00:00:57 Slereah: Anyway. 00:01:03 (read) only reads an s-expr. 00:01:06 Hello world <-- won't work 00:01:08 (a b c) <-- works 00:01:16 Slereah: Basically, (read) reads some Scheme code. 00:01:54 But, display (read) works as a one time occurence :o 00:02:14 Slereah: Shut up. (read) reads a peice of scheme code. 00:02:21 That's all you need to know. 00:02:24 Try it. 00:02:26 In the REPL. 00:02:29 Oh, wait. 00:02:36 Slereah: What are you using instead of the run button 00:02:51 I was using the command line of Dr Scheme 00:03:14 Slereah: You are running the graphical IDE. Yes? 00:03:35 Yes. 00:05:41 http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3169/2554098095_a9cd81f67b_o.jpg 00:05:41 What unholy magic is this :o 00:05:48 Slereah: So, you are typing in the window. 00:05:50 Then, PRESS RUN. 00:05:55 A screen will appear at the bottom. 00:06:01 Where you can type scheme code and have it show the result. 00:06:05 And it'll run your program in it. 00:06:05 DO IT 00:06:08 Already did, as soon as you mentioned it! 00:06:20 Slereah: Hokay. :P 00:06:25 Well 'butt' displays because it's parsed as a symbol. 00:06:29 Slereah: Try this. 00:06:34 #$"£()*(SAD 00:06:34 How peculiar. 00:06:40 It'll error out. 00:06:46 Because read READS A SCHEME EXPRESSION. 00:06:47 Ah yes. 00:06:58 Well, what is the input-as-string? 00:07:07 Slereah: Well, (read-line) will do 00:07:10 Something like this: 00:07:17 -!- revcompgeek has left (?). 00:07:31 (define (cat) (display (read-line)) (cat)) 00:07:33 Doesn't do EOF, but who cares. 00:07:37 -!- oerjan has joined. 00:07:39 Use as (cat) in the REPL after running 00:07:40 I tried read line. 00:07:48 "reference to undefined identifier: read-line" 00:08:32 Slereah: Hokay, let me figure out what mzscheme calls it 00:08:33 :P 00:08:59 I set the language to R5RS, is it the awesome one 00:09:07 -!- timotiis has quit (Remote closed the connection). 00:09:07 Slereah: No. 00:09:12 Set it to Standard. 00:09:18 What is? 00:09:18 It is standard. 00:09:22 Slereah: No. 00:09:24 "Standard (R5RS)" 00:09:24 It's set at "R5RS". 00:09:26 Oh. 00:09:29 Slereah: Wait. 00:10:32 Slereah: K wait. 00:10:54 * Slereah waits some more 00:10:58 * Slereah nops 00:11:02 o.o 00:11:04 Slereah: PLT->Textual. 00:11:09 what on earth are you kids doing 00:11:17 R5RS is the scheme standard specification, but it's what's referred to as "HILARIOUSLY MINIMAL" 00:11:23 Oh. 00:11:28 No liberries? 00:11:31 PLT->Textual is pretty much like R5RS except it has like 453507349853457934859385 more function. 00:11:33 *functions 00:11:34 and libraries 00:11:34 and shizz 00:11:43 It's the 'MzScheme language', basically. 00:11:51 (MzScheme is PLT's scheme implementation, that the DrScheme IDE uses) 00:12:17 Slereah: Then click Run again. 00:12:24 The read-line stuff should work. 00:12:35 Well, yours work 00:12:39 My lambda thing doesn't. 00:12:50 Slereah: Who cares, that code was frankly messed up. 00:12:56 By the by, are you putting yer newlines in the right place? 00:13:00 [[(define (cat) 00:13:00 (display (read-line)) 00:13:00 (cat))] 00:13:05 err 00:13:05 [[ 00:13:06 (define (cat) 00:13:06 (display (read-line)) 00:13:06 (cat)) 00:13:07 ]] 00:13:14 Slereah: You should put all the ending parens on the same line ye see. 00:13:20 None of this c-style: 00:13:21 (foo 00:13:22 bar 00:13:23 ) 00:13:32 Messed up maybe. 00:13:38 But why does it no work! 00:13:53 Slereah: Shush you. 00:13:56 Or work only once, that is 00:13:58 Read sick pea. 00:14:26 Slereah: Either read sicp if you want to know or just do what I say. :P 00:14:34 Ill urine won't help me much. 00:14:44 I doubt I'll be able to read it all before going to bed! 00:14:50 Or find the related part 00:15:05 Or possibly understand it. You never know with those computer fellows. 