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02:44:25 <GregorR> Making a machine that does something usually done on a computer (e.g., sorting) isn't mechanical engineering, it's just porting to the language "physics" :)
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04:35:33 <bsmntbombdood> i'm not sure how i should go about getting a real job
04:39:32 <Warrigal> Everyone on IRC is a college student.
04:40:38 <Warrigal> Except ehird, because in Britain, "college" means "Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays while both digits of one's age are prime".
04:41:07 <Warrigal> Or something like that, anyway.
04:42:16 <bsmntbombdood> 22,23,25,27,32,33,35,37,52,53,55,57,72,73,75,77
04:46:01 <Warrigal> Actually, I think the days of the week might be rearranged over there, making it Wednesdays, Mondays, and Thursdays, in that order.
04:47:29 <Warrigal> Nope, looks like Britain's days of the week are generally Sunday-first, like ours.
05:09:48 <psygnisfive> f(0) = 1, f(1) = 1, f(2) = 1, f(3) = 1, f(4) = 1
05:13:48 <Sgeo> psygnisfive, saw that on qntm once
05:14:13 <psygnisfive> because for any arbitrary numbers, x0, x1, ... xn there exists an infinite number of quadratic functions that have zeros at those numbers, so suppose z(x) is just such a function
05:14:35 <Sgeo> http://qntm.org/?1111
05:14:37 <psygnisfive> if thats the case, you can construct any function you want that is constant on exactly those numbers, and something else elsewhere
05:14:44 <MizardX> 1+x^5-10*x^4+35*x^3-50*x^2+24*x
05:16:13 <psygnisfive> so from that you can do anything you want.
05:16:20 <psygnisfive> add it to any relevant number, multiply it, whatever
05:17:05 <psygnisfive> and at those numbers itll equal 0, but outside that range itll be whatever
05:20:39 <lament> in general, finitely many values are not enough to describe a function.
05:21:08 <lament> which is not surprising at all
05:21:10 <psygnisfive> for some classes of functions they are but in general no. which is interesting :)
05:21:42 <psygnisfive> not surprising, but it's got obvious implications for inductivism
05:21:47 <psygnisfive> not that inductivism makes sense anyway, but
05:22:23 <lament> i think a more interesting fact is that countably many values is enough to describe a large class of useful functions
05:27:48 <lament> (f(x) = 1 for x in [0,1]. What's f(42)?)
05:29:33 <lament> (for that matter, f(x) = 1 for all x not equal to 42. What's f(42)?)
05:30:01 <psygnisfive> f(42) =--- Error -21456: Your planet has been demolished by a vogon construction fleet.
05:31:05 <lament> f(1) = 0, f(1) = 1, f(1) = 2, f(1) = 3, f(1) = 4
05:31:25 <psygnisfive> also, i can divide polynomials while sleep-deprived, out of practice, and intoxicated.
05:31:30 <psygnisfive> i wonder if i have some russian blood in me.
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06:58:36 <oklofok> psygnisfive: is dividing polynomials an extremely hard procedure?
06:59:40 <oerjan> not in a single variable, at least
07:00:44 <oerjan> for more variables i vaguely recall the answer can be dependent on order, i think i saw something about it in wp's Gröbner basis article
07:01:53 <oerjan> for two polynomials in x, dividing one on the other gives you a quotient and a remainder by long division
07:01:54 <oklofok> ohh single variable right, you mean like having just one variable.
07:02:25 <oklofok> you meant what you *said*, never occurred to me.
07:02:42 <oerjan> you do it almost like with integers, pretending that x is the base
07:02:57 <oklofok> yes, i know the procedure.
07:03:40 <oerjan> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gr%C3%B6bner_basis
07:03:42 <oklofok> can't really not know it having gone to school for X years
07:03:50 <oklofok> (not sure how many exactly)
07:04:34 <oerjan> "multivariate division of any polynomial in the polynomial ring R by G gives a unique remainder;" is one of the equivalent definitions of a gröbner basis
07:06:18 <oerjan> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multivariate_division_algorithm
07:06:29 <oklofok> stop seducing me with your links, i need to read my things.
07:07:33 <oklofok> i have an exam in $stupid_course in 50 minutes
07:09:12 <lament> oklofok: you'll appreciate this: http://images.google.ca/images?q=alba
07:11:33 <oklofok> the course is about gui's, the lecture notes are mostly about how java does it, and the exam asks more theoretical questions i can't really answer based on the notes, because they are crap in the theory parts.
07:11:45 * oerjan lends oklofok his swatter to use on lament
07:12:23 <oklofok> stuff like "- how to do this?", and presumably the lecturer has then answered that, but i didn't attend lectures.
07:12:56 * oklofok swats la.. himself in the face
07:13:09 <oklofok> i can't use this thing it's like it has a life of its own
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07:15:24 <oerjan> well the last - was from pikhq i think
07:16:31 <oerjan> for the rest of it, well i was walking down the internet when i noticed this little webshop that hadn't been there the previous day
07:17:53 <oerjan> inside there was this strange little chinese looking man with glasses, who offered me the fly swatter
07:19:00 <oklofok> ...was that chinese man called wong by any chance?
07:20:15 <oerjan> he didn't say, and i couldn't read the shop sign. i bought the swatter and went. then i realized the manual was in chinese too, so i went back to ask if he had any european language manual.
07:20:34 <oerjan> but the shop was already gone!
07:21:41 <oerjan> fortunately google translate allowed me to get most of it. but there were some mysterious passages that caused google to crash.
07:22:03 <oerjan> not just google translate - apparently their whole network went down.
07:23:02 <oerjan> and that's all i know. i just try not to do anything too fancy with the swatter, just in case.
