< 1214525847 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol! >| < 1214526523 0 :cctoide!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1214526544 0 :cctoide!n=fortytwo@87-196-207-140.net.novis.pt JOIN :#esoteric < 1214527352 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got my first dollar bill :D < 1214527364 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :5 dollars. < 1214528376 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"CommandQ" < 1214529221 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1214529428 0 :cctoide!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can hire Pyurio now < 1214529430 0 :cctoide!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :five dorra < 1214529728 0 :ihope_____!n=chatzill@pegcompaq.dhcp.rose-hulman.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1214529747 0 :ihope_____!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ihope < 1214529892 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I ordered a book, and I got refunded 5 dorra for the postage < 1214529915 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I put it on my wall, so Abe can watch me masturbate. < 1214530081 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just lost the game < 1214530689 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1214531367 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf68ca.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1214531399 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1214532598 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm. < 1214532604 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm watching Captain N. < 1214532609 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is he so stupid? < 1214532619 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He has a pause button, why doesn't he use it at every opportunity? < 1214532969 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Captain N? < 1214533863 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: wikipedia says http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captain_N < 1214533874 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an elaborate marketing ploy by nintendo < 1214533993 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they do a lot of those < 1214534065 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.amazon.com/Omega-Game-Steven-Krane/dp/0886779073/ref=cm_lmf_tit_6 oO < 1214534123 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good old Swann < 1214534157 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he was an Agora player < 1214534219 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But, you can't win the Game! D: < 1214534230 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless he returned after i left, for all you know < 1214534269 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why isn't Swann a player, and why aren't YOU? < 1214534320 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :life is full of mysteries < 1214534595 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1214535622 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1214537108 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Good night" < 1214538044 0 :ihope_____!n=chatzill@pegcompaq.dhcp.rose-hulman.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1214538064 0 :ihope_____!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ihope < 1214539064 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"This computer has gone to sleep" < 1214545180 0 :GreaseMonkey!n=gm|--0@122-57-235-233.jetstream.xtra.co.nz JOIN :#esoteric < 1214546160 0 :Judofyr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1214546193 0 :Judofyr!n=Judofyr@cE699BF51.dhcp.bluecom.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1214546796 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: He has a pause button, why doesn't he use it at every opportunity? <<< presumably prefers quantity over quality when it comes to life < 1214546816 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming the pauses are reduced from his lifespam < 1214546819 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*lifespan < 1214546874 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, really the subjective length of life would be the same, but he doesn't want to live less than others, in global time < 1214546903 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems intuitive one might feel that way < 1214547259 0 :Slereah_!n=hix@ANantes-252-1-11-115.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1214547262 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1214549978 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Ex-Chat" < 1214550151 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what a wonderful morning < 1214550165 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i feel like singing, but it's hard in ascii < 1214550182 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i shall use the following notation for my singing < 1214550233 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : makes the preceding syllable a note of that lenght/pitch < 1214550250 0 :olsner!n=salparot@h-79-136-60-96.NA.cust.bahnhof.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1214550262 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 relative pitch is 440hZ, 1 relative length you can choose yourself < 1214550287 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :relative pitch n is is 2^(n/12)*440 < 1214550406 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :better notations exist < 1214550435 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what<0, 2> a<2, 1> won<4, 2> der<2, 1> ful<0, 2> mor<5, 3> ning<9, 3> how<7, 2> could<4, 2> this<2, 1> feel<0, 2> ing<4, 1> be<7, 2> topped<5, 8> < 1214550445 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know any that incorporates lyrics < 1214550449 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*incorporate < 1214550457 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, that was the song, really < 1214550484 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd think it would continue < 1214550488 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but nah < 1214550515 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: care to sing it better? < 1214550524 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no :D < 1214550583 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hate it when people judge my singing if they can't sing themselves! < 1214550724 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: wanna play the guitar as i sing? < 1214550734 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_: will you take the bongos? < 1214550747 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1214550921 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol < 1214550925 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :california legalized gay marriage < 1214550927 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lets get married < 1214550929 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::o < 1214550951 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1214550969 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :has gay sex been legal all this time we have not been having sex? < 1214550972 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*illegal < 1214550978 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it hasn't < 1214550986 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the gay marriage has been. < 1214550988 0 :Slereah!n=hix@ANantes-252-1-11-115.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1214550993 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we could go to norway too, thats closer to you < 1214551012 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1214551061 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or we wait a few years until finland legalizes it, and then not marry each other *here*, how about that? < 1214551131 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we're always quick at these things, so desperate for attention < 1214551140 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could always go to sweden and not marry < 1214551232 0 :Judofyr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1214551270 0 :Judofyr!n=Judofyr@cE699BF51.dhcp.bluecom.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1214551397 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess the negation does make it quite easy to accomplish in any country. < 1214551430 0 :cherez!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1214551569 0 :cherez!n=cherez@cpe-76-167-242-249.socal.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1214552470 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1214552761 0 :RedDak!n=dak@87.18.90.165 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214553268 0 :RedDak!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1214553406 0 :adu!n=ajr@pool-72-66-81-143.washdc.fios.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1214553438 0 :Slereah!n=hix@ANantes-252-1-11-115.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1214553599 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1214553600 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1214554068 0 :Slereah_!n=hix@ANantes-252-1-11-115.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1214554098 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1214555242 0 :SevenInchBread!n=CakeProp@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake JOIN :#esoteric < 1214555408 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1214555425 0 :oklopol!n=nnscript@a91-152-134-23.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1214555534 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1214555704 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1214555709 0 :shachaf!n=shachaf@66.17.178.32 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214556031 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1214556053 0 :augur!n=augur@c-71-57-164-119.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1214556258 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1214556442 0 :mtve!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1214559234 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214559826 0 :ais523_!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214560391 0 :ais523_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"rebooting" < 1214560412 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1214560534 0 :adu!n=ajr@pool-72-66-81-143.washdc.fios.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1214560789 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HELLO BONGO PHONE? < 1214560907 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION answers with his butt < 1214561170 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214561972 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1214563109 0 :mtve!i=mtve@mtve.vm.jvds.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1214565268 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Remote closed the previous member app" < 1214566352 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"afk food" < 1214567538 0 :SevenInchBread!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.. < 1214567556 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :! < 1214567717 0 :cctoide!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let 8=0.999... and D=1 < 1214567720 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214568073 0 :AnMaster!n=AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1214568498 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1214568526 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214569729 0 :RedDak!n=dak@87.18.90.165 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214569798 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let 8===D < 1214571549 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SevenInchBread! < 1214572114 0 :SevenInchBread!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg < 1214572118 0 :SevenInchBread!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1214572141 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that's unusual, I don't think anyone's pinged SevenInchBread in a while < 1214572148 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ihope: why did you ping them? < 1214572183 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because nobody's pinged him in a while, I guess? < 1214572197 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ihope: do you like pinging random people for no obvious reason? < 1214572233 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clog: ping < 1214572363 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Man, the Gabriel Knight book has the laziest cover. < 1214572375 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's three screenshots from the game shopped together. < 1214572528 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clog didn't respond... < 1214572532 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is disappointed < 1214572541 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, where'd cmeme go? < 1214572555 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does this mean that ircbrowse aren't logging us any more? < 1214573311 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I'll toss your salad!" < 1214573322 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh. Love cartoons double entendre. < 1214573418 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to figure out what happened to cmeme < 1214573426 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently it left June 5 and never came back < 1214573595 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, ircbrowse is being really slow < 1214573602 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I picked one of the active days back from 2005 < 1214573607 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the page was cut off at "GregorR-L Quit with mess" < 1214573709 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, there are some gems in the early logs: " I already got complaints about the 4-bit adder being too unnatural-looking and lacking scenery." < 1214573981 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION ponders the idea of doing an "optical illusion" thing which is actually an animated gif that simulates the effect you're meant to see < 1214573986 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it isn't an illusion, it's actually there < 1214574398 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523 < 1214574403 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi AnMaster < 1214574405 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how goes ffungi? < 1214574508 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not very much further yet < 1214574513 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I was just about to start on it again < 1214574651 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, ansembler is probably turing complete (except that it got limited memory like a computer, so not really) < 1214574663 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bounded-storage, then < 1214574664 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by now it got all but floating point and SYS done < 1214574683 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and some floating point are done < 1214574692 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I went crazy with pre-processor in it < 1214574701 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :want to see some examples? < 1214574707 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :may as well < 1214574713 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why are you creating a new asm anyway? < 1214574718 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it just for fun or is there another reason? < 1214574721 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : GenerateArithmeticOP(MUL, 64, *=, u, U, uint) < 1214574721 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : GenerateArithmeticOP(IMUL, 32, *=, s, S, int) < 1214574721 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : GenerateArithmeticOP(IMUL, 64, *=, s, S, int) < 1214574728 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, just for fun < 1214574738 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : GenerateArithmeticOP(ADD, 32, +=, u, U, uint) < 1214574738 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : GenerateArithmeticOP(ADD, 64, +=, u, U, uint) < 1214574741 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: ugh, are you using stringify there? < 1214574748 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I use ## a lot yes < 1214574780 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, http://rafb.net/p/GywJbw94.html < 1214574801 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, seems totally intercal level! < 1214574806 0 :SevenInchBread!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1214574822 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my interpreter-macros.h is over 300 lines long < 1214574828 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :332 to be exact < 1214574829 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, I only do that sort of thing in a couple of cases < 1214574844 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most notably in the ffi, where I run the C preprocessor, then my own preprocessor, then the C compiler < 1214574845 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my interpreter.c is 281 lines long < 1214574846 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1214574870 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, well I need a lot of variants on similar thing < 1214574873 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so doing this is good design < 1214574880 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :avoiding code duplication < 1214574881 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :! < 1214574893 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#define GetRegister(rreg, type)\ < 1214574893 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : { \ < 1214574893 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ans_regspec my_regspc = FetchRegspec(); \ < 1214574893 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : rreg = GetRegister ## type (my_regspc); \ < 1214574893 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : } < 1214574921 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FetchRegspec is a generated function btw < 1214574924 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CreateFetchParam(Regspec, ans_regspec) < 1214574927 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;P < 1214574931 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :static inline < 1214574933 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but generated < 1214574950 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://rafb.net/p/guaCo541.html < 1214574972 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SevenInchBread, and ais523: what do you think ;P < 1214575025 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : GenerateBitwiseOP(XOR, 32, ^=) < 1214575025 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : GenerateBitwiseOP(XOR, 64, ^=) < 1214575035 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those are nice imo < 1214575042 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : GenerateFloatDoubleArithOP(ADD, +=) < 1214575042 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : GenerateFloatDoubleArithOP(SUB, -=) < 1214575054 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#define GenerateFloatDoubleArithOP(name, operator) \ < 1214575054 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : GenericFloatingPointArithOP(F ## name, operator, flt[0]) \ < 1214575054 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : GenericFloatingPointArithOP(D ## name, operator, dbl) < 1214575060 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1214575063 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214575088 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[13:53] hey, I only do that sort of thing in a couple of cases < 1214575089 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, read log < 1214575090 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[13:54] most notably in the ffi, where I run the C preprocessor, then my own preprocessor, then the C compiler < 1214575093 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[13:54] I have macros that expand into instructions for my preprocessor < 1214575095 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[13:57] what's FungeSpaceSaveToFile for? < 1214575097 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, connection dropped < 1214575101 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://rafb.net/p/z8hQGE37.html btw < 1214575118 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, FungeSpaceSaveToFile is for o instruction < 1214575122 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is needed < 1214575127 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1214575130 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o writes out some of funge space to a file < 1214575132 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :......... < 1214575143 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214575148 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, http://rafb.net/p/nTbx9t70.html < 1214575152 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see that link < 1214575155 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all you missed < 1214575174 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry... connection troubles < 1214575179 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, so open link < 1214575186 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have done < 1214575239 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, why is FungeSpaceSaveToFile a problem? < 1214575241 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders how easy it would be to serialise the internal state of a Befunge interp, so that Befunge programs could be frozen into a file and restarted later < 1214575243 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it isn't < 1214575243 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is *needed* < 1214575248 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was just wondering why it was there < 1214575250 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1214575263 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was wondering if it was part of a serialisation trick like that < 1214575264 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm pretty sure there is a nice doxygen comment in the header for it < 1214575292 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, but yes a program could use it it to serialize itself < 1214575322 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it needs to get it's own size probably too < 1214575330 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y instruction should know that < 1214575333 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd have to serialise the stack too, though, and Funge-98 has a stack stack too IIRC? < 1214575333 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc < 1214575338 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1214575345 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then you need ip state < 1214575350 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1214575352 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so a bit more indeed < 1214575371 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also internal state of fingerprints < 1214575376 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, why would you need to serialise it? < 1214575382 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: various reasons < 1214575382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and some fingerprints use static variables < 1214575386 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hidden in their own files < 1214575399 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the data is shared between all the fingerprints < 1214575399 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance when I initialised Lost Kingdoms separately and sent the resulting serialised BF image to ehird < 1214575400 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1214575402 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all the ips < 1214575409 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because he was fed up with waiting for it to load < 1214575413 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, oh I see < 1214575422 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Emacs uses that trick, I think < 1214575425 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1214575429 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it dumps core and then makes the core dump into an executable < 1214575434 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aye < 1214575446 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather nasty IMO < 1214575450 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... do core dumps have their own headers? < 1214575459 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is it possible to dump core in such a way that it starts with an ELF header? < 1214575464 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be a brilliant quine < 1214575472 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I think they have special elf headers < 1214575473 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a machine-code Kimian quine based on core-dumps... < 1214575484 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that will need modification after < 1214575489 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pity < 1214575535 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, unless it is fantasy game ;P < 1214575556 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1214575863 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION ponders what includes are needed in the glue code < 1214575877 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :, of course, but which of yours will I need? < 1214575884 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um what? < 1214575889 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, depend on what you are using < 1214575889 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :header files < 1214575906 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :each header corresponds to a source file apart from global.h < 1214575909 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :loading fungespace from a string, then running the interp < 1214575929 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to duplicate the functionality of interpreterMainLoop, but with various modifications < 1214575930 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, the headers mostly include other headers as needed I think < 1214575980 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION ponders how k would interact with NEXT < 1214575981 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, interpreter.h + maybe reach internals in that file not sure, and funge-space/funge-space.h < 1214575983 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least < 1214575984 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :badly, I htink < 1214575997 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, well k interacts badly with a lot of things < 1214576009 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instructions/iterate.c < 1214576012 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see how it is done there < 1214576015 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lots of special casing < 1214576039 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and k + marker makes little sense either, but I don't think it can ever come up in a situation where it's dangerous < 1214576049 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :k + forget? < 1214576060 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, as for fingerprint you may need more headers not sure < 1214576067 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: that's fine, 15kF and 51kF would be equivalent < 1214576074 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, if there are any major changes you want upstream, I'm open for discussion < 1214576094 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think there will be, I'm trying to disturb upstream as little as possible < 1214576107 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, well you got your load from string < 1214576115 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, thanks < 1214576126 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I think you may need to touch internals in interpreter.c, not just the header < 1214576151 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as for k + fingerprint... that is one hard < 1214576169 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :current infrastructure doesn't really support special casing k for fingerprints < 1214576175 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nor is it something the upstream will need < 1214576182 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've thought of a way to avoid messing with internals, which is a good idea anyway to avoid the internals being messed up with my stupid stack tricks < 1214576184 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as I have very few feral fingerprints < 1214576191 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I'd like you to figure out k + TRDS... < 1214576205 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I don't plan on implementing TRDS in upstream < 1214576210 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, I'm not surprised < 1214576238 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, see README, it contains a list of fingerprints which won't be implemented < 1214576246 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but what most of the fingerprint commands do is set flags, which are processed when control returns to ick_InterpreterMainLoop or whatever I call it < 1214576264 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, right, makes sense < 1214576271 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that way there's nothing much dangerous on the C stack when I go about destroying it or whatever < 1214576285 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1214576291 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it's only InterpreterMainLoop that I have to worry about making re-entrant < 1214576305 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah true < 1214576316 0 :RedDak!