< 1284854411 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1284854481 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284854503 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pushpop < 1284854623 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :poppush < 1284854628 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :peek < 1284854633 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :peekpoke < 1284854635 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pokepeek < 1284854643 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pokeprod < 1284854645 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nerdymon in a nerdyball! < 1284854661 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and yes I did get the poke reference) < 1284854668 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Please regularly remind me that Fine Structure comments are spoilery. < 1284854670 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but um, couldn't think of a new way to continue it ) < 1284854677 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/ )/)/ < 1284854838 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikapika < 1284854898 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhqpikhq < 1284854910 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooganooga < 1284854918 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhqoerjan < 1284854922 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(from that plot) < 1284854923 0 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-59-152.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1284854971 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1284855002 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284855079 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1284855250 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, alise: "* GregorR-L forces it into EgoBot >: )" < 1284855253 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1284855299 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kinky. < 1284855300 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::| < 1284855305 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also illegal in 41 states. < 1284855321 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :atat < 1284855333 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@@ < 1284855354 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, yes he was forcing "Furryscript" into it < 1284855356 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he said that < 1284855365 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :42 states, then. < 1284855366 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, which makes it even more kinky I guess XD < 1284855367 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: They are. < 1284855379 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, furryscript being zzo's scripting language < 1284855384 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :furry < 1284855388 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yuck < 1284855401 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1284855409 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AssertionError: broken timestamp: UNLOAD <-- indeed, and I hate xchat that I was using back then < 1284855428 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this word reminds me this weird type of pornography that is somewhat popular (and hated) on 4chan < 1284855434 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284855507 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: eh? < 1284855541 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Furryscript's main competitor: http://esolangs.org/wiki/FURscript < 1284855555 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Quite infamous, as I'm sure you know.) < 1284855558 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also: meant to be serious.) < 1284855590 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The person who designed this language was 100% serious about it and the vb6 compiler, but I think he got as far as a text box and a copyright notice before going back to programming his graphics calculator. --Einsidler 10:44, 24 Nov 2006 (UTC)" < 1284855638 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1284855692 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;] < 1284855796 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1284855819 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1284855837 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we have even a suitable category < 1284855842 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284856046 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd love to design another esolang but it's probably impossible to make something completely new < 1284856141 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Why has he just stuck all his short stories together and called them a novel? < 1284856144 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1284856147 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Note: I realise it'll change as I keep reading.) < 1284856154 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Just try. < 1284856163 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284856219 0 :Flonk_!~chatzilla@80-123-40-164.adsl.highway.telekom.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1284856309 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: It shows that he's new to novels. < 1284856332 0 :Flonk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1284856335 0 :Flonk_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Flonk < 1284856347 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: No. The Ed stories flowed better than this. If I was reading this without knowledge of their prior status, I'd assume he's up to something. < 1284856350 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: It is complete now, right? < 1284856356 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: last time i discovered something exciting... it turned out to be a perfectly normal lisp < 1284856362 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Heh; what was it? < 1284856387 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i tried to design something like ais' Feather < 1284856407 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What happened? < 1284856424 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1284856460 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: It is. < 1284856482 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: It also gets more flowing later... < 1284856522 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Good. I just have to ask this, and please answer as vaguely as possible -- a simple "yes" or "no" will be fine -- do these disconnected fragments actually get picked up again, or are they just there to fuck with me? < 1284856564 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, my answer questioned: there's Seph again. < 1284856567 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1284856570 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're finally reading Fine Structure? < 1284856585 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. < 1284856588 0 :Flonk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1284856588 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: They get picked up again. < 1284856590 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Good. < 1284856610 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284856612 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a horrible urge to write some sci-fi, and I'm suppressing it as well as I can because I know it'd be terrible. < 1284856625 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are you up to? < 1284856648 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[["Yes," says Mitch. "I can walk through stuff. And myself." He passes his wrists through each other. < 1284856648 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Don't-- don't do that," says Seph, "it could be bad for you."]] < 1284856650 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1284856652 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: Hmm? < 1284856662 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1284856665 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I've read this chapter before. Actually I think I've read all of these chapters before. I might not have read one.) < 1284856668 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: Oh, chapter. Right. < 1284856675 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indistinguishable from magic. < 1284856681 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*"Indistinguishable from magic". < 1284856700 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*I might not have read one of them before.) < 1284856714 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is, there is one of them that I might not have read; not "it is a possibility that I have not read any of them before". < 1284856787 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Up to a certain point, I presume < 1284856876 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!18bf618a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.24.191.97.138 JOIN :#esoteric < 1284856924 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: ? < 1284856931 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, that's what I mean. < 1284856935 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Firefox randomly decided to crash < 1284856937 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The standalone stories that have been integrated into the timeline. < 1284856949 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some of them were never standalone < 1284856950 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|FsckPuppy: Why haven't you switched to Ubuntu yet? < 1284856958 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still don't have the USB stick < 1284856964 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Indistinguishable from magic" is the first one that has never been standalone yet, I think. < 1284856987 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Power Of Two" was a directory but not inside Fine Structure to start with, I think. < 1284856997 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't recall. < 1284857016 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Indistinguishable from magic" has always been part of Fine Structure, though, to my knowledge. Nonetheless, I have read it. I believe it was the first story for a while. < 1284857019 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: nothing, at one point i proved that my meta abstractions system is just lisp's macro system < 1284857022 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: heh < 1284857038 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zanjero was always a sequel to Power of Two < 1284857055 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1284857056 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Power of Two was once taken offline due to someone claiming it could get published, iirc < 1284857089 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[2008-07-18 18:30:49 by Paradoxia: < 1284857090 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, I see what you're saying. He **REDACTED** < 1284857090 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2008-07-18 18:59:56 by Sam: < 1284857090 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Paradoxia, I edited your comment because it gives away plot details from later in the story.]] < 1284857090 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thank you. < 1284857093 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|FsckPuppy: Yes, that's what I mean. < 1284857107 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The two teleportation stories were outside at first, too, I think. < 1284857137 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Might nto be the best idea to read comments before you've read the whole thing < 1284857142 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. < 1284857149 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And now I'm turning into Teal'c. < 1284857162 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|FsckPuppy: "Unbelievable scenes" is a bit of a bad opening because I thought "FUCK YEAH I hope the next few chapters are like this too". < 1284857218 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sam told us that he'd be bringing a story in < 1284857233 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I saw all the speculation about USIS, but... I'm shutting up now < 1284857287 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1284857288 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :USIS? Would it be a spoiler to expand that acronym? < 1284857337 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unbelievable Scenes in space >.> < 1284857350 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is not the name of it, so n/m < 1284857361 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why did you think it was "in space"? :P < 1284857392 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good question < 1284857436 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION inexplicably starts singing a song
< 1284857454 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was about to say the name, but if you twisted it just right, you'd get a spoiler < 1284857455 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|FsckPuppy: Let me guess: Spoilers? < 1284857467 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is "Unbelievable scenes in space" a spoiler? < 1284857483 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No < 1284857484 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The name of the song I'm thinking of is.. kind of < 1284857484 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, "Unbelievable scenes in spoilers" < 1284857485 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1284857486 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, I should probably just remember your track record with Fine Structure spoilers and ignore you until I finish it. < 1284857492 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/ignore, that is. < 1284857496 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I'm too foolish and kind-hearted to. < 1284857514 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not going to deliberately spoil you < 1284857533 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you will link to a ROT-13 decoder and say a bunch of stuff in ROT-13, and then say "...which is how Fine Structure ends". < 1284857550 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I won't < 1284857554 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wonders why the story's continuing as normal when all the stars and shit have been blinked out.
< 1284857559 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Yes, yes, I know, non-chronological order.) < 1284857576 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Fabula and sujet and all that.) < 1284857602 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fabula and sujet? < 1284857747 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :JFGI < 1284857812 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did < 1284858227 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, then, now you know. < 1284858240 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, and Power Of Two reaches its next chapter: Exponents. < 1284858248 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't like that capital O. I don't like it. < 1284858293 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the characters connect again! < 1284858297 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You did read Paper Universe, right? < 1284858769 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise? < 1284858779 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. Yes I did. < 1284858895 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1284858947 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok < 1284859015 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night → < 1284859112 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1284859161 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284859415 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|FsckPuppy: Is Ching's first name Kuang? < 1284859426 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1284859436 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1284859540 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1284859555 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|FsckPuppy: I know FTL gets invented, but I've forgotten the name of the guy who does it already. :) Bloody comments. < 1284859559 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1284859576 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1284859581 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless it just meant whoever invented the device here on Earth in On Digital Extremities and onwards. < 1284859581 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Um... I don't think it does? < 1284859587 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh. Alright then. < 1284859588 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, FTLC? < 1284859601 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that's blocked, which you should know already < 1284859602 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1284859622 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284859631 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and you may be thinking of a story that's retconned ouyt < 1284859632 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*out < 1284859646 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, you are < 1284859664 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ping alise * < 1284859688 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FTL was invented in that retconned-out story. < 1284859739 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pong. < 1284859750 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|FsckPuppy: I have not read the story, as I explained. < 1284859752 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So thanks for the spoiler. < 1284859767 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, you just spoilered that it stays blocked forever. < 1284859774 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No I didn't < 1284859786 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[FTL gets invented, implicitly "sometime in the future"] "No it doesn't" < 1284859790 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Provided as evidence: < 1284859791 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Oh, FTLC? < 1284859791 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Well, that's blocked, which you should know already < 1284859794 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes you did. < 1284859801 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm excluding possible developments later on < 1284859830 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whether this means that it stays blocked or not... well, I'm not saying < 1284859869 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same with FTL travel < 1284859908 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don < 1284859949 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't attempt to decode, from what I've said, information about the future of the story < 1284860011 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|FsckPuppy: No, but you see, you reacted to "faster-than-light communication gets invented" with "no it doesn't". You then say "perhaps you meant [this form of it]?" and then state that it does not work; obviously, the answer you gave first is validated by your second negation, meaning that it never gets unblocked. < 1284860028 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, maybe I should just try not to talk to you about Fine Structure and vice versa until I'm done with it and it is impossible to spoil me. :P < 1284860044 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still remember a bunch of people suffocate at one point. < 1284860044 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where's pikhq? < 1284860099 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dammit, where's someone who read FS already? < 1284860157 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, ping ping-a-ding < 1284860175 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why do you want such a person? < 1284860184 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Wow, that's a pretty ghastly way to kill someone wrt. Eleven.) < 1284860192 0 :augur!~augur@208-58-6-161.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1284860218 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, warning: You do not want the answer to that question < 1284860225 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Therefore, I won't answer < 1284860292 0 :cheater00!~cheater@ip-80-226-28-34.vodafone-net.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1284860301 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol @ the use of BBC "News" < 1284860311 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The tendency of the BBC to put every damn thing in quotes in news headlines) < 1284860318 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :("Two killed in "transporter accident"") < 1284860362 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can I say something if I don't feel it's a spoiler? < 1284860412 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only if you check really damn hard that it provides no possible inferrable information about the story to someone who has not read "Two killed in "transporter accident"" or beyond yet. < 1284860431 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::S < 1284860436 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think "Stuff happens" being inferrable is that bad < 1284860456 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it ok if what I say simply infers that? < 1284860482 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Outside of the official stories, but still canonical, is another thing in that format < 1284860493 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whether there are more things of that format within the stories, I'm not sure < 1284860541 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which format? < 1284860546 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :News story < 1284860554 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is canon outside of the official stories? < 1284860559 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that not a contradiction? < 1284860560 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: why :S? < 1284860614 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is not a contradiction < 1284860616 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*why ":S"? < 1284860620 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|FsckPuppy: Is listing them a spoiler? < 1284860631 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i just typed it < 1284860636 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YES < 1284860645 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looking at the Extras contains spoilers < 1284860667 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why are there so many fucking spoilers? < 1284860673 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are the extras? The notes below the stories? < 1284860682 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are the CHAPTER TITLES spoilers? I've read them. < 1284860697 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The thing listed asExtras, appendices, feedback (subdirectory) < 1284860709 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arguably < 1284860744 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brolog < 1284860754 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1284860779 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|FsckPuppy: *as Extras, < 1284860841 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284860858 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :distant_figure annoys me with this cycling < 1284860881 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I like Mitch. < 1284860882 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Ditto. < 1284860884 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :distant_figure: Stop it. < 1284860895 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: oh wait < 1284860897 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he lives in south africa < 1284860900 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably their power grid < 1284860906 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1284860916 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's mentioned it going off and on a lot before < 1284860923 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sick < 1284860929 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc they have regular planned downtime of the power grid too :) < 1284860939 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would buy a diesel generator in such case < 1284860953 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1284860966 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or even use my car to generate electricity for computers < 1284860990 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I'd ask you a question, but you'd be able to ... um < 1284860992 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :crap < 1284861020 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooooooh, it's soo late < 1284861049 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|FsckPuppy: "I'd ask you a question, but you'd be able to" is not a spoiler. < 1284861053 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So what the fuck is it now? < 1284861064 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sleep time, good night < 1284861072 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Night nooga. < 1284861075 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, yes it is. If you squint real hard and are a bit psychic < 1284861078 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Night nooga < 1284861088 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|FsckPuppy: It really isn't. < 1284861124 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I complete that, promise not to be angry at me? < 1284861144 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|FsckPuppy: It is a spoiler, yes? < 1284861154 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you think about it < 1284861166 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|FsckPuppy: Remember when I said we just shouldn't talk about it? < 1284861174 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok < 1284861177 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am trying to enjoy a novel here. :P < 1284861196 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh a SUBDIRECTORY. < 1284861206 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1970-? < 1284861261 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1284861269 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arcologies sure feature a lot in this. < 1284861288 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1284861301 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, have you read Fine Structure? < 1284861302 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1284861329 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: No < 1284861343 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is it? < 1284861358 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284861420 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A story that I've read and alise is reading < 1284861480 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://qntm.org/structure, for what it's worth. < 1284861573 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|FsckPuppy: Am I meant to be completely disoriented, chronologically? < 1284861579 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maaaan, I own the domain name onero.us and I STILL do nothing useful with it. < 1284861587 0 :trinithis!~trinithis@99-7-56-119.lightspeed.davlca.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1284861589 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'll reorient < 1284861592 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I'll buy it. < 1284861603 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: No way! Also you can't, legally :P < 1284861613 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: No, but you can let it drop. Or I could pay you fees. :P < 1284861620 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Let it drop in exchange for me paying you a lump sum, that is.) < 1284861637 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: No, I mean you can't own it in that it's a .us domain and you're not a US resident. Not that this is really enforced, but /technically/. < 1284861651 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Oh. < 1284861656 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Well let's pretend I am a US resident. < 1284861673 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Then it's just the age problem :P < 1284861677 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe < 1284861686 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|FsckPuppy: This thing must be set in an alternate universe; presumably 1970- is implying some sort of circa 1970 onwards setting here, and it's definitely not after the present day due to the vehicles mentioned, so... < 1284861692 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: What age problem? < 1284861699 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh < 1284861704 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you actually own it or just rent it like everyone else? < 1284861706 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, it is a story about information? Is a book available? < 1284861714 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: There are PDFs available that you could print out. < 1284861717 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe you'll reorient yourself once you finish reading 1970- < 1284861726 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1284861727 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: I just rent it like everyone else, but that's still a contract. < 1284861730 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"A story about information" hasn't quite come together yet; but then, these are localised segments. < 1284861743 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Well, I happen to have purported to agree to several of them and nobody's g-- < 1284861749 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I can flagrantly violate the terms of my domain contracts. < 1284861751 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OMG ^_^ < 1284861757 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: OK, I might try the PDF < 1284861774 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: There's two PDFs. I guess they're formatted differently. < 1284861786 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1284861797 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I'd go for the second. < 1284861801 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's smaller, and better typeset. < 1284861804 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, just keep reading < 1284861848 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: The files are a lot of pages. Where can I purchase this book? < 1284861864 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: There is no printed copy as of yet. You could print the PDF, or just read it online. < 1284861873 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or you could use lulu.com to create your own print copy using that formatted PDF. < 1284861878 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then buy it... from yourself... < 1284861943 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: I would rather buy it from the author, if I can. If I can somehow make something on lulu.com to make it pay someone else, and that I can indicate who to pay, for each book even in the same account to be able to put payment to different people < 1284861967 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: You could set it to the minimum price so that all money goes to Lulu, and then send some money to Sam Hughes. < 1284861981 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I imagine he'd give you an address to send a cheque or such to if you emailed him. < 1284861981 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, are you a logreader? < 1284861985 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: But that won't do if someone else purchases the book too < 1284861994 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: You can set it so that only you can see it. < 1284861998 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I do sometimes read the log < 1284862001 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then nobody else would be able to purchase it, making it a personal copy. < 1284862002 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1284862016 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :His email is on this page, obfuscated for spambots: http://qntm.org/contact < 1284862022 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION needs to talk to pikhq
< 1284862028 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I am not looking to add advertisements to qntm.org at this time. Thanks for your interest." ;; guess he didn't bother to update it when he added Google ads < 1284862047 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: But what if someone else wants to buy it, too? < 1284862068 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Then... they'll just have to do what you did. Or, far more likely, read it online or print out their own copy. < 1284862079 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or you could simply promise to give all profits from the book to Sam Hughes. < 1284862127 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION blibbers
< 1284862130 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I'll ask Sine < 1284862149 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :361 pages; I would have expected the book to be longer. < 1284862173 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|FsckPuppy: Gosh, the start of Crash Zero is a bit boring. < 1284862198 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: That is not a bad idea. But, if I run a business selling this book, I am not going to give *all* the profits to Sam Hughes (but I will give most of the profits). But when I have time to run a business, this can be one of the products. And then he can earn the money, too! < 1284862210 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: But you wouldn't have done anything but fill out a form on Lulu. < 1284862218 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284862225 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meh, I see the whole of 1970- as.. um, shutting up < 1284862226 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They process all orders, they print and mail out all copies, they take their chunk of the profit (plus however much you want, possibly nothing). < 1284862241 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So taking profits would be a bit disingenuous... and illegal, too, without explicit consent from Sam Hughes. < 1284862255 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, so would publishing a public edition in the first place. < 1284862278 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: I know. I can't publish it at all without permission, of course. < 1284862290 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is why I suggest I would rather I purchase it from *his* Lulu account. < 1284862290 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Untrue; you can make a private copy for yourself on Lulu like I suggested. < 1284862306 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He has stated he will not publish on any "vanity" press, i.e. self-service presses. < 1284862308 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This includes Lulu. < 1284862315 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you're out of luck on that front. < 1284862339 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION ponders the nature of spoilers
< 1284862394 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Ah, I guess I can make a private copy to myself and then delete it. I might consider doing that. < 1284862541 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1284862542 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But not yet. It will be much later. < 1284862568 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or just read them online < 1284862613 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284862641 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I suggest doing what Sgeo|FsckPuppy just suggested. < 1284862672 0 :Sgeo|FsckPuppy!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Winston < 1284862688 0 :Winston!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo|web < 1284863134 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BRB < 1284863389 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even if I read it online, I will not do so right now. < 1284863449 0 :EOF!461e5690@gateway/web/freenode/ip.70.30.86.144 JOIN :#esoteric < 1284863452 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yo < 1284863464 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still sorting those logs? < 1284863490 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nay < 1284863498 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EOF, have you read Fine Structure? < 1284863506 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, no < 1284863514 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know how trustworthy you are < 1284863528 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ish < 1284863540 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no i haven't < 1284863570 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll go through the wikipedia article :) < 1284863577 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION declares Japanese rap "weird".