07:23:10 * oklofok fears this'll be his first non 5/5 grade :<
07:23:49 <oerjan> no. but your finnish genes imply a slight chance of a shooting spree.
07:24:00 <oerjan> well, in which case you might die.
07:24:31 <oerjan> oh and of course, eventually.
07:24:46 <lament> sooner if you keep using the swatter
07:25:42 <oklofok> i can already feel my trigger finger starting to twitch uncontrollably
07:26:40 <oerjan> there is a half-translated passage of the manual that says there is a way to use it not to die. but it also warns that this is _very_ unlikely to be considered an improvement.
07:27:09 <oerjan> even in the short term.
07:27:32 <oklofok> if i start shooting people
07:27:37 <oklofok> use the swatter on me, okay?
07:27:58 <oerjan> i'm afraid i won't be there. the swatter only works on the internet.
07:28:31 <oklofok> lol like i'd ever shoot anyone irl :D
07:29:28 <oerjan> in that case, it might be better to use the saucepan.
07:29:46 <olsner> bleh, megzlna in #haskell...
07:29:56 <oerjan> it has, as far as i can tell, no mystical properties.
07:30:31 <oerjan> although it has a good steel bottom.
07:31:25 <olsner> steel? are you sure it's not aluminum?
07:31:29 <oklofok> oerjan: what about megsaasc
07:32:05 <oklofok> i think haskell's global names thing is pretty annoying too.
07:33:13 <oerjan> olsner: finest stainless steel
07:33:33 <oerjan> oklofok: what is megsaasc
07:33:52 <olsner> oklofok: well, I agree, but he/she has a way of being annoyed that is by far more annoying than the thing itself
07:35:32 <oklofok> but yeah, modules are a working solution for that, which is why i only see it as a slight inconvenience
07:35:52 <oklofok> and dunno about annoying, i'm never annoyed
07:36:44 <olsner> me, frequently annoyed
07:39:02 <oklofok> haskell modules, do you need to separate them in different files?
07:39:48 <oerjan> it's how the compiler finds them
07:40:30 <oklofok> i'm sure it's very practical, that's no excuse, because i'm critisizing the whole world, not just haskell
07:41:46 <olsner> the module system is pretty simplistic, but I like that it is
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09:12:49 <AnMaster> GregorR, there? codu.org seems down
09:12:58 <AnMaster> no idea if you know about it or not
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16:06:12 <GregorR> AnMaster: It's gone down a few times recently so I started logging the processes and top output to see why this is happening. The result: I haven't a fegging clue X_X
16:11:09 <ehird> I could check it out if you want.
16:11:15 <ehird> rutian never goes down except when I restart it :P
16:25:28 <GregorR> The problem is that for some reason some stale trac.cgi processes are hanging around chewing up memory. Pile together a hundred of those or so and I've got no memory left.
16:26:44 <GregorR> In fact ... they're staying precisely to their CPU limit, then failing to die ...
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16:29:35 <GregorR> What a useless non-solution.
16:29:41 <GregorR> Because it's not like I have any .htaccess files.
16:35:21 <ehird> GregorR: Yeah, yeah.
16:35:30 <ehird> It also has a module specifically for serving a transparent 1x1 gif.
16:35:37 <ehird> But just ignore all that shit. :P
16:35:46 <ehird> http://wiki.codemongers.com/ english docs
16:40:04 <Slereah-> More like COCKMONGLER, amirite?
17:01:52 <oklofok> ehird: It also has a module specifically for serving a transparent 1x1 gif. <<< lol wut? :D
17:02:05 <ehird> oklofok: it's because in ye olde 90s people did <img src=blank.gif> for padding
17:02:15 <ehird> because they knew not of css.
17:02:22 <ehird> so that module does it hyperfast.
17:05:32 <oklofok> :DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDdddddddddddddddddddd
17:27:59 -!- ehird has changed nick to zuff.
17:28:02 <zuff> More bouncer errors.
17:28:20 <AnMaster> zuff, is it a config issue or software issue?
17:28:47 <zuff> It's a SPIRITUAL ISSUE.
17:28:56 <AnMaster> if it is the former, complain to ehird, if it is the latter tell ehird he may want to try znc
17:29:14 <zuff> I am not close enough to GOD for my bouncer to work correctly.
17:29:22 <zuff> ehird's bouncer.
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18:26:10 <zuff> fizzie: can you do something with fungot for me?
18:26:10 <fungot> zuff: ( c) the judge, or
18:26:35 <fungot> ^<lang> <code>; ^def <command> <lang> <code>; ^show [command]; lang=bf/ul, code=text/str:N; ^str 0-9 get/set/add [text]; ^style [style]; ^bool
18:26:45 <zuff> no; it needs fizzie-permissions
18:28:57 <fizzie> Hm? (I'm preparing food, so partially away.)
18:29:33 <zuff> fizzie: Make it change nick to meow and join #reddit.
18:29:36 -!- Hiato has joined.
18:30:06 <fizzie> Uh, no; I want to be around to observe that sort of stuff, and busy right now. :p
18:30:38 <zuff> Don't worry it's mostly perfectly innocent apart from the one bit which is all of it.
18:39:32 <Hiato> Wow, hold on: is iHope == Actaeus on the XKCD for a?
18:39:54 <Hiato> er, that is to say, is anyone here that person on the fora?
18:40:34 <zuff> Link to their profile/
18:41:20 <Hiato> http://forums.xkcd.com/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=31598&sid=bbf395caf53ac448f3e5347d6b4fdc5a#p1189920 that links to http://tunes.org/~nef//logs/esoteric/06.03.20 and I am busy playing that game on the XKCD forum. I was just interested if someone here I knew was, in fact, playing against me
18:42:09 <zuff> Well, our logs are quite googleable.
