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02:28:15 <GregorR> So, y'know how I mentioned that JSMMIX was too slow?
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04:57:58 <Sgeo> No xkcd tonight, Randall's taking a vacation.
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10:14:53 <GregorR> JSMIPS is coming together much better than JSMMIX did ^^
10:25:27 <AnMaster> Deewiant, is it allowed to make the , instruction output the cell as UTF8?
11:22:53 <AnMaster> Deewiant, I made ccbi segfault
11:23:21 <AnMaster> Deewiant, in REFC, I believe, I fixed the valgrind error that happened for cfunge in that one, but well I don't know where ccbi segfaults
11:24:31 <AnMaster> Deewiant, basically 0D before you do any R, test code (complex because it was found using fuzz testing) at http://rafb.net/p/zjR5x060.html
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11:36:04 <AnMaster> Deewiant, in fact this is enough to crash ccbi: "CFER"4(0D @
11:39:48 <AnMaster> Deewiant, oh wait, you crash on any invalid value to D
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13:52:18 <Deewiant> AnMaster: yep, doing array[ip.stack.pop()] isn't a good idea ^_^
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14:33:13 <RodgerTheGreat> GregorR: is JMIPS a MIPS-architecture CPU simulator written in JavaScript?
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15:31:21 <AnMaster> Deewiant, hope you fixed it :)
15:31:55 <AnMaster> Deewiant, oh btw I found some new nifty functions to microoptimize with, mostly to irritate ehird really
15:32:43 <AnMaster> look up the man pages if you want the details, anyway I check if they are available ;P
15:33:07 <AnMaster> <insert manical laughter here />
15:34:25 <AnMaster> Deewiant, however man posixoptions is interesting
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17:34:08 <AnMaster> Deewiant, I'm rewriting parts of the hash library to make it less generic, and more fit for cfunge
17:36:01 <AnMaster> shaved about 0.010 seconds of the hash stuff, which is around 1/5 of the time spent in that code
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19:50:36 <AnMaster> I wonder if hash table is in fact not the wrong way
19:58:38 <AnMaster> Deewiant, what would you recommend for funge-space?
19:59:01 <AnMaster> some sort of binary tree maybe?
19:59:20 <AnMaster> would that work better do you think?
19:59:26 <Deewiant> I'd say hash table is, of the 'simple' data structures, the best
19:59:37 <Deewiant> what you can think about is the fact that the usual use case is:
19:59:44 <AnMaster> Deewiant, ok I get quite a few hash collisions
19:59:55 <Deewiant> do pg stuff in some area which may or may not be the same
20:00:07 <AnMaster> Deewiant, well we do move around in one area, but that doesn't really help much
20:00:09 <Deewiant> so some sort of partitioned tree might be nice
20:00:30 <Deewiant> AnMaster: for non-flying deltas you'd get O(1) access to the next node
20:00:39 <Deewiant> and I'd argue that 99% of the time you are, in fact, not flying ;-)
20:00:51 <AnMaster> Deewiant, not really as you need to look up the next cell
20:01:13 <Deewiant> I mean, if you have a quadtree or octree
20:01:21 <Deewiant> you can just follow a pointer to get to the next cell
20:01:39 <AnMaster> Deewiant, yes but what about non-flying?
20:02:02 <Deewiant> say, partition space into 128x128 squares
20:02:10 <AnMaster> Deewiant, also what about looking up value at another place, using p or such
20:02:12 <Deewiant> within such a square, always travel by the trees
20:02:36 <Deewiant> if moving to another square which is some distance away, lookup that square and find the target cell from a tree
20:03:12 <Deewiant> I'd possibly keep a few 'last accessed' pointers to trees
20:03:28 <Deewiant> and check them on funge-space access to see if you already have a close cell
20:03:31 <AnMaster> or is there any library I wonder?
