< 1254787438 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1254788933 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: English. < 1254788947 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/bother < 1254788958 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :US pronunciation: /'bɑðɚ/ < 1254790004 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Freaking English. < 1254790428 0 :coppro!n=coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1254791458 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1254792065 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is trying to get at least one article on tvtropes finished < 1254792117 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn you < 1254792119 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean i can't not get them finished because i keep opening sublinks or anything, the articles are just really, really boring < 1254792119 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, oh? < 1254792137 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll try again tomorrow < 1254792148 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_o < 1254792172 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh, you mean read one < 1254792174 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1254792184 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, yes < 1254792202 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never contribute to any of the web2 stuff < 1254792231 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tip: don't read every example in a tvtropes article < 1254792287 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's git's equivalent of checkout? < 1254792295 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sleep time! -> < 1254792759 0 :augur!n=augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr2.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1254794389 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: What you mean by "checkout"? < 1254794520 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Checkout in approximately the meaning SVN uses it? < 1254794921 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: yeah, got it, thanks for asking < 1254794964 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Useful git lession: Figure out exactly what clone does. < 1254794984 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: heh. I know what it does. Distributed RCS and all < 1254794999 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just don't care when I'm trying to retrieve a source tree so I can build + install < 1254795020 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: There's also the infamous remote snapshot. < 1254795044 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Infamous because it almost never works. < 1254795046 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1254795064 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(due to server not authorizing it). < 1254795530 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1254802894 0 :bsmntbombdood_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :bsmntbombdood < 1254803193 0 :Zombie_Will!n=x@216-164-152-178.c3-0.eas-ubr10.atw-eas.pa.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1254807839 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Good night" < 1254809626 0 :Zombie_Will!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Will_Relaxing < 1254810935 0 :FireFly!n=FireFly@1-1-3-36a.tul.sth.bostream.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1254810939 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer) < 1254810953 0 :MizardX!i=MizardX@79.136.28.236 JOIN :#esoteric < 1254811695 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1254812807 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Later" < 1254812866 0 :amca!n=amca@CPE-121-208-82-97.qld.bigpond.net.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1254812918 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1254814164 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@jol13-1-82-66-176-74.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1254814788 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The "job offers" noticeboard here was crowded enough so the posters had been interleaved a bit; one had changed so that they were now looking for "Python oders". < 1254814811 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm sure there is at least one "Ode to Python" thing, but I didn't realize you could do that sort of thing professionally. < 1254815432 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1254815784 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION eats fizzie's poori < 1254815999 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1254816000 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1254816365 0 :Will_Relaxing!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Zombie_Will < 1254816395 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1254816891 0 :Rugxulo!n=chatzill@adsl-065-013-115-246.sip.mob.bellsouth.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1254816906 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no ehird? I'm surprised ... < 1254817900 0 :adam_d!n=Adam@cpc2-acto6-0-0-cust48.brnt.cable.ntl.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1254819207 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1254819282 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :howdy howdy < 1254819706 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1254819726 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch, Evolution seems to have deleted my timetable < 1254819740 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, I left my keys at home < 1254820393 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1254820418 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1254820797 0 :amca!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Farewell" < 1254821032 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1254821071 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1254821183 0 :rodgort!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1254821292 0 :rodgort!n=rodgort@li14-39.members.linode.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1254821370 0 :rodgort!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1254821423 0 :rodgort!n=rodgort@li14-39.members.linode.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1254823592 0 :ais523!i=93bcfa33@gateway/web/freenode/x-avmeeeifjtsnmcnd JOIN :#esoteric < 1254823898 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :robinson.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1254823902 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :robinson.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1254823902 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :robinson.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1254823902 0 :Leonidas!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :robinson.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1254823902 0 :adam_d!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :robinson.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1254823902 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :robinson.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1254823907 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :robinson.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1254823927 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :robinson.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1254823933 0 :adam_d!n=Adam@cpc2-acto6-0-0-cust48.brnt.cable.ntl.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1254823933 0 :dbc!n=daniel@130-94-161-238-dsl.hevanet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1254823933 0 :pikhq!n=pikhq@r02jjw8v9.device.mst.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1254823933 0 :Deewiant!n=deewiant@kosh.hut.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1254823933 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@97-118-124-89.hlrn.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1254823933 0 :Leonidas!n=Leonidas@unaffiliated/leonidas JOIN :#esoteric < 1254823933 0 :Warrigal!n=warrie@lunch.normish.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1254823992 0 :oklopol!n=oklopol@a91-153-117-63.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1254824086 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wb everyone who was on the other side of that netsplitt < 1254824281 0 :MigoMipo!i=3e779bfd@gateway/web/freenode/x-txhtpkviwznckggm JOIN :#esoteric < 1254824284 0 :acloglio!n=oklopol@a91-153-117-63.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1254824717 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=behold@62.119.155.253 JOIN :#esoteric < 1254824791 0 :FireFly!i=3e779bfd@gateway/web/freenode/x-lydeswoaylnlmrex JOIN :#esoteric < 1254825091 0 :atrapado!n=roper@130.58.117.91.dynamic.mundo-r.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1254825426 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1254826262 0 :acloglio!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1254826277 0 :oklopol!n=oklopol@a91-153-117-63.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1254826679 0 :jix!n=jix@f054015039.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1254827321 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Page closed" < 1254828456 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1254828501 0 :MigoMipo!i=3e779bfd@gateway/web/freenode/x-xnbtvccdzltsiuyw JOIN :#esoteric < 1254828822 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1254829399 0 :adam_d!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1254829439 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Page closed" < 1254829825 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1254829835 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1254831217 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1254831316 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 180 seconds < 1254833917 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1254837093 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1254838491 0 :atrapado!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Ex-Chat" < 1254838525 0 :puzzlet_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1254838530 0 :puzzlet!n=puzzlet@147.46.241.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1254838642 0 :ais523!i=93bc1b86@gateway/web/freenode/x-pdumhiutahrmmltw JOIN :#esoteric < 1254839159 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=behold@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1254839387 0 :puzzlet!