18:42:19 * zuff internet-stalks to see
18:42:49 <zuff> I spend far too much of my time on the xkcd fora, where I go by Actaeus. I’m also a denizen of #xkcd on irc.foonetic.net, where I’m Daedalus, but lately I haven’t been there very regularly.
18:42:53 <zuff> Never seen either of those here.
18:42:58 <zuff> So nobody from here I think
18:43:33 <zuff> oklofok: what why
18:43:45 <oklofok> firefox crashes every day, sometimes many times.
18:44:06 <Hiato> Oh, so it is you zuff - curse you :P Heh, either way, I can't say I knew you before hand
18:44:18 <zuff> Hiato: I'm ehird.
18:44:31 <Hiato> Oh, damn, you are? Hell, small world
18:44:49 <zuff> Do you know another zuff?
18:45:44 <Hiato> and let me guess then, it was ais523 that came up with the 3 state two symbol (or visa versa) turing machine that caused some controversy..
18:46:17 <zuff> Hiato: no; but he solved it and got money in the process.
18:46:21 <zuff> How did you guess? :-P
18:46:27 <zuff> That's coincidence.
18:46:58 <Hiato> Heh, no, no, not really - but partially. Adrew Smith = AiS:P (Ian?)
18:47:07 <zuff> Alex (ian) smith
18:47:26 <zuff> Technically ais523 is a separate person because he's a wikipedia admin and they get death threats and stuff.
18:48:00 <Hiato> Oh, heh - bad memory. So then, let me ask, who is scikidus? Heh, lol - interesting take on FOSS attitude there
18:48:08 <Slereah-> Well, most of the death threats were from me.
18:48:30 <zuff> I don't think we've seen a scikidus.
18:48:36 <zuff> ...should we have?
18:49:32 <Hiato> Slereah: I see, anything you'd like to share? Ehird/zuff: Well, that other guy on the Big number game - unless, of course, you were joking. Oh, and tricky777
18:49:48 <zuff> Hiato: Slereah- was joking... also, what was I joking about
18:50:08 <Slereah-> It's true. I didn't actually issued death threats to ais523.
18:50:23 <Hiato> My world has been turned upside-down
18:50:26 <Slereah-> Although I could do some now, I suppose.
18:50:36 <Hiato> (20:43:01) zuff: I spend far too much of my time on the xkcd fora, where I go by Actaeus.
18:50:50 <zuff> Hiato: that was copy pasting from the guy you linked's blahg
18:50:57 <Hiato> Youtube it (might as well make a pretty penny)
18:51:16 <Hiato> Wow, this is what happens after a long day
18:52:57 <Hiato> Ok, let's see - how do we delete the logs? :P
18:59:20 <zuff> http://esolangs.org/wiki/Special:Recentchanges
18:59:33 <Asztal> http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net/wiki/Befungehttp:/www.mepis.org/docs/en/index.php/Make_Media_players_work
18:59:48 <fizzie> Misread that as Special:Rectangles. They should have a special page like that. With some CSS rectangles in it, or something.
19:00:00 <zuff> fizzie: NICK meow JOIN #reddit
19:00:18 <fizzie> Nnnnah. But you can run your own copy of fungot to do that, maybe?
19:00:18 <fungot> fizzie: providing a unique name, mintor, except a transfer order
19:00:18 <zuff> (fungot taht is)
19:00:18 <fungot> zuff: the initiation of the contract's terms, the voting period. this rule
19:00:27 <zuff> fizzie: That would be difficult.
19:00:49 <fizzie> Well, nontrivial, maybe.
19:00:53 <zuff> http://esolangs.org/wiki/Talk:%22The_most_important_thing_in_the_programming_language_is_the_name._A_language_will_not_succeed_without_a_good_name._I_have_recently_invented_a_very_good_name_and_now_I_am_looking_for_a_suitable_language.%22 ais523 WANTS TO DELETE OUR LANGUAGE
19:00:59 <fizzie> The language model stuff needs a bit of disk space.
19:01:18 <zuff> fizzie: plzzzz
19:01:23 <zuff> I'll bribe you with agoran assets
19:01:46 <fizzie> I doubt those translate to anything useful in a real-world sense.
19:02:14 <zuff> fizzie: jaycampbell was offering 5 bucks for 300 coins a while back, iirc.
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19:03:02 <fizzie> I am wary of doing anything related to freenode channels I do not know about (which, at this point, means anything else than #esoteric) since they might get offended or something.
19:03:13 <zuff> don't worry, they'll be very happy
19:03:34 <fizzie> I'm also not sure whether you're the most trustworthy person around.
19:04:33 <zuff> fizzie: CMON :D
19:04:43 <fizzie> Mmmeh. I guess I can always /part if it looks like someone's getting restless. Although fungot's raw-loggery is difficult to follow.
19:04:43 <fungot> fizzie: be known to all contestants, and cannot be made in a row receive exactly the same
19:04:52 <zuff> fizzie: Thank you :}
19:05:44 <fizzie> Er, I think I'll run another copy, though. If I just do ^raw NICK, it won't change the name it looks for in the babbling thing.
19:05:53 <zuff> Ah, good point.
19:06:22 <fizzie> Did you want it set to this agora style?
19:06:31 <zuff> Any style would be OK, but irc would be best.
19:07:02 <oklofok> fizzie: you should explore freenode more, this is the best network there is
19:08:19 <fizzie> oklofok: I did look at some freenode channel list, but was unable to decide, there being so many options. I used to idle on #scheme some time ago, though.
19:09:16 <oklofok> well this is the best channel, so a good start.
19:09:59 <oklofok> fizzie: where else are you?
