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00:18:50 <GregorR> Hmmmm
00:19:04 <GregorR> "... was almost the victim of an assassination attempt by ..."
00:19:14 <GregorR> Can you be /almost/ a victim of an assassination /attempt/?
00:28:33 <pikhq> I'm 7?!?
00:28:54 <pikhq> (granted, I *was* when I acquired the name)
00:32:55 <Sgeo> How did you come up with pikhq?
00:43:46 -!- sebbu has quit ("@+").
00:51:12 <pikhq> I was trying to create a website called "Pikachu's Headquarters", or "pikhq" for short.
00:52:24 <GregorR> D-8
00:52:39 <GregorR> pikhq.respect -= infinity;
00:54:31 <pikhq> GregorR: At the age of 7.
00:54:50 <pikhq> Before anything but the Pokemon game was released in the US.
00:54:55 <pikhq> Before the game was even popular.
00:54:58 <pikhq> You may bite me.
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01:46:54 <Slereah> Where can I find an interpreter or compiler for Unlambda on windows?
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02:41:03 <bsmntbombdood> pikachu's headquarters LOL
02:41:11 <bsmntbombdood> Slereah: don't use windows
02:41:39 <bsmntbombdood> and you've graduated to magic
02:42:56 <Slereah> Last time I tried to install Linux, I had bad surprises.
02:43:02 <Slereah> I'm not very computer savvy.
02:43:32 <Slereah> I could use the on-CD version, but it's a whole lot of trouble.
02:47:23 <bsmntbombdood> ooh interesting: http://it.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=365703&cid=21415869
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03:17:42 <bsmntbombdood> whoa
03:17:44 <bsmntbombdood> see seccomp
03:18:43 * immibis has been signed up to two online sites, by someone else, WITHOUT HIS PERMISSION.
03:19:45 <bsmntbombdood> zomg
03:19:47 <bsmntbombdood> stfu
03:21:06 <bsmntbombdood> seccomp keeps your proccess from using ANY syscall but exit,read,write,sigreturn
03:22:27 <bsmntbombdood> that's secure enough to run arbitrary code >_<
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03:53:13 <Sgeo> nogm
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07:38:30 <GregorR> http://www.codu.org/plof/plof3.html (RFC on just the internal stack language)
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08:15:12 <bsmntbombdood> Well, Pam... Which way you going, left or right?
08:15:19 <bsmntbombdood> Right!
08:15:24 <bsmntbombdood> Oh, that's too bad...
08:15:30 <bsmntbombdood> Why?
08:15:37 <bsmntbombdood> Because it was a fifty fifty shot on wheter you'd be going left or right. You see we're both going left. You could have just as easily been going left, too. And if that was the case... It would have been a while before you started getting scared. But since you're going the other way, I'm afraid you're gonna have to start getting scared... immediately!
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13:09:09 <Slereah> Shouldn't ```sii`.ai print a double a?
13:20:14 <Slereah> Ah, got it. No `.a.a
13:20:33 <Slereah> Or did I?
13:20:34 <Slereah> Rargh.
13:22:08 <Slereah> ``.ai`.ai works, why not ```sii`.ai?
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14:25:29 <ehird`> i notice the logs linked has changed
14:25:34 <ehird`> ircbrowse not 1337 enough? :P
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14:28:58 <asiekierka> Hi!
14:29:02 <Slereah> Hi.
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16:37:03 <ehird`> sqoddleberg
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16:48:23 <asie_dead> I'm looking for an easy to implement esoteric language that's not brainfuck, not deadfish, and has under 7 commands.
16:48:49 -!- asie_dead has changed nick to asiekierka.
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16:49:01 <ehird`> hah
16:49:07 -!- asiekierka has joined.
16:49:14 <asiekierka> here, i'm back
16:49:16 <asiekierka> so waiting for answer
16:49:19 <ehird`> asiekierka of course being the only person in #esoteric who couldn't just make their own in 2 minutes
16:49:24 <ehird`> oh, you're waiting for an answer
16:49:25 <ehird`> sorry
16:49:31 <ehird`> next time i'll be less than 60 seconds
16:49:54 <asiekierka> I can make my own esoteric language.
16:49:59 <asiekierka> But it'll never get popular
16:50:00 <asiekierka> xD
16:50:13 <asiekierka> under 7 commands, and the commands must have NO parameters.
16:50:39 <Slereah> What are the commands!
16:50:43 <asiekierka> Any.
16:50:45 <asiekierka> ANY.
16:50:52 <asiekierka> i will eventually modify it a bit
16:50:53 <asiekierka> so?
16:51:33 <Slereah> I have a little difficulty to see what's the language!
16:51:44 <asiekierka> Not guessing.
16:51:46 <asiekierka> But
16:51:49 <asiekierka> FINDING
16:51:56 <asiekierka> if you find a good language, you get a prize!
16:52:24 <asiekierka> Tried Deadfish in "ZZT", a real old GCS, i replaced square with multiply by 2, but the multiply command is (not so) slightly buggy.
16:52:25 <asiekierka> It does it
16:52:39 <asiekierka> but after i multiply 64 by 2, it dosen't do every second command.
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16:53:25 <ehird`> asiekierka: 'get popular'?
16:53:28 <ehird`> why the hell do you care
16:53:42 <calamari> hi
16:53:47 <asiekierka> I care about my esoteric language being used more than by 1 person (me).
16:54:03 <asiekierka> Well, if it'll be okay, who'll use it?
16:54:09 <asiekierka> There will be better alternatives.
16:54:19 <asiekierka> Brainfuck (implemented in exact same GCS. 2 TIMES)
16:54:27 <asiekierka> Piet
16:54:28 <asiekierka> Etc
16:54:28 <asiekierka> Etc
16:54:30 <Slereah> Make it awful.
16:54:41 <asiekierka> Ok.
16:54:41 <Slereah> It will attract people!
16:54:43 <asiekierka> I will put increment, but not decrement.
16:54:49 <asiekierka> xD
16:54:57 <asiekierka> I will put output, but not input.
16:55:08 <asiekierka> I will put start of a loop, but not an end
16:55:26 <Slereah> Well, make it TC, also!
16:55:35 <asiekierka> TC?
16:55:37 <asiekierka> Teh Crap?
16:55:44 <Slereah> So that people can try to make stuff with it!
16:55:47 <Slereah> Turing Complete.
16:55:56 <asiekierka> :/
16:56:08 <asiekierka> A thing dosen't need turing-compleetness to do it
16:56:19 <asiekierka> or
16:56:21 <asiekierka> A thing dosen't need turing-compl33tness to do it
16:56:34 <Slereah> Well, what will it be able to do!