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1254839452 0 :puzzlet!n=puzzlet@147.46.241.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1254839771 0 :Pthing!n=pthing@77-100-194-169.cable.ubr04.pres.blueyonder.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1254840788 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Page closed" < 1254842009 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1254843020 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :robinson.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1254843021 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :robinson.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1254843021 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :robinson.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1254843026 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :robinson.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1254843081 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=behold@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1254843081 0 :augur!n=augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr2.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1254843081 0 :coppro!n=coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1254843081 0 :AnMaster!n=AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1254843118 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :SendQ exceeded < 1254843157 0 :AnMaster!n=AnMaster@d83-177-106-207.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1254843448 0 :FireFly!n=FireFly@1-1-3-36a.tul.sth.bostream.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1254844046 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"I am leaving. You are about to explode." < 1254844832 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1254844850 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi everyone < 1254844868 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523 < 1254844890 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is annoyed at today's lecture about Latex < 1254844904 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the lecturer was trying to enumerate a number of things that differed between Latex and word < 1254844906 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Word < 1254844914 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but all but one was actually a similarity rather than a difference < 1254844928 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there /are/ reasons to use Latex over Word, but he didn't actually manage any of them < 1254845608 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :robinson.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1254845608 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :robinson.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1254845614 0 :ineiros!n=itniemin@james.ics.hut.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1254845643 0 :mtve!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :robinson.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1254845645 0 :Gregor!n=gregor@65.183.185.22 JOIN :#esoteric < 1254845652 0 :mtve!n=nnmtve@65.98.99.53 JOIN :#esoteric < 1254845738 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Later" < 1254845780 0 :BeholdMyGlory_!n=behold@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1254845857 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1254845862 0 :BeholdMyGlory_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :BeholdMyGlory < 1254845873 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :robinson.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1254845887 0 :augur!n=augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr2.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1254846076 0 :MigoMipo!i=54d90afb@gateway/web/freenode/x-rbjcvfnhegxbhkts JOIN :#esoteric < 1254846200 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :robinson.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1254846221 0 :augur!n=augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr2.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1254846345 0 :MigoMipo_!i=54d90afb@gateway/web/freenode/x-mjgyszoeyfsuqwpw JOIN :#esoteric < 1254846370 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1254846379 0 :MigoMipo_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :MigoMipo < 1254846585 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1254846589 0 :augur!n=augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr2.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1254847726 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, ouch < 1254848096 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, lets see... I can think of think of: consistent formatting, better math support, good support for citations and such through bibtex, much better line breaking algorithm (two justified margins looks horrible in word), easy to automate stuff with it (auto generating tables from source data or such, sure word has VBA but no one can claim that is easy to use..), and several more < 1254848111 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which of those did he mention? < 1254848128 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, he did get the line breaking algorithm < 1254848135 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, that was all? < 1254848135 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :none of the others, though < 1254848145 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he did mention lots of things that both Word and LaTeX are good at < 1254848153 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and claimed them as advantages for LaTeX < 1254848160 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, line breaking algorithm is a fairly minor point compared to the three first ones < 1254848179 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bibtex in particular is wonderful < 1254848185 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :consistent formatting is possible in Word using styles < 1254848202 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, easy to break by unapplying the style for some part IME < 1254848230 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that easily happens by mistake < 1254848231 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but if you're careful not to break it, you can manage it < 1254848269 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, yeah you need to be super-careful to fool word's "helpful" features trying to guess what sort of formatting you want too < 1254848271 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example < 1254848306 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, and it takes a bit of setup to get it working. With LaTeX it is the default < 1254848330 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, you don't have to figure out where to set sections to be numbered for example < 1254848757 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, ever used xfig? < 1254848764 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: not really < 1254848772 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have it installed, but I haven't used it < 1254848782 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the UI looks horrible. think xdialog style on controls < 1254848801 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bitmapped fonts too I think < 1254849026 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you need to add colours to a palette before you can use them if you don't want any of the standard ~35 or so < 1254849029 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm 33 it seems < 1254849082 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, btw about LaTeX. Any good way to include nice looking function graphs? Like say y=x^2 or something like that < 1254849093 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice looking, vector graphics if possible < 1254849097 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's probably a package for it < 1254849113 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, sure but I have no clue what one. < 1254849166 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, btw it turned out there was a package to illustrate the Gaussian method http://www.ctan.org/tex-archive/macros/latex/contrib/gauss/ < 1254849203 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hehh, of course. < 1254849267 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, now I just have to learn how to use that without messing up the system installation (basically I want to install it somewhere in $HOME < 1254849353 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a feeling that TeX installations by default include ~/texmf in the relevant paths, but it needs to be a proper texmf tree. < 1254849384 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Personally I've just been putting such approximately-one-use-only packages to the same directory with the .tex file itself. < 1254849400 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1254849407 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.tex.ac.uk/cgi-bin/texfaq2html?label=privinst is something I've referred to before, I think. < 1254849503 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1254849534 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm what does *.sty actually stand for? < 1254849558 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh "style" it seems < 1254849787 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw I found out cfunge bzr needed a later cmake than 2.6... 2.6.3 at least. This is actually due to how the ncurses check is now done after input on it from ehird < 1254849826 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(basically it turns out "if" in cmake before 2.6.3 didn't support parentheses...) < 1254849855 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1254849905 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.115 JOIN :#esoteric < 1254850072 0 :Cerise!i=jerry@81-89-105-25.blue.kundencontroller.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1254850100 0 :Cerise!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Guest32954 < 1254850308 0 :Guest32954!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Cerise < 1254850334 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@jol13-1-82-66-176-74.