19:10:00 <AnMaster> <Hiato> http://forums.xkcd.com/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=31598&sid=bbf395caf53ac448f3e5347d6b4fdc5a#p1189920 that links to http://tunes.org/~nef//logs/esoteric/06.03.20 and I am busy playing that game on the XKCD forum. I was just interested if someone here I knew was, in fact, playing against me <-- hm... that makes me wonder
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19:10:16 <fizzie> oklofok: Nowhere else, in this network.
19:10:18 <AnMaster> "fastest-growing recursive function for two arguments that only calls the successor function (x+1) and itself".
19:10:26 <fizzie> Hmm, for some reason the meow-copy does not babble.
19:10:33 <oklofok> i meant on what other networks
19:10:37 <oklofok> then realized i already know.
19:10:38 <zuff> maybe fixed lenght check
19:10:41 <fizzie> I think it's missing some file; the list of styles is empty.
19:11:45 <Hiato> Yeah, AnMaster: It would be nice, and hugely recursive, but again,it's infinite and thus incomputable thus violating two of the rules in the OP, but there are faster growing ones
19:11:52 <Hiato> oklofok, yeah, already tried
19:12:13 <AnMaster> any number of arguments allowed?
19:12:50 <AnMaster> to make it as fast growing as you want
19:13:00 <fizzie> Yes, it was missing styles.list.
19:13:13 <zuff> fizzie: works now? :D
19:13:34 <fizzie> The nickname is registered, though. Not in use right now, but still.
19:13:48 <Hiato> oklofok: http://forums.xkcd.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=7469&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=120#p1119569
19:13:58 <Hiato> AnMaster: what's the idea?
19:14:18 <fizzie> The raw log doesn't show anything I send, so I won't see them replies.
19:14:29 <AnMaster> N(0,b,c,d) -> d N(a,b,c,d) -> N(a,b,c-1,d+1)
19:14:58 <AnMaster> but the basic idea is that you for each level make it recursively add to the last argument
19:15:06 <AnMaster> using the others as counter, adding huge amounts to them
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19:15:30 <AnMaster> I think something like that _may_ work
19:15:37 <zuff> fizzie: that lasted long
19:15:39 <Hiato> Currently I think this to be the greatest number in the competition: http://forums.xkcd.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=7469&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&sid=b2fb64934328f8712614dc0c394f9f0a&start=200#p1206232 which relies on this http://forums.xkcd.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=7469&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=80#p1096078
19:15:54 <AnMaster> also define several sub recursions for each
19:16:02 <fizzie> Yes, how intolerant. It wouldn't even have looped for any more messages.
19:16:15 <Hiato> Yeah, I've basicly done that in my recent one. While you decrease one argument, increase another etc
19:16:23 <zuff> fizzie: indeed. what pigs.
19:16:59 <AnMaster> Hiato, yes and add a huge amount of arguments + increase several at once, make each such call increase everything else
19:17:58 <fizzie> oklofok: Oh. Just the plain old IRCnet.
19:17:59 <Hiato> Yeah, the idea is awesome, the thing is you have to find a way to make it grow in value incomprehensibly at the same time as making it massively recursive
19:18:10 <AnMaster> N(a,b,c,d) -> N(N(N(a,b,c,d-1),N(a,b,c,d-1),N(a,b,c,d-1),N(a,b,c,d-1)),N(N(a,b,c,d-1),N(a,b,c,d-1),N(a,b,c,d-1),N(a,b,c,d-1)),N(N(a,b,c,d-1),N(a,b,c,d-1),N(a,b,c,d-1),N(a,b,c,d-1)))
19:18:47 <AnMaster> I can't be arsed to work out the details
19:18:52 <AnMaster> but the general concept should work
19:19:00 <AnMaster> Hiato, as long as you give credits to me ;)
19:19:02 <Hiato> Yeah, though, I hat to say it, but relatively, that is less recursive than some other numbers
19:19:11 <Hiato> Though, AnMaster, you seem to have something there
19:19:25 <AnMaster> Hiato, yes, just a rouge sketch
19:19:28 <Hiato> so I'll definitely try to use it - and yeah, you'll get the credit :P
19:19:42 <zuff> A(G_A(G_64,G_64),A(G_64,G_64))
19:19:48 <zuff> A(G_A(G_64,G_64),G_A(G_64,G_64))
19:19:53 <oklofok> fizzie: yes i know, as i said.
19:19:57 <Hiato> Sure, of course, and make it call itself as a supplmemntary argument as well
19:19:59 <AnMaster> zuff, very nice, but just nest them a few more levels
19:20:01 <oklofok> i've whoissed you on all networks i'm on.
19:20:07 <zuff> Slereah-: graham
19:20:18 <zuff> the G number indexed by A(g64,g64)
19:20:18 <Hiato> zuff: that is A(G_xkcd,G_xkcd) which is puny
19:20:21 <zuff> and apply it to A
19:20:38 <Slereah-> It's a huge-number generator not used enough
19:20:42 <Slereah-> Plus, it's on a turing machine!
19:20:49 <Hiato> slereah: http://forums.xkcd.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=7469&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=120#p1119569
19:21:07 <fizzie> oklofok: I also used to be on dalnet and efnet, but I can't even remember what channels, except dalnet's #alt.suicide.bus.stop, I think.
19:21:22 <zuff> alt.suicide.bus.stop is lulzy
19:21:27 <Hiato> Oh, and the numbers from page four are way to large to be computed these days
19:21:32 <zuff> as is its newsgroup parent
19:22:05 <fizzie> I think hanging on their IRC channel got my picture to some Italian magazine about those crazy Internet people.
19:22:13 * Hiato slaps Slereah with a mackerel
19:22:29 <zuff> mackerel is the b nomic currency
19:23:16 <zuff> Hiato: b.nomic.net
19:23:18 <Hiato> Hahaha - so, so, so sad
19:23:53 -!- BurgerFuel has changed nick to CorunFuel.
