< 1289347293 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: More seriously, I think it'll be pretty cool. Although would you be freaked out by programs you compile ending up using a different libc to the rest of the system? 'Cause if so, well. < 1289347306 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :libc is just another library :P < 1289347308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: (Static linking = just because a new libc comes out, doesn't mean I'm recompiling every fucking package) < 1289347321 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but I will package the new libc) < 1289347330 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(so, you know, feel free) < 1289347336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(to recompile the entire system) < 1289347359 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll only like it if you use something like my Separated Packages System :P < 1289347365 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what epic argument did I join in the midst of? < 1289347369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cal153: none at all < 1289347373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Link me to that again, I forget the specifics. < 1289347380 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do I have a link for it? X-D < 1289347385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: It had a web page! < 1289347396 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: With at least ONE example! < 1289347401 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/projects/trac/sps/ < 1289347410 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: It was not Trac! It in fact had no CSS at all! < 1289347414 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: But this will do :P < 1289347432 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I have actually updated it since then. I rewrote it from scratch at least once. < 1289347435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Right, that horrible piece of bloat :) < 1289347435 0 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1289347460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: More seriously, I don't think I'll have a /usr. So, you know, you'll be messing with what / is. Which is, good luck. < 1289347470 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, needs a /usr :P < 1289347480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Well, feel free to create a /usr. And run SPS on it. I might even package it. < 1289347491 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: You'll have to port it from apt-get though, which should be trivial :P < 1289347500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Semi-relevant: < 1289347501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ ls /opt < 1289347501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bash-4.1 emacs-23.2 nginx-0.8.53 ruby-1.9.2-p0 < 1289347501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CLC-INTERCAL-1.-94.-2 ick-0.-2.0.29 perl-5.12.2 zsh-4.3.10 < 1289347501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :egobf-0.7.1 nasm-2.09.03 Python-2.7 < 1289347513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: All installed from HTTP URLs to tarballs and nothing else :P < 1289347519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(inst(1)) < 1289347524 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, it's versioned! < 1289347533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.nongnu.org/sps/ this was the page < 1289347550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: At least you've abandoned D. < 1289347559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I note that your source repository is remarkably empty for SPS. < 1289347562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Notably, it lacks: SPS. < 1289347570 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a good language with a community that's shit itself. < 1289347588 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Uhh, you mean http://codu.org/projects/sps/hg/ ? < 1289347612 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What language? < 1289347614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: It's a bad language with a bad toolchain and a community that has been blinded by the gigantic ejaculate of shittiness so that they can no longer see how crap their whole environment is, and patiently explain how to massage the crap into something vaguely usable to anyone who asks. < 1289347628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: No, I meant the Trac source viewer, which inexplicably has files in it :P < 1289347631 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a GOOD language. At least D1 was. < 1289347638 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: 'Snot. 'S like C++. < 1289347645 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'snot! < 1289347646 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, what language? < 1289347651 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Okay, that IS the repo I was seeing. < 1289347654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it has no SPS :P < 1289347654 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: D. < 1289347659 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed! :P < 1289347665 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ignore SPS X-P < 1289347750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: To be honest, SPS is entirely useless for libraries because of static linking :P < 1289347836 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: As far as needing various versions of *binaries*, well... how often do you actually have that need, seriously? Enough to build an entire system around? :P < 1289347848 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: (Is putting a symlink named "gcc" somewhere in a temporary $PATH so difficult?) < 1289347871 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It's spiritually based on a system they used at Intel. < 1289347876 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For a normal system it's totally useless :P < 1289347896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Yeah, I'm sure systems as fucked up as Intel will migrate to Kitten right away :P < 1289347902 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And expect everything to work out of the box, too! :D < 1289347926 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I <3 the mountains < 1289347932 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: I <3 poop < 1289347941 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wrong answer < 1289347948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Says the coprophiliac. < 1289347981 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://bits.ohloh.net/attachments/5031/logo-caca.png < 1289347992 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is indeed libcaca's logo. < 1289348048 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :used to be < 1289348060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, they changed it. Slightly. < 1289348132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I just realised the Kitten release day will be plagued by your silly complaints :P < 1289348254 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :link to Kitten? < 1289348259 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: (Unless you like it and promise to use it forever, and then I'll just have to deal with your bug reports) < 1289348274 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :calamari: file:///home/ehird/mind-fifo < 1289348278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also ~/kitten for stuff I'm hacking on) < 1289348283 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1289348283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Err, not fifo. Device file. < 1289348289 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :calamari: http://www.webdesign.org/img_articles/7072/BW-kitten.jpg < 1289348316 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you kill it? :( < 1289348327 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, God did. < 1289348337 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1289348493 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if Huckabee wins and puts God into the constitution, what does that mean for us godless sinners? < 1289348508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :calamari: It means no kittens. < 1289348515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, nothing (apart from the ones who live in the US). < 1289348524 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: How STRONG is your hate for ksh? < 1289348543 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :calamari, I would hope that Congress wouldn't vote any such amendment in < 1289348563 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1289348578 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Less than bash or zsh, more than csh? < 1289348591 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm < 1289348591 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah well I'd hope that the president can't choose to kill any citizen he wants to with no oversight, but that can happen < 1289348592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: You... hate ksh more than csh? < 1289348593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-P < 1289348594 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That was all backwards < 1289348602 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: More than bash or zsh, less than csh? < 1289348604 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: ?hsc naht... no, I still don't get it. < 1289348627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: WELL TOUGH! cuz it totally (will) (use)[s] pdksh by default. < 1289348637 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: or emacs :-D < 1289348642 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Pretty Damn Kute Shell < 1289348678 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :public domain ksh actually :P < 1289348686 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shit shell is still supreme < 1289348694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Well, actually, it's more likely to be the portable version of the OpenBSD ksh. < 1289348711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: (Or mksh) < 1289348764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.delilinux.de/oksh/ < 1289348764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://github.com/dryfish/openbsd-pdksh < 1289348765 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.wormhole.hu/~ice/ksh/ < 1289348767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh the choices... < 1289348817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"To use mksh, you only need the C runtime (and any supplemental libraries the binary was linked against) and, optionally, /bin/ed" < 1289348841 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The first example is using BSD paxtar (MirOS BSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD®), or < 1289348841 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : “bsdtar” (DragonFly); the second and third use cpio(1) or pax(1) and are < 1289348841 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : for most operating systems; the fourth is for Debian." ;; there are exactly three examples listed < 1289349081 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Aw man, I'll definitely have to include GNU make. < 1289349109 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MUAHAHAHAHA < 1289349118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Unless you know of a make that's gompatible :P < 1289349133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"pymake: A mostly GNU-compatible python implementation of `make`" < 1289349137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOOGLING THIS REASSURES ME < 1289349147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, it's for Mozilla. < 1289349151 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, slightly more inspired :P < 1289349154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"# Parallel builds (-j > 1) are not yet supported" < 1289349156 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Inspiration utterly drained < 1289349251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ This option makes grep, sed etc handle rare corner cases │ < 1289349251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ (embedded NUL bytes and such). This makes code bigger and uses │ < 1289349251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ some GNU extensions in libc. You probably only need this option │ < 1289349251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ if you plan to run busybox on desktop. │ < 1289349259 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like how I want that but can't if I'm not going to use glibc :P < 1289349303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WJW: < 1289349304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ Store usage messages in compressed form, uncompress them on-the-fly │ < 1289349305 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ when --help is called. │ < 1289349384 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why would... maybe I shouldn't bother being part of this channel < 1289349405 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But why would things like handling embedded NUL bytes require extens... Oh. C string suckiness. Right < 1289349516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I certainly can't find the option to have all applets as separate binaries. < 1289349592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ Line editing code uses on-stack buffers for storage. │ < 1289349592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ Symbol: FEATURE_EDITING_MAX_LEN [=1024] │ < 1289349598 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x_x < 1289349644 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1289349724 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, bought minecraft yet? < 1289349735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Ehm, too busy Kittening. Which would you prefer? :P < 1289349750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Right now I'm trying to coerce busybox to build a lot of little binaries rather than one gigantic one. < 1289349772 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I would prefer that you made a giant kitten model in minecraft. Or implemented kitten on that ALU in minecraft! < 1289349777 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which appears impossible < 1289349782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: There's a CPU now. < 1289349787 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1289349788 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah < 1289349800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It had a whopping 8 bytes of RAM, which is apparently going to be doubled. < 1289349812 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, could take a lot of work < 1289349817 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also chunk issues < 1289349825 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Not really, it's just tedious (copying the blocks). < 1289349828 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course if you used an editor... < 1289349837 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah indeed < 1289349842 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You should exclusively support x86_64. < 1289349856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: And then what of all the other machines? < 1289349864 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Screw them. < 1289349872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You do realise that all good ThinkPads were 32-bit? < 1289349884 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about ARM < 1289349894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: screw ARM. no really, screw ARM :P < 1289349897 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Everyone knows there can only be one architecture. < 1289349902 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, hah < 1289349906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You can't make "an ARM OS", you have to make 50 ARM OSes pretending to be one. < 1289349939 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, um you could just put the custom code in one place? < 1289349946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"a minimal static blog generator written using old-school unix tools (make, ksh, m4, awk, procmail and a pinch of elisp)" < 1289349954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make okay, ksh okay, m4 okay, awk okay, ... procmail?! < 1289349956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... elisp?!?!?! < 1289349957 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1289349960 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ? < 1289349980 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I mean, linux pretends to be not only x86 and x86_64, but also ARM and what not < 1289349983 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ! < 1289349993 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I do not understand your words. :P < 1289350020 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Gaah, why did you make my brain believe BusyBox would be nice and simple; the damn thing has an implementation of dpkg! < 1289350024 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: You can't make "an ARM OS", you have to make 50 ARM OSes pretending to be one. <-- so linux is more than 50 OSes (remember the other arches) pretending to be one? < 1289350034 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I never intended to imply it was simple at all :P < 1289350035 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not. < 1289350047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Except that ARM is wildly inconsistent since it's, like, the most popular CPU around and isn't even one consistent architecture :P < 1289350059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And at least x86/64 implies something vaguely like an IBM PC in some ways. < 1289350060 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm true < 1289350068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that meaning x86/x86_64) < 1289350069 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, there were non-PCs < 1289350075 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, based on x86 < 1289350076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but you can't boot i386 Linux on them :P < 1289350088 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it supports some of them < 1289350089 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc < 1289350108 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, some weird 32-bit NUMA system and so on < 1289350128 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Xen :P < 1289350146 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that is special < 1289350153 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, night → < 1289350155 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UML! < 1289350156 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Fuck BusyBox, I already have one hellishly deep configuration set to work out (Linux) :P < 1289350209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Now you are legally required to point me to something that isn't BusyBox (or gnu coreutils) :P < 1289350229 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.google.com/search?q=heirloom+toolchest < 1289350235 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You can boot i386 Linux on those odd-ball architectures. < 1289350241 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You just have to build the kernel for them. < 1289350247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Yeah, I know what Heirloom is. It's what Sgeo would do, if he grew up on UNIX. < 1289350256 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I am not aiming for nostalgia, old Unix sucked and that's the truth :P < 1289350266 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I would like to claim the UNIX typo there was intentional.) < 1289350347 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, then BSD. < 1289350358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-rwxr-xr-x 1 elliott elliott 937K Nov 10 00:50 busybox < 1289350360 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Look at that crap! < 1289350363 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Okay, so that's dynamic glibc.) < 1289350365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And gcc.) < 1289350375 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And it probably contains all sorts of useless crap I didn't have the patience to disable.) < 1289350384 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the point of keeping the old algorithms (which are somewhat invisible) intact, but removing some nostalgia-inducing limitations? < 1289350397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I tried compiling the FreeBSD core utilities on OS X once -- the same damn OS, you will recall. < 1289350401 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: FIRE AND MOTHERFUCKIN' BRIMSTONE. < 1289350407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That code is soooooooo not portable. < 1289350415 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wait, this is actually for "real work"? < 1289350421 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: How 'bout NetBSD! < 1289350425 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION mindboggles
< 1289350426 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Linux: Of course it runs NetBSD!" < 1289350434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1289350441 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^faq Linux < 1289350444 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^netbsd Linux < 1289350446 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1289350447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^help < 1289350447 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ ; ^def ; ^show [command]; lang=bf/ul, code=text/str:N; ^str 0-9 get/set/add [text]; ^style [style]; ^bool < 1289350457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: What did I call that command, again? < 1289350470 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1289350480 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1289350490 0 :EgoBot!~EgoBot@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1289350605 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TIME FOR A VOTE < 1289350608 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shoo-in or shoe-in? < 1289350618 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the latter, like "shoe in the door" < 1289350624 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But apparently other people think the former. < 1289350634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I thought it was the latter but apparently "not" http://www.wsu.edu/~brians/errors/shoe-in.html < 1289350639 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A race horse so fast that you can merely shoo it across the finish line rather than having to urge it on with stronger measures is a “shoo-in”: an easy winner. It is particularly unfortunate when this expression is misspelled “shoe-in” because to “shoehorn” something in is to squeeze it in with great difficulty. < 1289350659 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think shoe-in has overtaken in the public consc... consciousness of the small portion of the public that says that. < 1289350667 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shoot-in < 1289350694 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: That description of unfortunateitude makes no sense, since it ignores the expression "shoe in the door" ... < 1289350710 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: THARS PRESCRIPTIVISM FOUR YAR < 1289350745 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prescriptivists suck. And not in the good way. I'm spelling it "shoe-in" just to be anti-prescriptivist ... in a prescriptivist kind of way. < 1289350760 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll prescribe YOUR ivist. < 1289350968 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Wikipedia trying to counter our argument for little-endian systems because of some misguided notion of neutrality: "On the other hand, in some situations it may be useful to obtain an approximation of a multi-byte or multi-word value by reading only its most-significant portion instead of the complete representation; a big-endian processor may read such an approximation using the same base-addr < 1289350968 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ess that would be used for the full value." < 1289350972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if anyone has ever used that ever :P < 1289351033 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah, nice nonsense hypothetical there :P < 1289351521 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: your wiki reign is finally over < 1289351525 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: nethackwiki just moved off wikia < 1289351531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :onto the NAO server < 1289351559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now let's watch wikia do their usual thing and try and split the community < 1289351577 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nethackwiki should totes be a Hackiki :P < 1289351598 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[Wikia staff members (ie Sannse) have been deleting ANY post which mentions eyestrain or headaches on the community blogs. There have been several ophthalmologists from Britain who've posted that the skin has caused eyestrain to those who have dominant right eyes, and that the eyestrain could easily cause a headache. All posts were deleted with the reason being "spam".]] < 1289351603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is absolutely insane, Wikia. < 1289351608 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :First it was "wiki host". < 1289351612 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm an admin there too < 1289351614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then it was "we made a new skin. FUCK YOU, YOU WILL LIKE IT." < 1289351645 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then it was "don't like it? Moving off? We refuse to give you anything, and we WILL continue using your URL and name and promoting it over yours. Also, we registered [yourwiki].com because fuck you. You can't have it. [This actually happened]" < 1289351659 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now it's "Expert? Think we're damaging eyes? FUCK. YOU." < 1289351669 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I did get someone more experienced with such moves to help contribute advice < 1289351677 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And elliott still has me blocked < 1289351686 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION plays websplat on the Nethack wiki.