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1254850692 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, given a *.sty or such with embedded latex documentation as comments how do you generate the documentation pdf from it < 1254850694 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I always wondered < 1254851043 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it's a .dtx file, which is that "literate-tex, can create both documentation and code" thing, it should be possible to just run it through LaTeX as a source file to generate the documentation. < 1254851060 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It redefines % no longer to be a comment or something; I don't really know the details. < 1254851275 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, it is actually an *.sty < 1254851340 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it might be still in the correct "doc" package format; I don't know. Have you tried to feed it to LaTeX like that? < 1254851371 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah didn't work as expected < 1254851402 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LaTeX Warning: You have requested package `', < 1254851402 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : but the package provides `gauss'. < 1254851408 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then just a prompt < 1254851576 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I guess it's not a doc/docstrip-using literate-tex file; the comments seem to be just, well, comments. < 1254851624 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm doc/docstrip might be worth a try < 1254851627 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just have to find doc < 1254851657 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not that; if it were using that style, it should be runnable as a tex file to generate the documentation. < 1254851794 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, or actually I'm not sure; I guess the doc package uses a separate driver file. < 1254851914 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's like a normal article file, except it does \usepackage{doc} and \DocInput{blah.dtx} (or .sty, I guess), and it'll slurp in the comment lines there. < 1254851943 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm no < 1254851962 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, look at http://www.ctan.org/get/macros/latex/contrib/gauss/gauss.sty yourself < 1254851971 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I did look. < 1254851995 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't look like any of the standard ways < 1254852020 0 :lifthrasiir!i=kFM9z3Gt@haje12.kaist.ac.kr JOIN :#esoteric < 1254852135 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I did get the documentation made out of it. < 1254852157 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With a doc driver file: < 1254852162 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fis@eris:~/tmp/gauss$ cat gauss.tex < 1254852162 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\documentclass{article} < 1254852162 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\usepackage{doc} < 1254852162 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\usepackage{gauss} < 1254852162 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\begin{document} < 1254852163 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : \DocInput{gauss.sty} < 1254852165 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\end{document} < 1254852197 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't be sure if that's how the author does it, or if he has a trivial script to collect the % lines and stick them in a article container template like that. < 1254852251 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You can replace "\documentclass{article} \usepackage{doc}" with a "\documentclass{ltxdoc}" in that driver file, but it still needs the \usepackage{gauss} in there.) < 1254852505 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, how? < 1254852521 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't managed to get doc to work. docstrip yes... but not doc < 1254852528 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah hm < 1254852554 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean like a wrapper file for it < 1254852561 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, isn't that what I said? < 1254852573 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yes it was. I just misread you first time < 1254852770 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :about creating graphs it seems that with pure latex you are more or less forced to use pstricks < 1254852782 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however xfig seems able to export to this < 1254852800 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good unless you need an exact plot of something like x^2 or whatever < 1254852808 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://glx.sourceforge.net/ looks promising though < 1254852836 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :found in gentoo, but as far as I can find, not in ubuntu < 1254853350 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GNUplot creates various latex-related outputs too, and you can get reasonably pleasant output from it, it's not just the most user-friendly thing around. < 1254853407 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's the "latex", "pslatex", "pstricks" and "postscript" drivers, all of which can be used. < 1254853431 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and "eepic". < 1254853457 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 105 (No buffer space available) < 1254853553 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The "eepic" and "pstricks" drivers obviously use those related packages; I'm not quite sure what the plain "latex" does; the "pslatex" driver outputs both a .tex file and a .ps file, draws the graph itself with postscript and does labels and such with LaTeX; and finally the "postscript" driver can of course just generate a regular .eps file for inclusion if you don't care so much. < 1254853589 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course if you're willing to dabble with xfig, user-friendliness must not be very high on your list of priorities. < 1254853628 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, does it end up as vector graphics in a resuling pdf? < 1254853648 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, also I'm likely to use inkscape then export to something xfig can import then convert that < 1254853659 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RATHER than using xfig for all of the process < 1254853684 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eeeh... why don't you just go directly from inkscape to something you can include in the LaTeX document? < 1254853698 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.eps for latex+dvips+ps2pdf, .pdf for pdflatex. < 1254853702 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway since lyx at least can import svg from inkscape directly, it shouldn't be needed, except possibly the fonts will end up fitting better what with is used in the document < 1254853719 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, fonts for text in the image < 1254853725 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like y = x^2 or whatever < 1254853744 0 :Slereah!n=butt@ANantes-259-1-95-188.w92-139.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1254853750 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, well. I haven't tried xfig's latex-exportation parts. < 1254853818 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, the gnuplot drivers that are explicitly tex-related (latex, eepic, pstricks, pslatex) do the "can do math mode in labels and the fonts match your document" thing. < 1254853836 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is (mathematically speaking) sin(x) = tan(x)cos(x) ? < 1254853848 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would guess it isn't because tan(x) isn't defined for some values < 1254853853 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the other hand < 1254853876 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you simplify it symbolically rather than plotting it on a calculator you will get it defined for those values < 1254853905 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, sounds good. Now to learn gnuplot :P < 1254853925 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as long as it is vector graphics rather than bitmap it should be fine < 1254853936 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and yeah labels look right) < 1254853975 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :evil idea: Plotting sin(1/x) with vector graphics for values between -1 and 1 < 1254854036 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Generally any plotting tools you might use still end up sampling the function at regular intervals. < 1254854125 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, you could plot x^2 as a simple vector graphics curve (whatever that name was, slipped my mind atm). < 1254854201 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Spline? < 1254854210 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, maybe. Something on B iirc? < 1254854237 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway my guess is something like x^2 should be simple to represent as a vector-thingy < 1254854252 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and stuff like 2x+4 would definitely be simple to represent as that < 1254854260 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are all kinds of splines; you can plot x^2 with a simple quadratic spline. < 1254854371 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And if you're going to use anything regular (like gnuplot), it will still just sample the function and write a polyline-ish shape with a hundred points in it, instead of trying to find out how to represent the function you're plotting with any fancy "primitives". < 1254854388 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1254854523 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, "on B", you mean a Bézier curve? < 1254854577 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Or a Bézier spline, which is just a number of those put together.) < 1254854606 0 :Asztal!n=asztal@host86-156-195-201.range86-156.