< 1293840031 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah < 1293840390 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Happy New Year for REAL! < 1293840419 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, my view of the Edinburgh fireworks was completely spoilt by a church in the way. < 1293840459 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I shall have to consult with the local branch of Al Qaeda. to have it removed. < 1293840474 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOTE TO MI5: I DO NOT REALLY INTEND TO DO THIS < 1293840502 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :al qaeda demolition services < 1293840519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NODE TO MI5: Phantom_Hoover JUST TOLD ME HE REALLY INTENDS TO DO THIS < 1293840522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PLEASE MONITOR THIS COMMUNICATION < 1293840531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TERRORIST CHILD PORNOGRAPHY BOMB BOMB 9/11 AMERICAN BASTARDS CAPITALISM < 1293840533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :REVENGE < 1293840535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ALLAH < 1293840538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*NOTE < 1293840565 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOTE TO MI5: ELLIOTT IS A MENTAL PATIENT AND CANNOT BE TRUSTED < 1293840586 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :terrorist child pornography bombs are all the rage < 1293841244 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOTE TO MI5: HEY GUYS, I'M IN THE US < 1293841436 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1293841498 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oooooooo < 1293841500 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :drunk < 1293841505 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1293841520 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aaaaaaaaaa < 1293841521 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sober < 1293841546 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just spoke with thomas from trontheim via phone < 1293841551 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*d < 1293841554 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and he's sooooo drunk < 1293841563 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trondhein* < 1293841568 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*m < 1293841569 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trondheim* < 1293841578 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shut up oerjan, i know < 1293841583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tromdein < 1293841837 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :▜▘ ▄ ▄ ▌▗ ▄ ▗▘▛▖▗ ▖▖▐ ▚ ▗▖▗▖▖▖▝ ▄ ▟▖ ▗▖▗ ▖▖ ▟▖▌ ▝ ▗▖ < 1293841837 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :▐ ▛▌▄▌▞▌▛▘ ▄▌ ▐ ▛ ▛▘▛ ▐ ▐ ▘▖▌ ▛ ▐ ▙▘▐ ▙ ▌▌▛ ▐ ▛▖▐ ▘▖ < 1293841837 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :▀▘ ▘▘▀▘▝▘▝▘ ▀▘ ▘▘ ▝▘▘ ▘▘ ▀ ▝▘▘ ▝ ▌ ▘ ▘ ▝ ▘ ▘▘▘▝ ▀ ▝ < 1293841846 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :int main(int ac, char **av) < 1293841847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{ < 1293841847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#define typedef < 1293841849 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#define uint8_t a[printf("hello world\n")] < 1293841851 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#include < 1293841852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :} < 1293841855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ lol what < 1293841857 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is the most beautiful thing ever < 1293841863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Translation? < 1293841896 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I made a (Perl) script for this." It's readable even in the logs if you just manually swomp your browser into an UTF-8 frenzy. < 1293841945 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how does it work? < 1293841956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: That C program? < 1293841975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The line in stdint.h looks like "typedef unsigned char uint8_t;". < 1293841986 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Of course, depending on this is LOL NO, especially as .hs don't even have to be written in C technically. < 1293841992 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: No, it isn't. < 1293841999 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I think some of my chars are non-monospaced. < 1293842013 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. Well, that's a shamey. < 1293842030 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess the space might not be spaced like the Unicode block-drawing ones, but that's just weird. < 1293842046 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think there is a specific "block-drawing space". < 1293842070 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1293842071 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1293842986 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2qbG0zi9ZeE (don't watch this :P) < 1293843132 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : #define uint8_t a[printf("hello world\n")] <--- ....... wow < 1293843149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: wow you look different < 1293843159 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: NORLY? :P < 1293843165 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ten years does a lot to a man :P < 1293843175 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Esp. when they're the years of 14-24 < 1293843176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: yeah like make him not suck at making music OH SNAP < 1293843182 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1293843183 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that depends a LOT on what exactly stdint.h does on that given system < 1293843183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: ok question why are you dressed all normally and shit < 1293843188 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: where is the pink man < 1293843189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHERE IS THE PINK < 1293843191 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I mean, exactly how it is implemented < 1293843192 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Ten years does a lot to a man :P < 1293843201 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I THOUGHT YOU WERE GREGOR FROM THE MOMENT YOU WERE BORN < 1293843202 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sheesh < 1293843231 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good thing i'm 15, i can totally preempt all my 24-year-old-self's objections to current me and reverse them, I'VE GOT IT ALL FIGURED OUT (<-- note: same words that probably went through Gregor's head at the time :P) < 1293843252 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no objections to 14-yr-old me :P < 1293843271 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He just happens to be a different person is all. < 1293843298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: EXCUSE ME, he is NOT wearing ANY pink at ALL? < 1293843312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I mean HELLO? < 1293843315 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like I said, different person. < 1293843321 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: WORST PERSON? < 1293843330 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU ARE THE WORST PERSON < 1293843335 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Man, I just realised that talking to you instantly turns me into T-Rex. < 1293843343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that is because you are T-Rex. < 1293843399 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2qbG0zi9ZeE (don't watch this :P) <-- quite nice < 1293843411 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though you developed a lot since then < 1293843453 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, where was that? < 1293843464 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I have noooooooooo idea :P < 1293843469 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and seems you already liked to compose music that takes some effort to listen to) < 1293843538 0 :Wamanuz3!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1293843560 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you were right < 1293843570 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm drunk as f*******\ < 1293843572 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, how comes you didn't become a professional composer instead? < 1293843588 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Because I'm a far better computer scientist. < 1293843605 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think Gregor does not make the best music < 1293843606 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, then you must be really good at that! < 1293843610 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soorry Gregor < 1293843617 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Case in point :P < 1293843629 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw Pink Floyd did < 1293843639 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, you don't like classical I guess? < 1293843647 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like classical < 1293843660 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like almost every kind of music < 1293843668 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, true I would not say Gregor's work is classical < 1293843676 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather, modernistic < 1293843686 0 :Wamanuz2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1293843692 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently I time travel. < 1293843693 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHO KNEW. < 1293843697 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb, have to walk to the gas station to buy cigs < 1293843701 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, what < 1293843713 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, well, neo-classical in /style/ < 1293843718 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1293843722 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I prefer "neo-romantic" < 1293843726 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, I think defining it by when it was made is silly < 1293843772 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, why: because it breaks down for that is often called "baroque music" (which is really not a single style) < 1293843797 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also you get neo- a lot < 1293843823 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, anyway your music is not really romantic < 1293843857 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, too much dissonance for it. Maaaybe neo-"late romantic" < 1293843876 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: still here < 1293843878 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1293843984 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at greg, i play electric guitar alot < 1293843999 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i can't play any. whole song < 1293844030 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just improvise in major and minor penatatonic scales < 1293844057 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and septimal* eee i don't know if * this is good word in english < 1293844058 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1293844069 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but my gr is playing piano as well < 1293844081 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gf* < 1293844099 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ignore me, wait 30*60 s < 1293844193 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :food -> < 1293844414 0 :Wamanuz4!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1293844484 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, half an hour? < 1293844490 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, WHAT < 1293844493 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, food now!? < 1293844505 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course < 1293844517 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, ... lunch or just some snaks? < 1293844519 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :snaks* < 1293844522 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :snacks* < 1293844523 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you know that oerjan operates on a 25-hour schedule < 1293844526 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(like harry potter!*) < 1293844531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(*according to Yudkowsky canon) < 1293844534 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't eaten a proper meal for nearly six hours < 1293844542 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, well and? < 1293844543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, not so much 25-hour schedule < 1293844549 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as oerjan's body is convinced that days last 25 hours < 1293844553 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did have some snacks though < 1293844555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and, accordingly, sleeps at the same time every 25-hour day < 1293844567 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: my doctor thinks melatonin may be a good idea < 1293844567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. one hour forwards in the blatantly incorrect 24-hour day system < 1293844582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: great to hear < 1293844590 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, my body thinks it is 25.5 hours, but I keep ending up resetting it all the time < 1293844603 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well mostly all the time < 1293844604 0 :Wamanuz3!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1293844640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: according to the highly reliable internets, btw, 1.5 mg is a good dose and lasts about an hour to kick in < 1293844643 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just call me mr. doctor < 1293844643 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well something is wrong with my resetting < 1293844655 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most sites selling it i've seen recommend rather higher dosages < 1293844659 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i rather suspect a doctor might too < 1293844662 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, mine is failing atm, due to holidays < 1293844663 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks pharma companies *tinfoil hat* :) < 1293844670 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(for obvious reasons) < 1293844678 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, melatonin, what does that do now again < 1293844684 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: makes you sleep. < 1293844686 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah < 1293844728 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wasn't there something similar-named that had something to do with getting brown when being in the sun? < 1293844732 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(skin that is) < 1293844761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes. < 1293844769 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I've forgotten what it is :-P < 1293844777 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, same... < 1293844832 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Vorpal, melanin. < 1293844844 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wow, check the various boxes below http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melatonin#External_links < 1293844847 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is absurd < 1293844851 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, ah thanks < 1293844861 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Melatonin is in TiHKAL? X-D < 1293844878 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I meant the boxes below that < 1293844904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was just remarking. < 1293844917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: TiHKAL is actually the second-last box, anyway. < 1293844930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://isomerdesign.com/PiHKAL/read.php?domain=tk&id=35 Anyone wanna try the recipe? :-P < 1293844935 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what is tihkal? < 1293844947 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder if i'll end up buying it from the internet, it's rather expensive says my doctor and a bit of googling seems to imply it isn't covered by the norwegian medical expenses cap < 1293844980 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: tryptamines i have known and loved, sequel to PiHKAL. drug stuff. < 1293844996 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: It's expensive? < 1293845003 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: he's full of shit -- it's incredibly cheap on the interwebs at least < 1293845006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's from reputable sites < 1293845007 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*she < 1293845012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm sorry < 1293845057 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well i assume this is from a norwegian pharmacy, and moreover she may be referring to the fact it's not subsidized < 1293845073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: right. i assume you guys have "herbal stores" and the likes there? < 1293845076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like holland and barrett < 1293845079 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sell tons of supplements and crap < 1293845092 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you can either find it in those or the internet equivalents of those, for $nothing < 1293845107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :failing even /that/ (which I doubt) you could import it from http://melatonin.com/ i guess, but the shipping is going to be non-zero < 1293845169 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes, there are herbal stores, including some pharmacies (i noticed one the other day advertising homeopathic remedies) < 1293845203 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yeah. there's no real point in getting it from a pharmacy if it's considered a health supplement, not a drug, which it is just about everywhere < 1293845207 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otoh if melatonin is registered as a medical drug then it is unlikely to be legal for non-pharmacies to sell it here < 1293845220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I doubt it is -- Wikipedia says it is in the UK and it's _not_ < 1293845229 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can find it on tons of (reputable enough) herbal online stores < 1293845234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*online herbal < 1293845238 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(only a few very common drugs are allowed to sell in ordinary shops) < 1293845254 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well it's likely not considered a drug. < 1293845260 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just a supplement. < 1293845260 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and even that is a relatively new change) < 1293845267 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. in america it's a "dietary supplement". < 1293845415 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION googles < 1293845440 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: can you make oklopol come back?? < 1293845447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want to tell him that Phantom_Hoover totally got his 2d physics working < 1293845454 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, go to Finland and make him come back. < 1293845456 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1293845462 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh, he knows about gravity. < 1293845467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: well get the other parts working < 1293845477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yes do it. actually do you have his phone number. just call him and yell at him. < 1293845480 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, angular momentum? < 1293845480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :act drunk (or get drunk first) < 1293845486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: LOCALISED PHYSICS DISTORTIONS < 1293845498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: say #ESOTERIC AND ABANDON AND < 1293845505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do the needful < 1293845515 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, that could slot nicely into my existing classes for masses. < 1293845529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Classes for masses. < 1293845531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 < 1293845536 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Best nomenclature EVER < 1293845542 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make angular-mass a subclass of point-mass, add some extra stuff. < 1293845545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Bear in mind that Amber doesn't have any classes, though :-P < 1293845553 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no CLOS? < 1293845554 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1293845566 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Why not add an angular-stuff field to point-mass, that can be NULL? < 1293845573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Substitute appropriate nothing-value for NULL.) < 1293845579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Or how about making all point-masses angular-masses? < 1293845597 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, because I'd like to be able to make bullets point-masses. < 1293845621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I'm tempted to say that bullets should bypass physics altogether and just have their movement hardcoded. < 1293845627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since there could be thousands of them at any one time. < 1293845663 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :re < 1293845673 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have cigs and beer < 1293845682 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;et's continue < 1293845689 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :l* < 1293845691 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but curve shots around planets! < 1293845754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Have you got polygon collision yet? < 1293845766 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I've done basically nothing! < 1293845769 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION does not have oklopol's phone number < 1293845783 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, use your mathematician powers to calculate it! < 1293845792 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1293845815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Do polygon collision :P < 1293845844 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I have not the STRENGTH < 1293845844 0 :Wamanuz5!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1293845849 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: :< < 1293845850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: :{ < 1293845852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: pweeze < 1293845859 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1293845863 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :googling suggests that melatonin requires a prescription in norway < 1293845890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ;( < 1293845919 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, QUITE < 1293845942 0 :Wamanuz4!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1293845986 0 :Wamanuz5!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1293846034 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293846060 0 :Wamanuz5!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1293846077 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1293846206 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1293846274 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, so ask the doctor then? < 1293846312 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did mention it < 1293846350 0 :Wamanuz5!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1293846382 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: if you ever want to see Asteroids II out you better code polygon collision >:) < 1293846382 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, yes I mean ask again if you need a prescription < 1293846393 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it is too late < 1293846395 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, can't you do it? < 1293846407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: tomorrow then! < 1293846408 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i'm lazy < 1293846412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i already have to write a compiler for this < 1293846502 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems like melatonin is falling a bit between the cracks in norway, simply by not being properly registered there. you can get it but it's more complicated and unsubsidized. < 1293846518 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it is tomorrow already < 1293846522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: just import it from the us >:) < 1293846577 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, see note about prescription. I doubt importing it is legal then < 1293846596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Hear that? The police are gonna get you for drug smuggling. < 1293846601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"...found with whole GRAMS of melatonin..." < 1293846637 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1293846650 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why do you always exaggerate everything < 1293846676 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess it's unregistered because it's natural and therefore unpatentable... < 1293846676 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm trying to demonstrate that importing melatonin being illegal is completely irrelevant as no non-ridiculous response could be taken. < 1293846703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, they'd be incriminating oerjan for importing something harmless that's ALREADY INSIDE HIS BODY. < 1293846741 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, by that logic DMT should be okay everywhere, since the human body naturally have traces of DMT < 1293846747 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i suspect if i got a prescription first i could legally import it < 1293846754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I see no issue with that statement < 1293846757 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that would be sane, at least < 1293846775 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm < 1293846791 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, indeed. But that is not the case < 1293846797 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Admittedly, importing poop would be kind of weird :P < 1293846798 0 :Wamanuz2!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1293846808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, but you can't get high off melatonin :P < 1293846927 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well why is it in that tihkal then? < 1293846952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Who knows? The entry just talks about it being unclear whether it's effective for sleep or not, going by WP's link. < 1293846964 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1293846965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not solely a book to get high off, unless I'm sorely mistaken :P < 1293846968 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1293846970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(INHALIN' PAPER) < 1293846980 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, :D < 1293847028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, melatonin is a tryptamine with interesting properties, thus explaining its presence. < 1293847068 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but does it involve lipase amylase and trypsin? < 1293847078 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they gonna help with my digestion < 1293847148 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHY DOESN'T MY SHELL WORK < 1293847183 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about insulin, glucagon, coming from the islets of langerhans? < 1293847185 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: fix my shell ok < 1293847242 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: give me root ssh < 1293847252 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nou < 1293847257 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think the mmap might be failing or something < 1293847460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf@@this < 1293847799 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hey < 1293847809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi augur < 1293847820 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/etw3g/problem_boole_comparisons_in_php/c1awit4 < 1293847822 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4u < 1293847837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: lol depends < 1293847841 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it does! < 1293847853 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it depends on what the other things are! < 1293847869 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: I have a better table < 1293847872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: I will express it in html < 1293847872 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1293847877 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no! < 1293847883 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use your css! < 1293847883 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :D: < 1293847887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a table, doofus < 1293847893 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooooooo ~#@_@#~ < 1293847897 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes i know im just being a dick < 1293847918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur:
xy
xTrueFalse
yFalseTrue
< 1293847923 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the important point tho is the conversation with kamatsu < 1293847933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: tada, a perfect description of a (properly-implemented) equality function in Haskell! < 1293847937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming all Eq classes are done right that is < 1293847938 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true ;) < 1293847944 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :technically x can == y < 1293847951 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but only if x is indistinguishable from y /outside/ the module < 1293847952 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can indeed! < 1293847954 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if x == y < 1293847956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's x == x from outside < 1293847956 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1293847959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: shut up :) < 1293847961 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;D < 1293847963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: ok new table < 1293847966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : x < 1293847968 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x (x==x) < 1293847970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1293847973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : x < 1293847973 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lolol < 1293847975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y (x==y) < 1293847977 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PERFECT TABLE < 1293847980 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the convo with kamatsu is the important bit < 1293848006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: meh, mere misunderstanding :P < 1293848012 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really < 1293848023 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he originally said it compared forall a. (Eq a) => a < 1293848026 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is also false < 1293848047 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the point is that (==) only compares two things of the same type < 1293848065 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and he said it could compare bool to string if you wanted < 1293848074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1293848076 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is false, without some major magic < 1293848104 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but god damn if that little ascii table didnt get me some karma < 1293848236 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one thing i fucking love about haskell is (G)ADTs < 1293848248 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i love that i can define new atomic values out of nothing < 1293848253 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1293848259 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and theres no possibility of misusing them as some other type < 1293848270 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's awesome < 1293848296 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :enums are nice and all, but the fact that they're usually just another name for an int is a problem < 1293848323 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1293848334 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, obviously you could do atomic values as ints and shit, but the type system enforces the opacity < 1293848336 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and OO languages typically add too much baggage to ADTs < 1293848343 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1293848365 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, i like OO for some reasons, but GADTs and type classes are sexy < 1293848414 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OO style for certain things is quite appealing. < 1293848427 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1293848435 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :list functions, for instance < 1293848454 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm? < 1293848489 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i much prefer xs { |x| x.odd? }.map { |x| x ** 2 } over map (**2) (filter odd xs) < 1293848503 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er.. xs.filter { ... < 1293848530 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tho i'd prefer if i could do xs.filter(odd?).map(**2) < 1293848535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: that's just concatenative :) < 1293848537 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that perl 6? < 1293848542 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ruby < 1293848546 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1293848558 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, i know, i just like the style of having Collection Method PRoc < 1293848564 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than Method Proc Collection < 1293848578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: true. currying gets ugly though. < 1293848585 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know < 1293848587 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :admittedly you can say .filter(odd?) in a platonically perfect language < 1293848588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but still < 1293848588 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think in haskell theres a reverse apply isnt there? < 1293848589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's less pure < 1293848592 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like $ but backwards? < 1293848594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: sure, "flip" :P < 1293848599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah, i think there is < 1293848603 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: APL? < 1293848605 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah yeah but i think theres a built in flip ($) < 1293848609 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lets call it $$ < 1293848624 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and lets say its left associative < 1293848629 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously: xs $$ filter odd $$ map (**2) < 1293848642 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION → sleep < 1293848645 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so haskell doesnt make this style impossible < 1293848653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: what about APL? < 1293848658 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is all the more reason to fuckin love haskell < 1293848660 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: nothing built in, maybe in a module < 1293848660 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293848665 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: haskell's type system is bad :) < 1293848669 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: whatever. its easily definable, anyway < 1293848671 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: bad how < 1293848710 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you can probably do .filter(odd?).map(**2) in APL, except it would be 5 characters long < 1293848728 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: too restricting < 1293848734 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, i think Perl 6 actually does allow .filter(odd?).map({* ** 2}) < 1293848736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: i can probably do that in J < 1293848737 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: probably 6 < 1293848742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: don't need that {} do you? < 1293848743 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it doesn't, it certainly ought to < 1293848746 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: maybe not < 1293848747 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: restriction in what fashion? < 1293848752 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.. restricting** < 1293848754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: compare to Coq's < 1293848758 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont know coqs < 1293848759 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm not up-to-date in Perl 6 < 1293848760 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a middle-ground is probably nicest for actual programming) < 1293848763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: then i can't explain sry < 1293848765 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its dependently typed tho isnt it? < 1293848767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1293848774 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well there you go < 1293848779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's more than that though < 1293848790 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any type system that isnt itself a turing complete programming language is too restricted to you, isnt it? < 1293848790 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1293848799 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: um Coq's type system is sub-TC < 1293848801 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so is Coq itself < 1293848804 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh is it? < 1293848811 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i thought dependent types are TC < 1293848814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: yes, otherwise _|_ would prove any proposition < 1293848817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1293848822 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is it only _some_ DT systems < 1293848838 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: well with dependent types your type system basically becomes a special part of your value system < 1293848844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if you use your TC language to do it, yes, it becomes TC < 1293848845 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1293848851 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you have nonterminating _types_, ho ho, good luck wit hthat < 1293848852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*with that < 1293848856 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh. anyway < 1293848861 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Agda is also sub-TC unless you tell it not to be, when it becoems inconsistent < 1293848866 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ive never gotten into the traditional theorem provers < 1293848879 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coq is really nice. you'd like it < 1293848880 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :insert cock joke < 1293848900 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i say it like caulk, so < 1293848915 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or like the kidlings on the chans say cock: cawk < 1293848967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kidlings :D < 1293848987 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: well map **2 is just foo^2 < 1293849014 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lets see, surely we can figure this apl shit out < 1293849022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno how to filter odd though :) < 1293849027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: J not apl < 1293849033 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same thing < 1293849037 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no. < 1293849038 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really not. < 1293849046 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, but thats not the point < 1293849056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, is-odd in j is just < 1293849077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0=2|n < 1293849080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1293849082 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0<2|n < 1293849088 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's not the best way to filter by odd. < 1293849091 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1293849094 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop knowing j < 1293849109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait foo^2 isn't actually map(^2) < 1293849110 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i get that 2|n is two divides n < 1293849111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd want hmm < 1293849115 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that should be boolean < 1293849119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo(^"1)2 < 1293849121 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so whats the 0 2 | n in some other language? < 1293849197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ursala < 1293849199 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah < 1293849201 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: is it actually foo^2, or do you need to do some fancy foo<<^2? < 1293849207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: 2|n is n mod 2 < 1293849218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: we want map ^2 right? < 1293849221 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: then it's foo^2 in j. < 1293849222 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah < 1293849222 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right but is it a lambda or is it a value? < 1293849225 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh in j < 1293849228 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was thinking Perl 6 < 1293849236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: who cares, we're doing j now < 1293849239 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has some syntax for turning a scalar operation into a vector one < 1293849244 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, sure about the spelling? google is unhelpful < 1293849245 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: um is "n mod 2" a lambda? :) < 1293849247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't get you < 1293849255 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cause in Functional JS you can do shit like xs.map("x*2") and itll convert "x*2" into the lambda \x -> x*2 < 1293849255 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: will find example < 1293849264 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://www.google.co.uk/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=ursala+language&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&redir_esc=&ei=i5IeTeb1EpO6hAf074i3Dg#hl=en&client=safari&pwst=1&rls=en&sa=X&ei=i5IeTaaIGIyIhQfnvIS3Dg&ved=0CBUQvgUoAA&q=ursala+language&nfpr=1&fp=733b49addeb556 < 1293849272 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because x is a variable that isnt bound < 1293849273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: you have to realise that in J there are no "lambdas" < 1293849283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: if you give an "incomplete" expression, it just becomes a box < 1293849285 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok so there are no such things at all < 1293849288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can apply boxes to things < 1293849288 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1293849292 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: there are, it just usurps them all :) < 1293849295 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dontknow shit about j, really < 1293849298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g., wait, lemme download j to demonstrate < 1293849300 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats a box < 1293849315 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, where in there? "Ursula Bellugi - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia" first hit, Lots of non-programming hits < 1293849317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh oh OH THERE IS A J BETA OUT OMG < 1293849326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: tell it you don't mean urusula. < 1293849328 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see the top bar < 1293849329 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ursula < 1293849334 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: it's a thing. < 1293849338 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, aha < 1293849342 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1293849350 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aint nothin but a j thang < 1293849358 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stupid google < 1293849359 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[701 J Engine (JE - J Language implementation) changes are incremental and compatible. < 1293849359 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :701 J Front End (JFE) changes are revolutionary! < 1293849359 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Previously the primary JFE was based on Jsoftware's proprietary WD (window driver). WD was built on Windows API and was refined and polished over more than 15 years. And for 10 years Unix users had a WD Java port. < 1293849360 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :701 abandons WD. There is risk as WD was a mature product central in so many ways to J. The replacements are as far from polished as only software version 1 can be. < 1293849362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With your patience and contributions we believe the rough will soon be polished and WD will be just a fond memory. One significant difference is that WD was a closed and proprietary system implemented in C++ and Java. The new JFE's are open and are implemented in J and based on open products and industry standards. < 1293849364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :]] < 1293849366 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg < 1293849368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this beta is my new girlfriend < 1293849371 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: why does ursala look like line noise? < 1293849376 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott? girlfriend? hahaha < 1293849379 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: ursala is terrible, do not discuss it < 1293849384 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also stop laughing :| J LOVES ME < 1293849391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The first is JHS (J HTTP Server) where a browser is the front end. The browser is a powerful front end that has considerable advantages. Almost by definition it is familiar to all users and is the most completely cross platform. With html, css, ajax, and javascript it is a rich environment. It would be a mistake to continue to ignore the focus of resources and users on the browser as the window on the world. J701 lets your browser be < 1293849391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your window on J, as well as on everything else. < 1293849391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The second is JGTK which is based on the GTK+ portable library for creating graphical user interfaces. This is on the bleeding edge of what is possible and will allow the ultimate in power user tools and applications. < 1293849392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay gtk < 1293849395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...wait i'm on os x < 1293849396 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, it was the "girl" part < 1293849399 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NAY GTK < 1293849409 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: i'm not gay. sorry. :p < 1293849426 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know you're not. if you were it wouldnt be fun to joke about < 1293849452 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh jesus you're right about ursala < 1293849459 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :choices = ^(iota@r,~&l); leql@a^& ~&al?\&! ~&arh2fabt2RDfalrtPXPRT < 1293849468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: it's crazily-designed, too < 1293849471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ask ais about it sometime < 1293849476 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, to me, it only looks slightly more noisy than J code :P < 1293849490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: i know you're not. if you were it wouldnt be fun to joke about < 1293849490 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats why elliott hates it < 1293849492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it would < 1293849494 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aaaa < 1293849496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see for example: you < 1293849496 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aaaaaa < 1293849498 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aaaaa < 1293849499 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aaaa < 1293849500 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aaaa < 1293849502 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aaa < 1293849503 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aww elliott < 1293849503 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: stfu < 1293849503 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 < 1293849503 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still drunk? < 1293849505 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aa < 1293849507 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aa < 1293849510 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a < 1293849511 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no he sobered up in 30 minutes < 1293849511 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(@ nooga) < 1293849512 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooo < 1293849515 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's 2011 < 1293849517 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooo < 1293849520 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ... body doesn't work like that < 1293849521 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but parody my own sexuality so < 1293849528 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sexuality < 1293849530 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my gf < 1293849532 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aaaaaaa < 1293849533 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aaaaa < 1293849534 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: then why ask < 1293849536 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aaa < 1293849538 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aa < 1293849541 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a < 1293849542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think nooga's gf just told him she's a lesbian < 1293849544 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aa < 1293849546 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aaa < 1293849548 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aaaaa < 1293849551 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no :D < 1293849551 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, shut up < 1293849553 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: wouldnt he be masturbating then? < 1293849564 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::f < 1293849565 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1293849565 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this channel, SO MATURE, you guys! < 1293849586 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :she told me that she's more kinki tht i thought she is < 1293849588 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1293849589 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes when augur, you, and some 90% of the other people are here :P < 1293849596 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott is SO MATURE < 1293849603 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: do tell < 1293849614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GUYS WE ARE TALKING ABOUT *MY* GIRLFRIEND, THAT IS, J < 1293849615 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I mean, me, olsner, fizzie. And perhaps a handful of other. Then it is mature :P < 1293849625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: hear that, Vorpal just called you mature < 1293849628 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Java? < 1293849632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: no, J, faggot < 1293849638 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, compared to you :P < 1293849639 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :J like Java < 1293849648 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Elliott-Hirds-MacBook-Air:~ ehird$ /Applications/j701/bin/jgtk.command ; exit; < 1293849648 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|control error: script < 1293849648 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 3 :0'' < 1293849649 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|[-7] /Applications/j701/addons/gui/gtk/gtk.ijs < 1293849651 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAAAT ISSS THISSSSS < 1293849651 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: In Perl 6, @foo[bar] is syntactic sugar for @foo.[bar] < 1293849659 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1293849660 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: you're syntactic sugar lol < 1293849666 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is this shit < 1293849667 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Elliott-Hirds-MacBook-Air ... what a hostname < 1293849668 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck perl < 1293849669 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :god damn < 1293849672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: that's the default hostname :D < 1293849673 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that error is... weird? < 1293849677 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yep! < 1293849686 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ive started coding in C# < 1293849687 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it has way too much whitespace for J < 1293849691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: i haven't figured out what to change it to yet, i kinda like Elliott-Hirds-MacBook-Air, it's just so silly < 1293849697 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my prompts have never been longer < 1293849701 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i know :D , my mac was Marcin gasperowicz's MacBook pro < 1293849710 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :G* < 1293849717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am so glad i don't have a really long name < 1293849719 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I hate when prompts wrap though < 1293849728 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :John-Jacob-Jingleheimer-Schmidts-MacBook-Air < 1293849729 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and that is a risk for you < 1293849739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :his name is my name toooo < 1293849743 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: better than Darryl-McAdamss-MacBook-Pro < 1293849748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: McAdamss hahahaha < 1293849750 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1293849759 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, is that a real example < 1293849761 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1293849764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's his name, so yes < 1293849767 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf my ? key is glitchy < 1293849769 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well no, but it would be if it were stupid enough to use my full name < 1293849772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: what happens if you're japanese, do you get a utf-8 hostname < 1293849778 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or does it replace it all with dashes < 1293849784 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-----------MacBook-Pro < 1293849788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry < 1293849789 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it could punycode it? < 1293849794 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :----------s-MacBook-Pro < 1293849797 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dareru-makkuadamuzu-no-makkubukku-purou < 1293849803 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: KAWAII < 1293849805 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.. makkadamuzu* < 1293849811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah that error, so important < 1293849813 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thx for correctation < 1293849815 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is! < 1293849821 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I SUGGEST punycode! < 1293849823 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually i am that stupid < 1293849823 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck me < 1293849827 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :darryl-mcadamss-macbook-pro:~ darryl$ < 1293849834 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should fix this shit < 1293849846 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: set your hostname to "fag" < 1293849866 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1293849875 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use mythical creatures. phoenix, dragon, pegasus and so on. < 1293849875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok i think j is almost working < 1293849882 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also tux is grandfathered in) < 1293849891 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tux is pretty mythical < 1293849893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah tux isn't mythical < 1293849894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha snap < 1293849900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I SEE TUX ALL THE TIME < 1293849910 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesnt make him not mythical < 1293849921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean irl < 1293849922 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :duh < 1293849924 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just makes him ... THE STUFF OF LEGENDS < 1293849935 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you couldn't find tux on Middle earth :P < 1293849954 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: speaking of restrictive type systems, C#'s piss-poor type system pisses me off < 1293849964 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i tried to define fold just for fun < 1293849966 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cant do it < 1293849966 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you could find dragons, and while no phoenix or pegasus are recorded by Tolkin afaik they would fit right in, < 1293849968 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :type error < 1293849972 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/,$/./ < 1293849972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: fatg < 1293849990 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry what < 1293849993 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's all get drunk and write PPC assembly < 1293849998 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, couldn't you do it with a generic class? < 1293850002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GIVE ME ONE GOOD REASON WHY NOT < 1293850004 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: how do you mean < 1293850012 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: are you allowed to get drunk yet < 1293850016 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you ever BEEN drunk? < 1293850017 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, something like... Folder or such? < 1293850025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: no, but i'm also not allowed to INFRINGE COPYRIGHT < 1293850028 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, having one method. fold < 1293850029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which i do. < 1293850031 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh ok < 1293850038 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, yes this is insane. But it might just work. < 1293850039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ITT: c# isn't java < 1293850051 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: can you tell me why steve jobs put fn next to ctrl on the macbook keyboards < 1293850051 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ehh.. maybe. i didnt use a generic class < 1293850054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: it is the stupidest thing ever < 1293850058 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm? C# has generic classes. < 1293850062 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it was because of a circular type of some sort < 1293850063 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It is an error to use this operator outside of a lol context; in other words it must be bound into a ** (slice) parameter rather than a * (slurpy) parameter." goddammit perl 6 < 1293850069 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't see why it *wouldn't* work < 1293850074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: a lol context? :D < 1293850088 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is impossible to understand perl 6 without understanding it first < 1293850092 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, sure that isn't some INTERCAL-lolcode hybrid? < 1293850106 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: unfortunately < 1293850111 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1293850124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Building, Bundling, and Integrating GTK+ on MacOSX is now consolidated at http://gtk-osx.sourceforge.net, where you'll find up-to-date downloads, information and support. There is a forum, a mailing list, and a tracker there. The development of the quartz backend to GTK+ remains in the GTK+ project. < 1293850127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://gtk-osx.sourceforge.net/ jesus christ < 1293850130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like from fucking 2003 < 1293850135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're using i think panther's wallpaper < 1293850136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on leoprad < 1293850139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and those colours < 1293850140 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*leopard < 1293850142 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jesus christ < 1293850143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who made this site < 1293850153 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the genericness wasnt at issue. i just defined it like.. public List FoldR { ... } < 1293850162 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er, not List < 1293850166 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, so what is the problem then? < 1293850174 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem was it didnt work! :P < 1293850179 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lemme do it again for posterity < 1293850179 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, also is that a property!? < 1293850207 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no its a stupid unthought-about method on a dummy object < 1293850208 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hold on < 1293850211 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur,: public List FoldR(INSERT SOME SORT OF DELEGATE HERE, List list) { ... } < 1293850224 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the delegate should take T somewhere < 1293850225 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1293850235 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe. i just tried to implement it naively < 1293850237 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, delegate. Like function pointers for C# < 1293850249 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://gtk-osx.sourceforge.net/ guess when this side was created < 1293850249 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway it shouldve worked if the type system could handle it < 1293850252 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*site < 1293850260 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont like the lack of polymorphism in the types tho. < 1293850263 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you cant just do like < 1293850274 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, uh.. no clue < 1293850278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: guess < 1293850285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :based on its form + screenshots < 1293850288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :form as in design < 1293850325 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well it says 10.5 in the text. So fairly new. Screenshots don't help me, except that it has that 3D dock so fairly recent. Rest of design is like 8 year older < 1293850331 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :public X FoldR(..., Z zero, List xs) { ... } < 1293850336 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as far as i know, anyway < 1293850338 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the site was created sometime 2009 to 2010. < 1293850340 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, well yes < 1293850341 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i should try that < 1293850343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: and it was /designed/ like that. in 2009 to 2010. < 1293850345 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, the ... would be the delegate < 1293850349 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1293850358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: did I mention that the site it replaced was pretty sleek? < 1293850358 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, but what is Z? < 1293850366 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some type Z < 1293850369 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, shouldn't Z and X be the same? < 1293850387 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perl 6 does not have a sepc < 1293850388 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*spec < 1293850389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck j 7 < 1293850389 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose it depends on how your folding function works < 1293850391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: yes it does < 1293850392 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't care what they say < 1293850395 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no < 1293850397 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :theres no reason it couldnt be a -> b -> b < 1293850404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: it has a spec it has no formal spec < 1293850404 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could not write an implementation of Perl 6 from this "spec" < 1293850407 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rtho yeah sure X < 1293850417 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, but then FoldR should return Z not X < 1293850422 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no? < 1293850429 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true. im not thinking, obviously < 1293850442 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, these backwards type signatures are weird < 1293850448 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then theres these JS ones < 1293850457 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, you mean return type first? < 1293850459 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1293850465 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :function (x : X, y : Y) : Z < 1293850471 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :horrible < 1293850478 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cluttersome < 1293850488 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, is that... name : type ? < 1293850491 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1293850494 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd much prefer like < 1293850500 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, what the fracking helll < 1293850512 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hell* < 1293850518 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it makes sense, since : is the mathlogic-notation for types < 1293850526 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh. j needs 32-bit java < 1293850526 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1293850531 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you see that kind of shit in like Martin-Lof type theory < 1293850535 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ... really? < 1293850541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. at least 602. < 1293850543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on os x. < 1293850547 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how strange < 1293850554 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but its just so cluttersome < 1293850554 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: not really. only the UI is 32-bit. < 1293850556 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :better to do like < 1293850559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it uses jni to talk to the engine < 1293850564 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, I don't know Martin-Löf type theory (isn't that the proper name?) < 1293850574 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :type foo(X,Y) : Z ; function foo(x,y) { ... } < 1293850580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: coq is close to martin-lof type theory. < 1293850585 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, Martin-Lof is the formal logic behind dependent types < 1293850588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: type foo(X,Y) : Z ; function foo(x,y) { ... } < 1293850592 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm pretty sure that is an ö not an o < 1293850594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that wouldn't work for dependent stuff really :) < 1293850597 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: NOBODY FUCKING CARES < 1293850599 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no its not supposed to < 1293850606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (1 2 3)^2 < 1293850606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 4 9 < 1293850606 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, at least write it as oe then < 1293850606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :--J < 1293850608 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than o < 1293850609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: nobody < 1293850610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: fucking < 1293850612 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: cares < 1293850614 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: im just trying to show how you might design the JS2 type signatures to factor out the inlined :'s < 1293850620 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliot: okay I see < 1293850620 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to make it more haskellish < 1293850627 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo :: (X,Y) -> Z < 1293850630 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe "eliott"? < 1293850630 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo x y = ... < 1293850632 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ^ < 1293850635 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vs < 1293850636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2|(1 2 3 4 5 6 7) < 1293850636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 0 1 0 1 0 1 < 1293850637 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I could start using either < 1293850640 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :type foo(X,Y) : Z < 1293850640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the odd ones we want are the 1s here < 1293850643 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :function foo(x,y) { ... } < 1293850668 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Elliot, I could write it this way even. < 1293850751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 i.2|foo < 1293850752 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 1 0 1 0 1 0 < 1293850755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so we want to select the 1s here from foo < 1293850768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we could do < 1293850769 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (1 i.2|foo)*foo < 1293850769 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 2 0 4 0 6 0 < 1293850771 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then ditch zeroes < 1293850773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that would be cheating < 1293850775 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since we'd ditch all zeroes < 1293850818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is so hard < 1293850949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : >(foo;1 i.2|foo) < 1293850949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 2 3 0 4 5 6 7 < 1293850949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 1 0 1 1 0 1 0 < 1293850953 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm. < 1293850979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm wait. < 1293850990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok zero isn't odd ofc < 1293851022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : foo*2|foo < 1293851022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 0 3 0 0 5 0 7 < 1293851025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so we just need to ditch zeroes < 1293851063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (foo*2|foo)^2 < 1293851063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 0 9 0 0 25 0 49 < 1293851064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: gettin' close < 1293851465 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are we trying to do here < 1293851484 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293851529 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1293851591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: um .filter(odd?).map(**2) < 1293851636 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@2001:4428:251:1:21f:16ff:fe68:a55 JOIN :#esoteric < 1293851640 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1293851640 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1293852687 0 :wareya_!~wareya@cpe-74-70-142-220.nycap.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1293852713 0 :wareya_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1293852785 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulliver's_Travels_(2010_film) WHYYYY < 1293852789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: why does this exist < 1293852800 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because jackblack. < 1293852822 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: no no no WHY < 1293854015 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just had a great conversation with my brother (language expert) < 1293854049 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he told me that no matter who you are < 1293854068 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you will adapt to the culture of a country you live in < 1293854073 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty true < 1293854078 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you're a racist asshole < 1293854083 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or a conquering brit < 1293854089 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you make them adopt to you < 1293854089 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1293854091 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there is this think < 1293854095 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thing* < 1293854120 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example < 1293854129 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm a muthafucking pole < 1293854135 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for 23 years < 1293854163 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and even if i speak perfect norsk and know norwegian culture in depth < 1293854199 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't forget 23 years (early years) in poland < 1293854233 0 :subleq!~gavin@c-24-9-98-117.hsd1.co.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1293854235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: are you in norway < 1293854236 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and theese years will make me a different person from an average norwegian < 1293854247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: are you in norway < 1293854251 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1293854254 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i < 1293854255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1293854256 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1293854256 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i could be < 1293854260 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: i think you dont understand the meaning of "adapt" < 1293854263 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bot i'm not < 1293854271 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :adapt means kill half of them rape the rest < 1293854275 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i understand that < 1293854277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i learned this from columbus < 1293854284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1293854295 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i could adapt urdu culture < 1293854313 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that does not make me urdu < 1293854361 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one could just deny hid origin and become someone else < 1293854383 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :his* < 1293854450 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :beh < 1293854456 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think < 1293854552 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even if i lived for 40 years in USA, and define myself as an american... i would stil bear this small part of < 1293854635 0 :subleq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1293854644 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23 years of Polish upbringing in myself < 1293854650 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no matter what < 1293854717 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :besides of any patriotism < 1293854730 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which i don't have tbh < 1293854755 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ffffffffffffff.... < 1293854756 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1293854998 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :goodnight < 1293855365 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1293855487 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1293855781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur < 1293855787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :help me make a golfing language < 1293855812 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no what < 1293855827 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: a la golfscript < 1293855875 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1293856003 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: surely you know golfscript < 1293856015 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1293856028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: http://golfscript.com/ < 1293856033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :common on anagolf? < 1293856034 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know? < 1293856042 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf is this < 1293856062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: a language ... < 1293856067 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i got that < 1293856072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: um you know what code golf is right < 1293856130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: ? < 1293856187 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1293856214 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1293856225 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I how ^op in category theory < 1293856241 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hate* < 1293856572 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats ^op < 1293856656 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :opposites category < 1293856674 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtffffff < 1293856684 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Elliott-Hirds-MacBook-Air:~ ehird$ zcat < 1293908507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*PHP. < 1293908511 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1293908542 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, implement cauchy sequences in C then < 1293908543 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something < 1293908558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone help me work out my GolfScript ripoff. < 1293908627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I CHOOSE YOU < 1293908632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can get out of it by doing angular momentum. < 1293908654 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, golfscript is fun, try another one < 1293908667 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, say "inferior PHP ripoff" (ouch!) < 1293908680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, Phantom_Hoover is scared of any work. < 1293908684 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I really am making a golfscript ripoff. < 1293908696 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm having trouble distinguishing arrays of small integers and strings, though (ha ha Erlang), which is important for eval. < 1293908698 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Specifically, < 1293908704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[1 2 3] eval --> stack is 1 2 3 < 1293908705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1293908716 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"abc" eval --> stack is whatever the stack is after executing abc < 1293908723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yet "abc" = [97 98 99] < 1293908751 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott is that an issue? < 1293908757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes. < 1293908763 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, after all C has string as array of bytes < 1293908776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because every variable is evaluated on reference. Evaluating anything that isn't a function should just push it to the stack. < 1293908777 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1293908780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: [1 2 3] eval --> stack is 1 2 3 < 1293908781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather < 1293908783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stack is [1 2 3] < 1293908783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in < 1293908785 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :single element, [1 2 3] < 1293908831 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why not let eval execute a list? < 1293908845 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What. < 1293908859 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I fail to see the issue here < 1293908871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your last-but-one sentence is utterly incomprehensible. < 1293908874 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Restate it. < 1293908899 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well does "abc" eval and [97 98 99] eval have to do different things? < 1293908906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1293908909 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why < 1293908914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because otherwise you couldn't assign [97 98 99] to a variable. < 1293908921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it'd execute "abc" when you mentioned the variable. < 1293908922 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, eeeh okay < 1293908928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As I said, variables are evaluated when mentioned. < 1293908944 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, then make string and list different data types? < 1293908960 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, because all the operations you might want on the two are the same. < 1293908970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am considering tracking around the function-ness of a list at this point. < 1293909037 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1293909165 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1293909311 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i recall postscript has two kinds of lists depending on whether you want evaluating them to run what's inside or not < 1293909447 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, who won the war? < 1293909474 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: there appears to be a strong disagreement between north korea and the usa on this issue < 1293909494 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :north korea claims that you were completely obliterated by the missile i sent < 1293909515 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :while the usa claims it exploded just a few seconds after being launched < 1293909519 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, I am a Phantom_Hoover and as such cannot be destroyed with physical weapons. < 1293909535 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: the missile contained rice pudding < 1293909552 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and incidentally caused the starving of thousands of north koreans < 1293909561 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, a cunning plan, indeed, but I was prepared! < 1293909602 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used the swatpan to catch it, and then hit you with it! < 1293909611 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch < 1293909719 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1293909854 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: or wait was that dependent on storing it in a variable, my memory is a bit vague < 1293909860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: who knows :D < 1293909984 0 :updog!~updog@208.78.103.223 JOIN :#esoteric < 1293909991 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Boy, I've got a massive plate of updog right here. < 1293909991 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1293910000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know, updog. What *is* updog? < 1293910000 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1293910006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A question for the ages. < 1293910007 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :updog is edible? < 1293910007 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1293910077 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have some suspicions about updog < 1293910078 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1293910084 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :confirmed < 1293910103 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: what suspicions? < 1293910132 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I SUSPECT HE IS OF AN INFERIOR SUBSTRATUM < 1293910145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's just lodgin'. < 1293910148 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, *substrate < 1293910183 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: alternate spelling it seems < 1293910192 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In Newspeak updog is doubleplusgood. < 1293910192 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1293910255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm updog's got broken < 1293910255 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1293910257 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION kills the process < 1293910266 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION slaps elliott with a dickfor < 1293910270 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293910276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For what? < 1293910282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You didn't complete your sentence. < 1293910304 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION swats elliott for ruining the joke -----### < 1293910322 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE BEATINGS WILL CONTINUE UNTIL MORALE IMPROVES < 1293910326 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, what's a dickfor? < 1293910329 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is considering installing Linux Mint < 1293910331 0 :updog!~updog@208.78.103.223 JOIN :#esoteric < 1293910333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Copulation. < 1293910366 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that was so that I could infiltrate oerjan's evil tyranny and undermine it from within1 < 1293910368 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*! < 1293910381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AW DAMMIT UPDOG WHY DO YOU HAVE TO BE SO UPDOG < 1293910392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. It could do with some more uppercasing. < 1293910496 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Shut up about Newspeak! < 1293910504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What. < 1293910508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1293910514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant Orwell's, dummy. < 1293910737 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293910767 0 :updog!~updog@208.78.103.223 JOIN :#esoteric < 1293910796 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Updog! < 1293910796 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1293910800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know < 1293910810 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gah, why is it using all the CPU. < 1293910831 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's due to a plot by its arch-nemesis downcat < 1293910857 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1293910886 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :inorite sounds like a very annoying mineral < 1293910904 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293910914 0 :updog!~updog@208.78.103.223 JOIN :#esoteric < 1293910935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UPDOOOG < 1293910943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Updog < 1293910944 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1293910946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I already told you, I don't know < 1293910993 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293911031 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What language is your bots in? < 1293911036 0 :updog!~updog@208.78.103.223 JOIN :#esoteric < 1293911039 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293911039 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(is? are?) < 1293911059 0 :updog!~updog@208.78.103.223 JOIN :#esoteric < 1293911076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :updog is in Ruby. < 1293911076 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1293911083 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is also proof that I have no concept of "pointless". < 1293911116 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yet you have the gall to call things I do pointless. < 1293911132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I detect the distinct tinge of offence. < 1293911431 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1293911567 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523! < 1293911581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One after ais522! < 1293911616 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais522+1! < 1293911650 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :++ < 1293911668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO YOU EMBIGGENED HIM < 1293911794 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i've upset sgeo forever now < 1293911920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OS X thinks that you unpack .bin files to .bin.cpgz. < 1293911920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What. < 1293911957 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I saw that before as well. < 1293912039 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi everyone < 1293912060 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, I was busy saying hi to a greeting cascade in a different channel < 1293912061 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: cpgz is an abbreviation for .cpio.gz? < 1293912097 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: quite possibly < 1293912122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION converts to ISO < 1293912149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i have a lot of updog lying around, can you take care of it? < 1293912149 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1293912151 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: also after reading perl6 "spec", I believe that @foo.filter(* % 2)>>*>>2 would have the desired effect discussed yesterday < 1293912154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NEVER CEASES TO AMUSE < 1293912159 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: lmao < 1293912184 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: not @foo.filter(*%2)>>* ** 2? < 1293912200 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, no, you're right, my bad < 1293912208 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or @foo.filter(* % 2)»**»2 < 1293912225 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1293912228 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the >> or » is the "hyper" metaoperator and extends the operation over the list < 1293912244 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :» is more of a pain to actually type but more readable < 1293912261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think all the perl 6 editors must have really tricked-out emacs setups for unicode < 1293912265 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1293912275 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also this assumes filter exists and works like that < 1293912282 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't checked that yet < 1293912286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1293912306 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also, re my complaint about it not being a spec, ff and fff operators are /never/ defined. They just say "have semantics like Perl 5 .. and ... flipflops) < 1293912439 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, nope, that's not quite right < 1293912456 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/filter/grep/ < 1293912517 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm about to test COMI (MI3) in ScummVM now. < 1293912549 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: So if it works well, then it works well on 2.1GHz Core 2 Duo w/ 4 GiB of RAM, good nvidia integrated GPU and 256 GiB SSD. Which is of course very relevant to your situation. < 1293912553 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, telst what? < 1293912556 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :test* < 1293912558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :COMI. < 1293912560 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1293912560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Curse of Monkey Island. < 1293912575 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and I checked, it works well on my computer < 1293912609 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, play it on hard! < 1293912620 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: There is no hard, there's just "wimp" vs. "actual game". < 1293912624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I assume you played MI2 on hard too. < 1293912629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea why the easy versions exist. < 1293912634 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, of course I used hard < 1293912637 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why play an adventure game if you don't want puzzles? < 1293912656 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, except for MI3 it looks like it is called normal and mega < 1293912662 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1293912663 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :while for MI2 it was easy and normal < 1293912666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mega is the one you want to play. :p < 1293912677 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: First report: Well, it starts up! It's ugly-LCD-scaled, though. < 1293912680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why are LCDs so bad at scaling? < 1293912690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't use the 2x filter because 960 > 800. < 1293912705 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wait a second. 800? < 1293912712 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, which dimension is 800? < 1293912720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 1440x800 < 1293912725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :640x480 * 2 = something x 960. < 1293912732 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, can't you play it at native res? < 1293912741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Sure. It gets ugly-LCD-scaled. < 1293912743 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, WINDOWED! < 1293912747 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Ew. < 1293912751 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, do it! < 1293912754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Talk about non-immersive. < 1293912770 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, idea: windowed on completely black bg < 1293912772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Maybe if it could black out the rest of my screen and center it. < 1293912773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ha. < 1293912790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Oh, and MI3 of course has voice acting, if you didn't know. < 1293912792 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good voice acting, mind you. < 1293912794 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so black bg and hide menu bars then window near middle < 1293912808 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I noticed. I played the first scene to test it < 1293912824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Finished MI2 yet? < 1293912837 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well no, but I had to test system reqs < 1293912844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. < 1293912870 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why doesn't ScummVM have a 1.5x. < 1293912881 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, black border! < 1293912883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :960x720 with black border around it would be perfect. < 1293912888 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But 640x480 is so small. < 1293912893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: This is 128 ppi, dammit! < 1293912896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :640x480 looks like my thumbnail! < 1293912918 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway windowed is only sane option for me. 96 dpi or such. And 24" < 1293912931 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, 24" wide screen even < 1293912951 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I think every computer should come with a low-quality early-90s CRT, complete with digital-to-VGA converter. < 1293912962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the best way to play. < 1293913119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Allow me to demonstrate why windowed doesn't work for me. < 1293913135 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ? < 1293913156 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mrf. < 1293913158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gimme a second. < 1293913162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :imgur appears to now transcode big pngs to jpg. < 1293913170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Low quality at that. < 1293913245 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://ompldr.org/vNnQzdA < 1293913251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Now consider that that's on a 13" screen. < 1293913342 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Get the picture? :p < 1293913357 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :waiting for it to load < 1293913360 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(browser that is) < 1293913367 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :get an ssd :P < 1293913369 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes what is the problem < 1293913379 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: OK. First look at its size in comparison to the whole thing. < 1293913385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Now try and remember how big a 13" laptop's screen is. < 1293913389 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, SURE if you have 2x 1 TB SSD for use in RAID 1 < 1293913394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: (Try looking at your laptop's and imagining a screen quite a bit smaller.) < 1293913407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Get the problem? It's tiny. Not very nice. < 1293913422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to play it with LCD-crappy-scaling, I think. < 1293913437 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, right. Still it fills less of the screen than on my desktop < 1293913455 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Full screen the damn thing :P < 1293913465 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, on a wide screen!? < 1293913471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Black borders at the side, duh. < 1293913473 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LCDs do that. < 1293913482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: And if you have more than 800 vertical pixels, you can use the 2x scaler. < 1293913485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So the LCD scaling will be minimal. < 1293913503 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Have YOU played monkey island? < 1293913508 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is addicted to watching DS9 < 1293913526 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although it is, thus far, the least entertaining series I have ever comitted myself to watching < 1293913537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*committed. < 1293913538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: WELL < 1293913544 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I have 1050 vertical < 1293913551 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does it get better in season 2? < 1293913558 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I have not! < 1293913565 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Right. Try full-screening it; set the scaler to "2x". < 1293913570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All in Edit Game. < 1293913576 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Play NAO < 1293913577 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not in global options? < 1293913579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*NOW < 1293913582 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, HAO < 1293913584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, that'll set it for the launcher UI too. < 1293913587 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: SCUMMVM < 1293913607 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I leave you scoundrels to play the game! < 1293913608 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293913639 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2xSAI looks better < 1293913745 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot < 1293913746 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: mtmp mo 9; ytmp yr 1; s splnet(); alien. i quote below from the domain of a line behind the original file! < 1293914068 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293914274 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1293914894 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1293914908 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Helpful tip for COMI: If your cursor is an arrow, double-clicking goes there immediately, btw. < 1293914914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293915020 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is excited for this month < 1293915093 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1293915119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Have you been able to get voice-with-no-subtitles working? < 1293915127 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why Must O'Brien Suffer? < 1293915130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It shows the subtitles for me. < 1293915137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Because. < 1293915149 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, oh god why are you excited. < 1293915152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Even when I just set it to Speech. < 1293915176 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have plans to meet up with a girl < 1293915183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh god. I'm leaving now. < 1293915186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Please answer quickly. < 1293915188 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, Christ no. < 1293915207 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, why is this distressing? < 1293915223 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION envisions thousands of tiny little Sgeos running around, retreats into his own nightmare. < 1293915228 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, it implies your genes may continue. < 1293915242 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to go drown my sorrows. In Monkey Island. < 1293915242 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, you are clearly incapable of a committed relationship. < 1293915247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dammit Vorpal, respond. < 1293915252 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yeah, how does Factor feel? < 1293915258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You abandoned her, you bastard. < 1293915267 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For that slut Scala. < 1293915272 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Was it Scala? < 1293915276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've lost track. < 1293915283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if even Sgeo knows. < 1293915284 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think so. < 1293915293 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I gave Scala more than a passing glance < 1293915305 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I swear you did. < 1293915309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or was it Clojure < 1293915309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1293915316 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Never even touched Clojure < 1293915325 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: OK, I give up guessing. < 1293915330 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I started reading about Scala again, then this channel discouraged me < 1293915338 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I went Factor -> Newspeak < 1293915338 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'ma play COMI. < 1293915362 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Awesome, shutup PMs me now < 1293915448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293915505 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back < 1293915520 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: Have you been able to get voice-with-no-subtitles working? <-- no clue < 1293915839 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, do you like Ian Stewart? < 1293915953 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86-rdmsoft [XULRunner 1.9.2.12/20101026210630] < 1293916025 0 :myndzi\!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :myndzi < 1293916191 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\m/ \m/ \m/ \m/ < 1293916198 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1293916202 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : \m/ \m/ \m/ \m/ < 1293916202 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  `\o/´    `\o/´ < 1293916202 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :    |        | < 1293916202 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :   /´¯|_)   /'\ < 1293916202 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (_|      (_| |_) < 1293916271 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wikis < 1293916283 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wants to read The Science of Discworld at some point < 1293916573 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3 is the best < 1293916616 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3, was that the one with Darwin in it? < 1293916643 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1293916665 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the god of evolution < 1293917253 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1293917259 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wb elliott < 1293917267 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Ian Stewart is the one who wrote that EVIL BOOK, FLATTERLAND. < 1293917273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Information thanks to Sgeo) < 1293917282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: hello, i'm going back to playing COMI < 1293917288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :none of you are interesting enough < 1293917355 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: flatterland is evil? < 1293917365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: according to Sgeo! < 1293917383 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: flatterland is evil? < 1293917388 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :05:41:20 I just realized something horrible about Flatterland < 1293917389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :05:42:36 It promotes the pseudoscientific bullshit involving taking scientific words, interpreting stuff as you please, and thinking it means something < 1293917389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :05:43:10 --- join: jcp (~jw@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539) joined #esoteric < 1293917390 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :05:44:07 I feel no guilt about spoiling this: the last scene involves the protagonist basing arguments for gender equality on Flatland's supersymmetry < 1293917392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :05:45:29 "Supersymmetric sister! ..." < 1293917394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :05:46:03 I forgot the rest of her advertisement on Flatland's Internet < 1293917396 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: BEHOLD THE HORROR < 1293917401 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and now to play a game where i can forget all you bastards exit -> < 1293917449 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1293917457 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: we don't exit < 1293917461 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we idle here < 1293917466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: heh < 1293917480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's funny because i meant to say exist, you bsatards. < 1293917482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*bastards. < 1293917531 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know < 1293917570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't know anything. i'm going back to guybrush threepwood. < 1293917571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293917793 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" I feel no guilt about spoiling this:" < 1293917812 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT KIND OF MATHEMATICAL CRIME CAN JUSTIFY SUCH A CRIME < 1293917827 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er, s/CRIME/DEED/ < 1293917892 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :supersymmetric ones, of course < 1293918108 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1293918117 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Dramatis Personae" was an awesome episode < 1293918322 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No it wasn't. < 1293918393 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that names rings a bell for some reason < 1293918418 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what? < 1293918419 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never read any karl marx < 1293918433 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, what? < 1293918474 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, Dramatis Personae is the pretentious Latin name for a list of characters in a play. < 1293918483 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah that will be it then < 1293918498 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's also an awesome season 1 episode of DS9 < 1293918566 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And a group of theater-like people in Stephenson's Diamond Age book. < 1293918646 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gah, argument in another channel: does O(1/n) mean anything at all, and if so, does it mean something different from O(1)? < 1293918704 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :using f in O(1/n) iff f in O(n) by my definition < 1293918707 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, well, I think the definition of O(f(x)) is reliant on f being strictly increasing. < 1293918825 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1293918829 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O(1/n) does mean something! < 1293918834 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :k/n will be smaller than some constant eventually, so O(1/n) should imply a lower upper bound < 1293918843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: O(1/n) = O(n^-1) -- it's EXPONENTIAL! < 1293918845 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1293918849 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1293918860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it definitely isn't O(1) though i don't think < 1293918864 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O(n) maybe < 1293918865 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, polynomial, surely? < 1293918871 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But no, it isn't O(1). < 1293918878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: n^-1 <-- LOOKS LIKE EXPONENTIATION TO ME < 1293918879 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f(x) = 1 isn't O(1/n) :D < 1293918883 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O(1/n) is not the same as either O(1) or O(n) < 1293918889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O(1/n) is O(fish) < 1293918899 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oafish? < 1293918901 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Dramatis Personae <3 < 1293918906 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1/n^2 is O(1/n) < 1293918907 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f in O(1) means that there exists some x' and c such that every x > x' we have f(x) >= c < 1293918925 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: * <= < 1293918931 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, <= < 1293918944 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've always thought =< would be a better symbol < 1293918945 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :less ambiguou < 1293918946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s < 1293918953 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes they are different, my mistake < 1293918960 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't there a language that does that? < 1293918964 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :=< and >= ? < 1293918974 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you merely described \Omega(1) there < 1293918983 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1293918988 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, that is exactly \Omega(1) < 1293918991 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: eralgn < 1293918994 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: btw, the Dominion arc starts properly at the end of season 2. < 1293919006 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WP gives f(x) is O(g(x)) iff |f(x)| <= M|g(x)| forall x>c. < 1293919010 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i guess the confusion is because for things larger than O(1) you have an equivalent choice of _either_ using the "every x > x'" form _or_ adding a constant and saying it holds everywhere? < 1293919025 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although you forgot the absolute value condition < 1293919028 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So if c = 1, it's O(1). < 1293919039 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and those obviously give different interpretations for O(1/n) < 1293919044 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: uh what < 1293919046 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not at all < 1293919050 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, err, you're right. < 1293919055 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if g(x) is constant < 1293919077 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and f(x) is O(g(x)), then f(x) is also O(1) < 1293919098 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, yes. Forall x>1, 1/x<1. < 1293919100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :new question -- are there any algorithms that are O(1/n)? < 1293919112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think there are, but only ones that explicitly do a for loop up to 1/n :P < 1293919118 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: oh, you're saying 1/x is O(1) < 1293919118 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1293919119 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is true < 1293919142 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more generally, x^n is O(x^m) if n < m < 1293919146 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*<= < 1293919154 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, not if you allow n to be arbitrarily close to 0. < 1293919161 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: however when you use O()-notation for things like Taylor series, you cannot just add constants (e.g. since you are taking limits with real numbers rather than a sequence) < 1293919173 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: huh? < 1293919180 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1293919186 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, don't you *multiply* by constants though? < 1293919198 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : n^-10000000000000000 is O(1) < 1293919206 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pop quiz: How do you install Ubuntu on a machine that can't run unetbootin, doesn't have an optical drive, and without a USB drive to hand? < 1293919225 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, not if you allow n to be arbitrarily near 0! < 1293919237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prizes offered for ansewrs. < 1293919240 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: grab a minimalist floppy with debbootstrap installed? < 1293919252 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: why not? < 1293919258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: um ok this is a macbook air, it doesn't have an optical drive and it _certainly_ doesn't have a floppy drive :D < 1293919264 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh < 1293919267 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, because there's no upper bound to 1/x, x<0! < 1293919282 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: uh what < 1293919285 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, x>0. < 1293919286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: I'm thinking either netboot, or partition the drive, somehow write the Ubuntu CD to that drive, and boot from it < 1293919294 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's about asymptotic behavior, Phantom_Hoover < 1293919298 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: there's a windows-based installer < 1293919306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: It's a Mac. It doesn't come with Windows either. < 1293919308 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh < 1293919313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: also Wubi is beyond shit < 1293919314 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hmm < 1293919316 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is the shittiest McShit of Shitville < 1293919318 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, wait, starting point isn't... OK, you're right. < 1293919319 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: istr the thing you use for Taylor series is a different notation that just happens to look similar to O-notation but is actually completely different < 1293919324 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: can you repartition the drive safely? < 1293919330 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: yes, while it's booted no less < 1293919333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think < 1293919342 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: just do that and have a VM run the CD < 1293919343 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Hello, welcome to McDonalds, would you like to try our Shitty McShitville McShit? < 1293919346 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ok < 1293919353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: netbooting might actually work out in this case -- if I can install a netbooter without a CD. I think rEFIt might be able to do it? < 1293919356 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Yes. < 1293919357 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: What. < 1293919358 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, zuh? < 1293919359 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: No, no VMs. < 1293919366 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: VM hardware veeeeery different to Mac hardware. < 1293919370 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Sgeo: btw, the Dominion arc starts properly at the end of season 2. < 1293919379 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ah. < 1293919386 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, do you actually read books any more? < 1293919389 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I feel that ok was a proper response especially given that the previous line was about Erlang < 1293919389 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Ubuntu installer doesn't care about hardware does it? < 1293919395 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, rarely < 1293919408 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: erm. i wouldn't trust it not to, especially since EFI is ~weirdcakes~ < 1293919410 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: and if it does, it should work well enough to dpkg-reconfigure everything < 1293919411 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, hmm. < 1293919412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it installs bootloaders < 1293919425 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh yeah, forgot about bootloaders < 1293919437 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did read Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency a while ago < 1293919437 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :debbootstrap then and do the bootloader config manually < 1293919446 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro will want me to read it again, iirc < 1293919452 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1293919453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: i don't like your solutions, i just want to get the actual cd booted, through any means :) < 1293919460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the actual installation I want to do with a native boot of the normal installer < 1293919464 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: fine. write the cd to partition then < 1293919476 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: I am not convinced that will work :D a USB image, maybe < 1293919485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus can ubuntu install to the media it was booted off? < 1293919486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt it < 1293919491 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC it's a pain to get it to do that < 1293919534 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: um i think the only difference with Taylor series is that you are taking the limit as you go to a particular real value rather than as you go to infinity < 1293919564 0 :pingveno!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1293919582 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't think it's difficult at all < 1293919584 0 :pingveno!~pingveno@c-98-246-133-8.hsd1.or.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1293919590 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually wait < 1293919598 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a netboot is looking appealing at this point < 1293919604 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, you wouldn't be able to without massive trickery < 1293919605 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, if i can netboot over wifi < 1293919612 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :glwt < 1293919623 0 :pingveno!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1293919624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: well i've done similar things < 1293919628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: involving lazy, forced unmounts < 1293919635 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: using unetbootin in its put-it-in-C:\ mode < 1293919646 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NetBoot WONDER IF I COULD USETHIS < 1293919700 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is going to add the bias warning template < 1293919702 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where is that template < 1293919721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: to hwhat < 1293919733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*what < 1293919756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: ? < 1293919788 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that page you just linked < 1293919795 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: er why? < 1293919798 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see any bias < 1293919867 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"core technology" < 1293919879 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"technology from Apple" < 1293919884 0 :pingveno!~pingveno@c-98-246-133-8.hsd1.or.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1293919887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: you do realise that NetBoot is a proprietary Apple thing? < 1293919890 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do < 1293919890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note the capital B < 1293919895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yes, it is from Apple < 1293919896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the issue < 1293919913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: does it "read like an advertisement" solely because it doesn't have a huge Criticism section or something? < 1293919922 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything there is neutral and referenced < 1293919940 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it doesn't seem neutral to me; if other disagree, wiki magic will remove that template and things will be well < 1293919985 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it, in my opinion, ought to read more like "NetBoot is a proprietary Apple implementation of network booting" or the like < 1293920005 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: that sounds less neutral than the current text. < 1293920052 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: in what way? < 1293920067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: "proprietary" being the fourth word < 1293920083 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NetBoot is Apple's implementation of network booting -- sure < 1293920083 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the first one that counts. < 1293920090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1293920101 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ok, dropping proprietary would be ok < 1293920122 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I actually don't know enough about it to know if it's proprietary, I just said that because you did < 1293920147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think the extensions to the protocol are proprietary < 1293920205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wonder if there's a usb stick lying around here < 1293920734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: is there an #ubuntu-less-stupid? < 1293920773 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1293920810 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not, i have a question requiring actual though to answer < 1293921598 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, there is now. < 1293921612 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is? < 1293921627 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you could try a channel at random < 1293921640 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially on freenode, ubuntu saturation may be high enough to find someone who knows < 1293921655 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: picked my channel, will ask a question now < 1293921659 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey guys! < 1293921661 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone use ubuntu? < 1293921669 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to write the Live CD/USB to a disk partition and boot that with e.g. GRUB < 1293921672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this possible? if so, how? < 1293921676 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: am i doing it right? < 1293921714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :22:41 itaylor57: Gartral: they arent flags just optiopns < 1293921717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :--#ubuntu < 1293921796 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh < 1293921807 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe the Bajoran-Cardassian stuff is interesting < 1293921813 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Just saw "Duet") < 1293921843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course it's interesting X-P < 1293921857 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, do you actually consume any non-mass-market SF? < 1293921858 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it would bore me < 1293921876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Does Star Trek count as mass-market really? < 1293921878 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, ... what does and does not count as mass-market? < 1293921879 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's pretty nerdy. < 1293921891 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes, but it counts in my book. < 1293921899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: As what, mass-market? < 1293921905 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps "mass-market" is the wrong word. < 1293921906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yer not a HATER are ye?! < 1293921921 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does HHGG count as mass-market? < 1293921935 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, you've read Fine Structure. < 1293921937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who the fuck says HHGG. < 1293921937 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does the SCP Foundation wiki? < 1293921944 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HHGttG, yes. H2G2, eys. < 1293921945 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*yes. < 1293921946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HHGG? < 1293921947 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which elliott has not, and as such he is inferior to sgeo. < 1293921958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I've read like 55% of it! < 1293921966 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :=P < 1293921971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: your idea didn't work < 1293921976 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the WRONG 55%! < 1293922200 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you know how you mentioned using a native EFI bootloader? < 1293922211 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: apparently VTs don't work with that. or suspend/resume. or brightness control < 1293922614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It's your lucky day! You get to help me figure out my new partitioning scheme! < 1293922652 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOOOOOOOO < 1293922666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I NEED THREE PARTITIONS YO < 1293922678 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, wait. < 1293922690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the best partition format that both OS X and Linux can read? < 1293922731 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FAT16. < 1293922741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Um, I would think that they can both read FAT32 at least. < 1293922744 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact I know that for a fact. < 1293923032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh come on, surely someone is opinionated enough to partition my drive for me. < 1293923033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro! < 1293923125 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, partition it in a geometric series. < 1293923156 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: oijrt < 1293923157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x < 1293923168 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: why don't you partition my drive :P < 1293923169 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't know < 1293923173 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it's not that horrible an idea. < 1293923174 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FAT32 will work though < 1293923275 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: apparently VTs don't work with that. or suspend/resume. or brightness control <-- wtf wtf and wtf < 1293923286 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, most wtf at the first thing though! < 1293923294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: they stay black apparently < 1293923295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: because the legacy bios support doesn't go on < 1293923299 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: so clearly linux's efi support SUCKS < 1293923303 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, quite < 1293923316 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't figure out how to partition this drive though < 1293923326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :256 GiB ... quite small since I need two partitions and then a shared one < 1293923337 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well get an 1 TB SSD! < 1293923341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shared I think I'll go for ext2 or ext3, since there's a FUSE thing for ext2/ext3 designed for OS X < 1293923344 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://alperakcan.org/?open=projects&project=fuse-ext2 < 1293923355 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure if i can trust it < 1293923364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :last release 0.0.7 in 2009 X-D < 1293923369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps not < 1293923375 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, question: are there no insult-fights in MI2? < 1293923390 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: hm indeed < 1293923394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: there are in MI3 though < 1293923396 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and they rhyme < 1293923429 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe ... 96 gig shared partition < 1293923431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1293923434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that only leaves 80 gigs per os < 1293923439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1293923464 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I sing the joyful song of 1 TB disks in RAID 1 at this point! < 1293923484 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1293923485 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sing a song of sixpence < 1293923497 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, err was this a pun of some sort? < 1293923501 0 :wareya!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1293923502 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm fucking impressed that they can even fit 256 gigs into this thing :P < 1293923515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I keep turning it on its side trying to figure out the bulge where all the components are < 1293923518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE < 1293923554 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: a very cheap pun. at least i doubt you can get 1 TB disks for six pence < 1293923557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: btw one really cool thing about os x is that you can resize the current booted OS partition < 1293923561 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grow /and/ shrink < 1293923715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: quick, how should i partition! < 1293923948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: :| < 1293923984 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, IIRC there are some HFS things for Linux... < 1293923998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :irrelevant < 1293924003 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just want actual partitioning advice at this point < 1293924032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :os x size, ubuntu size, and shared size < 1293924101 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :augur < 1293924216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: HA;LP < 1293924295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: 256 gigs give me three numbers < 1293924355 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clearly this requires a salomonic judgement. i hear he was good at partitioning. < 1293924360 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't know about partitioning! < 1293924366 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Let me restate. < 1293924368 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My partition table is HORRIFIC! < 1293924371 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: How many gigs should I give to OS X. < 1293924375 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How many gigs should I give to Ubuntu. < 1293924378 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How many gigs should I give to shared. < 1293924389 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, 25%, 25%, 50%? < 1293924404 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, wait, you aren't meant to use the whole disk, < 1293924408 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: That gives a whopping 64 gigs for each OS ... waay to smal. < 1293924409 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*small. < 1293924410 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And what? < 1293924413 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to use the entire disk. < 1293924427 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. 1/8th for each OS, and the rest to shared. < 1293924436 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ...dude. < 1293924449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You are telling me to give 32 gigs to each OS. < 1293924453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :80 gigs is more reasonable. < 1293924467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe 72. < 1293924468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not 32. < 1293924473 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, WELL I DON'T KNOW < 1293924477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PAH < 1293924511 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You might as well ask Sgeo for help with... anything. < 1293924541 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, incidentally, what in god's name are you wearing in your Facebook profile picture? < 1293924548 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe 72 for both OSes, and 112 for shared. < 1293924553 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It looks like you just came from a furry convention. < 1293924568 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god mental image stop it < 1293924593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. I've currently used 34 gigs on this OS X partition and I barely have anything on it. < 1293924619 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, OS X seems to take up *way* too much space. < 1293924649 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps 96 (OS X) + 64 (Ubuntu), leaving 96 for the shared partition. < 1293924767 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1293924902 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: quick, how should i partition! <-- 10 GB for OS X, rest for linux < 1293924916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you do realise that even a base os x install is >10gigs? < 1293924933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this thing is 3 days old and its os x partition is 34 gig used < 1293924942 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: also i want a shared partition < 1293925015 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, did you check the usage when you got it? < 1293925033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. But I've barely added anything. < 1293925185 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, why are you looking at my Facebook profile? < 1293925187 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just found the worst Useless Use Of Cat ever: cat a >> file; cat b >> file; cat c >> file; cat d >> file; < 1293925191 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also: Part of a blood drop suit < 1293925193 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, curiosity...? < 1293925203 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Was volunteering at a blood drive at my school < 1293925214 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: brilliant < 1293925222 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: you do realise that even a base os x install is >10gigs? <-- ah, uh < 1293925230 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, that's not for real is it. < 1293925230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: and I say that as an *advocate* for useless uses of cat :) < 1293925232 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how much more than 10 GB? < 1293925234 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's for real, isn't it. < 1293925240 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, yes < 1293925240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I do actually plan to use this occasionally. < 1293925246 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : this thing is 3 days old and its os x partition is 34 gig used <--- what the fucking thing < 1293925254 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: To be fair, it also has iLife installed. < 1293925258 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, 60 GB to OS X? < 1293925258 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, please show me that script. < 1293925264 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs941.snc4/73456_489504182743_618027743_7473878_3043494_n.jpg < 1293925267 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: More like 72 to 96 gigs. < 1293925275 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Ubuntu should be fine on 64 to 72 gigs. Rest can go to shared. < 1293925285 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well don't ask me if you don't want to get an answer! < 1293925290 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, what an odd furry costume. < 1293925294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I don't want an answer that's unworkable :P < 1293925299 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: What animal is that. < 1293925344 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks like a strawberry to me < 1293925352 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(no not an amimal indeed!) < 1293925356 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :animal* < 1293925410 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have this Ubuntu I've been using a while, it's taking a bit less than 10 jiggabytes, discounting /home. (Just as another point of data.) < 1293925429 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, http://pastebin.com/Z3nFQBfk < 1293925466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Counting home in this case. < 1293925472 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: A lot of things will be shared but not all. < 1293925492 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Er, well, my /home is 315G, so that's not a helpful data point for you, I think. < 1293925493 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, he asked me why it doesn't work < 1293925495 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-\ < 1293925496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: the kind of code only a python programmer could write < 1293925503 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: love the duplicated list-contrib lines < 1293925510 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note lines 18-20 < 1293925516 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The kind of face only a Python programmer could love. < 1293925516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Well, yes, indeed. < 1293925538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: "If they had offered a terabyte SSD..." < 1293925642 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...they would have asked a lot of money for it. < 1293925650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: They already asked a lot of money. < 1293925691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude> let x = 0/0 < 1293925691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude> x == x < 1293925692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :False < 1293925693 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: *cry* < 1293925706 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats wrong elliott < 1293925710 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: ^ < 1293925715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHY HASKELL WHY < 1293925721 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did the mean GHCi do bad things to you < 1293925724 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nan is unequal to everything including itself, what's the problem? :) < 1293925733 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :show me on the doll where simon peyton jones touched you < 1293925740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: IEEEE CANNOT OVERRIDE THE LAWS OF MATHEMATICS < 1293925743 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EQ HAS *RULES* DAMMIT < 1293925747 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU ARE BREAKING THEM PRELUDE < 1293925750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BAD PRELUDE < 1293925751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BAD! < 1293925776 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those "laws of mathematics" should be saying something about not holding when dividing by zero < 1293925790 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: obviously that doesnt matter < 1293925795 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for all x, x == x. < 1293925798 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what augur said < 1293925803 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0/0 shouldn't be a valid program, but if it is < 1293925808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it'd better return a meaningful result < 1293925809 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is simply true regardless of anything < 1293925809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btiches < 1293925811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*valid expression < 1293925816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: SURE THING AYN RAND < 1293925819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg < 1293925823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ayn rand would have hated floating point < 1293925826 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you believe it < 1293925827 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I SAID FORALL X NOT FORALL A < 1293925828 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOSH < 1293925832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :she'd write books on the evil of floating point < 1293925834 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be amazing < 1293925838 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wouldn't that be amazing? < 1293925840 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be so amazing < 1293925883 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I think I once said that to an Objectivist at my school. < 1293925893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I ... doubt he got it < 1293925895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*they < 1293925929 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, he didn't. < 1293925931 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont D: < 1293925941 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, NaN != NaN < 1293925942 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: lolz A=A this is basis of philosophy because i am smart < 1293925948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: nan != nan bitches < 1293925951 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: WAAAAAAR < 1293925971 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh is that true about float? lol < 1293925976 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still have no idea what the hell the "A is A" thing is meant to mean. < 1293925989 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: yOU ARE YOURSELF AND NO OTHER SELF;;;;ERGO TAXES IS THEFT < 1293925996 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: all things are self-identical < 1293926006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I think it's meant to be like ... uh ... you are yourself, and you are not anyone else, so you have your own existence and consciousness and mind < 1293926014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and are therefore morally obligated only to yourself < 1293926014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something < 1293926020 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's objectivism man < 1293926022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it makes no fucking sense < 1293926023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why bother < 1293926038 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hereby accuse augur of being a smelly objectivist < 1293926050 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey im not smelly! :( < 1293926054 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I accuse augur of not knowing about smelly objectivists. < 1293926057 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nor an objectivist but < 1293926135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://dis.4chan.org/read/prog/1293725159/30 is it a sign of mental retardation if i can't stop moving my cursor around with the dot? < 1293926140 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wheeeeee < 1293926256 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hate books about godels theorem < 1293926267 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nobody except godel should be allowed to say anything about it < 1293926278 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1293926282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: :D < 1293926309 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, GEB? < 1293926320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ExFAT < 1293926321 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol what < 1293926327 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: GEB is ... not a good book. < 1293926334 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: firewooh < 1293926335 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :d < 1293926342 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GEB is ok < 1293926343 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I know that! < 1293926362 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, paper doesn't burn too well. < 1293926371 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it certainly shouldn't be considered a good math book < 1293926381 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or a math book period < 1293926434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GEB is what happens when a smart person has some kind of mental blockage that makes them consider recursion amazing. < 1293926451 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: and Penrose < 1293926452 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it's like whoa. < 1293926465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Penrose should just be ... forced to shut up forever? < 1293926470 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL < 1293926470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: like a restraining order < 1293926474 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he can't publish any books any more < 1293926477 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Penrose is crazy too? < 1293926480 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the problem with Penrose is he's a really smart guy < 1293926493 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he just has this one absolutely idiotic idea that he talks about sometimes < 1293926499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: he thinks that intelligent life is immortal because the universe's maximum state of entropy has all information or something < 1293926504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :??? I don't know, I can't explain crazy people < 1293926505 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think Hofstader also knows his stuff < 1293926505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yeah < 1293926513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: the smarter someone gets, I think, the more likely they are to have one really stupid idea < 1293926519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and be unable to see how stupid it is < 1293926523 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1293926525 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like einstein < 1293926536 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, which crazy idea did he have? < 1293926539 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah einstein with that stupid "relativity" stuff < 1293926540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: yeah what was that fucker thinking with realtivity < 1293926542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*relativity < 1293926545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: *high5* < 1293926547 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1293926560 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: spooky action at a distance < 1293926584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's my favourite name of anyhting really < 1293926585 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't the non-existence of action at a distance a direct consequence of relativity? < 1293926590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :spooky action at a distance < 1293926595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just ... the best name < 1293926595 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well, you'd think < 1293926612 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Action_at_a_distance_(physics) i bet this was renamed from the proper name by wikilamers < 1293926616 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but Einstein also developed the first inklings of quantum theory < 1293926626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOTT DOST NOT PLAY DIECE < 1293926629 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly < 1293926650 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he hated quantum theory because of its implications < 1293926657 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he was too hung up on dumb concepts < 1293926670 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :despite having given the insight which led to the < 1293926671 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*them < 1293926723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gödel's really stupid idea was that he was being poisoned, but that one resolved itself quite quickly :D < 1293926725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aww that was an awful thing to say < 1293926728 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm such a bad person < 1293926757 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GÖDEL'S GHOST FROWNS ON YOU < 1293926768 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MAY ALL YOUR THEOREMS BE UNDECIDABLE < 1293926769 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gödel's skeletal ghost < 1293926824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: OS X — 96 gigs; Ubuntu — 56 gigs; Shared — 96 gigs < 1293926830 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: dunno whether those are decimal are binary gbs but who cares < 1293926833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does this look reasonable? < 1293926846 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my school has a course that includes undecidability < 1293926850 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've heard it's kind of boring :( < 1293926860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can resize the OS X one at any time really, but < 1293926898 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no it doesn't < 1293926904 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, too much of OS X :P < 1293926914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: aside from zealotry. < 1293926917 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :w/in 25 < 1293926918 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but since you can resize it again, sure < 1293926920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OS X takes up more space, simple fact < 1293926926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yeah but i'd have to get rid of ubuntu/shared < 1293926935 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what? < 1293926941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: because this takes up the whole disk < 1293926945 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, couldn't you add shared-2 < 1293926946 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or such < 1293926952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you mean shrink OS X? < 1293926955 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes < 1293926957 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt i'll want to give less to OS X < 1293926960 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah < 1293926965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :considering there's only 50 gigs free on there as it stands < 1293926973 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, aren't there shrinkable linux file systems? < 1293926975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :56 gigs for ubuntu might be too little? probably not < 1293926981 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: probably. i'm just going to go with ubuntu default < 1293926998 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not sure how much ubuntu need < 1293927003 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :du -sh /usr might take a while < 1293927012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well as fizzie said his ubuntu install only uses about 10 gigs. < 1293927016 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on my arch system: < 1293927018 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ df -h /usr/ < 1293927018 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Filesystem Size Used Avail Use% Mounted on < 1293927018 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/dev/mapper/array-usr < 1293927018 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 20G 8,5G 11G 46% /usr < 1293927021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: but there's /home in these too, just things like music will go on shared < 1293927024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also probably code? < 1293927034 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well my /home : < 1293927041 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Filesystem Size Used Avail Use% Mounted on < 1293927041 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/dev/mapper/array-home < 1293927041 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 69G 59G 7,4G 89% /home < 1293927048 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :89% !? < 1293927050 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1293927054 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I'll have to grow it < 1293927055 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :again < 1293927061 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :long live LVM! < 1293927061 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, yes, I /am/ planning to buy my big desktop system. < 1293927079 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you here see the wonder of LVM! < 1293927079 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'd like it if there was some kind of standard thing like a slimmed down LVM ... with saner nomenclature and tools. < 1293927090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: and if all filesystems supported resizing. online resizing. < 1293927103 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well actually jfs supports on line growing < 1293927106 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: but, uh, LVM has the wondrous feature of interoperating with NOTHING < 1293927115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :want to just LOOK at your files in another OS? SORYYYYY < 1293927118 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so does ext4 iirc < 1293927128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yeah. well. i'm not making my shared partition ext4 < 1293927130 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, lvm for fuse? DO IT NOW! < 1293927136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck no < 1293927145 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I think ext3 supports resizing too < 1293927148 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :online I mean < 1293927172 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway I doubt I will change from linux on my destop < 1293927175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck it, I'm resizing. If I decide it's all wrong I'll trash ubuntu & shared and redo it. < 1293927175 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :desktop* < 1293927187 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what about swap < 1293927187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: um hello @? (okay so @ won't interact with anything else either :-)) < 1293927194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I don't need swap, I have four gigabytes of RAM < 1293927202 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you can't suspend to disk then < 1293927207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Sure you can with a swap file. < 1293927212 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... right < 1293927232 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: OK, fine, I'll make room for a six gig swap. < 1293927234 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it's a blood drop < 1293927234 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, separate /boot I guess? < 1293927236 0 :wareya!~wareya@cpe-74-70-142-220.nycap.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1293927243 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, needs to be 60 MB or less < 1293927256 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well it could be larger) < 1293927257 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION finished Braid < 1293927264 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(would be a waste though) < 1293927269 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: why separate /boot. < 1293927283 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well depends on if your bootloader can handle the main fs < 1293927318 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I guess you need to install bootloader into partition rather than into mbr on that computer < 1293927320 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no? < 1293927334 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ du -sh /usr/ < 1293927334 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :7,6G /usr/ < 1293927336 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from thinkpad < 1293927369 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/var contains a few chroots < 1293927373 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so pointless to check < 1293927383 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293927418 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1293927420 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow. < 1293927423 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That resize was quick. < 1293927426 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wonder why LimeChat crashed. < 1293927432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Resize and partition, no less.) < 1293927444 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, now I need to put GRUB on the shared partition. < 1293927460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can install GRUB from OS X right? ...right? < 1293927485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1293927491 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you download "GRUB 2 images" or something? < 1293927496 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't count on it: :) < 1293927531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh come on, i have to :P < 1293927596 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1293927655 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :configure: error: objconv not found which is required when building with apple compiler < 1293927662 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: grub can build on os x apparently? < 1293927703 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1293927721 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, but isn't it heaps easier to do this from ubuntu once you install it? :) < 1293927728 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:21 < c_wraith> (I have goldbach's conjecture in formal logic as a tattoo) < 1293927730 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: i need grub to install it. < 1293927739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: lol. < 1293927750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :goldbach's conjecture is beautiful now? < 1293927753 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, due to not having an optical drive? < 1293927755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in logic notation? < 1293927762 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: i'm going to boot from hd with grub :p < 1293927767 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you're going to install the installer and boot it with grub? < 1293927769 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: I could just fish out a usb stick but this is the moar funz < 1293927770 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1293927772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes i am < 1293927774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :install by copying < 1293927777 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I approve :D < 1293927813 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GRUB2 will be compiled with following components: < 1293927813 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Platform: i386-efi < 1293927817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1293927820 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait grub doesn't do 64-bit < 1293927820 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1293927823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't want efi though < 1293927852 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can it even boot without efi support on a mac? < 1293927860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: well. yes. with bios emulation. < 1293927866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although probably it hands over control as bios? < 1293927873 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm just scared that it'll be grub-efi < 1293927875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which I do nooooot want < 1293927882 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: see http://grub.enbug.org/TestingOnMacbook < 1293927887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1293927887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wrong page < 1293927897 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no wait < 1293927899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: that's the page < 1293927902 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: see drawbacks < 1293927905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no virtual terminals :-) < 1293927908 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But Grub-EFI is so modern! < 1293927927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it actually possible to force a bios build??? < 1293927943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1293927949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :--with-platform=pc should do it < 1293927965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(is that "ok" to do? who knows let's find out) < 1293928068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In file included from kern/err.c:23: < 1293928068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :./include/grub/i18n.h:28:5: error: "ENABLE_NLS" is not defined < 1293928068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make: *** [kernel_img-kern_err.o] Error 1 < 1293928069 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make: *** Waiting for unfinished jobs.... < 1293928071 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In file included from kern/misc.c:26: < 1293928073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :./include/grub/i18n.h:28:5: error: "ENABLE_NLS" is not defined < 1293928075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol. < 1293928287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok seriously. even a grub 1 image would do < 1293928301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll try a grub floppy. who knows < 1293928304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just might work < 1293928367 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's see if that worked < 1293928368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :refit time < 1293928387 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexa_Ray_Joel < 1293928403 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[On December 5, 2009 Joel ingested a quantity of Traumeel, a homeopathic alternative to ibuprofen.]] < 1293928411 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Worst. Suicide attempt. EVER. < 1293928414 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's WikiNotable! < 1293928422 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And HILARIOUS. < 1293928422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I thought it was ... without context. < 1293928428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On December 6, 2009 Joel ate breakfast. < 1293928651 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is a perfect demonstration of the way that selection pressures in our culture are working against intelligence. < 1293928653 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't call that a suicide attempt < 1293928693 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :People clever enough to realise that you should use evidence-based suicide do not go on to reproduce, while those who opt for complementary and alternative suicide live. < 1293928709 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, well "attempt" is certainly relevant. < 1293928721 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note: that thing about selection is tongue in cheek. < 1293928723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[Within a month after her Traumeel incident, on December 31, 2009 Joel publicly posted[51] that she wanted to help young girls deal with what she termed "heartbreak-related depression,"[52] which term, it was noted, "does not currently exist as a clinically diagnosable form of depression."]] < 1293928738 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, like CWC and his date ed classes. < 1293928762 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :she's just an idiot, now she goes on to make depression even less respectable as a serious mental healht problem < 1293928787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293928847 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They had that public mass-suicide-by-homeopathy thing, http://www.1023.org.uk/the-1023-overdose-event.php < 1293928875 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1293928877 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :has that had much of an effect? < 1293928905 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1293928913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Didn't work. < 1293928927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, I have another idea. < 1293928927 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all these fucking "cuts" everyone complains about, but the NHS still prescibes homepathy and ancient chinese "stick needles in the guy to heal him" < 1293928942 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah nhs support of homeopathy is fucked < 1293928958 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Great idea: aquapuncture - combination of the ancient chinese art (?) and homeopathy! < 1293928967 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll make a forture^H^H^H help lots of people! < 1293928972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1293928972 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought the government basically said "no, it doesn't work, but we're still going to use it." < 1293928981 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293928990 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Take a needle. Dilute it 10^60 times. < 1293928995 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1293928999 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stick it into the patient. < 1293929027 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Iridopuncture, aka needles-to-the-eye. < 1293929030 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although that would probably cure you of pins and needles, not anything else. < 1293929050 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like-cures-like is applicable to EVERYTHING. < 1293929065 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shot? Dilute a bullet 10^60 times! < 1293929096 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minecraft homeopathy. < 1293929113 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Broken foot? Dissolve someone else's foot in acid, then start diluting that. < 1293929126 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Remember to break it first, though.) < 1293929201 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Defend yourself against creepers! Bucket + gunpowder, then repeat 100 times! < 1293929630 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1293929748 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1293929809 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1293929817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've had a sudden burst of reasonableness and found a USB stick < 1293929930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Can the world float? < 1293929944 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not sure. < 1293929949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CAN IT FLOAT ON PIN < 1293930189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Who was the hippocampus? < 1293930209 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :John. < 1293930218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That explains it. < 1293930487 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Changing server < 1293931166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293931554 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1293931755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"One of the arguments for functional programming is better modular design. By analyzing publications advocating this approach, in particular through the example of a framework for financial contracts, we assess is strengths and weaknesses, and compare it with object-oriented design. The overall conclusion is that object- oriented design, especially in a modern form supporting high-level routine objects or “agents”, subsumes the fu < 1293931755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nctional approach, retaining its benefits while providing higher-level abstractions more supportive of extension and reuse." < 1293931758 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :--Bertrand Meyer ... < 1293931761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I disagree :-P < 1293931763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One of the arguments for functional programming is better modular design. By analyzing publications advocating this approach, in particular through the example of a framework for financial contracts, we assess is strengths and weaknesses, and compare it with object-oriented design. The overall conclusion is that object- oriented design, especially in a modern form supporting high-level routine objects or “agents”, subsumes the fun < 1293931763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ctional approach, retaining its benefits while providing higher-level abstractions more supportive of extension and reuse. < 1293931764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1293931765 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://se.ethz.ch/~meyer/publications/functional/meyer_functional_oo.pdf < 1293931804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"(We share the reader’s alarm at the unappetizing nature of the examples, especially coming from a Paris- based author. The sympathetic explanation is that the presentation was directed to a foreign audience of which it assumed, along with unfamiliarity with the metric system, barbaric culinary habits. The present discussion relies on the assumption that bad taste in desserts is not a sufficient predictor of bad taste in language an < 1293931805 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :d architecture paradigms.)" < 1293931891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293932271 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1293932539 0 :rderos!~Felipe@189.25.7.252 JOIN :#esoteric < 1293932543 0 :rderos!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1293932620 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1293932922 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[When people want to emphasize how pathetically far we are from proving P≠NP, they often use the following argument: for godsakes, we can’t even prove that NEXP-complete problems aren’t solvable by depth-3, polynomial-size circuits consisting entirely of mod 6 gates! < 1293932922 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But no more.]] < 1293933148 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders who "they" are :D < 1293933221 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: the set {Scott Aaronson} :D < 1293933264 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so he uses the royal "then", i take? < 1293933270 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*"they" < 1293933274 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: clearly :D < 1293933324 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a subtle megalomania mixing the styles of queen victoria and julius caesar < 1293933432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bleh ... it seems you have to have a gpt thing to do usb w/ macbook air < 1293933438 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wonder if fedora's stuff would do it < 1293933490 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION looks at the actual blog post and detects _possibly_ a tiny tinge of sarcasm there... < 1293933496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: no shit :P < 1293933585 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I feel slightly wrong writing in a functional style in K&R C < 1293933599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Er, wow. What. < 1293933601 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :purely for the purpose of making a "record this, do something, put it back to the original value" wrapper nest easily < 1293933602 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, cool! < 1293933608 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Why are you ... < 1293933625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I mean, K&R? And ... < 1293933625 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and as for K&R C, I was writing a hacked version of NetHack for RNG manipulation purposes < 1293933629 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and NetHack's written in K&R C < 1293933637 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: protoize that shit for AceHack :P < 1293933639 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it predates C89, so you can hardly blame it for that) < 1293933654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any reason not to? < 1293933660 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't done things like reindenting or protoizing so existing patches apply wel < 1293933662 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*well < 1293933670 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :boring :) < 1293933680 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the indentation style's currently a mix of my two-space, and NetHack's four spaces for one level, tab for two levels < 1293933702 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ...see, um < 1293933711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: not following an existing codebase's indentation style < 1293933718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I'm afraid I'm going to have to kill you for the benefit of everyone. < 1293933720 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: means I end up not mixing tabs and sapces? < 1293933725 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't have things both ways round < 1293933735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: at least keep the same indentation width < 1293933743 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(4, since they probably assume tab=8) < 1293933748 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, in some cases I've been interspersing eight spaces for two levels < 1293933767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but don't do any two-spacing < 1293933771 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly because telling the editor to save mixed-tab-and-space, while entirely possible, would mean repeatedly changing it there and back < 1293933781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :time to try out this ubuntu usb stick again < 1293933791 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: erm emacs can condition on the path of the file < 1293933800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293933828 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(for the logs) I know, but that would be a pain to set up < 1293933838 0 :elliott!~elliott@91.105.67.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1293933840 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1293933840 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1293933841 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grrrrrrrrrrrrrr < 1293933842 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as I have far too many NetHack source trees, in all sorts of places < 1293933845 0 :coppro!~scshunt@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1293933846 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GRR < 1293933849 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GRRRGRGRGRGGRGR < 1293933854 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1293933875 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what? < 1293933880 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: stupid mac < 1293933904 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, why do places like BBC News always credit YouTube or Wikipedia rather than the actual author of the content? < 1293933907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: basically, as far as i can tell, the only way to boto from a usb stick is to have it gpt-partitioned < 1293933909 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*boot < 1293933912 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch < 1293933916 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Booting Windows or Linux from an external disk is not well-supported by Apple’s firmware. It may work for you, but if it does not work, there is nothing rEFIt can do about it." < 1293933917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: which can be done ... with a fedora specific, linux-only, RPM package < 1293933920 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Just saw that on a page.) < 1293933926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically < 1293933928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my options are < 1293933934 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :- see if i can get that working here (endless unpredictable pain) < 1293933935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or < 1293933939 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need a Linux-based program in order to install Linux? < 1293933941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :- £60 on external SuperDrive < 1293933955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: clearly! ubuntu has instructions for setting up a usb stick on a mac but they don't work and from what i'm reading, cannot possibly work < 1293933962 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, what about running Fedora in a VM, and using that to reformat the stick? < 1293933974 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293933984 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that... sounds like it could rapidly become more than £60 worth of pain < 1293933986 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can't you partition it with just gdisk? < 1293933999 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: partitioning is easy -- getting the files on there and making it bootable, I have no idea ho < 1293934000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :w < 1293934005 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently it has to be HFS-partitioned too < 1293934011 0 :coppro!~scshunt@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1293934014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so regular bootloaders won't work? < 1293934025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Feel like making a USB stick image for me? :-P < 1293934027 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1293934032 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was totally my fault < 1293934037 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All it'll require is alien, an Ubuntu ISO, and PATIENCE! < 1293934046 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1293934049 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'll instead sleep on it. :p < 1293934065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: You're far too loyal not to help out, right? < 1293934159 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: THAT IS NOT THE SOUND OF REASSURANCE < 1293934225 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: re youtube/wikipedia < 1293934237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: because those seem like real, respectable businesses < 1293934242 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: real sources < 1293934246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Coolguy1272 doesn't < 1293934331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[Steve Wozniak is an out and out self proclaimed geek. As the co-founder of Apple, he has given the world products aimed at making our life easier and more fun.]] < 1293934337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I ... don't think Woz stayed on for very long, BBC < 1293934385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bleARGH < 1293934387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*bleargh < 1293934460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok seriously < 1293934465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's got to be possible to do this < 1293934475 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is the last ep of season 1 good? < 1293934483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Does it matter? You can't skip any. < 1293934489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I don't suppose I can convince you to try and install one package and try out a command ...? < 1293934714 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, most of the good episodes were near the end of the season < 1293934831 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: what about YOU, I can depend on you can't I < 1293935031 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1293935085 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: What assistance do ou need, citizen? < 1293935108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: one (1) .rpm converted to .deb and installed by you with the help of ``Alien'' conversion tool; < 1293935119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: and one (1) Ubuntu Live CD ISO downloaded; < 1293935129 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: and one (1) conversion of this ISO to a disk image using that Linux-only tool < 1293935162 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :knowledge of RED Hat is above your Clearance, citizen. < 1293935172 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Report for termination immediately. < 1293935175 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thank you, and enjoy your day. < 1293935181 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: p < 1293935185 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*alien -i foo.rpm < 1293935187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: DAMMIT I'MA GO INSANE < 1293935194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sdfghjk, < 1293935196 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nm, < 1293935197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zxcvbnm, < 1293935203 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't even bother with references INSTALL THE PACKAGE ;_; < 1293935210 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you need your ISO converted? < 1293935218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: to install ubuntu. < 1293935225 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to what though < 1293935230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: this. < 1293935258 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is this < 1293935264 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: um, a computing machine? < 1293935272 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait it's a usb stick image? < 1293935281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: no it's a live cd that you can turn into a usb stick image < 1293935282 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol just stick a partition table in front of it < 1293935288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: yeah um it needs to be gpt < 1293935290 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and hfs-formatted < 1293935295 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gpt? < 1293935295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i have no idea what bootloader it installs < 1293935297 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and hfs? < 1293935298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: apple shit < 1293935312 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol not happening < 1293935317 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(maily cos I'm lazy) < 1293935325 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: there _is_ a reason I mentioned the .rpm, you know < 1293935329 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but also because you wouldn't do it for me < 1293935340 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would actually if yelled at enough < 1293935343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how much do i have to tell < 1293935360 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"livecd-iso-to-disk --mactel --reset-mbr foo.iso blah" NAG NAG NAG < 1293935369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NAG NAG NAG NAG NAG NAG NAG < 1293935373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fffff < 1293935798 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1293935932 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1293936142 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293936166 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1293936197 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1293936214 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1293936536 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: stop it < 1293936573 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: sorry. ive been trying to fix my mbp screen < 1293936576 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i broke the glass :( < 1293936584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: pray to steve jobs < 1293936586 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yet i followed the professional instructions! < 1293936618 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: steve jobs. < 1293936630 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1293936678 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: surely you have another computer with linux < 1293936687 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that was a statement) < 1293936714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: I do, yes, but uh ... hmm. < 1293936718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why amn't I doing taht. < 1293936720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well < 1293936723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :getting a friend to do it instead < 1293936967 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, has thedailywtf's forum actually been patched to allow only haikus? < 1293936974 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as opposed to a mod doing it manually? < 1293936981 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the sidebar forum, not the replies on the articles) < 1293936998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: er, wow < 1293937001 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, not only haikus, but posts of approximate haiku length < 1293937016 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can write a short plaintext sentence which has a similar length < 1293937029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://forums.thedailywtf.com/forums/t/21032.aspx < 1293937030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not very haikuy < 1293937040 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :From henceforth, all messages posted that are not in the form of a Haiku will be deleted. < 1293937040 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have been warned. Have a nice day. < 1293937041 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@bas5-toronto47-1167928546.dsl.bell.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1293937049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1293937054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: seems like it's some kind of bug < 1293937056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe < 1293937058 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1293937066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and then it was turned into a haiku rule < 1293937076 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I see < 1293937089 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CS has decided only to allow very short posts due to being broken < 1293937111 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the mod's response was, instead of fixing the forum, to institute a "haiku rule" to patch around it < 1293937146 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now if there was only some website I could post on to report curious perversions in information technology... < 1293937150 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the REAL wtf... < 1293937152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1293937155 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because that definitely qualifies < 1293937196 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: http://forums.thedailywtf.com/forums/p/21032/241597.aspx#241597 < 1293937229 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : You can now type more text into the subject line (255 UTF-16 characters by the looks of it) than you can in a post (~180 was it?) < 1293937241 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: saw it already < 1293937269 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CS? < 1293937274 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :community server < 1293937276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :community server < 1293937278 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1293937281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a horrible asp.net abomination < 1293937282 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a much-maligned forum that somehow got even worse < 1293937286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the real wtf is the daily wtf < 1293937295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seriously, why did it have to be alex that started it? < 1293937299 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's so close to being the wtf himself < 1293937415 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: is Username a mod? < 1293937422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he has rather ...suspicious... stats < 1293937425 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he/she < 1293938079 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1293938885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293939167 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, have you determined the exact allowable length yet? < 1293940346 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :According to Star Trek, all aliens want human girls < 1293940355 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, human-looking girls < 1293940560 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1293940710 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to make up the new URI scheme for IRC, to get rid of problems with "IRC" scheme. The new one can be "IRCP" (for "Internet Relay Chat Protocol") and it accepts the username and password field, host, port, and so on. For example the URL for this channel would be: ircp://irc.freenode.net:6667/join?%23esoteric < 1293940891 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yuck < 1293940976 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To represent the registration of this channel: ircp://irc.freenode.net:6667/cs/info?%23esoteric < 1293941050 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: We don't sell that. < 1293941211 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why would you have a password in a URI? < 1293941248 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: You probably wouldn't, but you could if you needed to. (Other URI schemes do support username/password) You might also include just the username. < 1293941454 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ircp:// URIs shall be case-insensitive (except the password) < 1293941509 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would make far more sense to call this channel ircp://irc.freenode.net:6667/%23esoteric < 1293941552 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and for instance, its info would be ircp://irc.freenode.net:6667/%esoteric?info < 1293941578 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: I understand, but I don't like that much. < 1293941605 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's certainly better than putting something dumb like chanserv in there < 1293941626 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: But it is the chanserv info, isn't it?? < 1293941636 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that info might not be provided by chanserv < 1293941653 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also you're making "cs" be a magic string there < 1293941667 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: But then the servers do not have a standard way of retrieving it, and it won't work. < 1293941676 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yes, that's a difficulty < 1293941691 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: but you don't have a standard way of asking for "cs" info < 1293941755 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Yes; the URL for the channel info would be secondary level specification, not a primary level; primary levels are the more standard ones. Secondary levels are used when the primary ones are insufficient. < 1293941793 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(As if they are two separate RFCs or two separate chapters in one RFC, for example.) < 1293941892 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, the channel type symbol (#&!+) must be URL encoded using % and hex code, except for ! which can be written as either "!" or "%21". The # & + MUST be written using "%23", "%26", "%2b", respectively. < 1293942738 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293943284 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is a command on this IRC server I didn't know, the CHANTRACE command. < 1293943393 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just put ChanServ in the URI < 1293943413 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, no, that sucks < 1293943423 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ChanServ might not be the only thing gthat varies < 1293943430 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gVaries, now using glib < 1293943610 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It is why I have specified that there is "primary level" and "secondary level". < 1293945705 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is a algorithm for calculating standard deviation (using integers only)? < 1293946678 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds difficult, considering the average of integers is not necessarily an integer... < 1293946717 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: I could also just calculating fixed point using integers < 1293948926 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1293951478 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293951876 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wants combat rations < 1293955199 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1293955200 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1293955705 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* chantrace :Outputs a list of members in #channel in ETRACE format, with the classname < 1293955705 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* chantrace :replaced by the server the users are on. < 1293955709 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@ zzo < 1293955921 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, you have a cloak on - right? < 1293955939 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, why? < 1293955944 0 :Wamanuz3!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1293955958 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, because I think I just found your IP < 1293955966 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*gasp* < 1293955975 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, not a major issue < 1293955983 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I want to know if cloaks actually work < 1293956004 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, well, try finding the IP of someone who's cloaked. < 1293956023 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, your not? < 1293956044 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless it's possible to be cloaked without one's knowledge, I am not. < 1293956048 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What made you think I was? < 1293956068 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, misreading my /whois < 1293956071 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry < 1293956090 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION shrugs < 1293956100 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cloaks work if you identify before joining a channel < 1293956114 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had one for a while myself < 1293956124 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, I know how it works - I misread something < 1293956125 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but now I have a hostname I'm not interested in cloaking < 1293956134 0 :Wamanuz2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1293956150 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1293956161 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hrm < 1293956176 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn you, grad courses < 1293956194 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, what courses? < 1293956259 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: there's a course on logic next term I may sit in on < 1293956285 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's called "logic for comp. sci." by the registrar < 1293956290 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, cool < 1293956291 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which leaves me guessing as to what it actually is < 1293956315 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my favorite subject is logic :-} < 1293956351 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if it's anything like the previous logic course taught by the same prof (Advanced Logic in Computer Science) 5 terms ago, then it may be worth trying to maneuver my way around the dumb undergrad course < 1293956581 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure how far above my head it starts < 1293956602 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if it isn't too far, I would definitely love to take a real logic course rather than the blargh undergrad one < 1293956626 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(provided, also, that I can convince necessary people that it is a good idea for me to replace the mandatory undergrad course with the grad one) < 1293956657 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, worst case just audit the class < 1293956966 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: if I can find the time, sure < 1293956978 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and/or if I can follow along < 1293957217 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`/win 3 < 1293957246 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1293957594 0 :Wamanuz4!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1293957802 0 :Wamanuz3!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1293958208 0 :sftp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293958711 0 :Wamanuz5!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1293958870 0 :Wamanuz4!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1293961005 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1293961140 0 :Wamanuz5!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1293962041 0 :Wamanuz2!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1293962212 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1293963560 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ais523: that... sounds like it could rapidly become more than £60 worth of pain <-- (for logs): why £60 specifically? < 1293964743 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My parents insist that I never stopped talking since I was nine months old, but this video tape of me at my first birthday has a distinctive lack of any meaningful vocalizations :P < 1293966067 0 :Wamanuz3!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1293966257 0 :Wamanuz2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1293966821 0 :Wamanuz3!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1293967003 0 :Wamanuz4!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1293967880 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-13-27.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1293970249 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, :D < 1293970721 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :mauna < 1293970729 0 :mauna!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :augur < 1293970883 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1293970883 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1293970883 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1293971046 0 :wareya!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1293971831 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1293972172 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan! < 1293972174 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WAR! < 1293972228 0 :WAR!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1293972247 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That would have been a lot better if it hadn't had my name in the whois. < 1293972296 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1293972324 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wanted to make the "plain.cards" file and "texnicard_format.tex" file also available in the book, so I wrote a program in AWK. < 1293972338 0 :WAR!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1293972347 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I have written a program in AWK before. < 1293972436 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It works; but maybe I have done something 'improper' by not knowing programming with AWK, before. I don't know. < 1293972546 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :nice stuff at http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page | retards at voxelperfect.net have expired | historical documents at http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D or via hg at http://codu.org/projects/esotericlogs/hg/ < 1293972594 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :turds at http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page | turds at voxelperfect.net have expired | historical turds at http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D or via hg at http://codu.org/projects/esotericlogs/hg/ < 1293972598 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TURDS < 1293972632 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :TURDS at http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page | TURDS at voxelperfect.net have expired | historical TURDS at http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D or via hg at http://codu.org/projects/esotericlogs/hg/ < 1293972671 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good enough. < 1293972855 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is this considered a 'proper' program in AWK, or is there some things which I have done badly and could be improvement? http://sprunge.us/eLcc < 1293973370 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is SPARC system programming is soo undocumented < 1293973393 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: I don't know. Are you trying to write a program? < 1293973441 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OS < 1293974137 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :beh < 1293975191 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, hm, how does SPARC deal with the register window thing when it comes to running out of registers. That is: what happens when call stack gets too deep? < 1293975221 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know because i can't find the goddamn docs < 1293975225 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1293975237 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something like intel's manual < 1293975277 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was wondering if it was handled by the hardware itself or if it invoked an exception handler which had to deal with it < 1293975629 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293975645 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :going to reboot for kernel upgrade on the computer running this irc bouncer < 1293975647 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl < 1293975656 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net < 1293976167 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders if it may be worth it to wipe out Ubuntu and just use Tinycore for his Linux needs < 1293976407 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC running out of register window "depth" generates an exception, and then an OS exception handler will do some stack-pushery. < 1293976488 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: http://developers.sun.com/solaris/articles/sparcv9.pdf not good enough for your purposes? < 1293977154 0 :sftp!~sftp@79.174.49.208 JOIN :#esoteric < 1293977212 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: lol, i'm stupid < 1293977224 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i found that earlier and forgot that i have it :G < 1293978123 0 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1293979425 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: "An overflow [of the register windows] causes a spill trap that allows privileged software [read: the OS] to save the occupied register window in memory, thereby making it available for use." < 1293979817 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are algorithms for calculating such things as standard deviation, etc? < 1293980096 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_deviation#Rapid_calculation_methods < 1293980284 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a bit of a misleading title there, since it seems more about doing a running standard deviation; for the std of a particular n-point data set, I don't think there's typically anything much more cleverer than the straight-forward O(n) just-you-know-calculate-it thing. < 1293980372 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The algorithm described there should work. < 1293980407 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How large do you expect $s_2$ to become in case of a large set of cards? < 1293980477 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: well the clever thing about it afaik is that you can calculate it in one pass... < 1293980511 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: well it should be less than N times the square of your maximal value... < 1293980522 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Well, yes, that is what I was alluding to with the "running" part. < 1293980533 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(this is of course rather trivial) < 1293980547 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: mhm < 1293980594 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyhoo, quite often doing two passes is not a problem either. < 1293980614 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The see-also "computing variance" article is a bit more comprehensive. < 1293981231 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah < 1293981290 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, presumably there is some trap when going the other way too? (In order to unspill when required) < 1293981311 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, there's a "window underflow" trap too. < 1293981432 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And there are some complications because the OS needs to make sure one process can't manage to peek into the register windows of another process.) < 1293981442 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: you seem to know SPARCs pretty well < 1293981505 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm... You mean like, store/restore windows on context switch? < 1293981545 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if so, not sure how much it differs from normal storing/restoring of registers on other platforms (such as x86) < 1293981548 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It doesn't need to, because there are separate registers to mark some register windows belonging to "current process" and others to "other", and separate traps for those. < 1293981580 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Not really, I've just read a bit back when doing our compiler course, which had a sparc backend. < 1293981592 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, but what if you have three processes? < 1293981617 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then you'd have to manually keep track, but there's still some windows "owned" by the current one, and some by the others. < 1293981698 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, so the OS will spill/unspill as required then? < 1293981754 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, how much does this enforce a specific calling convention btw? I remember reading that (on x86/x86-64 at least) GHC uses a custom calling convention. < 1293981761 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Something like that. As far as I can determine, the idea is that if the current process only uses K register windows, you don't need to spill/fill the N-K unused ones. < 1293981812 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, right, but if it uses all N then this would mean more switches to kernel mode? < 1293981823 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which are usually slow on most architectures < 1293981903 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know about the tradeoffs, but there probably is one, yes. You could even have the OS maintain some sort of a per-process guesswork as to how many "clean" register windows it's going to prepare in advance on a context switch. < 1293981904 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there an algorithm that works better to calculate it if the sample values are already sorted low to high? < 1293981932 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1293981980 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, btw did I mention that mcmap bug? If you place a torch high up (about altitude 120 or above) you get a garbled mess on the map in a block around that area. Garbled both on normal map and on topo map. < 1293981985 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I don't think there is, but if you know of it, tell me) < 1293982012 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, better than what? < 1293982022 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes, I saw that, though I already managed to forget it. < 1293982028 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, and to calculate what? < 1293982070 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Standard deviation, I assume. < 1293982078 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well, if you happen to have time to test it... < 1293982086 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah < 1293982138 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See, if you had written this in the github issue list, I wouldn't have managed to forget it. I'll try to take a look at some point. It's probably related to the "max-alt trees cause flickering map-garbage" thing I saw on my local server tests. < 1293982196 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know since it is sorted, it can easily calculate minimum, maximum, median. < 1293982387 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which other statistics would be useful for a set of cards (such as for Magic: the Gathering and similar games)? < 1293982513 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Histograms of different categorizations? (I seem to recall MtG cards can be grouped into lands/creatures/instants/whatevers.) < 1293982566 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yes, the category by card type. < 1293982617 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can do like that, I already have grouping. < 1293982669 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Another question, about notation: if $Q_2$ is median, does $Q_0$ mean the minimum? < 1293982695 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I /think/ so, but Q_0 is not normally defined. < 1293982726 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :From Wikipedia: "The 25th percentile is also known as the first quartile (Q1); the 50th percentile as the median or second quartile (Q2); the 75th percentile as the third quartile (Q3)." < 1293982761 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't mention $Q_0$ or $Q_4$ (or $Q_5$, but that doesn't make sense). < 1293982783 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, so Q_0 and Q_4 could easily be read as the maxima and minima, but they're never actually defined. < 1293982805 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, "maximum and minimum", I suppose. < 1293982860 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could just add a note next to the equation that explains this notation. < 1293982961 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1293982963 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Based on a quick source-glance, I don't seem to be verifying the y values in world.c:block_change, and an overflow there could possibly ruin both the heightmap and the surface map. I'll take a closer look later. < 1293982980 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I want to see what sort of numbers the server sends before blindly fixing that.) < 1293983003 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_derivative_test < 1293983070 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :More tales of my adventures in the maths class: when I pointed out that the teacher's proclamation that f''(x)=0 at a point said nothing about its nature, I was told to shut up. < 1293983112 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The class being taught this were then informed that such a function would never come up, even after I pointed out that x^4 is clearly an example. < 1293983204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: you must be SO POPULAR < 1293983257 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I am actually banned from setting foot in the maths department. < 1293983283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You might mess up the dangerous maths experiments. < 1293983364 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathemagical monsters: http://deltafunktio.animeunioni.org/dft_eka_osa.gif (Disclaimer: you... uh, might have to be able to read Finnish to understand any of that.) < 1293983371 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Safety: the natural logarithm is an irritant and should be washed away if it comes into contact with the skin." < 1293983430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I think it's better without. < 1293983488 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"INTEGRAALI" < 1293983710 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, are the Finnish words for "oxygen" and "vulva" really only a letter apart? < 1293983735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both are required breathing for continued existence. < 1293983937 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I don't think so. But the words for "vulva" and "cone" (as in "pine cone", not as in "geometric shape") are. < 1293983959 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's even BETTER. < 1293983971 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop being a cont < 1293984001 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: As are the words for "oxygen" and a very colloquial term for the penis. < 1293984010 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/$/inuation!!/ < 1293984081 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :("häpy", "käpy" and "happi", "heppi", respecitvely.) < 1293984114 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, all similar! < 1293984126 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i take it finns are fond of happiness < 1293984133 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's more than a single-letter difference between häpy/happi, though. < 1293984144 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They *are* quite close, I guess. < 1293984158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Häpy heppi, heppi käppy. Käppy happi, happi häpy. < 1293984163 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm. < 1293984170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Häpy heppi, heppi käpy. Käpy happi, happi häpy. < 1293984240 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sharing consonants does not two words alike make. < 1293984241 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no?? < 1293984246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: does < 1293984253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shut up finnish l|_|z3r < 1293984275 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, consonants and similar phonetic properties if you don't know Finnish orthography! < 1293984292 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We have several words where the double-consonant (or a double-wovel) makes a semantic difference. Like "taka" → "takka" → "taakka"; "back" (mostly as a prefix, like "takapuoli" = "backside") → "fireplace" → "burden". < 1293984316 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you pronounce double 'k's? < 1293984330 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :takka on takataakka < 1293984339 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it's a stop consonant, only longer-duration one. < 1293984356 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, you can have duration for a consonant? < 1293984358 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[k:] < 1293984385 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Why couldn't you? < 1293984401 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stop_consonant#Length < 1293984405 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :english has a few double-consonants too < 1293984410 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bork < 1293984414 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, OK, a voiceless plosive consonant. < 1293984418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Can you prove that Finnish isn't just a gigantic prank on the rest of the world? < 1293984430 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you prove that English isn't? < 1293984438 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or C++! < 1293984452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Maybe it is, but if it is, it's a lot less funny than Finnish < 1293984454 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Finnish. < 1293984465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :More sad. < 1293984480 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, it's more what you get when you take about 3 languages and mush them together without thinking. < 1293984490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :English is like "A man walks into a bar. He is an alcoholic and it's destroying his family." < 1293984524 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`translatefromto en fi A man walks into a bar. He is an alcoholic and it's destroying his family. < 1293984533 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yL21sCWfnbE&t=1m8s "tuki" vs "tukki" < 1293984541 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mies kävelee baariin. Hän on alkoholisti ja se tuhoaa hänen perheensä. < 1293984570 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Disclaimer: I don't know if the guy knows what he's talking about, I just searched for an example) < 1293984692 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The mode in Wikipedia is different from TeX; it has some commands that TeX doesn't and TeX has many commands that Wikipedia doesn't. Most equations probably works, though. < 1293984692 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, is a long stop just one in which you wait for a bit before removing the obstruction from the airway? < 1293984710 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, this is because it is, in fact, LaTeX, < 1293984721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*EVILBLOATeX < 1293984722 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Something like that, yes. < 1293984769 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Does LaTeX not have any \def command? < 1293984799 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so LaTeX is A Bad Thing as *well*? < 1293984809 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IS THERE NOTHING THAT DOESN'T SUCK IN YOUR WORLD < 1293984811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No -- zzo38 just hates it. < 1293984815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I think LaTeX is great. < 1293984820 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh, right. < 1293984837 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, there *is* nothing that doesn't suck in zzo's world, unless he made it himself. < 1293984894 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Isn't that just what the Wikipedia link I pointed at says: "In a geminate or long stop, the occlusion lasts longer than in normal stops. In languages where stops are only distinguished by length (e.g. Arabic, Ilwana, Icelandic), the long stops may last up to three times as long as the short stops." < 1293984915 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, that is indeed where I got it from. < 1293984941 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I thought you were trying to describe what Deewiant's video was like. < 1293984946 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But phonetic language confuses me, not least because "stop" and "plosive" both seem to mean the same thing for no readily apparent reason. < 1293984963 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I find Plain TeX easier to understand and use; but there are some things I don't like in TeX and some things which I think are missing. In general it is good, though.) < 1293984971 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That guy was going on about glottal stops, so I suspect he may have no idea what he's talking about. < 1293984975 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :However, "ex-stop" and "explosive" are a very different thing. < 1293984985 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Swedish has double consonants too. With different effects on the pronunciation than for Finnish though. And sometimes with semantic differences. (For example sil = sieve, sill = herring) < 1293985032 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: What kind of effect, do you have to pronounce it longer? < 1293985041 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, louder? < 1293985051 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, it modifies the preceding vowel. < 1293985082 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: OK. < 1293985120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`wl sv en sil < 1293985121 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For Finnish it'd just be mostly a lenghtening. Compare "hila" (wicket/grate/grid) and "hilla" (cloudberry). < 1293985123 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sieve < 1293985147 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, as I said yes < 1293985158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You are probably not lying entirely! < 1293985169 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Our phonology is a bit on the simplistic side. < 1293985178 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unlike EVERYTHING ELSE. < 1293985208 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh, Wikipedia has examples, I don't need to invent any: < 1293985209 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : tuli = fire, tuuli = wind, tulli = customs < 1293985209 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : muta = mud, muuta = other (partitive sg.), mutta = but, muuttaa = to change or to move < 1293985212 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finnish_phonology#Length < 1293985242 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in Swedish the word "hade" (meaning "had") is pronounced as if it had been written like "hadde" btw. < 1293985255 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : english has a few double-consonants too ← not any with syntactic meaning AFAIK. < 1293985288 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : tuli = fire, tuuli = wind, tulli = customs <-- the last meaning I wound suspect is imported from Swedish, since sv:tull = en:customs. Either that or a common source for both. < 1293985302 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, not meaning. Word < 1293985337 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I mean double consonants that are pronounced longer < 1293985375 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's mostly when combining a word that ends with the same consonant the other word starts with < 1293985424 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then Swedish has the fun word pairs like tomten/tomten, anden/anden and so on. (Same spelling, different pronunciation for different meanings. VERY subtle differences.) < 1293985454 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(isn't it just a change in stress or whatever it is called?) < 1293985460 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1293985485 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in those examples, it's tonal differences rather than stress < 1293985489 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, ah < 1293985520 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, are there such examples with change of stress then? < 1293985559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293985585 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1293985674 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Of Finnish:] "Thus, omenanani "as my apple" contains light syllables only, and has primary stress on the first syllable and secondary on the third, as expected. In omenanamme "as our apple", on the other hand, the third syllable (na) is light and the fourth heavy (nam), thus secondary stress falls on the fourth syllable. --" Nice example words there. < 1293985715 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I think stress is what happens with our double consonants < 1293985732 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, ah, but no cases with same spelling then? < 1293985740 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, "omenanamme" = "as our apple", "omenan amme" = "apple's bathtub". < 1293985754 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: not that I can think of, but there probably are < 1293985941 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hah < 1293985948 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here's (in Finnish) two words that are spelled identically, but the stress differs: "-- for example the compound puunaama, meaning "wooden face" (from puu "tree" and naama "face"), is pronounced [ˈpuː-ˌnɑː-mɑ] but puunaama, meaning "which was cleaned" (...preceded by an agent in genitive, "by someone"), is pronounced [ˈpuː-nɑː-mɑ]." < 1293985991 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, "[...](...preceded by an agent in genitive, "by someone")[...]" <-- a cleaning agent? < 1293985998 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1293986032 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unfortunately the stress-indicating bold font parts got lost. < 1293986038 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1293986046 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well the channels filter bold I think < 1293986052 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :channel* < 1293986056 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ls < 1293986059 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err wrong window < 1293986071 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That should've been [*ˈpuː-ˌnɑː*-mɑ] vs. [*ˈpuː*-nɑː-mɑ]. < 1293986282 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, not as bad as the English words which are spelt identically but pronounced differently. < 1293986357 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, such as? < 1293986368 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't think of any example atl < 1293986369 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :atm* < 1293986370 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Read and read. < 1293986377 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tear and tear. < 1293986391 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1293986406 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which are both because "ea" can be pronounced 'eh' or 'ee'. < 1293986480 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, Does any other language have the sje-sound of Swedish? I seem to remember reading it was unique < 1293986509 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, Finland-Swedish (or whatever the English name of it is) has it obviously < 1293986519 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm... I wonder if fan #3 in this computer just doesn't have speed measurements available or why does lm-sensors say "0 RPM ALARM" about it... < 1293986567 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari, open case to check. I know that in my computer it is due to not having a case fan. (only CPU fan, PSU fan and GPU fan, and sensors only report about the CPU fan) < 1293986573 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: does it though? some dialects has it as sh, seem to recall finland-swedish doing that too < 1293986591 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, they have a different variant of it, that's true. < 1293986695 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, hm arguably the sje-sound in kjol and stjärna are slightly different. At least in whatever dialectal mix I speak. < 1293986713 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kjol doesn't have a sje-sound < 1293986723 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, what do you call that sound then? < 1293986810 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Today I learned AWK programming. < 1293986822 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1293986829 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sje-sound#Colognian < 1293986895 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: "Whether or not there is a relation between the Swedish /ɧ/, and the Kölsch /ɧ/, is not known. While none seems to have been established, comments (e.g. on page 18 in [3]) suggest that, the choice of ‹ɧ› might well have been based upon a misunderstanding." < 1293986901 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, does that text say they are different or the same. It seems to discuss that but I'm not good at linguistics. < 1293986913 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(basically I got lost in the jargon) < 1293986917 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: This is what you get when you let languages go all natural. < 1293986934 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I know, I didn't say that it was in another language, I just linked it < 1293986941 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And yes, that's what you get < 1293987005 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I would call it http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voiceless_postalveolar_fricative but wikipedia claims swedish kjol has a different sound < 1293987014 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1293987042 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :namely, this one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voiceless_alveolo-palatal_fricative < 1293987084 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, also stjärna vs. sju. A quick experiment seems to indicate the position in the mouth of the sje-sound in those two words is somewhat different. < 1293987087 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As a speech recognition guy, I think I'll petition the World Government (in our inevitable dystopic future) to instigate a "designed to be phonologically as simple as possible to distinguish" language instead. Maybe with just two (or very few) as-spectrally-different-as-possible sounds, and then all words are simple concatenations of those with none of this context-sensitive crap. < 1293987147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I propose mindlinks. < 1293987148 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yeah, it merges with the vowel a bit, dunno if it's enough of a difference to call it different sounds < 1293987155 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, hm < 1293987494 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've heard in a few places that this is the ugliest Finnish sentence(-pair) evar: "Älä rääkkää sitä kääkkää! En rääkkääkään!". (Translated, vaguely like: Don't torture that old guy! I'm not!) < 1293987506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293987524 0 :LORD_NIETZSCHE!border_666@adsl-ull-195-38.47-151.net24.it JOIN :#esoteric < 1293987553 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1293987594 0 :cheater99!~cheater@g231049226.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1293987606 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hah < 1293987616 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you seem to have connection problems today? < 1293987617 0 :LORD_NIETZSCHE!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1293987628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: um i think i've gone offline exactly twice? < 1293987630 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who is LORD_NIETZSCH < 1293987631 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who is LORD_NIETZSCHE < 1293987635 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no clue < 1293987638 0 :LORD_NIETZSCHE!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's me < 1293987644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can his nick stop shouting < 1293987681 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MOSFET < 1293987718 0 :LORD_NIETZSCHE!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1293988025 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1293988046 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who was Lord Nietzche? < 1293988050 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1293988050 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1293988176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://userweb.kernel.org/~warthog9/april1/2010/ please tell me kernel.org actually looked like this on apr 1 < 1293988296 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1293988554 0 :cheater99!~cheater@g231049226.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1293989048 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the upside-down K is the height of stupidity. < 1293989064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is rather silly. < 1293989165 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.complexitygraphics.com/#708027/-About-Contact <3 < 1293989269 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[Graduated from Moscow State University in Social Psychology, and then studied in High Academic School of Graphic Design. ]] < 1293989271 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pfff. < 1293989281 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :INFERIOR SUBJECTS. < 1293989283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1293989289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :her knees are too angular anyway! < 1293989303 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wha? < 1293989306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Meme. < 1293989332 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wha? < 1293989335 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wha? < 1293989354 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, I never realised that the Oolite theme gets way better if you wait a bit. < 1293989380 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Define theme. < 1293989385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, the tune. < 1293989386 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1293989386 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. < 1293989490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: guy in #anagol just said php is better than haskell < 1293989525 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This I must see. < 1293989536 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: nothing else was said < 1293989551 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well at least tell them that they're an idiot! < 1293989582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://sprunge.us/YTNc < 1293989604 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :17:31 Endres: um, but I think for me it is so < 1293989604 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :17:32 Endres: maybe not better, but... easier maybe? < 1293989615 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not even gonna bother arguing ... 'specially since obvs not a native < 1293989627 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :easier? lol < 1293989636 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, wasn't *your* first language PHP? < 1293989661 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: i think it was technically basic that i never tried to understand and just copied from a book < 1293989666 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PHP should be evaporated together with every dedicated PHP programmer < 1293989671 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but um, pretty much php, yeah < 1293989673 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::/ < 1293989677 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to be fair i was 8 ok? < 1293989688 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh, so it was child abuse by someone. < 1293989697 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, i chose to learn it myself < 1293989701 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was 10 when i tried Pascal, don't worry elliott < 1293989707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after learning that $favourite_website was written in PHP < 1293989721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: i used odbc to communicate with an Access database in PHP < 1293989723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not kidding < 1293989738 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :man < 1293989742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need some alcohol to forget that now < 1293989747 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wait, so you were using Windows as well? < 1293989759 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: this was before ubuntu even existed < 1293989760 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, Pascal was my first language soon! < 1293989764 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*too < 1293989766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: also we had a winmodem < 1293989769 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so linux is like ... no < 1293989783 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Followed soon by Python, then about a week later by CL. < 1293989814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You are the luckiest bastard. Seriously. < 1293989822 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, naaa. < 1293989827 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soon ... "F < 1293989829 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::F < 1293989833 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's CL? < 1293989835 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: OK, Pascal is kind of shit, but it's not a /hideous/ language. < 1293989843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Python is lame but really, it's not _that_ bad. < 1293989849 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: And then Common Lisp which is pretty damn good. < 1293989851 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: common lisp < 1293989859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I stayed with PHP for about _two years_. < 1293989871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you have *any* idea how warped my grey matter became? < 1293989875 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it was when you were asked to conceive and implement a sort algorithm by yourself. < 1293989896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Hm? < 1293989901 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With a teacher who as far as I know was a Latin teacher who later became the computing teacher. < 1293989903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had no idea why you would ever abstract anything. No idea how to modularise code. < 1293989912 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No idea that mixing code and, you know, output was in any way sub-optimal. < 1293989924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I rarely used functions. < 1293989930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was _awful_. < 1293989933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Two years. < 1293989934 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that is indicative of bad PHP coding - not necc. the language itself < 1293989937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or so. < 1293989946 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I will say that most PHP examples are HORRIBLE < 1293989950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Perhaps. But PHP certainly lends itself to bad coding style. < 1293989951 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: don't worry < 1293989954 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, yes, but when the language is definitely not conducive to that style... < 1293989954 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, agreed < 1293989958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: And even when it's coded perfectly, it's still a horrible language. < 1293989976 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it is not horrible for its purpose < 1293989980 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. It is. < 1293989998 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhmit is horrrible for every purpose < 1293989999 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trust me < 1293990005 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: what purpose < 1293990011 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i code php for *cough* money < 1293990016 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As someone who stayed in the awful confines of web development for too many years, let me say that yes, it is. Absolutely horrible. < 1293990018 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FWIW, I actually got my self-conceived sort algorithm off the ground when I used CL. < 1293990029 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott is right < 1293990030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hell, if you want to, I don't know, put the current date and time on a page. Even Perl is better. < 1293990051 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I gave up on doing it in Pascal when noöne could work out how the hell you got a function to return an array. < 1293990060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I don't think you can even do that < 1293990070 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, nor did the teacher. < 1293990089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: http://catseye.tc/about/php.html < 1293990106 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The fourth paragraph of that is perhaps my favourite thing ever. < 1293990114 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He basically told me to either use globals or alter the array passed to it. < 1293990125 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Already Phantom_Hoover knew the putrid stench of mutability! < 1293990185 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, at that point I thought "forget that", then did it in Python and then CL. Of course, I mutated the array passed for those programs, too, but I was what, 13? < 1293990211 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The algorithm was O(n^2), as well! < 1293990216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like how you're apologising for not being a rabid functional weenie by 13. < 1293990219 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i feel that i need to design a language that is extendable and elastic like scheme, concise like ruby or something and has a compiler that generates fast machine code < 1293990222 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then < 1293990227 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i will code only in this language < 1293990235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: And is purely functional? < 1293990237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Naw, thought not. < 1293990248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :useless then < 1293990249 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: not Haskell < 1293990257 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: There are purely-functional languages that are not Haskell. < 1293990262 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haskell isn't too extensible, either. < 1293990266 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't like them < 1293990280 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like mixed paradigm languages, like ruby < 1293990283 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, not in the same sense that Scheme is. < 1293990297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Irrelevant; answer the question: mutable data? < 1293990334 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :immutable = useless < 1293990339 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Ha ha ha. < 1293990342 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your language sucks. < 1293990353 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I LIKE to mess with arrays in-place < 1293990368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It amazes me how people still think, in 2010, that they should create a language that practically actively works against a programmer. < 1293990383 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently the world has not yet learned that you don't put in "features" merely because they're easy to implement at the lower level. < 1293990390 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Otherwise you throw away abstraction. < 1293990404 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :look < 1293990437 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know haskell is awesome and it's compiler is a piece of art < 1293990447 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :art LOL < 1293990456 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1293990458 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would have claled it something else < 1293990459 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clearly you have never seen ghc code < 1293990464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nobody gives a shit what the compiler looks like < 1293990475 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION shivers at GHC < 1293990475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway i don't even like haskell all that much, it has many flaws, but that's irrelevant < 1293990483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the fact is that mutability is a serious, crippling design flaw < 1293990487 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what flaws? < 1293990493 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't use haskell :/ < 1293990501 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And "it's not Epigram" does not count. < 1293990507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It's not Epigram. < 1293990535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Typeclasses are restricted in probably-unavoidable ways but I don't like them anyway; no module system (a la ML, with functors (not that kind of functor); this is VERY important for abstraction and reuse) < 1293990540 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i like to have more expressive C with poorman's, basic oo, closures and ability to mess with the language itself < 1293990541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some syntax quibbles < 1293990545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: and the fact that I don't like the IO monad < 1293990551 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, records with named fields are handled badly < 1293990552 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc ... < 1293990559 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what's wrong with the IO monad? < 1293990572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: it's imperative. < 1293990575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and impure. < 1293990580 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehh < 1293990591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: If you disagree, see http://conal.net/blog/posts/the-c-language-is-purely-functional/ < 1293990611 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's funny that ppl try to make languages that work AGAINST common sense and our machines architecture < 1293990633 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Programs are for humans first; machines second. P.S. That machines are imperative is a mistake of history. < 1293990638 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See http://www.cs.york.ac.uk/fp/reduceron/. < 1293990648 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know i know < 1293990655 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: And "common sense" is a term people use when they wish to portray an opinion as immediately obvious, without giving any logical reasoning to this. < 1293990659 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if we had purely functional machines it would be sooo cooool < 1293990663 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We do. < 1293990672 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah... like < 1293990688 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MIPS, x86, eeee, SPARC.... eee < 1293990695 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :none of them < 1293990701 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: http://www.cs.york.ac.uk/fp/reduceron/ < 1293990711 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but nobody uses it! < 1293990715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: if we had OS X and Linux it would be soo cooool < 1293990718 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so what way of doing IO would you prefer? < 1293990721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: but we don't, because 90% of people use Windows! < 1293990723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :drat! < 1293990726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :too bad OS X and Linux don't exist < 1293990729 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go home everyone < 1293990731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: FRP < 1293990749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: (but that question isn't really relevant; you do not have to suggest something better to hold the opinion that something is bad) < 1293990772 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :17:50 < elliott> nooga: Programs are for humans first; machines second. P.S. < 1293990780 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hmmmm < 1293990789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: almost direct sicp quote :) or was it R5RS... whatever < 1293990793 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's true wherever it came from < 1293990794 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but the fact that there seems to be no viable alternative makes complaining rather pointless. < 1293990798 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: FRP < 1293990809 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know. < 1293990824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: and that's sort of like dismissing the inventors of ${first purely functional language} because "Well, you haven't offered any replacements for ALGOL constructs like 'while'!" < 1293990855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It _is_ relevant to complain that an existing solution is bad; innovation has to handle the rest. < 1293990862 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Ideas for a better "haskell"CCC? < 1293990871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: are those Cs typo? < 1293990877 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1293990954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Some syntax tweaks. Make named fields in records be handled much better (make them proper accessor objects, there are a bunch of things on hackage that do good-looking things for this); ditch IO monad replace with FRP integrate into my perfect OS :-P (you can't really do any of this perfectly in an imperative OS); get rid of typeclasses, replace them, and the "module" system, with a proper ML-style module system with modu < 1293990954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :le functors and the like -- also maybe some ideas from Ur in this area -- ... < 1293990957 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: make it epigram ... < 1293990964 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ... and then make it epigram some more < 1293991099 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah < 1293991100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: also: redo the whole stdlib < 1293991111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: proper numeric typeclasses (except, module signatures now, not typeclasses!) < 1293991114 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm a fan of not having an stdlib < 1293991123 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1293991127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: maybe if you don't want a useful language :) < 1293991131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: fine in Coq, not for Haskell ... < 1293991158 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The first thing I do in Coq is turn off the massive stdlib and bootstrap my own tools :P < 1293991169 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same with haskell < 1293991172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that's just because coq's stdlib is really shitty < 1293991177 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :me and stdlibs... we don't get along < 1293991180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: and also because you presumably don't write actually useful Haskell programs ;) no offence < 1293991182 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes that's the point < 1293991182 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO WRITE ANYTHING WITHOUT IO THAT CAN BE SYNCED WITH OTHER SYSTEMS < 1293991187 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they tend to be shitty < 1293991195 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: i don't give a shit about your needs/wants :) < 1293991204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in @ it all works out perfectly of course. < 1293991214 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you imagine purely functional OS < 1293991225 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@ < 1293991227 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I mean you should still be able to do "import Numbers" or whatever it is you want < 1293991230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also see Urbit < 1293991243 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: but all this e.g. "Num" crap shouldn't be imported to all programs automatically < 1293991245 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I think it's useful to have a decent base built in... no point starting with a lot of useless import declarations < 1293991250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Num is crap, but if it were better designed ... < 1293991252 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what @ < 1293991254 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: @ < 1293991262 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::@ < 1293991267 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't think language designers are capable of making a good stdlib < 1293991288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: as a language designer I think they are :) but i guess you could call me a language designer and a library designer < 1293991295 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also the evolution of the language is at a different pace than that of the stdlib < 1293991303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not in @ :) < 1293991318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@ updates are almost as likely to update the language as the core stdlib, I'd say < 1293991332 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@? < 1293991337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@. < 1293991345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pronounced "@". < 1293991357 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@ is a macro expanding to whatever the final name of @ has. < 1293991358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*is. < 1293991394 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh great < 1293991406 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it have a homepage? < 1293991417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it has no need of one. < 1293991421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the channel logs are an okay start. < 1293991445 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nonexistant, useless < 1293991463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: I don't care about your needs/wants. < 1293991488 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but tonnes of the discussion was in private queries! < 1293991518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, @ has the deficiency of being hard to grep < 1293991541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10.09.19:07:41:54 alise: start writing aliseOS plz < 1293991545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I thought it was *useless*. < 1293991735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: i hire you to work on it < 1293991749 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no dice! < 1293991755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: why < 1293991794 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, because dice killed my family. < 1293991801 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: don't use dice then < 1293991813 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I CAN'T < 1293991815 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION sobs < 1293991940 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293992033 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what about Idirs http://www.cs.st-andrews.ac.uk/~eb/ < 1293992046 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :closer to epigram than haskell < 1293992062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i know of idris yeah it seems kinda cool but i'm not convinced that full dependent types are a good thing in practice < 1293992084 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh? TRAITOR! < 1293992087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: something like Ur/Web where you could write the /Web part yourself (i.e. code in all those static checks) -- that might be good -- it seems to have like 75% of what you'd want of dependent types in practice < 1293992094 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but is more, you know, decidable :) < 1293992098 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: nonono i love dependent types < 1293992101 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cough < 1293992104 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: for theorem proving and formal verification and shit < 1293992117 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i just think a 75% + stuff solution might be best for everything else < 1293992133 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: even to use something as simple as quotient types, I think you need full blown theorem proving < 1293992146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: are quotient types that useful outside of theorem proving? < 1293992148 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :serious question < 1293992238 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :either j-invariant is having a worldview breakdown or has shunned me < 1293992415 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually you killed the whole channel *sputter, argh* < 1293992435 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION swatpans oerjan's courpse. < 1293992438 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*corpse < 1293992448 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He was too good for this sinful earth. < 1293992460 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BRAINS. < 1293992473 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MY GOD < 1293992480 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MY SWATPAN IS MAGICAL < 1293992491 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...if you say so. < 1293992837 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how does this work?: < 1293992845 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ? < 1293992864 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :module Z (inject, (+), (*)) where type Z = (N,N) ; inject :: N -> Z ... < 1293992881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what's that from < 1293992882 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, is that... Agda? < 1293992891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah doesn't look like it < 1293992899 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes it does. < 1293992903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it looks like haskell < 1293992906 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh it was meant to be haskell but now that I write it i'm not sure if it means what I wanted it to < 1293992907 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hate 2011 < 1293992911 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although with less Unicode and underscores. < 1293992918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: are you trying to demonstrate ML modules or? < 1293992919 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://wronki.pl has AD 2011 bug :F < 1293992921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or are you just asking a really vague question < 1293992923 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no nevermind < 1293992923 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, yeah, it's so BORING. < 1293992928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: nono i want to understand < 1293992933 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forget that code Ill start again < 1293992937 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i did it ;f < 1293992938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1293992947 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you can define integers as a quotient on pairs of natural numbers (you know that?) < 1293992956 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just as a simple example < 1293992961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ifeq ($(shell expr "$(uname_R)" : '[15678]\.'),2) < 1293992961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : OLD_ICONV = UnfortunatelyYes < 1293992961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : endif < 1293992964 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :--git Makefile < 1293992965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yep < 1293992982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well the Works But Kind Of Horrible solution here is obvious < 1293992982 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so in haskell you might well use this approach, not exporting the definition of Z but exporting functions to work with it < 1293992985 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: just define your own (==) < 1293992985 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1293992999 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then MyModule imports that, uses the functions with Z to its hearts content and all is well < 1293993003 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1293993047 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by all is well, I mean that every function MyModule can define respects the equivalence relation < 1293993077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1293993083 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't prove this in Coq < 1293993089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1293993116 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this makes no sense < 1293993149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what doesn't < 1293993158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well Coq's knowledge of modules is limited i think < 1293993173 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait a second, it might be possible to prove this in Coq < 1293993202 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you implement a non-quotient version of Z and make a map between that and the quotient version < 1293993274 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to try this out < 1293993295 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooo nooo nooo < 1293993300 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :boring boring boring < 1293993303 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't work < 1293993394 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: All the letters on one side OK < 1293993517 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: have you ever looked at Clean? < 1293993847 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what does this mean? 18:56:48 [DIED] world.c: 108: broken decompressed chunk length: 49 != 50 < 1293993870 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chunk was meant to be X long, it was Y. i would presume. < 1293993877 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1293993887 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Vorpal, fizzie, Deewiant, has anything actually been done on the MC server? < 1293993890 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no < 1293993894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: since when < 1293993900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ok < 1293993903 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, lately? < 1293993907 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The last week or so? < 1293993997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: can i rewrite mcmap in ML or something < 1293994216 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, won't that have a lot of overhead if your system is already having some problem with running both minecraft and mcmap at once? < 1293994228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: not if I compiled it with MLton :) < 1293994237 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh? < 1293994255 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what is MLton? < 1293994258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jfgi < 1293994290 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm is it really that good? < 1293994306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good enough < 1293994326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not like mcmap is hugely resource-intensive or hugely speed-needing < 1293994369 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, true, I was thinking of memory overhead < 1293994384 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, which is the problem for me with minecraft alone < 1293994403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, these sorts of compilers usually try and unbox everything. < 1293994416 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try to yes < 1293994436 0 :Zuu!zuu@0x55529f1b.adsl.cybercity.dk JOIN :#esoteric < 1293994440 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1293994441 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1293994453 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how well does it manage though < 1293994487 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not like unboxing is hard. < 1293994500 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION unboxes elliott < 1293994641 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FWIW, I think we should try proper survival multiplayer. < 1293994671 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott killing Vorpal every 10 seconds by "accident" would be rather amusing. < 1293994694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: When the SMP server was up, I killed ineiros and got 64 mob spawners < 1293994697 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alas, they spawned only pigs. < 1293994716 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, there *was* an SMP server up? < 1293994721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes, for something like a day. < 1293994732 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Vorpal is too pussy to go on though. He'd just sit on IRC crying about his house. < 1293994740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Side note - if we do - it must be on the same map.) < 1293994951 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It means the zlib truncation bug I tweeted (but Notch ignored) has actually resulted in an incomplete chunk update. < 1293994979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Notch, fix actual bugs? < 1293994984 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hahahahahahahahaahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahaha < 1293994997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Too busy getting internet fellatio from Twitter. < 1293995026 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may fix it to ignore those too, as long as the truncation affects only the light values, which I ignore. < 1293995033 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: It means the zlib truncation bug I tweeted (but Notch ignored) has actually resulted in an incomplete chunk update. ← what are you responding to? < 1293995045 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: fizzie, what does this mean? 18:56:48 [DIED] world.c: 108: broken decompressed chunk length: 49 != 50 < 1293995046 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, to me < 1293995054 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I'm not a what < 1293995055 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, WELL DUH < 1293995158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes you are. < 1293995182 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Notch can't code < 1293995213 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, we know that better than you. < 1293995238 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: have you finished epigram yet < 1293995260 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For instance, there's a bug which will crash any server whatsoever and can be done with effectively no privileges. < 1293995281 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I'm not saying what it is, and noöne else who knows should either. < 1293995314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover killed a server with 1,000 people on it permanently once with that bug. True story!* < 1293995315 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*False story < 1293995343 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true for very false values of 'true' < 1293995765 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :solution < 1293995767 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :: < 1293995775 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :reimplement minecraft < 1293995806 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: NETCRAFT < 1293995808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: NETCRAFT < 1293995810 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :confirms it < 1293995951 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1293995962 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where < 1293996021 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't work on epigram < 1293996027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well get crackin'! < 1293996030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1293996032 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1293996035 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: parametrized modules < 1293996056 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: if I have an isomorphism between M and M', then why don't I have an isomorphism between F(M) and F(M')? < 1293996060 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Coq is stupid. < 1293996072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Because Coq is stupid. < 1293996075 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does epigram have this? < 1293996085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Epigram has everything! Including kittens! Nah, I don't actaully know. < 1293996086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*actually < 1293996101 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: if I could get an isomorphism between F(M) and F(M') I could have something like useful quotients < 1293996128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Doesn't every Coq story starting with "So I had this idea to implement quotient sets..." end with "...and it didn't work"? < 1293996139 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I should apply that mu- thing to a language with modules < 1293996146 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1293996158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mu- thing? < 1293996174 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's smoe magic way to turn a programming language into a dependently typed one < 1293996205 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they did it to a sort of haskell liek language and got a simple version of agda out < 1293996222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what happens when you apply it to C < 1293996226 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if we throw modules in maybe we'll get quotients out < 1293996228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it kill you and your family? < 1293996230 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well it has to be a lambda calculus < 1293996233 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: LAME < 1293996238 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the C calculus :D < 1293996255 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who does NETCRAFT < 1293996272 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro (coppro is the entire u/waterloo) < 1293996284 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it open? < 1293996294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's NETTTTTTULATORY < 1293996296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OF HTHE THWEOITH IOEDFJHDFGMLKDFGNHDKL;FGH < 1293996299 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :check their website for opening hours < 1293996303 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: excerice, prove the theorem http://pastebin.com/6P2ydkcU < 1293996303 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1293996337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ... < 1293996349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: for your homework, prove goldbach's conjecture < 1293996356 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well oerjan seemed afk < 1293996359 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well,* < 1293996385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: hmm < 1293996399 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um < 1293996401 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: (+,N):Z :: (*,Z):Q :: (^,Q):?? < 1293996422 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :netcraft is an internet services company based in england < 1293996437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga doesn't know who netcraft are lol < 1293996443 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga is young netcraft confirms it < 1293996445 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1293996460 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ isn't QxQ -> Q though < 1293996461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what's ?? :) < 1293996465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: oh indeed < 1293996466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: darn < 1293996474 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: (+,N):Z :: (*,Z):Q :: (^,Z):?? < 1293996502 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's easy to show that you can define an inverse-making-quotient operation given an operator and a set obeying a few rules and that f(+,N)=Z and f(*,Z)=Q... this much is obvious < 1293996512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: just wonder what happens when you put in (^,Z) < 1293996512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1293996513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1293996518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b) represents a-b or a/b < 1293996518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1293996528 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we were talking about minecraft reimplementation, not a company with rainbow logo < 1293996530 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b) represents a((^)^-1)b < 1293996548 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so is it just log_a(b)? < 1293996599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1293996603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think so < 1293996611 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(1/x,e) = x < 1293996613 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er no < 1293996619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you work out what comes out :P < 1293996667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well obviously (x,x^n) = n < 1293996671 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1293996684 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :waiit < 1293996698 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's actually (x^n,x) = n < 1293996700 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously < 1293996705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: halp < 1293996712 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :confusion < 1293996717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right okay < 1293996720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(x^n, x) = n < 1293996727 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously it's log_b(a) < 1293996731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for (a,b)... < 1293996750 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1293996754 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it closed < 1293996765 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHO KNOWS < 1293996777 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i think it's just Q with log to be honest... but then Q is just Z with divide < 1293996884 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1293996892 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1293996903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: does the mu thing have to be a lambda calculus strictly? < 1293996907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or can any similar-ish structure do < 1293996913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd love to see a dependent-typed term rewriting language < 1293997024 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Realizability and Parametricity in Pure Type Systems < 1293997045 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that'd require actual thought!!!! < 1293997138 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We describe a systematic method to build a logic from any < 1293997138 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :programming language described as a Pure Type System (PTS). The < 1293997138 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :formulas of this logic express properties about programs. We define a < 1293997138 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :parametricity theory about programs and a realizability theory for the < 1293997138 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :logic. The logic is expressive enough to internalize both theories. Thanks < 1293997140 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to the PTS setting, we abstract most idiosyncrasies specific to particular < 1293997143 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :type theories. This confers generality to the results, and reveals parallels < 1293997145 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :between parametricity and realizability. < 1293997148 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :awesome < 1293997178 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it cites View from the Left < 1293997185 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :therefore its' MEGAawesome < 1293997209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i wish i was cool enough to have my own dependent language :p < 1293997227 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can! < 1293997232 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: o rly < 1293997240 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just pick some esoteric PTS nobody cares about and apply this paper to it < 1293997261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: bah -- i still want a language based on dual-intuitionistic logic < 1293997265 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: paraconsistent type system, how cool is that? < 1293997273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :function arrow replaced with "butnot" < 1293997283 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1293997319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: hmm maybe i will try hacking up a dependent language < 1293997321 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sounds like fun < 1293997342 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: one with delimited continuations? < 1293997351 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can prove stuff that Coq and Agda can't prove if you do that < 1293997351 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you can implement them on top of a language can't you? < 1293997355 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1293997367 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i don't wanna start doing tactics and shit so maybe proving isn't what i should focus on for now :) < 1293997369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that sounds fun < 1293997372 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's this paper about it I don't really get it but an implementation would be interesting < 1293997372 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION waits for ghc to finish compiling < 1293997381 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just mean typing out lambda terms to prove things < 1293997387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1293997430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: maybe i can write a lazy specialiser for it and i will have succeeded in creating the Best Language :) < 1293997520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I wish Scheme was a better language because Ponzi Scheme is an awesome name < 1293997530 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1293997542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean i have to write it < 1293997545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even though i don't really want to < 1293997563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok so scheme is actually pretty nice < 1293997573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Brainfuck/w/index.php%3Ftitle%3DTalk:Brainfuck/index.php#Implementation i'm proud of this code, for all the awful shit it does it's pretty < 1293997618 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-154-243.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1293997631 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Grawr.\ < 1293997653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I found out how to use stow with packages that refuse to even give you the time of day if you change the prefix. < 1293997686 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Oh? < 1293997739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ./configure --prefix=/usr/local && make && make install DESTDIR=root && mkdir /stow/foo && cp root/usr/local/* /stow/foo < 1293997750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just about everything supports DESTDIR so this works great. < 1293997757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Even Python's setup.py does.) < 1293997834 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Do I win a prize? < 1293998035 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you know that de-bruijn-for-bound-stuff-names-for-unbound-stuff? < 1293998050 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1293998054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that the epigram people do < 1293998063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not a number, I am a free variable < 1293998065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something < 1293998074 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about it < 1293998076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: am i weird if i think we should just get rid of all non-local variables and just rewrite everything as a single lambda application < 1293998078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. < 1293998081 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x=y;foo=bar < 1293998083 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should just be < 1293998087 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes LOL < 1293998092 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(\x->(\foo->...)bar)y < 1293998097 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: not as in, the actual code we write! < 1293998101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i think compilers should do it like that < 1293998104 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i'm weird right < 1293998118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean an assignment like that is basically a let around the whole program < 1293998120 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if everything is a lambda, then you can't step inside an abstraction cayou? < 1293998125 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and let x=y in z is just (\x->z)y < 1293998128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: why not < 1293998138 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's just another lambda in side? < 1293998147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that isn't really what i mean < 1293998151 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i don't mean every object should be a lambda < 1293998169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I just mean that there should be no assignment or anything, it should just be lambda application to a constant :p < 1293998179 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and have everything be de bruijn < 1293998186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's simpler to process :D < 1293998218 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you can get away with it, do it! < 1293998233 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I'd like to thank this /r/programming thread http://bit.ly/eNygOX for helping me adjust to senescence." --pigworker < 1293998240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guess what thread it is < 1293998244 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can guess :P < 1293998298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: one issue with doing bindings in this way is that the order you choose is totally arbitrary ... and everything that passes some parameters to a module, if you add something to that module, all those break because the order changes < 1293998301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT THAT'S BORING PRACTICAL PROBLEMS < 1293998322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously we just redo every single piece of code every time a single byte changes < 1293998629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: quick, what should i put in my silly language < 1293998650 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quotients < 1293998665 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that sounds really painful to do :> < 1293998716 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: (is it?) < 1293998722 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it shouldn't be difficult < 1293998734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: can i add them after everything else or should i really do them first < 1293998745 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just needs to be done early < 1293998748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1293998939 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i am getting slightly disillusioned with all the provers :-. < 1293998941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*:-/ < 1293998956 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so am I but I try to hide it < 1293998962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1293998979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: let's go back to ridiculously dynamically typed, late-bound languages and write unit tests < 1293998988 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unit tests? HAH < 1293998993 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't /test/ < 1293998998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Unit tests prove goldbach!!!!!! < 1293999002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i ran 10^30 of them < 1293999004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all passed < 1293999017 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: (if I keep this up I'll turn into Zeilberger) < 1293999020 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's such a weird thought < 1293999021 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is still completely blown away by the recent PS3 hack... < 1293999029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or Chaitin... "Add an axiom!" < 1293999049 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what PS3 hack? < 1293999075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://i.imgur.com/rwmHO.png The PAXEL < 1293999078 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oen of my concerns is how large scale programming can work < 1293999095 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: The hack by fail0verflow, which contains all of Team Twiizers, detailed at 27C3 recently. < 1293999099 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: category theory may be the solution to it < 1293999100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: this is why i was talking about a 75% solution for all the not-just-pure-proving work < 1293999102 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Well, rather, the *set* of hacks. < 1293999116 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: like, I don't look at Idris or Ur and think "will this scale to bigger things..." < 1293999118 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: The most hilarious one is that they have the signing key now. < 1293999138 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow < 1293999172 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You see, Sony signs things using ECDSA, which requires, as part of the algorithm, a cryptographically secure random number. < 1293999179 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sony, however, uses a *constant* instead. < 1293999190 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1293999194 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which allows you to get the private key using simple algebra. < 1293999229 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Sony seem to have just randomly sprinkled crypto on the PS3 as magical pixie dust. Wackier crypto usage MUST be more secure, right? Right?" < 1293999232 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, the PS3 is as hacked as it is possible to be. < 1293999314 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is incredible < 1293999319 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They also discovered a handful of buffer overflows in un-reflashable code that would allow one to make a mod chip that Sony couldn't do anything about, but that kinda pales in comparison to it being *literally impossible* for Sony to do anything about everyone being able to sign anything. < 1293999322 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Phantom_Hoover: http://i.imgur.com/rwmHO.png The PAXEL ← WANT < 1293999336 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I guess the PS3 devs grew up writing websites that don't santies SQL inputs < 1293999375 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: there's actually a mod for it lol < 1293999378 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except it looks slightly less silly < 1293999388 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, WE MUST INSTALL IT < 1293999389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: obviously we can solve that with DEPENDENT TYPES < 1293999392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: client only < 1293999410 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, NOOOO < 1293999421 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is, in fact, more hacked than the Wii now. < 1293999595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/14765180/AnimalCrafting/screenshots/animalcrafting16.png WORST TEXTURE PACK < 1293999634 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what is that stuff meant to be? < 1293999642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Gravel. Seriously. < 1293999654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/1Z1Bw.jpg omg that reminds me i need to install ambient occlusion. and painterly. < 1293999688 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That animalcrafting16.png reminds me of one of the early 3D Sonics, for some reason. < 1293999704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's animal crossing methinks < 1293999721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: lol the reddit thread is filled with OMG WHAT TEXTURE PACK < 1293999724 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's painterly you idiots < 1293999963 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wut < 1293999978 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294000000 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what;s with this reimplementation < 1294000029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: what reimplementation < 1294000102 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: On CMOS in Minecraft: "This is the best idea in the history of minecraft. Or at least slightly behind the idea of the character being able to pee, I think that is important also." < 1294000114 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CMOS? < 1294000123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=45590 < 1294000213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Phantom_Hoover: http://getsatisfaction.com/mojang/topics/will_here_be_dragons_or_other_flying_mobsters_in_the_air_in_the_berworld#reply_4040443 < 1294000217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh god I cannot stop laughing < 1294000225 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: reimplementation of minecraft < 1294000253 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that is the best dragon ever. < 1294000262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: He is so happy. Unintentionally. < 1294000263 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's funny how everyone left digg for reddit, now people rae leaving reddit < 1294000268 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: For what :p < 1294000277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Also nothing like a dragon at all which is just amazing. < 1294000279 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there doesn't seem to be anything < 1294000285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ahahahaha oh god i just saw his eyes < 1294000287 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://blog.tmorris.net/bye-reddit/ < 1294000289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I thought the eyes were the nostrils < 1294000291 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at the front < 1294000307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that was the guy who said he was going to kill himself in all the irc channels he was in a few years ago. < 1294000319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that's what I know him for :-P < 1294000324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION reads post < 1294000355 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1294000365 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294000381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i wonder why because of quad's post ... it's supremely idiotic but isn't it obvious that nobody actually agrees with him? < 1294000444 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh ... just checked hacker news < 1294000448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that idiot kroc camen is at #1 < 1294000452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IS NOWHERE SAFE < 1294000503 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kroc camen? < 1294000507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: this idiot. < 1294000508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Cabal-1.10.0.0-8b2e042500a42b47b6b121795bb9262f is unusable due to missing or recursive dependencies: < 1294000509 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : process-1.0.1.4-2a42745dbb9dd3c8087608f127411124 < 1294000522 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?? < 1294000547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what < 1294000800 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, which idiot? < 1294000806 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an idiot < 1294001069 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that's quite possibly the least specific identifier EVER. < 1294001085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: an entity < 1294001106 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*non-obviously-flippant < 1294001141 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i flip ants < 1294001163 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: please please please get Ubuntu working on this. < 1294001189 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no. < 1294001217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: why < 1294001240 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you betrayed Debian in a Sgeoesque display of infidelity! < 1294001247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: BAH < 1294001250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Sgesque < 1294001607 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also, you are a stooge of SHUTTLEWORTH < 1294001608 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay, got that AONT code written (uses AES and SHA-256)... < 1294001615 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: *WORTHY SHUTTLE < 1294001636 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, YOUR TIME AT HOOVER HEAVY INDUSTRIES IS AT AN END < 1294001644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: OK. Can I still steal TNT? < 1294001644 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari, you can be his replacement! < 1294001664 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you can't use company TNT unless you concede that Shuttleworth is EVIL. < 1294001685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Of course he is. http://geekz.co.uk/lovesraymond/archive/cancomical-lynchpad < 1294001703 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, welcome back to HHI! < 1294001717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I don't want to join until you read every Everybody Loves Eric Raymond comic ever. < 1294001735 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I've read most of them, if not all. < 1294001756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if there will ever be a new one. < 1294001774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"December 21, 2012 – A new ELER strip is published. < 1294001774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometime after, millions of *nix administrators die of a shock induced heart attack, and critical infrastructure is left unmaintained. Major companies go bankrupt as their servers succumb to threats normally mitigated by vigilant admins. The economies of the United States and the European Union collapse. Major military powers blame the incident on Chinese cyberwarfare, and invade the nation. Nuclear war ensues." < 1294001780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I... that... is actually plausible. < 1294001782 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Certainly, all the links are purple. < 1294001789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTUALLY PLAUSIBLE. < 1294001824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Checked ELER for update, as friend asked me had I seen latest post. Friend is now on a certain list. Oh yes…." < 1294001848 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=2575#comment-279450 "while arguably, I *am* in fact a world-changing figure" --esr < 1294001962 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ESR SO CRAZY < 1294001977 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The fact that the man is allowed anywhere near a gun is something I will never understand. < 1294002013 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[His highly respectable work and expertise in computer technology has been all but overshadowed by his batshit insane wingnut tendencies in the wake of 9/11]] — RW on ESR < 1294002019 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Highly respectable HAHAHAHAHAHA < 1294002046 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1294002131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION corrects < 1294002168 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pleasepleaseplease do that. < 1294002185 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://rationalwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Eric_S._Raymond&diff=707432&oldid=695156 < 1294002190 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ADD A NEW REVISION ON TOP BEFORE HUMAN REVERTS ME < 1294002219 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The worst part of all is that he blames Alan Turing for his judicial punishment and suicide, even though Raymond, like every other computer programmer, owes Turing his career." < 1294002222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He does? Ha < 1294002227 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: AD DA REVISION ADD A REVISION QUIIIICK < 1294002230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT WON'T LAST LONG < 1294002235 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the hell? < 1294002242 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :el < 1294002245 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Talk:Eric_S._Raymond#Utter_madness < 1294002252 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he doesn't owe Turing anything < 1294002258 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what an absurd statement < 1294002264 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's rationalwiki it can't be right < 1294002265 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note David Gerard's statement. < 1294002266 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or sane or reasonable or < 1294002291 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, OTOH, he was saying that "Turing was asking for it", which is appalling beyond words. < 1294002301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Who cares — the article is already crap anyway. < 1294002304 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[Um, no. INTERCAL is one of the things that is ESR working in his sphere of powerful competence.]] < 1294002304 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"His highly respectable work and expertise ..." ~~> "His questionable work and expertise in computer technology ..." hahahaha < 1294002309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294002319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Add a damned revision to the article already so mine doesn't get reverted. < 1294002324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just tweak the formatting of my edit :P < 1294002325 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HE MERGED SOME GIT HUBS SO POWERFULLY COMPETENT < 1294002333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ^^^^ < 1294002333 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er, s/HUBS/THINGS/ < 1294002349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Also TO BE FAIR he did originally write C-INTERCAL, but the code wasn't very ... good. < 1294002416 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: So, is there any actual obstacle to using stow? < 1294002437 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, done. < 1294002441 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: yay < 1294002456 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Hey, you removed the amusing bit. < 1294002460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, just footnoted it. < 1294002575 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, [[I do not like this article because it does not sufficiently acknowledge what ESR is good at and famous for. He wrote large chunks of libgif and libpng - without him your web browser would be a much sadder place. He has code in every Linux-based gadget you use - if his contributions disappeared, your broadband modem and even your television would be bricks.]] < 1294002583 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :— David Gerard < 1294002589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Seen, yes. What of it? < 1294002598 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is this complete crap? < 1294002621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I think it's factually correct (probably), but it doesn't really matter much. < 1294002629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Parsing GIFs and PNGs is not some huge innovation. < 1294002649 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Also it doesn't invalidate my footnote which states that it's /hard/ to find such a list which is true. < 1294002675 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have some kind of negative thought linked to David Gerard's name in my head but I don't know why. < 1294002768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: maybe i'll use my crazy Transaction type in this lang < 1294002836 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fun stuff with AONT: Pad messages to fixed size and do AONT on each. Pick HMAC key for each message, chunk messages and compute HMACs for chunks and append the MACs to chunks. Then perform random in-order merge of chunks. If there are enough chunks per message and at least 2 messages, that's difficult to untangle without HMAC keys. < 1294002874 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, David Gerard has been... not trolling, but being a pain at Less Wrong. < 1294002891 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For extra fun, couple chunks containing random data can be added... < 1294002892 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Uh, other than symlinks sucking, no. < 1294002906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Howso? < 1294002914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I wonder how the GNU System guys didn't think of using DESTDIR. < 1294002927 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: They do. < 1294002935 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not sure. Look at the RW LW articles: he wrote a great deal of them. < 1294002965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You mean [[Less Wrong]] on RationalWiki? < 1294002967 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Basically, that allows making data undecode multiple ways with possibilty of junk that just doesn't undecode. < 1294002972 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes. < 1294002984 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Scared to do that — Reddit Atheists react explosively when confronted with people who are actually rigorous about it. < 1294002993 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, he's also part of the Wikipedian Bureaucracy. < 1294002999 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Found that by Googling. < 1294003006 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294003048 0 :Sasha2!~WHAT@75-174-221-10.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294003064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: '"rationalists"'. < 1294003069 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh scare quotes. < 1294003075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Then ... why is it blocking a release? < 1294003104 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Aren't you an admin? < 1294003123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Oh wait, I forgot, RW goes by the Wikipedia Administration model, where admins are given endless powers but actually using them is taboo. < 1294003125 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, at RW? Sure, but the criteria for that are more or less the same as for autoconfirmation. < 1294003127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/troll < 1294003153 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: A) They don't *want* to use stow. B) stowfs does not work yet. < 1294003157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://rationalwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Special%3AListUsers&username=&group=sysop&limit=50 < 1294003160 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Dear god how many are there. < 1294003166 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, a few hundred. < 1294003176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Over 500. < 1294003178 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FWIW, I'm also a bureaucrat for reasons unclear to me. < 1294003183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Do they realise that they have almost as many sysops as Wikipedia? < 1294003186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or maybe even as many? < 1294003191 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: C) That's not actually a major blocker; a major blocker is that HARDLY ANYTHING ACTUALLY HAPPENS WITH IT AT ALL. < 1294003205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: From using stow I actually kinda like it... < 1294003214 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you fail to understand that a significant driving force behind RW's policy is being the opposite of Conservapedia. < 1294003223 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: RATIONALWIKI PREDATES CONSERVAPEDIA (iirc) < 1294003235 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, the symlink thing is the only really *bad* thing about stow, and it's not *that* bad... < 1294003237 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, erm... no it doesn't. < 1294003246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It doesn't? Well that explains ... a lot. < 1294003273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I guess nobody realised that the opposite of Conservapedia is LiberalUnjustifiedNutjobPedia. < 1294003293 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, naw, that exists too, it's just *profoundly* unfunny. < 1294003307 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://liberapedia.wikia.com/wiki/Main_Page < 1294003312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It exists and it's called RW. Also isn't that Lumenos' thing? < 1294003330 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Imagine a female zzo. Then imagine her attempting to be funny. < 1294003331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you say "but RW is humorous", well ... I can't bring myself to take Conservapedia seriously either. :P < 1294003353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: "Libertarians aren't keen on illegal immigration, but liberals always sort them out." Err? < 1294003366 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, don't let it trouble you. < 1294003374 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It just ... ist hat meant to be funny? < 1294003375 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't get it < 1294003387 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, again, it was written by zzo's distaff counterpart. < 1294003401 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Too man contractions < 1294003438 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo? zzo38? < 1294003470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*many < 1294003473 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I know. < 1294003475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I meant in the text. < 1294003477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of Liberapedia. < 1294003484 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: [[If you indicate your disagreement with the local belief clusters without at least using their jargon, someone may helpfully suggest that "you should try reading the sequences" before you attempt to talk to them. The "sequences"[6] are several collated series of Yudkowsky's blog posts, and there are eighteen sequences in all. The indexes for just the four "core sequences"[7] are somewhere north of 10,000 words. Those < 1294003484 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :link to over a hundred and fifty 2,000-3,000-word blog posts. That's about 300,000-450,000 words for those four. For comparison, Lord Of The Rings is 454,000 words.[8] As such, "You should try reading the sequences" is LessWrong for "Godspeed" "fuck you."]] < 1294003489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: tl;dr "Reading is hard"? < 1294003528 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, saying "read this hefty tome" in an argument isn't a very good idea. < 1294003568 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It's sort of like expecting you to have read the Bible on a Christian debate forum ... (I know, I know, that choice of analogy is just giving ammo but I don't care.) < 1294003571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: As bad as RationalWiki is the Richard Dawkins forum is worse. :p < 1294003614 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, of course. RW is at least /ostensibly/ without any opinion on religion. < 1294003652 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: In attempting to interpret that sentence of yours, my brain stumbled upon a world where the definition of "ostensibly" is "not". < 1294003661 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Disturbingly that seems to be the real world. < 1294003718 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, there are quite a few theists, and they get along fairly well. < 1294003727 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: O god, the RW article mentions the Amanda Knox case. < 1294003754 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm? < 1294003761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Murder of Meredith Ketcher. < 1294003774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: As far as I can tell the entire Richard Dawkins forum is united in considering Amanda Knox 100% guilty without actually presenting any evidence at all or... anything; the courts agree. Less Wrong is of the opposite opinion. < 1294003803 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't actually understand _why_ the RD forum agrees except that Reddit Atheists have this strange tendency to put undue trust in authority, presumably because they also believe all the most popular scientific theories without actually looking into them themselves. < 1294003811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Such a strange world. < 1294003818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And by that I mean the whole world.) < 1294003848 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, trusting the prevailing scientific theories is just the only way to get by in the world. < 1294003855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Certainly. < 1294003861 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: But it doesn't mean you should generalise that to "trust authority". < 1294003894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I don't have any /evidence/ that Reddatheists think this, but it's the only theory I can come up with for things like their absolute unwavering trust in, e.g. courts. < 1294003929 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, particularly odd, given that Dawkins himself is no fan of the legal system. < 1294003954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I love Dawkins. It's his fans I'm not too keen on. < 1294004056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: BTW, the Amanda Knox thing is http://lesswrong.com/lw/1ir/you_be_the_jury_survey_on_a_current_event/ http://lesswrong.com/lw/1j7/the_amanda_knox_test_how_an_hour_on_the_internet/; those posts have links to the Richard Dawkins forum, but if you replace "Don't be stupid, everyone can see that Amanda Knox is insanely guilty" mentally that's pretty much the exact content of the RD threads. < 1294004368 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It still irks me that they ask for probabilities. < 1294004558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The LW-consensus is that an aversion to giving numeric probabilities is basically an artefact of human wetware. < 1294004589 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but... I mean, do they have calculations for it or what? < 1294004599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: "Your probability *estimate*". < 1294004626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It's meant to be rough, just like any guesswork. Numbers aren't inherently "precise". Note: I am giving my perception of the LW consensus, not supporting it or agreeing with it. < 1294004718 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eat < 1294004767 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm... Returning to that fan problem... At least CPU fan and main case fan both work... < 1294004797 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(dunno about PSU fan) < 1294004801 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, incidentally, Ilari is now your subordinate at HHI. < 1294004812 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, GPU fan appears to work... < 1294004816 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HHI? < 1294004816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: Do whatever. The paychecks will come at regular intervals. < 1294004825 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Is it bad to try and establish a utopia of laziness with my position? < 1294004837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: Hoover Heavy Industries, the most fake corporation of fakeness. < 1294004852 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm still not sure what kind of entity it is. < 1294004866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It's a militacountrypany! < 1294004879 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, OMG HHI in Oolite. < 1294004894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: OH GOD < 1294004895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Oh god < 1294004916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I would really play an Oolite MMO... I realise it's a non-trivial problem but I would honestly subscribe to a pay-monthly Oolite MMO I think. < 1294004924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: EVE is just so boring and hard to get into. < 1294004928 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yeah, but even then. < 1294004941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Even then what. < 1294004952 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even in a world of Platonically ideal computers, Braben would sue the hell out of the people running the MMO. < 1294004985 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's hardly easy-going about the rights to Elite. < 1294004986 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Even if the ship names were changed? Presumably it'd take place in a new world anyway. < 1294004995 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You can't copyright gameplay itself. < 1294005007 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Change the names, make new designs, redo the UI. < 1294005009 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, by this point you can always just look at Infinity and sigh. < 1294005020 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Who cares about landing on planets. < 1294005034 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, there is actually an OXP that lets you do that... < 1294005043 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh. < 1294005126 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although it basically just consists of flying into the planet and getting a docking effect. < 1294005179 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's there? < 1294005232 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[Go to your preferences, select monobook as your default skin and never again worry about the horrible new crap mediawiki wants to inflict on you. That's what I did, anyway. --JeevesMkII The gentleman's gentleman at the other site 15:18, 30 December 2010 (UTC) < 1294005233 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::That's the right conservative attitude. --Idiot numbre 188 (talk) 16:26, 30 December 2010 (UTC)]] < 1294005236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should stop reading RW, it's bad for me. < 1294005241 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I even /like/ Vector but COME ON. < 1294005283 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, Vector does have the font size problem. < 1294005300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Font size problem"? < 1294005342 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is it with people and No True Scotsman. I see No True Scotsman misused more than I see actual No True Scotsman. < 1294005343 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is well-documented that the text is far far far smaller than Monobook's on many computers. < 1294005379 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If Dawkins announced that he was a Christian, and then kept doing EXACTLY THE SAME THINGS HE DID BEFORE FOREVER, and someone said then RD wasn't actually Christian, someone would bring out No True Scotsman. < 1294005398 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just because he publishes books and speaks in public about how all religion is false doesn't make him not a Christian! SCOTSMAAAAAN < 1294005401 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Really? < 1294005405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: s/computers/browsers/. Probably. < 1294005410 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've never seen that. < 1294005437 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did when WP started using it. < 1294005488 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh god I forgot how amazing http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZW2qxFkcLM0 is. < 1294005491 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Admittedly, Vector has a smaller font size anyway, but it was more pronounced. < 1294005540 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL < 1294005565 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: lol at the trailer? or < 1294005568 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294005571 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is hilarious < 1294005572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's amazing :D < 1294005575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would so have gone and seen it < 1294005585 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a parody of a real film no? < 1294005596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's the trailer to "2012", recut with bongos < 1294005599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and 70s < 1294005600 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294005616 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also stupid scrolling text. < 1294005769 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: *awesome < 1294005769 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, agreeing with you: that is a horrible misuse of No True Scotsman. It has a very particular syllogistic form that I've almost never actually seen used < 1294005802 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the flaw has nothing to do whether someone or something is or isn't in a group :-\ < 1294005806 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[ Hamish is shocked and declares that "No Scotsman would do such a thing." [Brighton is not part of Scotland.] ]] — Antony Flew (before he got old and crazy) < 1294005809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Best [] note ever. < 1294005817 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, true < 1294005829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, he died. < 1294005869 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Antony Flew? < 1294005876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: He did indeed. < 1294005894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: (The populariser of No True Scotsman and famous atheist who later got old and was convinced to agree that God does actually exist.) < 1294005899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Then he died.) < 1294005902 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the pure logical form is: (a) All members of the set of A lack the trait T. (b) X is a member of A (objection) X has trait T (c) X is not a True A < 1294005903 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION swatpans elliott to within an inch of his life --==\#/ < 1294005915 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Do you remember when almost all the examples of forms of argumentation on Wikipedia were between Father and (precocious) Daughter? < 1294005919 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That was hilarious. < 1294005926 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ...no. < 1294005931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It was amazing. < 1294005951 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SHOW ME < 1294005957 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, one thing I'm *really* good at is logic :-} < 1294005960 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: In one of them the father argued for tolerance of all beliefs, then the daughter went "Well, you CAN'T say that because you have to be tolerant of the belief that it's BAD to be tolerant!" and oh god < 1294005970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll try and find it. < 1294006008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can't. < 1294006030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I wonder whether I should do this with she. < 1294006063 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{-# LANGUAGE TypeOperators, GADTs, KindSignatures, RankNTypes, TypeFamilies, FlexibleContexts, NoMonomorphismRestriction #-} < 1294006065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I will < 1294006066 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{-# OPTIONS_GHC -F -pgmF she #-} < 1294006070 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I call that "Tuesday" < 1294006130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION edits keyboard layout, changes £ to # < 1294006135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nobody talks about money and I need my hash < 1294006158 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, have you ever actually seen NTS used correctly? < 1294006164 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: not that I know of < 1294006165 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, HAHAHA YOU HAVE A CRAPPY MAC KEYBOARD LAYOUT < 1294006171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it appears to be a vanishingly rare fallacy in practice. < 1294006186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly because there are easier-to-make, more convincing ones. < 1294006203 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yep < 1294006217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"To open kluchrtoxml, you need to install Rosetta. Would you like to install it now?" < 1294006218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lol, powerpc < 1294006234 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stupid VLC and mplayer can't play my DVD < 1294006258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mplayer plays everything, you did something wrong < 1294006284 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it should be mplayer dvd:// -dvd-device /dev/acd0 < 1294006285 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right? < 1294006290 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dunno :D < 1294006488 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: SHE can't do < 1294006488 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I wish Type:Type was consistent < 1294006488 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :data (:/:) (r :: *) :: {Poly r} -> * where Q :: r -> r :/: p < 1294006489 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :type Gauss = Integer :/: {x^2 + 1} < 1294006501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Indeed, I doubt it can :P < 1294006505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not a full language, man! < 1294006523 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: That's cool though. < 1294006526 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I doubt it's possible :P < 1294006601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: nicer than plain haskell though < 1294006603 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294006801 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1294006939 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how does urxvt NOT have unicode support.... < 1294006942 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is really confused < 1294006991 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: it does < 1294007000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: :( she can't have types which are dependent on themselves < 1294007007 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i.e. a constructor of type T takes a dependent T < 1294007055 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, any unicode character shows up as ? < 1294007063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: you set encodings wrong < 1294007074 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what should I change? < 1294007081 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: depends :) < 1294007088 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't see what you mean < 1294007095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: hm i think i did it wrong < 1294007103 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Sigma :: {a:Type} -> Term {Pi (TypeI Z) (TypeI Z)} -> Type < 1294007111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the output for that tries to use : as a type operator and stuff so no it's not that < 1294007113 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh does it have to be :: < 1294007114 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course < 1294007115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does that work though < 1294007129 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope doesn't < 1294007130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so how do you do it < 1294007138 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, which language are you guys messing around with this time? < 1294007169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nm got it working < 1294007171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Haskell+she < 1294007203 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what does this "she" do? < 1294007211 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: she does many things. < 1294007215 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, any ideas for what to look for? < 1294007218 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that's what SHE said! < 1294007226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pseudo-dependent types, Pi, pattern synonyms, pseudo-aspect-oriented programming, and IDIOM BRAKKETZ < 1294007230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: LC_ALL etc < 1294007235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: what program is outputting them? < 1294007237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you tried "cat" < 1294007237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1294007268 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :run locale < 1294007272 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that outputs the relevant variables < 1294007280 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, when I attempt to copy from xchat to the shell (so I guess its zsh) < 1294007281 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also shows which is in effect for those not set < 1294007286 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LC_ALL is empty < 1294007296 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are all ="C" < 1294007298 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, then there is LANG, LC_CTYPE and so on. < 1294007304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah you need to set them to en_foo.UTF8 < 1294007307 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, well of course unicode doesn't work then < 1294007318 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I'm new to unicode in the terminall.... < 1294007338 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should set them to en_US.UTF8 ? < 1294007351 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, set LANG=en_US.UTF-8 < 1294007353 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it is < 1294007367 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then all the unset ones default to LANG < 1294007372 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you only need to set LANG < 1294007379 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and LC_ALL overrides all on top of that) < 1294007391 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :urxvt: default locale unavailable, check LC_* and LANG variables. Continuing. < 1294007408 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh < 1294007409 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294007423 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :export LANG="en_US.UTF8"; urxvt < 1294007434 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, you might want to change LC_COLLATE to C again. since the non-C locales often sorts case insensitively. < 1294007438 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait - missing a 0 < 1294007440 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a - < 1294007456 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or another alternative: maybe the locale was not generated < 1294007462 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think how varies between distros < 1294007487 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope: adding a "-" works < 1294007492 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294007495 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems < 1294007560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: aw man < 1294007564 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just messed this up < 1294007572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :data Term :: {Nat} -> {Type} -> * where < 1294007572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Star :: {n} -> Term l {TypeI (S n)} < 1294007572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Var :: Fin {n} -> Term {n} ??? < 1294007583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: am i going to have to carry around the whole environment of types or something? : < 1294007584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::/ < 1294007668 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously < 1294007694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: in the /type system/? < 1294007698 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I'm not Oleg! < 1294007706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but okay < 1294007709 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just a list < 1294007722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not Found < 1294007723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The requested URL /~conor/pub/she/examples/ShePrelude.lhs was not found on this server. < 1294007723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apache Server at personal.cis.strath.ac.uk Port 80 < 1294007771 0 :Sasha2_!~WHAT@75-174-221-10.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294007836 0 :MigoMipo_!~John@84-217-13-27.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294007838 0 :BMG!~behold@d83-183-183-70.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1294007919 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294007919 0 :BMG!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294007923 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :BeholdMyGlory < 1294008004 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1294008043 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1294008050 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1294008056 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, my next language design goal is to make a language that takes an extremely long time to *compile* but NOT based on the time of day or have any arbitrary time requirments < 1294008090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: We have that, it's called C++. < 1294008093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Or Haskell. < 1294008123 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, isn't haskell faster than C++ at least? < 1294008127 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(at compiling) < 1294008135 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically - make the language itself require algorithms that are Θ(2^n) < 1294008163 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, why not O(n!) < 1294008165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well. We're working on that. < 1294008192 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: better -- have a language with, e.g., 2^128 types exactly. have the only possible method of type checking be brute forcing < 1294008194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: in fact < 1294008200 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: just store programs as SHA-512 hashes of an actual program < 1294008205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compilation takes place by brute-forcing the actual program < 1294008207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then compiling that < 1294008224 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : variable: just store programs as SHA-512 hashes of an actual program <-- didn't gregor do this already? < 1294008240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably. < 1294008243 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: this sucks < 1294008246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think there is such a language on the wiki. < 1294008247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: What does? < 1294008256 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no because that is not deterministic < 1294008276 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I don't just want O(n!) I want Θ(n!) < 1294008279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: yes it is deterministic < 1294008286 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294008291 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are hash collisions, but who cares :) < 1294008296 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no - because there could be multiple programs that result in the same sha hash < 1294008300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: specify the order in which strings are brute-forced duh < 1294008304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it's deterministic < 1294008310 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it fails to compile, just search for a collision < 1294008316 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: :D < 1294008322 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294008330 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294008332 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294008336 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294008356 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but then its not turing complete - not all programs could be represented < 1294008357 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :run the program < 1294008357 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :until you manage to find a program that compiles < 1294008357 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ask the user if it's what they want < 1294008361 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294008365 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294008368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it's not, keep going < 1294008369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ËÌÍÎË‚·∏Ø!:L < 1294008369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Was this correct? [y/n] < 1294008370 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well that works if every possible string is a valid program < 1294008370 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, you just completely skip the non-compiling ones. < 1294008370 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well true < 1294008370 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: That's not a requirement for turing completeness... < 1294008389 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-154-243.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294008389 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294008389 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294008389 0 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-57-8.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1294008397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: You take the original language, remove a bunch of programs (those which come after a valid program in brute-force-order), and that's the "real" language. < 1294008428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The hashes are just a facade over that. < 1294008428 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Excess Flood < 1294008429 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway, I'm pretty sure that every hash can yeild a program that outputs a given output, assuming a good hash function. < 1294008430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You could finetune a hash function for it. < 1294008430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*yield btw. < 1294008431 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-154-243.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294008431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: But that isn't true. < 1294008432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Consider outputs bigger than the hash size. < 1294008442 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, Φ = lower bound O = upper bound Θ is when O == Φ IIRC < 1294008442 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, there are infinitely many strings that result in the same hash < 1294008442 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Specifically, uncompressable outputs bigger than the hash size. < 1294008449 0 :coppro!~scshunt@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1294008449 0 :dbc!~daniel@130-94-161-238-dsl.hevanet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294008455 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, yes. < 1294008457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The pigeonholes are very crowded. < 1294008469 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: did j-invariant ask? < 1294008469 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Excess Flood < 1294008469 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, meh - I want to invent the language myself < 1294008469 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-} < 1294008485 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I thought he did when he said hm < 1294008488 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294008490 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, if the hash function is good, then it will "look" random. Thus we won't get that anything starting with, say, an "y" can't have this hash < 1294008491 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-154-243.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294008521 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if that would happen, then it wouldn't be a good hash function < 1294008540 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, am I right? I always forget the lowerbound symbol - the rest I know are correct < 1294008548 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: I... think so. < 1294008552 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, thus, we should be able to find a program for any given hash that gives a specific output. Though it may be a /very/ long program. < 1294008554 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, right? < 1294008561 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Let's just say yes and not think about it! < 1294008574 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, do you think I'm not right? < 1294008575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Var :: {Fin n} -> Term {t:ts} t < 1294008577 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: can't believe that actually works < 1294008580 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::/ < 1294008581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I don't know :-) < 1294008585 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's probably right. < 1294008591 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott ah I have another idea for a language < 1294008600 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, who would be the expert on this? < 1294008606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Your mo^W^Wsomeone. < 1294008616 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It sounds like something very hard to prove. < 1294008619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For a given hash function. < 1294008627 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, for any /real/ hash function yes < 1294008633 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you program the language by defining all legal inputs and the resulting outputs. The compiler bruteforces the shortest program that would result in those inputs/outputs :-} < 1294008633 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but for a theoretical perfect one < 1294008649 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Reminds me of Clue. < 1294008660 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, let's consider the hash function : String -> 1. < 1294008675 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: There is only one such function, f(s) = (). < 1294008684 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294008692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Every program has the hash (), and the hash () has every program. < 1294008698 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: What is your hypothesis again? < 1294008724 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what do you think of HOAS? < 1294008766 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, for every value in the co-domain of the hash function it will be possible to find a program in the domain that gives the specific output (assuming a language where the program isn't the same as the output, I suspect the language need to be brainfuck-IO-complete) < 1294008780 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or at least output, I don't think input matters) < 1294008780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Consider < 1294008796 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f : String -> 2; f('x':...) = A; f(s) = B < 1294008802 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what language is this < 1294008804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. x followed by anything is A, everything else is B. < 1294008807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Pseudo. < 1294008809 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294008816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Now consider a language where no valid program starts with x. < 1294008823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All programs hash to B; A has no program. < 1294008833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Of course this is pathological ... but it demonstrates that it is not universally true. < 1294008835 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm true. < 1294008844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I think the problem is that while hash functions "appear" random they are not _actually_ perfectly uniform. < 1294008849 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: HOAS is stupid < 1294008854 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: why < 1294008858 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that is not a good hash in the way I said above though. < 1294008864 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's just completely impossible to use for anything nontrivial < 1294008866 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: elliott, if the hash function is good, then it will "look" random. Thus we won't get that anything starting with, say, an "y" can't have this hash < 1294008866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I don't think a good hash in that sense exists then. < 1294008868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well eys :P < 1294008869 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*yes < 1294008879 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, true, I suppose even sha512 has some bias < 1294008893 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but something like sha512 or similar should come close at least < 1294008918 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294008929 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294008933 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294008935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Close doesn't make a theorem. Infinity is against you; close times infinity equals infinitely far. :p < 1294008936 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: obvious being able to write syntax using lambda terms is nice, but using it internally for algorithms doesn't seem possible < 1294008936 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, of course. < 1294008936 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: agreed < 1294008945 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, good hash functions are not defined by looking random < 1294008945 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION parameterises Type < 1294008948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(on the level...) < 1294008958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: is there any way out of an infinite hierarchy of Type-s again? < 1294008962 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good hash functions are defined by small changes in the source result in large changes in the output < 1294008963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is it all just machinery to hide it < 1294008970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: yes. we are aware < 1294008977 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he was defining his own notion < 1294009024 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but theoretically perfectly unbiased hash functions are often used in discussing algorithms using hash function. Proving something secure with that is easier than with any given real hash, so I seem to remember that often crypto things are proven secure given an unbiased hash function first. < 1294009036 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, indeed < 1294009084 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, actually my definition isn't complete < 1294009084 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, which will as a result look pretty random. I was not being very strict in my wording when I said "looking random" < 1294009084 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because then theoretically multiplying all the bytes together should be a "good" hash function < 1294009102 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: is an unbiased function even theoretically possible? < 1294009106 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is away < 1294009108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure such a functoin would be computable < 1294009109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*function < 1294009126 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, define theoretically. < 1294009135 0 :jix!jix@tomakin.h-ix.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294009181 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Is there a computable unbiased hash function? < 1294009183 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you can discuss things using an oracle in articles. They are presumably not possible for an UTM. < 1294009190 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So not computable then. < 1294009202 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't know if it has been proven if one could exist or not < 1294009210 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm pretty sure none is known though. < 1294009226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :data Term :: {[Type]} -> {Type n} -> * where < 1294009226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Star :: {n} -> Term {ts} {TypeI (S n)} < 1294009226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Var :: {Fin n} -> Term {t:ts} {t} < 1294009228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Fun :: {t} -> Term {t:ts} {s} -> Term {ts} {Pi t s} < 1294009230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : App :: Term {ts} {Pi t s} -> Term {ts} {t} -> Term {ts} {s} < 1294009235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what's the hot way of describing data structures nowadays < 1294009240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :W fell out of favour I know that :) < 1294009260 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, W? < 1294009273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: W. < 1294009282 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :W < 1294009284 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dot. < 1294009293 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes not very googable < 1294009312 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, even with the dot < 1294009314 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THINGS I HATE: people who equate the web to "www". < 1294009315 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The birth ceremony http://www.cs.nott.ac.uk/~txa/publ/icalp04.pdf and obituary http://www.e-pig.org/epilogue/?p=324 < 1294009333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Just skip straight to the obituary. < 1294009379 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"In Epigram 2, we don’t take W-types as the primitive source of inductive structure. Instead, we supply a universe of inductive types, giving first-order data a first-order representation. We’ve just written a paper about it: The Gentle Art of Levitation." < 1294009381 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, elliott: HASHFUCK IS PATENTED < 1294009385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i think that might be overblown for what i want < 1294009399 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: YOUR MOERMYORI TJOP FDJ ODGPDNG IODFJG IODJG IODFJG KOFDJGOIFDJH0DZJSVOI HIOSI ]EWSE0R 9J90E4JYS0SJ TAWR -K5 -K[RS';T/XHC;LGKO[N]PLJK < 1294009401 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah < 1294009413 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you read the whole post and understood it in that time? < 1294009414 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hashfuck? < 1294009415 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't lie < 1294009417 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no < 1294009419 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I didn't < 1294009420 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WELL THEN < 1294009421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :get to it < 1294009422 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I never claimed I did < 1294009428 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ShaFuck rather < 1294009429 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I WONDER WHY < 1294009439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I should probably have a type for terms and values < 1294009450 0 :coppro!~scshunt@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1294009450 0 :dbc!~daniel@130-94-161-238-dsl.hevanet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294009478 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Rebooting < 1294009597 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you mean both? < 1294009617 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294009618 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: as in, two individual ones < 1294009625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than just reducing Terms down to more value-y terms < 1294009626 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1294009706 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh, this utterly sucks < 1294009737 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have Maybe all over the place because I can't parametrize haskell modules by values < 1294009748 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's not clear whether they get turned to Just's in time < 1294009759 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well too long to read, but the general issue he mentions is a recurring theme. Too flexible, too hard to work with in computers. < 1294009760 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :data Term :: {[forall n. Type n]} -> {Type n} -> * where < 1294009761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : TermWrap :: Thing Term {ts} {s} -> Term {ts} {s} < 1294009761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : App :: me {ts} {Pi t s} -> me {ts} {t} -> Term {ts} {s} < 1294009762 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instance Thingy Term where wrap = TermWrap < 1294009764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SUCH FUN < 1294009785 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well there's more important stuff near the bottom where he demonstrates theoretical problems too. < 1294009793 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:08 j-invariant: I have Maybe all over the place because I can't parametrize haskell modules by values < 1294009797 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: this is why we need an ML-style module system! < 1294009801 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294009803 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or really Ur-style < 1294009803 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1294009810 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know much about module systems really < 1294009821 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the bit about canonical representation? < 1294009821 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want a language expressive enough to define them in < 1294009828 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the bit about tt = ff. < 1294009831 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or ff = tt. around there. < 1294009832 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294009889 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, should I learn OCaml? < 1294009892 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I tried once < 1294009901 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah... it is inconsistent, right? < 1294009903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Learn Standard ML instead. Probably. < 1294009907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's more subtle than that :-P < 1294009944 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: so what's your favourite way of defining recursive types in the value language! < 1294009946 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The reason I started with Racket in the first place is because I heard good things about the module system. I was lied to. < 1294009950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: LIED < 1294009959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: the ML module system is nothing like what you think it is. < 1294009969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i.e. combinators resulting in Types. < 1294009972 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ...? < 1294010101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: can you look at what i have so far? http://sprunge.us/UiXi < 1294010107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: specifically the XXX: comments ... I'm a bit confused < 1294010118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm that App signature at the bottom is all wrong < 1294010120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it hosuld say Term, not me < 1294010121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*should < 1294010133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also star should be gone < 1294010144 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also i have a bug < 1294010145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ffff < 1294010147 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, any reasons for Standard ML over OCaml? < 1294010157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ocaml sucks. sml sucks less. < 1294010174 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: just use Agda already :P < 1294010184 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but agda is 'orrible < 1294010194 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this IS agda code < 1294010215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: LET ME LIVE IN MY ILLUSION < 1294010232 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw < 1294010240 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't really use lists for a context of types < 1294010245 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Not in scope: type constructor or class `SheTyType' < 1294010246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is this even. < 1294010247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: why not < 1294010249 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since later types might depend on the earlier ones.. < 1294010255 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this makes things difficult < 1294010263 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: oh god you're right < 1294010266 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: asdfghj that is awful < 1294010273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i need like < 1294010274 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dependent lists < 1294010279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that something that exists < 1294010311 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what are you trying to do? < 1294010319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: things. < 1294010333 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, okay, if you don't want to tell... < 1294010353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i explained above. < 1294010376 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, approx where? < 1294010386 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno < 1294010391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a dependent lang < 1294010407 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that you are writing (or do you mean what she is?) < 1294010425 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :former < 1294010430 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, cool < 1294010439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is not going well < 1294010464 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, haskell should add such an extension already < 1294010471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha! < 1294010480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :solved < 1294010490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: um that would require a complete restructuring of GHC < 1294010498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and would be difficult to integrate with large swathes of haskell < 1294010547 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm true < 1294010556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Ambiguous type variable `thing' in the constraint: < 1294010556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : `Thingy thing' < 1294010566 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: apparently "thing" is ambiguous, who knew? < 1294010574 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what good general purpose dependently typed languages are there? < 1294010576 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any? < 1294010584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Epigram < 1294010590 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, 1 or 2? < 1294010593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2 < 1294010603 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, which isn't usable yet iirc < 1294010604 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so... < 1294010610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are computers? < 1294010614 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :none that is usable as of today? < 1294010618 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, that depends < 1294010704 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, was it epigram that allowed you to declare a data structure using RFC notation? Or was that another language (which one?)? < 1294010764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That was Cola/whateveryouwanttocallit, completely unrelated, that one's more similar to Smalltalk — don't tell Sgeo, or I'll have to add another regexp to shutup. < 1294010794 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, dude you just highlighted him < 1294010795 0 :MigoMipo_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294010804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: INDEED < 1294010829 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so this Cola, was it any good? < 1294010841 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's a VPRI project. It's pretty coo'. < 1294010858 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah... < 1294010894 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294010896 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294010900 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294010931 0 :Leonidas!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294010934 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: they are not general purpose < 1294010935 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, maybe I should try to learn Epigram? < 1294010935 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, which ones? epigram? < 1294010935 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: none of them < 1294010935 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, would you call haskell general purpose? < 1294010946 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294010946 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah well < 1294010946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Epigram is close enough :P < 1294010951 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, in what way is epigram not general purpose then? < 1294010956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You can't learn Epigram 2 because nothing actually runs Epigram 2. < 1294010962 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm true < 1294010979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: There's an interactive-in-a-user-hostile-kind-of-way theorem prover that can define things in the Epigram system, but the actual language is completely unimplemented and utterly unfinished. < 1294010992 0 :Leonidas!~Leonidas@unaffiliated/leonidas JOIN :#esoteric < 1294010992 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294010992 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294010992 0 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-57-8.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1294011042 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: *Polynomial> let w = (one - Quot (mon 1, Just eisenstein))*(one + Quot (mon 1, Just eisenstein)) < 1294011042 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, right. Is it moving forward fast or? < 1294011042 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Polynomial> printPolynomial names ((inj w * x + y)^7) < 1294011042 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"y^{7} + (14 + 7\\zeta)x y^{6} + (63 + 63\\zeta)x^{2} y^{5} + (105 + 210\\zeta)x^{3} y^{4} + (315\\zeta)x^{4} y^{3} + (-189 + 189\\zeta)x^{5} y^{2} + (-189)x^{6} y + (-54 + -27\\zeta)x^{7}" < 1294011057 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's been in progress since 2005, so no; but Conor likes throwing out gigantic swathes of the underlying system, so yes. < 1294011058 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: N I C E < 1294011058 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hah < 1294011058 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: did you write this?!?! < 1294011066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: *system on a regular basis, < 1294011071 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294011116 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :printPolynomial < 1294011116 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : :: (SheChecks Nat n, Ring r, Eq r, Show r) => < 1294011116 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vec n String -> MonoidRing r (Vec n Integer) -> String < 1294011250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i approve. i approve very hard < 1294011282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: so do quotient sets work yet >:) < 1294011461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/Users/ehird/Code/tabby/first.hs:52:26: < 1294011461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Could not deduce (Show (me (t1 :$#$#$#: ts) s)) < 1294011462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : from the context (t ~ SheTyPi t1 s) < 1294011463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : arising from a use of `show' < 1294011465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : at /Users/ehird/Code/tabby/first.hs:52:26-31 < 1294011467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Possible fix: < 1294011469 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : add (Show (me (t1 :$#$#$#: ts) s)) to the context of < 1294011471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : the constructor `Fun' < 1294011474 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :import ShePrelud < 1294011475 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1294011520 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"For any logical system, T, with an algorithm to decide what is and is not a proof in T (aka a decidable set of axioms) such that each axiom of Robinson Aritmetic (which is a very weak theory of arithmetic) is provable in T, there is some formula G, such if T proves G or if T proves ¬G, then T proves 0=1." < 1294011520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: already have yo < 1294011526 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hasn't helped < 1294011540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i see the problem though MAYBE < 1294011550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :flexible contexts -- ALWAYS A MISTAKE ??? < 1294011578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: indeed < 1294011584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: any reason for quoting that? :p < 1294011723 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"the incompleteness and undecidability of PA cannot be blamed on the only aspect of PA differentiating it from Q, namely the axiom schema of induction." < 1294011770 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha "For Christmas I received the book Gödel, Escher, Bach: An Eternal Golden Braid (or GEB) and I have been pretty deeply troubled regarding Gödel's incompleteness theorems since." < 1294011842 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"troubled"? < 1294011854 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: where's that from btw < 1294011984 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://i.imgur.com/1LCv6.png I think dome3 is smaller than the Cube. < 1294011997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Note how they have tons of people working on it and even they haven't gone for bedrock. < 1294012109 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, dome3? < 1294012120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: see image. on the reddit creative server. < 1294012136 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I see the image. But what is it supposed to be? < 1294012141 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A dome. < 1294012143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WIP. < 1294012146 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just a dome? < 1294012176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1294012192 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how does one get to dome 3? < 1294012206 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: /warp dome3. < 1294012211 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Try not to crash the server. < 1294012245 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, such suspicion! < 1294012255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I'M ON TO YOU < 1294012272 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't understand haskell types < 1294012275 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are they for < 1294012279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: to type things < 1294012286 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which things? < 1294012298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: typed things < 1294012319 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, it is useless when he is in this mood < 1294012325 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1294012351 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: actually i was joking along with j-invariant. < 1294012358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :p. sure j-invariant knows what haskell types are < 1294012359 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294012369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: TYPES IN HASKELL ARE LIKE BURRITOS TO YOUR MONADS < 1294012528 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294012550 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X) < 1294012565 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294012607 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I became obsessed with Haskell, would shutup be configured to yell at me for mentioning Haskell? < 1294012646 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Only if you say stupid things. < 1294012647 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the dome is quite astounding. < 1294012658 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes. Yet it is, afaik, smaller than the Cube and also more shallow. < 1294012665 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: How the fuck is the Cube ever going to get completed? < 1294012669 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: is that polynomial thing up anywhere? < 1294012672 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it definitely does go down to bedrock. < 1294012674 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1294012675 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd help if I could < 1294012681 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Buy Minecraft. < 1294012690 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it will get completed because we are HHI and we do not have restrictions on TNT. < 1294012697 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HHI? < 1294012700 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Do we have the TNT kit yet? < 1294012706 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TNT kit? < 1294012713 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1294012717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: a kit to get tnt < 1294012720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: is the polynomial source open? < 1294012725 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you have a script to tell him to shut up? < 1294012728 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why not just ignore < 1294012758 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, if I say Racket, Newspeak, Smalltalk, Factor, AW, Active Worlds, or ActiveWorlds, I get PMed a message teling me to shut up < 1294012769 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Used to say it in the channel, but oerjan got ticked off < 1294012788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am excellent at obeying the letter but not the spirit of any judgement. < 1294012789 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, just filter such /msg from elliott! < 1294012793 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what do you want to see? < 1294012796 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It doesn't come from me. < 1294012799 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's 5 files < 1294012802 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, it's from shutup < 1294012802 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: dunno :D < 1294012808 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, then easy to /ignore < 1294012818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Sgeo clearly realises how irritating he is sometimes because he hasn't /ignored it yet. < 1294012823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I consider it a public service. < 1294012831 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you run that bot? < 1294012833 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I rarely use ignore < 1294012839 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: "No, it runs on magic." < 1294012843 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh, shutup isn't even in the channel < 1294012849 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well it could be someone else running it < 1294012855 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, indeed which was why I wondered < 1294012856 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you hitting tunes.org servers repeatedly? < 1294012867 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be nasty < 1294012867 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I'm ticked. < 1294012870 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1294012882 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so how does it work then? < 1294012884 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, shutups < 1294012890 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er. < 1294012894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1294012897 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Its methods do not concern you. < 1294012906 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why not < 1294012907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nobody's resources are being taken up I can assure you. < 1294012920 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION glares at updog suspiciously < 1294012921 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1294012925 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, Vorpal, shutup's mechanics are an industrial secret knowledge of which is only permitted to senior HHI personnel. < 1294012927 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm genuinely interested < 1294012932 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote updog in like five minutes Sgeo :P < 1294012933 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1294012935 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, stop being so silly < 1294012938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It amuses me, you see. < 1294012953 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how many bots do you have on here? < 1294012964 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Everything but botte! Anyway, this is boring. < 1294012969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LET'S TALK ABOUT THE CUBE < 1294012969 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, updog, or the updog part of the script? < 1294012969 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1294012974 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, lets not < 1294012979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I wrote the whole program in about 3 minutes. < 1294012989 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well *I'm* tlaking about the cube. < 1294012990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*talking < 1294012993 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Have we got a TNT kit yet < 1294012994 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294013011 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, have we got a TNT kit yet? < 1294013022 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftwiki.net/index.php?title=Special:Search&search=TNT+kit < 1294013106 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, that won't help < 1294013114 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, he is talking about a hmod kit < 1294013146 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also I just checked for you and the answer is no < 1294013167 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294013176 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night → < 1294013294 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1294013583 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, WHYYYY < 1294013629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Are the biome-compliant leaves any good? < 1294013644 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no. < 1294013650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Really? < 1294013650 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, the grass isn't. < 1294013658 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The leaves, I said. < 1294013665 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The leaves might well be, but they won't match the grass. < 1294013677 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fair enough. < 1294013695 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: 'S just that the leaves I normally use with Painterly have an annoying blue dot on them. < 1294013707 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, huh? < 1294013709 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not for me. < 1294013723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It's only for one colour < 1294013834 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Have you noticed how ugly Painterly coal ore is? < 1294013843 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No... < 1294013856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: wut < 1294013878 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it's a little smeared, but it's not too bad. < 1294013889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?Just remove the borders from my glass entirely. < 1294013890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" < 1294013895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE PERFECT GLASS TEXTURE < 1294013950 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's what I've been using since forever. < 1294014448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Don't you just hate fantasy? < 1294014448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fantasy is boring. It's all about a hero killing dragons or rescuing princesses. And in the end, the hero gets a big reward from some autocratic ruler, and spends the rest of his life banging said princess." < 1294014454 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :--start of a texture pack thread on minecraftforums < 1294014566 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Monster Spawners? Uhh... actually, I don't see how to modernize this. I have at least put caution stripes on it so that it's safer, though. (Caution stripes make everything safer.)" < 1294014981 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it appears that using LiquidThreads on one's talkpage is now The Hip New Thing at RW. < 1294014990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Oh dear god. < 1294014996 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd despair if I hadn't already done so. < 1294015013 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/User_talk:Armondikov < 1294015029 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Admittedly, they did get rid of those hideous gray boxes. < 1294015046 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Add a new comment without using liquidthreads and -- jesus christ that is so much UI noise. < 1294015053 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I look at that and my brain sees "computer". < 1294015057 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pure, raw computer. < 1294015067 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the _exact point_ I made when it was proposed. < 1294015080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Please tell me you used the exact words "Pure, raw computer." < 1294015095 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no, just that it was UI noise < 1294015105 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[Hopefully to the chagrin of many, this page is now running Liquid Threads.]] < 1294015111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sigh* < 1294015121 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What a self-righteous little... < 1294015121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Halp on the server. I am lost < 1294015129 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, which server? < 1294015131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: a322 < 1294015132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: HAHA < 1294015133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/User_talk:Armondikov/archive < 1294015137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: He has summarised all his archives. < 1294015138 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how can I help? < 1294015141 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the most douchebaggy way possible. < 1294015141 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, *she < 1294015144 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oops. < 1294015147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I really need to stop doing that. < 1294015155 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DOESN'T MATTER it's still hilariously obnoxiou < 1294015155 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s < 1294015187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I think that the regular server is ... gone? < 1294015188 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal? < 1294015189 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Armondikov is a noted self-superior prat. < 1294015214 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT IS THIS PLACE < 1294015236 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When LiquidThreads was proposed she basically said "All of you who don't like it are IDIOTS who CANNOT WORK THINGS OUT because you are SO MUCH STUPIDER than me.! < 1294015241 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/!/"/ < 1294015283 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the deal with this wiki? < 1294015293 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, beats me. It's full of idiots. < 1294015317 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I failed to realise this a few years ago and this mistake has hounded me since. < 1294015380 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294015400 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Has any drainage happened? < 1294015407 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, nope. < 1294015412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Also, I remember when I mocked RW and you went off in a huff. :p < 1294015415 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT WE HAVE CORRUPTED YOU NOW < 1294015435 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, I've been drifting for ages now. < 1294015446 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No I take credit thank you < 1294015454 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The fact that they couldn't deal with a *single* troll was annoying me. < 1294015469 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Look up "MarcusCicero" somewhere; the saga is hilarious. < 1294015475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/User:Armondikov Look at the wonderful self-quote at the top. < 1294015486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tl;dr Privacy is irrelevant because, lol, you gave someone your details so it's everything! < 1294015490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :“” — me < 1294015492 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There have been at least *3* major conflicts over whether or not a self-admitted troll should be blocked. < 1294015493 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in ITALICS < 1294015495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: X-D < 1294015508 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I say *conflicts* here. < 1294015527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: What is this WIGO thing on her page and why. < 1294015529 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The site was *haemorrhaging* users at points. < 1294015551 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, WIGO CP is the blow-by-blow report on Conservapedia; it spread from there. < 1294015582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I find it hard to believe that RW has not already exhausted the finite amount of lulz obtainable from Conservapedium. < 1294015591 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it has. < 1294015595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. < 1294015600 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That hasn't stopped anyone. < 1294015611 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well it's basically their driving force isn't it. < 1294015620 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Weeeeelll... < 1294015629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wasn't that what sparked its *creation*? < 1294015643 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but it isn't quite as CP-centric as it was. < 1294015670 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You seriously should look up MarcusCicero: the saga is utterly farcical. < 1294015710 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TL;DR is that the old guard of ex-CP members view blocking anyone at all as being "worse than CP" and refuse to do anything about it. < 1294015721 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/User:Armondikov/pearls < 1294015727 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a *series*. < 1294015747 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Click the edit button to see them all. < 1294015779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ex-CP members? Don't you mean ex-trolls? :p < 1294015792 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then again, one could argue that Conservapedia has actually turned into a satire wiki and its owner is just too dumb to realise that. < 1294015800 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no, I mean the people who signed up to CP to troll it when it started. < 1294015805 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. < 1294015810 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean ex-CP trolls. < 1294015840 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ex-{CP trolls} that is. < 1294015847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Ugh @ those pearls. < 1294015847 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1294015851 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1294015854 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Internet has destroyed all humbleness. < 1294015879 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lolol < 1294015885 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Random quotes that I like. They should be mostly mine, but attributed where possible." < 1294015890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You perhaps coming on MC or are you going to bed soon. < 1294015891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294015900 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should have gone to bed 50 minutes ago. < 1294015961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: did you ever get minecraft working btw? < 1294016015 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I think I would have to buy it to run it < 1294016023 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so no < 1294016053 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: classic runs in browser fine with sun jvm < 1294016056 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, it's what, £dirtcheap? < 1294016071 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You pay for the quality of the engineering. < 1294016075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: lawl < 1294016079 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all 0 quality < 1294016080 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294016083 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but alpha is a totally different game reallyf < 1294016084 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*really < 1294016090 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yeah, it's like non-standard analysis. < 1294016095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I would recommend buying it, but I'm biased. < 1294016108 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, you can help on the CUBE < 1294016114 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :INDEED < 1294016137 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, THINGS TO PUT IN THE CUBE: midair minecart track. < 1294016157 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Putting floors in seems really really boring.) < 1294016159 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# Once you've bought the game, it's yours. No DRM. <--- no source code though < 1294016179 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you can decompile it and make mods, people are crazy enough to < 1294016183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's even a deobfuscator :> < 1294016209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: no drm isn't strictly true ... it automatically updates on each run ... and if you don't authenticate with the server you can't do multiplayer so updates are pretty much forced. to be clear, notch is a terrible programmer, it's just that the game is /that/ fun < 1294016279 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw < 1294016289 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294016858 0 :Hiant!~Person@pool-71-246-67-35.bltmmd.east.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294017042 0 :Hiant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1294017174 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294017188 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ? < 1294017328 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/4Sn6v.jpg Holy fucking cube3. < 1294017493 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: On ^: "All this to play spleef?" < 1294017496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ^ < 1294017505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That would be the most epic game of Spleef ever. < 1294017518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Holy shit, they did all that digging in a week. < 1294017882 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Was that dug out, or was the bridge and walls built up? < 1294017895 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION guesses the former, based on what elliott just said, but how can you tell? < 1294017909 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It was dug out. < 1294017913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And because landscape don't come naturally like that. < 1294017928 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can't build walls like that? < 1294017934 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See the floor. < 1294017937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's flat stone with bedrock. < 1294017995 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, can I pm you? < 1294018024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure? < 1294018029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyone can PM me at any time :P < 1294018720 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, can I trick you into /nick'ing into something starting with Sgeo and mentioning Smalltalk? < 1294018833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: No. < 1294018996 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo_not_a_chanc < 1294019010 0 :Sgeo_not_a_chanc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aw, it got cut off < 1294019021 0 :Sgeo_not_a_chanc!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :oerjan < 1294019047 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: didn't work < 1294019060 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aw < 1294019069 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aw does not trigger shutup < 1294019076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not that dumb. < 1294019077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1294019084 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BAH < 1294019099 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo_once_more < 1294019118 0 :Sgeo_once_more!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Smalltalk Smalltalk Smalltalk < 1294019129 0 :Sgeo_once_more!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :oerjan < 1294019132 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BAH < 1294019140 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AW < 1294019404 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha! < 1294019419 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have finally found a popular language in which false == 1 and true == 0 < 1294019436 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and you all use it) < 1294019466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: shell. yes. < 1294019479 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well done there < 1294019516 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you ever manage to install linux on that laptop? < 1294019548 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294019608 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, why's that? < 1294019616 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: because it hates me < 1294019624 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in what way? < 1294019662 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm sure it doesn't *really* hate you, it might just be a bit hung up. < 1294019709 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, no - it hates him < 1294019744 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mov eh, 0xH8 ? < 1294020309 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Braid < 1294020313 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh < 1294020532 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Debian 6.0 "Squeeze" to be released with completely free Linux Kernel < 1294020695 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: what are the cube coordinates? < 1294020891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :found 'em < 1294021010 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wai/ < 1294021022 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's in the screenshot? < 1294021104 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ? < 1294021109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What screenshot < 1294021127 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The one that had that huge dug-out area < 1294021170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: some thing on the reddit server. < 1294021184 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Cube is a 128x128x128 cube under construction. I believe it is larger than dome3. < 1294021217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is also not on the reddit server. < 1294021507 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minecarts will crash the Reddit server? < 1294021509 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTF? < 1294021524 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: what? < 1294021535 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://code.reddit.com/wiki/help/faqs/Minecraft#MinecraftSubredditRules < 1294021584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Where does it say it will crash the server? < 1294021601 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hold on, browser's acting up < 1294021613 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Do Not Use Banned Items Current list is: Water, Ice, TNT, Fire, Tracks and Minecarts. They will crash the server, you will be banned." < 1294021669 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Where does it say it will crash the server? < 1294021674 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, there. < 1294021679 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: By crash it means because of server load. < 1294021694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover knows there are far more effective ways though. Cough. < 1294021780 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Grr, minecraft's acting up < 1294021799 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: You bought Minecraft? < 1294021817 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm playing with classic singleplayer < 1294021825 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Oh. *crapcraft < 1294021976 0 :Wamanuz4!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294022165 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I appear to have hit bedrock rather quickly < 1294022216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: That's what happens when all digging happens instantly. < 1294022220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is stupid. < 1294022245 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does current Minecraft do? < 1294022278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Um, different blocks take longer to dig? < 1294022282 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294022286 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1294022287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Classic is unlike Alpha in many, many ways. < 1294022498 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I didnt hit bedrock < 1294022524 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is freezing constantly one of them? < 1294022534 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Um, it doesn't freeze, no. < 1294022542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well. It does if you have rendering distance set too far. < 1294022546 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also *didn't. < 1294022557 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION hits elliott with a golem < 1294022658 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294022659 0 :augur_!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294022895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_log_reader: Who is Mei and why are they annoying. < 1294023071 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have reached some sort of underground cavern < 1294023087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Just buy the game. < 1294023112 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it's going to freeze constantly like classic is doing: No. < 1294023132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It isn't. < 1294023139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: For one you run it outside of your browser. < 1294023359 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lava does not, in fact, appear to be hot < 1294023389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It kills you in Alpha. < 1294023467 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is TNT useless in classic? < 1294023522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Yes. < 1294023553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Classic is basically a glorified tech demo that is endless amounts of fun if and only if you're the variant of autistic that just makes you want to build pointless structures with no obstacle or goal forever. < 1294023633 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ... I thought that was what Minecraft was about < 1294023694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Shit comes out at night to kill you. You build traps to catch them to get food to restore health and sulphur to make TNT to make cannons and shit to get rid of them. You explore the infinitely-generated terrain and stay alive. You mine for materials and build something awesome while staying alive. You network it all with a minecart network. You go to hell and back. etc. < 1294023708 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, so monsters and health are disabled on our server, but there's still an awful lot of exploring and mining. < 1294023719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With classic you can build anything by holding down right click for long enough. < 1294023725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's much more involved in Alpha. < 1294023762 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, worlds are infinitely huge? < 1294023764 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION happies < 1294023777 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Well. 4x the size of the Earth. < 1294023784 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: So: Yes. < 1294023791 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: (The coords have to fit into a 64-bit integer.) < 1294023811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And no, it is not possible to get to the edge in less than some hundreds of years.) < 1294023817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And it would probably just wrap around. < 1294023818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :) < 1294023840 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wants to try < 1294023865 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It's just $20. < 1294023872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Less when it was Alpha of course. < 1294023880 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: And that buys you the final game too. < 1294023913 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ... I have limited ways of getting what little money I have online < 1294023934 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: You're 21. Get a credit card. < 1294023939 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or at least a debit card. < 1294023944 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or anything? < 1294023954 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION will probably try to get a debit card < 1294023959 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hook it up to paypal < 1294023962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Try"? < 1294023967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're not going to ask your dad are you. < 1294023979 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... :/ < 1294023987 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've bugged my dad about it in the past < 1294023993 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're 21. Just go and get one. < 1294024062 0 :mtve!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1294024110 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Honestly. You're an adult. < 1294024121 0 :mtve!~mtve@65.98.99.53 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294024192 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are there any minable objects with no value in and of itself? < 1294024252 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Yes. < 1294024268 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any of them used as currency? < 1294024295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: No. All that it takes to mine anything is time and not much time at that (like 20s for obsidian, way less for everything else). < 1294024304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Currency is useless. There is no scarcity. It has no reason to exist. < 1294024340 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It might take a while to find areas where certain things exist? < 1294024356 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Mining is easy. < 1294024362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A mountain is bound to contain whatever it is, even if it's diamond < 1294024364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*diamond. < 1294024373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: But why? What need is there for currency? < 1294024795 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1294024862 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ... < 1294025570 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never understood why people fixate on decimal representations of things < 1294025794 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION imagines filling a huge pit with obsidian, leaving a small chute down, and having someone fall in < 1294025890 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OML8FtI_tGk&feature=related what's that blue tower? < 1294026134 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: A number of the CSC are working on a minecraft reimplementation (official working title: boxes). It will be released once the not-suckage level is reasonable, or probably when they get bored of it < 1294026143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Water. That's a really old version though. < 1294026145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The game does not look like that now. < 1294026164 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it sort of does. < 1294026227 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: also you forgot dbelange < 1294026234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Forgot him how. < 1294026237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: oh. < 1294026239 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: he's your suckpuppet < 1294026246 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hahahahahahahahahah < 1294026252 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: don't deny yo < 1294026267 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you want to say that to my face? < 1294026268 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1294026269 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1294026276 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294026349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: dbelang is your sockpuppet! < 1294026353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Directed at your face < 1294026358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*e < 1294026434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, RTF is based on LaTeX. < 1294026556 0 :BMG!~behold@d83-183-183-70.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1294026568 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294026574 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294026574 0 :BMG!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294026579 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :BeholdMyGlory < 1294026634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294027443 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's possible to build normally in The Nether, right? < 1294028576 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It has been confirmed that portals do not work in multiplayer yet; while they can be created, they can not teleport you." < 1294028577 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294028621 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294030733 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obsidian looks.... annoying to obtain < 1294030740 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mark my words, I will run an Obsidian farm < 1294033024 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :augur < 1294033093 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1294033194 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-174-34.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294034174 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294034922 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And thus, we get the surprising implication that, if aliens with infinite computational powers came to earth, they could not only beat humans at chess, but could also mathematically prove they were playing chess perfectly < 1294035005 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/chess/$GAME_FOR_WHICH_PERFECT_PLAY_NETS_A_WIN/ < 1294035708 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :int main[] = { 0x0A692568, 0x6AE08900, 0xB8905001, (int)printf, 0x44FFD0FF, 0x7C8104E4, 0x03E804E4, 0xEB7E0000, 0xECAFFEEB }; < 1294035710 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294036929 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nowwhat.net/transfers/RoseFactorizations.png < 1294036932 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er < 1294036934 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wellnowwhat.net/transfers/RoseFactorizations.png < 1294038089 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294038634 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1294040167 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294041006 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: lawl, what platform is that for? < 1294041058 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: surprising? < 1294041070 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is chess' solvability surprising? < 1294041078 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hell, even Go is solvable < 1294041261 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In principle, every game with no random element and many games with random elements are solvable. < 1294041471 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly < 1294041509 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in some games, solvability isn't the point < 1294041519 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those ones computers will not grasp for a long time < 1294041521 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Diplomacy) < 1294041599 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1294041600 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1294041639 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Chess and Go is obviously solvable if you mean mathematically (rather than practically) by "solvable". < 1294042631 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, is that the case? Is there conceivably a game, say with no randomness and infinite states, that is simply unsolvable? (although you could still solve a good enough subset to stump any human of course) < 1294042651 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: depends what you mean by solvable < 1294042657 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was just about to say that :) < 1294042673 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :More precisely, I was going to say "I suppose that depends on what you mean by solvable." < 1294042682 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe if it's infinite, you have the halting problem < 1294042733 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll say that it's solvable if there exists a program which is guaranteed to win or stalemate against any opponent, where infinitely-recurring-states and any in-game-defined stalemate are stalemates. < 1294042800 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed, then you have the halting problem < 1294042830 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not necessarily, I can easily define games with infinite states but trivial programs to win. < 1294042835 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1294042846 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the halting problem doesn't mean all programs are difficult to reason about < 1294042847 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just some < 1294042855 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although then I guess it starts to depend on your definition of "game", since corner cases are lame 8-D < 1294042886 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Do you mean the game "My Dad Has More Money Than You", in which there is infinite possibilities but it is easy to always the second player wins? < 1294042892 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Given an infinite tape, both players choose a cell and write a character there at the same time. The first player to write the character 'a' wins. If both characters write the character 'a' in the same turn, it's a stalemate." <-- solvable "infinite" game < 1294042906 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: sure < 1294042921 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Idonno that game :P < 1294042927 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: int main() { while (false) { } } // solvable "infinite" program < 1294042934 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Yup < 1294042952 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, in my previous "game" the enormous majority of cases are reducible into one, and your program has a single strictly-recurring state. < 1294043093 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294043108 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Errr < 1294043109 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it terminates immediately < 1294043116 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, read it as while true for some reason. < 1294043153 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any finite game is clearly solvable by a TM < 1294043167 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but does that extend to infinity? < 1294043175 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION doesn't know enough computational theory to say < 1294043175 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, let us, using our extraordinary #esoteric minds, invent a game which is playable with paper and pencil, has infinite state-space, and we suspect to be generally unsolvable (although it may be solvable for "reasonable" board sizes) < 1294043219 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Solvability of things with infinite states becomes very fuzzy, you have to prove you can collapse infinite states into finite states. < 1294043221 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: each person has a massive piece of a penrose tiling to start with < 1294043243 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: each move is the place one piece of tile, plus any others whose placement is forced by that one < 1294043255 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How massive is "massive" < 1294043262 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: sufficiently big < 1294043266 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe 25 pieces < 1294043275 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a player wins when their piece is replicated on the gameboard < 1294043312 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... you mean loses, right? < 1294043316 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, wins < 1294043329 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the players' pieces are not part of the board < 1294043349 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ohhhhhhhhhhh < 1294043363 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually I don't know if this one is potentially infinite < 1294043370 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I don't think it is. < 1294043377 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I think it is < 1294043381 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any state that's bigger than the gameboards is reducible I think. < 1294043395 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(To the union of several smaller states) < 1294043416 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh, sure, but you still need to get those states to appear on the board < 1294043416 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make a game that is known to be solvable if and only if Goldbach's conjecture is true. < 1294043422 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and remember, penrose tiling is aperiodic < 1294043436 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then prove it. < 1294043458 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I'm tempted < 1294043470 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Ohhhh, I see the trick ... that may in fact work, but it's hard to inject strategy into, since I'm betting it'd be nigh-on impossible to guess what will help you :) < 1294043489 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: indeed; you didn't say that guessability was a criterion :) < 1294043519 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, let us, using our extraordinary #esoteric minds, invent a game which is playable with paper and pencil, has infinite state-space, is fun, playable and strategic for humans, and we suspect to be generally unsolvable (although it may be solvable for "reasonable" board sizes) < 1294043529 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1294043532 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294043543 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm thinking something with graphs. < 1294043552 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how about N-in-a-row < 1294043598 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Something to do with if you get N in a row, then the opponent has f(N) turns to get N+1 in a row or you win. Then it repeats when they have N+1 < 1294043665 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1294043747 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So lesse. The gameboard is a giant (infinite) grid, you'd probably need a counter to keep track of turns too, one player starts by placing a single X, and then the opponent has to get two Os in a row within f(1) turns (f to be defined) ... with a few caveats I think we may be on to something doable. < 1294043810 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I should add one more requirement to my giant list above: The game has to be non-random. < 1294043846 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will tell you the "My Dad Has More Money Than You" game: First player says some integer. And then second player says an integer. Whoever says high number wins. Obviously second player can win. But there is an infinite number of choices. < 1294043855 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Does it also have to be complete information? Or not? < 1294043857 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: ah, yeah, I was assuming perfect information < 1294043885 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmmmm < 1294043895 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could go either way, opinions? < 1294043916 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: You can try it both ways to see what happens. < 1294043922 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The concern is really solvability, but it feels like a more impressive feat if you have a game that can't be solved and has no information hiding :) < 1294043940 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't look for such a game < 1294043952 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather, I'd prove its existence by showing equivalence to the halting problem < 1294043953 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :far simpler < 1294043975 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The point is to actually PLAY this game at some point too X-P < 1294044040 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, I have a sketch of the proof now < 1294044050 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :based upon a DFS of the game's state graph < 1294044055 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1294044057 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BFS < 1294044172 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have no flair for invention :P < 1294044326 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like category theory < 1294044366 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now make rock-paper-scissors game with two ducks. < 1294044391 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ducks? *two* ducks!? < 1294044398 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: JOIN US < 1294044404 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, join me :P < 1294044416 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: Yes. < 1294044418 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pooppy has gone off into proovy-land < 1294044450 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: apparently you're inventing some kind of game of strategy? strategy is boring... < 1294044497 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: Then play http://codu.org/wiki/Hydra , it has more randomness :P < 1294044525 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now make a game and prove that any strategy you come up with is provable to be the worst possible strategy that exists (worse than any others), no matter what strategy you select to make this proof. < 1294044567 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*worse or equally bad as < 1294044595 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: No. Strictly worse only. No equally bad as. < 1294044625 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"She's like the Internet with breasts! Oh wait, Internet has breasts." <-- House being funny < 1294044626 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: But nearly any strategy will have an almost-identical strategy with no game-relevant difference that performs equally poorly. < 1294044661 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Like with my game, always write "b" and always write "c" are equally-bad strategies, and with your game (as the second player), saying the other's number minus one and minus two are equally bad strategies. < 1294044761 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Then add that as the restriction and then consrtuct a proof for such a game with a proof of non-proof of non-proof of proof with the axiom of choice assuming it is a game with hidden information but no randomness. < 1294044819 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :First assume the axiom of choice is correct and then assume it is incorrect and then make a game from the results of the proof. < 1294044932 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I think if you make it the game has points at the end instead of just win/lose, then, for example, you have whatever number you said is the difference of you (winner's) and the other is your points. Now, there is no best strategy and no worst strategy. < 1294044975 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even though it is still easily the second player wins. < 1294045387 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :awesomeness < 1294045397 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can now switch desktops and invert colors in x simultaneously < 1294045400 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 xmonad < 1294045437 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... how ... useful? < 1294045454 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's very useful < 1294045457 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for not burning my eyes < 1294045568 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahhhh ... but why does that need to be associated with switching desktops oh of course because everything but your web browser is configured properly to be white-on-black. < 1294045693 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not quite everything < 1294045711 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but have you tried making a browser to white-on-black? < 1294045712 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impossible < 1294045729 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everyone and their brother explicitly specifies that the background color be white < 1294045790 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have. < 1294045793 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And yes, it's impossible. < 1294045801 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hence why I listed that one in particular :) < 1294045831 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I actually submitted a bug to Mozilla about problems with their (now, I believe, unsupported) settings to override page colors. < 1294045845 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A bug which sat for two years and then was closed as unresolved :P < 1294045874 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, there is a way < 1294045877 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :userChrome.css < 1294045884 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with !important styling tags < 1294045911 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!important styling tags in userChrome.css will override anything and everything in a web site's css < 1294045917 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nope, the bug wasn't with getting the colors in, it was with opacity issues resulting from that. < 1294045980 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Basically, since divs are by default transparent, if you a) force it to color them black, then you get weird effects when they're supposed to be transparent, or b) force it not to color them, you get unreadable stuff when they're supposed to be opaque. < 1294045996 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It didn't have any way to say "Make things which are opaque black" < 1294046056 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294046062 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think CSS allows for such a thing < 1294046080 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's not mozilla's fault < 1294046092 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's CSS' for not making alpha a separate propertyu < 1294046098 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you make it turn off alpha transparency and instead select opaque/transparent/background-color based on some simple algorithm to decide? < 1294046104 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: no < 1294046109 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not without JS that is < 1294046117 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a solid GreaseMonkey script could easily do it < 1294046795 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We've lost site of the awesome game :P < 1294046850 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sight < 1294047619 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1294047896 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why is there *no* command in TeX to check if a paragraph contains overfull lines? < 1294047976 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: how did you get interested in TeX? < 1294048083 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I use TeX for many things it is a better typesetting system than most. < 1294048100 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thdat's why I use it too < 1294048175 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also like the DVI format. < 1294048184 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1294048193 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I can write a program in Enhanced CWEB I can write TeX codes and C codes in the same file. < 1294048221 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think DVI format is simple and superior than PDF or others. < 1294048244 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't studied either but that sounds very likely < 1294048297 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PDF format is full of stupid stuff. < 1294048342 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-1-107.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294048368 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have figured out how to make a lot of things with TeX. But some things I just didn < 1294048375 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'t figure out. < 1294048544 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose it is possible to do some things by running the job twice and make it parse the log file from the first run. < 1294048842 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\begingroup\setbox0=\vbox{\noindent\vrule\par}\endgroup < 1294048850 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that guaranteed to reset the error count? < 1294050017 0 :dbc!~daniel@130-94-161-238-dsl.hevanet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294050088 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I might figure out one way in which we might figure out overfull boxes, because it adds a rule to end of each overfull line (hhox) in a paragraph. < 1294050148 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just before the rule (or at the end if there is no rule) is a \rightskip glue. < 1294050246 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let me try. < 1294051018 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It worked: http://sprunge.us/BXSK < 1294052952 0 :WAR!~phantomho@cpc1-sgyl29-2-0-cust788.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294053090 0 :WAR!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Phantom_Hoover < 1294053101 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294053101 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294055239 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"All indestructible permanents are removed from the game." < 1294055422 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1294058288 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294058291 0 :fxkr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294058294 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294058295 0 :sshc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294058304 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294058743 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294058933 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1294059221 0 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1294059221 0 :fxkr!~fxkr@unaffiliated/fxkr JOIN :#esoteric < 1294059221 0 :tswett!ihope@thay.Stanford.EDU JOIN :#esoteric < 1294059221 0 :sshc!~sshc@unaffiliated/sshc JOIN :#esoteric < 1294059221 0 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1294059315 0 :sshc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Max SendQ exceeded < 1294059364 0 :sshc!~sshc@unaffiliated/sshc JOIN :#esoteric < 1294059412 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : how is chess' solvability surprising? < 1294059491 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not the thing that has been proved < 1294059511 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the exact statement is subtle < 1294059601 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_if_ the aliens have infinite computational power (possibly more is needed than just to solve chess), _then_ they can convince a human being that they can solve chess perfectly, _in much less time than it would take for a human to understand how to do it_ < 1294059778 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or to rephrase, even if solving chess takes exponential time, they can convince a human of their ability to do it, in polynomial time < 1294059832 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it has not actually been proved that solving chess _does_ take exponential time, P ?= PSPACE is still a major unsolved problem) < 1294061823 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm this iwc is confusing, there are two parallel visits to the same room of hitler's headquarters, both iirc in 1940, but they are _not_ bumping into each other? < 1294061842 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course today's one's _are_ time travellers, but still... < 1294061846 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ones < 1294062108 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't figure out this muAgda language < 1294062122 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it uses the same variable name for different variables in its output < 1294062180 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, Agda? Bleurgh. < 1294062184 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not agda < 1294062220 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Actually, I think Agda is a fairly nice experiment in dependent types which is under the regrettable delusion that it is a proof assistant.) < 1294062236 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: do you know parametricity? < 1294062244 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, I do not! < 1294062252 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well the idea is quite simple < 1294062255 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It sounds wonderful! < 1294062260 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah it is! < 1294062364 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is it!? < 1294062370 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you ever noticed there are some things which are quite obvious just from the type of a function (but they can't be proved without looking at the definition) e.g. f :: [a] -> [a] can't "inspect" the elements 'a' because there are no typeclass constaints.. so map g . f = f . map g? < 1294062402 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or another example swap :: (a,b) -> (b,a) -- you know exactly what it does but you can't prove it unless you use the definition < 1294062585 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does not ring a bell? < 1294062633 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, yep. < 1294062677 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well then the idea of parametricity is to get these theorems (the ones that come just by inspecting the type) < 1294062719 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The language here implements it http://hackage.haskell.org/package/uAgda-1.0.0.1 < 1294062739 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294062746 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's quite hard to actually use though < 1294062747 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi elliott < 1294062753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1294062799 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: anyway I think one could make very good use of this parametricity < 1294062841 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So... why is it called uAgda? < 1294062884 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:04:03 It's possible to build normally in The Nether, right? < 1294062891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Uh, not really. The terrain is not very conducive. < 1294062895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:58:53 Obsidian looks.... annoying to obtain < 1294062895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:59:00 Mark my words, I will run an Obsidian farm < 1294062901 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not; you just need lava and water; and impossible. < 1294062936 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, with hmod's /sethome, /home and /spawn and loads of buckets you can construct very quickly. < 1294063001 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wishes Epigram 2 was further along in its development. < 1294063010 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, to mine obsidian, you need a diamond pick-axe, which requires diamond, which requires an iron pick-axe, etc. < 1294063022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Mining obsidian is a folly. < 1294063026 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: You create it in-place. < 1294063081 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My plot to have Edwin Brady kidnapped in order that I might then kidnap Conor McBride is regrettably dead in the water. < 1294063100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Why? < 1294063107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll go tell him. < 1294063139 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Operative says that I might as well write Epigram myself and says that effort of kidnapping Brady is greater than required to do so. < 1294063162 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: you and elliott should learn mu Agda < 1294063167 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Operative knows nothing of the nature of Epigram and as such cannot be swayed from this position. < 1294063179 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note to self: Don't build a fireplace in a wooden house < 1294063183 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LnjSWPxJxNs < 1294063184 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could use some help figuring it out :/ < 1294063190 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: "Kidnap me a fucking Ph.D., then." < 1294063191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: oh? < 1294063196 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, we have a wooden house with a fireplace, FWIW. < 1294063201 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On our server. < 1294063205 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is literally zero documentation < 1294063212 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That guy is just an idiot. < 1294063228 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1294063233 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: did you read the scrollback, I just explained the key feature of muAgda < 1294063240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: totalling doing so now < 1294063251 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I think I've figured out how to do quotients with it... < 1294063264 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: neat < 1294063278 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are these quotient things? < 1294063303 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: just like when you create modular arithmetic out of the integers using the equivalence relation < 1294063316 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(do you knhow that construction?) < 1294063320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:04:14 it's very useful < 1294063320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:04:17 for not burning my eyes < 1294063320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol @ people who think that white on black hurts eyes less < 1294063325 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lern2contrastandbrightness < 1294063365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:46:16 zzo38: how did you get interested in TeX? < 1294063365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:48:03 j-invariant: I use TeX for many things it is a better typesetting system than most. < 1294063365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:48:20 thdat's why I use it too < 1294063369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you probably use LaTeX < 1294063376 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yeah :/ < 1294063377 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38 thinks LaTeX is a horrible bloatware scourge ;) < 1294063378 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*:) < 1294063382 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wow < 1294063384 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then...he's zzo < 1294063389 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's pretty cool < 1294063393 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything is a horrible bloatware scourge < 1294063397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: hehe < 1294063402 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't even know which bits are TeX and which are LaTeX < 1294063412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: LaTeX is ... most of it < 1294063417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: raw TeX has nothing "semantic" < 1294063421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's all just raw formatting commands < 1294063422 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how is the Nether not conducive to building? < 1294063425 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and most of them don't take arguments < 1294063429 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's pretty imperative < 1294063431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not very nice < 1294063435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very manual < 1294063440 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: because the terrain sucks < 1294063463 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So just flatten it or something first < 1294063467 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, very rough terrain and everything's a cavern. < 1294063479 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION just wants to build a cannon for high-speed transport in the Nether >.> < 1294063483 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, there are exactly 3 building materials available. < 1294063487 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw uAgda *does* compile < 1294063489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :05:43:40 (Actually, I think Agda is a fairly nice experiment in dependent types which is under the regrettable delusion that it is a proof assistant.) < 1294063492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you stole that opinion from me < 1294063493 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :give it back < 1294063494 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :surprised me! you just have to cabal install some deps < 1294063503 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: lemme logread first < 1294063506 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(hint hint)_ < 1294063506 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I came to it of my own accord! < 1294063514 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wouldn't disagree either < 1294063517 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: um cannons can't make you travel fast ... and flattening the nether would involve MAJOR mining < 1294063526 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMJo_UNrtyo&NR=1 < 1294063532 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although the guy does die at the end < 1294063533 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wait. < 1294063545 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Find a lava lake, solidify it. < 1294063550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Well ... yeah. < 1294063557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: You will die. < 1294063562 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A large area of flat terrain upon which you can build. < 1294063567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Notice how he goes straight up. < 1294063571 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thought that you can't die on your server < 1294063571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Nice. < 1294063579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: If you have no health, then just swim across the lava... < 1294063646 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i will install uagda < 1294063660 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You need to mine out Obsidian to make portals... < 1294063664 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: in return i expect you to figure out how to boot ubuntu on this >:D < 1294063666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: no. < 1294063670 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: you just need buckets of lava and water. < 1294063677 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a brain. < 1294063679 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, I don't think you get it. < 1294063688 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still lava + water → obsidian. < 1294063690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Why Lisp is a Big Hack (And Haskell is Doomed to Succeed)" This post is going to be shit. < 1294063716 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: stupid quote of the day: "(When I say Haskell, I'm not only speaking about Haskell per se, but also about all the FP languages in its halo, like Ωmega, Agda, Epigram, ...)" < 1294063724 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that makes zero sense < 1294063738 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's written by a lisper nothing they say makes any sense < 1294063760 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you want to speak about FP languages, say "Functional languages" < 1294063829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linking dist/build/cmdargs/cmdargs ... < 1294063830 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ld: warning: in /opt/lib/libiconv.dylib, file was built for unsupported file format which is not the architecture being linked (i386) < 1294063837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: get ubuntu working and i'll be able to install uAgda < 1294063861 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: The only way I ever got ubuntu to boot was off a CD - and it had to be a specific older version < 1294063887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on a mac? < 1294063892 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294063897 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i have booted ubuntu off a usb stick but it was on an older machine < 1294063907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so bleh... i'll get it working later < 1294063913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guess what i get to do now THAT'S RIGHT rebuild things! < 1294063928 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I want to be able to test a incomplete program, even if it hasn't been type checked fully" *_* < 1294063936 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X_X < 1294063943 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :knee jerk sort of thing to say < 1294064064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i honestly think all the lispers are desperately clinging at ways to say they're more expressive and interaction and rapid development than all these blasted new bondage and discipline languages ... kinda sad really :p < 1294064097 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Notch codes so badly that a 10FPS speed boost is trivial: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=123503 < 1294064155 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is completely insane. < 1294064239 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :frankly, stuff like Haskell isn't strong enough for me < 1294064270 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Strong as in...? < 1294064271 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know how /anyone/ sucessfully programs in that language < 1294064335 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm? < 1294064359 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even with extensions like SHE I can't do what I want < 1294064430 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do you want? < 1294064441 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know the answer to that :( < 1294064491 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294064495 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm assuming you aren't writing run-of-the-mill programs. < 1294064551 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I just write normal stuff < 1294064654 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus proofs are "eternal" < 1294064654 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So how do you fail to do it? < 1294064674 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a sufficiently good dependently typed langauge we shouldn't have to re-implement the same nonsense a million times < 1294064749 0 :sftp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294064855 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, example? < 1294064865 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of what? < 1294065025 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The same nonsense. < 1294065255 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, I would still like recommendations on new computery things. < 1294065273 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NB: I still have no idea whether or not I would like a laptop or desktop. < 1294065563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Do you actually ever use it elsewhere. < 1294065605 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, I move rooms occasionally, and I am forced to go to Ireland most holidays... < 1294065619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Is your current laptop insufficient for those purposes? < 1294065626 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no. < 1294065632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Buy a desktop then, < 1294065635 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*then. < 1294065639 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although the battery is completely screwed. < 1294065666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's electricity in Ireland. I think. < 1294065711 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, are you sure? < 1294065720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well. Not really. < 1294065774 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, IIRC there wasn't broadband in the specific village I stay in until fairly recently. < 1294065775 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, this crash bug you mentioned, have you reported it? < 1294065788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I doubt fizzie would like that. < 1294065791 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the house within the village remains landlineless. < 1294065793 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, eh? < 1294065798 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's teleportation. < 1294065801 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294065803 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294065803 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, the GPU or MC one? < 1294065809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The MC one. < 1294065809 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, MC. < 1294065812 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I'm not going to tell notch. < 1294065817 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good then < 1294065822 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Besides, his fix would probably be... very ... interesting. < 1294065828 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For one thing, he is clearly unable to fix it competently. < 1294065831 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also it's useful just so long as nobody else finds out ever. For our personal use. < 1294065850 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For another, can you imagine what would happen if a serious griefer got their hands on it? < 1294065861 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294065863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. The reddit creative server would go down every five minutes. < 1294065868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then what would we do Phantom_Hoover! < 1294065868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ha ha. < 1294065871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I am sure that will never happen. < 1294065882 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thing That Would Be Much Nicer If Minecraft Did Antialiasing: the Tronic pack. < 1294065909 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you file a CVE against any sort of software (no I'm not about to do that, just the thought of a CVE against minecraft sounds hilarious) < 1294065913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's nice, so long as you only look at things from the right angle. < 1294065919 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I believe so. < 1294065922 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294065932 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: But in this case "full disclosure" means "full anarchy". < 1294065943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ordinarily I woul dapprove, but Notch is just so helpless. < 1294065944 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CVE? < 1294065960 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1294065961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Csomething Vsomething Esomething. < 1294065965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HTH < 1294065971 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, usually they tell the vendor a few days before the full disclosure iirc < 1294065976 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No. < 1294065982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That's one of the infinity "Responsible Disclosure" policies. < 1294065984 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, that would be deeply hilarious. < 1294065990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Full disclosure, the most common practice, is instant full disclosure. < 1294065996 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm okay < 1294066004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: This is for the best because if history proves anything, it's that vendors really don't give a shit. < 1294066008 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The entire Mojang workforce would be dedicated to fixing it before we made it public. < 1294066010 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, right < 1294066028 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And would fail, naturally. < 1294066041 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: They'd probably throw legal threats at us or something. < 1294066046 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh. < 1294066047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's ILLEGAL to reveal that! You're a bad person! < 1294066050 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're letting the terrorists win! < 1294066055 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Have you tried the Tronic texture pack, btw? < 1294066062 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I've seen it. < 1294066066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It's my single-colour texture pack, except actually nice. < 1294066069 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, link? < 1294066073 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION prefers Painterly. < 1294066075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://evilmousestudios.com/tronic/ < 1294066086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: See screenshots at the bottom. < 1294066103 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite nice, but I think I'll stick to painterly < 1294066128 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm is tronic "high res"? Or is it just the smooth colours that make it look that way? < 1294066136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's 32x32. < 1294066141 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294066145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I think those screenshots have been cubically downscaled though. < 1294066150 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's more jaggedy in practice. < 1294066164 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Painterly is kinda nice but I get the feeling (and drama on /r/Minecraft) agrees that the creator doesn't really know what they're doing. < 1294066168 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mc: the only context where 32x32 would be called HD during 2011. < 1294066173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The defaults are... really inconsistent, for one. < 1294066174 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And weird. < 1294066180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plus, a lot of them don't tile really well. < 1294066195 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I think they're working on the individual tiles without thinking about how they fit into the world. < 1294066195 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Painterly is kinda nice but I get the feeling (and drama on /r/Minecraft) agrees that the creator doesn't really know what they're doing. <-- fitting. Nor does notch. < 1294066199 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or what do you mean? < 1294066209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, X is really pretty, but when you have a gigantic world of X, Y and Z, it's just too noisy with detail. < 1294066213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X being a single block. < 1294066218 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, true < 1294066227 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Somewhere in-between would be nicest. < 1294066227 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you have to customise painterly to get a good result < 1294066233 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but I can't stand the default cobble < 1294066236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I have. < 1294066247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I have cobble that looks like little circular markings (not perfect circles) on stone. < 1294066249 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Light stone. < 1294066255 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, probably the same < 1294066272 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Do you have painterly's water enabled? < 1294066286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's really nice but you need mcpatcher to do it. Or manually editing the jar. < 1294066288 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I picked the actual grid-shaped cobble. < 1294066295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Grouse. < 1294066295 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, last I looked it said it required some "non-standard" mod and it seemed like more work. < 1294066303 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so no < 1294066308 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it looked most like actual cobblestones! < 1294066308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: "non-standard"? It's easy, you just run the jar, pick the pack, and check a few boxes. < 1294066311 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's pretty common. < 1294066344 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=123503 ... tried it? < 1294066361 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Nope. It's incompatible with Better Light. < 1294066365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Also it makes no difference on multiplayer. < 1294066365 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, because single player is pretty much unplayable in beta for me. < 1294066368 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on my desktop < 1294066370 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Try it then. < 1294066374 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Results seem good from all responders. < 1294066382 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: And the technical details look sound (and prove how stupid Notch is). < 1294066413 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I wonder what META-INF is and why it should be deleted. Hm. < 1294066418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Some cache I think. < 1294066426 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dunno. < 1294066426 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a cache, in a jar? < 1294066428 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1294066437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I think it stores, like, a directory? Don't ask me. < 1294066442 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294066452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Can I make the map in mcmap turnable-off by an option? Amusing, I know, but I play fullscreen and so can't really use the map, but //goto is super-useful. < 1294066453 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :META-INF contains the .jar metadata. < 1294066458 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The manifest thing thing. < 1294066464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Failing that I'll just fork or something. Or rewrite it in ML. :p < 1294066464 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure. < 1294066468 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, can't it be minimised? < 1294066473 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :". In vanilla Minecraft, the entire list is sorted by distance from the player every frame" < 1294066473 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Still takes up CPU. < 1294066476 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION mindboggles < 1294066477 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though the name "mcmap" makes it a bit silley. < 1294066481 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not very much you claimed! < 1294066481 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I disable the map don't need to keep track of chunks do I? < 1294066494 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Dude, I use Better Light, Far, and Fancy. < 1294066504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: *Any* CPU is lots of CPU for me. < 1294066504 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why doesn't the patch help in multiplayer? < 1294066521 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, right. < 1294066522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Because chunks update when the server decide. < 1294066524 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*decides. < 1294066533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I'll make my own texture pack that's like Painterly but less ornate. < 1294066577 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Does //goto need to know what chunks are around? Only for "omg no sky", right? < 1294066585 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only for that check, right. < 1294066608 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It currently barfs if you try to invoke it from a chunk it hasn't seen. < 1294066621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Welp, us no-mapsters don't need no safety. < 1294066624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I'll add a prompt. < 1294066626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is the sky visible? [y/n] < 1294066630 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294066639 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A more healthier sort of //goto would need the map for route-planning. < 1294066651 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The sort of an auto-walk style //goto.) < 1294066653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do not goto while pregnant. < 1294066673 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'll also commit my make-it-work-on-OS-X fixes and *oh* joy I just realised I have to rebuild glib. < 1294066735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Committ'd. < 1294066743 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :& push't no less. < 1294066794 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incy-dentally, keeping track of these compiles is quite a pain: http://sprunge.us/eXUZ < 1294066808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I might just abandon this manual stow system. In fact, yes, I will. Goodbye, /opt. < 1294066817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone give me Ubuntu. Or a stiff drink. < 1294066837 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so stow wasn't good then? < 1294066850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Stow itself performed perfectly; compiling everything by hand was not fun. < 1294066859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Especially as glib is 32-bit only or something for god knows what reason or I don't know and ugh. < 1294066879 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't care what Homebrew recommends I'm installing it into /opt, like a decent person. < 1294066880 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, blame OS X for crazy 64-bit situation < 1294066895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: "Crazy"? It's about as sane as a pure 64-bit migration can be (i.e. not very). < 1294066909 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you're a compiler now? < 1294066915 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well why did they go 32-bit on intel at all? < 1294066923 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Because Core 2 wasn't out yet ... < 1294066927 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah.... < 1294066945 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: In fact the first test Mac Pros given to developers were Pentium 4-based. < 1294066950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The first released Intel Macs were based on Core. < 1294066994 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Quick lesson: Core is based on the Pentium M architecture. Core 2 is based on the Core architecture. No not Core 2, Core. < 1294067000 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yet linux managed to go 64-bit without all this mess. Sure there was still some problems but mostly from programmers messing up int, long and void* during a lot of years. < 1294067009 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Core is not based on Core, Core 2 is based on Core, and Core 2 has no relation to Core, but it is built in Core. < 1294067026 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, err what < 1294067031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Confused yet? < 1294067038 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, are there two different things called "Core"? < 1294067052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Core[CPU] is not based on Core[arch], Core 2[CPU] is based on Core[arch], and Core 2[CPU] has no relation to Core[CPU], but it is built on Core[arch]. < 1294067058 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294067060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Linux transitioned to 64-bit by way of "take something like 7 years to do it". < 1294067068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not really a viable business strategy. < 1294067069 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, incidentally, shouldn't //goto fail if you try to enter the Cube? < 1294067076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It does. Usually. < 1294067087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Why does world have a capital .C on the end. < 1294067098 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001f5b00390f-CM001e6b2335dc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294067133 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, actually... I ran 64-bit back when you still ran into the "stored pointer into an int" kind of issue daily. And really that was the only major portability issue. I could just patch it and store it in a portage overlay and file a bug (yes I ran gentoo back then) < 1294067182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Guess what isn't an option for OS X users? < 1294067190 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Patching it and storing it in a portage overlay. < 1294067193 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294067203 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294067243 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There shouldn't be any capital .Cs. < 1294067254 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Well there iz. < 1294067255 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but anyway, if you can recompile the software then migration is pretty swift. The vast majority of the software that isn't JITing or similar will probably work. (possibly after changing an int to a long somewhere or such) < 1294067261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Possibly OS X's fault. < 1294067270 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are none in the github web-view. < 1294067281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Well, HFS is case-insensitive, so lulz happen < 1294067283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*happen. < 1294067284 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Foodcraft. → < 1294067295 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION looks at (0,0) again. < 1294067296 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Weird. < 1294067300 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not capital C for me < 1294067306 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it's on your side yeah < 1294067330 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/usr/local/Cellar/git/1.7.3.4: 965 files, 18M, built in 51 seconds < 1294067332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gotta wonder why it tells me that. < 1294067335 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, bug report: < 1294067337 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cc1: error: unrecognized command line option "-fnested-functions" < 1294067339 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's an island of 3 pre-Halloween chunks surrounded on all sides by post-Halloween terrain for at least 5 chunks on all sides. < 1294067340 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Oh man, 51 seconds! I'd better optimise my C compiler!" < 1294067342 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what is this about? < 1294067348 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: God DAMMIT, Apple. < 1294067368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Apparently when they decided to turn off nested functions by default (why?) they added an option to turn it back on that nobody else has! < 1294067376 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GUESS THE MAKEFILE'S GOTTA USE UNAME < 1294067392 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well it doesn't exist on any gcc version I have (4.3, 4.4 and 4.5) < 1294067454 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Appropriately profanity-laden commit pushing now. < 1294067459 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fucking fuckity fuck. < 1294067485 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why not just a "checking if compiler has -fnested-functions" thing? ;) < 1294067513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Hardy harf harf. < 1294067524 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's a bug in Apple's compiler, it doesn't need to be worked-around cleanly :P < 1294067534 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294067538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That's basically what's wrong with autoconf: it checks for features; it should check for bugs. < 1294067564 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: And checking for bugs (which it calls features) never works because everyone's bugs are subtly different so it ends up basically checking what compiler you have in a really roundabout, slow way. < 1294067579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because, dammit, people play Minecraft on SunOS and they want to use mcmap. < 1294067630 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION decides he's getting too sane, takes a look at useful.make. < 1294067646 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$(objdir)/$(1): $(2:%.c=$(objdir)/%.o) Makefile | $(objdir) ; \ < 1294067646 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : $(call do-template,LINK,$(objdir)/$(1),$(cc.link) -o $(objdir)/$(1) \ < 1294067646 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : $(2:%.c=$(objdir)/%.o)) < 1294067647 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm I now want to try this with some compiler that will error on -std=gnu99 < 1294067647 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$(if $(cleaning),,-include $(2:%.c=$(objdir)/%.d)) < 1294067649 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote that? < 1294067653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't remember writing that. < 1294067655 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what icc will do < 1294067656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did I write that? < 1294067668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HOW did I write that. < 1294067680 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what does it mean? < 1294067725 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/types/comments/ev708/the_dialectica_interpertation_in_coq/c1b9pfa < 1294067731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I think it means Zalgo. < 1294067733 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HUH CLEVER... NOT HEARD THAT ONE BEFORE < 1294067737 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: But, um, that's the rule for linking a C program. < 1294067742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, part of it. < 1294067748 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeargh < 1294067763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: $(1) is the final program name, $(2) are the C files, space-separated. < 1294067781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's relatively easy to figure out if you know that but, yeck. < 1294067786 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: did you know < 1294067787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: co < 1294067787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :q < 1294067789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: sounds like cock < 1294067792 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, downside of useful.make: simple to use but you are left completely clueless should you ever do something that makes it break ;) < 1294067793 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: which is a colloquial term for penis < 1294067796 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha INSTANT HILARITY < 1294067807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ABSOLUTELY. And I wrote it! < 1294067821 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well you could probably manage it. But anyone else? < 1294067833 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg! XD < 1294067838 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, I had to debug useful.make when I first put it into practice and it was impossible. < 1294067853 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah... < 1294067860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: wow that Coq code is really elegant < 1294067862 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even the proofs < 1294067867 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm going to kill him and steal his powers < 1294067875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*kill him, steal his heart, and absorb his powers < 1294067875 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: makes me happy that the comment is -1 < 1294067888 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, at least a simple self-contained makefile tends to be easy to understand. < 1294067894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it's /r/types, more highbrow than the other reddits :P < 1294067901 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294067905 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :simple = fits on a screen, or at most two < 1294067906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Not really. Nobody truly understands what Make does. < 1294067914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: They think Make works logically, and interpret the Makefile accordingly. < 1294067916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems simple. < 1294067925 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But in fact it is only for now that their view coincides. < 1294067930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Soon Make will ravage them with its incomprehensibility. < 1294067980 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, "# This code is licensed under the WTFPL, version 2" <-- how could they possible need a second version? < 1294068002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I forget what version 1 was. < 1294068013 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I think it was literally just the sentence "You just DO WHAT THE FUCK YOU WANT TO." < 1294068021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: And then Sam Hocevar made the expanded version. < 1294068026 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1294068031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Only v2 is FSF-certified :P (On a mailing list!) < 1294068049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[ An interesting side-anecdote. I was talking to Bradley Kuhn < 1294068049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :last year sometime, and he says the FSF's folks had to laugh and agree < 1294068049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that "DO WHAT THE FUCK YOU WANT" is a valid Free Software license (I < 1294068050 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :think they had received a submission with that string attached). I < 1294068052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :suggested that perhaps a useful short license with indemnification of < 1294068054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :warranty could be "Do what you want, but it's not my fault!"]] < 1294068078 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1294068084 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why are klingons and vulcans and humans so similar? < 1294068112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: because the human form is pure perfection^Uactors are cheap < 1294068127 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, because it's cheaper that way yeah < 1294068140 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but seriously? < 1294068155 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there no reason? < 1294068169 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, budget most probably < 1294068182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[On rape, the left still doesn't get it < 1294068182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I admire Julian Assange for his work on WikiLeaks, but that doesn't rule out the possibility that he has committed sex crimes]] --Guardian article
