00:03:48 <oerjan> zeers with palindromes
00:04:25 <oklofok> i'm talking about {fizzie, FireFly}
00:04:48 <oerjan> but a bit short on palindromes
00:05:02 <oerjan> and z's for that matter
00:05:03 <ehird> z = sleep I assume
00:05:40 <oklofok> oerjan: nick palindromes are a temporary meme, please keep up.
00:06:08 <oerjan> yes, and you agree length 1 is short, right?
00:06:45 <oklofok> but sometimes i'm too stupid to realize other's aren't stupid, and explain myself.
00:09:34 <oklofok> also the "oerjan: and z's for that matter" did kinda hint you didn't understand me.
00:10:40 <oerjan> well i didn't understand that part
00:14:01 <lament> how many notes does it take to have a melody?
00:14:51 <ehird> I've seen 2-note melodies.
00:15:33 <lament> oerjan, ehird: Fight to the death.
00:16:16 <oerjan> ehird always wins those fights
00:16:34 <oklofok> the empty melody has no notes
00:16:50 -!- Dewi has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
00:16:57 <oklofok> it's used as the base case for many inductive music proofs.
00:17:52 <oerjan> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4%E2%80%B233%E2%80%B3
00:18:46 <oklofok> the point of that was not to play the empty melody, he had some ridiculous idea about using the audience as a modern music instrument
00:18:54 <oklofok> afaik, guess i could just read it
00:20:53 <oklofok> stupid non-mathematical stupidity
00:21:16 <lament> i postulate that 4'33" only qualifies as music if you're fucked up in the head.
00:33:36 <lament> it's better than most rap
00:34:13 <ehird> it's better than most music, as there's infinite music.
00:35:00 <ehird> lament: one note played once. one note played twice.
00:35:11 <ehird> there you go. a tiny segment of the infinite music that exists.
00:35:13 <lament> that's not music, that's a bunch of notes.
00:35:21 <ehird> s/one note/one melody/.
00:35:58 <lament> 1) is the same melody played 2398475987897 times really "music"?
00:36:14 <lament> 2) is this music really different from the same melody repeated 2398475987898 times?
00:36:31 <ehird> lament: if we accept 4'33" as music (implicit in the 'better than most music' I said), then it's still music if repeated for any amount
00:37:52 -!- psygnisfive has quit (Remote closed the connection).
00:46:31 <lament> ehird: you are so brainwashed.
00:46:34 <lament> ehird: you're part of the haskell cult.
00:48:15 <lament> ehird: also your argument strategy is peculiar to say the least
00:48:38 <lament> instead of responding, you just copy what i said to a bunch of unrelated people?
00:49:08 <lament> not only it's impolite, but it only proves my point
00:49:21 <lament> can you think for yourself and not bring the haskell cult into this?
00:50:22 <lament> xahlee, to be sure, raises some valid points in that essay
00:50:29 <lament> although he mostly talks about scheme and only mentions haskell in passing
00:50:59 <ehird> 1] IRC is public, I copied it because it was amusing 2] i see 3] I wasn't intending to discuss it 4] wrong 5] k
00:51:35 <lament> i have no idea what those numbers correspond to.
00:51:57 <ehird> from [00:48:38] <lament> instead of responding, you just copy what i said to a bunch of unrelated people?
00:53:49 <lament> keep in mind that, assuming you're brainwashed, it's very hard for you to detect that - that's the nature of brainwashing
00:54:31 <ehird> you're an excellent troll, lament. fyi I don't like haskell all that much.
00:54:48 <lament> i had years of practice.
00:58:09 <lament> also i kinda like xah lee's style
00:58:16 <lament> (the calling everyone a fuckhead part)
01:00:04 -!- oerjan has quit ("Good night").
01:10:24 -!- metaphysician has quit ("Oh Noes!").
01:18:05 -!- oklofok has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)).
01:31:08 -!- metaphysician has joined.
01:43:22 -!- Dewi has joined.
02:31:07 -!- Sgeo has joined.
03:40:31 -!- Slereah_ has joined.
03:45:59 -!- psygnisfive has joined.
03:59:43 -!- Slereah has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
04:52:44 -!- GreaseMonkey has joined.
05:21:18 -!- Sgeo has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)).
05:54:36 -!- DarkPants has joined.
05:55:05 -!- DarkPants has quit (Remote closed the connection).
06:06:41 -!- GreaseMonkey has quit (Connection timed out).
07:53:48 -!- oklopol has joined.
07:59:59 -!- clog has quit (ended).
08:00:00 -!- clog has joined.
08:45:36 -!- oklopol has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)).
08:45:52 -!- oklopol has joined.
08:50:07 <fizzie> ok-lopol: Hey, you have the nickname-palindromitis also. Why is it that you just point it out in others?
08:50:39 <oklopol> fizzie: i have pointed it out in myselves too
08:51:10 <fizzie> Oh. I must have missed it.
08:55:50 <oklopol> it was my great palindrome bit. but don't worry, i'm going to keep doing it until everyone thinks "palindrome" means "letter".
08:56:11 <oklopol> and burrows-wheeler is one confusing little pecker.
09:00:27 -!- Slereah has joined.
09:12:57 -!- Slereah_ has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
09:17:05 -!- ais523 has joined.
09:59:59 -!- oklopol has quit ("( www.nnscript.com :: NoNameScript 4.2 :: www.regroup-esports.com )").
10:15:04 -!- Dewi has quit (Network is unreachable).
10:29:26 -!- Corun has joined.
10:37:58 -!- Mony has joined.
10:41:34 <Mony> hey, i'm back :D
10:44:13 -!- oerjan has joined.
10:59:23 -!- oklopol has joined.
11:12:11 <ais523> oklopol: I already knew
11:13:13 <oklopol> so ais523 i didn't hear your summer plans
11:13:22 <ais523> I didn't realise I had any
11:13:39 <oklopol> does your university stuff end during summer
11:13:47 <oerjan> plans? who needs plans?
11:13:53 <ais523> but I find it hard to plan so far ahead
11:14:35 <oklopol> yes, i couldn't tell ppl my plans, but i can easily ask other people's plans :)
11:14:46 <ais523> 365 weeks a month, 80 days a week
11:14:47 <oklopol> oerjan: yes i predicted when he dies.