20:04:16 <AnMaster> Deewiant, also that would not work with current funge-space interface, would have to extend it for IP travel
20:04:40 <AnMaster> current is get (x,y) basically
20:04:51 <AnMaster> so I would need a getnext(x,y,direction)
20:05:06 <Deewiant> since you already have the current position
20:05:33 <Deewiant> so you know that get(x+1, y) is like get(x,y, east)
20:05:36 <AnMaster> but still need a funge-space interface for this special "get from current" instead of just "get absolute x,y)
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20:07:21 <Deewiant> but yeh, something to think about
20:07:27 <Deewiant> I don't know if it's really that big an advantage
20:08:21 <AnMaster> well I was able to speed up current hash a bit but making it less general
20:08:53 <AnMaster> ie, sizeof(fungekeytype) and getting rid of memcmp and doing comparing by hand, ie the reverse of generic types
20:09:11 <AnMaster> Deewiant, still I think what I really need is a better hash function
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20:36:11 <AnMaster> Deewiant, any idea how to do copy on write in C? it seems the best for opcode stacks in split
20:36:55 <AnMaster> yes I know CCBI doesn't duplicate them across split
20:37:34 <Deewiant> keep a pointer, set copy to true, when writing, if copy, copy the data and set copy to false
20:37:55 <Deewiant> something similar in both the original and the split IP
20:40:25 <AnMaster> hm wonder if overhead is larger or not
20:45:02 <AnMaster> Deewiant, how is speed on my current trunk for you?
20:46:13 <Deewiant> linux machine isn't on, can't test
20:47:05 <AnMaster> Deewiant, it doesn't compile on windows?
20:47:18 <Deewiant> but since you're using POSIX-only stuff, probably not
20:47:26 <AnMaster> well since windows is posix iirc it should
20:47:42 <Deewiant> I don't have the required crap installed
20:47:48 <Deewiant> I could run it in cygwin, of course
20:47:53 <Deewiant> but I don't have bzr and can't be bothered
20:48:09 <Deewiant> and performance testing is kinda pointless in such an environment
20:48:19 <Deewiant> whether I use cygwin or MS's stuff
20:48:19 <AnMaster> heh true, windows does suck indeed
20:48:24 <Deewiant> it'll be a billion times slower than on *nix
20:48:35 <AnMaster> of course, all windows stuff are
20:49:01 <Deewiant> but emulating posix is, definitely
21:17:33 <GregorR> Although still slow, it's faster than JSMMIX was. malloc isn't working right now though >_<
21:17:45 <GregorR> But that can be worked around with -msoft-float
21:18:20 <RodgerTheGreat> I know some MIPS ASM- lemme know if you need help writing demo apps for it or something
21:18:36 <GregorR> My goal is to use /real/ apps as demo apps :P
21:18:58 <GregorR> I can do "Hello, world!" with write(), but not with printf() since that uses malloc (which, as I mentioned, isn't working)
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21:29:46 <ehird_> the intercal community is huge
21:29:50 <ehird_> all of one person downloaded my mirror
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21:31:40 * oerjan wonders what kind of bug ais523 is talking about
21:33:35 <GregorR> http://www.codu.org/jsmips/
21:34:29 * oerjan isn't a productive Intercal programmer, the unlambda interpreter is my only work afair
21:35:38 <AnMaster> ehird_, you will be happy over my last extreme microoptimizing
21:36:05 <AnMaster> posix_fadvice when reading files ;) on and posix_fallocate when writing ;P
21:36:16 <AnMaster> I decided to use them just to irritate you
21:37:12 <RodgerTheGreat> GregorR: wow- JSMIPS is pretty impressively fast for what it does
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21:37:41 <GregorR> Please note that the vast majority of the time after you press the button is taken loading the ELF file :P
21:38:39 <GregorR> Well then your computer clearly rawx0rz mine >_>
21:39:07 <RodgerTheGreat> MIPS is a CPU architecture common in embedded systems and the Playstation 1 and 2
21:39:10 <ehird_> but it runs in a few mips here too
21:39:18 <ehird_> RodgerTheGreat: Oh my god you MUST implement the PS api
21:39:38 <GregorR> Wow, THAT would be fast :P
21:39:59 <RodgerTheGreat> hehe. GregorR: think you could hack JSMIPS into an EmotionEngine emulator? :)
21:40:06 <GregorR> But I'm going to stick with the loftier goal of printf("Hello, world!") for the moment.