< 1289351708 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, get elliott to either unignore me or read the logs of just now < 1289351709 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What, http://nethackwiki.com/wiki/Main_Page? < 1289351713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hardly many images. < 1289351716 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: any new havenworks scores? < 1289351729 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: None better than what'd been done before :P < 1289351743 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :CheckLogs < 1289351746 0 :CheckLogs!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo < 1289351754 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Nice attempt :P < 1289351756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Did Mr. Inhuman play again? < 1289351759 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, I saw that nick change. < 1289351763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why, I'm not sure. < 1289351847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(15:56:29 * Sgeo is just glad humanity hasn't been sterilized <-- wut) < 1289351866 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SG-1 "2010" reference < 1289351868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :15:36:59 A ... geeky person I know seems to have found an issue with common definitions of turing-complete < 1289351876 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I added two configured channels now < 1289351878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hardly; ais523 has been over all these ambiguities with his proof. < 1289351891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's as far as I'm reading :P < 1289351907 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was hoping you'd be reading my response to the wiki stuff >.> < 1289351928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :17:18:27 I was hoping you'd be reading my response to the wiki stuff >.> < 1289351929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You said one line < 1289351949 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2 < 1289351975 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is elliott having trouble counting without Captain Obvious? < 1289352000 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott should take some C&O lessons < 1289352019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: ? < 1289352036 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: combinatorics & optimization < 1289352037 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a field of math < 1289352045 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: [[In Related languages section, after the phrase "Many people at various times have tried to extend brainfuck to make it easier to program in", I would like to delete "but such efforts have been compared to trying to make a luxury car by gluing parts onto a skateboard" and put in this place "BrainSub is the first one to achieve this goal in 2007"; unless someone have reasons to not to do this c < 1289352046 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hange. What do you think? Aacini 03:50, 18 July 2007 (UTC)]] < 1289352049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Yes, I am not sure why you said that. < 1289352051 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He needs to learn to count first < 1289352075 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: laaaaaaaaaaaaaaaawl < 1289352091 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: no, that's where he goes to learn to count < 1289352102 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right, elliott has Sgeo on /ignore < 1289352107 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why he doesn't get it < 1289352131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh :P < 1289352156 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This BrainSub person is an idiot :P < 1289352181 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No shit :P < 1289352189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GERDNIGHT; FLUTBAI < 1289352191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1289352296 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's put COBOL in a modern runtime! Oh, wait, that's been done for real. For serious reasons. < 1289352321 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :COBOL.NET and BrainSub were made by the same person! < 1289352329 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can't you see? < 1289352494 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1289352710 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think Gregor has his ignore list hardlinked to elliott's < 1289352724 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nope < 1289352731 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Acting like it sometimes though < 1289354004 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION catches the end of Time's Arrow
< 1289354540 0 :Sasha!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1289354723 0 :Sasha!~WHAT@97-124-32-225.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1289355014 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86-rdmsoft [XULRunner 1.9.2.12/20101026210630] < 1289355364 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION immediately notes an averted trope in this SGU episode
< 1289355372 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, hmm < 1289355448 0 :Sasha!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :B0NERS? < 1289355541 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The ship did not stop moving when engines went off < 1289355554 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to watch this season < 1289355562 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when is the hiatus? < 1289355622 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm? Not sure < 1289355763 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wikipedias it
< 1289355805 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm.. 3 weeks from now < 1289355810 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION debates torrenting now vs. then
< 1289356199 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1289356321 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it possible to torrent now, and then later only the relevant episodes? < 1289356407 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That sentence makes no sense, but I THINK you're talking about downloading only particular files via *torrent, which you can do with certain clients. < 1289356416 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Such as most clients, for example. < 1289356901 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This episode is somewhat painful < 1289356922 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just.. plot hole wise. Or maybe I don't remember some previous episodes well enough < 1289357147 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: it is < 1289357152 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that requires getting two torrents < 1289357242 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow. Car manufacturers design 3 different versions of their cars: US, rest of the world right-hand-drive, rest of the world left-hand-drive. < 1289357279 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because, just to be contrary (honest, *just to be contrary*), our safety standards are completely different from every other countries'. < 1289357294 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and incompatible) < 1289357344 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :waitwhat < 1289357358 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually just to be incompatible? < 1289357362 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1289357374 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds so very american < 1289357375 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The world safety standards came *before* the US ones. < 1289357380 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :examples of incompatibilities? < 1289357400 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The types of headlights mandated in the rest of the world are banned in the US. < 1289357408 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahaha < 1289357412 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow < 1289357495 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, US safety standards are based around increasing safety without increasing cost appreciably. < 1289357499 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And yet these Zenon (or whateverTV) bulbs are allowed? < 1289357499 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wait, are they actually Xenon? < 1289357502 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, actual Xenon? < 1289357512 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's bad about Xenon? < 1289357514 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it was just some brand name, never occurred to me that it may not be X-D < 1289357545 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, the ultra bright bulbs? < 1289357551 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Xenon bulbs are so fucking bright that they blind everyone unlucky enough to be in their path. So the driver may be able to see the pedestrian (unless he's blinded by the glare), but the pedestrian is blind. < 1289357616 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're only supposed to use them in certain conditions, I think < 1289357625 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although, drivers being drivers... < 1289357639 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: In the rest of the world, such headlights require lens cleaners and automatic beam levelling for the purpose of reducing the glare and blinding. < 1289357646 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: In the US, such things are optional. < 1289358107 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SGU SPOILER IN TRAILER FOR NEXT EPISODE FFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU < 1289358166 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My memory < 1289358172 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1289358174 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never watch those < 1289358184 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'s already editing it to make me wonder if I misremembered and maybe they said something else < 1289358205 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And of course, it's possible that what I heard happen doesn't happen for "real" < 1289358215 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and US safety standards also have the effect of reducing fuel efficiency *while* decreasing safety. < 1289358218 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bravo. Bravo. < 1289358227 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, how so? < 1289358234 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: but it costs no more, right? < 1289358240 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what's important! < 1289358279 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: The safety standards require less safe and less fuel-efficient designs. < 1289358297 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stargate Wiki: FFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUU even more < 1289358305 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: LOL < 1289358310 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you aren't caught up < 1289358313 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you went to a wiki < 1289358314 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHY < 1289358314 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In particular, our mandate for 1940s headlight designs up until the early 90s made creating aerodynamic cars almost impossible. < 1289358317 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am caught up < 1289358325 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1289358331 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then wth did the wiki do? < 1289358337 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We motherfucking hate logic. < 1289358353 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"**** will have a *-episode story arc" < 1289358366 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ah < 1289358385 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although actually, the given number doesn't quite match ... um, actuality < 1289358388 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AFAICT < 1289358394 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think < 1289358444 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, n-episode might mean she's not involved in every episode < 1289358445 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm < 1289358455 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So the n only includes episode's she's in? < 1289358484 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is confused
< 1289358502 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still, I heard what I heard. And that n is a small number < 1289358516 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Crud < 1289358523 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I gave away more than I intended to < 1289358644 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :US classification of weapons makes no fucking sense. < 1289358684 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All GPS receivers capable of functioning above 18km altitude and 515 m/s are considered weapons under US law. < 1289358712 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahah < 1289358719 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has no use for such a devic... _capable_?
< 1289358719 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about Galileo receivers? < 1289358734 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As such, all consumer GPS receivers have code for disabling that. < 1289358749 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Yes, *capable*. < 1289358784 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had this missile lying around, and I wanted to target a specific location, so I got a GPS. Sadly, they disabled the ability to work under the conditions I need. < 1289358788 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: No such stupidity. < 1289358798 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Doesn't stop cruise missiles. < 1289358807 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Just ballistic missiles. < 1289358822 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm pretty sure someone with a ballistic missile could make a GPS receiver. < 1289358829 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed < 1289358854 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doesn't the military have the ability to disable GPS or something? < 1289358864 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That was removed iirc < 1289358867 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Yes. < 1289358891 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Actually, they just disabled the feature that gives the military higher accuracy than consumer devices. < 1289358904 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1289358915 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: They can still selectively *disable* GPS in a region except for the US military. < 1289358931 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a < 1289359215 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, awesome. Soviet Russia did a global navigation satellite system as well. < 1289359218 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It still functions. < 1289359228 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course it does < 1289359232 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nobody took it down < 1289359253 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It fell into disrepair in the 90s, but Russia committed to restoring it by 2010 back in 2000. < 1289359332 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did they succeed? < 1289359358 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It covered the world once again in September. < 1289359370 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Had full coverage of Russia earlier. < 1289359434 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do sattelites manage to have full coverage of exactly one area of the globe for a significant period of time? < 1289359435 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're also about to launch more satellites that will broadcast on the same frequencies as GPS, GALILEO, Compass, et al. < 1289359454 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(so that a multistandard receiver would be easier) < 1289359493 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hypothetically, could someone launch a satellite that sends fake GPS or GALILEO signals? < 1289359544 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Actually, it's more that each satellite has coverage of a *path*. Full coverage in an area involves being able to access more than one satellite at the same time 24/7, by having the paths intersect just right. < 1289359575 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1289359599 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Not very well. One of the things that those satellites do is broadcast information about *all* the satellites (rough orbital path, general system health, etc.). < 1289359786 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And how they actually get the positioning down is by each satellite having an atomic clock and broadcasting a time signal. < 1289359884 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Account for the speed of light, you get the distance from each satellite, triangulate, voila. < 1289359904 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I assume the receiver calculates where each sattelite should be? Where does that part occur? < 1289359945 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It knows the orbital path of each satellite. < 1289359955 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it got told by all the satellites. < 1289359980 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you said "rough" orbital path < 1289360035 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The satellite also broadcasts its own orbital path as accurately as can be measured. < 1289360074 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1289360111 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does the receiver have much use for the excess information (path of other satellites)? < 1289360140 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Makes it easier to find the other satellites. < 1289360164 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And know if some satellites are bogus. < 1289360694 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Defintion of "weapon of mass destruction" is also quite bad. Certainly more broad than the classical definition of "ABC". < 1289360887 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or even the extended defintion of CBRN... < 1289361006 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And why is encryption a form of weaponry? < 1289361014 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck the US. < 1289361015 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wonder if the GPS receivers are hardened against bogus data (systems receiving "trusted" data might not be)... < 1289361051 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd imagine consumer receivers aren't, but military receivers are. < 1289361065 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There was some STB that could be hung quite badly by sending random garbage as data... < 1289361096 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Intentionally bogus data is even worse than random garbage. < 1289361140 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The reason for that guess is simple: the military gives a shit about their systems always working, and consumer electronics manufacturers give a shit about saving pennies. < 1289361665 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Surely it's a matter of software to do some checking? < 1289361690 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I guess development time does cost money, so < 1289361713 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see how it's not basically a one-time cost though < 1289361843 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Remember: business is run by cheap-ass bastards. < 1289361952 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*cheap ass-bastards < 1289362028 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1289362031 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if you could dye your hair a color that no human has, but is subtle enough the people wouldn't immediately recognize it as fake. < 1289362131 0 :augur!~augur@208-59-167-26.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1289362468 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION learns about the Nuclear Football
< 1289362650 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1289362916 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1289364768 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello. Welcome to ;jaljsdfa;lsjfwijf.0wjt.4wtj42q3t1t3ji0gjehjNO CARRIERljq3;4tlj,,v;tc.-0935-91324`;skv a,ijgrntwerjk; < 1289366084 0 :Ilari_an1rcomp!~user@2002:5870:32ae::1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1289366177 0 :yiyus__!1242712427@je.je.je JOIN :#esoteric < 1289366189 0 :Ilari_!~user@2002:5870:32ae:1:4261:86ff:fe96:fca JOIN :#esoteric < 1289366201 0 :mycrofti1!~ircguy@h69-128-47-242.mdsnwi.dedicated.static.tds.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1289366230 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1289366230 0 :yiyus_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1289366230 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1289366230 0 :Ilari_antrcomp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1289366230 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1289366230 0 :mycroftiv!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1289366231 0 :fizzie`!fis@iris.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1289366294 0 :Ilari_an1rcomp!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Ilari_antrcomp < 1289366295 0 :Ilari_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Ilari < 1289366714 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1289367598 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can GraphicsMagick with with MIFF format? < 1289368084 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1289368593 0 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 JOIN :#esoteric < 1289369421 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1289369998 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1289370623 0 :augur!~augur@208.58.6.161 JOIN :#esoteric < 1289371212 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-13-116.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1289371463 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1289371831 0 :fizzie`!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :fizzie < 1289374222 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1289374599 0 :Slereah!~butt@ANantes-259-1-103-17.w92-139.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1289374803 0 :jcp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1289374895 0 :jcp!~jw@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1289374999 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1289375489 0 :wareya_!~wareya@cpe-74-70-142-220.nycap.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1289375648 0 :wareya!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1289375999 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1289376000 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1289376005 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott (for log reading): yellow text: "NP is not in P!" XD < 1289376013 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt he has proof < 1289376049 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if he did, would it give him more money to write the paper or work on minecraft? < 1289376080 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl < 1289376238 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Millennium prize for "P ? NP" is $1M; minecraft.net says "579053 purchases" at the moment, so with 9.95 EUR/purchase, that's gross profits of about $7.9M. Of course it's anyone's guess how large a percentage of that will be burned by the startup company; probably pretty large. < 1289376260 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86-rdmsoft [XULRunner 1.9.2.12/20101026210630] < 1289377643 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, heh < 1289377731 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, NP has a strange name considering it isn't known to not be in P < 1289377780 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'unno, it's not N for "non", after all. < 1289377898 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah wait, I'm still half asleep < 1289377904 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that explains it < 1289378125 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, bbl (university) < 1289378167 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.salon.com/technology/how_the_world_works/2010/11/09/john_shimkus_god_and_noah < 1289378171 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: your government is fucked up < 1289378210 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh... If there is problem in NEXPTIME that's not in EXPTIME, then NP does not equal P. < 1289379558 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1289379612 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1289379845 0 :Slereah!~butt@ANantes-259-1-131-125.w92-139.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1289380994 0 :Decarabia!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1289381152 0 :Decarabia!~root@S010600240171528a.ed.shawcable.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1289386769 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1289386942 0 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs186230.pp.htv.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1289395644 0 :sftp!