< 1284863582 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EOF: There isn't one! Ha! < 1284863582 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, finally! < 1284863599 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION seconds prior /m statement
< 1284863640 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://bit.ly/8PRw6j I mean seriously, whaaat? < 1284863643 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://eo.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maldika_strukturo in Esperanto < 1284863682 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EOF: Mia Esperanto malbonas. Japanalingvo? < 1284863683 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: They're not even trying < 1284863684 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sheesh < 1284863727 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Would you expect them to be doing stereotypical urban black culture? < 1284863744 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I meant the actual rapping. < 1284863749 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. Yeah. < 1284863751 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I can do is make a file for TeX so that you can use UTF-8. It should not be too complicated to do. Simply to make all characters 128 to 255 active and then make table which character in a font corresponds to which character in a different font, that should do it < 1284863759 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As far as I can make out he's just picking the shortest words with the easiest sounds to end every line with :P < 1284863764 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not that I can make out much of it at all, of course. < 1284863769 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not knowing Japanese and all. < 1284863776 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eeeps < 1284863789 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eeepc < 1284863802 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://tinyurl.com/2amodvo < 1284863806 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: What you're hearing there is just the normal Japanese syllable structure. < 1284863824 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not very good < 1284863838 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There *aren't* many sounds in Japanese. < 1284863846 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1284863851 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I think he got most of them in there. < 1284863857 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<EOF> http://tinyurl.com/2amodvo < 1284863865 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :links to a let-me-google-that-for-you for "Child Pornography" < 1284863867 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, did you receive my msg's? < 1284863874 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if anyone's too lazy to click. or is just not stupid enough to click links from EOF < 1284863876 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: Yes. < 1284863901 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: "Communication" You can't just fucking use an English word to rhyme < 1284863913 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nobody finishes English rhymes with a French word because they're too lazy :| < 1284863924 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU USED "COMMUNICATION" AGAIN < 1284863928 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You SUCK < 1284863931 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe we could find a foreign word to rhyme with "orange" < 1284863938 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Door hinge. < 1284863942 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: It's a perfectly ordinary and commonly used word in Japanese. < 1284863947 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Shut up. :| < 1284863988 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Law of Fantasy: Any language you make up uses "ae" to excess. < 1284863994 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Ika Lgass Hunaethn" "ancient Aethn" < 1284863997 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sam Hughes, I am disappoint. < 1284864020 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most people suck at making plausible languages. < 1284864065 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even though for most uses of a made-up language (namely, handful of loan words) it would pretty much suffice to define a basic phonology and perhaps a handful of morphemes. < 1284864076 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, kind of difficult for the characters to ever learn the true pronunciation, I think < 1284864082 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh < 1284864087 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You are up to that, right? < 1284864094 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: True pronunciation? What? < 1284864099 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Ignore him. < 1284864106 0 :yiyus_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1284864111 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think maybe we are getting too lax with our Sgeo-does-not-talk-to-me-about-Fine-Structure-at-all rule :P < 1284864121 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: No, the thing is, he's making shit up. < 1284864126 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1284864133 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wild mass guess fanon? < 1284864141 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, literally making shit up. < 1284864145 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat. < 1284864166 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Has he divulged some insane theory to you in /msg or something :P < 1284864212 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone want to do some marathon programming? < 1284864245 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Is it just me, or has Sam Hughes actually gone to lengths to make "The Voice Of The World" in "The Nature of the Weapon" actually seem like it was translated? < 1284864250 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, not flowing quite in the usual manner. < 1284864258 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It may just be my brain making shit up itself. < 1284864401 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AFK < 1284864403 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not AFP < 1284864407 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What? < 1284864438 0 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1284864526 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how on earth all this is going to tie together. < 1284864549 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I was Hughes, I'd be looking for a cop-out ending that saves me from having to explain everything round about now. < 1284864558 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION angers at AndChat
< 1284864564 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: "AFP"? < 1284864582 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thought you'd have guessed < 1284864612 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I haven't, so elaborate. < 1284864620 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Away From Phone < 1284864640 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a while back a friend of mine learned PHP, the next month he was a pothead.... < 1284864706 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1284864729 0 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@32.164.187.178 JOIN :#esoteric < 1284864923 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1284865077 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alise, tell me when you leave 1970- < 1284865093 0 :yiyus_!1242712427@je.je.je JOIN :#esoteric < 1284865104 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeoN1: Why? < 1284865149 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because I'd get bored wth being updated every 1970- story you finish < 1284865157 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeoN1: And why do you need to know...? < 1284865173 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm on "The Big Idea", anyway. < 1284865184 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1284865226 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now TMI. < 1284865468 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note to self: Yuen is fucking crazy. < 1284865530 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whether by doing that thing to that group every time interval, or by saying she does. < 1284865562 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The former, seemingly. < 1284865624 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd ask whether a certain story is still listed, but it would reveal a connection to that stry < 1284865664 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoa, him-- < 1284865670 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeoN1: You could check. < 1284865676 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeoN1: Uh, in 1970-? I can just paste the list. < 1284865678 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just did < 1284865683 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :--him! < 1284865692 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How has HE survived?... < 1284865694 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No < 1284865698 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do < 1284865698 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not < 1284865699 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :say < 1284865699 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a < 1284865700 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :word < 1284865730 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You think I spoiled you when I didnt < 1284865782 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You said no presumably to the story. < 1284865786 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it was to that M-guy. < 1284865790 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it no longer. < 1284865802 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1284865807 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am 99% certain it's that guy, anyway, since he can do that thing he does. < 1284865823 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Fine Structure is a story about saying the most with very, very little.) < 1284865856 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284865874 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ask pikhq what I meant, I'm not retyping it < 1284865890 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Um < 1284865899 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No; that would be a spoiler. < 1284865906 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We should make up the plane 17 and more to "hyperastral planes", where the high bits of the code numbers can indicate properties and right-to-left and complex scripts and other things like that. < 1284865911 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am now leaving "1970-". < 1284865962 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Where plane 0 is normal plane, 1 to 16 is supplementary planes, and 17 and above is hyperastral.) < 1284866131 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And so I'm back, from outer space (no relevance ) < 1284866141 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's playing on the radio < 1284866151 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, it's you're < 1284866322 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now there's a song associated with one of the crappier virtual worlds < 1284866329 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, that I associate with < 1284866352 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Planes 16777216 up to 3355431 shall be hyperastral planes. < 1284866371 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1284866418 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not as crappy as imvu though < 1284866432 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What? Which? Not that I care, but. < 1284866443 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284866457 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vSides < 1284866489 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vSide < 1284866512 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note that my metric for crwppiness behaves weird sometimes < 1284866737 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nonviolent_video_games ;; Non-violent first-person shooter < 1284866778 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Super Noah's Ark 3D < 1284866784 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if(you != lying){printf ("you deserve a hug.\n");} < 1284866834 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(if (abuses-fake-code-for-dialogue-in-that-way-once-more? EOF) (perish-burning-fire EOF)) < 1284866850 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least make your fake code work properly in /theory/ or just don't do it at all or ... ever... < 1284866857 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I approve < 1284866893 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1284866953 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fine, do you want me ti pastebin the whole file? < 1284866954 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you.truth_status? < 1284866978 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EOF: There is no possible way "you != lying" makes coherent sense. < 1284866996 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, you can make that code compile and execute... and possibly even ask the user if they're lying, and make you = 1, and store it as a boolean in lying. < 1284867018 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's still not what you were trying to express. And fake code is irritatingly pointless unless it has some code-related merit. < 1284867023 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And yes I'm grumpy. < 1284867025 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you is an indication of truth or falsehood for some nutty reason < 1284867026 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@121-73-165-42.dsl.telstraclear.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1284867027 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1284867027 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1284867035 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not elegant < 1284867051 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I sort of see lying as a constant here < 1284867060 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not RIGHT. You are-a person; lying is a status. A person cannot be a status belonging to them; it is meaningless. You have failed. < 1284867067 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1284867081 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Therefore perishment. < 1284867091 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but no < 1284867104 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION attachés an iron chain with ball to EOF
< 1284867104 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the program simply continues to execute < 1284867137 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION misread perishment as punishment
< 1284867138 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :life goes on, or ends... < 1284867149 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeoN1: attachés? Really now? < 1284867166 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I managed to typo an accent! < 1284867232 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1284867245 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what keyborad layout? < 1284867262 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :keyborat < 1284867283 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The N1 keyboard layout < 1284867300 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd be easier to make this in java < 1284867308 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was goinc for C < 1284867314 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Java poisoning is a terrible thing < 1284867333 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1284867335 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284867346 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :java is (:-/ < 1284867349 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hell, even vaguely-C-like-family-language-poisoning is sad < 1284867358 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooo < 1284867360 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C FTW < 1284867365 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C is nice < 1284867369 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uSUCK < 1284867374 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But sticking with that family of languages is poisonous < 1284867381 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1284867405 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C is all powerful < 1284867422 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learn Haskell, or a Lisp, or Factor, or Smalltak (probably not Smalltalk, not different enough) < 1284867426 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omnipotent < 1284867435 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Smalltalk < 1284867439 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION finds an error in Fine Structure
< 1284867443 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise? < 1284867449 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EOF: "uSUCK" -> obnoxious. Rabid C defending -> obnoxious. < 1284867452 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hence the esoteric channel < 1284867466 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a basic mental health thing < 1284867472 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is? < 1284867485 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learning non-industry languages < 1284867496 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: "You're wife's maiden name" is the error. < 1284867503 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt EOF has anything to do with the industry. < 1284867525 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should check that what I removed is actually the HD < 1284867528 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION removes SgeoN1's poorly attached ball and chain.
< 1284867573 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sudo su < 1284867580 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"sudo su" is extremely bad practice. < 1284867584 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"sudo -s" is always preferable. < 1284867586 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :echo "i am omnipotent" < 1284867593 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or "sudo -u user -s" for the case of switching to another user. < 1284867594 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rm -rf / < 1284867608 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :killall rm < 1284867628 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kill -9 Sgeo|web < 1284867632 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If Sgeo|web's command is executing, you are not facing a shell prompt. < 1284867643 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not a PID < 1284867644 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^C < 1284867645 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is "kill -9 Sgeo | web". That is unlikely to be what you want. < 1284867650 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Furthermore, kill takes a process ID. < 1284867680 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is your PID Sgeo|web ? < 1284867698 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does this inanity have a point? Humour can count as a point. < 1284867704 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're shit, number 2 < 1284867708 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kill -9 2 < 1284867720 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, assuming that it will, eventually, evolve or progress into something that has a single element of humour -- that would be enough. < 1284867744 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry < 1284867749 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was mean < 1284867760 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Killing people is generally considered mean. < 1284867760 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i'm drunck < 1284867767 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and my friend is high < 1284867776 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and wer'e all idiots < 1284867781 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What has your /friend's/ mental state got to do with anything? < 1284867801 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1284867803 0 :wareya!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1284867828 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284867865 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If my house were a restaurant, it would be condemned < 1284867873 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1284867888 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION gets Sgeo|web a maid
< 1284867945 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION gets Sgeo|web laid
< 1284867970 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION sets up Sgeo|web 's RAID
< 1284868008 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RAIDs probably still die when dropped < 1284868056 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has overused rhyme and for that he will have dearly paid
< 1284868077 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is sorry for what he said
< 1284868101 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :paid and said do not rhyme < 1284868119 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I speak for all sane persons when I said that this is proof that English is demented < 1284868129 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: where are you? < 1284868140 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Story So Far. < 1284868157 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: only shitty laptops fail like yours when dropped < 1284868173 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my Toshiba has a habit of parking the drive heads when I so much as tilt it, and it's very effective. < 1284868176 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1284868180 0 :wareya!~wareya@cpe-74-70-142-220.nycap.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1284868181 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tl;dr I <3 laptop < 1284868185 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1284868193 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My laptop is old < 1284868203 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although it is a Toshiba... < 1284868210 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my laptop is new and crappy < 1284868229 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's a gateway(ewww) < 1284868237 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they overheat :/ < 1284868294 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Calrus -- < 1284868298 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Page closed < 1284868305 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION sets out to replace ALSA
< 1284868317 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-- Are all the guys with that name in this story the same fucking person?! < 1284868319 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sheesh! < 1284868340 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: With OSSv4? < 1284868343 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION forgot the details of that story
< 1284868395 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Yes. < 1284868417 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Recommendable. BTW: Install XFCE's mixer if you don't have it. It can do OSSv4. < 1284868433 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have it. < 1284868439 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's so bad about ALSA? < 1284868442 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PCM11 -- for me, at least -- and the output of the first vmixer -- are the ones you want. Use ossxmix to turn everything up to full volume, first; watch out for application-specific volumes. < 1284868445 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometimes they start out low. < 1284868453 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Basically you want everything but your last output turned up to maximum. < 1284868456 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is not the default. < 1284868458 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"osstest" is useful. < 1284868460 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: It sucks. < 1284868512 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aaaaand there's not useful Gentoo packages. Fek. < 1284868523 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yes, there must be. < 1284868531 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.gentoo-wiki.info/OSS4 < 1284868536 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Add the OSSv4 layman overlay: < 1284868537 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :layman -a oss-overlay < 1284868554 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: The tarballs referred to in those ebuilds no longer exist. < 1284868559 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lovely. < 1284868564 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Give up now while you still have your sanity. < 1284868573 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Recommended suffix to that sentence: "On Gentoo, that is." < 1284868589 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have three options: write my own ebuilds, give up, or switch distros. < 1284868607 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I don't know of any distros that suck less ATM. < 1284868608 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You use freaking Gentoo. The last option is such a wonderful one, I'm surprised you're not going to take it twice. < 1284868616 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Well, true. < 1284868627 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use Ubuntu. Obviously, you won't. I don't blame you. < 1284868644 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well. Nix is *highly* tempting. < 1284868645 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Arch Linux is decent enough and OSSv4 is a single installation away -- but its community is as bad as Gentoo's used to be. < 1284868665 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You could try GoboLinux. For the fucking hell of it. < 1284868666 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I can be trusted to judge communities < 1284868675 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Are you familiar with Nix? < 1284868678 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Relatively. < 1284868686 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's totally done wrongly, of course. < 1284868688 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Based on one person, I thought the whole LambdaMOO community was anti-documentatipn < 1284868698 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, but less so than a lot of other things. < 1284868710 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually Gobo Linux is like Nix when you don't try and make everything as much like Haskell as possible. < 1284868710 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GoboLinux might be fun to try as well. < 1284868715 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*GoboLinux < 1284868738 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: And if you use GoboLinux/Étoilé, well, then you have OS X with Torvalds' name stuck on it. :P < 1284868750 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And a rather hopeless set of applications... < 1284868767 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GoboLinux only supports i686. DEAL BREAKER < 1284868777 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Oh, I wish tuomov's blog is still up; he had a *wonderful* post on package manager design. < 1284868795 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Know the old URL? archive.org < 1284868800 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: robots.txt. < 1284868806 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU < 1284868815 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I HATE MORONS < 1284868819 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd email him, but, well, his abrasive personality is pretty well-known. :) < 1284868824 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: It may be his server administrators. < 1284868830 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Hey, I know1 < 1284868832 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*know! < 1284868833 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Try a BSD. < 1284868838 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: did you get to the description of Akker? < 1284868848 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Proprietary ATI drivers available? < 1284868850 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: I know he committed suicide. That's all; shut up. < 1284868856 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Only one way to find out, buddy! < 1284868858 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's all I wanted to know < 1284868867 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Google! < 1284868881 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284868894 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a "no, but some crazy bastard hacked the proprietary drivers to kinda-work on FreeBSD". < 1284868901 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bleh, FreeBSD. < 1284868905 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So BORING. < 1284868910 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But who needs graphics? < 1284868913 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it weren't for that, shit, I'd be on a BSD tonight. < 1284868914 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I see only one solution. < 1284868937 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: I'm not making my own distro. < 1284868943 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apex. (Alise + Pikhq + Unix = Apix, "ooh that's similar" -> Apex). < 1284868948 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, WE are! KITTEN HUGS FOR EVERYONE < 1284869006 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, yeah. Another thing that makes me hate most distros: they almost all suck at building packages sanely. < 1284869031 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gentoo is somehow the best at doing this. Everything else will *gleefully* allow things like undefined symbols in shipped binaries. < 1284869056 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ~Apex~ < 1284869083 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Debian's better about this than most, simply because they only change APIs every couple years or so. < 1284869102 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AyeAyeAyeAyeAyePecccks < 1284869107 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Gentoo's better about this than most, because they change APIs daily and as such they actually have to deal with API breakage correctly. < 1284869132 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: PAY-EX. < 1284869157 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Slackware's better about this than most, because Patrick Volkerding is an all-around good guy. < 1284869183 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1284869190 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ex-pay. < 1284869210 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284869241 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You cannot hide from its necessity! < 1284869249 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU MUST NIX NIX < 1284869260 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION shall install Nix in a VM to check it out