21:42:53 <ehird_> GregorR: Printf doesn't need malloc
21:43:24 <RodgerTheGreat> hm. I'm tempted to take a crack at implementing my "Revolver" architecture in JS and creating a similar VM.
21:45:14 <ehird_> GregorR: http://rafb.net/p/PH5m5q12.html
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21:58:12 <ehird_> NOTE-AIS523: In file included from src/cesspool.c:40:
21:58:12 <ehird_> /usr/lib/gcc/i686-apple-darwin8/4.0.1/include/varargs.h:4:2: error: #error "GCC no longer implements <varargs.h>."
21:58:36 <ehird_> olsner: C-INTERCAL source file
22:00:06 <ehird_> ais523 - in fact just define _POSIX_SOURCE
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22:02:32 <GregorR> ehird_: It shouldn't, but newlib's does :P
22:02:45 <ehird_> GregorR: It just needs _POSIX_SOURCE
22:03:41 <GregorR> Oh wait, cross-contaminated conversations?
22:03:55 <GregorR> ehird_: printf shouldn't need malloc, but newlib's does :P
22:04:49 <ehird_> GregorR: So use my skeleton
22:04:54 <ehird_> Not that hard to implement a full printf
22:05:07 <GregorR> ehird_: I'm not going to diverge from newlib just to bypass a bug I'll need to fix anyway ...
22:05:27 <ehird_> GregorR: http://sourceforge.net/projects/pdclib
22:05:38 <ehird_> That is quite complete, has a real printf, a real malloc
22:05:42 <ehird_> And its very simple to understand
22:06:07 <GregorR> Its malloc probably won't work either - I just need to fix whatever bug in the CPU implementation causes malloc to fail.
22:07:25 <ehird_> GregorR: Still, take a look at it anyway
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22:16:50 <ehird_> RodgerTheGreat: it's lowercase, #esoteric
22:17:19 <ehird_> RodgerTheGreat: but all irc chans are lowercase
22:17:59 -!- ehird_ has set topic: #esoteric LOGS: http://ircbrowse.com/cdates.html?channel=esoteric WIKI: http://esolangs.org/wiki/ FILES: http://esolangs.org/files/.
22:18:15 -!- lament has set topic: LOGS: http://ircbrowse.com/cdates.html?channel=esoteric WIKI: http://esolangs.org/wiki/ FILES: http://esolangs.org/files/.
22:18:26 -!- lament has set topic: #eSOTERIC LOGS: http://ircbrowse.com/cdates.html?channel=esoteric WIKI: http://esolangs.org/wiki/ FILES: http://esolangs.org/files/.
22:19:20 -!- ehird_ has set topic: #esoteric = http://ircbrowse.com/cdates.html?channel=esoteric.
22:19:42 <GregorR> Hahahaha, if I got GCC in MIPS, I could compile stuff (extremely slowly) in my browser! :P
22:19:50 <lament> nooo what about the link to the wiki
22:19:57 -!- ehird_ has set topic: ircbrowse.com/cdates.html?channel=esoteric.
22:20:06 <ehird_> the only reason the logs are there is because freenode requires it
22:20:09 -!- GregorR has set topic: PLACE TOPIC HERE.
22:20:17 <ehird_> GregorR: freenode doesn't allow that
22:20:24 <ehird_> mine was the shortest valid one
22:20:28 <GregorR> I DON'T SEE THEM STOPPING ME
22:20:37 -!- ehird_ has set topic: logs@ircbrowse.com.
22:20:41 <ehird_> people can find 'em themselves
22:20:47 -!- ehird_ has set topic: ircbrowse.com.
