< 1257033698 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION goes
< 1257033752 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: btw, re LFS: I might, but I imagine that most of what I pick up will be stuff that doesn't matter due to my design choices (e.g. dynamic linking issues) < 1257034348 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :11:21:44 why is there a status setting thingy at the top of it < 1257034348 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :11:21:48 for IM clients < 1257034348 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and email. < 1257034359 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :email has online/offline? < 1257034364 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1257034365 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i see, that one < 1257034370 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i thought he meant the messaging menu) < 1257034376 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is linked to it < 1257034392 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :11:24:20 ais523, argh: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-applet/+bug/447964 < 1257034392 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :11:24:34 ais523, it seems linked to evolution, But it is in the indicator applet thingy < 1257034393 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :11:24:42 which iirc is used for other (useful) stuff < 1257034393 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The messaging menu IS useful. < 1257034401 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :11:25:24 it's empathy it's linked to, not evolution < 1257034401 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :11:25:29 oh, the letter icon < 1257034402 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :11:25:36 that means new mail arrived, I think < 1257034402 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or new IMs < 1257034407 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or someone signed in recently < 1257034435 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1257034440 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, it isn't like that VM has evolution set up or anything < 1257034444 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nor any IM < 1257034448 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just remove it from the panel. < 1257034450 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Easy. < 1257034455 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No need to uninstall anything. < 1257034457 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right click. < 1257034457 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, isn't it used for other stuff? < 1257034460 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1257034462 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1257034470 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The indicator applet is the meessaging menu. < 1257034473 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*messaging < 1257034493 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well < 1257034497 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"A small applet to display information from various applications consistently in the panel. < 1257034498 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The first revision is focusing on messaging applications. The design specification for the messaging component is available at: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MessagingMenu/" < 1257034505 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So currently it's just for email and IM, but it won't be later. < 1257034755 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is the uber-jackal effect in ADOM too weak? < 1257034768 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1257034891 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know, if ever, if they will ever release the source-codes for ADOM or not. < 1257035000 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Can KDE3 desktops view a special desktop with all desktops combined? < 1257035002 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dwm can (Mod+0) < 1257035019 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is dwm < 1257035023 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A window manager. < 1257035042 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, now I found it. But at first I didn't have the browser open < 1257035042 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, no. Where would one have place for it? < 1257035054 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's... so zzo < 1257035058 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: What does that mean? < 1257035064 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where would one have place? < 1257035065 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What? < 1257035075 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, view all? at the same time? on the same monitor < 1257035081 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some compiz like zoom? < 1257035090 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It just arranges all the windows together in dwm. < 1257035092 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I look it seems is not too bad < 1257035098 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would be good < 1257035099 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In dwm, tags are as much an organisational tool as a screen extender. < 1257035120 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :However, still if I write, I would write my own, however. (But I might based on others window managers) < 1257035136 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(you can name the tags too) < 1257035147 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, it would be hard to see them all? < 1257035151 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if there are many < 1257035152 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like < 1257035156 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, they'd be quite small. < 1257035159 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's a useful overview. < 1257035172 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, so less useful than, say, Exposé? < 1257035180 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not for the same purpose as Exposé. < 1257035245 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1257035260 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The error is in thinking that a tag is a desktop, instead of a means of organising. < 1257035273 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it lets you organise a windowspace bigger than your screen could handle for using an individual window. < 1257035283 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's also about grouping related windows, which is why you can apply multiple tags. < 1257035300 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So mod+0 is like looking at the "actual workspace" that you're organising: you can see every window you have. < 1257035313 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Useful if, for instance, you want to make two windows interact briefly. < 1257035346 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, dwm is a perfectly capable floating WM too. < 1257035347 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, you would like gentoo's init system. Quite sane. dependency based. Doesn't use classical run levels much (nothing you think of as an user). Uses instead named ones. "boot" and "default" only normally < 1257035355 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes still sysvinit but you can replace it < 1257035359 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with runit or others < 1257035364 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more or less supported < 1257035368 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a proper floating WM that is) < 1257035405 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to bring windows to the top with the keyboard, but you can mod+drag to move, and it's sloppy focus (hover to focus) < 1257035444 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The benefits are obvious — the dwm config lets you set certain programs to appear in a separate workspace and with different layouts. < 1257035452 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you could have a workspace for running the GIMP in floating mode. < 1257035454 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Voila, no problems. < 1257035482 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Plus it means ex-evilwm junkies can cope. :-P) < 1257035498 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never used evilwm. tell me about it < 1257035525 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just a very minimalist floating manager with no window decorations apart from a one pixel border. < 1257035531 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.6809.org.uk/evilwm/images/cap1.jpg may ring a bell. < 1257035549 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't say it does < 1257035555 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.6809.org.uk/evilwm/ < 1257035559 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie used it I believe. < 1257035581 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is the official screenshot? < 1257035588 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no wonder it isn't popular < 1257035589 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1257035823 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The launchd daemon is essentially a replacement for init, rc, the init.d and rc.d scripts, SystemStarter" < 1257035825 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um yeah < 1257035826 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT < 1257035829 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rc links to < 1257035836 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unix_security < 1257035838 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the hell < 1257035849 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, ^ < 1257035851 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=behold@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1257035858 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno < 1257035865 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night < 1257035871 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make that < 1257035876 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night → < 1257035962 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, I rewrote my silly ii script in rc: < 1257035964 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#!/bin/rc < 1257035965 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for (line in `{ tail -n 0 -f out }) { < 1257035965 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if (echo $line | cut -f4- -d' ' | grep -i rhee\+t >/dev/null) { < 1257035965 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : echo Ding! >in < 1257035965 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : } < 1257035966 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :} < 1257035973 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, wait < 1257035975 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to set ifs < 1257035987 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#!/bin/rc < 1257035987 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ifs=' < 1257035987 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :' < 1257035988 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for (line in `{ tail -n 0 -f out }) { < 1257035988 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if (echo $line | cut -f4- -d' ' | grep -i rhee\+t >/dev/null) { < 1257035988 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : echo Ding! >in < 1257035990 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : } < 1257035992 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :} < 1257036009 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :More readable, methinks, than the sh version: < 1257036011 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#!/bin/sh < 1257036011 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tail -n 0 -f out | < 1257036011 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :while read line; do < 1257036011 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if echo $line | cut -f4- -d" " | grep -i 'rhee\+t' >/dev/null; then < 1257036011 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : echo "Ding!" >in < 1257036012 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : fi < 1257036014 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :done < 1257036023 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact, I could simplify it further, I think. < 1257036072 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some window managers use alt+drag to move window, but I think only the window manager's key should be used by the window manager. (Which key it is could be configurable in the configuration file) < 1257036085 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's set in config.h with dwm. < 1257036088 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mod is alt by default. < 1257036113 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, I think the LOGO key should be used by default, but if you don't have that key you could use PRINTSCREEN instead, for example. < 1257036152 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nah, my simplification made it less readable (I changed: < 1257036158 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if (echo $line | cut -f4- -d' ' | grep -i rhee\+t >/dev/null) { < 1257036159 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to < 1257036168 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if (`{ cut -f4- -d' ' | grep -i rhee\+t >/dev/null } <<< $line) { < 1257036170 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is worse.) < 1257036182 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used evilwm, yes; I'm not sure I used it on the main desktop (might have, though), but definitely on that one low-end laptop. < 1257036190 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does the "configure by twiddling the source" thing too. < 1257036261 0 :ehiird!n=ehiird@91.105.101.218 JOIN :#esoteric < 1257036262 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, there's a proper config.h with dwm. < 1257036267 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it's not like you're editing hardcoded things. < 1257036282 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rheet < 1257036285 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rheeet < 1257036287 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aww < 1257036294 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is not too bad < 1257036303 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how can you say that without using it? < 1257036310 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :test < 1257036449 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One pixel border is enough (like evilwm and dwm both has). Resizing can be done with wm's key and left button for floating windows, wm's key with right button for tiled windows, and wm's key with middle button to move. For keyboard operation, you can just use wm's key in combination with some other keys (such as arrow keys) < 1257036497 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why have separate buttons for tiling windows only < 1257036540 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So that the windows do not have to designated tiled/floating, you can just use them in both ways. So, you can easily switch and stuff however you prefer < 1257036555 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just if you use tiled resize, it will also resize the other windows with adjacent borders too < 1257036563 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's how I would write it, anyways. < 1257036569 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a sort of a configuration section in evilwm.h too, though it's pretty small and the file contains a lot of other crap, too. Oh, and keyboard bindings are in keymap.h which is pretty editable. (Pretty strangely, though, the combination of modifiers is not configured there, but instead there's a command line flags (-mask1, -mask2, -altmask) to define those.) < 1257036574 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Asleep now, though. < 1257036578 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In dwm, moving or resizing a window makes it floating. < 1257036595 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only resizing you can do for tiling windows is to make one of the two columns bigger or smaller. < 1257036611 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And moving is handled merely by making something either the main window or secondary. < 1257036622 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've never felt the need to manually manage any tiling windows. < 1257036650 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1257036692 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does do mod+right click to resize a floating window, though; never thought to try that. < 1257036768 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Also, middle button drags are awkward, since it's usually a clickable mouse wheel. < 1257036820 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I know, but I never use the wheel, I only use it to click < 1257036832 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't like the wheel there < 1257036834 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The web is unusable without the wheel. < 1257036838 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, really, any long document. < 1257036841 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometimes it is accidentally pushed in one direction or the other < 1257036847 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not if it's a good mouse. < 1257036852 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They have good resistance. < 1257036859 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I use the web without the wheel. I use the page-up/page-down keys to navigate through the document < 1257036878 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That just gives me a headache and pisses me off as I try and find where I left off in the last page. < 1257036886 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plus I can't scroll things nicely in my line of sight without a pain. < 1257036926 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah can't sleep < 1257036935 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could drag the scrollbar or use the up/down arrows too if I need more precise scrolling. Another thing I sometimes do, is click and hold the scroll bar and then use either the mouse or keys to scroll, and then move the mouse away from the scroll-bar to return < 1257036937 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : while read line; do < 1257036937 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if echo $line | cut -f4- -d" " | grep -i 'rhee\+t' >/dev/null; then < 1257036940 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :usless < 1257036942 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :useless* < 1257036948 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :set IFS and do it all in read < 1257036952 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no need for cut < 1257036953 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least this works in Windows. Not sure about Linux < 1257036960 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Um, do feel free to rewrite that with IFS. < 1257036977 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, IFS and read -d of course < 1257036978 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Dragging the scrollbar is the same as flicking the wheel except more of a pain < 1257036991 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I will tomorrow < 1257036998 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Congratulations, the Unix philosophy weeps at your desire to make everything in one program < 1257037021 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it possible to avoid using PAM with recent kernels? < 1257037024 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, when coding python I tried to make all functions as few lines as possible. < 1257037032 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, PAM is not related to kernel afaik < 1257037033 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's nice, AnMaster. < 1257037037 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not to me. I would rather have a mouse without a wheel if I could get one < 1257037054 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I'm just saying that you should consider that most people like their wheel before assigning things to the middle button. < 1257037056 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and night, *tries to sleep again* → < 1257037057 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I prefer to use the middle button as a middle button < 1257037078 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Otherwise you have only two buttons < 1257037088 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait what < 1257037099 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Clicking with the middle wheel is easy. < 1257037103 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use scrollwheel as scrolling and clicking it for paste < 1257037103 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: But clicking and dragging is not. < 1257037104 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1257037110 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, indeed < 1257037120 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clicking and dragging is hot. < 1257037121 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tilting it for scrolling sideways < 1257037122 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You just have to avoid middle-click-drag motions, not middle-clicks. < 1257037140 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, clicking and dragging isn't *too* hard < 1257037144 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a bit irritating < 1257037146 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but can be done < 1257037148 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's something to consider. < 1257037185 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can certainly consider it. But, if someone doesn't like the way I wrote it, they can change it themself < 1257037206 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah I bet you will have a config option for it :P < 1257037215 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night *tries again dammit* < 1257037216 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't need to avoid middle-click-drag < 1257037223 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Personally I'm happy that I don't need to rewrite every piece of software before using it because compromises have been made for other people. < 1257037235 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And thank $DEITY for that. < 1257037277 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use the web without the wheel. Of course, I have mouseless link-following, so it's a bit more usable... < 1257037324 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When I write software, it is generally written for groups of people who prefer it this way, including (but not necessarily limited to) myself. And, it can be Free Software/Open Source so that other people can even modify it, too. < 1257037352 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The hardest part with a distro is that compiling the kernel is a must to get it going, but you'll need to do it over and over and over and over and over and over again. < 1257037352 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is a large number of various different software < 1257037358 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can find a different software, too. < 1257037712 0 :madbrain!n=madbrain@modemcable175.136-81-70.mc.videotron.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1257037740 0 :sierinjs!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1257037852 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wish dwm let you name tags at runtime, although it'd probably be a pain to manage < 1257038361 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Woot, at works perfectly < 1257038534 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pretty sure using at is kinda overkill for a clock, though < 1257038557 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Could just, you know, have a sleeping process < 1257038561 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does anyone actually use at? < 1257038576 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still, at least the script is quite nice: < 1257038581 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now=( $(date +'%H %M') ) < 1257038581 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :h=${now[0]} < 1257038581 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :m=${now[1]} < 1257038582 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1257038582 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if [ $m = 59 ]; then < 1257038583 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : h=$((h + 1)) < 1257038584 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : m=0 < 1257038586 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :else < 1257038588 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : m=$((m+1)) < 1257038590 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fi < 1257038592 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1257038594 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at $(printf %02i%02i $h $m) <:D < 1257048085 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1257048124 0 :coppro!n=coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1257048214 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish there was a way to detect vt100 apps so I could write a terminal that lets you do actually useful shit and changes mode for them. < 1257048215 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sigh. < 1257048238 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1257048250 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vt100 apps? < 1257048304 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apps that reposition cursor, for instance every curses-using app < 1257048309 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and other vt100 stuff < 1257048311 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :colour is okay though < 1257048317 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't need to detect colour usage < 1257048329 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apps that make the input raw < 1257048332 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that they get every character < 1257048333 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc < 1257048373 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not just output straight VGA text mode < 1257048387 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: what? < 1257048391 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what has that got to do with anything < 1257048429 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I'm thinking in terms of dos apps, sorry < 1257048438 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't write vt100 apps < 1257048447 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just wish they identified themselves as "hello we are going to fuck with the terminal" < 1257048452 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I want to have a terminal that can copy and paste across lines without copying an actual linebreaks, that can support keyboard shortcuts without mangling them horribly due to applications inside the terminal, that can delete selected text after highlighting it like everything else < 1257048454 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc < 1257048476 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and stupid applications like vi and everything that want to shoehorn a complex UI onto a command-line system stop me doing this < 1257048487 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if i could detect them, i could emulate a vt100 like every other terminal and let them take over < 1257048495 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and when we drop back to a shell, it could become rich again < 1257048507 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they don't identify themselves, they just go ahead and control it < 1257048550 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1257048563 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about detecting vt100 escape sequences? < 1257048571 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's one possibility, for sure < 1257048585 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if a program doesn't use one at startup that'd be weird < 1257048590 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it'd come into the normal text view then bam < 1257048595 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all the other stuff is gone as it takes over the terminal < 1257048612 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make it user selectable then? < 1257048627 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Warrigal: you could try to solve the problem i did tell about < 1257048638 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: vt100 apps are pretty common you know < 1257048644 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it'd be a huge pain to have to do that < 1257048663 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ perhaps so annoying to outweigh the benefits of being able to assume text < 1257048675 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, dunno, I'm comming from a world of DOS and windows so that stuff is different for me < 1257048680 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otoh, it would let me use the rc shell without bloating it with filename completion and the like nicely, like it is in plan9... < 1257048691 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: i'll try and explain < 1257048694 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: you know edit.com? < 1257048703 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so my reference for that is the VGA text mode < 1257048716 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what problem was that? < 1257048720 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: yeah? < 1257048732 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: and you know, e.g. deltree or whatever? a command that prints its status linearly and the like < 1257048737 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Warrigal: read logs, wasn't that long ago < 1257048745 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1257048751 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: and command.com itself, which is like deltree or whatever but also has user input < 1257048753 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the binary linear code thing < 1257048779 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: well, edit.com is like a curses app on linux (which use the vt100 codes to do colours, reposition the caret to output in predefined places instead of linearly, get direct access to the keypresses, yada yada yada) < 1257048780 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: prove that if you have a binary linear code of word length 7 and there are exactly 7 words of weight 3, then 1111111 belongs to the code? < 1257048788 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: and deltree and command.com are like "regular" terminal apps < 1257048790 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1257048795 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. vim and emacs without the GUI are ncurses apps < 1257048798 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so is irssi < 1257048806 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1257048832 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then wouldn't most "rich" apps start filling the screen with colors and stuff like that right off the bat? < 1257048844 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I can handle colours in plain text < 1257048849 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes, most would indeed < 1257048853 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A binary linear code is a code that forms a vector space over {0, 1} where addition is elementwise XOR? < 1257048859 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm definitely considering it nnow < 1257048861 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*now < 1257048870 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps I should make a new window for vt100 stuff, too < 1257048874 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1257048875 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since it'll act differently < 1257048883 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and to let you terminate it etc. via the normal terminal < 1257048903 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vt100 is, what, similar to VGA text mode, right? < 1257048933 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure what you mean < 1257048938 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the "weight" of a code is the number of 1s in it? < 1257048941 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vt100 was just an ancient CRT terminal you plugged into a mainframe < 1257048945 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could output text to it like normal < 1257048952 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it also has special things to output that do things like: < 1257048955 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :set background/foreground colour < 1257048956 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in terms of functionality, not interface) < 1257048961 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :move cursor (where text is output) up one line < 1257048964 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :left one character < 1257048967 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and < 1257048976 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop buffering text at lines before you send it to me, give me every keypress raw < 1257048978 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i can handle it how i want < 1257048980 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sort of stuff < 1257048992 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Warrigal: yes < 1257049016 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: right < 1257049026 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: thanks for making me rethink that detecting wouldn't work, btw; I'm seriously considering it now < 1257049042 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: one issue, though, is: how do I know when it's stopped vt100ing? I guess I'll look at the process tree and mark them as vt100ing < 1257049053 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i need to look at processes the shell creates < 1257049056 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, if the code contains everything it possibly can, it has 21 words of weight 3. I would bet that if you XOR all 7 words of weight 3, you'll always get 1111111. < 1257049060 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so this will actually be more involved than your typical terminal < 1257049084 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So then it's a matter of proving that for any possible set of 7, for each position, an odd number of the 7 have a 1 in that position. < 1257049102 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could probably maintain a non vt100 and a vt100 state < 1257049137 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: yah, but for most terminals, once the vt100ing program is through, they don't know < 1257049143 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they don't handle processes, the shell does < 1257049147 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the terminal just blithely follows the ouutput < 1257049168 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Warrigal: what do you mean by 21? < 1257049181 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote Warrigal: what do you mean by 21? < 1257049186 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1257049188 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oops. < 1257049195 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, once it goes out of vt100, the special characters would eventually get flushed out of the screen no? < 1257049196 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :100| Warrigal: what do you mean by 21? < 1257049199 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C(7, 3)? < 1257049209 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's 35 < 1257049215 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey quote 100 < 1257049218 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean by 100 < 1257049221 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :35, yeah. < 1257049222 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: that's true < 1257049239 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: but that'd be even weirder to have it go back; I'm thinking of spawning a separate window for vt100 stuff, since it behaves differently < 1257049255 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: vt100 apps mess up the scrollback (things scrolled off-screen) anyway < 1257049265 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since they take over the entire screen, they usually overwrite stuff before themselves < 1257049268 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not all of it, just some < 1257049274 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so putting it in another window helps that < 1257049296 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish 35/7 were a power of two. < 1257049345 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: well, basically they stop doing vertical scrolling and make the screen into a 2 array, no? < 1257049347 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, tell me if you come up with anything interesting, time to sleep < 1257049349 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-> < 1257049353 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION nods.