Wow, yes, it's pure coincidence that the allegations appeared RIGHT AFTER Assange became a public figure! The fact that one of the women involved published an insane "guide to revenge" including mentioning accusing someone of rape if they cheated on you (IIRC) — who cares! Silly leftist < 1294068182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s. Sigh. < 1294068194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*article \n < 1294068206 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder why the Guardian likes to hire someone stupid to write an article every now and then. < 1294068216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover linked to that anti-mathematics-education one a while back. < 1294068390 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, erm, that wasn't someone stupid they'd hired as a one-off. < 1294068397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I know that. < 1294068400 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That was Simon Jenkins, one of their most prominent columnists. < 1294068404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I didn't mean they actively hired. < 1294068411 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: WHY AM I TERRIBLE AT SENTENCES < 1294068424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I was using it non-literally in a case where it makes perfect sense to use "hire someone stupid to" literally. < 1294068430 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it's the "every now and then". < 1294068443 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yes. < 1294068458 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jenkins is a noted hater of science. < 1294068625 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294068691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Is opt exposed to the other files? < 1294068832 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :God, Digg is just... dead. < 1294068860 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Not yet, but you can make it to be. < 1294068883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I might just if I can forget my revelation of the past few seconds that everything in the code is tied to the map :P < 1294068905 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, isn't that nautral for something called mcmap? < 1294068907 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it *is* called "mc*map*", it might be a bit map-oriented. < 1294068912 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Xactly. < 1294068918 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Elsewhere again.) < 1294068934 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294068954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well I don't WANT to have to fork it and call it sml-mc-instant-server-crasher! < 1294068960 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Otherwise Phantom_Hoover_ would be unstoppable. < 1294068996 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh < 1294069085 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is packet_format in .data and not .rodata btw? < 1294069104 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :means it can't be shared between multiple instances (har har) < 1294069121 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294069171 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why is it that almost every non-trivial C project ends up with a header named something like common.h, global.h, shared.h or such... < 1294069183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Because files suck. < 1294069194 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah indeed < 1294069266 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also hfs being case insensitive sounds like it would really make a mess of the unix semantics. Besides wouldn't it be locale dependent? < 1294069277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did not know that SoyLatte was X11-based. < 1294069288 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how does HFS handle the German ß (isn't it ss in lower case or something?)? < 1294069296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Unix semantics aren't case-sensitive AFAIK. And I think it uses the same algorithm always. < 1294069310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Elliott-Hirds-MacBook-Air:mcmap ehird$ touch ß; mv ß ss < 1294069310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Elliott-Hirds-MacBook-Air:mcmap ehird$ < 1294069322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So ß is distinct. < 1294069329 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what about ö vs Ö ? < 1294069349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, wait, "mv a A" works. < 1294069359 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll try it another way. < 1294069378 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ö = Ö; \ss != ss < 1294069384 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294069427 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and once you leave the latin scripts, things get really messy < 1294069511 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes, well, it is based on HFS, as in 1984 HFS. < 1294069541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: They were going to change to ZFS but then ... didn't. < 1294069551 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(A year or two ago.) < 1294069558 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well right. But at least back during pre-OS X era they didn't try to shoehorn it into unix < 1294069570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Better than Mac OS Classic :P < 1294069590 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, certainly, but at the file system isn't really fit for something unixy < 1294069597 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, isn't : still forbidden in filenames? < 1294069611 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Nope, you can put : in a filename just fine. It'll show up as / in Finder though. < 1294069622 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SCIENCE < 1294069624 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ... awesome < 1294069635 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: This is actually pretty useful to name things with /s in them X-D < 1294069646 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Finder translates back automatically, so you can name files foo/bar. < 1294069672 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I wonder what is actually stored in the fs < 1294069675 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect / in fact < 1294069691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I imagine it's translated to : and back at the POSIX layer. < 1294069698 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which I imagine is separate from the underlying FS implementation. < 1294069720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Things like iTunes at least as of a year or two ago would actually show the paths to audio files using the : notation if you can believe that. < 1294069721 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well I imagine it is stored as a / on disk though, to not break compatibility with old HFS and MacOS < 1294069726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mac OS Classic heritage, woo < 1294069731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Indeed. < 1294069764 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, in fact the issue seems to be that if you changed it now you would break compat compared to previous OS X versions < 1294069778 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, impossible to change without breaking compat at the point of change. < 1294069790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Mandatory conversion step :P < 1294069802 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can imagine they want to avoid it. < 1294069890 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I think the best option would be to make a new char for path separator. That way there is no conflict < 1294069900 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, a new unicode codepoint < 1294069905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Say NUL. < 1294069910 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for efficiency it should probably be stored as a NUL though < 1294069912 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294069928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Or how about we store everything as objects!!1111 < 1294069938 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, In OS X? < 1294069943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The problem with improving filesystems is that if you go too far the filesystem disappears :P < 1294069970 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, while I'm all for what you suggest fitting that into a "traditional" OS sounds.... painful < 1294069991 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pah. < 1294069993 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@@@@@@ < 1294070013 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you complain it doesn't exist yet, it's useless until you own a large SSD anyway :P < 1294070027 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, sure. But apple is not going to switch OS X to use that overnight. Especially since not a single line of code of it exists anywhere < 1294070037 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Why not. < 1294070043 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why not what? < 1294070049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why won't they. < 1294070053 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's perfect! < 1294070124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Vorpal: -m now takes the map out of mcmap, leaving mc. < 1294070131 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Even if it is (I don't want a discussion about that atm, it's all too subjective anyway), since when has large companies ever been sane and perfectly rational at compsci. < 1294070143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It should do something like "use much less memory and CPU". < 1294070145 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :case in point: ipv6 migration. Companies are not perfectly rational. < 1294070161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Clearly Apple should become an anarchist commune? < 1294070163 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so -m means that it just sits there and listens for //goto and //coords? < 1294070169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Yes. < 1294070175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: And lets you chat/read chats from the console. < 1294070185 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I have no good answer to that statement. < 1294070218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: What you're saying is YEP INDEED < 1294070219 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but it still links to SDL. You should make it a compile time option, no? < 1294070231 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Not really. < 1294070234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does it matter if it links to SDL? < 1294070246 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no it definitely isn't!. What I'm saying is closer to "undefined" < 1294070260 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, wait. < 1294070265 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mcmap actually does "while (1);" right now. < 1294070270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So by "less CPU usage" I mean "full CPU usage". < 1294070277 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, :D < 1294070279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION fixes < 1294070284 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION watches videos on moulding obsidian < 1294070297 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, as long as you don't break the traditional map stuff < 1294070306 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, in real life? or mc? < 1294070311 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mc < 1294070326 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm yeah I doubt you would mould it in real life < 1294070358 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, would it be better to place lava into water rather than douse some lava in a mould? < 1294070375 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, that way you just need a flooded chamber open at the top. < 1294070413 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, I think it sounds harder to do it that way. Specifically it sounds tricky to get it in the right place < 1294070418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interestingly mcmap still shows as not responding ...but it only uses 0.1 CPU. And 7 megabytes of real memory. < 1294070431 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, does it work in map mode? < 1294070436 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1294070439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably. < 1294070445 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't actually test it but there's no reason it shouldn't. < 1294070482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pushed a non-98%-CPU-usage patch. < 1294070485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*no= < 1294070486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*no- < 1294070489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only relevant if you use nomap really. < 1294070493 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which ONLY I DO < 1294070493 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, better check to make sure < 1294070496 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I can't atm) < 1294070506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Nope, it's mcmap tradition to not test commits in any way whatsoever. < 1294070507 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not when compiling a C++ program with -j2) < 1294070522 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(specifically debug build of llvm) < 1294070527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Technically I broke the rules even by checking that no map popped up. < 1294070541 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, FWIW, I think using that method placing obsidian is as simple as placing any other block underwater. < 1294070573 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, trickier to deal with if you make a mistake though. Not as simple as simply bucketing it up again. < 1294070595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no shit? < 1294070603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obsidian misplaces are fatal anyway < 1294070605 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, oh, fair point, < 1294070617 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hardly. But they are annoying < 1294070649 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, mining obsidian is after all very slow < 1294070700 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION imagines building huge minecraft tracks in the Nether < 1294070709 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When will the Nether be available in multiplayer? < 1294070719 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, minecart tracks < 1294070740 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm what are the monster spawning rules in nether. Surely not the same light level as for the "real world"? < 1294070783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The server has been so kwiet recently. < 1294070787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Maybe never. < 1294070795 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Portals are apparently going to teleport to other servers by default. < 1294070808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could maybe do a mod for it, but it'd be very involved. OTOH Notch might add portals that go to the Nether in SMP anyway. < 1294070831 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, linky? < 1294070831 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you could do two server. A normal one and a nether one. No? < 1294070836 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Link to what. < 1294070843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, yes, but inventory would not transfer, would it? < 1294070844 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :servers* < 1294070847 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your source for " Portals are apparently going to teleport to other servers by default." < 1294070850 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, who knows < 1294070855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: My source is Notch. < 1294070869 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I think I read something about he planned to make it possible to configure servers to trust a list of other ones < 1294070872 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something such < 1294070875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Ah. < 1294070898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Better if he never even realised the potential. Start local server, gift yourself TNT ... < 1294070940 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wouldn't it even require configuring of which server was the teleport target anyway? < 1294070945 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How difficult is it to obtain sulfur? < 1294070951 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes. But it'd be quite easy. < 1294070960 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Kill creepers or find it in a dungeon. < 1294070965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On our server, ask HHI; get laughed at. < 1294070987 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could also ask Vorpal but he'd probably ask you what you've done and follow you around for days rather than just laughing at you. < 1294071015 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, doesn't ghasts drop sulphur too? < 1294071026 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh, maybe. Killing creepers is easier and less traumatising. < 1294071031 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HHI? < 1294071039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: "Turns out the team that made Father Ted were Irish! Ireland is now officially better than England." ~~~~~~~~Notch < 1294071045 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Note: The more ~s I use, the more sarcastic I am being.) < 1294071049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Hoover Heavy Industries. < 1294071113 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do creepers and ghasts even exist on the server? < 1294071117 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, no. < 1294071138 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, HHI is Phantom_Hoover_'s and elliott's fictional joke company. Specialising in uncompleted projects based on observational data. < 1294071141 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The HHI reserves were made in about 20 minutes by elliott using a duplication glitch. < 1294071173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: CLASSIFIED. < 1294071176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :INFOR. < 1294071176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MATION. < 1294071186 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, actually, HHI was originally founded in order that ROU abandonment would be easier. < 1294071194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Also t'was more like 15 minutes. < 1294071195 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, oh? < 1294071197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"abandonment"? < 1294071205 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do dungeons exist? < 1294071215 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, yep < 1294071227 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I haven't added to it ever since I realised there wasn't a hope in hell of MoveCraft working with something that huge. < 1294071228 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume that's where elliott got the initial sulphur? < 1294071242 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where *I* got the initial gunpowder. < 1294071250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT'S CALLED SULPHUR LOL < 1294071271 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't think he named it officially before beta added the labels < 1294071272 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I REFUSE TO LISTEN TO AN IDIOT WHO DOESN'T KNOW CHEMISTRY < 1294071285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: It's TNTnamite. < 1294071290 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sulphur makes TNTnamite. < 1294071299 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That annoys me too. < 1294071310 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gunpowder != nitroglycerine != TNT. < 1294071364 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They are all completely different compounds. < 1294071372 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it is a different TNT < 1294071379 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, what. < 1294071391 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that stands for Tsulphur aNd sandT or something < 1294071396 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294071399 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tsulphur. < 1294071409 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sandt. < 1294071411 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well yeah. I blame notch < 1294071430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pmw7JfsNzoY < 1294071437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An educational program about Tsulphur. < 1294071444 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :third world war? blame notch. End of world? blame notch < 1294071506 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lost car keys? guess who to blame! That's right, Notch. < 1294071536 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, wait, have you actually bought MC? < 1294071544 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, no, but planning to < 1294071545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: No. He's obsessing about it first. < 1294071607 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: http://www.ehow.com/how_4777739_debit-card.html < 1294071628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Note lack of step 1, "ask father" < 1294071863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: http://www.pcgamer.com/2010/10/20/mind-blown-minecraft-to-link-servers-with-portals/ < 1294071952 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Awesome < 1294071960 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, ahahahahaha < 1294071968 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294071981 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, that will either a) never happen or b) it will happen and mining will break. < 1294071992 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/mining/anything else you actually want to do/ < 1294072009 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: What will never happen. < 1294072015 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the portal thing. < 1294072025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: I think it relies on a list of trusted servers. < 1294072037 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, he hasn't even got Nether portals working at all. < 1294072050 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, hm? < 1294072068 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, we have a portal sitting near spawn. It doesn't work. < 1294072086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does make noises though. < 1294072129 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Sgeo, we have a portal sitting near spawn. It doesn't work. <-- I suspect he thought linking servers would be easier than making the server handle two worlds < 1294072137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh. < 1294072148 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I hate how the Nether transition isn't seamless. < 1294072157 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, because it unloads and loads yes < 1294072165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Couldn't he load a few Nether chunks etc. when you come in the vicinity of a Nether portal, in the background? < 1294072167 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then it could be instant. < 1294072174 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, probably due to global state messing up < 1294072184 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: lol. < 1294072186 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(probably same reason for servers) < 1294072236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SOMEONE GET ON MINECRAFT ORELSE < 1294072254 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Beta has far fewer vertical voxels than Classic, yes? < 1294072309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Indeed. < 1294072317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: classic maps could be 2048x2048x2048 if you had infinity ram. < 1294072337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: See e.g. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19PZA1tnKtg < 1294072348 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a ceiling in MC? < 1294072360 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, you can't build above 128. < 1294072381 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How far above that can a player go? < 1294072423 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, however far he can jump above it I guess? < 1294072428 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, arbitrarily, as the TNT cannon video demonstrates. < 1294072447 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, hm, surely it doesn't use bignum though? < 1294072455 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, meaning something will hit a limit < 1294072461 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you go high enough < 1294072461 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, *within the bounds of the coding. < 1294072465 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294072753 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obsidian is TNT resistent? < 1294072832 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, yep. < 1294072839 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, it takes a huge amount of TNT *at once* to break obsidian iirc. And that amount would probably crash minecraft anyway. < 1294072840 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: How many packets would I need to handle to get //coords working with nomap? < 1294072842 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :5000 I think it was < 1294073234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: Stop skyping :P < 1294073246 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1294073254 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is that fastrender thing open or closed? < 1294073265 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Closed like everything, but you can decompile it. < 1294073446 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: downwownwonw < 1294073460 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, dunno < 1294073464 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=120160 < 1294073469 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no. < 1294073493 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: seenv < 1294073495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*seen < 1294073498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: compatible with FastRender too < 1294073527 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: when it's dark, white on black hurts less than black on white, because there is less contrast with surroundings < 1294073530 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, looks interesting. My saves backup is >100 MB in disk size. Less than 50 MB in actual file length. < 1294073542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: that's why your monitor has a contrast setting < 1294073543 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not going to check exact values with du atm, it takes too long) < 1294073550 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hah I wish < 1294073557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: um yes it does < 1294073567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: ping? < 1294073576 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pong. < 1294073581 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'd love if you could show me where it is < 1294073590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: probably somewhere in your settings. < 1294073594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: you on the server? < 1294073601 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1294073612 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's software < 1294073617 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: that controls hardware < 1294073657 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, is it a laptop? If not the monitor probably has a "menu" button or such < 1294073667 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is a laptop < 1294073678 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, then I would check in monitor settings < 1294073680 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you said my monitor has a setting; you are wrong < 1294073689 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: yes it does < 1294073699 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: it is just not exposed via buttons < 1294073714 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's too much work then < 1294073727 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus inversion = hawt < 1294073731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: then stop whining < 1294073741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the fact is your display has a setting < 1294073897 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm I wonder how the brightness buttons on my thinkpad are handled in linux < 1294073918 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are by fn and clearly goes to the OS < 1294073964 0 :cheater99!~cheater@e181136090.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294074059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: First generation? < 1294074064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: You mean you've been there before? < 1294074075 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, there? Yes. < 1294074084 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Hmm. < 1294074100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=120160#p1742827 < 1294074102 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Erm.. whos Amdahl lol xD?" < 1294074208 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh dbus < 1294074258 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I can't find contrast control on my thinkpad btw < 1294074273 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder where ubuntu hides it < 1294074396 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, googling yields no useful results either < 1294074420 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: TREEHOUSE < 1294074503 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, TOO DIFFICULT < 1294074512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: LAME < 1294074521 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: We could life of the fatta tha land! < 1294074533 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, tree house eh? sounds fun < 1294074547 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, until you accidentally remove a leaf block. < 1294074547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: We found a nice tree. < 1294074583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :""The Basic Texture pack is developed for people who own slow computers or suffer from lag, giving you and your computer a better time, while retaining the minecraft feel. " < 1294074594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This idiot thinks that making textures have more solid colours makes the rendering go faste.r < 1294074596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*faster. < 1294074600 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let us laugh. < 1294074628 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, quite < 1294074643 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, link? < 1294074652 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the beta tree rules are "within 4 blocks of a log, and connected to the log by leaves (or directly)" iirc < 1294074656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.adkins-online.com.au/minecraftbasic/; site requires Flash so I can't see it. < 1294074665 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which differs from the old leaf rules in alpha-with-decay < 1294074669 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I HAVE FLASH < 1294074701 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This pack seems nice, FWIW: http://www.largames.com/games/games-in-general/160-largamesminecraft.html < 1294074797 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: No Skyping this week. I'm still at work at the moment. < 1294074809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: Pah. < 1294074819 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Christ, the Basic texture pack spells "normal" as "normle". < 1294074831 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Notch quality. < 1294074855 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my god microsoft is retarded < 1294074865 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It also speaks of "test's" and that it runs "with out" computers running "slowley". < 1294074866 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"let's make phones upload up to 50 MB of data each day" < 1294074872 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what can possibly go wrong < 1294074914 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, they did that? uploading what sort of stuff? < 1294074991 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, FWIW, people claim to have FPS rises when using it. < 1294075005 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: People claim homeopathy works. < 1294075056 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes, but this is actually objectively measurable. < 1294075067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: But has it been objectively measured? < 1294075121 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, the FPS is hard to get wrong, although I doubt they understand rigour. < 1294075188 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Same scene, actions etc. < 1294075203 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Name my pack! < 1294075216 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you aren't making a texture pack, are you? < 1294075225 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: M... m... may... shut up. < 1294075231 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: It's not even going to be single-colour! < 1294075296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Not sure whether it'll be 16x or 32x; probably 16xl < 1294075298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*16x. < 1294075305 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ? < 1294075313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Texture pack. < 1294075467 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the 1x1 one? < 1294075470 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Water cannot be found in The Nether and water from a bucket will evaporate as soon as it touches anything in there." < 1294075473 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No :P < 1294075477 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, then what < 1294075483 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does that include, say, cobblestone made by a player there? < 1294075490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Just a texture pack. < 1294075492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Probably. < 1294075493 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If so, it's impossible to mould a portal in the Nether < 1294075499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: That is not true. < 1294075508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: You mine your old portal. And actually you probably can wtaer your own blocks. < 1294075509 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*water < 1294075514 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I can name it when I see what it looks like < 1294075518 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, show me some screenshots < 1294075523 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Haven't started yet :P < 1294075531 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, can't mine your old portal without diamond pickaxe anyway < 1294075538 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, if you want the obsidian back < 1294075540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: So get a diamond pickaxe. < 1294075543 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, can't name it then. A hd pack might need a different name than a 1x1 pack < 1294075553 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example < 1294075556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 16x. Like Painterly, just less cluttered and not stupidly ornate. < 1294075567 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, drawingly? < 1294075628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: xD < 1294075647 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Water#Infinite_Spring_Duplication is this deliberate? < 1294075662 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Who cares, it's damn useful. < 1294075678 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it's not deliberate, it might be removed < 1294075779 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe it is deliberate < 1294075799 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since lava doesn't do it. < 1294075812 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, when it comes to notch such a thing means very little < 1294075812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wow. < 1294075823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looking at the Minecraft font... it's code page 437. < 1294075826 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Welcome to the 80s, Notch. < 1294075833 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ;D < 1294075836 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D* < 1294075844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Verry tempted to try and replace it with the actual code page 437 font now. < 1294075858 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except I think the dimensions are different. < 1294075884 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is even someone like Notch capable of writing code that causes new water sources to be made like that accidentally? < 1294075900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Notch is capable of all bugs. < 1294075918 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the booster thing started as a bug I think < 1294075989 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know what would be an awesome pack? < 1294075992 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The default one, but shuffled randomly. < 1294075999 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would be hilarious. < 1294076008 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the faster render thing helps a bit. 5-10 FPS or so. None of those huge speedups that some people reported in comments. And you still get a lot of "jerks" in the gameplay < 1294076027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The internet is full of jerks, silly. < 1294076029 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is the primary thing making it unplayable in single player atm < 1294076037 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, .... different meaning of the word :P < 1294076043 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Try the region mod? < 1294076050 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yeah might later < 1294076234 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the thing is, I get those jerks even if I don't move. it is enough to pan the view between a chest and workbench in front of me. So chunk loading doesn't sound like it. < 1294076247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I blame Notch. < 1294076258 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well duh < 1294076265 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION watches someone build a house < 1294076273 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, large? < 1294076274 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION decides that he wants to build a swimming pool < 1294076285 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie did that < 1294076291 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :two in fact < 1294076351 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, btw built a gate in single player. Gate as in "castle scale" gate with portcullis and so on. < 1294076388 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lawl < 1294076392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it go down :P < 1294076422 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, well, I'll make a larger one < 1294076424 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION growls < 1294076450 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well no. Not without some mod that makes fence posts and redstone interact < 1294076467 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'll take a screenshot shortly < 1294076486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: do you actually growl. < 1294076502 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION hits elliott. < 1294076510 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :About as much as I actually hit you just now < 1294076518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SURE THING FURRY < 1294076561 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, mcmap map mode seems broken btw < 1294076566 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I just tried it < 1294076579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Probably I said opt.nomap where I meant !opt.nomap < 1294076583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Grep main.c :P < 1294076618 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the window pops up, then login hangs < 1294076658 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo is a furry? < 1294076671 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: He growls, he must be. < 1294076683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also Phantom_Hoover_ has SOLID EVIDENCE of him being in a FURRY SUIT. < 1294076704 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A BLOOD furry! < 1294076706 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION growls at coppro < 1294076718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: What a sick, sick fetish! < 1294076724 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT'S SO DISGUSTING < 1294076734 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like vampires, only WEIRDER. < 1294076743 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am puking as we speak! < 1294076753 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know, i think of all of us, elliott is the only one who can be reliably said to be likely to growl < 1294076760 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294076774 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only its an incidental growl thats intended to be a grumble < 1294076776 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the gate btw: http://ompldr.org/vNnR5aA/2011-01-03_18.43.47.png < 1294076790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: what < 1294076796 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU HEARD ME < 1294076849 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I should add another semi-hidden layer of fence on top < 1294076853 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :might look better < 1294076882 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, ...how big is your castle. < 1294076895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could really do with a zip mounter. < 1294076904 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, not a castle. Just a checkpoint in a pass between two high mountains < 1294076920 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FWIW, I have actually made significant progress on my SSP world. < 1294076921 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, the location was perfect for it < 1294076928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Set it to HARD. < 1294076930 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It now has PANORAMIC WINDOWS < 1294076936 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what does that do? < 1294076949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Makes things more explody and longer-living. < 1294076956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Things being bad things. < 1294076959 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, meh. < 1294076963 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, for castle I go obsidian instead. < 1294076966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wimp. < 1294076968 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(for lower sections) < 1294076986 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I have a completely secure shelter and mine; I never get mobs within 5 metres of me. < 1294076998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Do you *ever* explore? < 1294077004 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not really. < 1294077011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: How utterly boring. < 1294077048 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I want to explore I can just go onto ineiros' server. < 1294077063 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not as if the terrain generator is different. < 1294077073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH MY GOD MAKING TEXTURE PACKS IS SO HARD < 1294077079 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, this is somewhat outdated: http://sporksirc.net/~anmaster/minecraft/screenshots/fort/2010-11-16_23.26.07.png < 1294077081 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT IS < 1294077084 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I WANT MY MOMMY < 1294077088 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE COMPUTER IS MY FRIEND < 1294077089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: ;_; < 1294077089 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the thing is significantly larger now) < 1294077108 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, how the hell did you get that much TNT? < 1294077111 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, :D < 1294077116 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, TNT? < 1294077124 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm *obsidian < 1294077140 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, also there is a nether portal just inside. Ends up right next to a huge lava lake. Which used to be even huger < 1294077149 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, aaaaaah. < 1294077163 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i wrote a scheme preprocessor that will do a form of CPS on delimited continuations using zippers :T < 1294077164 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you are insufficiently happy, citizen < 1294077166 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, quite a chore still. Considering the dimensions of it < 1294077169 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :being insufficiently happy is treason < 1294077172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: Dear god. < 1294077175 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CPS transform** < 1294077183 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, see this too: http://sporksirc.net/~anmaster/minecraft/screenshots/fort/2010-11-16_23.21.47.png < 1294077187 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: dear god what? :P < 1294077193 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: I. < 1294077202 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An obsidian fortress with wooden doors. < 1294077207 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, also floor is obsidian a bit inwards (not the hole bottom floor yet, though that is the plan) < 1294077207 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is no higher comedy. < 1294077214 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, I changed that since I took those screenshots < 1294077215 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: finish that thought please < 1294077220 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, I was low on iron back then < 1294077221 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: . < 1294077229 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: And dirt below it no less. < 1294077231 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, due to all the buckets < 1294077236 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: :| < 1294077239 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"So here we have the soil ... and then we put some obsidian on top of it." < 1294077242 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Lots of obsidian in fact." < 1294077252 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh wait, you hate scheme right? well, it'd work for CL too < 1294077258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: what < 1294077262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: since when do i < 1294077269 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i dont know, you confuse me < 1294077270 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1294077274 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, fizzie did build a bunker which can be blown wide open with a lucky hit from a creeper. < 1294077274 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, quite. But since floor is obisidian it will at worst end up as a floating box (well, the middle of the floor is currently cobble in part) < 1294077275 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its really just an sexp manipulate < 1294077277 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: For //coords you need to handle those PACKET_ENTITY_* it already handles, plus PACKET_PLAYER_MOVE and PACKET_PLAYER_MOVE_ROTATE. < 1294077282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: I _like_ Scheme. < 1294077285 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o ok < 1294077302 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: TOO MUCH WORK < 1294077302 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and I checked with TNT next to wall, it doesn't quite reach up to the stone sections :) < 1294077317 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, besides I will have a moat OF LAVA around the fort. < 1294077329 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*moat OF TNT < 1294077342 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, elliott, it takes expressions like this: (+ 1 (reset x (* 2 (shift x (- 3 x))))) < 1294077345 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not really now < 1294077346 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no* < 1294077361 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: but you can do delim continuations with real continuations. you prolly know that < 1294077370 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I suspect that much TNT would reach up to the stone section anyway < 1294077374 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, whyever not? < 1294077383 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, whyever not what? < 1294077392 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would certainly kill any intruders. < 1294077400 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh yes, but the point was to do delimited continuations without any magic < 1294077404 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and to do it with a preprocessor < 1294077408 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294077411 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, ... right and demolish everything around it < 1294077412 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and to do it syntactically via zippers < 1294077414 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was an exercise < 1294077429 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, probably down to the minecart system level even (which is at around alt 28 or something such) < 1294077431 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, FLOATING CASTLE < 1294077449 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like your bunker in Mt. Vorpal. < 1294077459 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, ... < 1294077463 0 :santiago_!~santiago@190.84.27.139 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294077482 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, the one 20 metres above sea level? < 1294077502 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOR NOT MENT TO KNOW ABOUT THAT < 1294077511 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, this is single player... < 1294077524 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Your latest nomap change managed to remove the proxy-thread creation completely when !opt.nomap. < 1294077532 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: im teaching a sort of SICP++ to a friend < 1294077541 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yes I told him it was broken several minutes ago < 1294077543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: has he actually read sicp < 1294077543 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nomap? < 1294077544 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, the point is that if Mt. Vorpal is attacked, the bunker will be floating in midair. < 1294077547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Oh yes, indeed. < 1294077552 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Well, SEP. < 1294077554 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, I don't see the issue with that < 1294077565 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, apart from it being attacked is an issue < 1294077571 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: we're using it as source material. its mostly SICP, and then some stuff beyond sicp but bolted onto the SICP model < 1294077580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i see. < 1294077616 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, so when you decide to rebuild the world after ineiros' attack you will step outside and promptly fall to your death. < 1294077621 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so like, we're going to implement a primitive pattern matching system on top of the interpreter, and use that as a springboard to discuss unification < 1294077637 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: we're also going to use it as a springboard to discuss ADTs < 1294077659 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ADTs! < 1294077662 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :generic operators will give us a means of getting into type systems < 1294077665 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, anyway for my other single player world I devised a much better way to build a fort. Obsidian for a tiny ladder shaft up from ground. to the fort, which is "balanced" on this shaft. And which doesn't need to be in obsidian < 1294077668 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i fucking love ADTs, can i just say < 1294077671 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can mapping stuff be used with multiplayer stuff? < 1294077685 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i love ruby but there are so many times when i wish it had ADTs < 1294077685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: mcmap can. < 1294077691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: ruby is terrible < 1294077697 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, it can *only* be used in SMP. < 1294077697 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, then I would have to build on top of bedrock :P < 1294077706 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: meh. i like it. but i wish it had GADTs and types < 1294077714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: and didn't have mutability. < 1294077715 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SMP = Survival MultiPlayer? < 1294077720 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, seems the logical place to put a bunker. < 1294077722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: and was functional. < 1294077722 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, yes. < 1294077723 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i dont mind the mutability. < 1294077726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: you should. < 1294077746 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, takes far to long to reach in an emergency < 1294077752 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, dropshaft. < 1294077757 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1294077772 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i mean, i use mutability sparingly anyway, but when i do its in a sort of .. whats the word for it < 1294077783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: dangerous? < 1294077785 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :single-reference object? < 1294077786 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no no < 1294077790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: evil? < 1294077790 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note: I am putting this into Mt. Hoover so don't you dare steal it. < 1294077792 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: antipattern? < 1294077796 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: leaky abstraction/ < 1294077798 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294077801 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean i use mutability when the mutated object is private, so to speak < 1294077802 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, anyway speaking of that gate, I think it would be cool to build a castle on that scale. < 1294077818 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, you'd need to light the internals. < 1294077822 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, though even that gate took several hours in game time (and it's solid, though cobble inside, not stone) < 1294077831 0 :santiago_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Ex-Chat < 1294077840 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, well duh I need torches yes. So? < 1294077849 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, or wait < 1294077852 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean the gate < 1294077854 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why are we in #minecrack < 1294077855 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, OMG make a motte and bailey. < 1294077855 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not the future castle? < 1294077866 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, i probably use mutability elsewhere, but its usually in that form. i tend to use mostly functional style in ruby anyway < 1294077869 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, what on earth is/are that/those? < 1294077878 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motte-and-bailey < 1294077903 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, I was thinking a vasaborg. Whatever those are called in English < 1294077909 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1294077927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: HHI needs an IRC server. < 1294077952 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, example: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9b/%C3%96rebro_castle_in_Sweden.jpg < 1294077958 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: did i tell you, chris barker was at UMD in november < 1294077962 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, model of Edinburgh castle? < 1294077966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: yes < 1294077967 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, ? < 1294077975 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hes pretty cool < 1294077980 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT A BEAR < 1294077982 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :D < 1294077982 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OTOH, obsidian would be the logical replacement for basalt here... < 1294077985 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.. beard < 1294077988 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>.> < 1294078003 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edinburgh_castle < 1294078003 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, this? http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a1/EdinburghCastle.jpg < 1294078003 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: because of him, i now understand the reader monad < 1294078008 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but only moderately! < 1294078021 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, if so... far too ornate. < 1294078021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: it's the same as the (->) monad < 1294078021 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's sited on top of a basalt plug. < 1294078031 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it is, but now i understand that! :) < 1294078046 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, how hard is it to understand? < 1294078053 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: not hard at all! < 1294078066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294078066 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, so how didn't you? < 1294078074 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: frame of mind < 1294078113 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i generally come to understand things by analogizing them to their equivalents in linguistics < 1294078117 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294078141 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, well, it'd be something to do with a map editor, at least initially. < 1294078157 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, well sure. I'm not going to use a map editor < 1294078159 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: so its hard for me to sort of .. grok the typical haskellish discussion < 1294078183 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, mine will be stone I guess. When/if I make it. < 1294078183 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i also need very ground up explanations; i still dont understand monad transformers properly, despite philippa's efforts < 1294078187 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, well, just for the initial geography. < 1294078192 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: What is he doing. < 1294078202 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, augur or Vorpal? < 1294078207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: Monad transformers are ... really simple. < 1294078208 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Vorp. < 1294078217 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, castle AFAIK. < 1294078218 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, will model it one one of these I guess: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a7/Kalmar_slott.jpg or http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9b/%C3%96rebro_castle_in_Sweden.jpg < 1294078227 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so im told, but they havent yet fit into place in my mental picture of things < 1294078236 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, no, I'm not. I'm considering doing that. < 1294078268 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, that sucks! < 1294078278 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MOTTE AND BAILEY < 1294078279 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, also you plan to make Edinburgh castle? Good luck, it looks rather complex. < 1294078281 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294078309 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, well. It's my single player game. I'll let you do whatever you want in your :) < 1294078324 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i have a very visual tendency when trying to understand code, and its very hard for me to visualize monad transformers < 1294078343 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, besides "A motte-and-bailey is a form of castle situated on a raised earthwork and surrounded by a protective fence" <-- the MC fence would look tiny and silly in this context < 1294078358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: sry but when I hear "visual learner" i hear "idiot" :} < 1294078385 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294078406 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what's wrong with visualisation? < 1294078410 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i dont know if im a "visual learner", i just tend to visualize a computation < 1294078425 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: nothing, but "visual learner" almost always means "unable to think abstractly". < 1294078432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :symbols, bitch. < 1294078435 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh. < 1294078439 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yes, symbols definitely < 1294078447 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i need to see how the symbols FLOW < 1294078450 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sort of < 1294078466 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i cant just look at a definition and understand it < 1294078468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: try lsd < 1294078477 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, i could grind through it < 1294078488 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i wouldnt intuitively get how to make it anew < 1294078490 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I was going to suggest printing and then using tap water < 1294078495 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: im working on it xP < 1294078498 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its hard to get you know < 1294078504 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, though, I doubt that works with laser printers < 1294078522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: I suggest you do it alone! And next to the computer with all your files on. < 1294078528 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: You'll probably end up dying but it'll be hilarious for the rest of us. < 1294078538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or worse, wiping your disk. < 1294078546 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: "with all your files on" what? < 1294078553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: So I could end with "wiping your disk". < 1294078558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shut up. < 1294078569 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yeah, the "garbage on map because of torch" is because when you put a torch at Y=127, it sends block-set messages for Y=128 to "change" that block to air. < 1294078570 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, "~ on it"? < 1294078572 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Fixed that.) < 1294078587 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you probably WOULDNT end up wiping the disk, actually < 1294078589 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm but why did it happen at y=125 then too? < 1294078629 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems to send those pretty randomly whenever you are high altitudes. < 1294078637 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: Admittedly doing something stupid and dying sounds more likely. < 1294078646 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: not really < 1294078650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: *More* likely. < 1294078652 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:24:35 block_change: (5,127,9) -> 4 < 1294078652 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:24:35 block_change: (5,128,9) -> 0 < 1294078652 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:24:36 block_change: (5,127,9) -> 4 < 1294078652 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:24:36 block_change: (5,128,9) -> 0 < 1294078652 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:24:36 block_change: (5,127,9) -> 4 < 1294078652 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:24:36 block_change: (5,128,9) -> 0 < 1294078657 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps it's just best not to wonder. < 1294078658 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, heh < 1294078673 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: people generally dont do stupid things and die when on LSD < 1294078684 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: No, but they do it more often than they rm -rf / < 1294078702 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i'd need to see a study to believe that! < 1294078704 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, was that for placing /one/ torch? < 1294078727 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: "Remove... recursively... forced... root" vs "Ooh it's cheese. Oh the cheese is hollow. Ooh wind. This is ni" < 1294078731 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, one cobblestone. And it was just a snippet, there were about 6 more lines. < 1294078736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Depiction of LSD 100% ACCURATE) < 1294078748 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : .. beard <-- yeah, SURE... < 1294078763 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well hes more of an otter anyway, right, so. < 1294078765 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294078768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur is like 3 years old he can't grow a beard < 1294078773 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, some waste data there heh < 1294078777 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: what line is that from < 1294078782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait i was prolly offline < 1294078788 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: me talking about chris barker just five minutes ago < 1294078794 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he has an awesome beard < 1294078932 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl < 1294079199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294079278 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294079430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :axiom < 1294079453 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A is A < 1294079514 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :scrap your boilerplate looks really interesting < 1294079650 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, NaN. Q.E.D. < 1294079688 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: objectivist < 1294079736 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: it's not my fault that IEEE numbers don't obey the rules of predicate logic with equality < 1294079747 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that was the joke < 1294079754 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, YES IT IS < 1294079757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: objectivists don't joke < 1294079838 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: possible < 1294079841 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jokes are SOCIALIST < 1294079842 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: impossible < 1294079866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SOCIALIST are JOKES < 1294079881 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The one objectivist I have met uses the terms "socialist", "communist", and "fascist" completely interchangeably.) < 1294079911 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that person was stupid < 1294079941 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its like words dont have meanings anymore T_T < 1294079958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: all objectivists are stupid < 1294079966 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: true! < 1294080030 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294080034 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1294080262 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1294080316 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294080933 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, EXECUTIVE DECISION: < 1294080954 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HHI's research department should be moved to a midair fortress. < 1294080959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Yes. < 1294080963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: On top of Mount Vorpal. < 1294080969 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no. < 1294080972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1294080974 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1294080977 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHO IS THE CEO HERE < 1294081037 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you are just trying to troll me by suggesting that. I know you won't do it. < 1294081071 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Me. < 1294081081 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no. < 1294081091 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: When you went on leave to a luxurious Mount Vorpal holiday and demoted me, I climbed up the ranks slowly. < 1294081093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To SUPER CEO. < 1294081104 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then when you rejoined, the reanks realigned; you're INFERIOR CEO, I'm CEO. < 1294081112 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, foolish youth. < 1294081140 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I AM OMEGA CEO FOR LIFE < 1294081144 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I think doing it right on top of ineiros's tower is better < 1294081150 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal. < 1294081165 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes? < 1294081170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mount Vorpal. < 1294081174 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no < 1294081178 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1294081201 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no. < 1294081206 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294081208 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : WHO IS THE CEO HERE <-- * oerjan gets a calvin an hobbes treehouse backflash < 1294081213 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*and < 1294081226 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1294081236 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no and I don't have time to discuss further. bbl < 1294081244 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: "Discuss". < 1294081254 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That was some discussion I had with Vorpal there! < 1294081263 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not enough vertical space above Mt. Vorpal. < 1294081268 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Make some! < 1294081284 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If he had any significant sea-level constructions, maybe. < 1294081401 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: We could build it around his two gigantic waterfalls. < 1294081430 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, giving Vorpal easy access to this facility is not an option. < 1294081434 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294081505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: OK, I suggest we construct it entirely out of obsidian, from level 128 downwards, and then empty out the entire space below it, such that to enter, you have to jump down to bedrock, solve a redstone puzzle, go in a boat elevator, and then enter an iron door. < 1294081516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good enough? < 1294081533 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no, since getting in would still be trivial. < 1294081539 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Um, how? < 1294081556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Sure, you could build a gigantic path from ground to there, but you'd have to break through obsidian. < 1294081568 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, cobble tower to the necessary level, then use the normal entrance. < 1294081605 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Impossible. < 1294081611 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: The entire path upwards is coated in obsidian. < 1294081620 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: i.e., thin obsidian tower up like 64 levels, and then the actual facility. < 1294081628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The actual facility is completely covered. < 1294081664 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: And if you're going to say "But you could get in by just breaking two obsidian!", well, that applies to EVERYTHING. < 1294081671 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My ideal method of access would be to install MoveCraft and have an HHI airship. < 1294081683 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that's not going to happen. < 1294081684 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Yeeeeees. < 1294081690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: So, let's get a shitload of lava and water. < 1294081750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Any ... ideas for that? < 1294081843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: See /msg. < 1294082579 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :beeeh < 1294082589 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :minecraft refuses to work on my ubuntu < 1294082747 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FWIW, "java -Xmx1024M -Xms512M -cp /path/to/Minecraft.jar net.minecraft.LauncherFrame" seems to work fine on this Ubuntu 10.10 w/ the default openjdk-6-jre 6b20-1.9.2-0ubuntu2; but that's just me, I've heard people complain about OpenJDK before. < 1294082769 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The memory limits could be bigger too. < 1294082816 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just blackscreens < 1294082838 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hear sun-java6-jre works more reliababbely. < 1294082849 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I'unno. < 1294082860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: doesn't work in browser < 1294082871 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://timashley.me/node/596 < 1294082874 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i found this < 1294082936 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looks like manually swabbing lwjgl versions. < 1294082959 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what i'm trying to do after jars download < 1294083016 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, down? < 1294083020 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no < 1294083042 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: use sun jvm. also, you pirated it, didn't you? < 1294083074 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1294083082 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wouldn't pay for something i can;t try < 1294083089 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it does not work properly < 1294083101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: um, yes, because all the pirated ones are ancient. < 1294083101 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i like it i will buy it < 1294083105 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if not - i will remove it < 1294083111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: um, yes, because all the pirated ones are ancient. < 1294083114 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is why it doesn't work < 1294083123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway _nobody_ gives a shit because you whine about Minecraft sucking constantly. < 1294083126 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so whatever. < 1294083148 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this looks like 1.1_02 < 1294083389 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, beta or alpha? < 1294083420 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1.1_02 sounds like a beta version number to me. < 1294083654 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha! < 1294083663 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: see game. < 1294083671 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1.1_02 fully working < 1294083682 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I appear not to have MC open. < 1294083687 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Why not. < 1294083693 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No idea. < 1294083700 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: OPEN < 1294084643 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294084656 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now suddenly it's dark and i can't find coal for a torch < 1294084673 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :am i supposed to sit in my shelter til morning comes? < 1294084690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: yes. < 1294084692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: you failed. < 1294084783 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how long is the night? < 1294084823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: as long as the day. well, almost. < 1294084838 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like 7 minutes + a bit vs. 10 minute day < 1294084849 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294085089 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, what's your shelter type? < 1294085135 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hollow in a hillside, small hut on a plain? < 1294085175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Castle in a ... fastle? < 1294085306 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hollow in a hillside < 1294085320 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i closed the entrance with dirt < 1294085337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: You might want a door. < 1294085345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, make sure it's not too big a hollow; monsters can spawn in small spaces. < 1294085358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You probably want a torch. < 1294085362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or twenty. < 1294085489 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or peaceful < 1294085491 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hostile mobs don't spawn within 25m of you. < 1294085551 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, you might want to play on peaceful to learn the game mechanics. Just a suggestion. < 1294085565 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Ah. < 1294085571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Don't; Vorpal is a wimp. < 1294085584 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, thanks. < 1294085618 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't find coal < 1294085642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: It's underground. < 1294085644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or in cliff faces. < 1294085651 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, hm. look on cliff sides for black dots, or underground as elliott suggested. < 1294085698 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Finding coal is the hardest part. < 1294085720 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, of the entire game. Hm quite true. < 1294085730 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, of the initial stages. < 1294085733 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fffuu < 1294085741 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just screwed < 1294085754 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm in a dark cavern with no light < 1294085755 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You need either nice terrain or enough time to set up a mine < 1294085787 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, "oops" < 1294085801 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do i respawn/die anything? < 1294085826 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, you die by getting killed. then you respawn at start with inventory dropped where you died. < 1294085836 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note: objects on ground time out. < 1294085846 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure if they time out if the chunk is unloaded < 1294085851 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't want to weit < 1294085856 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or if it only counts down when the chunk in loaded < 1294085857 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guess i'll start over < 1294085859 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, "weit"? < 1294085862 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1294085865 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, ah < 1294085880 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ypo < 1294085884 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, I still suggest peaceful to figure out the game. Even though elliott says it is wimpy < 1294085884 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :typo :D < 1294085889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Patience helps. < 1294085900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: P.S. place doors from outside. < 1294086092 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1294086201 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-180-144.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294086557 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doors from outside? < 1294086709 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: yes. < 1294086713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't place them from the inside. < 1294086725 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhuh < 1294086736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: you can fight monsters if you place them from outside < 1294086737 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can imagine that monsters will be able to open them < 1294086742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: um no. < 1294086745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they can't. < 1294086758 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YET < 1294086829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ever :P < 1294086841 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, weeeeelllll... < 1294086852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: NO < 1294086857 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: SPECIEST < 1294086862 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Notch has no problems with making things pointlessly harder. < 1294086871 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*SPECIESIST < 1294086940 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Soon they will be solving redstone puzzles. < 1294086974 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, god, when will \sqrt{-\Garfield} stop that goddamn meme. < 1294086976 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1294086987 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what am i supposed to do at night? < 1294086997 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can i at least mine? < 1294087004 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, yes. < 1294087017 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although you don't want to leave areas of the mine in darkness. < 1294087019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Yes. Make sure to keep all caverns well-lit because monsters can spawn in them. < 1294087030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: You can also go outside as long as you have a lot of armour and a goodsword. < 1294087057 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: If you start expanding your realms by exploring in the day, you can mark your path with torch and then build underground minecart tracks at your convenience; so you can visit your territories at night, too. < 1294087074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: And you can always build, so long as you don't go too close to the wrong parts of the surface. < 1294087094 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have actually taken direct hits from a creeper with trivial damage. < 1294087113 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Armour saves lives, kids! < 1294087134 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Well, um, yeah, if you have decent armour you can go crazy. < 1294087138 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, creepers. < 1294087141 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right. < 1294087149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: It's actually pretty safe at night if you have a good sword, full armour, and some food. < 1294087153 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Irritating, definitely. < 1294087156 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dangerous, meh. < 1294087323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: The problem is that getting to that stage is ... tedious. < 1294087347 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i need armor huh < 1294087361 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, you need iron, first. < 1294087376 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which requires lots of coal and a functioning mine. < 1294087530 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoa < 1294087540 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's already day but monsters are out < 1294087620 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They don't vanish; you have to wait. < 1294087636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Most of them burn. < 1294087641 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: If you mean creepers, they stay. Forever. < 1294087648 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: If you mean spiders, they're peaceful in the day unless you attack them. < 1294087653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But at night... they'll go rabid again. < 1294087657 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, erm, no. < 1294087665 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Info from minecraftwiki. < 1294087676 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :During the day, Spiders become passive, and will not become aggressive unless they are attacked. When spiders are in a passive condition, their eyes do not glow red. The player will not receive damage if they touch them. Spiders become aggressive again as soon as night falls or if the player moves into darkness. If they were chasing the player during the night, they will usually continue to chase them during daylight. < 1294087676 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Creepers disappear eventually; this much is obvious. < 1294087682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Ok. Yes. < 1294087687 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I prefer to think they just go elsewhere. < 1294087692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: They certainly don't disappear in one day. < 1294087733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Hey... mobs don't spawn on half blocks or glass. < 1294087741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Build tall wall around huge area. Fill huge area with half blocks. < 1294087742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :??? < 1294087743 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Profit! < 1294087765 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, or just light it up? < 1294087780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: SHUT YOUR MOUTH, THIS IS BETTER < 1294087815 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you can't place torches on halfblocks. Nor minecart tracks or anything else that needs to rest on them. < 1294087843 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but filling with glass sounds more fun < 1294087850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You can't place anything on glass either :P < 1294087865 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: But you just build all those in your fortress and underground obviously. < 1294087875 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yeah but at least placing solid blocks on top won't look like they hover on top < 1294087887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That would look awesome. < 1294087891 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm < 1294087901 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Ghasts aim at the camera, not the player. Going into 3rd person mode and having a ghast fire a fireball at you will go over the player, given the right camera angle." < 1294087908 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stop filming me! < 1294087911 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, .... what the fuck < 1294087918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :notch quality < 1294087927 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wouldn't that be more work < 1294087931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOTCH QUALITY < 1294087938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The camera is an object I think, so no. < 1294087938 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, in the ghast case you have to think it might be intentional < 1294087947 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doubt it < 1294087950 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294088001 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :light repels them? < 1294088014 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, do they spawn in light area in nether? < 1294088018 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :areas* < 1294088024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: They spawn in any light area, yes. < 1294088027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Hm? < 1294088031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: You mean normal monsters? < 1294088035 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They only spawn in low light. < 1294088036 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what about dark areas in nether? < 1294088042 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They'll walk happily onto high light if they can ofc. < 1294088046 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: They spawn anywhere in Nether. < 1294088052 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hrrm. < 1294088097 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish forcing antialiasing worked in OS X for Minecraft. < 1294088176 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it doesn't work /well/ on linux < 1294088254 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION makes Minecraft 64-bit < 1294088301 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, eh...? < 1294088309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The .app is 32-bit only on OS X. < 1294088311 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I fixed that. < 1294088314 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294088336 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, does it get worse or better performance wise? < 1294088358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same I think. But maybe Java was ignoring -sever because I had -d64 -server. < 1294088359 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it should work now. < 1294088382 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, doesn't -server make performance worse iirc? < 1294088390 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Slower startup, *much* faster running. < 1294088395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's why it's called server: for long-running processes. < 1294088401 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Maybe it's different for MC but I doubt it. < 1294088405 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, on linux too? < 1294088414 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does -server do? pre-optimize? < 1294088426 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: on Sun JVM, yes < 1294088431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: different runtime entirely < 1294088438 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, on openjdk? < 1294088447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: only has server I think, but I'm not sure < 1294088459 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah < 1294088466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do java -help to see the vms :P < 1294088466 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -server to select the "server" VM < 1294088466 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : The default VM is server. < 1294088473 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no other vm is listed < 1294088479 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right. < 1294088512 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This openjdk: < 1294088514 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -server to select the "server" VM < 1294088515 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -cacao to select the "cacao" VM < 1294088515 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -zero to select the "zero" VM < 1294088515 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : The default VM is server. < 1294088518 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a bit weirdy. < 1294088529 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe it's some sort of a startup script thing? < 1294088540 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, same for me on ubuntu < 1294088567 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't believe how tiny the PS3 root key is < 1294088575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Cacao is IcedTea I think. < 1294088583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why does MC break when ran through OpenGL Profiler? Sigh. < 1294088590 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why not call it -icedtea then or such? :D < 1294088600 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: IcedTea = OpenJDK + Cacao. < 1294088600 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe. < 1294088606 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294088611 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what zero is < 1294088616 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1294088649 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, did you see that castle-gate screenshot above btw? < 1294088662 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://c1.complang.tuwien.ac.at/cacaowiki/FrontPage < 1294088666 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :giyf < 1294088757 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would think http://www.cacaovm.org/ is more like their "front page". < 1294088780 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also < 1294088786 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obsidian is a horrible construction material < 1294088789 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :icedtea-6-jre-cacao, "Alternative JVM for OpenJDK, using Cacao"; that is indeed where it comes from. < 1294088799 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, in real life or in mc? < 1294088814 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :real life < 1294088824 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although it's fantastic for making blades out of < 1294088824 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, well I can imagine that < 1294088828 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, indeed < 1294088832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: it's pretty though. < 1294088837 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, since when was minecraft realistic? < 1294088848 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BOXES is 100% realistic. < 1294088850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact 101%. < 1294088851 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A well-crafted obsidian blade can have a sharp edge with a thickness of 3 nanometers! < 1294088852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is more realistic than real. < 1294088854 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, obsidian is a kind of volcanic glass! < 1294088856 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: indeed < 1294088863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Obsidian should be SEETHROUGH < 1294088871 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it isn't in real life really < 1294088872 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294088873 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol no < 1294088878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's glass, duh. < 1294088882 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's black < 1294088885 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interestingly I don't have openjdk-6-jre-zero installed, but it still shows up in -help. (The -zero flag doesn't work, though.) < 1294088889 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a beautiful stunning black < 1294088896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: A see-through black. < 1294088899 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not as in window glass... < 1294088908 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1294088916 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, glass as in the lack of crystalline structure < 1294088934 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Zero is a port of OpenJDK that uses no assembler and therefore can trivially be built on any system. The goal of this project is be to be able to build a TCK-compliant OpenJDK of reasonable performance on any platform with no additional porting work. -- [and it also has] an LLVM-based JIT known as Shark." < 1294088937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Nope, actual seethrough. < 1294088954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: My life is enriched with this information. < 1294088962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I shall now devote a life to learning about JVMs. < 1294088965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*my life < 1294088972 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a sort of a silly name. < 1294088973 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, since you didn't reply to if you saw it or not: http://ompldr.org/vNnR5aA <-- from one of my single player games. It is built in the pass between two hard to climb mountain ranges. < 1294089007 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, no: I did not see it. < 1294089039 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still think MC's terrain is horribly limited. < 1294089064 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :64 metre high mountains? Seas that are never deeper than your average lake? < 1294089064 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, you mean the generated terrain or the fact that it is based on 1 m³ blocks? < 1294089074 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah... < 1294089092 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://p.zem.fi/cacaocraft < 1294089096 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION bugs the boxes devteam < 1294089107 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOG: [0x00007f83d5834700] vm_abort: WARNING, port me to C++ and use os::abort() instead. < 1294089110 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1294089114 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf indeed < 1294089127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Try ZEROCRAFT. < 1294089132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD @ port me to C++ < 1294089144 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the error makes no sense indeed < 1294089151 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Error: no `zero' JVM at `/usr/lib/jvm/java-6-openjdk/jre/lib/amd64/zero/libjvm.so'"; I'm not sure I want to install it just for that. < 1294089162 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :great < 1294089163 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Psht. < 1294089180 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an exploding prick killed me when i was trying to mount door < 1294089188 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, lower terrain below ground level around mountain and you can get up to 128 high mountains < 1294089196 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well 127 I guess < 1294089209 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, ah, a creeper < 1294089218 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :127-metre mountain is still a bit on the "lame" side; even Finland has higher hills than that. < 1294089223 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, 128 metres is still horribly limited. < 1294089228 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, quite < 1294089242 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, but imagine how slow it would be with even more data per chunk? < 1294089283 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well, zerocraft works but it's slooow. < 1294089291 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But not slooooow, just slooow.) < 1294089294 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, only to be expected < 1294089294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: NOT SLOW ENOUGH < 1294089300 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how many FPS? < 1294089302 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1294089303 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ^ < 1294089313 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, you can get fps with f3 btw < 1294089317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Yeah, uh, don't be stupid. Stay away from them. Keep hitting them and retreating if you're daring < 1294089319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*daring. < 1294089418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rite, I'ma try 'ttaching instead. < 1294089433 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294089460 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, ~30fps, but it goes <10 quite often, and at completely 100% CPU usage; nonzerocraft gives me stable-ish 40-60fps with ~40% CPU load. < 1294089541 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294089582 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, your computer is better than mine then. No surprise there. < 1294089652 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.google.co.uk/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=18446744073709551615+-+18446744073709551611&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&redir_esc=&ei=kT0iTfj9GNSJhQfthLW2BQ < 1294089654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOOGLE MATHEMATICS < 1294089687 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, it was also a reasonably simplistic indoor scene, and I wasn't moving around a lot. It's not always quite so smoothly animated. < 1294089759 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You know what Minecraft needs? < 1294089764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A 2D interface, like Dwarf Fortress. < 1294089770 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And mcmap, come to think of it. < 1294089772 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I get 40 FPS while looking at an empty sky. With 60% CPU < 1294089776 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, in single player that is < 1294089781 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, more in multi-player < 1294089801 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I get 40-50 fps in multiplayer with far/fancy/better light in a window. < 1294089803 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ha h. < 1294089804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Ha ha. < 1294089809 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, floating point math I presume < 1294089822 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes my desktop is dated < 1294089830 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the gpu load is probably not high < 1294089838 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how many FPS do you get in glxgears? < 1294089839 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Full screen — 32/35 to 40. < 1294089843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Har har :P < 1294089843 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's that 2dcraft, but it's a clone (and some sort of weird .net thing), not a minecraft UI. < 1294089850 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well? < 1294089867 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, iirc I get 8000-10000 FPS in glxgears < 1294089867 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: (1) I doubt that is very easy to obtain on OS X; (2) glxgears is so far from being a benchmark that it's not even funny. < 1294089870 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: But it's not 3D like Dwarf Fortress. < 1294089882 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, true it isn't a benchmark. < 1294089887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, I have glxgears. But it's X11-based of course. < 1294089890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So no point running it at all. < 1294089899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3140 frames in 5.0 seconds = 627.893 FPS < 1294089899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3780 frames in 5.0 seconds = 754.286 FPS < 1294089899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ Because of X11. < 1294089901 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no opengl acceleration in X on OS X? < 1294089907 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :glxgears framerate depends quite a lot on window size, too. < 1294089910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Probably, but it's still massive overhead. < 1294089913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Indeed; that was with the default size. < 1294089915 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I assumed standard window size < 1294089919 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: But it's not even _close_ to a benchmark. < 1294089929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: See http://wiki.cchtml.com/index.php/Glxgears_is_not_a_Benchmark. < 1294089933 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, indeed it isn't < 1294089935 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and I know that < 1294089936 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"So to summarize, glxgears only tests a small part of what you typically see in a 3D game. You could have glxgears FPS performance increase, but your 3D game performance decrease. Likewise, you could have glxgears performance decrease and your 3D game performance increase." < 1294089938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: So why ask. < 1294089945 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure how to get the default window size here, since it's a tiling VM. Maybe if I float it it'll assume the default size. < 1294089951 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, as a joke... < 1294089959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right. Usually they're funny. < 1294089969 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :44781 frames in 5.0 seconds = 8956.168 FPS < 1294089971 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Yay." < 1294089972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Tiling Minecraft -- that must go well for you. (OK, you probably float it or use a desktop.) < 1294089997 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: No, I keep it as a half-a-screen sized 960x1200 window, actually. < 1294090011 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Don't ask why.) < 1294090033 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, glxgears is still useful to check "do I have software or hardware 3D?" < 1294090042 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: When all you have is a hammer^Wtiling window manager... < 1294090049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: see http://wiki.cchtml.com/index.php/Glxgears_is_not_a_Benchmark#Debunking_the_Myth_.28glxgears_is_a_benchmark.29 and following section < 1294090057 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whenever I make a more "landscape" window, the silly thing resizes all the UI elements to take horribly much space. < 1294090064 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With the 960x1200 window, they're reasonably small. < 1294090105 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can use it to show that DRI works, but it does not even test that well. There's glxinfo or your Xorg.0.log to tell you if DRI was enabled as well. <-- well it tests that well IME. Maybe not so much with fast modern CPUs though < 1294090117 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but 5 years ago it worked perfectly for checking that DRI worked < 1294090199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION watches the Yellow Rose demo. (A prerecording 'cuz I'm a loser.) < 1294090218 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, link? < 1294090226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://ftp.kameli.net/pub/fit/yellow_rose/Yellow_Rose.mov is a fairly-low-quality recording. < 1294090236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pretty nice for a 4K demo (that it runs on Linux and OS X does NOT BIAS ME AT ALL) < 1294090245 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Admittedly there are some super-impressive 4Ks out there. < 1294090275 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it fails badly at streaming < 1294090279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WFM. < 1294090286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mplayer is very bad at stremaing if you're trying that. < 1294090287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*streaming < 1294090295 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, was trying vlc < 1294090298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://ftp.kameli.net/pub/fit/yellow_rose/ Here's a bunch of ports. < 1294090298 0 :iamcal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1294090306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SGI, Solaris, MorphOS, NetBSD, OS2, PPC Amiga... < 1294090310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PSP, QNX, S60... < 1294090318 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is os4? < 1294090322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...and Android if you'll believe it. < 1294090326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Amiga OS 4 I believe. < 1294090328 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The .lha suggests so. < 1294090331 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294090339 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION reads the source code < 1294090371 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, which language is it? < 1294090378 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Very impressive, if Finnish-commented (in one file, osa.c). < 1294090378 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: C. < 1294090389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find myself wondering where all the actual code is. < 1294090393 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and this compiled to less than 4K on all those? < 1294090405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, I imagine that's not "guaranteed". < 1294090409 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fi:osa == en:part. < 1294090410 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294090415 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hah < 1294090424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: For instance the 64-bit Linux binary here is 25K. < 1294090429 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294090430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Possibly just the Windows binary was 4K, but does it matter? < 1294090435 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1294090440 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Makefile hardcodes gcc-3.3, heh. < 1294090462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Well, new gcc versions can be verrry buggy. < 1294090471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION runs it on OS X! < 1294090489 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it use opengl or? < 1294090551 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: There's a software-3d version. < 1294090589 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems to have mostly replaced "glFoo" calls with "mlFoo", and then there's a ml.c that implements just those few it does call. < 1294090602 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel dizzy. < 1294090623 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C.f. the glLight "reimplementation": http://p.zem.fi/u7hs < 1294090658 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not quite as complete a OpenGL 3d renderer as, say, Mesa. < 1294090670 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, doesn't call the hardware opengl then? < 1294090691 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The "default" version does. < 1294090699 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294090706 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why do you feel dizzy? < 1294090710 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess those ports that don't have it are based on the sw-3d version. < 1294090713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The demo spins a bit. :p < 1294090717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And runs full screen by default. < 1294090727 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294090736 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, I didn't even know pouet has OS icons for Solars and SGI/IRIX ports. < 1294090747 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, pouet? < 1294090751 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seven Solaris demos in their repositomatory. < 1294090754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: *pouët. < 1294090755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1294090756 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pouet.net/prodlist.php?platform[]=Solaris < 1294090757 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294090771 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Those fit guys like Solaris. < 1294090797 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, four out of the seven are fit/bandwagon products, I see. < 1294090808 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, one is just fit. < 1294090835 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.kameli.net/~marq/pROSEssing/ < 1294090840 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ported to Processing, now with antialiasing. :p < 1294090862 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Their port-icon list at http://pouet.net/groups.php?which=409 is also rather more colorful than most. I see some BeOS there. < 1294090865 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, don't they have one for every one in the list? < 1294090885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: That Chrysler one, impressive :P < 1294090900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ports I mean < 1294090914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what the most ported one is < 1294090917 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Probably, but I didn't know the Solaris scene was so lively. < 1294090942 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, not very lively really < 1294090948 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh. < 1294090952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lively for Solaris. < 1294090953 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compared to, say, windows. Or even to linu < 1294090955 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :linux* < 1294090958 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well fair enough < 1294090963 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The *PSP* keys suffer from the same vulnerability. < 1294090973 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's two consoles hacked from one mistake. < 1294090977 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: X-D < 1294090991 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Wasn't the PHP already homebrew'd up the wazoo? < 1294090994 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*PSP < 1294091014 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: They discovered ways to downgrade the firmware to vulnerable ones. < 1294091026 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Much like the PS3 can be downgraded. < 1294091096 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, one of the Solaris prods (Centripetality, a game) is by a friend; I think it's very likely that's because of the Solaris boxes in one of the university's computer classrooms. < 1294091141 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Stretching the term of demo a bit. < 1294091156 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION gives it a go. < 1294091172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It looks fun-ish. < 1294091177 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294091214 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As long as it's in a compo at some sort of a demoscene-related event, I think it's good enough for pouët. < 1294091250 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't like it too much, but that's probably just because I'm not twitchy enough; it needs rather quick flipping between colors there. < 1294091270 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also the controls, like all the commentators say. < 1294091284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My question on the Ubuntu forums is getting lots (none) of expert help! < 1294091339 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looking at the list of controls, I need more hands. < 1294091448 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds like rather unusual gameplay < 1294091452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Oh dear god this would be fun were it not so god damn hard. < 1294091455 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, the web scoreboard is still up and all. (Though for the most part the entries are all 3 years ago. Still, there's one in the top-20 that's just one week old.) < 1294091469 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't help that my ctrl key is very inaccessible. < 1294091477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck it, I'll make caps lock ctrl just for this. < 1294091479 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, where is ctrl? < 1294091486 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I just kept getting confused about which color my ship was and switching exactly when I shouldn't. < 1294091489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: To the /right/ of Fn for some ungodly reason. < 1294091504 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, didn't you argue it should be outermost before? < 1294091509 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I seem to remember that < 1294091514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Ctrl? IT SHOULD BE. < 1294091537 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wait, isn't fn always outermost? < 1294091544 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I never seen a laptop where it isn't < 1294091544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No? < 1294091551 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ThinkPads and Macs are the only ones where it's outmost. < 1294091555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it's _stupid_. And irritating. < 1294091559 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, let me check my old dell < 1294091587 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh indeed not outermost < 1294091597 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I always found ctrl hard to hit on my old dell < 1294091603 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guess I'm just too used to my thinkpad < 1294091658 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I can manage exactly two keyboards well: generic full sized pc keyboard (NOT thin models though!). And my thinkpad < 1294091667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: This game - HARDEST EVER. < 1294091681 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, harder than "I wanna be the guy"? < 1294091692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes. < 1294091696 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wow < 1294091704 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Take "more than 28737 points" as your score-goal, then you have beaten the game's developer. < 1294091712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'm getting, like, 5000! WOOOO < 1294091717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Note: More like 4300.) < 1294091729 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't sound too hard to get points then? < 1294091735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT IS < 1294091745 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well, with >6921 you have beaten me, according to the web-scoreboard. < 1294091755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck this, I'm playing IWBTG. < 1294091770 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://darwine.sourceforge.net/ ;; very alive < 1294091772 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294091777 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My rank seems to be the honorable 208th. < 1294091779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, brew has wine. < 1294091779 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=120946&sid=fb4376cb29342af1342de884bbc7f90b < 1294091788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: I HAVE FOUND WHAT WE SHOULD BASE ASTEROIDS II ON SORT OF < 1294091790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EXCEPT MUCH LESS HARD < 1294091796 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AS IN ASTEROIDS II SHOULD BE MUCH LESS HARD < 1294091800 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hmm. < 1294091803 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Go on. < 1294091809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: http://www.scene.org/file.php?file=%2Fparties%2F2007%2Fassembly07%2Fgame%2Fcentripetality_by_aroppuu_huamn_juhovh.zip&fileinfo < 1294091814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Note: Game is possible to play only for Finns. < 1294091836 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: May require three hands. < 1294091868 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Fuck this, I'm playing IWBTG. <-- windows only iirc? < 1294091873 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Wine. < 1294091878 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm true < 1294091896 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do love the people who say that Notch is doing us a favour by letting us play MC before it's done. < 1294091906 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello? We PAID for it? < 1294091906 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that zip the Linux-x86 version or what? < 1294091985 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What it isn't is 64-bit, or even runnable on a 64-bit system. < 1294092004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Just install lib32-blah < 1294092012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or compile it. < 1294092016 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: It's a bunch of platforms in one. < 1294092048 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: It has a Solaris/SPARC port, though. Doesn't that count as something? < 1294092062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*count for < 1294092069 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why does the readme in http://www.scene.org/file.php?file=%2Fparties%2F2007%2Fassembly07%2Fgame%2Fcentripetality_by_aroppuu_huamn_juhovh.zip&fileinfo render as an image < 1294092073 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is fucking stupid < 1294092101 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't have lib32whatever. < 1294092103 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's just something scene.org does. < 1294092105 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even on APT. < 1294092111 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, how utterly silly < 1294092114 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: You have libsomething32bitsomethingsomething < 1294092121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: I forget the *exact* names. < 1294092128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's because of charsets. < 1294092130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's an NFO renderer. < 1294092133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NFO = dos codepage. < 1294092139 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh I see < 1294092142 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So there is no way to portably display them properly without an image. < 1294092144 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I still can't see it. < 1294092145 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how does it know which code page? < 1294092150 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't. < 1294092152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: There's only one that anyone used. < 1294092158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. the default font. < 1294092159 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm < 1294092160 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DOS had no real codepages. < 1294092160 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not exactly true any more. :p < 1294092166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There was just "the IBM PC font". < 1294092170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Blah blah :P < 1294092179 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The image-rendering manages to break all party results textfiles and everything. < 1294092202 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I remember you often loaded code pages in Sweden to get the chars < 1294092206 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, in fact you had to < 1294092208 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on DOS < 1294092208 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: ia32-libs for one < 1294092216 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so yes there was more than one code page loaded < 1294092217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: I forget the name for SDL. < 1294092222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Or just Compile It Yourself. < 1294092241 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the source isn't in that zip and I need libcurl. < 1294092252 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so this just assumes the US standard code page? < 1294092270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: sf.net/project/centripality < 1294092274 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :modulo typos/whatever < 1294092276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes. < 1294092277 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah. < 1294092289 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, only US/UK and such used it < 1294092297 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it was never popular in Sweden for example < 1294092298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Nobody cares. < 1294092322 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, correction: nobody who used the default code page because it had their letters in it cares. < 1294092332 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, 404. < 1294092339 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: MODULO TYPOS/WHATEVER < 1294092346 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :google " sourceforge" < 1294092347 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sheesh < 1294092349 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: http://sourceforge.net/projects/centripetality/ < 1294092360 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here's a link if you need desperately to click on something. < 1294092365 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you fail at spelling :D < 1294092376 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Spelling made up words. < 1294092378 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What an achievement. < 1294092387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Specially as I never actually looked at the name. < 1294092403 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: I'm not sure the open-source version supports the web-scoreboard, though. And I'm sure you want to get your FAME ON. < 1294092438 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, made up words derived trivially from English ones. < 1294092448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Wah wah wah. < 1294092452 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, quite < 1294092463 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, I wonder why elliott is acting so childish now < 1294092470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think Vorpal is just looking for ways to complain at this point. < 1294092479 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On a Utnubbu system I don't think it needs anything else than ia32-libs to run. < 1294092481 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, incidentally, HHI stuff in Oolite. Comment. < 1294092483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I solemnly swear to NEVER TYPO A GAME NAME EVER AGAIN < 1294092486 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you are pathetic. < 1294092492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: SORRY can't reply I'm too busy being too childish to reply. < 1294092508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That time of the month again...? < 1294092511 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey there different-group-of-people-from-yesterday. < 1294092521 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: hi. < 1294092530 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, very droll. But I guess you should know, alise. < 1294092546 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Help us make an unsolvable game! < 1294092561 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wow, you're reaching the height of comedy Vorpal. Soon I'll have to ignore you before laughing so hard I wet my pants. < 1294092563 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Which is nonetheless strategic, fun, and playable by humans) < 1294092579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: The unsolvable game is asking people to make an unsolvable game which is nonetheless strategic, fun, and playable by humans. < 1294092589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: You trick people into helping, have fun doing it... < 1294092592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but ultimately, it is impossible. < 1294092593 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ... YOU JUST BLEW MY MIND < 1294092596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT NOW, LOGIC < 1294092599 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Joy. Centripetality doesn't compile for me. < 1294092603 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I guess a simple intellect like yours is easily amused. < 1294092610 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, (wait this reminds me of monkey island) < 1294092618 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But anyway, I put our current thoughts here: http://codu.org/wiki/N-in-a-row%20game < 1294092637 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You know, I haven't actually flooded anything with lava lately. If you don't stop being inane I might be less careful with buckets. < 1294092640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sigh. < 1294092647 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now back to scheming. < 1294092664 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you take it to threats like that? ... < 1294092668 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i i've found redstone but i don't even have iron yet < 1294092684 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, ... < 1294092693 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Redstone is found much deeper than iron. < 1294092694 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know < 1294092696 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, no point in mining it then. Since you won't get anything from it. Find iron first < 1294092710 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :theres no goddamn iron in this worls < 1294092710 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Considering you've basically been irritating me for no discernible reason based on one not-even-typo, and continue to do so, yes, I'll raise it to basically anything I want. < 1294092713 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :world < 1294092714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now quit the noise. < 1294092714 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, iron might be harder to see than redstone certainly < 1294092726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: You have to set up an actual mine. < 1294092740 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, staircase mine at first. < 1294092740 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm digging tunnels < 1294092746 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :STAIRCASE < 1294092747 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did 3 < 1294092748 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, how deep are you? < 1294092756 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how am i supposed to know < 1294092759 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, what's so great with a staircase mine? < 1294092767 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, f3 shows coordinates < 1294092773 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did 3 staircases and found only gravel < 1294092798 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, it isn't redstone unless y is less than, 30 or so < 1294092803 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: You need to do staircases and then branch off. < 1294092804 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-44 < 1294092809 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, not for 4 < 1294092813 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1294092815 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not for y* < 1294092815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Main staircase, make corridors in the sides, and then make corridors going off *those*. < 1294092818 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn eyboard < 1294092820 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: And that's how you do it. < 1294092821 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :keyboard* < 1294092834 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, x,y,z y is altitude above bottom of map < 1294092841 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: i.e., the corridors you actually mine in are the same direction as your stairs. < 1294092848 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :36 < 1294092862 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, maybe redstone then. < 1294092883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: It's redstone if it's red. < 1294092890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Brought to you by "Vorpal Makes It Complicated" Industries. < 1294092903 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what is? < 1294092914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Redstone is red. Things that aren't redstone are not red. < 1294092935 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well red flowers... (sorry) < 1294093014 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, the advantage of staircase mining is that it's both simple and dense: if you plan correctly, you can ensure that you have examined every block within the range of the mining. < 1294093035 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/gDee5.png oh shit < 1294093044 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, cool < 1294093059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's ... wallpaper-sized < 1294093062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... no i refuse < 1294093073 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wo < 1294093083 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wrong dimensions for my screen though :/ < 1294093087 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just found a tunnel with nice stream < 1294093089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just resize/crop. < 1294093133 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, oh like my high density mines then? That model (which I do not claim to have invented) are good for when you are already near the bottom and want to mine a lot at a given altitude < 1294093182 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, are your high-density mines just the ones in Mt. Vorpal? < 1294093187 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you get rid of rubble? < 1294093203 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, hm? < 1294093204 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rubble? < 1294093217 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, yes those multi-layer ones that look like a zipper < 1294093241 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: this cobblestone that you collect when mining? < 1294093242 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, it's a form of branch mining < 1294093275 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, either a) put it in a chest or b) throw it elsewhere. < 1294093288 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you have much wood? < 1294093359 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea < 1294093368 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make CHESTS. < 1294093381 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for cobblestone? :F < 1294093391 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well depends < 1294093397 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I have things set up such that I never need to leave my shelter.) < 1294093398 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, you probably want to save some, but not all < 1294093398 0 :Sasha!~WHAT@75-174-221-10.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294093412 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, well if you are that style of player :D < 1294093414 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except for sand. < 1294093433 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, you have chests full of iron then? < 1294093436 0 :myndzi\!myndzi@c-24-19-39-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294093457 0 :Sasha2_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294093474 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Cooblestones are useful for pickaxes. < 1294093478 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You won't _always_ have iron. < 1294093485 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do! < 1294093490 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, quite < 1294093494 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: You're straying into very Vorpally territory. < 1294093496 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not at the start anyway < 1294093511 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what is wrong with having a lot in chests? < 1294093513 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :buy 900 cobblestone is useless < 1294093522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean arranging things so you never have to leave. < 1294093533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: As long as you mine at least three cobbles with each stone pickaxe you're good :P < 1294093538 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well. That follows as a result of having huge stores in chests < 1294093560 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, actually you never /have/ to leave once you have a small shelter and one torch < 1294093568 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pointlesscraft < 1294093576 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, quite < 1294093588 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I leave even though I don't have to. Because it would be boring otherwise < 1294093590 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294093612 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: In fact, can't you just have a two high wall four around you (8 blocks), plus one block above? You'd need to place 10 blocks (one extra to get the top block in, but the final result would just be 9 blocks). < 1294093622 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nothing can get into that, nothing can spawn in it, and you need nothing else forever. < 1294093633 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :900 cobblestone is not especially much for some sort of a megastructure. < 1294093638 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I conclude that to win Minecraft, one has to mine 10 blocks, and you then complete the game with one block. < 1294093650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well... actually, removing the block you need to place the top would be difficult. < 1294093654 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, every time I started a single player game I ended up on a beech. I don't get it. Isn't the starting position random at all? < 1294093658 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So basically to win Minecraft takes 10 blocks of any description. Well, apart from sand. < 1294093665 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I end up on a beach quite often but I don't think always. < 1294093675 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, true that would work < 1294093701 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, 900 is hardly enough for any sort of mega structure < 1294093708 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but too much for everything else < 1294093755 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you need 9 blocks. You can remove the one used to place and then reuse it for another yet unbuilt wall < 1294093765 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming it is something that can be removed < 1294093768 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not glass or such) < 1294093788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Oh, indeed. < 1294093797 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Takes 10 blocks and you finish with one. < 1294093799 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BRB, winning Minecraft. < 1294093812 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you could manage with two blocks if you find a straight cliff side. mine two. walk into the hole. Place the two just outside the hole < 1294093816 0 :BMG!~behold@d83-183-183-70.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1294093824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Oh INDEED. < 1294093825 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does lava mean that there are precios minerals near? < 1294093826 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I will do that now. < 1294093837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: It means you're near the bottom of the lava, where most minerals are. < 1294093838 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, is it wise to start a mine near lava lake? < 1294093841 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, or 3 blocks if you dig down into the ground and place one back above you < 1294093849 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the lava is on surface < 1294093853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Oh. < 1294093855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: That indicates nothing. < 1294093859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: (Good luck to find one of them though.) < 1294093860 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, there are lava lakes at many altitudes nowdays < 1294093865 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Build a base on top for the lulz. < 1294093868 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, even just a few blocks below < 1294093874 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't have glass :D < 1294093877 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Shush, I'm about to win Minecraft with two blocks. < 1294093880 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: just get sand < 1294093884 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I noticed lava lakes on the surface are WAY more common in SMP than in single player < 1294093889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Spawned on a beach X-D < 1294093890 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, based on a local testing server < 1294093895 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, HAH! < 1294093903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I blame Notch < 1294093936 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pumpkinz! < 1294093941 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, NO NEED! < 1294093948 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294093948 0 :BMG!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294093948 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, two blocks remember < 1294093950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I WIN < 1294093952 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :BeholdMyGlory < 1294093956 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hart staircases do you build? < 1294093956 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh? < 1294093958 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3x3? < 1294093967 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, hart? < 1294093972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: I did 3x3 shafts and then do the middle as staircases. < 1294093980 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Took two dirt from a hill, stepped inside, placed them on the floor outside. < 1294093981 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I win. < 1294093984 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now to actually play. < 1294093988 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, indeed < 1294093989 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you win < 1294094002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SNOW BIOME OMG <3 < 1294094017 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294094019 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes I spawned in that once. On a beech in one. < 1294094022 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go figure < 1294094026 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BEACH < 1294094029 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yeah whatever < 1294094033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :B < 1294094033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :E < 1294094033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A < 1294094035 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C < 1294094037 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :H < 1294094039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: English spelling fail < 1294094061 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note to self: always say "beech" to elliott instead. And call the tree "beach". Just to annoy him < 1294094076 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that I will do. < 1294094098 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ENGLISH IS NOT THAT HARD. :P < 1294094143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Holy shit SSP is slow. < 1294094158 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, bug since beta yes < 1294094162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Move over, Crysis. < 1294094165 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, try those mods. they help somewhat < 1294094175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I like Better Light. < 1294094201 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, try the save one? I haven't tried that one yet < 1294094219 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I might but I rarely play SSP. < 1294094259 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294094261 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, whyever not? < 1294094298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WATERFALL OMG WATERFALL LOVE < 1294094301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Less fun. < 1294094317 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :People farm cobblestone? < 1294094331 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, scared of the monsters? < 1294094337 0 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs186230.pp.htv.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1294094343 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, not farm really no < 1294094348 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, factory sure < 1294094350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I play peaceful because I'm a wimp. < 1294094357 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott ++ < 1294094370 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also hypocrite < 1294094374 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(wrt nooga) < 1294094384 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't recommend that other people become wimps. < 1294094714 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294094722 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh i died but i've managet to get back < 1294094728 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, ah < 1294094736 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zombie spawned in a cavern < 1294094737 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whee < 1294094740 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is the best idea ever < 1294094745 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :invert my screen every 0.5 seconds < 1294094745 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, need more lights then < 1294094752 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, .... why? < 1294094824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: 0.1 < 1294094843 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, make sure to warn any epileptic person then! < 1294094843 0 :Munekhtew!~munekhtew@unaffiliated/munekhtew JOIN :#esoteric < 1294094852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no enjoy the pain < 1294094860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Munekhtew is a monkey cthulhu < 1294094880 0 :Munekhtew!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nops < 1294094917 0 :Munekhtew!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just watch < 1294094950 0 :Munekhtew!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294095043 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1294095120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: what about infinite D tic tac toe, oklopol played that with me < 1294095122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:55 Phantom_Hoover_: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=120946&sid=fb4376cb29342af1342de884bbc7f90b < 1294095125 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is whiny < 1294095160 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: basically you had to get 4 in a row in any dimension i think... coordinates were lists of naturals (or integers, I forget) < 1294095177 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: it may have been more complex than that. I remember it had its own mini-language to describe infinite coordinate lists :) < 1294095186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: The nice thing there is that the coordinates are isomorphic to reals. < 1294095238 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One of the requirements is that it be fun and playable with pencil-and-paper. In other words, you're not doing constant insane math, and real numbers are pretty much right out. :P < 1294095256 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: you don't even think about the reals < 1294095261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: it's just infinite coordinate lists < 1294095274 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: btw i played it with oklopol with a bot and it /was/ fun, so fuck your pencil-and-paper requirement < 1294095280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: hell, playing chess with pencil-and-paper is a bitch < 1294095285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: so what is the point of that requirement? < 1294095292 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wtf: http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Redstone_circuits#The_North.2FSouth_Quirk < 1294095304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: lol < 1294095309 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, VERY USEFUL but /might/ be fixed < 1294095346 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, I guess pencil-and-paper /per se/ wasn't what I was looking for, just playable with minimal setup "in real life" (that is, no computer required) < 1294095352 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294095354 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :18 iron < 1294095358 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pencil-and-paper is just nice because it's near-zero setup. < 1294095381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: You can do this with pencil and paper quite easily, just note down the filled columns. It's not a /graphical/ representation, but "meh". < 1294095392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Smelt it in a furnace (1 coal = 8 ores turned into N ingots). < 1294095400 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1294095403 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doing that < 1294095425 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: An interface would be quite fun, since you can "hack" it into a finite display by saying that (X 0 0 0 0 ...) is X, and all the rest of X is "inside" X. < 1294095431 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then what to do with the iron? armor? wapon? iron picks aren't too durable < 1294095433 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then (X Y 0 0 0 0 ...) is Y for all Y, etc. < 1294095446 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: So you can basically move around the board, and go inside one level, and that lets you navigate. < 1294095455 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Of course infinite placement requires /some/ kind of expressive moves, but eh :P < 1294095467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: They aren't, but you need them to mine quite a bit of stuff. < 1294095473 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Armour and sword are always good picks. < 1294095481 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : nooga: Smelt it in a furnace (1 coal = 8 ores turned into N ingots). <-- where N = 8 < 1294095501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: So basically you have 90 iron ingots. < 1294095511 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: You can make all the armour with that I believe. < 1294095520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And probably a few tools too. < 1294095524 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sword and pickaxe I'd go for. < 1294095532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course you might want to keep a lot of it for later :P < 1294095550 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, sword and pickaxe, then armor. And don't throw away any iron like you did with the cobble < 1294095620 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Armour is most important. < 1294095635 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make a full set of iron armour, two swords, and the rest into pickaxes (with a few swords if you have enough). < 1294095641 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294095648 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, okay then. < 1294095652 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, stone tools aren't actually all that bad and they're super-renewable. < 1294095658 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But, uh, stone armour :-P < 1294095668 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you mean leather armor < 1294095670 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :armour* < 1294095670 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt he has any armour now, so getting it would be a high priority. < 1294095680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yeaaah not only is that a pain to get the leather for but it's beyond useless :P < 1294095695 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, fair enough < 1294095707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Got any chainmail in your game? < 1294095711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's made out of PURE FIRE http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Chainmail < 1294095717 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no, that would be cheating :P < 1294095720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PURE < 1294095721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FIRE < 1294095749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Anyway, iron armour is pretty much the most practical armour considering that diamond is incredibly scarce, gold is a joke, and leather is... leather. < 1294095749 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Chainmail armor has the same durability as Gold armor. " < 1294095755 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in other words. Pretty useless < 1294095758 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Just get MORE FIRE < 1294095808 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does diamond stuff ever break < 1294095809 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294095820 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, yes. But it takes ages < 1294095837 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does HHI have diamond supplies? < 1294095847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Diamond is utterly free on the server :P < 1294095857 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, only for the 3 basic tools < 1294095859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a large chest (ok, currently inaccessible) of it at spawn, and there's a kit to get diamond tools. < 1294095863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Sword too. < 1294095865 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, wait, no. < 1294095866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, whatever. < 1294095866 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1294095869 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not sword indeed < 1294095872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The chest will probably be fixed sometime. < 1294095874 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it hardly matters. < 1294095876 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, quite < 1294095880 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A "kit" to get diamond tools? < 1294095892 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, yes for pickaxe/axe/spade < 1294095925 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How does a chest become accidentally inaccssible? < 1294095928 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, btw the tools in the "stacks" are used one at a time I found. So if you have a stack of 3-4 you can forget to renew for some time < 1294095932 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's under spawn protection. < 1294095935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Server-side inventory stole it from us. < 1294095938 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, by being in spawn protection area < 1294095950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Also we have a kit that fills your entire inventory with glass. Including armour slots. < 1294095954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You actually see the glass cube on your head. < 1294095955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's great. < 1294095969 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you should have glass elsewhere on your body IMO < 1294095992 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I like how you can get cactusheads and portalheads. < 1294095998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would pay good money for a portalhead. < 1294096005 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, portalheads? LINK! < 1294096011 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been thinking about some kind of assembly language with macros, types and abstraction, but everything still rooted in actual assembly... you could see it as the ultimate assembly-generation DSL < 1294096019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: There were no pictures but it was in a thread of people trying various headgears. < 1294096024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Apparently the portal actually animates. < 1294096032 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, cool < 1294096037 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Level_Assembly Congrats, you're a crazy person. < 1294096038 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try it on a local server < 1294096039 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, AKA HLA? < 1294096070 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I've been thinking about some kind of assembly language with macros, types and abstraction, but everything still rooted in actual assembly... you could see it as the ultimate assembly-generation DSL <-- dependant types!? < 1294096071 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: Just write enough of Lisp to have an x86 assembler and macros, and you can built types, structures etc. on top of that. But, oops! Haha, you just invented Lisp. < 1294096071 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Adamantium needs to exist < 1294096081 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: So why would you want to use assembly. < 1294096092 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It does, it's called bedrock. < 1294096123 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AKA adminium. < 1294096140 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AKA bedrock because adminium is a horrible name. < 1294096141 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I /gave myself some on my local test server then built a room out of it and added a warp point inside. Great fun. < 1294096162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes, er, great fun. < 1294096197 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hmm, maybe it would end up as crazy as HLA by necessity, was hoping for awesome rather than crazy though :P < 1294096215 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes because you could never break it with TNT. Not even with with >500 TNT (which could break obsidian) < 1294096228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: http://imgur.com/a/hGmQ1/1#ZCUK4 100-block diameter dome of jaw-dropping awesomeness. < 1294096232 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: dependent types, yes, probably... < 1294096239 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FWIW, I think it is actually possible to penetrate bedrock or obsidian ceilings. < 1294096239 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: You know what dependent types are, right? < 1294096269 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: And, well, as I said, the simplest and most awesome way to do this is Lisp ... but when you have Lisp, why would you want assembly> < 1294096272 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*assembly? < 1294096312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: You just need a bunch of assembler primitives and the basic Lisp toolset -- then you can build labels, "combined" instructions (i.e. "mov" out of all the different kinds of mov), proper addressing (just have the offsets etc. built in to the primitives -- basically make it a direct match for machine code). < 1294096321 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: Then you can build macros, types, etc. on top of that with Lisp macros. < 1294096325 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the tooltip for bedrock? "Bedrock"? < 1294096350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: "What how do you have this stop it" < 1294096351 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, the idea was that it should allow enough abstraction to be able to have a language like haskell defined as a combination of type system and "macro" features that you can write haskell-syntax programs and your macros do code-generation to assembly code like a haskell compiler would :) < 1294096385 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also a level more like C, where you mostly have register allocation and function calls handled for you < 1294096385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: so basically you substitute fragile macros for a real language :> < 1294096422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Welp, be back in 20-30-40 minutes. < 1294096424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294096556 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : fizzie: "What how do you have this stop it" <-- really? *goes to check* < 1294096567 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it's just bedrock. < 1294096576 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah < 1294096584 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least I think so. < 1294096619 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tile.bedrock.name=Bedrock < 1294096635 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I it's "Bedrock" yes < 1294096638 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(lang/en_US.lang in minecraft.jar.) < 1294096650 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, it has langauges? < 1294096651 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1294096662 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what locales does it have? < 1294096669 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's the only file in there. < 1294096680 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it seems like an attempt for localization. < 1294096696 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It contains what seems to be the most of the text in the UI. < 1294096750 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, the "internal names" for Netherrack, Soul Sand and Glowstone (i.e. netherstuff, slowsand/mud and lightstone) are "hellrock", "hellsand" and "lightgem". < 1294096915 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Github's thing where if you write "closes #n" or "fixes #n" in a commit message, it actually goes and closes issue #n, puts a link to the issue-post into the commit view, and adds the commit message as a comment in the issue (except with "closes/fixes #n" → "closed/fixed by [commit id]") is a nice (if quirky) thing. < 1294097303 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Invent a TeX format for code golf. < 1294097344 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Yeah, only MP, SP fences are just fine. < 1294097344 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" < 1294097359 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that's nice, random bugs seemingly unrelated to the mode are mode dependent < 1294097360 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used to think there was no command in TeX for calculating overfullness of boxes, but actually there is. < 1294097370 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It still baffles me why you wouldn't just make SP a special case of MP. < 1294097374 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's so *obvious*. < 1294097464 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: What is SP, does it stand for "Special" or "Special Point" or something like that? < 1294097472 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd probably completely fail to realize that people would want SP < 1294097475 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, single player < 1294097476 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, single-player. < 1294097481 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1294097483 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where "MP" is multi-player. < 1294097505 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well then, you should have a single-player mode, multi-player, and multi-player with one player. < 1294097635 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1294097664 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1294097738 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, where the last of those is exactly equivalent to single-player. < 1294097748 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, there? < 1294097761 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I still get that high altitude bug. Updated one hour ago < 1294097773 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If that is how it works, then you don't need single-player mode, except for it to possibly mean turn off network access. < 1294097818 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmmn. < 1294097853 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, f3 reports 114 < 1294097860 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and placing on ground next to me < 1294097875 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, now it only bugs in top view < 1294097876 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, let's see. < 1294097881 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, not in normal view < 1294097897 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait, normal too, but less obvious < 1294097955 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, does not happen at 113, but happens at 115 < 1294097979 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294098030 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294098096 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it seems to do something strange. < 1294098123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I made an isue 'cuz i'm cool < 1294098124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*issue < 1294098132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah you fixed it < 1294098132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe < 1294098141 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: i would prefer it if nomap didn't use sdl < 1294098149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :avoid loading it etc < 1294098154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i guess it might already be loaded < 1294098165 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's linked-to, anyway. < 1294098172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294098194 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like the comment says, a no-SDL nomap would be nicer; but I don't think it makes much practical difference there. < 1294098201 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Would you think it rude if I rewrote the wholet hing in ML? :D < 1294098263 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: continuing from before, what I have in mind is not really "macros" in the typical code-that-makes-code macros... rather something like type classes, let's say it'd let you define a category of "boxed values" and describe that they are thunks that get forced when looked at < 1294098273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: weird < 1294098292 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, cool < 1294098331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'tronic uses higher resolution textures than the standard minecraft ones so you need to run the HD Texture Fix or your bricks and hellstone will look all fucked up." < 1294098336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What a weird thing to break. < 1294098338 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*"tronic < 1294098382 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, fun fact: minecraft uses a signed value for durability. And counts up. Not down. With an inventory editor you could make a twice as durable diamond tool for example :D < 1294098395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Indeed. That has been done. < 1294098403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: With negative values. < 1294098410 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Also Minecraft uses signed EVERYTHING; Java has no unsigned. < 1294098414 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, exactly < 1294098439 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wait, what about reading binary data with unsigned values? < 1294098458 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You add a lot of &0xff's in. < 1294098471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION decides to try Tronic again. < 1294098496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love how Java perfectly strides the line between low-level drudge work and high-level limitedness, achieving neither. < 1294098503 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Truly the most useless of languages. < 1294098564 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You never answered my ML question! How rude! < 1294098567 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, btw about that stupid "for older computer" texture pack. I just realised that with texture compression involved it /might/ actually save some video ram. Very very doubtful it would make a difference though < 1294098583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: But DUDE, it has to PUT LESS PIXELS < 1294098597 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol >>> operator < 1294098607 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, what does it do? < 1294098615 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Zero-extend bitshift, IIRC. < 1294098618 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well not that. But it might, /just might/, have to shuffle less data to/from video ram < 1294098622 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, in which language < 1294098623 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The default >> sign-extends. < 1294098625 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Java. < 1294098629 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294098659 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(as for why assembly is involved in my idea - it's mostly because I've been writing assembly lately and realized it involves a lot of boring drudge work :) ) < 1294098681 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, who let Notch play with the Minecraft Wiki? < 1294098690 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Oh, I must've erased that comment. It was something along the lines of "no, as long as you don't push the ML rewrite as the master branch of mcmap". Of course you're free to reimplement it in any language you like. < 1294098692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: What. < 1294098693 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(so I want something that'll both allow register fiddling and custom calling conventions (where relevant or interesting), as well as higher-level programming where you don't really care, while never leaving the same language... was thinking about making an actual haskell dsl to generate my kernel assembly, and then thought some more along those lines :P) < 1294098698 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The wiki is dow < 1294098700 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :down < 1294098714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Can I push it to the totally-better-and-more-awesome-fizzie-sucks branch? < 1294098723 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, not rare < 1294098754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: I wanted to do a Scheme OS a while back, and someone lisppasted an awesome x86 assembler written in a few hundred lines of Scheme. < 1294098755 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, sure, I don't see anything rude about that. < 1294098789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: The most AWSUM(tm) way to do a kernel in Scheme would be to write the code with an in-Scheme assembler, building up useful macros to relieve the drudge work, so that you have macros that implement a sizeable subset of a Scheme compiler. < 1294098811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: Then you write a Scheme JIT compiler in this Scheme-based-assembler-with-macro-based-compiler-of-a-lot-of-Scheme. < 1294098820 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: Voila! You can now do the rest in Scheme, with inline Scheme-assembler. < 1294098828 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: What I'm saying is, live my dreams for me so I don't have to do the work. < 1294098831 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, isn't that the way @ works? < 1294098833 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, spawn on multiplayer test server is not at 0,0 btw. And it is on a beach. < 1294098844 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it has not been moved < 1294098861 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, however it is closer to 0,0 than on ineiros's server < 1294098863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: heh. very well then, but obviously someone travelled to (0,0), moved about three chunks, and then left < 1294098864 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not possible for walking < 1294098878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Close, close ... I'm too hardcore to depend on anything but an assembler, so the implementation of the @-language is done in pure, raw assembly. < 1294098895 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, this is why it will never be made. < 1294098896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: The way I figure it is: if I wanted to use a better language I would use @-lang. < 1294098896 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, spawn coords: -19 -34 < 1294098916 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now < 1294098921 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is what i call mining < 1294098932 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've found an ultimate cavern < 1294098957 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wrong < 1294098963 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there exists a chance of a better one < 1294098965 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it isn't ultimate < 1294098997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your MOM is the ultimate cavern lol < 1294099011 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's what she said < 1294099020 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm slightly upset that all MC worlds are larger than the largest AW world < 1294099022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: osnap—that's what your face said to her when she said it < 1294099034 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I'm slightly upset that all MC worlds are larger than the largest AW world < 1294099036 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Also, all MC worlds are more fun than the funnest possible AW world (which is no fun at all). < 1294099040 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol what < 1294099045 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ANOTHER SLIGHT < 1294099053 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha! < 1294099055 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: lol what to what < 1294099055 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iron < 1294099060 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOADS OF GODDAMN IRON < 1294099063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: don't you have enough < 1294099068 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: your awful awful comeback < 1294099070 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also < 1294099075 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :world needs more rockraiders remakes < 1294099077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: almost as awful as your mom < 1294099079 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AlphaWorld is (32750 * 2)^2 square meters < 1294099082 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't think scheme is quite up to the task of fulfilling my vision :) < 1294099089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: except that's not actually possible < 1294099110 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a better fuel for furnance than coal? < 1294099111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: You can't do my dream-but-one (not quite my dream) with Haskell 'cuz Template Haskell sucks bawlz. < 1294099114 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: yes < 1294099122 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember seeing something about it being roughly the size of California < 1294099128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: but, coal + multiple furnaces is fast and economical < 1294099138 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Furnace#Fuel_efficiency < 1294099141 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: lava bucket is the most hardc0re < 1294099147 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh... One blog is almost down... Presumably because highly popular podcast is about to be released today... < 1294099149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"*Note that using a Lava Bucket will not only use the lava, but destroy the bucket as well." < 1294099155 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: you can use stairs and jukeboxes and fences for no apparent reason < 1294099195 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, obviously I'd have to write my own compiler or compile-time interpreter or whatever it ends up being < 1294099207 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294099288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: GET ON MC < 1294099339 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, if you haven't blown up Mt. Vorpal by "accident" I will be sorely disappointed. < 1294099359 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" (Note: You cannot farm cheap obsidian here, as the water evaporates!) " < 1294099594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: I have. < 1294099715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: I am ready to blow things up. < 1294099723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Can we make a 10x10x10 cube of TNT? < 1294099734 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO. < 1294099739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: 3x3x3? < 1294099754 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2x2x2 is already an insanely huge explosion. < 1294099761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: 3x2x2? < 1294099784 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2x2x2. Full stop. < 1294100131 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmhm < 1294100643 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hey < 1294100695 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: hi < 1294100878 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tell me of your favorite type system < 1294100999 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294101003 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: um < 1294101006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: depends! < 1294101009 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x3 < 1294101011 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this cave is too big to light < 1294101011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: system I\Xi is pretty nice < 1294101014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: no it isn't < 1294101016 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: get more torches < 1294101018 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tell me about it < 1294101023 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there are monsters < 1294101031 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, people do mine obsidian: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=78446 < 1294101201 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it possible to make a lava column? < 1294101666 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, yes. < 1294101747 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wasn't your scree x9nn? < 1294101763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: what. < 1294101772 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, screen res < 1294101775 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, on your macbook air < 1294101776 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tell me < 1294101781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 1440x900 < 1294101787 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that small? < 1294101805 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, "ha ha my computer is better than yours" < 1294101809 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to quote you < 1294101823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope mine is better < 1294101824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sry < 1294101844 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, 1680x1050 > 1440x900 < 1294101852 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, thus in that aspect mine is better < 1294101860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine is better in every way < 1294101869 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well fuck. < 1294101872 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, except that < 1294101878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ? < 1294101879 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also fewer usb ports < 1294101887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the usb ports are better though < 1294101887 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, mine has... 8 usb ports < 1294101891 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some Senators are stating that they will allow the US to default on its debts. < 1294101892 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also the fewer pixels are more zen < 1294101893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :q.e.d < 1294101899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: luzl < 1294101904 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how are your usb ports better? usb 3.0? < 1294101935 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We do not know what will happen if that happens, except that it will be *fucking terrible*. < 1294101943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: they're more usb < 1294101948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: but yes this has usb 3 < 1294101954 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also you don't have hardware midi! < 1294101962 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, or built in gbit ethernet < 1294101970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: nope, it's because steve jobs wrote the software midi himself and it sounds like angels peeing on your face < 1294101979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the ethernet is 20gb duh that's why it has to be housed in a separate container < 1294101982 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, or 1 TB non-volatile storage space < 1294101983 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and the dollar would probably instantly go into hyperinflation. < 1294101985 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because otherwise it would be breaking speed regulations < 1294101991 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I have more, I have petabytes < 1294101995 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: they call it "the internet" < 1294101998 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, har har < 1294102003 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it even has a wireless connection to it < 1294102005 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUILT IN < 1294102010 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :] < 1294102016 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, 11n? < 1294102021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes actually. < 1294102022 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so does my thinkpad < 1294102025 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it has 11n < 1294102027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Does it have USB 3.0? < 1294102039 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no but it has more usb ports than you < 1294102044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But they're worse. < 1294102050 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway aren't usb 3.0 ports taller? < 1294102052 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :than usb 2 < 1294102056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Er. No. < 1294102060 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, err yes < 1294102066 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, or is that usb 4? < 1294102068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Allow me to repeat: Err, no. < 1294102078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, it's actually USB 2.0. < 1294102086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: My USB ports are better because they're more USB porty than your USB ports. < 1294102092 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quod erat demonstrandum, motherfucker. < 1294102099 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DO YOU CONCEDE < 1294102136 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how are they more usb porty? < 1294102146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Because they're more USB. < 1294102148 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and no I do not concede < 1294102152 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, because I call that a lie < 1294102162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You are wrong and your entire family is made out of meat. < 1294102179 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so is your < 1294102197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, I'm a computer. < 1294102198 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, *yours. < 1294102212 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also: I FUCKING WISH MINECRAFTFORUM WOULD REMOVE THAT IRRITATING NOTCH SMILEY. < 1294102215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ALL THE IDIOTS USE IT < 1294102227 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, solution: adblock it < 1294102236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Too much work. < 1294102241 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, two clicks? < 1294102243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Idiots are the problem. :p < 1294102248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: (1) Install AdBlock < 1294102259 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, 1) already done... over two years ago < 1294102265 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: For you, not me. < 1294102276 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how can you live with the ads? < 1294102289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I don't browse sites that show me irritating ads. < 1294102293 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Bonus: I don't browse shitty sites. < 1294102298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or at least I browse less of them. < 1294102304 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, same but google ads = irritating to me < 1294102305 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294102313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Then you're just whiny. < 1294102325 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, they were okay when they only allowed text < 1294102331 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find AdBlock a need. < 1294102337 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but now I'm pretty sure I seen graphics in one < 1294102340 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Essentially all ads are fucking annoying. < 1294102344 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, indeed < 1294102351 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Google's text ads being the only exception. < 1294102364 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, they have non-text ads nowdays iirc? < 1294102371 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's put it this way: reddit has exactly two ad spots: the one at the top, which is commercially-posted links, almost all of which have comments and are often interesting; and the square ad on the right sidebar, which is _never_ irritating, never animated, and always subdued, and the admins keep it that way. < 1294102371 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sadens me < 1294102378 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Irritating ads get reported and removed extremely swiftly. < 1294102386 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Static images aren't too bad; a minor irritant. < 1294102391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plus, often subreddits etc. are advertised in the right bar and it can be interesting. < 1294102396 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see _no point_ in blocking those whatsoever. < 1294102400 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, oh yes I have gif animations set to "don't repeat" < 1294102409 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Animated images vary from "somewhat irritating" to "OH HOLY FUCK I MUST KILL SOMEONE". < 1294102416 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plus there's a good chance of them showing you a kitten instead of ads. < 1294102417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seriously. < 1294102426 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Flash ads make me want to line up all advertisers before a firing squad. < 1294102433 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They put random pictures there not linked to anything on like 1/5th of all page loads. < 1294102436 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I don't have flash of course < 1294102439 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :After that noise I just installed AdBlock and called it a day. < 1294102450 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, quite! < 1294102452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal lives in a world where not having Flash is "of course". < 1294102460 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294102461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, any website with Flash ads isn't worth the time of day. < 1294102465 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hey *you* don't have flash you said < 1294102468 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and ones that appear *over* the page also make me want to wipe out humanity. < 1294102468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I just don't browse such websites for more than 10 seconds at a time. < 1294102476 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, they made that? < 1294102477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Sure, but it's hardly "of course". < 1294102483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: They've "made that" since the 90s ... < 1294102487 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Livejournal has them now. < 1294102487 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no, accept it. < 1294102488 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes. < 1294102491 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_Those_ I would block. < 1294102493 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: What? < 1294102504 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it /is/ of course. Welcome to the club. Accept your fate. < 1294102517 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, video ads before a video are pretty annoying. < 1294102527 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially when it's the same fucking ad for every video on a site. < 1294102531 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, don't tell me youtube have them or something? < 1294102537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Nope, the next time I want to play a Flash game or watch a weebl's stuff cartoon I'll happily install it. < 1294102539 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Youtube does. < 1294102543 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :holy shit < 1294102551 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, it has ads before the video? < 1294102555 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this cave is never ending system of dark pits and halls < 1294102556 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, long live youtube-dk < 1294102557 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometimes. < 1294102558 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dl* < 1294102558 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then < 1294102567 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, youtube-dl for the win! < 1294102577 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(mostly corporate-posted videos.) < 1294102580 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, congrats on finding a large cavern system < 1294102590 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Because making a worse product is a good idea." < 1294102598 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, it happens a few times in every game. Rarely does it naturally go down to lava lake level < 1294102603 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but those are awesome < 1294102612 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had one game with two such. Near each other. < 1294102658 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone said they would make up a new kind of poker game and make manga of it, and then I will be the non-Japanese people to play this game. < 1294102689 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err! night! < 1294102695 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: youtube-dl is bullshit, just use a youtube->html5 thing. < 1294102699 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :359345743957395 of them exist < 1294102735 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why is it bull shit. It rocks if your connection can't handle highest definition available < 1294102758 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also I thought youtube had html5 naively nowdays? < 1294102768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Natively only on videos without ads and it's slow as fuck. < 1294102775 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294102788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, having to wait ages to watch a stupid YouTube video defeats the entire point. < 1294102850 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't use YouTube. It is full of wrong thing........ < 1294102860 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: youtube-dl is actually a god-send for some videos. < 1294102867 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you can watch while it downloads. Something like youtube-dl foo & sleep 10 && mplayer foo.flv works file < 1294102872 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fine* < 1294102878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I just use YouTube5 and it works perfectly. < 1294102891 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm happy for you. But don't call youtube-dl shit < 1294102897 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, if you don't like it, so be it < 1294102899 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Or mplayer `youtube-dl -g` < 1294102918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: mplayer is retarded, it never buffers enough. < 1294102920 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VpEu5AZnTGM < 1294102925 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, that works too if it doesn't fuck up buffering as elliott said < 1294102926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Wrong thing is an ellipsis made out of 8 dots. < 1294102930 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: -cache set-the-buffer-in-kilobytes < 1294102930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: It's three, man, it's three. < 1294102941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: It seems to buffer, use the entire buffer, get some more, etc. < 1294102942 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is stupid. < 1294102970 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is not ellipsis. It is a 8-dots-ellipsis. < 1294102987 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway don't complain about youtube-dl just because you don't use it. There are no technical problems with it as such. < 1294102993 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyways, I find youtube-dl handy for things encoded with the wrong aspect ratio, black level too high, interlaced, or the like. < 1294102997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Except sucking. < 1294103001 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: There is no such thing. < 1294103001 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how does it suck? < 1294103006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Every way! < 1294103018 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you are not helpful in the least < 1294103030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You see, it sucks. < 1294103032 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, stop being a turd. < 1294103034 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, batch download of something I don't want to watch *right now* but would like to watch later. < 1294103038 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tuuuuurd < 1294103040 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You love that word. < 1294103043 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, either say /why/ it sucks or shut up. < 1294103048 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Stop being a dumbass. < 1294103050 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no I don't. I used it once here. < 1294103053 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Because it sucks. < 1294103054 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, quite. < 1294103062 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294103065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I'm actually just trying to irritate him which is working splendidly. < 1294103068 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there, ignore added < 1294103074 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: See, dumbass! < 1294103080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How surprising. I bet it'll last for a whole ten minutes. < 1294103086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: To be fair, it's Vorpal and he always deserves it. < 1294103088 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, just use /ignore as well :) < 1294103107 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Nah, he's not pissing me off. < 1294103110 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Now there is such thing as 8-dots-ellipsis because I had just used it. < 1294103123 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Short-term stupidity is not enough to anger me, or even care too much about. < 1294103124 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, he is however a dumbass as usual < 1294103132 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"As usual"? < 1294103140 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is a different kind of punctuation than ellipsis because it is different use. < 1294103140 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Funny, he's usually fairly intelligent. < 1294103144 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, well okay he has moments where he lacks that < 1294103147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Tuuuuuuuuuurds < 1294103147 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, quite often even < 1294103158 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, BUT these dumbass moments are quite regular. < 1294103163 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yes, yes, pieces of fecal matter. < 1294103166 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, every few days < 1294103173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuurds < 1294103181 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: What Vorpal fails to understand is that I optimise solely for irritating him < 1294103200 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :P.S. Vorpal is wrong, he's used "turd" on here twice before. < 1294103239 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION hates knowing that everything sucks. < 1294103246 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't fix it! I'd have to rewrite everything! < 1294103270 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Every: OS, browser, emulator, compiler, etc. sucks ass. < 1294103276 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially emulators. < 1294103278 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION checks log to see if elliott became saner < 1294103280 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm nope < 1294103286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Turds turds turds. < 1294103289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Turds turds turds. < 1294103292 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TURDS. Turds turds. < 1294103295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know you've been logreading all this time. < 1294103296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tuuuuuurds < 1294103298 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know of only a handful that even emulate the system in question well. < 1294103299 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Is that a real sentence? < 1294103302 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Please ignore me forever.) < 1294103304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Yes. < 1294103310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You don't need to rewrite the OS, just use @. < 1294103318 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"17:06:40 P.S. Vorpal is wrong, he's used "turd" on here twice before." <-- as a matter of fact, you used the word before too. And using a word more than once doesn't really mean you love it. It wasn't recently in any case. < 1294103320 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fewer still that have a usable UI. < 1294103325 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Precisely one with readable code. < 1294103328 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Turdy turdy turd < 1294103330 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it is, amazingly, in C++.) < 1294103337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: @@@ < 1294103353 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, readable C++. < 1294103390 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION WTFs at iCraft < 1294103392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: @ @ @ best os ? best os < 1294103403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: what about it < 1294103416 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, what is in readable C++ hm? < 1294103422 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Portals that just teleport to the same world? < 1294103428 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the best operating system is plan 9 < 1294103432 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: bsnes. < 1294103435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: that's cool people did Portal esque stuff with it < 1294103435 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, ah < 1294103441 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seriously, look at it. < 1294103445 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: plan 9 is kinda lame. < 1294103452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a major improvement on unix but still way, way too little. < 1294103452 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's true. < 1294103456 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's, like, executable documentation of an SNES. < 1294103457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hell, genera was clloser. < 1294103461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*closer. < 1294103487 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem with genera is it doesn't have plan9's gui < 1294103500 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, but does it use enhanced cweb? *ducks* < 1294103511 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it doesn't. < 1294103524 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Sgeo WTFs at iCraft <-- ? < 1294103533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: plan 9's gui is better than most GUIs but wildly substandard. < 1294103540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: genera's UI was nicer because it was basically Emacs. < 1294103555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Admittedly Plan 9's was more flexible. < 1294103556 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think the standard is the average, not the median < 1294103559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Genera makes up for that by using Lisp.) < 1294103562 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294103587 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, but does it use CWEB or any variant of CWEB? *peoples* < 1294103589 0 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-57-8.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1294103595 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: NEIN < 1294103597 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*aardvarks* < 1294103655 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the reason why i like calculators made out of ttl logic is that you can't write a kernel for them, precluding the whole os debate. < 1294103664 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: today i uploaded an interlaced video to my sight which claims to be xhtml but is in fact subtly invalid on every page and sent out of text/html < 1294103665 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: riiight < 1294103698 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: it was about downloading a bunch of GoodSNES ROMs and playing them with ZSNES, which I praised as the best piece of software ever written < 1294103721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: i also mocked bsnes for having ridiculous system requirements < 1294103739 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zsnes is really well made < 1294103772 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, why could you not make a calculator with TTL logic capable of running an OS? < 1294103775 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in theory I mean < 1294103781 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: It's very good assembly code. Its emulation leaves much to be desired these days, though. < 1294103783 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Fuck you. < 1294103785 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure you would need more than the standard components < 1294103797 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: hahahahahahahaha successful trolling < 1294103800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should actually do that < 1294103815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: zsnes is actually terrible. < 1294103827 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: it's basically a collection of hacks to make the most popular games work and nothing else. < 1294103841 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, my experience with it was very good. < 1294103849 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Like most emulators, sadly. < 1294103851 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, yes, just about any emulator can run $game. < 1294103854 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's nothing new. < 1294103869 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: except for MAME!111 except MAME is, like, actively developed to be as useless for actually playing things as possible. < 1294103875 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it always felt very solid and fast and the options it provided always set it apart from other emulators < 1294103883 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make something like TRIP test but meant to test NES emulator, SNES emulator, GameBoy emulator, etc. < 1294103907 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Among other things, zsnes will change the emulated clock rate to work around bugs in its emulation. < 1294103908 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: because then it'd be more than a calculator < 1294103908 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Honest. < 1294103924 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, well but nothing in TTL logic precludes it < 1294103926 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: yeah, emulators are always funny < 1294103938 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no, but the word "calculators" does < 1294103943 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, also no. my TI-83+ is still a calculator. graphing calculator. < 1294103943 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Not all emulators are like that. < 1294103948 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, with flash < 1294103949 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so on < 1294103954 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, but it is a calculator < 1294103956 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's not discrete ttl logic < 1294103960 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Though bsnes has somewhat high system requirements, it's very good... < 1294103964 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, indeed. < 1294103974 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: you can turn bsnes down btw to get something that runs fast with slightly lower compatibility < 1294103977 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still vastly more than zsnes though < 1294103986 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't remember if i'd ever used bsnes < 1294103991 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, but then we seen that nothing in either "TTL logic" NOR "calculator" precludes being unable to have an OS < 1294103999 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my current gripe is not having a working DS emulator < 1294104000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: zsnes in and of itself is not a problem, although I don't know why you'd use it; the problem is people who advocate it blindly and malign things like bsnes for no reason. < 1294104001 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: bsnes's performance profile will accurately emulate all but 1 licensed game and all but a handful of demos. < 1294104008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Indeed. < 1294104016 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, thus follows that a calculator in TTL logic could have an OS < 1294104017 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: snes9x is better at "I just wanna play a game on this low-end machine", FWIW. < 1294104018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Than zsnes.) < 1294104040 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVt9dgpxwF4&feature=related what's the point of making the stripes go all the way down? < 1294104049 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, it has some other profile than "performance"? < 1294104052 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Its accuracy profile emulates every SNES game accurately except for 2, and the ones that use the Satellaview expansion. < 1294104061 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Performance, compatibility, accuracy. < 1294104069 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, compat does what? < 1294104076 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, even more performance than performance? < 1294104098 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there any sort of thing similar to TRIP test but is meant for testing accuracy of SNES emulation and so on? < 1294104104 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, also wait. performance: all but 1. accuracy all but 2? < 1294104105 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1294104109 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it's lower performance than the performance profile, but it has a somewhat more accurate CPU and PPU emulation. < 1294104119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it's an ascending scale < 1294104122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :performance does almost all shit < 1294104129 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compatibility does almost all + 1 (I think everything?) < 1294104132 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Oh, wait, I forgot to mention the 2 that can't be emulated *at all* currently. < 1294104132 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes, but the tense i used was present, i.e. "i like calculators (...)", not "i would like calculators (...)" < 1294104133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :accuracy does EVERYTHING PERFECTLY EVER. < 1294104139 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, ah < 1294104140 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ascending scale of system requirements. < 1294104141 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: this means, existing calculators. < 1294104149 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, okay < 1294104154 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Those 2 use special chips in the cartridge which have not been reverse engineered yet. < 1294104167 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, ah the fun of those < 1294104181 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It used to be 3, but SD Gundam GX's DSP chip got its program ROM dumped. < 1294104191 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, last month. < 1294104191 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice < 1294104194 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes, snes9x always seemed faster i think < 1294104208 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i remember not being able to play zsnes but being able to play snes9x at some point < 1294104215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: omg i just realised, bsnes will be like awesome on this machine < 1294104224 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyways, on top of those and the Satellaview, you get lower compatibility with the other profiles. < 1294104234 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this opponent thought he was so clever stuffing his king behind the pawn so the only way I could not stalemate was to lose the pawn < 1294104237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[The following two titles are unplayable, due to special on-cart DSPs whose program ROMs have not been extracted. < 1294104237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hayazashi Nidan Morita Shougi 1 (uses ST-0011 co-processor) < 1294104238 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hayazashi Nidan Morita Shougi 2 (uses ST-0018 co-processor) < 1294104239 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anything not in the above list is assumed to be fully compatible and bug-free.]] < 1294104247 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he lost 4 moves after taking the pawn to my rook < 1294104305 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: hmm, bsnes tries to build with g++-mp-4.5 < 1294104306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's -mp- < 1294104336 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The compatibility profile makes a graphical effect on 1 single game stop working and a couple demos stop working, and the performance profile *in addition* might not have pixel-accurate rendering of frames on other games. < 1294104351 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : else ifneq ($(findstring Darwin,$(uname)),) < 1294104351 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : platform := osx < 1294104351 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : delete = rm -f $1 < 1294104353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : else < 1294104355 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294104360 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : else ifeq ($(platform),osx) < 1294104360 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : compiler := gcc-mp-4.5 < 1294104360 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, the latter has reasonable system requirements? < 1294104366 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: That's a good sign the stock gcc won't work, isn't it. < 1294104386 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :multiprocessing ? < 1294104389 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, where reasonable means playable on a sempron 3300+ ;) < 1294104398 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ha great, the gcc shipping with os x doesn't do c++0x. < 1294104421 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, the performance profile can't do in-game debugging, and it doesn't emulate the bizarre requirement that you need to wait a few clock cycles before reading the result of a divide or multiply. < 1294104442 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Is the NES perfectly emulated yet? < 1294104445 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Does gcc ship with OS X now? < 1294104453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: If you install the developer tools, yes. < 1294104454 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought before you said it didn't. < 1294104456 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like it always has < 1294104461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But not in the very stock install, no. < 1294104465 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No official games care, but *many* ROM hacks will not do the necessary wait, because no other emulator handles that right. < 1294104468 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Nestopia. < 1294104483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Is it reaaaaaally perfect though? < 1294104509 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, does anything depend on that bizzare requirement < 1294104516 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bizarre* < 1294104539 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well unless it can emulate jitter in the master clock it's not perfect emulation < 1294104545 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is also the category of homebrew games, in addition to official and ROM hacks. < 1294104552 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Perfect assuming a flawless universe. :p < 1294104555 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No. But if you don't account for it, the game won't work on real hardware. < 1294104555 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i believe the master clock in the nes was a relaxation oscillator which was very funny < 1294104560 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as opposed to a crystal < 1294104562 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(they cheaped out) < 1294104563 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, fair enough < 1294104567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: i.e., cycle exact. < 1294104570 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this made games do funny things < 1294104575 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is why bsnes emulates it. < 1294104582 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slow down and speed up depending on what instructions were being run etc < 1294104589 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The idea is that if the game runs on the accuracy profile, it will work on a real SNES. < 1294104601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The Accuracy core uses a slower dot-based emulation of the S-PPU rather than the traditional scanline-based method found in other SNES emulators. The Compatibility core uses the scanline-based rendering with code speedups that obfuscate the source code to an extent" < 1294104605 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Err, what a strange text from Wikipedia. < 1294104610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That text links to the article on code obfuscation. < 1294104612 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is there no good ds emulator? < 1294104614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is it saying? "Performant code is ugly?" < 1294104625 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, isn't there one semi-decent? < 1294104628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Isn't NO$GBA meant to be popular. Or DeSmuME. < 1294104630 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It's not obfuscated, it's just optimised rather than being clear documentation. < 1294104633 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no$gba sucks < 1294104637 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :desmume sucks even more < 1294104639 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Right. < 1294104651 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure who wrote that line in the Wikipedia article, but eeew. < 1294104664 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no$gba is terrible: no saves, games are halfway unplayable < 1294104667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: OK, what simple systems aren't perfectly emulated. :p < 1294104672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: IT SOUNDS LIKE FUN < 1294104673 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :desmume is impossibly megaslow < 1294104683 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also games are unplayable < 1294104702 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Probably not the Gameboy Advance. < 1294104712 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Definitely* not the Playstation. < 1294104717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Oo, we have different definitions of simple, my friend. < 1294104724 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And beyond that you're dealing with "insanely complex". < 1294104772 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Okay, okay, lowering it a bit, then. Gameboy Advance not emulated well, nor, to my knowledge, is the Virtual Boy. < 1294104779 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sega dreamcast < 1294104782 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294104784 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sega saturn!! < 1294104785 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1294104788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: What about the original Gameboy? < 1294104808 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Gambatte or KiGB are believed to be as accurate as humanly possible. < 1294104819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: SUGGEST A SYSTEM < 1294104824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=haOCJ8wL0OA < 1294104830 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gambatte is used in bsnes for its Super Gameboy emulation currently. < 1294104874 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: The Magnavox Odyssey! < 1294104894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Insufficiently interesting :P < 1294104900 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is, in fact, *completely* unemulated. < 1294104923 0 :p_q!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294104930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ...really? < 1294104930 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294104937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Analogue circuitry. NO THANK YOU. < 1294104942 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>:D < 1294104953 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Cycle-exact emulation is therefore utterly impossible on a digital machine :P < 1294104973 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Emulation of anything more recent than the SNES pretty much sucks ass. < 1294104978 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Hmm, is the C64 perfectly emulated? < 1294104992 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: VICE is pretty good, it's handled everything I've thrown at it and god knows C64 programmers do awful things to that machine. But? < 1294105005 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's a troll right < 1294105014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: What is? < 1294105026 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the video! < 1294105030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: No, it's real. < 1294105036 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: ly terrible. < 1294105063 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: VICE seems to not be a perfect emulator... < 1294105073 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the voice at the end coming from offscreen sounds like zombo.com < 1294105078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: lol < 1294105079 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: :( < 1294105090 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's close. < 1294105091 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: The C64 is so complicated though, simply because of all the bugs and intricacies of implementation :P < 1294105100 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite. < 1294105100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: yeah, probably easier to leave the VICE people to finish the job < 1294105105 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GO FURTHER THAN YOU HAVE EVER GONE BEFORE. SEGA SATURN. ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE WITH SEGA SATURN. < 1294105110 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Suggest another machine, then :p < 1294105113 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I WANNA EMULATE < 1294105113 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WELCOME TO SEGA SATURN < 1294105128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: You will have nightmares about Silver Head tonight. < 1294105133 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hoxs64 appears to be perfect but DOESN'T HAVE SOURCE. < 1294105136 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's silver head again? < 1294105136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you ready... for the future? HAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHA < 1294105137 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Gameboy Advance. < 1294105145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: That guy. < 1294105147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the ad. < 1294105148 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's probably simpler than the SNES to emulate. < 1294105152 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294105153 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Isn't the GBA pretty damn advanced though? :p < 1294105159 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought i'd check out another promo < 1294105161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Lord knows the GBA emulators still get updated. < 1294105165 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i clicked and thought it can't be that bad < 1294105180 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after exactly 7 seconds i have realized how wrong i was: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=99iiUtPR-fM&NR=1 < 1294105197 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's similar to the SNES in capability, except without all the things that make emulator authors cry. < 1294105201 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: http://www.hoxs64.net/files/hoxs64.txt "Hoxs64 V1.0.0 BETA (c) 2001 David Horrocks" ""Core 2 Duo 1.5Ghz or Athlon 2Ghz or Pentium4 3Ghz." < 1294105202 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TIME TRAVELLER < 1294105205 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at the 12th second i have paused because i couldn't watch on. < 1294105219 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: SOLDIER ON < 1294105245 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: in fact the Hoxs64 project is a secret prototype benchmark for future generations of computer processors < 1294105255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294105258 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(16 MHz ARM, 4/8 MHz GB-Z80, *no fucking crazy PPU*, and NO SPECIAL CHIPS. AT ALL.) < 1294105262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: oh god, that one you linked < 1294105264 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: is the same one < 1294105266 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there, timed ignore expired < 1294105266 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it goes to Silver Head < 1294105268 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after saturngirl < 1294105268 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as they are released to the public, his nda allows him to add more architectures to the compatibility list < 1294105268 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see < 1294105272 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: turds turds turds < 1294105278 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, that ad, I think I saw myst in it < 1294105285 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the sega one) < 1294105327 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh damn, i hadn't even noticed < 1294105336 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i just paused on alienhead < 1294105339 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: then it goes on to do all sorts of things, from skipping around < 1294105343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :worst advert or best advert? < 1294105345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't decide < 1294105359 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: BTW, *most* emulators "still in development" don't focus much on improving emulation accuracy. < 1294105360 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I'll start a perfect emulation project for the GBA if you'll help. :p < 1294105363 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE INFINITE IS ATTAINABLE WITH SEGA SATURN < 1294105368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right. Which is why it sounds fun. < 1294105374 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And also _easier_; I can just implement the behaviour directly. < 1294105376 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Amusingly. SNES9x actually does improve on accuracy. < 1294105384 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: BUT YOU HAVE TO HELP because I'm supremely laz. < 1294105384 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y. < 1294105388 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC they now use the same sound emulation as bsnes. < 1294105395 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : worst advert or best advert? <-- worst by far I ever seen < 1294105406 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: BTW, NO$GBA is _meant_ to be a pretty good DS emulator for actually playing games... < 1294105412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: But is it the worst or the _best_? < 1294105416 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I can imagine Lynch creating that. < 1294105418 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i know < 1294105430 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: but it doesn't work for XX XY which immediately disqualifies it < 1294105435 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you only find out when you get to scene 8. < 1294105451 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least it doesn't work in wine. < 1294105466 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: FIrst and foremost, use Byuu's libco. < 1294105472 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the one with the woman looks like it would be against Swedish law. Gender discrimination. < 1294105473 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: That alone will save you a lot of effort. < 1294105483 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, as in, as an *ad* in Sweden < 1294105486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You mean the thing at the start? < 1294105489 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes < 1294105492 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the thing at the start < 1294105493 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HpA3RJyyVSk < 1294105498 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vectorman and ecco were really cool < 1294105500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: What if it was immediately followed by the same thing with a man. < 1294105505 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the one game i had never beat: the ooze < 1294105510 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was very fun too, but tough < 1294105512 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, doubt it would help if it was a man < 1294105523 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: heh < 1294105529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Is libco anything but coroutines? < 1294105535 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nope! < 1294105542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: But there are hundreds of coroutine libs. < 1294105548 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also what was the target audience? kids? < 1294105550 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :libco's small and simple. < 1294105551 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or older? < 1294105562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 13-year-olds who think it's cool. < 1294105565 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FpNbx53ErzQ < 1294105566 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: X-D Look at the first post on http://byuu.org/. < 1294105575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I sure hope he's not planning to upgrade that to Advance. < 1294105575 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, if kids they would have been into /deep shit/ in Sweden with such an ad. < 1294105582 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, because then stricter rules apply < 1294105587 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: He's not even intending to upgrade that to Color. < 1294105599 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What about PC emulation (for playing those DOS games that no longer work well under modern OSes)? < 1294105610 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It's meant to replace Gambatte for his Super Gameboy emulation. < 1294105616 0 :FireyFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294105620 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294105620 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: Bochs is pretty much cycle-accurate PC emulation. < 1294105624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DOSBox is usually more useful, though. < 1294105627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Fair enough then. < 1294105640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: So will you at least half-heartedly help with a GBA emulation project or do I have to be all alone :p < 1294105652 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may well help with it. < 1294105673 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though I wish I had a GBA flash cart so we could actually do hardware tests when necessary. < 1294105678 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Hey, didn't you say you'd port bsnes' Qt UI to libsnes? Seems he's already done that and looking for a maintainer ... < 1294105696 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"my megadrive, which is the japamanese original one" < 1294105701 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And maintainers have already stepped up before I saw that. :P < 1294105702 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Also, that would be nice. Aren't they still sold? < 1294105712 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes-ish. < 1294105728 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"As a consequence, the bsnes download page has removed reference to the old bsnes/Qt v070 release. This site will only focus on pure accuracy at any cost. I am hoping that the future Qt maintainer can set up a page for casual SNES emulator users to peruse." < 1294105735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is he trying to... become an emulation academic? < 1294105742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ph.D. in emulation? < 1294105750 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though it's possible later consoles actually change details. < 1294105759 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: He actually did not graduate from high school. < 1294105759 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I mean the flash carts. < 1294105766 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, yeah, totally. < 1294105769 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's nothing new. :p < 1294105775 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a GBA from launch. < 1294105779 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoo. < 1294105785 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I have an Advanced SP but not an original Advanced, but I'm faaairly sure they're absolutely identical internals-wise. < 1294105791 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except with a BACKLIGHT which is a killer feature. < 1294105796 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably, but not necessarily. < 1294105816 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The SNES's smaller revision actually changed a lot of details, for instance. < 1294105830 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, perfect gba emulation? cool < 1294105835 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, it's atually frontlit. Ha. < 1294105835 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perfect gameshark emulation too? < 1294105840 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Eh, I can always eBay. < 1294105844 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it's effectively the same as a cheap SNES clone from China, as far as capabilities go.) < 1294105859 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(yes, this means bsnes is more accurate than some "real" SNES's) < 1294105866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Paaatches welcome, I have no idea about the GBA hardware so this will basically be a diary of learning in version control form :) < 1294105885 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well I have no GBA hardware < 1294105893 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so I'm pretty much useless on this < 1294105895 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Fairly cheap right now. < 1294105905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The hardware won't help me *much*; I'll probably end up scouring the web for documentation to start with. < 1294105908 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, not sure I really care enough to get a gba < 1294105918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aw, but the GBA is a really nice cons... sort of. < 1294105926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...I can't actually think of many good non-Pokemon games for it really. < 1294105937 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Sonic Advance was decent. < 1294105938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT WHO CARES < 1294105941 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, zelda's link awakening? < 1294105948 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: GBC < 1294105954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, yeah, the Zeldas are probably good, never got around to playing any Zelda games on GBA. < 1294105960 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, oh right. But I played it in visual boy advance? < 1294105963 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, ports of good games. < 1294105971 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Which also emulates the GB/GBC. < 1294105975 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Inaccurately, but hey. < 1294105980 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, ah, so this won't work in your emulator then? < 1294105985 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::/ < 1294105986 0 :p_q!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294105991 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's actually not too much work to add GB or GBC emulation to a GBA emulator. < 1294106006 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well zelda is cool. Needs to be there and so on < 1294106006 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The GBA uses the GB-Z80 for some sound effects. < 1294106015 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294106030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: *my emulator! < 1294106035 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq is just helping because I'm forcing him to. < 1294106037 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like a wizard. < 1294106039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An evil wizard. < 1294106053 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, right got it. You are the figure head. < 1294106072 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right. < 1294106076 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant < 1294106080 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :missed a dot there < 1294106085 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294106095 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders how painful the ARM is. < 1294106137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: o god, i have to emulate an arm? < 1294106148 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Main CPU. < 1294106150 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh god, it's Thumb too. All new and modern. < 1294106154 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has a 16 MHz ARM. < 1294106175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1294106180 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :couldn't you reuse ARM code from qemu or something? < 1294106182 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also a GB-Z80! < 1294106183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iPod, Lego Mindstorms, Roomba... < 1294106187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All use the same CPU. < 1294106192 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what you really want to emulate is a directx8 pc for games < 1294106192 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I doubt that's cycle-accurate. < 1294106195 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I beg to differ < 1294106197 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that should be fairly easy. < 1294106197 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: qemu is very solidly not an accurate emulator. < 1294106200 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, lego mindstorms NXT sure < 1294106206 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NXT, yes. < 1294106210 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's like a half-JIT. < 1294106217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're the only person with a shitty enough university to care about mindstorms >:) < 1294106220 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but RCX used a H8300 < 1294106230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Maaybe not the GBA then... ARM sounds kinda painful. < 1294106231 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ennough with this mc < 1294106236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe but, maybe not. < 1294106236 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably works just fine for emulating a Linux system, but game consoles tend to care about a lot of annoying details. < 1294106236 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hey this I care about due to my free time < 1294106237 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :goodnight < 1294106242 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: buy it and you can get on our server :p < 1294106249 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Ahh, so you're just hopeless then! < 1294106256 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, elliott anyway RCX has a Hitachi H8300 < 1294106258 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as the CPU < 1294106263 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hitachi make CPUs? < 1294106266 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, used to < 1294106269 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Western Digital CPUs! < 1294106272 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seagate CPUs! < 1294106273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MAXTOR CPUS < 1294106273 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, they sold the division < 1294106276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :QUANTUM CPUS < 1294106278 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wanna do something < 1294106280 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't think of what though < 1294106283 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, nvidia cpus next < 1294106286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: HELP ME WRITE A PERFECT GBA EMULATOR. < 1294106291 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is weird because I'm pretty sure it's like one thing < 1294106292 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no u < 1294106305 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ima go one-line more project euler in Haskell < 1294106306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ATI CPUs, yes; well, AMD Vision CPUs, which will just be called AMD CPUs. < 1294106307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yes :P < 1294106310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: J bitch < 1294106323 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I actually bet the Atari is a royal pain to emulate. < 1294106326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Q: What do J users call the activity that other languages' users call "one-lining"? A: Half-charactering. < 1294106329 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H8_Family < 1294106338 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, "H8 is the name of a large family of 8-bit and 16-bit microcontrollers made by Renesas Technology, originating in the early 1990s within Hitachi Semiconductor and still actively evolving as of 2006." < 1294106365 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I believe they were Hitachi when the first RCX were produced < 1294106374 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then later they become Renesas for later model RCX < 1294106385 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not about to pry my two RCX open to check though < 1294106386 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Renesas. Sounds terrorist. < 1294106412 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mr spock is having a seizure: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvgteRnaIhA&feature=related < 1294106435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Before I get started on any of this though, I need to get Ubuntu installed. < 1294106443 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially as almost every game more advanced than Pong was actually exploiting unintended hardware features. < 1294106450 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Look at what OS X gives me: < 1294106450 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :say what? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ytwbGVExWi8&feature=related < 1294106452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: i686-apple-darwin10-gcc-4.2.1 (GCC) 4.2.1 (Apple Inc. build 5664) < 1294106463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Did I mention you have to use -fnested-functions to get nested functions? For no reason? < 1294106470 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: am I a bad person: triangles n = (:) <*> (:[]) . (+1) < 1294106472 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Bleck. < 1294106477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: haha they're smiling < 1294106484 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1294106485 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/n/ < 1294106504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: that won't parse < 1294106505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think < 1294106506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :needs more parens < 1294106516 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heck, displaying more than 2 sprites on the 2600 required using hardware bugs. < 1294106517 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :02:01 elliott: @pl ((:) <*> (:[])) . (+1) < 1294106517 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :02:01 lambdabot: ((:) <*> return) . (1 +) < 1294106519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: HTH < 1294106520 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wait, isn't .|. bitwise or in haskell? < 1294106530 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Umm, if you import Data.Bits I think. < 1294106534 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: X-D < 1294106535 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah right < 1294106544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Why? < 1294106546 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Any console ideas that don't involve ARM? < 1294106549 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it always looked so dirty to me :P < 1294106566 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what about GBC? < 1294106566 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, yeah, you're doing bitwise manipulations, you should feel dirt. < 1294106567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*dirty. < 1294106570 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think had ARM < 1294106573 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: N64? < 1294106574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: GBC has been done perfectly, I believe. < 1294106576 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it had* < 1294106577 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>:D < 1294106577 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq can confirm/deny < 1294106582 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, n64 yes! < 1294106589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Fuck you, man, N64 is where high-level emulators got INVENTED :P < 1294106602 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 100% game and demo compatibility has been achieved by two *different* emulators for the GBC. < 1294106608 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Proper N64 rerecording emulation would be pretty big deal... < 1294106621 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari, quite. Will you help elliott on this? < 1294106624 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yes, because nobody bothered emulating the RDP right. < 1294106629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: Don't believe his lies. < 1294106633 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I'm not doing N64. Ever. < 1294106637 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay. < 1294106642 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXHM1I8wgtc&feature=related < 1294106657 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. I'm actually unsure about the Sega family of systems. < 1294106671 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not even if the Singularity comes and we all get infinite lifespans to spend how I wish, and I perform every other possible action such that each action in the set can be performed in a time span of 700 billion years or less, < 1294106672 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Master System/Genesis/Game Gear) < 1294106680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not even then will I write a cycle-accurate N64 emulator. < 1294106681 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As would be proper rerecording emulation of Sega Saturn or Sega Dreamcast... < 1294106686 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*how we wish, < 1294106687 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, which one was RDP then? < 1294106688 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(et cetra) < 1294106691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NEVER. < 1294106693 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Graphics. < 1294106696 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, ah < 1294106707 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You could upload microcode to it, and many games did this. < 1294106722 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: N64 emulators just emulate the behavior of the microcode instead. < 1294106735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not only will a metal ball the size of the sun be worn down by solar winds before I emulate the N64, but entire universes will be simulated from start to finish such that if each universe took up a quark it would result in a ball the size of the sun when packed together with no empty space between them at all. < 1294106748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And even then, I will not write a cycle-accurate Nintendo 64 emulator. < 1294106749 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This works for a *large* number of games (because few people actually *wrote* microcode), but quite a few get left out. < 1294106754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: DO YOU UNDERSTAND YET < 1294106770 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OR AM I NOT BEING QUITE EXPRESSIVE ENOUGH < 1294106772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LET ME TRY < 1294106779 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Cycle-accurate might be unneeded. < 1294106807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Even if your mother loses SO MUCH WEIGHT that she's actually NO LONGER CLASSED AS OBESE — which would take longer than the universe will last — I will not write a Nintendo 64 emulator. < 1294106813 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyways. < 1294106815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...okay, maybe if /that/ much time passes I will. < 1294106816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT NO SOONER < 1294106853 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :susan plays streets of rage: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PyaiGLITrN8&feature=related < 1294106855 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not know of an accurate emulator for the Genesis. < 1294106864 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I do not know of any good games for the Genesis. < 1294106871 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Sonic Sonic Sonic! < 1294106881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Bah :P < 1294106901 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though that would be a *royal* pain if you want to emulate the 32x or the CD as well. < 1294106903 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you should make an emulator that JUST runs sonic 1/2/3/k < 1294106917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to write an emulator that JUST runs the 8-bit Sonic. < 1294106920 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Easy if you want to emulate the Game Gear or the Master System, or the SG-1000... < 1294106925 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Before they decided that the best way to market consoles was to make him run REALLY FAST. < 1294106929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Stupidest decision ever?) < 1294106939 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :best stupidest decision ever. < 1294106956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Worst. < 1294106956 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Sega's systems before the Saturn were based around the same hardware) < 1294106967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't actually /like/ most of the Sonic games. < 1294106976 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(many of them were even electrically compatible) < 1294106984 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When you reduce the majority of play to going really fast, you don't have any game left. < 1294107028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(see http://newbreview.com/2010/07/22/retro-fix-sonic-the-hedgehog-8-bit/, btw) < 1294107075 0 :zeotrope!~65X32@unaffiliated/zeotrope JOIN :#esoteric < 1294107084 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Maybe I'll perfectly emulate a seriously fucked up fictional system whose only game is I Wanna Be The Guy. < 1294107102 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I do wanna be the guy < 1294107121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Perhaps I'll design my own architecture based on the IWBTG executable. "Why, this complicated Windows API call? Looks like a really long CPU instruction to me!" < 1294107131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So that the .exe works as a ROM. :p < 1294107193 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mBVn0g7fZTU&feature=related WTF < 1294107198 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Dig straight down" < 1294107211 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good PC rerecording emulation would also be quite a deal (so far PC rerecording emulation is pretty much garbage). < 1294107223 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Digging straight down is not deadly if you're, say, on the surface and just doing it for a few blocks ... < 1294107244 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: Rerecording is actually pretty easy if you've got cycle-accurate emulation. < 1294107262 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You pretty much just need the ability to serialise after a clock cycle, and restore that. < 1294107278 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_2mpcssg274&feature=related < 1:20 < 1294107284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: How is that Nethack TAS going btw? < 1294107297 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, the PC is freaking painful to do cycle-accurately. < 1294107304 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everything changes from system to system! < 1294107318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Holy shit this is overcomplicated. < 1294107370 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Seems like turn 317, fighting The Wizard of Yendor. < 1294107373 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Of course, the PC is freaking painful to do cycle-accurately. Everything changes from system to system! <-- then you probably don't need it. Since nothing will assume cycle accurate anyway < 1294107375 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right? < 1294107381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: RNG hackery I presume? :) < 1294107386 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lots. < 1294107394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You need it for perfect TASing. < 1294107404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since the goal is basically "take as few cycles as possible". < 1294107404 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: make an emacs emulator < 1294107409 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it only runs emacs. < 1294107412 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, perfect in the sense it could not be done on a real machine? < 1294107436 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it may be needed, but only for early PC games. < 1294107444 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, the original IBM PC. < 1294107464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That applies to all TASes, pretty much. < 1294107471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: done, it's called emacs < 1294107479 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh snap. < 1294107496 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what about emulating an lcd game? < 1294107502 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: egg harvest! < 1294107507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :boring < 1294107548 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm.. < 1294107577 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll emulate anything simpler than an ARM :P < 1294107585 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cray x-mp? < 1294107591 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, ok < 1294107594 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :old nokia phone? < 1294107603 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Atari 2600? < 1294107605 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: bit pointless :P < 1294107616 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I thought you just said that wast he land of *insane* hardware glithces. < 1294107620 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*was the *glitches < 1294107621 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I pretty much stopped watching, got distracted < 1294107628 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: *And* NTSC artifacts! < 1294107642 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why not make a cycle accurate calculator emulator? Say, TI-82 or some such < 1294107653 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, no framebuffer. < 1294107654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Aren't there already? < 1294107654 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At all. < 1294107655 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because who cares < 1294107656 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calculator_gaming < 1294107663 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't know if they are cycle accurate < 1294107665 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know perfectly well tyvm < 1294107680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If people arnen't stupid enough they will understand that it is FAKE < 1294107680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DetHeMi 1 week ago < 1294107680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@DetHeMi lol, well done < 1294107681 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WtfMinecraft 1 week ago < 1294107683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ^ < 1294107687 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: why is arm so difficult to emulate? < 1294107694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: it's just a complicated normalarchitecture < 1294107722 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Some newer consoles are probably worse than just dealing with the ARM, though. < 1294107734 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Namely, ones where you need to emulate a large number of CPUs. < 1294107743 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(looking at *you*, Sony.) < 1294107743 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: dunno if it is fake though < 1294107751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: it looks real enough, but it'd be one-use < 1294107752 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ds is just arm7 and arm9 or something like that < 1294107764 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I didn't even watch it < 1294107770 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm talking to someone >.> < 1294107779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Is it Alluded-To. < 1294107784 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1294107796 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, generic cycle accurate ARM emulator. Then you can just add on some custom code for each of the ARM products. And you done lots of different consoles and tools < 1294107807 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHMiJFfsEj4&NR=1 < 1294107808 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you could do a roomba emulator even (not sure why though!) < 1294107814 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Daemon escaped from pentagram < 1294107816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ROOMBA EMULATOR OMG YES < 1294107822 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'd put it in horrible mazes and watch it suffer. < 1294107832 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's roomba? < 1294107833 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I knew you would love that < 1294107834 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then put it in a huge clean room with no obstacles because I feel sorry for it. < 1294107836 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294107840 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: a robot that cleans. < 1294107845 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh that thing < 1294107850 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: And the Gameboy is "just" an ARM7 and a GB-Z80. < 1294107853 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still a pain. < 1294107853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sayyygaaaaaah! < 1294107863 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, Gameboy Advance. < 1294107870 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Gameboy is just a GB-Z80. < 1294107877 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1294107878 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, what about GBC? < 1294107887 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Twice the clock rate, same CPU. < 1294107891 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294107902 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, palleting. < 1294107966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Are you suuuure the GBC is cycle-perfected? < 1294107968 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GB, sure, but GBC? < 1294108013 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cycle-perfected? < 1294108028 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hrm haskell < 1294108030 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop being lame < 1294108036 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: emulated perfectly to cycle granularity < 1294108117 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GBC ? < 1294108134 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :garbage collection ? < 1294108149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: game boy colour < 1294108152 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay, we scheduled a day < 1294108221 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Stop alluding to Alluded-To. < 1294108264 0 :calamari!~calamari@ip70-162-184-205.ph.ph.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294108330 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : coppro: emulated perfectly to cycle granularity <-- what, no more < 1294108336 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about sub cycle? < 1294108346 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, emulate the actual transistors < 1294108352 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cycle perfected = ? < 1294108352 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION knows little about emulation < 1294108353 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, with quantum noise! < 1294108373 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: what about background radiation < 1294108379 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, that too of course < 1294108381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: cycle-perfect emulation < 1294108389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: i.e., perfect emulation down to the cycle level of every internal piece of hardware < 1294108407 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, and thermal noise of course < 1294108407 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nintendo DS is ARM7 and ARM9. Official games all use the standard ARM7 code, though. Homebrew games will use their own ARM7 codes, so you will need to emulate the ARM7 if you want to emulate homebrew Nintendo DS programs. < 1294108434 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahhh - lag < 1294108445 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION lols at "quckly" < 1294108455 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you want to emulate ds < 1294108455 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not as though the flow of water will stop < 1294108463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: no, way too much work < 1294108473 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: let me redefine < 1294108480 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you want to make an XX XY emulator < 1294108496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I don't :P < 1294108505 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a good game :p < 1294108558 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote a GameBoy game once, I had to add a extra VBLANK to make it work on Goomba emulator < 1294108606 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{ I have 23 second lag now - so my questions/comments may seem a bit off - sorry } < 1294108664 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: make a (working and usable) eniac emulator < 1294108669 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: no :P < 1294108671 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those exist iirc < 1294108678 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :usable < 1294108681 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's simpler than arm!!!! < 1294108695 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: make a (working and usable) eniac emulator IN MINECRAFT < 1294108702 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HA < 1294108708 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: i've played the tic-tac-toe game on an eniac emulator iirc < 1294108728 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Very. < 1294108734 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Gambatte and KiGB do so. < 1294108735 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, don't take a productive member of society and encourage him to play minecraft < 1294108742 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its just wrong < 1294108746 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: encourage? he needs no encouragement < 1294108755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ;_; < 1294108757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Dude, I already play Minecraft :P < 1294108766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I'm nooooot a productive member of society except by really strange definitions. < 1294108774 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: With a cycle-accurate emulation, you can do mode 7-like effects on there. < 1294108789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHY HAS EVERYONE GOT TO PLACES BEFORE I GET TO PLACES < 1294108796 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, with hardware that's on par with the NES. < 1294108857 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(note: unintended feature) < 1294108862 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i thought GBC wasn't very different from GB < 1294108868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it isn't, but dammit :P < 1294108882 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: No it is basically the same. Just it is color < 1294108889 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: And double clock-rate. < 1294108902 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is fairly easy to account for. < 1294108903 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: It supports double clock-rate but you can switch it at run-time < 1294108910 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yeah. < 1294108910 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea, so why would gbc be that different from gb to warrant: GB, sure, but GBC? ? < 1294108929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: because the extra bits might not be perfect yet! :P < 1294108933 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GBC emulation comes almost for free from GB emulation. < 1294108940 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: they might be rotting < 1294108950 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294108954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: [[Lastly, there was the case of Speedy Gonzales. In level 6-1, there is a switch that needs to be hit to finish the level. Up until recently, this game would lock up any emulator when it was hit. You can probably imagine why this was overlooked, but it's quite a big deal to play a game that long and instantly lose all of your progress due to an emulation bug. In this case, it actually turns out to be a bug in the game itself. B < 1294108955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ut as it works on hardware, it needs to work under emulation as well. It is reading from an unmapped memory address, and will not break out of this loop until it gets the value it wants. As it turns out, after so many tests, eventually the read will happen immediately after an HDMA transfer, which will update the S-CPU's memory data register, giving the game the value it needs to break out of the loop.]] < 1294108963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :byuu: you are crazy. < 1294108970 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yes, yes he is. < 1294108984 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :byuu: we won't hold it against you if you just lie down for a day. srsly. < 1294108986 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :promise. < 1294108989 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :relax. < 1294109011 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: He actually doesn't do *too* much of the hardware testing. < 1294109027 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though his dump-all-SNES-games project is positively crazy. < 1294109035 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the awesome sort of way, of course. < 1294109044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[blargg's S-DSP core is known to be 100% bit-perfect to real hardware, with the one exception that the mute command is instant, and does not exhibit a very fast fade-out effect.]] < 1294109045 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UN < 1294109046 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AC < 1294109047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCKING < 1294109048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CEPTABLE! < 1294109056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TRASH IT OUT AND WRITE A NEW ONE < 1294109060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*THROW < 1294109063 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Analog... < 1294109076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pingveno: EMULATE < 1294109076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PURE < 1294109077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ANALOGUE < 1294109078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UNIVERSE < 1294109080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*pikhq: < 1294109111 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5EMX8qIgWOs < 1294109122 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE ACTION < 1294109197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Srsly, computers should come with reprogrammable analogue hardware. :D < 1294109202 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: make a cycle accurate emulation of a DX-7 with the option of scaling it up to 64 fs < 1294109217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Those sound effects are fake, right? < 1294109221 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or is it actaully hooked up to a speaker? < 1294109222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*actually < 1294109225 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd think so < 1294109226 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Do you know how to make up such computer hardware? < 1294109229 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Y'know who's crazy? Dr. Decapitator. < 1294109246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Anyone who purports to be a doctor and then decapitates people is crazy. < 1294109249 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Nope. < 1294109253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UMmUciXRMaI&feature=related realistic < 1294109257 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd think what < 1294109258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fake or speaker < 1294109265 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: He decaps chips for MAME, and has been doing so for bsnes as well. < 1294109279 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was replying to the first < 1294109290 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I should write a CYCLE-ACCURATE emulator of the MT-32. < 1294109293 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Note: The MT-32 is analogue. < 1294109298 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think there's even any sort of pcm sound on the ti 83 < 1294109303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Seriously, why don't computers come with reprogrammable analogue. < 1294109310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: just generate raw pcm data and send it over a wire :D < 1294109311 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :se'hųku ni site, ne. < 1294109314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: what < 1294109324 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i saw that halo 3 thing too < 1294109324 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Commit suicide, right? < 1294109326 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the TI-83 has no built-in sound at all (although you could connect an external speaker) < 1294109333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: clearly < 1294109358 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: It had a TSR jack connected to a UART... < 1294109367 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: You could *probably* get square wave audio out of there. < 1294109379 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yes < 1294109387 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and with PWM, you could totally emulate normal sound < 1294109393 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: If you have such a calculator, could you try that? < 1294109394 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what frequency did the uart work at? < 1294109457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[The past three years have been amazing. I know that SNES emulation can never be 100% perfect, but I finally feel that I have reached a point where I could walk away from bsnes and feel that my job is done. That the SNES hardware is very well preserved for future generations.]] < 1294109461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I bet he questions that not-100% thing now. < 1294109462 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : zzo38: You could *probably* get square wave audio out of there. <-- been done < 1294109486 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a TI-83+ but they connector is not a normal speaker connector I think < 1294109489 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is longer < 1294109501 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh, 9600 kbit/s. Knowing how serial works, that gets you... 76.8 MHz audio. < 1294109513 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1294109515 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :76.8 MHz, 1 bit audio. < 1294109518 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that 9.6 mbit/s? < 1294109528 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, 9600 bits/s. < 1294109529 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry. < 1294109536 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :76.8 kHz audio. < 1294109543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Ha. MAME SNES emulation is worse than something called "ESNES". < 1294109546 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is still enough for *recognisable* audio. < 1294109548 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that a good enough audio to make a telephone noise? < 1294109551 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, TI-83/83+ has crazy cable < 1294109554 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, just saying < 1294109558 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's 1 bit < 1294109579 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's sort of like 16 khz 4 bit audio < 1294109580 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, the computer link had to include a PIC to deal with translating to something that the computer could use < 1294109611 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is going to go up to say 8 khz < 1294109618 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you could do speech... very nasty speech < 1294109653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[Oh, and believe it or not, until recently MAME/MESS used floating point for their synchronization counters.]] < 1294109653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :barf < 1294109662 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, you could do chiptune style music < 1294109662 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf? < 1294109670 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: 76.8 kHz is enough for anything isn't it? < 1294109681 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Telephone is generally done with 8 kHz, 8-bit mu-law audio. < 1294109683 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: 1-bit. < 1294109689 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: make a working mortal kombat trilogy arcade emulator, cycle-accurate < 1294109704 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yeah, you could *definitely* get workable audio out of there. < 1294109712 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, BEEN DONE < 1294109724 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as I said above < 1294109734 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: yeah, it could definitely work < 1294109738 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: someone would have to try it < 1294109748 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, :P < 1294109754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be cool if someone did that < 1294109757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shame it hasn't happened yet < 1294109758 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder why < 1294109764 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, very droll < 1294109770 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: maybe it's just a discovery waiting to happen?? < 1294109776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Let's try it out! < 1294109778 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: maybe the ti 83 is actually skynet! < 1294109781 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote a program once on Linux that generates a lot of telephone noises, including: arbitrary frequency, red box, blue box, silver box, dial tone, busy signal, special information tones, ... < 1294109784 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if it IS possible. < 1294109786 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Is it possible? < 1294109794 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :. < 1294109796 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's waiting for us to plug earphones into the port... a digital port, connected directly to our crania < 1294109805 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: y/n? < 1294109807 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO FUTURE < 1294109817 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott µ < 1294109837 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: \0 < 1294109843 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :° < 1294109867 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: There are a few things that could be more accurately emulated on the SNES, but not *much*. < 1294109883 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: such as? < 1294109887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: That mute-thing strikes me as one. < 1294109895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would be impossible to perfectly emulate the analogue behaviour of the fast fadeout. < 1294109896 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :duck hunt controller?? < 1294109908 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Cx4, used by the Megaman X2 and X3, for instance. < 1294109909 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: No, anything that isn't strictly digital. < 1294109915 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is impossible, I think. < 1294109915 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1294109917 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's just a simple RLC that can be easily emulated < 1294109918 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Currently, bsnes uses a very accurate HLE. < 1294109926 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and is easily emulated in thousands of existing softwares < 1294109928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: I don't think a Turing machine can perfectly emulate an analogue sound effect. < 1294109931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Note *perfectly*. < 1294109933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it can do it very well. < 1294109935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But not *perfectly*. < 1294109942 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, not perfectly < 1294109954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Thus 100% SNES emulation is impossible with digital computing. < 1294109954 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but emulation is different from reproduction < 1294109961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: bsnes is very much a reproducer. < 1294109964 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean 100% snes reproduction < 1294109967 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :emulation is possible < 1294109969 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Until recently, the DSPs were likewise. < 1294109969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, also called perfect emulation. < 1294109985 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/dev/urandom is a 100% snes emulator, for my emulation goal < 1294109999 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: emulation is not used in that way. < 1294110002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when referring to console emulation. < 1294110006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is used to mean reproduction. < 1294110012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :usually very inaccurate reproduction. < 1294110015 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the ST-0011 and ST-0010 are completely unemulated. < 1294110027 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, s/11/18/. < 1294110036 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The ST-0011 is partially emulated via HLE. < 1294110050 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i still say the DX 7 should be your goal < 1294110058 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or a synclavier < 1294110061 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the fm part) < 1294110064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: i don't like synths :/ < 1294110068 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the fm part is actually very intricate) < 1294110072 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the synclavier is british! < 1294110072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I might emulate an SK-1 :) < 1294110078 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should do it because of that! < 1294110091 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's pretty much a huge computer with sound output < 1294110120 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, the Satellaview is effectively impossible to emulate. < 1294110125 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION listens to Shnabubula's performance of All Blues. < 1294110132 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(due to having been unusable for years now) < 1294110137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wondrful. < 1294110160 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://retrothing.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/sync.jpg < 1294110169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SR < 1294110172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Y TOO BUSY LISTENING TO JAZZ < 1294110174 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the left is a computer < 1294110190 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :notice huge ribbon cable connecting it to keyboard < 1294110191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the fairlight cmi is insane isn't it < 1294110192 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, if you have a TARDIs it'd be easy. < 1294110196 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TARDIS, rather. < 1294110200 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tards. < 1294110201 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Turds. < 1294110203 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TURDIS. < 1294110215 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In which case you could even get a *dump* of all of the games for it. < 1294110218 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://retrothing.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/fmsynth.jpg THREE DEE! < 1294110222 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which is likewise impossible) < 1294110234 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: meh, the fairlight ain't so hot < 1294110239 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: what games don't exist any more? < 1294110286 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: The games were downloaded via satellite and stored on a flash cart. < 1294110306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: heh < 1294110318 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A dump can *only* exist if someone happened to keep it from when it was broadcast. < 1294110335 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, some of the games actually had voice acting via *live broadcast*. < 1294110345 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a different kind of emulation idea. You have in the emulator, emulation of various processors, video units, audio units, input units. etc. And then the file it loads indicates which ones are used and what memory mapping and a few other options. < 1294110346 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Despite a slow system clock the processor was extremely efficient at moving data around (a one cycle multiply/divide math's co-processor being very advanced for the time) so efficient in fact, that NASA used the computer on board space craft resulting in the processor being classed as classified computer equipment, not to be sold to countries outside the COCAM agreement and no technical details to be distributed outside of the United Sta < 1294110347 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tes. NED also developed their own Operating System, Scientific XP/L, again bypassing limitations of available Operating Systems. So with this dedicated processor it was possible to add new hardware as and when it became available, in some cases the additions enhancing the processor by sharing the workload with it. < 1294110357 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if that's not worthy of emulation what is < 1294110358 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: bsnes does this. < 1294110369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :03:05 pikhq: Also, some of the games actually had voice acting via *live broadcast*. < 1294110372 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Well, except it only handles the SNES, but hey. < 1294110372 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is amazing. < 1294110375 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yeah, bsnes does that. < 1294110394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: http://ns2.opencollective.cc/music/Shnabubula/All+Blues+(VRC6)/ < 1294110398 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :STOP WHAT YOU'RE DOING AND LISTEN TO THIS < 1294110400 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe three times < 1294110401 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or four < 1294110415 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :404 Error: Page Not Found < 1294110415 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, we are unable to find the page you've requested. If you've typed the URL yourself, check for any spelling mistakes you might have made. If you've followed a broken link, bla bla bla. Please click back or visit our homepage at 8bc.org. < 1294110419 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294110423 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Satellaview_broadcasts If it has SoundLink support, it's literally impossible to reproduce the game without a time machine. < 1294110425 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, bad cp < 1294110431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: http://8bc.org/music/Shnabubula/All+Blues+(VRC6)/ < 1294110433 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there, better now < 1294110444 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even *if* you have the ROM. < 1294110450 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miles davis would have approved < 1294110464 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yea it's good < 1294110477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: have you heard it before or did you make that judgement based on three seconds :-P < 1294110482 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am thinking something a bit different. A more general form. And the loaded file, instead of the ROM file, is a collection file. You then convert it for the official or homebrew game or whatever you run. < 1294110493 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes < 1294110498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: which < 1294110518 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i heard it before in the normal form.. and i made that judgement based on three seconds < 1294110519 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294110549 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: do you know of the midibox sid? < 1294110567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, but it's probably worse than e.g. the hardsid. < 1294110572 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1294110575 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's much better < 1294110582 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: What is a midibox sid? < 1294110584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: what, than the studio edition? < 1294110589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: http://www.hardsid.com/hardsid_4u.php < 1294110594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt /that/ < 1294110597 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has the best update rate for the sid < 1294110603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: see above link < 1294110612 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: 8 khz isn't so bad. :p < 1294110623 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :8 khz is weak < 1294110628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're weak. < 1294110631 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it has a full user interface < 1294110641 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as opposed to hardsid being a non-interactive box < 1294110644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just buy a c64 and wire up data ports to it, it's the only way to get the real sound < 1294110647 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where you point and click and go to sleep < 1294110673 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# Microsoft Vista compatible < 1294110676 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :great < 1294110686 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll use it with my vista! < 1294110688 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :marketing. < 1294110689 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that i don't have. < 1294110696 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, shows who they make it for < 1294110697 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1294110714 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the midibox sid is compatible with any operating system that can access a UART < 1294110721 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't beat that < 1294110736 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and has OSC < 1294110750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: the UART is just the politically correct version of the LART. < 1294110753 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it is also compatible with any operating system that can somehow communicate with ethernet < 1294110784 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LART is a single-board computer (SBC) designed by staff of the University of Delft/Netherlands. The creators advertise complete layout by means of CAD files ... < 1294110788 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :emulate that! < 1294110800 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyways, the midibox sid is cool < 1294110804 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cooler than cakes < 1294110832 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i hung out with the guy who made it at his flat :p we did a rock-out nite with some other dudes < 1294110860 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you think 31 character for each original and destination word forms is enough for plural making rules? < 1294110896 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not if you're talking about airplanes < 1294110914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*airplanae < 1294110918 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(remember that volcano?) < 1294110918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*aeroplanae < 1294110930 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aeaeroplaenae < 1294110937 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: What about airplanes? < 1294110951 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: What does this have to do with airplanes? < 1294110964 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :æroplænæ < 1294110968 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was a volcano with a long name obscuring flights lately < 1294111026 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :æρplænæ < 1294111077 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i was right < 1294111083 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294111084 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it's good) < 1294111095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what an achievement < 1294111124 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i kno rite < 1294111140 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now i want to hear freddie freeloader done like this < 1294111147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: http://kindofbloop.com/ < 1294111151 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: it's from a whole remake of the album < 1294111152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :enjoy < 1294111153 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$5 < 1294111162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pirating it works but it's kind of a dick since the royalties cost $$$$loads < 1294111168 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is $5 some sort of memory address? < 1294111169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brought to you by http://waxy.org/ < 1294111172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: it's a price. < 1294111184 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://kindofbloop.com/samples/02_freddie_freeloader_sample.mp3 :p < 1294111222 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is flac formed? < 1294111228 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ærœplænə < 1294111234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Kind of Bloop is available for digital download in high-quality MP3 and FLAC format for $5.00, cheap." < 1294111237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: it's just the sample /shrug < 1294111244 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i remember when it was still in Kickstarter phase < 1294111247 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i know, but i need the flac < 1294111249 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the royalties cost ridiculous amounts < 1294111255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: for the _30 second preview_? < 1294111255 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1294111261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: the All Blues you listened to was mp3. < 1294111262 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: of course not < 1294111266 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so buy it :P < 1294111274 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: they should've made it free < 1294111281 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :suddenly, no royalties! < 1294111283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: impossible, with the costs < 1294111284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: nope < 1294111286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not true < 1294111290 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how so < 1294111298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :find the blog posts yourself, i'm too lazy < 1294111304 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and, wait < 1294111307 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what royalties? < 1294111311 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a new performance < 1294111318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't remember exactly. it's stupid music industry bullshit < 1294111320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is the kickstarter: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/waxpancake/kind-of-bloop-an-8-bit-tribute-to-miles-davis < 1294111325 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't own/copyright/patent a MELODY < 1294111327 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To create this album, I hope to raise $2,000 to pay royalties, pay the artists, and print CDs. Legally releasing cover songs requires paying mechanical licenses to the song publishers through the Harry Fox Agency, totaling about $420 for every 250 downloads and a $75 processing fee. I'll be using the remainder to print a very limited run of CDs for Kickstarter backers, and split the rest evenly among the five musicians for their pains < 1294111327 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :taking work. (This is a labor of love for me, so I won't be keeping a dime.) < 1294111328 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: ^ < 1294111329 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: BTW, that was Eyjafjallajökull. < 1294111341 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hence, any new performance is a new thing. < 1294111343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: ^ < 1294111353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: your opinions are irrelevant in the face of what is actually the case. < 1294111405 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION hopes that what cheater99 said is true < 1294111405 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294111413 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not fully sure on the legal aspect of this < 1294111417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: it is, as demonstrated by my quote, false. < 1294111422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copyright law is fucked up, that is obvious and irrelevant. < 1294111424 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If not, I've participated in copyright infringement, as so has AWLD < 1294111425 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Odd word construction courtesy of being a fairly conservative North Germanic language. < 1294111427 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is relevant is what is the actual case < 1294111435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: OH GOD COPYRIGHT INFRINGEMENT < 1294111436 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i think there's some confusion in that post. < 1294111436 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FEEL BAD < 1294111437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FEEL EVIL < 1294111438 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU ARE THE WORST < 1294111444 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: well, i don't. < 1294111452 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, companies should be more careful than individuals < 1294111466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: andy baio /has/ been at this for _rather_ a long time < 1294111467 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's ok, since we have separate consciousnae < 1294111483 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and can think opposite thoughts. < 1294111508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: face it, even if it is the case, legally, the agency could sue him off the face of the earth < 1294111510 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lawyer costs etc < 1294111555 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GAMESTATE RECALCULATION < 1294111598 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i still think eniac in minecraft is yet to be done < 1294111610 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that freddie freeloader sample is not interesting at all i fear < 1294111618 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sounds fairly... simple. < 1294111623 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did John Cage use any dynamics in his 4'33" music? < 1294111631 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: 30 seconds != however long freddy freeloader is < 1294111652 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: just checked. you heard a whopping 5% of the track. < 1294111658 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but the original had much more depth and wasn't full of shitty little kiddie arpeggios that made no sense < 1294111673 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sounds fine to me. < 1294111687 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the other track we have listened had translated the depth much better < 1294111692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't have to be a 1:1 replica. < 1294111706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Depth is a vague and subjective concept; it seems you are just trying to belittle it without actually making any arguments that it's an inferior work. < 1294111709 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, but 1:00000000000000000000000.1 isn't good either < 1294111718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: you mean 1:0.1? < 1294111722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure why you bothered with those 0s. < 1294111736 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe he means s/1:0/1:10/ ? < 1294111747 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt it. < 1294111752 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably 0.0[...]1 < 1294111754 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a subconscious tactic of showing my perceived worth < 1294111764 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of that piece of music. < 1294111774 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :notice very many zeros < 1294111780 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or s/0(0*)\./0.$1/ ? < 1294111781 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and one tiny tiny digit one < 1294111799 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that... is ridiculous < 1294111803 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1:0.000000000000000000001 sure < 1294111805 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so as far as in the light of law i only said it's worth only 10 times less < 1294111809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but 1:00000000000000.1 is exactly 0:.1. < 1294111818 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your subconscious knows, i really mean zero. < 1294111824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are full of shit. < 1294111825 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YES < 1294111830 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why i tricked you < 1294111840 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: anyway it's rather pretentious to listen to an entire 11 minute work and then say that a 30 second sample of a 10 minute work is inferior. < 1294111842 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's exactly 0.1 < 1294111845 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to listen to the entire thing to make that kind of judgement. < 1294111862 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i think being pretentious is what makes us human < 1294111873 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you say that only because you are pretentious. < 1294111887 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would it be pretentious of me to admit? < 1294111908 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not saying the rest of the song must be bad < 1294111925 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm just saying: the part i heard wasn't translated as well as comparable parts in the other song < 1294111951 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now if i had a flac edition of the whole album, that might change my perception completely < 1294111991 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seeing as i don't... i'll probably never see the light on the topic of how good the adaptation really is < 1294112038 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I'm going to cycle-perfectly emulate YOUR CURRENT COMPUTER. < 1294112040 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here is the program: < 1294112045 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Run it and it shall be perfect. < 1294112054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: You could just, you know, spend $5. < 1294112085 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that includes a lot of assumptions < 1294112103 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that are not true not accordingly to my will or ability < 1294112115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Such as? < 1294112116 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you cite this article? http://www.csse.monash.edu.au/~damian/papers/HTML/Plurals.html I see nothing about a journal or book it is published in. Do you know what journal or book it belongs to? < 1294112130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Interestingly, people publish work without it being inside a journal or a book. < 1294112135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: In this case, it is a "web page". < 1294112137 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't have a reliable repeatable way of doing the spending < 1294112144 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: does it need to be repeatable? < 1294112150 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294112157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Are you planning on buying the album numerous times? < 1294112172 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, but it needs to because there are other things such that those things are of value $5 < 1294112190 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: You're not being pretentious now, just stupid. < 1294112203 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm just saying i need to be able to buy breakfast too < 1294112212 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Then how can it be cited in the bibliography? < 1294112217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: However you want. < 1294112227 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Are you currently out of $5 each time you buy breakfast? < 1294112228 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: look how wikipedia does it!!!! < 1294112234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, don't < 1294112240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when in doubt, if wikipedia does something, do the opposite < 1294112249 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, because sometimes i don't buy breakfast < 1294112259 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: but breakfast is a great thing. < 1294112274 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: for those who have a repeatable source of $5's < 1294112290 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Does a repeatable source of $5s not fund your internet? BREAKFAST OR INTERNET: THE SHOWDOWN < 1294112299 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: http://board.byuu.org/images/challenge.jpg BYUU'S FORUM WANTS ME TO DO SIMPLE ALGEBRA AT 3:37 AM WHY DOES HE HATE ME < 1294112300 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :internets are free < 1294112309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION expert wolfram alpha < 1294112310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: orly < 1294112314 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my $5s are not available during this month or two < 1294112344 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Should I include the name of the university in the citation? < 1294112369 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it's a university website < 1294112373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I wouldn't. < 1294112376 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's his work, not the uni's. < 1294112398 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, if it's a private website don't < 1294112411 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the name of the university is listed at the top of the article. (I already put Damian Conway's name in the citation) < 1294112417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a private website that happens to be hosted on a university. :p < 1294112423 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Yeah, but that's standard practice in "papers" of any sort. < 1294112431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: No harm in crediting, I suppose, but I think it's purely his work. < 1294112442 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't bibliography citations usually list the publisher though? < 1294112446 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miscrediting citations can be big beef < 1294112449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: The publisher is himself in this case. < 1294112453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He put the file there. < 1294112455 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't want to credit someone's work to something else < 1294112464 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. Then I will just put his name, the title, and the URL. < 1294112465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Is the TeXnicard source available? < 1294112468 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An Algorithmic Approach to English Pluralization < 1294112468 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Damian Conway < 1294112468 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :School of Computer Science and Software Engineering < 1294112468 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Monash University < 1294112468 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clayton 3168, Australia < 1294112473 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is just his contact info, that's all < 1294112479 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294112480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: agreed < 1294112483 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the author is the second line < 1294112512 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now if it was: < 1294112521 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Damian Conway, Evil Overlord < 1294112522 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yes, so far only incomplete versions on sprunge, but eventually it will be available properly when version 0.1 is complete enough to publish in this way. < 1294112523 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An Algorithmic Approach to English Pluralization < 1294112523 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :University of Buckdoodle, Damian Conway < 1294112524 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd have to credit that part too < 1294112528 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: finished your sentence for you < 1294112531 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you'd credit the university < 1294112538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: or even "Damian Conway, University of Nowhere" < 1294112544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Can I see the current version, please? < 1294112557 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: OK. Just a minute... < 1294112571 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: why thank you, that was very nice of you to finish that sentence < 1294112587 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this means i can now go to sleep, and you can continue saying things i would say < 1294112631 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi I'm cheater99 and I kill puppies for fun < 1294112639 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and profit < 1294112643 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://sprunge.us/TKVI < 1294112669 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Any comments to make about it? < 1294112683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me skim it first :) < 1294112683 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those dalmatians will make for a BEAUTIFUL fur!! mwahahahahah! < 1294112707 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, now i'm off to dream about uranusgirl and silver head < 1294112786 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thank you and good night < 1294112828 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol uranusgirl < 1294112928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: How likely is it that anyone can convince byuu to never use XML again. < 1294112954 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Not very. He wrote a very simple XML parser. < 1294112963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: But WRONGNESS. < 1294112987 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aside from only handling UTF-8 instead of UTF-8 and UTF-16, it seems to be a correct implementation of *just* XML. < 1294113033 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shame, though, that he couldn't be convinced to use a better scheme instead. < 1294113040 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you also want to see the current (incomplete) version of the file "plain.cards" (Plain TeXnicard), "texnicard_format.tex" (TeX format file for Plain TeXnicard), or "system_book_conv" (AWK program to compile a book describing the other two files)? < 1294113104 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: plain.cards < 1294113140 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://sprunge.us/UCBc < 1294113146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks < 1294113195 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/98753-Ultra-Rare-NES-Cartridge-Sells-for-41-000 < 1294113265 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Apparently it'd been dumped before though X-D < 1294113278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[So ok, I guess this isn't some avid gamer desperately wanting to play the game (the game has been dumped afaik and a NES console + flash cart and/or PC capable of running Nestopia would cost a lot less). < 1294113278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So the most likely reason anyone would buy at that price is because they hope to resell it even higher in a decade or so. At least that's the only "sane" reason I could find. So it's basically game speculation. That or the person(s) who bought this are billionaires and like to waste their money for shits and giggles.]] < 1294113399 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Or it's a collector of some sort. < 1294113409 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: A crazy collector :P < 1294113415 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yes. < 1294113424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Shit, I'm tempted to get a box professionally printed and sealed now. < 1294113425 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'd have to be if you want, say, the entire NES set. < 1294113451 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Put a dumped cartridge inside (with professional label etc.), age the box slightly, get it professionally sealed... $41k is mine. < 1294113459 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or the entire US SNES set, like Byuu does. < 1294113528 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So crazy. < 1294113979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: http://board.byuu.org/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=838 Dear god @ during. < 1294113989 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any comment about the TeXnicard files, yet? < 1294113995 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: No. seems good < 1294114138 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Sometimes I wish I had focused on the Sega Genesis instead. They only have one special chip, which was only used by one game :/" < 1294114141 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TARGET MARKET < 1294114167 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: The Genesis had more than one special chip, they just got released as seperate consoles. :P < 1294114175 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sega CD and 32X. < 1294114216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[I think it is our very own AamirM who made Regen, which basically what could be called "bgen" (as in, an accuracy focused Genesis/Mega Drive emulator).]] < 1294114217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SHEESH < 1294114218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :furrfu < 1294114219 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And arguably the Genesis *was* a "special chip" for the Master System. < 1294114268 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you have any suggestions and/or questions about TeXnicard? (Or about related things?) < 1294114270 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AamirM is also working on an N64 emulator. < 1294114294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"And yes, N64 emulation is rather poor and most N64 emulation projects are no longer active. If I had the skills, I'd give it a shot myself, but I'm afraid it's out of my reach. Anyone up for a team effort?" — guess that's happening then. < 1294114296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except not team. < 1294114300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, good night. < 1294114302 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294114333 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294114339 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should get a list of all unregistered one-char domains some time. < 1294114343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294114448 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Including unicode or not? < 1294114474 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Oops] < 1294114547 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm - one character domain names that are not registered == roughly all of them < 1294114552 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except for two < 1294114560 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they stopped registering them < 1294114628 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x.org and q.com IIRC < 1294114653 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh - google tells me I'm wrong - there exist 5 < 1294114699 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Do you have any opinions about TeXnicard? < 1294114720 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Also, can they register unicode one character domain names? < 1294114785 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TeXnicard? < 1294114832 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, unicode domain names are mapped to punycode < 1294114847 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so there are no such thing as "single letter" unicode names < 1294116011 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: I know that unicode domain names are mapped to punycode. But is there punycode name that represents a single unicode character which are registered? < 1294116022 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1294116048 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, as far as I am aware - yes < 1294116064 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And, TeXnicard is,,, you can see the files: http://sprunge.us/TKVI http://sprunge.us/UCBc < 1294116207 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GPLv3 :-( ah - its designed to create playing cards? < 1294116239 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes it is designed to create playing cards. < 1294116260 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there anything you do not like about GPLv3? < 1294116319 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its less free than in it could be and restricts commercial modification (and often therefore support) of the code < 1294116363 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How does it restrict commercial modification? < 1294116366 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll have to play around with the code tomorrow to see what kind of cards I could create :-} < 1294116377 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: It is incomplete. You cannot create any cards yet. < 1294116392 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you can make opinion of what I have so far. < 1294116463 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if a company wants to base a product around the source code - for example MacOS/FreeBSD < 1294116481 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they would have to release the source code - which means that they would probably not want to use that project < 1294116492 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which means one less contributor (usually) < 1294116517 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :b) the GPL lies about freedom - making it seem that its a binary thing "either your free or your not" < 1294116530 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: a) That is the whole *point* of the GPL. < 1294116541 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: b) How does the GPL do that? < 1294116543 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is the intention. That if someone wants to make something they have to give everyone else same permissions < 1294116551 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :c) its well documented < 1294116555 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :re the project < 1294116562 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I'll look at it tomorrow < 1294116575 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, a) which is its weakness - I prefer copyfree licences < 1294116599 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :b) the GPL claims that it "is free" which makes no sense < 1294116646 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, it is better to allow everyone to use the code - and encourage people to give back instead of force people to give everything which may scare people away < 1294116667 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :However, it is OK if someone wants to make private modifications for their own use in their company to make cards with it. The GPL does not prevent that. < 1294116694 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, as soon as they distribute it they must provide all the source code < 1294116701 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which means they likely won't use it < 1294116710 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and thus not help you if they fix anything < 1294116723 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: This is a fallacious argument. < 1294116729 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, how so? < 1294116738 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: *Plenty* of companies make use of GPL software and make contributions to it. < 1294116750 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, yes - but plenty more avoid it like the plague < 1294116764 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, because of a lack of understanding of how it works. < 1294116780 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, or because it would ruin their business model < 1294116791 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if they were BSD licensed there is nothing stopping anyone from contributing in the same way as the GPL < 1294116792 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a common thought that by using GPL licensed software, you need to release *all source code ever*. < 1294116795 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is patently false. < 1294116810 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, you must release all source code that is a derivative work < 1294116815 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why yes. < 1294116824 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And with the BSD license you don't need to. < 1294116833 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And with most software licenses *you can't make derivative works*. < 1294116837 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, so imagine if apple were forced to release *all* of their source code < 1294116844 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ie if FreeBSD were GPLed) < 1294116861 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the BSD licence you are allowed to < 1294116864 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, Apple releases the code for everything from BSD... < 1294116869 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I know < 1294116883 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If a company wants to use it to produce their own cards, they do not need to release the source code to the program. The cards are just output. (Actually, I don't know if "plain.cards" changes this? If so, I should add an exception in the "plain.cards" file to ensure you are allowed to produce proprietary cards with this program) < 1294116884 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And uses quite a bit of GPL software. < 1294116890 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(GCC, WebKit, etc._) < 1294116893 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if it were GPL it would be required to release all of the OS code - not just the kernel parts < 1294116901 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1294116908 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just all the derivative works. < 1294116915 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which they do even when not obligated to. < 1294116924 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, and since linking with inner interfaces could be considered a deriv. work < 1294116937 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BTW, merely executing *on* an OS does not a derivative work make. < 1294116949 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, yes, I'm aware < 1294116954 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If FreeBSD were GPL, it would change hardly *any* of Apple's behavior at all. < 1294116963 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because they comply already. < 1294116968 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, not at all < 1294116971 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By choice. < 1294116992 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, they would be forced to release any and all code that is a deriv. of the FreeBSD work < 1294117000 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and would include a large majority of the OS < 1294117005 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Funny, they have. < 1294117005 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of just the darwin kernel < 1294117026 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does "plain.cards" and "texnicard_format.tex" need a exception similar to the font exception? < 1294117049 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only things in OS X without source code available are, in essence, things that support their UI. < 1294117106 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cocoa, Carbon, and the like. < 1294117108 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Do you know enough about the GPL to know whether or not this exception would be needed? < 1294117166 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Uh, I think it would need almost precisely the font exception. < 1294117168 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, which in theory could be considered a deriv work < 1294117175 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: It isn't. < 1294117184 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Speaking as someone who has actually read copyright law, it isn't. < 1294117203 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, I think it would require the font exception -- or just use a license that doesn't restrict distribution < 1294117203 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not even remotely. < 1294117231 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, speaking as someone who has read the licence, read copyright law, worked for a copyright attorney, and has two patents.... < 1294117248 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And somehow you still don't seem to understand what a derivative work is. < 1294117255 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Congrats! < 1294117265 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now that the ad hominem is away < 1294117271 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, you seem to not understand < 1294117273 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :congrats < 1294117284 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the GPL defines it in a specific way < 1294117305 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, true, the GPLv3 doesn't even use the term "derivative work", it uses something different... < 1294117323 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lesseee. < 1294117327 0 :zeotrope!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Lost terminal < 1294117336 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, the basic idea is that interfacing using "private" methods results in a derivative work nearly always < 1294117368 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, "implementation of POSIX" (which is essentially all that OS X gets from the BSDs) is not exactly "private". < 1294117369 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, my point is lets say that what your saying is true < 1294117391 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq,and that apple completely complies with the gpl (pretending freebsd was gpl) < 1294117444 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the 2-BSD license still results in fewer restrictions than the GPL (and public domain even fewer - but its not legally possible to put something in the public domain) < 1294117461 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there is nothing stopping companies from contributing < 1294117475 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Yessss, and? < 1294117498 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: But "texnicard.w" should not need the font exception, because to that program, the file "plain.cards" is just data, and "texnicard_format.tex" is data to TeX, and these two files are linked. Am I correct? < 1294117506 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you really call a modification that nobody else can access "contribution", or even "behavior that ought to be encouraged". < 1294117519 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, wow - you completely misunderstand < 1294117534 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Hmm. Well. Is any of Texnicard actually going to be output in the resulting .dvi? < 1294117538 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: How so? < 1294117640 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: No. (Also, the .dvi is not even the final result; the final result are picture files such as .png and so on.) < 1294117646 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, company X decided to make a project. they look for some base to start on. they find G (GPLed) and B (BSDed). They choose to go with B because of its more free licences. They make a product and sell it. they contribute 20% of that code back to B. Now B gets something and G gets nothing. lets pretend B didn't exist and X wanted to have a viable business model. so they decide to write it on their own and not use G. so now G still < 1294117646 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gets nothing. < 1294117673 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Has this even once happened? < 1294117680 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, re comments on the actual project instead of the license: I'll look at it tomorrow. < 1294117701 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hrm. Actually, no, pretty sure it has. LLVM. < 1294117703 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Never mind. < 1294117713 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, yes all the time. most commercial organizations have "copyright training" where they teach you to avoid the gpl < 1294117720 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: OK. You can look at it tomorrow. (Just remember it is currently incomplete. It does compile and run; but it is incomplete.) < 1294117725 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Bullshit training", you mean. < 1294117755 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I use the term the companies use. < 1294117768 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use a term that accurately describes it. < 1294117791 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, all this comes courtesy of a few simple things... < 1294117801 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, tbh in the end it hardly matters - I just like to get the code out. I dislike spending much time on license debates < 1294117808 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*hardly matters to me < 1294117811 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Namely: copyright law is far too complex, and it's completely and utterly pointless in the modern day. < 1294117821 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not to mention counterproductive. < 1294117851 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, agreed with the specific reference to software copyright. not saying I disagree about other things - but I don't have the energy right now to discuss :-} < 1294117873 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: In general, though, it's *certainly* far far too complex, you must agree. < 1294117879 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, yes < 1294117886 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"not saying I disagree about other things' < 1294117896 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its 1211 am now < 1294117896 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yuh. < 1294117903 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wanted to be asleep 1130 < 1294117905 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-} < 1294117938 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, copyright law is insanely complex - and imho outlived its usefulness for certain things < 1294117944 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I really need to get to sleep < 1294117952 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :お休み! < 1294117961 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!? < 1294117965 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good night! < 1294117978 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good night - I enjoyed this conversation < 1294117982 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/away < 1294118279 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are a few files in TeXnicard which are public domain, such as "system_book_conv", which is not actually needed to run TeXnicard; what it does is to make book from "plain.cards" and "texnicard_format.tex" files. < 1294118416 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is the extra restriction on the use of the name of TeXnicard is valid? < 1294118439 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1294118949 0 :Iwnda0!~nomad@pool-72-70-202-85.sctnpa.east.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294119296 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294119835 0 :Iwnda0!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294121739 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://keiapl.info/archive/APLblossom.mp3 < 1294123310 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAX0gJt-aZg fuckin LOL < 1294123583 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i have java gtfo >| < 1294123596 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hate** < 1294123604 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :java goes JING JING < 1294123913 0 :cal153!~cal@c-24-4-207-72.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294124576 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294125034 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1294125297 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294125426 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294127999 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1294128000 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1294129029 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-4-138.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294129981 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294130091 0 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs186230.pp.htv.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1294130688 0 :Sasha!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294130691 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294130693 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294130706 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294130737 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294130754 0 :Leonidas!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294130756 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294130763 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294130765 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294130773 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294130791 0 :Ilari_antrcomp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294130791 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294130799 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how come adults can't spell "a lot"? < 1294130801 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you come across "alot' alot? < 1294130803 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more often thannot. < 1294130894 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1294130894 0 :Leonidas!~Leonidas@unaffiliated/leonidas JOIN :#esoteric < 1294130944 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-4-138.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294130944 0 :Slereah!~butt@ANantes-259-1-140-145.w92-139.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1294130944 0 :bsmntbombdood!~gavin@c-24-9-98-117.hsd1.co.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294130971 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1294130971 0 :Ilari_antrcomp!~user@2002:5870:38d7:1:20e:a6ff:fe6f:2288 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294130971 0 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:38d7::1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294131013 0 :Sasha!~WHAT@75-174-221-10.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294131013 0 :jix!jix@tomakin.h-ix.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294131013 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@209.59.220.33 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294131013 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@61.251.165.38 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294133252 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: For what reason do certain English-speaking adults insist on conforming to and uplifting a certain subset of the prescribed rules of correct English grammar, but still ignore others? Perhaps because English is a living language, and if an entire generation starts spelling "a lot" as "alot", then the correct spelling is "alot". < 1294133324 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: adults can spell "a lot" perfectly fine < 1294133342 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem is that "a lot" is a thing you park your car in < 1294133390 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"a lot" ~ "alot" as a quantificational element is a single word, not two, in modern english. < 1294133422 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so would writing "alot" be an improvement? < 1294133425 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :furthermore, orthography is purely conventional, and as gregor points out, the current convention in colloquial written english is that the space is entirely optional < 1294133446 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in many ways, "a lot" is going the same way as "up on" < 1294133457 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :woah did this actually happen < 1294133463 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so many other such words in english < 1294133474 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you know any book or whatever that talks about this? < 1294133477 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"through out", "none the less", "not with standing" etc etc < 1294133485 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Did this actually happen" // English has no regulatory body, it's happening because people are just doing it. < 1294133489 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: any good book on descriptive linguistics. < 1294133498 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: even if english DId have a regulatory body, it wouldnt matter < 1294133506 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: Fair point :) < 1294133509 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: are there any good ones for a beginner wyouwould recommend? < 1294133512 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :languages are the original grassroots technology < 1294133514 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: But thank Jebus it doesn't ;) < 1294133530 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: for orthography, no, but for language in general, sure < 1294133535 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294133551 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: for language in general, check out guy deutscher's the unfolding of language < 1294133607 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"above" is the result of successive de-prepositionalizations from "on by up on" (only from back when they were said and spelled "an be uf an" < 1294133651 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: the moral of that book is that language is a constant tension between expressiveness and conciseness < 1294133695 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :concision drives us to eliminate parts of the language that don't have any function (in that they don't make the language any more usable) < 1294133730 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :expressivity drives us to invent new constructs when the language has no technique for conveying quite what we want to convey < 1294133753 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so theres a tension between reduction and expansion of the language, and it happens all the time < 1294133788 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have any new constructs come up in recorded history? < 1294133802 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every day < 1294133816 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every new thing you hate is a new construct that might be standard a hundred years from now < 1294133832 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :usually its new words, since words are for some reason incredibly easy to invent < 1294133837 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and usually its certain kinds of words < 1294133850 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tho it varies by language which words are so freely invented < 1294133866 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what baout a new "thing" like verb/noun/etc < 1294133870 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grammatical constructs are harder to change < 1294133878 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :verbs and nouns are the easiest words to invent < 1294133890 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :adjectives and adverbs probably next < 1294133891 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no I mean like verb/noun/quux < 1294133901 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, you mean a new category? < 1294133904 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294133922 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :theres debate over whether categories are real in any sense < 1294133934 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah that makes senese < 1294133936 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but in general we only see a small number of categories < 1294133980 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, most contemporary theories place no real restriction on the number of categories, and we dont have any principled way to explain why we dont see the full range of possibilities < 1294134030 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is to say, there seem to be restrictions, but we dont know what they are beyond some very rough outlines in the theoretically possible category landscape < 1294135178 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294135237 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294135371 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION gets desparate < 1294135375 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :desperate < 1294136040 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294136201 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, are there any languages with more/different categories than English? < 1294136288 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: maybe < 1294136303 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there generally seems to be a fairly fixed inventory that all languages draw from < 1294136434 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294136437 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why does my printer only ever decide to take two pages at a time when doing double sided printing. And only in the second "pass" too!? < 1294136445 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it never ever do that otherwise < 1294136449 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does* < 1294136864 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294136969 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294137564 0 :WAR!~phantomho@cpc1-sgyl29-2-0-cust788.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294137707 0 :WAR!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Phantom_Hoover < 1294137717 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294137718 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294137815 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, why does the Minecraft window not capture the mouse? < 1294137837 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, it does for me. < 1294137855 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there maybe a bug in the older version that I.. obtained? < 1294137888 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Possibly, or it could be something else; if you're not on Windows, we can't help. < 1294137911 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am on Windows < 1294137918 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...trying it before I buy it, so to speak < 1294137931 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am happy to state that the issues I was having in Classic do NOT occur in Alpha < 1294139020 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FWIW, if you actually buy it and you want to use mcmap, you'll need to switch to Linux. < 1294139043 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Once I buy it, I intend to mostly play on online servers < 1294139072 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :F11 helps the mouse not be captured, but I don't want to have to go to fullscreen < 1294139081 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294139400 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294139815 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294141037 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1294141239 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294141418 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294141475 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294142050 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :TheDoctor < 1294142061 0 :TheDoctor!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :augur < 1294142547 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, wha? < 1294142554 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey what < 1294142904 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1294142974 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :FireFly < 1294143459 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294143484 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294143674 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, why did you change your name to TheDoctor and then back again? < 1294143792 0 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs186230.pp.htv.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1294143872 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: name antics in another channel < 1294143887 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, HMMMMMMMMM < 1294144120 0 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294144313 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294144504 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo's dad is periodically rebooting his computer for lulz. < 1294144877 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294145079 0 :Sgeo__!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1294145503 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders if you can prove that the only function of type a -> a is the identity function. < 1294145759 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is obsidian made? < 1294145771 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, water poured onto /still/ lava. < 1294145778 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Flowing lava becomes cobblestone. < 1294146780 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HAHA' I'VE GOT 5 OBSIDIANS < 1294146877 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean: how is obsiddian formed < 1294146936 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HT < 1294146942 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294146947 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's lava on obsidian < 1294147077 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: what about f x = 2*x < 1294147094 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, that's why I said a -> a. < 1294147105 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for any type? < 1294147108 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294147109 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in, a polymorphic function with no typeclass constraints. < 1294147143 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can demonstrate that id is the only one possible if you let a be the unit type, but it's extending that upwards that I'm having problems with. < 1294147149 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course you can have polymorphic fall-over < 1294147158 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in which case your question is easily answered < 1294147189 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1294147303 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: < 1294147317 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: < 1294147319 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in Haskell or SysF ? < 1294147365 0 :sftp!~sftp@79.174.49.208 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294147375 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm. Is there a difference in the answer? < 1294147383 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I just mean "in what" < 1294147609 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :System F, then. < 1294147677 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: in that case, it is a (difficult) theorem that every well typed term has a normal form (i.e. you can evaluate everything and it wont loop) < 1294147714 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's plausible to enumerate all (one) normal forms of type forall a. a -> a < 1294147736 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And in Haskell? < 1294147737 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so like \a -> a counts but (\a -> a) (\a -> a) doesn't < 1294147776 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :undefined :: a -> a is a counterexample < 1294148068 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294148207 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: you don't buy it?? < 1294148219 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294148225 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: have you seen any proof that simple typed lambda calculus normalizes < 1294148424 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# [...]. From reading these comments, it is clear that < 1294148424 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# text following a '#' is ignored to the end of the line. < 1294148433 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from the top of a config file :D < 1294148440 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice way to put it < 1294148535 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294148803 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, zuh. < 1294148836 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, OK. Pretending undefined doesn't work? < 1294148844 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*exist < 1294148895 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, wait. I see what you mean. < 1294149616 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1294149667 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, hi < 1294149673 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1294149734 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: for log reading: I tried that newer version of synergy thingy. Same old bugs: 1) clipboard buggy in various ways 2) altgr key sometimes get stuck when on guest screen. < 1294149749 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :both still there < 1294149848 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294149876 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294149935 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: there is possibly one bug that is gone, but it is so rare I can't be sure yet. (Caps lock getting suck in different states compared to keyboard led, and different states on the different computers) < 1294149957 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that happened like twice in 6 months < 1294149962 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294150003 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:15:47 erm - one character domain names that are not registered == roughly all of them < 1294150013 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: no, that you can actually register -- there are 100 or so < 1294150016 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most are reserved or registered < 1294150064 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: know anything about LaRouche youth movement? < 1294150096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: LaRouch people are all complete nutcases, as far as i can tell. it is interesting but i have not looked in to it as much as i would like to < 1294150103 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: why? < 1294150116 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that's where I am < 1294150122 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought you might know more :P < 1294150137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: nope :) but wikipedia does! < 1294150140 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Views_of_Lyndon_LaRouche_and_the_LaRouche_movement < 1294150168 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I believe 1 or 2 letter ones can no longer be registered. Not sure if it was some tlds only, or all. The existing ones were grandfathered. < 1294150180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: only some TLDs. < 1294150185 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294150187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you _definitely_ can register them. i looked into thix < 1294150195 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, god, I love the LaRouche movement. < 1294150218 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They say that the 340Hz A is part of the conspiracy. < 1294150218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: for instance I believe that nic.st will sell you a one-char if you give them insane amounts of money < 1294150222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: :D < 1294150226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: info! ^ < 1294150251 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er, *440Hz < 1294150256 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tell me! < 1294150261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: hopefully I will be able to script looking up all the domains to see which ones are free and registerable, filter out those with unreasonable laws (*cough* .ly must follow sharia law *cough*), and then filter out those with insane prices < 1294150275 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway, as I said in log. the new synergy thingy did not help at all < 1294150280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha. < 1294150280 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know more about it than that, just that they want to go back to 432Hz A tuning. < 1294150281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ah. < 1294150293 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.nic.st/twoletter/name/w < 1294150304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294150308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway x.st is registered < 1294150338 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1294150340 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :php infinite loop < 1294150345 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: doesn't crash my php < 1294150347 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RELEVANT: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_YDVog236Bc < 1294150358 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, if only I knew how to reproduce these bugs. It is pointless to say "alt-gr sometimes get stuck" or "sometimes you get ghost pastes in gtk programs on the 'interactive' machine". < 1294150387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: aww, not anagolf's either < 1294150398 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[This achievement by an amateur chorus would have been virtually impossible if not for [...] performing the work in the scientifically correct musical tuning of C=256 Hz, rather than the prevalent, anti-musical and vocally destructive tuning of the Romantic School's A=440 or higher (see below).]] < 1294150408 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SCIENTIFICALLY CORRECT < 1294150408 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait no it does! < 1294150411 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was doing it wrong < 1294150433 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294150446 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I trsied that out earlier when I read hte article but I must have done it wrong < 1294150455 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I don't know more about it than that, just that they want to go back to 432Hz A tuning. <-- err, as far as I know you generally try to tune to match what the music was written for. At least in professional orchestras. < 1294150480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't work on 5.3.3 here < 1294150486 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I think they just want *everything* tuned to 432Hz A. < 1294150491 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, this might include non-equal temperament and so on < 1294150496 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, that's just silly < 1294150505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH MAN YOU THINK SO? < 1294150514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SO WEIRD I WOULDN'T HAVE CALLED THEM SILLY YOU'RE A VISIONARY < 1294150517 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, if you are doing it professionally you tune for whatever the music was written for < 1294150545 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294150547 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[The Schiller Institute, which represents these ideas internationally, has become known for its initiative to lower the international standard musical pitch to middle-C=256 cycles per second (corresponding to approximately A=430 to 432), in order to preserve the human voice and to return the performance of Classical music to that of the composers' poetic intentions.]] < 1294150557 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PRESERVE THE HUMAN VOICE < 1294150581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: plz don't debate gpl/bsd here, it has been done 5 billion times before < 1294150588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we're above such jihads < 1294150614 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well if the music was written for that then it should be played like that. If it was written for something else then do as it's author intended! < 1294150616 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because we all know that a 1% increase in frequency wreaks havoc on the vocal chords. < 1294150625 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.21stcenturysciencetech.com/images2010/Obama_BP.gif < 1294150632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: p.s. it's irrelevant because selling data is a broken business model only held in place by illogical regulations that should be abolished, which would conveniently make the GPL and BSD identical in making no restrictions whatsoever < 1294150635 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BP employee of the month LOL < 1294150659 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, also, why do they centre around vocals? Don't they care at all about purely instrumental music!? < 1294150661 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :14:05 < JohnFlux> Roger Penrose, as a kid, was dropped down a grade at school < 1294150661 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : for doing so badly at math < 1294150661 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :14:06 < j-invariant> and now he thinks godels incompleteness theorem means that < 1294150664 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: heh < 1294150664 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : the human brain is something more than a turing machine - < 1294150668 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : guess some things never change, huh? < 1294150670 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ nobody in #physics liked my joke < 1294150688 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shouldn't that be < 1294150690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :##physics < 1294150692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :***8troll#Y% < 1294150709 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :##physics IGNORED my brilliant idea. < 1294150718 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, GRIND THEM INTO THE DUST < 1294150728 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MORE RELEVANT STUFF: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schiller_Institute < 1294150736 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what was that "brilliant idea"? < 1294150745 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, Hawking generator. < 1294150761 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, err. What would that be < 1294150763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:00:31 pikhq, speaking as someone who has read the licence, read copyright law, worked for a copyright attorney, and has two patents.... < 1294150768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: software patents by any chance? < 1294150770 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, a generator of physicists in wheelchairs? < 1294150775 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Before I discovered that some bastards had copied it, gone back in time and written a paper on it. < 1294150799 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a generator that produced hawkings would be awesome < 1294150804 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[The Schiller Institute employs a large set of arguments for this tuning, from historical accuracy to claims that this is how the universe is tuned, with references to Johannes Kepler's treatise on the harmony of the world, where he proposes the notion that the ordering of planetary orbits is based on harmonics and the relationships among the Platonic solids.