22:20:51 <olsner> GregorR: is that MIPS the instruction set/cpu or some other meaning of MIPS you're referring to?
22:20:52 <ehird_> and people can find ircbrowse on google
22:20:55 -!- ehird_ has set topic: ircbrowse.
22:21:16 <GregorR> olsner: And no, not that kind of ISA *hah hah hah ambiguity is fun*
22:21:26 <GregorR> (That is, the instruction set :P )
22:21:31 * olsner suddenly understands nothing
22:21:42 <GregorR> http://www.codu.org/jsmips/
22:21:50 <olsner> you've found a MIPS emulator in JS or something like that?
22:22:02 <GregorR> I /write/ a MIPS emulator in JS
22:22:42 <olsner> well, MIPS is pretty common, so it shouldn't be hard to get a GCC running... but you do need some kind of OS interface for GCC to use for reading files and stuff like that
22:23:09 <lament> does freenode actually require to disclose the location of the logs?
22:23:11 <olsner> wouldn't know how hard it would be to hand-code syscalls out into JS code for everything that GCC needs to interface
22:23:26 <olsner> you should just boot linux on it! :P
22:23:46 -!- lament has set topic: LOGGED.
22:24:28 <GregorR> I've written a few basic syscalls, and I have a GCC /targeting/ it :P
22:25:45 <olsner> aah, you're just one step away from cross-compiling gcc to be hosted on it then
22:25:45 -!- GregorR has set topic: W/LOG.
22:26:09 -!- olsner has set topic: LOGD.
22:28:21 -!- GregorR has set topic: To anyone whom it may concern, the discourse, discussions and general chatting of any sort on this channel are recorded by an automated program, which then proceeds to copy said recordings (herein "logs") into a permanent location. Although not easily alterable, the logs are accessible via a web page (using the Hypertext Transfer Protocol) with the Universal Resource Locator http://ircbrowse.com/cdates.html?channel=esoteric.
22:28:23 -!- Iskr has quit ("Leaving").
22:28:41 -!- pikhq has set topic: cat /var/log/#esoteric.
22:28:53 -!- ehird_ has set topic: ircbrowse.
22:29:06 -!- GregorR has set topic: To whom it may concern, the discourse, discussions and general chatting of any sort on this discussion forum (colloquially, "channel") are recorded by an automated program, which then proceeds to copy said recordings (herein "logs") into a permanent location. Although not easily alterable, the logs are accessible via a web page (using the Hypertext Transfer Protocol) with the Universal Resource Locator http://ircbrowse.com/cdates.html?channel=eso.
22:29:10 -!- oerjan has set topic: ln.
22:29:10 -!- ehird_ has set topic: ircbrowse.
22:29:20 -!- ehird_ has set topic: ibrowse.
22:29:26 <ehird_> people can deduce irc themselves
22:29:28 -!- ehird_ has set topic: browse.
22:29:36 <pikhq> GregorR: It's Uniform Resource Locator, not Universal.
22:29:37 <ehird_> browse, abbeviated -> bws
22:29:39 -!- ehird_ has set topic: bws.
22:29:45 -!- ehird_ has set topic: bs.
22:29:49 -!- GregorR has set topic: To whom it may concern, the discourse, discussions and general chatting of any sort on this discussion forum (colloquially, "channel") are recorded by an automated program, which then proceeds to copy said recordings (herein "logs") into a permanent location. Although not easily alterable, the logs are accessible via a web page (using the Hypertext Transfer Protocol) with the Uniform Resource Locator http://ircbrowse.com/cdates.html?channel=esote.
22:30:35 -!- GregorR has set topic: To whom it may concern, the discourse, discussions and general chatting of any sort on this discussion forum (colloquially, "channel") are recorded by an automated program, which then copies said recordings (herein "logs") into a permanent location. Although not easily alterable, the logs are accessible via a web page (using the Hypertext Transfer Protocol) with the Uniform Resource Locator http://ircbrowse.com/cdates.html?channel=esoteric.
22:31:20 <GregorR> Maximally verbose, minimally informative.
22:32:28 * oerjan wants that in Victorian English
22:32:52 <GregorR> Does babelfish have an English->Victorian English translation service?
22:33:34 -!- ehird_ has set topic: Quien corresponda, a, el discurso, los debates generales y de charlar de cualquier tipo en este foro de debate (coloquialmente, "canal") son registrados por un programa automatizado, que luego copia dice grabaciones (en lo sucesivo "registros") en una ubicación permanente. Aunque no son fácilmente modificables, los registros son accesibles a través de una página web (utilizando el Protocolo de transferencia de hipertexto) con el localizador u.
22:33:53 -!- olsner has set topic: Den hr This kanalen channel loggas is being logged och and loggarna the logs sparas are saved p on en a server server p on internet the internet, p at adressen address http://ircbrowse.com/cdates.html?channel=esoteric.
22:34:06 <olsner> in a minimally readable way
22:34:06 -!- ehird_ has set topic: 関係者各位は、談話は、いかなる種類のチャット及び全般的な議論をしてこのディスカッションフォーラム（口語では、 "チャネル" ）は、自動で記録されたプログラムは、その後のコピーによると録音（ここに"ログ" ）を恒久的なロケーションです。簡単に変更はないが、これらのログには、ウェブページを介してアクセスできる（.
22:34:13 <ehird_> that should be japanese.
22:34:25 <olsner> ehird_: as if that is the actual topic message?
22:34:41 <olsner> also, apply SJIS to UTF-8 recoding on that
22:34:54 <ehird_> blame google translate
22:34:55 <olsner> oerjan: ja, visst r det? :P
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22:35:28 <ehird_> الى من يهمه الامر ، الحديث ، والمناقشات العامة الدردشه من اي نوع على مناقشة هذا المنتدى (بشكل عامي ، "قناة") لم تسجل مؤتمت البرنامج ، الذي قال بعد ذلك نسخ التسجيلات (هنا "السجلات") الى موقع ثابت. وان لم يكن للتغيير بسهولة ، ويمكن الوصول اليها عبر الجذوع صفحة
22:35:32 <ehird_> ويب (باستخدام بروتوكول نقل النص التشعبي) مع عنوان إنترنت http://ircbrowse.com/cdates.html؟channel=esoteric
22:35:35 -!- ehird_ has set topic: الى من يهمه الامر ، الحديث ، والمناقشات العامة الدردشه من اي نوع على مناقشة هذا المنتدى (بشكل عامي ، "قناة") لم تسجل مؤتمت البرنامج ، الذي قال بعد ذلك نسخ التسجيلات (هنا "السجلات") الى موقع ثابت. وان لم يكن للتغيير بسهولة ، ويمكن الوصول اليها عبر الجذوع.
22:35:42 <olsner> now that is seriously broken in xchat
22:36:59 * ehird_ is putting multibebl on it
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22:42:09 <ehird_> Process-prominent the relative one, the argument and diverse variable
22:42:10 <ehird_> arguments and in this general of tribune (" in the universal
22:42:10 <ehird_> word,; this interests channel" ) in sistemazione (here "
22:42:10 <ehird_> What logs" of the interests; Memorizzato he) around the neighbor
22:42:10 <ehird_> to the copy of the automated program, in the position of the normal
22:42:11 <ehird_> position. The probably easy modification, but that one interests the
22:42:14 <ehird_> HTTP of the URL of the logarithm of Naperian:
22:42:19 <ehird_> /ircbrowse.com/cdates.html? (of the FTP of the end of the customs of
22:42:19 <ehird_> the File Transfer Protocol) it is with the simple exactitude of
22:42:19 <ehird_> channel=esoteric the homepage
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22:48:28 <ais523> oerjan: you mingle a value which might be above 65535
22:48:42 <ais523> (you throw the high bits away anyway, but it can cause an error before then)
22:48:58 <ais523> the bug in your code was hidden by a bug in C-INTERCAL, which when I fixed exposed the bug in your code
22:49:19 <ais523> (4402) DO RESUME '?'"?!101~#128'$!101~.101'"~#65535'$#2'~#3
22:49:34 <ais523> (that's the corrected line, you can find the original by searching for the line number (4402))
22:49:46 <ais523> I added the select against 65535
22:50:01 <ehird_> (while compiling on os x)
22:50:09 -!- ais523 has changed nick to ais523|busy.