< 1257049375 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: basically. the problem is that, e.g. if you scroll down in a vt100 app, then scroll up in your terminal, you see the top line of the current scrolling, and then the line before you started it < 1257049390 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after quitting, they disappear as if they never happened < 1257049397 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's all very weird < 1257049480 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1257049624 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: so it's basically text prompt up to the vt100 app, then vt100 sorta as if it was a virtual screen, except that screen disappears on quitting? < 1257049634 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep... < 1257049640 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :here, let me tell you what i mean by losing backlog < 1257049659 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :first I resize my terminal to 6 lines high to demonstrate < 1257049667 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[~]$ < 1257049667 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[~]$ < 1257049667 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[~]$ < 1257049667 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[~]$ < 1257049668 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[~]$ < 1257049668 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[~]$ < 1257049669 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[~]$ < 1257049671 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just hit enter until i got a tiny scrollbar < 1257049679 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I type in "man rc", hit enter < 1257049682 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it all turns into < 1257049687 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[~]$ < 1257049687 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[~]$ < 1257049687 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RC(1) RC(1) < 1257049688 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NAME < 1257049688 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : rc - shell < 1257049688 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :: < 1257049692 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although there's a blank line after RC(1) < 1257049694 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and before the : < 1257049695 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stupid irc < 1257049709 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, you can see that it's cut off some backlog; it could have cut off a command's outputt in the middle were it there < 1257049711 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*output < 1257049714 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I press q to quit, and < 1257049718 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[~]$ < 1257049718 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[~]$ < 1257049718 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[~]$ < 1257049719 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[~]$ < 1257049719 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[~]$ < 1257049719 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[~]$ < 1257049721 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[~]$ man rc < 1257049723 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[~]$ < 1257049725 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it comes back < 1257049728 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is all very weird and awkward < 1257049735 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1257049736 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :curses apps just aren't like the command-line < 1257049741 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I want to segregate them to a window < 1257049743 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1257049764 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that way i can interpret the rest as regular text < 1257049770 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus making using the terminal with other apps not hellish < 1257049811 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, you could detect ncurses apps and give them a virtual 24 line window inside your scrolling window < 1257049828 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1257049840 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the thing is, that still leads to an inconsistent experience, because now they are trapping your keystrokes < 1257049844 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you lose the keyboard shortcuts < 1257049847 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of the terminal < 1257049852 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and copying and pasting doesn't work the same, etc < 1257049860 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can't highlight some text and delete it, say in vim or emacs < 1257049864 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it doesn't work that way < 1257049891 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1257049916 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plan 9 does this awesomely < 1257049930 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you start a "rich" app (there is no gui/cli distinction), < 1257049934 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it takes over the terminal until you exit < 1257049936 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it goes back < 1257049938 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the clever thing is < 1257049942 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every window in plan 9 is the same as a terminal window < 1257049947 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the same text interface, totally malleable < 1257049959 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically, the text window, you can just print to it < 1257049966 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or you can replace it with two text windows < 1257049974 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's made so that a terminal isn't an oddity < 1257049993 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unfortunately there's still existing apps in the way in linux. :( < 1257050071 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1257050103 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah it would take something akin to "video modes" < 1257050143 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1257050253 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, outputting any vt100 character is implicitly "switch to vt100 mode" < 1257050258 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#plan9's hostility is unparalleled: < 1257050258 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[03:35] ehird: hmm < 1257050258 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[03:35] ehird: does $"`{...} work? < 1257050259 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[03:35] soul9: NP < 1257050259 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[03:35] soul9: NO < 1257050262 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: yep < 1257050264 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but just for that process < 1257050280 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I have to scoop up the previous output, put it in a new window, and redirect the process's output there in vt100 mode < 1257050307 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1257050325 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be good if you had a "return from vt100" procedure too < 1257050370 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :supposing the guy calls a series of apps that switch between the two kinds of apps or something < 1257050389 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :normally a vt100 would do some cleaning up when quitting no? < 1257050394 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1257050399 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in most terminals, it's very simple < 1257050403 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the program simply stops executing < 1257050405 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the shell prints its prompt < 1257050407 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you keep going < 1257050409 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's all one stream < 1257050432 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1257050447 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: man termcap, man terminfo. i'm pretty sure there _was_ some "start using escape sequences" sequence in at least one of them... < 1257050450 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then obviously you should put your hook into the shell < 1257050480 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ah, you mean construct my own? < 1257050486 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and make the shell activate your "exit from vt100 mode" procedure when starting up < 1257050495 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's how curses applications determine how a terminal works... < 1257050517 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sweet < 1257050522 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: i was wondering since you kept saying vt100 if you didn't know about it... < 1257050523 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(are you sure?) < 1257050528 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i know about i t < 1257050540 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just didn't realise it let you tell the app to output something when it starts doing funny business < 1257050543 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*it < 1257050555 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am pretty sure i vaguely recall it ;D < 1257050728 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are there any 132 column apps? < 1257050742 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most progs can handle any terminal size. < 1257050753 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#!/bin/rc < 1257050753 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1257050754 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fn update { < 1257050754 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : clock=`{date +'%b %-d, %H:%M'} < 1257050754 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : xsetroot -name $"clock < 1257050754 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :} < 1257050756 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1257050758 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :update < 1257050760 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :while (sleep `{echo 60-`{date +%S} | bc}) update < 1257050762 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clocks are awesome! < 1257050820 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm maybe i was thinking of ti/te in termcap < 1257050830 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah one of the escape sequences is "reset terminal to initial state" < 1257050873 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :come to think of it, I should probably make it say -11-01 instead of Nov 1 < 1257050879 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since I use the number more than the name < 1257050884 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it doesn't tell me the full name anyway < 1257050889 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-11-01 is pretty ugly though < 1257050920 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, that thing's running sleep 59 right now < 1257050925 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one thing that's funny is that they hacked a 132 column text mode into the PC, obviously for vt100 compatibility, but they did it really late (like, in SVGA cards) < 1257050930 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could have been a perfect 60 if i wasn't a second too late! < 1257050950 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, maybe I should add a funge factor of sleeping one extra second, just in case I get it just before the next minute starts < 1257050953 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not a big deal though < 1257050960 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like the weirdest video mode ever < 1257050967 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vt100 is 80x24 < 1257051025 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :these docs say that it had a 132x mode, but probably that people didn't use it < 1257051044 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1257051072 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :annoying that it's very hard to say "start of next minute" with things like sleep < 1257051077 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sleep `{echo 60-`{date +%S} | bc} is ugly < 1257051088 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(translation: "Sleep for 60 seconds minus the seconds elapsed in the current minute".) < 1257051170 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's an... interesting way of coding < 1257051182 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: what, the composition of simple commands? < 1257051188 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, it's called unix. well, it was called unix in the 70s. < 1257051225 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bc is the calculator, echo just prints something out, a | b runs a sending the output to b as it goes, `{...} runs ... and expands its output into the command it's in < 1257051226 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rc shell < 1257051232 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd look like this in the more common bash: < 1257051239 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sleep $(echo 60-$(date +%S) | bc) < 1257051243 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, more probable, < 1257051255 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sleep $(( 60-$(date +%S) )) < 1257051281 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, window's shell isn't good enough for that! < 1257051308 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah what do you guys do, keep a (non-digital) clock on your desk? < 1257051313 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :weirdos < 1257051320 0 :fax!n=somebody@unaffiliated/fax JOIN :#esoteric < 1257051359 0 :coppro!n=coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1257051369 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno, but a .bat file clock sounds like it would be hard to code < 1257051380 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno if .bat is even turing complete < 1257051390 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has goto, I'm pretty sure it is < 1257051395 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and conditionals < 1257051403 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus potentially infinite storage (filesystem) < 1257051408 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1257051428 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: write a brainfuck interp and see < 1257051431 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shouldn't be too hard < 1257051434 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah ok it might be using some ugly tricks < 1257051459 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :such as creating new .bat files and running them < 1257051464 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-D < 1257051468 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :awesome; do it < 1257051583 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :( echo import brainfuck, sys & echo brainfuck.run(' '.join(sys.argv[1:])) ) | python < 1257051590 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hur hur hur < 1257051595 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/hur $/hur/ < 1257051777 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you and your invisible end-of-line spaces < 1257051798 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1257051908 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :neither irssi nor the logs contain it, maybe it is stripped by the irc server < 1257051922 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, what's the typical length of a dram refresh cycle%? < 1257051933 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meaning? < 1257051969 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ie how much time maximum between refreshes? < 1257051975 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a dram is always refreshing < 1257051979 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is refresh < 1257051997 0 :Pthing!n=pthing@77-100-194-169.cable.ubr04.pres.blueyonder.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1257052000 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well, if by always you mean every 10ms or some similar value < 1257052029 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: dram loses data if you don't regularly read and rewrite it! < 1257052041 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*whoosh*. admittedly that word's probably obscure in english, but it exists. < 1257052063 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 a small drink of whiskey or other spirits (often used in humorous imitation of Scottish speech) < 1257052092 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: anyway, something like 10 minutes < 1257052098 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the record for post-shutdown recovery < 1257052101 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno how modern PCs refresh DRAM... afaik some older ones had an interrupt < 1257052101 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more if you cool it < 1257052251 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, afaik, one reason the z80 was popular was that it handled ram refresh for you < 1257053333 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha, 16m < 1257053336 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16ms < 1257053354 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(from a datasheet) < 1257053364 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is a totally strategic time! < 1257053403 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is a connoisseur of esoteric words
< 1257053536 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol conoisseur < 1257053597 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1257053630 0 :fax!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm a lol conoisseur < 1257053682 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: 16 meters? that's an awfully long time! < 1257053733 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not at all, that's very short, ask any relativist < 1257053742 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1257053816 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :....Someone forgot where his OWN building was < 1257053852 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Days after he showed it to me < 1257053935 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that'd be more amusing if it wasn't almost certainly in BobsVeryOwnVirtualRealityCirca1999. < 1257054015 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1257054027 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was in AWTeen 3205.00N 1235.00E -0.01a 0 (Active Worlds) < 1257054049 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AW lets you save locations (I'd hate to imagine a place that didn't) < 1257054073 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyways, I need to go to sleep. Bye all < 1257054202 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EVERYONE: Stop fucking using sourceforge! < 1257054296 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i find it somewhat difficult to understand how someone could use sourceforge for fucking in the first place < 1257054306 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, rule 34 and all < 1257054321 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't even parse that way, so you fail :p < 1257054326 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, rule 34 is about porn. < 1257054362 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i claim it can parse that way < 1257054442 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chomsky hates you. < 1257054465 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chomsky hates nearly everyone, doesn't he. < 1257054474 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who knows < 1257054567 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rule 34 is about cartoon porn yeah < 1257054591 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it's about porn in general. < 1257054629 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's this about porn? < 1257054638 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, the rule is just "There is porn of it. Period." < 1257054701 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it's very very true. < 1257054748 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very true < 1257054750 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, technically it's about porn in general, but what it mostly means is that it's hard not to find porn of whatever cartoon and that there are many crazy fetishes < 1257054777 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain — premier mind-reader since 2009 < 1257055244 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1257055248 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rule 1: most artists have drawn some porn < 1257055283 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION just had a terrible thought
< 1257055283 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm fairly sure that's not a rule of /b/ no matter what set you use. < 1257055285 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :corollary: this includes artists that do kids games and cartoons < 1257055288 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: unthink it < 1257055303 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SF.net porn :/ < 1257055322 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh yeah, baby, gimme that... bloated download page? < 1257055508 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote SF.net porn :/ Oh yeah, baby, gimme that... bloated download page? < 1257055525 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :101| SF.net porn :/ Oh yeah, baby, gimme that... bloated download page? < 1257055573 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll badly integrate all your web apps into a slow-loading monstrosity, if you know what I mean ;-) < 1257055920 0 :fax!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1257055993 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1257056021 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION spontaneously combusts
< 1257056156 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm looking at DRAM datasheets to figure out how to design a system < 1257056182 0 :Asztal!n=asztal@host86-159-107-94.range86-159.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1257056193 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: what are you doing? < 1257056195 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sounds fun < 1257056316 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trying to design a system with a cpu, graphics and sound hardware < 1257056325 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: like, custom cpu? fpga? < 1257056333 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :design your own computer? fucking awesome < 1257056347 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly all that stuff running from inside a fpga yeah < 1257056360 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i absolutely want to do that some day < 1257056375 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: the good fpgas are so expensive though :( < 1257056381 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1257056386 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"good"? < 1257056389 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like $500 up; the $200 "evaluation boards" are limited as far as complexity, iirc < 1257056389 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in < 1257056397 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :each board can only handle so much logic < 1257056402 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the $200 ones don't handle much at all < 1257056407 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1257056414 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd have to ask ais523 < 1257056417 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's studied this stuff < 1257056434 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's not too much point to a 500$ fpga, I could get a beagle board for that price :/ < 1257056439 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, actually doing it in hardware costs far too much < 1257056446 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do they know < 1257056454 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: also, the tools to put VHDL or whatever onto the chip are expensive < 1257056456 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: how do they know what < 1257056462 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the apples < 1257056464 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: like "contact us" < 1257056471 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: what apples < 1257056481 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: then I'll probably go for one of those spartan3 evaluation boards or something < 1257056483 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: (for price) < 1257056486 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ie the small/limited stuff < 1257056499 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: well, they might come with tools of some sort < 1257056542 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, a design with cache is rather complicated, so without cache there should be some sort of upper complexity limit < 1257056559 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the cache of gonads < 1257056567 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: how do what apples know what < 1257056583 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: make it a microcode interpreter and swap the cpu microcode from registers to RAM :-D < 1257056585 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ie probably go for some kind of RISC for the cpu since with only raw DRAM access there's a limit to data access rates < 1257056595 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's pertussis, not infection pneumonitis < 1257056614 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: ? < 1257056622 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: how drunk are you exactly < 1257056631 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: you know what microcode is right? < 1257056640 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not familiar with that < 1257056643 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my father is swimming < 1257056666 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: basically, modern CPUs don't implement the CPU in the actual electric pathways < 1257056675 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: they have an interpreter for a proprietary microcode, like a RISC architecture < 1257056686 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: and each instruction is coded in it, in super-fast, on-chip ROM < 1257056687 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's basically CPU opcodes get expanded to larger processor instruction data inside < 1257056693 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1257056697 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the processor executes the microcode instead of the instructions directly < 1257056710 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so current CISC chips are actually RISC internally < 1257056716 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although you can't change it and it's undocumented, so uh < 1257056718 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1257056719 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good luck doing anything with it < 1257056745 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: ofc, storing the microcode in RAM would be so slow and swapping it to registers is useless since there's so few of them :-) < 1257056746 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was a joke. < 1257056759 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd like to do a super out-of-order stack reduction based chip but that would be way too large for a fpga :D < 1257056775 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: fpgas can cost up to like $5,000 < 1257056779 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not many limits with them really < 1257056787 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :low clock speed < 1257056788 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is way too much money < 1257056793 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just saying < 1257056794 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1257056808 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it would require cache < 1257056819 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm joking man < 1257056828 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: so uh what was that about apples < 1257056858 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah, right now I'm debating on whether to try to take advantage of fast-page/edo DRAM or go for static access cycles < 1257056888 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: please make it something not like the standard risc architectures < 1257056888 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thx < 1257056937 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why < 1257056943 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because they're boring? :D < 1257056945 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: because they're boring. < 1257056947 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also crap < 1257056973 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :crap? < 1257056978 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :crap. < 1257056991 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh my < 1257057072 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a glorious beard < 1257057096 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, I'm going through this sdram specification.... this is complicated < 1257057106 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: eat it < 1257057107 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is food < 1257057115 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think so mister < 1257057116 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: i think the fpgas abstract the ram away for you < 1257057121 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523? < 1257057143 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sort-of < 1257057149 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variables in the HDL become RAM in the fpga < 1257057166 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although sometimes the compiler is stupid and you have to specifically tell it to use dedicated RAM rather than LUT-based RAM < 1257057182 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LUT is the complexity unit, right? < 1257057214 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1257057223 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can make one LUT into one bit of RAM < 1257057227 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's normally really wasteful < 1257057236 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so FPGAs tend to come with some pre-built RAM too < 1257057242 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, but you're talking about in fpga ram < 1257057245 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is SRAM < 1257057268 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and typically comes in, what, 16k? probably more or less depending of the chip but still < 1257057276 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no more < 1257057285 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the $200 boards have like 256 MiB of RAM < 1257057289 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or was it like 23 MiB < 1257057295 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever it was, it was very sufficient < 1257057296 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah but that's SDRAM no? < 1257057301 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :prolly < 1257057309 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's different! < 1257057315 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/23 MiB/32 MiB/ < 1257057317 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: so :P < 1257057358 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on chip ram is static ram and can be addressed pretty fast... cpu caches are SRAM for instance < 1257057386 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but SDRAM is DRAM and you have to sorta planify who gets a turn to read from it, etc... < 1257057407 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not to mention variable access times depending on type of accesses < 1257058026 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, one possible manner is to make a chip that outputs 320x240 and where everything is based on 400 memory cycles per scanline < 1257058165 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from there, if you keep a lid on register space, ROM space, and excessive multipliers, it should be synthesizable < 1257058194 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously that would give a rather classic, probably amiga-like design < 1257058812 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then a fast-page or edo-based design, which would be more 486-y < 1257059166 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :amiga-like is good! do that. < 1257059180 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm always a fan of the tied-to-the-CRT-rate stuff < 1257059808 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg guys < 1257059809 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in two months < 1257059811 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it will be MMX < 1257060473 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1257060625 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION swattit madbrainum -----###