11:15:32 <ais523> the answer is I'm almost always working on something, but during the holidays it normally isn't university-related
11:15:59 <oerjan> oklopol: if he works like that no way he'll live until 80
11:16:47 <oklopol> oerjan: better to overestimate.
11:28:14 -!- Corun has quit ("This computer has gone to sleep").
11:38:50 -!- ais523 has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)).
11:43:44 -!- Slereah_ has joined.
11:48:29 -!- oerjan has quit ("leaving").
11:54:21 -!- ais523 has joined.
11:56:09 -!- Slereah has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
12:03:51 -!- jix has joined.
12:49:26 -!- jix has quit ("...").
12:53:54 -!- jix has joined.
14:01:47 -!- ehird has quit ("Caught sigterm, terminating...").
14:01:58 -!- ehird has joined.
14:19:06 <ais523> argh, Simulink is calculating the absolute value of a number as being negative
14:19:11 <ais523> there is no way that works, at all
14:19:30 <ais523> I think it must be using some sort of fuzzy maths
14:40:58 -!- Hiato has joined.
15:01:38 -!- ais523 has quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client").
15:07:11 <ehird> what was the number
15:10:51 -!- ais523 has joined.
15:19:53 <oklopol> but why would a number say such a thing?
15:20:22 <ehird> http://waferbaby.com/setup/2009/02/13/_why <- why the lucky stiff is on LSD again.
15:23:35 <ehird> i loved the ljofol reference
15:27:41 <ehird> i loved all of it.
15:28:18 <ehird> me too. let's get married.
15:38:19 -!- Slereah has joined.
15:50:49 -!- Slereah_ has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
15:53:35 <oklopol> what's the square root of seven in unary?
15:55:27 <oklopol> and do you brits like cold tea? i think it tastes rather interesting.
15:55:36 <ehird> we like tea in general
15:56:32 <ehird> we like it probably
15:57:04 <oklopol> well how about you know when it's solid
16:00:10 <ehird> by which I mean no
16:01:31 <oklopol> hmm. i'm not sure i'm going to accomplish anything saying random things on random ...medias.
16:01:45 <oklopol> should probably stop using double plurals and start reading or something.
16:02:10 <oklopol> and oh my god RuralHack is crazy, #philosophy is awesome
16:03:11 <ehird> oklopol: ic, some mystic crazy fuck?
16:03:51 -!- Hiato has quit ("Leaving.").
16:04:13 <ehird> [16:03:51] <vostibackle> the bot doesn't have the appropriate functional relationships for consciousness
16:04:13 <oklopol> NaN is actually talking about another crazy fuck, who you probably know, called DanFredriksen
16:04:19 <ehird> oklopol: I think they're _all_ crazy fucks
16:05:11 <ehird> "to lie to others you have to lie to yourself?"
16:05:45 <oklopol> everyone pretty much tunes him out.
16:06:23 <ehird> oklopol: they're all batshit.
16:06:42 <ehird> well, the whole concept of philosophy is pretty much distinguishing the identical
16:06:46 <ehird> so ofc they're batshit
16:07:17 <ehird> oklopol: NaN is in ##christian
16:07:21 <ehird> of course the bot has to differ
16:07:28 <ehird> anything else would be admitting the nonexistance of the soul
16:07:44 <oklopol> admits it's an irrational belief though.
16:08:23 <ehird> man, ruralhack is retarded
16:09:10 <ehird> oklopol: whuz the fancy name for the philosophy "things are just how they physically are goddammit stop being stupid"
16:09:11 <oklopol> yes! he's fun to watch when you're really.
16:09:20 <ehird> not just when you're tired, when you're really, too
16:09:48 <ehird> discount me with your ManWordzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
16:10:09 <ehird> oklopol: does he just type, forever?
16:10:53 <ehird> oklopol: how do you make him stop
16:11:10 -!- ais523__ has joined.
16:11:12 <oklopol> well i'm starting to think he may be a bot, at least a sentence generator, there must be an operator there too though.
16:11:23 -!- ais523__ has changed nick to ais523_.
16:11:28 <ehird> we're watching a mad person in ##philosophy. called ruralhack.
16:11:28 <oklopol> he leaves when he wants to.
16:11:45 <ais523_> wow, that was a surprising moment to get a kernel panic
16:11:55 -!- ais523 has quit (Nick collision from services.).
16:11:59 -!- ais523_ has changed nick to ais523.
16:12:17 <ais523> I have no idea why that happened...
16:12:31 <oklopol> kernel panic. what's kernel panic?
16:12:46 <ais523> oklopol: the OS getting so insane all of a sudden it doesn't even know what's gone wrong
16:12:51 <ais523> the whole computer freezes up
16:13:03 <ais523> and on my laptop, it flashes capslock and scrolllock to show that something's gone wrong
16:13:05 <ehird> [16:12:23] <RuralHack> It makes me cry you hate yourself so much that you act as if you are not life
16:14:25 <oklopol> ais523: i see. what oses do that?
16:14:38 <ais523> all the major ones do, or can do
16:14:50 <ais523> and it didn't even leave any info in the logs to show what had gone wrong
16:15:06 <ehird> kernel panics are bugs.
16:16:26 -!- ais523_ has joined.
16:16:37 <oklopol> 18:15… RuralHack: Thank you for letting me rant <<< he stopped.
16:20:09 <ehird> [16:20:03] <RuralHack> go ahead ehird... sorry for interrupting
16:20:54 -!- FireFly has joined.
16:25:42 -!- ais523_ has quit (Remote closed the connection).
16:32:19 -!- Slereah has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)).
16:32:41 <ehird> omg mathematica is crap
16:32:48 <ehird> it is using all my memory just to load a wav
16:33:30 <ehird> ais523: gawd why does it suck so much
16:33:34 <ais523> ehird: I've told you about its inefficiency several times
16:33:46 <ehird> but it's just loading a freaking wav
16:34:50 <ais523> Mathematica manages to be a computational order slower than other things for no good reason at all, somehow
16:35:51 <ehird> it has to load this wav EVENTUALLY...