16:56:38 <asiekierka> or like, "That thing dosen't need turing-compl33tness to do it, right?"
16:56:43 <asiekierka> Poke fun at the programmer.
17:06:06 <asiekierka> also, Slereah:
17:06:07 <asiekierka> Although it is often a self-imposed constraint, there is no burden on an esoteric programming language designer to make their language Turing-complete. For instance, it seems reasonable that most esolangers would rather see a language which is interesting but not Turing-complete, over a language which is Turing-complete but uninteresting.
17:06:13 <asiekierka> see?
17:07:02 <asiekierka> If not:
17:07:02 <asiekierka> Although it is often a self-imposed constraint, there is no burden on an esoteric programming language designer to make their language Turing-complete. For instance, it seems reasonable that most esolangers would rather see a language which is interesting but not Turing-complete, over a language which is Turing-complete but uninteresting.
17:07:12 <Slereah> I know, I know!
17:09:57 <asiekierka> What commands/possibilities should be there to make a language Turing-complete?
17:10:15 <asiekierka> Well, with up to 7 commands and NO params for commands possible, it'll be a turing tarpit
17:10:58 <Slereah> Hard to say. You just need to be able to recreate any other TC language.
17:11:14 <Slereah> There's some pretty strange ways for that.
17:12:05 <asiekierka> You mean?
17:12:16 <asiekierka> strange ways?
17:12:28 <asiekierka> or is there any other possibility than recreating another language?
17:12:59 <Slereah> TC just mean that it is equivalent to a Turing machine.
17:13:11 <Slereah> If it is, you should be able to recreate one with the language.
17:13:22 <asiekierka> I will just make a language then.
17:14:14 <asiekierka> You have 58 bits to use.
17:14:14 <asiekierka> < - move west
17:14:14 <asiekierka> ) - move east and flip
17:14:24 <asiekierka> Output is there already (not a command)
17:14:39 <asiekierka> shown
17:14:41 <asiekierka> now tell me
17:14:48 <asiekierka> what do ya think?
17:15:20 <Slereah> Everything outputs as the head moves?
17:15:27 <Slereah> Won't that be a little messy?
17:15:33 <asiekierka> the bits are shown
17:15:34 <asiekierka> on-screen
17:15:50 <asiekierka> You have 58 bits to use.
17:15:50 <asiekierka> < - move west
17:15:50 <asiekierka> ) - move east and flip
17:15:50 <asiekierka> [ - if the bit is 0, skip the next command
17:15:52 <asiekierka> now
17:15:52 <asiekierka> done
17:16:18 <asiekierka> What do ya think?
17:16:34 <asiekierka> xD
17:17:15 <Slereah> Does the moving loop back?
17:17:30 <asiekierka> ... moving loop back?
17:17:54 <Slereah> Yes, I'm not very good with technical term
17:18:03 <Slereah> And now that I think of it, my question doesn't make sense.
17:18:06 <Sgeo> Oh, does the tape wrap around?
17:18:10 <asiekierka> yeah
17:18:22 <asiekierka> You have 58 bits to use.
17:18:22 <asiekierka> < - move west
17:18:22 <asiekierka> ) - move east and flip
17:18:22 <asiekierka> [ - if the bit is 0, skip the next command.
17:18:22 <asiekierka> } - move to the previous command
17:18:25 <asiekierka> no wait
17:18:30 <asiekierka> You have 58 bits to use.
17:18:30 <asiekierka> < - move west
17:18:30 <asiekierka> ) - move east and flip
17:18:31 <asiekierka> [ - if the bit is 0, skip the next command.
17:18:33 <asiekierka> } - move 2 commands back
17:18:35 <asiekierka> here goes
17:18:45 <ehird`> oh gawd, is asiekierka at it again
17:18:52 <asiekierka> now wait
17:18:56 <asiekierka> no wait*
17:18:57 <asiekierka> i'll fix it
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17:19:42 <asiekierka> ok
17:19:43 <asiekierka> done
17:19:45 <asiekierka> hopefully
17:19:45 <asiekierka> You have 58 bits to use.
17:19:45 <asiekierka> < - move west
17:19:45 <asiekierka> ) - move east and flip
17:19:45 <asiekierka> [ - if the bit is 0, skip the next command.
17:19:47 <asiekierka> } - move to the matching [ if the bit is 1.
17:19:49 <asiekierka> n - nop
17:19:51 <asiekierka> 5 command
17:19:53 <asiekierka> s
17:20:00 <asiekierka> Here we go!
17:20:05 <oklopol> asiekierka: brainfuck is not a turing tarpit
17:20:14 <ehird`> oklopol: it is, just a very bloated one
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17:20:38 <oklopol> it has 6+io
17:20:39 <ehird`> IMO the best turing tarpit is either a Minsky machine with two registers of some sort or Bitwise Cyclic Tag
17:20:46 <asiekierka> <)[n)}
17:20:52 <ehird`> iota brings far too many semantics in with it to really be minimal
17:20:52 <asiekierka> I think it will flip the 1st bit
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17:21:13 <Slereah> What's your definition of a Turing tarpit.
17:21:16 <asiekierka> and then move and NOT.
17:21:16 <Slereah> ?
17:21:33 <asiekierka> Mine?
17:21:49 <ehird`> Slereah: subjective
17:21:49 <Slereah> ehird`.
17:21:53 <asiekierka> oh
17:21:59 <asiekierka> What about my crappy language?
17:22:09 <ehird`> Slereah: semantics must be minimal, so must the syntax
17:22:16 <asiekierka> Well the same thing can be achieved with
17:22:16 <ehird`> iota has minimal syntax but a lot of semantics
17:22:17 <asiekierka> <[n)}
17:22:25 <asiekierka> 5 commands
17:22:31 <Slereah> I'm trying to see if I can make the very first Turing program with it.
17:22:31 <asiekierka> What now?
17:22:38 <asiekierka> ok
17:22:45 <asiekierka> nops are optional
17:22:47 <ehird`> asiekierka's language is not TC based on intuition
17:22:48 <oklopol>  } - move to the previous command <<< this woudl totally own xD
17:22:52 <ehird`> i may not be right
17:22:55 <Slereah> Which is just 01010101...
17:23:02 <ehird`> oh
17:23:04 <ehird`> with your new } definition
17:23:11 <ehird`> its most likely turing complete
17:23:18 <ehird`> but really it's very similar to brainfuck..
17:23:22 <asiekierka> MY new } definition? or oklopol's?