< 1257060628 0 :Jaykul!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Jaykul[AFK] < 1257060655 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MMX! < 1257060681 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MMPH! < 1257060708 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, sdram isn't bad :D < 1257060733 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except it has way too many pins :( < 1257060932 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1257061305 0 :calamari!n=calamari@ip72-211-145-161.tc.ph.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1257062078 0 :Gracenotes!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1257062128 0 :Gracenotes!n=person@wikipedia/Gracenotes JOIN :#esoteric < 1257062399 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1257063327 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1257063327 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Just one incident: when my Symbolics came, the seller mixed up billing and shipping address and sent it to my home. Had to pick it up at the post office but they sent a customs postcard with the price on it. Well, I had to explain why I would spend "that much" on an old keyboard. After everything was settled I looked at the postcard once more and realized it only showed the shipping costs." < 1257063487 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: :) < 1257063660 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1257063688 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Things to do to make the distro: * Get hardware. * Set up Arch development environment. * Go through the gigantic kernel configuration process. * Write the init. * Figure out what login to use and all that crap. * Figure out what libc to use. * See if LLVM can do a.out, if not, switch from it (unlikely) or get it to work or whatever... < 1257063689 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Figure out what coreutils to use, or write one I guess; port it if it's a BSD one, etc. * Compile some stuff. * Write a package manager. * Compile a toolchain for the toolchain. * Bootstrap shortly after. * Write the rest of this list < 1257063716 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :man, sdram modules have 168 pins o_@ < 1257063718 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At some point some testing would be good, and getting other people to test too... < 1257063728 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You guys like testing, right?! Thought so. < 1257063891 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Maybe I can get pikhq to test it by replacing all references to Linux with As-Of-Yet Unnamed Suckless.org Kernel.) < 1257063940 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Eh, I have free time, and am at least curious to see what you come up with. < 1257063955 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, it worked before I even did it. < 1257063959 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's some mighty good plan. < 1257064013 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should probably build a box with some medium-common-denominator hardware to get it all working... < 1257064039 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Using something high-end is probably a bad idea considering the state of drivers. < 1257064084 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll have to restrain myself from omitting everything from the kernel that I don't use... < 1257064115 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Eh, who needs disks, anyways? That's what a ramdisk is for, right?" < 1257064175 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RAM?! Recent Core 2 processors have 12 MiB of L2 cache, you know. < 1257064183 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As for the cache... we did fine with L1 back in the day! < 1257064218 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this i7 has what, 8mb of l3 < 1257064219 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Think about it. The Core 2's L2 cache? It can hold 8.3333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333... fully formatted floppy disks. < 1257064221 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHOAAAAAAAAAAAAAA < 1257064234 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: yeah and 4x256 KiB of L2 I believe < 1257064413 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Radiateur" < 1257064417 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1257064428 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :android's libc (bionic) has no termios < 1257064443 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess that doesn't really matter < 1257064624 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Android implements its own account management, and does not use /etc/passwd. There is no getpwent(), and getpwnam()/getpwuid() are implemented as wrappers around an Android ID service. At present, the Android ID service consists of 25 hard-coded accounts in < 1257064624 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh, so bionic is quite tied to android < 1257064634 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i really wish dietlibc wasn't fucking retardedly gpl < 1257064642 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's clearly the right thing < 1257064967 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, now i remember why I dumped dietlibc < 1257064968 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :• The BSD people would not accept it without $LICENSE==BSD (currently: < 1257064969 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GPL) < 1257064969 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :• Then, Microsof t could steal my code to make Windoze less obviously broken < 1257064969 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(can’t let that happen). < 1257064979 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the author is a fucking loon. < 1257065000 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why is it GPL and not LGPL or BSD? < 1257065000 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because I don’t want to be r ipped of f. < 1257065001 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Implicit: "or anyone to use it" < 1257065054 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Implicit: "I have less regard for common practical scenarios than RMS." < 1257065103 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1257065117 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: should I go off the deep end and write my own libc, or just use newlib! < 1257065127 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the fact that i can ask that question probably signifies I've already gone off the deep end < 1257065171 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh... um... < 1257065174 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: not newlib < 1257065178 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :newlib doesn't support linux < 1257065182 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Red Hat's newlib < 1257065186 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't support linux. < 1257065201 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's, um, what's the word, uhh, stupid < 1257065211 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, waitt. < 1257065214 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seems they added it. < 1257065215 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*wait < 1257065729 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I can't use uclibc < 1257065740 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's LGPL, so if I link with it I have to offer an unlinked object file < 1257065753 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sigh* < 1257065777 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :newlib too. < 1257065779 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So my choice is either: < 1257065787 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hack up Bionic to work on non-Android and stuff... < 1257065789 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or < 1257065790 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Write my own < 1257065895 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1257065900 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What a crock of shit this is! < 1257065952 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, hmm < 1257065958 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently most of newlib is BSD-style < 1257066112 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Red Hat bought Cygnus. < 1257066117 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cygnus developed newlib. < 1257066121 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. < 1257066128 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still... < 1257066132 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hopefully newlib should work, though it seems rather stale. < 1257066149 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. Maybe you could port BSD libc? < 1257066150 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it beats hacking up Bionic, which is rather Android-tied (e.g. no /etc/passwd or fstab support) < 1257066158 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I was thinking about that, and looked it up < 1257066171 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/cvsweb.cgi/src/lib/libc/i386/ < 1257066176 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BEHOLD THE EPIC MORASS OF ASSEMBLY CODE!!! < 1257066188 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Admittedly that's just some of it. < 1257066197 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clearly I should have said "Minix". < 1257066230 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought Tanenbaum was criminally insane... http://harmful.cat-v.org/software/andy_tanenbaum < 1257066275 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, BSD libcs are quite good, but still pretty bad: http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/cvsweb.cgi/~checkout~/src/lib/libc/stdlib/atexit.c?rev=1.8.10.1.2.1;content-type=text%2Fplain < 1257066333 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's see how to compile newlib. < 1257066371 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On a brighter note, porting BSD libc to Linux would make porting BSD utils... Trivial. < 1257066406 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's true. What I'd have would look suspiciously like a BSD at the end, though, and they're not without their flaws. < 1257066416 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At that point I'd do well to save myself the effort and use their kernel too. < 1257066691 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, hey, I forgot about that one. < 1257066708 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PDCLib! < 1257066725 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I could port PDCLib to Linux/a.out if it hasn't been already, very easily. < 1257066740 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PDCLib is very minimalist and it's very easy to port it (it was designed for hobbyist OSs). < 1257066761 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unfortunately it's inccomplete... < 1257066762 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And C99 < 1257066764 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*incomplete < 1257066867 0 :Gracenotes!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1257067465 0 :ehird_!n=ehird@91.104.240.126 JOIN :#esoteric < 1257067536 0 :ehird_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION compiles an i686 ELF newlib because he's too lazy to set up a crosscompiler
< 1257067666 0 :ehird_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pretty sure newlib is gcc only, I might try it with clang though < 1257067795 0 :ehird_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.pfu.co.jp/hhkeyboard/ < 1257067796 0 :ehird_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Happy Hacking Keyboard Red Control Key! < 1257067799 0 :ehird_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GIVE US MONEY NOW < 1257067809 0 :ehird_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Next up: Red "F" key < 1257067814 0 :ehird_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Red "X" key < 1257067820 0 :ehird_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Red " key < 1257067827 0 :ehird_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and < 1257067831 0 :ehird_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Red power switch < 1257067836 0 :ehird_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Red USB cable! < 1257067943 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Red Alert key < 1257067974 0 :ehird_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(KEY)RED < 1257067989 0 :ehird_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1257068016 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grmbl < 1257068029 0 :ehird_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrmbklfgjksfdg < 1257068031 0 :ehird_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gumball < 1257068372 0 :ehird_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: any opinion on how I should handle progs like dwm that have to be recompiled to config? same with the kernel too. i don't want to become source-based < 1257068383 0 :ehird_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe just make it simple to download my build environment for a package < 1257068388 0 :ehird_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still seems like a pain < 1257068391 0 :ehird_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since you can't autoupdate etc < 1257068408 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1257068413 0 :ehiird!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1257068445 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1257068446 0 :ehird_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ehird < 1257068952 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GCC, < 1257068955 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No standard library, < 1257068959 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Static binary, if you please < 1257068964 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, include newlib's includes < 1257068967 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And my source < 1257068970 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dash of newlibc < 1257068976 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And -lgcc because you demand it, dammit < 1257068979 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also name it test < 1257068990 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cannot find entry simple _start, but it's just a warning < 1257068994 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To the tune of ./test, 1, 2, 3: < 1257068996 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello, world! < 1257068999 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Segmentation fault < 1257069010 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And ls tells me: 163 KiB. < 1257069012 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :↑↑↑↑ BEST POEM EVER < 1257069026 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*symbol not simple < 1257069446 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does anyone know if it's possible to take a linux installation and boot it but tell it to use another binary somewhere else as init? < 1257066366 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://doc.cat-v.org/bell_labs/face_the_nation/ < 1257066368 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1974 < 1257066372 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Each image was then reduced interactively to a 48«48 bit (1 bit per pixel) black– and– white 'ikon. ' < 1257066388 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Am I reading the paper that pioneered the terminology icon? < 1257066890 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : AnMaster: There? <-- now I am < 1257066893 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what did you want ehird? < 1257066909 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :paste the context? < 1257066911 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've forgotten < 1257066913 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION looks
< 1257066924 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : you help me with this < 1257066925 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : and only then. < 1257066925 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : anyone here an expert on beta distribution? < 1257066925 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : i wish my brain worked < 1257066925 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* oerjan vaguely recalls the name from statistics. that means no, btw < 1257066925 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Asztal has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) < 1257066927 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : AnMaster: There? < 1257066929 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* BeholdMyGlory has quit (Remote closed the connection) < 1257066931 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oklopol: I'm an expert on the beta distribution the same way that I'm an expert on the derivative of x^2. < 1257066939 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: i uh < 1257066939 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um < 1257066940 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::/ < 1257066941 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no idea < 1257066970 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, damn you. ;P Searching scrollback for highlight all in vain. < 1257067031 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[08:57] ehird: does anyone know if it's possible to take a linux installation and boot it but tell it to use another binary somewhere else as init? < 1257067033 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :answer that! < 1257067042 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, of course < 1257067067 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, known last line of rescue is to use init=/bin/busybox at the end of the kernel command line < 1257067075 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1257067094 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what argv init gets < 1257067095 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, wouldn't work very well with an initrd of course < 1257067132 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I'd expect argv[0] to be as usual, the rest none, or kernel command line maybe < 1257067142 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think Arch uses an initrd by default < 1257067147 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course you can get kernel command line easily once /proc is up < 1257067154 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, it does. But my arch box doesn't < 1257067162 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, I'd have to futz with it. < 1257067162 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grumble < 1257067170 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, dropping initrd saved half a minute of boot on my old pentium3 with arch < 1257067181 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nice. < 1257067184 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION ponders registering rwx.st
< 1257067208 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from just over a minute down about 30 seconds. Then later on I managed to bring it down to ~14 seconds by messing around with init scripts < 1257067221 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like commenting out parts that weren't relevant to me < 1257067228 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and disabling automatic module loading < 1257067240 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, "try to load modules are required" < 1257067247 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything relevant was built in anyway < 1257067251 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With my distro getting rid of unused init stuff will be really easy < 1257067259 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since you see it all every time you go to enable or disable a daemon anyway < 1257067263 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as it's the same operationn < 1257067313 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, hm? Oh and since that box is headless all it starts is basically network, sshd, ntpd and nfs server iirc < 1257067315 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION boots it
< 1257067324 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: as in < 1257067329 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no separate init scripts/inittab < 1257067335 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, oh btw those 14 seconds were from grub. BIOS takes about 14 seconds itself < 1257067340 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or 15 rather < 1257067346 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so commenting out stuff you don't use is just adding a # before some lines in the file you use to configure daemons < 1257067360 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, well yeah. Makes updates a bit messy though < 1257067369 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not really, just adding packages < 1257067373 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And that's simple to solve: < 1257067383 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# installpkg kde-bloatware < 1257067385 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Blah blah blah < 1257067387 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh ffs. Judging from harddrive activity light it is fsck after n mounts time < 1257067389 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION waits
< 1257067391 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This package has an init script: < 1257067394 0 :adam_d_!n=Adam@AAnnecy-751-1-27-133.w83-197.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1257067407 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : /etc/rc.d/kde-bloatware -- start KDE bloatware services < 1257067409 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1257067413 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : /etc/rc.d/kde-bloatware.start -- start KDE bloatware services < 1257067415 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DAEMONS=(syslog-ng network rpcbind nfs-common @iptables @sshd @crond @ntpdate @ntpd @smartd @xinetd @nfs-server) < 1257067416 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah there < 1257067418 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : /etc/rc.d/kde-bloatware.stop -- stop KDE bloatware services < 1257067419 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever < 1257067420 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you get the idea < 1257067422 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a bit more than I remembered < 1257067424 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just tell the users to add the lines < 1257067426 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trivial < 1257067431 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, indeed < 1257067493 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I sure will enjoy reporting e.g. bugs to software authors using this distro < 1257067509 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : author: blah blah blah, this fails when doing etc etc, not sure what the problem is, can you help? < 1257067514 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, oh? Mostly due to a.out I assume? < 1257067516 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : me: ok, what distro are you using? < 1257067520 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : author: um, $name < 1257067528 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : me: never heard of it. is it a derivative or something? < 1257067533 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : author: well... no... < 1257067536 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : me: gimme a link < 1257067542 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : author: http://blah.org/ < 1257067542 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1257067554 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : me: static binaries? a.out? this isn't 1990! < 1257067559 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : author: hey! they're good because-- < 1257067563 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : me: sorry, no support < 1257067565 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : author: ! < 1257067571 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :** author has kicked me from the channel < 1257067584 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I very much suspect that some binaries will break if they can't dlopen() stuff. < 1257067598 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: That's true, but most programs let you disable that crap. < 1257067620 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION curses.... wrote "pacman -Sy upgrade"
< 1257067628 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For those that really want programs that don't let you... well, I can have a dynamic linker as a package... but... stay well away if you don't absolutely have to... < 1257067631 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least I didn't mix up portage into it as well < 1257067636 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but just apt and pacman < 1257067676 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, what browser will you include? I somehow assume that you won't be happy with links or lynx < 1257067689 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably http://surf.suckless.org/. < 1257067697 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WebKit + suckless. < 1257067710 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and just a vague memory. I think a.out will confuse the hell out of boehm-gc (w3m uses that iirc) < 1257067717 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION read parts of libgc source
< 1257067726 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried links -g incidenatlly < 1257067729 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*incidentally < 1257067731 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's WEIRD < 1257067733 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, poor you < 1257067736 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does its own font rendering, I think < 1257067744 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :menus and dialogs and form widgets are curses-style < 1257067754 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'd be a lot better if it was elinks < 1257067764 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fucking annoying to have gigantic piles of list-menus blocking your view < 1257067775 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd have installed surf into the VM, but Arch broke libwebkit. sigh. < 1257067783 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I'm twiddling my thumbs until they fix it < 1257067792 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(known issue.) < 1257067810 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, btw that p3 box with arch has a weird issue. If the system is loaded, new ssh connections time out < 1257067816 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see, if we had static binaries, software authors could safely supply binaries they know will work :P < 1257067818 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :loaded here means CPU or network load < 1257067820 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not disk load < 1257067824 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on almost any system < 1257067828 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with no dependencies < 1257067835 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whee, packages got updated < 1257067841 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :install install install. i live for nothing other than to update packages. < 1257067859 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like all these lib*s i'm getting here. wouldn't need them with STATIC BINARIES DID I MENTION STATIC BINARIES :P < 1257067861 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, you know python will break badly by this? < 1257067872 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Fairly sure it won't. Care to justify? < 1257067879 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, all loadable C modules will break. < 1257067881 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are *.so < 1257067887 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and they aren't *that* uncommon < 1257067899 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm something like 47% sure I could link them in. < 1257067918 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, yes you could. But then you would need to rebuild python to add a new one < 1257067933 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. Just like the kernel. < 1257067941 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here's an idea. < 1257067953 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C modules are packages that install .as to a directory somewhere. < 1257067962 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the builder script just links in them all. < 1257067966 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same with kernel modules. < 1257067978 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That way you can install/uninstall modules, and just flip the buildkernel binary or whatever and it'll all work. < 1257067987 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The modules are implemented at the package level, effectively. < 1257068151 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Zzzz" < 1257068219 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1257068232 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, it is annoying. < 1257068240 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The kernel can be fast to build, Python not so much. < 1257068251 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, would need some adjustments to the binary linking. But quite possible in theory yes < 1257068253 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And definitely slower than downloading a binary on a fast connection. < 1257068258 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plus it's a pain for the user... < 1257068260 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, oh and X... X loads drivers and such as *.so < 1257068272 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would need to patch X quite a bit < 1257068273 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yeah, pretty sure you can link those in. < 1257068308 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, with python it is easy to (just change the C code a bit so it looks like those modules already built into python) < 1257068317 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with X I suspect it needs some more work < 1257068334 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to patch it? < 1257068337 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :urgh < 1257068372 0 :adam_d!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1257068381 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, python? well yes think so. So that the module is initialised the right way. Some minor adjustments only. Possibly adding to some array of modules in the main python binary (not sure about that bit) < 1257068417 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I can write a fun stub dynamic linker that does some sort of unholy hack using processes... < 1257068424 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in, an .so is a binary, and it spawns it... < 1257068431 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...on the other hand that would be unholy < 1257068438 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, shared memory mess? < 1257068439 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1257068453 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't *.exe and *.dll have different address spaces on windows iirc? < 1257068463 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you have to hack stuff when you want to share things < 1257068493 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno < 1257068515 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1257068522 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember what I was going to ask you, AnMaster < 1257068525 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1257068532 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: is it possible to compile a gentoo system using static binaries? < 1257068577 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, unknown. But since portage is in python I see a potential problem right there. < 1257068594 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compile static binaries != omit dynamic linker < 1257068598 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :== pass -static to everything < 1257068613 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: does it still take 24h to compile everything? < 1257068628 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, true. But you can't easily mix dynamic linking and static linking iirc < 1257068645 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes you can. < 1257068649 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, depends on hardware. Haven't done a clean install of gentoo for ages. < 1257068650 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a -static binary can easily dlopen(). < 1257068656 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hardware is... a VM. < 1257068712 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, it won't be as fast as installing ubuntu of course. And it will require user interaction in many parts. Unless you use that "not really newfangled any longer" GUI installer. Which I never tried. < 1257068715 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure how it works < 1257068737 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't mind interaction, but if it takes 4 hours or more I'm pretty much not going to bother. < 1257068753 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :other people complained it was laughably bad in the beginning. I assume it improved < 1257068763 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, depends on how much system you want < 1257068774 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :full blown KDE? < 1257068789 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or bootable system without X? < 1257068809 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Small kernel (but I don't want to configure it manually), hopefully with no initrd or anything, networking, X11. < 1257068812 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's pretty much it. < 1257068950 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2.1ghz core 2 duo, 1 gib of ram, pretty boring vm/host really < 1257069125 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, manually or auto with initramfs are the options iirc < 1257069139 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless genkernel nowdays can generate without initramfs < 1257069140 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fine, I can do that. < 1257069145 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So how long would it take, roughly? < 1257069156 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<4 hours, <10 hours, <24 hours, <48 hours? < 1257069159 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, was that "no X" or "with X"? < 1257069164 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With X. < 1257069185 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Drivers supplied by VirtualBox, nothing else needed apart from vesa to bootstrap. < 1257069195 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. assuming a system with dual quad core Xeon CPUs? < 1257069210 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[09:49] ehird: 2.1ghz core 2 duo, 1 gib of ram, pretty boring vm/host really < 1257069220 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1257069225 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :7200 rpm disk :P < 1257069249 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, could be less than 4. Definitely less than 6 at least. < 1257069265 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless things got a lot more bloated since 2007 < 1257069285 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how big are dem livecds i wonder... < 1257069309 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, classical command line stage3 install would only require minimal cd. which is around 100 MB for x86_64 < 1257069320 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol, a livedvd < 1257069329 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, oh btw if you got for multilib x86_64 it will probably not manage in less than 4 hours < 1257069338 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder what exactly they have on that monstrosity over ubuntu's 700 megs < 1257069343 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :livedvd, sheesh < 1257069346 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, source? < 1257069350 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LiveDVD (released Oct 10, 2009) < 1257069351 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(up to 2.6 gigabytes depending on arch) < 1257069351 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :amd64 x86 < 1257069353 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.gentoo.org/main/en/where.xml < 1257069399 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, minimal install + stage3 install following manual < 1257069402 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is what I would do < 1257069414 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like "LFS light" I guess < 1257069419 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stage3 has compiled stuff doesn't it < 1257069437 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, stage3 is enough base system to compile new stuff < 1257069449 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, not static binaries then < 1257069457 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if you are going for static it will likely take longer, due to having to figure out how. < 1257069472 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some packages do have an useflag "static" < 1257069478 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CFLAGS=-static < 1257069483 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the chainsaw maneuver < 1257069646 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, sure. I won't be surprised if things break < 1257069648 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like glibc < 1257069655 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure about other libcs < 1257069658 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never tried < 1257069692 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bleh < 1257069693 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no point with all that < 1257069697 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll just jump straight to my distro < 1257069737 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it won't be hard < 1257069746 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as soon as I have a kernel and an init it can be booted < 1257069750 0 :adam_d!n=Adam@AAnnecy-751-1-2-50.w90-52.