16:38:13 <ais523> ehird: if I were to guess, it's doing the equivalent of not using a StringBuilder
16:38:40 <ehird> oklopol: gawd, now there's a guy who doesn't see why I'd get up in the morning if I think life has no purpose
16:41:06 <oklopol> ehird: cdials: no, I do it by my own free will because I want to. conciousness has no justification apart from itself, so the continuation of itself is the only logical course. <<< listen to all these wackjobs with their big philosphical words!
16:41:31 <ehird> oklopol: i was attempting to communicate with the lower life form of "philosophical fuck".
16:41:34 -!- sebbu2 has joined.
16:41:40 <ehird> [16:41:02] <NaN> I believe the chief end of man is to glorify God by enjoying him forever.
16:41:45 <ehird> thanks for that, we couldn't have guessed.
16:41:51 <ehird> why would a christian think that.
16:44:24 <ehird> my brain is rotting.
16:47:24 <fizzie> That makes God sound like some sort of a drink.
16:47:33 <ehird> "Enjoy god every morning!"
16:48:16 <ehird> oklopol: do you ever feel like you're just repeating yourself all the time when talking to them
16:48:47 <ehird> [16:48:42] <Irishmanluke> drdrdrd
16:48:49 <ehird> best insight in hours
16:52:47 <ehird> oklopol: i tried to fit the word conciousness as many times as I could in that sentence
16:56:21 -!- Slereah has joined.
17:02:48 <ehird> [17:02:32] <ehird> i'm pretty sure this argument in history has only been had seventy billion times.
17:02:48 <ehird> [17:02:41] <ehird> clearly having it one more time will get somewhere
17:02:51 <ehird> Time until kick: 3 seconds
17:03:42 <oklopol> i have a two hour argument this morning there
17:04:09 <oklopol> this dude was trying to convince me statistics are crucial for learning a language.
17:07:18 <oklopol> well, that's fine, except i was talking about how in my opinion it would make more sense to create bots that learn simple artificial grammars, and bots that use a simple-to-parse language and try to do something sensible with the semantics, instead of just starting to feed a generic AI statistics about english and trying to get it to speak it.
17:07:26 <oklopol> (i was interrupted, sorry.)
17:08:18 <oklopol> and told him about a hundred times i was not interested in having an argument about how children learn language, and that i agreed with him about the statistics argument anyway.
17:09:23 <oklopol> and the dude just kept on telling me how his child understood pronouns, and that convobots shouldn't be designed intelligently, but they should be made to understand any language, based on what they're given as input.
17:09:36 <ehird> oklopol: here's an artificial grammar for you:
17:09:38 <oklopol> and i told him i agreed with that as well.
17:10:01 <oklopol> when you add the fact i cannot stop arguments, because, you know, i'm retarded, it was one painful discussion.
17:10:28 <oklopol> missed the whole lecture, fortunately i learned after the lecture i had still understood more than others, it seems.
17:10:49 <ehird> oklopol: expr = verb | verb ' ' verb. verb = [adegklnopstuyz]+
17:10:57 <oklopol> "so, did anyone get at least some sense out of this?" *silence, i wave my hand in midair*
17:11:46 <ehird> oklopol: expr = verb | expr ' ' verb | expr '. ' expr | '"' expr '"' | expr expr. verb = [adegklnopstuyz]+
17:12:32 -!- sebbu has quit (Connection timed out).
17:12:35 <ehird> i haveno idea what that says
17:13:13 <ehird> "polget" is a quotation, ofc.
17:13:22 <ehird> [ofc it has first-class functions]
17:13:48 <ehird> quotations are verbs consisting of the composition of everything in the quotes.
17:13:54 <ehird> but they also reference the verbs inside.
17:14:09 <ehird> agelo was a name, so as a singleton it's (\x. x agelo)
17:14:26 <ehird> na is 'says', I guess.
17:14:33 <ehird> so you can compose "agelo na"
17:14:37 <ehird> to mean 'Agelo says...'
17:15:59 <oklopol> i thought you said elephant
17:16:04 <ehird> sentences (a. b) just run a, clear the stack, then run b.
17:16:06 <oklopol> but umm elegant, let's see
17:16:26 <ehird> oklopol: quotations should nest, actually
17:16:33 <ehird> make it alternating " and '
17:16:36 <ehird> determined by whitespace
17:17:15 <ehird> "'"polget" "agelo na"' agelo na" agelo na
17:17:26 <ehird> ((polget) (agelo na) agelo na) agelo na
17:17:33 <oklopol> i want to make my cool convobot.
17:17:53 <ehird> Agelo says, "Agelo says, "'Polget' and 'Agelo says'.""
17:18:30 <ehird> oklopol: put my grammar into it. and make it invent words for how people behave.
17:18:52 <ehird> like, it'd just recognize patterns in what people say, and learn them as words
17:19:02 <ehird> and if people said patterns along others, it'd associate them
17:19:07 <oklopol> i don't think i'd constrain its capability to invent words.
17:19:17 <ehird> that wasn't constraining
17:25:49 -!- BeholdMyGlory has joined.
17:32:27 -!- ais523_ has joined.
17:33:31 <ehird> oh my god this word generating algorithm is amazing.
17:34:03 <ais523_> is that even pronouncable?
17:34:08 <ais523_> it ends with oko, anyway, so it's forgiven
17:34:24 <ehird> wait. I have u down as a consonant.
17:34:50 <ehird> ok, triple vowels is a bit excsesive.
17:35:44 <ehird> ais523_: "gaotolootaaney"
17:36:21 <ehird> actually, double is ugly no matter what.
17:36:29 <ehird> it should just be cvcvcvcv or vcvcvcvc
17:36:33 <ais523_> double o works, double a doesn't
17:36:57 -!- MigoMipo has joined.
17:37:30 <ehird> ais523_: i'd prefer oo to be a separate letter
17:38:19 <ehird> ais523_: "sakogakasepude"
17:39:59 <ehird> this is clearly oklopol's native tounge
17:40:33 <ehird> 'nakutapupu' <- pronounced 'nahcootahpoopoo'.
17:42:10 <ehird> eyoyanaka <- e, o and a are short there
17:42:17 <ehird> (all vowels are short apart from u)
17:47:21 <ehird> the alphabett: danepokupytz
17:58:45 -!- Hiato has joined.
