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00:01:32 <ehird`> Hmm
00:01:33 <ehird`> I fixed that.
00:07:47 <bsmntbombdood> my feets
00:07:50 <bsmntbombdood> they have pain
00:09:17 -!- puzzlet has joined.
00:13:31 <ihope_> Te duelen los pies.
00:13:40 <ihope_> You hurt the feet.
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00:17:08 <Sgeo> Hi meowfish
00:17:56 <meowfish> Hello
00:18:26 <ihope_> Ello.
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00:40:16 <ehird`> ircatwork.com has to be the lamest dmoain ever
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00:51:06 <bsmntbombdood> meowfish
00:51:10 <bsmntbombdood> is that like twofish?
00:59:54 <ihope_> Is it IRC at work or IR cat work?
01:00:12 <ihope_> (One fish, two fish, meowfish, moo fish?)
01:00:32 <pikhq> IRCAT work.
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01:00:58 <ihope_> What's an IRCAT, I wonder...
01:01:12 <ihope_> Is it an infrared cable-Atlantic trans?
01:01:30 <ihope_> Which, I suppose, is a weird way of saying "infrared trans-Atlantic cable"?
01:01:48 <pikhq> Infrared Red Cable Automatically Terminated
01:02:00 <ihope_> Ah.
01:02:07 <pikhq> Even less sense. :)
01:03:25 <ihope_> It's clearly an Irradiated Residue Connector/Auxiliary Transmitter.
01:06:30 <ihope_> It functions as an auxiliary transmitter when placed in proximity to an irradiated residue receiver.
01:34:26 <bsmntbombdood> IRCAT, CueCat's succesor
01:48:32 <bsmntbombdood> df -h
01:48:34 <bsmntbombdood> oops
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02:35:25 <pikhq> Who would be kind enough to join me in proving that 1+1=3?
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03:16:43 <bsmntbombdood> pikhq: easy to d
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03:20:00 <pikhq> First, we assume e*e=e^3. :p
03:31:19 <immilinux> excuse me?
03:31:26 <immilinux> e*e*e=e^3
03:31:46 <pikhq> immilinux: If e*e=e^3, 1+1 must =3. ;p
03:33:22 <immilinux> oh and in case nobody worked it out, i am immibis, using linux.
03:33:34 <immilinux> not 1+1
03:34:57 <immilinux> if = = == then !(e&(~1))
03:35:10 <immilinux> 1+1 is irrelevant to exponents.
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03:35:58 * immilinux hit alt-f4 as he was playing around with hotkeys in irssi. D'oh!
03:36:16 <immilinux> oh and does anyone know of a way to make an Xboo GBA multiboot cable out of paperclips?
03:43:25 <RodgerTheGreat> I'm certain it's possible
03:44:06 <pikhq> e*e=e^3
03:44:13 <pikhq> ln(e*e)=ln(e^3)
03:44:15 <pikhq> 1+1=3
03:44:17 <pikhq> QED.
03:44:17 <pikhq> :p
03:45:19 <RodgerTheGreat> e*e = e^3? wtf?
03:45:31 <pikhq> RodgerTheGreat: It obviously doesn't.
03:45:49 <pikhq> I was making the point that if you assume e*e=e^3, then 1+1=3.
03:45:54 <RodgerTheGreat> reductio ad absurdum?
03:46:33 <pikhq> No, I got started on this train of thought by asking for proofs that 1+1=3. :p
03:46:47 <RodgerTheGreat> ah
03:47:27 <RodgerTheGreat>  "Reductio ad absurdum, which Euclid loved so much, is one of a mathematician's finest weapons. It is a far finer gambit than any chess gambit: a chess player may offer the sacrifice of a pawn or even a piece, but a mathematician offers the game."
03:50:00 <pikhq> Of course, if you assume 1+1=3, then 1+1=3. :p
04:02:56 <immilinux> pikhq: it certainly is if 1 == 1.5.
04:13:06 <immilinux> but how do i make a gba Xboo multiboot cable out of paperclips?
04:13:32 <immilinux> i also have some wires, resistors and capacitors of various sizes, and a few other bits and pieces if they're needed.
04:16:50 <immilinux> my main problem is how to keep the paperclips/wires/whatever stuck to the pins.
04:17:10 <immilinux> and i DO NOT have a gba multiplayer cable.
04:32:56 <immilinux> hello?
04:35:20 <pikhq> Got solder?
04:44:22 <immilinux> no
04:44:34 <immilinux> just paperclips, wires, and some other bits and pieces.
04:47:18 <immilinux> would tape work?
04:53:06 <bsmntbombdood> "immilinux" "hit's alt-f4" and closes?