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1257069766 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but... I need hardware first < 1257069780 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because VMs reaaaaaaaaaaaally aren't real world < 1257069876 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone got an old computer they want to give to me? :P < 1257069892 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, why not use your mac? < 1257069914 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one because the cognitive dissonance of such an environment on the quite frankly pretty opposite iMac would probably break my brain < 1257069922 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :two because the damn EFI would be bigger than my distro!* < 1257069924 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*exaggeration < 1257069934 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :three because i don't want to deal with EFI and crap < 1257069944 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :four because eh < 1257069949 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't swap the hardware easily < 1257069955 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't test whether new hardware works or whatever < 1257069972 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't swap an SSD in to test performance < 1257069972 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc < 1257070028 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus < 1257070035 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everyone else is going to be running this on pc hardware < 1257070041 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i want to minimise my pain < 1257070126 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :besides, the silent pc tinkerer in me still hasn't found release < 1257070185 0 :adam_d_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1257070343 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, heh < 1257070358 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, so you were the guy that said "Hi! I'm Linux"? < 1257070379 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except you pretended you were the Mac guy < 1257070389 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1257070395 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://dmartin.org/files/Mac_linux.jpg < 1257070419 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, one of several variants of it < 1257070424 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1257070498 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway I'm kinda reluctant to call it a linux distro because when i say linux distro i get a clear picture and my head and mine isn't it... < 1257070529 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, it would be a linux distro < 1257070530 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :("almost certainly cookie-cutter" and "all the general 'modern' crap") < 1257070532 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yes < 1257070533 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just not a GNU/Linux one < 1257070537 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :touché < 1257070542 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a good way of explaining it < 1257070561 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, it is kind of the inverse of Debian/BSD in a way < 1257070566 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1257070600 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, what will it be called? < 1257070621 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :man, I'm terrible at names... < 1257070628 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :microdon linux? < 1257070633 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1257070647 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :midget linux < 1257070652 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1257070662 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :monolith (ooh that's a good one) < 1257070665 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not very googlable though) < 1257070674 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :monolix.. aw, it's taken. < 1257070681 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :monolux is too < 1257070787 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what my install procedure will be like < 1257070830 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably just "use the package manager to install the packages inside the empty partition" for the most part. < 1257070832 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How boring. < 1257070841 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(netinstall only) < 1257071012 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, microlith? < 1257071023 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, that's an acttual existing thing. < 1257071027 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really? < 1257071053 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microlith < 1257071081 0 :MigoMipo!i=54d906d7@gateway/web/freenode/x-bymlwoyaajdeoyte JOIN :#esoteric < 1257071090 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh. < 1257071160 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, no point thinking about a name now < 1257071166 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1257071180 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll probably call the init something lame like ehird's init anyway < 1257071182 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, git is too bloated for this btw. I suggest rcs < 1257071188 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the package manager might have its own name < 1257071205 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Heh. < 1257071212 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Methinks git is not bloated. :P < 1257071222 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, sec < 1257071262 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :85616 /usr/bin/rcs < 1257071267 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :945520 /usr/bin/git < 1257071269 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is bytes < 1257071290 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You forgot the few git-*s! < 1257071295 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm seems like rcs consists of several binaries too < 1257071304 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :git-cvsserver, git-shell, you know, all these things. < 1257071306 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I thought they were symlinks or such? < 1257071306 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes. < 1257071308 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Many binaries. < 1257071313 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, that was abolished. < 1257071317 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :These are just auxillary tool,s. < 1257071321 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*auxiliary < 1257071323 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*tools < 1257071348 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ qlist git | wc -l < 1257071348 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :690 < 1257071352 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ qlist rcs | wc -l < 1257071352 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :30 < 1257071366 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh shush you. < 1257071383 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, half of the git files are in /usr/share/doc anyway < 1257071391 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least half < 1257071393 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All that pesky documentation. Just bloat! < 1257071400 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, exactly! < 1257071410 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :half of rcs is docs too < 1257071412 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Use your MIND to understand it. < 1257071415 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just that half is much smaller half < 1257071436 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ qlist rcs | grep -v /usr/share | wc -l < 1257071437 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :11 < 1257071440 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: RE: static Gentoo. < 1257071441 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ qlist git | grep -v /usr/share | wc -l < 1257071441 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :157 < 1257071449 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could back in 2005; the profile for that is no longer maintained at all. < 1257071465 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dropped along with uclibc support. < 1257071475 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Bastards. < 1257071489 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah; I'm kinda upset about it too. < 1257071490 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ qlist rcs | grep -v /usr/share | xargs du -bh --total | tail -n 1 < 1257071490 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :6,4M total < 1257071493 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ qlist git | grep -v /usr/share | xargs du -bh --total | tail -n 1 < 1257071493 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :11M total < 1257071503 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, git is bloated. Even excluding docs < 1257071511 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and possibly other non-docs in /usr/share) < 1257071518 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Git does a lot more than rcs. < 1257071523 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, yeah of course < 1257071524 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I have to wonder if any user or developer ever really wanted dynamic linking before some crazy guy added it. < 1257071527 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that wasn't the point here < 1257071529 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: wow, rcs is that big? < 1257071532 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :git is that small? < 1257071539 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a really tiny difference considering how much better git is < 1257071573 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, 13 MB with the compressed docs in /usr/share < 1257071577 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gentoo uses lzma it seems < 1257071579 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rcs is like the worst revision control system that actually does the job of a revision control system... < 1257071589 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :must have been a recent change < 1257071590 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Gentoo uses whatever PORTAGE_COMPRESS is set to. < 1257071592 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was bz2 before < 1257071594 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're being too kind to rcs, pikhq. < 1257071595 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, true < 1257071602 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Consider. < 1257071605 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CVS is actually better than RCS. < 1257071608 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, worse than visual sourcesafe? < 1257071623 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: do you just have an internal macro that uses anything microsoft as a lowest common denominator? < 1257071630 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They may have changed it in the 10.0 profile; I dunno, I set PORTAGE_COMPRESS to lzma quite a while ago. < 1257071651 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: RCS does the job. *Barely*. < 1257071661 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yes, but, you know how bad CVS is? < 1257071665 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Absurdly. < 1257071666 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: CVS was AN IMPROVEMENT on RCS. < 1257071669 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Think about that. < 1257071686 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, not a macro. it is a < 1257071693 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : form iirc? < 1257071704 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone written in Lisp would never code in Bash and C. < 1257071707 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I'm saying that the only things worse than RCS are adhoc shared directories with "branches" consisting of "renaming files" and crazy shit like that. < 1257071721 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1257071723 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :special form < 1257071724 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it waas < 1257071730 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your aa key is stuttering. < 1257071735 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1257071736 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is < 1257071743 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Either that or your a key actually has "aa" printed on it, which would be lulzy. < 1257071755 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cp foo "fooBar";cp foo "baz/foo"; # There's revision control! < 1257071777 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"cp" "foo" "foobar" < 1257071783 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Useless use of quotes award! < 1257071788 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, my finggeerrs are ccoold. < 1257071804 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shatttering finger nails I gueesss < 1257071807 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I typed that in meaning to use spaces and didn't use spaces. < 1257071814 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Put the damn heating on. < 1257071820 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, it is on. < 1257071824 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Turn it up. < 1257071865 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, how do you turn a fireplace up? < 1257071882 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(j/k, both the electric heater and the fireplace are "on") < 1257071894 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How cold is it indoors in Sweden?! < 1257071903 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Surely those would be enough to warm any room. < 1257071943 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, house built in 1907. Sure it has been upgraded since then. But still, not quite the same as a modern house < 1257071958 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but really, those would be enough to warm a 5 C room. < 1257071964 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe. < 1257071970 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: How warm of you. < 1257071983 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I estimate it is around 17 C indoors atm < 1257071995 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I bet people in Nordic countries are actually warmer than e.g. Brits, because they always have heating on. < 1257072000 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(indoors) < 1257072024 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, not during middle of summer < 1257072029 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yeah. < 1257072031 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :say, june-august < 1257072035 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But your summers are probably better than ours. < 1257072037 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in these parts of Sweden < 1257072044 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We get, uh, rain. < 1257072047 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe a few days of sun. < 1257072050 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe only July in north Sweden < 1257072056 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, we do get *some* rain too < 1257072059 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Brr, subarctic climatee. < 1257072061 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*climate < 1257072067 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but UK always get rain < 1257072068 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's like bipolar disorder for weather. < 1257072089 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HEY THIS SUMMER IS PRETTY COOL < 1257072094 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow it is winter and my toes fell off < 1257072097 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :repeat ad infinitum < 1257072120 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, the sun becomes retarded < 1257072126 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"ima stay up here for dayz" < 1257072136 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"but but i dont wanna get up for like. a day" < 1257072213 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally... < 1257072240 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could make a passable multitouch surface with some patterned glass and a webcam chip. < 1257072248 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite easy to detect a hand. < 1257072255 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And fingers, with an appropriate pattern. < 1257072285 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, "a day"? < 1257072290 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than that in Kiruna < 1257072304 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, it's like night and day for months in subarctic climates. < 1257072309 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like a few months during summer all up and some months during winter all down < 1257072311 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Horrible. < 1257072333 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although... < 1257072335 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, quite cool to see the sun going around to the north instead of setting < 1257072339 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as a tourist I mean < 1257072343 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wouldn't want to live there < 1257072362 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The daylight parts + everyone adopts Uberman = HAHA WE ARE TOTALLY TWICE AS AWESOME AS YOU < 1257072365 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has been up there during summer
< 1257072380 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"We're just up. Almost continuously." < 1257072385 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Day. Forever." < 1257072500 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah < 1257072553 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why nah? < 1257072614 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people sleep during the time that would have been night < 1257072630 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know, but if everyone did adopt Uberman, it would be colossally awesome. < 1257072641 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is. when the sun is standing in north < 1257072740 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1257072741 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fun thing to do: Mirror entire compilation setup for my distro, type "mk". Watch every package in the whole distro compile. < 1257072749 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wheeeeeeeeeeee < 1257072770 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, in parallel? < 1257072792 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does mk support -j (or equivalent) < 1257072794 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1257072801 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes: < 1257072807 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION imagines a cluster
< 1257072823 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The environment variable $NPROC determines how many targets may be updated simultaneously; Some operating systems, e.g. Plan 9, set $NPROC automatically to the number of CPUs on the current machine." < 1257072823 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ibm roadrunner. How many seconds will it take? < 1257072836 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about Blue Gene, which runs Plan 9? < 1257072846 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, heh good idea < 1257072847 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, I don't know. Less than a minute for sure. < 1257072854 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe more if you include KDE ;-) < 1257072868 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, I hope I don't outgrow having to compile every package myself... < 1257072884 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt I'd be able to get people to contribute server resources. < 1257072891 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, yeah. some stuff can't be done in parallel. Like when you have to generate the source file for something else (think: flex, bison, ...) < 1257072941 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, predition: you won't be the next ubuntu < 1257072967 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite. < 1257072992 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't expect more than, say, 100 users for a long time. < 1257072999 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even that's pushing it. < 1257073005 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I'd expect ~1 user < 1257073012 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think that's true. < 1257073013 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus a few that tries it out < 1257073018 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then goes elsewhere < 1257073030 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll be pretty committed to maintaining packages. < 1257073036 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, well. zzo could have used it. But he will likely make his own as well instead < 1257073038 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And there isn't really anything like it. stali is the closest. < 1257073044 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than using your < 1257073052 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: zzo doesn't innovate, though... he just reinvents at the same level. < 1257073057 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He doesn't do anything new. < 1257073061 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1257073069 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, and adds options to it < 1257073069 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh, no offence if he's reading this. < 1257073072 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to set window title < 1257073086 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here's a good option: "Name of this option" < 1257073092 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a string, defaults to "Name of this option" < 1257073097 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1257073111 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[X] The state of this option < 1257073137 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1257073185 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I imagine if I posted it on the Arch Linux forums I'd get some users, even if only temporarily. (But I don't really like the crowd there.) < 1257073198 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I'm not masochistic enough to create busywork for myself like that. < 1257073210 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, unlike your mom < 1257073220 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh-huh. < 1257073221 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(too good chance to miss) < 1257073248 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no offence meant of course < 1257073313 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(heh "no offence meant" after a your mom joke really makes no sense) < 1257073347 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Guess who else really makes no sense? < 1257073348 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hitler. < 1257073353 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(No offence) < 1257073404 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1257073702 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how much stuff compiles with libc5. < 1257073737 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, why libc5? < 1257073753 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not suggesting glibc < 1257073760 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just something modern < 1257073763 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Last non-glibc release. I was just curious. < 1257073765 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like uclibc or something < 1257073784 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or porting BSD libc? < 1257073796 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(actually scratch that) < 1257073815 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uclibc is lgpl < 1257073822 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1257073825 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I can't distribute statically linked uclibc binaries, < 1257073828 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without also distributing an unlinked .o < 1257073832 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric := not happening < 1257073836 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, what will you use instead of bison? < 1257073843 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and flex < 1257073844 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Um, yacc. < 1257073846 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1257073848 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1257073855 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course if some stuff depends on either they can have it,. < 1257073858 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*it. < 1257073869 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, iirc ick does < 1257073875 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, isn't that right? < 1257073882 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, my only existing options are Newlib and Bionic (Android's). < 1257073899 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bionic doesn't support /etc/passwd or fstab and their user stuff is hardcoded and stuff, but with hackery it would make a nice BSD-licensed minimalist libc. < 1257073901 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, or porting netbsd libc < 1257073906 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But still, it's always going to be dictated by Android. < 1257073914 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Newlib is stale but, I think, acceptable. < 1257073917 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It feels very meh, though. < 1257073922 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I don't like Red Hat. < 1257073927 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: ick depends on a yacc-like and a lex-like < 1257073928 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: That is one option. < 1257073933 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think they have to be bison and flex specifically < 1257073936 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: It'd be a lot of work, though. A lot. < 1257073942 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They use lots of BSD-only stuff. < 1257073948 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, wasn't it some infinite lookahead for '. or something like that? < 1257073956 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION forgot the details of that parsing issue
< 1257073958 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: And BSD libc and BSD kernel are even more tied together than BSD kernel and BSD userland. < 1257073972 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't like being dictated by the whims of the developers of the BSD, y'know? < 1257073981 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, true < 1257073983 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, your own libc? < 1257073999 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm no good at optimisation. < 1257074009 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1257074021 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not < 1257074024 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dunno. < 1257074034 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, maintaining a compatible libc would be a metric fuckton of work. < 1257074039 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Enough to build a small company around. < 1257074041 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1257074065 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dietlibc would be so, so perfect if only its author wasn't a lunatic who GPL licenses it to stop Microsoft stealing it *sigh*. < 1257074078 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, what architectures will you support? < 1257074087 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i686 < 1257074109 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no 64-bit? < 1257074109 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :before you ask the answer is compatibility < 1257074117 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i said that before that appeared on my screen :) < 1257074131 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, reverse order here :P < 1257074138 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :diff by one sec < 1257074142 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1257074147 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't have sub-second timestamps < 1257074147 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, 64-bit doesn't really have any advantages apart from registers < 1257074160 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it uses the PAE hack just like you can do in 32-bit, so no advantages for lots of memory < 1257074161 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, and with more than 4 GB RAM. < 1257074165 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PAE < 1257074166 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, wrong < 1257074170 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PAE is for kerne < 1257074171 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kernel* < 1257074181 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :user space can't have more than 4 GB in one process < 1257074184 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, sure < 1257074200 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a pretty edge user case. < 1257074219 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, currently, sure < 1257074238 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when it becomes common I'll flip some switches and make it 64-bit only < 1257074245 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(processes using over 4 GiB) < 1257074270 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, and imagine working with IPv6 ips. dividing two of them on 32-bit needs a lot more operations than on 64-bit (no clue why you would do that though) < 1257074270 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: anyway clearly the larger filesystems and higher ram usage cause the need to use >4 GiB, 64-bit is inverse-of-self-defeating ;-) < 1257074291 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IPv6 is divided into blocks < 1257074293 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...literally < 1257074298 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1257074315 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can, for instance, get all addresses divisible by 39853948 < 1257074316 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-P < 1257074322 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*note: total lies < 1257074335 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err yeah total lies < 1257074357 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but what then did you mean by blocks. Not same as I was thinking about presumably < 1257074363 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd like to watch a totally serious documentary that isn't outrageously absurd, except the only problem is it's filled with things that are total lies < 1257074366 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :simply not true < 1257074400 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, if it wasn't outrageously absurd, idiots would think it was true < 1257074405 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus no one dare produce that < 1257074423 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just put "Note: All of the following contents are full of complete lies." at the start :P < 1257074462 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, no one would see that, everyone would think it was the usual "you may not copy, lend, watch or touch this dvd blah blah" < 1257074473 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then that is their problem. < 1257074513 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that was an example of outrageously absurd btw) < 1257074580 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think newlib is my best option for now < 1257074844 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dddfs < 1257074916 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a while back i wrote 2/3 out in full peano set theoretic notation < 1257074925 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all {{{{}}}{}{}{}{{}}}, rhythm < 1257074941 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yesterday i got round to turning that into music < 1257074966 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so { goes up a n-tatonic tone, } goes down, a comma is a pause and so on similarly < 1257074974 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1257074983 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://users.aber.ac.uk/rhw6/music/halfsecrests5-tet.mp3 < 1257075016 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is surprisingly (except not because it's pretty richly structured) melodic < 1257075021 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, peano set theoretic notation? *googles* < 1257075036 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1257075036 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://lebesgue.wordpress.com/2009/09/21/two-thirds-of-nothing/ < 1257075037 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x_x < 1257075064 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, that seems to be a rather verbose notation in any case < 1257075069 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the integers are constructed as an equivalence set of ordered pairs of naturals < 1257075101 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and 2/3 with a dedekind cut using integers < 1257075112 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing: i like this mp3 < 1257075118 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, how long is it? < 1257075123 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh, 20 minutes < 1257075128 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, wow < 1257075134 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are shorter versions < 1257075136 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :says the classical listener. < 1257075155 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, usually you get around 10 minutes at most, unless it is Mahler. < 1257075166 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is more Gregor-esque < 1257075170 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in length < 1257075174 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what < 1257075190 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://users.aber.ac.uk/rhw6/music/onetwentiethat200hz.mp3 is 5 minutes for example < 1257075199 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and considerably more manic, especially given it doesn't have rests < 1257075201 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing: i'm listening to this and all three of my neurons dedicated to saying "hey is this philip glass" are firing ontinuously < 1257075206 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's also not on any musical scale < 1257075207 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, there is some bas sound in the bg? < 1257075210 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, yes, it's uncanny < 1257075211 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, of the first one I mean < 1257075218 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*continuously < 1257075230 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster, two sources of gunk because I hacked it together quickly < 1257075238 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the "rests" are actually 25 hz tones < 1257075258 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the clicking is because when it adds tones, it just writes them sequentially, so it's all very cuspy < 1257075269 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hence you get a clicking at every note, but I think it helps < 1257075270 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, why not silent rests? < 1257075275 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION pauses to listen to the 5m one