< 1284869265 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO < 1284869266 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO DARK SIDE < 1284869267 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ONLY APEX < 1284869277 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I even have the slogan < 1284869291 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The Apex of Linux Systems Design in A Downloadable TargzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzZzz" < 1284869304 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: are you at Sundown yet? < 1284869310 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, dammit! < 1284869384 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HOW THE FUCK DOES THAT LINK TO UNBELIEVABLE SCENES < 1284869388 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: I'm at it; I will not read it. I will leave. < 1284869397 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: APEX. Is this having any effect on you? < 1284869419 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why? < 1284869420 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :..? < 1284869425 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: I need to fucking sleep. < 1284869432 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1284869446 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Well, is i-- Apex < 1284869453 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Normal sleep is no good? < 1284869466 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Normal sleep is excellent! I will now obtain it. < 1284869471 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But only if pikhq Apex pikhq Apex < 1284869492 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No? Alas. Goodnight. < 1284869495 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bye. < 1284869497 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1284869617 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1284869705 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284869906 0 :sshc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1284870142 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1284870542 0 :jcp!~jw@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1284871126 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found this list of videogame cliches: http://qntm.org/cliches < 1284871143 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I do think some of my games (and other games from other sources) are break some or all. < 1284871150 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's think about "Super ASCII MZX Town" series. < 1284871164 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Player one is blue and player two is red: Not applicable. < 1284871187 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it has a weak spot, it'll flash yellow when you shoot it: This game breaks this cliche. < 1284871296 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any broken machine of any kind will work perfectly once you have found the correct spare part. Moreover there is exactly one spare part hidden in the level. It is the correct one: There is one situation like this, but there is many spare parts (you need all of them). And they are found in a different level than the thing you have to fix. < 1284871374 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An experienced gamer will automatically destroy crates/pots/boxes/rats to look for ammunition/health/magic/gold inside: In this game, shooting crates/pots/boxes/rats/monsters/yourself/etc is likely to only waste your ammunition. So use it only when absolutely necessary! < 1284871434 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :automatically looking for the red key to the red door: Most keys in this game do unlock the same color door. But there is one door which is different. < 1284871436 0 :sshc!~sshc@unaffiliated/sshc JOIN :#esoteric < 1284871549 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Climbing a ladder is more life-threatening than engaging in a gun battle: Not applicable, there are no ladders. < 1284871633 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it's covered in fur, its a good guy. If it's covered in spikes, it's a bad guy: This game breaks this cliche. You cannot tell by what they are covered by. You often cannot tell by even seemingly obvious things! < 1284871890 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make the gamer think: Yes, to win the Super ASCII MZX Town series games, you do actually have to think about it. If you do what might appear obvious to you, you will quickly get stuck. < 1284872026 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You might find a clue that seems obvious, but the obvious interpretation is not correct! You have to think about it sideways, too. < 1284872244 0 :sftp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1284872619 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does that mean that you have a platformer part where gravity is sideways < 1284872669 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreaseMonkey: Not in the game I am discussing, but there are such things in other games I have invented in the past. < 1284872783 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good guys will only have first names, and bad guys will only have last names: My game does not follow this rule. (Also, I consider the terms "first name" and "last name" racist, but that's not the point.) However: < 1284872851 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MEDIUM_SIZE_MONSTER (who happens to be a bad buy) asks for various things in order to take over the world (including a copy of the game on VHS). Eventually BIG_MONSTER (a good guy) reveal they know the other guy's real name, which happens to be Dave. < 1284872922 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Yes, I do mean a copy of the game that those characters (and your character) are in!) < 1284873092 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have found more lists of these cliches, and since this game series is not finished yet, I might decide to break some of these cliches in the future games in this series. < 1284873143 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Every powerful character you attempt to seek aid from will first insist upon "testing your strength" in a battle to the death: No, but there is one character who fakes it! < 1284873202 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No city will have more than two shops (Natural Monopoly Rule): In Part II, there is one shop that has many vendors. I do not know whether or not this counts. < 1284873302 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When you're out wandering around the world, you must kill everything you meet: Not the case at all. In fact, attempting to kill everything you meet will just waste your ammunition, even if you are successful at first. (You willl also get less bonus points because you have less conserved ammunition) < 1284873601 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Xenobiology Rule (predatory species of the world will include spiders, scorpions, snakes, wolf, dragon, etc): The game does not include all of them. Also, some individuals will be good to you instead, even of similar type than the other ones. Example: In one room there is two dragons. One will hurt you. The other is good and won't hurt you (they will ask for your autograph, though). < 1284873705 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :However, I might say one thing: The spiders/scorpions/dragons/etc that are good to you and don't hurt you can usually talk, in this game (but occasionally in a language which you cannot understand). < 1284874639 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A note about the source-codes of this game: The codes are freely available for anyone to view, modify, and distribute. The codes do exactly what it seems, with no lies. However, reading them is more likely to deceive you than to help you to win this game (in most cases, not all)! < 1284874879 0 :augur!~augur@208-58-6-161.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1284875367 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1284875743 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :throne room + thief is so good < 1284875748 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why, because "jump off a cliff" actually means "jump, off hits a with a cliff" < 1284875749 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1284875755 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1284875766 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"jump cliffs off with 'a'" < 1284875767 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1284875773 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Throne room + thief? Give an example, perhaps < 1284875903 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An ending sequence that's little more than a single line and a pixelly picture: Part I, just says you win (no picture). Part II, does have a picture (that has nothing else to do with the rest of the game), and other text, such as "Those responsible for the subtitles have been sacked". The things having to do with the game are the "you win" and the bonus points. < 1284876042 0 :bsmntbombdood!~gavin@97-124-203-150.hlrn.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1284876967 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ever played dominion? < 1284877125 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: No. < 1284877242 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1284877295 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How does that game work? < 1284877331 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Bye < 1284877422 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Night all < 1284877581 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know The CGA Collection: The CGA Collection is a collection of games for DOS systems, all written in QBASIC, all using either 40x25 sixteen colors text mode or 320x200 four colors graphics mode. Sound effects are only PC speaker. Games include: BJACK, BUMPERSH, COLORSPI, ELEMENTA, DOWN, KNAR, HACKBITS, GIVEAWAY, MAKETEN, MINES, MUTCHNAM, PUZGEN, QCOOKIE, SKEDALS, SNAKEBIT, SOVMINGA, STARSTAK, STARWARS, and more. < 1284877638 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The game MUTCHNAM has ten billion levels (really!). < 1284877697 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The game KNAR has five thousand levels. < 1284877699 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dominion, the board g ame? < 1284877701 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's pretty cool < 1284877733 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine a CCG, but the game is to build your deck (instead of building it beforehand and the game is playing it) < 1284877762 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :myndzi: OK. Now I know a little bit. < 1284877786 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have a little bit more ;) < 1284877792 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't played in a while so i forget the exact details < 1284877810 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but basically you set up 10 stacks of cards in the center of the table, as well as stacks of property and money < 1284877816 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(these vary in amount by the number of players) < 1284877817 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :myndzi: Have you ever invented any chess variants? < 1284877840 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on your turn you draw cards, play them, and discard your whole hand < 1284877857 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :money cards let you buy things, property cards are useless but give your deck value, and other cards have CCG-ish things going on < 1284877873 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's about how it works then :P the 10 stacks are chosen from about 25 different cards in the basic set < 1284877877 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you have to play all your cards, or some of them, or a certain number of them, and do you discard all of them regardless? < 1284877880 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you get a different game depending on what cards you play with < 1284877884 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you discard them all regardless < 1284877890 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you go through your deck pretty quickly < 1284877894 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can't "save up" money or something < 1284877902 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it lends a focus towards building a deck that works well with itself < 1284877917 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are cards that can give you more actions, more money, more cards < 1284877925 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interesting idea..... < 1284877931 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :along with various other stuff, some cards that are sorta like "attacks" < 1284877939 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though nothing with hit points < 1284877947 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is quite fun < 1284877957 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as for inventing a chess variant, ha, nah < 1284878000 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have invented a few chess variants, including Xorix Shogi, where the pieces powers are XORed by any piece it captures. < 1284878009 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Do you know about shogi? I have a set of shogi pieces and board) < 1284878010 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though when i learned about navia dratp, i concocted a half-designed game that was influenced by that, settlers of catan, and uhh, whatever the hell that one OSS turn based strategy game is called < 1284878014 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i <3 shogi < 1284878027 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wesnoth < 1284878028 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's it < 1284878033 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Navia Dratp? Yes I saw them playing it at the anime convention! < 1284878035 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never actually playtested it haha < 1284878048 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i did cut out a bunch of little hexes and sorta design a way to randomize the board! < 1284878056 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it wasn't very effective so i didn't pursue it < 1284878074 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also lol @ xored powers < 1284878078 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's pretty interesting actually < 1284878079 0 :augur!~augur@208-58-6-161.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1284878097 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you revise the movements or just keep them the same? < 1284878158 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :myndzi: They are mostly kept the same, but see: http://www.chessvariants.org/index/msdisplay.php?itemid=MSxorixshogi < 1284878300 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be interesting to see what could become of designing the pieces' basic movements around the concept < 1284878344 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :myndzi: Yes it might be, perhaps you can try to make a new game based on a similar concept, if you want to. < 1284878355 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what happens if a lance captures a pawn? < 1284878373 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can it then skip a square? :P < 1284878383 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and also be unable to capture in that square) < 1284878383 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anything capturing a pawn in Xorix Shogi stay as they are. < 1284878399 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fine, rook capturing a gold general < 1284878407 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It says "All pieces can always move one space straight forward". < 1284878420 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was trying to concoct an example ;p < 1284878430 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of how to xor "move one space" with "move any number of spaces" < 1284878446 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See this page for some clarification: http://www.chessvariants.org/graphics.dir/xorixshogi/index.html < 1284878447 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i read that rule but didn't put 2 and 2 together < 1284878540 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you play mahjong? I played Washizu Mahjong at the anime convention (just once, though). < 1284878573 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1284878584 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you get your blood drawn? :P < 1284878638 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :myndzi: No, we didn't do that part. We didn't play for money either. < 1284878668 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But we did use all the other rules such as the transparent tiles (some are opaque), and the teams. < 1284878689 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1284878710 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haven't played mahjong yet, but i did watch akagi after someone told me about how the game worked < 1284878717 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the transparent tiles thing was actually kinda interesting < 1284878724 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am having trouble understanding the graphics on the page you linked < 1284878736 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without having to read up, what's going on here? < 1284878738 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably a 'leap' is a one space movement? < 1284878744 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a ride is 2 or more < 1284878760 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the images for 0 and 1 are confusing < 1284878769 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: just talking about board games and variants < 1284878782 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okieday < 1284878789 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: nevermind, it just occurred to me < 1284878794 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, leaps mean one space < 1284878797 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And ride is two or more < 1284878803 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does anyone need a hug? < 1284878805 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a bit counterintuitive to have the icons not drawn in the same place every time < 1284878840 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did not draw the icons. I wrote the rules to the game, and then Fergus Duniho made the icons for the pieces. < 1284878860 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION shrugs
< 1284878867 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's still a bit counterintuitive seeming at first :P < 1284878870 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but now i understand < 1284878904 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know what < 1284878912 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, nevermind :( < 1284878921 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought i had a clever way to implement that game with physical pieces < 1284878940 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it wouldn't let you keep the powers of captured pieces < 1284878992 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also invented a chess variant which is extremely unlike chess, it uses a one-dimensional board with 72 cells, unequal armies, 12 kinds of pieces, and no rule of "check"; yet, it is exactly the same as chess. < 1284879004 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lolwut < 1284879131 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One of the 12 kind of pieces is a neutral kind that belongs to neither player. There are a few kinds of pieces that cannot move, and pieces which change the first time they move, pieces which cause other pieces to change..... < 1284879161 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It might seem to be entirely different from chess, but, actually, it is exactly the same as chess!! < 1284879190 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here are the rules in case you want to read it: http://www.chessvariants.org/index/msdisplay.php?itemid=MSeeeeeeeeeeeeee < 1284879499 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha, that's sorta cheating < 1284879510 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not REALLY one dimensional ;p < 1284879620 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Higher dimensional games can be mapped onto one dimensional boards, and then indicate everything in one dimensional terms. < 1284879762 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess so < 1284879802 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION challenges myndzi to an m,n,o,p,q,r,k game
< 1284879803 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION challenges quintopia to an m,n,o,p,q,r,k game
< 1284879821 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn you and your partially scriptedness! < 1284879825 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol. < 1284879842 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know what this m,n,o,p,q,r,k is < 1284879857 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never heard of an m,n,k game? < 1284879864 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also: i try so hard to tempt people to abuse that script by making it obvious but to no avail! < 1284879874 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope :| < 1284879894 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1284879950 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The game GIVEAWAY in The CGA Collection is also a chess variant. There are 26 kind of pieces. It is a single-player game, but there are opponent pieces as well, but the opponent pieces have a fixed rule for what they have to do (sort of like the rule in blackjack that the dealer has a fixed rule to play). < 1284880005 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you can capture, you must capture, otherwise you can make a non-capturing move. Opponent's pieces on opponent's turn make all possible captures simultaneously. If you have no legal move or if opponent's pieces are unable to make a capture, then you lose. If you run out of your own pieces, then you win. < 1284880023 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting < 1284880047 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds like a really weird game < 1284880053 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are the rules for capturing? < 1284880075 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rules for capturing are just like in normal chess. < 1284880096 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1284880097 0 :Ilari_antrcomp!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Ilari < 1284880128 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is a level file containing the boards (which can be of any size), and it is also possible to create your own levels, that you might even ask someone else to solve. < 1284880173 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: what are the rules for the other side? < 1284880240 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: The rules for opponent's pieces are that on opponent's turn, opponent's pieces make all possible captures simultaneously. If a piece can capture multiple other pieces, copies are created in all of those positions. If multiple opponent pieces of different kind try to move to the same position, it turns into a question mark, which cannot move or capture at all. < 1284880345 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: so the opponent pieces do not move if they cannot caputre, or if it is not clear which piece should do the capturing? < 1284880398 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: No, if multiple opponent's pieces can do the capturing, they *all* do, simultaneously, and if they are not all of the same kind, they turn into a question mark. < 1284880413 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Ilari_antrcomp < 1284880419 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For your own pieces, you can make only one move (or capture) each turn, no simultaneous moves allowed. < 1284880442 0 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:32ae:1:4261:86ff:fe96:fca JOIN :#esoteric < 1284880451 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If there are no possible ways that the opponent's pieces can capture any of your own pieces, then you lose the game. < 1284880473 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: what does a question mark do when it forms? < 1284880497 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :occupies space forever? < 1284880507 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can it be captured? < 1284880519 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: It can be captured. It is just a piece with no moves. < 1284880595 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is CGA? < 1284880615 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Color Graphics Adapter? < 1284880637 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm asking zzo38 < 1284880653 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Yes, it is Color Graphics Adapter. < 1284880676 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1284880730 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Why what? Why does CGA stand for that? < 1284880743 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION tried to watch Repo! The Genetic Opera today. The music was terrible.
< 1284880770 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: no i mean, why does somethign named that have a collection of games? < 1284880779 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bad operatic music is cringe-inducing. Absolutely, positively cringe-inducing. < 1284880856 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Rather, the collection of the games has the title "The CGA Collection", and they all have certain things in common, one of them being that all of them use either 40x25 text mode with sixteen colors, or 320x200 graphics mode with four colors. < 1284880918 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: is CGA a company? did they develop these games? < 1284880948 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: No. CGA is just the name of the graphics adapter. I programmed all of these games myself. < 1284881043 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did not actually *invent* all of the games myself, though, but I did invent some, and even some of the ones that I did not invent, these implementations have some extra features or something else. < 1284881065 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All the sound/music in the SKEDALS game is Bohlen-Pierce. < 1284881192 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I did in fact invent a game with ten billion levels. < 1284881202 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lokl < 1284881219 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so these games only work if you have said graphics adapter? < 1284881271 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: No, modern graphics adapters can usually emulate the CGA. And even if they don't, you can use DOSBOX or something like that. < 1284881296 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(CGA is a very old graphics adapter.) < 1284881310 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1284881328 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so one needs dosbox or some other kind of dos emulator then? < 1284881330 0 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1284881334 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to run on linux for instance? < 1284881375 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, to run on Linux you do need a DOS emulator. < 1284881397 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1284881923 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The COLORSPI game is a sort of puzzle game and action game. Your piece is the spider. There are green backgrounds and black backgrounds, and then there are walls. There are also seven colors of balls and seven colors of webs. And there is a time limit! < 1284881969 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If a ball touches a spider, touches a web of a different color than the ball, or touches another ball, then you lose. < 1284882002 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Webs of different colors are not allowed to cross each other. < 1284882200 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have limited number of webs of each color, at each level. Some colors of webs can be cut and some cannot be cut. < 1284882249 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If a ball touches a web of the same color of the ball, the ball remains there (you can still lose if other balls collide with it), and it is safe for a spider to touch it and then it is removed. Once all balls are removed in this way, the goal apperas. < 1284882264 0 :yiyus_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection timed out < 1284882289 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have to reach the goal also within the time limit, and sometimes you might have to make sure to plan ahead correctly such that you *can* reach the goal! (Some levels have no balls, in which case the goal is visible from the start.) < 1284882330 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Webs can be created on black backgrounds only (and it is the only way for a spider to move across black backgrounds). Green backgrounds can contain no webs but can be moved across freely. < 1284882351 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are also a few other kind of objects, some of which can be pushed, and which work only on green backgrounds. < 1284882409 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like this idea? < 1284882453 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how should i know? < 1284882521 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Just guess, perhaps? Or make question/comment? < 1284882559 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : quintopia: Yes, it is Color Graphics Adapter. <-- s/Adapter/Array/ < 1284882582 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreaseMonkey: No, it is "Adapter". VGA is Video Graphics Array. < 1284882588 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmkay < 1284882663 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Boxes and slanted lines can be pushed around on green areas (they cannot be pushed into black space, it is like there is a wall there). Balls touching boxes cause you to lose. Balls touching slanted lines are deflected. < 1284882693 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then, there is one kind of piece which can be pushed like the box, except that it can be pushed into a black space to make it green. < 1284882724 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And there is a sign that changes into a wall after anything passes over it. < 1284882826 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is how the game works! < 1284882904 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i ever get a chance to try the game out, i'll let you know if it's any good < 1284882989 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1284883122 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Good day. This was *not* the Spanish Inquisition speaking, nor was it your boss's sister, despite any rumors you may have heard (or not heard). < 1284883199 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1284883200 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1284883388 0 :yiyus_!~124271242@je.je.je JOIN :#esoteric < 1284884107 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1284884112 0 :coppro!~scshunt@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1284884112 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1284884113 0 :coppro!~scshunt@unaffiliated/scshunt JOIN :#esoteric < 1284884741 0 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1284884936 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so who is here this late? < 1284884953 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :moi < 1284884985 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh. you're just a userscript engine for firefox. i'm looking for people. < 1284885025 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Late? 10:30 here. < 1284885035 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(AM) < 1284885103 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, like, ozland? < 1284885108 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nzland < 1284885112 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1284885213 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10:30 is 7 hours ahead of me, which doesn't seem quite far enough to be new zealand < 1284885223 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, i though india was 7.5 hours ahead < 1284885268 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah, international channels should all have timezone-bots. < 1284885472 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :late? it's early, I just got up < 1284885524 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Filand here. < 1284885542 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Finland? < 1284885556 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, that makes more sense < 1284885559 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but I thought we were using those 2-char country codes. < 1284885568 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FI-land < 1284885610 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://zem.fi/~fis/esomapnz.png -- now with more zzo38, whose weirdness unfortunately makes other people get more overlappy than in esomapn.png. < 1284885717 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this a map of when peoples are in this channel? < 1284885797 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't seem right < 1284885799 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf is it? < 1284885837 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it's a map of two first PCA components out of 60 writing-style related features. < 1284885861 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :first two singular values? < 1284885869 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the feature set? < 1284885897 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, can i be on it? < 1284885908 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://zem.fi/~fis/esomap-comp.png -- that has some of the more interesting features. < 1284885941 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have to leave in ten minutes and get dressed before that, so don't have time for replotting right now, otherwise yes. < 1284885971 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is capitalization at beginning of sentences a feature? < 1284885978 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie is teh big words man < 1284885978 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://zem.fi/~fis/test12.png -- this one is channel activity per time-of-day (Finnish time). < 1284886009 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks about like every channel i've been in < 1284886027 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It might be, I'm not sure. The feature set was originally designed for book author classification though, and everything's capitalized properly there. < 1284886049 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://zem.fi/~fis/test12r.png -- same thing normalized. < 1284886056 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I really must be going. < 1284886071 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :agagaga < 1284886100 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise posts a third of the messages pretty much around the clock < 1284886106 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just as i would have guessed < 1284886482 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, like the saying goes, "evil never sleeps". < 1284886521 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shhh, don't wake it up < 1284886538 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey fizzie are you familiar at all with entscheidungsproblem? < 1284886818 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1284886847 0 :Quadrescence!~Quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence JOIN :#esoteric < 1284888326 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: omghaahhahaohwow < 1284888589 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :man, people that take their foul moods out on other people suck < 1284890459 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hallooooooo < 1284890569 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1284890980 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1284891377 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1284891733 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1284892462 0 :tombom!~tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1284893671 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1284893676 0 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1284895011 0 :cheater99!~cheater@ip-80-226-217-181.vodafone-net.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1284895109 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, fizzie, oerjan: http://sprunge.us/CdUU < 1284895113 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1284895177 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the purpose of doing that anyway? < 1284895188 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does he want his lines in the logs to be easier to find? < 1284895227 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, no, that is him saying stuff like "oerjan swats alise -----###" (he uses his flyswatter) < 1284895235 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it is some kind of in-joke .P < 1284895239 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/\./:/ < 1284895250 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1284895259 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would never have recognized that as a flyswatter < 1284895500 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, what about ===\__/ then? < 1284895513 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no idea what that is < 1284895521 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a pan? < 1284895545 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he hits people with pans/ < 1284895548 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sicko! < 1284895679 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, again an in-joke :P < 1284895692 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yeah, a saucepan < 1284895749 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's see who laughs when i hit HIM with a pan. < 1284895782 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, ah but then you would have to steal it or get him to lend it to you (since there is only one pan) < 1284895841 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: then what was that you just posted above? did you, *gasp* MAKE YOUR OWN PAN? < 1284895861 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, no it was not in a /me, so it didn't count < 1284895872 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh okay < 1284895873 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus I was quoting him < 1284895879 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus* < 1284895886 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so two reasons it didn't count < 1284895894 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, you know < 1284895898 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's not here right now < 1284895906 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so he wouldn't notice if i uh... < 1284895909 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION nabs the pan