04:53:47 <immilinux> hits
04:54:00 <bsmntbombdood> yes
04:55:10 <bsmntbombdood> well i guess some lesser window managers immitate windows keybindings
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05:04:32 <bsmntbombdood> gnome is a lesser window manager
05:05:10 <pikhq> Not-ratpoison is a lesser window manager.
05:05:37 <bsmntbombdood> i haven't used ratpoison
05:05:46 <bsmntbombdood> anyway, i'm completely happy with my current one
05:13:11 <immilinux> which is?
05:13:36 <immilinux> bsmntbombdood: kde does the same.
05:14:51 <immilinux> and its the most active - and therefore most likely one of the most popular - window managers/desktop environments around.
05:16:35 <immilinux> also does anyone know how to make cpuspeed slow down my cpu when the computer gets really hot?
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05:18:45 * immilinux turns down the cpu to 1.06 ghz and the temperature drops 20 degrees almost instantly.
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06:01:59 <bsmntbombdood> immilinux: ion3
06:03:12 <bsmntbombdood> and why is ircbrowse down
06:05:13 <immilinux> what?
06:05:48 <bsmntbombdood> ircbrowse.com
06:06:23 <immilinux> what is ion3?
06:06:58 <bsmntbombdood> a window manager
06:09:22 <bsmntbombdood> the window manager i use
06:10:01 <immilinux> and you mention it here in response to what?
06:11:05 <bsmntbombdood> uuuuh
06:11:20 <bsmntbombdood> <bsmntbombdood> anyway, i'm completely happy with my current [window manager] one
06:11:23 <bsmntbombdood> <immilinux> which is?
06:27:45 <immilinux> ok
06:28:31 <immilinux> i ran several commands in the interval between when i said that and when you responded, and it scrolled off the top of the terminal emulator.
06:29:07 <immilinux> and i didn't work out how to scroll the message list until just after i wrote the previous message
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07:32:39 <oklofok> mwahahaha
07:32:55 <oklofok> TODE has been bloatified!
07:32:56 <oklofok> http://vjn.fi/mb/?p=TODEx
07:33:38 <oklofok> i'm not sure this can be implemented without an AI, but... it's pretty great anyway
07:37:46 <oklofok> typed in apt-get install intercal for fun, there was one :O
07:38:11 <oklofok> oh, also unlambda
07:38:57 <immibis> and on fedora?
07:42:34 <oklofok> on fedora?
07:42:59 <oklofok> hmm, how do i list downloaded packages?
07:44:48 <oklofok> immibis: what happened to toBogE? i miss it
07:46:26 <oklofok> hmm, class is over, cya ->
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07:52:12 <GregorR> MMIX's register pushing and popping is SO EFFING COMPLICATED
07:53:15 <GregorR> Try 1: Failure. Try 2: Failure. Try 3: Failure. WTF, am I incapable of reading pseudocode?
07:57:02 <immibis> oklofok: remind me tomorrow
07:57:04 <immibis> oops he left
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09:58:19 <Tritonio> hello
11:36:32 <Slereah_> Hello.
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13:28:54 <faxathisia> I found a subleq self interpreter
13:28:56 <faxathisia> http://eigenratios.blogspot.com/2006_08_31_archive.html
13:29:31 <faxathisia> oops it even on esolang wiki as well
13:34:03 <SimonRC> hi
13:34:06 <faxathisia> hello
13:36:04 <faxathisia> did you read this eigenratios site?
13:36:24 <faxathisia> It's amusing :"p
13:43:47 <ehird`> indeed it is
13:55:02 <ehird`> hm
13:55:06 <ehird`> what the world needs
13:55:12 <ehird`> is a monospace font good for reading text
13:55:15 <ehird`> like on irc, you need a monospaced font
13:55:21 <ehird`> but a terminal/code one is just yuck
13:55:26 <faxathisia> I quite like Luxi Mono
13:55:35 <faxathisia> for editing code though
13:55:40 <ehird`> hmm yes luxi mono is quite non-monospaced like while still  being monospaced
13:56:36 <ehird`> I guess what I'm saying is that most monospaced fonts are just typewriter-esque
13:56:47 <ehird`> and I want a monospaced font for *reading text*
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14:23:14 <ehird`> http://www.radicaleye.com/lifepage/patterns/unitcell/ucdesc.html recursive life
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14:27:34 <ehird`> hmm
14:27:58 <ehird`> what is the simplest language that 1. is not TC 2. can be self-interpreted (eval doesn't count)
14:28:04 <ehird`> does one even exist? i think so
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15:43:13 <faxathisia> sick how things are named the same
15:43:17 <faxathisia> like PsiLisp :/
15:43:43 <faxathisia> It's meant to be a reversible language but it's also some database thing\
15:44:33 <AnMaster> ehird`, what is TC?
15:44:41 <Slereah-> Turing Complete.