18:00:49 -!- ais523 has quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client").
18:00:54 -!- ais523_ has changed nick to ais523.
18:20:15 <ehird> i always used to think there was a C+
18:20:20 <ehird> there's C and C++, so there must be a C+!
18:20:22 <ehird> (Note: i was like 6)
18:53:50 -!- oklopol has quit (Connection timed out).
18:54:03 -!- oklopol has joined.
19:20:34 -!- sebbu2 has quit (No route to host).
19:27:46 -!- Hiato has quit ("Leaving.").
19:32:18 -!- sebbu has joined.
19:34:53 <ehird> [19:29:12] <kana> hello, what if time runs backwards and we feel it runs forwards ?
19:51:58 <ehird> [19:51:32] <Sailormoon> Excuse me, all this arrogance has given me diahrea, im going to go take a hot steamy shit, brb
20:01:45 -!- kar8nga has joined.
20:06:37 <ehird> oklopol: have you written tga files?
20:07:52 <oklopol> not sure i've even really used them.
20:08:10 <ehird> he ripped off my haskell lib and gave it tga :P
20:08:33 <fizzie> I thought I'd read some tga files, but upon closer inspection it turns out those were tiff files instead.
20:08:37 <oklopol> Asztal: drag your asz in here and tal us about tga
20:15:32 <ais523> oklopol: ehird's decided to do something with tga
20:15:40 <ais523> because he things libpng is too complicated
20:15:49 <ais523> and now he needs your help, it seems
20:15:53 <ehird> I think that using a library is no fun.
20:18:04 <Asztal> my code for it was pretty short (I didn't bother with endianness) : http://paste.pocoo.org/show/104330/
20:18:49 <ehird> Asztal: ic, I didn't use pallettes
20:18:55 <Asztal> hmm, I suppose I do kind of bother with endianness
20:19:17 <ehird> but ... that's pretty much my cod
20:19:23 <ehird> so wtf doesn'tit work o_O
20:19:39 <Asztal> I didn't do palettes either (not sure what that 32 is there for)
20:20:15 -!- oerjan has joined.
20:20:33 <ehird> Asztal: wait wait, some of those are _words_?
20:21:05 <ais523> ehird: how did you not notice that?
20:21:10 <ais523> from the spec you linked me?
20:21:24 <ehird> AnMaster: writing.
20:21:31 <ehird> Asztal: fputs("\0\0\2\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0", file);
20:21:31 <ehird> _write_little_endian(file, img->w);
20:21:32 <ehird> _write_little_endian(file, img->h);
20:21:32 <ehird> fputs("\24\0", file);
20:21:34 <AnMaster> ehird, png is a lot more interesting
20:21:38 <ais523> writing's easier as you don't have to worry about compression
20:21:42 <AnMaster> also why do you need to write tga?
20:21:45 <ehird> and I'm at a loss to why that doesn't work
20:21:52 <ais523> AnMaster: because he doesn't want to write png, yet wants graphics output
20:21:54 <ehird> AnMaster: I don't care what you think is interesting, and because I want to
20:22:07 <ais523> I suggested RAW but he couldn't read it
20:22:11 <AnMaster> what is it that you are outputting?
20:22:53 <ais523> AnMaster: never heard of it
20:23:01 <ais523> although it's possibly a different name for .raw
20:23:08 <ehird> the header is the right length, I checked
20:23:17 <ehird> so my values are screwed up somehow, or the data
20:23:20 <AnMaster> ais523, actually there are two, semi-incompatible variants of .rgb, flightgear used to use the more uncommon one
20:23:34 <ehird> more uncommon = less common
20:23:34 <AnMaster> which was a pain to save in gimp, you had to manually select type every time
20:23:51 <fizzie> Uh, that \24 there is octal, isn't it?
20:23:59 <fizzie> While you probably want 24-as-decimal.
20:24:00 <AnMaster> ehird, more common -> less uncommon?
20:24:41 <ais523> I mean, they're both correct
20:24:45 <ais523> rather than one's better than the other
20:24:50 <ais523> I thought that's what you meant by the ->
20:25:01 <ehird> "more uncommon" --AnMaster
20:25:08 <ehird> "say 'less common'" --me
20:25:13 <AnMaster> ais523, ehird seemed to suggest I should use "less common" rather than "more uncommon"
20:25:23 <AnMaster> so I wondered if that was symetrical
20:25:28 <ehird> because more uncommon is a double negative.
20:25:35 <ais523> ehird: since when was "more" a negative
20:25:36 <AnMaster> should "more common" be replaced with "less uncommon"
20:25:49 <ehird> ais523: err, well, you know what i mean
20:25:55 <ehird> more uncommon sounds awkward.
20:26:04 <ais523> try "rarer", you can collapse it into one word
20:26:04 <ehird> less common is ... less uncommon.
20:26:05 <AnMaster> ehird, then you should use less uncommon too
20:26:17 <oerjan> ehird doesn't do deMorgan's laws
20:26:58 <AnMaster> I'm surprised he don't know about that
20:27:18 <ehird> err, I'm talking about language.
20:27:21 <ehird> and what sounds awkward.
20:27:36 <oerjan> "awkward" sounds awkward.
20:27:43 <ais523> ehird: the problem is that nobody here agrees with you, not even the other native English speakers
20:28:08 <ehird> ais523: you think "more uncommon" is better than "less common
20:28:09 <fizzie> Awkward sounds "to the direction of awk".
20:28:26 <ais523> fizzie: yes, it's the opposite of sedwards
20:29:21 <fizzie> I'd say "more uncommondededer."
20:29:57 <ehird> i asked someone who isn't on crack and they can confirm that you're all on crack.
20:30:14 <oerjan> but is "more uncommon" less uncommon than "less common"?
20:30:19 <fizzie> Being not on crack, how would they know?
20:30:21 <ehird> "It might be LSD or heroin."
20:30:27 <ehird> ok, so there is SOME AMBIGUITY here
20:30:32 <ehird> but I don't think no drugs is a possibility
20:30:53 <oerjan> only heroes do heroin. such as the taliban.
20:31:06 <fizzie> Would think the taliban use talidomide.
20:31:17 <AnMaster> <fizzie> I'd say "more uncommondededer." <-- :D
20:31:24 <fizzie> Oh, wait, it's with an 'h' in english.