~sftp@79.174.50.208 JOIN :#esoteric < 1289397166 0 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1289398153 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Actually it is "non" ... non-deterministic anyway :P < 1289398177 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, if you want to be a PEDANTIC PEDANTY PEDAN about it. < 1289398192 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pee-dan. < 1289398278 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*pedo < 1289398854 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1289398867 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:39:58 Can GraphicsMagick with with MIFF format? < 1289398868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1289398885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:00:05 elliott (for log reading): yellow text: "NP is not in P!" XD < 1289398886 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :link < 1289398901 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:03:58 The Millennium prize for "P ? NP" is $1M; minecraft.net says "579053 purchases" at the moment, so with 9.95 EUR/purchase, that's gross profits of about $7.9M. Of course it's anyone's guess how large a percentage of that will be burned by the startup company; probably pretty large. < 1289398906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PayPal take a LOT of it. < 1289399152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:50:06 And why is encryption a form of weaponry? < 1289399152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:50:14 Fuck the US. < 1289399154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :non-US countries have that < 1289399275 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PayPal merchant rate says it's (2.9 %+$0.30) per transaction by default, (1.9%+$0.30) for the "merchant rate" with >$100k monthly payments. Then there's a +1% cross-border fee, and +2.5% currency-conversion fee that I guess quite often would apply to someone in Sweden accepting money in EUR. And maybe other hidden fees; still, I don't think they can conceivably eat more than, say, a third. < 1289399295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rich bastard :) < 1289399332 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think quite a few indie-ish game-developers are feeling the envy. I know at least one. :p < 1289399584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Hell, I'm jealous of my indie-game-developer-blah friend, and he only makes on the order of thousands. < 1289399595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But then his games take a lot less work to make than Minecraft. :P) < 1289399801 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"A ′′symmetric algorithm′′ employing a key length in excess of 56 bits" is part of the EU-wide export control restrictions; see the 269 pages of Regulation 428/2009 at http://trade.ec.europa.eu/doclib/docs/2009/june/tradoc_143390.pdf < 1289399833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How to deal with crypto export laws when publishing open source software on the Internet: Ignore them. :p < 1289399840 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are all kinds of exceptions, of course. < 1289399847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Although put some kind of "If this is illegal for you then, welp" notice there.) < 1289399877 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You are allowed to put strong encryption into a DVB set as long as it is "exclusively used for sending the billing or programme-related information back to the broadcast providers". < 1289399912 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also okay are things that are "specially designed and limited for banking use or ’money transactions’". < 1289399964 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A subnote of 5A002 Note d clarifies that "settlement of fares" is a type of money transaction. < 1289400049 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And mobile phones as long as they can only talk directly into the network operator's hardware, and can't do end-to-end encryption. < 1289400055 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh. < 1289400095 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also good: "Portable or mobile radiotelephones and similar client wireless devices for civil use, that implement only published or commercial cryptographic standards (except for anti-piracy functions, which may be non-published) and also meet the provisions of paragraphs b. to d. of the Cryptography Note ..." < 1289400096 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1289400130 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a long long document. < 1289400157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: "Crypto is weaponry, unless you use it for things you'd use crypto for." < 1289400161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Summaris'd < 1289400165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Summarise'd?) < 1289400185 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Personal area network" things that involve only "published or commercial" standards are exempt as long as "the cryptographic capability is limited to a nominal operating range not exceeding 30 metres according to the manufacturer’s specifications". < 1289400204 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Sorry, you can't ship this: the crypto goes three metres too far." < 1289400226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1289400397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plan: Hijack fizzie's laptop server. Use copious disk space to store Kitten packages. < 1289400398 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1289400408 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(TODO: Find out how much disk fizzie's laptop server has.) < 1289400418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(TODO: Avoid law enforcement.) < 1289400457 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I went to do a df for you, but apparently the vserver stuff messes that up a bit. < 1289400465 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Filesystem Size Used Avail Use% Mounted on < 1289400465 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/dev/hdv1 5.0G 971M 3.8G 21% / < 1289400492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: That's quite alright! Just do a ... whatever command creates one of them servers ... for me1 < 1289400493 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*me! < 1289400531 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I'm going to start server-hosting, sowwy. < 1289400542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: No, you see, I'll be hijacking. < 1289400547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you'd have no official position at all! < 1289400610 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In actual reality the external USB disk thing has 233G, of which 151G is used. Why is there so much stuff in there, in fact? < 1289400628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yeah, that thing could store far more Kitten packages. < 1289400676 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Suppliers wishing to apply for authorisation should contact the competent national authorities for details of what information must be supplied." But what if everyone in my country is incompetent? < 1289400702 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Join the EU! < 1289400708 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I am not quite sure what political opinion that makes.) < 1289400720 0 :jcp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1289400722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also there's the obvious nonsensicalness of it all. < 1289400730 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Being that it's circular. < 1289400748 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also the page on how export control is derived from UN resolutions is titled "How to prevent proliferation of horrific weapons, weapons of mass destruction?" < 1289400758 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HORRIFIC, I tell you. < 1289400767 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HORRIFIC 35-meter-range personal area networks. < 1289400799 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I like the repetition. < 1289400813 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HORRIFIC WEAPONS. EWAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION! < 1289400880 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ewoks of mass destruction. < 1289401085 0 :jcp!~jw@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1289401154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Wait, non-GNU/Linux has a serious problem: what binutils? < 1289401160 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know of any maintained ones apart from the GNU ones. < 1289401809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[in #pcc] < 1289401812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : gnu/linux is about the worst host OS for it < 1289401812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : their system headers are *so* incompatible… < 1289401812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : gcc and glibc specifc, and all that < 1289401812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (non-GNU)/Linux actually :-) < 1289401812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ah < 1289401813 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : then good luck < 1289401817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :People as crazy as me! Whoo! < 1289402319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: apparently in the EU interfaces aren't copyrightable < 1289403356 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ The amount of time saved by this optimization is actually too small to │ < 1289403357 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ measure. The linker just had to search the library path to find the │ < 1289403357 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ linker script, so the dentries are cache hot if it has to search the │ < 1289403357 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ same path again. But it's what glibc does, so we do it too. │ < 1289403494 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@137.125.188.14 JOIN :#esoteric < 1289403497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1. Compile uClibc (with gcc). 2. Compile pcc (with gcc and uClibc). 3. Compile uClibc (with pcc). 4. Compile pcc (with new uClibc and pcc). < 1289404179 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh well, utter fail; seems my gcc is not friends with uClibc. And I don't feel like building gcc right now. < 1289404192 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :build clang instead? < 1289404353 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Awesome < 1289404361 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I lost two points on a subjective question < 1289404366 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well done < 1289404376 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: no :) < 1289404377 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: i like pcc < 1289404385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: (I'll probably use clang for C++ programs) < 1289404401 0 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 JOIN :#esoteric < 1289404404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And before you say clang has substandard C++ support, it's not nearly as substandard as pcc's C++ support, because it has none. < 1289404405 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"What sort of tasks is pattern matching useful for? Name three" < 1289404407 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My answer: < 1289404429 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastie.org/1287296 < 1289404437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: I could just build a gcc made to work with uClibc, but I'm trying to get away from gcc and its build system, dammit! (I could just use buildroot but I think it wanted me to build a Linux kernel and I like doing that myself thankyouverymuch). < 1289404482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"# Supports several hundreds of packages for userspace applications and libraries: X.org stack, Gtk2, Qt, DirectFB, SDL, GStreamer and a large number of network-related and system-related utilities and libraries are supported." < 1289404484 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lawl < 1289404512 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1289404516 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: 1. Compile clang (with gcc). 2. Compile uClibc (with clang). 3. Compile clang (with clang and uClibc). 4. Compile uClibc (with clang) etc. < 1289404517 0 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1289404519 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, < 1289404528 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: step 4 is unnecessary < 1289404563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: also, i know how to build clang, i just don't want to :) Besides, I bet you that the clang you build in step 1 won't be able to build uClibc programs properly. < 1289404576 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: why do you say that? < 1289404601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: because my gcc can't, and my gcc is just a regular one, like the regular clang you build in step #1 < 1289404613 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: why can't it? < 1289404618 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: resulting programs segfault < 1289404625 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oo < 1289404664 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: plus -nostdlib -nostdin -Lblahblah -Iblahblah blahblah/{crt1.o,libc.a} is a bit of a mouthful. it is possible i did something wrong out of laziness :) < 1289404971 0 :Sasha!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1289405066 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, clang won't compile uclibc anyways :( < 1289405081 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stupid inline assembly < 1289405094 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: I am not that hopeful that pcc will compile uClibc either. :) < 1289405102 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: wait, clang supports inline asm right? < 1289405114 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah, but there are some weird gcc-only magicks < 1289405123 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I imagine pcc will choke on them too < 1289405125 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: you can disable them < 1289405129 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the menuconfig < 1289405136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at the cost of some speed, but what's that for anti-gcc purity? < 1289405136 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :too many questions < 1289405149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: you have to make menuconfig to use uclibc anyway :) it makes some silly decisionsb y default < 1289405151 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*decisions by < 1289405161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can't decide whether the default config is for desktopish things or embedded devices < 1289405252 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am pretty sure that I can't avoid binutils :( < 1289405752 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Almost half of the people got the true/false The string "syf" matches the regular expression "sn?yf" wrong < 1289405832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/usr/bin/gcc -c -I/home/elliott/kitten/buildroot-2010.08/output/host/include -I/home/elliott/kitten/buildroot-2010.08/output/host/usr/include -DIN_GCC -DCROSS_DIRECTORY_STRUCTURE -W -Wall -Wwrite-strings -Wstrict-prototypes -Wmissing-prototypes -Wcast-qual -Wold-style-definition -Wc++-compat -Wmissing-format-attribute -pedantic -Wno-long-long -Wno-variadic-macros -Wno-overlength-strings -DHAVE_CONFIG_H -I. -I. -I/home/elliott/kitten/buildroot < 1289405832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-2010.08/output/toolchain/gcc-4.4.4/gcc -I/home/elliott/kitten/buildroot-2010.08/output/toolchain/gcc-4.4.4/gcc/. -I/home/elliott/kitten/buildroot-2010.08/output/toolchain/gcc-4.4.4/gcc/../include -I/home/elliott/kitten/buildroot-2010.08/output/toolchain/gcc-4.4.4/gcc/../libcpp/include -I/home/elliott/kitten/buildroot-2010.08/output/toolchain/gmp/include -I/home/elliott/kitten/buildroot-2010.08/output/toolchain/mpfr/include -I/home/elliott/kitten < 1289405833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/buildroot-2010.08/output/toolchain/gcc-4.4.4/gcc/../libdecnumber -I/home/elliott/kitten/buildroot-2010.08/output/toolchain/gcc-4.4.4/gcc/../libdecnumber/dpd -I../libdecnumber /home/elliott/kitten/buildroot-2010.08/output/toolchain/gcc-4.4.4/gcc/gcov-dump.c -o gcov-dump.o < 1289405848 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Unix and C, aren't they so simple and lean and wonderful and crisp? < 1289405848 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd spam elliott in relatiation, but... < 1289405853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1289406065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Tinycc can already rebuild itself (for x86 and arm targets), and has previously built a modified subset of an older (2.4) linux kernel. I'm upgrading it to work on more hosts (such as my x86-64 laptop), support more targets (x86-64, mips, powerpc...), and to build more software (especially a current unmodified 2.6 Linux kernel). < 1289406065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This project is on hold. I need to replace its code generator with TCG from QEMU, and break it up into a swiss-army-knife binary that can be called as "cc", "ld", "as", "strip", and so on, as appropriate." < 1289406069 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.landley.net/code/tinycc/ ... but he gave up < 1289406393 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1289407158 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a concept of smallest regex that matches all and only strings within a set of strings? < 1289407181 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably < 1289407313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: probably? < 1289407326 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I imagine it exists < 1289407331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: imagine what exists? < 1289407333 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1289407334 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo etc. < 1289407338 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1289407400 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :Number of times elliott has been confused because he /ignored Sgeo: 3 | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D < 1289407413 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :names < 1289407467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :Number of times elliott has been confused because he /ignored Sgeo: 3 | Number of times elliott has avoided banging his head against a brick wall because he /ignored Sgeo: countless | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D < 1289407506 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :priceless imo < 1289407553 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION pushes elliott's head against a brick wall
< 1289407580 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ll < 1289407582 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*lol < 1289407609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : priceless imo < 1289407611 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's priceless < 1289407649 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a more recognizable word for what you meant. You know the MasterCard commercials... then again, it's not like number of times confused is a price < 1289407678 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd say that was a Captain Obvious thing, but since elliott didn't get it < 1289407771 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: oh you mean the topic? < 1289407776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"priceless" makes no sense in that context < 1289407802 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :echo "Welcome to Buildroot" > /home/elliott/kitten/buildroot-2010.08/output/target/etc/issue < 1289407837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ugh* and i'm left with a useless pile of disorganised software < 1289408170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: HAHAHA IT WORKED FUCK YOU < 1289408205 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Sgeo explained it... oh wait < 1289408221 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: increment the counter and you die :) < 1289408228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: I assume it's a mastercard ad reference < 1289408236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: but, uhh, "priceless" makes no sense there. < 1289408249 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :Number of times elliott has been confused because he /ignored Sgeo: 3 | Number of times elliott has avoided banging his head against a brick wall because he /ignored Sgeo: countless | Number of days without oerjan's passionate embrace: 19 | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D < 1289408279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :Number of times elliott has been confused because he /ignored Sgeo: 3 | Number of times elliott has avoided banging his head against a brick wall because he /ignored Sgeo: countless | Number of days without oerjan's passionate embrace: 19 | Number of days since the topic last changed: 39 | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D < 1289408300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :Number of times elliott has been confused because he /ignored Sgeo: 3 | Number of times elliott has avoided banging his head against a brick wall because he /ignored Sgeo: countless | Number of days without oerjan's passionate embrace: 19 | Number of days since the topic last changed: 39 | Number of days the channel has been logged in the new clog directory: See http://tunes.org/~nef/log < 1289408303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aww < 1289408308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D: 34 < 1289408321 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :42: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D < 1289408338 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :42: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | number of times elliott has changed the topic: countless < 1289408357 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :42: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | number of times elliott has changed the topic: countless (not technically) < 1289408363 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :ASIEKIERKA FOREVER | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D < 1289408454 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :ASIEKIERKA FOREVER | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | amount of topic spam: uncountably infinite < 1289408473 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obviously, that's a deliberate lie. Then again, so is infinite < 1289408487 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :Welcome to #esoteric, the international hub for the occult, voodoo, crystal healing, esoteric topics in computation and programming languages, magick, astrology and spiritual projection | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D < 1289408497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: That upsets ais523 :P < 1289408499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You don't upset ais523. < 1289408504 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :E_DONTCARE < 1289408505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :praise be unto ais523 | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D < 1289408514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: WE CAN'T GO ON WITHOUT OERJAN *OR* AIS523 < 1289408549 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :Welcome to #esoteric, the international hub for the occult, voodoo, crystal healing, esoteric topics in computation and programming languages, magick, astrology and spiritual projection | Praise be unto the enlightened one, Zendu, who currently possesses the mind and being of ais523 | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D < 1289408567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :THERE IS NO AIS523. THERE IS ONLY ZUUL. http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D < 1289408583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I THINK I WIN OK < 1289408584 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 00:00:05 elliott (for log reading): yellow text: "NP is not in P!" XD link <-- link how? < 1289408588 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :Welcome to #esoteric, the international hub for the occult, voodoo, crystal healing, esoteric topics in computation and programming languages, magick, astrology and spiritual projection | Praise be unto the enlightened one, Zenduul, who currently possesses the mind and being of ais523 | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D < 1289408590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: link to whatever page had that < 1289408591 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it was on the screen in minecraft < 1289408594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohh < 1289408607 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :THERE IS NO ZUUL. THERE IS ONLY GREGOR'S UNWASHED BEARD. http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D < 1289408607 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah the update was release < 1289408610 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :released* < 1289408618 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :THERE IS NO ZUUL. THERE IS ONLY GREGOR'S UNWASHED BEARD. http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D < 1289408633 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dude. < 1289408636 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't grow a beard. < 1289408640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: PRECISELY < 1289408652 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: All purple bananas are poisonous. All Gregor's beards are unwashed. < 1289408663 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, on the minecraft wiki version history. "Known bugs: Pressing F4 spawns a portal to the Nether near the player's location. This is probably debug code that Notch forgot to remove before the release." < 1289408665 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1289408669 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Useful! < 1289408677 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, a bit like cheating though < 1289408683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Probably near = nearest multiple of 8. < 1289408696 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly < 1289408696 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Since otherwise you could get overlapping portals by making one, moving to the right a little bit, and making another. < 1289408707 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also texture pack support h,m < 1289408708 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm* < 1289408709 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both would go to the same place; where would you end up if you went into the single Nether one? < 1289408711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Or would they overlap?) < 1289408738 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: < 1289408739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott@dinky:~/kitten$ ./buildroot-2010.08/output/staging/usr/bin/x86_64-unknown-linux-uclibc-gcc -static hello.c -o hello < 1289408739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott@dinky:~/kitten$ ls -lh hello < 1289408739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-rwxr-xr-x 1 elliott elliott 11K Nov 10 17:05 hello < 1289408756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haven't configured uClibc much or anything, and it's typical bloated gcc code. But I'm going to use this to bootstrap pcc and uClibc. < 1289408758 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1289408812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Still, two more weeks to try to finish stuff up, so I'm building packages as fast as I can. One of them is gnu libiconv. Its configure stage says: < 1289408812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : checking for iconv... (cached) no, consider installing GNU libiconv" < 1289408822 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lawl < 1289408847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it was ghc, telling you to install ghc... that wouldn't be a lie. < 1289408852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(At least SBCL can build with CMUCL and CLISP.) < 1289408856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And others, I think.) < 1289408896 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, "near" seems to be "on top of you" < 1289408903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: xD < 1289408907 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1289408913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott@dinky:~/kitten/pcc/pcc$ CC=$HOME/kitten/buildroot-2010.08/output/staging/usr/bin/x86_64-unknown-linux-uclibc-gcc LDFLAGS="-static" ./configure --prefix=$HOME/kitten/stage1 < 1289408916 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, or rather: around you < 1289408927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you end up... inside the portal? < 1289408934 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/home/elliott/kitten/buildroot-2010.08/output/staging/usr/bin/x86_64-unknown-linux-uclibc-gcc -DLIBEXECDIR=\"/home/elliott/kitten/stage1/libexec/\" -DGCC_COMPAT -DINCLUDEDIR=\"/home/elliott/kitten/stage1/include/\" -DPCCINCDIR=\"/home/elliott/kitten/stage1/lib/pcc/x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu/0.9.9/include/\" -DPCCLIBDIR=\"/home/elliott/kitten/stage1/lib/pcc/x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu/0.9.9/lib/\" -Dos_linux -DTARGMACH=amd64 -Dmach_amd64 -I../.. -I../ < 1289408934 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :../os/linux -I../../mip -I../../arch/amd64 -g -O2 -Wall -Wmissing-prototypes -Wstrict-prototypes -Wshadow -Wsign-compare -c cc.c < 1289408936 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dear god. < 1289408945 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :./mkext < 1289408945 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make[2]: ./mkext: Command not found < 1289408946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LULZ < 1289408968 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Protip: Use LDFLAGS < 1289408974 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION puts -static in CFLAGS