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1254854695 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PostScript primitives are pretty much a line, a cubic Bézier curve and an arc (of a circle). < 1254854719 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yeah probably < 1254854817 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, argh how does one plot in gnuplot < 1254854827 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't find any tutorial or such < 1254854839 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With the "plot" command. < 1254854856 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Results 1 - 10 of about 191,000 for gnuplot tutorial. (0.20 seconds) -- you really should be able to find one. < 1254854884 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm was looking on official website < 1254855101 0 :augur!n=augur@129-2-175-79.wireless.umd.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1254855325 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :arvid@dragon ~/tmp $ head -n2 sin1_x.tex < 1254855325 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :% GNUPLOT: LaTeX picture < 1254855325 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\setlength{\unitlength}{0.240900pt} < 1254855325 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :arvid@dragon ~/tmp $ file sin1_x.tex < 1254855325 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sin1_x.tex: Bio-Rad .PIC Image File 8229 x 20039, 20565 images in file < 1254855327 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh? < 1254855336 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, quite a identification failure eh? < 1254855397 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh. < 1254855590 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :54 leshort 12345 Bio-Rad .PIC Image File < 1254855631 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it looks at byte 54 for little-endian short field with decimal 12345; that's 0x3039; in little-endian order bytes 39, 30; that's ascii "90". < 1254855663 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably the "90" from "0.240900", that looks like it'd be around byte 54. < 1254855831 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same for the numbers; 8229 => 0x2025 => 25,20 => "% ", 20039 => 0x4e47 => 47,4e => "GN", 20565 => 0x5055 => 55,50 => "UP". < 1254855894 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ head -n3 sin1_x.tex < 1254855894 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :% GNUPLOT: LaTeX picture with Postscript < 1254855894 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\begingroup < 1254855894 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : \makeatletter < 1254855901 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ file sin1_x.tex < 1254855901 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sin1_x.tex: graphviz graph text < 1254855903 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah right < 1254855905 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# Bio-Rad .PIC is an image format used by microscope control systems < 1254855905 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# and related image processing software used by biologists. < 1254855905 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See: let a biologist design a file format, and he'll think a suitable magic is to look for "90" in offset 54. < 1254855941 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And, well, this is what my magic file has to say about graphviz: < 1254855943 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# graphviz: file(1) magic for http://www.graphviz.org/ < 1254855944 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# FIXME: These patterns match too generally. For example, the first < 1254855944 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# line matches a LaTeX file containing the word "graph" (with a { < 1254855944 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# following later) and the second line matches this file. < 1254855944 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#0 regex/100 [\r\n\t\ ]*graph[\r\n\t\ ]+.*\\{ graphviz graph text < 1254855944 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#!:mime text/vnd.graphviz < 1254855946 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#0 regex/100 [\r\n\t\ ]*digraph[\r\n\t\ ]+.*\\{ graphviz digraph text < 1254855948 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#!:mime text/vnd.graphviz < 1254855967 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 145 (Connection timed out) < 1254855987 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They have, in fact, been commented out in this version. < 1254856157 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1254856476 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what would happen if you mounted / on some system A over nfs into /mnt/A on system B. Then mounted / from B into /mnt/B on A? < 1254856492 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does nfs nest at all? even if not cyclic < 1254856534 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1254856880 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a feeling it should (I mean, you're free to NFS-export any path even if multiple local filesystems live there), but I guess it's possible people have built in some sanity-checks to avoid that sort of thing. < 1254857009 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know there's some sort of cycle-avoidance thing in bind mounts: http://pastebin.com/m7a3152f6 < 1254857037 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :boring < 1254857153 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or is that just because I didn't use rbind, actually? < 1254857181 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, doesn't load here. just hangs < 1254857190 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then I always had issues with pastebin.com < 1254857205 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.ca works and so do most others < 1254857223 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it took quite a while to load here too; it did work in the end, though. < 1254857245 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a pitty rafb stopped < 1254857247 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doesn't work differently with --rbind though. < 1254857254 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it used to load faster than all other ones < 1254857385 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, for the reference, here's the same thing with --rbind and two directories: http://pastebin.ca/1599059 < 1254857479 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er, with the exception that I can't umount it now; I did umount d2/d1 first, and now d1/d2 says it's "busy". < 1254857547 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, err... < 1254857570 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, I had to umount d1/d2/d1 manually too, even though it didn't end up in mtab. It seems like with --rbind it copies those mounts, doesn't quite "share" them the way I wanted. < 1254857595 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, check /proc/mounts < 1254857605 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Too late now, since I already umounted it. < 1254857613 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :easy to mount again < 1254857628 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm pretty sure that's what it'd say, though. < 1254857637 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, nfs should allow proper cyclic file system mounts though < 1254857656 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming there is no detection for it < 1254857696 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can get proper infinitely-deep directories with a filesystem image and a hex editor, too. < 1254857708 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fis@eris:~$ sudo mount --rbind /home/fis/d1 /home/fis/d2/d1 < 1254857708 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fis@eris:~$ sudo mount --rbind /home/fis/d2 /home/fis/d1/d2 < 1254857708 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fis@eris:~$ cat /proc/mounts | grep 'd[12]' < 1254857708 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/dev/mapper/vg-home /home/fis/d2/d1 ext3 rw,relatime,errors=continue,data=writeback,usrquota,grpquota 0 0 < 1254857708 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/dev/mapper/vg-home /home/fis/d1/d2 ext3 rw,relatime,errors=continue,data=writeback,usrquota,grpquota 0 0 < 1254857708 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/dev/mapper/vg-home /home/fis/d1/d2/d1 ext3 rw,relatime,errors=continue,data=writeback,usrquota,grpquota 0 0 < 1254857784 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Funny way of showing bind mounts there. < 1254857808 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gaa, I should be writing my article+slides for tomorrow and not mounting directories all around. < 1254858152 0 :KingOfKarlsruhe!n=nice@p5B134C56.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1254858494 0 :ehird!n=ehird@91.105.82.41 JOIN :#esoteric < 1254858555 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello from a new, even crappier keyboard with barely any tactile sense! < 1254858561 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am having trouble hitting keys consistently. Ugh. < 1254858607 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :11:54:41 The 7-zip web-site says it supports unpacking RAR archive, but I downloaded the latest version, and RAR is not supported. < 1254858608 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wrong. < 1254858616 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It supports rar perfectly, and has for years. < 1254858716 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Argh, this eybord is really annoying. < 1254858770 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Put it flat, still hard. Wonder if it's easier. < 1254858777 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION watches the flamewar between Stallman and de Icaza < 1254858780 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Argh, I think the key sizes are different on this keyboard. < 1254858788 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I really cant put too muh prsesure < 1254858789 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ARGH < 1254858791 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK HTIS KE YBOARD < 1254858808 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want a fucking PS/2 to USB conevrter and plug in my Model M, which I can actually type on < 1254858817 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This thing is unusable < 1254858833 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Know what's funny AnMaster? < 1254858835 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's Saitek < 1254858868 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is that funny? < 1254858903 