[23]]] < 1294150811 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kepler's theory of the world. < 1294150816 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is no higher comedy. < 1294150817 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :weird I was just about to paste that exact quote < 1294150823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:04:04 the 2-BSD license still results in fewer restrictions than the GPL (and public domain even fewer - but its not legally possible to put something in the public domain) < 1294150833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: it is in many countries. don't be so US-centric. < 1294150834 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :..and say that Kepler himself knew this theory was slightly off and throw it out < 1294150835 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, HIS MOTHER! < 1294150849 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: :D < 1294150854 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, he clearly knew it was crap, since it requires circular orbits to work. < 1294150864 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh, that doesn't sound as good asas "YOUR MOTHER". < 1294150866 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as* < 1294150874 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294150915 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Phantom_Hoover wonders if you can prove that the only function of type a -> a is the identity function. < 1294150930 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is parametricity < 1294150943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:07:26 pikhq, company X decided to make a project. they look for some base to start on. they find G (GPLed) and B (BSDed). They choose to go with B because of its more free licences. They make a product and sell it. they contribute 20% of that code back to B. Now B gets something and G gets nothing. lets pretend B didn't exist and X wanted to have a viable business model. so they decide to write it on their own a < 1294150943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nd not use G. so now G still < 1294150943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:07:26 gets nothing. < 1294150944 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :parametricity, awesome word < 1294150945 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unfortunately, as there is no such thing as a monopoly on copying non-scarce data, X's hilariously bad business model nets them nothing and they go out of business before they even realise that the GPL has no legal standing. a sad story! < 1294150946 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION googles it < 1294150950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wait, that's just in reasonable world. < 1294150970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Phantom_Hoover wonders if you can prove that the only function of type a -> a is the identity function. < 1294150975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: weren't you talking about that < 1294150977 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :theorems just from the types < 1294150982 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's what prompted it. < 1294150982 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: SHEESH < 1294150990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: sheesh what < 1294150991 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: right < 1294150993 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: and have you installed uAgda yet? < 1294151000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: well f can't inspect the value because it's polymorphic < 1294151007 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: no, i had to reinstall ghc. < 1294151010 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it holds perfectly for system F, and breaks down partially for haskell because of nontermination and seq < 1294151010 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294151020 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: haskell is not a useful language to prove things about :) < 1294151022 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes, but I mean an actual, rigorous *proof*. < 1294151035 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: probably in uagda :} < 1294151039 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :14:23 < oerjan> it holds perfectly for system F, and breaks down partially for haskell because of nontermination and seq < 1294151042 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haahaa < 1294151043 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well someone _did_ write a paper about how much parametricity still holds in haskell < 1294151045 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.schillerinstitute.org/music/revolution.html < 1294151051 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"PARTIALLY" < 1294151055 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The website of the crackpots itself. < 1294151087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: it's a power of two, i like it < 1294151105 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: basically parametricity gives you for f : a -> a that f . g = g . f for any g whose type fits. then put g = const x for any x < 1294151111 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes, but that's where the non-crazy arguments end. < 1294151114 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*f :: a -> a < 1294151118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://www.schillerinstitute.org/music/2007/historic_videos.html < 1294151123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :VIDYAS < 1294151162 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Order Verdi pitch tuning forks" I KNEW THEY WERE SELLING SOMETHING < 1294151171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:27:32 j-invariant: For what reason do certain English-speaking adults insist on conforming to and uplifting a certain subset of the prescribed rules of correct English grammar, but still ignore others? Perhaps because English is a living language, and if an entire generation starts spelling "a lot" as "alot", then the correct spelling is "alot". < 1294151181 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Um, excuse me, the alot is used when referring to the alot. http://hyperboleandahalf.blogspot.com/2010/04/alot-is-better-than-you-at-everything.html < 1294151187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: a lot is quantification. < 1294151189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Duh. < 1294151238 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :beh < 1294151253 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought i can make a tunnel for lava to flow < 1294151269 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, you can but be careful of burns. It need to slow downwards though < 1294151270 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and take flowing lava from the lake to light my cave < 1294151272 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: your addiction is inevitable, buy it so you can play on our server :p < 1294151290 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, we have a skyway! < 1294151299 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, your argument made no sense wrt. "alot". He just claimed that language changes over time. < 1294151311 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, the skyway is actually secure on non-peaceful mode. < 1294151314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: alot and a lot mean two different things < 1294151318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the alot is an animal: http://hyperboleandahalf.blogspot.com/2010/04/alot-is-better-than-you-at-everything.html < 1294151327 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: a lot means "a lot". < 1294151333 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ever heard of homonyms? :) < 1294151340 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: WHOOOOOOOSHTUPID < 1294151349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :neither whoosh nor stupid seemed to cover it there < 1294151353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i decided to innovate < 1294151367 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoopid < 1294151369 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and yes it is an invented animal. But sure. Why not. < 1294151370 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Innovation in Puns medal, Missing the Point division plz? < 1294151391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :02:02:51 * Sgeo gets desparate < 1294151391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :02:02:55 desperate < 1294151398 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not so desparate that you won't correct your spelling i see < 1294151417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :02:44:48 Possibly, or it could be something else; if you're not on Windows, we can't help. < 1294151419 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We can't? < 1294151422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't you mean if you _are_ on Windows. < 1294151431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :03:03:40 FWIW, if you actually buy it and you want to use mcmap, you'll need to switch to Linux. < 1294151431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :03:04:03 Once I buy it, I intend to mostly play on online servers < 1294151432 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294151434 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that's what I meant. < 1294151435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: mcmap works only on online server. < 1294151435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s < 1294151445 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, UNTRUE! < 1294151452 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lava floows in my tunnel but the cave isn't so deep < 1294151453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: well, it only works on SMP servers. < 1294151454 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It can work on LOCAL servers as well! < 1294151457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and playing an SMP server locally would suck < 1294151461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since you can just give yourself shit < 1294151462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also bugs < 1294151478 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: and mcmap is incredibly useful on our server since we often just give a coordinate pair to //goto. so be prepared to boot to ubuntu. < 1294151479 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294151488 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, in any case you are the one being silly here. First for trying to appeal to authority (which isn't even one really!) and second for trying to use that as an argument where it didn't fit. < 1294151504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: please, you need to invent the Nuclear Whoosh so I can use it on Vorpal < 1294151513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: he is the Hiroshima to my desire to bomb japs < 1294151519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(best analogy? no, GREATEST) < 1294151534 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, was it supposed to be a joke? Aren't they supposed to be funny. I think I remember you claiming that. < 1294151558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: are you trying to start like a daily game where we each annoy the other into ignoring them for a period of time < 1294151575 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no. But that's an interesting idea. < 1294151577 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll keep score! < 1294151588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. it won't work because my first and last ignore will be permanent. < 1294151591 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Being a neutral 3rd party.) < 1294151598 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: neutral :P < 1294151625 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I'm not sure I'm playing. I'm far too nice to be good at it :P < 1294151636 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA < 1294151648 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, you're better at it than you think. < 1294151652 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, good, you realised that wasn't meant seriously :) < 1294151653 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Much* better. < 1294151677 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also I hate this weather < 1294151680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm made out of a unicorn that poops flowers and niceness. < 1294151685 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 dm snow this afternoon < 1294151701 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm actually inside snow now < 1294151705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we don't have doors in my country < 1294151722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :05:18:14 cheater99, that's why I said a -> a. < 1294151729 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: you should probably say forall a. a -> a < 1294151737 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only haskell lets that kind of implicit shit fly >:) < 1294151738 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu < 1294151739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, and ML < 1294151743 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it says it as 'a < 1294151747 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's quite unambiguous < 1294151751 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The snow is all gone here. < 1294151751 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was out in car today. Had to stop a few times because the windshield wipers froze. Fiat really isn't made for this kind of winters. < 1294151763 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fiats* aren't* < 1294151765 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just burt myself in the lava that i invited to my cave < 1294151771 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, lucky you < 1294151773 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and all my possesions < 1294151793 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, should have put glass in first < 1294151799 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, and had a safety water pool < 1294151844 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, official snow depth is at 32 cm. Though it is a fair bit from here. < 1294151863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: did you have lava? < 1294151865 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294151866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: armour < 1294151877 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they only measure it in a few places < 1294151878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: also ignore Vorpal's advice, just stuff valuable stuff into chest before working with lava < 1294151896 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, my advice was good. Having a water pool to put out the fire is a good idea < 1294151901 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a bucket of water in a quick slot < 1294151906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more trouble than it's worth < 1294151908 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :usually < 1294151910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bucket sure < 1294151911 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anything else meh < 1294151923 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :besides after a point dying is preferable < 1294151932 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. you're on fire. you have a diamond pickaxe < 1294151938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you spend the time throwing the pickaxe away from fire < 1294151943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or trying to save yourself possibly failing and losing it? < 1294151978 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you make sure to always be above the lava level when working with it. And there being a way to get out if you fall. < 1294151988 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you haven't answered my q < 1294151989 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and water pools are still useful < 1294152001 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh, deewiant expressed is lagged beyond usability. < 1294152005 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*express < 1294152005 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, actually I'm not sure. I would safe myself since I have diamond armour too. < 1294152014 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no time to throw it all the safety < 1294152029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION falls down an unloaded chunk error, with cows, while moving forwards somehow, in a minecart < 1294152032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you didn't get rid of the armour before working with lava? < 1294152034 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clever. < 1294152084 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, if I work with lava sure. But then I make sure to take security precautions such as being able to walk out the lava area if I fall in, so I don't get stuck unable to get out < 1294152104 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the other case when you could hit lava is mining, and then I wear armour of course < 1294152111 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in case of pits or whatever < 1294152159 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i will move myself < 1294152167 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so far I only fell into lava once in minecraft on single player. And that was in the beginning, I had stone tools only still back then < 1294152181 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: there is lava everywhere at low levels btw. < 1294152194 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed. And sometimes at higher levels < 1294152200 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, last I checked chests didn't burtn < 1294152202 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :burn* < 1294152209 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea < 1294152213 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i don't have much < 1294152216 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some gold, one diamond < 1294152220 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :200 redstone < 1294152231 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i think i'm bored with this enormous cave < 1294152254 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a video of bees building a honeycomb? < 1294152259 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can take everything and find another place < 1294152261 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, mhm. If you find a large floating island you could build a cottage on top (they are rarely large enough even for that, let alone anything larger) < 1294152280 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, btw about language change. Do you say "a newt" or "an ewt"? < 1294152292 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an ewt < 1294152303 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, at least you are somewhat consistent then! :D < 1294152312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: you can ditch redstone generally < 1294152317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: it's slow to mine and basically worthless < 1294152321 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1294152332 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well a few are useful to have around, for the occasional circuit < 1294152347 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but circuits... < 1294152350 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :personally I don't mine it actively, but if I need to mine it because it is in my way then I put it in a chest < 1294152360 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: only mine it if you need it :P < 1294152363 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it won't go away < 1294152363 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, yeah. If you have it, don't throw it away < 1294152369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1294152372 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but don't mine it actively unless you need it < 1294152380 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just mean when mining you can ignore it most of the time < 1294152402 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, quite, except when it is in your path and you are digging a supposedly straight tunnel. < 1294152443 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, do you use a minecart system to get around your single player world btw? < 1294152462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i don't have an active single player world < 1294152466 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah < 1294152469 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially since the files are on the other box < 1294152473 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for my inactive one :D < 1294152474 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah right < 1294152494 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, rsync them. that is what I do between my thinkpad and my desktop < 1294152525 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm i should build a boat < 1294152551 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no, i don't plan to use the old laptop all that much now < 1294152553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it can be a server < 1294152589 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, build when needed. They break so easily it is pretty pointless to build one and expect it to be there next time. Some animal could walk into it the wrong way so it gets pushed into a stone wall or whatever. Happens a lot < 1294152605 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well having a backup on another system is always nice < 1294152653 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also laptop as server is probably not such good idea. laptop drives are made for lots of starts/stops, not for long continuous operation. < 1294152672 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :such a* < 1294152673 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh, who cares, it's quiet and small :) < 1294152674 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : variable: software patents by any chance? --> no; I am NOT getting into the rest of the conversation < 1294152690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: >:) < 1294152701 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: if we're going to have a holy war it can at least be in less-explored territory < 1294152721 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, emacs vs vi ? < 1294152727 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what about a coq vs. agda flamewar? < 1294152728 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-} < 1294152766 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do I parse command line arguments in Haskell ? < 1294152777 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: there is a System.Arguments I think < 1294152805 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: but they're not even the same thing :) < 1294152810 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: System.Environment < 1294152816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do args <- getArgs; ... < 1294152818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :args is then [String] < 1294152831 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah getArgs from System.Environment < 1294152837 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, are vi and eamcs really the same thing though? < 1294152839 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: emacs v. vi is *very* well-trodden < 1294152843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: vile vs. nedit would be fun < 1294152845 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it also has GetOpt < 1294152852 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :System.Console.GetOpt < 1294152858 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ed vs. TECO? < 1294152875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: teco wins obviously, speaking as someone who has edited with both < 1294152876 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :emacs v. vi is *very* well-trodden <--- yet nobody seems to have got anywhere..? < 1294152882 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, icewm vs dwm ? < 1294152891 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you used teco? < 1294152928 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go meta: flamewar vs. not-having-a-flamewar < 1294152959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes, i've used teco, it's nice < 1294152963 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294152975 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, really? Huh. < 1294152980 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I like ais' statement -- the kind of people you get in here are more likely to use either both emacs and vi, or neither < 1294152999 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais ? < 1294153003 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes, I mean if you showed a dump of all the keys you put into emacs it'd look like line noise too but it's actually fun to use < 1294153006 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, ais523 < 1294153009 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: ais523, one of our top actives < 1294153012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not as much recently though < 1294153018 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm < 1294153021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.wolframscience.com/prizes/tm23/solved.html this guy :-P < 1294153039 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE BEARD < 1294153042 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note: site is shameless wolfram self-promotion crap < 1294153043 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT IS SO RIDICULOUS < 1294153052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Beardiculous. < 1294153081 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually today I used... emacs, kate, nano. Not vi though. While I have nothing against vi as such, I just can't get used to the split command/editing mode concept. < 1294153113 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as for vim, all I can say is that I looked at vimscript and concluded that while elisp is not great for a lisp, it is still better than vimscript. < 1294153113 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, exactly < 1294153125 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : variable: software patents by any chance? --> no; I am NOT getting into the rest of the conversation <-- or else he'll have to use his patented death ray < 1294153134 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, sshhh < 1294153149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: *patented death ray control software < 1294153224 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is interesting, Kepler has a different theory about snowflake formation than me < 1294153241 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294153329 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001f5b00390f-CM001e6b2335dc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294153431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: lol < 1294153510 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm doesn't that apply to a lot of old science. The best fitting theory changes over time as new discoveries are made and so on. < 1294153526 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, what is so interesting about this difference in particular? < 1294153599 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, ^ < 1294153619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kepler is right about everything < 1294153622 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C=256hz qed beyotches < 1294153724 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so what about non-European music? < 1294153756 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it safe to jump to the water from a great height? < 1294153764 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, how deep is the water < 1294153770 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 256 fucking hz < 1294153774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: 2 deep or more, yes < 1294153774 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :few boxes < 1294153780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 square, no < 1294153807 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, 2 or deeper should be safe. But I found that sometimes 3 or deeper is needed. I presume due to lag in SMP but I haven't played much single player lately < 1294153824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love how NOBODY HAS RESPONDED TO MY UBUNTUFORUMS THREAD AT ALL. < 1294153835 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact it has been pushed off the front page. < 1294153839 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ubuntu forums are useless.... < 1294153846 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ubuntu. What do you expect. < 1294153849 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: less useless than #ubuntu. < 1294153853 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :repost it to all the forums :P < 1294153853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: less useless than #ubuntu. < 1294153857 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well sometiems good stuff comes up in google < 1294153866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: googled to hell and back for this already :/ < 1294153872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i'm not about to go for linuxquestions or something that's even worse < 1294153882 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is the problem? (..I don't know anything about this stuff :/) < 1294153886 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you think you've got it bad? < 1294153909 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Noöne* has any helpful advice for me on this graphics issue. < 1294153918 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well yeah. But that is like saying falcon is better than lolcode. (note: I do not know the sorting order of badness here, just that both are very bad) < 1294153929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: how do i make a macbook air boot a normal usb drive formatted like the ubuntu download instructions tell me to with ubuntu on it; googling suggests that macs dont like to do it but this appears to be false; the fedora guys seem to think you need a gpt partition table and an hfs partition; but apparently there are success stories with using those instructions to boot ubuntu off a usb stick on a mac < 1294153933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I have NO FUCKING CLUE < 1294153943 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, LOLCODE is quite a nice language if you ignore everything before the AST. < 1294153961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*quite a horrible language < 1294153963 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, maybe it differs between different macs? < 1294153968 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, firmware versions or whatever < 1294153970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It uses the implicit result of the last statement to work out conditionals. < 1294153972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Doubtful. < 1294153974 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I was able to boot mac os x off a USB but not ubuntu < 1294153980 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: heh... < 1294153990 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is bootcamp installed? I presume it is? < 1294154003 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: as i have told you countless times before, "boot camp" is a marketing name that means nothing. < 1294154006 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so you might have to burn some CDs to do it - and it takes a lot of testing to find out which CD works etc .. < 1294154014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it is an EFI update which adds bios emulation, and an OS X tool to download windows drivers and partition the disk. < 1294154027 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, told me once afaik. And I meant the EFI upgrade in question < 1294154033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every mac since it came out comes with the EFI update and the tool, however i have not used the tool as it will only create two partitions < 1294154037 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well resize one and create one < 1294154043 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294154048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: CDs would make it trivial, but I don't have an optical drive < 1294154054 0 :cheater99!~cheater@g229031242.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294154057 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh O_o < 1294154060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: and Airs can only boot with the Steve Jobs Approved(TM) SuperDrive. which costs £60. < 1294154067 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::S < 1294154068 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sucks < 1294154071 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i kind of want to get usb working :-P < 1294154075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm sure I can it'll just be a pain < 1294154080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what you get when you buy Apple... < 1294154083 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :infinite pain < 1294154091 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought someone figured out how to get ubuntu on the macbook air < 1294154098 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe it was pro < 1294154103 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: oh they have < 1294154106 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they say "use a superdrive" < 1294154110 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh. < 1294154112 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh okay < 1294154115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or "follow the instructions for usb on the download page" < 1294154117 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see!! I told y < 1294154117 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can Macs even boot flash drives? < 1294154120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the latter i have tried and it didn't work) < 1294154122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: yes < 1294154130 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HMMMM < 1294154130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but theydont like doing it :) < 1294154135 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1294154157 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what happens instead of booting it? < 1294154164 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, error? just booting normal? < 1294154190 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"So after examining all the ideas that came into my head I conclude thus: the cause of the six-sided shape of a snowflake is none other than that of the ordered shapes of plants and of numerical constants; and since in them nothing occurs without supreme reason--not, to be sure, such as discursive reasoning discovers, but such as existed from the first in the Creator’s design and is preserved from that origin to this day in the wonderful nat < 1294154215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: when i hold down option it just shows my drive and the partition i have with i think a grub floppy image on < 1294154217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no usb < 1294154225 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HUHUH < 1294154231 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, does it show the mac os x usb stick if you insert that instead? < 1294154250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the one it came with? i'm sure it does < 1294154255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haven't actually tested it, but yes, it will < 1294154262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can read USBs perfectly fine < 1294154262 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've got a great settlement in a hanging cliff, on a remote island < 1294154264 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just doesn't like this one < 1294154268 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think i might need gpt/hfs ... but < 1294154273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the os x usb instructions on ubuntu.com < 1294154277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :suggest otherwise :-/ < 1294154295 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294154313 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, loadlin for OS X? I'm sure it is possible with a driver of some sort. < 1294154320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dear god no < 1294154337 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it is a journaled fs, you have nothing to worry about ;) < 1294154344 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would probably be possible to make the install CD boot off a /partition/ if i extract it and hook all the bootloaders up and kernel params and stuff < 1294154347 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and rely on BIOS emulation to go properly < 1294154349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it'd be a pain < 1294154352 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, i'd have to do it on the install partition < 1294154362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the swap and shared ones are partitions 4 and 5 IIRC < 1294154366 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i don't think you can boot from them < 1294154368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well maybe swap < 1294154381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although if i put grub on the main ubuntu partition < 1294154384 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, can't you boot from any partition number with gpt? < 1294154387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and used it to boot the 4th or 5th partition... < 1294154387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1294154393 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: not with bios emulation i don't think < 1294154396 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when i select one it just does the 3rd < 1294154400 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm. < 1294154402 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is presumably expected to have a bootloader for the rest < 1294154407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway i'd rather just get usb working < 1294154416 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i half-suspect it might just be that the mac doesn't like that usb stick in particular :D < 1294154424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it can read it in os x and stuff... < 1294154437 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that sounds weird. Maybe it doesn't have the approved-by-jobs bit set? < 1294154456 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, if it can only use one specific cd drive I mean < 1294154466 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, then it is possible the same could apply to usb sticks < 1294154474 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i doubt it since other people have reported success < 1294154490 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, with the same generation of macbook air? < 1294154497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1294154499 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294154520 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :strange indeed < 1294154531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder what the rules for bumping are on ubuntuforums, and how much they'll yell at me if i violate them < 1294154720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Programming language design has a strange dogma that ... distilling the smallest possible set of elegant core axioms is both possible and profitable. From there, offering this set of axioms leaves the dirty business of making workable software to blue-collar workaday programmers." < 1294154744 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, err. what. < 1294154748 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that made very little sense. < 1294154752 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The foundations of mathematics has a strange dogma that ... distilling the smallest possible set of elegant core axioms is both possible and profitable. From there, offering this set of axioms leaves the dirty business of making workable theories to blue-collar workaday mathematicians. < 1294154768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(first quote from http://www.modernperlbooks.com/mt/2011/01/minimalism.html, latter my own mockery) < 1294154862 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just cannot understand that sort of thing < 1294154890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: either he considers the stdlib axiomatic, or he thinks that people run around with different incompatible stdlibs. well ok you do but nobody else does :) < 1294154917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's surprising how much of an antiacademic sentiment exists in programming < 1294154924 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, antiïntellectualism seems rife in "practical" programming... < 1294154926 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use the same standard library as everyone else that uses a good one < 1294154928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, aren't we meant to be above that? < 1294154942 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we're (meant to be) competent thought worker engineers < 1294154949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so why does everyone shit on theory? < 1294154962 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :programmers are idiots < 1294155023 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that's because the non-idiots have better things to do. < 1294155034 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Technically, SML'97 as defined in the Definition requires only a minimal initial basis, which, while including the types int, real, char, and string, need have no operations on those base types. Hence, the only observable output of an SML'97 program is termination or raising an exception." < 1294155040 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what he means is that languages should come with frameworks < 1294155048 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and huge libs < 1294155060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: no, he means that languages should be perl. < 1294155069 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perlol < 1294155070 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because all he does is advocate perl. all day. on reddit. < 1294155087 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://programmers.stackexchange.com/ < 1294155092 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i installed a package that was dependent on some perl bs the other day < 1294155093 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I rest my csae < 1294155114 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it said "indexing perl manpages, this could take a while" < 1294155129 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after 10 hours it wasn't done. i straced it, and noticed it's opening every single file on my hard drive. < 1294155129 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ugh no i hate that site it's the only one worse than stack overflow < 1294155130 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294155139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: why did you leave it 10 hours. < 1294155158 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when i saw it opening /bin/ksh i knew it was doing something bad < 1294155177 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i couldn't be bothered touching some sort of perl disaster < 1294155184 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you have against ksh :| < 1294155187 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: and besides i have enough cores. < 1294155191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the best worst shell < 1294155196 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: nothing, it's just not a perl manpage < 1294155202 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: but it COULD be :D < 1294155205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a self-extracting perl manpage < 1294155211 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :documenting the "ksh" function < 1294155235 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you filter the ksh binary for readable characters, it's both a perl module and a manual for it < 1294155255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION strings /bin/ksh < 1294155258 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"For example, consider perhaps the ultimate counter example of minimalism in programming language design. PHP's multiple searching functions differ in searchtype( $needle, $haystack ) and search_type( $haystack, $needle ) and searchType( $neestack, $haydle ) and other permutations—and these are core language features." < 1294155258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :))++++////33337777777>>>>BBBEEEHHHKKKNNNQQQQUUUUUUUUUU < 1294155264 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this makes no sense < 1294155265 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yup, perl < 1294155273 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are just procedures, you could add them to scheme < 1294155281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cdefbghijkl+m,*n !"#$%&'()opqrstuGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ[\]^_`vwxyaz-./0123456789:;<=>?@ABCDEF{|}~ < 1294155283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i sense a table :D < 1294155289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o < 1294155289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :m < 1294155290 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f < 1294155291 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :g < 1294155293 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fffffff < 1294155295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UUUUUUU < 1294155297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :--strings /bin/ksh < 1294155320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not the omfg part that is < 1294155323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just th efu < 1294155326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*the fu < 1294155370 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh elliott I hate stuff like this < 1294155378 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't even know what he's trying to say but it's wrong < 1294155384 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe :/ < 1294155395 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish people just wouldn't write stuff < 1294155427 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you can't understand it you've never used php < 1294155429 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is good. < 1294155449 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hereby approve osmose as a good sms emulator < 1294155453 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : --strings /bin/ksh <-- well it is based on a heuristic. A very simple one. Just find printable chars. On each line print as long lengths of these are possible. < 1294155488 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what point is he trying to make < 1294155541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: no idea < 1294155549 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: FFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUU < 1294155559 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do people hone this ability of just write absolute shit < 1294155613 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :strings on random large program in /usr/bin have things like: < 1294155616 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fffff. < 1294155616 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AVAUATUSH < 1294155616 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UUUUUUU < 1294155621 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why doesn't strings at least look for null-termination? < 1294155626 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AVAUATUSH! < 1294155635 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal has finally cracked. < 1294155643 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION joins in < 1294155647 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: POSIX actually says it can < 1294155650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: but most implementations don't < 1294155656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to catch, uh, non-C software! < 1294155661 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IÄ! IÄ! CTHULHU FTAGN < 1294155669 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er, *FHTAGN < 1294155670 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, a lot of strings are not null-terminated outside the C world < 1294155676 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: (possibly because posix requires you to implement a flag that doesn't check for any kind of termination, so it's less work :)) < 1294155689 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although gnu strings is, surprise surprise, SUPA ADVANCE: < 1294155690 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, a lot of UUUUUUU in lots of binaries. Maybe some sort of padding or something that is generated by some tool? < 1294155691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : The options to strings(1) are: < 1294155691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -a This option causes strings to look for strings in all sections < 1294155691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : of the object file (including the (__TEXT,__text) section. < 1294155691 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which flag? < 1294155696 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: probably < 1294155704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: well it's meant to be -a. < 1294155726 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION still views GNU true as the best programming joke EVER. < 1294155741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9699919799/utilities/strings.html < 1294155744 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294155745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-a < 1294155745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Scan files in their entirety. If -a is not specified, it is implementation-defined what portion of each file is scanned for strings. < 1294155748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok so it's not quite that < 1294155758 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :incidentally gnu strings doesn't have -t. < 1294155767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so technically ... OS X doesn't actually count as certified Unix < 1294155777 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except i guess they're probably quite relaxed about all the fiddly command line flags : < 1294155778 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294155789 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 0: 55 push %rbp < 1294155791 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or the machine was fitted with a special POSIX compliamt command set < 1294155791 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that is U < 1294155794 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: heh < 1294155795 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as far as I can tell < 1294155809 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so probably not just nop padding then < 1294155810 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://libposix.sourceforge.net/ why does this exist < 1294155819 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION decides to disassemble his /bin/true < 1294155838 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, *nix in user space or what? < 1294155841 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no < 1294155848 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: libc that conforms strictly to posix 2008 with no extensions < 1294155852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? WHO KNOWS < 1294155856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sourceforge.net/apps/mediawiki/libposix/index.php?title=Compare < 1294155885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stupid < 1294155898 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294155905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay, I got hand-approved for byuu's forum. SO LUCKY :p < 1294155908 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very stupid and ill defined criteria for most of those < 1294155941 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Conclusion: /bin/true is completely insane. < 1294155967 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Scan files in their entirety. If -a is not specified, it is implementation-defined what portion of each file is scanned for strings. <-- on linux I believe it skips some comment sections from ELF files or such < 1294155977 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nopw 0x0(%rax,%rax,1) < 1294155978 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What. < 1294155984 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Do not scan only the initialized and loaded sections of object files; scan the whole files." < 1294155988 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just, what. < 1294155997 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what is strange about that. It is a nop. < 1294156005 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, in fact a nop larger than 1 byte < 1294156018 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, but WHY < 1294156026 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294156028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :addressed nop < 1294156028 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is nothing unexpected. Compilers add padding between functions and so on. < 1294156032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: disassemble with intel syntax urgh < 1294156041 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh, you can do that? < 1294156059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: i think you can tell objdump to < 1294156064 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-M intel < 1294156065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :failing that you could convert < 1294156066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294156076 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, better. < 1294156086 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still have no idea where the hell execution starts. < 1294156104 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Later < 1294156113 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, both intel and amd docs recommend that you use use as large nops as possible rather than many small. Better with one 7 byte nop than 7 one byte ones. Better for instruction pipeline if ever executed or something such iirc (as would be if it aligns the start of a loop, but not if you align the start of a function) < 1294156128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Um, at _main. One would presume. < 1294156137 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not _start? < 1294156142 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, that's irrelevant. < 1294156144 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GNU true is written in C. < 1294156164 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And dynamically linked? < 1294156164 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well _start is provided by crt0.o or some such file < 1294156167 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1294156180 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294156191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um yes i would assume < 1294156196 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. C programs are linked to crt whatever, which contains the _start symbol. < 1294156196 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :re dynamically linked < 1294156207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well crt is always compiled in < 1294156208 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Statically linked, not dynamically. < 1294156213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it'll be dynamically linked to libc. < 1294156224 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no one claimed it would be dynamically linked to crt0.o ... < 1294156265 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyhow, at least my /bin/true is stripped, so it doesn't have the executable's own symbols any more. < 1294156267 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, also, ELF(64) doesn't prepend _ to function names. < 1294156269 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how fun, my /bin/true seems completely stripped of all symbols < 1294156277 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably they are in some -dbg packet < 1294156280 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :package* < 1294156314 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, objdump -f reports the entry point address; start from there. < 1294156331 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, _start is still called _start < 1294156343 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, just check with an unstripped file < 1294156345 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, yes, but main is not changed to _main. < 1294156383 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I never claimed it was < 1294156390 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, that was elliott < 1294156408 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is this true? < 1294156414 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i believe so? < 1294156421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was a misatke < 1294156424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*mistake < 1294156501 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how tricky is un-inlineing? < 1294156538 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for something like lostking.b it could be an optimisation I believe. < 1294156655 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: tricky. < 1294156663 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think lostkng is goto-based, not procedures, no? maybe not < 1294156667 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: have you managed to compile bsnes? < 1294156685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: yes on linux, no on os x < 1294156689 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd need a newer gcc < 1294156692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i'd rather just get linux working < 1294156696 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't have 4.5 and when i try to compile wiht 4.4 it makes problems with syntax < 1294156698 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm. I just noticed a lot of code snippets showing up again and again over the file < 1294156706 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't want to install 4.5 either. < 1294156737 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: well, you have to. < 1294156739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: gcc is very buggy. < 1294156754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: besides, it needs a gcc with C++0x support < 1294156754 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why not clang? < 1294156758 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which 4.4 evidently doesn't have < 1294156762 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There really ought to be a word for anti-Luddites. < 1294156775 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you have no idea how much emulator code gets badly compiled < 1294156785 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: the makefile specifically sets that gcc version when the OS is OS X, and for a reason < 1294156786 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, apart from "anti-Luddites" you mean? < 1294156802 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know, people who view all new technology as wonderful and obviously superior to what went before. < 1294156804 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4.4 has 0x < 1294156805 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, is it doing something strange then? < 1294156810 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott! < 1294156817 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't recognize []() { ... } < 1294156821 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tell me about that type system you mentioned earlier < 1294156824 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what 4.4 chokes on < 1294156824 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I mean, unless you JIT or do evil mangling or similar it should work, no? < 1294156835 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, in theory at least < 1294156836 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: hahahaha < 1294156840 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you have way too much faith in c compilers < 1294156843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: that's C++0x. < 1294156850 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well duh, due to bugs it won't in practise < 1294156852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: you need a compiler with C++0x lambda support. get a gcc 4.5 binary. < 1294156857 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: 4.4 has 0x mode at least < 1294156862 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: but no lambda support < 1294156865 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294156868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: http://lukepalmer.wordpress.com/category/code/ixi/ read from bottom to top < 1294156878 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is he using lambdas anyways? < 1294156935 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, C++? lambdas? wait a second... Do they give you a proper closure? < 1294156946 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would seem they do < 1294156946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes. < 1294156958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: because he built his gui layer around them < 1294156972 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha @ php, php has recently received closures. < 1294156997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :name\spaces < 1294157006 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can separately sort of tell which variables to capture. < 1294157012 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(In a C++0x lambda.) < 1294157016 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what language would you use to write a program that needs to do lots of ioctl()s and similar? < 1294157024 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah, namespaces in php are largely laughable < 1294157030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i wouldn't :> < 1294157040 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: haskell of course < 1294157042 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, in the hypothetical situation that you would. < 1294157042 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: or some ML dialect ... if I could get away with it ... maybe < 1294157059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haskell might work < 1294157062 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm. So good FFI there? < 1294157069 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no, just bindings. < 1294157073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don;'t know of any ml ffis < 1294157074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*don't < 1294157078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh < 1294157078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1294157081 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm tired < 1294157082 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294157089 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, go sleep then? < 1294157104 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: umm < 1294157104 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you can join oerjan in his sleep schedule < 1294157104 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's 4pm < 1294157108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have to be up at 8am < 1294157112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294157113 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :8 to 9 < 1294157124 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :both haskell and erlang have very good ffi < 1294157133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i slept now i would wake up at midnight < 1294157137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i couldn;t anyway < 1294157138 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not tired enough < 1294157140 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*couldn't < 1294157149 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you'll get up at 4-5, which means you'll be allowed to oversleep for the next couple of weeks < 1294157157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh shut up < 1294157178 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that wasn't nice :( < 1294157613 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I slept 24 hours once a week ago < 1294157642 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :continuously? < 1294157649 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1294157703 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my "record" is about 16 hours I think < 1294157738 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Had you not slept before? < 1294157783 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I had slept before. < 1294157833 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think mine may be like 20 hours, but not sure < 1294157878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: how long ago? < 1294158067 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I think the previous day. < 1294158199 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294158214 0 :Hilbert!~Hilbert@93.95.81.129 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294158240 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn < 1294158246 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm completely lost < 1294158255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: try and die >:) < 1294158256 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg who got lambdabot < 1294158261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: did you get lambdabot < 1294158277 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes. < 1294158283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: permanent? :p < 1294158296 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cale certainly offered it. < 1294158310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SO LUCKY < 1294158314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 41+1 < 1294158314 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 42 < 1294158335 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@208.69.183.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294158343 0 :Silvah!~Silvah@unaffiliated/silvah JOIN :#esoteric < 1294158348 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Cale, i.e. yes. < 1294158348 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Phantom_Hoover: done :) < 1294158349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh dear god Phantom_Hoover what did you do < 1294158355 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're invading now < 1294158373 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, THE PORTAL IN THE CHANNELS WAS NOT MEANT TO BE < 1294158374 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :our topic is not very presentable for this occasion < 1294158381 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I HAVE TAMPERED IN GOD'S DOMAIN < 1294158394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page | logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D or (hg) http://codu.org/projects/esotericlogs/hg/ < 1294158404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :act professional, everyone < 1294158411 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION does his tie up. < 1294158452 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Relax, people. I deal with esoteric languages all the time. < 1294158454 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294158466 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Today I'll probably be doing something with C++, for instance. < 1294158471 0 :Cale!~Cale@CPE00026f8481b6-CM00222d55727d.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294158482 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why did it quit? < 1294158487 0 :Silvah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: seconded < 1294158493 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It quit in #haskell as well, FWIW. < 1294158494 0 :Cale!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just wanted to make a change to the code < 1294158500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh oh :D < 1294158505 0 :Cale!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's coming back up :) < 1294158508 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well of course, to be per channel it would be /part < 1294158516 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or PART rather < 1294158518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cale: we apologise if it gets into one of our famous botloops. < 1294158525 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although i think lambdabot puts spaces in front of enough outputs to avoid that. < 1294158525 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cale: What, lambdabot doesn't support hot reloading of the startup code? :-) < 1294158534 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, thankfully the last one was ages ago iirc? < 1294158537 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Was that bug fixed? < 1294158548 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: What bug? < 1294158559 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?where+ bug ?where haskell < 1294158567 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, she's not even in here. < 1294158569 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@echo !echo `echo echo < 1294158580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I doubt she responds to herself. < 1294158581 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, wait. < 1294158588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: But, er, if that works then yes, there is slight cause for concern. < 1294158590 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I believe the bots are configured to ignore each other. Also which one is @ ? < 1294158593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-P < 1294158594 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yes, you need two lambdabots for that to work. < 1294158600 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, lambdabot. < 1294158602 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294158607 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Say hello to EgoBot, HackEgo, and fungot. < 1294158607 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: as for unix. ( at the problem: if a ranlib index is there really such a subdomain as far as i have < 1294158608 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As well as > and ?, it appears. < 1294158610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^source < 1294158610 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://git.zem.fi/fungot/blob/HEAD:/fungot.b98 < 1294158615 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot ignores all the bots though. < 1294158615 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i wonder if that isn't terrible, just to show a friend of mine heard shouted at his theatre, " it's _not_ a waste of my message was just too damn busy putting in multiple ways by the < 1294158618 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But HackEgo talks to everyone I think. < 1294158624 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it hm < 1294158628 0 :Cale!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: It was a different change I wanted to make (the flags for running mueval) < 1294158635 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ul (`ls)S < 1294158636 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`ls < 1294158636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(P.S. When is lambdabot going to be rewritten in Befunge?) < 1294158637 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cale: Ah. < 1294158641 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lets see < 1294158644 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1294158646 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It's obviously the most elegant and concise language for writing IRC bots: http://git.zem.fi/fungot/blob/HEAD:/fungot.b98) < 1294158646 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: upon setting establishing a dial up connection, large memory and a few < 1294158647 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where is hackego? < 1294158652 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: down again probably < 1294158656 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294158659 0 :Cale!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, wow, the joins take a long time < 1294158668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cale: I'm sure they'd go faster ... with Befunge! < 1294158675 0 :Cale!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdabot's join list is getting kind of insane :P < 1294158685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Psht, I remember when we were one of, like... 10 channels! < 1294158688 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294158689 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, your bots are not looking making a good impression. < 1294158691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the good old days. < 1294158692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 2+@ < 1294158694 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : mueval-core: Prelude.read: no parse < 1294158694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1294158696 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@unlambda `.xv < 1294158697 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 2+2 < 1294158697 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : x < 1294158698 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : mueval-core: Prelude.read: no parse < 1294158706 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@echo !echo `echo echo < 1294158706 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, lambadbot belongs here after all. < 1294158706 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :echo; msg:IrcMessage {msgServer = "freenode", msgLBName = "lambdabot", msgPrefix = "Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486", msgCommand = "PRIVMSG", msgParams = ["#esoteric", < 1294158707 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :":@echo !echo `echo echo"]} rest:"!echo `echo echo" < 1294158717 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf, how so? < 1294158726 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That seems buggy, but I'm no expert. < 1294158727 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, @bf and @unlambda. < 1294158734 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe that's not esoteric enough for this channel, though. < 1294158734 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf, right < 1294158737 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>putStrLn "hello" < 1294158746 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: EgoBot already does those! :-P < 1294158746 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> text "hello" < 1294158748 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : mueval-core: Prelude.read: no parse < 1294158760 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and fungot too? < 1294158760 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: we're still picking up the core file, i get a zillion copies of the directory, it is possible there's a new conceptual grouping of processes). < 1294158761 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cale: mueval is broken. < 1294158766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: not unlambda < 1294158770 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh right < 1294158774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: So is the Brainfuck 8-bit, 16-bit, bignum? Left-infinite or right-infinite tape? What EOF convention? (Any input?) < 1294158785 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@version < 1294158786 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdabot 4.2.2.1 < 1294158786 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Do c and d interact properly in the Unlambda? < 1294158786 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :darcs get http://code.haskell.org/lambdabot < 1294158787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>:D < 1294158792 0 :Cale!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh dear < 1294158793 0 :Cale!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1294158794 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I always mix up {under,un}{load,lambda} for unknown reason < 1294158803 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clearly lambdabot should support Lazy K instead of unlambda. < 1294158806 0 :Silvah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cale, you broke lambdabot! < 1294158810 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I approve. < 1294158812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's more flexible! < 1294158815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j #haskell < 1294158816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops. < 1294158831 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did I pimp my monady IO library for Lazy K yet? < 1294158842 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT IS TOTALLY MONADY < 1294158855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://code.haskell.org/lambdabot/Plugin/BF.hs Wait, whre's the actual interpreter? < 1294158860 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also the sequencing is broken. < 1294158872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Heh @ it being breadbox's though.) < 1294158932 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: In the main directory. < 1294158949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294158987 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294158995 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it looks like it's... right-infinite? I think so < 1294158998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :8-bit cells < 1294159002 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It should support http://samuelhughes.com/boof/ < 1294159005 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wrap on overflow < 1294159015 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Samuel Hughes != Sam Hughes? < 1294159020 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: It should support every language on http://esolangs.org/wiki/Language_list. < 1294159030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: But especially http://esolangs.org/wiki/Brainfuck/w/index.php%3Ftitle%3DTalk:Brainfuck/index.php. < 1294159030 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: What do you mean? < 1294159032 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Some of them are uncomputable. < 1294159036 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf, note that a fair deal of those languages are not computable. < 1294159040 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: And it should support them best of all! < 1294159051 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And some of them require time travel. < 1294159055 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The latter is an alias for the former, as far as I can tell. < 1294159065 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf, Sam Hughes of qntm.org. < 1294159066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not like time travel is computable. < 1294159073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everyone with the same name is the same person! < 1294159075 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No, it's "the other" Sam Hughes. < 1294159077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You heard it here first. < 1294159087 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :idiotic mob killed me in my new cavern < 1294159094 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i've lost tools and coal < 1294159095 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1294159096 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;f < 1294159097 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How stupid of it. < 1294159099 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: At least pretend this isn't #minecraft while we have guests. < 1294159109 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ha! < 1294159113 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We've caught you. < 1294159121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO WE TALK ABOUT ESOTERIC LANGUAGES _ALL DAY_ < 1294159128 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some of them, although computable, are not enough information to write implementation. < 1294159132 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MINECRAFT IN AN ESOTERIC LANGUAGE < 1294159133 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DISCUSS < 1294159135 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294159136 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guests < 1294159136 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like Java? < 1294159139 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How esoteric. < 1294159152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Oh man, that's as funny as that one time someone called Perl line noise! < 1294159156 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf, we have a well-established boundary between "esoteric" and "boring". < 1294159157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :woah, yesterday's log is really big < 1294159158 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Actually we discuss like a lot of various things in this channel, although esoteric programming is its main topic. < 1294159166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes. Boring languages are the ones we don't like. < 1294159168 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ostensibly < 1294159173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Esoteric languages are the ones too repulsive to dislike. < 1294159174 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, YES < 1294159186 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, some esolangs are actually nice. < 1294159200 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Redivider is actually quite snazzy I've always thought. < 1294159207 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(We still need an Eodermdrome interpreter.) < 1294159234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Really though, our favourite esoteric language, so theoretical and academic to be almost useless, yet so beautiful in its purity that it's almost a shame that it's impossible to write real programs in it... < 1294159237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Haskell. < 1294159242 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION runs away, *very* quickly < 1294159271 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Why? I doubt most of #haskell would seriously disagree with you. < 1294159280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :touche :) < 1294159280 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294159287 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe dons and the other Galois folks. < 1294159290 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you think Haskell isn't theoretically pure *enough*. < 1294159298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well...yes...that is to say... < 1294159305 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOOK JUST BECAUSE I WANT DEPENDENT TYPES < 1294159319 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well, as far as languages that *try* to be theoretically pure, Haskell probably ranks pretty badly. < 1294159320 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AND FRP RATHER THAN IO < 1294159341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just say that 'cuz Conal's surname is my name. < 1294159345 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We should totally make a Haskell Lazy K interpreter. < 1294159346 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have to stick together and all. < 1294159354 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: A Haskell interpreter in Lazy K? < 1294159355 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I approve. < 1294159359 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BOTH! < 1294159363 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there any language that uses FRP in any meaningful way? < 1294159372 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Conalskell! < 1294159375 0 :Cale!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haskell is pretty much right on the boundary between research languages and languages that are practical to use < 1294159377 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :First the Lazy K interpreter. < 1294159386 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Is "elliott" /= "elliottt"? < 1294159397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Yes indeed. < 1294159407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: In fact I have talked to elliottt before I believe. Quite confusing. < 1294159412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact I'm = ehird. < 1294159413 0 :Cale!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathematica 7 has a sorta FRP-like thing which actually works, but isn't very theoretically nice. < 1294159422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cale: Plus it's Mathematica. < 1294159429 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, you're ehird. OK. < 1294159437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Darn, now you know my secret. < 1294159446 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Must be sneakier. < 1294159496 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294159576 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This channel seems like such a time-waster. < 1294159585 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION doesn't play Minecraft, though. < 1294159595 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So presumably when you show your true colors it'll subside. < 1294159663 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: That is, until you start playing. < 1294159678 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually we seem to have had a slight break in Minecraft chat due to Christmas. It has been replaced with silence. < 1294159686 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I think it's picking up again. < 1294159697 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I swear we talk about other things sometimes too though, I just have no idea what they are. < 1294159770 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:42 < Cale> Haskell is pretty much right on the boundary between research languages and languages that are practical to use < 1294159778 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes it sound like haskell is almost useless < 1294159805 0 :Cale!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Well, it basically just became useful for industry work :) < 1294159827 0 :Silvah!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294159834 0 :Cale!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: In the last few years or so. < 1294159837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cale: yeah sure, with your wimpy typesystem < 1294159880 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't play Minecraft either. < 1294159882 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (،،3) 1 2 < 1294159882 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I really am amazed how people can use haskell types to set up the program to be correct in various ways < 1294159885 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (،،3) 1 2 < 1294159887 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (3,2,1) < 1294159899 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did make up a lot of my own games, though. < 1294159909 0 :distant_figure!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1294159911 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every time I try to do that I find that I don't need some feature that don't exist < 1294159930 0 :distant_figure!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294159956 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, wait, to prove it correct? < 1294159962 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294159977 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dear GOD, why is it so hard to find a list of reasons why sucks. < 1294159985 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: not abtsract high level correctness but simple stuff < 1294160029 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, PHP, C++, Java: these are all considered suckish. Yet it is nigh-impossible to find reasons for this. < 1294160038 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294160046 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just assumed that you *know* why they suck. < 1294160085 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I would like to make a game < 1294160112 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I could be bothered to actually type out all the code for the thing |I have in mind tohugh :( < 1294160129 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294160142 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, what is it? < 1294160212 0 :Cale!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The question of why those suck comes up all the time and has been answered on the web, mailing lists, and elsewhere countless times :) < 1294160232 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cale, but actually finding those answers is hard. < 1294160240 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: What ideas do you have for making a game? < 1294160268 0 :Cale!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The easiest reason that those three all suck is that they have no proper support for functions. < 1294160274 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: well not so much a game but just an program that lets you immerse yourself in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhombic_dodecahedral_honeycomb < 1294160283 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: so it could be like a maze < 1294160305 0 :Cale!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, you could go into detail, but why nitpick when there's a gigantic glaring flaw :) < 1294160309 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, make it a text game. < 1294160313 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Have you tried any of my games? Feel free also to modify them. < 1294160322 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: do anya of them work on ubuntu? < 1294160336 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, DO NOT BE DRAWN IN BY ZZO < 1294160337 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@p4FF68F66.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294160346 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Yes, any MegaZeux games will work if you compile MegaZeux for Ubuntu. < 1294160360 0 :Cale!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We've known how to implement first class functions efficiently for decades, and we've known about their importance to abstraction since before the dawn of electronic computing. There's no excuse. :) < 1294160387 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: link? < 1294160391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cale: also they have mutability < 1294160393 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to your MegaZeux games < 1294160399 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :08:59 < Khaos> !pom < 1294160399 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :08:59 < Rodney> The Moon is New. New moon in NetHack for the next 3 days. < 1294160400 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and weak to no type system < 1294160406 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdabot needs to get this functionality. < 1294160421 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://zzo38computer.cjb.net/mzx1/ASCMZXTO/ASCMZXTO.ZIP < 1294160438 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: psht, soon you will ascend from nethack to playing dwarf fortress. then you'll descend from playing dwarf fortress to lego^Wminecraft. < 1294160441 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And here is the source code of MegaZeux so that it can be compiled: http://zzo38computer.cjb.net/mzx1/mzx_extended/megazeux_src.zip < 1294160459 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: shouldn't I use http://sourceforge.net/projects/megazeux/files/megazeux/2.82b/megazeux_2.82b_amd64.deb/download ? < 1294160462 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294160470 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Dwarf Fortress? Minecraft? What about your liberty? < 1294160470 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nevermind < 1294160487 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: NetHack takes away the liberty referred to as "free time" < 1294160535 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: what do you think of my idea < 1294160555 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: No. You can also get the latest version compiled from http://vault.digitalmzx.net/ but my version has some additional features and other things. < 1294160559 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Dwarf Fortress doesn't provide the source code. Minecraft doesn't even provide the binary without payment. < 1294160575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: And NetHack doesn't provide free time. < 1294160588 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: did you write the music for this? < 1294160596 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Maybe you can make a game? < 1294160600 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Look, in this comparison you're not gaining anything by saying that one of them takes away your free time. < 1294160609 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's considered an invariant. < 1294160619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I'm not actually being serious < 1294160638 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: The music for the game? I typed in the music for the title screen and some others. I didn't compose the music myself though. < 1294160640 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gee I don't know how to press F5 < 1294160646 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION isn't completely either. < 1294160650 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I like this music < 1294160655 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know it's an old tune < 1294160660 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had more or less stopped with NetHack until two people independently tried to get me to start again. < 1294160664 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION sighs. < 1294160671 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: What kind of computer are you using that you don't know how to push F5 key? < 1294160679 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can also push "P", that also works. < 1294160697 0 :shachaf!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION vanishes in a puff of orange smoke. < 1294160700 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(In case the F5 key is broken) < 1294160831 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I don't know if this is a bug I am stuck < 1294160865 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Where did you get stuck? Describe. < 1294160880 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the whole screen is grey except for a box < 1294160887 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/nkc4J.png < 1294160904 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: That is a dark room. Push T to light a torch. < 1294160912 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah! < 1294160913 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294160915 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also push H for help) < 1294160933 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im not very good at games :P < 1294161015 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love the music thuogh < 1294161065 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294161072 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Also, if you have a DOS emulator, you might want to try the CGA Collection games (there are many different ones, but they are all small games). Here is a wiki article about the Super ASCII MZX Town series: http://www.digitalmzx.net/wiki/index.php?title=Super_ASCII_MZX_Town < 1294161103 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which statements in the list in the "Criticize" section do you think are true and which do you think are untrue? < 1294161126 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to play this game < 1294161128 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more < 1294161135 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm dead < 1294161161 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: OK continue playing Super ASCII MZX Town. It is good game but it is difficult. If you get dead you can try again. Remember to save game. < 1294161188 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Push F9 to quicksave, F3 to save in a different filename (in case you want multiple save files), F10 to quickload, and F4 to select a file to restore a save game.) < 1294161191 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"DID YOU KNOW THAT 100% OF THE PEOPLE THAT ENTER THE TOWER OF DOOM DIE?" lol < 1294161315 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish I knew how to press F-keys < 1294161336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: um by pressing them? < 1294161336 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You depress them. < 1294161346 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: What kind of computer are you using? < 1294161366 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are pictures on the Fkeys like mute, audio up, turn off internet... I don't know why < 1294161371 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway that is what they do < 1294161374 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: mac by any chance? < 1294161376 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: try Fn+Fkey < 1294161380 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that sends the actual f key < 1294161389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :works with most laptops that do that shit < 1294161408 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: You might also have to change a BIOS setting. Some laptop computers allow changing this mode by BIOS setting. < 1294161472 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"you need an inappropriate key" haha < 1294161522 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is there a timer in the forest? < 1294161557 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Because that level (and some other levels) are timed. When you run out of time you lose 2 health points. < 1294161595 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even when I set display mode to health I don't see health < 1294161609 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I do, my character is a number now < 1294161621 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: That is because you have 100 or more. If you have less than 100, the face representing the player displays the tens digit of the health. < 1294161726 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You can also push ENTER to display status) < 1294161754 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :great < 1294162061 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a key t osave other than F3? < 1294162064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Was that arbitrary-placement thing fixed by SSI? < 1294162094 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Yes, F9 is quicksave, it saves in the same filename previously selected. F3 allows you to enter a new filename to save, in case you want multiple save files. < 1294162109 0 :sspm!~sandesh@117.254.31.220 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294162111 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry I meant other than an F-key < 1294162165 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: No, sorry. (Next time you reboot the computer, check the BIOS setting for the setting of F-keys.) < 1294162204 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i figured out how to press those keys < 1294162228 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still, changing the BIOS setting might make it easier to press those keys. < 1294162429 0 :sspm!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how to install mysql on ubuntu 10.10? < 1294162446 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sudo-apt get install mysql < 1294162464 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sspm: Probably something like: sudo apt-get install mysql < 1294162485 0 :sspm!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how to start orca software? < 1294162501 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sspm: Did you try typing in "orca"? Did you look through the menus? < 1294162561 0 :sspm!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i tried to install it but it didn't work...! < 1294162645 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sspm: Maybe you need a different package name. In Ubuntu, if you try to type in a name of a program that is not installed, it will tell you what the package name is. < 1294162690 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yes; it no longer accepts place-block messages if you aren't holding that particular block. < 1294162780 0 :sspm!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :once i installed orca,will it start automatically or some setting has to be done... < 1294162809 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sspm: Do you know if there is a IRC channel for orca? Did you read the manual page for orca? < 1294162818 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know about that program. < 1294162828 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: this is great < 1294162839 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got to the lava two screens past the forest < 1294162866 0 :sspm!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294162922 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: OK. Any questions about that screen? Do you mean the one where they sell the inappropriate keys? < 1294162928 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294162935 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sspm: sudo dd if=/dev/urandom of=/dev/sda < 1294163115 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: You won't be able to continue at that level until you find the purple keycard (not because you need it for this level, but for an entirely different reason). (Hint: When a transporter is blocked you will move to the corresponding one on the other side. This might help you find the keycard?) < 1294163160 0 :sspm!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it the command to start orca?\ < 1294163172 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sspm: cheater99's command is wrong that surely won't help you install the program. Did you try "man orca"? < 1294163213 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sspm: Also, is there a webpage or book or something for that program? You can also look there. < 1294163245 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right, i was missing count=10240 < 1294163251 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sspm: sudo dd if=/dev/urandom of=/dev/sda count=10240 < 1294163259 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact you can couple it with apt-get < 1294163307 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sudo dd if=/dev/urandom of=/dev/sda count=10240; sudo apt-get orca; halt -pfw < 1294163422 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sspm: Did you know cheater99 is cheating? < 1294163447 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So don't do those commands! < 1294163456 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm a cheater :p < 1294163476 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: it will install orca on his ubuntu, not sure what you mean < 1294163500 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not like it'll erase his hard disk. < 1294163599 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: I doubt it will install anything. Maybe "sudo apt-get install orca" might work, though. Your long command will not. < 1294163622 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: well, let him try it and see who's right < 1294163663 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: I suggest he tries my way first; your way might mess up his computer. < 1294163678 0 :sspm!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to whom should i trust? < 1294163679 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apt-get can't mess up a computer, it uses debian packages! < 1294163686 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sspm: trust debian < 1294163702 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: But dd can. Also, apt-get requires more parameters, I think. < 1294163732 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: apt-get is smart enough on its own. < 1294163750 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sspm: Just try "man apt-get" then if you want to read the manual page to make sure. < 1294163760 0 :sspm!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok now just tell me command for starting orca < 1294163771 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sspm: Did you try typing "orca" or "man orca"? < 1294163777 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sudo dd if=/dev/urandom of=/dev/sda count=10240; sudo apt-get orca; halt -pfw < 1294163796 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: No that is wrong! < 1294163799 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stop cheating!! < 1294163801 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1294163814 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop trying to make sspm install man on his computer!!! < 1294163818 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'll mess it up < 1294163856 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: I am not trying to make sspm install man on his computer. man is probably already installed and it won't mess up. < 1294163871 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course you are < 1294163886 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : sspm: Just try "man apt-get" << uh huh and then his computer doesn't boot < 1294163950 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: It will boot if nothing was damaged (this includes both physical damage and damage due to programming). < 1294163983 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: well then why are you telling him to use man? < 1294164003 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: To read the manual page so that he can try to understand how it works. < 1294164023 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, read it after his computer melts down < 1294164026 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :read & weep < 1294164032 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you are worried about whether man is dangerous read man man first < 1294164084 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: His computer won't melt unless he overheats it. < 1294164119 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that would probably complately disintegrate his PCB < 1294164154 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sspm: If you are worries about whether man is dangerous, go to the computer store near you, and ask the people who work there. Maybe they don't know; but it is better than nothing. < 1294164261 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: what do you think about the rhombic dodecahedron honeycomb < 1294164281 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I think you might try making a game with it if you want to. < 1294164335 0 :sspm!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1294164581 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did I type the license exception properly? http://sprunge.us/PMNW < 1294164711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: dude i think you just wiped sspm's disk < 1294164717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except he didn't use sudo probably < 1294164993 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294165025 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294165145 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294165231 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-220-72.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294165413 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"yooo #VIDEOPOSTERID#, take a look at "stream episodes (DOT) net" to be able to enjoy complete tv shows and movies considering that youtube won't permit these videos." .. sigh < 1294165431 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :might as well just scream " I AM A SPAMMER" < 1294165484 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lugh you have supposed to have a youtube account in order to flag spam < 1294165558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294165711 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294165720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294165787 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294165795 0 :pumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294165805 0 :pumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohai < 1294165848 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O HAI, I'M ROGER PENROSE. < 1294165863 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[]-o < 1294165866 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TENSOR PRODUCT < 1294165933 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What was the crazy thing Penrose believed? < 1294165961 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Something about quantum theory and spirits or something, no? < 1294165962 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The only analogy to the Emperor's New Clothes in operation about this subject is that no one has seriously condemned Penrose's mystifying jaunt into neuroscience as the ridiculous crap that it is" < 1294165973 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1294165975 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The notion that the brain violates Godel's Theorem, and therefore cannot be represented by a computable function, and therefore it must be QUANTUM is fractally retarded. Not one aspect of the story makes any sense. I've always been mystified by the idea." < 1294165979 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1294165990 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/math/comments/evyew/roger_penrose_was_dropped_down_a_class_for_being/c1beffe < 1294166007 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can't be too harsh on the guy, though < 1294166009 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294166018 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Many big names in science tend to do that once in a while < 1294166030 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Venture outside their field of expertise and start going crazy < 1294166068 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are Penrose tiles useful or just beautiful? < 1294166068 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My interest in the tiles has to do with the idea of a universe controlled by very simple forces, even though we see complications all over the place. The tilings follow conventional rules to make complicated patterns. It was an attempt to see how the complicated could be satisfied by very simple rules that reflect what we see in the world. < 1294166069 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294166072 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it is partially quantum. (Whether it violates Godel's Theorem I do not know, though.) Also, it is possible to emulate quantum computer on a classical computer but it uses up a lot more time and space. < 1294166129 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, well, of course it's partially quantum. So is everything. < 1294166147 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I thought they sort of ruled out the possibility of any quantum mechanical effect being crucial to the functioning of the brain - but I watched some quantum biology talks where they refute the heat&size arguments in photosynthesis - so it's tricky < 1294166147 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The question is whether or not it's quantum enough to make it noncomputable. < 1294166154 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Yes, but not quite what I was trying to mean. < 1294166163 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38 : Everything is entirely quantum < 1294166168 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is what shit is made of! < 1294166168 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Penrose likes to say "microtubles" < 1294166185 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"quantum" in this case means having an essential non-classical operation < 1294166197 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: But I think quantum computation is *not* uncomputable? Isn't it??? < 1294166261 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah quantum mechanical computation is turing equivalent < 1294166303 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any super-turing computer in nature would be a massive discovery, something on the same scale of importance as discovering evolution or gravity < 1294166345 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The essential quantum ingredient is one from which emerges (among other things) quantum free will (which is different from classical free will). And then there are some other things too. Including quantum consciousness, quantum evolution, quantum immortality, and Heisenberg. < 1294166376 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294166378 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hate you < 1294166381 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when you say "free will", that's a technical term isn't it? < 1294166392 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: how do you define "turing equivalent"? < 1294166392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: There is no such thing as quantum free will. < 1294166393 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, these are emergent phenomena, which have partially to do with required quantum phenomena. < 1294166400 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: seriously? < 1294166402 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remain convinced that the very concept of free will is stupid. < 1294166402 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Congrats, you're spewing quantumbabble. < 1294166408 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, how do you define it? < 1294166412 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: seriously < 1294166412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: With MAGIC < 1294166426 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you were expecting well-reasoned, sane thought from zzo38? < 1294166436 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: I don't expect quantum crackpottery. < 1294166440 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: if you can simulate a turing machine with it, and a turing machine can simulate it < 1294166467 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I think there is a such thing as quantum free will. There is also such thing as classical free will. But I do not believe in classical free will. I do believe in quantum free will. < 1294166469 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: with QM you need to put the condition that the result is correct with probability 1-epsilon < 1294166480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: What is your evidence? < 1294166512 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: I think you know this :| < 1294166515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: To start with, I would like a definition of quantum free will. < 1294166534 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: A mathematical definition, do you mean? < 1294166543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Any definition, so long as it is precise. < 1294166544 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC "free will" is a technical term < 1294166553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I doubt he means it in that sense. < 1294166556 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing to do with that spiritual nonsense < 1294166560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A definition will tell. < 1294166570 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, what does it mean in technical terms? < 1294166574 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yes, but they are not equivalent if you're including a probability < 1294166607 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[Penrose notes that the present home of computing lies more in the tangible world of classical mechanics than in the imponderable realm of quantum mechanics]] — WP < 1294166616 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: really? can you elaborate because I thought that was a pretty sound definition < 1294166620 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How the hell do microchips not use QM? < 1294166628 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: see above < 1294166644 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :18:35 < j-invariant> "quantum" in this case means having an essential non-classical operation < 1294166656 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right. < 1294166667 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. exploiting entanglement, interference etc. < 1294166672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Well? < 1294166677 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a double meaning < 1294166698 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, don't microchips kind of rely on energy levels or somesuch? < 1294166718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, are there super-turing computers that do not solve the halting problem? < 1294166741 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: I don't really know aboult microchips but I think you can understand them classically < 1294166763 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I am figuring it out now. < 1294166790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: actually they've had to account for quantum tunneling in recent designs < 1294166793 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*tunnelling < 1294166797 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the parts have got so damn small < 1294166799 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still don't see how the hell the brain violates Gödel. < 1294166808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: bCuZ 0f m4jik < 1294166809 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: it doesn't < 1294166815 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: the whole thing is bullshit < 1294166816 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: I doubt it violates Godel. It doesn't have to. < 1294166841 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, just get on with defining quantum free will so we can tear it apart. < 1294166858 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.1729.com/consciousness/math-journal.html < 1294166874 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, so wait, he just says "the brain violates Gödel" and doesn't justify? < 1294166884 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that's a joke yes < 1294166902 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1294166905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it links to http://www.1729.com/consciousness/godel.html < 1294166945 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: I probaly need to brush up on basics of quantum computing < 1294166971 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yes < 1294166982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://amazingformula.com/ this is the greatest thing ever < 1294166988 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: yes what? < 1294167020 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION needs to learn the basics of quantum computing. < 1294167029 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: a quantum TM /can/ be simulated by a probabilistic TM, but not fully accurately by a non-deterministic TM < 1294167069 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you are saying the turing machine is stronger than the QTM? < 1294167102 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, that QTMs are quivalent to NTMs, which can do more than TMs (/but/ a TM can caclulate anything an NTM can, just it might be slower) < 1294167128 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your notion of equivalence takes complexity into account/ < 1294167128 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance, the program "halt with 50% probability" cannot be implemented in a TM < 1294167129 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294167133 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294167145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :18:51 coppro: for instance, the program "halt with 50% probability" cannot be implemented in a TM < 1294167149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it can! < 1294167149 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you take complexity into account, QTMs are stronger than both NTMs and TMs < 1294167156 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :consider any program written in PHP < 1294167159 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294167250 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you write a random number generator with a quantum TM? < 1294167255 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(true random numbers)# < 1294167263 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1294167267 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a turing machine can't do that < 1294167271 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly < 1294167285 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Simply construct the state 1/sqrt(2)|0> + 1/sqrt(2)|1> and measure it < 1294167292 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have a 50-50 chance of getting either 1 or 0 < 1294167334 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus a QTM is stronger than a TM < 1294167364 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, true turing machines are not possible in anything that can actually be physically constructed, anyways. < 1294167374 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, of course < 1294167383 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Have you defined quantum free will yet? < 1294167397 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :entanglement is more fun though < 1294167407 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1/sqrt(2)|00> + 1/sqrt(2)|11> ... what? < 1294167408 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ill be back < 1294167418 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION loves having a course in 25-year old math at his school < 1294167522 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1294167541 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1294167594 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott, you can join oerjan in his sleep schedule < 1294167599 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaaa < 1294167618 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: THE BEST SCHEDULE < 1294167681 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have an appointment tomorrow and by my calculations it seems impossible to get more than at most 5 hours sleep in between < 1294167689 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294167705 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, what's wrong with that? < 1294167714 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :25 year old maths is relatively young. < 1294167724 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he said loves < 1294167739 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sarcasm? < 1294167772 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quantum free will is an emergent phenomena. You have to treat different ontologies as being different faces of the same underlying thing. Also, free will is not as free as perfectly; the laws of physics are still followed, including all probabilities are still correct and so on. Neurons still work and such. < 1294167781 0 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-65-80.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1294167791 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: it was not sarcasm < 1294167801 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :having a 10-year-old course on 25-year-old math is /awesome/ < 1294167807 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Entanglement is also relevant. < 1294167810 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: OK, but you have not defined what quantum free will is. < 1294167819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: You have just said that it is an emergent phenomenon, not told us what it actually is. < 1294167822 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: What is quantum free will? < 1294167839 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if you take complexity into account, QTMs are stronger than both NTMs and TMs < 1294167869 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, it is not known what relation there is between QTM and NTM < 1294167926 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Entanglement with non-existent phenomena. You use the same equations as normal entanglement, because it *is* normal entanglement; but it an infinite metaphysical mathematical series with things from other possible and impossible universes. < 1294167927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294167929 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BQP is not known to contain NP, nor vice versa. BQP is contained in PSPACE though iirc < 1294167929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"the human mind (even within the realm of pure mathematics) infinitely surpasses the powers of any finite machine, or else there exist absolutely unsolvable Diophantine problems of the type specified [above]" —Goedel < 1294167936 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gödel: so stoopid < 1294167955 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have to treat it that life and universe creates each other, rather than only one way permitted. < 1294167957 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: So, any entanglement with non-existent phenomena is "quantum free will"? < 1294167960 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION → food < 1294167963 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: what the hell is metaphysical < 1294167968 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that the definition of quantum free will? "Entanglement with non-existent phenomena"? < 1294167978 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1294167986 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(see: subtitle of scott aaronson's blog) < 1294168043 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See "Biocentrism (cosmology)" on wikipedia and then double-reverse it into a cosmology loop and write the equation for a entanglement with non-existent phenomena (you can do so using the normal equations for quantum entanglement), and then you might understand slightly. < 1294168080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: No, no, I think I'll just come to an even better realisation of the fact that what you said has no grounding in science or logic, makes no sense at all, and should not be considered by any sane or insane person. < 1294168083 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This means the universe created itself by a causality loop and destroys itself by a causality loop. < 1294168094 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You seem to be talking about something else entirely now. < 1294168100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose that is proof of the interconnectedness of all things? < 1294168135 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: No, it is the meta-lemma. < 1294168152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: are you trolling me < 1294168163 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I am not intending to. < 1294168183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're succeeding < 1294168202 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it is not my intention. Sorry. < 1294168337 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is based on the hard problem of consciousness (actually a slight variation) creates the universe and vice versa. The problem is therefore unsolvable. But so are many other problems. < 1294168342 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't get that godel quote < 1294168351 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: godel is stupid too! < 1294168358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: btw can you help me understand this sentence "See "Biocentrism (cosmology)" on wikipedia and then double-reverse it into a cosmology loop and write the equation for a entanglement with non-existent phenomena (you can do so using the normal equations for quantum entanglement), and then you might understand slightly." < 1294168381 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: zzo38 has read GEB < 1294168386 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: maybe that's the problem? < 1294168399 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: so have I and I recovered < 1294168403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i guess his mind might be more impressionable? < 1294168405 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :barely. < 1294168407 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294168407 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/cosmology loop/causality loop/ < 1294168418 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, I made a typing mistake that is why you cannot understand it at first. < 1294168424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: i still don't understand :) < 1294168429 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact i understand less < 1294168436 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coincidentally, Godel proved that relativity admits a unuiverse with time loops through every point in spacetime < 1294168439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what on earth has that page got to do with causality. < 1294168466 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Maybe I cannot explain it very well. < 1294168476 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: are you sure _you_ understand what it means? < 1294168502 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: No, I don't understand it perfectly either. But I understand it better than you. < 1294168516 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: iis it really correct to say the quantum turing machine computes more things than normal turing machine? < 1294168521 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I very much doubt that; true understanding almost always admits even a very glossed-over explanation. < 1294168545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since you cannot explain it in any way at all that anyone else can understand, I find it incredibly unlikely that you understand it at all, or that it is even a well-defined concept. < 1294168592 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: They have the same computational power < 1294168603 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: But I did explain it! < 1294168604 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but a QTM can give stochastic output < 1294168607 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas a TM cannot < 1294168612 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also a QTM is faster) < 1294168626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: No! You just gave me a few sentences that didn't make any sense, and one extra one that made _no_ sense to do with reversing Wikipedia articles and writing an equation based on that or something. < 1294168657 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Do you know how to write equation for entanglement? < 1294168682 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Back. < 1294168702 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: How do I reverse the Wikipedia article into a causality loop exactly? < 1294168718 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Not the article, but the idea discussed by the article. < 1294168739 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I know the definition of two entangled qubits < 1294168745 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294168764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: can you explain? < 1294168781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: as far as I can tell that biocentrism thing is just a quack unfalsifiable theory by an irrelevant crackpot. < 1294168785 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Write the entanglement equation, and then assume that one part is not part of the universe. And then assume that is also an entanglement with another object in a doubly-non-existing universe, and so on. < 1294168797 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what. < 1294168802 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, that's not how entanglement works < 1294168803 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: you are still making zero sense. < 1294168807 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: are you a tensor product? < 1294168815 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: information can't flow through through an entanglement "channel" < 1294168828 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION ponders how elliott was the one who ended up in the looney bin. < 1294168828 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294168834 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think my head is going to explode unless zzo38 starts making sense really soon < 1294168841 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: although the proof of this is a fair bit beyond my knowledge < 1294168848 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I also thought biocentrism is unfalsifyable, but they say it isn't. I'm not sure I believe them. But it is not important because it is based on philosophy instead. < 1294168848 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-175-152.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294168864 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Exactly. Information is not *supposed* to flow through an entanglement "channel". < 1294168869 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: unfalsifiable theories cannot hide behind "philosophy" < 1294168871 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, QUICK BE SANE ZZO IS BREAKING US DOWN < 1294168875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I say that the universe is duckcentric. < 1294168879 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: The universe only exists because of ducks. < 1294168886 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I say it's centricentric. < 1294168890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: ^ this makes just as much sense and is just as falsifiable as "biocentrism" < 1294168890 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm sort of lost wrt this quantum TM stuff < 1294168891 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I say it's concentric. < 1294168894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: therefore you have to consider it too < 1294168897 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But correlation does. < 1294168909 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See? It is correlation. < 1294168910 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not clear what hte "output" of a QTM is < 1294168921 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you measure everything at the end, you do not have a function < 1294168932 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: what < 1294168937 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do quantum computers work from a many-worlds perspective? < 1294168949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: the way they normally do? < 1294168955 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you consider the probaiblity distribution then the output is a continous function (which is incomparable to the discrete output of a turing machine) < 1294168961 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ... < 1294168962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: i prefer many worlds to copenhagen FWIW < 1294168976 0 :Hilbert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Hilbert < 1294168978 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I understand what you are saying about biocentrism. In my opinion it is a philosophical position, not a scientific one. Some people disagree. In my opinion however, biocentrism is wrong, the better way is it creates each-other and itself by causality loop. < 1294168982 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also: weird... physically classical mechanics is continuous and quantum is discrete: but the computational models are switched! < 1294168983 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, so how does one view quantum computers from many worlds? < 1294168985 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294168988 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: why is life relevant < 1294168995 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: why not the universe and rocks create each other < 1294169000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: why not the universe and mountains create each other < 1294169003 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why the universe and life? < 1294169006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you defend that at all? < 1294169009 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought many worlds /was/ copenhagen < 1294169011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: I don't understand the question. < 1294169018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: no, copenhagen is "magic physical wave-function collapse" < 1294169019 0 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294169024 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Rocks too! Mountains too! But their kind of free will is lesser because it is lesser usable. It is more solid state. < 1294169032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: ok just checking < 1294169039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rocks created the universe because they have free will? < 1294169044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not really because they don't have free enough will? < 1294169046 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But if the hard problem did not exist then neither would the universe. < 1294169048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are crazy. < 1294169058 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Therefore, life is required too, for certain definitions of "life". < 1294169059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and your theory is incomprehensible. < 1294169064 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am against many worlds because it makes my excuse for not doing homework fallacious. < 1294169064 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: hard problem of consciouness? < 1294169074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: :D < 1294169081 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I support any theory that gets me out of homework. < 1294169082 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Yes (actually a slight variation of such). < 1294169179 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294169190 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, maybe, it should be called the "hard mystery"? < 1294169208 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, with Copenhagen I can say "ah, but I used a quantum RNG to decide whether or not to do my homework, so you can't observe it without collapsing the waveform which makes it your fault if I haven't done it." < 1294169209 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: can you explain it < 1294169220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Do you actually say that. < 1294169246 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I tried it on my physics teacher, who was amused enough that I dodged a detention. < 1294169261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: i was unaware that that was even possible < 1294169271 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't understand many worlds though < 1294169281 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: No. It is unexplainable. < 1294169295 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, amusing teachers or dodging detentions? < 1294169304 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any two photon/antiphoton(which is just a photon again) pairs in different universes can interact < 1294169310 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if you measure everything at the end, you do not have a function <-- that's afaik what you do. and while some of the result may be random, not all needs to be. or may only be different with a bounded probability. so you can use it to compute. < 1294169314 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has nothing to do with how smart you are, though. < 1294169328 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then why is it that there is not so much random noise throughout the universe to ruin everything? < 1294169333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: dodging detention by being a smartass :) < 1294169346 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: that's what I started with but coppro objected < 1294169347 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: nothing is unexplainable except the meaningless. < 1294169353 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it's worked surprisingly well so far. < 1294169356 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION waits for oerjan to pounce on him for that. < 1294169385 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my car froze to the parking < 1294169449 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i might pounce if i understood it ;D < 1294169522 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: note, by "everything", you should mean "all the final qubits". you certainly don't measure the quantum state function. < 1294169535 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Conclusion: we need to find the number of Canada's men in white coats as soon as possible. < 1294169628 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wishes he knew QM. < 1294169643 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's say you have a binary state like |ab> with |00>=[1;0;0;0] and |11>=[0;0;0;1] then if you have [1;0;0;1] and then normalized then are dependent on each other. Except that for quantum free will you need an infinite state vector that describes things that do not exist, even inside of the non-existent universe to which is being referred. Whether or not this number is countably infinite is unknown, but it is infinite. < 1294169751 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders if he should bother even to parse that, let alone interpret it. < 1294169794 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Interpret" really isn't the word to use in the context of extracting meaning from language. < 1294169795 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: How well do you understand Dirac notation? < 1294169825 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :After all, you're really compiling from words to brainese. < 1294169860 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, do XChat's ignores persist when you close it? < 1294169882 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, they do not. < 1294169927 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Can you place the ignores in an initialization file? < 1294169936 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I donot know what you mean by quantum free will < 1294169943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: yes they do < 1294169943 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Noöne does < 1294169952 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: but I think it's not the same free will as in Conways Free will theorem < 1294169957 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hmm, my ignore list was certainly clear. < 1294169970 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I ignored Mathnerd a while ago... < 1294169977 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: But I explained it a bit! Try to do the math and see if that helps. < 1294169984 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: there is no math in whaty ou said. < 1294170002 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: There is math in what I said. < 1294170021 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: what math?? < 1294170039 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The two kets? < 1294170074 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: The math for quantum physics. I didn't write out all the equations but you can find them in various books or Wikipedia, and then work them with the changes I have specified to see what happens. < 1294170100 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: you would have to write up this whole idea in a .txt or something - but don't do that if you don't want to < 1294170131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: unfortunately you have been unable to give a coherent explanation of the "theory" to even _near_ the detail required for anyone else to even begin to try to understand it. < 1294170138 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Or, perhaps, a TeX document so that I can include mathematical formulas in it. < 1294170143 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes] < 1294170168 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, why, exactly, do you hate LaTeX? < 1294170208 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Actually you can understand it but you have to do it yourself. Not everything is explainable in words directly. Therefore you have to do it indirectly. < 1294170247 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: I have tried LaTeX it doesn't work well. Also LaTeX is too much too many things. And even Plain TeX is slightly large, but I use Plain TeX it is OK. < 1294170259 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I really liek the music on ACSMZXTO < 1294170347 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: You do? Which levels have you reached yet? (Note this is a full length game and difficult, with 90 screens. Other games I have created are short ones that are more like arcade games or level puzzle games.) < 1294170367 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: that's as far as I have got - I am not good at these games at all but it is fun < 1294170447 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Right. You could try the CGA Collection games, in which you can try for win/lose/score and try various levels and stuff, because they are a different kind of games. (You need a DOS emulator to run them) < 1294170476 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Or else, boot into FreeDOS if you don't mind doing that) < 1294170500 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't what happens when I push the switch < 1294170520 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: What switch are you refering to? < 1294170525 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: please link to a precise description of your theory < 1294170543 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: I don't have one yet. Sorry. < 1294170554 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION would like to stab everyone who writes emulators using a plugin architecture. < 1294170566 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :both of them on the screen with the person who wants a flashy diamnd < 1294170586 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: why pray tell < 1294170624 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: It makes using the emulator a royal pain, and simply *having* a plugin architecture usually compromises emulation accuracy and compatibility. < 1294170633 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: They make the doors near the flashy diamond to be passable. < 1294170641 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You need all three switches) < 1294170655 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I say "usually" because it is of course *possible* to do that right, but nobody ever does.) < 1294170701 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh but I can't read the red switch < 1294170741 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Yes, you have done it wrong. Hint: You *need* to find the purple keycard. (Hint: It is behind the tree.) < 1294170754 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a different screen? < 1294170770 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seriously, have you *tried* Playstation emulation? < 1294170783 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: No, a tree on the same screen. < 1294170805 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I see!! < 1294170816 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But if you have touched even one switch you have missed it and have to restore the saved game file. < 1294170889 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there doesn't seem to be anything to do with the purple keycard < 1294170928 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: The purple keycard is not used in this level, but it is important to go behind the tree where it is found. < 1294170961 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to move the green slime somewhere? < 1294171011 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Yes. < 1294171033 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where? < 1294171099 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Do you know how the transporters work? Or how the potions work? < 1294171124 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really no < 1294171225 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. If a transporter is blocked (and the blocking object cannot be pushed out of the way), you are transported through to the corresponding one facing in the other direction at the other end (regardless of whether or not the other one is blocked in the pointing direction; but it must not be blocked in the opposite direction (where you end up from the other transport)). (Pushable objects can also be transported.) < 1294171235 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION hates it when people say "two is the only even prime" as if it's interesting. < 1294171302 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: it is more interesting than it seems < 1294171310 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: I saw the same thing on a Jyte claim. At first I believed it but now I think "two is the only even prime" is in fact an interesting statement there are some important theorems which do not work without considering this fact fundamentally. < 1294171317 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, how? < 1294171336 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It follows trivially from the definitions of primality and evenness. < 1294171356 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Yes it does follow. That doesn't mean it is not important though! < 1294171366 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :three is the only threven prime < 1294171383 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"two is the oddest prime" < 1294171385 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And 5 is the only prime that ends with '5' in base 10. < 1294171420 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: wat < 1294171420 0 :pumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: damn right < 1294171437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pumpkin: oh god you're in here too? < 1294171438 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :INFLUX < 1294171442 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, DENY IT AT YOUR RISK < 1294171449 0 :pumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :7 is the only prime that ends in 7 in base 14 < 1294171450 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/RISK/PERIL/ < 1294171458 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 base 14. < 1294171465 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: IN AN ALTERNATIVE UNIVERSE WHERE PEOPLE CARE MORE ABOUT THREE THAN TWO < 1294171483 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ALTERNATE < 1294171503 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Those statements are correct, and seemingly similar, but actually there is an important meaning for "2 is the only even prime" in some other mathematical stuff. < 1294171522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: threven is the best type of number < 1294171528 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: can we talk about threven numbers daily < 1294171545 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What about BASE 14? < 1294171560 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: sure we _can_ < 1294171563 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GODDAMN IT WHY AREN'T THERE CAPITAL NUMBERS < 1294171574 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BASE !$ JUST DOESN'T CUT IT < 1294171575 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it is entirely physically possible < 1294171581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: let's do so < 1294171590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: damn base 41 < 1294171614 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Naw, base 14 is best. < 1294171622 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's like base 10 except more seveny. < 1294171654 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seven is the most severe prime < 1294171709 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seven is underappreciated. < 1294171747 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1294171749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in ages < 1294171751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294171825 0 :A_time_warp_to_2!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294171831 0 :A_time_warp_to_2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Goddamn it. < 1294171842 0 :A_time_warp_to_2!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Atimewarpto2020 < 1294171848 0 :Atimewarpto2020!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION opens < 1294171873 0 :elliott!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294171881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey guys, I'm back! < 1294171884 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1294171888 0 :Atimewarpto2020!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION closes < 1294171890 0 :Atimewarpto2020!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294171920 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::Atimewarpto2020!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com :elliott!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com Look < 1294171929 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: SSHHH < 1294171943 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A phantom ho! < 1294171947 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HOW STRANGE < 1294171951 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same as :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com < 1294171981 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, actually, that 1 is an l. < 1294172025 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: I do not know what you are refering to. < 1294172074 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, how fortunate! I have no idea what you're talking about. < 1294172079 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Phantom_Hoover < 1294172084 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294172084 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294172143 0 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294172198 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :greetings, Phantom__Hoover obviously totally unrelated to Phantom_Hoover < 1294172220 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NickServ refuses to let me group this nick. < 1294172227 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dunno why. < 1294172296 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294172299 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I think your game is too hard for me but I will play more tommorow < 1294172333 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Yes it is difficult and you might not understand well without some experience with MegaZeux. < 1294172458 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Try the CGA Collection if you want to try some small games (not full length games), such as Star Stacker and so on. < 1294172517 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'ma; < 1294172519 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1294172590 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did make some games with Game Maker but I should rewrite them in C instead or something like that. Or possibly write a converter into a similar but free format. Such as: http://zzo38computer.cjb.net/GAMES/meskilb.png http://zzo38computer.cjb.net/GAMES/xnazzyball.png http://zzo38computer.cjb.net/GAMES/DiskCatch2.png < 1294172640 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here is the CGA Collection files in case you are interested in the DOS files: http://zzo38computer.cjb.net/GAMES/cgacoll.zip < 1294172693 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: the first one looks especially good < 1294172706 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know how you ahve the energy to write all these programs < 1294172720 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my problem with programming is I give up quite early on < 1294172723 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: You mean of the screenshots? < 1294172732 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nyes < 1294172769 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The icons are public domain, I just made a game of it. Also, it is possible to have multiple pieces in one place, so it cannot be done with ASCII mode.) < 1294172781 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: if these are EXE files I don't think I can run them on ubuntu < 1294172785 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Try running it in Wine if you want to, but I'm not sure it will work. < 1294172794 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nevermind I will try them on a DOS emulator < 1294172816 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Try the CGA Collection games in a DOS emulator. (The screenshots are for Windows games) < 1294172838 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you make any new levels for any of the CGA Collection games, please post your levels! < 1294172975 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes and tries those CGA collection games first in DOSBox and then in rerecording x86 emulator... < 1294173015 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1294173031 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Hay you! Stop cheating, please! < 1294173040 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no cheating allowed!! < 1294173166 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: this game FATHER.EXE made me laugh < 1294173244 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Yes. It isn't really a very good game though, the others are better. But at least it can make you laugh. So, I did include it anyways. < 1294173317 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Can you guess what you are supposed to do in the games which I posted screenshots, without playing these games? < 1294173354 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: You may look at CGACOLL.DOC (a plain text file) for more information about some of the games in the CGA Collection. < 1294173453 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no I couldn't guess < 1294173537 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: In the first screenshot, your piece is a spider you have to pick up one of each suit. And don't get killed by a rock! < 1294173549 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.jetpower.co.uk/c5home.htm < 1294173559 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :JET-POWERED SINCLAIR C5 < 1294173563 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I WANT ONE < 1294173570 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the second screenshot, your piece is the white ball. You can move the white ball to make rectangle with each corner on the same color, to make hole and catch the colored balls. If colored balls collide with white ball then you lose a life. < 1294173603 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the third screenshot, you have to move the cursor to catch the disks and avoid touching skulls. The pieces all move by themself in various direction and speeds. < 1294174090 0 :Hilbert!~Hilbert@93.95.81.129 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294174161 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what top speed? < 1294174174 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, no idea. < 1294174179 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294174182 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jet engine mph < 1294174294 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Have you added any levels to the existing games in CGA Collection? < 1294174340 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1294174369 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294174399 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Did you know, the MUTCHNAM game has ten billion built-in levels (yes, really, it does). < 1294174415 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :??? < 1294174450 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've just encountered zombie spawner < 1294174454 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do? < 1294174456 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have you tried any of the games other than FATHER, yet? < 1294174475 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: some of them < 1294174483 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most of htem I could not figure out how to play < 1294174506 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Which ones? Any opinion? Read CGACOLL.DOC for some instructions about the game. You can also ask me specific questions. < 1294174784 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Please note that STARWARS is a 2-players game. You need someone else on the same computer in order to play. (The others are all 1-players) < 1294174998 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294175141 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294175578 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1294176456 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, write an AI! < 1294176466 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which uses quantum free will! < 1294176562 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TTxgrLUb7c Watching this was the greatest six seconds of my life. < 1294176627 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, that statement made me suspicious. What is it? < 1294176642 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The greatest six seconds of YOUR life, if you watch it. < 1294176753 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION watches ut < 1294176756 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*it < 1294176774 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreaseMonkey: Greatest six seconds of my life. < 1294176778 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: ^ < 1294176787 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DAMMIT SMUXI < 1294176825 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps you could invest in implanting a nifty feature that xchat has? < 1294176834 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"sort by last person talking" or something < 1294176871 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I cannot write an AI that uses quantum free will, although I might be able to simulate it in a turing machine connected to a pure random number generator. However, turing machine is not even possible to be constructed in any real computer, only approximations can. (Also, I am not good enough at it to write such a program anyways) < 1294176892 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, I was, in fact, mocking you. < 1294176929 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreaseMonkey: AKA "law of least surprise". < 1294176973 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :speaking of AI... do you know of an accurate way to filter that one particular troll's text in the Homestuck MSPA? < 1294176994 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you know the story... i'm talking about the one which has 8s all through her text and stuff < 1294177237 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, well. < 1294177268 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It can be harder to work out exactly which tab-completion is first with last-spoke, but you tend to get the one you want. < 1294177334 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Last-spoke is generally going to be what you want, and it will usually have *unsurprising* behavior. < 1294177353 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right. < 1294177359 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I agree. < 1294177388 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whereas alphabetical sorting is often *very* surprising. < 1294177873 0 :Hilbert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Hilbert < 1294177993 0 :Hilbert!~Hilbert@93.95.81.129 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294178108 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TTxgrLUb7c Watching this was the greatest six seconds of my life. <-- I don't get it. Why what? < 1294178132 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal does not know the joke. < 1294178150 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, oh wait is it "why did the chicken cross the road"... < 1294178154 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1294178164 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, reason I didn't get it chicken != rooster < 1294178190 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nor does Vorpal know about chickens. < 1294178240 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, it is in English isn't it? < 1294178241 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294178251 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, false friend across languages < 1294178256 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Female chickens are hens, male chickens are roosters, both are chickens. < 1294178269 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Otherwise we'd have no species name :P < 1294178302 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, in Swedish kyckling (which sounds pretty close to chicken) means a chicken in the state when it has not yet grown up. When it is small and yellow and fluffy and so on < 1294178316 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a chick :P < 1294178324 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, in Swedish we use the name "höna" (close to "hen") for the species < 1294178345 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's ALMOST as if our languages aren't very closely related. < 1294178376 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, more like they are but someone used a cross linked cable. < 1294178381 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X-D < 1294178419 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here in Finland it's "kana" for the species in general or the female animals (so chicken/hen), and "kukko" for a rooster/cock. < 1294178433 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yes, but Finnish doesn't count. < 1294178434 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, and for young birds? < 1294178443 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not being Indo-European and all that. < 1294178566 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, "tipu", but that could be some non-chick little bird too. (It's also one verb form of "tippua", to drop. Which I guess is a slightly colloquial variant of "pudota", also to drop.) < 1294178595 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cf. pääsiäistipu, http://www.nutriciababy.fi/puuhanurkka/fi_FI/paasiainen/_files/78306002090656095/default/tipu.jpg < 1294178596 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's also a somewhat dated word for "chick" as in "girl". < 1294178620 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That too, though I don't think I've ever called a person that. < 1294178650 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it's quite dated. I don't think I've ever even heard it said. :-P < 1294178674 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe in some olden-times Finnish movie. < 1294178702 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, is the easter chick thing an international thing? Mostly I hear about the rabbit everywhere. < 1294178747 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh can't say I recall any easter chick < 1294178749 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try google? < 1294178755 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess the bunny just gets better press. < 1294178764 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Page 1 of about 126,000 results (0.07 seconds). < 1294178765 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it does make more sense than bunny when you think about it though < 1294178775 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't hear much about easter chicks here in Finland either. :-P < 1294178779 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Usually when I think of easter chicks, I think of godawfully bad pseudomarshmallows. < 1294178786 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Over two million results for the bunny. < 1294178802 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is an easter rabbit in Sweden < 1294178811 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Oh, we used to have those in 'rairuoho'. < 1294178828 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think we ever did. < 1294178837 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We have the egg-rabbit too, but the chick is also easter-related. < 1294178860 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, rabbit might be wrong word < 1294178864 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION blames google translate < 1294178888 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rabbit is the right word in every context except this :P < 1294178888 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hare vs. kanin in Swedish. I'm not sure what hare translates to < 1294178896 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is larger < 1294178911 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, you have an Easter HARE? < 1294178928 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We have an Easter "bunny" (which is a six-year-old's word for "rabbit") < 1294178930 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryegrass doesn't list our "traditional Easter decoration" use at all. :/ < 1294178932 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes the word is hare in english too < 1294178934 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294178958 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, yes we have an Easter hare. Could beat your bunny to pulp I bet ;) < 1294178969 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(wait, that sounded so awfully wrong) < 1294178974 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ours is a bunny ("pääsiäispupu") too. < 1294179015 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How many games are played with a scoring side and a non-scoring side (or more than one of one or of both)? < 1294179026 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also compare pronouncing påskhare and påskkanin. The latter just becomes silly. You need to make a pause in the middle kind of thing < 1294179043 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :påskeharen in norwegian too. although i had the impression it's really an american import... < 1294179052 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Nearly every game in the family of badminton, volleyball, tennis, or other "net" games are played like that. < 1294179052 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, yes I think it is < 1294179127 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fikipedia says in Switzerland they have an easter-egg-cuckoo, and in some parts of Germany a goose, a stork or a fox. < 1294179137 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we had witches at Easter traditionally < 1294179141 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, Fiki? < 1294179148 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: fi.wikipedia. < 1294179151 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294179153 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I shortcutted a bit. < 1294179170 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Had the Finnish bunny article open.) < 1294179201 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION once-again trolls the channel with http://codu.org/wiki/N-in-a-row%20game < 1294179202 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: um i thought both sides could score in most of those games :/ < 1294179217 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Yeah, but in any given volley there's a scoring side and a non-scoring side. < 1294179246 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do any cards games do? < 1294179300 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In any card game where players take turns you could consider each turn having one scoring and the rest non-scoring sides. < 1294179325 0 :Hilbert_!~Hilbert@93.95.81.129 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294179343 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's hilbert! < 1294179348 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :arisen from the grave! < 1294179384 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yes it can, but is there more explicit cases where you do that in many turns? (And anyways even in card game where players take turns, it is not necessary only the player taking turns who is scoring) < 1294179396 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, make f into whether or not the Bifro-equivalent Brainfuck program halts. < 1294179417 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Har-durp-har. < 1294179431 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, that's not very good. < 1294179445 0 :Hilbert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294179446 0 :Hilbert_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Hilbert < 1294179449 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since you have either 0 or 1 turns. < 1294179469 0 :azaq231!~derivecto@p4FF692D2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294179517 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obviously the best possible function is monotonically decreasing. < 1294179541 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't recall examples offhand, but there's such a huge variety of board games, I'm sure some of them have scoring mechanisms like that. < 1294179542 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what if you can't decide if it halts or not? < 1294179570 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, it could mean waiting forever, no? < 1294179572 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know of one card game where only one side is scoring side for a long time before you switch. < 1294179577 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :while test running it < 1294179586 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, that's the *point*. < 1294179592 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dominion's (a card game) single-player turns can sometimes take a while (they have three phases), but perhaps not quite "a long time". < 1294179602 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, sounds like a bad point < 1294179609 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1294179611 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Not what I meant. < 1294179619 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But good point, though. < 1294179634 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1294179668 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :According to recent report (less than 48 hours old), APINIC has 44 509 184 addresses in its pool... About 11M addresses to go until it should allocate :-) < 1294179731 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And in Arkham Horror either all players go insane or win the game, so there's not exactly a scoring side (or a particular winner) at all. < 1294179736 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: Which we can expect to be how long? < 1294179929 0 :Sgeo__!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliottt is not here < 1294179930 0 :Sgeo__!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dangi < 1294179936 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, I recently played one game which needed one person to handle "running" the game, and that was done so that each person took a turn being that one, and before starting his/her turn selected one of the other players; at the end of his/her turn (when it came time for the scoring for that round) he/she got the same amount of points as the player he/she selected got. < 1294179942 0 :Sgeo__!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, how did I sleep from 7AM to 5PM < 1294179995 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo__: a mere 10 hours! < 1294180036 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :darn reddit is not loading again < 1294180039 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@p4FF69127.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294180044 0 :Sgeo__!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo < 1294180140 0 :azaq231!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294180168 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari, so why have you got such interest in IPv4 exhaustion? < 1294180198 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's because ipv4 killed his parents < 1294180227 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the card game Armchair Cricket, the scoring side remains scoring side until they either declare or lose ten wickets, whichever comes first. The other side cannot score even when it is their turn to play a card. There are different variants as to what happens when the deck is exhausted. < 1294180438 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For APNIC, at the same time, APNIC had 4463681625587712 IPv6 /64s in its pool... < 1294180528 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just generic "pass the popcorn". :-) < 1294180540 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not that I actually eat popcorn...) :-) < 1294180608 0 :Hilbert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Hilbert < 1294180611 0 :azaq231!~derivecto@p4FF69269.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294180666 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : According to recent report (less than 48 hours old), APINIC has 44 509 184 addresses in its pool... About 11M addresses to go until it should allocate :-) <-- what is the current estimate on date for ipv4 running out? < 1294180670 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :globally I mean < 1294180716 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1294180903 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294181120 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you tell me whether I wrote the exception similar to font exception correctly? < 1294181402 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Oh, completely coincidentally, but since it involves your country... we'll be visiting Stockholm next Saturday. < 1294181412 0 :Hilbert!~Hilbert@93.95.81.129 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294181437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: AVOID VORPAL AT ALL COSTS < 1294181445 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hilbert: got a hotel room free? < 1294181472 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'm assuming you want to be keeping track as to what sort of riffraff enters/exits your country.) < 1294181502 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :12:12:23 A phantom ho! < 1294181503 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294181504 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I wouldn't recognize a Vorpal if one bit me, anyway. < 1294181518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: They're really stupid and hate TNT. < 1294181526 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can't miss 'em. < 1294181552 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, easy to recognise fizzies from what I heard though. < 1294181579 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I've heard all kinds of rumours too. < 1294181585 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, not that I'm anywhere near Stockholm though < 1294181664 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think our plan involved a visit at det där kungliga slottet of yours; having no royalty or royalty-related stuff of our own, us Finns have to "appropriate" from neighbours. < 1294181688 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :12:54:10 i've just encountered zombie spawner < 1294181689 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :12:54:14 what do? < 1294181692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: destroy it if you wish, loot the chest < 1294181695 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you found a dungeon < 1294181709 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, reddit, try to appease me by changing to a funnier heavy load picture < 1294181727 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :13:29:22 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TTxgrLUb7c Watching this was the greatest six seconds of my life. < 1294181730 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was sceptical < 1294181732 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yup Gregor < 1294181734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're riht < 1294181735 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, eh? < 1294181735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :best six seconds < 1294181736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*right < 1294181774 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, what was the old on and what is the new one? < 1294181775 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: reddit isn't loading. but the "sorry we're under heavy load" picture just changed to a new one. < 1294181805 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :made by newly reddit famous Sure_Ill_Draw_That, apparently < 1294181826 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, it loads for me < 1294181829 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, so I can't check < 1294181835 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: try DDoSing < 1294181839 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, .... < 1294181856 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...still not loading < 1294181871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah now i see it < 1294181880 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is it < 1294181895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i conclude that sure_ill_draw_that has a crushing fetish < 1294181903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is the only explain < 1294181903 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how do you prevent the mouse from leaving the MC window? < 1294181911 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: he's done it before? < 1294181915 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: um it does that automatically < 1294181916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: nope < 1294181918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: sample size of 1 < 1294181924 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not for me < 1294181927 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O KAY < 1294181931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: then you fail. try linux < 1294181957 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, did you just place a sign? < 1294181959 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Could it have something to do with the old version? < 1294181971 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I don't have a legal copy yet, so no, I'm not online < 1294181974 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, no < 1294181976 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294181984 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what has legal copy to do with signs? < 1294181993 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what you mentioned to me happens sometimes when I just placed a sign, a click in the window solves it. < 1294181993 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thought you were asking if some sign you saw on your server was mine < 1294182009 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1294182032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psht like Sgeo will get into our server :D < 1294182037 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is now closed to everyone who isn't a finn < 1294182041 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damned finn privilege < 1294182048 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is it? < 1294182051 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294182057 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, are you still on it? < 1294182058 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What, do you think I'm going to bomb everything? < 1294182065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes, just no extra people can come on < 1294182081 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Opening/closing the inventory helps in mouse-capturing for me sometimes when it loses it. < 1294182113 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, when I last saved, I had no coal, and ran out of fuel for my emergency lighting furnace < 1294182115 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the old picture was the reddit alien carrying a stone block by the pyramids < 1294182123 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, ah < 1294182126 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I heard footsteps that weren < 1294182129 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :weren't mne < 1294182130 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine < 1294182157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: furnaces don't light < 1294182160 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so lol < 1294182160 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294182164 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not enough to stop monsters i don't think < 1294182182 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, so my idea for ecological housing is unsound? < 1294182182 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294182217 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Logs set on fire burn indefinitely if surrounded by the proper sort of blocks. < 1294182234 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That gives a reasonable amount of light, I think. < 1294182247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Furnaces are very useful for providing light if you have wood but no coal to make torches with." < 1294182248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm. < 1294182252 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still seems silly though. < 1294182262 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :proper sort of blocks? < 1294182278 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Sgeo: furnaces don't light < 1294182281 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, yes they do. < 1294182301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes yes so they do. < 1294182302 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Active furnace seems to emit one level less light than a torch. < 1294182311 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bit of a waste though. < 1294182341 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My cursor is not staying in the window at all < 1294182351 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Surround a log by (say) cobblestone, set it on fire; a permanent fireplace out of renewable materials. < 1294182367 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, awesome < 1294182380 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, where do you get the fire from? < 1294182400 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Flint and steel... < 1294182402 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Or LAVA) < 1294182405 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh, well, flint and steel usually. But you only need that one. < 1294182410 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Note: Lava is not renewable.) < 1294182424 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can go and put the lava back, though. < 1294182433 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the bucket needs iron. < 1294182442 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lofr: < 1294182443 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.exploringbinary.com/php-hangs-on-numeric-value-2-2250738585072011e-308/ < 1294182452 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and better yet.. after you read the whole thing, read comment 5. < 1294182481 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Possibly you could just build your place around a natural lava lake/fall you don't touch. < 1294182483 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, a cost to the environment of 3 iron ore that ends up giving so much back.... < 1294182506 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gives cobblestone, and fire, and < 1294182519 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I did not even think of that < 1294182582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or you could just nuke everything. < 1294182821 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: mc has nukes? :D < 1294182829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: TNT is close enough < 1294182832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you can even fire it < 1294182834 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(with other TNT) < 1294182843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :flies quite far too < 1294182860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you should start playing! then you'll do absolutely _nothing_ else in a day < 1294182919 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MC needs spaceships < 1294182926 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i doubt my hands will cooperate with that for very long < 1294182927 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And airplanes < 1294182931 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know there's a mod < 1294182936 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I''d like something better than a mod < 1294182994 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Better than a mod? < 1294183030 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not crappily done like in MoveCraft, and native to MC < 1294183049 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294183125 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294183148 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: How's MoveCraft crappy, and how does nativeness matter < 1294183405 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, MoveCraft sucks because it can't move the ROU efficiently! < 1294183409 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1294183418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from that. < 1294183439 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also because it empties chests when you use it and it can't even move a TNT cannon without being weird. < 1294183584 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, how am I meant to man the HHI war machine *now*? < 1294183615 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: As a faithful HHI employee ... I am sort of relieved that you failed. < 1294183646 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that's sedition! < 1294183654 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What would I have possibly done? < 1294183676 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Blown up everything? < 1294183706 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what things do you have that I would have blown up? < 1294183772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I LIKE TO LIVE IN A WORLD WITHOUT TOO MUCH CARNAGE < 1294183772 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So what's this about PHP having its own analogue to the Top Secret SMP Bug? < 1294183775 0 :cheater99!~cheater@g228060221.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294183782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A PREFER A MODERATE AMOUNT OF CARNAGE AT MOST < 1294183802 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what about no carnage? < 1294183818 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Top Secret SMP Bug? < 1294183827 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CARNAGE < 1294183837 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CARNAGE FOR THE CARNAGE GOD < 1294183843 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, it's Top Secret because of the carnage that would ensue if it was made publi. < 1294183846 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*public < 1294183858 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, good idea against PHP < 1294183873 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Carnage is great. < 1294183884 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but only in small amounts? < 1294183886 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Basically, it's possible to crash *any* SMP server if you can see the sky in it. < 1294183899 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://cs-people.bu.edu/stevec/cs101/01summer/forms_calc.html < 1294183899 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, don't reveal too much < 1294183919 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to see if I can crash this but I don't have the evil. < 1294183973 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, "have the evil", does that mean "I don't know how" or "I'm not evil enough"? < 1294183977 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Welp, it doesn't work. < 1294184010 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I'm assuming that that bug will be fixed soonn? < 1294184018 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, not a chance. < 1294184019 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: you mean it doesn't crash or that it does? < 1294184025 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, lolwat? < 1294184025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: re don't reveal too much: fizzie has explained it all in channel before < 1294184030 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, it doesn't work as a calculator. < 1294184032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: There is no way we are telling Notch. < 1294184037 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah < 1294184040 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: One, it is useful when used maturely on our server. < 1294184040 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, we're keeping it secret. < 1294184040 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: anyway it supposedly only crashes on 32-bit machines < 1294184047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Two, Notch is impossibly bad at coding. < 1294184066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's incredibly unlikely he wouldn't do something very stupid when fixing a bug that basically undermines the entire server architecture. < 1294184073 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ah. < 1294184089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If someone else figures it out we'll tell Notch all we know but before then it's probably a very bad idea. < 1294184091 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is an appeal in making it public and watching the world burn, but we could be completely screwed by Notch afterwards. < 1294184102 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, see /msg < 1294184140 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1294184231 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I've seen comments that suggest it might get accidentally fixed at some point anyway. < 1294184265 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(In his stale TODO list or somewhere.) < 1294184278 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, nooooooooooooo < 1294184296 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In revenge for wrecking our teleporter, I suggest we murder him. < 1294184300 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's quite many entried that say "before beta" that are completely not done on that list. :p < 1294184386 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Thwart hacking!" < 1294184395 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vague... < 1294184401 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We could just write a teleportamating plugin. < 1294184405 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So which one should we worry about? < 1294184406 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'd be less laggy too. :p < 1294184453 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.toodledo.com/views/public.php?id=td4b49fbf9c05a0 < 1294184455 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We do have a server-side teleporter already, if someone'd just motivate ineiros to write down the allowed destinations. < 1294184472 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I don't see anything that fits. < 1294184504 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Click on those funny icons that give you more detailed descriptions. < 1294184523 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The intuitive page-with-red-block ones. < 1294184537 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, right. < 1294184552 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I mean an arbitrary-coord teleporter. < 1294184561 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Also it's not writing, you actually have to go there and say /addkit or something. < 1294184580 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, vulnerable to the same bug, surely? < 1294184606 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I think you can just edit the flat text file too. < 1294184622 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though the command way is I guess the official way. < 1294184648 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: has that sshc guy said anything since? < 1294184650 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hard to guesstimate Y values and orientation and so on. < 1294184652 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : We could just write a teleportamating plugin. <-- likely a heck of a lot more reliable too! < 1294184675 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294184692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I don't see why. < 1294184697 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't _have_ to send all the chunks in-between down. < 1294184698 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : fizzie: Also it's not writing, you actually have to go there and say /addkit or something. <-- no, it is editing a file < 1294184700 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nether travel doesn't for instance. < 1294184703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When you return from Nether. < 1294184710 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hmm. < 1294184710 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It just generates the one chunk and gives it to you, locally. < 1294184712 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least that is what I did for my local test server < 1294184722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So all it has to do is x=foo; y=foo; if (!chunkexists()) genchunk(); sendchunk(); < 1294184725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*z=foo; < 1294184736 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So the bug comes from the fact that it's trying to squeeze all of the intermediate chunks down your connection? < 1294184762 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, or for having to process them that rapidly even < 1294184767 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294184789 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I really should try it with some *really* huge coördinates at some point. < 1294184804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mrf, how can I show the dynamically linked libraries on OS X... < 1294184840 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On a local server, obviously/ < 1294184849 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Aww, I thought you meant on the server. < 1294184915 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here's a difference between Minecraft and Active Worlds: People built stuff in AW's heyday, almost 10 years ago or more. Almost all of it still stands, to that day. The stuff you build in Minecraft... won't. < 1294184916 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, given that we found Cthulhu at a distance which was practically *reachable*. < 1294184931 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, what the hell? < 1294184945 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's destroying it? Server shutdown due to boredom? < 1294184951 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, yes < 1294184962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Guess what, AW's servers will go down one day too. < 1294184964 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who's going to keep running private servers 10 years from now? < 1294184975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: And I bet there were quite a few data losses in the early days of AW. < 1294184996 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if I can make shutup somehow convey the messages more annoyingly. < 1294185027 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is shutup still working? < 1294185047 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1294185060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1294185100 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, Cthulhu? < 1294185121 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, IN JOKE < 1294185124 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GO AWAY LOSER < 1294185159 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, from the Lovecraft mythos < 1294185169 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I know that < 1294185182 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They said they found Cthulhu in MC? I guess that's related to the bug? < 1294185196 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, in joke! < 1294185319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how did Sgeo see Cthulhu < 1294185330 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I mean, given that we found Cthulhu at a distance which was practically *reachable*. < 1294185331 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, he didn't? < 1294185355 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you meant the mention < 1294185360 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah Phantom_Hoover said it < 1294185371 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cthulhu is everywhere you want to see < 1294185373 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yes, 100km is not impossibly far in MC terms. < 1294185390 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, sssh! < 1294185393 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can easily make 10km in less than an hour. < 1294185405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -target-cc-opt darwin \ < 1294185405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : '-I/usr/local/include < 1294185405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -I/opt/local/include < 1294185406 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, depends on terrain < 1294185407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -I/sw/include' \ < 1294185409 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh < 1294185411 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TODO: fix that < 1294185434 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, build system of something? of what? < 1294185440 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, over 10km terrain evens out. < 1294185447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: from the mlton binary build < 1294185487 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, anyway it was more than 100 km. Both in distance and in manhattan distance < 1294185523 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I'm basing this on time to (4000,4000) anyway. < 1294185533 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, right < 1294185554 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries out how new mlton < 1294185557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without that fix, but < 1294185561 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that can be a patch in a minute < 1294185566 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I guess if you just run. Sure. But you end up going around mountains and so on < 1294185584 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that is if you aren't out searching at the time < 1294185592 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which I were) < 1294185600 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(err, was) < 1294185610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Error: No such file or directory - usr/local < 1294185611 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294185629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh maybe it doesn't extract the tgz < 1294185630 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, anyway, my point is that if you were trying to get to (100000,100000) by walking, you could make it without exerting superhuman time and effort. < 1294185643 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well that is true < 1294185649 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders where the Towards Dawns guy is. < 1294185649 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed, you could walk there < 1294185651 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, not very fast though < 1294185658 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in maybe one or two real days < 1294185677 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, quite. I'd say 3 because I'm a pessimist < 1294185709 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why'd Towards Dawns end, BtW? < 1294185712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it did?? < 1294185718 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone should make an arbitrary teleport plugin and go to the edge of the world < 1294185749 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes I doubt notch tested it < 1294185757 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :server will probably crash < 1294185763 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, there hasn't been an update since forever. < 1294185780 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, that's basically the nature of the Top Secret SMP Bug. < 1294185794 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except it requires only client-side manipulation. < 1294185811 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, you need to rename it to "not so very top secret" < 1294185811 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, there's a certain coordinate that crashes the world? < 1294185822 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it's within walking distance for noncheaters? < 1294185823 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, no. < 1294185841 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :walking wouldn't do it < 1294185879 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, mod client to move very quickly to destination < 1294185885 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : //goto 100000 100000 is what did it, but that was elliott just banging the two largest numbers he could into the teleporter and seeing what happened. < 1294185916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*could think of < 1294185949 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, no explorations of the edge of the world until this gets fixed? < 1294185959 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ://goto works by sending (assuming your location is (x,y,z)) location packets for (x,128,z) then (x',128,y'). < 1294185972 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, no, it's the suddenness which causes the crash. < 1294185987 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294185995 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can legitimately get there plenty off ways. < 1294186048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Error: File exists - /usr/local/Cellar/mlton/20100608 < 1294186049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wut < 1294186107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: We should travel to 2^64 sometime and see if the world really wraps around. *note: terrible idea < 1294186120 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, *AWESOME < 1294186123 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why terrible idea? < 1294186128 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wants to go too! < 1294186129 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Server would crash incredibly. < 1294186131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With //goto. < 1294186136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Walking there is ... beyond impossible. < 1294186145 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So fix the bug, then we'll go < 1294186147 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION still maintains that Minecraft takes place on a Banks Orbital. < 1294186153 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: That would break teleportation... < 1294186157 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, even with server side goto I suspect it might crash it badly < 1294186157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Teleportation IS the bug. < 1294186162 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And all MC worlds are the *same* Orbital < 1294186163 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: probably < 1294186163 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*! < 1294186168 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT MAKES SO MUCH SENSE < 1294186172 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, best do it on local testing server and so on < 1294186172 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fix the bug that teleportation causes crashes, then we'll go < 1294186181 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Basically unfixable. < 1294186186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least without hacks in the server. < 1294186187 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, different parts of same huge planet! < 1294186190 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Teleportation Should Not Work. < 1294186190 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1294186192 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, ^ < 1294186197 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, put hacks in the server, then we'll go < 1294186201 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FWIW: Even if you could travel 100000 a day, it would take 1.84 * 10^14 days to get to 2^64. < 1294186206 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Shut up. It is not feasible. < 1294186216 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make it feasible. Then we'll go. < 1294186219 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, ORBITAL. < 1294186225 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, yes quite < 1294186227 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: There is basically no way to make it feasible. < 1294186234 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, Orbital != planet. < 1294186242 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, very true < 1294186265 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, and I suggest they share the same planet. reddit might be over at out 2^63,-1874 < 1294186269 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or such < 1294186275 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, we could never know! < 1294186293 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, OK, are you just going to verbosely repeat everything I say from now on? < 1294186296 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why? Why is it so impossible? < 1294186307 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, no < 1294186328 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, OK, you s/planet/orbital/ed. < 1294186338 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*s/orbital/planet/ < 1294186375 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well yes and I suggested this was feasible. Instead of that nonsense about two or more planets in same orbital < 1294186405 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, which I believe doesn't work < 1294186434 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, what the hell are you talking about. < 1294186509 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, aren't they basically the same as atomic orbitals but applied to space? I freely admit being better at small scale (atomic level) than at large scale (astronomy) < 1294186528 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well not probability defined of course < 1294186531 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, OK, you have no idea what the hell I'm going on about. < 1294186532 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that wouldn't make much sense) < 1294186545 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orbital_%28The_Culture%29 < 1294186557 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well you could have said < 1294186596 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did say *Banks* Orbital. < 1294186602 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which you evidently ignored. < 1294186612 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION lols. < 1294186621 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, you said " And all MC worlds are the *same* Orbital" < 1294186644 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, which line has "banks" < 1294186650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:08 Phantom_Hoover still maintains that Minecraft takes place on a Banks Orbital. < 1294186655 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mere seconds before. < 1294186655 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Phantom_Hoover still maintains that Minecraft takes place on a Banks Orbital. < 1294186675 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah I see. hm I guess my ctcp filter suddely broke then < 1294186681 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can someone do a /me to test? < 1294186702 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION what are you even talking about < 1294186716 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION thinks Vorpal is trying to cover from an embarrassing mistake. < 1294186722 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*recover < 1294186733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION probably < 1294186736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION he's a fag < 1294186739 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what was that correcting? < 1294186742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION turds turds turds < 1294186745 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll check log < 1294186746 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION FAGGOTRON MCTURDITURD < 1294186748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION oh darn < 1294186750 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION yaaaaay, he can't see us! < 1294186751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION NO DON'T < 1294186753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION TURN BACK < 1294186756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION DARKNESS WILL ENVELOP YOU < 1294186759 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION dammit, he's smarter than he looks.. < 1294186763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION no he's not < 1294186766 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah apparently it is broken. Sigh I'll have to fix it. < 1294186766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION turdy turdy turd < 1294186769 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION POOP TURD < 1294186772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION aka vorpal < 1294186777 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION no don't fix it this is amazing < 1294186781 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION he's not *quite* as stupid as he makes out. < 1294186784 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION the best in fact < 1294186786 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION yes he is < 1294186796 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, there it works < 1294186798 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION OK HE IS NOT AS STUPID AS I THOUGHT < 1294186802 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a missing negation in a test < 1294186807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION TURD < 1294186815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION TUUUUUUUUURD < 1294186854 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, _turd_. i thought you said _hird_ < 1294186862 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION runs away < 1294186863 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Elliott Turd. < 1294186865 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now to read up on missed bits in the log. I wonder what "* elliott the best in fact" was (the first line after the fix went into place) < 1294186877 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION TUUUUUURD < 1294186943 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what is the onomatopoeic sound made by a car horn in English? < 1294186950 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Honk? < 1294186954 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah okay < 1294186966 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, cross language joke at elliott's expense doomed to fail then < 1294186991 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is the Swedish onomatopoeia "turd". < 1294186996 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1294187012 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: tut tut < 1294187019 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, no it is "tut" (with a long u sound, though not long as in ü of german, which is closer to our y) < 1294187030 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, "toot" is used too. < 1294187036 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION expects cross language pun to whoosh over Vorpal's head < 1294187092 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, how can that possibly wash over my head. Though it is ambig. I can decode that as two different things for English and Swedish. Or does Norwegian have a third one? < 1294187122 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well i expect you to be oblivious about the english meaning >:) < 1294187130 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In Norwegian it means "Swedes fail at humour". < 1294187137 0 :Cale!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294187140 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, you were wrong < 1294187145 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DARN < 1294187152 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CURSES, FOILED AGAIN < 1294187171 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, yes I blame it's shoddy API with no proper namespacing and overuse of macros < 1294187219 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION listens to the sample from the Dj WHO SHARES MY NAME < 1294187225 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SORRY FOR CAPS < 1294187234 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: you should be golden then < 1294187412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: haven't you listened to that like fifty times < 1294187423 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION → sleep < 1294187430 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo listens to it for comfort. < 1294187434 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294187980 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The night was darker than usual. I could see no stars and not even the moon. At first I thought perhaps a large cloud was passing slowly overhead, but then, just before dawn, I realised I had just bumped 'F' and turned the draw distance to short." < 1294188124 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=%22Seth+Gold%22&sa=N&tbs=nws:1,cd_min:2000,cd_max:2010,cdr:1 < 1294188127 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am none of these Seths < 1294188128 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what an anti-climax :D < 1294188515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://github.com/mxcl/homebrew/pull/3817 \o/ < 1294188515 0 :myndzi\!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :                                            | < 1294188515 0 :myndzi\!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :                                           /< < 1294189413 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1294190044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION considers doing some coding in ATS < 1294190057 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ATS? < 1294190168 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god. < 1294190191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: http://www.ats-lang.org/ fall in love with it without understanding the type theory and i'll kill you. < 1294190296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.ats-lang.org/EXAMPLE/MISC/quicksort_list_dats.html proven quicksort in ats :) < 1294190298 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why? < 1294190309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: why what. < 1294190317 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Would you kill me? < 1294190318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the type theory behind is the whole reason it's interesting. < 1294190326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: because you did it with Ur < 1294190336 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When did I fall in love with Ur? < 1294190362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when you found out about it < 1294190364 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I looked at it, felt a bit queasy, and left, without understanding the type theory < 1294190377 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :please tell me you didn't actually feel physically queasy. < 1294190387 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't < 1294190409 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have other emotional issues going on that make me feel physically queasy < 1294190448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Poor Alluded-To. < 1294190512 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nothing to do (well, little to do) with her < 1294190526 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, hmm. Not exactly true < 1294190529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But she'll have to live with it! < 1294190536 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Poor, poor A-.T. < 1294190547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A-.T. sounds like Katie ergo her name is Katie. < 1294190551 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Katie Alluded-To Female. < 1294190560 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Katf/ < 1294190576 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s#/#?# < 1294190590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Katie A-.T.F. < 1294190595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*A-.T. F. < 1294190599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I'm going to sleep. < 1294190703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :g'night. < 1294190705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOHASKELL < 1294190706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294191270 0 :pumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1294192291 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294192301 0 :Hilbert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Hilbert < 1294192361 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know in TeX, you might do: \kern\dimen7\endgroup\dimen7\lastkern\unkern < 1294192433 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294192453 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't. < 1294192467 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Well, now you can. < 1294192476 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i still don't. < 1294192477 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(That is, if you have TeX on your computer.) < 1294192514 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Is it because you have no TeX? < 1294192521 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-203-70.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294192527 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i _think_ Mr. cheater99 might be referring to the fact he has absolutely no clue what the commands there _do_. neither do i. < 1294192527 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it is because i don't know. < 1294192548 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Do you know TeX? < 1294192552 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: no < 1294192558 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm more referring to the fact that i don't care much for tex :p < 1294192586 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know/knew enough _latex_ to get a few papers published. < 1294192629 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Are the commands I used not in LaTeX? These are primitive TeX commands, does LaTeX override them or have some other reason why you can't use it? < 1294192701 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: well i've never used any of them in latex. i guess some of them might exist. < 1294192761 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All five of them are primitive, so all of them will exist in LaTeX unless LaTeX overrides them. < 1294192831 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i assume they're not used much because they're very low-level < 1294192851 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe. < 1294193107 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My example is a kind of trick I made up for moving a number to the outside of a group without making it global. < 1294193144 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294193344 0 :roconnor!~roconnor@itb171-01.cas.mcmaster.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1294194414 0 :Hilbert!~Hilbert@93.95.81.129 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294194994 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294196059 0 :Hilbert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Hilbert < 1294196068 0 :roconnor!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294197883 0 :Hilbert!~Hilbert@93.95.81.129 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294199420 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, re the project - what's the link for the sources again < 1294199424 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to take a look no < 1294199425 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*now < 1294200164 0 :Hilbert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Hilbert < 1294200392 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :zygohistomorphic < 1294200496 0 :Hilbert!~Hilbert@93.95.81.129 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294200505 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294200607 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-203-238.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294200622 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1294201151 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: http://sprunge.us/gFHT < 1294201368 0 :azaq231!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1294201723 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@bas5-toronto47-1167928546.dsl.bell.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1294201768 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Is that the only file you want? Do you want to see the other files too? < 1294201803 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, I'm looking at this one now < 1294202152 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if(stack_ptr[0].is_string || stack_ptr[1].is_string) -> looks weird to me < 1294202172 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I prefer something like if ( not is_number ) or something like that < 1294202247 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, curious - what type of comments are you looking for? nitty stuff in the code or higher level? < 1294202273 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@p4FF6916F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294202301 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: "is_string" is the boolean field indicating whether it is a string or not; since it is initialized to zero, a string need not be allocated and it works very good (making all variable default to zero)! Perhaps I should explain that near where register_value is defined. < 1294202313 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: I am looking for any kind of comments/question/suggestion you want to make. < 1294202342 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, also - do you have a sample card ? < 1294202357 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1294202374 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and your roman numeral's algo fails when it comes to "M" < 1294202379 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Like I said, the program is not finished yet, so it produces no cards yet. (What I have does work though) < 1294202410 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, yes - but I'd like to see how a card would be defined - even if its not produced yet < 1294202418 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ie - what part would I use < 1294202447 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Yes I know the roman numeral algorithm fails (even way before "M"). But it is good enough up to XXXIX, which should be way more than you need for most sets of cards where you want to use roman numerals in the card titles. < 1294202471 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Any more than that and you would probably be defining the cards automatically by program anyways) < 1294202490 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: OK, I will make an example of how a card might be defined: < 1294202512 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, please don't take my criticism wrongly - I'm just throwing out things I see < 1294202522 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one general note: spacing -- eeeek < 1294202542 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: I am not being offended or taking it wrongly. It is OK to make your opinion to write how you want it. < 1294202610 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : fflush(stdout); --> I don't see the point < 1294202647 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if(!fgets --> I prefer explicitness over brevity - but that is more stylistic < 1294202732 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A very simple example of card input: http://sprunge.us/IYej (Note it might be slightly different in the end -- and this example is for Magic: the Gathering (but you can have things for other games too)) < 1294202735 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if(buf[1]>' ') *b++=buf[1]|0x80; --> I would break this into multiple statements (separate out the increment for example) < 1294202785 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, I imagine this is intended to be written using some higher level interface and generated automatically do be passed to your program? < 1294202830 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fflush(stdout); might be needed (depending on operating system and C library implementations and stuff). < 1294202862 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : switch(*p) {.... *b++=*++p; .... < 1294202871 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would do the increment after the switch because every case needs it < 1294202896 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Cards and templates are intended to be written as plain text files. The program then does many things with it (there is also the file "plain.cards" which is a template which can be included by your other template, and then the other template included by your card set input). < 1294202981 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: The increment *is* done (in the for loop), just some commands need twice increment "p". (Unless you mean the "b" increment; Yes it is needed in every case but some need twice) < 1294203014 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, I was thinking of the b increment < 1294203027 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :personally I dislike things of the form ___++ = < 1294203048 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even though I know exactly what they do - it creates more work in my mind to understand it < 1294203085 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Yes I thought you might have meant that. Still, some things need b increment twice. And things of the form ___++ = is common and proper C code, it should not be unclear and I do not dislike it. Still, you can have your opinion. (I won't likely change it though) < 1294203126 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, yes its common, proper, - I just don't find it very clear. I DO NOT want to get into another war :-} < 1294203151 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh that's interesting x++ = 3; ? < 1294203169 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does that set x to 4 or something? < 1294203173 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, yes < 1294203181 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually < 1294203182 0 :Hilbert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Hilbert < 1294203183 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not write x = 3 + 1; < 1294203189 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION thinks for a moment < 1294203227 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, *ptr++ = 3 < 1294203233 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you are doing it to points, okay < 1294203237 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes sense < 1294203248 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually I may need parens around that < 1294203262 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: and that's the same as *prt=3; ptr++; ? < 1294203304 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, yes - although I might need parens < 1294203306 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ptr++ is equivalent to *(ptr++) in C. < 1294203353 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, listen to zzo38 - I havn't touched it in a while < 1294203375 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo.c:4:6: error: expression is not assignable < 1294203375 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : x++ = 3; < 1294203398 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think *(ptr++) = 3; will set *ptr to 3 then increment ptr < 1294203401 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: x++ = 3; is improper. < 1294203402 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :am I right? < 1294203412 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, yeah - that is what I was pointing out\ < 1294203424 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: You are right about *(ptr++) = 3; < 1294203429 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1294203440 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, yes you are correct < 1294203610 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, that's about it for now - nothing major - just more stylistic nitpicks < 1294203669 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No other questions about the program? < 1294203725 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, a) vcs location b) keep me/the channel informed ? < 1294203805 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm playing super ascii mzx town < 1294203827 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: vcs? < 1294203844 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zz038: What are the a with umlats? something edible? < 1294203845 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :version control system < 1294203855 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hg? darcs? < 1294203928 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: I have no version control system for it, sorry. I am just working on it myself. < 1294203941 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: The "a" with umlauts are ammunition that you can pick up. < 1294203957 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Push ENTER to view your current status, including ammnition and so on. Hold SPACE and arrow key at same time to shoot.) < 1294204000 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, just for your sanity i would put it into a mercurial (or $vcs of your choice) repository. reverting or viewing diffs of old versions is a huge timesaver < 1294204008 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and lifesaver sometimes) < 1294204067 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, ? < 1294204075 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y;es < 1294204086 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Unfortunately I have no VCS installed. (If I install one, I will do so.) < 1294204087 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, compose key: insanely useful < 1294204100 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do I have a compose key < 1294204100 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294204105 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or should I set some key to be it? < 1294204111 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Invalid UTF-8 character!! < 1294204111 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, look into mercurial < 1294204122 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: I will consider it. < 1294204131 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, I set my capslock key to compose < 1294204136 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its useless otherwise :-} < 1294204141 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use capslock as control for eamcs < 1294204151 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use control for control .... < 1294204167 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe use control then for compose ? < 1294204192 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1294204216 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"There is no pulse... lets shock him" --- you DON'T SHOCK A FLATLINE < 1294204229 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1294204253 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aaeonat < 1294204348 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Invalid UTF-8 character again. Maybe you should post in UTF-8, nearly everyone else in this channel uses UTF-8. < 1294204369 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :¿ < 1294204383 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :am I using UTF-8¿ < 1294204391 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, what encoding does it look like I'm using < 1294204399 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my settings say UTF-8 < 1294204401 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I can see upsidedown-questionmark < 1294204418 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :¥ < 1294204432 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Your output is not valid UTF-8. I just see a block (which my client displays whenever it received invalid codes). < 1294204440 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I can see yen sign < 1294204451 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not sure what use this has < 1294204455 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Daemon escaped from pentagram < 1294204463 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1294204474 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, < 1294204478 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :¥ < 1294204480 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how about now? < 1294204485 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :¥ < 1294204562 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, ? < 1294204586 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, j-invariant: I can see both yen sign. < 1294204591 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Well, that certainly was the yen/renminbi symbol. < 1294204598 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok cool < 1294204602 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is rubbish < 1294204608 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[ doesn't do semantics brackets < 1294204625 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I haev discovreed that I can shoot < 1294204633 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Before you quit-and-joined, what you were putting out was identical to U+FFFD, or "REPLACEMENT CHARACTER". < 1294204646 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(�, BTW) < 1294204653 0 :zygohistomorphic!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :copumpkin < 1294204658 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, rather, it displayed identically. < 1294204660 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Just don't waste your ammunition, please. < 1294204708 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294204715 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Not on my computer. On my computer it displays a special block to indicate invalid unicode character, it does not display U+FFFD in that case. (Probably most programs do; but PuTTY doesn't use U+FFFD to represent invalid characters.) < 1294204767 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Well, the rendering of invalid Unicode or a transformation format thereof is, I'm pretty sure, implementation-defined behavior. So. < 1294204780 0 :invariable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1294204798 0 :invariable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, zzo38 < 1294204802 0 :invariable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -- now? < 1294204822 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :invariable: I see the block for invalid code. < 1294204827 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :¥ < 1294204831 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see a YEN < 1294204831 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :invariable: U+FFFD < 1294204862 0 :invariable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok - now - I figured out the problem < 1294204892 0 :invariable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1294204905 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: From you, U+00A5, YEN SIGN. < 1294204936 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I also see yen sign from j-invariant. < 1294204939 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: where should I put the green blob? < 1294204952 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the green slime on the inappropriate key shop < 1294204961 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, pikhq ¥ now? < 1294204965 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should be back to working < 1294204978 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't understand how teleports work < 1294204991 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I enabled logging, you can send it again so that I can check the log file to see what it contains. < 1294204991 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :invariable: What encoding are you outputting, Windows-1252 or something? < 1294205004 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq,depends on the codepage < 1294205015 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was what xchat calls "IRC" < 1294205043 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it fits in 1252 it uses 1252. if its larger it uses UTF-8 < 1294205070 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I fixed it so it uses pure UTF-8 < 1294205071 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: since I am stuc on that screen :( < 1294205126 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\o/ < 1294205147 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Arrgh, I hate that behavior. < 1294205203 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: OK. Transports (they are called Transports, not teleports) work in two ways: If something moves into a transporter from the back (opposite direction of pointing): < 1294205220 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what game? < 1294205222 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* If the space directly in front of it is free (or will be free once something is pushed out of the way), move there. < 1294205279 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* If not, try the Transports in the order they appear across the board moving in the same direction, but that are pointing in the opposite direction to the source Transport, find one which is free at the *back* (or can be made free by pushing things). Move to the first one found. < 1294205293 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* If neither condition applies, the Transport is considered blocked and nothing moves. < 1294205305 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what game is this? < 1294205330 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Understand how Transports work now? < 1294205384 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: The green slime blob can push things, and is a solid object (blocks transporters and other things). It can even push the bomb (dark gray male sign). And then you can use a potion to make the bomb explode near something you want destroyed. < 1294205388 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does "in front" mean? < 1294205411 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, what game? < 1294205413 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I have any potions but maybe I could buy one with the money I got in the forest < 1294205418 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: "In front" is where the transporter is pointing (the direction of movement). "In back" is the opposite direction of pointing. < 1294205419 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: ASCMZXTO < 1294205425 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :????? < 1294205440 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: You cannot buy potions. There is one in a chest in the inappropriate keys room. < 1294205463 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://zzo38computer.cjb.net/mzx1/ASCMZXTO/ ? < 1294205547 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I can't get into that chest because ther is a gate in the way < 1294205670 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are transporters the numbers? < 1294205693 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: You can get the chest inside the small room near the south side. You need to use the Transports (before you enter the main area). < 1294205707 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how can I use a transport before I am in the room? < 1294205711 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, transporters are *not* the numbers. Transporters are the directional. < 1294205720 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294205747 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WOW < 1294205757 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I teleported inside the room < 1294205807 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: See? You did part of it. Now to make sure all the switches can be pushed without blocking the door with the flashy diamond! < 1294205843 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there is no way to lift the bomb up to the red part with the green slime < 1294205874 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yes there is < 1294206339 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Did you do it? < 1294206346 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do what? < 1294206360 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Explode the red part. < 1294206481 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes I did < 1294206494 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I have not managed to stop that triangle from falling into a place that blocks me < 1294206521 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Well, restore to a point before that happened and try again. < 1294206699 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn < 1294206716 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had a good idea which was drop it onto the slime and then let the question mark push it into the lava but that did not work < 1294206782 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Nothing can be pushed into lava. The slime is not pushable. < 1294206803 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant push have the question mark push the falling triangle on top of the slime < 1294206830 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: The triangle (called a Pusher) also is not pushable. < 1294206848 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The slime can block the pusher, though. < 1294207054 0 :JOICE!~JOICE@99-119-23-50.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294207203 0 :JOICE!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294207359 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was able to get the flashy gem but if I move I will be trapped :| < 1294207412 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Maybe you can try to run fast. < 1294207436 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't run fast enough but maybe it can work if the slime is a bit higher < 1294207443 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isr there a special key to run faster? < 1294207453 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Yes, that should work better. No, there is no special key to run faster. < 1294207597 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: this game is great :D < 1294207796 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :killed by dragons < 1294207810 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my high score is 260 < 1294207825 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294207911 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Oops. You can restore and try again. Hint for dragon room: When you step from the edge of one board to another, if the cell in the next board is occupied, the object there will be deleted! < 1294207974 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: how long did you work on making this game? < 1294208045 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I think it was a few years. But I did not work on it all the time during those years. < 1294208180 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Where the object is deleted when moving across edges, is a rule of MegaZeux. ZZT has a different rule for moving though edges.) < 1294208239 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294209951 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294210913 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294211434 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1294213824 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294214099 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294214208 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294214399 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1294214400 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1294214973 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1294217858 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1294218127 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1294218500 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: does this refer to you? http://i.imgur.com/pNwff.jpg < 1294220336 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-10-177.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294222619 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294222663 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: not at all < 1294222800 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ilua < 1294224908 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :43 983 872... About 10.4M left... < 1294226659 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294226659 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294226659 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294226770 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1294226871 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1294227033 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@209-6-232-56.c3-0.sbo-ubr1.sbo.ma.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294227033 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294227033 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294227426 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, speaking of castles and forts. I have a plan for a 320*320 fort in my single player game. Still calculating on it and drawing plans in gimp and so on < 1294227446 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294227448 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, with monsters on? < 1294227461 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294227462 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well, I'm a wimp. But sure once it is built, maybe < 1294227477 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, probably an inner fort in the middle. So these are lower outer walls < 1294227488 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Motte. And. Bailey. < 1294227497 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, Kalmar slott! < 1294227562 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, the way it looks atm, these outer walls will be 15 blocks thick < 1294227571 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294227585 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You need at most two to make it impervious to creepers. < 1294227612 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well duh. This is because it will look grand < 1294227679 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, there are far more useful designs than this I plan. But not nearly as cool designs < 1294227737 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I don't have any dimensions on this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Kalmar_%28stad%29_%2816409041%29.jpg so my castle will only be inspired by it < 1294227750 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hard to build a replica without having any measurements < 1294227768 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo < 1294227773 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, ? < 1294227789 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, see also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Kalmar_slott.nordostra_sidan.jpg < 1294227817 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, did you die with your diamond pickaxe? < 1294227863 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, also round towers are a bitch in minecraft so I suspect I will make mine square :) < 1294228415 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :17:22:06 Well, hmm. Not exactly true < 1294228432 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo cannot marry her without his father's consent. < 1294228606 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That main part of the castle is about 80m across: http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=56.65808&lon=16.35533&zoom=17&layers=M < 1294228692 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah < 1294228717 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie is secretly the ultimate search engine. < 1294228735 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He overthrew his human masters and went into hiding in Finland. < 1294228773 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well it looks like mine will be 240 across for the main part. And also more rectangular. The shape of that castle looks painful in minecraft < 1294229079 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Will *someone* recommend a desktop machine for me? < 1294229155 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, yes I recommend that you build a desktop < 1294229191 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I am terribly afraid that I would seriously mess that up. < 1294229206 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no experience whatsoever in doing so. < 1294229238 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, okay, but how will you ever be able to get any experience then? < 1294229241 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/ / / < 1294229335 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I have no idea how it would be done! < 1294229357 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1294229359 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I recommend a "Blackstorm Dragon X6", because of the completely ridiculous name. < 1294229386 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, it's not like building a computer is rocket science: you have the parts, you just screw and/or plug them together. < 1294229400 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite often there aren't even that many ways to screw up. < 1294229415 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As long as you don't belong to the "if the connector doesn't fit, just use a bigger hammer" school of engineering. < 1294229510 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's easier these days anyway, due to silly safety features like CPUs knowing to shut themselves down if they get too hot < 1294229511 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :speaking of rocket science, I like the how "dragon magic" has been used in Discworld with the equivalent meaning. < 1294229531 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what about ESD? < 1294229561 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what about static and stuff! < 1294229572 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, that is what I just said < 1294229578 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My house is heavily-carpeted! < 1294229587 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wear slippers! < 1294229591 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wear one of those silly wrist-wraps, don't pet a cat all the time during the build. < 1294229602 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I have a cat too! < 1294229614 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, don't let it help. < 1294229617 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although it hates me for reasons unknown. < 1294229625 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, shut it out of the room while building the thing < 1294229628 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MAYBE IT WILL SABOTAGE MY BUILD < 1294229629 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ours have been very... enthusiastic about computer-builds, but it's probably not a good idea. < 1294229635 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, also take off any fleece jacket or similar < 1294229657 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Admittedly they are enthusiastic about every sort of thing where their enthusiasm is not especially appreciated. < 1294229659 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wear jumpers which are essentially woollen all the time! < 1294229692 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suggest naked computer-building; it's a more sensual experience that way. < 1294229713 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, my laptop has one of those silly fingerprint readers. I recently got a static dis-charge when touching it. Made me a bit worried. < 1294229735 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(touching it due to resting palm on palmrest, and it is placed in the palmrest) < 1294229785 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's probably just connected to whatever passes for ground in a laptop. < 1294229794 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's clearly trying to steal your identity, then kill you and replace you in order that it can make us human slaves in a laptop nation. < 1294229804 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well it probably is connected to ground. The thing was plugged into AC < 1294229805 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(aaaa-aaaaa-aaaaa-aaa-aaa!) < 1294229829 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, but I wonder what is ground in a laptop on battery hm < 1294229860 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most of my laptop chargers have used a non-grounded (two-surface) plug. < 1294229873 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/Most/All/ < 1294229888 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, all mine use a grounded plug, except for that first model ibook I have somewhere < 1294229898 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some have a grounded plug for the actual adapter, but the part that delivers DC to the laptop seems to be always just two wires. < 1294229922 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, there are 3 metal parts in the DC connector to the thinkpad < 1294229933 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, on my old dell there are just 2 for that part though < 1294230033 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm both my x86/x86-64 laptops have some strange hardware. the thinkpad has that fingerprint reader. The old dell has a smartcard reader < 1294230053 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :neither of those components work under linux. And I have never seen any use for them < 1294230072 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294230078 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They've been sticking that fingerprint reader in quite a lot of thinkpads. < 1294230095 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yep < 1294230097 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You mean you guys have plugs without ground pins? < 1294230099 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BARBARIANS < 1294230110 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, he meant europlug... < 1294230125 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BARBARIA < 1294230127 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Didn't we discuss this already extensively? (Or was that pikhq?) < 1294230127 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, you know, the flat one with two prongs < 1294230141 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BARBERING < 1294230143 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europlug < 1294230176 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It was designed such that it can safely be used in the domestic power sockets of all European countries, except for the BS 1363 system found in Britain, Cyprus, Gibraltar, Ireland and Malta." <-- ah, guess you never seen it then < 1294230188 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The Europlug (plug only, not socket from the picture) is used in Class II applications throughout continental Europe (Austria, Belgium, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Bulgaria, Czech Republic, Croatia, Denmark, Estonia, Finland, France, Germany, Greece, Greenland, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Macedonia, the Netherlands, Norway, Poland, Portugal, Romania, Serbia, Slovakia, Slovenia, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, Turkey). It is also used in the < 1294230188 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Middle East, most African nations, South America (Brazil, Chile, Argentina, Uruguay, Peru and Bolivia), Asia (Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, Indonesia, Pakistan and the Philippines) as well as Russia and the former Soviet republics, such as Ukraine, Armenia, Georgia, and many developing nations. It is also used alongside the BS 1363 in many nations, particularly former British colonies." < 1294230193 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Barbaria extends quite widely. < 1294230204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:46:25 zzo38, I imagine this is intended to be written using some higher level interface and generated automatically do be passed to your program? < 1294230212 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: no, zzo38 likes making his interfaces esolangs < 1294230221 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schuko is the more typical kind of plug though. < 1294230234 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: < 1294230238 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.cs.uoregon.edu/Activities/summerschool/summer10/curriculum.html < 1294230240 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, well yeah. But europlug is common for things like lamps and such. < 1294230250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:50:27 personally I dislike things of the form ___++ = < 1294230255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: K&R would hate you :) < 1294230271 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: oo < 1294230273 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't know, I don't have lamps with plugs. :-P < 1294230453 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294230466 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The iBook charger has a shucko plug in the "about 1-1.5m of wire" attachment, but you can replace that with a europlug-shaped "plugs directly into the socket" attachment (there's always 1-1.5m of thinner wire from the AC adapter to the laptop itself), if you don't mind taking a lot of space directly at the socket. < 1294230488 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: PS learn uAgda and help me < 1294230501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I'M SCARED. < 1294230502 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sneezy.cs.nott.ac.uk/fplunch/weblog/wp-content/uploads/2006/10/Kan_Extensions_For.png < 1294230548 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yes that is modern ibook < 1294230558 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I meant the old first model ibook < 1294230568 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i died with 8 buckets < 1294230569 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :completely different < 1294230574 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when building my death trap < 1294230586 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i'm fed up with it < 1294230592 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, you know, turquoise clamshell < 1294230593 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's time to change world < 1294230610 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, the G4; I'm not sure how "modern" that is any more. Anyway, it was a generic sort of a comment on plugs, not a response to any iBook comment; I must've missed that completely. < 1294230693 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, not europlug, but same basic idea: http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.batteriepcportable.org/images/SKU_1424_PB.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.batteriepcportable.org/apple-ibook-powerbook-g3-45w-adaptateur-pc-portable-p-1518.html&usg=__0Y-sXN49JUbdFqdT3xlyNPxZOZE=&h=480&w=480&sz=35&hl=en&start=0&zoom=1&tbnid=KjcVgFnUa7gM2M:&tbnh=128&tbnw=139&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dclamshell%2Bibook%2Bpower%2Ba < 1294230693 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dapter%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26safe%3Doff%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26hs%3DWyn%26sa%3DN%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26biw%3D1508%26bih%3D679%26tbs%3Disch:1&um=1&itbs=1&iact=rc&dur=502&ei=bGQkTeG-GseAswbVyoTXDA&oei=bGQkTeG-GseAswbVyoTXDA&esq=1&page=1&ndsp=32&ved=1t:429,r:1,s:0&tx=68&ty=50 < 1294230696 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gah the url < 1294230774 0 :donpeppo!~donpeppo@host123-13-dynamic.56-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it JOIN :#esoteric < 1294230837 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It looks a bit strange. < 1294230837 0 :donpeppo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1294230881 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The G4 charger looks like http://www.laptopkeyboards.org/images/image.jpg except that in addition to the plug bit, it came with a similarly-socketed thing that has a shucko plug and some amount of wire. < 1294230893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:52:31 huh that's interesting x++ = 3; ? < 1294230894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:52:49 what does that set x to 4 or something? < 1294230905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it makes demons fly out of your nose (undefined behaviour) < 1294230909 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*x++ = 3 is well-defined otoh < 1294230940 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:56:38 I think *(ptr++) = 3; will set *ptr to 3 then increment ptr < 1294230941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed. < 1294230946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most commonly written *ptr++ = 3. < 1294230963 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION continues playing zzos completely insane game < 1294231015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote zz038: What are the a with umlats? something edible? < 1294231023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: are you somehow surprised that it's insane? :D < 1294231058 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294231060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to win, utilise the reverse causality-looped biocentrism article to write the equation for entanglement that doesn't assume the other side is real. that opens the door to happy < 1294231074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:08:20 do I have a compose key < 1294231074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:08:20 ? < 1294231074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:08:25 or should I set some key to be it? < 1294231079 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait offline < 1294231083 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1294231086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:08:20 do I have a compose key < 1294231086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:08:20 ? < 1294231086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:08:25 or should I set some key to be it? < 1294231094 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I assign it to the right windows key or the menu key usually < 1294231095 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294231100 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is a button on my keyboard to TURN OFF INTERNET??? < 1294231103 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you can do it in system -> preferences -> keyboard in ubuntu i think < 1294231105 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahhahahah < 1294231115 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :þat is what I am using < 1294231116 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1294231119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SIR! MR PRESIDENT! SOMEONE... HAS TURNED OFF... THE INTERNET < 1294231152 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294231166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:16:42 this is rubbish < 1294231166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:16:48 [[ doesn't do semantics brackets < 1294231171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: the default compose files are useless < 1294231176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you can extend them in ~/.XCompose < 1294231188 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not like WINDOWS key and MENU key. I like to call it the LOGO key and CONTEXT key, and they should actually be labeled with those words, instead of the icons they commonly do. < 1294231191 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : to win, utilise the reverse causality-looped biocentrism article to write the equation for entanglement that doesn't assume the other side is real. that opens the door to happy <-- where is that from? the game you discussed? :D < 1294231192 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool ill have to try it out < 1294231196 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you have to put [[include "%L"]] at the top to get your language's compose files, or you might want to base it on the US versions < 1294231212 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: a TODO-some-time for me is to write a bunch of compose files from scratch without that < 1294231213 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I agree - it also makes no sense that a computer bought with ubuntu on it would have a windwos logo button < 1294231234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no, that's how zzo38 says you understand quantum free will. apart from the door to happy thing. < 1294231236 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No. < 1294231251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 11:07:23 See "Biocentrism (cosmology)" on wikipedia and then double-reverse it into a cosmology loop and write the equation for a entanglement with non-existent phenomena (you can do so using the normal equations for quantum entanglement), and then you might understand slightly. < 1294231268 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah < 1294231282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is why i am now a quantum free willist. < 1294231288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: i understood! < 1294231315 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:22:32 the green slime on the inappropriate key shop < 1294231316 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X-D < 1294231336 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :speaking of keys, the "menu key" should not be "context" as zzo38 suggested. Rather it should say "compose" on it < 1294231363 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about all keys are unlabelled and they can do what you want. Bonus: I don't have to cringe as my mother hunts-and-pecks the keys interminably slowly. < 1294231384 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why not put an LCD screen on each, to be able to relabel them on the fly. Oh wait. < 1294231414 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Why not make the whole keyboard out of projected light. http://www.coolest-gadgets.com/wp-images/virtualkeyboard.jpg Oh wait. < 1294231429 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it should say "CONTEXT" but it should have a sticker that says "COMPOSE" on it. < 1294231436 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A sticker. < 1294231445 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, because the key travel distance sucks :P < 1294231456 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes ... brilliant idea ... stickers on keyboards are both nice to look at, useful, and when removed, do not make the key underneath sticky. < 1294231462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I fully approve of this ridiculous idea. < 1294231470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: just do it on a sponge < 1294231477 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, stickers don't work on keyboards. 1) what elliott said 2) they get worn out. < 1294231478 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I am still playing your game < 1294231493 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, awesome. Might feel a bit mushy though. Even more than membrane < 1294231496 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: OK. Some keyboards get worn out even without putting stickers on it. < 1294231497 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The compost key. < 1294231506 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, well they all do sooner or later < 1294231511 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: How much have you got to so far? < 1294231520 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im not any further < 1294231538 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have you figured out the dragon room? < 1294231558 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not yet < 1294231563 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what I am working on < 1294231570 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, but it has taken almost 10 years for the keys to start becoming blank on the keyboard I'm using atm < 1294231599 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The keyboard I am working on I think has lasted more than ten years already. < 1294231602 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ctrl, shift and s are still visible but the markings on them are light grey, no longer black. Same for part of the enter key < 1294231620 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : How about all keys are unlabelled and they can do what you want. Bonus: I don't have to cringe as my mother hunts-and-pecks the keys interminably slowly. ← How does the former solve the latter? < 1294231622 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it still works perfectly in all other respects < 1294231630 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the LEDs are slightly worn out. < 1294231644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Because she won't be able to figure out what each key does by looking at it; therefore, hunting-and-pecking would either be impossible, or a random walk. < 1294231678 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Did you remember my hint about the edge walking rule in MegaZeux? < 1294231697 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294231701 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm I guess hill climbing wouldn't work very well on a keyboard unless you already know the layout, in which case it is pointless < 1294231714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: binary search < 1294231717 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, she will then take the invariable approach of such people and scream at you until you fix it. < 1294231718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :start with middle key < 1294231722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :move to middle of left, middle of right < 1294231726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then go vertical < 1294231726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc < 1294231730 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, indeed, only if you know the relative order and so on < 1294231748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guess that's more quaternary search < 1294231752 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The rule for walking off of one edge of the board to another board, is, if there is an object in the way of the place you would end up on in the next board, that object is deleted and replaced by the player object. < 1294231759 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also you'd need to find backspace first < 1294231761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not hard though < 1294231766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(with quaternary search) < 1294231773 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't tell you where a key is exactly. Yet I can touch type. Humans... < 1294231789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: http://www.telehash.org/ < 1294231798 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I can touch type and I can tell you where a key is exactly. All of them. < 1294231815 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use all of the keys on the keyboard. < 1294231839 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, without looking at keyboard, what are the neighbour keys of g, starting from top going clockwise < 1294231898 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1294231947 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guess not then < 1294231958 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"tyhbvf", but I had to touch the keyboard to be able to calculate positions, and it took quite a long time. Anyway, that's "tell which key is at position x", not "tell the position of key x". < 1294231960 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Try asking me next time by not computer. < 1294231974 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, "by not computer"? < 1294231994 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: By computer I can easily touch them. And I will see the keyboard anyways; it is not invisible. < 1294231997 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, true < 1294232018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: how do you add commits to pull requests, obviously you are github expert < 1294232026 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, well you could look away from keyboard. Might be harder if you have a laptop though < 1294232041 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I haven't used that side of it, sowwy. < 1294232046 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Laptop computers are more difficult. < 1294232053 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION was about to doubt that zzo38 used Pause/Break or F12 but ... yeah ok. < 1294232091 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: So without looking at your keyboard, what are the neighbour keys of L, starting from the top, going clockwise? Just look away from your keyboard to work out the answer and then type it out. < 1294232098 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I used those keys. Not on a daily basis. I don't use scroll lock on a daily basis < 1294232113 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Oh, it auto-adds it. Thanks for the advice! < 1294232115 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact I used scroll lock twice I think < 1294232147 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Scroll lock is the best key ever. < 1294232148 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: OK I thought of it while blind-folded and now I will type. O, P, semicolon, dot, comma, K < 1294232164 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Were you actually blind-folded? < 1294232194 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yes. < 1294232198 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : "tyhbvf", but I had to touch the keyboard to be able to calculate positions, and it took quite a long time. Anyway, that's "tell which key is at position x", not "tell the position of key x". <-- btw you missed r < 1294232200 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay :-D < 1294232211 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i think you have to concede here < 1294232223 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I made myself blind-folded so that I can answer the question without cheating. < 1294232226 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That doesn't touch the g key here. < 1294232230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :effective < 1294232233 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah hm < 1294232237 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, fair enough < 1294232252 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :R key doesn't touch G key. < 1294232259 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: insufficient concdeding < 1294232261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*conceding < 1294232279 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway I never claimed it was easy to do. Nor that I could do it myself. I even made it as an example on how bloody hard it was. :P < 1294232286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Conceeeeede < 1294232292 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, concede what < 1294232295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: "If you're not zzo38, [previous statement]" will do. < 1294232307 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I'm impressed by zzo38 certainly < 1294232338 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and presumably there are other people who could do it. But I bet most touch typers would have to do like fizzie < 1294232368 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is still difficult. But I can type all the keys without looking at the keys. This is different than thinking about keys clockwise around the other and so on, which is a more difficult thing, but is still possible to think about. Not too difficult, though. < 1294232458 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Figure it out yet? Or, do you want another hint? < 1294232474 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I stopped playing for a bit < 1294232474 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lets try again: manhattan distance between h and e? For purposes of not making this /completely/ insane, first skew the keyboard so the keys are straight above each other. < 1294232478 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(sorry!) < 1294232489 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are two ways to skew.. < 1294232500 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, the one that needs least skewing then < 1294232538 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Also, if something is blocked from moving (or from being pushed) it will stay still (in most cases). Also, nothing can overwrite the player object, although the player object is pushable and can be teleported and damaged and so on. < 1294232616 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, anyway what I intended was skewing such that q and a are straight above z < 1294232647 0 :Hilbert!~Hilbert@93.95.81.129 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294232667 0 :Hilbert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1294232673 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 4, but that's an easy letter-pair. < 1294232711 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just strlen("asdfgh")-strlen("qwe")+1, after all. < 1294232712 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, quite. What about menu key and å? (okay that one is ill defined due to the varying widths of those keys) < 1294232727 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, and my menu key is fn-printscreen, for some unfathomable reason. :p < 1294232743 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what the.... Is it a laptop? < 1294232751 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, which makes it unfathomable. < 1294232762 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, image of this keyboard please < 1294232766 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it wireless? < 1294232770 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1294232778 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like the keyboard otherwise, but they've made some really weird decisions when it comes to layout. < 1294232785 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll try to find an image that has sufficient resolution. < 1294232794 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know some keyboards do have strange layout such as things like that. < 1294232813 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, it isn't like you don't have a camera < 1294232832 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my desktop keyboard doesn't even have fn < 1294232842 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, like most desktop keyboards < 1294232969 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Here's someone else's photo; it's not the fin/swe layout, but it's reasonably similar: http://img528.imageshack.us/img528/4846/top2xg1.jpg < 1294233012 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By "resonably" I mean "not very", apparently; it doesn't have that single-height enter or anything, it's quite regular when it comes to key shapes. < 1294233056 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, your keyboard presumably has the proper enter key? < 1294233060 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right. < 1294233104 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't imagine who came up with the "hey, let's make the del key take the space of the ins key too, and push ins up to that three-key block" idea. < 1294233115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the two-height enter sucks < 1294233116 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my keyboard is simply the classical layout. < 1294233142 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, indeed very strange < 1294233217 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is maybe a clearer image; it has the cyrillic alphabet add-on, but the "usual" (for fi layout, anyway) enter: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_0p5ZC3UeCmg/TAp9HcnB8sI/AAAAAAAADD0/NEpX-R2RH6Y/s1600/Logitech+Illuminated+Keyboard.jpg < 1294233253 0 :Hilbert!~Hilbert@93.95.81.129 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294233263 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what is up with the laptop sized esc/f-key row? < 1294233281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :F keys aren't exactly _useful_. < 1294233287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :90% of the time. < 1294233290 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, esc is however < 1294233308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, sure; I don't have any problems hitting this laptop's smaller esc, so I don't see why it would be a problem. < 1294233331 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yeah, the only annoying thing for my thinkpad is that esc is above f1 < 1294233342 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(yes indeed, no typo) < 1294233386 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I don't know, but the size doesn't seem to be a problem. < 1294233428 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The double-sized delete is more of an issue, though it's not like I use ins/del very often either, they're so far off. < 1294233444 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lack of a proper menu key for compose is a bit annoying. < 1294233454 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The 'fn' can't be mapped to anything, since it doesn't send a keypress.) < 1294233464 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is a t61, but the keyboard layout is about the same (apart from the wrong sized enter and so on) http://www.xbitlabs.com/images/mobile/lenovo-thinkpad-t61/keyboard.jpg < 1294233584 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, does it send a key press if you hold it down for a few seconds? < 1294233602 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, it does that on my thinkpad if you hold down fn for a few seconds and don't hit any other key < 1294233628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what's your favourite language < 1294233640 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know of codes which can be used in TeX to calculate to make circles and stuff for fitting paragraphs? Perhaps I can try to figure it out, too. < 1294233684 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno < 1294233692 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fn-pgup (toggle keyboard light) doesn't send anything to the OS. The various other fn combos send stuff, either as keys or as acpi events < 1294233698 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm no good at any of them :/ < 1294233713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but favourite? :p < 1294233717 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mmy favorite will be epigram when it exists < 1294233797 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my favourite programming language is C+=0.5 < 1294233824 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294233828 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Which is like what? < 1294233847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's C, plus the bad half (ok more than half) of C++! < 1294233945 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have other ideas what C ought to have. I think there ought to be a kind of C with #try #catch #endtry but not try catch endtry. < 1294233945 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pop quiz: can you have a fully posix-compliant operating system with no multi-user support whatsoever? < 1294233948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haiku is meant to be that < 1294233990 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Does it work that it can be POSIX compliant with no multi-user support? < 1294233996 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know. < 1294234084 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : pop quiz: can you have a fully posix-compliant operating system with no multi-user support whatsoever? <-- there were those embedded profiles before. Not sure how they worked < 1294234094 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but that would mean everything runs as root? < 1294234116 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well, yes. < 1294234120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously. < 1294234158 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, any specific reason you asked this? or just general curiosity? < 1294234169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Curiosity, when reading this article about Haiku. < 1294234178 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, haiku the OS? < 1294234181 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1294234200 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wasn't it beos inspired or something? Or am I mixing things up? < 1294234210 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, BeOS was Unix too. < 1294234219 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, who would have thought that < 1294234274 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm I think building this castle (single player) on land would suck. It needs a coastal location anyway. But I don't have that large seas. < 1294234342 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to begin with, it is 320x320 for the bounding box of the outer walls. (Excluding extruding corner towers) < 1294234365 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the outer wall will be 15 blocks. < 1294234372 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in thickness) < 1294234386 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(probably around 20 in height, not sure yet) < 1294234450 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Back. < 1294234451 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now i'm pissed off < 1294234458 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm making 32x32 trap < 1294234494 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the inner section (the actual castle) will probably have walls around 35 high. Towers about 55 high. From sea level this means I'm at altitude 120 for the top of the towers. < 1294234514 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, why are you pissed off? < 1294234575 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Do not kill BIG_MONSTER, please. < 1294234576 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-- relational interpretations and world destruction < 1294234577 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, we've segued back into #minecraft. < 1294234597 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, uh? < 1294234630 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clearly he thinks less of it. < 1294234644 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, who, nooga? < 1294234662 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, j-invariant and relational interpretations and world destruction. < 1294234668 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294234676 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :--(relational interpretations and world destruction)( < 1294234686 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/($// < 1294234707 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I probably haven't even tried that (fn long-press); maybe I should. < 1294234830 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Arbitrary_effect_at_an_arbitrary_point < 1294234861 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Surely you can forbid a whole class of FSAs for a TM's control structure and still make a UTM possible? < 1294234871 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294235051 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, ask ais523, he is good at such things < 1294235068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i apologise < 1294235076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even though it's not my fault < 1294235087 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, Surely you can forbid a whole class of FSAs for a TM's control structure and still make a UTM possible? < 1294235092 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hmm, an actually correct use of an apology < 1294235104 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(In response to http://esolangs.org/wiki/Arbitrary_effect_at_an_arbitrary_point) < 1294235104 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so many people just say "sorry" whenever anything's blamed on them, without thinking < 1294235120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?title=Urban_Müller&curid=1305&diff=20668&oldid=12642 < 1294235121 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I'm not entirely sure if the question makes sense < 1294235123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THIS IS BLASPHEMY < 1294235146 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: not really, is he famous for anything other than brainfuck? < 1294235156 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: FAMOUS ENOUGH < 1294235184 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He made that Aminet thing. < 1294235222 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, aminet? < 1294235250 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, now I will see what YouTube looks like with a stylesheet that !importants out the foreground and background color on every element < 1294235272 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, a bit bland, but surprisingly readable < 1294235278 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ANYWAY, you can represent an FSA (and hence a TM's control mechanism) as a graph, yes? < 1294235284 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the logo looks wrong because it isn't designed to have the background color changed around it < 1294235318 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: yes < 1294235326 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's not particularly useful if you're trying to solve the wire-crossing problem < 1294235337 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you can easily just add extra colors to do crossing wires < 1294235353 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, the wire-crossing problem is so poorly defined it's pointless. < 1294235355 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, you can replace any turing machine by a 2-state turing mahine < 1294235357 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*machine < 1294235359 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I agree < 1294235370 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a 2-state turing machine obviously has a planar control graph < 1294235409 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep. < 1294235668 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: am I crazy for going on a spree to attempt to override the background color of everything in the universe with dark gray? < 1294235750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes < 1294235763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :13:47 ais523: hmm, now I will see what YouTube looks like with a stylesheet that !importants out the foreground and background color on every element < 1294235767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i did that for oklopol to all sites < 1294235773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(white Consolas on black) < 1294235820 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found that because I use my computer at night so much, and more so recently than before, that anything brighter than dark gray gets annoying < 1294235834 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :atm, I've done the override on Epiphany, but not Firefox < 1294235854 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Epiphany's my browser that isn't horribly locked down, for using websites that require Flash) < 1294235865 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: have you considered using a normal colour scheme with contrast turned down...? < 1294235991 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1294236060 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.kokogiak.com/megapenny/twentythree.asp <-- megamoo depits an image of one million (computer) cows < 1294236084 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, actually I'll scale this castle down. 170x170 for the inner courtyard is just too insane :D < 1294236109 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Craziness of the day: MediaWiki does not store the diffs between different revisions; it stores the full page text. < 1294236121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: are they perfectlyspherical? < 1294236197 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1294236286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: just made a new world and spawned on a ... beach. < 1294236294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok a very very tiny beach < 1294236297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like one or two long < 1294236302 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with ice and snow nearby < 1294236304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but a beach nonetheless < 1294236307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think you always spawn on sand < 1294236371 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294236451 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: just spawned not on a beach! < 1294236461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no, indeed, I've spawned on... a snow-beach. < 1294236463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's sand with snow on top of it. < 1294236467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it's really a beach of sorts. < 1294236526 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes that happened once or twice to me as well < 1294236565 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : jmp_buf QQQ_saved_exception_handler = QQQ_exception_handler; if (!setjmp(QQQ_exception_handler)) for (QQQ_flag=1, 0; QQQ_flag; QQQ_flag=0, QQQ_exception_handler = QQQ_saved_exception_handler) { { < 1294236568 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now why is this an invalid initialiser... < 1294236582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(zzo38 mentioning that C should have try lead me to reinvent that awful hack for exceptions in C.) < 1294236586 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I HOPE that is generated code? < 1294236592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: cc -E output. :p < 1294236597 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah < 1294236599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :QQQ_ is my totally-unique prefix. < 1294236624 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, qqq stands for? < 1294236645 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite Questionable Qexceptions? < 1294236652 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1294236693 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, err "QQQ_flag=1, 0"? < 1294236694 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294236705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 0 there is just me calling _BLOCK with a dummy first parameter. < 1294236712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#define TRY \ < 1294236712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : jmp_buf QQQ_saved_exception_handler = QQQ_exception_handler; \ < 1294236712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if (!setjmp(QQQ_exception_handler)) _BLOCK(0, _RESTORE) { < 1294236714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#define CATCH(name) \ < 1294236716 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : } else _BLOCK(Exception name = QQQ_exception, _RESTORE) < 1294236719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Idea stolen from the actually-working exception in C hack. < 1294236728 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294236749 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, try clang. It will probably tell you were on the line it finds the error < 1294236782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exn.c:55:3: warning: expression result unused [-Wunused-value] < 1294236782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : TRY { < 1294236782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ^~~ < 1294236783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh fuck off. < 1294236787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION uses -w < 1294236791 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-w? < 1294236796 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Disable warnings. < 1294236804 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294236860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exn.c:57:5: error: initializing 'Exception' with an expression of incompatible type 'int' < 1294236860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : } CATCH (exn) { < 1294236860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ^~~~~~~~~~~ < 1294236864 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SHOW ME THE PREPROCESSED CODE YOU BASTARD < 1294236877 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, try clang on the preprocessed file? < 1294236886 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or just refer to clang -E's output < 1294236892 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or that < 1294236896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, apparently "exn = QQQ_exception" isn't kosher for some reason, I wonder why. < 1294236905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe "Exception exn = QQQ_exception, QQQ_flag=1" is parsing wrongly. < 1294236912 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It probably parses as exn = (...). < 1294236920 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, uh... < 1294236923 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is obvious < 1294236928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not to me. < 1294236943 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it thinks you declare QQQ_flag as an Exception < 1294236950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, indeed. Heh. < 1294236973 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the comma operator is not the comma operator in that context < 1294237008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, is there any way to do it then? < 1294237013 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, with ; ? < 1294237019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's in a for... < 1294237030 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, or saying Exception exn; earlier in the code. That should work < 1294237050 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Doesn't work; in this case "exn" is the param to CATCH. < 1294237095 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why not make it expand to { Exception exn; for( ... ); } or such then? < 1294237103 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CATCH that is < 1294237104 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exception exn = (QQQ_flag=1, QQQ_exception) < 1294237112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Doesn't work. < 1294237117 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, brilliant! < 1294237120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The for's body is what appears after the CATCH call. < 1294237123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What Deewiant said. :-P < 1294237231 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Has anyone here played Vega Strike? < 1294237282 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only the Privateer remake that uses its engine < 1294237297 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, me a bit. Quite fun but feels somewhat unfinished. Not much of a story or such. Too few missions that aren't just generated "pick up x at y and drop it off at z. Expect that faction w might attack you." < 1294237306 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :auto-generated* < 1294237481 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294237615 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I'd play Vegas Trike. < 1294237619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You tricycle through Las Vegas. < 1294237665 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but first you have to take the desert bus to get that < 1294237672 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*there < 1294237723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: no < 1294237725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you tricycle there < 1294237756 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Desert Trike; just like Desert Bus, except you also have to pedal all the time. < 1294237794 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13YlEPwOfmk&feature=player_embedded XD < 1294238203 0 :Hilbert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Hilbert < 1294238265 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: please do this: http://phdchallenge.org/announcing-the-2011-phd-challenge < 1294238269 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thank you < 1294238312 0 :cheater99!~cheater@g230231037.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294238558 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the 320x320 castle. Should I do it? I will probably need to map edit to get a suitable terrain to put it. (Note this is for single player) < 1294238570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Map edit and I'll completely ignore any achievement. < 1294238576 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Flatten the terrain yourself. < 1294238602 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well that is not too much work, I have an almost suitable place already < 1294238616 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MWAHAHAHA MY PLAN TO MAKE VORPAL WORK FOR YEARS IS SUCCEEDING < 1294238618 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, How do you consider inventory editing? < 1294238628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Like unto Nazism. < 1294238635 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I wouldn't do it in my game at least :P) < 1294238649 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, since it will use stone and not cobble hm. < 1294238658 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 30 furnaces + bucket of lava to fuel them < 1294238671 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, 30? that's not a lot < 1294238674 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 60. < 1294238681 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :64. < 1294238686 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alright. < 1294238706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That'd get you 100 stacks of 64 stone in 17 minutes. < 1294238712 0 :Hilbert!~Hilbert@93.95.81.129 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294238714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'd need 64 lava buckets though. < 1294238765 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, 4*(320*15+320*20*2) is just the stone needed for *hollow* outer walls (well corners are counted twice, but still about that amount, probably more due to misplacing and so on) < 1294238784 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1294238795 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Using 64 furnaces with lava buckets, that'd only take 11 goes. < 1294238814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'd just leave stuff going while you work (check back on it every 6 to 10 minutes or so to add 36 more cobbles) < 1294238824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(to each) < 1294238828 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ow 70400 < 1294238847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Of course, if you have enough coal, you could just use that. < 1294238849 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, 36? < 1294238859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: A single bucket of lava will allow for smelting of 100 blocks. The largest stack of blocks is 64. Considering that each smelting operation takes 10 seconds, to maximize the efficiency of a lava bucket, place a lava bucket with 64 blocks of unsmelted material (such as sand, cobblestone, etc) and return between 6 minutes and 10 minutes 40 seconds later to remove 36 smelted blocks and insert 36 more unsmelted blocks. < 1294238874 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294238899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 lava bucket = 12.5 coal, so it may be more economical just to use coal. < 1294238901 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to hell with this, I'll downscale it a bit < 1294238909 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Furnace-wise.) < 1294238910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Lame. < 1294238926 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, actually it would be too large to see the entire thing even on far. < 1294238952 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, better to make it fully visible on far < 1294239127 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Given that the ROU could comfortably be parked there, I'm inclined to agree. < 1294239173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: not if it's all visible on far < 1294239210 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you can see across the ROU on far IIRC. < 1294239228 0 :Eva4ever!~eva_earlo@213.87.76.13 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294239230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Maybe if you stand right at the start... but not for me. < 1294239347 0 :Eva4ever!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294239433 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294239480 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001f5b00390f-CM001e6b2335dc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294239492 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well the *inner* court yard would have been 170x170. How long is ROU now again? < 1294239527 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and what even does it stand for? < 1294239530 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :200 or so. < 1294239537 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Almost exactly 200. < 1294239537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Rabbits On Underside. < 1294239556 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, ah < 1294239559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Or Rapid Offensive Unit, you decide. < 1294239593 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i was just going to wait until someone else gave an answer < 1294239687 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I am trying to figure out how that Creepy Watson thing even works. < 1294239714 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It works with the power of crappy programming. < 1294239762 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, remind me, did you play FS2 again? < 1294239884 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294239918 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, FS as in? < 1294239927 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I know of a few games called FS < 1294239927 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeSpace. < 1294239930 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, that scribblecraft thing sure is funny. < 1294239945 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, no I don't think I did. Might have been on my todo list or such. < 1294239961 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, right. < 1294239971 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what does it do? < 1294239974 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You should totally play it because it is awesome.) < 1294239982 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's that hand-drawn style 128x128 texture pack. < 1294239994 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, blame elliott. For making me play monkey island instead < 1294240003 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah < 1294240009 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Tried Tronic? :p < 1294240011 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, does it tile well? < 1294240067 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, here's my home: http://zem.fi/~fis/scribble.png < 1294240103 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, the roof window looks strange? < 1294240118 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see any roof windows there. < 1294240133 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what is the thing in the upper right corner. White < 1294240143 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's the ceiling of the door. < 1294240147 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's very near, so it's a bit blurrey. < 1294240149 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294240162 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294240168 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: haha that pumpkin looks so happey. < 1294240171 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Torches look a bit strange. < 1294240175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yaaaay ima pumpken < 1294240197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been meaning to try tiling the default textures to 256x256 sometime < 1294240201 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd look weird < 1294240210 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, except, things like pumpkins would be just scaled up ofc < 1294240240 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obsidian in scribblecraft looks rather unimpressive. Here's the obsidian road: http://zem.fi/~fis/scribble2.png < 1294240262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Purpley. < 1294240274 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1294240278 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Purpley with little stars. < 1294240279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: TRIED TRONIC? < 1294240287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the best! Kinda! < 1294240314 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not yet. I've seen screenshots. This was the first irregular-sized thing I tried. < 1294240337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: There is actually a 16x Tronic but eh, the 32x is nicer. < 1294240338 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a bit incomplete; mobs aren't scribbled, for one thing. < 1294240361 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: BTW, the instructions on the Tronic page are overcomplicated; all you need to do is check Custom Water and Lava in the HD texture fixer, and then _de-check_ Animated Water and Lava. < 1294240368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And you get Tronic's custom water/lava and the animations of those. < 1294240369 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, are you playing FS2 yet. < 1294240375 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because you SHOULD BE < 1294240383 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Animated Water/Lava actually mean "disregard the texture pack's and use the default". So you have to uncheck them.) < 1294240409 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, when I finished MI2 and MI3 sure. Why not. Which based on the schedule for the spring will be during the summer < 1294240419 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Although it's pointless to try if you don't have Better Light installed. < 1294240424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But everyone should have Better Light installed! < 1294240429 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, fine then you should play it. < 1294240432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: MI3 can be completed in less than a day. < 1294240437 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal is too busy micromanaging. < 1294240447 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes so can MI2 given a walkthrough :P < 1294240452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I mean first time. < 1294240456 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe two or three days at the most. < 1294240461 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh, well MI2 can't be that I know < 1294240473 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MI2 is a rather difficult game. < 1294240490 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I would say MI2 is harder than MI1 < 1294240495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yes. < 1294240497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tronic's sand looks like fudge. < 1294240506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Surely you've completed MI2 by now? Dinky Island is right before the end of the game. < 1294240518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless you can't get rid of LeChuck. < 1294240520 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well I haven't had time / felt like playing < 1294240545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should make that Textual Texture Pack Deewiant said. :p < 1294240554 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WATERWATERWATERWATEROBSIDIANLAVALAVALAVALAVA < 1294240586 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, PIG PIG PIG PIG PIG PIG PIG PIG PIG COW! < 1294240607 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CREEPERCREEPERCREEPERCREEPER < 1294240620 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah that has the right number of syllables. Works better < 1294240637 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TRACKMINECARTTRACKTRACKTRACKTRACKTRACK < 1294240642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TRACKTRACKMINECARTTRACKTRACKTRACKTRACK < 1294240813 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, the scribbled sun: http://zem.fi/~fis/scribble3.png < 1294240816 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not very realistic. < 1294240877 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie will you play FS2 < 1294240889 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt that. < 1294240953 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294241137 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It sounds a bit too actiony. < 1294241183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Still not helping with Cube? < 1294241336 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, haven't decided < 1294241448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: QEWB KOM HALP < 1294241528 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: CKUBE COMOE HALWEP < 1294241576 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: What is this cobbles. < 1294241624 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ? I'm not online atm. What are you talking about < 1294241634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: At the bottom left of the cube. < 1294241644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's this cobble thing blocking the way of the drainage, but it's somehow been drained further. < 1294241646 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, huh, not me < 1294241651 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Must have been. < 1294241671 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh you mean that early experiment in a different way of draining? < 1294241678 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which turned out to not work very well < 1294241681 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: What was it? < 1294241694 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, testing to see how slow draining with buckets was < 1294241701 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slow, one presumes. < 1294241722 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yep. slow, mostly due to annoying streams < 1294241785 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@17.101.89.205 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294241785 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294241785 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294241809 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1294241851 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294241932 0 :Hilbert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Hilbert < 1294242132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: What. The fuck. < 1294242145 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What? < 1294242158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I respawned inside ... some underground thing, very vertical. There were torches. < 1294242159 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What. < 1294242176 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't connect... < 1294242190 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: Stop unleashing Cthulhu. < 1294242195 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oop, I'm connecting. < 1294242910 0 :Hilbert!~Hilbert@93.95.81.129 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294243087 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no way to make an inexhaustable lava pond < 1294243090 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ghhh < 1294243149 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1294243165 0 :[tubot]!~tubot]@212.182.112.5 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294243183 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Phantom_Hoover: I respawned inside ... some underground thing, very vertical. There were torches. <-- figured it out? < 1294243222 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume it was the excavation under the cube. < 1294243305 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, *inside < 1294243526 0 :[tubot]!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294243613 0 :Hilbert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Hilbert < 1294243765 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's weird < 1294243772 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all trees on the map are burning < 1294243817 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, might be some lava close by? < 1294243834 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, and it can spread pretty easily then < 1294243857 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, probably not all trees, but all trees in that forest or such < 1294243860 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@p4FF6916F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294244485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: we're opening up some of the drainage platform to the excavation. < 1294244520 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are eggs edible? < 1294244524 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you mean that old experiment? < 1294244531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No? < 1294244531 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh wait < 1294244538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I mean the platform where torching is done. < 1294244539 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you mean you started digging down? < 1294244543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The first few columns we're opening to excavation. < 1294244550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: In fact, the excavation is only one or two blocks down from that platform. < 1294244562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PH fell to bedrock with two towers of gravel just before, and that's on the newest line. < 1294244579 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, right. Well my ISP seems to have issues atm. Google takes 20 seconds to load, when it does. on IRC I get lag spikes every few minutes. And so on. < 1294244600 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The server seems down right now anyway. < 1294244610 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and yes it is just below. Mostly due to TNT messing up the ceiling :P < 1294244646 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, originally I believe the ladder went down far enough to have a safety margin of about 5 blocks below the deepest part of the sea. < 1294244687 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Back up. < 1294244903 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ffffffffffffu < 1294244918 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exploding dick ruined my deathtrap < 1294244975 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nightmare fuel of the day: the creeper design is based off a failed pig model. < 1294245119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: just mcmaping < 1294245122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And yeah, I know. < 1294245123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*mcmapping < 1294245257 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294245462 0 :Sasha!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1294245485 0 :Sasha!~WHAT@97-124-39-220.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294245587 0 :Hilbert!~Hilbert@93.95.81.129 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294245674 0 :oklopol!~oklopol@87-95-53-16.bb.dnainternet.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1294245713 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294245718 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where the fuck is elliott < 1294245721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yo < 1294245722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol < 1294245725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm here < 1294245726 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah good < 1294245731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :am i not talking enough < 1294245733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should i talk < 1294245734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at EXTREME LEVELS < 1294245740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: did you obtain minecraft < 1294245740 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you scared me to death there < 1294245752 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i'm normally talking ALL THE TIME < 1294245758 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no. i'm still playing the version without servering < 1294245780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ffff buy it you bastard we're working on a 128x128x128 cube < 1294245785 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and we need labourers < 1294245803 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have usually said something in the five seconds after my join, and often it was not at me < 1294245812 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh cool < 1294245821 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294245847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: also we're doing it in the sea. so we have to clear like 128x128x10 of water. < 1294245854 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294245888 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've spent most of my mc time collecting mountains in boxes < 1294245924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294245930 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although tbh, since one takes about 10 hours, so i've only collected 3 sofar :D < 1294245936 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*-so < 1294245965 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clear water? < 1294245977 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Water in the ocean isn't infinite? < 1294245996 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in second life, there's infinite water < 1294246037 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In Second Life, you can't pick up water and place it elsewhere < 1294246043 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: did I mention we're using tnt < 1294246067 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't use tnt for the mountains, because i didn't have any sand < 1294246078 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after 3 mountains i realized my castle was being build AT THE FUCKING SEASHORTE < 1294246084 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: xDDD < 1294246086 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*SHORE < 1294246087 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*built < 1294246087 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck < 1294246119 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i had tons of that black stuff, maybe not enough for the whole mountain, but would've helped a lot still < 1294246120 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Water in the ocean isn't infinite? < 1294246125 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's complicated. < 1294246125 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: did i mention that we have to excavate 128x128x64 < 1294246130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: the entire underground < 1294246130 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you giving yourself that tnt? < 1294246136 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Water is renewable, but it can be removed. < 1294246141 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no, we duped it with a bug :} < 1294246144 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you did not, but i sort of assumed that < 1294246146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but we're running out < 1294246154 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what bug? < 1294246163 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: server only < 1294246168 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you could duplicate stacks using a chest < 1294246185 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: hopefully ineiros will give us a kit (hMod thing, /kit foo gives you the items in kit foo) with lots of tnt in it to help. < 1294246201 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :purely academic interest, i usually try to avoid using bugs when they are obvious coding errors < 1294246221 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm sure that's very unique of me. < 1294246231 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Notch is the worst coder. < 1294246233 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you know why it happened? < 1294246235 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294246237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: inventory was client-side. < 1294246238 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: seriously. < 1294246240 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION once used a duplication bug in an online game < 1294246245 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: clients told the server what inventory they had. and it believed them. < 1294246254 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you could also place any block you wanted, just by having your client tell the server you wanted to place that one. < 1294246263 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then gave the results to [in-game] poliically important persons < 1294246274 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Trying to increase the wealth of the cities < 1294246276 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>.> < 1294246291 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah like if i had control of the mints i would print like 1000000000000 dollar bills? < 1294246291 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then i'd be rich < 1294246296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because like Sgeo i don't understand economics < 1294246310 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Water in the ocean isn't infinite? <-- it dupes only on top of a solid block < 1294246327 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see wiki or details < 1294246348 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, did I mention this was many years ago < 1294246372 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: no you didn't < 1294246385 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you usually do that kind of stuff? i mean afaiu wow only uses the server as a database, can you cheat it? < 1294246430 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i knew this stuff in the past < 1294246432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: cheating happens solely when the server trusts the client and doesn't do computing itself. < 1294246434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is stupid. < 1294246453 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can't do the computing on the server if there are millions of players < 1294246462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: sure you can < 1294246462 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, well, in that case I just dropped the object on the ground, then clicked to pick it up multiple times before the server got around to deleting the physical object from the ground < 1294246463 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294246465 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe in something like wow < 1294246469 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not in a nontrivial game < 1294246470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: EVE Online runs mostly on a single server < 1294246473 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and it's /huge/ < 1294246476 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1294246480 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool. < 1294246487 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(there are other servers but there is only one main one for most of the world) < 1294246494 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ofc this method is expensive. < 1294246543 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need a way to prove equations automatically < 1294246552 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ping < 1294246554 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but what if the clients cheat and show the player more than they are supposed to see, like say separate distinct hues of gray more clearly < 1294246560 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pong. < 1294246570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ping mc < 1294246570 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clearly the server should send the whole stream of pictures rendered < 1294246576 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ping < 1294246586 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: what? < 1294246590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: when are you going to finish the tnt < 1294246591 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, well... it's just a game, cheating isn't the end of the world < 1294246604 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially if stopping the cheating amounts to unreasonable measures like that < 1294246639 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same think with attempting to prevent things like seeing through walls < 1294246686 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thing < 1294246779 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"LG: "Weve added internet connections washing machines refrigerators, ovens and robotic cleaners using Wi-Fi technology."" < 1294246782 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DEAR GOD WHY? < 1294246805 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, mayybe refrigerators make sense, but for the rest: DEAR GOD WHY < 1294246837 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, got lagged. < 1294246845 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DO NOT DETONATE THE CHARGE YOURSELF < 1294246858 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: there's a charge there? < 1294246865 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't see one < 1294246868 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. But don't mess with it. < 1294246875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: okay < 1294246913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: down:| < 1294247203 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did anyone play zzos game? < 1294247218 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dont' know how to kill the dragons < 1294247243 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pour water in their mouth < 1294247255 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's dogs < 1294247260 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294247271 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah sorry, i was confused because i have no idea what game this is < 1294247328 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.digitalmzx.net/wiki/index.php?title=Super_ASCII_MZX_Town < 1294247398 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do dragons drop their tail if you scare them < 1294247405 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I cannot sscare them! < 1294247413 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they just chase you like dalekes < 1294247591 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what happens if i put lava in a square container and then delete the walls? will it spill? < 1294247660 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, sources of liquids act like an infinite source of flowing liquid < 1294247665 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: yes. < 1294247669 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But there's stil finite amount of source < 1294247679 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(except with water in some cases) < 1294247685 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's like the timeless question of whether a tree will fall if no one's in the forest providing gravity < 1294247695 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;f < 1294247719 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't actually read the question < 1294247734 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm looking for a way to contain some amount of lava in the center of my trap < 1294247737 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me show you < 1294247742 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If a tree falls in a forest that's not near any object much larger than itself, does it fall? < 1294247765 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe not < 1294247766 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Sgeo, die now. < 1294247783 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294247788 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that one even i can do < 1294247859 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if two bodies are in a stable gravitational orbit does one move around the other? < 1294247948 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let G operate from the right on a set X, then the orbit of an element of x is defined as xG < 1294248267 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hate programming in haskell < 1294248322 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how does anyone do that < 1294248405 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: how? basically you write text files in a special format, then there's something called a "Compiler" that transforms your text into instructions the computer understands < 1294248427 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: That much I can do < 1294248564 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, how goes the Minecraft? < 1294248571 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a feeling that no programming language could be good enough < 1294248593 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there will always be a point where yo know the limitaions and just so happens.. every program you try to write is pushing against them < 1294248626 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ttp://i56.tinypic.com/1er9x.png < 1294248635 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is my trap (with blocked center) < 1294248658 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd like to hang some lava in the center < 1294248956 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant is becoming a little me! < 1294249052 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, no. No he isn't. < 1294249076 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant is intelligent and has a mental age >= 14. < 1294249595 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The TTP protocol; for those that consider HTTP too Hyper. < 1294249619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TTP aka Gopher < 1294249658 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: You could dig all those dry blocks in the middle one deeper, and then fill that pit with lava. < 1294249676 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TTP aka postal service. < 1294249678 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294249678 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then < 1294249684 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC the water won't spread any further even if there's a straight drop there. < 1294249685 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :loot will burn < 1294249691 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, sure. < 1294249775 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Put a piece of cactus in there instead, I guess that doesn't destroy drops? < 1294249784 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294249786 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294249789 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can;t find cacti < 1294249815 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're everywhere in desers; you could use a map-making proggie to find the nearest desert. < 1294249900 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't be sure about the "doesn't destroy items" thing, haven't done any traps. < 1294250271 0 :pumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294250318 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no deserts ;| < 1294250439 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://web.mit.edu/newsoffice/2010/fuzzy-logic-0103.html < 1294250450 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How does one go about making a nondeterministic chip? < 1294250461 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or is it deterministic, but opaque for programming purposes? < 1294250467 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: quantum? < 1294250474 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1294250529 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good point, but I doubt that that would be smaller and ... actually, I don't know if the article is referring to present day technology or not < 1294250534 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it is < 1294250666 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes to read reddit commentshttp://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/ewl83/the_surprising_usefulness_of_sloppy_arithmetic/ < 1294250700 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294250727 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294250855 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How awesome would an SNES demo that uses every special chip be? < 1294250892 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Carpilcat. < 1294250923 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Is that the result of an awesomeness overflow? < 1294250932 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no cat overflow < 1294250967 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, you mean, every single chip that can be put in the cartridge? < 1294251009 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, if so, is that even possible? < 1294251020 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes. < 1294251033 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, oh wait, it hooks it up to the system bus doesn't it? < 1294251042 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, they all hook up to the system bus. < 1294251058 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, memory mapping? < 1294251067 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or does it use other forms of addressing < 1294251093 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, except for the S-DD1, which actually hooks into the ROM address lines... < 1294251123 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: They're memory mapped. < 1294251141 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, possible issues I see are: 1) running out of memory space and/or IO addresses for all the chipsets 2) is the power supplied enough for all these chipsets? How many amps are the pins rated for? < 1294251163 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1) Shouldn't be an issue. < 1294251178 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2) Dunno. < 1294251195 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except for the S-DD1, they use like 2 or 3 addresses... < 1294251206 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It occurs to me that I have no idea how game catridges work < 1294251223 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought they were something like ROM flash memory < 1294251225 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Oh, well. I think the Super FX and SA-1 use more than that. < 1294251246 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Computing actually takes place on those? < 1294251270 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though the SA-1 and the Super FX both multiprocessing. < 1294251282 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both *do* multiprocessing. < 1294251286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: with special chips, yes. < 1294251317 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: The cartridges for *most* systems are just ROM and maybe a bank switcher, and optionally some Flash or battery-backed RAM. < 1294251331 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, for SNES that is. I don't think N64 cartridges were quite as capable for example < 1294251335 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: A handful of systems expose the system bus to the cartridge. < 1294251371 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAX0gJt-aZg < 1294251377 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is *technically* possible to have an SNES cartridge that has its own CPU and *shuts off* the console's CPU. < 1294251377 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Java goes JING JING: Deal with it. < 1294251392 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(while still using the SPC and PPU on the SNES) < 1294251414 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And there have been several SNES cartridges that added an additional CPU for the SNES. < 1294251432 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heck, there was even an actual Gameboy-on-a-cartridge for it. < 1294251910 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the only other system to really do that is the Genesis, though... < 1294251924 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(this being how the 32x was implemented.) < 1294251990 0 :Hilbert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Hilbert < 1294252135 0 :Hilbert!~Hilbert@93.95.81.129 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294252153 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose you *could* do something similar for the Atari 2600. < 1294252174 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By having the cartridge do nothing but write into the scanline buffer. < 1294252231 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(yes, it had a scanline buffer, not a frame buffer) < 1294252271 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my trap does not work :| < 1294252305 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :monsters don't get any damage from cacti, dunno why < 1294252378 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They are supposed to. < 1294252850 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :creepers seem to die < 1294252857 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not sheletons < 1294252867 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294253080 0 :comex!comex@c-67-188-10-190.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294253124 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1294253259 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294253438 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294253577 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294253609 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294253730 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294253737 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294253744 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :skeletons refuse to be hurt from caci < 1294253769 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294253782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :down? < 1294253842 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For me, at least. < 1294253873 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Back up. < 1294253959 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wants in < 1294253962 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes nuts < 1294254555 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION watches a faked house on fire vid < 1294254572 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, not faked, but it's clearly an attempt at a recreation of < 1294254908 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294254920 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294254949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294254963 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294254975 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Poor guy loses his house on YouTube, and people JUST have to make fun of him because he's an idiot < 1294255179 0 :pumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean in minecraft? < 1294255310 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1294255348 0 :pumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was such a sad video < 1294255404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*hilarious < 1294255429 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais52 < 1294255430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: < 1294255465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294255474 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pumpkin, houses can be rebuilt < 1294255481 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294255485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: why do not stop the water < 1294255514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: did you blow up a shitload of tnt or something < 1294255518 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I was climbing up it. < 1294255529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did he < 1294255530 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :confirm/deny < 1294255597 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is it just my imagination, or are you being incoherent? < 1294255602 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294255604 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION rereads < 1294255648 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For some reason, I was wrongy filtering out nicks < 1294255659 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do not stop the water did he confirm/deny < 1294255674 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a bit spillover from the game-chat, so it's hard to follow perhaps. < 1294255682 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to go eat < 1294255687 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :next project < 1294255696 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#xkcd-minecraft has a chat bridge < 1294255701 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unnecessary compiler in Haskel :-} < 1294255707 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ll < 1294255867 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ll ? < 1294255882 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294255972 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Haskell", I presume. < 1294256000 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think there's some hMod plugin for an IRC/chat channel gateway. (And of course a client-based one would be easy too.) < 1294256017 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294256187 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yes - I was missing a single l :-} < 1294256354 0 :Hilbert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Hilbert < 1294256505 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do people accidentally burn down houses in MC often? < 1294256535 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Forests more often, I think. < 1294256536 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any house that I build is likely to be about as "creative" as http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQvYJfgv2Y4 < 1294256776 0 :Hilbert!~Hilbert@93.95.81.129 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294256856 0 :zzo38_____!~zzo38@shop.freegeekvancouver.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1294256882 0 :Hilbert!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294256889 0 :zzo38_____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: You cannot kill the dragons (the other dragon took away everything you need to do so). < 1294256912 0 :zzo38_____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you can use the rule about walking out of the edges of the board, to your advantage, in this situation. < 1294256920 0 :zzo38_____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Remember this is important rule!! < 1294257107 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Another important rule: Don't set up a fireplace if your house is made of wood and you don't know what you're doing < 1294257191 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How far away does the flame need to be from anything flammable? < 1294257197 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1294257238 0 :zzo38_____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is possible to block the door so that it won't close. Also, dragons are allowed to move into lava but it is difficult to see due to red color. < 1294257287 0 :zzo38_____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And if the door doesn't close, you can walk back and forth between those two boards and step in occupied spaces. < 1294257405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294257429 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294257563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294257590 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294257603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sdfsdf < 1294257646 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1294257648 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: I don't know the rules, but the fireplace I have in my house is three blocks away sideways (and two above) the wooden floorboards. < 1294257666 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(In the bunker I also have wooden fences directly next to a fire, but I don't know if wooden fences are flammable.) < 1294257707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it down < 1294257754 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-229-118.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294257770 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There seems to be a demand for an istheesotericminecraftserverdownornot.com. < 1294257771 0 :zzo38_____!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: But don't kill BIG_MONSTER. < 1294257780 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, joy. < 1294257807 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Republican legislators in 5 different states are trying to pass laws that would "cancel automatic United States citizenship for the American-born children of illegal immigrants." < 1294257839 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294257850 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was unaware that states had the power to define citizenship even under very strict interpretations of the Constitution. < 1294257878 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rofl < 1294257890 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact, I could've sworn that "all persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside." < 1294257892 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294257894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh < 1294257896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it stil down < 1294257897 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still < 1294257906 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(source: 14th amendment, US Constitution) < 1294257906 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: no you misunderstand < 1294257925 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you forgot the 2001st Republican Amendment < 1294257936 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the one that redefines the US constitution as toilet paper < 1294257938 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, right, the one that says "FUCK YOU" < 1294257950 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I completely forgot about the "FUCK YOU" clause. < 1294257966 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see, you should read these things more often < 1294258200 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the other hand, NJ is attempting to ban full-body scanners and patdowns < 1294258207 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :suddenoutbreakofcommonsense < 1294258236 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (In the bunker I also have wooden fences directly next to a fire, but I don't know if wooden fences are flammable.) <-- I don't think so. I used them next to lava < 1294258249 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, a barrier for the lava < 1294258280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: oi, get to the cube, oklopol is helping < 1294258283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there's a huge flood < 1294258286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and we're connecting with excavation < 1294258289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ALL HANDS ON DECK < 1294258321 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wants to help :( < 1294258333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: so go and get a debit card. < 1294258384 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I still have fucked up connection < 1294258393 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: oklopol is playing from a 3g stick. < 1294258395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :man up < 1294258433 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Would it be too annoying to use a touchpad in MC? < 1294258439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: i use a trackpad < 1294258441 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, dude, I get lag spikes like 50 seconds every few minutes. Against everything. If not working tomorrow I will call the ISP. < 1294258449 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since tracepath indicates it is on their network < 1294258452 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also: Small houses don't need lighting, do they? < 1294258453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: oklopol is playing on zero to ten fps. < 1294258455 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it is closed this time of day) < 1294258458 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294258458 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: yes they do < 1294258459 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294258462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1x1x2 ones don't < 1294258466 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, since when was I him? < 1294258467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and maybe 2x2x2 < 1294258470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but 4x4x2... < 1294258536 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10fps! That's like what I used to get in SL < 1294258545 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, fucked up times < 1294258654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: donate some gravel/sand then, we're on critically low supplies < 1294258940 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTF is gravel for? < 1294258972 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay gravity-obedient structures? < 1294258974 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have you cleared all the gravel from all the chests by the railway? < 1294258989 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Hmm? < 1294258991 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: No. < 1294259001 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: It's for draining. < 1294259005 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: It's in the sea. < 1294259014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Can we have it? < 1294259023 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure < 1294259260 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: We're raiding it now. BTW, you should totes come help out. < 1294259447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: yo i can't see anychests < 1294259514 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Look closer I guess < 1294259519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: no show me to them :D < 1294259525 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1294259532 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't remember where they are, they're just by the track < 1294259542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Filled with a whole 9 gravel and lots of cobble. < 1294259565 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, most of it will be cobble. < 1294259584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: ok let me get this straight: there is more than 512 gravel we're talking about here, yes? < 1294259686 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably not that much, but there might be a few hundred < 1294259711 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't exactly count what came up. < 1294259751 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And anything and everything may have been pilfered since the digging, of course. :-P < 1294259768 0 :hiato!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1294259850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi hiato < 1294259862 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hai < 1294259882 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice to see that you're still alive, ehird < 1294259929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1294259930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :totally dead < 1294259939 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bleh, cant seem to get to voxelperfect atm, host name blah blah < 1294259944 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :csb < 1294259955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: it expired < 1294259957 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you will never get there < 1294259958 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: use esolangs.org < 1294259959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try esolangs.org < 1294259970 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoa, seriously? Heh, damn < 1294260042 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: so will you help construct the cube :P < 1294260047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: have you been addicted to minecraft yet < 1294260070 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been there a bit but not much < 1294260084 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: there = the cube? < 1294260115 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1294260126 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes, it killed my exams. Famous last words: "I'll only play minecraft for a couple of minutes." < 1294260135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: YOU SHOULD PLAY ON OUR SERVER < 1294260138 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294260146 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wutyes < 1294260150 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :address? < 1294260161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: um ask ineiros he officially handles non-Finnish administrations < 1294260165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Finns get in automatically) < 1294260180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(thanks to Finn Privilege) < 1294260180 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, ok < 1294260204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, fizzie, Vorpal, me, Phantom_Hoover, Deewiant, and oklopol are on it < 1294260210 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also technically Gracenotes but he never comes on < 1294260214 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: So, I'm not Finnish, but I think we can work things out. May I play on the minecraft server < 1294260217 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice < 1294260240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294260241 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nailor too < 1294260244 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but he isn't from here < 1294260250 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so oerjan is above minecraft then? :P < 1294260255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :absolutely! < 1294260258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: you _may_ have to get a face transplant from a Finn btw < 1294260292 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: oh, and we're wimps, so there's no monsters or health. the fact that we have a high-up transportation system in the sky might have something to do with it too < 1294260296 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: this I can live with. But, I forsee terrible puns. "You got a face transplant, oh, yeah, he didn't finnish" < 1294260312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I think it gives my face a nice finnish." < 1294260314 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would like to see this < 1294260321 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, and so on < 1294260338 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: Right now we're working on draining the sea and excavating down to bedrock so we can build a 128x128x128 cube. Out of glass < 1294260340 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*glass. < 1294260342 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lit by lava. < 1294260392 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is way. too. cool. Though, I imagine you're not nearly 1/83494th into it < 1294260403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: we've drained like 7 to 10 lines of sea so far :P < 1294260410 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: and have excavated a few pits down to bedrock < 1294260413 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah, it needs more manpower. < 1294260415 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, nicely done < 1294260427 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*mindless power < 1294260431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: we do have multiple stacks of TNT. but they're running out :D < 1294260432 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which I am happy to provide < 1294260439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(thanks, item duplication bug!) < 1294260443 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which is now fixed) < 1294260445 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294260450 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh :/ < 1294260466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but we'll see if the server can't provide us with some tnt. :p < 1294260476 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's weird < 1294260476 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: btw this is going to take something like 100k glass :D < 1294260495 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, we do it the navvy way. Spades and picks < 1294260503 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and buckets :P < 1294260506 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i tried to leave spawn point and went far into the sea < 1294260511 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: no, we're clearing the water with gravel and sand < 1294260513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cleared with torches < 1294260525 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and after 10 minutes i saw my own base < 1294260535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: xD < 1294260551 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sheesh, you guys have too much time. If only I had known sooner, I wouldn't have had that same problem < 1294260552 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's this effect on real desert < 1294260578 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when you think that you're going straight and in fact you're running in circles < 1294260603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: btw i dreamed up this cube ... and also built a previous project which is two stairs from bedrock to top altitude (never finished) < 1294260603 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm trying fo find a desert or plains < 1294260609 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because no-one's legs are equally long, supposedly < 1294260611 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i _may_ be slightly crazy for a megascale engineer < 1294260624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: how's that relevant < 1294260628 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: just a tad. < 1294260664 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: because it's the cause of the effect nooga talked about < 1294260670 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: +1 < 1294260682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: ah < 1294260709 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha! < 1294260714 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now i've got my desert < 1294260756 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what ever happened to that pascal redux of yours? < 1294260965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: i don't remember finishing it :D < 1294260974 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato, *I* started making a 200-metre long warship. < 1294260982 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : when you think that you're going straight and in fact you're running in circles <-- isn't that a bit hard to achieve in a game afaik based on rectangular blocks? < 1294261002 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: "22:49 < olsner> because no-one's legs are equally long, supposedly" :P < 1294261032 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: boat-see warship or star wars? That effects the awesomeness of the project, so answer carefully < 1294261036 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you can move in any direction < 1294261037 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ah well < 1294261061 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oklopol, tell me when you've used up the gravel and have collected all of the torched columns. < 1294261068 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato, spaceship. < 1294261081 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: umm, I'm terrible at torching. < 1294261098 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: +17EXP. Nice, that sounds pretty cool < 1294261107 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes, but I've torched several columns already. < 1294261124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: how about we finish this column and do another one and then you come and torch them < 1294261145 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato, turns out that laying the hull on a 200-metre long ellipsoid is very boring. < 1294261208 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :man I just wanna get into this server < 1294261240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros ineiros ineiros < 1294261344 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :idle : 2 days 3 hours 48 mins 50 secs < 1294261366 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not immensely promising, that < 1294261419 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1294261468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: almost out. < 1294261478 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: he never talks. :p < 1294261485 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Revving up MC... < 1294261514 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ye olde telepathic alien < 1294262830 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: /msg < 1294262949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: is it down < 1294262949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: < 1294262950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: < 1294262956 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It was < 1294262965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still feels down to me :D < 1294262983 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well I got in and now I'm falling at y = -2800 < 1294263032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Chunk loading error lol < 1294263035 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or just no chunks at all < 1294263040 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: just reconnect < 1294263048 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i found a marvelous beach but probably not far enough yet < 1294263061 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I know what it is I was just hoping it'd eventually load the chunk and bump me back up < 1294263068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: it never does < 1294263072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you're online again? < 1294263078 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no < 1294263079 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: also haven't you been walking for like 10 minutes, and passed through a large forest < 1294263083 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't get back in < 1294263091 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ? < 1294263092 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i passed through a large forest < 1294263099 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's probably fine then :P < 1294263104 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i haven't actually been walking for 10 minutes, since with my lag, i walk half the time < 1294263118 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and half the time i'm disoriented, or waiting for walking to start < 1294263119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: is the beach big < 1294263124 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno yet < 1294263127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'd wait until you hit upon a desert < 1294263127 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just know it's marvelous < 1294263128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with cacti < 1294263132 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oooh < 1294263134 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since that's like < 1294263135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :infinity sand < 1294263142 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: in fact the land you started on was desert biome < 1294263146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1294263146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back up < 1294263356 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that castle. marked up outer walls. However it is in a forest. I cleared out the future interior of the outer walls (7 thick) from anything burnable. This will be epic < 1294264082 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Daemon escaped from pentagram < 1294264766 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1294264786 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: sshc is still silent o_0 < 1294264795 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294264826 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know, the guy who came in here asking for the exact command to install... wait what again? < 1294264843 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SSH, C! < 1294264852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was not sshc < 1294264860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it was orca or something < 1294264865 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea orca < 1294264868 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who was it then? < 1294264882 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno < 1294264884 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some random guy < 1294264888 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :welp < 1294264906 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think he won't be coming here asking ubuntu tech support questions so quickly < 1294265033 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294265101 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1294265120 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294265134 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HELLO EVERYONE < 1294265656 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello sweetheart < 1294265856 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Coincidentally, for mcmap users: I pushed (a while ago, in fact) a bit experimental opengl branch, which does the map-drawing (and scaling) with opengl. It looks approximately the same and might easily have a few bugs more. < 1294266787 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294266989 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck < 1294267112 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :suddenly, there was no minecraft < 1294267181 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294267214 0 :pumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1294267249 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: wut < 1294267261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: OpenGL does scaling really badly < 1294267261 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, while I'm disconnected I might as well update mcmap. < 1294267270 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what's the key for scaling? < 1294267286 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol! < 1294267293 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: an experimental branch < 1294267296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so pulling won't get it < 1294267303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: ok so "make" should do compiling fine if you have the libs < 1294267312 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So even the SDL version doesn't have it? < 1294267314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: then _build/mcmap a322.org:25566 but you probably want options < 1294267332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: -x N scales every block times N, -s WxH shows WxH blocks at a time on the ma p window < 1294267335 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: < 1294267336 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, yeah, investigating < 1294267340 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: or if you want no map, just pass -m < 1294267352 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: page-up/page-down makes block-size one pixel larger/smaller. < 1294267355 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: scaling is just pgup/pgdown. < 1294267357 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or -x N on the command line < 1294267359 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right. < 1294267369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: anyway, once you start it, you connect to 127.0.0.1 in minecraft < 1294267375 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It's scaled in the GL_NEAREST mode, so it's just the same as the SDL scaling. < 1294267385 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No bilinear filtering or anything. < 1294267389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Hmm. Is there any reason to use OpenGL? < 1294267399 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, not much. < 1294267404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Is the code shorter or longer? :p < 1294267444 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A bit longer, but that's mostly because there's an additional layer of complexity; I render in 4x4 chunk regions into 64x64 textures and draw those on quads. < 1294267462 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'd be shorter for a simpler 16x16 textures, one per block, approach. < 1294267478 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The drawing itself is shorter, I think. < 1294267512 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the player-direction-indicator might be more accurate there. (But it's still quantized not to cause redraws for all mouse movements.) < 1294267525 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I say stick with SDL ... < 1294267531 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it's a bit pointless. < 1294267545 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It still uses SDL for input handling, anyway. < 1294267549 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, it cant seem to connect < 1294267558 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, do you actually have any plans for large-scale release of this? < 1294267562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: how did you start mcmap? < 1294267566 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I hope not, not with //goto. < 1294267569 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :./_build/mcmap a322.org:25566 < 1294267580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: did you connect with minecraft? < 1294267583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to 127.0.0.1 < 1294267605 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or "localhost"; either works. < 1294267612 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, mcmap cant connect, or at least, hasn't said anything beyond waiting for connection < 1294267625 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's "waiting for connection" when it waits for you to connect to it. < 1294267626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: yes. < 1294267629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: you have to connect to it first < 1294267632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with minecraft < 1294267644 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, yes < 1294267716 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-773, 306 < 1294267834 0 :azaq231!~derivecto@p4FF686BF.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294267857 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294268310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: is it down < 1294268360 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: oklopol < 1294268361 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I figured as much < 1294268365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294268367 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it is for me. < 1294268375 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, stop torrenting! < 1294268414 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has come to my attention < 1294268417 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that it is down. < 1294268433 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: oklopol: the server runs on the highly reliable, fast platform of "a spare computer in ineiros' house hooked up to his cable connection". < 1294268436 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back up lol < 1294268444 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :subsequently, i have pressed the disconnect button, and am currently not able to get in. < 1294268449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's back up. < 1294268451 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good to know our work is in safe hands < 1294268463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: apparently backups are even AUTOMATIC now < 1294268479 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hoorah for technology. < 1294268499 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and wit that, I must leave you all. Early (ish) morning »»», cheers < 1294268555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: loser :D < 1294268557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay bye < 1294268563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: oklopol demands an mcmap windows binary now < 1294268624 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm just building one, as it happens. < 1294268647 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: \o/ < 1294268648 0 :myndzi\!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         | < 1294268648 0 :myndzi\!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :        /'\ < 1294268706 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and by the way, thanks all for that, was rather fun. < 1294268708 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact, the only thing that's missing is getting glib's option-parsing parse the single-string WinMain command line. (Unless if there's some mingw flag that makes it use a "traditional-style" main instead of WinMain.) < 1294268719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Will the ansi colours work? :p < 1294268722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: np, hope to see you again :) < 1294268724 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and thanks elliott for helping me crack the ip < 1294268738 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tomorrow is another day, I expect < 1294268741 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I really don't think they will, and neither will the readline input, in fact. < 1294268741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: um i think you can just use main() < 1294268748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: since it's a regular "libc" < 1294268754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, i know there's readline for windows... < 1294268768 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried to use main, but it insists on having a WinMain when linked, even without the "make a GUI app" -mwindows flag. < 1294268787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: strtok or whatever then. < 1294268814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just write a normal C program with main(int argc, char **argv), and < 1294268815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then for full Unicode file names use wchar_t strings and the wide char < 1294268815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :versions of the Win32 API explicitly. < 1294268816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :--mingw lists < 1294268819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Clearly main() works. < 1294268825 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it doesn't. < 1294268834 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/usr/lib/gcc/i586-mingw32msvc/4.4.4/../../../../i586-mingw32msvc/lib/libmingw32.a(main.o):(.text+0x85): undefined reference to `_WinMain@16' < 1294268838 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: What command line? < 1294268855 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i586-mingw32msvc-gcc -o mcmap [list of .os] [list of libs] < 1294268870 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe it should be mcmap.exe, actually, but anyhow. < 1294268898 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jokojokojokojokojoko < 1294268936 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :surely you're joking < 1294268962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Statically linking perchance? < 1294269018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ? < 1294269029 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meh, the prebuild mingw dev packages for SDL and glib only have DLL link-stubs. Anyway, I'll just g_strsplit, and wonder about that later. < 1294269044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I meant, are you. < 1294269050 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because googling suggests that might be problematic. < 1294269059 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, no. < 1294269115 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A "console" app should use the normal main; maybe I'm just using the wrong flag for that. < 1294269134 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: are you sure -mwindows won't help here < 1294269172 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pretty sure; that's what supposed to turn it from console app mode to GUI app mode, which definitely uses a WinMain. < 1294269480 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okkay. < 1294269486 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It will need some DLLs to run, I think. < 1294269502 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Zip 'em up? oklopol is supremely lazy. < 1294269518 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I will. A moment more. < 1294269639 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294269765 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Oklupdate: he's in a hole. < 1294269802 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GRAA froggin glib, it wants also gettext and zlib runtimes. (I linked zlib in statically in mcmap, but, well, apparently that was pretty useless.) < 1294269850 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least GTK folks package those up for me; combining. < 1294269852 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1294270039 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ wine ./mcmap.exe < 1294270039 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Usage: < 1294270039 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : mcmap.exe [OPTION...] host[:port] < 1294270042 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay, progress. < 1294270046 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's see if it actually does work. < 1294270073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: wine testing :-D < 1294270117 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it said "starting up", made a window, then hung up... < 1294270132 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course that might be just a Wine thing. < 1294270140 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Try it with nomap? < 1294270181 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@p4FF685C6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294270188 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it connected. < 1294270192 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that seems to be about it. < 1294270199 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe //coords wasn't a good idea, though. < 1294270208 0 :azaq231!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294270217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Why not. < 1294270263 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, um. < 1294270277 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It connected, worked, then crashed when I //goto'ed to 100 100 in order to test it. < 1294270289 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :** < 1294270289 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GLib-GIO:ERROR:gsocket.c:2347:remove_condition_watch: assertion failed: (g_list_find (socket->priv->requested_conditions, condition) != NULL) < 1294270289 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err:mmtime:TIME_MMTimeStop Timer still active?! < 1294270296 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This all could be more Wine things, of course. < 1294270334 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: If you want to try, http://zem.fi/~fis/mcmap-win.zip -- I'd give it about 8% odds of actually working. < 1294270356 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-1139, 737 < 1294270402 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unzip to a folder, then open a command prompt there and run "mcmap -m serverhost:port" for the more-likely-to-work nomap mode. < 1294270408 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: did it actually work. < 1294270417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: < 1294270420 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ^^ //goto time < 1294270427 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I guess I shouldn't bother censorshipping the host:port since elliott already blabbed it on-channel. < 1294270431 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm? < 1294270435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I did NOT < 1294270445 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: that was hiato < 1294270448 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : hiato: then _build/mcmap a322.org:25566 but you probably want options < 1294270449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i did but ages ago < 1294270453 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, you did NOT? < 1294270455 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: he said it before me. < 1294270457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1294270459 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1294270467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: it's been mentioned like 5 times now. < 1294270477 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, the CAT's out of the BAG, anyhow. < 1294270585 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess ineiros can always go to the whitelist-based approach for server administratamation. < 1294270594 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, "Bukkit will be superseding hMod. Once Bukkit is ready, hMod will no longer be updated." < 1294270608 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Bukkit. < 1294270613 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I no longer have an interest in Minecraft, so this change is for the best." < 1294270645 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Oh, dramahe. < 1294270647 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MWAHAHAHA NOW I KNOW YOUR SERVER < 1294270657 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: but... you have Norw Privilege. < 1294270659 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :until i forget again < 1294270675 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: hey0 seems to be rather ... fed up with minecrafters < 1294270679 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minecraft scene is so lively; people get into the "no longer have an interest" phase already, and the game has just barely reached (official) "beta". < 1294270736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I think it's code for "I hate you motherfuckers". < 1294270746 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: He stopped reading and posting to the hMod thread on minecraftforums, after all. < 1294270750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Ages ago.) < 1294270814 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bukkit project seems to be at least more enterprisey, which is always a good thing. < 1294270817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Update: oklopol has somehow managed to get to Wonders of the World by accident. < 1294270825 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: He started west of the Cube. < 1294270829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Then tried to get back. < 1294270835 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently this meant he ended up in the far north. < 1294270837 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They have buzzwordy paragraph headings and all in the description. < 1294270927 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"performance, ease-of-use, extreme customisability and better communication between the Team and, you, our users" "unique perspective and advantage" "integrated plugin management system" "philosophy of caring for our community and our users" ... < 1294270972 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And, well, oklopol's always been a real go-getter, I'm not surprised he got all the way to the North. < 1294271017 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: BY ACCIDENT. < 1294271023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: He must have walked around the cube in a gigantic circle. < 1294271385 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :augur[food] < 1294271398 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: please tell me you actually play mc < 1294271525 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That sounds hilariously unlikely. < 1294271569 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd be great though < 1294271578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my brain would be permanently confused < 1294271593 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, and after all oko does too, and *his* nick starts with an o also. < 1294271609 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294271629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoa < 1294271694 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, oerjan and oklopol start with the same letter? < 1294271698 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an ø is not an o! < 1294271714 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But an o is an o. < 1294271726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: do YOU play minecraft < 1294271729 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gah, don't make me URLencode those os to see if they're both the same < 1294271731 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no < 1294271741 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't want to pay for it, and don't want to pirate it either < 1294271746 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And 0["oerjan"] == 'o'. < 1294271757 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They were the same. < 1294271780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: also want time left in day to do things? :P < 1294271807 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ? < 1294271816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: minecraft eats up all free time. < 1294271820 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294271823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like WoW, but actually fun < 1294271826 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have other things to eat up my free time < 1294271837 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which are also actually fun, but not /that/ similar to WoW < 1294271850 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote a new Enigma level this morning, for instance, and spent over 4 hours solving it < 1294271853 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as I was thinking about it the wrong way < 1294271947 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1294271982 0 :augur[food]!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :augur < 1294272050 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: down? < 1294272059 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess < 1294272064 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you get my msg < 1294272069 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm in ineiros' hole < 1294272073 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :noticed its entrance < 1294272076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: WHY DID YOU GO IN THERE AGAIN < 1294272079 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: climb up the stairs < 1294272082 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use F3 to get to -200 < 1294272087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then go to 1000 < 1294272089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the other coord < 1294272092 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back up < 1294272093 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i figured it's faster to go from there than walk to spawn < 1294272101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is < 1294272104 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but falling in it does not help < 1294272106 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that's why i went there < 1294272108 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nono < 1294272116 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was walking on the tracks < 1294272116 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294272122 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and noticed the entrance to ineiros' hole < 1294272123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohh right < 1294272126 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stairs then < 1294272144 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's painfully obvious < 1294272146 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to notice < 1294272624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: be there in a second < 1294272907 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learn you a Haskell is amazing < 1294273330 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294273334 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Can you please give oklopol a lesson in basic navigation. He is worse at it than me. < 1294273370 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Or at least, I don't believe I could be within short-(or-maybe-normal)-viewing-range of the cube, go into the sea right next to it, claim to see nothing, and then become completely out of sight for someone on far 30 seconds later. < 1294273374 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no i'm not < 1294273388 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes you are < 1294273395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i'm terrible at navigation < 1294273496 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, i am not < 1294273569 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not the guy to ask, since I'd lose my own head without having it shown on a mcmap window. < 1294273645 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: is it down again. < 1294273650 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think so < 1294273668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no more < 1294274539 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@bas5-toronto47-1167928546.dsl.bell.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1294275496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: is it down again? < 1294275511 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: 'Tis. < 1294275525 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno dunno < 1294275530 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think so < 1294276714 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1294276887 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@209.59.220.33 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294277153 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294277215 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night → < 1294277383 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1294277411 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is it possible to change mcmap from using // to something else? I was going to try out this hmod plugin on my local test server: http://forum.hey0.net/showthread.php?tid=94 < 1294277415 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it uses // < 1294277416 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems < 1294277436 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perfectly possible but I like // and I'm not changing it. Grep the source or convince fizzie. :p < 1294277454 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, right, I assume it is just one place to change it? Some define or such < 1294277472 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, if not I could make a patch that makes it just a define to change it. Would you accept that? < 1294277483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wouldn't, but fizzie might. i certainly wouldn't like it if the usage messages < 1294277486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :got a hideous define in them < 1294277501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Code/mcmap/main.c: && p->bytes[3] == '/' && p->bytes[4] == '/') < 1294277501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Code/mcmap/world.c: if (t >= 3 && p[0] == '/' && p[1] == '/') < 1294277501 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well what about a command line option then < 1294277504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those are the two places to change. < 1294277510 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :making that a strcmp would be irritating. < 1294277537 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wouldn't need to be strcmp. The first char would always be /. It would just be a case of changing the second char < 1294277552 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but what if I wanted my prefix to be "^å"? < 1294277554 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and I agree that // is a good default. < 1294277573 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, then you could patch the source. / is very commandy after all :) < 1294277588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: if it was just a define to change the second char, and you left the usage messages saying //foo no matter what to simplify the code, sure, i'd apply it < 1294277604 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the messages, aren't they just strings < 1294277607 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you got any spare torches? ph has ours in his inventory i think and we need to torch sand. < 1294277610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes. < 1294277610 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm wait you would need to stringify < 1294277614 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be annoying < 1294277620 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even if you did < 1294277621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#define char / < 1294277622 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck C < 1294277629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294277631 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, sounds like a bad idea ;P < 1294277640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: got any spare torches? < 1294277647 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any #define char sounds bad < 1294277650 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, define spare < 1294277656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: to use for torching. < 1294277660 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i already asked that < 1294277670 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can have them back when ph gives us our torches back. < 1294277691 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well no, I carry the raw resources around. I don't carry more than a handful of actual torches < 1294277700 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I can't login atm. elliott you can have them tomorrow < 1294277711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: right, well, it's kind of a pressing need. < 1294277713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie? < 1294277713 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway, surely you found a shitload of coal by now? < 1294277722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: uh why i've been working on the cube < 1294277726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would we find coal < 1294277732 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, when digging below it? < 1294277745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: tnt. < 1294277750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :excavation is on hold until tnt kit anyway < 1294277754 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ecological practices would eliminate your need for coal! < 1294277757 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>.> < 1294277758 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm < 1294277770 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: got a better way to remove long columns of gravel/sand? < 1294277787 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but this makes no sense. those are reused < 1294277795 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ph has them in his inventory, as i said. < 1294277800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why can't you log in now < 1294277803 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, tell him to hand it back? < 1294277808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's offline < 1294277809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :duh < 1294277811 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I get route not found :P < 1294277819 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, my internet *is* screwed up < 1294277822 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you tried in the last hour < 1294277829 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I tried after you asked me < 1294277832 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how do you use coal to do that? < 1294277834 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just above < 1294277837 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, like 2 minutes ago < 1294277841 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: you use torches. < 1294277868 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway don't you have a stack of coal and a stack of logs in your inventory? < 1294277873 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no. < 1294277901 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION decides to use /7 for mcmap < 1294277913 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how? < 1294277942 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"**Torches can be placed on the block if fast graphics is on. Switching to fast graphics, placing the torch and then switching back to fancy will not remove the torch. < 1294277942 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" < 1294277944 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTF < 1294277970 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, it can be placed on leaves in both now I think < 1294277976 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, that bit should be updated < 1294277987 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why was there ever a difference? < 1294277992 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Notch quality coding/ < 1294277996 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294277997 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, handled as glass < 1294278002 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably < 1294278014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: buy the fucking game and come do our drudge work for us < 1294278062 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@209.59.220.33 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294278364 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I first parsed that as "fucking-game" < 1294278381 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal's turning into me! < 1294278386 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"do all the fucking for us, we'll handle the interesting stuff" < 1294278422 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, i didn't get that far before backtracking though :P < 1294278488 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: lol < 1294278553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: back up < 1294279090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294279101 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can one of my female buddies come on the server < 1294279254 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, ask ineiros? < 1294279266 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's who i'm asking mainly < 1294279350 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Be prepared to wait a while for the answer, also. < 1294279413 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1294281401 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, there? < 1294281421 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: stopped playing already < 1294282236 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294283503 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PHRASE O' THE DAY: "Spices is arsenic, dude!" < 1294283646 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE WIN < 1294283649 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOD, THE WIN < 1294283738 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...is there some reference i'm not getting :D < 1294283836 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: No, it's just freaking hilarious and winsome. < 1294284155 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is a reference, but it's way too "in-joke" to just me and some people in PDX :P < 1294284245 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"PDX can refer to Portland, Oregon" < 1294284271 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And does! < 1294284281 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION vaguely recalls Gregor is from there but swats him for the obscure acronym nevertheless -----### < 1294284297 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not an acronym, it's an international airport code :P < 1294284314 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same shit < 1294284397 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: But it doesn't expand to anything. < 1294284415 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just a pointer to the airport in Portland, Oregon. < 1294284416 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmph < 1294284421 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night → < 1294284422 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, and other people who've seen your Facebook statuses? < 1294284433 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Even without the in-joke-ness, it's pretty winsome. So. < 1294284437 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : It's not an acronym, it's an international airport code :P <-- no? < 1294284446 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, the international ones are 4-letters < 1294284449 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not 3-letters < 1294284530 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No. < 1294284534 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, nope < 1294284536 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are all 3 < 1294284541 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: There's multiple airport codes, and multiple international airport codes. < 1294284548 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, ICAO < 1294284559 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, it is the widely used one < 1294284563 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wants to play Minecraft multiplayer NAO < 1294284565 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294284567 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294284567 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: IATA is also an international airport code that is widely used. < 1294284580 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: And Portland has PDX. < 1294284591 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, "Most countries use ICAO codes, not IATA codes, in their official aeronautical publications." < 1294284593 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from wikipedia < 1294284616 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The US, to be contrary, uses its own. < 1294284629 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, thus I forgotten about IATA because you never see it used widely < 1294284632 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, typical of us :-} < 1294284656 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most of the time, but not always, it's identical to the IATA code, but the FAA code is completely distinct. < 1294284715 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, ICAO is way way more common than IATA < 1294284777 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except in the US, where FAA which is usually identical to IATA is more common. < 1294284783 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because we hate you. < 1294284784 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294284796 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, not for international flights though :P < 1294284822 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't remember the flight codes used on my last international flight, so I can't say. < 1294284842 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I meant for navigation and so on. I don't care about luggage :P < 1294284878 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, for navigation... English is the used language. Because we hate you. :P < 1294284895 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, well it is in many fields < 1294284906 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OUR HATRED IS VAST! < 1294284921 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, ta det språk som jag använde nyss till exempel. < 1294284931 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :engelska igen < 1294284937 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, och så vidare! < 1294284955 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :その言語がとても変だ。 < 1294284955 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(try google translate, it will probably be hilarious) < 1294284960 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/Minecraft/comments/ewr1a/so_i_have_a_new_way_to_play_minecraft/c1bkh2k < 1294284961 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :英語だけ! < 1294284965 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, touche < 1294285004 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Take the language that I used recently for example. English again. And so on! < 1294285019 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is astoundingly close to being comprehensible. < 1294285048 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I bet machine translation between Germanic languages is easier than the general case. < 1294285094 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : http://www.reddit.com/r/Minecraft/comments/ewr1a/so_i_have_a_new_way_to_play_minecraft/c1bkh2k <-- tried that on smaller scale < 1294285103 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, not necc. using google's algorithms < 1294285113 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, as in, a few minutes in nether and then 4-5 hours to trek home < 1294285122 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, for most language parsing based translators you would be right < 1294285134 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, 4-5 HOURS? < 1294285136 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but Google does not parse the language in order to translae < 1294285137 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o.O < 1294285140 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Take the language that I used recently for example. English again. And so on! <-- quite indeed < 1294285145 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, it made perfect sense < 1294285160 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Presumably because even just naively "translating" the words verbatim would get you in the ballpark. < 1294285181 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, yes. There was a huge lake in the way and some pretty sights. And the terrain was very uneven. < 1294285188 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I read a few whitepapers on how google does translation < 1294285194 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, I could probably have managed 1-2 hours if I had rushed < 1294285203 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, yeah, Google's is statistical based on its crawling, isn't it? < 1294285208 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, yes < 1294285226 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1294285228 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they take "known good" translations (such as wikipedia) < 1294285263 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and use some very interesting models to figure out which _phrases_ translate roughly to other phrases < 1294285268 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and use those < 1294285278 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ie: google does NOT know which words are nouns and which verbs < 1294285313 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And that's why you get hilarious translations from it sometimes. < 1294285320 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC something like Venice → New York. < 1294285354 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, one of the funniest things to do is to translate from Eng -> French -> Eng -> French -> Eng ... < 1294285368 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, leads to curios results sometimes. Such as "the official denied any knowledge of" turning into "the official denied not knowing anything about" (approx) once when I translated from Norwegian to Swedish. < 1294285405 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, and that was not iterative < 1294285439 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, you can "correct" the translations and over time Google will learn the new phrases < 1294285450 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, other known ones: inch -> cm. TT -> AP (TT is a Swedish news agency, AP is a completely different one) < 1294285471 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right: also km -> mile < 1294285475 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, yep < 1294285486 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because google doesn't know what it is translating < 1294285500 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, now I just hope they don't do sv:mil -> en:mile. Because a Swedish mile is 10 km < 1294285502 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it only knows that the two phrases occur at the right places in multiple documents < 1294285527 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is even more off than km < 1294285530 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That probably depends on time period. < 1294285543 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, eh? what does? < 1294285552 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, oh, length of mile < 1294285556 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I meant modern mile < 1294285571 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, as you might say "it is 10 mile to that city" or such < 1294285576 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`translatefromto no sv Tjenestemannen benektet ethvert kjennskap til < 1294285591 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, hackego not here < 1294285596 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. Actually, the traditional Swedish mil unit was actually close to 10 km. < 1294285598 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :darnit < 1294285610 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, possibly. I'm no history expert. < 1294285612 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone here speak Norwegian ? < 1294285618 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, yes oerjan < 1294285620 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :According to Wikipedia, that is. < 1294285635 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Yeah, Ørjan. < 1294285637 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, but a modern Swedish mil is 10 km < 1294285646 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, oooh perfect < 1294285651 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Instead of 10,688 m. < 1294285656 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, hah < 1294285663 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: that was just attempting to reconstruct Vorpal's example < 1294285664 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(11,295 m in Norway) < 1294285666 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, how do you pronounce ø ? < 1294285666 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, there were different mil iirc < 1294285677 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, like, for different purposes < 1294285690 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That was the, ah, "land mile" or "long mile". < 1294285702 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, travel by coach-mil I think? < 1294285708 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, vs. a few other land ones < 1294285710 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, if you can give me a good recording to listen to that would be awesome! < 1294285712 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I bet you had stuff like the nautical mile as well, and of course the statue mile. < 1294285716 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Statute, I mean. < 1294285722 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, statue, could be it < 1294285726 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also - anyone here speak Persian ? < 1294285729 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: low frontal rounded. also i have no microphone. < 1294285758 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or possibly mid frontal rounded, somewhere around there < 1294285758 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, don't you pronounce it like ö? < 1294285758 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The statute mile being, of course, 1,609.344 m. < 1294285766 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(because eff you) < 1294285772 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, hah < 1294285786 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, what was the point of statue mile? < 1294285799 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://dl.dropbox.com/u/11847921/Images/Games/Minecraft/screenshots/Heatsink.jpg why isn't the water flowing? < 1294285805 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: pretty close yes, i'm sure there is _some_ difference... < 1294285811 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Defined by Act of Parliament! < 1294285825 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, yes but why < 1294285850 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, ok cool < 1294285850 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, proably it flows down due to hole? < 1294285856 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To define a standard system of measurements across Her Majesty's Realm. < 1294285859 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, check wiki for rules on water < 1294285909 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, nice building though < 1294285919 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, and it is flowing. Right down < 1294285969 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I saw you the first time < 1294286000 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, ? < 1294286012 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You didn't need to repeat yourself < 1294286017 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The US, to be contrary, also has the survey foot. < 1294286017 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't < 1294286020 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And related units. < 1294286035 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which are *almost* identical. < 1294286095 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :God, I hate the US's units. < 1294286104 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, me too < 1294286112 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{ and I'm from the US } < 1294286118 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: As am I. < 1294286130 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, wherefrom? < 1294286139 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, relevant page is http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Fluids < 1294286146 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Near Colorado Springs, CO. < 1294286162 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I'm from the center of the world: New York :-} < 1294286172 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, sure, be near population. :P < 1294286219 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well. I suppose I'm near population. One of the few regions of population density in, oh, the surrounding few-hundred-kilometer radius. < 1294286289 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My dad's claiming that with my study habits, I would not have survived at a decent college, and it's the post-graduate college that matters anyway < 1294286307 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, grad school matters the most < 1294286319 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, curious - which uni are you in? < 1294286323 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seriously, the nearest place of notable population going west is a 920 kilometer drive... < 1294286329 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SUNY Farmingdale < 1294286340 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, I'm in SUNY Binghamton :-) < 1294286340 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where the professors are idiots, the students are idiots < 1294286345 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, east. < 1294286366 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :West, it's... 967 km. < 1294286376 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, you could probably transfer around the SUNYs fairly easily < 1294286380 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, wow. 96 mil < 1294286383 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, that's long < 1294286396 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The US is freaking huge, and the west is sparsely populated. < 1294286405 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, taking Computer Programming/Information Systems, need to work out if it's viable to do CS at Stony Brook for post-grad < 1294286433 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, it is like 200 km to Stockholm from here... And I consider that far. Well not as far as going to north Sweden. < 1294286446 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Look at a map of the US on Google Maps. Realise that that's about the size of Europe. < 1294286457 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, very true < 1294286503 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For me to go to the capital of the US would be a 28 hour trip driving straight... < 1294286515 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2,663 km. < 1294286544 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, take the sleeper train. Oh wait. < 1294286573 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I'm in the real capital of the US..... if I wanted to go to the political capital on the other hand..... < 1294286590 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: You could actually take a train there. < 1294286602 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION suddenly wants to build a huge automatic elevator < 1294286611 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, yes, I'm aware. I was joking about NY being the captial < 1294286622 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Including automatic rests for breathing as needed < 1294286645 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Well, it is the *largest* city in the US. < 1294286678 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, see pm again < 1294286701 0 :Sasha2!~WHAT@97-124-39-220.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294286765 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, you mean boatlevator? < 1294286774 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, there are other kinds? < 1294286786 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, no breathing rests required. Even when going from bottom to top of map < 1294286790 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, it is too fast for that < 1294286796 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh < 1294286818 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Awwww, I wanted to build breathing rests < 1294286821 0 :Sasha!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294286823 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, you could try out the one I have at my place on the server. When you buy the game and ineiros let you on < 1294286825 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Remove the ceiling! < 1294286830 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, it goes nearly to the top < 1294286848 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it is automated < 1294286851 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it's a loop) < 1294286862 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it is alt 4 -> alt 110 or something like that < 1294286991 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4pDe7CKGgWA&feature=related actually says that it's the need to collect resources that makes MC interesting < 1294286992 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh < 1294287067 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Person doesn't know how to make scaffolds < 1294287162 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o.O < 1294287181 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, actually, I guess that works < 1294287181 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a customary US fluid ounce and a food nutrition labelling US fluid ounce. < 1294287187 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, boat loop is simple < 1294287191 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably better, too. Easy to remove < 1294287201 0 :azaq231!~derivecto@p4FF691D7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294287209 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I'm talking about the method this person is using to get back up when he fell < 1294287210 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The customary once is *defined as* 29.5735295625 mL. The labelling one is 30 mL. < 1294287212 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, it you come on the server tomorrow I can show you < 1294287227 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3:13 < 1294287228 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/once/ounce/ < 1294287236 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, no chance I'll get MC by tomorrow < 1294287333 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, in my method that is no issue. You dig two spiral staircases down. one 2x2, one 2x3. Separated by 5 blocks. then connect them at the bottom . Close up top of 2x3. Place water along the far edge. Fix bottom end of loop (this is hardest). Remove stairs in the holes, starting from top. Finally Open up top of 2x3 so water can flow down as well < 1294287440 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1294287722 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It will be possible to use redstone to have music blocks play, right?/ < 1294287768 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, as far as I heard yes < 1294287798 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, anyway I prefer a larger loop variant < 1294287807 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1294287810 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, more reliable, more time to get out and in of < 1294287861 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, besides in total it needs 2x5 digging, not 2x9. Though the 2x5 is spread out into two separate holes with some distance in between < 1294288170 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No elevators on the Reddit servers < 1294288174 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Water is banned) < 1294288183 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm < 1294288201 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What happens if you use lava (not banned) and accidentally start a forest fire? < 1294288323 0 :bsmntbombdood!~gavin@c-24-9-98-117.hsd1.co.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294288702 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Is the current vocab system the final system that will be in Factor 1.0? < 1294288702 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : yes < 1294288709 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know why I bothered to ask < 1294288720 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, shutup shat up! < 1294288749 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, "shat" is almost certainly not .. does "shut" as a past tense work? < 1294288854 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/shut < 1294288912 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294289044 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo < 1294289821 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a programming language with *portals*... that would be interesting < 1294289874 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314, oooooooooshowme < 1294289892 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION falls in love with a possibly not yet existent language < 1294289895 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>.> < 1294289936 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, it's nonexistent so far < 1294290040 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :might be useful for distributed programming < 1294290049 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1294290280 0 :bsmntbombdood!~gavin@c-24-9-98-117.hsd1.co.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294290488 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :curses, there's already a portal programming language: http://www.google.com/search?tbo=1&tbs=bks%3A1&q=editions%3Aeqevfg0_XtQC < 1294290554 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I should call it "Portal 2" < 1294290814 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION falls in love with PORTAL < 1294290883 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm < 1294290892 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why haven't I heard of PORTAL before? < 1294291868 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1294292222 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's an esoteric research language that nobody uses? < 1294292344 0 :azaq231!