< 1284895912 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mwahahahaha! < 1284895915 0 :sftp!~sftp@79.174.50.208 JOIN :#esoteric < 1284896047 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, he is not in the channel atm, how would that be possible? < 1284896110 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if he's not here, then he's not paying attention to his virtual pan < 1284896117 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, you don't have to highlight me every few lines < 1284896119 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no one else here < 1284896188 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah indeed, a bad habit < 1284896196 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm used to high traffic channels < 1284896904 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you were the fin right? < 1284896906 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or < 1284896908 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :norway? < 1284897262 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan is from Norway. I'm from Sweden < 1284897276 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there are quite a few from .fi (plus two more from .se) < 1284897358 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh okay < 1284897368 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hard to keep you norsemen straight < 1284897409 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1284897634 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite a few more than two more swedes, I think < 1284897850 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you another one? < 1284898298 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, so, like, bedtime and stuff < 1284899595 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly, I only know of you and olsner apart from me? < 1284899606 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly, who else? < 1284899627 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BeholdMyGlory is here from time to time, also MigoMipo < 1284899632 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're not here atm though < 1284899636 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1284900631 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh, more swedes < 1284900737 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sqlite> select * from logs where serial > 869850 and serial < 869870; < 1284900737 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :869851|2009-10-25 01:02:32|FireFly|||5|"Later" < 1284900737 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :869852|2009-10-25 00:04:14|oerjan|||0|eek backwards time travel! < 1284900744 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1284900768 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, time to go vote then < 1284900830 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, Jag förtidsröstade < 1284900838 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly, I hope you vote too. < 1284900887 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course < 1284900902 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good < 1284900907 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after voting, back to scheme in haskell in 48h < 1284901633 0 :sshc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1284903615 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Reconnecting < 1284903621 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284903621 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1284903807 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://zem.fi/~fis/esomapf.png -- okay, that's a lot less pretty sight. (Here each x represents 2000 consecutive messages, and it's again PCA dims 1/2 out of the same features as before.) < 1284903877 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.246.49 JOIN :#esoteric < 1284903913 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, does python have any built in class or such for a circular buffer? < 1284903945 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to keep some sort of sliding window when matching up own/clog < 1284903954 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to handle out order issues < 1284903977 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're not saying "yarr" enough. < 1284904041 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, oh is it that day today? < 1284904044 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I don't think there is a built-in type for that, but there's the "buffer" object that can represent a slice out of an array. < 1284904077 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, not sure I want to put the entire db into an array :P < 1284904153 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Indeed; also, you are marked as away. < 1284904203 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's the queue class, but it's more about being thread-safely synchronized. (You could use two queues and pop off the end all the messages that are older than your threshold. < 1284904233 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right, there's a deque in "collections". < 1284904282 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can even specify a maximum length to the deque and it will automatically drop items from one end when you put new stuff into the other. < 1284904409 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1284904422 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yes that seems usable < 1284904682 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I wrote up some code to create a number of known matching points btw < 1284904735 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I'm sure there is a better way than http://sprunge.us/BUEj but it seems to work < 1284904774 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1284904774 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1284904816 0 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1284904978 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sounds like someone (accidentally or not) repeating his message within a short period of time would be a bit problematic for completely unconstrained matching; I guess taking the earliest match always and then removing it from consideration for later ones would handle that, though. < 1284905046 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yes indeed, but that code was just to find known good pairs, and I first got dups but then I got like every ":D" matched up to every other :D within 1 minute < 1284905061 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, the length(body) > 10 seems to have fixed < 1284905070 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there were no other dup pairs there < 1284905094 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it is not so often someone repeats a very long message completely exactly. < 1284905097 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it is not so often someone repeats a very long message completely exactly. < 1284905104 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Whoops." < 1284905106 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed :P < 1284905120 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, and indeed it isn't and it would as far as I can tell show up twice there < 1284905205 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: your /msg notifications suck :) < 1284905213 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, hm? < 1284905219 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh hah < 1284905221 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, does python have a two-way dict? < 1284905232 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, like equally fast to look up by key and value < 1284905232 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: does a buffer just appear silently or something < 1284905239 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : fizzie, does python have a two-way dict? ;; no but trivial to code one < 1284905240 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with two dicts < 1284905263 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, yeah, but I hoped to avoid that work, and also if it had it, doing the two-dict solution would be a bad case of NIH < 1284905273 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as far as i know, there is no package for it. < 1284905275 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :writing code is not NIH. < 1284905343 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :class BiDict(object): < 1284905343 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : def __init__(self, to, fro): < 1284905343 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : self.to = to < 1284905343 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : self.fro = fro < 1284905357 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :done < 1284905359 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo.to[x] < 1284905361 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo.fro[y] < 1284905422 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume you might want to have something where a single call would add in both dicts. < 1284905470 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, true. < 1284905502 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I checked the values with a simple select serial,tstamp,body from irc.logs where body in (select body from irc.logs where serial in ( < long list here > )) order by body; and the only "dupe" was "my brain hurts" from 2007 and 2009, thus not within the critical interval :P < 1284905557 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that was said by different persons < 1284905563 0 :sshc!~sshc@unaffiliated/sshc JOIN :#esoteric < 1284905604 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Vorpal: what would it take to convince you two to give me your full #esoteric logs sometime? < 1284905610 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see, obviously botte has to have the most complete logs ever < 1284905617 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i need to merge all of them. clearly. < 1284905655 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, a lot, since there could be private info in them, due to being xchat logs for several years < 1284905663 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so stuff like /msg nickserv went to log of current window < 1284905680 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Obviously, I would want those filtered out. :P < 1284905704 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, thus: never going to happen. And due to the ambiguity discussed before with * I do not trust filtering. Like "* You have been invited to #secret-channel" < 1284905727 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I could perhaps filter only join/part/quit/msg, and leave out all CTCP ACTION or such < 1284905735 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that should be reasonably safe < 1284905738 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't mind all /mes of that form being filtered out. Also, knowing the name of a secret channel is hardling devastating. < 1284905755 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I'm very cheap, I think I could part with my logs with just a five- or six-digit sum of euros. < 1284905759 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Hmm. Well, if I can get logs of fizzie I suppose I could use his to merge in /mes. < 1284905762 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Darn. < 1284905771 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, hah < 1284905772 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Don't you see it's for science? < 1284905785 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, clog is reasonably complete < 1284905796 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: clog has quite regular outages. < 1284905804 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it was fun writing parsing for znc buffer playback < 1284905804 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are huge swathes of logs missing in which good discussion has taken place < 1284905817 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :furthermore, its timechanges are problematic < 1284905817 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however due to the +- thing at start of messages it is sometimes ambig < 1284905832 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like when my irc client didn't yet know it was in that prefix-mode < 1284905841 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or when we were not yet in it < 1284905841 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can dump something out from the postgres db, after some sanity checks; I think they should be mostly safe. < 1284905849 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example I know a few will be incorrectly parsed < 1284905879 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like [10:11:12] +--[>+ ... < 1284905883 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I saw a few such cases < 1284905904 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: The postgres DB is clog logs, is it not? < 1284905905 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where it is ambig if it is + as in "id with services" or not < 1284905924 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, no it's his personal logs < 1284905929 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as he said before < 1284905959 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'm not sure how dumping a Postgres DB is any less safe than simply running the logs through the filter that got them in there in the first place? < 1284905971 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, anyway logs from late yesterday and onwards should be reasonably simple to filter < 1284906001 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : [...] (Also, I consider the terms "first name" and "last name" racist, but that's not the point.) [...] < 1284906142 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, eh what < 1284906172 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Presumably because in a lot of, for example, Asian cultures, the "last" name is listed first. < 1284906202 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Kim Jong-Il" is actually "Jong-Il Kim" in our ordering. < 1284906252 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :class deque(__builtin__.object) < 1284906252 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : | deque(iterable[, maxlen]) --> deque object < 1284906264 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and nowhere can I find docs what iterable does exactly < 1284906266 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or the type < 1284906268 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess a bool < 1284906270 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes you can. < 1284906271 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wrong. < 1284906287 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, not in help(collections.deque) at least? < 1284906299 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.google.co.uk/search?sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=iterable+python < 1284906301 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :5. Built-in Types — Python v2.7 documentation < 1284906302 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Python defines several iterator objects to support iteration over general and specific sequence types, dictionaries, and other more specialized forms. ... < 1284906303 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PEP 234 -- Iterators - Python < 1284906303 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :30 Jan 2001 ... (Due to a misunderstanding in the original text of this PEP, in Python 2.2, all iterator types implemented a next() method that was ... < 1284906373 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Because the filter can only output to postgres at the moment, so it's easier to dump. No safer, of course. < 1284906380 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, busy with other stuff now. < 1284906428 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :class collections.deque([iterable[, maxlen]])¶ < 1284906429 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Returns a new deque object initialized left-to-right (using append()) with data from iterable. If iterable is not specified, the new deque is empty. < 1284906430 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1284906432 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from the web site < 1284906439 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, a lot more helpful than the built in help < 1284906444 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is a pity < 1284906468 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the built-in help is not documentation < 1284906471 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, anyway, I presume deque(None,10) should work... (I need the second parameter, but not the first) < 1284906472 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is a quick reference tool < 1284906481 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the actual documentation, i.e. the manual, is the only official reference. < 1284906489 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: deque(maxlen=10) < 1284906490 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :duh < 1284906495 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh okay < 1284906542 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:40:10 http://zem.fi/~fis/esomapnz.png -- now with more zzo38, whose weirdness unfortunately makes other people get more overlappy than in esomapn.png. < 1284906543 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1284906552 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Everyone backs away slowly from zzo38 < 1284906572 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have collided with the GregorR nebula. < 1284906583 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It looks like everyone's being time dilated! NO! THE TACHYONS! < 1284906621 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The hull is collapsing!" "Send out a message on all channels! Even that secret channel we never use and that serviced as a deus ex machina three episodes ago! ZZO38--IS--A--BLACK--HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO[static]" < 1284906630 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[credits] < 1284906645 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thank you, thank you, no need to crowd, you can stop clapping now. < 1284906708 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:47:51 agagaga < 1284906709 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:48:20 alise posts a third of the messages pretty much around the clock < 1284906709 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:48:26 just as i would have guessed < 1284906715 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And almost half the messages in total... mwahahaha. < 1284906794 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, you are about as far out as zzo (in a different direction though) < 1284906842 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Less tight though. < 1284906851 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, not true. < 1284906854 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie is quite close to cpressey. < 1284906859 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38 is much further away from everyone else. < 1284906863 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1284906873 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think fizzie's position may be largely due to zzo38 pushing him away. < 1284906889 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can I remove arbitrary values in the middle of a dequeue < 1284906905 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Double-ended. < 1284906907 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Queue. < 1284906912 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hrrm < 1284906915 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So: no. Not unless Python's doing something screwy. < 1284906918 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :del q[n] might work. < 1284906922 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I doubt it has q[n]. < 1284906932 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually it wouldn't be del q[n]. < 1284906936 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :More like q.remove_at(n) or something. < 1284906938 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe. < 1284906939 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dunno. < 1284906953 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have an algorithm pretty much worked out but the sliding window data data type needs to act as a queue but with easy removing in the middle (when we match up an out of order element) < 1284906968 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hrrm < 1284906980 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1284906988 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : | remove(...) < 1284906988 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : | D.remove(value) -- remove first occurrence of value. < 1284906991 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has that though < 1284907030 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :04:53:50 olsner, Jag förtidsröstade < 1284907036 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you randomly talk in swedish to the swedes < 1284907040 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also, before you say anything, blame clog) < 1284907072 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, because I don't have a clue what it is called in English < 1284907078 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pre-vote sounds so strange < 1284907092 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I voted early", just like Google translates it. < 1284907125 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it's a completely different procedure though < 1284907147 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1284907161 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not just voting earlier, it's making your vote before the actual voting starts in a special way < 1284907170 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1284907181 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, so the translation fails to convey the correct info < 1284907192 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/info/meaning/ < 1284907202 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So? < 1284907204 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's still called that. < 1284907216 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I early voted", if you're willing to trade flow with a bit more meaning. < 1284907221 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :early-voted, maybe. < 1284907230 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_voting < 1284907232 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We just call it voting early, though. < 1284907239 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You silly overly-precise Swedes. < 1284907272 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually hm ordereddict with size limit might work better < 1284907276 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could emulate that manually < 1284907344 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, no dupes < 1284907346 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so won't work < 1284907926 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: make a fucking class. < 1284908271 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, yeah been doing that for several minutes < 1284908278 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :before you said it < 1284908302 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, what is the python format spec thingy for tuples? Like %s or %d for string/integer < 1284908314 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should just use %s. < 1284908318 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1284908325 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: even for %d, %s is usually used < 1284908329 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or %r, I guess, for __repr__. < 1284908332 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But for tuples that's the same. < 1284908350 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1284908360 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"TypeError: not all arguments converted during string formatting"? huh < 1284908366 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used %s < 1284908368 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1284908372 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could try %r < 1284908373 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :show your code < 1284908379 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i know what's wrong < 1284908381 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i need to see the line < 1284908383 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :def dump_lines(ol, cl): < 1284908383 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : print " Own: %s" % ol < 1284908383 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : print "Clog: %s" % cl < 1284908386 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fail < 1284908386 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1284908386 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :() < 1284908387 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you have only one tuple it'll try to use its contents < 1284908388 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does % take? < 1284908391 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ol,) (cl,) < 1284908393 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1284908397 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: for debug just use + :P < 1284908402 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :print 'Own: ' + ol < 1284908405 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :print 'Clog: ' + cl < 1284908433 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, well ol is a tuple containing a datetime object amongst other things < 1284908438 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would + magically handle that? < 1284908441 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1284908450 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would do str(ol) which == repr(ol) < 1284908459 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh %s with datetime formats non-nicely, oh well < 1284908472 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it formats non-nicely with everything < 1284908527 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah true < 1284908544 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er i meant < 1284908553 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything formats non-nicely with repr() < 1284908570 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what you need is an object inspector! < 1284908582 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Suddenly, your monitor goes blank. BONG! "Welcome to aliseOS."] < 1284908767 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, you mean like in genera? < 1284908770 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or squeak < 1284908783 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or in aliseOS, which has something like that but SO MUCH BETTER. < 1284908840 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm it got the first 313 events by the fast simplistic algorithm (which just matches up line pairs from the db), now to enable the more complex sliding window one < 1284909547 0 :Sgeo|web!18bf618a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.24.191.97.138 JOIN :#esoteric < 1284909567 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I really don't want to eat breakfast in this house < 1284909609 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1284909889 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The flies (or maybe that's the wrong term)... < 1284910120 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1284910289 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523 < 1284910390 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1284910409 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :update on my compression algo: it's better than bzip2 but almost certainly worse than lzma, except on very repetitive files < 1284910415 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and thus it doesn't have much of a reason to exist < 1284910634 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is lzma patented?\\ < 1284910646 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a good reason for your algo to exist < 1284910704 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1284910709 0 :EOF!461e5690@gateway/web/freenode/ip.70.30.86.144 JOIN :#esoteric < 1284910745 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel like I asked a stupid question < 1284910858 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not completely understand what the http://zem.fi/~fis/esomapnz.pnghttp://zem.fi/~fis/esomapnz.png is plotting, it says "map of two first PCA components out of 60 writing-style related features" but I do not know what that means. < 1284910914 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: start writing aliseOS plz < 1284910941 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Can I have a research grant? < 1284910971 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: LZMA is not patented. < 1284910975 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you could TWEAK IT!!!11 < 1284910991 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: also, it may be significantly faster than LZMA < 1284910992 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was for days on end < 1284910995 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which would be a very good idea < 1284911009 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and most of the tweaks slowed it down, but it doesn't lose too much to remove most of them < 1284911020 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://snarxiv.org/vs-arxiv/ ;; Which paper title is real, which is rubbish? < 1284911024 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Difficult! < 1284911030 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The real papers are just so ridiculous. < 1284911036 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(http://snarxiv.org/ random stream of rubbish) < 1284911056 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without the weird tweaking, it's O(n log n) with relatively low constant factors < 1284911068 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that sounds pretty good < 1284911074 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the real-time speeds you're getting? < 1284911075 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, it heapsorts linked lists. twice < 1284911075 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, in that graph, what is the X axis mean, what does the Y axis mean, and what does everything else mean? < 1284911083 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: er -- not mergesort? < 1284911085 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: I'm not sure, because it's overloaded with slow tweaks atm < 1284911097 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: plug in a mergesort :P < 1284911098 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: well, I needed to implement a priority queue < 1284911108 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :low-hanging fruit etc. < 1284911115 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and because I had the priority queue code already, it was trivial to make it into a heapsort < 1284911133 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and heapsort and mergesort are equally fast in terms of computational order, heapsort often has better performance in practice < 1284911191 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: on linked lists? < 1284911196 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that may be true for arrays < 1284911212 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure about on linked lists < 1284911227 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not like mergesort isn't a trivial algorithm < 1284911244 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heapsort isn't that bad either < 1284911262 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm trying to help you find a niche for your admittedly-now-useless algorithm, stop complaining < 1284911265 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one advantage of the heapsort is that the natural expression of it is iterative rather than recursive < 1284911266 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1284911269 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1284911286 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, decompression's O(n), which is nice < 1284911294 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I think lzma decompresses pretty fast too < 1284911298 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~sgtatham/algorithms/listsort.html has a complete pseudocode mergesort that, though i haven't read it, seems to be optimised for doing it iteratively on a linked list < 1284911313 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: how much more %s of compression do you get from the slow tweaks? < 1284911316 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know quantum bogosort? The algorithm is this: [1] Arrange the files at random. [2] If it is sorted, stop. [3] If it is not sorted, destroy the entire universe. < 1284911330 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"A perl script com piles the gram mar file into OCaml code (snarxiv.ml):" ;; Dear god. < 1284911337 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*compiles *grammar; dunno why that happened. < 1284911349 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, ­ hyphens, I think. < 1284911353 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: less than 1%, which is what's annoying me so much < 1284911358 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they looked really good on paper < 1284911376 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: then get rid of them, stick a mergesort in, and rewrite it in C if it isn't already < 1284911379 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(is it in Java?) < 1284911382 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's in C < 1284911390 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would I write it in Java < 1284911402 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno, you seem to be using the language for things, inexplicably < 1284911405 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the main reason it's in C is because I was doing a bunch of pointer manipulation < 1284911416 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: well, it's my job, that's a reason to be familiar with it < 1284911422 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I only have one major project in Java < 1284911426 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha, from the same guy as snarXiv: http://davidsd.org/theorem/ < 1284911428 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Write it in Enhanced CWEB, and then make a book of it. < 1284911429 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :random theorem generator < 1284911443 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I don't think this compressor is begging to be a book... < 1284911487 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my roguelike dynamic routing algorithm is much more deserving of a paper, because that one's actually useful < 1284911492 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1284911494 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should write it down mathematically sometime < 1284911535 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Then write that roguelike algorithm in Enhanced CWEB and make *that* one a book. < 1284911543 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but Enhanced CWEB is utterly insane... < 1284911559 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You can mix C codes with normal mathematical equations as well, if it is necessary) < 1284911597 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: You think it is insane? Maybe it is insane but I find it useful. I like to use it to write C programs with. < 1284911608 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what I actually did with the routing algo was to make it into a YouTube video < 1284911609 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udCNcoIfYIc < 1284911621 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: YouTube, the future of mathematical journals. < 1284911624 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION waits for alise to not believe me because it's so far out of character for me
< 1284911634 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I actually have Flash so I checked. < 1284911642 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Why doesn't TAEB play with DECgraphics and colours? Sheesh! < 1284911651 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A video? It would be better as a text, isn't it? < 1284911655 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it does play with colors < 1284911659 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it doesn't show them on its debug screen < 1284911663 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Pathetic. < 1284911670 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because colors are used for something else there < 1284911675 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: he /could/ have published a termcast, but... < 1284911678 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, a ttyrec < 1284911679 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever < 1284911698 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: TAEB can think faster and better than me, I feel kind of inadequate < 1284911709 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a strong urge to eliminate the competition. < 1284911712 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's actually slower than most humans < 1284911721 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well gee, that just makes me feel even better. < 1284911748 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Even as a termcast or ttyrec, I think a paper could better explain it, especially if you wrote it in Enhanced CWEB (but even a normal text could do). < 1284911765 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: It's just a video of it in action!! < 1284911768 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I made the video by pointing a screen capture program at ipbt < 1284911771 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: So what sense of routing is being used here? < 1284911776 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not entirely sure what you coded. < 1284911793 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: it's a straightforward shortest-path routing algorithm < 1284911806 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The terminal emulator used is the one from the PuTTY SSH client (simply because that's the one whose API I was most familiar with)." ;; conveniently not mentioning he wrote it < 1284911819 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what's special about it -- works on terrain you don't entirely know? < 1284911824 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's caching a) between turns, even if the goal and the player have moved; b) allowing for changes in the map < 1284911829 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1284911838 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's much faster than running Dijkstra or A* on the sort of workloads TAEB::AI::Player needs < 1284911839 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so is Planar better than main TAEB yet? < 1284911875 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no in terms of raw score, yes in most other respects < 1284911875 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I haven't worked on it for over a year now < 1284911877 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, when the whole map flashes green or blue, it's using a different algo < 1284911890 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, I find your YouTube video inadequate; re-upload it with at least 1080p resolution! < 1284911906 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :either because there are monsters around, which change the caches too quickly for them to be useful < 1284911908 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4096p if possible < 1284911930 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or because there's just been a major update and it's faster to recalculate from scratch than to diff < 1284911931 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: does TAEB ever use gX? < 1284911935 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or CtrlX? < 1284911947 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to move < 1284911957 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, but it uses travel when moving four or more spaces in known terrain < 1284911965 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, what level of the dungeon is this? the display doesn't say < 1284911969 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless D:2D means something < 1284911971 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bottom-left, it does < 1284911977 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2nd level, dungeons < 1284911980 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1284912052 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://undergrad.davidsd.org/theorem/applications.html ;; haha (the author of the random theorem generator getting a princeton student to nod his head along to the rubbish) < 1284912138 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: are you a licensed NIH Therapist? < 1284912152 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i feel a horrible urge to make a new OS and a new language again... < 1284912156 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NIH = Not Invented Here? or National Institute of Health? < 1284912160 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :former < 1284912175 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, doing something yourself for fun makes sense < 1284912197 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nonono, I have a deep, unflinching belief that everything sucks < 1284912201 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that i can do so much better < 1284912207 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if you're doing something for someone else, it helps to try to make sure it's better than the existing alternatives, and basing it on them makes sense < 1284912227 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jettyplay came out of a belief that all existing ttyrec player sucked; it's not finished yet, but I think it's better than all the competition already < 1284912236 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now I've finally tracked down all the known memory leaks < 1284912242 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: at least your project is small < 1284912254 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my language is probably not even implementable efficiently with current CS knowledge! < 1284912256 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, and the competition not only finite, but verifiably so < 1284912283 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION jibbers