20:31:28 * oerjan should note he is on neither, he just hasn't eaten yet
20:31:36 <ehird> fizzie: wouldn't you say "more of them uncommons"
20:31:48 <fizzie> I just might, if you keep that up.
20:32:17 <AnMaster> ehird, also I agree with ais523 on this question
20:32:40 <ehird> I could gather that, by the fact that you've both been arguing about it with me and saying the same stupid things.
20:32:52 <AnMaster> ehird, but you seem to think that "more uncommon" is more unenglish?
20:32:54 <ais523> ehird: nobody but you thinks they're stupid
20:33:05 <ehird> ais523: yes, well that's their problem.
20:33:20 <oerjan> AnMaster: you don't count, i saw you make a grammatical error just a while ago
20:33:22 <ais523> besides, "not uncommon" is more of a double negative than "more uncommon", and yet it's quite common
20:33:34 <AnMaster> oerjan, you mean "more unenglish"? that was just a joke.
20:33:44 <oerjan> no, <AnMaster> I'm surprised he don't know about that
20:33:59 <oerjan> that's what they all say
20:34:28 <AnMaster> oerjan, Actually you made an error too. You forgot to use a capital at the start of the sentence.
20:34:39 <oerjan> is this the tragedy of the uncommons, i wonder
20:35:10 <AnMaster> oerjan, Is that like uncyclopedia?
20:35:30 <AnMaster> I mean... wikipedia -> uncyclopedia, wikimedia commons -> uncommons
20:36:28 <oerjan> use the destructive uncommons licence for things you want _no one_ to have
20:36:37 <ehird> creative/destructive?
20:36:41 <ehird> that is not very ... opposite.
20:36:57 <AnMaster> ehird, no that would be less uninlogical
20:37:18 <ais523> so... in ehirdland, "creative" is not the opposite of "destructive", and more is a negative
20:37:38 <AnMaster> ais523, maybe he will say that uninlogical doesn't exist next?
20:37:46 <ehird> the opposite of creative would be uncreative. SHOCK HORROR.
20:38:04 <ais523> ehird: that's a negative, not an opposite
20:38:08 <ais523> what's the opposite of "less than"?
20:38:18 <ais523> somehow I think you're going to say "greater than or equal to", based on that reasoning
20:38:22 <oerjan> AnMaster: also, i don't do capital punishment sentences
20:38:50 <ais523> AnMaster: it was a pun
20:39:00 <ais523> "capital punishment" = "killing people to punish them for a crime"
20:39:07 <ais523> if you don't know that definition, the pun makes no sense
20:39:08 <fizzie> Those are opposites of different senses of creative; here's irrefutable proof from wordnet:
20:39:11 <fizzie> Antonyms of adj creative
20:39:19 <fizzie> creative (vs. uncreative), originative
20:39:19 <AnMaster> ais523, I *know* that. And I don' get it
20:39:26 <fizzie> INDIRECT (VIA constructive) -> destructive
20:39:39 <ehird> its not an opposite
20:39:40 <ais523> AnMaster: it's a reference to the capital letter complaint earlier that you made against oerjan
20:39:44 <ehird> it's the opposite of a related word.
20:39:46 <fizzie> The two senses being: 1. (13) creative, originative -- (having the ability or power to create; "a creative imagination"); 2. (3) creative -- (promoting construction or creation; "creative work").
20:39:52 -!- sebbu has quit (No route to host).
20:39:54 <fizzie> It's the opposite of creative in the second sense.
20:40:01 <AnMaster> ais523, oh I thought it was something far fetched based on *pun*ishment
20:40:26 <ais523> AnMaster: you were punning the wrong word?
20:40:46 * AnMaster waits for a joke about type punning next...
20:40:54 <oerjan> AnMaster: well it was that too, obviously
20:41:04 <fizzie> (Even the Principia Discordia uses the creative/destructive pair of opposites.)
20:41:08 <ais523> AnMaster: but my last comment wasn't even a pun, it was just designed to look like one
20:42:00 <oerjan> since i'm only halvway through my meal, don't expect my puns to make complete logical sense
20:42:42 <oerjan> hm what is type punning
20:43:04 <AnMaster> oerjan, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_punning
20:43:28 <AnMaster> it is stuff like: *((float*)&myint)
20:43:43 <AnMaster> there are less error prone ways to do it
20:44:04 <AnMaster> like unions, in practise every compiler supports "not accessing with same member" because everyone is doing that
20:44:29 <oklopol> your mom is pretty error prone
20:44:52 <oerjan> what the heck does that have to do with the word "pun"
20:45:42 <oerjan> oklopol: what the heck does that have to do with the word "pun"
20:45:54 <ais523> AnMaster: it's a reference to something ehird said ages ago
20:45:59 <AnMaster> ais523, that sounds like more unbad grammar to me.
20:46:05 <AnMaster> that is more like ehird defines it
20:46:25 <ais523> doubleplusungood grammar?
20:46:45 <ais523> anyway, I'm going home
20:46:46 <AnMaster> I haven't read the book but...
20:46:49 -!- ais523 has quit (Remote closed the connection).
20:47:20 <oklopol> oerjan: well you know, using another meaning of a variable in a sentence.
20:48:57 <AnMaster> on http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stride_of_an_array
20:53:43 -!- sebbu has joined.
20:57:53 -!- ehird has changed nick to ehird|away.
20:59:53 <oerjan> <ehird> [19:29:12] <kana> hello, what if time runs backwards and we feel it runs forwards ?
21:00:01 * oerjan has considered that before
21:04:05 <Asztal> I didn't see that one going!
21:07:40 <GregorR> One can argue that in a global sense time doesn't "run" one way or another, but that we perceive time as running one way due to causality. So, if time was running the other way because of causality, we would perceive it that way because of causality; whereas if it "ran" opposite of causality by some definition, that's irrelevant because causality is how we describe the direction of time.
21:07:52 -!- ehird|away has changed nick to ehird.
21:08:20 <GregorR> That is to say, there is no reasonable definition of time for which that can be true.