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :His mega-uber-joystick is Saitek; he talked about it yesterday. < 1254858906 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My P and N keys sometimes don't register unless I really push them (also a Saitek) < 1254858928 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mine's an uber-cheapo though. < 1254858949 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This one's supposed to be good :( < 1254858989 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't even find this one when googling, heh. < 1254859003 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://209.85.229.132/search?q=cache:86UMFLB6jmoJ:www.saitek.com/uk/prod/alumkey.htm+Saitek+slimline&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk < 1254859003 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tis. < 1254859005 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This. < 1254859006 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The page is gone. < 1254859038 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :utterly infuriating < 1254859063 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not the most error-free typer with my Model M but at least I kno when i've hit a damn key < 1254859095 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had to change my password because it had an n is it, and I never knew if I was typing it right < 1254859104 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh. < 1254859114 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Know what's funny AnMaster? It's Saitek <-- hm? < 1254859121 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is < 1254859123 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Look above that < 1254859141 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It only happens about 2% of the time, but it's enough < 1254859168 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, never tried a saitek keyboard. Thought you used an apple one? < 1254859194 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did, but Bluetooth doesn't work in Ubuntu, so I switched to my crappy-but-usable keyboard. < 1254859201 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then I broke that key < 1254859206 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and lost another < 1254859217 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And could only find one key that fit in a letter slot < 1254859225 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, bought this one. < 1254859229 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :God is it awful. < 1254859252 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The keys are really shallow, but they also just kind of mmph instead of clicking down, thus making typing impossible. < 1254859259 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And they require a lot of force to put down fully. < 1254859282 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So yeah, fuck this shit. < 1254859552 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should sue them for making this keyboard. Or at least boycott them. < 1254859556 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Preferably sue. < 1254859707 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.qwantz.com/index.php?comic=1566 ARE YOU SERIOUS RYAN NORTH? THAT HAPPENED IN 2004 AND I READ ABOUT IT ON WIKIPEDIA JUST DAYS AGO >_< < 1254859930 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :12:41:57 (This game: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUM_0cp5xgo) < 1254859936 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't that a derivative of ZZT itself? < 1254860200 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :08:54:56 ais523, lets see... I can think of think of: consistent formatting, better math support, good support for citations and such through bibtex, much better line breaking algorithm (two justified margins looks horrible in word), easy to automate stuff with it (auto generating tables from source data or such, sure word has VBA but no one can claim that is easy to use..), and several more < 1254860204 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :VBA is easy to use... < 1254860212 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :easier than writing tex macros at least < 1254860226 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :VBA > OpenOffice scripting last time I tried to use it < 1254860237 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although, when I need to script OpenOffice nowadays, I just manipulate the XML directly, it's easier < 1254860266 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OpenOffice is pretty bad < 1254860275 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AbiWord is nice if you like that sort of thing < 1254860289 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(word processing) < 1254860302 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use OpenOffice a lot for converting .doc and .xls files < 1254860317 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find I rarely actually create word-processed documents nowadays, though < 1254860329 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AbiWord and Gnumeric can do that without turning your computer into a splash-screen displaying space heater < 1254860392 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :09:23:07 btw I found out cfunge bzr needed a later cmake than 2.6... 2.6.3 at least. This is actually due to how the ncurses check is now done after input on it from ehird < 1254860392 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :09:23:46 (basically it turns out "if" in cmake before 2.6.3 didn't support parentheses...) < 1254860397 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't need the parens < 1254860403 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they were just while i was testing < 1254860715 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION searches for a Real Fucking Keyboard < 1254861101 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, Filco FKBN104M/EB or Scorpius M10 < 1254861123 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :First is tactlile+non-clicky, second is tactile+clicky but the sound doesn't seem as annoying as most. < 1254861160 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Argh, the Filco has a fucking glossy Vista logo key. < 1254861168 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DIE! DIE! DIE! < 1254861176 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-( < 1254861223 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the Scorpius M10 doesn't. < 1254861270 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it hav a super key at all? < 1254861276 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*have < 1254861288 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has two Windows keys, but no right-click key, I think. < 1254861342 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently more quieter than the Das Keyboard which is good. Small Windows key, don't care... black matted finish, but you can't get, alas, get smooth mechanical keyboards... $60 shipped to the US... Hmm... A few unfortunate disadvantages. < 1254861349 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://geekhack.org/showwiki.php?title=Island:5364 < 1254861356 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See "The Bad"... mmph. < 1254861413 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't mind the fewer and smaller rubber pads, nor the lack of gold plating on the USB connector, nor the lack of cable grommet, nor the bigger footprint, nor the imperfections in the plastic casing. < 1254861441 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I don't think I mind the print screen/scroll lock/pause/break keys standing taller than the F keys... but < 1254861457 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# Esc, F2, F5, F6, and F7 keys sit slightly lower on chassis than the other F keys < 1254861457 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# tilde, 1 and 3 keys sit slightly lower than other keys in same row# Esc, F2, F5, F6, and F7 keys sit slightly lower on chassis than the other F keys < 1254861457 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# tilde, 1 and 3 keys sit slightly lower than other keys in same row# Esc, F2, F5, F6, and F7 keys sit slightly lower on chassis than the other F keys < 1254861457 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# tilde, 1 and 3 keys sit slightly lower than other keys in same row < 1254861460 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oops < 1254861460 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# no recessed stepping for the Caps Lock key, or the Num Lock key < 1254861466 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# some keys feel and sound slightly different than others < 1254861466 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# doesn't feel quite as sturdy as the M1 and Das, and has more flex < 1254861470 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...seem bad. < 1254861491 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I should just get a Das Keyboard and deal with the noise. < 1254861611 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, the M10 weighs as much as a MacBook Air < 1254861700 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1254861743 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It does have a right-click key, I think. < 1254861761 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Yes, it's a ZZT derivative, I just didn't know about that until yesterday. < 1254861778 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right. < 1254862206 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1254862261 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish you could buy the Japan-only Happy Hacking keyboards with more keys. < 1254862312 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, wait, just a different layout. < 1254862330 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Happy Hacking keyboard uses the Caps Lock location for Control, has a tiny Alt key, and a big Windows key. < 1254862337 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And that's just reeeeeeeetaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrdeeeeeeeeeeeed. < 1254862637 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The defaults don't matter, you can change them < 1254862662 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Yes they do because there is no physical control key. < 1254862695 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could use the tiny alt key as control