< 1284912286 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION shakes
< 1284912298 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Explain how Enhanced CWEB is insane, in your opinion. < 1284912301 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, apparently the maker of I Wanna Be The Fangame is one of the only two people to have ever completed the original < 1284912309 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: i'm not sure, it just ... us < 1284912309 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sort-of makes sense, although I wouldn't have expected it < 1284912310 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*is < 1284912316 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(completed the original on highest difficulty, that is) < 1284912317 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no, more than one person has completed the actual one < 1284912319 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe that's old info < 1284912323 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's in the double digits < 1284912330 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i forget exactly how many < 1284912331 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I was only aware of two < 1284912335 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's good to know < 1284912338 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i /think/ < 1284912339 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i may be wrong < 1284912354 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the general consensus seems to be that once you get used to it, you can just memorise all the levels and complete it < 1284912366 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since i guess you can adjust to the insane bastard-physics < 1284912385 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grr Intel < 1284912405 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if they've actually put virtualisation support on my chip < 1284912407 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but just locked it out? < 1284912410 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I agree with that, I think < 1284912419 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's memorisation + steady hand platforming < 1284912430 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Modern laptops by Sony use, instead of a BIOS, a new approach called EFI." ;; I did not know this. < 1284912436 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sony laptops are on a collision-course with Apple. < 1284912443 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think they will release the exact same model within three years. < 1284912524 0 :cheater99!~cheater@ip-80-226-225-49.vodafone-net.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1284912557 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nobody loves my poor U4100 processor < 1284912569 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with its 1.3 GHz speed and its 2 MiB cache < 1284912576 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :model name : Genuine Intel(R) CPU U4100 @ 1.30GHz < 1284912577 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpu MHz : 1200.000 < 1284912579 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guess it's downclocked itself < 1284912649 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :due to overheating, or thinking it is? < 1284912666 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, you have pretty much the same sort of laptop as me, don't you? < 1284912669 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe it's just bored < 1284912678 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: all modern laptops downclock when not under load < 1284912679 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try rapping it a few times just beyond the top-left corner of the keyboard < 1284912682 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to conserve battery < 1284912685 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and fan < 1284912694 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes the fan gets stuck, and doing that frees it up < 1284912698 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my fan has never got stuck :P < 1284912704 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not a bug that it's downclocked < 1284912712 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, i think this laptop may be better-built than yours, being bigger and more expensive < 1284912714 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although essentially the same < 1284912722 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one would think the greater internal spreadout would leave less room for jamming fans < 1284912742 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually sometimes the fan on this goes off altogether because the cpu isn't even generating enough heat to be worth it < 1284912775 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION downloads the NixOS live CD
< 1284912788 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Purely functional package and configuration management, it's gotta be better than the rest, right? < 1284912792 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Linux distro) < 1284912796 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"sometimes"? < 1284912801 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the fan on this is /usually/ off altogether < 1284912804 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, me too < 1284912806 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :while it's spinning, it doesn't get stuck < 1284912810 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i often have like < 1284912813 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's when it tries to turn on that the problem happens < 1284912815 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 windows open < 1284912818 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with 7 browsers < 1284912820 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and 30 tabs in each browser < 1284912823 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, not that extreme < 1284912826 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you get my point < 1284912831 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and switching windows is... < 1284912833 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a bit taxing < 1284912837 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(never slow, but you can tell it's working) < 1284912934 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tabs don't use CPU, though, do they? just memory? < 1284912942 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless they're trying to run Flash or something silly like that? < 1284912953 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, no < 1284912961 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure *why* switching windows causes it to work a bit more if you have a lot of them < 1284912963 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :come to think of it < 1284912965 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i may be imagining it < 1284912973 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my relation with computers is very... superstitious < 1284912990 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't quite trust that they're actually doing something reasonable when i ask them to do something, because they're told to do *so* *much* stuff < 1284913033 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1284913033 0 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1284913037 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1284913041 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :404 Not Found < 1284913042 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm very sorry, but the following error(s) occurred: < 1284913042 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Product /nix/store/l3q29m17x8sdribzmnz9lr1kg2l7hic4-nixos-manual/share/doc/nixos has disappeared. < 1284913044 0 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1284913046 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well that's not very purely functional, is it? < 1284913228 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I had a strange language idea where modules were actually Erlang-style processes. < 1284913240 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And f(x) was just an object, Prolog-style. < 1284913242 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you did < 1284913253 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :io<-stdout<-print("Hello, world!\n") < 1284913257 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prolog has objects? < 1284913262 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : And f(x) was just an object, Prolog-style. < 1284913265 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like in Prolog < 1284913267 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can say < 1284913273 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :predicate(print("Hello, world!\n")) < 1284913276 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's just an object < 1284913279 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know what i mean < 1284913281 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the Scheme sense < 1284913282 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :value < 1284913283 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :entity < 1284913288 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :inert thing < 1284913449 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, ok < 1284913455 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think "term" is the "official" term for that < 1284913478 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love the way it's entirely possible to use, say, 3-4 as an inert piece of data < 1284913480 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"term" usually means "expression". Sometimes. < 1284913481 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://arcanesentiment.blogspot.com/2010/09/shorter-words-for-expression.html < 1284913494 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1284913496 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :arcanesentiment.blogspot.com/2010/09/shorter-words-for-expression.html < 1284913504 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because although it means '-'(3,4), it isn't interpreted as arithmetic unless you actually try to evaluate it as an arithmetic expression < 1284913532 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah < 1284913537 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah, that's the idea I had < 1284913547 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could also have things like, I don't know, a receiver for a socket < 1284913549 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which would end up having < 1284913556 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :receiver <- "packet" < 1284913559 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as opposed to a function call < 1284913564 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it was some sort of unification, but. < 1284913602 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Arcane Sentiment is an excellent blog, btw.) < 1284913647 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://snarxiv.org/ < 1284913652 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is extreely fun < 1284913659 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Extreely. < 1284913664 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :extremely funny < 1284913665 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://snarxiv.org/vs-arxiv/ is funner. < 1284913994 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@bas5-toronto47-2925351237.dsl.bell.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1284914013 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: how much RAM does your laptop have? < 1284914022 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure offhand < 1284914033 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :enough that Windows 7 actually manages to start, eventually < 1284914034 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I don't run it nowadays < 1284914071 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$(free -m), Mem - total :P < 1284914076 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not minus < 1284914336 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2891 me{ga|bi}bytes < 1284914350 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not entirely sure which unit it's using < 1284914356 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bi, almost certainly. < 1284914362 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should i make something like http://snarxiv.org/vs-arxiv/ for prolog bits? < 1284914366 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I have closer to 4 GiB. But the funny thing is, I find it hard to believe. < 1284914383 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because my CPU has quite a low GHz, and... well... it's so small! So small! and my desktops all have less memory... < 1284914389 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I keep thinking I don't have 4 GiBs to play around with < 1284914392 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and worry about allocating too much to VMs < 1284914438 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, I forgot how ugly 16-bit colour is with modern UIs < 1284914449 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they try and use their full-colour images, so the dithering is awful < 1284914479 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pfft < 1284914483 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i meant haskell < 1284914490 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: what do you mean :P < 1284914491 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :prolog is too simple < 1284914640 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a page that woul let you to guess which function is meaningless and which is a real one < 1284914691 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :easy :P < 1284915086 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird@dinky:~/NixOS$ dd if=/dev/zero of=hd bs=1k count=0 seek=8388608 < 1284915086 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0+0 records in < 1284915086 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0+0 records out < 1284915086 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 bytes (0 B) copied, 1.8299e-05 s, 0.0 kB/s < 1284915088 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Damn that was quick. < 1284915151 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, does python have any function like is-int? or such < 1284915188 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you don't want to. < 1284915191 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(isinstance) < 1284915195 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch < 1284915200 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isinstance(x, int) < 1284915205 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds messy < 1284915207 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's generally considered bad -- then again, who gives a shit? < 1284915207 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1284915210 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: not really < 1284915212 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, is it slow? < 1284915212 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just x is-a int < 1284915213 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a scary name < 1284915214 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no < 1284915223 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just checks that the class is either that class or a subclas < 1284915224 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*subclass < 1284915224 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fine then, since I need to invoke it quite often < 1284915367 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you need it to be fast, just make it so you don't have to check anything at all < 1284915397 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you need it to be fast, make it a lookup table < 1284915400 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THEN REMOVE THE LOOKUP TABLE < 1284915484 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make a graph of the IRC of: Uppercase letters, lowercase letters, digits, punctuation, line length, words per line, NOTICE messages, ACTION messages, messages containing CTRL+A but not ACTION, URLs, replies, user registration, QUIT messages, idle time, etc < 1284915495 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THEN ENGAGE CAPSLOCK < 1284915530 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THEN REPLACE YOUR CODE WITH NOPS < 1284915532 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, well, fast as in "not excessively slow" here. < 1284915533 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THEN REMOVE THE NOPS!!!! < 1284915592 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: did you know that linux consoles can have a background image, and be centred??? < 1284915605 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bg image yes, and centered as in the image? < 1284915610 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in the console < 1284915615 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NixOS's console is centred with a background that has a translucent, glow-bordered area < 1284915618 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in which the actual console is placed < 1284915621 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's freaking me out < 1284915626 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: seeing as python already is excessively slow, I think you'll be fine < 1284915629 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean center as in smaller buffer than screen or centered as in ? < 1284915631 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(translucent = dimmed) < 1284915634 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: former < 1284915635 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ARM SUPERCOMPUTER FTW < 1284915635 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, :P < 1284915642 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, hm okay, that bit I didn't know < 1284915644 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it looks like you have a title-less, translucent xterm on top of a background image < 1284915647 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :scary! < 1284915669 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello vorpal < 1284915678 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello alise < 1284915686 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and hello zzo38 < 1284915734 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EOF: OK. Hello < 1284915778 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the ARM archetecture is BEAUTIFUL!!! < 1284915816 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want to hug it < 1284915838 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EOF: Do you know about the MMIX? < 1284915842 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ARM has breasts < 1284915865 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MMIX better get going < 1284915878 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EOF: How is that relevant? And that doesn't even make sense anyways. How can ARM have breasts? < 1284915906 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's beautiful < 1284915983 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EOF: can you stop being fucking insane, or just go away? < 1284915997 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1284915999 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meanie < 1284916022 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"because it's beautiful"? I am not sure I follow..... < 1284916094 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i made a program for the sheevaplug and it calculates nipple positions from photos if you know the light angle < 1284916102 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it works < 1284916107 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1284916118 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're crazy. < 1284916138 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anybody want the code? < 1284916141 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no. < 1284916150 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or should o sell it to th military < 1284916157 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EOF: So now you made a program that can find things in pictures < 1284916168 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should make the code more generalized < 1284916173 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1284916183 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it finds nipple positions < 1284916187 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing more < 1284916213 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :using approximations of the golden ratio < 1284916216 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EOF: Yes I know that, but unless it can be modified to do more generalized stuff, it isn't that useful < 1284916251 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess it could find the majority of other measurements in the human body < 1284916270 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the right approach < 1284916293 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose that is a possibility < 1284916402 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :motion tracking for long range computerized riflemen? < 1284916427 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aka sniper sentries :) < 1284916588 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ARM's breasts AR M cups < 1284916689 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EOF: you are possibly the stupidest person ever to visit this channel. < 1284916724 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, the matching up works fine up until netsplit, but handling netsplit seems near impossible < 1284916732 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially the rejoining after < 1284916779 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :funtimes < 1284916960 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: You may be correct. It does seem like that. < 1284916971 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was once required by an employer to use FORTRAN, i quit < 1284916984 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FORTRAN EWW!!! < 1284916996 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fortran was a perfectly good language for its time. < 1284917023 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EOF: If you don't like FORTRAN, that is OK. Different people can prefer a different program language. < 1284917040 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, i suppose, but it was invented for the IBM 704 < 1284917058 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :prior to tpedecks < 1284917077 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dip switches and punchcards < 1284917388 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I invented the "Pokemon Keyboard". < 1284917505 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In typing mode, the keys are: 0/A, 1/B, 2/C, 3/D, 4/E, 5/F, 6/G, 7/H, 8/I, 9/J, minus/K, plus/L, multiply/M, divide/N, dot/O, colon/P, comma/Q, semicolon/R, equal/S, not-equal/T, less/U, greater/V, left-parenthesis/W, right-parenthesis/X, quote/Y, question/Z, hash/apostrophe, infinity/male, currency/female, SPACE, NUM/ALPLA, left, right, RUBOUT, ENTER, CLEAR, up, down, SPECIAL, CANCEL. < 1284917565 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In non-typing mode, the keys are: NULL, GRASS, FIRE, WATER, BUG, POISON, GHOST, ROCK, GROUND, NORMAL, FLYING, FIGHTING, PSYCHIC, ELECTRIC, ICE, DRAGON, DARK, METAL, PICTURE, OTHER, LEVEL, EVOLVE, SEARCH, AREA, STATUS, ORDER, HEIGHT, WEIGHT, TEXT, MODE, EDIT, PREVIOUS, NEXT, DELETE, SAVE, SEND, PROGRAM, PRINT, TIME, LOAD. < 1284917648 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0kh4xhem8tM&feature=player_embedded < 1284917679 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/ALPLA/ALPHA/ < 1284918130 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, so I'm only second stupidest? < 1284918251 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=191ZS217zOY&feature=related < 1284918273 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obviously, I'm only considering people in this channel, not the morons in the videos I'm linking < 1284918350 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: she is so shitfaced in that second video < 1284918358 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"You're stupid, you're stupid!" ":D :D XD :D :D :D" < 1284918358 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: I do understand that is what you mean. (However, I did not watch the video.) < 1284918373 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION looks for the remainer of what she said
< 1284918434 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" Angle: Actually, Thomas Jefferson has been misquoted, like I've been misquoted out of context. Thomas Jefferson was actually addressing a church and telling them through his address that there had been a wall of separation put up between the church and the state precisely to protect the church" " < 1284918464 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...does she think that Separation of Church and State doesn't do that? That that's not what it is? < 1284918467 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm not sure what's wrong with netsplit; isn't it just so that those messages will end up being not-matched and therefore both end up in the final result? (And after the split is over you should again start seeing matches.) (But I don't know what you've done there, so... also, still quite away.) < 1284918472 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It protects the church. All churches. < 1284918480 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And non-Christian equivs < 1284918492 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And those who don't believe < 1284918496 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It protects everyone < 1284918504 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Church" doesn't mean "little church building" in this context... < 1284918529 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: As for the Python type-checking, you can test like "if type(x) is int" or "if type(x) is not int"; I guess that won't handle inheritance though. < 1284918550 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: that's evil :P < 1284918551 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is a Python function for checking for inheritance < 1284918567 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|web: The isinstance() alise mentioned? < 1284918583 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1284918651 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Also, I did that "fixed sample set size" test, and ended up with a real mess: http://zem.fi/~fis/esomapf.png < 1284918658 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, the issue is matching up, since joins on different sides won't match < 1284918667 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I was on a different side than clog < 1284918677 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Seen it. < 1284918680 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: What is this graph plotting? < 1284918692 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I might be better off just trying to track msg/act < 1284918692 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: That one's the other one in seventy-gazillion bajillion years. < 1284918708 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Is it a particular problem if both sets of joins end up in the log? < 1284918714 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The galaxies merging and shit. < 1284918731 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So what VMs are there apart from VirtualBox and QEMU? For Linux that is. < 1284918767 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well that is one issue. There is another scenario as well: one side see it as a netsplit, the other times out < 1284918774 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which happens in a few places < 1284918781 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the first is a lot more problematic < 1284918789 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you tell me what this graph is plotting, please? Like, what is the X axis for, what is the Y axis for, what are the shapes means, etc < 1284918824 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: It's a scatterplot of the two first PCA components of 60 different writing-style-related features -- http://zem.fi/~fis/esomap-comp.png has some of the raw features -- where each x is from features computed over 2000 messages. < 1284918867 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: http://zem.fi/~fis/esomapnz.png uses a lot larger sample sizes, so there the people actually can be separated. < 1284918887 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My dad dislikes Obama, but only because of economic... thingies that I fail to understand < 1284918901 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For all I know, the Republicans are 100% correct when it comes to the economy < 1284918909 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, also messages can get lost before the point the other end see a quit < 1284918910 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: And the ellipses are just contour plots at one and two standard deviations of normal distributions fitted to corresponding points. < 1284918915 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Do you have a full list of the components and the features? < 1284918915 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the social stances in general I cannot agree with < 1284918945 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My dad also thinks of the Tea Party in terms of its economic positions < 1284918976 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: http://p.zem.fi/esomap-feats -- the "foo (n)" ones are like histogram bins there. < 1284918988 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, in the fixed set only you and zzo can be cleanly separated heh < 1284919010 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, at least for those two components < 1284919012 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And "Punctuation frequency (ellipsis)" is in fact bugged and always 0 for everyone. :p < 1284919044 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what does the ,1 for each one mean? < 1284919047 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the feats list < 1284919078 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's just the way octave prints out all cell arrays; it's a 60x1 array of strings, and it always prints out at least two indices. < 1284919098 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm what is Type/Token? < 1284919161 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's "count of unique words"/"count of all words". < 1284919162 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you have a copy of the raw data for everyone (and statistics, such as mean/median/stddev/variance, for each feature)? < 1284919167 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1284919169 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, also, is there any specific reason to not include line length in characters? After all that previous plot cleanly separated you from me and alise when you did frequency of line lengths... < 1284919191 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, raw data I assume is the logs in topic < 1284919192 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That's in there, it's the "[30,1] = Chars per paragraph (mean)". < 1284919199 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, oh okay < 1284919244 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: OK, what if I use those I would also need the algorithms, which I do not have. < 1284919312 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have the raw computed features in MATLAB's binary format (readable with Octave too) if someone's so curious. http://zem.fi/~fis/esofea-n10.mat and http://zem.fi/~fis/esofea-m2000.mat for the esomapn.png and esomapf.png features, respectively. The data structures in the files might be a bit screwy, though. < 1284919321 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, is there any way to calculate/visualise "separability" when taking all PCA axises in account? Maybe as a graph with distance from a given nick to the other ones, one per nick of those. < 1284919321 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(They're written to work with the MATLAB SOM toolbox.) < 1284919377 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You could graph serious "separability" by training some sort of classifier with the data, and then plotting the confusion matrix; I'll do that soonishly. < 1284919389 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, "confusion matrix" :D < 1284919401 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://gawker.com/5603331/comical-sharron-angle-needs-press-to-be-her-friend < 1284919403 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is this a joke? < 1284919407 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what does a confusion matrix mean? < 1284919498 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's just the recognition results, so that rows match to the correct labels, columns match to the classifier results, and a value is in (i,j) if it actually has the label i but the classifier gives it j. You'd want the confusion matrix to be as diagonal as possible, since all values on the diagonal correspond to correct classifications. < 1284919500 0 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1284919513 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Angle: "Well, no. We wanted them to ask the questions we want to answer so that they report the news the way we want it to be reported." < 1284919513 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 < 1284919537 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, didn't you switch nick with Gregor some year(s) ago? For a few hours or such? And when you revealed what was going on it turned out no one had detected it. < 1284919546 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I seem to have a vague memory of that < 1284919555 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes. < 1284919576 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Through a complicated number of swaps to each other's and other nicknames that appeared to restore itself but didn't. < 1284919583 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1284919584 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION also has a vague memory. of that, and in general.