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1214576324 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this breaks badly with k + NEXT, though, I think < 1214576329 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, as for how k + TRDS interacts: badly I think < 1214576331 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but some things work in my favour < 1214576338 0 :SevenInchBread!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster, wat. < 1214576345 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SevenInchBread, ?? < 1214576350 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance, k + COMEFROM is inexpressible with the notation I plan to use < 1214576354 0 :SevenInchBread!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you pinged me apparently. < 1214576365 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SevenInchBread, yes ages ago a bit after you talked here < 1214576376 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see scrollback < 1214576398 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : for instance, k + COMEFROM is inexpressible with the notation I plan to use <-- interesting < 1214576414 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: if you put the k before the marker, it's never seen, likewise if you put it after the C < 1214576421 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you put it after the marker it applies to the wrong statement < 1214576424 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, hum? < 1214576436 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if you put it before the C then the C ends mark-mode and the other iterations never run < 1214576437 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is the marker never seen with a k next to it? < 1214576446 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: program execution starts at the marker < 1214576455 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the k immediately before it never executes < 1214576470 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well what if the program hits the marker later on? < 1214576472 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :will it reflect? < 1214576481 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: no, a marker's a NOP if you aren't in mark-mode < 1214576483 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as is a COME FROM < 1214576495 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that reflects the INTERCAL behaviour < 1214576504 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a COME FROM does nothing if encountered in the normal flow of things < 1214576513 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, ok, then you need to change ExecuteInstruction in interpreter.c a bit < 1214576515 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think < 1214576519 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, that's not quite right, COME FROM pops the stack if not in mark-mode < 1214576533 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: not really, it should be easy enough to define a NOP in a fingerprint < 1214576544 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err fingerprints can only define [A-Z] < 1214576551 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : // Next: Is this a fingerprint opcode? < 1214576551 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : } else if ((opcode >= 'A') && (opcode <= 'Z')) { < 1214576560 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: well, I was planning to expose markers as M to the Befunge code < 1214576564 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just have them as middot in the source < 1214576566 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1214576569 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see < 1214576573 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, interesting! < 1214576580 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so they get magical marker metadata, whilst not surprising a Funge program < 1214576683 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders what the fffungi handprint should be < 1214576706 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IFFI? CFUI? < 1214576709 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CFNI? < 1214576713 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was planning to use IFFI for the fingerprint < 1214576716 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1214576723 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah seems good < 1214576725 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might make a good handprint too, though < 1214576739 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the handprint should acknowledge cfunge, really < 1214576743 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas the fingerprint shouldn't < 1214576743 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1214576752 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CFUN is current fingerprint < 1214576755 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1214576757 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :handprint < 1214576758 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc < 1214576761 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, I just looked it up < 1214576783 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe CFFI < 1214576793 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a nice symmetry there < 1214576795 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah seems to make sense < 1214576812 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, however that may be a future fingerprint on my side < 1214576820 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, what would it do? < 1214576824 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have had ideas about a C FFI fingerprint for befunge < 1214576826 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :using libffi < 1214576828 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, of course < 1214576831 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to handle it at runtime < 1214576837 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, however this may never happen < 1214576838 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would a handprint/fingerprint clash be a problem? < 1214576842 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as I got no idea how hard it would be < 1214576844 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, not realluy < 1214576846 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really* < 1214576850 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are separate name spaces < 1214576912 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, also when compiled in 64-bit variant the handprint of fingerprints could use 8 chars < 1214576916 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however it is not recommended < 1214576928 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :possible but not recommended < 1214576991 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and besides, what I'm doing also provides a C ffi for Befunge in a very tortuous manner < 1214576991 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd just need a stub INTERCAL program to connect the two < 1214576992 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1214577007 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214577037 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry... < 1214577039 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did I miss anything? < 1214577056 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We cured cancer. < 1214577057 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : you'd just need a stub INTERCAL program to connect the two < 1214577058 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* ais523 has quit (Remote closed the connection) < 1214577065 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, no I didn't < 1214577116 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, note I haven't tested the load from string < 1214577125 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if you have odd issues with loading look there < 1214577132 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I'm going to set to documenting what I'm about to do before I start actually coding it < 1214577132 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, oh and some gdb tricks < 1214577136 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that seems necessary here < 1214577160 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and C-INTERCAL's the first program I've ever come across which has managed to completely confuse gdb < 1214577162 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, compile *without* defining NDEBUG < 1214577167 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't like bits of stack disappearing without warning < 1214577178 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then in gdb you can do: < 1214577183 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call FungeSpaceDump() < 1214577211 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is also a funge stack dump < 1214577252 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call StackDump(pointer to a funge stack be sure it is correct, there is no verification) < 1214577375 0 :Corun!n=Corun@cpc1-rdng15-0-0-cust168.winn.cable.ntl.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1214577401 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, although it's unlikely to be the Befunge stuff itself that needs debugging < 1214577406 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although now I've said that it will be < 1214577509 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: oh, one other thing; is it possible for a fingerprint to do unusual stuff when it's loaded < 1214577514 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as opposed to when the commands in it are called < 1214577537 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one thing I'm not sure whether to do is to have the Befunge program run as normal until IFFI's loaded, then for the INTERCAL program to start < 1214577548 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to allow the Befunge program to do initialisation if it wants before relinquishing control < 1214577741 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1214577745 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : AnMaster: oh, one other thing; is it possible for a fingerprint to do unusual stuff when it's loaded < 1214577746 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1214577751 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anything that C could do < 1214577753 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HOWEVER < 1214577756 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it may cause issues < 1214577767 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was planning just to set a flag that the main loop could read < 1214577773 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could do memset(0, 0, 2*1024*1024); < 1214577783 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but likely that would segfault < 1214577827 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and well flag seems sane < 1214577842 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : one thing I'm not sure whether to do is to have the Befunge program run as normal until IFFI's loaded, then for the INTERCAL program to start < 1214577842 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : to allow the Befunge program to do initialisation if it wants before relinquishing control < 1214577844 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no clue < 1214577851 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my plan's basically an insane main loop combined with sane everything else < 1214577860 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, right < 1214577868 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems a good way to do it < 1214577900 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway a fingerprint is only activated when any instruction in it is called < 1214577904 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or when it is loaded < 1214577910 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never when it is unloaded or otherwise < 1214577918 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, that may be worth remembering < 1214577920 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, ok < 1214577925 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not when unloaded is slightly surprising < 1214577933 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? it wasn't needed < 1214577950 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: well, reversing whatever was done on startup, such as deallocating memory, etc, is what I'd have expected < 1214577979 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, so far that haven't been needed, all fingerprints that allocate memory to static variables should persist until the program ends < 1214577986 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1214577997 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all that allocate to data stored in ip, will persist until ip terminates or program ends < 1214578008 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that is only HRTI so far < 1214578017 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, if I needed unload I would indeed add it < 1214578022 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I can add it if you need it < 1214578025 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I need it < 1214578042 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may need it in the future, it would be a optional hook < 1214578044 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would make something more symmetrical, but I think the symmetry would be bad, and also a pain to implement at my end < 1214578056 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so only change would be a few lines in fingerprint spec, if even that < 1214578068 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION recalls that "no Intercal;" in C-INTERCAL is an error < 1214578075 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh? < 1214578078 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no Intercal;? < 1214578078 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is, C-INTERCAL's programmed as a Perl module < 1214578082 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it mustn't be unloaded < 1214578087 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doing so causes an error message < 1214578090 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahaha < 1214578097 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, well fingerprint may be unloaded < 1214578103 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/C-INTERCAL/CLC-INTERCAL/ < 1214578104 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously < 1214578105 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need to check if you are already initialized < 1214578107 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry for that typo < 1214578114 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just do something like: < 1214578129 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :static bool initialized = false; < 1214578135 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then in the loading code set it to true < 1214578156 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, simple enough < 1214578158 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't forget #include < 1214578170 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, a few fingerprints does that < 1214578173 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :REFC for example < 1214578180 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: you rely on a lot of header files that I don't depend on existing < 1214578181 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HRTI does per-ip for various reasons < 1214578185 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then C-INTERCAL doesn't depend on C99 < 1214578191 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :older versions don't even depend on C89 < 1214578192 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well stdbool.h is C99 indeed < 1214578202 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I see no reason not to use it < 1214578207 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for me it works well < 1214578212 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, this is only going to work in C99 < 1214578241 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course if you plan to write your fingerprint as C89 that should work with the exceptions of existing macros < 1214578272 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I'll make it C99, but mostly avoiding C99 features unless I would really find them useful < 1214578284 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway I think global.h already includes stdbool.h and stdint.h < 1214578285 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1214578294 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least stdint.h is included < 1214578295 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :either that, or the whole thing will be legal C89 except for a comment saying // this comment was put here to make the file C99 not C89 < 1214578304 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, hahaha < 1214578314 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may do that, it's in the spirit of the rest of the code < 1214578326 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the spirit of cfunge? < 1214578328 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really < 1214578337 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use C99 code because I find it is useful < 1214578352 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like variable sized structs < 1214578364 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :used for ip list in concurrent funge < 1214578371 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, I meant in the spirit of the rest of C-INTERCAL < 1214578378 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I normally try to pay homage to the langs other people chose < 1214578395 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so for instance my CLC-INTERCAL character set stuff is full of Perl idioms despite being written in C < 1214578482 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch < 1214578488 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, what are those idioms? < 1214578498 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly ifs done with short-circuit operators < 1214578504 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that requires a lot more parens to work in C < 1214578516 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um? short circut operators? isn't that the default in C? < 1214578520 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1214578525 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they aren't normally used for if statements < 1214578529 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :normally they're used for logic < 1214578565 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well if ((foo == bar) && (quux == xyzz)) will break on the first that is false < 1214578568 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in C < 1214578576 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for || it will break on the first that is true < 1214578588 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(void)(ic==-1 && (ick_cset_recent[ic=ick_csetow++].nbytes=0)); < 1214578599 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a common Perl idiom, but is much uglier in C < 1214578603 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1214578606 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does that do? < 1214578623 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1) that isn't a if statement < 1214578627 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2) that makes no sense < 1214578631 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it's functionally an if statement < 1214578639 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oooh < 1214578650 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[ $ic == -1 ]] && blah blah; < 1214578651 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in bash < 1214578659 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I use that *sometimes* in bash but not often < 1214578672 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in Perl it would read ic == -1 and $ick_cset_recent[$ic=$ick_csetow++]->nbytes=0; < 1214578675 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is much the same thing < 1214578681 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just C requires lots of parens < 1214578688 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a cast to void to satisfy linting tools < 1214578716 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well... < 1214578729 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GCC would warn on it < 1214578732 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something like: < 1214578737 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no wait it wouldn't < 1214578741 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it doesn't < 1214578748 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"statement with no effect"? < 1214578753 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have seen that < 1214578756 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when I typed: < 1214578760 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo == bar; < 1214578762 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of: < 1214578764 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo = bar; < 1214578765 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :once < 1214578796 0 :SevenInchBread!