< 1289409016 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pcc compiled! < 1289409031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT WILL IT BLEND^Wwork with uClibc? < 1289409040 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: LDFLAGS is a wonky concept in modern times anyway; are ldflags the flags passed to ld, or are they flags used for linking? Since they don't accept the same input, it's a sticky situation. There's no "correct" use of LDFLAGS. < 1289409048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Indeed. < 1289409050 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, why did this one back to earth spawn deep below the ground < 1289409052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Did I mention fuck software? < 1289409055 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought they spawned on the surface? < 1289409059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :("Software that FUCKS!") < 1289409060 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: (Literally) < 1289409072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I mention-fucked software. < 1289409104 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I... fucked it with... mentions. < 1289409296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott@dinky:~/kitten$ ./stage1/bin/pcc -nostdinc -nostdlibs -I/home/elliott/kitten/buildroot-2010.08/output/toolchain/uClibc_dev/usr/include -I/home/elliott/kitten/buildroot-2010.08/output/toolchain/gcc-4.4.4/include -L/home/elliott/kitten/buildroot-2010.08/output/toolchain/uClibc_dev/usr/lib hello.c -o hello < 1289409297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/home/elliott/kitten/buildroot-2010.08/output/toolchain/uClibc_dev/usr/include/stdio.h:34: error: cannot find 'stddef.h' < 1289409298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOLZ < 1289409313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott@dinky:~/kitten/buildroot-2010.08/toolchain$ find . -name stddef.h < 1289409313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott@dinky:~/kitten/buildroot-2010.08/toolchain$ < 1289409315 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOZL < 1289409332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, it's a Linux include :P < 1289409830 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1289409833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-nostdlib, not -nostdlibs < 1289409891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott@dinky:~/kitten$ ls /home/elliott/kitten/buildroot-2010.08/output/toolchain/uClibc_dev/usr/lib/ < 1289409891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :crt1.o crti.o crtn.o libc.so libm.so < 1289409892 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fffffffffffff < 1289409927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :./stage1/bin/pcc -nostdinc -nostdlib -static -I/home/elliott/kitten/stage1/lib/pcc/x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu/0.9.9/include -I$TC/uClibc_dev/usr/include -I$TC/linux/include/linux -L$TC/uClibc_dev/usr/lib hello.c $TC/uClibc-0.9.31/lib/libc.a -o hello < 1289409929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When in doubt, cheat. < 1289409934 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott@dinky:~/kitten$ ./hello < 1289409934 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello, world! < 1289409934 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Segmentation fault < 1289410833 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aaaargh I think these portals are cross connected < 1289410873 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, if I go through A in nether and then back I end up at B. If I go through B in nether and back I end up at A < 1289410909 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1289410913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: that is AWESOME. < 1289410918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: CAN I HAVE THE UPDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD < 1289410920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :D < 1289410928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION mauled by a wild pack of bears
< 1289411018 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, upd? < 1289411022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 8 < 1289411027 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean < 1289411044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was saying "can I have the update" which you have stated you won't give; it was therefore a joke :P < 1289411046 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION buys Minecraft
< 1289411055 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1289411058 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Quick, copy your jars away so you can have portal-spawning action when it's fixed. < 1289411098 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Holy shit, the Minecraft purchase page is in Swedish X-D < 1289411133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION fixes
< 1289411239 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Give me a good reason not to set up an OpenGenera partition. < 1289411270 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you mean.. native? < 1289411277 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, which page is in Swedish? < 1289411611 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm; I also built two portals in the real world -- for faster traffic between my two buildings -- and even though they've spaced pretty far apart, something like at least a hundred steps, they both mapped to the same portal. But for me it works so that if I go into Nether from either, I get out of the single portal, but if I go in, I always end up in just one of the portals, the one I made first. < 1289411640 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So as a fast-traffic system, it only works unidirectionally. < 1289411641 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thank you for purchasing Minecraft! Your status should update soon, or within a week if you paid by e-check. < 1289411641 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it doesn't, send me an email (include the transaction ID and username) and we'll sort it out. < 1289411645 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The PayPal page, by default. < 1289411782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yay! It works! < 1289411924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: All I need now is a better graphics card to go with it. :p < 1289411991 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nether is cool. < 1289412121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: fancy rendering is actually quite fast for me < 1289412655 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`echo How slow am I today? < 1289412674 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How slow am I today? < 1289412684 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`echo How slow am I now? < 1289412686 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How slow am I now? < 1289412713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 1. Find tiny little rock -- well, grass patch -- in a little passage of water between two islands < 1289412718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2. Put all your blocks down on one square < 1289412720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3. Night time < 1289412722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4. SEA TOWER SHELTER < 1289412749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :5. Watch spiders and shit on the islands below < 1289412809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm going to F4 in the day on top of this tower :) < 1289412829 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm < 1289412858 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The shelter thing actually works well, but you have to find a square of buildableness on water close to wherever you are now) < 1289412859 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1289412879 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WhatTF is so compelling about Minecraft anyway. < 1289412880 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can't have said mhm to what I just said, you said it right as I did :P < 1289412884 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: You know Lego? < 1289412894 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yes, they're delicious. < 1289412917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Now imagine doing Lego with huge, life-sized blocks in an endless interesting pretty sandbox. < 1289412919 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, did you know that furnaces continue to operate while you close the dialog for them? < 1289412924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Also, monsters. And you can dig. < 1289412929 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, meaning you can run several at the same time < 1289412936 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I haven't done furnaces yet :P < 1289412985 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the creepers have all figured out that I'm in the water < 1289413013 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also wrt running game while tabbed away: open inventory, furnace or crafting bench then just move pointer out of the window < 1289413040 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I've been opening inventory and then alt-tabbing away, yes. But it's hard to see what's going on if you do that (say, watching stuff at night). < 1289413070 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well I'm indoors and running 6 furnaces in parallel atm... < 1289413748 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In multiplayer games, you can press 't' to open the "talk dialog", which is just a prompt at the bottom of the screen: that doesn't obscure things so much than inventories/furnaces/such. < 1289413760 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But t doesn't do anything in a single-player session, so it's no help there. < 1289413769 0 :kar8nga!~kar8nga@j-21.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1289413780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Now how do I make nights go faster? < 1289413794 0 :madbr!~madbrain@poste87-171.wl.t.ulaval.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1289413807 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know: I'm sure there's some sort of a hack for that. < 1289413827 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I usually just do some mining at night: it's dark under-ground anyway. < 1289413838 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'm on top of a pole. :p < 1289413941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, someone finally got around to making an Emacs-esque thing that actually has a real browser in it. (And IRC too; it seems to embed gtk stuff.) In Haskell! http://www.flickr.com/photos/48809572@N02/ Bit strange though. < 1289413948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still ... tempting ... < 1289413982 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how expensive chip pins were in the 90s < 1289414009 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: totally gonna spawn a portal on this pole now < 1289414020 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, if you make your mem bus 32bits instead of 16bits, that's 16 more pins of cpu and 16 more dram pins and 16 more copper tracers etc < 1289414025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Suddenly, nothing happened :P < 1289414033 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1289414034 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: OMG < 1289414039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I just made a portal appear on top of another portal. < 1289414047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Step 1. Go up a tall pole. Step 2. Press F4 a lot. < 1289414089 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but then again you have twice the ram bandwidth...) < 1289414177 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Want screenshots? < 1289414319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: < 1289414323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://imgur.com/8C2v8.png < 1289414323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://imgur.com/El0iP.png < 1289414329 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://imgur.com/CU5CA.png < 1289414333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://imgur.com/z03kU.png < 1289414335 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie too. < 1289414356 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eventually they started spawning right next to my pole (on water, even?) and then one spawned on top of me and I walked off the pole to my death by mistake. < 1289414400 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION still has no comprehension of what the appeal of this game is.
< 1289414408 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like lego < 1289414413 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been told that. < 1289414436 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was never much for legos unless I had something very utilitarian to do :P < 1289414452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Well, you could drum up a fake sense of superiority to all the Lego fans or you could just accept that it appeals to everyone else* but you. < 1289414455 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*for some definition of everyone else < 1289414456 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno, it's creative, open ended, looks nice < 1289414470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: Has GODDAMN TERRIFYING SPIDER HISSES. < 1289414471 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I prefer a fake sense of superiority. < 1289414481 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not if you play multiplayer < 1289414493 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's wait for OpenMinecraft < 1289414520 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are enemy-spawners in multiplayer too -- in dungeons -- and the enemies they create are unkillable, except by fire. < 1289414603 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, is it a bug? < 1289414633 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1289414636 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, a very general sort of bug, the server doesn't track health for anyone. < 1289414640 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So the players are unkillable too. < 1289414642 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1289414670 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, so the enemies cause no real harm then < 1289414740 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Creepers still blow stuff up. < 1289414743 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That can be annoying. < 1289414778 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so can players with tnt :D < 1289414782 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, obsidian. I'm making the lower parts of the walls of this fort I'm working on in obsidian < 1289414800 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, only week point now is the doors < 1289414816 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm not sure how to deal with that < 1289414822 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obsidian is a bit boring to mine for. < 1289414830 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, doors don't work in multiplayer either. :p < 1289414851 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, true, it takes ages < 1289414857 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, also I play locally < 1289414874 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do creepers blow up iron doors? < 1289414879 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no idea < 1289414894 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, so far I used peaceful mode because I have been learning how the game works. < 1289414919 0 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 JOIN :#esoteric < 1289414926 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, seems TNT is able to blow it up < 1289414933 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then creepers will too, I guess. < 1289414935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : let's wait for OpenMinecraft < 1289414936 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, indeed < 1289414942 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've done a bit of obsidian farming, but that's pretty slow too. < 1289414948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unlike you, nooga, we're really not that concerned about the price of four packs of cigarettes. < 1289414963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or at least I'm not. < 1289414988 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Stacked a portal on top of a portal yet? < 1289414998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm trying to get one close to me so that I can see what happens if you go into an airportal. < 1289415001 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Spawn in the Nether air? < 1289415011 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably it just maps to a single Nether portal. :/ < 1289415049 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Netcraft is currently in development, btw < 1289415085 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no I don't want a silly looking game world :P < 1289415093 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" Is there a concept of smallest regex that matches all and only strings within a set of strings?" <<< you are given a finite set of strings, and you ask whether there's a smallest size of regex that can be used to match exactly those strings? < 1289415096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: MineBSD is dead, Netcraft confirms it. < 1289415100 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I actually play in a serious way < 1289415106 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Suuure you do. < 1289415107 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ... MineBSD??? < 1289415112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You don't know that! < 1289415114 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I plan, construct, build and so on. < 1289415116 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl food < 1289415117 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or are you hoping for a minimality result like the one for DFA's < 1289415118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Yes. It's BSD by Minecraft players. < 1289415125 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lololol < 1289415141 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, BSD implemented in a buggy Java framework? :P < 1289415150 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where can I find info on designing a cpu instruction set < 1289415152 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION had to google it so that he could be 100% sure it doesn't actually exist
< 1289415169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Since when is it buggy? < 1289415178 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: Look up the details on MIPS' instruction set. Expand. < 1289415190 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Interesting choice of portal placement -- it seemingly ate up some of my huge tower and put a portal there. < 1289415196 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it's close to me. < 1289415198 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1289415207 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: A friend of mine told me that he checked for exception handlers and MineCraft catches an obscene number of NullPointerExceptions. < 1289415216 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Minecraft, whatever < 1289415223 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gregor: doesn't the MIPS need cache to run fast < 1289415231 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can think of a billion reasons for that and they're all to do with third-party libraries, Gregor :P < 1289415233 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Netcraft is implemented mostly in C, but with C++ to interface with Bullet < 1289415239 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is/will be < 1289415246 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: All real CPUs need a cache to run fast. < 1289415246 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i had a dream that Gregor was in turku, and we agreed to meet, he said "you are the only pervert from the internet i'm ever going to meet irl" < 1289415271 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: this is because they're lame < 1289415282 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they can't do quantum either < 1289415284 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I meet lots of perverts I know from the webertubes. < 1289415298 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gregor: yes < 1289415313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Okay, gone in an airy one and arrived at a Nether portal. < 1289415322 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(btw, quantum computing is insane. And awesome. And insane. etc.) < 1289415328 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION vaguely wonders if JSMIPS would run faster with some kind of caching :P
< 1289415432 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gregor: hmm < 1289415452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Wouldn't that just come out to an array access to cache an array access? :P < 1289415467 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: YES. < 1289415467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless you have 32 thousand variables or so. And even then it'd be variable access vs. array access. :P < 1289415517 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact it would be more like array access to cache /map/ access. < 1289415533 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since my vmem ended up having to be a map. < 1289415538 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how hard to design are caches anyways < 1289415571 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: You lurched wildly from "instruction set" to "actual chip" here :P < 1289415580 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1289415613 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's hard to design an instruction set that runs fast if you don't know what sort of memory architecture you're dealing with :D < 1289415622 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is netcraft < 1289415624 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1289415648 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :netcraft = gratis minecraft < 1289415655 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who does it? < 1289415679 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a bunch of guys here < 1289415684 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gregor: my goal would be something that can do fast resampling < 1289415685 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who < 1289415692 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I predict a 30% chance of actually getting something decent < 1289415702 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: a bunch of people < 1289415707 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for stuff like texture mapping, music playing... < 1289415718 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who is in this bunch then? < 1289415727 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just zeeze guyz, you know? < 1289415741 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you care so much> < 1289415742 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, if you can do fast enough resampling and multiplication and mixing, you don't need any real sound hardware < 1289415742 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1289415772 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm joking < 1289415781 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: Can't help ya :P < 1289415856 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, that's the problem with amigas, 286s, 386s... it has to load every instruction from DRAM and you have extra wasted instructions for managing the loop, incrementing variables etc < 1289416005 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas RISC instruction set makes plenty sense when the loop instructions are all cached, the DRAM access patterns come out in blocks which is ideal for stuff like EDO (ie on a Pentium or something like that) < 1289416090 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if you don't have cache, instructions like add register, [memory] make sense < 1289416131 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: cloning minecraft shouldn't be hard < 1289416139 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or even weird string instructions like STOSB < 1289416142 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: yes it should < 1289416146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :minecraft is pretty complex by now < 1289416157 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like what? < 1289416159 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :crafting? < 1289416162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1289416164 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :red stone logics? < 1289416168 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: please list the things you can do in minecraft to nooga < 1289416173 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :infinite, procedural maps? < 1289416193 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :carts & tracks? < 1289416199 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :minecraft does infinity really dumb-like < 1289416211 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: it's been made less dumbly as of recently, no? < 1289416213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: making a good procedural map generator isn't easy. especially biomes. also, multiplayer < 1289416219 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: also, good caverns and shit. < 1289416219 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: by necessity, smoewhat < 1289416228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: also, the things you list aren't exactly trivial. < 1289416229 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is < 1289416233 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: smoe what? < 1289416234 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gregor: Mostly I'm hesitating between 16bit design where you know how much cycles everything takes so you can play off that, and with lots of Amiga-like effects but there's less memory bandwidth < 1289416237 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OR < 1289416242 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: no, it isn't; the old minecraft generators are not nearly as good as the new ones < 1289416247 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bunch of CAs < 1289416253 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you're done < 1289416265 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION lawls at reading nooga's line as madbr's line.