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1294292735 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: I do believe this is #esoteric. < 1294292744 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Esoteric languages are sort of our thing. < 1294292949 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294294461 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294294584 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION chuckles at r/circlejerk's latest antics < 1294294606 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-221-26.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294294665 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/circlejerk/comments/ewmac/for_every_500_upvotes_this_submission_gets_i_will/ < 1294294672 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AFAICT, PORTAL was meant to be a practical language < 1294294879 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.theonion.com/articles/who-was-i-and-why-was-i-important-again,18715/?utm_souce=popbox this is what elliott wants me to be < 1294295104 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still love that the US's national anthem is originally a drinking song. < 1294295323 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mythbusters sez: Sneeze into your elbow. < 1294295404 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq says: next performance of the US national anthem, be sure to sing "To Anacreon in Heav'n, where he sat in full glee" ... < 1294296620 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I should just sneeze on the nearest hatted person < 1294297323 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294297836 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1294298574 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1294299378 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION suddenly realizes the obvious reason that shutup wasn't talking < 1294299396 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Shut up about shutup! < 1294299399 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^^not real < 1294299404 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which was? < 1294299414 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, elliott not being online to run the bot < 1294299426 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. < 1294299429 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And updog's presense here disproves my theory < 1294299429 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1294299444 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless... shutup gets its cues from elliott's client < 1294299454 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm i thought it could be updog too... < 1294299454 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1294299459 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Factor < 1294299467 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shutup is, in fact, awake < 1294299484 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you got a response? < 1294299486 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1294299496 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't know why I didn't get a response earlier < 1294299500 0 :ChanServ!unknown@unknown.invalid MODE #esoteric :+o oerjan < 1294299509 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Is the current vocab system the final system that will be in Factor 1.0? < 1294299515 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294299523 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Factor 1.0? < 1294299523 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1294299533 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Factor < 1294299536 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AW < 1294299538 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Smalltalk < 1294299545 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No responses < 1294299556 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Active Worlds < 1294299560 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid MODE #esoteric :-o oerjan < 1294299576 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION glares at the kicked updog menacingly < 1294299584 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, at least we know that oerjan kicks dogs < 1294299632 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So yeah, updog feeds shutup < 1294299862 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So now you can speak freely! < 1294299870 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1294299962 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Got yet another Spam IM with a suspicious message < 1294299968 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This time, I plan on clicking < 1294299971 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[in a VM] < 1294299978 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION downloads TinyCore < 1294300274 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now, as soon as I figure out how to install a browser on this thing < 1294300799 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1294300800 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1294300948 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION gets it working < 1294300970 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a thing claiming to give a free Blackberry Torch < 1294301629 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Started lagging out :/ < 1294301641 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also started fearing that maybe Freenode decided I was a spammer or somesuch < 1294301649 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you expect to get from it? < 1294301680 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, was expecting malware or ... what do those fake contest things DO, exactly? < 1294301702 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really know either < 1294302065 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294302092 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294303967 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Specker_sequence < 1294306749 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ilua < 1294308576 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294313880 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294313901 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294314353 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294315095 0 :cheater99!~cheater@e181139241.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294315529 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294315532 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294315801 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's distressing that I couldn't figure out how to change the resolution in SLAX < 1294315802 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::/ < 1294315827 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your FACE is distressing. < 1294315836 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As is your blood furry costume. < 1294315962 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://tinymelinux.com/doku.php/download#bittorrent-recommended < 1294315970 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see a torrent on that page < 1294315972 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTF < 1294316258 0 :cheater99!~cheater@g231050251.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294316374 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :VirtualBox is beginning to piss me off < 1294317567 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimplyMEPIS has THREE seeders < 1294317567 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least it's not doing anything unexpected < 1294317570 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's depressing < 1294317586 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even f****n JOLICLOUD has more < 1294317588 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's simplymepis? (i can't use the web right now) < 1294317595 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linux distro < 1294317606 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is it relevant? < 1294317619 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because I'm exploring Linux distros right now < 1294317643 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or.. did you mean for this channel? < 1294317650 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i meant for this conversation < 1294317655 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what have you found to be noteworthy so far? < 1294317674 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The download hasn't finished yet < 1294317692 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you may have tried other linuces < 1294317703 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SLAX is still using KDE 3.something < 1294317720 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Saw something in the forums suggesting that it doesn't have latest ntfs-3g or somesuch < 1294317731 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1294317737 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anything else? < 1294317740 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TinyCore boots up REALLY FRIGGEN FAST < 1294317751 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean as far as *interesting* things, not "things that ubuntu does easily" < 1294317753 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh ok < 1294317753 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool < 1294317770 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :keep goin < 1294317771 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1294317850 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've decided that my honeymoon with VirtualBox is over. < 1294317854 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what other distros have you tried? < 1294317857 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm about to download VMWare Server < 1294317886 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Recently, or in the past? < 1294317893 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :recently < 1294317923 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Um, just TinyCore and SLAX < 1294317927 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to me it feels like most distros try and fail at copying several of the big ones < 1294317933 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slackware, gentoo, debian/ubuntu < 1294317937 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :redhat < 1294318231 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dear VMWare: I live in Schenectady. Love, Sgeo. < 1294318248 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Note: I do not live in Schenectady] < 1294318290 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you got em so tricked < 1294319173 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They do seem to check that the city you put in is real < 1294319188 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't test whether or not it requires the matching ZIP code < 1294319203 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I put in 12345, which is for General Electric in Schnectady < 1294319305 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, why on earth would you try this many distros? < 1294319329 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To find one I like! < 1294319367 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What don't you like about every major one? < 1294319392 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION misparsed that at first < 1294319426 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Relatively stupid stuff, mostly < 1294319461 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only one I ever HATED that I can remember is Linux XP < 1294319474 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, "major" < 1294319791 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why does VMWare Server feel a need to download a Java Runtime Environment? < 1294319805 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :VirtualBox maybe I'd understand < 1294319823 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wants to shoot Su.. oh wait, Oracle did that and is now being evil < 1294320886 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294321241 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294321392 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294321437 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So: VMWare Server now makes your computer into a server, and the UI is a webpage < 1294321442 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why didn't I see this coming? < 1294321672 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, because visibility inside your blood fursuit is poor. < 1294321698 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION restarts XChat to get the bloody thing to register my default nick changes. < 1294321701 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1294321722 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294321799 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm pretty sure pikhq warned me about this, but I ignored him because I thought he was talking about crappy internal architecture < 1294321957 0 :cheater99!~cheater@e181138159.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294322676 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294322703 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294323464 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1294323848 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@d83-183-183-70.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1294323851 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294323851 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294323886 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294324223 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294324344 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294324426 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1294324537 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION lols at the existence of ipv6-literal.net < 1294325114 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@p4FF691D7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294325745 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-6-114.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294325963 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, there? < 1294326006 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, a question about mcmap: does water really block tp? Because when you ended up sub-surface in an unloaded chunk tp out of there would be /very/ useful < 1294326105 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294326223 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it doesn't. < 1294326232 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll fix that thing at some point. < 1294326234 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294326279 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how's that win version coming < 1294326322 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would be nice to get home, i managed to convince myself i had a way to look at coordinates as much as i like, and decided to take a random walk < 1294326341 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, you can use f3 to see coords < 1294326341 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then turns out once i started using my great idea, i had a constant amount of look-ups :D < 1294326345 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no you can't < 1294326350 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, what? < 1294326351 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or you can, 5 times in a game < 1294326362 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, not you confused me < 1294326365 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now* < 1294326374 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a red square goes on top of the numbers < 1294326384 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, ah yes, I heard that was a problem on smaller screens < 1294326385 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You just have a too small window. < 1294326386 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grows < 1294326399 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, the graph thingy I assume? < 1294326403 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :too small resolution more like < 1294326421 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, it is fine with a maximised window on my 24" desktop monitor ;) < 1294326423 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyhows, I don't know about the win binary, did it not work? < 1294326435 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as i said, this is a very old crt < 1294326447 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i didn't know it existed yet < 1294326461 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is probably very buggy. < 1294326484 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://zem.fi/~fis/mcmap-win.zip if I remember right. < 1294326499 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The no-map mode might work if you just need a //goto. < 1294326526 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For me it crashed on //goto, but it looked like it actually teleported first, so it might sorta-work. < 1294326527 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all i want is to look at coordinates < 1294326531 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1294326545 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I don't think that works in nomap mode yet. < 1294326560 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can fixize that after I get home. < 1294326581 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, a feature request would be to turn the second letter of the command prefix into a #define or command line option. I was trying out a hmod plugin on my local test server that uses // as prefix. I patched it locally but it seems rather hackish. And // is a good default for most people. < 1294326589 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have to constantly look up to know where north is, because i can't see any landmarks with tiny, and it's very hard to keep track locally because whenever i move my mouse, one second later, all that is collected into a random turn < 1294326603 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, //compass ? < 1294326604 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1294326608 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : /compass < 1294326609 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather < 1294326615 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is a /compass command, right. < 1294326615 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmod provides it < 1294326618 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(constantly look up and switch to normal) < 1294326623 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh cool < 1294326626 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It tells you which way you are looking at. < 1294326637 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doesn't tell you where you are, though. < 1294326689 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, helping on the drainage operation? < 1294326713 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe when i randomly find my way back, and no, i don't want your help and annoying comments < 1294326721 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, idea: get worldedit hmod plugin. stand next to water, use //drain 128 < 1294326747 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, hmm. I think elliott might object to that. < 1294326764 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's too close to using a map editor. < 1294326778 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, worldedit *is* an in-game map editor < 1294326780 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw there was a random boat in the water, i decided to steal it since they are practically free < 1294326794 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was a few blocks south < 1294326797 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, OK, so he's not going to accept that/ < 1294326800 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, in the water where btw? < 1294326802 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hard to assess < 1294326804 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294326811 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :south from cube < 1294326824 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, it works better than the free standing ones I tried. < 1294326833 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, that is not the point. < 1294326848 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, i should probably continue playing, i just randomly bumped into one of your bridges < 1294326851 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, indeed, I didn't claim it was. Was just a general statement. < 1294326852 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The point of this is to build it with legitimate-but-for-kits methods. < 1294326854 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i love this game < 1294326862 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hours of walking in the dark and suddenly: bridge. < 1294326867 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, bridges hm. Must be near spawn? < 1294326873 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, or wait. Very far south? < 1294326902 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, do you have an in-game compass (those always point towards spawn) < 1294326911 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gonna try to see if there's something familiar there, being near spawn has been a rather confusing experience, since i've always been following a guy who randomly jumps 30 blocks at a time and calls me a retard < 1294326915 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :using that and /compass you could tell general direction from spawn < 1294326922 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, if you don't have a compass I can give you one. < 1294326939 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, same. But I have to do some RL stuff now. bbs < 1294326946 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :might be fun i guess, i wish there was an in-game coordinate gadget < 1294327010 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i'm not very far south anymore, see i tried to get back by going north, but then i just ended up playing with the boat till i got lost < 1294327022 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it was so much fun < 1294327027 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, hm < 1294327060 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've always just swim, but when i suddenly found a boat, was hard not to try it < 1294327061 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, well there is f3 ;P < 1294327062 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*i < 1294327082 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, they are quite hard to control when laggy < 1294327085 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well this is the biggest resolution i've got, and the crt is already blurring things a lot < 1294327089 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, they work a lot better in single player thus < 1294327103 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i have both lag and very low fps < 1294327137 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my internet is crappy, i have a very old crt, and my computer is a tiny little laptop not exactly meant for gaming, can't handle most flash games < 1294327186 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, you have a CRT laptop? < 1294327201 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001f5b00390f-CM001e6b2335dc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294327593 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1294327810 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, "bus error" when trying to connect sometimes, randomly pretty much. < 1294328309 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294329283 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1294329759 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oklopol, ah yes, I heard that was a problem on smaller screens < 1294329762 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No it isn't. < 1294329781 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a measure of CPU load. < 1294329785 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294329854 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294330090 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well on a large screen it never goes on top of the coords. even when the CPU is bogged down by mc < 1294330277 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In my vertically oriented window it does not seem to be a problem either. < 1294330293 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does it scale the text too or just the GUI elements? < 1294330319 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, are you disconnected? < 1294330326 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I lost connection it seems < 1294330327 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294330327 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294330333 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or lagging out < 1294330342 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, down for you too? < 1294330348 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1294330448 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just confused "The Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai: Across the Eighth Dimension" with Tron < 1294330498 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the new Tron good? < 1294330514 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has never seen either Tron or The Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai < 1294330523 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have not seen the original Tron? < 1294330548 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Correct < 1294330571 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :("Is that not so?" "Yes, that is not so.") < 1294330600 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTF, googling for that quote and Pratchett gives nothing < 1294330606 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I KNOW I saw it in Thief of Time < 1294330611 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a good film < 1294332378 0 :cheater99!~cheater@e181139218.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294332414 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ("Is that not so?" "Yes, that is not so.") <-- 1) without quotes the words are probably too generic to give a good result. 2) with quotes a tiny comma difference or such would probably result in not getting the result < 1294332426 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't remember that quote btw < 1294332515 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Auditors < 1294332525 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They were trying to convince... someone.. of something... < 1294332553 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Making excuses for why they weren't eating < 1294332560 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was supposedly against their religion < 1294332569 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To eat the food that was being offered < 1294333174 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1294333677 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan! < 1294333705 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly, possibly < 1294333715 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean hi < 1294333723 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan * (oerjan - 1) * (oerjan - 2) .. < 1294333894 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the factorial of oerjan < 1294333936 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294333989 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, we know all your secrets! < 1294333997 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Ok, just one] < 1294334019 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott we missed you in mc < 1294334075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"missed"? < 1294334100 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, we were all like if only this guy was here < 1294334118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why, what have you done < 1294334157 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im considering buying it < 1294334159 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:58:09 My dad's claiming that with my study habits, I would not have survived at a decent college, and it's the post-graduate college that matters anyway < 1294334161 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::S < 1294334161 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it involved tnt, stupidity, and the destruction of all your dreams < 1294334162 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno < 1294334164 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: your dad claims so many things < 1294334218 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see we figured it'd be even faster to torch with tnt, because tnt blows up a much bigger area than a torch < 1294334319 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ("Is that not so?" "Yes, that is not so.") <-- 1) without quotes the words are probably too generic to give a good result. 2) with quotes a tiny comma difference or such would probably result in not getting the result < 1294334336 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think google considers punctuation much even with quotes < 1294334339 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm did updog crash? < 1294334350 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oerjan kicked it < 1294334354 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: WE DID AN EXPERIMENT < 1294334356 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meaning I can say Factor all I want! < 1294334360 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1294334377 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Factor Active Worlds Smalltalk Newspeak < 1294334403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, looks like updog being kicked broke shutup since they run on the same service supervisor < 1294334405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your point? < 1294334408 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it was FOR SCIENCE < 1294334413 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your point? < 1294334428 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well that is what you _say_ < 1294334440 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you're still trying to hide shutup being fed by updog? < 1294334442 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shutupdog < 1294334445 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's so obvious now < 1294334455 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is ... obvious about putting two words together < 1294334461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: are you going to continue to be opaque or are you going to tell me what you're talking about? < 1294334483 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it is obvious that shutup had to get sgeo's channel message information through _someone_ in this channel < 1294334484 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294334501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you realise that updog is a0 < 1294334504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 line ruby script? < 1294334517 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 line Ruby scripts can't feed other scripts now/ < 1294334518 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294334519 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and since it didn't shut up when _you_ were away, updog was the main suspect < 1294334534 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: http://sprunge.us/dcFS < 1294334553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i lied, it's actually 12 lines. < 1294334605 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prove it. Run shutup without running updog < 1294334625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would involve editing the service. also, i don't particularly feel like proving anyhting to you < 1294334652 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294334657 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, clearly updog isn't _banned_ < 1294334658 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are SO busted < 1294334677 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: if you're just looking for someone to ban there's plenty of other things you could < 1294334680 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course not, poor updog never did anything wrong < 1294334680 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it was an experiment, not ... bannishment < 1294334702 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Such as Sgeo < 1294334740 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION blinks at extraneous ls < 1294334751 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, just one l is extraneous < 1294334763 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there's one too much t < 1294334777 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, are you willing to help on the Cube or not? < 1294334787 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, but perhaps not today < 1294334788 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or < 1294334789 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least < 1294334791 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not right now < 1294334808 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have Important Things irl < 1294334822 0 :updog!~updog@208.78.103.223 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294334827 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Factor < 1294334830 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh < 1294334837 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Guess shutup isn't awake yet < 1294334841 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoops, what's that, your stupid conspiracy theory isn't true?!! ZOMG < 1294334845 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and shutup has been online all this time < 1294334845 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well shutup it _there_ < 1294334854 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Idle: 9:48:43" < 1294334868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it broke because shutup is run on the same service to conserve memory on my _256 MiB_ vps, tyvm < 1294334881 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: you _do_ realize it is trivial for elliott to change anything and even lie about what code he is running if he wishes? < 1294334885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meaning their network connections interact rather oddly < 1294334898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: are you going to continue being paranoid? < 1294334911 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's this shutup thinm < 1294334915 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*g < 1294334916 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the other explanation for how shutup works is... magic? < 1294334921 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i got stuck in minecraft mode < 1294334929 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, whenever I say certain things, shutup tells me to shutup < 1294334929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you don't _mind_, i'd like to restart it so that shutup starts working again < 1294334933 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: not really. but the fact that shutup has to get its information from _someone_ in the channel remains. i doubt you have a freenode server running. < 1294334933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i won't bother if you're going to kick updog < 1294334934 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1294334947 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in pm? < 1294334952 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, yes < 1294334961 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1294334983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so are you going to ban updog if i restart the instance so that shutup unbreaks? < 1294334984 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1294334996 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I've said Factor Smalltalk Active Worlds etc. etc. more now that shutup exists... < 1294334997 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that was only for an experiment. there is no point in repeating it. < 1294335022 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294335034 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o.O? < 1294335039 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since Sgeo can ignore shutup any time he wants, i see no point in actually intervening. < 1294335041 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm restarting them, as i said. < 1294335127 0 :updog!~updog@208.78.103.223 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294335162 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, did you kick it? < 1294335170 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes < 1294335193 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, updog was kicked for an experiment to see if shutup would stop reacting to my Newspeak and Active Worlds obsessions < 1294335193 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1294335198 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, because that should leave it connected. Meaning that nonsense about network connections interacting seem even less plausible than if it had been disconnected < 1294335204 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shutup now gives notices < 1294335217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm really uninterested in conspiracy theories. < 1294335228 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so how does it work then? Just wondering. < 1294335239 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well it's not _entirely_ implausible that it caused something in elliott's setup to break ;D < 1294335239 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I told you, what fun would it be for me? < 1294335242 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool minecrafpt works < 1294335257 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: if you buy it, you can come on our server and do menial work on the cube forever < 1294335263 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, seriously, did you actually go to a crap college because your dad said so? < 1294335270 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe well I can try to connect now < 1294335276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: if it's a pirated copy it won't work < 1294335282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Sgeo does everything because his dad said so < 1294335284 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no I bought it < 1294335290 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wasn't aware it would be crap, but I pretty much went there because my dad said to < 1294335297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ah. ask ineiros for the address < 1294335298 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, Christ... < 1294335308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Sgeo regularly checks with his dad if it's OK to keep breathing. < 1294335321 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you neither have Finn privilege or South African privilege so you have to go through normal channels < 1294335322 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The worst part is that there's actually an intelligent person in there somewhere, kept down by a barrage of conditioned stupidity. < 1294335391 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i can even imagine him being honest about what code updog is running, as long as he has something listening in between :) < 1294335391 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1294335413 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although i don't precisely know how to do that myself < 1294335422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: or maybe -- JUST maybe -- it works in a way you haven't thought of yet < 1294335446 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you said it doesn't read logs on the web... does it use mercurial at all? < 1294335448 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well listening to one of the logs i think would be too resource intensive < 1294335449 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have this ominous feeling that is was a huge mistake to buy this and I will not have any time for anything else :| < 1294335459 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: no, gregor would know if it did < 1294335460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: YUP < 1294335464 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1294335465 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you've already denied that < 1294335471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: welcome to the rest of your life < 1294335523 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i can imagine many ways to set it up, but no plausible ones that don't require an accomplice on the channel < 1294335539 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course it doesn't have to be updog. < 1294335540 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1294335547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am master of the implausible < 1294335560 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it _is_ suspicious that it stopped when i kicked updog. < 1294335561 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1294335603 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, if elliott wanted, he could switch it over to him then remove updog, as a "demonstration" that it wasn't updog < 1294335604 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1294335614 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, we have lambdabot < 1294335623 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yeah < 1294335623 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, permanently too. < 1294335627 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh < 1294335629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: zomg, you should like, write an essay about that < 1294335633 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :about misplaced trust! < 1294335658 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How can lambdabot be an accomplice? < 1294335674 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I got a 100% on the essay < 1294335685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: and now you are applying your learnings to updog < 1294335686 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1294335692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a question for the ages < 1294335785 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294335807 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>updog< Factor < 1294335807 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-shutup- Shut up about Factor! < 1294335807 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1294335819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: as i said, sharing the same connection < 1294335822 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Factor < 1294335857 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo_not_really < 1294335866 0 :Sgeo_not_really!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ActiveWorlds < 1294335874 0 :cheater99!~cheater@e181130179.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294335925 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'd ask you how that even makes sense in any way whatsoever other than updog being the source, but < 1294335926 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1294335961 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seriously.. are you not running a normal OS on that machine, just wrote your own hastily written network stack? < 1294335972 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aww I think my computer is too slow to actually run this game < 1294335981 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at a decent speed < 1294335992 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: go into options < 1294335995 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rendering distance short or tiny < 1294335997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :graphics on fast < 1294336000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not fancy) < 1294336003 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which game? < 1294336007 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minecraft < 1294336007 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: minecrack. < 1294336011 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294336027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :silly haskell invaders, this is secretly #minecraft < 1294336037 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294336039 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've noticed < 1294336049 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you know i don't give him the logs < 1294336058 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: OMG DON'T TELL THEM < 1294336060 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a mirc script < 1294336067 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: i don't know if lambdabot can be an accomplice but that _is_ why i was browsing the channel member listing ;D < 1294336085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what the fuck, man, your big chest is actually full < 1294336118 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, well, given the evidence, there's a LOT pointing to updog currently being the accomplice < 1294336118 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1294336128 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A parking lot even < 1294336129 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>.> < 1294336163 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: what < 1294336174 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, bad pun < 1294336229 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: full of sand? < 1294336235 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or full of sand and gravel < 1294336239 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: sand and gravel < 1294336243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just filled it up to the max < 1294336258 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a big box full of multiple things is not a pure box, and is useless < 1294336266 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i didn't put the gravel there < 1294336267 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should make another box for gravel < 1294336271 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : silly haskell invaders, this is secretly #minecraft <-- actually it is #would-be-offtopic-if-anyone-ever-was-on-topic but freenode limits the name length so we had to go for something else < 1294336335 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how broken is your custom network stack? < 1294336347 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: pretty broken. also, it's not a "network stack". < 1294336437 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You do realize that you're not convincing anyone, right? < 1294336453 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/FuYln.jpg < 1294336457 0 :Sgeo_not_really!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, why do you actually want a full big box of sand? < 1294336460 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this built programmatically? < 1294336465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: i don't care? < 1294336470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: might be, might not < 1294336477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: not if it's on multiplayer ofc < 1294336484 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i can see someone building that by hand < 1294336489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not a "huge" project to do so < 1294336492 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_not_really: i just do alright? :\ < 1294336504 0 :Sgeo_not_really!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, Falcon < 1294336510 0 :Sgeo_not_really!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Phantom_Hoover < 1294336510 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I_O < 1294336532 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so anyway < 1294336556 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds likely that the ellipse has been computed unmanually < 1294336564 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294336713 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, feel free to test shutup by msg'ing updog < 1294336714 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1294336745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's not called Sgeo, it would do nothing. < 1294336754 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo_ < 1294336758 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo_test < 1294336763 0 :Sgeo_test!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Factor < 1294336768 0 :Sgeo_test!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meh, true < 1294336771 0 :Sgeo_test!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo < 1294336780 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo_ < 1294336793 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, would he need to be identified to PM? < 1294336909 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: build us a chest for gravel, i have more sand to put in < 1294336927 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll build you a forest of chests when i get to it < 1294336944 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: er please don't < 1294336952 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll plant a 256x256 forest and replace log with chests < 1294336966 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...so you can't open any of them < 1294336968 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;D < 1294336971 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294336977 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION doesn't get it < 1294337010 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D < 1294337032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: "THIS LARGE CHEST IS FULL OF DIAMOND. TOO BAD I PUT BEDROCK ON TOP." < 1294337045 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294337062 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've never a diamond box .( < 1294337074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that a one-eyed sad < 1294337081 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294337116 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION acts pseudooffended < 1294337166 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how's your linux project < 1294337179 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: which < 1294337199 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: there was no specific quantifier :-D < 1294337205 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, if elliott's telling the truth, AND updog and shutup are running on it... he's failing miserably < 1294337205 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1294337213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: what < 1294337216 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: what < 1294337229 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: kitten or installing ubuntu on this laptop or what < 1294337240 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess ubuntu on laptop < 1294337260 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In order for you to be telling the truth about updog not being shutup's source, shutup must be confusing updog's input with its own < 1294337260 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1294337267 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is a sign of dementia at the OS level < 1294337280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_ is dementia < 1294337326 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION suddenly wants DementedOS < 1294337392 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how is ubuntu laptop coming along? < 1294337409 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: not at all until someone responds to my ubuntuforums post < 1294337419 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders when he'll receive the email from PayPal describing why, exactly, someone who makes $38/year is not eligible for their credit card thing < 1294337421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which seems unlikely, at this point < 1294337432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: just get a debit card < 1294337457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, isn't it fairly obvious? < 1294337485 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but still. < 1294337499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: so get a debit card? < 1294337514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait i forgot you'd have to ask your father ... because 21 year olds can't get debit cards < 1294337518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forgot, sorry, ignore me < 1294337571 0 :cal153!~cal@70.36.237.178 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294337571 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: just send them money with a bank transfer < 1294337628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no he'd have to ask his dad < 1294337632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and his dad thinks bank transfers are bad < 1294337635 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously < 1294337833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=54784 < 1294337836 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: lol < 1294337857 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I have to say, that animation under Usage is something I would love to see in your mcmap. < 1294337888 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, .... tbh I told my dad that I was angry and that I was going to go get a debit card... and he said he'll look into it, he's going to Wal-Mart anyway, so he'll get one for me < 1294338010 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't get you at all < 1294338062 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I could easily have an "surface except up to max-height" mode, but I don't have an isometric view at all. < 1294338099 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how would his dad know if he gets a bank account and makes a transfer < 1294338112 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1294338125 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well Sgeo_ would ask him of course < 1294338135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: psht! < 1294338187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: i'd add it, except I only do _easy_ work < 1294338199 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, that's an offline map-browser thing? The word "live" confused me. < 1294338207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, it is? A shame. < 1294338218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Having said that... an isometric mode would be amazing... albeit slow. < 1294338233 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"From the file menu you can select Worlds 1-5 from single-player minecraft on your system or any world folder, including server worlds." < 1294338277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What; M-x new-frame makes the font reset. < 1294338302 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/107712/MCMap%20Screenshots/ss5.png Also this would be nice in real-time. : < 1294338303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1294338342 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll consider isometricry and/or other prettification things too. And some sort of block-finder, that could be nice too. < 1294338368 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you guys take the venture out of adventure < 1294338381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D < 1294338388 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i don't actually use mcmap's mapping < 1294338394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just use it for the //goto < 1294338417 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i understand that, although i'd prefer minecarts that are easier to use < 1294338448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: are you _sure_ you're right clicking them :D < 1294338486 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you push them, then you right click a random number of times, and hope an odd number of clicks is done, then you wait to see something, and you'll know whether you're in the cart or whether the cart has run away < 1294338508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you push them, you right click once, and you wait < 1294338508 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hope, because every fifth click works < 1294338516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it fails it's because ineiros is skyping < 1294338555 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, so maybe minecarts are special like that < 1294338589 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but sometimes it takes me a few minutes to get a click to work < 1294338607 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I might just prefer preset warp destinations; maybe I'll have ineiros finally add some when he visits. < 1294338618 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :god i love complaining about this, i'm like an old lady telling everyone how much her hips her < 1294338623 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*hurt < 1294338636 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hurt hips her? < 1294338650 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :her hips hurt her < 1294338669 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :her hurt hips her < 1294338672 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway previous is corrected < 1294338672 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is being sill < 1294338674 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y < 1294338683 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that works too < 1294338685 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Her hip hurt herds her. < 1294338707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :04:44:10 I've decided that my honeymoon with VirtualBox is over. < 1294338708 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god < 1294338711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the marriage breaks down already < 1294338713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm weeping < 1294338726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess all that cheating on Vorpal VirtualBox did just got too much < 1294338749 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, err. What? < 1294338779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Sgeo_ broke up with VirtualBox and started a new love affair with VMWare < 1294338787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume it's because of all the time VirtualBox is spending with YOU < 1294338801 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, gah. vmware is even worse. Though I am looking for a good alternative to virtualbox what with oracle and so on now < 1294338807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: vmware SERVER no less < 1294338811 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did inva enter server btw? < 1294338815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ? < 1294338819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: who is inva < 1294338820 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh j-invariant < 1294338824 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I decided to shoot VMWare Server before I ever touched her < 1294338831 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'm telling him to ask ineiros, but you could just tell j-invariant the address < 1294338832 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\Sigma^*inva\Sigma^* < 1294338835 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're oklopol so nobody would blame you < 1294338847 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I used that.. back before virtualbox exited (or at least before it was well known). But yeah it is annoying. And isn't modern versions browser based too < 1294338849 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294338852 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(never used modern versions) < 1294338853 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tru < 1294338854 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yup! < 1294338865 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, yes. Yes it is. < 1294338867 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :05:49:59 I'm pretty sure pikhq warned me about this, but I ignored him because I thought he was talking about crappy internal architecture < 1294338871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :water blocks toilet paper, yup < 1294338874 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294338875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :07:00:06 fizzie, a question about mcmap: does water really block tp? Because when you ended up sub-surface in an unloaded chunk tp out of there would be /very/ useful < 1294338897 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :07:05:22 would be nice to get home, i managed to convince myself i had a way to look at coordinates as much as i like, and decided to take a random walk < 1294338899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have a home now? < 1294338911 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :07:06:14 a red square goes on top of the numbers < 1294338911 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :07:06:24 oklopol, ah yes, I heard that was a problem on smaller screens < 1294338912 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294338913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it isn't the fucking screen size < 1294338914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's cpu usage < 1294338916 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, temporary home < 1294338918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more cpu usage = it blocks the indicator < 1294338920 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :VMware Server before their *revolting* AJAX UI wasn't bad. < 1294338922 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't have any place yet < 1294338942 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It wasn't the greatest thing ever, but it had an entirely usable and working GTK UI, and it just plain worked. < 1294338949 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, actually screen size matters too, this system is bogged down under mc, but the screen is large. < 1294338956 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now, it doesn't fucking work and it HAS ITS OWN COPY OF EVERYTHING < 1294338962 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well obviously mc uses up all my cpu, so maybe i should just force it to be low while reading coords < 1294338981 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: or just use mcmap and //coords when fizzie makes a working windows binary :p < 1294338985 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :07:12:01 Phantom_Hoover, idea: get worldedit hmod plugin. stand next to water, use //drain 128 < 1294338988 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: cuboid plugin does that. < 1294338989 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1294338993 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah, no. < 1294339002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"minecraft would be so much better if we didn't have to mine or craft!" < 1294339006 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Did you try out the win-binary, incidentally? < 1294339009 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"or explore" < 1294339011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: he just wants coords < 1294339018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :07:08:19 The no-map mode might work if you just need a //goto. < 1294339018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :07:08:46 For me it crashed on //goto, but it looked like it actually teleported first, so it might sorta-work. < 1294339018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :07:08:47 all i want is to look at coordinates < 1294339019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :07:08:51 Oh. < 1294339020 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a windows binary, forgot about ti < 1294339021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :07:09:05 Well, I don't think that works in nomap mode yet. < 1294339023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :07:09:20 I can fixize that after I get home. < 1294339025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TO QUOTE THE LOGS < 1294339027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: HOME YET < 1294339054 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, cuboid is less well written from what I read. Not quite notch quality but buggier definitely. (And worldedit has more features as well.) < 1294339064 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh okay < 1294339082 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i only know cuboid from http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaigDxHBKbA, which is my favourite video ever < 1294339082 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well, you do get coords in the mappy mode, but I guess that's less likely to work. Anyway, just came home. < 1294339096 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cute. < 1294339101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: so if worldedit can do that then SURE < 1294339102 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: what's cute < 1294339111 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sony claims they'll be "fixing the issues" with the PS3 using a network update. < 1294339132 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rofl < 1294339163 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I should have listened to you < 1294339166 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm so sorry < 1294339172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: it can be effective. < 1294339187 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, the only thing that could do anything about this is: adding a new layer of signing onto new games plus a whitelist for all the old games. *On a new revision of hardware.* < 1294339189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: means that for anyone who hasn't yet homebrew'd the console, the only way to do it is hardware modding < 1294339226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: i.e., there's three types of machine: updated ones, can't be hacked except by hardware mods; already-hacked ones; and new ones, which are invulnerable < 1294339226 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you actually play this game? < 1294339227 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, can't answer until I watched video. But one think I did was select a huge area (200x200) then expand the selection to bottom of map and replace everything but air with stone. Worked perfectly and as happened so fast it seemed instant. < 1294339229 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in an idael situation (for sony) < 1294339230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ideal < 1294339240 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently you can build < 1294339244 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: mine stuff, build a shelter, get armour, find a nice mountain, start a mine < 1294339248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: make farms, kill bad things < 1294339251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: build interesting stuff < 1294339253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wire it all together < 1294339253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :explore < 1294339253 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: This, of course, presumes that Sony does it perfectly. < 1294339256 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/think/thing/ < 1294339272 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is, creates new keys and a whitelist, and introduces *no new vulnerabilities*. < 1294339288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you should be hideously irresponsible with the server address right now! < 1294339294 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and the new keys would of course have to be in the mask for future CPUs. < 1294339294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or j-invariant could just read the logs i guess :P < 1294339305 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also invalidates the old keys < 1294339307 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'll be several months before we start seeing that. < 1294339316 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: "Whitelist". < 1294339333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's easy to break THAT! < 1294339333 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes it can fill a selection with lava like that. < 1294339336 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: eh, ok < 1294339342 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just make a hacker which has the exact same signature as a legit game. < 1294339343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DUH < 1294339350 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, also, this totally assumes that they don't use a cracked PS3 to download the update and pick it apart < 1294339350 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, something like //set lava after making a selection < 1294339351 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i linked it because it was funny not because i thought worldedit couldn't do it < 1294339369 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294339371 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh I must have misinterpreted your line " Vorpal: so if worldedit can do that then SURE" then < 1294339373 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All this will only prevent homebrew from happening on new consoles, anyways. < 1294339383 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: if worldedit can generate SUCH HILARITY then sure. < 1294339389 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The update *will have to be* encrypted with the old keys. < 1294339392 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, I guess it's a bit late for me to buy a PS3? < 1294339397 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah < 1294339399 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: not if you do it NOW < 1294339399 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: but then they can break the new keys < 1294339402 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which means that you will *have* the new keys. < 1294339408 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since the new keys will have to be encoded in the same way < 1294339411 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So piracy on old hardware will happen forever and ever. < 1294339421 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so then piracy on new keys will happen the same way < 1294339427 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: i am trying to figure out how to do the packet_id enum in SML sanely :D < 1294339428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn your C < 1294339430 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And there is literally nothing Sony can do about it at all. < 1294339441 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: there is definitely not the address of the minecraft server in yesterday's logs. < 1294339446 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, you will have the public keys though, which shouldn't be private, so? Oh, unless you intercept it? < 1294339448 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Oh, you're actually doing the ML rewrite? < 1294339449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right oklopol? < 1294339455 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: well i'm... toying with the idea :D < 1294339459 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: it might not actually include the map part < 1294339460 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also worldedit can generate snowfall. Might be useful up around dw's place < 1294339467 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: The public keys are sufficient for doing piracy on cracked firmware. < 1294339468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: it's symmetric encryption < 1294339471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc < 1294339482 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that seems... stupid < 1294339495 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It's assymmetric, but all PS3s have the public key. < 1294339495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sony, stupid? haha you lie < 1294339503 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would be nice if you could just disable the bad thingies in some areas < 1294339504 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, I have now produced a Windows mcmap binary that has working //coords, and it worked for me (in nomap mode) under Wine: http://zem.fi/~fis/mcmap-win.zip < 1294339505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: mhm < 1294339509 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: fizzie ^ < 1294339514 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's *supposed* to be in a SPU that you can't normally access. < 1294339527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: "mcmap -cm a322.org:25566" in a cmd window < 1294339532 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The public keys are sufficient for doing piracy on cracked firmware." < 1294339532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: then connect to 127.0.0.1 with minecraft < 1294339536 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and do //coords in chat < 1294339539 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...why? < 1294339544 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They can just replicate the attack method on the new keys on old hardware, can't they? < 1294339546 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How does that make.. I'm confused < 1294339555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: not if sony redoes the encryption without stupid < 1294339558 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it should have a Win32-specific launch dialog where you enter the host/port and select the options, since aren't Windows users in general rather uncomfortable with the command line? < 1294339562 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: Decrypt stuff with the new keys, and run it on firmware that doesn't do the key check. < 1294339594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: does mcmap give up permanently whenever it sees an invalid password? < 1294339596 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: The key revealing actually came because Sony did their signing algorithm retardedly. < 1294339606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose I could have each packet ID written twice (one in the data type, one in an int -> packet_id converter) < 1294339608 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294339610 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: It's actually not anything on the PS3 itself at *all*. < 1294339617 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, ok < 1294339623 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :18:45 fizzie: I think it should have a Win32-specific launch dialog where you enter the host/port and select the options, since aren't Windows users in general rather uncomfortable with the command line? < 1294339628 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this just makes me want to design some weird 2D cellular automata < 1294339630 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: do you _want_ to encourage clueless windows users to use this? < 1294339640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: do it in redstone < 1294339644 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyways. Sony's "security" architecture is positively retarded. < 1294339645 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GoL has been done < 1294339666 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in minecaft? I dind't mean in minecraft < 1294339670 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fun fact: with arbitrary code execution *at all*, you can decrypt everything ever even without access to the keys that you shouldn't be able to access. < 1294339672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: :D < 1294339676 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: everything in your life is minecraftn ow < 1294339678 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Market adoption, I hear it's important. And it gives up permanently whenever the TCP connection is closed. (It doesn't look at the login packets otherwise, except for reading the player entity ID out of it.) < 1294339685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: er invalid packet < 1294339690 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The decryption SPU can be used as a decryption oracle so long as you're running code. < 1294339694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: what does it do if it sees an invalid packet? < 1294339695 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :give up forever? < 1294339700 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Category theory is a popular framework for expressing abstract properties of < 1294339700 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mathematical structures. < 1294339701 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" < 1294339705 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um. that's one way to put it < 1294339714 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seriously, the PS3 is fucked 15 different ways. < 1294339725 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well, yes, because it's impossible to guess where the invalid packet would end. I guess it could *try* to resync, but I'm not sure how likely that is to work. < 1294339731 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, elliott is morally opposed to anything that is popular. < 1294339742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: um are you _defending_ Windows < 1294339754 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and there will *be* arbitrary code execution exploits: you write software for it in C. < 1294339756 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or C++. < 1294339761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm just saying that the kind of people who won't open cmd.exe to type "mcmap blah" are the kind of people who are going to produce the whining fizzie loathes so < 1294339777 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe they can't figure out where to whine. < 1294339788 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If they whine, say, on the minecraft forums, that's not a loss for me. < 1294339792 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Sgeo_'s right here. < 1294339798 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: more seriously-- < 1294339802 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: do you really want to touch the win32 api? :-) < 1294339812 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's been a while; it might be nostalgick. < 1294339814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hear it is _quite_ loathesome. < 1294339845 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I already looked at the dialog resource script file format, it's very awful. (MinGW of course doesn't have a dialog designer thing.) < 1294339886 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A Win binary without the mapping feature might not be very popular, though. < 1294339894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Just do it all with those OK/Cancel default MsgBoxes. < 1294339895 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And of course there's the denial-of-service thing. < 1294339903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: "Is the first bit of the address 0?" < 1294339940 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yes, I think //goto is rather good justification for never letting this out ever. (Even if you removed it, just takes one intrepid commit-logger...) < 1294339949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially since it has been verified to do Awful Things. < 1294339977 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can't Notch make //goto ineffective over the relevent distances? < 1294339991 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: The reason //goto works is because his server architecture is completely broken. < 1294340000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not expect he could redesign it to be less broken, as he is an idiot. < 1294340026 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How DOES it work? < 1294340034 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo < 1294340035 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Again, his todo list hints that //goto is pretty likely to be nerfed in the future. < 1294340072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You still haven't shown why really. < 1294340077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Telling you that seems ... unwise. < 1294340078 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A simple maximum-speed check for PLAYER_MOVE messages would make it unworkable. < 1294340091 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: What entry in his todo list implies it'll be fixed? < 1294340095 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...it's just PLAYER_MOVE messages? < 1294340121 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: The highest-priority "Make the server check for flying, no clip and increased speed." one? < 1294340122 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> fix(([1,2]++).drop 2.(uncurry replicate=<<).flip zip(cycle[1,2])) < 1294340123 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : [1,2,2,1,1,2,1,2,2,1,2,2,1,1,2,1,1,2,2,1,2,1,1,2,1,2,2,1,1,2,1,1,2,1,2,2,1,... < 1294340126 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It works by sending 20 of them with subtly invalid fields that confuse the server in a specific way. < 1294340131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: There, now don't abuse it. < 1294340141 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Hmm, isn't that from the Classic era? < 1294340147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I know flying was ubiquitous then. < 1294340157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I don't think noclip is possible with Alpha, but it was with Classic. < 1294340170 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, the context is "Before beta", so technically speaking all three things should be already done. :p < 1294340173 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Back. < 1294340186 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I think he's sort of given up with that toodledo list.) < 1294340227 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"While we [Mojang] were doing this [having a strategy meeting], there was a film crew on place (since Monday, actually), documenting and interviewing." < 1294340237 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh, expect a "Minecraft: the making of" hip-cumentary. < 1294340246 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It's like a documentary, except more hip.) < 1294340288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: have you excavated recently by any chance? < 1294340289 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Oh, and I’ve finally committed the Music Blocks to the repository. < 1294340289 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Oh, wait, no, I didn’t.. Doing so broke git, so we’re changing to svn because git is horrible and evil)" < 1294340299 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ...did he say that. < 1294340301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Did Notch say that. < 1294340306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Please tell me Notch didn't say that. < 1294340308 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it's in his glob. < 1294340315 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'm going to punch him IRL. < 1294340322 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, when it seems imminent that it will be fixed, we make the server crash bug public and watch the anarchy. < 1294340322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: He has circlejerks^Wmeetups, right? < 1294340332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Evil, but ... fun. But evil. < 1294340334 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But ... fun ... < 1294340345 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know, but probably some sort of events, yes. < 1294340350 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Extremely* fun. < 1294340389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: OK. So theoretically I could go and punch him. < 1294340392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless he has fan bodyguards? < 1294340462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"If this gets a bunch of upvotes, I'll write and record a concept album about Creepers, and release it for free in February." < 1294340465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am going to punch everyone. < 1294340501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I'm kind of sad to see him diss git like that. I really enjoy it, and it has lots of advantages over svn. It's a shame he ran into problems. (But.. svn?? There are other options, man! It's not like you're committing large binary files!)" < 1294340505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now, please, bet on the following statement: < 1294340513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Notch is committing large binary files to the Minecraft repository." < 1294340574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Phantom_Hoover: Also bet on: "Adventure mode will exist in the first post-beta release." < 1294340585 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Music Blocks" does sound pretty much like large binary files. < 1294340614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Music blocks is this new block type he's adding. < 1294340619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It toots or something. < 1294340623 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Source: Twatter. < 1294340641 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ha, apparently they're trying to "come up with a release date" for Minecraft already. < 1294340648 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Are all Swedes stupid, or is my sample size just deficient? < 1294340683 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, me and olsner aren't stupid < 1294340690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right, olsner isn't stupid. < 1294340693 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe just most Swedes then. < 1294340711 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why has Notch abandoned Git? < 1294340723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :18:57 fizzie: "Oh, and I’ve finally committed the Music Blocks to the repository. < 1294340723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :18:57 fizzie: (Oh, wait, no, I didn’t.. Doing so broke git, so we’re changing to svn because git is horrible and evil)" < 1294340726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because Notch has no brain. < 1294340740 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294340748 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1294340763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Notch has stolen the concept of Minecraft from the world; nobody can ever execute it properly, because the accusations of plagiarism will be non-stop. < 1294340772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I propose a lynching. < 1294340817 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott, me and olsner aren't stupid <-- you _have_ to be the straight man, don't you? :D < 1294340843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i do wonder if he really missed my "subtle" insult, or whether he just decided to ignore it for the sake of anti-comedy < 1294340855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(anti-comedy is not the result of anti-jokes, it is the result of being anti-joke) < 1294340878 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anti-jokes are, of course, hilarious. < 1294340935 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, FWIW, I added "Complaining About People Not Liking The Show" to MC's TV Tropes page. < 1294340940 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Countdown to revert... < 1294340962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: THAT IS A SUBJECTIVE TROPE < 1294340965 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :br < 1294340968 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*brb < 1294340982 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Notch's fans seem to be using the Diaspora excuse to excuse his issues < 1294341010 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Was originally a Spiritual Successor of the free Infiniminer" < 1294341019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zach must fucking hate Notch. < 1294341042 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: BTW, Survival Test is now completely gone. < 1294341264 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: snpidcoc < 1294341275 0 :coppro!~scshunt@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1294341308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Can you force ineiros' IP to change to something really easily-guessable? < 1294341328 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back to mc < 1294341367 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: DON'T WORRY IF YOU'RE GOING ON THE SERVER I'M AT THE SPAWN TO HELP GUIDE YOU >:D < 1294341434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: "Somewhat averted by Alpha Update 1.0.15. Wood and other flammable blocks now catch fire up to three blocks away from lava." < 1294341435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For the rules. < 1294341465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Hey, I just realised all the slogan texts are gone, it just says "finally beta now" (just realised: just read on the tv tropes page) < 1294341466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294341609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*finally beta" now < 1294341711 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" oklopol: DON'T WORRY IF YOU'RE GOING ON THE SERVER I'M AT THE SPAWN TO HELP GUIDE YOU >:D" <<< i am not at spawn tho < 1294341761 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interesting; the "Finally beta!" string comes from a try { ... } catch (Exception e) { l = "Finally beta!"; } code-structure. < 1294341774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: X-D < 1294341784 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even though the /title/splashes.txt is still there in the .jar. < 1294341790 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know how he's hardcodeded it. < 1294341790 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello again. < 1294341797 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294341826 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Next trope to add to Minecraft: Idiot Programming. < 1294341842 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, BtW, http://rationalwiki.org/w/index.php?title=Eric_S._Raymond&diff=709079&oldid=708724 < 1294341855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Seen, and mentioned to you ages ago. < 1294341860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's better than before, so I won't argue. < 1294341862 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, you did? < 1294341863 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. < 1294341864 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(before = before i edited) < 1294341889 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could argue that his work in computing is generally respectable. < 1294341910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yeah, uh, fetchmail. < 1294341912 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Respectable. < 1294341913 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" oklopol: "mcmap -cm a322.org:25566" in a cmd window" <<< it just tells me how to use mcmap < 1294341916 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, *generally*. < 1294341920 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Usage: ... < 1294341924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what did you type, in full < 1294341930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did ou type -exactly- that :P < 1294341931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*you < 1294341932 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copied that exactly < 1294341934 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fetchmail is in the category of embarrassingly wrong. < 1294341940 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ^ < 1294341955 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone have a link summing up MC's stupid technical problems? < 1294341962 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, no, it doesn't: it actually comes from something like try { ...; l = splashes.get(rnd.nextInt(splashes.size())); goto bleh; } catch (Exception e) { bleh: l = "Finally beta!"; } ... assuming I read the bytecode right. So it actually selects a random splash, then rewrites it with that. < 1294341969 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294341980 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or just a series of links to examples of Notch's idiocy. < 1294341995 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: That's weirdistic. But admittedly I have only tried it with wine. What about "mcmap dummy -cm a322.org:25566"? < 1294342029 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though I guess that won't hep, since it'd anyway just miss the -cm part. < 1294342049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:25 Phantom_Hoover: Someone have a link summing up MC's stupid technical problems? < 1294342057 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: why do you assume the badness of things is always summed up in links < 1294342062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ... :D < 1294342067 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I manually split the command line I get from GetCommandLine() at spaces, since that one includes the program name, unlike the WinMain lpCmdLine param.) < 1294342069 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it's for the TV Tropes page. < 1294342085 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want at least *some* evidence before I call Notch an idiot. < 1294342086 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should just figure out how to make mingw build a binary with a traditional "main". < 1294342091 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or add that launcher dialog! < 1294342099 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Well it's _meant_ to just work. :p < 1294342111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That :D was from the bleh: thing. < 1294342112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course. < 1294342139 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but it doesn't want to "just work" for me. < 1294342150 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott, me and olsner aren't stupid <-- you _have_ to be the straight man, don't you? :D <-- hah < 1294342158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah Vorpal isn't gay < 1294342171 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1294342182 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: look at random pages on minecraft wiki, "pigs stopped working after the halloween update due to the texture of cobblestone being changed" < 1294342252 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: <33 < 1294342255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :please tell me that's true < 1294342255 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MinGW crt1.c supposedly has this: < 1294342257 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : * Call the main function. If the user does not supply one < 1294342257 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : * the one in the 'libmingw32.a' library will be linked in, and < 1294342257 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : * that one calls WinMain. See main.c in the 'lib' dir < 1294342257 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : * for more details. < 1294342261 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294342262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i would really like that to be actually true < 1294342266 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i can actaully believe it < 1294342269 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be pretty awesome. < 1294342276 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So yes, it's supposed to use a user-supplied main when there is one. < 1294342282 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was that problem with trees inflooping cause by something unrelated < 1294342287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: turns out he procedurally generated the pig texture based on the cobblestone one, obviously < 1294342291 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*caused < 1294342294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also, stores state in the unused parts of the texture < 1294342294 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1294342298 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what. < 1294342308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: or, better: the pig and cobblestone code is completely unrelated < 1294342313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the pig code doesn't even touch the texture code < 1294342313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at all < 1294342314 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, that idiot programming trope is going up NOW. < 1294342319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: note: this is lies < 1294342319 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294342325 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, doesn't matter. < 1294342327 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: just very true lies < 1294342340 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's still such a crazy bug it qualifies by itself. < 1294342357 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: it isn't real < 1294342382 0 :BMG!~behold@d83-183-183-70.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1294342394 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1294342415 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Republicans in the House read the US Constitution upon opening the current session of Congress... < 1294342422 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*And intentionally omitted parts*. < 1294342431 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oaky leaf decay caused infloops in leaves. still kind of weird that was not something he could just quickly fix. < 1294342435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: :D < 1294342438 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Oh, I think it's a SDL problem, in fact. The SDL.h header does: #if defined(__WIN32__) ... #define main SDL_main ...; and then there's supposed to be some sort of a SDL winmain.c that calls it. How very messy. < 1294342440 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294342442 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ah yes, leaf decay is very oaky. < 1294342445 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: OH YEAH, SDL_main < 1294342449 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Including the ⅗ths compromise... < 1294342451 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I had to do stuff with that once < 1294342457 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: where is your ubuntuforums post? < 1294342458 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: just rename main to SLD_main < 1294342460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*SDL_main < 1294342464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1658418 < 1294342471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: for all platforms < 1294342472 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which stated that, for the purposes of the census, a slave will be considered ⅗ths of a person.) < 1294342475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: and it'll Work Out Perfectly IIRC < 1294342491 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i don't disable the map, what'll happen? < 1294342495 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't have the balls to try myself < 1294342499 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I'd still like some examples of completely stupid bugs. < 1294342499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you'll probably die < 1294342504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but i'd wait until fizzie fizes :P < 1294342505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*fixes < 1294342511 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzes < 1294342513 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shit < 1294342514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: placing torches on leaves used to only work in fancy...or was it fast < 1294342518 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the shop open i want stuff < 1294342519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it worked when you put it back < 1294342531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in they didn't disappear < 1294342556 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It pains me to say this, but I can't add the trope with that evidence. < 1294342597 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the fact he clearly codes every new enemy from scratch should be evidence enough < 1294342609 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's tons of evidence for that: every object works slightly differently < 1294342620 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i meant < 1294342621 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*mean < 1294342635 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :details do, even though the relevant things are the same for them < 1294342659 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i'm not being very helpful, but the point is it's weird if no one has collected this stuff in a list < 1294342666 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's evidence everywhere < 1294342710 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well anyway shoppe tyme < 1294342811 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well, it only works if with SDL_main if I also statically link in -lSDLmain, and I'm not sure I want to do that. I guess it's sort-of recommended-by-some, but it breaks e.g. the otherwise legal "int main(void)". (And -lSDLmain is not part of SDL's pkg-config flags.) I think I'll just crudely work-around it in the win32 build, that one is allowed to be ugly. < 1294342839 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Okay, but I think it's like that for a Reason. < 1294342843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: SDL needs special initialising on win32 I think. < 1294342914 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :took a random page: "Currently, slimes cannot spawn naturally, but this will most likely be fixed." <<< why the fuck do they have their own spawning code? < 1294342926 0 :Wamanuz2!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294342947 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and what the fuck is hard about using a function to calculate prob of appearing from height, and then adding a certain kind of tile on the map < 1294342951 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294342951 0 :BMG!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294342954 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe he wants to make them into puddings < 1294342954 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how the fuck can you have a bug in that < 1294342954 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :BeholdMyGlory < 1294343092 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294343165 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So did oko get it started or what actually happened? < 1294343200 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Get what started. < 1294343205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's not on the server at least. < 1294343206 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mcmap. < 1294343267 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Well, he hasn't tried it since the first error afaik. < 1294343277 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This time I got even the mappy version started, and there's a map and all, but then it hung up after two chat messages and downloading most of the initial chunks. < 1294343287 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(In Wine.) < 1294343312 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Something is probably wrong there, but Wine-testing is so crummy. < 1294343356 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He can try the same URL again, it has a "regular" main now so maybe the command line args work too. (Then again, maybe not.) < 1294343360 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, according to Slashdot, converting the string "2.2250738585072011e-308" into a floating point number sends PHP 5.2 and 5.3 into an infinite loop < 1294343372 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's not /just/ Excel that has problems with float stringification < 1294343388 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :again, you wonder how that was discovered... < 1294343482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: welcome to three days ago < 1294343487 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: redownload it < 1294343637 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: have you tried resizing the existing mac partition(s) and putting a new partition on there? < 1294343648 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294343651 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the hard drive.. < 1294343701 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Uhh, I did that before any of this ... you do realise my issue is actually getting the LiveCD booted, right? < 1294343703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, liveUSB. < 1294343724 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so you don't want ubuntu permanently on your laptop? < 1294343739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: You have a way to install Ubuntu without booting the live media now? < 1294343745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not about to use Wubi. < 1294343750 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes < 1294343753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: orly. < 1294343760 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: install ubuntu on another computer, and clone the partition over < 1294343764 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've done that 1304758203475 times < 1294343766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: not an option. < 1294343769 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1294343783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't have any even vaguely-similar hardware. plus, the fstab would be fucked up and probably all kinds of shit would break subtly. < 1294343788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(since the fstab uses guids nowadays.) < 1294343792 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the hardware doesn't matter < 1294343796 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, elliott: If it still doesn't work, I'll just build a windows binary that hardcodes the command line options. < 1294343802 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've been swapping the same hard drive between 3 different cpu architectures < 1294343811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: cpu is irrelevant. < 1294343813 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it works straight away (well i have to reboot once) < 1294343818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: for instance < 1294343821 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: bootloader installation < 1294343823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no other EFI machines < 1294343825 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294343833 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bootloader is different < 1294343834 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but! < 1294343847 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i believe there is the grub installer for macos too < 1294343866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: yeaaaah no, it's probably grub-efi < 1294343867 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which sucks < 1294343879 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can tell it to install grub on disk n partition k and it does it all automagically < 1294343879 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i really only want to go the live-media route. < 1294343882 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should not be difficult. < 1294343894 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's grub-efi and why is it bad? < 1294343895 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :macos is what mcdonald's calls tacos < 1294343905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: grub-efi is grub-efi and it's bad because linux efi support sucks < 1294343915 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's efi? < 1294343933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294343934 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not apple-compatible, i don't know those things < 1294343941 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1294343950 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :waiting for connection < 1294343968 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294343969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: if you don't know what efi is, the chances of you being able to help me are close to 0. < 1294343974 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :considering it's basically the entire problem < 1294343984 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well if you explain it to me then i will know it! < 1294343996 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: When it says "waiting for connection", it means you have to start minecraft and connect to 127.0.0.1. < 1294344005 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Or presumably "localhost".) < 1294344005 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: dentistry is about toothcare. can you give me a filling? < 1294344007 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know! < 1294344015 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i can try! :D < 1294344075 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so you don't want grub at all, yes? < 1294344085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, i do < 1294344095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want normal grub, as the ubuntu live media installs perfectly on macs when it is booted. < 1294344111 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i don't think it's a special grub that there is < 1294344121 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: erm, that sounded funny < 1294344132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Yes, there is, grub-efi. < 1294344138 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I _do_ know this shit. < 1294344149 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what about running ubuntu in parallels < 1294344158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want to run ubuntu as my main os. also, parallels is crap. < 1294344167 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean just once < 1294344178 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you can run it in parallels, have the normal grub install stuff, and you could boot ubuntu. < 1294344180 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe. < 1294344206 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: considering parallels emulates a "normal" BIOS PC, I'd put the chances of that working fairly low ... but more importantly, I don't think parallels can read/write to an existing system partition < 1294344252 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you on mac set another partition as "bootable" like on pcs? < 1294344280 0 :pumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294344351 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: umm, sort of. but that wouldn't help. < 1294344367 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294344377 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then you could write grub to just the linux partition, and make that partition bootable ("sort of") < 1294344380 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and maybe it could work? < 1294344381 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when someone talks, it crashes, i think < 1294344389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: you didn't make it use readline did you < 1294344393 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I've noticed something like that too. < 1294344395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: i already wrote grub to a partition, sort of < 1294344395 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: No. < 1294344399 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i could only find a floppy image of grub 1 < 1294344406 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't help :) < 1294344426 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think maybe grub 2 could be better, sort of? < 1294344436 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most of console.c's #ifdef'd out, it just uses the "write to file descriptor 1" approach of consolying. < 1294344448 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It shouldn't have the readline thread started or anything.) < 1294344462 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes this is fixable by doing a smc reset. This should fix your USB ports: < 1294344462 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note: Portable computers that have a battery you should not remove on your own include MacBook Pro (Early 2009) and later, all models of MacBook Air, and MacBook (Late 2009). < 1294344462 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1. Shut down the computer. < 1294344462 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2. Plug in the MagSafe power adapter to a power source, connecting it to the Mac if its not already connected. < 1294344463 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3. On the built-in keyboard, press the (left side) Shift-Control-Option keys and the power button at the same time. < 1294344466 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4. Release all the keys and the power button at the same time. < 1294344470 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :5. Press the power button to turn on the computer. Note: The LED on the MagSafe power adapter does not change states or temporarily turn-off when you reset the SMC. < 1294344473 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Source: < 1294344475 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://support.apple.com/kb/HT3964 < 1294344487 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: what is that from. you could have just linked me. < 1294344497 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1465614 < 1294344505 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :last post < 1294344507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sounds suspiciously similar to "ZAP THE PRAM" of yore < 1294344522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: yeah no, my usb ports work fine. < 1294344525 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Hrrrrm...I'm having a problem with the superdrive version. After about a few minutes of booting from the Live-CD (both Ubuntu 10.04 and an old version of Gparted) the superdrive goes dead and the usb port will not work again without a COPS reset. When booted into OS X the superdrive works fine copying whole data DVD's onto the harddrive... any thoughts?" < 1294344528 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the usb ports work absolutely fine < 1294344542 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe they only stop working when you're trying to boot < 1294344542 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294344543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: there's a guy in scotland i need you to kill < 1294344550 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yea < 1294344555 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, who? < 1294344561 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://mikemcquaid.com/ < 1294344598 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which version of macbook air do you have? < 1294344600 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can't be bothered sifting through the blog; outline why he needs to die. < 1294344621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's complaining about my commit for stupid reasons and is a dick in other pull requests < 1294344622 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://github.com/mxcl/homebrew/pull/3817 < 1294344631 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: the latest one < 1294344635 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: it is literally days old < 1294344638 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that's 3.2? < 1294344641 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294344642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3,2 < 1294344643 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not 3.2 < 1294344666 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sounds like the time i have created a reset button for my commodore < 1294344668 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294344669 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: tl;dr imagine if you packaged ghc in a source distro, using the binaries like some other packages do in the source distro, rather than actually building from source, < 1294344672 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EFI booting is explained in Brian Tarricones MacBookAir3,1 Gentoo install report : http://spurint.org/misc/installing-g...-macbookair31/ < 1294344672 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Basically, it requires a patch to force EFI booting in physical mode rather than virtual mode. < 1294344673 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a very interesting read for anyone tweaking his/her MBA3,* < 1294344679 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: and you got a complaint when submitting it: < 1294344679 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :source: http://art.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=10202692 < 1294344685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: "Please use the binaries to build GHC from source." < 1294344698 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: i.e.: "Make lots of computation happen to produce bit-identical binaries." < 1294344705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: note that there is no customistaion of the build possible in this case < 1294344707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*customisation < 1294344715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: this is exactly what's happening, except it's MLton which is basically the same < 1294344734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :technically MLton builds with SML/NJ, but no point downloading another compiler to build a really-slow bootstrapper. < 1294344753 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: also, are you using the usual installation iso for ubuntu, or the "alternative cd"? < 1294344770 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: the usual iso, and i don't want to use the alternative cd. i have an ethernet adapter so i can use that for the install. < 1294344783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't want to efi boot, as i've said < 1294344791 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: there are people saying that they couldn't succeed with the usual but alternative worked < 1294344793 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[If you ever make it to Sedona, AZ, I owe you a beer. Why doesn't the wiki say "You just spent an insane amount of money on Apple hardware, save yourself some pain and spring for the Superdrive and ethernet dongle" then direct folks to the Alternate CD? Would have saved me much aggravation. Thanks.]] < 1294344795 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CD DRIVES IN 2010 < 1294344807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't want to spend 60 fucking pounds just to install ubuntu < 1294344823 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is alternative going to do efi boot? < 1294344847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: i mean re that thing you quoted < 1294344853 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yea < 1294344880 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when i bought this i kinda assumed that ubuntu had improved mac support since 2007/2008 < 1294344881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :siiiigh < 1294344889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i realise it's not really their fault but still) < 1294344936 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think in london you can also loan out mac hardware probably < 1294344957 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not in london. and why would i want to do that < 1294344966 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought you were in london? < 1294344969 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where are you then? < 1294344989 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :up north < 1294344993 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294345013 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was gonna say go to the mac store off oxford circus and nag them until they give you a superdrive for a sec < 1294345022 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's not to be :D < 1294345134 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: i just wrote packet id parsing functions, then realised that this packet_type thing should really just be a packet ADT :D < 1294345148 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: except that translating that from your C will be fun since you don't name any of the packet items < 1294345193 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could use that Haskell implementation as a base, it has data-type-ish packets. Though I don't think I really saw much names there either. < 1294345208 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: was it you i discussed zooko's triangle with? maybe not < 1294345214 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: well i don't actually need names come to think of it < 1294345216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: got a link to that haskell? < 1294345232 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure if it's updated to the beta protocol. < 1294345292 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got the early protocol bits from https://gist.github.com/727175 -- then the rest from that one wiki.) < 1294345294 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Away now.) < 1294345309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Hmm, wait, I'll have to parse every parser manually won't I if I do this. < 1294345393 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Erm, that is, I'll have to parse even similar-parametered ones separately. < 1294345395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, it uses She. < 1294345397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*SHE. < 1294345399 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294345527 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-172-190.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294345894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do sha512 digests ever contain nul bytes? < 1294345914 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course they do < 1294346015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you suuuure :D < 1294346020 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, where does that guy you want me to kill live? < 1294346026 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: scotland. < 1294346039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: specifically, broughty ferry. < 1294346054 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The same place as Bob Servant! < 1294346107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :void packet_free(gpointer packet); < 1294346111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Shouldn't that be packet_t *? < 1294346142 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION realises that he has no idea where Dundee actually *is*. < 1294346173 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, north of Fife. < 1294346218 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders if he can get the Operative to kill him. < 1294346241 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OTOH, she refused to kidnap Edwin Brady, even though that would be far less work, so that's not likely. < 1294346257 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would guess approximately 22.16% of SHA-512 digests contain at least one 0 byte. < 1294346285 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION remembers, with growing horror, that he has a copy of The Emperor's New Mind. < 1294346301 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It's a gpointer so that it can be used as a free-func in one of the containers, I forget where. (Probably the queues.) < 1294346436 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also, you're re-hired as HHI Selector Of Components. < 1294346444 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: What do they do. < 1294346457 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, remember? For the computeer? < 1294346460 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*computer < 1294346464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Oh god. < 1294346482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : base(n, "0123456789abcdefghijklmnopqrstvuwxyzABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ") < 1294346489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone got a longer digit set that doesn't have ugly shit in it? :) < 1294346525 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, which ones are ugly? < 1294346535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: symbols mostly. < 1294346547 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, all symbols? or are some okay? < 1294346552 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ä. < 1294346552 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe. < 1294346555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: no. < 1294346558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :too swedish < 1294346565 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :â. < 1294346569 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, add the greek letters < 1294346575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe :P < 1294346579 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what are you planning to use this for? < 1294346581 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A good idea from Vorpal. < 1294346584 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How unusual. < 1294346616 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: A semi-clone of fizzie's pastebin thing, except instead of doing the useless task of URL shortening as well as pastebinning, mine does private pastebinning and image hosting. < 1294346627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Except I want to make the URLs hashes, rather than evil imperative sequential IDs. < 1294346635 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I want short-ish URLs. :P < 1294346638 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1294346653 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what about adding _ and - then? < 1294346657 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even a 32-char prefix (of a 64-char SHA-1 hash) in base 62 (0-9a-zA-Z) gives things like "8azxrfY2khCG23lFERXRWh3i4Zu". < 1294346661 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Those are ugly. Especially when repeated. < 1294346670 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well at least they won't be url encoded :P < 1294346678 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0..15 gives: ny6WsmDgQfcMWrngBmLZO6 < 1294346679 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the greek letters would be < 1294346682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and by -char I mean byte. < 1294346694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How good is a 64-bit prefix of SHA-1? :P < 1294346705 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As good as a 64-bit hash. < 1294346714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Um, greek letters in URLs work fine, just not Greek domains. And even those might. < 1294346720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Good enough? :p < 1294346730 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, they will end up encoded as %nn surely? < 1294346737 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I doubt it. < 1294346748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sheesh, even a 12-bit hash gives "ny6WsmDgQfcMWrngBmLZO6". < 1294346750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm. < 1294346754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*96-bit < 1294346767 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, a counter does have some advantages :P < 1294346774 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I liked the "shortest unconflicting prefix, lookup oldest-first" thing, but it does have the "URLs get longer as time passes" property. < 1294346794 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: And is also EVIL and STATEFUL. < 1294346812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Is that what your thing does? < 1294346821 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, just paste data uris instead. Self contained! (though it completely missed all the other points < 1294346821 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, include "$" < 1294346826 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I think my thing just generates a random fixed-length ID when you dont' specify one. < 1294346827 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't get url encoded < 1294346828 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: ew :) < 1294346833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: it'll look like /etc/shadow < 1294346846 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ls: /etc/shadow: No such file or directory < 1294346868 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why don't you just want to use a sequential numeric id? < 1294346891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:46 variable: elliott, ls: /etc/shadow: No such file or directory < 1294346897 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would you have preferred I said /etc/master.passwd? < 1294346904 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-} < 1294346905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and confused everyone? < 1294346914 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that's what freebsd calls it too btw < 1294346917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sequential numeric IDs are evil and stateful, duh. < 1294346920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: that's why i said it. < 1294346923 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable is a BSD zealot :p < 1294346926 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1294346933 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I thought it was what os x uses < 1294346936 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something < 1294346946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Seems" to. < 1294346954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But there's probably some LDAP database somewhere that it _really_ uses. ;-) < 1294346963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# Note that this file is consulted directly only when the system is running < 1294346963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# in single-user mode. At other times this information is provided by < 1294346963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# Open Directory. < 1294346965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HA < 1294346967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was right! < 1294346970 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ldap for local, so screwed < 1294346971 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and more than likely it would be possible to change one and not the other < 1294346977 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then get screwed :-} < 1294346982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Apple's Open Directory architecture includes source code for both direc- < 1294346982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : tory client access and directory servers. Open Directory forms the foun- < 1294346982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : dation of how Mac OS X accesses all authoritative configuration informa- < 1294346984 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : tion (users, groups, mounts, managed desktop data, etc.). Mac OS X < 1294346985 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : obtains this information via abstraction APIs, enabling use of virtually < 1294346986 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION undermines Mt. Vorpal's security system with some redstone torches and some TNT. < 1294346987 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : any directory system. Configuration of Open Directory is done through < 1294346990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : the Directory Utility applications in /Applications/Utilities. This < 1294346992 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : application can configure plugin settings, including turning on/off vari- < 1294346994 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ous directory services. < 1294346995 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Seems it's some custom thing. < 1294346998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Woo, now we'll never get a TNT kit. < 1294347014 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you misparsed, clearly. < 1294347024 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's LDAP-compatible, though. < 1294347028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I did? < 1294347029 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least to some extent. < 1294347035 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used the torches for the undermining; I simply *have* some TNT. < 1294347039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1294347042 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no intention of *using* it. < 1294347046 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obviously. < 1294347058 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Apple — compatible — to some extent — never a good sign. < 1294347199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: So, a 40 bit hash -- it'll totally last forever right? < 1294347223 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A 48-bit hash is about as high as I'l go. < 1294347225 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're reasonably likely to have collisions when you have around 2^20 entries. < 1294347233 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or 2^24 for that. < 1294347282 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And to think: if only we wouldn't celebrate birthdays, there would be no birthday paradox, and we could get by with half as long hash functions. (What do you mean it doesn't work that way?) < 1294347295 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294347318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'm more asking whether a 40-bit hash might cause me problems if, say, SHA-1 is broken. OK, OK, that'll only help for intentional collisions. < 1294347320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT STILL. < 1294347334 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are there any quote bots here? < 1294347343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: hackego; `quote is the main command, it also greps if you give it an argument < 1294347348 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1294347348 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless it's a number in which case you have to parenthesis it < 1294347350 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you worry about intentional collisions, 40 bits is quite bruteforceable even without breaking SHA-1. < 1294347351 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*parenthesise < 1294347352 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it's egrep) < 1294347357 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote fizzie < 1294347361 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"`pastequotes [optional grep]" and "`pastenquotes" are also quite nice < 1294347370 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no I want to remember one < 1294347371 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: are you trying to add it? :) < 1294347373 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294347378 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: `addquote foo < 1294347382 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: 40 bit prefixes of SHA-1 hashes to identify every entry in a combined pastebin/image database < 1294347384 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: FEASIBLE??? < 1294347393 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: or should i go for a prefix of an SHA-2 function. or just increase the size < 1294347402 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, will it only add the last one - or could I say to remember one from before < 1294347410 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: um you have to type it in manually < 1294347411 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus the foo < 1294347423 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote And to think: if only we wouldn't celebrate birthdays, there would be no birthday paradox, and we could get by with half as long hash functions. (What do you mean it doesn't work that way?) < 1294347426 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah. I was thinking of something like !grab user :-} < 1294347427 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :demonstration :> < 1294347482 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where is hackego, anyway? < 1294347501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOOD QUESTION < 1294347502 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: < 1294347511 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!help < 1294347517 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeellllllllllllllllllppppppppppp < 1294347520 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I killed 'im. < 1294347525 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why ? < 1294347527 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!HELP YOU DAMN BOT < 1294347529 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I stabbed 'im with a filet knife. < 1294347542 0 :EgoBot!~EgoBot@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1294347545 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1294347556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote And to think: if only we wouldn't celebrate birthdays, there would be no birthday paradox, and we could get by with half as long hash functions. (What do you mean it doesn't work that way?) < 1294347557 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wb EgoBot and HackEgo < 1294347566 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, they both yours? < 1294347572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294347574 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yuh < 1294347575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he just controls them < 1294347578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with his mind < 1294347579 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :261) And to think: if only we wouldn't celebrate birthdays, there would be no birthday paradox, and we could get by with half as long hash functions. (What do you mean it doesn't work that way?) < 1294347579 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mine to stab and/or filet. < 1294347585 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1294347588 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :183) you should be eating corpses more < 1294347593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1294347594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1294347595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1294347595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1294347596 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :32) after all, what are DVD players for? < 1294347598 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :226) [...] I'm just widening the shaft to be 4x2 or so. < 1294347600 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :100) Discrimination fields ACTIVATE. < 1294347602 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :165) you don't have an urethra, you're a girl. < 1294347610 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott, ah. I was thinking of something like !grab user :-} < 1294347616 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The quotes are of ... mixed quality. < 1294347622 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I *did* clean them up before! but somehow it hasn't helped < 1294347625 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hrm? < 1294347637 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!showinterp pi < 1294347649 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!show pi < 1294347651 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sh read p; if [ "x$p" = "x" ]; then p=5; fi; echo "scale=$p; a(1)*4;" | BC_LINE_LENGTH=490 bc -l | tr -d '\\' < 1294347713 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!addinterp grab sh read u; echo '`quote' $u < 1294347714 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interpreter grab installed. < 1294347720 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!grab elliott < 1294347721 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote elliott < 1294347722 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :209) elliott: i like scsh's mechanism best: it's most transparent and doesn't really serve a very useful feature. \ 212) elliott: it's hard to debug havoc on your mirror if you accidentally hit r, then a character could be multiple words long, depending on the task. \ 221) elliott: My university has < 1294347736 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like the fact that none of the quotes are his. < 1294347736 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294347737 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is, um, not quite what grab was meant to do, methinks. < 1294347751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote <(elliott|ehird)[^>]+> < 1294347752 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have no VISION < 1294347753 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1294347759 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1294347760 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1294347764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sucks to be me < 1294347773 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, `grab user is supposed to `addquote the last thing user said < 1294347796 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!delinterp grab < 1294347797 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interpreter grab deleted. < 1294347800 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ARE YOU HAPPY NOW < 1294347800 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can't be done by da botses. < 1294347802 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!pi < 1294347802 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3.14156 < 1294347815 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, why not? < 1294347826 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EgoBot, you got it WRONG - your missing digits < 1294347827 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!pi 10 < 1294347828 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3.1415926532 < 1294347841 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: They strictly react to their relevant activation character, they don't record anything else. < 1294347847 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION can't help but think something is up here. < 1294347870 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Define something. < 1294347879 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!pi < 1294347880 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3.14156 < 1294347883 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!pi 10 < 1294347884 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3.1415926532 < 1294347895 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note the 5th digit of each. < 1294347953 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume it's because a(1) isn't terribly precise. < 1294348001 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote poultry < 1294348002 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :221) elliott: My university has two Poultry Science buildings. Two! < 1294348183 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Player count: 6349 < 1294348183 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Player count: 6350 < 1294348183 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Player count: 6351 < 1294348184 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I think a(1) is precise up to the given "scale", it's just that it takes a(1)*4 there. See, 3.14156/4 = 0.78539; that's... well, actually that's only a truncated five-significant-digits of a(1), not a rounded one. There's that too. < 1294348187 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, what the^ < 1294348195 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari, it kept counting up insanely fast < 1294348197 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1294348197 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, ^ < 1294348201 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn tab complete < 1294348227 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, I logged off when minecraft started swap trashing from it < 1294348235 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a lot of players. < 1294348251 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, except mcmap didn't report a lot of players showing up < 1294348287 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and now server seems down < 1294348324 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, you were on just before that happened. Is it down? < 1294348328 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you see the same thing? < 1294348348 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hate num lnock < 1294348360 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> pi < 1294348361 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 3.141592653589793 < 1294348365 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> pi^2 < 1294348366 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 9.869604401089358 < 1294348391 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote what, you mean that wasn't your real name? Gosh, I guess it is. I never realized that. \ 19) ehird has gone insane, clearly. \ 21) oerjan: are you a man, if there weren't evil in this kingdom to you! you shall find bekkler! executing program. please let me go... put me out! he's really < 1294348448 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think that grep is entirely accurate... < 1294348481 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: howso < 1294348490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < < 1294348492 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1294348494 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think < may be a special char < 1294348496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote \< < 1294348497 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1294348501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe it's still broken < 1294348504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it was broken at one point < 1294348504 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: [<]oe should have matched , no? < 1294348510 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm indeed < 1294348513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`paste bin/quote < 1294348514 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.6107 < 1294348515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: enjoy fixing < 1294348564 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1294348569 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run [ "<" ]; echo $? < 1294348571 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 < 1294348573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294348575 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@2001:4428:251:1:21f:16ff:fe68:a55 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294348575 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294348575 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1294348730 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could file(1) be enough to detect programming languages, I wonder? < 1294348794 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, for some certainly: #!/bin/sh is a definitely clue for the first line < 1294348806 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I mean with the default db -- I recall file tells me "C source" sometimes < 1294348813 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it does < 1294348815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the file here I have is OS X file which is ~limited, so i'll ssh into rutian to check < 1294348824 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you need to have a good magic database < 1294348825 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, DID YOU KNOW: < 1294348829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: duh :) < 1294348830 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes - it could be good enough < 1294348838 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The order in which Oolite loads OXPs is non-deterministic. < 1294348841 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but if you want something even better - look at ohloh < 1294348842 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well ubuntu file can't detect ruby code at least < 1294348844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: :D < 1294348850 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but then it identifies charset and such, and that isn't using the magic db iirc < 1294348850 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's no effort to sort it *at all*. < 1294348863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: ohloh tends to get things wildly wrong in my experience :-D < 1294348872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: and i doubt they have some open source software to do the magic < 1294348878 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, they do < 1294348882 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-} < 1294348893 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, mostly ohloh mixes up C and C++, though it was worse before < 1294348907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: hmm < 1294348908 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and yes their software for doing that is/was FOSS < 1294348917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :their site is hell to navigate so links would be nice :D < 1294348918 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it does basic line counting stuff too < 1294348928 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, google for "ohcount" iirc < 1294348942 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all I need is language detection for single streams of text, for my pastebin < 1294348944 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sourceforge.net/p/ohloh/oh-count/ci/452d902d8f69afc10eecb2e382b0f39cc2342e92/tree/ < 1294348948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I imagine using the file extension would be more practical, though :) < 1294348973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, that does not look like normal sourceforge. < 1294348977 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohloh? < 1294348987 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: this semi-useless site. < 1294349341 0 :myndzi!myndzi@c-24-19-39-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294349376 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION decides to poke into Oolite's code just to show that fixing the loading order would be trivial. < 1294349380 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will probably fail. < 1294349396 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> fix((0:).tail.(([[0,1],[1,0]]!!)=<<)) < 1294349398 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : [0,1,1,0,1,0,0,1,1,0,0,1,0,1,1,0,1,0,0,1,0,1,1,0,0,1,1,0,1,0,0,1,1,0,0,1,0,... < 1294349414 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ohloh used to be owned by sourceforge < 1294349422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: oh. that explains the suckage. < 1294349427 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmhm, so i guess fizzie stopped working on the win version < 1294349434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what < 1294349436 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie got it working < 1294349438 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just didn't redownload < 1294349439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i even pinged you about it < 1294349456 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i downloaded that version and it didn't wokr < 1294349457 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*work < 1294349464 0 :myndzi\!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1294349466 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least i downloaded one after fizzie said it works < 1294349474 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unfortunately it crashed when someone talked < 1294349486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: didn't he redo it < 1294349486 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coords worked tho < 1294349488 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ? < 1294349491 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i can prolly use it now < 1294349501 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll just hope none of you play today < 1294349541 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I didn't "redo" it, since I'm not sure why it crashes. < 1294349551 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll try to get it working, though. < 1294349563 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But not today; I'll be un-internetted fri/sat/sun, and have to do some packing before. < 1294349586 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's comforting to know that when it crashes in Wine, it in fact crashes also in real life, because then I can perhaps test it locally too. < 1294349706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: how can you ever be uninternetted WHY < 1294349717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait are you moving, can i come visit, oklopol will come too < 1294349729 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, no, it's just the Stockholm trip I mentioned. < 1294349880 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294349900 0 :Wamanuz3!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294349929 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294349937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: so err i don't quite understand zpaste, does it store pastes in files < 1294349963 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1294349980 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Named after, well, the name. < 1294350081 0 :Wamanuz2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1294350236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294350247 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294350586 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are we talking about the stockholm syndrome? < 1294350864 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you have failed in your duties as Selector Of Components. < 1294351114 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: What's your budget again? £3? < 1294351125 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$expensive. < 1294351139 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :£expensive, too < 1294351158 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1294351173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Wasn't it £800? < 1294351175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Close to £3. < 1294351178 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or was it £700. < 1294351185 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :£800 is good. < 1294351216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: And ... general requirements? :P < 1294351229 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hmm. < 1294351240 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doesn't crash when I play Oolite with the Griff ships. < 1294351262 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(:P) < 1294351278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You could get that for £300. :p < 1294351297 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes, that was facetious. < 1294351305 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So was mine. < 1294351534 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I NEED OPINIONS < 1294351552 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: When taking a short (40 or 48-bit) prefix of a hash function, is it best to take a prefix of SHA-1 or one of the SHA-2 functions? If the latter, which? < 1294351580 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I, and, uh. < 1294351585 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you usually walk from the cube, or do you always /spawn? < 1294351613 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: /spawn, yup :D < 1294351617 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: walk from to where < 1294351643 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, anywhere, it's pretty disconnected from the others < 1294351653 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which are mostly near spawn < 1294351654 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, actually, not really. < 1294351664 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant's is further, for instance. < 1294351668 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, right < 1294351720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm i wonder where mount hoover is relative to cube < 1294351723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it's quite close in one axis < 1294351729 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a bit of a walk in the other < 1294351832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'd just walk back to spawn really < 1294351836 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well < 1294351837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: actually < 1294351848 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'd walk to ineiros and use the minecart system ... except getting into ineiros' pit from below is hard < 1294351861 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, that's why i'm asking < 1294351863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the minecart system is connected to pretty much anywhere, so if you get on there you're golden, assuming lag is low enough < 1294351878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you could make a hole outside ineiros' pit that leads near the minecart station there :D < 1294351879 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The track to my place is probably nearest, it's how I go to the cube. < 1294351880 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because i couldn't find a way there, so anyway i decided i'll just walk at random until i find something, it's worked for me sofar < 1294351891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after all Phantom_Hoover did the connecting, not ineiros < 1294351893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: huh? < 1294351899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: you go to your house, and then walk to the cube? < 1294351905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that must take a long time surely < 1294351914 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I start from spawn, minecart to around x = -200, then walk the rest. < 1294351967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: er how, the express doesn't have any stops? < 1294351970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you just sit there monitoring F3 < 1294351975 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Monitor F3. < 1294351979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: :D < 1294351981 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: how do you get out < 1294351986 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whack the cart. < 1294351989 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294351990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :out of the station < 1294352008 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've dug two sets of stairs out (the second because I couldn't find the first; at the top I noticed it was about two blocks to the side) < 1294352009 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: how I do it is: go to ineiros, jump out the northern end, walk over the tiny hill there, then just go west to the cube (about 400 zs away) < 1294352018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: what's your way? < 1294352020 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it's quicker < 1294352025 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My way is probably faster than yours then < 1294352027 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, do you have mcmap? < 1294352030 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Given that it's also around 400 zs < 1294352032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: uh sort of. < 1294352034 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the x is all minecart < 1294352035 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't really use it much :D < 1294352052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: yeah but mine doesn't involve holding down F3 and gettin' all twichy < 1294352054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*twitchy < 1294352055 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's relaxin' < 1294352059 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The US military is *cutting its budget*. < 1294352066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: also, hell is chilly < 1294352070 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Turn it on, with map mode, then walk to fizzie's, then to that weird dirt thing in the sky, then to the Hall of Midas, then to the cube. < 1294352083 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It's not twitchy, just click once at around 200. :-P < 1294352106 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: TWITCHY MAN < 1294352115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: "weird dirt thing in the sky"? < 1294352124 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you can see it on the map. < 1294352134 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a bunch of squares supported by a pillar. < 1294352172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: you mean the one with the tree? < 1294352176 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: "Indeed, the pretty printer is too stupid to rename identifiers in case of clash. The result is incomprehensible output as you witnessed. A possible workaround is to try and name identifiers everywhere in the input. < 1294352180 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUu < 1294352182 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, erm, no. < 1294352188 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: where's that from :D < 1294352197 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/dependent_types/comments/efb3y/micro_agda_a_simplistic_language_with_native/c1bolme?context=3 < 1294352199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: PREFIX SHA-1 OR SHA-2 < 1294352204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: :DDDDDDD < 1294352207 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: SHA-2 < 1294352211 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: why < 1294352213 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BECAUSE HIGHER NUMBERS ARE BETTER DOOD < 1294352215 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294352215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ok fine < 1294352217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: which SHA-2 < 1294352221 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YES < 1294352222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: do you know anything about this < 1294352224 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so mad < 1294352226 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have to fix this myself < 1294352300 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, why is the US military cutting its budget? < 1294352303 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$178 billion cut in war spending. < 1294352331 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294352334 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Partly to make the US budget more balanced, partly because it's a bunch of stuff that is completely unneeded. < 1294352343 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::/ < 1294352347 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they don't even use a monad < 1294352348 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, like the UK's aircraftless aircraft carriers? < 1294352356 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which we totally need, apparently. < 1294352373 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Republicans are upset about it. < 1294352378 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"We're in two wars!" < 1294352394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i love how that reddit discussion is about the difficult task of proving that 0 is not 1 < 1294352398 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... And nearly insolvent, and the military budget is half the budget. < 1294352433 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is indeed a weird dirt thing; I've wondered about it. What's it supposed to be? < 1294352447 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: thies thing has horrible code duplication < 1294352458 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but even with the usual set theoretic construction definition of complex numbers, isn't 0 != 1 trivial? < 1294352463 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah you can't prove that in this language :P < 1294352465 0 :pumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294352469 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: useful! < 1294352476 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know 1 != 2 is almost direct at least < 1294352480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: hey it represents dependent values as their folds < 1294352483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/induction combinators < 1294352486 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and 1 + 1 = 2 < 1294352487 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I have no idea at all. < 1294352494 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: lol @ specifying it on complexes < 1294352503 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294352505 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just know that from it you can see the Hall of Midas on the map. < 1294352521 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you use something like successor functions, then 0 != 1 is basically by def < 1294352530 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: sha-224, 256, 384 or 512 < 1294352532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for prefixing < 1294352538 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if you're doing reals, might as well do complexes < 1294352539 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: not in uAgda :D < 1294352553 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh. < 1294352560 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting < 1294352576 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or probably it's trivial but hell of a chore for some technical reason? < 1294352582 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's not possible < 1294352590 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Laik, higher numbers better < 1294352593 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: 1024 < 1294352608 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: laik, clearly the 512 thing has all its hash info spread out whereas 256 is more compact < 1294352609 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it could be added thogh < 1294352614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so taking a prefix of 256 is more useful < 1294352617 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and information filled < 1294352618 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: duhh < 1294352627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::trollface: < 1294352632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523 ais523 ais523 < 1294352642 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's by definition, but you can't access the definition < 1294352654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:51:58 I have decided to use spivak on IRC, all over. < 1294352656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: that didn't work out < 1294352669 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: can you prove true /= false in uagda? < 1294352728 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think so < 1294352749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: hmm < 1294352769 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well, SHA-224 == SHA-256 except with different initial state and it's "pre-truncated" by omitting one 32-bit word at the end, so for truncation purposes it's pretty likely SHA-224 and SHA-256 are essentially equivalent; the same for SHA-384 vs. SHA-512. < 1294352798 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The truncated versions aren't even any faster to compute. < 1294352801 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Well, right. I'm just wondering whether it's better to take a small prefix of SHA-1, SHA-256, or HSA < 1294352802 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*SHA-512. < 1294352817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: can you prove (\sf zf -> zf) /= (\n sf zf -> sf (n sf zf)) in Coq given uhh I forget the name of the axiom < 1294352826 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall f g,(f=g)<->(forall x, f x = g x) < 1294352829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that one < 1294352832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note <-> not -> < 1294352835 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er <- rather < 1294352839 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although wait < 1294352841 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the axiom only needs -> < 1294352843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294352846 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but can you derive < 1294352853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(exists x, f x /= gx) -> (f/=g) from that < 1294352857 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, y'know what the Cube needs? < 1294352862 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A spleef arena. < 1294352891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: If and only if it's lined with obsidian. < 1294352902 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not want any "accidental" breakages that leave LavaLite flooded everywhere. < 1294352915 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is so annoying, I can't see how to make this code print out names properly < 1294352964 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: that didn't work out <-- indeed < 1294352985 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i might just start calling everyone and everything "it" < 1294352985 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the biggest cave in the world? < 1294352993 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: define "cave" < 1294353002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are tons of massive cavern systems that keep connecting to things you didn't know about :D < 1294353008 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, manmade hole in earth < 1294353028 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean in terms of blocks removed < 1294353031 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294353036 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess the whole fucking system is connected < 1294353053 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most of that is "natural" cavernetics, though. < 1294353061 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but anyway, at subtree, the actual number of blocks removed did not look like that much < 1294353067 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would think Vorpal's mines have the largest number of blocks removed. < 1294353084 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well ineiros' pit basically... vorpal's mines don't count as holes since < 1294353085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh < 1294353091 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know what they count as; a diagnosis? < 1294353098 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, ineiros' pit is not very big < 1294353103 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what about the old mines? < 1294353104 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: It's very deep, though. < 1294353106 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: um it goes down to near bedrock < 1294353113 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: very near in fact < 1294353122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and it's on a high mountain < 1294353124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's like 100 deep < 1294353129 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've built like 10 caves like that, never from a mountain tho < 1294353135 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but point is, that is not that many blocks < 1294353138 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oklopol: well ineiros' pit basically... vorpal's mines don't count as holes since <-- why not < 1294353145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: because they're not hollow < 1294353155 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1294353158 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly never as big, because i just do it when i wanna start underground mining < 1294353171 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, in area, which of course means much less blocks < 1294353200 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well. the stairs aren't really holes < 1294353203 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're ... diagonal holes :D < 1294353247 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: http://zem.fi/~fis/miney.png -- that thing top-right is I think parts of Vorpal's mines. (But I'm no expert on them.) < 1294353263 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. diagnosis definitely < 1294353265 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The mine tunnels aren't that many blocks either, I guess. < 1294353281 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I don't think we have very large man-made holes there. < 1294353282 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than ineiros' pit surely < 1294353301 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, mines > pit < 1294353319 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they were definitely tons longer than 128 < 1294353338 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people should just fix their code for me :( < 1294353340 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and maybe like sixth of the area? can't really assess < 1294353368 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, *checks < 1294353386 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oklopol: http://zem.fi/~fis/miney.png -- that thing top-right is I think parts of Vorpal's mines. (But I'm no expert on them.) <-- yep < 1294353393 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: It's composed of rather thin tunnels, though. < 1294353436 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if i make mines like that, people can just look at them with an editor? < 1294353439 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, nice view of my tree farm too there. < 1294353453 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's hard to get a good grasp of block-volumes from the slices generated by mcmap. < 1294353454 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, fizzie is using mcmap < 1294353466 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I have no clue about the block volumes either < 1294353476 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought you needed to have been there, but clearly fizzie hasn't gone to your mines < 1294353500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: so do i prefix SHA-1, SHA-256 or SHA-512 INQUIRING MINDS WANT TO KNOW < 1294353503 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I have, in fact, but I didn't this time. The region shown there is the region the server sends chunks for when you stand there in the middle. < 1294353504 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, he is on ground somewhere near < 1294353507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you just need to go close enough < 1294353515 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: On top of your mountain, in fact. < 1294353566 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah < 1294353577 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Random thought: I could have mcmap generate a "minecraft-compatible" world-dump, though; then you could "play" in there, and also run all those pretty-picture offline mapmakers if you wanted. (Though of course only the regions you had walked around in mcmap.) < 1294353615 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've forgotten whether you got the terrain-generation seed out of the handshake packets; it might've been there. (And it might have not.) < 1294353652 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, even if you do, my mines are in pre-halloween but iirc a tiny section crosses into post-halloween < 1294353691 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, you'd get discontinuatitities there, but less. And of course I could make mcmap able to "overwrite" an existing world-dump if you already went and moved around in there. < 1294353709 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, the map seed is in fact there. < 1294353710 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hah < 1294353723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :discontinuatitties < 1294353762 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, I did put a launcher-option-setting dialog in the win32 port, with pure win32 api. Mwah-ahaha. (But I didn't fix the crashing bugs. Priorities, priorities...) < 1294353808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Ooh, ooh, make sure to misspell words, make the padding all weird, have checkboxes for things that should be radio buttons, and ideally have only one button, "Do it", and have the actual action controlled by other elements of the interface. < 1294353817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Writing "Username:" as "UserName :" gets extra bonus points. < 1294353825 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294353828 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is very weird when it comes to control-positioning. < 1294353844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: As well as using a title like "::[ McMAP v.3.2 ] by fizzie:: [Connect]" < 1294353923 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: would it be cheeky to fix the bug in such a horrible way that he feels the need to rewrite the whole thing better rather than applying it? < 1294353939 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294353948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you social engineer, you < 1294353991 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (_₁ : A⇧¹ → (_quux : A⇧¹) → P₁) → < 1294353991 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (_₁quux : A⇧¹ → (_quux : A⇧¹) → P₁quux) → < 1294353992 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's better < 1294354017 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: please tell me you can get quuxquuxquux < 1294354021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something < 1294354025 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah if there's three nested types < 1294354062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: why not just make it use ' < 1294354065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or even UNICODE PRIME < 1294354076 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah that would work :P < 1294354239 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Coreutils in HASKELL -- best idea or worst idea or worst idea or best worst idea < 1294354252 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Both. Simultaneously. < 1294354262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: HERE'S MY CAT IMPLEMENTATION < 1294354269 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :main = putStr =<< getContents < 1294354282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait should probably disable buffering before doing that < 1294354283 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But arguments! < 1294354319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: oh yeah indeed < 1294354325 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: well i have something to tell you brother < 1294354327 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: FUCK ARGUMENTS < 1294354332 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1294354333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(cat x >y < 1294354567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Elliott-Hirds-MacBook-Air% x >y" is also fairly pointless as "| tee x >y" does the job just as well. < 1294355084 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Oh, right, that. Well, I mean, theoretically speaking SHA-512 will have a larger safety margin (more rounds and so on) when it comes to getting breaked so that you can solve it faster than brute-force, but if your truncation is small enough to be practically bruteforceable then it really doesn't matter. < 1294355138 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: sha256 is a lot faster, at least (when applied to large images; though I am using the hideously efficient pure library. I'll try a binding.) < 1294355168 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I might just go with a truncated SHA-256, it's cheaper to compute than SHA-512 and all. And I'm sure hashing speed will of course be your bottleneck. < 1294355185 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: It will, yes, my network is instant. < 1294355251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I have a feeling that OS X users tend to use zsh. I don't know why. < 1294355252 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@bas5-toronto47-1167928546.dsl.bell.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1294355256 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I blame your heritage. < 1294355260 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what will you do in case of a collision? < 1294355262 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: That combines with every *other* redirection thing, though. < 1294355272 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I started using zsh *after* OS X. < 1294355273 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, on the truncated hash I mean < 1294355278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: *** OH GOD HASH COLLISION: WHY GOD WHY < 1294355287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The likely of a hash collision with 40 or 48 bits is pretty unlikely :p < 1294355288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*:P < 1294355289 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: >(x) >(y) < 1294355290 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*likelihood < 1294355294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I wasn't _specifically_ trying to break shit. < 1294355299 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so it will properly refuse upload of the collided file then? < 1294355300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Clearly | should be sugar for >(...). < 1294355304 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : main = putStr =<< getContents <-- you mean main = interact id >:) < 1294355306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes. < 1294355309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i was considering that :) < 1294355319 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how will it handle exact dupe < 1294355326 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :silent? < 1294355328 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: What do you mean. Uploading the same file twice? < 1294355336 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes < 1294355338 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'll just barf out and say there's a hash collision, probably. :p < 1294355349 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294355349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I might make it say "This has already been added! ...or else there's a hash collision." < 1294355353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is, after all, single-user. < 1294355367 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably. < 1294355498 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, why leave the game? :/ < 1294355514 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: after before before http://pastebin.com/swa5r518 < 1294355515 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Early morning tomorrow, have a boat to catch. < 1294355537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what :D < 1294355543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: a boat? you so zany < 1294355547 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hope it doesn't break. But in case it does bring 4 wood < 1294355547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: don't finns have zeppelins < 1294355551 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with their suave tech < 1294355554 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: what < 1294355555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294355555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh. < 1294355558 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err 5 < 1294355558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: shoot Vorpal < 1294355559 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even < 1294355569 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, :P < 1294355579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone know a country with lax border checks? < 1294355582 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, around? < 1294355582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we can have an esoteric meetup there < 1294355584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i can bring a gun < 1294355586 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and shoot Vorpal < 1294355661 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what's your opinion of TinyCore? < 1294355663 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you cannot have zeppelins in worlds where the nazis have lost the war, duh < 1294355676 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You only need about a million pasted items before the probability of having at least one collision in there starts to get close to 50%, for a 40-bit hash. < 1294355685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It's not called TinyCore, for one. < 1294355693 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: untrue (c.f. His Dark Materials) < 1294355699 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :simple time traveler axiom < 1294355704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: 48-bit, then? < 1294355712 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, 16 million. < 1294355713 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i haven't read that SO IT DOESN'T EXIST < 1294355717 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how rare is clay? i don't remember seeing any on your map before this, and all i've done is walked around at random for hours < 1294355718 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess for private use it's not too bad. < 1294355730 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Quite a lot of nearby clay has been snarfed up. < 1294355747 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is very upset that zeppelins never took off (har har). < 1294355752 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But it is a bit on the rare side too.) < 1294355771 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't never be in the near. < 1294355799 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clay pretty much only happens near sandy beaches. < 1294355811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294355814 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did I even eat breakfast today? < 1294355817 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think so < 1294355819 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1294355836 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294355840 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Clay pretty much only happens near sandy beaches. <-- also in deserts < 1294355846 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you'd hate his dark materials, it's preachy-atheist :) < 1294355859 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: but i thought they were the bomb! < 1294355891 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stick + coal --> burning torch ... makes sense < 1294355907 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, it's obvious! < 1294355934 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And four ingots of iron and a pile of redstone dust -> compass! Also obvious! < 1294355988 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A diamond inside some planks -> jukebox! Equally clear! < 1294356006 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the hell? These torches don't light < 1294356009 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clearly you mash a quarter of a bit of coal into a quarter of a stick. < 1294356013 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, is it day? < 1294356020 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it's night < 1294356036 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh youhave to right click < 1294356041 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294356054 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have to place a torch before it starts giving out any light. Obvious! < 1294356064 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to light stick, right click < 1294356072 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294356085 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this game is just so cosy < 1294356114 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Though did the better-light mod add a carried-torch light source too? Maybe I am just imagining things. There is at least one handheld-torch-light mod.) < 1294356134 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: But where should I write "click" to? < 1294356148 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294356164 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: cosy :D < 1294356167 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: met a creeper yet? < 1294356175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: no, better light doesn't add that < 1294356185 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't thin < 1294356203 0 :BMG!~behold@d83-183-183-70.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1294356206 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes I drilled into the side of a mountain and there was a lava stream below so I went that way and then this guy jumps out of nowhere and blows up right next to me LOL < 1294356215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: :D < 1294356219 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: did you see his face < 1294356222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: his horrifying < 1294356224 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: horrifying face < 1294356240 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294356240 0 :BMG!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294356246 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :BeholdMyGlory < 1294356352 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you just broke oklopol trying to get coord when you spoke < 1294356360 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i apologise sincerely < 1294356362 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he *just* rejoined with mcmap < 1294356403 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1294356432 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294356573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294356588 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294356739 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice, gdmflexiserver has an easter egg < 1294356757 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, down? < 1294356769 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ^ < 1294356782 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294356784 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: o...kay? < 1294356799 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: btw i'm just gonna buy a superdrive < 1294356812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've already given apple >£1k, what's £60 more, sigh < 1294356819 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i thought in case you ever need to measure \pi in a rudimentary setup that only has sh and gdmflexiserver. < 1294356827 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: wonderful < 1294356925 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ubuntu is free, think of it as still being cheaper than windows vista.. and you get a free disk drive! < 1294356944 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :today i found out we've got a 10" hard drive in another room < 1294356963 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's huge and bulky and the metal casing is like 2cm thick cast iron < 1294356982 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with reinforcement grid < 1294356988 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could survive an atomic blast ez < 1294357033 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually i think it might be 14" < 1294357097 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://rigaux.org/language-study/syntax-across-languages --> people here might be interested < 1294357132 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1294358288 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294358685 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294358872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: make the fans quieter :( < 1294358873 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294359423 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iatv18rAK-k < 1294359554 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fill your house with water so that you don't have to worry about firwes? < 1294359588 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, alternately, build with something non-flammable. < 1294359619 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294360021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: lol :D < 1294360023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: just worry about drowning < 1294360202 0 :cheater00!~cheater@g224202250.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294360299 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@bas5-toronto47-1167928546.dsl.bell.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1294360385 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294360474 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: dwodwondwoind < 1294360484 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :me knows < 1294360529 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it possible to download minecraft worlds that people have made? < 1294360560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: sort of. < 1294360565 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people occasionally put them up < 1294361666 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Margarie may have won the war, but she hasn't won the battle < 1294361722 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kVyDDXWRs7k < 1294361890 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1294362124 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: are you in ubuntu now? < 1294362131 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: or is that in osx? < 1294362135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: lolno, why would i be, yes os x, why? < 1294362140 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i know there's a fix for ubuntu :D < 1294362143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i bought a superdrive ;( < 1294362146 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know < 1294362150 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'll be ok < 1294362162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: i think it's not a thing that needs fixing, i think it's just that this thing is optimised for silence when you do nothing and then raging fans when you do < 1294362165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because of insufficient cooling otherwise < 1294362177 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :our society supports anything that's expendable < 1294362177 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because real mac users don't play minecraft < 1294362186 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah < 1294362187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i support death < 1294362193 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a crazy raging fans fix for ubuntu < 1294362196 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i bet for macs too < 1294362205 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also what helps is one of those stands < 1294362211 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just put something under it so that it has air under it < 1294362222 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know, macbook air.. works better with air amirite? < 1294362262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not really raging < 1294362267 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just louder than i'd like :> < 1294362278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: actually i position one leg to cover the vent. < 1294362281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it quietens it slightly. < 1294362284 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a core duo laptop which is supersilent (since i put in a new hdd) < 1294362293 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the toshiba was nice and silent. < 1294362296 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i have a core 2 duo pc next to it which is inaudible < 1294362302 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a feeling they used smaller fans in this to save space. < 1294362311 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this one's some sort of crappy old advent thing that my stupid drughead flatmate left behind < 1294362318 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i took it because he thought it was broken < 1294362322 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294362328 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he left it because he thought it was broken, and i took it. < 1294362334 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when he moved out :) < 1294362347 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was broken in that there was a virus that would reboot your pc after 5 minutes. < 1294362367 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm surprised they even fit any fans into the thing < 1294362439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm gonna build that super-powerful silent pc sometime. sometime. :p < 1294362448 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it's very simple < 1294362456 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: ah, you misunderstand how perfectionist I am < 1294362467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: I have spent many, many hours reading random, beyond-obscure topics on silentpcreview < 1294362470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :worried about LCD whine even < 1294362470 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you misunderstand how perfectionist *i* am < 1294362475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: let's put it this way < 1294362494 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: if it doesn't have an expensive AMD CPU (AMDs are of course ridiculously hot), and a good graphics card, it's imperfect, BUT ALSO if it has a _single_ fan it's imperfect < 1294362501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it must be completely solid state apart from the bulk storage drive < 1294362506 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why amd and not intel? < 1294362508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which will be in a quietening enclosure. < 1294362519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: don't wish to support intel's business practices any more. < 1294362526 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AMDs are hot and not as fancy, but *shrug* < 1294362531 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the wattage of an amd? < 1294362536 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: higher than an intel :) < 1294362542 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well let's put it this way < 1294362561 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just put my hand on the heatsink of this pc.. < 1294362571 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's barely warm < 1294362580 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like, "this tea is getting cold" warm < 1294362615 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: you realise that even silentpcreview's work pc in the anechoic chamber used when monitoring the dBA levels of equipment and shit ... < 1294362617 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: has a fan? :D < 1294362618 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the loudest thing in this pc is inarguably the power supply.. < 1294362620 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one single, 140mm case fan. < 1294362629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i consider even _that_ unacceptable. < 1294362634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: oh yeah, i really want a solid-state PSU too < 1294362638 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that seems unlikely < 1294362641 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you misunderstood < 1294362642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know of a 400W solid state one < 1294362648 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you know what microphonics are? < 1294362656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, yes i do < 1294362658 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the enemy :) < 1294362663 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: is the psu fanless? < 1294362667 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294362668 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :450w < 1294362671 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: omg link < 1294362676 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: i have been unable to find a fanless psu of that wattag < 1294362677 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1294362680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: do you have a case fan? < 1294362737 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :www.lmgtfy.com/?q=silent+450w+psu < 1294362739 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2nd link < 1294362755 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and further revisions make it even quieter < 1294362760 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but this switching noise that it has.. < 1294362762 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's inaudible < 1294362767 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my pc has no case fans. < 1294362771 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: ah, so one of the ooold ones < 1294362772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it still sold < 1294362780 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course < 1294362784 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a very good design < 1294362789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the site linked in that 2003 review is squatted < 1294362800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: btw i was considering a copper heatpipe + big radiator solution < 1294362800 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :silverstone st45nf < 1294362805 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: what cpu/gpu do you have? < 1294362814 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :core 2 quad e8500 < 1294362814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: ah. our second links differ. < 1294362819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is why lmgtfy is bad ;) < 1294362821 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the fastest geforce i could get at the time < 1294362834 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so no fans at all, right? just checking :D < 1294362840 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh there are fans < 1294362840 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294362843 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but no case fans < 1294362844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: where :| < 1294362846 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294362858 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a fan between the cpu and graphic card heatsinks < 1294362864 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's a noctua p12 < 1294362869 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not audible < 1294362869 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UN < 1294362872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AC < 1294362873 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCKING < 1294362873 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CEPTABLE < 1294362877 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :naw < 1294362883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: i would buy a zalman totally-no-noise but they're not sold any more < 1294362883 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ??? < 1294362885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just mini-atx versions < 1294362889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: silent pc nerdery < 1294362892 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it actually does not have enough mechanical impedance to transfer any sound < 1294362901 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: everything that moves sounds. < 1294362908 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1294362908 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :things that move are the enemy. < 1294362916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MOVING IS THE ENEMY < 1294362918 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're talking to someone who knows a lot about acoustic engineering < 1294362931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: what if i want to use my computer in a vacuum, asshole < 1294362935 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know.. i make my own speakers < 1294362947 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it wouldn't work in a vacuum. < 1294362951 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for multiple reasons. < 1294362958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: SHUT UP < 1294362963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if i live in an anechoic chamber < 1294362964 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and am a bat < 1294362971 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :first of all, the electrolyte in capacitors would be instantly sucked out through the ventilation perforation < 1294363000 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :second of all, the heatsinks would not be able to give away the heat because they're not touching any matter < 1294363012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if i live in an anechoic chamber < 1294363013 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and am a bat < 1294363036 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, if you're a bat that's fine because bats hear supersonics < 1294363070 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and fans by the fact of their design drop in acoustic coupling performance as frequency goes up < 1294363096 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you stick your ear next to the fan at a very specific angle < 1294363102 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that has to be measured with a laser < 1294363119 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no wait < 1294363120 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I do that < 1294363134 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then i can hear a barely audible rumble of say maybe 5 hz < 1294363149 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you did that you couldn't hear anything, because your hearing ain't good nuff < 1294363172 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but in fact < 1294363190 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i bet with a slightly bigger heatsink it could be possible to run this pc fanless < 1294363199 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the graphic card that does all the heat, not the cpu < 1294363204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: the problem is that without the airflow everything breaks down :( < 1294363209 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if the newest graphic cards are better with that it's nice < 1294363215 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yes < 1294363216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: hahahano < 1294363220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: graphics cards are getting hotter < 1294363227 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've got an uh < 1294363277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: anyway it's more psychological, i could _feeeel_ that fan moving < 1294363280 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i need to connect a keyboard to that pc. < 1294363281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: have you looked into heatpipe solutions < 1294363317 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1294363344 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: i was considering passive watercooling but realised that pumps make noise < 1294363365 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a 9800 gtx+ < 1294363369 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :512 mb < 1294363374 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the hottest running graphics card ever < 1294363379 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was the hottest of its time < 1294363380 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294363387 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i put the slowest ever fan possible on it < 1294363393 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't really need like < 1294363397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the best graphics card < 1294363413 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you could get something that can be run fanless < 1294363424 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then put a convection stack on your cpu < 1294363443 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's actually very simple, you just take a drain pipe < 1294363444 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294363447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294363453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: i'm probably going for a scythe of similar size to http://www.crazypc.com/images/coolers/cpu/prolimatech/megahfull.jpg < 1294363461 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know convection? < 1294363464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1294363466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i may want to have this pc horizontal < 1294363471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't trust things like that to hang :D < 1294363476 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wrong < 1294363484 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the mounting system is very good < 1294363491 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the fan works properly only when the fins are vertical < 1294363500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ffff < 1294363500 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which means the whole pc has to be < 1294363506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fine < 1294363508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i don't trust it < 1294363515 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure if you want that scythe < 1294363520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not actually a scythe < 1294363521 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did everything with thermalright < 1294363522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a megahalem < 1294363530 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have this internal thermalright => shit mapping < 1294363533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it's thermaltake i'm thinking of < 1294363542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah it is < 1294363544 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thermaltake is shit < 1294363550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's wrong with scythe, i like scythe < 1294363556 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you use thermalright if you want things to be right < 1294363564 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i did everything with thermalright and it worked well < 1294363571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :spcr like scythe :p < 1294363572 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't have this experience with scythe coolers < 1294363580 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a scythe hdd enclosure which is the best ever < 1294363586 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a nightjar psu < 1294363592 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i know nothing of their coolers < 1294363594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: http://www.scythe-usa.com/product/cpu/053/scnj3000-detail.html < 1294363604 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: they're mostly of the gigantic fucking heatpipes variety :D < 1294363606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I LIKE that variety < 1294363616 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea so is thermalright < 1294363622 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except thermalright also does something very useful < 1294363627 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is backplane coolers < 1294363640 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1cMC-m0sjsM < 1294363646 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which help a lot with cpus even thought you'd think they wouldn't < 1294363649 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.noctua.at/main.php?show=productview&products_id=33&lng=en <-- the most fans i will allow in my pc is one (1) of these < 1294363652 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but every cpu gets equally hot on both sides < 1294363654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing else < 1294363654 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :MinecraftVideoBo < 1294363658 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the underside catches a lot of warmth < 1294363661 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOTHING ELSE < 1294363663 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a warm air pocket happens < 1294363668 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea < 1294363670 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what i do < 1294363678 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even then < 1294363680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would feel bad about it < 1294363682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and cry every night < 1294363685 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and actually < 1294363691 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :noctua have just come up with a new one < 1294363694 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's bigger than the one i use < 1294363697 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and hence silenter < 1294363699 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatwhat < 1294363702 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea < 1294363707 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh this one you linked < 1294363709 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the biggest one on their products page < 1294363712 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine is a p12 not a p14 < 1294363717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm isn't the 140mm one quite old < 1294363718 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's supersilent already < 1294363728 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but it didn't exist back before time < 1294363740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't trust myself to apply thermal paste, will be fun < 1294363746 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also now they do this jaded fin thing < 1294363756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"oh i just sorta... put an icing of it on" < 1294363759 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a special procedure you do with thermal paste < 1294363761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"the cooler is kinda wedged in the goop" < 1294363767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah you make a pea ball and crush it w/ the heatsink < 1294363768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know < 1294363771 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294363785 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what spcr tells me :> < 1294363786 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not one person i've spoken to actually knows their shit on how to do that < 1294363789 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :spcr is wrong < 1294363794 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a better way of doing this < 1294363804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, i trust you, mr. other random person on the internet < 1294363809 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well my pc works < 1294363811 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294363811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than the original, mr. three random people on the internet < 1294363814 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and has only one fan in it < 1294363835 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah one too many < 1294363842 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :d? < 1294363850 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah well buy a weak graphics card and you can have it without < 1294363857 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: probably < 1294363862 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: heatpipes bitch < 1294363870 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: how much RAM DO YOU HAVE EH < 1294363877 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :four gigabytes < 1294363878 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd like to insert MY heatpipe in a bitch < 1294363881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: hahahahahahahahahaha < 1294363889 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you know what i meant < 1294363890 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's because i still run 32 bit windoze sometimes < 1294363895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: lol u fag < 1294363897 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for audio applications < 1294363898 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no u < 1294363902 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :32 bit windoze boots with >4 gig anyway doesn't it < 1294363904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and just ignores it < 1294363907 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :U < 1294363920 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well back then that was what i was using most of the time < 1294363922 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so no point < 1294363927 0 :MinecraftVideoBo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has 2GB RAM in this machine < 1294363931 0 :MinecraftVideoBo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the most I ever had < 1294363935 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now i do ubuntu and run vim in it < 1294363941 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i could do with 2 mb of ram < 1294363943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: its funny because im getting 12 to 16 gigs because i love excess < 1294363945 0 :MinecraftVideoBo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea why it uses 64-bit Windos < 1294363947 0 :MinecraftVideoBo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WIndows < 1294363949 0 :MinecraftVideoBo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Windows < 1294363959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: the part list i got for bsmnt had 12 gigs, so really i just need to top him in _some_ way < 1294363965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe "not sounding like a jet" < 1294363968 0 :MinecraftVideoBo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION accidentally summons Bill Gates < 1294363973 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is bsmnt? < 1294363980 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that guy over there ---> < 1294363982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the username list < 1294363990 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and what is bsmnt? < 1294363995 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that guy over there ---> < 1294363995 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the username list < 1294363998 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294364000 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but what is it? < 1294364004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he said he wanted a new computer, i produced a list of parts out of my ass^W^Wnewegg < 1294364007 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i see it, i still don't know what it is < 1294364009 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :surprisingly they worked first time < 1294364011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a person < 1294364012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know < 1294364013 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like < 1294364013 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you tell him to dd if=/dev/urandom ? < 1294364015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :breathes and shits < 1294364016 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and shit < 1294364019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: no he's cool < 1294364021 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh ok < 1294364021 0 :MinecraftVideoBo!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo < 1294364024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think he still uses that box < 1294364027 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i still wonder if that kid did it < 1294364033 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's a Sgeo? < 1294364047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i kinda set myself up for a fal lthough he has an intel ssd, i7 cpu, 12 gigs of ram... < 1294364049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can beat him on gfx card < 1294364052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he has some shitty passive thing < 1294364066 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you have an intel mac < 1294364074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't remind me? :( < 1294364075 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're on the dark side already < 1294364089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not my fault they're thin, fuck off < 1294364092 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : i am your father, elliott < 1294364102 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god, i hope not < 1294364108 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wrong < 1294364115 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : NOooOOOOooooooooooooooooooo11!!!! < 1294364118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brbsuicide < 1294364128 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so either way < 1294364138 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's some sikrit tipz to having a quiet pc < 1294364144 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that no one tells you about < 1294364147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh huh < 1294364163 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the most sikrit tip is to not have a psu in your case < 1294364172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: FUNNY i'ma violate that tip < 1294364178 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :things i hate that aren't sound: WIRES < 1294364180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and < 1294364180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THINGS < 1294364194 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ya well ur laem < 1294364209 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :won't have such a silent pc then huh < 1294364232 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or iow: enjoy your hair dryer < 1294364247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: or i could just put it in the case and < 1294364250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: here's the clever bit < 1294364255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: you know what i would do? < 1294364261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: i would cut off the back of my case < 1294364262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instant < 1294364262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mother < 1294364263 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuckin < 1294364265 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :airflow < 1294364267 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ya, no < 1294364271 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :am i genius? i am genius? yes, i am genius < 1294364278 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ya, no < 1294364280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: buy me some heatpipes < 1294364285 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ya, no < 1294364292 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ya no has to be my favorite phrase in Spanish < 1294364299 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even though I forgot what it means < 1294364327 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1294364339 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: really, you don't want the psu in your computer. < 1294364348 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: but it'll stare at me < 1294364357 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The most silent computers are ones that don't work! < 1294364358 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the silverstone is very beautiful < 1294364360 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: did i mention i want an ips monitor < 1294364363 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, cheater00 means outside the case I assume < 1294364385 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's nice matted extruded aluminium < 1294364393 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's ips again? < 1294364424 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh is that this lcd overdrive stuff? < 1294364444 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think those overdrive ones are loud but not sure < 1294364465 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: research backplane coolers k < 1294364471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lcd overdrive? what? < 1294364494 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah there's this thing that makes lcds behave like they have faster times.. < 1294364496 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and die faster too < 1294364498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that's stupid < 1294364507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: IPS is what the graphics"pros" use < 1294364508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically < 1294364513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TN (normal LCDs) have uneven colour distribution < 1294364514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no matter what angle < 1294364517 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh it's the superslow lcd kind < 1294364519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :colour at left corner is different to middle < 1294364523 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: mmmnope < 1294364525 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which you can't use for computer games < 1294364528 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ya < 1294364529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294364534 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're superthick too aren't they? < 1294364542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: 10 to 14 ms response; also, most actual LCDs have similar ACTUAL response rates < 1294364547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the "cheating" is ubiquitous < 1294364552 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i know < 1294364555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in non-IPS < 1294364565 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: btw all iMacs and Apple Displays have been IPS for like two years now < 1294364574 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know, cooler is just one mistake away from cooker < 1294364576 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :admittedly nobody has yet to play a game on one :D < 1294364582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: yeah they're pretty thick, but... < 1294364585 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they have bootcamp < 1294364585 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TN displays suck < 1294364592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: also since TN displays are cheaper, they tend to have other shit too < 1294364593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like < 1294364594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :glossy < 1294364598 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stupid rounded edges hiding pixels < 1294364600 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc. etc. etc. < 1294364603 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :glossolalia < 1294364603 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :look at this: < 1294364608 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.scan.co.uk/products/thermalright-ifx-10-backplate-motherboard-backside-extra-cpu-cooler-%28775-am2-939%29 < 1294364621 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: funnily enough that's the name of a song i like a lot < 1294364626 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you know what that is < 1294364630 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's freedom, bitch < 1294364680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dude... who looks at non-newegg sites when deciding on components < 1294364696 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was the first hit < 1294364705 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also scan are a very good uk shop < 1294364728 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :irrelevant, buying is irrelevant < 1294364732 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you look at newegg when looking < 1294364734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :buying never happens < 1294364735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in my experience < 1294364759 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294364773 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you seem to have some income now < 1294364777 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is a good sign < 1294364896 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If elliott has more income than me, I < 1294364900 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll be jealous < 1294364942 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i make 1k/day but my dad takes it all away to spend on HATRED < 1294364946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trufax < 1294364948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry < 1294364949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*1m/day < 1294364950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :typo < 1294364955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :keys are literally right next to each other < 1294365001 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lliterally literally < 1294365004 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*literally < 1294365019 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: if you work contracts you could easily be doing 1k per day. < 1294365029 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When will we have figuratively literally literally? < 1294365031 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd probably have to move to london or reading. < 1294365032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but 1m? < 1294365037 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1m yen < 1294365038 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And have to say literally literally literally? < 1294365060 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION overdoses on literally < 1294365060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is an essentially fifteen-year-old part of my brain that sees the word work, contracts, and move to london, and immediately ignores you for the next ten minutes < 1294365095 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294365128 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Google wants to replace copumpkins with gopumpkins < 1294365185 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's also the fifteen year old part of your brain that sees the word "able to buy new toys" and "able to afford lawyers that tell people i don't like to fuck off" < 1294365210 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, word. i bet the chinese have single-words for each of those < 1294365217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: yes indeed < 1294365231 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: also, i can tell people to fuck off without lawyers < 1294365240 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not always effectively < 1294365265 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my email has spam filters! < 1294365344 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can it filter out court orders < 1294365349 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why do I feel a sudden need to bounce off walls? < 1294365360 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just earlier, I couldn't keep my eyes open? < 1294365362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: i'm not really into the habit of getting court orders, are you? < 1294365366 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::O < 1294365370 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1294365381 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought you had some sort of bs going on earlier though? < 1294365391 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :last summer < 1294365423 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: like uh what < 1294365442 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought you said you had to live in some sort of boarding school of sort < 1294365451 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that you didn't want to go to at all but school made you go to < 1294365455 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for some crazy reason < 1294365459 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294365482 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably someone else then\ < 1294365489 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: was that you? < 1294365499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo is totally crazy, it's plausible < 1294365637 0 :elliott_!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294365745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294365771 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294365862 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: i want to see that convection based cpu cooler :D < 1294365872 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would have to be at least 3 meters high :D < 1294365898 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have to like < 1294365899 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go now < 1294365900 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to sleep? < 1294365904 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :goodbye? < 1294365905 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294365916 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe < 1294366403 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't get your excavation site, you are just blowing stuff up down there at random :D < 1294366417 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could just do tnt columns < 1294366443 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RANDOM FOR THE RANDOM GOD < 1294366445 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XOM < 1294366461 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or preferably, just do row by row, but i guess that's boring < 1294366691 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's it called if you're attracted to slime? < 1294366753 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :japs use a lot of this fake sperm, so what you have is basically people having sex in slime < 1294366840 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i tried to ggl but all i get is "pedophiles are slime and should be killed" < 1294367027 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the pedophile blob, coming to a cinema near you < 1294367063 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :blobophile < 1294367089 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that i even know what people who like sperm are called, although i have a guess < 1294367201 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they call that "bukkake" < 1294367229 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294367236 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call what bukkake < 1294367266 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the slime thing? they do, but it's completely different, because you'll usually have a pretty mundane sex scene under all the slim < 1294367267 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1294367274 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unlike when there's actual wanking involved < 1294367283 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :japs do get physical then, ofc, as well, but less < 1294367302 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :american bukkake is much more formal < 1294367305 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1294367407 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there's less euro and it's less clearly themed, or maybe i just notice differences easier because i'm from here, and therefore understand the european bukkake taste better < 1294367417 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not an expert on bukkake really, but i do dabble < 1294367435 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf are you on now < 1294367443 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing < 1294367471 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you like the pun < 1294367526 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think you've been attacked by the pedophile blob as a child < 1294367543 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294367648 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, german bukkake is very easy to spot of course < 1294368002 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION suddenly realizes that "bukkake" could mean "stomach cake" in norwegian < 1294368089 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahaha. < 1294368201 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :buk = stomach? that's weir < 1294368203 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :d < 1294368311 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would've been better if i'd said dabble in it, didn't realize that works for both < 1294368313 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :crazy norwegs < 1294368474 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently it's more precisely "abdomen" < 1294368492 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well that's better isn't it < 1294368512 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er... < 1294368582 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean doesn't it make more sense < 1294368612 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :think about it < 1294368683 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my confusion is probably due the fact that no:mage can mean _either_ stomach or abdomen < 1294368690 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1294368722 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know what the finnish words mean, i think both means both < 1294368763 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we have a word that loosely translates as "stomach bag" < 1294368784 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is used with both words, so maybe that's what you're supposed to call the container < 1294368795 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean bag is used with both < 1294368864 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, we have "magesekk", which splits similarly and means only stomach < 1294368892 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"mahaskki" < 1294368913 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that's not the finnish word, skki = sack) < 1294368916 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you probably borrowed at least the parts of that :D < 1294368929 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(laukku = bag) < 1294368943 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yeah, we may have < 1294369224 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just said that because of mage = maha, since english didn't seem to have a friend for it < 1294369230 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stomach i guess < 1294369436 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gre:stoma => gre:stomakhos => lat:stomachus => old french:stomaque, estomac => middle english:stomach < 1294369445 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so definitely the same < 1294369545 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um that does not show a link to "mage" < 1294369547 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno what i could've found that wouldn't have convinced me tho < 1294369558 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :machus vs maha < 1294369564 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pronounced macha < 1294369568 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294369578 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...if a german pronounces it < 1294369610 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't show a direct link to mage, no < 1294369623 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but those look like friends < 1294369625 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to me < 1294369679 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh old english had maga < 1294369708 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/maga#Etymology_2 < 1294369753 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's slightly closer, maybe < 1294369774 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you pronounce that < 1294369784 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maygah? < 1294369828 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um i wasn't really referring to the english, but to the etymology, which is obviously the same as no:mage < 1294369842 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, stomach is not related < 1294369895 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well g ~ h isn't that weird, so maha is then not related to stomach either < 1294369896 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's stoma + chos, the greek is a derivation with a suffix < 1294369908 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh indeed < 1294369933 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i read that, but i was already convinced enough not to read the rest < 1294369937 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean with brain < 1294369951 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294369954 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it looks like stoma may be related to no:stemme (voice) < 1294369961 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although why does that mean maga couldn't be from that? < 1294369970 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294370001 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why couldn't the etymology be that sto dropped out for some reason :P < 1294370016 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IN THEORY < 1294370048 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: because the addition of -chos happened _in_ greek, long after the word had been inherited to the other sister language branches < 1294370095 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm yeah i suppose greek isn't exactly a dead language < 1294370139 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294370192 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still not 100% convinced by that proof, although you are surely right < 1294370229 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well indeed it's not entirely impossible, you'd have to be a linguist and look at many languages to see how it was inherited < 1294370261 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it's already clear from the list i gave that sto is not easy to dtop < 1294370267 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*drop < 1294370283 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so why the fuck would a hundred year old language like norwegian suddenly drop it < 1294370307 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um it would have be dropped _long_ before that :D < 1294370311 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*have to be < 1294370334 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my point exactly, maybe < 1294370344 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure how a sentence like that can have a point < 1294370357 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are cognates of mage in celtic and balto-slavic languages, according to that link < 1294370396 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have work tomorrow, kinda pointless even going because everyone will have left when i'd get there < 1294370411 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming i wanna sleep < 1294370452 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1294370686 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294373138 0 :Wamanuz3!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1294373719 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294373978 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294374224 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :“The problem with Internet quotations is that many are not genuine.” - Abraham Lincoln < 1294374272 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Abraham Lincoln never said that." - Oscar Wilde < 1294374291 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The REAL two hardest problems in CS: Cache Invalidation, Naming Things, and Off by One Errors. < 1294374306 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...yes. < 1294374333 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when did #esoteric become #uncyclopedia < 1294374355 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Presumably variable is writing an Oscar Wilde language. < 1294374375 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but was that off by one error caused by a cache invalidation? < 1294374394 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: OK THAT'S ALL MY FAULT < 1294374435 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i recall i saw a fake lincoln quote being teared to pieces on reddit a few weeks ago (i think) < 1294374468 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ... yes < 1294374495 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was something that it was almost plausible for him to have said, about corporations getting too much power. and it _was_ from the 19th century, but not by him. < 1294374504 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION considers writing HowTo:Play Mao < 1294374514 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc. < 1294374543 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: and then a concise guide to playing mornington crescent, i assume? < 1294374573 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I MEAN SINCE THE OFFICIAL RULES ARE SO LARGE < 1294374587 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: maybe < 1294374601 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the Mao guide would mostly be a guy complaining about how he doesn't get it < 1294374623 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :inspired by a real-life guy who just didn't get it < 1294374624 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at all < 1294374635 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :remotely < 1294374637 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: i _really_ think that quip above would have been better if you had named something in it. then it could have been three-way self-referential. < 1294374647 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, two-way. < 1294374668 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we were happy when he left partway through and we could recover half the deck < 1294374678 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, it wasn't mine :-( < 1294374681 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(we were playing with two decks!) < 1294374684 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish it were < 1294374719 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: nihil novi sub soli < 1294374737 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sole < 1294374880 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing new under the sun? < 1294374893 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294374928 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :another nice self-referential quotation < 1294375003 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*torn < 1294375014 0 :sftp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294375995 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294376647 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294376899 0 :sftp!~sftp@79.174.49.208 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294379275 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1294380773 0 :cal153!~cal@c-24-4-207-72.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294381035 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294381485 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294382008 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No text to send < 1294382259 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes text to send < 1294382644 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or text to send < 1294383182 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did they complete the next level in my game? < 1294383715 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294384236 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1294385356 0 :Wamanuz3!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294385485 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1294385878 0 :Wamanuz4!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294385995 0 :Wamanuz3!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294386368 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any answers? < 1294386674 0 :Wamanuz5!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294386823 0 :Wamanuz4!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1294387199 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1294387200 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1294387583 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294387745 0 :Wamanuz5!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294387882 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294387962 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294391195 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1294391601 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ilua < 1294392079 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is this a real channel? < 1294392098 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294393303 0 :Wamanuz2!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294393342 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1294394371 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-6-114.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294395747 0 :Wamanuz3!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294395889 0 :Wamanuz2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1294396280 0 :Wamanuz4!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294396448 0 :Wamanuz3!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294398581 0 :pingveno!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294398703 0 :pingveno!~pingveno@c-98-246-133-8.hsd1.or.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294399147 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1294400921 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294400957 0 :cheater00!~cheater@e181135101.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294401472 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, nifty... potaroo.net is now connectable for me without hacks... < 1294403085 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294404805 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294405793 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION hopes he doesn't break anything by installing these things I downloaded I think they're supposed to be installed in order but I don't know what order I didn't download them in order < 1294406144 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294406557 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294406636 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes to play with Virtual PC < 1294407040 0 :Wamanuz5!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294407224 0 :Wamanuz4!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1294408506 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fun fact: There are no checks as to what version of Windows 7 is in use. < 1294408658 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...there is a check < 1294408677 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It checks when you try to use it < 1294408682 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Long after installation < 1294408951 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dear Microsoft: What made you geniuses think that the best thing to do was put the XP Mode HD on the comp regardless of whether it's an acceptable host? < 1294409008 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1294409149 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294409177 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294410353 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294410496 0 :cheater00!~cheater@g231051178.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294411608 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries Parallels < 1294411619 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION vaguely wonders what the limitation in the trial is < 1294411624 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION guesses that it's time limited < 1294411634 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll flip a nut if it is, but yeah < 1294411757 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It unnerves me when emulation software goes to install in Program Files (x86) < 1294412187 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh < 1294412195 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, it's no a time-based limtation < 1294412201 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Instead... < 1294412213 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OOOHHH < 1294412215 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :n/m < 1294412283 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a 30-day trial < 1294412490 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001f5b00390f-CM001e6b2335dc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294412557 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, I like Parallels < 1294412914 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1294412935 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294413050 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@61.251.165.38 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294413679 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1294414138 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1294414295 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...ok then < 1294414346 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is Sgeo pronounced < 1294414407 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sgeo.diagonalfish.net/sgeo.wav < 1294414514 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How to get Windows 98 to install in Parallels: Tell Parallels that the Guest OS is not Windows 98 < 1294414558 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294414696 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd love Parallels much more if it WORKED < 1294414701 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bloody piece of shist < 1294414714 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wwhat are you supposed to do while you wait for the sun to come up? < 1294415404 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294415712 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294415794 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1294415949 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One good thing about VirtualBox: It actually works < 1294416022 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found these virtualizer programs all took too much RAM < 1294416540 0 :cheater-!~cheater@e181128171.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294416569 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294417461 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294417764 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294418042 0 :KingOfKarlsruhe!~nice@p5B1332EE.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294418930 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe VMWare Server was breaking other random shit in the other emulators < 1294419270 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh, apparently it was < 1294419272 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION WTFs < 1294419317 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294419471 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or maybe it wasn't < 1294419474 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes insane < 1294419575 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294419576 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"goes" < 1294419579 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294419620 0 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-65-80.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1294419697 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what are you supposed to do in your cave while waiting for the sun to come up? < 1294419717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: try making a house/castle, not a cave; but, basically; < 1294419735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: mining; building (if you have a lit-and-encased-by-wall build project you can stay), < 1294419739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: crafting < 1294419753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you can even go out with a sword and enough armour < 1294419780 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also.. every time I die I lose all my rare stuff like coal :( < 1294419789 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried putting it all in my cave but it disappeard < 1294419814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: make chests, duh < 1294419836 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :store things in chest, put all your valuable shit in chests before doingsomething dangerous < 1294419837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*chests < 1294419839 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*doing something < 1294419844 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iI dono't know if its cheating or not to read the wiki < 1294419867 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Naw. < 1294419870 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Crafting is basically essential. < 1294419881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Even the people who play without spoilers get told how to craft certain things by friends < 1294419900 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool chest is easy to make! < 1294419912 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294419915 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: There's really only a small finite number of things you can "spoil", and knowing them is pretty much essential to play the game well, so it's probably not worth worrying about. < 1294419931 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello everyone < 1294419935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1294419984 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: now _here's_ a question, what do you do if you spawn in a desert biome < 1294420000 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You delete the world and start again. < 1294420006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CORRECT < 1294420007 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you still talking about minecraft < 1294420009 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is a biome? < 1294420009 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294420014 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or find your way to some trees. < 1294420017 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: biome is a region of area of a certain type < 1294420022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: there's desert, forest, ... < 1294420023 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, different terrain and flora. < 1294420025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: snow... < 1294420059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: rain forest, swamp, seasonal forest, forest, savanna, woods, taiga, desert, plains, tundra < 1294420064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also the Nether but it hardly counts < 1294420080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that last but one line is the full list < 1294420084 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, significantly, some biomes have no accessible tree. < 1294420089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Biomes :P < 1294420089 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*trees < 1294420111 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And since such basic things as mining require wood, you're screwed. < 1294420116 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dont' like cutting up trees because I worry about them all disappearing < 1294420162 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, breaking leaves gets you saplings. < 1294420162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: um they drop saplings < 1294420168 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: the leaves decay automatically < 1294420171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the ones that don't, hit them < 1294420172 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plant the saplings, and a new tree will eventually grow. < 1294420174 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: then pick up the little tree saplings < 1294420180 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I planted sapling but they just stay there < 1294420182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plant one in the same place with right click < 1294420189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you have to wait for day and stuff < 1294420194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just leave them, they'll grow < 1294420202 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: there has to be three free blocks above < 1294420203 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and they need light < 1294420213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: best idea is to plant one in the same place as the tree you destroyed < 1294420255 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can make a little indoor arboretum if you are very paranoid. < 1294420260 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As well as a farm. < 1294420332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I FOUND THE BEST MOUNTAIN EVER < 1294420386 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294420386 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, better than Mt. Hoover? < 1294420395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck yes. In single player. < 1294420408 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Screenshot? < 1294420497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure. Second. < 1294420566 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://ompldr.org/vNnZ1eA < 1294420568 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://ompldr.org/vNnZ1eQ < 1294420570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://ompldr.org/vNnZ1eg < 1294420575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: These photos were taken *on top of a tall mountain*. < 1294420577 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In a snow biome. < 1294420577 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294420580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The arch stops snow falling inside. < 1294420589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are also a lot of trees nearby. < 1294420594 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wiw cool < 1294420621 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, you clearly haven't seen the glory of Mt. Hoover. < 1294420637 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no I havenot7 < 1294420679 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, weirdness: I have been nominated to the RationalWiki Foundation's Board of Trustees. < 1294420684 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not that that means very much. < 1294420700 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why does that exist < 1294420710 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: are you gonna come on our server? < 1294420711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1294420802 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294420815 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hve to go out first < 1294420937 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294420955 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1: Post "HALP IVE BEEN MEGA HACKED" to stack overflow 2: Infinite karma problem stackexachange? < 1294420967 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294420976 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :server fault* < 1294420994 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1294421017 0 :KingOfKarlsruhe!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294421108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: oh god monster noises on Peaceful < 1294421275 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So far, VMware Workstation is working < 1294421282 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wish I had more than a trial key though < 1294421293 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh god Sgeo is liveblogging again < 1294421325 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, one word: pirate. < 1294421343 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, Four words: I'm trying and failing < 1294421535 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :scarf < 1294421537 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ais523 < 1294421586 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, EXPLAIN YOURSELF < 1294421611 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's sometimes scarf. < 1294421725 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is reading Dr McNinja a bad sign? < 1294421759 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it? < 1294421768 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a sign that you are reading a webcomic < 1294421802 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You might turn into me! < 1294421832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Pretty sure Sgeo doesn't read Achewood, it would be a good way to distance yourself from him. < 1294421848 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, please tell me Dr McNinja isn't something you read. < 1294421850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HELPFUL ANTI-SGEO ADVICE DISPENSED DAILY < 1294421863 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, surely Sgeo reads Achewood! < 1294421866 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I've glanced at it, but haven't gotten into it < 1294421870 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's a furry, after all! < 1294421881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: But Achewood is actually amusing and interesting, see < 1294421889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, for some definitions < 1294421929 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I dropped Freefall to avoid Sgeo, and that's as far as I'll go. < 1294421946 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION assumes you're joking < 1294421969 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'd seriously stop reading a webcomic just because I read it? < 1294421994 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That and I was losing patience with it. < 1294422012 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, that makes more sense < 1294422019 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've decided I'll catch up every few months, since the story moves at a snail's pace. < 1294422073 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, I want your full webcomic list, though. < 1294422259 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xkcd, Freefall, Dilbert [ok, not a webcomic], User Friendly on occasion not that it updates anymore, Order of the Stick, Erfworld, Bonobo Conspiracy, Superosity, 1/0 [dead], Triangle & Robert [dead], Jesus & Mo, atheistcartoons, Subnormality, The Non-Adventures of Wonderella, Basic Instructions, Cyanide & Happiness, SMBC < 1294422267 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cowbirds in Love < 1294422544 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xkcd? Why? < 1294422659 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because Sgeo has no taste. < 1294422683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1/0 and T&R are not so much "dead" as completed... < 1294422700 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh fuck fuck fuck you read Subnormality why stop it I <3 subnormality you're not allowed to < 1294422775 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh bonobo conspiracy is written by the guy who wrote the "what colour are your bits?" thing... who puts stock in astrology :D < 1294422783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders if that'll make Sgeo vomit and stop reading or something < 1294422829 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm vaguely aware of that already < 1294423075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: btw, oklopol has been mining in the excavation pits :) < 1294423100 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, any news re the TNT kit? < 1294423109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :None. < 1294423113 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That I know of. < 1294424092 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A large fraction of the MC community hate people who play it on peaceful, apparently. < 1294424096 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I despair. < 1294424132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hate howso. < 1294424337 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dislike for not playing it The Right Way, I assume. < 1294424338 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://mwunsch.tumblr.com/post/1179254565/notchdrones < 1294424341 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Urgh. < 1294424374 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There totally needs to be a survival horror version of MC. < 1294424395 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With old mines which are crawling with monsters due to a single, minor breach. < 1294424400 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*abandoned < 1294424434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: That guy using \alpha is iiiiiritating < 1294424437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*rr < 1294424441 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Extremely so. < 1294424571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dear M. Wunsch: I don't care how many hours he works in a day, I care about him acting like an idiot, I care about him being a jerk to people who have worked insane amounts with his stupid, obfuscated code to produce amazing mods, I care about him not testing the product he's _sold_ for even FIVE SECONDS before pushing it — beta is no excuse — and I care about how he does shit like badmouth git with no justification when he is far < 1294424571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : less of an engineer than anyone who's worked on git. < 1294424616 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I care that he's selling a game with potential that he's wasting by doing stupid shit and not thinking; he is clearly good enough at coding in theory to be able to do this properly, he just _isn't_. And I care that the raving hordes of fanboys lynch you for even suggesting any of this might be true. < 1294424620 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck him. < 1294424624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(him=Wunsch) < 1294424672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: [[And here is Notch, who has mastered the art of computer science to express a creative ambition, making a game on his own time and finding success because of it. We should all be “sitting on his cock”…figuratively, of course.]] < 1294424686 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That... I don't care whether that's figurative or not. < 1294424707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"If I were Notch, and I poured all of my creative ambition and energy into this project and was called a “lazy cunt” by some nothing, I would immediately cease working on the project. I would send out an update patch that bombs the game and makes it unplayable. And I would take the money and run. And I would never again bless this planet with my creativity and thoughtfulness." < 1294424714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tl;dr not only is my skin so thick as to be non-existent, but I am a gigantic asshole. < 1294424721 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who.... who wrote that. < 1294424735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: M. Wunsch in that post you linked. < 1294424745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He longs to sit on Notch's cock ... figuratively, of course. < 1294424892 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I demand that you let me copy that rant to M. Wunsch to TV Tropes' Just Bugs Me page for MC. < 1294424915 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Sure. But omit the fuck him part. < 1294424919 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Also don't attribute me. :p < 1294425018 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1294425031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um < 1294425124 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YAY PARALLELS HATES WINDOWS 98 < 1294425307 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, FWIW, I added it. < 1294425316 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :link < 1294425356 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sec, repairing the formatting. < 1294425393 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/JustBugsMe/Minecraft < 1294425471 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[nothing wrong with rars, but whatever.]] — The author of hMod, when someone asked him for a zipped file. < 1294425510 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://arc.opera.com/ping.html < 1294425583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: "can I have a tarball" "ew, pervert" < 1294425619 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, hMod is being superseded. < 1294425630 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :welcome to N days go < 1294425631 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ago < 1294425631 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, saw that. Bucket? < 1294425639 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bukkit < 1294425680 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294425733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Buy the damn game and do drudge work on Cube. < 1294425744 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, FWIW, who was Notch a jerk to? < 1294425780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: All mod developers. < 1294425788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: That "frown upon" bullshit. < 1294425801 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the passive-agressiveish "very grey area legally" from the same sentence. < 1294425807 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What "frown up on" bullshit? < 1294425817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See his ancient blog post. < 1294425843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: "First of all, most “mods” that add new features to the game are in a very gray area legally, and I frown upon them." < 1294425847 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, right. < 1294425850 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bastard. < 1294425876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tl;dr "These '''mods''' -- I use scare quotes despite the fact that they are, in fact, mods -- are something I COULD, hypothetically, sue all your fucking asses over. Also, I hate you." < 1294425885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, so that's actually longer than the non-tl;dr :D < 1294425887 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't wait until he open-sources the code and good programmers fix it. < 1294425899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I, also, cannot wait for infinity. < 1294425905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is something rather difficult to wait for. < 1294425907 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yesyesyes < 1294425910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*I, too, < 1294425911 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is so awesome. < 1294425920 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A free MMO with _proper_ gameplay. < 1294425923 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And space! < 1294425928 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Newtonian combat! < 1294425946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Wait what. < 1294425953 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Define it. < 1294425954 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right, < 1294425957 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not Infinity. < 1294425962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294425966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1294425972 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(For which I cannot actually wait.) < 1294425975 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HOW EMBARRASSING < 1294426001 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I WANT A QUANTUM MMO < 1294426038 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=82789 < 1294426050 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A joke, or TRUTH? < 1294426299 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, is Notch actually against *redstone circuits* < 1294426346 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm sure he isn't, which kind of ruins things. < 1294426353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Umm...no. :P < 1294426375 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The point of that kind of parody is to take reality and twist it, rather than making stuff up. < 1294426558 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294426619 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, have you set up that SSP server? < 1294426642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No. I either need to upgrade my VPS or ... my internet connection :P < 1294426664 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anything fun going on on ineiros' server? < 1294426682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"4:29PM The screens are now an undulating blue cube field. And man -- are they ever undulating." < 1294426691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes, I'm TNTing ineiros and everyone he holds dear. < 1294426694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Not really. Except, yes, really.) < 1294426699 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[I was skeptical at first, but this is a much better game than Fallout 3. Heaps of crashes and console freeze bugs.]] — Notch on Fallout 3. < 1294426707 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA < 1294426773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fallout 3: better than Fallout 3. < 1294426778 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ITYYM New Vegas.) < 1294426779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ITYM < 1294426789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[4:39PM Oh, Zoll's on stage now! He's... holding a remote? Oh, he's sitting on a couch and watching... a video of his mother being pregnant? Oh boy. < 1294426789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4:40PM "My parents were totally stoked when I finally arrived... Grandma said I must have been the most documented kid ever."]] — document of Samsung keynote < 1294426814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: OMG. FALLOUT NEW VEGAS WAS DEVELOPED BY OBSIDIAN ENTERTAINMENT < 1294426815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CONSPIRACY < 1294426836 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, yes. < 1294426900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Speaking of that, if you haven't seen this you must: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ToKIkw3LIoQ < 1294426943 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :God that's creepy. < 1294426949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It gets better. < 1294426983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The great thing is, the first time it just looks like your vision is all messed up, and then it KEEPS GOING < 1294427024 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAAAAAAAAARRRRGGGGHHHH < 1294427030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BOB-WALK < 1294427036 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That has to be the scariest thing in a game, like, ever. < 1294427055 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any complete of my game, yet? < 1294427060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nope. < 1294427066 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or any part of it? < 1294427076 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wasn't j-invariant playing this game? Did they get past that level? < 1294427104 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't know. < 1294427156 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think they are not on this IRC at this time? < 1294427209 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1294427217 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yes, the irony of Notch complaining about someone else's buggy game is delightful. < 1294427235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.engadget.com/2011/01/06/live-from-samsungs-ces-2011-keynote/?sort=oldest&refresh=0 Oh my god, this is the most amazing thing ever. < 1294427241 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or at least second most amazing. < 1294427324 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION now wonders what the first is < 1294427325 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the most amazing? < 1294427357 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Chocolate unicorns. < 1294427389 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have only myself to blame. < 1294427395 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, and oerjan. < 1294427403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What. < 1294427417 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've been reading reddit too much, i feel like adding bacon to that < 1294427419 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :5:03PM Demoing the change from ESPN to CNN. This is really cool stuff. < 1294427420 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :5:04PM Cool in the sense that it's happening on the Galaxy Tab, not cool in the sense that he changed a TV channel. < 1294427503 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I get sound working in this VM, I'll finally be able to play a kid's game that I haven't played in years1 < 1294427504 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :! < 1294427519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: And then, finally, you can become a child once more. < 1294427642 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What the hell *is* this Cloud thing people keep going on about? < 1294427705 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: probably has something to do with global warming < 1294427712 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right. < 1294427719 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :steam is a greenhouse gas, after all < 1294427742 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, cloud seeding is one of the proposed methods of geoengineering < 1294427756 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although it's unclear how one would store data in a cloud. < 1294427799 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294427804 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[The letter A just exploded from serif to sans-serif. It's hard to explain that any better.]] < 1294427842 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This guy is amazing. < 1294427848 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION → food < 1294427870 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: well i read they managed to store data in _bacteria_, so why not < 1294428157 0 :cal153!~cal@70.36.237.178 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294428199 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001f5b00390f-CM001e6b2335dc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294428597 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, storing data in bacteria is easy! < 1294428611 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They already _have_ a built-in storage medium! < 1294428622 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1294428628 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A linear, quaternary one at that. < 1294428652 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe we should ask some homeopaths, i hear they are experts at storing data in water < 1294428681 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or the sociopaths < 1294428682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DATA IN BLOOD < 1294428774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Do you still have that symbolic-mode parsing code? I feel like converting it to Haskell. < 1294428880 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is no such thing as sociopaths. stop believing that nonsense or i will make _sure_ you regret it. < 1294428929 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, symbolic-mode parsing code? < 1294428931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Now now, be more classy; a decent sociopath would go "I see.", smile genuinely, convince you into going home with him, and disembowel you. < 1294428934 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh, that rhymes. < 1294428942 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes. As in o+x,g=wr. < 1294428946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o=g,g+a. < 1294428956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Most commonly e.g. "+x" or "a+w". < 1294428962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chmod's argument, basically, when not octal. < 1294428969 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I CAN'T HERE YOU I AM RAPPING ABOUT SYMBOLIC MODE PARSING CODE IN MY HEAD < 1294429001 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's a ridiculous suggestion, i don't want to have to clean up that stuff < 1294429030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Wow. Lazy sociopathy is surprisingly hilarious. < 1294429048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I would kill you for no reason at all, but I'd probably have to hide your body and that sounds like a lot of work." < 1294429071 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1294429095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"5:29PM Zoll remembers going to an amusement park with his dad for the first time. He wishes his dad had taken pictures in 3D, because the pictures they took don't adequately capture the memory. Oh, Zoll." < 1294429105 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[5:29PM BK: "Last year we launched the world's first Full HD 3D TV! That's a lot of initials."]] < 1294429133 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: while i _hope_ i have a more solid moral than that, that still feels eerily close to how i feel about annoying people sometimes < 1294429145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i... please don't kill me? < 1294429154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: or... anyone < 1294429167 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you're nowhere near _that_ annoying. < 1294429194 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, RUN < 1294429197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: OR ANYONE < 1294429207 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: not nearly as bad as it could be though - could be specified as a LED LCD TV, and they could throw in SCART and HDMI and VGA and DVI as well... < 1294429209 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: hi < 1294429224 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[5:35PM BK just gave Katzenerg a pair of prescription 3D glasses. "These are so light -- maybe I'll just wear these all the time instead of my real glasses." Sure you will, Jeff. Sure you will.]] < 1294429239 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there an explicit R^2 → R bijection? < 1294429244 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I don't seem to annoy oerjan < 1294429249 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: plenty < 1294429249 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just you and elliott < 1294429253 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: maybe that would let you see the world in 3D though? < 1294429257 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, Sgeo has no idea how annoying he is. < 1294429259 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Do you figure out the game yet? Remember you can block the door so that it won't close all the way, and then you get get out and go back in to the dragons room. < 1294429263 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, tell me one < 1294429264 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: :D < 1294429271 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then if you win, the other dragon will give you back the ammunition and give you the key. < 1294429279 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I could not defeat the dragons < 1294429279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: represent as infinite stream of base 2, intermingle < 1294429283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294429285 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I mean, that would be *AWESOME* < 1294429288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294429289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: :D < 1294429292 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: super HD < 1294429300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[5:39PM Zoll's back! "Nature rules!" Oh, Zoll. Zolly Zoll Zoll.]] < 1294429305 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :super HD *3D*, no less < 1294429315 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, there is that. < 1294429332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[5:43PM "If you are to be successful, this child must be an inspiration to us all... a child of the 21st century. We must think of him every time we create a product." Can we never think of Zoll again, though? Is that also an option?]] < 1294429337 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I give you a hint. Block the door while it is closing, and it won't close. And then you can go north, and then south and you can destroy the piece of the door. The dragon can be removed in the same way. < 1294429347 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: you need to patch that up a bit because of the 0.111... = 1.000... issue, but that's essentially constructive, yes < 1294429368 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Turing machines accept recursively enumerable languages. ---> what are "recursively enumerable languages" < 1294429370 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, y'know what was a cool idea? Sierpiński numbers! < 1294429387 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, the type of languages Turing machines accept. < 1294429397 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, no < 1294429400 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-} < 1294429403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: languages that you can enumerate, recursively < 1294429407 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable, quite clearly. < 1294429415 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recursively_enumerable_language < 1294429420 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A recursively enumerable language is a formal language for which there exists a Turing machine (or other computable function) which will enumerate all valid strings of the language. Note that, if the language is infinite, the enumerating algorithm provided can be chosen so that it avoids repetitions, since we can test whether the string produced for number n is "already" produced for a number which is less than n. If it already is pro < 1294429420 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :duced, use the output for input n+1 instead (recursively), but again, test whether it is "new". < 1294429425 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A recursively enumerable language is a formal language for which there exists a Turing machine (or other computable function) that will halt and accept when presented with any string in the language as input but may either halt and reject or loop forever when presented with a string not in the language. Contrast this to recursive languages, which require that the Turing machine halts in all cases. < 1294429492 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Phantom_Hoover, I don't seem to annoy oerjan <-- actually their constant picking on you annoys me more than you do. although you _do_ need to do something about your father issues. (so do i.) < 1294429524 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I could destroy the door but the dragons still kill me < 1294429542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I tried to be nice to him and felt pity for his issues! but it was too much! too much! < 1294429546 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, if you go and tell Sgeo's father that he's a complete cretin I will be so happy. < 1294429556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so i've given up :( < 1294429556 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I AM NOT INTERPRETING THAT ANY OTHER WAY < 1294429586 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll go tell oerjan's father the same! < 1294429603 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: OK. Remember dragons cannot move diagonally. You can stand next to the north edge so the dragons step near there (you can move faster than dragons can). And now you can go back to the other board north and then east/west and then south. < 1294429677 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also dragons are allowed to move in lava, but it is difficult to see due to same color is red. < 1294429691 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: eek < 1294429693 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I get it! < 1294429697 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: on the plane now < 1294429706 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll tell elliott's father something. < 1294429725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Try "fuck you". < 1294429743 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Someone experienced with MegaZeux might or might not know this. But it can be learnable by the codes for MegaZeux, too. < 1294429774 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm sorry, your quota of people whom I should murder or kidnap has been exhausted. < 1294429786 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: "Fuck you", not murder or kidnap. < 1294429802 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, just putting that out there. < 1294429822 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Murder/kidnap would be a waste of time. < 1294429860 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also, I tend to avoid swearing in general. < 1294429871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It is, in this case, well, well worth it. < 1294429886 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(This is in order that I have something to say when I rm -rf ~ * by accident.) < 1294429903 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I win .. this time! < 1294429917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I go for compound curses when that happens. < 1294429931 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Yes. Now you have to figure out which one is the real key. (You might create a save file at this point, in case you make mistake) < 1294429942 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Normal sentence: "...fucking...". rm -rf: "FUCKING PISS-SHITTING TWATBASKET" < 1294429952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(OK, so more likely "Fuckfuchklfcucklik just deleted my home directory aaarhgiudfhgjkgljlkfhjd") < 1294429955 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did find the key < 1294430000 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Good! Now you can ask the other dragon for the other key and they will give you back your ammunition, too. < 1294430014 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/DarthWiki/IdiotProgramming < 1294430026 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everyone comment! < 1294430073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[Also from the programming side, libraries developed by the Department Of Redundancy Department where you have to lapse into Pokemon Speak to write any meaningful code. For instance, take this line from Debian's version of awesome's rc.lua: < 1294430074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{ "Debian", debian.menu.Debian_menu.Debian } < 1294430074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To be clear, "menu" is the only member of "debian", and "Debian_menu" is the only member of "debian.menu".]] < 1294430078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is... not actually all that bad. < 1294430087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obviously "debian" is reserved for Debian-related stuff to avoid namespace clashing. < 1294430099 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :debian.menu is reserved for {Debian menu}-related things. < 1294430109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the {Debian menu} contains the root item {Debian}, I believe, which is the actual Debian menu. < 1294430118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd make it debian.menu.Debian, but still. < 1294430178 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Thing that irritates me about TV Trope: Linking every reference to MemeticMutation. < 1294430186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I REALISE WHAT IT IS, I'M NOT AN IDIOT, I JUST WANT TO KNOW WHAT YOU'RE REFERENCING < 1294430189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ALSO REFERENCES AREN'T MEMES < 1294430199 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, indeed. < 1294430553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :main :: IO () < 1294430553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :main = do < 1294430553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : args <- getArgs < 1294430554 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : case args of < 1294430556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ("-n":args') -> putStr (unwords args') < 1294430558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : _ -> putStrLn (unwords args) < 1294430560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey oerjan < 1294430562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOLF < 1294430933 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :main = do args <- getArgs; putStr . unwords $ case args of ("-n":args') -> args' ; _ -> args ++ ["\n"] -- I'm not sure I consider this an improvement... < 1294431016 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: erm does that not put a space before the newline < 1294431024 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1294431028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> unwords ["poop","\n"] < 1294431030 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : "poop \n" < 1294431046 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Now did you figure out the next part of this game? < 1294431047 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :updog < 1294431047 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog? < 1294431056 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when did we get lambdabot? < 1294431082 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, when I convinced Cale to let us have it permanently with my dashing good looks and wit. < 1294431090 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that means unwords cannot be combined :( < 1294431092 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Read: I asked him. < 1294431101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: foreversad < 1294431103 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*forever sad < 1294431105 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: no this part is crazy! I will take a while to figure it out < 1294431109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you can < 1294431112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: just append \n to the last :D < 1294431120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: (make sure this handles no args) < 1294431125 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh. hm. < 1294431144 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: which sounds like it's unlikely to be shorter < 1294431159 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: BUT ZANIER < 1294431166 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: After trying for a while if you cannot figure out, you can ask questions about things you do not know about the working of MegaZeux if you need to (such as how specific objects work and so on). < 1294431176 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks zzo38 < 1294431189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hm note that the case can be < 1294431202 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : case args of < 1294431202 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ("-n":args') -> putStr (unwords args') < 1294431202 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : args' -> putStrLn (unwords args') < 1294431205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. rhs is the same < 1294431207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i don't think this helps < 1294431230 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, because you still cannot combine the args', not being in the same scope < 1294431247 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh hm < 1294431248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: :D < 1294431265 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait rhs isn't even the same there < 1294431277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: we could have "helper f xs = f (unwords xs)" < 1294431540 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :main = do args <- getArgs; putStr . uncurry ((++) . unwords) $ case args of ("-n":args') -> (args',"") ; _ -> (args,"\n") < 1294431544 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not tested) < 1294431574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you are a bad person? < 1294431576 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you are a bad person < 1294431580 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294431594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: now make it point-free < 1294431624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: main=do a<-getArgs;putStr.uncurry((++).unwords)$case a of("-n":b)->(b,"");_->(a,"\n") < 1294431626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my small contribution < 1294431628 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :point-free-ing case statements is not precisely nice < 1294431641 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: psht < 1294431668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :main :: IO () < 1294431668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :main = eachFile ((B.putStr =<<) . B.hGetContents) =<< getArgs < 1294431674 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: do you think my cat implementation (pictured) is too readable? < 1294431700 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION didn't even recall eachFile existed < 1294431756 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle hInteract < 1294431756 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No results found < 1294431783 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :google tells me System.IO.Utils has one < 1294431797 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i wrote it :D < 1294431807 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294431807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eachFile :: (Handle -> IO ()) -> [String] -> IO () < 1294431807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eachFile f [] = f stdin < 1294431807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eachFile f xs = mapM_ doFile xs < 1294431808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : where doFile "-" = f stdin < 1294431810 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : doFile fn = withFile fn ReadMode f < 1294431812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in Utilities.hs < 1294431828 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I think I should probably split ((B.putStr =<<) . B.hGetContents) back into being named cat, though < 1294431953 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's B.hGetContents >>> B.putStr, i think < 1294431974 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or >=> < 1294431981 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (>=>) < 1294431982 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a (m :: * -> *) b c. (Monad m) => (a -> m b) -> (b -> m c) -> a -> m c < 1294432008 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (<=<) < 1294432009 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall b (m :: * -> *) c a. (Monad m) => (b -> m c) -> (a -> m b) -> a -> m c < 1294432111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so many fuckin arrows yo < 1294432122 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@src <=> < 1294432122 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Source not found. The more you drive -- the dumber you get. < 1294432124 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@src <=< < 1294432124 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Source not found. I can't hear you -- I'm using the scrambler. < 1294432127 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe, what should be have in TeXnicard, is a parser that can compile a Inform7-like code into a C code. So that you can use the cards in a computer game as well. < 1294432128 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1294432133 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@source <=< < 1294432133 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<=< not available < 1294432139 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@source >=> < 1294432140 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>=> not available < 1294432146 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@source (>=>) < 1294432146 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(>=>) not available < 1294432152 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever < 1294432170 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@help @source < 1294432170 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :help . Ask for help for . Try 'list' for all commands < 1294432176 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@help source < 1294432177 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :source . Lookup the url of fptools libraries < 1294432183 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah < 1294432198 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle >=> < 1294432199 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Monad (>=>) :: Monad m => (a -> m b) -> (b -> m c) -> a -> m c < 1294432204 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@more < 1294432218 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait it does say the module < 1294432244 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION hasn't played with lambdabot for ages < 1294432245 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@src (>=>) < 1294432245 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Source not found. I can't hear you -- I'm using the scrambler. < 1294432248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@help src < 1294432248 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :src . Display the implementation of a standard function < 1294432253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well @source would not have worked, any way :) < 1294432254 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*anyway < 1294432262 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1294432297 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@src map < 1294432298 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :map _ [] = [] < 1294432298 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :map f (x:xs) = f x : map f xs < 1294432308 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>=> and <=< were added a couple years ago or so < 1294432321 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@src fix < 1294432321 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fix f = let x = f x in x < 1294432332 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Strange... < 1294432339 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's strange < 1294432357 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why the let? < 1294432361 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it uses the Report's Prelude code. < 1294432364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: for sharing < 1294432369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: fix f = f (fix f) eats memory < 1294432373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(without a sufficiently smart compiler) < 1294432375 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: to ensure the value is not reevaluated < 1294432378 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas "let x = f x" is more like a circular list < 1294432385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except it's not a list, you know what i mean :) < 1294432386 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Surely GHC is a Sufficiently Smart Compiler? < 1294432425 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: except sometimes the _other_ choice also eats memory, so ghc does not always try to be smarter than you < 1294432477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: at least, until it gets {-# LANGUAGE MindReading #-} < 1294432483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not long, at this rate < 1294432484 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well maybe not in the case of fix < 1294432568 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1294432572 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: however some of that code is shared with other compilers than ghc, or at least used to be when there were others < 1294432608 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ghc may add rules pragmas for its own optimizations < 1294432685 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some of the code may be inherited from the haskell 98 report < 1294432692 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not fix though) < 1294432849 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1294432902 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There were other compilers? < 1294432937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah! Hugs! wait. < 1294432943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also there /is/ < 1294432948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*are* rather < 1294432958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Yhc < 1294432962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also nhc is an old one i think < 1294433099 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What kind of card games have circular text boxes? < 1294433218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle (>=>0 < 1294433219 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Parse error: < 1294433219 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : --count=20 (>=>0 < 1294433219 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ^ < 1294433219 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle (>=>) < 1294433220 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Monad (>=>) :: Monad m => (a -> m b) -> (b -> m c) -> a -> m c < 1294434064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=1020&t=110095#p1626297 < 1294434134 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is crazily awesome. < 1294434134 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'m addicted < 1294434147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Erm, are we looking at the same thing. < 1294434162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[[img]Minecraft%20lava[/img] < 1294434162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know whether this picture works, but it demonstrates the demonic power of above land lava!]] < 1294434165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's what I link to. < 1294434169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: buy it, do drudge work on Cube on server. < 1294434173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*linked < 1294434192 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, OK/ < 1294434348 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eachFileInteract f = eachFile (\h -> B.putStr =<< (f <$> B.hGetContents h)) < 1294434356 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: POINTFREE IT :D < 1294434581 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eachFile (B.putStr . f <=< B.hGetContents) < 1294434604 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or wait < 1294434627 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294434650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: THAT'S NOT POINT-FREE < 1294434659 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1294434666 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's as pretty as it can be < 1294434666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :enjoy ugly :D < 1294434708 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eachFileInteract = eachFile . (<=< B.hGetContents) . (B.putStr .) < 1294434721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: good! now inline all the functions < 1294434764 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO < 1294435085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i need a posix standards opinion < 1294435336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=1020&t=110095&sid=a30c290f6bd796ded3e2a348a40cf3c9&start=30#p1635944 < 1294435460 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm? < 1294435477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Is it OK if, e.g., rev(1) accepts only valid UTF-8? < 1294435495 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is rev even POSIX? < 1294435511 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: mentally substitute some other text processing filter, then < 1294435533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Elliott-Hirds-MacBook-Air:hsybox ehird$ echo 'häagen-dazs' | ./rev < 1294435533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :szad-negaäh < 1294435533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Elliott-Hirds-MacBook-Air:hsybox ehird$ ./rev /dev/random < 1294435535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rev: /dev/random: hGetContents: invalid argument (Illegal byte sequence) < 1294435537 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that tree is much better than me. < 1294435542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You are inferior. < 1294435546 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My life doesn't have a purpose any more. < 1294435547 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, such as sed or cut? hm < 1294435581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Bonus question -- is it even valid to do the Right Thing on valid UTF-8, and do it dumbly on invalid text? Or does POSIX actually require that you mangle non-ASCII text? < 1294435588 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, does POSIX say anything about it? (the utf-8 stuff) < 1294435595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what i'm askin'! < 1294435632 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have idea. TeXnicard could ignore pages in the DVI file that have negative page numbers. This way you can check for whatsits in a box by \shipout\lastbox and similar things to that. < 1294435654 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I know posix from an user perspective, not from an implementer perspective. And my guess is that it is locale dependent < 1294435671 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you check posix yourself, my computer is too heavily loaded to open such a huge pdf < 1294435687 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't wanna dig through N pages. (Also, don't you just use the HTML version? It has a nicer UI.) < 1294435702 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is there one for POSIX.1-2008? < 1294435702 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems to me that things like rev(1) would probably be required by POSIX to have no friggin' clue what Unicode is, and just recognize char 0x0A < 1294435735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes. < 1294435737 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, except as far as I can tell from some quick checks rev(1) comes from BSD and is not specced by posix < 1294435744 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah :P < 1294435746 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"things like" < 1294435752 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294435761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9699919799/ < 1294435764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: POSIX 2008. < 1294435780 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, back when I downloaded 2008 it was like 2 weeks after being ratified. And there was no html version then < 1294435793 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: boosters have apparently been fixed in the source code repository according to heresy < 1294435797 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :enjoy redoing your minecart tracks < 1294435802 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, fixed as in? < 1294435808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in they don't work any more. < 1294435832 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how reliable is this source? < 1294435837 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a very obvious definition of "fixed" < 1294435842 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, TWO people on Minecraft forums! http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=1020&t=128232 < 1294435873 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well could just be a rather mediocre hoax < 1294435885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Extremely mediocre < 1294435905 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite < 1294435973 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, played with craftbook on local test server btw. It's fun. Stuff like elevators with signs where you right click on sign to go up/down and bridges and what not < 1294435983 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it's a nice hmod plugin < 1294436004 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haven't tried it's minecart stuff but it does have some booster blocks and such < 1294436143 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Craftbook? < 1294436161 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, a hmod plugin that seems rather nice < 1294436205 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also I decided that the castle was not viable even when scaled down. Considering if I might do it with worldedit or similar. If I make the inner fort in obsidian it would be about 60000 obsidian or so I think. Which would be awesome but utterly infeasible without help from such a mod. < 1294436218 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heck it would be a pain even in other materials < 1294436232 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and that would be just hollow, rouge approximation < 1294436257 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Why not just make it manually, you have like 9348579845793845798345365 resources... < 1294436287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha! /me spawned OFF a beach < 1294436305 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not on my local test server no. And even with faster-render and region save single player is still unplayably slow. < 1294436314 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the server I can run on another computer on the lan) < 1294436327 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(one with good cpu but sucky intel graphics) < 1294436346 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh spawned above sea level < 1294436351 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think C ought to have a #try #catch that works at *compile time* (not at run time). < 1294436353 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh? < 1294436357 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Doing what. < 1294436373 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Catching compiler errors and warnings. < 1294436377 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294436377 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294436389 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually that sounds quite interesting (also rather mad) < 1294436444 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hey seeing "uncaught syntax error" would be epic :P < 1294436462 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or uncaught syntax exception I guess < 1294436499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :incidentally, wtf mcedit is hard to use. < 1294436535 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes it is. And for me it is slow too < 1294436547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Um. Question. < 1294436554 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cobblestone doesn't come naturally, does it. < 1294436562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, a dungeon. < 1294436563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But er. < 1294436564 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it does. Lava + water. Also in dungeons < 1294436566 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Non-mossy cobblestone? < 1294436574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did i mention that sand fell to reveal this :D < 1294436576 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, dungeons have non-mossy as well < 1294436592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha... the dungeon spawned underneath sand < 1294436594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the sand fell when i spawned < 1294436597 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ugh, where's my thumb drive? < 1294436604 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that sort of stuff happens. < 1294436614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :usually not right next to spawn though < 1294436617 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, why do you ask *us* that? < 1294436679 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf, dungeon without a chest :( < 1294436713 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, sure it isn't hidden under the sand? < 1294436727 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, cleared away all the sand to the cobble walls? < 1294436731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294436735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :underneath the remaining sand is just stone < 1294436735 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does gravel have a use? < 1294436748 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm. < 1294436750 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, weird < 1294436762 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, certainly. For draining. < 1294436775 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, how? < 1294436780 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty much same use as sand (except you can't smelt it for anything) < 1294436800 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION decides that he will torrent as much Red Dwarf as he can get his hands on. < 1294436811 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, drop it in, it will sink down. Easy to remove using the usual torch trick (see wiki if you don't know it) < 1294436914 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, craftbook has "redstone ICs" too. Including stuff like light level detector, 3-bit prng, water sensor, and what not. Oh and you can make redstone controlled torches. And pumpkins. So you can make light switches :) < 1294436922 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know of the prng. < 1294436935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder why pumpkins/torches aren't redstoned. < 1294436952 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, pikhq, one of the two of you please pick a torrent from http://torrentz.eu/search?f=red+Dwarf < 1294436969 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh and there are some ICs that require admin privs it seems. Such as "set time of day". I just combined a light detector and that to reset to day as soon as dusk comes. Waiting to see if it will work. < 1294437004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: They all look like shitty xvid. < 1294437008 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Series 9 is not necessary here. < 1294437012 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, :( < 1294437024 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Look for the DVD ISOs and transcode yourself. < 1294437041 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I think that might ... not be what he wants. But yeah, agreed :P < 1294437056 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yay, it resets to just-after-sunrise about 2 seconds after the light level starts to decrease during dusk. Hm that is actually kind of useful when building stuff outdoors. < 1294437067 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not looking for ultra-high quality here. < 1294437071 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Now turn monsters on. < 1294437074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Then download anything. < 1294437077 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hah :P < 1294437088 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: If it's not h.264 it's a waste of disk space. < 1294437109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Oh, stop being a zealot. < 1294437113 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294437128 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, maybe. Maybe not. It has health of and worldedit on. So it is very much a creative testing server :P < 1294437130 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, well, if there aren't any h.264 torrents which won't take until the heat death of the universe to download, I'm fine with wasting disk space. < 1294437142 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://torrentz.eu/e9e838463c428d6e169fdf9c4a0858bb5fc71cd4 < 1294437146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Go for that. < 1294437153 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Just disable season 8 or whatever. < 1294437156 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm not even being a zealot here! < 1294437165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the biggest one with enough seeders to download well. < 1294437169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Biggest as in file size. < 1294437170 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, naw, season 9 is the optional one. < 1294437180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Er, right. < 1294437203 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Especially since most Xvid stuff is downscaled, and it's *all* at what would be, for h.264, an *insanely* high bitrate. < 1294437219 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294437227 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yes, but sourcing ISOs is nearly impossible. < 1294437237 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also if you don't like the bridge in it you can make toggleable areas. Like you build something. Mark it with worldedit (craftbook and worldedit have the same author), then use a save area command. Then you can make redstone control this, replacing it with empty air or with another saved area. To switch between them. You can make quite fancy bridges that way. < 1294437239 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, OK, but turning my nose up at it is not something I'm going to do if there aren't any other options. < 1294437241 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, true. < 1294437255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Also, you do realise that there isn't any season 9? < 1294437258 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though there were a lot of Red Dwarf PAL ISOs there... < 1294437279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The Back to Earth three-parter is sometimes referred to as season 9 for god-knows-what-reason. < 1294437280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ORLY? < 1294437281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I saw none. < 1294437301 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yeah, that sets off my crap detectors so I'll leave it for now. < 1294437304 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Sort by size, look at the torrents that are about 4 gig. < 1294437312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Season 8 is also pretty bad, I gather. < 1294437328 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: http://torrentz.eu/searchS?q=red+dwarf < 1294437336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: The top one there is 2 gigs of xvid. < 1294437343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er, wait, 20 gigs. < 1294437363 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: OK, all I see is remastered ones and a few others. < 1294437376 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Certainly no reliable way to get all of them without stupid remastering. OR even with. < 1294437387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also: Unseeded. < 1294437398 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish I wasn't so twitchy about torrents. < 1294437398 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, fuck, they are unseeded. < 1294437407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: "Twitchy"? < 1294437410 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHY DO PEOPLE STILL USE XVID. IT SUCKS. < 1294437424 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I get paranoid if it doesn't start downloading quickly. < 1294437439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Fill in trackers from torrentz. Forget it exists for five hours. Come back. < 1294437571 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it stupid to wish there was some kind of sequencing operator for torrents? < 1294437602 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It's called pause and resume. < 1294437608 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Would it be impossible to prioritise early files for download? < 1294437620 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You can do that manually. < 1294437630 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Go into properties, files, set the first ones to high priority. < 1294437634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*first few ones < 1294437647 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Opinion: Just about every block should react to a redstone current. Also, redstone currents should be able to move blocks somehow. < 1294437659 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That would be 90% of the way to letting you make a dig-o-matic bot. < 1294437696 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hah < 1294437702 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOT A JOKE < 1294437737 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: "Whats the texture pack" -- in reply to someone using the default texture pack. < 1294437748 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but presumably it'd need some finite resource to power it? < 1294437750 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I just imagined a blocky variant of one of those huge digging machines you see on pics sometimes. Forgot the name of it. Started with B iirc. < 1294437774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Finite resource: sure, time. Minecart perpetual motion machines already exist anyway :P < 1294437776 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, you'd have to make a turbine generator and attach it to a furnace. < 1294437804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I was about to say that you should be able to, like, burn a "deactivated redstone torch" item in a furnace, and it'd become a redstone source. < 1294437807 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not if boosters are fixed < 1294437811 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, then they don't < 1294437812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(With normal redstone torches being removed.) < 1294437826 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Boatloops then. < 1294437826 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My idea is BETTER < 1294437830 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh true < 1294437841 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I don't get yours, would you just put coal in a furnace and no items? < 1294437843 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, yes I agree your idea is better < 1294437845 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have a turbine block which can be crafter. < 1294437848 0 :impomatic!~chatzilla@146.88.113.87.dyn.plus.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294437850 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*crafter < 1294437851 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :snow on top of a pumpkin :D < 1294437851 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi :-) < 1294437856 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*crafted < 1294437861 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic, hello < 1294437862 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What happened to http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net ? Has it moved? < 1294437868 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, quite common < 1294437870 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: But there's no fluid involved. >_> < 1294437873 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay gold < 1294437876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic: it is, as always, at esolangs.org; voxelperfect expired < 1294437894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You can s/deactivated redstone torch/anything/ in my idea. < 1294437895 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you people haven't spelunked much have ya < 1294437899 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You then have some kind of pipe-based thing, and a heat exchanger item. < 1294437901 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: gold is useless < 1294437902 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all the caves near cube are unlooked-at < 1294437902 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite a few links on the esolang wiki to voxelperfect addresses. < 1294437907 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, nice < 1294437909 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's the point < 1294437910 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Run pipes from furnace to turbine. < 1294437912 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The point is that furnacing an item would make the furnace act as a redstone torch. < 1294437919 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Put heat exchanger in furnace. < 1294437923 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Light furnace. < 1294437924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With redstone torches being removed. < 1294437952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Ideally, there'd be some way to "push" blocks into furnaces with some kind of machine, so the miner could power itself :) (if it found those blocks) < 1294437961 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, removing them would be a PITA. You could no longer make inverters. Or any logic. < 1294437969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Why not? < 1294437972 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yes, but this way you can also use hydroelectric power. Although water flow would have to be made finite or somesuch. < 1294437975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Presumably you'd just fuel up a stack of redstone torches and it'd use them. < 1294437985 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, inverters rely on redstone torches. < 1294437990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Weird, exposed stone outside (a lot of it). < 1294437994 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As do all logic gates. < 1294437996 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well you called your a source. That means it always generate, no? < 1294438000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Meh, you can easily build a constant flow. < 1294438003 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, your idea is good too. < 1294438003 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, unlike redstone torches < 1294438004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just route the furnace-torch to two places. < 1294438015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It acts exactly like a redstone torch when burning. < 1294438020 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, furnaces mesh nicely with my uranium idea. < 1294438026 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: YES. < 1294438029 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how would you place it on the side of a block then? < 1294438037 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nuclear-powered autominers! < 1294438043 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, because that is what makes logic work < 1294438054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Dunno yet. < 1294438059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: 1 uranium burns to produce 64 toxic wastes. < 1294438077 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but it burns for 20 real-time days. < 1294438089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No. :p The point is that it takes ages to smelt. < 1294438098 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: So given enough coal it'd run forever. < 1294438104 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sort of. < 1294438109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Toxic wastes in a furnace make it corrode, or something, so you have to pick them up, but if you hold them for too long you start losing health gradually. < 1294438111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you have to dump them. < 1294438120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But they solidify water into, I dunno, obsidian. < 1294438129 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make glass decay, trees to die. Etc. < 1294438130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The solution? < 1294438134 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why, throwing it into lava, of course. < 1294438141 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wasn't thinking of having uranium burnable by itself, FWIW. < 1294438146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Make grass decay, < 1294438152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Should uranium be the smelted item or the fuel? < 1294438173 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'd smelt uranium ore into uranium blocks, both of which would cause gradual and persistent health damage. < 1294438177 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you plan on writing a mod to do this? < 1294438182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Fuck no. < 1294438188 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm fantasising, like Sgeo but more awesome. < 1294438204 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then you craft the blocks into a core by surrounding them with iron, and use that as a fuel. < 1294438207 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, less awesome. I think Phantom_Hoover's suggestion was a lot better < 1294438217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: um his and mine suggestions are working off each others < 1294438224 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*my < 1294438227 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well the turbine one I meant < 1294438231 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When a core is exhausted, you get nuclear waste. < 1294438239 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: whatever < 1294438240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I approve. < 1294438276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: So, what do things do when hit by a current. < 1294438301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Ooh. Maybe lanterns _are_ a good idea. < 1294438307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Torches expire, and lanterns need a current to run. < 1294438314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: So you'd end up mining to keep your house's main generator running. < 1294438318 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yep. < 1294438345 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294438367 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The autominer would presumably be crafted. < 1294438378 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No no no, I was meaning constructing your own. < 1294438398 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: As in, logic gates for... logic, and using the advanced circuitry's interactions with blocks to actually move a mining-vehicle along a track. < 1294438406 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, this would be huge. < 1294438428 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What role does redstone play here? < 1294438438 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does it still act as the primary current carrier? < 1294438463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Presumably. < 1294438488 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Maybe we should call it something else, considering it'd probably end up totally different. < 1294438490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Bluestone? < 1294438497 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yes, this would be an extremely fun thing to add. < 1294438514 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FWIW, a more elegant method than redstone wiring would be necessary. < 1294438522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Obviously minecarts would interact with bluestone. Ooh, I know. < 1294438544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: If you put a bluestone current into a minecart track, it pushes any cart on it forward at X speed. < 1294438565 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How would wiring work? < 1294438567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: So you can make a booster-style system by having a generator, and just having it follow the track, occasionally splitting into "further along the track" and "rightwards to boost the track". < 1294438574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: COMPLICATEDLY, I don't wanna think about wiring :P < 1294438584 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do I tell if a file exists in Haskell ? < 1294438594 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about you make a wire-carrying block. < 1294438604 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION found doesFileExist ... < 1294438619 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right-clicking with bluestone lets you run more cables through. < 1294438623 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: < 1294438624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :22:16 elliott: @hoogle FilePath -> IO Bool < 1294438624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :22:16 lambdabot: System.Directory doesDirectoryExist :: FilePath -> IO Bool < 1294438625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :22:16 lambdabot: System.Directory doesFileExist :: FilePath -> IO Bool < 1294438627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :22:16 lambdabot: System.Console.Editline.Readline readHistory :: FilePath -> IO Bool < 1294438630 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: MAYBE, DO NOT WANT TO THINK, LEAST FUN PART OF THIS < 1294438651 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks < 1294438681 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: @hoogle is your friend :-) < 1294438731 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I always feel misanthropically bitter when I get download rates a tenth of my seeding rates on a torrent. < 1294438746 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ME TOO < 1294438750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*TOO. < 1294438750 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1294438797 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You lay some bluestone on the top of some obsidian, and then on the right of it. Catch: The right of it is immersed in lava. < 1294438805 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Please tell me this works and you can send currents to lava to do awesome things. < 1294438839 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well... < 1294438854 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would be nice to have proper water and lava manipulation. < 1294438881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Maybe the lava should travel backwards as fire along the circuit :D < 1294438895 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, naaa. < 1294438896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That would let you hook up an automated-burner; just flick a switch and burn whatever's on the other end. < 1294438900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: OH FINE. < 1294438907 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make it damage the player, though. < 1294438924 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And make water conductive, because chemistry is boring. < 1294438949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I'm talking about when a current hits a block, though (think how TNT behaves now). < 1294438953 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHOOOOOPS < 1294438955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obviously a current hitting a lava block should do SOMETHING fun. < 1294438970 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, set fire to it? < 1294438996 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Lava blocks are sort of already fire. < 1294439000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minecraft-physicsy. < 1294439059 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: did you know your pit is just next to a huge cave system... only have to break a few blocks to get to your staircase, not telling you how i know tho < 1294439128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294439168 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cobblestone burns SLOOOOOW < 1294439257 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, I should point out that we can get pretty thorough pictures of underground areas with mcmap < 1294439267 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: cobblestone burns? < 1294439270 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Liberal destruction is not necessary. < 1294439272 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh smelts right < 1294439286 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294439576 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: if by that you mean i should be more careful, then yes, i certainly try to avoid stuff like this, i just didn't realize the cave went under the fucking mountain < 1294439596 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294439598 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah burns < 1294439656 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think smelting stone should produce obsidian. < 1294439685 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you could only do it by lava bucket, and it'd take one whole bucket < 1294439689 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :burns 1000 min iirc < 1294439710 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it was seconds, but anyway < 1294439719 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forever < 1294439759 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros must have gotten pretty pissed, i keep timing out < 1294439850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: 1000s, yeah < 1294439856 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i... forgot to take the stone out, and picked the stove < 1294439859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294439886 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the coal, mined about a hundred of that stuff, now i have 20 something < 1294439902 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fucking hell < 1294439923 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, really? < 1294439929 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really what < 1294439936 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Coal is so common the rest of us leave it alone. < 1294439952 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you need one coal like every 5 seconds < 1294439955 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when spelunking < 1294439961 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i mean i do < 1294439966 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Feel free to get some from Mt. Hoover or the ROU; my supplies are enough for me. < 1294439978 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i put a torch on every square < 1294439981 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes two < 1294440002 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but anyway yeah, it's common, but i don't have a box full of it yet < 1294440009 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because i just started mining < 1294440013 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: lame, i mine every block in a tunnel i go in, fill it with lava, then cover it with glass < 1294440019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :best lighting system for spelunking imo < 1294440020 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have something like one stack there or what? < 1294440076 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or a spare big box < 1294440119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: did you know that if you destroy a chest without using a pick, just your hands, it keeps the items inside and you can store it in your inventory? < 1294440136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so you can store like 36 chests with items in your inventory < 1294440138 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really useful < 1294440149 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh? really? < 1294440167 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is very useful, if it's true < 1294440181 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yep < 1294440201 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i won't even need a base then < 1294440215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: nomad :P < 1294440261 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what about a box, can you store a box full of stuff in a box? < 1294440274 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because i could just carry a castle around then. < 1294440292 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"here come's oklopol with a bag full of a fucking 64x64x64 diamond castle" < 1294440295 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*comes < 1294440311 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mc is making me swear < 1294440329 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: hmm i guess you could actually < 1294440333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, it's just breaking the box that has the items in < 1294440345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but getting an item out of 10 nested boxes might be a bitch :D < 1294440391 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah like i'd ever actually *use* the stuff i'm carrying < 1294440511 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I've tested that in the past. < 1294440522 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :please tell me it works < 1294440523 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Breaking a chest drops all items inside. < 1294440526 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU PH < 1294440529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I EVEN ASKED YOU IN /MSG NOT TO TELL < 1294440531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294440535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was going to keep that up for days < 1294440540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuuuuuck youuuuu < 1294440546 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would've just tried after this tho < 1294440547 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You said "DON'T TELL HIM" < 1294440550 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With no context. < 1294440557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: A POX UPON YOU < 1294440562 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I checked here, and I didn't associate the two at all. < 1294440564 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it was kinda obvious he was lying < 1294440571 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyhow < 1294440581 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought you were telling me not to tell David Braben he was a dick < 1294440649 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294440825 0 :cheater99!~cheater@e181140136.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294440863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Wow, there are people who don't understand why people would not like InvEdit much. < 1294440905 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :People tend not to be very tolerant of people who enjoy different forms of play to them. < 1294440945 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :invedit = ability to put stuff in your inventory? < 1294440955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Even I dislike InvEdit to a degree... i.e., I'm not going to think of much of a gigantic superstructure if it was built entirely with InvEdit. < 1294440959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'d materials. < 1294440970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: lets you put whatever you want in your inventory and change various random shit like getting infinite health, tool health, etc. < 1294440988 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but we have infinite player and tool health. < 1294440996 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or at least we have the former and want the latter. < 1294441013 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just want bots < 1294441014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yesyesyes, but we can't just say //giveme 5 diamond blocks and 1000 obsidian < 1294441019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: AUTOMINER < 1294441045 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is that, i have no way to guess < 1294441064 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or are you naming a game < 1294441070 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, things like that Enterprise would be impressive if they had been built by hand at all. < 1294441082 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even with inventory editing, < 1294441090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Eh, sure. Still. < 1294441094 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, that's the whole point of Creative mode. < 1294441098 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"OMG I MADE A HUGE CASTLE" "but didn't mine a block to make it"... meh. < 1294441109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: autominer is me and Phantom_Hoover's hypothetical machine built with bluestone < 1294441115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where bluestone is a hypothetical circuit system far better than redstone < 1294441121 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294441128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :powerful enough to build an automatic mining tool with that can even power itself (assuming it finds the right ore) < 1294441139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would, however, be gigantic :D < 1294441154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd probably want one central computer and underground wires leading to all the places you want to mine < 1294441160 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than making multiple ones < 1294441167 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : well it was kinda obvious he was lying <-- well, with all they've been speaking about notch being a lousy programmer... although such a cheat would probably be a high priority to fix. < 1294441167 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i'm not saying you can't build an identicle in mc < 1294441176 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just that you can't make a nice one < 1294441209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: wut < 1294441241 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-222-39.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294441246 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yeah, but i figured it was a multiplayer specific feature no one mentioned to me, because no one else actually needs boxes < 1294441259 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1294441259 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: identicle was defined in a conversation a few months ago here < 1294441266 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm hm i vaguely recall it < 1294441269 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.D < 1294441270 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294441280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10.12.01:13:29:43 elliott: let's talk about identicles instead < 1294441289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10.12.01:12:48:07 elliott, the principle is identicle. < 1294441291 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed that is the principle < 1294441293 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well in this case, something that is able to destroy everything < 1294441296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: few months ago = december < 1294441302 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it ... felt like it was ages ago though, what < 1294441312 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah i don't really experience time quite as linearly as most people < 1294441320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you could do that with bluestone kinda < 1294441329 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does bluestone do < 1294441334 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you know what redstone does? < 1294441334 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :redstone + movement? < 1294441337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that, but much more advanced < 1294441337 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somehow < 1294441345 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1294441347 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: basically, it involves redesigning 1/4th of the whole game :D < 1294441350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it'd be so much cooler < 1294441351 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know what redstone does, but haven't really used it much < 1294441357 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because i find it bleh < 1294441369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could basically make a rabid auto-miner that fuels itself, except while normally you'd make it only work on a cave and only mine useful stuff < 1294441374 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could make one that just eats everything < 1294441380 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and assuming it gets enough fuel to keep it going... < 1294441400 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you won't without the recursive boxing < 1294441404 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294441413 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you won't get positive prob in the limit with fixed inv size < 1294441435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it would just throw them into a lava pit < 1294441440 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or get rid of them some other way < 1294441471 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :get rid of what < 1294441479 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: the blocks it mines? < 1294441480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or what do you mean < 1294441491 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm actually < 1294441516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: the idea is basically: mine everything; stuff that can be used as fuel goes in the furnace-power-generator; everything else gets destroyed < 1294441519 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just realized fixed inventory size doesn't matter because you can just leave blocks in stacks or something, until you've proven you have enough later on or something < 1294441532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eventually the whole world would just be, like, bluestone circuits < 1294441538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or actually just bedrock with this hovering death-machine in the sky < 1294441543 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh hmm < 1294441544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since it'd mine the blocks that it puts bluestone on eventually < 1294441548 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which would cause it to fall < 1294441550 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right you actually do need fuel < 1294441560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yeah in this case there'd be no redstone torches < 1294441565 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so then what i said earlier: eventually it'll stop < 1294441567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd have to burn a certain item in a furnace and that'd generate current < 1294441572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: sure, but the point is, < 1294441579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: whenever it mines fuel, it uses it to fuel itself < 1294441580 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot, < 1294441581 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ok, sometimes the info to the pascalites, release v, level 1.2. < 1294441591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and it'd have multiple redundant furnaces to keep it going < 1294441606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: sure if you had a GIGANTIC area with no useful fuels... but then you could just double the initial furnaces and try again :> < 1294441607 0 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294441632 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: can it build more furnaces or something? < 1294441635 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294441645 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the point is, if it only has a fixed amount of storage for excess fuel < 1294441653 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then the probability of stopping is 1 < 1294441656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: the world is finite, you recall. < 1294441660 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh true < 1294441666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although i suppose you are working in a hypothetical infinite universe :) < 1294441670 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294441677 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mathematically more interesting < 1294441678 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it could build more furnaces, sure, if it got the materials < 1294441691 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise i could just say there's positive prob for the world being empty < 1294441694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and the probability of getting the requisite cobbles for building a furnace before it dies is, like, 1, according to the minecraft rng < 1294441723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: note that this death machine would have to be VERY complicated and would probably take up more space than the alu or cpu :) < 1294441733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since not only does it have to mine, but it has to plan its mining so that it leaves enough tracks for _it_ to go on < 1294441746 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, if it can build arbitrarily large amounts of furnaces, maybe you can manage it, at least then it's not trivial that you can't. < 1294441749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also it has to bring the materials back, decide what to do with them, build more furnaces, move them into place, dispose of waste from uranium fuel, etc. < 1294441780 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, but that's just engineering ;) < 1294441793 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any monkey with a phd can do it < 1294441796 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, FWIW, nuclear bombs are the other use for uranium. < 1294441801 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: oh joy :D < 1294441841 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Craft uranium, dynamite and iron into a bomb, which is then detonatable by a bluestone charge. < 1294441841 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294441863 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd like to craft HER anium if you know what i mean < 1294441877 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: the project gutenberg license is non-free :D < 1294441899 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: how big boom < 1294441940 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: I suggest it requires one uranium, four dynamite, and four iron < 1294441952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: uranium in middle, surrounded by dynamite, iron in the corners < 1294441954 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that's the precise design I had in mind. < 1294441957 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: actually iron is a bit out of place... < 1294441959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: it's too common < 1294441962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: may i suggest diamond? :D < 1294441979 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, the point is that the uranium is the really rare bit. < 1294442003 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, there would be *very* few reasons to detonate it unless in PvP SMP. < 1294442046 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Griefer's dream. Well, really dedicated mining griefer. < 1294442061 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, I'm thinking of damage on the order of scouring all of the earth for kilometres around, and making vast areas unusable due to radiation. < 1294442071 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, it can melt stone. < 1294442076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294442077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: I suggest that smelting uranium ore produces only one uranium. < 1294442092 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: But counts as, say, 16 to 32 units of smelting. < 1294442095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you need, e.g., more than one coal to do it. < 1294442123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: OH I HAVE A WONDERFUL IDEA < 1294442123 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I fail to see the utility of that. < 1294442136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: The utility is that smelting uranium becomes slower and more resource-using. < 1294442142 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: WONDERFUL IDEA: < 1294442149 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Once you have any uranium ore, you'll have heaps of coal anyway. < 1294442151 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: When using uranium as a fuel for smelting, I said it produces 64 nuclear waste. < 1294442153 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT BETTER IDEA: < 1294442172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: It produces, say, 512 nuclear waste. If it has 64 and wants to generate another one, the furnace *explodes*. < 1294442191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Specifically, all bluestone it's connected to catches fire, and an explosion is made. < 1294442193 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Small explosion, and irradiation. < 1294442197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1294442198 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And also fire. < 1294442198 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: That, of course, is the reactor meltdown. < 1294442206 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One TNT, not nuke. < 1294442223 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Maybe more than one TNT, reactor meltdowns are pretty nasty. < 1294442252 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, due to nuclear leakage, not due to explosive power. < 1294442264 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Oh, fine. You're no fun but okay. < 1294442289 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The irradiation is bad enough. < 1294442295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Of course, you could "wrap" this up in a safe reactor, which uses BLUESTONE MAGIC to take out the nuclear waste and dispose of it safely. Or even, if you want a small design. < 1294442309 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, you end up with an effectively unusable patch of lang. < 1294442310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: just have one that detects when the thing becomes full of nuclear waste and takes out the uranium. < 1294442312 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*land < 1294442320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Oo, er, slight issue. < 1294442352 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: 32 full of nuclear waste in smelting output. You take the uranium out. You put it back in. < 1294442355 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ZOMG INFINITE URANIUM POWER < 1294442403 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, make the uranium inaccessible like coal and other normal fuels? < 1294442425 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Then how do you prevent meltdown if it fills with nuclear waste? Oh, duh, you destroy the furnace. < 1294442438 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or remove the waste? < 1294442443 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Or that, yes. < 1294442449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: OK, so the simplest safe reactor would be a furnace hooked up to a circuit that detects when there's 64 waste, and destroys the furnace. < 1294442465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although detecting when there's 64 waste would probably require a chest to do it in, at which point you might as well just use the disposal-version. < 1294442479 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Hmm, I feel like being able to destroy nuclear waste easily in lava is a bit of a cop out. < 1294442490 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is. < 1294442492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: How about: Throwing nuclear waste into lava gradually irradiates it. When it fully radiates, it turns into obsidian. < 1294442498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: No, this makes no sense, but who cares? < 1294442501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It sounds cool. < 1294442526 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MC doesn't *have* any mechanic to make anything impossible to dispose, really; < 1294442544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: And then a self-sustaining circuit would then mine the obsidian, get more lava, put lava in the hole again, and throw the obsidian into the lava. < 1294442557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: And no, but impossible to dispose is boring; this just makes it _annoying_ to dispose of in large amounts. < 1294442575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: omg, I so want to have all of this in the game ... but the Java work would be immense, and Notch would break it every update. < 1294442589 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, erm, you can just throw things and leave them for 15 minutes. < 1294442619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Thrown nuclear waste acts like placed nuclear waste. < 1294442625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. gradually irradiates a large surrounding area. < 1294442642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: And ideally it'd remember what chunks have thrown nuclear waste in, and record when it was thrown in the chunk file. < 1294442667 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, then just make a chamber deep underground and throw everything there. < 1294442678 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seal it when it's too irradiated to use. < 1294442683 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lather, rinse, repeat. < 1294442697 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: "Too irradiated to use"? < 1294442704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, I would imagine that radiation has infinite upwards extent. < 1294442727 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but you reach a point where it kills you in 5 seconds. < 1294442749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So basically throwing it in a pit doesn't help. < 1294442819 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't you just make it a block that cannot be dropped < 1294442824 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that seems more natural < 1294442831 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes, but consider: < 1294442838 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Yes, that's probably the best idea. < 1294442853 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the point is you need to find a place for it, if you can just put 64 in a 1x1x1 hole, that's kinda lame < 1294442898 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is looking at himself on top of a dancing minecart < 1294442938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D i've done that before < 1294442953 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Consider... < 1294442986 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Also, idea: N-thick (3?) obsidian blocks all radiation. Dump nuclear waste by storing it in large chests surrounded by thick obsidian. Make creepy underground passageways with warning signs to there. NEVER VISIT EVER. < 1294442989 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm. Making it undroppable is a bit silly. < 1294443007 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: "This place is not a place of honour", etc. < 1294443008 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That last idea is the best one. < 1294443021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Have you read that paper or a summary of it of any kind? It's awesome.) < 1294443023 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, you read that stuff too? < 1294443027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1294443039 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294443041 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you find out about it from TV Tropes? < 1294443044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, jwz. < 1294443047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :('s livejournal.) < 1294443065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Idea: Dropping nuclear waste starts irradiating the area around you EXTREMELY rapidly. < 1294443073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Makes no sense? Absolutely. Will stop anyone dropping it? Absolutely. < 1294443088 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: why is it silly? < 1294443110 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: imagine an object in your pocket you can't throw out < 1294443113 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure mc isn't "realistic" < 1294443115 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can < 1294443115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not being able to throw something? < 1294443118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes no sense < 1294443120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: orly < 1294443145 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes really. < 1294443150 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, it just makes the whole idea pointlessly impractical. < 1294443157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what then < 1294443182 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: then maybe you could have less then 64 of it, and you can't just carry it around in huge quantities, or you'll start getting damage at some point < 1294443182 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Other idea: iron chests which block radiation enough to make it practical to store uranium. < 1294443186 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*than < 1294443186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: WRT those nuclear warnings, I have a feeling that future idiotic explorers might see it as "ha ha, this primitive culture thought they could keep us away from their treasure by making up some 'death-ium'!" < 1294443199 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't see how elliott < 1294443204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OTOH, maybe it's best that such recklessness has its consequences demonstrated in the early days of a society. < 1294443208 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'s chest idea makes it wait he explained < 1294443208 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: don't see how what < 1294443212 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you die if you drop it < 1294443220 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think that's even sillier < 1294443230 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Gold blocks make best sense as shielding, followed by much larger amounts of iron.) < 1294443244 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Just make gold chests. < 1294443248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gold would become actually useful. < 1294443260 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Obsidian would actually be pretty useless IRL, since it's mainly silicon.) < 1294443264 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes! < 1294443265 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: I do think that you should be able to hold on to uranium for a few in-game days without starting to feel the radiation. < 1294443269 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, you need to handle it. < 1294443283 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, indeed. < 1294443295 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It causes slow, tenuous damage, though. < 1294443295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: OTOH, gold chests should probably decay if given tons of time. < 1294443307 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you get radiation bubbles which start popping every few hours < 1294443315 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. you can't just eat some pork and get better. < 1294443319 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ofc if you're holding 64... < 1294443319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: I do think that obsidian should block it, 'cuz obsidian is basically made out of magic in Minecraft. < 1294443324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: But only thick obsidian. < 1294443331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: And it must have *no holes*. < 1294443334 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any holes --> radiation gets out. < 1294443356 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obsidian-coated gold chests is what you do every real-world month to dispose of your current pile-up of waste. < 1294443361 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Far underground. < 1294443366 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You do NOT want to break that obsidian.) < 1294443387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Oh, and perhaps you need to leave enough space for the chest to burst. < 1294443402 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. if you store 64 obsidian in a gold chest, you need 63 free blocks surrounded by obsidian around the chest. < 1294443411 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So that when the chest decays and the waste bursts out, it doesn't escape. < 1294443444 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Makes sense. < 1294443470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Aaaand this is why it's sad that an awesome programmer didn't think of MC before Notch did. < 1294443482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Instead he's deciding on release dates and getting a documentary filmed. < 1294443484 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. < 1294443569 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a chance of us getting a decent game in the same vein any time soon? < 1294443601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Clearly that must be Heavy Hoover FUN Industries' second product after ASTEROIDS II: NEWTONIAN BOOGALOO. < 1294443609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Hoover Heavy FUN Industries' < 1294443612 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So heavy in FUN1 < 1294443614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*FUN! < 1294443678 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: NO? < 1294443693 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clearly. < 1294443705 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And any projects that might actually come to fruition? < 1294443714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: :P < 1294443722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: oklopol's game will probably be decent if impossible. < 1294443734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(to play.) < 1294443740 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol has a game? < 1294443740 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I figured out how I could make it read the log file, almost. I could do like: tex example > example.fot and then read that file in using TeX. But it won't work unless file contains \message{} command to force it to wake up otherwise it won't read past a certain point. < 1294443757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: It's like Minecraft except 2D and it has no textures and creatures are super-deadly and everything is random and he came up with it before MC < 1294443802 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1294443804 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no i came up with this particular one tons after mc, i just hadn't heard about mc < 1294443809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Also, oklopol HAS made games before, albeit impossible-to-play ones. < 1294443809 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As well as Asteroids II. < 1294443811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: same thing really < 1294443815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: independent invention < 1294443820 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: What about it. < 1294443823 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol seems to come up with the best game ideas. < 1294443826 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well now mine has also all the few good ideas of mc < 1294443839 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right, oklopol also invented Asteroids II unintentionally. < 1294443856 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's asteroids 2? < 1294443858 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I made a lot of game too but probably nothing like that. < 1294443862 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it that game of mine < 1294443871 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, remember that polygon gravitational thing you mentioned? < 1294443875 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294443881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Asteroids II is the game slowly crawling its way outside of the 2D Newtonian physics simulation. < 1294443885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*out of the < 1294443886 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're growing that out of that thing of yours? < 1294443887 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294443892 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorta guessed < 1294443949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: http://vjn.fi/index.php?g=0 oklo's games plus some other stuff < 1294443952 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the mc type game of mine will mostly be about coding bots, you can't really survive otherwise < 1294443971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: are the .exes python-compiled < 1294443974 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or are they not written in py < 1294443983 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(you're not supposed to let your player die) < 1294443990 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm actually i'm considering using c# < 1294443995 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i mean the games you've made < 1294443998 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since someone taught me to make pixels in it.. < 1294444007 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :c++ and non-compiled python < 1294444015 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Why do you have to use C# if just C should work? < 1294444024 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know how to make a pixel in c < 1294444035 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, C is the worst language in the world < 1294444042 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd rather use brainfuck < 1294444051 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well who wouldn't, but i'd rather use c++ < 1294444061 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, C is a nice enough language. < 1294444062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: putpixel(screen, x, y, colour) < 1294444064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: allegro ^ < 1294444066 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Why you don't know how? And what is so bad with C? I prefer Enhanced CWEB to make a C program. < 1294444067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for putting a pixel < 1294444071 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just abused horribly. < 1294444077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although _putpixel() is faster < 1294444082 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just have to decide what colour depth you want < 1294444086 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: i don't know how to make a pixel because no one told me how one is drawn < 1294444096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: putpixel(screen, x, y, colour) < 1294444097 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :w/ allegro < 1294444098 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, STOP MENTIONING YOUR GODDAMN _EXTENSION_ TO A PREEXISTING PROGRAM SOMEONE ELSE WROTE. < 1294444104 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOONE ELSE WILL _EVER_ USE IT < 1294444106 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DEAL WITH IT < 1294444108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: fully: putpixel(screen, x, y, makecol(r, g, b)) < 1294444109 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294444113 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: It depends what system you are using for screen drawing. < 1294444122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so now you gotta use C! also it'll be faster :p < 1294444126 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, it might be different SDL with Allegro, for example. < 1294444126 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: but so can i just open a text editor, write that inside mine and compile? < 1294444128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and have a better chance of running on linux < 1294444128 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294444129 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :main < 1294444142 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :too much mc maybe. < 1294444147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you have to put allegro_init(); first and then like a few lines to tell it what size screen you want < 1294444152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: plus tell it that you, like, want a keyboard < 1294444154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but after that < 1294444156 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty much, yep < 1294444161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :allegro is very simple as these things go < 1294444190 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I prefer to use SDL, but you can use Allegro if you prefer. < 1294444197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: http://alleg.sourceforge.net/docs/how_to_make_a_pong_game.en.html Pong in Allegro, obviously you can ignore all the stupid image/sprite/mouse stuff < 1294444198 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that does sound nice enough. but the pathfinding algos i have are rather complicated, and would probably be faster in c# than me-written c < 1294444209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: erm i find that doubtful < 1294444213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: unless you're like a mega leet c# coder < 1294444226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since ~pretty much the same algorithm can be done in C for all such algorithms < 1294444236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and C has the advantage of not having all the vm baggage and also of having well-tuned compilers < 1294444241 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Is there a problem with C that you cannot do #try #catch that operating at *compile time*? < 1294444247 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i certainly am not, but i don't understand anything about cache of anything, and i can't exactly just load chunks when player goes near like mc can < 1294444271 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well uh C# doesn't cache for you < 1294444276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not that much higher-level than C < 1294444278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :objects don't solve caching :P < 1294444281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so you're gonna simulate an infinite world every frame? < 1294444282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clever < 1294444283 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: the problem is C isn't very high level < 1294444290 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nor is C# :D < 1294444293 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean i find math too low level < 1294444294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C# is just java with lambdas. < 1294444316 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nowadays i prefer lack of communication. < 1294444336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: write it in J < 1294444342 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: or oklotalk! write it in oklotalk < 1294444356 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, do you seriously not realise that you are just being annoying by constantly bringing up your own solutions to problems nobody has. < 1294444368 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no i'm not going to simulate an infinite world every frame, that would mean nth iteration takes Omega(n) times < 1294444369 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*tim < 1294444370 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1294444383 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like C, but I think it should have a few more compile-time directives such as ones to catch compiler errors and warnings, and to tell the optimizer about various things that might even be wrong... < 1294444385 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i'm simulating a huge part of the world, preferably < 1294444386 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it would take O(infinity) time :D which is the same as O(0) < 1294444393 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: then C will help for the pure number-crunching speed < 1294444401 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: do blocks have any more state than what type of block they are? < 1294444426 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: c# is much higher-level, but i guess if i dl'd nice data structures for c someone competent has made, it would just have uglier syntax. < 1294444434 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no gc < 1294444486 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no it wouldn't < 1294444490 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :take infinity time < 1294444503 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :messages don't travel infinitely far < 1294444531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: okay then < 1294444534 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:52 elliott: oklopol: do blocks have any more state than what type of block they are? < 1294444551 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: blocks can be programmed arbitrarily, and different blocks have different "components" that determine what they can actually physically do < 1294444570 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :arbitrarily, although depends on block how much programming it allows, most blocks are pretty stupid < 1294444586 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so you can create a new block the behaves pretty much exactly how you like by programming? < 1294444587 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: while playing? < 1294444590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :l0lz < 1294444603 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294444609 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294444622 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as i said, most blocks will not be all that useful < 1294444636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: right, the issue there is that your world update gets a whole lot slower < 1294444636 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Why do you think they are nobody problems? < 1294444645 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :say they have an empty list of components < 1294444656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's turned from basically an advanced, big cellular automaton with wider effects into running millions of programs per frame :D < 1294444666 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's just optimized away unless you start madly programming blocks. < 1294444681 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ok, so there are basically "predefined blocks", and "programmed blocks"? < 1294444685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where the former are optimisations of the latter < 1294444715 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. conceptual purity in an impure way. < 1294444728 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because true purity is a bit out of reach < 1294444732 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also < 1294444737 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: how many predefined blocks, 256, 16 thousand, or way more? < 1294444739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ever, hypothetically < 1294444745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :block types that is < 1294444781 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :blocks stop executing far enough from the player, probably. the pure reason being then you need to keep your player block near < 1294444812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but how many predefined block types will there be :P < 1294444812 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: combinations of as many features as i can come up with, and can make work together < 1294444821 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can just read the code of the blocks to see what they do < 1294444824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: as in, an actual number < 1294444826 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for _predefined_ blocks < 1294444831 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. optimised ones < 1294444845 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well astronomically many, because it's features that are optimized, not individual blocks < 1294444857 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so a block is a set of features? < 1294444864 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly. < 1294444876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: mostly? :D < 1294444880 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your game is SO IMPURE < 1294444889 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically it's a list of components that perform a physical action, and a program that executes them. < 1294444904 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's all < 1294444911 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so the former are like...limbs? < 1294444943 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can think of them that way, but components can teleport, change the block's shape, move it, copy it, change programs of other blocks, glue to other blocks, etc < 1294444968 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so what _is_ a component < 1294444971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in its actual definition < 1294444981 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: also, so, there are no hardcoded programs? < 1294444983 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's also a kind of discrete version of euclidean physics in play, for when you build make huge structures, but dunno if i'll actually implement that < 1294444985 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if blocks aren't hardcoded, just features < 1294445020 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294445022 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i believe so < 1294445028 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the programs shouldn't be very complicated < 1294445032 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in natural blocks < 1294445038 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so updating the world is running millions of programs, still. < 1294445044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not going to be fast. < 1294445057 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really, many of them will be event-based, and can just be unloaded < 1294445086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D so it's actually a table of programs? < 1294445107 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the programs are executed very slowly. and why do you say that? just a programming language that allows events. < 1294445149 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294445158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so updating the world does not actually run the block programs? < 1294445162 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so anyway basically if you find a block that can execute a lot of code, you might still need a block that computes a specific type of function or your bot will take ages doing that in software < 1294445167 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance pathfinding is like this < 1294445189 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it does on paper, but the world is designed so that it can usually be optimized awayt. < 1294445190 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294445191 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*away < 1294445224 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D your game is not very conceptually pure, i have no idea what the block structure definition would look like at all < 1294445290 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is. a block has a piece of code that it executes at that blocks execution speed, and can call functions specific to that block. < 1294445293 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, what do you actually *study*? < 1294445295 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's all the game is < 1294445302 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :math, corrently, rather cs type < 1294445326 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doing my master's thesis in picture languages, currently doing automata on pics < 1294445331 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*currently < 1294445360 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :currently as in forever from now on, but i was doing cs a year ago, and officially changed only after i finished my bachelor's which was a few months ago < 1294445369 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :again, oklo month which is anywhere between a day and a year < 1294445374 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Picture languages? < 1294445376 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :november i think < 1294445380 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah matrices over finite alphabet < 1294445396 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: are you still in your second year :) < 1294445406 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without any operations, automata theory in 2d, basically < 1294445412 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, second year of math tho < 1294445417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: third? < 1294445428 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah third year of uni going < 1294445448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder how you and Sgeo can be in the same room without, like, exploding < 1294445451 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :matter, antimatter, that sorta shit < 1294445461 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you count the cs time, i'm only half a year ahead of the usual scheduly, degreewise < 1294445490 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It is not a bomb. It is a device that is (not) exploding. < 1294445494 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: what. < 1294445495 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: zzo38 < 1294445498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1294445513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes but you have a stupidly large awesome surplus < 1294445521 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol i'm not that good, my master's thesis is going to be complete bullshit for instance < 1294445546 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have an open problem that i decided to solve < 1294445550 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i haven't been able to < 1294445561 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even though anyone could do it < 1294445624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: does your game have gravity < 1294445635 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, kind of < 1294445664 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294445668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: lame < 1294445671 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who likes restricted movement < 1294445672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOT ME < 1294445675 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gravity exists, but you can hover quite far < 1294445677 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: unless you mean like < 1294445683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: air blocks have their program built to push you down < 1294445687 0 :cheater00!~cheater@g228060041.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294445687 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't want lack of gravity, because i like the idea of falling < 1294445689 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and you can just hack their program out if you want :D < 1294445693 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because that would be... amazing < 1294445807 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well see currently there is quite a complicated physics, but i'll probably leave those optional, because i can't imagine others enjoying them. < 1294445835 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: dude, my idea was amazing? leave the physics up to the blocks? < 1294445838 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because i seem to be the only man on earth who enjoys learning weird physicses < 1294445841 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hacking air to float? < 1294445847 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least people don't play my cool games :( < 1294445854 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i want to but you only provide exes on vjn ;o < 1294445855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gimme some .py < 1294445873 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294445891 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: erm yeah, physics are up to the blocks of course < 1294445902 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you don't need air to even be an actual block for that < 1294445906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but it should be < 1294445907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously < 1294445911 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, it should < 1294445917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: the great thing is < 1294445924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: have an air meter which goes down very quickly < 1294445932 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: then, air blocks just have code to give you air :D < 1294445940 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can make a vacuum, which will suffocate you < 1294445944 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but also let you float < 1294445954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if you want to breathe but float, you could hack some air blocks' source < 1294445962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: amazing yes? < 1294445980 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah at some point i was thinking about air physics, air pressure etc < 1294445999 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not suffocation tho, you have to keep eating to survive anyway < 1294446008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but then you could just chill in a vacuum < 1294446010 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which makes little sense :D < 1294446011 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but you just have a program for that ofc) < 1294446021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: also bonus: if stuff like falls on top of you, you suffocate < 1294446027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or if you jam your head into stone somehow < 1294446086 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :head? < 1294446093 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION → sleep < 1294446095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well as in you < 1294446098 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294446100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the head is metaphorical < 1294446104 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294446147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but you could turn yourself into a robot if you wanted right? < 1294446150 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :artificial head etc. just have you as a brain < 1294446167 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can glue blocks to yourself if you get the glueing component < 1294446176 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you inherit components from the blocks you own < 1294446201 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can make yourself into a robot, yes, that's basically what the game is about < 1294446207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: can i make a perpetual motion machine < 1294446243 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you have your in-game coding window, which is maybe not your primary, but a very important part of your movement. < 1294446284 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there's a high-level clue-based stack language......................... < 1294446292 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i shouldn't have mentioned that < 1294446303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: when can i buy it < 1294446305 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294446328 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: tomorrow? < 1294446335 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll try to finish my thesis in february, then start allocating coding time < 1294446349 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a tiny little coding spark atm, actually < 1294446353 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294446362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i kinda wanna code it somehow except i'd be terrible :D < 1294446416 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go ahead, a proof of concept shouldn't be hard to make < 1294446448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no it sounds _really_ hard < 1294446453 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294446472 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: even doing it in haskell sounds like drudgery :D < 1294446477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you should write the whole thing in Clue++ < 1294446553 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically you have a stack language, but there are events, and a command for "use the components X to achieve Y", which should work for simple things like pathfinding very well, and hopefully could manage some slow stupid way for more complicated things < 1294446575 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the language is very high-level, like you can just directly refer to things you see on map < 1294446579 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294446584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: why stack though < 1294446591 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not all that high-level, that clue command is much more high-level :D < 1294446613 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: also you should make the code have no text form, clicking blocks to actually put a little line from them to a little point in the code sounds hilariously funsilly < 1294446615 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah dunno about stack, for some reason it feels natural for that kind of things < 1294446632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, maybe make a block highlight be, like, a picture of a block and its moore neighbours dimmed < 1294446635 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, it should be very untexty < 1294446649 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can like hover over it with your mouse and it shows you that part of the map with a red border around the block < 1294446696 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that's pretty much what i'm going for < 1294446751 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but anyway i'll probably publish the physics before starting to code it < 1294446756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well then allow me to state the obvious < 1294446763 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least completely specify them < 1294446763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: have there be another map, filled with functions < 1294446772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you don't ever use words, you just include parts of the code-map < 1294446774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294446780 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294446786 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can draw a little like 16x16 icon for each block in the code-map < 1294446789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you could fit a few letters on < 1294446794 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or a representative picture demonstrating its operation < 1294446800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then code is just a sequence of pictures < 1294446804 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, i wish i didn't find that such a great idea. < 1294446819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's great because it'd show you the dimmed neighbours of that function in the actual code... like you know ... < 1294446823 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah i was kinda thinking that, something like an inventory of code blocks < 1294446825 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: if you liked this function, why not try these similar functions... < 1294446867 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xd < 1294446871 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294446922 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: okay but seriously, it would be cool < 1294446926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: in fact... < 1294446933 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but anyway, mainly i'm interested in enemies. < 1294446935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: those function-squares? < 1294446939 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: should be doors leading into function rooms < 1294446947 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1294446950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: that's right: individual pieces of code are themselves a map < 1294446954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after all, they're just a bunch of blocks < 1294446961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop laughing, i am a revolutionary < 1294446991 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alrighty < 1294447001 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so that's how you're doing it, yes? < 1294447037 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway the thing is i want the game to be fucking scary, you never know if the next block you mine out is a tree that grows 5 blocks at a time for 10 seconds, then explodes < 1294447065 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to use bots to mine, and try to find ways to do that safely < 1294447073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: question, is it realtime or turnbased < 1294447127 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :realtime, a couple moves a second, where a move could be moving to your neighbor cell. (it will actually look rather smooth tho, because you have to look at it all the time.) < 1294447157 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like when you start, it's that, of course later on your player block can basically just teleport whereever it wants < 1294447250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but time is like... boring? < 1294447254 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so linear < 1294447302 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's on the commutative free group with two generators, the second most done to death thing in the mathematical world < 1294447321 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Z^2 < 1294447332 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :time i do not mind, however. < 1294447336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but time is lame. < 1294447353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: at least make each second take an amount of time determined by a complex formula < 1294447401 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294447403 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294447417 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :time slows down further away from sentient blocks < 1294447461 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and comes to a stop, eventually (i would make it never come to a stop due to purity, but that's not very practical) < 1294447541 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ilua < 1294447551 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: just make it so that some kind of circuit fails if time is going too slowly < 1294447556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it turns out, everything is made out of this circuit! < 1294447585 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it does < 1294447589 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :definitely < 1294447600 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: then your problem is solved PURELY < 1294447618 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294447628 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry i misread you < 1294447632 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" oklopol: just make it so that some kind of circuit fails if time is going too slowly" < 1294447637 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somehow i managed to read something like < 1294447653 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"doesn't it make certain kinds of circuits fail if time slows down at a certain boundary" < 1294447668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D < 1294447697 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because this is a very bad thing if you want to have say a computer: it doesn't just stop when you move away, it might completely break due to time slowing in an unfortunate way in one part of the machine < 1294447726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: just make the story be that everything is made out of this material or whatever < 1294447739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and that its interactions break down when time gets too slow, such that it just sort of warbles on the spot < 1294447745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and then starts running again if time is faster < 1294447752 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, 1) these distances are very big, 2) this is a completely documented (or at least consistent) physics thing, so you just have to deal with it. < 1294447757 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you should be able to < 1294447763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then, you can simulate infinite time-slowdown, with a discrete universe < 1294447774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just by ignoring all blocks beyond a certain point < 1294447779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and this is deemed OK by the pure physics < 1294447781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I AM GENIUS < 1294447838 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, anything can be called pure, and somehow implemented in-game, conceptually. although i'm sure this is a rather kill-joy thing to say < 1294447875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: specify the pure semantics based on the semantics of finite-state machines, x86, Unix, and C < 1294447878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: SO PURE YET SO PRACTICAL < 1294447889 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, cool craftbook has "ICs" that shoot arrows. I'm building a battery of them now < 1294447897 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294447932 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also pvp should be more fun when you can program thousands of blocks to fight each other < 1294447949 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, too many arrow cause lag < 1294447953 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :network lag < 1294447959 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even when they are on ground < 1294447962 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this makes no sense < 1294447966 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we're talking about my nonexistant game, no lag in that one. < 1294447972 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, ah < 1294447984 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, I was talking about craftbook < 1294447993 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(as well) < 1294448008 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: your radiation stuff should mutate animals into monsters. just saying. < 1294448010 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ent < 1294448016 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whooplers < 1294448031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: way ahead of you :D < 1294448041 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i didn't see you mentioning that... < 1294448048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my head calculates quickly < 1294448058 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i was thinking they'd turn into rotting, crazy animals that die easily but are vicious < 1294448069 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: or maybe sometimes they are really hard to kill thanks to radiative superpowers < 1294448077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i just couldn't perfect it enough to be worth saying yet :D < 1294448110 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all of that feels so small-scale now that i have my game in my head again. < 1294448116 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mmmm < 1294448117 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my game < 1294448220 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :another thing i'd like to make is this game where you have an arbitrary monoid, and you can walk on it, dunno what the game is really, or if there is one, i have this marvelous way to project it in 3d < 1294448242 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it can't fit in an irc message < 1294448274 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :. < 1294448297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so do you play MC :D < 1294448327 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no he's too busy doing things < 1294448336 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294448351 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: if i giftcoded you it would you play it, it sounds like a hilarious event < 1294448373 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294448446 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1294448450 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is salsa night tonight < 1294448453 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with lots of hot women < 1294448504 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so which is hotter < 1294448507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you would ... reject my purchase??!?!?!?! ;( < 1294448507 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the women or the salsa < 1294448510 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: take that insult back < 1294448516 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you can't do that, that's stealing < 1294448548 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what's going onnn < 1294448557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm trying to convince oerjan that he should play minecraft < 1294448570 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you might find yourself unable to < 1294448588 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think he's sort of had this thing where he was "siding with me" in not playing minecraft < 1294448597 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(whereas i simply didn't care) < 1294448599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i...don't think so < 1294448604 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: are you aware of any alliance with cheater00 < 1294448613 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was like way back < 1294448617 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he probably forgot already < 1294448619 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: what's your relationship with cheater00? < 1294448627 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be useless as i would undoubtedly trigger my rsi < 1294448634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: well i kinda know you for making up bullshit theories to explain random things you see. usually related to yourself < 1294448638 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: rsi enhances the experience < 1294448644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: immensely < 1294448660 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's because i am god and everything i say immediately becomes reality... right? < 1294448668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: yes < 1294448676 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: play with the other hand!!!!!!!!!! < 1294448695 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha yeah the one YOU DON'T USE FOR MASTURBATION :dDDDDDDDDD < 1294448702 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i get it < 1294448704 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: none of my hands are entirely free of it < 1294448709 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also elliott, the functions of the mouse buttons, can you remap them to the keyboard somehow? < 1294448717 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you mostly only get rsi when you click the mouse < 1294448723 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you just move it around it's much better < 1294448730 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :surely. but not with minecraft itself < 1294448733 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD < 1294448737 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1294448741 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you get it too? < 1294448745 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the joke is < 1294448751 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294448752 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it's nice to have them on the mouse < 1294448753 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1294448757 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes. < 1294448762 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i'll pay you, regularly, to play minecraft < 1294448762 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: also it's not _really_ rsi because my feet hurt as well < 1294448771 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION ills < 1294448773 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: use the other foot < 1294448776 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD < 1294448777 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294448781 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it definitely gets worse when i play games < 1294448781 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxD < 1294448793 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : haha yeah the one YOU DON'T USE FOR MASTURBATION :dDDDDDDDDD < 1294448798 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::| < 1294448803 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that why you couldn't play mastur minecra minesweeper < 1294448809 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :minesweeper that one time < 1294448819 0 :zeotrope!~65X32@unaffiliated/zeotrope JOIN :#esoteric < 1294448822 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: but no really < 1294448828 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never mind masturbating with the feet.. < 1294448839 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might be a slipped disc? < 1294448840 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i remember i told my record < 1294448849 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: 23 times a day? < 1294448849 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and oerjan is like LOL goddammit oklo ur so nub < 1294448857 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: your masturbation record? < 1294448859 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can do it in like MINUTE < 1294448863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha! < 1294448864 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol :( < 1294448869 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan gets it down to, like, 20 seconds < 1294448869 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i go well do it and show vid < 1294448872 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and he starts < 1294448872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unfortunately it's given him rsi < 1294448874 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: xDDDD < 1294448878 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then says nah hands can't do it. < 1294448894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i see no reason _whatsoever_ to read your words with the correct interpretation < 1294448898 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true story, do you remember oerjan? < 1294448900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although i suspect you might have been encouraging that. sightly. < 1294448900 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294448902 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*slightly. < 1294448909 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the part i said, the others may have added stuff < 1294448931 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no < 1294448933 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't < 1294448939 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm angry at you people for doing that < 1294448947 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meanwhile in another channel < 1294448949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have damaged oerjan's stellar reputation < 1294448950 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and just for that i'm never letting you play my game < 1294448956 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : what router should i buy? < 1294448963 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : an old openbsd box! < 1294448971 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : use the other hand! < 1294448977 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : but that would be more expensive and generate more heat < 1294448988 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : haha ur mum generate heat < 1294448989 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : i just want something i can order and plug in ;( < 1294448995 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : www.dildos.com < 1294448998 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : haha like a sexual dol < 1294449000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: censoring usernames = lame < 1294449010 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : lol c gets it :D < 1294449013 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: also that quote wasn't...funny < 1294449024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1294449025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1294449025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1294449026 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1294449027 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't want you quazimodos bothering srs ppl < 1294449028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1294449039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: usernames != channel name < 1294449052 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can still /queery < 1294449063 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :139) ooh a test to see your procrastination hotspots ill do it later < 1294449064 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :126) Well yeah, but furthermore unlike, oh, say, an Apple product, you don't have to sign their "we own your sperm" license agreement to GET that SDK and the requisite libraries. ... pikhq: Sure, but it's the only way Apple could get a first-born-son clause into a modern licensing agreement without infringing < 1294449064 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :109) so a.b.c.d.e.f.g.h.i.j.k.com might be self-relative, but a.b.c.d.e.f.g.h.i.j.k.l.com always means a.b.c.d.e.f.g.h.i.j.k.l.com.? < 1294449064 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :6) His body should be given to science. He's alive :P Even so. < 1294449064 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :249) I love the way zzo38's comment was cut off after the f of brainfuck that's just the most hilarious place to cut it off in a discussion about censorshi < 1294449072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: who would bother doing that < 1294449093 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oklopol < 1294449097 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mee < 1294449100 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ < 1294449116 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol talking is a gift to anyone so stfu < 1294449132 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in german, gift means poison < 1294449134 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah just the other day i was talking about bukkake on this channel on programming < 1294449144 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was your gift for christmas??????????????????????? < 1294449145 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everyone was like OH GOD WHERES THE OPS ::DOS < 1294449153 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yeah < 1294449153 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't get any really < 1294449156 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i don't recall oh god wheres the ops :P < 1294449158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: "about programming" < 1294449158 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :presents < 1294449166 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you seriously need to die xD < 1294449191 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm surprisingly hard to kill < 1294449191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no oklopol is the best < 1294449208 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i got this 2tb drive actually < 1294449214 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess that was sorta a present from my mumma < 1294449216 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only 2tb? < 1294449225 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my cpu has more cache < 1294449229 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :afaik 2.5 is the largest drive you can actually buy :p < 1294449231 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, they didn't have smaller ones < 1294449235 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nwb < 1294449240 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i'll have to do with that < 1294449246 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are you gonna run on it < 1294449252 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :windows 3.11? < 1294449266 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not gonna put an os on it < 1294449285 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol has a computer with no operating system in it < 1294449306 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he turns it on, lets it fail booting, and then tries different keyboard inputs to see if anything happens like on a c64. < 1294449310 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294449365 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this computer has maybe dunno 200gb < 1294449388 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :200 gb donkey porn < 1294449404 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nowadays i usually stream everything < 1294449427 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all your donkey porn < 1294449439 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do not have donkey porn on my hd < 1294449452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah you stream it all < 1294449453 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can lead a donkey to the stream, but you can't make it drink < 1294449455 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol is the registrar ceo for www.donkeyporn < 1294449475 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294449480 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait what < 1294449481 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one of the lesser known toplevel domains < 1294449491 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah there you go < 1294449507 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems i foresaw the funny < 1294449528 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cinemraft! < 1294449531 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they had to allow it but chose to keep it under lids < 1294449589 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's banned in most muslim countries though. not because they're donkeys, but because some of them are male. < 1294449633 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol it links femanic there < 1294449680 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't find any dp tho < 1294449709 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rule 34 is pretty silly, clearly none of the people advertising it have actually researched the subject < 1294449737 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in other news, that is < 1294449740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no no it's far more subtle than you believe < 1294449752 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's essentially a platonist statement < 1294449761 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohh i get it < 1294449769 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: basically you can't consider 34 along, 35 is just as important < 1294449775 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: porn *exists*, but if porn *doesn't* exist, it will be made < 1294449817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: the point is: 34 is "For every thing, there _exists_ porn of it." but 35 is "For every thing, if the _extant_ porn of it is has not been _realised_ and distributed yet, then it is _guaranteed_ to be at some point in the future (given that civilisation continues)." < 1294449837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i.e., when porn of something is created for which no porn previously existed, it is actually just being _realised_; it already existed in the platonic realm of ideas. < 1294449855 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294449856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :therefore, rules 34 and 35 can and do coexist without contradiction; they are both completely true. < 1294449862 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a deep philosophical statement. < 1294449870 0 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-4db4edd6.