00:00:02 (srsly) 00:00:07 ... 00:00:07 wut 00:00:14 he's on the wrong drugs, man 00:00:18 :) 00:00:19 Sounds like bullshit to me. 00:00:27 GregorR: http://lwn.net/Articles/262570/ 00:00:34 For values of bullshit equal to "rms said it". 00:00:40 It is very efficient use of his time. 00:01:08 yes well 00:01:11 im sure what he means is 00:01:14 he doesnt browse the web 00:01:19 which frees up a lot of his time 00:01:20 augur: Just read it, man. 00:01:22 i did 00:01:38 theres no way he browses the web like normal people do, given that. 00:01:49 no duh 00:02:46 no getting lost in wikipedia's web of links 00:02:54 this much is very obvious 00:03:47 ehird, what did you think about that music? 00:04:01 23:47 ehird: AnMaster: that song is ok. i mean, i like the basic style, but it's still of typical game music quality 00:04:02 23:47 ehird: s/song/track/ for accuracy 00:04:10 AnMaster: Might wanna expand that backlog. 00:04:17 You DID say something the line after... 00:04:33 "Even functions are functions! I invented this concept. Just like Steve Jobs will one day." — why the lucky stiff 00:04:36 http://hackety.org/potion/ 00:07:13 "Even functions are functions! I invented this concept. Just like Steve Jobs will one day." — why the lucky stiff <-- I'm not sure what he means with "even functions are functions"... But depending on what he means I think that has already been done... 00:07:23 It's called "a joke". 00:07:46 ehird, ah 00:08:07 author = 00:08:07 [...] 00:08:08 else: 00:08:10 '... probably Philip K. Dick'. 00:08:12 * ehird lols 00:11:16 ehird, I don't get that joke 00:11:24 I mean about steve jobs 00:11:32 yes I realised it was some joke 00:11:37 but I didn't understand it 00:11:38 AnMaster: That was an extra joke. 00:11:54 The first joke was "Xs are objects! Ys are functions! EVEN FUNCTIONS ARE FUNCTIONS!" 00:12:06 AnMaster: and Steve Jobs & Apple "invent" and "innovate" many things that they didn't 00:12:12 ah right 00:12:19 ehird, like the GUI 00:12:26 For instance, the Macintosh was the first GUI — invented by Steve Jobs — modulo Xerox Parc, and the team of Apple engineers who designed it. 00:12:28 Right. 00:12:39 (it=macintosh in the latter clause) 00:12:49 ehird, strange, but just 10 minutes ago I was reading about Xerox Alto 00:12:50 ... 00:12:56 scary! 00:13:17 Well, I mentioned it yesterday, but huh. 00:13:26 It was a nice system. I would like one. 00:15:20 ehird, I knew of the "Xerox being first" thing for ages, but I was reading about the actual computer model. Haven't found any good screenshots of it's GUI yet... 00:15:45 http://toastytech.com/guis/alto.html 00:16:03 Protip: When in want of GUI stuff, check guidebookgallery.org and toastytech. 00:17:58 Another example of Smalltalk running on a later model Alto or Star. Smalltalk provided its own GUI environment that included pop-up menus, windows, and images later referred to as icons. 00:17:59 This is what Steve Jobs saw when he visited PARC. Apple went back and implemented a more robust system and added pull down menus, desktop drag and drop, the menu bar, the Apple system menu, and modern copy and paste. 00:18:02 http://toastytech.com/guis/altost2.jpg 00:18:05 Lovely. 00:18:30 [[Xerox had no interest in producing a general purpose computer. They were, and still are, a company who's products revolve around the creation and use of paper documents. They saw the general purpose computer, electronic documents, and electronic document transfer, as a potential threat to their existing business. ]] 00:18:33 And this is why Xerox will die. 00:20:05 AnMaster: have you seen sketchpad? 00:20:15 ehird, is that the early vector thingy? 