21:12:06 <oerjan> i think it assumes there is some "real" time which our consciousness moves along, and asks whether this could correspond with backwards travel in the sense of physical causality
21:13:33 <oerjan> i.e. it assumes a soul/matter dichotomy or similar
21:13:36 * oklopol suggests reading the bible
21:13:50 * oklopol joined ##christian and #jesus today
21:14:13 * oklopol is trying new things... ircwise
21:14:14 <oerjan> another possibility to make sense of it: imagine if our universe is a simulation inside another, which is running backwards relative to the outer one
21:14:50 * AnMaster invites oklopol to ##flyingspaghettimonster
21:15:07 <AnMaster> oklopol, also wth "##christian" but "#jesus"
21:15:14 <AnMaster> the latter one should be ##jesus
21:15:21 <AnMaster> according to freenode channel naming guidelines
21:15:32 -!- fungot has quit (brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:15:32 -!- fizzie has quit (brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
21:15:35 <oklopol> yes, and this should be ##esoteric
21:15:58 * oerjan swats AnMaster -----###
21:16:10 <AnMaster> then we could have cloaks like * [oklopol] (n=nnscript@esoteric/oklopol): Ville Salo
21:16:43 <oerjan> YOU REVEALED HIS NAME! YOU ASSHOLE!
21:16:48 -!- oklopol has quit ("( www.nnscript.com :: NoNameScript 4.2 :: www.regroup-esports.com )").
21:17:11 -!- oklopol has joined.
21:17:44 <AnMaster> * [nick] (ident@host): GECOS/Real name
21:17:44 <oklopol> AnMaster: yes, i meant real name.
21:18:09 <oerjan> it's been revealed before, right?
21:18:15 <AnMaster> * [AnMaster] (n=AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster): AnMaster <-- much better :D
21:18:18 <oerjan> or maybe not on channel
21:18:34 <AnMaster> I think you are correct Ørjan Johansen
21:18:43 <oklopol> i don't care about people mentioning it.
21:18:44 <oerjan> i am not trying to hide my real name
21:18:46 <AnMaster> * [oerjan] (n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no): Ørjan Johansen
21:18:46 <oklopol> i care about them seeing it
21:19:12 <oerjan> would i choose a nick based on it if so...
21:19:19 <AnMaster> oerjan, nor am I, I just care that any causal observers won't find out with a random whois, my name is easy enough to find anyway...
21:19:57 <lament> THIS LINE IS FOR EASIER GOOGLING. OKLOPOL'S REAL NAME REVEALED IN CLOG! Tags: oklopol, real, name, clog, esoteric
21:20:18 <oklopol> lament: shouldn't you have the name in that line too?
21:20:34 <lament> The name is in today's log, if anyone's interested.
21:20:42 <lament> Just scroll up a couple pages.
21:21:06 <oerjan> lament: i don't think clog is on google properly, i've had trouble searching, only a few pages show up
21:21:14 <oklopol> but i could just disconnect the internet if i wanted people not to see it.
21:21:19 <oklopol> it's not like i'm not in control.
21:21:31 <lament> oklopol: your secret is safe
21:21:44 <AnMaster> your secret is safe with the world
21:22:07 <oklopol> my name is not a secret, i just don't like you using it.
21:22:15 <lament> Don't mention oklopol's name in vain.
21:23:11 <oklopol> and they probably wanted a girl.
21:25:45 <oklopol> not that i know swedish, but still.
21:25:56 <AnMaster> oklopol, well "hitta" is "find"
21:26:06 <oerjan> it's not like you had to learn it in school or something
21:26:08 <oklopol> i thought it sounded a bit curious.
21:26:33 <AnMaster> well "hitta på <något>" == "make <something> up"
21:26:44 <oklopol> well i was pretty much a top student in all languages.
21:26:46 <oerjan> norwegian is "finne på", same structure and meaning of parts
21:27:02 -!- ehird has changed nick to ehird|away.
21:27:19 <AnMaster> oerjan, yeah I figure you Norwegians can understand Swedish better than we Swedes can understand Norwegian
21:27:33 <oklopol> AnMaster: please don't translate things twice to me after i fail.
21:27:57 <AnMaster> oklopol, you mean like "hitta på" <=> "make up"
21:27:58 <oklopol> i'm a sore loser especially when there's no competition.
21:28:10 <oerjan> yep, all swedish culture comes to norway, little goes the other way
21:28:31 <AnMaster> strange... why would it be like that, oerjan?
21:29:00 -!- ehird|away has changed nick to ehird.
21:29:39 <oerjan> not sure, maybe norway is smaller means we need to take from where we can find it
21:30:08 <ehird> <AnMaster> yes a mirc looser
21:30:12 <ehird> I get the feeling you've never used mirc.
21:30:12 <AnMaster> you lucky bastards, got lot of money from it
21:30:26 <ehird> mirc's a fine client, it's shit like hydraIRC that suck
21:30:37 <AnMaster> ehird, mircscript is worse than apple script..
21:30:46 <ehird> i'm talking about the actual client
21:31:13 <AnMaster> anyway I have no interest to discuss subjective stuff with you
21:31:20 <AnMaster> you just never change your mind
21:31:35 <AnMaster> (I don't often, but I sometimes do)
21:31:38 <ehird> yeah, how dare I not be convinced by amazing arguments like <AnMaster> yes a mirc looser
21:32:31 <oklopol> i'm at least one mirc looser than you.
21:32:50 <ehird> oklopol: maybe by amirc he meant american
21:32:58 <ehird> an american that is looser?
21:33:02 <oerjan> oklopol: yes, let's try and bury the quarrel in puns :D
21:33:40 <oklopol> yeah we can be like the messengers of luv
21:34:07 <oerjan> we have nothing to loose
21:34:43 <oerjan> hm we won that one fast
21:34:58 <ehird> did I mention AnMaster is an idiot?
21:35:04 <ehird> oerjan: now you can go some mor
21:35:55 -!- ehird has quit ("Caught sigterm, terminating...").
21:37:13 <oerjan> i think i'll have to loose that challenge
21:37:41 -!- ehird has joined.
21:38:02 <oerjan> eek, playing loose and fast with o's seems to have caused them to procreate
21:38:19 <oklopol> probably that's what happens
21:39:20 <oerjan> we should all be more.