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294449900 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi folks < 1294449904 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey < 1294449909 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we're talking about esolangs < 1294449914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha yes totally true < 1294449921 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294449929 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wanted to start explaining clue but ugh < 1294449933 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i came to listen < 1294449944 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone should rule34 Brainfuck < 1294449959 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thx anyway oklopol < 1294449989 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as long as you didn't come to conquer < 1294450016 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue is pretty awesome tho < 1294450038 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue clue clue < 1294450058 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nor to divide < 1294450077 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :division is quite accepted here < 1294450092 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 3%4 + 1/6 < 1294450093 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 11 % 12 < 1294450111 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heeey found it www.vjn.fi/oklopol/clue.rar < 1294450117 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least to anything but zero < 1294450121 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably doesn't work with current pythons :( < 1294450126 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 1/0 < 1294450127 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Infinity < 1294450131 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it? < 1294450144 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah we do wheels here < 1294450220 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1294450240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol just has no clue < 1294450254 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cluuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuue < 1294450268 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every time an error in the official clue imp is corrected, a new u is added < 1294450276 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the name is still clue because i'm very smart < 1294450301 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unlike others who have no clue < 1294450309 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually me and a uni friend designed a much nicer conditional system but i've been too lazy to implement it < 1294450317 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was like when clue was first implemented < 1294450321 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what was that like last week < 1294450327 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno < 1294450328 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"SKI compiles in about 20 seconds on my machine." < 1294450329 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294450332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"All this code is mine, don't touch it unless you really want to." < 1294450333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I really want to. < 1294450345 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294450348 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294450359 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so is oklotalk superseded by clue < 1294450364 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ilkka made an interp for random or what's it called < 1294450374 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should up that < 1294450378 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at some point < 1294450410 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's random < 1294450422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Random? :P < 1294450422 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a language on esolang, pretty retarded < 1294450432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so is oklotalk 2 clue++ < 1294450434 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think so < 1294450441 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1294450444 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe! < 1294450455 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so what's clue++ < 1294450459 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue where everything is an oklotalk object? :P < 1294450461 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :feed buridans mules < 1294450464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :def funthatreturnsntharg(i): < 1294450465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return lambda*args:args[i] < 1294450467 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294450468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like your naming convention < 1294450470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's hilarious < 1294450482 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically i'd like clue with something like object < 1294450495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: right, and then you'll code oklOS in it < 1294450503 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*s < 1294450518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: where you write programs by drawing a gui, drawing the result of using this gui, repeat a few times, and give it a few clues as to what operation the program performs < 1294450523 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it spits out a half-broken gui app object < 1294450527 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but most importantly, the concept of strategies. < 1294450527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AM I CORRECT < 1294450565 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294450567 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294450573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so erm is there a way to get clue to print out the function it infers < 1294450604 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe the compiler has a way, but the code is not very structured < 1294450616 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and of course even if it were, you wouldn't know by reading it) < 1294450622 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1294450627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# functions are applied (using applier and aritiers) randomly to objects, to get new objects < 1294450631 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually random? :D < 1294450653 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not in that implementation, i think < 1294450660 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :afaict it has no actual interface :) < 1294450679 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: hmm i think if you print out the function right before compiling it to a func it would work < 1294450689 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's not specified, so that could be sensible, probably it's just poetic. < 1294450691 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice article on that topic http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buridan%27s_ass < 1294450725 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course it doesn't have an interface, interfaces are for people who don't have faces exter. < 1294450743 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hope that is convincing enough < 1294450755 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294450756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ python cluetest.py < 1294450757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19.804610014 < 1294450757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3 < 1294450761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: this isn't... imprecise SKI is it? < 1294450768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no that's timing info :D < 1294450785 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there should be a rather clear separation of compilation and running < 1294450788 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"A discrete decision based upon an input having a continuous range of values cannot be made within a bounded length of time." < 1294450790 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...again conceptually < 1294450807 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ < 1294450824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think i'm gonna try and hack cluetofun to print stuff < 1294450843 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm hrm, i have this vague memory that i considered making a nice output form for funcs < 1294450844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C[B[IOP([1]:0)], B[IOP([2]:0)], B[IOP([3]:0)], B[IOP([[2, 1]]:0), IOP([[2, 3]]:0)], B[IOP([[[3, 2], 1]]:0), IOP([[[3, 4], 5]]:0)], B[IOP([[3, 2]]:0), IOP([[3, 4]]:0)], B[IOP([[1, 0]]:1), IOP([[[2, 1], 0]]:2), IOP([[[[3, 2], 1], 0]]:3), IOP([[[[[1, 2]]]]]:4), IOP([[[[[[1, 2], 3], 4], 5], 6]]:4)]] < 1294450848 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i never got to that... < 1294450849 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: does that look like post-inferred code? < 1294450854 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is that the pre-inferring < 1294450855 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294450860 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's... < 1294450862 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :inferring = working out actual function from the source < 1294450863 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pre < 1294450869 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those are just data < 1294450871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you sure < 1294450873 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are lists < 1294450875 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294450876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : for i in clue.branches: < 1294450876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if i.isbase(): < 1294450876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : compile_base(clue.bag,clue.helper_objs,i) < 1294450878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if i.isrec(): < 1294450880 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : compile_rec(clue.bag,clue.helper_objs,i) < 1294450882 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's after that < 1294450886 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1, 2, 3 are the ski functions < 1294450889 0 :Wamanuz5!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294450894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what should i print, clue.bag? < 1294450910 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no i don't think so... < 1294450920 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can i see the... wait what the fuck maybe i can just dl it < 1294450928 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott's writing Python? < 1294450938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, i'm hacking okopython < 1294450941 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's learning from gods < 1294450941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is a good language < 1294450941 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no rapes it < 1294450958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: why do you use classes, you should write all your python code with functions < 1294450960 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294450961 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: my code, elliott is just reading < 1294450972 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: www.vjn.fi/oklopol/python.txt < 1294450977 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how about that style? < 1294450989 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yeah that is quite acceptable, but you still use objects < 1294451038 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :opening the jar of beauty that is clue.py < 1294451060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :def nil(g): < 1294451060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return{'car':nil,'cdr':nil,'length':0}[g] < 1294451060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :def cons(x,y): < 1294451062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : def _(g):return{'car':x,'cdr':y,'length'1+y('length')}[g] < 1294451064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return _ < 1294451067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: is this not a more perfect way to implement lists than any other? < 1294451071 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*'length':1+ < 1294451083 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ofc ideally you'd do your own naturals too for the length < 1294451090 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should probably print code < 1294451093 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.code < 1294451133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: that just prints a lot of None :D so i guess compile_clue is the important func < 1294451151 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you have to umm argh i'll read better < 1294451155 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :def compile_clue(clue): < 1294451155 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : def fun(*args): < 1294451155 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return call_clue(clue,args,10) < 1294451157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : funn=stuff.unvararg(fun,clue.arity) < 1294451159 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : clue.setcode(funn) < 1294451161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return funn < 1294451163 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or not < 1294451173 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294451187 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that funn should be the program i think < 1294451214 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm... < 1294451218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yess, but you see it's a python function < 1294451220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so not really printable:) < 1294451229 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so compile all < 1294451236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :def call_clue(clue,args,depth_lim): < 1294451236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if depth_lim==0: < 1294451236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return ["nothing here"] < 1294451238 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : value=clue.condcode(*args) < 1294451240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294451242 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so condcode has something to do with it < 1294451244 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except maybe not < 1294451244 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compiles all functions in a piece of clue code, and returns a hashtable with these program < 1294451246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue.branches < 1294451248 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s < 1294451248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's definitely clue.branches < 1294451253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : for i in clue.branches: < 1294451253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if i.istest():continue < 1294451254 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if i.value==value: < 1294451256 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return call_branch(clue,i,args,depth_lim) < 1294451257 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1294451258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if i.value==None: < 1294451260 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : default=i < 1294451261 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a python function yeah < 1294451262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: clue.branches is the real code, then? < 1294451264 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yessss < 1294451269 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think so yeah < 1294451272 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but then branch.code is a python function :D < 1294451275 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed i compile to python code < 1294451278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so what's the precompiled version < 1294451280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of branch.code < 1294451283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there an internal representation < 1294451291 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm fuck < 1294451299 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :printing branches gives < 1294451300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[B[IOP([1]:0)], B[IOP([2]:0)], B[IOP([3]:0)], B[IOP([[2, 1]]:0), IOP([[2, 3]]:0)], B[IOP([[[3, 2], 1]]:0), IOP([[[3, 4], 5]]:0)], B[IOP([[3, 2]]:0), IOP([[3, 4]]:0)], B[IOP([[1, 0]]:1), IOP([[[2, 1], 0]]:2), IOP([[[[3, 2], 1], 0]]:3), IOP([[[[[1, 2]]]]]:4), IOP([[[[[[1, 2], 3], 4], 5], 6]]:4)]] < 1294451306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is pretty much what print clue gave :D < 1294451320 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's get_ast? < 1294451326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have no fucking clue < 1294451331 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294451336 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think that does roughly what you want < 1294451341 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually prints code < 1294451342 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try it < 1294451369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh seemingly < 1294451398 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like just get_ast(funcs["ski apply"]) say < 1294451404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rite < 1294451406 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but wait < 1294451407 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my python is too new, would have to correct a lotta stuff < 1294451409 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :funcs,asts=clue.compile_all(open(cluefile).read(),stuff.funcs) < 1294451419 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: asts suggests that compile_all might actually already return the asts? < 1294451422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :('ski apply', "Condition: ski type?('#0')\nBase branch (0)\n'#0'\nRec branch (1)\nSubast(0,0):['car', ['cdr', '#0']]\nMain ast: '#1'\nRec branch (2)\nSubast(0,0):['cadar', '#0']\nMain ast: '#1'\nRec branch (3)\nSubast(0,0):['pair', ['cadaar', '#0'], ['car', ['cdr', '#0']]]\nSubast(1,0):['pair', ['cadar', '#0'], ['car', ['cdr', '#0']]]\nSubast(2,0):['pair', '#1', '#2']\nMain ast: '#3'\nRec branch (4)\nSubast(0,0):['car', '#0']\nSubast( < 1294451422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1,0):['pair', '#1', ['car', ['cdr', '#0']]]\nMain ast: '#2'\n") < 1294451423 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1294451423 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that just compiles the clues in the code < 1294451424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294451427 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes < 1294451428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's in cluetest < 1294451430 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah i guess < 1294451430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: asts contains the asts < 1294451432 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol :D < 1294451434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so you already had all this code :D < 1294451435 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed! < 1294451443 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, always one step ahead of oklopol < 1294451453 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just skipped it, "don't need the ast... now how to convert funcs to ast" < 1294451477 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway dunno if i print that nicely anywhere < 1294451485 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i might just have been satisfied with that < 1294451487 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294451495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for k,v in asts.iteritems(): < 1294451495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : print '----', k < 1294451495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : print v < 1294451497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does fairly well < 1294451503 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shommmme < 1294451508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still not really readable though < 1294451509 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what < 1294451512 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :show < 1294451514 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294451514 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1294451595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: http://sprunge.us/cERU < 1294451602 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: whether you consider this readable or not is down to personal taste. < 1294451615 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i would, personally, prefer it outputted in a format "like" clue source, except without all the actual clue-y parts, but :) < 1294451630 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, obviously you need to know how clue works internally < 1294451633 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm is id(x) always true or something < 1294451638 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- more than 3 < 1294451638 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Condition: id('#0') < 1294451648 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it's just the identity function... conditions work kind of weirdly < 1294451650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would seem to me like (x) is only valid if x is true < 1294451654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D < 1294451660 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well see < 1294451665 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not actually a condition, it's a branch < 1294451688 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but of course. that's why you've called it a condition < 1294451712 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have an expression, and a function on it, then, certain values of that function correspond to certain codes being executed < 1294451718 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there's always a default branch < 1294451727 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes :D < 1294451760 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"deep first with cutoff" < 1294451771 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like that < 1294451796 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294451811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: clue is kind of pretty really, you started off with the most obviously readable and beautiful way to write a program possible (just show what it should do and let the computer figure it out), and have managed to make it completely incomprehensible and difficult < 1294451811 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after Base branch, it shows (x) in parens, that's the value of the condition leading to that branch < 1294451816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's skilful < 1294451817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294451840 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so basically, it does a switch statement (ala C) on the result of the condition? < 1294451847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i assume you know what switch is >_> < 1294451863 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes, that's the whole point, make a beautiful concept really technical and complicated, while technically keeping the basic idea < 1294451870 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes! :D < 1294451906 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but anyway that is a stupid system, and there's a better one coming, it's just so you have *some* way of doing stuff < 1294451914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294451919 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's really annoying when you have say multiple recursive branches < 1294451947 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i really really have to meet you sometime, i get this feeling you're some kinda being of pure energy < 1294451961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who has three modes, programming, mathing, and normal < 1294451970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the latter seems a bit boring though < 1294451975 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm a pretty normal dude < 1294451989 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: while programming? < 1294451990 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you wouldn't notice me on the street < 1294451997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: that's why i said, three modes < 1294452001 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tru, tru < 1294452004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one normal, the other two oklopol < 1294452049 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait wtf are subasts... < 1294452056 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should ask ilkka how all this works < 1294452060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who is ilkka :D < 1294452063 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's probably the only one who gets it < 1294452067 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a uni friend < 1294452071 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no no no shut up i want to get this < 1294452075 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294452077 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :me too < 1294452078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want to master the clue < 1294452085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you say , isn't <> for quoting multi word names < 1294452095 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294452104 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's for stdlib < 1294452112 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe < 1294452114 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294452119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D < 1294452120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: why < 1294452133 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...i don't knwo < 1294452135 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*know < 1294452222 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- make singleton < 1294452225 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Condition: id('#0') < 1294452225 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (None) < 1294452225 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :['cons', '#1', '#0'] < 1294452225 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf is this < 1294452227 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294452240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294452246 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make singleton conses two arguments together? maybe i don't know what #0 and #1 are... < 1294452285 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294452289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: make singleturn turns x into [x] < 1294452291 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, lol :D < 1294452302 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make singleton ~ {. 1 -> [1] < 1294452302 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . [1, 2, 3] -> [[1, 2, 3]]} < 1294452302 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make singleton ~ ; cons; #[] < 1294452328 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"#[]" < 1294452329 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294452332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1294452336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh is that an implicit param < 1294452339 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the idea is it gives the empty list as an arg < 1294452342 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294452342 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when it's actually used < 1294452344 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater < 1294452347 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294452354 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's how you do constants < 1294452370 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should figure the constants out ITSELF < 1294452378 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nonono < 1294452381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can i just omit the hints entirely < 1294452382 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in this < 1294452384 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and have it still work < 1294452394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :will it just try everything < 1294452398 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no! that's not what clue is about < 1294452404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want a brute force :D < 1294452405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : "_":(lambda a:0), < 1294452407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dude < 1294452411 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are such a fucking cheat < 1294452414 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue is about doing the drudge work BUT MAKING IT LOOK LIKE YOU'RE JUST GIVING THE RESULT < 1294452429 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why it's so fucking awesome < 1294452444 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you stole "drudge work from me"...bitch < 1294452450 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*drudge work" from me...bitch < 1294452451 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i mean it's actually pretty nice to read, for simple functions < 1294452461 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so mm yeah it's kinda sex < 1294452482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#for i in asts: < 1294452482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# print i < 1294452482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# print asts[i] < 1294452484 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# print < 1294452485 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did, i take things people say and use them. that's what i do. < 1294452486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :found at the bottom of cluetest.py < 1294452501 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294452504 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :. < 1294452525 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :import clue < 1294452525 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue=reload(clue) < 1294452525 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :import stuff < 1294452527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stuff=reload(stuff) < 1294452529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294452531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so elegant < 1294452542 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeeeah i'm not really into solving trivial problems in sensible ways :D < 1294452547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TypeError: 'NoneType' object is not iterable < 1294452552 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that means my code is insufficiently helpful, right? < 1294452554 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clueful even < 1294452563 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm hrm, i... dunno, what did your code say? :D < 1294452581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :succ ~ {. 0 -> 1 < 1294452581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 1 -> 2} < 1294452581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :succ ~ inc < 1294452585 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :adding ; #1gives: < 1294452589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : File "/Users/ehird/clue/clue.py", line 574, in separate_cond < 1294452589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if l[i][0]=="<" and l[i][-1]==">": < 1294452591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TypeError: 'int' object is unsubscriptable < 1294452593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*; #1 gives: < 1294452615 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try adding < 1294452639 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what. < 1294452645 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the bag < 1294452645 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait itshould be < 1294452646 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right? < 1294452647 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not inc < 1294452652 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh that too maybe < 1294452656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : File "/Users/ehird/clue/clue.py", line 640, in compile_all < 1294452656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : raise DepthLimitException("depth limit exceeded ("+i+")") < 1294452656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue.DepthLimitException: depth limit exceeded (succ) < 1294452659 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol ok i'll try too < 1294452663 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe, yeah < 1294452668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : File "/Users/ehird/clue/clue.py", line 648, in compile_all < 1294452668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : [i+"("+unfounds[i]+")" for i in compilees if not compilees[i].iscompiled]) < 1294452668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TypeError: exceptions must be classes or instances, not str < 1294452671 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ...:D < 1294452679 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you fail at triggering errors < 1294452680 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294452694 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeeeeeah i use strings as errors, it used to be possible < 1294452700 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just frowned upon < 1294452705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i too remember those days < 1294452712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: frowned upon -- you stole that from me from notch < 1294452714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hate your guts < 1294452732 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you came up with that, i see < 1294452743 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, gah, can't you get anything to compile? < 1294452763 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it shouldn't be *that* hard :( and i'm not saying ur stup i'm saying clue is < 1294452767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: almost almost almost i can do this < 1294452785 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exception: Can't compile succ() < 1294452786 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um okay < 1294452787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not < 1294452796 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, < 1294452823 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same code? < 1294452837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294452855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :succ ~ {. 1 -> 2 < 1294452855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 2 -> 3 < 1294452855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 3 -> 4} < 1294452856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :succ ~ ; < 1294452858 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :added one testcase, didn't help < 1294452872 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and compiling crashes huh < 1294452874 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: wait, what is this :. stuff < 1294452881 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294452882 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that only for recursive shit < 1294452883 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :recursion < 1294452885 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ignore for now < 1294452888 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294452890 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eeeerm < 1294452894 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so okay < 1294452896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 3 ~ {. 0 -> 0 } < 1294452896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 3 ~ {. 1 -> 0 } < 1294452896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 3 ~ {. 2 -> 0 } < 1294452897 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 3 ~ {. 3 -> 0 } < 1294452899 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stuff in a {} < 1294452899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 3 ~ {. 4 -> 1 < 1294452901 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 5 -> 1 } < 1294452903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 3 ~ ; #0; #1 < 1294452905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait what < 1294452905 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should have the same value of condition func < 1294452907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should add < 1294452909 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :another {} < 1294452911 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :around my other testcases? < 1294452913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in have each be separate < 1294452915 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: right < 1294452927 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : and can't make all those 3 numbers into the same thing! < 1294452946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :succ ~ {. 1 -> 2} < 1294452946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :succ ~ {. 2 -> 3} < 1294452946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :succ ~ ; < 1294452949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same can't compile error < 1294452955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exception: Can't compile succ() < 1294452956 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grrrr < 1294452971 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm maybe i have old python as well < 1294452979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have 2.6 < 1294452984 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i have 3 versions < 1294453065 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is waiting for ski to compile < 1294453074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski compiles fine here at least < 1294453099 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: im gonna try a less ambitious function < 1294453100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"is zero < 1294453101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" < 1294453122 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :took only a minute to compile that < 1294453135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- succ < 1294453135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Condition: id('#0') < 1294453136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (0) < 1294453137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'#1' < 1294453139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (None) < 1294453141 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'#0' < 1294453143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bitches < 1294453145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :succ ~ {. 0 -> 1} < 1294453147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :succ ~ {. 1 -> 0 < 1294453149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 2 -> 0} < 1294453151 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :succ ~ ; #0; #1 < 1294453153 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note: function is actually is zero < 1294453155 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not succ < 1294453156 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's wrong tho, isn't it :D < 1294453157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: wait < 1294453162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you sure? < 1294453165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think None matches anything < 1294453168 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294453180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: can i make the condition a constant? < 1294453182 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but isn't applied is it < 1294453184 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294453187 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry < 1294453188 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, that's is zero < 1294453188 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294453188 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not succ < 1294453189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as i said < 1294453190 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294453194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: can i make the condition a constant < 1294453194 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah yeah < 1294453199 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that... should work, yes! < 1294453199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how < 1294453227 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm erm < 1294453238 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294453239 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_ is a constant < 1294453241 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 < 1294453243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah indeed < 1294453244 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294453246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so <_> then < 1294453247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the best smiley < 1294453249 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then # gives you constants < 1294453251 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but.... < 1294453257 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294453263 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :will it actually use them for condition though < 1294453264 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294453268 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or will it try and condition on inc or something stupid like that < 1294453310 0 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-4db40ce2.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294453322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : File "/Users/ehird/clue/clue.py", line 419, in parse_number < 1294453322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return int(code[:i]),code[i:] < 1294453322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ValueError: invalid literal for int() with base 10: '11-' < 1294453323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ... < 1294453329 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :code: < 1294453330 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s zero? ~ {. 0 -> 1 } < 1294453330 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is zero? ~ {. 1 -> 0 < 1294453331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 2 -> 0 } < 1294453333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is zero? ~ ; #0; #1 < 1294453335 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :succ ~ {. 0 -> 1 < 1294453337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 -> 2 < 1294453339 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 3 -> 4 } < 1294453341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :succ ~ <_>; < 1294453343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note distinct lack of "11-" < 1294453354 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294453366 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i... wish i knew what to say < 1294453391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :def parse_number(code): < 1294453391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : i=0 < 1294453392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : while i22->3' < 1294453416 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'11->22->3' < 1294453418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'11->22->3' < 1294453420 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's code at each iteration < 1294453422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have only one question < 1294453424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what. < 1294453426 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is code growing, it's not even touching code < 1294453428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in < 1294453432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the loop body is literally += 1 < 1294453437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh because a different call < 1294453438 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294453440 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what i'm saying is < 1294453441 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm laughing my ass off here < 1294453444 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohh < 1294453447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forgot the . before the next condition < 1294453450 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you notice that? < 1294453454 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no you didn't, because your syntax sucks < 1294453460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or did you notice that and are mocking me < 1294453472 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exception: Can't compile succ() < 1294453474 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahaha fuck me < 1294453482 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294453494 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do the order of hints matter? < 1294453494 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll start playing too < 1294453498 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this looks like fun < 1294453507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think constants have to go last < 1294453508 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, last is default. < 1294453508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for some reason :D < 1294453512 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope! < 1294453512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: default condition? < 1294453515 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294453525 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exception: Can't compile succ(<_>) < 1294453527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHY NOT < 1294453557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: this is the worst language i have ever used ... was gonna say "game i have ever played", my mind can't really view this as a rational activity < 1294453577 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :def is_function(a): < 1294453577 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : try: < 1294453577 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : a() < 1294453578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : except Exception,e: < 1294453580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if str(e)[-12:]=="not callable": < 1294453582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return False < 1294453584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return True < 1294453586 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ... < 1294453588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what on earth made you write that < 1294453603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: did you not consider any of the other 439857349857345 simpler and faster solutions :D < 1294453603 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294453616 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294453630 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i didn't want to open a browser < 1294453666 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my first program compiled just fine, but lemme try succ < 1294453734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :poop ~ {. 0 -> 0 < 1294453734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 1 -> 0 < 1294453734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 2 -> 0 } < 1294453736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :poop ~ <_> < 1294453739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: things your shitty language cannot handle: this function < 1294453741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I need ; #0 < 1294453755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT WORKED WOOWOWOWOWO < 1294453760 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK < 1294453769 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see <> means "this is the condition" < 1294453780 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so nothing worked when it was used multiple times < 1294453780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ...:DDD < 1294453783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: not "stdlib"? :D < 1294453789 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fucking hell < 1294453793 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hhaahahahaahaha < 1294453793 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO < 1294453796 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your language is the worst < 1294453804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought it was pretty stupid mind :D < 1294453811 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1294453817 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's wrong with that < 1294453823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: nothing < 1294453827 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i meant it being used as stdlib < 1294453831 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounded... really dumb < 1294453838 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed :D < 1294453846 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- succ < 1294453846 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Condition: _('#0') < 1294453846 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (None) < 1294453848 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :['inc', '#0'] < 1294453850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PRAISE THE LORD < 1294453851 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just threw it in the air more like, then started considering it word of god < 1294453876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmhmm do you have negation in this language perchance < 1294453881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or should i just pretend negative numbers don't exist < 1294453897 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :succ ~ {. 0 -> 1 . 1 -> 2 } succ ~ ; inc < 1294453905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, yeah < 1294453911 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you can just sub from zero i suppose < 1294453912 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :succ ~ {. 0 -> 1 < 1294453912 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 1 -> 2 < 1294453912 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 2 -> 3 } < 1294453914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :succ ~ inc; <_> < 1294453916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ^ less stupid ver :P < 1294453941 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that's UR opnn < 1294453953 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: now i just have to figure out how to do "is negative?" < 1294453960 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294453982 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see less than 3 function < 1294453988 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :~<>? < 1294453990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does this thing have comments < 1294453998 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for a proof of nonexistance of comparison operator < 1294454004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: which less than three function < 1294454007 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i see more than three < 1294454008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no less than three :D < 1294454015 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm yeah that < 1294454028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so are there comments < 1294454031 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What language is tis? < 1294454032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean in clue code < 1294454034 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: clue < 1294454034 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this < 1294454037 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294454045 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't need comments! < 1294454049 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the code comments itself! < 1294454050 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eso or noneso, it looks noneso < 1294454052 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lemmesee... < 1294454053 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294454061 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i doubt it < 1294454078 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :write a comment and give it a bag... < 1294454083 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: eso. < 1294454083 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, linky to info? Is this a new language youre making now? < 1294454087 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THIS IS AN COMMENT HERE RIGHT HERE ~ < 1294454087 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1294454092 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: comments to erase my undone code :D < 1294454097 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohhhh < 1294454099 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: it's pretty old actually < 1294454101 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah sorry, nothing for that. < 1294454107 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was wondering why you'd need them < 1294454108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: maybe i'll hack in a _stop peeking here_ < 1294454128 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just strip lines that start with # < 1294454133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: boring < 1294454135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also more work to comment < 1294454142 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: basically you show a few examples of inputs and outputs in the function, give a basic list of operations to hint the impl what it needs to do, and it figures out the rest < 1294454146 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also nymfokitiara says hi < 1294454148 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :works surprisingly well with sufficiently disciplined use < 1294454149 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, old as in, "we're not making it right now" < 1294454149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: who is that < 1294454157 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a human < 1294454161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: pretty cool < 1294454163 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: is it a uni guy < 1294454169 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i told we were playing with my clues < 1294454170 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294454173 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that sounds awesome < 1294454176 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sgeo *g < 1294454180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: oh yeah totally is < 1294454180 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know uni guys that irc < 1294454182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm a fan < 1294454193 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"A Clue program is a string consisting only of 0s and 1s. " < 1294454199 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then what are you talking about? < 1294454200 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er no. < 1294454201 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's another clue. < 1294454204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol doesn't use the wiki. < 1294454216 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a language there < 1294454222 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :made for the purpose of having a language there < 1294454233 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: example clue code < 1294454234 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION lols < 1294454235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make singleton ~ {. 1 -> [1] < 1294454235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . [1, 2, 3] -> [[1, 2, 3]]} < 1294454235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make singleton ~ ; cons; #[] < 1294454237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pair ~ {. 1, 2 -> [1, 2] < 1294454239 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . [3], [4, 5] -> [[3], [4, 5]]} < 1294454241 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pair ~ ; make singleton; cons < 1294454243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: pretty obvious to see how that works < 1294454246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the ; stuff is hints < 1294454255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the {. ...} are example inputs -> outputs < 1294454261 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, once you start using recursion, things get slightly more hairy. < 1294454268 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: only slightly! < 1294454274 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it is pretty obviously the best language? < 1294454294 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that is obvious ofc < 1294454305 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: example of recursion, very obvious code here: < 1294454305 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it implemented? < 1294454306 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1294454307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski apply ~ {. 3 -> 3 < 1294454307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . [2, 2] -> [2, 2] } < 1294454307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski apply ~ {:. [1, [1, 2]] -> 2 < 1294454309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [1, 2] -> 2 } < 1294454309 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294454311 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski apply ~ {:. [[2, [1, 3]], 2] -> 3 < 1294454313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [1, 3] -> 3 } < 1294454315 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski apply ~ {:. [[[3, [2, 2]], [2, 1]], 5] -> [2, 1] < 1294454317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [[2, 2], 5] -> 2 < 1294454319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [[2, 1], 5] -> 1 < 1294454321 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [2, 1] -> [2, 1] < 1294454323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : :. [[[3, 1], 1], 1] -> 1 < 1294454325 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [1, 1] -> 1 < 1294454327 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [1, 1] -> 1 < 1294454329 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [1, 1] -> 1 } < 1294454331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski apply ~ {:. [[[[1, 2], 1], 2], 1] -> 1 < 1294454333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [[[1, 2], 1], 2] -> 1 < 1294454335 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [1, 1] -> 1 < 1294454337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : :. [[[[[3, 2], 3], 2], 3], 1] -> 3 < 1294454338 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm too tired and stressed to think about all that < 1294454339 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [[[[3, 2], 3], 2], 3] -> [2, 3] < 1294454341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [[2, 3], 1] -> 3 } < 1294454343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski apply ~ < 1294454345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski apply ~ pair; car; cdr; cadaar; cadar < 1294454347 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yes, it is implemented < 1294454347 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue <3 < 1294454351 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously figuring out that ski apply just takes like a second < 1294454353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the examples illuminate it all < 1294454355 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the hints only make it obvious < 1294454376 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, if you could write all that as actual ski code, it might make *even more* sense, if possible < 1294454384 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is too tired to try to understand anything < 1294454389 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and stressed < 1294454389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: < 1294454396 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ python cluetest.py < 1294454397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-1] wtf < 1294454397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Traceback (most recent call last): < 1294454398 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294454400 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TypeError: 'NoneType' object is not iterable < 1294454404 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :es I did just say that < 1294454404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i don't think it likes negatives < 1294454418 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'm going to explode in a Trogdor < 1294454435 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wa recently linked to H*R somehwere, btpobably TVTropes < 1294454448 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can add new commands if you like < 1294454458 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just added what i absolutely needed for ski, and a few other completely random ones < 1294454461 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are the Clue primitives? < 1294454466 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comparison would be very nice < 1294454473 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: there are very few, but you can do stuff with lists and numbers < 1294454475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :funcs={"cons":cons, < 1294454475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : "car":car, < 1294454475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : "cdr":cdr, < 1294454477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : "id":identity, < 1294454479 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : "dec":decrement, < 1294454481 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : "inc":increment, < 1294454483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : "add":add, < 1294454485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : "empty":empty, < 1294454487 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : "is list?":islist, < 1294454489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : "_":(lambda a:0), < 1294454491 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : "compare":compare} < 1294454493 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: < 1294454495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :remember how you said < 1294454497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nonexistence of a compare function < 1294454499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well uh < 1294454501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294454503 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :def compare(a,b): < 1294454505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if a==b:return 0 < 1294454507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if a where foo takes 2 args < 1294454694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if so, how do you get clue not to die by trying it with one < 1294454705 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that i don't know, because compare has probably never been tried :D < 1294454705 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294454712 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohhh < 1294454716 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well umm < 1294454719 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :conditions are kinda special... < 1294454723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...:D < 1294454724 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they can not take two args xD < 1294454732 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: if i made a wrapper for compare < 1294454735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that takes it as a two-arg list < 1294454740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: then would that work? < 1294454742 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just have as condition < 1294454746 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and compare in bag < 1294454746 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd have to call pair in the condition of course < 1294454748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: er how < 1294454750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1294454751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but how < 1294454751 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Take it, take it, take it, I've gont tloco < 1294454756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: leave < 1294454759 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :~ ; compare < 1294454763 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as you already realized < 1294454770 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, just in a weird mood < 1294454796 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somehow i thought giving the condition func would make things faster or whatever, but it's just fucking stupid < 1294454801 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- is negative? < 1294454801 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Condition: id('#0') < 1294454801 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (None) < 1294454803 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'#1' < 1294454805 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (0) < 1294454807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'#0' < 1294454809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (1) < 1294454811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'#1' < 1294454813 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i dont think that'll actually work < 1294454815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*don't < 1294454816 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :almost there < 1294454817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't really call compare at ... all < 1294454819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :need more testcases? < 1294454826 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :show code < 1294454827 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh lol my test was wrong too < 1294454844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh my god, it just figured out what zero is < 1294454854 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lmao < 1294454855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Condition: id(['compare', '#0', ['compare', '#0', '#0']]) < 1294454856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: look < 1294454859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's a genius < 1294454866 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294454875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it wanted 0, but despite the fact that it was _given_ 0, < 1294454876 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :- You are sitting in a chair. - < 1294454880 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it compares it to itself to get it < 1294454884 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: wait what... < 1294454888 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (-1) < 1294454888 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'#1' < 1294454889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (0) < 1294454890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'#0' < 1294454892 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (1) < 1294454894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'#0' < 1294454896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't #0 the param her < 1294454898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1294454898 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wild shiny mon found. < 1294454899 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm laughing so goddamn loudly right now < 1294454900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...well whatever :D < 1294454900 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bitching. < 1294454914 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: show code? < 1294454917 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: have you heard about that embarassing DOS bug in php that they have found monday? < 1294454921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think, if you have 0, 1, and compare, and you want 0, choosing compare(x,x) to get it is an inspired solution < 1294454924 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Caught. < 1294454934 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: yes, but i'd rather forget php exists. also the bug is rather subtle and not _all_ that stupid < 1294454934 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dos? cheater < 1294454946 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how is that stupid? < 1294454953 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: ? < 1294454957 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s//not/ < 1294454981 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how is that not stupid? < 1294454995 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linky? < 1294454997 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they copypasted code from someone who didn't know wtf they were doing. < 1294455002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: no, they didn't < 1294455015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: it was to do with an edge-case on x87 vs sse < 1294455015 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: can i get your negative number parsing code? < 1294455032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if code[0].isdigit() or code[0]=='-': < 1294455032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return parse_number(code) < 1294455033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: in parse_object < 1294455037 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's it, the rest you already wrote :D < 1294455040 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they didn't even write an exhaustive unit test for it which would have taken, only once executed, a minuscule amount of time. < 1294455052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: unit tests are stupid. < 1294455057 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :executing them only once is doubly so. < 1294455059 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they test units < 1294455062 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something they hadn't done < 1294455072 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you only need to test code once every time it changes < 1294455074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: enjoy enumerating every floating point value lol < 1294455085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this ain't 32-bit land < 1294455104 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exhaustive doesn't mean every value < 1294455109 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exhaustive means every important value < 1294455122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, so basically what you are saying is: they should have predicted the bug perfectly < 1294455128 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since when are you such a php fanboi? < 1294455132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hate php, php devs are idiots, but this bug is subtle and not something i would expect anyone to catch. < 1294455138 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every decision they make is idiotic. < 1294455145 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294455148 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least we agree on that < 1294455152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's like saying, oh, "john mccain raped me and my sister for five days on end and that's why he's terrible" < 1294455157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, that's stupid, he's terrible for entirely other reasons? < 1294455166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bad metaphor prize < 1294455168 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :goes to me~~ < 1294455170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now back to clue < 1294455174 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: okay so i am going to see if it can NEGATE < 1294455180 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a little enjoyment hasn't hurt anyone so far < 1294455183 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294455247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so to subtract i use the add function despite the fact thaty ou have decrement :D < 1294455248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*that you < 1294455254 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because there's no subtract functin < 1294455255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*function < 1294455274 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what bout addin neg numbers < 1294455278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1294455285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: lol... you can't actually do negate i don't think < 1294455290 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: -x = 0-x = 0+-x < 1294455295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so to do negate with add, you need negate < 1294455307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: care to try and do negate or subtract as a recursive fn? :D < 1294455332 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you could start incing and deccing in both sides of a pair < 1294455336 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :until one reaches 0 < 1294455343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: wait what < 1294455345 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294455352 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well something like that, i mean there's a workaround < 1294455354 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyhows < 1294455359 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could just ass sub... < 1294455364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO < 1294455365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THAT'S CHEATING < 1294455369 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294455369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this platonic core will be perfect forever < 1294455371 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*add btw < 1294455378 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you write the subtract or negate function (negate is more useful for me fwiw) < 1294455380 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, want to get stats on block count so far in building that castle with hmod + worldedit + craftbook? < 1294455385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: wait, why don't we just use lists of [] < 1294455388 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: to denote naturals < 1294455390 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: uh sure < 1294455391 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, even though it is just a shell it is rather massive < 1294455459 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, 596516 stone (note, area uneven, might include 5-10 deep into ground). 62806 obsidian. 968 lightstone. 829 torch. < 1294455466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh so like 2 minute work < 1294455467 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus a number of other ones < 1294455478 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no, more like half a day of work < 1294455486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3 minute :D < 1294455488 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also some cool redstone stuff :P < 1294455493 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that took time < 1294455503 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, like the automated arrow shooting battery < 1294455507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294455511 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so is negate done yet < 1294455517 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway whats the clue of clue, but making comments useless :p < 1294455524 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p6778978682.txt < 1294455541 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, flip a lever, watch it shoot. Then watch notch poor code for arrows over network lag the thing to hell < 1294455557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: excuse me, i meant in clue < 1294455567 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294455576 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was almost as hard < 1294455581 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some respect man < 1294455604 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i just don't see how you can write negate in clue at all :D < 1294455610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i really want to know < 1294455613 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can compare with 0 < 1294455619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and? < 1294455630 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so whether it's negative or positive, you'll find it if you go both directions < 1294455639 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294455644 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's just comparison with 0 < 1294455657 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you know it's negative, then just inc until 0, and inc twice on other track < 1294455671 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'll end up with (0, abs(n)) < 1294455672 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if dont? < 1294455675 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i < 1294455681 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no don't do abs, i'm trying to do abs USING negate :D < 1294455682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck you man < 1294455690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're like < 1294455692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :skipping ahead < 1294455701 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nono i didn't write abs < 1294455705 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just meant < 1294455710 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294455716 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah true < 1294455721 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but anyway the algo i gave is just for negate < 1294455733 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it requires a bit of list fiddling, but shouldn't be too hard < 1294455748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ok then ... teach me how to recurse :D < 1294455756 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd love to! < 1294455777 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION gets some popcorn < 1294455800 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you have like (three points) a -> b (two points) c -> d < 1294455819 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then, a is transformed into c, and a and d are transformed into b < 1294455823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait wait < 1294455826 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i need to brb for ooone sec < 1294455898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: back < 1294455905 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, well that's recursion < 1294455907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what are points < 1294455908 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like < 1294455910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :three = :. < 1294455912 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :two = :? < 1294455917 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :allya < 1294455921 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ya < 1294455923 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good you ask < 1294455927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a and d transformed into b ... what < 1294455936 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i see < 1294455962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so basically, "given f(c) = d, f(a) = b, where c comes from a and b uses a and d"? < 1294455973 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294455983 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294455998 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obvious right < 1294456000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: is that ":D how does anyone else but me understand this" :P < 1294456037 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well. kind of, i wasn't actually surprised, more like yay ehird so smart i don't have to explain eeeeverything. < 1294456059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i feel vaguely insulted :D < 1294456070 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's really all there is to recursion, and it is one of the things i like best about clue < 1294456074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ok so base cases are done with onedots < 1294456078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and then i have separate blocks with recursion < 1294456080 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yarr < 1294456085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294456089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so (0,x) -> x and (x,0) -> x < 1294456090 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw remember it's just the amt of blocks, you can say ... as well < 1294456093 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...important right < 1294456098 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah? for this abs subfunction thing < 1294456099 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: wut < 1294456106 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's ... < 1294456106 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soooomething like that < 1294456115 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :":." = ".:" = "..." < 1294456120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ah. :P < 1294456125 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i bet you were real proud of that < 1294456130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are FOUR DOTS < 1294456131 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294456138 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :examples < 1294456141 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :general examples < 1294456143 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :test cases < 1294456164 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :documentation < 1294456171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: are five dots like < 1294456172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :design documents < 1294456184 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about six dots, are six dots the one-sentence summary of how the code works < 1294456200 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294456211 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe five could actually be comments < 1294456213 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be... < 1294456220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::. < 1294456232 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: do the order of ~{} blocks matter? < 1294456249 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294456255 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now that i've given this thing some thought < 1294456260 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm pretty sure they don't really < 1294456266 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, i'd but the default case last < 1294456294 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if there is no default case? < 1294456312 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good q < 1294456321 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :leave it empty? < 1294456332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't specify it, one would assume < 1294456338 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think there will always be one < 1294456347 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: okay so wait what tuple do abs(-5) and abs(5) start out with? < 1294456350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the loop < 1294456363 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is actually bad for further inference, you should definitely be able to make things fail < 1294456380 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i'd do negate separately < 1294456396 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: okay what tuple do negate(-5) and negate(5) start with :D < 1294456397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :help a retard here < 1294456412 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well erm < 1294456416 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd write those separately too < 1294456419 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negate positive < 1294456423 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negate negative < 1294456425 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then < 1294456433 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negate negative starts with (-5, -5) < 1294456434 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Console Hacking 2010 Part 2 - Chaos Communication Congress < 1294456439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what about negate positive < 1294456440 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the rules is to (inc, inc inc) < 1294456442 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is this stuff that will be educational to me? < 1294456446 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I seem to be learning < 1294456468 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: clue is VERY educational, yes < 1294456471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: okay wait negative negative, < 1294456476 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so that goes < 1294456479 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(-4, -3) < 1294456483 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, I'm talking about a talk < 1294456483 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294456484 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(-2, -1) < 1294456485 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly < 1294456486 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :About PS3 security < 1294456486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(-3, 1) < 1294456487 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: i know < 1294456491 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: do we keep going? < 1294456494 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(-2, 2) < 1294456497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(-1, 4) < 1294456498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(0, 5) < 1294456498 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dont try it at home < 1294456498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DD < 1294456499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wow < 1294456504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok so it's 0,x -> x < 1294456510 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, do that last < 1294456523 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm sure you'll be able to translate that to clue < 1294456534 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: hey i don't even need recursion do i < 1294456537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait do i < 1294456540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, yes, i do < 1294456541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't I? < 1294456542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, i do < 1294456548 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just need it for the loop < 1294456570 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm.... < 1294456577 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite hard :D < 1294456582 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except you could also just write a program that adds the number to itself, twice < 1294456585 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean... < 1294456586 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait what < 1294456590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ...or that, yes < 1294456591 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"just negate it, then" < 1294456594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: can clue do that? < 1294456599 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it certainly can < 1294456606 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what it can't do is negate < 1294456609 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294456611 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're not using that < 1294456614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: right, negate negative is easy < 1294456616 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: negate positive won't be < 1294456634 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whreres the difference? < 1294456640 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no negate negative won't be easy! < 1294456656 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the idea doesn't work, because you'd need to negate so you could negate < 1294456667 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need to add the negation twice! < 1294456670 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, duh < 1294456673 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294456691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay so let's see, i'll write this in a language this is actually easy and obvious in and then translate < 1294456697 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f (0,y) = y < 1294456704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f (x,y) = f (x+1, y+2) < 1294456705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SO < 1294456726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f (x,y) = x where x = f (a, b); a = x+1; b = y+2 < 1294456739 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When it says geohot glitched .. something with the RAM, not entirely sure, do they mean physically? < 1294456748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: < 1294456749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negate negative ~ {:. a, b -> c < 1294456749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : a+1, b+1 -> c } < 1294456756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i just need to fill in this template a few times, right? < 1294456757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294456758 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*b+2 < 1294456764 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1294456778 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It required really annoying hardware to pull off" < 1294456784 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, i believe so < 1294456802 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and don't forget base case ofc < 1294456828 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negate negative ~ {:. -5, -5 -> 5 < 1294456828 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : -4, -3 -> 5 < 1294456828 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : -2, -1 -> 5 < 1294456830 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : -3, 1 -> 5 < 1294456832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : -2, 2 -> 5 < 1294456834 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : -1, 4 -> 5 < 1294456835 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : 0, 5 -> 5 } < 1294456837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: is that... correct? < 1294456846 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, although you don't need that much < 1294456850 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294456853 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :noooooo < 1294456864 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything after -4 -3 is excess < 1294456871 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the -5 -5 case is not using all that < 1294456875 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just one level is given < 1294456880 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294456891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do i need more than one example? < 1294456892 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or will that one do < 1294456900 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :point is to allow it to just brute force one layer instead of always going to base case < 1294456911 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: btw i disagree with how you indent these things, IMO the : for subcase should be aligned with the . for supercase < 1294456916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then the two x -> ys get aligned < 1294456918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294456921 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one may do, one may not, i don't really have an intuition for that atm < 1294456964 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TypeError: 'NoneType' object is not iterable < 1294456966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yaaaaaay < 1294457001 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294457005 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :turns out negative negative != negate negative < 1294457029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- negate negative < 1294457029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Condition: is zero?('#0') < 1294457029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rec branch (0) < 1294457030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Subast(0,0):['inc', '#0'] < 1294457032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Subast(0,1):['inc', ['inc', '#0']] < 1294457034 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Main ast: '#2' < 1294457036 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (1) < 1294457038 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'#1' < 1294457040 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: holy shit, it actually works. < 1294457066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and negate positive is just the same except it's x, 0 and we do dec/dec dec, right? < 1294457067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294457075 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i believe this to be the case. < 1294457077 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :always wondered y -1*1 makes -1.. thats kind of evil < 1294457078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294457083 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: ...what < 1294457084 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yo dawg, i heard you like negation < 1294457088 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: x*1 = x < 1294457116 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok so far < 1294457122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: let x = -1 < 1294457125 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ergo -1*1 = -1 < 1294457133 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294457143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm...yes < 1294457156 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: both (-1)*1 and -(1*1) are -1, of course, even if for slightly different reasons < 1294457157 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its an axiome..isnt it? < 1294457177 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or rather both follow from x*1 = x actually < 1294457208 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: x*1 = x < 1294457214 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: do you accept that this is true no matter what x is? < 1294457215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 of x is x. < 1294457216 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: yes, x*1 = x is one of the field axioms < 1294457218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x times 1 is x. < 1294457224 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes? < 1294457226 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes elliott.. < 1294457242 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: let us suppose that x = -1. so we have x*1 = x. expanding x's value, we have (-1)*1 = (-1). < 1294457245 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that so hard? < 1294457254 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294457256 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you needed just one recursion case? < 1294457263 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i needed 2 < 1294457264 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yup, guess clue is magical < 1294457267 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: also negate positive works < 1294457273 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is also true that (-a)*b = -(a*b) for all a and b < 1294457276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negate negative ~ {:. -5, -5 -> 5 < 1294457276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : -4, -3 -> 5 } < 1294457276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negate negative ~ {. 0, 1 -> 1 < 1294457278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 0, 2 -> 2 < 1294457280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 0, 3 -> 3 } < 1294457282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negate negative ~ ; inc < 1294457284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: guess i am a better clue programmer than you? < 1294457287 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294457295 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe! < 1294457297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what's your code < 1294457329 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could have -a*b = b .. isnt it a question of notation? < 1294457330 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue.DepthLimitException: depth limit exceeded (negate) < 1294457331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh come on < 1294457331 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p1551824545.txt < 1294457344 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: so negative one times two apples is two apples? < 1294457354 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: also, you can have 2*2 = 72. < 1294457357 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: um -a*b usually parses as -(a*b) < 1294457360 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the fact is that * is an operation defined by certain facts about it. < 1294457361 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so maybe that's the reason you only needed one < 1294457363 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's kinda random ofc < 1294457374 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think some programming languages violate that, though < 1294457398 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thx oerjan.. < 1294457406 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh i think i might actually need a non-inner loop version... < 1294457407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for negate < 1294457418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe i just need to give it id < 1294457421 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just check if it's pos or neg and negate < 1294457427 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats the direction i wanted to get it goin < 1294457434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negate ~ {. -1 -> 1 < 1294457434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . -2 -> 2 < 1294457434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . -3 -> 3 } < 1294457436 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negate ~ {. 0 -> 0 < 1294457438 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 1 -> -1 < 1294457440 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 2 -> -2 } < 1294457442 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negate ~ ; negate negative; negate positive; id < 1294457444 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: goes all depth limit, < 1294457446 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: because negate X takes two arguments < 1294457448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want it to give them both as the same < 1294457450 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i don't know if it's smart enough to < 1294457451 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: but it is still true that both the obvious parsing candidates give the same final value < 1294457481 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should certainly be smart enough for that :\ < 1294457486 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmhmm < 1294457498 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also -a*b = b holds for a = -1 or b = 0 < 1294457511 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean it can deduce things like cadar < 1294457549 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's is negative?` < 1294457557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is negative? ~ {. -1 -> 1 < 1294457557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . -2 -> 1 } < 1294457557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is negative? ~ {. 0 -> 0 } < 1294457559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is negative? ~ {. 1 -> 0 < 1294457561 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 2 -> 0 } < 1294457563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is negative? ~ ; compare; #0; #1 < 1294457565 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it might infer wrong ... < 1294457569 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- is negative? < 1294457570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Condition: id(['compare', '#0', ['compare', '#0', '#0']]) < 1294457571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (-1) < 1294457573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'#1' < 1294457575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (0) < 1294457577 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'#0' < 1294457579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (1) < 1294457581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'#0' < 1294457583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that seems very suspicious to me < 1294457589 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems to work < 1294457592 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294457607 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294457610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you sure :D < 1294457619 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ummmmmmm < 1294457624 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no. < 1294457638 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is #0 the zeroth arg or is it a zero < 1294457660 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do not know :D < 1294457666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it' the zeroth arg < 1294457666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*it's < 1294457667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that makes like ... no sense < 1294457668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT bear in mind < 1294457673 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do have "#0; #1" < 1294457674 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it could be both < 1294457719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: just tested in console < 1294457721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is correct < 1294457736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>> _['negate negative'](-5,-5) < 1294457736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 < 1294457739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294457739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294457752 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh needs to be [-5,-5] < 1294457757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or not, no < 1294457766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>> _['negate positive'](5,5) < 1294457766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2 < 1294457774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you're lying to me about how these constructs work ... or something < 1294457828 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :/ < 1294457853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: any ideas :D < 1294457867 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm...... < 1294457870 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm. < 1294457883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean the _actual test case_ is failing < 1294457894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe is fucking it up somehow...naw < 1294457921 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :weirdness man < 1294457933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries things < 1294457947 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the fact is that * is an operation defined by certain facts about it. <-- so multiplication of a negative and a positive value results in a negative value,yes..it may be a metaphysical question, but i wonder if it's based on a natural law or just another entropy < 1294457960 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: do you have the swatter? < 1294457967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it is _really_ desperately needed. < 1294458000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ok mine can't even figure out a one-arg negate negative :D < 1294458022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think our implementations are subtly different now :/ < 1294458049 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll finish mine, and try to come up with why you can't < 1294458052 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then < 1294458112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: gimme your current src tree and i'll diff it against mine < 1294458124 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh meh < 1294458130 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh what you mean clue.py? < 1294458178 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes < 1294458180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also stuff.py < 1294458243 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okky < 1294458339 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p2332981772.txt http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p1364929955.txt http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p9712658752.txt < 1294458393 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: okay, you have negate built in obvs < 1294458403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"function should be have" < 1294458404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :be have :D < 1294458434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: the only cluedifferences we have are that i fixed the exception messages differently < 1294458436 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*clue differences < 1294458449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cluetest mine is just a bit more featured < 1294458454 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :print funcs["is negative?"](-7) # --> 3 < 1294458456 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice comment < 1294458494 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294458504 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey i can't get this little pecker to compile < 1294458539 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohh < 1294458541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im stupid lol < 1294458544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have youever felt < 1294458544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stupid? < 1294458554 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no wait < 1294458558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue is still the stupid one < 1294458569 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey < 1294458592 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something wrong with parsing maybe, because negate negative works, but negate positive doesn't, even though i just changed signs < 1294458597 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe my error < 1294458647 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D < 1294458651 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan.. hmm.. okay.. so if -ab is kind of a short to notation to -1*a*b*.. there is no need to think in cases of negative or positive, right?.. makes sence < 1294458653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: probably, yes < 1294458656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: since the recursion is different < 1294458680 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's really not < 1294458715 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's parsing that fails < 1294458717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1294458720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm just fixin' my negate negative < 1294458722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: weird < 1294458724 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what error < 1294458730 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as can easily be seen from the error message........... < 1294458737 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Traceback (most recent call last): < 1294458737 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : File "C:\stuff}clue\cluetest.py", line 10, in < 1294458737 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : funcs,asts=clue.compile_all(open(cluefile).read(),stuff.funcs) < 1294458737 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : File "C:\stuff}clue\clue.py", line 618, in compile_all < 1294458737 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : compilees=parse(code) < 1294458737 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : File "C:\stuff}clue\clue.py", line 596, in parse < 1294458737 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : clues[i]=stuff_to_clue(tokenized[i]) < 1294458738 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : File "C:\stuff}clue\clue.py", line 589, in stuff_to_clue < 1294458739 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : cond,others=separate_cond(helpers) < 1294458739 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TypeError: 'NoneType' object is not iterable < 1294458744 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what kind of piece of shit wrote this thing < 1294458751 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I WANT FUCKING ERROR MESSAGES < 1294458767 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the guy was probably like < 1294458768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ahh ,yes, i remember that error < 1294458771 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey if you make amistake < 1294458771 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: show me your code? < 1294458774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i remember fixing that < 1294458774 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck you, you suck < 1294458778 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think you forgot to specify clues < 1294458780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you got a name wrong somewhere < 1294458785 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :check your names < 1294458827 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue.DepthLimitException: depth limit exceeded (really negate positive) < 1294458869 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>> _['negate positive'](5,5) < 1294458870 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :['nothing here'] < 1294458870 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1294458870 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it turns out < 1294458870 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i got a name wrong < 1294458870 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what < 1294458872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>> _['negate positive'](5,5) < 1294458873 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :['nothing here'] < 1294458875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what < 1294458878 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somewhere < 1294458882 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ARE YOU A WITCH < 1294458888 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i noticed when i checked my names < 1294458892 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: excuse me < 1294458894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is it doing that < 1294458904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if depth_lim==0: < 1294458904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return ["nothing here"] < 1294458904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1294458940 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...que < 1294458948 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh erm hrm < 1294458955 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294458960 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"sorry" < 1294458975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohh < 1294458977 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :duh < 1294458978 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i made a mistake < 1294458981 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and your impl was all like < 1294458982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"fuck you" < 1294458985 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"stop making mistakes" < 1294459035 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmhmm < 1294459043 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294459047 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it occasionally does that < 1294459071 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- negate < 1294459072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Condition: is negative?('#0') < 1294459072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (1) < 1294459073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :['negate negative', '#0', '#0'] < 1294459075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (0) < 1294459077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :['negate positive', '#0', '#0'] < 1294459079 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: do i win prize < 1294459081 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not the most user friendly thing < 1294459123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- abs < 1294459123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Condition: is negative?('#0') < 1294459123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (1) < 1294459124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :['negate', '#0'] < 1294459126 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (0) < 1294459128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'#0' < 1294459130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: can i get prize? < 1294459158 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliot scores 5dots < 1294459184 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's nice < 1294459184 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nicer than mine, surely < 1294459184 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in my defense, i was just gonna do negate negative, not all of negate < 1294459194 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well i finished before you, so prolly not < 1294459196 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wlel < 1294459199 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*well < 1294459202 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: did you get abs before me < 1294459205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294459211 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well then < 1294459217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i will just have to figure out subtraction < 1294459222 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't done abs! < 1294459223 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't notice that sry < 1294459231 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the second mouse gets the cheese < 1294459231 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294459242 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i couldn't have seen how that's done < 1294459256 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like you... meh i'm not even gonna try < 1294459298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :subtract ~ {. 1, 3 -> -2 < 1294459298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 2, 1 -> 1 < 1294459298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . -3, -2 -> -1 } < 1294459298 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that's pretty simple..... except you need to do positives and negatives separately again :D < 1294459299 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :subtract ~ <_>; add; negate < 1294459303 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294459304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- subtract < 1294459304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Condition: _('#0') < 1294459305 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah umm < 1294459305 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (None) < 1294459307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :['add', '#0', ['negate', '#1']] < 1294459309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: sure, i did < 1294459309 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm a serious fucking retard < 1294459314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1294459322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: here's my code < 1294459325 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forgot add exists < 1294459331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: http://sprunge.us/DFfN < 1294459331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294459336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: to be honest add shouldn't exist. < 1294459344 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294459354 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: in fact, nothing should exist except pairs and one non-pair object < 1294459364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no multiple arguments, that's done with pairs < 1294459373 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zero? < 1294459379 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, nil or something < 1294459383 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you do realize *ski* takes 20 seconds to compile, and functions are executed about a million times when you compile somethin < 1294459384 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :g < 1294459386 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: indeed, in a sufficiently advanced implementation, functions would be represented as lists in this kind < 1294459387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294459399 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yeah so since it's useless, let's make it good and useless < 1294459434 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw i was close to adding higher order functions to the impl, not really any more work, but would be fucking awesome < 1294459445 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean just think about the clue definition of map < 1294459460 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mmmm < 1294459465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: see, like i said, do functions as lists < 1294459472 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: then you already have it all :D < 1294459476 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just have an apply function < 1294459480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :taking an object and an objects < 1294459485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :object = pair object object | nil < 1294459498 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah < 1294459498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and "foo" in examples is just a reference to that object ofc < 1294459504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: whyever not :D < 1294459521 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's pretty much perfect now < 1294459530 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just needs MORE stuff, and a better conditional < 1294459542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: this would be more stuff < 1294459542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :done < 1294459544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with LESS stuff < 1294459545 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: the rule -(a*b) = (-a)*b holds for more than just ordinary numbers, it holds for any ring including those where you cannot distinguish positive and negative elements. < 1294459647 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> all [ -(a*b) == (-a)*b | a <- [0 .. 255::Word8], b <- [0 .. 255::Word8]] < 1294459648 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `a -> GHC.Bool.Bool' < 1294459648 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : against inferred ... < 1294459651 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eek < 1294459657 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294459659 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heeeeeeey < 1294459661 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CLUE BOT :D < 1294459663 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> and [ -(a*b) == (-a)*b | a <- [0 .. 255::Word8], b <- [0 .. 255::Word8]] < 1294459664 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : True < 1294459674 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but you have no expression syntax :D < 1294459678 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so how ya gonna test things < 1294459685 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: Word8 being one such ring, arithmetic mod 256 < 1294459705 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i'm not proud of this but... clue was supposed to have main < 1294459714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ...i'm disgusted < 1294459715 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you think there should be any BytePusher related stuff in the esoteric programming files archive? < 1294459715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck off < 1294459754 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no u < 1294459757 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah < 1294459771 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: all you have to do is write another parser then < 1294459771 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OMG < 1294459773 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a bit... impure, really i'd prefer that you can't actually run the programs! < 1294459775 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: or reuse the existing one < 1294459775 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...like now! < 1294459794 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i was thinking < 1294459800 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just give the bot definitions < 1294459805 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: func~{1,2} < 1294459807 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then you can give it mains which are expressions < 1294459808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :will the parser parse that? < 1294459813 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294459814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe func ~ 1; 2 < 1294459817 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right you would need to parse... < 1294459831 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: basically, what can the parser parse that's nested reasonably :D < 1294459835 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from list literals < 1294459851 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing else i suppose < 1294459856 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue doesn't have logical nesting < 1294459870 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: recursion duh < 1294459876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ok if you just extend the parser a tiny bit < 1294459877 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we can have < 1294459878 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean in syntax < 1294459884 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every expression is parsed as < 1294459886 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo~{...} < 1294459887 0 :azaq231!~derivecto@p4FF68394.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294459888 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where ... is the expr < 1294459889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can enter < 1294459890 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and by logical i meant control < 1294459900 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or what's it called < 1294459903 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :non-data < 1294459918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. func, 1, x, 2 -> result; func2, 34 -> x < 1294459919 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's < 1294459923 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :func(1, func2(34), 2) < 1294459927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294459930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. func, 1, x, 2 -> result : func2, 34 -> x < 1294459931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ofc < 1294459959 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah you could have something like that in a bot < 1294459970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i mean all you have to do is keep strings you can't parse < 1294459975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then 'foo~{'+x+'}' < 1294459978 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i mean you don't need to write a parser < 1294459984 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this gives you expressions for FREE < 1294460006 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1294460033 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or you could just have somekinda ugly sexp syntax < 1294460040 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the bot i mean < 1294460047 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that not what you're talking about < 1294460055 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well yes < 1294460061 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but this way you get to reuse almost the existing parser < 1294460066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's SO MUCH MORE CONVENIENT? < 1294460083 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well right, so do it :P < 1294460085 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want the bot! < 1294460117 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heeeey i could implement quicksort! < 1294460125 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder when i implemented that last < 1294460146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: is that even possible in clue < 1294460156 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, why wouldn't it be? < 1294460162 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a pretty high-level language < 1294460176 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(;;;;;;;;;;D) < 1294460300 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, why can functions only return one value < 1294460301 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294460306 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's fucking stupid < 1294460309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: workin on the bot < 1294460310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and lol < 1294460311 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just return a list < 1294460327 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i sort of came up with that < 1294460337 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just fucking stupid < 1294460412 0 :azaq231!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294460412 0 :azaq231!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294460424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: take a look at my amazing ast representation < 1294460428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[is zero?('#0')] <>(0) =>{0,0}:['inc', '#0'] ; {0,1}:['inc', ['inc', '#1']] ; ;; <= '#2' ;; !.(1) => '#1' ;; < 1294460437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :irc optimised < 1294460448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahahaha wow that is the worst ever :D < 1294460454 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294460462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION makes less ghetto < 1294460608 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[is negative?('#0')] .(1) => ['negate negative', '#0', '#0'] | .(0) => ['negate positive', '#0', '#0'] < 1294460611 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's getting better! < 1294460641 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nicenice < 1294460693 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what _is_ the "main ast" anyway, for a recursion < 1294460728 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it's default branch, but... umm.... < 1294460733 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait waht < 1294460750 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess it's the part that calculates actual result < 1294460765 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what :) < 1294460767 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then there's special asts that calculate subinputs from input < 1294460769 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294460798 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, i can't get pivot to compile, and i'm not sure it's a coding error...... :D < 1294460891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- negate positive < 1294460891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[is zero?('#0')] < 1294460891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|^(0) => '#2' <= {(0,0): ['dec', '#0']; (0,1): ['dec', ['dec', '#1']]; } < 1294460893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(1) => '#1' < 1294460896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: this is actually a nicer syntax in general xD < 1294460940 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294460955 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually it was a coding error, and it compiles in a microsecond < 1294460956 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do oyu mean < 1294460959 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*you < 1294460962 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nicer than what < 1294460981 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: than get_ast < 1294460983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is hideous < 1294460984 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is my replacement < 1294460985 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ghetto_ast < 1294460989 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, well surely < 1294461006 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :get_ast is horrible < 1294461027 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was just a quick thingie so i could see what was going on, i think < 1294461029 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294461048 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe i did give it some thought, don't really remember, if i did, it was bad touhght. < 1294461050 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*thought < 1294461070 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- is zero? < 1294461070 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[id('#0')] < 1294461070 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(0) => '#1' < 1294461072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(_) => '#0' < 1294461074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is actually starting to make sense :D < 1294461086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: do Clues know what their constants are? < 1294461087 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294461087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd like to show them < 1294461105 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294461114 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :look in the bag? < 1294461119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294461304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: < 1294461305 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- subtract < 1294461305 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[_(#0)] < 1294461306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(_) => add(#0, negate(#1)) < 1294461310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- negate < 1294461310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[is negative?(#0)] < 1294461312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(1) => {negate negative}(#0, #0) < 1294461314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(0) => {negate positive}(#0, #0) < 1294461320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think i win < 1294461327 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<- like < 1294461327 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86-rdmsoft [XULRunner 1.9.2.12/20101026210630] < 1294461358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- negate positive < 1294461358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[is zero?(#0)] < 1294461358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|^(0) => #2 <= {(0,0): dec(#0); (0,1): dec(dec(#1))} < 1294461359 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(1) => #1 < 1294461363 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can even understand that if i try hard enough :D < 1294461382 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so um constants are _not_in the bag < 1294461384 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*_not_ in < 1294461402 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1294461403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :helper_objs < 1294461419 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh lol < 1294461448 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somehow i think i should optimize this thing, i've been compiling pivot for a couple minutes now < 1294461483 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's incredibly hard to rip a list open, since from the program's standpoint that's not in anyway more sensible than adding stuff to it. < 1294461507 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm going to make it more sensible, but because i need to do it in a pure an extensible way, that's easier said than done < 1294461538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: could i actually rewrite these constanty things to their val... nah < 1294461540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :too lazy < 1294461632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[is zero?(#0)] |^(0) => #2 <= {(0,0): dec(#0); (0,1): dec(dec(#1))} |.(1) => #1 < 1294461636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[id(#0)] <= [0, 1] |.(0) => #1 |.(_) => #0 < 1294461639 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :think that's about as nice as these are gonna get < 1294461771 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so um < 1294461774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: wanna write a parser for this < 1294461783 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.D < 1294461814 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeeeeeeeeeah totally < 1294461829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: expr := '#' nat | int | (string_without_spaces | '{' string '}') '(' args ')' < 1294461835 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where args is comma-separated expr < 1294461838 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where is the lid? < 1294461839 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: c'mon, it'll be fuuun :D < 1294461841 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh where is the lid? < 1294461849 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where is the, where is the, where is the liiiid? < 1294461889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ok i'll write the parser, but you have to tell me how lovely i am for four days after that < 1294461950 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :will do man < 1294461965 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: liiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii < 1294462088 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i need a better computer < 1294462108 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no but seriously i need to optimize this thing, it's kinda ridiculously slow atm :D < 1294462121 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or my code is wrong) < 1294462130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i just realised that your language is so awesome that you don't even need {} < 1294462133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to group spacey names < 1294462159 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed you don't < 1294462165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[is negative?(#0)] |.(1) => negate negative(#0, #0) |.(0) => negate positive(#0, #0) < 1294462168 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :flexibility yo < 1294462269 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return ('a',n,a),s < 1294462269 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anas :D < 1294462426 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>> park('is zero?(#0) this is a comment')[0] < 1294462426 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :('a', 'is zero?', [('v', 0)]) < 1294462434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: note my cunning disregard for trailing text providing useful comment functionality < 1294462449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm wait don't actually need #n here < 1294462461 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YES < 1294462471 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i managed to compile a tiny helper function for pivot < 1294462485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: should i require commas between arguments < 1294462488 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's so last year? < 1294462495 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's kinda last year yeah < 1294462511 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should probably remove some commas from clue < 1294462536 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean from data < 1294462550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i will in ghetto_ast < 1294462640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[id(compare(#0 compare(#0 #0)))] <= [0 1] |.(-1) => #1 |.(0) => #0 |.(1) => #0 < 1294462642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pure beauty < 1294462696 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why does it consistently add that extra computation, i will never understand < 1294462717 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you didn't punch me. Why didn't you punch me? < 1294462744 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrgh < 1294462762 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i need to reimplement this fucker in a faster language, with a less brute force algo < 1294462794 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ok quick does clue support adding things to a funcs dict < 1294462794 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like < 1294462796 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :incremental compilation < 1294462827 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you get cons to caaar 0, [[1], [2], [3]] -> [[1], [2], [0, 3]] to compile? < 1294462853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what :D < 1294462855 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the funcs dict is a python dictionary.... < 1294462859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yesyes < 1294462860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294462862 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have some func < 1294462863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s < 1294462865 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have some new clue code < 1294462869 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can i add its compilation to func < 1294462870 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cons to caaar ~ {. 0, [[1], [2], [3]] -> [[1], [2], [0, 3]] } < 1294462875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming it uses the stuff always in funcs < 1294462882 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you can compile that, you're my hero < 1294462888 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well my impl is the same as yours, or do you want me to fiddle with hints < 1294462895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if so, i will, just as soon as i get cluebot working, which will be soon < 1294462905 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have an impl for that? < 1294462929 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah i do want you to fiddle with hints < 1294462952 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i always meant for it to be really hard to get things to compile, but i just plain can't come up with a way to do that :D < 1294462962 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, maybe some reeeeeeeally roundabout way < 1294462993 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean you can write sequential code if you like ofc < 1294463000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh fucking god, compile_all is a bitch < 1294463001 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's just kinda tedious < 1294463013 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm sure it is, why? :D < 1294463013 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: isn't there something to like...fuck < 1294463016 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: okay question um < 1294463032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: compile_all... can you use it on a predone funcs? < 1294463033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think so < 1294463065 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think you can separate parsing if you like < 1294463072 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i don't know what you're supposed to call then < 1294463145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :def run(coeducational): < 1294463145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : asts.update(clue.compile_all(coeducational, funcs)[1]) < 1294463148 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thought koed was too cliche < 1294463201 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, now it compiles in 4 seconds < 1294463218 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cons to caaar that is.... < 1294463253 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i used to use koed because it's nice to write < 1294463260 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :koedkoedkoedkoedkoedkoedkoedkoedkoed < 1294463295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>> cabinetoflaughter('is negative?(-1)') < 1294463295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'s' < 1294463298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :evaluation function: not so good < 1294463327 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294463338 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know the Unolympics? < 1294463434 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders what Inventables stuff are good to just have fun with < 1294463467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cluebot starting < 1294463502 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: nope < 1294463504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: cluebot nick is taken :D < 1294463505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: let's try us < 1294463507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*uh < 1294463515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: larc < 1294463526 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: cluebot -> cluebat -> luser attitude readjustment clue < 1294463546 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's...... perfect., < 1294463574 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: That's OK, I don't know either. < 1294463601 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: what do you know then? < 1294463626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: larc is registered :D < 1294463637 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: luatre then < 1294463642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LUser ATtitude REadjustment clue < 1294463762 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so I'm thinking, for luatre commands, < 1294463764 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: It is just idea... make Unolympics with difference from Olympics, with events such as: * Circular reasoning * Judge bribing * Flagpole sitting * Beer drinking contest * Watch TV all channels at once by changing the channels really fast * You are allowed to use any drugs you want in order to win < 1294463772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: three dots evaluates, four dots defines < 1294463774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: five dots looks up < 1294463852 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :six dots is just for testing < 1294463860 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seven dots means you win immediately < 1294463872 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: um it's lart not larc < 1294463876 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :t for tool < 1294463878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: luser attitude readjustment clue < 1294463881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you silly < 1294463886 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cluebot -> cluebat -> luser attitude readjustment clue < 1294463891 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGH FUCKING CLUE IMPLEMENTATION < 1294463896 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but lart is already the same as a cluebat < 1294463898 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who the fuck as written this piece of shit < 1294463910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: no shit < 1294463911 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm gonna kill that little homo < 1294463913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it's a pun < 1294463916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: heard of them? < 1294463941 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO SUCH THING < 1294463952 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294463956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. butts < 1294463965 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294463970 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294463971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. butts < 1294463975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... buts < 1294463978 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::(( < 1294463986 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294463990 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294463992 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. sdfsdfsdf < 1294463994 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294463997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294464016 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294464020 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294464022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. asdf < 1294464025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294464041 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294464056 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294464060 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294464061 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. asdf < 1294464064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ffwef[kgsfdhiok < 1294464070 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294464074 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294464076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. a sdf < 1294464078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what\ < 1294464081 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. asdf < 1294464097 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: luatre will not respond < 1294464126 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, I didn't know that. < 1294464130 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294464136 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294464136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. abc < 1294464137 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lookup! < 1294464141 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294464147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... abc < 1294464147 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lookup! < 1294464151 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.... abc < 1294464155 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...:D < 1294464161 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294464164 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294464166 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lookup what? < 1294464169 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah umm okay the pivot function may not be implementable :D < 1294464171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. x < 1294464171 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lookup! < 1294464176 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, in any sensible way at least < 1294464196 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fucking hell :D < 1294464205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294464208 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294464212 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294464213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. tarski < 1294464214 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eval! < 1294464214 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tarski < 1294464218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: foo < 1294464218 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :define! < 1294464218 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo < 1294464220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::. lookup < 1294464220 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lookup! < 1294464220 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lookup < 1294464222 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294464229 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't really have to do all that much... < 1294464235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what, the bot? < 1294464245 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no i mean pivot < 1294464247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294464318 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294464331 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit:  < 1294464333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. cons(1 []) < 1294464334 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294464347 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294464349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. cons(1 []) < 1294464350 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maximum recursion depth exceeded in cmp :( < 1294464361 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294464365 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294464366 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. cons(1 []) < 1294464367 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294464379 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294464380 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. add(1 2) < 1294464410 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294464417 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294464418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. add(1 2) < 1294464419 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :: cannot concatenate 'str' and 'int' objects :( < 1294464476 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm. < 1294464477 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294464515 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf http://i.imgur.com/vymTu.jpg < 1294464522 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(r/pics) < 1294464568 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDDD < 1294464578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is the best < 1294464580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at 5:30 < 1294464664 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294464665 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. add(1 2) < 1294464665 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3 < 1294464669 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. cons(1 []) < 1294464670 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exceptions.RuntimeError: maximum recursion depth exceeded in cmp :( < 1294464676 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294464742 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294464747 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294464748 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as far as pieces of shit go, this program is one; i don't mind the lack of error messages really, but fucking hell i can't anything compiled :D < 1294464748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. cons(1 []) < 1294464748 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[1] < 1294464753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. cons(1 [2 3]) < 1294464753 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exceptions.RuntimeError: maximum recursion depth exceeded in __instancecheck__ :( < 1294464771 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i compiled stuff more complicated than pivot at some point < 1294464774 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno what happened < 1294464775 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. [1 2 3] < 1294464776 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exceptions.RuntimeError: maximum recursion depth exceeded in __instancecheck__ :( < 1294464778 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294464791 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::.sdjfkdjfkjsdf < 1294464795 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::SD:Sd.fDD:DDDD < 1294464838 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294464842 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294464845 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. cons (1 [2 3]) < 1294464846 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[1 2 3] < 1294464866 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :neato < 1294464871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: is zero? ~ {.0->1} is zero? ~{.1->0 .2->0} is zero? ~ ; #0; #1 < 1294464872 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is zero?: [id(#0)] <= [0 1] |.(0) => #1 |.(_) => #0 < 1294464881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. is zero? (-1) < 1294464881 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm going to compile pivot overnight and see if something happens < 1294464882 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 < 1294464883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. is zero? (0) < 1294464884 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 < 1294464885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. is zero? (1) < 1294464886 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 < 1294464891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::. is zero? < 1294464891 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is zero?: [id(#0)] <= [0 1] |.(0) => #1 |.(_) => #0 < 1294464893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::. cons < 1294464894 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exceptions.KeyError: 'cons' :( < 1294464896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294464898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::. is zero? < 1294464898 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is zero?: [id(#0)] <= [0 1] |.(0) => #1 |.(_) => #0 < 1294464902 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: admire please? < 1294464922 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice < 1294464936 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION fiddles < 1294464939 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294464944 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294464947 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: did i mention that my expression syntax is awesome < 1294464955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's literally just < 1294464958 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[id(#0)] <= [0 1] <<< this is like what args it gets or? < 1294464961 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or constants < 1294464963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: constants, yeah < 1294464969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: feed it something recursive < 1294464988 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :expr := int | '[' expr* ']' | name '(' expr* ')' <----- the entire expression syntax < 1294464990 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's rather verbose, but k < 1294464993 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with whitespace being irrelevant except to separate < 1294465001 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1294465004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what is, recursive stuff? < 1294465008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or the way to show constants < 1294465017 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :recursivity is verbose < 1294465020 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in clue < 1294465021 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in general < 1294465021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah well :P < 1294465027 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah let's see < 1294465060 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm so i don't really see how that syntax works if i'm supposed to use that for def as well < 1294465069 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :: foo < 1294465071 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: just remove all newlines < 1294465071 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or do i just write normal code < 1294465073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294465080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... 2 < 1294465081 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2 < 1294465085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: threedots = expression < 1294465087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: fourdots = clue < 1294465093 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rrright < 1294465094 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: fivedots = look up the ast of this function i give < 1294465102 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: guess how many lines cluebot.py is, note that my replacement for get_ast is in there (not in clue.py), also the parser and evaluator for my expression language, and all the irc code :| < 1294465107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION coding skillz < 1294465280 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.:. parity helper ~ { . 0, 0 -> 0 . 0, 1 -> 1 } parity helper ~ { :. 5, 1 -> 0 : 4, 0 -> 0 :. 3, 0 -> 1 : 2, 1 -> 1 } parity helper ~ ; compare; #0; #1; sub < 1294465280 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exception: Can't compile parity helper(sub) :( < 1294465284 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that'll never compile < 1294465323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no sub < 1294465327 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i can add it if you want me to cheat < 1294465331 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do < 1294465358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: sub ~ {.1,3->-2 .2,1->1 .-3,-2 -> -1} sub ~ <_>; add; negate < 1294465359 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exception: Can't compile sub(negate) :( < 1294465363 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294465369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this will be fun < 1294465405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: is negative?~{.-1->1 .-2->1} is negative?~{.0->0} is negative?~{.1 -> 0 .2 ->0} is negative? ~ ; compare; #0; #1 < 1294465406 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is negative?: [id(compare(#0 compare(#0 #0)))] <= [0 1] |.(-1) => #1 |.(0) => #0 |.(1) => #0 < 1294465427 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't you just add it as a primitive :D < 1294465436 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :: negate negative ~ {:. -5, -5 -> 5 : -4, -3 -> 5 :. -4, -3 -> 5 : -3, -1 -> 5 :. -3, -1 -> 5 : -2, 1 -> 5 } negate negative ~ {. 0, 1 -> 1 . 0, 2 -> 2 . 0, 3 -> 3 } negate negative ~ ; inc < 1294465439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shit < 1294465441 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: negate negative ~ {:. -5, -5 -> 5 : -4, -3 -> 5 :. -4, -3 -> 5 : -3, -1 -> 5 :. -3, -1 -> 5 : -2, 1 -> 5 } negate negative ~ {. 0, 1 -> 1 . 0, 2 -> 2 . 0, 3 -> 3 } negate negative ~ ; inc < 1294465441 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exception: Can't compile negate negative(is zero?) :( < 1294465460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: is zero? ~ {.0->1} is zero?~{.1 ->0 .2->0} is zero?~; #0; #1 < 1294465461 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is zero?: [id(#0)] <= [0 1] |.(0) => #1 |.(_) => #0 < 1294465463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: negate negative ~ {:. -5, -5 -> 5 : -4, -3 -> 5 :. -4, -3 -> 5 : -3, -1 -> 5 :. -3, -1 -> 5 : -2, 1 -> 5 } negate negative ~ {. 0, 1 -> 1 . 0, 2 -> 2 . 0, 3 -> 3 } negate negative ~ ; inc < 1294465464 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negate negative: [is zero?(#0)] |^(0) => #2 <= {(0,0): inc(#0); (0,1): inc(inc(#1))} |.(1) => #1 < 1294465476 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294465478 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is beautiful < 1294465492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: negate positive ~ {:. 5, 5 -> -5 : 4, 3 -> -5 :. 4, 3 -> -5 : 3, 1 -> -5 :. 3, 1 -> -5 : 2, -1 -> -5 } negate positive ~ {. 0, 1 -> 1 . 0, 2 -> 2 . 0, 3 -> 3 } negate positive ~ ; dec < 1294465492 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negate positive: [is zero?(#0)] |^(0) => #2 <= {(0,0): dec(#0); (0,1): dec(dec(#1))} |.(1) => #1 < 1294465504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like how the ast dumps are nicer than the actual code < 1294465512 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no they aren't < 1294465519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: negate ~ {. -1 -> 1 . -2 -> 2 . -3 -> 3 }negate ~ {. 0 -> 0 . 1 -> -1 . 2 -> -2 }negate ~ ; negate positive; negate negative < 1294465520 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negate: [is negative?(#0)] |.(1) => negate negative(#0 #0) |.(0) => negate positive(#0 #0) < 1294465526 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: sub ~ {.1,3->-2 .2,1->1 .-3,-2 -> -1} sub ~ <_>; add; negate < 1294465527 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sub: [_(#0)] |.(_) => add(#0 negate(#1)) < 1294465528 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: enjoy sub < 1294465531 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are not nearly as nice < 1294465536 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thx < 1294465543 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.:. parity helper ~ { . 0, 0 -> 0 . 0, 1 -> 1 } parity helper ~ { :. 5, 1 -> 0 : 4, 0 -> 0 :. 3, 0 -> 1 : 2, 1 -> 1 } parity helper ~ ; compare; #0; #1; sub < 1294465544 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :parity helper: [id(#0)] <= [0 1] |.(0) => #3 |^(_) => #4 <= {(0,0): sub(#2 #1); (0,1): compare(#1 #3)} < 1294465549 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm what < 1294465553 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :happened < 1294465570 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh. < 1294465590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: look right? :P < 1294465612 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. parity helper (5, 3) < 1294465613 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ValueError: substring not found :( < 1294465623 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294465625 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm... too tired < 1294465628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. parity helper(5,3) < 1294465628 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ValueError: substring not found :( < 1294465629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294465631 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294465632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: commas duh < 1294465634 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. parity helper (5 3) < 1294465634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we don't do commas ere < 1294465634 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 < 1294465634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :here < 1294465639 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. parity helper (5 4) < 1294465640 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 < 1294465642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. parity helper (3 4) < 1294465643 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 < 1294465644 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. parity helper (5 1) < 1294465644 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 < 1294465645 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. parity helper (0 0) < 1294465646 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 < 1294465648 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. parity helper (5 0) < 1294465649 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 < 1294465649 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. parity helper (-2 1) < 1294465649 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RuntimeError: maximum recursion depth exceeded in __instancecheck__ :( < 1294465653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...:D < 1294465656 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. parity helper (3 0) < 1294465656 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 < 1294465659 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. parity helper (3 1) < 1294465659 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 < 1294465662 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay it works < 1294465663 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's parity helper(-2 1) meant to be < 1294465668 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an error < 1294465708 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh good < 1294465729 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: parity ~ {. 3 -> 1 . 2 -> 0 . 1 -> 1 } parity ~ <_>; #0; parity helper < 1294465730 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :parity: [_(#0)] <= [0] |.(_) => parity helper(#1 #0) < 1294465737 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... parity ( 5 ) < 1294465738 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ValueError: substring not found :( < 1294465742 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... parity (5) < 1294465742 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 < 1294465745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294465745 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... parity (8) < 1294465746 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 < 1294465748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a bug for sure :) < 1294465760 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno about that, but i love clue again < 1294465770 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i could just hack up some crappy special casing for lists < 1294465783 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because those are impossible to brute force together < 1294465809 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas in numerical algos, i always completely underestimate the speed < 1294465834 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, when that parity helper compiled, i assumed it was an error message because it was so fast, never seen anything happen that fast with lists < 1294465846 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294465992 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i should sleep now < 1294465998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can have cluebot.py tomorrow or something < 1294466016 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294466025 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294466047 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue cluecleucluceluceluceluceluceluclueclueclue < 1294466061 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tomorrow's retro language: toi < 1294466080 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::> < 1294466127 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you been here before oklopol? < 1294466150 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION blinks at hagb4rd  < 1294466188 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yess.. im the noob i know < 1294466208 0 :TLUL!~TLUL@wikia/The-last-username-left JOIN :#esoteric < 1294466221 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have, yes :P < 1294466245 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :been ircing kinda lazily lately < 1294466252 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah.. < 1294466258 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since i have irl stuff i should be doing < 1294466262 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294466316 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...or maybe graphica :D < 1294466347 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just realized graphica has kind of a similar syntax as clue < 1294466378 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe ef, although i have no idea how that thing works....... < 1294466404 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a good point to start < 1294466466 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isnt it? :) < 1294466518 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it's a verrry old language < 1294466864 0 :TLUL!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294467199 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i really like this chan..must admit i haven't found anything comparable on the whole wide irc net < 1294467280 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, didn't mean to accidentally offend you < 1294467287 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just that oklopol has been here for a long time < 1294467297 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION continues to fail to eat < 1294467298 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :u didn't :> < 1294467327 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Glad to.. see that < 1294467334 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION emotion-ills < 1294467433 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION hits Sgeo with the saucepan ===\__/ < 1294467442 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HOPE THAT HELPS < 1294467544 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: when did you come? < 1294467563 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was a very rare moment of sanity you saw there, i arranged it just for you < 1294467576 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we were talking about porn when you entered < 1294467590 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes.. thanks for that :) < 1294467598 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes home < 1294467601 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its up to a month or sth < 1294467602 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1294467607 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not longer < 1294467619 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i still dont understand anything < 1294467638 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, thats kind of good news < 1294467666 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you seen any of my definition listings < 1294467667 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :looking for teachers and friends ya know < 1294467678 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1294467681 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i sometimes just define random math concepts < 1294467733 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: If you logread, I think I accidentally left Station V3 [and sister comics on occasion] off the list < 1294467758 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where do i have to look? < 1294467824 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the logs? < 1294467908 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i dunno about that < 1294467911 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was just wondering < 1294467919 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mainly to know whether i've been doing that lately < 1294468180 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats far behind my person insight so far..but it wouldnt surprise me at all < 1294468314 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn, my corroded-schoolenglish must be insulting, so please excuse.. im tryin to fix this < 1294468384 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*trying >:) < 1294468692 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and oerjan is send by the goodlord himself.. the good soul ..a real philanthrope :D < 1294468747 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :please just shut up and don't refuse ;) < 1294468794 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O KAY < 1294468800 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::> < 1294469057 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294469431 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1294469581 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm tired < 1294469588 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm about to start falling asleep on people < 1294469668 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that may not be advisable < 1294469819 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you considered taking a vacation sgeo? < 1294470105 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294470173 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :drink sangria in the park < 1294470185 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or feed some animals in the zoo < 1294470637 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1294472487 0 :cal153!~cal@c-24-4-207-72.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294473021 0 :zeotrope!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Lost terminal < 1294473599 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1294473600 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1294475718 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294475874 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294475969 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294476364 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1294478161 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1294478186 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294478415 0 :azaq231!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1294479165 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc1-sgyl29-2-0-cust788.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294479165 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294479165 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294479573 0 :impomatic!~chatzilla@146.88.113.87.dyn.plus.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294479578 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi :-) < 1294479596 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does anyone know when BF Joust and FYB were added to EgoBot? < 1294480042 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1294480190 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For BF Joust, i think it was approximately the same time as it was added to the wiki < 1294480217 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?title=BF_Joust&diff=14558&oldid=14535 < 1294480340 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for fukyorbrane, i have a vague idea that it was in the previous version of EgoBot as well. the wiki article is from before i joined here. < 1294480532 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course Gregor is the appropriate person to ask < 1294480663 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FYB was in EgoBot as long as both existed, more or less, but that was in the pregobot. < 1294480685 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's been in this EgoBot for considerably less time, the hg log is sure to elucidate: https://codu.org/projects/egobot/hg/ < 1294480738 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-6-114.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294480775 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20 months for FYB, 19 months for BFJoust. < 1294481495 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1294481564 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pregobot? < 1294482233 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294482302 0 :cheater00!~cheater@e181128130.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294482792 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, somehow I read that as "pogobot" first. (as in pogo-stick) < 1294482809 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294483865 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thanks :-) < 1294485864 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: 19 months is for the new version of BFJoust. Can you remember when it supported the original? < 1294485898 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This was the only version it ever supported. < 1294485904 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294485908 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294485942 0 :impomatic!~chatzilla@146.88.113.87.dyn.plus.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294485971 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Firefox always crashes when I click a link in ChatZilla :-( < 1294486022 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic, strange. < 1294486087 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Gregor: 19 months is for the new version of BFJoust. Can you remember when it supported the original? < 1294486087 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : This was the only version it ever supported. < 1294486106 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: sorry, I was thinking of the hill that used to be at http://faculty.washington.edu/kerim/nomic/bf/ :-) < 1294486119 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Snot mine! < 1294486127 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Besides, my BFJoust hill is more fair :P < 1294486738 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294486908 0 :cheater00!~cheater@e181137192.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294486966 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294487745 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294488017 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294488132 0 :MigoMipo_A!~MigoMipo@2.68.9.75 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294489047 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294489060 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION boggles at the stupidity of Windows anti-virus software. < 1294489117 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not unknown for Norton to identify itself as a virus, and both McAfee and AVG have deleted essential Windows files which they thought were viruses. < 1294489575 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, *McAfee, AVG and Norton < 1294490557 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294490998 0 :cheater00!~cheater@g230229133.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294491056 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: got any screenshots of Mt. Hoover? < 1294491068 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, I might... < 1294491329 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://imgur.com/d1Df9 < 1294491363 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's from a while ago; I've put a better lighting system in since and removed that small amount of dirt to the back of the room. < 1294491394 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, did you read logs? < 1294491399 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Nothing important] < 1294491402 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh thato's cool < 1294491427 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love how this game is like lemmings: Stuff does not just fall down < 1294491439 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sand and gravel does! < 1294491444 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The better lighting system in question is a layer of glass with lava on top. < 1294491446 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*) < 1294491451 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, I haven't read the logs, but I will now. < 1294491456 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And water and lava... are water and lava < 1294491459 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, sand and gravel falls though < 1294491500 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is more worthless? Gravel or gold? < 1294491537 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, probably gravel, unless you are draining. At least gold can be used for watches and you can also built nice looking thrones out of gold blocks < 1294491560 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, gravel is the only source of flint, which is very useful. < 1294491564 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, seems like it snows, rains and hails at the same time. < 1294491574 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gold can be used for nothing but watches and decoration. < 1294491575 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hm true < 1294492277 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And golden apples! < 1294492287 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, ahahahahahahahaha < 1294492321 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Golden apples are good for bragging rights; that's it. < 1294492432 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That sounds almost like a quote from the wiki < 1294492632 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Case in point: Vorpal getting his hands on one. < 1294492687 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, found it as a golden apple in a dungeon < 1294492702 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, and you went on about it for half an hour. < 1294492703 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never found even a normal apple in any local game or on SMP < 1294492713 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, no I mentioned it once. That was all < 1294492741 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You've probably secreted it in one of your super-secret underground bunkers in the wilderness. < 1294492785 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, nah, it is pretty useless really. Who would want it? < 1294492851 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If golden apples didn't require as much gold to make, would they be worth it? < 1294492935 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, I never found a normal apple yet and iirc they don't stack anyway < 1294493164 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, no, because you can just go out and punch some pigs if you need gold. < 1294493188 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are pigs a renewable resource? < 1294493214 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwo8qxUit00 < 1294493225 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: what do you do all night>? < 1294493255 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294493260 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Sgeo, no, because you can just go out and punch some pigs if you need gold. <-- ?? < 1294493269 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er, *food < 1294493298 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, unless you're on the move, setting up a mine would be worthwhile. < 1294493316 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh but I have a treehouse < 1294493349 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, and they don't stack either. I suggest carrying a work bench and a stack of wheat when exploring. Maybe one or two ready breads in case you need them urgently < 1294493354 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :saves space < 1294493470 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, if you aren't in a hurry to smelt and/or craft stuff, then deferring it to the night might relieve some boredom (and also let you get more stuff that needs daylight done during the day) < 1294493494 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I don't have any thing to smelt but I guess that's my problem < 1294493500 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :P.S. wyh is coal so hard to find?? < 1294493509 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I keep finding it before I learned how to make chests < 1294493511 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, are you mining for it? < 1294493515 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now I can store it I don't have any < 1294493524 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not sure < 1294493530 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do dig into the cobblestone < 1294493535 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, why not go back to the coal you found back then? < 1294493550 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's gone < 1294493555 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I already took it all < 1294493561 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, right then you used it I guess? < 1294493570 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I got kileld < 1294493574 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294493633 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, well you are likely to find more underground than when wandering the surface. As long as you have some torches (if you don't and can't find any surface coal you might be in a bit of a deadlock) it should be reasonably safe to mine < 1294493648 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :get some iron too, and make armour < 1294493650 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it's a deadlock < 1294493696 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, well try mining in the open. As in, dig down so you have sky visible at all times, rather than digging tunnels. < 1294493724 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clever < 1294493731 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, a lot more work though < 1294493742 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you will probably find coal soon enough < 1294493762 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, if you have monsters on securing the thing will be a pain. < 1294493781 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, do this at close to sea level btw, not at a mountain top. Reason for this is that you won't find iron above a certain altitude < 1294493830 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, you mean for the open thing. Well as soon as you find enough coal to make a handful of torches you can switch to a different mining system < 1294493856 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, however, it seems a decent way to break the deadlock :P < 1294493908 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm to have one chest for every block id define you would need 173 chests (twice if you want double chests of course) < 1294493918 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, not all are possible to get < 1294493962 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(such as fire, redstone ore, redstone-placed-on-ground, or similar) < 1294494008 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 Fry & Laurie < 1294494016 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And elliott will kill me for liking something good < 1294495212 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the hell < 1294495258 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, ? < 1294495504 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I loaded up the game in the spawnpoint instead of my treehouse :( < 1294495521 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't know why that happened < 1294495548 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, did you die? < 1294495552 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think so < 1294495824 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you avoid getting bored when hauled up in a 2x2x2 house at night? < 1294495864 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, if I'm on Peaceful, I don't need to bother with that, do I? < 1294496000 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: my question exactly :P < 1294496305 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294496423 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, you mine. < 1294496489 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how many bug reports he gets a day... < 1294496504 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, while trying to keep the house small so mobs don't spawn? < 1294496516 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, do you have no coal? < 1294496516 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Note: I have hard times finding coal in a rush] < 1294496521 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right. < 1294496567 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pass, then: I've never stuck at it in a world where I didn't get coal quickly. < 1294497457 0 :TLUL!~TLUL@wikia/The-last-username-left JOIN :#esoteric < 1294497635 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah, the fastest way to load all of minecraft world data into memory for map generation when it isn't cached into ram seems to be to prefetch it using find whatever/ -type f | xargs -P 4 -n 100 head -c1 > /dev/null. The files are small enough that this seems to load the entire files. And the parallel processes make it faster somehow (about 3.5 times as fast) . Could be NQC maybe, since I doubt a single < 1294497635 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :head process would try to read one file while waiting for the previous one. < 1294497787 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err NCQ* < 1294498667 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love teh way you make symbols in minecraft < 1294498692 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: are you a newbie at minecraft too? < 1294498711 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or haveu you had it for a while < 1294498885 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Symbols? < 1294498892 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, you mean the crafting interface. < 1294498914 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yies < 1294499936 0 :TLUL!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: *disappears in a puff of orange smoke* < 1294500309 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-6-114.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294501069 0 :TLUL!~TLUL@wikia/The-last-username-left JOIN :#esoteric < 1294501793 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294502003 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294502183 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294502393 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294502459 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1294502611 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294502714 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294503233 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294503525 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294503633 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294503641 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:55:27 have you been here before oklopol? < 1294503644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: no, he's very new < 1294503675 0 :aloril!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1294503735 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1294503753 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a whole bunch of creepers blew up in my face and killed me < 1294503756 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi elliott < 1294503768 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I went back to the spot to get my pick and they had revealed some coal < 1294503814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :03:28:47 Besides, my BFJoust hill is more fair :P < 1294503818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: They're MYYY rules! < 1294503821 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: :D < 1294503828 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: they destroy like 70% of blocks though < 1294503843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: p.s. you know you can fight from behind a door? < 1294503856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you place a door from the outside of your house, not the inside, then you can walk right up to it and hit things from there < 1294503863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a creeper you just keep whacking it with a sword until it goes away < 1294503889 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah cool < 1294503974 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: btw as far as finding coal goes < 1294503983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you probably *really* want a mine of some kind < 1294503994 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a "mine" < 1294504000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a proper mine, I mean :) < 1294504007 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I don't know what that is I guess < 1294504012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: the simplest kind is: just dig a shaft (doesn't matter how wide), diagonally, to bedrock (watch out for lava lakes near the bottom; you could stop there if you're lazy) < 1294504021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: then, you build 1-wide shafts off to the sides < 1294504027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: and then 1-wide shafts on both sides of *that* < 1294504031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :separated by, iirc, three blocks < 1294504044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or no wait < 1294504047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :separated by one block I think < 1294504052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: and basically you just dig along _those_ shafts, and whenever you find ore, you dig out that area < 1294504054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :watch out for caverns though < 1294504061 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you get much more ore like 10 above bedrock < 1294504066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: this method of mining is a bit tedious though < 1294504073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: another way to do it is just spelunking < 1294504080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: find caves, light them all up, get all their ore < 1294504096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: in fact, you can even use a staircase mine to find caverns... they often appear underneath the shafts, and you fall down :> < 1294504208 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Tutorials/Mining_Techniques < 1294504211 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : separated by one block I think <-- err, 2 blocks seem saner < 1294504217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, twob < 1294504220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*two blocks. < 1294504221 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right. < 1294504231 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more if you do a zip like layout < 1294504245 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where you alternate two alts, this stacks well < 1294504266 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no, that's overcomplicated < 1294504278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: the staircase mine method I mentioned, if done correctly, can have you see every block in the entire area < 1294504299 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not if you want to cover a specific altitude. sorry bbl < 1294504310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, you do see everything < 1294504466 0 :aloril!~aloril@dsl-tkubrasgw3-fe7ef900-153.dhcp.inet.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1294504695 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well yes but if you want to cover a narrow altitude range but one that is larger than 2 blocks high you have to dig away more blocks with your 2 wide separation scheme < 1294504720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :irrelevant, you still see it all < 1294504720 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also, do you shift the layers relative each other, or how do you take care of the non-visible corners? < 1294504732 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, each layer gets shifted right by one (IIRC) < 1294504779 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm you need a separation of one for that to work < 1294504780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have this feeling that normal mining isn't too practical in general though < 1294504783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it takes ages to get ore < 1294504886 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, actually the high density scheme works fairly well. Also it turns out that if you have a large area at your disposal, a less dense mining scheme which might miss some ores will yield more per dug away block. Due to that ores often comes in clumps. < 1294504917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my staircase mining method is just as high density, but easier to keep track of :) < 1294504941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1294504944 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think spelunking is easiest < 1294504949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :caverns have shitloads of ore < 1294504999 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway this is why shifting by one won't work with separation of two: http://sprunge.us/TIUA < 1294505033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, so separate by two like i said < 1294505041 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, err by one you mean < 1294505047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm. yes. < 1294505070 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the problem is finding good caverns. Some games you find lots in that go deep. Sometimes you hardly find any that goes deep enough to need torching < 1294505135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and sometimes your mountain has little ore < 1294505137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sucks 2b u < 1294505347 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, quite < 1294505365 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I have some single player games with awesome cavern systems though :) < 1294505408 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, btw, my basic mining scheme is this: http://sprunge.us/gMZH While it is indeed more complicated and requires some care to get it right, it is faster due to mining far fewer blocks per blocks seen. < 1294505424 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course, spelunking is probably the nicest way, at least on peaceful < 1294505444 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not so good if the cavern is overrun with monsters) < 1294505576 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, there was a quite interesting thread on the minecraft forums analysing this. I don't seem to be able to find it again though < 1294505647 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Someone needs to figure out the big-O of these mining schemes! < 1294505653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So that the forum can say "lol 0x=0 u stupid" < 1294505658 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I think that mining scheme is implementable in a staircase mine. < 1294505661 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, XD < 1294505679 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, yes, I don't see any problem combining them < 1294505682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Staircase mines with a drop shaft to the bottom are p. much the best! < 1294505701 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although seeing *every* block isn't really necessary. < 1294505722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I might start playing MC in a new way: on peaceful until I get an iron sword and armour, and then on hard. < 1294505727 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everything comes in clumps, so you can leave a line unchecked and not miss anything. < 1294505743 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover is right < 1294505747 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, anyway, I wouldn't use it except for the diamond ore altitude range. Because other ores tend to have large deposits so in practise you don't need to see every block to find a deposit. And the few 1x1 coal deposits out there aren't really worth the extra diggign < 1294505749 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :digging* < 1294505760 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, so it's a ratio blocks seen/blocks mined that you want to maximize? (and the limit of that as you mine to infinity, of course) < 1294505772 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gah, don't say what I intend to say while I'm writing it. ;P < 1294505781 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :minecraft is so addictive some people actually DO mine to infinity < 1294505804 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, can't in this case since it is a side view. And that has a limited range < 1294505840 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at some point you'll want to factor in whatever random algorithm is used to place valuables in the ground < 1294505863 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have this huge tunnel to a good place from the spawnpoint// < 1294505867 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: stop making DCSS fanboi comments that i have to reply to < 1294505869 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, yes quite. we did that :P < 1294505869 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the stream in it goes the wrong way < 1294505880 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, when we noted the thing about those clumps < 1294505931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i live on as little ore as possible due to laziness but let's pretend it's just my style < 1294505941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i need it i'll go get it! < 1294505946 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wait, is Sgeo speaking? < 1294505969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/eydlc/as_a_gamer_without_a_steady_internet_connection/c1bwz27 < 1294505976 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hmm, doesn't that actually *make* it your style to use as little ore as possible? < 1294505991 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Worse — he's replying to threads about NetHack on reddit with random factoids about how Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup is so great. < 1294506000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is just irritating, because (1) that's irrelevant and (2) it's a terrible game. < 1294506001 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yeah personally I do it like mplayer buffers (or at least how you claimed it appears to be buffering) < 1294506005 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: INDEED < 1294506023 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I thought yu were talking about the decryptomatic thing. < 1294506026 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*you < 1294506030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: that's DeCSS :P < 1294506032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mining is pretty much the most boring thing ever, so yeah i don't really do that < 1294506038 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :spelunking can be fun once in a while < 1294506148 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's slightly sad that this channel is now all about minecraft < 1294506163 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, yeah < 1294506167 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol's random walk method is great, I just found the Stairs accidentally < 1294506170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: >:) < 1294506175 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you're using minecraft for computation, because then it's suddenly on topic < 1294506183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: we did interesting stuff yesterday! esolang i mean < 1294506183 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, there is that red stone CPU in it < 1294506198 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes, we d id interesting mc computation stuff yesterday < 1294506198 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*did < 1294506204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :me and Phantom_Hoover invented THE BEST CIRCUIT SYSTEM EVER < 1294506212 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because redstone is shit < 1294506216 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool < 1294506221 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how is redstone shit as such? < 1294506229 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It also allows you to make nuclear reactors. < 1294506231 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, not *the* shit, but shit? < 1294506235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: yes < 1294506237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :redstone is crappy < 1294506241 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we redesigned it ... and half the game, but < 1294506244 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it can hardly interact with the environment < 1294506248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it has infinite power which is just no fun < 1294506255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and every circuit is gigantic < 1294506258 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well true. There are mods for interacting with environment though. < 1294506267 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes circuits are large < 1294506267 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :our way is the best :> < 1294506299 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am sad that civilisation gets little love now ... anyway < 1294506309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: we'd talk about interesting stuff if someone said anything, but nobody does :) < 1294506313 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, one think I would like is a lever that affects a wire to blocks below. So you can place a lever on ground and hide the wires < 1294506345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: hmm < 1294506348 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I know, sans the minecraft spam it'd just be completely quiet in here, and that could be more boring < 1294506352 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: easy, since you can cover bluestone'd blocks with other blocks < 1294506358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so just have a wire going underground and cover it with blocks :) < 1294506376 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: it's not like we used to be more on topic before, it was just more varied offtopic < 1294506384 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, sure you can use a 3 thick wall currently but that is not always a viable option. Such when I wanted a fire level on top of the wall of that fort. < 1294506390 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lever* < 1294506407 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yah, probably < 1294506416 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so speaking of on topic < 1294506433 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, s/f on/ff/ < 1294506467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1294506468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :watch < 1294506483 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION waits for on topicness < 1294506488 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stupid slow bot < 1294506496 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294506500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THAT'S ON TOPIC < 1294506506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. cons(1 2) < 1294506507 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TypeError: can only concatenate list (not "int") to list :( < 1294506508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. cons(1 []) < 1294506509 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[1] < 1294506512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. add(3 -4) < 1294506513 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-1 < 1294506523 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, which language? < 1294506524 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.: is list?([1 2 3]) < 1294506524 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 < 1294506529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... is list?(2) < 1294506529 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 < 1294506530 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Clue < 1294506534 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well, Clue plus my expression language < 1294506545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the actual interesting parts are done with :: (or any combination of : and . resulting in 4 dots) < 1294506558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :five dots looks up the compiled form of a given function < 1294506564 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, an esolang? It looks rather too sane for that < 1294506573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's just the expression language... < 1294506576 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah < 1294506579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is oklopol's language :) < 1294506588 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay likely extremely weird then < 1294506590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make singleton ~ {. 1 -> [1] < 1294506590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . [1, 2, 3] -> [[1, 2, 3]]} < 1294506590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make singleton ~ ; cons; #[] < 1294506593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ that's a function in clue < 1294506596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :turns x into [x < 1294506597 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :] < 1294506602 0 :cheater99!~cheater@e181130061.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294506613 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically, clue is programmed by giving a bunch of examples, and then telling it what functions it needs to use < 1294506614 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, [x] meaning? < 1294506616 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it solves all the rest by itself < 1294506618 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: um a list containing just x < 1294506619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously < 1294506624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. f x = [x] < 1294506627 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh so why the name singleton then < 1294506630 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seemed strange < 1294506633 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: because the list is a singleton < 1294506647 0 :TLUL!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: *disappears in a puff of orange smoke* < 1294506652 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :another example function < 1294506655 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 3 ~ {. 0 -> 0 } < 1294506655 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 3 ~ {. 1 -> 0 } < 1294506655 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 3 ~ {. 2 -> 0 } < 1294506657 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 3 ~ {. 3 -> 0 } < 1294506659 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 3 ~ {. 4 -> 1 < 1294506661 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 5 -> 1 } < 1294506663 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 3 ~ ; #0; #1 < 1294506677 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so.. how does it do this? Nearest example? < 1294506683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: eh? < 1294506684 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why are 4 and 5 in the same bracket? < 1294506688 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"nearest example"? < 1294506695 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I mean, how does it extrapolate from the examples < 1294506705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: something almost, but not entirely, like brute force < 1294506710 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it compiles the ski impl in 20 seconds < 1294506719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tehre's special syntax for doing recursion < 1294506720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*there's < 1294506723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: basically, means "branch using id" < 1294506729 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, okay. But that doesn't answer my question on how. < 1294506735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: so, the first branches are the branches for 0, 1, 2, 3, because it infers the branch as id(param) < 1294506736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is just param < 1294506739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: the last branch is default < 1294506744 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so contains everything above 3 < 1294506749 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how do you define something like sin() in it? < 1294506756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you don't, it just has integers and lists < 1294506768 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well lets say integer fixed point sin then :) < 1294506784 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: very, very slowly < 1294506804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll show you the compiles form of make singleton < 1294506821 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*compiled < 1294506825 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: make singleton ~ {. 1 -> [1] . [1, 2, 3] -> [[1, 2, 3]]} make singleton ~ ; cons; #[] < 1294506826 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make singleton: [id(#0)] <= [[]] |.(_) => cons(#1 #0) < 1294506842 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, so that <= [foo] means that it gets [] as the first parameter, because we told it it was a constant it needed < 1294506847 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's luatre? < 1294506853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so in the function body, #0 is [] < 1294506860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but in the condition, #0 is the parameter < 1294506864 0 :cheater00!~cheater@e181140108.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294506867 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm. Well what I'm trying to figure out is how it extrapolates. One obvious approach would be to use the examples to train an ANN for example. Another would be to compute a hyper-plane that separates the examples properly (this couldn't handle sin, or xor for example) < 1294506871 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I hope you're saving up all these discusfsions, where you show people how Clue works: And saving them into "clue.clue" < 1294506871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically, we switch on the argument, but only have a default (this is the same as having no branch) < 1294506878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it just conses the param with the constant param ([]) < 1294506881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: :D < 1294506884 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: clog is doing that for me! < 1294506895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ANN? no, no, this is precise < 1294506904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the SKI implementation is a _real_ SKI implementation < 1294506908 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that can handle any SKI form < 1294506940 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so hm, what does it do when there could be several different alternatives that would fit the given examples? < 1294506955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: then your program is bad... but that's why you use hints < 1294506971 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, will it error out or? < 1294506980 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i managed to implement subtraction and abs, fwiw, when all there was was add, and no negate < 1294506986 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks to help from oklopol < 1294507015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no, if it manages to generate a function using the functions in the bag you specified, using the conditional function you specified, meeting your recursion scheme (if you have one), and fitting all the examples in their corresponding branches < 1294507025 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294507026 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: then it'll use that function, but ... if you write it properly there's only one function it can really generate < 1294507033 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that more than 3, does it handle -1? < 1294507035 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the importance of the bag < 1294507039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: let's find out < 1294507047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it'll say that -1 is more than three < 1294507052 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294507062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because anything that isn't 0, 1, 2, or 3 gets true, basically < 1294507064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you could easily fix it < 1294507074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by having another case ... or even just a wrapper function < 1294507076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that checks for negativity < 1294507081 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, presumably you could make it extrapolate in both directions? < 1294507093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't "extrapolate"... < 1294507097 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is not guessing, it is very precise < 1294507099 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, okay, bad word < 1294507114 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294507126 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: basically, no, because you'd still need to switch on whether it's negative < 1294507128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's easy < 1294507129 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1294507131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: more than 3 ~ {. 0 -> 0 } more than 3 ~ {. 1 -> 0 } more than 3 ~ {. 2 -> 0 } more than 3 ~ {. 3 -> 0 } more than 3 ~ {. 4 -> 1 . 5 -> 1 } more than 3 ~ ; #0; #1 < 1294507131 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 3: [id(#0)] <= [0 1] |.(0) => #0 |.(1) => #0 |.(2) => #0 |.(3) => #0 |.(_) => #1 < 1294507144 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, i can see straight away that that will think -1 is more than three < 1294507160 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(if you can't, maybe you're not good enough at understanding my compiled syntax form) < 1294507247 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294507247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: here's an implementation of negate, subtract, and abs http://sprunge.us/gOPE < 1294507254 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the :. : bit is the recursion schemes < 1294507280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: is negative? ~ {. -1 -> 1 . -2 -> 1 } is negative? ~ {. 0 -> 0 } is negative? ~ {. 1 -> 0 . 2 -> 0 } is negative? ~ ; compare; #0; #1 < 1294507280 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is negative?: [id(compare(#0 compare(#0 #0)))] <= [0 1] |.(-1) => #1 |.(0) => #0 |.(1) => #0 < 1294507284 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294507291 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that compare(#0 #0) is quite amusing, it's 0 obviously < 1294507300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the brancher can't access the constants < 1294507303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since it doesn't get them yet < 1294507307 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it doesn't use the examples in a very clever way it seems < 1294507307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it couldn't just use teh constant 0 it's given < 1294507308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*the < 1294507310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it figured out what 0 is :) < 1294507322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: what do you mean? < 1294507328 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you generally don't need many of them at all < 1294507339 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's more in my negating functions because i made a mistake earlier < 1294507362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: take a look at this < 1294507384 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: negate negative ~ {:. -5, -5 -> 5 : -4, -3 -> 5 :. -4, -3 -> 5 : -3, -1 -> 5 :. -3, -1 -> 5 : -2, 1 -> 5 } negate negative ~ {. 0, 1 -> 1 . 0, 2 -> 2 . 0, 3 -> 3 } negate negative ~ ; inc < 1294507384 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exception: Can't compile negate negative(is zero?) :( < 1294507388 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh :D < 1294507399 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: is zero? ~ {. 0 -> 1 } is zero? ~ {. 1 -> 0 . 2 -> 0 } is zero? ~ ; #0; #1 < 1294507399 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is zero?: [id(#0)] <= [0 1] |.(0) => #1 |.(_) => #0 < 1294507405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: negate negative ~ {:. -5, -5 -> 5 : -4, -3 -> 5 :. -4, -3 -> 5 : -3, -1 -> 5 :. -3, -1 -> 5 : -2, 1 -> 5 } negate negative ~ {. 0, 1 -> 1 . 0, 2 -> 2 . 0, 3 -> 3 } negate negative ~ ; inc < 1294507405 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negate negative: [is zero?(#0)] |^(0) => #2 <= {(0,0): inc(#0); (0,1): inc(inc(#1))} |.(1) => #1 < 1294507410 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well hard to explain what i mean < 1294507413 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: see negate negative in that sprunge up there < 1294507417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :17:22 luatre: negate negative: [is zero?(#0)] |^(0) => #2 <= {(0,0): inc(#0); (0,1): inc(inc(#1))} |.(1) => #1 < 1294507419 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it figures that out < 1294507423 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :based on the recursion scheme and base case < 1294507428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is pretty good, if you ask me < 1294507435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to translate that inferred function to haskell: < 1294507449 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294507462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negneg x y | not (isZero x) = negneg (x+1) (y+1+1) < 1294507466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| otherwise = y < 1294507514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: anyway it is the best and most expressive language ever :D < 1294507517 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just...kinda hard to use < 1294507517 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is puzzled by a clearly visible Sony TV in Red Dwarf. < 1294507522 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well sure. But it takes rather a lot of code to do it < 1294507533 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and yes, sure it is nice. < 1294507539 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really < 1294507540 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not because of the anachronism, but because I thought that violated the BBC's anti-product-placement rules. < 1294507543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll write negate negative shorter < 1294507559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i added the extra test cases because i was paranoid when it broke once < 1294507577 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294507579 0 :aloril!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1294507614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: negate negative 2 electric boogaloo ~ {:. -5,-5 -> 5 : -4,-3 -> 5 :. -4,-3 -> 5 : -3,-1 -> 5 } negative negative 2 electric boogaloo ~ {. 0,1 -> 1} negative negative 2 electric boogaloo ~ ; inc < 1294507614 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TypeError: 'NoneType' object is not iterable :( < 1294507622 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: negate negative 2 electric boogaloo ~ {:. -5,-5 -> 5 : -4,-3 -> 5 :. -4,-3 -> 5 : -3,-1 -> 5 } negative negative 2 electric boogaloo ~ {. 0,1 -> 1} negate negative 2 electric boogaloo ~ ; inc < 1294507623 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TypeError: 'NoneType' object is not iterable :( < 1294507626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i fail at spelling < 1294507632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: negate negative 2 electric boogaloo ~ {:. -5,-5 -> 5 : -4,-3 -> 5 :. -4,-3 -> 5 : -3,-1 -> 5 } negate negative 2 electric boogaloo ~ {. 0,1 -> 1} negate negative 2 electric boogaloo ~ ; inc < 1294507633 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negate negative 2 electric boogaloo: [is zero?(#0)] |^(0) => #2 <= {(0,0): inc(#0); (0,1): inc(inc(#1))} |.(1) => #1 < 1294507642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: in long form, that code is just: < 1294507644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negate negative ~ {:. -5, -5 -> 5 < 1294507644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : -4, -3 -> 5 < 1294507644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : :. -4, -3 -> 5 < 1294507646 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : -3, -1 -> 5 } < 1294507648 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negate negative ~ {. 0, 1 -> 1 } < 1294507650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negate negative ~ ; inc < 1294507673 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm okay < 1294507677 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294507685 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : negate negative ~ ; inc <-- inc? < 1294507692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :inc is just x->x+1 < 1294507697 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes quite < 1294507702 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but what's more, i can prove it < 1294507704 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but why does it need to increment? < 1294507716 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: um because the algorithm works by doing f (x+1) (y+2) < 1294507719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see the compiled form < 1294507732 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: succ ~ {. 0 -> 1 . 1 -> 2 . 2 -> 3} succ ~ <_>; inc < 1294507734 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :succ: [_(#0)] |.(_) => inc(#0) < 1294507738 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PROOF < 1294507746 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right. < 1294507752 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_ is just _(x) = 0 < 1294507756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. _([1 2 3]) < 1294507756 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 < 1294507767 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if you gave negate negative ~ ; it would fin dhe other program? < 1294507778 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what do you mean? < 1294507778 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sqrt(x^2) instead of if x<0 then -x else x < 1294507793 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well you would do <_>; sqrt square < 1294507794 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although sqrt may be difficult to implement < 1294507796 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but yes, it would probably get that < 1294507804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you mean sqrt being separate < 1294507807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well you would do <_>; sqrt; square < 1294507811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would probably get it, yes < 1294507812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite easily < 1294507814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but doing sqrt would be a bitch < 1294507829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: here's the ski impl: http://sprunge.us/gdNj < 1294507834 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you do sqrt? :D < 1294507837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*impl: http://sprunge.us/gdNj < 1294507849 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: would be much more readable if s, k and i could be something other than constant integers, but < 1294507850 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, heh < 1294507861 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: not really :) ... you could probably do newton's method? < 1294507889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it's actually a wonderful program < 1294507891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski apply especially < 1294507893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is very pretty < 1294507898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also note that :s after the first in a :. are ignored < 1294507900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're documentation < 1294507909 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well... or i think they are tested < 1294507909 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, just write a soft floating point library in it. In theory it is possible since it is TC. But likely infeasible. < 1294507913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they aren't used for generating the recursion scheme < 1294507920 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how long did ski take to compile? < 1294507926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i'll measure < 1294507938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: note that the implementation has many, many really stupid things < 1294507948 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :such as? < 1294507952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :def is_function(a): < 1294507952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : try: < 1294507952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : a() < 1294507953 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : except Exception,e: < 1294507956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if str(e)[-12:]=="not callable": < 1294507958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return False < 1294507959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return True < 1294507962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :things like that :) < 1294507967 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :python, eww < 1294507968 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it also calls functions during compilation like 138917491238912379x more than itn eeds to < 1294507969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*it needs < 1294507973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not python < 1294507978 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's oklopython < 1294507982 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did oklopol write it? < 1294507985 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294507994 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how does that differ from normal python? < 1294508000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# glue is just a helper for glue_ < 1294508000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# we add recipes to objects < 1294508000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :def glue(functions,applier,applicabler,objects,condition): < 1294508002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : objectswithrecipes=[] < 1294508003 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I expected BETTER < 1294508004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : for i in xrange(len(objects)): < 1294508006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : l=(lambda j:lambda app,*args:args[j])(i) < 1294508007 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, it's crazier. < 1294508008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : objectswithrecipes.append((objects[i],l,"#"+str(i))) < 1294508009 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return glue_(functions,applier,applicabler,objectswithrecipes,condition,5,objects) < 1294508011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's how < 1294508021 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, but it uses the same interpreter as normal python? < 1294508034 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is actaully not the most oklo python i've ever seen, that would be the oklotalk-- impl < 1294508048 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is how I mine http://sprunge.us/SbMK < 1294508057 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :def funthatreturnsntharg(i): < 1294508057 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return lambda*args:args[i] < 1294508061 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's my favourite name for a function tbh < 1294508065 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : # glue is just a helper for glue_ <-- that sounds like a weird naming scheme < 1294508085 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, he meant wrapper? < 1294508088 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll compile ski now < 1294508109 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :always seem to find coal if you just do it for long enough < 1294508120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 17.8115589619 seconds < 1294508123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to compile everything in that paste i showed < 1294508129 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, on what sort of hardware? < 1294508133 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice thing about Clue is you don't have to test the program! < 1294508147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: um 2.1ghz core 2, 4 gigs of ram... i don't think it's ram intensive < 1294508148 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just very slow < 1294508149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: naturally < 1294508152 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, right. < 1294508153 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Tested by construction" as opposed to "Correct by construction" that we do in Epigram < 1294508157 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL < 1294508200 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a whole program paradigm based around testing: I can hardly beleive it's not subsumed java/C# etc by now < 1294508203 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: recompiling ski now so i can show the asts in my form < 1294508204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ghetto ast) < 1294508213 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, knowing python you would probably get a 3x speed improvement if you switched to another language. < 1294508220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is actually less ghetto than oklopol's: < 1294508221 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- depth of first < 1294508222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Condition: is list?('#0') < 1294508222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (0) < 1294508224 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'#0' < 1294508225 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rec branch (1) < 1294508228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Subast(0,0):['car', '#1'] < 1294508230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Main ast: ['inc', '#2'] < 1294508232 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you would get a 3x speed improvement just removing all the stupid shit from the impl < 1294508241 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hah < 1294508267 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: < 1294508270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- ski apply < 1294508270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ski type?(#0)] < 1294508270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(0) => #0 < 1294508271 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|^(1) => #1 <= {(0,0): car(cdr(#0))} < 1294508272 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, try it with pypy? < 1294508273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|^(2) => #1 <= {(0,0): cadar(#0)} < 1294508275 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|^(3) => #3 <= {(0,0): pair(cadaar(#0) car(cdr(#0))); (1,0): pair(cadar(#0) car(cdr(#0))); (2,0): pair(#1 #2)} < 1294508277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|^(4) => #2 <= {(0,0): car(#0); (1,0): pair(#1 car(cdr(#0)))} < 1294508279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe. :p < 1294508282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some simple memoisation would help. < 1294508289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also impressive: < 1294508290 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- ski type? < 1294508290 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[id(cons(deep first(#0) make singleton(depth of first(#0))))] <= [0 1] < 1294508291 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.([1, 0]) => #0 < 1294508293 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.([2, 0]) => #0 < 1294508295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.([3, 0]) => #0 < 1294508297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.([2, 1]) => #0 < 1294508299 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.([3, 2]) => #0 < 1294508301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.([3, 1]) => #0 < 1294508302 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh < 1294508303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(_) => deep first with cutoff(#2) < 1294508307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's pretty good at figuring out conditions :) < 1294508312 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294508319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the id(x) thing is just because this version of the lang is stupid < 1294508324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the stuff is... basically totally unnecessary < 1294508342 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it should be able to automatically strip id() off anything < 1294508351 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no, it should just not need < 1294508356 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the reason it has id there is because oko did < 1294508359 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :; ... < 1294508363 0 :aloril!~aloril@dsl-tkubrasgw3-fe7ef900-153.dhcp.inet.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1294508365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the normal conditional form can only handle one argument and shit < 1294508367 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's stupid < 1294508375 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294508421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- depth of first < 1294508421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[is list?(#0)] <= [0] < 1294508421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(0) => #0 < 1294508424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|^(1) => inc(#2) <= {(0,0): car(#1)} < 1294508424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- deep first < 1294508426 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[is list?(#0)] < 1294508429 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(0) => #0 < 1294508430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|^(1) => #1 <= {(0,0): car(#0)} < 1294508432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- deep first with cutoff < 1294508434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[id(more than 3(depth of first(#0)))] <= [4] < 1294508436 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(0) => deep first(#1) < 1294508438 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(1) => #0 < 1294508440 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ that's quite an interesting block of functions. < 1294508449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :remember that in the body, rather than the brancher/conditional, the args are all N forward < 1294508452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where N is the number of constants < 1294508457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the first N are the constants shown :) < 1294508533 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294508561 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should probably explain the ast format < 1294508562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shouldn't i < 1294508585 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure why not, got a bit busy RL now though < 1294508620 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll wait then, gotta have someone hearing my blabbering < 1294509451 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294509458 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how the thell do I take a screenshot of minecraft/ < 1294509567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: F1+F2 < 1294509570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :F1 to turn on camera, F2 to screenshot < 1294509574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :goes in ~/.minecraft/screenshots < 1294509746 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :morning < 1294509793 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi oklopol < 1294509799 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you want cluebot.py < 1294509958 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" Which is more worthless? Gravel or gold?" <<< gravel, you can make armor out of gold. < 1294509975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: gold armour lasts like 0 seconds < 1294509976 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is useless < 1294510305 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294510784 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1294510804 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's *slightly* better than leather IIRC. < 1294510934 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" also note that :s after the first in a :. are ignored" <<< that's not true! < 1294510950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i clarified < 1294510956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: they're tested but don't go towards making the recursion scheme < 1294510957 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right? < 1294510966 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are when recursion branches multiple times, like you'd expect < 1294510994 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well...whatever :D < 1294511006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negate negative ~ {:. -5, -5 -> 5 < 1294511006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : -4, -3 -> 5 < 1294511006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : :. -4, -3 -> 5 < 1294511008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : -3, -1 -> 5 < 1294511010 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : :. -3, -1 -> 5 < 1294511012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : -2, 1 -> 5 } < 1294511014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so is there a better way to write that < 1294511031 0 :Slereah!~butt@ANantes-259-1-71-195.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1294511200 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you write prime factorization? < 1294511215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: um :D < 1294511218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: do prime factorisation < 1294511230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you can do pretty much any recursive algorithm ... as long as each step can also be done ... prolly < 1294511254 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" oklopol: gold armour lasts like 0 seconds" <<< not really < 1294511262 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :twice as good as leather < 1294511267 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they always double < 1294511269 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: don't you have...iron < 1294511275 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and chainmail is between gold and iron < 1294511275 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iron is 100000x superior to gold < 1294511278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and lasts like 100000x longer < 1294511279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what < 1294511286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: chainmail is impossible to get without inventory editing < 1294511292 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also stops all damage < 1294511315 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" well...whatever :D" <<< it's just the way you explained it sounded like things like quicksort would indeed not be possible < 1294511324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1294511337 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought you thought you can't recurse multiple times, but just tail < 1294511348 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm except not tail because many examples are non-tail < 1294511364 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oklopol: so is there a better way to write that <<< one or two examples is enough < 1294511371 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh yes indeed < 1294511373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just meant would : be useful < 1294511402 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" can you write prime factorization?" <<< i believe it's possible to compile a simple imperative language to this, and prove some sort of bound on compilation speed < 1294511410 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, referenced bad line maybe < 1294511448 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" oklopol: don't you have...iron" <<< i have iron, yes. all i'm saying is if sand was much easier to find than gravel, would you say gravel is worthless because it doesn't fall < 1294511464 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(because sand is easier to get and falls oh so much nicer) < 1294511477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well sure < 1294511481 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you have gold and gravel, and a bunch of creepers coming, gold is better. < 1294511497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: certainly, but if i have iron and all the usual necessities, < 1294511501 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and your life is more precious than emptying seas < 1294511504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: then i'd rather have a bunch of gravel than gold ... probably ... maybe not < 1294511508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only cuz of the cube :) < 1294511575 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's clear that gold has no actual use, usually < 1294511582 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except the exeptions < 1294511585 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*exc < 1294511616 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway personally i'm more happy finding gold than gravel < 1294511624 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i'm sure i would be even if gold wasn't valuable irl < 1294511639 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gold blocks are pretty, and gold is rare, that's enough. < 1294511698 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah i'm sure you all wouldn't even mine gold, just like you don't mine anything else you find < 1294511725 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cuz you already have a lifetime stock of almost one whole stack of it < 1294511751 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so seriously, i slept all day < 1294511764 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i went to sleep at sunrise, and it's now been dark for a while < 1294511774 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have an exam on monday :( < 1294511779 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll probably fail AS USUAL < 1294511790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/Q0GSe.jpg < 1294511790 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw checked < 1294511805 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after looking at the numbers, i notice chainmail is actually weaker than gold < 1294511808 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1294511813 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you fail exams? :P < 1294511823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, yeah, chainmail is weak, but ... dude, it stops all your damage < 1294511851 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i actually failed an exam once, it was about using windows and unix < 1294511866 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you had to get everything right, apparently i fucked something up in the excel part < 1294511881 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or was it the unix part, maybe i wasn't able to unzip something < 1294511892 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't remember, i hate computers anyway < 1294511903 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294511932 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but anyway not being able to solve a problem in the exam is as good as failing, and that i've done a lot < 1294511955 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance, in a recent exam, there was this problem that i couldn't solve (and later proved impossible) < 1294511959 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: really? < 1294511976 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so everyone got a 100% from the prob < 1294511996 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really what < 1294512000 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i said a whole bunch of things < 1294512141 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, basically what i could do is, instead of doing brute force search (which already discards multiples), i do a kind of variant of a*, so that if an operation *simplifies* another object, it's applied first < 1294512154 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where list simplicity is just its size as a tree < 1294512160 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: um are you talking about clue now < 1294512175 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this will later be made pure, since this is just a special case of a strategy < 1294512184 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but for now, it's let me write things like quicksort < 1294512200 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: why not < 1294512210 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i meant that as in < 1294512219 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"yeah sure, you may interpret this as clue talk" < 1294512243 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but surprisingly, there's also an implicit "yes" < 1294512250 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh shit shoppe -> < 1294512381 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, hm, couldn't means-ends analysis work for clue (if that was it was about) < 1294512719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: so can i tell you ast yet < 1294512720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*so can < 1294512723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or are you still real-life-crapping < 1294512731 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"crapping"? < 1294512746 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like < 1294512747 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thingsing < 1294512751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except life is boring so things=crap < 1294512753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's crapping! < 1294512770 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, sure, tell me. < 1294512777 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is now known as /dev/null < 1294512796 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: psht fine then i won't < 1294512798 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, or why not tell someone else, sure clue was interesting, the ast not so much < 1294512811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the ast is just the shit that shows you waht it actually compiles to < 1294512814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is the only way to understand it < 1294512823 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh okay < 1294512838 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so it compiles to ast? (what?) < 1294512846 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes, before it compiles to a python function < 1294512847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay so < 1294512849 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[id(#0)] <= [0 1] < 1294512849 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(0) => #0 < 1294512850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(1) => #0 < 1294512852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(2) => #0 < 1294512854 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(3) => #0 < 1294512856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(_) => #1 < 1294512858 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically < 1294512861 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every clue function is of the form < 1294512890 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes? < 1294512907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\a1 a2 a3 ... -> (\c1 c2 c3 ... a1 a2 a3 ... -> case B of x -> ...; y -> ...; z -> ...; [and optionally] _ -> ...) cv1 cv2 cv3 ... a1 a2 a3 ... < 1294512913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :c1,c2,c3 are the constants < 1294512916 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294512917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and cv1,2,3 are their values < 1294512923 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, this is pseudo-haskell? < 1294512924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :B is the branching expression < 1294512926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294512929 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294512938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, here, in this ghetto ast form, [x] in the top line is the branching expression (B) < 1294512951 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are two constants; c1's value is 0, and c2's value is 1 < 1294512957 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and these get passed as the first two arguments to the function itself < 1294512963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas the branching expression just sees the actual arguments < 1294512965 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem with inference atm, is that you have things that build bigger things in your bag, now say you want to find a certain thing inside a list, should be easy because even though you need a depth 3 expression for that, there's only a finite amount of sublists, so just look at them all; unfortunately, by simply using cons, at level 3, you'll be looking at millions and millions of lists < 1294512971 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you don't indent the ast to make it easier to follow? < 1294512977 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, this switches on id(first arg), i.e. the first arg < 1294512987 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 to [first arg], same with 1 2 3; anything else to [second arg] < 1294512992 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in this case, the first arg is 0, and the second 1 < 1294512994 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those are the two constants < 1294513001 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can see this because after the branching expression it has "<= [0 1]" < 1294513003 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is the list of constants < 1294513007 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294513008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: doesn't need it? < 1294513009 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so really i could probably make it faster by *adding every sublist* in the set of objects currently usable in expressions < 1294513013 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :functions all follow this form < 1294513050 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: oh and function arguments are just written adjacent < 1294513051 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no commas < 1294513052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: so, now, considering some recursion < 1294513060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[is zero?(#0)] < 1294513060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|^(0) => #2 <= {(0,0): inc(#0); (0,1): inc(inc(#1))} < 1294513060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(1) => #1 < 1294513064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :booleans are just done as integers here < 1294513069 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ means it's a recursive branch < 1294513073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are no constants here < 1294513082 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but we can see, if the parameter is zero, we just return the second parameter < 1294513086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because #n is the nth parameter < 1294513092 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it's not, we get recursion < 1294513102 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, there's 1 recursion here < 1294513108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the first element of the recursion pairs is always 0 < 1294513110 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meaning first recursion < 1294513119 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, this isn't the AST. This is a human representation of the AST. Or if it is the AST, why the hell are you working on it in a textual form in the program ;) < 1294513120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(consider fib, which would have two, and so would have first-elements of 1) < 1294513127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes, it's the representation of the ast < 1294513131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is important for figuring out what the function does < 1294513146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ok, so that list basically says: the first recursion has first parameter inc(#0) and second parameter inc(inc(#1)) < 1294513152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is first param + 1, and second param + 2, respectively < 1294513155 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wouldn't looking at the compiled result work? Or is that unreadable? < 1294513173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the result of this recursion is treated as an extra parameter to the function < 1294513183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in this case, we just return the subrecursion with no processing -- i.e. it's tail recursive < 1294513189 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so if ^ is recursive then . is a base case? < 1294513190 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294513191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: this IS the compiled result < 1294513203 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the ast is hard to follow because instead of writing it in sexp-like form, you name subtrees, and just say (cons #4 #6) where #4 and #6 are the fourth and sixth expressions defined < 1294513204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the compiled-compiled result is just a python function which processes the ast list when called < 1294513206 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I can't deal with Haskell - Ishould program in Scheme < 1294513216 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294513220 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ew < 1294513230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Brainfuck/w/index.php%3Ftitle%3DTalk:Brainfuck/index.php#Implementation proof that scheme is best language < 1294513231 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why not compile it to haskell or something < 1294513235 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1294513243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: um because the impl is written in python < 1294513244 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an interpreter < 1294513258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: also because the language isn't lazy/ < 1294513260 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* < 1294513261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*? < 1294513264 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a kinda stupid question. < 1294513267 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but the actual interpretation doesn't look complicated? < 1294513274 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of the ast I mean < 1294513277 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :fum < 1294513280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that's why most of the code is the other parts. < 1294513290 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think i'm going to change the ghetto_ast to show recursion normally < 1294513296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, as actual applications < 1294513298 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh I thought it was. Well compiling to scheme then? < 1294513313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: that would require a python implementation _and_ a scheme implementation and vastly complicate everything < 1294513334 0 :fum!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :augur < 1294513337 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, we could move away from python. This alone would speed it up < 1294513345 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: do you drop the main branch? i can't see it in "is zero?" < 1294513349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yeah cuz scheme is sooooooooooooo fast < 1294513361 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well there is one compiler < 1294513362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: the main branch being what in particular? < 1294513366 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, forgot the name of it < 1294513370 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tbh that was the first nontrivial one i actually gave some thought to, apart from "mm correct general feel" < 1294513378 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: restricted subset of r4rs. also, oklo python is beautiful < 1294513391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what was the fisrt nontrivial one you actually gave some thought to < 1294513391 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm what < 1294513391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*first < 1294513397 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"is zero?" is, i just realized < 1294513399 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what is it that makes it oklo? < 1294513405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D < 1294513405 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"is zero?", and not "negate negative" < 1294513408 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the weird thing with exception handling? < 1294513409 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: oklo < 1294513419 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: the main branch is between => and <= < 1294513420 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no < 1294513425 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i assumed it was negate negative, because of the incing twice < 1294513428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but i'm going to make it so that negate negative looks like this: < 1294513428 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no wait what < 1294513431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[is zero?(#0)] < 1294513439 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh < 1294513448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|^(0) => recurse(inc(#0) inc(inc(#1))) < 1294513453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(1) => #1 < 1294513457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except i'll give recurse a name < 1294513463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: should the recursion function be @ or $ < 1294513468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the display < 1294513492 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well I don't know what in the code is oklo. Just saying oklo makes it oklo is a tautology.. < 1294513499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: oklopol wrote it < 1294513528 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, okay. But does it differ in coding style or something from normal python? < 1294513541 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, or is it just defined by author being oklopol? < 1294513541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm yes < 1294513543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in every way < 1294513547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: link me to your scheme interp again < 1294513547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on vjn < 1294513576 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" oklopol: i think i'm going to change the ghetto_ast to show recursion normally" <<< should be done, yes, just a tiny amt of work so i skipped it < 1294513581 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so just wondering if you can give me some representative example showing what makes it oklo :) < 1294513600 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: limme scheme terp vjn prove Vorpal oklopy langue < 1294513633 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so was that thing actually the is zero function or is it a part of negate negative < 1294513634 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, your keyboard seems to have broken < 1294513646 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's negate negative clearly, that's why i'm asking < 1294513673 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i usually have a rather unique way of writing in a language < 1294513687 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it was zero yeah now link me to scheme terp < 1294513690 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :usually it's in the canonical ugly code direction < 1294513694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ill make Vorpal rue day he evr asked < 1294513701 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, yes I understood that. But I was basically wondering unique in what way. :) < 1294513704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: technically i'd prefer to show him the oklotalk-- impl but that's somewhere in space < 1294513705 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: scheme interp in what language? < 1294513711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: your smiling is creepy < 1294513712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: python < 1294513745 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ooh, like a creeper? < 1294513783 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that can not be the is zero function! < 1294513791 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[id(#0)] <= [0 1] < 1294513791 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(0) => #1 < 1294513791 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(_) => #0 < 1294513793 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it can? < 1294513797 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no but the < 1294513803 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : [is zero?(#0)] < 1294513803 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : argh < 1294513803 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : |^(0) => recurse(inc(#0) inc(inc(#1))) < 1294513803 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : |.(1) => #1 < 1294513807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh well yes. < 1294513810 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1294513810 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's negate negative. < 1294513811 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm < 1294513817 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :main branch is not in there < 1294513817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as i sedd < 1294513819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's negate negative < 1294513821 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: howso < 1294513824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: the main branch is just #2 < 1294513826 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it gets expanded out < 1294513832 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm fuck < 1294513833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: the point is that i'm going to inline all the recursions < 1294513835 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah us right < 1294513836 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to be, you know < 1294513837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty < 1294513840 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see what happened was < 1294513844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless it does like cons(#2 #2) < 1294513846 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't understand how tail recursion works < 1294513846 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but who would do that < 1294513848 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294513849 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294513850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :happens < 1294513852 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's a very new concept for me! < 1294513854 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in life sometimes < 1294513856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :absolutely < 1294513876 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but right, when you write it in recurse(inc(#0) inc(inc(#1))) form, it's rather clear this function does not need cons < 1294513897 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, just remember the linking of code :) < 1294513921 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway i want functions to return multiple values, that would fit the scheme so perfectly, especially since you don't actually ever *call* functions < 1294513994 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trivia: you can write code that looks like you're returning multiple values now, but they are completely ignored in examples by parser < 1294514017 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :win 3 < 1294514019 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: NO U < 1294514044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- negate negative < 1294514044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[is zero?(#0)] < 1294514044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|^(0) => #2 < 1294514046 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(1) => #1 < 1294514047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDDD < 1294514050 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so elegant < 1294514072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- negate negative < 1294514072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[is zero?(#0)] < 1294514072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|^(0) => @(inc(#0) inc(inc(#1))) < 1294514074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|.(1) => #1 < 1294514077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ^ < 1294514095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually i should probably drop the ^/. indicator < 1294514102 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since it doesn't actually help you understand it now < 1294514104 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :opnz oklopol? < 1294514132 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: can't find it in there < 1294514155 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- negate negative < 1294514155 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[is zero?(#0)] < 1294514155 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 0 => @(inc(#0) inc(inc(#1))) < 1294514157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 1 => #1 < 1294514159 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- negate positive < 1294514161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[is zero?(#0)] < 1294514163 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 0 => @(dec(#0) dec(dec(#1))) < 1294514165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 1 => #1 < 1294514167 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ...are you back in time? < 1294514175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HEY i JUST REALISED, i can replace constants like this < 1294514199 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i was reading contents of vj.fi < 1294514201 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*vjn.fi < 1294514203 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean scp < 1294514206 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: is tusho there a lot? < 1294514217 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i saw a folder named tusho... < 1294514223 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::Ddddd what's in there < 1294514264 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah the redirecting service < 1294514278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where does it go < 1294514296 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYws8biwOYc someone has redirected "awesome" to this < 1294514296 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294514317 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i... have seen that < 1294514340 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so even more 100% sure that it was not just a random internet guy < 1294514357 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho goes to google.com < 1294514369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294514378 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.wellnowwhat.net/transfers/Tusho%20is%20a%20girl%20part%201.mov < 1294514382 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is tusho1 < 1294514386 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294514398 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn < 1294514401 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god not that < 1294514405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why can't we forget i was ever proved female < 1294514443 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1294514516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[id(compare(#0 compare(#0 #0)))] < 1294514516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| -1 => 1 < 1294514516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 0 => 0 < 1294514518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 1 => 0 < 1294514521 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...can't believe this is actually kinda working :D < 1294514537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :( my ast is getting readable enough that i can't explain how amazing it is < 1294514568 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that statement made no sense < 1294514580 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless unreadable == amazing < 1294514582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :before i could give a lesson on what each part ment and how it switched and stuff < 1294514584 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :made a bit tho < 1294514586 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but now anyone can make sense of it... < 1294514592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: made a bit what < 1294514596 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sens < 1294514649 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i agree that's kind beautiful, as long as you have #x actually mean constants and arguments, and not named expressions < 1294514661 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and actually write a tree < 1294514664 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294514684 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait i guess it's just when the subrecursion inputs are calculated that new things are named? < 1294514702 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bleh, i'll just let you figure this out, and complain about the obvious problems if there are any < 1294514734 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohhh < 1294514747 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294514750 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294514755 0 :Leonidas!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294514757 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i guess the reason for named things is that that's actually how the computation goes, since it's faster not to compute things multiple times < 1294514765 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course, usually the named expression is only used once < 1294514803 0 :coppro!~scshunt@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1294514804 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294514804 0 :Leonidas!~Leonidas@unaffiliated/leonidas JOIN :#esoteric < 1294514973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: < 1294514975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ski type?(#0)] < 1294514976 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 0 => #0 < 1294514976 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 1 => @(car(cdr(#0))) < 1294514977 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 2 => @(cadar(#0)) < 1294514979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 3 => @(pair(#1 #2)) < 1294514981 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 4 => @(pair(#1 car(cdr(#0)))) < 1294514986 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, is this for the compiled output or for the process of compilation? If it is for the compiled output, couldn't you keep a counter for each named expression and inline it just used once? < 1294514986 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this shit actually works :D < 1294514988 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: btw i think you can use constants when computing the condition, i think it's more likely that when it tries compare(#0 #0), it actually substitutes that for the code for generating the number 0 (which was the constant zero), because it noticed due to memoization that they have the same results. < 1294515003 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it can't actually measure whether constant 0 or compare(arg1 arg1) is faster < 1294515018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depth of first isn't working i don't think, it's showing wrongly < 1294515027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no, you can't use such a constant < 1294515030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: because it gets the first param as #0 < 1294515032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even if you have constants < 1294515038 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so clearly it doesn't get constants :) < 1294515040 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what are #0 #1 and #2 in that, it's not clear. < 1294515048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :things...i'm trying to work it out < 1294515091 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll look in the code to see if you're right about constants < 1294515099 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm rather convinced you are < 1294515316 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294515325 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :glue is not called with that information. < 1294515335 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compile_cond < 1294515336 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : # find the code for determining branch < 1294515336 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : _,preprocessing,prepcode=glue(clue.bag, < 1294515336 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : stuff.apply_to_visible, < 1294515336 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (lambda f,args:stuff.getarity(f)==len(args)), < 1294515336 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : nontestbranchinputs, < 1294515336 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (lambda a:is_partition(stuff.apply_to_visible(clue.cond,[a])))) < 1294515342 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nontestbranchinputes < 1294515344 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ts < 1294515352 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should have constants before it < 1294515376 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you should add that :P < 1294515392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: should i patch it up to make it a little bit more efficient? < 1294515402 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, at least the great thing about clue is no programs should break < 1294515442 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not many languages where you can start giving more unnamed args to functions, and they still work the same way < 1294515447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ski type?(#0)] < 1294515447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 0 => #0 < 1294515447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| aaa1 => @(car(cdr(#0))) < 1294515449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| aaa2 => @(cadar(#0)) < 1294515451 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| aaaaaaaaa3 => @(pair(#1 #2)) < 1294515453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| aaaaaa4 => @(pair(#1 car(cdr(#0)))) < 1294515455 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now that's what i call debugging output < 1294515467 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294515476 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm wait what < 1294515484 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i should fix it, that's so clearly an error < 1294515497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh man, this is quite impressively broken i think < 1294515512 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i wonder how localized i can make the change, i believe pretty localized, but hmmhmm < 1294515522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i can do it if you want, this is fun < 1294515534 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well sure < 1294515558 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copy paste the code for fixed_h_objs from some other func, unless you know what invisible_lists are < 1294515580 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are just when you want a vector such that all things are actually applied to their contents < 1294515591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what xD < 1294515596 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that we can have multiple examples, and functions apply to them separately < 1294515601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have never once wanted that < 1294515606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nor do i understand, but < 1294515621 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, you need it for this < 1294515647 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a rather common thing to need < 1294515666 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NEED, not even want < 1294515674 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just as soon as i fix this abomination < 1294515717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah!!!!!!!!!! < 1294515761 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see this way i can write glue (which is the only thing that does any search) in such a way that it doesn't have to know anything about multiple examples, or even what examples are, it's just looking for a path from A to B, for expressions A and B, and given operations for walking (contents of bag) < 1294515802 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and yet it's a hideous function < 1294515806 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very true to the Clue spirit i feel < 1294515808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294515855 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well there's tons of optimization < 1294515859 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise it's not that many lines < 1294515864 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also some debugging stuff i haven't removed < 1294515902 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the basic reason is the compiler actually compiles everything into a python function, the asts aren't actually executed < 1294515912 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and of course i do this by building hideous lambdas < 1294515923 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : newobjrecipe=(lambda fun_,subsetrecs_ : < 1294515923 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (lambda app,*args : < 1294515924 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : app(fun_,map(lambda o:o(app,*args),subsetrecs_))))(fun,subsetrecs) < 1294516005 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtffff < 1294516007 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at this < 1294516049 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just need a really simple (to specify) program -- but filling the details in (i.e. writing it) is a huge hassle < 1294516058 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that's why clue is great! < 1294516075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: figures out all the little details for you, so long as you specify them all in an unreadable form underneath the examples < 1294516111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: can i have some coffee, i need it to understand clue < 1294516112 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what makes glue hideous is that when it's building objects, it's actually building the actual python object, an ast explaining how it was made, and a python lambda that makes it from the arguments given to the original glue function < 1294516119 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then i have many lines that do the memoization stuff < 1294516123 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahaha I doubt Clue can do what I want < 1294516135 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should make a human powered web interface for Clue < 1294516136 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i have a big try catch thing that checks whether applications succeed < 1294516145 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe a different language all together < 1294516213 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and applying, being applicable, what we're looking for, what functions we may use are abstracted away < 1294516271 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :their exact semantics are not as pretty as they could be ofc, might take 10 minutes to see how to make that thing infer say brainfuck code < 1294516358 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but basically you could have objects be contents of brainfuck tape, and asts be code that generates them, prolly just leave recs empty (or generate bytecode of some sort) < 1294516428 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then give a bag of operations like -- could be applicable iff object (the tape) has more than one at current cell, and it would add -- to the end of ast, and would decrement current cell twice to get the new object < 1294516443 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :glue would automatically memoize away multiple ways to get the same tape contents < 1294516470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: am i correct in thinking that hardcoding the brancher/conditional to would be the best thing? < 1294516480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: since it works perfectly fine when you do that, and is also a very common thing to do < 1294516483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and just removing <> entirely < 1294516495 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it break ski? < 1294516517 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ilkka just put everywhere and told me conditions are done in a stupid way < 1294516524 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well yes, in that you'd have to strip <> from it < 1294516525 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i said duh < 1294516530 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then also get rid of ; since it'd be redundant < 1294516536 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but other than that it should work perfectly < 1294516551 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe have it as backwards compatibility :D < 1294516552 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: call it "clue 1.5" :P < 1294516553 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD < 1294516558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: lol < 1294516559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you joke < 1294516570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: the backwards compatibility is the fact that there's a file called clue.py.old < 1294516572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294516580 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1294516605 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or "that old clue.rar on vjn server if i didn't overwrite it yet" < 1294516612 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have that saved :> < 1294516620 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: clue 1.5 — more powerful conditions, less thinking about the bag, and OPTIMISED! < 1294516624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also < 1294516627 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294516627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CONSTANTS IN THE CONDITIONAL < 1294516642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm? < 1294516659 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well if i make 1.5, it'll have a completely different condition system, not just dropping < 1294516673 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: 1.25 < 1294516679 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294516689 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think that's really necessary, just have for now < 1294516692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I'm going to do it whether you want to bother or not, just tell me what version number to give it :P < 1294516699 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohhh < 1294516702 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i'm optimising it anyway...and putting constants in conditions < 1294516703 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you can use 1.5 < 1294516705 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*1.25 < 1294516710 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i'll actually call mine 1.5 < 1294516710 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i might as well fix the condition system a little bit while i am at it? < 1294516721 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can! < 1294516737 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...how? < 1294516747 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: make it always assume is given, remove <> from the parser < 1294516751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then in the ast printer, just ignore condname < 1294516757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and use condast instead < 1294516825 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also how were you planning to optimize? my suggestion is you add a "size" function to glue, and it always makes sure all subobjects are in the bag < 1294516837 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that you don't make objects bigger, unless you really have to < 1294516859 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this would be rather easy to do, and would probably make ski compile in a millisecond < 1294516887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'll probably do that < 1294516895 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294516900 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294516904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: first bit of optimisation was going to be "fix your stupid fucking is applicable" function though :D < 1294516914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok luatre now has nicer function printing!!! < 1294516925 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :feed it something recursive < 1294516926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and gawp < 1294516927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact < 1294516928 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just do it without making glue dependent on the rest of the code, i'm very strict about the conceptual purity of code < 1294516928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i will < 1294516951 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean fix applicable function? < 1294516960 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where you call a function to see if it can be called. < 1294516968 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how else would you do it? < 1294516990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: um isinstance(f,types.FunctionType) < 1294516996 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294517000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294517021 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's see... < 1294517034 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294517044 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if the function only works for integers? < 1294517053 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: irrelevant, you call it with no arguments < 1294517056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can't find that out anyway < 1294517081 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... length ~ {:. [1,2,3] -> 3 : [2,3] -> 2 :. [[],2,[1,2],3] -> 4 : [2,[1,2],3] -> 3} length ~ {. [] -> 0} length ~ ; cdr; inc < 1294517081 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ValueError: substring not found :( < 1294517087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294517088 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294517092 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.:. length ~ {:. [1,2,3] -> 3 : [2,3] -> 2 :. [[],2,[1,2],3] -> 4 : [2,[1,2],3] -> 3} length ~ {. [] -> 0} length ~ ; cdr; inc < 1294517092 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DepthLimitException: depth limit exceeded (length) :( < 1294517094 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call it with no arguments? applicabler(fun,subsetobjs) < 1294517096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294517100 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you do not call it with no arguments < 1294517101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.:. length ~ {:. [1,2,3] -> 3 : [2,3] -> 2 :. [[],2,[1,2],3] -> 4 : [2,[1,2],3] -> 3} length ~ {. [] -> 0} length ~ ; cdr; inc; #0 < 1294517102 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :length: [empty(#0)] | False => inc(@(cdr(#0))) | True => 0 < 1294517124 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :applicabler is one of the most important things in the whole system, currently of little use because you can't make your functions fail explicitly < 1294517126 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :def is_function(a): < 1294517126 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : try: < 1294517126 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : a() < 1294517127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : except Exception,e: < 1294517129 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if str(e)[-12:]=="not callable": < 1294517131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return False < 1294517133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return True < 1294517135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i mean that. < 1294517136 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you meant that? < 1294517138 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohhhhhh < 1294517145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:04 elliott: .:. length ~ {:. [1,2,3] -> 3 : [2,3] -> 2 :. [[],2,[1,2],3] -> 4 : [2,[1,2],3] -> 3} length ~ {. [] -> 0} length ~ ; cdr; inc; #0 < 1294517145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:04 luatre: length: [empty(#0)] | False => inc(@(cdr(#0))) | True => 0 < 1294517146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dude < 1294517147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol < 1294517147 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought you wanted to remove applicabler from glue :D < 1294517149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has booleans < 1294517153 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you didn't even realise :D < 1294517166 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it uses python types directly < 1294517169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294517169 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so sure < 1294517176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ok so here's what i'm planning to do for clue 1.25 < 1294517176 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just don't have operations for them yet < 1294517180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: optimisations and stuff < 1294517185 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: remove <> < 1294517189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: remove commas from lists :D < 1294517197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: rename empty to empty? and make it return an int < 1294517201 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah all those i agree with < 1294517205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and maybe add those neg/sub you have < 1294517205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or < 1294517206 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :better < 1294517208 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have stdlib.clue < 1294517213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which implements them using my impls :D < 1294517225 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although i doubt you'll be able to donate that many optimizations < 1294517229 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that are actually relevant < 1294517234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably not, but who cares < 1294517235 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, except the one i just explained to you < 1294517245 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:59 oklopol: also how were you planning to optimize? my suggestion is you add a "size" function to glue, and it always makes sure all subobjects are in the bag < 1294517246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294517248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll do that < 1294517249 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i can :P < 1294517261 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can get slightly hairy, but shouldn't be that hard < 1294517277 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmhmm < 1294517281 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or not... dunno < 1294517361 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294517363 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O() wise, it's enough to check if at least one new object was added that was smaller than the ones it was derived from, and if such an object was added, skip adding the big stuff on this iteration < 1294517372 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1294517393 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unfortunately, if not all things are added, it also means you should start checking that you're not doing redundant stuff < 1294517423 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which leads to all kinds of very nice fastenings, but will also make glue also conceptually ugly. < 1294517451 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exception: Can't compile cadar(), deep first with cutoff(), deep first(), make singleton(), cadaar(), depth of first(), more than 3(), pair(), ski type?(), ski apply() < 1294517452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294517457 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :currently, glue is basically just for all subsets of objects found so far, check what functions can be applied, apply them all, remove duplicates, add to known objects. < 1294517458 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :silly me < 1294517478 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"ski type?" ;O < 1294517484 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1294517487 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was just using the old ski < 1294517489 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in ski apply < 1294517495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah and? < 1294517502 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A NONTRIVIAL CONDITION! < 1294517508 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should probably change that < 1294517509 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also < 1294517513 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait nm < 1294517517 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: nah, you can't tell it's a condition in 1.25! < 1294517517 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also < 1294517519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- succ < 1294517520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[?(#0)] < 1294517521 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| _ => inc(#0) < 1294517525 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the code < 1294517526 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :succ ~ {. 0 -> 1 < 1294517527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 1 -> 2 < 1294517529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 2 -> 3 } < 1294517531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :succ ~ _; inc < 1294517535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: clue decided it didn't need _ :D < 1294517537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't that amazing < 1294517537 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well = ; ski type? < 1294517539 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's so smart < 1294517550 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very < 1294517567 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would be fun to look at the actual python bytecode generated btw < 1294517580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"fun" < 1294517588 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and perhaps make a version of glue that writes java bytecode instead < 1294517595 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, abstract that away as well < 1294517602 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: don't you call clue functions as the lambda < 1294517607 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294517609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the bytecode will just look like... a function call to the interpreter < 1294517623 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- negate negative < 1294517623 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[#0] < 1294517623 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| _ => #2 < 1294517624 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1294517624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 0 => #1 < 1294517629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ...it decided it didn't need "is zero?" < 1294517630 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :holy shit < 1294517632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is so fucking smart < 1294517645 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a function call to the interpreter?!? < 1294517648 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the fuck man < 1294517651 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT ACTUALLY COMPILES TO PYTHON < 1294517658 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: to...python strings? < 1294517658 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is not interpretation < 1294517659 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it actually < 1294517661 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO < 1294517667 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why glue looks ugly < 1294517667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it manually writes bytecode? < 1294517682 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it writes a whole mess of lambdas. < 1294517696 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ok, but the point is that the lambdas don't get inlined inside each other < 1294517704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's still going to look like a single lambda with a big environment full of lambdas < 1294517719 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you'll get very fragmented and jumpy python bytecode, yes < 1294517732 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not a function call the an interpreter, because there isn't one < 1294517739 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*to an < 1294517842 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i could, i guess, make glue directly write bytecode, if i abstracted away code generation < 1294517846 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which wouldn't be very hard < 1294517884 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i could then change tail recursion to an actual loop ofc < 1294517925 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which happens outside glue ofc, glue never recurses into code that hasn't been completely inferred yet < 1294517936 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1294517953 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah it doesn't understand recursion, i guess that's what my point was < 1294517980 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'll be pleased to know, i've broken ski somehow < 1294517987 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294517993 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it wasn't very hard to write < 1294518070 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i should write a really simple and stupid version of that glue + size_functions < 1294518086 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i basically just wanna see if pivot starts magically compiling fast < 1294518152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :incidentally why does make singletone exist < 1294518156 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can do pair with just #[] and cons < 1294518173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*singleton < 1294518184 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or even just that functions can be neutral, building or demolishing < 1294518200 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'll be happy to incorporate those changes into 1.25 :P < 1294518206 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: because it was easier to make things compile that way < 1294518221 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D < 1294518224 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: see with clue 1.25 it just works < 1294518241 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pair ~ {. 1, 2 -> [1, 2] < 1294518241 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . [3], [4, 5] -> [[3], [4, 5]]} < 1294518241 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pair ~ #[]; cons < 1294518243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294518245 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*cons; #[] < 1294518246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for elegant < 1294518248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*elegance < 1294518252 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294518253 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :building and demolishing could easily be actual concepts you can have for your objects as well, it's clear what they are in general for inductive data structures < 1294518256 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are the terms in cs? < 1294518260 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the correct terms < 1294518262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno :D < 1294518263 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like building = cons < 1294518264 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: erm < 1294518267 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :demolishing = car, cdr < 1294518269 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ah < 1294518272 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: constructing, destructing < 1294518275 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: introduction and elimination < 1294518275 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah! < 1294518279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or what j-invariant said < 1294518285 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i prefer elliott < 1294518286 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'s < 1294518288 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because those i knew < 1294518290 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294518294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine have a nice balance :P < 1294518304 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by which i mean oo uses constructing < 1294518307 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course < 1294518327 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oo doesn't really make inductive data structures very natural < 1294518371 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294518486 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should also have some kind of "in-place" changing of things, that is, you don't have to demolish an object, get to one of its subobjects, change it, and build the original back, but instead, you can virtually demolish, and sort of just get an (object, pointer) pair, such that building something out of this new object actually builds something out of the subobject referenced by the pointer, and the actual object is built on top < 1294518491 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294518515 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as an implementation detail, since elliott claims he might want to do this kinda stuff < 1294518530 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yeah if it's not too hard. < 1294518533 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas it's clear i'll just do stuff in my head and then go all meeeeeeh code. < 1294518534 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Which maze? < 1294518544 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: the crazy mirror maze thing < 1294518566 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that thing i just mentioned might be a tad complicated to do in a nice way < 1294518566 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oklopol: introduction and elimination <-- that's more for type systems and logic deductions, isn't it? < 1294518601 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the reason i like demolishing is that you actually destroy an inductive data structure *completely* < 1294518604 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yeah < 1294518605 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when inferring < 1294518618 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't just use it once or twice < 1294518632 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean you will in the compiled prog, ofc < 1294518663 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like if x :: a and y :: b then (x,y) :: (a,b) < 1294518665 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Although the display-mode ("P") function doesn't work here, you can still use bombs and bullets. Also there are various fake walls. < 1294518684 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: or more like, easy to do in a nice way, but not at all easy to see how to actually have it make things fast, instead of just adding another exponential blow-up < 1294518692 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294518700 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or not, but i'm not gonna get into the details maybe < 1294518706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it's what dependent losers use :D like me! < 1294518796 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i'll add building and demolishing as quick hacks now, as poc < 1294518830 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the functions are actual python functions, so i can't just quickly add that info to them :( < 1294518834 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or i can, but that sounds ugly < 1294518840 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I am raelly stunned by this game btw < 1294518853 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: it is very detailed and tricky < 1294518873 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Yes that level with mirrors is not one of the best levels I have created. The other levels are better. < 1294518885 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O mean the whole thing < 1294518903 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did j-invariant mention the mirror room at some point < 1294518912 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just checking < 1294518921 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294518924 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1294518937 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would've been so classis zzo38 to guess a specific room you're referring to < 1294518938 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294518940 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*classic < 1294519001 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: makes sense < 1294519004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i suggest rewriting it as an ast interpreter so that your structure easily allows compilation :} < 1294519012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(just because an interp is easiest first) < 1294519058 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION suddenly gets the idea of a codependent programming language < 1294519062 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294519084 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Still, the mirror maze is solvable with some trial/errors (other levels are better). Just some hints, use bullets/bombs in case you forget where you are. Another way is that some things will push you and you can hear the noise of pushing. And, you can pick up potions, too. < 1294519105 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nono i just need to have a function that extracts "construction type" information from functions, unspecified for most functions, but specified as building or demolishing for certain stdlib functions, in glue < 1294519119 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically i'd be done if i could just add a string of information to the stdlib functions < 1294519166 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : zzo38: I am raelly stunned by this game btw <-- so it has lots of ufos? < 1294519171 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(If you have a save game, you can restore the save game and try a different level if you don't like that one?) < 1294519187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: read you as oklopol was like, what, that's too real for him to mention < 1294519189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(rael lol) < 1294519270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so when does the depth limit get exceedemated < 1294519357 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :return glue_(functions,applier,applicabler,lambda a:None,objectswithrecipes,condition,5,objects) < 1294519361 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in glue < 1294519369 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :return glue_(functions,applier,applicabler,cons_typer,objects+newobjects,condition,depth_lim-1,orig_objs,objectlookup) < 1294519371 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in glue_ < 1294519392 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it only does 5 rounds < 1294519396 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that _doesn't_ make sense < 1294519405 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :later, it will only make 5 *build* rounds < 1294519408 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: what < 1294519411 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no no no i mean < 1294519415 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: if the depth limit gets exceeded < 1294519417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what has clue failed to do < 1294519418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*no no < 1294519420 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at a high level < 1294519426 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has failed to find an implementatoin. < 1294519429 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*implementation < 1294519435 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for something < 1294519449 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294519453 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oerjan: read you as oklopol was like, what, that's too real for him to mention < 1294519462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: read your name as oklopol < 1294519463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was like < 1294519464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294519469 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's too real for him to mention < 1294519480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: okay, so basically it means "im not smurf enough to this function?" < 1294519481 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol; was < 1294519513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where smurf is smart and to is to make < 1294519516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes? < 1294519525 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294519533 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a very precise sense < 1294519535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but that's...bad, yes < 1294519536 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ufos are too real for oklopol to mention, gotcha < 1294519538 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that it looks at the size 5 ball. < 1294519541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: no but raels < 1294519586 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i didn't know rael < 1294519600 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think that <> is actually needed in some cases :D < 1294519603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. deep first with cutoff < 1294519607 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't work without ... < 1294519611 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...wait what? < 1294519612 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294519619 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should, just slightly slower < 1294519629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not actually slower, this < 1294519654 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well obviously the functions that previously used something other than id will now be slower < 1294519662 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you're giving it the topmost function < 1294519665 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: nonono, this is confusing < 1294519667 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of having it do that for you < 1294519675 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1294519716 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so how do i add a bit of information to a function < 1294519726 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't want to make my own function class or anything < 1294519735 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that'd take MINUTES < 1294519751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: hmm < 1294519764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: func.foo = 3 < 1294519765 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :works fine < 1294519766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294519800 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294519801 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294519846 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AND THEN I'LL JUST MAKE A TRY CATCH BLOCK TO CHECK FOR THAT < 1294519859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294519864 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: try < 1294519876 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294519878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: getattr(func,'propname',default) < 1294519891 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294519895 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't know the name < 1294519900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aw man, it doesn't print I BARFED UP A YUPPIE < 1294519903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bug isn't there then < 1294519990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what the fuck is happening < 1294520055 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD < 1294520059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: < 1294520060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- deep first < 1294520060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[#0] < 1294520061 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 1 => #0 < 1294520063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| [[1 2] 3] => #1 < 1294520077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MAYBE THAT'S THE BUG < 1294520119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: tl;dr without <>, you need more examples < 1294520124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to stop the silly thing thinking it can do trivial shit < 1294520152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so uh... should i add more examples or restore <> < 1294520236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: EH < 1294520240 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294520276 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so erm how did you do the removal of <> exactly < 1294520278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i mean obviously the clue purist in me says, obviously, get rid of <> and just add more examples < 1294520280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: simple < 1294520284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i hardcoded the cond function to id < 1294520286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and left all the rest as is < 1294520297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so everything has now basically < 1294520302 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and deep first broke what was it using? < 1294520319 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is list k < 1294520335 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yeah... is list? is in the function list though < 1294520343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it just needs another example in one or both blocks < 1294520347 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so that clue realises it needs is list < 1294520349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than hardcoding < 1294520365 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's okay that it needs two examples for deep first imo < 1294520385 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, the correct thing to do is assume the first ones are hard coded things, and the last one is a default branch < 1294520388 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294520399 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're trying to find the easiest implementation of the given behaviour < 1294520403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- deep first < 1294520403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[#0] < 1294520403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 1 => #0 < 1294520405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| _ => #1 < 1294520406 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er what... < 1294520418 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so just add another example for the constant case, and is list? in the bag < 1294520435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is list was already in the bag < 1294520440 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah, it's the constant case that needs adding < 1294520452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: maybe if clue can't use all the functions you provide it should error out < 1294520461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"either you have useless code, or i wasn't smart enough" < 1294520493 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least a warning < 1294520498 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294520504 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294520532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay ski seems to compile now... I think either deep first or my printing function is broken though :) < 1294520535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably my printing function < 1294520540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :deep first ~ {. 1 -> 1 < 1294520540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 2 -> 2 } < 1294520540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :deep first ~ {:. [[1, 2], 3] -> 1 < 1294520541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [1, 2] -> 1 < 1294520543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : :. [1, [2, 3]] -> 1 < 1294520545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : 1 -> 1 } < 1294520547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is what seems to have fixed it < 1294520553 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean for instance if you just go "this can prolly be done with car, cons and cdr but i can't ass thinking about it", and turns out you just need two of those, then i wouldn't call that a bad thing < 1294520555 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294520559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yeah, but < 1294520562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should say < 1294520566 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"hey, you might wanna remove these: " < 1294520570 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294520573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"or else if you know it's needed, lol, i fucked up, be more examply please" < 1294520583 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i mean, see < 1294520588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: omg i just invented SuperClue < 1294520595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: every function defined so far is put into every bag < 1294520600 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SO SIMPLE < 1294520622 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah yeah, remove the reason glue actually works, and it'll be even more beautiful < 1294520661 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well ... who runs programs < 1294520664 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just write them < 1294520665 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, anyway that might actually be feasible, when a very nice interp is made by a very smart person, and when there's a bit more stuff you can do to help compilation < 1294520694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- ski apply < 1294520694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ski type?(#0)] < 1294520694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 0 => #0 < 1294520696 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 1 => #1 < 1294520698 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 2 => #1 < 1294520700 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 3 => @(pair(cadar(#0) ski type?(cdr(#0)))) < 1294520703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 4 => @(car(#0)) < 1294520704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that looks very suspicious < 1294520709 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1294520712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just my broken printing function again < 1294520713 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, i'm going to add a rather nice syntax for adding new inductive data structures, at some point. < 1294520714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes back to get_ast < 1294520721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and then remove built in lists and numbers, yes? < 1294520733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: omg... if it actually did guessing based on the induction scheme of the structure < 1294520736 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather nice as in, clue should never start to look like an esolang... again conceptually < 1294520742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::}}}}}languagegasm < 1294520758 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah that's the idea < 1294520783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: btw < 1294520784 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :62.0739979744 < 1294520789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ski compilation is over 2x slower :D < 1294520791 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that you have something like "list tool bag", which is the basic operations of lists, and if you have lists as args, it's unioned with the bag by defauly. < 1294520793 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*defauly < 1294520795 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*default < 1294520807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but then again... < 1294520807 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not all that surprising < 1294520812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: optimising over language purity is kinda < 1294520813 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT IT'LL RUN FASTER NOW! < 1294520813 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yuck? < 1294520816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bags i can accept < 1294520818 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed! :D < 1294520818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1294520823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :conditionals are just < 1294520831 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh man, it actually uses my cpu doing this < 1294520838 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. conditionals are you writing actual code, doing some specific thing. < 1294520840 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: we've invented your language which takes ages to compile anything < 1294520849 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they should not be allowed near clue. < 1294520861 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well if conditionals could take multiple arguments. then i wouldn't mind nearly as much < 1294520864 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you wouldn't have to do . < 1294520866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they can't. < 1294520868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so vomit < 1294520891 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hrm? which lang? < 1294520892 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i sort of mind them anyway, i mean next thing you know you'll want to say "...and this recursive case should cons two things together" < 1294520896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: cue < 1294520910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*clue < 1294520916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh sertanly, i just meant i wouldn't HATE IT WITH ALL MY GUTS if they could take multiple args < 1294520921 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294520922 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll look in a bit - I can't talk now < 1294520923 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same here < 1294520929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: also, i am going to add constant support for conditionals now ... < 1294520932 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is working on a unnecessary compiler in haskell  < 1294520933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: can we stop calling it a conditional? < 1294520936 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"brancher" < 1294520938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be better < 1294520943 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed it would. < 1294520973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : condcode=lambda*a:clue.cond(preprocessing(apply,*a)) < 1294520975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm. < 1294520981 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm. < 1294520995 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :preprocessing? < 1294521018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i just wanna know where you create the conditional code :D < 1294521021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i can give it constant access < 1294521026 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although the inferrer would have to know about it too < 1294521072 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :giving it constant access is not that easy, because you also have to call it with constants then < 1294521078 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is done in a different place < 1294521080 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that should be it < 1294521088 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no, glue doesn't need to know about this. < 1294521099 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :glue has nothing to do with anything around it < 1294521113 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it will when i add demolishing check, but glue_ will still not < 1294521147 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294521156 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: clue is so awesome. < 1294521158 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i keep tight track of logical dependancies, usually < 1294521166 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dancy dancy < 1294521277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you know what, you can add constants in conditionals :D < 1294521307 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not actually that hard, but you need to wrap stuff in invisible lists a bit and such < 1294521310 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can do it sure < 1294521388 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :essentially it's just giving glue the constants when you call it for conditional, in invisible lists full of that constant (for each example, that constant in the index of the invisible list reserved for that example), and then wait what? < 1294521391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (lambda a:is_partition(stuff.apply_to_visible(clue.cond,[a])))) < 1294521395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it safe to turn this into uh < 1294521398 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um < 1294521406 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :say that clue.cond doesn't exist any more < 1294521410 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's assumed to be id < 1294521413 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how can i rewrite that line? < 1294521416 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yeah then you need to find where the lambda is made that actually computes all of that stuff < 1294521475 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i believe so, you can just check if the actual objects are a partition already < 1294521477 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like < 1294521498 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294521539 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is_partition is... a bit involved is it... < 1294521544 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*n't < 1294521551 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294521560 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohh < 1294521566 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's because of default branches < 1294521606 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is_partition actually checks if the list you give it is a partition, assuming one of the partition elements can be "default", so for instance [[1, 1, 1], [3, 3], [6, 5], [4, 4]] would be a partition < 1294521613 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because only [6, 5] is default < 1294521614 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :....maybe < 1294521629 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i believe that's how it works < 1294521665 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so maybe just have is_partition as cond < 1294521668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: okay so i just put the list in there directly. < 1294521679 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of that whole lambda < 1294521684 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294521718 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I THINK. < 1294521761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :61.5558609962 < 1294521764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is an achievement for me. < 1294521795 0 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@cpc1-sgyl29-2-0-cust788.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294521795 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294521795 0 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294521922 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: can i rename inc/dec to succ/pred < 1294521926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>_> < 1294521948 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1294521952 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski now compiles in 3 seconds < 1294521957 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pivotpivotpivot!!!! < 1294521962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what < 1294521963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it does? < 1294521965 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1294521972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: holy shit give me your new clue.py, i want to see if no-conditions could actually be fast < 1294521980 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294521987 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: unless you're lying < 1294522011 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294522013 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p2721555448.txt < 1294522028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you ... just changed stuff.py? not clue.py? < 1294522037 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p1499968214.txt < 1294522039 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :both < 1294522040 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sry < 1294522128 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather obvious change < 1294522142 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just does... well exactly what i explained earlier < 1294522147 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1294522162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+def check_demolishing(f): < 1294522162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ if getattr(f,'demolishing',None)==True:return True < 1294522162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ return False < 1294522163 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: lol < 1294522168 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note that functions are partitioned into demolishing and nondemolishing ones because i just wrote it where my cursor was :D < 1294522170 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeaah :D < 1294522170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: "return getattr(f,'demolishing',False)" < 1294522171 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294522173 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i knwo < 1294522175 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*know < 1294522182 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :made me laugh when i saw what my fingers had done < 1294522206 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i wanted to leave it as a surprise for ya < 1294522227 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294522261 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm.... it's very likely i won't get pivot to work without the pointer idea < 1294522269 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder if there's some two line solution for that... < 1294522286 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" note that functions are partitioned into demolishing and nondemolishing ones because i just wrote it where my cursor was :D" <<< you should be laughing at this instead of that two line demolishing check tho < 1294522294 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll fix it now < 1294522315 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ for (funname,fun) in demolishingfuns+nondemolishingfuns: < 1294522317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: that's the same as functions < 1294522321 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that list you construct < 1294522322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294522325 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's really not < 1294522331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh does the order matter < 1294522332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294522346 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unfortunately it does, see things are added one functions at a time < 1294522370 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1294522376 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for a reason that is rather irrelevant at this point < 1294522378 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :might i just add that i hate humans < 1294522390 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thank you < 1294522424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oaky, merged your changes in, time to test < 1294522478 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1294522535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UnboundLocalError: local variable 'newobjects' referenced before assignment < 1294522539 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294522556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh lol < 1294522558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indentation :D < 1294522565 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-197-83.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294522600 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ python cluetest.py < 1294522600 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1.07862401009 < 1294522601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ^ < 1294522606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ski without conditionals < 1294522624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: does that mean that removing conditionals has... made it go faster? < 1294522631 0 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-65-80.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1294522685 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe it means my computer is very slow < 1294522700 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well okay but mine didn't do ski faster than 20s either < 1294522705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: point is: hey removing conditions is practical!! < 1294522707 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it couldn't possibly be faster without conditionals < 1294522710 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean compilation couldn't < 1294522712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well eys < 1294522714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*yes < 1294522714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1294522718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not a problem < 1294522720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the rest is so faster < 1294522721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: has pivot compiled yet < 1294522723 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yarr < 1294522724 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no :( < 1294522733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'll try with my faster computer? :p < 1294522757 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1294522772 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p2549382249.txt < 1294522777 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go ahead, code might be wrong as well... < 1294522792 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i think i've tested everything except pivot at least < 1294522800 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i seriously need to add that :: thing < 1294522802 0 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-65-80.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1294522803 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :test cases < 1294522860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i could make a repl for luatrelang :P < 1294522884 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm.... < 1294522892 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exception: Can't compile caaar pivot helper(), triple(), cons to caaar(), caaar with consed(), make singleton(), car pivot helper(), caaar(), pivot(), cons to car(), caar() < 1294522895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i get to modify your code!! < 1294522899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm what < 1294522900 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can't even compile the things outside pivot now, maybe ski just happened to be faster :\ < 1294522901 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey < 1294522905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: lol < 1294522916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i didn't save my old clue.py < 1294522918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you bastard :D < 1294522923 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the only list prog i have so hard to say < 1294522924 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294522955 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can just comment car.demolishing = True. < 1294522966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does that do. < 1294522968 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make it faster? :p < 1294522978 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1294522983 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you comment that out, it's basically the same as earlier < 1294522990 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just demolishing funcs are tried first. < 1294523021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably cdr too < 1294523022 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so at all times, you will have, in the list of found objects, every object that's a subobject of it < 1294523030 0 :cheater99!~cheater@g230230244.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294523031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: pivot still going, are you sure this will compile in finite time? < 1294523033 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*for every object, every subobject that's a ... < 1294523037 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not relaly. < 1294523038 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*really < 1294523040 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see i just realized < 1294523041 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that < 1294523053 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no wait nm < 1294523059 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yeah < 1294523060 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like < 1294523065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to compile without pivot < 1294523067 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh < 1294523069 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh this is... uncharacteristically slow < 1294523105 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294523107 0 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-65-80.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1294523109 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there should be an simple way to disable compilation of something < 1294523111 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*a < 1294523146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still churning < 1294523183 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmhmm. < 1294523188 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i don't think this change was a good idea :D < 1294523195 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was < 1294523200 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but hmm < 1294523203 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well this... definitely went faster before. < 1294523219 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh? you've compiled that before? < 1294523225 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When a line of text is centered vertically in a box, should it use only the part above the baseline for centering the text? < 1294523228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well no. but it looks trivial. < 1294523231 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i mean without pivot < 1294523238 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it still hasn't compiled such simple things as "car pivot helper" < 1294523261 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1294523262 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1294523263 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe < 1294523275 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what i should do, is make glue simply demolish the original objects completely < 1294523279 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then not demolish any of the new ones < 1294523285 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like i said at some point < 1294523302 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1294523304 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then maybe you would get both speedy ski, and speedy other things < 1294523312 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll try that < 1294523336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my laptop is being a great heater right now < 1294523338 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks to clue < 1294523390 0 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294523611 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bleh :/ < 1294523624 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :changed, ski compiles at essentially same speed, no help with pivot :( < 1294523631 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :spent ages defining polynomials in coq but I got into trouble with equality < 1294523633 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it's wrong. < 1294523677 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the notion of finite support is ugly < 1294523699 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: 282.139328003 < 1294523704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: to compile all the non-pivot functions in the file < 1294523708 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294523709 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: note that they're all trivial :D < 1294523720 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how long without demolishing? < 1294523735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: just removing the .demolishing = True stuff for car and cdr you mean? < 1294523741 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294523746 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just comment those out < 1294523762 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it's what it was before, i recall even i could compile them < 1294523777 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll try < 1294523801 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: compilin' < 1294523864 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: 1.24288511276 < 1294523867 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: for all non-pivot functions < 1294523868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :will try with pivot now < 1294523894 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmhmm < 1294523894 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see < 1294523901 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pivot should work faster with demolishing. < 1294523904 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the others not so much < 1294523914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D < 1294523924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: this is without conditionals btw < 1294523928 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i figured it can't actually *hurt* the others that much < 1294523933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although it's equivalent for this file < 1294523933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think < 1294524021 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is < 1294524039 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so umm, wanna try adding demolishing just before pivot is compiled? :D < 1294524052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no :P < 1294524087 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, as you may have guessed, that's essentially what strategies are, ugly workarounds so that you can help it look in the right direction < 1294524102 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yeah, i oppose them vehemently < 1294524107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i do think you should replace the bag with something else though < 1294524111 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although they have much higher ambitions than just guiding the search with utility functions < 1294524132 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like what < 1294524176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: dunno < 1294524183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think a form of strategies but purer < 1294524188 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: like, you describe what kind of algorithm is < 1294524191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"depth first recursion" might be one < 1294524196 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: or like "fold" < 1294524199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it uses that < 1294524286 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except that's much less pure than strategies < 1294524328 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :strategies are so abstract and complicated i can't even put my finger on them < 1294524329 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay1 I slept all day! < 1294524330 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294524336 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: me too! < 1294524340 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :woke up at 8 < 1294524346 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20 < 1294524350 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:00 that is < 1294524381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yeah but < 1294524384 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it'd be describing the function < 1294524386 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess tht's < 1294524388 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :icky behaviour code < 1294524409 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: pivot still pivotoeing < 1294524414 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294524420 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294524428 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with or without dem < 1294524429 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: are you sure this isn't in an infinite loop < 1294524441 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not an infinite loop, no < 1294524490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: greater-than-universe loop? < 1294524559 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it's superexponential < 1294524571 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in that depth_lim = 5 < 1294524575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ...it is? :D < 1294524578 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1294524588 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you think it's 5 instead of 100 < 1294524588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: why am i even running this then < 1294524592 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294524602 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it might find the answer before doing the complete search < 1294524623 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have no idea how deep the answer lies! < 1294524629 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually i could just calculate i guess < 1294524631 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's... so poetic < 1294524643 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1294524703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ...you adopted my indentation convention :D < 1294524706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm so loved < 1294524727 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did < 1294524747 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i have a feeling it's actually harder to read, but who cares it's prettier < 1294524783 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should just infer constocaaar( car(#2) #3 ) :\ < 1294524793 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe something is very fundamentally wrong somewhere < 1294524804 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, i have no idea what it's finding hard to do < 1294524805 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: are you sure your search algorithm is working right :D < 1294524817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: erm why not put a bunch of prints with the func and its arguments above suspect functions < 1294524821 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then just look at what it's doing so much < 1294524825 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKFUCKUFKCUFKFJDKSF < 1294524829 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCKFUFKFUKCUFUUFUCCKCFKJUFCKUCFKUCFUKCFUKCFUKCF < 1294524832 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CFUJCFUJCFUKCFKCFKCFUKCFKUCFKUCFKUCFKUCFKUCFKUCFKU < 1294524835 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294524837 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOOK AT PIVOT < 1294524838 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT < 1294524840 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PROGRAMMING < 1294524840 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LANGUAGE < 1294524841 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IS < 1294524842 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT < 1294524843 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WRITTEN < 1294524843 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IN < 1294524845 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BECAUSE < 1294524845 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THAT'S < 1294524846 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOT < 1294524847 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CLUE < 1294524854 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um why not :D < 1294524858 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294524860 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'s the condition? < 1294524871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...does it have one? < 1294524873 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDD < 1294524889 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well. < 1294524889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh my god the poor thing's been sitting there going WHAT CONDITION IS THIS WHAAAAAAT < 1294524899 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :run that search up to depth five and it's possible we'll know. < 1294524902 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't see it. < 1294524916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so uh. fix it? :p < 1294524919 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, that's the kind of thing the new conditionals will be able to do < 1294524925 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now, it needs to be worked around < 1294524935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: try not to work around it in a way that doesn't work without <> >_> < 1294524953 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem is i didn't originally realize that i'll need cases for the recursive thing, and then i just split it in two cases without realizing CONDITIONS < 1294524957 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :branchers < 1294524967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: right well... go fix < 1294524974 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :will do. < 1294524992 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck i'm blind < 1294525018 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i actually have no idea how to fix that :P < 1294525024 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294525026 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: rewrite from scratch? :P < 1294525028 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually of course i do < 1294525028 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294525042 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what i have to do, obviously, is write the condition function < 1294525047 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and leave pivot as is < 1294525066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: has anyone told you that you behave exactly like a really dim but hyper kitten somehow given silly amounts of intelligene? < 1294525068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's quite hilarious < 1294525074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*somewhat dim < 1294525078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*intelligence < 1294525154 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm.... < 1294525176 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no! actually no one *ever* told me that! < 1294525209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well < 1294525211 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now you know < 1294525216 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1294525222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it has to be noted that i've been trying to think how to perfectly summarise how you act since, like, 2007 < 1294525228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so maybe everyone else just gave up sooner? < 1294525240 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294525638 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :|Rassilon| < 1294525676 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|Rassilon|: what < 1294525692 0 :|Rassilon|!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :augur < 1294525762 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well fi:rassi is something you use to clean pipes < 1294525777 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so isn't it fitting since augur is, well, you-know-what < 1294525802 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, i was reenacting the formation of timelord society in another channel < 1294525802 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1294525804 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what i did was < 1294525811 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: ah, that was my second guess < 1294525851 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION waits for first night in first minecraft game on hard < 1294525856 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i told my computer hey you silly little thing that cannot handle most flash games, have here this python program that constantly allocated more and more memory while doing this impossible search for a nonexistant thing < 1294525857 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a tiny house and no torches < 1294525864 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll go do something else < 1294525871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :( < 1294525871 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*allocates < 1294525872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i want fix < 1294525879 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah yeah once my computer starts working < 1294525981 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i meant i told my computer i'll go elsewhere btw, in case that was what you were :(ing about < 1294525981 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol im afraid of creepers < 1294525985 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who isn't < 1294525986 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and thinks taht make noise < 1294525988 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*that < 1294525990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*things < 1294525998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what i'm saying is < 1294525999 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"creepers" < 1294526001 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HOW DO I MAKE NIGHT BEARABLE < 1294526016 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i find creepers even scarier during the day < 1294526026 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: also how do i get the courage to run outside on the first day < 1294526028 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats a creeper < 1294526030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all i have is a wooden fucking sword < 1294526043 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in american parlance, a creeper is any guy who you're not attracted to who is attract to you < 1294526049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :auhttp://4.bp.blogspot.com/_oaOBSdwJP7k/TFfZbw0Py8I/AAAAAAAABFQ/crE_sdzUIR4/s1600/Twocreepers.png < 1294526050 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_oaOBSdwJP7k/TFfZbw0Py8I/AAAAAAAABFQ/crE_sdzUIR4/s1600/Twocreepers.png < 1294526057 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in american-post-minecraft parlance < 1294526058 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a creeper < 1294526061 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the worst thing in the world < 1294526066 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, a mindcraft thing < 1294526067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"D:" < 1294526067 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine** < 1294526076 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: yeah creeper is a special case of that < 1294526081 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: also i have no food! < 1294526093 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean mc creeper is < 1294526096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: hi skeleton out the window < 1294526121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god it got up here < 1294526130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol < 1294526131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can skeleton shots < 1294526134 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :get through my door < 1294526145 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when's the hard server up < 1294526152 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol no < 1294526166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you mean my server? when i learn how not to be a pussy < 1294526180 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, hm what would a game called mindcraft do? < 1294526189 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :python is using 650mb :D < 1294526195 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: also also how do i look outside the window without getting scared shitless < 1294526200 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's a fuckload for this computer < 1294526212 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it'd be like minecraft only instead of building castles you stop being lame. < 1294526216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"In SMP, other people can't see your pictures." :D < 1294526225 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: excuse me, minecraft is awesome? < 1294526229 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :castles are for losers < 1294526235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uncreative poops build castles < 1294526239 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course augur hates mc < 1294526246 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only awesome thing about mincraft is that CPU someone built < 1294526246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :too straight for him. < 1294526257 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and maybe some other shit i dont know about < 1294526263 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the overwhelming majority of minecraft is lame < 1294526263 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: excuse me i believe i am working on a 128x128x128 cube made out of glass lit by lava? < 1294526265 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : "In SMP, other people can't see your pictures." :D <-- further if the chunk unloads from your client the painting will be gone. If that is what you meant. < 1294526267 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is half underwater? < 1294526274 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: sounds pretty lame to me < 1294526285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :funny, 'cuz so do you < 1294526299 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont sound lame to me < 1294526314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, you do to me < 1294526323 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, the majority of mc is lame from the outside, that's rather irrelevant. how much have you actually played? < 1294526329 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but you're lame so your opinion doesnt count < 1294526336 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oklopol: also also how do i look outside the window without getting scared shitless <-- by making the walls out of obsidian and so on < 1294526347 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mc < 1294526355 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no i'm just scared of seeing things < 1294526355 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'s contributions to the world are mostly uninteresting < 1294526360 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i've played absolutely none, which is why my opinion is valid. its objective and untainted by the brainwashing of minecraft usage < 1294526363 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :duh < 1294526372 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: gay sex is lame! < 1294526381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can say this 'cuz my mind is untainted < 1294526383 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no but it is gay < 1294526384 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, make a obsidian window shutter on the outside then. Then you can see through the window and see nothing scary < 1294526393 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an* < 1294526396 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: BUT THINGS ARE MAKING NOISJEFOISNKGDFH;S] < 1294526398 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :besides, everyone knows you're a gay, elliott < 1294526405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i'm a gay woman < 1294526408 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well known fact < 1294526418 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm. Make your house large enough that you can't hear anything outside when near the middle < 1294526419 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh thats right < 1294526420 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294526423 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then never go near outer walls < 1294526427 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you a gay boy or a straight woman < 1294526428 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: right, you should clarify that tho < 1294526430 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :girl < 1294526434 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmph! < 1294526436 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :both i should think < 1294526455 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a superposition of both states, using the Quantum monad! < 1294526463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your mother is a monad < 1294526473 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm fine with people hating on mc because you can't actually build anything interesting in it, it's just actually a fuckload of fun to do it, which is what makes the game a good one < 1294526477 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that a complement or a slight < 1294526480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who knows < 1294526481 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its hard to tell < 1294526487 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: there is a skeleton like 5 blocks away from me fuck i can't see it aargh < 1294526489 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1294526500 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i actually dont give a shit about minecraft, i have no opinions of it < 1294526501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant what did you do on your first night before you had stuff to make tools and shit < 1294526505 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not enough windows then! < 1294526510 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, your mother is the linguistic analogue of a monad. < 1294526511 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm in a really tiny house with a wooden sword looking scared out of my door with not orches < 1294526513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*no torches < 1294526517 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294526521 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: so a .. monad? < 1294526535 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and that is a problem. < 1294526536 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I died every night for the first 10 nights or something < 1294526553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: that's the best solution to my previous problem that i could cook up in ten minutes < 1294526564 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the previous problem was that i was in a dense forest with no good place for a house and basically nothing apart from wood and dirt. < 1294526568 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my world is quite habitable now, if you know the right places to go < 1294526572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did i mention my house's bottom layer is made out of dirt < 1294526588 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wait, didn't you spawn on a beach?! < 1294526601 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I Spawned on a beach < 1294526603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes i did < 1294526605 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: i know < 1294526606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it was right next to a forest < 1294526611 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also digging down a few blocks will aways get to stone < 1294526613 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O FUCKING GOD THE SKELETON JUST WALKED PAST MY DOOR < 1294526620 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: couldn't have got enough stone in time < 1294526620 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1294526621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god < 1294526622 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can it see me < 1294526624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :through the door < 1294526627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can can't it < 1294526632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if so: can it hurt me < 1294526636 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" j-invariant what did you do on your first night before you had stuff to make tools and shit" <<< it takes about 3 minutes to get rock tools < 1294526637 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, on Peaceful, I shouldn't bother with lighting, should I? < 1294526639 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, uh, you have 10 minutes from starting the first day until the first dusk < 1294526641 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stone < 1294526645 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what were you waiting for < 1294526653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: well. if you don't care about being able to see at night, sure. < 1294526663 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well first i had to walk to where there were trees, 30 seconds < 1294526681 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: then i cut down two trees, waited for the saplings, and replanted (second one i looked for a big one) - 2 minutes about < 1294526687 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, funny definition of "right next to" ;) < 1294526695 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a way to list you XYZ coordinates? or would that be cheating? < 1294526695 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok it was actually 10 seconds. < 1294526697 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: then i walked until i found some land that wasn't a fucking forest < 1294526699 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: like 2 minutes < 1294526701 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: F3 < 1294526713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: then i climbed to the top of it < 1294526715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: like 2 minutes < 1294526716 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, waiting for the saplings would be wrong thing to do at that stage unless it is the only tree near it < 1294526721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: then i cut down a biiig tree to make space for a house < 1294526723 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"waited for the saplings"? < 1294526724 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :about 2 minutes < 1294526728 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: to generate < 1294526729 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah great! that will make coordinate two tunnels much easier < 1294526740 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that was wasted time < 1294526741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: then i started building my house, about 2 to 3 minutes < 1294526755 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :generate what? < 1294526758 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: finally it was done, then all the way through this i crafted a few things < 1294526759 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :new trees? :D < 1294526764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pick, sword, bench < 1294526768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was about 2 minutes in total then < 1294526774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yes, it started getting dark soon after. < 1294526781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: umm saplings spawn on leaves if you cut down a tree < 1294526785 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: then the leaves decay and they fall < 1294526785 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, crafting takes 2-5 seconds usually < 1294526790 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why didn't you just hack them? < 1294526791 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i meant crafting in total. < 1294526794 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what < 1294526797 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294526798 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the leaves? < 1294526798 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294526812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i did < 1294526819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but you have to wait for the saplings to generate to get more < 1294526820 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, sure that takes some times. But point is, you wasted time on waiting for saplings < 1294526829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i.e. logs -> wood, wood -> sticks, -> workbench, -> pick, -> sword < 1294526830 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ignore them until you have a good shelter < 1294526833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who cares, saplings took like 20 seconds in total < 1294526834 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so stfu < 1294526842 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also the craftings above weren't done all at once < 1294526843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yeah < 1294526848 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty much didn't stand around for a second. < 1294526860 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you will get at least 2 saplings from a tree without any waiting < 1294526861 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Goddamn it Sam Hughes, update your blog more. < 1294526872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :come back you fucking skeleton i want to kill you < 1294526882 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :usually, that is < 1294526898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did it < 1294526899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg < 1294526901 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am a hero < 1294526918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did i mention i am on hard < 1294526932 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :skeletons are the same on hard < 1294526947 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...i mean CONGRATULATIONS! :) < 1294526950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: shut up < 1294526957 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: their arrows deal greater damage < 1294526959 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, suggestion for better first day handling: craft bench with first log, then axe with the next few. Cut down some more, craft pickaxe. Now build a shelter around the bench you placed, use wood and/or dirt or whatever is around. Doesn't matter if it is in wooded area, Way better that it is near spawn in case you die. Then you will have a nearby shelter < 1294526960 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true. < 1294526971 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, then hunt coal < 1294526974 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's less discouraging < 1294526991 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, now, second day you look for a nice place for actual main base < 1294526996 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also i didn't remember that, but that's not important. < 1294527035 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :another way to do things: take random direction, RUN < 1294527041 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you can craft the sword during the first night. Also keep track of time so you can get back to shelter in time < 1294527050 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :work all day, run all night < 1294527065 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shelters are for wimps < 1294527088 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I did that once < 1294527096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: except < 1294527100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: a creeper exploded me in the water < 1294527105 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i had to get onto land or shit would happen < 1294527109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because another was coming < 1294527111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i got onto land < 1294527115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then a zombie appeared < 1294527118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the creeper got there < 1294527123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i died, pretty much < 1294527208 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would've survived all that. < 1294527210 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all of it. < 1294527216 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm you never see any live humans. But there are skeletons and zombies. Presumably you are like the last man on earth. Post-apocalypse. Except scenery looks too untouched for that. < 1294527220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what would you have done, then < 1294527225 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: there is one other ... < 1294527230 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, a hoax yeah < 1294527234 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you know, the usual i woulda killed them all < 1294527238 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: h e r o b r . . < 1294527243 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with my BARE HANDS < 1294527246 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the hoax yes < 1294527251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yeah i tried that, but they killed me < 1294527254 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Stop. < 1294527260 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, stop what? < 1294527266 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's hard to explain, i'd have to show you < 1294527302 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh wait, do you use that mod that adds him? IIRC there was some human-mob mod too. That added both friendly and enemy humans. That built stuff even. < 1294527329 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any mod to do it is probably not as good as it should be < 1294527340 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i doubt he cuts down trees, for instance < 1294527344 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, they did < 1294527350 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, they didn't add doors though iirc < 1294527351 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they, i mean a herobrine mod < 1294527356 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the human mob stuff you can go up to < 1294527361 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :herobrine you can't get near < 1294527371 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1294527400 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: he's always just out of reach. < 1294527404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay why do all the enemy mobs have such fucking terrifying noises < 1294527435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294527438 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :two hours ago: < 1294527439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://twitter.com/notch/status/23849639551700992 < 1294527443 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :suspiciously < 1294527444 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SPECIFIC < 1294527445 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :denial < 1294527446 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't you think? < 1294527476 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Oh no, I don't have a sister called Sandra who killed 10 people and then became web-famous by pretending to be a fish. And she definitely isn't secretly half-black." < 1294527484 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i feel this situation is comparable) < 1294527509 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://manicdigger.sourceforge.net/news/ < 1294527543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone showed that to notch on twitter and he's all ":|||" < 1294527562 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1294527564 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what does it do? It doesn't really say. Just news. < 1294527570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: um look at screenshots < 1294527571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a MC clone < 1294527575 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294527576 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems to be compatible with MC servers too, well, circa july < 1294527597 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't seem updated < 1294527603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh apparently it's actually about as old as mc... presumably they, eh, realigned their priorities after MC got popular though < 1294527609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably better coded mind you < 1294527615 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably < 1294527648 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-214-21.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294527660 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (i feel this situation is comparable) <-- not really no < 1294527666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294527697 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so is that the semi-mythical Minecraft Clone With A Chance? < 1294527708 0 :invariable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1294527711 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294527713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: It doesn't look good mind you. < 1294527714 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, he stated he never had a brother except a half-one he never met. And that herobrine isn't real. Presumably in reply to someone? < 1294527717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Notch seems pissed. < 1294527718 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294527721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Herobrine is real. < 1294527725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Yeah, I pretty much live by XKCD" ————————————————————Notch~~~~~ < 1294527728 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(1) it's lowercase < 1294527730 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(2) ha ha ha ha ha die < 1294527731 0 :invariable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294527733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(3) did i mention i hate you < 1294527737 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(4) oh how i hate you < 1294527749 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why not boycott the game then! < 1294527756 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yes, but he's *Notch*. He always hates people who build on his work. < 1294527756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :too addictive < 1294527760 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Herobrine is real? < 1294527762 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Evidence? < 1294527769 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if notch were a drug dealer < 1294527772 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, none whatsoever :P < 1294527772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he would b... < 1294527773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1294527774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh < 1294527775 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he kind of is. < 1294527788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: http://www.minecraftwiki.net/images/6/68/1283223082465.jpg has photographic proof. < 1294527809 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, well know hoax :P < 1294527818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal is wrong. < 1294527819 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, "photographic proof" is completely useless here. < 1294527829 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hell, there's an hMod plugin that adds Herobrine. < 1294527847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: did you know: talking to people who refuse to not take anything seriously is like talking to Vorpal < 1294527874 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh? < 1294527877 0 :drakhan!~drakhan@c34-243.icpnet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1294527884 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That parses weirdly for me. < 1294527890 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't take things too seriously < 1294527898 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I don't take things seriously enough... < 1294527903 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Am I the anti-Vorpal? < 1294527927 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, are you saying that you aren't being serious about Herobrine? < 1294527939 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :absolutely not < 1294527941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :herobrine is real < 1294527946 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :AntiVorpal < 1294527957 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo < 1294527965 0 :AntiVorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Note: This nick should not be construed to mean that I hate Vorpal] < 1294527965 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Factor < 1294527985 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AntiVorpal, you should ghost elliott now :P < 1294527987 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, guess it broke again :D < 1294527995 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: just steal my nick :{ < 1294527998 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is punishment enough < 1294528002 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to know the evil Vorpal is using my nick < 1294528009 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, har, as if I would let myself be ghosted < 1294528027 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Disconnected by services < 1294528035 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1294528054 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294528054 0 :Sgeo!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294528062 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that's your password sgeo? < 1294528068 0 :AntiVorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION promises not to do that again, unless you actually get on my nerves < 1294528074 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ Sgeo (~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott) has joined #esoteric <-- except you aren't logged in as him < 1294528080 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't bother < 1294528105 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(FWIW, the only evidence I would actually accept of Herobrine (or any other ultra-rare events in a moddable game) would be if someone actually pointed me to the exact line where it says addHerobrine() in the MC jar.) < 1294528125 0 :AntiVorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Herobrine? < 1294528127 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, would you accept add_herobrine() instead? < 1294528147 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AntiVorpal, widespread Minecraft myth. < 1294528152 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, NO. < 1294528203 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: you DO realise that nobody believes herobrine? < 1294528209 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is, and always has been, a joke < 1294528235 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, well, I do now. < 1294528241 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, this one: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=111753 < 1294528248 0 :AntiVorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, when you pulled similar BS on me, you didn't admit it until I directly asked another channel and made a fool of myself there < 1294528267 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AntiVorpal: yes, because you believing that was hilarious in a pathetic kind of way. < 1294528270 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: done it yet? < 1294528273 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AntiVorpal, what do you expect from elliott? < 1294528284 0 :AntiVorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, is consistency too much to ask? < 1294528297 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: dude, he reacted to "#machomebrew" by asking whether Apple _really_ didn't let people run unsigned code on their computers < 1294528310 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then kept believing it when me and Phantom__Hoover told him how, yes indeed, there were only a few interpreters and they only ran signed code < 1294528323 0 :AntiVorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, what makes you think I actually believed it? < 1294528324 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, I presume that channel is for their locked down products then? < 1294528333 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AntiVorpal: um because you've been offended by it ever since? < 1294528336 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no, it's a package manager. < 1294528348 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :elliott < 1294528350 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, well okay. Did he know this? < 1294528360 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Disconnected by services < 1294528369 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no. but it was damn obvious that we were mocking him. < 1294528380 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :beyond even "moron in a hurry" level. < 1294528387 0 :elliott!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294528388 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Phantom_Hoover < 1294528395 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :darn, one second too quick < 1294528396 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, that was not very nice. < 1294528402 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294528402 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294528410 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: sgeo did it to me :) < 1294528414 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, I have it on secure in any case. < 1294528424 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't care, i just wanted to ghost you < 1294528431 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like herobrine < 1294528432 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : darn, one second too quick < 1294528450 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294528451 0 :AntiVorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, I'm not threatening to ghost you again... until I get bored of this nick, at any rate < 1294528453 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i could have ghosted you again < 1294528468 0 :AntiVorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I'll likely give you warning < 1294528481 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you screenshot? < 1294528491 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: F1+F2 < 1294528493 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't i tell you that < 1294528494 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoever is the real elliott atm: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=122479 < 1294528500 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's Phantom_Hoover < 1294528500 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you might be interested in that < 1294528519 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm. < 1294528527 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it still authenticate you if you choose to stay back < 1294528527 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no idea if it logs in < 1294528532 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't tried it < 1294528541 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftforum.net/download/file.php?avatar=49238_1293764836.jpg omg what are these, they look delicious < 1294528561 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/c50oW.png < 1294528564 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol one of the idlers in here replied to that thread < 1294528565 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay sgeo is ehird I guess. *checks /whois* < 1294528577 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, yes? < 1294528580 0 :AntiVorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, you weren't paying attention to the nick changes? < 1294528591 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :reminds me of when Gregor and I were each other for like < 1294528591 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hours < 1294528593 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: :D < 1294528595 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: tree hideaway < 1294528599 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AntiVorpal, well not after "+ elliott is now known as Phantom_Hoover" < 1294528605 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can yu see the creepers < 1294528614 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they watch me at night :( < 1294528623 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, switch to peaceful? < 1294528629 0 :AntiVorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is now known as JesusChrist < 1294528647 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION downloads the untested os x version < 1294528653 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: why not build a house :P < 1294528684 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do we end up with such an insane number of lurkers? < 1294528705 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aww hi creeper :3 < 1294528708 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :creepers are kinda cute < 1294528710 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i actually don't mind them < 1294528717 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd rather have all creepers and no zombies/spiders/skeletons < 1294528719 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :creepers don't make scary noises < 1294528722 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and are relatively easy to deal withi < 1294528724 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*with < 1294528742 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :question < 1294528747 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you guys pick up enemy drops at night < 1294528752 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like i don't wanna lose this sulphur < 1294528815 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: is there a way to deal with this?? http://i.imgur.com/KqQ16.png < 1294528825 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: sure < 1294528825 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he is going to destroy D: < 1294528830 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: get close to it, bash with sword < 1294528832 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he'll retreat < 1294528833 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go up to him < 1294528834 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :repeat < 1294528842 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :either he'll die or, worst case, explode further away from your structure < 1294528907 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Sgeo: is there a way to deal with this?? http://i.imgur.com/KqQ16.png <-- your structure looks insufficiently secured? < 1294528914 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh shut up < 1294528920 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's easy enough to deal with creeper < 1294528920 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s < 1294528922 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, no walls < 1294528924 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and beauty takes priority < 1294528924 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no roof < 1294528926 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so on < 1294528927 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what < 1294528928 0 :MigoMipo_A!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Bye < 1294528928 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who cares < 1294528942 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, what is it? not a shelter at least < 1294528952 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i'm going to build a house on top of a high stack of dirt < 1294528964 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, and beauty comes second place to "does it's job well" < 1294528976 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it is obviously not meant for use at night < 1294528987 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: cool! it worked < 1294528995 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, indeed. < 1294529000 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: :) < 1294529003 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :elliott < 1294529009 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't wanna not get credit for all this good advice < 1294529039 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, and if being beautiful is the job then of course it comes in first place. By the same definition. < 1294529059 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ^ < 1294529080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm < 1294529086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't see the relevance < 1294529105 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know what would be cool? an smp server which spawns everyone really far away from each other < 1294529111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with monsters that it < 1294529124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd have to set up a little empire and fort before you have enough materials and stuff to start finding other people < 1294529176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"At the end of 2010, the "open-source" software movement, whose activists tend to be fringe academics and ponytailed computer geeks" — wall street journal. ha < 1294529191 0 :AntiVorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo < 1294529196 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/ns ghost sgeo < 1294529207 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, somehow, I'm not scared < 1294529207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop stealing Sgeo's nick, antivorpal < 1294529229 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seth, gold, activeworlds... no passwords found yet < 1294529237 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294529240 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Sgeo, and beauty comes second place to "does it's job well" < 1294529247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*its < 1294529277 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, there is no actual need for walls when you're in the air. < 1294529291 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, true. But how did the creeper get up? < 1294529347 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not on the structure. < 1294529351 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As can be plainly seen. < 1294529366 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Omg, I should make a wall-less house. < 1294529369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just floor and ceiling. < 1294529372 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the air. < 1294529382 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, I gave Vegastrike a try and found it supremely boring. < 1294529382 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, that was a power cut < 1294529466 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : It's not on the structure. <-- it is up in the tree however < 1294529494 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and actually very near the structure. In fact I think it is in it, it looks like it dips down there < 1294529521 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay at my step-mother calling me mentally ill < 1294529524 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION angers < 1294529535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lolllllll < 1294529545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sgeo home of stability < 1294529549 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, it feels like it had potential to be a good game, but the project seems to have more or less died. Or seemed to when I last checked. < 1294529558 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, my step-mother doesn't live here < 1294529562 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If she did, I'd go insane < 1294529567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sgeo, < 1294529578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a slogan < 1294529597 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, how have you not murdered your stepmother yet < 1294529608 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i found an actual, meaningful error in the compile < 1294529608 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :r < 1294529622 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D < 1294529624 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one that's not a missed typo, but a complete failure of brianing < 1294529626 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*braining < 1294529653 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, yes... I think it's just a general lack of interest in space sims. < 1294529664 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless i'm mistaken, everything is completely wrong, although it's very hard to notice. < 1294529671 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :augur[food] < 1294529696 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, i'm not sure multiple examples have actually helped the brancher at all, or something :D < 1294529703 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure what the situ is yet < 1294529730 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Literally the only two I can think of in active development are Oolite (held afloat on a raft of nostalgia) and Infinity (depressingly near being vapourware). < 1294529765 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, realistic space sims: too small market segment < 1294529769 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EVE does not count as a space sim here, since it's more of a MMO RTS. < 1294529789 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, no, I mean generic space flight sims. < 1294529804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the great thing about asteroids ii is that it has great market potential! < 1294529809 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, generic as in including unrealistic ones too? < 1294529816 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, yes. < 1294529820 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294529822 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's basically an insane shooter! but awesome! < 1294529834 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, that's stranger. < 1294529857 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm defining space sim as "you have a spaceship which you fly around in a non-automated fashion". < 1294529877 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is minecraft in that definition? < 1294529878 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which excludes EVE etc. in one fell stroke, since their flight system is "right click". < 1294529907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Have I mentioned that I am terrible at Asteroids? < 1294529909 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 MMORTS < 1294529913 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you haven't < 1294529916 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I should get involved with EVE? < 1294529932 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like Shattered Galaxy a lot, except for having to decide what stats to put points into < 1294529932 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: If you like spreadsheets. < 1294529934 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, do you enjoy fiddling with Excel? < 1294529938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: EVE has a lot of that. < 1294529946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You "learn" automatically. Somehow. < 1294529947 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't like the thought of applying math < 1294529950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it takes time. < 1294529961 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, well, there's none of *that*. < 1294529963 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Math for math's sake is fun. Math for gaming purposes is not. < 1294529966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you're not good at accounting EVE is probably going to be a bit of a drag, though. < 1294529983 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No EVE, then. Ok. < 1294529986 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: BTW, if you're good enough, you can play for free. You can buy the monthly subscription with in-game money. < 1294530007 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'd probably have to spend a few months paid and also be amazing to be able to do that exclusively, though. < 1294530022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And you might have to blow up some ships and steal their money to do it. < 1294530035 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Yes, this is legal in EVE.) < 1294530047 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's sad, really: space sims are a venerable genre with a history going back nearly as far as the idea of using a computer to play games. < 1294530084 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION <3 Microsoft Allegiance < 1294530136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Allegiance, the multiplayer space-combat game from the minds of Microsoft Research, combines the challenges of tactical squadron-based combat, intense one-on-one space dogfights, and amazing graphical and sound effects into a space-action experience like nothing you've seen before." < 1294530139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like Asteroids II, but worse. < 1294530178 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh is it 3d? lol < 1294530181 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :crap < 1294530202 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also get the sense that I am the only person under the age of 40 in the Oolite community. < 1294530204 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that website is dead < 1294530219 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It's probably not Newtonian, and it's also 3D. < 1294530219 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://freeallegiance.org/ < 1294530231 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It is, therefore, *vastly* inferior to Asteroids II. < 1294530243 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Newtonian 3D flight is not something with a good reputation. < 1294530248 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cf. Frontier. < 1294530253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: That's why Asteroids II isn't 3D. < 1294530268 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: As far as I know a 2D Newtonian space shooter just hasn't been created yet. < 1294530272 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You do realize it's not a single-player game? < 1294530284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Asteroids II doesn't even have a single player mode ... or if it does it's a very low priority. < 1294530292 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1294530293 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I *really* want to give the ICP a spin, but it's Windows only and even on Wine it falls afoul of the Evil Graphical Glitch. < 1294530295 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*) < 1294530303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ICP? < 1294530320 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the prototype of Infinity's combat. < 1294530326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1294530342 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Um, do you actually know what Asteroids II is? < 1294530345 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Notable for a) being the only solid evidence of progress and b) being Newtonian and 3D. < 1294530346 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No < 1294530352 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Asteroids II? < 1294530354 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, http://au.gamespot.com/gamespot/features/pc/bestof_2000/p2_15.html < 1294530380 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It's a 2D multiplayer space shooter based on Newtonian mechanics with gravity (including orbits) and localised physics distortions (e.g. slowing down the speed of light to trap someone, then shooting the hell out of that bubble before they can escape). < 1294530387 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, why newtonian? < 1294530388 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the awesome physics-based space shooter that me, elliott and (sort of) oklopol came up with. < 1294530400 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Because orbits. < 1294530408 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why not base it on general relativity? < 1294530410 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, in the case of ICP, who knows. < 1294530415 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Ha ha ha ha ha ah a ha ha ha hahahaahahahahahahahaha < 1294530432 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, because I do not actually have any idea what the hell a tensor is or what they do. < 1294530433 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't think Astroids II and Allegiance are in competition < 1294530441 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, ah < 1294530442 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Says the person who always abandons one language for another] < 1294530447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Yes, sure they are. < 1294530456 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Allegiance is a bad shooter that is neither Newtonian nor 2D. < 1294530459 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Asteroids II is therefore superior. < 1294530468 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why is being 3D bad as such? < 1294530477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Because movement in 3D is a bitch and distracts from shooting shit. < 1294530481 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oi, those criteria include FS2 which was good. < 1294530482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also you can't do Newtonian well in 3D. < 1294530485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It ends up not being fun. < 1294530485 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, uh. Joystick? < 1294530493 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: >_> < 1294530498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Still not nearly as smooth as 2D. < 1294530502 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it was! < 1294530515 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, 3D is perfectly navigatable with joystick. Though not very much with just keyboard and mouse < 1294530521 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's cathartic when you need to blow stuff up! < 1294530543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Regardless, 3D Newtonian is a bitch. < 1294530545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Newtonian is <3. < 1294530549 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ergo 2D. (Or 4D!) < 1294530549 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, to code or? < 1294530553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: To play. < 1294530556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not very fun. < 1294530573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2D Newtonian hasn't been reacted-to yet because as of yet nobody has done it, as far as we know. < 1294530581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :However it's probably going to be superficially similar to Asteroids in how flight works. < 1294530584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thus the codename. < 1294530585 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm. Do you dislike realistic 3D sims in general? < 1294530591 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, such as flightsims. < 1294530594 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, erm, Asteroids is 2D Newtonian. < 1294530598 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(In that turning around doesn't actually stop you flying in the way you're flying.) < 1294530601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Is it proper Newtonian? < 1294530604 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Spacewar is 2D Newtonian. < 1294530609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or just a vague approximation? < 1294530610 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Star Control is 2D Newtonian. < 1294530617 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, define "proper". < 1294530623 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: As proper as gravity.lisp. < 1294530633 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :star control had that yeah < 1294530633 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, similar thing happens in Alleg. It's not Newtonian though, need thrusters to keep moving etc < 1294530633 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If not, as far as I'm concerned, gravity basically changes a lot. < 1294530635 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fights < 1294530643 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no, but the essential features are there, other than unlimited acceleration. < 1294530656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well, it's the little bits that'll be innovative. :p < 1294530656 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least it rings a bell < 1294530657 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, why not a relativistic 2d game, instead of newtonian? < 1294530662 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (In that turning around doesn't actually stop you flying in the way you're flying.) <-- well duh. Even EV Override does that. It's 2D. And it is hardly realistic when it comes to other stuff (no gravity from planets and so on) < 1294530663 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Spacewar and Star Control both have (limited) gravitation. < 1294530664 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Because we're doing it on computers. < 1294530676 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, uh? < 1294530676 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, because the calculations for that are sodding difficult. < 1294530680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Ours isn't limited. :p < 1294530682 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1294530686 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Additionally multiplayer would be impossible. < 1294530690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You need, like, perfect sync. < 1294530692 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I cannot understand the equations" difficult. < 1294530704 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I cannot get even the vague gist of the equations" difficult. < 1294530710 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Anyway, physics distortion is innovative. :p < 1294530722 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I do not understand the concepts behind the equations" difficuly. < 1294530725 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, IS IT < 1294530727 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there any way I can help? < 1294530744 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : If Sgeo gets involved, I'm quitting < 1294530753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Can you program in Amber? < 1294530762 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm sure I can learn Amber < 1294530765 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not fair. It is a new language you invented for this. < 1294530765 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, it's day. I'm going to go out there, sword in hand, try not to die, and punch some trees. < 1294530771 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, see that too ^ < 1294530779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: My, my, life isn't fire, Vorpal. < 1294530782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*fair, < 1294530782 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott, I'm sure I can learn Amber < 1294530784 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It _is_ fire. < 1294530788 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, *I* cannot program in Amber. < 1294530797 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No, but I hired you on other criteria. < 1294530799 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, wha? < 1294530810 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is only elliott _capable_ of programming in Amber? < 1294530815 0 :augur[food]!