19:24:18 <vabot_> Hiato: Due to a required test protocol, we will not monitor the next chamber, you will be entirely on your own. Good Luck
19:24:50 <Hiato> God's truth oklofok - is everything here destined to be mis-interpreted? :P
19:26:57 <AnMaster> Hiato, hm I read about some math professors doing something like that recently
19:27:43 <AnMaster> one of them ended up with something like (don't remember exactly) "the smallest number that is larger than any number of a finite <something> set"
19:28:13 <Hiato> Oh, Aleph-null? Hrmm, interesting, I don't suppose you have the link...
19:28:14 <oklofok> Hiato: intentionally yes. accidentally only if AnMaster is online ;)
19:28:30 <oklofok> well okay he hasn't done that for a while
19:28:46 <oklofok> AnMaster: you're oerjan's official pun-misinterpreter
19:28:48 <AnMaster> also I was talking about the big number
19:29:02 <oklofok> oh? you misunderstood what i was saying
19:29:07 <zuff> Hiato: [stalk mode]
19:29:08 <zuff> (hence forth referred to as Esolangs - whose root word remains unknown to me)
19:29:13 <zuff> [eso]teric-[lang]uages
19:29:19 <AnMaster> oklofok, no I was not reading current convo
19:29:25 <AnMaster> I was thinking about big numbers
19:29:39 <AnMaster> http://tech.mit.edu/V126/N64/64largenumber.html
19:29:47 <Hiato> Thanks, will check it out now
19:31:41 <AnMaster> Hiato, ah it was "The smallest number bigger than any number that can be named by an expression in the language of first order set-theory with less than a googol (10100) symbols."
19:32:19 <Hiato> hrmm, yes, though there is a problem with that
19:32:23 <Hiato> let me find the link
19:32:35 <Hiato> http://www.scottaaronson.com/writings/bignumbers.html
19:33:29 <Hiato> One plus the biggest whole number nameable with 1,000 characters of English text This number takes at least 1,001 characters to name. Yet we’ve just named it with only 80 characters! Like a snake that swallows itself whole, our colossal number dissolves in a tumult of contradiction. What gives?
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19:36:13 <AnMaster> Hiato, ah that differs a bit doesn't it?
19:36:43 <Hiato> Well, the syntax is different, but the concept is the same
19:37:07 <oklofok> category theory explains that phenomenon
19:37:14 <Hiato> The largest number one can notate within a given number of symbols is elegantly beaten by it's definition
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19:37:52 <oklofok> well, basically it defines set as something that cannot contain certain sets, you need classes (?) for that
19:37:59 <oklofok> i don't really understand it.
19:38:06 <oklofok> so i can't say much about it
19:38:42 <zuff> paradox :- not(paradox).
19:38:51 <zuff> is that the prolog translation of "is the answer to this question false?"
19:38:59 <Hiato> Well, I don't know much about that approach, but logic most certainly invalidates this
19:39:48 <Hiato> Ehird: What is the answer to this question?"
19:39:48 <Hiato> "This statement is neither true nor false"
19:39:48 <Hiato> "Why doesn't this question have an answer?"
19:39:48 <Hiato> "The following statement is false. The previous statement is true"
19:40:22 <lament> The following statement is false.
19:40:23 <zuff> How do you say, in Prolog, the statement
19:40:29 <zuff> "This statement is false."
19:40:53 <Hiato> Oh, I see :P Still, the irrelevance and obscurity of my quotes should be entertaining enough
19:41:06 <zuff> lament: i don;'t think so
19:41:07 * Hiato leaves for a brief ice-cream break
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19:45:59 <lament> it's equivalent though
19:46:24 <lament> suppose we have a statement X that says "X is false"
19:49:01 <AnMaster> Hiato, also there is an easy way to always post a number bigger than the last posters number
19:50:01 <oklofok> big numbers and paradoxes are boring
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20:02:43 <Hiato> AnMaster: Again, in violation of the OP :P
20:02:57 * Hiato returns from the ice-cream break, non the hotter
20:04:23 <Hiato> Oooh, oh my... so subtle, yet attractive too
20:05:33 <Slereah-> Subtle. Like my dick. Which I am about to shove in your mouth
20:07:19 <Hiato> Oh, no, please, don't feel compelled - it was just getting inappropriate
20:08:44 <Hiato> ... channel ideas?
20:09:02 <zuff> #hiato_and_slereahs_hot_loving
20:09:14 <Slereah-> Nah, that's the name of our paying website
20:09:52 -!- Slereah- has changed nick to Slereah.
20:10:05 <Hiato> See, future planning, that's where you phail zuff
20:14:19 <Hiato> Original Post (methinks) - basically the rules for the post/description of what is needed/requested
20:17:20 <Hiato> http://forum.osdev.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=18573 - lol
20:18:14 <Slereah> I'll rock your body alright!
20:18:24 <Slereah> And by that I mean STONE YOU YOU SHAMELESS WHORE
20:18:33 <Slereah> COVER YOUR BODY AND STOP THIS DEMONIC DANCING
20:18:35 <oklofok> ...wait how did you turn that into something sexual?!? :o
20:18:37 <Hiato> Damn, slereah, I though *WE* had something special
20:18:51 <oklofok> Slereah: are you covering for psygnisfive today?
20:19:05 <Slereah> since when is stoning threats gay?
20:23:47 <Slereah> psygnisfive : I'll cover you!
20:28:56 <oklofok> being drunk occasionally makes the little things more fun
20:29:06 <oklofok> but you can't do the big things, because those require brain.
20:29:41 <oklofok> for instance i can never get myself to wash the dishes, but give me a bottle of vodka, and it becomes trivial.