22:50:40 <ais523|busy> ehird_: I'm busy with something else at the moment, I don't have time to go logreading
22:50:50 <ehird_> but its a severe c-intercal bug
22:50:54 <ais523|busy> or even to answer questions about compiling unless they're easy enough to answer in a couple of line
22:51:03 <ehird_> but it required hand-hacking
22:51:12 -!- ais523|busy has changed nick to i.
22:51:18 -!- i has changed nick to ais523|busy.
22:51:46 <ais523|busy> ehird_: most versions of C-INTERCAL before I fixed the build system needed hand-hacking for me too
22:54:01 <ehird_> ais523|busy: you use va_dcl and vaargs.h and other stuff on OS X
22:54:06 <ehird_> defining _POSIX_SOURCE for it fixes it
22:54:30 <ais523|busy> ehird_: varargs vs. stdarg has been conditioned on _POSIX_SOURCE for ages
22:54:46 <ais523|busy> for some reason they didn't pick an identifier which is defined by default, obviously
22:54:58 <ehird_> ais523|busy: But you don't define _POSIX_SOURCE on OS X. You should.
22:55:00 <ais523|busy> but I should be able to change it to something autoconf-detected easily enough
22:55:03 <ehird_> Because otherwise it breaks
22:55:35 <ais523|busy> so I'll get autoconf to define it if it finds stdarg.h (which should be strong enough evidence that stdarg is available)
22:55:43 <ais523|busy> C-INTERCAL predates C89 catching on, you see
22:56:02 <ais523|busy> and the use of stdarg.h was hacked in later as a nonstandard default...
23:00:25 <ais523|busy> anyway, the solution's pretty simple once the problem's known, so I can fix that for the next version
23:00:25 <ais523|busy> (which I'll probably release once the bug reports die down as 1.28)
23:00:41 <ehird_> ais523|busy: nobody used my mirror, btw :)
23:00:58 <ehird_> RodgerTheGreat: it's your topic, in arabic
23:01:25 <RodgerTheGreat> Colloquy handles the arabic script like a champ, naturally
23:02:23 <ais523|busy> (of course, I'd have no hope of understanding it if I were using telnet, but it's Konversation today as I'm too busy to respond to pings manually)
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23:04:59 <ais523|busy> heh, I just got a notification because ehird_'s ghost was on the wrong side of a netsplit
23:06:06 <ais523|busy> that's one of the most pointless things my client's ever started flashing at me about
23:09:25 <ais523|busy> hmm... it seems that C-INTERCAL is Debian's 17745th most popular package in terms of the number of people who use it regularly
23:09:54 <ais523|busy> (and that doesn't count me, because I don't have the Debian package for C-INTERCAL installed because it would interfere with my development)
23:13:52 * oerjan wonders if it follows Zipf's law
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23:16:00 <oerjan> (in which case, somewhere between 50 and 70 thousand perhaps?)
23:16:15 -!- Deformati has changed nick to Deformative.
23:17:15 <ais523|busy> RodgerTheGreat: sufficiently many that both Firefox and Kate went SIGSEGV when I tried to paste the list from one into the other
23:18:00 <RodgerTheGreat> and even more interesting would be how many of those 50-70 thousand packages are included in the "over 2000" figure for GPLv3 projects
23:19:58 <ais523|busy> it ranks 58523rd in terms of packages for which users had sent invalid data back for, though, so there must be at least that many packages
23:20:18 <ais523|busy> (apparently, all data anyone has sent back about C-INTERCAL usage are vaild)
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