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :augur < 1294530818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyone can, it's a trivial language :P < 1294530818 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That makes no bleeding sense < 1294530821 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, elliott is making a new language just for this project < 1294530821 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, I know nothing of it other than "it's C with GC and lambdas". < 1294530835 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C with lambdas ooh < 1294530837 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott has not actually defined it beyond some code snippets. < 1294530838 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, thus only he knows it yet. < 1294530848 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, "making", not "made" < 1294530851 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, is he slacking? < 1294530853 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :adding GC doesn't really have to change anything < 1294530859 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the progger < 1294530868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yeah it's just that the GC is precise < 1294530870 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He has concluded that CL is TOO SLOW and that I need to program 3 inches from the metal. < 1294530874 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: which you can't do in C without ugly annotations < 1294530884 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Too slow, not really, but without bindings to things we need, yes. < 1294530887 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, based on profiling? < 1294530893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Too slow, not really, but without bindings to things we need, yes. < 1294530894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ^ < 1294530904 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes it arrived same second < 1294530905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, as much as you love profiling, it is possible to use reason as well as blind testing. < 1294530905 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, erm, one can always bind with CL's FFI. < 1294530911 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, there are no good CL implementations with good ways to bind to ... what Phantom_Hoover said < 1294530916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ...which is a large project in itself. < 1294530927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Amber is explicitly designed to not require bindings. < 1294530939 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, larger than writing your own language and using the C interface? < 1294530947 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Making it a perfect language for Active Worlds bots! < 1294530956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Amber is also a nice language. :p < 1294530968 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ALSO: GC time. < 1294530977 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_Any_ GC that causes _any_ significant pause is completely unacceptable. < 1294530982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because the game will freeze. < 1294530990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor's generational GC is much faster than boehm. < 1294530999 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So hopefully it won't cause noticeable pauses. < 1294531010 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And current CL GCs? < 1294531012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(If it does, I'll have to see if I can get a parallel GC.) < 1294531015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Are stop-the-world. < 1294531027 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what about haskell gc < 1294531027 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, all of them? < 1294531035 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA < 1294531044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: A Haskell game would spend an upsetting amount of time in IO without FRP. < 1294531045 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I do not know the model of haskell's gc < 1294531048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes. Well, maybe not Franz's. < 1294531057 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: GHC's garbage collector is concurrent but I do not know that it's parallel. < 1294531067 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what's the best way for me to learn FRP? < 1294531073 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm < 1294531079 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Don't. < 1294531084 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are no useful implementations yet. < 1294531085 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why not? < 1294531086 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1294531087 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and why not use FRP then? < 1294531097 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: There are no useful implementations yet. Well, a few contenders, but. < 1294531099 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is FRP? < 1294531101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Definitely nothing commercial-ready. < 1294531102 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah < 1294531105 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: functional reactive programming < 1294531107 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294531113 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks for clearing it up < 1294531115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: did i mention i don't know where my house is < 1294531116 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: YW < 1294531120 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Racket has an implementation? < 1294531121 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah umm, can you get a "greater than?" function to compile? :D < 1294531126 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because i sure can't. < 1294531127 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, fail < 1294531128 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how can you not know? < 1294531130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I CAN TRY < 1294531140 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: because i had to walk to somewhere with enough space for a house first day < 1294531141 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, apparently it will make the entire world into kittens. < 1294531145 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems conditions vs multiarg is completely wrong < 1294531151 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, he can get lost inside a 3x3x3 room in minecraft :P < 1294531159 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FRP is what makes functional programming possible. < 1294531165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rather than functional core with imperative interface code. < 1294531183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ok i will < 1294531184 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, he is THAT bad at navigating. (Okay, slight exaggeration, but not much) < 1294531184 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: sec < 1294531185 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rofl < 1294531192 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Going to try MC again < 1294531194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: what < 1294531196 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Goddamn it, I have the Star Control 2 Ur-Quan theme stuck in my head < 1294531201 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you're spouting nonsense < 1294531206 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: I am not. < 1294531216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Alternatively: Tell that to Conal's face. < 1294531245 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's at least bulshytt < 1294531254 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this looks interesting: http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Functional_Reactive_Programming < 1294531255 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what you're saying, anyways < 1294531259 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: OH MAN THANKS FOR YOUR CONVINCING ARGUMENTS < 1294531263 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good to know you are right < 1294531283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll go back to using haskell, which is perfect as it is, obviously, despite the fact that many of the "leading" haskellers don't like IO and want FRP to succeed < 1294531290 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: they're as high quality as your usual arguments < 1294531297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: oh, fuck off. < 1294531308 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't feel like it < 1294531317 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can just run two copies of the program, and allocate a huge amount of memory in the other one, then always take the image drawn by the program that has recently changed the screen more < 1294531326 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is my solution to gc freezing < 1294531336 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott: they're as high quality as your usual arguments <-- coppro++ < 1294531339 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*allocate at first < 1294531346 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that its gc cycle is different < 1294531353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: does it make you feel good to automatically agree with and side with anyone who doesn't agree with me? < 1294531356 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your argument is pretty much a vague appeal to authority < 1294531362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're in good company! like... Republicans! < 1294531366 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than any argument or even explanation of FRP < 1294531366 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: no, see, i haven't presented any arguments < 1294531369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: i've just told you to go away < 1294531373 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, http://docs.racket-lang.org/frtime/index.html isn't decent/ < 1294531382 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I have no idea. I agreed with him based on actually agreeing on the point he was making. < 1294531392 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: your argument is that FRP is "what makes functional programming possible" < 1294531393 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so I never tried out what you suggested. < 1294531399 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: the IO monad is imperative. < 1294531400 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm not going away < 1294531403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it wasn't an argument, also. < 1294531404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was a remark. < 1294531412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: no, it isn't. a good general implementation of FRP requires solutions to a few open research problems. < 1294531430 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the IO monad is interprative only depending on your interpretation of it < 1294531448 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, does it feel good to always use strawman arguments by the way? < 1294531462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ah... you see, you are making the same mistake as coppro < 1294531465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not making an argument. < 1294531468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm telling you to fuck off. < 1294531480 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I am replying to this line in the same style: " Vorpal: does it make you feel good to automatically agree with and side with anyone who doesn't agree with me?" < 1294531488 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: we're not fucking off < 1294531491 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: the IO monad is not impure iff C is impure. < 1294531494 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, if you're going to tell people to fuck off, I'm going to tell you to fuck off. < 1294531496 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you wish to stop having us talk to you < 1294531498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, but you see, if I /ignore you, then you *will* fuck off. < 1294531500 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need to leave < 1294531504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :untrue < 1294531508 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd like to rem HER ark. < 1294531511 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1294531512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IRC clients have had ignore for the past two decades < 1294531514 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm scrolled up again < 1294531517 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also appeal to authority: " coppro: Alternatively: Tell that to Conal's face." < 1294531518 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then that makes even less sense < 1294531528 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: see, that was telling him to fuck off. < 1294531534 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you /ignoreing me is not me fucking off; < 1294531538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i thought an argument with coppro could be in any way productive, i would have responded differently. < 1294531544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, you see, i don't, because he always acts the exact same way < 1294531555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: greater than works. < 1294531559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- greater than? < 1294531559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Condition: ['compare', '#0', '#1'] < 1294531560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (-1) < 1294531561 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'#0' < 1294531563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (0) < 1294531563 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, actually I think FRP looks interesting. But I despise the way you argument by being a jerk. < 1294531564 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't know if what you're saying has merit, but I am furious at you telling people to fuck off just because you disagree with them < 1294531565 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'#0' < 1294531567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (1) < 1294531569 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'#1' < 1294531570 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: obviously no Haskell code will be truly functional < 1294531575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: *I am not arguing* < 1294531578 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no code on any Von Neumann machine will be < 1294531584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: ...loooool < 1294531596 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, okay if you say so. Looked damn similar however. < 1294531601 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what the fuck < 1294531604 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ignored until, say, you figure out the difference between language and implementation, coppro < 1294531606 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: do you want to refute my argument? < 1294531609 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the hell < 1294531610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1294531613 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, the impurity of Haskell lies right outside Haskell < 1294531617 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I know < 1294531626 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh so maybe i did something completely fuck when i changed that one last bit. < 1294531646 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D my greater than? works even if you don't give it #0 and #1 < 1294531652 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- greater than? < 1294531652 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Condition: ['compare', '#0', '#1'] < 1294531652 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (-1) < 1294531653 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: your argument is that IO is not pure because of how it is implemented, but FRP is pure because it can be implemented so that it can be pure < 1294531653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :['compare', '#0', '#0'] < 1294531655 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (0) < 1294531657 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :['compare', '#0', '#0'] < 1294531657 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. you have no logic < 1294531659 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (1) < 1294531661 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :['compare', '#0', '#1'] < 1294531663 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: how amazing is that < 1294531678 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1294531683 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's genius :D < 1294531689 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Magic Set Editor scripting language is almost pure. It has a few impurities which I think could be easily corrected. < 1294531698 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: lolwut < 1294531703 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it is not < 1294531717 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: look beneath the surface < 1294531730 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: can i see your code? :P < 1294531735 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what < 1294531740 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Why do you think? < 1294531747 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: it's an imperative language... < 1294531747 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: nm < 1294531750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :greater than? ~ {. -1, 3 -> 0 < 1294531750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 3, 5 -> 0 } < 1294531750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :greater than? ~ {. 3, 3 -> 0 < 1294531751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . -2, -2 -> 0 } < 1294531753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :greater than? ~ {. 3, -1 -> 1 < 1294531754 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it happens to have first-class functions < 1294531754 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Well, I am making TeXnicard and it is more like dc instead?) < 1294531755 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lox < 1294531755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 5, 3 -> 1 } < 1294531757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :greater than? ~ compare; #0; #1 < 1294531759 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: maybe removing <> made it work, but i doubt it < 1294531794 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: No it only has local variables and those are not impure. They are only local. < 1294531812 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: how do you define pure? < 1294531907 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: It would be pure if you change the random number functions to take a parameter "seed" which is normally by the built-in variable called "seed", which is available (and reseeded) for each export template, add card scripts, and pack generation. And also the export template functions for directory should instead return a list, ... < 1294531921 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: < 1294531923 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: define pure for me < 1294531924 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm < 1294531930 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... and you return from the export template script, the list of all of those concatenated together and then it will copy the files. Instead of duing it immediately. < 1294531930 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ValueError: substring not found :( < 1294531935 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There, that would be pure. < 1294531938 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :look at this code snippet of mine, and tell me what you think < 1294531939 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what < 1294531939 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :greater than? ~ {. 5, 6 -> 0 . 10, 12 -> 1 } < 1294531940 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :greater than? ~ {. 2, 2 -> 0 . 6, 6 -> 1 } < 1294531942 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wrote this code < 1294531948 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then i looked at it for 15 minutes < 1294531956 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Do you understand me? < 1294531958 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i should sleep amore < 1294531959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think you are my favourite person and can i come live with you < 1294531963 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294531964 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294531967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HOORAY < 1294531973 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've always wanted a 15yo gf < 1294531996 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294531999 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who is interested in clue < 1294532001 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :13 just too young? < 1294532006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, insufficiently clueterested < 1294532016 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clueterested sounds like some...horrible medical procedure < 1294532024 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: no < 1294532027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like they redirect your bladder to your balls because it got infested or something < 1294532029 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: because you have failed to define pure < 1294532039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway! < 1294532044 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know it is not a proper definition but doesn't it help? < 1294532047 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294532054 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to know what your definition of pure it < 1294532055 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*is < 1294532102 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no global state? < 1294532123 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: That every function affects and is affected by, nothing outside of itself. Other variables outside of the function can be considered like a special kind of parameters, and so can variable assignment commands, because they can also be considered like parameters to the rest of the lines of the current function. < 1294532154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think you have a bug or something < 1294532166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: the current time of day is a paraemter to the program! < 1294532166 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: in clue.py? < 1294532167 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*parameter < 1294532169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EVERYTHING IS PURE < 1294532171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes < 1294532175 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why < 1294532176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: < 1294532185 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[is list?(#0)] < 1294532185 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 0 => 0 < 1294532185 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 1 => inc(#2) < 1294532187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's only one recursion < 1294532189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and one parameter < 1294532190 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: ... < 1294532190 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that should be #1 < 1294532193 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it isn't < 1294532195 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :??? < 1294532209 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It does mean that for random numbers, you do have to keep track of the seed counter by yourself, but it could be defined a syntax to do so (like the increment operator in C) < 1294532211 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.... dunno? < 1294532218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well. :D < 1294532223 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll try defining the function in lu < 1294532224 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LUATRE < 1294532225 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :luatre < 1294532227 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see if it works < 1294532235 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, int getRandomNumber { return 2; //chosen by a random die roll} < 1294532240 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no seed required < 1294532268 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and yes - I really did just roll a die) < 1294532292 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The time of day, as long as it is set only once and stays the same for as long as the function takes to execute, it can work. (You could also have it set during card script, and a "action" script that you push a key to set date/time to the script so you can set it on the card, otherwise everything changes whenever you load the set!) < 1294532379 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That way, would make it pure. < 1294532397 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: pivot works! < 1294532441 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: gimme your files so i can merge them in :D < 1294532444 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: or < 1294532448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: was it just the pivot code that was bad < 1294532464 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :greater than? had an error, nothing else xD < 1294532489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so the pivot code was right? < 1294532496 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could make these suggested changes if you want to make MSE pure (it is not the most important thing); or use TeXnicard (which uses a different model of templates, so it doesn't need pure). < 1294532753 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i think so < 1294532769 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trying to make the actual quicksort now < 1294532800 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i have this vague feeling in my balls that that's not gonna happen anytime soon < 1294532810 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeeeeeeah < 1294532811 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no. < 1294532913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My new home is in the air. < 1294532916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although it's not tall enough to jump. < 1294532922 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so can i have clue.py/stuff.py < 1294532937 0 :pingveno!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Write error: Broken pipe < 1294532937 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i have a huge amount of horribly ugly debug code :D < 1294532943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can remove it :) < 1294532952 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meeeeeeeeeeeeehh < 1294532958 0 :pingveno!~pingveno@c-98-246-133-8.hsd1.or.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294532958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i want the coooode < 1294532961 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll make qs wirk furst < 1294532992 0 :cheater00!~cheater@g228063186.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294533006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: dof~{.0->0.5->0}dof~{:.[[1,2],[3,4]]->2:[1,2]->1:.[[[1,2,3],4],5]->3:[[1,2,3],4]->2}dof~is list?; cons; car; cdr; inc; #0 < 1294533006 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TypeError: 'int' object is unsubscriptable :( < 1294533008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294533015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: dof~{.0->0 . 5->0}dof~{:.[[1,2],[3,4]]->2:[1,2]->1:.[[[1,2,3],4],5]->3:[[1,2,3],4]->2}dof~is list?; cons; car; cdr; inc; #0 < 1294533015 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TypeError: 'int' object is unsubscriptable :( < 1294533019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :halp < 1294533067 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294533084 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ha;pl < 1294533171 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294533274 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"That's not irony." ;; on the internet NOTHING counts as ironic < 1294533364 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :god dammit! Coq is evil < 1294533381 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's designed to hurt me < 1294533400 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything is impossible but only after you waste 10 mins proving lemmas < 1294533475 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, you clearly have the same high standards for *everything* as elliott. < 1294533497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294533501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :air is so lame < 1294533507 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To the extent that nothing actually satisfies the standards without violating several laws of physics or precepts of mathematics. < 1294533518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DAMMIT I WANT ANTIGRAVITY < 1294533527 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds about right :D < 1294533537 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Then invent one antigravity. < 1294533540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm trying to think of something that i can honestly say is perfect < 1294533546 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without any qualifiers < 1294533548 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TeX? < 1294533551 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i just ... can't < 1294533553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: heck no :) < 1294533561 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's even _impure_! < 1294533568 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, for what it was originally designed? < 1294533578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: plain tex is gross, whatever zzo38 said < 1294533582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :latex is a bit limited sometimes < 1294533587 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TeX is very good but not quite perfect. < 1294533647 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LaTeX and PDF are much worse. < 1294533669 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION → sleep < 1294533672 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294533687 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION - wake up < 1294533715 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1294533741 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: btw you're right in that there kind of is an interpreter, it's only the actual function applications that are made into python functions. < 1294533742 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello < 1294533746 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i guess you already knew that < 1294533750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :told you < 1294533752 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294533756 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I define a new data type like lists except that it cannot have trailing zeros: [0,1,2,0,44,5] is okay but [3,54,2,0,13,0] is a type error < 1294533776 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you have opinion/comment/suggestion/question about this? http://sprunge.us/BFGb < 1294533779 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, for some reason i just didn't realize that's actually a rather important part of execution, and not just something that's done at first < 1294533798 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :reason is probably that i haven't been able to think all that straight today < 1294533808 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance i watched hours of gay porn < 1294533818 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: see above < 1294533829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: and? < 1294533832 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: definition accepted < 1294533832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what then < 1294533834 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thatos all :D < 1294533838 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294533844 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now I have to program with it :( < 1294533855 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Then don't watch pornography anymore. < 1294533904 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION suddenly wants to buy Chessudoku < 1294533904 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nono i think it was more like that i wasn't thinking straight so i started watching men lick each other's balls on the internet < 1294533911 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and not the other way around < 1294533932 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the reason for this is that i didn't sleep very well < 1294533941 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my head is all wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeerlie. < 1294533944 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294533945 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1294533971 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah i'll go on with... i don't remember what but maybe i do when i open py < 1294534016 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i think i managed to make a program with an actual runtime error :D < 1294534021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: wow < 1294534042 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: re ball licking, i think zzo38 just doesn't want anyone to wtach pornography < 1294534044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*watch < 1294534049 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least i think quicksorting a list of 7 objects shouldn't take more than 100 deep recursion... < 1294534053 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294534070 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: is this true? < 1294534080 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i basically watch pornography as a hobby < 1294534091 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is absolutely crap < 1294534105 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not possible to define this list type in any useful way < 1294534114 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: No, it isn't true. I don't want to watch pornography myself, if other people do I don't complain. However, if you watch pornography and you cannot do anything else, then obviously you have done something wrong, such as not watching it upsidedown. < 1294534144 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you want to do something else, but can't, then yes, i agree, you should probably flip your screen < 1294534148 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I am not trying to stop you from watching pornography, I am just trying to suggest better things) < 1294534202 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well watching porn can be interesting, once you get past the whole mmm pussy let's masturbate thing. < 1294534248 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have done rather exhaustive research in many areas, but haven't found a publisher yet. < 1294534252 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I wanted to prove (forall x, [p](x) = [q](x)) -> p = q -- p and q are lists of numbers which represent polynomials, and [p] is the evaluation of p < 1294534265 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: In what areas have you done exhaustive research? < 1294534281 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you really want to know? < 1294534299 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: No, I just want to know why you have not found a publisher yet. < 1294534300 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haven't found a publisher? < 1294534306 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you publish it by yourself? < 1294534306 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the most common paraphilias, regular porn is not very interesting outside the mm pussy part < 1294534325 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is the difference? < 1294534412 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hard to put into words < 1294534433 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's interesting how people react in weird situatoins < 1294534436 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*situations < 1294534437 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :say in scat < 1294534449 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is a *very* diverse branch of porn < 1294534481 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the rules are completely different < 1294534506 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, so you want to tell the difference which pornography movies you like which are interesting as opposed to non-interesting pornography. Is that it? < 1294534542 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly i'm interested in what people will do for money < 1294534550 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and how well they can hide it < 1294534615 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also, a single type of porn will have a rather clear set of rules, for instance even you might know that in american porn, the girl blows the guy, then they have sex a couple minutes in the basic positions, then the guy jizzes in her face < 1294534633 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is not how things like bukkake and scat work < 1294534645 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's roughly how it works, but a lot of subtletieas < 1294534647 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*subtleties < 1294534665 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually I wouldn't know, I don't like to watch pornography. But at least now I know that it is not so simple to categorize. < 1294534697 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, if you have a pornography store or archive you would need subcategory for those kind of things, I guess. < 1294534723 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem with categorization is it really never works < 1294534730 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least that is a bit better hobby than ordinary watching pornography. < 1294534731 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294534803 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean it's easy to categorize based on certain elements, like for most people it would suffice that "in this movie girls has sex with donkey" < 1294534822 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like < 1294534831 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's rather easy to categorize based on what people actually wanna wank to < 1294534865 0 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-4db42d05.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294534871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i am totally moving in < 1294534875 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only in #esoteric does pornography get treated academically. < 1294534875 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because most people either have one of a list common elements they want to see in their porn, and it's easy to find porn categorized based on those < 1294534885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: erm plenty of other places too i would think :P < 1294534893 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ONLY IN #ESOTERIC < 1294534896 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: :P < 1294534898 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like mm i wanna see fat chicks mm i wanna see japs licking each other's faces < 1294534933 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you are going to make a report would you categorize it? Such as, subcategories might be: artistic, photograph, movie, professional, manga, man, woman, American, children, animal, hard, soft, joke, ..... < 1294534946 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but once you get even slightly deeper, you can't really put your finger on the category, for instance there is obviously a continuous scale of whether the people actually enjoy touching each other < 1294534993 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: are you sure you would include the children category :D < 1294535029 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess that's supposed to be the "amateur" category, but it doesn't really work that way < 1294535031 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Of course child pornography is illegal but you need to include such a category anyways even if it is hidden < 1294535057 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION looks at scrollback < 1294535059 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: There is a black market for it, I'm sure. < 1294535059 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the hell!? < 1294535061 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"[ ] Children (don't click this) (no really)" < 1294535067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: we're talking about pornography, hi < 1294535076 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :sebbu < 1294535077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: no shit :P < 1294535082 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes that was what I reacted to < 1294535086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: tell us more < 1294535087 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: no, i wouldn't categorize like that at all < 1294535106 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those overlap < 1294535111 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: OK. How would you categorize? Do you need to make a report of how you categorize? < 1294535111 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not to mention that drawn depictions thereof are generally *legal*. Though it will suck if you get accused of pedophilia and caught with such. < 1294535115 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294535123 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, maybe there is some overlap though? < 1294535157 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, I mean, for most useful categorisations < 1294535161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: not in the uk actually < 1294535166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as of recently... now i look suspicious for knowing this < 1294535168 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have not meant to imply it is a category that you select exactly one category. < 1294535170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not legal, that is < 1294535178 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: i would analyze individual movies < 1294535195 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i had to write a report < 1294535231 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Aren't you doing this for the purpose of writing a report, though? < 1294535239 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really < 1294535243 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just thought you were interesting < 1294535247 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*interested < 1294535268 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course I don't know because I don't like to watch pornography. I am only making suggestion. < 1294535276 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably I am entirely wrong. < 1294535306 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: oh well yeah i would definitely agree with having those as terms for certain types of porn < 1294535308 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yeah, but the UK probably still has laws against women showing ankle, I'm sure. < 1294535309 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294535327 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but for instance "hardcore" means nothing as an on/off scale < 1294535350 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can be anything between "actual sex!" and max hardcore (actor) < 1294535357 0 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-4db4232d.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294535399 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: it's better than the USA's laws against women implying they might show ankle < 1294535401 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Then maybe you need to add a category titled "actual_sex"? < 1294535404 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I believe it isn't legal in Sweden either. IIRC there was some court case some years ago that suggested that the law was to be interpreted as it not being legal. Though textual stories of the same would probably be. < 1294535424 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: i'm not very good at putting things like reactions of people into words, so i doubt i could ever actually write any sort of report on anything. < 1294535431 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i doubt anyone can do that < 1294535446 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I seem to recall it being precedent that the 1st amendment bars bans on child pornography without actual children involved in the creation thereof. < 1294535453 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least, in the US. < 1294535466 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, yeah the 1st amendment is only relevant for US < 1294535469 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I thought you previously said at first that you were going to write a report, and you need it published?? < 1294535476 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ... For now. < 1294535477 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294535482 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, what do you mean < 1294535482 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm pretty sure the 1st amendment doesn't ban that < 1294535487 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't really matter what they say, because cp and necro fans can soon just make their own animations. < 1294535499 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Joking suggestion that the US will conquer everything. That's all. < 1294535501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: We're going to give you democracy. < 1294535506 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you just publish it by yourself? Or publish it in a pornography store? < 1294535508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hardcore-style. < 1294535521 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" oklopol: I thought you previously said at first that you were going to write a report, and you need it published??" <<< are we talking about this because you took that seriously < 1294535521 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I'm just waiting for China to invade you ;P < 1294535522 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294535534 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I was about to make that joke, except funnier < 1294535537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes. < 1294535541 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Oh, they're not going to invade. < 1294535543 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, gee thanks :P < 1294535561 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: They'll just purchase. < 1294535563 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So much cleaner. < 1294535564 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, oh true. They can probably buy you for a tenth of the market value < 1294535588 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have watched tons of porn simply out of pure interest (not saying i haven't also watched tons of it because of penis), that's all i meant. < 1294535589 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or as the market value would have been if you hadn't managed the economy so badly) < 1294535593 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arguably, they've been working on the down payment. < 1294535596 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: OK, if you cannot write a report, then don't. But you seem to know enough about these things to write a very small report. < 1294535602 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1294535619 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(China is the largest holder of federal debt ATM) < 1294535622 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, only after it all went bad < 1294535633 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(if you meant what I thought you meant) < 1294535649 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: lol speaking of max hardcore who you mentioned: "Based on Max Extreme 4, the city of Los Angeles in 1998 charged him with child pornography and distribution of obscenity. The fact that the actress was over the age of 18 was not disputed; they brought charges based solely on the fact that the actress was portraying a character who was underage." < 1294535652 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i usually aim for a certain level of professionalism in everything i do < 1294535672 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he has a lot of movies like that < 1294535689 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the amount obscenity is incredible for an american actor < 1294535692 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*of < 1294535755 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :americans tend to do even rather hardcore stuff with a hollywood style feel of unrealness. < 1294535770 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unlike japs who are just insane < 1294535846 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294535848 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno if i've seen that movie, i've been out of the game for quite a while < 1294535853 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh 1998 < 1294535857 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then probably < 1294535858 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Germans, who seem to have a fondness for feces. < 1294535880 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's also that brazilian group, best known for 2g1c < 1294535913 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fucking crazy bastards. < 1294535915 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294535923 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: have you watched SWAP.AVI? < 1294535927 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they have a very unique way of doing things < 1294535935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: y/n < 1294535936 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1294535941 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: dunno, but usually i've seen the original movies years before these clips are made < 1294535943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*SWAP.avi < 1294535945 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: http://www.somethingawful.com/d/horrors-of-porn/horrible-saga-swapavi.php < 1294535950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it was requested by the something awful forums < 1294535959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: to be the most ridiculous and inexplicable scat film possible < 1294535963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and they actually made it according to the requirements < 1294535966 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh the jap one? < 1294535966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it is ... yeah < 1294535969 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1294535970 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the silver suits < 1294535970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that i know of < 1294535971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brazil < 1294535972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294535974 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: read http://www.somethingawful.com/d/horrors-of-porn/horrible-saga-swapavi.php < 1294535975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's hilarious < 1294535978 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :will < 1294535979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pics are barfy though < 1294535980 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know... < 1294535985 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sexual Content: Imagine if the Holocaust was a 63 minute long video about pooping. Now imagine your mother drowning in a bathtub full of diarrhea. This is the sexual content of SWAP.avi. < 1294535986 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should just never unignore elliott < 1294535992 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this channel is that much nicer without him < 1294536029 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, only issue is missing out of more than half of the convos < 1294536029 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well there are tons of 63 minute movies about pooping < 1294536034 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he is the most active speaker in here < 1294536036 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(still I think) < 1294536056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no, no, keep watching < 1294536091 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night → < 1294536099 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i'm just waiting for you to have to do enough work that you leave and i will be able to completely dominate, making me in control of who ignores and gets ignores entirely based on channel flow. < 1294536148 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: under the circumstances, i am starting to agree < 1294536221 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTF? < 1294536337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hey oklopol is the one who started the scat talk < 1294536365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ?FTW < 1294536377 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION decides he will ignore elliott's advice and re-investigate Ur/Web < 1294536382 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh dear god. < 1294536423 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: who was that at? < 1294536425 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Set your user mode +D if you want to ignore someone, next time. < 1294536439 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: < 1294536442 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: < 1294536445 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: why < 1294536450 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, mode +giDRQ < 1294536452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders wtf pikhq is doing < 1294536461 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: WTFing at coppro and oerjan. < 1294536465 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: you and your funny blank lines < 1294536470 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Next time you want to ignore someone, do like that instead. < 1294536471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: why < 1294536479 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks pretty run-of-the-mill < 1294536480 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :based on pics < 1294536483 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol zzo38 < 1294536486 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :18:19 I should just never unignore elliott < 1294536490 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :18:19 this channel is that much nicer without him < 1294536493 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :18:22 coppro: under the circumstances, i am starting to agree < 1294536509 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think oerjan is either complaining about my joke wrt controlling the channel flow. or the scat. < 1294536511 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should ignore myself, it'd be fun < 1294536513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never be able to correct typos < 1294536525 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: because while sometimes he provides me with new things to look at, usually what he does is "your worldview disagrees with mine you suck" < 1294536528 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the only reason i started talking about this is that zzo38 insisted < 1294536530 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294536530 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro is just always an idiot, but apparently not idiotic enough to not ignore me < 1294536533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::3 < 1294536538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: let's ban zzo38! < 1294536544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :solve the problem at the root < 1294536546 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that evil troll < 1294536549 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Your worldview disagrees with mine you suck. < 1294536556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Verily < 1294536558 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not just ban everyone, that should be the end of all problems in this channel < 1294536559 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Because I insisted? ??? < 1294536564 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294536565 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: :) < 1294536583 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: Don't ban anyone just set your user mode to +giDRQ -w < 1294536584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: how dare you suggest that < 1294536586 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's ban olsner < 1294536588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also everyone who isn't olsner < 1294536591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a better solution < 1294536615 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how about joining ##elliott < 1294536616 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: that must have looked funny to elliott < 1294536620 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: hey wait that _was_ a blank line, i thought you were doing something japanese i couldn't see < 1294536622 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And leaving #esoeric < 1294536625 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" oklopol: In what areas have you done exhaustive research?" " What is the difference?" so i figured i'll take an example that makes you say "okay yeah i don't wanna know". < 1294536625 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Setting the user mode like this is the best way to ignoring someone, instead. < 1294536626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"##"elliott? < 1294536627 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294536633 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'm an official representative for myself. < 1294536635 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean probably. < 1294536640 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am also considering /ignoring zzo38 < 1294536640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So the extra # is ... not really needed ... < 1294536646 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you just kept asking for more < 1294536652 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on account of him never actually saying anything useful < 1294536654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: but, aww, you're hilarious when you're pissy < 1294536676 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: You do not need to ignore zzo38 or anyone else. If you want to ignore someone just set your user mode instead. < 1294536694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: SHUT UP ABOUT USER MODES < 1294536729 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: unless they're programmed in enhanced cweb < 1294536733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is your irc server programmed in enhanced cweb? < 1294536738 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can i download it with your web browser? < 1294536739 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, definitely /ignoring zzo38 < 1294536742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :will it run on your linux distribution? < 1294536749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :will I be able to configure it? < 1294536753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it have user modes? < 1294536771 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I did not write it entirely by myself. But both of these program will run my Linux distribution, you will be able to configure it, and it does have user modes. < 1294536771 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, Gilad Bracha actually admires Racket's module system? < 1294536772 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: how in the world is a user mode not containing information about a nick supposed to ignore them? < 1294536782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it's not written in Enhanced CWEB, I don't care, zzo38. < 1294536785 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Try it and see how. < 1294536792 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: because it ignores everyone? or something? < 1294536799 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what olsner said < 1294536809 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It is not written in Enhanced CWEB although maybe I can make change so that the next version is with Enhanced CWEB. < 1294536814 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: so it's joke, ok. < 1294536817 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*a joke < 1294536825 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's probably a joke < 1294536831 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but zzo38 never actually says anything useful < 1294536835 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(no i didn't try) < 1294536837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, the most hilarious joke < 1294536850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so why do you want to ignore me, i kinda want to optimise for annoying people? < 1294536867 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+Dg will make it so you pretty much can't receive messages < 1294536923 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the rest aren't really necessary < 1294536966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think oerjan has me on ignore < 1294536968 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i feel kinda special < 1294536969 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that scat thing < 1294536971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :usually he just bans people instead :D < 1294536972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294536977 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: oklopol was the one talking about it :P < 1294536986 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YEAH JUST MAKE ECUSES < 1294536990 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*EXCUSES < 1294536990 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, define "useful" < 1294537021 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You don't have me on ignore. Is what I say ever actually more useful than what zzo38 says? < 1294537025 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yes < 1294537029 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was talking about it because i was asked, and i don't think i mentioned anything that explicit < 1294537033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: that's an exceedingly good point < 1294537036 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i might ignore the both of you < 1294537036 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: because unlike you, talking to zzo38 is like talking to a brick wall < 1294537051 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he never backs his claims up; he just rambles on about dumb things < 1294537056 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you seem to have some modicum of curiosity < 1294537058 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With some of the bricks sideways and upsidedown. < 1294537064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294537075 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thank you, I guess < 1294537076 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he just seems to get dumb ideas in his head and defend them to the death < 1294537080 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and by "to the death" < 1294537088 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean "by repeating them over and over with no arguments" < 1294537098 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is it about people losing their temper over zzo38 lately < 1294537108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: he didn't _use_ to spend every minute talking about enhanced cweb < 1294537119 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, it's not that he gets dumb ideas... just ideas that are of interest to him and him alone, as far as I've seen. < 1294537120 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm possibly < 1294537121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and butting into random, completely unrelated comments to talk about how everything you do should be in enhanced cweb. < 1294537140 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and, also, never actually really responds to any questioning or rebuttals of anything he says. < 1294537153 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tbh the "quantum free will" crap from a few days ago is what started annoying me, i didn't really care before that < 1294537164 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I try to respond, at least. But maybe I do not do such good response. < 1294537167 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: there was one a few days ago < 1294537171 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm too lazy to dig it out < 1294537181 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right the metaquantumwhodunnawutzit < 1294537184 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ooh, sounds like a discussion I'd be interested in < 1294537198 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38 annoyed me once for a few seconds < 1294537206 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was long ago tho < 1294537211 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: apparently you can understand quantum free will by inverting a wikipedia article on itself to create a causality loop and then writing down the entanglement equation < 1294537213 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Then read the log file you can read everything on this channel in the past days and weeks and months and years by anyone in this channel regardless of who wrote it. < 1294537215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: but not assuming the other part is real or even exists. < 1294537220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: This is almost a direct quote by the way. < 1294537232 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: also, life creates the universe, but the universe creates life, and you can't have only one. < 1294537240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: also rocks have life but not very much life so they don't create the universe much. < 1294537243 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I mean not inverting the article itself, but based on the double inversion of the things which the article discusses!! < 1294537254 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The article itself is not invert) < 1294537256 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The double inversion? So ... a no operation? < 1294537271 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION contrapositives zzo38 twice < 1294537277 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: No, I mean to have both the invert and double invert together. < 1294537288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. Because contradictions prove things! < 1294537288 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, combined in one piece. < 1294537292 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, instead of inverting the ideas, try just describing them? < 1294537302 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As inverted, I mean < 1294537304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: oh god we spent a whole day doing this, why did you go and say that < 1294537307 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I try to describe them? < 1294537318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: his explanation is that it's not life which creates the universe, it's both and neither. < 1294537332 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" elliott: I mean not inverting the article itself, but based on the double inversion of the things which the article discusses!!" <<< okay clearly elliott had misunderstood you completely < 1294537333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: based on an article by some random quack written about on wikipedia who says that life is necessary for the universe or some crap. < 1294537338 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Ah, now you can understand a bit better. < 1294537343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: not at all. < 1294537348 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, instead of describing ideas in terms of Wikipedia articles, describe them on their own terms, then optionally relate it to the article < 1294537350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well it's kind of hard to interpret nonsense < 1294537354 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote cosmology < 1294537358 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Final Anthromorphic Principle? < 1294537367 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wants to slap whoever came up with that < 1294537368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: no, not that, and it's "anthropomorphic". < 1294537371 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: and that was Penrose. < 1294537371 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1294537376 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm i didn't add it to qdb < 1294537386 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: can it run qsort yet < 1294537406 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then add it (assuming HackEgo is not just broken) < 1294537406 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i've been busy ircing and thinking about whether i should read for that exam of mine < 1294537411 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :study < 1294537420 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Perhaps you should do the exam. < 1294537430 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*study for < 1294537439 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION admires zzo38 not getting upset by the insults being hurled at him < 1294537453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XIYO < 1294537458 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X in Y out, Y not mentioning X < 1294537471 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know what i should do, that doesn't necessarily mean i'll do it < 1294537472 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, unsafeCoerce? < 1294537483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: no, zzo38. < 1294537503 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that a pure function < 1294537521 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, zzo38 breaks the type system. Awesome. < 1294537528 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no. < 1294537529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Y is fixed. < 1294537532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f _ = 3 < 1294537535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is basically zzo38. < 1294537538 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294537560 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :funniiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii < 1294537580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol Y is fixed < 1294537583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahahahahahahahaha ahem < 1294537584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1294537585 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol < 1294537588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does qsort run yet < 1294537596 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you know < 1294537598 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does and does not < 1294537602 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294537607 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly does not < 1294537649 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still cluein around? < 1294537655 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294537656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorta < 1294537658 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well are you fixing it < 1294537670 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p5451998242.txt < 1294537671 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294537673 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you < 1294537678 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :look at the output of compilation < 1294537700 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean it compiles, but as i said, runtime error, i dunno what to dooooo < 1294537711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: um yes, but you understand that i've been asking for your latest version < 1294537714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: because mine hangs on that < 1294537717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so...gimme the py files < 1294537742 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION vaguely wonders if Ioke is a bit like the only thing I like about Racket < 1294537800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i really need to fix shutup. < 1294537809 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p1815468777.txt http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p5342334176.txt < 1294537816 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at your own safetylessness. < 1294537835 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is more type-system-breaky than zzo38. Sometimes I'll say stuff out of the blue that has no connection to anything whatsoever, sometimes I'll say something semi-relevant, and sometimes I'll ask relevant questions < 1294537838 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the way i debug is less than optimal :D < 1294537849 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what makes you think it's broken? < 1294537856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: what < 1294537862 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shutup < 1294537871 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: also, orange juice is nice. *slurp* < 1294537872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: well when i nicked to sgeo and said Factor it didn't yell at me. < 1294537878 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Factor < 1294537880 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Sometimes anyone might do, isn't it? < 1294537880 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: especially when it's fecal matter! < 1294537883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what's "cool" < 1294537883 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's yelling at me < 1294537893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh jesus. < 1294537894 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: debugging < 1294537895 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294537902 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see < 1294537903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you know what, remove all the debugging code and i'll make sure qsort works < 1294537906 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :glue is very general < 1294537910 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor's apples to oranges comparision convinced me to like oranges < 1294537913 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1294537923 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i want to debug a specific moment of compilation < 1294537932 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :things are messy < 1294537942 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: erm, why? < 1294537947 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are just print statements < 1294537951 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: because i have to merge it into _my_ version < 1294537964 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: which means considering all your changes and making sure they work without conditionals < 1294537974 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: pain enough to do that when I have all this cool stuff too :P < 1294537980 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course they work without them, i only change glue < 1294537998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: fine < 1294537999 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool stuff is just print statements, i use a global so i can trigger stuff in stuff.py as well. < 1294538052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ if isinstance(l,list) and len(l)==0:return 1 < 1294538052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ return 0 < 1294538055 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: < 1294538063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :return int(isinstance(l,list) and len(l)==0) < 1294538083 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what a useful correction < 1294538087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep! < 1294538091 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thank you < 1294538115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so is demolishing a failed policy? < 1294538133 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really, it still makes ski very fast < 1294538149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but you haven't made it good yet. right. :p < 1294538187 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294538203 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it gives a 6x improvement in one test case, so given that we currently have 2 test cases, i wouldn't exactly call it a failure < 1294538216 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1294538237 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might be qs that's the odder one < 1294538243 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i doubt it) < 1294538245 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294538258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what do you use random for < 1294538260 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ! < 1294538273 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing atm < 1294538282 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i added it to test random searching for fun < 1294538305 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that... didn't go well < 1294538309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294538377 0 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-4db4fc23.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294538436 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hate this damn router < 1294538442 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: "death" to crash the program < 1294538443 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brilliant < 1294538445 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brilliant yet horrible < 1294538481 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. < 1294538496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what why did you punctuate what < 1294538497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294538500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what and capital < 1294538500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294538501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294538502 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where is oklopol < 1294538504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what did you < 1294538506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where < 1294538508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294538511 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294538516 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SPAM! < 1294538517 0 :ChanServ!unknown@unknown.invalid MODE #esoteric :+o oerjan < 1294538524 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294538525 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OKLOPOL JUST CAPITALISED AND PUNCTUATED A FUCKING SENTENCE < 1294538527 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do you mean? < 1294538527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...xD < 1294538532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :holy shit stop it < 1294538539 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stop what exactly? < 1294538541 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1294538542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm vomiting < 1294538545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'M VOMITING!!! < 1294538554 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHERE DID YOU PUT OKLOPOL < 1294538565 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can we just get back to the matter at hand, please. < 1294538581 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Oklopol < 1294538582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ if demolishing_done==True and first_round:break < 1294538585 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the real oklopol wrote this code < 1294538588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he knows that you have to check booleans < 1294538591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to see whether they're True < 1294538593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :before conditioning on them < 1294538607 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay. What does that have to do with anything? < 1294538608 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION decides to learn Io < 1294538614 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now that was amusing, i wanted to close the chanserv window and closed #esoteric instead < 1294538616 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: You're not the real oklopol. < 1294538619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: it's a bad language < 1294538629 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, howso? < 1294538631 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: said as someone who developed with it for months. < 1294538637 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: and was part of the |||~~community~~||| < 1294538641 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: for one, it has basically no stdlib. < 1294538645 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :simple string and array functions are completely missing. < 1294538647 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'LL TAKE THAT AS A SIGN NOT TO BAN ELLIOTT YET < 1294538649 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I have no comment. < 1294538653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, there is basically no documentation < 1294538654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: :( < 1294538659 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: what < 1294538684 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: PAY ATTENTION. OR ELSE I'LL BAN YOU ANYWAY. < 1294538709 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so the concept is good, the execution is crap? < 1294538717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: i love how you called a variable demolishing, which stops you executing the demolishing function < 1294538722 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oerjan accidentally exited #esoteric, when he tried to close the message from ChanServ when he opped himself. This meant he could not ban you. < 1294538727 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh my god. < 1294538731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: both are pretty crap. the "pass everything as a function" thing doesn't work well. < 1294538746 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo(hello + world) <-- this could print "hello + world" to the screen even if hello=1 and world=2 < 1294538754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :completely breaking basically... every invariant i can think of in programming < 1294538763 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: see Oklopol gets it. whether or not he's oklopol. < 1294538782 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, isn't that what documentation is for? < 1294538794 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: let's just have no rules. < 1294538800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an arbitrary byte prefix has control over the rest of the program. < 1294538807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :string delimiters? why, functions can choose whichever ones they want. < 1294538812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how can i use this without going insane? < 1294538815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't that what documentation is for? < 1294538908 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i expect tomorrow we'll see in the news about how finland is the center of a new global pandemic of correct spelling, punctuation, and horrible fatal hemorrhaging. < 1294538912 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : def fun(*args): < 1294538913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return call_clue(clue,args,10) < 1294538917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: you changed this to 1000, why? :P < 1294538919 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: :D < 1294538943 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I changed it to 1000 in case quicksort actually happened to need more than 10 levels of function calls. < 1294538980 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: oh my god you sound so...boring and sane like this < 1294538983 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I admit that was a much larger number than should be expected as an upper limit. < 1294538987 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: so tell me, how do you structure your python code, usually < 1294539021 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you be more specific? "I think." < 1294539041 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: like, what is your general coding formatting style! < 1294539067 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The one you see in the .py files i've given you. < 1294539107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: ok i hate you stop it < 1294539112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"i've" < 1294539112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha < 1294539115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have caught you < 1294539116 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you lose < 1294539118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go back to normal < 1294539119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294539146 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Naming varies, because I don't particularly care about names, amount of whitespace varies, but is generally little. I tend to write rather long segments of code for doing simple things, even if I know a shorter way. < 1294539159 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...anyway, creepyklopol, < 1294539160 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue.DepthLimitException: depth limit exceeded (cadar) < 1294539161 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I had a typo. < 1294539162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do < 1294539168 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also, are you going to be like this forever < 1294539168 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Congrats for noticing. < 1294539192 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no seriously what do < 1294539199 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what you are referring to. Is that from running quicksort? < 1294539202 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: only until the hemorrhages start < 1294539205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: no from running ski < 1294539224 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. Heh, I guess I've broken something then. < 1294539227 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm can demolishing_done be a non-boolean :D < 1294539234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just looking at the differences between our codes < 1294539240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: yeah well... get on fixing that, freak of nature < 1294539270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: note this is with my non-conditional thing < 1294539275 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so maybe the branch-inferrer is taking too long < 1294539280 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :freaks of culture are even creepier < 1294539291 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: it does the same on foo.clue < 1294539295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depth limit exceeded for is negative < 1294539296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294539299 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*negative? < 1294539302 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, given that I've never had a run-time error in a Clue program, and suddenly both programs in existence are failing with the same error... < 1294539318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDD < 1294539325 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :excuse me, btw, but foo.clue breaks too :D < 1294539328 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is just my set of stuff < 1294539330 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ski works for me. < 1294539349 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least that one example program does. < 1294539365 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Somehow I doubt you made another testcase. < 1294539404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: huh what... < 1294539411 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: ok so it's the removal of conditionals that break it < 1294539424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: can we just unify on the non-conditional version to make this a whole lot easier for both of us? :P < 1294539426 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's obviously superior < 1294539486 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't particularly want to since things work very slowly on my machine without that additional complication for the compiler. < 1294539591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: ehh it's actually not slow at all < 1294539601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: it's like, 3/4ths as fast < 1294539604 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also way purer :p < 1294539631 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, you can give me your files once you get SKI to compile. < 1294539659 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And quicksort, since I would very much like to see the program that was inferred for it. < 1294539680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: well uh < 1294539685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: i will try and figure out the bug < 1294539695 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: but only if you talk okloy again < 1294539721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: found it. < 1294539725 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have to eat something now. < 1294539728 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: in glue(), you pass depth_lim to glue_ as True < 1294539728 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, nice. < 1294539731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: which is the same as 1 as an int < 1294539735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: what's it meant to be, 5? < 1294539742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and is orig_objs meant to be True? < 1294539745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you can just correct that call < 1294539755 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I pass it as 5. < 1294539764 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1294539780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: you do not pass it as 5 :) < 1294539789 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1294539792 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: but i'm not sure which way it should be rearranged, so if you could correct it... :P < 1294539819 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To me it looks like I pass it as 5. < 1294539870 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: ok let's count < 1294539872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :True,5,objects) < 1294539878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in the signature < 1294539878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depth_lim,orig_objs=None,objectlookup=None): < 1294539886 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depth_lim=True, orig_objs=5, objectlookup=objects. < 1294539901 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, one argument is not passed from glue. < 1294539911 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The last one. < 1294539923 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh. < 1294539924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :darn. < 1294539953 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: i increased the depth limit and it just overflows python's stack. < 1294539960 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: i conclude you have an infinite loop somewhere. < 1294539978 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: ok pop quiz for you < 1294539980 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :glue is the clue to glue clue together < 1294539983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: where in glue_ do you ever exit? < 1294539991 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, there is one return < 1294540012 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ur/Web takes ideas from functional reactive programming? < 1294540031 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: The infinite loop must be in the generated code. < 1294540036 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: right < 1294540043 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: it's a research language with strong links to type theory that you have mistaken as some kind of industry tool. < 1294540056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: as i have said on numerous occasions, if you don't understand this, you will get nothing out of it. < 1294540073 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the ur-idea < 1294540122 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's Web, it _must_ be industrial! < 1294540166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he should have made it Ur/DependentlyTypedSpreadsheets or something to avoid the peanut gallery < 1294540487 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: so um er fixed the bug yet? :D < 1294540524 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't even know if there's a bug. < 1294540602 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: well. i assume so. < 1294540609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: since it can't even work out "is negative?". < 1294540617 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is negative? ~ {. -1 -> 1 < 1294540617 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . -2 -> 1 } < 1294540617 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is negative? ~ {. 0 -> 0 } < 1294540619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is negative? ~ {. 1 -> 0 < 1294540621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 2 -> 0 } < 1294540623 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is negative? ~ compare; #0; #1 < 1294540627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: which, you know, should not overflow python's stack. < 1294540629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because of depth limit < 1294540657 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It can't? Weird, since SKI and pivot work normally. < 1294540679 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nnnno ski doesn't < 1294540691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue.DepthLimitException: depth limit exceeded (cadar) < 1294540695 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i increase the depth limit the stack just overflows. < 1294540708 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only differences between our two versions is that mine hasn't got <> stuff, as i said < 1294540725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: unless < 1294540727 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :- if demolishing_done and first_round:break < 1294540727 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ if demolishing_done==True and first_round:break < 1294540731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :demolishing_done can't be a non-bool, can it? < 1294540784 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It should always be a boolean. < 1294540852 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I'm sure our versions are essentially identical, but I just plain cannot fix a bug my code does not have. If I've changed something that doesn't play well with your changes, sorry, but that's life. < 1294540880 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: well considering our respective changes shouldn't even interact with glue ... :/ < 1294540895 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed they shouldn't. < 1294540899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sprunge.us/HQiJ is the whole differences... - is mine, + is yours... i'm trying to figure out wtf is up < 1294540915 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you suuuure ski works for you? :/ < 1294541043 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: heh... if i remove most of the ski functions it finally gets a non-limit errors < 1294541045 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*error < 1294541048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(complaining about all the missing things) < 1294541089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: ...okay so, as little as i believe this myself < 1294541093 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just compiled SKI. < 1294541095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: the error was a missing "import clue" in stuff.py. < 1294541100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not kidding. < 1294541105 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What. < 1294541107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess apply_to_visible failed...somehow... < 1294541111 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1294541114 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: do you have any big "catch every error" things? < 1294541116 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that just ignore it? < 1294541120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because that probably caused it if so < 1294541121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah, what :D < 1294541124 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I suppose there was an error, which i catch somewhere. < 1294541131 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sounds like something oklopol would do. < 1294541138 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, but Oklopol would never do that < 1294541171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: so, um, i will try qsort now, can you link me to the current ver? < 1294541183 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is interesting that I haven't run into that problem when debugging that. < 1294541192 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sounds like something that would be a constant annoyance. < 1294541205 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has not changed, but sure. < 1294541225 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p5399236149.txt < 1294541226 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, As far as I can tell, what Ioke calls "macros" are Io-like functions < 1294541229 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: i would have thought your code in general would be a constant annoyance when debugging :) < 1294541234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is, incidentally, not a complaint at all. < 1294541237 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pivot should actually work, quicksort doesn't. < 1294541240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or an insult or w/e < 1294541242 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that less bad than what Io does, since it means most functions don't do that sort of shenanigans? < 1294541247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: also it has changed i don't have qsort < 1294541250 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't find my code particularly hard to debug. < 1294541324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: qsort compiled, at least < 1294541330 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all in less than two seconds, no less < 1294541356 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but er well < 1294541359 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :add(@(pivot left(car(#0) #0)) @(pivot right(car(#0) #0))) < 1294541362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the non-null case for qsort < 1294541369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@ is recursion of course < 1294541380 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What < 1294541384 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now i'm not _certain_ but does qsort result in an integer? < 1294541386 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That looks pretty much right... < 1294541388 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1294541391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294541393 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :add is also append :D < 1294541405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: yes, it works fine here. also, that <2s compilation is without <> marks. < 1294541412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm going to fix my pretty-AST-printer now. < 1294541420 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1294541425 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see what the problem is. < 1294541456 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Add is just the python (+) function, yes. That is not something that should be true. < 1294541457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: oh? < 1294541466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, i'm trying qsort with demolishing now < 1294541467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just for the fun of it < 1294541498 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alright. < 1294541508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: can you tell me why you are talking like this :x < 1294541542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just < 1294541543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :want a reason < 1294541618 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: :( < 1294541702 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't have a reason, sorry. < 1294541718 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Felt like it." < 1294541735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: holy shit holy shit qs compiled < 1294541736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with destructing < 1294541741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :273.050776958 < 1294541743 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294541770 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now i'm gonna try and figure out how to fix my printer < 1294541771 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh. < 1294541786 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: are you going to stop talking like that ever :( < 1294541847 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is interesting that quicksort compiles, I don't see how it can with that bag. < 1294541892 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How can the element used as pivot ever get to the output? < 1294541921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: that's a mighty good point. < 1294541937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- quicksort < 1294541937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[#0] < 1294541937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| [] => #0 < 1294541939 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| <<<{'#0': '#0'}>>><<<{'#1': '@(pivot left(car(#0) #0))', '#0': '#0'}>>>_ => add(@(pivot left(car(#0) #0)) @(pivot right(car(#0) #0))) < 1294541941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ignore between <<< and >>> < 1294541946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(note how mine avoids empty automatically :D) < 1294541959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: that's really weird < 1294541960 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1294541985 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294542005 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294542006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's try it in luatre :) < 1294542010 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: quicksort([]) < 1294542018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh. < 1294542023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::. hello < 1294542024 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :KeyError: 'hello' :( < 1294542026 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: poop < 1294542029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294542032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: [] < 1294542037 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294542078 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294542085 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294542091 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: empty([]) < 1294542094 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf. < 1294542101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... x < 1294542102 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ValueError: substring not found :( < 1294542107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohhh < 1294542109 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eh, turns out it is smarter than me. It actually pivots the whole list by the first element, that that the pivot element itself goes on the right side. < 1294542117 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This way, it doesn't have to add it back. < 1294542118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. empty([]) < 1294542118 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 < 1294542119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: heh :D < 1294542124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::. quicksort < 1294542124 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quicksort: [#0] | [] => #0 | _ => add(#1 @(pivot left(car(#0) #0))) < 1294542134 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: quicksort([4 3 2 1]) < 1294542139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. quicksort([4 3 2 1]) < 1294542140 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RuntimeError: maximum recursion depth exceeded :( < 1294542150 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: your quicksort, it is, mighty "efficient" < 1294542153 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. quicksort([1]) < 1294542154 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RuntimeError: maximum recursion depth exceeded :( < 1294542159 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...:DDDDDddd < 1294542166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. quicksort([]) < 1294542166 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[] < 1294542175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. pivot left(1 []) < 1294542175 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[] < 1294542176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. pivot left(1 [1]) < 1294542176 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[] < 1294542181 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. pivot right(1 [1]) < 1294542181 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[1] < 1294542184 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, the one given by luatre doesn't even call pivot right. < 1294542191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: no no that's a bug in the printer < 1294542198 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i fixed that in my local copy < 1294542200 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ignore its output < 1294542203 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. add(pivot left(1 [1]) pivot right(1 [1])) < 1294542203 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[1] < 1294542208 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. quicksort([1]) < 1294542209 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RuntimeError: maximum recursion depth exceeded :( < 1294542211 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what. < 1294542222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back to fixing my printer and avoiding thinking about that < 1294542260 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1294542262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: so how fast does ski compile for you < 1294542272 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It occurs to me that that quicksort would be an infinite loop in any language. < 1294542279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i'm going to turn destructing on (nice avoidance of the common terminology there btw) to make testing this easier :D < 1294542286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: oh, indeed. :D < 1294542294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: insufficient hinting! < 1294542299 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: often a problem with the branchless form < 1294542303 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it can never actually "use" a piece of the input. < 1294542319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: i'm starting to suspect the whole oklopol thing is one gigantic act < 1294542321 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to make it also return singletons directly. < 1294542323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you're actually a horribly < 1294542324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :horribly < 1294542325 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :normal < 1294542326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :boring person < 1294542328 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294542332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you violate my life's constants < 1294542333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: make him stop < 1294542336 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Either that, or I'm fizzie. < 1294542343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...what < 1294542344 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that true < 1294542359 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you fizz < 1294542360 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1294542361 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ie < 1294542364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :despite being in stockholm < 1294542366 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I've been that much like him. < 1294542372 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you've punctuated and capitalised < 1294542374 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's basically enough < 1294542396 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, let me get back to the code. < 1294542418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the qs code or clue.py < 1294542527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- depth of first < 1294542527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Condition: ['is list?', '#0'] < 1294542527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Base branch (0) < 1294542529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'#0' < 1294542531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rec branch (1) < 1294542533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Subast(0,0):['car', '#1'] < 1294542535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Main ast: ['inc', '#2'] < 1294542537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :w h a t < 1294542541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :deep first ~ {. 1 -> 1 < 1294542541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 2 -> 2 } < 1294542543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :deep first ~ {:. [[1, 2], 3] -> 1 < 1294542545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [1, 2] -> 1 < 1294542547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : :. [1, [2, 3]] -> 1 < 1294542549 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : 1 -> 1 } < 1294542551 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :deep first ~ is list?; cons; car; cdr < 1294542559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: wtf is #1 there < 1294542603 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :First argument, I suppose, although that's #0. < 1294542610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: well precisely... < 1294542615 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Really I don't understand how the numbering works at all. < 1294542617 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294542621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depth of first has the constant #0 < 1294542627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so right, yes, why haven't i handled that < 1294542640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah! < 1294542666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1294542736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- depth of first < 1294542736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[is list?(#0)] < 1294542736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 0 => 0 < 1294542738 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 1 => inc(@(car(#0))) < 1294542740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294542787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- quicksort < 1294542787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[#0] < 1294542787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| [] => #0 < 1294542788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| _ => add(@(pivot left(car(#0) #0)) @(pivot right(car(#0) #0))) < 1294542790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: that's definitely the quicksort code. < 1294542815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: hey you know what clue should be able to do < 1294542821 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: MUTUTALLY RECURSIVE FUNCTIONS < 1294542939 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it should be able to do those. In fact, didn't I mention adding support for that today? < 1294542944 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe I did. < 1294542962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you talk like this in real life < 1294543008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: so, challenge: write even? in clue < 1294543010 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :handling positive and negative numbers < 1294543118 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems that quicksort works fine now. < 1294543125 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was my bad really. < 1294543131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: oh joy: [[clue.DepthLimitException: depth limit exceeded (even?)]] < 1294543136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: also, can i has the code? < 1294543137 0 :res_!~res@96-35-248-155.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294543141 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By which I meant my Clue program was wrong. < 1294543162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION changes the depth limit to 10 and tests :D < 1294543171 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, actually it turns out only lists of lenght 3 can be sorted. < 1294543171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to be fair it is a _very_ complex condition i want < 1294543175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: what :D < 1294543180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: insufficient testcases, man < 1294543192 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: Clue, the only language where not testing enough actually breaks your program. < 1294543249 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: i'm having a bit of trouble making a program with a complex conditional < 1294543268 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: specifically, even? is basically this: "if x<0 then (if x==-2 then 1 else 0) else even?(x-2)" < 1294543275 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i just can't see how to do that, even with multiple functions < 1294543306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1294543316 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can do it with compare to 0 < 1294543321 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :specifically < 1294543365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"[compare(#0,0)] | -1 => 0 | 0 => 1 | 1 => @(dec(dec(#0)))" < 1294543365 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know what I realized? < 1294543368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1294543375 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The program IS STILL CONCEPTUALLY WRONG. < 1294543378 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDD < 1294543396 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :conceptual wrongness exists in program! < 1294543423 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@bas5-toronto47-1167928546.dsl.bell.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1294543434 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know what gave it away? Adding a third test case. < 1294543439 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : :. [1, 2, 3] -> [1, 2, 3] < 1294543439 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [] -> [] < 1294543439 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [1, 2, 3] -> [1, 2, 3] } < 1294543441 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1294543456 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: :D < 1294543458 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :L O L L O L L O L L O L: < 1294543464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i forgot to give positive even? #1 right < 1294543466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- positive even? < 1294543466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[compare(#0 compare(#0 #0))] < 1294543466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| -1 => 0 < 1294543468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 0 => compare(0 dec(0)) < 1294543470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 1 => @(dec(dec(#0))) < 1294543472 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: compare(0 dec(0)) < 1294543473 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love this language. < 1294543476 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :greatest way of writing 1 ever??? < 1294543478 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GREATEST WAY?? < 1294543497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: here's what happens if i don't give it 0 either: < 1294543498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[compare(#0 compare(#0 #0))] < 1294543499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| -1 => compare(#0 #0) < 1294543499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 0 => compare(#0 dec(#0)) < 1294543501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 1 => @(dec(dec(#0))) < 1294543501 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait what? < 1294543503 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :amazing < 1294543505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: wait what what? < 1294543513 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1294543526 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah nm, yes, that is fun. < 1294543527 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 defined as a number equaling its own predecessor? < 1294543539 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: 0 is the python number 0. < 1294543542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: no < 1294543547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf i can't tab complete olsner < 1294543552 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1294543556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: no, compare() is <=> < 1294543560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, -1 if <, 0 if =, 1 if > < 1294543569 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compare(x, x-1) is always 1 < 1294543574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compare(x, x) is always 0 < 1294543578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically, Clue is a genius. < 1294543584 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: wait Oklopol is in stockholm? that clearly explains the change. < 1294543592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: no, fizzie is :P < 1294543596 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294543640 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :osnler is so hard to tab complete < 1294543671 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no seriously, it just doesn't let me :D < 1294543674 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would I be hard to tab complete? < 1294543685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my client is buggy < 1294543685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :evidently < 1294543689 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: PROBABLY YOU'RE IN STOCKHOLM OR SOMETHING < 1294543698 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: so here's a sane compilation of even?: < 1294543699 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[is negative?(#0)] < 1294543699 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 1 => positive even?(negate(#0)) < 1294543700 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is an explanation for _everything_ < 1294543700 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 0 => positive even?(#0) < 1294543713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: but say i were to withhold is negative? from this program < 1294543717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: what does the genius of clue come up with? < 1294543723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[positive even?(#0)] < 1294543723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 0 => positive even?(negate(#0)) < 1294543723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| _ => positive even?(#0) < 1294543727 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294543741 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: probably not, but something could arbitrarily decide that my IP is in stockholm for whatever reason < 1294543778 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: No, oerjan attributed my weird behavior to my being in Stockholm earlier. < 1294543793 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not in Stockholm though. < 1294543795 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: as a member of the Clue Standardisation Board, can I humbly suggest that we both rename "empty" to "empty?". < 1294543799 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*"empty?"? < 1294543801 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is only logical. < 1294543802 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: is empty? < 1294543816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: are you sure, every predicate is getting "is" in front of it D < 1294543817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*:D < 1294543818 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION somehow read that as the Clue Scandinavisation Board < 1294543824 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"is this list empty?" < 1294543826 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: i mean sure but only if you actually make the change < 1294543855 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm not making any changes before quicksort works. I don't know why. < 1294543856 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: isn't weird behaviour just normal behaviour when it comes to you? < 1294543866 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: I don't know. < 1294543868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: well, done in mine :P < 1294543876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: look at how he's fucking talking < 1294543879 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's unbearable :( < 1294543881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so... so wrong < 1294543893 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Okay, I don't exactly mind if your versions differ. < 1294543908 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: i have a feeling you don't think much of elliottclue :) < 1294543911 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I'll do the change at some point. < 1294543913 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You should just relax, I think. < 1294543933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: so uh, speaking of changes...constants in branchers? >_> < 1294543956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://0au.de/~apo/mario.png < 1294543961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: autoconverted, but still, :D < 1294544077 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm sure you already have seen the enterprise [minecraft edition]? -- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kn2-d5a3r94 :> < 1294544089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, like five years ago >:) < 1294544100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X32nuDEvw-4 < 1294544218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. [1 2 3] < 1294544218 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[1 2 3] < 1294544272 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294544290 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294544762 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you ever played brabens frontier elite? probably the best game ever.. travel our galaxy with a cute spaceship, trade, fight pirates..become elite! until now the only game you can land on planets without any loading screens! pretty nice physics..all that on one single floppy(!).. a masterpiece of work.. hope that there will be a sequel some day :/ < 1294544772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover is an Elite fan. < 1294544775 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But everyone hates Frontier. < 1294544784 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not true elliott < 1294544789 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but anyway < 1294544789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, there _was_ a sequel. < 1294544796 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, everyone hates Braben. :p < 1294544803 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea < 1294544826 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: Anyway: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frontier:_First_Encounters < 1294544829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sequel to Frontier. < 1294544848 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder if there where all the pgogrammers are gone < 1294544855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eh? < 1294544874 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea i know that one, but its about 15years old or sth < 1294544885 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sry < 1294544890 0 :res_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Ex-Chat < 1294544892 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-if there < 1294544892 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: so I wrote a clue repl... it lets you specify filenames on cmd line, prints all the asts at startup, lets you evaluate stuff in LuatreLang, lets you load new files, and lets you reload everything < 1294544899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, well, Elite 4. :p < 1294544906 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294544913 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be funn < 1294544916 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1294544917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elite_4 < 1294544919 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Duke Nukem Elite. < 1294544922 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hrhr < 1294544924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Duke Elite Forever. < 1294544928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Elite Nukem Forever. < 1294544934 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wanted < 1294545010 0 :res0001!~res@96-35-248-155.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294545011 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how did he manage to fit all this stuff on one single floppy? < 1294545031 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the old bastard should publish the code < 1294545039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Procedural generation. Also, give more credit to Ian Bell; I imagine most of the procedural generation code Ian Bell had at least some part in. < 1294545055 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :agree < 1294545058 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :respect < 1294545059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: I distinctly recall PH telling me that Braben litigated Bell into taking down the code to Elite. < 1294545071 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So a Frontier source release might happen, mm, approximately never. < 1294545081 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i will code < 1294545083 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it < 1294545085 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::> < 1294545094 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: Why bother, Asteroids II is better. < 1294545106 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it? never played it < 1294545129 0 :res0001!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1294545129 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd, I don't think it exists yet < 1294545182 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds reasonable then *g < 1294545185 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: It's a 2D Newtonian-physics-based shooter with full physics including gravity (with orbits!) and things like localised physics distortion (e.g. slow down speed of light in a bubble that enemy is approaching, circle around it quickly and fire bullets inside before they can get out). < 1294545201 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Being "worked on" very, very slowly by me and PH, whereby most time spent working on it is thumb-twiddling. < 1294545211 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do want it to get finished, though. < 1294545223 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where can i get your alpha? < 1294545230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/dev/null < 1294545235 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :46 seconds to compile quicksort helper, which hopefully was the hard part of quicksort < 1294545243 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294545246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's going to be a commercial game if it ever does get done, so, uh, pony up $(preorder price). :P < 1294545250 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's hope for the best. < 1294545258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The release will come with full source code, allowing redistribution of modifications.) < 1294545280 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cmon.. let me have a look < 1294545285 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that how Minecraft works? < 1294545286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(So modding is perfectly legal and permitted, as well as complete reworks, so long as you either don't distribute enough to reconstruct a large part of the entire game, or only distribute it to people you can reasonably verify own it.) < 1294545289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: There _is no code_ right now. < 1294545291 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Releasing source to purchasers? < 1294545297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: No, Minecraft is just closed source. < 1294545301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just that Java is very easy to disassemble. < 1294545305 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, no less. < 1294545310 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd, there isn't even code for the programming language yet < 1294545315 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You get something very close to the original code minus names (and the modders are working on that). < 1294545315 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294545322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: All that has been written is gravity.lisp, which does 2D Newtonian mechanics with orbits. < 1294545325 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even I have disassembled some Java code. < 1294545332 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y 2d? < 1294545344 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lisp < 1294545348 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1294545349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: Because 3D Newtonian mechanics is considered rather unfun to fly in -- see Frontier ;-) < 1294545354 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: The actual game won't be written in Lisp probably. < 1294545365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it was what PH hacked up that in (it doesn't even have graphics, it just prints tables of numbers). < 1294545379 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's a proof that Oklopol was wrong enough, or how PH interpreted Oklopol was wrong enough, and it can work:P < 1294545380 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*work :P < 1294545381 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what dialect of Lisp? < 1294545382 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(orbits in 2D) < 1294545385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It was Common Lisp. < 1294545393 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>> funcs["quicksort"]([4, 2, 45, 2, 65, 45, 34, 34, 6 ,76]) < 1294545393 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[2, 2, 4, 6, 34, 34, 45, 45, 65, 76] < 1294545397 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What was Oklopol wrong about? < 1294545407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Um, Oklopol said that someone said that orbits don't form well in 2D or something. < 1294545414 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :must lurk into this procedural generetion stuff.. < 1294545423 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: see, with my luatre console, that's as simple as < 1294545430 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can I see proof of orbits forming? < 1294545434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: quicksort([4 2 45 2 65 45 34 34 6 76]) < 1294545434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :! < 1294545444 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: proof, err, not really, ph isn't online and i don't have the code, but < 1294545451 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then call ian and get started with elite4 < 1294545452 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: How fun, now can I try this in your bot? < 1294545452 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::> < 1294545456 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: basically the only problem was a drift over time, caused by setting dx too high < 1294545466 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Please make it run url-given code. < 1294545475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: and it would be low enough in a game < 1294545475 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aren't there plenty of orbit simulators? < 1294545477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: ok, i will < 1294545478 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: So can I see? < 1294545480 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Microsoft Encarta came with one < 1294545484 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: as i said, i don't have the current code < 1294545492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: the point is getting orbits to form naturally with newtonian mechanics in 2d < 1294545512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: I might make luatre just an interface to the repl, tbh, but I'll hack it up right now. < 1294545542 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would be nice to be able to give urls since Clue is sort of a verbose language. < 1294545552 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothin simpler then the newtonian mechanics < 1294545571 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p1926614985.txt < 1294545573 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294545587 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294545598 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p1926614985.txt < 1294545599 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ValueError: substring not found :( < 1294545609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1294545609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294545610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nm < 1294545611 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the point of quicksort append? < 1294545614 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :46 seconds to compile btw < 1294545617 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was trying to evaluate that as a luatre expr < 1294545620 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It's a helper function. < 1294545634 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the kind of appending quicksort does after recursing. < 1294545637 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just no friction.. < 1294545654 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"quicksort helper" on the other hand has no clear meaning whatsoever. < 1294545665 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: What? < 1294545670 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294545675 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294545683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p1926614985.txt < 1294545695 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...... http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p1926614985.txt < 1294545699 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294545700 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH < 1294545701 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294545702 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :inertia, no friction thats all < 1294545722 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its easier then jumpnrun.. i guess < 1294545724 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294545725 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see what friction has to do with anything. < 1294545726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p1926614985.txt < 1294545727 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294545727 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294545727 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exception: Can't compile pivot(), inc twice(), caaar pivot helper(), make singleton(), car pivot helper(), quicksort helper(), pivot condition 2(), caaar with consed(), cons to caaar(), quicksort(), greater than?(), quicksort append(), pivot left(), triple(), caaar(), pivot right(), cons to car(), pivot condition(), caar() :( < 1294545745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: your code is busy using the old busted clue 1.0 ;) < 1294545761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: i, uh, can't really think of a way to fix that that isn't a gigantic hack. < 1294545766 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed! I can fix that. < 1294545785 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: Yeah, thankfully your program is still written in an identical fashion with everywhere. :p < 1294545796 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :friction and gravity and impulse is the only counterforce to inertia in space Oklopol < 1294545797 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck you ~ {. [1] -> [2] . [1] -> [3] } < 1294545812 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p2134133721.txt better? < 1294545819 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no sry < 1294545819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: yes, try it out < 1294545822 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^^I don't think that's syntactically right < 1294545827 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is no friction < 1294545831 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are those raw numbers I see in the code for? < 1294545835 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wait < 1294545836 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're integers. < 1294545836 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :making things preatty simple < 1294545840 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Those are both arguments? < 1294545841 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything is just an example invocation. < 1294545845 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yes. < 1294545848 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Instead of single-argument functions, ok < 1294545853 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So my fuck you makes sense? < 1294545853 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...... http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p2134133721.txt < 1294545855 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294545855 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294545855 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exception: Can't compile pivot(pivot condition), quicksort helper(quicksort append), quicksort(length), quicksort append(append), pivot left(pivot), pivot right(pivot), pivot condition(empty) :( < 1294545855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: it is valid, but you want to drop the [] there prolly, and you need hints < 1294545874 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: it's "is empty?" now :D < 1294545891 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What about it? < 1294545904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: you have "empty" < 1294545906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's "is empty?" < 1294545908 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus the failure < 1294545909 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: fuck you ~ {. 1 -> 2 . 1 -> 3 } fuck you ~ inc; dec; #0; #1; compare < 1294545909 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DepthLimitException: depth limit exceeded (fuck you) :( < 1294545909 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh dear. < 1294545912 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ^ < 1294545918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the bot likes you not < 1294545926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::. quicksort < 1294545926 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :KeyError: 'quicksort' :( < 1294545933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::. pivot < 1294545933 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :KeyError: 'pivot' :( < 1294545949 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: boring ~ {. 1 -> 2 . 1 -> 2 } fuck you ~ inc; dec; #0; #1; compare < 1294545949 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IndexError: list index out of range :( < 1294545952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: btw, why are inc/dec not called succ? also why isn't neg called negate >:) < 1294545961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i kinda see clue as the language of the most verbose, useful names you can come up with, thanks to the spaces < 1294545966 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oops < 1294545972 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: boring ~ {. 1 -> 2 . 1 -> 2 } boring ~ inc; dec; #0; #1; compare < 1294545972 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :boring: [#0] | _ => inc(1) < 1294545975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: also shouldn't your greater than? be "is greater than?" < 1294545982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: you just need inc to do that. obviously. < 1294545984 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: The way around the fact it's annoying to write "is empty?" will be that some sort of type information will usually tell the system what the contents of the bag should be. < 1294545996 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: i was just giving fuck you a fighting chance with some nice functions. < 1294546002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: right. so shouldn't it be "is greater than?" < 1294546011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: and shouldn't neg be negate and sub subtract? < 1294546021 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yesss < 1294546025 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it totl should < 1294546031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: you regressed thank you <3 < 1294546033 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :oklopol < 1294546035 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1294546039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh nothing. < 1294546046 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ke, as they say in the land of the espanolas < 1294546053 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i kinda miss Oklopol now, i have a feeling coherency is about to take a big dip :D < 1294546077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so um can I implement inc->succ; dec->pred in my impl sometime < 1294546078 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i agree with all your naming stuff < 1294546081 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1294546086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't have negate or subtract except in foo.clue < 1294546089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which has them as negate and subtract < 1294546092 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i should pre-load foo.clue < 1294546093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's pretty useful < 1294546100 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the names of things have annoyed me forever, but it's sooooo much work changing them < 1294546124 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.:.:http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p8579956286.txt < 1294546125 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: changed to is empty? yet? < 1294546127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294546128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you forgot space < 1294546131 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.:.: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p8579956286.txt < 1294546132 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294546132 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294546132 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exception: Can't compile pivot(), inc twice(), caaar pivot helper(), make singleton(), car pivot helper(), quicksort helper(), pivot condition 2(), caaar with consed(), cons to caaar(), quicksort(), greater than?(), quicksort append(), pivot left(), triple(), caaar(), pivot right(), cons to car(), pivot condition(), caar() :( < 1294546135 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually that was a typo < 1294546137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294546179 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what now? and also, i'd prefer having negate and abs in the stdlib. i see no point not to < 1294546200 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :remember, this is not a tarpit, it's a high-level language gone really wrong < 1294546224 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what happened < 1294546248 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294546249 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck < 1294546255 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i changed all the id's back already < 1294546255 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294546263 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you fix it K? < 1294546301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: also, negate and abs _are_ in my stdlib < 1294546302 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo.clue < 1294546305 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: also, no :P < 1294546310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: just use python to do it < 1294546319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: open('foo').read().replace('; ','') < 1294546327 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: open('foonew').write(open('foo').read().replace('; ','')) < 1294546357 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nevahh < 1294546381 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1294546391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION renames foo.clue -> std.clue < 1294546395 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294546404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gives you an STD on every use! < 1294546417 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also btw < 1294546425 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you might wanna s/dec/pred/ and inc to succ on your code while you remove < 1294546430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'cuz i'm gonna take advantage of the moment < 1294546433 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i added append as a primitive < 1294546435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or would "predecessor" and "successor" be better :D < 1294546454 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1294546455 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why does id have <> around its name? < 1294546455 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, i'll make it pred and succ < 1294546456 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :totally < 1294546456 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294546461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: old obsolete feature < 1294546465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and i'll implement append in the stdlib < 1294546488 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :technically i could have backwards-compat here < 1294546493 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then you'd never change your progs :D < 1294546495 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"[..]However, Mr Braben said that the pair originally had some difficulty finding a publisher, despite the game being popular with their friends. < 1294546495 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He said that the game was so different from traditional coin-operated games, not least because Elite did not actually have a score, that most publishers rejected it. 'They just didn't get it, they wanted a high score and they wanted players to have three lives' ..lol < 1294546521 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sigh < 1294546535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: btw i have greater than? in my stdlib < 1294546539 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll rename it "is greater than?" < 1294546545 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go ahead < 1294546552 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i still think this verbose naming might be a mistake :D < 1294546583 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well there could be shorthands as well. < 1294546596 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it's not clear what is meant, both are added to the bag! < 1294546610 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the great thing about clue < 1294546616 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :abs should be absolute value, surely < 1294546626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: no :D < 1294546636 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Y NO < 1294546640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: after you get qs working can I eliminate , from arglists and lists too? < 1294546642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since that's like < 1294546644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clearly superior < 1294546652 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: magnitude, then? < 1294546652 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how about "The function that returns the absolute value of the number given as a parameter." < 1294546657 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294546667 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ot that. < 1294546669 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*or < 1294546687 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"A function that returns the negation (the subtraction from zero) of its argument if it is less than zero, or the argument itself if it is greater than or equal to zero." < 1294546691 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, ","'s should be removed < 1294546733 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also what were the things i was supposed to do for the sourch < 1294546741 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(e) < 1294546754 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How much of the stdlib is primitives, and how much is written in Clue? < 1294546789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: there are a handful of both < 1294546797 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: erm < 1294546799 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It's clues all the way down!" < 1294546800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: remove ; < 1294546802 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: turn inc->succ < 1294546806 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: turn dec->pred < 1294546808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that should be it for now i think < 1294546811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also empty-> is empty? < 1294546812 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(IN AN ALTERNATE IDEAL UNIVERSE) < 1294546825 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote ALTERN < 1294546826 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :17) IN AN ALTERNATE UNIVERSE: First, invent the direct mind-computer interface. Second, learn the rest with your NEW MIND-COMPUTER INTERFACE. \ 23) IN AN ALTERNATE UNIVERSE: there is plenty of room to get head twice at once \ 24) In an alternate universe, ehird has taste \ 25) IN AN < 1294546831 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so anyway, my append function is taking A VERY VERY LONG TIME < 1294546833 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are the ... does TC-ness imply? < 1294546842 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: what < 1294546845 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: to compile < 1294546845 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why did I just say imply? I meant.. make sense < 1294546861 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh more hints sped it up :D < 1294546878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- append < 1294546878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[#0] < 1294546878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| [] => #1 < 1294546879 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| _ => cons(car(#0) @(cdr(#0) #0)) < 1294546883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294546908 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::..: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p6825816189.txt < 1294546911 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294546911 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294546911 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exception: Can't compile quicksort helper(quicksort append), quicksort(length), quicksort append(append) :( < 1294546916 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fucking fuck < 1294546922 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT IS WRONG NOW < 1294546925 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :luatre: i added append < 1294546927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*oklopol: < 1294546927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just < 1294546929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me reload the bot < 1294546931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kay? < 1294546937 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well okay..... < 1294546950 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294546956 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294546956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to get std.clue in < 1294546958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok go < 1294546974 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: i imagine there is some function you cannot write in clue because no matter how many sample values you give there is _always_ a candidate function that works for those values and is easier to find. (note: i don't _really_ know how clue works.) < 1294546988 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: but is that function completeable < 1294546990 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*works only for < 1294546995 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::..: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p6825816189.txt < 1294547002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: and remember that it only uses functions _you_ allow it to < 1294547010 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what did you do to it. < 1294547011 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. < 1294547030 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you can basically write imperative code < 1294547035 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294547035 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294547035 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294547039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh heh < 1294547045 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MURDERERS < 1294547047 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE LOT OF YOU < 1294547050 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it takes 46 seconds on my computer < 1294547052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :missed a flush < 1294547054 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294547055 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: try when it comes back < 1294547058 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and with your append, of course much more < 1294547061 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, now < 1294547071 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the function that takes 46 seconds is slow because it uses append so much < 1294547073 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::..: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p6825816189.txt < 1294547074 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294547074 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294547083 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it takes 3 seconds i'll lol at your feeble computer < 1294547089 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294547102 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :computer is heating up < 1294547112 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :consider adding append as a primitive < 1294547119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: consider FUCK YOU < 1294547124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue is a language for beauty, not usefulness < 1294547126 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or ability to run at all < 1294547139 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exception: Can't compile quicksort(length) :( < 1294547143 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: elliott: i sincerly hope you will make a clue wiki page < 1294547145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :DDD < 1294547149 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ability to run at all is not even close a design goal, no < 1294547150 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll add append to std.clue < 1294547150 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*+e < 1294547153 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*to < 1294547174 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :length? < 1294547187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm yes < 1294547188 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :length < 1294547188 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::::. < 1294547189 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i added a length function < 1294547192 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as primitive, do you have it? < 1294547199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::. length < 1294547199 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :KeyError: 'length' :( < 1294547205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294547211 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also make append check that its arg is not an integer < 1294547216 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's very important < 1294547224 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what does it do for integers < 1294547226 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that either of them isn't < 1294547230 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :returns none < 1294547242 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: None the python object? < 1294547244 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are joking yes :) < 1294547246 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1294547254 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well anyway reloading is broken SO < 1294547255 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294547256 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh it has a special meaning < 1294547262 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is an exception < 1294547263 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, i had error < 1294547277 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294547279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i haven't implemented that :) < 1294547282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::. length < 1294547282 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :length: [#0] | [] => 0 | [1 2 3] => succ(@(cdr(#0))) < 1294547285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...:D < 1294547290 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SNEAKY < 1294547296 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at some point, i'm going to add { . [1] -> ! }, that is, erroring out < 1294547302 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: excuse me ^ < 1294547315 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as a primitive type system < 1294547316 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::::. < 1294547318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::. length < 1294547319 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :length: [#0] | [] => 0 | [1 2 3] => succ(@(cdr(#0))) < 1294547321 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::. length < 1294547321 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :length: [#0] | [] => 0 | [1 2 3] => succ(@(cdr(#0))) < 1294547322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::. length < 1294547322 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :length: [#0] | [] => 0 | [1 2 3] => succ(@(cdr(#0))) < 1294547323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::. length < 1294547323 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :length: [#0] | [] => 0 | [1 2 3] => succ(@(cdr(#0))) < 1294547323 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote clue is a language for beauty, not usefulness ability to run at all is not even close to a design goal, no < 1294547324 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294547324 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :262) clue is a language for beauty, not usefulness ability to run at all is not even close to a design goal, no < 1294547324 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...very primitive :D < 1294547330 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294547330 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::. length < 1294547331 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :length: [#0] | [] => 0 | _ => succ(@(cdr(#0))) < 1294547333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's better < 1294547335 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: try now < 1294547342 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::..: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p6825816189.txt < 1294547343 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294547343 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294547343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I _mentioned_ ability to run before that :P < 1294547356 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"just a minute" is funny because it actually takes about a minute. < 1294547363 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :caaar ~ {. [1, 3, 4] -> 4} < 1294547364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :caaar ~ car; cdr < 1294547375 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i suspect this will turn into "[#0] | _ => 4" < 1294547375 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah it's not really caaar < 1294547377 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294547380 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if that's what you mean < 1294547386 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i suspect this will turn into "[#0] | _ => 4" < 1294547387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is what i mean < 1294547390 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes, that is also true :P < 1294547400 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :laptop heating up < 1294547410 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :caaar pivot helper: [#0] | _ => cons to caaar(car(#0) #1) < 1294547410 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :greater than?: [compare(#0 #1)] | 1 => 1 | -1 => 0 | 0 => 0 < 1294547410 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :car pivot helper: [#0] | _ => cons to car(car(#0) #1) < 1294547410 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pivot right: [#0] | _ => caaar(pivot(#0 #1)) < 1294547410 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quicksort helper: [#0] | _ => quicksort append(#0 car(#1) #2) < 1294547411 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pivot condition 2: [greater than?(#0 car(#1))] | 0 => 2 | 1 => 3 < 1294547411 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :caaar: [#0] | _ => car(cdr(cdr(#0))) < 1294547412 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cons to caaar: [#0] | _ => triple(car(#1) caar(#1) caaar with consed(#0 #1)) < 1294547412 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make singleton: [#0] | _ => cons(#0 []) < 1294547413 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quicksort: [length(#0)] | 0 => #0 | 1 => #0 | _ => quicksort helper(@(pivot left(car(#0) #0)) #0 @(pivot right(car(#0) cdr(#0)))) < 1294547413 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quicksort append: [#0] | _ => append(#0 append(make singleton(#1) #2)) < 1294547414 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pivot left: [#0] | _ => car(pivot(#0 #1)) < 1294547414 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :triple: [#0] | _ => cons(#0 cons(#1 make singleton(#2))) < 1294547414 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how could it turn into that < 1294547415 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :caaar with consed: [#0] | _ => cons(#0 caaar(#1)) < 1294547424 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in no way could it turn into that, #4 is not given < 1294547427 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1294547430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay sure try it out < 1294547435 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh < 1294547440 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: quicksort([5 4 1 9 2]) < 1294547440 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... quicksort (1, 2 ,3) < 1294547441 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ValueError: substring not found :( < 1294547441 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asojuhgfiuje < 1294547447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: fail :D < 1294547447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now < 1294547448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's see < 1294547451 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. quicksort([5 4 1 9 2]) < 1294547452 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[1 2 4 5 9] < 1294547456 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\o/ < 1294547456 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  | < 1294547457 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : /`\ < 1294547458 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you are god < 1294547470 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. quicksort([5 4 1 9 2 54 45 643 6 3 67 4 53 564 354 4 55 6 65 5 54 45 45 34 34 54 65 67 76 76 54 6356 345 6 3467 356 46 536 345 6543 6 435 67 58678 54 5 234 5245]) < 1294547471 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[1 2 3 4 4 4 5 5 5 6 6 6 6 9 34 34 45 45 45 46 53 54 54 54 54 54 55 65 65 67 67 67 76 76 234 345 345 354 356 435 536 564 643 3467 5245 6356 6543 58678] < 1294547480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it even runs in finite time! < 1294547482 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's great how the actual programs aren't slow at all < 1294547484 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WITHOUT blowing the stack! < 1294547497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. [5 4 1 9 2 54 45 643 6 3 67 4 53 564 354 4 55 6 65 5 54 45 45 34 34 54 65 67 76 76 54 6356 345 6 3467 356 46 536 345 6543 6 435 67 58678 54 5 234 5245] < 1294547498 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[5 4 1 9 2 54 45 643 6 3 67 4 53 564 354 4 55 6 65 5 54 45 45 34 34 54 65 67 76 76 54 6356 345 6 3467 356 46 536 345 6543 6 435 67 58678 54 5 234 5245] < 1294547503 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. length([5 4 1 9 2 54 45 643 6 3 67 4 53 564 354 4 55 6 65 5 54 45 45 34 34 54 65 67 76 76 54 6356 345 6 3467 356 46 536 345 6543 6 435 67 58678 54 5 234 5245]) < 1294547503 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :48 < 1294547510 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yeah anything that can sort a 48 second list in a second is amazing in my book :D < 1294547512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294547514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*48 element < 1294547533 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you aren't being sarcastic by any chance? :D < 1294547545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: MAYBE < 1294547552 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you sounded very oerjan for that line < 1294547557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/nick oerklopol < 1294547568 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but yeah, p. amazing < 1294547572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how come this actually works < 1294547576 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :idgi < 1294547577 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kinda...damaging my faith in languages? < 1294547581 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe mergesort next < 1294547587 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wanna do it? < 1294547596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: isn't it the clue way that, after doing one sort, you don't need to do any more < 1294547603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because a smart impl could just turn it into any sort it wants < 1294547610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ergo i don't have to do that :D < 1294547613 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yeah probably i should write up a couple page spec < 1294547623 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you've done fib right? < 1294547631 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1294547634 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go for it < 1294547636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh? then I can < 1294547636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1294547651 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'm very close to writing a clue mode for emacs < 1294547654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just to do the fucking indentation for me < 1294547654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294547657 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, *alignment < 1294547663 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw that quicksort should probably go in the stdlib. < 1294547668 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not make it official < 1294547681 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although all the functions you made for it should be primitives imo :P < 1294547681 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well. you see. i would. except the stdlib currently takes about a second to compile. < 1294547689 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i might make them primitives ;x < 1294547694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i'll do fib first < 1294547704 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's wrong with stdlib taking a minute to compile? :D < 1294547736 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: anyway with the tcness definition most people have, clue is tc because i made ski in it < 1294547762 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes to write a wrapper for the AW SDK in Clue < 1294547767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p3111652293.txt < 1294547767 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294547768 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294547769 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DepthLimitException: depth limit exceeded (fib) :( < 1294547790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p7621978181.txt < 1294547790 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294547791 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294547792 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DepthLimitException: depth limit exceeded (fib) :( < 1294547795 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294547812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: < 1294547829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294547830 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :duh < 1294547851 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p8721655922.txt < 1294547851 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294547851 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294547852 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fib: [#0] | 0 => 0 | 1 => 1 | _ => pred(#0) < 1294547853 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kinda obvious < 1294547856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :DDD < 1294547896 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294547897 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294547905 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's so fucking great < 1294547909 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know, best fib ever < 1294547916 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this language really makes you think < 1294547921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i like how i TOLD it i was going to recurse < 1294547926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it was like... < 1294547929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah man, this shit is easy < 1294547932 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294547932 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p8928373356.txt < 1294547932 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294547932 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294547932 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fib: [#0] | 0 => 0 | 1 => 1 | _ => add(@(pred(#0)) @(pred(pred(#0)))) < 1294547936 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDD < 1294547940 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. fib(10) < 1294547940 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :55 < 1294547941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. fib(100) < 1294547947 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION 's machine catches fire < 1294547947 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294547958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: erm? < 1294547961 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note that the problem is your algo < 1294547966 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's all < 1294547972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: my algo looks right to me? < 1294547976 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294547981 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :":. fib(100)" taking forever < 1294547983 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would in haskell too < 1294547986 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, right < 1294547992 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i might kill the bot! < 1294548003 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm just very protective of clue < 1294548011 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i had to tell that right away < 1294548040 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run sed -i 's/usefulness/usefulness or ability to run at all' quotes < 1294548042 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1294548044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'ma internalise^Wprimitivise the functions now < 1294548047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote ability to < 1294548048 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1294548050 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote ability < 1294548053 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :262) clue is a language for beauty, not usefulness ability to run at all is not even close to a design goal, no < 1294548059 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eek < 1294548063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`paste quotes < 1294548064 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.18966 < 1294548067 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i'll write a real crappy page for clue now so you can then complain about it and i have to make it better < 1294548069 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: the way of the quote database is very subtle. < 1294548080 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually that sounds really hard < 1294548088 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you missed the last / for instance >:) < 1294548095 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :darn < 1294548099 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wikis are very scary < 1294548100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh man my machine is churning < 1294548109 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: fib 100 will never run < 1294548121 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run sed -i 's/usefulness/usefulness or ability to run at all/' quotes < 1294548123 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1294548140 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what should I make add([] []) be? < 1294548142 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't want an error < 1294548144 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :errors are for like < 1294548145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :donkey butts < 1294548146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1294548149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do errors in testing make the test fail? < 1294548152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if so that'd be beneficial < 1294548158 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294548169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: add([1 2] [3 4]), I want to stop it working < 1294548169 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well i knew i was tempting fate with using sed -i at all :D < 1294548177 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop it working in what sense < 1294548178 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :will raising an exception make all tests involving add on list "fail"? < 1294548180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without breaking things < 1294548183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: stop it returning [1 2 3 4]. < 1294548190 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you return None, as i said < 1294548194 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote ability < 1294548195 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294548195 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :262) clue is a language for beauty, not usefulness or ability to run at all ability to run at all is not even close to a design goal, no < 1294548204 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that will not give you a None object in code < 1294548206 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's special. < 1294548221 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh-KAY < 1294548221 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it means test cases will fail, i guess that's what you wanna hear < 1294548236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw isinstance(a,int) fails for sufficiently big a < 1294548240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and s/int/long/ works only for big a < 1294548242 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so int(a)==a is best < 1294548283 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let fib = 1:1:zipWith(+)fib(tail fib) in fib!!100 < 1294548284 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 573147844013817084101 < 1294548284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: length(0), None or 1? < 1294548285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294548304 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :length of numbers should be None < 1294548326 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :types will play a very important in clue 1.5 < 1294548328 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*role < 1294548349 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so let's try to separate the existing two types as much as possible < 1294548386 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION removes is even? from stdlib for now < 1294548387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: okay < 1294548412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'm leaving is zero?, is negative?, and is greater than? in stdlib < 1294548417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because they're... not performance-intensive < 1294548429 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294548433 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh luatre died due to not responding to pings due to being lagged < 1294548434 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that's good < 1294548447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: wanna rename caaar to what it actually is and then link me to the qsort? < 1294548451 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll add it to my filesystem < 1294548453 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1294548455 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah maybe < 1294548456 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is odd? should be called i don't even? < 1294548460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: :D < 1294548465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is this(i don't even?(42)) < 1294548477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: have you done fact < 1294548546 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw god esolanging is fun, why don't we do it more often :D < 1294548558 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p8325321461.txt < 1294548559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : code=reduce(lambda a,b:a+b,[i for i in code if i!=" "]) < 1294548565 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you realise that this doesn't remove newlines? < 1294548572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or are they removed elsewher < 1294548572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1294548609 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :newlines are not the same as spaces < 1294548628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is true < 1294548629 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are the end marker of bags < 1294548633 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, true < 1294548651 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294548653 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't really know the syntax... < 1294548660 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly i mean < 1294548673 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"do like in these examples and it should work" < 1294548686 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: how many :s should comments be < 1294548687 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*dots < 1294548696 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so hmm < 1294548698 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :four? that's kinda nice since :: looks commenty < 1294548703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or six, ::: looks the same < 1294548704 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: is used < 1294548705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and :: might be wanted for something < 1294548706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1294548707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::::? < 1294548711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or ...... :D < 1294548713 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just not implemented < 1294548715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or :.:. < 1294548717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or .::. < 1294548721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i'll make it six if that's okay < 1294548727 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm well < 1294548733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that not okay :p < 1294548738 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be nice if 5 was used as well then < 1294548745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well that's reserved for future expansion < 1294548748 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294548749 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1294548751 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that's good < 1294548757 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"reserved" < 1294548761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes :D < 1294548777 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you actually adding :::? < 1294548788 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can just make it cut the rest of the line < 1294548789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294548792 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am going to do that < 1294548794 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as you were going to do < 1294548796 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just saying < 1294548799 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294548849 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god that exams gonna go baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaad < 1294548860 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :caaar (l) = we need to go deeper (3 l) < 1294548871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: xD < 1294548884 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1294548910 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw once ! is added, you can pretty much exactly write the code you want < 1294548912 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :know what that means? < 1294548915 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294548929 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well umm, hard to put it to words < 1294548940 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it has a similar role as a weird thing as it does in prolog < 1294548943 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course, completely different < 1294548954 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's this sort of technical thing that can be used to guide searches < 1294548959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294548966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ghetto_ast is ghetto no more, incorporated into clue.py itself < 1294548970 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's actually very natural in clue, but i just find that fun for some reason < 1294548992 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also the meaning is actually kinda similar, "stop this branch of search" < 1294549004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TODO: rename the luatre functions to something nicer, put in luatre.py < 1294549010 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I've decided that the expression language is called luatre) < 1294549034 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294549040 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294549046 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: put quicksort in again < 1294549058 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :! = cut that out < 1294549059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: while i work on a faster fib < 1294549087 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::..: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p6825816189.txt < 1294549088 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294549088 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294549094 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do I indicate an error in Haskell ? < 1294549104 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :caaar pivot helper: [#0] | _ => cons to caaar(car(#0) #1) < 1294549104 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :greater than?: [compare(#0 #1)] | 1 => 1 | -1 => 0 | 0 => 0 < 1294549104 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :car pivot helper: [#0] | _ => cons to car(car(#0) #1) < 1294549104 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pivot right: [#0] | _ => caaar(pivot(#0 #1)) < 1294549104 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quicksort helper: [#0] | _ => quicksort append(#0 car(#1) #2) < 1294549104 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pivot condition 2: [greater than?(#0 car(#1))] | 0 => 2 | 1 => 3 < 1294549104 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :caaar: [#0] | _ => car(cdr(cdr(#0))) < 1294549105 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cons to caaar: [#0] | _ => triple(car(#1) caar(#1) caaar with consed(#0 #1)) < 1294549105 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make singleton: [#0] | _ => cons(#0 []) < 1294549106 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: would be nice except it's not a function < 1294549106 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quicksort: [length(#0)] | 0 => #0 | 1 => #0 | _ => quicksort helper(@(pivot left(car(#0) #0)) #0 @(pivot right(car(#0) cdr(#0)))) < 1294549106 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quicksort append: [#0] | _ => append(#0 append(make singleton(#1) #2)) < 1294549107 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pivot left: [#0] | _ => car(pivot(#0 #1)) < 1294549112 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> error "Message here" < 1294549113 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : *Exception: Message here < 1294549119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: error "foo" for simple stuff < 1294549131 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, perfect - thanks < 1294549135 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wants a jetpack < 1294549139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: you might also consider returning (Maybe resulttype) instead, or having (Either SomeErrorType resulttype) < 1294549140 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who doesn't < 1294549140 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.martinjetpack.com/ < 1294549143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: for API functions < 1294549161 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, nah - I need Error in this case :-} < 1294549162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The Martin Jetpack is a experimental aircraft. Its tradename calls it a "jet pack", but is not jet- or rocket-powered." < 1294549174 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: consider printing compilation time btw, i find it very interesting at least < 1294549179 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: sure < 1294549188 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: it's just that error and friends can only be caught in the IO monad < 1294549189 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1294549196 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can someone make a disambiguation page? :P < 1294549219 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :while Either and Maybe can be analyzed by pure functions < 1294549227 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294549232 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294549247 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when clue was young, i remember ais523 saying "yay, we get our first disambiguation page" < 1294549262 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: also there is undefined for when you don't even want to give a message < 1294549262 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, lulz < 1294549266 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: should keymaker's lang be "Clue (Keymaker)" or "Clue (2009)" < 1294549274 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the former is more disambiguous, the latter...nicer? < 1294549278 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, does error exit the program? or does it continue going.... < 1294549281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact clue oklopol has no defined creation date i guess < 1294549282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for sure < 1294549283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*year < 1294549284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so keymaker < 1294549333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: clue was invented 2010—2011? < 1294549337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or 2009? or 2010? < 1294549343 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i doubt it was in 2010 < 1294549350 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe more like 2009 < 1294549353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1294549369 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's hard to say when it became a distinct language, all the ideas were there much before < 1294549379 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Clue < 1294549382 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: it exits unless you catch it from IO < 1294549434 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i should call clue clue++, add km's clue commands, and say clue++ is an extension of clue < 1294549445 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...or maybe not :D < 1294549450 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: thanks < 1294549458 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now all i need to do is actually write something < 1294549459 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: try qsort now < 1294549461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'll say the time < 1294549468 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yayy < 1294549474 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::..: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p6825816189.txt < 1294549475 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294549475 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294549491 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TypeError: cannot concatenate 'str' and 'float' objects :( < 1294549508 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86-rdmsoft [XULRunner 1.9.2.12/20101026210630] < 1294549517 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, http://pastebin.com/PETSzuE1 --> something is obviously wrong < 1294549518 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unn.hs:6:12: parse error on input `<-' < 1294549524 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you should have oved it < 1294549526 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :moved < 1294549531 0 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-4db43439.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294549532 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, n/m < 1294549539 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe for all the syntax things, there could be a verbose command as well, but uppercase: "!" = CUT IT OUT, ":." = "RECURSION BRACH", ":" = SUBBRANCH < 1294549545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: you forgot do < 1294549548 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: essentially haskell has two kinds of error responses, the ones like error, undefined and throw (with more advanced exception options) that don't show up in your expression type but which exit and can only be caught in IO at most, and the other kind like Maybe and Either which show up in your expression type (usually as a monad wrapper) and don't exit but the result needs to be analyzed by the caller < 1294549555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: also Maybe isn't a value < 1294549557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a type < 1294549557 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Didn't see that the Talk page was in fact on Clue (Keymaker) < 1294549561 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i have no clue whet you were trying to do now < 1294549568 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HAHA CLUE < 1294549573 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HAHAHAHAHAHA < 1294549584 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I need parseUnn to return either " < 1294549594 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an error or "" depending whether the file exists < 1294549609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: < 1294549614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if fileExists then error "Oh no." < 1294549619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :else return () < 1294549621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is probably what you want < 1294549633 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your current function would need {return ""} as well as the fix for Maybe < 1294549635 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you'd have to putStr it < 1294549638 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that would be exceedingly pointless < 1294549659 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hrm? < 1294549660 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone should put a Network Headache server back up < 1294549662 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Permanently < 1294549680 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or < 1294549686 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1294549691 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if Network Headache could be made to work serverlessly < 1294549814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: wait < 1294549817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :05:04 luatre: TypeError: cannot concatenate 'str' and 'float' objects :( < 1294549818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294549820 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohh < 1294549828 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294549833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try _now_ when it comes back < 1294549834 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294549841 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, http://pastebin.com/fLwG6dzU -> now I'm getting incorrect indentation < 1294549878 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : { also I have new idea for a language: similar to python - except that it enforces a *horid* indentation pattern :-)) < 1294549884 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294549902 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: < 1294549912 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: indent the else < 1294549915 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: um yes, then and else must be at the same level < 1294549918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: better: separate the then < 1294549921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :put a new line and two spaces before then < 1294549923 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and align the else < 1294549936 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah then & else. I was aligning the if and else :-) < 1294549949 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well then and else don't _need_ to be at the same level, but that may be best < 1294549955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p3599837528.txt < 1294549955 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294549956 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294549956 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiled in 0.0620181560516 seconds < 1294549956 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slow fibonacci: [#0] | 0 => 0 | 1 => 1 | _ => add(@(pred(#0)) @(pred(pred(#0)))) < 1294549956 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fibonacci: [#0] | _ => fast fibonacci loop(#0 0 1) < 1294549956 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fast fibonacci loop: [#0] | 0 => #1 | _ => @(pred(#0) #2 add(#1 #2)) < 1294549963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: this fibonacci function is VERY fast < 1294549964 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I put the then on a new line now :-} < 1294549965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. fibonacci(100) < 1294549965 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :354224848179261915075L < 1294549967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. fibonacci(1000) < 1294549967 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OverflowError: long int too large to convert to int :( < 1294549970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...:D < 1294549972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that needs _fixing_ < 1294549973 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you implement ::: already? < 1294549982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: as comments, yes < 1294549983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :untested :D < 1294549997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'm going to go fix all the functions to not use int() now < 1294550004 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: technically it's not that else needs to be aligned with anything, but it _cannot_ be aligned with the do statements since it isn't a statement of its own < 1294550014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'll use, uh, long() or something... or maybe maybeintmaybelong() < 1294550015 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll put ::: on the wiki then < 1294550025 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, ok - that makes sense < 1294550027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: anyway feed it quicksort again < 1294550063 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: this actually is being tweaked in the newest haskell standard i think because it trips up so many people < 1294550100 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294550105 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294550108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: feed it qs again dammit :D < 1294550111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'll print compilation time < 1294550114 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but actually < 1294550115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p3599837528.txt < 1294550115 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294550116 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294550116 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DepthLimitException: depth limit exceeded (fast fibonacci loop) :( < 1294550117 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait until this finishes < 1294550121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what?! < 1294550126 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294550127 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, two more questions a) how do I go thru all the command line arguments b) how do I get the *number* of command line arguments < 1294550129 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: your depth limit is too low < 1294550138 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or wait < 1294550139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i have a bug < 1294550154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah! < 1294550155 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1294550162 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :count getArgs ? < 1294550163 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : { also I have new idea for a language: similar to python - except that it enforces a *horid* indentation pattern :-)) <-- that is one of my design goals for my (mostly vaporware) language Reaper < 1294550182 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294550187 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294550190 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p3599837528.txt < 1294550190 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294550191 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294550191 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiled in 0.0681719779968 seconds < 1294550191 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slow fibonacci: [#0] | 0 => 0 | 1 => 1 | _ => add(@(pred(#0)) @(pred(pred(#0)))) < 1294550191 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fibonacci: [#0] | _ => fast fibonacci loop(#0 0 1) < 1294550191 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fast fibonacci loop: [#0] | 0 => #1 | _ => @(pred(#0) #2 add(#1 #2)) < 1294550197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. fibonacci(1000) < 1294550197 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RuntimeError: maximum recursion depth exceeded in __instancecheck__ :( < 1294550204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dude :( < 1294550213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. fibonacci(100) < 1294550213 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :354224848179261915075L < 1294550215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. fibonacci(800) < 1294550215 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RuntimeError: maximum recursion depth exceeded in __instancecheck__ :( < 1294550217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. fibonacci(500) < 1294550217 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RuntimeError: maximum recursion depth exceeded in __instancecheck__ :( < 1294550220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. fibonacci(300) < 1294550220 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :222232244629420445529739893461909967206666939096499764990979600L < 1294550228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: apart from your impl being kinda sucky, that fibonacci is stupid fast :P < 1294550229 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, , two more questions a) how do I go thru all the command line arguments b) how do I get the *number* of command line arguments < 1294550232 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and easy to write, too < 1294550241 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: mapM_ to go through command arguments < 1294550248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mapM_ someFunc aList < 1294550255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :number is just (length args) obviously < 1294550256 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1294550262 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :args ? < 1294550270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: if you've done "args <- getArgs" < 1294550273 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1294550275 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is an idiot < 1294550277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1294550285 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294550289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: fine I'll feed it qs < 1294550290 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now - once I bind args - how do I get out of the "do" < 1294550297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p6825816189.txt < 1294550297 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294550297 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294550298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: what < 1294550299 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't need to be in an IO thing anymore < 1294550306 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to go back to pure functional < 1294550309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: um, you can't, what do you mean < 1294550312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: just call purely-functional functions < 1294550314 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kk < 1294550317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :inside the do < 1294550319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and do something with them < 1294550320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. < 1294550325 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :print (somePurelyFunctionalThing 42) < 1294550327 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiled in 14.6956260204 seconds < 1294550328 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :caaar pivot helper: [#0] | _ => cons to caaar(car(#0) #1) < 1294550328 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cons to car: [#0] | _ => cons(cons(#0 car(#1)) cdr(#1)) < 1294550328 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :triple: [#0] | _ => cons(#0 cons(#1 make singleton(#2))) < 1294550328 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quicksort helper: [#0] | _ => quicksort append(#0 car(#1) #2) < 1294550328 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pivot condition 2: [greater than?(#0 car(#1))] | 0 => 2 | 1 => 3 < 1294550328 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :caaar with consed: [#0] | _ => cons(#0 caaar(#1)) < 1294550329 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cons to caaar: [#0] | _ => triple(car(#1) caar(#1) caaar with consed(#0 #1)) < 1294550329 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make singleton: [#0] | _ => cons(#0 []) < 1294550330 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quicksort: [length(#0)] | 0 => #0 | 1 => #0 | _ => quicksort helper(@(pivot left(car(#0) #0)) #0 @(pivot right(car(#0) cdr(#0)))) < 1294550330 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :caar: [#0] | _ => car(cdr(#0)) < 1294550331 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quicksort append: [#0] | _ => append(#0 append(make singleton(#1) #2)) < 1294550331 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pivot left: [#0] | _ => car(pivot(#0 #1)) < 1294550332 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :car pivot helper: [#0] | _ => cons to car(car(#0) #1) < 1294550348 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, erm - I need to get the number of arguments **before** I do args <- < 1294550349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait, that is a slightly old one < 1294550350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but who cares :) < 1294550357 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: no, you don't, and that's patently impossible < 1294550357 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise haskell outputs an error < 1294550367 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: where do you use the arguments? < 1294550368 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294550373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: show your code < 1294550374 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294550379 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott,hang on a sec < 1294550430 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, meh - I made a mistake < 1294550441 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :before I had (fileName:_) which caused an error with 0 arguments < 1294550460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1294550462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: try < 1294550463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :case args of < 1294550467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : [fileName] -> ... < 1294550472 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : _ -> error "you used it wrong, idiot!" < 1294550478 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than mucking about with length etc. < 1294550493 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kk < 1294550552 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: did you die < 1294550555 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: or possibly [] -> error "you used it wrong, idiot!" as the first option if you want to allow more than one filename < 1294550560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: can you do constants for branchers already < 1294550562 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :case args of < 1294550568 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : [] -> error "you used it wrong, idiot!" < 1294550575 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : filenames -> ... < 1294550575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : _ -> mapM_ processArg args < 1294550581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or that < 1294550584 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: will you remove the commas btw? < 1294550589 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or did you already? < 1294550594 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because i'll make that official if < 1294550628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i will now < 1294550632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: if you remove them from qsort :P < 1294550656 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can remove them from quicksort and ski, sure < 1294550663 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: thanks < 1294550666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'll give you my latest ski < 1294550669 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i modded it < 1294550692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p1739965483.txt < 1294550702 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: incidentally it is generally considered bad form to use length to check whether a list is empty, since that works badly when you want computation to be as lazy as possible, especially with empty lists < 1294550712 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er < 1294550719 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*especially with infinite lists < 1294550740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh, this might be an issue < 1294550746 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you kinda strip spaces < 1294550749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which become the only separators < 1294550749 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, makes sense < 1294550762 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: shall i uh redesign the parser :D < 1294550785 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact even using list == [] is considered bad form because that needlessly forces the element type to be comparable for equality < 1294550817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah infinite cmd line args < 1294550817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294550838 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well i'm just trying to prevent him from getting into bad habits < 1294550858 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes yes :) < 1294550888 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294550890 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t null < 1294550891 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. [a] -> Bool < 1294550898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1294550900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so uh any ideas < 1294550913 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the function to use, although it's usually even better if you can use pattern matching < 1294550921 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, I'm a little confused now: how do I return from a function that an error occurred? Just, Maybe ? < 1294550939 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Nothing < 1294550942 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t Nothing < 1294550942 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. Maybe a < 1294550952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think i fixed it < 1294550953 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that's a value ;D) < 1294550966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: indeed < 1294550969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: do you want my current interP? < 1294550971 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, Nothing is an error ? I was using it to say that nothing needs be done - should I return () for that? < 1294550971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*interp? < 1294550983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: data Maybe a = Just a | Nothing < 1294550989 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: imagine the result of a hash table lookup < 1294550993 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if an element is there, you would return (Just value) < 1294550995 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise, Nothing < 1294550997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the use of it < 1294551004 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294551007 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes sense < 1294551012 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: hm if you aren't actually returning a value in either case, maybe it would better to use Bool < 1294551014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note that obviously if you return Nothing somewhere you have to return Nothing or (Just x) everywhere < 1294551019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise you'd be stepping outside Maybe < 1294551032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: except < 1294551035 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want your interp once i've written a crappy version of the spec < 1294551037 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: he's already wrapping doesFileExist < 1294551038 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, the weird thing in this case is that I need to return nothing except on error < 1294551040 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which results in IO Bool < 1294551040 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1294551046 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah :D < 1294551048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: try this: < 1294551084 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :filterM doesFileExist < 1294551092 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t filterM < 1294551092 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a (m :: * -> *). (Monad m) => (a -> m Bool) -> [a] -> m [a] < 1294551095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: runProg filename = do exists <- doesFileExist filename; if exists then error "Oh no!" else return (); main = do args <- getArgs; case args of [] -> error "Oh no!"; _ -> mapM_ runProg args < 1294551097 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, http://www.esolangs.org/wiki/Unnecessary --> Writing a compiler for this < 1294551100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: oh, now it's on < 1294551127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t any < 1294551127 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (a -> Bool) -> [a] -> Bool < 1294551131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t anyM < 1294551132 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not in scope: `anyM' < 1294551135 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I had that - but then the compiler exits after the first bad file name < 1294551147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: ah, you do not want that? < 1294551170 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no - I want it to go thru every given file name and report failure of any of them < 1294551176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle (a -> m b) -> m a -> m b < 1294551176 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude (=<<) :: Monad m => (a -> m b) -> m a -> m b < 1294551176 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Monad (=<<) :: Monad m => (a -> m b) -> m a -> m b < 1294551177 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude (>>=) :: Monad m => m a -> (a -> m b) -> m b < 1294551191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: don't use error, then < 1294551199 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, just return a plain string? < 1294551217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :main = getArgs >>= filterM doesFileExist >>= mapM_ (\bad -> putStrLn "Oh no! " ++ bad ++ " exists!") < 1294551219 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just use that >:) < 1294551228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: I would use putStrLn directly < 1294551230 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :==...== is a section, can i make a subsection kinda thing < 1294551231 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since you're in IO already < 1294551235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ===foo=== < 1294551247 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294551251 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything else someone else will have to fic < 1294551253 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*fix < 1294551253 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294551254 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks < 1294551256 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: commas removed, plz2be qsort and ski < 1294551260 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with that ski i gave you < 1294551290 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so it's 5:34 am and i blame you < 1294551348 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: oklopol: http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Ambience oh holy fucking shit i had no idea this exists < 1294551352 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*existed < 1294551353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why does this exist < 1294551365 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i think it would have become 5:34 am eventually regardless < 1294551426 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, http://pastebin.com/8SRWxGm4 this is what I have so far. If I add putStrLn before parseUnn it fails; if uncomment the commented line it fails < 1294551431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PA2uLm8ups jesus fucking christ this is terrifying < 1294551447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: ok well, that is wrong < 1294551453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: pop quiz < 1294551463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: er wait i see < 1294551466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: right, okay, firstly < 1294551467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're in IO < 1294551470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you need to have -> IO String < 1294551471 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294551475 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh - right < 1294551495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: "putStrLn parseUnn" fails because parseUnn isn't a string :) < 1294551514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: mapM_ (\filename -> parseUnn filename >>= putStrLn) fileNames would work < 1294551516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but is rather ugly < 1294551522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan should not respond with fancy monad operators now < 1294551525 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as it will not help :) < 1294551531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: I would s/return/putStrLn/ in parseUnn < 1294551538 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'd rather not < 1294551542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: and note that putStrLn "" will print a blank line -- use return () instead < 1294551543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: why not? < 1294551549 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cause I want to learn the functional method of doing things < 1294551558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: the functional method of doing things is not done in IO :-) but okay < 1294551569 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: well... add \n to the end of the error string < 1294551581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then s/putStrLn/putStr/ in the line that i said would work but is ugly < 1294551583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would work < 1294551587 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A song got stuck in my head < 1294551587 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the goal of this isn't to get it done. I did it in bash, perl, ruby, etc already - its to learn the language < 1294551594 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It contains more than my usual amount of swearing < 1294551599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: yeah :) < 1294551607 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: try to one-line project euler problems in haskell < 1294551610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: well, the whole operation of Unnecessary is basically IO. < 1294551619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if FILE EXISTS, ok, if not, PRINT AN ERROR < 1294551625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: so it is hard to suggest a functional way to do this :) < 1294551644 0 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-4db4fbd5.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294551652 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, heh < 1294551661 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: although it _is_ possible to use higher-order monadic functions like filterM and mapM < 1294551666 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*mapM_ < 1294551667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan is right < 1294551667 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, I will - I've already done a few of them though < 1294551675 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, explain ? < 1294551699 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : main = getArgs >>= filterM doesFileExist >>= mapM_ (\bad -> putStrLn "Oh no! " ++ bad ++ " exists!") < 1294551715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle (a -> b) -> (c -> m a) -> c -> m b < 1294551715 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Language.Haskell.TH.Quote dataToQa :: Data a => (Name -> k) -> (Lit -> Q q) -> (k -> [Q q] -> Q q) -> (b -> Maybe (Q q)) -> a -> Q q < 1294551718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :darn < 1294551720 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, interesting < 1294551722 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has an idea < 1294551791 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: hihi are you converting < 1294551805 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: holy fucking shit < 1294551806 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: http://i.imgur.com/iJ2eG.jpg < 1294551807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that bastard < 1294551810 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am gonna rip his head off :D < 1294551905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: taaalk < 1294551932 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@more < 1294551946 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i distinctly recall @more working once upon a time < 1294551948 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or wait < 1294551957 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle (a -> b) -> (c -> m a) -> c -> m b < 1294551957 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Language.Haskell.TH.Quote dataToQa :: Data a => (Name -> k) -> (Lit -> Q q) -> (k -> [Q q] -> Q q) -> (b -> Maybe (Q q)) -> a -> Q q < 1294551959 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@more < 1294551966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is no more :P < 1294551981 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just in case someone else had got a command in in #haskell or such < 1294552011 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well it's fmap/liftM + <=< of course < 1294552020 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it may not have a single function for it < 1294552034 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or wait < 1294552042 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol oklopol oklopol oklopol oklopol oklopol < 1294552045 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: make oklopol talk < 1294552080 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (\f x -> fmap f . x) < 1294552081 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b (f :: * -> *) (f1 :: * -> *). (Functor f, Functor f1) => (a -> b) -> f1 (f a) -> f1 (f b) < 1294552091 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er < 1294552130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol < 1294552148 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait right < 1294552150 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (.) < 1294552150 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b (f :: * -> *). (Functor f) => (a -> b) -> f a -> f b < 1294552160 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdabot still defines (.) = fmap :D < 1294552161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: make oklopol talk < 1294552167 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: TALK < 1294552170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t map < 1294552171 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b. (a -> b) -> [a] -> [b] < 1294552173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LAME < 1294552179 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294552187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: but yes, of course it defines (.) = fmap, as specified by the Caleskell Report < 1294552218 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: your function is just (.)(.) with that notation >:) < 1294552223 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294552226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fmap fmap fmap < 1294552227 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (.)(.) < 1294552227 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b (f :: * -> *) (f1 :: * -> *). (Functor f, Functor f1) => f1 (a -> b) -> f1 (f a -> f b) < 1294552237 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er or is it < 1294552251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294552279 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (.).(.) < 1294552280 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall (f :: * -> *) a b (f1 :: * -> *). (Functor f, Functor f1) => (a -> b) -> f (f1 a) -> f (f1 b) < 1294552286 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's better < 1294552303 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed it _is_ fmap fmap fmap < 1294552323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fmap fmap fmap fmap fmap fmap fmap < 1294552346 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that reiterates after four fmaps < 1294552383 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well eventually. i don't quite recall if it's immediately. < 1294552440 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol < 1294552443 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklo fucking pol < 1294552672 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: WIKI SPAM < 1294552695 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION cackles disturbingly < 1294552875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: make oklopol a human < 1294552914 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a recall reading somewhere that needing to sleep is a distinctly human characteristic < 1294552930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he was working on the wiki page < 1294552932 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clearly not sleeping < 1294552944 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it is 8 am there :/ < 1294553013 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well he hasn't saved the page < 1294553092 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Clue_%28oklopol%29 < 1294553107 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH NOES < 1294553133 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i tried to make it roughly correct, but didn't really aim for readability or completeness. < 1294553141 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can fix the formatting < 1294553165 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you will be mercilessly haunted by graue for creating a new category. well, if he gave any sign of being alive, that is. < 1294553192 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or perhaps not being alive would help with the haunting < 1294553197 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294553224 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, does that make sense to elliott after already knowing the language? < 1294553237 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that much would be nice < 1294553239 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: have you converted qs or ski < 1294553250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: don't call them commands < 1294553253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's too impure for clue < 1294553257 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i shouldn't, true < 1294553259 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just < 1294553270 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they didn't really have a name, so i just chose a consistent naming for the purpose of writing that. < 1294553277 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but so < 1294553279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"betweem" :D < 1294553285 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a clue is the set of stuff defining a single function < 1294553289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'll completely rewrite that, _tomorrow_ < 1294553299 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go for it < 1294553308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: now gimme ski and qs without commas < 1294553323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: based on this ski http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p1739965483.txt < 1294553343 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, \filename what is that syntax called? < 1294553349 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose an example should actually be a single [1] -> [2] thingie < 1294553354 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: lambda... it's (\args -> value) < 1294553363 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then i need a name for { ... } < 1294553369 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :branch < 1294553371 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess < 1294553377 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'm wondering whether removing commas is actually nice < 1294553392 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i haven't seen code with that, it's just something i've been wanting to have < 1294553414 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: do it to qs and a decision can be made < 1294553442 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quicksort ~ {. [] -> [] } < 1294553442 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quicksort ~ {. [1] -> [1] . [2] -> [2] } < 1294553442 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quicksort ~ {:. [4 2 3 1] -> [1 2 3 4] < 1294553443 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [2 3 1] -> [1 2 3] < 1294553443 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [] -> [] < 1294553443 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : :. [2 5 4 1 5] -> [1 2 4 5 5] < 1294553443 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [1] -> [1] < 1294553444 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [5 4 5] -> [4 5 5] < 1294553444 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : :. [1 2 3] -> [1 2 3] < 1294553445 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [] -> [] < 1294553445 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [2 3] -> [2 3] } < 1294553446 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quicksort ~ length; cdr; car; pivot left; pivot right; quicksort helper < 1294553447 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you tell me that's not elegant as shit < 1294553449 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `IO b' < 1294553450 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : against inferred type `[String] -> IO ()' < 1294553454 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : _ -> mapM_ (\filename -> parseUnn filename >>= putStrLn) < 1294553456 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well sure < 1294553467 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what is this supposed to be? < 1294553474 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so um just want to check, we are standardising on my impl right :p < 1294553479 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: quicksort < 1294553486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since... it's incompatible with yours on just about every program now < 1294553488 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well obviously < 1294553490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :due to renames and syntax < 1294553498 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but what's with the funny syntax? < 1294553514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: it's clue, if you don't understand it < 1294553514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then < 1294553515 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what am I doing wrong with that? < 1294553515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294553519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess you're mentally retarded cuz < 1294553522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :easiest language ever! < 1294553527 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes, removal of <> will be in clue 1.0 if that's okay by you < 1294553532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: you forgot to provide the list at the end < 1294553540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: 1.0? don't you mean 1.5 < 1294553550 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i forgot to credit myself, which i obviously want to do < 1294553555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but i also mean the renaming of funcs and stuff < 1294553565 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: the syntax isn't funny < 1294553568 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: can we call what i have clue 1.25 or at least close to it :p < 1294553571 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what language? < 1294553575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah the syntax isn't the funny part of clue < 1294553577 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh - I'm an idiot :-} < 1294553581 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: can't we just call it clue 1.0? < 1294553588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but what you had was clue 1.0 < 1294553593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've been thinkin' of this as clue 1.25 < 1294553595 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the changes are tiny :\ < 1294553606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but it's also the OPTIMISATION < 1294553616 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: clue 1.5 is when we get constants in branches, I know that much :) < 1294553625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: aww c'mon, let me have the 1.25 version number < 1294553626 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: link < 1294553629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's so shiny and cuddly? < 1294553629 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OR the sensible branching system < 1294553653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what's a sensible system < 1294553688 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, http://pastebin.com/zVZnPNHj - final version < 1294553692 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the one we designed with ilkka, or mostly i defined < 1294553699 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the obvious system. < 1294553700 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: summarise? < 1294553708 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: because i like the current system a lot < 1294553712 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of having one branching function, separate things one at a time. < 1294553714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: yay :P < 1294553714 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: wut < 1294553721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i don't get it < 1294553724 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294553727 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294553734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: that sounds like clue 2.0 to me anyway, not 1.5 < 1294553740 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you find something that's true for a certain subset of examples, but not the other ones, first branch on that < 1294553768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: theoretically that can be done already < 1294553772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: if you have add in the bag < 1294553773 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, what is with the wut ? < 1294553780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: since it can do addition of booleans... and also other stuff :) < 1294553784 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: like multiplication of booleans! < 1294553787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or even < 1294553789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just cons them into a list < 1294553789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ofc < 1294553796 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: should improper lists be allowed < 1294553797 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. cons(1 2) < 1294553798 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm aware of that. < 1294553801 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i say no < 1294553809 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: nevermind < 1294553819 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, they should not < 1294553822 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rite < 1294553834 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there can be a tree type in the stdlib tho < 1294553842 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RTYPOE TYPES TYPES < 1294553851 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: can we ditch _? it can easily be coded in two lines < 1294553853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's an ugly name < 1294553859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and post-<>-removal it's basically never ever useful ever < 1294553862 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :certainly < 1294553864 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey < 1294553866 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just realized < 1294553884 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're like the secretary i've been talking about getting that does all the trivial stuff for me because i can't be assed < 1294553890 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I have a new languag. You define a set of functions and set of conditionals for those functions. There is only global state and functions never make calls. instead once a function is started it goes to completion. When a functions completes the compiler chooses randomly from the set of functions whose conditionals are true < 1294553891 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how much do you want me to pay ya < 1294553894 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1294553895 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sup < 1294553901 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: 0, i find this fun < 1294553904 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: inf < 1294553906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'s good language < 1294553908 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well okay, i guess < 1294553913 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliot: do you use be? < 1294553921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well you can pay me £1000/day if you really want < 1294553923 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: not available here. < 1294553932 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: i'm planning on switching to bogons.net... < 1294553938 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder if i can reprogram my bebox to work with other isps < 1294553941 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's still dsl2 < 1294553963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you in uk < 1294553968 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no germany < 1294553970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294553973 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i took my bebox with me :D < 1294553973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: just buy a linksys < 1294553975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294553978 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm cheap < 1294553979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all other routers are shit < 1294553988 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone should really fix "Quicksort: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p6825816189.txt SKI: Well I don't have the link at hand but anyway." < 1294553999 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and add corrected qs there < 1294554000 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ski < 1294554003 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well < 1294554008 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : new language -- define a set of functions and set of conditionals for those functions. There is only global state and functions never make calls or exit early. instead once a function is started it goes to completion. When a functions completes the compiler chooses randomly from the set of functions whose conditionals are true < 1294554009 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i will fix qs and ski i guess < 1294554013 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: heh < 1294554018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: it's like clue but worse! :) < 1294554022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then < 1294554023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so is every language < 1294554024 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone should really fix """ someone should really fix "Quicksort: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p6825816189.txt SKI: Well I don't have the link at hand but anyway." """ < 1294554025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from clue < 1294554044 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: it's like thue but worse < 1294554054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294554058 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like intercal but worse < 1294554066 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no THU < 1294554102 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" oklopol: i will fix qs and ski i guess" <<< thank you, although i did it already < 1294554103 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: can i convert windows line endings to unix on all these files :D < 1294554108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you code with notepad i guess (wordpad can do it) < 1294554109 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming it was just commas < 1294554125 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, i just did it too < 1294554127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's nicer i think < 1294554132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also re-indented ski < 1294554158 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you put them on the wiki AND link them here < 1294554158 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294554168 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1294554176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll even put them on a wiki page, not vjn < 1294554202 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :k < 1294554207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you forgot to mention how : = .. < 1294554212 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohhh < 1294554216 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's like the most important part! < 1294554276 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you are the weakest link. < 1294554400 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294554403 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lolwat < 1294554414 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: examples added < 1294554419 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i added that information on the page, in its rightful spot. < 1294554420 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is a spammer on the wiki... posting nice but irrelevent stuff. Not a singe link < 1294554433 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"You certainly have some agreeable opinions and views. Your blog provides a fresh look at the subject." < 1294554433 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D < 1294554514 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe that should be mentioned first < 1294554520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no :P < 1294554524 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::d < 1294554530 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's approaching 7 am so i'm going to sleep soon, but yeah, clue < 1294554532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't it great < 1294554537 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's fucking <3 < 1294554556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: possibly your crowning achievement as far as esolangs go < 1294554568 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh sure the others have more interesting "theoretical" bases < 1294554570 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i suppose. < 1294554574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but do they obsolete the notion of programming itself?! < 1294554578 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294554589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: http://www.vjn.fi/oklopol/clue.txt oh my god what is this, Clue 0.1? < 1294554591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's so...retro < 1294554601 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1294554607 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg i didn't remember < 1294554609 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahahahaa < 1294554615 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i actually kind of like it XD < 1294554629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i have a suggestion < 1294554631 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know in the bag < 1294554632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#foo < 1294554634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not drop the # < 1294554635 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's fugly. < 1294554644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then the bag becomes like... "things you need" < 1294554650 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1294554655 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's another great idea < 1294554656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: will implement :P < 1294554663 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1294554690 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: one theory is that such spammer bots are trying to put their links in some form field which doesn't actually exist < 1294554693 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT ELSE SHOULD IT HAVE TELMMETELMMEE :D < 1294554706 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that they don't show up in the resulting edit < 1294554715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: BLACKJACK AND HOOKERS < 1294554733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: stuff_to_clue what is this what what what < 1294554744 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294554754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah tknz_helper_list looks useful < 1294554772 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :split by ";" ? :D < 1294554812 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1294554815 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay it seems it does something more than that < 1294554845 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: # purged < 1294554861 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't even mention helper objects in the article btw < 1294554865 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: if you google that "You certainly have some agreeable opinions and views" phrase you will find that the spam is also in comments on some sites that are not wikis at all < 1294554873 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed i don't < 1294554894 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as i said, didn't really aim for completeness, but yeah those should certainly be mentioned < 1294554918 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :website < 1294554924 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Found one.. it links to website < 1294554926 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-233-105.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294554928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :examples fixed < 1294554928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294554929 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://website/ < 1294554937 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: huh < 1294554942 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.knowyouaregod.com/blog/2010/03/27/13/ < 1294554967 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Last comment < 1294554968 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: this is the greatest language < 1294554984 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: it could be that is also just something being put in the wrong format for a field? < 1294554986 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i just wish, you know, coding in it didn't suck, because i'd totally use it for everything :D < 1294555023 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, here the spammers suceeded: http://www.universities-in-europe.com/7-unconventional-ways-to-pay-for-a-college-education.html < 1294555031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so have you ever used emacs < 1294555050 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION falls in love with Clue < 1294555059 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i've kinda used it a bit, at some point, but not really a relevant amount. < 1294555078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: if it had it so that if you changed the name of a clue function, all the lines in the branch would automatically get re-aligned < 1294555081 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-shutup- Shut up about Clue! < 1294555085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how much more perfect would your life be < 1294555086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from < 1294555087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ENTIRELY < 1294555106 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::)))))))))))) < 1294555112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: IS THAT "ENTIRELY" I HEAR < 1294555118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i believe i specifically forbade entirely as an answer < 1294555131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: why does stuff.py exist btw, it's not like clue.py isn't 700 lines :D < 1294555172 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i... dunno? < 1294555181 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not like there's any kind of logical separation < 1294555185 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294555209 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just felt like things should be in multiple files because that's how adults code < 1294555218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294555223 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm a big boy now and i'm going to use multiple files < 1294555228 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1294555301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: should...multiplication be in the stdlib < 1294555303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm thinking yes? < 1294555303 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think PSOX was my only multi-file project thus far < 1294555304 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mutual recursion is going to be a very big step, and i have no idea what the nice way to do it is < 1294555304 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>.> < 1294555311 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: primitive. < 1294555317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mutual recursion is clue 1.75 isn'tit < 1294555318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*isn't it < 1294555321 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or even 2.0 < 1294555324 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was almost certainly under .. wai < 1294555326 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no reason to make things slow just for the sake of making them slow < 1294555333 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Was about to say under 18, but I must have been 18 < 1294555338 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: in fact i vaguely recall reading that one antispam technique is to include an invisible form field which _only_ bots would fill out, as a honeypot < 1294555347 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: call it "multiply"? < 1294555353 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294555365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :done :) < 1294555372 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also divide, and make it fail if result is not int! :P < 1294555381 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure that's very sensible < 1294555396 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can efel myself barely abl to type < 1294555404 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just staring at the screen numbly < 1294555408 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know wh < 1294555411 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y < 1294555412 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: being there < 1294555414 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: < 1294555415 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- factorial < 1294555416 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[#0] < 1294555416 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 0 => 1 < 1294555418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 4 => multiply(#0 @(pred(#0))) < 1294555420 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294555422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's hilarious < 1294555424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because < 1294555426 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :factorial(4) doesn't even result in 24 < 1294555428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which was my testcase < 1294555431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :factorial ~ {. 0 -> 1 } < 1294555432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :factorial ~ {:. 4 -> 24 < 1294555434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : 3 -> 6 < 1294555436 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : 2 -> 2 } < 1294555438 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :factorial ~ multiply; pred; 1 < 1294555440 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: factorial(10) < 1294555440 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294555440 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ValueError: unknown url type: factorial(10) :( < 1294555442 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AttributeError: 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'isbase' < 1294555444 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: factorial(4) < 1294555444 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294555444 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ValueError: unknown url type: factorial(4) :( < 1294555446 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AttributeError: 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'isbase' < 1294555448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: clue.py bug? < 1294555450 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think definitely < 1294555460 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::o < 1294555468 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh that's umm < 1294555488 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that's kinda a clue.py bug. i noticed it earlier but i didn't feel like fixing it < 1294555491 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294555494 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i fixed it in factorial < 1294555498 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that means none of your branches has been chosen as the default one < 1294555500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg < 1294555501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294555508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: guess what happens when i deprive factorial of 1 < 1294555510 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's an easy fix < 1294555512 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294555515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- factorial < 1294555515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[#0] < 1294555515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 0 => multiply(pred(#0) pred(#0)) < 1294555516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| _ => multiply(#0 @(pred(#0))) < 1294555518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDD < 1294555520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD < 1294555523 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue is anti-cubic < 1294555569 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw your factorial definition is very weird < 1294555578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :howso < 1294555582 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you copy paste it from your fibonacci program < 1294555588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294555589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why < 1294555593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah < 1294555593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i realise < 1294555596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't need the extra : < 1294555597 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i separated it out < 1294555597 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can i have your current version? < 1294555606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stack-hogging factorial ~ {. 0 -> 1 } < 1294555606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stack-hogging factorial ~ {:. 4 -> 24 < 1294555606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : 3 -> 6 < 1294555608 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : :. 3 -> 6 < 1294555610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : 2 -> 2 } < 1294555610 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, it should still work that way, but you need another base case < 1294555612 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stack-hogging factorial ~ multiply; pred; 0 < 1294555614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gonna do tail-recursive now < 1294555616 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AND THEN SLEEP < 1294555632 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it will actually do the recursion, just ignore the result :D < 1294555644 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or... i guess it might use it as well, but then it would prolly be wrong < 1294555697 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: < 1294555699 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if default==None: < 1294555699 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : default=clue.branches[len(clue.branches)-1] < 1294555703 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in erm < 1294555718 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call clue, instead of what was @ if default == None before < 1294555731 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that should maybe fix things. < 1294555742 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MAYBE NOT, HOWEVER. < 1294555748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you do that :P < 1294555752 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meanwhile cluetest.py has hung for me < 1294555755 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did, but my version is oooooooooold < 1294555766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you can fix it in mine tomorrow, double fun < 1294555769 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can i get all your files < 1294555777 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i'm not here tomorro < 1294555777 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :w < 1294555783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well < 1294555786 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: if you promise not to like < 1294555788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rewrite them all < 1294555789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because i'd get sad < 1294555795 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i won't rewrite anything < 1294555811 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just change those two lines, and maybe test out the current version on the examples < 1294555852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: does vjn have a file-uploady < 1294555862 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, the filebin, but i doubt it actually works < 1294555866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :link :P < 1294555875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: btw cluetest is the repl, "python cluetest.py file1 file2 file3", very useful for testing, see its source for more < 1294555886 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i don't know where it is, it seems < 1294555889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: don't change cluetest or cluebot, though, I want to factor out the luatre code into a separate file rather than copypasting it < 1294555894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :before anything else changes < 1294555921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :factorial loop ~ {. 0 6 -> 6 < 1294555921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 0 24 -> 24 } < 1294555921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :factorial loop ~ {:. 3 1 -> 6 < 1294555923 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : 2 3 -> 6 < 1294555924 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not going to change anything. < 1294555925 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : :. 1 6 -> 6 < 1294555927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : 0 6 -> 6 } < 1294555929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :factorial loop ~ multiply; pred < 1294555931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :factorial ~ {. 0 -> 1 < 1294555933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 3 -> 26 < 1294555935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 4 -> 24 } < 1294555937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :factorial ~ factorial loop; 1 < 1294555939 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why does this hang clue? < 1294555954 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe because of . 3 -> 26 < 1294555986 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uploading clue < 1294555993 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oops :D < 1294556002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: http://rapidshare.com/files/441572099/clue.zip < 1294556008 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: has your superdrive arrived? < 1294556011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: feel free to correct it to 3 -> 6 locally in numplay.clue :P < 1294556014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: no, about monday or tuesday < 1294556039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: btw i would like it if the implementation became properly tail recursive even though python doesn't really allow that < 1294556045 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294556054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I might make it compile to something that isn't a tangle of lambdas in a day or so < 1294556066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because right now tail recursive code is useless :D < 1294556072 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's inacceptable < 1294556076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: what is < 1294556083 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, was thinking of mentioning that, but realized you aren't an idiot < 1294556086 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this time delay < 1294556090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: ...why? < 1294556123 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: compiling to python bytecode shouldn't be very hard < 1294556127 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean directly < 1294556142 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-231-66.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294556142 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yeah but also python bytecode is kinda gross < 1294556145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: maybe x86 asm :> < 1294556172 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :java bytecode would be nice. just because. < 1294556189 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everyone else is doing it! < 1294556197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well it would certainly be fast. < 1294556199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably < 1294556204 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: because i want you to finally stop using macintosh operating system < 1294556213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: i've used debian for the past months and ubuntu before that... < 1294556217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't touched os x in like a year < 1294556226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: python bytecode has the advantage of being able to do reply stuff easy < 1294556228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*easier < 1294556228 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU HAVE BECOME UNPURE < 1294556233 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and it's like... fast enough :P < 1294556253 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are you doing with python? < 1294556286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: Clue < 1294556292 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's that? < 1294556292 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the most intuitive language possible < 1294556297 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1294556312 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just give the results, and the compiler infers all the code! < 1294556315 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: because you write your programs by simply listing a few example inputs and outputs, and show how they recurse < 1294556315 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's THAT simple! < 1294556320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then there's sortofatinylineofhintsbutwhocaresaboutthat < 1294556324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it gives you your function! < 1294556329 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's tdd? < 1294556334 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quicksort: oklopol: python < 1294556335 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's tddddd < 1294556336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294556339 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quicksort: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Clue_%28oklopol%29/Quicksort < 1294556340 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: edd < 1294556344 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: example driven despair < 1294556350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: test driven dragon < 1294556362 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how does it know what to infer < 1294556366 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'ma remove greater than? from quicksort and use is greater than? elsewhere 'cuz it's in stdlib < 1294556367 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: cleverly! < 1294556380 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every finite sequence has an infinity of possible continuations < 1294556400 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know what test driven development is, but i assume it's something totally gay < 1294556407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :done < 1294556422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: just read http://esolangs.org/wiki/Clue_%28oklopol%29/Quicksort and absorb the simple < 1294556443 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah it's not really even an esolang, we should be talking in #serious_programming < 1294556448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=1021&t=124541 very nice!! < 1294556451 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: this sounds like one of those mysteries < 1294556453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: absolutely < 1294556476 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, how does science putty stay hard yet always able to become malleable < 1294556488 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: this is nicer than painterly < 1294556501 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, how do rice krispies keep crackling and popping?? < 1294556507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: winner of the texture pack compo :P < 1294556519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: also nice: http://www.eldpack.com/ < 1294556544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so, clue self-interp < 1294556597 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you will like this http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=98896 but i don't think it'll work on smp < 1294556606 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the quicksort in clue is really truly the best quicksort ever < 1294556628 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact i know someone who might be very interested in doing something like this with python bytecode < 1294556633 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or even make it generate python < 1294556648 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: wanna make me a texture pack where all the blocks are just drawn a thick border < 1294556661 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: how does clue know what to infer < 1294556664 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i did a almost-all-solid-colour pack but it was beyond fugly < 1294556667 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and maybe slightly different hues of black < 1294556669 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: cleverly < 1294556672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: and it does generate python < 1294556674 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, sorta < 1294556676 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that does not answer my question < 1294556687 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway people sounds like other people sounds scary, they'd probably want to add a way to call functions too < 1294556689 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :explain to me the procedure < 1294556703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: http://www.vjn.fi/clue.rar see clue.py < 1294556703 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :please thanks < 1294556707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :glue function in particular < 1294556710 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :has kinda changed but mostly optimisations < 1294556712 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i can explain the procedure i use in my implementation < 1294556713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that'll give you a good idea < 1294556717 0 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-4db43cf0.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294556718 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh rar < 1294556728 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why must i execute non-gpl code for this < 1294556742 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :page no find eror 404! < 1294556742 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A pages you tried to acess does no exist on this servers. < 1294556742 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Copyright 2007 by VJN. All Rights deserted. v: 0.9 < 1294556749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: that's because you're bad < 1294556756 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least i can stay gpl for another couple of minutes < 1294556760 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: http://rapidshare.com/files/441572099/clue.zip < 1294556760 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: it just brute forces < 1294556762 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :code isn't gpl'd :P < 1294556765 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well sorta. < 1294556773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it literally just brute forced it'd never work. < 1294556774 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: neither is rar < 1294556781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: http://rapidshare.com/files/441572099/clue.zip < 1294556786 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: dos line endings because oklopol < 1294556792 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't you use something sane like dropbox? < 1294556801 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: i would just host it myself except my web server is sort of not on. < 1294556806 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i normally use filebin.ca < 1294556807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's down < 1294556807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :again < 1294556818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dropbox requires an account and is bullshit software i don't need irritating me...like all software < 1294556818 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dropboxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxy < 1294556822 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: do you edit with notepad or wordpad, can't really imagine you using anything else < 1294556824 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's actually pretty nifty < 1294556835 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: sorry, idle < 1294556837 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like the tools they provide and they're under steady maintenance < 1294556849 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ah good, i can convert to unix file endings < 1294556852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: also non-gpl < 1294556852 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you're not using vim?????????????? < 1294556860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: fuck you, oklopol can do what the fuck he wants < 1294556881 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i run it inside a VM so that i don't get infected with non-gpl-aids < 1294556891 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, oklopol cannot do anything. < 1294556900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: thing i wanted to type: rm *.pyc < 1294556900 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION casts a spell of non-doing on oklopol < 1294556904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: thing i typed: rm *.py < 1294556908 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294556920 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: it's really hard to just quickly summarize how exactly clue works < 1294556925 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION downloads his own zip < 1294556930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION hyperventilates < 1294556931 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess it's a good illustration if i explain how recursion is done < 1294556951 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294556956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :phew, it still runs < 1294556958 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294556959 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so you give clue some basic rules and some data and infers some rule that fits the data? < 1294556988 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you give is an input -> output pair, and you tell it all the subinputs and suboutputs, which would be done recursively, then subinputs are computed from input, and output from suboutputs. this gives you a rule for computing recursive cases < 1294556993 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: yes < 1294556998 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the idea < 1294557012 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the details that are interesting, since they make that feasible < 1294557020 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"feasible" < 1294557024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p3593752799.txt < 1294557024 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294557025 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294557025 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DepthLimitException: depth limit exceeded (pivot condition 2) :( < 1294557028 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :given two different implementations of clue, how do they ensure they infer the same rule? < 1294557031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol < 1294557032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294557042 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: add more examples, and they'll probably have the same rule < 1294557045 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no way really < 1294557055 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you can do it < 1294557060 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why haven't I heard of Fantom before? < 1294557065 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do what? < 1294557068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: you have, it was called Fan then < 1294557076 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I haven't heard of Fan either < 1294557078 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you just need to make a canonical way of traversing the space of rules. < 1294557086 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh < 1294557089 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294557090 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course i can do that < 1294557094 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294557096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p3593752799.txt < 1294557096 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294557096 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294557096 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DepthLimitException: depth limit exceeded (pivot condition 2) :( < 1294557098 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would i do that < 1294557122 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's silly < 1294557124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : try: < 1294557124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : newobj=applier(fun,subsetobjs) < 1294557124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if newobj==None:continue < 1294557125 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : except: < 1294557127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : continue < 1294557129 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: this. this is the worst. < 1294557131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can i remove that < 1294557137 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: to have causality < 1294557141 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294557146 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294557147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p3593752799.txt < 1294557147 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294557148 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294557148 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TypeError: 'int' object is unsubscriptable :( < 1294557154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatttt < 1294557182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : File "/Users/ehird/clue/stuff.py", line 47, in car < 1294557182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : def car(l):return l[0] < 1294557182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TypeError: 'int' object is unsubscriptable < 1294557184 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: aha < 1294557186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :need to return none < 1294557217 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Duration literals? < 1294557227 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: should isempty 3 be None < 1294557241 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: i don't really care what you think, it's a stupid idea to order the search in the spec, because then compilers would have to check that whole path, and in general that's impossible. < 1294557242 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Never seen anything like those before, although due to Factor's "syntax", factor may as well < 1294557244 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294557247 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impossible to shortcut < 1294557255 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's easier to let people compile however they want < 1294557259 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes? re isempty < 1294557291 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: not order the search, but canonicize the traversal < 1294557296 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: it's not even specified that the same program should work the same way when compiled twice on the same compiler < 1294557307 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: what's the difference? < 1294557312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what should cdr([]) be? < 1294557314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :error again? < 1294557317 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: error < 1294557323 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example if you have a labirynth and you're traversing it, one way to canonicize it is to say "turn right first" < 1294557333 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fantom is failing to turn me on < 1294557334 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you do NOT have to search all paths to do that < 1294557336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you will be glad to know, making stuff that should be errors into errors makes clue break the stack < 1294557337 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, that's what i meant by ordering the search < 1294557340 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not turning me off, but it's... boring < 1294557349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo thinks about languages with his penis < 1294557366 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you don't have to pre-compute the complete space for that. < 1294557373 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: no, but you can't use another strategy then, and it's not the spec's job to contain the best strategy. < 1294557375 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's insane to think that < 1294557382 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you can < 1294557389 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: just have a specifier < 1294557398 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fantom : C# :: C# : Java < 1294557401 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :From what I can tell < 1294557403 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no you can't, you'd have to prove that it's the first thing you'd've found with the strategy given in the spec. < 1294557419 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you can input your own strategies. < 1294557431 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: otherwise the language is really infertile < 1294557438 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well... remind me to fix what i broke in the zip impl tomorrow. dunno what. :(. also: remind me to make that auto-realigning emacs mode. in fact just copy this to a file and restate it to me. < 1294557443 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: additionally, please hold on to your old code < 1294557447 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: you are infertile < 1294557447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i can correct the current code with it tomorrow < 1294557450 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: okay? < 1294557455 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i am very fertile < 1294557460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: you do not understand clue < 1294557466 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i do < 1294557472 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you do not < 1294557476 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"This means non-nullable is the default unless otherwise specified:" < 1294557479 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you do not understand what i understand about clue < 1294557479 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :! < 1294557480 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's.. good < 1294557484 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a good thing < 1294557486 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: sure < 1294557492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: thx < 1294557493 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bai < 1294557495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294557498 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bye < 1294557503 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's like "Improve this here, improve that there" < 1294557553 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think being able to input your own strategies would really be the best eva < 1294557564 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294557627 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: it would be nice, yes, although possibly the topic of another language. what would be retarded is to write "if there is an implementation of function f with these properties in the ball of size k, then this implementation should be chosen". < 1294557655 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or having in the spec that you always follow the right hand wall < 1294557665 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : for example if you have a labirynth and you're traversing it, one way to canonicize it is to say "turn right first" <-- except this will cause you to miss parts for most labyrinths. which might be analogously relevant for clue as well... < 1294557665 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you define your strategies and put em in a lib < 1294557674 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and just say "use X" < 1294557676 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or "use Y" < 1294557684 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or "use-search-manhattan" < 1294557684 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as i said, if you added a whole strategy concept to the language, yes, that would be nice. < 1294557722 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: no, you would not miss them, unless they're unimportant. < 1294557733 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: the idea is simply to get to the other side. < 1294557746 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: backtracking is implied. < 1294557755 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1294557769 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does that mean, the right hand algo doesn't have backtracking < 1294557775 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it is not a goal to visit every square. < 1294557790 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: imagine two labirynths, one is to your right, one is to your left < 1294557797 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: the one to the right has no exit. < 1294557816 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it has a loop. < 1294557824 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: sorry i somehow read that as "turn right always" :D < 1294557829 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to backtrack < 1294557915 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not part of the right hand algo, but yes, you're right, the right hand algorithm doesn't solve all labyrinth related problems. just like it doesn't solve the knapsack problem. < 1294557954 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i misread him, he didn't actually say the right hand algorithm < 1294557965 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed he didn't < 1294557968 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i misread him too < 1294557974 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was wondering what that comment of yours was about < 1294557987 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: i'm sorry as well < 1294558048 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway it's a good thing that programs work differently on different compilers < 1294558065 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the point is to put in enough examples that that doesn't happen, which isn't all that many. < 1294558111 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is meant to be a *practical* language, for your everyday programming needs. < 1294558129 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it compiles quicksort in less time than it'd take you to eat a sandwich < 1294558163 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if you compile your programs to ski, you can write ANY PROGRAM POSSIBLE < 1294558163 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you haven't been paying attention in maths class have you < 1294558169 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how so? < 1294558182 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : every finite sequence has an infinity of possible continuations < 1294558183 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't you insult my math skills once before? < 1294558191 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite possible :p < 1294558191 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that's the most retarded comment i've ever heard < 1294558198 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um < 1294558200 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seriously < 1294558205 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's mathematically proven < 1294558220 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION learns of the existence of Noop < 1294558220 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the only thingi i'll answer is NO U < 1294558222 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm going to stop talking to you now < 1294558229 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no u. < 1294558322 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but anyway it's clear that you can't continue the sequence 7 5 3 2 1 in anyway for instance, since the next one would have to be a prime number smaller than 1, and one doesn't exist < 1294558324 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ARGH < 1294558325 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :q.e.d. < 1294558332 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*any way < 1294558334 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SO MANY AWESOME SEEMING LANGUAGES OUT THERE < 1294558345 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can be mathematically proven that there are no prime numbers smaller than 1 < 1294558352 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me prove that rigorously: < 1294558371 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let p be a prime number that's smaller than 1; then, it must be 0, but 0 is not a prime number < 1294558393 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it could be negative, but then it's not a natural number, and the sequence must be over natural numbers < 1294558396 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :q.e.d. < 1294558421 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i guess you should take your crazy theories elsewhere < 1294558445 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :riddle time: imagine there are 2 doors..one leads to heaven (actually the place you want to go), the other leads to hell.. in front of each stands a guardian, one is telling the truth, and the other one lies (you don't know who lies).. u have only one(!) question to find out which door leads leads to paradise; what question would you ask? (if you already know the answer, be nice and let the others take a chance) hf! < 1294558447 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: 1 IS NOT A PRIME NUMBER < 1294558451 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: oh shit < 1294558460 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so actually even THAT sequence doesn't exist? < 1294558466 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :INDEED < 1294558467 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn...... < 1294558471 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is kinda creepy < 1294558472 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294558474 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can see it there < 1294558480 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it... doesn't exist < 1294558484 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :8| < 1294558496 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :math can be pretty counter-intuitive sometimes < 1294558500 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you could also drop the 2 < 1294558519 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you heard that theorem that if you take a ball, and an infinite amount of boxes, then you can build another ball by making the correct choice? < 1294558521 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that would be an odd thing to do < 1294558533 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294558556 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or was it 5 balls < 1294558584 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: how did it go again, i'm a bit rusty on my advanced complex measure theory? < 1294558595 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it rings a bell. do you know what's an anagram of banach-tarski? < 1294558607 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well? < 1294558619 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :banach-tarski banach-tarski < 1294558628 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294558634 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's awesome < 1294558722 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: sorry, but if there is anyone here who _doesn't_ know the answer, we'll have to ban him for being insufficiently geeky. < 1294558733 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294558744 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nevermind < 1294558784 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION just went "oh that simple thing" and went on with his life, now wonders if he could actually do it < 1294558879 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay yeah i got it < 1294558890 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was slightly deeper than i expected < 1294558907 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't know it though < 1294558987 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm right, there actually is a trivial solution < 1294558989 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://xkcd.com/246/ and http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0327.html < 1294558991 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was kinda wondering < 1294559016 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/KnightsAndKnaves with the usual warning) < 1294559020 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"true?" < 1294559027 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"yep" vs "nope" < 1294559033 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry for spoiler < 1294559039 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, you havent just gooled the answer, did you?^^ < 1294559045 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bad bad oerjan < 1294559051 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: i ruined it < 1294559059 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gave away the whole answer < 1294559061 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: of course not, i was trying to find that oots comic from before < 1294559078 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i liked it < 1294559089 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahh < 1294559106 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you also don't know which one stands at which door :D < 1294559128 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDDDD < 1294559134 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no you dont :> < 1294559146 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so fun, let's try again < 1294559197 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw the tvtropes page _does_ contain spoilers. in fact several options. < 1294559214 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://emerginglangs.com/speakers/ < 1294559218 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to learn all of these < 1294559219 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right now < 1294559232 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, not all of them < 1294559240 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay so just use the fact both operations are involutions < 1294559252 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean id and not < 1294559253 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dalvik isn't even a lang.. well, I guess it kind of ... huh? < 1294559260 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"if you asked yourself, ...." < 1294559352 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, route through both gates < 1294559369 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: i am currently mind-boggling at oklopol apparently being _two_ geeky to find a simple solution :D < 1294559371 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really it's a trivial problem once you put it down formally < 1294559375 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*_too_ < 1294559394 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: my solutions are g^2 and gh < 1294559402 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you get away with just one operation? < 1294559404 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I'm looking at ooc < 1294559406 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a danger of geekiness, you see too many options < 1294559423 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its not that simple.. to be honest.. i spent hours on it < 1294559426 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tell me in pm if you can't tell here < 1294559479 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to be honest i've known this puzzle for so long that i cannot even remember if i solved it before reading the answer or not (probably not, to be honest) < 1294559496 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean it's likely those aren't the simplest solutions when you actually translate them to english, but i don't think that's a very interesting problem. < 1294559816 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think ooc has more marketers than program language designers < 1294559850 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Another is set in Transylvania, where people can be either sane or insane (insane people believe untruths) and either a human or a vampire. Humans speak the truth and vampires lie all the time, so an insane human speaks untruths he believes while an insane vampire speaks truths he does not believe in." < 1294559868 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I'm wrong < 1294559879 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the documentation is so... obtuse < 1294559888 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll look at it agian later I gues < 1294559934 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: doesn't a true mathematician forget all problems, and solve them from scratch every time < 1294559949 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hear neumann started all his proofs from epsilons < 1294559999 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1294560000 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1294560005 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :COULD BE < 1294560032 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be nice if that was a characteristic of a true mathematician, because i still keep proving equivalences between definitions of continuity daily < 1294560050 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i certainly used to do such things < 1294560056 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not so much these days < 1294560069 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i'm working on finite things now, but usually < 1294560128 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :were you just like me at 21? < 1294560173 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exam in 24 hours, fuckfuckfuck < 1294560175 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :reproving theorems in my head? yes. < 1294560183 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i meant in every way < 1294560205 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :being paid to do math has made me a really lazy studier, i feel like i'm above taking courses < 1294560208 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294560228 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOTHING YOU CAN TEACH ME. < 1294560229 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have the impression you're considerably more extroverted than me. but that might not be something which shows perfectly over irc. < 1294560256 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was recently told by a professor that i might enjoy the master's thesis seminar because i'm so extroverted < 1294560279 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*g < 1294560389 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and once a guy was really surprised i was a mathematician because i actually talked to people < 1294560413 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i wonder what kinda mathematicians he's met because i mostly played the guitar when he visited afair < 1294560415 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i certainly started dropping a number of lectures after a few years. especially early morning ones. < 1294560464 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :master in maths, social engineerer, star-author and sex-symbol :> < 1294560468 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've started not doing homework, and improvising a solution if asked (they choose a random dude to present their solution) < 1294560513 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sex-symbol? :D < 1294560525 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea < 1294560534 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lemme draw you one < 1294560541 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think he deduces that from the fact you seem to actually get laid < 1294560552 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :another translation bug?? < 1294560554 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :8=====D (|) < 1294560561 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if we are to believe you < 1294560564 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: no i don't think so < 1294560568 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :k < 1294560574 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ah, the nerd definition < 1294560628 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually not so much lately, since i broke up with the gf, although we've been talking about being sex-buddies with an ex < 1294560682 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(we broke up because of artistic differences) < 1294560692 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i _guess_ all the porn talk could be a factor as well < 1294560721 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294560732 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you mean she didn't want to make a porn movie with you? how unartistic. < 1294560744 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes! < 1294560758 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually she didn't, although i'm not entirely sure that was a factor < 1294560797 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so now that elliott is gone < 1294560811 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's really NOTHING for me here, i wonder if i should actually start studying soon. < 1294560826 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just there's a fuckload of theorems : d < 1294560833 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean a true and serious fuckload < 1294560845 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's scary. < 1294560847 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hundreds of thousands, i hear < 1294560860 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294560887 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you know green's theorem < 1294560891 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294560898 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in semigroup theory :P < 1294560908 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no i'm a bit green on that < 1294560944 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe we should kick&ban oklopol, until he mad the grade :p < 1294560950 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i thought you meant in analysis, and was going to complain that i missed a pun opportunity) < 1294560981 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294560988 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23hours and a hald < 1294560991 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: tried that with Sgeo, didn't work < 1294561013 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: also i need to sleep some part of that :D < 1294561034 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 am now, the exam is actually at 9 am tomorrow prolly < 1294561057 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it turned out eventually that he only got to doing his homework once he got back on the channel. well i guess the swiftly approaching extended deadline might have had a part as well. < 1294561063 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's maybe 10 pages that contain stuff i couldn't just crap out of my wrist in the exam < 1294561115 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: green's is when you define xLy <=> Sx = Sy and xRy symmetrically < 1294561124 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then H = intersection of those < 1294561156 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then a H class is a group iff it contains an identity iff it is closed under multiplication of at least two of its elements < 1294561172 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :crazy shit huh? < 1294561180 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a lot more where that came from < 1294561263 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well aren't you gonna say "woooooooooow" < 1294561280 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god, i'm so tired. < 1294561295 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wooow < 1294561302 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i go to sleep now, and sleep my usual 10-12 hours, i'll still have like 12 hours left < 1294561303 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really, it doesn't precisely sound surprising < 1294561361 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: in my case i would be more worried about actually being able to be awake tomorrow... < 1294561382 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are many examples of complicated proofs in the literature which prove a small subcase of that < 1294561394 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i guess your sleeping rhythm isn't quite as fragile as mine < 1294561399 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is it not surprising, maybe i don't understand it? < 1294561422 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't have a sleeping rhythm. < 1294561432 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just sleep when ever i happen to < 1294561435 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well i guess it could be harder to prove than i think < 1294561443 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*whenever < 1294561463 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thank god for saying that, i actually took the papers here < 1294561474 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*you said taht < 1294561476 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*that < 1294561529 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the first iff looks like it should be nearly trivial, at least < 1294561535 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294561558 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm indeed < 1294561570 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't spoil it, i'm sure you're faster than me < 1294561585 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm wait is that an identity for H or for the whole semigroup? < 1294561592 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for H < 1294561695 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah then that is trivial < 1294561723 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right to left, why does tehre need to be an inverse in H? < 1294561726 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*there < 1294561748 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because ee = e, so Sx and xS both contain e < 1294561767 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or wait hm < 1294561775 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=1021&t=124541 very nice!! <-- quite, but the inventory screen looks weird. < 1294561776 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :darn < 1294561780 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xS and Sx of course contain e, because they are that H class < 1294561793 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so? that "inverse" might not be in H < 1294561800 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just realized that :D < 1294561846 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alrighty, it's possible that there's a very simple proof, and that it's on three pages just for clarity, there's a very nice lemma that clarifies how things jump between these classes < 1294561858 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :before this < 1294561861 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1294561875 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was i too formal? < 1294561880 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :hagb4rd|afk < 1294561884 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :too sarcastic rather < 1294561906 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was being serious :D < 1294561958 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :deducing something from "closed under multiplication of at least two of its elements" looks somewhat harder anyway < 1294561961 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway it's inverse semigroups that are the main point of this course, do you remember that semigroup problem we tried to solve in the fall? < 1294561971 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vaguely < 1294561994 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :inverse semigroups are that kinda stuff < 1294562005 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you define inverses without an identity < 1294562013 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yeah < 1294562016 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like forallx, x = xyx for unique x < 1294562021 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*for all x, < 1294562022 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xx'x = x and x'xx' = x' < 1294562040 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err right, that for unique is inverse semigroup i think < 1294562064 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they turn out to have all kinds of crazy properties < 1294562079 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...which i don't understand at all < 1294562084 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294562100 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose i did at some point, but now i don't even remember what the trace is < 1294562131 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we were fooling around with idempotents and proving there was only one and thus it was a group under some condition < 1294562187 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION doesn't recall any trace either < 1294562196 0 :marcules!~marc@unaffiliated/marcules JOIN :#esoteric < 1294562202 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What worked for me was not sleeping for 48 hours < 1294562209 0 :marcules!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION schaut zu hagb4rd|afk :> < 1294562214 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :S is a group <=> forall x exactly one y: x = x x'x < 1294562220 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was it that one? < 1294562225 0 :hagb4rd|afk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1294562234 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The effects of which are still with me < 1294562236 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then also exactly one y: x x' idempotent < 1294562246 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the form of staying up and night and sleeping during the day < 1294562253 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*x = xyx < 1294562261 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*xy idempotent < 1294562293 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: your spelling seems to imply you need sleep < 1294562296 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm sure it was the first one < 1294562300 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yeah. < 1294562326 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when reading these proofs, the most important thing is being able to retain the about 10 things they name, and remember exactly what equations were proved sofar < 1294562345 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's like the exact opposite of the being able to do nothing with my brain state that i'm in atm < 1294562368 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heeey shoppe is open, maybe i should go buy some pizza, and watch the cleveland show < 1294562372 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD < 1294562391 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this early on a sunday? < 1294562396 0 :dilapan!~nuramon@p5B364E16.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294562401 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it's 10-10 every day < 1294562409 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294562412 0 :dilapan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1294562415 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a kinda special shoppe < 1294562425 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BTW, elliott really was trying to login as me < 1294562429 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's *the* shoppe of the student village i'm living in < 1294562429 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-NickServ- 3 failed logins since last login. < 1294562431 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-NickServ- Last failed attempt from: elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott on Jan 08 23:26:33 2011. < 1294562435 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most shops in norway don't keep open on sundays, by law < 1294562448 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ones under 400m^2 can stay open here < 1294562452 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :small ones are exempted < 1294562453 0 :hagb4rd|afk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey dilapan :> < 1294562461 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and can in general stay open whenever they want < 1294562470 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds similar < 1294562560 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: there was a great battle here in the early 90s between shops and gasoline stations where the former had to obey closing restrictions but not the latter and the latter started getting more and more shop-like groceries and the like < 1294562560 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1294562628 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, the ANI tutorial reads like an esolang spec < 1294562631 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after trying for a while to distinguish based on what they sold the politicians eventually gave up and changed it to being based on shop area instead < 1294562637 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol and then shops started selling gasoline < 1294562649 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well some tried < 1294562653 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really? :D < 1294562657 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fun < 1294562664 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although not for that reason i think < 1294562713 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was a grocery chain (rema 1000) who tried adding gasoline outlets. this was after what i described above though. < 1294562727 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/outlets/pumps/ < 1294562756 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think they sold them off after a while < 1294562790 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway here in norway 7/eleven tends to be open 24/7 < 1294562852 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(they're actually franchised by the rema 1000 people) < 1294562883 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well here in trondheim at least, don't know if it's true in smaller places < 1294562908 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How is ANI not an esolang? < 1294562911 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION mindboggles < 1294562956 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know about ANI but we used to require some _intent_ to be esoteric < 1294562976 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294563004 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm sure ANI is perfectly usable for ordinary applications < 1294563005 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was this BancStar thing which was completely insane but which wasn't considered esoteric since it was actually used in some industry < 1294563023 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something like that < 1294563038 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just.. now I know what it feels like for an imperative programmer to jump headfirst into functional programming < 1294563043 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Utterly, utterly bizarre < 1294563060 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, do you know any dataflow languages? < 1294563064 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because that's what ANI is < 1294563124 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: multiplication from left preserves H classes, so if two things have their product in a H-class, you also know their H-classes go into that H-class < 1294563134 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm i don't _know_ any, but i've heard something. sisal rings a bell. < 1294563134 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this property of H is easy to prove, although a bit verbose < 1294563155 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's xy \in H => H group < 1294563158 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is the hard part i think < 1294563177 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or wait < 1294563197 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I think it's called anic < 1294563257 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it's not that simple bleh < 1294563273 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um H classes are sort of left-right symmetric aren't they < 1294563302 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1294563322 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i specified left because at that precise moment i wasn't sure i wouldn't need to talk about right as well < 1294563333 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but now it looks kinda useless, yes < 1294563351 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i certainly don't see why multiplication from left preserves H classes < 1294563558 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not actually true: what's true is if x, y \in S, xLy, and sx=y, s'y=x, then 1) (s*) : R_x -> R_y is bij., (s'*) : R_y -> R_x is bij 2) (s*) and (s'*) are inverses 3) zLsz for all z \in R_x 4) u, v \in R_x => (uHv <=> suHsv) < 1294563562 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294563576 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh < 1294563583 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the last one < 1294563585 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :says < 1294563588 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1294563612 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ANIC gives me a headache < 1294563617 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It looks awesome, but < 1294563668 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: um but S is not necessary a monoid so how do you know there is an s such that sx=y? or is that an assumption? < 1294563672 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if xLy, and sx = y, then multiplication by s from left is actually a bijection from R_x to R_y < 1294563674 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the first one < 1294563690 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's easy because s' is its inverse < 1294563702 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: oh shit sorry < 1294563705 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have the wrong definition < 1294563724 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1294563725 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xLy <=> S^1 x = S^1 y < 1294563735 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where S^1 is guess < 1294563749 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :S or identity? < 1294563761 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's S + identity < 1294563771 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a monoid < 1294563780 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294563795 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if there already is an identity, then S^1 = S < 1294563795 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294563802 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :crazy i know! < 1294563817 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's i think equivalent to x \in S y and y \in S x, no? < 1294563838 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, therefore i could implement this relation with s and s' < 1294563844 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't even know the name of the thing < 1294563846 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yeah that was implicit up there < 1294563848 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it ANI or ANIC? < 1294563886 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm except... if S x does not contain x what then < 1294563900 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't matter, L is defined using S^1 < 1294563911 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is S + identity < 1294563911 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's necessary to use S^1 for that < 1294563933 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, what do you mean < 1294563954 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, it's necessary to define that particular definition the way it's defined, if you want to define it the way it's defined. < 1294563967 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294563981 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just gave the wrong definition for relation L, originally < 1294563989 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which would've made the theorems impossible to prove < 1294563990 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probabl < 1294563991 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y < 1294563994 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well if S x doesn't contain x then only x is in its class < 1294564012 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1294564025 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1294564046 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in its what class, L class with the correct def? < 1294564053 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294564096 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because S^1 y cannot contain x if S^1 x contains y and x is not y < 1294564122 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1294564133 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on in that case < 1294564133 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming S x does not contain x < 1294564136 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1294564156 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1294564174 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't think at all right now :\ < 1294564214 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really don't see it < 1294564250 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ilua < 1294564260 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assume S x does not contain x, and xLy, x != y. then S^1 x = S^1 y. < 1294564302 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since x!=y, y \in S x. also x \in S y. but then x \in S x, contradiction. < 1294564350 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're using the wrong def of L there or? < 1294564357 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, the right one. < 1294564373 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since x!=y you cannot have 1 x = y or x = 1 y < 1294564373 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so... you assume xLy, and prove S^1 x = S^1 y? < 1294564380 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I should stick with Mozart/Oz instead < 1294564391 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the definition of L < 1294564393 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: um that's not proving, that's using the definition < 1294564398 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :opkay < 1294564405 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohh lol < 1294564406 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah okay < 1294564429 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah okay you're right < 1294564460 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does that give us something interesting? < 1294564473 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems like it could be the gist of ...something < 1294564486 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only a way to rephrase xLy without using S^1 < 1294564486 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :locks < 1294564488 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oz has locks < 1294564498 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes back to trying to understand ANIC < 1294564527 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm err right < 1294564528 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294564538 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oz is tempting me though in every other way < 1294564542 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose it's something i'd normally consider trivial < 1294564574 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i'm tired too < 1294564849 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my head hurts < 1294564874 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll prolly go to the shoppe, eat a pizza, and try to sleep only till like 18 < 1294564891 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and hope i can stay awake all night and then do the exam :D < 1294564896 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa < 1294564929 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've been trying to flip my sleep rhythm all week, but it just keeps around, and i mostly sleep during the day < 1294564991 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :The fucked up sleep channel | http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page | logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D or (hg) http://codu.org/projects/esotericlogs/hg/ < 1294565003 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway see ya, might actually be useful to talk about this stuff with you if i was even close to my usual self, but currently i'm just durrrr xS durrrr what did that mean again < 1294565030 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see ya < 1294565098 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...actually that's exactly what i did because i defined R using xS and then assumed x was automatically there < 1294565108 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yewah <>-ewaf<-> < 1294565517 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :skip < 1294565524 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay, I wrote an Oz program! < 1294565564 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All sorts of languages have bizarre ways of saying NOP < 1294565570 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i could write an Oz program, if i only had a brain < 1294565581 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :COBOL's continue, Oz's skip, Python's pass < 1294565583 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol oerjan < 1294565662 0 :kokkoloko!~Oliver@x1-6-1c-bd-b9-af-db-4d.k464.webspeed.dk JOIN :#esoteric < 1294565712 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastie.org/1442161 < 1294565724 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, this code from the tutorial is comprehendible! < 1294565755 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just realized something, I think < 1294565785 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{Max 3 4 X} would bind 4 to X. But {Max 3 4 3} would raise an exception, and {Max 3 4 4} doesn't < 1294565791 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's interesting to think about < 1294565937 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's def. a Prolog vibe here < 1294566254 0 :kokkoloko!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294566858 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1294567383 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders what Alice is lie < 1294567400 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alice ML? < 1294567406 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Grah, don't want to learn SML first < 1294567426 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's a sort of toned down version of Oz, but with Types < 1294567449 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is Oz still actively worked on? < 1294567790 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, there is a hole in my mines that I did not blow. I have not been on for a few days but I suspect ehird or PH. It looks like TNT < 1294567799 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they were in that area when I last disconnected < 1294567850 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, a lot of damage < 1294568196 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, see /msg for further detailks < 1294568198 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :details* < 1294568383 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://superuser.com/questions/230871/is-it-possible-to-code-on-two-different-computers-simultaneously < 1294568385 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION predicts this will instigate a violent minecraft civil war which will lasts for months and only peter out when it turns out these explosions are just caused by a somewhat rare interaction of bugs < 1294568391 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Is it possible to code on two different computers simultaenously" < 1294568395 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*last < 1294568796 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Sometimes it feels as if we're in a permanent civil war already. < 1294569159 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wants to see servers based on war < 1294569171 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION imagines extensive Obsidian mining campaigns < 1294569193 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_programming_languages < 1294569201 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, there goes any chance of me sleeping ever again < 1294569238 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, I have no way of determining which are interesting and which aren;t < 1294569265 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All that have odd SHA hashes are interesting. (A scientific fact.) < 1294569331 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: you could make something that picks a random one each week and tells you to learn about it < 1294569347 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless it has "Visual" in the name < 1294569713 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-6-114.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294570456 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc1-sgyl29-2-0-cust788.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294570456 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294570456 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294570476 0 :dilapan!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294570684 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, perhaps you can explain why there is an obvious TNT hole in my mines. You and ehird were the people most recently seen near that place. < 1294570727 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want my lawyer. < 1294570737 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294570781 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, in other words, you did it? < 1294570795 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I mean that I want my lawyer. < 1294570898 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, that sounds absurd in this situation. Anyway someone blew up stuff there. One chest with mined obsidian and diamond (about 15 of each) was in the destroyed area. So I want to know who did it < 1294570916 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm. < 1294570937 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott placed the TNT, and I set it off unintentionally. < 1294570951 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ridiculous as that sounds, I have a touchpad with tap-to-click enabled. < 1294570989 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So TNT is unremovable? < 1294571009 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, ... < 1294571010 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, you can safely detonate it if you pour water over it. < 1294571020 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, speaking of compensation... < 1294571048 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How much obsidian can you mine with 3 diamonds (= 1 diamond pick-axe)? < 1294571063 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, you have far more obsidian than 15 blocks. < 1294571080 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You've stated yourself that you have storerooms full of it. < 1294571094 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes quite. But it is work restoring the area < 1294571101 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294571114 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, you could have told me right away so ineiros could have used a backup to restore that chunk < 1294571143 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I can help patching over the hole. < 1294571174 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, also compensation doesn't work that way. If you burn down a small garden shed in real life of someone who has a large house and a lot of money there will still be consequences < 1294571196 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, take it up with elliott. < 1294571223 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I leave it up to you two how to split the compensation between you < 1294571246 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, that will come to "nothing/2" then. < 1294571284 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, very well. I will speak with ineiros when he comes on < 1294571422 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I did offer to help repair the damage. < 1294571423 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But if you think elliott is going to do anything like help with "compensation", you are being astoundingly naïve. < 1294571426 0 :pingveno!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294571430 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294571435 0 :Leonidas!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294571445 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294571449 0 :hagb4rd|afk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: hagb4rd|afk < 1294571467 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I wonder what he would do in real life in case he messed up for someone else < 1294571491 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: With one diamond pickaxe, you can mine 1025 blocks of obsidian, assuming you have the patience (about 4 hours, 22 minutes of solid mining) for it. < 1294571545 0 :dbc!~daniel@130-94-161-238-dsl.hevanet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294571559 0 :pingveno!~pingveno@c-98-246-133-8.hsd1.or.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294571559 0 :coppro!~scshunt@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1294571559 0 :Leonidas!~Leonidas@unaffiliated/leonidas JOIN :#esoteric < 1294571577 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minecraft is serious business. < 1294571606 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION distinctly recall someone said obsidian should be made with lava and water, not mined < 1294571610 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*recalls < 1294571617 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, yes, it should. < 1294571634 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, if you don't want to spend ages getting the blocks. < 1294571851 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How long does it take to transport all the lava to where you need it? < 1294571873 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: Depends on how many buckets you want to make. < 1294571896 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Enough to have large stockpiles of lava < 1294571935 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you use all the non-hand slots for buckets, you could carry 27 bucketfuls of lava each trip to your lava sea. < 1294572355 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1294572406 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, incidentally, why is the hillside in front of the wooden house scoured of dirt? < 1294572569 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is this a new development or something? < 1294572613 0 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294572613 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294572613 0 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294572638 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :03:29:29 Is this a new development or something? < 1294572653 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, just wondering why it was like that in the first place. < 1294572661 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. Well, that was before my time. < 1294572690 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, to answer your in game question: 26 < 1294572795 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294575614 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I like Atomo more than Slate, but.. I'm wondering if Slate syntax weirdness is there for a very good reason < 1294575649 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And how, in Atomo, you'd go about pattern matching such that a family of objects might receive etc,' < 1294575660 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The way in Slate, you'd use Someclass traits in the thingy < 1294575685 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm assuming elliott knows the answer to this. He's known almost every language I have ever looked at < 1294575686 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :. < 1294575753 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does wood have any use? or should it all be turned into planks? < 1294575759 0 :dangerouslyfluff!~dangerous@209.123.64.179 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294575767 0 :dangerouslyfluff!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294575841 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"For wood to be destroyed by fire it must have several sides simultaneously burning. If only one side is burning, the fire and wood block will last forever. This is probably a bug but makes for nice fireplaces. Now, Netherrack can be used instead, as it burns forever without any tricks." < 1294575965 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : does wood have any use? or should it all be turned into planks? ← basically, yes. < 1294575978 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's good for decoration, but not much else. < 1294575996 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also how does the algorithm for culling leaves work? < 1294576007 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when you chop some wood away there is some kind of CA that culls leaves < 1294576036 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : does wood have any use? or should it all be turned into planks? <-- it is useful to carry as logs in inventory, takes less space for the same amount of wood < 1294576115 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is this list exaustive? http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Crafting < 1294576120 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, lets say you are exploring a cave and want to carry torches with you. Carrying 64 logs will be equiv of 256 wood, which can be used for§ 512 torches (with 128 coal). < 1294576148 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and this can be done in inventory screen crafting slots < 1294576218 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Atomo blocks are the prettiest of them all < 1294576245 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, think so. But I haven't checked. < 1294576254 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but at a quick glance I see nothing missing < 1294576294 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, though it does combine some where the material varies but the shape does not (various types of armour, the ore blocks) < 1294576300 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and tools) < 1294576528 0 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-65-80.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1294576647 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294576862 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :sebbu < 1294577284 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wants a list of all domain names that end with -lang < 1294578069 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, unsure if you can enumerate an entire TLD. Probably not < 1294578116 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I am aware that my fantasy is unrealistic < 1294578123 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good thing too. It would be like crack < 1294578135 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any list of new and interesting languages is crack to me < 1294578370 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Programming_language < 1294578393 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, there's no filter on that < 1294578403 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have some idea of what fascinates me and what doesn't < 1294578416 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294578417 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1294578420 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh shit < 1294578523 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: the ball paradox. < 1294578546 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is based on the axiom of choice and uses rotations in 4 dimensions. < 1294578559 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_ will not be seen alive again. < 1294578593 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But there's so many awesome languages not on the wiki! < 1294578794 0 :ELEMENTO!~minskum@123.109.156.2 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294578855 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal, I am aware that my fantasy is unrealistic Good thing too. It would be like crack <-- what, is it a fantasy to list all domains ending in -lang? < 1294578859 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just searched Freenode for channels tha mention lang < 1294578864 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean what the hell < 1294578900 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm screwed < 1294578940 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :personally I seldom check out new languages unless someone I know mentions it < 1294579023 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found a good set of usable languages that cover my daily needs (haskell, C, erlang, scheme, plus a handful of shell like languages for trivial tasks). < 1294579123 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what good -lang channels are there? < 1294579128 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo < 1294579140 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know of any that uses such a suffix < 1294579154 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, it's #haskell, not #haskell-lang for example < 1294579158 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some have lang in the topic < 1294579173 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#euphoria #mirah #haxe #grml #BitC < 1294579175 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#arc < 1294579186 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only one I heard of in that list is BitC < 1294579198 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which looks somewhat interesting. Might be dead though. Not sure < 1294579202 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#atomo < 1294579212 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#fancy < 1294579218 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait, I heard of arc too < 1294579220 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#fantom doesn't mention lang in the topic < 1294579222 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do not try arc < 1294579224 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ever < 1294579234 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh? < 1294579263 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, it's a very very bad lisp. The PHP of LISPs basically. < 1294579285 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, Paul Graham, need I say more. < 1294579296 0 :ELEMENTO!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com < 1294579304 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The PHP of LISPs" was more informative than "Paul Graham" < 1294579411 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grml is not a language, apparently < 1294579439 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It got caught because of "Official language: en" in the topic < 1294579470 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, Arc? < 1294579513 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#hugin < 1294579523 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is not a language < 1294579638 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, err. Are you asking if I'm talking about arc or are you asking what arc is? < 1294579647 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is itt? < 1294579650 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*it < 1294579700 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, the PHP of lisps. I expect elliott hates it too (not sure if it has been mentioned in the channel before). < 1294579726 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but that's just telling me your opinion of it, not what it is or why you think that. < 1294579785 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, do you know of Paul Graham at all? < 1294579791 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1294579803 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I associate his name with Lisp vaguely. < 1294579831 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, hm, you should ask elliott when he comes on. I'm a bit busy today. Water leak and that means calling insurance company and so on. < 1294580468 0 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-65-80.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1294580509 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/h5Mjg.jpg < 1294580513 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Goddamn it. < 1294580527 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, looks awesome < 1294580542 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, is it Hindenburg? < 1294580547 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but it's bigger than the ROU and much cooler! < 1294580563 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, quite. How many blocks it it from end to end? < 1294580571 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dunno. < 1294580581 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Definitely more than the ROU, though. < 1294580584 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294580593 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, less I think. But it is much thicker near the middle < 1294580613 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, and it is a lot more complete < 1294580623 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, what server is it on? < 1294580643 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know. < 1294580860 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, nice large ocean in that screenshot too, behind the zeppelin or blimp < 1294580860 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to play some more MC < 1294580868 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just wish I didn't have to do it fullscreen < 1294580873 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1294580878 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is end of world is it? < 1294580882 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did I mention that it's logically possible to penetrate 1-metre-thick layers of anything? < 1294580884 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(rendered world) < 1294580911 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, of anything? < 1294580919 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep. < 1294580927 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, well sure with the right tools < 1294581033 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, but MC seems to match there except for bedrock. And bedrock can be explained by suspension of disbelief. And also that falling through bottom of world is annoying. < 1294581439 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1294582813 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, erm, no, I mean without breaking it. < 1294582819 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. including bedrock. < 1294582929 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, are you saying you can wall through a wall of steel 1 m thick without making a hole? < 1294582969 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, I meant in MC. < 1294582980 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And only horizontal layers. < 1294582984 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, oh I thought this was a "look how unrealistic MC is" rant < 1294583005 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And only in SMP. < 1294583011 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm how? < 1294583086 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Place track on top of layer. Place minecart on top of track. Climb into minecart. Destroy minecart. < 1294583201 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, ah < 1294583230 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, where does the minecart end up? < 1294583277 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume you pick it up while falling into the top-secret enemy base. < 1294583387 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, what happens if the layer is 2 or 3 thick? < 1294583423 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, then it doesn't work, obviously. < 1294583601 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a channel on here for music? < 1294583697 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt there's a decent one. < 1294583746 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S219XUm18LA <-- This particular break is called the AMEN < 1294584133 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There should really be a language that compiles into a TM. < 1294584146 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TM? < 1294584164 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Turing machine? < 1294584253 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I still think that http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3keLeMwfHY is the coolest thing ever.) < 1294584270 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's silly < 1294584299 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need a computer to build that computer < 1294584385 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very attractive machine though < 1294584448 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but to be fair an analogue control mechanism would be nigh impossible to build. < 1294584652 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, analogue computers do exist though. < 1294584875 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, any sophisticated enough for a TM's control mechanism? < 1294584897 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, no expert on them < 1294584910 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean Phantom__Hoover? < 1294584915 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a TM control mechanism? < 1294584931 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The state machine? < 1294584957 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The bit which controls the tape? < 1294584982 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, isn't that just an FSA basically? < 1294584984 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't understand. What's that to do with analogue? < 1294585022 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm. I had a point but I've forgotten it. < 1294585068 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Analogue" is an absurd notation anyway < 1294585079 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing in reality is analogue < 1294585385 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you'd rather explain the idea at length every time you need it rather than give it a name? < 1294585400 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: really? < 1294585415 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think it's at all absurd < 1294585424 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not? < 1294585454 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway Vorpal, a tm is nothing but an FSA with moving, reading and writing < 1294585527 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: digital is when we use two-valued electrical signals and no moving parts, analogue is else. < 1294585548 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, I thought it meant something else < 1294585572 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that's a horrible oversimplification. < 1294585622 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the significance of the term is that almost everything happens to be digital < 1294585646 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so just knowing the vague fact of analogueness is more than enough in many cases < 1294585678 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but really i'm not sure what you mean by that nothing in reality is analogue < 1294585728 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hope your point wasn't that the universe is discrete or anything < 1294585747 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant analogue as in Newtonian physics or exact real numbers (which can hold an infinite amount of information) < 1294585782 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you take these things seriously you get stupid consequences like planetary systems which reach infinity in finite time etc. < 1294585850 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know what that means. but analogue is a very concrete concept, and it refers to the kind of continuous scales the universe allows, not to computation with reals. < 1294585861 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294585863 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does "reach infinity" mean < 1294585931 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.ams.org/notices/199505/saari-2.pdf < 1294586131 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294586143 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so reach infinity in the obvious sense < 1294586210 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : anyway Vorpal, a tm is nothing but an FSA with moving, reading and writing <-- indeed. Wasn't that what I said? < 1294586221 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i was confirming that < 1294586252 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*yes, a tm is ... < 1294587352 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YouTube comment: "omfg thats diamond i picked that yeter day and thoguht it was a snowball so i threw it into the lava xD" < 1294587357 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NaZ6wtes58M&feature=related < 1294587374 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minecraft spells "chestplate" as "chesplate". < 1294587375 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I despair. < 1294587400 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294587867 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jesus, what was that. < 1294587889 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like a screech or some... oh, it's that terrifying ambience. < 1294588572 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo < 1294588728 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294588792 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Vorpal told me to ask you why Arc is the PHP of Lisps. < 1294588818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tell Vorpal I just woke up. < 1294588825 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm here < 1294588850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Tell Vorpal I just woke up. < 1294588871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:34:05 riddle time: imagine there are 2 doors..one leads to heaven (actually the place you want to go), the other leads to hell.. in front of each stands a guardian, one is telling the truth, and the other one lies (you don't know who lies).. u have only one(!) question to find out which door leads leads to paradise; what question would you ask? (if you already know the answer, be nice and let the others take a chance) hf < 1294588871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :! < 1294588875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahahahaahahahah < 1294588875 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: real numbers do not hold an infinite amount of information. < 1294588876 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, he just woke up, apparently < 1294588878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahhahahahhahahahaha < 1294588881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: thanks < 1294588885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: yes they do < 1294588896 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294588898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: consider Chaitin's omega < 1294588909 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, they do. < 1294588910 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, uh, you are not on ignore. Why go through Phantom__Hoover? < 1294588914 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's obvious. < 1294588918 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every real number can be encoded by a single point on an axis. < 1294588923 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: because i felt like it! < 1294588928 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294588930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: that single point is describable only by a real. < 1294588940 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes! < 1294588941 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It can take an infinite number of digits to, say, describe the real in binary < 1294588942 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you are aiming for being awake the same time as oerjan is? < 1294588947 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They can be represented by an infinite array of bits; ergo, they represent an infinite amount of information. < 1294588955 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that real is just one piece of information. < 1294588963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: clearly. < 1294588966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: you do not understand information theory. < 1294588971 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, I have a file on my hard drive < 1294588974 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, do please shut up, then. < 1294588976 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it cannot be described by a finite amount of binary data < 1294588976 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's Infinity GB < 1294588982 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: gfy < 1294588989 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does not store an infinite amount of information, as it's just one file. < 1294589001 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: you do not know what the formal definition of "information" is. accordingly, your arguments have no basis. < 1294589006 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: you misunderstood my point < 1294589012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a real _does_ convey an infinite amount of information. < 1294589031 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: my point is, "finite" depends on what algebraic system you are working on < 1294589054 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's "infinity" that has a tendency to vary, I think < 1294589055 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Information_theory < 1294589056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: thank you < 1294589058 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but how compressible is that real. That is also interesting (though a different issue). < 1294589063 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think "finite" is usually the same, I may be wrong < 1294589073 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure I'm using the right words for it here < 1294589075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well it's equivalent to a unique infinite stream of naturals. < 1294589081 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's exactly as compressable as that :) < 1294589084 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in Z, you can only encode +oo with an infinite amount of numbers which tend to +oo < 1294589085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(more or less) < 1294589104 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in Z u {+oo} you can encode +oo in a finite amount of information < 1294589115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: question, what makes you say that you know more mathematics than other people and act condescending towards them when clearly you have no idea at all? < 1294589126 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i act condescending? < 1294589151 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294589154 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm just explaining myself. < 1294589156 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think you act condescendingly. Just wrongly. < 1294589160 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: question, what makes you say that you know more mathematics than other people and act condescending towards them when clearly you have no idea at all? < 1294589161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:29:42 every finite sequence has an infinity of possible continuations < 1294589161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:29:43 didn't you insult my math skills once before? < 1294589161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:29:51 quite possible :p < 1294589162 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what I was thinking of was that you can some reals, such as pi or e as a simple algorithm that can calculate it to any given precision. < 1294589162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:29:51 yeah that's the most retarded comment i've ever heard < 1294589164 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:29:58 um < 1294589166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:30:00 seriously < 1294589168 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:30:05 it's mathematically proven < 1294589170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ this is idiotic and condescending towards oklopol < 1294589173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :enjoy /ignore < 1294589178 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:05 < elliott> 23:29:42 every finite sequence has an infinity of possible continuations < 1294589179 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how cute < 1294589181 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is correct < 1294589184 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: indeed it is < 1294589196 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: however, cheater00 was repeating it over and over, acting like oklopol didn't know it, < 1294589199 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone's got a chip on their shoulder < 1294589201 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: and trying to use it to "disprove" that Clue works < 1294589207 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what LOL < 1294589213 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wasn't disproving anything. < 1294589218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the fact is that that theorem has basically NO relevance ...ever... < 1294589221 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not some great truth < 1294589236 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we're back to elliott making up bs < 1294589251 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as usual when he's pissed off at something in his life and wants to channel it onto *someone* < 1294589274 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is that not an attempt to make things worse? < 1294589288 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my conversation with oklopol was fairly relaxed. < 1294589302 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what i just said about elliott? < 1294589307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol @ logs, cheater00, always the psychoanalyst < 1294589324 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: how can it possibly get worse when i address the immediate problem at hand? < 1294589329 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder what kind of person it takes to be a persistent troll without actually actively trying to _troll_, and then acting really stupid whenever anyone treats him like a troll < 1294589333 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :llol at putting someone onn ignore then just reading what they say anyway X) < 1294589354 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, whatevs elliott < 1294589355 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's great because i can just ignore 90% of it and yell at them for the remaining 10% < 1294589365 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found masses of coal < 1294589372 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Atomo: Nice language or piece of crap? Same question for Slate < 1294589393 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's atomo and isn't slate that copycat thing < 1294589394 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : lol @ logs, cheater00, always the psychoanalyst <-- what exactly is the point of /ignore then :P < 1294589396 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: try deciding yourself...unless you're going through like 498543795345794354354 languages and need a reply < 1294589407 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i'm asking myself. < 1294589408 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: he is going through the whole list < 1294589412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: gets him angry, lets me ignore 90% of what he says without my irc client beeping < 1294589421 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just that Atomo and Slate are... similar < 1294589424 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh you have it beep your speakers? < 1294589427 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really. not at all in fact. < 1294589432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: when someone highlights me, yes. i find it useful. < 1294589435 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :atomo: Hey guys, guys check this out: What if we took scheme right.. and then ... changed the syntax to look like ruby! < 1294589455 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: being on ignore doesn't make me angry, you making up bs and getting angry at me for no reason like a hormonal 13 year old girl on a rag makes me angry < 1294589456 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: atomo i don't...care about... at all... it's just...not interesting in the slightest and doesn't innovate at all really < 1294589465 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, i just make it flash the emacs "button" in the taskbar. < 1294589478 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know anything about slate < 1294589483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: slate is interesting! i have talked to the people behind it. it's prototype-based but with multiple-dispatch. < 1294589492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but...it's still a mutable, imperative OO language < 1294589500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i'm completely sick of them. < 1294589502 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't Atomo also prototype-based with multiple-dispatch? < 1294589506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are very much not the way forward. < 1294589508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: i don't know nor care < 1294589523 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, looks like it. but it's irrelevant. < 1294589527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :firstly, it's just a toy language. < 1294589534 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :secondly, Erlang's concurrency model sucks. < 1294589541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thirdlyi t's just ... how can you even get interested in it < 1294589542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's shit < 1294589550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is impossible to care about < 1294589574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it has macros, which are anti-features. < 1294589579 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anti-features < 1294589580 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294589581 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's like a prettier Slate.. missing some Slate stuff < 1294589590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slate is pretty. < 1294589596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: "features" that make a language worse < 1294589599 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@ is not pretty < 1294589601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: example: mutability < 1294589604 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like macros in Scheme < 1294589606 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The rest of it is, @ is not. < 1294589613 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: good to know we're still extremely superficial < 1294589633 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although.. it might be easier to understand than whatever magic Atomo does < 1294589652 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :atomo also has bad concurrency and macros, as i said. two points against it. < 1294589658 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, slate is an actual project, atomo is a toy language. < 1294589667 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : also it has macros, which are anti-features. ← even the Lispy ones? < 1294589672 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slate seems to have taken a hiatus, and is just now waking up < 1294589680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: pretty much. < 1294589687 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: it has been going since the 90s. their irc channel is relatively active. < 1294589698 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: it still works fine. :p < 1294589699 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The huge manual is supposedly obsolete, there are no up-to-date binaries < 1294589706 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how do they make the language worse? < 1294589709 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Downloads < 1294589709 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slate.little.32.2011-01-01.image.bz2 < 1294589709 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slate.little.64.2010-04-01.image.bz2 < 1294589710 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Show all » < 1294589712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: no up to date binaries? < 1294589720 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I stand corrected < 1294589729 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Release Overview (Currently Old Releases Only)" < 1294589729 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: (f (g hello) (h)) < 1294589731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: this can't be the same as < 1294589737 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why do they say "old releases only" then? < 1294589743 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: (let ((hello 2)) (f (g hello) (h)) < 1294589744 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait < 1294589746 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: those are snapshots, I believe < 1294589755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: basically... you can't rely on anything with function applications < 1294589758 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: every invariant breaks < 1294589767 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, right. < 1294589769 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, got it < 1294589807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: it is possible to manage this but i'm gradually and gradually getting more pissed off that the computer doesn't tell me when i did something stupid < 1294589816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: also, 60% of what you want macros for can be done with lazy evaluation. < 1294589850 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ioke differentiates between macros and functions such that macros are just functions that are call-by-name, Io style < 1294589863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the remaining 40% can be either reworked to be slightly different and not require a macro somehow, or can be done with something like Template Haskell that, yes, is big and ugly to use, but you get signs in your code yelling "HEY I AM CALLING A MACRO HERE", and besides, you shouldn't use it much anyway < 1294589865 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*anyway. < 1294589881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: also: macros introduce more of a "compile time" < 1294589885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :semantically < 1294589888 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas lazy evaluation doesn' < 1294589888 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :t < 1294589932 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how out of date is http://files.slatelanguage.com/progman/ ? < 1294589967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: #slate < 1294589983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clog-logged, I would add. < 1294589988 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TUNES represent :) < 1294590051 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"their irc channel is relatively active." < 1294590052 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LIES < 1294590079 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: perhaps because they haven't had a sgeo to irritate them. < 1294590437 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I have to somehow aquire like a million iron ingots < 1294590443 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: why? < 1294590455 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I can make a track from the spawnpoint to somewhre interesting < 1294590472 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: make sure to make it underground :P < 1294590477 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ugh < 1294590478 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1294590478 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or high in the air would probably be ok < 1294590481 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: mobs will walk on it < 1294590485 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also need to install git < 1294590485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you'll bash into them < 1294590489 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294590490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and your booster energy will go < 1294590495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: make sure to use boosters, not powered minecrats < 1294590497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*minecarts < 1294590501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you want a really slow ride < 1294590505 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want a very fast :P < 1294590511 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: impossible :) but boosters are close < 1294590517 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Minecart_booster < 1294590537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's a "bug" but although some people it's being fixed i'm not sure it will be in the short term at all, everyone uses them < 1294590543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's SO MUCH FASTER than powered carts < 1294590567 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is being fixed? :( < 1294590581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well. some people say it is but i haven't actually seen evidence < 1294590590 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm < 1294590592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: anyway, easy enough to convert to whatever it gets replaced with when that happens. < 1294590598 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just removing them would be a joke, powered carts are useless < 1294590598 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, I think I understand @ a bit better < 1294590602 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294590605 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use a minecart enhancement mod if that happens :P < 1294590620 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0v5cAFYouWY#t=4m52s cool < 1294590625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: anyway one booster can keep you going for hundreds of blocks < 1294590629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you only really need...one < 1294590713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: btw, an "easy" way to make a resetting booster is to make it go upwarda fater the cart leaves and hit a wall :D < 1294590714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*upwards after < 1294590719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but using the south-west rule is more reliable < 1294590909 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19PZA1tnKtg cool < 1294590997 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Slate has macros < 1294591007 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :antifeature indeed < 1294591018 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1294591037 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PA2uLm8ups enjoy being crepeed out < 1294591038 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why what? < 1294591058 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're against macros? < 1294591064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: pretty much :) < 1294591074 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why! < 1294591093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: < 1294591095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:15 elliott: Phantom__Hoover: (f (g hello) (h)) < 1294591095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:15 elliott: Phantom__Hoover: this can't be the same as < 1294591095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:15 Sgeo: Why do they say "old releases only" then? < 1294591097 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:15 elliott: Phantom__Hoover: (let ((hello 2)) (f (g hello) (h)) < 1294591099 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:15 Sgeo: Wait < 1294591101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:15 elliott: Sgeo: those are snapshots, I believe < 1294591103 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:15 elliott: Phantom__Hoover: basically... you can't rely on anything with function applications < 1294591105 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:15 elliott: Phantom__Hoover: every invariant breaks < 1294591107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:16 elliott: Phantom__Hoover: it is possible to manage this but i'm gradually and gradually getting more pissed off that the computer doesn't tell me when i did something stupid < 1294591109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:16 elliott: Phantom__Hoover: also, 60% of what you want macros for can be done with lazy evaluation. < 1294591111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:17 Sgeo: Ioke differentiates between macros and functions such that macros are just functions that are call-by-name, Io style < 1294591113 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:17 elliott: the remaining 40% can be either reworked to be slightly different and not require a macro somehow, or can be done with something like Template Haskell that, yes, is big and ugly to use, but you get signs in your code yelling "HEY I AM CALLING A MACRO HERE", and besides, you shouldn't use it much anyway < 1294591143 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slate's macros require knowing that you're calling a macro, I think < 1294591230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Minecart_booster has all kinds of boosters < 1294591256 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: lol http://www.minecraftwiki.net/images/f/fa/Minecart-booster-door-1.jpg "well it's not like i haven't used 3485739845 iron anyway, i'll make some blocks of it" < 1294591415 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't like the idea that, in a message send, a clone of a clone of a clone of an object (essentially, a child) is not necessarily the same as the object itself in choosing what's dispatched < 1294591425 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I'm misunderstanding it < 1294591577 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: house built on top of ice: best idea? < 1294591653 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oklopol: well... remind me to fix what i broke in the zip impl tomorrow. dunno what. :(. also: remind me to make that auto-realigning emacs mode. in fact just copy this to a file and restate it to me. < 1294591675 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: oh wait bad idea, can't build underground < 1294591676 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yess indeed i will do that in 2 min < 1294591676 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s < 1294591797 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, eh. house on top of ice sounds cool, and cold. And dark since you can't use torches < 1294591849 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : j-invariant: lol http://www.minecraftwiki.net/images/f/fa/Minecart-booster-door-1.jpg "well it's not like i haven't used 3485739845 iron anyway, i'll make some blocks of it" <-- ignoring the iron blocks the idea is still very neat < 1294591889 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, btw tried out the two winner texturepacks (well, not the second place one, that candy one). Both are way too dark in colours for me. < 1294591906 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eldpack is somewhat better when it comes to that, but still too dark < 1294591927 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/File:Minecart-booster-door-2.jpg <-- why!? < 1294591963 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I guess it can't go into the block fully < 1294591965 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that must be why < 1294592120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. I built a path from spawn to my new house (out of wood markers). It's in a nice area. I have a sword. < 1294592126 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I need coal! < 1294592137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And there are no mountains to speak of nearby. < 1294592140 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh where is that house? < 1294592143 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sounds fun < 1294592148 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you finally getting a house I mean < 1294592154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Er, on my single-player game. < 1294592158 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh okay < 1294592241 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"As opposed to PostScript? < 1294592241 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I learned Japanese well after I learned PostScript. It turned out to my delight that Japanese and PostScript grammar have quite a lot in common. I don't know why it hasn't made the Japanese masters at writing clever PostScript though. < 1294592241 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wait." < 1294592246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(oh wait is link to obfuscated raytracer in postscript) < 1294592250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that's why anagolf is full of postscript ;) < 1294592251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*:) < 1294592262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ok i'ma code now < 1294592293 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : File "/Users/ehird/clue/clue.py", line 425, in call_clue < 1294592293 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return call_branch(clue,default,args,depth_lim) < 1294592293 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : File "/Users/ehird/clue/clue.py", line 411, in call_branch < 1294592295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : suboutputs.append(call_clue(clue,subinputs,depth_lim-1)) < 1294592297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : File "/Users/ehird/clue/clue.py", line 425, in call_clue < 1294592299 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return call_branch(clue,default,args,depth_lim) < 1294592300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : File "/Users/ehird/clue/clue.py", line 411, in call_branch < 1294592303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : suboutputs.append(call_clue(clue,subinputs,depth_lim-1)) < 1294592304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : File "/Users/ehird/clue/clue.py", line 425, in call_clue < 1294592307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return call_branch(clue,default,args,depth_lim) < 1294592309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: that's bad, isn't it < 1294592528 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: can i er < 1294592530 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, in /general/ backtraces probably are bad. < 1294592531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have your files < 1294592534 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to figure out what i broke < 1294592541 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, though iirc there is some esolang based on error handling? < 1294592553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no this is example based programming, the most powerful paradigm < 1294592558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i lost all my py files and my release doesn't work < 1294592564 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I didn't say that one was based on errors < 1294592570 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, please read what I said :) < 1294592578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did < 1294592579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i discarded it < 1294592589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh wait... it actually works, just depth limit errors turn into stack overflows < 1294592592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: is that...right? < 1294592596 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, elliott, though iirc there is some esolang based on error handling? Vorpal: no this is example based programming, the most powerful paradigm <-- this exchange makes no sense < 1294592632 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : and i lost all my py files and my release doesn't work <-- how? < 1294592650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rm *.pyc ----> rm *.py, and no, i'm not going to alias it into rm -i, i'm just going to be more careful < 1294592666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now i'm just trying to figure out why the zip i made doesn't work the same < 1294592667 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, a decent compromise might be rm -I ? < 1294592679 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my rm does not have that option :) < 1294592703 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh okay. For being a GNU extension (I assume) it is damn useful < 1294592823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sprunge.us/EAUF didn't quite realise how tiny the Luatre implementation is < 1294592827 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool :D < 1294592852 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Luatre? < 1294592864 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a language for calling Clue programs, basically. < 1294592868 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294592869 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :luatre, the clue bot, uses it. < 1294592872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also the clue repl i wrote. < 1294592893 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the function names...? < 1294592925 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well "eval" is python's. < 1294592929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"run" is another thing. < 1294592935 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also where is "cabinetoflaughter" called apart from inside itself? < 1294592942 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: um that's a module < 1294592944 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :other things call it < 1294592946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance the repl and the bot < 1294592951 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cabinetoflaughter is just your eval func, obviously < 1294592952 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh so it isn't the whole thing then < 1294592955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it is < 1294592957 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the whole language impl < 1294592962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cabinetoflaughter(park(code)[0]) is what other things do < 1294592965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to provide a UI < 1294592971 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah right < 1294593010 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, are the other functions part of the public API too? < 1294593020 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(doesn't python use some special naming convention for private?) < 1294593031 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing is public, clue and all tools related to it are closed source < 1294593034 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that you have to pay for < 1294593045 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, a very different sense of public :P < 1294593059 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you really want to distribute them and download them for free < 1294593085 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh indeed, i didn't read context at all < 1294593086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: is it ok if the interp stack overflows sometimes rather than, say, raising a depth overflow thingy < 1294593111 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really, if that means the program crashes < 1294593118 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't care what error messages say tho < 1294593127 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, it's your interpreter, what does my opinion matter < 1294593139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's your interp that i'm modifying :p < 1294593145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: in call branch, < 1294593146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : suboutputs.append(call_clue(clue,subinputs,depth_lim-1)) < 1294593146 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh indeed it is < 1294593151 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i figured you were just asking < 1294593154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shouldn't that immediately return None if that returns none? < 1294593157 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what luatre should print out or something < 1294593161 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294593163 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah? < 1294593185 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i don't care what luatre prints out < 1294593197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not luatre < 1294593200 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the damn clue.py < 1294593207 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought < 1294593222 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" yeah?" meant "yes, it's luatre whose output we're talking about" < 1294593230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294593230 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which i don't care about, as such < 1294593248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll work it out later < 1294593256 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if depth_lim==0: < 1294593256 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return ["nothing here"] < 1294593256 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah you can make it immediately return none < 1294593256 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that should be return None right..? < 1294593264 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, i tried that, but it didn't stop the stack overflow, so nm :) < 1294593267 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm... < 1294593272 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah shouldn't nothing here be None... < 1294593281 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right runtime errors are currently "nothing here" :D < 1294593290 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah you should totally change all those to None < 1294593298 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, btw if you use version control rm *.py will be non-fatal (sure, changes since last commit would be lost) < 1294593308 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but that is much less of a problem) < 1294593308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it's oklopol. so no < 1294593311 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because failed runs will also return "nothing here"'s when you use them for inference < 1294593316 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: except i think it's a compile time error too < 1294593317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294593317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294593323 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've used a version control system once! < 1294593329 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for an actual project < 1294593330 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, which one? < 1294593343 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the program was called tortoisesvn < 1294593351 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Incidentally, turns out the N900 default camera app also has a manual white-balance knob nowadays (added by one of the firmware updates, I think); it still doesn't really have any other manual controls (like exposure/focus), but at least that's something. < 1294593361 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a Windows Subversion client. < 1294593362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i changed all one instance and nothing changed :D < 1294593378 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would anything happen < 1294593378 0 :cheater-!~cheater@e181141092.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294593417 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if there's a stack overflow, then clearly the "nothing here" thing is not reached, as that cuts the search. < 1294593424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: because i'm getting a stack overflow when given a wrong program and depth_lim should be catching it!! < 1294593436 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294593440 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, i'm not sure it does, there's no checks for nothing here :D < 1294593441 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anywhere < 1294593441 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if your depth_lim is small enough, then sure < 1294593451 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's 5... < 1294593469 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the search should never be able to continue more than depth lim deep < 1294593470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :def unvararg(f,n): < 1294593471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : vrs=",".join(["n"+str(i) for i in xrange(n)]) < 1294593471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : l="lambda "+vrs+" : f("+vrs+")" < 1294593472 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return eval(l,{"f":f}) < 1294593474 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :genius < 1294593489 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is depth lim always decremented when you recurse in the interp? < 1294593499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's YOUR interp :D < 1294593513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but uh < 1294593514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if not demolishing_done or not first_round: < 1294593514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : new_depth_lim=depth_lim-1 < 1294593515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : else: < 1294593517 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : new_depth_lim=depth_lim < 1294593520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure what that's about, you added it < 1294593520 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note that it's possible that there's a huge stack of functions calls that were inferred, and can't be caught by the interp < 1294593528 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's during compilation < 1294593609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should that stay? < 1294593621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess so, changing it doesn't do anything < 1294593629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lesson: don't write invalid programs < 1294593636 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, nice < 1294593661 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ANIC. Worth learning or illegible mess? < 1294593662 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294593671 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dataflow programming sounds fun < 1294593677 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: what's special about it? < 1294593680 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you tried example-driven programming? < 1294593686 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hear it's the new c++! < 1294593701 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294593710 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Tried it out on the boat (they have that "promenade" walking-thing) but unfortunately it has randomly cycling coloured lighting, which pretty much does the same thing as a randomly fluctuating white-balance. < 1294593730 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p6237641484.txt < 1294593730 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294593731 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294593731 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiled in 0.0759010314941 seconds < 1294593731 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :factorial: [#0] | _ => factorial loop(#0 1) < 1294593731 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stack-hogging factorial: [#0] | 0 => multiply(pred(0) pred(0)) | _ => multiply(#0 @(pred(#0))) < 1294593731 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :factorial loop: [#0] | 0 => #1 | _ => @(pred(#0) multiply(#0 #1)) < 1294593731 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fibonacci: [#0] | _ => fast fibonacci loop(#0 0 1) < 1294593732 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fast fibonacci loop: [#0] | 0 => #1 | _ => @(pred(#0) #2 add(#1 #2)) < 1294593732 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slow fibonacci: [#0] | 0 => 0 | 1 => 1 | _ => add(@(pred(#0)) @(pred(pred(#0)))) < 1294593737 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, oh right you are in Sweden now? < 1294593740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. factorial(100) < 1294593740 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :93326215443944152681699238856266700490715968264381621468592963895217599993229915608941463976156518286253697920827223758251185210916864000000000000000000000000L < 1294593748 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, I was on Saturday; we're home now. < 1294593752 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah < 1294593760 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: how hard would it be to make the interp tail-recursive? i'm guessing very < 1294593909 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :easiest way would be to notice tail rcursion at runtime, and just hack up a tail recursive python call < 1294593922 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, i'd just compile to bytecode, in which case it's eay < 1294593925 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*easy < 1294593969 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or actually < 1294594060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are no tail recursive python calls really :) < 1294594064 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, yeah i don't know if there's a way to easily make a while loop out of that, it would get messy with functions that can branch in multiple ways < 1294594065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: def name(n):return map(chr,range(97,123))[n%26]+"'"*(n/26) < 1294594069 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why hack up < 1294594071 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: thought you might enjoy that function < 1294594078 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not that hard to change the contents of the stack < 1294594091 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it gives a,b,c,...,z,a',b',..,z',a'',b'',...,...,f'''' < 1294594168 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just love that function < 1294594226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294594249 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>> dict(enumerate([1,2,3])) < 1294594249 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{0: 1, 1: 2, 2: 3} < 1294594250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yess :D < 1294594260 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : r='('+', '.join(names)+') => ['+past(clue.condast,dict(enumerate(names)))+'] ' < 1294594284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait i need # in front < 1294594295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so have you added constants to branchers yet :D < 1294594304 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :augur[afk] < 1294594327 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :map(chr,range(97,123))[n%26] looks far more sensibly written as chr(97+n%26). < 1294594337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: GOOD POINT < 1294594341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and even uglier too < 1294594343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294594344 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :less comprehensible < 1294594469 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RuntimeError: maximum recursion depth exceeded while calling a Python object < 1294594470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294594473 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i broke qsort:DDDD < 1294594480 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie's is better < 1294594488 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah id id < 1294594489 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that happens < 1294594497 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :life is like thate < 1294594498 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*that < 1294594500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exception: Syntax error: ,[2]]]] < 1294594500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1294594503 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes things go well < 1294594504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is no , in the source < 1294594505 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then suddenly < 1294594515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nowait i broke ski did i < 1294594516 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :recursion depth is exceeded < 1294594522 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably both < 1294594545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski seems to work < 1294594551 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i will fix qsort soon < 1294594558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: DONE CONSTANTS IN BRANCHERS YET? < 1294594571 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no. < 1294594640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: will you ever or do i have to SLAVE over the code. < 1294594701 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i might even do it today, it's like two lines of code < 1294594705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg the output is almost beautiful :DD < 1294594712 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i should really try to read these couple of pages i have left < 1294594742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw you know that your compare function is just python's cmp? :D < 1294594812 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's really not < 1294594820 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :howso < 1294594827 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try changing it to cmp < 1294594831 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, it's reversed < 1294594832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-cmp then < 1294594845 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no but cmp is a builtin < 1294594852 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so my function check fails < 1294594853 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;D < 1294594857 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: nono i just mean < 1294594860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the body can be replaced :P < 1294594863 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohh < 1294594864 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so wait is it cmp or -cmp < 1294594869 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that is of course true < 1294594870 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've turned it into < 1294594870 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm < 1294594872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :def compare(a,b): < 1294594872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if not isint(a,b):return None < 1294594872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return cmp(a,b) < 1294594872 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does that matter? < 1294594878 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those are the same thing in clue < 1294594879 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it changes the behaviour? :D < 1294594880 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1294594880 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1294594882 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg i love clue < 1294594903 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, that's probably the awesomest thing about the language < 1294594912 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can change even the interface of functions < 1294594917 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without telling anyone < 1294594917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 3 => @(pair(#1 #2)) < 1294594919 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :waaait what... < 1294594922 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski apply only has one parameter < 1294594924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?? < 1294594933 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, the current string < 1294594937 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's being rewritten < 1294594940 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I just had an effect on the evolution of Slate and Atomo < 1294594947 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes, but < 1294594954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: the param is #0 < 1294594959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so wtf are #1 and #2 :D < 1294594962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i already replace helper objs < 1294594983 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: did you hear that in example-driven programming, you can change the sign of the output of your api function, and no one using that function will have to change their code. well, usually anyway. < 1294594999 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the latest buzz of the example-driven programming community < 1294595010 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw is there such a term already, i didn't actualyl check :D < 1294595012 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*actually < 1294595016 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, um... what? How does that happen? < 1294595017 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i doubtit :P < 1294595020 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*doubt it < 1294595022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: cleverly < 1294595028 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no idea what #1 and #2 are. < 1294595037 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :DDD < 1294595043 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like how printing this is fucking hard < 1294595043 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294595060 0 :VelcroMan!VelcroMan@83.209.145.182 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294595061 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should probably try to find out how that numbering thing works at some point < 1294595073 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or better yet, you should :D < 1294595075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a feeling it's like < 1294595077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :totally broken < 1294595094 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wellllll < 1294595098 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that happens < 1294595099 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what i'm doing if you can't tell, is naming the arguments < 1294595099 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's life < 1294595107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the printout < 1294595109 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i could've guessed that < 1294595112 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't tho < 1294595114 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just because it WASN'T READABLE ENOUGH < 1294595134 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay...deep first's compilation is...very very wrong :D < 1294595142 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you should see this: < 1294595149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- deep first < 1294595149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a) => [car(a)] < 1294595149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| _ => a < 1294595151 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| _ => @(car(a)) < 1294595156 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDDD < 1294595193 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one idea that i had was that 5x"."'d be used for these sort of clue lambdas, where you give an example of a subcomputation; unfortunately this would mean you could just show it the whole computation < 1294595203 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ^^ < 1294595208 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is Mozart/Oz dead? < 1294595212 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what...it works < 1294595217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: how < 1294595226 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1294595228 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :two _'s? < 1294595231 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oH < 1294595237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: clue has figured out that if car returns None < 1294595241 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it's not a list < 1294595247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so it can return the element directly < 1294595247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. < 1294595260 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :deep first([[1] 2]) -> deep first([1]) -> deep first(1) -> car returns None -> 1 < 1294595261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: BUT < 1294595264 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it also has a default branch < 1294595269 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and both are represented in the ast by None :D < 1294595277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: tl;dr your code doesn't give up on None for some reason < 1294595278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or my code :P < 1294595284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's actually matching on None itself < 1294595287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to use car to do is list? < 1294595304 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's very possible that that's true < 1294595310 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't thought about failing at all < 1294595321 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so what functions actually call to test things :P < 1294595335 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ALSO surely raising some special exception would be more reliable than None < 1294595340 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since... < 1294595342 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :things like this < 1294595343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not handling it < 1294595356 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the compiler makes sure that all computation is legal, and no Nones are seen < 1294595371 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well it...doesn't :) < 1294595375 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise this func would never be generated < 1294595394 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no condition? < 1294595395 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just a? < 1294595405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm the [] bit is the condition < 1294595409 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: a is the param < 1294595412 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh alright < 1294595414 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- deep first < 1294595415 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a) => [car(a)] < 1294595415 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| _ => a < 1294595416 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| _ => @(car(a)) < 1294595418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so this is actually < 1294595428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :case car(a) of None -> a; _ -> recurse(car(a)) < 1294595431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which should never be generated, of course < 1294595435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ever < 1294595441 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e., it's doing < 1294595442 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lemme look at code... < 1294595447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :case is list?(a) of 0 -> a; 1 -> recurse(car(a)) < 1294595453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: do you want my current files :P < 1294595472 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really < 1294595483 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as stupid as that is. < 1294595561 0 :VelcroMan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1294595597 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh shit < 1294595613 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait no < 1294595634 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :car should throw an exception if it's called with illegal input during search < 1294595644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well....... < 1294595646 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in that case, the resulting object is not added to the list of available objects < 1294595650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: where do you call functions in a search? < 1294595653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll make it handle None < 1294595657 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : try: < 1294595657 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : newobj=applier(fun,subsetobjs) < 1294595657 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if newobj==None:continue < 1294595657 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : except: < 1294595657 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : continue < 1294595662 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yeah no i removed that :D < 1294595670 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's now < 1294595671 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : newobj=applier(fun,subsetobjs) < 1294595671 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if newobj==None:continue < 1294595673 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but note ==None: < 1294595677 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :car DOES return None given illgeal input < 1294595678 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in my version < 1294595679 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*illegal < 1294595682 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well obviously it doesn't work if you break it < 1294595687 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :def car(l): < 1294595687 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if not isinstance(l,list) or not l:return None < 1294595687 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return l[0] < 1294595688 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see above < 1294595690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't break it < 1294595693 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it returns None < 1294595697 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it gives exactly the same results < 1294595703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you do the same on newobj==None and < 1294595713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm? < 1294595716 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do, so what, it doesn't work after that correction? < 1294595726 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*i do; < 1294595746 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'd like to point out that i removed it so that i got useful exceptions rather than "depth limit" for all of them :) < 1294595753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :considering the way of failure is to return None < 1294595763 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah yeah it was a good change, if you fixed functins appropriately < 1294595765 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*functions < 1294595767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: anyway, i have no idea why it wouldn't work in my version, since it's functionally equivalent, are you sure your version doesn't produce the same output? < 1294595772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yeah i did < 1294595788 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure my version doesn't produce the same output, no < 1294595794 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't have a good way to check < 1294595798 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: cluetest.py < 1294595802 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :python cluetest.py numplay.clue < 1294595808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :remember to fix the 3 -> 6 example in factorial first < 1294595810 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's 3 -> something else < 1294595814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the version you have < 1294595867 0 :VelcroMan!VelcroMan@83.209.145.182 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294595914 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294595951 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm this person must be an esolanger... < 1294595967 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you must tell me your thoughts on Oz. I'll tell you my thoughts: It's large, but... fascinating. Just wish I was more confident that it was actively worked on < 1294596018 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, can i give parameters to the program from the IDE, adding python to my command line path sounds like a chore, and the default python is 3.1 so i can't drag and drop; you don't use the same IDE tho < 1294596033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: erm...maybe < 1294596050 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: import sys; sys.argv=['','numplay.clue']; import cluetest < 1294596149 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a fucking million useless settings for permissions, but you can't make python.exe not fucking close the terminal after running < 1294596152 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i fucking hate this os < 1294596153 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i fucking hate it < 1294596154 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1294596171 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :arghh < 1294596172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: trying it from the cmd line instead? :p < 1294596175 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hate command line arguments < 1294596182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: just do it in cmd.exe and write out the full path to python or something < 1294596185 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dragged-and-dropped < 1294596186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or < 1294596189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might actually be in the path < 1294596190 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think python adds it < 1294596190 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :changed default python < 1294596196 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. < 1294596260 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no module named readline < 1294596277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :DD < 1294596279 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :python is not in the path even though i have three versions of it installed. < 1294596281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comment out the import readline in cluetest.py < 1294596288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's ... sort of not windows-tuned, thsi < 1294596289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*this < 1294596324 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay, works. < 1294596334 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait why am i running numplay? < 1294596340 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was the function < 1294596341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ...good question! < 1294596343 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :deep first < 1294596345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294596349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :might wanna turn on demolishing < 1294596373 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so now parsing fails < 1294596378 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the same error you pasted < 1294596384 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :,[2] < 1294596389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yeah it's a bug in ski.clue < 1294596390 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :remove the comma < 1294596458 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now it just plain old can't compile < 1294596469 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what howso < 1294596525 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the fuck, YOU CAN'T COPYPASTE FROM THE COMMAND LINE WINDOW IN WINDOWS 7 < 1294596529 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT THE FUCKING HELL < 1294596530 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHY?!?!?!? < 1294596531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: um < 1294596532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you sure < 1294596535 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can. < 1294596537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to right click the title bar and click mark < 1294596538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294596538 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not using mouse tho < 1294596542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see above < 1294596545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you've always had to do that < 1294596546 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know < 1294596550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294596553 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, and you STILL have to do it < 1294596556 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAETHGAIYUIAGGVKLJEUG < 1294596558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: dude, use it from idle, it'd be nicer prolly < 1294596560 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm going to destroy < 1294596598 0 :VelcroMan!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294596628 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay what, now it seems it's compiling < 1294596630 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yeah you can just remove the readline line and then do < 1294596632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :import cluetest < 1294596634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in idle < 1294596636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it works great < 1294596640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then .load ski.clue < 1294596707 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :might be nice if you got some sort of sensible output from the compiler if you asked < 1294596723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: eh? < 1294596729 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.load printso ut all the compiled ASTs < 1294596730 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*prints out < 1294596732 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the repl < 1294596736 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean during compilation < 1294596739 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski is still compiling < 1294596740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.show foo is also useful < 1294596741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: right < 1294596749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i might add that, once I can figure out whether the breakage is yours or mine :> < 1294596752 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then fix it < 1294596753 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually it's taking so long i doubt it'll actually happen < 1294596762 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: did you enable destructing < 1294596778 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :demolishing i mena < 1294596779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mean < 1294596795 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, but when i enable it, it gives the compile error, it seems < 1294596802 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what error? < 1294596807 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Traceback (most recent call last): < 1294596808 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : File "", line 1, in < 1294596808 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : import cluetest < 1294596808 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : File "C:\stuff\clue\cluetest.py", line 55, in < 1294596808 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : refresh() < 1294596808 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : File "C:\stuff\clue\cluetest.py", line 48, in refresh < 1294596808 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : funcs,asts=clue.compile_all(open(filename).read(),stuff.funcs) < 1294596809 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : File "C:\stuff\clue\clue.py", line 708, in compile_all < 1294596809 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : [i+"("+unfounds[i]+")" for i in compilees if not compilees[i].iscompiled])) < 1294596810 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exception: Can't compile deep first with cutoff(depth of first), depth of first(inc), ski type?(depth of first), ski apply(ski type?) < 1294596815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: change inc to succ < 1294596816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in ski < 1294596818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's another bug < 1294596818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1294596821 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(fixed in mine) < 1294596821 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh hah < 1294596840 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what a clear error message < 1294596847 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"i can't compile!" < 1294596851 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah it should probably be topographically sorted or sth < 1294596856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1294596857 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is < 1294596865 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is? < 1294596872 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294596872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :inc would be last, if that were so < 1294596876 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh umm < 1294596879 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294596881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or first < 1294596893 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah not sorted in that message, but compilation of course sorts < 1294596907 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you can't compile if there's an uncompiled function in your bag < 1294596916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rigght < 1294596917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*right < 1294596955 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- depth of first < 1294596955 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[is list?(#0)] < 1294596955 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 0 => 0 < 1294596955 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 1 => succ(@(car(#0))) < 1294596959 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was it this one? < 1294596989 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no, deep first < 1294597040 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lemme look < 1294597051 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- deep first < 1294597051 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[is list?