and the big windows key as alt, but that'd fucking suck because the control key would be in the uncomfortable Windows key position, and tiny. < 1254862698 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not a default then. < 1254862710 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never called it a default; you did < 1254862715 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No I didn't < 1254862717 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*did. < 1254862724 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : The Happy Hacking keyboard uses the Caps Lock location for Control, has a tiny Alt key, and a big Windows key. < 1254862724 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : And that's just reeeeeeeetaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrdeeeeeeeeeeeed. < 1254862724 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : The defaults don't matter, you can change them < 1254862727 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You didn't? < 1254862741 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I was trying to say was: "what the keys do by default doesn't matter" < 1254862770 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but you mistakenly assumed that the reason I rejected it was because of that. :P < 1254862778 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you have an issue with the keys themselves as opposed to what they do, that's different < 1254862787 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant that, in lieu of having an actual control key, it defaults to using the Caps Lock position for it. < 1254862793 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A default is part of that complaint, but not the reason for it. < 1254862850 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even that doesn't clearly say to me that there's no key where the control key typically is :-P (I guess the Windows key is there, by your description?) < 1254862919 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/33/Happy_Hacking_Keyboard_Professional_2.jpg < 1254862939 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Default mapping is the small leftmost/rightmost keys are alt, and the keys next to the space bar are Windows. < 1254862941 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Blank space O_o < 1254862947 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. < 1254862950 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fucking bulllllllllshit. < 1254862962 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's indeed somewhat retarded :-P < 1254862972 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC some of the previous models, still, IIRC, sold in Japan, have, you know, more keys. < 1254863168 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: From their site: http://www.pfusystems.com/hhkeyboard/images/lite2_us_layout.gif < 1254863177 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DID IT OCCUR TO ANYONE TO MAKE THEM BIGGER AND FLUSH WITH THE SHIFT KEYS < 1254863191 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know, since you're adding another useless key, Fn. < 1254863272 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-) < 1254863291 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whee, the Das Keyboard costs 99 eur in, uh, Europe. < 1254863294 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...plus shipping. < 1254863337 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OHH ENJOYING THAT KEYBOARD ARE YOU, 87 EUR IN THE US, WITH FREE SHIPPING < 1254863342 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well how about we take our cocks < 1254863345 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cocks of expense < 1254863347 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and shipping < 1254863353 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and slap you with them < 1254863353 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1254863355 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let us do that < 1254863359 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after all this is Europe < 1254863362 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where we do such things < 1254863479 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-) < 1254863501 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-) < 1254863516 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can anyone get past the road in http://tane.us/? < 1254863522 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if there's even anything more. < 1254863692 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got past it < 1254863720 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How :P < 1254863735 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Click to the beat < 1254863742 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahahahaha < 1254863798 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love this site < 1254863927 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU FINISHED TANE! YOU ARE GREAT! < 1254864019 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Page closed" < 1254864080 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to assume you made that up and this continually serves up new fun every click forever < 1254864103 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, it changes domain < 1254864111 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :18 pages total < 1254864119 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Click here to download plugin" < 1254864126 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, a .mid < 1254864132 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm sure it's delightful < 1254864153 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...this one again? (oldtane) < 1254864164 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, it only takes one click now < 1254864180 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It over :( < 1254864342 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.chickensnack.com/flash/marioq.html < 1254864525 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.chickensnack.com/flash/enzyte.html < 1254864595 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Artsy < 1254864631 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.chickensnack.com/flash/fun.html < 1254864632 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fun! < 1254865648 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.evoluent.com/kb1.html Did it occur to them that they could just remove the number pad < 1254865680 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Evidently not < 1254865695 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (Patents pending.) < 1254865744 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You mean "Patented and additional patents pending". < 1254865754 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, ugh, mushing the arrow keys with those other ones. < 1254865794 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just move the printscrn-sysrq/scroll-lock/pause-break/insert/home/pgup/delete/end/pgdwn/arrow keys to the left and drop the number pad! < 1254865795 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And all-important keys like "My Comp" and "Media Player" < 1254865806 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I open my media player EVERY FEW SECONDS < 1254865820 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then put my computer to sleep and wake it up < 1254865830 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BECAUSE I CAN < 1254865847 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then I open my email, look at it, switch to my web browser, go backwards and forth a few times, open my Computer, and then SHUT THE COMPUTER OFF. < 1254865854 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh god, they have a Del key right to the left of the space bar. < 1254865856 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DO NOT WAT < 1254865858 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*WANT < 1254865889 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :going back and forth is something i might actually want buttons for, except backspace already does the more useful of those two < 1254865892 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also to the right of Ctrl < 1254865897 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: alt-right < 1254865901 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are WELCOME < 1254865927 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shift-backspace also < 1254865927 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I gave up my backspace habit and now use alt-left/right. < 1254865927 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm, that's two buttons < 1254865927 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you really think i have the time < 1254865927 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not in my browser < 1254865932 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but you have the time for pointing and clicking? < 1254865936 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iiiiiiinteresting < 1254865963 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it's faster than pointing and clicking, but it isn't as fast as single key would be < 1254865972 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes but it's an improvement < 1254865974 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PRAISE US < 1254866003 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure here goes < 1254866012 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^_____________^ < 1254866057 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i'm going to go sort a deck of cards using a binary heap now < 1254866099 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: try gnome sort! < 1254866102 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or bogosort < 1254866113 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the former is probably a better idea, in case the latter doesn't terminate < 1254866116 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THUS EVENTUALLY TERMINATING... < 1254866117 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1254866118 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOUR LIFE < 1254866168 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't actually follow algorithms strictly enough for gnome sort and insertion sort to have a crucial diff < 1254866176 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should < 1254866182 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no i shouldn't < 1254866198 