< 1257075277 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: wuick hack < 1257075279 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as he said < 1257075281 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1257075281 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*quick < 1257075292 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i put it to 1 but something horrible happened < 1257075307 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :non-euclidean horrible? < 1257075308 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://users.aber.ac.uk/rhw6/music/onetwentiethat200hz.mp3 isn't very good. :P < 1257075318 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well see it's not even scaled < 1257075330 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just turns the frequency up or down 200 hz linearly < 1257075337 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah indeed < 1257075341 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doing it on a chromatic scale is also weird < 1257075342 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://users.aber.ac.uk/rhw6/music/onetenth12-tet.mp3 < 1257075344 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because boring < 1257075355 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it sounds a little like The Flight of the Bumble Bee < 1257075360 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION lols
< 1257075378 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, ghostly theme on hyper speed? < 1257075390 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the last one < 1257075392 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the ghostly theme < 1257075411 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, thing SNES RPG or such. Ghost wood. the theme there. < 1257075421 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where SNES RPG is any generic SNES RPG < 1257075425 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(almost) < 1257075427 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know it, but I see your point < 1257075442 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the philip glass thing is a good point < 1257075459 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it were orchestrated properly, it would sound surprisingly good for all that it is entirely algorithmic < 1257075463 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, why not use midi btw? < 1257075477 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I've not worked out how to get python to do midi yet < 1257075481 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1257075502 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas getting it to write sine waves to wav is a matter of stealing code from somebody's blog < 1257075520 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, http://wiki.python.org/moin/PythonInMusic ? < 1257075523 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :first google hit < 1257075534 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, i looked all that up < 1257075558 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i figured also i might as well just do bleep bloop sine waves to see if it was worth making it prettier < 1257075594 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://users.aber.ac.uk/rhw6/music/halfsecrests5-tet.mp3 settles into a beat after a while < 1257075596 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a sort of rhythm < 1257075603 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, using silence for pauses might work better. Not sure though < 1257075606 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, the repetition has abstracted away into a rhyythm < 1257075608 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*rhythm < 1257075619 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster, well undoubtedly yes < 1257075631 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like the little pats < 1257075637 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :click things < 1257075639 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but duller < 1257075642 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't fix them :P < 1257075644 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, especially since I have good enough headphones to hear those 25 Hz tones quite clearly < 1257075648 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :me too < 1257075651 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: lowpass < 1257075666 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, hm? < 1257075668 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i probably ought to try that < 1257075670 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's see < 1257075674 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :run it through a lowpass filter < 1257075675 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the clicks < 1257075676 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at 25 Hz < 1257075684 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I'm just doing: $ mplayer http://users.aber.ac.uk/rhw6/music/halfsecrests5-tet.mp3 < 1257075690 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So don't, ffs. < 1257075692 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would be a PITA to figure out how < 1257075696 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't see any way short of like, smoothing out the waveform somehow to get rid of them, nor do I want to get rid of them < 1257075699 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sox < 1257075710 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably in the ~~real orchestration~~ there's some violins just going duhduhduhduhduh < 1257075713 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing: open audacity, put wav in, lowpass < 1257075720 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1257075738 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, why insert silence instead from the beginning? Is that harder? < 1257075745 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/73/Spectrogram-of-swept-triangular-wave.png ;; the matrix data centre! < 1257075767 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, hah < 1257075774 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster, yeah, the way I've jambed the stolen code in, it's difficult to get it to pass through to silence < 1257075790 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without adding more jambed code, by which point I shouldn't be jambing shit together like that < 1257075800 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, getting this on piano or such would be awesome < 1257075816 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i still think it'd be better as a string quartet < 1257075839 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, maybe. Seems a bit too fast for that though < 1257075908 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, or playing pizzicato? < 1257075914 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah! < 1257075923 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pizzicto would get the clickiness, I guess < 1257075925 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*cato < 1257075966 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, I find it hard to believe any human could manage that for ~20 minutes though :P < 1257075972 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then we'll build robots < 1257075979 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a race of atomic supermen < 1257075983 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, about the beat. There is a beat from the start to me < 1257075991 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aah I've always wanted a robotic math rock band < 1257076005 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :their timing would be IMPECCABLE < 1257076097 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait hang on i think i see a way to get silences < 1257076129 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :noo you'll ruin it < 1257076139 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe, maybe not < 1257076141 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we'll see < 1257076149 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just add "-af sinesuppress=25" or "-af equalizer=-12:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:0:0" to the mplayer command line. (Disclaimer: I don't know whether either one will work, can't seem to find a generic FIR filter there.) < 1257076167 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, the second one. What does it mean? < 1257076192 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, the first one doesn't < 1257076208 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nor the second < 1257076240 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a 10-band equalizer; that line of numbers is telling it to provide -12 dB of amplification at 31.25 Hz, 0 on all other bands; it should at least make any 25 Hz frequency components less loud. < 1257076293 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, not by much < 1257076315 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the ending is n ice < 1257076319 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the low tone < 1257076320 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*nice < 1257076448 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah okay that sounds like it worked < 1257076553 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://doc.cat-v.org/bell_labs/crabs/technical-memorandum.pdf < 1257076553 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :awesome awesome awesome < 1257076635 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, hm? where? < 1257076641 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :url that is < 1257076642 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uploading < 1257076756 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn could you implement crabs on X11? < 1257076759 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think maybe < 1257076766 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing's stopping windows from fucking with each other right? < 1257076799 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, what exactly does crabs do? I find that scanned text quite hard to read < 1257076814 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :headache-inducing < 1257076814 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zoom in < 1257076821 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's impossible at smaller sizes < 1257076824 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But at bigger sizes it's fine < 1257076828 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1257076833 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You really need to read it, it's awe-inspiring < 1257076839 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it gets better on the actual text < 1257076845 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :starting "TECHNICAL MEMORANDUM", "Laws and violations" < 1257076858 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I read the laws and violations section < 1257076868 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite funny. But I want like an abstract of crabs < 1257076877 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Audacity's highpass filter gets rid of them reasonably well, but that's unarguably more work than just streaming through mplayer. (You really don't want to low*pass* at 25 Hz; unless you want to keep just them and discard everything else.) < 1257076885 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: your loss; it's absolute genius < 1257076890 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :summarising it would ruin it < 1257076893 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1257076908 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, it is pixly when you zoom in < 1257076917 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't zoom in that far then. < 1257076942 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://users.aber.ac.uk/rhw6/music/halfsectruerests5-tet.mp3 < 1257076948 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :has true etc. < 1257076979 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Oh*, the name wasn't about "secrets" at all. < 1257076979 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, those clicks. What causes them did you say? < 1257076998 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing: sounds more mechanical < 1257077011 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, haha < 1257077021 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems to be because it writes half a second of sine wave at, say, A, then it goes up and immediately starts writing another sine wave a tone higher < 1257077029 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the waveform is cuspy < 1257077033 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which clicks, I guess < 1257077048 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pthing, go figure out midi :) < 1257077059 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: do you realise how demanding that sounds < 1257077066 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, yeah. < 1257077072 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was half-joking < 1257077101 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, what is that QIX? < 1257077105 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that knowledge is assumed about < 1257077111 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A game of some sort. < 1257077119 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doesn't matter too much < 1257077191 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is from 1984, btw < 1257077200 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1257077202 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bonus: It includes screenshots of circa 1984 graphical Unix environments < 1257077205 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Non-X11, I believe < 1257077213 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Including the 1-bit faces < 1257077269 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :including code with k&r decls :) < 1257077285 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why was one of them *dicating code* < 1257077294 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dicating? < 1257077300 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-typo < 1257077319 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(dictating of course) < 1257077320 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dictating i.e. explaining it < 1257077330 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes I know what it means < 1257077337 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just wondering why they did it like that < 1257077341 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, dictating means reciting < 1257077344 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But in this context it means explaining < 1257077351 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And because people know English better than C < 1257077351 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pair programming, you know. Back in the eighties! How agile. < 1257077359 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, haha < 1257077366 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Their PRODUCTIVITY. So high. SO HIGH < 1257077398 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1257077428 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wasn't it possible back then to draw to a private buffer and blit it to the screen or such? < 1257077444 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The graphical environment was called Blit. < 1257077459 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what you mean, though. < 1257077470 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, double buffering basically I guess. < 1257077477 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, why wouldn't you be able to < 1257077489 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION just read about "angry measles"
< 1257077496 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Keep going! < 1257077500 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It just gets better. < 1257077532 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I'm just wondering why they can't look at a private bitmap. which might or might not be hidden by a window on top. In theory that would work as wlel < 1257077534 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well* < 1257077549 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because you can't access other process's memory. < 1257077574 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, er. I think you misunderstood me < 1257077608 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, like a modern game would do. Render to a canvas. You can read it yourself. Window system takes care of handling hiding part of it when another window is on top < 1257077653 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This has nothing to do with any of the demos. < 1257077859 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure it does: anything that keeps a private bitmap and blits it on screen whenever some part of it changes (and periodically-but-often) is sort-of crab-immune. (The story about crabs eating someone's painting, for example, wouldn't really work on a modern painty program which doesn't use the screen as the only copy of the bitmap-being-edited.) < 1257077876 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure that sort of stuff would be fast enough on a terminal, though. < 1257077877 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1257077878 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yes. < 1257077882 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Too slow, not simple enough. < 1257077892 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not needed, because, you know. < 1257077899 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only things like crabs break it. < 1257077906 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1257077912 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Besides, it's not something that's easy to discovevr. < 1257077913 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :discoevr < 1257077915 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*discover < 1257077923 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's quite ludicrous to do two graphic writes to do one < 1257078079 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"TMBR: A mind consisting of computable determinism does not perceive." < 1257078079 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Guess I'm a p-zombie then < 1257078138 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Anti-evolutionist Don McLeroy, a dentist and chair of the Texas State Board of Education, testified at Friday's hearing: 'I disagree with these experts. Someone has got to stand up to experts.'" Yes! Down with the experts, I say! Always being all.. experty, all over the place! < 1257078149 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, it mentions the lens being unaffected by being re-generated. Well, basically every modern app would be unaffected. terminal would be fixed by simply scrolling it up down a few steps < 1257078153 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: >_< < 1257078258 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Unless you make the crab mark onto a separate mostly-transparent window, and use a bit of programming to always keep that on top of the window below. < 1257078269 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's no faiar. < 1257078271 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*fair < 1257078302 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That one Windows proggie that lets you shoot your windows with a shotgun, leaving permanent marks, does something like that, I think. < 1257078303 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, true, and what ehird said < 1257078340 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I believe that best form of government is a mix of libertarian, socialitic, free market policies." how coincidental, i believe the best colour is both black and white < 1257078393 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"You are everybody but don't realize it." why am I reading this subreddit, it's just uninformed idiots stating their idiotic beliefs < 1257078400 0 :puzzlet_!n=puzzlet@147.46.241.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1257078562 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION toys with the idea of registering rwx.st
< 1257078568 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rwx.st? < 1257078569 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1257078602 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I need a domain and it's short and catchy. rwx after the file permissions, st is a popular country-code-hijacked-for-generic-stuff dealie < 1257078643 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus it looks aesthetically pleasing — http://rwx.st/bsdutils/releases/bsdutils-12.tar.gz < 1257078649 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird@rwx.st < 1257078663 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: And then everyone can read, write and execute you! < 1257078669 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Absolutuely! < 1257078672 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Absolutely < 1257078681 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh, pointless X trickery: http://xdesktopwaves.sourceforge.net/ < 1257078716 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, rwx.st is also pretty neutral, i.e. it's not really tied to anything because it's a meaningless jumble of letters < 1257078725 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hard to fool myself into thinking I'll keep it forever, but eh. < 1257078781 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My only complaint is that on QWERTY, rwx is a bit left-biased. < 1257078795 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :However, it's quite easy to type. < 1257078870 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heyo < 1257078885 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, can't magnify screenshots < 1257078888 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :irritating < 1257078889 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should write a mail server thing. < 1257078890 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hows it goin, kids < 1257078897 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's going < 1257078897 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait for it < 1257078899 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TOTALLY < 1257078900 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BITCHING < 1257078901 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RAD < 1257078906 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh man < 1257078914 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, why write a mail server? < 1257078922 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cuz they all suck :/ < 1257078925 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cory doctorow has a new story out. :X < 1257078932 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, netqmail too? < 1257078939 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes. I also am a bit doubtful as to how well it works on modern, compositey 3d-fluffy X stuff; the proggie seems a bit on the old side. < 1257078950 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: does it include a really, really, really awkward sex scene? just kidding, of course it does < 1257078957 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, oh I thought it used composite < 1257078960 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(note: I have never actually read any cory doctorow novels) < 1257078960 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it looked like it < 1257078969 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: qmail is probably nice if you apply 500 paatches < 1257078973 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*patches < 1257078979 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: i dont know. its about decommissioning the first AI < 1257078980 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, yeah that is what netqmail is about < 1257078984 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those 500 already < 1257078985 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I don't really know; it's just that GCC 2.7 doesn't sound so new. But maybe they've just tested with old compilers too. < 1257078993 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: "twiddle my bits baby" < 1257078996 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hah < 1257078998 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1257079013 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, okay, xshape is old iir < 1257079014 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc* < 1257079016 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: doesn't qmail depend on daemontools crap anyway? < 1257079025 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, you can use other ones < 1257079031 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, like sysvinit even < 1257079039 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Last release from Sat Dec 18 2004. < 1257079044 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how about rc-shell-script-init :P < 1257079061 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, unsure. I would recommend a supervisor if possible. But not strictly needed I think < 1257079115 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, um something was meant to go here but I got distracted < 1257079123 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1257079149 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have not yet slept. < 1257079166 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyw- < 1257079170 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm sure it was relevant < 1257079175 0 :puzzlet!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1257079179 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't have been "it can't be too hard" writing a mail server will be a bitch < 1257079198 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wonder if i could avoid imap, just rsync from the server to get your mail :) < 1257079212 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...since imap is really bad < 1257079246 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so is smtp come to think of it < 1257079256 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, you can't avoid smtp < 1257079263 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1257079267 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for like talking to other mail servers < 1257079268 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can avoid it for sending your own mail, though < 1257079273 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, oh? < 1257079281 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance "ssh sendmail ..." < 1257079283 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well the mail server needs to use it to send it onwards < 1257079286 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(sendmail(1) != sendmail) < 1257079290 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: well, yeah. < 1257079337 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, ssh is bloated. Your distro should use telnet < 1257079339 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;P < 1257079349 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact i was just starting to write a line complaining about ssh < 1257079355 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and rcp < 1257079357 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of scp < 1257079363 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the negotiation crap in ssh is so stupid < 1257079370 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"hurr let's put every encryption algorithm EVER" < 1257079370 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, oh? < 1257079372 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"into it" < 1257079376 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"and guarantee NONE OF THEM" < 1257079383 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"and then, just, like, chit-chat for hours to decide which to use" < 1257079394 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"WE ARE CRYPTOGRAPHERS FUCK YEAH" < 1257079412 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, it doesn't seem to take long to me? < 1257079413 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, ssh is really big so it's hard to trustt. < 1257079415 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*trust < 1257079418 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: everything is fast. < 1257079488 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess i should concentrate on getting myself some hardware < 1257079502 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :them new, cheaper, cooler and more energy-efficient i7s are looking mighty purty < 1257079564 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol, intel though will apparently never stop ripping people off < 1257079573 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2.8 GHz, $289.99 < 1257079578 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2.93 GHz, $549.99 < 1257079583 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same specs otherwise < 1257079620 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean really, is there a >=1 GHz processor in the world that cannot be overclocked by .13? < 1257079796 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, depends on if the 2.8 ones are made from bad 2.93 ones < 1257079805 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, "they still work just fine for the lower speed" < 1257079810 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, i highly doubt that < 1257079821 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seeing as the core i7 is the highest-end desktop processor intel offer < 1257079823 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somewhat like the 3 core cpus from 4 core cpus with one bad core < 1257079845 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...I'm driven to Core 2 slightly, though, because I'd like ECC... < 1257079860 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, i7 doesn't support ECC? < 1257079865 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nope. < 1257079866 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not even in server editions? < 1257079869 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1257079872 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're not i7. < 1257079876 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're Xeon "Nehalem". < 1257079881 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1257079885 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, why not go for that then < 1257079895 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it costs like $500 more just for the CPU. < 1257079901 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good reason < 1257079934 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, not that bad < 1257079940 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$639.99 for 2.93 GHz < 1257079949 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No 2.8 GHz option though, just 2.66 GHz at $269.99 < 1257080001 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, you probably want kernel and libc available in cpu specific versions. For other software generic would work well < 1257080011 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, maybe video player. Not sure < 1257080013 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? debian doesn't < 1257080021 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't see anyone complaining < 1257080029 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heck, debian are not even 686 < 1257080032 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're 386 < 1257080040 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, ubuntu does on i686 for i386 and i686 libcs iirc < 1257080051 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, cmov/non-cmov < 1257080059 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :using cmov eh < 1257080060 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forgot when that was added exactly < 1257080064 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds like someone's using a pentium 4 < 1257080070 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's a pessimisation on recent hardware < 1257080074 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if you are using a pentium 4 < 1257080077 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*BASH* < 1257080078 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*BASH* < 1257080080 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*BASH* < 1257080084 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, depends on if the branch is predictable < 1257080085 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can dead people use pentium 4s? < 1257080095 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://ondioline.org/mail/cmov-a-bad-idea-on-out-of-order-cpus < 1257080105 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's bad. < 1257080123 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, when I profiled I saw basically no difference on modern hardware. But a large speed up on a pentium 3 < 1257080135 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is p3 even 686 < 1257080137 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a specific sample < 1257080141 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, it is < 1257080149 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, whatever < 1257080151 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything is slow on a p3 < 1257080168 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, not really. remember than 14 second boot with arch and no initrd? < 1257080174 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, sure. < 1257080177 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :p3 at 996 MHz < 1257080187 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wanna donate that box? :P < 1257080188 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(lol *almost* 1 GHz!) < 1257080190 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, no way < 1257080196 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you suck :( < 1257080197 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, 20 GB PATA disk btw < 1257080204 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and hm 512 MB RAM at most < 1257080206 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop saying pata nobody says pata < 1257080207 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people say ide < 1257080219 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Debian does somewhat CPU-specific kernels; linux-image-2.6-{486,686,amd64} are available on the i386 platform. < 1257080227 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I say pata < 1257080230 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :p3s actually went up to 1.4 GHz < 1257080231 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so does kernel < 1257080243 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, amd64 on i386? < 1257080244 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1257080267 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes, if you want to run a 32-bit debian on an amd64-style CPU. < 1257080272 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :People do that sort of thing. < 1257080290 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, a good reason to write my own mail server: to write my own mailing list software. Duh! < 1257080290 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and libc6-{,i686,amd64} too. < 1257080292 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well chroot I guess < 1257080303 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: you can optimise for amd64 architectures without using long mode < 1257080312 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION forces ehird to use mailman