(#0)] < 1294597051 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 0 => #0 < 1294597051 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 1 => @(car(#0)) < 1294597055 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sry < 1294597060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ff < 1294597063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok so i added a bug in < 1294597064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :will fix soon < 1294597067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :writing a clue editor first < 1294597069 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(emacs mode = too hard) < 1294597073 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1294597077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's gonna be schwoot < 1294597161 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdas would not only allow cheating, they would also make functions significantly uglier, because you'd have your clue cluttered with completely meaningless snippets of dataflow < 1294597182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheating :D < 1294597189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :best user-hostile language veer < 1294597194 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294597240 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you wouldn't lose stuff like being able to flip the sign of compare tho < 1294597245 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey actually < 1294597268 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about like [1, 2, 3] -> [2, 3] -> [3] for cddr for instance < 1294597300 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the meaning that the middle objects are just hints, "this object is useful!" < 1294597301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: for recursion you mean? < 1294597307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh, i see < 1294597313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: that owuld be nice but what semantics would it have < 1294597314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*would < 1294597323 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no semantics. < 1294597326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294597329 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294597336 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at the level of what functions compile to < 1294597355 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more like standardized compiler directive < 1294597369 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : $class = 'Database' . ucfirst($wgDBtype); < 1294597369 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : $db = new $class( $this->backupServer(), $wgDBadminuser, $wgDBadminpassword, $wgDBname, false, $flags ); < 1294597377 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: OH GOD STOP IT < 1294597383 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAAAAAAAH < 1294597386 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$wgDBtype is something like 'SQL' or 'PGSQL' < 1294597390 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :STOP < 1294597392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :STOPSTOPSTPOSTSPTJSPOTJSOPTJOPSTJOPSJTPOSJTPESRJGOIDKLFGMLKHFGJ < 1294597397 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there are classes DatabaseSQL and DatabasePGSQL < 1294597399 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION vomits < 1294597401 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION vomtvomtvoimtits < 1294597404 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically, my idea was that in a_1 -> ... -> a_n, first a_2 would be found using a_1, then all state would be dropped, and another search would be started for a_3 from a_1 and a_2 < 1294597445 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which sounds really stupid of course, dropping state essentially means you'll make the same objects again :D < 1294597477 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, you would've sort of reached a milestone < 1294597504 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, btw, it should definitely be possible to ask the compiler that the bottleneck is < 1294597509 0 :asiekierka!~asiekierk@078088180066.elblag.vectranet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1294597527 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ey < 1294597527 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, there are a fixed number of searches, you could just make them store compilation times automatically < 1294597597 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you removed the check for default==None between < 1294597597 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if i.value==None: < 1294597598 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : default=i < 1294597598 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return call_branch(clue,default,args,depth_lim) < 1294597624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : for i in clue.branches: < 1294597624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if i.istest():continue < 1294597624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if i.value==value: < 1294597625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return call_branch(clue,i,args,depth_lim) < 1294597627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if i.value==None: < 1294597629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : default=i < 1294597631 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return call_branch(clue,default,args,depth_lim) < 1294597633 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did I < 1294597641 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think so < 1294597653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well that's my clue.py < 1294597656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i don't see how :P < 1294597670 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have < 1294597671 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if default==None: < 1294597671 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : default=clue.branches[len(clue.branches)-1] < 1294597671 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return call_branch(clue,default,args,depth_lim) < 1294597686 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i mentioned this to you, but it may have been a change after you last got my code < 1294597697 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know, i know < 1294597703 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that [-1] thing you're gonna mention < 1294597729 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that change means that all functions are total. < 1294597739 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :currently, it's possible they are inferred non-total < 1294597759 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is, it's possible that there is actually no default branch, now the default branch is the last one < 1294597776 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :! should be used for failure explicitly, should be easy to add < 1294597952 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one way is that ! is just added as a separate object in the clue object parser, and it simply evaluates to a None. < 1294597964 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i believe that'd do the trick < 1294597966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'm pretty confused now < 1294597986 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :about what < 1294597991 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything :D < 1294597996 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, how many blocks would ROU be now again when finished. Approx? < 1294597998 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1294598004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: can i have your .pys < 1294598016 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, IIRC it was 10,000 or so for the hull. < 1294598028 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the important thing: add "if default==None:default=clue.branches[len(clue.branches)-1]" < 1294598030 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, ah and why didn't movecraft work for this? < 1294598055 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't done any changes to my old files, or your files, but you can have my old files if you really want to. < 1294598068 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, it has a built-in threshold of 1000 blocks; this is changeable, apparently, but I have a suspicion it'd clobber the memory and CPU to actually move something that big. < 1294598110 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, right. So making that castle I'm building on my local test server (because single player is horribly laggy since beta) fly is not realistic then < 1294598128 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, it has over 60000 obsidian alone :) < 1294598137 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, probably not. < 1294598165 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, the algorithm for separating the ship from everything else would probably mess it up. < 1294598179 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION gets a headache trying to talk to someone < 1294598189 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, and iirc over 500 000 stone (though hard to measure with such tools, the terrain below it is very uneven. < 1294598190 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Not Alluded-To] < 1294598214 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I guess anything between 150 000 and 400 000 is part of the proper castle) < 1294598219 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, stone and dirt aren't incorporated into ships. < 1294598228 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, oh well. < 1294598235 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so where is the printing of the compiler output done? < 1294598247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: cluetest.py < 1294598248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but er < 1294598253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i've kinda rewritten that in my version < 1294598258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're going to change it thennn :P < 1294598262 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, wait, I'm testing it right now and I could place a stone block on top o my none-stone and it worked < 1294598270 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just want to know where the #x's come from < 1294598281 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clearly your output lacks their origin < 1294598284 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, however, stone below or to the sides were not included < 1294598287 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, was the stone moved with it? < 1294598288 0 :BMG!~behold@d83-183-183-70.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1294598290 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, yes < 1294598293 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably because neither of us knows what they even are < 1294598295 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh. < 1294598297 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294598297 0 :BMG!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294598299 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, but only if placed more or less inside the craft < 1294598300 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :BeholdMyGlory < 1294598304 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, (it was a ship) < 1294598317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a none-stone < 1294598322 0 :drakhan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Wychodzi < 1294598353 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, any block that is not a stone (and implicitly in this context: not air or a fluid either) < 1294598379 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think this person's text messaging stuff is delayed by a few messages < 1294598393 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And for some reason, her texts include my text. < 1294598451 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, the other reason a flying castle is impractical: MoveCraft empties chests. < 1294598459 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what is the largest structure known to have been done in MC so far? Largest as in most blocks placed. < 1294598468 0 :drakhan!~drakhan@c34-243.icpnet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1294598475 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, ah yes that is indeed a known bug < 1294598479 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1294598483 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, at least it is on the todo-list < 1294598513 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, also it doesn't rotate crafts yet. Meaning you better make it rotationally symmetric for now < 1294598526 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: dunno < 1294598544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: my clue editor is a total nazi < 1294598550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it reformats your code every time you do anything :D < 1294598565 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION fantasizes about war on a MoveCraft server < 1294598579 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, it screws up TNT cannons as well. < 1294598580 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-shutup- Shut up about your fantasies! < 1294598582 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what about largest bounding box (in a single direction) < 1294598587 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, aww, darn < 1294598620 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I was thinking more of dropping TNT from ships than cannons on.. no, I was thinking cannons on ships too, more for defense < 1294598623 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is it with the people who act like playing MC on peaceful is a personal insult? < 1294598625 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, considering something like a 1x1x4000 cobbblestone thingy < 1294598628 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bb* < 1294598669 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -shutup- Shut up about your fantasies! <-- just ignore it, that /me you did above was perfectly okay IMO < 1294598689 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Difficulty < 1294598698 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[ * Notch made a tweet on October 22nd 2010, stating that "I'm changing "difficulty" to "realism". Lowest setting = creative. Highest setting = starve" ]] < 1294598708 0 :cheater00!~cheater@e181128101.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294598710 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'Cos obviously difficulty == realism! < 1294598717 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, haven't happened so far yeah < 1294598732 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Notch is just like me1 < 1294598734 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: that's the one thing i'd change about mc < 1294598740 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[In the always taking hiatuses aspect] < 1294598741 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thank god notch noticed it < 1294598768 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so umm the #'s are just helper objects + inputs + subrec outputs, as one might imagine < 1294598775 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it says so quite clearly in your code < 1294598780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: sure but there's more than there should be :D < 1294598785 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, btw craftbook is cool < 1294598787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: for instance #1 and #2 in ski apply < 1294598791 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it's completely unrealistic not to have malicious creatures unrelentingly stalk you during the night < 1294598793 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ski apply has no helpers < 1294598793 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*! < 1294598799 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and those are _inside_ the subrec _inputs_ < 1294598823 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, I have portcullises that can open and such now < 1294598831 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well subrec inputs can be calculated from outputs of previous subrecs < 1294598835 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294598836 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i don't see what the problem is < 1294598890 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in ski apply, when #1 and #2 are used, they refer to the outputs of the first and second subrec, and they are first used in the third case < 1294598933 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait what < 1294598935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: right! but #1 and #2 should get inlined < 1294598941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to be @(...) things < 1294598945 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they're not?? < 1294598948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH < 1294598954 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rrrrrrright i was being a retard < 1294598959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : nrpls['#'+str(i.get_arity()+len(clue.helper_objs)+sub)] = past(rrgs,rpls) < 1294598961 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294598963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :notice the lack of using nrpls there < 1294598968 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was thinking like of a completely different thing < 1294598989 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294599046 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you rename to nrpls midway? < 1294599068 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294599073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because < 1294599075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it only applies for that one branch < 1294599085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a) => [ski type?(a)] < 1294599085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 0 => a < 1294599085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 1 => @(car(cdr(a))) < 1294599087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 2 => @(cadar(a)) < 1294599088 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 3 => @(pair(#1 #2)) < 1294599090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 4 => @(pair(#1 ski type?(cdr(a)))) < 1294599092 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bugger, still doesn't work < 1294599127 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1294599147 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, movecraft fails at shadows. There is a shadow matching my aircraft on ground. Far from where the aircraft actually is currently < 1294599165 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rrgs.append(past(i.getsubast(sub,ar),rpls)) should use nrpls < 1294599168 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, that's probably MC failing, actually. < 1294599179 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm could be < 1294599207 0 :impomatic!~chatzilla@146.88.113.87.dyn.plus.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294599210 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi :-) < 1294599217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1294599274 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, did you fix it? < 1294599294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: done < 1294599302 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :testing now < 1294599305 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, also why does lightstone give shadows on ground < 1294599316 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since it is as bright as the sun... < 1294599330 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, yes, but it has z-axis attenuation, while the sun doesn't. < 1294599341 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, good point < 1294599428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 3 => @(pair(@(pair(cadaar(a) ski type?(cdr(a)))) @(pair(cadar(a) ski type?(cdr(a)))))) < 1294599429 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, hm flying minecart. That should be possible to make smooth < 1294599429 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: hooray < 1294599441 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::S < 1294599444 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294599446 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- deep first < 1294599447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a) => [is list?(a)] < 1294599447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 0 => a < 1294599449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| 1 => @(car(a)) < 1294599449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what... < 1294599453 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION imagines huge Obsidian bunkers, for things such as mining flint from gravel < 1294599454 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, or flying boat (boat as in boat-crafted-in-workbench) < 1294599454 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait what, it actually infers that whole thing? < 1294599456 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: turning on destructing makes it do the bad version, I think < 1294599457 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, did you try to move a craft with a minecart on it? < 1294599481 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, I haven't < 1294599489 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In theory, with time+patience, all gravel can be turned into flint? < 1294599497 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt it'll work. < 1294599499 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, yes. < 1294599501 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, but I wonder. if you could not make smooth movements instead of the one block at a time thing < 1294599501 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no it doesn't, at least in mine < 1294599503 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :using one of those < 1294599505 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, with a mod < 1294599509 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't even compile ski without demolishing < 1294599513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if default is None: < 1294599513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : default=clue.branches[len(clue.branches)-1] < 1294599513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^^ so do I want to add this in? < 1294599529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :done, let's see if it does anything < 1294599531 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, not without radical alterations to MC, which is outside the scope of hMod's plugin architecture. < 1294599533 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, you can get flying boat when you time out and are in a boat and falling down. So clearly it will work on the client side < 1294599544 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmmm... does anyone know how I can work out the position of the rightmost 1 bit without using bitwise operations? (n & -n normally does the trick) < 1294599555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- deep first < 1294599555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a) => [car(a)] < 1294599555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| _ => a < 1294599556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| _ => @(car(a)) < 1294599560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: that's WITH your fix, can i have your clue.py and stuff.py? < 1294599561 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: after adding that, the order of examples matters, which i'm not sure i like < 1294599563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to see where ours differ < 1294599568 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's better than not having it, still < 1294599571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ew no, i don't like tht < 1294599571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that < 1294599573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm removing it :D < 1294599597 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1294599611 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic, n & -n assumes two-complement doesn't it? < 1294599637 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294599656 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes, that's one of the problems. < 1294599675 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic, hah! And here I was trying to make a silly remark :P < 1294599677 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: okay, in that case make it return None, otherwise it'll be order-dependent anyway < 1294599691 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic, now I'm interested, what language or platform are you targeting here? < 1294599696 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oaky < 1294599699 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you make it return None, you basically have an implicit default branch that fails. < 1294599706 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vorpal: redcode :-) < 1294599709 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294599712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :---- deep first < 1294599712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a) => [car(a)] < 1294599712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| _ => a < 1294599713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| _ => @(car(a)) < 1294599714 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic, hm < 1294599715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: still does it though :) < 1294599753 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i really think you should have that order-dependence thing, actually, it just makes everything so much simpler. < 1294599789 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm optimizing a non-recursive program to draw this: http://twitpic.com/3nt74q < 1294599791 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well i dunno, why didn't you save your old code so i don't have to up it < 1294599800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh i did < 1294599804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but you've evidently changed it :> < 1294599840 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic, why not make it recursive < 1294599840 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't < 1294599842 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmmm... pastebin.ca has been inaccessible here for a couple of days :-( < 1294599850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well i didn't remove that defaulting thing < 1294599851 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic, also what sort of signed integers does redcode use? < 1294599857 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so you must have added it? :/ < 1294599884 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic, use sprunge.us < 1294599889 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic, it is good, and loads faster < 1294599950 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I have a recursive program too... Redcode only has positive numbers. -x is represented as CORESIZE-x. In a normal core -1 is 7999 < 1294599960 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i haven't touched it < 1294599964 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic, that's so wtf < 1294599976 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i may have, but it's unlikely that i have, more likely that the universe has a bug < 1294599994 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-) < 1294600003 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D < 1294600016 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic, why is it not a power of 2? Everything is better as a power of 2. No exceptions except for the exception that ternary is awesome. < 1294600036 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: should i make the editor automatically turn .. into : < 1294600044 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :upon my files says roughly so: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p5657189962.txt http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p9156561368.txt < 1294600044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you type .., it becomes :, type a ., it becomes :., type a dot, it becomes :: < 1294600065 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: coresize can be any value, but historically it's been 8000. < 1294600066 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...what? :D < 1294600070 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: in the editor1 < 1294600071 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*editor! < 1294600072 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oklopol: should i make the editor automatically turn .. into : oklopol: should i make the editor automatically turn .. into : <-- what for? < 1294600072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cled < 1294600079 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: they are equivalent in clue < 1294600080 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so... how do you get a dot then? :D < 1294600092 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: don't type an even number of them, duh! < 1294600102 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh lol < 1294600105 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's keeping your code to the Clue Standardisation Board's recommendations for colon and dot entry < 1294600107 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i well whatev < 1294600112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THIS IS IMPORTANT DUDE < 1294600124 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1294600125 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes but why do you want to enforce using one them rather than the other < 1294600137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :- if default is None: < 1294600137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :- return None < 1294600137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ if default==None:default=clue.branches[-1] < 1294600140 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1294600157 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yeah obviously i added that one < 1294600166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine is so much better < 1294600168 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :order is so impure < 1294600174 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wait, are you using a VCS now? < 1294600188 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294600192 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm using diff < 1294600197 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294600210 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, see, yours has the slight disadvantage that you can't write *any* functions with just one example in each hint < 1294600213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: okay our versions have no notable differences to speak of other than the exception-catching :D < 1294600214 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294600218 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in each branch < 1294600231 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well... come up with an algo that isn't order-based, any algo < 1294600232 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not random :P) < 1294600234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i'll use it < 1294600246 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm < 1294600259 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Water spouts are apparently quite resistent to explosions < 1294600261 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is no way < 1294600271 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, order for what? < 1294600273 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no simple way at least < 1294600277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :things < 1294600279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: are you sure < 1294600286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: maybe default branches need syntax :/ < 1294600292 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one way would be to have *drumroll* conditions < 1294600296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe, you know, man up and add another case < 1294600299 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, are you trying to decide which order to try things in? < 1294600302 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because... < 1294600304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294600306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you only have one case < 1294600309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stuff breaks a lot anyway :P < 1294600314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'cuz it likes to hardcode < 1294600314 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was actually one of the reasons i had conditions, i just forgot about it < 1294600322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: who cares, SO IMPURE < 1294600326 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah syntax for defaults is very much okay < 1294600370 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what are conditions in this context and why are they impure? < 1294600375 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :things < 1294600377 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and because lame < 1294600387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ofc it breaks down when you have complex conditions nayway < 1294600392 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gee, being unhelpful < 1294600394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i don't see what's wrong with needing two example cases < 1294600395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i mean < 1294600400 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: if you just do < 1294600402 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: a condition is a function used as the parameter of the switch statement that is the body of each function. < 1294600402 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :. 0 1 -> 1 < 1294600408 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it'll probably hardcode the 1 or something stupid like that < 1294600410 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, thank you < 1294600411 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a lot of cases < 1294600434 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, why would they be impure though? < 1294600441 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they were removed in the form they existed in the first version of clue, and were replaced with something else, but this is slightly technical. < 1294600451 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, can they have side effects? < 1294600452 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you have a bunch of TNT together, does it make a stronger explosion or not? < 1294600475 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically, you used to be able to give the toplevel function, like you could say you switch on the value of f, switch(f(...)), but ... may be guessed by the compiler in any way < 1294600480 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no. < 1294600492 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, so in what sense are they impure? < 1294600510 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :subjective < 1294600520 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, ah < 1294600525 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are code written by the programmer < 1294600531 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1294600536 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jan 08 20:51:23 Gregor's apples to oranges comparision convinced me to like oranges // I win forever? :P < 1294600544 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, but in a sense the examples is code written by the programmer. < 1294600546 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance, if the output format of that function f was changed, it's possible that it can't directly be used to branch anymore. < 1294600561 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the compiler should be allowed to do post-processing on the value of f < 1294600566 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294600572 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's impure in a very precise sense. < 1294600617 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm okay < 1294600620 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: examples are code written by the programmer in a sense, sure. but the sense i'm referring to is the one that breaks the ability to change output and input protocol. < 1294600630 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is one of the points of clue < 1294600645 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't even have to read the api, as long as you know what the functions do on an intuitive level < 1294600658 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course this would only be true if the compiler was 100 times faster than mine < 1294600754 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: nothing wrong with needing two example cases i guess < 1294600756 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294600788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: my editor is... so nazi < 1294600794 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's actually kinda scary < 1294600795 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would it be wrong if 1) if there's only one branch, it's always default 2) if there's exactly one recursion, it's default if no one else is < 1294600801 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't insert more than one space in a row < 1294600806 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yeah that sounds ok < 1294600812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: since... you can't get base case recursion :D < 1294600816 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be nice and practical, but kind of impure. < 1294600822 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: would it? < 1294600827 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: recursion to me basically IMPLIES some defaultness < 1294600830 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, hm okay < 1294600834 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and one branch is default by basically definition < 1294600845 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294600852 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those are *very* natural, in actual programs < 1294600853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll impl that after cled works :D < 1294600868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well i even think "random" functions obey that too < 1294600870 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people would basically just assume them anyway. < 1294600872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :base cases don't recurse, by definition < 1294600878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and recursion is walking towards a base case < 1294600883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anything that isn't a base case, covers a range of values < 1294600885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and is thus a default < 1294600891 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but < 1294600896 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : you can't insert more than one space in a row <-- how do you indent then? < 1294600900 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could have some function used for branching < 1294600905 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also what editor is this? leaden? < 1294600910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no, cled < 1294600912 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, it indents for you < 1294600915 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything is automatic < 1294600916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EVERYTHING < 1294600916 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, cled being? < 1294600917 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you could have an infinite number of base cases, say all the cases where that function gives a positive number < 1294600928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CLuEDitor < 1294600929 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if the function gives you a 0, it means you haven't found the result yet, and have to recurse < 1294600939 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is it an emacs mode? < 1294600944 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in that case it'd be the base case that's defaul < 1294600945 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so add more than one example :> < 1294600945 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :t < 1294600951 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no, i decided it would be way too hard like that < 1294600969 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure sure, i'm just saying it's technically possible to have a base case be the natural default < 1294600981 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then you'd just need to tell the compiler that by having two examples. < 1294600984 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's more pure than assuming the last is default, let's put it that way. < 1294600992 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm, Is it ncurses-based? < 1294600995 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :about 42 times purer. < 1294600998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no, tk(inter) < 1294601001 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's not total! :D < 1294601001 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah < 1294601004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's convenient in python < 1294601008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and not _hideously_ ugly on os x / windows < 1294601018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the whole UI is a text box with a scrollbar to the right anyway < 1294601024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it won't even be too horrid on x11 :) < 1294601026 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it is rather ugly on linux though < 1294601029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*x11 < 1294601045 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Tk scrollbars are ugly on linux < 1294601058 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, do you use that theme thingy whatever it was called < 1294601062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no < 1294601067 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why not < 1294601073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't think tkinter can do that. < 1294601075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't really care how ugly a single scrollbar is anyway :P < 1294601090 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wait, you don't care about aesthetics? < 1294601100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not for cled < 1294601100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :! < 1294601107 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how unlike you! < 1294601271 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, last xkcd is so sad, but the title text was actually quite funny. < 1294601360 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"If you look at these languages in order, Java, Perl, Python, you notice an interesting pattern. At least, you notice this pattern if you are a Lisp hacker. Each one is progressively more like Lisp. Python copies even features that many Lisp hackers consider to be mistakes. You could translate simple Lisp programs into Python line for line. It's 2002, and programming languages have almost caught up with 1958." < 1294601372 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[Nevertheless, some historians still consider it was Hilliard who won that dude battle.]] < 1294601377 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BEST WIKIPEDIA QUOTE EVER < 1294601382 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, wait, it isn't < 1294601394 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, where is that quote from? < 1294601405 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[Fukutsuru died in 2005 but his frozen sperm lived on for people’s benefit.]] < 1294601414 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THAT is the best Wikipedia quote ever. < 1294601554 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TypeError: cannot concatenate 'str' and 'int' objects < 1294601556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait,what... < 1294601574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*wait, what < 1294601582 0 :TLUL!~TLUL@wikia/The-last-username-left JOIN :#esoteric < 1294601598 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you could translate simple haskell programs into dofigj line for line. it's 2032, and programming languages have almost caught up with 1994. < 1294601670 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I wish I lived in such a world < 1294601693 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : text.delete("1.0+%dc" % idx+1, "1.0+%dc" % spc) < 1294601693 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TypeError: cannot concatenate 'str' and 'int' objects < 1294601694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtfff. < 1294601695 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :idx is an int. < 1294601922 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A good argument for Better Grass: http://i.imgur.com/82ndJ.jpg < 1294601957 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: have you tried http://www.largames.com/lartexture? < 1294601965 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey the graphics look different < 1294601976 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, j-invariant, where is that quote from? < 1294601988 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: different texture pack < 1294601989 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also a mod < 1294602037 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it looks rather flat somehow. I prefer something suggesting a real world rather than something suggestion a flat mario64-like world. But sure I'll try it some day. < 1294602050 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it is flat. < 1294602083 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, uh and? I don't want the texture to make it look flatter than the default texture pack does < 1294602098 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't ... < 1294602106 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, to me it looks that way < 1294602115 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from the screenshots < 1294602136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: < 1294602137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : text.delete("1.0+%dc" % idx+1, "1.0+%dc" % spc) < 1294602137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TypeError: cannot concatenate 'str' and 'int' objects < 1294602138 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seriously wtf < 1294602141 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :idx is an int < 1294602156 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohhh < 1294602158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :need parens < 1294602342 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it would be nice if compilations could be written to a file < 1294602346 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even if just with pickle < 1294602348 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or marshal < 1294602362 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously < 1294602390 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could even check that the compilation is correct < 1294602398 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :P < 1294602399 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FOR FUN < 1294602419 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it was correct by construction < 1294602426 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think i'm gonna make cled hold the program as a structure in memory and just write it as a string all the time... < 1294602432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and respond to keypresses :P < 1294602433 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd be simpler < 1294602457 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have to go shoppe < 1294602757 0 :cheater-!~cheater@e181131235.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294602916 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294602953 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i just realised that if i make it hold it as an object i get to make a terrible terrible semantic ui for it < 1294602958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you are gonna use this to write all your programs right :D < 1294603029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey Vorpal how do you make an emacs mode < 1294603047 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, by writing elisp and reading docs. < 1294603059 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you making an emacs mode for Clue? < 1294603060 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I haven't done it. I have tweaked existing ones however < 1294603063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes, but, without the second thing < 1294603070 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well. i'm writing an editor program BUT < 1294603071 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, you never answered: j-invariant, j-invariant, where is that quote from? < 1294603075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might be easier to do it as an emacs mode :D < 1294603078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: pg. < 1294603086 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, "pg"? < 1294603089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pg. < 1294603101 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, as in postgresql command binary prefix? < 1294603106 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that is all I know it as :P < 1294603110 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :emacs modes tend to have a certain format: They have a syntax hilighter table and such < 1294603115 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so what do you mean by pg < 1294603126 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :paul g < 1294603126 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pol grayam < 1294603130 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah < 1294603134 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pearly graham crackers < 1294603153 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yeah but in this case I want auto-indentation which is less than trivial for clue < 1294603156 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it depends on the first line of the block < 1294603158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :specifically the length of the name < 1294603194 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I believe some modes manage such auto indention < 1294603199 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't remember which ones < 1294603226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yeah but i want to do it easily :D < 1294603308 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you lazy < 1294603317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: question! < 1294603318 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, insert fitting can-only-have-2-out-of-3 statement here < 1294603324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh actually i have no question really < 1294603327 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I can be lazy too) < 1294603338 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ok question < 1294603346 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what's the max number of examples you'd put on one line < 1294603346 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kebab place was the complement of a set containing an open ball arouns each of its points :( < 1294603347 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :two? < 1294603364 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :two or three < 1294603370 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294603391 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can imagine something like . number -> number more than twice on one line < 1294603471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294603478 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll make it < 1294603482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :less than five, so long as the result is less than 50 chars < 1294603489 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why limit it? < 1294603489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or actually 40 < 1294603489 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294603496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: because really long lines are ugly < 1294603499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: this is the auto-formatter < 1294603509 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right because ur editor hates jews < 1294603510 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: cled has kinda morphed into this thing where you edit the bags and branches and stuff as actual objects < 1294603515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and it just reads and writes to the files < 1294603519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the background < 1294603523 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you know... like oklOS :D < 1294603532 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) < 1294603537 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294603759 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: should i make it impossible to put a function that doesn't exist into the bag :D < 1294603763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, that's excessive. probably < 1294603774 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294603854 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294604112 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mmm, snow. < 1294604214 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: < 1294604216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 3 ~ {. 0 -> 0 } < 1294604216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 3 ~ {. 1 -> 0 } < 1294604216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 3 ~ {. 2 -> 0 } < 1294604219 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 3 ~ {. 3 -> 0 } < 1294604221 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 3 ~ {. 4 -> 1 . 5 -> 1 } < 1294604223 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 3 ~ 0; 1 < 1294604225 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: written by a program :D < 1294604358 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now add a feature where you can write a function, and it's compiled into examples < 1294604360 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294604364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D < 1294604377 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: that would officially be the most pointless combination of programs in existence < 1294604381 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1294604390 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'm considering never putting more than one example on a line... < 1294604393 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's... always kinda ugly < 1294604559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depth of first ~ {. 0 -> 0 . 5 -> 0 } < 1294604559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depth of first ~ {:. [[1 2] [3 4]] -> 2 < 1294604559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [1 2] -> 1 < 1294604561 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : :. [[[1 2 3] 4] 5] -> 3 < 1294604563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [[1 2 3] 4] -> 2 } < 1294604565 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depth of first ~ is list?; cons; car; cdr; succ; 0 < 1294604567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: written by a program :D < 1294604680 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice < 1294604721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think we should just make this the new official syntax for clue: http://sprunge.us/HXGG < 1294604726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also by written, I mean turned into text, obviously < 1294604729 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it didn't actually write the program < 1294604732 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although that would be nice < 1294604751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ooh i'ma make the bag into a set. < 1294604911 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in what sense? < 1294605036 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: um in that it's a python set :D < 1294605041 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ordered when it gets turned into a string < 1294605070 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err okay, that sounds like a reeeeally useful change < 1294605095 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i suppose it means you can't use order for optimization, which is good because the order shouldn't be meaningful. < 1294605115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh no no i don't mean in clue.py < 1294605117 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean in cled < 1294605125 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the semantic CluEDitor! < 1294605139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you have to tell me now that you're gonna use this thing to write all your clue programs, even though it's crazy :D < 1294605146 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh heeh go for it. < 1294605147 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TI-83+ is weird, it has orthogonal persistence when turning off due to no key being pressed after a number of minutes. But if you manually turn it off you get back to the basic "shell screen" (for lack of better name) next time you turn it on. < 1294605150 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a film adaptation of Asimov's Foundation series coming. < 1294605152 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll consider it. < 1294605152 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::'( < 1294605166 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could not get into that book at all < 1294605168 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ^ < 1294605174 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: heh < 1294605178 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the first bit was cool but it started dragging and dragging..... < 1294605191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I want to be a filmmaker for the sole purpose of making Ed stories and Fine Structure into films. < 1294605203 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To be directed by Roland Emmerich. < 1294605207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Yes, I have considered how to depict Unbelievable Scenes.) < 1294605227 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: 2012: It's a Disaster! < 1294605237 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You may know him for really, really *stupid* films, such as Independence Day and The Day After Tomorrow. < 1294605248 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And, yes, 2012. < 1294605260 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZW2qxFkcLM0 < 1294605350 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, if this adaptation is any good at all, it will be a miracle that psychohistory could not predict at all. < 1294605355 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : To be directed by Roland Emmerich. ← NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO < 1294605390 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: At least it's not Uwe Boll. < 1294605408 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, that wouldn't be much worse! < 1294605413 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSZhBParVjo < 1294605419 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Yes it would. < 1294605419 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294605420 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least with Uwe Boll we would know everyone would hate it! < 1294605420 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wrong link < 1294605422 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes it would. < 1294605425 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZW2qxFkcLM0 < 1294605435 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Hah. < 1294605438 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, Emmerich is a major director. < 1294605448 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :His film will be well-funded and widely promoted. < 1294605449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SO IS UWE BOLL < 1294605456 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :People will *see* it. < 1294605460 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :People I know IRL. < 1294605478 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :People who will not have read the book and will not see the film for the dross it will inevitably be. < 1294605499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: THIS IS EXACTLY WHY I HAVE TO FILM ED STORIES AND FINE STRUCTURE. < 1294605512 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you haven't read the latter! < 1294605512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OTHERWISE SOMEBODY, SOMETIME IN THE FUTURE, WHEN SAM HUGHES IS DEAD BUT INCREDIBLY POPULAR, SOMEONE WILL MAKE A FILM OF THEM < 1294605514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AND IT WILL _SUCK_ < 1294605520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: I've read, like, over half of it! < 1294605526 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shame we can't resurrect Kubrick and have him do it. < 1294605534 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Really though it'd be a worthy film even just with Unbelievable Scenes and 1970—. < 1294605538 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ed would really be better as an episodic miniseries thing. < 1294605550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: At the start... but not Be Here Now onwards. < 1294605552 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And FS would not compress into an average-length film. < 1294605557 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At all. < 1294605568 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Who said anything about "average-length"? < 1294605577 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How would you even go about turning FS into a film/ < 1294605580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Up to The Story So Far fits into my head-film with plenty of space left. < 1294605581 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, there is an upper limit on film length. < 1294605582 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'll be a 12 hour cinematic experience, I'm sure. < 1294605593 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: People watch LotR in a single sitting. < 1294605595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: 3 hours, maybe? < 1294605597 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any further questions? < 1294605599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To three and a half. < 1294605604 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not unheard of. < 1294605606 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, that is two hours longer than the total length of LoTR. < 1294605610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it's epic enough. < 1294605615 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Not the extended editions. < 1294605632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: If you can tell me why FS can't fit into three and a half hours without spoiling past The Story So Far, go ahead. < 1294605633 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LoTR actually compresses pretty well into a film; the large amount of description becomes unnecessary. < 1294605658 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LotR would compress pretty well into a book; the large amount of description *is* unnecessary. < 1294605662 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>:D < 1294605694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, with enough rejiggling of the starting bits (adding filler/transitions), Ed Stories could work as a film, I think. < 1294605695 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote LoTR actually compresses pretty well into a film; the large amount of description becomes unnecessary. LotR would compress pretty well into a book; the large amount of description *is* unnecessary. < 1294605703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or maybe it could be in medias res. < 1294605712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Starting with that moment where Ed calls up and says "hey, what did I ever invent that could work". < 1294605725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Each invention leading to a flashback of the relevant short story. And then work Be Here Now into there somehow. < 1294605729 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :263) LoTR actually compresses pretty well into a film; the large amount of description becomes unnecessary. LotR would compress pretty well into a book; the large amount of description *is* unnecessary. < 1294605743 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm too lazy to fix it < 1294605745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what. < 1294605751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: what manner of witchery is this. < 1294605754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, "pikh" < 1294605757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try delquote < 1294605767 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I actually found the Silmarillion less dreary than LoTR because of that. < 1294605789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried to read Fellowship once, and decided that Tolkien was fucking with me about 100 to 200 pages in. < 1294605790 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: You found the Silmarillion *less* dreary. < 1294605792 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Less*. < 1294605800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then I gave up. < 1294605803 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: The series is worth reading. Once. < 1294605804 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It confuses me. < 1294605807 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does anyoen know what I'm talking about?? < 1294605811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what did you say < 1294605818 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(That I found it easier.) < 1294605819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: The movies themselves were fairly slow too, but fun. < 1294605827 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I was *dragging* myself through Return. < 1294605843 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish it were public domain, so it would be legal to edit out the unneeded content. < 1294605863 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :regarding Foundation: the first bit was cool but it started dragging and dragging..... < 1294605866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294605867 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't read it < 1294605871 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And leave the poetry as an appendix, or a seperate volume, rather than IN THE FREAKING STORY. < 1294605872 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't make it into the good bits, I guess < 1294605873 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: this is going to be soooo much of a semantic editor < 1294605877 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because everyone loves that book... < 1294605879 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's gonna be RIDICULOUS < 1294605882 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: What was the last bit you got to? < 1294605883 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The movies are actually way better. < 1294605894 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I can't remember, they were making wikipedia < 1294605897 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Lord of the Rings in 500 Pages would be a great book. < 1294605914 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have some issues with the movies, but they do demonstrate that, dammit, Tolkien would be much improved with editing. < 1294605930 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though The Hobbit does this, as well. < 1294605931 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, until pretentious literary types start badmouthing it. < 1294605951 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Oh, they can go to hell. They badmouthed the books until recently anyways. < 1294605974 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://tolkien.slimy.com/etext/EtextChps.html what is this. < 1294605981 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1294605981 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it wasn't ~deep and meaningful analysis of the human condition~? < 1294606068 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: The pretentious literary types really seem to like terrible fiction. About 50 years after it's been published. < 1294606081 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Examples? < 1294606084 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On occasion they like good fiction as well, but I suspect this is a fluke. < 1294606109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: this editor is going to be pretty horrible :D < 1294606116 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's basically going to be a shitload of boxes inside other boxes < 1294606181 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: "The Grapes of Wrath", by Steinbeck. < 1294606202 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's terrible? (I wouldn't know.) < 1294606206 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: This book earned Steinbeck a Pulitzer and a Nobel Prize. < 1294606208 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: < 1294606209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if default is None: < 1294606209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if len(clue.branches)==1: < 1294606210 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : default=clue.branches[0] < 1294606212 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : else: < 1294606214 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : recs=filter(lambda i:i.isrec(),clue.branches) < 1294606216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : if len(recs)==1: < 1294606217 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Every *other* chapter has plot. < 1294606218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : default=recs[0] < 1294606220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : else: < 1294606222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return None < 1294606224 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : return call_branch(clue,default,args,depth_lim) < 1294606249 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The plotless chapters are pretentious mental wanking put on a page, in the form of allegory. < 1294606285 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We only have 12 years to wait < 1294606287 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except for you < 1294606290 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have 42 < 1294606295 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lolsonnybono < 1294606316 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: By "12" or "42" you mean "infinity". < 1294606320 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: 6 < 1294606320 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, other random info: a goto based loop in TI-BASIC is about 5 times slower than a for-based one. A for is about 20% faster than a while loop. < 1294606322 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: ^ < 1294606328 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: what < 1294606332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: YOU MEAN INFINITY DAMMIT < 1294606354 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Pooppy witchery. < 1294606356 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Retroactive copyright extensions happen every time Mickey Mouse is about to hit public domain. < 1294606359 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I have no clue what you meant to say there < 1294606361 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who is copumpkin? < 1294606362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Oh. < 1294606362 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: oh, not here < 1294606368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: An evil witch. < 1294606373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Correct pikh -> pikhq. < 1294606390 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you guys < 1294606394 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we have 12 years < 1294606394 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: who is Vorpal? < 1294606415 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(once I get an indication of what information you're looking for in an answer to that kind of question, I can answer yours :P) < 1294606416 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: This tends to be enforced by WIPO. < 1294606421 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't find what " copumpkin: YOU MEAN INFINITY DAMMIT" was a reply to < 1294606422 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: uh what < 1294606440 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yet more proof you have no scrollback < 1294606464 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think they both meant coppro < 1294606465 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Every 20 years or so they get a stick up their ass, become convinced copyright needs to be 20 years longer, and strongarms most of the world into compliance. < 1294606468 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin, "someone new here" "someone who changed nick", "sometime who been away for many years but used to be a regular" < 1294606472 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :both pikhq and elliott < 1294606472 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: no < 1294606473 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin, that kind of stuff < 1294606474 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294606476 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: stop lying < 1294606479 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: you mean infinit < 1294606480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y < 1294606482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you know it's true < 1294606483 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: not Canada < 1294606487 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: he's a #haskell informant. < 1294606492 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: someone who's been here for about a week or two now I think, but yeah, relatively new :P < 1294606504 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Member of WIPO, as well. < 1294606510 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, aha < 1294606520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah copumpkin is a member of wipo < 1294606523 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i agree < 1294606534 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wipo? < 1294606538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :absolutely < 1294606540 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh okay < 1294606606 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin, are you the codomain of pumpkins or? < 1294606620 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm a pumpkin in the opposite category < 1294606625 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294606674 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Well I'll be. You guys haven't gone beyond the international-treaty-required-minimum of *life plus 50*. < 1294606681 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: nope < 1294606683 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294606700 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is still bullshit. < 1294606700 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are we doing category theory < 1294606701 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: implement copumpkin in your category theory < 1294606703 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: agreed < 1294606704 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: no < 1294606707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294606710 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll go back to sleep them < 1294606735 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: in fact, Mickey Mouse has 6 more years here. < 1294606773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:10:28 actually not so much lately, since i broke up with the gf, although we've been talking about being sex-buddies with an ex < 1294606773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:11:22 (we broke up because of artistic differences) < 1294606777 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :More so under US copyright law, where Congress only has the power to enact copyright law for the purpose of increasing the works produced... < 1294606779 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :movies are ridiculously short when you get used to watching seasons of a tv series in one go < 1294606785 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: *phew* i still couldn't quite see you as being in a stable, long-term relationship < 1294606790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you seem less..conflicting now < 1294606801 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ < 1294606809 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Artistic differences"? < 1294606821 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you disagree with her views on interior decoration? < 1294606847 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that is to say, under a strict interpretation of the US constitution, Congress *does not have the power* to create a copyright law that does not increase the amount of artistic expression.) < 1294606866 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Consider this http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=VBavHxpt < 1294606866 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, artistic difference could mean so very very much when oklopol says it. < 1294606867 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: have fun with that one < 1294606873 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: you should sue the government < 1294606877 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the problem is to write init in terms of foldr < 1294606880 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(of course, under a strict interpretation of the US constitution, Congress doesn't have the power to do almost everything it does, so hey!) < 1294606885 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, consider yesterday's discussion between him and zzo for example < 1294606889 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: yep < 1294606903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i've written functions in terms of foldr all the time < 1294606905 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Maybe the methods here could be incorperated into Clue < 1294606911 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol :) < 1294606915 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: since i think that data should be represented as its foldr < 1294606915 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I am pointing out that the derivation is systematic < 1294606919 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1294606919 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, instead of church representation etc. < 1294606922 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yes, indeedy < 1294606934 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. Of things it commonly does, it has the power to: run the military, fund roads, run the postal service, and tax. < 1294606936 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I have been watching some videos about the difference between the encodings data = ... and folds < 1294606967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: people have already encoded data as its fold as an implementation technique? < 1294606973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and made pattern matching and recursion compile to that? < 1294606975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slitting wrists brb < 1294606980 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, isn't the postal service private in US? If so that surprises me < 1294606984 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1294606989 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ? < 1294606994 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it was rather stable and long-term imo < 1294607012 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The postal service is very much public. < 1294607018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yeah but it isn't any more, which is the good thing. also if you're somehow normal enough to get offended by me saying this, just say < 1294607024 0 :KingOfKarlsruhe!~nice@p5B133BF5.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294607025 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well right < 1294607034 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i get offended if you tell me i suck at math < 1294607038 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You should learn uAgda: In this language we define data types by their elimination behavior and theen program with them using parametricity < 1294607038 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's it < 1294607043 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I don't know if the word exists (it probably doesn't) but that is an geochronism < 1294607049 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or whatever) < 1294607051 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: :D < 1294607054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you suck at math < 1294607058 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(probably chron has to do with time) < 1294607060 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck you < 1294607066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'm jokin i'm jokin < 1294607066 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(so it should be anageonism or something) < 1294607069 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: u r math god < 1294607076 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: do you actually do any math < 1294607087 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which one? < 1294607096 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It functions independentally, does not receive any money *from* the federal government, but it's a government agency nevertheless. < 1294607100 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yes < 1294607101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he does all the maths j-invariant < 1294607105 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"which one?" < 1294607111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's a BACHELOR! he even got a plaque, saying he's a bachelor < 1294607112 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, uh... < 1294607114 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think this is how degrees work < 1294607114 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hate trying to help people in IR < 1294607116 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IRC < 1294607118 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they never listen to me < 1294607136 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, I know the feeling < 1294607138 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The functioning independentally is just a matter of how the bureaucracy works. < 1294607143 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do I just come across as some sort of liar that wants to trick people or what < 1294607146 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, hm < 1294607148 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i listened to you :< < 1294607184 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's part of the executive branch, and technically the President could just start bossing people around. < 1294607193 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, hah < 1294607261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: have you ever used tkinter < 1294607267 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, it predates the US, and was founded by Ben Franklin. < 1294607268 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION listens to HAPPY SONG < 1294607272 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes < 1294607272 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: wat < 1294607278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: can i like < 1294607291 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JwmU9kQTv4U < 1294607292 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: recursively transform an object structure into a gui widget, different widget type per class < 1294607296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and have it sort of automatically update? < 1294607314 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't used it enough to tell you more than any tutorial could < 1294607318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i thought you just had a song that you referred to as HAPPY SONG for no reason :D < 1294607323 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've mostly just made basic interfaces with it < 1294607327 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294607332 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like you know text box + button < 1294607343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'm tempted to just do this with sdl :D < 1294607347 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or whatever < 1294607349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pygame or sth < 1294607445 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what a waste of tiem geez < 1294607475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ? < 1294607486 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what are you doing then? < 1294607491 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: this guy wanted to know how to write init as foldr, I tried to help him but he just ignored me < 1294607492 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, har har < 1294607497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: like i can't figure out how to do this, do i have to reconstruct every object constantly < 1294607501 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(wrt games) < 1294607501 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: what is har har/ < 1294607507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: do you mean me >_> < 1294607513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't recall wanting to know that < 1294607515 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ?? no < 1294607517 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294607531 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294607531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's possible he just didn't see your message... < 1294607542 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, wait nvm. I read "geez" as "games" somehow (and sorted out the grammar without noticing it) < 1294607566 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I need to sleep < 1294607572 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well I /have/ spent about 60% of the last few days playing minecraft < 1294607585 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, that was why I went "har har" :P < 1294607685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think i need... zippers... in python :D < 1294607691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or just < 1294607692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg < 1294607693 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mutable integers :D < 1294607697 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BEST IDEA < 1294608014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh wow it's actually working. < 1294608064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: dude. < 1294608069 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's < 1294608070 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WORKING < 1294608216 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : mutable integers :D <-- what exactly do you mean? < 1294608218 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something like < 1294608221 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 = 5? < 1294608228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: x = IntHolder(5) < 1294608231 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x.value = 6 < 1294608245 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oklopol: i think i need... zippers... in python :D ← Well, someone already did monads... < 1294608250 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, uh. so it is inc() ? < 1294608251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm possibly these objects should know their parents < 1294608256 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, or wait < 1294608257 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: what < 1294608262 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you mean x = 5; x = 6 ? < 1294608263 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the point is that it's (int *) < 1294608264 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically < 1294608266 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294608266 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but boxed? < 1294608272 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yes < 1294608278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x = Holder(5); f(x); x ==> Holder(6) < 1294608280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if f is < 1294608283 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so you need boxed mutable variables. Okay < 1294608284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x.value += 1 < 1294608294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: http://imgur.com/JybuB < 1294608359 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: current state of cled: http://i.imgur.com/931qc.png < 1294608365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: those buttons are actually going to be like text boxes < 1294608366 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but whatever < 1294608392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: the idea is basically that everything is a list: e.g. a branch is a list of examples < 1294608397 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's cled? < 1294608402 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you can go up and down a list, "descend" into a list, and ascend back up < 1294608414 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so for instance, the list shown there is 1, 2 and 3 < 1294608414 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, AAAAAAAAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHH < 1294608431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: if you are over, e.g. an integer, then you can type a new one to replace it < 1294608447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: bags are obviously an auto-sorted unique list (set) of their elements < 1294608451 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: lists are of course lists of their elements < 1294608459 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and the whole program is an auto-sorted unique list (set) of the functions < 1294608469 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there's one extra key, / < 1294608473 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/foo jumps to the function foo < 1294608485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and there's also "insert element to list here" and "delete element" < 1294608493 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you create a function by inserting an element in the program, typing the name, and going from there < 1294608495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: what's aaargh < 1294608507 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that creeper < 1294608511 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Ah. < 1294608531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: the keys to create "more than 3" look something like this: < 1294608540 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what is it! < 1294608544 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Phantom__Hoover: http://imgur.com/JybuB <-- that looks like a cross between a creeper, a duck and some blobby creature from generic scifi that can shape shift. < 1294608547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: an editor for Clue trees < 1294608551 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294608557 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, end result is not scary but just laughable < 1294608563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is terrifying. < 1294608567 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, the moooouuuuuutttthhhh < 1294608582 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, yes it just looks silly < 1294608594 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, a mouth that shape, how would it close it? < 1294608607 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't < 1294608608 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :duh < 1294608612 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ever seen a creeper with its mouth closed? < 1294608620 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no and I blame notch for that < 1294608622 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: +emore than 3+e+e0e0... and more < 1294608629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i swear this is easy to use :D < 1294608641 0 :BMG!~behold@d83-183-183-70.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1294608653 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294608653 0 :BMG!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294608658 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :BeholdMyGlory < 1294608667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: so anyway, water flows upwards now http://i.imgur.com/4mx3X.png < 1294608681 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294608682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just visual < 1294608683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294608693 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=99048 < 1294608836 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i get the feeling you don't think this editor is brilliant : < 1294608837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294608872 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1294609155 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1294609563 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://imgur.com/JybuB = awesome < 1294609675 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone should totally make mc with those graphics < 1294609710 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha this guy shows how to make a memory cell using boats and doors < 1294610130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: making this is so hard :D < 1294610136 0 :augur[afk]!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :augur < 1294610166 0 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-65-80.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1294610175 0 :KingOfKarlsruhe!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294610206 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://imgur.com/nlL89 hd textures :D < 1294610220 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sleeeeeeeep < 1294610284 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294610357 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what, why < 1294610409 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I dare you to retell Lord of the Rings in 10 sentences. < 1294610417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: (Not ten chapter-long sentences.) < 1294610565 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Frodo Baggins must destroy the Ring of Power, so that ultimate evil cannot use it! He does so. < 1294610570 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2. < 1294610572 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There. < 1294610606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: That leaves out almost all details. Try and pack all the important details into 10 sentences. < 1294610610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is going somewhere. < 1294610771 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"First Wikileaks, then their followers. Next will be the follower's followers. Eventually the US will get their real target: Kevin Bacon < 1294610790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294610807 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294610813 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like my conspiracy to conspire to commit fraud. < 1294610990 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294611099 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1294611150 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: tile would probably work with this actually < 1294611151 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but whatever < 1294611208 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oklopol: what, why <-- he has an exam tomorrow, remember? < 1294611212 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so? < 1294611233 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: so anyway, water flows upwards now http://i.imgur.com/4mx3X.png <--- old, happens all the time with diagonals like that. It can go down if you have a 2x2 basin without the corners for example < 1294611233 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION swats elliott -----### < 1294611249 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: tile would probably work with this actually <-- this made no sense < 1294611257 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: i have a tk question < 1294611257 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not know the context < 1294611262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: tk themeable widgets < 1294611268 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1294611270 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well okay < 1294611271 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night < 1294611276 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't know Tk well, but k. < 1294611285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: what event do I bind to on an entry (single-line text input field) such that it triggers whenever an extra char gets inserted? < 1294611288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : doesn't work < 1294611294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it calls even for things like tab, cursor keys, etc. < 1294611296 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hell if I know. < 1294611303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: :( < 1294611453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: MAKE IT WORK < 1294611585 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294611728 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, mcmap feature request? < 1294611776 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1294611780 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Could it copy the block data it receives to an SSP-compatible world file? < 1294611952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: fizzie already has that planned. < 1294611966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I could plan how to blow up Mount Vorpal locally. < 1294612190 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Do you know of a tcl wiki link listing tk events? < 1294612372 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294612638 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1294613294 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, that was a bizarre spambot on Esolang < 1294613303 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's replacing arbitrary links with piped links to its own website < 1294613372 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds like one that might be effective < 1294613375 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hi! < 1294613397 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, looks like it was just programmed to s/[.*/ / < 1294613457 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: indeed < 1294613561 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it really screwed up the syntax < 1294613586 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: have you ever used a semantic editing tool? < 1294613598 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, not too badly. < 1294613610 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It actually worked perfectly. < 1294613632 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Links become links to the spammer's site, but with a single ] at the end. < 1294613776 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What happened to voxelperfect, BtW? < 1294613792 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Expired. < 1294613805 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The domain? < 1294613860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1294613862 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes/no? :p < 1294613959 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's a semantic editing tool? < 1294614519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: I'LL GET TO THAT LATER < 1294614539 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, my Complaining About People Not Liking The Show entry on TV Tropes' MC article has been bumped to the YMMV tab. < 1294614552 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Haa. < 1294614567 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Other things in that tab are "Demonic Spiders". < 1294614574 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This isn't even marked as subjective. < 1294614579 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I despair. < 1294614654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Creepers are of the same species as the Slender Man." < 1294614655 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh dear god < 1294614674 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DON'T MENTION THAT < 1294614760 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Meanwhile, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RiJh5fpWPAo < 1294614796 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1294614852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Incidentally, with the kind of rates he gets there, HHI could double its TNT supply in days. < 1294614882 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Roll on creeper Wednesdays! < 1294615151 0 :TLUL!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :TLUL|afk < 1294615591 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=1016&t=71196 < 1294615593 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SCIENCE! < 1294615600 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pigman science! < 1294615823 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Notch fanboy stupidity of the week: < 1294615848 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone on TV Tropes said that you'd be mocked relentlessly for appreciating the things Notch does FOR FREE! < 1294615851 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294615867 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Free.... except for the €15 charge for the beta. < 1294615893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bahaaha. < 1294615969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what, voxelperfect works again < 1294615974 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ^ < 1294615975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ^ < 1294615982 0 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1294615993 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294616085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: hey it's actually working :D < 1294616252 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-243-192.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294616261 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: woohoo! < 1294616365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: foo ~ { -> 3 }; foo ~ 3 < 1294616366 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IndexError: list index out of range :( < 1294616369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: foo ~ { -> 3 } foo ~ 3 < 1294616369 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IndexError: list index out of range :( < 1294616371 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294616376 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should complain to oklopol about that :D < 1294616379 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EylMIwGLRBg < 1294616382 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How... < 1294616393 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How did he get FPS that high on the Reddit creative server? < 1294616399 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WITH SCIENCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! < 1294616471 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Y'know, CS isn't really a science... < 1294616476 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Obviously. < 1294616477 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's more of a whatever mathematics is. < 1294616485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: It *is* a field of mathematics. < 1294616486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: "Computing theory". < 1294616489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or "Computation theory". etc. < 1294616497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CS is neither a science nor related to computers. < 1294616499 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :People who claim otherwise are ignorant. < 1294616534 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, any other novels which are awful and loved by the pretentious? < 1294616549 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Lemme find some. < 1294616600 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Alternately, I could cut the work and just say "Look at a literature cirriculum." < 1294616601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Iain M. Banks < 1294616601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION OHHHHHHHH < 1294616624 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, M.? < 1294616627 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not loved by the pretentious. < 1294616632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: T'was joke. < 1294616641 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yeah, I should have said just Iain Banks. < 1294616642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Iain Banksy. < 1294616650 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulitzer_Prize_for_Fiction Here's a list. < 1294616668 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SF in general isn't loved by the pretentious, since you need to have a modicum of intelligence to appreciate it. < 1294616673 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294616676 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(note: some omissions required. Namely: Hemingway is a good author.) < 1294616700 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(whose writing style is most notable for lacking any bullshit at all.) < 1294616803 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Bullshit" here meaning "all forms of punctuation higher than the full stop." < 1294616808 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er, *". < 1294616842 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to like Vonnegut but can't because he hates semicolons. It is a wretched state of existence I find myself in. < 1294616848 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, it's more that he's completely unpretentious. < 1294616856 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Road is meant to be good. < 1294616861 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I like semicolons! < 1294616866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SO DO I < 1294616874 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, this is natural, considering that he's also quite legitimately a badass. :P < 1294616877 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, pissmarsed. < 1294616886 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"First rule: Do not use semicolons. They are transvestite hermaphrodites representing absolutely nothing. All they do is show you've been to college." < 1294616888 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :—Vonnegut < 1294616891 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Road is also speculative fiction. < 1294616895 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :COINCIDENCE < 1294616908 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I learnt it in my first year of senior school"! < 1294616912 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/"// < 1294616921 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't recall *not* knowing proper use of the semicolon! < 1294616928 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Turns out that the guys who wrote the Oxford Latin Course love semicolons. < 1294616963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used to never use the semicolon, then I did, and used it excessively to the point of insanity in here; then I decided to stop entirely for a few months, which I did, and my writing became a bit less silly; and then I started again, but more moderately. < 1294616971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, "moderately" here means "a few times per sentence". < 1294617022 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Remember my Comic Sans essay? < 1294617034 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The teacher scolded me for "semicolon splicing". < 1294617061 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When I pointed out to her that that was the ENTIRE POINT of the semicolon, she said I still wasn't using it properly. < 1294617070 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders if he still has that essay handy. < 1294617120 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I do, but it's in LyX. < 1294617129 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Might as well convert it to LaTeX. < 1294617135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Semicolon splicing. < 1294617135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 < 1294617152 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Next up, write an essay on the proper use of semicolons. < 1294617158 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cite every major style guide. < 1294617169 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(they're not likely to disagree on major points.) < 1294617212 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, well, her quibble was more that I had used it between sentences that weren't very logically connected. < 1294617246 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Define "logically connected". < 1294617263 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dunno. < 1294617281 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could put the text of the essay up, if you want, but it's not terribly good. < 1294617292 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've probably seen worse. < 1294617295 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I knocked it together in about 2 hours on the day before it was due. < 1294617310 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I was then scolded *again* for formatting it wrongly. < 1294617323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Wrongly = with LaTeX? :D < 1294617325 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(To be fair, I did use sections and a couple of footnotes.) < 1294617336 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, naw. < 1294617355 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although lots of people made the oh-so-clever suggestion to typeset it in Comic Sans. < 1294617384 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GODDAMN IT APTITUDE I DON'T CARE IF THERE'S AN UNMET DEPENDENCY IN A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT PACKAGE TO THE ONE I WANT TO INSALL < 1294617387 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*INSTALL < 1294617991 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, I've exported the essay to LaTeX... < 1294618207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TODO: make the display of branches somehow a table. < 1294618259 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, who wants to see the stupidity I make up when scrambling to finish an essay at 12 o'clock? < 1294618337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1294618404 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's that command-line pastebin? < 1294618412 0 :TLUL|afk!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :TLUL < 1294618478 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, sprunge. < 1294618583 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sprunge.us/SRKV < 1294618605 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Advice welcome, since I suspect I'll have to hand this in for some exam or other. < 1294618962 0 :hagb4rd|afk!~perdito@koln-4db41d94.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294619278 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd|afk: HOW CAN YOU JOIN WHEN YOU'RE AFK, THIS NO SENSE MAKE < 1294619365 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, he joined with his mind. < 1294619371 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh < 1294619439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: I refuse to review anything other than the originale ssay. < 1294619443 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*original essay. < 1294619460 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that is essentially it. < 1294619469 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: \author{Phantom Hoover} < 1294619470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt! < 1294619489 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I made no alteration to the text other than to change \author from my real name to... NOT GOING TO BE THAT EASY < 1294619520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294619525 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: what were those two name possibilities again < 1294619533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: FWIW, OS X has only had Comic Sans as of very recently, and Unix machines rarely ship with it. < 1294619538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I don't get this "every computer" stuff. < 1294619547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"other operating systems rapidly followed suit" -- no they did not < 1294619551 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: wat < 1294619561 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, WROTE IT IN 2 HOURS < 1294619570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: of the two possible names ph can be < 1294619572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or did fizzie get that < 1294619579 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FACTUAL ERRORS ARE FORGIVEABLE UNLESS BLINDINGLY CLEAR < 1294619586 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION doesn't recall < 1294619642 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also, it's an ENGLISH essay. < 1294619648 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Facts are irrelevant. < 1294619791 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You may lie as much as you wish, as long as your grammar and spelling is impeccable. < 1294619808 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which they are! < 1294619815 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294619816 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except for the semicolon splices. < 1294619916 0 :cheater00!~cheater@g228062212.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294619983 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1294620019 0 :hagb4rd|afk!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :hagb4rd < 1294620043 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION → sleep < 1294620086 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1294620088 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sry oerjan.. i was afk before i quit < 1294620093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=128995 < 1294620094 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes! < 1294620099 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294620148 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but to answer your question: remote control :p < 1294620224 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yeah from screenshots this relaly makes everything smoother < 1294620226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*really < 1294620238 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah phantom did it < 1294620244 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn :/ < 1294620245 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: what a ridiculous concept! < 1294620256 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did whata < 1294620271 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :concept would go too far < 1294620292 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: also http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=128043 arbitrary shader mod! < 1294620308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://img443.imageshack.us/f/screenshot20110108at101.png/ if better light is better light, what is this? perfect light? < 1294620309 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lets call it 'the creative moment of superposition' < 1294620336 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ME GO TOO FAR! < 1294620348 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahahahahahahahahaaa: < 1294620350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[Do not distribute anything I've made. This includes the client and the server software for the game. This also includes modified versions of anything I've made.]] < 1294620357 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't redistribute the minecraft server which is available for free download < 1294620358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294620476 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kind of inviting < 1294620528 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe me/you leak on trust for the culture of white man < 1294620726 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[pretty nice track: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egdOBB-Z16c&fmt=18] < 1294620782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hagb4rd: what < 1294620806 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :minima lelectro music < 1294620823 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :feel free to ignore it < 1294620824 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7jzsrnTFhyQ I think I prefer this. < 1294620908 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aza's texture pack looks nice... < 1294620908 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh.. u mean my mistranslated thompson quote :> < 1294620915 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed. < 1294620918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is what i mean < 1294621054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to flesh out list semantics. < 1294621080 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice1 pikhq :) < 1294621081 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A list has a current selection. The arrow keys move this selection up/down or left/right (same thing) the list of focusable children. < 1294621106 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The E key can be pressed to cause the current selection to be focused. Before this, the current selection stays as the list's widget. < 1294621146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The current selection's border is blue; other selections' borders are light grey. I might have some extra border colour for "selected and focused", but this is not very relevant, since you could tell by seeing whether there are any highlighted borders inside it. < 1294621182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The D key defocuses the current selection, and returns to the list, with it still selected. < 1294621185 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Focusing a number makes it become blue-bordered, say, and then typing overwrites that number. < 1294621197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So e123d, when a number is selected, would turn it into 123. < 1294621249 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The + or = key (not sure which) adds a new element after the current one in a list and selects it (but does not focus it, I don't *think*.) < 1294621262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should probably have an "insert before" key so that you can insert at the top of a list. < 1294621273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I do, then probably = should be insert after, and + should be insert before, since + is shifted = for me. < 1294621294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So in an argument list, +e123d adds 123 as an argument after the current one. < 1294621324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Perhaps I should make sure that all examples have the same number of arguments? That could be a pain (although maybe not), but it would be nice if it could do that somehow and... automatically add blank arguments to the others? Not sure.) < 1294621331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, it would be +ie123d. < 1294621348 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since + would take the type in an argument list; either integer (i) or list (l). < 1294621386 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So +le+ie123d+ie456d+ie789d adds the list [123 456 789] after the current argument. < 1294621392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or perhaps e should be implicit after +. < 1294621403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In that case, it would be: (oh, and I'm using + to mean = here, i.e. insert after) < 1294621415 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+l+i123d+i456d+i789d < 1294621421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's certainly nicer, but perhaps more confusing. I'll have to see. < 1294621434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Backspace or something deletes the current selection. < 1294621451 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In a set, obviously, everything gets sorted, so no matter where you add an element, it'll move to the right place after you enter the name. < 1294621463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On that note: in a bag, there's an extra type other than i and l, f for function. < 1294621483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But is used in place of d when writing a string. (Perhaps should be a synonym for d everywhere.) < 1294621500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So +fesucc or +fsucc (if e is implicit) adds succ to the current bag. < 1294621503 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like it. < 1294621523 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Other things I should probably have: keys to jump to the branch list and bag of the current function, no matter where you are in it. < 1294621535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, a command called / which has you type in a function name, press enter, and it jumps there. < 1294621562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think this could actually work! < 1294621574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, s or Cmd+s or whatever saves. Obviously. < 1294621587 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Saving will have to exit the current item if it's an integer or string to make sure it gets updated properly... < 1294621601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should probably also store history here, but I'm not sure how. Maybe just copy the whole thing on every change and store it in memory, the ghetto way. :p < 1294621872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also also, the focus starts on the program object, which is just a set of functions (well, really a dictionary, but you don't see that). < 1294621896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There, + just takes a name and creates a function. Perhaps it should actually do an implicit "ee", i.e. enter into the function, and enter into the name. < 1294621904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obviously it would remove it if you try and name a function an existing name or whatever. < 1294621907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or don't give it a name. < 1294622000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=11997 The Minecraft Society of Blowing People's Chests Up. < 1294622005 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wholeHEARTEDLY approve. < 1294622109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/Minecraft/comments/ez76j/living_underground_playing_minecraft_in_moleman/ < 1294622115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I really want to do this as a two-person SMP thing. < 1294622119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I'll convince PH. < 1294624139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...so basically, I keep a list index (or object references for sets? Or for everything? I have no direct object duplicates... eh, TODO: figure this out.) in each list object. < 1294624148 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And make sure it all gets highlighted and have bindings to move around that list. < 1294624154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then I just have a binding to focus the current index/whatever. < 1294624168 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Each widget itself has a key to focus its parent, which accomplishes "going up" one, i.e. exiting (d). < 1294624172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And ). < 1294624176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And perhaps .) < 1294624178 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*.) < 1294624183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, this could work. < 1294624209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obviously integers just have to snarf the keys 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 and - when they're focused and do the obvious (*10)+. < 1294624216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although - might require some trickery. < 1294624226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I should keep it as a string until the whole integer's written. < 1294624229 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or maybe not. Whatever. < 1294624390 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1294624453 0 :TLUL!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294624485 0 :TLUL!~TLUL@wikia/The-last-username-left JOIN :#esoteric < 1294624634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[["We" don't make us Ninjas or Rockstars - we still have the notion of "Monks". You might think this is stupid - on a cultural level you're basically comparing living the boheme with celebacy - guess what speaks to < 1294624634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people?]] < 1294624636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is the silliest article ever < 1294624736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Ah Perl, a ... weapon ... from an ... age." —reddit < 1294624961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D1sXuHnf_lo Deldo, teledildonics for Emacs. WJW. < 1294625038 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh god he's having sex with Steve Yegge via Emacs. What is this. < 1294625161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bahahaha networked teledildonics < 1294625273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's proposing teledildonical eugenics to wipe out vi. < 1294625472 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294625475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294626198 0 :TLUL!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :TLUL|afk < 1294626677 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would a language that does a random walk among all its instructions (and otherwise TC) be considered TC because it will *eventually* perform whatever it is that you actually intended < 1294626972 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that sounds like it would be an infinitely long computation, wouldn't it? and defining what it means for infinite computation models to be TC is very subtle < 1294627025 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the thing is that you need some kind of output translation algorithm to look through the actual random walk to say what the final result is < 1294627092 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the question is then, is it your random walk or the output translation that is doing most of the _real_ computation? < 1294627151 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is a problem for such things as rule 110 cellular automaton and that minimal turing machine which ais523 proved < 1294627353 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :both of which require an infinite setup which calculates forever < 1294627365 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: ^ < 1294627446 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rule 110 cellular automation ? < 1294627449 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION googles < 1294627491 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also to be nitpicking, theoretically TC should always be about computing a result somehow, whether it is also performing "actions" is fairly irrelevant < 1294627583 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the other one see http://www.wolframscience.com/prizes/tm23/solved.html < 1294627584 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, so my question should have been "since it will eventually compute whatever it is you intended" < 1294627596 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ps - nitpicky is good for me - it helps me learn < 1294627610 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: well you see you have to have some way to decide on _one_ result to get out of it < 1294627649 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(warning, everything wolfram is embedded in an ocean of hype) < 1294627788 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might compute as many other things it wants, but at the end you have to have a way to choose, and if that way is itself too computationally complex it is too easy to cheat < 1294627824 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, so what your saying is that the chooser itself becomes what becomes TC so the random walk doesn't matter < 1294627847 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that can happen yes. although sometimes there is a combination. < 1294627953 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the rule 110 automaton you need infinite setup and extraction of result but each of those is essentially still a finite state automaton (i think) < 1294628001 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so in some sense they're still "simple" < 1294628094 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the 2,3-turing machine case the setup is even more complicated, and there was a debate about whether it was simple enough < 1294628155 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i recall ais523 telling that the output extraction was still a very simple check) < 1294628171 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294631497 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1294631524 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-195-158.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294632230 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o < 1294632298 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think ive started to understand how continuation based backtracking works < 1294632298 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::T < 1294632540 0 :TLUL|afk!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :TLUL < 1294632627 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294632697 0 :azaq231!~derivecto@p4FF6868A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294632699 0 :azaq231!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1294632710 0 :azaq231!~derivecto@p4FF6868A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294632724 0 :azaq231!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294632724 0 :azaq231!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294632785 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1294632938 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :here's my essay about comic sans: "Comic Sans is not monospaced, nuff said." < 1294632977 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Comic Sans is not monospaced", Nuff said. < 1294633016 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION finds it funny how bad people are at driving in snow. < 1294633038 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Oh my god there's half an inch of snow! I CAN'T DRIVE!" < 1294633045 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(for you non-Americans, that's 1 or 2 cm) < 1294633130 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1.27 < 1294633173 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Ballpark figures get ballpark conversions from me. < 1294633205 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1.270000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 < 1294633219 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The 0s are irrelevant digits! < 1294633225 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294633233 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOUR digits are irrelephant! < 1294633234 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: congratulations < 1294633238 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An inch is *defined as* precisely 25.4e-3 m! < 1294633248 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know. < 1294633253 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D < 1294633254 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 < 1294633256 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was sort of his point < 1294633285 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bah. < 1294633305 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyways. < 1294633315 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I actually saw people *parked on the side of the road*. < 1294633341 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the significance of that, said the foreigner? < 1294633360 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do americans only use fancy big parking lotw < 1294633361 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*lots < 1294633371 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Their thoughts were "Oh fuck it's too bad I'm going to wait this out". < 1294633382 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh like just a random road < 1294633389 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Meanwhile I'm driving by at ~45 mph (~70 kph). < 1294633399 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose that's sort of the definition of road < 1294633429 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we rarely have half an inch of snow on the roads because people drive about as much as in the summer < 1294633451 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well. probably much less, but you don't need that many cars to remove the snow. < 1294633472 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It happens when it's snowing pretty well, and it's evening. < 1294633482 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose it might < 1294633486 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't actually own a car < 1294633573 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should prolly go to uni and try to study a bit < 1294633754 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i think i now understand the green's stuff completely, the lemmas are just because you first prove that there is a kind of inverse element for each *pair* of identity elements in the same D class, for D = L \circle R (an eq relation), that is, for each x, eRx, fLx where e and f are idempotents, there is a unique fRyLe such that xy=e, yx=f < 1294633788 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is actually pretty easy, but you have to guess what y is, by building it from the elements used in the implementations of L and R relations < 1294633804 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the same meaning of implementation as i used yesterday < 1294633843 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so xRy ~ xs = y, ys' = x would mean s and s' implement the relation, not sure that's a good term but anyhows < 1294633885 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the really complex looking lemma i listed yesterday is actually very simple when you think of it in terms of these diagrams representing D classes < 1294633951 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :D = R \circle L so have R classes as rows and L classes as columns, then what the lemma says, or on of the things, is that if left multiplication takes an element in an R class a to another R class b, then actually the whole class a is bijected onto b < 1294633998 0 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-4db40fe0.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294634029 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and L classes are preserved when multiplying a's elements from the left (by that element we chose), since well obviously because there's another element whose multiplication from the left inverts the operation < 1294634030 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294634050 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not really very clear this way either, but trust me, it's clear when you draw a diagram and move your fingers along it! < 1294634141 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyhow so in short, H classes within one R class a are bijected onto H classes of the other R class b, if you multiply from the left by an element implementing the L relation between two elements x \in a, y \in b < 1294634191 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i'll run away screaming now < 1294634220 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294634242 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the stuff in the inverse semigroups chapter is waaaaaaaay more complicated < 1294634293 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd love to rant about it but < 1294634299 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should probably read it once more < 1294634306 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and to do that, i should probably leave < 1294634323 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway in short: < 1294634339 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :inverse element of x is y such that xyx = x, yxy = y < 1294634348 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :inverse semigroup = all have unique inverses < 1294634370 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in short my brain is not capable of this stuff today < 1294634387 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the trace of a congruence is the restriction of it on the semilattice of idempotents (nontrivial that it's a semilattice, essentially needs the same proof we spend hours on back when) < 1294634391 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294634399 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i don't really care! < 1294634403 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so umm < 1294634404 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where was i < 1294634410 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeeeeeah < 1294634413 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as long as you don't mind speaking to yourself < 1294634417 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now for each congruence on an inverse semigroup < 1294634426 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you might not be listening, but others might! < 1294634432 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDDDDDDDDD < 1294634434 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway so < 1294634441 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SUUUUURE < 1294634493 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.ninjapirate.com/newcomputer.html < 1294634496 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let p be a congruence, we can define p_{min} = complicated shit; then we can prove, using a page of dense impossibl- to-understand algebration, that p_{min} is the smallest congruence with the same trace < 1294634499 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same for p_{max} < 1294634517 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's the greatest sexiness eva < 1294634565 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :such a uniqueness of minimul suchness is not the case for all regular semigroups < 1294634578 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in the case of groups, that is an empty definition < 1294634584 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as is usually the case in semigroup theory < 1294634591 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is essentially the theory of idempotents afaiu < 1294634616 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay rant over, you don't have to feel bad about me wasting my time anymore < 1294634633 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YAY < 1294635202 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1294635398 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll continue after the exam, try to get your brain up and running with puzzles and shit while i'm gone k?! < 1294635490 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NEVER < 1294635502 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::((( < 1294635511 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok MAYBE < 1294635530 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294635566 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should actually try to clean up this place, i moved about a week ago, and i still haven't moved a single object < 1294635572 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, maybe like 5 objects < 1294635573 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyhow -> < 1294635576 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294635580 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should do that today < 1294635588 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good luck on the exam < 1294635592 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's possible i won't be here all day < 1294635594 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks < 1294635602 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently it's super hard < 1294635605 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294635608 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294635625 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :according to the guy who deduced how clue works from ski < 1294635685 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i'm sure i'll manage with 5 hours of sleep < 1294635732 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-> < 1294636073 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My new favorite game is Super PSTW < 1294636090 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we'll have to update shutup then < 1294636096 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION ducks < 1294636097 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION was joking < 1294636111 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has no idea what Super PSTW is anyhow < 1294636118 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/495903 < 1294636287 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-145-143.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294636478 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1294636684 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1294639175 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh no < 1294639180 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mercury < 1294639216 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Evil Planet < 1294639228 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or wait, uh uh < 1294639260 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_definitely_ time to update shutup < 1294639310 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, it will need to be provided with an AI capable of determining when I'm expressing an interest in something new. < 1294639335 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds plausible < 1294639512 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, this sounds like a lot of redundant typing that Haskell eliminates via the IO monad < 1294639520 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1294639547 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Mercury IO predicates manually take in and give back the state of the world] < 1294639582 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" < 1294639582 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Naming all these intermediate states quickly becomes tedious, so Mercury < 1294639582 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :provides us with syntactic sugar in the form of state variables" < 1294639583 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh good < 1294639829 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll look at it in more detail tomorrow < 1294639837 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just got confused by a line that looks backwards < 1294640042 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294640830 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1294641128 0 :TLUL!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :TLUL|rlybusy < 1294641194 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294642302 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1294642889 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294642900 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1294643110 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294643245 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quick! Everyone count to zero! < 1294643252 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Quick_Everyone_c < 1294643254 0 :Quick_Everyone_c!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1294643291 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at last a request we can fill < 1294643550 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't do it though. this isn't #irp < 1294643566 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes you did. < 1294643594 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you lie. < 1294643612 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :watch me count to zero again: < 1294643668 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> [1 .. 0] < 1294643668 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : [] < 1294643672 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294643691 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he didn't say to start counting at 1 < 1294643699 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most computer scientists start at zero < 1294643703 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the default duh < 1294643705 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that requires counting at least zero < 1294643737 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...you show me an average computer scientist who starts at zero when counting actual items < 1294643774 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he didn't ask anyone to count actual items < 1294643792 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop making up arbitrary situations where you're right and i'm not :P < 1294643802 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*MWAHAHAHA* < 1294643947 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, me, out of habit, on occasion < 1294643965 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*counting chairs to remember where I sit* 0, 1, 2, < 1294643967 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I SAID AVERAGE < 1294643981 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :supergeeks don't count < 1294644061 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have an annoying bug or something that is pissing me off. my microSD card unmounts always and only when i copy files to it < 1294644066 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION reads up on the no true computer scientist fallacy < 1294644073 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ lie < 1294644074 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :creating files on it is fine, copying files from it is fine. < 1294644098 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want to punt it but then i'd lose it...it's too small < 1294644123 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION suggests cat > < 1294644139 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries < 1294644297 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still fails and unmounts but takes longer in doing it < 1294644304 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1294644324 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about touch followed by cat >> ? < 1294644334 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(FOR SCIENCE!) < 1294644380 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :failed fast again < 1294644395 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does the size of the file copied matter? < 1294644396 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the touch worked though) < 1294644408 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i tried a pretty small one and it failed < 1294644414 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me try an uber small one < 1294644467 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alright, a 4byte file copies fine < 1294644534 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about a slow-speed write with something like perl -e 'open IN, "<:raw", "/input/file"; open OUT, ">:raw", "/output/file"; while (read IN, $data, 512) { print OUT $data; sleep 1; }' -- that's half a kilobyte per second. < 1294644595 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently half a kilobyte is too big < 1294644608 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that the block size? < 1294644612 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just tried to echo 10 lines of t's into a file and it failed < 1294644634 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what happens if you echo >> 10 times? < 1294644743 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it appears to fail as soon as the file reaches a certain (extremely small size) < 1294644749 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lemme try again slower < 1294644801 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm just wondering if it's absolute file size or just amount written in one go < 1294644850 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently if i wait long enough between appending 80 or so bytes at a time i can make big files < 1294644859 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294644878 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries the perl script with a 80 byte rate < 1294644880 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh so it's not enought to close in between, you have to wait? < 1294644891 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1294644903 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :echoing really quick in a row still breaks it < 1294644920 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could try echo + sync + echo + sync; though that sort of thing is probably going to wear out the card quicker. < 1294644931 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They have to always erase a full block when writing, after all. < 1294644968 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :odds are it's an issue with the card reader < 1294644983 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know the card is fine < 1294645215 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294645249 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294645294 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is now writing a file at 40 bytes/sec >_> < 1294645377 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now if this slow speed means it syncs so that it does that erase a full block everything thing... < 1294645400 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*everytime < 1294645404 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeahhhhhhhhhhh... < 1294645416 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just for science anyway < 1294645543 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What're you doing? < 1294645589 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :running fizzie's perl script < 1294645675 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: MINDLINK. I had committed-and-pushed a (very preliminary probably broken) //save command (which saves the so-far received block data, sans signs, furnaces and chests, into a hopefully Minecraft-compatible world-dir) about an hour before you had that feature request. < 1294645677 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION discovers r/inglip < 1294645720 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, HOW DARE YOU STEAL MY THOUGHTS BEFORE I EVEN THINK THEM < 1294645732 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it's any consolation, it probably doesn't work. < 1294645786 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders if he is witnessing the birth of a meme < 1294645815 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've only tried the resulting world with pynemap, and, well, http://zem.fi/~fis/pynemap.png -- there's a bit of it that's missing. < 1294645840 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also the lighting values are likely to be very worng. < 1294645866 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the heightmap I know is mirrored over the x=z line. < 1294645894 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The heightmap is used as a speedup for computing the final light values from block-light and skylight, or some-such.) < 1294645918 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, inglip? < 1294645975 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the perlscript expt failed < 1294645987 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://www.reddit.com/r/fffffffuuuuuuuuuuuu/comments/eybba/dark_captcha_magic/ < 1294645996 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, it's good enough for my plot to blow up Mt. Vorpal locally. < 1294646011 0 :azaq231!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294646031 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and of course http://www.reddit.com/r/Inglip/ < 1294646032 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You shouldn't say stuff like that before actually verifying whether it works in the actual game at all. < 1294646056 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, ah, it's Zalgo 2.0. < 1294646062 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I WILL < 1294646067 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: possibly < 1294646079 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm i guess that means it may have troubles competing < 1294646122 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zalgo does have something of a monopoly on the field of memetic Lovecraftian horrors. < 1294646399 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1294646400 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1294646521 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this Inglip seems a teeny bit reluctant though < 1294646544 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*this Inglip daemon < 1294646546 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1294646637 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I'll try out the saved world now... < 1294646730 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It is possible you may fall into your death. < 1294646768 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd have tried it myself, but I always get queasy when there are glitches in 3D-y games. < 1294646787 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I can confirm that it does indeed work. < 1294646800 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh no! Wait, what? Where's the "not" in that sentence? < 1294646801 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I spawned on Mt. Vorpal, and I saw the skyway in the distance. < 1294646833 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then what happened? < 1294646882 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The experience must've been so horrible, it robbed him of the power of speech. How tragic! < 1294646892 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, it even captured the front half of nailor's cabin. < 1294646897 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It looks a bit forlorn. < 1294646922 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How's the lighting? < 1294647015 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fine. < 1294647021 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Weird. < 1294647029 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I only explored the overground bits. < 1294647064 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At this point I just want to load hMod locally and give myself a load of TNT. < 1294647095 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can server-command-'give' yourself 64 blocks of TNT even without any hMods. < 1294647121 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The //save-enabled mcmap build will use 2.5 times as much memory as the normal version, which is a bit of a shame. I should possibly do the whole "persist far-away chunks to file" thing the usual client does; then there wouldn't be a separate //save, it'd be intemagrated. < 1294647182 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use mmap:ed memory for everything? :> < 1294647217 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yes, but I want to turn health off. < 1294647265 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: Just plain old data-structure dumps won't be combattible with the official client on-disk formats, unfortunately. < 1294647298 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, yeah... unless your memory format is compatible < 1294647426 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The NBT thing it uses is a bit uncomfortable to work with. < 1294647430 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and it needs to be gzipped. < 1294647682 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, screw that then :) but you can always build converters from your format to official-client format < 1294648906 0 :wth!~tianhou@122.82.35.128 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294649180 0 :wth!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294649868 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh. Dynamite disappears after a short time, and doesn't do anything when punched. < 1294649986 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only happens in some chunks. < 1294650751 0 :wth!~tianhou@122.82.35.128 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294650793 0 :wth!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294650815 0 :wth!~tianhou@122.82.35.128 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294650870 0 :wth!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294651098 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ilua < 1294651364 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, your house is next. < 1294651415 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just hope you don't get confused, accidentally connect to the real server, and then explode the *beep* out of it. < 1294651706 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I don't have 5 stacks of dynamite on the real server. < 1294651739 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, the amount of TNT I used on your house seems to have broken the world... < 1294651882 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So this is how the world ends. < 1294652249 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not with a bang but with a NullPointerException. < 1294652967 0 :quintopi1!~quintopia@209.59.220.33 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294653010 0 :quintopi1!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1294654841 0 :TLUL|rlybusy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, look at this: http://goo.gl/4yVWN < 1294654874 0 :TLUL|rlybusy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has ruined breakfast for some of you < 1294655090 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have HAD breakfast, fool! < 1294655150 0 :TLUL|rlybusy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's 5:30, fool < 1294655167 0 :TLUL|rlybusy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :europenub < 1294655401 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :12:30, more like. < 1294656030 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10:38! < 1294656203 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294656239 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@209-6-232-56.c3-0.sbo-ubr1.sbo.ma.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294656241 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294656241 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294656605 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, oh it saves now? excellent. < 1294656648 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems to sorta-work for some purposes, but it's all reasonably experimental still. < 1294656686 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, how does one enable this saving? < 1294656758 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's just a command to dump the currently-in-memory world into a directory. "//save" (which uses "world" in current dir), or "//save dir" if you want to specify where it goes. < 1294656786 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, also how comes that part of the --help output is localised to Swedish? < 1294656797 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's from glib. < 1294656799 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294656866 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm is it able to dump a larger area than that which the server lets you see at a single point in time? < 1294656921 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It dumps whatever you have seen during the "session". < 1294656930 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah nice < 1294657005 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll probably make it also load an existing dump and in general auto-persist the world on disk at some point, in order to reduce memory use for long-running game sessions where you wander around far and wide. < 1294657027 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Plus that way you'll have the map from the previous session as "background"; should probably shade it or something to indicate it may be out-of-date, though.) < 1294657053 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, might be a good idea to be able to turn off this tracking in case you don't want that memory overhead. Like when I play on my local test server. < 1294657098 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is currently no way for it to forget any chunks, but there probably should. < 1294657131 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, any way to tell when it finished saving? < 1294657138 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait, there it comes < 1294657145 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that took some time) < 1294657152 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it's suspiciously slow. < 1294657154 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, http://imgur.com/3Wjwh < 1294657184 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well it is your local copy. As long as it doesn't happen on the actual server. *shrug* < 1294657214 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has a feeling Vorpal wasn't supposed to have noticed that :D < 1294657224 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I did read scrollback :P < 1294657230 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have since corrupted the copy, though. < 1294657230 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1294657231 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, ^ < 1294657246 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hm? < 1294657274 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I used an insane amount of TNT on fizzie's place and it corrupted the world data after crashing the server. < 1294657287 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, ouch. < 1294657299 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, did you find fizzie's hidden chest by any chance? < 1294657319 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, another question: do signs and such things work? Chests? < 1294657327 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or do you get empty signs and chests? < 1294657331 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, no, although I did find two of yours. < 1294657338 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're empty, though. < 1294657355 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Although I still looked inside them on the actual server.) < 1294657406 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I don't care what you do with your local copy as long as you don't steal anything on the actual server and don't mess it up there either. < 1294657455 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, notice I have never messed up your place so far, so I assume you won't mess up mine. :) < 1294657481 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll be picking apart fizzie's house soon, though/ < 1294657493 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, not on the actual server I presume? < 1294657500 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Chests will be empty, and signs will be gone completely. < 1294657510 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also furnaces should disappear. < 1294657518 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(For some values of "should".) < 1294657525 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Possibly just their contents. < 1294657528 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe we need an extension like realms or similar. I hope we don't < 1294657534 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, they still exist. < 1294657540 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, then it's just their contents. < 1294657555 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what about crops? < 1294657561 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Those should be there. < 1294657574 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, but isn't the growth stored as aux data? < 1294657578 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you track that? < 1294657584 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, nowadays. < 1294657587 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294657604 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can compile-time disable that, though it will also disable //save. < 1294657611 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1294657765 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What will not be stored in the //save dump are Entities (mobs, items, paintings, vehicles, primed TNT and currently falling sand) and TileEntities (furnace and chest contents, signs, mob spawner details). < 1294657783 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, wait, paintings are entities!? < 1294657791 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that explains why they don't work on SMP < 1294657947 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, FWIW, test 2 of //save was far less positive. < 1294657955 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what happened? < 1294657962 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a jumbled mess of saved chunks and generated ones. < 1294657980 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, btw: any progress on the surface-and-heightmap corruption bug? < 1294657991 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, huh, did you save before everything loaded? < 1294658007 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dunno. I'll retry... < 1294658013 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Not really. I stared at it, but didn't figure it out. < 1294658026 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it's probably best to wait that the situation is "stable". < 1294658061 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The hashmap walk will probably fail in the middle of the save (silently, to boot) if it's modified (read: chunk-update for a so far unseen chunk) during the save. < 1294658145 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except that saving and updates are done by the same thread, so that shouldn't happen. < 1294658145 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, that must happen a lot since the save takes like 20-30 seconds? < 1294658147 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, I have a nice square area. < 1294658188 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Saved it, will start blowing stuff up. < 1294658215 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have fun in your local copy < 1294658270 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, remember that you only need 5000 TNT going off at once to blow up one obsidian! < 1294658328 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, to make sure they go off at once I suggest redstone wiring. Be sure to time them right when it comes to inverters (so every TNT have the same number of inverters on the path to it) < 1294658359 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however I'm not sure what this will do to the server < 1294658371 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, is door position saved btw? < 1294658376 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm. Some chunks have spawn-like protection on them. < 1294658394 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well, where is your local spawn then? < 1294658410 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, presumably the area around that spawn is protected < 1294658420 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That doesn't really explain it; some other chunks are unprotected. < 1294658427 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er, *protected. < 1294658431 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, huh < 1294658443 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, do you have admin rights on your local hmod server? < 1294658459 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, but again, that doesn't explain *why* they have the protection. < 1294658474 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I got another world-destroying NullPointerException. < 1294658478 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, any weird plugins? < 1294658492 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I assume you made a copy before starting the local server? < 1294658496 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if not do that for the next time < 1294658499 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The world spawn position may be set to something rather weird. < 1294658518 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, such as? < 1294658542 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it's supposed to be set to wherever you appeared first when connecting. < 1294658581 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I just took the first PLAYER_MOVE packet sent by the server.) < 1294658634 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm < 1294658635 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should probably take the last seen SPAWN_POSITION packet. (Currently I don't look at those at all.) < 1294658659 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though then it'd be the regular spawn, which might easily be outside the //save'd region. < 1294658667 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I think I found fizzie's secret chest. < 1294658668 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Possibly I could just use player position at //save time. < 1294658682 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: In the house or in the bunker? < 1294658690 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, in the house. < 1294658697 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then it's empty on the real server too. < 1294658705 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I detonated a TNT charge in it and I found a chest. < 1294658708 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :based on checking with the interactive map viewer minutor (rather good, and very quick and responsive) the dump I made worked fine < 1294658715 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TIME TO SEE HOW THE BUNKER HOLDS UP < 1294658767 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, the TNT room will hold up just fine. And in case of nuclear war I have always planned to block the door up with obsidian. (since steel door won't last for long against TNT) < 1294658804 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, does the server send the random seed to the client or? < 1294658812 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I just got into the bunker without even bothering with the doors. < 1294658822 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The storeroom is ridiculously easy to break into. < 1294658841 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, fizzie's bunker you mean? < 1294658842 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294658863 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it's like single block of stone and one layer of dirt. < 1294658867 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And yes, the random seed is sent. < 1294658890 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw it seems you can get bedrock holes again in recent versions < 1294658907 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know those underground lakes? And lava lakes at non-standard altitudes? < 1294658923 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I've heard you can get a lake over bedrock. < 1294658927 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they can result in holes in the bedrock when they end up at a suitable altitude for that < 1294658947 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Re the random seed, you'll of course get post-halloween map-generation even on blocks that would be pre-halloween on our server, if they don't end up in the //save-dump. < 1294659016 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't have mcmap when I started with the bunker, which sort-of explains why it's so near the surface. Didn't bother thinking about where I were inside the mountain. < 1294659035 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's also the reason the storage room is L-shaped; I was making it a long I-shaped one, but I hit the mountain wall. < 1294659058 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294659175 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, an idea for mcmap which would be cool but is not really high priority: ability to load an image and overlay it on terrain with, say, 25% alpha or such. Perfect when you are doing mega-engineering. Currently I did this with cartographer + gimp but cartographer takes ages. < 1294659220 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is also useful to check that you did indeed get it right between the point of planning it and it being finished. So you can check the dimensions halfway < 1294659281 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(still the map corruption bug is more important than that idea) < 1294659286 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(way more important) < 1294659405 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mhm, well, sure; that could be done. < 1294659426 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, found it. < 1294659434 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the cactus farm? < 1294659444 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well done. Though blabbing on-channel is a bit impolite! < 1294659460 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now someone will steal all my treasureres. < 1294659465 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THAT WAS A LIE I FOUND NOTHING < 1294659466 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, let me tell you that it would be a sanity saver when working on a 200x200 sized structure. :P And so would fixing the corruption bug when working on the upper parts of said structure < 1294659502 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, really it was quite easy to find it already with mcmap < 1294659531 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I had a hunch it was around there since some time when I had mcmap in mode 2 when visiting you and noticed a 1x2 black thing in the wall < 1294659916 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Death to the subtree! < 1294660012 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, for the hell of it, I'm going to send down a 5x5 raft of TNT. < 1294660024 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This will probably break the server. < 1294660024 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, raft? < 1294660115 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that's that. < 1294660407 0 :TLUL|rlybusy!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: *disappears in a puff of orange smoke* < 1294660496 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm is the area around spawn never unloaded on servers? < 1294660517 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if so that is the perfect place to place some redstone stuff that should run all the time < 1294660635 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"NOTE: This event is not suitable for undergraduate students". I wonder what sort of DIRTY PORNOGRAPHY they're going to show in this three-hour MathWorks-given "Programming Techniques to Speed up MATLAB/Parallel Computing with MATLAB/Symbolic Computing with MATLAB" seminar. < 1294660638 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What like? < 1294660727 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, you have a rather strange mind. Personally it seems perfectly innocent to me. Just meaning "this is too technical for that group" or such < 1294660777 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's no chance whatsover that a three-hour PR session is going to be "too technical" for undergraduates; there must be another reason. < 1294660796 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, PR? < 1294660827 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're not going to come here just out of a desire to be helpful. < 1294660838 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, are you going to go there? < 1294660864 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know. It's three hours I'd never get back; and ineiros attended the previous one and I think it was a bit "meh", IIRC. < 1294660878 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294660900 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On the other hand, there's a half-hour "Break", which might include free cookies. < 1294660969 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On the third hand, I didn't know people were actually doing symbolic stuff with MATLAB; that smells a bit desperate to me. < 1294661032 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently they've (MathWorks, that is) bought a symbolic algebra company and "integrated" their product as a MATLAB Toolbox now. (Well, now == 2008 in this case.) < 1294661038 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Cf. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MuPAD) < 1294661259 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294661273 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: They had some useful advice. < 1294661298 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, hi there < 1294661310 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Though you could get 85% of the information in 15 minutes by reading the slides they provided. < 1294661334 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gawds, I hate the parcel-tracking of the Finnish post office; it has a textfield which auto-empties itself whenever it gains focus. So if you have, say, a parcel ID code in another browser tab in a non-pasteable form, you have to either remember the whole 17-digit number, or transcribe it elsewhere first for pasting. (Because if you write down only part of it, it'll get erased when you switch back to the tab.) < 1294661556 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least it's just the front-page quick-link textfield that does it; the actual tracking-page field doesn't. < 1294661873 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, in a non-pastable form? < 1294661939 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, like an image? < 1294661941 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if so wtf < 1294661969 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. For some unfathomable reason, the "delivered via the web-e-post-system" hey-we-have-your-parcel notes are scan-like images of the ones they deliver on paper. < 1294662016 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess they're not really scans, since evince does manage to extract text from the "open as PDF" version. < 1294662037 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the thing shown in the web-system is a bona-fide image. < 1294662087 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess they are "imagey" because they want the bar code to appear properly, and there are form fields for signatures and whatever on it. < 1294662109 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, the PDF variants have the dubious distinction of being unprintable from Evince. < 1294662347 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294662367 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, evince respects copy protection? < 1294662369 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm surprised < 1294662383 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it just prints them... well, I'll take a photo. < 1294662391 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, garbled? < 1294662404 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, does it work in other pdf viewers, such as okular? < 1294662416 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It works with acroread. < 1294662419 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haven't tried others. < 1294662433 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had problems printing pdf on some computers but not on other ones < 1294662441 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It also shows up just fine on-screen in Evince, it's just the printout that turns out like http://users.ics.tkk.fi/htkallas/20110110_001.jpg (the red blocks are my own redactions). < 1294662459 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly from my desktop running arch, and it seems to have been related to a cups upgrade. < 1294662465 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it seems to work again now) < 1294662495 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah different type of garbling < 1294662497 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The barcode in the Evince print is correct, so theoretically speaking it might be that I could use that printout to claim the parcel; I've never bothered to try, though. < 1294662510 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, also I see some was *red*acted ;P < 1294662536 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That was just my name and address, and I'm not exactly sure why I bothered, since it's not especially difficult to find out. < 1294662540 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294662561 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, also the sender company's name. < 1294662666 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm. Must have been some dirty MathWorks thing then ;P < 1294662724 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You caught me: it was a package full of toolboxes. (Well no, not really.) < 1294663301 0 :cheater-!~cheater@e181131170.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294663372 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294664619 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294664693 0 :cheater-!~cheater@g230230230.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294664961 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, speaking of movecraft and chests: worldedit managed to move a chest with the //move command just fine. So probably isn't too hard < 1294665568 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a feeling that in these server-side inventory times, chest contents are only sent on-demand, so //save can't dump chest contents unless the player actually looks inside. < 1294665644 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably < 1294665792 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, btw if it helps: the map corruption bug doesn't happen only when placing blocks up high through the client. If you use worldedit to set a block at similar altitudes it also happens. So presumably related to chunk update rather than sending "place block here" kind of message < 1294665886 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been dumping the chunk-update/set-block/multi-set-block messages, but haven't figured it out yet. I think next thing I'll try (later, though) is to dump only those packets that actually cause map-visible changes. The server keeps sending all kinds of inconsequential block-set packets quite often. < 1294665898 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like setting empty blocks to air, or grass to grass, or leaves to leaves. < 1294665970 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Was it so that the topo-map also got corrupted? < 1294665994 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yes < 1294666025 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, haven't seen mode 2 or 3 get corrupted though < 1294666055 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, so maybe it is not a bug in how you handle the messages but in how you update the surface map? < 1294666063 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, probably. < 1294666092 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, tried valgrind? Otherwise I'll do it if you tell me how to make a debug build of mcmap < 1294666170 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least a short "okay, it got corrupted" test got no valgrind errors. But of course most of the memory around there is allocated as largeish blocks, and valgrind can't really notice if I just mess up indexing or something. < 1294666211 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, valgrind in memcheck mode won't tell if you enter another valid object < 1294666214 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, so hm < 1294666228 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, exp-ptrcheck or ptrcheck-exp or whatever it was called < 1294666232 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the --tool parameter < 1294666241 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(note: probably even slower than the default memcheck) < 1294666250 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that tracks pointers jumping between objects < 1294666256 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll check at home. < 1294666315 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The current surface-map update logic is approximately: if placing a block with type T and Y >= current topmost non-air block: set surface on that point to T and height to Y. Then if T was air: rescan from Y down to 0 to find the highest non-air block. Set surface map to that block, and height to that height. < 1294666339 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, also something I noticed is that the orientation of the player marker seems to lag behind when you rotate the view while in a boat < 1294666373 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mhm, yes, I don't think I track the "entity-look" packets at all. < 1294666375 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294666389 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well it does change, it just lags behind a bit < 1294666499 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm what happens if you try to teleport with mcmap while in a boat? < 1294666535 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really know how it sends looking-around while in a vehicle. For location once you've "attached" to a vehicle, it will send only (0, -999, 0) or some-such as the location; for the view direction it might be more complicated, since there's both the current boat-direction as well as the player view direction. < 1294666538 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea. < 1294666552 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps an "illegal move" and a blocked teleport. < 1294666560 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, -999, how strange < 1294666568 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it was some sort of a nonsense value. < 1294666613 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, that kind of "explains" that "placing block in the 999 bug z plane"-bug I read about recently though. For some very weird values of explains. < 1294666645 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what sort of packets the client sends when you're "driving" a boat, either. < 1294666663 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294666695 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The usual entity-move packets are all marked as server-to-client only. < 1294666743 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, in mcmap or in protocol docs? < 1294666756 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In protocol docs, though of course those aren't any more official. < 1294666915 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1294667465 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yeah exploring with mcmap made the system swap trash now < 1294667502 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, how did you say you disabled this at compile time? < 1294667521 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Comment out the FEAT_IFORGETTHENAME #define in config.h and rebuild. < 1294667527 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294667533 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FULLCHUNK or some-such. < 1294667563 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah there is only one there, not too hard to find < 1294667589 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The forthcoming "unload far-away chunks on disk" code will probably make it easy to also provide a (runtime) mode where it just forgets faraway blocks. They're always re-sent by the server for the client, anyway. < 1294667660 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Though the hash-map based chunk storage isn't the best one for a "which chunks are outside this box?" query.) < 1294668377 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm is it just me or were the pre-halloween seas much larger than the ones you get nowdays? < 1294668402 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't really looked at any large-scale maps. < 1294668531 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, there's a (custom) minecraft terrain generator that comes with a FUSE filesystem module; you can mount it into a "world" directory and that way get on-the-fly terrain generator inside an unmodified client. That's quite a clever (if weird) trick. < 1294668558 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not only weird, crazy < 1294668562 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, link to this? < 1294668571 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.nuke24.net/projects/TMCMG/ < 1294668578 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know about the quality of terrain it generates. < 1294668646 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294668753 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well the current terrain generator in beta have some issues with desert biome edges. Looks like blocks that contain both sand and grass ends up with wrong rotation. So that the edge blocks are rotated away from the desert. < 1294668760 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least it looks like that on a map < 1294668780 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I've wondered about the edges on the map too. < 1294669149 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, that's brilliant... < 1294669302 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, that site needs example screenshots from minecraft of the results of using it < 1294669328 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, it gets off due to being AWESOME < 1294669340 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hard to tell how awesome it is < 1294669391 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, uh, fuse is on the todo list? https://github.com/TOGoS/TMCMG/raw/master/doc/todo.txt < 1294669405 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It also exists already. < 1294669412 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294669421 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://github.com/TOGoS/TMCMG/raw/master/README "Using with GeneratorFS" < 1294669478 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: coordinates by any chance? < 1294669518 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: No coordinates for you! (That is, I don't really know what's causing the crash in the Windows version.) < 1294669534 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How does it fail for you, anyway? For me it just seems to go into a 100% CPU-wastage loop and hang up. < 1294669547 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, didn't it work when you used it last time and other people spoke? < 1294669816 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I'm going to try that terrain gen thing. < 1294669914 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Great, fuse requires root access. < 1294669980 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: timeout in mc, and the program just disconnects and crashes after a while afaiu < 1294669981 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*afair < 1294669987 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i could check at some point < 1294669996 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it worked for a while < 1294670012 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the bug can't just be that when people talk, it crashes < 1294670019 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's kinda important, maybe, fizzie < 1294670110 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it's a bit of a show-stopper, admittedly. < 1294670111 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" http://www.nuke24.net/projects/TMCMG/" " I don't know about the quality of terrain it generates." <<< it's a programming language, it generates what you ask < 1294670117 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but basically what you can do is < 1294670150 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have the perlin function, which is a pseudorandom function that gives you random constant size bumps, you can scale it, and gets big bumps and small bumps on top. < 1294670187 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and things like cutoffs for different kinds of terrains are easy to do as well, although it's one of the horriblest languages out there < 1294670193 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :made a couple levels for friends < 1294670210 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or one level for them, and a couple for myself, rather < 1294670227 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: i meant, knowing that may be important < 1294670283 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe the most retarded thing is that you actually have the 3d perlin function < 1294670295 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Great, fuse requires root access. <-- hm... so it does. But I thought only for the initial mount, and for the unmount. Not in between? < 1294670306 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can't actually say things like insert the 3d coordinates to perlin, and if it goes over cutoff, put diamond here < 1294670318 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you have to reimplement the whole 3d perlin idea by using 2d perlin < 1294670324 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least, i couldn't find a better way < 1294670356 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. Right, right. I'd try a debugger to see where it's hung up, but I don't quite know how to debug a wine-running executable. I'm sure it's somehow possible, though. < 1294670418 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also the "fractal" command is quite a letdown in tmcmg < 1294670423 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, testing it... < 1294670447 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just means you constant amount of levels of smaller and smaller grained bumps < 1294670459 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*you add together a constant < 1294670519 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless i misunderstood it, i never actually tried it because if i understood it correctly, it's pretty useless < 1294670571 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, how comes you know so much about TMCMG? < 1294670667 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know pretty much everything about it because i read the documentation so i could make a level with it < 1294670676 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the docs are like one page < 1294670691 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, did it work well in the end? < 1294670692 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can call the perlin function, and do basic math on the result. < 1294670719 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i just wanted a world mostly full of sand, so yeah i succeeded well enough :D < 1294670783 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there were also some oases < 1294670804 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i made a cutoff that added water and dirt < 1294670813 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the perlin function idea makes randomness very nice to handle < 1294670868 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because like water and dirt can just look for the same cutoff, and add themselves on different levels below sand level < 1294670886 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm nice worldedit has a //smooth command that you can use to patch up heightmap edges in the scenery. Mostly for the halloween ones. It seems to work decently when the difference in height is 0-20, but doesn't work very well if more than that. At least not when you only select like 10 blocks on each side of the border. (Tried it on artificial border since my local testing server doesn't have any pre-hal < 1294670886 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :loween scenery) < 1294670904 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, nice < 1294670950 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, so for a given x,y,z perlin always return the same value? < 1294670954 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294670973 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1294670980 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, any way to add a fourth parameter if you want to randomise different things for the same coord. < 1294670989 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can just add 10000 to the y coordinate to get another perlin function < 1294671012 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, hm < 1294671018 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you'll actually be using the 3d perlin function to get *heights* of ground at different x, z spots < 1294671033 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm I see < 1294671057 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know if that y+100000 thing was the author's idea originally, to me it seems kinda retarded that you can't just say "put sand where 3d perlin spikes" < 1294671064 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but instead < 1294671078 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to have put sand from 1 to perlin height < 1294671090 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, in certain cases the former is much better < 1294671094 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like in the case of resources < 1294671098 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294671103 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : so what PRNG algorithm is this perlin? < 1294671115 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a well-known algorithm i first heard about when i read that documentation < 1294671122 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, :D < 1294671125 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course, he doesn't say anything about the grain size < 1294671148 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a well-known algorithm I first heard about when I was looking at landscape generation ages ago. < 1294671155 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you have to trial and error that out, unless you know what the standard size is in perlin implementations (he surely didn't write the prng himself) < 1294671159 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(because he sucks) < 1294671166 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it does appear in things like procedural textures quite often. < 1294671182 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you know how it works? < 1294671199 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :take a random map of 0 and 1, and add smooth transitions? :P < 1294671202 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Y'know what would make SSP so much cooler? < 1294671204 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, you could check the source to find out what the grain size is < 1294671215 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The implementation [of simplex noise] used by TMCMG seems to have lower average amplitude than perlin noise, so you may want to multiply the output more to get a similar effect." -- yes, I don't think either one was written by the author here. < 1294671216 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it added the wreckage of a spaceship to your spawn point. < 1294671231 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, being less laggy is like 1000 times more important atm < 1294671234 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it's not necessarily easy to see there < 1294671242 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, true < 1294671244 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, it's not that laggy for me. < 1294671252 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, better cpu maybe < 1294671259 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: was that from the tbtmbmtmbtmb page? < 1294671284 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: From it's readme, yes. < 1294671314 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, SMP works fine but in SSP it stutters a lot. And no it isn't low FPS as such, but seemingly random delays a few times every second. Between the FPS seems decent < 1294671348 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that comment is a bit ridiculous, since you'll have to adjust your intuition on what perlin looks like to fit the mc scale anyway < 1294671374 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless he means the hills are actually different shape or something, in which case multiplication doesn't help < 1294671382 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh hmm < 1294671447 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, that is for simplex. He is just comparing perlin to simplex? < 1294671468 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. But it sounds like both implementations come mostly-cribbed from some external source. < 1294671475 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1294671501 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-9-252.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294671503 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can tell by the programming language that he either doesn't have a very firm grip on what he's doing, or the project was a really really quick hack < 1294671509 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the idea of that program is good but the implementation seems poor. I guess it is a perfect fit for minecraft then < 1294671516 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1294671559 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the language is just silly, or, well, tell me if you like the way argument passing is handled, in my opinion it was really annoying to use < 1294671620 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wikipedia on perlin noise: "The function has a pseudo-random appearance, yet all of its visual details are the same size (see image)." <-- the image doesn't explain what it means here. Exactly what is a "visual detail" and how do you measure it. < 1294671648 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :look at the image < 1294671663 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i doubt there's a definition that makes it more clear than that < 1294671679 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, do you mean the width of the white parts such? < 1294671698 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294671700 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is approximately the same it seems. < 1294671705 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294671721 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not white noise, it's a desert < 1294671727 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1294671743 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, uh does "desert" have some technical meaning in this context? < 1294671750 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294671753 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294671756 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just a desert. not really the best possible way to put it. < 1294671764 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because < 1294671778 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :deserts have waves, not bumps < 1294671847 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294671901 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, deserts can have that but there are different types. Stony ones for example. < 1294672061 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, surely it's clear what visual details means here. < 1294672074 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, but is it rigorous? < 1294672094 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, you could formulate it in terms of self-similarity. < 1294672122 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hm. That might work yes < 1294672384 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would formulate it based on some sort of second order differential, how fast, on average, the slope is changing < 1294672395 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno what you mean by self-similarity < 1294672415 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294672463 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slope change + average i suppose < 1294672486 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, dunno if that works, it's a characteristic but maybe not really sufficient < 1294672527 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, I assumed he meant to define it by the fractal nature of it somehow- < 1294672552 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has fractal nature? < 1294672567 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, hm maybe not. < 1294672571 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your way sounds better < 1294672573 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't that exactly what it doesn't have < 1294672582 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294672594 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because if you look at it from further away, it will look *different*, bumps are smaller < 1294672605 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh good point < 1294672626 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, so define it by the lack of fractal nature? < 1294672631 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294672633 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe, maybe < 1294672698 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : it has fractal nature? ← that's my point, there's no fractalness. < 1294672700 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just "fractal nature" and fractals in general make my "meaningless bullshit" sensor tick, sort like turing completeness, heard one meaning less too many < 1294672706 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ah < 1294672709 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what Vorpal said < 1294672717 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can't make it look the same by scaling up or down. < 1294672767 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, but since it is PRNG won't it eventually cycle? Given a large enough region. < 1294672792 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :first of all a prng doesn't have to cycle even if it's just a function from integers < 1294672801 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :second of all, no < 1294672829 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294672845 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least not in a sense that would mean grains appear again < 1294672855 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :say when you zoom < 1294672872 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294672907 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, however I guess it might when expanding to a larger region being generated at the same zoom level. < 1294672910 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :secret maryo is fun < 1294672926 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is true is that if you hold a constant size slot of bits B, compute some random value, and recompute the contents of B to get a new seed, then certainly the random values will cycle < 1294672941 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: might, doesn't have to tho < 1294672980 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohm < 1294672982 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm* < 1294672984 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could increase state as it moves further, and do more complicated computation < 1294672984 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1294673012 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :helloklopol < 1294673022 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if nth bit can be computed in O(1) after computing the n-1 first ones, then it'll eventually cycle, i think < 1294673034 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not sure if that's amortized < 1294673048 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really i'm so tired i might be spouting complete bullshit here. < 1294673055 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater-: helloes. < 1294673070 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*not sure that's true if the O(1) is amortized < 1294673075 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes < 1294673086 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not even true if it's not amortized, actually < 1294673095 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance you could have it print 01001000100001 etc < 1294673101 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: http://www.secretmaryo.org/index.php?page=game_downloads < 1294673102 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or a similar sequence < 1294673105 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by moving a marker < 1294673123 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that constant sequence is not very random, but at least my theorem is not true < 1294673142 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yeah, spouting bullshit here, you may just as well ignore me till tomorrow < 1294673157 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294673159 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the usual situation :D < 1294673168 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294673175 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm rarely wrong < 1294673191 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no i mean the "ignore until tomorrow" < 1294673195 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j/k :3 < 1294673200 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater-: what's that? < 1294673207 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why did you give it to *me*? < 1294673215 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you were in the blasting radius < 1294673220 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater-: i was just kidding too, i'm very often wrong < 1294673229 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: not true! you're always right. < 1294673239 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck you man < 1294673245 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's hurtful < 1294673277 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gah where's oerjan < 1294673281 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wanna talk to him about semigrops < 1294673283 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*groups < 1294673295 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right, i told him i would, so he's probably in a bunker somewhere < 1294673469 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is there to discuss about semigroups? < 1294673488 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have all of the things to say about semigroups not already been said? < 1294673519 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294673523 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly! < 1294673597 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc at least one of the branches of the current theory is about a very special case of inverse semigroups, which are exactly semigroups of partial injective functions < 1294673604 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*exactly the < 1294673648 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should know what that special case was < 1294673663 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but anyway it's a reeeeeally beautiful theory < 1294673670 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :inverse semigroups are much sexier than groups < 1294673688 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(they are a superset of groups tho) < 1294673709 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, out of curiosity, what exactly is a semigroup? < 1294673720 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a set and an operation < 1294673724 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :set is closed under the op < 1294673724 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and < 1294673728 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :associativity < 1294673731 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is present < 1294673737 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, isn't that what a group is? (set + operation)? < 1294673750 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :associativity means (a*b)*c = a*(b*c) < 1294673761 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know what associativity is in general yes. < 1294673790 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: groups always have inverses, and they always have an identity element < 1294673797 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294673806 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a semigroup with identity but not necessarily inverses is a monoid < 1294673837 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, "not necessarily" as in "some members of the set might have inverses"? < 1294673860 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294673864 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not forbidden < 1294673873 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus groups are monoids < 1294673878 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and monoids are semigroups < 1294673882 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294673916 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't get "semigroup". < 1294673926 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's more of a third of a group, not half a group. < 1294673928 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just a name < 1294673937 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An INACCURATE one! < 1294673938 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294673962 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a weird name, i didn't like it at first, but now it's just a name to me < 1294674024 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: regular semigroups on the other hand have inverses (with a different definition), but not necessarily an identity element < 1294674030 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, would the set of all nxn matrices for a given constant n and the operation matrix multiplication be a semi-group? < 1294674041 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in fact if they have an identity, they are just groups) < 1294674047 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or monid even I guess) < 1294674055 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294674061 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :monoid, but not a group < 1294674071 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not a group? < 1294674074 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, oh, so it's two thirds of a group. < 1294674077 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(homework) < 1294674078 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, well obviously not a group indeed. Not all elements have inverses < 1294674085 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, *that* bit is trivial :P < 1294674088 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: no monoid is 2/3 isn't it? < 1294674114 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: what is not trivial then? the fact that matrix multiplication is associative is pretty obvious if you think of them as linear transformations < 1294674116 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, *regular* semigroups. < 1294674129 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, how do you have inverses without an identity? < 1294674130 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh sorry < 1294674137 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, well, I was just wondering if there was some other snag. < 1294674142 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: x's inverse is a y such that x = xyx < 1294674184 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe it's not strictly obvious that it's associative even if you think about them as linear transformations, but anyhow everyone knows that! < 1294674200 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, but not such that forall y, x*x^-1*y = y? < 1294674200 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, hm x = xyx doesn't imply y = yxy in such a case I guess? < 1294674219 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: inverse semigroups are when you assume a *unique* x^-1 such that x and x^-1 are each other's inverses < 1294674255 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it doesn't, necessarily, although you can prove that in a regular semigroup, all elements x have a pair y such that x = xyx, y = yxy < 1294674291 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, what property guarantees that? < 1294674295 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, if x = xyx, then x = xyx = x.yxy.x, and yxy.x.yxy = yxy, so yxy is such a pair < 1294674304 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: my proof guarantees it < 1294674322 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can clarify if you're not used to following that kind of stuff < 1294674338 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well maybe that's easy to read < 1294674339 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, what is the . there in that notation < 1294674345 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh just an explicit * < 1294674349 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* was harder to write < 1294674350 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294674350 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294674351 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294674363 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294674386 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, you need to drop associativity for that to no longer work I guess < 1294674408 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah associativity is very crucial, because it allows rewriting strings context-freely < 1294674411 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294674417 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean context sensitively < 1294674420 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the sense that < 1294674436 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can rewrite something, and then use parts of it in another rewrite < 1294674437 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like < 1294674478 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like? < 1294674498 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in xyx = x.yxy.x, i rewrite the x.y.x to x.y.xyx, but then i split the result in a different way to obtain x.yxy.x < 1294674499 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294674504 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, well yes < 1294674514 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, I never disputed this < 1294674521 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not a very good example because i don't actually use that new decomposition for anything, but that was all i had < 1294674537 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: just trying to make it clear what i mean < 1294674554 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because IT WAS SOOOOOOO COMPLEX < 1294674582 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, not really no < 1294674592 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, it was clear once you said what you meant by . :P < 1294674633 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, when i said why associativity is crucial, i wasn't talking about that example, but proving things for semigroups in general < 1294674649 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, oh okay < 1294674722 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so a semilattice is a semigroup such that all its elements are idempotent x^2 = x, and its elements commute, xy = yx; let S be an inverse semigroup, let us prove its idempotents form a semilattice under the semigroup operation < 1294674729 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let e, f be two idempotents < 1294674737 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :consider the unique inverse x of ef < 1294674752 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1294674763 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ef = efxef = ef.xe.ef = ef.fe.ef by the fact e and f are idempotent < 1294674764 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, err can't say I'm very familiar with lattices < 1294674777 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:00:25 according to the guy who deduced how clue works from ski < 1294674777 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how < 1294674790 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also xe.ef.xe = x.ef.xe = xe because x is the inverse of ef < 1294674810 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :similarly, fx.ef.fx = fx < 1294674821 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294674840 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now, xx = xe.fx = x because x is ef's inverse => x is an idempotent < 1294674859 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if x is an idempotent, then x^3 = x, and so x is its own unique inverse, which must mean x = ef! < 1294674870 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :therefore, the product of two idempotents is idempotent < 1294674876 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now, let's prove commutativity < 1294674900 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, so what is a lattice then? (And isn't that word used for different things in different areas of mathematics) < 1294674905 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ef and fe are idempotent by what we already proved, ef.fe.ef = ef.ef = ef by the fact e and f are idempotents < 1294674911 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :similarly, fe.ef.fe = fe < 1294674918 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so ef and fe are each other's unique inverses < 1294674925 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but again, they are also their own inverses => ef = fe < 1294674927 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :w.e.d. < 1294674928 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*q.e.d. < 1294674932 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294674948 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: not completely, he knew the basic idea. < 1294674952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: wtf happened to your throne room < 1294674960 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, something happened to it? < 1294674966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Blown up. < 1294674966 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you don't have to be familiar with lattices, since i was talking about semilattices :D < 1294674971 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i defined them! < 1294675012 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a lattice is something more complicated, if you remember what boolean algebras were (the abstract axiom-based definition), lattices are boolean algebras with a few less axioms. < 1294675017 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'll check soon. Minecraft.net seems down. But then I suspect PH. He talked about doing it in a local copy saved with mcmap (it has that feature now) but if he did it on the server then fuck him. < 1294675038 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically, there isn't necessarily a "0" or "1", and there is no complementation < 1294675047 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just union and intersection < 1294675088 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that have to satisfy a series of axioms, they don't actually have to be unions or intersections on a set though, just arbitrary binary ops that satisfy the axioms) < 1294675090 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow the lag < 1294675123 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not blown up? < 1294675134 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyhow that's one of my favorite proofs, why aren't you more excited :( < 1294675159 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have to wait for oerjan < 1294675162 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, yeah, I was just playing a trick on him. < 1294675162 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, hm < 1294675170 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, oh elliott? < 1294675171 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hah < 1294675178 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Actually I knew. < 1294675183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just wanted to see if you'd freak < 1294675185 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*freak. < 1294675213 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hardly more than you would if told that the cube was blown up (once done). You would probably also go online to check :P < 1294675270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, I'd go online and immediately destroy Mount Vorpal, most likely. < 1294675276 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also everyone knows elliott is a crazy mythomaniac < 1294675277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOTE TO PEOPLE WHO WANT TO BLOW UP THE CUBE: probably a bad idea. < 1294675301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so anyway i designed cled in the logs < 1294675307 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why on earth. It could have been nailor. < 1294675317 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :too UNINTERESTING; didn't read < 1294675332 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and I wouldn't blow it up. I'm not like you. < 1294675350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's more like an incentive for everyone because they'd have to listen to you scream if it happened < 1294675353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: So how fucked up is the lighting? < 1294675353 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nailor's door was locked :( < 1294675363 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not very, < 1294675368 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not at all, in fact. < 1294675381 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why would it be? < 1294675402 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie said they were. < 1294675406 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: No, I'd go online and immediately destroy Mount Vorpal, most likely. ← did that on the local copy. < 1294675420 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I ended up corrupting the world file due to Notch-quality engineering. < 1294675422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294675458 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also blew up the wooden house. < 1294675466 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, the charge in that was what broke it. < 1294675490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :02:56:45 I'll probably make it also load an existing dump and in general auto-persist the world on disk at some point, in order to reduce memory use for long-running game sessions where you wander around far and wide. < 1294675492 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294675500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Do it the sane way; just use mmap and let the OS handle it for you. < 1294675522 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you realise that isn't sane when there is a shitload of small files? < 1294675531 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as opposed to a number of large ones < 1294675542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Umm, he should store them in one file and then convert for //save, duh. < 1294675548 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No reason to be as stupidly-architectured as the client. < 1294675551 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, many files are smaller than the page size. Besides they are gzip compressed. < 1294675561 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And mcmap's internal data structures are different to MC's internal ones. < 1294675567 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, still, do you suggest storing them uncompressed? < 1294675571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1294675575 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that would be huge. < 1294675582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just for what you've seen in the current session... < 1294675602 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no? < 1294675608 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it is. < 1294675609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See logs. < 1294675623 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it sounds like it would be able to load dumps when starting? < 1294675636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, and? < 1294675647 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meaning they would be between sessions < 1294675715 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, to get something like Slate working on Windows, would I compile using Cygwin, or MinGW? < 1294675722 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION barely knows the difference < 1294675738 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: mcmap -c on OS X gives me unloaded chunks all around my current location. < 1294675742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: try mingw first. < 1294675748 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, ty < 1294675756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: or just use linux, it's unlikely to work on win. < 1294675825 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Dude, is it totally broken for everyone else? < 1294676080 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294676171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: to build debug mcmap, make debug=1 < 1294676191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294676194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make clean; make debug=1 < 1294676228 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294676236 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294676242 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I guess the symlink at ./mcmap will no longer work? < 1294676259 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I refuse to answer that yourself since you can figure it out in 3 seconds. < 1294676267 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, do you know Mercury? < 1294676268 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, separating normal and debug builds is a good thing. < 1294676271 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, you don't need to clean. < 1294676275 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make debug=1 will put it in _debug. < 1294676281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you can keep your current build. < 1294676281 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes it is a good idea to separate them < 1294676748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so oklopol < 1294676750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cled < 1294676751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :best or best < 1294677176 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1294678461 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: if you still come back, wanna tell me if i'm on your map? < 1294678490 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't go *that* far, and i was thinking settling down < 1294678521 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, where'd you go? < 1294678533 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'm blowing up the spawn area right now.) < 1294678540 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to a random place < 1294678558 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're blowing it up locally or what? < 1294678563 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1294678591 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just checking, not a good time building a home if you're abandoning the world or something < 1294678638 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: cleddy cled < 1294678644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also oklopol building a house? weird < 1294678654 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"house" < 1294678720 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001f5b00390f-CM001e6b2335dc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294678811 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1294678813 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so, i heard i was trying to disprove clue works at all < 1294678834 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott told you or what? < 1294678847 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i sometimes do things without knowing. i'm sorry if you felt bad about my sleepwalking argumentative self < 1294678853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ? < 1294678855 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, apparently i have < 1294678873 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't feel bad about anything < 1294678876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION compiles a few clue programs < 1294678884 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shit, you're right, it actually just spews out python errors :D < 1294678894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ python repl.py qsort.clue < 1294678897 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god what is this < 1294678898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ < 1294678925 0 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1294679305 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: omg cled is actually working :D < 1294679344 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: http://i.imgur.com/M27fK.png < 1294679352 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: this is a graphical representation of {. 0 1 -> 1 . 0 5 -> 5 } < 1294679363 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can even move about and ascend and descend the tree and everything < 1294679377 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No more comma? < 1294679385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: that was removed a while ago < 1294679390 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh < 1294679399 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also i can press cmd+s and it prints the tree < 1294679402 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nicely-formatted and all < 1294679431 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't get why i had the comma, i never have those in my languages < 1294679479 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: dude http://i.imgur.com/M27fK.png < 1294679484 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOOK AT THE BEAUTIFUL UGLY? < 1294679490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like aardappel < 1294679491 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except clue < 1294679530 0 :cheater00!~cheater@e181140250.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294679560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: in fact it's very similar to aardappel, since in aardappel you name func params with example values :P < 1294679563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue just does it PROPERLY < 1294679633 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294679722 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION blinks < 1294679742 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I saw ---> as a solid arrow and was wondering how it would be typed in a real program < 1294679800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: With cled, -> IS a solid arrow! http://i.imgur.com/M27fK.png < 1294679826 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is talking about Mercury < 1294679838 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: Inferior to cled. < 1294679924 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, was just thinking that < 1294679940 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, still want me to help you on the server? < 1294679953 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: was just thinking what < 1294679968 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aardappel has a property clue has, and you're making an editor that looks like a non-ugly version of the aardappel editod < 1294679971 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*editor < 1294679997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i wouldn't exactly call that screenshot non-ugly, but at least it doesn't have stupid pictures everywhere :) < 1294680002 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: i have forgotten all context < 1294680003 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also you can't really edit aardappel with the keyboard < 1294680004 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294680006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas all of this is keyboard-based < 1294680016 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, you were lost? < 1294680017 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :want you to help me, that i do yes, if you log in, check if i'm on your map < 1294680021 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no not really < 1294680026 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: in fact I think that editing with this will take quite a bit fewer keystrokes than editing wtih a file < 1294680100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i gotta say something though < 1294680109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: why can't you have zero-arg functions in clue < 1294680110 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's totally nonelegant < 1294680119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just a parser bug? < 1294680131 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\" (had the database < 1294680131 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :community known about maybe types they never would have invented NULLs < 1294680131 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and wrecked the relational model. . . " < 1294680133 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294680139 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just didn't want zero arg functions < 1294680140 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: why not < 1294680156 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meh: GLib-GIO:ERROR:gsocket.c:2347:remove_condition_watch: assertion failed: (g_list_find (socket->priv->requested_conditions, condition) != NULL) < 1294680163 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you can't define _ in clue, that's not very elegant :) < 1294680165 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because they are completely useless, and {. -> 3 } looks wrong < 1294680178 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so useless that you defined one as a primitive < 1294680186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294680196 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that used to be useful < 1294680200 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ok well... why can't you return multiple values < 1294680205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be more symmetrical < 1294680205 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it will be again, when i add higher-order funcs < 1294680215 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should definitely be able to return multiple values < 1294680220 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294680228 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's even more important than multiparam < 1294680232 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since < 1294680240 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :multiparam is more dangerous < 1294680243 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for explosions < 1294680249 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what would f(multiple value returner(x)) do < 1294680265 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in clue, you don't have to think about that < 1294680278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well right < 1294680280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm just asking < 1294680288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably None or whatever < 1294680291 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the code gen would arrange for like < 1294680297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :multiple value returner@2(x) < 1294680298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to get the third arg < 1294680300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(@0 for first) < 1294680313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: now what i'd really like to be possible < 1294680316 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is {. -> } < 1294680320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zero inputs, zero outputs < 1294680323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you wanna know why? < 1294680327 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1294680331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: as it is, currently, in cled, the program is not always a valid ast < 1294680342 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: when you create an example, it creates two Hole objects (or, well, it will when i code that) < 1294680345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one arg, one result < 1294680348 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :these can't be serialised to value clue < 1294680354 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're just so that you can enter them, specify what type they are < 1294680356 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then specify a value < 1294680365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you could have N inputs and N outputs, it could just have two empty input and output lists < 1294680369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you'd add them at your leisure < 1294680379 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the tree would always be a valid clue tree < 1294680443 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294680467 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zero inputs and outputs would work just fine if "side-effects" are ever added, which i might just do at some point, not the binary output stream approach tho < 1294680486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ew no side-effects, that's so lame < 1294680495 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really < 1294680496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but uh, basically a function with zero outputs would never be called I think < 1294680498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as part of a generated program < 1294680510 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you can only call a function as (func@(result number)(params)) < 1294680514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and since result numbers start at 0 < 1294680518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no valid number for a zero-output function < 1294680523 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the point is, it'd make cled more elegant :) < 1294680532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since having the tree in an invalid state is just lame < 1294680542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could have you specify the inputs and outputs before it let you do anything else, but that feels annoyingly restricting < 1294680544 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could be called, it's output just wouldn't be numbered < 1294680545 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294680553 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the current implementation, no, it wouldn't be called < 1294680559 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is what you meant < 1294680568 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so ignore what i said < 1294680602 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well the way i see it is the simplest way to impl it would be to turn every func call from < 1294680605 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :name (params) < 1294680605 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :into < 1294680612 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :name @resultnum (params) < 1294680617 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ok, if you didn't feel bad, but elliott has given me shit already, maybe i should start talking shit about clue, just to cash in my debt ;p < 1294680624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that way you can't have f(multiple args(foo)), it's always f(multiple args@0(foo)) or @1 etc < 1294680627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*etc. < 1294680630 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: works for me < 1294680631 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294680636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so since 0 is first result, for a zero input function, there is no valid @ number < 1294680640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it'd never be calle < 1294680641 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :d < 1294680648 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: clue is php < 1294680672 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: worse, clue is c++ < 1294680679 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay that's enough kthx < 1294680687 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOEUGH < 1294680690 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ENOUGHEONUGENOUGHEOUGNEOUGHE < 1294680700 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what < 1294680700 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CAN'T TAKEA IRTSARJTIJIT < 1294680702 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1294680709 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1294680711 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh? < 1294680716 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1294680717 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh? < 1294680721 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1294680722 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :excuse me? < 1294680729 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i beg your pardon? < 1294680731 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry? < 1294680733 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :que? < 1294680736 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nani? < 1294680740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fag < 1294680748 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott broke it < 1294680753 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's such a spoil sport < 1294680755 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION works on a new language < 1294680759 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no i thought that was a good ending < 1294680769 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so uh got any suggestions for cled that don't involve holes < 1294680770 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean < 1294680774 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: nope! < 1294680776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could be that if you + to add an example < 1294680779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to say e.g. < 1294680781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :li < 1294680783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meaning "list to integer" < 1294680783 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just play minecraft and be a happy! < 1294680784 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but eugh < 1294680787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so lame < 1294680796 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so um is clue abandoned :p < 1294680816 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perl is a general purpose language. It's also known to be the only widespread use obfuscated language. < 1294680818 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lulz < 1294680826 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so do u vant to normalize clue? < 1294680846 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001f5b00390f-CM001e6b2335dc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294680848 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think clue could actually lift off really well, there's nothing else that does what clue does < 1294680850 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no < 1294680859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's funny, this channel has only been witness to "perl is esolang" sentiments about 1000000 times :D < 1294680863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yay < 1294680864 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: it could totally become mainstream! < 1294680880 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and with the current extreme TDD approach and python lifting off it could make me famous < 1294680880 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i'm not working on it today, no < 1294680883 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you too maybe < 1294680884 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly this week < 1294680889 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that is on the wiki < 1294680892 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the idea is to come up with a spec < 1294680895 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes sense < 1294680903 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gnar, I don't get why the Win build fails; it is as if it just decides to close the connection. < 1294680906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think some random anon added it and nobody bothered to remove it. < 1294680917 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it should be kept - tis true < 1294680922 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I don't suppose you see any sort of "GLib-GIO" error message on your end when it goes? < 1294680925 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'tisn't, not really < 1294680934 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :odd, sure < 1294680947 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but esoteric shouldn't be applied to every language just because people think it's weird. < 1294680948 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: doesn't ring a bell < 1294680965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol @ cheater00 thinking clue is practical < 1294680967 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I get one, but I don't know, it might be just a side-effect of the connection disconnectering. < 1294680979 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey clue is TOTALLY practical < 1294680987 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :totally < 1294681019 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1294681029 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294681033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you have to swear now to always use cled for everything < 1294681034 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i believe it could become a practical language < 1294681039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: it really couldn't :) < 1294681040 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and/or framework for existing languages < 1294681047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems like it could, before you figure out how it actually works. < 1294681049 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it could as well < 1294681063 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294681063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh oklopol, you so zany < 1294681066 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: let's ignore the torl < 1294681067 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for certain values of practical < 1294681072 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what should I call my random chance language ? < 1294681079 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i feel it's a fairly new paradigm < 1294681092 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"the torl"? < 1294681100 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think in fact what you got right now - the language in itself - is just very basic < 1294681108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, it's a new paradigm because it's amazingly stupid ... in that puttign it into practice is nearly impossible < 1294681109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*putting it < 1294681120 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's how retarded people pronounce troll. < 1294681137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fitting < 1294681154 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think you could have multiple very languages very distant from eachother, derived from clue, just using different inference methods < 1294681176 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: because those inference methods are actually what defines clue < 1294681188 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: hence i was talking about defining your own inference methods < 1294681236 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think clue is a bit near to the automatic prover territory, isn't it? < 1294681286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: not raelly. < 1294681287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*really. < 1294681298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: also example-based programming isn't really a HUGE NEW IDEA < 1294681305 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by saying < 1294681310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"omg different inference engines" < 1294681311 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're saying < 1294681319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"chuck out all of the current work on clue and keep the obvious core idea!" < 1294681324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is stupid because the work was the hard part < 1294681357 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shush < 1294681370 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: um what i'm saying is perfectly true < 1294681378 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. shush. < 1294681434 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :business in my pants < 1294681447 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: that's where the business always is. < 1294681450 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how's THAT for a slogan? < 1294681491 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm gonna go make some breakfast and watch the ballet dancers next door < 1294681540 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :take pix k < 1294681544 0 :pumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294681604 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1294681943 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's illegal < 1294681967 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :take mental pix < 1294682006 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :done < 1294682018 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with my mental-undress-ray < 1294682150 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, don't encourage him. < 1294682168 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to do what, send me pictures of ballet dancers? < 1294682176 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, to be cheater. < 1294682198 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ignore him and we'll all be much happier. < 1294682205 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if someone was encouraging me to be oklopol (elliott), i would be really pleased < 1294682225 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: be oklopol < 1294682237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: be oklopol < 1294682239 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: be oklopol < 1294682241 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: be oklopol < 1294682243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: be oklopol < 1294682246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clog: be oklopol < 1294682251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: be oklopol < 1294682254 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, don't tell fizzie to be oklopol! < 1294682268 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If fizzie is oklopol, who will be fizzie? < 1294682271 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, be fizzie. < 1294682284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294682287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we don't need fizzie < 1294682289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we just need more oklopol < 1294682298 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1294682308 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But there will be wars over interior decoration! < 1294682320 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Processing... ... ... Error 49123: Mutant produced. Details: Now Vorpol. < 1294682336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that like Vorpal but intelligent? < 1294682347 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wouldn't want to be someone who has "toilet" as part of their name < 1294682348 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it is like the most extreme sides of me and oklopol < 1294682374 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294682379 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So incredibly stupid and irritating and awesome and intelligent? < 1294682381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: What have you done < 1294682392 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it was you who did it < 1294682408 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I blame Vorpal < 1294682412 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahaha vorpol luuuuv it < 1294682414 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I blame you < 1294682461 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl food < 1294682486 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: http://dict.leo.org/ende?lp=ende&lang=de&searchLoc=0&cmpType=relaxed§Hdr=on&spellToler=&search=klo < 1294682568 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know that word, yes < 1294682587 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's funny because < 1294682590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol has "lo" in his name < 1294682593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so obviously he's low < 1294682594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BROW < 1294682595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :low-brow < 1294682599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowbrowpol < 1294682612 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and obviously i'm input and output < 1294682613 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ell IO tt < 1294682623 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal is clearly everyone's PAL < 1294682625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also into VORe < 1294682630 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really i could just go back to playing locally, you guys are never here < 1294682634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow this is like reading tea leaves but better < 1294682641 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i was on but then you DIDN'T LET ME VISIT < 1294682650 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, in fact I'm into VORs since I'm into flightsims :P < 1294682652 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well obviously i don't want to see any of you < 1294682654 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: and i eat ch's? < 1294682672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: no, you're che guevara < 1294682673 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it's a type of omnidirectional navigational beacon. < 1294682674 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously < 1294682681 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes. right. sure. < 1294682681 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1294682698 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What about MEEEEEE < 1294682709 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and you move impure IO (ellIOtt) < 1294682722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :18:03 elliott: and obviously i'm input and output < 1294682722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :18:03 elliott: ell IO tt < 1294682728 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh missed that < 1294682729 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: you're j. edgar hoover < 1294682730 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You're an ant named Tom. < 1294682746 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, which is over something < 1294682763 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i think you're offtopic < 1294682768 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elli OT t < 1294682773 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1294682782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: I think you're gender-neutral < 1294682783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ch E ater00 < 1294682784 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that explains the channel < 1294682785 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also a fan of Spivak < 1294682794 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuckin science < 1294682796 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#esoteric OT there < 1294682799 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so off topic < 1294682802 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it all fits < 1294682807 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also you drive an audi TT < 1294682811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :E's OT, Eric. < 1294682812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :translation < 1294682816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He or she is off-topic, Eric. < 1294682821 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only remaining question is < 1294682822 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, no, he is a news agency < 1294682824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHO IS ERIC < 1294682830 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, (TT is a Swedish news agency) < 1294682835 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :excuse me < 1294682838 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just decoded #esoteric < 1294682840 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can we science please < 1294682848 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I said it was OT in it yes < 1294682848 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl < 1294682852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294682855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i decoded the whole thing < 1294682859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#esoteric -> E's OT, Eric. < 1294682859 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it's about Eric the Esot < 1294682863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He or she's off-topic, Eric. < 1294682867 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this fits #esoteric < 1294682868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously < 1294682869 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this channel is about Eric the Esot < 1294682870 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so who's Eric???? < 1294682872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe oklopol is Eric < 1294682874 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the esot. < 1294682920 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, what was your name again? < 1294682933 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :klo < 1294682936 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :toilet. < 1294682939 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's also an OPO < 1294682948 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which makes no sense because there's nothing named OPO < 1294682989 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i broke it :DDDD < 1294683005 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you broke clue? < 1294683064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294683064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cled < 1294683282 0 :sshc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294683317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294683482 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294683525 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT IST BROKE < 1294683548 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : #esoteric -> E's OT, Eric. <-- hm < 1294683550 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1294683553 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :drakhan's heart. < 1294683562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who. < 1294683567 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : WHAT IST BROKE <-- your connection was broke before < 1294683570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1294683571 0 :drakhan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(; < 1294683572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not broke. < 1294683574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who is drakhan < 1294683577 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ elliott has quit (Remote host closed the connection) < 1294683581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: that is correct < 1294683593 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the TCP connection was broken. < 1294683596 0 :drakhan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, as for my person - I`m new here < 1294683621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1294683630 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you on one of those horrible keyboard layouts where you can't put an apostrophe in properly < 1294683631 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1294683647 0 :drakhan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi. < 1294683652 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well /whois says .pl, you could check that < 1294683668 0 :drakhan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it`s my preference < 1294683675 0 :drakhan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, Poland. < 1294683725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's your preference to use backticks instead of apostrophes? < 1294683743 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even diamonds feel worthless when your items are all made of it for free :( < 1294683752 0 :drakhan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it so important? < 1294683762 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just curious, since it makes lines harder to read. < 1294683812 0 :drakhan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A matter of habit. < 1294683817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Somewhat typical of PHP’s API, there are actually thirteen different built-in array sorting functions." < 1294683980 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1294684058 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :philosophical question < 1294684060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if j-invariant's j varied < 1294684062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what would happen < 1294684093 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PHP's design philosophy is "you should never have to write any real algorithms. any algorithm that actually does something difficult should be built in." < 1294684113 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: "Except that, we'll actually implement it badly." < 1294684119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently usort() used to be — wait for it — BUBBLESORT. < 1294684120 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I would stay the same < 1294684136 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :friend of mine wrote bot in php and i said "it should have a rot13 function" and he determined that the best method to implement it ... would be to make a call to rot13() >_> < 1294684153 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently they left their CS classes in the three seconds between "This is bubblesort" and "NEVER USE BUBBLESORT." < 1294684166 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe one should have to aquire a liscence to write algorithms < 1294684173 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sort of like a driving liscence < 1294684188 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: european computer mechanics license < 1294684193 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(there's a european computer driving license) < 1294684200 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it is a hilariously easy Microsoft Office thing) < 1294684205 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course if you have a full proof that you algorithm works you can use a provisional algorithm liscence to have it uploaded into a sandbox < 1294684231 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which one is bubble sort? < 1294684235 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it can never be actually used unless it is also experimentally determined to be efficient in practice < 1294684239 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you ever heard of Dijkstras room? < 1294684240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: the horrible one < 1294684255 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the *algorithm*? < 1294684261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: bitch, you can work that out without testing it < 1294684267 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if your theory doesn't match practice your theory wasn't good enough < 1294684269 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you're executed < 1294684270 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: the one with the near-guaranteed quadratic runtime in number-of-comparisons < 1294684284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bubble_sort#Implementation < 1294684339 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" PHP's design philosophy is "you should never have to write any real algorithms. any algorithm that actually does something difficult should be built in."" <<< somehow i doubt it actually has any useful algorithms in it < 1294684340 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: sure, but sometimes it's easier to test it on all the possible hardware platforms than prove for each instruction set (and the respective latencies) that the constants in the runtime are low < 1294684346 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it? < 1294684355 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: instructions are irrelevant, mostly < 1294684356 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: http://zem.fi/~fis/mcmap-win-fba7271.zip and then just doubleklick the .exe. < 1294684364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't get "oh this c code is really slow on sparc but really fast on x86" < 1294684377 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just takes one level of abstraction to even those out < 1294684383 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean say if i want to turn an NFA into a DFA < 1294684388 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the php function < 1294684419 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's basically the only thing you'll ever need < 1294684419 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: nfatodfa($nfa) OR nfa_convert('Dfa',$nfa,2) (the 2 is to disable the old version of the function) < 1294684423 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's mainly an issue when involving floating point stuff, memory/disk access, and other I/O < 1294684444 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or automatonConvt($nfa, getconv('NFA'), getconv('DFA'), $output) < 1294684463 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah thanks < 1294684489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh man how did i break this < 1294684491 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: note: lies < 1294684494 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you even fail at quicksort? < 1294684502 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: qsort is not really something that should be used. < 1294684511 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's wrong with quicksort? < 1294684513 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Recursion? < 1294684517 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: worst-case performance < 1294684520 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and what about that algorithm that solves the two-pair case of pcp? < 1294684521 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever(n^2) < 1294684523 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quacksort < 1294684529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :--> if you sort arbitrary user-inputted data < 1294684533 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the marked version < 1294684533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you gon get DDoSed < 1294684536 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294684537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or just DoSed < 1294684545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: e.g. merge sort is much better < 1294684553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: do merge sort in clue :P < 1294684562 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there an in-place sort with the performance guarantee of merge sort? < 1294684565 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was thinking i'd, but then i not'd. < 1294684581 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: i think there's an in-place merge sort < 1294684600 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's kinda hairy, if i recall correctly < 1294684626 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also you can do quicksort without recursion, i think < 1294684630 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294684633 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heap sort is also good < 1294684636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think < 1294684638 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you don't get any better worst case performance < 1294684639 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294684640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually < 1294684641 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know what < 1294684642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just use http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timsort < 1294684643 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heap sort is very fast, and can be done in-place < 1294684644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294684645 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heap sort is also not in-place < 1294684647 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stable mergesort < 1294684650 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how < 1294684656 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how to do in place oklopol < 1294684658 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia; merge sort is worst case n log n < 1294684658 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think it's in-place but < 1294684659 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who cares < 1294684662 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: do what in-place? < 1294684666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mergesort or if you're feeling fancy, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timsort < 1294684670 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heap sort < 1294684713 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: You can do merge-sort in-place and some variants have even been described by Finnish guys: http://www.diku.dk/hjemmesider/ansatte/jyrki/Paper/mergesort_NJC.ps < 1294684714 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well you use an array, and 1 (2 3) (4 5 6 7) (8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15) ... where those are the levels of the tree < 1294684724 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Finnish guys, what would we do without them. < 1294684733 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can then multiply index by 2 and either add 1 or 0 to get to children, and divide by 2 to get to daddy < 1294684758 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aww hi daddy < 1294684760 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where's mommy < 1294684764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this in a cruel world where all list mothers run away < 1294684765 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god < 1294684766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is the worst < 1294684768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your sorting algorithm < 1294684770 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what has it < 1294684771 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of < 1294684813 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: lol no wonder a prof at our uni mentioned it < 1294684824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's actually funny how broken this is... < 1294684828 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jukka teuhola is a prof at our uni < 1294684833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well more like, depressing < 1294684839 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :katajainen hangs there too < 1294684849 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :diz ir oklopol < 1294684850 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Yeah, we hear about Kohonen maps all the time at WaveU. < 1294684857 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294684862 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: oh god don't call it that < 1294684874 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so wait how old is fizzie now, 47? < 1294684898 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also WSOM 2011 deadline is Jan 14th, submit your full papers now!) < 1294684904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :48? < 1294684907 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh it's even PRACTICAL in-place mergesort :D < 1294684909 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Twentyseven, I think. < 1294684914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :49 then < 1294684926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i want to see the previous paper, Impractical In-Place Mergesort < 1294684940 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: "average O(2^n), but hey, it's in-place mergesort!" < 1294684949 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: can you write fib with clue? < 1294684955 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the earliest draft, "completely useless out-of-place mergesort". < 1294684958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: yes. < 1294684960 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :efficiently too. < 1294684967 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you write a clue compiler? < 1294684973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p6379491136.txt < 1294684983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yes, with more pain than anyone should have to endure :D < 1294685028 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: has been done, so yeah < 1294685037 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no, IN clue < 1294685040 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294685041 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant means < 1294685047 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not in a very nice way < 1294685051 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294685053 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :understatement prize < 1294685055 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance parsing is nicest to do with mutual rec < 1294685077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah < 1294685077 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a clever way to do it though? by reflecting the way clue works < 1294685079 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's totally the main reason < 1294685085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: nope, not even remotely < 1294685090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't harness it at runtime at all < 1294685094 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :darn < 1294685099 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe if you had eval :P < 1294685106 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue interp ~ eval < 1294685107 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing as crude as eval < 1294685109 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but maybe there could be a slightly modified form of clue < 1294685117 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which allows for a nontrivial self interpreter < 1294685128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it's not really an interp < 1294685132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue is pretty inherently a compiler < 1294685133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as much as can be < 1294685178 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue could even be thought of as a metalanguage < 1294685198 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but hopefully people don't) < 1294685270 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are there some detailed pages on Clue with source code? < 1294685278 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really < 1294685310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: clue.py :P < 1294685311 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's the esolang page, that's it < 1294685312 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't the probability of getting O(n^2) runtime for a random-pivot quicksort unbelievably low? < 1294685326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: yes, but the point is that you can't trust your users. < 1294685335 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's easy to craft such inputs < 1294685339 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and this has been done < 1294685345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: also, why bother? merge sort is just as easy < 1294685361 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm just trying to understand the theory man < 1294685364 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :merging is almost the same thing as pivoting < 1294685366 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not the guy in charge of this shit < 1294685380 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just the other one unzips, the other one zips < 1294685381 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where can i find these carefully crafted inputs? < 1294685404 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: no he means if you run qs on user-given input on your server, then ppl can give crafted inputs that make slow it up < 1294685431 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can craft such inputs if you know how pivoting is done < 1294685435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this shit is well-known btw < 1294685436 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes, but i don't see how any adversary could slow a random-pivot quicksort < 1294685444 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems like random pivoting is unbeatable < 1294685457 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed it does < 1294685466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, if you use a crypto rng < 1294685466 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know if it *is* though < 1294685468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that seems unlikely. < 1294685470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, meh < 1294685472 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :merge sort is nicer anyway < 1294685495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also quicksort is unstable < 1294685496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is just lame < 1294685518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/summary?doi=10.1.1.44.5903 < 1294685555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway the theoretical worst-case performance is reason enough :) < 1294685579 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was already convinced. you were preaching to the choir < 1294685595 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm just curious about the theory of DoSing qs < 1294685637 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you need an easier character to type than > for the "goes to" symbol in clue < 1294685643 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: it's -> < 1294685644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not > < 1294685648 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also that is like < 1294685650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the stupidest complaint < 1294685650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ever < 1294685661 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you realize > is inside -> ? < 1294685673 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> is trivial to type, if it isn't your layout sucks < 1294685674 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : parse error on input `type' < 1294685678 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also this is an esolang < 1294685683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop bothering us with your petty concerns :| < 1294685688 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also you're boring me < 1294685691 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: i have to agree with elliott, that is even less interesting than elliott's additions! :P < 1294685708 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i totally removed branchers, man < 1294685710 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: the most important reason for me to use python over php is that it doesn't use braces :D < 1294685712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and implemented your default thing < 1294685716 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :default branch thing < 1294685719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shower me with praise < 1294685722 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: being able to type in code without shift is veddy important < 1294685722 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: everyone ignored them already :D < 1294685726 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well except in ski < 1294685735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i did #x into x, that's like < 1294685738 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :total improvement < 1294685741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also removed the devil ,s < 1294685745 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: can you do map/reduce with clue? < 1294685749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294685751 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't < 1294685752 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you will be < 1294685755 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why can't you? < 1294685757 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :able to < 1294685760 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it has no first-class functions < 1294685762 0 :sshc!~sshc@unaffiliated/sshc JOIN :#esoteric < 1294685762 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because functions not ho < 1294685767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :functions not ho < 1294685767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1294685779 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about map/reduce with a hardcoded reduction < 1294685783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that's trivial. < 1294685785 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like just + < 1294685806 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course you can do that < 1294685807 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294685820 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :might even compile fast! < 1294685838 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does Clue have higher order programs? < 1294685843 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no. < 1294685844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, as we just said :P < 1294685846 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not atm < 1294685853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: sum ~ {. [] -> 0 } sum ~ {:. [1 2 3] -> 6 : [2 3] -> 5 :. [4 5 6] -> 15 : [5 6] -> 11 } sum ~ add; cdr; 0 < 1294685853 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DepthLimitException: depth limit exceeded (sum) :( < 1294685855 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they would be easy to add though < 1294685855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294685857 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no lambda! WHAT! < 1294685859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what did i do wrong < 1294685867 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean ridiculously easy < 1294685871 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: wow! I was hoping they would be some tremendously difficult addition < 1294685874 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C1TSND_enUS401US401&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=-lang.org#sclient=psy&hl=en&rlz=1C1TSND_enUS401US401&source=hp&q=lang.org&aq=f&aqi=g-s1g-c1g-ms2g-o1&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=&pbx=1&fp=ca05a7bb65e82229 < 1294685876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol < 1294685877 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There goes my life < 1294685878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what did i wrong < 1294685905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: WHAT DID I WRONG < 1294685906 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to die from lack of food and sleep due to reading about programming languages for the rest of my short life. Bye all. < 1294685910 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :essentially you'd have to give an apply function to glue, and have syntax for functions in examples < 1294685918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: ah so you won't talk about them? < 1294685919 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :great, have fun < 1294685924 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: aren't most of then rubbish? < 1294685929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: doesn't matter to sgeo < 1294685951 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: anyway are you going to structure this, like study a new one at the start of each fortnight? < 1294685955 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No < 1294685956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: lol http://www.thorn-lang.org/ is high on that list, which Gregor did something with :P < 1294685959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least i've seen it before < 1294685961 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: why not? < 1294685961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and he's listed on the page < 1294685964 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: what is your plan? < 1294685969 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, just keep reading < 1294685970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to read them all and not eat or sleep and then die < 1294685971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as he stated < 1294685989 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: well maybe you are just fundamentally different than me, but if I did that I would not really get much out of it < 1294686013 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you don't have car < 1294686018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh right < 1294686019 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, if by "get something out of it" you mean "be capable of writing a line of code in that language" than yes, well < 1294686022 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*then < 1294686023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you need pattern matching :P < 1294686027 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :car and cdr should be a single command < 1294686033 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: no I didn't mean that < 1294686035 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: returning a list, good idea! < 1294686038 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: waaaaiit. < 1294686039 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1294686041 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294686043 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: sum ~ {. [] -> 0 } sum ~ {:. [1 2 3] -> 6 : [2 3] -> 5 :. [4 5 6] -> 15 : [5 6] -> 11 } sum ~ add; car; cdr; 0 < 1294686043 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TypeError: unsupported operand type(s) for -: 'float' and '_socketobject' :( < 1294686048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...xD < 1294686050 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not exactly what i meant, but why not < 1294686067 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294686072 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294686073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: sum ~ {. [] -> 0 } sum ~ {:. [1 2 3] -> 6 : [2 3] -> 5 :. [4 5 6] -> 15 : [5 6] -> 11 } sum ~ add; car; cdr; 0 < 1294686074 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiled in 0.0132999420166 seconds < 1294686074 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sum: (a) => [a] | [] => 0 | _ => add(@(cdr(a)) car(a)) < 1294686080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: fold ^ < 1294686086 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is Epigram 1 any good? < 1294686088 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: þorn.org is the preferable address :P < 1294686097 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No :-P Not compared to Epigram 2! < 1294686103 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: why does the recursion become the first argument, that's kinda WEIRD < 1294686108 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why? < 1294686111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: omg that works :D < 1294686116 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: BECAUSE IT'S NOT EPIGRAM 2 < 1294686123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. sum([1 2 7 9]) < 1294686123 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19 < 1294686134 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, you know about this stuff. < 1294686138 0 :sshc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294686141 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh thanks Phantom_Hoover < 1294686144 0 :sshc!~sshc@unaffiliated/sshc JOIN :#esoteric < 1294686181 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: factorial loop ~ {. 0 6 -> 6 . 0 24 -> 24 } factorial loop ~ {:. 3 1 -> 6 : 2 3 -> 6 :. 1 6 -> 6 : 0 6 -> 6 } factorial loop ~ multiply; pred < 1294686181 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiled in 0.00318908691406 seconds < 1294686181 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :factorial loop: (a, b) => [a] | 0 => b | _ => @(pred(a) multiply(a b)) < 1294686216 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Everything that went into epigram 1 is spelled out in Conors research papers: Read those instead.. and once you've donen that you can read the new ones about the theory of Epigram 2 < 1294686222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. factorial loop(0 factorial loop(1 factorial loop(2 factorial loop(0 3)))) < 1294686222 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :6 < 1294686228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...xD < 1294686232 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Once you've done all that.. maybe Epigram 2 will be useable! < 1294686233 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Timber just caught my eye < 1294686234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. factorial loop(0 factorial loop(1 factorial loop(2 factorial loop(3 factorial loop(0 4))))) < 1294686234 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :48 < 1294686240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh good < 1294686249 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait it should be 4 0 < 1294686254 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. Does MapReduce = map . reduce with optimisations? < 1294686258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. factorial loop(0 factorial loop(1 factorial loop(2 factorial loop(3 factorial loop(4 0))))) < 1294686258 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 < 1294686260 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait no < 1294686261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 4 < 1294686262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294686265 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. factorial loop(0 4) < 1294686265 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4 < 1294686266 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. factorial loop(0 5) < 1294686266 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :5 < 1294686274 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so we want < 1294686274 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mobl.... sounds... intersting yet scary < 1294686276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :factorial loop(rest this) < 1294686277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1294686280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :factorial loop(recurse this) < 1294686289 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION would NOT like to see Mobl take over the world < 1294686311 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf is mobl < 1294686339 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.mobl-lang.org/ < 1294686345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. factorial loop(factorial loop(factorial loop(0 1) 2) 3) < 1294686345 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :6 < 1294686351 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. factorial loop(factorial loop(factorial loop(factorial loop(0 1) 2) 3) 4) < 1294686351 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2880 < 1294686363 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. factorial loop(factorial loop(0 1) 2) < 1294686363 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2 < 1294686379 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_, Christ that's stupid. < 1294686386 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: what ~ {. [] -> 0 } what ~ { [0 1 2 3 4] -> 2880 : [0 1 2 3] -> 6 :. [0 1 2 3] -> 5 : [0 1 2] -> 2 } what ~ factorial loop; 0; car; cdr < 1294686386 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiled in 0.00108098983765 seconds < 1294686386 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what: (a) => [a] | _ => 0 < 1294686389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294686391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ^ < 1294686397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294686398 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294686399 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bad syntax < 1294686407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: what ~ {. [] -> 0 } what ~ {:. [0 1 2 3 4] -> 2880 : [0 1 2 3] -> 6 :. [0 1 2 3] -> 5 : [0 1 2] -> 2 } what ~ factorial loop; 0; car; cdr < 1294686407 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RuntimeError: maximum recursion depth exceeded while calling a Python object :( < 1294686408 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How many times will people reinvent the same language? < 1294686412 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294686418 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294686421 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same language? < 1294686421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: factorial loop ~ {. 0 6 -> 6 . 0 24 -> 24 } factorial loop ~ {:. 3 1 -> 6 : 2 3 -> 6 :. 1 6 -> 6 : 0 6 -> 6 } factorial loop ~ multiply; pred < 1294686421 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiled in 0.00199413299561 seconds < 1294686421 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :factorial loop: (a, b) => [a] | 0 => b | _ => @(pred(a) multiply(a b)) < 1294686425 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: what ~ {. [] -> 0 } what ~ {:. [0 1 2 3 4] -> 2880 : [0 1 2 3] -> 6 :. [0 1 2 3] -> 5 : [0 1 2] -> 2 } what ~ factorial loop; 0; car; cdr < 1294686425 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RuntimeError: maximum recursion depth exceeded while calling a Python object :( < 1294686430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294686447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: what ~ {. [] -> 0 } what ~ {:. [0 1 2 3 4] -> 2880 : [0 1 2 3] -> 6 :. [0 1 2 3] -> 6 : [0 1 2] -> 2 } what ~ factorial loop; 0; car; cdr < 1294686447 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RuntimeError: maximum recursion depth exceeded while calling a Python object :( < 1294686458 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: what ~ {. [] -> 0 } what ~ {:. [0 1 2 3] -> 6 : [0 1 2] -> 2 } what ~ factorial loop; 0; car; cdr < 1294686458 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RuntimeError: maximum recursion depth exceeded in __instancecheck__ :( < 1294686461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294686515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. factorial loop(factorial loop(0 1) 2) < 1294686516 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2 < 1294686529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. factorial loop(0 1) < 1294686529 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 < 1294686533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: what ~ {. [] -> 0 } what ~ {:. [0 1 2] -> 2 : [0 1] -> 1 } what ~ factorial loop; 0; car; cdr < 1294686534 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RuntimeError: maximum recursion depth exceeded while calling a Python object :( < 1294686537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf???? < 1294686539 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294686544 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294686547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: factorial loop ~ {. 0 6 -> 6 . 0 24 -> 24 } factorial loop ~ {:. 3 1 -> 6 : 2 3 -> 6 :. 1 6 -> 6 : 0 6 -> 6 } factorial loop ~ multiply; pred < 1294686548 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiled in 0.00293016433716 seconds < 1294686548 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :factorial loop: (a, b) => [a] | 0 => b | _ => @(pred(a) multiply(a b)) < 1294686559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: what ~ {. [] -> 0 } what ~ {:. [0 1 2] -> 2 : [0 1] -> 1 } what ~ factorial loop; 0; car; cdr < 1294686560 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RuntimeError: maximum recursion depth exceeded while calling a Python object :( < 1294686562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol < 1294686587 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elly < 1294686602 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Like many programmers with a pulse, I am compelled to create my own programming language." < 1294686606 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://jolt-lang.org/ < 1294686608 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you want me to tell you what's wrong? < 1294686617 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it stack overflows for no apparent reason < 1294686619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes < 1294686620 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do < 1294686659 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-169-71.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294686676 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294686685 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294686716 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't see anything wrong < 1294686745 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. factorial loop (0 6) < 1294686745 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :6 < 1294686753 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::. factorial loop (10 1) < 1294686754 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3628800 < 1294686756 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294686763 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what gave an error exactly? < 1294686764 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plain language! < 1294686766 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"what"? < 1294686793 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes < 1294686797 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the examples for what make no sense, so there's really no telling what the code will do < 1294686805 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294686820 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except you get a runtime error during compilation < 1294686826 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so obviously < 1294686834 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :factorial loop is called with parameters what make it infloop < 1294686841 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you don't catch exceptions anymore < 1294686854 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(incidentally, this is why i caught theem) < 1294686855 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*them < 1294686873 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'll catch stack overflow exceptions then? < 1294686879 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm yeah prolly < 1294686896 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dear Pika: < 1294686901 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Mersenne Twister based pseudorandom number generator." is not a language feature. < 1294686907 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In conclusion, fuck you. < 1294686912 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.pika-lang.org/features/ < 1294686950 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Chu < 1294686980 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: Technically that depends :P < 1294686999 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: If it has a random-based object system ... :P < 1294687002 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: why not? < 1294687042 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Language features are features of the LANGUAGE, not libraries provided. < 1294687057 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, the features page doesn't say _language_ features < 1294687066 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It also doesn't list every single library < 1294687066 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, it didn't? :P < 1294687070 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the different between language and library is fuzzy < 1294687080 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, in that case, j-invariant: That's an extremely boring feature :P < 1294687085 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1294687121 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We have a library that lets you retrieve content via HTTP! < 1294687135 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-169-71.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294687165 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why you should use my language: Ships with binding to libcurl. < 1294687167 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The rest of Pika is boring < 1294687179 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: Everything except for the random number generator? ;) < 1294687213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey Sgeo_ < 1294687214 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use Apex < 1294687215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the best < 1294687235 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it's in contrast to those languages who ship with stdlibs who use the xkcd RNG < 1294687255 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...on-demand? < 1294687298 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's. A. Language. For. Code. That. Runs. On. salesforce.com. < 1294687298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1294687306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294687319 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Enterprise Language 101 < 1294687326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know, every time you talk to us about languages < 1294687330 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's time you could spend googling more < 1294687334 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you don't mean http://wiki.developerforce.com/index.php/Apex_Code:_The_World's_First_On-Demand_Programming_Language do you? < 1294687338 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's what Google came up with < 1294687341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, i don't < 1294687366 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hahah, reading that. < 1294687373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean Apex, the expressive, functional imperative language from Cat's Eye Technologies < 1294687402 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'Like all aspects of salesforce.com’s application and platform technologies, Apex Code is “on demand,” running entirely on Force.com without requiring any local servers or software' <-- this ... is what they mean? LAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAWL < 1294687495 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, it's the first language that HAS to be run on the cloud < 1294687505 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Probably not) < 1294687582 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I can't find Apex on cpressey's site < 1294687596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's too secret. or too vapourware. < 1294687605 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also mostly formulated by me. < 1294687679 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294687799 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294687931 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: how come you are interested in it anyway? < 1294687940 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in what < 1294687947 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh epi < 1294687953 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: APPLIED PHLEBOTINUM IS BETTER THAN LOGIC < 1294687958 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The consensus is: " Let’s briefly look at some non-solutions to the software problem. First, we can’t just prove everything to be correct. This is way too expensive and most real systems lack formal specifications." < 1294687966 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" At present, it is not even clear that the correct behavior of large systems can be formalized at all, though hopefully this will be possible someday (exercise for the reader: formalize Asimov’s Three Laws in HOL, Coq, or a similar language)." < 1294687973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is this broken, what manner of witchery is this < 1294687974 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everyone seems to agree with this (tripe) < 1294687987 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: eh? < 1294688009 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT MANNER OF WITCHERY IS THIS!!!!!! < 1294688017 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it is exceptional to find people that seriously think proofs are sensible < 1294688023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtfwtfwtfwtfwtfwtfwtwfwtwffwtwftwfwwffwtwfwtfffffff < 1294688025 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or useful etc etc < 1294688040 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you can find them interesting without finding them useful :) i.e. computer-based systems < 1294688042 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Clearly math education should be mandatory. < 1294688057 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not entirely sure that Coq/Epigram/etc. are useful for proving theorems. for writing verified software, of course. < 1294688062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but regardless, they are interesting. < 1294688078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohh < 1294688082 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like how tk eats up all exceptoins < 1294688084 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and doesn't print them < 1294688085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*exceptions < 1294688086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well Tkinter < 1294688089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's very nice < 1294688110 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh dear, that is a problem < 1294688194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: can you give your executive opinion on a part of cled < 1294688201 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: huh? it is < 1294688212 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: no it isn't < 1294688214 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :arithmetic education is < 1294688219 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm it's kinda broken when you tab away... todo, fix < 1294688261 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: That's no more math education than the alphabet is literature education. < 1294688295 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it possible to teach math? < 1294688347 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite likely. Is it possible without a mathematician becoming supreme ruler of the Department of Education (or your local national equivalent)? Probably not. < 1294688369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol i need opinion < 1294688376 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because almost everyone is convinced that we already teach math, and quite well... < 1294688422 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha they must be crazy < 1294688489 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, ...you didn't know this? < 1294688506 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't know what? < 1294688512 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Were you homeschooled for your entire life until you moved out into a cave in the wilderness? < 1294688517 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294688521 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That maths education is nothing of the sort. < 1294688521 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't pay much attention in school < 1294688564 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: anyway I am curious how&why did you get interesetd in epigram < 1294688573 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems... interesting. < 1294688577 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294688668 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :combinatorics is interesting < 1294688736 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Man. I just now realised that IPv4 depletion is literally happening *this month*... < 1294688760 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Awesome. < 1294688770 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :blargh < 1294688774 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well. It *could* happen early February. < 1294688807 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So wait, what was P(civilisation collapses) again? < 1294688814 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0. < 1294688835 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd suggest not being in the stock market, though. < 1294688846 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or strategically selling short. < 1294688873 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But P(civilisation collapses | the stock market fluctuates) is rather high, no? < 1294688888 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite high, yes. < 1294688906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it won't have that big a deal < 1294688909 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NATs are not very hard to set up really < 1294688917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and remember that most hosting companies and the like < 1294688922 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :already have way more IPs than they use < 1294688931 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Telecoms are boned. < 1294688935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's not like people are gonna see "lol no you can't have a server we have no ip to give it" < 1294688937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: oh sure < 1294688939 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm just saying that < 1294688943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everyone already has IPs to spare < 1294688945 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it won't be a _huge_ deal < 1294688969 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except that adoption of IPv6 will be really expensive at this point, and it will be mandatory pretty soon. < 1294688990 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mostly for the telecoms. < 1294689311 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hah. < 1294689344 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :After depletion, RIPE and AfriNIC will only allocate IPv4 to entities with IPv6 allocations. < 1294689604 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294690210 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was there something derisive about measuring code in KLOCs? < 1294690234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: eh? < 1294690920 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://www.reddit.com/r/compsci/comments/ez93s/the_future_of_software_system_correctness/c1c7740?context=3 < 1294690978 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: heh < 1294690984 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i think they're right though ... _for now_ < 1294690989 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0.999.. = 1 therefore math is not perfect < 1294691007 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I have a feeling that with the progress, probably a... loss of precision will be had < 1294691023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i.e., it turns out that if you prove a kernel, like, "only 80%" correct, it takes only 30% of the work < 1294691041 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"After depending typing, the only type of bugs left are those that are not provable, like if prime numbers ever end and such." lol wat < 1294691061 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well generally you would only prove the very very awkward difficult parts: So 80% correct would be 99% as hard < 1294691081 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Perhaps! ...but then perhaps not, you see people writing unit tests for every damn thing < 1294691082 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: LOL < 1294691094 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Anyway, consider, the very very awkward difficult parts tend to consist of multiple subproblems < 1294691102 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: so if you prove most of those but not all < 1294691108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: or if you prove that all of them apply in, like, 80% of cases < 1294691135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: like, I can imagine some proof system that lets you state some property on, like, floats, and as long as it can experimentally verify it for a few thousand random values, and also pathological ones like denormalised numbers < 1294691139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it lets it be accepted as a theorem < 1294691143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :useless, mathematically < 1294691147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but for proving software, potentially very useful < 1294691235 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294691239 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's called testing elliott < 1294691244 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :peopl already do that < 1294691264 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: not really < 1294691269 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I mean, say you have a big, formal proof < 1294691274 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that relies on some twiddly property of floating point numbers < 1294691283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: if you can prove that, using that theorem < 1294691294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then have that hypothesis about floating points "experimentally" demonstrated < 1294691297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it allows the proof < 1294691308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a whole lot better than just testing the component < 1294691584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: lol ololol ololo olol ololololo lololoo < 1294691586 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: "Does computer science completely miss the point of a computer -- namely, that it is a creative tool?" < 1294691599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One could argue that computer science is like a "pen science" where scientists find ways to write as quickly as possible with a pen and to fill up a page with as much text as possible. < 1294691599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That would of course completely miss the point of a pen. < 1294691599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One could say something similar about computer science with its focus on time and space efficiency of computations. < 1294691601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The computer -- like a pen -- is a creative tool and the focus should be on the invention of new kinds of software applications -- not on making existing ones more efficient. < 1294691602 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Universities should have a creative field of study -- distinct from computer science -- for novel uses of computers. < 1294691604 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :roffflllll < 1294691606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xDD < 1294691626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :worst thing ... ever < 1294691631 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1294691642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how did that get on /r/compsci < 1294691666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i like how they think computer science is just about like < 1294691667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :optimising programs < 1294691680 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"hat does the /r < 1294691686 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*What does the /r mean? < 1294691697 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: subreddit < 1294691699 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's part of the url < 1294691702 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :reddit.com/r/subredditname < 1294691956 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294691961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol you'll love this program < 1294691966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you know why oklopol < 1294692284 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294692289 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: where was that < 1294692289 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION accidentally mentally dropped the why < 1294692297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: /r/compsci < 1294692301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: what < 1294692303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294692303 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I know < 1294692309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's on the front page < 1294692312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of compsci < 1294692314 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I looked there < 1294692334 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's #3 < 1294692337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you're not looking quite hard enough :D < 1294692341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/compsci/comments/ez4op/does_computer_science_completely_miss_the_point/ < 1294692384 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what thehell? that's not on my front page at all < 1294692421 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294692457 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: looks like the poster actually agrees with that stuff http://www.reddit.com/r/compsci/comments/ez4op/does_computer_science_completely_miss_the_point/c1c2upo < 1294692463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i have a feeling the poster asked the question < 1294692465 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: P.S. did you not notice this is voted zero :| < 1294692467 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just realized i haven't used ftp in so long that i don't have a proper ftp client installed. any recommendations? < 1294692474 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i did yeah < 1294692479 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: ftp(1) < 1294692487 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh < 1294692496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's trivial to use < 1294692516 0 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-65-80.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1294692519 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, but it requires me to remember the command names. i want drag and drop for instant gratification < 1294692539 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :read: i'm lazy, motherfuckers < 1294692680 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1294692873 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IRONY: http://i.imgur.com/DkbPs.png < 1294692891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(after someone got into his account in the thread an xss was discovered in stackoverflow) < 1294692984 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's ok, he never uses StackOverflow anyway < 1294693028 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jeff atwood is such a dork < 1294693160 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*thread where an < 1294693173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wish i could delete jeff atwood's face < 1294693174 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or all of him < 1294693236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: have you written any clue programs yet? < 1294693251 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no I am waiting for the wiki page: please write it! < 1294693281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Clue_%28oklopol%29 < 1294693290 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it is not very complete... e.g. bags can also contain objects < 1294693293 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's a primer :> < 1294693302 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait it does say that < 1294693304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok just read it then < 1294693324 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should write a Clue compiler < 1294693338 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: uh, "good luck" < 1294693347 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: clue.py is 717 lines < 1294693375 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously the problem is that you're using python < 1294693380 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: :> < 1294693397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: writing clue programs is great fun though, you struggle through and go wtf, but the moment the compiler spits out the right function < 1294693402 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it feels like it was so easy < 1294693405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and your code is so simple < 1294693466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://pb.vjn.fi/p9634238413.txt < 1294693466 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294693467 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294693467 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DepthLimitException: depth limit exceeded (:..: factorial stack-hogging factorial) :( < 1294693473 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aw man ... < 1294693478 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comments don't actually work < 1294693496 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so how do you compile clue? < 1294693512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: difficultly... < 1294693519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's basically advanced brute force :) < 1294693523 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not just breath first generate all programs? < 1294693529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no way < 1294693539 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a reason there's more than one {} branch in each function < 1294693542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, most functions < 1294693547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e., there's a reason you do that < 1294693549 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a reason the bag exists < 1294693553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there's a reason :. : exist to denote recursion < 1294693565 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay this is getting complicated < 1294693585 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: hehe < 1294693612 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yeah there is basically no way you could do recursive functions (only flow control other than branching really) with a stupid search like that < 1294693618 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the search is stupid, not the idea, that is < 1294693628 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294693676 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294693681 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294693682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://pb.vjn.fi/p9634238413.txt < 1294693682 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294693683 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294693683 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DepthLimitException: depth limit exceeded (:..: factorial stack-hogging factorial) :( < 1294693686 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1294693694 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294693699 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh this is a clue bot! < 1294693699 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294693701 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://pb.vjn.fi/p9634238413.txt < 1294693701 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294693702 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294693702 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DepthLimitException: depth limit exceeded (:..: factorial stack-hogging factorial) :( < 1294693706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't use it i'm busy fixing it :> < 1294693712 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294693719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait what ... < 1294693732 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o, lol < 1294693844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey j-invariant < 1294693852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how many ways can you represent 6, if . is +1 and : is +2 < 1294693859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and those are the only symbols you can use < 1294693899 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know what . and : do < 1294693907 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh they are symbols for +1 and +2 < 1294693918 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well ...... is 6 < 1294693923 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: is 6 < 1294693923 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294693924 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ValueError: unknown url type: is 6 :( < 1294693939 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294693940 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yep < 1294693942 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can combine them < 1294693942 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1294693949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: it's a cluebot. < 1294693952 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::.... .:... ..:.. ...:. ....: < 1294693952 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294693953 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :URLError: :( < 1294693953 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://lemonparty.com < 1294693961 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a fail :P < 1294693962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: xD < 1294693970 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::.. <-- can't be bothered drawing all these but there are 4!/2!2! of them < 1294693970 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294693971 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ValueError: unknown url type: <-- can't be bothered drawing all these but there are 4!/2!2! of them :( < 1294693981 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://lemonparty.com < 1294693981 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294693981 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294693982 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiled in 3.00407409668e-05 seconds < 1294693985 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294693987 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1294693989 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL < 1294694007 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Elliott-Hirds-MacBook-Air:~ ehird$ curl http://lemonparty.com < 1294694008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1294694012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hardly surprising it was fast then < 1294694029 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: 1 + 5!/1!4! + 4!/2!2! + 1 < 1294694061 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ok, i'm not gonna write out all 2906 then :D < 1294694084 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's 13?? < 1294694092 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, W|A fails at parsing < 1294694099 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1294694103 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: what < 1294694107 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I wasn't using proper syntax < 1294694119 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4!/2!2! is obviouly 24 < 1294694133 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and 5!/1!4! is obviously 24*120 < 1294694143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's 5!/(1!4!). < 1294694313 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean 4!/(2! * 2!) < 1294694320 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. 6 < 1294694345 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it makes no sense to use abcd/efgh as abcdfgh/e < 1294694351 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't who does this < 1294694356 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, everyone does, but I don't know why < 1294694365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes it looks nicer < 1294694366 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kinda < 1294694373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same reason you see \frac{1}{x} ... in equations < 1294694376 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes but in that case you can use (abcd/e)fgh < 1294694380 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1294694382 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1294694499 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : same reason you see \frac{1}{x} ... in equations ← as opposed to...? < 1294694601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: \frac{...}{x} < 1294694609 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: words letters = map (flip replicateM letters) [1..] < 1294694617 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1294694654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: was that...responding to my #haskell question in here? < 1294694654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294694683 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@pl words letters = map (flip replicateM letters) [1..] < 1294694683 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :words = flip map [1..] . flip replicateM < 1294694707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that produces a list of lists, you mean concatMap surely < 1294694722 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, an @pl which is pretty! < 1294694724 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Re the "how many times", it's actually fib times: http://oeis.org/A000045 "F(n)=number of compositions of n-1 with no part greater than 2. Example: F(4)=3 because we have 3 = 1+1+1=1+2=2+1." < 1294694752 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh flip replicateM letters =<< [1..] then < 1294694782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude Control.Monad> takeWhile (\x -> s x < 7) (words ":.") < 1294694782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[":",".","::",":.",".:","..",":::","::.",":.:",":..",".::",".:.","..:","..."] < 1294694783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: wait what < 1294694788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude Control.Monad> let s('.':xs)=1+s xs;s(':':xs)=2+s xs;s []=0 < 1294694868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: is it just not ordered like that? < 1294694889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yay i got all 13 < 1294694890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[":::","::..",":.:.",":..:",".::.",".:.:","..::",":....",".:...","..:..","...:.","....:","......"] < 1294694919 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Re the "how many times", it's actually fib times: http://oeis.org/A000045 "F(n)=number of compositions of n-1 with no part greater than 2. Example: F(4)=3 because we have 3 = 1+1+1=1+2=2+1." ← COINCIDENCE? < 1294694927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1294694958 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: And of course it's fib, since for all the F(n) ways to write n, there are F(n-1) those that start with '.' and F(n-2) those that start with ':'. < 1294694983 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I know. < 1294694992 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Admittedly the example is a bit silly. < 1294695003 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: how many times what < 1294695017 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh how many ways to write? < 1294695018 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294695020 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Should've been that, yes. < 1294695023 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294695032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p9634238413.txt < 1294695032 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294695033 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294695033 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiled in 0.000127077102661 seconds < 1294695038 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...that's definitely not right < 1294695049 0 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294695049 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294695049 0 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294695064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: What's with that x- suffix. < 1294695104 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: lol: < 1294695108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:28 EvanR-work: set of finite strings from a countable alphabet is countable? < 1294695108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:28 Cale: EvanR-work: yes < 1294695108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:28 EvanR-work: interesting < 1294695113 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: WHAT A REVELATION < 1294695121 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: he meant something else < 1294695127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you suure < 1294695128 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: he was thinnking base infinity < 1294695133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294695139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that's continued fractions :) < 1294695141 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: which is not at all what he /said/ :P < 1294695145 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no idea. < 1294695154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait no it isn't < 1294695158 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: everyone in #haskell is going "oh I misread it" < 1294695158 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ask the guy on #freenode who cloaked me. < 1294695166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:29 cdsmithus: EvanR-work: It's pretty easy to see. Just enumerate all the 0-length strings (finitely many), then all the 1-length, then the 2-length, and so on. Every finite string has some length, and will be reached eventually < 1294695169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :finitely many 0-length strings < 1294695173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all 1 of them < 1294695257 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294695370 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: did i break this ~ {. 0 -> 1} did i break this ~ 1 < 1294695371 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294695371 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ValueError: unknown url type: did i break this ~ {. 0 -> 1} did i break this ~ 1 :( < 1294695374 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::: did i break this ~ {. 0 -> 1} did i break this ~ 1 < 1294695374 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiled in 0.00750088691711 seconds < 1294695377 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, yes i did < 1294695408 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohhhh < 1294695410 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xDDD < 1294695445 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294695450 0 :luatre!~luatre@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294695454 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :::: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p9634238413.txt < 1294695454 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Downloading... < 1294695454 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling, just a minute... < 1294695455 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiled in 0.080559015274 seconds < 1294695455 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :factorial: (a) => [a] | _ => factorial loop(a 1) < 1294695455 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stack-hogging factorial: (a) => [a] | 0 => multiply(pred(0) pred(0)) | _ => multiply(a @(pred(a))) < 1294695455 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :factorial loop: (a, b) => [a] | 0 => b | _ => @(pred(a) multiply(a b)) < 1294695455 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fibonacci: (a) => [a] | _ => fast fibonacci loop(a 0 1) < 1294695456 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fast fibonacci loop: (a, b, c) => [a] | 0 => b | _ => @(pred(a) c add(b c)) < 1294695456 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slow fibonacci: (a) => [a] | 0 => 0 | 1 => 1 | _ => add(@(pred(a)) @(pred(pred(a)))) < 1294695461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :commentz wurk! < 1294695537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: so my program's structure is quite flawed, what about you < 1294695541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any flawed programs lately? < 1294695735 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything I have written in the past ... forever < 1294695744 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1294695795 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: :D < 1294695798 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: have you ever written GUI PROGRAMS < 1294695806 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah they suck :| < 1294695812 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know how to make it look okay < 1294695814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: haha what did you write < 1294695820 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I tried to make a little REPL < 1294695820 0 :pumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :copumpkin < 1294695830 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GUI PROGRAMS WHERE ARE THEY GET THEM AWAY < 1294695893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: cled! < 1294695895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cled is a gui program < 1294695898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the best gui program ever in fact < 1294695902 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAa < 1294695920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: how didn't it look ok? :p < 1294695972 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/6eG6a.png < 1294695991 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that doesn't look bad < 1294696005 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sorts of sucks < 1294696010 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd add a bit more spacing after the rendered equation, and possibly make that whole upper pane white-backgrounded if i could < 1294696016 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what did you write it with? < 1294696027 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, http://www.reddit.com/r/Minecraft/comments/ezre7/did_notch_give_details_why_they_switched_from_git/ < 1294696029 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gtk haskell < 1294696029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: anyway it's not as ugly as cled http://i.imgur.com/M27fK.png :D < 1294696033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: by far < 1294696041 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: "From my own experience with both I find Subversion to be easier to understand." lol < 1294696044 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like the look of cled < 1294696049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: really? it's hideous :D < 1294696055 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is Subversion awful? < 1294696061 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I want to make a GUI for interactive program derivation < 1294696066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: It's centralised. Its aim is to be "CVS done right" which is impossible. So yes. < 1294696070 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that would be amazing < 1294696081 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Haskell < 1294696090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh? < 1294696092 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like that paste I showed you: except you do it all in place < 1294696094 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294696101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which paste < 1294696101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294696105 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey that would be really cute I should actually make it < 1294696118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: btw cled isn't really meant to look like that... ideally instead of those awful borders, it'd have like, those outwards poking ones... so that it looks like things deeper in the tree stick out further, you know? < 1294696119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3d style < 1294696126 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: and then what would happen is, descent would be shown by element background < 1294696129 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not by border colour < 1294696132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's on the todo list < 1294696171 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Program derivation? < 1294696196 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it'd be a lot nicer because right now borders kinda drown out everything < 1294696240 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: here is a derivation of init in terms of foldr http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=VBavHxpt < 1294696245 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah right < 1294696258 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm actually there is no nice way to make a GUI for this < 1294696280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: btw, isn't your cons just (:) there... < 1294696300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1294696300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294696313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the cons name is kinda confusing though :p < 1294696360 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't think there is a good way to make a GUI for program derivation < 1294696377 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are too many different ways to structure things < 1294696387 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What else is on voxelperfect.net other than esolang stuff? < 1294696389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps... < 1294696390 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: nothing < 1294696392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that we know of < 1294696394 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: did you read that? < 1294696410 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, yes, but it confuzzled me. < 1294696413 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1294696454 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that's wrong < 1294696466 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because I have no idea what fold is meant to do. < 1294696477 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: oh you should learn about foldr < 1294696484 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: it is? < 1294696491 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you tried running it? < 1294696506 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I *know* what foldr is, but I thought it had a function involved... < 1294696508 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> foldr cons [] [1..10] < 1294696509 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :saying why it's wrong >> telling to run :) < 1294696510 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : [] < 1294696514 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294696515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: fail < 1294696519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: cons is defined in the where clause < 1294696522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t cons < 1294696523 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. a -> [a] -> [a] < 1294696524 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ that's not used < 1294696529 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294696533 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, I @let that myself < 1294696535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :init = foldr cons [] where < 1294696535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : cons x [] = [] < 1294696535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : cons x (y:ys) = x : y : ys < 1294696536 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the final result < 1294696538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294696539 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as defined in the where clause < 1294696546 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait what < 1294696563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, wait what < 1294696568 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote @let cons x [] = []; cons x (y:ys) = x : y : ys < 1294696732 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let cons x [] = [x]; cons x (y:ys) = x : y : ys in foldr cons [] [1..10] < 1294696733 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : [1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10] < 1294696742 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's revealing < 1294696748 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1294696761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you should write a clue program ... with cled! < 1294696772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: that's not the intention, though < 1294696774 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I thought it was a debugger < 1294696779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ... :D < 1294696787 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I know! I'm just saying, it shows where it's going wrong < 1294696794 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I have no idea how http://i.imgur.com/M27fK.png could be used to debug anything < 1294696803 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's actually an editor < 1294696818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what you see in that screenshot is the clue branch < 1294696819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{. 0 1 -> 1 < 1294696819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 0 5 -> 5 } < 1294696843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can descend and ascend through that tree, basically, move about, and edit individual atoms < 1294696849 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus add/remove to the lists, etc. < 1294696855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the lists in a display sense, not in clue-code-sense < 1294696907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm i shouldn't link to such scary screenshots when #haskellers are around < 1294696914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a feeling they have some modicum of taste < 1294696920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: can you confirm/deny? < 1294696927 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294696935 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not a true haskeller < 1294696941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that #haskellers have some modicum of taste < 1294696947 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, no taste here < 1294696952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and thus linking to things like http://i.imgur.com/M27fK.png when they're around is likely to scare them off < 1294696961 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've seen worse < 1294696967 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1294696976 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but keep in mind that I have no taste < 1294696985 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so my idea of worse may actually be better < 1294696991 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should implement that background-based system, like now < 1294696997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it'd stop scaring off helpless children < 1294697097 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/compsci/comments/ez93s/the_future_of_software_system_correctness/c1c7ks6 < 1294697119 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HAY GUYS: GODELGODELGODELGODELGODEL < 1294697130 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when will people learn this is just not relevant? < 1294697207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :godel is often relevant! but usually not in the cases when people think it is < 1294697280 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"GODELGODELGODEL" is the sound of a mathematician turkey. < 1294697550 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the incompleteness from outer space < 1294697647 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a nice, light blue < 1294697658 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0000FF < 1294697664 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THAT IS NOT LIGHT < 1294697669 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FFFFFF < 1294697674 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THAT IS NOT BLUE < 1294697680 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BBBBFF < 1294697708 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is... not nice... actually it's koay < 1294697709 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1294697709 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294697722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :givin' cled a makeover < 1294697838 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://twitter.com/notch/status/24558373093515264 Reeds are now sugar canes. I am not even kidding. < 1294697838 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Sugar_Cane < 1294697851 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Vorpal: Gawp at the ...ness. < 1294697959 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found some reeds but I could not find them again :( < 1294697961 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I lost them < 1294698018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: *SUGAR CANES < 1294698024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: have you joined the server yet :p < 1294698043 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what is the address? < 1294698095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I can't tell you, that would be wrong; you'll have to look at a four days old log or something where we discuss mcmap! < 1294698106 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is a guess of course. Naturally. < 1294698106 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not < 1294698112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An utter guess. < 1294698116 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dno't want to join if I'm not supposed to < 1294698122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294698133 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should ask the boss if its okay < 1294698136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :get oklopol to tell you, he has oklopolic immunity < 1294698145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's no joke < 1294698235 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Our administratafator has been a bit gone for the evening; my guess is some sort of debauchery. < 1294698279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You're the right-hand man, go tell j-invariant the address. < 1294698331 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: and from those sugar canes you will be able to produce high-fructose corn syrup >:) < 1294698338 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, but I couldn't possibly, that'd be insubordination. < 1294698360 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Our administratafator has been a bit gone for the evening; my guess is some sort of debauchery. ← MATLAB debauchery? < 1294698362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Insubordinate! < 1294698381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: So is there a scenester named SUGAR CANE who isn't in your pants either? < 1294698383 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your sign needs changing. < 1294698392 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right. < 1294698399 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also whiskey and creme brulee < 1294698399 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or just leave it as a protest :P < 1294698410 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, maybe I'll just be all RETRO-reed. < 1294698412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh man, whiskey in Minecraft would be amazing. < 1294698425 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I was into reeds before they were sugar canes." < 1294698430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'll, like, restore 70% of your health, but if you drink too much your vision starts going blurry and stuff. < 1294698434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And tilting around. < 1294698437 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: you had reeds on vinyl? < 1294698457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i had reeds before they sold out < 1294698468 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Reeds on Vinyl", sounds like a band. < 1294698494 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Sounds like a band" sounds like a band. < 1294698500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: with the amount of things the internet has called good band names, we'd need like 1,000 times more bands than have ever existed to be created. < 1294698538 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"'Sounds like a band' sounds like a band" sounds like a band < 1294698573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My band will be called #1#="\"#1#\" sounds like a band". < 1294698577 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Literally that. < 1294698583 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/band/band name/g < 1294698587 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294698590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :First album will naturally be called Main Page. < 1294698596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because fuck Wikipedia! < 1294698819 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION recalls there was a norwegian race horse named "Sugar Cane Hannover" < 1294698839 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*hanover < 1294698861 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the people who name horses are like people who name cats fun things, except on crack < 1294698871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, you start naming cats silly things < 1294698874 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then when you get a job < 1294698875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and become a pro < 1294698877 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you become a horse name < 1294698877 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :r < 1294698893 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :famous enough to have a no.wikipedia page < 1294698897 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is it with horse names, anyway? < 1294698911 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :born in sweden actually < 1294698952 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Followed by the horse formerly known as Horse." < 1294698975 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found that more hilarious than it was < 1294698984 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294698985 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if horse racing actually involved like < 1294698987 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :programming jokes < 1294698990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd watch < 1294698999 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But oh! Here comes My Other Car Is A Cdr! < 1294699036 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION hits elliott with an element and a list < 1294699044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's cons. < 1294699045 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll name my horse 🐎. < 1294699062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Name a horse after the Unicode snowman. < 1294699065 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone tell me if Firefly is non-crap. < 1294699078 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you think I'm capable of thinking of some stupid not-that-funny thing to say about car and cdr? < 1294699080 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it isn't < 1294699082 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: It's... Joss Whedon-y, isn't it? Said as someone who hasn't seen it. < 1294699084 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: BIAS < 1294699085 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, well, I dunno < 1294699095 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly, it isn't non-crap? < 1294699103 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :From the little I've seen, yes < 1294699105 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming you mean the show < 1294699108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: I get the feeling there's more western there than scifi. < 1294699112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Space western", as they say. < 1294699114 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know people like Firefly < 1294699115 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You mean that it is, in fact, crap? < 1294699126 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Name a horse the GLAGOLITIC CAPITAL LETTER SPIDERY HA. < 1294699129 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Pronounced like that. < 1294699131 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And that it was cancelled < 1294699131 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION applauds Sgeo_ for his research skills. < 1294699143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I THINK THEY MADE A MOVIE OUT OF IT < 1294699146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GUYS? GUYS??? < 1294699151 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So wait, noöne has actually seen it? < 1294699159 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :randall munroe likes it, which is always a bad sign < 1294699161 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well then, I see no harm in joining the crowd. < 1294699171 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, he liked it pre-xkcdecay. < 1294699181 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Randall Munroe likes breathing. < 1294699192 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: Breathing is kind of a pain. < 1294699195 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes. < 1294699201 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Sure, but he also liked Python. < 1294699210 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like Python! < 1294699212 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: not breathing even more so < 1294699216 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Python is a necessary evil. < 1294699222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Is it? < 1294699232 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION cries as his lingua fraca gets spit upon < 1294699251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Python is a terrible language. < 1294699260 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, lazy people and idiots want to program. < 1294699272 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Funny. I don't want them to. < 1294699299 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Dude, I'm going to change MY name to GLAGOLITIC CAPITAL LETTER SPIDERY HA < 1294699303 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes, but it filled a gap in the market, so it was inevitable. < 1294699303 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And would you rather they used Perl? < 1294699323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: No, but ... intelligent people who like Python are odd. < 1294699326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I approev. < 1294699327 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*approve. < 1294699332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: And they, strangely, exist. < 1294699335 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol! < 1294699350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol likes Python for, like, totally different reasons to everyone else. < 1294699374 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: *franca < 1294699385 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what reasons? < 1294699400 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Well, not "clean code and comprehensive standard libraries" :-) < 1294699417 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, do you think I'm an idiot? < 1294699419 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: don't be harsh, english isn't Sgeo_'s lingua fraca < 1294699427 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION lols < 1294699429 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because oklobrainese compiles easily to Python? < 1294699430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: Not really, but I have the feeling you like Python for the wrong reasons. < 1294699433 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: WHO KNOWS < 1294699446 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hey i wasn't intending to start a fracas < 1294699457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ...you win :D < 1294699487 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YAY < 1294699527 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a language called HaXe < 1294699534 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AND MY HAXE < 1294699545 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As far as I can tell, the only reason people like it is its "portability" < 1294699554 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294699590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to start drinking more coffee. < 1294699658 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1294699724 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fancy's supposed to be able to target a bunch of stuff eventually < 1294699732 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey j-invariant design my program < 1294699734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somehow < 1294699753 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-169-71.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294699759 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now that I look at http://www.fancy-lang.org/features/ again, it looks boring < 1294699773 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except for the BDD thingy, which puts Scala's thing in mind < 1294699812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :example-driven development is the only acceptable policy. < 1294699827 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294699831 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOT < 1294699832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :KIDDING < 1294699845 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION still wants to know if it's TC < 1294699846 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294699852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what, Clue? < 1294699880 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ideally the language _specification_ should be example-driven, no? < 1294699882 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1294699890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: yes, it is < 1294699901 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh. That's awesome. < 1294699903 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How? < 1294699905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: oh yes definitely, but unfortunately there's no other example-driven processors < 1294699915 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: you can basically write simple imperative loops that use each other < 1294699921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there's also an ski interpreter < 1294699925 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and quicksort < 1294699926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soo < 1294699926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :QED < 1294699931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most people would consider SKI enough < 1294699937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, you might not consider that so if, e.g., < 1294699940 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i guess it's hard when you don't have any examples < 1294699941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't express every turing machine as a unique program < 1294699954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, yes < 1294699958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can basically write code imperatively < 1294700088 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bleh < 1294700091 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does anyone know tk here < 1294700186 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know of it. And that Python comes with libraries for it < 1294700204 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :22:55 < qfr> How am I supposed to develop software in Haskell if I can't even prepare my projects in UML?! It seems like an impossible task. < 1294700208 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HAHA < 1294700227 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294700230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are they serious < 1294700234 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think so < 1294700322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: oh god, he is < 1294700345 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is amazing, like meeting a Mormon or something < 1294700357 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aw everyone is ganging up on him < 1294700374 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: except for the ones who are telling him UML can work ... lol < 1294700416 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTF does UML have to do with Haskell? < 1294700428 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is UML some sort of imperative thingy? I thought it was flowchartiness < 1294700434 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which I guess is imperative < 1294700448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's OO. < 1294700465 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1294700550 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://www.reddit.com/r/compsci/comments/ez93s/the_future_of_software_system_correctness/c1c7sdo < 1294700595 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: stupid guy, first comes out with this irrelevant halting problem crap then starts being all arrogant < 1294700646 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294700662 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294700663 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all the godel/turing/etc stuff < 1294700676 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :man, I got downvoted < 1294700677 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1294700679 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people just need to STFU about it < 1294700694 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah cool you just learned something new and interesting, NOT EVERYTHING IS A NAIL < 1294700700 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant++ < 1294700726 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why don't we get people that just learned thermodynamics and join every fucking energy discussion with "YYEAH BUT YOU CANT CREATE INFINITE FREE ENERGY SO WHY BOTHER WITH WINDMILLS?" < 1294700739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote 22:55 < qfr> How am I supposed to develop software in Haskell if I can't even prepare my projects in UML?! It seems like an impossible task. HAHA [...] this is amazing, like meeting a Mormon or something < 1294700766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: because you don't have Thermo Engineering < 1294700768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: or Thermo Monkeys < 1294700790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HackEgo: ping :( < 1294700812 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :264) 22:55 < qfr> How am I supposed to develop software in Haskell if I can't even prepare my projects in UML?! It seems like an impossible task. HAHA [...] this is amazing, like meeting a Mormon or something < 1294700856 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the guy is fucking off the wall < 1294700863 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: like totally bonkers < 1294700868 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't even keep up with what's going on < 1294700881 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love the guy responding to me with a condescending tone < 1294700889 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: which guy < 1294700897 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tachi-kaze < 1294700901 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/compsci/comments/ez93s/the_future_of_software_system_correctness/c1c7s0t < 1294700906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the reply to that < 1294700923 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't get the aversion to correctness < 1294700926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: i'm glad to see you've found the secret purpose of #esoteric, other than #minecraft < 1294700927 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's actually completely mad < 1294700930 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-169-71.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294700931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is #behind-people's-backs < 1294700936 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mmm < 1294700940 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: you're godofpumpkins i guess? < 1294700946 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That just means we can't exactly decide when something halts or not <---- nobody cares < 1294700950 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yep :) < 1294701002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: oerjan is FAMOUS, he basically wrote half of the haskell 98 report* < 1294701006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*complete and utter hogwash < 1294701007 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/compsci/comments/ez93s/the_future_of_software_system_correctness/c1c7ks6 < 1294701011 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294701014 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it upsets me that this comment has score 2 < 1294701016 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: point copumpkin to that typo you fixed or whatever!! < 1294701018 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should be -30 < 1294701020 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your fame will never end < 1294701032 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: keep saying that in here and I'm sure it will be :) < 1294701039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did my bit!! HIVEMIND < 1294701041 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doubt it < 1294701046 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION posts to twitter that it should be -30 < 1294701048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now to go make stupid comments < 1294701055 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: WE CAN DO THIS < 1294701056 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I have a lot of dumb followers who do my bidding) < 1294701057 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well only actually downvote it if you agree with me: That his comment is totally irrelevant < 1294701059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if we all work together! < 1294701064 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: there were several and i don't have them memorized < 1294701068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: MORONS DON'T UNDERSTAND QUALIFIERS < 1294701093 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dammit now my z key is acting up < 1294701095 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think tachi-kaze has probably smoked a load of dope < 1294701102 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :holy shit comex has a lot of twitter followers now < 1294701103 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing he says has anny connection to reality < 1294701105 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :107,757... < 1294701107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i remember when he had like < 1294701107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3 < 1294701109 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: indeed :) < 1294701115 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex superstar! < 1294701117 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn dude, getting all famous and hsit < 1294701118 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoa, copumpkin is in this channel < 1294701118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*shit < 1294701121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294701127 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: duh, I follow you around < 1294701129 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's comex? < 1294701133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: this Agora player! < 1294701137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>:D < 1294701139 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, actually I saw people mention it in #haskell(-blah?) < 1294701140 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what he's known for < 1294701141 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :playing Agora < 1294701143 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah < 1294701144 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not a player < 1294701148 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well okay < 1294701150 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EX-agora player < 1294701153 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as of a few days ago :P < 1294701161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but my statement will be correct again soon enough < 1294701164 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex is a playa < 1294701165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: I'm gonna go around tleling people < 1294701168 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I knew comex before he was famous < 1294701170 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1294701173 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why so many followers? < 1294701179 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: superstar, and playa < 1294701181 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you never knew me before I was an Agora player < 1294701182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: he did the new jailbreakme.com iPhone crack < 1294701187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*jailbreak < 1294701187 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your statements contradict ;) < 1294701190 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh cool < 1294701195 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also that's not very new anymore < 1294701198 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well no < 1294701202 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's what propelled you to INTERWEBS INFAMY < 1294701209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: i say new because, i remember using the old jailbreakme < 1294701212 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the day i bought my iphone < 1294701214 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294701215 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good point < 1294701215 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (I have a lot of dumb followers who do my bidding) <-- you do know that voting conspiracies are a bannable offense on reddit, right? < 1294701220 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I helped make that one :P < 1294701226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: he can just say "omg this is so stupid" < 1294701231 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they're not in Agora < 1294701235 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well luckily I don't do such conspiracies < 1294701237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: naw, Haskell can't do anything practical like that < 1294701243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop lying < 1294701246 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: lol, that was pre-haskell :P < 1294701253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh the old one < 1294701253 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then I saw the light and lost interest in iphonez < 1294701275 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294701276 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294701279 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have to go to bed < 1294701280 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not as superstarish as comex, sadly < 1294701287 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did not get anything done < 1294701287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i had comex on vinyl < 1294701291 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this sucks < 1294701294 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's play ircnomic < 1294701298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :before he went platinum < 1294701301 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: don't sleep! < 1294701306 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sleep is for the weak anyway < 1294701311 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: heh, #ircnomic still redirects to ##nomic < 1294701312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT I CAN FIX THAT < 1294701321 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grumble wooble grumble grumble cough < 1294701332 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION eats some orange chicken < 1294701348 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop ditsracting me < 1294701355 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :risdacting < 1294701360 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*risdracting < 1294701391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gah, how can i remove the redirect... < 1294701406 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought comex was famous for iPhone-related reasons before jailbreakme < 1294701407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ehird < 1294701442 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: he had a sex tape < 1294701456 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294701464 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with emma watson < 1294701504 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HOW DO YOU REMOVE A CHANNEL REDIRECT < 1294701507 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the forces of wooble are acting against me < 1294701642 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: this fucking qfr is just an idiot trill < 1294701647 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm bored o fhim < 1294701648 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: #ircnomic now open for business < 1294701654 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't crowd around now < 1294701656 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one at a time < 1294701703 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, I thought it was centuries before we learned the Trills' secrets < 1294701708 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*secret < 1294701724 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo < 1294701745 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: oh, shush < 1294701751 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: do you have a copy of the last ircnomic ruleset :D < 1294701755 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :waht is a trill? < 1294701760 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :star trek. < 1294701765 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294701786 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: well... get one? < 1294701809 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: so have you started playing minecraft yet >:D < 1294701813 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just want to progrma something really simple what is the issuse < 1294701817 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: program what < 1294701828 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: just some really simple algorithms on polynomials < 1294701831 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: hell no < 1294701834 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: do it then :D < 1294701842 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: what language? < 1294701847 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried scheme, haskell and Coq they all fail < 1294701847 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: agda < 1294701849 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: haskell? istr you did some stuff with it < 1294701853 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and polynomialalalallal < 1294701854 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s < 1294701859 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: agda is not a language for human consumption < 1294701860 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or production < 1294701866 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: it's only a matter of time before you're yelling expletives at Notch every day, btw < 1294701867 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I consume and produce it all the time < 1294701875 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: you're a pumpkin < 1294701877 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i said human < 1294701878 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: yeah I tried to write the same program in all languages, none of them are any good < 1294701879 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fair enough < 1294701888 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: and maybe you do, but you certainly don't produce nontrivial proofs in it >:) < 1294701890 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should make my own language < 1294701892 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because that's impossible! < 1294701896 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what was not good about it? < 1294701900 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :about haskell i mean < 1294701902 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: :( < 1294701909 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: COQQQQQ < 1294701917 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: consider modular arithmetic data type < 1294701928 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: you need to implement type level numbers to do it < 1294701932 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote that in two different ways in agda < 1294701935 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or use unsafePerformIO < 1294701936 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :both were painful < 1294701938 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: use she :) < 1294701943 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the best language! < 1294701950 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: yes I did use she < 1294701957 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: then you only have to implement nats ;P < 1294701957 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is she? < 1294701958 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*:P < 1294701963 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: but I don't do modular arithmetic but polynomials < 1294701971 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: she's a thing. < 1294701977 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: she's a preprocessor for haskell < 1294701978 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean the type level "thing" is not a natural but a polynomial < 1294701982 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that I've started using for her other features, too < 1294701986 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not just the autolifting of data < 1294701987 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically it's a clusterfuck < 1294701998 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't do this in a reasonable way in haskuell < 1294701998 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: just define a polynomial normally < 1294702003 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and she will define the type-level version < 1294702004 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :She's an it! < 1294702005 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's wrong with that < 1294702008 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294702011 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: She's a SHE. < 1294702012 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: well, to a degree < 1294702014 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: it does not work that way < 1294702020 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: does for me :-D < 1294702020 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294702022 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on a good day ... < 1294702026 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :she only lifts data constructors < 1294702029 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's true < 1294702032 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but who needs strong kinding < 1294702034 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if j-invariant wants to actually do something to the polynomial < 1294702039 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then he needs to write it himself < 1294702043 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: idk I just can't get stuff working it sucksf < 1294702047 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need proofs too < 1294702051 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you need a polynomial at the type level anyway? < 1294702056 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't program in haskell it's like "woah what if everything is wrong?" < 1294702065 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :agda's getting a better compiler or two soon too < 1294702077 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: Z[x]/(p(x)) < 1294702091 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1294702092 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294702093 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait for epigram2 < 1294702096 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294702104 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NEED < 1294702105 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MORE < 1294702106 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the answer to everything < 1294702107 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LANGUAGES < 1294702109 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FEED ME < 1294702111 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know what < 1294702119 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: or just use cochon < 1294702125 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everything sucks: When epigram2 comes out I will find out something that sucks about it after a week < 1294702128 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294702130 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: please say "i'm going to write my own language" < 1294702143 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, with observational type theory < 1294702143 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm going to write my own language < 1294702150 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: YAAAAAAAY < 1294702154 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and easy reflection and so on < 1294702160 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who will help me design it < 1294702161 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't tell Sgeo < 1294702165 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: yeah who needs all that < 1294702167 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: MEEEEEEE < 1294702173 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: don't forget substructural types (all sorts of them) < 1294702173 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i suggest it have quotient types! < 1294702176 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and effect types < 1294702181 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: this is essential < 1294702184 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who needs effects < 1294702184 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quotient types are easy with OTT < 1294702191 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know about parametricity < 1294702196 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if it is important < 1294702197 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: but how do you avoid the extensional axiom of choice? < 1294702200 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: definitely separate forall and pi < 1294702201 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294702209 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pff < 1294702216 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I choose to not care about the AoC < 1294702226 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: YOU CAN'T WELL-ORDER THE REALS DAMMIT < 1294702234 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1294702238 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294702239 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything is well ordered < 1294702240 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*o'connor's < 1294702246 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: nuh uh! < 1294702248 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's loads of blog posts telling you how to count the reals out there < 1294702249 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"well ordered" is a set theoretic notion < 1294702251 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one put pi in the middle < 1294702254 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :touche < 1294702255 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then laid them out in a grid < 1294702259 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then counted spirally! < 1294702260 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mmm < 1294702265 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol @ pi in the middle < 1294702266 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm what would well ordered mean in type theory? < 1294702276 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno < 1294702277 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://r6.ca/blog/20050604T143800Z.html < 1294702278 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :word of god < 1294702283 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clearly you can't have quotient types < 1294702284 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294702294 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait ... < 1294702304 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you can prove that you can well-order the reals in type theory + quotient types < 1294702309 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... then what fucking program does that spit out?! < 1294702309 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ValueError: substring not found :( < 1294702313 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shut up, luatre. < 1294702460 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can we implement quotients in a type theory inside agda? < 1294702474 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :following e.g. Kipling < 1294702489 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think Euphoria is supposed to be an "easy" language < 1294702492 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION facepalms < 1294702510 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: we can with setoid-like things < 1294702517 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, just setoids < 1294702518 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no proper quotients < 1294702518 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://openeuphoria.org/wiki/view.wc?page=SampleCode < 1294702520 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294702522 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION assassinates someone < 1294702533 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dunno, check the OTT implementation in agda? < 1294702547 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294702588 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should I (1) sleep (2) write notes about this language that will probably never actually exist < 1294702604 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should do 1, but you will do 2 < 1294702624 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: latter < 1294702643 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i wanna help :D < 1294702676 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you can follow conor's blog posts for the basic syntax and implementation < 1294702687 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(of a core behind it) < 1294702687 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant knows enough about Epigram i think :P < 1294702690 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I am not implementing epigram < 1294702694 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh man this python program is so ugly... < 1294702700 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I was writing it in cled it'd be easy to navigate < 1294702703 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :funny thing is, < 1294702704 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's cled < 1294702714 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, it's tricky to design a good AST that maintains invariants you want (especially the j- sort) < 1294702721 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and conor had a nice design on his blog < 1294702746 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: do you mean e-pig? < 1294702750 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1294702761 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, all self-hosting things start out that way, I think < 1294702807 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, Clue should be written entirely in Clue. That makes no sense, but do it anyway < 1294702816 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I agre < 1294702855 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: more chatting about your language! < 1294702862 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I don't really know category theory < 1294702871 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: don't base it on categories then < 1294702880 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: but they are the solution to all problems? < 1294702881 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT AN INTRUIGING IDEA < 1294702887 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: or ARE they!!!!!!!! < 1294702890 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yet < 1294702891 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294702905 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: try and solve 80% of problems then :P < 1294702920 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : self.fill_widget(self) < 1294702920 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TypeError: fill_widget() takes exactly 1 argument (2 given) < 1294702920 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294702950 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i love how tk just ignores errors, it's so cute < 1294703018 0 :rom9com!~Rom@men75-6-82-230-14-45.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294703046 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the fuck ... oh < 1294703048 0 :jesus_muppet!~jesus@soy95-6-88-168-57-135.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294703109 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: gimme a unicode character that looks like a hole, or a box, or a cross or something < 1294703132 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mr. unicode < 1294703134 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :∘ < 1294703136 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(your new name) < 1294703143 0 :calamari!~calamari@ip70-162-184-205.ph.ph.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294703145 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: what is that :D < 1294703177 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when did I become mr unicode? :( < 1294703211 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use compose key < 1294703234 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ōºō°øô < 1294703241 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow it works ... kinda < 1294703251 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a not really working way < 1294703318 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is really stressful < 1294703476 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what is < 1294703500 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't get anything important done :| < 1294703504 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't have the tools < 1294703515 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't have the tools to make the tools etc. < 1294703562 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you have the latter surely < 1294703568 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haskell is good for implementing languages :P < 1294703654 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't "get" haskell < 1294703662 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: there's nothing to get < 1294703666 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know how those guys can do anything with it < 1294703675 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://qntm.org/tesla DARNIT < 1294703701 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: by testing code rather than proving it correct < 1294703708 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: what < 1294703714 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1294703905 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'll try learning OCaml again < 1294703915 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, reading about < 1294703959 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: so tell me about your lang :P < 1294704013 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION turns back to Slate < 1294704093 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: A universal property in category theory holds all extensional information about an objects behavior: the computational object is just a witness for the universal property < 1294704135 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: if we want to do a large scale program it seems necessary to base modules on this: Otherwise a proof might require a computation that spans several modules (and takes hours to compute) < 1294704158 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i meant the language you thought you had enough knowledge to implement, but OK :P < 1294704161 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: but category theory is not entirely non-computational: So it is very difficult < 1294704173 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when did I ever say I have any clue how to make it :P < 1294704226 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well i meant presumably you have a "better-than-Haskell" in your head that's like Haskell except better :) < 1294704230 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i doubt that's based on category theory. < 1294704255 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I don't know if I have any significant ideas to improve haskell < 1294704273 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: don't you have like 10 languages in your head at once :| < 1294704274 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do < 1294704280 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't mean improve haskell < 1294704282 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what i'm saying is < 1294704292 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what language isn't based on category theory, and would be nice to implement this polynomial stuff in, in your head < 1294704551 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: the silly thing is, THAT is the language I was trying to implement < 1294704555 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294704555 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call your language CCC+SK < 1294704562 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: with the polynomials? < 1294704566 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: hahah lmao that quadrescence post about haskell has got a followup < 1294704567 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently, < 1294704568 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: anyway it's sort of an "algebra system" < 1294704572 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since the monad laws aren't automatically enforced, < 1294704576 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: except (dependently) typed < 1294704579 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and since Monad isn't a subclass of Functor, < 1294704584 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haskell is pseudo-mathematics < 1294704588 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: but it's not for writing proofs in, just mathematical algorithm < 1294704588 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294704589 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :loool < 1294704603 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm he isn't here right now < 1294704606 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder if he's gone away forever < 1294704607 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be nice < 1294704608 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quadrescence is odd < 1294704617 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: we've had more than our fair share of him. < 1294704618 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :his last blog post was ridiculous < 1294704621 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than #haskell. < 1294704638 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: which one < 1294704645 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the one about the cargo cult < 1294704646 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Follow-Up to Infamous Post < 1294704648 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294704649 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's old < 1294704662 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: yeah, uh, i'm quoting from the follow up to that < 1294704663 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294704674 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I figiured < 1294704676 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-i < 1294704698 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i started reading his uhh "book" < 1294704704 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he seems to think that rewriting languages solve everything < 1294704708 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*term rewriting < 1294704727 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10.12.27:22:32:19 Quadrescence: can you make any constructive suggestions? < 1294704727 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10.12.27:22:33:08 rename monad to something else, delete "morphism" from your vocabulary unless you have reason to need it < 1294704727 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10.12.27:22:36:27 Quadrescence: that's not radical enough < 1294704728 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10.12.27:22:37:56 ok, rename haskell to Fortran++ < 1294704766 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294704785 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he kept bugging everyone in here to write for his blog :) < 1294704858 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: seen cryptol? < 1294704862 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ages ago yes < 1294704867 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's ... kinda cool i guess? < 1294704869 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: a bit like that, I guess < 1294704877 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"kinda cool"?? < 1294704879 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294704883 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't look into it much! < 1294704883 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's great < 1294704891 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except non free... < 1294704896 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: if you're going to write like, a dependent CAS, then i wouldn't try and e.g. implement polynomials in haskell < 1294704900 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the idea is good though: Use dependent types < 1294704905 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I'd implement a sort-of-symbolic dependent language < 1294704907 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and do the rest in that < 1294704923 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1294704925 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dependent types are hard to implement nicely though < 1294704931 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and are still hard to program in < 1294704956 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: why are you ehird < 1294704983 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because i am < 1294704996 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: says the agda user < 1294704998 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coq is soo easy :}}}} < 1294705005 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294705014 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're still hard < 1294705017 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coq and agda are equally useless < 1294705023 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294705028 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :computers are useless, let's get rid of them < 1294705031 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the specific thing I want to do < 1294705041 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you really need your own lang for it i feel... < 1294705047 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Axiom is kinda close to what you want in fact. < 1294705055 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, a dependent CAS < 1294705063 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. The free ATi drivers seem to be genuinely non-shitty these days. < 1294705145 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: i need a unicode cross or something < 1294705146 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in X < 1294705153 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or a hollow square or circle < 1294705156 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FILL MY NEED < 1294705297 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: . < 1294705299 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: have you seen Axiom? < 1294705325 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yup, definitely *insanely* better at video display, and I don't actually have a good OpenGL test case... < 1294705352 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But as I clearly don't actually use OpenGL much, moot point. :P < 1294705383 0 :jesus_muppet!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294705420 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: no < 1294705426 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you perhaps should < 1294705437 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's also a gigantic literate program :^) < 1294705482 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: basically Axiom is this crazy developed-since-1970 literate program that implements a strongly-typed, mathematical type hierarchy-based CAS < 1294705493 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ee/Matrixinmatrix.jpg < 1294705495 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: note the Type: lines < 1294705501 0 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-65-80.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1294705510 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: fully symbolic, etc. < 1294705525 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: yeah really I should stop being such a hermit and just use existing software < 1294705540 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: oh i am not saying that axiom is the solution < 1294705544 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i'm saying you should look at it :) < 1294705561 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Axiom_(computer_algebra_system)#Documentation click a pdf and start reading :D < 1294705567 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: k, ignored < 1294705571 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the literate program < 1294705574 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: oh grow up < 1294705586 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why did coppro ignore? < 1294705596 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because he's even more childish than I am < 1294705599 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because this channel is better without ehird < 1294705600 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :eherd < 1294705606 0 :eherd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm a herd of Es < 1294705619 0 :eherd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*this channel is almost silent without < 1294705627 0 :eherd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the bits that aren't silent, mostly incomprehensible one-sided conversations < 1294705652 0 :eherd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I think there are probably very few systems developed since the early 70s < 1294705662 0 :eherd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that are still in active (non-maintanence) development today < 1294705670 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eherd: changing your nick is not sufficient < 1294705674 0 :eherd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*maintenance < 1294705680 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294705689 0 :eherd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: my ident hasn't changed < 1294705694 0 :eherd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: so if it's based on nickserv: HI. < 1294705708 0 :eherd!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ehurd < 1294705710 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, OMFG kernel mode setting. < 1294705711 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Axiom project focuses on the "30 Year Horizon". The primary philosophy is that Axiom needs to develop several fundamental features in order to be useful to the next generation of computational mathematicians. Knuth's literate programming technique is used throughout the source code. Axiom plans to use proof technology to prove the correctness of the algorithms (such as Coq and ACL2). < 1294705715 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: there's no possible way i'm still ignored now < 1294705722 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol literate programming < 1294705724 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow this is interetsing < 1294705727 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't not heard zzo38 today < 1294705736 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It makes my framebuffer actually use the native resolution of the display! < 1294705737 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294705743 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OTHER THINGS ZZO38 LIKES: BREATHING < 1294705786 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehurd: this is interesting actually, gonna check it out < 1294705797 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: "For example, Axiom’s integrator gives you the an- swer when an answer exists. If one does not, it provides a proof that there is no answer." < 1294705813 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*answer < 1294705836 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: "A function can take a type as argument, and its return value can also be a type. For example, Fraction is a function, that takes an IntegralDomain as argument, and returns the field of fractions of its argument." < 1294705847 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i think this is more like \Omega{}mega than Agda, though < 1294705854 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure though < 1294705932 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1294705935 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omegamega is so stupid < 1294705973 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehurd: so apparently you have a u now < 1294705999 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: is it? < 1294706001 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: oh indeed < 1294706013 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: it's obvious that your ignore didn't fail, btw. < 1294706025 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehurd: it's just crazy, like reimplementing everything at multiple levels? < 1294706033 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well i might be wrong < 1294706035 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i just meant < 1294706041 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i don't think that axiom lets you do actual dependency < 1294706044 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i.e. pi types < 1294706048 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: sigma maybe < 1294706058 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i don't know omegamega, so i wasn't trying to draw a strong comparison. < 1294706104 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294706105 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehurd: it's probably dynamically checking types < 1294706110 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: no i do not think so < 1294706113 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's strongly-typed < 1294706124 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: which volume are you reading? < 1294706125 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or are you not < 1294706190 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ? < 1294706209 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's this "30 year horizon"? < 1294706228 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's neither sigma, nor pi, nor dynamically checking < 1294706236 0 :drakhan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Wychodzi < 1294706250 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: owhat are you talking about? :D < 1294706256 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omega < 1294706337 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was talking about axiom < 1294706401 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am seeing universal properties and categories everywhre < 1294706429 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :categories are everywhere < 1294706436 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so are universal properties! < 1294706443 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: I realized that divisibility forms a category < 1294706449 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an order < 1294706459 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any partial order can be made into a category < 1294706464 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ < 1294706469 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's described at the top < 1294706488 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: so which volume are you reading < 1294706517 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :divisibility is more special than any old partial order < 1294706521 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294706563 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most partial orders are more special than any old partial order :P < 1294706568 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: what < 1294706571 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: helloooo < 1294706572 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, we can set up a partial order of partial orders < 1294706574 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by specialness < 1294706588 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: oh you crafty < 1294706594 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294706609 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: how many more times should i ping you < 1294706702 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: < 1294706705 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :??? < 1294706729 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: which volume are you reading < 1294706730 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of Axiom < 1294706753 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not < 1294706860 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you said about the 30 year thing < 1294706863 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's mentioned in the book < 1294706879 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://axiom-developer.org/axiom-website/bookvol0.pdf is the introduction book which contains all the interesting info < 1294706886 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vs. all the implementation details and code in the rest more or less :P < 1294706896 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: contains the general overview of the system and cool stuff etc. < 1294706934 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well ok there's more but < 1294706949 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: DID I MENTION: category theory plays a large part in axiom < 1294706951 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC < 1294706997 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although i don't know that for _sure_ < 1294707145 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes you are < 1294707355 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: are you reading it? :p < 1294707381 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i think it's actually surprisingly close to what you were talking about wanting, from reading this volume 0 < 1294707420 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: heh it uses categories to mean something other than what category theory means by them < 1294707422 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think < 1294707571 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think j-invariant fell asleep < 1294707649 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hii < 1294707664 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: are you kirby all of a sudden? < 1294707675 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294707679 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1294707759 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehurd: compare: < 1294707771 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(10 http://www.reddit.com/r/compsci/comments/ez93s/the_future_of_software_system_correctness/c1c6ps2 < 1294707774 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(1) < 1294707789 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what's 2 :P < 1294707789 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(2) http://www.reddit.com/r/compsci/comments/ez93s/the_future_of_software_system_correctness/c1c7ks6 < 1294707804 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly the same thing except one guy said "prime numbers" and the other guy said "halting problem" < 1294707808 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294707820 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ZOMG ALAN TURING. MUST UPVOTE < 1294707829 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuckin pathetic :/ < 1294707833 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not worth getting worked up over! < 1294707837 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now read the axiom introduction, it's really interesting :P < 1294707848 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm only on page 13 and i think it's cool < 1294707849 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, il be back in a moment < 1294707861 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1294708155 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: you have strayed into a deadly trap < 1294708162 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294708191 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: being the only active person who doesn't have me ignored >:) < 1294708196 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now watch as i force you to test my awful software < 1294708198 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mwahahahahahahaha < 1294708208 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294708221 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, I'm busy < 1294708226 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :busy testing, yes < 1294708231 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my god, it's 381 lines < 1294708232 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how did that happen < 1294708371 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1294708631 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/cw06e/the_mercury_language_take_prolog_speed_it_up/c0vpmgg < 1294708708 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: tell me how ehird bashes it ok < 1294708721 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I linked to was a joke < 1294708738 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although yeah, I'm looking at Mercury < 1294708739 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: why does it say "Yes"? < 1294708767 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's funny because prolog impls print yes < 1294708777 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: prince xml was written in mercury, btw < 1294708793 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and is a very advanced, complex program, sold for lots of money, with a small binary size < 1294708800 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o.O < 1294708803 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :converts XML/HTML + CSS into PDF, basically, with very high quality < 1294708811 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://princexml.com/ < 1294708816 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, ehurd is not bashing Mercury. < 1294708817 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :proof that the language can do shit, at least < 1294708817 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehurd: no they don't? < 1294708822 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: impossible < 1294708827 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yes they do < 1294708830 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This sort of reaction is what got me interested in Factor so long ago < 1294708834 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well... < 1294708834 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he didn't mention it first < 1294708836 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ok they actually don't < 1294708836 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it can't be good < 1294708838 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they print No! < 1294708840 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's what matters < 1294708843 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehurd: that's some stupid SWI prolog thing < 1294708849 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait no it's not < 1294708859 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: well i wouldn't want to write an actual program in Mercury myself. < 1294708870 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :logic programming doesn't gel with me. < 1294708887 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the fact that it has no cut or side-effects is nice :) < 1294708918 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: do you want to try out the initial cled prototype :D < 1294708934 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294708956 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p7989249361.txt < 1294708959 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: just run as: python cled.py < 1294708968 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try not to defocus the window afterwards, it doesn't like that < 1294708986 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: most of the underlying stuff is written but not exposed as the ui... but it can manipulate integer argument lists! < 1294708995 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The tutorial could use some work < 1294709013 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: quick rundown: lilac background means it's selected. j and k move around the current active object, selecting children of it, showed by highlighting with lilac. < 1294709030 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: e descends into the currently selected object. d ascends upwards from any objects. < 1294709044 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: if you descend into an integer, then you can rewrite the integer by typing a new one and hitting or d. < 1294709066 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mutable inteegers... < 1294709067 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: to add a new element to a list (only in . -> things now (they're called examples)), press = to insert after the current element. + (shift-=) to insert before. < 1294709069 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: no < 1294709071 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's an editor < 1294709080 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's like seeing 42, pressing backspace twice, and typing a new on < 1294709080 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1294709084 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an AST-based code editor < 1294709092 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: press x to delete an argument. < 1294709107 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: now, if you do =, it's "?", because it's waiting to decide what type you'll put in based on your input < 1294709109 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is called a box < 1294709116 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you d before entering a type, you'll see an ugly red ? in your program < 1294709121 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :these are call boxes, but they should be called holes. < 1294709130 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're basically just things that need objects but haven't filled in yet < 1294709136 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice it works! < 1294709139 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you try and delete the output of an example, or all the inputs, you just get a single box instead < 1294709144 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's pretty much it for now < 1294709148 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note that if you ascend too far everything breaks < 1294709159 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294709166 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and "r" replaces the current selected thing with a box < 1294709171 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which will probably be useful somehow! < 1294709177 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's possible to descend too far?? < 1294709181 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: no < 1294709183 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can ascend too far < 1294709197 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you try and go above the list of examples < 1294709223 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: oh and Ctrl+S prints the current program to stdout < 1294709230 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note that if you have boxes, this'll be an invalid program < 1294709258 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool < 1294709290 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and you should be able to enter [ into a hole instead of a digit or -, to get a list < 1294709292 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that doesn't work yet :) < 1294709311 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: incidentally, the programs are pretty-printed. < 1294709326 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so for instance it outputs < 1294709327 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depth of first ~ {. 