20:30:16 <psygnisfive> i mean boring in that the drug produces no fun mental or physical effects
20:30:17 <oklofok> but yes, being drunk isn't that much fun
20:30:42 <oklofok> at least that's the most noticeable effect
20:30:57 <psygnisfive> the whole experience was much like DXM actually
20:31:21 <psygnisfive> i suspect alcohol might do that eventually too but i think it'd be too difficult for me to consume enough to do that
20:31:47 <Slereah> Maybe you should do drugs instead.
20:32:34 <Slereah> TELL ME, MY FRIENDS IN THE PARTYVAN WOULD LIKE TO KNOW
20:32:55 <psygnisfive> ive done DXM the most, tried salvia, and tried lsd. the latter two never actually got anywhere D:
20:34:10 <psygnisfive> tho dont let that cause you to think it's trivial
20:34:27 <Slereah> I could use some cough syrup myself
20:34:34 <Slereah> Not for drugs, though. I have a cold :(
20:34:46 <oklofok> psygnisfive: how much did you consume?
20:35:02 <oklofok> i usually drink 15-20 beers
20:35:07 <psygnisfive> if you plan on ever doing dxm, get cough gels. the syrups often have other crap that will destroy your liver.
20:35:30 <oklofok> (well used to, nowadays i don't really drink)
20:36:02 <oklofok> i have no idea how much that is in terms of beer, how much is 1 oz
20:37:09 <oklofok> okay so that's half a liter or smth
20:38:01 <oklofok> "i believe you o great mathemagician"
20:39:20 <oklofok> anyway that's a good dose if you aren't used to drinking, you should have experienced "being drunk"
20:39:52 <psygnisfive> and i certainly dont see why they're so incompetent on it
20:40:20 <fizzie> "Imaginary friends don't count."
20:40:30 <Slereah> Even though I was not born in Finland
20:40:42 <Slereah> Because Finn is a way of being, you see.
20:41:00 <oklofok> if you understand that, you are automatically finnish.
20:41:28 <Slereah> I hope I don't have to pay Finn taxes though
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20:44:29 <oklofok> we don't have taxes here, every week we sacrifice a few hundred citizens (poison gas) and take their money
20:45:07 <oklofok> probably more than a few hundred, i'm not a politician
20:45:33 <oklofok> not politician, that other thing.
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21:10:47 <psygnisfive> is the <u> in <tuple> the <oo> in <too> or the <u> in <but>?
21:12:25 <fizzie> I would've used the butt variant, I think.
21:12:31 <Slereah> Although actually, I never use tuple.
21:12:36 <Slereah> I always say ordered pair.
21:13:01 <fizzie> I think en:tuple is officially fi:monikko, which sort-of sucks, since that word has a lot more common meaning of en:plural.
21:13:29 <Slereah> psygnisfive : You can build a 5-tuple with ordered pairs
21:13:33 <psygnisfive> wee i like how fizzie is using the language prefixes :D
21:13:44 <psygnisfive> slereah: i can build a 5-tuple out of your mother
21:14:32 <fizzie> My pronunciation is not something anyone should draw any conclusions from, since it's mostly guesswork. The native English speakers should comment on this.
21:15:25 <psygnisfive> the pronunciation is optionally /u/ as in <two> or /V/ as in <tonne>
21:15:47 <Sgeo> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qqKb1P_RKKk
21:18:19 <zuff> i'm pretty sure psygnisfive was being sarcastic
21:20:39 <oklofok> but that's a word i've never heard used (well probably have, but haven't paid attention) nor checked, because i haven't had to say it
21:21:21 <oklofok> been wanting to check it though, because both pronunciations sound possible to me
21:21:45 <fizzie> I've spoken "tuple" the way I'd read it as a Finnish word, when speaking otherwise-Finnish but needing that particular concept, because I don't think anyone seriously uses the translation.
21:22:04 <fizzie> I'm not sure I can explain that pronunciation, though; maybe oklofok could.
21:23:00 <oklofok> you mean you don't think anyone uses the word "tuple" in finnish?
21:23:14 <fizzie> I don't think anyone uses the word "monikko" for it, even though that's what my dictionaries give.
21:23:28 <fizzie> Except maybe some database people, they are freaky.
21:23:57 <oklofok> some of our lecturers use it
21:24:07 <oklofok> and i think the rest use english.
21:24:17 <oklofok> but otherwise i've only heard "tuple"
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21:26:35 <AnMaster> poll: What project should I begin this xmas (apart from upgrading some servers and such that I have to do anyway): 1) Start learning haskell 2) Start working on a hobby OS (very basic, think, real mode only, very basic shell)
21:27:03 <zuff> because it is not 1)
21:27:04 <AnMaster> note I may ask the same question elsewhere, and what I will decide may be based on several sources
21:27:07 <lament> write a hobby OS in haskell... in the type system!
21:27:20 <zuff> lament: you really don't want to inflict AnMaster learning another functional language on us.
21:27:20 <AnMaster> lament, hah, I think I will have to do 1 first then
21:27:25 <zuff> please think of the kittens!!
21:27:35 <zuff> i will personally kill 5 kittens if AnMaster chooses 1)
21:27:45 <lament> hm, yes, consider the kittens then
21:27:55 <AnMaster> well I asked this question in another channel and got 5 "1" so far
21:28:34 <lament> 1 is easier, in the sense that it is achievable
21:28:35 <zuff> Asztal: god damnit
21:28:37 <zuff> i am dying here
21:28:43 <zuff> please think of the kittens
21:28:47 <AnMaster> Asztal, indeed, and I will probably try the other one later
21:28:52 <lament> 2 is not really achievable, and even if you do achieve it, all you'll have for it will be a really shitty hobby OS.