< 1257080316 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOOOO < 1257080318 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO < 1257080321 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO < 1257080330 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hereby swear off mailing lists for ever and a day < 1257080337 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION forces ehird to read his font rendered in Ariel instead of Helvetica
< 1257080345 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i define ariel to be an alias to helvetica < 1257080346 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HA < 1257080347 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TYPOSPLOIT < 1257080347 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :his mail rendered* < 1257080352 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, argh. < 1257080377 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :phoenix ~ $ uname -a < 1257080377 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linux phoenix 2.6.31.5-L1 #1 Sun Nov 1 12:32:00 CET 2009 i686 Pentium III (Coppermine) GenuineIntel GNU/Linux < 1257080397 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intel_Core#Core_i9 < 1257080400 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yeah 500 MB RAM < 1257080402 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :says free < 1257080403 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :six cores? next year? < 1257080406 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :12 MiB of cache? < 1257080408 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : total used free shared buffers cached < 1257080408 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mem: 500 31 469 0 2 16 < 1257080410 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU IINTEL < 1257080415 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCKING WITH MY MIND AND SHIT < 1257080416 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least it's the same socket < 1257080421 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I HAVE LOTS OF MONEY ANYWAY RIGHT? < 1257080428 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, you do? < 1257080429 0 :fax!n=somebody@unaffiliated/fax JOIN :#esoteric < 1257080430 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1257080448 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, why do you need high end hardware? < 1257080449 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i have quite a bit but that's just because i never buy anything and little amounts accumulate, funny how that works < 1257080458 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't even get my puny 4G used: < 1257080459 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : total used free shared buffers cached < 1257080459 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mem: 3835 2116 1719 0 139 964 < 1257080463 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, oh btw your distro might be binary. but to *you* it will be source based < 1257080464 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since < 1257080468 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know < 1257080473 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you will make the binary packages < 1257080476 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: separate step < 1257080486 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can install a package i compiled earlier that i'm not using < 1257080492 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so really it's just like maintaining a source tree < 1257080497 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a horrible source tree < 1257080501 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :full of horrible software < 1257080508 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1257080543 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpu MHz : 996.661 < 1257080543 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cache size : 256 KB < 1257080547 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and < 1257080549 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :flags : fpu vme de pse tsc msr pae mce cx8 apic sep mtrr pge mca cmov pse36 mmx fxsr sse < 1257080551 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so few < 1257080562 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: also because high end hardware is fast. and if you're careful with your system config and willing to get your hands dirty you can get it for quite cheap < 1257080591 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's way cooler to have a silent supercomputer on the floor than a silent lagger < 1257080629 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, go arm < 1257080633 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no. < 1257080635 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpu MHz : 600.000 < 1257080635 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cache size : 1024 KB < 1257080635 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :flags : fpu vme de pse tsc msr mce cx8 sep mtrr pge mca cmov pat clflush dts acpi mmx fxsr sse sse2 tm pbe bts est tm2 < 1257080651 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, more flags < 1257080657 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but not so much more. < 1257080668 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what cpu is it? < 1257080675 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :model name : Pentium III (Coppermine) < 1257080677 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the one above < 1257080700 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpu MHz : 0.740 < 1257080700 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cache size : 0 KB < 1257080700 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :flags : < 1257080705 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :INTEL 4004 FUCK YEAH < 1257080710 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An "Intel(R) Pentium(R) M processor 1400MHz"; it's just the speedstep-or-whatever-they-called-their-cpufreq-thing that's made it 600 MHz. < 1257080722 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah < 1257080733 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, my p3 doesn't support cpufreq changes < 1257080737 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I win < 1257080745 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, sure. But you don't have one < 1257080752 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, and those spaces are all messed up < 1257080759 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not aligned like what I pasted < 1257080760 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Atom I have has more flags than the Athlon X2. < 1257080761 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :flags : fpu vme de pse tsc msr pae mce cx8 apic sep mtrr pge mca cmov pat clflush dts acpi mmx fxsr sse sse2 ss ht tm pbe syscall lm constant_tsc arch_perfmon pebs bts rep_good pni dtes64 monitor ds_cpl tm2 ssse3 cx16 xtpr pdcm movbe lahf_lm < 1257080766 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just copied the spaces from your first line < 1257080788 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, um they are aligned in monspace. so it can't be same for all < 1257080790 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :12 GiB of RAM for $249.99? why, don't mind if I do < 1257080795 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: don't care < 1257080822 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, heh that's quite a mouthful < 1257080831 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :flags : fpu vme de pse tsc msr pae mce cx8 apic sep mtrr pge mca cmov pat pse36 clflush dts acpi mmx fxsr sse sse2 ss ht tm pbe syscall nx lm constant_tsc arch_perfmon pebs bts rep_good pni dtes64 monitor ds_cpl vmx smx est tm2 ssse3 cx16 xtpr pdcm sse4_1 lahf_lm tpr_shadow vnmi flexpriority < 1257080835 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is my laptop < 1257080837 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think they're just making those up nowadays. < 1257080841 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :model name : Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU P8400 @ 2.26GHz < 1257080864 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$291.98 for 12 GiB DDR3 ECC. < 1257080869 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, that atom lacks nx? < 1257080941 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :flags : fpu vme de pse tsc msr pae mce cx8 apic sep mtrr pge mca cmov pat pse36 clflush dts acpi mmx fxsr sse sse2 ss ht tm pbe syscall nx lm constant_tsc arch_perfmon pebs bts rep_good pni dtes64 monitor ds_cpl vmx smx est tm2 ssse3 cx16 xtpr pdcm sse4_1 xsave lahf_lm tpr_shadow vnmi flexpriority < 1257080968 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a work-workstation; we're almost flag-buddies, though there's some difference somewhere, judging from the length. < 1257080972 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, must be a xeon or i7? < 1257080995 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Quad CPU Q9400 @ 2.66GHz", and apparently it has xsave that yours doesn't. < 1257080996 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh, why can't i7 processors just support ecc? < 1257080996 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, xsave is new < 1257081011 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, said it same second < 1257081018 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what is xsave? < 1257081070 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: No idea. And according to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Intel_Atom_microprocessors the Atom 230 I have has "XD bit (an NX bit implementation)". < 1257081078 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION filters mobos by manufacturer=intel
< 1257081089 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, why? < 1257081096 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: damn foolin' mobo vendors ain't gonna fool me no' mo'! < 1257081105 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least i can trust intel to have a rock solid board < 1257081111 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also: intel graphics < 1257081118 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1257081124 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :admittedly i don't know if you can get intel graphics on the i7 boards < 1257081144 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :./include/asm/cpufeature.h:#define X86_FEATURE_XSAVE (4*32+26) /* XSAVE/XRSTOR/XSETBV/XGETBV */ < 1257081154 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is in /usr/src/linux-*/arch/x86 < 1257081198 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://lwn.net/Articles/281921/ < 1257081207 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dear amd: < 1257081214 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why haven't you realised a good processor since the last time I checked up on you < 1257081218 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you fail at life < 1257081294 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, this X2 workstation I have has an Athlon 64 X2 5600+ with a rated TDP of 89 W; the Atom box has a TDP of 4 W. That's quite a difference in performance/watt; I mean, this box is faster, but it's certainly not 89/4 times faster. < 1257081297 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd be cool if you could buy actual intel graphics cards < 1257081308 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, heh < 1257081327 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I don't think it scales linearly anyway. but even so < 1257081560 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The CSC guy's "future of supercomputing" presentation had one slide, where they had calculated some specs for a hypothetical one exaflops supercomputer using today's tech; it was something like half a million cores, using about 300 megawatts of power; that's 35 % of one of Finland's four nuclear reactors. Not very feasible. < 1257081688 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's funny how Wikipedia's "nuclear power plant" infobox has a "Status: Operating" line, and the "Operating" text is coloured green. It makes it look like it's hooked directly to the reactor sensors and displays real-time data. < 1257081762 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1257081769 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, btw that cmov related link. Have you actually read it all? < 1257081777 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ues < 1257081778 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It really all boils down to: there's simply no real reason to use cmov. < 1257081778 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not horrible either, so go ahead and use it if you want to, but don't < 1257081778 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :expect your code to really magically run any faster. < 1257081778 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Linus" < 1257081779 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :t < 1257081781 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :u < 1257081782 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y < 1257081783 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just pointing out that < 1257081791 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my y and u keyss are swapped < 1257081799 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yes but it demonstrates that having cmov versions of kernels is tupid < 1257081799 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stupid < 1257081813 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1257081855 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTF < 1257081858 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xedit has ispell < 1257081861 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and syntax highlighting < 1257081879 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AND AUTOINDENTATION < 1257081890 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and paren matching < 1257081901 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ctags support < 1257081910 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes that xedit < 1257081919 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, bloated much? < 1257081928 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know which xedit i'm talking about right? < 1257081943 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :protip: control+middle button -> edit mode -> C/C++ < 1257081949 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :type in a simple program and see it get autoindented and highlighted < 1257081952 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never even knew. < 1257082037 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I hardly remember xedit < 1257082038 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FirePath (a VLIW-ish -- two ops per instruction, so maybe not so V -- all-SIMD architecture used in central-office DSL stuff) has a funky SIMD-conditional-execution thing. < 1257082043 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: start it and you'll remeember < 1257082045 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*remember < 1257082092 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://everything2.com/title/FirePath has a bit of an example. < 1257082093 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, unable to find it. And ubuntu doesn't list a package containing it < 1257082101 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um... it comes with x < 1257082107 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :failing that, install xedit package? < 1257082113 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1257082118 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MRI machine! < 1257082138 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apt-cache show xedit < 1257082138 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :W: Unable to locate package xedit < 1257082139 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there < 1257082144 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use the dpkg search thing < 1257082148 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, apt-file < 1257082150 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1257082155 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Sophie Wilson was a guest at the Altparty event; first time I heard about FirePath. It's sadly so very unknown, except to people who do the DSL stuff.) < 1257082165 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, what is the case for the binary? < 1257082172 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xedit < 1257082175 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/usr/bin/xedit? < 1257082175 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1257082186 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ apt-file find /usr/bin/xedit < 1257082189 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ < 1257082203 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I'm afraid ubuntu doesn't have it (jaunty at least) < 1257082210 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"/usr/bin/xedit x11-apps [not avr32] " < 1257082213 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's for Debian. < 1257082242 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No files called "xedit" in Ubuntu-jaunty. :/ < 1257082248 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :queer < 1257082326 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :karmic's "x11-apps" has xedit, too; that's even queererer. < 1257082344 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x11-apps exists, contains no xedit? < 1257082346 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1257082363 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even have it installed < 1257082364 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://packages.ubuntu.com/jaunty/x11-apps → http://packages.ubuntu.com/karmic/x11-apps -- the only difference is the xedit line. < 1257082381 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, changelog entry about it? < 1257082389 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x11-apps (7.4+2) unstable; urgency=low < 1257082389 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : * Add xedit 1.1.2, closes: #499085, #505064. < 1257082404 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x11-apps (7.3+4) unstable; urgency=low < 1257082404 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : * Remove xedit from the package, it's unmaintained and broken < 1257082404 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (closes: #321434). < 1257082404 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : * Remove xedit's conffiles on upgrade. < 1257082414 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, huh < 1257082437 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can probably check out those bug report numbers for more details. < 1257082438 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is too lazy to check those bugs out
< 1257082448 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh you were half a second faster < 1257082488 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 180 seconds < 1257082513 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, xedit is actually pretty good for editing C! < 1257082540 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the syntax highlighting is very complete, the colours pleasing, the automatic indentation perfect... < 1257082546 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the keybindings good < 1257082571 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ubuntu bug #1: "Microsoft has a majority market share". Declined for Edgy, Feisty, Gutsy, Hardy, Intrepid, Karmic; Nominated for Lucid. Sure. (Though I guess it's been that way all the time.) < 1257082603 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, old < 1257082608 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I always feel stupid doing < 1257082610 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exit(...); < 1257082612 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :break; < 1257082612 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you only just discovered it? < 1257082622 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, why would you do that < 1257082625 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: presumably he was commenting on the nomination < 1257082627 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, switch () < 1257082641 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, yes but why the break after it. It isn't required afaik < 1257082653 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can have fall through cases after all < 1257082677 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :c warnings etc. < 1257082679 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, so yeah you should feel stupid < 1257082694 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think inconsistency is worse. < 1257082705 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, hm gcc at least should be able to figure out exit() never returns, since it has __attribute__((noreturn)) iirc < 1257082963 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :things i don't like: the part where xedit just crashed onm me < 1257083011 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1257083018 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, thats a feature < 1257083048 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but a bug that it is active when INTERCAL syntax highlighting isn't used) < 1257083223 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1257083328 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK < 1257083331 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it happened again < 1257083473 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, install debugging symbols. Run under gdb < 1257083488 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh < 1257083494 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :prolly apple's x11 server < 1257083501 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1257083933 0 :Telesforo!n=Telesfor@104.Red-79-154-39.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1257084022 0 :Telesforo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1257084054 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Message sending failed. Check E-Mail settings." Yay, what a colossally helpful error message. < 1257084083 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better than "[c]ontact your system administrator." < 1257084180 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Got it from the phone when trying to send outgoing email. I guess it's possible the operator has a different outgoing-SMTP server for us mobile users, it's just that the only one I can find from the support pages is the one on their generic "email settings" page. < 1257084442 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, there's some sort of blog comment saying that it's "smtp.mobiili.net" for that. Great. < 1257084500 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not that it works any better with that. < 1257084572 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, this is just ridiculous < 1257084575 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xedit has a lisp evaluator < 1257084750 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, *this* is ridiculous: To send email, I have to go to mailbox settings and toggle the "Security" setting to "Off", because otherwise it tries to use SMTP-over-SSL, which is not supported by the operator's outgoing SMTP server. To read email, I have to go back to the settings and toggle "Security" to "On", because that's the only way to make it use IMAP-oer-SSL, which is required by the IMAP server. < 1257084792 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, I guess the Lisp evaluator is pretty ridiculous too. Still. < 1257085254 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's funny; the 25 second sound clip is 2208 bytes. Format's 8 kHz narrowband AMR; since even the lowest codec in that family is 4.75 kbit/s, and that file has about 700 bits/s, I'm forced to conclude that it's just using the "store some statistics of the background noise and not the signal itself" mode for the whole file. < 1257085274 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe the phone wasn't the best possible device for recording the suspicious-sounding power supply noise after all. < 1257085925 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=behold@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1257086245 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Better than "[c]ontact your system administrator." <-- why the [] around c? < 1257086258 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C < 1257086279 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, you mean [cC]? < 1257086292 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :english quotation style fail. < 1257086300 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh not a regex < 1257086366 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what power supply? < 1257086414 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, store statistics of signal noise? is there really a sound format with that? < 1257086422 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1257086432 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes. < 1257086449 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AMR-NB -- it's called Comfort Noise Generation (CNG) there. < 1257086484 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think Speex has it too. < 1257086508 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least the VAD and DTX parts; maybe not the noise generation. < 1257086543 0 :migomipo!i=54d906d7@gateway/web/freenode/x-cfniofzefcgunwgg JOIN :#esoteric < 1257086567 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Discontinuous transmission is an addition to VAD/VBR operation, that allows to stop transmitting completely when the background noise is stationary. In a file, 5 bits are used for each missing frame (corresponding to 250 bit/s)." I guess Speex doesn't store noise statistics, at that. Well, AMR does, anyway. < 1257086646 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Indicates that it was originally capitalized but I changed it to lower case. < 1257086694 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, ah < 1257088292 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1257088561 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think im going to go to a cafe and chill for the whole day < 1257088574 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who thinks i should do this? < 1257088585 0 :fax!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you < 1257088607 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :besides me! < 1257088806 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION doesn't care
< 1257088867 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1257088869 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok bye < 1257089103 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1257089641 0 :atrapado!n=adk@95.169.238.163 JOIN :#esoteric < 1257089825 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1257090466 0 :atrapado!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1257094423 0 :FireFly!n=FireFly@1-1-3-36a.tul.sth.bostream.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1257094815 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1257094862 0 :Asztal!n=asztal@host86-159-107-94.range86-159.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1257095267 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=behold@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1257095511 0 :coppro!n=coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1257098622 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Later" < 1257098799 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1257099189 0 :fax!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1257099825 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=behold@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1257100235 0 :Jaykul[AFK]!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Jaykul < 1257102985 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1257103358 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: iwc :D < 1257103368 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, indeed < 1257103375 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, but you weren't here hours ago when I read it < 1257103384 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, what the hell was it about now again? < 1257103398 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kyros and bad choices < 1257103404 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aaah yes < 1257103407 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :two clearly linked concepts < 1257103416 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well... that's given < 1257103743 0 :Oranjer!n=Owner@adsl-243-220-33.cae.bellsouth.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1257104583 0 :FireFly!n=FireFly@1-1-3-36a.tul.sth.bostream.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1257104616 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from syn. < 1257104619 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from syn. < 1257104619 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from syn. < 1257104622 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from syn. < 1257104624 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from syn. < 1257104624 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from syn. < 1257104628 0 :migomipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from syn. < 1257104628 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from syn. < 1257104630 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from syn. < 1257104639 0 :adam_d!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from syn. < 1257104639 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from syn. < 1257104639 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from syn. < 1257104641 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from syn. < 1257104641 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from syn. < 1257104641 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from syn. < 1257104641 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from syn. < 1257104643 0 :comex_!i=comex@c-98-210-192-54.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1257104648 0 :FireFly!n=FireFly@82.182.180.137 JOIN :#esoteric < 1257104654 0 :AnMaster!n=AnMaster@90.130.2.147 JOIN :#esoteric < 1257104657 0 :Deewiant!n=deewiant@130.233.228.12 JOIN :#esoteric < 1257104665 0 :comex_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from syn. < 1257104665 0 :fizzie`!i=fis@83.150.124.63 JOIN :#esoteric < 1257104666 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from syn. < 1257104666 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from syn. < 1257104669 0 :fizzie`!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from syn. < 1257104670 0 :Oranjer!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :netsplit?!? < 1257104673 0 :ais523!n=ais523@92.236.187.64 JOIN :#esoteric < 1257104675 0 :Slereah!n=butt@92.135.29.119 JOIN :#esoteric < 1257104682 0 :FireyFly!n=FireFly@1-1-3-36a.tul.sth.bostream.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1257104689 0 :cal153!n=cal@69.181.46.213 JOIN :#esoteric < 1257104698 0 :fizzie!i=fis@iris.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1257104701 0 :Asztal!n=asztal@host86-159-107-94.range86-159.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1257104702 0 :adam_d!n=Adam@AAnnecy-751-1-2-50.w90-52.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1257104705 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :##overflow is filling up massively fast < 1257104709 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not a netsplit < 1257104719 0 :Oranjer!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1257104722 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the server went mad and decided to K-line /everyone/ < 1257104727 0 :Oranjer!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::O < 1257104729 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=behold@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1257104730 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-syn- Your reported IP [0.0.0.15] is banned: christel; Your access to freenode has been terminated. klines@freenode.net with questions. (2009/02/19 18.45) < 1257104731 0 :EgoBot!n=EgoBot@codu.xen.prgmr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1257104736 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that was pretty strange. < 1257104743 0 :coppro!n=coppro@d75-159-19-254.abhsia.telus.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1257104750 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, I don't think my IP is 0.0.0.15. < 1257104830 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, my IP was reported as 0.0.0.10 < 1257104842 0 :dbc!n=daniel@130-94-161-238-dsl.hevanet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1257104849 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"-Md- [GlobalNotice] sorry for the recent mass-kill issue! we are investigating what happened exactly" Heh. "Sorry that we killed you. Our bad." < 1257104849 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not surprised that that IP is banned < 1257104850 0 :AnMaster!n=AnMaster@cl-394.sto-01.se.sixxs.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1257104862 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I am surprised that it misdetected the IP that badly < 1257104929 0 :comex!i=comex@c-98-210-192-54.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1257105260 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1257105264 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the < 1257105266 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fucking < 1257105268 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :crazy < 1257105268 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was also 0.0.0.15 < 1257105270 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hell < 1257105273 0 :Oranjer!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1257105276 0 :Oranjer!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what happened < 1257105280 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: freenode went mad and k-lined /everyone/ < 1257105282 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :including services < 1257105284 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-syn- Your reported IP [0.0.0.10] is banned: christel; Your access to freenode has been terminated. klines@freenode.net with questions. (2009/02/19 18.45) < 1257105285 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[20:46:50] [>> $*] [GlobalNotice] sorry for the recent mass-kill issue! we are investigating what happened exactly < 1257105288 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you didn't notice < 1257105293 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :reconnected on ipv6 < 1257105309 0 :Oranjer!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay me! I love being immune to horrible, horrible bad luck < 1257105326 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireyFly, .10 not .15 < 1257105334 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[20:45:52] Incidentally, I don't think my IP is 0.0.0.15. < 1257105334 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[20:47:12] oh, my IP was reported as 0.0.0.10 < 1257105336 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was .10 too < 1257105339 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And yes, my was reported as .15 < 1257105341 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireyFly, I wasn't connected at that point I think < 1257105350 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's three .10s, two .15s. < 1257105355 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least I never got the message < 1257105364 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BeholdMyGlory was .190 < 1257105371 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oranjer, on ipv6? < 1257105395 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I heard some on another network (chatspike) that mentioned being unaffected. They all used ipv6 < 1257105409 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1257105412 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh 43 seconds lag < 1257105413 0 :puzzlet!n=puzzlet@147.46.241.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1257105415 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hate this < 1257105450 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION was never k-lined, he thinks.