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: do bucket sort with actual buckets < 1254866205 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1254866237 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no that's stupi < 1254866247 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Later" < 1254866251 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: how about pigeonhole sort with actual pigeons < 1254866253 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1254866253 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1254866257 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actual pigeonholes < 1254866261 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but sure, sort pigeons into them if you want < 1254866283 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...timsort with an actual tim peters? :P < 1254866308 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :burstsort... then ACTUALLY BURST < 1254866314 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should do some sort of standup < 1254866318 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: also is stupi the same thing as stupid? < 1254866323 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BECAUSE IF SO THAT IS *FUNNY* < 1254866333 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but, I might < 1254866336 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/ $// < 1254866337 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :get tired < 1254866339 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so why < 1254866340 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't I < 1254866340 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do < 1254866344 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SITDOWN COMEDY < 1254866346 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was like a cool contra(di)ction < 1254866350 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll be here all year < 1254866392 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :! < 1254866392 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-> < 1254866397 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1254866398 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-< < 1254866400 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1254866401 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i fail < 1254866402 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<- < 1254866587 0 :Asztal!n=asztal@host86-156-195-201.range86-156.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1254866621 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HAHAAHQQHQHQA THE TOTAL DELETION OF YOUR FACE < 1254867002 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night → < 1254867337 0 :augur!n=augur@129-2-175-79.wireless.umd.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1254867440 0 :Rugxulo!n=user@adsl-065-013-115-246.sip.mob.bellsouth.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1254867922 0 :KingOfKarlsruhe!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1254868086 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1254868443 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Care to try a self-eating watermelon? < 1254868453 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh? < 1254868570 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone replying to a comment wondering about why Slashdot were reporting on a Slashdot post < 1254868599 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1254868601 0 :Gracenotes!n=person@wikipedia/Gracenotes JOIN :#esoteric < 1254868632 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh, why does control-refresh not open the current page in another tab in Firefox? < 1254868671 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(clearly, I take interface consistency very seriously...) < 1254868674 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1254868681 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure that's inconsistent < 1254868692 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, you missed it < 1254868700 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was running DOSEMU under x86-64 yesterday 8-) < 1254868701 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Missed what? < 1254868703 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh < 1254868710 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does that give you 64-bit DOS? < 1254868715 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1254868721 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lame < 1254868725 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just normal DOS (with 16-bit emulated and 32-bit DPMI stuff runs as native) < 1254868729 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1254868735 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if you could make 64-bit DOS run the usual programs... < 1254868742 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just define near = far and you're some part of the way < 1254868744 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: File a bug! < 1254868757 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, 64-bit has no V86 mode, hence you can't run 16-bit stuff at all unless emulated < 1254868775 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: refresh opens the current page; holding down control causes pages that would open to open in a new tab instead < 1254868776 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So? < 1254868780 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make the 16-bit stuff works. < 1254868782 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*work natively < 1254868783 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or unless AMD or Intel add V86 to 64-bit < 1254868785 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As 64-bit. < 1254868786 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :therefore, my reasoning was that control-refresh should open the current page in a new tab < 1254868802 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Yes, but Ctrl only applies to opening new links by clicking. < 1254868808 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what DOSEMU does, it translates 16-bit to 64-bit < 1254868809 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did click < 1254868815 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and control applies to more or less everything in the interface < 1254868818 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Opening new LINKS < 1254868818 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the menus, for instance < 1254868827 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For instance, ctrl-enter adds www. and .com to the start and end in the location field < 1254868829 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I commonly refresh pages by following self-links < 1254868832 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so... < 1254868840 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that's your problem; I don't think this is an inconsistency < 1254868862 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo: yes, but it doesn't give them 64-bit pointers, for instance < 1254868872 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, DOS progs can't run in 64-bit < 1254868889 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd have to (in theory) have a 64-bit DOS itself or maybe an extender < 1254868915 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's what I'm saying < 1254868916 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sheesh < 1254868917 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A 64-bit DOS < 1254868926 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the question is, would most programs work with it? < 1254868942 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For instance, how many of them pack structures and depend on their sizes? < 1254868964 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :work without recompilation? doubt it < 1254868982 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be more likely to work without than with IMO < 1254868996 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, obviously < 1254869000 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The question is whether it can be good enough < 1254869009 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For, you know, critical high-memory DOS usage < 1254869025 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;-) < 1254869051 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: do you happen to know what licence Colloquy is under? < 1254869055 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't find it anywhere on their website < 1254869062 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they claim to be open source, and there's source < 1254869069 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but no licence statement on the website, no COPYING in the source < 1254869127 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1254869128 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll look < 1254869130 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1254869147 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the issue of GPL iPhone apps came up on the Enigma mailing list < 1254869158 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone gave Colloquy as an example of an open-source iPhone app < 1254869167 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the mobile app != the desktop app, btw < 1254869169 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I'm utterly confused at my inability to determine what licence < 1254869170 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I know < 1254869177 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't find the licence for either, though < 1254869179 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the mobile app isn't open source afaik < 1254869187 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it claims to be < 1254869191 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://colloquy.mobi < 1254869199 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there's a link to the source < 1254869212 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Open minded and Open source, like it should be." < 1254869219 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lookin < 1254869220 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :g < 1254869239 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://colloquy.info/project/wiki/Development%20Guide < 1254869241 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GPL2 < 1254869264 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, well found < 1254869273 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wiki -> development guide < 1254869276 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :two clicks from source < 1254869280 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :admittedly it should be included < 1254869286 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't think of checking the wiki < 1254869303 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, I think it violates GPL2 to not state the licence in the source < 1254869314 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I was staring at GPL2 for about half an hour, so I'm pretty sure < 1254869317 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the actual source files < 1254869320 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/$/?