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"haaaaaaaaaa" < 1214578806 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gcc would also do it if you discard the data from a function marked __attribute__((const)) < 1214578811 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it does have an effect < 1214578816 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, yes true < 1214578816 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's two assignments in there < 1214578825 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a cast to void to show that I don't care about the final value < 1214578841 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, doing an assign inside a [] sucks IMO < 1214578849 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, probably, I wouldn't do it normally < 1214578854 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact there are two assigns inside that [] < 1214578855 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is perlish? < 1214578858 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the ++ is reasonable < 1214578862 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I have done ++/-- < 1214578864 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in that < 1214578864 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I don't think it's perlish < 1214578872 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except when golfing < 1214578885 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but Perl is much more commonly used for golfing than C < 1214578888 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why did you do it then? < 1214578893 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I couldn't resist the temptation to golf a bit < 1214578903 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tbh, often the temptation to golf a bit gets me anyway < 1214578911 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I avoid that < 1214578918 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but on serious projects I normally suppress it < 1214578920 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, doxygen kind of kills that ;P < 1214578925 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try it < 1214578936 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION imagines golfing documentation in such a way that it was still readable < 1214578941 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and useful < 1214578942 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doxygen works wonders on supressing your urge to golf < 1214579008 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1214579019 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, anything else you need help with explaining in cfunge? < 1214579031 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not right now, probably there will be later < 1214579033 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"This computer has gone to sleep" < 1214579041 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, try running: doxygen < 1214579043 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in top dir < 1214579050 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see doxygen-docs/html < 1214579058 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or doxygen-docs/latex < 1214579059 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after < 1214579149 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks mildly useful, presumably that becomes more and more useful the bigger your project gets < 1214579377 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... should I put much effort into making IFFI work standalone? < 1214579408 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in theory, it could work like that, creating a Funge + COME FROM language < 1214579421 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without the need for an INTERCAL program connecting < 1214579448 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that would mean reimplementing the INTERCAL call stack, etc., in cfunge, so it probably isn't worth doing < 1214579497 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed isn't worth doing < 1214579518 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, my future CFFI would be way more straight forward, just a wrapper for libffi < 1214579535 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1214579542 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after all, you don't need COME FROM then < 1214579549 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1214579569 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and indeed doxygen is way more useful on larger projects < 1214579587 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I did doxygen here in order to help third party developers < 1214579595 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know my way around the code anyway < 1214579750 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I think the file list and desc what each file contains should be useful to you < 1214579757 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, probably < 1214579808 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although ideally I won't have to touch any of cfunge apart from the main loop and fingerprint code < 1214579814 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact I still think it may be possible with unmodified sources, just with extra files being added < 1214579823 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe < 1214579856 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION just pushed a new revision < 1214579865 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just adding some comments to shut up some doxygen warnings < 1214580008 0 :timotiis!n=timotiis@jfkew.plus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1214580494 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: what do you call it when the IP's moving like it does in Befunge-93 < 1214580501 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is, one step at a time, orthogonally < 1214580679 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :• If the IP’s delta is either (0,-1) (south), (1,0) (east), (0,1) (north), or (-1,0) (west), it is said to < 1214580679 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : be travelling cardinally . This is the same as how a rook moves in chess and this is in fact < 1214580679 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : the only way the IP can move in Befunge-93. < 1214580694 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :• Any IP with a nonzero delta is considered moving. < 1214580695 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :• Any IP with a zero delta is said to be stopped. < 1214580695 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :• Any moving IP that is not travelling cardinally, and is not stopped, is said to be flying. < 1214580702 0 :Corun!n=Corun@cpc1-rdng15-0-0-cust168.winn.cable.ntl.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1214580706 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, thanks < 1214580724 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is found in funge98 standard, but the copy was from my 108 draft < 1214580734 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is in latext/pdf < 1214580734 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as far as I'm concerned, if people are going to write a COME FROM non-cardinally, they can put the code to set the IP direction in themselves rather than the interp trying to guess < 1214580735 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;P < 1214580741 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :latex* < 1214580777 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, what about pushing delta on stack? < 1214580793 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what parameters will your code have there? < 1214580869 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: well, the point is that I have to try all the markers with all the possible cardinal deltas < 1214580871 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1214580881 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1214580882 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1214580888 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't make sense < 1214580889 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214580893 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : AnMaster: well, the point is that I have to try all the markers with all the possible cardinal deltas < 1214580894 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* ais523 has quit (Remote closed the connection) < 1214580894 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ... < 1214580894 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : err < 1214580894 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : that doesn't make sense < 1214580895 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about < 1214580902 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for parameters, < 1214580919 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :V_1 = position to set marker at < 1214580929 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, suppose I have a line (100) in the INTERCAL code < 1214580931 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :V_2 delta to use for ip when we start from here < 1214580936 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and COME FROM (100) in the Befunge code < 1214580942 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :value = line number < 1214580951 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At current I'm planning that to be Maa*C < 1214580953 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, you could make it take more parameters < 1214580965 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, you mean more metadata/ < 1214580966 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for non-initial one < 1214580969 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's an interesting idea < 1214580981 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for initial one you would have to have some defaults < 1214580989 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does that sound sane? < 1214580994 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I kind of like the idea of a middot surrounded by arrowheads so that three of the directions are incorrect < 1214580997 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your way is saner, though < 1214581014 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but less visual in the source < 1214581078 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'll finish writing the spec as I planned it originally < 1214581080 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then show you < 1214581103 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1214581117 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well for initial marker allow just some directions < 1214581129 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for later markers I'd say allow more meta data < 1214581134 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, yes, the four (/two/six) cardinal directions seem to make sense < 1214581143 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe each marker should have allowed directions < 1214581156 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well for initial marker: cardinal < 1214581158 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which defaults to all four cardinal directions to test in for a middot entry < 1214581164 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for adding new using fingerprint: any delta < 1214581165 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right? < 1214581179 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but when specifying them programmatically you can use any delta you like < 1214581181 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also how do you do initial marker's line number? < 1214581193 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: the line numbers aren't metadata < 1214581198 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but instead specified in Funge code < 1214581199 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh?! < 1214581202 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1214581207 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf XD < 1214581210 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the markers are there to say where to start executing to determine the line number < 1214581219 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh my < 1214581222 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. line 150 would be Maf*L < 1214581226 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well write your specs < 1214581239 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that way you can have computed COME FROMs, computed line numbers, etc < 1214581239 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I will read with interest < 1214581243 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :food is soon ready < 1214581589 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: interesting point: if I try to do something that's an error in INTERCAL (such as NEXTing to a non-existent line) from inside Befunge, should it reflect as in Funge, or error out as in INTERCAL? < 1214581605 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, don't really know < 1214581613 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is a collisions of interests clearly < 1214581616 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1214581624 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably the second is what'll happen if I don't special-case it < 1214581634 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well do what you prefer < 1214581663 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure really, I'll have to think about it more < 1214581669 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :reflecting would certainly be more useful < 1214581672 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Try `rm ./-d9A2oq1N38.flv' to remove the file `-d9A2oq1N38.flv'. < 1214581677 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'm not sure if that's a good or a bad thing < 1214581680 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I knew that < 1214581689 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting to see gnu rm being so bloated < 1214581704 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION did rm -- -d9A2oq1N38.flv tough < 1214581727 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I think it's trying to be user-friendly < 1214581735 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that is at least a useful tip for people who don't know it < 1214581740 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1214581747 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :besides, have you seen how bloated GNU true is? < 1214581756 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know it is < 1214581771 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could write one in like 3 lines C: < 1214581776 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :int main(void) { < 1214581779 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :return 0; < 1214581781 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :} < 1214581797 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why does it need help? < 1214581798 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: IIRC there was a 0-byte implementation of true in some OS, but it was buggy < 1214581800 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or version < 1214581813 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for false just change to return 1 < 1214581824 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, a few lines of asm would also work < 1214581827 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders if a single colon would be a non-buggy implementation of true < 1214581834 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it's one byte of machine-code in DOS < 1214581841 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for rather convoluted reasons < 1214581843 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming *nix < 1214581843 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1214581846 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but DOS doesn't implement true anyway < 1214581854 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes com is crazy < 1214581857 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*.com I mean < 1214581864 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically, it pushes a 0 on the stack before the program runs < 1214581878 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, oh? why? < 1214581880 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the DOS equivalent of exit(0) is put at location 0 in the segment the .com file is loaded into < 1214581888 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :specifically so doing a single return will exit the program < 1214581896 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's for compatibility with some old OS < 1214581899 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that predates even DOS < 1214582001 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... I have a Windows version of true on here that I wrote myself, which was basically your three-liner < 1214582012 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's 172065 bytes as a .exe < 1214582024 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what all those bytes are used for? < 1214582042 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by comparison GNU true is only 22192 < 1214582059 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BusyBox true is even smaller because it's a symlink, but that's cheating < 1214582192 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: http://rafb.net/p/7Ze8i339.html < 1214582197 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those are my partial specs so far < 1214582205 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've put most of the flow-control stuff in there < 1214582290 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The fingerprint adds a new mode to the IP, known as 'mark mode'." < 1214582296 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you plan to store this? < 1214582303 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in static variables in my own stuff < 1214582310 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :other Funge commands have no way to change it < 1214582316 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it can exist at the same time as other modes < 1214582322 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I should clarify that a bit differently < 1214582329 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's possible to be in mark-stringmode for instance < 1214582340 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1214582344 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I'm not sure what would happen if something like L was hit whilst still in stringmode < 1214582355 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, clearly it wouldn't run the command < 1214582358 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would just push it on the stack < 1214582363 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what stringmode does, after all < 1214582446 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, what should happen on a @ < 1214582454 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or q < 1214582458 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all the programs end < 1214582461 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1214582468 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's consistent between C exit() and INTERCAL GIVE UP < 1214582475 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it should be consistent to Befunge @ too < 1214582478 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, do you need to do any clean up on your side? < 1214582486 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because cfunge simply calls exit() < 1214582490 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, deallocating memory's nice, but apart from that no < 1214582501 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, you could use atexit() then < 1214582508 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, I thought the same thing myself < 1214582509 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and OS should free the memory < 1214582515 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that'll be something to do later < 1214582524 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the OS frees the memory < 1214582530 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and because it affects more than just fffungi < 1214582534 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure about DOS though ;P < 1214582557 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DOS doesn't free after program end IIRC, but then I don't know if cfunge would run on it < 1214582570 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably it would under DJGPP, it might need some tweaking though < 1214582579 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure I see what C is doing < 1214582601 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: basically M5C does a COME FROM from line 5 < 1214582613 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing if it's encountered in program flow, it just pushes then pops the 5 < 1214582615 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1214582636 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if line 5 is encountered, it's run in mark-mode, the C compares 5 to 5, finds they're equal, and seizes control < 1214582649 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, bbiab food is ready < 1214582655 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1214583487 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back < 1214583607 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, how do you define a new come from label < 1214583613 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with that fingerprint < 1214583619 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and how do you remove an existing? < 1214583621 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what, the label to come from, or the come from itself? < 1214583635 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, you edit the playfield to add a marker, code to compute the label, and an L < 1214583645 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to remove an existing you simply demetadata the marker < 1214583651 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1214583660 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well here is how I would do it: < 1214583663 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although you can wipe that area of the playfield clean instead or as well if you like < 1214583682 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :N < 1214583684 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on stack < 1214583686 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and: < 1214583694 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :D < 1214583695 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on stack < 1214583700 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the first to add, the second to remove < 1214583718 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the second doesn't make sense when there are two COME FROMs aiming at the same line < 1214583723 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :admittedly, you probably don't want to do that < 1214583726 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok so you need x,y too < 1214583730 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's legal so long as that line's never encountered < 1214583741 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, well you could involve concurrency in this XD < 1214583744 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(better not) < 1214583748 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: that's what INTERCAL does in that situation < 1214583761 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but one issue with that is it only gives you noncomputed COME FROMs < 1214583770 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :both INTERCAL and C support computed COME FROMs < 1214583786 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :computed goto I know < 1214583792 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but computed come from I don't get < 1214583797 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just COME FROM an expression < 1214583805 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whenever a line label is reached, that expression's evaluated < 1214583807 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :computed come from would be exceedingly slow right? < 1214583814 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :need to be checked once every line < 1214583818 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if it evaluates to the same value as the label, you do the COME FROM < 1214583821 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes, it is pretty slow < 1214583827 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although not all lines are labeled in INTERCAL < 1214583831 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which speeds it up to some extent < 1214584112 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, anything else? < 1214584128 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not right now, I don't think < 1214584160 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, will there be a way to do non-computed COME FROM in your fingerprint? < 1214584173 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's just COME FROM with a constant expression < 1214584178 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1214584183 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that is faster right? < 1214584183 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you think there should be an optimised way? < 1214584198 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: not the way I was planning to implement it, it's a bit difficult to optimise < 1214584208 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes I think it should be an optimized way, though you could do it optimized anyway < 1214584216 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can't be compiled into a goto, for instance because Funge can't be compiled < 1214584217 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :monitor those cells for change < 1214584238 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, what about JITing? < 1214584248 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has pondered JIT of befunge for quite some time < 1214584258 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but JIT is unportable < 1214584262 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe with LLVM? < 1214584471 0 :ais523_!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214584498 0 :ais523_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry... < 1214584504 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1214584508 0 :ais523_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ais523 < 1214584637 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf68ca.