21:45:27 <ehird> Deewiant: how about the fact that it WON'T PRINT ANY CHARACTER
21:45:31 <Deewiant> and also, fputs writes zero-terminated strings.
21:45:40 <Deewiant> ehird: stuff that doesn't compile generally doesn't do much
21:45:50 <ehird> shush, there was string after it
21:45:53 <Deewiant> zero-terminated strings are idiotic.
21:46:01 <ehird> idiotic like a hamburger.
21:46:15 <ehird> should I feel bad about trolling ##christian?
21:46:25 <Deewiant> yeah, like a hamburger. I guess. (?)
21:46:28 <oerjan> or was that a jelly donut
21:46:30 <ehird> Deewiant: exactly.
21:46:59 <ehird> OH YEAH MY TGA KIND OF WORKS.
21:47:56 * oerjan drops Poe's Collected Laws on ehird |====|
21:49:39 <oerjan> Transient Global Amnesia always works as far as anyone can remember
21:51:09 <ehird> hmm. how curious this is.
21:52:09 * oerjan needs to start typing slower than he thinks
21:52:18 -!- fizzie has joined.
21:52:39 <AnMaster> yet I have like 5 different ones
21:52:50 -!- MigoMipo has quit ("QuitIRCServerException: MigoMipo disconnected from IRC Server").
21:53:00 <lament> what's a good way to notate homophonic music in ascii?
21:53:03 <AnMaster> now all I want is like a um, openid manager... you know like a old style key ring app
21:53:13 <lament> i know what the possibilities are
21:53:22 <AnMaster> to connect all these openids in some web-2.social way
21:53:24 <lament> there's tab notation, there's lilipond-style text-based format
21:53:31 <ehird> AnMaster: or just... ignore them>
21:53:41 <AnMaster> ehird, that works too, but is less sarcastic
21:53:42 <ehird> you're only meant to have 1 openid.
21:53:44 <lament> but those possibilities suck, so my questios really is
21:53:56 <ehird> lament: invent your own.
21:54:16 <ehird> lament: base it on rotation.
21:54:17 <AnMaster> ehird, err, a lot of sites I do have normal logins on apparently also provide openid based on that login, Not my fault.
21:54:20 <ehird> everybody loves rotations.
21:54:29 <lament> bsmntbombdood: you mean in tab notation?
21:54:30 <ehird> AnMaster: they are not offering an openid.
21:54:36 <ehird> AnMaster: they are accepting openids.
21:54:57 <ehird> yes, you're only meant to use one.
21:55:09 <AnMaster> ehird, for example it turned out I could use https://launchpad.net/~anmaster as an openid... saw that just now
21:55:10 <bsmntbombdood> you can even put it on multiple lines and make it polyphonic
21:55:35 <ehird> AnMaster: you would be an idiot to use launchpad as an OpenID. who wants to delegate their online identity to them?
21:55:37 <lament> bsmntbombdood: what would the numbers mean?
21:55:47 <AnMaster> ehird, that is true... I wouldn't use it
21:55:59 <ehird> that's only the third time you've said that
21:56:12 <AnMaster> ehird, I was just reinforcing my argument or something ;P
21:56:22 <ehird> AnMaster: so why are you using electricity
21:56:30 <AnMaster> anyway, if you are just meant to have one openid...
21:56:34 <ehird> how do you know the electricity company isn't monitoring your secret files
21:56:36 <AnMaster> why do so many sites provide it?
21:56:50 <ehird> most people are idiots.
21:57:17 <ehird> ps you can host an openid yourself, yknow.
21:58:05 <AnMaster> ehird, well ps, I don't own any domain I know I will have in 20 years, while an encrypted backup of a keychain that is refreshed every week and for which I know the password...
21:58:20 <AnMaster> for some reason I trust that more :>
21:58:28 <ehird> 20 freaking years?
21:58:41 <ehird> i somehow very much doubt the www will be around as it is now in 20 years.
21:58:43 <AnMaster> ehird, hey, long now foundation is even more extreme
21:59:01 <ehird> totally different.
21:59:18 <AnMaster> why do I have to use relevant arguments?
21:59:27 <AnMaster> it is like boring, + not fair when you don't anyway
21:59:36 <ehird> erm, I do use relevant arguments.
21:59:44 -!- kar8nga has quit (Remote closed the connection).
22:00:00 <ehird> way more often than you, at least.
22:00:01 <oerjan> use elephant arguments
22:00:08 <oerjan> if people disagree, stomp on them
22:00:40 * oerjan stomps on lament |_|_|_|_|
22:00:45 <ehird> holy shit, stomp orgy.
22:00:55 <ehird> it's all my wildest fantasies come true
22:01:09 * oerjan stomps on AnMaster |_|_|_|_|
22:01:22 <AnMaster> Always wear a hard hat on IRC :)
22:01:27 <oerjan> i didn't notice everyone else started before i finished the foot
22:02:06 <oerjan> an elephant foot, naturally
22:02:27 <AnMaster> looked line some glasses side by side
22:02:46 <AnMaster> oerjan, more unvirtually you mean.
22:03:04 * oerjan stomps on AnMaster some more for disagreeing |_|_|_|_|
22:03:49 <oerjan> hm this foot is too small and easily dodgeable
22:03:54 <AnMaster> also that was a less uninstopdededers
22:04:01 <lament> |_|_|_|_| |_|_|_|_| |_|_|_|_| |_|_|_|_|
22:04:16 * oerjan uses an apatosaurus foot this time |__|__|__|__|__|
22:06:01 <ehird> Asztal: er, your routine produces upside down images
22:07:00 <oerjan> ehird: aw o+ au!j >|oo| hay+
22:08:05 * oerjan carefully moves away from the ehird black hole
22:08:39 <oerjan> and by that i mean you seem particularly dense
22:10:26 <oerjan> hint: it was a comment on your previous one
22:10:48 <oerjan> <ehird> Asztal: er, your routine produces upside down images
22:10:58 <ehird> was your text meant to be upside down
22:11:01 <ehird> I tried to read it lik ethat
22:11:17 <oerjan> well within the limits of ASCII
22:14:31 -!- FireFly has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
22:15:21 <Asztal> ehird: odd, I don't really remember
22:15:33 <Asztal> I probably only tried it on symmetrical images :D
22:17:12 <ehird> Asztal: in fact, it flips it horizontally too
22:17:17 <ehird> it swaps x and y coords
22:17:26 <ehird> in a 100 px image (99,0) is the top left.