00:20:19 Yes. 00:20:24 ehird, think so tyen 00:20:25 then* 00:20:32 some video demoing it 00:20:47 Yeah; probably the one I got #1 on reddit for. 00:24:11 that toastytech consistently writes "origional" instead of "original"... Strange 00:24:52 Well, it is some 1996 site complete with "YARR IE 5 SUCKS" and animated gifs and the like: http://toastytech.com/ 00:24:59 GUI collection is very valuable though. 00:25:32 Well, it's not unupdated. 00:25:40 There's some youtube references and stuff. 00:26:01 (The above sentence being proof that 's isn't "is" in a whole lot of cases) 00:26:02 -!- FireFly has quit ("Later"). 00:26:46 -!- BeholdMyGlory has quit (Remote closed the connection). 00:31:31 ehird, right 00:31:38 night 00:31:46 -!- KingOfKarlsruhe has left (?). 00:33:05 "Intel's 34nm NAND SSDs launch in two weeks" —The Inquirer, 26 June 00:33:08 please be true please be true 00:48:18 WTF! Google result pages have quite a big margin now. Too much change. Do not want. 00:49:55 Intel also to launch 34nm CPUs in $SOON. 00:50:19 pikhq: Q1 2010 00:50:25 Or Q4 2009 00:50:26 I forget 00:50:36 $SOON is easier. 00:50:50 pikhq: But these SSDs are going to be really gooooood prices. 00:51:01 Heh. 00:51:19 Estimated is 320GB for price of current 160GB (~$630), 160GB for price of current 80GB (~$320), 80GB for ~$150 00:51:26 Which rocks. 00:51:38 *rock, I guess. 00:51:42 Bloody grammar. 00:51:51 That's approaching the prices I can see someone actually having one in their computer. 00:52:15 Granted, $150 could get you a terabyte with ease, but you're not exactly buying SSD for the storage density, now are you? ;) 00:52:50 $150 is an awesome price for 2x snappiness increase in common operations. 00:56:03 It's a price point at which I can see someone not spending heaps of cash on their computer actually getting one, yes. 01:03:16 ?djin (a -> b -> c) -> (a,b) -> c 01:03:20 ?djinn (a -> b -> c) -> (a,b) -> c 01:03:25 @djinn (a -> b -> c) -> (a,b) -> c 01:03:31 * ehird kicks lambdab— 01:03:33 Where's it gone? 01:10:47 * ehird ports the #haskell discussion of UIs here. 01:10:54 I wish it was feasible to make a good UI system. 01:25:53 * ehird nabs lost of ideas from Potion. 01:28:01 Also. 01:28:07 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rope_(computer_science) ← Ropes are awesome. 01:28:25 They do everything strings do, with direct indexing just being a liiiittle bit slower in some cases. 01:28:33 And then beat the shit out of them with sub-linear common operations. 01:28:33 COMPUTER BONDAGE 01:28:48 Constant concatenation (including prepending). 01:28:51 Logarithmic substring. 01:28:54 Logarithmic indexing. 01:28:57 Linear iteration. 01:29:03 (indexing is amortized constant, though) 01:29:18 (you could add flattening ropes into one node as part of your GC-esque task) 01:29:32 I wonder if ropes would be good as vector replacements too 01:29:56 There's a trivial way to make a good UI system. First, invent the direct mind-computer interface. 01:30:14 Second, you know the rest. 01:30:37 pikhq: You still need an in-mind UI. 01:30:53 But yeah, that's good and all, but I'm waiting for the singularity for that. 01:30:54 :P 01:31:20 `addquote First, invent the direct mind-computer interface. Second, you know the rest. 01:31:22 21| First, invent the direct mind-computer interface. Second, you know the rest. 01:31:38 \m/ \m/ 01:31:38 `\o/� 01:31:39 | 01:31:39 (_|�'�|_) 01:31:50 Dammit myndzi! 01:32:24 Woooooo 01:32:29 `addquote IN AN ALTERNATE UNIVERSE: First, invent the direct mind-computer interface. Second, learn the rest with your NEW MIND-COMPUTER INTERFACE. 