< 1289416279 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lool :D < 1289416298 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1289416300 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the server originally just retained the whole thing in memory < 1289416310 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if you went farther and farther, it would just slow down and slow down < 1289416320 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1289416322 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or 32bit-ish design with something like fast-page or EDO dram and a frame buffer < 1289416328 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My understanding is that optimizations have been made, but this is still fundamentally a problem < 1289416415 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Paging would help with that if it wasn't Java 8-D < 1289416450 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: maybe you could use sand automata for the beaches? < 1289416461 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :netcraft's approach could still be exploited, but is far less dumb < 1289416471 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's his approach < 1289416483 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically it stores the generator, the seed, and a diff < 1289416497 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so simply venturing out into infinity leaves no trace in memory < 1289416530 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and I assume the diff is appropriately compressed so the only way to run up the memory usage is to actually make a large number of changes) < 1289416531 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if things are forgotten, a lot of the funness of the game is forgotten too < 1289416543 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no, changes are retained in the diff < 1289416547 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh ohh < 1289416552 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah sry i stupidet < 1289416656 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi oklopol < 1289416661 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi cheater99 < 1289416678 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how are things? < 1289416684 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, fine i guess < 1289416699 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i got my maturity exam thingie done for my bachelor's < 1289416706 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so now i can switch to math < 1289416708 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... "maturity exam?" < 1289416711 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1289416736 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what they call it, i don't know what it's official translation is < 1289416744 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :definitely not that one < 1289416745 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1289416777 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in britain it's a-levels < 1289416795 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's this simple test where they check you did your bachelor's yourself, and know finnish. < 1289416805 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or the language the thing was written in < 1289416805 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: that's what i would do < 1289416877 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also i'm gonna get my first publication i think, but it's just proceedings < 1289416909 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :u? < 1289416920 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still a perverted faggot? < 1289416921 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: i would be fun too make slopes as seen in TTD < 1289416958 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh that's not a-levels then < 1289416962 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1289416976 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think they call it review < 1289416983 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you think of matriculation exam or smth? < 1289416986 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know what a-levels is < 1289416992 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a-levels is at the end of high school. < 1289416999 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that's called matriculation here < 1289416999 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: a-levels = high school exams, as I understand it < 1289417003 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1289417011 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's called diploma exams in my home province < 1289417026 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so who's seen this new lang < 1289417030 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://gosu-lang.org/comparison.shtml < 1289417046 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought that was a joke < 1289417076 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah, I like the last one < 1289417084 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf happened to my ignores? < 1289417086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, damn < 1289417094 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also lol at 'reified generics' < 1289417097 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :missed a * after cheater < 1289417100 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds like a wonderful way to make generics suck more < 1289417105 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah he's sneaky like that < 1289417111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: absolutely. < 1289417115 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hadn't changed my nick in months < 1289417124 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: sure, but you'll have to pay me < 1289417127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: I am tired of tables that have all "Y"s on the product in question. < 1289417136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: could there be a more obvious example of bias? < 1289417141 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes < 1289417142 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yet alise keeps on taking me off ignore and then pretending she forgot to add some bit. < 1289417142 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Put some shit you don't have yet in there! < 1289417147 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they could also have all Ns for the other stuff < 1289417148 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: "Gosu rawks"? :P < 1289417157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oklopol: a-levels = high school exams, as I understand it < 1289417157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1289417173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott: the server originally just retained the whole thing in memory < 1289417176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who plays minecraft on servers < 1289417177 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(losers) < 1289417183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's paged out to disk now :p < 1289417191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: with "chunks" < 1289417195 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : basically it stores the generator, the seed, and a diff < 1289417195 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : so simply venturing out into infinity leaves no trace in memory < 1289417197 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still bad < 1289417197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're very wrong < 1289417201 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it now saves the chunks to disk < 1289417203 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1289417205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :netcraft < 1289417205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1289417212 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: plz see http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Chunks < 1289417234 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: right < 1289417237 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it does that chunking thing < 1289417240 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: WOW that's where i draw the line! < 1289417241 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if you leave a chunk < 1289417246 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that chucnk stays around < 1289417248 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :entirely intact < 1289417282 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yes < 1289417297 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: how insightful < 1289417302 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: line? < 1289417312 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what's going on? < 1289417323 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is going all wrong. < 1289417331 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It amuses me greatly that fuel efficiency can be measured in square meters. < 1289417332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: absolutely very insightful; cheater99: you too < 1289417338 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :u confyouz me. < 1289417344 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(1L/100km = 0.01m^2) < 1289417352 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1289417360 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@ pikhq < 1289417368 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1289417374 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1289417376 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ofc < 1289417390 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: please list the things you can do in minecraft to nooga < 1289417391 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1289417394 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :too long < 1289417396 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hooray, base SI units. < 1289417398 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :help < 1289417400 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are there any ops < 1289417402 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I delegate this to you and to fizzie < 1289417408 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no :P < 1289417412 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott is msging me with cusswords < 1289417414 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1289417426 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: i took you off ignore. nice try < 1289417427 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was Bullet? < 1289417433 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, if you took a cylinder containing the fuel of the length you can drive, it'd be the cylinder's thingie area < 1289417437 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i know < 1289417440 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: physics engine < 1289417451 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : My understanding is that optimizations have been made, but this is still fundamentally a problem <-- I believe it will unload chunks that are some distance away < 1289417460 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so actually i don't think it's at all funny anymore < 1289417461 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: is netcraft closed-source? < 1289417488 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because that's what's being measured, "how much fuel you need to move one differential forward" < 1289417491 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw < 1289417492 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: source will be released when it's ready for first release, is my understanding < 1289417501 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : netcraft's approach could still be exploited, but is far less dumb <-- netcraft? < 1289417502 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :has anyone ever run a turing machine on a GOL? < 1289417509 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: a clone of minecraft < 1289417513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: good to know they're, uh, being creative < 1289417516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: even in their naming < 1289417534 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've seen some GOL's that had the name "turing machine" etc, of course the proof eluded me. i'm not much into GOL. < 1289417537 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh. googling netcraft just gives netcraft.com results. Which are not very relevant here < 1289417540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :personally i couldn't have thought of "Let's make a game that's like Minecraft... and... yes." < 1289417556 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, got a link to netcraft? < 1289417569 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's people at coppro's uni < 1289417572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :demonstrating how creative they are < 1289417605 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: they were turing machines < 1289417622 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, wrong order of magnitude. < 1289417624 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0.01 mm^2. < 1289417632 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or 1*10^-8 m^2. < 1289417638 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : demonstrating how creative they are <-- XD < 1289417650 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: have you ever looked into the problem of running turing machines on GOL's more in-depth than just looking at GOL presets? < 1289417660 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well could you have thought of the idea "it's like minecraft, but we take the mine bit off and add net"?! < 1289417685 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: certainly not < 1289417690 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so no mining? < 1289417694 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOL*'s*? < 1289417695 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1289417699 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;P < 1289417700 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'s GOL then < 1289417710 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: JCGOL? < 1289417723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no you just net things up < 1289417725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like a butterfly net < 1289417731 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah < 1289417731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then craft them into hideous corpse art < 1289417732 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :john conway's game of life. < 1289417735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NETCRAFT! < 1289417739 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know JCGOL, same rules? < 1289417744 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: (i'm lying) < 1289417744 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1289417747 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, like the zombie pigmen ;P < 1289417750 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Bweheheh. That is, of course, the integral of V(x) from 0 to distance travelled, with respect to x. It makes some amount of sense, too! < 1289417751 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Victory! < 1289417758 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: what else is there? < 1289417766 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's only that. < 1289417772 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1289417810 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, still no < 1289417825 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1289417831 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it does seem like fairly useful research < 1289417836 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i might if there was a high-level explanation, but most of it consists of guns etc so actually you could probably just look at it < 1289417843 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it's really not < 1289417853 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1289417857 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the thing is the single cells are so very very simple < 1289417866 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're even simpler than transistors you'd think < 1289417888 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, no. < 1289417893 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't need address lines etc < 1289417910 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they usually just need connection to some neighbour cells < 1289417931 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which could mean, you make a cpu which just has those simple cells, and that's that < 1289417943 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :surely it's interesting, but proofs that things can simulate turing machines aren't usually considered very important < 1289417956 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because they can always do that < 1289417967 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"always" is a bit much < 1289417981 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a rubik's cube can't simulate a turing machine. < 1289417981 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1289417998 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think GOL could be an interesting processor architecture < 1289418009 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, you need several cells to signify a single bit < 1289418015 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but those cells could be so much smaller < 1289418018 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, maybe. probably no < 1289418019 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :t < 1289418028 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, almost single molecules probably < 1289418037 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're doing a lot of useless stuff, guns and all that, and still the rule is complicated < 1289418057 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even wireworld would be better < 1289418093 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you could probably come up with something crazy like say growing peptide crystals where each molecule strand is neatly crafted into the network and represents a single GOL cell. < 1289418101 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1289418116 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is just pure sci-fi, but i wouldn't be surprised if it were possible < 1289418127 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in gol, you have signal crossing *everywhere* < 1289418131 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw < 1289418134 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1289418138 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean? < 1289418145 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the neighborhood already forces it < 1289418149 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1289418188 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, ... transistors don't need address lines... < 1289418191 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, you know, you can't put down tiles on the plane so that they are gol-connected < 1289418230 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RAM needs it < 1289418241 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because a's connection to its bottom-right crosses a's right neighbor's connection to bottom-left < 1289418242 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: minecraft just got updated < 1289418246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: wanna bet f4 no longer works? < 1289418264 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well I have a copy, anyway I have heaps of obsidian < 1289418275 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no, newer than that < 1289418277 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i was thinking of FPGAs there for a second < 1289418277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :literally, since today < 1289418288 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I have a copy of the one where f4 works I mean < 1289418290 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: since normal CPUs are not as programmable as a GOL board < 1289418293 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but FPGAs are < 1289418298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1289418308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed f4 disabled < 1289418312 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, sure they are. But only during design < 1289418322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: wow, there's *two* minepedias... < 1289418324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://minepedia.net/index.php?title=Main_Page < 1289418329 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :minepedia? < 1289418334 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a GOL board? < 1289418342 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that one I haven't seen < 1289418344 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :game of life board. < 1289418348 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :me neither < 1289418364 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*either < 1289418370 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway I get connection error to minecraft.net < 1289418381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did but don't now < 1289418381 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what, someone did a game of life simulator with lots of parallelism on some custom arch? < 1289418381 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1289418383 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :overloaded server i guess < 1289418384 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION clicks play offline
< 1289418384 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523 < 1289418401 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: no < 1289418415 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: we're considering gol AS the arch < 1289418578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"here is the kicker, lava produces heat, energy at a certain frequency that is harmful to us, just as we can see light because we perceive things through this 4x box, of 3 dimensions of space, and 1 dimension of time. < 1289418578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quantum, we understand that waves and particles are one in the same, that particles are waves. So lets just say that monsters are made of of particles that are exist in a certain frequency that is not effected by the same frequency as heat." < 1289418579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1289418582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(comment on minecraft blog) < 1289418647 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1289418666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Now, you might think that is silly, because it is heat. I mean, every burns at a high enough temperature, right? wrong. Since heat is bound by the existence of time, thus the bound by the speed of light and all the energy required by it. As things get hotter and hotter, eventually they start producing gamma rays and such, etc, but it gets to a point where the energy required to make more heat goes off to infinity when you get temperatures that h < 1289418666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ave energies that have frequencies near the speed of light, so thus, things that are made up of particles that are smaller than light can perceive and such, can be non effected by heat, as heat will have to break out of the existence of time before it can effect these particles... but if it breaks out of time, then it is not longer heat, per say." < 1289418672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"So lets just say that monsters are made up of atomic, subatom, etheric, and subetheric particles that exist on a frequency where, quantumly, they are visible by light, and can effect physical objects, but their physical existence is outside the bounds of our reality and heat do not effect them. < 1289418672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not saying this is the reason, I am just saying that when you look into things from a quantum mechanical level, everything becomes waves and probabilities. everything is possible. =) < 1289418674 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :enjoy, minecraft is awesome." < 1289418676 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that made sense! < 1289418698 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a better explanation: you can punch trees, therefore lava doesn't harm ghasts Q.E.D. < 1289418702 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you know, if he'd just said that monsters were transparent to infrared, it would have been a lot simpler < 1289418711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: heh < 1289418725 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even though that reasoning doesn't really deal with conducted or convected heat... < 1289418728 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais < 1289418773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it doesn't help his quantum pseudo-reasoning that you can bash them with swords, either :) < 1289418820 0 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 JOIN :#esoteric < 1289418828 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was the biggest bundle of crazy nonsensicality i've seen this week < 1289418835 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've been ircing too little :( < 1289418842 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: HAHA -- one of the possible names for Nether was "Norway" < 1289418843 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1289418850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D < 1289418854 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, :D < 1289418885 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ,D < 1289418913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://www.reddit.com/r/Minecraft/comments/dx88i/notch_if_you_read_this_please_leave_the_fire/c13mm12?context=1 < 1289418930 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oklopol, ,D < 1289418997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I think you should call is Steve." "That would be the funniest damn thing he could do. Construct menacing portal...enter menacing portal....'You have entered....STEVE"" < 1289419009 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THIS IS AN ULTIMATE GAME < 1289419028 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gSOQGazo7Oo < 1289419072 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ? < 1289419086 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I see < 1289419096 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm still on just-online mode, when I try to do about 8 things at once and so does my computer < 1289419132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: YOUR COMPUTER WILL RUN FASTER WITH KITTEN < 1289419154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It's got static linking. That's what plants crave! < 1289419155 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`translate Hey guys, mimi fasta kutafsiri amri. < 1289419156 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey guys, I fixed the translate command. < 1289419162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`wl < 1289419169 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You get NOTHING! You LOSE! Good DAY sir! < 1289419170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`wl sv smorgasbord < 1289419173 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Smörgåsbord < 1289419175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Translate is LAME :P < 1289419179 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wl 4 eva < 1289419187 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`translateto sv smorgasbord < 1289419189 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :smörgåsbord < 1289419206 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`translateto sv elliott's translation method is so rife with lame. < 1289419209 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Elliotts översättning metoden är så fulla av lama. < 1289419212 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`translateto it Dirty Hungarian Phrasebook < 1289419213 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dirty frasario ungherese < 1289419217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`wl en it Dirty Hungarian Phrasebook < 1289419218 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You get NOTHING! You LOSE! Good DAY sir! < 1289419221 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...? < 1289419227 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: is static linking actually faster? < 1289419228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`wl en it Dirty_Hungarian_Phrasebook < 1289419229 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :computer translation is getting pretty scary, because they are making less and less errors in grammar, but just... completely misunderstand everything < 1289419230 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Il frasario ungherese < 1289419234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: HAHA IW IN < 1289419235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*I WIN < 1289419238 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, translatefromto actually uses the Google APIs now :P < 1289419239 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yours doesn't translate "dirty" < 1289419239 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's like reading the translation of a native retard < 1289419242 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No more trying to parse HTML. < 1289419251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the linker is a lot simpler, so it's faster, and starting executables is much faster < 1289419261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: (since it doesn't have to load all the libraries) < 1289419261 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd expect it to be slower because it couldn't keep libc in the cache < 1289419268 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I suppose it depends on how often it context-switches < 1289419275 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Uhh... you do realise Linux does sharing of all the libcs? < 1289419275 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps it starts faster and runs slower? < 1289419280 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`wl en pl dirty hungarian phrasebook < 1289419282 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You get NOTHING! You LOSE! Good DAY sir! < 1289419284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You never have two copies of libc functions in RAM with static linking. < 1289419285 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: indeed, but how can it do that with static linking? < 1289419287 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1289419288 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;D < 1289419299 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's pretty ingenious, actually < 1289419307 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sort-of dynamic unstaticing < 1289419311 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I'm not sure at what granularity Linux does it, but it's good enough < 1289419339 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but yes, linker is a lot faster, starting executables is a lot faster, runtime is the same really < 1289419342 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*linking < 1289419364 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"You never have two copies of libc functions in RAM with static linking." Well this smells like total BS. < 1289419393 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well function may be false < 1289419397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there is most definitely sharing. < 1289419404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know that Plan 9 does pervasive sharing < 1289419412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aren’t statically linked executables consuming more memory? < 1289419413 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We believe that due to the small size of the base system the opposite will be the case. First of all, the kernel will load each static executable’s .rodata, .data, .text and .comment sections only once for all instances into memory. Second, because each static binary has only been linked with the object files necessary, it has already been optimised at linkage time for memory consumption. When loading it, we don’t require the kernel to map al < 1289419413 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :l dependent dynamic libraries into memory from which our binary might only use 5% of the functions they provide. So, in reality, the memory footprint is becoming less, and the dead code hold in memory (or paged) reduces overall consumption. This is also true for programs, like surf, which don’t use all webkit/gtk/glib functions. < 1289419416 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :--sta.li < 1289419430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, so less sharing than plan 9 < 1289419433 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but still < 1289419441 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: also, more will fit into cache as the libc is a lot smaller than glibc :p < 1289419457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://9fans.net/archive/2002/02/21 plan 9 sharing < 1289419465 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it will share each INSTANCE of the SAME program, but it won't share bits of it across programs. < 1289419466 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the plan 9 statement there seems to imply that it shares .rodata and .text, etc., for two programs with the same executable, not any two programs < 1289419469 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: right < 1289419477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: right < 1289419477 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sharing between two different programs would be rather harder < 1289419480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do recall systems with more sharing < 1289419498 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially as, given static linking, the functions aren't going to be in the same relative positions in memory in the two programs < 1289419506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: anyway, i don't know of any reports saying static linking has slower runtime performance. < 1289419521 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and it seems unlikely to me, especially when your libc is *much* more compact than glibc < 1289419626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i should read linux from scratch :) < 1289419640 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, really, there should be a two-tier libc < 1289419648 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...? < 1289419652 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one that does everything that C99 and POSIX require, the other for all the GNU extensions < 1289419698 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Not much of LFS is actually special information for building a base Linux system, BTW. < 1289419706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you can do the latter with gcc: just append "|| rm *.c" to the command line, without the quotes < 1289419710 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I can't parse your sentence < 1289419721 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Most of it is just "here's how you build foo". < 1289419749 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Basically, after you've got the toolchain up and running you're just installing exceptionally common dependencies. < 1289419760 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(e.g. Perl) < 1289419817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ISTR some part of recent perls depend on static linking :) < 1289419819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*dynamic linking < 1289419827 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't see how deleting all C files if the compile fails would help < 1289419833 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: And LFS has you build a conventional glibc system. < 1289419837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: right. < 1289419863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it removes the GNU dependencies from all the .c files in the directory < 1289419874 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meanwhile, a sign of Slashdot strangeness: I've just metamoderated two of the comments I've just moderated < 1289419875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(assuming your compile is failing because of missing gnu extensions) < 1289419892 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in other words, I'm currently keeping tabs on my own behaviour < 1289419901 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's not what I want < 1289419907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Who moderates the moderatormen? < 1289419912 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the GNU extensions are often useful, but they should be in a separate library < 1289419919 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's different from arbitrarily deleting programs that use GNU extensions < 1289419926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :usually the gnu extensions are useful ideas, implemented terribly and with a terrible api :) < 1289419931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nobody really uses them apart from gnu though. < 1289419937 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(especially as gcc is entirely capable of compiling programs that use them...) < 1289419949 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the course on C I'm teaching uses GNU extensions < 1289419955 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not by my choice, incidentally < 1289419959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ugh < 1289419962 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it makes a lot of other dubious decisions, too < 1289419976 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think GNU have managed to successfully embrace-and-extend C < 1289419980 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Linux's sharing works *precisely* the same as Plan 9's. The only stuff that isn't shared (and even that, I'm pretty sure, is COW) is stuff that's writable. < 1289419985 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Ah. Okay. < 1289419995 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1289420006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: too many people are complacent with bad design and tactics just because they're perceived as supporters of freedom < 1289420023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who calls out GNU for encouraging people to go beyond the standards and write code that isn't portable to non-GNU systems? < 1289420026 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nobody < 1289420035 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it functions just the same for dynamic libraries. The only gain dynamic libraries get you is that there's only a single copy of each symbol floating around, rather than a single copy per program using it. < 1289420043 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm not even sure /how/ to call them out < 1289420048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Right. But if the symbols are tiny, it doesn't make any sense. < 1289420055 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you can't, really; any anti-gnu site would just be dismissed as FUD < 1289420065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I have become rather cynical towards GNU. < 1289420075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1289420078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Right. But if the symbols are tiny, it doesn't make any difference. < 1289420096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: For instance, a system running dynamically-linked glibc executables will use the same or more memory than one using statically-linked uClibc executables. < 1289420098 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which makes whether or not you get a benefit from dynamic or static linking, well, complex. < 1289420108 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the advertising clause in the GPLv2 is pretty bad (not nearly as bad as the one in the GFDL...) < 1289420119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it has an *advertising clause*? < 1289420123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You get benefits, just maybe not memory ones. < 1289420137 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: if you modify a non-interactive GPLv2 program to become interactive < 1289420143 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it has to put up a GPL blurb when it loads < 1289420144 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well, yes. I was just concerning myself with the memory and disk usage for this. < 1289420145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ah, yes < 1289420150 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: does v3 have that? < 1289420153 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't remember < 1289420155 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me check < 1289420165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Disk space is definitely a win, measure static uClibc vs. dynamic glibc sometime. (Okay, browsers are bigger.) < 1289420198 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: But still, I have disk. And RAM. Do you? < 1289420199 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: If you've got a lot of static binaries, there *might* be a benefit from dynamic linking. < 1289420218 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Using the precise same libraries, of course... < 1289420219 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: have you read the new chapters in "learn you a haskell"? < 1289420220 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes to some extent, but it's been toned down from v2's < 1289420226 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: not recently; I read the one about zippers < 1289420243 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Glibc ends up producing gigantic dynamic libraries compared with uClibc's static libraries, of course. < 1289420247 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it has monads now! < 1289420257 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : An interactive user interface displays "Appropriate Legal Notices" to the extent that it includes a convenient and prominently visible feature that (1) displays an appropriate copyright notice, and (2) tells the user that there is no warranty for the work (except to the extent that warranties are provided), that licensees may convey the work under this License, and how to view a copy of this License. If the interface presents a list of user < 1289420258 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :commands or options, such as a menu, a prominent item in the list meets this criterion. < 1289420299 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're interested, that clause (in v2 and v3) has only triggered twice in me writing GPL programs: C-INTERCAL and jettyplay (both of which were based on previous GPL code) < 1289420303 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"prominent" < 1289420338 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C-INTERCAL handles it with a license blurb when starting up the debugger; jettyplay has a comment about the GPL as the default status bar when it loads < 1289420350 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: how long did it take to write c-intercal? < 1289420358 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: I didn't write it from scratch < 1289420365 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think esr wrote the original version in a weekend, but it didn't actually work < 1289420371 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've spent years on it, but not continuously < 1289420375 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea but what you were doing with it < 1289420377 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1289420381 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: If you are the copyright holder, you can add an additional permission allowing for you to not do that with GPLv3. < 1289420393 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does anyone know if xchat can be set to ignore mentions of a name too? < 1289420399 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least addressed messages < 1289420403 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I'm not the only copyright holder for either of the programs in question < 1289420412 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C-INTERCAL has loads of copyright holders, jettyplay has 3 IIRC < 1289420436 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the copyright holder on a GPLv3 work may add any number of additional permissions; these permissions can be removed by anyone at will.) < 1289420452 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, 5 < 1289420499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :12:11:59 that's different from arbitrarily deleting programs that use GNU extensions < 1289420499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :12:12:17 (especially as gcc is entirely capable of compiling programs that use them...) < 1289420506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not library extensions, if you don't use glibc < 1289420508 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the bzip2 library was originally BSD, but I relicensed it as GPLv2 to simplify the license for the program as a whole < 1289420531 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: not to mention, it deletes all C files in the current directory, rather than the files you were compiling, which might or might not be in the current directory < 1289420540 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, the files you're compiling need not end with the .c extension < 1289420544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: sry will never joke ever :P < 1289420584 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :incidentally, GPLv3 is /much/ saner than GPLv2, despite its many detractors < 1289420594 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I discovered this due to reading GPLv3 incessantly while testing azip < 1289420605 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it's one of the two test files I'm using) < 1289420648 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: CAN I HAZ AZIP LOLRZL < 1289420656 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh right, I got it working again < 1289420660 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me see if I got unazip working too < 1289420671 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Yeah, the GPLv3 is genuinely a better license, FUD aside. < 1289420686 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are licenses that important < 1289420705 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: they can be, it depends on what you're doing < 1289420705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: yes. < 1289420707 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: Because we live in a society where copyright law has gone crazy: YES. < 1289420741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There isn't much more important than freedom. (Have I really turned into a freetard? Oh well, at least I still dislike the GPL.) < 1289420746 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm just testing it atm, I'll send it to you if it's working, and otherwise check what's wrong < 1289420758 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i didn't expect you to actually send it, but sure :P < 1289420772 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, I can't see much of a reason why you'd choose GPLv2 over GPLv3, except compatibility with other GPLv2 things, which is pretty large < 1289420779 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A programmer is basically forced to be a bit of a lawyer to not get sued for all the money in this day and age. < 1289420781 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can see why you'd choose, say, BSD3 over GPLv3 < 1289420793 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BSD3 is obsolete :) < 1289420802 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was it obsoleted by? < 1289420804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BSD2 < 1289420811 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I disagree, there < 1289420849 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd also say that BSD2 was obsoleted by ISC but there you go :P < 1289420856 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The endorsement clause of BSD3 is a noöp. < 1289420865 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depends on which country you're in, I think < 1289420906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Berne convention, I think < 1289420945 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://pastebin.ca/1987512 < 1289420945 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. < 1289420956 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try using the -t option to see what it's doing < 1289420981 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And nations that haven't signed that don't recognise foreign copyright at all, so it's a moot point. < 1289420983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: your typical copyright terms, I presume? (I can't do anything without asking you) -- just checking :P < 1289420992 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, apart from modifying it locally of course... < 1289420999 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: copyright currently undecided, thus it's all-rights-reserved by defaut < 1289421001 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*default < 1289421021 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it actually turns out to be useful, I'll license it under something more permissive < 1289421028 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION should eat
< 1289421036 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ugh, now I have to write a shell one-liner to split that into two files, as is my duty < 1289421038 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note: statistically speaking, it's likely to infringe at least 1000 US patents < 1289421051 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :due to being a) software, b) a compression algorithm < 1289421075 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it was a shell one-liner to join them into one file < 1289421082 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love using more for things like that < 1289421090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you used *more* for that? < 1289421092 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've done things like "more * | less" before now < 1289421108 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's what more does if you give it multiple files and stdout isn't a terminal < 1289421198 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: now I just need unmore! < 1289421200 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ooh! < 1289421209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I know! I'll use sed to turn it into a shell script that outputs those two files! < 1289421217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(what's the sed to merge the next line with this one again?) < 1289421220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er, keeping the \n in the buffer < 1289421258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: so have you made an azip quine yet? < 1289421375 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, N is the command I wanted < 1289421568 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, I haven't tried < 1289421571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: gah, uClibc doesn't support leap second < 1289421572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*seconds < 1289421579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: how can you make me code sed like this < 1289421582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*write < 1289421594 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd be pretty awkward due to the way the encoding changes all the time < 1289421599 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as bad as trying to write a bzip2 quine < 1289421811 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1289421856 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That topic confuses me immensely. < 1289421876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I give up; I'm extracting the files manually. < 1289422034 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm < 1289422048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ? < 1289422060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: filebin converts to DOS line endings, jesus christ < 1289422074 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wrt last highlight of me :P < 1289422077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i forget < 1289422086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: can't you just uuencode a tarball to sprunge.us? :) < 1289422091 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, reddit thread < 1289422096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ah < 1289422109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: specifically, the post and notch's reply < 1289422113 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which i highlighted) < 1289422168 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: btw, why do I get &e0 when i die without points? < 1289422170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :strange way of saying 0 :P < 1289422188 0 :digimunk!~David.Man@prague.dreamhost.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1289422207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wonders whether anyone other than dreamhost employees ircs from dreamhost
< 1289422212 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, "&e0"? < 1289422217 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also uh points? < 1289422229 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: umm yes you get told your # of points when you die < 1289422254 0 :digimunk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not an employee of dreamhost < 1289422255 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, http://i.imgur.com/YDI84.png (no I didn't take this one, but abuse of F4!) < 1289422261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seen it < 1289422267 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :digimunk: why would you irc from dreamhost? < 1289422279 0 :digimunk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tunnel out of work through dreamhost < 1289422285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://i.imgur.com/yBRWd.png < 1289422286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :digimunk: heh < 1289422302 0 :digimunk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it is banned from a lot of servers ;) < 1289422309 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, issue is they probably all go to the same portal at the other end < 1289422312 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it is fairly useless < 1289422314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yeah :( < 1289422323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :digimunk: just use tor :p < 1289422326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :banned from even more! < 1289422346 0 :digimunk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tor's a bit slow < 1289422365 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/YDI84.png < p0rtals? < 1289422381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: do you know which of -O3/-Os is faster? < 1289422389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: "p0rtals"? seriously? you replace o with 0? in 2010? < 1289422391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1289422395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :digimunk: more than a bit :) < 1289422396 0 :digimunk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HAHA < 1289422409 0 :digimunk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :r0de3ntz live! < 1289422415 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2010 < 1289422433 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://i.imgur.com/F8mY0.png this guy did what i did but moreso and, uh, creepers < 1289422521 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway creating portals from the real world seems to like to end up in the same place. Need to create all but the first portal from within nether, or it doesn't work well < 1289422524 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is very backwards < 1289422531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: heh < 1289422536 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since distances are shorter in nether, not the other way around < 1289422546 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes, but one nether pixel = 8 world pixels < 1289422549 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and quite far from each other < 1289422557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if you create nearby portals in the real world < 1289422562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they can all map to a single nether point < 1289422564 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like 100 blocks in nether < 1289422571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://i.imgur.com/Q3z6K.jpg portal bridge < 1289422576 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, dude I walked about 300 tiles in the real world < 1289422581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: true. < 1289422592 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I doubt that bridge is very walkable! < 1289422626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, is there an easy way to stop Minecraft updating apart from disconnecting? < 1289422641 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no clue < 1289422648 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, entering wrong username? < 1289422651 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from iptables :p < 1289422656 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is nether? < 1289422679 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: indeed < 1289422681 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: hell < 1289422698 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just saw someone say elsewhere that providing free education for all is selfish elitism. < 1289422701 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean what is it in Minecraft < 1289422716 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This annoys me in a poorly-expressable way. < 1289422739 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, it is a hell like word in minecraft < 1289422746 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, elliott did answer you < 1289422765 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and why 1 nether pixel = 8 rw pixels? < 1289422778 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: why is it selfish elitism? < 1289422795 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, because the stupid should be allowed to go to university too! < 1289422827 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if they can get there for free, they can't go? < 1289422833 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure i'm following the logic < 1289422841 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1289422857 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, no, the person said something idiotic about the "less intellectually able subsidising the educated elit < 1289422858 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, isn't it more fun to do the portals the proper way anyway? < 1289422867 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*elite." < 1289422882 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1289422889 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay i get it < 1289422892 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The fact that they were saying this on the internet was lost on them. < 1289422906 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, btw I think the posting times on twitter are way off... http://twitter.com/notch the top one said "less than 20 seconds" half an hour ago for me... < 1289422910 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it still does < 1289422914 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I cleared cache and such... < 1289422920 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: lost on me too < 1289422937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: server-side cache presumably < 1289422946 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, huh < 1289422948 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*? < 1289422951 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :here too though < 1289422965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: where was it < 1289422973 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : and why 1 nether pixel = 8 rw pixels? <-- well blocks, not pixels. And it is to use it for fast travel... < 1289422975 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, elsewhere. < 1289422978 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: what editor have you been using to look at the level? < 1289422980 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that works on linux < 1289422983 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: i don't get how it's ironic to say that on the internet < 1289422984 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: that's not an answer < 1289422987 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if that's what you meant < 1289422993 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, guess who made the internet. < 1289422996 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you mean the map I posted before? was a map viewer, not an editor < 1289423001 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clue: it wasn't a hairdresser. < 1289423005 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: people who paid for their uni courses? < 1289423010 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or hairdressers. < 1289423012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well ok, that. < 1289423026 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in any case i don't think that's all that ironic < 1289423032 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it is kind of hugely slow once the world becomes larger than about 20 MB < 1289423033 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it's a bit < 1289423041 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, taking minutes to load < 1289423065 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway, it was "Minutor" (see http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Programs_and_Editors#Map_Viewers) < 1289423072 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was more asking if there was a name for the size of the smallest regex, I guess < 1289423083 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: there is not afaik < 1289423087 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I tried "Minecraft X-Ray" too, but kind of useless < 1289423089 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not unique < 1289423092 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1289423093 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slow and hard to use < 1289423104 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, smallest regexes.. < 1289423117 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, using a dedicated mapper (generates images basically) might work better < 1289423117 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The min() of all the sizes of all relevent regexes < 1289423124 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ab)*a and a(ba)* for instance < 1289423138 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yeah no, i don't see how that would be very useful anyway < 1289423146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: heh only linux-compatible alpha *editor* is shareware < 1289423149 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really it's rather coincidental which ones are minimal < 1289423150 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, more like donateware but whatever < 1289423159 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, indeed, and requires python 2.6 < 1289423166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: not 2.7? < 1289423169 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, indeed < 1289423175 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it has *.pyo files < 1289423176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: lame < 1289423176 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Illustrating the difference between, say, elliott and eliott vs elliott and ehird < 1289423178 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: uhh < 1289423180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can rm the .pyos < 1289423185 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no, there are no .py < 1289423186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: oh. < 1289423187 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can't < 1289423196 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: what a load of crap. < 1289423198 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway, my system has 2.7 so... < 1289423199 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1289423203 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kind of tricky to use < 1289423221 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although the size of the regex varies directly with the size of the strings, so < 1289423225 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wonder if anyone's written docs on the format < 1289423237 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, there is on the wiki iirc < 1289423238 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also < 1289423240 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I sort of wanted a string difference like thing that works on more than two strings to give a single number < 1289423250 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wine + a windows editor might work < 1289423251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also? < 1289423254 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :worth a try < 1289423254 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: maybe. < 1289423259 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think i care enough to do that < 1289423262 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm not really interested in editors though < 1289423274 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Bet it'd expect it to be in the Minecraft folder for Windows. < 1289423290 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I only want an editor to make the game engine suffer :) < 1289423307 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, uh I think it goes into Application Data/.minecraft on windows or something < 1289423319 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, presumably you could figure out where wine puts that and then symlink < 1289423325 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh :P < 1289423337 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway, saw it listed somewhere on the wiki < 1289423420 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::C < 1289423435 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CURSE YOU ALL! < 1289423457 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have shit tons of work to do and i'm just sitting here and staring at the terminal < 1289423467 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, your own fault < 1289423473 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just close the irc client < 1289423487 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal does not understand akrasia < 1289423488 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm procrastinating < 1289423523 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm sure I will once I read the wikipedia article! < 1289423540 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :besited < 1289423540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: [[Akrasia is the state of acting against one's better judgment. Examples of akrasia include procrastination and inability to form strong cooperating communities.]] < 1289423542 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's hopeless < 1289423547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://wiki.lesswrong.com/wiki/Akrasia < 1289423555 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i close the irc client i will move to facebook or some other shit < 1289423557 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like digg < 1289423565 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :digg? haha < 1289423575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd laugh even before the upgrade, but seriously? < 1289423581 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1289423585 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :digg = corporate spam site < 1289423586 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :joking < 1289423589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :k < 1289423591 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've never been there < 1289423602 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, really? < 1289423603 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;d < 1289423605 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never knew... < 1289423614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: yeah the update ... fucked things up < 1289423618 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and caused a mass digg->reddit exodus < 1289423627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: basically stuff is no longer posted by users, it's posted by sites. < 1289423634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not strictly true for all cases, but < 1289423638 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a large part of it < 1289423670 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, of course, reddit will go down the bad path at some point too. It is kind of built in in that type of site I think... < 1289423673 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It smacks a little of the inability of Facebook users to deal with the change of a single pixel... < 1289423695 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: lol < 1289423701 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: the fact that some complaints are bullshit < 1289423701 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hm? < 1289423706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does not imply that all complaints are bullshit, ok? < 1289423714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i remember the whole last.fm upgrade bullshit. it wasn't like that < 1289423718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :digg is, quite literally, a graveyard. < 1289423727 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, but what broke? < 1289423731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kevin Rose's brain < 1289423754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: let's put it this way: a few days after the Digg upgrade, the majority of front page links linked to *reddit threads* instead of the link directly. that's literally how much it had fallen, the top links were all people linking to reddit < 1289423764 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HA < 1289423768 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :great\ < 1289423773 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now my gf asks me out < 1289423777 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, OK, I just want to know what made people leave/ < 1289423784 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forwardslashes did < 1289423790 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how could I resist < 1289423804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: i can't find a summary of the changes, and don't have the patience to blab about it < 1289423809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as i've never been a digg user < 1289423835 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I only thought it was trivial since that's how the changes seemed when I looked it up. < 1289423845 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some minor graphical redesigns, and some downtime. < 1289423876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, nothing like that < 1289423882 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the whole submission structure was changed < 1289423893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i have pumpkins everywhere. wat < 1289423967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: btw realworld->nether translation isn't literal; it won't spawn you on lava, for instance < 1289424035 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: or on water, the other way < 1289424072 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: or on water, the other way <-- on ice though < 1289424100 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what it should do is spawn you on a small platform < 1289424117 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like 3x3 < 1289424125 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe 5x5 or such < 1289424130 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the portal in the middle < 1289424141 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a few tiles above the lava < 1289424145 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at sea-level (if water) < 1289424190 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Fun thing to do: Get to a place where F4 will spawn you into a portal. Do so. Step back a bit so you don't get sucked in. Press F4 a lot. You get stuck in block and lose health rapidly, but then jumping somehow evaporates it and you end up in a box of portals. < 1289424251 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't want to mess up my map I told you < 1289424254 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :better screenshot it < 1289424271 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: So make a new world :P < 1289424277 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, meh < 1289424312 0 :TLUL!~TLUL@wikia/The-last-username-left JOIN :#esoteric < 1289424341 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TLÜL < 1289424367 0 :TLUL!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :n00ga < 1289424376 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's awesome because you can run quickly through the portals, but if you end up at a dead end... NETHER < 1289424394 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, screenshot I told you < 1289424398 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also nether is no dead end < 1289424412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :screenshotted but nowhere to put them, feel free to offer scp < 1289424413 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, with a pickaxe you can get elsewhere and make a portal and go back < 1289424440 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1289424445 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what about http://imageshack.us/ ? < 1289424465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw holding F3 shows stats < 1289424480 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also I can offer scp but only if you set up an ipsec tunnel with X.509 certs to me. Send me your local root CA cert ;P < 1289424480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i use imgur.com, which is like imageshack.us but not run by an asshole. but it's tedious to upload multiple images < 1289424497 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : btw holding F3 shows stats <-- well known < 1289424507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just sayin' < 1289424525 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you can lock it on by pressing alt after iirc < 1289424526 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something < 1289424528 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nether transition should be smoother :( < 1289424539 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Fortunately, it seems very likely that the leap second will be abolished. < 1289424565 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: really? < 1289424567 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, should yes < 1289424659 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: The IERS vote on the issue will be finished in 2011. If 70% of member nations agree, then the leap second will cease to be. < 1289424673 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I *like* the leap second. < 1289424701 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's more pain than it's worth, IMO. < 1289424717 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The main problem with it is that it's not algorithmically computable. < 1289424764 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Instead, you just have about 6 months notice about whether or not there will be one. < 1289424836 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1289424887 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, simulate the people who tell you about it. < 1289424960 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Impractical without a very good means of measuring DUT1. < 1289424967 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the difference between UT1 and UTC) < 1289424976 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: simulate the universe < 1289424979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see what they say in that universe < 1289424981 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TADA < 1289424991 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, way to steal my idea. < 1289424996 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: No, it's much easier than that... < 1289425000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine was better poophead < 1289425073 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You need to simply be able to observe UT1 (the mean solar time at the meridian through Greenwich), and see if the difference between UT1 and UTC would go above or below 0.9s in the next 6 months. < 1289425223 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Suppose we get rid of the leap second. How much time until it becomes an issue? I suppose technically it's not determinable given our lack of ability to actually determine long enough in advance when leap seconds should be, but an approximation < 1289425340 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: If Greenwich ever gets nuked we are so fucked. < 1289425350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Congratulations! You are now the Kitten toolchain consultant. < 1289425379 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh. < 1289425389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Your job is to get a working pcc/uClibc where the uClibc was compiled with pcc and the pcc was compiled with pcc and statically-linked with uClibc -- on Linux. < 1289425395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Good luck! < 1289425396 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, the Prime Meridian no longer goes directly through the Greenwich observatory. < 1289425440 0 :madbr!~madbrain@poste87-171.wl.t.ulaval.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1289425549 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I said good luck! < 1289425576 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Nein. < 1289425580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: YEIN < 1289425722 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Prime Meridian is 5.31 arcseconds east of the meridian going through the transit circle at Greenwich, rather than going straight through. < 1289425733 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because of an accident when setting up GPS. < 1289425738 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1289425770 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And they chose to change the definition of the Prime Meridian rather than change the satellites. < 1289425806 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that within walking distance? < 1289425808 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, sorry, when setting up TRANSIT, which was the very first satellite navigation system. < 1289425831 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It's 102.5 meters at the latitude of the Royal Observatory. < 1289425929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: what's your rate for getting insane linux toolchains to work < 1289425942 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll pay up to 3p a day < 1289426056 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: 10g of ¹⁹⁷Au per hour. < 1289426075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Done. Get workin' < 1289426085 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt you can pay that. < 1289426099 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Sheesh, I might charge for Kitten if nobody else does any drudge work at all :P < 1289426171 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In that case, I should charge for PSOX! < 1289426258 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, any reason you don't want the other isotope in your gold? < 1289426310 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION double-checks something
< 1289426397 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION fails to find it online
< 1289426462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: and THEN what would you do! < 1289426466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1289426519 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1289426520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoops < 1289426529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so can gparted resize partitions mounted on / yet? < 1289426535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is linux still lagging behind os x in that aspect :) < 1289426628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: and if you say use LVM i'll kill myself < 1289426668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Swap: 7431 1 7430 < 1289426671 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION gets rid of swap
< 1289426705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :7 gigs should be enough for a kitten base install methinks < 1289426706 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1289426732 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I demand that I get Kitten for free? < 1289426743 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*. < 1289426744 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: That's not a question. < 1289426748 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know that. < 1289426753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well, you have to do drudge work, then. < 1289426762 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I missed a question mark a while ago. < 1289426777 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION does not do drudge work.
< 1289426784 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover does not get Kitten for free! < 1289426785 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do get others to do it! < 1289426791 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Not successfully. :P < 1289426819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: NOW IS YOUR CHANCE TO CHANGE THE HISTORY FUTURE: JFS or btrfs? < 1289426830 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, fizzie, Vorpal, drudge. < 1289426836 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Would I be able to do any of the druge work? < 1289426841 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, if I wasn't ignored? < 1289426844 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, you can be the threat. < 1289426848 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: pinging people like that is irritating and will get you ignored < 1289426857 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Drudge, or I shall get Sgeo to SING! < 1289426873 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, OK, I'll stop. < 1289426877 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: maybe, have you ever compiled anything ever? < 1289426888 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think so < 1289426895 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make that a yes < 1289426900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: on linux? < 1289426904 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1289426920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: do you have linux installed? < 1289426937 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not at this very moment, no, but I do have access to my school's Linux system < 1289426970 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, it takes, what, 5 minutes to install it/ < 1289426973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Have you ever debugged problems with the C stdlib initialisation files (crt1.o) etc. on Linux? < 1289426973 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*? < 1289426978 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: but it doesn't run active worlds! < 1289426982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also more like 10 < 1289426984 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, OF COURSE! < 1289426999 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've WRITTEN crt before. < 1289427009 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no :( < 1289427010 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You won't do drudge work. < 1289427015 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not terribly difficult, but anyway... < 1289427023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: (Drudge work = compiling uClibc and pcc twice or so, sorting out problems.) < 1289427031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: (This involves recompiling pcc with pcc and uClibc.) < 1289427041 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: (Also probably compiling a cross-compiling gcc, so that uClibc works.) < 1289427043 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And V*rpal just said that it didn't ount. < 1289427047 0 :Sasha2!~WHAT@97-124-34-128.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1289427051 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah. < 1289427052 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*count < 1289427058 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what didn't count? < 1289427118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Then I can't think of anything you can do except test it, which would involve... installing it. < 1289427122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also using it. < 1289427123 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My crt.o. < 1289427172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Why not? < 1289427174 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since it was for Microcosm, and apparently despite the fact that *he had said the ABI was x86-64 UNIX* he claimed that the ABI hadn't been picket. < 1289427176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And not count as what? < 1289427177 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*picked < 1289427183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1289427193 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Microcosm is just a lame version of my user-space POSIX project, anyway. :P < 1289427216 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :QUICK < 1289427220 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MAKE WORDS WITH TTIASACRMMMILLHTMITEHIT < 1289427261 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Disclosure: I'm doing this for Reddit stuff) < 1289427320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Too wimpy to install it? :p < 1289427334 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, maybe over the weekend when I have time < 1289427353 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, can I install in user-space? < 1289427364 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :True; terrible Italians always scrape along crevasses. Remember, multi-meters militantly inject legumes litigiously, having tried mayonnaise. I tried eating hare, I think. < 1289427505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ...how the hell would you be able to install in user-space? < 1289427508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Other than, uh, Wubi. < 1289427527 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Depends on what exactly is being installed. < 1289427534 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OS stuff, obviously not < 1289427539 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Actually you'll probably only be able to install from Linux to start with... as I haven't written an installer. < 1289427571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: You realise that Kitten is an OS? < 1289427586 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I do < 1289427635 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ... it's a Linux distro. < 1289427751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: So, seems I have to look elsewhere for a drudger :p < 1289427761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: So want to do the drudge-work?! That isn't actually drudgy?! < 1289427764 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or just wait until I have some free time < 1289427786 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the maximum amount of work I'm doing is "sh drudge.sh". < 1289427802 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Oh come on, compiling stuff is fun! < 1289427814 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, noooooo < 1289427821 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ザルゴイットカームズ！ヒーフーウェイツビハインドザワルズ！ < 1289427848 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1289427889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You get to compile, then! < 1289427943 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: sàrukò i'to kâmusù? hî hû uēitu hìhaintò sà warusù? < 1289427949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :drgdfg < 1289427963 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, what's this about the loogoid? < 1289427971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: So, JFS or btrfs, which do you want to see? < 1289427973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or other. < 1289427982 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Definitely ZFS. < 1289428001 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, also, your vowel extension lines are MISPLACED! < 1289428012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: They're not lines. < 1289428019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're pikhq's own romanisation scheme. < 1289428025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You... do realise that the native ZFS port is not yet released? < 1289428030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: And FUSE, no. < 1289428036 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that's re his katakana. < 1289428049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Oh look: "This project solves the licensing issue by distributing ZFS as a separate kernel module users will have to download and build for themselves." < 1289428055 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: So no, I cannot use ZFS. Pick again. < 1289428068 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm aware, I was being unhelpful. < 1289428071 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: [[There's still some major work to be done, so this is not production-ready code. The ZFS Posix Layer has not been implemented yet, therefore mounting file systems is not yet possible; direct database access, however, is. Supposedly, KQ Infotech is working on this, but it has been rather quiet around those parts for a while now.]] < 1289428072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1289428084 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I won't even make you work on it! Just offer opinions, dammit :p < 1289428104 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Btrfs seems significantly more awesome. < 1289428133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: btrfs is also still labelled as "WILL DESTROY YOUR DATA FUCKING FUCK FUCKSHIT", and is not part of any official stable kernel release. < 1289428147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Also, btrfs needs a separate /boot. < 1289428150 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, what are you going on about the Loogoid for? < 1289428195 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Whereas JFS is insanely stable, "fsck" takes less than a second if there's nothing wrong and a second or two for excellent recovery if there is, has many of the advanced XFS features without the unreliability, and is generally awesome. The *single* downside to JFS is that it doesn't support resizing on Linux. IIRC it does on OS/2. < 1289428222 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ... Loogoid? What? < 1289428226 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: That was Zalgo. < 1289428232 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, ah. < 1289428240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Oh, and btrfs is under Oracle control. < 1289428245 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: And FUCK ORACLE. < 1289428245 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You suck at reading kana, apparently. < 1289428252 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Wait, seriously? Fuck Oracle. < 1289428255 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I didn't read that... < 1289428263 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got my Japanese friend to do it. < 1289428267 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yes; it is an Oracle project. The lead developer works on it at Oracle. < 1289428270 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Then... He sucks. :P < 1289428279 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Or just doesn't handle English-in-kana well. < 1289428287 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Very possibly. < 1289428287 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which, granted, is completely screw.) < 1289428290 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(screwy) < 1289428292 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You will now whine about how JFS doesn't support resizing. < 1289428336 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well, then JFS isn't an option either. < 1289428385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Personally the lack of resizing doesn't bother me too much. But obviously it's a deal-breaker for many. So, tell me: what do you suggest? :P < 1289428407 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Resizing is a very nice thing. < 1289428428 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sufficiently so that I consider filesystems not supporting it a non-option. < 1289428430 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Resizing? < 1289428441 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Just that. < 1289428449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Being able to resize a partition. < 1289428457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Come on then, I'm waiting :) < 1289428486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ReiserFS isn't an option for obvious reasons. XFS is a bit prone to data loss, apparently. < 1289428505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Apparently Linux supports the FFS BSD filesystem, but really now, no :P < 1289428522 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, because it causes uxicide? < 1289428529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ? < 1289428536 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Namesys is somehow still functioning. < 1289428540 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wificide! < 1289428541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Err, no. < 1289428546 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Indeed < 1289428549 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: The future of the company fell into doubt after Reiser was found guilty of murder and announced plans to sell the company to pay for his legal defense.[2] Their website has not been accessible since November 2007. Edward Shishkin, a Namesys employee, was quoted in a January 2008 CNET article as saying that "commercial activity of Namesys has stopped".[3] < 1289428559 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: They get funding from DARPA. < 1289428560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Namesys is dead, dead, dead and ReiserFS with it. < 1289428563 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Honest. < 1289428575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ReiserFS 4 development is still stopped. < 1289428581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: And I don't want to use ReiserFS, so there :P < 1289428582 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Why Hans hasn't sold it is beyond me. < 1289428593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ...can he? He's in jail, you recall. < 1289428596 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait < 1289428598 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: And they're trying to get Reiser4 into the kernel... < 1289428602 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Also, he's hardly a sane man. < 1289428608 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ? < 1289428611 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yes, you can still sell stock ownership in jail. < 1289428621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: See my note about his sanity :P < 1289428625 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If he was found guilty, what's he hoping for wrt the legal defense? Less jail time or avoiding of capital punishment? < 1289428633 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ...he's already in jail. < 1289428649 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On September 5, 2008, Hans Reiser arrived at San Quentin State Prison to begin serving his sentence. Reiser tried to appeal his second-degree murder conviction on October 30, 2008. The request was denied by Judge Larry Goodman on November 13, 2008.[50][51] On January 10, 2009, it was reported that Reiser was recovering after having been beaten by several prisoners.[52][53] On January 28, 2009, he was transferred to Mule Creek State Prison.[54] < 1289428651 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So what can he be hoping for in terms of legal defense? < 1289428662 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ...why would he be hoping for any legal defence at this point? < 1289428667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He confessed, he's in jail, 15 years to life. < 1289428677 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The future of the company fell into doubt after Reiser was found guilty of murder and announced plans to sell the company to pay for his legal defense" < 1289428698 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ...not recently. < 1289428701 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Reiser cannot appeal his conviction or sentence as a result of his plea bargain." < 1289428705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Before he confessed, Sgeo. < 1289428721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Picked a filesystem yet? :P < 1289428747 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Fuck filesystems. < 1289428760 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: WELL THAT SOLVES THE PROBLEM < 1289428775 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ext5 < 1289428792 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ext1337 < 1289428812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The ext series' obsolescence is planned; Ted Ts'o says that ext4 is a stopgap measure, and the future is btrfs. < 1289428828 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Therefore ext5 will not exist; ext4 is the last version, before a transition to btrfs. < 1289428837 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rename it ext5, plobrem sloved < 1289428865 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So not only will we have to time travel, but we'll have to go to a different universe < 1289428867 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: Except that all the other ext filesystems are related. < 1289428868 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Problem solved < 1289428883 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1289428889 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why are there so many linux filesystems :D < 1289428911 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most of the filesystems Linux supports were designed for other OSes... < 1289428912 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: there aren't that many. < 1289428913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a lot of them are ports. < 1289428915 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most of them even < 1289428918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xfs, jfs: ports < 1289428922 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at the very least < 1289428934 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION → sleep