21:28:55 <zuff> after killing the kittens i will put them in the fucking lhc
21:28:59 <zuff> and make them die
21:29:00 <zuff> and the world will DIE
21:29:02 <zuff> and AnMaster will DIE
21:29:07 <zuff> and everything will STOP
21:29:10 <oklofok> dunno, a friend of mine recently made an os
21:29:12 <zuff> and I will envelop the UNIVERSE
21:29:13 <zuff> and it will DIE
21:29:18 <Asztal> I did 2 before 1, anyway. But I turned into a Ctard.
21:29:19 <zuff> and I will KILL IT
21:29:21 <AnMaster> lament, indeed, it would be like LFS, very interesting distro to install, and you learn a lot
21:29:25 <zuff> and I will KILL IT
21:29:29 <zuff> AND I WILL KILL IT
21:30:08 <oklofok> how is a working os not usable, all you need it brainfuck, irc and some kinda word processor
21:30:12 <oklofok> and you can code those in a minute
21:30:13 <zuff> these kittens are eating my brain
21:30:18 <zuff> i am ready to strangle them
21:30:34 <AnMaster> I have investigated these questions a bit
21:30:51 <AnMaster> and I will probably go for 1. but I don't know.
21:30:59 <zuff> AnMaster: here's something to put you off:
21:31:05 <Sgeo> Make an OS in Haskell!
21:31:07 <lament> AnMaster: http://learnyouahaskell.com/
21:31:15 <zuff> AnMaster: modern haskell is painful without compiler-specific extensions.
21:31:18 <zuff> including major ones.
21:31:30 * zuff watches AnMaster choke on his own breath
21:32:02 <oklofok> AnMaster: it's easy. and you can't convince someone who doesn't know what he's talking about that he's wrong, so don't even try.
21:32:18 * Sgeo knows just enough haskell to make one stupid joke
21:32:58 <zuff> /ignore AnMaster
21:33:02 <zuff> let me know when the nuclear fallout is over
21:33:08 <Sgeo> What did Goldilocks say upon seeing "Maybe (b -> Either a b)"?
21:33:17 <AnMaster> scheme is said to be painful without compiler extensions
21:33:41 <Sgeo> Funnily enough, in XChat, /ignore does not work that way
21:33:49 <zuff> funnily enough, xchat sucks dick
21:34:20 <fizzie> There's an OS project course in at least our university; they do build and OS there, and it doesn't seem to be terribly difficult. Okay, so they do get some skeleton code provided, but still.
21:34:27 <Sgeo> lament, is that "hehe" at the joke, or at /ignore zuff ?
21:34:32 <lament> AnMaster: with haskell, unlike with scheme, there's only one compiler
21:34:39 <zuff> lament: no there isn't
21:34:44 <zuff> ok, all the other ones suck
21:34:45 <Sgeo> "It's Just Right"
21:34:48 <zuff> and the interpreters suck
21:35:26 <AnMaster> lament, I use erlang too, there is just one implementation
21:35:42 <zuff> lament: you are a really awful person.
21:37:59 <lament> zuff: i'm awfully real.
21:37:59 <Sgeo> oklofok, "It's Just Right"
21:38:16 <zuff> lament: yes. your continued existence is awful in light of recent events
21:38:37 <Sgeo> http://haskell.org/haskellwiki/Humor/Goldilocks
21:38:46 <zuff> Sgeo: that page does not belong under Humor/
21:39:05 <zuff> also, that would be Maybe (Either a)
21:39:20 <zuff> Right the actual constructor
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21:42:49 <AnMaster> also is zuff actually ignoring me?
21:45:56 <oklofok> you'll probably know right after i answer you
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21:57:52 <AnMaster> <lament> AnMaster: http://learnyouahaskell.com/ <-- thanks btw
21:58:01 <AnMaster> "This tutorial is aimed at people who have experience in imperative programming languages (C, C++, Java, Python …) but haven't programmed in a functional language before (Haskell, ML, OCaml …)."
21:58:18 <AnMaster> I do know scheme and erlang, but it will still be useful I'm sure
21:59:56 <AnMaster> lament, I have already collected a small collection of links to Haskell tutorials
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22:01:13 <zuff> learnyouahaskell is only good if you like cartoons and code examples involving calling people gay.
22:01:43 <zuff> yes on ignore.
22:01:45 <zuff> i just checked the logs.
22:01:55 <AnMaster> zuff, "real world haskell" looks quite interesting too
22:02:07 <zuff> it's not a good intro. also, stop learning haskell.
22:02:07 <oklofok> he goes to great lengths to be able to read everything you say yet ignore you.
22:02:21 <oklofok> he must love/hate you quite a lot.
22:02:34 <zuff> oklofok: the ignoring is symbolic of my fiery hatred.
22:02:40 <zuff> the reading is symbolic of my morbid curiosity.
22:02:57 <AnMaster> zuff, suggestion: I don't ask you haskell questions, I ask someone else?