< 1284919606 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I guess that could both explain why you end up so near Gregor and also perhaps confuse the algorithm to place you even nearer. Or rather, place Gregor even nearer (due to your much higher volume I suspect you won't be affected as much) < 1284919619 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it was for a short period of time < 1284919629 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true, but the first point still stands < 1284919680 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, did you drop an R hm? < 1284919683 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1284919685 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1284919686 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ages ago < 1284919691 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Molto ages ago. < 1284919692 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, do you merge Gregor and GregorR in those plots? < 1284919700 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mucho gusto molto < 1284919730 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I think I merged in all that are like 'gregor%' there. < 1284919744 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1284919756 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Makes sense since up 'til recently I used GregorR?(-[A-Z])? < 1284919784 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Also, here's a confusion matrix for letters: http://zem.fi/~fis/q3.png -- you can see things like "oh, s is very easy to classify" and "k/p/t and m/n are easily confused". < 1284919805 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, pretty. < 1284919826 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: wat < 1284919828 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, is that for OCR? Or for the problem at hand? < 1284919843 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's some old speech recognition course homework. < 1284919855 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So where's this nick-associability graph you're all referring to? < 1284919859 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah < 1284919860 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see it in the logs (yet) < 1284919862 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: /~fis/ must be so huge. < 1284919868 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, Finnish or English? < 1284919883 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: http://zem.fi/~fis/esomapn.png is one. < 1284919921 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, another one is http://zem.fi/~fis/esomapnz.png < 1284919932 0 :Sgeo|web!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1284919934 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, why is there no http://zem.fi/~fis/esomapfz.png ? < 1284919956 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Because esomapf.png already has a zzo in it. < 1284919957 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are the axes? :P < 1284919968 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what about a non-z version of that? < 1284919969 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I said this like *right now*. < 1284919986 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, first two PCA < 1284919995 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: zzo38: It's a scatterplot of the two first PCA components of 60 different writing-style-related features -- http://zem.fi/~fis/esomap-comp.png has some of the raw features -- where each x is from features computed over 2000 messages. < 1284920021 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See, this is why I don't like using a BNC :P < 1284920035 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It appears I've been here for hours, when in actuality my BNC's backlog didn't even cover that. < 1284920066 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: So... don't? < 1284920072 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I've configured bip to replay absolutely everything that has happened after I last said something/manually reset the backlog/last connected. < 1284920078 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, so set it to log further than that? < 1284920086 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not that I usually read the backlog, though, so I guess it won't help. :p < 1284920093 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bleh < 1284920109 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The confusion matrix is lacking äö, so it might even be English. In any case it was an phonemes-out-of-acoustics only trivial "recognizer", so it's actually a bit language-agnostic in that it doesn't care about words. < 1284920181 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1284920198 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, but not all languages have all phonemes afaik? < 1284920206 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: < 1284920207 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# ls /bin < 1284920208 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sh < 1284920213 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# ls /lib < 1284920218 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ls: cannot access /lib: No such file or directory < 1284920221 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, um, wtf? < 1284920224 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# ls /usr < 1284920224 0 :jcp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Later < 1284920229 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ls: cannot access /usr: No such file or directory < 1284920234 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, ls / < 1284920239 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tell me what that does < 1284920246 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Works. < 1284920250 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, and lists what? < 1284920250 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ohbtw: Gregor: So... don't? // but now my hostname is codu.org :P < 1284920255 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bin boot dev etc home media mnt nix nix-store.squashfs proc root sys tmp var < 1284920265 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, what is nix-store? < 1284920265 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Right, and English phonemes tend to have screwier names than just letters; so I think it is Finnish. I think it was from a three-sentence datasets, so it might just not have any äö in it. < 1284920266 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I can think of a million other ways to achieve that. < 1284920272 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Do you use a graphical client? < 1284920297 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeeeeeeeeees < 1284920304 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, you don't have stuff like combination of letters making new sounds in Finnish? Like sj in Swedish < 1284920318 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, or long/short < 1284920325 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Here, I've thought of one already: Set up a tiny, tiny server on a port on codu.org that, when connected to, waits for a NICK/USER/PASS line, checks the PASS line, then creates a connection to irc.freenode.net, sends off those three lines, and simply directly relays everything between the two. < 1284920333 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This connection is, obviously, broken when your client or the server breaks it. < 1284920342 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This would be, what, 30 lines of code? < 1284920345 0 :jcp!~jw@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1284920354 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: So, a bnc that doesn't remain connected. < 1284920361 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: BNCs are much more involved... < 1284920368 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They have "commands" and stuff! < 1284920371 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: then what was that you just posted above? did you, *gasp* MAKE YOUR OWN PAN? <-- Ceci n'est pas un pan < 1284920399 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Can you tell what it is yet? < 1284920403 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No Googling. < 1284920409 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, not all bncs have commands < 1284920415 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Err, not that. < 1284920425 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The disturbingly-empty filesystem tree. < 1284920436 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Not much, though I think "ng" is often considered a different phoneme in Finnish. Still, Finnish text-to-phoneme mapping is usually done with a (very small) set of rules, as opposed to English which always needs a pronunciation dictionary. < 1284920447 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, well you had nix-store.squashfs in it < 1284920454 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, and you didn't answer my question: < 1284920457 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : alise, what is nix-store? < 1284920466 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I won't answer something /that/ simple. < 1284920471 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I presume it is something called nix-store < 1284920475 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm afraid I will require more mechanical commands. < 1284920480 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or very simple questions. < 1284920480 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!18bf618a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.24.191.97.138 JOIN :#esoteric < 1284920491 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I'm not sure I'm interesting in guessing < 1284920511 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: .squashfs makes it sound like some sort of embedded-linux, maybe a router or wlan-ap or whatnot. < 1284920522 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, but what does ls /nix do? < 1284920546 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, oh and some other stuff: < 1284920547 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc var < 1284920550 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :type uname < 1284920553 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although it also had "store" there a minute ago. < 1284920559 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is literal < 1284920563 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uname is /var/run/current-system/sw/bin/uname < 1284920574 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ls /nix/store does indeed work.) < 1284920575 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, uname < 1284920577 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(run that) < 1284920586 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Input/output error. I think I broke something. < 1284920598 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, what about: uname -a < 1284920607 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same. I think it doesn't like the VM. < 1284920630 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, well... does other commands that are not shell builtins still work? < 1284920667 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, anyway, is it linux-based or other (such as *bsd or whatever) < 1284920703 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. Linux. < 1284920710 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would somebody run linux in a VM if they could just fuse kernels < 1284920713 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure how well squashfs is supported on anything not a Linux. < 1284920719 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ls -l ==> Bus error, lol, I have really fucked something up here < 1284920724 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION sneakily steals his saucepan back
< 1284920740 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION thinks that wasn't so sneaky
< 1284920740 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, well then the answer is simple, it is some crazy linux distro along the lines of gobolinux when it comes to crazy organisation of the filesystem :P < 1284920744 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'll just give it away: it's NixOS, using the purely-functional package manager Nix. < 1284920748 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :similar, yes, but it's crazy in a cool way < 1284920763 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because < 1284920768 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every configuration or package change is versioned < 1284920769 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why the squashfs though? < 1284920771 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can run trunk all the time < 1284920776 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since you can just boot the previous configuration in grub < 1284920778 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EOF: well you're not the one who isn't supposed to notice. < 1284920784 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/nix/store/r8vvq9kq18pz08v249h8my6r9vs7s0n3-firefox-2.0.0.1/ < 1284920789 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the hash is a hash of the dependency graph < 1284920809 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the directory is immutable < 1284920819 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and users can install multiple local versions of a package and it use the same tree < 1284920819 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, a pitty the whole OS is not purely functional. Since then fucking it up would be considered a side effect and thus be hard to perform :P < 1284920821 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(because they're verified) < 1284920861 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: < 1284920861 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When you install a package like this… < 1284920861 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ nix-env --uninstall firefox < 1284920861 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the package isn’t deleted from the system right away (after all, you might want to do a rollback, or it might be in the profiles of other users). Instead, unused packages can be deleted safely by running the garbage collector: < 1284920861 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ nix-collect-garbage < 1284920863 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This deletes all packages that aren’t in use by any user profile or by a currently running program. < 1284920865 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can garbage collect the packages! < 1284920874 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(nice < 1284920881 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/\(// < 1284920881 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh yeah, and the package manager works on other distros too. < 1284920905 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I'm not sure the native package manager wouldn't clobber it < 1284920934 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm pretty sure dpkg clobbers stuff just fine if it doesn't think it handles them itself and they are not in /etc or such < 1284921029 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it doesn't < 1284921033 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since it's self-contained < 1284921034 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also < 1284921036 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :here's the really cool thing < 1284921043 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in NixOS, the CONFIGURATION is managed with nix too < 1284921052 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{ < 1284921052 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : boot.loader.grub.device = "/dev/sda"; < 1284921052 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1284921052 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : fileSystems = [ < 1284921052 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : { mountPoint = "/"; < 1284921053 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : device = "/dev/sda1"; < 1284921055 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : } < 1284921057 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ]; < 1284921059 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : services.sshd.enable = true; < 1284921061 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :} < 1284921063 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's an example minimalist full-machine configuration < 1284921069 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I didn't say nix clobbered, but that the package manager might unless you use a prefix for the nix stuff < 1284921070 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can roll this back even if you make it not boot properly < 1284921072 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(maybe not if you fuck up grub) < 1284921083 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, also the name is highly likely to cause confusion < 1284921084 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with *nix < 1284921085 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it all goes in /nix/store :P < 1284921089 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://nixos.org/ < 1284921091 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an established project < 1284921095 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, not /bin/sh though? < 1284921096 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :research papers, large package set < 1284921100 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(full KDE 4, many many packages) < 1284921103 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :continuous builds < 1284921106 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :small but established userbase < 1284921125 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I think that's because too much stuff breaks without it, dunno < 1284921129 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I write distro, I will write a new package manager, called "pm", which receives package files (which can be concatenated) from stdin, and does stuff depending on the command-line options, sending results to stdout and status messages to stderr. < 1284921151 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, there are a few more in that category, /usr/bin/env is very common < 1284921168 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i'm not sure what they do for that. i'd have to checl. < 1284921170 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*check. < 1284921197 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, does it boot though? < 1284921209 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Boot? Of course it boots. People use it as their main system. < 1284921220 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I mean after you fucked it up < 1284921224 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was a livecd < 1284921227 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1284921231 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure how i fucked it up but i sure did < 1284921232 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, that explains the squashfs < 1284921235 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :righ < 1284921236 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*right < 1284921248 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How does being a purely functional package manager help with any of that < 1284921270 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|NeedUSB: what? < 1284921282 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Nix is a purely functional package manager. This means that it can ensure that an upgrade to one package cannot break others, that you can always roll back to previous version, that multiple versions of a package can coexist on the same system, and much more. < 1284921285 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" < 1284921300 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the package management is purely functional, not just the code < 1284921315 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not "this is written in Haskell" it's "packages are literally immutable and rollbackable" < 1284921336 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, what happens if you manually edit a file of a package? < 1284921361 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1284921378 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well, at least one of the people there wants to chattr +i the store < 1284921386 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think you CAN fuck it up as root, but you'd have to be very deliberate < 1284921387 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure < 1284921508 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no /usr/bin/env :D < 1284921508 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hardcore < 1284921606 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, hm < 1284921635 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION rm -rf /nix/store
< 1284921641 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a LiveCD, what's the worst that could happen?! < 1284921651 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mm, the silent sound of destruction. < 1284921658 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anarchic carnage. Chaos rules the land of Nix! < 1284921676 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, 2gb flash drive enough?> < 1284921684 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|NeedUSB: What? < 1284921688 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, so is there any package monad? < 1284921691 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To put Ubuntu on < 1284921696 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: WHOA < 1284921698 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And be reasonably sane < 1284921700 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the kernel panicked :D < 1284921704 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, how fun < 1284921710 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|NeedUSB: mmmmmmyes. < 1284921712 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd go for 3-4 gb < 1284921715 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but 2gb should be fine at a pinch < 1284921718 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|NeedUSB: NOTE < 1284921721 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :boot it from a livecd first < 1284921726 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then use the USB Creator to write it to your drive < 1284921729 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Will do < 1284921739 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|NeedUSB: remember to check the setting that allows ~ to be preserved < 1284921745 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, anyway, when they say a package isn't deleted right away does it mean that the app stays in your path and such < 1284921750 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is it moved elsewhere from there < 1284921755 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It won't preserve installed packages though, will it? < 1284921757 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it's taken out of the current system < 1284921761 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but still exists in prior systems and in the store < 1284921761 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, right < 1284921768 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the current system is just a bunch of symlinks, I think < 1284921769 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more or less < 1284921772 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, does it use unionfs for it or something? < 1284921775 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1284921775 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|NeedUSB: uh, maybe. dunno. probably not. < 1284921781 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i'm not sure on the details < 1284921783 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd have to ask #nixos < 1284921814 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1284921830 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, any multilib support? < 1284921844 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :multilib done properly would make me interested < 1284921848 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Probably? Ask #nixos. < 1284921849 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea. < 1284921879 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I feel myself switching to Haskell < 1284921889 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I really want Haskell with Erlang-style hotswapping < 1284921892 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or Smalltalk-style < 1284921937 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"This command does everything necessary to make the configuration happen, including downloading and compiling OpenSSH, generating the configuration files for the SSH server, and so on." <-- hm, so... what if you want custom settings for the sshd, more than just "on/off"? < 1284921954 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you edit sshd_config then or does it provide some other way for all possible ssh settings? < 1284921965 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: #nixos < 1284921968 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're doing that thing you do < 1284921972 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, but you have it running < 1284921974 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming that because someone mentions something they're an expert < 1284921982 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: so do they < 1284921985 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they also know where all this stuff is < 1284921986 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :touche < 1284921993 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Every web framework and its mother has its own templating language < 1284922001 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|NeedUSB: not all of them! < 1284922049 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: what, you mean you're not a nixos expert? you've been using this thing for several hours by the sound of it! < 1284922050 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, the docs on their website... are very limited < 1284922091 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, the thingy for Smalltalk instead has ... painting thingies < 1284922100 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: minutes actually! < 1284922106 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: they have a full manual. < 1284922114 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the NixOS manual link is broken, here is one that works: < 1284922122 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://hydra.nixos.org/build/638450/download/1/nixos/manual.html < 1284922126 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some issue with their continuous build system < 1284922149 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, yes it is very limited. It's the same as the one I saw. < 1284922200 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, here I compare to gentoo manual or freebsd manual. Heck even openbsd manual is better than that. It is just a quick start guide compared to those. < 1284922217 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do I paste into urxvt? < 1284922230 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|NeedUSB: middle mouse button < 1284922244 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: irrelevant. those document all the software packages in the system too < 1284922246 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nix has no need to < 1284922248 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, bbl, valvaka (no clue how to translate that, ask olsner or fizzie or someone, though olsner is probably going to watch that too) < 1284922248 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Grr < 1284922260 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION goes to enable middle mouse button emulation
< 1284922266 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"valvaka", says Google. < 1284922269 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|NeedUSB: it is already on < 1284922272 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :left and right buttons together < 1284922277 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shift+insert might also work < 1284922289 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :election wake? < 1284922295 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nope < 1284922312 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, got it < 1284922315 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wrong clipboard < 1284922348 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, wake seems to be a specifically funeral ceremony < 1284922352 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1284922388 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :election wake XDDDD < 1284922417 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it translates to vaalivalvojaiset; HTH. < 1284922433 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :staying up late to watch the counting of the votes live and listen to political analysis and stuff < 1284922502 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The annoying thing about Try Haskell is that it's more REPL-like and less "Put stuff in, put it in a file, run file" like < 1284922502 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://wiki.nixos.org/wiki/Main_Page < 1284922507 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THis makes a difference for Haskell < 1284922572 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: nix-build --argstr system i686-linux $NIXPKGS_ALL -A skype_linux < 1284922575 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yes multilib < 1284922592 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, adjusting back to prefix is painful < 1284922630 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Later < 1284922662 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|NeedUSB: You can (IIRC) swap the button meanings in urxvt so that it's "paste" on right-button and "extend selection" (the far less used one) on middle, but I'm not sure I'd do that, I'm afraid it might lead to a habit of right-clicking for paste. < 1284922689 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right-click is paste on PuTTY, iirc < 1284922698 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Could you add support for the tag to the esolang wiki? (It does not have to actually output the <xmp> tag, it might convert it to other tags.) Also support digits after "xmp", so that you can write <xmp15> ...... </xmp15> < 1284922708 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha, luckily wake also means "to remain awake for some purpose, duty, etc." and "to keep watch or vigil." ... either works well with an election < 1284922774 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The <xmp> tag on MediaWiki should make it print everything inside the tags as verbatim text, with no templates, signatures, HTML tags, HTML character entities, or other stuff. < 1284922808 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you shold all try f.lux program < 1284922814 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|NeedUSB: PuTTY's is configurable too; I think it even calls the paste-on-middle "X-style". < 1284922815 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's totally awesome < 1284922837 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As well as turning off the spam filter inside of <xmp> tags for registered autoconfirmed users. < 1284922880 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: What is f.lux program? < 1284922884 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :google it < 1284922913 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh my, the nationalist party may get into parliament < 1284922932 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it adjusts color temperature of your display so that you can last whoile night looking at it < 1284922974 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it doesn't affect the actual brightness nor contrast < 1284923006 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f.lux is cool < 1284923009 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i hate it < 1284923028 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I already adjusted the color temperature on my computer anyways < 1284923037 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: it updates it dynamically over the night < 1284923043 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it maintains a constant perceived brightness < 1284923045 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hahaha ad fail. Accidentally clicked a Hulu ad that led me to http://ask.sherwin-williams.com/ < 1284923050 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :based on your timezone and the light you use < 1284923054 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is an unconfigured IIS7 install :P < 1284923067 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Wow, they stole that Welcome-in-43583475345-languages thing from OS X. < 1284923075 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the whole spacey-explosion-background-with-big-shadowed-text thing. < 1284923083 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Microsoft: TRYING TOO HARD < 1284923094 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stealing from OS X is what Microsoft does. < 1284923107 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Do you know how stable btrfs is? < 1284923113 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nope. < 1284923117 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WELL START KNOWING < 1284923122 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: And I don't need such a thing that updates it dynamically based on those things, what I have works < 1284923210 0 :Sgeo|NeedUSB!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1284923295 0 :SgeosTears!18bf618a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.24.191.97.138 JOIN :#esoteric < 1284923388 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ubuntu download at 19% < 1284923446 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, continuing to read FS? < 1284923457 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeosTears: not right now, but later. < 1284923462 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, ugly: http://www.epstk.de/ http://epstk22.awardspace.com/examples/demo2.png < 1284923472 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: latter is 404 < 1284923487 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Weird, maybe it checks referer or something. < 1284923492 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah works on the page < 1284923515 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we need something to fake referer instead of just hiding it (like anonym.to does) < 1284923524 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somehow < 1284924280 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh, wget? You should be saving to USB < 1284924284 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not to memory < 1284924317 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh crap < 1284924397 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dammit, is it starting the download over? < 1284924398 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION cries
< 1284924432 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION attempts to work out how to resume a download
< 1284924495 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wget -c, usually. < 1284924523 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ty < 1284924528 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although saw it in the manpage < 1284924559 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Woohoo! < 1284924580 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION makes sweet, sweet love to wget
< 1284924609 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://p.zem.fi/shogun-octave -- a stable piece of software there. < 1284924840 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note to self: Don't assume /mnt/flash is, in fact, the flash drive < 1284924852 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Esp. if i know that /mnt/sda1 is def. the flash drive < 1284924852 0 :wareya!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1284924856 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hate the word definitely < 1284924908 0 :wareya!~wareya@cpe-74-70-142-220.nycap.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1284925228 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeosTears: how old is fine structure? it was there in august 2005 < 1284925280 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know < 1284925288 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but iirc, it ended earlier this year < 1284925298 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://web.archive.org/web/20080221012806/qntm.org/?structure < 1284925303 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"This story has been ongoing since 2006." < 1284925303 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yet < 1284925305 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://web.archive.org/web/20080221003727/qntm.org/?fiction < 1284925308 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2005-08-23 < 1284925312 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fine Structure (subdirectory) < 1284925317 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise! < 1284925333 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Forgotten things in space. That's not in any more, is it? < 1284925335 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION flops on alise sup you
< 1284925344 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's why you said unbelievable scenes in space, SgeosTears? < 1284925357 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is reading "Forgotten things in space" a spoiler, then? < 1284925358 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: hi. < 1284925412 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hows things < 1284925435 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeosTears. < 1284925437 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: good < 1284925465 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Forgotten things in space was retconned out < 1284925480 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it is why I said Unbelievable Things in Space < 1284925498 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Then a man named Calrus discovered how to travel faster than light." < 1284925502 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then that explains it < 1284925504 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the comment on the later story < 1284925508 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :about "Calrus, the guy who invented FTL?" < 1284925516 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1284925533 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tears < 1284925536 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lul < 1284925547 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rebooting < 1284925557 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1284925574 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION can't wait to use Ubuntu