< 1257105455 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION feels special
< 1257105497 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see < 1257105499 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still joining channels it seems < 1257105563 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1257105589 0 :Oranjer!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1257105620 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm unable to join #freenode < 1257105627 0 :Oranjer!n=Owner@adsl-243-220-33.cae.bellsouth.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1257105639 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :get redirected to ##overflow < 1257105647 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was 0.0.13.238 < 1257105653 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am unable to _list_ #freenode < 1257105739 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think i am using ipv6 to connect to freenode < 1257105739 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, hm? < 1257105741 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does that mean < 1257105747 0 :Oranjer!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1257105752 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:00 LIST Server load is temporarily too heavy. Please wait a while and try again. < 1257105771 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Channel #freenode modes: +tncPLfJ < 1257105776 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: /list command? < 1257105777 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can see < 1257105781 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1257105787 0 :Oranjer!n=Owner@adsl-243-220-33.cae.bellsouth.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1257105795 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with /mode < 1257105808 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Ooh, your number is very big. < 1257105809 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :« quit » {AnMaster} {n=AnMaster@90.130.2.147} Nick collision from syn. < 1257105910 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, I don't think you remember what that does. And I'm too lazy to explain < 1257105912 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus it won't work on freenode anyway < 1257105924 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MizardX, I'm well aware < 1257105985 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what doesn't work on #freenode? i've used /list many times < 1257105993 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: And not 0.0.0 either! < 1257106051 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1257106058 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, you mean /names or /who < 1257106060 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not /list < 1257106065 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/list lists channels < 1257106080 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: i _was_ listing a channel. sheesh. < 1257106085 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, um < 1257106092 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, *list channel names* < 1257106096 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's what i use to see a channel topic < 1257106111 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and number of users < 1257106111 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, can you list #gentoo or something like it? < 1257106130 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm #freenode is +m now < 1257106138 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:08 #gentoo 756 Gentoo Linux support | Can't speak? /join #gentoo-ops | Paste over 4 lines? http://dpaste.com | KDE4? xrl.us/otdxr + #gentoo-kde | e2fsprogs block fix: xrl.us/bea7ut | X Server 1.5? Bust KB/Mouse? xrl.us/bem6c4 1.6? http://xrl.us/bfqrjt | poppler blocks? xrl.us/bephtt | Gentoo 10.0 LiveDVD: xrl.us/gentoo10years | Profiles: < 1257106144 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 2008.0->10.0 | irefox/ nvidia-drivers/ glibc/ nptl downgrade? sync and retry < 1257106188 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm ok < 1257106194 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<+RichiH> -- PLEASE READ: we had a massive bug in one of our internal service bots which caused a massive, network-wide kill. that christel was mentioned is pure chance so please do not message her about it. we are working on fixing the problem. the bot has been disabled, for now -- < 1257106205 0 :puzzlet_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1257106256 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: i don't think i have tried to use /list without a channel argument, if that's what you mean. i'm not _that_ stupid :D < 1257106263 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, hah < 1257106726 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :FireFly < 1257106968 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1257108825 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION too wasn't disconnected
< 1257108847 0 :Oranjer!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::O < 1257109157 0 :augur!n=augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr2.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1257109200 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I figured out who was disconnected (which also explains why I wasn't). < 1257109240 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari, oh? < 1257109281 0 :Oranjer!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1257109301 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pretty much anybody whose local part of ident starts with 0-9, a-f or A-F. Mine starts with 'u' (the real account name would start with 'I'). < 1257109312 0 :Oranjer!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::O < 1257109376 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm maybe it did things alphabetically and was stopped halfway through < 1257109403 0 :Oranjer!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::O < 1257109409 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION goes to see what that http://announce.freenode.net link was about
< 1257109409 0 :Oranjer!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder who stopped it! < 1257109477 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh it's hexadecimals < 1257109486 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1257109492 0 :Oranjer!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::O < 1257109719 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some apparently think that it is not possible to have Unix login names that start with capital letter. Not true. < 1257109747 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari, it is? < 1257109810 0 :Rugxulo!n=user@adsl-065-013-115-246.sip.mob.bellsouth.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1257109892 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :login[21013]: FAILED LOGIN (2) on '/dev/tty4' FOR 'UNKNOWN', Authentication failure login[21013]: pam_unix(login:session): session opened for user Ilari by LOGIN(uid=0) < 1257109928 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The first is what one gets for trying to log in as user 'ilari'. < 1257109989 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari, eh, well it is case sensitive < 1257109992 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what did you expect < 1257109995 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's certainly possible. It just makes logging in a pain on certain old terminals. < 1257109996 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1257110002 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which are still supported by termcap) < 1257110076 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The reason why it wasn't possible in some systems is compatiblity feature of terminal emulation. But Linux TTY emulator doesn't have that feature (because it doesn't need it). < 1257110196 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.amazon.com/Essential-Vivaldi-Masterpieces-Amazon-Exclusive/dp/B002POQ2UQ . Go. Buy. < 1257110278 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1257110380 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, cheap, good point < 1257110496 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haha... What would Vivaldi think if he saw that? < 1257110604 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, so the IP is also about hexadecimals; so 'ais523' => 0xa => 10 => 0.0.0.10; 'fis' => 0xf => 15 => 0.0.0.15; 'deewiant' => 0xdee => 3566 => 0.0.13.238. < 1257110607 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Funky buggery. < 1257110635 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MizardX: Well, after taking a few years to explain the very most basics of all the technology employed, the value of a dollar, and the major changes in economic conditions from when he was alive 'til now, I'm thinkin' not much. < 1257110639 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Heh, well spotted. < 1257110658 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1257110679 0 :adam_d!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1257110684 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he was (apparently) a priest, so I doubt he cared about money < 1257110685 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, it was in the announcement. < 1257110690 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :died poor, too < 1257111092 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1257111102 0 :Rugxulo!n=user@adsl-065-013-115-246.sip.mob.bellsouth.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1257111268 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :netsplit? :-P < 1257111275 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster> unless things got a lot more bloated since 2007 < 1257111277 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes they have < 1257111379 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: I read the announcement only after spotting that fact; though admittedly I spotted it only after hexadecimals were mentioned. < 1257111560 0 :adam_d!n=Adam@AAnnecy-751-1-2-50.w90-52.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1257111570 0 :Oranjer!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::O < 1257111577 0 :Oranjer!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1257111875 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :conclusion from this symbol: ⇔ dejavu has sucky hinting outside the more common symbols. < 1257111881 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dejavu sans mono that is < 1257111889 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a blur here < 1257111904 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somewhat better on the higher DPI screen of my laptop. But not much < 1257111935 0 :madbrain!n=madbrain@modemcable175.136-81-70.mc.videotron.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1257111941 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yeah, that's pretty awful. < 1257111943 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyone interested in a system design compo? < 1257111949 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://s.engramstudio.com/src/sdc.txt <- tentative rules < 1257111954 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, you see what it is supposed to be? < 1257111960 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when copying it I assume < 1257111965 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yeah. < 1257111967 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is the <=> thing < 1257111973 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Liberation mono is a bit better. < 1257111991 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, sans-serif and monospaced? as many symbols? < 1257112003 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could make a version of the compo with faster fast page ram or EDO or SDRAM but that's more complicated and can wait < 1257112006 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION may need to switch fonts -- that is rather annoying.
< 1257112009 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, yes and yes. But by "a bit" I really meant "a bit", not "a lot". < 1257112021 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, to or from dejavu? < 1257112033 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, this is at 9 pt btw < 1257112040 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that I'm using it < 1257112056 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: From Deja Vu Sans Mono. < 1257112065 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, you could make a patch or something < 1257112068 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The other Deja Vu fonts seem to have nice hinting. < 1257112068 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the hinting < 1257112077 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, but you need mono space < 1257112078 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1257112081 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on irc < 1257112094 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just do /msg chanserv help (or /cs help on a properly set up client) < 1257112095 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not all that nice when it comes to things like <=> or => or ->... < 1257112109 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I use a terminal for most things. < 1257112113 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, → looks good here < 1257112121 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-> and => are hard to distinguish. < 1257112122 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well. < 1257112125 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could be better < 1257112128 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, yeah < 1257112130 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the combination, not the two-character sequence) < 1257112136 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well of course < 1257112172 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Liberation mono? seems to be missing it *goes font hunting* < 1257112189 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION emerges
< 1257112389 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... from the depths of the netherworld! < 1257112419 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, hah. No that is the gentoo command to install a package < 1257112496 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb restarting client to make it see the new fonts... < 1257112527 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why couldn't it see the new ones on the fly < 1257112539 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION just reconnected to the bouncer
< 1257112558 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh < 1257112573 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, that liberation is smaller at 9 pt < 1257112578 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ugly < 1257112583 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is not sans serif < 1257112585 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is serfi < 1257112588 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :serif* < 1257112602 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Liberation mono is sans serif. < 1257112613 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hrm. Actually, it seems to be inconsistent-serif :P < 1257112620 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, exactly < 1257112626 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was unusable < 1257112648 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You fontophiles are idiots. < 1257112656 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster, yes I (barely) recognized that ... but at first it looked strange ;-) < 1257112667 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can understand the complaint about <=>, but this is just nonsense. < 1257112668 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : AnMaster, yes I (barely) recognized that ... but at first it looked strange ;-) <-- what? < 1257112679 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION doesn't have scrollback from before disconnecting
< 1257112699 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Rugxulo, hah. No that is the gentoo command to install a package < 1257112711 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, I'm no fontofile. I prefer Ariel over Helvetia because the font spacing is proper in konqueror with it < 1257112717 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, ah that < 1257112736 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, I'm the person who is interested in proper colour handling < 1257112741 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with 16 bits per channel < 1257112742 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and such < 1257112758 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Colorphiles. < 1257112760 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : everything is slow on a p3 < 1257112771 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some P4s are allegedly slower than some P3s !! < 1257112791 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, yes < 1257112832 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you still run a P3 box? < 1257112853 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good :-) < 1257112873 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : some P4s are allegedly slower than some P3s !! ; It is true of all lines of Intels (at least since P1pro) that there are early models of the newer one that is slower than the latest models of the previous one. < 1257112884 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, I have one < 1257112893 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :996 MHz < 1257112904 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : six cores? next year? < 1257112908 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I swear it is faster than the 2 GHz P4 I used to have < 1257112909 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought that was later this year? (guess not) < 1257112920 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :faster at what, Gentoo or something else? < 1257112944 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: That's just because the P4 is always running so hot that it has to run slow to avoid melting :P < 1257112959 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seriously, that's probably true < 1257112975 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, compiling, running stuff, generic. And the p4 ran gentoo, but the p3 runs arch < 1257112976 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has a P4, hasn't used it too much lately except when router got scrambled temporarily
< 1257112983 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION should get a P4 for the sake of warming his coffee
< 1257112994 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compiling depends on the GCC used, etc. < 1257113001 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though, knowing P4s, that should more be "making his coffee"... < 1257113007 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, the p4 broke in early 2006 iirc < 1257113009 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or around there < 1257113021 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what exactly broke on it? just stopped working? < 1257113022 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the p3 I got my hands on in mid 2007 < 1257113049 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only really "bad" part about a P3 is how heavily ignored SSE1 is by programmers < 1257113058 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, it refused to boot. Removing CPU showed some black parts on it < 1257113061 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in < 1257113062 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :charred < 1257113066 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was it overclocked? < 1257113071 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, it wasn't < 1257113094 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :P4 broke even classic software optimizations, so no wonder it was slow < 1257113112 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, and heatsink and such was cleaned regularly. < 1257113118 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with compressed air < 1257113130 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every 2-3 months or so < 1257113143 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ehird, I estimate it is around 17 C indoors atm < 1257113152 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could maybe use another one to kill two birds with one stone ;-) < 1257113160 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, hah. < 1257113167 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, I care about environment a bit < 1257113178 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I try to go by bus instead of car and so on < 1257113208 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(no train around here that could do the job. well there are trains, but they don't go on useful times) < 1257113210 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know I know, P4 isn't optimal in any form < 1257113446 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your laptop already has VMX? < 1257113459 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops, sorry, brain lapse, thought it said AVX < 1257113494 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2.26 Ghz, does it get good battery life? < 1257113569 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : it'd be cool if you could buy actual intel graphics cards < 1257113574 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not if you want to use latest Ubuntu :-P < 1257113604 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oops, sorry, brain lapse, thought it said AVX < 1257113605 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1257113610 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is an intel core 2 duo < 1257113625 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, as for battery life. around 3 hours with wlan off < 1257113635 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2.5 with wlan on at uni < 1257113639 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2.75 with wlan on at home < 1257113657 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :due to the storm of broadcasts from misconfigured laptops at university < 1257113664 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know. mdns, upnp and so on < 1257113677 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zeroconf and what not < 1257113684 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : um... it comes with x < 1257113691 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then that's not the Xedit I was thinking of < 1257113701 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, oh you were talking about the flags I posted? < 1257113706 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some hours ago < 1257113720 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably ... yes, sorry, reading logs in lieu or real conversation ;-) < 1257113732 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3 hours w/ what size battery? 12 cell??? < 1257113742 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, 6 cell iirc < 1257113750 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's still better than mine < 1257113760 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, it is more like 2 hours and 55 minutes though < 1257113765 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I don't dare run it to 0 < 1257113783 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I stop at 5-10% < 1257113802 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AMD64x2 1.7 Ghz w/ 6 cell only gets 2 hours MAX on power saver!! (e.g. both cores halved) < 1257113819 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, AMD CPUs use more power < 1257113820 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :other than that they are better IMO < 1257113843 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I knew AMD used more power, but still ... pretty crappy to not even be able to watch a 2 hour DVD, barely < 1257113851 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it still gets noticeably warm, bah < 1257113864 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, oh I never tried watching dvd on it < 1257113867 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it does at least match (or surpass) my P4 in performace < 1257113878 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't either, just saying, kinda inconvenient < 1257113882 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, I plan to replace the dvd drive in the ultrabay with an extra battery < 1257113899 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can get a 12-cell, probably helps more than replacing the DVD drive < 1257113907 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, no place in backpack for that < 1257113913 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also probably my fault for using Vista (even 7 claims better battery life) < 1257113926 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, I use linux. Of course. < 1257113934 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though I remember antiX Mepis not being too great either (shut off without warning) < 1257113935 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't use anything lacking a proper shell < 1257113948 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"antiX Mepis"? < 1257113950 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is that < 1257113958 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some "lightweight" Mepis derivative < 1257113976 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've tried a billion liveCDs, just never installed any < 1257113982 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and not really *nix savvy < 1257113996 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, what is mepis? < 1257114000 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linux < 1257114000 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds familiar < 1257114006 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never tried mepis < 1257114010 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION uses ubuntu on laptop
< 1257114016 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because things just work. Mostly < 1257114019 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://antix.mepis.org/index.php/Main_Page < 1257114026 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haven't tried it lately, had a few issues I didn't like < 1257114037 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but at least it had DOSBox by default, which I liked < 1257114054 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, where would I find software to run in it < 1257114055 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and < 1257114064 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be one or two clicks away in most distros < 1257114067 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in DOSBox or Mepis? < 1257114073 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in dosbox < 1257114084 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a (lame) DOS-related website < 1257114097 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, never saw the point of DOS < 1257114104 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :horrible command interpreter < 1257114115 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then use 4DOS or DJGPP Bash ;-) < 1257114124 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, and no memory protection < 1257114128 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no multi tasking < 1257114142 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :memory protection in DJGPP (and other DPMI stuff), etc. < 1257114145 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :djgpp + libraries helps with a couple of these < 1257114150 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hell even Apple's System 7 had multi tasking. (no memory protection though) < 1257114157 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :multitasking not free but exists (Win 3+, Desqview, DR-DOS 7) < 1257114158 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, no multi tasking < 1257114178 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, yeah. Windows indeed. then go NT and drop DOS completely < 1257114179 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use DOSEMU or DOSBox with a "real" OS in the background for multitasking < 1257114188 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then run dos from win9x < 1257114197 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one of these days I wish I would know enough to make my own DOS-oriented distro (based on uber-lean Linux, most likely) < 1257114198 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I fail to see the point of windows OR dos < 1257114200 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seriously < 1257114218 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"run DOS from Win9x" ... but it ain't free and limits you in some ways < 1257114222 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is no universal solution < 1257114231 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I grew up on macs. Used windows for a short while (including XP). But then went completely Linu < 1257114232 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :linux* < 1257114235 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :various distros < 1257114238 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NT didn't drop DOS completely, just much weaker support < 1257114245 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :red hat 5.0 was the first linux distro I tried < 1257114248 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was pretty bad < 1257114253 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: DOS is mostly useful by merit of being a very low-level OS that's at least vaguely usable. < 1257114257 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still compared to windows back then it was awesome < 1257114263 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DOS has "no point" if you're not used to it < 1257114269 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, very very vaguely < 1257114276 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just like C++ or Java have no point if you don't grok them < 1257114286 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, I grok more C++ than I'd want to < 1257114291 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for my own sanity I mean < 1257114295 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION shudders at templates
< 1257114299 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have come to grok C++ template programming. < 1257114302 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION shudders
< 1257114312 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno, I like DOS stuff but it's rare to find some use where you couldn't do it in win32 instead < 1257114324 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain: Loadlin? < 1257114334 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is that? < 1257114337 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's because Win32 has had most everything from DOS ported to it (and Linux also), plus all new stuff only targets the main three (OS X, Win32, Linux) < 1257114341 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A Linux bootloader. < 1257114350 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And a DOS executable. < 1257114381 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shudder < 1257114388 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just use grub 1 or lilo or something < 1257114394 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(no, don't use grub 2) < 1257114394 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's nowhere near as crazy a hack as you'd think, too. < 1257114404 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably more useful when UMSDOS worked (2.4 kernels) < 1257114417 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, what was the point of UMDOS < 1257114423 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION forgot what UMDOS even was
< 1257114427 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or UMSDOS < 1257114428 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no need to repartition just to try Linux < 1257114429 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Dual-boot Linux/Windows setups. < 1257114429 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or whatever < 1257114436 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just dump some files atop your pre-existing FAT and voila < 1257114438 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Very useful before XP. < 1257114441 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um like a disk image file? < 1257114446 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I see < 1257114448 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1257114462 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, the Linux filesystem was FAT. < 1257114466 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mkdir linux ; cd linux ; unzip old_linux.zip ; linux.bat (runs) < 1257114494 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it used FAT as host file system, no ext2 required < 1257114497 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(... with extra metadata) < 1257114510 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---linux.--- (or similar, I forget) < 1257114519 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this was before QEMU, BOCHS, etc. became popular < 1257114527 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even 2.4 had ext3 iirc? < 1257114535 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well not early ones < 1257114537 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but later on < 1257114563 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION prefers virtualbox over those