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1214584654 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : it can't be compiled into a goto, for instance because Funge can't be compiled < 1214584654 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : monitor those cells for change < 1214584654 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ais523, what about JITing? < 1214584654 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* AnMaster has pondered JIT of befunge for quite some time < 1214584654 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : but JIT is unportable < 1214584655 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : maybe with LLVM? < 1214584658 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, missed any of that? < 1214584666 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I missed bits of it < 1214584674 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is LLVM, anyway? < 1214584684 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I thought JIT was a compilation technique, so how can it be unportable? < 1214584693 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, you mean that it would need to compile into machine code < 1214584737 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, the registered Sgeo on Agora is I < 1214584756 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: good, I thought so, but given the circumstances it was worth checking < 1214584765 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I seriously doubt you're ehird in disguise < 1214584792 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe he had this disguise lurking for years just for this possibility muahahahah! j/k < 1214584855 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, indeed machine code :/ < 1214584863 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and llvm is some pretty cool stuff < 1214584864 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :google < 1214585015 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As a player, I have to read EVERY public message? < 1214585054 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :11:42 AM (1 hour ago) < 1214585064 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, are you a time traveller? < 1214585080 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I'm in UTC+1 < 1214585089 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, you don't have to read every public message < 1214585100 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however sending a public message is an accepted way of informing you of something < 1214585119 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can't claim ignorance of the contents of a public message < 1214585126 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :take this conversation over to ##nomic? < 1214585950 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1214585972 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214586512 0 :tusho!n=tusho@91.105.117.61 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214586523 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523 < 1214586525 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH YEAH < 1214586536 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::3 < 1214586574 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmph < 1214586581 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i would appreciate your approval < 1214586582 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1214586602 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, hm? < 1214586620 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: the beat-ais523-greeting-me competition < 1214586639 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1214586641 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :riright < 1214586653 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHY AM I STILL ON THE COMPUTER?! < 1214586666 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cause < 1214586681 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have somewhere I want to be at 1:30 my time < 1214586690 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I still need to look for clothing and eat < 1214586701 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I can only be there 4 hours out of 9.5hrs < 1214586712 0 :ais523_!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214586716 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: GAHAHA < 1214586721 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got you while your network was fucked evidently! < 1214586734 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still, i got you much less than a second after actually joining, so I'd have beat you anyway < 1214586739 0 :ais523_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi tusho < 1214586741 0 :ais523_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from my point of view, I won < 1214586743 0 :ais523_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from your point of view, you did < 1214586747 0 :ais523_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the logs will have stated you won < 1214586750 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1214586753 0 :ais523_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ais523 < 1214586757 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523_: unless you scripted it, no way < 1214586758 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so good win < 1214586762 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had 'hi ais523' on the clipboard < 1214586770 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and as soon as I saw 'esoteric' appear in the sidebar, CMD-VENTER < 1214586783 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'll have come late to you because of your network problems < 1214586795 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it actually didn't arrive at all < 1214586802 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, then < 1214586803 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-P < 1214586807 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I believe you < 1214586811 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming a good network I probably would have won < 1214586812 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yay < 1214586820 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: oh, and I suspect oerjan has better things to do than play agora < 1214586824 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like writing papers and stuff. < 1214586954 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION ponders adding a hi tusho script < 1214586958 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and hi ais523 < 1214586961 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1214586969 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I never disconnect my client < 1214586978 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unlike you two < 1214586994 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as for this night's disconnect: power outage < 1214587006 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I'm not online at all much of the time < 1214587009 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and my laptop's off < 1214587013 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it would be a bit hard to be connected < 1214587016 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh ok < 1214587047 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless, presumably, I run a friendly bot on some always connected server and actually implement /nickswap... < 1214587225 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1214587241 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214587413 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1214587467 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214587922 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :atsampson: ping < 1214587935 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: cmeme kept joining/parting < 1214587937 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so lament banned em < 1214587939 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: what's with all the pinging random people that's going on today? < 1214587947 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: techncially, seveninchbread talked earlier < 1214587949 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :03:52:18 .. < 1214587964 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and lament banned the logbot? presumably, it's worth trying letting it back in to see if it helps < 1214587965 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was just joining the bandwagon < 1214587970 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it can always be banned again < 1214587973 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i think e unbanned the logbot, but it never returned < 1214587977 0 :atsampson!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: pong < 1214587980 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :makes sense < 1214587987 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :atsampson: hey!! you're not dead < 1214587988 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi :) < 1214587996 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is amazed < 1214587996 0 :atsampson!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't go that far -- it is Friday evening ;) < 1214588014 0 :atsampson!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wanders off to fight the Amazon courier service < 1214588020 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1214588065 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are yyou about to talk about doing things at the last minute? < 1214588067 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably not < 1214588076 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just had some rather strong deja vu < 1214588108 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://dev.eclipse.org/viewcvs/index.cgi/org.aspectj/modules/weaver/src/org/aspectj/weaver/patterns/HasThisTypePatternTriedToSneakInSomeGenericOrParameterizedTypePatternMatchingStuffAnywhereVisitor.java?revision=1.1&root=Tools_Project < 1214588109 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTF < 1214588112 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1214589658 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ping < 1214589682 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, ping < 1214589712 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pong < 1214589717 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is more active in ##nomic < 1214589724 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone up for pinging everyone in this channel? < 1214589727 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, maybe you? < 1214589731 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or you tusho? < 1214589736 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pong < 1214589739 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1214589741 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds good < 1214589746 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ahem* < 1214589772 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: stop faking your ping time responses, it's silly < 1214589786 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAA_AAA ais523 AnMaster atsampson augur bsmntbombdood cctoide cherez clog Corun Deewiant Dewi fizzie ihope Ilari jamesstanley Judofyr lament lifthras1ir mtve oklopol Polar puzzlet RodgerTheGreat sebbu sekhmet Sgeo shachaf SimonRC Slereah_ timotiis tusho < 1214589789 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and ihope won that little ping race < 1214589791 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: his client does that < 1214589794 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wha < 1214589800 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: i pinged everyone < 1214589809 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: that's just pingspam < 1214589813 0 :Judofyr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1214589813 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omgwhat < 1214589823 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho dont make me rape you. < 1214589826 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: EXACTLY! < 1214589835 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1214589839 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: AnMaster proposed it < 1214589840 0 :Judofyr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kill, kill, kill, kill! < 1214589844 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything he says is logical and rational < 1214589846 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-P < 1214589852 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice to see this channel alive! < 1214589861 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ANMASTER IS AN ASS. < 1214589863 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MASTER. < 1214589864 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but in the wrong way < 1214589867 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.. < 1214589869 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I pinged everyone too, but via ctcp < 1214589871 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, I said it as a joke < 1214589881 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a lot nicer < 1214589884 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was tusho that didn't get the joke < 1214589893 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*the previous statement should be read in the voice of Shake, from Aqua Teen Hunger Force < 1214589899 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Ping reply from cherez: 0.31 second(s) < 1214589899 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Ping reply from Sgeo: 0.55 second(s) < 1214589899 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Ping reply from clog: 0.57 second(s) < 1214589902 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those won < 1214589908 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, ihope won when I tried < 1214589913 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then clog < 1214589915 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, well not odd < 1214589916 0 :cherez!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You punks! < 1214589921 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cherez: thanks < 1214589921 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1214589925 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, after all < 1214589935 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we are probably on different servers < 1214589936 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: now to do that in #ubuntu... < 1214589942 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: YES < 1214589943 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YES < 1214589943 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YES < 1214589943 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YES < 1214589946 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1214589946 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION writes a bot < 1214589947 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1214589949 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1214589949 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: stop spamming < 1214589953 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no, you'll just get banned < 1214589958 0 :cherez!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mark my words: you will have been on fire recently in the near future! < 1214589964 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, do it in #wikipedia rather < 1214589967 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: glad I use os x then :-P < 1214589968 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no don't < 1214589969 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: #ubuntu's bigger < 1214589970 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cherez: ha, a decent use of the future perfect < 1214589979 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, but ais523 is a wikipedia admin < 1214589983 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he will ban you ;) < 1214589986 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh < 1214589992 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not a wikipedia chanop < 1214589992 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wikipedia admin != #wikipedia op < 1214589994 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1214589996 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1214589999 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's like 500 wikipedia admins. < 1214590004 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can there be that many chanops? < 1214590004 0 :cherez!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It rarely gets used in English, so I try to bring it back when I can. < 1214590017 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, editors with like a few months of experience get adminship over there, it's bizzare :-P < 1214590025 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cherez: worth it, although Feather requires a whole new set of tenses < 1214590029 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Mark my words: you will have been on fire recently in the near future! <-- is that valid? < 1214590037 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yes, I parsed it < 1214590042 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a bit redundant < 1214590045 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does that form mean? < 1214590047 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but correct < 1214590065 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it means that at some point in the future, someone (probably tusho) will have been on fire recently < 1214590065 0 :pingspam!i=ping@gateway/tor/x-60c38a6581e2fcf2 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214590072 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1214590076 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/kickban pingspam < 1214590081 0 :pingspam!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :enlarge your pings! < 1214590088 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pingspam: hi AnMaster < 1214590094 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh? < 1214590096 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's weird about future perfect < 1214590097 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, ? < 1214590100 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a guess < 1214590102 0 :pingspam!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :get latent quick! < 1214590102 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a tor user < 1214590110 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't think of anyone else who would use tor in here < 1214590111 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, well I'm not pingspam < 1214590112 0 :pingspam!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1214590119 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you? < 1214590123 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1214590133 0 :cherez!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not fun if they don't have to spend a little while grokking. < 1214590139 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, I don't even have tor on this pda < 1214590145 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: I've learnt through experience to deny your denials in such cases < 1214590146 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I'm not at home < 1214590157 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still think it was you who wrote a bot to vandalise the canada ruleset < 1214590170 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my mouth hurts :( < 1214590191 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, ouch, maybe write a esoteric language bemoaning this fact? < 1214590192 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION runs < 1214590200 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:02… ais523: oklopol: stop faking your ping time responses, it's silly <<< what? < 1214590210 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't use tor < 1214590210 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-P < 1214590213 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Ping reply from oklopol: 1214535396.53 second(s) < 1214590215 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, that < 1214590217 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably < 1214590221 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's his client < 1214590222 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::| < 1214590226 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well, I get 15 seconds within less than a second when I ping you < 1214590233 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, faking ping responses was my idea first! < 1214590236 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no < 1214590240 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clients do it quite often < 1214590240 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then I find nnscript's done it all along < 1214590244 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just as a 'oh shut up' < 1214590245 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I get more than that < 1214590252 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I get a whole 1214535396 seconds < 1214590256 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: probably our clients encode the ping timer different ways < 1214590268 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you guys seen the 4chan quine? < 1214590268 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, yes I think it uses unsigned int... < 1214590274 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, where? < 1214590278 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: no, how did that happen? < 1214590281 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it an IRP quine? < 1214590288 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and has it become a worm? < 1214590294 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or a meme? < 1214590309 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it pudding? < 1214590322 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION glares at oklopol < 1214590371 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop it that tickles < 1214590371 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://encyclopediadramatica.com/4chan.js < 1214590426 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1214590428 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it posts itself < 1214590437 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clever < 1214590438 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's a JS virus? < 1214590462 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's a JS that, when run, posts {Copy and paste the following to Notepad, save with the filename "4chan.js", open the file you created and shit bricks.} < 1214590465 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :followed by its own code < 1214590472 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to 4chan, repeatedly < 1214590475 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's a JS honor virus < 1214590476 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's hardly obfuscation < 1214590494 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it spams /b/ with a message telling people to run itself < 1214590498 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://encyclopediadramatica.com/4chan.js#Unencoded_script < 1214590516 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, server the purpose of obfuscation, but there should be a separate word for real obfuscation, and that kind of trivial code hiding < 1214590535 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://images.encyclopediadramatica.com/images/8/81/4chanjsshit3.PNG ok this made me laugh < 1214590539 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, sex partners < 1214590712 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what in gods name < 1214590767 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : wow, sex partners < 1214590768 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : what in gods name < 1214590770 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#esoteric is modern art < 1214590780 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, oklopol! :D < 1214590782 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::pounce:: < 1214590797 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: actually, I've been thinking that esolangs are an art form for a while, and the associated channel seems to be a different art form < 1214590829 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: only after augur and oklopol and Slereah_ < 1214590833 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they kind of mesh with the rest of the channel < 1214590835 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it explodes into art < 1214590989 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: well actually, i got redirected to a page that told me there are cheap sex partners in turku :D < 1214590993 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(where i live) < 1214590998 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: o, that's the interstial ads < 1214591000 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you click Skip Ads < 1214591010 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, im very cheap < 1214591011 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :free infact < 1214591014 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just not in turku :( < 1214591034 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :interstial? < 1214591044 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1214591045 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: so i hear! < 1214591045 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: between the sts < 1214591080 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ah! < 1214591146 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats the full JS in that post? < 1214591172 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i see < 1214591177 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, the challenge is to golf that JS down to 510 characters, plus the IRC stuff that goes on at the start of the line < 1214591177 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, how goes ffungi? < 1214591186 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I've been doing other things for a while, sorry < 1214591193 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the ffungi window is still open but not typed in < 1214591203 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, blargh < 1214591207 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;P < 1214591230 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I support that blargh. < 1214591244 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that script obviously cheats the quine part, so it's not really an interesting task < 1214591260 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: how do you cheatquine in JS? < 1214591264 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh. i think its interesting that the script preys on windows users. < 1214591270 0 :KingOfKarlsruhe!n=cypher@HSI-KBW-091-089-028-216.hsi2.kabelbw.