< 1284925658 0 :calamari_!~calamari@ip70-162-184-205.ph.ph.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1284925724 0 :calamari_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :calamari- < 1284925834 0 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1284926176 0 :Quadrescence!~Quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence JOIN :#esoteric < 1284926501 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1284926507 0 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1284926721 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1284926900 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: "[REDACTED] is canon. Think of it as a deleted scene." < 1284926910 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, [REDACTED] is not the title of the actual thing < 1284927008 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, apparently Myst completely confused its fans, when the developers made statements about official canon that contradicted the games < 1284927018 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people aren't entirely sure what to make of it < 1284927052 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Recently? < 1284927075 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I think that in Uru canon, the games were actually PC games based on real events < 1284927096 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Here's a confusion matrix out of a default-parameters SVM classifier, on the "easy" set (everyone's all messages divided into 10 sets), 10-fold cross-validation (i.e. classifier trained on a set that has 9 points from everyone, then tested on a set that has one point from everyone, results averaged out). It's pretty boring, < 1284927147 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<olsner> staying up late to watch the counting of the votes live and listen to political analysis and stuff <-- so what is it called in English? < 1284927175 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah wake works, right < 1284927179 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm *looks* < 1284927192 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, "here" you say, but where is the link? < 1284927207 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Uh... I *thought* I had written it, but seems not. < 1284927223 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://zem.fi/~fis/esoconf.png anyway; "I mean, really, you should've been able to guess that". < 1284927261 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, so Gregor/ihope?! < 1284927273 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and pikhq < 1284927273 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1284927288 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant/alise too < 1284927308 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's two instances of ihope being misclassified as Gregor, right. And some cross-confusion between gregor/pikhq, which I think was in the original plot too. < 1284927317 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what is the scale? percent of messages tested on? < 1284927324 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That level of correlation is pretty high, actually. < 1284927338 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose you could identify me fairly accurately with /:P$/ though :P < 1284927345 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well ratio, not percent < 1284927367 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, I do that sometimes too, and ";P" < 1284927379 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use both < 1284927397 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's normalized across the columns, so it's "fraction of correctly classified instances of this particular person". < 1284927412 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, confusing < 1284927423 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Right, but my features are borderline trivial: http://p.zem.fi/esomap-feats if you didn't see them yet. < 1284927424 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :94% < 1284927429 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That's why they call it a confusion matrix. < 1284927431 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in which C compilers x[y] means the same as y[x] < 1284927432 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, XD < 1284927433 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1284927448 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: In all of them. Well, all compliant, anyway. < 1284927462 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since, i believe that it's all translated to *(x+y) < 1284927463 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x[y] = *(x+y) = *(y+x) = y[x], after all. < 1284927468 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yeah, I saw them. < 1284927478 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but huh < 1284927480 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, 4["hello"] == 'o'. < 1284927481 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1[tab] ? < 1284927532 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a bit of an IOCCC'y trick to do, though. < 1284927556 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've seen exactly one instance of integer_variable["string literal"] in real code, I think. < 1284927570 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I'm surprised you seen any at all < 1284927577 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what was the context of that one < 1284927608 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: dcraw.c, tiff_get(), line 4308 (of some version): if (*len * ("11124811248488"[*type < 14 ? *type:0]-'0') > 4) < 1284927648 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not integer_variable["string literal"] < 1284927663 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Oh, you're right! I misremembererered it. < 1284927685 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: It's still pretty messy, though. Maybe I could suggest swapping those around. < 1284927709 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It seems to me you're trying to make this more confusing: here, swap those around." < 1284927733 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meh, that's how I'd write it < 1284927742 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1284927747 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Modulo naming the magic constants :-P < 1284927747 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a bit confusing yeah < 1284927771 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also type → t and len → l < 1284927779 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dammit, what's Ubuntu's md5? < 1284927783 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: I'd write it with a "static unsigned char type_lengths[] = {1, 1, 1, ...}" and then type_lengths[...], instead of using ascii digits and subtracting '0'. < 1284927798 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeosTears, which version? for which platform? which type of install? < 1284927807 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeosTears, or do you mean the program? then md5sum < 1284927811 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also why "tears" in your nick < 1284927825 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Well yes, that comes with the naming < 1284927827 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because Firefox on PuppyLinux keeps crashing < 1284927850 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it's somehow really obvious I might write it as shown, but it probably isn't < 1284927878 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see the list of md5s < 1284927925 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is canon. Think of it as a deleted scene. < 1284927927 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1284927943 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ubuntu-10.04.1-desktop-i386.iso < 1284928002 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeosTears: 9a95ed6f6ec38fb58c446dba1add6a08 if I picked the right row. < 1284928018 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, great < 1284928022 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now where did you find it? < 1284928030 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeosTears: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuHashes < 1284928035 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ty < 1284928066 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw for anyone interested (updated every minute): http://www.val.se/val/val2010/valnatt/R/rike/index.html < 1284928069 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, ^ < 1284928093 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :burning time < 1284928139 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeosTears, firefox keeps crashing? how weir < 1284928141 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :weird* < 1284928166 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yep, been refreshing the page ever since they started < 1284928166 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or the distro as whole? < 1284928230 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Are the light-grey bars last election's results? < 1284928245 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, I think so < 1284928269 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Based on the fact that those column headings are also grey, I guess so. < 1284928452 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Booting into Ubuntu, hopefully < 1284928452 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://cobaia.net/2010/09/top-funny-source-code-comments/ < 1284928467 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: "Valdeltagande .. 81,8%"; our last parliament elections (2007; there's one next year) had the lowest participation rate in Finland ever in the post-war era, 67,9%. Victory of the apathetic. < 1284928556 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... lawl. < 1284928558 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.246.49 JOIN :#esoteric < 1284928560 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is it in the US? < 1284928564 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :15% or something? ;) < 1284928565 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Painful. < 1284928620 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: In the US it hasn't beat 60% in 30 years. < 1284928710 0 :SgeosTears!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1284928739 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, that's preliminary < 1284928743 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, night → < 1284928744 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :12:12:55 <Vorpal> ah wake works, right < 1284928745 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it does not < 1284928751 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wake for is funerals only < 1284928758 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://zem.fi/~fis/esoconff.png -- heh, the fixed-size 2000-message test set is a pretty horrible sight. Almost everyone else (except ais523, me, oklopol and vorpal, and oerjan to some extent) keeps getting misclassified as alise. Probably because e represents over a third of the dataset. < 1284928783 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<olsner> aha, luckily wake also means "to remain awake for some purpose, duty, etc." and "to keep watch or vigil." ... either works well with an election < 1284928786 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, ^ < 1284928788 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :based on that < 1284928789 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it does < 1284928803 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: nobody says wake < 1284928804 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when you say wake < 1284928806 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people think funeral < 1284928807 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :immediately < 1284928811 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*nobody says wake in any other context < 1284928823 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hah < 1284928823 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: When you say wake, I think of that thing behind a boat. < 1284928840 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, now what would you call it? < 1284928844 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: analysing punctuation would probably work better < 1284928849 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll read the answer tomorrow. Night → < 1284928881 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Probably. All this was originally done for book authorship classification, where the data points are quite a bit larger, so simple statistics like that have less variance. < 1284928923 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :things like the punctuation mark used after a nickping would distinguish me from Vorpal straight off < 1284928969 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not often seen in books, though. I'll try to make a more IRC-specific feature set at some point. There's some punctuation frequency counts, but they're just averages over the whole set. < 1284928996 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Still, the "colon frequency" would probably be higher for people that do "nick: foo" often.) < 1284929112 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1284929120 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1284929217 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1284929308 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://zem.fi/~fis/esomap-comp.png -- well, Vorpal does have the lowest colon frequency, and he does "nick," I guess. < 1284929430 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lulz < 1284929438 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi fizzle < 1284929609 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh, hello. < 1284929620 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I never quite know how to react to greetings.) < 1284929663 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1284929682 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have fallen in love with the arm architecture < 1284929702 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the energy efficiency associated with it < 1284929762 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just image if intel applied their 22nm process to a desktop-class ARM cpu < 1284929783 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why, we could end world hunger in one swell foop! < 1284929789 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Caution: hyperbole.) < 1284929832 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION instructs fizzle to duck as he fixes to explode
< 1284929841 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION
< 1284929847 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION 3
< 1284929849 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION 2
< 1284929851 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION 1
< 1284929857 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION BOOM!!!
< 1284929995 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION sees that fizzle ducked just in time and only lost four of his eight limbs
< 1284930024 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is going to stop with the /me stuff
< 1284930032 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wonders who fizzle is.
< 1284930055 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION takes that back
< 1284930072 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION doesn't know who fizzle is either
< 1284930101 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION also thinks that we should all speak in third person about ourselves
< 1284930101 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Coincidentally, "fizzle" is what I was used to be called. < 1284930107 0 :calamari-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :solution: increase font size < 1284930124 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!~Sgeo|Empa@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1284930128 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION sees the error in his waingys/typ
< 1284930145 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is Empathy as bad as most IM clients that try to do IRC are? < 1284930171 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, this is kind of pretty, but un-irc-like < 1284930177 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has never used empathy
< 1284930185 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, /ctcp doesn't work :/ < 1284930211 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No /version command < 1284930242 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meh, I'll live, maybe < 1284930931 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@bas5-toronto47-2925351237.dsl.bell.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1284931000 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-0-138.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1284931136 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :End world hunger in the way they did at the radio, the entire universe is destroyed. And then they had news "the world no longer exists, I wanted to go to the zoo next week but I can't because neither the world nor me exist any more" < 1284931240 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: such a statement is a difficult one to make truthfully < 1284931262 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Yes it is, but that was a joke (I think it was called "Irrelevance Show" or something like that) < 1284931391 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION installs Chrome
< 1284931405 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Firefox just wastes SO MUCH screen space it isn't funny < 1284931415 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Ubuntu Software Center crashes < 1284931478 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|Empathy: You can turn off some stuff, I think, in Firefox. Or use XUL-Runner, since Vonkeror does not use up much screen space for user interface stuff, only the document you are viewing takes up most of the space of the window. < 1284931616 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|Empathy: if you press F11, then it doesn't use up any screen space but the document you're reading, the vertical scrollbar, and a few pixels at the top of the screen < 1284931717 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Chromium installed < 1284931962 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1284931975 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are the haps, my friends? < 1284931990 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1284932004 0 :augur!~augur@208-58-6-161.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1284932024 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gwibber has Digg but not Reddit? < 1284932027 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1284932041 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The horror! < 1284932253 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1284932255 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1284932263 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!~Sgeo|Empa@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1284932264 0 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1284932266 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sgeo is not empath- oh wait < 1284932358 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :empathetic < 1284932368 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: what was the end of that sentence? :P < 1284932375 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :etic < 1284932421 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<Phantom_Hoover> What are the haps, my friends? ;; this is a *so* un-you thing to say < 1284932429 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't want to have to reinstall Chromium and Flash when I restart the comp < 1284932435 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: i was making a pun on em-pathetic :P < 1284932439 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway how do you know that? < 1284932444 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you're making a diagnosis of autism < 1284932465 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: his name was Sgeo|Empathy but then he left. we know he's still Sgeo, so he must no longer be empathetic! < 1284932468 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but now hes back < 1284932477 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. < 1284932477 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also < 1284932478 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://s3.amazonaws.com/readers/2010/09/19/tapir3_1.jpg < 1284932482 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have a david mitchell tapir < 1284932485 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xDDD < 1284932495 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its nose is dripping. :| < 1284932498 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb, booting into a livecd < 1284932500 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1284932762 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Grah < 1284932772 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't cheat Meebo into telling me what my passwords are :( < 1284932853 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.246.49 JOIN :#esoteric < 1284932855 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@bas5-toronto47-1176440465.dsl.bell.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1284932858 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: david mitchell tapir has a cold. < 1284932891 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Verily. < 1284932927 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do dependently-typed languages have to be totalistic, or can they allow general recursion? < 1284932954 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"total", not "totalistic". < 1284932962 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the former; the latter implies an inconsistent type system. < 1284932963 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*totalitarian < 1284932968 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FASCIST LANGUAGES < 1284932971 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose if you don't mind type-checking taking forever and will never want to prove anything with it, it's okay. < 1284932985 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mhm. < 1284933000 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Literally forever.) < 1284933018 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC there was some plan for Epigram to have limited general recursion, but I don't know the details. < 1284933040 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"limited general" < 1284933097 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, there was a tagging system in the type system, I think. < 1284933143 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the difference between gddrescue and dd_rescue? < 1284933160 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One of them has a g, the other an underscore. < 1284933186 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :g sounds like something with a GTK gui. < 1284933241 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also, this is fizzie|Empathy speaking, and I don't like this especially much. The correct-as-I-type puts squiggles under my name.) < 1284933254 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here, the g is just GNU, I think < 1284933280 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then the difference is probably that gddrescue can check your emails in addition to reading a disk. < 1284933290 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION stopped using Empathy when he discovered it was making his real name visible in whoises.
< 1284933306 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is my real name visible in /whois < 1284933309 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I couldn't fix it easily, so I just switched to XChat. < 1284933312 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it isn't. < 1284933312 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You can change that in the "add account" preferences. < 1284933324 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why can't I use /whois from here? < 1284933350 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, what, exactly, is People Near Here? < 1284933477 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Empathy sucks as an IRC client and as a chat client in general, really. < 1284933510 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With this default theme, I'm finding it pretty hard to distinguish between who says what. < 1284933513 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I really do like the log viewer < 1284933529 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the integration with .. Ubuntu..ness < 1284933641 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<Sgeo|Empathy> Also, what, exactly, is People Near Here? < 1284933642 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :People Near Here. < 1284933713 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How does someone not on Ubuntu connect to it? < 1284933727 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They don't, probablyy. < 1284933728 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*y < 1284933775 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see a "People Near Here" anywhere. :/ < 1284933787 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh, graphical smileys, sign of civilization. < 1284933803 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: As an account type < 1284933812 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sign of populist crap < 1284933846 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a "People Nearby" account type here, I guess that's the same thing. < 1284933890 0 :aku2!~opera@85.185.37.196 JOIN :#esoteric < 1284933903 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION meant People Nearby
< 1284933911 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has joined the room
< 1284933971 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't exactly like the word "room" in an IRCy context either. < 1284933982 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the speech bubbles sure are purty. < 1284933996 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I thought this plan was foolproof!" "Foolproof yes, idiot-proof no." < 1284934011 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION dislikes how it's impossible to distinguish between someone joining/parting and someone using /me
< 1284934033 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1284934054 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has disconnected(Ping timeout: 10000000000 seconds)
< 1284934057 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dammit < 1284934064 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has disconnected (OR HAS HE)
< 1284934075 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|Empathy: Yes, that's confusing, I had to take a look in the XChat window to find out what actually happened on your "join". < 1284934100 0 :aku2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1284934124 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"No Bullwinkle, we've got to think!" "Rocky, this is no time to pick up a new hobby!" < 1284934143 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<Sgeo|Empathy> How does someone not on Ubuntu connect to it? < 1284934143 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1284934149 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just uh < 1284934150 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is it < 1284934153 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bonjour < 1284934154 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zeroconf < 1284934157 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jabber < 1284934157 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thing < 1284934158 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's an Empathy thing, not an Ubuntu thing < 1284934165 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm < 1284934168 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh? < 1284934176 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's listed as an account type < 1284934176 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something < 1284934178 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1284934181 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :other clients support it < 1284934187 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AH < 1284934189 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it may just be a libpurple thing, but no, iChat has it too < 1284934199 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, it seems to be a serverless Jabber thing. < 1284934225 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Passwordless too < 1284934244 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now, how does it work? < 1284934246 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That sort of goes hand-in-hand with the serverlessness; where would you send the password to. < 1284934271 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least there hasn't been major crashes yet < 1284934281 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zeroconf is done with multicast-DNS-driven service discovery, I assume that's how it works too. < 1284934320 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1284934343 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BRB, restarting, in the hopes that my installed software stays installed somehow < 1284934388 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastebin.com/R6pkvHBF LW is beginning to disturb me. < 1284934557 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which part, exactly? < 1284934559 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seriously, that response by EY would be more in place in a SF/horror story than any kind of rationalist discussion. < 1284934569 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, you could just link. < 1284934573 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The second post, by EY. < 1284934582 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AFAIK that thread has been deleted. < 1284934606 0 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1284934606 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1284934617 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's safe to assume EY is at least slightly autistic, and definitely ... abnormal, socially. < 1284934623 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have _no_ effing idea what they're so scared of. < 1284934635 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's some kind of sick joke going on where sometimes, it refuses to see the USB stick < 1284934641 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's part of the problem. Even if you don't agree with EY. < 1284934654 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A non-Friendly AI being created is the worst possible thing that could happen. Ever. < 1284934667 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I agree with EY there. Although I see part of his point after filtering out the rage. < 1284934672 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck, I just made one. < 1284934684 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But everyone agrees that a non-Friendly AI is the Worst Possible Thing. < 1284934701 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"everyone" ← qualify that? < 1284934719 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, anyone who's actually thought about it -- you know, rationally. < 1284934721 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Naw, a non-Friendly AI is just the next evolutionary step. At that point humans will be obsolete. < 1284934731 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We are the Borg. < 1284934737 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey now, that's not so bad: http://zem.fi/~fis/esoconfnf.png -- it's the same "features from 2000-message sets" confusion matrix, but with a different classifier than esoconff.png. < 1284934738 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: A non-Friendly AI would not become the Borg. < 1284934746 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Non-Friendly != evil; non-Friendly is worse. < 1284934749 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Hence the quote :P < 1284934769 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Borg aren't evil. < 1284934770 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A non-Friendly AI wouldn't actively decide to wipe us out, it would just see no problem with doing an action that happened to result in that, at all. < 1284934771 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just efficient. < 1284934778 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay, Chromium stayed installed! < 1284934780 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same with the Borg. < 1284934795 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, so we wouldn't see it coming, or what? < 1284934799 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Borg don't seek to destroy a species that doesn't threaten them and isn't worth assimilating. < 1284934803 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: If you said "I like paperclips" to a non-Friendly AI that listens to humans, it is *very possible* that it would just replace the entire universe with a paperclip pattern. < 1284934815 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahh, < 1284934824 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I like paperclips" -> I'm trying to make them happy -> I like paperclips means paperclips are good -> < 1284934826 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make more paperclips < 1284934837 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Best way to make more paperclips: Turn things into very small paperclips. < 1284934840 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Begin. < 1284934862 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, but surely it can reason enough to evaluate multiple factors? < 1284934874 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Elaborate. < 1284934882 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. it has a better view of the world than "paperclips". < 1284934905 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Elaborate. < 1284934911 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never said that's how it viewed the world. < 1284934915 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: have you read Creating Friendly AI? < 1284934921 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have not. < 1284934929 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not asking you to sign up to the Cult of Yudkowsky or anything, I'm just saying you should. < 1284934946 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it's pretty important that nobody defends or builds any AI which isn't some form of Friendly. < 1284934964 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!~Sgeo|Empa@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1284934979 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But AI != has power to paperclippise everything? < 1284935003 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, a computer on a desk has... limited paperclipping capability. < 1284935023 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same applies to a huge mainframe. < 1284935038 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: And that's the thing. < 1284935045 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We are presuming that the AI is self-improving, since that's the threat. < 1284935050 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahhh.. < 1284935052 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We are presuming that it surpasses human intelligence. < 1284935056 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now. < 1284935056 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A sufficiently smart might be able to persuade humans to give it what it needs < 1284935068 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How difficult would it be for a smarter-than-human AI to work up some money, and buy tech? < 1284935069 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or: < 1284935070 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sufficiently smart AI < 1284935071 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To steal the tech. < 1284935071 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So the crucial thing is that we make it friendly *before* making it self-improving? < 1284935075 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes. < 1284935082 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I get it now... < 1284935087 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because once it's smarter than us -- or even as smart as us, if it's cunning and logical -- we can't control it. < 1284935105 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.craigslist.org/about/best/phi/1755781713.html ... lawl. < 1284935105 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm... < 1284935125 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Surely nuking it while it's still vulnerable would work? < 1284935128 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I'll also just mention that a lot of very smart people have thought about this very hard for a very long time. :) < 1284935135 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Not if it's replicated itself across the globe. < 1284935144 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hence "vulnerable". < 1284935151 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yes, I see the point. < 1284935152 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: And how do you know whether it's friendly or not? < 1284935160 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'll have no hope of understanding its data banks after it's mutated them itself. < 1284935168 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it'll be moving too fast for you to tell, anyway. < 1284935178 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Surely these are all arguments against making an AI at all? < 1284935201 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you're this unsure, playing games with the whole of humanity is profoundly unethical. < 1284935204 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: A Friendly AI has no such problems. And, well, that's saying that you should stop progress before it's dangerous. < 1284935210 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We're not unsure if you get it right the first time. < 1284935212 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only if you don't. < 1284935219 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Inventing fire was dangerous. < 1284935226 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fire changed everything. What if it was for the worst? < 1284935227 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but you just said we can't tell it was friendly. < 1284935229 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Untrue. < 1284935238 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I said that it's impossible to see the looming danger if it's self-improving. < 1284935238 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<alise> Phantom_Hoover: And how do you know whether it's friendly or not? < 1284935244 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I meant to say was: < 1284935248 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1284935250 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I worded it badly. < 1284935258 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Anyway, you know you need to nuke it if you have some code and it's not Friendly. < 1284935262 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Before you even run it. < 1284935268 0 :MigoMipo_!