22:17:48 -!- jix has quit ("...").
22:21:14 -!- FireFly has joined.
22:21:54 * oerjan swats FireFly -----###
22:23:56 <AnMaster> <ehird> what <-- didn't you once claim that was my typical comment. Fail.
22:23:58 <oerjan> hah, i knew they were legs
22:24:03 <oerjan> no way you have two mouths
22:25:52 <AnMaster> ehird, idea: unless performance critical just flip the image afterwards?
22:26:03 <ehird> i'd prefer to output a correct tga
22:26:11 <ehird> <AnMaster> <ehird> what <-- didn't you once claim that was my typical comment. Fail.
22:26:19 <ehird> I've been saying "what" for years
22:26:36 <ehird> it doesn't mean "what?" it means "i seeeeeee".
22:29:40 * oerjan notes certain things take on a completely new meaning then
22:29:57 <AnMaster> <oerjan> ehird: aw o+ au!j >|oo| hay+
22:30:09 <AnMaster> ehird, no it means "what" in that context
22:30:25 <oklopol> ehird could've been confused by oerjan telling him he's dense.
22:30:37 <ehird> AnMaster: I know what I meant, thanks.
22:31:30 <ehird> -----------------------------
22:31:30 <ehird> | | | --------------
22:31:33 <ehird> -------|---------------------
22:32:01 <FireFly> What's that? A gigantic swatter? :<
22:32:04 <ehird> a lisp cons cell. see http://labs.aezenix.com/lispm/skins/common/images/cons-chip-80.jpg
22:32:15 <ehird> it can probably swat flies too, though
22:34:45 <oerjan> more like swat elephants
22:38:20 <Asztal> I think TGA has two bits in the header you can set to flip the TGA in x or y
22:39:06 <ehird> | 8 | 2 | X Origin of Image. |
22:39:06 <ehird> | | | Integer ( lo-hi ) X coordinate of the lower left corner |
22:39:06 <ehird> | | | of the image. |
22:39:09 <ehird> | 10 | 2 | Y Origin of Image. |
22:39:16 <ehird> | | | Integer ( lo-hi ) Y coordinate of the lower left corner |
22:39:17 <ehird> | | | of the image. |
22:39:20 <ehird> | | | Bit 5 - screen origin bit. |
22:39:30 <ehird> | | | 0 = Origin in lower left-hand corner. |
22:39:31 <ehird> | | | 1 = Origin in upper left-hand corner. |
22:39:32 <ehird> doesn't help for the other problem
22:40:08 <ehird> didn't help either
22:47:36 <ehird> sure, it's a lisp machine
22:47:45 <AnMaster> ehird, wow, one cons cell per chip?
22:47:45 <ehird> an MIT CONS, to be specific
22:47:55 <ehird> that's just the logo of the machines.
23:03:04 <FireFly> Has anyone here played around with WireWorld?
23:03:42 <ehird> bsmntbombdood: ditto.
23:04:12 <ehird> end the scourge of computing slums
23:04:25 <ehird> bsmntbombdood: y'know, now I cannot die until that is done.
23:04:31 <ehird> i have temporary immortality!
23:05:46 <oerjan> as opposed to spatial immortality
23:07:58 <oerjan> from this we conclude that the clue to full immortality is to find a way to transport formalin faster than light.
23:23:13 <ehird> bsmntbombdood: iirc, you don't
23:23:20 <ehird> you offer the neccessary hooks for the language to do it
23:23:35 <ehird> bsmntbombdood: you don't actually run lisp on the hardware -- you still compile -- just it's an instruction set suited for lisp
23:23:41 <ehird> also, I'm not really sure
23:23:46 <ehird> hooks into finding objects, or something like that
23:26:10 <bsmntbombdood> you can probably make continuations nicer with hardware support
23:27:09 <ehird> bsmntbombdood: look up 'orthogonal persistence'
23:27:19 <ehird> it's totally suited to a lisp machine
23:28:52 <ehird> 14:56:22 <shrdlu-> chat bots are stupid
23:28:52 <ehird> 14:56:35 <shrdlu-> please stop talking about them
23:28:53 <ehird> 14:56:38 <shrdlu-> everyone
23:28:53 <ehird> 14:56:40 <shrdlu-> in the world
23:31:46 <bsmntbombdood> if the operating system supports it, you can do copying gc without copying
23:32:10 <ehird> a modern lisp machine would totally make me stop hating computers
23:41:02 <ehird> so bsmntbombdood. have it on my desk by tomorrow
23:49:08 <AnMaster> <oerjan> from this we conclude that the clue to full immortality is to find a way to transport formalin faster than light. <-- :D
23:52:12 <oerjan> and a little bit of special relativity.
23:52:56 <AnMaster> O, Wise Oerjan, would you please describe the logical steps to teach that conclusion.
23:52:58 -!- BeholdMyGlory has quit ("'night everybody").
23:54:35 <oerjan> Why, to get full immortality we must naturally have both temporal and spatial immortality, as mentioned above.
23:55:03 <oerjan> Also, formalin allows us spatial immortality, also above.
23:55:21 <AnMaster> oerjan, yes, indeed, but you got temporal immortality due to wanting to complete a Lisp Machine
23:55:44 <ehird> also, it was temporary
23:55:45 <AnMaster> "you" in the generic sense here
23:55:47 <ehird> oerjan was punning
23:55:54 <ehird> AnMaster: "you" cannot be generic there
23:56:01 <AnMaster> so where did you end up faster than light
23:56:04 <ehird> "but you gain temporal immortality" would be valid
23:56:11 <ehird> AnMaster: #esoteric
23:56:38 <AnMaster> ah of course... #esoteric explains it
23:57:01 <oerjan> By special relativity, space can be converted into time by a suitable change of speed. For full conversion, however, faster than light travel is necessary. Q.E.D.
23:59:23 <AnMaster> ehird, you still like small talk right?
23:59:30 <ehird> Smalltalk, yes. small talk, no.
23:59:33 <AnMaster> Visual Smalltalk: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VistaSmalltalk