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1214591273 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais: cheatquine? < 1214591276 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, by using JS's method of outputting the source for a function? < 1214591277 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: dunno, but something there has to read the source. < 1214591290 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: a quine that doesn't use "legitimate" techinques < 1214591293 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't actually read it, because i don't know half the functions used < 1214591297 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. a quine that reads the program's source code from disk < 1214591299 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, you mean one that reads its own source? < 1214591305 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that sort of thing < 1214591310 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or the Q command in HQ9+ < 1214591318 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or arguably any PHP program that doesn't contain < < 1214591327 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that one's more debatable < 1214591331 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats ever so slightly tricky i think. < 1214591340 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: < 1214591341 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f = WSH.createobject("scripting.filesystemobject") < 1214591341 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :g = f.opentextfile(WSH.scriptfullname) < 1214591341 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :h = g.readall() < 1214591343 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this does it < 1214591351 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now that i took a glance < 1214591360 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ugh, they should have done it genuinely < 1214591360 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that only works with some weird WSH thing which isnt standard JS < 1214591367 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes. < 1214591368 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: well duh < 1214591372 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the instructions say save it as 4chan.js < 1214591373 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then run it < 1214591385 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can do it without that i think. < 1214591387 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after all, in JS if you cast a function to a string you get its source code < 1214591388 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, that is an instant hint it cheats < 1214591390 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: duh. < 1214591393 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, augur, but it uses WSH for other stuff < 1214591394 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's pretty easy to do < 1214591405 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais: true < 1214591412 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that doesnt print the script as a whole < 1214591414 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just the function < 1214591441 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: < 1214591459 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: it's easy enough to quote the bit around it in the function itself < 1214591462 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: but it's trivial to do the rest < 1214591464 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1214591467 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :function f(){var me = "function f(){" + f.toString() + "};f();";};f() < 1214591470 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er < 1214591473 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :function f(){var me = "function f(){" + f.toString() + "};f();";};f(); < 1214591479 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'me' is the program < 1214591499 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: actually I think toString gives the name of the function as well < 1214591500 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me test < 1214591514 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ah yes < 1214591525 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :function f(){var me = f.toString() + ";f();"; ...};f(); < 1214591530 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :technically that has extra whitespace < 1214591532 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it reindents the code) < 1214591538 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :javascript:function f(){var me = f.toString() + ";f();"; alert(me);};f(); < 1214591541 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's almost a quine < 1214591542 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can't use obfuscation with it. < 1214591544 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1214591545 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except that Firefox pretty-prints it < 1214591550 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's required < 1214591552 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a do-the-same-thing quine, anyway < 1214591554 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Safari does it < 1214591555 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1214591556 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok so firstly < 1214591559 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that way wouldn't let you obfuscate it < 1214591563 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is required for that worm to work well < 1214591565 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you dont need ; after the } in the function definition < 1214591572 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :secondlt, you dont need f.toString < 1214591572 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: we know < 1214591575 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you need a newline instead < 1214591575 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: yes you could obfuscate it like that < 1214591578 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and third < 1214591581 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we know javascript, jeez < 1214591582 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you < 1214591585 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'re not the only one in here < 1214591588 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we were just hacking it up on irc < 1214591594 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and? < 1214591601 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ... so you don't need to tell us :\ < 1214591619 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then act like you know it without me needing to tell you. :) < 1214591620 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: you could put the source code for a JS obfuscator inside the quine if you wanted to < 1214591627 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah augur, how silly of you to think me, tusho or ais523 wouldn't know a language that exists. < 1214591629 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well yes, but. < 1214591641 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ais523 has written quite a lot of esolang interps in JS < 1214591644 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most of his interps are, in fact < 1214591648 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're on the esowiki < 1214591653 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and readily linked < 1214591654 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: I've written at least one esolang interp in JS < 1214591660 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: at least 3 < 1214591661 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i believe < 1214591662 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also a BF-minus-input to Underload compiler < 1214591668 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: probably, I lose track < 1214591668 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(function f() { alert("(" + f+")()"; })() < 1214591674 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: i don't know what your point is, but good to know :P < 1214591682 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did know ais523 knows js < 1214591711 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've written nothing in js, i think < 1214591715 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i know it quite well < 1214591735 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also I wrote quite a few scripts for Wikipedia in JS < 1214591739 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i know it well enough to use it, i don't prolly know much about its specific coolnesses. < 1214591765 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: coolnesses: cloning-based object model, lambdas, exceptions < 1214591772 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i know those < 1214591776 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and a really sane syntax for objects < 1214591800 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, oklotalk "stole" js:s object model somewhat, although i learned about js after designing it. < 1214591816 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just it did exist before ot, and it's very similar < 1214591819 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(function () { < 1214591819 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : alert("(" + arguments.callee + ")();"); < 1214591820 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :})(); < 1214591822 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a real quine in firefox < 1214591827 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i.e. actually the same text) < 1214591835 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: really sane syntax for objects? < 1214591840 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: thats basically what i wrote before. < 1214591842 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yep < 1214591842 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the function thing? < 1214591843 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only more verbose. < 1214591846 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least I think so < 1214591850 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: except yours didn't output the same string bit for bit. < 1214591851 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compare to Java for instance < 1214591861 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because function's string conversion prettyprints in all browesrs I know. < 1214591862 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't tried it out, but i like the model, and have invented it a few times < 1214591873 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: {prop: value, prop: value, ...} < 1214591874 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: not terribly relevant since whitespace is semantically empty. < 1214591878 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :add back in the whitespace if you want. < 1214591881 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: a quine outputs its code byte for byte < 1214591882 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, that one, right < 1214591884 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I did < 1214591888 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: well, your program outputs a quine, at least < 1214591888 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no you didnt. < 1214591894 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have that in a few of my languages as well < 1214591906 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you used arguments.callee which is unnecessary, tusho. < 1214591914 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, methods are just properties which are functions < 1214591918 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: naming things is for losers < 1214591929 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and arguments.callee is fun < 1214591933 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :losers and people who want small functions. < 1214591941 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now try to do it by overriding Array() < 1214591947 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's get offended that I made your quine actually be a quine < 1214591949 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a great topic < 1214591951 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :furthermore, named functions like that are the same as arguments.callee < 1214591951 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note that they don't allow that in FF3 because it's a security risk < 1214591953 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think we should whine about it all day < 1214591954 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :waaaaaaah < 1214591975 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: why the fuck did you do that? < 1214591982 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's augur done to deserve such bashing < 1214592000 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: his previous bashing; and the fact that he wouldn't shut up about it < 1214592005 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: let me prove to you why you're wrong: string outputting for function code is dependent on browser, and therefore yours is no more a quine then mine. < 1214592016 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: i stated 'in FF' < 1214592020 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :irrelevant. < 1214592059 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :always with the fighting < 1214592069 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey dont blame me, tushos the one being a child. < 1214592074 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want to code up something < 1214592087 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: whatever you say :P < 1214592087 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: pretty sure you agreed to shut the fuck up about my age. < 1214592090 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, progress? < 1214592096 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I haven't started again < 1214592108 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: i wasn't referencing your age, but i figured you'd think that given your current mental state. < 1214592113 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :StartCoding(ais523, ffungi); < 1214592123 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :undefined < 1214592125 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: don't worry, you usually appear the more mature one :P < 1214592131 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in case you were unaware, tusho, saying someones acting like a child is not a reference to their age < 1214592135 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but a reference to their behavior < 1214592136 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am aware < 1214592139 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it was clearly a reference < 1214592142 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although often the more annoying one. < 1214592146 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually it clearly wasnt < 1214592164 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've been trying to shut up about this for the past like 10 messages, can we actually do that now < 1214592177 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i find it interesting that you're so worked up about the quine that you're this irrational, tusho. < 1214592189 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you should go have a nice cup of tea and come back when you've calmed down. < 1214592196 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1214592199 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i find it interesting that you evidently find this conversation fulfilling, worthwhile, or indeed useful, when I just suggested we drop it. < 1214592201 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe a nap < 1214592204 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah cuz he's british, haha < 1214592216 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know. hes british. oh those brits. < 1214592229 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh also nap cuz he's so young :P < 1214592233 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :such comedy < 1214592241 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey hey hey, dont mention his age < 1214592244 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh, code, must code < 1214592300 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: i don't see why you always make everything spiral out of control into pointless bickering whenever you say something and I point out an error I see in it < 1214592308 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's really damn tiring < 1214592309 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol. < 1214592318 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, where did _I_ make this spiral out of control? < 1214592318 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially when I ask if we can stop and you start commenting about the conversation < 1214592326 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-sigh- < 1214592343 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're trying to come out of this more mature than me I don't think you're going very far < 1214592344 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could it have been when i acted like a fucking twat and said stupid shit like < 1214592345 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"let's get offended that I made your quine actually be a quine" < 1214592349 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, wait, that was you! < 1214592363 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats right, YOURE the one who started acting like an idiot, silly me. < 1214592385 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jesus christ < 1214592423 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"c'mon guys geez I was obviously acting like an idiot ironically your sarcasm meters are broken I'm not actually being an asshole honest" < 1214592453 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1214592456 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : undefined < 1214592459 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :blergfh < 1214592470 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay tusho left, now you can code ais523! < 1214592541 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so on to more interesting things < 1214592569 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"This computer has gone to sleep" < 1214592685 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i downloaded a torrent the other day < 1214592693 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it had like a hundred books on CS subjects < 1214592697 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly AI-related stuff < 1214592701 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but lots of other stuff too < 1214592713 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1214592720 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now you have to read them all < 1214592791 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know :( < 1214592796 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im reading one right now actually < 1214592917 0 :RedDak!n=dak@87.18.90.165 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214592934 0 :KingOfKarlsruhe!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1214592935 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh also, awesome music: < 1214592945 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wellnowwhat.net/transfers/Dream.zip < 1214593004 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zips usually just sounds like white noise to me < 1214593065 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1214593102 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ive actually got a 30 second brown noise loop i can send you < 1214593109 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its great for going to sleep. :o < 1214593148 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :javascript:var y="X",x="javascript:var y=\"X\",x=\"X\".split(y);alert(x[0]+y+x[1]+x.join(y).split('\\\\').join('\\\\\\\\').split(\"\\\"\").join(\"\\\\\"\")+x[2]);".split(y);alert(x[0]+y+x[1]+x.join(y).split('\\').join('\\\\').split("\"").join("\\\"")+x[2]); < 1214593155 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are probably simpler ways to do that, though < 1214593325 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :christ almighty wtf is that?! < 1214593326 0 :tusho!n=tusho@91.105.117.61 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214593326 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1214593342 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks like a quine < 1214593350 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is a quine < 1214593354 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without cheating < 1214593356 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i don't actually feel like running it in my head < 1214593359 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais thats ridiculous. lol < 1214593360 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to be precise, it's a URL quine < 1214593367 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I included the javascript: at the start in it < 1214593370 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, got that much < 1214593429 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :glah, i hate imperative quines. < 1214593458 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(\x -> x ++ show x) "(\x -> x ++ show x) " < 1214593471 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i love functional quines :P < 1214593475 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ap (++) show "ap (++) show " -- this works too I think < 1214593484 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ap? < 1214593518 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ap is a monad thing < 1214593526 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ap = liftM2 id < 1214593537 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(:aSS):aSS < 1214593566 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(aS(:^)S):^ < 1214593569 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: basically < 1214593575 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ap m1 m2 = do { x1 <- m1; x2 <- m2; return (x1 x2) } < 1214593585 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in this case we use it with the function monad < 1214593591 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: function monad? < 1214593591 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :full quine: < 1214593594 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah < 1214593598 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does that do? < 1214593606 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: < 1214593606 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: @src (->) return < 1214593606 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[19:07] lambdabot: return = const < 1214593606 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[19:07] tusho: @src (->) (>>=) < 1214593607 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[19:07] lambdabot: f >>= k = \ r -> k (f r) r < 1214593627 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's the Reader monad < 1214593632 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but without the wrapper of Reader < 1214593646 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and 'ask' becomes 'id') < 1214593674 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :main = putStrLn $ ap (++) show "main = putStrLn $ ap (++) show " < 1214593677 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :full version < 1214593717 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a rough conversion of tusho's functional quine: (function (f) { alert("(" + f + ")(\"" + f + "\");"); })("function (f) { alert((\" + f + \")(\\\"\" + f + \"\\\");\"); }"); < 1214593736 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's basically right < 1214593743 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's imperative and has backslash syndrome < 1214593743 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :QED < 1214593744 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1214593795 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, backslashes are, well.. < 1214593825 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: that's why I use directed quotes in Underload < 1214593837 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :directed quotes? < 1214593845 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :strings are delimited by () < 1214593847 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :separate quote for open and close < 1214593847 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and () nest < 1214593865 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :incidentally, INTERCAL causes brilliant confusion by using undirected parens in expressions < 1214593868 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :( for open, ) for close, instead of " for both < 1214593869 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as the opposite of that < 1214593882 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: like doesn't matter which you use? < 1214593894 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no, you enclose groups in ' ' or " " < 1214593904 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so in C you'd write, say, (1 + 1) * 3 < 1214593916 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with INTERCAL parenising that would be " ' 1 + 1 ' * 3 " < 1214593925 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: is it whitespace sensitive < 1214593926 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like nopol < 1214593927 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: no < 1214593929 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :darn < 1214593931 