00:15:12 watch SICP :o 00:15:28 Why, is there a feature movie now? 00:15:35 Sans Nom 00:15:40 no you can watch the original lectures 00:15:46 Or find the related part 00:15:46 http://swiss.csail.mit.edu/classes/6.001/abelson-sussman-lectures/ 00:15:47 DON'T. 00:15:52 What is so hard about reading it in order? 00:15:56 that would be such a cool name if it wasn't the exact opposite of a name. 00:15:57 Jeez. It's a book, not a reference. 00:15:59 you can also watch berkeley's more confusing version with brian harvey 00:16:03 http://webcast.berkeley.edu/course_details.php?seriesid=1906978502 00:16:10 tusho : Length and the fact that it goes through a lot of already known stuff 00:16:11 You're meant to read it from start to end, in order, and read all of it. 00:16:24 i agree with tusho 00:16:27 whole thing man 00:16:29 Slereah: Well I'm not gonna help you until you do, because you're making it hard for yourself and asking us questions it can answer. 00:16:30 done use it as a ref 00:16:36 augur: *don't 00:16:38 augur : I read sexuality into that 00:16:55 Slereah: You read sexuality into everything, especially SICP, which you use as an excuse to ignore it's content. 00:16:55 ::sexualities you:: 00:16:58 hey oklofok 00:16:58 -!- timotiis has joined. 00:17:01 do you oklofuck? 00:17:06 yes he does 00:17:10 awesome 00:17:14 Nah, I only read D&D in SICP 00:17:41 http://swiss.csail.mit.edu/classes/6.001/abelson-sussman-lectures/wizard.jpg 00:17:42 See? 00:17:48 That's what I'm talking about. 00:17:52 dude 00:17:54 watch SICP 00:17:57 and you'll be a wizard 00:17:58 :o 00:18:26 augur: I think Slereah has severe ADHD and also a joy of giving people questions that he has the materials with which to answer himself but which he ignores so he can 'read D&D into them' 00:18:30 it's happened before.. 00:18:49 when sussman does over the metacircular evaluator 00:19:00 he dones a fez and a nice jacket 00:19:15 and they play also sprach zarathustra 00:19:24 Indiana Jones would kick his ass in a second. 00:21:11 Reading online books is not a lot of fun, tusho 00:21:39 Slereah: Get a hard copy. 00:21:50 http://ocw.mit.edu/OcwWeb/Electrical-Engineering-and-Computer-Science/index.htm 00:21:52 From ze MIT press! 00:21:58 mit open course ware on EE and CS 00:22:11 Well, it would take a week to arrive. 00:22:26 you can masturbate in the mean time. 00:22:44 Although maybe they got it in town. 00:22:44 But... 00:22:44 FULL OF FRENCH 00:23:10 Slereah: don't read SICP, it'll prolly kill you, just use it as a ref, and ask questions here whenever you're not sure if it might answer them 00:23:22 don't read sicp, you're too stupid for it! 00:23:33 yes, you suck haha lol 00:23:52 I see what you did there --_-- 00:25:49 well probably with THOSE MASSIVE EYES 00:26:22 i don't really have an opinion about whether sicp should be read, although it is a nice book 00:26:56 oklofok: it should certainly be read if you're writing terrible scheme and expecting us to help 00:27:07 especially if you're writing A COMPILER. 00:27:12 which is, uh, kind of SICP's forte 00:28:54 -!- cherez has quit (Connection timed out). 00:30:34 -!- cherez has joined. 00:34:09 -!- Slereah5 has joined. 00:34:43 -!- Slereah has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 00:34:55 -!- Corun has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 00:35:53 cool compiler 00:35:58 i don't have a single opinion atm. 00:41:04 so hows the c-to-lisp compiler coming 00:41:25 you should do a lisp-to-brainfuck compiler. 00:41:57 lisp not fucked up enough already? 00:42:46 don't look at me i didn't do it 00:44:17 lisp-to-brainfuck ain't that hard 00:44:22 lisp->c then use c->bf 00:52:16 c->lisp->bf->haskell 00:53:49 I want the c->befunge compiler to be completed 00:53:57 I know it will never happen, but I can hope :) 00:54:50 -!- revcompgeek has joined. 00:55:21 augur: c->haskell isn't that hard 00:55:26 you can even do pureness analysis 00:55:29 -!- revcompgeek has quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client"). 00:55:35 by storing extra type information 00:55:54 yes but is c->lisp->bf->haskell hard? i suspect so! :o 00:56:03 augur: no 00:56:07 c->lisp not hard, the lisp machines did it 00:56:07 ok. 00:56:14 lisp->bf a bit hard, yeah, but not infeasable 00:56:24 bf->haskell trivial 00:56:26 how did the lisp machines work, do you know? 00:56:31 augur: yes 00:56:34 the cpu executed lisp code. 00:56:40 right. :P 00:56:45 -!- revcompgeek has joined. 00:56:49 can you explain the large scale structure of the cpu? 00:56:56 -!- revcompgeek has left (?). 00:56:58 augur: it ran lisp 00:57:11 ok, now a slightly smaller scale structure? :P 00:58:38 i mean 00:59:03 i get how c can run on a modern cpu, because modern cpus are imperative and such 00:59:23 and c is hardly an abstraction from machine code, in the grand scheme of things 00:59:34 but lisp is so far from modern cpus that i cant imagine how the cpu looked 01:06:21 anyone know what a thunk is? 01:10:06 in lisp, a function with no arguments 01:11:01 cool thunk 01:11:10 (i can't stop) 01:11:47 augur: well, it isn't like c running on a cpu 01:11:52 it's like a cpu that at its most native level, runs c 01:34:40 Bye for today :) 01:35:33 -!- tusho has quit (Remote closed the connection). 01:53:21 -!- oerjan has quit ("leaving"). 02:00:43 -!- Corun has joined. 02:47:22 -!- olsner has joined. 02:50:59 oklofok! 02:56:02 -!- Nocta^ has joined. 03:07:02 -!- Nocta has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 03:20:34 -!- Corun has quit ("This computer has gone to sleep"). 06:03:14 -!- GreaseMonkey has joined. 06:03:52 lalala 06:35:42 lala 06:37:03 -!- augur has changed nick to psygnisfive. 06:37:21 hey 06:50:07 wenas 06:51:59 -!- Judofyr has joined. 06:53:50 wassup lament 06:54:22 nomucho 07:13:35 im bored and i have nothing to do :( 07:31:58 write a good music notation program for os x and release it as open source. 07:59:59 -!- clog has quit (ended). 08:00:00 -!- clog has joined. 08:03:36 -!- oklofok has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 08:03:53 -!- oklopol has joined. 08:25:39 i dont understand music notation :( 08:47:04 oh 08:47:13 then, first, learn music notation 08:47:24 learn to play some instrument so you can apply that knowledge 09:41:08 -!- GreaseMonkey has quit ("Read error: -128 (overflow)"). 09:41:19 -!- GreaseMonkey has joined. 10:30:28 -!- GreaseMonkey has quit ("Saliendo"). 10:35:29 write a good music notation program for os x and release it as open source. 10:35:39 doesn't rosegarden work on OS X? 10:35:45 it's just QT/KDE 10:35:49 should be portable? 10:55:47 -!- Hiato has joined. 11:03:50 -!- Deformati has joined. 11:04:05 -!- Deformative has quit (leguin.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 11:04:05 -!- Phenax has quit (leguin.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 11:04:06 -!- psygnisfive has quit (leguin.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 11:04:06 -!- bsmntbombdood has quit (leguin.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 11:09:08 -!- Corun has joined. 11:11:07 -!- Polar has quit (leguin.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 11:11:30 -!- Polar has joined. 11:13:20 -!- augur has joined. 11:14:00 -!- Hiato1 has joined. 11:20:51 -!- bsmntbombdood has joined. 11:31:32 -!- Hiato has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 11:40:43 -!- Corun has quit ("This computer has gone to sleep"). 13:28:41 boo 13:33:16 o¨ 13:41:59 Well, seems like ill urine isn't at the local bookstores. 13:43:08 US UROPHILES HAVE A RIGHT TO PROGRAM TOO 13:43:11 WHO DO THEY THINK THEY ARE 13:43:52 Scheme is made of gold! 13:43:52 GOLDEN SHOWERS, THAT IS 13:46:43 Scheme is my mother tongue! 13:46:55 KINDA LIKE I PEED IN YOUR MOTHER'S MOUTH LAST NIGHT 13:47:03 Oh snap! 13:47:10 I just was served! 13:47:11 i think i've won here. 13:47:34 IHTKUIL, PPL 13:47:39 *ITHKUIL, actually 13:48:03 Is that the terrible conlang that nobody speaks? 13:48:29 http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e5/Ithkuil_sentence.ogg < that scares me 13:48:52 Slereah5: yes 13:49:08 there's nothing terrible about it, except for the great amount of phonemes. 13:49:34 i'm contemplating hiring a teacher or smth 13:49:35 And the fact that everyone of them means something 13:49:51 I read about the formal script for Ilaksh yesterday, that was just weird 13:49:52 ithkuil root words are of the form C1..C2 13:49:59 two consonants 13:50:29 you can have a, e or i in between, for 3 modifications of the concept 13:50:34 and then... 13:50:42 MILLIONS OF WAYS TO MODIFY IT! 13:50:52 What happens if you have a cold? 13:50:58 Are you unable to communicate? 13:50:58 :) 13:51:13 doubt that 13:51:30 Yeah, since no one talk that language 13:52:25 i doubt many have tried. 13:52:36 it really doesn't seem that hard. 13:52:48 the problem is the lexicon, as with all languages. 13:52:57 There's a LJ communauty of it 13:53:00 But it's in Russian 13:55:17 LJ? 13:56:12 LiveJournal 13:58:09 nh 13:59:00 -!- Hiato1 has quit ("Leaving."). 14:25:52 -!- jix has joined. 14:36:46 -!- Slereah has joined. 14:36:46 -!- Slereah5 has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 14:43:26 -!- jix has quit ("CommandQ"). 15:34:45 -!- pikhq has joined. 15:35:12 Hot shit on a stick, Batman! 15:35:16 Reprap replicates! 15:44:21 http://craphound.com/overclocked/Cory_Doctorow_-_Overclocked_-_Printcrime.html, BTW, is a damned good story. 15:45:37 You know what else is a damn good story? 15:45:37 Watership Down. 15:47:57 wuzzat i dunnothat 15:49:11 It's a damn good story. 15:49:29 http://www.amazon.fr/Watership-Down-Richard-Adams/dp/038039586X/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1212763757&sr=8-2 15:50:17 Still, come on. . . 15:50:22 Reprap repraps! 15:52:57 pikhq: true, that was pretty great 15:53:10 that story 15:55:03 -!- pikhq has quit (Remote closed the connection). 15:55:24 -!- pikhq has joined. 16:06:48 ithkuil does relative clauses just like lalna! 16:07:02 except my system is much more complex. 16:07:11 Here, have a cookie. 16:07:12 well more extensive 16:08:17 ithkuil does everything with -fixes and infliction, which i think is the reason for it seeming so complicated 16:08:44 I'm used to that. 16:08:56 you are? 16:09:35 well, sort of. I'm learning hungarian - not quite *so* suffix-obsessed, but has a lot 16:09:39 and that is because you're from ...x? 16:09:44 ah. 16:09:55 they say hungarian is similar to finnish 16:10:12 hal (hung.) = kala (finn.) is all i know though. 16:10:39 (fish (engl.)) 16:10:49 they are related, but I think they probably split quite a while ago 16:11:17 since they're apparently unintelligible to each other 16:11:19 i dunno, i don't really believe in history 16:11:23 yes 16:11:45 there aren't really any noticable similarities 16:11:57 whereas I can read Dutch and recognise a lot of it :) 16:12:06 -!- ais523 has joined. 16:12:26 víz = vesi = water 16:12:32 kéz = käsi = hand 16:12:39 vér = veri = blood 16:12:47 I remembeer szív is shared too 16:12:50 heart 16:12:50 i have no idea, there was a hungarian here... nick was something starting with n* 16:12:58 sydän 16:13:21 Deewiant: know hungarian or googled? 16:13:29 wikipedia'd 16:13:30 * ais523 knows a few words of Hungarian 16:13:51 I lived in hungary when I was 3-4 years old but that's not very helpful I'm afraid :-P 16:14:08 I went there for a conference for a week once 16:14:16 but everyone spoke in English 16:14:23 evidently it also always stresses the first syllable 16:14:30 yes. 16:14:47 here's a short table: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finno-Ugric_languages#Common_vocabulary 16:14:56 and here's some more: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regular_sound_correspondences_between_Hungarian_and_other_Uralic_languages 16:15:21 but I'm going to eat now -> 16:15:45 I like english's method... the stress patterns can be weird and even native speakers get it wrong :) 16:18:13 The stress patterns are quite variable in English, for the sake of emphasis. Whee. 16:18:51 stress patterns *within words* aren't, pikhq 16:19:04 Not usually. 16:19:11 But it's been done. 16:19:12 ;) 16:19:12 you're an IMportant man. 16:19:24 like lexicographical: it seems the stress pattern is made so that the stressed syllables are evenly spaced 16:19:36 IPA uses different sorts of apostrophes to mark stresses 16:19:44 that must be how we guess the stress pattern by intuition 16:19:59 imo ithkuil went over the line a bit by making stress actually change the meaning of a word 16:20:17 (otherwise it's great sofar) 16:20:34 it can do in english too, though it's rare (reCORD, REcord) 16:22:23 well, that's a different length of e 16:22:35 -!- pikhq has quit (Remote closed the connection). 16:22:53 -!- pikhq has joined. 16:49:55 -!- tusho has joined. 16:49:58 hello ais523 16:50:01 I don't dare to boot up X, yet. 16:50:04 hi ehird 16:50:12 I trust you haven't messed up the eso-std server yet? :-P 16:50:19 I'm planning on getting apache working today 16:50:44 no, I haven't screwed up the server 16:50:46 or even logged in 16:50:54 I'd like to get the darcs stuff back up soon, though 16:51:04 ais523: yes, i'll do that ASAP after I get apache working 16:51:34 ais523: i'll also put darcsweb on there, because it's nice to be able to browse the code online & view diffs between revisions etc 16:51:45 yes 16:52:34 i'll start x now, but a bit of snake(1) before that to make sure it won't die 16:54:02 ais523: gnome's starting... 16:54:11 what part do you think it'll crash at? 16:54:19 also, should I open epiphany, xchat or other first? 16:54:29 no idea 16:54:34 -!- Hiato has joined. 16:54:38 you have a better idea of your computer's idiosyncracies than I do 16:54:51 ais523: you'd think so... 16:54:59 and I'd wish so. 16:55:11 it defies all laws of logic, I think it might be one of thems 4-dimensional aliens 16:55:28 Well, I chose epiphany. 16:55:44 ais523: intersetingly, even if the gui is doing stuff it never crashes in console mode 16:55:48 i really do think it's the gfx card like you said 16:56:54 ais523: WOW! The back button didn't crash it. 16:56:57 It must like me today 16:58:53 ais523: xchat time 16:59:07 connect lil' guy! connect! 16:59:11 i wanna see you from irssi 16:59:13 -!- tusho_ has joined. 16:59:15 :D 16:59:19 hi 16:59:29 ais523: he can't talk right now, he's busy in console mode 16:59:52 I JUST RESIZED MY XCHAT WINDOW :D 16:59:56 good for you 16:59:59 -!- tusho has quit ("leaving"). 17:00:09 -!- tusho_ has changed nick to tusho. 17:00:20 ais523: #ESO? 17:07:00 -!- pikhq has quit (Remote closed the connection). 17:07:12 -!- Judofyr has quit. 17:07:18 -!- pikhq has joined. 17:09:50 -!- tusho_ has joined. 17:09:51 -!- tusho has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)). 17:09:55 un fucking believable 17:10:03 X crashed? 17:10:11 ais523: no, the computer crashed 17:10:18 even though it was working for 10 minutes 17:10:19 oh dear 17:10:25 well, that was a fast restart, then 17:10:46 pretty fast yeah 17:20:53 Alrighty, I conceded, this python has beaten me. Calling reinforcements... 17:21:28 mmyes? 17:21:58 http://rafb.net/p/wj80Yx47.html 17:22:09 that's where it sits currently 17:22:59 http://rafb.net/p/SCYYhi81.html 17:23:14 that's what it should be doing (rough description) 17:23:40 Hiato: 4 space indentations plz 17:23:54 come again? 17:25:44 Hiato: everyne who uses python uses 4-space indentation, it's hard to read python with other indentations 17:25:51 tusho_: what? 17:26:26 ais523: what? 17:26:39 'hard to read python with other indentations'? 17:26:55 ais523: it is. 17:26:58 changing indentation amount doesn't make langs harder to read if the screen's wide enough to fit the indentation on 17:27:01 4-space indentation is universal 17:27:06 right, I'll learn of this so called "4 space indentation" hopefully, but, how do I fix what's broken :P 17:27:15 Hiato: i'd tell you if I could read it 17:27:27 ais523: With a whitespace-sensitive language like p ython it really does make things hard 17:27:30 that 8-space looks perfectly readable to me 17:27:31 (hah, how ironic) 17:27:39 indentation makes something hard to read only if it's 1 space or over 10 spaces 17:27:51 that was automatic by IDLE by the way :P 17:27:59 Hiato: did you save it as .py? 17:28:03 yep 17:28:04 if not it won't highlight or indent properly 17:28:09 Hiato: _before_ typing it? 17:28:12 Deewiant: almost agreed, my version of that statement is "indentation makes something hard to read only if it's 1 space in a language not designed for it, or so wide the lines wrap" 17:28:13 yep 17:28:33 ais523: yeah, that's more accurate 17:28:51 BF and Lisp are both readable at 1-space indentation 17:29:01 well, tusho_ the problem is more or less with this guy: 17:29:02 if ord(n[k]) in range(ord('a'),ord('z')): 17:29:02 which simply doesn't work... 17:29:07 or doesn't seem to for that matter 17:29:10 I don't call anything in BF 'indentation' ;-) 17:29:24 Deewiant: I have a BF mode for Emacs which does auto-indentation 17:29:41 :-D 17:30:25 -!- kar8nga has joined. 17:32:55 aha 17:32:58 fixed it :) 17:33:05 if ord(n[k]) in xrange(ord('a'),ord('z'),1): 17:33:16 maybe something there is still redundant, but whatever 17:34:34 now something is wrong with the logic... 17:36:08 -!- pikhq has quit (Remote closed the connection). 17:36:58 -!- pikhq has joined. 17:38:42 I cannot understand this at all, I have clearly written if blah blah: t-= 1, but everytime it gets there and blah is true, it increases t. What is going on? 17:39:35 Hiato: are you sure that that's the bit of code that's running? 17:39:43 * Hiato wonders if everyone decided to leave the noob to he's own devices 17:39:48 yep 17:39:50 try putting a print statement there to make sure that it's that bit that's running but not a different bit 17:39:52 so says the debugger 17:40:03