15:44:46 <AnMaster> ah
15:44:56 <AnMaster> thought it was some language that was called TC
15:46:15 <AnMaster> ehird`, well while malbolge is turing complete, why not write a malbolge interpreter in malbolge?
15:47:15 * faxathisia wonders if there is any sub-turing language capable of 'interesting' calculation within which a self interpreter can be written
15:47:49 <AnMaster> heh
16:08:19 <GregorR> faxathisia: Yes, there is.
16:08:41 <GregorR> faxathisia: Mind you, I have no proof or evidence, but I'm confident that there is ;)
16:12:42 <GregorR> ehird`: Re monospace: OS?
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16:13:34 <GregorR> ehird`: Simplest language that is not TC and can be self-interpreted: The operation 'x' outputs the character 'x'
16:14:11 <GregorR> No wait, better:
16:14:23 <GregorR> The operation 'x' is cat.
16:14:48 <GregorR> So stupidlang x.sl < x.sl > x2.sl ; cmp x.sl x2.sl ; $? == 0
16:15:06 <faxathisia_> damn.. ircbrowse is down
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16:25:58 <AnMaster> GregorR, is that a language?
16:26:11 <AnMaster> well, broad definition then IMO ;)
16:27:02 <GregorR> First you'll need to make a definition for "language"
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16:32:28 <ehird`> GregorR: OK, let's say that doesn't count :P
16:33:01 <ehird`> [14:27] <ehird`> what is the simplest language that 1. is not TC 2. can be self-interpreted (eval doesn't count)
16:33:01 <ehird`> [14:28] <ehird`> does one even exist? i think so
16:33:10 <ehird`> without counting cat and similar.
16:33:16 <GregorR> "similar"
16:36:51 <bsmntbombdood> ehird` is so vague
16:38:45 <Slereah-> Maybe he refered to the "The operation 'x' outputs the character 'x'"
16:42:15 <faxathisia> The operation "RUN" reads a single 'x' outputs the character 'x'
16:42:32 <faxathisia> emm.. it does have to be called 'x' doesn't it
16:43:25 <GregorR> I seem to have a proclivity for writing scripts that cause Firefox to freeze.
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16:48:58 <faxathisia> at any rate GregorR proved it's possible
16:49:13 <faxathisia> but is there a more interesting or capable language with the property?
16:49:41 <ehird`> bsmntbombdood: sheesh
16:49:45 <ehird`> :P
16:58:33 <bsmntbombdood> firefox freezes when you're out of disk space
17:04:51 <oerjan> well, as far as i understand the impossibility of interpreting many non-turing complete languages in themselves follows from what happens when you translate the proof of the halting problem to them
17:07:09 <ehird`> 'many' or all
17:10:19 <oerjan> basically if the programs in the language always halt, and there is an interpreter which can run any program (still halting), and you have enough ways of composing programs to do the diagonalization the proof needs, then you end up with a contradiction
17:10:36 <ehird`> always halt != non-tc
17:10:40 <oerjan> so there would be several ways out
17:10:59 <GregorR> Um, always halt == non-TC
17:11:00 <ehird`> subset-of(non-tc, always halt)
17:11:01 <oerjan> it could have non-halting programs without being tc
17:11:08 <GregorR> Oh
17:11:12 <ehird`> there are non-TC languages with programs that do not halt
17:11:30 <GregorR> ehird`: I thought you were being colloquial with your "!=" :P
17:11:35 <oerjan> ehird`: 0x29A on the wiki is one, i proved
17:11:36 <faxathisia> "composing programs to do the diagonalization the proof needs" - Which proof?
17:12:00 <oerjan> and Subtle Cough too, sort of
17:12:00 <faxathisia> I never saw a diagonalization argument in anything relating to halting
17:12:22 <ehird`> subtle cough is, rather useless ;P
17:12:38 <oerjan> faxathisia: the proof of the halting problem is a diagonalization proof, indeed
17:12:42 <ehird`> I've always wondered if there's a variation on subtle cough with one more func (That isn't the iota combinator ;)) that is TC
17:13:08 <ehird`> hmm, oerjan is 0x29a not TC?
17:13:11 <ehird`> there's a bf->it translation
17:13:13 <oerjan> ehird`: well I isn't that function, i recall :)
17:13:21 <oerjan> ehird`: oh, i meant the functional subset
17:13:26 <ehird`> ah
17:13:37 <ehird`> oerjan: Well, i is turing complete by itself
17:13:40 <ehird`> (Iota, not identity)
17:13:47 <oerjan> i meant identity
17:14:09 <oerjan> it's easy to add to Subtle Cough but gives nothing else, iirc
17:14:44 <ehird`> of coursen ot
17:14:47 <ehird`> *ci is useless
17:14:51 <ehird`> and *iX is also useless
17:15:35 <oerjan> back to the ways out: (2) a language could be too simple to allow composition of programs for diagonalization
17:16:14 <oerjan> hm, i guess that's about it
17:16:47 <oerjan> i suppose GregorR's example is (2)
17:17:57 <oerjan> what about regular expression languages?