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was just making it easier to read < 1214593932 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, yeah, i should've known that < 1214593941 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais, how do you quote a (? < 1214593944 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a huge run of ' and " all mashed together is a pain to read in a variable-width font < 1214593945 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: nopol has <> for lists, and >< for negative lists! < 1214593951 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: you can't, ( and ) always come in pairs < 1214593960 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can use the a command to enclose something in ( ) < 1214593962 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :beat that confusingness < 1214593977 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so then quines cant be produced with strings < 1214593977 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in Underload, there's no way to modify the contents of a string, just append things to it and prepend things to it < 1214593983 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: yes they can < 1214593985 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how? < 1214593989 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just use a to create a pair of parens < 1214593990 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd need to quote ( < 1214593992 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(:aSS):aSS < 1214593995 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd like (1 + 1) * 3 to be 1 + )1 * 3( in a language < 1214594014 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: wasn't there a BF version which swapped + with - and [ with ]? < 1214594019 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, dont be silly < 1214594022 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :another silly BF derivative < 1214594026 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: how's that similar? < 1214594031 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd have to be 1 + 1) * 3( < 1214594036 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: because [ and ] go the wrong way round < 1214594041 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/augur/oklopol/ < 1214594047 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that's not nearly the same < 1214594056 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oklopol, dont be silly < 1214594061 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh, yes, I misread it < 1214594062 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION points to the sign saying "#esoteric" < 1214594079 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: 1 + )1 * 3( will work just fine < 1214594084 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lies! < 1214594085 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1214594088 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1214594090 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, you know < 1214594091 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'll see < 1214594098 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its easy to transform that into sensible stuff < 1214594099 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, the ) and ( reduce the precedence of everything inside them? < 1214594102 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as opposed to increasing precedence? < 1214594106 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just move each ) and ( to the right one < 1214594107 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes < 1214594117 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: what? < 1214594117 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: obviously that cant be true < 1214594131 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is no precedence for 1*3 in the statement (1+1) * 3 < 1214594137 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::| < 1214594142 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: yes, but * has a precedence < 1214594150 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1214594152 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine, say, that * and / have precedence 2, and + and - have precedence 1 < 1214594169 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :say parens increase the precedence of everything inside them by 2, but otherwise have no meaning < 1214594173 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :)( will not be a context insensitive construct. < 1214594179 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you can parse strings of + - * / without trouble < 1214594179 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, but decreasing precedence is somewhat nonsensical by grouping like that. < 1214594180 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there will not be a trivial conversion < 1214594192 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: no, it works too, in much the same way < 1214594206 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: seems nonsensical because of the lack of context insensitivity < 1214594209 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :precedence only arises with composite op composite-or-atomic < 1214594224 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but otherwise there's nothing nonsensical about it. < 1214594240 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh, my version of how it worked was context-insensitive < 1214594246 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to keep it simple, say there's only one op o < 1214594246 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no < 1214594250 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 + )1 * 3( makes no sense because the operation 1*3 has no precedence in the semantics. < 1214594259 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(1 o (2 o 3)) o 4 is how it would look normally < 1214594286 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 o 2) o ((3 o 4)) is how it would go in reverse-paren notation < 1214594288 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1214594289 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1214594289 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: context insensitive in syntax, but not in semantics < 1214594289 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1214594293 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, (1 o 2) o ((3 o 4)) < 1214594296 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its the * that has precedence so you would need to do something like < 1214594301 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and all those parens are backwards < 1214594305 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 + 1 )*( 3 < 1214594308 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :)1 o 2( o ))3 o 4(( < 1214594318 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well, maybe I have a different idea from you < 1214594331 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I have the same idea as augur, except I moved the parens to just outside the closest operands < 1214594333 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I could < 1214594336 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, stop all of you, it took me a second to come up with the perfect way, stop slowly spelling it out for me :P < 1214594356 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i have no idea what augur is doing < 1214594363 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i'm sure it's the same < 1214594382 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you're silly. < 1214594388 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1214594392 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am fairly silly < 1214594393 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im simply saying that 1 + )1 * 3( makes no sense < 1214594402 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: two people disagree with you < 1214594405 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: yeah, you say a lot of things that make no sense < 1214594406 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: yes it does, the ) ( reduce the precedence of * < 1214594407 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so uh, i guess maybe it does make sense < 1214594416 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and they're moved outside the operands for aesthetics < 1214594417 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/shrug < 1214594419 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais: but thats not how precedence works. < 1214594428 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: yes it is, in this system < 1214594434 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it may not be how you use precedence normally < 1214594440 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: really, it's just that the semantics aren't context insensitive, which you automatically assume from a nesting construct. < 1214594448 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, sure if you say that )( work only on the operator they enclose, ignoring the operands, then thats fine < 1214594449 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but precedence is equivalent to "parens increase the precedence of everything inside them by a lot" < 1214594454 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but its not the reverse of () in any sense. < 1214594455 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: yes, that is what I mean < 1214594466 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the ( ) are also put around the operands for no good reason < 1214594467 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the stuff inside )( has no precedence. < 1214594480 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually they're put around the operands for a very good reason < 1214594505 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, 1 (o 2 (o)) 3 o 4 is equivalent to (1 o (2 o 3)) o 4 < 1214594506 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :() are part of ordered rules. < 1214594518 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just that the second looks nicer < 1214594529 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually no its not the same ais :P < 1214594538 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::| < 1214594543 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it is, the way I'm doing it < 1214594556 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, if ( is "increase the precedence of the things to the right of here by a lot" < 1214594566 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ) is "increase the precedence of things to the left of here by a lot" < 1214594571 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the way you're doing it is not the reverse of () and therefore not relevant to the original problem. :P < 1214594578 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, ) = decrease to the right, ais523, i think < 1214594582 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you get a nice balanced notation that works both for forward and for backward () < 1214594586 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1214594587 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually < 1214594591 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course works your way too < 1214594595 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's equivalent < 1214594598 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1214594603 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your way's nicer because it leads to smaller numbers, of course < 1214594615 0 :Corun!n=Corun@cpc1-rdng15-0-0-cust168.winn.cable.ntl.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1214594615 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... we could end up with paren golf! < 1214594622 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1214594624 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 o (2 o 3)) o 4 < 1214594627 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais: your way is a bitch to parse too. :P < 1214594632 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that isn't even balanced < 1214594635 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and my way is trivial to parse < 1214594639 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lies. < 1214594644 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :using traditional operator-precedence algorithms < 1214594650 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just the parens dynamically change precedences < 1214594656 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lying lies. < 1214594658 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this way, you don't even need left- and right-precedences < 1214594665 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it handles parens more naturally than the old method < 1214594679 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, it's just augur wants to parse the syntactically context insensitive construct straightforwardly into a context insensitive ast < 1214594699 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes, the parens vanish altogether in the parsetree < 1214594702 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually i just want to use ordered rules. i like them better. ;) < 1214594703 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's as it should be < 1214594720 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ordered rules make precedence a breeze, since its inherent in the system. < 1214594777 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: for golfing your original, (1 o (2 o 3)) o 4 => 1 o 2( o ))3 o 4, ay? < 1214594791 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes, that works < 1214594796 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like this < 1214594811 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why haven't i ever teamed you @ language creation, you get me :) < 1214594817 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, pee time -> < 1214594838 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :me + ais523 + oklopol < 1214594841 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric := argument < 1214594841 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wouldnt that really need to be 1 o 2) o ((3 o 4? < 1214594860 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: no < 1214594867 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have the parens the wrong way round < 1214594892 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then () is behaving like normal and increasing precedence inside < 1214594911 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::\ < 1214594912 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: that's right, but it's decreasing precedence outside < 1214594918 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1214594926 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's symmetrically-acting parens < 1214594933 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which can be placed anywhere in the input string without trouble < 1214594938 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but its exactly the same then as the normal kind < 1214594947 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: no, its an extension to the normal kind < 1214594951 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1214594956 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its a trivial conversion from that to the normal kind < 1214594965 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that's what I was trying to say all along < 1214594982 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol was trying to make it exceedingly non-trivial in appearance < 1214594989 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make it seem reversed. < 1214594996 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really < 1214595012 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your whole big thing is reversing, what are you talking about < 1214595012 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1214595014 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 o )2 o 3( o 4 < 1214595023 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's much nicer with reverse parens than normal parens < 1214595029 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compare to 1 o (2 o 3) o 4 < 1214595033 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a nice duality there < 1214595045 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can pick whatever parens suit the job < 1214595072 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o (o) (o (o)) o -> 1 2 2 3 1 -> 3 2 2 1 2 -> ((o) o o) o (o) < 1214595080 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1214595081 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but with your version that should be 1 o 2( o )3 o 4 < 1214595082 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :error < 1214595090 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o (o) (o (o)) o -> 1 2 2 3 1 -> 3 2 2 1 3 -> ((o) o o) o ((o)) < 1214595114 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o (o o (o)) o -> 1 2 2 3 1 -> 3 2 2 1 3 -> ((o) o o) o ((o)) < 1214595135 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :incidentally, the trick to reading INTERCAL expressions is to treat ' followed by an operand as an opening paren, and ' preceded by an operand as a closing paren < 1214595141 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming constant parsing direction for all o < 1214595141 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that works fine for everything but array indexing < 1214595205 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :furthermore, your version has implicit paren balancing < 1214595226 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: that's just because oklopol's putting extra parens at the edges of the expression to make it looked balanced < 1214595228 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that this is bad but im just saying. < 1214595230 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/looked/look/ < 1214595243 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's possible to make any expression look balanced like that < 1214595249 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, its still implicit tho < 1214595267 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since you have to define what happens at the edges < 1214595274 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::\ < 1214595288 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't really see the big thing here, it was just a trivial parsing semantics idea < 1214595290 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: no you don't < 1214595293 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see my explanation above < 1214595302 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it does define what happens at the edges, but coincidentally < 1214595309 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah. < 1214595321 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so trivial i had a moment of doubt whether i shuold say it or just quickly implement it < 1214595326 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*should < 1214595343 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: implement it < 1214595344 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i still dont like that its the same as normal parens tho. < 1214595347 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll use it for everything < 1214595347 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw. the reason i'm sounding even more trivializing than usual is i'm quite high on caffeine. < 1214595347 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::3 < 1214595350 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1214595357 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 o (2 o 3) o 4 => 1 o 2( o )3 o 4 < 1214595363 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean thats just too simpler :\ < 1214595368 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :simple* < 1214595386 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 o 2) o (3 o 4 is better. < 1214595401 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: that's just (1 o 2) o (3 o 4) in our system < 1214595405 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the easiest way to say it < 1214595409 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no its not < 1214595413 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you said earlier that < 1214595415 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what you're doing is our system with ) and ( reversed < 1214595419 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 o (2 o 3) o 4 in your system < 1214595429 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is 1 o 2( o )3 o 4 < 1214595432 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, it is < 1214595438 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're both correct ways to write it < 1214595452 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that makes no sense < 1214595467 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: yes it does, parens affect nothing but operators < 1214595477 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :( decreases precedence of the left stuff, right? < 1214595486 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: yes, the operators to the left < 1214595489 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ) to the right? < 1214595492 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it doesn't matter which side of the operand you put it < 1214595495 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1214595496 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then your version is incorrect. < 1214595501 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in what way? < 1214595513 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(1 o 2) o (3 o 4) has the middle o as a lower precedence than the other two < 1214595519 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: correct < 1214595527 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it handles ordinary parens correctly < 1214595561 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, which is why i said that its too simple! < 1214595567 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it basically IS normal parens < 1214595572 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with implicit balancing. < 1214595575 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: but your version is a trivially obfuscated version of ours < 1214595581 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with ( and ) the other way round < 1214595587 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but its visually a hell of a lot more confusing. < 1214595595 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, if that's all you wanted... < 1214595626 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, whats the point of making special magic )( if all they do is autobalance? :P < 1214595654 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, if o ( o )) o autobalances to (o ( o )) o then why bother making this at all? < 1214595665 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: because they can be either side of the operands, too < 1214595683 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still trivial to understand when looking at it. < 1214595704 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hardly more complicated than if they were on the right side of the operands. < 1214595736 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haskell has a low-precedence-izer you know. < 1214595739 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ < 1214595750 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ f a = f a < 1214595754 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: actually, $ is a low-precedence version of whitespace < 1214595765 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's ($) f a = f a because $ is infix < 1214595780 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er.. i dont think it is... < 1214595782 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :incidentally, is it legal to do `($)` to prefixise it and then infixise it again? < 1214595789 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: I know $ is infix, I've used it before < 1214595850 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the )( thing is mostly visually interesting if it's requires to be explicitly balanced. < 1214595894 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*required < 1214595898 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, you're right it is infix, sorry. < 1214595929 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, its interesting none the less. < 1214595939 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no < 1214595947 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i (h (g (f x))) == i $ h $ g $ f x < 1214595953 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no to `($)`? < 1214595954 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's legal in oklotalk :) < 1214595959 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, no. < 1214595963 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1214595967 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that should be legal, I reckon < 1214595969 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is effectively your version of ( i guess. < 1214595970 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sort of. < 1214595971 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it a syntax error < 1214595974 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1214595986 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: no < 1214595997 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes. :P < 1214596003 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because your versoin would be < 1214596008 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i (h (g (f x < 1214596023 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in that situation, it's the exact same < 1214596026 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not in general < 1214596049 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed, but its pretty close. < 1214596065 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its also a shittonne more confusing < 1214596066 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a higher-precedence parenthesis construct without a closing paren < 1214596084 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tho $ is like "of" < 1214596099 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i of h of g of f x < 1214596113 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the confusing part is