22:03:11 <zuff> it's still in here :P
22:03:22 <AnMaster> oh the answers will also be here then
22:03:28 <AnMaster> so you don't get around it any way
22:04:00 <zuff> in conclusion, fuck life
22:05:49 <zuff> someone give me some rss feeds to subscribe too. I'm trying out google reader to further convince myself that rss sucks
22:06:52 <zuff> it seems ok. the design made me puke though so i satisfied my inner wannabe typographer by installing http://helvetireader.com/
22:07:39 <AnMaster> <lament> AnMaster: http://learnyouahaskell.com/
22:07:44 <AnMaster> http://www.gentoo.org/rdf/en/gentoo-news.rdf
22:07:50 <zuff> http://www.news.com.au/story/0,27574,24812462-23109,00.html ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah
22:08:01 <zuff> AnMaster: yeah it would help if I used gentoo
22:08:42 <AnMaster> http://book.realworldhaskell.org/feeds/comments/why-functional-programming-why-haskell/
22:09:01 <Slereah> why-haskell <- because you hate yourself
22:09:11 <zuff> umm, why would I subscribe to the feed of comments on one section of a haskell book that I don't like all that much
22:09:26 <lament> i just got my copy yesterday
22:09:34 <zuff> lament: but you hate haskell
22:10:25 * zuff adds his google reader feed to google reader, ending the universe
22:11:06 <zuff> damn, it works properly
22:11:08 <zuff> what a disappointment
22:11:44 <zuff> i should make a blog just to subscribe to it
22:12:02 <AnMaster> zuff, don't you already have a blog?
22:12:12 <zuff> not as if I post to it or anything.
22:12:25 <zuff> also, it's technically down.
22:12:32 <zuff> also, that's tusho's blog/
22:13:24 <zuff> it occurs to me that I should probably just write yet another rss->email thing since I check my email often.
22:15:38 <zuff> that would be the _one single_ good use of html mail./
22:20:10 <zuff> it'd kind of suck in that you'd just get the title and source
22:20:16 <zuff> instead of a summary of the article
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22:26:52 <AnMaster> zuff, I see why you like http://learnyouahaskell.com/introduction
22:26:59 <AnMaster> "Also, I think you can do Haskell development with that wacky mouse with one button, although I'm not sure."
22:27:12 <AnMaster> yes yes I know macs have two nowdays
22:27:22 <zuff> "congratulations you got the joke"
22:28:21 <AnMaster> zuff, last I checked macbook and macbook pro still use single mouse button below the touchpad
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22:37:39 <AnMaster> I _may_ know some other software that does the same
22:37:49 <zuff> AnMaster: that is really not helpful
22:38:01 <AnMaster> zuff, oh? I was trying to be helpful
22:38:04 <zuff> nor was your suggesting of trying another editor when SimonRC (i think) had a minor problem with another
22:38:17 <Slereah> \*SubsuperscriptBox[\(\[Integral]\), \(-\[Infinity]\), \
22:38:17 <Slereah> \(\[Infinity]\)]\((HeavisideTheta[t - T]*
22:38:17 <Slereah> A)\)*\((HeavisideTheta[t - T - \[Tau]]*A)\) \[DifferentialD]t\)
22:38:40 <AnMaster> Slereah, that looks like somewhat broken LaTeX notation?
22:38:52 <zuff> that looks like mathematica.
22:39:15 <Slereah> Mathematica looks like that in the real world.
22:39:22 <AnMaster> to me it looks somewhat similar to LaTeX
22:39:25 <Slereah> It only looks neato in Mathematica
22:39:39 <zuff> yeah, in mathematica that \ stuff transforms into real-mathematical-equation looking
22:40:14 <Slereah> Well, it should answer a function.
22:40:22 <AnMaster> example: LyX, has WYSIWYG LaTeX formula editor
22:40:40 <Slereah> And I really don't want to do it by hand
22:40:46 <Slereah> And I must give something back friday
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23:26:33 <Slereah> I received this from a random ICQ person
23:26:35 <Slereah> 364399558: , ! , , ! sex-gong()ru 25879
23:26:44 <Slereah> Must be some sort of secret code!
23:28:26 -!- wumpus_ has joined.
23:31:06 <lament> Подготовься, друг! Тебе понадобится все свободное время, чтобы пересмотреть нескончаемые порно фильмы, которые мы припасли для тебя! sex-gong(точка)ru
23:31:46 <Slereah> I'm picturing russian men strinking gongs with their penises.
23:31:51 <Slereah> It's a million dollar idea.
23:34:22 <lament> sounds like something russian men would do
23:34:41 <Slereah> Well, it's Russia, they probably don't have the internet
23:34:45 <Slereah> You've got to pass the time
23:36:18 <zuff> you new here? :P
23:36:56 <zuff> sacrificed some goats already?
23:37:23 <lament> You smell a wumpus_ nearby.
23:37:35 <wumpus_> nope, but I beat up my dog regularly :-)
23:39:12 <wumpus_> ok next time it's your turn :-)
23:40:43 <wumpus_> you are really brave Slereah
23:41:30 <Slereah> That's all in a days work.
23:41:38 <zuff> /topic #dogabuse
23:44:04 <lament> hello wumpus_, welcome to #esoteric
23:44:16 <zuff> lament here is your channel cofounder
23:44:31 <lament> we're a small multinational community dedicated to designing a programming language centered around sexual abuse of domestic animals
23:44:42 <wumpus_> hi lament, you are also a fan fan of those BSD-games?
23:44:52 <Slereah> You don't want to know how to write a cat program!
23:45:30 <wumpus_> my fortune-software started today with some ways to skin a cat
23:46:56 <wumpus_> so you are dealing with Satanic Code
23:49:13 <Slereah> It's really a bitch to type pentagrams.
23:50:16 <Asztal> I expected there to be a pentagram in unicode, but sadly no :(
23:51:32 <wumpus_> perhaps you did not mumble the right mantras while programming
23:54:14 <Slereah> http://www3.waterstones.com/wat/images/nbd/l/20/9780099403357.jpg
23:54:21 <lament> in Satanic Code, typing a pentagram is pretty easy: data Pentagram = Pentagram Point Point Point Point Point
23:57:18 <Asztal> that doesn't look like an inverted pentagram to me!
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23:58:23 <zuff> lament: pfft, you are not using Pan!
23:58:29 <zuff> type Image a = Point -> a
23:58:38 <zuff> type Point = (Float, Float)
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