17:18:48 <oerjan> without perly extensions, they would probably be too simple too, by the chomsky hierarchy
17:19:27 <faxathisia> you would try to match <self interpreting regex> against "a+b:aaaaaaaaab" or something?
17:19:42 <oerjan> oh wait
17:19:59 <oerjan> it probably won't have an interpreter
17:20:30 <faxathisia> maybe there are some new operators to add which make it possible
17:20:36 <faxathisia> although I have no idea what..
17:21:09 <ehird`> regexps can't match regexps
17:21:16 <ehird`> case in point: balanced things of any sort.
17:21:18 <ehird`> QED
17:21:28 <ehird`> and if you can't PARSE regexps, you can't RUN them
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18:11:43 <jix> but repeated application of regexps could interpret regexps
18:12:22 <faxathisia> do you have any example of it?
18:14:54 <jix> no but repeated string serach replacement is turing complete
18:15:08 <jix> so repeated regexp application is a superset of that and thus turing complete too
18:22:39 <ehird`> my regexp language supports this
18:23:01 <ehird`> syntax: either a\nb\nc or anything (including a\nb)
18:23:04 <ehird`> if the first,
18:23:11 <ehird`> then run the regexp a with replacement b on c
18:23:14 <ehird`> and evaluate that as code
18:23:29 <ehird`> if the latter, well i don't know, but the first spec said if last-char == "." output the rest
18:23:30 <ehird`> otherwise error
18:23:44 <ehird`> I conjecture that it is turing complete.
18:23:58 <ehird`> Certainly, a BCT conversion would be tivial
18:24:08 <ehird`> *trivial
18:32:39 <ehird`> :)
18:32:58 <ehird`> first person to write BCT->thatlang converter wins a prize of ... something
18:33:02 <ehird`> probably useless ePoints
18:34:51 <Slereah-> *wins internets
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20:29:49 <oklopol> the game of life unit cell is that big... i thought it was like 10x10 :D
20:36:09 <ehird`> oklopol: gregorr said cat a while back
20:36:11 <ehird`> not funny
20:36:11 <ehird`> :|
20:36:37 <oklopol> i read that, yeah, wasn't supposed to be funny though
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21:53:16 <dbc>  >>>>++++++++++>>+>+>+[[->[-]++++++[<++++++++>-]>>>>]<<<<<[<[>+>+<<-]>.<<<<
21:53:16 <dbc> <]>.>>+[-[<<<<<[+<<<<<]>>>>>>>[[-]>[<<+>+>-]<[>+<-]<[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+
21:53:16 <dbc> <-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>[-]>>>>+>+<<<<<<-[>+<-]]]]]]]]]]]>[<+>-]+>>>>>]<<<<
21:53:16 <dbc> <[<<<<<]>>[>>>>>]++[-<<<<<]>>>>>>-]+>>>>>]<[>++<-]<<<<[<[>+<-]<<<<]>>>>>>>]
21:53:37 <dbc> (factorials)
21:55:29 <ehird`> nice
21:55:44 <ehird`> now make it 3 lines so I can include "(factorials)" at the end of my sig ;)
22:12:42 <dbc> Feel free :P
22:13:45 <bsmntbombdood> 3 72-char lines
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22:53:05 <ehird`> mega-someone-ping
22:53:57 <bsmntbombdood> wut
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23:17:44 <Kahdloc> say hello
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23:19:29 <ehird`> hello bsmntbombdood.
23:19:34 <ehird`> meta ping #2
23:19:36 <bsmntbombdood> what
23:19:37 <ehird`> *mega
23:19:43 <ehird`> you pong'd, bsmntbombdood.
23:25:18 <bsmntbombdood> ....
23:28:18 <bsmntbombdood> jihad 4ever!!
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23:38:47 <ehird`> i got bored so i tried to write a ridiculously minimal yet usable chat protocol
23:38:57 <ehird`> the spec is 117 lines in total, including whitespace etc
23:39:03 <ehird`> and most of it is basically trivial
23:39:09 <ehird`> :D
23:39:26 <bsmntbombdood> so?
23:39:36 <bsmntbombdood> simplified-irc is trivial...
23:40:12 <ehird`> sure, sure, but it's not anything like irc
23:40:28 <ehird`> and barring a few things is pretty much usable
23:40:35 <ehird`> (as a replcaement to irc)
23:40:40 <bsmntbombdood> so?
23:40:44 <ehird`> i dunno
23:40:49 <bsmntbombdood> no me importa
23:41:28 <bsmntbombdood> aaaw assballs i've got homework
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