01:32:31 22|IN AN ALTERNATE UNIVERSE: First, invent the direct mind-computer interface. Second, learn the rest with your NEW MIND-COMPUTER INTERFACE. 01:32:33 \m/ 01:32:38 No? 01:32:51 ehird: Ah, Dinosaur Comics. 01:33:04 /o/ 01:33:04 | 01:33:04 /�\ 01:33:13 \o\ 01:33:13 | 01:33:13 /'\ 01:33:19 o// 01:33:21 pikhq: You're an expert on Olde English. What would you ask someone for if you were asking for themself? 01:33:22 That is, 01:33:28 "foo: yourself" 01:33:31 Thou? 01:33:36 Thouselfst? 01:33:58 ehird: Þyself. 01:34:11 Hmm. 01:34:23 pikhq: But it's from the perspective of that agent. 01:34:27 Just like "foo: name?" 01:34:39 "foo: blah?" (is foo) 01:34:47 I am not sure what you're asking. 01:35:12 pikhq: You can ask an agent (foo) for things like: 01:35:14 "name?" 01:35:15 "age?" 01:35:20 "place of birth?" 01:35:22 "friends?" 01:35:24 "spouse?" 01:35:38 pikhq: What would it be for the thing that makes it give you the agent (foo) in Olde-style English? 01:35:40 i.e., "yourself" 01:35:55 In this context? "Yourself". 01:36:14 pikhq: But that's not olde! 01:36:24 (þou is the second person singular *familiar*, you covers all the rest.) 01:36:53 Fine, fine. "Yourſelf". 01:37:45 Bha :P 01:37:46 Bah :P 01:43:09 New! Drag and drop 01:43:09 Drag messages into labels and labels onto messages. 01:43:11 Your labels moved up here 01:43:13 To get you started, we put your most used labels here and hid the labels you use the least under "4 more". 01:43:16 01:43:18 OK 01:43:20 GOOGLE. 01:43:22 Don't do that shit to me. 01:43:24 You're CHANGING STUFF. 01:43:26 Stop it!!! 01:43:46 The four more aren't labels, just Starred, Chats, All Mail and Bin, so I guess I don't really use much stuff huh. 01:44:01 * pikhq hugs his IMAP 01:44:28 pikhq: I wanted to as well, but wake me up when you have conversation-style layout, flexible labels instead of stupid folders, truly awesome search, ... 01:44:44 I had a project but then I realised I was duplicating years of Google man effortt. 01:44:47 effort, even. 01:44:54 Also writing desktop apps sucks like shit. 01:45:01 I have conversation-style layout... 01:45:15 Not labels or awesome search, sadly. 01:45:34 O rly? 01:45:55 pikhq: That means "the emails of a thread in order in one frame, instead of hitting the 'next' key all the time and having to bat backwards and forth." 01:46:01 s/\."$/"./ 01:46:34 Strictly speaking, I hit the "Page Down" key to go to another email. ... And to go down a page in my email. 01:47:07 So what you're saying is threaded layout, not conversation layout. 01:47:09 That's not what I said. 01:47:14 Yeah. 01:47:17 Well. 01:47:30 GOOGLE HAS AJAX AND WEB2.0 AND THATS EVIL. 01:48:04 pikhq: I'm a less principled man than you in face of usability :P 01:48:47 I just have a radically different idea of usability than most. 01:48:54 ... Most of that idea involves telling programs to fuck off. 01:49:03 Programs suck, documents rule. 01:49:15 Unfortunately 90% of existing OSs disagree. 01:49:18 I want to punch said OSs. 01:49:26 (Smalltalk gets it, though.) 01:49:47 Smalltalk seems to get a lot right. 01:51:00 pikhq: BTW, know how you said using Plan 9 was tempting? If you use nothing but Plan 9 on your personal desktop(s) for a month, and actively use the computer during this time, I'll, uh, do nothing but stand by and idly be amazed at how either you're (a) incredibly flexible with tools or (b) amazingly capable of just playing Hunt the Wumpus and using IRC via a socket for a month. 01:51:03 :-P 01:51:23 by the way 01:51:25 !wumpus 01:51:28 :> 01:51:42 nescience: That did a lot. 01:51:45 supports multiple players who can therefore kill each other 01:51:52 !wumpus 01:51:56 Hum dum. 01:52:09 it's too much text to run on irc, it operates via dcc chat 01:52:19 you may be blocking them? 01:52:19 Welp, I can't use dcc. 01:52:25 Client don't know none of dat shit. 01:52:29 wat 01:52:33 your client sux :( 01:52:36 Thx 01:52:37 nescience: ehird uses a shit client, ignore him. 01:52:38 !wumpus 01:52:42 you could possibly telnet to it 01:52:45 it also runs as a dcc server 01:52:50 Ha 01:52:50 Sure 01:53:02 Client connects to Server and sends: 01:53:04 nescience: ip? 01:53:04 100 clientnickname 01:53:07 When Server receives this, it sends: 01:53:07 lemme see if i can remember the port 01:53:13 101 servernickname 01:53:15 2966 says the dcc request 01:53:16 Connection is established, users can now chat. 01:53:28 that's not the dccserver port 01:53:29 that's the port for that dcc session 01:53:36 o 01:55:52 i think the dccserver is 2421 01:55:57 ip 216.231.36.84 01:56:02 if it's not that, it's 2422 01:56:23 % telnet 216.231.36.84 2421 01:56:23 Trying 216.231.36.84... 01:56:24 actually 2422 might be a telnet interface 01:56:24 100 ehird 01:56:25 i forget 01:56:26 Guess it's not 2421. 01:56:33 crap 01:56:36 ports not forwarded, new router 01:56:38 Nor 2422. 01:56:39 Heh. 01:57:02 ports not forwarded, new router< 01:57:05 * nescience logs in 01:58:49 ok 01:58:51 try 2422 first 01:58:58 i think that's actually a telnet interface, forgot i had it 01:59:31 maybe not, it's a little weird 01:59:34 you need linemode i think 02:00:04 To enter the caves, speak thy name. 02:00:04 100 ehird 02:00:07 Egads, what a mouthful! (try a different nick) 02:00:09 "ehord" worked. 02:00:12 Now to spell it right. 02:00:22 yeah, i don't recall what that error is for 02:00:25 i think sanity checking 02:00:37 but i started in character mode telnet so it didn't work well, i got that error a bunch 02:00:46 I think the space kicked it off or sth. 02:01:26 pikhq: I task you with making unicode symbol entry easy in OSs. Plz make cent, forall and the like work, by searching fulltext without spaces (i.e. f,o,r,a,l,l) and with some reordering stuff. 02:01:28 Kthx. 02:01:30 (I'm trying to use jewnicode) 02:01:53 on an irc client, it colors lines because you see other people's status lines 02:01:59 allowing you to deduce their location and shoot them ;) 02:02:02 heh 02:02:06 fun 02:02:40 i have a map that has only 5 rooms and one that has like 50 02:02:51 and some various ones inbetween .. i have a lot of fun with that game on occasion :) 02:03:00 also there's a high score thing but i think it doesn't save when i exit mirc 02:03:23 I left :P 02:03:27 I have a short attention span 02:03:29 ew i got yellow 02:03:42 can't see that on white, oh well 02:03:44 time to go 02:05:13 bai 02:38:56 -!- rodgort has quit (Client Quit). 02:39:42 -!- rodgort has joined. 02:45:43 @hoogle random 02:45:51 grr 02:47:09 hmm 03:23:44 -!- oerjan has joined. 03:25:21 * ehird reads a Chick tract which starts by raping evolution and then turns to raping fundamental particle physic 03:25:21 s 03:26:21 it's so much easier to get your religion just right when you don't need to worry about the actual universe. *sigh* 03:26:48 What is a "Chick tract" and how is it distinct from a "tract" ... 03:27:02 GregorR: Jack Chick's special brand of fundamentalist bullshit. 03:27:08 http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/0055/0055_01.asp 03:27:15 Things that are not real: (a) evolution, (b) gluons 03:27:21 GregorR: Hilarious reading if you forget that he's serious. 03:27:22 .asp; SHOCKED 03:27:42 active shocking pages? 03:28:00 Among other things, he's claimed that Tolkien and Lewis were antiChristian satanists. 03:28:04 Actively shitting p-onscience. 03:28:07 pikhq: O_O 03:28:37 (Tolkien being a noted Catholic fantasy author, and Lewis being about as obnoxiously Christian as you can get while still seeming to have *some* grasp on reality) 03:28:56 pikhq: What grasp would this be? 03:29:00 HURR GIANT LION IT'S LIKE CHRISTIANITY 03:29:07 HURR LET'S WRITE TONS OF BOOKS ABOUT THINLY-VEILED CHRISTIANITY 03:29:13 I WAS AN ATHEIST ANGRY AT GOD FOR NOT EXISTING. THAT MAKES SENSE, RIGHT? 03:29:27 That was only the Chronicles of Narnia. 03:29:38 Actually the last one was his personal account 03:29:39 well it is hard to be an atheist angry at god for _existing_, isn't it 03:29:43 Most of the rest were just straight-up Christianity. 03:30:17 Though he did a nice completely non-Christian retelling of a few Greek myths. 03:30:46 -!- r89w3n has joined. 03:30:51 Tolkien was massively racist, wasn't he? 03:30:53 Hi r89w3n. 03:31:06 rationalizationamationa[...]wetn? 03:31:08 Not especially. 03:31:15 I know i18n, but not _this_. 03:31:43 -!- r89w3n has quit (Client Quit). 03:31:52 pikhq: wikipedia agrees with you 03:32:07 He was horrified by the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, referring to the scientists of the Manhattan Project as "these lunatic physicists" and "Babel-builders".[88] 03:32:13 I cannot, however, forgive insulting Feynman. 03:32:55 Feynman is too badass to insult. 03:33:41 Also too likely to crack your safe for the hell of it. 03:34:07 http://www.soapier.com/reddit_alien_molds.htm 03:34:19 Reddit alien + Bacon smell = übersoap 03:34:55 although I'm not sure I'd like my hands to smell of bacon afterwards. 03:34:59 Scratch that, yes I would. 03:35:02 GregorR: Reading the Chick tract? 03:35:08 I want people to think I eat bacon constantly. 03:35:14 They'll be soooo jealous. 03:35:16 ehird: Smell of bacon? 03:35:20 Merely *smell* of bacon? 03:35:30 pikhq: I don't want to have any more desire or I'll be handless. 03:35:34 I want bacon in my hands after I wash my hands! 03:35:39 unhandy, even 03:35:46 That would be truly übersoap. 03:35:51 pikhq: Just figure out a way to use ACTUAL BACON as soap. 03:36:02 YES. 03:37:57 http://www.chick.com/tractimages16113/1059/1059_18.gif 03:38:02 This is just so absurd. 03:38:36 pikhq, ehird: I wonder what their definition of "most scientists" is :P 03:38:46 GregorR: I wish I knew. 03:38:51 "Creationist '''''scientists'''''" 03:39:18 Also, I saw "vestigial pelvis" and though "vestigial penis", and went "WTF?" 03:39:37 http://www.chick.com/tractimages16113/1059/1059_22.gif ← This is how Christians die 03:39:58 Vestigial ... pelvis? 03:39:59 They look bright, happy, there's a ray of light and they talk normally. They reach out without any effort at all, and then they just kind of flump down, dead. 03:40:00 * pikhq doṫs hɨs ṫs and crosses hɨs ɨs. 03:40:02 TRUFAX 03:40:06 Vestigial penis actually makes MORE sense :P 03:40:14 The pelvis is totally useless. 03:40:27 GregorR: They do in fact have a vestigial structure that one could call a pelvis. 03:40:32 The penis also; who needs reproduction? 03:40:34 "Hip" is a more accurate term, though. 03:40:34 Who is "they"? 03:40:53 ehird: Penises are mostly exclusive to mammals, so no, penis != strictly necessary. Just fun :P 03:41:13 Where "they" refers to whales. 03:41:19 Yes, but our reproductive system is sorta wired to a penis... 03:41:28 So's your MOM 03:41:33 OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH, BEST SETUP EVER 03:41:51 XDDDDDDDDDDDDDD 03:41:57 MANY MOUTHS TO D MORE 03:41:59 MOUTHES 03:42:01 MOUTHIES 03:55:50 (I'm trying to use jewnicode) 03:56:01 i'm sorry, only Slereah is allowed to do that. 04:12:36 -!- amca has joined. 04:41:10 -!- oerjan has quit ("leaving"). 05:07:33 -!- comex has joined. 05:08:44 -!- comex has quit (Client Quit). 05:08:58 -!- comex has joined. 05:14:49 -!- comex has quit ("leaving"). 05:16:33 -!- comex has joined. 05:26:02 -!- inurinternet has joined. 05:27:44 WTF, Google Chrome advertises? 05:28:00 WTFl, there's advertisements? 05:28:11 WTF, Google Chrome advertises on television? 05:29:34 WTF, people still have TVs? 05:37:06 WAFFLE 05:37:55 CREAMPUFF 05:44:37 -!- Pthing has quit (Remote closed the connection). 06:38:57 -!- AnMaster has quit ("ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net"). 06:39:18 -!- AnMaster has joined. 06:41:25 -!- amca has quit ("Farewell"). 07:59:59 -!- clog has quit (ended). 08:00:00 -!- clog has joined. 08:06:39 -!- rodgort has quit (Client Quit). 08:15:15 -!- iEhird has joined. 08:15:35 you should fly in to a banana 08:15:39 like 08:15:42 flying 08:15:54 whoever you are 08:16:03 just go do it 08:16:40 well bye 08:16:44 -!- iEhird has quit (Remote closed the connection). 08:19:30 Are we quite sure ehird's not partaking in any sort of substance abuse? 08:19:58 sure? nope, not at all 08:20:26 he seems less crazy than oklopol though 08:21:44 -!- iEhird has joined. 08:21:59 fizzie I can assure you that 08:22:08 I am not not not not not 08:22:15 not not not not 08:22:24 not not not not not not 08:22:26 -!- iEhird has quit (Remote closed the connection). 08:23:10 -!- iEhird has joined. 08:23:17 not not 08:23:24 not not not not 08:23:26 -!- iEhird has quit (Remote closed the connection). 08:23:29 hmm, the last thing oklopol said was "this off it ->", and then he quit, after speaking of a chain of some sort, and that was on June 22 08:23:50 -!- iEhird has joined. 08:23:55 omg, maybe oklopol *is* Reiser in disguise 08:23:55 . 08:23:58 -!- iEhird has quit (Remote closed the connection). 08:24:15 best get going then 08:24:17 -!- olsner has quit ("Leaving"). 08:24:45 -!- iEhird has joined. 08:25:26 HEY EVRYONE WILL YOU IRC MAARY ME ABD MY NEXT QUESTION IS WH NOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ...in bed ...on a plane 08:25:30 not not not 08:25:43 not not not not not 08:25:46 -!- iEhird has quit (Remote closed the connection). 08:35:20 -!- calamari has joined. 08:38:01 -!- rodgort has joined. 08:55:41 -!- immibis has joined. 08:55:58 what kind of language has dynamic typing but no implicit type conversions? 08:57:22 -!- MigoMipo has joined. 09:05:03 -!- Judofyr has joined. 09:05:50 -!- Judofyr has quit (Client Quit). 09:07:41 -!- iEhird has joined. 09:07:49 immibis 09:07:52 c 09:07:56 python 09:08:04 wellc is dynamic 09:08:12 python perl ruby a 09:08:19 smalltalk.... 09:08:21 -!- iEhird has quit (Remote closed the connection). 09:10:10 -!- oerjan has joined. 09:10:17 -!- AnMaster has quit (hubbard.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 09:10:17 -!- comex has quit (hubbard.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 09:10:17 -!- pikhq has quit (hubbard.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 09:10:17 -!- Gracenotes has quit (hubbard.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 09:10:58 -!- AnMaster has joined. 09:11:35 Are we quite sure ehird's not partaking in any sort of substance abuse? <-- my exact thought 09:12:03 * oerjan abuses some mackerel in tomato sauce 09:12:21 -!- pikhq has joined. 09:13:10 when i said "what kind of language has dynamic typing but no implicit type conversions?" i meant that "1 + 2.0" is an error 09:13:12 perl - erm, "2" + 2 yields 4 just fine. That seems somewhat implicit to me. 09:13:32