< 1257114566 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, but you can't run DOS or Windows on ext3, and plus usually those took up the whole drive by default < 1257114582 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like VirtualBox too, it runs very well (when it works, which is most of the time, thankfully) < 1257114593 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, resize partitions? I'm pretty sure there was some tool for it < 1257114596 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even back then < 1257114605 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming you actually wanted to resize < 1257114608 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, except for plan9 < 1257114614 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you need qemu < 1257114624 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this was probably also before liveCDs became popular < 1257114659 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no I really fails to see the point of DOS or windows. DOS very much so < 1257114665 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :completely pointless nowdays < 1257114690 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kind of like esoteric programming < 1257114698 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UMSDOS predates emulation at sane speed. < 1257114715 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DOS is pointless if you don't know / like it < 1257114728 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DOS had a point when window's gfx stuff was too slow < 1257114750 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, not quite. If /// was TC or not was pretty interesting < 1257114752 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example < 1257114776 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, I said "nowdays" < 1257114777 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But quite pointless. < 1257114798 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C64 I can understand people being nostalgic about < 1257114802 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like DOS mostly for my familiarity with it and its small size < 1257114804 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but DOS‽‽‽‽ < 1257114812 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why C64 but not DOS? < 1257114823 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, the c64 did have a flavor yeah < 1257114823 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, to begin with: SID chipset < 1257114824 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DOS has lots of good games, too < 1257114836 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, not what I'm talking about < 1257114837 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think SID is overrated though < 1257114849 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Why SID but not PC speaker? < 1257114858 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, because SID actually sounded good? < 1257114859 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or adlib, or Roland MT-32, or whatever < 1257114867 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus I can beep the pc speaker inside linux < 1257114869 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PC speaker sounded good too < 1257114869 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I want too < 1257114870 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :easily < 1257114878 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And you can emulate a SID easily < 1257114882 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, yes < 1257114892 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is why I don't have a c64. I use an emulator < 1257114896 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, on PC most games that sounded good had soundtracks mixed in real time < 1257114910 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, probably. What about it? < 1257114918 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and what was adlib? < 1257114929 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or Roland MT-32? (sounds familiar, unlike adlib) < 1257114935 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :adlib is actually complex and interesting hardware < 1257114949 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :roland mt-32 sounded a lot better but nobody had that < 1257114953 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :way too expensive < 1257114971 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, oh? how do they compare to stuff like my Soundblaster Live! 5.1? < 1257114973 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus most of the sounds are in ROM and you can't change them < 1257114974 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Love it's sound < 1257115000 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The SB live is, like, a DSP < 1257115014 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you give it something like 512 instructions to process sound < 1257115014 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, indeed. And it has good bass tones < 1257115025 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even the adlib has good bass < 1257115040 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.adlibtracker.net/ < 1257115042 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, actually I just use it for it's hardware midi and good bass compared to on board sound < 1257115051 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(somebody in here claimed to write some stuff with that, madbrain???) < 1257115056 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is using a 71 MB soundfont
< 1257115061 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ruxglo: yeah < 1257115079 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and (surprise!) AT2 needs DOS ;-) < 1257115089 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ruxglo: http://8bitcollective.com/music/mad/Oskari+goes+to+Soundblasterland/ < 1257115111 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, FM synth? < 1257115114 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, AdT2 is hard to run out of dos < 1257115118 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anmaster: yeah < 1257115120 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is that < 1257115125 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm used to high quality samples < 1257115137 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I care about that sort of stuff < 1257115147 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically the adlib combines 2 waveforms to make a more complicated one < 1257115172 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, oh algorithmic synth is inferior to samples < 1257115176 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if that is what you mean < 1257115190 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :adlib is an algorithmic synth yes < 1257115211 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mt-32 is also partially algorithmic, and partially (very small) samples < 1257115222 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, I have a roland electric piano next to me. Should tell you I expect some decent sound :P < 1257115230 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when playing < 1257115231 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mt-32 has reverb though < 1257115287 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, was that one of your songs? < 1257115292 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1257115294 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, you can emulate it in software on modern hardware < 1257115297 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :easily < 1257115299 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yaeh < 1257115299 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds good ;-) < 1257115310 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sound hardware is basically dead < 1257115311 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is not exactly true of my sb live yet < 1257115336 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anmaster: you could probably rip the samples out of it and reverse engineer its reverb :D < 1257115342 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, depends. my sb live does manage better low bass (25 Hz and below) than any on board stuff < 1257115351 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that I have seen < 1257115353 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes < 1257115360 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have professional headphones. < 1257115366 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can hear those tones < 1257115380 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the on board via just cuts off below 50 Hz < 1257115396 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :might be due to stupid DAC design on onboard < 1257115406 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever the laptop has cuts off below 45 Hz. But below 70 Hz it is very weak < 1257115414 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it is intel on board < 1257115423 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha yeah they do that on laptops sometimes < 1257115430 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they put a highpass filter < 1257115434 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dumbest idea ever < 1257115438 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch < 1257115442 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1257115446 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no idea < 1257115449 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, and the via stuff is on desktop < 1257115450 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :might be battery related < 1257115477 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you could get unfiltered sound with some soldiering < 1257115489 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, it's less than half a year. No way < 1257115503 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, btw my headphones are http://www.beyerdynamic.de/en/broadcast-studio-video-production/products/headphonesheadsets/headphones.html?tx_sbproductdatabase_pi1%5BshowUid%5D%5BshowUID%5D=41&tx_sbproductdatabase_pi1%5BshowUid%5D%5BbackPID%5D=93&cHash=0fd1ee1ab1 < 1257115531 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice < 1257115560 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't have a budget for that sort of expensive stuff yeah < 1257115573 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :luckily classical music doesn't suffer quite as much from that cut off as other music < 1257115578 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still it suffers < 1257115603 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I love classical music. And also other art music from other periods. Like the romantic period < 1257115630 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what you could do is use the SBlive then < 1257115641 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, yep. But not when traveling with my laptop < 1257115649 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course those headphones are pretty bulky < 1257115667 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, only complaint I have is listed in that link: < 1257115669 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Average pressure on ear acc. to IEC 60268-7 4.5 N" < 1257115686 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think this is mechanical pressure < 1257115690 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from the headphones < 1257115716 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slightly too much to be completely comfortable for long time wear < 1257115900 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah many DOS games use software synthesis instead < 1257115951 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which depends on the quality of the samples but is usually good < 1257115956 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, most of the time I prefer real recorded music. High quality stuff. CDs < 1257115969 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or CDs ripped to lossless < 1257116118 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster, how much RAM does your laptop have? < 1257116145 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno about CD audio... it sounds good but it tends to be a tad more disconnected from the game action < 1257116157 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, 4 GB. Why? < 1257116173 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, that's what I thought I remembered < 1257116174 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was 2 GB initially < 1257116180 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :added another 2 < 1257116192 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, oh I didn't mean for game < 1257116204 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, I meant for sitting back and enjoying a symphony < 1257116246 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what you use those 4 GB for ;-) < 1257116258 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, hm? < 1257116270 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well. why 2 when I can use 4? < 1257116291 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eats more battery power < 1257116313 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, not much. Was like a 5 minute difference < 1257116347 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, and I usually need no more than 2 hours in one run < 1257116370 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wishes all laptops lasted 12 hours ...
< 1257116404 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same < 1257116434 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :P.S. speaking of music for DOS, http://www.oldskool.org/pc/MONOTONE < 1257116435 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;-) < 1257116462 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, what is a tracker exactly? < 1257116483 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also on my laptop if I turn off the speakers, the pcspeaker doesn't beep < 1257116484 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anmaster: type of music program that originated on the amiga < 1257116491 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION guess it is emulated in the BIOS or such
< 1257116509 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anmaster: the amiga had 4 sample playing channels so its music software was based around that < 1257116529 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, couldn't play any wave tone? < 1257116532 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just samples? < 1257116533 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tracker is usually used to describe .MOD editors, etc. < 1257116544 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wave and samples are the same thing < 1257116546 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, hah. haven't seen a *.mod in ages < 1257116560 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, this isn't .MOD either, it's a custom format ;-) < 1257116561 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbrain, samples to me means samples like in a soundfont < 1257116564 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for midi < 1257116575 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :About half of the music I listen to is *.{mod,s3m,it,xm} < 1257116589 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, seen all of those except it < 1257116594 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is the difference between them < 1257116596 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.it = Impulse Tracker < 1257116598 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, for the past two years or so it's been about all of the music I listen to < 1257116624 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Different trackers' formats. < 1257116641 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.mod is oldest (with a few extensions), .s3m is from Scream Tracker 3 (circa 1994), .xm is from Fast Tracker (mid 90s), .it is from Impulse Tracker (late '90s) < 1257116643 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1257116645 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ProTracker, Scream Tracker 3, Impulse Tracker and FastTracker 2. < 1257116645 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anmaster: basically each one is a sucessive improvement over the previous one (mod->s3m->xm->it) < 1257116663 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see < 1257116668 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except Impulse Tracker is specifically meant as a better Scream Tracker < 1257116673 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same exact interface < 1257116675 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever is wrong with *.ogg and *.flac these days :P < 1257116705 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster, I think your problem is that you don't realize that the world existed before Core 2, 4 GB RAM, 64-bit, etc. ;-) < 1257116710 0 :madbrain!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't rip the samples out of them or snoop how the dude composed music :D < 1257116720 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, I certainly do. But I grew up with mac < 1257116728 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can go on being nostalgic about old mac games < 1257116730 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you want < 1257116748 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, old Macs had games? ;-) < 1257116748 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except, I uh don't see the point. I'm nostalgic like twice a year < 1257116753 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you keep saying, "What's the point?" as if it was always so cut and dry < 1257116753 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and find my old ibook < 1257116756 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with dead mattery < 1257116777 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, yes. Because these sound awful compared even to macs from the same year < 1257116785 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm nostalgic at least once per day < 1257116792 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, age? < 1257116793 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :beauty is in the eye of the beholder < 1257116799 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: 21. < 1257116830 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, okay I do get nostalgic over Myst. Especially with the sound of the CD drive of a performa 5600 in the background (or was it 5200? I forgot...) < 1257116839 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a twinkee is inferior to a real cake but still a bit tasty nevertheless < 1257116856 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`google define:twinkee < 1257116859 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1257116863 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`define twinkee < 1257116863 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :twinkie* < 1257116867 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`define twinke < 1257116871 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`echo test < 1257116874 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1257116877 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh < 1257116878 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1257116880 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* A Twinkie is a "Golden Sponge Cake with Creamy Filling" popular in the United States and elsewhere in North America. ... \ [14]en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twinkee \ < 1257116880 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`ls < 1257116884 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1257116884 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there you go < 1257116885 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :test < 1257116886 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1257116887 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, I think it is slow < 1257116893 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bin \ help.txt \ huh \ karma \ paste \ quotes \ share \ tmpdir.658 < 1257116918 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`ls bin < 1257116926 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1257116929 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? \ addquote \ calc \ commands \ creatures \ define \ esolang \ etymology \ fortune \ google \ helpme \ imdb \ karma \ minifind \ paste \ ping \ quote \ rec \ runfor \ sayhi \ strfile \ toutf8 \ translate \ translatefromto \ translateto \ unstr \ url \ wolfram < 1257116932 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very slow indeed < 1257117067 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, also I could get faux nostalgic about old unix < 1257117083 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, oh ever played Myst? < 1257117103 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wonders if you can emulate a pre-OS X PPC mac on linux easily
< 1257117112 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an eary ppc would do < 1257117161 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes I have Myst on both PC and Atari JagCD < 1257117172 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :came close to beating it in 2005 but never did finish (haven't played it much since) < 1257117195 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not faux nostalgia, DOS lives (barely), just some of us find it interesting < 1257117200 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION kills a runaway process on codu.
< 1257117201 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`ls < 1257117202 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bin \ help.txt \ huh \ karma \ paste \ quotes \ share \ tmpdir.914 < 1257117204 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, finished it < 1257117204 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh :P < 1257117209 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without walkthroughs < 1257117212 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and on mac < 1257117223 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got stuck at that maze underground, couldn't figure out what to do < 1257117231 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not afraid of cheating, just too lazy to bother I guess < 1257117249 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, oh in the sound world? < 1257117250 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hear some of the sequels are good, though, but never tried 'em < 1257117260 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, in the tunnel car thingy < 1257117270 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, with faux nostalgia I meant "never used those, so can't be nostalgic about them, but still is" < 1257117277 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's kinda an underwhelming game in some ways (very isolating) < 1257117281 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, that was in the soundworld < 1257117286 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sound world* < 1257117290 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I probably missed something obvious < 1257117297 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should probably go ahead and cheat and finish it one of these days < 1257117298 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, something rather non-obvious < 1257117312 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, you got sounds indicating direction you should go < 1257117314 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically < 1257117328 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PPC? PearPC? (dunno really) < 1257117346 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, isn't it OS X only? < 1257117349 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still need to finish Gabriel Knight 1 one of these days < 1257117352 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no idea < 1257117361 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but QEMU supports other arches, doesn't it?? < 1257117406 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh indeed < 1257117415 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ruĝulo? < 1257117419 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, yeah but not Mac as such < 1257117433 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wrong hardware emulated iirc < 1257117434 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Warrigal: yes? < 1257117441 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster, ever tried Ardi's Executor? < 1257117447 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but that was mostly System 6, I think) < 1257117447 0 :Warrigal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just wondering if that's also your name. < 1257117449 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, never heard of it < 1257117455 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my nickname, yes < 1257117471 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://github.com/ctm/executor < 1257117485 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ran on DOS at one point (circa 1996) using DJGPP < 1257117496 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, need to run PPC binaries < 1257117497 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now it's been ported to Linux < 1257117500 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, for those old games < 1257117512 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, well this is 68000 (only I think??) < 1257117518 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1257117520 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the issue < 1257117526 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still I have that old ibook < 1257117532 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whenever I get nostalgic < 1257117558 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah, no PPC, sorry < 1257117568 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :easy to forget all their billions of transitions < 1257117583 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apple? yeah < 1257117606 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and PearPC seems dead < 1257117610 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :last news item in 2005 < 1257117674 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm sure someone has done it, just dunno who < 1257117701 0 :adam_d!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1257118156 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :noticeably different keyboard on this laptop than P4 (harder to play Llamatron, barely) < 1257118204 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Llamatron :-D < 1257118207 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :long story short, I'm 30 (not that old), but I do remember DOS + Win 3.1 < 1257118209 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That game was awesome < 1257118227 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I still use old computers, hence I need a "lite" OS more than "lightweight Linux" (128 MB??? o_O) < 1257118236 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/old/ancient/ < 1257118261 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :works well in DOSBox :-) < 1257118266 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :QEMU does some Macintosh hardware bits too. No idea how complete it is; personally I've just played around with PearPC. < 1257118403 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: http://www.llamasoft.co.uk < 1257118422 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I know of the new ones < 1257118440 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, I mean old Llamasoft is freely available there < 1257118496 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, so it is. < 1257118498 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There was that one iPhone-runs-System 7-with-QEMU newspost -- http://mobile.osnews.com/printer.php?news_id=21045 though the actual site seems less alive -- that might've been with the m68k emulator, who knows -- qemu site hardware target list has "G3 Beige PowerMac (PowerPC processor)". < 1257118545 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Llamatron? < 1257118550 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the hell is that < 1257118556 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :game < 1257118561 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :weird clone of Robotron < 1257118569 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : QEMU does some Macintosh hardware bits too. No idea how complete it is; personally I've just played around with PearPC. <-- which doesn't do pre-OS X < 1257118578 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : weird clone of Robotron <-- never heard of that < 1257118591 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Robotron is from like 1980 or so < 1257118612 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, 1982 < 1257118613 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.klov.com/game_detail.php?game_id=9347 < 1257118619 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's on Midway Arcade Treasures 1 < 1257118686 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Well, there's SheepShaver; that one does pre-OS X only ("7.5.2 thru 9.0.4"), don't know how well. < 1257118696 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, could work < 1257118738 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the point?? ;-)) < 1257118760 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, yeah. good point. Since I have that old ibook when I want this < 1257118779 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, still the OS is at least better than DOS < 1257118789 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it is less pointless < 1257118798 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you say so ;-) < 1257118802 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DOS has more apps :-P < 1257118812 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, mac apps were better. < 1257118827 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope ;-) < 1257118831 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and charm < 1257118880 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SheepShaver's supposed to run pretty well on actual PowerPC systems, if you want just virtualizationary stuff; I gather the PowerPC core emulation isn't all that hot, though certainly with modern processors it might not be such a big issue. < 1257118898 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Llamatron <-- ugh arcade style < 1257118918 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION always preferred games where you could win. Not more and more levels all the time
< 1257118994 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I want sound and ability to run OS 8 or OS 9 to run some old games. Mostly turn based. Though one "real" time < 1257119007 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :arcade style is unavoidable when cloning an arcade game ;-) < 1257119019 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, which is why you shouldn't < 1257119022 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what, you don't like trying to beat your high score?? < 1257119027 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It did have an ending, didn't it? < 1257119030 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember being envious of a Mac-using friend, because he had that funky paper airplane game. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glider_PRO) < 1257119032 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rugxulo, I prefer RPGs < 1257119034 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with lots of text < 1257119035 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno, never beat it ;-) < 1257119050 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about Nanosaur :D < 1257119059 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, oh I think my mac had that < 1257119063 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I sucked at it < 1257119120 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I miss those types of games. < 1257119123 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Well, Glider 4 or something, but I don't think that has a Wikipedia article.) < 1257119147 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1257119158 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, screenshot? < 1257119193 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: http://www.lauppert.ws/screen1/mac/glider.png < 1257119199 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The games are nowadays free, it seems. < 1257119217 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what was the objective? < 1257119251 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, I remember playing something like that. < 1257119272 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To fly the paper airplane through the house, avoiding all obstacles. (IIRC, the only controls you had were "left" and "right" to toggle the direction; heat vents made the airplane go up, in other places it just glided slowly downwards.) < 1257119293 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Possibly a ripoff of some kind, since I think it was on a PC. It /was/ a paper aeroplane. < 1257119297 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Those things on the floor in that screenshot are heat vents, I think. < 1257119303 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: There's a Windows port of Glider 4.0. < 1257119310 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: http://homepage.mac.com/calhoun/Downloads.html < 1257119315 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you feel like checking. < 1257119331 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The "PRO" version probably has colors and everything.) < 1257119335 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what the time stamp on that thing is. < 1257119353 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Wikipedia article doesn't even mention a Windows version. < 1257119377 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Right, because the Wikipedia article is for the PRO version. < 1257119383 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bah. < 1257119512 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and the eponymous glider gets electrocuted if you fly it directly in front of a electricity wall socket thing. That's very realistic; I get shocked every time I walk past a wall outlet too. < 1257119518 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is a screenshot so much worse than a picture of a car when it comes to license? < 1257119522 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on wikipedia I mean < 1257119611 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno, useless pedantry < 1257119622 0 :Rugxulo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I hope not ;-) < 1257119675 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: lousy grounding i bet