17:23:25 <asiekierka> Well i know it is
17:23:41 <asiekierka> but it was designed to be as easy to implement (in ZZT, an old GCS) as possible
17:24:02 <oklopol> hmm
17:24:06 * oklopol intuits
17:24:37 <ehird`> what is gcs anyway
17:24:38 <ehird`> i'm dumb
17:24:43 <asiekierka> Game Creation System
17:24:50 <asiekierka> zzt -> zzt.belsambar.net
17:24:56 <asiekierka> check it
17:25:01 <asiekierka> there are 2 BF interpreters
17:25:02 <ehird`> ah, i guess you haven't learned C yet
17:25:03 <oklopol> basically you have bitchanger with do...while instead of while
17:25:09 <ehird`> not suprised.
17:25:23 <asiekierka> ZZT is so limited, i srsly like it.
17:25:25 * ehird` is perhaps bitter from his previous experience with asiekierka 
17:25:28 <asiekierka> I LIKE LIMITS.
17:25:49 <oklopol> someone thought of that some time ago
17:25:49 <oklopol> don't remember who
17:26:00 <Slereah> asiekierka likes command bondage.
17:26:05 <ehird`> oh
17:26:06 <ehird`> that zzt
17:26:15 <ehird`> still
17:26:18 <oklopol> ehird`: what was that experience?
17:26:20 <ehird`> pretty lame
17:26:27 <oklopol> anyhow, it is most likely tc.
17:26:50 <oklopol> in case i got the semantics right
17:26:54 <ehird`> oklopol: he was annoying, repeated stuff a lot, had a bot which basically flooded the channel, and kept whining about how he was only 10 years old as an excuse for all this
17:27:12 <oklopol> oh cool :P
17:27:12 <oklopol> i don't remember that
17:27:16 <oklopol> can i see log?
17:27:26 <oklopol> guess i could search myself
17:27:30 <ehird`> beh, i dunno when it was
17:27:31 <ehird`> not that long ago
17:27:37 <ehird`> a month or two max
17:27:40 <asiekierka> I doubt THIS is turing-complete:
17:27:40 <asiekierka> You have 58 bits to use, they are by default 01010101010101...
17:27:40 <asiekierka> Z - swap the bit and the bit near it.
17:27:40 <asiekierka> [ - if the bit is 0, skip the next command.
17:27:58 <asiekierka> nope, it was like, three or four months
17:27:59 <asiekierka> i'm sorry.
17:28:25 <oklopol> near it :P
17:28:35 <oklopol> it's not tc
17:28:44 <asiekierka> what it lacks?
17:28:50 <ehird`> define 'near'
17:28:53 <ehird`> also
17:28:59 <oklopol> even if you made the array infinitely extensible
17:29:02 <ehird`> its trivially non-TC by your definition even ignoring commands
17:29:04 <ehird`> since, 58 max bits
17:29:13 <Slereah> Heh.
17:29:13 <asiekierka> it's the limit of ZZT
17:29:14 <asiekierka> not mine
17:29:16 <asiekierka> got ya?
17:29:18 <asiekierka> What else?
17:29:25 <oklopol> the halting problem cannot be solved for a turing complete language, it can for yours.
17:29:36 <oklopol> *be
17:30:06 <oklopol> yours will always halt because the code is finite, and after every step, one command is lost.
17:30:15 <oklopol> (= you can't loop)
17:30:25 <asiekierka> You have 58 bits to use, they are by default 01010101010101...
17:30:25 <asiekierka> Z - swap the bit and the bit near it.
17:30:25 <asiekierka> [ - if the bit is 0, skip the next command. If the bit is 1, jump to the previous command.
17:30:29 <asiekierka> I toyed around MORE.
17:30:30 <ehird`> that's a crazy way of proving non-TCness/TCness
17:30:39 <asiekierka> Now i can loop... sorta.
17:30:41 <ehird`> "The halting problem is impossible to solve in this language! Therefore, it is TC."
17:30:42 <ehird`> :D
17:30:48 <ehird`> asiekierka: not TC
17:30:51 <oklopol> asiekierka: an infinite-loop  instruction won't help ya ;)
17:30:55 <asiekierka> What it lacks AGAIN?
17:31:08 <oklopol> haha
17:31:21 <oklopol> ehird`: i never said it works that way too
17:31:23 <oklopol> not does it.
17:31:24 <asiekierka> oh
17:31:24 <asiekierka> i know
17:31:29 <oklopol> *nor
17:31:47 <oklopol> asiekierka: it lascks skill
17:31:55 <oklopol> just add some of that, and you've got a decent language
17:31:57 <oklopol> ;)
17:32:02 <asiekierka> You have 58 bits to use, they are by default 01010101010101... The tape wraps around.
17:32:02 <asiekierka> Z - swap the bit and the bit near it, then move the pointer east.
17:32:02 <asiekierka> [ - if the bit is 0, skip the next command and move the pointer west. If the bit is 1, jump to the previous command.
17:32:08 <oklopol> *lacks
17:32:11 <asiekierka> oh god
17:32:17 <asiekierka> ehird`, please, help me!
17:32:27 <ehird`> asiekierka: are you going to pee your pants if i don't???
17:32:29 <ehird`> OH NO DISASTER
17:32:31 <ehird`> AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH
17:32:33 <ehird`> HELP
17:33:00 <Slereah> Let's invoke the ghost of Alan Turing.
17:33:00 <oklopol> asiekierka: you need to be able to jump backward *any* amount of commands
17:33:13 <asiekierka> make 3 1's
17:33:16 <asiekierka> and 3 [[['s.
17:33:19 <asiekierka> oh
17:33:20 <asiekierka> wait
17:33:23 <oklopol> well
17:33:32 <oklopol> hard to say anything but lol here :\
17:33:54 <asiekierka> You have 58 bits to use, they are by default 01010101010101... The tape wraps around.
17:33:54 <asiekierka> Z - swap the bit and the bit near it, then move the pointer east.
17:33:54 <asiekierka> [ - if the bit is 0, skip the next command and move the pointer west. If the bit is 1, jump 1 instruction after the nearest [, or 1 instruction after if there's none.
17:34:04 <asiekierka> Now you can any.
17:34:06 <asiekierka> i guess.
17:34:24 <ehird`> methinks asiekierka should learn about how languages work before trying to write one
17:34:42 <asiekierka> IT'S an esoteric language
17:34:43 <asiekierka> forgot?
17:36:16 <ehird`> oh
17:36:23 <ehird`> i forgot you can make esolangs
17:36:27 <ehird`> without knowing about languages!
17:36:30 <ehird`> truly amazing
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17:36:46 <asiekierka> It was meant to be weird AND minimal.
17:37:05 <asiekierka> esolang != lang
17:37:13 <asiekierka> esojokelange != esolang != lang
17:37:21 <asiekierka> my esolang != esojokelang != esolang != lang
17:37:25 <asiekierka> discuss.
17:37:29 <oklopol> o
17:37:31 <Slereah> Well, they technically all are a subset of languages.
17:37:37 <asiekierka> yeah
17:37:47 <asiekierka> Who tested mine against Turing-compleetness?
17:37:58 <Slereah> My keyboard doesn't have a belong sign, butt.
17:38:02 <Slereah> ..
17:38:09 <asiekierka> Belong?
17:38:19 <Slereah> The stylised epsilon.
17:38:26 <asiekierka> ok
17:38:30 <asiekierka> How's the test?
17:38:50 <oklopol> asiekierka: you guessed wrong, anyhow, i agree with ehird` here
17:38:53 <ehird`> (asiekierka does not realise not everyone is interested in every single thing he does every second of their day)
17:39:20 <oklopol> i am
17:39:24 <oklopol> asiekierka: you really 10?
17:39:27 <asiekierka> yeah
17:39:31 <asiekierka> nearly 11, in fact
17:39:32 <asiekierka> and from poland
17:39:40 <Slereah> Heh. Poland.
17:40:02 <asiekierka> If you're really interesed in every esolang i do every minute of you're day, #asie_esolangs
17:40:13 <asiekierka> it will be the OFFICIAL BETA-TEST PAGE BEFORE PUBLISHING HERE
17:40:30 <oklopol> heh, maybe later :P
17:40:36 <asiekierka> Please, join #asie_esolangs if you're interesed in every esolang i do every minute of your day.
17:40:47 <asiekierka> I'm very limited by time, going in a hour or so
17:40:56 <oklopol> wish i was 10 and knew what esolangs are...
17:41:10 <asiekierka> ok
17:41:51 <Slereah> I didn't knew how to program until I was 19.
17:42:05 <Slereah> Esolangs were a long way off!
17:42:20 <oklopol> cool, another one older than me
17:42:33 <Slereah> How old are you?
17:46:08 <ehird`> asiekierka is 10
17:46:28 <oklopol> i'm 18
17:46:33 <Slereah> 'kay.
17:46:42 <oklopol> i think that's the median
17:46:46 <oklopol> or whatever it's called
17:47:52 <oklopol> median is correct, how lucky
17:48:07 <Slereah> What, the value with the largest population?
17:50:28 <oklopol> no
17:50:28 <oklopol> it's the least intuitive one of them all.
17:55:57 -!- sebbu has quit (Connection timed out).
17:59:23 <oklopol> i'm gonna do some pointless math now, cya ->
18:00:04 <asiekierka> :(
18:00:22 <ehird`> asiekierka is now having a seizuer
18:00:27 <ehird`> *seizure
18:00:52 -!- jix has quit (Nick collision from services.).
18:01:02 -!- jix has joined.
18:11:25 -!- RedDak has quit ("I'm quitting... Bye all").
18:27:22 <GregorR> If I announce PSL as an esoteric language, then will you give me comments on it? :P
18:27:33 <asiekierka> I will check it out.
18:27:55 <GregorR> http://www.codu.org/plof/plof3.html (It's not an esolang, but I want it to be a usable stacklanguage before I build a real language on it)
18:35:04 -!- oerjan has joined.
18:37:57 <GregorR> oerjan, pass judgment unto my bytecode!
18:39:37 <oerjan> BYTECODE, THOU WILT PERISH IN THE SEA THAT BURNETH WITH FIRE AND SULPHUR
18:39:43 <GregorR> Gracias.
18:39:52 <GregorR> But more specifically, http://www.codu.org/plof/plof3.html
18:40:13 <GregorR> It's partially modeled on Glass (weeeh stack-based object-oriented languages)
18:41:00 <oerjan> I SEE.  IN THAT CASE, REPLACE SULPHUR BY SILICON.
18:41:34 <GregorR> VERY GOOD, SIR.
18:41:36 <oerjan> might be appropriate for programs in any case
18:41:44 <Slereah> Burning in fire and silicon?
18:41:49 <GregorR> Well, I know you can write code in it :P
18:42:14 <GregorR> But I want comments like: "You ought to have an operation <x> to make <y> easier" or "shouldn't <z> be done with <a>?"
18:43:36 <oerjan> i find it somewhat amusing that you think i am competent on such matters.  or sad, perhaps.
18:43:44 <GregorR> :P
18:44:10 <GregorR> I think I need jix's opinion, since PSL should be reminiscent of Glass.
18:47:00 <oerjan> Slereah: the burning in fire and ... bit is a bit redundant, i guess, it's translated from norwegian. (it was weird there too)
18:47:34 <Slereah> Well, it is a poetic licence.
19:03:02 <oerjan> <Slereah> Where can I find an interpreter or compiler for Unlambda on windows?
19:03:20 <Slereah> I found one. Sort of.
19:03:25 <oerjan> just download an interpreter or compiler for one of the languages it's been implemented in
19:03:44 <Slereah> Well, I asked because the C version I found didn't compile.
19:04:00 <Slereah> But I got Hug for Haskell and the Unlambda for Haskell.
19:04:07 <oerjan> the c-refcnt one is most portable
19:04:18 <Slereah> I feel less manly with the Hug program in my computer, but it works.
19:04:28 -!- Tritonio_ has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
19:04:29 <oerjan> yeah, there are several unlambdas in haskell (one is mine)
19:04:48 <Slereah> Although it isn't very practical. I must not make one typo, or the program crashes or launch!
19:04:53 <oerjan> you can use ghc and compile it properly
19:04:57 -!- Tritonio_ has joined.
19:04:58 <Slereah> ghc?
19:05:08 <oerjan> the glasgow haskell compiler
19:05:35 <Slereah> I tried to get it IIRC.
19:06:01 <Slereah> I mainly downloaded the first Haskell that had a .exe instead of them .gz extensions.
19:06:09 * Sgeo feels like torturing norns
19:06:22 <Slereah> Heh. Creatures.
19:06:27 <Slereah> It's been a while!
19:08:03 * Sgeo is making something that will torture to death any norns that come in from the warp
19:08:15 <ehird`> GregorR!
19:08:18 <ehird`> Minimize your instruction set.
19:08:47 <ehird`> You don't need most of  that crap if you add some memory and some read/store instructions
19:08:53 <ehird`> e.g. "array" can be implemented in it trivially
19:09:12 <ehird`> also make push0-push8 a "grab" thing, which takes the number off the top of the stack
19:30:29 <Sgeo> http://sgeo.diagonalfish.net/screenshots/plne_fun_1.png
19:31:11 <Slereah> What Creature is this?
19:31:46 <Slereah> They made any after the 3?
19:31:53 <Slereah> Or am I just of short memory.
19:32:10 <Sgeo> Docking Station
19:32:16 <Sgeo> It's free
19:32:26 <Sgeo> And if you have Creatures 3, you can dock it to DS
19:32:31 <oerjan> <Slereah> ``.ai`.ai works, why not ```sii`.ai?
19:32:42 <Sgeo> http://creatures.wikia.com/wiki/Docking_Station
19:32:58 <Slereah> I asked another chan for that. Apparently the .x isn't evaluated at the end or something!
19:33:01 <oerjan> because unlambda is strictly evaluated, `.ai is evaluated only once
19:33:12 <oerjan> the result being i
19:33:28 <oerjan> which is passed to the result of ``sii
19:34:35 <Slereah> So much for the mockingbird.
19:34:53 <oerjan> however ``sii works fine in other situations
19:35:13 <Slereah> Well, yes. But how does the repeat printing works then?
19:35:28 <oerjan> which one?
19:35:48 * ehird` wonders if ANSI Common Lisp counts as an esolang
19:35:49 <ehird`> probably.
19:36:23 <Slereah> Well, repeating printing something without just writing it a lot.
19:36:43 <Slereah> I'm sorry, I just don't know many technical terms.
19:37:30 <oerjan> infinitely or a fixed number of times? church numerals are nice for the latter
19:38:12 <Slereah> How will Church numeral works any differently than in the SII case?
19:38:30 <oerjan> ````sii.ai should work, btw
19:39:04 <Slereah> I'll lambda that, see if I can understand better!
19:39:46 <oerjan> or alternatively, ``<n>.ai for a church numeral <n>
19:40:13 <ehird`> hmm
19:40:33 <ehird`> if Common Lisp >IS< esoteric then it's probably the most widely deployed and praised esolang
19:41:14 <Slereah> Oh. So I have (.a.a)I instead of (.aI)(.aI)
19:41:18 <Slereah> Wait.
19:41:24 <Slereah> Aaaaargh
19:41:57 <oerjan> it's the application of .a that prints the a
19:42:02 <Slereah> I guess I'll just have to read the full unlambda page.
19:42:13 <oerjan> it doesn't matter what you apply it to
19:42:25 <oerjan> .a = i, except for the printing
19:42:33 <Sgeo> Slereah, thoughts on DS?
19:42:47 <oerjan> <ehird`> i notice the logs linked has changed
19:42:55 <Slereah> Yes, but if I just write `.a.a, there's only one a.
19:43:01 <Slereah> DS?
19:43:10 <ehird`> Slereah: Docking Station, i would imagine
19:43:11 <oerjan> i changed it when ircbrowse was dead for several days
19:43:13 <ehird`> as he last linked to it
19:43:16 <ehird`> oerjan: ah :)
19:43:20 <Slereah> Oh.
19:43:30 <Slereah> Well, it's been a while since I played Creature 3.
19:43:30 <oerjan> could change it back now if we want
19:43:39 <Slereah> I didn't really like that much the spaceship concept.
19:43:39 <Sgeo> Get DS!
19:43:59 <Sgeo> Although that's worse as far as a spaceship concept I guess
19:44:12 <Sgeo> the um.. world is in space
19:44:21 <Sgeo> Capillata I think
19:44:27 <Slereah> Well, it already was in the 3!
19:44:36 <Slereah> Possibly the 2 as well, I don't remember.
19:44:46 <Slereah> Just that the 1 wasn't.
19:44:58 <Sgeo> But with DS, your norns can travel to other players' worlds..
19:45:05 <Sgeo> And they can come to your world
19:45:08 <oerjan> although it is rather slow at the time, so i don't think so
19:45:37 <Sgeo> And I'm working on a device that will torture and kill norns that come to my world, so beware lol
19:45:37 <oerjan> gah, it didn't load at all
19:46:10 <Slereah> With that mud cannon thing?
19:46:53 <Sgeo> Slereah, no, although that is a possibility I guess
19:46:56 <ehird`> Someone rate the evilness of this idea from 1-10:
19:47:02 <ehird`> Compiling Brainfuck code to JVM bytecode.
19:47:10 <ehird`> (Oh yes I am writing a program to do that!)
19:47:22 <oerjan> 3
19:47:35 <ehird`> Pff, just 3?
19:47:35 <Sgeo> I'm making my own agent, and it will effectively slap incoming norns repeatedly, and make sure they DIE
19:47:46 <Sgeo> and make them feel PAIN!
19:47:48 <oerjan> brainfuck is easy to compile
19:47:53 <ehird`> oerjan: Yes, but to the fucking JVM
19:47:54 <ehird`> :D
19:47:59 <oerjan> or so i hear, never tried :D
19:48:02 <Sgeo> It will also send a message to whoever sent me the norn
19:48:07 <Slereah> What if your norns come near it?
19:48:15 <ehird`> Sgeo: I could never do that when playing Creatures. I always felt sorry for the poor thing after about 3 slaps :P
19:48:18 <Sgeo> Nothing to do with proximity
19:48:28 <Sgeo> It will do it to all incoming norns
19:48:36 <Sgeo> It will be invisible too
19:48:42 <Sgeo> Although you can hear the shouts
19:48:42 <Slereah> What if your norns leave and come back? :O
19:48:45 <ehird`> I think I might have had less of a problem with it if they didn't keep trying to tell me to stop in the process
19:49:01 <Sgeo> Then my norns die, I care for them LESS than innocent norns from the warp
19:49:10 <Slereah> Heh.
19:49:19 <Slereah> What if your innocent Grendels die?
19:49:35 <Sgeo> It's going to attack any incoming creatures
19:49:37 <oerjan> ehird`: can you get that bf adventure game to run on the web? :)
19:49:52 <oerjan> in which case, i'll raise you to a 7
19:49:56 * Sgeo is evil
19:49:56 <Sgeo> >.>
19:50:00 <ehird`> oerjan: I probably can.
19:50:18 <ehird`> oerjan: Instead of compiling to input/output statements, use some kind of textbox with awt
19:50:20 <Sgeo> I'm hatching norns to be slaughtered in this manner
19:50:32 <Sgeo> Now I'm working on the messaging thing
19:50:38 <ehird`> oerjan: But it'll be slooow. As I'm not planning on optimizations for now.
19:50:50 <Slereah> Sgeo : Once your system is complete, send invitations.
19:50:58 <ehird`> I just like the JVM, really. I don't care for the Java language in any way, but I like Swing and the VM
19:50:59 <Sgeo> invitations?
19:51:07 <Slereah> For other norns to come!
19:51:17 <Sgeo> The warp doesn't quite work like that
19:51:27 <Sgeo> Unless you mean messaging random people..
19:51:40 <Slereah> Well, random people for random killings.
19:52:56 <ehird`> Hmm.
19:53:04 <ehird`> What's a kind-of-hard-to-compiler (at least, harder than BF) language?
19:53:11 <Sgeo> Slereah, are you getting DS?
19:53:14 <ehird`> Ooh, I could try compiling Befunge->JVM :D
19:54:28 <Slereah> Not right now.
19:54:35 <Slereah> Tomorrow mehby.
19:55:09 <ehird`> oerjan: Actually, how DO the befunge compilers do it?
19:55:21 <ehird`> For a while I know that it was thought to be impossible.
20:02:41 <oerjan> i don't know, never looked at them
20:02:57 <asiekierka> Please rate the evilness of this idea from 1 to 10:
20:03:22 <asiekierka> Combine all esoteric languages into one and write an interpreter in BASIC and don't release the source code and make it extremely slow.
20:03:32 <oerjan> i assume they sort of compile the initial state, with some way to check if a cell has changed
20:03:54 <oerjan> since most befunge programs probably are not that self-modifying
20:03:57 <asiekierka> ...
20:03:59 <asiekierka> .....
20:04:01 <asiekierka> '''
20:04:05 <asiekierka> '
20:04:11 <ehird`> hooray! asiekierka is being an annoying idiot again!
20:04:15 <asiekierka> um
20:04:18 <asiekierka> i just asked
20:04:23 <asiekierka> or
20:04:24 <ehird`> and then spammed the channel
20:04:24 <asiekierka> pleased
20:04:37 <ehird`> and also asked a stupid question with no use in having an answer
20:04:38 <asiekierka> and then made some dots because i'm waiting for answer
20:04:45 <Sgeo> asiekierka, how do you plan on combining all esoteric languages?
20:04:53 <Sgeo> How do you plan on FINDING them, even?
20:04:58 <asiekierka> ... esolangs wiki
20:05:09 <Sgeo> As though everything's on that wiki..
20:05:09 <Slereah> There's like a few hundred of them.
20:05:11 <asiekierka> how? I'll just put every crappier function of all languages
20:05:13 <ehird`> Sgeo: ignore him. he's an idiot.
20:05:14 <oerjan> i rate evilness <<< amount of work
20:05:20 <asiekierka> so?
20:05:21 <asiekierka> 10?
20:05:22 <asiekierka> or -1?
20:05:31 <oerjan> amount of work: 10
20:05:35 <ehird`> asiekierka: You made tons of dots TWO MINUTES after you asked it! WE DO NOT SIT HERE WAITING FOR YOU TO ASK A QUESTION SO WE CAN IMMEDIATELY ANSWER IT.
20:05:41 <Sgeo> Semantic meaningless: 100
20:06:14 <Sgeo> What would it mean to combine all esolangs?
20:06:25 <ehird`> Sgeo: asiekierka doesn't know himself, he's just trying to get attention...
20:06:31 <asiekierka> Put every crappiest function from ALL languages
20:06:36 <asiekierka> and make it work good.
20:06:56 <asiekierka> and
20:06:56 <asiekierka> i
20:06:57 <asiekierka> am
20:06:57 <asiekierka> just
20:06:59 <oerjan> asiekierka: the most interesting esoteric languages are not defined solely by their functions, but by how they fit together
20:06:59 <asiekierka> kidding
20:07:33 * Sgeo works on his norn torturing and murdering machine
20:07:41 <ehird`> i
20:07:42 <Sgeo> ^^more attention getting by me..
20:07:42 <ehird`> a
20:07:42 <ehird`> m
20:07:43 <ehird`> just
20:07:43 <asiekierka> why it's so hard to make an esoteric language?
20:07:45 <ehird`> typig
20:07:46 <ehird`> on
20:07:47 <ehird`> multiple
20:07:47 <ehird`> lines
20:07:48 <ehird`> to
20:07:49 <Slereah> Otherwise, it would be easy to make a language full of useless function!
20:07:50 <ehird`> annoy
20:07:52 <ehird`> people
20:07:54 <oklopol> i think Sgeo is the evil one here.
20:07:54 <ehird`> like asiekierka!
20:08:04 <asiekierka> Well
20:08:05 <asiekierka> but
20:08:06 <Slereah> Like for instance, a function which makes the super mario theme on the PC speaker.
20:08:11 <asiekierka> is there any tutorial
20:08:16 <asiekierka> on making... esoteric... lang..uages?
20:08:27 <oklopol> hmm
20:08:28 <oklopol> there should be
20:08:32 <ehird`> asiekierka: STEP 1. Learn to actually use languages and how they work. STEP 2. You don't need this step!
20:08:43 <Slereah> "Esoteric language" is a vague term.
20:08:45 <asiekierka> STEP 3. Step 2 is false.
20:08:56 <Sgeo> asiekierka, you just come up with an idea for a programing language that no sane person would want to use..
20:08:57 <Slereah> STEP 4 : There is no step 5.
20:09:10 <asiekierka> Step 5: Step 4 is true.
20:09:14 <asiekierka> Step 6: There is Step 5.
20:09:18 * oklopol promises to write a book on esoteric languages some day in case no one does it first
20:09:22 <Slereah> PIME TARADOX
20:09:37 <ehird`> asiekierka: you did that crap with the rules last time you spammed up this place
20:09:57 <asiekierka> ... xD
20:10:01 <oerjan> asiekierka: there was a collective effort to make an esoteric language some months ago by everyone submitting different parts, the resulting mess was so horrible we didn't even _try_ to fit it together
20:10:06 <ehird`> it's not funny, it's really annoying
20:10:10 <Sgeo> oerjan, we gave up?
20:10:14 <Sgeo> D:
20:10:34 <oerjan> ok it _may_ be we just lost interest as usual :D
20:10:50 <asiekierka> \_/"\_/
20:11:09 <oerjan> but it still was a horrible mess that no one knew how to fit together
20:11:13 <ehird`> \_/"\_/ I CAN MAKE USELESS SYMBOLS TOO
20:11:15 <ehird`> \_/"\_/\_/"\_/\_/"\_/\_/"\_/\_/"\_/\_/"\_/\_/"\_/
20:11:17 * Slereah is trying to make an esolang.
20:11:25 * Sgeo is the main interest loser he.. I'm bored. I think I'll do something completely different now.
20:11:27 <Slereah> But with what I know of regular languages, it's hard
20:11:38 <oerjan> and fitting _all_ esolangs together would obviously be worse.
20:11:39 <oklopol> ehird`: don't be so mean on asiekierka :\
20:11:47 <oklopol> let's all get along!
20:11:52 <ehird`> oklopol: he was deeply annoying and stupid last time he's in here
20:11:56 <ehird`> so far he does not seem to be improving
20:12:05 <Sgeo> oerjan, at least no one submitted something that implies it would be a 2D language
20:12:05 <asiekierka> T_T
20:12:43 * ehird` thinks he'll be evil and implement the BF tape as local variables in java
20:12:50 <oklopol> ehird`: i recommend you remind yourself of immibis before talking about annoying ;)
20:12:58 <Sgeo> immibis?
20:13:05 <asiekierka> bye
20:13:06 <asiekierka> BYE
20:13:06 <asiekierka> bye
20:13:12 <ehird`> oklopol: immibis, i've seen the name in here but do not recall them ever talking
20:13:13 <oklopol> wonder if he's here...
20:13:18 <Sgeo> Bye asiekierka, and you only need to say it once
20:13:19 <ehird`> asiekierka: saying it once works too
20:13:21 -!- asiekierka has quit.
20:13:25 <ehird`> with only one casing...
20:13:50 <oklopol> ehird`: whut :\ he used to spam this channel 24/7
20:13:55 * Sgeo goes to continue working on the autospammer
20:13:57 <ehird`> oklopol: show example
20:13:58 <Sgeo> erm
20:14:02 <Sgeo> NO not an autospammer
20:14:03 <Sgeo> >.>
20:14:08 -!- oklopol has changed nick to immibis.
20:14:10 <ehird`> Sgeo: we already have one it's called asiekierka
20:14:10 <Slereah> A hand-activated spammer?
20:14:11 <ehird`> :D
20:14:13 <immibis> LOL TESTING MY BOT A BIT
20:14:17 <immibis> *THIS IS TEST**
20:14:17 <ehird`> oh
20:14:18 <immibis> *THIS IS TEST**
20:14:18 <immibis> *THIS IS TEST**
20:14:19 <immibis> *THIS IS TEST**
20:14:24 <ehird`> immibis made toBoGe
20:14:27 <ehird`> didn't he?
20:14:29 -!- immibis has changed nick to Ooklopol.
20:14:29 <Slereah> So, is it working?
20:14:31 <Sgeo> Slereah, no, a misstatement on my part
20:14:37 <Ooklopol> yeah
20:14:42 <ehird`> which is in the topic, so i guess he isn't hated here or anything
20:14:48 <ehird`> I test my bots in here a lot too
20:14:49 <ehird`> :|
20:15:00 -!- Ooklopol has changed nick to oklopol.
20:15:22 <oklopol> nothing wrong with immibis, but he's definately the floodiest guy ever.
20:17:14 <Sgeo> I can be floody if I.. no I can't..
20:19:17 <oerjan> Sgeo: Das vill be repression due to die trauma at die anal stage
20:19:19 <oklopol> the great thing about immibis was he was able to spam multiple channels semi-manually (no 100% bot loops) while not seeming to realize it at all
20:19:37 <Sgeo> semi-manually?
20:19:44 <oklopol> i explained in the parens
20:20:05 <Sgeo> Yes, but what did he say that caused it?
20:20:14 <Sgeo> ightly tired
20:20:30 <Sgeo> maybe rest self sgeo
20:20:35 * Sgeo pokes Slereah 
20:21:36 <Slereah> Yah?
20:22:44 <oklopol> Sgeo: caused it? ehh
20:22:56 <Sgeo> <Sgeo> maybe rest self sgeo
20:23:02 <Sgeo> look familiar?
20:23:19 <oklopol> why, he had floditis immaturitis, of course
20:23:25 <Slereah> Yes. There's the very same like 5 lines above.
20:23:35 <Slereah> So I have kind of a déjà vu feeling.
20:23:47 <Sgeo> I meant, wrt Creatures3
20:24:27 <Slereah> wrt?
20:24:37 <Sgeo> wrt = with relation to
20:25:18 <Slereah> Well, my last game was at least one year ago.
20:25:26 <Slereah> But I do recall them having bad grammar.
20:31:30 <Slereah> Really, the ` function in unlambda is an annoying character.
20:32:31 <oklopol> no
20:32:32 <oklopol> it's great
20:33:34 <Slereah> Well, the interpreter I have crashes if I type something wrong, and he only accepts `+space to display `.
20:33:45 <Slereah> And for some reason, I can't copypasta.
20:35:17 <oerjan> cannot paste into hugs running programs, yeah
20:35:23 <oerjan> it's annoyed me too
20:35:41 <Slereah> You'd think a program called hug would be more user friendly.
20:35:45 <oerjan> what do you mean by crashing?
20:36:11 <Slereah> Well, there's a program error, and I have to restart everything.
20:36:15 <Slereah> "Unknown operator"
20:36:55 <oerjan> er, sounds like mine
20:37:06 <oerjan> btw it can take file input
20:37:49 <Slereah> "This is an interpreter of the Unlambda language, written in - the pure, lazy, functional language Haskell. -  - Copyright (C) 2001 by Ørjan Johansen "
20:37:58 <Slereah> I suppose it is!
20:38:35 <Slereah> How does the file input works?
20:38:43 <oerjan> try :main filename
20:39:50 <Slereah> Filename, a filepath?
20:39:59 <oerjan> yep
20:40:16 * Slereah looks on Esolang
20:40:28 <Slereah> So you're the one writing the unlambda in INTERCAL too?
20:40:34 <oerjan> indeed
20:40:38 <Slereah> And making me scream of the madness of you people!
20:40:44 <oerjan> :D
20:41:04 <Slereah> Functional esolangs seem like the orphans of the esolangs.
20:41:08 * ehird` wonders how he could make his BF->JVM compiler more evil
20:41:26 <Slereah> ehird` : Make a function that plays a sinister tune.
20:41:31 <ehird`> heh
20:41:32 <ehird`> no :P
20:42:06 * Sgeo is evil.
20:42:32 * Sgeo is going to move a norn into space
20:42:37 <Sgeo> Without air, presumably
20:42:52 <Slereah> Ah yes, the old decompression chamber near the engine.
20:42:59 <Slereah> *Shpof*
20:44:28 <Sgeo> Not quite like that
20:44:33 <Sgeo> She's at the title screen now
20:44:42 <Slereah> "A note about evaluation order: when Unlambda is evaluating an expression `FG, it evaluates F first, and then G"
20:44:45 * ehird` just realised that he doesn't know how to execute some bytecode in java
20:44:47 <ehird`> just create it.
20:44:49 <Slereah> Is that why my SII didn't worked?
20:44:56 <Slereah> Or `i.a for that matter.
20:45:31 <oerjan> well partly
20:45:55 <oerjan> although in the `i.a case it's more that printing only happens when .a is applied _to_ something
20:46:01 <Sgeo> http://sgeo.diagonalfish.net/screenshots/title_screen_norn.png
20:46:16 <Slereah> Oh.
20:46:23 <ehird`> java should have a java.lang.runByteCode or something :P
20:46:25 <oerjan> application happens after _both_ parts have been evaluated, btw
20:46:27 <Slereah> Any particular reason why?
20:46:49 <Slereah> That's a creepy norn.
20:46:55 <oklopol> strictness is easy to implement...
20:47:26 <Sgeo> I did `targ norn mvsf 0 0`
20:47:35 <oklopol> hmm, now Lazy K, is that just lazy SKI? i'm too lazy to wiki right now
20:47:50 <Slereah> Lazy K is just SKI, yes.
20:47:52 <Sgeo> Slereah, which norn's creepy? The real norn, or the purple one that's part of the title screen?
20:47:54 <ehird`> Lazy K is not!
20:47:57 <ehird`> Lazy K has many syntaxes
20:47:58 <ehird`> it's crazy
20:48:03 <oklopol> (damn, forgot to make a pun)
20:48:03 <Slereah> Although it can also work with *i
20:48:10 <Slereah> abd 01 from Jot.
20:48:18 <Slereah> And unlambda notation
20:48:36 <oklopol> :O
20:48:36 <oklopol> oh
20:48:39 <oklopol> cool
20:48:49 <oklopol> perhaps i *should* check it out then,.
20:48:52 <oklopol> .,.,.,.,;:;:;
20:49:24 <oerjan> all the unlambda functions except d (delay) only do things when applied to something
20:49:47 <oerjan> er, that's not quite right
20:49:52 <oerjan> even d
20:50:21 <Sgeo> http://sgeo.diagonalfish.net/screenshots/title_screen_w_map.png
20:50:25 <oerjan> primitive functions, i should say
20:50:45 <oerjan> expressions may of course apply their parts during evaluation
21:02:29 <ehird`> I wonder what the most complex esolang is.
21:02:57 <oerjan> Magenta perhaps?
21:03:49 <Slereah> Define "complex".
21:21:59 <oerjan> well for a different "complex", i guess quantum brainfuck could also qualify :)
21:25:44 <ehird`> heh
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21:51:59 <ehird`> This is not a message
21:55:29 <oerjan> This is not an incredible predictable answer
21:55:34 <oerjan> *ly
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22:06:35 <ehird`> IMPORTANT STATEMENT
22:09:14 <oerjan> OBSCURE COUNTEREXAMPLE
22:10:14 <ehird`> ERROR
22:10:37 <oerjan> PARTIAL FIX
22:16:04 <ehird`> WORKSFORME
22:16:26 <bsmntbombdood> NOT SAFE FOR WORK
22:16:49 <ehird`> WONTFIX
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22:32:47 <ehird`> random, esoteric and computer-related (although not programming-language-related) idea: is there a language-sensitive diff? you could get patches that don't die horribly with two different formattings (code-style that is) of the same source, etc.
22:33:32 <oklopol> diff?
22:34:46 <oerjan> it rings a bell
22:37:07 <oerjan> some google hits
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22:50:13 <ehird`> 2 = 5
22:50:18 <ehird`> oklopol: you know, diff(1)
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23:01:30 <oerjan> splitty weather today
23:01:48 <bsmntbombdood> oooh i think it's supposed to snow today
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23:04:03 <oerjan> the snow here has rained away again, for now
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23:07:09 * oerjan hates it when irssi misses that a bunch of rejoins are from netsplits
23:12:28 <Sgeo_> oerjan, hms?
23:20:53 -!- ehird` has joined.
23:21:51 <ehird`> WAIT. WHAT DID I MISS. THIS IS IMPORTANT.
23:22:55 <oerjan> * oerjan hates it when irssi misses that a bunch of rejoins are from netsplits
23:23:00 <oerjan> Sgeo_> oerjan, hms?
23:23:26 <oerjan> and a bit more
23:23:37 <ehird`> (define a bit)
23:23:47 <ehird`> (set! bit (or 0 1))
23:23:53 <oerjan> 3 lines
23:24:12 <oerjan> about the weather, on net and off
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23:25:03 <oerjan> Sgeo_: irssi tries to summarize netsplits and netjoins, but sometimes it fails entirely and dumps a page of noise
23:25:54 <oerjan> not a problem on this channel, but annoying on #haskell which has ~400 users
23:27:29 <ehird`> once there was a netsplit in #ubuntu and about 400 people disappeared
23:28:12 <oerjan> eek
23:28:12 <ehird`> hm, there should be some kind of standard (probably not official :P) defining an api for graphics interfaces
23:28:17 <ehird`> just the api, not the actual display of them
23:28:32 <ehird`> so e.g. someone could write one that wraps around a toolkit, or various toolkits
23:28:34 <ehird`> not even X-specific
23:28:40 <ehird`> its a cloud dream I know :-)
23:29:27 * oerjan wonders if it's called html DOM
23:40:12 <ehird`> oerjan: hah
23:40:21 <ehird`> html is hardly ideal for writing a desktop app
23:40:31 <ehird`> no matter what the "2.0" proponents would like to have you believe
23:40:42 <ehird`> on another note, i am going to generate a brainfuck "hello world" using natural selection.
23:40:45 <ehird`> why? i have no idea.
23:43:59 <bsmntbombdood> hms
23:44:38 <ehird`> hms what
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23:47:51 <ehird`> !bf >[+.->->]+>[.>[+]>][>.+>]-->>>->>>>+>.++>>>+>
23:48:01 <ehird`> my program started off with that
23:48:02 <ehird`> :P
23:48:04 <ehird`> !ps
23:48:07 <EgoBot> 1 ehird`: ps
23:48:10 <ehird`> hm
23:48:14 <ehird`> it must output something
23:48:19 <ehird`> so i guess its a non-printable character
23:48:20 <ehird`> not too bad.
23:59:03 <ehird`> [>>.>>>]>>-..>.-[].>-[-]>[[>>+[+>>[].++[.>->.[.>..>>[>[-+.[.>>]-[.].+[+-+[..>.[]->[-.-.].[]->.].>+]>]]>++]]+>[+.>>+++>--+-+>]>>+[[[].>].->-[-.>+-]>>>]>>>>][>][-]>-+>..+->>>[]+>>].]>>>[]+.>>>->->+.->[+.[.[>.+]+->-.]>>]->[+>->-[>[++]>..>.+[>.+.+.][[-->>-.]][>+[>.-]>>.>>-]][>+[+>.-+>+[+[>[[->[.>-]]]]]]]]
23:59:09 <ehird`> im pretty sure that doesn't print hello world
23:59:09 <ehird`> :P