~John@84-217-0-138.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1284935276 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendly is an actual term, not just pointlessly-capitalised. < 1284935284 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So we need to have absolute, unshakable, complete proof of Friendliness before giving it power? < 1284935298 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Before executing it < 1284935301 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Again, surely this stuff is just... obvious. < 1284935316 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|Empathy, with self-improvement, they're the same. < 1284935317 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1284935322 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<Phantom_Hoover> So we need to have absolute, unshakable, complete proof of Friendliness before giving it power? < 1284935323 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1284935337 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Eliezer was the first to give Friendliness a rigorous treatment, though. < 1284935342 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To actually define what an AI has to be to be safe. < 1284935353 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The system of supergoals and subgoals, that's all his. < 1284935393 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Anyway, yes, there is massive risk. Even if you're careful and prove it in so many ways. But if you get it right it's also the end of suffering, which is Kind of a Big Deal. < 1284935411 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://singinst.org/upload/CFAI.html < 1284935419 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is definitely a worthy read if you're at all interested in this stuff. < 1284935451 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm interested in it inasmuch as I want to stop my pathological worrying getting in the way of my life. < 1284935486 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I went through that too. Don't worry. < 1284935516 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In any case, that LW thread still seems like a fairly irrational, fearful response. < 1284935518 0 :MigoMipo__!~John@84-217-0-138.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1284935534 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, well, this stuff is scary. I didn't read the thread due to the paste being badly-formatted. < 1284935564 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, if you're that worried about nFAI, you should be doing everything to stop its slightest risk. < 1284935578 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. actively preventing AI research. < 1284935597 0 :MigoMipo_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1284935662 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No. Seriously. < 1284935667 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AI research is not bad. < 1284935672 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know that! < 1284935684 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AI or the death of civilisation seems to be more or less inevitable in the long term. < 1284935691 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes! < 1284935692 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So what you have to do is promote Friendliness. < 1284935698 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not stop AI research altogether. < 1284935704 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because if civilisation survives -- and I think it probably will... < 1284935708 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's gonna be AI. < 1284935710 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like nanotech. < 1284935710 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But deleting discussions on non-Friendliness? < 1284935723 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hopefully not like GLaDOS < 1284935726 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nobody does that. I don't know that thread on LW. Possibly it was a mistake. < 1284935731 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't that even *more* risky, if anything. < 1284935741 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although anyone outright advocating non-Friendly AI on Less Wrong is almost certain to get mauled. < 1284935746 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That thread seems to have been deleted from LW itself. < 1284935757 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On the grounds of risk to humanity. < 1284935759 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GLaDOS was friendly before someone made her schizophrenic by changing important components < 1284935770 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's like saying "Why don't we try nuclear war?" as if everyone had nuclear weaponry in their house and it just required a huge amount of intelligence to fire them. < 1284935779 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Risk to humanity -- yes, inflated, I agree. < 1284935781 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't have done it. < 1284935785 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I see where he's coming from, you know? < 1284935818 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway. < 1284935839 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, deleting discussions *on the risks* on the grounds of risk is not going to help avoid the risks, IMO. < 1284935847 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually most AI proponents think that developing nanotech is a very bad idea because of the immense destructive possibilities, and it's best to let a benevolent AI take care of developing it. < 1284935849 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Agreed. < 1284935854 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You are probably right. < 1284935859 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am just defending the reasoning behind it, not the action. < 1284935871 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not convinced that Yudkowsky actually sleeps at night. < 1284935881 0 :MigoMipo__!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1284935883 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the name of the dude that offers money to people if he, prentending to be an AI trapped on a disconnected computer, can't convince them to let him out in just a couple hours? < 1284935889 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Yudkowsky. < 1284935891 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And if he thinks an nFAI is that petty and malicious, surely the people attempting to stop its creation would be the first on its Infinite Torture List? < 1284935895 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He doesn't do it any more, I don't think. < 1284935906 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Stop what's creation? < 1284935910 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah he would eventually fail, and lose a lot of money < 1284935911 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nFAI. < 1284935918 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: But nFAI is a bad thing... < 1284935920 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. by researching Friendliness. < 1284935925 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that's my point. < 1284935926 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :People trying to stop nFAI being created are his friends... :P < 1284935931 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Yeah, all $20. < 1284935937 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: It's a thought experiment, anyway. < 1284935944 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the real situation the thing on the other end is many, many times smarter than you. < 1284935947 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it's guaranteed to win. < 1284935948 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Sgeo|Empathy < 1284935948 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could have sworn he offered more than $20 < 1284935957 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!~Sgeo|Empa@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1284935961 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Anyway, I'm going to reboot now. < 1284935962 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But he deleted that post because he thought that if an nFAI was created, it could rain down suffering on people it didn't like. < 1284935966 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOOO < 1284935968 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :baibai < 1284935971 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO < 1284935972 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1284935973 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DON'T LEAVE ME ALONE WITH MY THOUGHTS < 1284935979 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA < 1284935984 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm here for you < 1284935990 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is your thoughts speaking < 1284935994 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we need your attention < 1284936003 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't listen to any of the other voices < 1284936009 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pay attention right here < 1284936013 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, what should I do tomorrow? < 1284936021 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you lose your train of thought, you may never get it back < 1284936065 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't lose your thought of train... Don't lose your thought of train... Don't lose your thought of train... Don't lose your thought of train... Don't lose more lot of rain... < 1284936076 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :keep it on its track and don't get derailed < 1284936117 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38! < 1284936134 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tomorre do that this and the same? < 1284936160 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gah. dropped packets like no one's biz. < 1284936162 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Today is the tomorrow you worried about yesterday. < 1284936201 0 :augur!~augur@129-2-175-79.wireless.umd.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1284936348 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Extrapolating Moore's law infinitely as evidence for a singularity seems... dodgy. < 1284936378 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1284936379 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Given that we can't go much further down without bashing into fundamental constraints. < 1284936397 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially with the hard limits that have already been identified on the various Moore's Laws < 1284936445 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the fact that the good old laws of thermodynamics have *already* started to cap processor clock speeds. < 1284936458 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that one's of the limits < 1284936481 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1284936508 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, we can probably push quite a bit further, but not indefinitely. < 1284936508 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's also a hard limit imposed on transistor size, although if quantum scale gates become feasible and cost-effective, that'll go away < 1284936515 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but even then, we have a size limit < 1284936566 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :adiabatic computing could go a long way toward stepping past current heat-related limitations < 1284936577 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And there's also the jetpack effect when extrapolating into the future. < 1284936577 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's really hard to imagine where we'll get to though < 1284936592 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iiiii think we just said the same thing < 1284936621 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1284936637 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We'll be right with some things, but wrong with many, many more. < 1284936728 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's still worth consideration, since the costs and gains are so huge as to be impossible to ignore. < 1284936744 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right and happy tlapd and stuff. shouldn't have forgotted that. < 1284936823 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yarr, I be missin' TLAPD! < 1284936840 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a variation on asimov's laws that doesn't drive AIs insane? < 1284936850 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This be far more disconcertin' than any of this FAI stuff! < 1284936901 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can be a pirate and still talk about bots < 1284936928 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yarr, OK. < 1284936941 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also be thinkin' that nanotech be highly overrated. < 1284936961 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lies < 1284936976 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, why be ye sayin' this? < 1284936997 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We almost certainly won't be havin' nanoscale construction machines. < 1284937026 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1284937043 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I be thinkin ye wrong about tha < 1284937051 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it bein a matter of school pride < 1284937101 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, macroscale von Neumann probes be plausible, but packin' the complexity necessary for such a feat into nigh-molecular scales is so implausible with current technology that it be meanin'less to speculate. < 1284937122 0 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@32.164.199.255 JOIN :#esoteric < 1284937181 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alise, better to wait for some more time until I get the external mount, or as soon as possible, despite not having the external mount < 1284937188 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I be havin' a horrible feelin' that alise will start arguin' with me over this, and that not be particularly pleasant for those in the same time zone who be havin' conserrrvative sleep schedules. < 1284937209 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeoN1, he not be on right now. < 1284937236 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: why be ye callin' the lassy a he? < 1284937243 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Be ye still tryin' ta recoverrr yer hard drive? < 1284937243 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1284937252 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PH, what's your suggestion? < 1284937272 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, I not be bothered to keep track of everyone's pronoun requests. < 1284937273 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Come now, would I sell my own granny for $1,000?" "I don't know, would you?" "Of course I would!" < 1284937282 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That be my line, and I be stickin' to it. < 1284937283 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: why you callin' the laddie a lassie? < 1284937299 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeoN1, have ye got the hard drive out of tha computarrr? < 1284937308 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: arrrr, ye don't know the legend of alise, do yer? < 1284937325 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope. i hope it's a good story < 1284937335 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's been out for a while < 1284937353 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: it be best told by the girl herself < 1284937356 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, it be complex, and best be told by the 'man 'imself. < 1284937393 0 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1284937395 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow < 1284937398 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1284937398 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds confusing < 1284937406 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: clearly yer didn't be learnin' the morrral o' the tale < 1284937417 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, narr, I not be. < 1284937421 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerrrrjan < 1284937423 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*! < 1284937444 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :g'vning < 1284937461 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: and an 'earrrrty 'ello to you too! < 1284937514 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is the HD actually accumulating damage right now? < 1284937525 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shiver me timbers! < 1284937584 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeoN1, I not be knowin' < 1284937604 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it be spinnin', you can't be surrrre. < 1284937610 0 :tombom!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1284937705 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I added in PicoC into Enhanced CWEB now, so that you can define codes to run at compile time (for CTANGLE only), and you can make a function lossy$() that is executed instead of typing the identifier "lossy" into the output. And, it works. < 1284937722 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<quintopia> yeah he would eventually fail, and lose a lot of money < 1284937731 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i recall he already failed some times < 1284937741 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1284937744 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never heard that < 1284937746 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I be laughin' out loud at that. < 1284937753 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I have no plans on letting the GUI start if I have the HD just be inside the comp < 1284937754 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he just hadn't put that on the main page for the challenge < 1284937765 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it was in some comment he made < 1284937774 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yarr, be tharr a link? < 1284937792 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't recall where it was < 1284937809 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arr, that not be good enough! < 1284937838 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah it's that day again. actually it already ended here. < 1284937860 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerrrjan, be ye in GMT+1? < 1284937864 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+2 < 1284937885 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:10 < 1284937895 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Parted Magic shouldn't take that long to boot, really. < 1284937897 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'ts been over for over an hour here already; 'ts +3 here. < 1284937924 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yarr, pirates not be regarrdin' time zones! < 1284937964 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in my book, it lasts 2 days, from the moment it begins at the international date line, to the moment it ends on the other side of the same < 1284937980 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my logic bein' that a true pirate should no' claim a home port! < 1284937992 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yarr, for pirates be intarrrnational! < 1284938039 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pirates be so arrrrrrogant folk, all about making everyone talk like one. < 1284938060 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i actually would rather be a pirates of penzance type pirate < 1284938068 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i can talk like a lord gone astray < 1284938132 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: I suggest ye learn a proper West Country accent! < 1284938175 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, yarr, whar be tha West Countrrry? < 1284938186 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pirates be from tha sea! < 1284938191 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PROPAH < 1284938235 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: No, West Country is rhotic. And the stereotypical pirate accent. < 1284938247 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: So. "Prroperrr" < 1284938303 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lame < 1284938318 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was also used in Pirate of Penzance. < 1284938324 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know < 1284938333 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they were effecting it < 1284938343 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yar. < 1284938347 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretense and all < 1284938371 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want to be a dainty pirate captain < 1284938373 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or a sky pirate! < 1284938378 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like articulate jim! < 1284938390 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fine, fine. RP. < 1284938436 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yarr, ye not be a trrrue pirate! < 1284938546 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also be less surre on whetharr civilisation be survivin' than alise. < 1284938574 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By this point, a single fall would be the end for a very very very long time. Yarr. < 1284938597 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since we be usin' up all the easily accessible resources. < 1284938723 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: found a link to a discussion (with more links): http://www.reddit.com/r/science/comments/6k95z/a_transhuman_ai_would_just_convince_you_to_let_it/c04360q < 1284938828 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thanks. < 1284938897 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: On the other hand, we are leaving *around* a lot of accessible resources. < 1284938912 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :google conspires to make the mentions of failure rather hard to find if you just search for "yudkowksy aibox" :( < 1284938912 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not particularly. < 1284938926 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If civilization fell, the next civilization would have a number of things easy. < 1284938934 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(especially if you don't _know_ about the failures) < 1284938938 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For instance: metal would not need to be mined. < 1284938969 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but things like coal and oil, which fuelled our technological development, will be much harder to get. < 1284939033 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And a pile of rust, which is really all that would remain of exposed structures after a surprisingly short time, is not very useful. < 1284939082 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Coal and oil were only really primary fuels for the past, oh, hundred years. < 1284939097 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1284939123 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And even concerning coal: for many purposes, it's merely *more convenient* than the alternative. < 1284939143 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, which is also the major period of technological advance. < 1284939164 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: perhaps it will take a longer _time_ than the industrial revolution because of lack of coal and oil. but there _are_ still environmentally clean energy sources, such as windmills. < 1284939166 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We went from abacuses to quantum computers in around that timeframe. < 1284939186 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes, but it still is plausible that an alternative energy source would be found. < 1284939187 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, can you imagine the Industrial Revolution happening with windmills? < 1284939195 0 :augur!~augur@129-2-175-79.wireless.umd.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1284939215 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but is going slower even a bad thing? the breakneck speed might be why we got into this much trouble in the first place < 1284939217 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Dude, "past 100 years" *post-dates* the Industrial Revolution. < 1284939235 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dammit, yes. < 1284939238 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :History fail. < 1284939269 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But anyway, it's not at all certain that civilisation will survive on Earth. < 1284939273 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Industrial Revolution could have *easily* happened with wood instead of coal. And a lot of it was actually powered by windmills and water wheels anyways. < 1284939275 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least with humans. < 1284939286 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, I concede the point. < 1284939332 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, even assuming no alternative fuel sources could be found (not *that* likely), we'd still get up to Industrial Revolution level tech with mostly renewable/recyclable resources still left. < 1284939375 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I strongly suspect that one could build up to nuclear power from there. < 1284939421 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This AI box thing is starting to infuriate me. < 1284939445 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, what are you trying to prove by not revealing the nature of the arguments? < 1284939483 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if he were still doing it, i'd take the challenge and then reveal the arguments. < 1284939499 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought it was to prevent "I would never have fallen for that" arguments, i think he said as much < 1284939502 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i could een do it without lying, by making someone else doing the promising not to part < 1284939552 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I would never have fallen for that" _is_ a major way of human self-delusion, after all < 1284939608 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, yes, but why not *show* what he fell for? < 1284939623 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can see no rational reason not to do so. < 1284939642 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is _much_ more infuriated by the _apparent_ hiding of the failed experiments, in case you didn't guess
< 1284939650 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1284939686 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although i _suppose_ that could be just an artifact of google's pagerank < 1284939701 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also think the gatekeeper is incapable of showing anything meaningful. < 1284939715 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!~Sgeo|Empa@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1284939717 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: < 1284939719 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: < 1284939732 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EOF: < 1284939734 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EOF: < 1284939739 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: < 1284939742 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: < 1284939751 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION feels like ending this chat
< 1284939769 0 :EOF!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION feels like shooting himself
< 1284939774 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1284939777 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: but i _think_ yudkowsky's basic belief is that an AI would be so resourceful that saying you "would never have fallen for" a particular argument _is_ a dangerous delusion < 1284939798 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the AI could have used a plethora of other methods < 1284939803 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but this experiment has little to no bearing on any real situation. < 1284939818 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess that's true < 1284939826 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The point might stand; it might not. This experiment is completely useless. < 1284939835 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus we should make sure to have a friendly AI before a malevolent AI gets wise enough to convince its gatekeeper to let it out < 1284939842 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then we could have a titan clash of the AIs < 1284939851 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AI Wars! < 1284939853 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is reminded of Raindbow's End
< 1284939854 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1284939861 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exclusive to BBC 2! < 1284939875 0 :SgeoN2!~AndChat@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1284939881 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It clashes with Eastenders, so it can't go on BBC 1) < 1284939923 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know what < 1284939928 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait < 1284939937 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: a friendly AI would simply prevent an evil one from ever being built, surely < 1284939943 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can I start Ubuntu at the commandline, then from there start x? < 1284939948 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And of course, *without knowing the effing discourse between the participants, the experiment is utterly stupid* < 1284939952 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also we need a time machine so we can preemptiveill any scientists that eventually turn out to work on creating malevolent AI < 1284939964 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+li ki < 1284939969 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, malevolent != nFAI. < 1284939970 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/i/y/ < 1284939983 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It's like publishing an experiment without publishing the data. < 1284939989 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact, it *is precisely that*! < 1284939989 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: if it had the power to < 1284939991 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, exactly. < 1284940001 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not rational *at all*. < 1284940017 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :About as valid as "I have an elegant proof of this that the margin is too small to contain." < 1284940020 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The kind of thing Ben Goldacre spends ages picking apart, in fact. < 1284940038 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But don't expect them to admit it. < 1284940042 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway. < 1284940055 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION → can't sleep, AI will eat me.
< 1284940059 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: at least in this case the experimental result has been verified by several individuals, so it is somewhat more trustworthy than fermat's proof < 1284940098 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1284940122 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed, i would argue that in this case, it is like publishing the data without publishing the experiment < 1284940130 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Which is the better ddrescue? < 1284940131 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: of course yudkowsky and his ilk _are_ fanatically afraid of evil ais, psychologically so even if they are correct < 1284940137 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we know how many people fell for it, but not what the actual methodology was < 1284940153 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Still absolutely unvalid, though. < 1284940187 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: irreproducible at least, but we can imagine the techniques used at least < 1284940189 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you could suspect him of being disingenious on purpose < 1284940201 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Irreproducible == INVALID < 1284940224 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: the results are NOT invalid, they are just not confirmable. there is a subtle difference < 1284940233 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah did he leave < 1284940246 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you can't reproduce it it's invalid. < 1284940271 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No answer? < 1284940276 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they can reproduce it. it's just not independently reproducible < 1284940311 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which makes it invalid. < 1284940314 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|Empathy: his last comment was probably a humoristic way of saying he went to bed < 1284940321 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i really don't like your definition < 1284940329 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then you really don't like science. < 1284940340 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1284940344 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION didn't even see it
< 1284940350 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't even follow < 1284940350 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1284940355 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I can just go into the console when X is starting, I guess < 1284940359 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo|Empathy: hey i did the same thing :D < 1284940387 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess, before doing anything else, I should figure out the exact commands I'll be using < 1284940405 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't invalidate a result by not explaining what the result was. it's still a result. it just isn't a widely understood one. < 1284940416 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Their claims are as scientifically legitimate as publishing data purpoting that saying magic words (they won't say which) summons God 10 times out of 10. < 1284940453 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in other words, possibly completely legitimate and valid, but we'll never know if that's the case < 1284940460 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly what i was saying < 1284940468 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Precisely. And that *makes it invalid*. < 1284940482 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's no reason to not let X load while I do the ddrescue stuff, right? < 1284940486 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and not knowing whether god exists makes god not exist? < 1284940491 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all agnostics are atheists? < 1284940511 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :correct != valid < 1284940514 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It makes it invalid *as an experiment*. < 1284940535 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An experiment can readily have correct results while still being invalid. < 1284940548 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Much like a proof can have correct results while still being invalid. < 1284940557 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this confuses me greatly. how is it that an invalid experiment could *suddenly become valid* just as soon as its results are published? < 1284940580 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i could see an unconfirmed but valid experiment being confirmed valid on this occasion < 1284940584 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: It depend what you meant by "agnostics" or "atheists", but I consider it different. < 1284940595 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as well as an unconfirmed invalid experiment being confirmed invalid < 1284940603 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not invalid->valid < 1284940616 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also consider different that the different athesists and different agnostics even have different opinions of their own atheism/agnosticism. < 1284940620 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: can i get on your speech analysis plot? < 1284940627 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I myself, am agnostic, if it cares) < 1284940648 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: I have no speech analysis plot. If I make one though, everyone relevant will be on it (including you). < 1284940657 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: In order to be valid as an experiment, it *must be testable*. This is about as essential to science as the idea that reality can be observed. < 1284940660 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oshit < 1284940689 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: this is a tewstable hypothesis, and it has been tested. independently verifiable != testable < 1284940691 0 :Sgeo|Empathy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Should I set "Spin down hard disks when possible"? < 1284940691 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Without being testable, an experiment might as well be the rantings of a drunk hobo. < 1284940698 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You are correct about experiments. If the experiment does nothing, how can you do anything relevant with it? < 1284940707 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: who was it who posted the speech analysis plots :/ < 1284940727 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Look it up in the logs, I don't remember either < 1284940737 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Independently verifiable is a necessary but not sufficient condition of being testable. < 1284940764 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: indeed, if an independent group can replicate their results using their own slightly-different methods, would the experiments together still be collectively invalid to you? < 1284940776 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If they don't publish their methods? < 1284940781 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1284940786 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As far as I'm concerned, it's a second group of drunk hobos.