/ < 1254869322 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bullshit < 1254869322 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1254869327 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :many GPL projects don't do that < 1254869330 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, accompanying them < 1254869333 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1254869338 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then I agree it's possible < 1254869347 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't have to be in the file itself, but you need the COPYING in the distribution, or at least a statement of licence somewhere < 1254869357 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas what they're publishing as "the source" doesn't mention it anywhere obvious < 1254869358 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The GPL requires that the license be clearly indicated. < 1254869375 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It suggests that you put a notice in the source code. < 1254869375 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe we could edit the wiki to make it BSD? < 1254869381 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no, that doesn't work < 1254869386 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I know < 1254869388 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any more as committing a license file saying it's BSD doesn't < 1254869403 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it's the only place it's mentioned, it would certainly confuse people, though < 1254869522 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, my current problem with Enigma is trying to change the title "Once, No More No Less" to be the width of an s less wide < 1254869547 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1254869548 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1254869580 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it doesn't currently quite fit on the level summary screen < 1254869582 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: make it cutesy - either "Once, NoMore NoLess" or "OnceNoMoreNoLess" < 1254869588 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1254869591 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's probably best to rephrase < 1254869598 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :boooring < 1254869604 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: how about "Once" < 1254869605 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1254869629 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Once, No Mo' No Less < 1254869644 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ==1, !<1, !>1 < 1254869746 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No More/Less < 1254869797 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wince Na-Mar Narless < 1254870117 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1254870150 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1, ! ++, ! -- < 1254870622 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1254870939 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1254871033 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1254871213 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi oerjan < 1254871257 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ehird < 1254871451 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is your name pronounced oerjan < 1254871475 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ørjan < 1254871487 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so not helpful :P < 1254871491 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1254871503 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :orrchzn? < 1254871510 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*no z < 1254871524 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*in fact add that z back < 1254871525 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION looks up http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norwegian_phonology < 1254871527 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oar? air? < 1254871617 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ø, j, n are the correct ipa in fact < 1254871625 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know ipa :P < 1254871659 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :r is some variant with rounded upper part < 1254871675 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::| < 1254871677 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a without the upper tail or whatever it's called < 1254871683 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg my | key moved aaaaaaaaaaa < 1254871700 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway let me look up the names < 1254871712 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ø: close-mid front rounded < 1254871720 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also short < 1254871723 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know this stuff :( < 1254871789 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :r: dental/alveolar flap < 1254871804 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(rolled, but just once) < 1254871828 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j: palatal approximant. like english y. < 1254871864 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a: open back unrounded. something like a in father, but shorter < 1254871916 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :n: dental/alveolar nasal. pretty much like in english. < 1254871944 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the whole word has the second pitch accent < 1254872025 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know what that is :D < 1254872031 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the ø is hard to explain in english < 1254872033 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The wikipedia article on pitch accent is all centred for some reason. < 1254872041 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe closest to u in "fur" < 1254872045 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ø is like ö, apparently. < 1254872046 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Asztal: oh? < 1254872051 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erjan. < 1254872071 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, Eryaan. < 1254872083 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know how to roll rs, and I don't know what the second pitch accent is. < 1254872084 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure you should double that a < 1254872098 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a fairly short vowel < 1254872104 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was expressing the father-ness. < 1254872117 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, the whole thing is entirely ... soft until the n? < 1254872135 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't the n soft too? < 1254872136 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Vowels are soft, r is soft, things like k aren't, n isn't at the end of a word.) < 1254872140 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I guess so < 1254872160 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i don't know about that < 1254872185 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a rolled r is harder than an english one, i'd say, unless hard is some technical term < 1254872217 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Asztal: not centered for me < 1254872226 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nor I < 1254872261 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: here's an attempt: < 1254872265 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: OK, it's not for me either now... maybe it was just one of the many strange consequences of incremental reflow < 1254872273 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://filebin.ca/hzfbcy/oerjan.wav < 1254872281 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: just forget the pitch accent, it varies by dialect anyhow < 1254872286 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch < 1254872297 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i expected to do badly < 1254872324 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my ouch was because i have to find out how to listen to it, not because it's bad (i don't know yet :D) < 1254872333 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just a wav :P < 1254872398 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the thing is, every time i try to play something which is not in flash, i get this message to set up windows media player < 1254872430 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and every time i chicken out of the menu which seems to essentially ask how much to behave like spyware < 1254872480 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://mpc-hc.sourceforge.net/ use it (ignore the shoddy website, it's just an actually-maintained fork of Media Player Classic) < 1254872499 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@jol13-1-82-66-176-74.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1254872500 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :features include not being shit < 1254872500 0 :augur!n=augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr2.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1254873138 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION finally manages to play the file < 1254873175 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, the r definitely needs work ;D < 1254873191 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the rest is surprisingly close < 1254873234 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay