< 1250726740 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: check the talk page, i don't know more than what would be there... < 1250726750 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't exist iirc < 1250726772 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :having some discussion on how to categorize things doesn't seem like a bad idea < 1250726809 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Esolang talk:Authors certainly exists < 1250726836 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[on Lisp Machines] "Put everything else on a networked file server - for example using NFS. That's much faster than the local disk." < 1250726923 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: incidentally the current consensus was _not_ graue's initial preference < 1250726944 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1250726954 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really like Graue's administration of the wiki < 1250726985 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well currently it's "don't do anything unless someone emails me to tell the wiki's broken" ;D < 1250727130 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heck from reading the talk page i'm not sure there _is_ a consensus < 1250727154 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, dmenu is fast < 1250727182 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is showing the latest entries, asking for input, in less than a second, when given 57838 lines of items < 1250727204 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1250727251 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, it seems all real edits of the Authors page are by graue, indeed < 1250727290 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe we should just ignore his guidelines :) < 1250727322 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he did claim to be summarizing the consensus < 1250727355 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, i see nothing wrong with the guidelines < 1250727359 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why "User:ehird" < 1250727362 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my name is ehird < 1250727363 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I, ehird, made it < 1250727365 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not I, User:ehird < 1250727369 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a technical detail of the wiki < 1250727401 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's because links to userpages should be marked < 1250727413 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's fine to mark it "ehird" if you link to an encyclopedic page about ehird < 1250727416 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not to a userpage < 1250727416 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: "links to userpages should be marked because links to userpages should be marked" < 1250727417 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION claps < 1250727426 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your logic is interestingly circular. < 1250727442 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, your name is Elliott Hird. And if you had enough languages on the wiki we would have created that page. < 1250727442 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's to do with things like neutrality < 1250727453 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people have more leeway in userspace < 1250727471 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: my name is not Elliott Hird as far as esolangs go. < 1250727479 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is ehird. < 1250727485 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the esolang wiki is hardly neutral < 1250727495 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most pages are written subjectively by the author < 1250727503 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know, but in theory other people could edit them, and sometimes do < 1250727508 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas editing other people's userpages is more discouraged < 1250727514 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so we're basing our policy around theory now? < 1250727538 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's that supposed to mean < 1250727558 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that we should make policy based on what actually happens < 1250727581 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1250727618 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't sound like a completely insane thing to want < 1250727633 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION bought a J book < 1250727649 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has fractals! < 1250727649 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: whuzzit called < 1250727651 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, K is better. < 1250727657 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1250727710 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :visualization, fractals and J, i took a 5 second glance at ToC, then ordered, i prefer surprise over usefulness < 1250727729 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's it called < 1250727733 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm this _could_ be a problem. ais523 would be a prime suspect of getting his own article now, but he'd scream loudly if we used his real name in it... < 1250727743 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*for < 1250727766 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: his name is ais523. < 1250727775 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's nickname < 1250727781 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: why does a name have to be Blah Blah? who cares what's on the certificate? < 1250727786 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your definition of "name" is outdated < 1250727829 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the thing is most of the older esolangers from before the wiki are referred to by real name, i think < 1250727841 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so? < 1250727845 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird is a real name < 1250727859 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rubbish and lie < 1250727864 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tradition is the key to happiness < 1250727883 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's rude to call people something other than they consider themselves just because their government thinks so, oerjan. < 1250727883 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a pseudonym < 1250727948 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or should I say it like this, Ørjan Johansen? < 1250727967 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are perfectly allowed to. < 1250727987 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, because you only have one name, and consider oerjan an abbreviation for it < 1250727991 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not so for me < 1250728045 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would be terribly annoyed if people called me Ville, not because it's a secret, but because it's not who i am on the internet. < 1250728053 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly < 1250728055 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance, Ville is finnish < 1250728082 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for all intents and purposes i'm nowhereish. < 1250728089 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1250728100 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: for consistency, I assume you refer to transgender people who haven't registered their change of gender with the government depending on whether they have a penis or not? < 1250728107 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has a strong "get off my lawn" feeling now :D < 1250728113 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after all, it's not their real gender; their government says so < 1250728120 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they just made it up < 1250728130 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION swats ehird -----### < 1250728140 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BORING DISCUSSION IS BORING < 1250728142 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's one convincing counterargument < 1250728154 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: no, it's relevant to my position on the wiki policy < 1250728163 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My name is Josiah "pikhq" Worcester, as far as the Internet's concerned. < 1250728259 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever. however "ehird" and "User:ehird" would still be two different articles, one a user page and the other community-edited. < 1250728265 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My name is Gregor "Gregor" Richards, as far as the Internet is concerned. < 1250728279 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, no R? < 1250728284 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: but user pages and article pages often have the exact same authors, subjectivity level, and non-neutrality < 1250728300 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so why the hell have such a pedantic policy leading to many little, useless pages that people just click on to their user page from? < 1250728304 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR would be just Gregor, but some bastard took that already < 1250728308 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also that's a guess < 1250728332 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably not true given there's not Gregor < 1250728337 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*no < 1250728343 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Gregor < 1250728356 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, somebody has that nick. < 1250728364 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I neglected to grab it when they first cleared 'em out. < 1250728369 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:32] Gregor: group < 1250728369 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[00:32] NickServ: Nick gregor is already registered to gregor < 1250728372 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ehird < 1250728378 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1250728386 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so maybe i remembered it and didn't guess it < 1250728412 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hard to say, since it's rather obvious as you're such a proud user of your irl name < 1250728483 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay IRL name < 1250728501 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :POWERWORD < 1250728512 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: you love your irl name < 1250728519 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do! < 1250728537 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what *it* said, when you asked it to marry you < 1250728537 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fun fact: The world population fits in about 33 bits. < 1250728544 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(July 2008 estimate 6,706,993,152) < 1250728556 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by which i mean something like "you should marry it", but one step further < 1250728558 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So one of your CPU's registers, assuming a sufficiently modern CPU, can hold a unique identifier of any person in the world. < 1250728560 0 :Guest89116!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1250728565 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Almost two. < 1250728571 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell 2^33 < 1250728588 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no EgoBot :( < 1250728592 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where's EgoBot? >_O < 1250728600 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: almost two? < 1250728607 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: 64-bit cpus < 1250728613 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so roughly two bist out < 1250728613 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: No, not "almost two". < 1250728614 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*bits < 1250728621 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, right < 1250728633 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude> logBase 2 6706993152 < 1250728633 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :32.64301898301364 < 1250728635 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: why not almost two < 1250728651 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless you mean "could pack to IDs into a single register", which is the much more obvious definition than what I was going with. < 1250728659 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. :P < 1250728662 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/to/two/ < 1250728681 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was wondering if someone would mistake that, heh < 1250728706 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait what did pikhq go with < 1250728723 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unordered, perhaps... < 1250728731 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: takes almost two registers < 1250728743 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: uh, it's trivial to order all human beings < 1250728747 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ah < 1250728749 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by birth time in planck times, say < 1250728770 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: erm, i'm saying you save a bit if you don't order them < 1250728776 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: except it's still "almost two" < 1250728779 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: howso < 1250728786 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need a 1:1 correspondanc < 1250728787 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1250728835 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: basic information theory, you store every pair twice, so you need one less bit if you don't save order < 1250728835 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :logBase 2 (6706993152*6706993151/2) < 1250728838 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :64.2860379658122 < 1250728849 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: = almost two < 1250728856 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: I don't follow < 1250728858 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1250728865 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: then learn basic information theory < 1250728880 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: just explain why you can omit things from a unique identifier < 1250728884 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only give the bits that differ? < 1250728889 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could be all of them < 1250728896 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: it takes 1 less bit to store an unordered pair of two persons than it takes to store an ordered pair < 1250728904 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1250728916 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...why < 1250728925 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1250728928 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :first order all humans < 1250728930 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because there are twice as many ordered pairs < 1250728935 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then, take all pairs that are ascending < 1250728938 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then number them < 1250728942 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, of course < 1250728946 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's twice less than the amount of unordered pairs < 1250728948 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: that means we can't duplicate < 1250728950 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(p1,p1) < 1250728964 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: that only adds a small extra though < 1250728966 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: we ignored that, complicates it a bit, but still it's about 64.something < 1250728989 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :me + oerjan = redundancy < 1250728994 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well (p1,p1) means that it must at least be as many bits as needed for one person < 1250728999 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't imagine storing all of them in one bit < 1250729008 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it must be >=65... < 1250729008 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh? < 1250729014 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I'm stupid :) < 1250729018 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are stupid < 1250729037 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_one_ person requires 32.something bits < 1250729042 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if we're talking unordered pairs, that is, sets, {p1, p1} isn't one < 1250729115 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: yeah, but what if the order doesn't matter but you still want duplication < 1250729120 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. futuristic marriage! < 1250729140 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then allow it, and you'll need slightly more bits than you need for ordered pairs that allow duplication. < 1250729151 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm yeah right of course < 1250729156 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry I misread everfksgljsdfjg blah I'ms tupid < 1250729184 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't worry, you wouldn't believe how garbledly i read your message just now. < 1250729193 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: slightly _fewer_ bits < 1250729287 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1250729294 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1x → (x,x) < 1250729308 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0x → pairs[x] < 1250729316 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`ls bin < 1250729317 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? \ addquote \ calc \ commands \ creatures \ define \ esolang \ etymology \ fortune \ google \ helpme \ imdb \ minifind \ paste \ quote \ runfor \ sayhi \ strfile \ toutf8 \ translate \ translatefromto \ translateto \ unstr \ url \ wolfram < 1250729330 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, reminds me of jot < 1250729344 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`ls /bin/g* < 1250729344 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: yeah :P < 1250729345 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1250729349 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run ls /bin/g* < 1250729350 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/bin/grep \ /bin/gunzip \ /bin/gzexe \ /bin/gzip < 1250729538 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: your mom had fewer bits before she duplicated. is my response. < 1250729572 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1250729585 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :penis-growing mothers. < 1250729621 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what, the only chapter whose content was mostly new to me isn't in the exam < 1250729628 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THIS IS AN OUTRAGE < 1250729662 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Go and complain, "This is too easy!" < 1250729674 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: j? < 1250729680 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, no < 1250729733 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MizardX: i usually slip those complaints into my exam answers < 1250729763 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's my exam style, annoying piece of shit whose always right < 1250729772 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, probably neither, but anyway < 1250729780 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"(toöluvku haanen!)" < 1250729781 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*who's < 1250729784 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shut up ehird < 1250729790 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does it mean in finnish xD < 1250729802 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing < 1250729805 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :daww < 1250729813 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't have ä or ö if you have u < 1250729815 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or o < 1250729821 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dammit < 1250729834 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can't have "vk" < 1250729842 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haanen is okay < 1250729850 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hyvää paivää < 1250729852 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"tuluvu haanen" < 1250729860 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a and ä can't coexist either < 1250729883 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's ää < 1250729885 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: better < 1250729894 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: but it's pAivää < 1250729912 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yäö and uao are enemies < 1250729927 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tuläk Universet Haanen < 1250729943 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm that ä should be just a < 1250729950 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: you can't end a word with k < 1250729955 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hyvää paivää i thought that means good day < 1250729955 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>_< < 1250729961 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tulaä Universet Haanen < 1250729967 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: päivää < 1250729971 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1250729982 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :äh < 1250729986 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: good y/n < 1250729990 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think Universet is very finnish < 1250729990 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also to me, "hyvää päivää" means "what the fuck" or something < 1250729994 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wouldn't use it as a greeting < 1250730011 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_o < 1250730020 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perkele < 1250730024 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: you should < 1250730025 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: tulaä has aä, universet sounds somewhat finnish < 1250730027 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just like party < 1250730032 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ehird: what the fuck! \o/ < 1250730043 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's only what the fuck if you use it right < 1250730063 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: Tulaä Universet Haanen < 1250730066 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, damn < 1250730068 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just repeated it < 1250730069 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1250730071 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ää just looks weird < 1250730087 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try to synthesize some polish < 1250730089 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: universet is actually norwegian < 1250730100 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: voljka protczneiw < 1250730105 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe swedish too < 1250730110 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*protczniew < 1250730120 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: like universe? < 1250730122 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: russian < 1250730124 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: means university or universe? < 1250730127 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm trying to get university < 1250730133 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :means the universe < 1250730143 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: rusvert kamput < 1250730144 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :university is universität or something in swedish < 1250730169 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: for sweden, herj tumasen < 1250730170 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :university is "universitet" in swedish < 1250730182 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also in norwegian < 1250730184 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MizardX: how sweden is "herj tumasen" < 1250730191 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*swedish < 1250730199 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: how polish is "voljka protoczniew" < 1250730203 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tumasen sounds finnish ;D < 1250730204 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MizardX: don't you use "ät" for similar purposes as well though? < 1250730211 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i mean for some purposes < 1250730215 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: norwegian is easy, you create words from english ones: centrum -> sentrum, electric -> elektrisk, universe -> universet < 1250730222 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: no < 1250730225 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: "tumasen" is finnish < 1250730240 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :herj would be norwegian for pillage or so < 1250730246 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: uhm, there lj is very not polish < 1250730261 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :volijka maybe < 1250730263 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but means nothing < 1250730274 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(imperative) < 1250730275 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and protoczniew could be a russian surname < 1250730285 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was going for like, zbigniew < 1250730298 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zbigniew is polish name < 1250730300 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1250730317 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: "tumasen" is the genetive of the diminutive of nucleus < 1250730318 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, zbigniew is always an old guy without teeth < 1250730326 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"of the little nucleus" < 1250730330 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: how about gasperowicz < 1250730339 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh that's actually my surname < 1250730345 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, I was fucking with you. < 1250730355 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :noticed < 1250730382 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MizardX: i'm sorry about never having acquired active knowledge of your language < 1250730390 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: those words are in the style of borrowing from latin/french, not english < 1250730401 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean that's just rude < 1250730406 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :english doesn't fit so nicely :( < 1250730409 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: tääimen < 1250730415 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :finnish y/n < 1250730429 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cholerni zjadacze majonezu < 1250730434 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: "ääi" doesn't sound very f < 1250730440 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en-gb&q=tääimen&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8 / or, russian xD < 1250730449 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: täämien < 1250730461 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: works < 1250730467 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\o/ < 1250730469 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :victory < 1250730485 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :means at least "of täämis", but "täämi" means nothing < 1250730518 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but but it's positively tääming with meaning < 1250730531 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Druidian Donogood < 1250730535 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could also be a form of the verb "täämiä", meaning something like "by täämi'ing", but the verb means nothing < 1250730545 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: hahaha awesome < 1250730557 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all you finns in here should call themselves täämien < 1250730562 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Oh yeah, I'm from täämis." < 1250730566 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I'm täämien. < 1250730567 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" < 1250730598 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"[How should I do it?]" "Täämien [it!]" < 1250730639 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tää emien täämimien täämien maa < 1250730665 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okokokokokokotäämienokokokokoko < 1250730682 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow it fits in so beautifully with the other letters < 1250730685 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(this land of täämis täämied by pistils) < 1250730695 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1250730722 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :finnish is a pretty manglible language compared to english. i like that about it < 1250730735 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okotäämien täämienoko okotä täämiö < 1250730747 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er darn < 1250730752 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*okota < 1250730756 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"In my small village of täämis we have a... sacred tradition, täämien[ing]; and I think before we get married, we should prove that we truly love each other by performing it." < 1250730763 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Sure, what do we have to do?" < 1250730782 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"[explanation of bukkake]" < 1250730803 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's oh so useful to be from täämis! < 1250730808 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :manglifyingly mangling < 1250730808 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In unrealistic fictional situations. < 1250730824 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: actually "sacred tradition, täämiminen" < 1250730834 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miminen < 1250730836 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :beautiful < 1250730850 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you meant "täämien" as a verb? finnish verbs usually end in an "a" or an "ä" < 1250730862 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you said it could be a verb < 1250730868 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[01:08] oklokok: could also be a form of the verb "täämiä", meaning something like "by täämi'ing", but the verb means nothing incompatible encoding < 1250730875 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: do you like "omimia"? < 1250730882 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess < 1250730892 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically i think it should be used as a verb that means anything < 1250730905 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the justification for that is that it's to do with the village of täämien < 1250730910 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no matter what the meaning is < 1250730919 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(where you grew up, naturally) < 1250730946 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think we've sidetracked a slight bit < 1250730954 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my proposal is excellent. < 1250730966 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean from the original heated discussion < 1250730970 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :about something < 1250730992 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :penis growing mothers, then you complaining about university exams being easy < 1250730997 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then I faked some finnish and this < 1250731012 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :before that, 2*person bits < 1250731073 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure any of those qualifies as a topic < 1250731098 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1250731105 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :before that wiki polciy < 1250731106 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :policy < 1250731108 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and namign < 1250731166 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds official enough < 1250731172 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's continue that < 1250731181 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: GET BACK HERE AND START FIGHTING < 1250731216 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION swats oklokok -----### < 1250731224 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION lobs a punch at (343, 89) < 1250731245 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :poor tuple, what did it do to you? < 1250731255 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it's the coordinates that I'm aiming the punch at < 1250731262 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. < 1250731280 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hit! Cruiser goes down. < 1250731286 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somewhere close to the north pole, i take < 1250732396 0 :Asztal!n=asztal@host86-169-5-210.range86-169.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1250732903 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want a bigger room < 1250732912 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm come to think of it i just want a one-room apartment < 1250732921 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mainly because it's hard to get stuff, because I can't put it anywhere < 1250733254 0 :Sneezle!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"good night, have fun o/" < 1250733375 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1250733592 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, of course! < 1250733986 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's obvious! < 1250733997 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but it didn't work. < 1250734007 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was also wrong! < 1250734017 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes! < 1250734756 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one of the fox jokes is a suicide note, i guess the mystery is solved < 1250734788 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_o < 1250734814 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this about _why? < 1250734877 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or someone else? < 1250734884 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f1:"have you noticed this book is basically written by a lunatic" f2:"yup" f1:"seriously, he's way too hyperactive, if he keeps up this frantic pace, he's gonna burn out real quick" < 1250734894 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes < 1250734896 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1250734901 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he said something like before 30 < 1250734907 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although i guess any age applies to that :P < 1250734909 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f2:"burn out? he's gonna shoot himself in the head by the time he's 30" < 1250734921 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alt says "out in the pickup truck" :P < 1250734928 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he doesn't look 30 < 1250734946 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so clearly he agrees with the fox < 1250735400 0 :Gracenotes_!n=person@wikipedia/Gracenotes JOIN :#esoteric < 1250736239 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: http://i32.tinypic.com/5nq179.jpg < 1250736240 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :discuss < 1250736278 0 :Gracenotes!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1250736285 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/9c5on/where_is_why/c0c7ss1 < 1250736290 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could all be false < 1250736448 0 :coppro!n=coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1250737474 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, codegolf has posted a new challlenge < 1250738133 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :moon looks blue to me < 1250738231 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i hear it tends to so, once in a *hit by falling anvil* < 1250738236 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*to do so < 1250738280 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1250738288 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was my joke < 1250738344 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then why did *i* get hit by an anvil? it's not fair i tell you! < 1250738422 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, who the heck got the idea of adding omega-3 to _bread_? this slight fishy taste... < 1250738430 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1250738630 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially as the mackerel in tomato i've got on one of the slices is nowadays advertised in norway approximately as follows: "Question: how many slices with [our traditional mackerel in tomato sauce] do you need to eat in order to get your recommended daily dose of omega 3? Answer: 1" < 1250738843 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer) < 1250738856 0 :puzzlet!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1250738904 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(after being approached by omega 3 pill _street sellers_ in town i found that advertisement refreshing) < 1250738911 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :headache < 1250738920 0 :puzzlet!n=puzzlet@147.46.241.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1250738920 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: hm? < 1250738926 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have < 1250738991 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and thus, alas, #esoteric starts getting decimated by the swine flu < 1250739076 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we will mourn you. even AnMaster, or else i'll swat him. < 1250739216 0 :Pthing!n=pthing@77-100-194-169.cable.ubr04.pres.blueyonder.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1250739390 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION hopes ehird just went to bed, and didn't have a stroke or something < 1250739401 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would have disconnected < 1250739408 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. < 1250739414 0 :pikhq!n=pikhq@75-106-100-121.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250739420 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT'S ALIVE! RUN! < 1250739462 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, you don't use a bouncer nowadays? < 1250739465 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1250739476 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never have. < 1250739491 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My computer is just on in perpetuity. < 1250739553 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yeah < 1250739568 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i might when i switch to a laptop so i don't miss things < 1250739623 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, if you usually drink coffee, forgetting it may give a headache. just in case. < 1250739631 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't drink coffee < 1250739641 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then you should. < 1250739699 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure whether caffeine relieves headache in itself, or if it's just the removal of withdrawal symptoms < 1250739703 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm addicted to pepsi < 1250739717 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, then that might still apply < 1250739719 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Both. < 1250739723 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i think i'm just tired < 1250739749 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i drink like... double digit glasses of pepsi a day, i should really cut down :) < 1250739755 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(note: low double digits.) < 1250739771 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Specifically, caffeine can be a good treatment for migraine headaches. It can also cause migraine headaches from withdrawal or excessive dose. < 1250739799 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hot chocolate made me feel alive after sleepdep yesterday; maybe I should drink it when it starts getting late < 1250741516 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: (after being approached by omega 3 pill _street sellers_ in town i found that advertisement refreshing) <<< i bought those < 1250741541 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i drink 2l coke a day on average < 1250741569 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and half a liter of $energy_drink < 1250741579 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I read that as "21" < 1250741583 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Made me go "D-8" < 1250741587 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :about 1/2 l here < 1250741600 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ 1 cup of coffee < 1250741653 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o < 1250741654 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o < 1250741654 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o < 1250741657 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's morning < 1250741660 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the morning has come < 1250741673 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :come has the morning < 1250741673 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Okay, *Americans* get portrayed as being crazy about their soda. You guys... Are freaking insane. < 1250741712 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: Isn't that awfully expensive in $NOT_USA? < 1250741724 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(though that portrayal makes some sense -- you can readily buy a ~1L *cup* of soda here...) < 1250741735 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i usually drink the 2l in about 4-5 hours, would probably drink two of those if i had an infinite supply < 1250741751 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: Gimme a price! :P < 1250741756 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm curious! < 1250741757 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well how much is a regular tall glass < 1250741764 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :60cnt/l iirc < 1250741792 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`calc 0.60 euro in usd < 1250741793 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0.60 Euros = 0.85446 U.S. dollars < 1250741810 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So about $1.70 for a 2L. A bit less for a 2L here, but not WILDLY less. < 1250741824 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does anyone know what regular glasses are called < 1250741828 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| | < 1250741829 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|_| < 1250741831 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no bend < 1250741833 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but that's the insanely cheap coke < 1250741843 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most cokes are 2-3 times more expensive < 1250741854 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Coke is a brand ... < 1250741866 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coke is a drink < 1250741873 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i mean cola < 1250741876 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coke is a drug! < 1250741876 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who knows < 1250741885 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :co* < 1250741901 0 :augur!n=augur@static-66-16-151-189.dsl.cavtel.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250741919 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this one is called "freeway cola" < 1250741937 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't give a shit about brands < 1250741938 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in my opinion pepsi is the best < 1250741955 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: I get 2L for ~$1. < 1250741955 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has almost all the cold blammo of coke and tastes way better. < 1250741957 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pepsi is a completely different drink < 1250741961 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im moved! :o < 1250741970 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least according to my tastebuddies. < 1250741987 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yeah, that was my estimate. < 1250741998 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: But everywhere I've been in Europe, a 2L of coke would be like 4USD, so $1.85 is pretty good :P < 1250742012 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: Fair enough. < 1250742020 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: it may be < 1250742023 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if so, it's superior < 1250742025 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you lucky bastards < 1250742085 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, we have Mountain Dew. < 1250742093 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is delicious and caffeinated. < 1250742104 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't it sort of like... citrus? < 1250742117 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they tried to market mountain dew here a year or two ago < 1250742120 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i get the feeling it's an...immature drink < 1250742127 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think it took off < 1250742130 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, cola, it's mature, one unifying flavour < 1250742132 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, but my favorite soda I have to import, so it's like $1.85 for a 20oz bottle :P < 1250742137 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`calc 20oz in liter < 1250742137 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you mean you have (mountain dew), which is caffeinated, or that you have (mountain dew, which is caffeinated) < 1250742138 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20 US fluid ounces = 0.591470591 liter < 1250742139 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mountain dew seems to be like an explosion of KAZAM flavours < 1250742142 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is jutst lame < 1250742142 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because we have mountain dew < 1250742143 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*just < 1250742148 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's a boring drink < 1250742153 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: (Mountain Dew), which is caffeinated. < 1250742162 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1250742167 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250742174 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh? eh? < 1250742176 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a favored drink of many a programmer. < 1250742177 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :answer me < 1250742189 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mountain Dew is disgusting. < 1250742194 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ANSWER MY QUESTIONS ABOUT IT < 1250742200 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: It is *sorta* citrusy. < 1250742203 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: Lies! < 1250742210 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: but is it mature and homely like cola < 1250742215 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: your opinions on this stuff are kinda useless < 1250742217 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1250742218 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean i see cola as being on par with coffee and wine. < 1250742223 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's very mature and distinct. < 1250742235 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :homely like a girl? < 1250742243 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dr pepper moreso, though it doesn't taste better than cola. < 1250742244 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: ... You sound like you've never had Dr. Pepper. < 1250742249 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha snap < 1250742253 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by which i mean you could be replaced by a regexp, since you only like two drinks < 1250742268 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: Wha, whyzat? < 1250742283 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: i thought you only like water and soda < 1250742297 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/GregorR/grep/g < 1250742311 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: And juice ... :P < 1250742311 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: *moxie < 1250742316 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Moxie is soda :P < 1250742332 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: anyway dr pepper is very sophisticated but cola tastes better and is still sophisticated < 1250742342 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: maybe i should have the non-hfcs dublin dr pepper? < 1250742365 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's good shtuff! < 1250742369 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: well stop liking it, you used to be special, now you're just really picky. < 1250742386 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: I'm only picky in drinks :P < 1250742399 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :oklopol < 1250742406 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, sorry, i was being a dick < 1250742428 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want to invent my own soft drink < 1250742437 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with lots of cinnamon < 1250742446 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yummy cinnamon < 1250742452 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: You need non-HFCS Dr. Pepper. < 1250742460 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: how about you buy it for me < 1250742477 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, but if I drive down to Dublin, I'm filling up the car and ITS ALL FOR ME. < 1250742485 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1250742491 0 :GregorR!n=gregor@65.183.185.3 JOIN :#esoteric < 1250742492 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's all drive there together < 1250742511 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Am I less laggy now? >_> < 1250742514 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I only have had the non-HFCS Dr. Pepper when it was shipped nation-wide for a couple of months...) < 1250742537 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: They have it at Greyhouse, a coffee shop near Purdue :) < 1250742555 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Along with delicious Puma Kola, made from real Puma blood. < 1250742561 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's all go to an Amsterdam coffee shop! And then an Amsterdam whorehouse. < 1250742565 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: You make a compelling case for me to move. < 1250742573 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ transfer :P < 1250742607 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1250742635 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll switch back to being a TA if you transfer and get into my class X-P < 1250742662 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm perfect soda: caffeine, water, sugar, cinnamon, lavender, ginger spice, vanilla < 1250742701 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Soooo, ginger ale mixed with cream soda :P < 1250742710 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: if it has bubbles and tastes a lot, i'll drink it. < 1250742713 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: ginger ale is like real ginger? < 1250742720 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: When it's made right. < 1250742725 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: When it's made right it IS real ginger. < 1250742736 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the good thing about my recipe is that it has no citrus < 1250742743 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :John Kemper's ginger ale will clear your sinuses if you smell it. < 1250742750 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm let's do brown sugar, not white sugar < 1250742756 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for extra yummy goodness < 1250742759 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Molasses in soda? < 1250742775 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :molasses is liquid < 1250742777 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's good about not having citrus < 1250742788 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: tangy and unsophisticated < 1250742791 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not as smooth to drink < 1250742800 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: So is semen, but putting that in soda would only appeal to a very niche market. < 1250742838 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i remember drinking half a liter of pure lemon juice in germany < 1250742838 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean the fluffy brown sugar < 1250742847 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thinking it was some kinda soda < 1250742853 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err not "juice" < 1250742858 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ... < 1250742866 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1250742880 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more like... what's the term < 1250742891 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: anyway doesn't my recipe sound yummu? < 1250742892 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't tell me :P < 1250742892 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yummy < 1250742901 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :extract < 1250742902 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :caffeine, water, brown sugar, cinnamon, lavender, ginger spice, vanilla < 1250742903 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mm < 1250742904 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: If you get rid of the brown sugar and lavendar. < 1250742913 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: why lavender, it's smooth and nice < 1250742927 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :softness++ < 1250742960 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: anyway have you ever had fluffy brown sugar, just tasted it < 1250742965 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's heavenly < 1250742984 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I have, but I don't feel it would go with the rest of that. < 1250742999 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anything goes with anything < 1250743016 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's add Brussel's Sprouts. < 1250743022 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1250743032 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: why wouldn't it < 1250743046 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's smooth, it's sweet, it's not tangy < 1250743050 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not capable of describing food combinations. < 1250743053 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd love a brussel's sprouts soda < 1250743064 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Jones makes one around thanksgiving. < 1250743073 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: In the USA and Canada. < 1250743078 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: You could probably get some online. < 1250743094 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it have bubbles? < 1250743095 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: It's enough to make you gag before you can even swallow any of it. It's quite vile. < 1250743098 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it's soda. < 1250743099 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: well, do you think mine is tangy or spicy w/o the brown sugar? it has no carbonation in it, for instance < 1250743100 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::O < 1250743105 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :holy shit, want want want < 1250743122 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Wait, wtf, it's not carbonated? I thought we were talking about soda! < 1250743129 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: DELICIOUS soda. < 1250743138 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: SODA IS DEFINED BY CARBONATION YOU FUCKFACE < 1250743142 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who says it has to be carbonated? Flat soda is awesome. < 1250743143 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1250743156 0 :augur_!n=augur@static-66-16-151-189.dsl.cavtel.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250743172 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: They make it as a joke, in case you couldn't guess. They also have turkey and gravy soda. < 1250743172 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without bubbles, tastes need to be even more interesting to be entertaining. < 1250743197 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: oh < 1250743207 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm insane, remember < 1250743211 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1250743212 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :caffeine, water, (maybe brown) sugar, cinnamon, (maybe lavender), ginger spice, vanilla, (maybe soda) < 1250743217 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's (maybe) delicious < 1250743222 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should make it < 1250743231 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'll be safe, right? :P < 1250743251 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I honestly think the only unsafe thing would be handling caffeine personally. < 1250743271 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.colawp.com/colas/400/cola467_recipe.html opencola < 1250743277 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has stuff about the caffeine < 1250743283 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OMFGSWEET < 1250743285 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0.5tsp < 1250743292 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: warning: cory doctorow involved < 1250743297 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OpenCola_(drink) < 1250743301 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sweet, /me dons his red cape and goggles < 1250743305 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :opencola was a company unrelated to cola, it was promotional :) < 1250743326 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Good promotion, though. :) < 1250743341 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it enveloped the company /shrug < 1250743351 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TOO GOOD. < 1250743390 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my mother was an "aromatherapist" in like the 80s and still uses oils a shit ton, so she'll prolly have everything i need < 1250743414 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(aromatherapy being basically entirely bullshit) < 1250743440 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they cost a shitload < 1250743481 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, and the recipe uses mililiters. < 1250743487 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eyp < 1250743488 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1250743493 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the bottles are so tiny < 1250743525 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.allproducts.com/manufacture98/islandspa/product4.jpg one of these bottles costs about £10 < 1250743534 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Neroli is a very expensive item, be prepared (US$48.52 for 5.00 ml) D-8 < 1250743540 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :usually < 1250743545 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jeeze. < 1250743560 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :opencola's been around for years < 1250743563 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes < 1250743569 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my recipe is uber-cheap! No neroli! < 1250743572 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Man, that recipe. You need eyedroppers. < 1250743582 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm accepting preorders now ;) < 1250743591 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm in < 1250743603 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it will be called Swig Ingest Drink: for Human Consumption < 1250743611 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll pay that 2x pounds you owe me < 1250743623 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ delivery < 1250743639 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure thing < 1250743692 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, alternatively, 5 euros & delivery, and you still owe me the 2X pounds < 1250743693 0 :augur!n=augur@static-66-16-151-189.dsl.cavtel.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250743698 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: sure. < 1250743699 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe, I'm totally gonna make this < 1250743712 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your choice < 1250743727 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not like I'll make a profit. < 1250743752 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since it will go in a real glass bottle! < 1250743767 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a klein bottle < 1250743770 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you make the bottle around the soda? < 1250743778 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: wanna up the price for the klein bottle? < 1250743779 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: how come you owe oxlopol 2x pounds? < 1250743781 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*oklopol < 1250743785 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: counter game < 1250743789 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1250743790 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1250743791 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he got to #1 from far down insanely quickly < 1250743795 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the pointless website? < 1250743796 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1250743798 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :remember? < 1250743800 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, I know < 1250743800 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: depends on the cost of klein bottles < 1250743803 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah, :P < 1250743817 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and what's the value of x? < 1250743823 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i don't remember < 1250743828 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's 20-something < 1250743836 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never remember what people owe me or what i owe them < 1250743853 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance this one dude owes me something between 200 and 400 < 1250743874 0 :augur_!n=augur@static-66-16-151-189.dsl.cavtel.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250743878 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: costly < 1250743883 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$56 for http://www.kleinbottle.com/top_mouth_erlen_klein.htm < 1250743887 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`calc56 $ in eur < 1250743888 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1250743890 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`calc 56 $ in eur < 1250743891 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :56 US$ = 39.3230812 Euros < 1250743912 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1250743931 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: You are horribly unrealistic. < 1250743933 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: if you buy the bottle you can have the drink free :P < 1250743936 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: that's just the 3d projection of one < 1250743943 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :! < 1250743943 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't you know, you can't *put* anything in a Klein bottle? < 1250743944 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...yes xD < 1250743951 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: you can in these! < 1250743968 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: No, no. It's a zero-volume manifold. < 1250743973 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in 4d space :p < 1250743982 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...klein bottles = time cube < 1250743984 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4th d = time < 1250743994 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By a quirk of gravity, it manages to not leak. < 1250743995 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1250744001 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can put something in a klein bottle the same way you can put something in a bowl < 1250744013 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't put things /inside/ the bowl, rather, you balance them on top < 1250744036 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.kleinbottle.com/top_mouth_erlen_klein.htm here, to drink, it goes through the handle < 1250744037 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously < 1250744066 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have the mug < 1250744074 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't buy them < 1250744076 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: nice use of $80 < 1250744078 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not < 1250744081 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION needs to get one < 1250744082 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're expensive and you can't really use them < 1250744086 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not < 1250744088 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're very hard to clean < 1250744097 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh < 1250744100 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's easy for them to develop mold and shit < 1250744101 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who needs cleaning < 1250744108 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And they're a zero-volume manifold! < 1250744149 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: anyway swig ingest drink (for human consumption) in regular bottle glass will be like, oh, 10 euros < 1250744153 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`calc 10 euros in £ < 1250744154 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 Euros = 8.60795455 UK£ < 1250744159 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe less. < 1250744200 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`calc €10 in $ < 1250744201 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 = 14.24100 US$ < 1250744215 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a specialist item! < 1250744222 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my cost-per-item is high! < 1250744244 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok maybe like 5 euros < 1250744247 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`calc 5 euros in £ < 1250744248 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :5 Euros = 4.30397727 UK£ < 1250744253 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus shipping < 1250744292 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :includes, like, stuff < 1250744335 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :includes sticker label that makes it look like what'd happen if you applied the chinese ripoff industry to real beer < 1250744337 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1250744340 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :less money talk, more sending me soda < 1250744352 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'll make it tomorrow and fridge it < 1250744362 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :prototype < 1250744408 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: then get enough shit to make about 5 bottles < 1250744429 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so hopefully in a few weeks, mail me some money and an address and it's yours :P < 1250744437 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll send you your owed along with it < 1250744471 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds really complicated, can't you just send it, and i'll pay you next time i see you < 1250744495 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1250744497 0 :augur!n=augur@static-66-16-151-189.dsl.cavtel.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250744520 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i say "yo
", you put money in envelope with address on and send in post < 1250744529 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :later, you get a drink and money in the mail. < 1250744553 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... does oklopol ever see ehird in RL? < 1250744566 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, although rectifying that would be fun < 1250744566 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: alright, which payment do you prefer? < 1250744586 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well i won't tell you for a few weeks, so < 1250744587 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: last time i was in GB i was 5 < 1250744590 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depends on how tasty it is < 1250744692 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it's tasty, i pay with the debt, if it sucks, i pay 5? < 1250744702 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something like that < 1250744716 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alright. < 1250744751 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: if it makes me spit it out, you pay even mor since you like that shit < 1250744755 0 :augur_!n=augur@static-66-16-151-189.dsl.cavtel.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250744759 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*more < 1250744772 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1250744774 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: now really, klein bottles are _easy_ to clean, since you only need to clean the outside < 1250744854 0 :augur!n=augur@static-66-16-151-189.dsl.cavtel.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250744854 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1250744863 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: :D < 1250744898 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: if you throw in a plane ticket you get an interview with me about it in person. < 1250744901 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also another bottle. < 1250744938 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lessons learned from Bear Grylls: If you're in the wild and you have to swim, always swim nude. < 1250744951 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Grill bears. < 1250744953 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For food. < 1250744966 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no doubt that he would, given the opportunity. < 1250745008 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've also learned to squeeze water out of elephant shit < 1250745033 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: will you be throwing in the plane ticket? :P < 1250745037 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.kleinbottle.com/Tantalus.html Also awesome. < 1250745041 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how much is it? < 1250745064 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"suddenly the water drains out through the siphon. (In Canada, Australia, and Britain, the water drains through a syphon)." < 1250745065 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh? < 1250745068 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: the plane ticket? < 1250745073 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1250745082 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no idea, like, 80 euros?? < 1250745086 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :literally no idea < 1250745133 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've been given a minimum estimate of 20e < 1250745135 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh siphon/syphon < 1250745148 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :both directions < 1250745156 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :together < 1250745172 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like summed up you know. < 1250745177 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so like 40 eur realistitcally < 1250745180 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*realistically < 1250745201 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe < 1250745231 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm teaching my children lojban along with english < 1250745239 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1250745239 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they will be awesome warriors of logic. < 1250745245 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you have kids? < 1250745247 0 :augur!n=augur@static-66-16-151-189.dsl.cavtel.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250745249 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD no < 1250745251 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean i will < 1250745253 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i breed. < 1250745262 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or adopt < 1250745332 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone else want to preorder swig ingest drink (for human consumption) liquid? augur? < 1250745347 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1250745357 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, you'll have to adopt. < 1250745372 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or get some woman who have you and your partner's baby < 1250745384 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless they figure out how to let guys get pregnant by the time you're an adult < 1250745403 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, because he's gay < 1250745405 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm gay? < 1250745406 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clever < 1250745407 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1250745414 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, youre either gay or a girl < 1250745421 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or ... not < 1250745422 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :take your pick fag/woman < 1250745425 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XP < 1250745435 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well that was just odd :P < 1250745441 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gregorr: i do my best < 1250745442 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw < 1250745445 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ive moved! < 1250745453 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: anyway it's caffeine, water, (maybe brown) sugar, cinnamon, (maybe lavender), ginger spice, vanilla, carbonation. < 1250745463 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds like soda. < 1250745470 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we heard! congrats out loud in case the silent ones weren't enough < 1250745471 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless thats a list of ingredients in order of amount < 1250745473 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in which case < 1250745476 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sounds delicious < 1250745476 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: swig ingest drink. for human consumption. < 1250745484 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bottle of liquid < 1250745502 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shame it's not Klein. < 1250745513 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: add cost of bottle and it is < 1250745533 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently you can make carbonated water with just a few 2L bottles, tubing, and yeast. < 1250745537 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Klein bottles are, of course, expensive, due to the impracticality of a mold. < 1250745546 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: And sugar. < 1250745553 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well yeah, but I'm considering that free. < 1250745559 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You need water too :P < 1250745570 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gregor: thats not carbonated water < 1250745574 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats beer < 1250745589 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : /moonshine < 1250745590 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: will you buy it, eh? < 1250745593 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: The tubing is to get the CO2 out of the yeast-sugar-water and into the plain water. < 1250745595 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: depends! < 1250745608 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sounds cheaper to buy carbonated water. < 1250745612 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: Out of the brewery, actually. :P < 1250745619 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: Yeast is cheap. Sugar, more-so. < 1250745621 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: like 10 eur or less + shipping! < 1250745624 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`calc 10 eur in £ < 1250745626 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 Euros = 8.60795455 UK£ < 1250745626 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`calc 10 eur in $ < 1250745628 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 Euros = 14.24100 US$ < 1250745631 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :prolly less < 1250745634 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`calc 8 eur in $ < 1250745634 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I can't imagine anything being cheaper than the above strategy ... < 1250745635 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :8 Euros = 11.3928 US$ < 1250745637 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds about right < 1250745641 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like $10. < 1250745644 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for a bottle. < 1250745648 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And when you're done, you also have a solution of ethanol. < 1250745651 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(high unit price :p) < 1250745685 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, it's extraordinarily difficult to by plain carbonated water without salt in the US. (And not even easy to buy it with salt) < 1250745707 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except for a few places e.g. New Yawk < 1250745710 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just buy literal soda < 1250745715 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and put it in water < 1250745732 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: btw my soda won't be caramel colour < 1250745734 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather, transparent < 1250745740 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretend it's water! vodka! < 1250745796 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want alcohol free vodka :\ < 1250745804 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lawl < 1250745835 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Here's how to make it: < 1250745843 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1) Take 10L water < 1250745849 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2) Put two potatoes in it < 1250745849 0 :augur_!n=augur@static-66-16-151-189.dsl.cavtel.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250745852 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3) Wait four days < 1250745855 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4) Remove potatoes < 1250745861 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1250745870 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1250745875 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds like youre making irish booze < 1250745895 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur_: will you order it! < 1250745899 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$10+shipping! < 1250745901 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ingest it! < 1250745914 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no. < 1250745924 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not, oklopol will < 1250745930 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't you want to be him. < 1250745934 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus, i thought you said =C=10? < 1250745936 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur_: Irish booze? If they didn't have beer, they would invent vodka, yeah. < 1250745937 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not $10 :| < 1250745951 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no i dont want to BE oklopol < 1250745958 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want to be ON oklopol('s cock) < 1250745960 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: i don't believe you < 1250745971 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur_: Don't we all :P < 1250745974 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur_: $ costs more than euro, duh < 1250745974 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1250745978 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh < 1250745981 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :8 eur = $11 < 1250745982 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur_: How very homosexual of you. < 1250745985 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1250745997 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur_: how about $5+shipping < 1250745999 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for an whole bottle! < 1250746002 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comes with autograph! < 1250746011 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats an even better deal, surely < 1250746025 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is < 1250746036 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't make a profit anyway since i'm not buying the ingredients in bulk < 1250746038 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh Bear Grylls, covered in pig blood again? < 1250746074 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I remember talking to this guy at a 2600 meet once and being turned on by the fact that he was running OpenBSD." —reddit < 1250746086 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did adrian lamo say that < 1250746094 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/9bwy5/im_the_daughter_of_lesbians_ama/c0c73w1 < 1250746119 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Kif: "Captain, may I have a word with you?" Zapp: "No." Kif: "It's an emergency, sir." Zapp: "Come back when it's a catastrophe!"" < 1250746126 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dude, Bear Grylls is eating better than me. < 1250746126 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<--- adrian lamo's autoreply < 1250746137 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^^^ even < 1250746144 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur is adrian lamo's autoreply :P < 1250746154 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :god dont even say that < 1250746158 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1250746170 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all i get from him is "come to defcon! come have sex with me! come to california!" < 1250746185 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so do it! < 1250746193 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would but im poor! < 1250746199 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :defcon wouldve been fun < 1250746201 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So get him to pay for your ticket! < 1250746203 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb junkfood < 1250746204 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1250746205 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then you're just literally a manwhore. < 1250746208 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hes poor too! < 1250746212 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur_: junkliquid < 1250746214 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you even know who adrian lamo is? < 1250746214 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for consumption < 1250746218 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE HOMELESS HACKER < 1250746225 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adrian_Lamo) < 1250746232 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that should surely clear things up with the money issue < 1250746232 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thank you ehird < 1250746232 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 < 1250746239 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, ehird < 1250746243 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Run ehird, he wants your boy butt < 1250746245 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur_: was this just an excuse for you to mention knowing a celebrity < 1250746250 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think so. < 1250746251 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 euro costs me $1.42 < 1250746262 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :horrible < 1250746273 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: not really! < 1250746275 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`calc 10 / 1.42 < 1250746277 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 / 1.42 = 7.04225352 < 1250746277 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, hes not really a celebrity < 1250746280 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :7 eur < 1250746292 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you watched TSS religiously < 1250746300 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, 7 euros! < 1250746312 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb junk food < 1250746312 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 < 1250746330 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :transexual sinners < 1250746366 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"ending a three-year period during which the U.S. District Court's ruling prevented him from exercising certain freedoms, including the ability to employ any privacy protection software, travel outside certain established boundaries, or socialize with security researchers." < 1250746388 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... If that's not unconstitutional, it's certainly against the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. < 1250746394 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw i like drinking vanilla extract < 1250746396 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not to mention creepy. < 1250746408 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's lovely < 1250746439 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :restraining people to within a specific region isn't controversial at least < 1250746455 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vanilla < 1250746457 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck yeah < 1250746476 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing: It's explicitly against the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. < 1250746485 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And reaks of Soviet Russia. < 1250746486 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which one < 1250746499 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Freedom of travel? < 1250746548 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(article 13) < 1250746552 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Article 13 < 1250746553 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1. Everyone has the right to freedom of movement and residence within the borders of each state. < 1250746553 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 2. Everyone has the right to leave any country, including their own, and to return to their country. < 1250746557 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTF BEAR < 1250746560 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i mean presumably < 1250746569 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You just ate some freaking pork, why are you eating a cricket? < 1250746569 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this cannot be in reference to imprisonment < 1250746595 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: you know that almost all of the government is unconstitutional? < 1250746597 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Duh. < 1250746606 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we'd be uber-libertarian if we followed the constitution to the letter < 1250746616 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Or have a much larger constitution. < 1250746628 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: not without explicitly contradicting the founding statement. < 1250746637 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in which case, fuck the constitution, we're ignoring it anyway < 1250746654 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And not uber-libertarian. Social programs are constitutional. < 1250746664 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Congress has the power to provide for the general welfare) < 1250746666 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in economics at least. < 1250746710 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sleep time at least, oklopol: tell me to make the drink tomorrow < 1250746714 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*without at least < 1250746760 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a sec < 1250746796 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll totally tell you < 1250746807 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: sarcasm? < 1250746812 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope. < 1250746817 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thx < 1250746859 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1250746891 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well maybe it actually was sarcasm, since the "totally" makes sarcasm explicit, working as a negation, whereas i actually am going to tell you < 1250746898 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe that's double sarcasm < 1250746904 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vending machines not working :( < 1250746904 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or like 1.5 < 1250746909 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :math is hard < 1250746931 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur_: that's what you get for moving < 1250746935 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything changes < 1250746940 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: wat < 1250746943 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::| < 1250746944 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shut up < 1250746952 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently the "right to a nationality" is a human right??? < 1250746976 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gregorr: makes sense in the term the UN is probably using it in < 1250746981 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except for jews < 1250746995 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur_: Ahhh, OK, yeah, that makes sense I guess. Context is everything. < 1250747013 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yeah < 1250747020 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stateless people are in a fucked up situation < 1250747033 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"nationality" in the governmental sense just means "belonging to some state or other" < 1250747051 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What if you are born in international waters < 1250747054 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not "belonging to their own state < 1250747054 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Poor people born and raised --- yeah! < 1250747055 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" < 1250747057 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What Slereah said :P < 1250747066 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :citizenship from parents < 1250747068 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesnt make you not a national. < 1250747086 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as pthing said, citizenship in most firstworld countries comes from parents < 1250747094 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing : But what if that state is DROIT DU SOL < 1250747103 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then barbarians < 1250747112 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, gregorr: interestingly there are some people who end up having no country < 1250747118 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was like < 1250747120 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this guy < 1250747127 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who got on a plane to some country < 1250747141 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and during the flight, his country was invaded and taken over and ceased to exist < 1250747146 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rendering his passport useless < 1250747157 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no im not thinking of that movie with tom hanks < 1250747179 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1250747188 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1250747232 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur_: did they kill him to avoid the paperwork < 1250747236 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A slightly tragicomic portrayal of this condition is the film The Terminal (2004), in which a man is forced to live in an airport due to his unrecognized citizenship status (his homeland had a military coup while he was in transit and the US government refused to recognize its new government). This story was inspired in part by the real-life story of Mehran Karimi Nasseri, who spent almost two decades in the Charles de Gau < 1250747238 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lle Airport, originally due to conflicts with French law (he refused to claim being an Iranian refugee) plus also the fact he was not welcome in his countries of origin (Iran and Belgium) nor his destination (the United Kingdom). He was eventually granted and served with French immigration documents, but subsequently refused to leave the building. < 1250747271 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh that's even cooler < 1250747290 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mehran_Karimi_Nasseri < 1250747297 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd love to live in an airport < 1250747305 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you would < 1250747307 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you nutball < 1250747337 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1250747359 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any big building would work for me < 1250747370 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...or insanely small, that's fun too < 1250747378 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now hes living in a homeless shelter < 1250747380 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how horrible < 1250747383 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he could live with me < 1250747390 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he'd be awesome to have around < 1250747410 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go to posh clubs and be like "ever seen terminal? this guy is the real thing" < 1250747444 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Reading the wikipedia page on him makes him just seem like a dick. < 1250747457 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a bit < 1250747458 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1250747517 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Hey if you come back to Belgium we'll give you new papers, then you can go back to the UK." "I don't want to go to Belgium, I want to go to the UK." "OK, that's fine, just come back and get new papers, then you can go." "But I want to go to the UK." "Or maybe you just want to live in an airport as essentially an 18-year publicity stunt?" "Yeah, that's it." < 1250747524 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im sure he could escape the airport tho < 1250747528 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :noone fucking notices that shit man < 1250747536 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something funny about augur wanting to live with him and him being a dick cuz you know gay < 1250747538 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, on domestic flights, anyway < 1250747553 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should do stand-up < 1250747563 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i totally see which strings to pull < 1250747568 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with my eyes < 1250747570 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: You should do get-punched-in-the-face-up. < 1250747580 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can pull my strings ;o < 1250747590 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haw, hawt < 1250747590 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, insult a random angry dude in the audience < 1250747593 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :until they hit me < 1250747612 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is now imagining an augur_ man-nequin < 1250749742 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :goddamnit < 1250749771 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this internet connection is useless < 1250749847 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing good on your internets? < 1250749899 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the tubes are too small < 1250749988 0 :ehird!n=ehird@91.105.76.79 JOIN :#esoteric < 1250750001 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh < 1250750003 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't sleep atm < 1250750012 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I'm still awake, too < 1250750051 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :party, ehird! < 1250750060 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ha, cool < 1250750063 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you validate my poor decisions < 1250750068 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in what way? < 1250750075 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to sleep in the daytime, like I did yesterday < 1250750105 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, I've been up all day and haven't slept yet < 1250750114 0 :augur!n=augur@static-66-16-151-189.dsl.cavtel.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250750130 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the day before the day preceding this night, I hadn't slept the whole night prior < 1250750140 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I know what, by having not slept yet, I'm getting myself into < 1250750146 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1250750149 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1250750154 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've been trying to go to the bank all week, but i'm always asleep while it's open < 1250750165 0 :ehird!n=ehird@91.105.76.79 JOIN :#esoteric < 1250750187 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1250750280 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I should adopt Uberman's, right now < 1250750318 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was considering going to bed soon, but with this group pressure :D < 1250750360 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) yeah < 1250750360 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it must be because this is an international channel and we live in different countries < 1250750371 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes, there's like, 3 hours difference. < 1250750379 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2 < 1250750399 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so is it 8 there < 1250750401 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or 4 < 1250750413 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :7:40 < 1250750473 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: just remember coming to finland will make christmas come sooner. < 1250750479 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so 1hr. < 1250750482 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for you < 1250750486 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so you haven't slept all day? < 1250750491 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's 1:41AM here :P < 1250750535 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1250750541 0 :augur!n=augur@static-66-16-151-189.dsl.cavtel.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250750547 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure i slept < 1250750576 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not during night time however < 1250750685 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: is finland really cold < 1250750787 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`google weather in Finland < 1250750788 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Displays current conditions for all major cities on one page, with five-day forecast and more detailed information for each available. \ www.wunderground.com/global/FI.html - [15]Cached - [16]Similar < 1250750797 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cool, I use wunderground.com :P < 1250750825 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder if they know what their name implies < 1250750847 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: dude that shit sounds kinda cold, it's like 18 C around here nowadays < 1250750852 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's chilly < 1250750869 0 :coppro!n=coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1250750896 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know the temperature, could check if i wasn't so tired < 1250750916 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: like 10C < 1250750920 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :greg linked me < 1250750928 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, HackEgo did :P < 1250750929 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: btw http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/1347/has-a-guy-been-stuck-in-the-paris-airport-since-1988-for-lack-of-the-right-papers, not as simple as you implied about belgium < 1250750948 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: All I know I got from Wikipedia. < 1250750960 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, but it's more nuanced than that even on wikipedia GregorR < 1250750964 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he couldn't just have gone there < 1250750977 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all i know is it's warm in a t-shirt < 1250750985 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ... at 10 C? < 1250750989 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what kind of guy are you < 1250750996 0 :augur_!n=augur@static-66-16-151-189.dsl.cavtel.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250751015 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i occasionally wear a t-shirt in subzero < 1250751149 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from weather finland sounds amazing < 1250751156 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you guys have a pirate party < 1250751175 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5ipwp8ekbh9qwu2I_5mBIGQBCNZ9w < 1250751176 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :12 hours ago < 1250751176 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1250751195 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: as of about 12 hours ago you guys have a pirate party < 1250751238 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well what do you know, i thought we've had one for ages < 1250751241 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have < 1250751243 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not an official party < 1250751248 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they got registered < 1250751256 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, right < 1250751462 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1250751561 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@97.118.125.248 JOIN :#esoteric < 1250751594 0 :nescience!n=myndzi@70-58-88-38.tukw.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250751663 0 :mycroftiv!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1250751715 0 :evenant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer) < 1250751744 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi guys < 1250751750 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi oklopol, ais523, oerjan < 1250751754 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even GregorR < 1250751762 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1250751772 0 :mycroftiv!n=drabgah@h69-128-47-245.mdsnwi.dedicated.static.tds.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250751803 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi mycroftiv < 1250751835 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi hi < 1250751862 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :party.... < 1250751890 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tired party in slo-mo < 1250751928 0 :MigoMipo!n=MigoMipo@84-217-5-129.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250751944 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: why < 1250751987 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1250752005 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because i am so tired everything is slomo < 1250752019 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm tired too < 1250752022 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sleep soon < 1250752269 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: green < 1250752285 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks < 1250752293 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ;);( < 1250752364 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::IIHJ] < 1250752374 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sleep maybe? let's see! < 1250752375 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauve < 1250752376 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-> < 1250752442 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no! < 1250752449 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you are validating my decision to not sleep yet < 1250752462 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-----------) < 1250752463 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-> < 1250752539 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: fuk yu < 1250752541 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: validate me. < 1250752564 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: 88cf5ba3488a2e27d329a495f9413e86 < 1250752572 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: deep < 1250752585 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what is that < 1250752597 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an md5 hash of your nickname, for validation purposes < 1250752603 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Ping reply from ehird: 1.82 second(s) < 1250752604 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :woah < 1250752606 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unnacceptable < 1250752612 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: you're such an idiot < 1250752615 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's usual ping time < 1250752637 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :usual ping time <1 second < 1250752637 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :me to oklopol is 0.71 < 1250752640 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: you're pinging slower than ehird < 1250752656 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hee, remember ec? < 1250752657 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[CTCP] Received unknown CTCP-PING request from ehird. < 1250752663 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: could you ping me in lowercase instead? < 1250752664 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: obviously, because my isp is a douchebag < 1250752668 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ask my client < 1250752669 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there may be something weird about my client < 1250752698 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, ec just "headdesks repeatedly until he bleeds from the forehead", which makes me happy and joy < 1250752699 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... but if I ping you in capitals, I still get a time bac < 1250752700 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*back < 1250752702 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\o/ < 1250752710 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm such a dick < 1250752710 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, why does my client not like your pings? < 1250752721 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it accepts me pinging myself < 1250752731 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: just got 11 unknown CTCP-PINGs in a row < 1250752735 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the last was in lowecase < 1250752738 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was me hitting the button, then me doing /ctcp < 1250752747 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something weird is going on here < 1250752753 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, anuses < 1250752768 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: try again, I've turned the raw log on < 1250752777 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, if anybody wants to golf something: while(){if($l++){print substr $_,0,$r;print substr($_,$r,$e-$r)x$ARGV[0];print substr $_,$e}else{$r=index $_,"*";$e=index $_,"\$",$r}} < 1250752784 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: ...in K? < 1250752787 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure! < 1250752803 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, such hard thinking for tiredness < 1250752804 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can persist < 1250752817 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: describe what it does < 1250752826 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>> :ais523!n=ais523@92-236-187-64.cable.ubr08.king.blueyonder.co.uk PRIVMSG ais523 :PING 1250749170 || >> :ehird!n=ehird@91.105.76.79 PRIVMSG ais523 :ping < 1250752830 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite a difference < 1250752846 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, when I do /ctcp ais523 ping, it adds an argument to the ping < 1250752853 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, it doesn't accept ping without an argument for some reason < 1250752868 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's fine with a silly argument < 1250752882 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: so what's it do < 1250752895 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shouldn't be too hard to figure out < 1250752907 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: it's 7am, tell me :| < 1250752909 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have to go to work now so I can't explain it for about an hour -> < 1250752912 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: we're all sleep-deprived here < 1250752913 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can create, i can't comprefuck you < 1250752939 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder if drugs make you this stupid < 1250753007 0 :kwertii!n=kwertii@67.180.202.175 JOIN :#esoteric < 1250753019 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii! < 1250753025 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm dworacky < 1250753038 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereforth dost thou cometh < 1250753057 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhhhh.... in search of esotericism < 1250753064 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the magic kind? < 1250753066 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1250753076 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION glances at your channel list < 1250753078 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1250753080 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems a bit programming-biased to me. < 1250753088 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. I am a programmer :) < 1250753093 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :usually the people who come in here expecting esotericism have no other channels. < 1250753115 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: alas, the general consensus here is, I imagine, that esotericism is a load of bullshit. we play around with esoteric programming languages. < 1250753138 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, swing and a miss < 1250753155 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, I know. I've been here before :) < 1250753166 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm perhaps, I haven't slept < 1250753167 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1250753181 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: was it a joke then, i really can't tell atm < 1250753189 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh,... nope < 1250753200 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...so why come to a channel that you know doesn't cater to what you want? < 1250753217 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the contrary; I came to a channel that I know does cater to what I want. esoteric programming language discussion. < 1250753251 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you said the magic kind of esotericism < 1250753260 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: we don't usually do esoteric magic rituals to create our languages, do we? < 1250753264 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no.. I just said esotericism < 1250753276 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :08:24 ehird> the magic kind? < 1250753277 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :08:24 kwertii> yes. < 1250753277 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which can easily apply to programming languages < 1250753283 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, this is strictly the programming kind < 1250753287 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GUILTY AS CHARGED < 1250753293 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have to make Druidcode now. < 1250753298 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WE WILL FOREVER CROSS BOUNDARIES < 1250753298 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: heh < 1250753302 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :programming languages can be magic. < 1250753302 0 :puzzlet!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1250753307 0 :puzzlet!n=puzzlet@147.46.241.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1250753311 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: you tricksy guy :) < 1250753315 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't see a firm distinction there < 1250753325 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esotericism FYI < 1250753330 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, I'm aware < 1250753337 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the compiler checks GPS to see if you're at stonehenge and errors out if you're not < 1250753355 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that could be kind-of tricky < 1250753369 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially as I have reams of fake gpsd data, not from stonehenge though < 1250753384 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it buys an iphone 3g s for you, so no cheating < 1250753399 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think hexham should count, with that name < 1250753418 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we only use magic to make ham sandwiches < 1250753460 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds very ham-fisted < 1250753501 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Conjuring some sleep, now" < 1250753954 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: good pba solution < 1250753969 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks < 1250754079 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so.. what's going on in the esoteric programming world? < 1250754080 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, slept well? < 1250754088 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: haven't slept yet, like ais523 < 1250754089 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :morning ais523 < 1250754094 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :morning < 1250754094 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh uh < 1250754100 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this sounds dangerous < 1250754107 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, we could DIE. < 1250754117 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION watches ata exceptions during resume from disk < 1250754121 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yet, it seems to work < 1250754121 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, that. < 1250754128 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'm a bit scared by it < 1250754128 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they usually mean nothing ime < 1250754135 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :linux is buggy :) < 1250754159 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, there seems to be some reports about data loss on ext4 related to suspend to ram though < 1250754164 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on certain chipsets < 1250754169 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like the chipset in this laptop < 1250754301 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mmh... I want a lisp machine... < 1250754324 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, who doesn't? < 1250754329 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :idiots < 1250754343 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, you can get one for $675 < 1250754354 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought of buying a Lisp machine back when I had money before I went back to school... till I realized it was the size and heat output of a small refrigerator and the CPU was slower than the one on my phone < 1250754371 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so... it's not like they're impossible to afford... but while spending a thousand bucks on a new computer seems fine, an old lisp machine... < 1250754381 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: 9 x 18 x 25 inches dimensions < 1250754383 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not too big < 1250754385 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the old machines) < 1250754398 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :70 pounds though = 31 kg < 1250754400 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's about as heavy as me < 1250754408 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: really? ok, I dunno what I was looking at. it seemed unreasonable in any case :) maybe it was the weight. < 1250754417 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: probably the newer models < 1250754420 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they cost $3,000+ < 1250754421 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or < 1250754424 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the macivory < 1250754426 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, 31 kg? < 1250754428 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they're just macs running the emulator < 1250754430 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow you are light < 1250754432 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really light < 1250754434 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yep, I'm like 35kg or something < 1250754441 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe 37 now, tops < 1250754460 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I'm slightly more than twice as heavy :P < 1250754462 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: but no doubt they're slow and noisy < 1250754469 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very noisy - the standard solution was to run loooooong cables < 1250754469 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(82 kg last I checked) < 1250754479 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: the gem is in the OS and the architecture < 1250754488 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: can't you emulate it? < 1250754498 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the OS, yes, the architecture, no < 1250754506 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :symbolics machines were very much all-the-way-down < 1250754511 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything was pervasive < 1250754602 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: http://sfxbros.blog.so-net.ne.jp/_images/blog/_7c2/sfxbros/symbolics-3620-053.jpg a 3620 < 1250754609 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :including symbolics keyboard, mouse and screen < 1250754623 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting.. about what year is that? < 1250754624 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(they actually made their own screens iirc) < 1250754631 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: 80something, of course < 1250754634 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's SLOW < 1250754641 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: they use ESDI disks < 1250754644 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a precursor to SCSI < 1250754645 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does it do at the sub-OS level that's cool? < 1250754672 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: the architecture is lispy, it has built-in support for tagged pointers, helpers, iirc, for GC, ... < 1250754683 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cdr coding < 1250754686 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hardware GC? awesome < 1250754691 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: not hardware GC < 1250754693 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but support for it < 1250754700 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the actual gc was at OS level, using the hardware support < 1250754708 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: but it has instructions to do taggedp ointers < 1250754710 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what kind of CPU? < 1250754721 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd do the operation on the pointer, while simultaneously checking the tag < 1250754729 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: custom, of course! < 1250754734 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what made them lisp machines < 1250754755 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: in fact, they made everything themselves, apart from iirc the keyboard material < 1250754765 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :despite making all their screen mechanics, they decided that was just too much < 1250754795 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently, they're really, really loud and power hungry the 36xx series < 1250754810 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the macivory machines arne't lisp machines, so lame, and the XL machine is both loud and costs $3,500 and is huge < 1250754812 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*aren't < 1250754818 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: http://www.lispmachine.net/symbolics.txt btw < 1250754829 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"If you really want a collector's item, we have a number of different 36xx" is the line about the machines i'm talking about < 1250754832 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :weigh up to 400 pounds! < 1250754839 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(AnMaster: 181kg) < 1250754840 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh. you could emulate all that hardware... < 1250754849 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: no shit < 1250754855 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are lisp machine emulators < 1250754865 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, heh < 1250754871 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I suggested this a minute ago and you said "the OS yes but not the rest" < 1250754880 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: you can emulate everything of course < 1250754884 0 :FireFly!n=FireFly@1-1-3-36a.tul.sth.bostream.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1250754886 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not the experience < 1250754889 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahh < 1250754896 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if there's a layer below, that's a limitation < 1250754901 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a lisp machine, everything is there at every level < 1250754903 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an emulator won't keep your coffee cup warm < 1250754922 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or have the cops show up thinking you're growing marijuana in your closet from your power bill.. < 1250754927 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1250754947 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: just get a bunch of them. the power bill software is written in c < 1250754949 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it'll overflow < 1250755196 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.ehird so what do you think of Clojure? < 1250755199 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1250755200 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1250755205 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it basically sucks. < 1250755215 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.. any particular reason? < 1250755236 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i could write a book about it, but i haven't slept yet so i'm not going to < 1250755241 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1250755286 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it fixes my #1 problem with CL, the lack of libraries, and the #2 problem, the massive spec bloat deriving from design-by-committee < 1250755304 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I admit I haven't done any nontrivial projects with it yet, so I don't know how well it will hold up < 1250755318 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess, if you're a practicalist who can deal with the vomit-worthy pile of stench that is using java, then it's fine < 1250755320 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm an idealist who can't < 1250755331 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Java runtime != Java the language < 1250755339 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well aware, thank you < 1250755352 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the runtime and associated baggage nontheless exists and i find it intolerable < 1250755353 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't get me wrong, I'd prefer something that compiled to machine code if it were available... < 1250755439 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't see lisp as the future < 1250755448 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it compromises the common usability for the less common usability of macros < 1250755460 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :agree < 1250755460 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the macros should be slightly more awkward than coding; lisp gets this dead backwards < 1250755486 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1250755486 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like my syntax < 1250755495 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right now (as others here can attest) I'm obsessed with the K language < 1250755506 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CL is frozen in 1984 or so, which is part of the problem, and Scheme devs are more into writing cool recursive fractal algorithms than actually, say, interacting with a user < 1250755521 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like fractals < 1250755525 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :me too < 1250755552 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you know of a job where you get paid to write fractals, pls let me know :) < 1250755566 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay, a language that's good for getting jobs! < 1250755572 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm switching to C++. < 1250755579 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh. manual memory alloc < 1250755581 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, s/C++/Java/ these days :/ < 1250755584 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or wait < 1250755588 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe VB.NET by now? < 1250755589 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: but we're discussing java < 1250755592 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hate having a job as much as the next guy, but I gotta pay the rent... < 1250755592 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: gets jobs < 1250755593 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, oh right < 1250755595 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jobs are nice < 1250755609 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :job security especially from all the pointless unmaintainable code you'll inevitably write. < 1250755609 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ideally I'd rather not be stuck using a suck language for it < 1250755631 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would never write software products anyway, only backend code < 1250755639 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it doesn't bother me much < 1250755681 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i have concluded that the selling of unscarce goods like software is at best pointless (as it can be, morally, made more or less impossible) or worst immoral) < 1250755702 0 :CESSMASTER!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1250755712 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: couldn't agree more. but alas, I'm not independently wealthy, so I am forced to vend my labor at the crass altar of capitalism.. :( < 1250755725 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't mind capitalism. < 1250755729 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but selling software contradicts capitalism. < 1250755734 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :capitalism is about scarce goods < 1250755760 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: if someone would pay me to write GPL code, I'd be fine with that < 1250755767 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i'm crazily principled and as of yet under the age of employment, so what do i know :) < 1250755769 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: gpl :( < 1250755784 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/gpl//g < 1250755807 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ideally there'd be no copyright and I wouldn't have to license things... but, MIT < 1250755811 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, I remember that... under age of employment.. that was nice < 1250755828 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nowadays if I don't get money, I starve. that would suck. a lot. < 1250755828 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite < 1250755833 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :starving is quite bad < 1250755846 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though it's easy to not starve < 1250755853 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :harder to do the rest < 1250755858 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've also grown fond of sleeping indoors < 1250755869 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what country do you live in? < 1250755875 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :USA, SF, California < 1250755887 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you? < 1250755906 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the uk at least it's perfectly possible to live in a house with food without working, although of course this is being a leech < 1250755950 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a bit harder here. nobody gives a fuck if you don't have a place to live. < 1250755972 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are homeless shelters, but they're not exactly pleasant < 1250755981 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i always just assumed other places have a similar system < 1250755987 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha. no. :) < 1250755991 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's perfectly possible to live in an ok house quite comfortably here without working < 1250755997 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i say quite ok < 1250755999 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that okay, but < 1250756005 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :must be nice < 1250756025 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess in the us that'd fail due to people going "taxes! ohhhhhhh nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!" < 1250756033 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, pretty much < 1250756070 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, the concept of the role of govt is rather different here compared to Europe... there was a huge backlash against the welfare state model starting with Reagan in the 1980s to the present < 1250756094 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's insane how far-right the us is < 1250756117 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yet i've seen someone not entirely off their rocker claim that they think most of the world would consider obama far-left < 1250756131 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then again they also think he wasn't born in the usa, so i guess he is off his rocker < 1250756140 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*shrugs* 1) it's not as bad as foreigners think, and 2) the country is split about 50-50 between right and left. the right are just much better organized and more vocal, so their presence is overstated in the media < 1250756172 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(1) seriously, man, i follow your politics. the only way it could be fine is a reality distortion field when you enter < 1250756175 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(2) but your "left" is democrats < 1250756180 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :democrats are right wing too < 1250756189 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my city supervisor here in SF is from the Green Party < 1250756196 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, i say this in the uk, and the UK is right-wing! < 1250756222 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but SF is far-left by US standards.. < 1250756224 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: the greens are okay from what i gather < 1250756235 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, Cynthia McKinney is insane < 1250756288 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the center here is definitely to the right of the center in Europe, incl the UK < 1250756318 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically, i consider the only countries with an acceptable political climate to be the european social democracies < 1250756344 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh. I lived in Germany for a year, it wasn't that great politically < 1250756352 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wouldn't class germany under that < 1250756359 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was run by Social Democrats at the time.. < 1250756384 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, that's just a name < 1250756389 0 :Gracenotes!n=person@wikipedia/Gracenotes JOIN :#esoteric < 1250756390 0 :AnMaster_!n=AnMaster@d83-177-104-248.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1250756478 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does Scandinavia count? < 1250756485 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :prolly < 1250756494 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1250756499 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It consists of the kingdoms of Norway, Sweden, and Denmark.[2] While some authorities argue for the inclusion of Finland and Iceland" < 1250756503 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :including those < 1250756506 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they seem nice politically, but most Scandinavians I've met irl were *ahem* not very friendly < 1250756544 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't want to live there < 1250756545 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1250756555 0 :ehird!n=ehird@91.105.76.79 JOIN :#esoteric < 1250756558 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as i was about to asy < 1250756573 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION glances at AnMaster, Deewiant, FireFly, fizzie, Ilari, ineiros, MizardX, olsner and oklopol < 1250756576 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and possibly MigoMipo < 1250756587 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: want to revise your statement about scandinavians? : < 1250756588 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1250756590 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION isn't unfriendly :< < 1250756591 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know them < 1250756596 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hooray for highlighting everybody for no good reason < 1250756596 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :50% of them were perfectly nice < 1250756596 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Yup, Sweden. < 1250756600 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1250756602 0 :AnMaster_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :AnMaster < 1250756602 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: uh, for very good reason < 1250756610 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :50% ranged from indifferent to openly hostile, for no apparent reason < 1250756611 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're all scandinavians < 1250756617 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: omg! people are dicks. < 1250756619 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously, you must've offended those scandinavians somehow < 1250756632 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than the usual "people being dicks" level < 1250756647 0 :Gracenotes_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1250756654 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you suggesting that scandinavia's weather makes people assholes :) < 1250756655 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: But their input isn't needed: you could just say "about 25% of the people here are Scandinavian", or whatever < 1250756660 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii, where was this? < 1250756666 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: that is much less directly convincing < 1250756673 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's vagguer < 1250756680 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Berlin. I met a Norweigan girl in Berlin, asked her whether it was very different from Norway. She said, "oh yes, everyone is so *friendly* here! It's not like this in Norway..." my American friend and I looked at each other, jaws agape.. < 1250756690 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gah, bad lag after reconnecting < 1250756706 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the context for " kwertii, where was this?" thus was " 50% ranged from indifferent to openly hostile, for no apparent reason" < 1250756711 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in case it arrived much much later < 1250756750 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I was going to a German language school in Berlin that had many Scandinavian students. half were perfectly nice and friendly, the other half were indifferent / openly hostile, even to the other Scandinavians." < 1250756784 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most Finns are "indifferent" to each other < 1250756799 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know about "openly hostile", maybe that's just what it looks like to an American :-P < 1250756810 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: yes, I suspect that is it. < 1250756819 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii, not representative of the actual countries I think < 1250756834 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw you should ignore AnMaster, he's stupid :) < 1250756885 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you should ignore ehird for being silly :P < 1250756888 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But anyway, back to while(){if($l++){print join(substr $_,0,$r),substr($_,$r,$e-$r)x$ARGV[0],substr $_,$e}else{$r=index $_,"*";$e=index $_,"\$",$r}} < 1250756899 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I dunno. the Norweigan girl described Berliners as "friendly". < 1250756941 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: what does it do < 1250756975 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: It finds the indices of * and an optional $ on the first line, then for each line after that prints the range up to where the * was, repeats the *-to-$ range argv[0] times, then prints the $-to-EOL range < 1250756982 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why < 1250756991 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why not < 1250756996 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why < 1250757006 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because there's no good reason why not < 1250757053 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dfg < 1250757078 0 :mycroftiv!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250757078 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250757079 0 :Judofyr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250757114 0 :mycroftiv!n=drabgah@h69-128-47-245.mdsnwi.dedicated.static.tds.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250757114 0 :MizardX!i=MizardX@unaffiliated/mizardx JOIN :#esoteric < 1250757114 0 :Judofyr!n=Judofyr@c249DBF51.dhcp.bluecom.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1250757116 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's essentially expanding a simple description of simple Befunge < 1250757138 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"QuitIRCServerException: MigoMipo disconnected from IRC Server" < 1250757181 0 :mycroftiv!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1250757191 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My guess is that that can be stripped to half of that in Perl < 1250757192 0 :mycroftiv!n=drabgah@69.128.47.245 JOIN :#esoteric < 1250757544 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you guys have any intuitions on whether/how different human languages could be said to have different "complexities" (for some definition of "complexity")? < 1250757558 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See Ithkuil < 1250757586 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: this is someone in here? < 1250757599 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it's a language :-) < 1250757602 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ithkuil < 1250757611 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: oh :) < 1250757625 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1250757649 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm studying linguistics now, and the general party line in the field is that it is horribly politically incorrect to suggest that one language is more "complex" than another < 1250757789 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: ... wow. awesome. I just have to show people this grammar, and they will be disabused of that idea < 1250757799 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-D < 1250757886 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC Ilaksh (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ilaksh) has simpler phonology but more complex grammar < 1250757900 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though the mainstream linguist would reply that it's a toy language, and that "real" human languages are all equivalently complex < 1250757916 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep, they probably would < 1250757924 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't think of a good way to formalize complexity in the context of human language < 1250757943 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, it's not very obvious < 1250758077 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 148 (No route to host) < 1250758626 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=behold@d83-183-183-70.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1250758848 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@97-118-134-114.hlrn.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250759805 0 :M0ny!n=Harmony@AToulouse-258-1-91-210.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1250759885 0 :M0ny!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi guys :) < 1250760457 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1250761122 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"The only thing I know is that I know nothing" < 1250762415 0 :MigoMipo!i=3e779bfd@gateway/web/freenode/x-zyceutixvodzisuh JOIN :#esoteric < 1250764169 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1250764190 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1250764203 0 :augur!n=augur@static-66-16-151-189.dsl.cavtel.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250765087 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"goodnight" < 1250765296 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1250766870 0 :Judofyr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1250767231 0 :M0ny!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1250770141 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250770173 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm, ehird's not in here :( < 1250770820 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1250770913 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250774305 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1250774326 0 :augur!n=augur@static-66-16-151-189.dsl.cavtel.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250774387 0 :mtve!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250774681 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250774686 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250774686 0 :nescience!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250774686 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250774686 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250774686 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250774723 0 :augur!n=augur@static-66-16-151-189.dsl.cavtel.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250774723 0 :AnMaster!n=AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1250774723 0 :nescience!n=myndzi@70-58-88-38.tukw.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250774723 0 :lifthrasiir!i=FuYvyBKf@haje12.kaist.ac.kr JOIN :#esoteric < 1250774723 0 :Slereah!n=butt@ANantes-259-1-24-75.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1250774723 0 :ineiros!n=ineiros@james.ics.hut.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1250774757 0 :Leonidas!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250774758 0 :cmeme!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250774819 0 :Leonidas!n=Leonidas@unaffiliated/leonidas JOIN :#esoteric < 1250774819 0 :cmeme!n=cmeme@boa.b9.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1250774893 0 :jix!n=jix@188-193-95-175-dynip.superkabel.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1250774921 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250774922 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250774954 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250774954 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250774955 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250774955 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250774956 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250774960 0 :jix!n=jix@188-193-95-175-dynip.superkabel.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1250774960 0 :HackEgo!n=HackEgo@codu.xen.prgmr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1250774982 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250774982 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@97-118-134-114.hlrn.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250774982 0 :GregorR!n=gregor@65.183.185.3 JOIN :#esoteric < 1250774982 0 :Pthing!n=pthing@77-100-194-169.cable.ubr04.pres.blueyonder.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1250774982 0 :Ilari!n=user@a88-113-39-59.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1250774994 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1250775853 0 :Gracenotes!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 145 (Connection timed out) < 1250777509 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1250778491 0 :CESSMASTER!n=CESSMAST@unaffiliated/joelywoely JOIN :#esoteric < 1250779194 0 :MigoMipo!n=MigoMipo@84-217-14-146.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250779434 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=behold@d83-183-183-70.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1250780894 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Installing VirtualBox, which requires disconnecting. BRB. < 1250781113 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1250781117 0 :Sgeo_!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250781616 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1250781883 0 :pikhq!n=pikhq@99-196-5-91.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250782130 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmph, I tried a regex variation but it only became longer; I fail at Perl golf < 1250782237 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1250782542 0 :pikhq!n=pikhq@99-196-5-91.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250782771 0 :EgoBot!n=EgoBot@codu.xen.prgmr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1250783782 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes and decreases cache misses in cfunge :P < 1250783788 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just to annoy ehird and Deewiant < 1250783795 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh? < 1250783822 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now, checking for if fingerprint is implemented will soon have a unit stride of a funge cell :D < 1250783924 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, what do you mean < 1250783967 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, currently my scheme for checking for fingerprints is simple, I have a struct with { fingerprint, pointer to loader function, implemented opcode list} basically < 1250783972 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lots of them in an array < 1250783984 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found that a linear scan was faster than a binary search < 1250783987 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, and you just did an search through that < 1250784004 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, yes, binary search is slower than a linear search with abort if we went too far < 1250784007 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1250784010 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now I'm doing: < 1250784016 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cell Fingerprints[]; < 1250784017 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and < 1250784026 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DataStruct Data[] < 1250784027 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically < 1250784055 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, because on 64-bit platforms you could fit about 1.5 such structs in a cache line before < 1250784066 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is clearly suboptimal when searching through them < 1250784086 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :better find the index you want, then look up the entire data thingy for that only < 1250784238 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer) < 1250784447 0 :pikhq!n=pikhq@99.196.5.91 JOIN :#esoteric < 1250784547 0 :Judofyr!n=Judofyr@c249DBF51.dhcp.bluecom.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1250784897 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it possible to close an fd in /proc/$pid/fd/ from outside the program somehow < 1250785115 0 :Asztal!n=asztal@host86-169-5-210.range86-169.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1250785115 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, inject things with gdb? < 1250785131 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, but to me, doing so sounds like a seriously bad idea < 1250785131 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you want to do that < 1250785173 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Starting a program with "foo &" and wanting to close its stdin < 1250785206 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, for some reason the unit stride access slowed it down according to profiling < 1250785213 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In this case I can just modify the program to exit if it gets a certain input line, but I'm wondering if that'd be possible < 1250785213 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah I think I see... < 1250785258 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly hardware prefetcher was smart enough to prefetch in the normal case, but now that we needed to find the matching entry in the other array as well that caused a cache miss? < 1250785272 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That'd be my guess < 1250785283 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can try allocating one contiguous block for both arrays < 1250785290 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it might still fail if it gets too big < 1250785305 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, you mean storing them both in a struct after each other? < 1250785341 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually I meant just "fingerprints = malloc(size of fingerprints + size of data); data = &fingerprints[size of fingerprints];" < 1250785357 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A struct might have some padding, after all ;-P < 1250785367 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, yep, on my old pentium 3 the unit stride version is faster < 1250785379 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and iirc that lacks hardware prefetch < 1250785405 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, well, since they are stored as static const < 1250785406 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So add a configuration entry to your CMake, asking the user if his processor can prefetch ;-) < 1250785409 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1250785434 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, nah, the difference codewise between the different variants is too large < 1250785453 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If they're constants the struct way still works < 1250785454 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, fun thing: even on my intel core 2 duo laptop, gcc generates a cfunge that is significantly faster < 1250785458 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :than icc < 1250785491 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, indeed. I was just saying the malloc way didn't < 1250785498 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also avoiding padding? < 1250785502 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume you are joking < 1250785510 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep < 1250785522 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since you basically are suggesting I should use unaligned access to it < 1250785528 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You might want to optimize for memory use instead of CPU time < 1250785530 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;-) < 1250785545 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although they're pointers so they're pretty much guaranteed to be aligned anyway < 1250785553 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I thought about an option for that. < 1250785559 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or no they aren't, never mind < 1250785561 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean < 1250785575 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know what you meant < 1250785576 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an option for memory or speed < 1250785585 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compile time of course ;P < 1250785593 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would be useful for "embedded cfunge" ;P < 1250785631 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but too much work for too little gain (currently at least) < 1250785768 0 :Judofyr!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1250785836 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, really, concurrent funge is irritating, it isn't very useful (all IPs blocks on blocking IO...) and it prevents JITing, since you can't do stuff like constant folding the program or such < 1250785858 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or optimising idioms like >:#,_ < 1250785890 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-P < 1250785918 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can still optimize in the single-threaded case < 1250785943 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, yes, but that basically means two implementations < 1250785947 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one JIT and one interpreter < 1250785953 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that you shift between < 1250785958 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or do something like suspend an IP doing >:#,_, run the others until they would do something side-effecting, count how many characters could've been output in that time, output that many < 1250785978 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, heh... < 1250785982 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Well yes, if you want to JIT the whole thing < 1250786016 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, optimising idioms would probably best be implemented as a part of a JIT < 1250786041 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because, looking for idioms would be quite expensive if you did it every time you hit > in an interpreter < 1250786045 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or such < 1250786053 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or tracking last few instructions executed < 1250786093 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, just adding a tick counter makes a measurable difference in cfunge. < 1250786118 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the fact that that difference is around 0.010 shows just how fast cfunge is at mycology :P) < 1250786262 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"QuitIRCServerException: MigoMipo disconnected from IRC Server" < 1250786279 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Desktop: < 1250786280 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ time ./cfunge -b ../mycology/mycology.b98 >/dev/null < 1250786281 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :real 0m0.057s < 1250786281 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :user 0m0.034s < 1250786281 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sys 0m0.018s < 1250786284 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :laptop: < 1250786293 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ time ./cfunge -b ../mycology/mycology.b98 >/dev/null < 1250786293 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :real 0m0.038s < 1250786293 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :user 0m0.028s < 1250786293 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sys 0m0.012s < 1250786298 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it just shows how slow your computer is :-P < 1250786301 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with clean env (env -i) < 1250786309 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ env -i bash --norc --noprofile -c "time ./cfunge -b ../mycology/mycology.b98 >/dev/null" < 1250786309 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :real 0m0.032s < 1250786309 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :user 0m0.008s < 1250786309 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sys 0m0.020s < 1250786312 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is on laptop < 1250786328 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, just showing how much faster mylaptop is < 1250786334 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my laptop* < 1250786366 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess that's without exact bounds < 1250786385 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION looks < 1250786397 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nop < 1250786406 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Desktop $ ./cfunge -v < 1250786406 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cfunge 0.9.0 [+con +trace +exact-bounds +ncurses hardened debug asserts p:64 c:32] < 1250786416 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Laptop $ ./cfunge -v < 1250786416 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cfunge 0.9.0 [+con -trace +exact-bounds +ncurses hardened p:64 c:32] < 1250786417 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1250786421 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hardened? < 1250786424 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that seems wrong < 1250786427 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION looks at that < 1250786440 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait was wrong directory on desktop < 1250786457 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On desktop: cfunge 0.9.0 [+con -trace +exact-bounds +ncurses p:64 c:32] < 1250786458 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1250786476 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems like ubuntu modified stuff to always use the checking versions of some libc functions < 1250786483 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is what the hardened switch normally does < 1250786495 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I guess it could be even faster < 1250786538 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, let me check without exact bounds :P < 1250786540 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interestingly low user time on that last one, then < 1250786550 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :real 0m0.024s < 1250786550 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :user 0m0.012s < 1250786552 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is typical here < 1250786572 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, well, I was not in debug directory for that, I managed to change terminal tab between that and checking the version < 1250786581 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so times above are correct < 1250786709 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, this may be because I had to turn off hpet on my laptop due to it being buggy < 1250786737 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :regression in all kernels after 2.6.24 for this chipset. bug report exists < 1250786777 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, so user timing may be inexact on there < 1250786811 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, in fact, seems to be multiples of 0.008 unless at least 0.020 < 1250786839 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or 0.004 so that theory didn't hold < 1250786861 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh btw: < 1250786864 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ env -i bash --norc --noprofile -c "time ./cfunge -Fb ../mycology/mycology.b98 >/dev/null" < 1250786864 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :real 0m0.010s < 1250786864 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :user 0m0.008s < 1250786864 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sys 0m0.004s < 1250786878 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is without exact bounds, without concurrent funge support, and without fingerprints < 1250786895 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with fingerprints that ends up at: < 1250786898 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ env -i bash --norc --noprofile -c "time ./cfunge -b ../mycology/mycology.b98 >/dev/null" < 1250786898 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :real 0m0.022s < 1250786898 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :user 0m0.004s < 1250786898 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sys 0m0.020s < 1250786910 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah, I forgot, it also wasn't linked against ncurses < 1250786921 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so fewer *.so to load < 1250787085 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hrmph, how should I talk to a process started as a background job < 1250787094 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sockets? < 1250787098 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, well, there are several ways < 1250787103 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depending on how much you need to tell it < 1250787113 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :signals, sockets, fifos for example < 1250787119 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IPC, shared memory < 1250787141 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :watching a directory with gamin or similar to look for new request files in it? ;P < 1250787144 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just want as simple a way as possible to give it textual input from a shell script < 1250787152 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, ok signals is a bad idea then < 1250787160 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw < 1250787189 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I deigned a protocol for arbitrary data using just SIGUSR1 and SIGUSR2 < 1250787190 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I can start it as 'foo &' and then do something ideally as simple as 'echo bar >> something' and it'll read "bar" immediately < 1250787200 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :crazily slow and sluggish < 1250787210 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried mkfifo, but it doesn't work since it doesn't stay open < 1250787226 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, mkfifo then keep that file open from inside your source? < 1250787228 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in < 1250787232 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a fifo on the file system < 1250787249 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but of course, pipe() works if both programs will run all the time < 1250787253 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ideally I could keep this as reading from stdin < 1250787266 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd just like to note that, for all its flaws, Erlang makes for nice servers. < 1250787286 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm. In spite of all its flaws. < 1250787292 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm. < 1250787295 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, for any data over SIGUSR[12]: Let SIGUSR1 be equal to the bit 0, and SIGUSR2 be equal to the bit 1 < 1250787296 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then < 1250787297 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Imma get coffee. < 1250787300 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :send SIGUSR1 < 1250787304 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes, that's rather obvious. < 1250787307 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait for a confirmation using SIGUSR1 < 1250787315 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since otherwise signals might be merged < 1250787321 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then send the next and so on < 1250787345 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if the other process want to send to you, use SIGUSR2 as kind of "Now it's my turn to talk" < 1250787378 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so for receiving process: SIGUSR1 is confirm, SIGUSR2 is "I want to send" < 1250787393 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1250787407 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there may be a race condition for confirming SIGUSR2 < 1250787411 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure how to handle that < 1250787452 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, anyway, I suggest shared memory. It is the coolest. < 1250787460 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and, most tricky I guess < 1250787471 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, I want simplest :-P < 1250787471 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but also fastest < 1250787486 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Speed is uninteresting, the data amount is minimal < 1250787501 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1250787503 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : So I can start it as 'foo &' and then do something ideally as simple as 'echo bar >> something' and it'll read "bar" immediately < 1250787505 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :simple < 1250787560 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use mkfifo to create a file on the file system < 1250787570 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make sure to open it in non-blocking mode if you need that < 1250787579 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then listen on it or such < 1250787582 0 :FredrIQ!n=FIQ@90-229-128-35-no52.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1250787584 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :using select() or whatever < 1250787590 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, then echo stuff into that fifo < 1250787597 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, seems simple enough to me < 1250787609 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have done it a few times myself using mkfifo(1) in bash scripts < 1250787684 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meh, select() < 1250787694 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not simple :-P < 1250787697 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, see fifo(7) too < 1250787701 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, ok, what about poll < 1250787703 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or epoll < 1250787710 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :poll has a nice interface < 1250787713 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"gets" is simple < 1250787715 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I tried mkfifo, but it doesn't work since it doesn't stay open < 1250787722 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean < 1250787724 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with that < 1250787741 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, select is simple if you use a high level language :P < 1250787756 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heck, even epoll is simple in something like erlang < 1250787759 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"mkfifo foo; cat foo &; echo a >> foo" -> cat hits EOF and dies < 1250787767 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, don't do it like that < 1250787775 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you want to do it in a shell script < 1250787786 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use exec to open it on a fd < 1250787790 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like fd 4 or whatever < 1250787801 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then do a read on that < 1250787816 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exec? < 1250787838 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, in POSIX shells exec is stupidly overloaded < 1250787854 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exec foo is the normal variant < 1250787857 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1250787885 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION looks for the syntax < 1250787904 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exec 4> fifo" that kills it? < 1250788220 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, hm? < 1250788249 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, what is the >> for there < 1250788250 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, can I do "mkfifo fifo; proggy-that-does-clever-polling-or-whatever fifo; echo foo >> fifo; echo bar >> fifo" < 1250788254 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :append to the end of the fifo? < 1250788256 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1250788270 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think >> makes no sense for a fifo :P < 1250788274 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My intuition would be that >> doesn't close it < 1250788297 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, >> means "append to end of file, instead of truncate file and append to that" < 1250788298 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But if you say so, it's the same as > then < 1250788305 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I know < 1250788326 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, anyway, your python process will get an EOF message. so handle that then as "end of message" < 1250788338 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and wait for future stuff to be sent to the fifo < 1250788343 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc that should work < 1250788358 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So if I do select([fd], [], []) < 1250788370 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then just read a line from the fd < 1250788373 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Will it work? < 1250788387 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, try it and see? I don't remember the exact results of that < 1250788404 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, possibly you will have to open it in non-blocking mode < 1250788411 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : The kernel maintains exactly one pipe object for each FIFO special file that is opened by at least one process. The FIFO must be opened on both < 1250788412 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ends (reading and writing) before data can be passed. Normally, opening the FIFO blocks until the other end is opened also. < 1250788413 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :says < 1250788415 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :man 7 fifo < 1250788417 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and < 1250788421 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : A process can open a FIFO in non-blocking mode. In this case, opening for read only will succeed even if no-one has opened on the write side yet, < 1250788421 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : opening for write only will fail with ENXIO (no such device or address) unless the other end has already been opened. < 1250788440 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, but yes I think you will get an EOF every time the other end is closed. And? < 1250788443 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just handle it! < 1250788477 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, just don't open it read *and* write, because that is implementation defined < 1250788484 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or rather < 1250788485 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :undefined < 1250788489 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but linux defines it < 1250788498 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it isn't what you want to happen I think < 1250788908 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alright, got it to work, thanks < 1250789443 0 :ehird!n=ehird@91.105.76.79 JOIN :#esoteric < 1250789456 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahh, I feel gerat < 1250789458 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*great < 1250789466 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slept from about 9am-4:30pm < 1250789534 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:45:00 though the mainstream linguist would reply that it's a toy language, and that "real" human languages are all equivalently complex < 1250789534 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ask augur < 1250789561 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's not been here for about 7 hours < 1250789568 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(kwertii, that is) < 1250789711 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everyone logreads < 1250789747 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, I just want to say that 09:00-16:30 is a wonderful sleep schedule, and everyone should adopt it < 1250789802 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I slept from 3am to 5pm :( < 1250789822 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that can't work well < 1250789863 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it didn't really help either < 1250789882 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've never felt so good on seven and a half hours of sleep < 1250789885 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I either forgot to set my alarm, or it failed to wake me < 1250789921 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes I go to bed really tired, and wake up fully refreshed after four hours of sleep... it's perplexing < 1250789923 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i woke up naturally < 1250790069 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastebin.ca/1536576 My first bit of non-trivial Erlang. Whoo. < 1250790090 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why are you torturing yourself < 1250790101 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shit, wow, that's verbose < 1250790109 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that could be like 50 lines of haskell < 1250790127 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a lot of process spawning. < 1250790144 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And explicit recursion. < 1250790150 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :step 1, spawn processes < 1250790152 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :step 2, ??? < 1250790154 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :step 3, scalability! < 1250790236 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/9c0gf/clojure_the_zombiereanimated_corpse_of_lisp/c0c8irt / Yay lisp machines! < 1250790248 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the loper os guy is making an FPGA flash disk card for one :) < 1250790251 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :too cool < 1250790368 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gah, now I have to save up < 1250790448 0 :puzzlet!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1250790564 0 :puzzlet!n=puzzlet@147.46.241.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1250791194 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer) < 1250791197 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.asciilifeform.com/paralleleye/eye.html / this head mounted display looks awesome < 1250791211 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :720x280! although monochrom < 1250791212 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1250791289 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(GregorR: http://www.media.mit.edu/wearables/lizzy/lizzy/pe-hat.html) < 1250791294 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hats + head mounted displays! < 1250791339 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1250791354 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :("16 red scale, and supposedly looked like a 60″ screen at 5 feet." sweet) < 1250791614 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grr, current graphic interfaces suck so much < 1250791636 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm going to write a python thingy that lets me do "grid[x,y] = z" as a formula, with variables like frame < 1250791656 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grid[x,y] = pixels[x,y][frame%2] < 1250791659 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :voila, flicker < 1250791673 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, updating in real time, I hate pressing run < 1250791693 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now how do I embed pygame inside tk < 1250791810 0 :pikhq!n=pikhq@99-196-5-91.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250791812 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use a hammer < 1250791841 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Always a good answer. < 1250792004 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite < 1250792033 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh, tk is so slow < 1250792165 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: do you grok tk? < 1250792233 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1250792252 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may not grok foreign-language bindings thereof, though. < 1250792271 0 :Gracenotes!n=person@wikipedia/Gracenotes JOIN :#esoteric < 1250792336 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: first, how can I make typing into the text widget not feel like wading in molasses? < 1250792360 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: ... What the *fuck* did you do? < 1250792366 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Use OS X, probably. < 1250792376 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The platform that nobody in FOSS gives a royal shit about. < 1250792380 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I repeat: what the *fuck* did you do? < 1250792380 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But they certainly pander to Windows users.) < 1250792388 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: < 1250792388 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :import Tkinter < 1250792389 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :root = Tkinter.Tk() < 1250792389 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :w = Tkinter.Text(root) < 1250792389 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :w.pack() < 1250792389 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :root.mainloop() < 1250792391 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On OS X. < 1250792407 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Tcl/Tk OS X port is written by Apple... < 1250792412 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Oh, it would be quite nice if it recognised ANY of my bindings. < 1250792418 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not originally, iirc. < 1250792420 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They just maintain it. < 1250792427 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(My bindings = My OS' keybindings.) < 1250792451 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So... Tkinter is bad? < 1250792455 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, Tkinter is fine. < 1250792462 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IDLE is fine on non-OS X platforms. < 1250792467 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On OS X, it's horrible to use < 1250792476 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In conclusion: Fuuuuuuck you Tk < 1250792484 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :package require Tk;pack [text .w] < 1250792487 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Try that. < 1250792515 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better. Not perfect. < 1250792540 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That... Is very weird. < 1250792557 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ask in #tcl? < 1250792571 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it so hard for you to comprehend that Tk sucks on OS X? :P < 1250792576 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, it's horribly non-native, even if it was fast. < 1250792595 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can only conclude that it has gone massively downhill since I last used it. < 1250792604 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It uses a WHITE BACKGROUND. They fuckin' use the button widgets and couldn't even write one line to change the window background to be OS X's. < 1250792617 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and right clicking seems to be "paste" in the text widget. < 1250792626 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, only if you select something. < 1250792628 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It copies it next to it < 1250792629 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is... Quite implausible. < 1250792632 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh, no, where you click. < 1250792637 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: but true < 1250792652 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially when you consider that it just uses Carbon. < 1250792659 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Tcl 8.6 uses Cocoa) < 1250792668 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: they implement their own text widget, obviously < 1250792694 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's easy to get a decent OS X looking thing up, people just don't care, or think that they're doing us a favour by bringing their obviously superior platform conventions to us < 1250792740 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Think you could tell me the version of Tk being used? < 1250792747 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(return value of package require Tk) < 1250792762 0 :M0ny!n=Harmony@AToulouse-258-1-91-210.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1250792808 0 :M0ny!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :re < 1250792809 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ehird:~] % wish < 1250792809 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :% package require Tk < 1250792810 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :8.5.6 < 1250792810 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :% % [ehird:~] % which wish < 1250792815 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/opt/local/bin/wish < 1250792818 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Woah, that messed up. < 1250792823 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, so I'm using a macports tcl < 1250792832 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my system tcl is 8.4 < 1250792850 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and is the same, except maybe a little faster < 1250792936 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders what he can embed pygame in < 1250792950 0 :comex!i=comex@c-98-210-198-162.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250792958 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I strongly suspect Macports is doing something weird. < 1250792969 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq! Shut up! I tested it with my system Tcl! < 1250792972 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tk. Sucks. On. OS. X. < 1250792974 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Simple as. < 1250792993 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Except that it doesn't. Except for you. < 1250793018 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except, it does. < 1250793026 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's your sample? < 1250793049 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: iwc :D < 1250793050 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FYI, http://pastie.org/590048.txt?key=wmjzqz4idjslw2inbbh9rg and http://pastie.org/590050.txt?key=4ooj6eeey5vtvrlsy03aq are the portfiles. < 1250793059 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Protip: They just use the official sources. < 1250793060 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tk sucks. < 1250793101 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Download ActiveTcl. If it still sucks, file a bug report and feel free to execute someone, because that's an epic regression. < 1250793114 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An epic regression, or I just notice these things more than you < 1250793134 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most people who use OS X without actually switching to it... aren't very picky about it. < 1250793146 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fyi, I tried it in like 2006-2007 too < 1250793151 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly the same < 1250793184 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :File you a bug. < 1250793199 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Make it not suck" < 1250793211 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ActiveTcl wants me to run an installer package, no doubt to pollute my system directories. < 1250793225 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, indeed. < 1250793230 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It mangles /Library/Frameworks/Tcl.framework < 1250793240 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Admittedly, that doesn't exist, but. < 1250793245 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A lot of files I'd have to clean up < 1250793346 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh < 1250793349 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll install it < 1250793394 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thanks, ActiveTcl; just open a documentation page in my browser without asking. < 1250793407 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: gimme the code < 1250793439 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: For? < 1250793443 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :test < 1250793452 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :package require Tk;pack [text .w] < 1250793479 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exactly the frikkin same < 1250793488 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now what files did this garbage install < 1250793512 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then feel free to say Tk on OS X sucks. < 1250793519 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tk on OS X sucks. < 1250793524 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now what can I embed pygame into... < 1250793621 0 :Pthing!n=pthing@77-100-194-169.cable.ubr04.pres.blueyonder.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1250793626 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :scrollwheels suck < 1250793630 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no way to make them go faster < 1250793694 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpus are so fast < 1250793745 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mice suck. < 1250793776 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, trackpoints look quite cool though < 1250793783 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and mice can be good < 1250793832 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as a diversion, here are the lyrics to a popular song: http://www.lyricsfreak.com/d/daft%20punk/around%20the%20world_10076007.html < 1250793840 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm, of course, referring to the common input paradigm that uses mice a lot, called WIMP. ;) < 1250793845 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kinda hard to figure them out < 1250793848 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :helps to sing along, you know < 1250793873 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: "Of course, I meant something totally different." < 1250793888 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Of course, by all that, I meant that your mother is fat. < 1250793911 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yo momma so fat they put her in Vista and that's why it takes up over ten gigabytes. < 1250793987 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : AnMaster: iwc :D <-- where is that quote from? < 1250793993 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't remember either < 1250794017 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, only reason you managed to say that before me was that I was away eating < 1250794059 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should give up eating so you always win < 1250794091 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: also, Star Wars. < 1250794104 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, hm ok < 1250794109 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...as I found when it rung a bell and so took three seconds to google. < 1250794176 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it's almost a darths & droids crossover < 1250794229 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, nah, he had a star wars theme in IWC too < 1250794240 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was quite a long while ago last time < 1250794250 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since the premise of darths & droids is that the roleplayers are in an alternative history where star wars doesn't exist < 1250794297 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: um this is not a crossover with star wars, this is a crossover with somewhere star wars (movie) doesn't exist < 1250794310 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, shower -> < 1250794312 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1250794312 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, oh right < 1250794316 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like how AnMaster "got the joke" without actually getting the joke < 1250794335 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clearly oerjan's connection doesn't work in the shower < 1250794344 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or why else would he quit the computer? < 1250794348 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1250794362 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because... he's not here? < 1250794365 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So... he leaves? < 1250794366 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously he plans to take computer with him < 1250794374 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so he could just do /away and leave computer on < 1250794390 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but since he took the computer with him, and wlan doesn't work in shower < 1250794392 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clearly < 1250794402 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...he has a water proof computer! < 1250794411 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh :P < 1250794411 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or < 1250794412 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :easy < 1250794416 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lets hope he does at least < 1250794423 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, I want a lisp machine. < 1250794438 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, you said that before. A. Few. Times! < 1250794443 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, but i mean like < 1250794446 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not just "oh it'd be lovely to have" < 1250794453 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i actually want to take actions to direct myself to owning one < 1250794467 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to muffle the noise i will put a bunch of thick clothes on top of it and then put it in a wardrobe :P < 1250794470 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, so you plan to get that instead of the laptop? < 1250794476 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: longer-term than that < 1250794477 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, thick clothes? < 1250794479 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fun < 1250794481 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1250794483 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with all the heat < 1250794483 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who cares about heat? < 1250794491 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I suspect it will overheat < 1250794505 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh < 1250794509 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're so loud the fans must be working hard < 1250794532 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, if you block the fans with thick clothes the fan effect will be very low < 1250794540 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually I suspect the fans are old < 1250794552 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i want a new machine of course, not used < 1250794556 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe replacing with modern fans that can shuffle as much air < 1250794557 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although it'll have been made in the 80s < 1250794561 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, old as in "old design" < 1250794570 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :before they found out how to make quieter fans < 1250794575 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I'll just not cover the exhaust itself < 1250794582 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, or inlet < 1250794583 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus < 1250794588 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1250794591 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume it radiates some as well < 1250794599 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as hot metal case < 1250794601 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plastic < 1250794604 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :acting as a heatsink < 1250794605 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, meh < 1250794627 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://lh3.ggpht.com/_q3-C8UUljH4/Rj4HReBP2iI/AAAAAAAAAoQ/9bbBBB1kwXM/image5-1.jpg < 1250794628 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :two of 'em < 1250794640 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I haven't seen non-metal pc towers in many years no. well, possibly the front is plastic, but the rest is usually metal it seems < 1250794642 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more appealing picture: http://www.sts.tu-harburg.de/~r.f.moeller/symbolics-info/symbolics-images/Symbolics-4.JPG < 1250794659 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: well the inside sure < 1250794660 0 :jix!n=jix@188-193-95-175-dynip.superkabel.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1250794661 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, that small? < 1250794667 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :small? it's big < 1250794668 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1250794675 0 :ehird!n=ehird@91.105.76.79 JOIN :#esoteric < 1250794676 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grr < 1250794679 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to lay off that key < 1250794688 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I imagined PDP 11 size < 1250794698 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they *are* single-user machines < 1250794706 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the later models were even smaller: http://www.sts.tu-harburg.de/~r.f.moeller/symbolics-info/symbolics-images/xl1201x2.jpg < 1250794721 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that's two) < 1250794732 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I will never have $3,500 to spend on one of them < 1250794735 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1250794738 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the 3620 it is < 1250794745 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: anyway, the 3620's dimensions are < 1250794751 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, make surface uneven, slap on an apple logo and you would basically have a ~1995 mac case! < 1250794756 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(on the latter picture) < 1250794771 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: 22.86 x 45.72 x 63.5 cm < 1250794774 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe a floppy or cd there < 1250794794 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, ok, that is about 150% larger I think < 1250794797 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: and it weighs 31.75kg to 181.43kg depending on configuration < 1250794800 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but design would be close < 1250794805 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, weight is heavy < 1250794808 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err grammar < 1250794814 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, anyway < 1250794816 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The standard < 1250794816 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cofiguration is 4 MWords with a 760 MB of ESDI disk and a 17" monochrome < 1250794816 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :console with keyboard and 3-button mouse. You can add another 760 MB disk < 1250794816 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for an additional $150. You can add additional memory for $50 per MWord up < 1250794816 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to a total of 8 MWords. You can upgrade to the 19" premium monochrome < 1250794817 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :monitor for an additional $300. The major problem with all of these < 1250794818 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :machines is disks. They do not have a SCSI bus and use very old ESDI, SMD < 1250794820 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or ST506 disks. The most disk space you can get on one of them is 1.5 GB, < 1250794822 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was so heavy in it < 1250794824 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they made the monitors, keyboards and mic < 1250794825 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1250794833 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(EVERY component of the monitors) < 1250794840 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not the plastic used for the keycaps < 1250794841 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1250794846 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they decided that was just going too far < 1250794860 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: and, I guess the disk for one < 1250794862 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the memory < 1250794867 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :power supply especially < 1250794874 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1250794879 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1250794880 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heavy power supply? < 1250794881 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is an 80s machine < 1250794882 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how comes < 1250794889 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it uses a royal fuckton < 1250794897 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that's bigger than both a metric fuckton and an imperial fucktonne) < 1250794919 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, so... what made the power supplies back then so heavy < 1250794923 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was it as heavy for C64 too? < 1250794934 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The C64 is like 100x less powerful < 1250794938 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well true < 1250794944 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and < 1250794948 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but really, it's basically a mainframe innabox < 1250794948 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :disk was heavy? huh < 1250794955 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: the disk predates SCSI < 1250794962 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, hm ok < 1250794963 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course it's heavy < 1250794971 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: btw, keyboard and mouse: < 1250794979 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, SCSI is an interface standard though < 1250794984 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: How big is a word < 1250794986 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not at the time, AnMaster < 1250794992 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, well yeah < 1250795004 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: 36 bit < 1250795013 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The main processor had a 36 bit word (divided up as 4 or 8 bits of tags, and 32 bits of data or 28 bits of memory address). Memory words were 44 bits, the additional 8 bits being used for error-correcting code (ECC). < 1250795027 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, but how the disk is constructed inside doesn't depend on SCSI or not < 1250795030 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1250795034 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: So 3.5 MB < 1250795034 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IOW, 44 bit < 1250795038 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No < 1250795040 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The rest is ECC < 1250795045 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IOW? < 1250795048 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We don't call ECC 64-bit memory bigger < 1250795052 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: in other words < 1250795054 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: ... An ST506, man. < 1250795059 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250795059 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1250795062 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: So 36 bits. < 1250795082 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ECC memory has extra bits for the ECC data? I didn't realize that < 1250795083 0 :ineiros_!n=ineiros@james.ics.hut.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1250795083 0 :dbc!n=daniel@130-94-161-238-dsl.hevanet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1250795085 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That predates "standard hard drive interface". < 1250795108 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, um. wikipedia claims ST506 was 5 MB. Yet ehird quoted the system as "up to 1.5 GB" above < 1250795114 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: ... That's how they work. < 1250795119 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :multiple disks of course < 1250795121 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1250795121 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes, that's the maximum addressable. < 1250795129 0 :FIQ!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250795129 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250795129 0 :Dewi!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250795130 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250795130 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :wolfe.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1250795130 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: It uses magic pixie dust to correct the errors < 1250795130 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1.5 GB / 5 MB < 1250795133 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how many disks? < 1250795134 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: shut up, it came with more than 5mb < 1250795138 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it came with like a gig < 1250795157 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1250795157 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.sts.tu-harburg.de/~r.f.moeller/symbolics-info/symbolics-images/keyboard.JPG < 1250795157 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.talisman.org/~erlkonig/img/peripheral/kbd/symbolics^mouse.jpg < 1250795159 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ECC memory has extra bits for the ECC data? I didn't realize that <-- haha < 1250795161 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except mouse was beige, whatever < 1250795163 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I presume it used a hard drive with the ST506 interface, rather than the ST506 hard drive, then. < 1250795171 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note the fun keys on the keyboard! < 1250795182 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: No. ESDI. < 1250795187 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Ah. < 1250795195 0 :FIQ!n=FIQ@90-229-128-35-no52.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1250795195 0 :oklopol!n=oklopol@a91-153-125-186.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1250795195 0 :Dewi!n=dewi@124-171-183-175.dyn.iinet.net.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1250795195 0 :lament!n=lament@S0106001b63f462cc.vc.shawcable.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250795195 0 :fizzie!i=fis@iris.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1250795199 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Must've been an expensive SOB. < 1250795208 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: In the day, probably about $7k < 1250795211 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in today's money < 1250795217 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, yes. < 1250795246 0 :nooga!n=nooga@86-63-124-134.sta.asta-net.com.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1250795247 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: The 3640 is more of an acceptable size to you: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/84/Symbolics3640.JPG < 1250795249 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, in retrospect it's rather obvious < 1250795272 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, you mean, much larger? < 1250795277 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey yo < 1250795279 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :signal processing guys < 1250795284 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The keyboard and monitor are resting on top of it. So, yes. < 1250795286 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how to asses quailty of a random number series? < 1250795302 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BTW, the Lisp Machines had no memory protection or users, iirc. < 1250795303 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I want a small lisp machine. I want a LISP phone! < 1250795309 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They were single-user affairs. < 1250795317 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :modern of course < 1250795318 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So don't go around offering shell accounts... < 1250795363 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like how they had CD-ROM drives. < 1250795367 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My brain doesn't process them as in the same era. < 1250795380 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not like they could distribute the gigs of software on floppy... < 1250795395 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1250795401 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, pic of the cd drive? < 1250795403 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean < 1250795414 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wonder if someone bothered to create a LISP processor using FPGA < 1250795424 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: What is there to show? < 1250795428 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if a modern cd fits in a huge 5.whatever" hole < 1250795432 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how large would it have been then < 1250795436 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Umm, regular. < 1250795441 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, well cd of course < 1250795443 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but drive I mean < 1250795453 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Btw, size comparison time. < 1250795456 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.asl.dsl.pipex.com/symbolics/photos/3%20old%20machines/SMBX_3600_XL_3620-2.JPG < 1250795458 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, clearly the drive should be enormous < 1250795459 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3600, XL1200, 3620 < 1250795466 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Look at the fucking SIZE of the 3600! < 1250795491 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, they learnt how to use IC around the time of the middle one? ~ < 1250795526 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can't find a piccy of the cd drive. < 1250795540 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Grr I hate the MacIvory < 1250795545 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a Mac, dammit! < 1250795550 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't care if it runs the OS. < 1250795600 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#lisp should buy up Symbolics. :) < 1250795741 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are there any true random number generators publicly available besides random.org ? < 1250795750 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hotbits < 1250795802 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, don't trust them if you are paranoid! < 1250795845 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: A CCD camera. < 1250795856 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(with the cap on) < 1250795868 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, is that really random? < 1250795874 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes. < 1250795884 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, isn't it, like, all black? < 1250795886 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1250795895 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, there's quantum noise. < 1250795916 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, oh ok, not a lot of it I assume? < 1250795921 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, as far as we know, it's at least as random as a geiger counter. < 1250795953 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: At least enough to be usable as a source of entropy. < 1250795961 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, since I remember taking all black pictures before, that were actually completely black except at some *statically* slightly off places < 1250795964 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it's fairly impossible for the hotbits owner to do anything fwiw < 1250795967 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :near impossible at least < 1250795975 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, true :P < 1250795985 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Specifically, web-cam. < 1250796004 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that noise is because of quantum? < 1250796005 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck that shit < 1250796029 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, oh? I tested with a good camera that was upper-mid-end a few years ago < 1250796047 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, but you say webcams are more random? how comes? < 1250796059 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Good cameras tend to try to filter the noise. Webcams don't bother. < 1250796068 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, filter? how? < 1250796077 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anti-quantum particles < 1250796087 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Multiple samples, averaging, IIRC. < 1250796088 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, my thought exactly XD < 1250796101 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seriously, wow, fuck that shit, it's due to quantum? < 1250796106 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuuuuuuuuck that shit. < 1250796112 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1250796129 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, wait, so it samples multiple times both when taking a 1/1000 exposure and when taking a 30 second one? < 1250796131 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1250796132 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever < 1250796153 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I can't see how it can get enough light though for it < 1250796198 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhm < 1250796222 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i need source of good quailty random numbers for many machines < 1250796232 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Hmm. < 1250796244 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As an alternate explanation, I'm full of shit. < 1250796245 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1250796255 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, about the quantum noise too? < 1250796282 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, no. Just how good-quality cameras don't show that as much. < 1250796301 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Good-quality. My English sucks today. < 1250796324 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go odqu al it y < 1250796385 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhm < 1250796412 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the thing is that i need a noise that resembles natural noise in light transport ;p < 1250796437 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, err what < 1250796466 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :take a light source that emits uniform white light in every direction < 1250796497 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it emits photons in random directions and energies < 1250796512 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with random energies* < 1250796532 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes... < 1250796538 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i need to simulate that < 1250796542 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1250796545 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1250796547 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and pseudo-random numbers give stupid patterns < 1250796554 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and all that shit looks unnatural < 1250796557 0 :fizzie!i=fis@iris.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1250796557 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well ok < 1250796571 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, sounds like a bad PRNG there < 1250796588 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : /dev/urandom < 1250796594 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, well duh < 1250796597 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's silly to use < 1250796616 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you shoot like, uh, 3000 000 000 photons, every PRNG will give patterns < 1250796617 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, try using that to create a seed. then using a good prng < 1250796637 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, are you doing ray tracing with like 3000 000 000 photons? < 1250796663 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can't get that much randomness from any such free source < 1250796669 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, forward, physically based raytracing < 1250796676 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try that "one million random numbers" book < 1250796680 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, that will be super-slow < 1250796688 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with that number of photons I mean < 1250796690 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and < 1250796690 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my raytracer traces photons FROM the lights TO the sensor < 1250796692 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect < 1250796692 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1250796694 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nearly white < 1250796699 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's fucking damn slow < 1250796707 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, and it will be nearly white? < 1250796732 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what will be nearly whitye? < 1250796793 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[19:31] AnMaster: and you can't get that much randomness from any such free source < 1250796793 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop FUDing < 1250796800 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :therefore i need a "supercomputer", i'd like to be able to distribute the process < 1250796810 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, FUD? < 1250796814 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no, not this "LOL AUTOMATIC DISTRBUTE ACROSS ITNERWEB" from nooga < 1250796836 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I checked, there are limits on the web forms < 1250796847 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can however send a special request it seems < 1250796852 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure what the size limit is then < 1250796853 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...so use /dev/random < 1250796861 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, yeah, that will be fast eh? < 1250796867 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1250796868 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because < 1250796871 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :raytracing "3000 000 000 photons" < 1250796873 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :move your mouse a lot < 1250796875 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is going to be fast anyway < 1250796880 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously < 1250796886 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: stop blabbering, rendering is the easiest process to distribute: give each slave a source description and tell them: each one of you must trace n photons, collect results from the slaves < 1250796887 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, no, but /dev/random will be slower < 1250796889 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :add the results < 1250796891 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and voila < 1250796902 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: over the internet. automatically. < 1250796904 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not < 1250796913 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not automatically no < 1250796913 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you've got scene rendered with n*(slave count) photons < 1250796930 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Well, it could theoretically work over the Internet. ... As a BOINC app. < 1250796933 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1250796934 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1250796946 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, or a botnet or such < 1250796947 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Manually written. < 1250796947 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would work as a boinc app < 1250796956 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OF COURSE MANUALLY WRITTEN!@ < 1250796957 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: And way, way slower than gigabit ethernet. < 1250796958 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, that requires splitting it into autonomous processes. < 1250796962 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By hundreds of billions of years. < 1250796966 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: No shit. < 1250796974 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Tell that to nooga. < 1250796985 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never thought that computer will magically turn my raytracer program into parallel system < 1250796996 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And by the time you've got it split into autonomous processes, parallelism is kinda... Trivial. < 1250797026 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Few lines of shell" kinda trivial. :) < 1250797028 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, iirc ray-tracing is extremely parallel < 1250797031 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vvvvvvvvvv18 people 18 people 18 people < 1250797041 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :raytracing is embarrasginly parallel < 1250797042 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no dependencies < 1250797047 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, indeed < 1250797048 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1250797054 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i understand all that < 1250797057 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but forward ray trace is kind of silly iirc < 1250797061 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless I misremember < 1250797063 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unfortunately nobody has a shitload of processors :P < 1250797077 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, get a shitload of FPGAs < 1250797079 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :issue solved < 1250797087 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: one fpga runs you about $100 < 1250797089 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Most people have shitloads of processors. It's called a "graphics card". < 1250797092 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: but it gives results closest to a taking photo < 1250797096 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: sure. < 1250797096 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I never claimed it would be cheap! < 1250797113 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yes, but it's probably cheaper to buy a bunch of commodity systems. < 1250797115 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :second hand < 1250797116 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, but even one FPGA can do better than a CPU. < 1250797117 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, to use that, you need to write it as a CUDA app. < 1250797125 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: or OpenCL, for ati < 1250797129 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well and nvidia too < 1250797134 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Intel. < 1250797135 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: but the work of one ray-tracing atom is trivial < 1250797141 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could do it at 10mhz, prolly < 1250797160 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, there are FPGAs close to 100 MHz iirc? < 1250797167 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1250797168 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :. < 1250797171 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm saying you don't need speed. < 1250797178 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So whether the FPGAs are fast or not is irrelevant. < 1250797180 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You just need parallelism. < 1250797187 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All you need is a shitload of processors of just about any speed. < 1250797204 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: tbh, my program could run parallel even now. i'd need to distribute copies of it with a scene description and ask users to send results of rendering using some small numbers of photons to me and then add the results < 1250797222 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i'd be faster than rendering on one machine < 1250797253 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Doesn't ray tracing need a decent amount of memory bandwidth? < 1250797278 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what i want to do is write a little utility that'd automatically send scene descriptions and collect the results < 1250797289 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AND THERE'S NO WORD ABOUT AUTOMATIC PARALLELISM < 1250797291 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :period. < 1250797354 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, what you want to do is reïmplement BOINC. < 1250797359 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1250797370 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's dumb; BOINC's not hard to write for. < 1250797376 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1250797399 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, except that it's C. :P < 1250797403 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you have to make ppl join your project < 1250797414 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... No shit? < 1250797418 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...as opposed to computing without their consent < 1250797426 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So do you not ACTUALLY have these machines? < 1250797451 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i planned to infect one of nearby academic houses < 1250797457 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or two < 1250797463 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Congrats; you're an immoral asshole. < 1250797468 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=behold@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1250797470 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? :D < 1250797474 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :........ < 1250797474 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just an experiment < 1250797482 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ... Doesn't ray tracing need a decent amount of memory bandwidth? <-- yep < 1250797482 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to strangle you. For being stupid, y'see. < 1250797490 0 :coppro!n=coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1250797491 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyone care to join me? < 1250797495 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: That's called "botnet". < 1250797497 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, local caches and such is very important iirc < 1250797502 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: i know, and? < 1250797507 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :..... < 1250797508 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And yes, that makes you an immoral asshole. < 1250797531 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1250797532 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: I wish a thousand viruses upon your computer. < 1250797537 0 :fizzie!i=fis@iris.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1250797539 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm using mac < 1250797540 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;| < 1250797546 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :. < 1250797548 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kill < 1250797551 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume you are joking nooga? < 1250797558 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: I wish all the viruses upon your computer. < 1250797559 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: has he ever joked about something so stupid? no < 1250797560 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ALL OF THEM. < 1250797569 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like how nooga thinks OS X can't possibly have any bugs. < 1250797578 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has bugs < 1250797586 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there are not many viruses for os x < 1250797597 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hope nooga does infect the computers; then I can get him arrested and we won't have to deal with him any more. < 1250797603 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, hm yeah a botnet is rather stupid < 1250797607 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"rather" < 1250797623 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: i planned to infect one of nearby academic houses << tbh, firstly i'd ask several friends to help me < 1250797630 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He actually thinks that making a botnet out of computers near him to do the computation he wants to do is not immoral. < 1250797633 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or even some scientists on my university < 1250797640 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, as you know by now, I tend to use "rather" before the adjectives like "stupid" and "silly"! < 1250797641 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we have cool clusters there < 1250797667 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I just murdered someone Hm, that's rather bad < 1250797675 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : why? :D < 1250797679 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, "rather horrible" < 1250797681 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean < 1250797689 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's putting it too strongly < 1250797692 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He might get offended < 1250797700 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh come on < 1250797705 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, you think so? Maybe "not very nice" would be better? < 1250797722 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: "Well, if you think you did the right thing..." might work < 1250797744 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, if it was in self defence? < 1250797753 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ghhh < 1250797764 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes; I was probably trying to kill him for being an idiot. < 1250797780 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably my botnet would fail because i don't know how to write malicious software < 1250797786 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially for windows < 1250797789 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so no fear < 1250797789 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good thing < 1250797800 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's only athought < 1250797803 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the only thing stopping me from murdering is that I'm weak. < 1250797809 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay fun moral system! < 1250797811 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, "athought"? < 1250797813 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i were christian i could go to church and confess < 1250797817 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as opposed to "bthought"? < 1250797840 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1250797849 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a thought) < 1250797856 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your parser is broken sir < 1250797863 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, isn't that only for Catholics or such? < 1250797869 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, confessing in curch < 1250797872 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :church* < 1250797879 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't poland like 99% catholic < 1250797885 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, oh good point < 1250797896 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i'm in that 1% < 1250797905 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1250797912 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so there are 99 other people in Poland then? < 1250797918 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"in" < 1250797925 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, argh I misread it < 1250797928 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baptism_of_Poland < 1250797928 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BAPTISM OF POLAND < 1250797932 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They actually poured water over ALL OF POLAND < 1250797932 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yuck < 1250797935 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck yeah! < 1250797949 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'s called rain < 1250797950 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1250797955 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it's a SKY FLOOD < 1250797964 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, heavy rain? < 1250797968 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw < 1250797969 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SKY FLOOD < 1250797974 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's with _why ? < 1250797987 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dunno; I'll look into my crystal ball! < 1250797993 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wait, it's a magic 8 wait I've said this before. < 1250798002 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the part before ';' would do < 1250798011 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't you ask yesterday nooga ? < 1250798013 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yes. < 1250798034 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zed Shaw posted to his blog calling _why Jonathan, which I made two posts rebutting. bah. < 1250798036 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: maybe something changed < 1250798080 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, use google yourself? < 1250798089 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: rich from you < 1250798095 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, thanks < 1250798098 0 :sebbu!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-82-25.w81-49.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1250798122 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, googled idiom but can't find definition < 1250798129 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so explain it < 1250798143 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"You're a hypocrite", basically. < 1250798148 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1250798172 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, and so is your mom < 1250798179 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Oh, snap." < 1250798289 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try to google "why" < 1250798301 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga just stfu < 1250798309 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1250798338 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, try _why < 1250798339 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1250798348 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"why the lucky stiff". < 1250798435 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, or that < 1250798773 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1250798853 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you know that whitehouse.gov used to use lisp machines? < 1250798856 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not for the main site, but. < 1250798898 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll get a link < 1250798980 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://web.archive.org/web/20000301193429/www.pub.whitehouse.gov/WH/Publications/html/Publications.html < 1250798986 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pub.whitehouse.gov ran on one < 1250799033 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1250799041 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why heh, it's awesome :( < 1250799041 0 :Gracenotes_!n=person@wikipedia/Gracenotes JOIN :#esoteric < 1250799050 0 :Gracenotes!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1250799051 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, source for this? < 1250799052 0 :Gracenotes_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Gracenotes < 1250799066 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you srsly question everything? i read it, i'm sure of it, end of < 1250799074 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have no reason to lie < 1250799077 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :google it if you care < 1250799086 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :reliable source and all that ;P < 1250799100 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ghh < 1250799103 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you assume that i give a shit if you believe me or not < 1250799113 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"(The LispM that served www.pub.whitehouse.gov sadly disappeared in january 2001 when Prez Bush replaced Prez Clinton)" < 1250799114 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1250799116 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :found one source < 1250799130 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, apparently a high-end macivory lisp machine cost about $50,000 in 1991 < 1250799130 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a few more < 1250799138 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_O < 1250799157 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it's time to reinvent lisp machines < 1250799166 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course it is. < 1250799173 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what i'm doing < 1250799182 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: So, I guess *that's* why Symbolics went out of business? Exceptionally expensive workstations? ;) < 1250799193 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope, symbolics did fine < 1250799197 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but nobody wanted a lisp machine < 1250799213 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... At a time that people figured "Eh, x86 is good enough." < 1250799216 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :besides, they still exist and sell things, albeit slowly :P < 1250799223 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I'll tell you what happened < 1250799224 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Windows happend < 1250799227 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*happened < 1250799231 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The explosion of unix happened < 1250799232 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are there moderl lisp processors? < 1250799236 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dammit, Microsoft. < 1250799237 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :modern* < 1250799239 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: no. not apart from fpgas < 1250799243 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1250799270 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION would like a Haskell machine < 1250799272 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :creating an industrial matrix for a processor is a bit expensive < 1250799300 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ASICs aren't woefully expensive < 1250799303 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you have a market < 1250799308 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :symbolics had their own fab, though < 1250799313 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :god damn they had money < 1250799357 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The fact that they actually *sold* any machines that cost $50,000 implies that they had money. ;) < 1250799372 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just can't comprehend that they made their monitors themselves < 1250799383 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think they basically relied on no other companies < 1250799387 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for anything important at least < 1250799393 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/d/d2/Symbolics-document-examiner.png / genera had very nice fonts < 1250799398 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, that seems silly < 1250799404 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the font in the Document Examiner window is really readable < 1250799405 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :man < 1250799406 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even when not anti-aliased < 1250799411 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, they could have managed way better if they had relied on other companies < 1250799413 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: but the displays were high-quality < 1250799414 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1024 x 867 in 80's < 1250799417 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: and no, they couldn't have < 1250799420 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was something < 1250799431 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, ok, maybe I'm just wishful < 1250799441 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, hardware was pretty crap in those days < 1250799449 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if you bought a symbolics machine, you're done < 1250799449 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: That is a *much* better UI than you'd expect for the era. < 1250799456 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: it's pretty much system-wide emacs < 1250799457 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, the font is readable because it avoids lines in directions that look bad < 1250799465 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a very well-designed font < 1250799468 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, there are some issues in the bold italics bit < 1250799475 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not the same font < 1250799478 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think < 1250799480 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, ah maybe < 1250799480 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, maybe < 1250799489 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: remember that CRTs blur a bit, though < 1250799494 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, true < 1250799500 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I wonder if you could hook up an LCD to a symbolics machine?) < 1250799520 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: but yes, the windowing system was great from what I hear < 1250799523 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I never got opengenera thingy working :/ < 1250799527 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in < 1250799527 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1250799534 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I've read the boot up source of the OS < 1250799536 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got it up to the enter site settings thing < 1250799536 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's written in lisp < 1250799538 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not pretty :) < 1250799549 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, but never got the site setting things to save properly < 1250799578 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: where is that source? < 1250799592 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/3769989/Symbolics_Open_Genera_2.0_for_Alpha_-_complete_package_with_Lisp < 1250799597 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fun comment: < 1250799598 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dkschmidt at 2007-08-15 02:24 CET: < 1250799598 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Congratulations on downloading the finest software development environment ever created. If you want to find out more about Genera or would like to have a Symbolics Lisp Machine, check out the Symbolics website at www.symbolics.com or contact sales@symbolics.com. < 1250799602 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dkschmidt is the remaining symbolics guy < 1250799604 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a true salesma < 1250799605 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :n < 1250799617 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1250799626 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Symbolics were like Macs done right, I think < 1250799635 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You bought them and got everything you needed, extremely high quality < 1250799638 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yet they were totally open < 1250799643 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could modify the whole system < 1250799662 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty cool < 1250799666 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because that's just Lisp for you. < 1250799667 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like the idea < 1250799695 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hope asciilifeform open sources his FPGA flash disk card < 1250799697 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how much does a lisp machine cost nowadays? < 1250799703 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: http://www.lispmachine.net/symbolics.txt < 1250799706 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: about $700 < 1250799709 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :up to $3,500 < 1250799719 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: don't get a macivory; they're macs with a lisp expansion board < 1250799724 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not nearly cool enough < 1250799734 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asciilifeform/loper os guy is getting a 3620 < 1250799735 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which macs? < 1250799745 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: MacIvory, they're Symbolics machines; < 1250799751 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically mac + Lisp processor expansion board < 1250799753 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's uber-lam < 1250799754 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1250799759 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhuh, i can imagine < 1250799767 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some info from the guy < 1250799768 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[The machine is equipped with dual 380MB disks (each with full OS install) and 4 MWord of RAM. The manual rates the power supply for 1KW max draw / 400W typical. The latter is much the same as my desktop PC. Noise is not a concern: I do not intend to run it 24/7. I expect the power consumption to fall by ~100W after the flash disk is in.]] < 1250799878 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow < 1250799886 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they had 64-bit word in 80's < 1250799895 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1KW max draw / 400W typical < 1250799896 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1250799897 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1250799905 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, ok about heavy power suplies! < 1250799914 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not a lot < 1250799920 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, 1 KW is < 1250799927 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1KW is what really high end gaming PCs use, AnMaster < 1250799930 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in, typically < 1250799932 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: because your parents pay the bills < 1250799933 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1250799934 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lisp Machines use that at peak < 1250799938 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, what really? < 1250799940 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Relatively < 1250799949 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes; not all that many machines actually use 1KW, but there are some. < 1250799957 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Think triple graphics card + overclocked CPU < 1250799965 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(quad-core, naturally) < 1250799971 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I thought it was like 600W peak on high end power supplies? < 1250799989 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most consumer power supplies are like 400W < 1250799992 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most brand-name are like 700W < 1250800012 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can purchase 1KW, but they cost a bit. < 1250800035 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it's not unheard of to have a 2 power supply system. Just... rather rare. < 1250800055 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1kw is like $300 < 1250800058 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.symbolics.com/ << what can I say, they have a pretty logo < 1250800062 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not at all uncommon < 1250800070 0 :jix!n=jix@188-193-95-175-dynip.superkabel.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1250800082 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for a company that sells it's products for 50k < 1250800090 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sold < 1250800092 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when they were new < 1250800100 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.lispmachine.net/symbolics.txt are modern prices < 1250800102 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what i mean < 1250800107 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :saw it < 1250800115 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about laptop power supplies? < 1250800124 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aren't they like 70 W or so? iirc? < 1250800127 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: they're external < 1250800129 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes < 1250800131 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :laptops use very little power < 1250800132 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, yes they are < 1250800141 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mac mini it 110W at peak AFAIR :D < 1250800148 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mac mini idles at 13watt < 1250800149 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is* < 1250800151 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, what about that 17"+10" one? ;P < 1250800157 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's true ehird < 1250800158 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: like 34958734953489789794835793457watt < 1250800162 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, right < 1250800162 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://support.apple.com/kb/HT3468 < 1250800164 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :13 - 110 watt < 1250800166 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mac mini < 1250800186 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, my laptop idles at 8.6 W iirc < 1250800193 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when disk is spun down < 1250800197 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really? < 1250800201 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :around 9.1 W when disk is spinning < 1250800210 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, tested with powertop, not sure how accurate that is < 1250800226 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, since it asks ACPI for the info < 1250800227 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc < 1250800269 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, you think it is high or low? < 1250800277 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :low < 1250800287 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, was 20% brightness on display though < 1250800292 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which could affect it < 1250800298 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and wlan was turned off. < 1250800308 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I was basically just testing how low I could get it < 1250800327 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when in usable mode with wlan off, around 9.8W with disk spinning < 1250800352 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wlan causes a lot of wakeups when searching for networks if it isn't connected to any < 1250800449 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://fun.noshit.pl/DIR-2009.08.20/fnp7.jpg << first exercise ;D < 1250800533 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, you think we can read that? < 1250800555 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's phonetic Polish for americans i suppose < 1250800557 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Asztal: Hey, why no asztal.net < 1250800635 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Przepraszam, czy można przymierzyć?" is the first line lol < 1250800645 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :deciphering that took me 2 minutes < 1250800700 0 :Gracenotes!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :SendQ exceeded < 1250800749 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=112003322&ft=1&f=1001 / wtf, I thought we stopped using physical objects to define units < 1250800819 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not the kilogram. < 1250800855 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We did; turns out that the kilogram is tricky < 1250800863 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We're working on it < 1250800878 0 :Gracenotes!n=person@wikipedia/Gracenotes JOIN :#esoteric < 1250800888 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: We? :P < 1250800893 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I said we. < 1250800897 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nevermind. < 1250800901 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-P < 1250800921 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, nevermind is totally a word. Just ask Nirvana. < 1250801012 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wonder if wolframalpha knows < 1250801016 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;> < 1250801028 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why can't it be defined in terms of Planck units? < 1250801042 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(aside from that being potentially absurdly hard to measure) < 1250801048 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`wolfram 1 kilogram in planck units < 1250801055 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$Failed \ \ < 1250801060 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`wolfram 1 kilogram in planck mass < 1250801061 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : One bacon in planck times per meters minus squared < 1250801068 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 kilogram in planck mass \ \ Input interpretation: \ \ convert 1 kg kilogram to Planck masses \ Result: \ \ 4.595 107 mP Planck masses \ Additional conversion: \ \ 1000 grams \ Interpretation: \ \ mass \ Corresponding quantities: \ \ Weight w of a body from w 2.2 lbf pounds force 0.069 slugf slugs force 9.8 N newtons < 1250801074 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See, that was easy. < 1250801104 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but planck mass is defined using grams < 1250801110 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`wolfram 1 yottaparsec in planck length < 1250801113 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: ... No. < 1250801116 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 yottaparsec in planck length \ \ Input interpretation: \ \ convert 1 Y yotta \ Result: \ \ pc parsec to Planck lengths \ \ 1.909 1075 lP Planck lengths \ Additional conversions: 37 \ \ 1.917 10 miles \ \ Interpretation: \ \ length \ Corresponding quantity: \ \ Light travel time t in vacuum from t 3.264 1024 years < 1250801124 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=planck+mass CTO < 1250801133 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where's definition using constants? < 1250801148 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planck_mass here < 1250801149 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from a guy who uses a 3620: "Most people will WANT to put the machine in a separate room. It is LOUD" < 1250801161 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga : Planck mass is when the Schwartzchild radius and the compton wavelength are the same < 1250801163 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How loud is this thing xD < 1250801167 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :50dBA? < 1250801168 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha < 1250801169 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1250801172 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is defined in terms of units defined such that G, h, c, 1/(4\pi\epsilon_0), and k_b are 1. < 1250801187 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's more sane < 1250801189 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I were more awake, I'd say something that ehird would take notice of. < 1250801196 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi Sgeo_. < 1250801198 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1250801216 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has, next to him, his copy of The Age of Spiritual Machines < 1250801226 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, m_p = \sqrt{hc/G} < 1250801237 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, Kurzweil's I-don't-wanna-die masterpiece. < 1250801245 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's something like 8 micrograms IIRC < 1250801255 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`wolfram planck mass in gram < 1250801259 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has predictions for 2009 < 1250801260 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Surely you want an updated version, where he amends the dates to be actually in the future, but still within his expected lifetime? < 1250801262 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :planck mass in gram \ \ Input interpretation: \ \ convert 1 mP Planck mass to grams \ Result: \ \ 2.176 10 \ \ 5 \ \ grams \ \ Additional conversions: \ \ 21.76 µg micrograms \ Comparisons as mass: \ \ 0.01 \ Interpretation: \ \ 1 69 \ \ mass of a typical mosquito \ \ 1 10 \ \ 6 \ \ kg \ \ mass \ Corresponding < 1250801263 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: ~2*10^-8 kg. < 1250801278 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The last edition will predict that the singularity will happen tomorrow; the day after, he'll be dead. < 1250801284 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1250801301 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Silly old people! < 1250801314 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As far as I'm conserned, there's nothing wrong with hoping he turns out to be right. < 1250801336 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's nothing wrong with hoping that there's a God who loves us all and takes us to heaven and gives us eternal joy forever. < 1250801336 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: Yeah, but you admit it's a hope. < 1250801340 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not prophecy. < 1250801344 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's still irrational. < 1250801357 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A better way to have hope is to actually work on making the world a better place. < 1250801360 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I hope that too, even though I don't believe that there is. < 1250801370 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hope that I will have a pony in three seconds. < 1250801379 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION spawns a pony < 1250801409 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if symbolics hired a typographer to design their fonst < 1250801410 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: get back to reinventing lisp machines < 1250801412 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fonts < 1250801413 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably not < 1250801423 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: :P < 1250801428 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He did get some predictions right, or rightish >.>. But still, a lot were wrong < 1250801430 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even you could design bitmap font < 1250801439 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Want me to post some of them? < 1250801440 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Fuck you, typography is awesome < 1250801443 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1250801445 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is < 1250801457 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: uri geller has been right about some football games too < 1250801488 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Something else that would be nice: just arbitrarily define the Avogadro constant. Voila, kilogram in terms of the mass of ^{12}C. < 1250801520 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"People typically have at least a dozen computers on and around their bodies, which are networked using "body LANs (local area networks)." < 1250801530 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On their bodies. < 1250801533 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least a dozen? < 1250801537 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is some new definition of "true". < 1250801543 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Body LANs? < 1250801551 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I wasn't posting an example of what he got right. < 1250801554 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not going to be common for another 5 to 10 years. < 1250801560 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Why a dozen? < 1250801561 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why not one? < 1250801563 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We don't need a dozen. < 1250801573 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We don't need "body LANs"; we have the internet. < 1250801590 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c6Q0dfrbr10 nice one < 1250801603 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Fair point. < 1250801614 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though a "body LAN" could carry TCP/IP, et viola. < 1250801618 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact, what he's talking about is 80s thinking. < 1250801621 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He got this at least half-right: "Computers routinely include moving picture image cameras and are able to reliably identify their owners from their faces." < 1250801627 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can't imagine a global network of everyone; that can't possibly work. < 1250801631 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: they cannot really do the latter < 1250801634 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not reliably < 1250801641 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You can't imagine one all-powerful computer. < 1250801641 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's why I said half-right < 1250801645 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course we need specialised ones. < 1250801654 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Hahah. < 1250801711 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to be random about what I'm posting. They're generally going to either be somewhat right or so dead wrong it's hilarious. < 1250801716 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Facial recognition is inherently heuristic (and therefore at least somewhat unreliable)... < 1250801760 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The majority of text is created using continuous speech recognition (CSR) dictation software, but keyboards are still used." < 1250801767 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hah. < 1250801773 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm better at typing than speaking. < 1250801777 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :More accurate, no trips, ... < 1250801791 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The extra speed of speech comes at a great cost. < 1250801801 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See, that sort of thinking is typical "future!". < 1250801805 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's different, and we can't do it now. < 1250801810 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Therefore, it must be something that we will do in the future. < 1250801817 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Never is "maybe it's actually not better" considered. < 1250801820 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION doesn't want to try to imagine programming via CSR < 1250801869 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My dad swears by it, though. >.> < 1250801876 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is your dad a programmer? < 1250801879 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No < 1250801883 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is he sane? < 1250801910 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The way he treats me sometimes, I'd think not. < 1250801933 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :woo, dysfunctional families \o/ < 1250801945 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not like he's physically abusive, at least < 1250801964 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well that's all right then < 1250801968 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or trying to stop me from going to college.. wait, actually, he kind of did in 2007 < 1250801969 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1250801981 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Durn kids and their, uhh education" < 1250801991 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@a-64.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1250801997 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He wanted me to go to college, just.. later, I think < 1250802005 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :After I went to Israel for a while < 1250802014 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why Israel? < 1250802017 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is he jewish? < 1250802024 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1250802044 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lawl < 1250802046 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This family is Jewish. I don't consider myself Jewish religion-wise < 1250802067 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I rather think that with Israel's actions, it would do the opposite of making me Jewish < 1250802125 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently, there's some program in Israel that my dad and step-mom thought would help "make me normal" or something. < 1250802139 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yuck < 1250802144 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yuck yuck yuck < 1250802169 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: "normal"? < 1250802180 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sionists < 1250802181 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not an evil atheist or something? :P < 1250802186 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: It's spelt with a z. < 1250802189 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yes, zionism is stupid. < 1250802189 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1250802197 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is < 1250802202 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, not that. They seem convinced that I couldn't live on my own, and had no responsibility. < 1250802216 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my mother thinks that :P < 1250802222 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but she's probably right) < 1250802289 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"$10 in Pennies is worth $18.05 if you melt them down for the copper." < 1250802296 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...do you think you could repeat this process? < 1250802309 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"That's not actually quite correct. $10 worth of 1909-1982 Lincoln copper pennies is worth $18.05 while $10 worth of 1982-2009 Lincoln zinc pennies is worth only $4.71. Thanks for the link though. +1" < 1250802310 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dammit < 1250802310 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: Y'know the way to fix that? Move out. < 1250802326 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want to move out, it sounds like hella fun < 1250802343 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: It is. It is also a PITA. < 1250802350 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, my dad has an apartment, but isn't letting me move there yet. He doesn't want the apartment ruined if I fail to clean. < 1250802369 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mentioned moving out on my own, and he said he'd cut off all support. < 1250802385 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yuck < 1250802390 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i live on my own < 1250802393 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :relly simple < 1250802395 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: sounds like your family sucks < 1250802396 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really < 1250802413 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :get a well paid job in IT or something < 1250802421 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :find a small apartament < 1250802425 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :working in IT is hell < 1250802429 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from what i gather. < 1250802433 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on symbolics lisp machine: "The old systems have a special console. No VGA" < 1250802437 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :buy food, pay rent and bills, party party party < 1250802437 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shame < 1250802449 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would be nice to hook up an lcd. < 1250802451 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: working is hell < 1250802459 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: but sometimes moreso than others < 1250802467 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I work in IT. < 1250802474 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, uh, porting MFC parts to OS X because someone orders you to do it < 1250802475 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc < 1250802500 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: yeah but your job is awesome (sample size: 1) < 1250802502 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, make an adapter? < 1250802506 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: how < 1250802508 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Indeed, it is. < 1250802514 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: analog and shit < 1250802520 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'm misunderstanding what MFC is. Isn't it the API provided by Windows for GUIs and stuff? < 1250802524 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you port that? < 1250802526 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: It is. < 1250802528 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: For general stuff < 1250802528 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, well and? There are VGA<->DVI adapters < 1250802529 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not just guis < 1250802530 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not only guis < 1250802532 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so clearly not impossible < 1250802533 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You reimplement it. < 1250802538 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :file support, strings, dates and such < 1250802542 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: brb, sytnthesizing a pony < 1250802543 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, just may require some knowledge of what you are doing < 1250802548 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*synthesizing < 1250802568 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: DVI cables can carry VGA signals directly on the wire. < 1250802568 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have all *.h files from MFC and i'm implementing the classes so that they comply their interfaces < 1250802574 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, correct. < 1250802575 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't there a thing to get WINE working in OS X? < 1250802575 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems Genera had no web browser < 1250802577 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unsurprising < 1250802581 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: wine supports os x < 1250802589 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but he means iphone < 1250802592 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ye < 1250802597 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also objective c stuff too < 1250802597 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, but I have seen converts to DVI-I or whatever it was called < 1250802600 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OS X is the first stage < 1250802608 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: Until the x86 port of OS X, it was kinda useless without qemu, but yes. < 1250802609 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then hopefully it would run on gayphone < 1250802610 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, ehird, so you basically figure out the electrical "protocol" of the analogue signal. < 1250802629 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Nontrivial, but doable. < 1250802641 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: get yourself an oscilloscope < 1250802644 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Must be fun, knowing that you're duplicating WINE's efforts, just so you can have what's basically WINE on iPhone < 1250802650 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: dude, shut up. < 1250802651 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, indeed, then you build a digital circuit to convert it to a digital signal < 1250802656 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: no < 1250802659 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mfc != win32api < 1250802660 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stfu < 1250802664 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, there are A/D converters after all < 1250802673 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: ah, i'm reimplementing a minimal subset used by a specific library < 1250802673 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, a subset of WINE on iPhone, then? < 1250802678 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you process that to render a picture, and re-emit it using display-port < 1250802679 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, ah. < 1250802681 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: MFC is a thick, thick wrapper on top of Win32. < 1250802682 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :problem solved < 1250802684 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's still simpler than reimplementing the library < 1250802685 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, pikhq ^ < 1250802686 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;P < 1250802689 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: jesus christ shut up < 1250802689 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :non-trivial indeed < 1250802712 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though by that notion, Qt is a thick, thick wrapper on top of X11. So... :P < 1250802713 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.cliki.net/Lisp%20Machine%20Videos < 1250802715 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION orgasm < 1250802724 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^__________^ lisp machine videooooooos < 1250802733 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh lame not actually vids < 1250802735 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just screencasts < 1250802741 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still < 1250802752 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :such a pretty interface < 1250802754 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow < 1250802755 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1-bit at its finest < 1250802760 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :screen capture on lispm? < 1250802774 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've never actually seen a Lisp machine before < 1250802775 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So < 1250802777 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://lispm.dyndns.org/lisp/pics/genera.jpg <-- physical NMI? :D < 1250802798 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zmacs? < 1250802925 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: ZLisp Emacs. < 1250802931 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guy sounds german < 1250802973 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: :) < 1250803006 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nmi? < 1250803047 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, ...... < 1250803049 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty cool < 1250803059 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Non-maskable interrupt. < 1250803072 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, you shouldn't be allowed to get a LISP machine. AND you are a hypocrite... who can't google < 1250803083 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en-gb&q=nmi&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8 < 1250803087 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :national microelectronics institute < 1250803090 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :national measurement institute < 1250803092 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en-gb&q=nmi+computer&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8 < 1250803093 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NMi netherlands < 1250803096 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, tried that? < 1250803097 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nautical mile < 1250803100 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :non-maskable interrupt < 1250803110 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, try adding the word "computer" < 1250803111 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as I said < 1250803118 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but sure, I shouldn't be allowed tog et a lisp machine because i didn't know one term < 1250803119 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which gets non-maskable interrupt at top < 1250803119 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck off < 1250803140 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, everyone geek should know NMI < 1250803156 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, everyone who wrote a kernel would know it < 1250803163 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i'm not a geek by your definition, that's okay, i don't give a shit about what you think < 1250803169 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm such an ungeek who doesn't know one acronym! < 1250803195 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Turn in your geek license. < 1250803206 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jesus fucking christ < 1250803206 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1250803213 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Computer displays built into eyeglasses are also used. These specialized glasses allow users to see the normal visual environment, while creating a virtual image that appears to hover in front of the viewer. The virtual images are created directly onto the user's retinas." < 1250803220 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Ehird has no sense of humor. < 1250803250 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, indeed < 1250803259 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool < 1250803276 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that Lisp Machines are so fucking über cool < 1250803379 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Translating Telephone technology (where you speak in English and your Japenese friend hears you in Japanese, and vice versa) is commonly used for many language pairs. It is a routine capability of an individual's personal computer, which also serves as her phone." < 1250803458 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then who was phone < 1250803459 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1250803511 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, http://www.creepypasta.com/yeah-so-quit-asking/ < 1250803520 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: ehird, everyone who wrote a kernel would know it << ehird's plan is not to write kernel < 1250803537 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he wants a kernel without kernel < 1250803537 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, oh right < 1250803546 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but everyone that wrote an OS would know about interrupts < 1250803550 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :including NMIs < 1250803700 0 :coppro!n=coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1250803723 0 :ehird!n=ehird@91.105.76.79 JOIN :#esoteric < 1250803759 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o.O didn't realize ehird wasn't here < 1250803875 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The total cost was around $750, including the PayPal surcharge. Note that the purchase also included a "New Type" keyboard." < 1250803934 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.sts.tu-harburg.de/~r.f.moeller/symbolics-info/Lasse-Rasinen/IMG_0716.JPG < 1250804025 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.sts.tu-harburg.de/~r.f.moeller/symbolics-info/Hannu-Koivistos-machines/symbolics-2-001.jpg < capacitors? < 1250804046 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psu? < 1250804054 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it looks so different from a modern computer < 1250804137 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION re-watches Space Mutiny < 1250804176 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gui looks pretty clever on those films < 1250804247 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, having to go through menu to move or resize window seems like a pain < 1250804254 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: "Turn in your geek license" is a joke, BTW. < 1250804263 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: uh, no < 1250804269 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :click, swipe, click < 1250804271 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quick as can be < 1250804280 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: oh, with minor changes it would be very usable < 1250804283 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for lisp stuff < 1250804284 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think < 1250804290 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :minor changes? why? < 1250804291 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is usable < 1250804298 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: kay < 1250804301 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like adding title bars to windows < 1250804309 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, err how did you open menu then < 1250804311 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least X buttons < 1250804320 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: right click < 1250804322 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga... It's an Emacs-like interface. < 1250804326 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, so that is two clicks < 1250804326 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea < 1250804327 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: ugh < 1250804329 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hate title bars < 1250804331 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i liked vim better < 1250804332 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, or three rather < 1250804334 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: "click, swipe, click" < 1250804337 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's "tiling". < 1250804340 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :menu, swipe, choose < 1250804342 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: it isn't tiling < 1250804343 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can tile < 1250804346 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it can float too < 1250804362 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Oh, okay. < 1250804365 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, 1) click to open menu, click to select resize, move mouse to where you want it to be resized, click to select that point < 1250804374 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/1)// < 1250804377 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plan 9 uses the same interface < 1250804380 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is perfectly usable < 1250804385 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I dislike it < 1250804392 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's better since you can move and resize in one click < 1250804399 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of two < 1250804400 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, uh how? < 1250804400 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one action < 1250804414 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: choose resize, click at starting point, drag at end point < 1250804416 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :voila < 1250804417 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, and very often I only want to move *or* resize < 1250804420 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not both < 1250804432 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so use tiling or patch the OS or STFU < 1250804481 0 :FIQ!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"- nbs-irc 2.39 - www.nbs-irc.net -" < 1250804510 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know what strikes me as "It sounds cool, so it will be the future"? The idea of a 3d web. < 1250804516 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1250804522 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a very horrible idea < 1250804556 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Things like SL are fun, but to force 3d to browse for information, and shopping? I see maybe utility for showing what a product might look like, but walking down a hall to shop? < 1250804568 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a reason that SL has a very 2d Xstreet SL < 1250804580 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :navigation is crap < 1250804585 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we have to in the physical world < 1250804588 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but hypertext is such a better model < 1250804595 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :space shouldn't exist < 1250804598 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's arbitrary < 1250804609 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :things are harder to get to because they just are, not for any reason < 1250804703 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Come to think of it, it would be on the same level as fighting monsters that guard the information you want. It's extending entertainment in such a way that it blocks productive use. < 1250804706 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can think of some reasons why 3D is a bad idea < 1250804717 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you and everyone else < 1250804730 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just think of a 3D game, and a 2D game. Which is easiest to keep track of where you are in < 1250804747 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2d is just as bad. < 1250804750 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than once in a third person shooter style game I managed to loose what direction I was looking in < 1250804750 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :theoretically < 1250804763 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, consider a side scroller, you tend to be able to keep better track of things < 1250804770 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh also < 1250804771 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT GAMES < 1250804779 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in 3D things are hidden behind other stuff < 1250804785 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure can be in 2D too < 1250804788 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT GAMES < 1250804792 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but isn't intrinistically so < 1250804794 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, nor am I < 1250804802 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes...you are... < 1250804803 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was just using it as an analogy < 1250804815 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A 3d web is like taking a game and forcing people who want information to play it. < 1250804816 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the whole point is that games are a bad analogy < 1250804818 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, no, about "hidden behind" I'm talking about navigation < 1250804820 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1250804824 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not talking about games at all < 1250804836 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sigh < 1250804903 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, in a 2D web page, all things are at one layer by default. Sure you can add image over text. Tends to be a sign of bad CSS in most cases. And image below text, which can be more ok (background image). But still fairly limited to a few layers < 1250804911 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :while this is not true for a 3D web < 1250804913 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jkldfjlkdsfjkdslfjkldsf you are missing the point _entirely_ < 1250804925 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where things are intrinsically behind each other < 1250804927 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hypertext, while rendered to be 2d, is fundamentally different from a 2d game < 1250804933 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: please try and explain to him < 1250804941 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, and I'm no longer talking about games < 1250804943 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so why are you < 1250804960 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're either being purposefully dense or are dense < 1250804965 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the last line I talked about game was " ehird, consider a side scroller, you tend to be able to keep better track of things" < 1250804971 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after that I left the game analogy < 1250804972 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1250804976 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you are being dense now < 1250804977 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not me < 1250804986 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the whole point is your model < 1250805000 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think we were considering more of the problem of navigation than rendering < 1250805017 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, I'm considering navigating in a 3D web page. < 1250805026 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and < 1250805031 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: he doesn't understand that how you navigate isn't just about the dimensions < 1250805039 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :navigation is made hard, if you can't see where things are < 1250805041 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas we were talking about 0-distance hypertext vs 2d/3d navigable space < 1250805048 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also he's on some sort of tirade about hiding < 1250805080 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hypertext isn't zero distance unless your mouse happens to be in the right place < 1250805081 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1250805091 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, I think the Worlds.com model would sort of, kind of, suckily, work < 1250805093 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or you tab to it < 1250805117 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: ...... < 1250805121 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Worlds can define a sort of 2d panel of links. Check out the lower-right < 1250805122 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:WorldsPlayer.PNG < 1250805129 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nigt < 1250805131 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: THAT IS NOT WHAT DISTANCE IN SPACE MEANS < 1250805131 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night* < 1250805146 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh my god, AnMaster is so idiotic i can't even believe < 1250805162 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: "the Wikipedia" < 1250805162 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, disseminating information in a 3d web is kind of insane, and a 3d web is still pointless except for the coolness factor < 1250805183 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I hope that was a typo on my part < 1250805282 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, you have an issue, mixing up "idiotic" and "lacking knowledge of the terms used" < 1250805286 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are quite different < 1250805295 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, if you read what Sgeo_ said, it was very obvious < 1250805314 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you're even intelligent inside your head, but your communication model is certainly one of the stupidest things i've ever interacted with < 1250805387 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I have no problems talking to most other people, either in here or elsewhere < 1250805396 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, so I guess our models are just non-compatible < 1250805410 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhh < 1250805415 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you had a problem talking to Sgeo_ < 1250805421 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since you completely misunderstood what he meant < 1250805428 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas i only have a problem with you < 1250805428 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, only when said person is interacting with you < 1250805438 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: hear that? talking with me makes you stupid. < 1250805444 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's quantum transferodynamic. < 1250805447 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I guess you force a certain mode. < 1250805451 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw < 1250805454 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :about PSU < 1250805466 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my laptop has a 65W external PSU < 1250805495 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1250805508 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I force a certain mode! < 1250805517 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better stop talking to me, people; you'll become idiotic. < 1250805543 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm apparently $100,000 was the most expensive symbolics system < 1250805724 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[Like everyone outside the US, I was grossly overcharged by Symbolics UK (some $40,000 per annum in maintenance charges alone). < 1250805724 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Read more: http://www.asl.dsl.pipex.com/symbolics/how_to_get.html#ixzz0Ol8aLpJ]] < 1250805727 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh < 1250805730 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that stupid read more script < 1250805740 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gtfo my browser < 1250805762 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm? < 1250805768 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when i copied it that link appeared. < 1250805776 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also sent off the snippet i copied to a server < 1250805777 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for analysis < 1250805786 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...wtf? < 1250805793 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a new company < 1250805794 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck them < 1250805797 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :almost enough to disable js < 1250805830 0 :M0ny!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1250805833 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1250806130 0 :Sneezle!n=marten@dyndsl-095-033-020-069.ewe-ip-backbone.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1250806253 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I am designing a VGA+PS/2 keyboard/mouse box to replace the console." < 1250806254 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 < 1250806454 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Note: LISP Machines themselves are Y2K compliant, for if ever your date overflows from fixnum format, the hardware will automatically use bignum instead, transparently for the user" < 1250806458 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :god, i love lispms < 1250806516 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :God, that's awesome. < 1250806556 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, iirc some system clock issue still < 1250806578 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1250806611 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.asl.dsl.pipex.com/symbolics/photos/IO/keyboard-9647.jpg < 1250806611 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HA < 1250806612 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Better stop talking to me, people; you'll become idiotic. <-- I never claimed "idiotic". Just temporarily incompatible with either my communication model or ehird's (pikhq often falls in this category) < 1250806615 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control in the bottom row < 1250806617 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais seems to manage still < 1250806627 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Proving that the caps lock remappers are stupid! < 1250806634 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control in the bottom row ftw! < 1250806642 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, eh yeah? < 1250806650 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why should it be elsewhere < 1250806654 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: many people swap caps lock and control, supposedly to be more ergonomic < 1250806657 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :These people know nothing about ergonomics. < 1250806659 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhu < 1250806662 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They hate their pinkies with a fiery passion. < 1250806668 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have Caps Lock as another control. < 1250806669 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1250806679 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, are you sure that keyboard you linked is ergonomic though? < 1250806688 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Not globally < 1250806692 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But control being there is MORE ergonomic < 1250806697 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :than where capslock would be < 1250806697 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1250806701 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, also, i18n < 1250806704 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and l10n < 1250806709 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about it < 1250806710 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, what sort of freaky hands do you have that makes *anything* where Ctrl is ergonomic? < 1250806716 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I want one with åäö as well < 1250806722 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: MORE ergonomic. < 1250806729 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But look at the lisp machine keyboard; it has control right next to spacebar. < 1250806732 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*That* is perfect. < 1250806735 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suggest a control pedal < 1250806738 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's where command is on Apple keyboards < 1250806740 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, *there*. < 1250806741 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it works brilliantly < 1250806743 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, no it isn't < 1250806747 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it i < 1250806747 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s < 1250806754 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is under the middle of my palm < 1250806763 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...what? < 1250806765 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :while about tab would be good for ctrl for my hands < 1250806766 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1250806772 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, your hands are too big < 1250806775 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, you have small hands < 1250806776 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so nobody cares. < 1250806780 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, that is under my palm as well. < 1250806791 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, it is you who have small hands < 1250806796 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My thumb has to curl in almost entirely to hit that. < 1250806797 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :evidently steve jobs has small hands too. < 1250806798 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :caps lock as ctrl would be nice < 1250806802 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1250806803 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :better than current ctrl < 1250806804 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it won't < 1250806806 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least < 1250806808 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's dangerous < 1250806811 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for your fingers < 1250806812 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, not for YOUR hands no < 1250806812 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the current Ctrl, well... < 1250806817 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, I mean in general < 1250806821 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is no way it can be ergonomic < 1250806822 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, xmodmap line? < 1250806826 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My finger almost comes out of its socket hitting the normal control. < 1250806836 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(http://www.asl.dsl.pipex.com/symbolics/photos/IO/keyboard-9647.jpg / square, circle and triangle; where's the x? how are they going to make a playstation emulator?!) < 1250806843 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, or similar < 1250806855 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :current ctrl is nice when you go for ctrl-h or so < 1250806864 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but caps lock would work fine then too < 1250806874 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is purl.org unlikely to die anytime soon? < 1250806878 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :keysym Caps_Lock = Control_L < 1250806881 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I lost my PURL password < 1250806894 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, thanks < 1250806902 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :purl.org dying is very unlikely. < 1250806905 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Ctrl as caps lock is the only option that doesn't almost make my finger go out of its socket. < 1250806910 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to claim that as ergonomic. < 1250806919 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, how to reload < 1250806948 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Uh. keysym Caps_Lock = Caps_Lock? < 1250806955 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, no I mean < 1250806961 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :reload the xmodmaprc file < 1250806967 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xmodmap -e xmodmaprc < 1250806984 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xmodmap: unknown command on line commandline:1 < 1250806985 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh < 1250806992 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used PURL once, but the place it linked to is gone, and I can't log in :( < 1250807005 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, can I use a PURL address for openID purposes? < 1250807017 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, ^ < 1250807031 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, isn't the right file ~/.xmodmaprc iirc? < 1250807034 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make, say, /NET/sgeo/openid link to an HTML page that does whatever OpenID stuff is needed? < 1250807036 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: No -e < 1250807043 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: Yes. < 1250807049 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay! < 1250807056 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1250807057 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: But just direct it directly to your openid provider. < 1250807058 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't work < 1250807063 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Much simpler. < 1250807064 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :caps lock is still caps lock < 1250807065 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, 302s work that way? < 1250807070 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any idea? < 1250807078 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: If they don't work that way, then directing it to an html page is useless < 1250807078 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ cat ~/.xmodmaprc < 1250807078 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :keysym Caps_Lock = Control_L < 1250807081 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as it'd only work as long as the html page < 1250807086 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus defeating the point of a purl < 1250807086 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yes < 1250807089 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and now: < 1250807090 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ xmodmap ~/.xmodmaprc < 1250807091 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xmodmap: /home/arvid/.xmodmaprc:1: bad keysym target keysym 'Caps_Lock', no corresponding keycodes < 1250807091 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xmodmap: 1 error encountered, aborting. < 1250807092 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1250807118 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it still does damn caps lock function < 1250807126 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, tell me what is wrong pikhq! < 1250807132 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay, I remember my PURL password! < 1250807135 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://world.std.com/~jdostale/kbd/KanjiTablet1.jpeg ; symbolics kanji keyboard < 1250807144 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: btw, most people use /net/, not /NET/ < 1250807155 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah >.> < 1250807172 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: What I'd do is, have http://purl.org/net/sgeo < 1250807184 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Point this at an HTML page with the openid meta tags pointing to whatever provider < 1250807189 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as well as a home page if you want < 1250807195 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e., don't have a separate openid page < 1250807197 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't just point it to the provider? < 1250807198 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since the openid is "you" < 1250807203 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: see ↑ < 1250807212 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1250807213 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :having a separate openid page is technically fine, but kinda misses the point < 1250807220 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus, http://purl.org/net/sgeo is shorter :P < 1250807231 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'm just going to point it to the provider for now < 1250807246 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, point is that it can represent non-openid too < 1250807290 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"We made our own < 1250807290 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :monitor electronics, our own laser-printer electronics, we wrote < 1250807290 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the microcode, we wrote the operating system, and so on, but making < 1250807290 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :our own keys was, finally, below the level of abstraction that demarked < 1250807291 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :our build/buy line. We were really, really crazy, but we were not < 1250807291 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really, really, really, really crazy." < 1250807476 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, < 1250807480 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, what worked was: < 1250807487 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :setxkbmap -option ctrl:nocaps < 1250807493 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xmodmap just doesn't work at all < 1250807503 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, might be interesting to know < 1250807622 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1250807658 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night < 1250807676 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : or why else would he quit the computer? < 1250807688 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mainly because i was going to take the bus afterwards < 1250807696 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh ok < 1250807701 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night really < 1250807743 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i've had the bad luck before of going into the shower without turning off the computer, coming back to catch up on irc, and missing the bus :/D < 1250807832 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ...he has a water proof computer! < 1250807842 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :logic is a marvelous thing, isn't it :) < 1250807958 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1250807973 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=behold@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1250808310 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, when I try using Purl, the sites still say that my identity is the underlying provider < 1250808320 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, of course. < 1250808328 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: but they'll identify you by the purl url, no? < 1250808335 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Therefore if you change the purl location, you can still login. < 1250808349 0 :oklokok!n=oklopol@a91-153-125-186.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1250808353 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, seems to me that they'd identify me by the provider < 1250808370 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: Well, try it and see. < 1250808376 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Log in as your purl, change your purl to another provider, try again. < 1250808382 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not now, I have other stuff to deal with < 1250808389 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: Create another purl to do it if you want to avoid breaking things. < 1250808739 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1250809437 0 :Gracenotes!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer) < 1250809834 0 :kwertii!n=kwertii@67.180.202.175 JOIN :#esoteric < 1250810032 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1250810859 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Later" < 1250811544 0 :ehird!n=ehird@91.105.76.79 JOIN :#esoteric < 1250811691 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1250812176 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"bye" < 1250812198 0 :kwertii!n=kwertii@67.180.202.175 JOIN :#esoteric < 1250812327 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there should be spoons that close up once you put something on them then open when they reach your mouth. my hands are shaking :P < 1250812345 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I believe those are called "tongs" < 1250812363 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Grog. There's a charity that was founded to provide free healthcare to third world countries. Said charity is providing healthcare in the US. < 1250812363 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1250812370 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Because we need it more than they do. < 1250812377 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Marge... do we have any of those things that you use to... dig.... food....?" < 1250812411 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: It's entirely possible your healthcare system is worse :P < 1250812419 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: shaddap you < 1250812448 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: In poorer regions, our life expectancy is about on par with Bosnia. < 1250812473 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Lucky Bosnia! < 1250812478 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cuba's overall life expectancy is higher than the US < 1250812497 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kwertii: And their healthcare system is a bit better. < 1250812509 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: US healthcare is the best in the world.... if you're rich < 1250812535 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Rich" as in "can pay for it all yourself, no insurance needed". < 1250812537 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1250812558 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Republicans don't seem to realise that if they want their granny not to be brutally murdered by a death panel (I mean, assuming that would happen, which it wouldn't) they could just do what they're doing now and pay for it... < 1250812571 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yet poor people are going out to heckle congressional representatives on behalf of the insurance companies *sighs* < 1250812582 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless they're okay with their grannies dying as long as a "death panel" wasn't involved :P < 1250812637 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"death panel" is one of their linguists' contrivances (like "death tax" and "tax relief") to push their agenda subtly even when opponents talk by the inherent framing of the debate in those terms. (cf. Don't Think of an Elephant by George Lakoff) < 1250812662 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course < 1250812677 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just in awe that the republicans don't understand that it's not mandatory < 1250812679 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I have to say, the Democrats really, really suck at that sort of thing. They control both houses of Congress and have the most popular president in 40 years, and they *still* can't get healthcare reform passed. < 1250812694 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1250812701 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1250812706 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: they understand perfectly well at the higher levels. the rank-and-file are stupid and easily manipulable < 1250812710 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're not even trying to push the best model - single payer health care < 1250812716 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the reform they want is a total compromise < 1250812771 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: http://incredimazing.com/static/media/2009/08/19/Itawb/itawb.jpg < 1250812793 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :remind me why people like the US :-P