< 1289428937 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1289428950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Maybe I'll use venti. :P < 1289428972 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ones for Linux in particular are: extfs, btrfs, ReiserFS. That I can think of. < 1289428976 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Maybe I'll use fossil, I mean. :P < 1289428986 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You'd need a ported fossil server in your initramfs, and 9P support in the kernel. < 1289428998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ext is an extended version of the Minix filesystem. < 1289428999 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: :P < 1289429008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Wait, seems not. < 1289429017 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You're right, ext is Linux-specific. < 1289429033 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the other ext filesystems are patches on that. < 1289429037 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Maybe I'll use http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xiafs, ext2's competitor. < 1289429048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The maximum size of a file was 64 MiB and the maximum size of a partition was 2 GiB." < 1289429074 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Wow, I'm pretty sure FAT16's better than that. < 1289429084 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Apparently that's *better* than ext. < 1289429087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ext must have been terrible. < 1289429096 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, FAT16 is precisely that. < 1289429101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh. < 1289429106 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ext -- worse than FAT16! < 1289429119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Or, I guess, it might be the same as ext and have improved other things. Maybe.) < 1289429135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: If you like specific bootloaders, now's the time to demand one. < 1289429143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(As part of the default package set, that is.) < 1289429150 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fat16 handles large files no? < 1289429152 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Eh, Grub2's not bad it seems. < 1289429157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Nope. < 1289429164 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Pick again. (I already know what my favourite is.) < 1289429171 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't care that much, to be honest. < 1289429183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Correct! The answer is: LILO. < 1289429191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I am not joking. < 1289429201 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I mean, a bootloader runs for all of a few hundred clock cycles. Doesn't matter in the slightest. < 1289429210 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LIIIIIIIIIIIIILOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO < 1289429232 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Waaaitt. < 1289429243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Waaaait? < 1289429246 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: FAT16 handles up to 4GB files. < 1289429253 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: But only up to 2GB filesystems. < 1289429263 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha, wtf < 1289429269 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X-D < 1289429273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: LIIIILOOOOOOO < 1289429291 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Likewise for FAT12, which handles up to 4GB files, but only up to 32MB filesystems. < 1289429299 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: The LInux LOader certainly works. < 1289429312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: It can also chainload! It can even read JFS partitions! < 1289429314 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And doesn't do much more than that. < 1289429320 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Surely it's just an accidental feature that it theoretically handles files up to that size? < 1289429325 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION should read the specs
< 1289429346 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually < 1289429355 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's a good first filesystem to read about? < 1289429356 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: http://i.cbsi.com.au/story_media/339303370/slackware-131_7.jpg Doesn't look bad if you ask me. < 1289429360 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: FFS. < 1289429367 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: (Not exasperation.) < 1289429379 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Different design with multiple OSes: http://www.designlegion.com/linux/screenshots/lilobmp.jpg < 1289429393 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: The file size is stored as 4 bytes. < 1289429406 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: On all FAT filesystems. < 1289429468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Question. Does any filesystem split files into multiple inodes? < 1289429471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or meta-inodes, whatever. < 1289429519 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Why would it? An inode is just metadata. < 1289429520 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So what happens if a Windows user tries to ... oh, FAT < 1289429524 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NTFS != FAT < 1289429533 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does anyone still use FAT? < 1289429540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1289429543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But they use FAT-*32*. < 1289429543 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Most flash drives. < 1289429546 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on my win98 box, yeah < 1289429546 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not -16. < 1289429556 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: And a lot of consumer electronics. A *lot*. < 1289429557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: If two files share the same N byte chunk... would be nice to share their storage? Eh, I dunno. < 1289429577 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but is the added complexity of that worth it? < 1289429579 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Amiga Fast File System? < 1289429580 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: So, you're asking about deduplicative storage. < 1289429582 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or something else? < 1289429583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: Probably not. < 1289429587 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Unix/BSD Fast File System. < 1289429592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Wikipedia it. < 1289429606 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berkeley_FFS ? < 1289429611 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1289429611 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ty < 1289429626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Read it all, the history is quite informative. < 1289429638 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Well, yes. A lookup tree from some hash to where it's stored. Only problem there is that you have to not only do a lookup but then a compare of N bytes to make sure... < 1289429670 0 :cheater99!~cheater@g228060236.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1289429679 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ZFS. < 1289429693 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ZFS does that? < 1289429693 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(fuck Oracle) < 1289429696 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1289429706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: How big are the chunks? Configurable? (Default?) < 1289429713 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I want some kind of citation before I believe that 4GB file-size limit for FAT12) < 1289429730 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File_Allocation_Table < 1289429733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: table at right < 1289429736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Max file size 4 GB minus 1 byte (or block size if smaller) < 1289429739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for FAT-12, FAT-16, FAT-32 < 1289429741 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Filesystem block level. < 1289429748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: how big are those typically again? 4k? < 1289429755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: so FAT-12 can store 4 GB files but only 32 MB volumes :D < 1289429757 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Typically. < 1289429770 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah, I saw that, but I want proof that it's also true < 1289429777 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: well, imagine if it only used two bytes < 1289429779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: 64k file max < 1289429783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: and a non-power-of-two is ... iffy < 1289429831 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a ... non-power-of-two-times-eight power of two < 1289429836 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Buut by default it just trusts the hash. < 1289429841 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: wat < 1289429852 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(SHA256) < 1289429862 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner is questioning what's so iffy about 3 bytes < 1289429865 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Urgh. < 1289429866 0 :TLUL!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1289429875 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For the size thing < 1289429876 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you mean it goes 2 -> 4 -> 8 bytes, then you have 2^(8*2^n) < 1289429893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: 2^1 = 2. 2^2 = 4. 2^3 = 8 < 1289429901 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Though deduplication is not enabled by default. < 1289429915 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: And you can tell it to verify a lack of collision with a filesystem option. < 1289429920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I can't put my faith in an filesystem that I can't trust to always work if my hardware is OK. < 1289429927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And verification sounds slow. < 1289429943 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, see "pig carting" on http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Saddle < 1289429947 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds fun < 1289429979 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Eh, involves reading or looking in the filesystem cache to verify. < 1289429993 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's the storage size in bytes, what I referred to was the maximum size you can store < 1289430009 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: err, surely it just gives a start pointer and file size < 1289430012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't see why it wouldn't < 1289430023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: heh < 1289430024 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: And it'd have to do a disk access anyways; with deduplication your blocks are reference-counted. < 1289430027 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Woohoo1 < 1289430035 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ...? < 1289430037 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learn You A Haskell now has a chapter on zippers! < 1289430044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck. < 1289430051 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: also, I'm still talking about the formulas for non-iffy sizes < 1289430056 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not about FAT12 anymore < 1289430058 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: you confuse me < 1289430062 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, I do < 1289430067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: i'm saying that < 1289430080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: the maximum file size in these is controlled entirely by the file size field < 1289430086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which any sane person would size as a power of two < 1289430094 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fat, it's 4 bytes. < 1289430102 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: a power of two number of bytes, that is < 1289430106 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: what's the C type for 3 bytes? < 1289430168 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: But in FAT-12 the actual filesystem pointers are 12 bits. I think they were mad. < 1289430175 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, there isn't one? < 1289430177 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously :P < 1289430179 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ...no shit < 1289430180 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1289430186 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why do you need one? < 1289430187 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just saying that if the field size grows as 2^n, the file sizes you can store in that field grows as 2^(8*2^n) < 1289430195 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: READ CONTEXT OR DON'T REPLY AT ALL FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF < 1289430197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: right < 1289430209 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, calm down, after all I did for you < 1289430216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ffffffffff < 1289430228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: or, 2^(2^(n+3)) :P < 1289430233 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: k :p < 1289430237 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott: But in FAT-12 the actual filesystem pointers are 12 bits. I think they were mad. <-- um, do they use the remaining 4 bytes up to the 16 byte boundary for anything else? < 1289430237 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1289430248 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No. < 1289430251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: THE FIRST FEW BYTES OF THE FILE CLEARLY < 1289430252 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1289430280 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, ... wtf < 1289430289 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well it could be used for flags or some such < 1289430292 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 12 bits plus 4 bytes? that's 44 bits < 1289430294 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, like "is read only" < 1289430299 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, 4 bits I meant < 1289430303 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and 16 bits < 1289430317 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously < 1289430318 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vorpal: they pack them together < 1289430320 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Erm. Well, yeah, it's not 0-filled after the 12. < 1289430328 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, ah, what is it used for? < 1289430340 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr, ... what < 1289430344 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Depends on where in the structs... < 1289430344 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it codes 2 entries over 3 bytes < 1289430352 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr, aaaaah < 1289430361 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: :D < 1289430377 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, actually you can do this in C. bitfield < 1289430382 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :floppies are nasty < 1289430385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: not packing though < 1289430386 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1289430392 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: All on-disk file pointers are 12 bits, and the whole thing is a bunch of linked lists... < 1289430402 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you use 25% less space for the FAT, you're saving on the reading speed < 1289430402 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This looks vaguely like it would benefit from being a monad < 1289430405 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plus metadata. < 1289430411 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, ah < 1289430423 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, as long as they don't cdr-encode XD < 1289430445 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I am so tempted just to use ext3. < 1289430454 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Or FFS. < 1289430463 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most floppy drives are ridiculously slow < 1289430525 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anything wrong with ext4? < 1289430550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The curmudgeon inside me sees no point to extents. < 1289430559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Or this fancy allocation tricky thingamajig. < 1289430569 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It has benefits. < 1289430576 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/c5/E2fsck-uninit.png < 1289430578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or short fscks. < 1289430582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fine! ext2. < 1289430590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Keep talkin', keep gettin' my shit. < 1289430648 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UFSv2 uses 16k blocks by default cuz its MODERN < 1289430651 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also extents < 1289430656 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Okay, eventually we'll have you only supporting FAT12. < 1289430657 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well it is useful when you have huge files < 1289430666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -o optimization < 1289430667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (space or time). The file system can either be instructed to try < 1289430667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : to minimize the time spent allocating blocks, or to try to mini‐ < 1289430667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : mize the space fragmentation on the disk. If the value of min‐ < 1289430667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : free (see above) is less than 8%, the default is to optimize for < 1289430667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : space; if the value of minfree is greater than or equal to 8%, < 1289430669 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : the default is to optimize for time. See tunefs(8) for more < 1289430670 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, like virtualisation disk images < 1289430671 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : details on how to set this option. < 1289430673 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nay, CP/M. < 1289430673 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OPTOMISED! < 1289430692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ sudo mkfs.ufs -J /dev/sda2 < 1289430693 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, from where is that? < 1289430696 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Just made your damn decision for you. < 1289430700 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: mkfs.ufs(8) < 1289430706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: We're using the motherfucking BSD filesystem. < 1289430708 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah *bsd again < 1289430716 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm doing this on Linux though :) < 1289430724 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: UFS is fully supported in Linux. < 1289430728 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ufs support on linux is read-only iirc < 1289430731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And mkfs.ufs is just the BSD newfs. < 1289430740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Not that I know of. Hell, I just created one in Linux, I should hope it can write it. < 1289430758 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, uh, I thought it was badly broken as well. Hm < 1289430778 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and not UFS2 support of course < 1289430782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes, UFS2 support. < 1289430787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or at least, I just created a UFSv2 file system. < 1289430795 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aaand it won't mount. < 1289430800 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, as expected < 1289430800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[31980.209605] ufs was compiled with read-only support, can't be mounted as read-write < 1289430802 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I told you so < 1289430805 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Nope, it does UFSv2. < 1289430807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It can even RW. < 1289430811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It was just COMPILED not to. < 1289430814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK DEBIAN < 1289430825 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the kernel option says "Read write UFS support (DANGEROUS BROKEN!)" or some such < 1289430828 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lawl < 1289430844 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I told you it wouldn't work... < 1289430856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Interestingly I don't take your statements as certain fact. < 1289430863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially when you put "I thought" in front of them. < 1289430879 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I might just use XFS and never upgrade it. < 1289430883 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, my word is of course law ;P < 1289430916 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think ZFS is probably the coolest file system right now < 1289430937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: ZFS is (1) under Oracle control and (2) unsupported under Linux < 1289430946 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, unfortunate accidents < 1289430957 0 :digimunk!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1289430959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: Not only does the Linux native port lack things such as "mounting a filesystem" (POSIX layer hasn't been implemented), I can never *ship* a kernel with it as that would be a license violation. < 1289430970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: btrfs is also out the window because of Oracle control. < 1289430994 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btrfs is oracle-filth? < 1289431025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: yeah -- it's an Oracle "product" and the lead developer works on it at Oracle < 1289431036 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh joy, "Developer: Oracle Corporation" says wikipedia < 1289431051 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: even if they don't corrupt it, I'm uninterested in using anything Oracle puts out. < 1289431128 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.dangermouse.net/esoteric/intelligentdesignsort.html < 1289431138 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1289431163 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that didn't teach me stuff I didn't know < 1289431352 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You are not permitted to learn. < 1289431372 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"My fear that Oracle would buy Sun only to let it die are becoming reality. I can't help but envision the corpse of Sun lying inert while a cloven-hoofed Larry Ellison dances around it, cackling -- such a tragedy." < 1289431476 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: ...quite the vision < 1289431524 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :collecting and piling the corpses, dancing around, cackling < 1289431533 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hard work < 1289431539 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: SO WHICH FISLESYSTEM SHOULD I USE < 1289431555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: i'm so sad you won't test kitten sniff sniffle sniffle < 1289431567 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, if I had time I would < 1289431569 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm < 1289431577 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let me get VirtualBox working < 1289431578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: You spend an awful lot of time IRCing :P < 1289431583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: No, VirtualBox testing isn't useful. < 1289431586 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have VirtualBox myself :P < 1289431586 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: btw, if something starts boiling again, remind me that it's supposed to < 1289431592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I don't have is various different hardware configurations. < 1289431592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: k < 1289431596 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1289431606 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1289431609 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, you want me to install some OS you made? < 1289431616 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It's Linux :P < 1289431621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can easily put it on another partition. < 1289431627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although doing that might actually require Linux. Ho hum. < 1289431631 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could still be doing malicous things < 1289431641 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :malicious < 1289431646 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION can't spell today
< 1289431646 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I really have better things to do than try and fuck up your computer. < 1289431666 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION doesn't have time right now. Maybe tomorrow
< 1289431675 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Hell, it's not ready today. < 1289431677 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or tomorrow. < 1289431681 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1289431699 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Try a few weeks to a month :P < 1289431770 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: " The U.S. Justice Department accused Oracle Corp. of defrauding the federal government on a software contract that involved more than $1 billion in sales." < 1289431773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*"The < 1289431775 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :--WSJ but still. < 1289431870 0 :Sasha2_!~WHAT@97-124-34-128.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1289431907 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, lame story about me being related to some quasi-famous thing in some way < 1289431924 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has become self-aware!
< 1289431930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wut. < 1289431943 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1289431987 0 :Sasha2_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sasha2 < 1289432041 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, .... ... http://www.worldofminecraft.com/ < 1289432066 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the name < 1289432089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha < 1289432113 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION hits Vorpal with a High-Tech Hand
< 1289432137 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, what? < 1289432139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I assume you've seen: < 1289432143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2010/9/17/ < 1289432144 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2010/9/20/ < 1289432145 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, what do you mean? < 1289432160 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no I haven't. *reads* < 1289432162 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There was a Creatures fansite called The High-Tech Hand < 1289432163 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(thanks) < 1289432174 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, uh? creatures as in? < 1289432180 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The game < 1289432189 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Well, series of games) < 1289432206 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what can you turn sticks into? < 1289432219 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: ALL SORTS OF THINGS (when paired with wood) < 1289432226 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, and what has that got to do with anything? < 1289432238 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, the weird name for a site < 1289432250 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :literally every sort of thing? < 1289432258 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, okay... < 1289432269 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, nah. Just a huge number of things < 1289432295 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, various tools, torches, weapons, fishing rod, lots more < 1289432314 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also not just with wood < 1289432316 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with wood < 1289432331 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that would be for low quality tools/weapons < 1289432336 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you want rock later on < 1289432341 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then iron < 1289432356 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps, if you are lucky and find some, diamond < 1289432358 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, have you been reading Sam Hughes's NaNoWriMo stuff? < 1289432411 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no... there was a plot twist but I missed it, now I have to backtrack to find out when it twisted and why < 1289432422 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, in what? < 1289432430 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Event < 1289432441 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, don't distract me :) < 1289432496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1289432555 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, isn't he still ignoring you? < 1289432604 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, now I get it, the cuts that looked like they were from a parallel story was actually the cuts that explained the plot twist < 1289432627 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, um, no? < 1289432636 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless he was obsessively reading logs < 1289433220 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1289433223 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Write a filesystem. (You'd be good with drudge work like that, I feel.) < 1289433449 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ouch. I'd hate to do that < 1289433462 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'd just use zfs except for it's license < 1289433468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: + oracle control < 1289433476 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ugh, but then I don't want to use ext4, because fscking is so slow compared to jfs... < 1289433482 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yeah but with a saner license it wouldn't be in such control < 1289433485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: When was the last time you resized a partition? < 1289433487 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, jfs? < 1289433492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it'd still need a fork for me to trust it. < 1289433495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: (btrfs has the same problem) < 1289433502 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, to trust jfs? < 1289433503 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: what do you mean "jfs?" < 1289433508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, to trust ZFS < 1289433509 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I suggest using jfs! < 1289433521 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Absolutely perfect of course, except that it doesn't support resizing partitions. < 1289433523 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Sam Hughes NaNoWriMo < 1289433527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ? < 1289433528 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have you been reading it? < 1289433529 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it supports growing iirc < 1289433534 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Not really. Why? < 1289433538 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not shrinking though < 1289433540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: not that I know of < 1289433550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :JFS includes a rather unusual partition-resizing ability: It's built into the kernel's JFS driver. You can use this feature to increase, but not to decrease, the size of the filesystem. As with most other partition-resizing tools, you must modify the partition size first by using fdisk to delete the partition and then recreate it with a larger size. After you've done this, you should mount the partition as you normally do and then issue the follo < 1289433550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wing command: < 1289433552 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, indeed < 1289433563 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, man mount < 1289433566 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just wondering. Also, there's at least one story that you'd have some shnaudenfraud over imagining me in it < 1289433573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: i have seen it. < 1289433576 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :spelling fail < 1289433585 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is aware of the fail
< 1289433587 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I suggest just using gparted