requiring balancing of )(, wasn't that clear from the start < 1214596129 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess not < 1214596137 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i still prefer the reversed )( to the normal () < 1214596142 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, i wanna get back to making my pointless game, stop being interesting -> < 1214596193 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais, if you replaced () with <**> you'd have something equivalent to the operator precedence parser's internals. < 1214596339 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and <**> would be terribly unfamiliar < 1214596344 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, progress? < 1214596362 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: no more < 1214596368 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, why not :( < 1214596369 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, you've got so pestery about this recently < 1214596377 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry < 1214596385 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anmaster: what are you hounding ais about? < 1214596386 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I blame my bad mood on the cold I have < 1214596408 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: it's OK, I don't mind AnMaster really, some people thing ffis between Funge and INTERCAL are really important < 1214596413 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/thing/think/ < 1214596418 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1214596431 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it is more likely to be useful than many other #esoteric projects < 1214596431 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well is there any part of it I can code? some more function you need? < 1214596438 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least both Funge and INTERCAL are reasonably well known < 1214596451 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I'd say INTERCAL is famous < 1214596455 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no, this is pretty much all my stuff, I just have to make up my mind to do it, I'm suffering from holidayitis < 1214596460 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ffis? < 1214596465 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, FFI yes < 1214596465 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and Befunge is almost as famous as INTERCAL < 1214596470 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FFI? < 1214596473 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Final Fantasy 1? < 1214596479 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: do you think we should just define FFI in the topic? < 1214596479 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FFI not FF1 < 1214596483 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never played the game, to be honest < 1214596485 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur must have been the fourth person or so to ask < 1214596486 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, .... < 1214596490 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, google? < 1214596495 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tho i probably should < 1214596498 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its a classic i hear < 1214596500 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, but yes you should < 1214596501 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1214596511 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuel Freedom International? < 1214596514 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I would but I can't spel it ;P < 1214596515 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Family Firm Institute? < 1214596518 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foreign function interface < 1214596520 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i know < 1214596523 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :The foremost international hub for enterprise esoteric programming language design, development and deployment | http://esolangs.org/ | Logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | an FFI is a Foreign Function Interface that allows programs in one language to use functions written in another, stop asking us to define it < 1214596526 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fatal Familial Insomia! < 1214596529 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Insomnia* < 1214596533 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, what oklopol said < 1214596539 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what ais523 said < 1214596544 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im not listening to oklopol < 1214596549 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he ruins my fun. < 1214596554 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1214596568 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :backronyms are a fun way to pass time < 1214596572 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, use your hands for more interesting things. like masturbating on a webcam. < 1214596591 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps, perhaps. < 1214596632 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :live.yahoo.com < 1214596657 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, two issues regarding reactance: < 1214596665 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x -> z, y -> z means what? < 1214596666 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and < 1214596695 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do we detect change without propogating changed values < 1214596712 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: depends, in my implementation it doesn't have any special meaning < 1214596718 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you said it should remove x->z < 1214596723 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. how to we get abs vals of derivatives of variables < 1214596728 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably the latter then? < 1214596734 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i prefer removing x->z < 1214596746 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because what if i dont want both to be active? < 1214596751 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how then would i delete x->z? < 1214596768 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i shouldnt need to know whats leading to z to begin with < 1214596785 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i appreciate your opinion < 1214596795 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it'd need to be something like :deletefrom z < 1214596845 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then again, if we wanted both x and y to feed z somehow, we'd need something like :both x y -> z < 1214596851 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : and no, this is pretty much all my stuff, I just have to make up my mind to do it, I'm suffering from holidayitis < 1214596852 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same < 1214596855 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if we have a change function, :change x < 1214596861 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I code much better when I don't really have time to < 1214596871 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then the both function would be trivial < 1214597704 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh my god < 1214597707 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the html5 examples have < 1214597709 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'Wake up sheeple!' < 1214597738 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahaha < 1214597879 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1214597891 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who listened to the music i sent? :| < 1214597924 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1214597951 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214598630 0 :olsner!n=salparot@h-79-136-60-96.NA.cust.bahnhof.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1214600113 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1214600127 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214600434 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[21:00] [CTCP] Received CTCP-PING reply from ais523: 14 seconds. < 1214600466 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back < 1214600472 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, impressive < 1214600477 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3.3 seconds for me < 1214600482 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :normally it is like 0.1 < 1214600487 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I have network trouble < 1214600494 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've managed quite a bit more than that before < 1214600506 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but normally it doesn't reconnect if the ping takes too long and I have to restart the client < 1214600508 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Received a CTCP PING 1214546901505614 from AnMaster < 1214600508 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Ping reply from AnMaster: 0.92 second(s) < 1214600553 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, mine reconnects when ping goes over 2 or 3 minutes iirc < 1214600560 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ihope: there are spambots attacking your userpage on Esolang < 1214600573 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, restore it then! < 1214600575 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you want me to protect it, or are you fine with me just deleting it every time a spambot creates it? < 1214600577 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I have done < 1214600588 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ihope hasn't had a non-spambot-created user page, I think < 1214600595 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you are an esolang admin I see < 1214601064 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1214601074 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214601564 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :pygnisfive < 1214601586 0 :pygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :psygnisfive < 1214601898 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf68ca.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1214602182 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lalala < 1214602875 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dont be so quiet. < 1214602891 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Join ##nomic < 1214602957 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :##nomic? < 1214603200 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: it's about nomic < 1214603218 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats nomic? < 1214603218 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1214603242 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: a game where legal moves consist of changing the rules < 1214603285 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i redefine the ruleset to be: Only I can change the rules. < 1214603289 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i win. < 1214603291 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :end of game. < 1214603297 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: there are limits on it, of course < 1214603310 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trying to find a way to loophole to do that is one recognised technique for winning < 1214603312 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've redefined them out of existence. < 1214603331 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: that sort of retroactivity shouldn't work, B Nomic are having a crisis because someone claimed it did < 1214603346 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its not retroactivity at all. < 1214603374 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: this is how most people play nomic when they first hear about it < 1214603383 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'I add a rule I win.' < 1214603397 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: it would probably be outvoted, though < 1214603408 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most nomics require at least a majority vote to begin with < 1214603423 0 :pikhq!n=pikhq@c-66-31-43-229.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1214603424 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well if thats the case then youve misinformed me sir! < 1214603439 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry < 1214603463 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is back. . . < 1214603468 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FROM USENIX. < 1214603502 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::uses pikhq's nix:: < 1214606938 0 :Judofyr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1214606991 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders: where's Gregor? < 1214607143 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :prague < 1214607147 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think < 1214607150 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bastard. < 1214607163 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I met his former boss at Intel, oddly enough. < 1214607171 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o.O < 1214607191 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mentioned my fondness for esolangs at USENIX. . . < 1214607219 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and they killed you for being a freak? < 1214607220 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-P < 1214607252 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And this guy was like "Oh, yeah. . . There was this student a while back who did Brainfuck. . . Named Gregor. He wore a different hat every week; insanely good coder, but a tiny bit odd." < 1214607259 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Gregor? ... Gregor Richards?" < 1214607266 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"... Yes..." < 1214607280 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hahahahahahahaha! < 1214607288 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Brilliant. < 1214607293 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :During the Russian revolution, the mathematical physicist Igor Tamm was seized by anti-communist vigilantes at a village near Odessa where he had gone to barter for food. They suspected he was an anti-Ukranian communist agitator and dragged him off to their leader. < 1214607294 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Asked what he did for a living he said that he was a mathematician. The sceptical gang-leader began to finger the bullets and grenades slung around his neck. "All right", he said, "calculate the error when the Taylor series approximation of a function is truncated after n terms. Do this and you will go free; fail and you will be shot". Tamm slowly calculated the answer in the dust with his quivering finger. When he h < 1214607298 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as I was saying, it's a small world < 1214607299 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ad finished the bandit cast his eye over the answer and waved him on his way." < 1214607339 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: Which function? < 1214607342 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: indeed, I think I have never created a userpage for myself on the Esolang wiki. < 1214607356 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ihope: no, you haven't, the spambots seem quite anxious to though < 1214607362 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION shoots pikhq < 1214607362 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the confusing thing is that they don't even add spam < 1214607363 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And there can be more than one Taylor series for a function. ;) < 1214607364 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just random text < 1214607365 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU ARE A SPY < 1214607371 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I make ihope a userpage will I get banned? < 1214607373 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cooool! < 1214607379 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I just paid attention in calculus. < 1214607382 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: it rather depends on what you do < 1214607391 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and my assessment of how likely you are to be human < 1214607402 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. What esolangs has ihope made? < 1214607406 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Redivider ... and ... < 1214607412 0 :sekhmet!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1214607498 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's you guys favourite esowiki article < 1214607499 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine is http://esolangs.org/wiki/FURscript < 1214607501 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's not a joke < 1214607528 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Dimensifuck < 1214607530 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1214607531 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it's mine. < 1214607534 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the BF constants one, just because people keep putting work into it every now and then < 1214607543 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's heartening to see so many people work together < 1214607591 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Slereah_ i think linked to a 4chan thread a while back where someone had linked to that page calling it the best language ever < 1214607607 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the rest of the thread was rather predictably people calling the language stupid < 1214607630 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :furscripe? < 1214607630 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno why I recalled that just now < 1214607631 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but hey < 1214607641 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :script* < 1214607649 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is it called furscript < 1214607660 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FURscript doesn't even make much sense < 1214607668 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it's hard to read < 1214607686 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :strangely, I don't find things like Unlambda and the various line-noise languages "hard to read" in that sense, just hard to fathom < 1214607695 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it looks like queer html. < 1214607699 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, looking at the code's fine, working out what it does is a lot harder < 1214607711 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mixed with turbo pascal and basic < 1214607731 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: it was apparently totally serious < 1214607739 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the guy who created the article said the creator had put it on their wiki < 1214607747 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(presumably of a programmign community) < 1214607747 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't have any loop construct < 1214607751 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and he moved it over there because it's so bad < 1214607765 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nor any data storage AFAICT < 1214607765 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{ * The person who designed this language was 100% serious about it and the vb6 compiler, but I think he got as far as a text box and a copyright notice before going back to programming his graphics calculator. --Einsidler 10:44, 24 Nov 2006 (UTC) } < 1214607781 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{# [DIRFORMAT="DIRECTORY","BYPASSSECURITY?"] FORMATS A DRIVE AND ASKS WHETHER TO BYPASS ALL RESTRICTIONS } is just so brilliant < 1214607797 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so why is the command called DIRFORMAT < 1214607807 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the command looks like it's trying to format a dir, not a drive < 1214607819 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, why are the descriptions in allcaps? < 1214607820 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: why are you using logic on this terrible abomination < 1214607844 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LMAO < 1214607845 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, why does it have procedures when there's no way to call them? < 1214607847 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just made ihope's user page < 1214607849 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but a spambot got it < 1214607852 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :while I was editing < 1214607857 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go delete that :P < 1214607887 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :done < 1214607904 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems to be from single-use spambot IPs < 1214607907 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which only ever hit once < 1214607910 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably zombies < 1214607910 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AWSUM < 1214607912 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a real page < 1214607913 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1214607932 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now, only time will tell if I have to semi that or not < 1214607937 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hope not < 1214608001 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: as for FURscript, what would you say to its deletion? < 1214608002 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg i love meat stews :( < 1214608007 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no, leave it there < 1214608009 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite a few people on its talk page wanted it deleted, including me < 1214608013 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's godly < 1214608016 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so probably you should comment onwiki about that < 1214608020 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the record < 1214608024 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you tried to make a more shitty language, you couldn't manage < 1214608033 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: are you sure? < 1214608033 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1214608037 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, probably I couldn't < 1214608037 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: pretty sure < 1214608040 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but lots of people could < 1214608046 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i doubt it < 1214608053 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially if they were sincere about it < 1214608076 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is poking around zzo38's site, he's pretty crazy but it's a fun mishmash of stuff < 1214608091 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm rather surprised at the list of features on http://zzo38computer.cjb.net/chrono/about.htm vs the shortness of http://zzo38computer.cjb.net/chrono/_show_source < 1214608130 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that multiple passwords thing a reference to your website where you could have two users with the same username but different passwords? < 1214608165 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somehow I doubt it < 1214608173 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not exactly sure what it means < 1214608178 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the code doesn't look that short to me < 1214608205 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i was saying in comparison to the length of the features < 1214608218 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i didn't really mean in lines < 1214608224 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I kinda meant in the 'the code is pretty trivial' < 1214608233 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though - http://zzo38computer.cjb.net/chrono/zzo38/mainpage the actual UI has something to be desired.. < 1214608265 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it looks about the right length for that feature set for well-written code < 1214608265 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just that well-written code is comparatively rare nowadays < 1214608265 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially in PHP < 1214608265 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and just try to work out the computational order of onoz < 1214608265 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1214608281 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1214608309 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry... < 1214608311 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and back < 1214608317 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grr... my client still isn't responding to self-pings < 1214608321 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if anyone else in #esoteric can see this < 1214608323 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, it responded < 1214608327 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[23:11] [CTCP] Received CTCP-PING reply from ais523: 22 seconds. < 1214608330 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really... < 1214608342 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably you lot will see this eventually, then < 1214608348 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :afk < 1214608349 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I probably won't get your replies for a while < 1214608351 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tasty soup < 1214608359 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, better now < 1214608366 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i saw that immediately < 1214608382 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: how do you know? < 1214608389 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'cause that's how fast you type < 1214608394 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hrh < 1214608396 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/r/e/ < 1214608422 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SMATINY is ihope's < 1214608427 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: aah, that multiple password thing - < 1214608433 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can have passwords for different privileges < 1214608439 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. a password for just posting and editing < 1214608444 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and another for system administration < 1214608445 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc < 1214608451 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also Foobar and Foobaz and Barbaz, oh my! < 1214608493 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION likes what-links-here < 1214608519 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://zzo38computer.cjb.net/chrono/zzo38/1203755544 i like some of the entries on here < 1214608523 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'Power to commit suicide' < 1214608528 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need special powers to do that < 1214608573 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like the "of course you also need powers to change back as well" < 1214608586 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thinking like a programmer who's met one too many evil genies < 1214608588 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :couldn't you just transform into whatever you were before < 1214608609 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: maybe not, if you transformed into something that didn't have the same powers as you < 1214608629 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :transform into the thing you were before with the same powers < 1214608648 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, if you transformed into something that couldn't transform < 1214608657 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1214608662 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just specify the transforming powers when you transform < 1214608706 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would you remember that every single time? < 1214608721 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or would you assume it was obvious after a bit and forget to specify it? < 1214608733 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you would specify the power to include not having to mention it. < 1214608740 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(when you transform the first time) < 1214608740 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that would be useful < 1214608750 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://zzo38computer.cjb.net/chrono/zzo38/1199580665 'Our Father who has warts in heaven' how on earth do you hear that < 1214608815 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"These are some comments about a book about philosophy I have. It is ISBN 1-55111-493-3" <-- why can't he just tell us the title? < 1214608961 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think VALGOL's my favourite out of the lesser known languages < 1214608977 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could easily be made a real lang, although it would probably suffer from LOLCODEitis < 1214609031 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOLCODEitis is easy to avoi < 1214609032 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :d < 1214609040 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't actively promote your language; because that's stupid, it < 1214609042 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'s a freaking esolang < 1214609053 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't build a huge fancy site and expect a 'community', who do you think you are? This is an ESOLANG < 1214609055 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey everyone, convert to Thutu now for all your programming needs! < 1214609069 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't act like you're the first person to ever think of making a programming language look funny (WTFWTFWTF) < 1214609070 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :besides, I think LOLCODE actually has a community] < 1214609071 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and finally < 1214609075 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually know how to design a language < 1214609081 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: unfortunately, yes. it's one of idiots < 1214609091 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, LOLCODE just seems to be a clone of generic imperativeness < 1214609100 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://catseye.tc/projects/valgol/doc/valgol.html parser! < 1214609100 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With more crap. < 1214609112 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah the lolcode people keep tripping over basic things < 1214609118 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or coming up with fucked solutions to easy problems < 1214609126 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they have Commities and Meetings < 1214609131 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and try to make it easy to use and practical and whatnot < 1214609133 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I'm like... < 1214609137 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :VALGOL? /Catseye/? I don't believe it < 1214609140 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're making a language about kitty pidgin. < 1214609143 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: why? < 1214609150 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :catseye has everything < 1214609159 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: I knew it had SARTRE < 1214609169 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but really, this just doesn't fit with my worldview at all < 1214609173 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not < 1214609177 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know < 1214609181 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"This computer has gone to sleep" < 1214609184 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this some kind of pun ais523 < 1214609190 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I did then my worldview would be able to fit it < 1214609192 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no, it isn't a pun < 1214609198 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mmmback < 1214609203 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just me being unusual for no reason that's satisfactory to anyone, not even me < 1214609207 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://catseye.tc/projects/eso.html < 1214609238 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok so cmon guys < 1214609249 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wanna make a really queer new kind of esolang < 1214609302 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: try implementing Feather, I'm struggling < 1214609326 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats feather. < 1214609335 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an esolang I've designed < 1214609347 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's object-oriented < 1214609348 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :specs? < 1214609354 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and based on inheritance by retroactive effects < 1214609360 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I don't really have specs yet < 1214609366 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well then i cant help you ;) < 1214609370 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the sort of thing that needs to be defined by a reference interp < 1214609376 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just to prove it's possible < 1214609387 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have partial notes on a few feather-like objects < 1214609390 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's about it < 1214609399 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, also they're wrong < 1214609405 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's not a very good thing to implement based on < 1214609446 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, how goes coding? < 1214609454 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it's half-past-11 < 1214609459 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, nothing done yet? < 1214609462 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really, would you expect me to be coding now? < 1214609463 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :k < 1214609470 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, well I coded just now < 1214609478 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably you aren't tired < 1214609501 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am < 1214609506 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I need to get this done < 1214609511 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais, surely you can provide some sort of spec < 1214609513 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got a deadline here < 1214609517 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: ok < 1214609518 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :syntax + semantics < 1214609522 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: I'll try < 1214609522 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a very urgent one < 1214609525 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DO IT < 1214609527 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's easier to explain over IRC, I think < 1214609535 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then show you what I have which is misleading < 1214609536 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1214609538 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'll paste anyway < 1214609548 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, specs on what? < 1214609550 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no dont show me what you have < 1214609553 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gimme specs < 1214609554 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Feather < 1214609557 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is? < 1214609561 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: I mean paste the specs < 1214609562 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :R0RF < 1214609579 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, could you explain it here over irc please! < 1214609586 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive just told me not to < 1214609593 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I tell you to! < 1214609595 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :error! < 1214609597 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do both! < 1214609600 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no error! < 1214609607 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IS NOT MUDDS WORLD < 1214609610 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me finish pasting my incorrect and incomplete specs for a different lang first < 1214609618 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive, what world? < 1214609626 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was it mudds planet? < 1214609633 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive, yes < 1214609640 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is that? < 1214609641 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DAMN YOU SHATNER!!! < 1214609645 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://rafb.net/p/TG83VV29.html < 1214609651 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, first, ignore that because it's wrong < 1214609654 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive, what are you talking about? < 1214609654 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it'll give you an idea < 1214609670 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically, the idea is that you have an object-oriented language < 1214609679 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are no classes, all objects are created from other objects by cloning < 1214609684 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, its neither < 1214609686 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its mudd's women < 1214609689 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, nothing is modifiable, it uses single assignment < 1214609691 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DAMN YOU SHATNER! DAMN YOU! < 1214609700 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you create a changed copy rather than modifying the original < 1214609701 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive, wtf are you talking about? < 1214609708 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its a reference to a star trek episode < 1214609716 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now, in order to do interesting things like inheritance < 1214609724 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais: so you've created stateless Self? < 1214609725 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can retroactively change what an object was at the time it was created < 1214609727 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive, well what one? I mainly watched TNG < 1214609731 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and Voyager < 1214609738 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mudd's Women, form TOS < 1214609742 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: well, Self doesn't have retroactivity, but it's similar < 1214609746 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive, plot summary? < 1214609755 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's also vaguely message-passing < 1214609758 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can modify anything < 1214609759 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where chekhov makes some robut women explode by telling them he loves on but not the other < 1214609759 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION writes something like chronojournal because e feels like it < 1214609767 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're all identical so this causes a logic error, naturally < 1214609772 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can even change the syntax of the language by modifying eval < 1214609779 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive, odd < 1214609783 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, retroactively modifying it < 1214609799 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais: i dont see what retroactive modification means. < 1214609815 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho has become asexual, hence his use of the gender-neutral pronoun "e" < 1214609824 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: it's all this agora playing < 1214609826 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: ok, say you make an object b that's a clone of an object a, and an object c that's a modified clone of a, and an object d that's a modified clone of c < 1214609835 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: it makes your cock vanish? < 1214609838 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1214609840 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now, suppose you retroactively modify a so it was really d all along < 1214609855 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1214609859 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does that MEAN tho < 1214609860 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you find out that b was d all along, and c was modified from d, and d depends on the old version of d < 1214609866 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the program is recalcualted to allow for that < 1214609872 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. rerun from that point with the changes < 1214609874 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the same inputs < 1214609878 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the whole program? < 1214609881 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1214609888 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except that that should be optimisable in many cases < 1214609889 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, this is backtracking isn't it? < 1214609890 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, ? < 1214609893 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: sort-of < 1214609895 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i foresee some potential problems < 1214609907 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but in backtracking you specify the possible choices at the choicepoint < 1214609912 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mainly that it has no single answer. < 1214609926 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas in Feather you can take information from one possible path and use it to modify the next path that's tried < 1214609938 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, do you mean recursive inheritance? < 1214609948 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: not exactly, that doesn't involve rerunning the program < 1214609949 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its an interesting idea, but not interesting enough. < 1214609955 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your language is boring. :P < 1214609956 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :recursive inheritance is entirely possible, though < 1214609971 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want interesting! < 1214609974 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: well, you write a language where you can change the syntax at runtime and have it effect everything the program's ever done < 1214609974 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :give me interesting!!! < 1214609988 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont know why i'd even want to do that, ais. < 1214609996 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance, you can modify objects representing functions to keep track of their source code and how many times they've been run < 1214610006 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: this is as interesting as reactance if not more so < 1214610008 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically you can make the language as reflective as you like < 1214610011 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a load of people in here are interested by it too < 1214610015 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive, intercal? < 1214610020 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's pretty interesting < 1214610023 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ais523 can give that < 1214610024 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a LOT of it < 1214610032 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :reactance isnt supposed to be interesting < 1214610034 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, I'm probably in the world's top 10 intercallers by now < 1214610056 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably the top when it comes to C-INTERCAL's newer features, but I could probably still be beaten on some of the more established ones < 1214610086 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, feather's interesting due to consistent time travel rules < 1214610099 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are a lot of possible consistent time travel rules, but strangely fiction normally doesn't use them < 1214610157 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1214610162 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which time travel rules? < 1214610182 0 :Corun!n=Corun@cpc1-rdng15-0-0-cust168.winn.cable.ntl.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1214610202 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: just the retroactivity, basically all the possible timelines are ordered, an earlier timeline can affect a later timeline but not vice versa, and all retroactive changes have to be legal in the timeline they were made but not necessarily in the resulting timeline < 1214610216 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there, that description should be in every nomic in existence, I reckon, to avoid stupid retroactivity things < 1214610253 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im not entirely sure i follow. < 1214610267 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well no, it took me a week or so to understand and I invented it < 1214610271 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is why it needs a reference interp < 1214610275 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://qntm.org/?models < 1214610275 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to prove that it's possible and works < 1214610277 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :time travel models < 1214610289 0 :RedDak!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1214610307 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh, intercal with actual time travel? < 1214610321 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no i mean in a general time travel sense < 1214610321 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't tried to attach time travel to INTERCAL yer < 1214610327 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont follow < 1214610329 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now you've mentioned it I'll have to think about it, though < 1214610335 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, it'd be awesome < 1214610361 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone seen Earth: Final Conflict? < 1214610362 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: you can go back in time and prevent yourself ever having got a time travel machine, this does not lead to a contradiction < 1214610387 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais: alternate universe interpretation? < 1214610400 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: yep < 1214610409 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lots of shows use this model of time travel. < 1214610411 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except that you can send objects from one universe into another < 1214610425 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :again, lots of shows. < 1214610433 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how does that work in your version tho? < 1214610437 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the sentence between universes < 1214610447 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but only one object, only in one direction, it always replaces an object in the next universe, and it's the only way to do time travel < 1214610466 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Star Trek has run long enough to include examples of all kinds of other models of time travel, as well as plenty of crazy rubbish which makes no sense. The model given here is approximately correct, but there are technicalities." < 1214610488 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sliders, Star Gate, Back to the Future < 1214610495 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: http://qntm.org/?models < 1214610497 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably others < 1214610502 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most of them don't actually. < 1214610515 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i love the fixed history model < 1214610525 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, so do I < 1214610527 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even though it makes no sense < 1214610528 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its brilliant for writing greek tragedy stuff < 1214610535 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it makes complete sense :) < 1214610549 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and the major problem with Feather programming is avoiding timeloops < 1214610576 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, I'd better go home now < 1214610580 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bye everyone < 1214610582 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bye ais523 :) < 1214610592 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"PLEASE DO NOTHING" < 1214610656 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, so that's a description of *dramatic* models of time travel with no consideration on how to integrate a model of time travel into a model of the universe < 1214610668 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: no < 1214610670 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the title of the page is < 1214610672 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Modelling time travel in fiction < 1214610686 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Favourite quote: {This violates the law of conservation of mass-energy, but that's a small price to pay for working time travel.}) < 1214610726 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quantum mechanics violates mass-energy conservation for very small values of mass-energy and time. < 1214610728 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe. < 1214610804 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very small products of mass-energy and time, iirc < 1214610994 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The larger the violation, the less time it may last. There is similar noncommutative relationship between time and energy as there is between position and momentum... < 1214611038 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION waves at Oerjan < 1214611049 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION waves back < 1214611051 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" it seems that time travel involves the sending back and forth through time of quantum packets of information, which alter history multiple times in a kind of feedback loop until the universe settles into a stable structure in which the instance of time travel is completely internally consistent." < 1214611198 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like that model ... it reminds me of fixpoints and the path-integrals they speak of in quantum mechanics