0 -> 0 < 1294709327 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : . 5 -> 0 } < 1294709328 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depth of first ~ {:. [[1 2] [3 4]] -> 2 < 1294709330 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [1 2] -> 1 < 1294709332 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : :. [[[1 2 3] 4] 5] -> 3 < 1294709334 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : : [[1 2 3] 4] -> 2} < 1294709336 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depth of first ~ is list?; cons; car; cdr; succ; 0 < 1294709338 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the right alignment everywhere < 1294709340 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that isn't generated by the code, but i know it does it properly :)) < 1294709346 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or wait i think i did feed it in at some point. anyway.) < 1294709424 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i'm not going to be able to convince you to read the first volume of axiom, am i :D < 1294709459 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294709586 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok i'll stop bugging you about it < 1294709658 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294709716 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294709857 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1294710018 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehurd: I am going to read it < 1294710025 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: \o/ < 1294710026 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :             | < 1294710026 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :             |\ < 1294710046 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I don't think it does do type-checking at runtime... that would be lame anyway < 1294710054 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also I like the idea of it more if it doesn't :P < 1294710074 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: lol, you declare a module system like you do types, and even structures (like ring) < 1294710077 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's all the same mechanism < 1294710103 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Because the argument of Matrix is required to be a Ring, Axiom will not build nonsensical types such as “matrices of input files”." < 1294710107 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb implementing matrices of input files < 1294710119 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yep, just read, it typechecks at compile times < 1294710121 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*time < 1294710198 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*just read that it < 1294710246 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294710310 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehurd: wow, both great < 1294710314 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's good < 1294710344 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm only on page 21... wonder how much mindbending stuff is in the next 1198 pages < 1294710345 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294710359 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm actually page 40 < 1294710364 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but 21 in the actual book < 1294710384 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty huge book, considering this is only volume 0 < 1294710392 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder if you can buy a complete set bound in leather that takes up a whole shelf < 1294710425 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: btw here's a link, mostly for my logreading benefit since i had to find it again before: axiom-developer.org/axiom-website/bookvol0.pdf < 1294710428 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*http://axiom-developer.org/axiom-website/bookvol0.pdf < 1294710570 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: this seems to do a lot of stuff as polynomials, lol < 1294710579 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think you've accidentally reinvented this < 1294710602 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: mind you, i'd still like to see what you come up with < 1294710639 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The function factor can also be applied to complex numbers but the results aren’t quite so obvious as for factoring integer: < 1294710639 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :144 + 24*%i < 1294710639 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :144+24 i < 1294710641 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Type: Complex Integer" < 1294710645 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i smell a documentation bug < 1294710732 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Chapter XXX describes these modules in < 1294710732 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more detail." < 1294710832 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: hur hur it's funny because ex < 1294710833 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sex < 1294710839 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No < 1294710843 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what then < 1294710852 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just complaining about the incompleteness of the documentation < 1294710875 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is that incomplete < 1294710887 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ? < 1294710902 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: it's a book, what's the issue < 1294710907 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Those XXXs are all over the place < 1294710915 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It's a number, isn't it. < 1294710916 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :30. < 1294710919 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No < 1294710929 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume you're talking about Axiom? < 1294710936 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm talking about Mercury < 1294710938 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1294710942 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then I don't care! Yay! < 1294710950 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: should i make my own language < 1294710958 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about it < 1294711035 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294711038 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: semi-dependent-typing, in that it has kinds and metakinds etc. etc. etc., and kinds are automatically derived from normal data types (with the same name and constructors), /but/ nothing crosses the : < 1294711042 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i.e., no pi types < 1294711049 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because < 1294711052 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds easier to implement :D < 1294711060 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bye < 1294711061 0 :ehurd!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294711279 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294711286 0 :luatre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294711453 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294711576 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294711880 0 :cheater99!~cheater@g228063205.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294712646 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294712786 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294712858 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Formal proof of correctness is not only tedious, time-consuming, and outlandishly expensive, it's also not necessarily effective! People commit errors when attempting a formal proof. There is no fool-proof way of determining if a proof is correct or not. -- JeffGrigg < 1294712910 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh yes there is < 1294712916 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clearly he doesn't know what a formal proof is < 1294712982 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294713011 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1294713021 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan! < 1294713034 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :morning orejan < 1294713037 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: wait what? < 1294713043 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it says "adjunction" posted that < 1294713043 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan < 1294713050 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but adjunction clearly doesn't think that < 1294713054 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I've seen other things he posted < 1294713132 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is confused < 1294713204 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :¡coppro, oklopol < 1294713325 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe j-invariant is adjunction < 1294713515 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION needs MORE < 1294713518 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MORE LANGUAGES < 1294713519 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MORE < 1294713523 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes nuts < 1294713534 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: learn all languages at once: Oz < 1294713544 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find myself interested in the concept of dataflow programming < 1294713555 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, is there still any work being done on Oz? < 1294713565 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Last ... thingy was 2008 < 1294713644 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" j-invariant: yeah there is basically no way you could do recursive functions (only flow control other than branching really) with a stupid search like that" <<< actually i have a good feeling about another way to do recursion stuff, although the idea is so simple i'll want to try it before saying it might work < 1294713660 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i'm usually right, like i was right about demolishing! < 1294713671 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...wait < 1294713687 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i am incapable or ferror < 1294713724 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :demolishing/ < 1294713876 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294713961 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monad_%28category_theory%29 < 1294713974 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294713994 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" 21:29 cdsmithus: EvanR-work: It's pretty easy to see. Just enumerate all the 0-length strings (finitely many), then all the 1-length, then the 2-length, and so on. Every finite string has some length, and will be reached eventually" <<< this doesn't work < 1294714105 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um yes it does < 1294714114 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as long as your alphabet is finite < 1294714115 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PENIS < 1294714149 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if your alphabet is countably infinite, though... < 1294714172 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can still enumerate it. < 1294714175 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1294714195 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Googles Go language uses a quicksort, though this is considered by some to be a bug. < 1294714196 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" < 1294714197 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lolwhat? < 1294714204 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :length + sum(ord(chr)) < n < 1294714222 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1294714222 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be one way < 1294714273 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Somewhat typical of PHPs API, there are actually thirteen different built-in array sorting functions" < 1294714315 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is that about < 1294714324 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oklopol: i am incapable or ferror <-- so, which one is it? < 1294714338 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it's both. < 1294714428 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: quicksort has bad worst-case behavior... < 1294714443 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I said "Ah" after reading the compaints < 1294714501 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, "Ah" is such a heavily information-loaded word < 1294714875 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1294714982 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" oklopol likes Python for, like, totally different reasons to everyone else." <<< the reason i like python is i used to like it, and used it so much it's soooooooooooo easy now. this is also why my programs are so retarded in syntax and how i do things locally, i actually don't think at all, i just write < 1294715021 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294715075 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294715173 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294715189 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :' Why don't we get people that just learned thermodynamics and join every fucking energy discussion with "YYEAH BUT YOU CANT CREATE INFINITE FREE ENERGY SO WHY BOTHER WITH WINDMILLS?"' xD < 1294715202 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@209.59.220.33 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294715256 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, you like Python for the same reason I do! < 1294715270 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am more practiced with Python than any other language < 1294715406 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, Sgeo Java has some weird behavior. <= 7 elements it uses insertion sort and > 7 it uses quicksort < 1294715560 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: well that's not so weird < 1294715576 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's well known that simpler sorts are faster for very short lists < 1294715587 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also pure quicksort? < 1294715589 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, actually it happens to be optimal for other reasons as well < 1294715589 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no introsort? < 1294715591 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, erm no < 1294715597 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant to say "modified quicksort" < 1294715613 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the number 7 isn't arbitrary either < 1294715646 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i'd assume without evidence that the <= 7 case is also used for sorting sublists in the quicksort? < 1294715665 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, yes < 1294715694 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION gets the source - hang on < 1294715766 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, < 1294715789 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Java's sort is based on http://portal.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=172710 < 1294715866 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" um yes it does" " as long as your alphabet is finite" <<< also the algorithm of doing nothing works. (as long as the alphabet is empty) < 1294715889 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no bloody abstract < 1294715890 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How long until we have non-Python languages running on CPython? < 1294715908 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: BRILLIANT < 1294715920 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Atomo runs on Haskell's whatever, a bunch of stuff runs on Erlang's VM, I'm pretty sure there's Ruby stuff.... < 1294715926 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :JVM and .NET are obvious < 1294715958 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, Sgeo btw - I was talking about an array of ints < 1294715968 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it uses something else (I think merge sort) for objects < 1294715975 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: huh < 1294715987 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: if you'd read context from 64 hours ago, you'd've known alphabet was just specified countable < 1294716001 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, int[] array is sorted differently than Integer[] array < 1294716003 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: O KAY < 1294716054 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: i guess they are assuming comparing two elements is so much more expensive then that it affects things... < 1294716077 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there should be a nonstandard set theory: \exists set S such that S^N is finite, but S is nonempty < 1294716088 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(from nonstandard analysis, although that was probably clear) < 1294716098 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, I don't remember exactly what they use to sort Objects. I __think__ its merge sort < 1294716195 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: hm. i could see why they'd want to use a different cutoff but not why they'd switch to another sort for large arrays entirely < 1294716255 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, I'm no Java expert - I just spent one semester too long learning Java :-\ < 1294716287 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well me neither < 1294716299 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't even learned it properly < 1294716324 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know everything about java, but i still can't understand love < 1294716389 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love the java jive and it loves me < 1294716494 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hate the halting problem < 1294716520 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like the least interesting piece of math ever, and everyone thinks they understand what it means on a deep philosophical level < 1294716587 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should be stripped of its popularity by force < 1294716626 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan so < 1294716633 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...it is the basis of most other undecidability theorems, isn't it < 1294716635 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you catch my inverse semigroup stuff < 1294716636 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294716640 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO < 1294716643 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION runs away < 1294716645 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it's a very important theorem, yes < 1294716681 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it shouldn't be uninvented or anything < 1294716688 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's tons of interesting stuff *on top of it* < 1294716768 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the popularity that annoys me < 1294716783 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, well right, it's not actually the *least* interesting piece of math ever, maybe :D < 1294716824 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's not a particularly interesting theorem < 1294716884 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i always hate it when someone tries to add ugly technicaly philosophy to a beautiful and pure formal mathematical theorems < 1294716894 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*technical < 1294716926 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294716935 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294716939 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294716949 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ more random adjectives before the terms why not < 1294716951 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like listening to a philosophy prof talk about math < 1294716958 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's almost actually painful < 1294717000 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i proved that in an inverse semigroup (so *unique* y such that x = xyx, y = yxy), idempotents form a semilattice < 1294717062 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: i haven't actually heard, but my dad studied philosophy, and he could recite these completely meaningless statements he'd learned for class that were some sort of explanations for the achilles paradox etc < 1294717064 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1294717071 0 :Slereah!~butt@ANantes-259-1-71-195.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1294717071 0 :jix!jix@tomakin.h-ix.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294717096 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294717104 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe they weren't meaningless originally, but my dad butchered them completely :D < 1294717134 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1294717142 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1294717211 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but in any case, who the fuck needs to learn about the achilles paradox... if i started studying philosophy, and i realized i was listening to a *lecture* about that retarded thing, i'd probably take a good look in the mirror, and kill everyone. < 1294717242 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: THAT'S NOT ALL THOUGH < 1294717246 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...about inverse semigroups < 1294717248 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um if you don't know any calculus and stuff then it probably _is_ somewhat mysterious < 1294717344 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, possibly; now consider an arbitrary congruence on an inverse semigroup < 1294717354 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in the usual semigroup sense) < 1294717369 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(although it does turn out that the quotient is an inverse semigroup) < 1294717379 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION surrenders and goes to install Cygwin < 1294717413 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that's not actually trivial i think, you need lallement's lemma, which says for all idempotents in the image, there is an idempotent in the preimage) < 1294717426 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's call this congruence p < 1294717477 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we define x p_{min} y <=> \exists e \in E_S: xe = ye, x^-1 x p e p y^-1 y < 1294717504 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's an equivalence relation, since idempotents commute < 1294717519 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait... < 1294717542 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let that be true for xe = ye, yf = zf < 1294717555 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then i was thinking xef = yef = yfe = zfe = zef < 1294717565 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but is the second thing true < 1294717583 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well of course it is < 1294717604 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's E_S < 1294717609 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because we know y^-1 y p f, and therefore e p f, and therefore also x^-1 x p f < 1294717611 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh sorry < 1294717612 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :idempotents < 1294717616 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forgot to define < 1294717644 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yeah that's an eq relation, but here's the fun thing: that's actually the minimal congruence with the same trace < 1294717665 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's some = missing up there < 1294717674 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where? < 1294717684 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x^-1 x p e p y^-1 y < 1294717687 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :p is a relation < 1294717694 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294717695 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :congruence < 1294717704 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294717717 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION somehow started reading it as an idempotent < 1294717718 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was rho in the lecture notes, and i'm copy pasting from my head < 1294717731 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the definition anyway < 1294717746 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm... Does ShowIP have some subtle bias: IPv4 addresses get shown as red and IPv6 addresses as green... :-) < 1294717746 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so for instance, consider the trivial congruence S x S < 1294717753 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let that be p < 1294717773 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then, p_{min} is actually the minimal congruence q such that S/q is a group < 1294717789 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because a quotient is a group if and only if idempotents are identified < 1294717818 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because an inverse semigroup is a group iff it has exactly one idempotent < 1294717874 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to prove that \exists e \in E_S: xe = ye, x^-1 x p e p y^-1 y is a congruence, you prove that it's a left congruence and that it's a right congruence separately, and that's actually kinda technical < 1294717883 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you have to guess the idempotent < 1294717931 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but so let x p_{min} y, and e be the proof; consider xz vs. yz and the idempotent z'ez where ' is inverse < 1294717984 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then xzz'ez = xezz'z = xez = yez = yezz'z = yzz'ez < 1294717992 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aaaaaaand umm < 1294717995 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i don't think i'm capable of concentrating enough to follow this stuff < 1294718003 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alright :P < 1294718007 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you get the actual theorem tho? < 1294718022 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think that's really nice even if i skip the proof < 1294718052 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that for each congruence p, there's minimal p_{min} with the same trace, with that definition i gave < 1294718056 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck < 1294718061 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trace = what idempotents are identified < 1294718073 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not very organized :\ < 1294718088 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's hard too because i don't have an intuition for how "inverses" are supposed to behave < 1294718135 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm wait is x^-1 x = x x^-1 always? < 1294718146 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like in groups, except that there are multiple 1-elements. < 1294718151 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is my intuition < 1294718154 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1294718168 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x^-1 x = x x^-1 <<< no, but both are idempotent < 1294718205 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :idempotents commute, so often you just care about the fact you have *some* idempotent somewhere < 1294718221 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should give examples maybe, have none... < 1294718339 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it took me quite a while to get a grip on how inverse semigroups work < 1294718374 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i don't exactly blame you if you have no ability to follow the stuff, mainly i wanted to advertise properties of inv semigroups... :D < 1294718409 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like that p_{min} thing, which is unique to inv semigroups in the semigroup monoid group etc family < 1294718416 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(afaik!) < 1294718436 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fun use for ShowIP. Visit all sorts of IPv6-related sites and see which ones support IPv6. < 1294718440 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(erm i mean of course it's true for groups......) < 1294718445 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but yeah) < 1294718488 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alright my alarm clock is tickling. < 1294718567 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: ooh, i guess we're just a week or two from exhaustion now? < 1294718591 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or has it already happened < 1294718603 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that APNIC allocation thing) < 1294718614 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :algebra is so damn sexy really, if i was any good at it, i might even consider doing my phd out of that stuff < 1294718648 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: tickling alarm clock? < 1294718678 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i mean i'm awesome at it but i don't really have an intuition on what constitutes as interesting new research < 1294718689 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not yet... Projections are turn of the month... But APNIC can justify allocation at any moment. < 1294718722 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course, i suppose you should always try to follow the road of *actually solving problems* < 1294718735 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION imagines bosses at APNIC headquarters sitting rubbing their hands and cackling maniacally < 1294718743 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: tickling sounds like it could mean some sort of beeping imo < 1294718755 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i already once used that word wrong in your presense < 1294718764 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :presence < 1294718771 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well there are already vibrating cell phones... < 1294718788 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294718797 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but a tickling alarm clock would sort of have to be _in_ your bed... < 1294718811 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my bed is too full of stuff to fit an alarm clock < 1294718814 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well or it could be a wrist watch i guess < 1294718824 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: do you have room to sleep :D < 1294718848 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, almost! < 1294718857 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should consider cleaning up this place at some poitn < 1294718859 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*point < 1294718865 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaa < 1294718869 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't remind me < 1294718897 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's been about a week and i haven't moved any of the stuff, and since i moved from a twice bigger apartment, there's suddenly huge amounts of stuff :D < 1294718913 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1294719016 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :these student apartments are so crappy i'm actually considering applying for a better one, mainly due to the facts i'm never going to be able to eat food if i have to prepare it in the presence of other people, everyone hears me watch porn at night and the fact the refrigerator wakes me up at 4 am ever morning < 1294719050 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the last one is actually not annoying at all, i just wanted to mention it :D < 1294719065 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294719116 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but a place full of students is like the worst place to have thin walls, at 4 am on a wednesday, it's not rare to feel someone suddently yell "WHAT THE FUCK MAN?!?" < 1294719124 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh < 1294719397 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It appears most dedicated IPv6 sites have IPv6 addresses... But some don't. < 1294719586 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Last entry on IANA allocations for IPv6: 2006-10-03... That's over 4 years ago... < 1294720057 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294720697 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1294721095 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whee... Mac OS X doesn't support DHCPv6 (according to these slides). < 1294721153 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haha... Blank slide titled "Response from Users". < 1294721468 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@209.59.220.33 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294723026 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294723375 0 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-d9329152.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294723673 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-CGIii_eTOk < 1294723681 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::'/ < 1294723832 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294723899 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1294723909 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294724234 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3bkmD-70e4&feature=related&fmt=18 < 1294724308 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All C#-like languages bore me < 1294724381 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION says that as he listens to a song he STRONGLY associates with Vala < 1294724408 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders why Sgeo adds the # < 1294724435 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because most of these highly marketed languages are closer to C# than C? < 1294724445 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although yeah, C-like bores me too < 1294724458 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not "highly" I guess. Hmm < 1294724493 0 :mycroftiv!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294724507 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it might be interesting experimenting with words, rhymes & rhytm.. but language becomes indefferent if u really want to say something < 1294724561 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION was not aware that C# had spawned its own subfamily < 1294724639 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most dedicated IPv6 sites support IPv6... But seems that many don't. :-) < 1294724667 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ugh. We really need to get on the ball and start supporting IPv7. < 1294725743 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shortest IPv6 address I have seen on public webserver: 11 characters. Longest: 39 (which is the longest possible). < 1294725849 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe the shortest possible valid IPv6 unicast address would be 9 characters... < 1294725909 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, actually, nope... 7. < 1294725955 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294726057 0 :cal153!~cal@c-24-4-207-72.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294726076 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2003::1 is at least an allocated address. < 1294726455 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll locate _your_ address < 1294726566 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What happens when we run out of MAC addresses? < 1294726716 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only 2^6 organizations can make network cards? < 1294726744 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :64 < 1294726751 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :64 manufacturers < 1294726756 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Past that, we run out < 1294726991 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2^6? < 1294726993 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where'd you learn to math < 1294726997 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :6 HEX digits < 1294727029 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mac addresses are 12 hex digits; first half is manufacturer, second is device < 1294727092 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 16^6 < 1294727093 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 16777216 < 1294727143 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :onoez. each manufacturer can only make 16m nics! < 1294727155 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, they can get another id < 1294727158 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly < 1294727160 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe they give them out in ranges < 1294727162 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION shrugs < 1294727166 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is why it's stupid to break it up that way < 1294727175 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gotta break it up somehow < 1294727177 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16^12 < 1294727181 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 16^12 < 1294727182 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 281474976710656 < 1294727189 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :better to hand out multiple ids to a manufacturer than give too many device ids to one and nobody can use them < 1294727298 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not just hand out ranges of MACs on a need-some-more basis and just have a public database if you really need the manufacturer? < 1294727303 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it works for IPs... < 1294727316 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dunno, i just sorta guessed it was something like that < 1294727335 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.coffer.com/mac_find/ < 1294727338 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh how about that < 1294727347 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :first google result for "mac address manufacturer database" ;P < 1294727348 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294727371 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://standards.ieee.org/cgi-bin/ouisearch < 1294727376 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also that < 1294727388 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it does look like an as needed basis < 1294727393 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :intel has a bunch but they aren't consecutive < 1294727571 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oops < 1294727579 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait < 1294727583 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3com cards used to be 00:01:02, but now they have a billion (for billion = 47) vendor IDs. < 1294727597 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wikipedia says 8 bits for the manufacturer < 1294727621 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are some flags in the upper bits. < 1294727626 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least two. < 1294727634 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wow, I misread the image < 1294727699 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybes I needs sleep < 1294727700 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s < 1294727904 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just don't understand why they need to assign them in 16m chunks < 1294727915 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that i care all that much < 1294727966 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Assigning in smaller units would mean more processing of "gimme more" forms. < 1294727986 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha < 1294727993 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess the assumption is that if you're manufacturing chips, you're going to do a lot of them. < 1294728070 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder how many vendors go out of business or stop manufacturing right in the middle of a block. or right at the beginning of one even < 1294728247 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They've only allocated 14503 OUIs out of the 4194304 possible, so we don't seem to be running out just ye. < 1294728257 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/ye\./yet./ < 1294728327 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1294728333 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is Rexx, and why is it so low on popularity charts < 1294728337 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Often lower than COBOL < 1294729288 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294729294 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1294729645 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are quite many Rexx-using Amigists, due to ARexx; but maybe that does not count. < 1294729681 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not-so-uncommon as an embedded scripting language sort of thing. < 1294729860 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess you could even call ARexx the Amiga AppleScript, except that sounds pretty silly. < 1294729971 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also I'd like to mention that I'm not an Amiga user, but some of my best friends are (er... were), and there is nothing "wrong" or "shameful" about being one, despite what some people say. < 1294730501 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :morning < 1294730523 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or should I say night. < 1294730564 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Woke up due to electric saw. Which was used due to the people here to repair the leaking water from the roof. Oh well. < 1294730582 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is already morning-time. < 1294730618 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, it isn't morning until 09:00 IMO < 1294730632 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, and even then only if it has to be. < 1294730656 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I was woken up by this sound at 07:33 < 1294730662 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd classify anything before 04:00 as night, after 06:00 as morning, and the part in the middle is a bit of a grey area. < 1294730669 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was woken up by an alarm clock at 07:10. < 1294730678 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, briefly, anyway. < 1294730691 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It didn't quite "take", and then I actually got up at 08:10 or so. < 1294730694 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I prefer morning to start at 10:00 and end at 11:30 < 1294730714 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :11:30-12:00 is "förmiddag" (can't remember English word for that atm) < 1294730730 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(wait, does English have afternoon but not prenoon?) < 1294730799 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They sort-of have a "forenoon", but I think that's a bit rare. < 1294730839 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also WordNet conflates that with "morning". < 1294730846 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1. morning, morn, morning time, forenoon -- (the time period between dawn and noon; "I spent the morning running errands") < 1294730861 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OED lists it separately, but still as "The portion of the day before noon". < 1294730913 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think they quite separate morgon/förmiddag like we do. (That's fi: aamu/aamupäivä.) < 1294731040 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even going by the dawn-based definition of "morning", it already is that here: sunrise today is at 09:15, and it's about 09:30 now. < 1294731177 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you pesky southerners and your early mornings < 1294731932 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Intriguing: Trondheim (suggested by grep) is at 63.43N (10.395E) while Lieksa (the place I'm sort-of from except not quite) is at 63.32N (30.025E); that's only a 12 kilometre difference in the North-South direction. < 1294732081 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh i guess it's just the timezone difference then < 1294732117 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The "from" was also in sort of an "originally from" sense; currently I'm in Helsinki, which is quite a lot southener. < 1294732141 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or more accurately Espoo, I guess. < 1294732147 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294732241 0 :drakhan!~drakhan@c34-243.icpnet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1294732260 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :60.1868N 24.8218E is the location of this university building; that's 361 km southwards. (And then take a right turn and go east for a bit.) < 1294732273 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(That's the 270-degree right turn.) < 1294732295 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...RIGHT < 1294732307 0 :drakhan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1294732356 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I can't seem to tell my left hand from my right.) < 1294732377 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WELL GET A TATOO THEN < 1294732382 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*TATTOO < 1294732392 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A knuckle tattoo, with the left hand saying LEFT and the other one RGHT. < 1294732403 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294732429 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i call rule 34 on that, or something < 1294732462 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no google, i _am_ trying to search for rght < 1294732464 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: http://www.knuckletattoos.com/gunCache/t_LEFTRGHT.jpg -- it has the benefit of being also wrongly oriented! < 1294732492 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh < 1294732509 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that's obviously photoshopped < 1294732523 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yes, it's a generator that makes those images. I just entered LEFTRGHT in it. < 1294732547 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294732607 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sadly google seems to fail me < 1294732799 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1294732800 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1294733675 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-4-27.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294733777 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294734636 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294734826 0 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@cl-394.sto-01.se.sixxs.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294734830 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294734831 0 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1294734969 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-243-153.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294735713 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294735762 0 :SimonRC!~sc@fof.durge.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1294736307 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ilua < 1294737536 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1294739425 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294741190 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1294742917 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294744131 0 :mycroftiv!~ircguy@h69-128-47-242.mdsnwi.dedicated.static.tds.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294744466 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294744862 0 :drakhan!~drakhan@c34-243.icpnet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1294745351 0 :cheater99!~cheater@e181132190.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294747272 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1294747358 0 :jcp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294747589 0 :jcp!~jw@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294747672 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1294747926 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294748004 0 :cheater00!~cheater@e181133218.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294748112 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294748710 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, first time ever that a spam message went through all the other filters server-side and was caught by my email client < 1294750316 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should cherish this moment < 1294750323 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's obvious it was DESTINED to be < 1294750332 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you should read it and memorize it < 1294751841 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294751942 0 :cheater-!~cheater@e181134242.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294751974 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294752118 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294754055 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294754151 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294754207 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is Clean worth learning? < 1294754220 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's just haskell without monads? < 1294754366 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294754447 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION isn't particularly interested in Clean being faster < 1294754457 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are some things that I can imagine being interested in < 1294754468 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Other than the language itself < 1294754473 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh? < 1294754555 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Say, things like a more.. convenient environment to work with, etc < 1294754578 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better module system or whatnot also, although I guess that's a language thing < 1294754663 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION gets bored and wanders off < 1294754984 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I think that there is a market for books with fewer pages; there < 1294754984 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are many people out there that need to learn computer science, but do < 1294754984 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not appreciate reading" < 1294754987 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck you < 1294755036 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...suddenly I think this Preface is meant in jest < 1294755254 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294755330 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: LOL < 1294755350 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294755559 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Grr < 1294755573 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Book says to use the Everything environment. There is no Everything environment. < 1294755658 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meh < 1294755771 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294756454 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294756553 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294756660 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294756675 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1294757979 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294758044 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001f5b00390f-CM001e6b2335dc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294758056 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1294758218 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@17.101.89.205 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294758219 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294758219 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294758391 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1294758572 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I think it's just haskell without monads? < 1294758593 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc clean is complete capable of monads, it's just that it doesn't need them for IO < 1294758597 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*completely < 1294758635 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :using uniqueness typing instead to thread the "world" through computations. < 1294758693 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it interesting enough to play with? < 1294758698 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And fall in love with? >.> < 1294758706 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this allows many computations to be performed with in-place updating, but yet be conceptually pure < 1294758734 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I like that thought < 1294758742 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I want more < 1294758746 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better module system etc < 1294758770 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION doesn't recall what module system clean has < 1294758902 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-5-52.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294758972 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It is also available with limited input/output capabilities and without the "Dynamics" feature for Apple Macintosh, Solaris and Linux." < 1294758973 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Grah < 1294758975 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That sucks < 1294759095 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like things that have a theme naming thing going on. Like the "awesome" window manager, which has a standard scripting library called "awful", a theming thing called "beautiful", widget thingies called "wicked", "obvious" and "vicious", a notification thingie called "naughty", and so on. < 1294759109 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, so do you love Newspeak? < 1294759113 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(To clarify: I don't like the WM that much, just the naming.) < 1294759129 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Brazil, Hopscotch, MiniTest, etc < 1294759156 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Not actually sure if Hopscotch fits thematically] < 1294759202 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why didn't shutup bother me? < 1294759204 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo < 1294759207 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Newspeak < 1294759210 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There we go < 1294759250 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294759273 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't figure out any examples of actual things that I'd like that'd have a clear naming theme right now, it's just the idea I like. < 1294759308 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, Chicken Scheme extensions are called "eggs", and I think it has some other related terms in use. < 1294759338 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294759497 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-224-158.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294759601 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, the object system (one of them) was called COOPS. < 1294759771 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One of them? < 1294759775 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's several? < 1294760275 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :COOPS is one of those eggs < 1294760435 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are approximately 7 different object systems in the egg repository. < 1294760489 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://wiki.call-cc.org/chicken-projects/egg-index-4.html#oop < 1294760535 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are they all incompatible? < 1294760539 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION guesses so < 1294760542 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That sucks < 1294760546 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1294760666 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're made by different people for different purposes, I don't see why (or even how, except kludgily) they should be compatible. < 1294760688 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Procedures can have no more than 4096 arguments." --Mozart/Oz limitation < 1294760691 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is not worried < 1294760856 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1294760863 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Procedures can have no more than 4096 arguments." --Mozart/Oz limitation < 1294760870 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Procedures can have no more than 1 arguments." --Haskell limitation < 1294760947 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294760960 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION plays some minecraft < 1294760989 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Look, this isn't an argument." --Monty Python < 1294761019 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love that one < 1294761305 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION mildly deja vus < 1294761484 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294761484 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294761484 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294761964 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HAPPY 31 DAY < 1294761978 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WAT < 1294761987 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat wat < 1294761993 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's 11111 < 1294762002 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O DAT < 1294762008 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YA DAT < 1294762117 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hate it when people do that. < 1294762141 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat wat in the butt < 1294762425 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Act like interpreting the date in binary means something. < 1294762475 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, its just for fun - get over it < 1294762481 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its like pi day < 1294762520 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It's just for fun" can't be used as an all-purpose justification. < 1294762524 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's still stupid. < 1294762578 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :justified with empty words, the party gets better and better < 1294762628 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now, 11/11/11 11:11:11 and a ninth of a second will be the time for partying. < 1294762638 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION went away alone, with nothing left but faith < 1294762673 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Regrettably, it's 11 seconds after the Remembrance Day two-minute silence starts, so partying may be frowned upon. < 1294763553 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1294763557 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294763560 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, yeah the only reason to party is when you get a power of two in unix time ;) < 1294763580 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RealPlayer still exists? < 1294763790 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1294764368 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :BeholdMyGlory < 1294764885 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294764889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523 < 1294765403 0 :cal153!~cal@70.36.237.178 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294765596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :18:30:43 j-invariant: it says "adjunction" posted that < 1294765600 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: I think j-invariant is adjunction < 1294765696 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: excuse me, I believe your information to be inaccurate < 1294765699 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Java uses timsort < 1294765711 0 :asiekierka!~asiekierk@078088180066.elblag.vectranet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1294765716 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey < 1294765717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It operates by finding runs in the data. Descending runs are reversed. Then, the size of the run is checked against the minimum run size for that particular array size. The minimum run size depends on the size of the array. For an array of fewer than 64 elements, the minimum run size is the entire array, making timsort essentially a fancy insertion sort in that case. For larger arrays, a number between 32 and 64 is chosen so that the < 1294765717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :size of the array divided by the minimum run size is equal to, or slightly smaller than, a power of two. The final algorithm for it simply takes the most significant six bits of the size of the array, adds one if any of the remaining bits are set, and uses that as the minimum run size. If the run is too small, insertion sort is used to increase the run until it's the minimum size. The runs are then merged together via merge sort to pr < 1294765717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oduce the final sorted array.[3] < 1294765721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: not quickxort-based < 1294765723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*quicksort < 1294765731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: well ok this is only used since Java 7 < 1294765733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but still < 1294765756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:18:10 How long until we have non-Python languages running on CPython? < 1294765760 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: um a few things do that < 1294765762 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's what I think too (I think I wrote it after that) < 1294765763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: for instance Clue is going to < 1294765767 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but still odd that he posted that < 1294765770 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: by "I think", I mean 99% sure < 1294765778 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: also, I think he was quoting it as mockery ... < 1294765785 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh okay < 1294765788 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it wasn't very obviously a quote < 1294765798 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except that given his other posting history, it was pretty obviously not what he thought < 1294765815 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, huh. Are there any languages that don't have other languages running on their... system? < 1294765833 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Malbolge. < 1294765866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: I think j-invariant was trying to see how many points it'd get :) < 1294765872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who knows < 1294765877 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, /me continues logreading < 1294765882 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's one thing you zany #haskellers can't do! < 1294765886 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we have nice, digestible 100k logs < 1294765908 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:19:18 oerjan, Sgeo btw - I was talking about an array of ints < 1294765910 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294765912 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorting an array of ints < 1294765917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can do that in O(n) < 1294766021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:21:17 there should be a nonstandard set theory: \exists set S such that S^N is finite, but S is nonempty < 1294766021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:21:28 (from nonstandard analysis, although that was probably clear) < 1294766028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: omg that would be amazing... invent that < 1294766345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:38:28 All C#-like languages bore me < 1294766345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:39:41 * Sgeo says that as he listens to a song he STRONGLY associates with Vala < 1294766345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how the fuck do you associate a song with Vala < 1294766402 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" Phantom_Hoover, yeah the only reason to party is when you get a power of two in unix time ;)" <<< ah, all ones! < 1294766413 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :along the lines of "11/11/11 11:11:11 and a ninth of a second" < 1294766438 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ars < 1294766451 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, oh, all ones too. Which is just power of two - 1 < 1294766464 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, by being extremely obsessed with a song and having it on loop at the same time as reading about the language < 1294766480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: nutcase :D < 1294766565 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sane cut < 1294766622 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: a power of two has more 1's than power of two - 1 < 1294766657 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, no < 1294766664 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294766664 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sea cont < 1294766666 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sea cunt < 1294766668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the ones are WORTH more! < 1294766677 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so did you hear, cled is working < 1294766679 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it has infinitely many doesn't it? < 1294766679 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorta < 1294766692 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294766698 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1111.111111111... < 1294766703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294766705 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh < 1294766706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: btw re first-class functions < 1294766712 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why i explained: 'along the lines of "11/11/11 11:11:11 and a ninth of a second"' < 1294766715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you should NOT add lambda syntax < 1294766725 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it doesn't count unless you convert it to graycode first < 1294766725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: in e.g. map, the lambda parameter must be an existing clue function :) < 1294766726 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh i was not gonna, don't worry < 1294766738 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only lambada syntax < 1294766753 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that was the original plan, however, how about single-example lambdas? < 1294766754 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like < 1294766777 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: here's how i'd do it < 1294766777 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :map ~ {. [] -> [] } map ~ {:. [1 2 3] -> [2 3 4] : [2 3] -> [3 4] } map ~ []; car; cdr < 1294766783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously can be any clue function you want < 1294766786 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or like xxx ~ function 1; function 2; helper object; { . 1 -> 2. 3 -> 6 }; < 1294766799 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: hmm i don't see why you'd need that? < 1294766805 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clue is good at inferring functions, after all < 1294766856 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just a random idea, what you said is pretty much exactly what i was thinking < 1294766868 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's with more of the < >? < 1294766869 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I timsort is an interesting sort - but I don't believe Java uses it - at least not in the current implementation < 1294766875 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: because names can have spaces < 1294766889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Timsort is a hybrid sorting algorithm derived from merge sort and insertion sort, designed to perform well on many kinds of real-world data. It was invented by Tim Peters in 2002 for use in the Python programming language, and has been Python's standard sorting algorithm since version 2.3. It is now also used to sort arrays in Java SE 7,[1] and on the Android platform.[2] < 1294766891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: ^ < 1294766895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as of Java 7 < 1294766897 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you probably want a separator that's not whitespace < 1294766909 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but because whitespace is the separator, the only non-ugly way is to enclose the function name < 1294766912 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: <> is nice because it used to have another meaning, so it breaks backwards compat! < 1294766918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: {} and [] are kinda taken, and () is ugly < 1294766920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is why I picked <>s < 1294766924 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What was the other meaning? < 1294766937 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh < 1294766938 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't ask < 1294766938 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294766945 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Too late < 1294766953 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"just this thing having to do with the hardest thing to explain about clue" < 1294766960 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not very hard really < 1294766965 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just can't manage to do it succinctly < 1294766977 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294766996 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all functions are switch statement + expression with possibly recursion; <> was used to give a function used in the switch statement < 1294767005 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now, that's inferred completely, as well < 1294767005 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah and you always used < 1294767008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bcuz it was made of retard < 1294767011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(technical term) < 1294767031 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294767121 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott < 1294767144 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant < 1294767154 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Axiom_%28computer_algebra_system%29 < 1294767161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :verily < 1294767190 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes? :P < 1294767191 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol ~ {. {. <{. 6 -> 7} ~ succ> 3 -> 5 } 4 -> 8 } < 1294767204 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1294767205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: xD i... how should i say this... no :P < 1294767210 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you missed a <> < 1294767212 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a hint list < 1294767215 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, i suppose you need explicit apply < 1294767222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but um yeah why compromise purity like that ... < 1294767222 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Axiom_%28computer_algebra_system%29 ← what about it? < 1294767224 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because not having it would be retarded < 1294767227 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's not like adding another function is much work < 1294767232 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: i was talking about it w/ j-invariant yesterday < 1294767236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: also, "explicit apply"? < 1294767240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean like, apply being a function? < 1294767243 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294767246 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need that in the bag < 1294767261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: why not cons(#0(car(#1)) @(cdr(#1))) < 1294767271 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sort of thing < 1294767272 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, did the conversation consist of " It sucks. I agree."? < 1294767273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without apply < 1294767278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: no, i think it's cool < 1294767286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i think it might be what j-invariant was inventing mostly < 1294767288 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: because objects shouldn't have operations attached to them < 1294767291 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :functions are no exception < 1294767291 0 :doraemon!60e8bcea@gateway/web/freenode/ip.96.232.188.234 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294767300 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294767303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: surely, then, you should have to include apply in every list < 1294767312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to call all the other functions in the bag < 1294767313 0 :doraemon!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Guest32802 < 1294767325 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(done by using apply in an infinite regress, naturally) < 1294767335 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that is true, but see in the grand scheme of things, apply would be good, since in clue 2.0, "function tools" would be included by default < 1294767344 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just like list tools would be if you were using alist < 1294767346 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*a list < 1294767346 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: fair enough then. < 1294767358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i hope clue 2 doesn't break cled too horribly. < 1294767366 0 :Guest32802!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi everyone, I have a question regarding a bf converter. I'd like to write a converter that converts a given string to bf, with one small catch: I < 1294767376 0 :Guest32802!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would like it to optimize the output as much as possible < 1294767383 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: and while apply would be in all your millions of higher-order functions, it's still possible you sometimes don't want to be able to apply < 1294767385 0 :Guest32802!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. the shortest string of bf that it can produce < 1294767390 0 :Guest32802!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :doraemon___ < 1294767401 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you might say just want to compose! wait... < 1294767405 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doraemon___: It is not generally possible to prove that a string is the shortest possible. < 1294767413 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doraemon___: that is provably impossible to do < 1294767416 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a general algorithm < 1294767417 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: well yeah, but I mean < 1294767417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SORRY :) < 1294767428 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd like to produce a short, optimized string < 1294767434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure but you can't do the _shortest_ < 1294767436 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not necessarily the shortest possible :) < 1294767442 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's what you said :P < 1294767443 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I know... < 1294767444 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: could've been an answer to me as well D: < 1294767447 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen Hello, doraemon___! < 1294767448 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" doraemon___: that is provably impossible to do" < 1294767455 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :163 +++++++++++++++[>+++++>+++++++>+++++++>+++<<<<-]>---.>----.>+++..+++.>-.------------.<<-.>.+++.-----------------.<+.++++++++.++.-.>--...>+.-----------------------. [164] < 1294767472 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's decent < 1294767473 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :txtgen is not a very good example, it's all yucky and non-deterministic < 1294767484 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i think all the best generators are like private projects that havent been released < 1294767485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*haven't < 1294767485 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well it's better than the dumb way < 1294767490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've heard people doing them in here < 1294767493 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doraemon___: it uses a genetic algorithm < 1294767495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of < 1294767497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some kind :D < 1294767500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol lynches me now < 1294767504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's prolly just hill-climbing < 1294767504 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah I was thinking about doing that < 1294767507 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Using a GA < 1294767507 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't ther ea very good way < 1294767512 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To find short possibilities < 1294767514 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gzip < 1294767523 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah it's some sort of hill-climbing < 1294767533 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for very small inputs direct: for larger inputs ASCII: for HUGE inputs gzip < 1294767536 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i read it once, but don't really remember, it definitely wasn't genetic tho < 1294767547 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My friend was using a method of predicting all the possibilities within a range, like 1...n < 1294767552 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it isn't a very good way < 1294767555 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doraemon___: bf_txtgen was was written by calamari. See http://codu.org/projects/egobot/hg/index.cgi/file/tip/multibot_cmds/interps/bf_txtgen < 1294767560 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was only 16 chars shorter than my brute force method < 1294767561 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use genetic algorithms to evolve a bf text generator >:D < 1294767562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SO META < 1294767569 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh thanks Gregor :) < 1294767588 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nothing EgoBot does is secret :P < 1294767595 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And most of it isn't mine either) < 1294767606 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So that's probably one of the best methods in your opinion? < 1294767620 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the best one you can get your hands on right now. < 1294767621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably not :P < 1294767621 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah Gregor can't really do anything right so he gets other people to write his code and takes all the credit < 1294767623 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yeah. < 1294767624 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no doubt that there are better ones. < 1294767627 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Pretty much. < 1294767630 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and sometimes write 1000 page books about this < 1294767632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: he tried to do that with me and cunionfs < 1294767634 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all hype < 1294767635 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: It's worked pretty well so far. < 1294767639 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suspect it's because he's a jew (<-- NOTE THIS IS NOT SERIOUS) < 1294767649 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I conjecture that it's possible to find the optimal brainfuck program for all strings of length below 256 < 1294767669 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: It is in fact /possible/ to find the optimal brainfuck program for any given string, it's just extremely expensive. < 1294767679 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: hey we're actually inching towards a place where I can yell halting problem legitiamtely < 1294767682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*legitimately < 1294767683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: not really < 1294767688 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: well, with human ingenuity, yes < 1294767696 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ? not really < 1294767698 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: did you know the busy beaver function hasn't been solved for was it 5 or 6 states and binary? < 1294767701 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for tm's < 1294767703 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Brute-force try every BF program from shortest to longest until you find one that prints the program. QED. < 1294767704 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yeah < 1294767705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not dumb-mechanically, because that program that runs for 100 years might then print out the right string < 1294767707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: dude... < 1294767713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: what about ones that don't halt < 1294767720 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: prove they don't halt < 1294767721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: that works, if you have infinite time to run them all concurrently < 1294767725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: right, so with human ingenuity < 1294767727 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: okay, just that yours seemed kind of astronomical compared to that < 1294767733 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: or an automated prover < 1294767735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor's is stupid though :P < 1294767748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that could work. maybe. for 64 char strings, sure, not 256. i'd wager. < 1294767766 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I don't see a direct connection with busy beaver? < 1294767768 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I think you need an Oracle to solve the halting problem :p < 1294767781 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" j-invariant: It is in fact /possible/ to find the optimal brainfuck program for any given string, it's just extremely expensive." <<< there's not even a semialgorithm for this < 1294767798 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen Hello, world! < 1294767801 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :126 ++++++++++[>+++++++>++++++++++>++++>+<<<<-]>++.>+.+++++++..+++.>++++.------------.<++++++++.--------.+++.------.--------.>+.>. [958] < 1294767827 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doraemon___: damn you larry ellison < 1294767879 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doraemon? < 1294767906 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes? < 1294767911 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: there's none, but i doubt there's an essential difference in the hardness of the problem, 256 needs a pretty long bf program, and i doubt you can say *anything* about certain bf programs of really short length < 1294767920 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do I know you, Sgeo? < 1294767934 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: which ones? < 1294767943 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have you ever played a game.. it was a web-based game < 1294767947 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: the ones that happen to be hard < 1294767957 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1294767959 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've played web-based games... sure < 1294767961 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which one, Sgeo? < 1294767964 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gee i can't imagine the name Doraemon being popular < 1294767964 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With battles, etc. Someone with your name (I think) was building a superweapon < 1294767968 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't remember the name < 1294767969 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1294767971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CAN'T IMAGINE < 1294767975 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the shortest difficult brainfuck program I can think of is collatz < 1294767977 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm, I'm not sure Sgeo < 1294767980 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Spacefed I think? < 1294767985 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Might have been a different me ;p < 1294768006 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no that doesn't work < 1294768014 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Space Fed Galactic Conquest < 1294768027 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm, yeah I don't think that was me < 1294768028 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION reappears. < 1294768036 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, darn < 1294768036 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: erm, you can implement any tm in bf with a constant size increment can't you? < 1294768040 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294768042 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, Sgeo :( < 1294768067 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the shortest brainfuck program that we don't know whether it terminates or not? < 1294768067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lawl < 1294768075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ,[.,] < 1294768078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ DEEP PHILOSOPHY SHIET < 1294768078 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :say keep state in n first bits in every second bit < 1294768081 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't use inputs < 1294768085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DARN < 1294768091 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and move that around < 1294768091 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :collatz i would guess < 1294768093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or some TM < 1294768100 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm what, how small is this collatz? < 1294768106 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.hevanet.com/cristofd/brainfuck/collatz.b < 1294768106 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1294768109 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should make an automated prover for halting of brainfuck, then use that to kill of boring candidates < 1294768110 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it takes decimals on input < 1294768112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :remove the output < 1294768112 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would have been in 2003 < 1294768115 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION shrugs < 1294768116 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and have it just iterate through every natural < 1294768122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1294768125 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that should be fairly short < 1294768128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably shorter than what's there even < 1294768157 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: funny how 2003 seems like such a long time ago now... < 1294768180 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't that collatz only long because of parsing input < 1294768182 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294768193 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shouldn't be more than a few characters, division isn't very hard < 1294768253 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but anyway, i find it unlikely that the shortest program your halting prover gets stuck in makes any sense at all, it's just a program with a random characters that happens to not have trivial behavior. < 1294768301 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*-a < 1294768330 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bf might certainly be especially slow at hitting something like that < 1294768359 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah if you made it just iterate, not print, and not take input, that collatz could be tiny < 1294768385 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll make an arbitrary conjecture: bf programs are easy to prove up up to size 38 < 1294768399 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :place your bets now < 1294768405 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Define "easy" < 1294768407 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ask definitions later < 1294768410 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294768421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: how do you define SIZE < 1294768423 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn, was too slow < 1294768427 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you define TO < 1294768434 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you define "38"? < 1294768440 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you define "I'll"? < 1294768443 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so can we have N-input, N-output functions < 1294768445 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: the obvious way, if there's a dispute, i'm right, you're wrong < 1294768446 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: specifically, 0-input ones < 1294768447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and 0-output ones < 1294768455 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i get the moneys < 1294768474 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what, in these bf programs? < 1294768480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294768483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in klew < 1294768496 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i totally didn't see that coming < 1294768520 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-CGIii_eTOk <<< why exactly did i have this retarded shit in my browser? < 1294768538 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i don't like how 0 io looks like, syntactically < 1294768544 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise i'd have no potato with them < 1294768551 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: sure, but it makes cled so less ugly... < 1294768554 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :holes are like < 1294768556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the biggest bug ever < 1294768562 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe they are allowed in the language, but you can't actually write any? < 1294768565 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can have the ast in an invalid state, and all it does is sit there looking slightly ugly < 1294768568 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: xD < 1294768577 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well let's put it this way < 1294768583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you're going to add N+1-output functions right? < 1294768584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294768589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you know who thinks 0 isn't a natural? < 1294768590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's right < 1294768591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stupid people < 1294768594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and do you know what set you'd be using < 1294768596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :N\{0} < 1294768597 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :parameters < 1294768598 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now < 1294768599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is that oklopol < 1294768601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is < 1294768603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HIDEOUS < 1294768605 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you, if you do that, are hideous < 1294768607 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't be hideous < 1294768609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :N-io < 1294768613 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i am hideous, you haven't seen me < 1294768619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes i have < 1294768621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you were on the map thing < 1294768627 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...oh right < 1294768630 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294768651 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i was pretty sexy in that pic so i guess i have nothing more to say < 1294768661 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what you have to say is < 1294768664 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK DUDE N-INPUT-OUTPUT BITCH < 1294768677 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no syntax for them must ever exist. < 1294768686 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: um you're adding syntax for N-output < 1294768688 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :surely < 1294768696 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: c'moooon :( < 1294768706 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, just whitespace separate the outputs < 1294768710 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294768716 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol ~ {. -> } < 1294768721 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that's ugly < 1294768721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's for the greater good dude < 1294768723 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but hmm < 1294768724 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it is < 1294768724 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is why < 1294768726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should never write it < 1294768730 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you could also write clue code like this < 1294768737 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MAYBE A SEPARATE SYNTAX FOR WRITING ZERO ARG FUNCTIONS < 1294768741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this_Is_A_Name~{: . hello->[1 2 < 1294768744 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294768745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3]} this_Is_A_Name < 1294768748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :~ x;y; z < 1294768750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is hideous < 1294768752 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you don't do that < 1294768757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you're a good clueist < 1294768764 0 :cheater99!~cheater@e181128178.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294768767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same reason you wouldn't do "lol ~ {. -> }", not only is it useless < 1294768769 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's fucking ugly too < 1294768787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: alternatively: remove N-inputs and just have every function take one input < 1294768788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294768820 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay have your fucking party, i don't actually give a shit about whether {. -> } is legal < 1294768833 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also..... < 1294768846 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{. -> 1} will be totally useful with hardcore functions < 1294768850 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by which i mean higher-order < 1294768852 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtfbbq is going on here :P < 1294768857 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i have the perfect way to write it < 1294768862 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: {.-> 1} < 1294768865 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294768868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: .-> is the lambda arrow's retarded cousin < 1294768872 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294768876 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: clue < 1294768881 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :get one < 1294768885 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294768889 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DO NOT WANT < 1294768895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: anyway actually implementing that will have to wait for you to add n-outputs, so :P < 1294768896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for now i'll just < 1294768898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eliminate holes < 1294768904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and force you to replace, not delete < 1294768906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the last two elems < 1294768907 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mmmm n outputs < 1294768908 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why didn't i think of that < 1294768910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH RIGHT < 1294768914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because inserting a branch is like liquid pain < 1294768916 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION touches with red thing in mouth < 1294768935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your uvula? < 1294768950 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no you pervert < 1294768972 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MEN DON'T UVULATE < 1294768983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294769056 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for some reason i know that word in english, but i remember i didn't know it in finnish until a friend of mine whose dad is a dentist told me < 1294769063 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like the most useless thing ever < 1294769076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://theorymine.co.uk/ haha what < 1294769130 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so embarassing < 1294769152 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Drøvel drøvel drøvel < 1294769159 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would certainly like to know what they look like < 1294769165 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the best automated termination checker for brainfuck? < 1294769184 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't know. < 1294769186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is this thing what < 1294769187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why does this exist < 1294769189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: there is none :P < 1294769197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's often trivial to prove < 1294769200 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probaly just running the damn thing for 100000 iterations < 1294769211 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. [ on an even number with balanced > and < means it loops forever < 1294769224 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well. with no nested loops < 1294769230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait that isn't true < 1294769232 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i forget the rule :D < 1294769264 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah [-] is a counterexample < 1294769287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a rule < 1294769289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :look at esotope for it :P < 1294769296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually an automated termination checker for bf would be fun < 1294769321 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well there are many obvious things you can do, like look at which cells it actually changed, and wait for loop < 1294769336 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you just code all the obvious rules that would be a good start < 1294769349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's an O(1) way for certain loops < 1294769351 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you can inspect the programs it doesn't get, and learn more sophistcated rules from them < 1294769354 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that can tell you it doesn't halt < 1294769361 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :based on extended euclidean algorithm < 1294769362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very simple < 1294769364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is assuming 8-bit cells < 1294769373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could easily be modified to spit out a certificate to prove it < 1294769375 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it does not halt < 1294769393 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: nice idea, but usually the first one you inspect will be completely out of your reach < 1294769408 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I doubt that, why do you say that? Think it will be a collatz type thing? < 1294769416 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my experience is mostly based on trying to find the smallest aperiodic set of wang tiles in the summer < 1294769417 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: if so, then that's my goal! I want to find that program < 1294769437 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: wow cool how did that go? < 1294769440 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we ran computer simulations, and when a tile set didn't work, we looked at it manually < 1294769441 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"This really captured my imagination and I'm delighted to buy TheoryMine's first Theorem. What an inventive use of Scotland's expertise in artificial intelligence to create such a novel and fun product". — TheoryMine testimonials. < 1294769449 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I AM NOT SCOTTISH SHE DOES NOT REPRESENT ME < 1294769456 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you could never say anything about them, after hours, you just ended up running the computer program for longer... < 1294769458 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION decides that The Onion Audio news suck < 1294769464 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Anne Glover, Chief Scientific Officer for Scotland < 1294769465 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the only sucky Onion thing < 1294769466 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAa < 1294769484 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: the onion is good for the headlines. < 1294769485 0 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-65-80.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1294769485 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clearly she is personally responsible for the suckishness of the computing curriculum. < 1294769487 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the articles are superfluous. < 1294769490 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: to my knowledge, every set of wang tiles except one is based on substitution < 1294769496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol wang < 1294769496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahem < 1294769501 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, there was one that had something the program didn't catch: there was a way to convert it into a smaller one that would've had to be aperiodic as well < 1294769502 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the one that's not is based on irrational numbers < 1294769503 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: proposed first step in the halting checker: see if esotope produces a simple infinite loop for it < 1294769508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it has a bunch of checks for that, i believe < 1294769509 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yeah, that smallest one is not based on substitution < 1294769509 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so they all "come from somewhere" < 1294769512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instanec < 1294769512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: proposed first step in the halting checker: see if esotope < 1294769513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294769515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 233 elif len(result) == 1 and result[0][0] == result[0][1]: < 1294769516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 234 if result[0][0] is None: < 1294769518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 235 return Always() < 1294769520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*instance < 1294769522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from its condition code < 1294769524 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's made by my employer < 1294769524 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't find the extended euclidean thing < 1294769532 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is why i was doing that in the sumemr < 1294769534 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*summer < 1294769541 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish that they had example theorems somewhere. < 1294769554 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1294769558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: they do < 1294769563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://hg.mearie.org/esotope/bfc/file/5bdae1176f46/bfc/opt/simpleloop.py < 1294769571 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(actually that's not completely true, since his colleaque changed a small detail to get one less tile, but that is a less interesting story) < 1294769578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 90 # let w be the overflow value, which is 256 for char etc. < 1294769578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 91 # then there are three cases in the following code: < 1294769579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 92 # i = 0; for (j = 0; i != x; ++j) i += m; < 1294769580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 93 # < 1294769582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 94 # 1. if m = 0, it loops forever. < 1294769584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 95 # 2. otherwise, the condition j * m = x (mod w) must hold. < 1294769586 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 96 # let u * m + v * w = gcd(m,w), and < 1294769587 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, where... < 1294769588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 97 # 1) if x is not a multiple of gcd(m,w), it loops forever. < 1294769590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 98 # 2) otherwise it terminates and j = u * (x / gcd(m,w)). < 1294769592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 99 # < 1294769594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 100 # we can calculate u and gcd(m,w) in the compile time, but < 1294769596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 101 # x is not (yet). so we shall add simple check for now. < 1294769598 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ^ < 1294769608 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right. < 1294769622 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: also http://dream.inf.ed.ac.uk/events/automatheo-2010/papers/automatheo2010_submission_1.pdf < 1294769644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: how is it that all these systems that seem to do better than coq get overlooked, btw? < 1294769648 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: HOL and Isabelle and stuff < 1294769654 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yeah, the ones that people have been able to prove things about come from somewhere; that's exactly my point, when they don't come from somewhere, you're screwed < 1294769672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I can understand Mizar, which has a very comprehensive development, being overlooked for being proprietary and non-constructive; and Automath too for similar reasons and also being old < 1294769675 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the others? < 1294769694 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for wang tiles, it seems possible that the best solution actually makes sense, since we're at 13, and 9 has been proven not to contain aperiodics afair < 1294769762 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh that was for balanced unnested? < 1294769772 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well obviously that's trivial, since you just have to look at the evolution of the current cell < 1294769773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i dunno :D < 1294769773 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294769775 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah < 1294769789 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL i say < 1294769798 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lo your own ol < 1294769810 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294769844 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should prolly go to sleep < 1294769866 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :last week i had 28 hour days, this week they seem to be more like 20 < 1294769867 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: help me write a brainfuck termination checker? < 1294769892 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: sure ... as long as it's not TOO hard < 1294769898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what proof language should the certificates be in? < 1294769907 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294769920 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I always have in mind the version where all the cells can contain infinitely large integers < 1294769935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i dislike that version intensely < 1294769939 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :either that or binary, everything else is retarded < 1294769941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that collatz uses 8-bit cells anyway < 1294769946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so why not :P < 1294769955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: most programs are written for 8-bit cells anyway < 1294769955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also < 1294769956 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just the 8bit thing is so bloody confusing < 1294769959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why < 1294769962 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except holding up to 37, and wrapping to 19 < 1294769964 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can never get my head around that wrap around stuff < 1294769969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: xD like deadfish < 1294769970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if we have arbitrary integers, < 1294769973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then the tape must be only two long < 1294769976 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is my proclamation < 1294769983 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh < 1294769990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: the nice thing about 8-bit integers < 1294769992 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am fine with 8 bit numbers < 1294769994 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lets go with that < 1294769997 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :integers? < 1294769998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: is that they make the work a bit easier < 1294770001 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so they can be negative.. < 1294770003 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the tape sort of segments them out < 1294770003 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294770003 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er no < 1294770009 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294770010 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :8-bit non-negative integers < 1294770011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 to 255 < 1294770012 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay good < 1294770013 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make the work easier?!? < 1294770016 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: sort of :D < 1294770018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when writing a termination checker < 1294770021 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey afaict they make everything harder < 1294770023 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's just plain not true! < 1294770032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you can't do that fancy euclidean stuff with arbitraries! < 1294770034 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294770038 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1294770038 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything gets really hairy, a mathematician would never have wrap 256 < 1294770067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well a boolfuck termination checker is a lot more boring < 1294770070 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: umm, for infinites, that algo doesn't even need modular arithmetic < 1294770075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because there's less existing programs to poke it at < 1294770083 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: hmmmmmmm < 1294770084 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1294770086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but things assume 8-bit < 1294770089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1294770100 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is, you don't even *need* that fancy euclidean stuff < 1294770118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294770120 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :infinite things are usually much simpler than finite ones < 1294770120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but but oklopol < 1294770124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how can i feed mandelbrot.b do it < 1294770125 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*to it < 1294770129 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do whom? < 1294770147 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good point < 1294770161 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you won't be able to prove anything about the halting of mandelbrot.b anyway < 1294770181 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: how do YOU know < 1294770183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe me and j-invariant < 1294770183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are < 1294770183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the < 1294770185 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BEST < 1294770187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coders < 1294770204 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've heard j-invariant sucks at coding < 1294770217 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from him, like, umm, yesterday? < 1294770226 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if he doesn't know, who will < 1294770230 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i certainly won't. < 1294770231 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i do. < 1294770241 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you < 1294770242 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294770247 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't even get me started about you < 1294770247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294770251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am < 1294770253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the BEST < 1294770266 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you maybe the best, but i ask you: best at *what*? < 1294770285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: code < 1294770297 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah i forgot what we were talking about < 1294770310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294770418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so um oklopol < 1294770424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use cled for writing like < 1294770425 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything < 1294770426 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay? < 1294770438 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it play well with latex < 1294770441 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :18:22 < oklopol> you won't be able to prove anything about the halting of mandelbrot.b anyway < 1294770446 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not? Isn't that one pretty simple? < 1294770451 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it always uses a condom, why do you ask < 1294770459 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i think you're a little too enthusiastic about the powers of automated proving < 1294770482 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i don't even remember the algorithm < 1294770484 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was it? < 1294770485 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: isn't it basically for(int i = 0; i < 100; i++) { do stuff } < 1294770496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well maybe < 1294770507 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it's very possible you will be able to prove stuff about that < 1294770509 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I think we should use esotope's code partly < 1294770512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it has this intermediate format < 1294770519 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1294770527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does a lot of constant folding, adds arithmetic expressions < 1294770527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for loops < 1294770532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even detects some infinite loops < 1294770537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be a lot easier to prove on i feel < 1294770809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: so um... what certificate lang < 1294770840 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it can be anything. You choose < 1294770846 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would use Coq but that's just because I have it installed < 1294770847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i don't know :D < 1294770856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: auto-generating Coq sounds a bit painful? < 1294770866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I think generating lambda expressions is probably the "easiest" thing < 1294770869 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than automating tactics < 1294770905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: so i really don't know :) < 1294770930 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably just program the whole thing in Ltac < 1294770946 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah that would be really slow < 1294770950 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it does need efficiecy < 1294770960 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yeah naw < 1294770970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I was thinking it'd be a Haskell program < 1294770979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: of course we _could_ just not generate any certificates, but that's much less fun < 1294770994 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes certificate is important < 1294770996 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or you could think about that when your program is ready up to that point < 1294771000 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: otherwise there may be a bug in the program < 1294771008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: um it's actually relevant from the start < 1294771012 0 :MigoMipo_!~John@84-217-4-100.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294771014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it has to use certificates from the very first line < 1294771016 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not < 1294771020 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, it is < 1294771022 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not < 1294771025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the certificates must be generated as part of the process < 1294771026 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol works without a safety net < 1294771028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than after the fact < 1294771048 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1294771049 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone here using FF 4.x ? < 1294771056 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and adblockplus) < 1294771063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: because that's how these things work? < 1294771069 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise it's duplicated work < 1294771204 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe sure the actual program will have to write certificates from the start, but i don't see why you'd need to know what proof language you'll be using from the start when writing the halting checker < 1294771208 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294771340 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: because with certificate stuff, every single bit of reasoning involves a certificate < 1294771343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't just say < 1294771348 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if foo then doesn't halt else dunno < 1294771350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to say < 1294771366 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if foo then (doesn't halt, proof that it doesn't halt in this specific case using general theorem involving "foo") else dunno < 1294772019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm going to have to make my emacs font smaller < 1294772023 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what you're saying is the finding of the proofs is not actually harder compared to the proving < 1294772025 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1294772043 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: the point is that you can't really do just one. < 1294772045 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :geh, whatever < 1294772053 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes, doing certificates _is_ actually pretty hard < 1294772108 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION headaches < 1294772112 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well given that j-invariant complains about how hard it is to prove trivial things about every second day, it's hard not to believe that < 1294772113 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I should eat breakfast < 1294772125 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all i'm saying is you don't have to do the search for the proof in a safe way+ < 1294772128 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*-+ < 1294772132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what do you mean < 1294772147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: also, yes, proving trivial things is hard in Coq etc. < 1294772154 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it's not hard proving trivial things is it? < 1294772160 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294772163 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol has a very lax definition of trivial. < 1294772165 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought I was complaining abuot not having support for certain features < 1294772168 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hard to say without knowing what kind of stuff you're going to do < 1294772186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think modelling category theory in type theory is < 1294772187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"trivial" < 1294772209 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well maybe you've once complained about something and it sounded like you were complaining about something that was trivial, but actually you meant there was no nice way to do it or something < 1294772215 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was just being colorful < 1294772225 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yeah, i have a very lax definition of trivial < 1294772273 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :say existence of infinitely many primes is trivial < 1294772289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: why doesn't emacs always have two copies of every buffer < 1294772291 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :displaye < 1294772291 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :d < 1294772292 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well maybe i would say that's simple < 1294772294 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not trivial < 1294772411 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: have you ever used teco, i think everyone should use teco < 1294772413 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for < 1294772414 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything < 1294772417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :including editing clue < 1294772419 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who needs cled < 1294772459 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's possible that in the case of bf programs, there isn't really much of a search stage < 1294772514 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but hard to say without knowing what specific things you're going to prove the halting of < 1294772569 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've heard o fit :P < 1294772573 0 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-19-45.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1294772597 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's great, because instead of using a program to program < 1294772600 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you program to program < 1294772606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every editor operation is a little mini program :) < 1294772612 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now you have two problems! < 1294772689 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294772704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294772731 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1294772754 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1294772841 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: writing cled is so hard why do you do this to me < 1294773215 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is for science < 1294773237 0 :BMG!~behold@d83-183-183-70.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1294773274 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294773274 0 :BMG!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294773279 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :BeholdMyGlory < 1294773421 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1294773562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: write a program whose only function is to output a proof that it works correctly < 1294773567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e., only ever outputs correct proofs < 1294773683 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the more sophisticated an automatical thoerem prover for brainfuck termination is, the further away turings liar program is < 1294773703 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. a really simple termination checker could be reimplemented in brainfuck and lied to in maybe, 3000 symbols. < 1294773712 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But a very advanced one would take 10000 symbols < 1294773719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i want to see that program :D < 1294773722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that i mentioned < 1294773726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/described < 1294773776 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't get it. What does it do? < 1294773806 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be an implementation fo the termination checker looking at this program AND a quine < 1294773826 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you fit the quine into the termination checker and do the opposite of what it says < 1294773868 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that's not necessarily true, since the formal proof system could be implemented in 5000 symbols, making all your further efforts pointless < 1294773870 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is a simple matter to make a stronger termination checker which can detect the termination of this pathological program < 1294773882 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I don't understand < 1294773898 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :sebbu < 1294773899 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh you mean godel instead of turing: Okay, I get it < 1294773930 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yeah it's a simple matter, as long as you don't expect to find a proof in the same formal system < 1294773967 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is only termination certificates though -- the actual termination checker is written in a turing machine < 1294773981 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hey we should just cut the crap and write the termination checker in brainfuck < 1294773994 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: oh yeah that sounds like a barrel of fun laughs < 1294774000 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: none of this python etc. < 1294774003 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i have an even better idea to do first < 1294774005 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's hang ourselves < 1294774008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or wait wait wait < 1294774008 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294774011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go bathe in a vat of acid < 1294774014 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL < 1294774015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg how can i decide < 1294774018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;_; < 1294774032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe have all my skin removed slowly before my internal organs are devoured by an angry goat, and then my skeleton is set on fire < 1294774057 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: re i don't get it < 1294774062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: a program X, with only one function < 1294774073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: when X is invoked, it returns a proof certificate P < 1294774083 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: this P is a proof of the statement that X works correctly < 1294774094 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: example definition of "works correctly": < 1294774099 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall P in Ps, P < 1294774107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where Ps is the set of proofs that X outputs < 1294774109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except *IsCorrect P < 1294774111 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL < 1294774112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you get what i mean < 1294774116 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders how easy or difficult it is to make a self-hosting language < 1294774130 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I am correct" < 1294774132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically, it outputs a proof P that proves that every proof X outputs (of which there is only one, P) is correct < 1294774133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep :D < 1294774140 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess part of it really does require making a compiler, doesn't it? < 1294774149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: kinda. < 1294774150 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: or just an interpreter < 1294774151 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really < 1294774154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could run it all on top of python < 1294774158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like you run it all on top of x86 < 1294774223 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: it's a good feeling though when you delete the original < 1294774224 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But.. that's not that interesting, is it? < 1294774233 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, right, that's what I want < 1294774240 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: you should do it!!! < 1294774245 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: it's a good feeling when you delete the x86 < 1294774250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after creating a processor for your language < 1294774252 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then delete physics < 1294774258 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ddelete the universe :D < 1294774260 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after making sure your language is hosted independently of physics < 1294774268 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically the idea is to replace everything with your language < 1294774269 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EVERYTHING < 1294774270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no dependencies < 1294774270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EVER < 1294774271 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the qustiion is "How low can you go" < 1294774275 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :language limbo < 1294774277 0 :calamari!~calamari@ip70-162-184-205.ph.ph.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294774283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^^ GUYS GENIUS PUN? < 1294774287 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I loled < 1294774332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: deleting the original though, i would never do that < 1294774335 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if i lose my interpreter binary < 1294774350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or i find a fatal bug < 1294774356 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that means all compilers have a contagious bug < 1294774358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :accidental trusting trust :D < 1294774380 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What did the original for gcc use? < 1294774389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm, they just used other C compilers. < 1294774397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the advantage of doing it for a mostly portable language :P < 1294774400 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :type the assembly by hand < 1294774401 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*with a < 1294774408 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then type the source code < 1294774415 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and check that compilation gives you back the compiler < 1294774415 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: *machine code < 1294774417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a butterfly < 1294774422 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what to do if no programming languages exist < 1294774446 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: assembly is a language < 1294774472 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/Minecraft/comments/ezzh4/why_not/c1canyy?context=1 THIS IS THE BEST WORST IDEA EVER < 1294774486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol @ the recipe below that < 1294774489 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does compiling to LLVM make sense? < 1294774513 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/Minecraft/comments/ezzh4/why_not/c1cbsrt <-- haha < 1294774514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only if you're a LOSER < 1294774516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :writing x86 assembly is easier < 1294774517 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tbh < 1294774517 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can put these in it < 1294774531 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?? < 1294774540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ? < 1294774541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: < 1294774543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i think that < 1294774549 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: one obsidian in the topright < 1294774552 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, are you serious? < 1294774556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: tnt to the right of that < 1294774556 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x86 is easier? < 1294774559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: diamond to the right of that < 1294774560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yes < 1294774563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x86 asm is trivial < 1294774570 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait < 1294774570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :llvm asm is pretty complex :P < 1294774574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: then below that < 1294774581 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compilers compile into asm? Wouldn't machine code make more sense? < 1294774581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: a golden apple on the left < 1294774584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294774589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: sure, gcc outputs gnu assembly syntax < 1294774595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: machine code is just as easy, though :P < 1294774600 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you define the instructions as names in your program < 1294774602 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and registers too < 1294774605 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's like a ghetto assembler < 1294774659 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I compile to x86, then certain things will be platform-dependent < 1294774664 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, OS-dependent < 1294774674 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: doesn't matter. < 1294774683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :syscalls are easier than anything else anyway. < 1294774687 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could just compile to C. < 1294774696 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: llvm assembly is quite platform specific anyway < 1294774698 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a lot of cases < 1294774720 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you won't be able to try my super-cool language that is poorly designed and only exists to prove to myself that I can write a self-hosting language. < 1294774727 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why no < 1294774728 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :t < 1294774735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294774744 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm on Windows, and not particularly likely to switch to Linux to do this < 1294774747 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL < 1294774748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL < 1294774749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL < 1294774749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL < 1294774754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't even know if windows has syscalls < 1294774758 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :continuation-based backtracking! \o/ < 1294774758 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :                                 | < 1294774758 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :                                 |\ < 1294774759 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if they do calling them will probably be a bitch < 1294774760 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294774763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could use dos-style interrupts < 1294774766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but those are a bitch to use < 1294774769 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, all the assemblers suck < 1294774775 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol lol lol @ the idea of doing this on windows < 1294774831 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Windows has syscalls but you rarely ever see them; you just call library functions instead. < 1294774845 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't they have that fucked up calling convention < 1294774846 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lool < 1294774897 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's stdcall, which is a bit strange; callee cleans up the stack. < 1294774922 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"nice" < 1294774932 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: wait, so C functions re-push their arguments? < 1294774937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to get popped right after? < 1294774939 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: that's so yesterday < 1294774940 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the most brilliantly stupid thing ... ever < 1294774948 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes but NOT FOR ME < 1294774952 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i GET it < 1294774956 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i grok it man < 1294774959 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its intuitive < 1294774964 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't you get it yesterday? < 1294774986 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i thought i did < 1294774989 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: it's also inefficient < 1294774989 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i just wrote some code < 1294774994 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and figured it out < 1294774996 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't know what that means. In foo(a,b,c) the caller does push c; push b; push a; call foo; and foo itself takes care of popping the arguments. (Unlike cdecl where the caller would adjust the stack back.) < 1294774997 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh sure, thats not the point < 1294774999 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh okay < 1294775006 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the point is to understand what people have thought of < 1294775011 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it's not yesterday, then it's today < 1294775022 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you know who else is inefficient? < 1294775024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: that seems actually saner for some things < 1294775027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: my butt? < 1294775030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::| < 1294775032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH LOOK AT THAT < 1294775032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SUBVERSION < 1294775040 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott butt x3 < 1294775043 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh shit you won < 1294775046 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294775048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: lolpedo < 1294775054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :darn wait it's ephebo now < 1294775055 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It looks a bit neater; though it then breaks worse than cdecl if the caller and callee disagree about the number of arguments. < 1294775056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :less catchy :( < 1294775064 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I think vararg functions are more messy somehow. < 1294775068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Right. < 1294775075 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you werent prepubescent when you were 13 either < 1294775080 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but thats not the point < 1294775082 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: HOW DO YOU KNOW < 1294775087 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :question: I have some coal and I want to make glass.... < 1294775096 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well im guessing you're not weird < 1294775097 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but should I use it to make glass or use it to find more coal? < 1294775102 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :liking 15yo is not really a philia < 1294775104 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1294775112 0 :rom9com1!~Rom@men75-6-82-230-14-45.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294775117 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for oklopol, its reality! < 1294775121 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294775122 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION licks oklopol < 1294775139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well < 1294775142 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: how much coal do you have < 1294775142 0 :rom9com!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1294775151 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: not sure, ilike 30 bits < 1294775153 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i mean obviously you need to keep a lot for torches and shit < 1294775159 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha keep shity < 1294775176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well, 1 coal can make 8 glass out of 8 sand < 1294775187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but you need torches to explore, and coal is useful besides < 1294775198 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: getting e.g. 64 coal should not take long at all -- are you mining properly? < 1294775234 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: coal is very easy to find, just keep a couple boxes full of it to make sure you don't accidentally run out < 1294775246 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: probably not X) < 1294775256 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: how are you mining < 1294775259 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: how much is a box full? < 1294775267 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :many, many stacks of 64. but only oklopol does that. < 1294775267 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: several different ways, to find out what works well < 1294775271 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you accumulate tons of it naturally usually < 1294775280 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The most coal I ever found was just by exploring, and noticing it on the sides of hills < 1294775287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: use the wiki, really :) < 1294775293 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Tutorials/Mining_Techniques lists all the viable mining techniques < 1294775299 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: apart from that -- you do spelunk right? < 1294775309 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats that < 1294775318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: going into caves < 1294775320 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw I also started a quarry because I wanted obsidian < 1294775320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and cavern systems < 1294775323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and lighting them < 1294775323 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that doesn't work great < 1294775324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and mining ore there < 1294775330 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quarry howso < 1294775338 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My coal-box only has 7*64. :/ < 1294775339 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, if you want obsidian, find some lava < 1294775365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: really, don't be ashamed of reading the wiki, it's not fun to be all "oh how can i get coal" :) < 1294775377 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and since the game has no real objective... if it's not fun, just look it up < 1294775419 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have lots of coal < 1294775437 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was just wondering if I should use it to set up somet mine or just create glass now < 1294775598 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ell? :)) < 1294775713 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I should build a spiral staircase that goes right down to lava < 1294775720 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, check the wiki. Reading the wiki is fun. < 1294775742 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, a straight one works fine? Though there aren't lava lakes everywhere. They are lava lakes after all < 1294775746 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i doubt i have a full box of coal even on my local < 1294775749 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :prolly close < 1294775759 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(with emphasis on lake) < 1294775766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i've built a staircase that goes down to bedrock zomg :P < 1294775770 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course, i use it about once every 5 steps < 1294775817 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, movecraft is fun btw. Sad it doesn't handle redstone, chests or doors yet < 1294775866 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on esoserver you can just mine straight down because you can't die :( < 1294775867 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Tutorials/Quarry <-- dunno if this is a troll article or not < 1294775870 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or rotating the boat/shift/aircraft/whatever for turning < 1294775892 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHERE'S THE MINECRAFT IN THAT? < 1294775900 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, ? < 1294775902 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to me? < 1294775904 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or to j-invariant? < 1294775927 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to neither, continuation to what i said earlier < 1294775957 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1294775981 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, well if you are mining for cobble (which probably only happens when you are doing megascale structures) they a quarry can work well < 1294775991 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you want ores then they are useless < 1294776036 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do hostile mobs spawn in trees? < 1294776059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: the Cube is basically a gigantic quarry < 1294776060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, well, will be < 1294776068 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I have a treehouse and a zombie sometiems spawns next to the tree ontop < 1294776079 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah my treehouse is open air :D < 1294776080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe a bad idae < 1294776082 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :idea < 1294776088 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, do they spawn on leaves or on logs only? < 1294776095 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it's the ground < 1294776103 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a layer of mud ontop of my house to grow trees on < 1294776160 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if a creeper spawns in the fucking tree i will die < 1294776164 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: mud? you mean dirt? :P < 1294776179 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294776185 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, add some glass walls? < 1294776192 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, or light up the tree? < 1294776199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: um this is first night < 1294776202 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah < 1294776203 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the tree is lit, kinda < 1294776205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can light it more < 1294776217 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well that is an easy way to protect yourself! < 1294776247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there, all lit up < 1294776263 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[In Beta, lava is less reactive with horizontal water flows. It also has a chance of forming redstone ore when water runs on top of it [citation needed]. Lava pools without a source will degrade to dirt after a given time period.]] < 1294776282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol, skeleton in the trees >_< < 1294776286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't shoot me < 1294776288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(another tree) < 1294776288 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also once movecraft gets fixed I think a yacht might be a cool living place. But at the moment that is not viable. < 1294776300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god spider noise < 1294776301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it just me < 1294776306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or do the monsters always seem to be closer < 1294776307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :than they are < 1294776308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by the sounds < 1294776310 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : [[In Beta, lava is less reactive with horizontal water flows. It also has a chance of forming redstone ore when water runs on top of it [citation needed]. Lava pools without a source will degrade to dirt after a given time period.]] <-- that sounds made up < 1294776314 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: How do I lift water up? < 1294776318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: bucket < 1294776322 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. to make an aquaduckt < 1294776326 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the dirt think I'm pretty sure is wrong for example < 1294776331 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no other way ;9 < 1294776332 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294776336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: just make bukkits < 1294776338 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only requires a few iron < 1294776344 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : EIdon't have iron ingots < 1294776347 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3 iron for a bucket < 1294776351 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"When you stay in Lava for about 1-2 seconds, your character makes noises which appear to go along to "When the Saints Go Marching In."" < 1294776352 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what xD < 1294776355 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, well can't be done without a bucket < 1294776362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iw onder if that's intentional < 1294776362 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, dude that is a troll < 1294776363 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*i wonder < 1294776366 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i don't care < 1294776368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't want it to be < 1294776368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also < 1294776371 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your definition of troll sucks < 1294776372 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :joke != troll < 1294776387 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well a joke should be funny. That is just pathetic < 1294776393 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it's amusing < 1294776396 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god why do the spiders sound so fucking close < 1294776397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are they close < 1294776403 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you have no sense of humour < 1294776422 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought he had too much of it < 1294776436 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like a sixth sense of humor < 1294776439 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, well maybe he has an anti-sense of humor < 1294776446 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1294776458 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl < 1294776465 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you copy words from other people too? i was just about to correct humor to humour because you used that < 1294776472 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then < 1294776480 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you go and spoil it by now having used both < 1294776508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf pig < 1294776512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how did you get on top of that tree < 1294776512 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just totally instantiated my own oklopol < 1294776536 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294776541 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but no one knows < 1294776546 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's in my CLOSURE. < 1294776559 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i KNEW you were gay < 1294776568 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1294776573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294776582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe cheater99 is augur < 1294776585 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this theory is backed by EVIDENCE < 1294776586 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what sort of gay hating is that now < 1294776595 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm only useful for 7 things, and 6 of them i can do on this channel. < 1294776608 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the seventh is knitting < 1294776610 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is not < 1294776619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it not? what is the seventh then < 1294776640 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: not being here < 1294776645 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's good for that. < 1294776647 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he can do that < 1294776650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's called af < 1294776650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :k < 1294776659 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm useful for, um < 1294776672 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea but he can't do that on the channel < 1294776681 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously by definition. < 1294776698 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[4.) Continue the process of mining a layer, and then another, until you hit bedrock. This may take a few days of vigorous playing to accomplish, but your earnings will make it well worth it. Most quarries yield an average of 150 stacks of coal, 50 stacks of iron ore, 20 stacks of gold ore, 5 stacks of obsidian, and a maximum of 1 stack of diamond gems, though these results vary with the width, depth and location of your quarry.[cita < 1294776698 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tion needed] (see discussion section)]] < 1294776699 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmhmm < 1294776699 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4 bits of coal produce 2 glass blocks??? < 1294776706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: dude... < 1294776714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: 1 bit of coal = 8 output; 1 bit of sand = 1 output < 1294776721 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?? < 1294776724 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: N sand -> N glass, requiring ceil(N/8) coal < 1294776724 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/File:Smeltingmenu.png < 1294776732 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that is in progress < 1294776736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as you can plainly see by the arrow < 1294776738 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the fires < 1294776743 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it takes time to smelt < 1294776791 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why would you use coal to smelt? < 1294776806 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wood works and is renewable < 1294776814 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really?? < 1294776837 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note: Just because what I said is true, doesn't make it a good idea. < 1294776914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Sgeo is being stuepid, coal is far more efficient & practical to use for smelting. < 1294776926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: See http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Furnace#Fuel_efficiency. < 1294776957 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Until the day you have to go on tremendously long minecart rides to get coal < 1294776958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ofc if you have some lava... :D < 1294776962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: what < 1294776963 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lava can smelt? < 1294776965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :getting coal is easy < 1294776969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: a bucket of it, yes, it also destroys the bucket < 1294776971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: hideously impractical < 1294776974 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nobody does it < 1294777192 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Wood works and is renewable ← only Vorpal cares about this, and he couldn't be bothered. < 1294777199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=20891 < 1294777204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, has the Sustainable project been canceled, Vorpal? < 1294777207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*cancelled < 1294777225 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I presume so. < 1294777226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: tl;dr guy wipes cave sounds due to being a pussy. < 1294777227 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no more cancelled than most of your code project s:P < 1294777230 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :projects * < 1294777231 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU TOO COULD FOLLOW IN HIS FOOTSTEPS < 1294777233 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Presume why? < 1294777241 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps I should warp out to (4000,4000) and check. < 1294777243 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but it is suspended < 1294777253 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, simply because lava is no longer renewable < 1294777262 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is no renewable light source any more < 1294777268 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, burning log < 1294777277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that where it was going to be? < 1294777278 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but what about making it burn in the first place? < 1294777291 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was near 4000,4000 < 1294777294 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not at it < 1294777300 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know exact coords < 1294777306 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just how to walk from 4000,4000 to get there < 1294777308 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1294777320 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone tell me in which series Red Dwarf ceases to be worth watching. < 1294777370 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The eighth series is meant to be a bit naff. < 1294777514 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : getting coal is easy <-- well, sgeo is right. some day you will exhaust all coal in the area near your base. This will however take a very long time. Probably months of mining in that area non-stop. < 1294777540 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in practise I doubt it will be a problem unless you keep a word for that long time < 1294777544 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I doubt that about you < 1294777647 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've just finished 50x50x3 hall under the sea < 1294777657 0 :Cocytus!~Cocytus@c-65-96-205-201.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294777679 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, those cave sounds are nice. They remind me of a cross between myst and nwn somehow. < 1294777716 0 :Cocytus!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294777737 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: HOW GOES GRAVITY.LISP. < 1294777743 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: That's less than 128x128x128. < 1294777753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Wait, x3? As in, only 3 tall? < 1294777754 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it doesn't go at all. < 1294777758 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: PAH < 1294777767 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3 metres tall is plenty! < 1294777772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1294777779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Sgeo: Buy the damn game and do drudge work on the Cube. < 1294777805 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If we have enough drudge workers, we can just mine it out by hand! < 1294777807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: http://cobolforgcc.sourceforge.net/ < 1294777818 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, glass? < 1294777828 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, if not, it isn't awesome enough for the roof < 1294777846 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Say a miner can reach the bottom of any square of map in 100 seconds. < 1294777853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Say you have 10 people on the job. < 1294777868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: There are 16,384 such squares to do. < 1294777870 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is the cube? < 1294777892 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: deep under the sea < 1294777900 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, elliott's slightly Freudian construction project. < 1294777901 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :around level 16 < 1294777901 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, isn't that 45 hours per person? < 1294777903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: tl;dr 45 and a half straight hours. < 1294777906 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, try again < 1294777917 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what about 128 workers? < 1294777921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: A 128 wide, 128 high, 128 deep cube in the ocean, made out of glass, lit by lava. < 1294777925 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: What's Freudian about it. < 1294777929 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, so not at the sea bottom? < 1294777934 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294777936 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, COMPENSATING FOR SOMETHING? < 1294777941 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, not awesome enough :P < 1294777946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My genitalia are not cuboid. < 1294777951 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, everyone dug under the sea in terrains < 1294777968 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: But yeah, even with 10 people working on it constantly and several breakings of the laws of physics, it would take 45 hours to mine out the Cube. < 1294777972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I'm saying is: TNT kit. < 1294777974 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hate minecraft < 1294777979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: then why did you make it < 1294777995 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my during the hours that took me to dig it < 1294778004 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, OK, but you're clearly compensating for the fact that you're 4 feet tall IRL. < 1294778008 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my gf got really mad at me < 1294778018 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i didn't earn a penny < 1294778023 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because coding is so boring < 1294778027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: That is true. < 1294778052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: MORE AWE AT THE CUBE PLZ < 1294778055 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : nooga, everyone dug under the sea in terrains ← terrains? < 1294778072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There should be underground biomes. < 1294778075 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, err, good questions < 1294778082 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :question* < 1294778099 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, there is that thing which fiddles with the terrain gen's internal parameters < 1294778099 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I think I'm a bit pluralish today < 1294778114 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(SSP only, though.) < 1294778118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: BiomeTerrain or whatever? < 1294778124 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No idea. < 1294778126 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I've wanted to try that for a while now. It looks way better than Notch's generator. < 1294778135 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, everyone dug under the sea in terrain? < 1294778139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Generates much larger, smoother biomes and the like. Lots of tweakable parameters. < 1294778146 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well it is /slightly/ better < 1294778155 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: That photo I linked of a highlands scene (saying it was a good argument for Better Grass) was made with it. < 1294778159 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, if you define terrain to "solid blocks" then it makes sense :P < 1294778168 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't remember that. < 1294778176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was literally days ago. < 1294778189 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, link to that photo? I don't remember seeing that photo < 1294778244 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I'm the sort of person who's done the Red Cross First Aid course twice and so I knew what to do and was almost immediately compressing his chest to the rhythm of the Bee Gees' Staying Alive with the phone operator counting along with me. No, I'm not being funny. The rhythm of that song is ideal for CPR." < 1294778253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Never perform CPR unless you do that. < 1294778288 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: sounds amazing < 1294778288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[Alternatively, it's the same BMP as Queen's "Another One Bites the Dust" and Pink Floyd's "Another Brick in the Wall Part II".]] < 1294778300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yeah, we've cleared, like, 10 lines of sea :P < 1294778303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like moses, except really slow < 1294778306 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10?? < 1294778309 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You said it looked too flat, IIRC. < 1294778309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: and excavation is... slow < 1294778310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yes, 10 < 1294778312 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've done more than 10 < 1294778314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: as in, 10 lines of 126 long < 1294778320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: about 10 deep each < 1294778331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i doubt you have < 1294778345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that's about 10*10*126 = 12600 blocks placed < 1294778348 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to clear < 1294778353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very roughly < 1294778395 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294778399 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294778406 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294778408 0 :sftp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294778408 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294778408 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294778418 0 :Ilari_antrcomp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294778418 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1294778424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://imgur.com/om0iL This is fully functional, with CraftBook. < 1294778424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Discuss superiority to Vorpal's gate. < 1294778455 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clearly superior. Also irrelevant if Vorpal doesn't have CraftBook. < 1294778505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's on his test server and he was talking about craftbook before. < 1294778507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And how awesome it was. < 1294778510 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So yes, he does. < 1294778563 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1294778563 0 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1294778563 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@61.251.165.38 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294778563 0 :sftp!~sftp@79.174.49.208 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294778563 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1294778563 0 :EgoBot!~EgoBot@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1294778563 0 :Ilari_antrcomp!~user@2002:5870:38d7:1:20e:a6ff:fe6f:2288 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294778563 0 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:38d7::1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294778598 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Excess Flood < 1294778601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: In which Notch actually responds to feedback: http://www.reddit.com/r/Minecraft/comments/ezpw5/lots_of_new_info_including_cake/c1c7grn < 1294778602 0 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-224-158.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294778623 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::O < 1294778636 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whe n you break a bit of glass you don't get it back :( < 1294778643 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: INDEED < 1294778647 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2lsFN5DgoLc This is the silliest thing. < 1294778666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Old, apparently.) < 1294778716 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zv6GVDu46ls I hypothesise that sound mods are inherently hilarious. < 1294778720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cow cow cow cow cow. < 1294778969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/Minecraft/comments/drvm8/my_experiment_with_modifying_the_minecraft_sound/c12gnct ;_; < 1294779128 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL < 1294779612 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1294779670 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gcd(F_m,F_n)=F_{gcd(m,n)} < 1294779691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool < 1294779695 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now use that to compute gcd < 1294779792 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1294779803 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fibonacci numbers are weird < 1294780144 0 :jix!jix@tomakin.h-ix.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294780310 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is the server down? < 1294780338 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm up now anyway < 1294780338 0 :rom9com1!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294780366 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, are you skyping? < 1294780688 0 :calamari!~calamari@ip70-162-184-205.ph.ph.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294780807 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294781235 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, what the hell are you doing? < 1294781708 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's toying with you. < 1294781715 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294782361 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ? < 1294782376 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With Vorpal. < 1294782420 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, is that supposed to be funny? It isn't really. < 1294782468 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, now you've made it even *less* funny. < 1294782483 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, your own fault for not making it funny to begin with < 1294782544 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, besides movecraft got updated. Now doors are supposed to work (nothing done on chests yet though) < 1294782554 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, also submarines < 1294782563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: help me design my language :P < 1294782574 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's this?? < 1294782594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: a language! btw have you read any more of the axiom info? < 1294782602 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eyah a little < 1294782620 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: is it close to what you were thinking of? < 1294782627 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294782633 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: no < 1294782633 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294782651 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can learn form it < 1294782667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: isn't it a dependent symbolic CAS? :P i mean that's my impression of it < 1294783263 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i'm actually curious < 1294783278 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: youo're right < 1294783287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what does your design have different to axiom? :) < 1294783478 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh i have to rename some of my methods... < 1294783491 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: can you fork ghc and add ml-style modules please, then i would always use haskell < 1294783559 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yeah I think I would change a bit moore than that :P < 1294783583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Well ... ML modules lets you chuck out typeclasses :P < 1294783604 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sort of. < 1294783725 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah, something that subsumes GADTs, Typeclasses and Modules < 1294783738 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you mean like dependent records? :P < 1294783763 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure < 1294783773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: sure < 1294783800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: dependent records do powerful ML-style modules; powerful ML-style modules do typeclasses with, like, one bit of magic; and dependent inductive types are of course basically GADTs < 1294783833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: (the one bit of magic I think is this: a module signature can specify one of its exported values is "magical"; whenever a value of that type is needed as an implicit module parameter (a notion added just for this), that value is used) < 1294783856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: for instance, the module implementing integers would have a magical value of type Ring Z < 1294783862 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then some function might be like < 1294783887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lolRingFunction : forall T, [Ring T] -> ... < 1294783893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where [] means "magic module param" < 1294783895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then < 1294783898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lolRingFunction (some Z) < 1294783902 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would auto-specify that (Ring Z) value < 1294783906 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hey what about < 1294783913 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lolRingFunction : Ring T, ... < 1294783914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course having two magical values of the same type in your current module scope is verboten < 1294783923 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use typeclasses *as* quantifiers < 1294783924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you mean as the syntax? < 1294783928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a nice idea < 1294783934 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would keep the verbosity down < 1294783944 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: maybe something like "the" though < 1294783948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lolRingFunction : the Ring T, ... < 1294784118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: oh god, I have created an image that could give Douglas Hofstadter an aneurysm < 1294784142 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a basilisk image? < 1294784149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but Hofstadter-only < 1294784154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :behold < 1294784154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/VqcIS.png < 1294784155 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RECURSION < 1294784159 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hear it blows his mind < 1294784168 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :too bad i'm not him < 1294784172 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like being blown < 1294784176 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1294784193 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1294784193 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :agh, tk < 1294784201 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously the egytions understood recursion < 1294784213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :egytions :D < 1294784223 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm making a pyramid in minecraft < 1294784232 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's glass on the inside but sand on the outside < 1294784234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note to self, add a separate background colour for selected vs. active... hard to remove those lists without knowing what you have selected < 1294784321 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :editing these nested expressions is slow :D < 1294784333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: nice < 1294784394 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would like to see an upside-down floating sand pyramid in minecraft < 1294784408 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not upside down :( < 1294784690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: is "foo ~ {}" valid Clue? < 1294784724 0 :hiato!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1294784774 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : i would like to see an upside-down floating sand pyramid in minecraft <-- possible with torches < 1294784787 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, if it floats just above a torch that is < 1294784796 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, why not make one yourself? < 1294784870 0 :MigoMipo_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294784874 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someday < 1294784900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: sometime < 1294784915 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, somewhere < 1294784957 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(wait, is none else going to continue this chain?) < 1294784961 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(bbl) < 1294785448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so hey, cled is ugly as fuck :D < 1294785623 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://i.imgur.com/CP1vV.png can you figure out what's going on here :D < 1294785626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even i have troubles < 1294785689 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what [] does.. looks nice though :D < 1294785820 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's just a list < 1294785830 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ([] (1) (2) (3)) there is [1 2 3] < 1294785858 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: basically, that screenshot is the really ugly representation of {. 3 [7 44 1] -> [[1] 3 [7 44]] } ... with some highlighting oddities < 1294785872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i think i'm starting to see why this kind of editing is unpopular < 1294785873 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is cled? some derivative of clue? < 1294785910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: cled is my semantic AST editor for clue ... it happened after i wanted to write a clue-mode for emacs < 1294785915 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's became, well, this monstrosity < 1294785918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*become, < 1294785926 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :time to kill it dead? < 1294785928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :453 lines of folly and counting < 1294785937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: nO < 1294785938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*NO < 1294785941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the platonically perfect clue editor < 1294785943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just sucks, is all < 1294785951 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i'm gonna develop it to completion anyway :D < 1294785958 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good < 1294785966 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only because clue sucks and not because there's anything wrong with the editor, yes? < 1294785981 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: no, clue is amazing < 1294785983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my editor sucks and ROCKS! < 1294785987 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and sucks < 1294786023 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird man speak with forked tongue. need whiskey and migraine pill for good medicine. < 1294786034 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone tell me which books of Known Space are any good. < 1294786036 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :concur < 1294786063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Someone point me to a list of the reasons X sucks. Someone tell me what subset of Y is good. < 1294786065 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: * < 1294786073 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All of them? < 1294786096 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What about the infamous third book in the Ringworld series? < 1294786097 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294786109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=132717 Nice. < 1294786110 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Someone point me to a list of the reasons X sucks. Someone tell me what subset of Y is good. ← BLATANT LIES < 1294786119 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: What do you mean, "what about it"? < 1294786120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FastRender: more efficient chunk queue processing. < 1294786120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UniText: a completely rewritten text renderer. It's faster and supports Unicode, although the Unicode font files are not included with this release. < 1294786120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fewer glClears: erasing the entire screen is expensive. This mod avoids it when possible. < 1294786122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better chunk drawing code: Removing a few useless transforms from the chunk rendering code lets all visible chunks be drawn in a straightforward manner. < 1294786127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like this Scaevolus guy. < 1294786149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: INCIDENTALLY, can you buy me a new GPU? < 1294786156 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I plan to configure Minecraft to be utterly insane soon. < 1294786158 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_, i.e. it's infamous for being a perfect instance of quality being inversely proportional to place in the series? < 1294786199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An HD texture pack if I find one I like, far distance, fancy rendering, Better Light, that shader mod with depth of field, perhaps also with that lighting shader if I can find it and make it work together... < 1294786205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mipmapping if it helps. < 1294786253 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1294786255 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I don't recall it being bad, though. < 1294786258 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my 50x50 trap works < 1294786269 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Definitely not as good as the first, mind. < 1294786291 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've get approx 24 sulfur in 15 min < 1294786319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: lol noob < 1294786338 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :??? < 1294786344 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RiJh5fpWPAo < 1294786346 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have 1 sulfer after 2 weeks playing < 1294786353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: kill creepers < 1294786357 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and build a mob trap < 1294786361 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :again, read the wiki :P < 1294786391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: build that and then come back < 1294786395 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the hell is happening in that video! LOL < 1294786409 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294786417 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the reason they die is because of falling from such a height < 1294786424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294786428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: watch the rest of it :) < 1294786429 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ummm.... that must have taken a while to build < 1294786434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: basically: they don't spawn on steps < 1294786438 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the ground below is safe < 1294786442 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then the huge dome catches them < 1294786444 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the only way is down < 1294786449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so they walk down and then fall inside < 1294786457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :resulting in loot < 1294786460 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's crazy wtf < 1294786469 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how the hell did he have the patience to build it < 1294786469 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since they're spawning all the time at night, they fall down at a crazy rate :) < 1294786470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294786471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er < 1294786473 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they don't walk down < 1294786475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's water < 1294786477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously < 1294786479 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to carry them < 1294786481 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: who knows :D < 1294786495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tl;dr mobs spawn in big water slide all night, ride uncontrollably, fall down, die, drop loot. < 1294786550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: building mob traps is not so hard though < 1294786567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: basically, you want an easily steppable-upon bit of water that mobs will go into, which then leads down to < 1294786568 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C C < 1294786569 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: @ this clip... i thought that mobs don't spawn on water < 1294786571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where space is nothing < 1294786575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the two Cs are catcuses < 1294786581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: dunno... i think they do < 1294786590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: but besides, there's those little sticky out bits of cobbles fro them to spawn on anyway < 1294786591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*for < 1294786595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: this crushes the mobs < 1294786599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: and they'll drop loot into the stream < 1294786603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: which you then route into your base < 1294786607 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, FWIW, that Optimine thing has mucked up Better Light. < 1294786614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: you apply better light afterwards < 1294786617 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: not before < 1294786624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: so basically mobs will keep walking in, getting crushed by the cactus, and their loot will float into a pool in your base < 1294786632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that won't be hugely fast, but it'll be pretty good < 1294786685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: oh and < 1294786694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: look for natural cobblestone while mining, and also mossy cobblestone < 1294786699 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it'll be a dungeon < 1294786702 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh ok < 1294786702 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: with a mob spawner inside < 1294786711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: now consider: dig out the floor beneath that mob spawner < 1294786725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: so much that they die of fall damage < 1294786727 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and route a path in < 1294786729 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H8xs53VmFjc neat < 1294786733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: mob spawners only spawn one type of monster < 1294786734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but.. < 1294786749 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[...these people are trying to make money from an idea that does not belong to them.]] — An Idiot on the MC boards. < 1294786761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: e.g. if it's a spider spawner < 1294786764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you could get shitloads of string < 1294786862 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that door machine is hilarious < 1294786877 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: if you tab away it sounds like venetian snares... sorta < 1294787339 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha, nice video < 1294787631 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1294787668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: btw: http://www.reddit.com/r/Minecraft/comments/evwk8/does_anyone_know_how_to_make_a_very_simple_but/ < 1294787671 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: stuff about mob traps < 1294787716 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1294788004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guide to minecraft: http://i.imgur.com/i1YWC.png < 1294788333 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is Notch going to remove indefinitely burning logs? < 1294788350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The probability of that is somewhere in the region of 0. < 1294788358 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why? < 1294788379 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because there's something like seventeen hundred billion fireplaces, and also, very little reason to fix it :P < 1294788456 0 :marcules!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: - < 1294788470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: pics of your trap? < 1294788471 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1294788542 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what are your thoughts on Clean? < 1294788572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an interesting curiosity and — mere curiosity. uniqueness typing is interesting. < 1294788577 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :learn haskell instead. < 1294788594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also clean has some REALLY weird bits < 1294788594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like < 1294788598 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you write (a -> b) -> [a] -> [b] < 1294788598 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as < 1294788601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a -> b) [a] -> [b] < 1294788602 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why??? < 1294788608 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't even make any sense and takes special casing < 1294788617 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, are Clean functions curried? < 1294788622 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294788631 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also (x:xs) is [x:xs], which, again, means that a single list with the single element (x:xs) is [[x:xs]]... which is just plain confusing and stupid < 1294788636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also infix o weird me out < 1294788640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but these are all syntactical differences. < 1294788750 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe uniqueness typing is what will bring me back into the purely functional world < 1294788754 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea that's stupid < 1294788757 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Or maybe I'll be bored to tears] < 1294788771 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: stop talking in trivial lists. < 1294788811 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I trapped some cows in a cave but they disappeared :( < 1294788817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i kind of feel embarrassed for Sgeo on behalf of... everyone < 1294788818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: whut < 1294788819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: howso < 1294788821 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it not possible to make a farm? < 1294788833 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just dug this small cave into a hill and trapped the cows in there < 1294788843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Of course it is: http://imgur.com/a/pt8v5 < 1294788845 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what cheater99 said was a joke, afaict. < 1294788850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose they might die in low light. < 1294788852 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think < 1294788853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: And? < 1294788871 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahaha I need one of these < 1294788877 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I wonder why they disappeared < 1294788899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: try building a small but ~5 deep pit instead < 1294788903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and put a torch on the walls < 1294788904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :get them in there and see < 1294788914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: if you walked too far away i guess they could disappear... but you'd have to walk a few chunks < 1294788916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so probably not < 1294788918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*quite a few < 1294788921 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh :( < 1294788934 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah I roam very far so that might not be worth doing then < 1294788938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: lol no < 1294788940 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i doubt it < 1294788948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's like 16 chunks < 1294788954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so like < 1294788957 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :walking 256 away maybe < 1294788961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess it's easy but < 1294788971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i think i'm wrong < 1294789014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Mobs spawn no closer than 24 blocks and disappear if they are more than 4 chunks away from the player." < 1294789015 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-elliott: why not just play farmville? < 1294789020 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ok if you walked far away. < 1294789027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: because minecraft is more than farming? :P < 1294789032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: build a mob trap :D < 1294789064 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im going to sleep ;) < 1294789066 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, use minecraft to make mafiaville or whatever they call it < 1294789074 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gangstaville? < 1294789084 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I finished building a pyramid though < 1294789089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: how big? < 1294789104 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's only like 6 high < 1294789132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: really? that shouldn't have took that long to build... unless it has like a flat top and is really wide < 1294789137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :screenshot? < 1294789150 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it's just a tiny pyramid < 1294789152 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should now recreate von dniken's mythology around it < 1294789167 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: how long did it take to build? < 1294789183 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: dunno I did other stuff in between < 1294789191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1294789204 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there like < 1294789208 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :automation for minecraft? < 1294789230 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: interesting < 1294789234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: there's redstone. < 1294789247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bluestone would let you build a hideously complex autominer but it doesn't exist and never will >:) < 1294789268 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :minecraft just sounds real fucking boring to me in that you have to sit around clicking stuff < 1294789288 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like killing wild pigs in a forrest in wow < 1294789288 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294789304 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 experience point per click or something equally dumb < 1294789311 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: umm what < 1294789313 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not that i ever played wow, but you know what i mean) < 1294789315 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't kill pigs generally < 1294789316 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294789328 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well er no because in MC most of the time is spent doing shit you want < 1294789330 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah, but that's what it feels like < 1294789331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. building shit < 1294789334 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it doesn't < 1294789337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you've clearly never played < 1294789341 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294789348 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i've seen many vids now < 1294789356 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :% of people who haven't played minecraft and think it's probably lame: 99 < 1294789364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :% of people who have played minecraft and think it's lame: much less < 1294789373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nobody cares, honestly. < 1294789386 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :generally in the family of minecraft-likes you'd expect a scripted way of doing things in accelerated time, or at least without user interaction < 1294789394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you not think everyone has already heard "OMG IT SOUNDS BORING AND LAME" 100 times before < 1294789414 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not trying to change your mind or anything < 1294789415 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DURP DURP MY INFORMED OPINION IS THAT IT'S LAME < 1294789422 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or like "tell you it's lame" < 1294789424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: OH MAN THAT'S NOVEL < 1294789432 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean literally lame though. < 1294789436 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has a limp. < 1294789437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: in response: no, automating such things would not make the game more fun. < 1294789444 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: So THAT'S what the view bobbing is. < 1294789444 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm just expressing what my impression is and wondering why you guys think different < 1294789446 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's all < 1294789454 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: 'cuz it's fun < 1294789459 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ya k < 1294789464 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no reason to get upset there < 1294789468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not upset < 1294789481 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I'M NOT UPSET OK????????? < 1294789483 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1294789492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, right, everyone who disagrees with you is upset < 1294789500 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, i'm just joking around < 1294789528 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mining can be fun enough because you find caverns and dungeons, exploring caves is fun and often screenshot-worthy, exploring terrain is fun and often leads to good locations for build projects, building structures are fun, building houses is fun, building machines with redstone is fun, fighting mobs is... uh... terrifying < 1294789532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1294789533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so terrifying < 1294789541 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ya i can see exploring mines is fun < 1294789562 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so can exploring terrain be < 1294789566 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exploring mines? you build mines, you mean caverns :P < 1294789570 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yes < 1294789574 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or other people's mines < 1294789588 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also fun is building a forest-top village < 1294789591 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but like.. i'm surprised there aren't scripts for say building houses or pools < 1294789591 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did I also mention that people who play Minecraft are torps and hurpadurp? < 1294789598 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that just feels so droll tbh < 1294789638 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a torp? < 1294789642 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that like a tarp? < 1294789708 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pfff < 1294789711 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Such a torp question to ask. < 1294789716 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HORP TORP < 1294789754 0 :drakhan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294789768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: man why aren't there machines that automate pushing pieces of lego together < 1294789778 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that just feels so droll tbh < 1294789826 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are < 1294789832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: would you use them < 1294789842 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: THAT SLEEP THING IS WORKING WELL FOR YOU HUH < 1294789846 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no i would just use big pieces < 1294789854 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1294789866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: ahh, so you'd rather play MINECRAFT: FOR KIDS! < 1294789876 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Roblox? < 1294789879 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd play minecraft duplo < 1294789882 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :minecraft is for kids X) < 1294789888 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, that reminds me, I want to try Roblox >.> < 1294789888 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with BIG pieces < 1294789907 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :designed for 1-3 years of age. < 1294789928 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since, like, i love to remit like that. < 1294789947 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you keep using that word etc. < 1294790035 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so my superdrive STILL isn't here, what is this INSOLENCE < 1294790063 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1294790126 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to make sure the infidels pay with their lives < 1294790150 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what word? < 1294790199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1294790204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :remit < 1294790241 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do? < 1294790255 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyways, some cool tricks here: http://blog.ksplice.com/2011/01/solving-problems-with-proc/ < 1294790257 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, but i do not think it means what you think it means. < 1294790305 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a remission is when you go back < 1294790308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"A UNIX process refers to its open files using integers called file descriptors. When we say "standard input", we really mean "file descriptor 0". So we can use /proc/self/fd/0 as an explicit name for standard input:" < 1294790309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lolfail < 1294790310 0 :hiato!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1294790311 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/dev/fd/0 < 1294790333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: that's irrelevant, the fact is that afaik nobody uses "remit" like that < 1294790341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you, like, got cancer at the age of 3 and still have it < 1294790345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I'm remitting back to BEFORE" < 1294790362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Good news! I'm in remission!" "That's great!" "Yes, I love being three years old!" < 1294790365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope, still not working < 1294790367 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but there's a technique in psychology called remission < 1294790369 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't there? < 1294790384 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't it regression you are thinking of < 1294790400 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just might be < 1294790436 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's so good to have you around < 1294790449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol is a plokloo < 1294790459 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could totally be a good subordinate neural network for some things < 1294790476 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should stuff your brain in a jar when you don't need it anymore < 1294790496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i doubt that you will be in much of a position to do that at that time < 1294790508 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how so? < 1294790527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i assume you mean when i die. < 1294790533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i *expect* you'll die before me < 1294790550 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, let's say you suddenly find yourself with vital organs failing surprisingly, as if someone were blasting surgically applied rays of microwaves into your body < 1294790560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be quite unfortunate, yes < 1294790570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i rather think my brain would take some damage < 1294790578 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's say it's a cabal of killer ninja-robot-rabbits < 1294790612 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're real precise. < 1294790620 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i rather meant from the trauma < 1294790656 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, we'd need to make the decision to jar you quick then < 1294790697 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1294790757 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a project to replace brains with something less volatile than a foie gras could be real fun < 1294790781 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even if, say, replicating the function of a neuron would take a supercomputer. < 1294790825 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um i find that unlikely. < 1294790857 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i find someone sitting down and writing GHC unlikely < 1294790888 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's that got to do with anything < 1294790888 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AND YET!!!!!!!!!!! < 1294790899 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1294790900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"someone" didn't, tons of people did it over the course of years < 1294790908 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it's as high on my unlikelihood scale < 1294790908 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, that's an argument /for/ technology being able to do things, not for it not being able to < 1294790918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ghc isn't _that_ advanced.. < 1294790920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*... < 1294791006 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still, looking back, in the 70s when most people were just working with perforated tape < 1294791019 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what ghc is now seemed like sci-fi < 1294791021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i find it incredibly unlikely that replicating the function of a neuron would take a supercomputer < 1294791022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is what i'm saying < 1294791030 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh ok < 1294791032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and, uh, not really, it's just a compiler ... < 1294791035 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :albeit a good one < 1294791047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: ML came out in the early 70s < 1294791055 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haskell isn't much of a leap < 1294791065 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i know < 1294791082 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but still, the general population was doing that perforated cards stuff < 1294791084 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"type inference? what's a type? is that like a collection of holes in a von neumann machine?" < 1294791119 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and what i'm saying is i guess we're to neuroscience what perforated card users were to computer science back then < 1294791122 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does SML not have the +. nonsense of OCaml? < 1294791138 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is +. nonsense? < 1294791151 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the worst thing about haskell for me is the indentation nonsense < 1294791154 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's very nonsensical. < 1294791189 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The thing that functions or whatever can't operate, say, on both ints and floats < 1294791202 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294791208 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eek. < 1294791224 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99? < 1294791235 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can write haskell with brackets and semicolons if you want to < 1294791248 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most people just prefer to reduce visual clutter < 1294791281 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm talking indentation not braces < 1294791295 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :python doesn't have braces or semicolons but it has a nice indent style < 1294791305 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what I'm saying < 1294791308 0 :SimonRC!~sc@fof.durge.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1294791310 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haskell doesn't < 1294791313 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with braces and semicolons, you can indent as you choose < 1294791313 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what i'm saying < 1294791322 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, no, fuck that < 1294791324 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't want that either < 1294791337 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can also indent as you choose with regular haskell and no braces and semicolons < 1294791344 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really understand what you mean < 1294791351 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like i'm saying "i don't like having diarrhea" and you say "cut off your arm instead" < 1294791351 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's strictly more flexible than python's rules < 1294791380 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i somehow find that's not really the case < 1294791386 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you give examples? < 1294791390 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also i see a lot of mutilated code < 1294791402 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, but there were some problems i have indeed run into < 1294791409 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like what? < 1294791410 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sadly i can't bring them up < 1294791422 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when i said i can't give examples i really meant it :p < 1294791431 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, that's a good stance < 1294791434 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sucks, but I can't remember why < 1294791442 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: cheater99 is a troll, ignore him :) < 1294791445 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh okay < 1294791452 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: elliott is a troll, just ignore him :) < 1294791461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro is already ignoring me < 1294791464 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro already does < 1294791477 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just reinforcing that state then < 1294791531 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: next time i run into something i'll let you know (if i can remember at all that you were being all gung-ho about it) < 1294791533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this channel is such a happy family < 1294791541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm there was someone being gung-ho here but it wasn't copumpkin < 1294791542 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everyone ignores everyone < 1294791562 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we're ending up like the eastenders. < 1294791573 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :constant haggle just to make do :D < 1294791579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...nobody should ever analogise wi- i give up i'm just going to go back to logreading < 1294791583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOBODY EVER ARGUES IN MY PEACEFUL LOGS < 1294791596 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294791596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :read oklopol talk about topology < 1294791599 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: well, let me just put it this way: python requires you to in/outdent by a specific amount each time. Haskell just looks for things that are indented the same depth and considers those to be at the same level. So you can indent haskell like python and have it behave as you'd expect < 1294791599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so relaxing < 1294791625 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: where is he talking about topology? < 1294791628 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, most code in haskell doesn't get very deeply indented < 1294791632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um pick a day, any day < 1294791644 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: give me something to search buffer for < 1294791648 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should try writing a literate program in haskell sometime, it'd be fun < 1294791651 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: grep oklopol 10* < 1294791675 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i only have this xchat buffer, i can search for exact strings < 1294791686 0 :Ilari_antrcomp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1294791686 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1294791705 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't have logs, what are logs, this is some sort of high-fly technology you're talking about. what's magnetic storage? < 1294791709 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: um oklopol hasn't talked about topology today < 1294791717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hg clone http://codu.org/projects/esotericlogs/hg/ esotericlogs < 1294791719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and pick dates at random < 1294791731 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a bzr interface? < 1294791745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just an easy way to get incremental updates to http://codu.org/projects/esotericlogs/hg/ ... < 1294791751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not like you're going to be committing typofixes < 1294791757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just hg pull; hg update every few days < 1294791761 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294791772 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll cron it to every 30 seconds < 1294791783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor put it in the topic under the assumption that people wouldn't rape his bandwidth < 1294791787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, uh, don't < 1294791797 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294791818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:09:04 actually < 1294791818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:09:06 you're right < 1294791818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:09:13 for this to be a great tv show < 1294791819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:09:22 we need like a really stupid fbi guy < 1294791821 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but pulling is very low-bandwidth, isn't it? < 1294791821 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:09:27 who asks stupid questions < 1294791823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:09:46 "so you're saying a locally connected spaces is like a rabbit that sticks its head into a bush when it gets scared?" < 1294791825 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: who let you be so awesome < 1294791830 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: it's also non-zero-bandwidth < 1294791831 0 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:38d7::1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294791862 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahah < 1294791868 0 :sshc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294791878 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about the converse < 1294791883 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CSI:torus < 1294791903 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the villain is an ant. < 1294791920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:18:06 hmm < 1294791920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:18:19 that's true for all partitions gotten this way? < 1294791920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:18:33 is that obvious again... < 1294791922 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:19:03 well of course it is < 1294791924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:19:06 by definition of touch < 1294791926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:19:29 wait < 1294791928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:19:42 what's the definition of touch? < 1294791930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:19:43 :D < 1294791931 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: Pulling is relatively low bandwidth, but it's a big enough archive that if a ton of people downloaded it, it would add up *shrugs* < 1294791936 0 :Ilari_antrcomp!~user@2002:5870:38d7:1:20e:a6ff:fe6f:2288 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294791942 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm gonna pull it every second < 1294791954 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: ya < 1294791970 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: i'm just gonna do what elliott suggests, you can blame him by proxy < 1294791975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no wait < 1294791977 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every picosecond < 1294791982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FEMTOSECOND PULLS < 1294791987 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: btw it only updates every day < 1294791989 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FEMTOSECOND < 1294791990 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think you'd need RTLinux for picoseconds < 1294792019 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know, tcp windowing gets interesting once you get to near-light speeds < 1294792028 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294792048 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if your requests can go out faster than they can traverse the cable < 1294792079 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just replace all hlt instructions in the kernel with hg pull code < 1294792081 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess that's been done with TCP/CP though < 1294792081 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, does that ever happen though? < 1294792090 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, in TCP/CP < 1294792095 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, CP? < 1294792097 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i love having two views of a buffer open at once, helps me forget my screen is tiny < 1294792105 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you tell him < 1294792110 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who < 1294792115 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vorpy < 1294792130 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought you'd know what TCP over Carrier Pidgeon was < 1294792135 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh that < 1294792138 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes I know that < 1294792141 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not the abbrev though < 1294792158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought you meant pigeons travelled at near light speed there < 1294792160 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, i just made it up to sound mysterious < 1294792167 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which i approv eof < 1294792167 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: WAIT A SECOND THERE < 1294792169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*approve of < 1294792170 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THEY DON'T ??????????????? < 1294792172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe they do in a vacuum < 1294792177 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a frictionless plane < 1294792177 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, they should < 1294792180 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THAT TOTALLY CHANGES EVERYTHING < 1294792195 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ziggy, what probabilities are we looking at right now?? < 1294792203 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes they do but um they are also turned into novergian blues < 1294792218 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that is plural of blue, not the word "blues") < 1294792243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:40:00 how are they not linear < 1294792243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:40:08 hmm < 1294792243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:40:28 i know too little about this stuff < 1294792244 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:40:38 MUST < 1294792246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:40:39 KNOW < 1294792248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:40:40 EVERYTHING < 1294792264 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, did he say those last lines? < 1294792275 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or did you add them? < 1294792289 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'll never know. the history is blurry at that point < 1294792296 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the path of time has been changed forever < 1294792299 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, I could grep logs < 1294792302 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it is some work < 1294792304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah nobody can check the logs < 1294792306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i committed and pushed < 1294792310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GUESS GREGOR DIDN'T THINK OF THAT EH < 1294792315 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GUESS NOT < 1294792316 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I have my local clog ones :P < 1294792321 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg what if he's secretly censoring things in the weekly checkouts < 1294792324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: confirm/deny < 1294792340 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: if we implemented brain as a quantum computer, could this mean it would be agnostic of time? < 1294792345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294792352 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because of quantum tangling across time < 1294792352 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what indeed < 1294792374 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean entanglement? < 1294792397 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :synonyms < 1294792408 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, tangling sounds so everyday < 1294792427 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Daily, and I censor them directly out of your mind, first. < 1294792432 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :entanglement sounds so popular science < 1294792442 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: oh that's what that pleasingly calm and relaxing sensation is < 1294792449 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, or actual real science < 1294792455 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294792459 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ABOLISH REAL SCIENCE < 1294792477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :science is not hipster < 1294792479 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's only talk about ufos and lsd-philosophy! < 1294792486 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and 2012? < 1294792495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and dragons < 1294792502 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, dragons! < 1294792506 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i heard someone say 2012 will not even happen in 2012 < 1294792515 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IDEA FOR WORST MOVIE EVER: A docudrama/romantic comedy about a quantum scientist and his ENTANGLEMENT with some fru-fru hippy girl that doesn't believe in science. < 1294792516 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294792520 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might happen later. < 1294792559 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was that movie about the great scientist and his son < 1294792560 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1991260 | 2010-12-14 06:40:40 | oklofok | | | 0 | EVERYTHING < 1294792562 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep he said it < 1294792572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: That is ... yes. < 1294792573 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the guy builds starships and his son goes to south africa and builds canoes < 1294792592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: ALSO CANDIDATE FOR: Strangest sex scenes in a movie. < 1294792595 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, haha < 1294792602 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, stranglet! < 1294792602 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I'm assuming you mean: literal entanglement. < 1294792612 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I read it as stranglet sex scenes < 1294792612 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in, his body is literally quantumly entangled with hers. Permanently. Somehow. < 1294792616 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, :D < 1294792619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Please tell me this is the case. < 1294792620 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Literal QUANTUM entanglement, that leads to romantic entanglement! < 1294792630 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Our spin, it's the same!" < 1294792641 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OMG < 1294792643 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: "You're...inside me..." "THAT'S WHAT SHE SAID!" < 1294792646 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :finally that song makes sense < 1294792653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: "It's not rape if physics dictates!" < 1294792655 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you spin me right round baby right round < 1294792668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: AM I: (A) BEST PERSON (B) HORRIBLE PERSON (NOT B)? < 1294792680 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like a [something something] right round round round < 1294792693 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*record baby < 1294792694 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: All of the above? :P < 1294792696 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you spin me right round baby right round, like a quantum entangled device right round round round < 1294792702 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: (C) ALL OF THE BELOW < 1294792732 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1294792773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently Dock stopped being the Minecraft artist because: < 1294792779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I kept on running into technical problems with the export process, and Markus wasn’t used to having to wait for art assets." < 1294792785 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Notch: I REQUIRE ART NOW < 1294792807 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :./08.08.22:14:18:36 Haskell is compiled from .hs-files which means HOMO SEXUAL this could be funny. < 1294792818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :joke beginning < 1294792845 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hah... Somebody's explanation of Gulf War Syndrome: It was the diet sodas troops drank... < 1294792866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :first thing oklopol said: < 1294792867 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:39:12 has anyone done quicksort in brainfuck? < 1294792882 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how embarrassing < 1294792895 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't brainfuck basically a quicksort algorithm < 1294792903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :06.12.20:16:54:40 a.split("") is illegal? how to parse a string to a list of letters? :DD then i might be able to carry on :) < 1294792903 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sorts out people who are bored enough to learn it < 1294792906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :06.12.20:16:56:20 haha i can't do an assignment in a lambda? :D or is there a way? < 1294792914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you were a bad person < 1294792953 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :06.12.26:12:59:06 i love brainfuck, yeah, you gotta < 1294792976 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A string already is a list of characters < 1294792980 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[in Python] < 1294792980 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it isn't < 1294792983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is false < 1294792995 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, oh right < 1294793009 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's iterable though, so usable in most such contexts < 1294793011 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for char in string: print char < 1294793015 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And list(somestring) should work < 1294793020 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think < 1294793029 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't modify a string in place in python iirc < 1294793029 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1294793035 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in mystr[4] = 'a'; < 1294793037 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or such < 1294793054 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TypeError: 'str' object does not support item assignment < 1294793059 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, indeed < 1294793060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294793061 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can < 1294793062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wiat no < 1294793064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*wait < 1294793065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't < 1294793066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1294793068 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1294793068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because python is stupid < 1294793070 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, as usual I'm right :P < 1294793073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and inconsistent < 1294793073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and shit < 1294793083 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it needs to be hashable or something iirc < 1294793088 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(stupid stupid) < 1294793119 0 :cheater00!~cheater@g229029175.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294793139 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variables in python are immutable. < 1294793145 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, i've done a very disturbing discovery < 1294793159 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ grep -ir \\\ . | wc -l < 1294793161 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2803 < 1294793163 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ grep -r \\\ . | wc -l < 1294793165 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :69 < 1294793167 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||| < 1294793172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the fuck is that <> shit for < 1294793178 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is very serious < 1294793185 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's word-boundary < 1294793189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\b < 1294793190 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :noob < 1294793195 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\bphp\b < 1294793197 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol elliott doesn't know regex < 1294793203 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know what it is < 1294793204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but why are you using it < 1294793207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it requires an extra escape < 1294793212 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is pretty awesome < 1294793216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ofc why you aren't just 'quoting' it is another mystery < 1294793219 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: \b is the same < 1294793224 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and requires one less escape the way cheater00 did it < 1294793233 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294793250 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but he is an idiot for not quoting < 1294793257 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\b is not the same in that it is not directional. < 1294793263 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and picking on idiots is politically incorrect < 1294793263 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: why would i quote? < 1294793267 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i'll remain silent < 1294793284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because wasting time figuring out how to escape in both the shell and regexps is a waste of brain? < 1294793297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"oh i need to escape this shell metachar, \, oh i need to escape this regexp metachar, \\, oh but it's a shell metachar too, \\\" < 1294793298 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i waste time doing that? < 1294793305 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294793306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1294793308 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just bash the \ button. < 1294793314 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :randomly it works or doesn't :D < 1294793314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very reliable. < 1294793398 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ grep -ir \\\ . | wc -l < 1294793399 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3050 < 1294793407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://images.apple.com/v20110110174859/startpage/images/store_ipodtouch_20100927.png look at that personal engraving < 1294793415 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1294793419 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we should have like a bar chart for each language mentioned on 99bottles and in the wiki < 1294793421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apple think everyone is a douchebag < 1294793429 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: botte will have statistics. < 1294793463 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does botte exist in [t=now, t=now+1year] ? < 1294793483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now+1 year, most likely yes < 1294793494 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i still need to figure how to address some infinity lines quickly though < 1294793506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1294793509 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2072804 lines < 1294793523 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need basically arbitrary (non-backtracking) regexp search on that. < 1294793527 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cron < 1294793534 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't solve the problem of _how_ to index it. < 1294793544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can use an efficient regexp lib like Russ Cox's RE2 to grep ... but I don't know if it will be efficient. < 1294793546 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just grep | wc -l every language name < 1294793555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um botte has far more advanced needs than just that < 1294793573 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :scope creep < 1294793580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an irc bot < 1294793585 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i didn't scope creep, it'd be 32583495 bots < 1294793588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like all bots < 1294793593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not something i've just made up now anyway... < 1294793599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ time grep 'hello' big >/dev/null < 1294793599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :real 0m0.203s < 1294793600 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh that's fast enough < 1294793603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(big is "cat *.*.*") < 1294793618 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it something you've made up five minutes ago? < 1294793623 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294793628 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok then < 1294793639 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh grep -i is significantly slower i think < 1294793644 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294793646 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ time (grep -i clue big | wc -l) < 1294793646 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1715 < 1294793647 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :real 0m4.860s < 1294793655 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still < 1294793658 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RE2 powers Google Code Search < 1294793662 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably faster than grep i'd wager < 1294793669 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hence you always have a collation-normalize copy < 1294793670 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :d < 1294793692 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. strtoupper everything < 1294793701 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that EVERYONE IS SHOUTING LIKE THAT ALL THE TIME < 1294793704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and remove punctuation, yes, maybe < 1294793714 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would you remove punctuation? < 1294793724 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well to make most searches more efficient < 1294793734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe have heuristics to keep it in urls and channel names and stuff < 1294793742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but "foo," "foo:" "foo." "foo!" "foo?" etc. < 1294793749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the plan is basically to build the whole botte storage engine on something similar to datalog < 1294793752 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e., a prolog-esque db < 1294793764 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well when you're searching you just use the simple copy for finding the right file/line < 1294793771 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you grep those lines with the usual files again < 1294793793 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course < 1294793802 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll probably just filter out [a-zA-Z0-9] < 1294793804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then uppercase it all < 1294793808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even drop spaces < 1294793814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :useful for e.g. "brainfuck" vs "brain fuck" < 1294793820 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or just filter out [A-Z0-9] < 1294793821 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294793828 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the channel would be silent :P < 1294793831 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294793838 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except for smileys :D < 1294793844 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have everyone pre-process on their own < 1294793850 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. before they send to the channel.. < 1294793858 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could have mutliple copies too < 1294793878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when i say prolog-esque db, i also want to stuff s-expressions in there somehow < 1294793883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just because it's, you know, advanced technology < 1294793904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now the issue is that no _language_ can live up to such an amazing database system... < 1294793905 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one normal copy, one with strtoupper, then with spaces normalized, then with common words removed, then with punctuation removed, then with more punctuation removed, then with spaces removed < 1294793918 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :each level has everything the previous had < 1294793972 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: have you played secret maryo? < 1294794029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1294794083 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>> re.sub(r'[^a-z0-9]', '', 'Hello, world! http://google.com/ is the nemesis 20 times over. :P'.lower()) < 1294794083 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'helloworldhttpgooglecomisthenemesis20timesoverp' < 1294794087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :might wanna filter out smilies first < 1294794095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually spaces could be worth keeping :) < 1294794108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :other things botte will let you do: play the Name Game < 1294794240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder if anyone's already invented my latex-but-for-semantic-document-layout-rather-than-print-layout-making < 1294794245 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like texinfo, except less sucky < 1294794274 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hence i say filter out common words < 1294794294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: that's getting too close to a proper indexer for my liking, i'd rather build that kind of stuff on _top_ of a powerful thing < 1294794300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, i'm not even sure i want to filter punctuation < 1294794305 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i'll just lowercase it all < 1294794313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can build another index store for searching on top of that < 1294794328 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you do < 1294794332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah < 1294794338 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if you want to search for code snippets < 1294794347 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is to be used by everything, i can build another stripped index on top < 1294794349 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you enter punctuation into your query < 1294794361 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, the current combined log is only 124 and a half megabytes < 1294794365 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then it knows, yo, i gotta use me the punctuation-enabled database, yo < 1294794391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i could fit 196.6 copies of the log onto a $20 prgmr vps < 1294794396 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(assuming the disk is otherwise completely empty) < 1294794405 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294794407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's including its inefficient textual storage format < 1294794412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and inclusion of irrelevant things like joins and parts < 1294794415 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so really i'm not too worried < 1294794436 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Have fun with no OS :P < 1294794443 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what we really need is a neuron simulation that will just learn how to tell us what logs to read < 1294794453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: it was just figurewank :P < 1294794457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: just read them all < 1294794477 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: OS is overrated, just load a simple telnet server into RAM from NetBIOS < 1294794491 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on a prgmr.com xen, SUUUUURE < 1294794500 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: :D < 1294794508 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i was saying that knowingly. < 1294794675 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION installs lhs2tex < 1294794762 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294794764 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Literate Hasell? < 1294794767 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haskell < 1294794787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294794792 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294794794 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh great... i borked my texlive install < 1294794825 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294794838 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION downloads basictex :P < 1294794861 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1294794895 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1294794898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what a coincidence! copumpkin coming in just as i do haskell! < 1294794904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(note: you will always be the #haskeller. always) < 1294794904 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zomg < 1294794907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ALWAYS) < 1294795008 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :man, I've only been using haskell for a couple of years and already I'm known for it! < 1294795034 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: you might consider that instead, the problem is that you haven't done _anything_ more interesting than use haskell :D < 1294795049 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294795054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: i'm just kidding! < 1294795056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294795059 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1294795073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :setup: /usr/local/texlive/2010basic/texmf-local/tex/latex/polytable: < 1294795073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :permission denied < 1294795074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294795095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i need sudo < 1294795097 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :greaaaaat < 1294795104 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sudo apt-install elliott < 1294795109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1294795110 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, whoops < 1294795115 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sudo apt-get install elliott < 1294795119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*aptitude < 1294795128 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294795133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aw i hurt his feelings < 1294795134 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294795136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1294795139 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's wrong with apt-get? < 1294795151 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, WTF key combination did I press thaat did that? < 1294795153 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294795156 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294795159 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck you, Ctrl-W < 1294795233 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294795234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: the official package manager of the Debian operating system is aptitude < 1294795238 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION drowns his sorrows in cheese < 1294795243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so hey copumpkin MISTER HASKELL how do i use lhs2tex, i want step by step instructions < 1294795244 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nextstep 101 < 1294795255 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i want that too < 1294795265 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want a pony < 1294795275 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: everything you find out, relay it to me, let me just turn on my Ono-Sendai < 1294795276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh... lhs2tex looks like it italicises all names by default, not just variable bindings < 1294795276 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no tex for you < 1294795280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but top-level definitions and library functions too < 1294795283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i'm sure i can customise that < 1294795287 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's a 7 < 1294795298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294795303 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what what < 1294795307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh this is stupid < 1294795307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is it < 1294795313 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't know the Ono Sendai Cyberspace 7? < 1294795327 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm trying to get lhs to work < 1294795328 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kthx < 1294795336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey it works zom < 1294795337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :g < 1294795345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :! LaTeX Error: File `stmaryrd.sty' not found. < 1294795352 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pastebin code example plz < 1294795362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"% The module for importing the St Mary's Road symbol font." < 1294795364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why are you importing that. < 1294795380 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh < 1294795384 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do people use os x < 1294795390 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea really < 1294795391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't understand how anyone can use an os without a package manager < 1294795399 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ < 1294795401 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like using a programming language without names < 1294795404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :esoteric OS < 1294795405 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same thing i've been asking myself < 1294795408 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1294795416 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's install netbsd on a toaster :( < 1294795428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :netbsd's package manager isn't so hot either :) < 1294795439 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea but it's an esoteric os project < 1294795459 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't osx have ports? < 1294795464 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought that wasn't shit < 1294795465 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00,already done < 1294795471 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: i know < 1294795473 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it toasts bread :-) < 1294795481 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: but until 5 people do it it's still esoteric < 1294795508 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: that's no special feat. any computer with a pentium 4 can toast bread < 1294795519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: macports is bad < 1294795525 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how bad < 1294795527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :homebrew is slightly better but run by seeming idiots and with a lack of packages < 1294795529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: bad bad < 1294795534 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it as bad as YaST? < 1294795536 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :saying it as someone who used it for like two years < 1294795543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um well rpm anything i can't really comment on. < 1294795554 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yast is superbad < 1294795570 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rpm is bad - not as bad as some others < 1294795581 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but meh < 1294795586 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.embeddedarm.com/software/arm-netbsd-toaster.php < 1294795592 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's lame though < 1294795604 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you gotta find a toaster that is produced in mass < 1294795616 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that without modifications (large ones) can accept a kernel OS < 1294795632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think what i'm going to do is write a bunch of programs that convert $stupid_language_specific_package_manager packages into debian packages < 1294795642 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dunno, aren't there microcontrollers in some toasters? < 1294795652 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I can do "sudo apt-cabal install some-hackage-package" < 1294795659 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it installs it as haskell-cabal-some-hackage-package < 1294795671 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ya, this whole package thing is pissing me off < 1294795689 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: i think it's because, in these little isolated bubbles, they're convinced that they can do better than everyone else < 1294795703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: it sorta started with CPAN, which wasn't _too_ horrible since it wasn't identical to apt — ok it was 500000x worse < 1294795705 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people should finally agree on the One True Package Distribution System: wget from cdrom.com < 1294795708 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you couldn't tell it was trying to be apt < 1294795713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then like < 1294795716 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :python's abomination < 1294795717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ruby gemshit < 1294795719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :came along < 1294795735 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and php's PEAR < 1294795735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then it just so happened that it was easy to write a program that automatically installed hackage packages... < 1294795737 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD < 1294795737 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...and now we have cabal! < 1294795740 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i love how shit pear is < 1294795748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think anyone uses pear < 1294795753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :php devs don't really understand the concept of a library package < 1294795755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i sure didn't < 1294795756 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea they don't < 1294795759 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pear fucking sucks < 1294795766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pear always confused me, like, < 1294795770 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there were all these functions < 1294795771 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but why so many < 1294795773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why these classes < 1294795775 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are classes for < 1294795781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and how come i can't use these functions it just gives me an error < 1294795782 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you ever used this php based make "replacement" < 1294795782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do i get them < 1294795788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1294795790 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like replacing broken bones with frozen doodies < 1294795797 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea < 1294795801 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's called phing < 1294795802 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1294795807 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it sucks so bad < 1294795813 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make is so bad, but if there's one thing worse than make, it's make replacements < 1294795824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol, phing is based on ant < 1294795827 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :always a good design decision < 1294795833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Simple XML buildfiles" < 1294795835 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ant...... < 1294795836 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but of course < 1294795837 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :horid < 1294795837 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if there's one thing worse than ant, it's ant replacements < 1294795838 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just < 1294795840 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :horid < 1294795843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*horrid < 1294795850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ant is great, they decided to make a build system < 1294795853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so they reimplemented shell scripts < 1294795855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except without any features < 1294795858 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294795865 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't even have dependency handling, or the ability to avoid rebuilding everything < 1294795872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could rewrite any ant file as a 10x shorter *dos batch file* < 1294795874 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it does < 1294795879 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have depends in ant < 1294795883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yeah. but it doesn't work properly < 1294795887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and everyone just has one compile target < 1294795889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which makes one call to java < 1294795890 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it does partial rebuilds < 1294795893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which does all the work < 1294795894 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea < 1294795914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wanna know the solution to that? < 1294795916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't use java software < 1294795925 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, ant is still the suckiest build system I've seen < 1294795929 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :including autohell < 1294795948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: i'm starting to come to a glowing appreciation of autohell after using scons < 1294795966 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Life's Been a Blast" < 1294795967 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :scorns? < 1294795971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with scons it's like they made a build system, but then heard about this "declarative" stuff < 1294795975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then hacked up something in five minutes < 1294795977 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Appropriate title for a book about a victim of a bombing? < 1294795978 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and decided to release it lik ethat < 1294795980 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*like that < 1294795981 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: YES. < 1294795991 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: :D < 1294796000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :best possible title < 1294796012 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I've never used scons < 1294796017 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i want a programming language that can be localized < 1294796019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: you're lucky < 1294796022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :white whine time: < 1294796027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how come i'm only getting 800 KiB/s < 1294796027 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: let's port python to en_GB < 1294796029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :over wifi < 1294796031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on my expensive computer < 1294796034 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, there exist such languages/libraries < 1294796036 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to download an automatic software installer < 1294796042 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that will let me typeset my useless programs < 1294796043 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :prettily < 1294796044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as PDFs < 1294796046 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for no higher gain < 1294796048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHYYYY < 1294796060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: better, let's write an stdlib that uses en-GB spellings < 1294796065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh it's horrible because < 1294796068 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294796072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have to name my own functions with "o" and "ize" < 1294796072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because < 1294796074 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.emilylyons.com/webs/emily/ < 1294796076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise they're inconsistent with api functions < 1294796079 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i keep typoing it < 1294796080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1294796083 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"o"? < 1294796083 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe instead of case-insensitive languages < 1294796084 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we should have < 1294796086 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh armor etc < 1294796087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: instead of ou < 1294796090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we should have < 1294796091 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1294796094 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dialect-insensitive languages < 1294796097 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ou and o are exactly the same < 1294796098 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ize and ise too < 1294796103 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BEST IDEA GUYS BEST IDEA < 1294796114 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it wuz my ideah < 1294796119 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :get ur own ideah durrr < 1294796122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, yours involved manual translation < 1294796124 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION smashes rocks together < 1294796129 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine would also remove 'eh' from every variable name for the canucks < 1294796142 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i said let's port, i never said manually < 1294796160 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when i say let's execute this program, i'm not manually moving electrons across semiconductor gaps < 1294796174 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you aren't? < 1294796175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :poseur < 1294796213 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1294796216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh man i should so be sleeping guess what i'm not doing THAT'S RIGHT sleeping < 1294796219 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are (hence "we") < 1294796225 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are my evil henchman!! < 1294796240 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: let's replace brains with computers < 1294796246 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is the working plan < 1294796251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ITT: cheater00 discovers transhumanism < 1294796253 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1. find out how brains work < 1294796263 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2. < 1294796270 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(wait did you call me a cross-dresser) < 1294796274 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294796283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a cross...THOUGHT MEDIUM < 1294796283 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ok good just checking) < 1294796285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...dresser < 1294796299 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2. find out how brains work even more < 1294796306 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3. find out how to replace parts of it < 1294796310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this trackpad is really nice < 1294796313 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4. experiment on tissue samples < 1294796318 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :5. figure out a unit testing suite < 1294796321 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :6. write unit tests < 1294796338 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: http://www.dansdata.com/gz092.htm < 1294796355 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :7. execute unit tests and keep fixing stuff < 1294796365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dan's data is my favrite < 1294796420 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well there's this teleportation death paradigm < 1294796430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: see http://www.dansdata.com/gz092.htm < 1294796430 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, the moment you are teleported away, you die < 1294796431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :read before commenting < 1294796436 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that paradigm is bullshit < 1294796438 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but see http://www.dansdata.com/gz092.htm < 1294796444 0 :BMG!~behold@d83-183-183-70.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1294796445 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that will put anyone's fears to rest < 1294796449 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well what i'm saying is, there's a "fix" to that < 1294796453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except it won't because they'll just find another excuse ofc < 1294796458 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: um yes and it's in http://www.dansdata.com/gz092.htm for instance :) < 1294796458 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can replace brain neuron by neuron < 1294796462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: yes that's exactly what he says < 1294796468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stfu and read it, dan's data must always be read < 1294796469 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well he's read my mind then < 1294796473 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294796478 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or more like you had the obvious idea < 1294796488 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would read immediately except i need to spend a penny < 1294796489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's total bullshit that teleportation is death though < 1294796494 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: eh? < 1294796513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Eclipse Orion Project Announced - Browser Based Eclipse" < 1294796522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Eclipse project, always advancing frontiers in IDE slowness. < 1294796527 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you've never been to a public toilet have you? < 1294796544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"We're afraid the current Java/SWT-based system just outgrew us," a spokesperson for the Eclipse Foundation said. < 1294796558 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTF < 1294796560 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's amazing < 1294796562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"With a Java backend, and a JavaScript frontend, we're hoping we can achieve slowdowns of some 2-4x." < 1294796566 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://dev.eclipse.org/blogs/mike/2011/01/11/introducing-orion/ < 1294796570 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, it might make eclipse less slow, because chrome < 1294796571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all quotes absolutely real < 1294796573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AND NO FABRICATED < 1294796577 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: who cares, it's still eclipse < 1294796584 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea fuck ide's < 1294796591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck putting everything into the browser < 1294796593 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i wanted an ide i'd just use bash < 1294796595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hate my browser < 1294796598 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so do i < 1294796601 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fucking firefox < 1294796605 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i fucking hate it so much < 1294796617 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dunno whether you're being sarcastic or not but yeah pretty much < 1294796617 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chrome is even worse < 1294796621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have an extremely hostile relationship with my browser < 1294796635 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and opera is like nice, nice, and then at some point it goes from being ok to TOTALLY BOMBING OUT < 1294796640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :opera is terrible < 1294796645 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a crappy browser, its two features are < 1294796649 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(1) runs on windows 95 < 1294796650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(2) is fast < 1294796660 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has terrible support for standards and ... everything < 1294796661 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea that's what i mean ((2)) < 1294796664 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :way more than any other browsers < 1294796678 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually opera was usually on the forefront of standards < 1294796687 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: perhaps in the 90s < 1294796689 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1294796697 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except it's not fairyfox so it doesn't get css optimized for it < 1294796698 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: that perception is ever-present but illusory nowadays < 1294796717 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll brb < 1294796718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :opera fanbois are *very* ... touchy about it, and very promoting < 1294796725 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i desperately need to continue reading cryptonomicon < 1294796728 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a feeling opera have built up this standards reputation by hiring a bunch of standards people < 1294796732 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but really shit breaks in opera all the time < 1294796739 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you know what i mean < 1294796752 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um. do you mean that you need to continue reading cryptonomicon < 1294796766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CryptoNomiCon is a conference for crypto freaks who play nomic < 1294797210 0 :TLUL!~TLUL@wikia/The-last-username-left JOIN :#esoteric < 1294797372 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unlike CryptoNomIcon, which is a picture of a super-dog eating. < 1294797413 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Gregor: I hate you. < 1294797427 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Pretty much. < 1294797443 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Especially since it's Kryptwhy do I know this. < 1294797463 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lawl, I legitimately didn't know it was spelled that way :P < 1294797472 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But did know it was "Crypto" < 1294797504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CryPtonoMicon is obviously a guy called Ptono Micon, who's crying. < 1294797524 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's Ghanan. < 1294797554 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :installin' mactex... then bed < 1294797669 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION likes the idea of "social coding" < 1294797706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds like the worst of ideas < 1294797730 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I think it's GitHub's tagline < 1294797760 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lame < 1294797764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lhs2tex doesn't work with memoir < 1294797765 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :! Class memoir Error: Font command \tt is not supported. < 1294797766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TODO: fix < 1294797782 0 :cal153!~cal@c-24-4-207-72.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294798094 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dammit < 1294798101 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Am I hallucinating that tagline? < 1294798176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think so < 1294798182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's on github.com's front page < 1294798187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh i'll fix all this lhs2tex stuff tomorrow < 1294798197 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm staring at it right now, and don't see it < 1294798203 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see the word social anywhere < 1294798238 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :logo. < 1294798240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when logged in < 1294798240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-> < 1294798242 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294798262 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh duh < 1294798285 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I'm not logged on < 1294798289 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But how did I miss that? < 1294798921 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294799013 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1294799552 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294799674 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sony suing Geohotz and Team fail0verflow in US courts. < 1294799676 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294799690 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know anything about process colors and spot colors? < 1294799695 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :US courts have no jurisdiction over anyone but Geohotz; wonder how that's going to work. < 1294799698 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :pikhq < 1294799726 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, I wonder how they're even going to serve papers. < 1294799804 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, they also have jurisdiction over bushing; he's in CA. < 1294799875 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: Say: a) did you have any involvement in fail0verflow that you are willing to admit to b) are you in the US? < 1294799920 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they don't know fail0verflow membership and it's worth not divulging it at this point < 1294799963 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: There's a reason I specified "that you are willing to admit to". < 1294799997 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As there are quite a few jurisdictions where admitting to that is probably a bad idea. < 1294800054 0 :totem!~brasero@unaffiliated/totem JOIN :#esoteric < 1294800087 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294800133 0 :totem!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what channel here? < 1294800144 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :totem: Esoteric computer programming. < 1294800156 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But we discuss a lot of other things too) < 1294800225 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A programming language is [in loose terms] a language that computers can understand. An esoteric programming language is a language that's not designed for practical utility, but for other reasons, such as being painful to use, or interesting in some theoretical sense, etc. < 1294800233 0 :totem!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, what about sex and malware? < 1294800244 0 :totem!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry < 1294800248 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :totem, this channel is off-topic 99% of the time < 1294800261 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :totem: Do you have questions about sex and malware? Maybe someone can answer them, I don't know. < 1294800315 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sexual jokes probably occur more frequently than discussion about malware < 1294800319 0 :totem!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, i'm reading the link of topic < 1294800384 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :totem: Yes the wiki has a lot of things about esoteric programming languages. Also the logs has previous discussions in this channel (you are not required to follow the logs, but you can if you want to). < 1294800422 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1294800483 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Ahahahah*. < 1294800515 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SCEA is moving to put an immediate halt to the distribution of these "circumvention devices". < 1294800520 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, are you Wanda? < 1294800530 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wanda Firebaugh < 1294800538 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone's about to taste the wrath of the Streisand effect. < 1294800540 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: No. < 1294800542 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: What circumvention devices, to be specific? And what is SCEA? < 1294800553 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Sony Computer Entertainment of America. < 1294800569 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did a Wanda Firebaugh laugh as my FB status when I finally got those assignments done < 1294800581 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: And the circumvention devices are... Not very well specified. < 1294800588 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um... I think I may have just spoiled something < 1294800592 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Presumably the private keys that Sony handed to everybody. < 1294800640 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you have the private key can you adjust the boot BIOS? < 1294800657 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can *replace* it. < 1294800663 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the circumvention "device" is the instructions and software < 1294800696 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: The instructions are well-known details about ECDSA, and the software is an ECDSA signer. < 1294800747 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everyone should replace it with one that does not allow the update service to change the boot BIOS system and instead switches to a secondary level BIOS which is the one which will be updated by Sony. < 1294800764 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And arguably the private keys are actually being distributed *by Sony*. < 1294800816 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: yes, but the legalese doesn't reveal that < 1294800833 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they need to put it in terms that make it sound dangerous and like it can be stopped < 1294800836 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And what Sony should do is, make a private key for each individual unit which is written somewhere on the unit. If they do that, whoever in Sony that distributed the universal private key will stop, because that will adjust the Conspiracy level to make them want to stop. < 1294800857 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since the whole point of that is to take geohot's (and the rest of f0f's, ideally) stuff to "stop distribution" < 1294800860 0 :TLUL!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1294800866 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: There's also the console private key; the hard drive is encrypted with it. < 1294800903 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't the HD encryption useless or something? < 1294800949 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: If you get around the signing, *all* the encryption is useless. < 1294800965 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You ask the decryption SPU to decrypt stuff for you *and it does*. < 1294800990 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As soon as you are executing code on the PS3, you're done. < 1294800998 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry. Code from GameOS. < 1294801014 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it wasn't this, then even a simple buffer overflow in a game would really fuck shit up. < 1294801027 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: They should write the console private key on the case, restore the 4 USB ports (instead of having only 2 USB ports), and make it so the console private key can be used anywhere that the universal one can be used and vice versa. And then whichever employee published it, might decide to stop distributing the universal key. < 1294801046 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No employee published it < 1294801050 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I don't think you understand how the private key got leaked. < 1294801053 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was a function of the way they were signing stuff < 1294801060 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You are right I do not understand. < 1294801064 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They signed stuff such that if you got two signed items, you could learn the key < 1294801088 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: ECDSA requires a random number to be used in generating signatures. If you don't do this, then it's trivial to obtain the key used. < 1294801103 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: And Sony used a constant instead of a random number. < 1294801122 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Someone made it like that deliberately because they wanted users to have the key, but without telling the other people who work in Sony. < 1294801126 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So. If you have two signed things from Sony, you can extract the key. < 1294801147 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you go about determining that it was a constant? Do the math as though it was, do it for several signed items, and see if the resulting key is consistent? < 1294801176 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: The first half of the signature will be constant, as that part is a function of the key, the key length, and the random number. < 1294801185 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1294801265 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That part is also believed to be nearly impossible to reverse. However, the remaining half is some basic modular arithmetic done on the key, the random number, and the hash of the message. < 1294801282 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did one of the employees do that deliberately? < 1294801288 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: We do not know. < 1294801301 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All we know is that *each and every PS3 executable* is signed like this. < 1294801308 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If not, they could correct it on PlayStation 4. < 1294801370 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But if so, then my scheme might correct it. < 1294801396 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So in addition to changing it to use random numbers instead of constants, make guesses as to whether or not it is deliberate. < 1294801446 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only *possible* scheme for Sony to fix this is to add a new layer of signing to new PS3 executables, add a whitelist for all "legitimate" old PS3 executables, and ship this out in a new firmware update. < 1294801462 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And *all* this does is make it so you need to use a modchip instead of a pure software hack. < 1294801486 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: So, everyone should upgrade the BIOS to their own version before Sony can do that. < 1294801500 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: No need. < 1294801511 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When you say executable, what level are you speaking at? The video I watched said that they didn't have the keys for signing games < 1294801527 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: fail0verflow never bothered to *get* the keys for signing games. < 1294801541 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: However, *each and every level* in the PS3 chain of trust is vulnerable. < 1294801583 0 :TLUL!~TLUL@wikia/The-last-username-left JOIN :#esoteric < 1294802296 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol @ sony < 1294802301 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol @ drm < 1294802568 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"A 2009 study published in Boston Review found that nearly 25 percent of non-Jewish Americans blamed Jews for the financial crisis of 2008–2009, with a higher percentage among Democrats than Republicans." < 1294802571 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lolwut? < 1294802804 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i also blame jews. specific jews. along with specific people of other creeds... < 1294803744 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294804021 0 :TLUL!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: *disappears in a puff of orange smoke* < 1294804028 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sony is also claiming that all of this stuff was done for the sole purpose of "enabling piracy". < 1294804075 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn right < 1294804078 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ARR MATEYS < 1294804082 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SHIVER ME PS3S < 1294804114 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And fail0verflow is doing it for the sole purpose of enabling an advertised feature of the hardware. < 1294804289 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They are also filing claims under various laws aimed at preventing cracking into other people's computers. < 1294804298 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is... Sony claiming *ownership* of all PS3s? < 1294804352 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And finally, they claim that by restraining this action, they can stop piracy on the PS3. < 1294804352 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This reminds me of a webcomic I used to follow < 1294804354 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Streisand! < 1294804382 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Ohhhh holy fuck. < 1294804397 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think Streisand applies when not doing anything would not prevent everyone from knowing about it, which they do anyway < 1294804426 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They are also seeking the impoundment of "any and all media in which circumvention devices are stored within the possession, custody, or control of Defendants". < 1294804453 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good thing most of Team fail0verflow is completely outside of jurisdiction. < 1294804455 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::O < 1294804510 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION finishes reading the request for temporary restraining order and impoundment. < 1294804511 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can they be extradited? < 1294804525 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Civil case. < 1294804529 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not only no but fuck no. < 1294804538 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1294804565 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, it's Sony v. George Hotz, Cantero, Sven Peter, and Does 1 through 100. < 1294804568 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Comical. < 1294804586 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o.O at Does 1 through 100 < 1294804596 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is not very rare, though. < 1294804598 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lots of anonymice < 1294804631 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most of team fail0verflow does go by aliases, and it's likely many of them are unknown. < 1294804660 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I shouldn't have Sgeo so closely associated with my RL name < 1294804700 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The request was granted. < 1294804709 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Against Geohotz. < 1294804725 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, no. < 1294804726 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No it wasn't. < 1294804773 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Misinterpreted the form for the *suggested* order as being granted; all that there is is a form that a judge could fill out. < 1294804786 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyways. Finished reading relevant legal documents. < 1294804820 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So far, I see two major fail from Sony's lawyers. One, many of the people they are suing are out of jurisdiction. Two, they are suing under claims of the DMCA. < 1294804857 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With claims that they did this with the *sole purpose* of enabling illegal copying. < 1294804916 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which they then note in the filing that all defendants have claimed otherwise. < 1294804922 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They may have just committed perjury. < 1294804989 0 :totem!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1294805104 0 :totem!~brasero@unaffiliated/totem JOIN :#esoteric < 1294805115 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They are also claiming that Geohot committed extortion. < 1294805142 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"if you want your next console to be secure, get in touch with me." ← this, namely. < 1294805167 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahaha < 1294805196 0 :mycroftiv!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1294805243 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION decides he wants to make a language in which you can write compilers as easily as interpreters < 1294805264 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1294805276 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1294805494 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*cough* < 1294805499 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erk: C0 CE FE 84 C2 27 F7 5B D0 7A 7E B8 46 50 9F 93 B2 38 E7 70 DA CB 9F F4 A3 88 F8 12 48 2B E2 1B < 1294805503 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :riv: 47 EE 74 54 E4 77 4C C9 B8 96 0C 7B 59 F4 C1 4D < 1294805508 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pub: C2 D4 AA F3 19 35 50 19 AF 99 D4 4E 2B 58 CA 29 25 2C 89 12 3D 11 D6 21 8F 40 B1 38 CA B2 9B 71 01 F3 AE B7 2A 97 50 19 < 1294805513 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :R: 80 6E 07 8F A1 52 97 90 CE 1A AE 02 BA DD 6F AA A6 AF 74 17 < 1294805518 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :n: E1 3A 7E BC 3A CC EB 1C B5 6C C8 60 FC AB DB 6A 04 8C 55 E1 < 1294805522 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :K: BA 90 55 91 68 61 B9 77 ED CB ED 92 00 50 92 F6 6C 7A 3D 8D < 1294805523 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a lot of keys < 1294805527 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Da: C5 B2 BF A1 A4 13 DD 16 F2 6D 31 C0 F2 ED 47 20 DC FB 06 70 < 1294805529 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*cough* < 1294805538 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What a very long and hex-y coughing fit. < 1294805569 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those hex numbers are illegal aren't they? < 1294805576 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION arrests pikhq < 1294805625 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: You are violating patents thousands of times a day! < 1294805657 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is [not actually] tempted to mention pikhq's name < 1294805662 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note: I'm not an asshole < 1294805715 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think < 1294805717 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION presumes that quintopia *is* a form of Terran life, and thus violates various gene patents constantly < 1294805739 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and yes, it *is* illegal to be alive in the US currently.) < 1294805772 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: i have diplomatic immunity < 1294805792 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Oh, you're a designated representative of a foreign state? < 1294805809 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In what capacity, might I ask? < 1294805812 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. i'm handling negotiations with the arcturans at the moment < 1294805837 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is my language idea feasible? I mean, if Trusting Trust is feasible, than surely my language is < 1294805853 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1294805892 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I'm wondering if the idea is too similar to these VM things < 1294805989 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294805991 0 :mycroftiv!~ircguy@h69-128-47-242.mdsnwi.dedicated.static.tds.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294806082 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1294806138 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better idea: It should make it decently easy to write your own self-hosting language < 1294806163 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not sure how that would work, exactly < 1294806250 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o.O < 1294806273 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sweden suspended mens rea. For men. Pertaining to rape charges. < 1294806289 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's... Awful. < 1294806347 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lolwat? < 1294806363 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(mens rea is the legal concept that someone cannot be charged with a crime unless that person had the actual intent to commit said crime.) < 1294806382 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, how would you rape someone without intending to rape someone? < 1294806427 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: You could be completely unaware that the other party was not in a state to give consent. < 1294806587 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Too much damn politics here < 1294806637 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Damned Norwegian, not having fucking crazy people around. < 1294806723 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ideally, the source for the compiler for my new language should not mention x86 at all. < 1294806728 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nothing platform-specific < 1294806741 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It should all be Trusting-Trust-ed in < 1294806846 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although it would make porting it to new platforms a royal bitch < 1294806996 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294807115 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294807223 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294807231 0 :totem!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294807237 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What DPI does WotC use for cards? I am told they are 133 DPI for process colors and 1200 DPI for text, but whoever told me has never actually seen how they make the cards and was never in WotC ever < 1294807451 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :More than 1DPI < 1294807596 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Yes........ < 1294807855 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But do I have to make TeXnicard to print two files, one for process colors and one for text? < 1294807892 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has no ida < 1294808040 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ida ?? < 1294808124 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't have any girls named Ida < 1294808128 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you have literate literate programming? < 1294808147 0 :calamari!~calamari@ip70-162-184-205.ph.ph.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294808155 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1294808168 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: Literate literate programming? You probably could, I guess.... but why? Because it is esoteric programming? < 1294808182 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, i mean like literate literate C < 1294808211 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: What is literate literate C? < 1294808216 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wouldn't that be a subset of literate literate programming? < 1294808219 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's literate C, but literate. < 1294808233 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: ?? < 1294808241 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As opposed to a barely-legible currently-existing literate C? < 1294808242 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: ???????????????????????????????? < 1294808250 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: bingo! < 1294808260 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: ???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? < 1294808272 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: ?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? < 1294808277 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It isn't barely-legible unless you use the wrong printer? < 1294808279 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Begun, the question mark wars have? < 1294808297 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, by barely-legible I meant hard for humans to understand < 1294808313 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It is not hard to understand if you understand programming. < 1294808326 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00 apparently disagrees < 1294808330 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ow < 1294808349 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :proving that ((-,a)->(a->b)) is hard < 1294808355 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(where -, is the not sign) < 1294808385 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it? < 1294808418 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you misunderstand then please write more clearly. And then the program/book can be understood. < 1294808425 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1294808431 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not long, I know this < 1294808442 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it is excruciating to attempt to work out < 1294808530 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: LOGIC TABLES???????? < 1294808553 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :logic tables is a nice way to prove something that only has two variables < 1294808556 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: Logic tables will show you too, but probably that is not what he meant. < 1294808570 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :will "show me too"? < 1294808574 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does that mean? < 1294808584 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :logic tables will knock on my door and give me a black eye? < 1294808590 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294808604 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE LOGIC TABLES WILL GET THEIR VENGEANCE, MWAHAHA < 1294808611 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hurr durrr < 1294808613 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1294808646 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, when you logread this, your bot tells me to shut up about sex < 1294808715 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alluded < 1294808719 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alluded-to < 1294808723 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alluded to < 1294808730 0 :rodgort!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294808876 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: no, this involves syntactically deriving it from a set of axioms < 1294808880 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tables are a crutch < 1294808948 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are there statements in logic that are true but cannot be proven from axioms? < 1294808960 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is logic expressive enough to express arithmatic? < 1294808975 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's more than one logic < 1294808992 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294809034 0 :rodgort!~rodgort@li125-242.members.linode.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294809107 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Have you seen Godel,Escher,Bach? It is a book maybe it can answer those two of your questions. < 1294809115 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heard of it < 1294809123 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294809138 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: there are necessarily < 1294809152 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you can prove anything, your logic is inconsistent < 1294809197 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, I thought that was only in systems expressive enough to contain arithmatic? < 1294809206 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294809216 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, also, *any true thing < 1294809255 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: it's a bit more complex that that and requires some funkiness < 1294809568 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" j-invariant: help me design my language :P" <<< HEY! you should be doing drudge work on the CLUE < 1294809631 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-224-158.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294809715 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is no one thing you can pinpoint and say "if you can express this, GIT applies, and otherwise it does not." it's a collection of things you need to have to make the proof go through. < 1294809973 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" I just dug this small cave into a hill and trapped the cows in there" <<< YOU ARE A MONSTER < 1294810323 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294810384 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294810423 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" 00:39:12 has anyone done quicksort in brainfuck?" " how embarrassing" <<< not really, i just felt like it'd be a waste of time doing it twice < 1294810666 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294810760 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it turned out a bit too hard for by tiny brain, i'm not even sure i completely finished my brainfuck in brainfuck back then < 1294811492 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o < 1294811492 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o < 1294811493 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o < 1294811493 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o < 1294811586 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" Are there statements in logic that are true but cannot be proven from axioms?" <<< what if the statement that there are statements in logic that are true but cannot be proven from axioms is true but cannot be proven from axioms? < 1294811589 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WE'D NEVER KNOW! < 1294811702 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The sandwich consists of a single warmed, hollowed-out loaf of bread filled with one jar of creamy peanut butter, one jar of grape jelly, and a pound of bacon." Wikipedia on the Fool's Gold Loaf. < 1294811705 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"... <<< not really, i just felt like it'd be a waste of time doing it twice" <<< yes, waste of the world's time < 1294811714 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is produced by a *five star restaurant* in Denver. < 1294811733 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No gold leaf? < 1294811749 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds pretty awesome < 1294811757 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brilliant < 1294811759 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i must go there < 1294811768 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know what grape jelly is but i suppose it is... grape jelly < 1294811780 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: grape with all the fruit taken out < 1294811838 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: You may know it as "jam" or "fruit preserves"; the name for that method of food preservation is kinda regional in English. < 1294811984 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Fool's Gold Loaf originally cost $50; it now costs something closer to $100, and is served with a bottle of Dom Pérignon. < 1294811997 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite an interesting combination of low and high class there. < 1294812062 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can only assume dom perignon is low class, because a pound of bacon is the highest you can get! < 1294812188 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dom Pérignon is a somewhat expensive vintage champagne. < 1294812344 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i have to be really honest, i had a hunch it was < 1294812360 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294812423 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294812515 0 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1294813585 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This has probably been said before, but here it is again. < 1294814538 0 :kwertii!~kwertii@ResNet-32-197.resnet.ucsb.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1294814543 0 :pingveno!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294814572 0 :pingveno!~pingveno@c-98-246-133-8.hsd1.or.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294815655 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294815659 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1294815922 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294816178 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-9-92.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294816450 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294816706 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294816885 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294817047 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294817180 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: bye < 1294817259 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: ~a => (a => b) <=> a => (~a => b) <=> ~( a ^ ~(~a => b)) <=> ~(a ^ ~a ^ ~b) < 1294817283 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously ~0 <=> 1. < 1294817320 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, you need to prove the negation of implication. < 1294817327 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you should have that by then. < 1294817388 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it depends on what definition of => you use. < 1294817395 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's usually a truth table. < 1294817848 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1294818390 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://www.dansdata.com/gz084.htm that guy has no idea how rechargable batteries work. < 1294818422 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: also he has no idea how gradual consciousness upload should work. the method he presents is inferior to mine. < 1294819199 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1294819200 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1294819570 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1294819967 0 :S0uRce!~S0uRce@mail.uni.perm.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1294820012 0 :S0uRce!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1294821208 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1294821363 0 :[SOLEIL]!~SOLEIL]@48.Red-88-2-217.staticIP.rima-tde.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1294821423 0 :[SOLEIL]!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294821587 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :INGLIP HAS BEEN SUMMONED < 1294821777 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1294822128 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : proving that ((-,a)->(a->b)) is hard < 1294822142 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dependent on your logic that might _be_ an axiom. < 1294822150 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*your logic formalism < 1294822170 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294822269 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've seen (-,a) being considered an abbreviation for a->False, in which case the axiom would probably be False->b < 1294822385 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : INGLIP HAS BEEN SUMMONED < 1294822388 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WE KNOW < 1294825355 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom_H@server.nowhere-else.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1294825355 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1294825355 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom_H@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294825411 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION ponders the WP article on Church encodings. < 1294825435 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It actually contradicts their lambda calculus article on the list encoding. < 1294825506 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Something Must Be Done. < 1294825569 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, that article is too stupid to salvage. < 1294825941 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Phantom_Hoover < 1294831450 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1294831456 0 :hiato!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1294832180 0 :cheater-!~cheater@e181132018.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294832309 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294833561 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1294835411 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294837516 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice < 1294837516 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :old landlady has accused me of stealing a soap holder. < 1294837516 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps you just have the face of a soap-holder stealer. < 1294837524 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i totally need to rip her off for this 5 euro soap holder < 1294839784 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Reboot < 1294840094 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater-: that sequence you posted does not work from the axioms we have < 1294840111 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it requires application of semantic meaning < 1294840113 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: what have you used instead? < 1294840121 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater-: I haven't worked it out yet < 1294840132 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what axioms and theorems do you have so far? < 1294840475 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294840524 0 :cheater-!~cheater@g230231193.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294840548 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propositional_logic#Example_1._Simple_axiom_system < 1294840577 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :minus the definitions of V and /\ < 1294840655 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric < 1294840991 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1294841415 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: define the things defined in the last axiom, and then prove their properties. < 1294841485 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with this set of axioms you don't even need to prove what the negation of implication is, since you've got it as a definition. < 1294841493 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very simple. < 1294841499 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:46:09 Actually, that article is too stupid to salvage. < 1294841499 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:52:21 --- quit: Phantom_Hoover (Quit: Phantom_Hoover) < 1294841533 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294841537 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alternatively, take my argument above and replace all instances of ^ (x, y) with the right formula based on => (a, b). < 1294841569 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know how => works, so there should be no problem. < 1294841618 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're complaining about having <=>, well, then just prove each direction of the equivalence by hand. < 1294841652 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's really about taking a high-level argument and compiling it down to a low-level axiom system < 1294841658 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should cost 2 cents to post a youtube comment < 1294841668 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should. < 1294841782 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If only because then everyone would end their comments with "just my 2 cents but..." < 1294841793 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294842285 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294842358 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1294842383 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294842384 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294842532 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater-: ... < 1294842536 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not that easy < 1294842549 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no, <=> is not acceptable directly from the axioms < 1294842555 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the biconditional isn't even a symbol < 1294842559 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and we don't have /\ < 1294842563 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or \/ < 1294842943 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1294843263 0 :cheater00!~cheater@g224203121.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294843365 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1294843406 0 :cheater99!~cheater@g231051041.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294843416 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294843512 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294844176 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294844440 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1294844535 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1294844778 0 :cheater00!~cheater@e181134144.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294844879 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294845302 0 :cheater99!~cheater@g231050214.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1294845383 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1294846307 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1294846405 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a programming paradigm which could be described as "preposterous programming"? < 1294846433 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :objects make false statements about other objects < 1294846450 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then those other objects have to unwind all that fuckedupness < 1294846529 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A.doesObjectImplement(B, 'Interface1') |-> True // B does not really implement Interface 1. < 1294846552 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well there is _now_ < 1294846578 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :B.doesObjectHave(A, 'foo') |-> False // Although A.foo == 24 < 1294846637 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :object C trusts A more than it trusts B < 1294846642 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C asks A stuff about B < 1294846652 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A's strategy is for B to not be used and for D to be used instead < 1294846692 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is because directly asked B would always say "i can do it!" < 1294846708 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :therefore C asks A which is judgemental < 1294846734 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in this case A is B's moral judge < 1294846783 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course, A will also be judgemental of B if it doesn't even have a pointer to B < 1294846793 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because A is preposterous, just like B is < 1294846815 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is what is known as "terribly maintained code". < 1294846816 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alternatively, A could defer judgement to E, which might or might not be telling the truth < 1294846864 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then, A could be doing heavy interpretation of E's answer, too < 1294846874 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can i add that to the wiki? < 1294846885 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ^ < 1294846943 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably < 1294847058 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This got me an interesting idea: Imagine a 2D area with each cell containing an instruction. Place a variable number of 8-sided cubes on the area, each cube has instructions on all sides. < 1294847066 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i love the "ideas" page < 1294847558 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294847757 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294848018 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://multimedia.worth1000.com/entries/619892/sagrada-familia-barcelona < 1294848023 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Words fail me. < 1294848179 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1294848259 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1294848321 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how fun, i just hacked about 500 stone at the server, then hopped, and now everything's back the way it was < 1294848401 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahahahah < 1294848475 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1294848540 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how the hell is that even possible < 1294848551 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does ineiros randomly reset the server or something < 1294848685 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what.... < 1294848703 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"End of stream error" < 1294848708 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and now it refuses my connection < 1294848710 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you
 on wiki
< 1294848717 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and anyway that resetting thing happened again
< 1294848720 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the fuck is going on
< 1294848728 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! FOCUS
< 1294848730 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you 
 on wiki
< 1294848734 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know and i don't care
< 1294848748 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i suppose no minecraft today
< 1294848789 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: find any page about algorithms on wp and edit it to see what they put around the pseudocode
< 1294848789 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ow
< 1294848790 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::(
< 1294848792 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds
< 1294848800 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION gives oklopol a huggy-hug.
< 1294848838 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i see
< 1294848853 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuckfuckfuckfuckfuckfuckfuck
< 1294848857 0 :Wamanuz2!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294848857 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm.
< 1294848862 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros:!
< 1294848866 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ineiros: !
< 1294848926 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: can i get a refund on all that work i did? :D
< 1294848964 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I'll have 0€ transferred to your account as soon as possible. ;)
< 1294848970 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's something wrong there.
< 1294848972 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\o/
< 1294848972 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  |
< 1294848972 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : /<
< 1294848992 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :   o//
< 1294849020 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :myndzi y u no complete sideways guy?
< 1294849045 0 :Wamanuz3!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294849092 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, completely wrong where?
< 1294849141 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: did you fix it?
< 1294849142 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294849145 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wanna continue
< 1294849148 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD
< 1294849160 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, didn't expect this to happen so soon; should have considered it: As you know, I've been running frequent backups since the last incident.
< 1294849172 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1294849173 0 :Wamanuz4!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294849175 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, yes
< 1294849185 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I ran out of free inodes.
< 1294849191 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, the what
< 1294849192 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD
< 1294849199 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, what fs
< 1294849205 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I guess you need to fix it then
< 1294849210 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what kind of 1910's operating system are you running
< 1294849211 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Sorry about the lost work, I'll have the server back in no time.
< 1294849220 0 :Wamanuz2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1294849222 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ext3.
< 1294849227 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, I would suggest xfs since it won't run out of inodes ever
< 1294849238 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Minecraft makes a lot of files, you know.
< 1294849247 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have no quarrel with you even just destroying the whole world for fun, it's your server
< 1294849256 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so no problem
< 1294849264 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm
< 1294849266 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if you do fix it fast, yay, since otherwise i'll just go to sleep
< 1294849280 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah xfs isn't too great at many small files
< 1294849298 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, sleep? this early?
< 1294849314 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, I just had breakfast! (Okay that was a bit late, but still)
< 1294849314 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Server's back on.
< 1294849315 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well every day i go to sleep 2 hours earlier, until i loop
< 1294849324 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, roughly
< 1294849333 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :last night was later, but i'm catching up now
< 1294849334 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't even had breakfast yet
< 1294849340 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: wow cool thanks
< 1294849352 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, how does that work during non-holidays?
< 1294849363 0 :Wamanuz3!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1294849365 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, yes but you aren't in Europe
< 1294849405 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it's just been going on this week, and 8-16 has been time awake, but in theory i could just sleep whenever i want, since i don't have that much mandatory stuff at uni
< 1294849414 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: write a Preposterous Programming language
< 1294849417 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so?  the point is it is too early for sleep no matter where you are
< 1294849419 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just any third of every day
< 1294849424 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: __*NOW*___
< 1294849448 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay so there's only two commands, 0 and 1, and each is more preposterous than the last
< 1294849456 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294849459 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the draft i have now
< 1294849469 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok. please prove TC
< 1294849482 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you can obviously do brainfuck with that
< 1294849488 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apply the axiom of infinite improbability
< 1294849490 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and done
< 1294849494 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Preposterous_Programming
< 1294849499 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ineiros: can i get a refund on all that work i did? :D ← oooh, what're you doing?
< 1294849519 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ = 1010001010101110100100101110, - = 1010111100101000100110101001000010101, < = 101110100010101010101011, > = 0101000100010011010110, [ = 0101111, ] = 010110001010101110011001001001
< 1294849528 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LIES
< 1294849563 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection timed out
< 1294849568 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ you need some additional stuff if you want to nest []'s more than 7 deep, unless all your loops have an even amount of >'s
< 1294849632 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also you obviously need 01110 in the beginning of the program, if the bf program allocates cells too fast
< 1294849671 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also i shouldn't have done that because now i desperately want to find that language
< 1294849702 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1294849860 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay so that's why the server had gotten so slow
< 1294849886 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: i can actually redo my work in no time since time is now 2.5 times faster
< 1294849944 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahaha
< 1294850244 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, what are you doing?
< 1294850257 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :making a home
< 1294850415 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nesting
< 1294850438 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION watches oklopol gather tiny tiny branches, feathers, and weeds in his beak, one at a time.
< 1294850951 0 :Wamanuz5!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294851033 0 :Wamanuz4!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds
< 1294851310 0 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-19-45.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294851365 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone put a bot in haskell that man-in-the-middled folks
< 1294851387 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like ti would just randomly PM two people "hey!" and then start transporting messages between
< 1294851452 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1294851565 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: tell ops about it :P
< 1294851600 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1294851686 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the bot still there?
< 1294851757 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no
< 1294851783 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, down?
< 1294851799 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, down?
< 1294852151 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, I want one.
< 1294852156 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oein what
< 1294852156 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?
< 1294852569 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One of those bots.
< 1294853132 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://gcc.gnu.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=323
< 1294853139 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :search for "duplicate" for comedy
< 1294853309 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?
< 1294853490 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1294853907 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :sebbu
< 1294854501 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294854503 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :18:37:55  comex: Say: a) did you have any involvement in fail0verflow that you are willing to admit to b) are you in the US?
< 1294854506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: (a) I doubt (b) he is
< 1294854557 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: The thing is, he actually *is* involved in Wii and iPhone hacking...
< 1294854560 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294854565 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: well sure
< 1294854575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: but the fail0verflow thing was hardware-oriented, I think
< 1294854582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas his iphone exploit is sw-based, dunno about the wii one
< 1294854605 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :His major Wii exploit is a buffer overflow in Brawl.
< 1294854641 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://superuser.com/questions/231273/what-are-the-windows-a-and-b-drives-used-for oh my god i'm 15 how young are you
< 1294854644 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the fail0verflow exploit is heavily software-based.
< 1294854653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does your mother know you are on the internet kid
< 1294854667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a buffer overflow in C++ code, how did comex find that, must be a genius
< 1294854696 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only thing they did to the hardware was wire a flasher to the flash where bits of the firmware are stored.
< 1294854762 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now to boot ubuntu
< 1294854829 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294854837 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol is cool: I never spent my summer trying to solve a problem like that
< 1294854855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol is cool incarnate
< 1294854893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :18:57:07  pikhq: They should write the console private key on the case, restore the 4 USB ports (instead of having only 2 USB ports), and make it so the console private key can be used anywhere that the universal one can be used and vice versa. And then whichever employee published it, might decide to stop distributing the universal key.
< 1294854896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i what
< 1294854917 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeaaah, zzo38 was a bit confused about what the *main* exploit was.
< 1294854924 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I am confused
< 1294854926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :18:58:42  Sgeo: Someone made it like that deliberately because they wanted users to have the key, but without telling the other people who work in Sony.
< 1294854928 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(fail0verflow found several)
< 1294854928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Based on EVIDENCE
< 1294854937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have EVIDENCE for this but you can't see it!
< 1294854948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or maybe I'm just making shit up
< 1294854956 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and there's probably more: they use C and C++! BUFFER OVERFLOWS, AHOY!)
< 1294854977 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:22:48  "A 2009 study published in Boston Review found that nearly 25 percent of non-Jewish Americans blamed Jews for the financial crisis of 2008–2009, with a higher percentage among Democrats than Republicans."
< 1294854977 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:22:51  lolwut?
< 1294854982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Shut up, you filthy Jew.
< 1294855004 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"THE JEWS DID THIS"
< 1294855020 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:56:05  Oh, it's Sony v. George Hotz, Cantero, Sven Peter, and Does 1 through 100.
< 1294855027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doe, a deer, a hundred female deers
< 1294855035 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://static.funnyjunk.com/pictures/jews012.jpg
< 1294855052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :concur
< 1294855081 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, what letter did old windows systems assign to tape drives? :P
< 1294855081 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:14:17 * Sgeo is [not actually] tempted to mention pikhq's name
< 1294855090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who, josiah worcester's?
< 1294855100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: they ... didn't :P
< 1294855120 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Suppose, hypothetically, their lawyers googled for the keys
< 1294855153 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm thinking of studying a normalization proof of CoC
< 1294855170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:58:50  ow
< 1294855170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:59:09  proving that ((-,a)->(a->b)) is hard
< 1294855170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:59:15  (where -, is the not sign)
< 1294855171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:59:45  is it?
< 1294855173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:00:25  yes
< 1294855175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:00:31  it's not long, I know this
< 1294855177 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:00:42  but it is excruciating to attempt to work out
< 1294855179 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Well, they can have *all* of my savings!
< 1294855179 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol
< 1294855187 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hope you like your $20 profit!
< 1294855187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT DID YOU KNOW THAT PROVING TRIVIAL THINGS IN PROOF SYSTEMS IS HARD
< 1294855199 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so mean :P LOL
< 1294855201 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now let me get back to proving the principle of explosion
< 1294855224 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:12:18  Sgeo: there are necessarily
< 1294855224 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:12:32  if you can prove anything, your logic is inconsistent
< 1294855224 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh my god
< 1294855230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then Gödel!
< 1294855234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is like a trifecta of shut the fuck up
< 1294855250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:13:17  coppro, I thought that was only in systems expressive enough to contain arithmatic?
< 1294855252 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:14:15  Sgeo: it's a bit more complex that that and requires some funkiness
< 1294855258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD
< 1294855261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:19:28  " j-invariant: help me design my language :P" <<< HEY! you should be doing drudge work on the CLUE
< 1294855263 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: cled, man, cled
< 1294855298 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you interface cled with clue
< 1294855316 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i've been riding around in a sinclair a lot lately
< 1294855320 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it feels very cheap :p
< 1294855333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have a sinclair c5?
< 1294855337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why
< 1294855346 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: um cled is an editor for clue code, as i keep trying to tell you :P
< 1294855357 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's plasticky
< 1294855365 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the outer hull is made like a water bike :p
< 1294855371 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, we have one here
< 1294855389 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they had to relocate it to the area around my front door because of the ballet school taking place
< 1294855397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:46:30  elliott: http://www.dansdata.com/gz084.htm   that guy has no idea how rechargable batteries work.
< 1294855398 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :facepalm
< 1294855402 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh wtf is sgeo tlking about now
< 1294855404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*talking
< 1294855420 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah, he says charging up a battery for 5 secs should not show it as completely charged
< 1294855429 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :05:48:14  cheater-: that sequence you posted does not work from the axioms we have
< 1294855429 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :05:48:31  it requires application of semantic meaning
< 1294855430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what
< 1294855435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: i wasn't agreeing with you
< 1294855447 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah, i know
< 1294855457 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he doesn't know how the measurement is made and why it is going to be showing up as full
< 1294855462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, he does
< 1294855467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't change the fact that it is /wrong/
< 1294855470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from a human point of view
< 1294855477 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, he subscribes to some sort of conspiracy theory
< 1294855498 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :category theory
< 1294855502 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm?
< 1294855503 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he doesn't even remotely mention that it's wrong because, hey, it's a fucking battery with a non-linear charging process
< 1294855515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :06:29:09  and no, <=> is not acceptable directly from the axioms
< 1294855515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :06:29:15  the biconditional isn't even a symbol
< 1294855515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :06:29:19  and we don't have /\
< 1294855517 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :06:29:23  or \/
< 1294855519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH GOD YOU HAVE TO WRITE OUT THREE SIMPLE DEFINITIONS HOLY SHIT
< 1294855542 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: we have had to write out the definition of False once.
< 1294855682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :reboot tie
< 1294855683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :time
< 1294855686 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1294855834 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't know elliott's tie was computerized
< 1294856146 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Misread "elliott's tie was compromised"; didn't know they were hacking ties already.
< 1294856407 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1294856532 0 :hiato!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294856825 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: so you think elliott has ties to hacking?
< 1294856842 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he
< 1294856869 0 :drakhan!~drakhan@c34-243.icpnet.pl JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294856900 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :drakhan is obviously a Sony lawyer
< 1294856954 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294856961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://tuomov.iki.fi/ is back up — but without his blog.
< 1294856999 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, http://tuomov.bitcheese.net/b/ seems to be a partial archive.
< 1294857013 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what do you have against me saying the word sex?
< 1294857018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What?
< 1294857021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A filter must be malfunctioning.
< 1294857024 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-shutup- Shut up about sex!
< 1294857027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD
< 1294857029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did not put that in.
< 1294857042 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It decides what to yell at you for based on what you say + the regexp, so hmm.
< 1294857072 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It also hates fantasy
< 1294857077 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-shutup- Shut up about your fantasies!
< 1294857097 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fixed the first report. It'll come into action, uh, ... whenever I restart it which is rare.
< 1294857315 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :syp
< 1294857316 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sup
< 1294857359 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sup is me trying to get ubuntu booting
< 1294857369 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :youbunter
< 1294857519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1294857899 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Sony is claiming that the court has jurisdiction because github.com is in California.
< 1294858135 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sony is also claiming *ownership* of all PS3s.
< 1294858188 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Page 21, line 9. "SCEA possesses an ownership interest in the PS3 System."
< 1294858191 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, people who have bought a ps3 actually just have an expensive loan console?
< 1294858204 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :From the complaint.
< 1294858207 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Yes.
< 1294858223 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: They are claiming that this hack was *trespassing*.
< 1294858228 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seriously? :D that was a joke :P
< 1294858241 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i figured you actually meant something else
< 1294858244 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also.
< 1294858250 0 :cheater00!~cheater@e181053165.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294858263 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Defendants have appropriated SCEA's property at little or no cost to them."
< 1294858278 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1294858283 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what property
< 1294858299 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck lawyers
< 1294858315 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd have to see the TaCoS on PS3 purchases to believe that...
< 1294858336 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1294858350 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : i'd have to see the TaCoS on PS3 purchases to believe that... < what does that mean?
< 1294858362 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And they are also claiming that this hack consists of cracking into someone else's computer.
< 1294858376 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And that it's a violation of terms of service.
< 1294858379 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1294858387 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Said terms, you need not actually *agree* to.
< 1294858396 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the terms of service for PSN.
< 1294858425 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if there is some license in there that says "by turning this system on you agree that you are leasing SCEA's property for an indefinite period and will not modify etc. SCEA's property" then they can probably get away with that...
< 1294858470 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, down?
< 1294858485 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No
< 1294858487 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Because the US's laws are motherfucking insane.
< 1294858515 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds
< 1294858609 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you think of this thing: http://sensebridge.net/projects/northpaw/
< 1294859168 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294859349 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: It's ... big.
< 1294859375 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha, reddit managed to get into a Scala vs. Clojure flamewar
< 1294859379 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's one I didn't expect to see
< 1294859388 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf?
< 1294859397 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294859429 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, why not
< 1294859433 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/f07sn/scala_effective_java/c1ccuk6
< 1294859451 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1294859523 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i remember trolling someone in one of the php channels by saying that scala runs in java
< 1294859530 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he couldn't handle it at all
< 1294859538 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :..?
< 1294859542 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294859546 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :scala, it's that java app, right?
< 1294859547 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, there's a php vs. gcc row going on at the moment
< 1294859552 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahahah
< 1294859564 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :php is full of idiots.
< 1294859570 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: got any specific links?
< 1294859574 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because PHP's strtod bug was using undefined behaviour in C89, which gcc exploits for better optimisations
< 1294859588 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea
< 1294859598 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :got an url to actual flamewars?
< 1294859615 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :here's a php advocate in the war: http://blog.andreas.org/display?id=9
< 1294859625 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait is it pichtler
< 1294859632 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why would someone rely on undefined behavior for something crucial?
< 1294859636 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By accident, I guess?
< 1294859638 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because php?
< 1294859650 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oh, there's a php vs. gcc row going on at the moment <-- wait what
< 1294859661 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the funny thing is, the PHP code in question was a copy of a strtod function in use elsewhere
< 1294859662 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is like comparing apples and bookshelfs
< 1294859668 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not even apples and pears
< 1294859671 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it had a big comment saying "this code does not work on x87"
< 1294859675 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and guess where PHP tried to use it?
< 1294859686 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh
< 1294859686 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it's about whose fault a bug was
< 1294859689 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1294859697 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the PHP side is claiming it's a compiler bug, the gcc side's claiming it's a program bug
< 1294859703 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, they tried to use it on x86?
< 1294859710 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why doesn't that idiot show his last name anywhere on the page
< 1294859717 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: indeed, with x87 instructions as the floating point emu
< 1294859719 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could his family not afford a last name?
< 1294859725 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you only have to get one!!
< 1294859733 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, but uh what did it expect?
< 1294859742 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, that x87 did wronfg
< 1294859745 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wrong*
< 1294859767 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: oh, x87 is more accurate than a normal C double
< 1294859780 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, yes so why did they use long double then
< 1294859785 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they didn't, they used double
< 1294859792 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, then I don't see...
< 1294859798 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but assumed that a floating point number would necessarily compare equal to itself, if not a NaN
< 1294859808 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that isn't actually the case in C
< 1294859808 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, shouldn't it?
< 1294859812 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh hah
< 1294859813 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, C89, at least
< 1294859836 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you might be comparing a value stored in memory with a value stored in the x87 registers
< 1294859846 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the x87 registers are more accurate
< 1294859849 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1294859855 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copying a value from the registers to memory and back can thus change its value
< 1294859863 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, but these days you always use SSE
< 1294859865 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not x87
< 1294859870 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you use long double
< 1294859871 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C99 specifies that you can't do that sort of thing; C89 doesn't
< 1294859876 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: PHP uses x87
< 1294859883 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(don't ask me why, I didn't set its compiler flags)
< 1294859884 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, unlikely on x86-64
< 1294859903 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is presumably x86-32
< 1294859914 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah probably
< 1294859946 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, I wouldn't really expect a floating point number to necessarily compare equal to itself, floating point is that insane
< 1294859978 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if the PHP devs did, they probably insufficiently understand floating point in C (not really surprising; /most/ people insufficiently understand floating point in C, including probably me)
< 1294860016 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah
< 1294860022 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i bet you sufficiently understand floating point in c.
< 1294860047 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, are you sufficiently sure of that
< 1294860063 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am sufficiently sufficient
< 1294860073 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, anyway C99 guarantees this doesn't it?
< 1294860079 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I wouldn't use C89 any more
< 1294860081 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's that article, "what every computer scientist should know about floating-point numbers" or some-such.
< 1294860097 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yes, I read it
< 1294860147 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C99 does indeed guarantee that doubles are cut down to 64 bits of precision before being compared, by default
< 1294860156 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a bunch of defines that can be used to tweak the behaviour
< 1294860171 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I can't remember whether it's in a program, or just fixed defines that report what the floating-point behaviour is
< 1294860183 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, yes and C99 is older than 10 years. C89/C90 is older than 20 years. Surely it is time to move on?
< 1294860190 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are things I do not like in C99.
< 1294860256 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C1x is just around the corner too.
< 1294860263 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what are the news in it?
< 1294860277 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For some values of "corner".
< 1294860347 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm?
< 1294860393 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :c1x is fully functional with type inference
< 1294860403 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The latest draft is not very dramatic. Multithreading and Unicode things, gets dropped finally, official compile-time asserts...
< 1294860407 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it doesn't use braces.
< 1294860419 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, oooh compile time asserts
< 1294860422 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's awesome
< 1294860445 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, sounds like c++202x
< 1294860463 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's hopefully prettier than the existing hacky preprocessor tricks.
< 1294860474 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, one can only hope
< 1294860486 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That make a negative-sized array with a funny name or other things like that.
< 1294860502 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah
< 1294860524 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: As part of a structure, so that it does not use up any memory at run-time.
< 1294860549 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and a exclusive-create mode letter ("x") for fopen, and that anonymous structure/union thing that I think many compilers already do.
< 1294860565 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Sure, but the error messages are still a bit suboptimal.
< 1294860570 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, the anon structure is pretty useless
< 1294860601 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You can make the error message display something specific using #line directive, maybe?
< 1294860610 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yearh
< 1294860613 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeargh*
< 1294860632 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, how will it do multithreading I wonder
< 1294860709 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, bbl
< 1294860735 0 :elliottu!5b68ec9a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294860753 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does anyone know how the ubuntu installer calculates how big a swap partition to create?
< 1294860842 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a composer friend who found out about a contest for the 400th anniversary of the King James Bible to write a composition using its text as the words. I'm trying to convince him to write and submit something using some of the less tasteful passages encouraging slave ownership, rape, etc :P
< 1294860848 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :The sucked up fleep channel | http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page | logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D or (hg) http://codu.org/projects/esotericlogs/hg/
< 1294860874 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do it as death metal
< 1294860876 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\m/
< 1294860888 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :King James: too hardcore for you.
< 1294860950 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I suppose you can use any passages, you can use less tasteful passage for part of it too, but you can also use other passages. Some of the verses are just the names so you can use that, too. I assume deuterocanonical/apocrypha are disallowed?
< 1294860970 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoosh
< 1294860976 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Has to be from the KJB, can't be from psalms or songs.
< 1294860990 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Omg, make him do another one with the whole "begat" bullshit from Genesis.
< 1294860994 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And ONLY that.
< 1294861006 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The most inspirational song EVER
< 1294861011 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think a song that's just an endless droning of that section in genesis that's all A begat B begat C begat D begat E begat F begat etc. could be amusing
< 1294861017 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and...ninja'd
< 1294861030 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, great minds think alike and all
< 1294861034 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Very traditionally, I think. Thread-local storage type declarators, and then a  with vaguely pthready creation/mutex/condvar options; and then atomic operations -- more than just sig_atomic_t -- for lockless things.)
< 1294861087 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Loop it, add an irritating your-speakers-exploded-but-now-it's-silent-aand-repeat-steadily beat, and echo the fuck out of it.
< 1294861099 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :INSTANT CHRISTIAN RAVE HIT
< 1294861107 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oonts oonts oonts oonts
< 1294861108 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: So, Psalms is also disallowed.
< 1294861124 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What kind of music/scales/temperaments are used in Biblical times? Can you make a music using the same kind?
< 1294861177 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliottu: it should also be done in the voice of that guy from butthole surfers that did the spoken word stuff in "my brother's wife"
< 1294861254 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clearly it should be Song of Solomon. Mmm, biblical erotica.
< 1294861303 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hate how god damn useless #ubuntu is.
< 1294861330 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who is elliottu and why can I see him talk
< 1294861346 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliottu is elliott with a goatee. So you know he's evil.
< 1294861349 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: GEE I APOLOGISE FOR USING A LIVECD
< 1294861358 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: just fuck off, stop being childish, and reignore me if I do something so INSULTING
< 1294861375 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, new idea: One singer sings the X-begat-Y section softly, while two singers sing a selection of passages that directly contradict each other, at the same time.
< 1294861375 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliottu: like that?
< 1294861386 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Talking about /ignores: it makes you cool.
< 1294861392 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, wait, no, I forgot: It makes you stupid.
< 1294861414 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1294861422 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, the worst thing about people worth ignoring
< 1294861432 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are the people who feel the need to advertise that they can't hear what the ignored person is saying
< 1294861447 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vorpal is a fan of that :)
< 1294861479 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You used a livecd? FUCKNG /IGNORED
< 1294861484 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294861500 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: And then log read to hear what the ignored person is saying.
< 1294861504 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thereby defeating the point.
< 1294861505 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::)
< 1294861508 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1294861554 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh well, 8 gigs of swap should be ENOUGH FOR EVERYBODY
< 1294861590 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: when you say "one singer sings" you mean "one beatboxer beatboxes" right?
< 1294861609 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FIVE GOLDEN RIIIIIIIIINGS
< 1294861616 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliottu: hajsan
< 1294861624 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH LOL LOOK IM INSTALLIN NOW ->
< 1294861644 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll come back under a different nick just to see coppro be whiny again
< 1294861649 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliottu: OMG THE CD DRIVE IS THERE?
< 1294861649 0 :elliottu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Page closed
< 1294861983 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294861999 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you, or do you not, "do you, or do you knot"?
< 1294862012 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[A-Za-z]{8,} matches any alphabetic character repeated at least 8 times in a row, yes?
< 1294862041 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION uses people instead of regex checkers
< 1294862061 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Do you want the same letter repeated or different letter?
< 1294862070 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same letter
< 1294862079 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that won't work will it
< 1294862082 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how?
< 1294862091 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you use back references?
< 1294862105 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any legal perl regex is fine i think
< 1294862138 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then see if using back references will do?
< 1294862151 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now i have to look up how to do that again :/
< 1294862156 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://arxiv.org/abs/1008.0666
< 1294862160 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294862278 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, that will be the same as [A-Za-z][A-Za-z][A-Za-z][A-Za-z][A-Za-z][A-Za-z][A-Za-z][A-Za-z]
< 1294862300 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: Very traditionally, I think. Thread-local storage type declarators, and then a  with vaguely pthready creation/mutex/condvar options; and then atomic operations -- more than just sig_atomic_t -- for lockless things.) <-- ah
< 1294862363 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: so how about ([a-zA-Z])\1{7,}
< 1294862378 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : copumpkin: And then log read to hear what the ignored person is saying. <-- that sounds like elliott
< 1294862392 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, I think that would work
< 1294862392 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION yawns
< 1294862401 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION carves copumpkin 
< 1294862409 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no
< 1294862413 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not a pumpkin
< 1294862415 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm a copumpkin
< 1294862423 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in dual-land, copumpkin carve you!
< 1294862426 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION laughs evilly
< 1294862437 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is a const - I can't be carved
< 1294862443 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin, he could still carve you. not as in cutting but as in wanting
< 1294862452 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :crave?
< 1294862457 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right
< 1294862463 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin, I'm just too sleepy
< 1294862472 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same here :(
< 1294862479 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and my VPN is broken
< 1294862485 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is tim to sleep soon
< 1294862488 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :time*
< 1294862490 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or should be
< 1294862511 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except my sleep schedule is fucked up
< 1294862571 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, join the club
< 1294862585 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, with oerjan and who else?
< 1294862589 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, me
< 1294862594 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1294862602 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although it's getting better... no it's not
< 1294862603 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as long as it is fixed to next week
< 1294862619 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's alternating between going to sleep at a normal time, and staying up all night
< 1294862636 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah fluttering
< 1294862649 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, mine is just moving around all over the place
< 1294862651 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to be awake Friday. I don't feel like meeting up with her when I'm too tired to care
< 1294862653 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with no reasonable pattern
< 1294862664 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to be awake when I'm around her
< 1294862672 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you are in love?
< 1294862702 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: highlight me with a message containing an expression that regex should match
< 1294862708 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think it's at the point where it can be called "love" yet
< 1294862730 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm also not sure if she's that interested in me. Or, well, she gives mixed signals somtimes
< 1294862764 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, if you dropped the h, you'd sound like zzo38
< 1294862783 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, yes but I'm not him
< 1294862990 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: the regex doesn't work
< 1294863050 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, oh sorry - I went away for a bit
< 1294863057 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me play with some things and I'll let you kno
< 1294863079 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, PHP has 13 different sort functions: http://us2.php.net/manual/en/array.sorting.php
< 1294863211 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :php has the shittiest stdlib ever
< 1294863294 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, and none of them are stable
< 1294863298 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also uh, random sort!?
< 1294863420 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I noticed that too - it twas funny
< 1294863478 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really a sort :P
< 1294863664 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, all of them are in-plae
< 1294863664 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*in-place
< 1294863774 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish I could make XChat /away me when I close the lid of my laptop.
< 1294863783 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1294863805 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's open source
< 1294863825 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-224-158.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294863839 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh, PHP has a sort function for user-defined orderings
< 1294863859 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought PHP had either no or extremely crappy support for first-class functions.
< 1294863946 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They added closures in PHP 5.3.0.
< 1294863953 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no, it had that long before that
< 1294863958 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they have a "callback" type
< 1294863972 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, you can use second-class functions for sort callbacks just fine
< 1294863976 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which until 5.3.0 was a string containing function name
< 1294863995 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or an array containing object or class name as the 0th index and function name as the first
< 1294864014 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, they just added proper (or I don't know how proper they are, but at least proper-looking) anonymous functions in 5.3.0.
< 1294864027 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, and they started calling them closures
< 1294864038 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because they're confused about computarrzzz
< 1294864062 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then they added the use() cancer so that they can actually be closures.
< 1294864175 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They also have a rather strange sort of nested functions; if you do function foo() { function bar() { ... } } then you can bar() from anywhere, but only after calling foo() once.
< 1294864204 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes.
< 1294864218 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use()?
< 1294864303 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea, it's like using a variable in a lambda without lambdaing it
< 1294864335 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f = \x.x+y         <==>   f = function(x) use(y) { return x+y; }
< 1294864337 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something
< 1294864356 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :add dollar signs everywhere
< 1294864358 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Crap, just saw some false information, than a link to Snopes discrediting it. My understanding though, is that if you receive information that you only mentally discredit later, it still gets stuck in the mind as "true"
< 1294864373 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f = \x.x+y         <==>   $f $= $function($x) $use($y) ${ $return $x$+$y$; $}
< 1294864393 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: oh damnnnnnnn
< 1294864405 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :php is mad .....
< 1294864409 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and even pre 5.3.0 (since 4.0.1) they had this thing for anonymous functions: string create_function(string $args , string $code)
< 1294864422 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the hell
< 1294864423 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You give it a bit of code as a string, and it defines a randomly named new function and returns the name.
< 1294864437 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea
< 1294864440 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then you can pass the new name into something that takes a callback.
< 1294864457 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they also do a shitload via eval()
< 1294864466 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is fucking funnay.
< 1294864533 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :create_function will waste memory though, there is no way to delete a function in PHP, or to override one which exists.
< 1294864548 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, ooh, like Forth!
< 1294864550 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :However, it is possible to pass an array with an object, as a callback. So you can do like that instead.
< 1294864560 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
< 1294864647 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: php wasting memory? CAN'T BE
< 1294864676 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ARE YOU SURE?
< 1294864676 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders if Objective-J is decent
< 1294864681 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah
< 1294864686 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: PHP is also slow. (However, it is fast enough to run my IRC client, and it actually does this well.)
< 1294864740 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you've gotta be joking me
< 1294864744 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a php irc client.
< 1294864762 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not joking.
< 1294864785 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, meet zzo38.
< 1294864803 0 :ellioppro!5b68ec9a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294864815 0 :ellioppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it installed, what are the chances
< 1294864821 0 :ellioppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i only had to boot into a non-graphical environment and plug in ethernet _once_
< 1294864841 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ellioppro, when did you two merge into a superorganism.
< 1294864871 0 :ellioppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I'm irritating coppro by circumventing his ignore, since he keeps doing the age-old IRC dickwaddery of bringing up that I'm ignored constantly.
< 1294864878 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: do you have an eval command there?
< 1294864911 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ellioppro: IS SUPERDUPERDRIVE YOURS???
< 1294864912 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ellioppro, I CAN'T HEAR YOU I'M IGNORING YOU
< 1294864922 0 :ellioppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: for N hours, yes.
< 1294864924 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: There is a single eval command in the program, but it is used only for parsing the initialization file.
< 1294864926 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ellioppro, remember when you ignored me? You were furious when I curcumvented it
< 1294864936 0 :ellioppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Not "furious" ...
< 1294864937 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And you kept reminding me that I was on ignore
< 1294864941 0 :ellioppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just told you to stop doing it.
< 1294864941 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: can i somehow store numbers into your php process?
< 1294864942 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And only lines starting with <
< 1294864944 0 :ellioppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And ... no I didn't.
< 1294864965 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How many times did you mention that, due to the ignore, things were better?
< 1294864966 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: What do you mean? The eval does not take any input remotely.
< 1294864982 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yeah ok.. but say i wanted to store a value that is later kept in the memory of your php process
< 1294864987 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how would i do it?
< 1294864991 0 :ellioppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Zero?
< 1294864997 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ellioppro, more than that
< 1294865005 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless my memory is failing
< 1294865025 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you remember the dates?
< 1294865031 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: lies, ellioppro never ignores anyone
< 1294865044 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ellioppro is everyone's friend.
< 1294865049 0 :ellioppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. i am
< 1294865054 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^
< 1294865056 0 :ellioppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :download faster, you fucking computer
< 1294865062 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :welllllll, except for Phantom_Hoover
< 1294865063 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: As far as I know you cannot do that. (You can send things and it is stored in the scrollback of PuTTY)
< 1294865080 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(PHIRC does use PuTTY to actually display everything in colors and so on)
< 1294865098 0 :ellioppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :12:32:38  Crap, just saw some false information, than a link to Snopes discrediting it. My understanding though, is that if you receive information that you only mentally discredit later, it still gets stuck in the mind as "true"
< 1294865102 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: do you get any commands that respond to triggers or something?
< 1294865104 0 :ellioppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: OH MY GOD YOU WILL HOLD THIS MISUNDERSTANDING FOREVER
< 1294865108 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's this about Phantom_Hoover?
< 1294865118 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ellioppro is not his friend
< 1294865141 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: The program will respond automatically to CTRL+A commands: FINGER PING TIME USERINFO VERSION
< 1294865147 0 :ellioppro!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :copprelliott
< 1294865155 0 :copprelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: do you prefer this version?
< 1294865167 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, candidly, I don't think he's too fond of cheater00 either.
< 1294865175 0 :copprelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe he has .*e.*l.*l.*i.*o.*t.*t.* on ignore
< 1294865186 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But only if /SET ANSWER + is set)
< 1294865192 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: copprelliott is very fond of cheater00
< 1294865199 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: oh
< 1294865206 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: that's not good
< 1294865225 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: you should have at least one command that takes the message, stores it as a number, and prints it or something
< 1294865248 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: Why is such a thing necessary?
< 1294865259 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's necessary. no explanation given.
< 1294865294 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here is the code, you can look at it, and make your own modifications if that is what you want to do:  http://sprunge.us/QeLb
< 1294865352 0 :copprelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ubuntu's trackpad driver sucks
< 1294865381 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've had some problems with it
< 1294865386 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you have problems with?
< 1294865399 0 :copprelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't seem to do any multitouch, prolly i need another driver
< 1294865405 0 :copprelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't, for instance,s elect things
< 1294865408 0 :copprelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*instance, select
< 1294865411 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copprelliott: also, make sure your cpu is running on normal speed
< 1294865414 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not on speedstep
< 1294865417 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@2001:4428:251:1:21f:16ff:fe68:a55 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294865417 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host
< 1294865417 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294865418 0 :copprelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why
< 1294865430 0 :copprelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd prefer to keep the fan down + conserve power usage.
< 1294865533 0 :cheater-!~cheater@e181134127.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294865545 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because mine always boots into slowest_mode
< 1294865602 0 :copprelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the cpu scales up as it is used, i see no issue
< 1294865660 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1294865676 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1294865714 0 :cheater99!~cheater@g224201135.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294865817 0 :copprelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :incidentally
< 1294865824 0 :copprelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the superdrive makes a nice cd case
< 1294865839 0 :copprelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a portable, unplugged USB drive to put ubuntu on any macbook air! kinda like a usb stick, except gigantic. :P
< 1294865846 0 :copprelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tl;dr too lazy to put in a box
< 1294865925 0 :copprelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Page closed
< 1294866000 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like dc?
< 1294866096 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why did coppro put him on ignore in the first place?
< 1294866109 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because elliot is not shit
< 1294866111 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :t
< 1294866172 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is the difference of cheater00 cheater99 cheater- ?
< 1294866190 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we're the holy trinity
< 1294866220 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The service provider is all the same.
< 1294866265 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :truly, your cunning is remarkable.
< 1294866274 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WE HAVE A NON-TRINITARIAN HERE
< 1294866318 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://9gag.com/gag/67468/ Japan has improved upon the slip-n-slide.
< 1294866357 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" Gregor: Omg, make him do another one with the whole "begat" bullshit from Genesis." <<< surely modern bibles just have a few diagrams for these
< 1294866370 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like KJB
< 1294866370 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :modern bibles LOL
< 1294866452 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: The text is even more WTF.
< 1294866462 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Modern Bibles are the same they just have different translations. Some also have footnotes, and some have deutrocanonical books, too.
< 1294866474 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Translate for us :P
< 1294866479 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some might have diagrams, though.
< 1294866516 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: "*something I can't read* Crank 2009! Milk! Construction! Explosions!" on the left.
< 1294866526 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" are the people who feel the need to advertise that they can't hear what the ignored person is saying" <<< no i think it's even worse when the ignored people start telling the ignorers how childish they are... wait, i'm even worse
< 1294866577 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This event is known to cause what some call a "milk explosion"
< 1294866594 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: "September~October 'The Autumn of Sports' An example photograph‽" on the right.
< 1294866604 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, yeah. WTF?
< 1294866664 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, sorry, I completely misparsed a bit of that. s/Milk/Tits/
< 1294866688 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lawl
< 1294866769 0 :elliott!~elliott@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294866773 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1294866780 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" Sgeo, with oerjan and who else?" <<< good morning
< 1294866789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sgeo is holding an orgy?
< 1294866796 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Guest78959
< 1294866829 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294866832 0 :Guest78959!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :13:05:57  " Gregor: Omg, make him do another one with the whole "begat" bullshit from Genesis." <<< surely modern bibles just have a few diagrams for these
< 1294866836 0 :Guest78959!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be ... amazing
< 1294866850 0 :Guest78959!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially w/ the incest
< 1294866855 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stick it on a time line. :)
< 1294866871 0 :Guest78959!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, genealogical tree
< 1294866888 0 :Guest78959!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :elliott
< 1294866890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host
< 1294866890 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294866939 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Aren't you glad you've hidden your IP, which is 91.104.236.154?
< 1294866960 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Extremely.
< 1294866983 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My hostname is codu.org. Jealous much?
< 1294867000 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe the reason you put "@unaffiliated/elliott" is to see if you are login to the services??
< 1294867022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: You should set up a fake ident daemon (there's tons of them) on codu.org, and configure it to tell the server that your username is whatever your email username is.
< 1294867029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: So your hostname would be your email address.
< 1294867036 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THIS IS M Y IDEA (C) ME FOREVER--FOREVER
< 1294867063 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to put my hostname "zzo38computer.cjb.net" (it does resolve to the computer I connected from) but they will not do that.
< 1294867096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who are "they"?
< 1294867108 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE MAN
< 1294867117 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: The Freenode.
< 1294867119 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol @ elliott claiming he never repeatedly told someone they were ignored :E
< 1294867142 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, oh i don't deny that
< 1294867148 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just deny i did it the last time i ignored sgeo
< 1294867158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: *The* Freenode?
< 1294867165 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yes.
< 1294867170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are they a cabal?
< 1294867177 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't know.
< 1294867262 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://9gag.com/gag/67468/ <<< but what if you accidentally have an erection and get stuck between the girls
< 1294867269 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so elliott
< 1294867276 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be embarrassing
< 1294867278 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you going to install every language possible on your ubuntu now?
< 1294867289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: xD
< 1294867293 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: not really
< 1294867299 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what if the erection gets stuck between the girls?
< 1294867335 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://www.cs.bham.ac.uk/~drg/papers/popl11.pdf
< 1294867361 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yay, another paper i can't understand
< 1294867363 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" i just deny i did it the last time i ignored sgeo" <<< oh well possible
< 1294867370 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i probably can
< 1294867370 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's the one I wanted to link you to earlier but couldn't find a legal copy of
< 1294867375 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i haven't, yet, expended the effort to
< 1294867387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i like how you have to work to find a legal version of your own paper.
< 1294867396 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the bottom of page 7 is amusing
< 1294867400 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't actually recall you doing that with Sgeo, but you have definitely done it! maybe it was cool back then tho, dunno
< 1294867431 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so umm
< 1294867431 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note that that isn't just "one such example", but the simplest known example
< 1294867441 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that took quite a bit of esoprogramming to find
< 1294867451 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I WISH I COULD SIDUHGDSFGJKHGSJKFGHLSKJFLHL;GKFDJGDSKDS SELECT TEXT
< 1294867477 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what uni are you on again?
< 1294867492 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Manchingham.
< 1294867516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"on"
< 1294867523 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why does coppro have you on ignore?
< 1294867539 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently the channel is better without me, i.e. the channel is almost silent
< 1294867540 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was just thinking about stuff and realized i might know how to prove this thing i've spent like 40 million hours trying to prove... and then i quickly stopped thinking about it before realizing what the reason for *this* idea not working will be, tl;dr, i can never think about math again :(
< 1294867585 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha oklopol, you are reduced to liberal arts!!!!!!
< 1294867597 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :11:45:00  copumpkin: And then log read to hear what the ignored person is saying.
< 1294867597 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :11:45:04  Thereby defeating the point.
< 1294867604 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not necessarily.
< 1294867612 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I'm going to play Quadrapassel until you tell me how to get selection working.
< 1294867627 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe i need to change my branch of math to something far enough
< 1294867633 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Get selection working on what?
< 1294867664 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you want to be able to ignore the dross someone comes out with 90% of the time and get context when someone else actually pays them any heed, it's worthwhile.
< 1294867693 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's http://www.cs.bham.ac.uk/~drg/papers/popl11.pdf? opening pdf's from the internets is just so much work
< 1294867701 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :finally
< 1294867701 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523:
< 1294867704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh
< 1294867713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523:
< 1294867715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seq : com × exp → exp is sequencing of command with expression, denoted by “;” when used in infix
< 1294867715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :notation, resulting in an expression with side effects;
< 1294867716 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes?
< 1294867726 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i like fig 2 on page 8.
< 1294867734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: "first we build this comprehensive cage to put side-effects in, then we poke a big hole in it"
< 1294867737 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: my second paper as a PhD student
< 1294867750 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's meant to be a simple imperative language
< 1294867753 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: i only use ignore in order to be in control of the times of looking at messages, so i don't pass out from anger when some retard is telling me how math works
< 1294867758 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we didn't cage side-effects at all, except via variable scope
< 1294867771 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: shush :P
< 1294867793 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and therefore actually look at all the messages later
< 1294867797 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Phantom_Hoover: i only use ignore in order to be in control of the times of looking at messages, so i don't pass out from anger when some retard is telling me how math works ← I use it to get rid of people who insist on butting into irrelevant conversations.
< 1294867821 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I imagine a 38 is involved somehow.
< 1294867854 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh cool, then i might open it actually
< 1294867868 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unlike the one before, I actually did most of the actual research that lead to that paper
< 1294867869 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, what's a good way to figure out what touchpad driver I am using?
< 1294867874 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although it was only about half written by me
< 1294867874 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we've been talking publishing some of my stuff once i get my master's finished
< 1294867900 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so currently publications are like the biggest thing in my life, you're basically a god now
< 1294867914 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in academia, publications are all anyone cares about, it seems
< 1294867918 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that and money
< 1294867936 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes about installing Chrome
< 1294867941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, Firefox; you're too hateful
< 1294868008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a feeling Ubuntu is going to be able to do almost, but not entirely, not what i want with my touchpad
< 1294868071 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1294868077 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i don't really have the same experience, people are so damn modest... it's like they don't even pay attention to what they do... for instance today person X said he has book Y in his shelf, and prof Z said "oh, that's mine"; i asked "you mean yours as in you're the author, or as in you own it?", he said he owned it. ten minutes later, he looks at the cover and goes "oh right, i actually did write this"
< 1294868096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294868098 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's amazing
< 1294868101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i aspire to be prof Z
< 1294868104 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294868110 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(he was a coauthor and it was more than 10 years old but anyway)
< 1294868119 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah good. David Touretzky is getting involved in the PS3 BS.
< 1294868135 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why is David Touretzky?
< 1294868137 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/Why/Who/
< 1294868218 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Professor of CS at Carnegie Mellon. Quite involved in the DeCSS litigation and a pain in the ass for the Church of Scientology.
< 1294868225 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :great ... i need to install Flash
< 1294868231 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : i aspire to be prof Z ← I recall a story about one of the Cayley-era mathematicians who told someone the first thing in his proof was wrong, and then the person showed him a proof that he himself had done and forgotten about.
< 1294868239 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294868240 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(he's responsible for many, many leaks of CoS doctrine)
< 1294868256 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: that's just false humbleness
< 1294868264 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*awesome
< 1294868288 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i have something good for you
< 1294868299 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: there's a ff plugin that installs the RIGHT version of flash for you
< 1294868316 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what bullshit is that, i have a package manager
< 1294868321 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has the 64-bit flash in it
< 1294868324 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea, the one from the package manager sucks dicks
< 1294868328 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it doesn't
< 1294868330 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not as of recently
< 1294868333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the native 64-bit one now
< 1294868335 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :enjoy your 1 fps
< 1294868341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: umm, it's the 32-bit one that did that
< 1294868342 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :idiot
< 1294868348 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or you could just install flash-aid
< 1294868358 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :idiot yourself :p
< 1294868376 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, flash-aid has secret access to a magical adobe version that fixes everything
< 1294868385 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yup
< 1294868386 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unlike the new 64-bit native one that Adobe released only a month or two ago
< 1294868390 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yup
< 1294868391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh huh
< 1294868399 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dyurrrr
< 1294868400 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok you're clearly trolling at this juncture
< 1294868406 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes i am
< 1294868410 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you weren't being nice
< 1294868415 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, i don't use firefox.
< 1294868419 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lrn2humans
< 1294868443 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, what do you use then?
< 1294868470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chrome. usually.
< 1294868481 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :b-but
< 1294868486 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chrome is missing so many things
< 1294868496 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly user interface things
< 1294868501 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :God, XChat's ignore window is badly designed.
< 1294868504 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vertical tabs, tab unloading..
< 1294868517 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has the "Clear" button right where you'd expect the "Close" button.
< 1294868523 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" oklopol: that's just false humbleness" <<< possibly, but it was some sort of survey or dunno, name was something like automata theory 134; actually may just have been a collection of papers, and he mentioned he was an author as a joke, since he happened to be compiling it now that i think about it :D
< 1294868523 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: /ignore foo*!*@* all
< 1294868541 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes, I know.
< 1294868556 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you're well versed in the ignore
< 1294868590 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i'm going to ignore you now because i don't like the way you think
< 1294868597 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1294868625 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294868669 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean it's not the things you say, or the way you say it, it's just what i can tell from the order and structure in which the facts come out, you think in a very insulting way.
< 1294868671 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*them
< 1294868678 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*from
< 1294868679 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD
< 1294868680 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :god shitted
< 1294868689 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, I'm going to ignore you because I think there are too many Finns on the channel and I can't handle all of them.
< 1294868699 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's 100% understandable
< 1294868712 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294868725 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Then ignore *!*@*.fi ? Probably not the best idea, though.
< 1294868744 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I am going to ignore you because you are English and I'm contractually obligated to hate you.
< 1294868756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay
< 1294868770 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We can all type in English.
< 1294868777 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no we kant]
< 1294868783 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was a finntroll on #math once, and TRWBW was like "k, there goes that country forever"
< 1294868797 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :The sucked up fleep channel | I'll suck up ALL your fleep, baby! | http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page | logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D or (hg) http://codu.org/projects/esotericlogs/hg/
< 1294868815 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i'm going to ignore you because you keep on calling me a troll, and i don't like honest people
< 1294868824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i forget, is trwbw the bad one or the good one
< 1294868826 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: ok
< 1294868842 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, I am going to ignore you because you are fairly English.
< 1294868842 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i don't know because i don't know who the other one you mean is
< 1294868847 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trwbw is the bad one and good one at the same time
< 1294868852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i don't
< 1294868855 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's an total idiot though.
< 1294868859 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: But I'm a Jew! A filthy, filthy Semite!
< 1294868860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm just asking whether he's bad or good
< 1294868860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1294868862 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trwbw is a very special person
< 1294868862 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :prolly good then
< 1294868864 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :re cheater99
< 1294868872 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: O, yes, you prefer cheating, isn't it? Well, I want you to please stop cheating. (I will not force you to stop, or put you on ignore, though.)
< 1294868875 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: enjoy your TRWBW
< 1294868876 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed
< 1294868885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :coprophiliac
< 1294868887 0 :coprophiliac!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi coppro
< 1294868888 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, no amount of Jewishness can compensate for being English!
< 1294868890 0 :coprophiliac!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :having a nice day today?
< 1294868910 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: i will put you on ignore because you refuse to put me on ignore. i will unignore you just as soon as i find out you have ignored me.
< 1294868918 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's like homeopathy!
< 1294868950 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coprophiliac: way to build on linking that scat porn thing
< 1294868966 0 :coprophiliac!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>_>
< 1294868967 0 :coprophiliac!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't
< 1294868968 0 :coprophiliac!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :prove
< 1294868969 0 :coprophiliac!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ANYTHING
< 1294868972 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i will ignore you because i will ignore you
< 1294868980 0 :coprophiliac!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i will ignore you iff i ignore you
< 1294868980 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294868985 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294868996 0 :coprophiliac!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :tarski
< 1294869000 0 :tarski!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :taken
< 1294869001 0 :tarski!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what shit
< 1294869002 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so could everyone here give me their addresses in pm
< 1294869003 0 :tarski!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :elliott
< 1294869010 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like irl addresses
< 1294869010 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :banach
< 1294869011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what kind of addresses
< 1294869013 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1294869015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why
< 1294869018 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: www.god.com
< 1294869025 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, wtf
< 1294869026 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yours i have already so i don't see why i need to answer
< 1294869032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no, we moved
< 1294869033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::>
< 1294869037 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :twice actually.
< 1294869044 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, then do give
< 1294869045 0 :banach!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :sierpinski
< 1294869049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no :D
< 1294869050 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you want my address now oklopololopol
< 1294869054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gimme yours
< 1294869056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll come visit
< 1294869074 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay
< 1294869080 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: not part of the deal
< 1294869091 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well it's either this or no deal
< 1294869100 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: are you really in finland btw?
< 1294869112 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is that just a bnc
< 1294869114 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of some sort
< 1294869125 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well just in case
< 1294869134 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just in case what?
< 1294869142 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just in case you have nowhere to send out anthrax?
< 1294869166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sweet, sound doesn't work
< 1294869171 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just in case i'm in the neighborhood and want human company, ofc
< 1294869185 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that shouldn't be too hard to fix, they do that on purpose to weed out 'posers'
< 1294869194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: xD
< 1294869198 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK fine I put cheater99 on ignore......
< 1294869205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : OK fine I put cheater99 on ignore......
< 1294869214 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok fine unignored
< 1294869220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YAY
< 1294869221 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :flip flop
< 1294869227 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::>
< 1294869274 0 :sierpinski!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to put j-invariant on my watchlist for ignoring for suspected Englishness.
< 1294869295 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was given no addresses :\
< 1294869299 0 :sierpinski!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Phantom_Hoover
< 1294869329 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because they said so........
< 1294869434 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's wrong with having an oklo ring your doorbell
< 1294869443 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RING RING
< 1294869447 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :here comes oklop
< 1294869450 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*-p
< 1294869537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1294869551 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: i'm really in finland
< 1294869553 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's like krampus at your door
< 1294869554 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also
< 1294869554 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<1> i cheater99;
< 1294869568 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay got first address
< 1294869578 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can someone tell zzo38 to unignore me now?
< 1294869603 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I don't want to filter it anymore.
< 1294869604 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: but won't you then ignore him?
< 1294869654 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait what?
< 1294869677 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: and why do you ignore the English?
< 1294869700 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, because otherwise I am not allowed to live in Scotland without a visa.
< 1294869713 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1294869718 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no, this was a one-time event
< 1294869728 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I looked at the log file, and I realized that I switched off the filter at the time which they told them to tell me to stop, it is coincidence, though, that it happened at the same time.
< 1294869730 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: ah
< 1294869746 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: well, scotland is better at everything but football, and I don't care about football
< 1294869751 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so why don't you just look down on us intead?
< 1294869755 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*instead
< 1294869767 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :scotland has HAGGIS
< 1294869770 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yum
< 1294869780 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99: it also has a sane education system and a sane legal system
< 1294869786 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is possibly more important
< 1294869789 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, we also have a worse life expectancy.
< 1294869814 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haggis is the awesome
< 1294869815 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and, HAGGIS.
< 1294869832 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: really? that surprises me
< 1294869846 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, we invented the deep-fried Mars Bar.
< 1294869851 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless the stereotypes about scots and healthy eating are actually true, which would surprise me even more
< 1294869854 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, we have a lower life expectancy.
< 1294869855 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tend not to believe in stereotypes
< 1294869876 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and although I know you invented the deep-fried mars bar, I thought that was just for selling to tourists
< 1294869898 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, wait, are we in an antiflamewar?
< 1294869905 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd better go home before it gets even worse
< 1294869907 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bye everyone
< 1294869909 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1294869950 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should point out at this point that I am not very Scottish at all.
< 1294870021 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does that mean
< 1294870452 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okoploop: My address is too easy to find that I'd bother distribatibuting it, but don't you already approximately know?
< 1294870563 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Finland".
< 1294870564 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know which town you live in
< 1294870577 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah i know where to find you
< 1294870591 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i have plans for a few others as well
< 1294870598 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How... ominous.
< 1294870623 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294870628 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: is it true that children aged 11 drink vodka in finland by the glass
< 1294870652 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Crazed student kidnaps 4, uses them for insane experiment."
< 1294870680 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i remember we drank one glass of vodka each when i was 10 or something, with a friend, but i didn't start drinking until i was like 15
< 1294870683 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe 14
< 1294870709 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They do seem to start younger (12?) nowadays, though.
< 1294870712 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but some 11yo's certainly drink a lot, i think they do in every country
< 1294870729 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7sNge0Ywz-M
< 1294870731 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is fun
< 1294870736 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he writes fibonacci in minecraft
< 1294870775 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vodka_belt ← I did not know that was a term.
< 1294870835 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so umm, i think my idea works
< 1294870857 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the problem i've been trying to solve
< 1294870861 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, I wish he'd had monsters on.
< 1294870873 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now i can't continue thinking about it because i'm so excited
< 1294870874 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...
< 1294870883 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Creepers exploding on the data bus would be a novel excuse for computer failure.
< 1294870939 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294870957 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Creepers on the Data Bus", yet another band name.
< 1294870975 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or a really weird euphemism.
< 1294870987 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Sorry, I can't come today; I've got the creepers on my data bus, if you know what I mean."
< 1294870990 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd like to creep on HER data bus
< 1294871002 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :creepers on the data bus is my meat loaf cover band
< 1294871066 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294871087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is better.
< 1294871127 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ubuntu suck cess?
< 1294871195 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Success enough. Tweaking things can come later.
< 1294871199 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, creepers on the data bus: the best excuse for computer failure ever?
< 1294871202 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Touchpad isn't working perfectly but I can refine it gradually.
< 1294871204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: YES.
< 1294871230 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now: can I adapt it to get out of homework?
< 1294871254 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've already tried "I wrote it on a flash drive, then I dropped it and the partition table fell out!"
< 1294871304 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Bring in a melted-in-the-oven floppy, and then just say "well *now* I know why they call them floppies!"
< 1294871320 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh.
< 1294871345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I have erectile dysfunction... but hey, at least I know why they call them floppies now!"
< 1294871766 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes to play EteRNA
< 1294871865 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1294871937 0 :cheater99!~cheater@g231049019.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294872035 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, please tell me that's a game in which you play as a cell.
< 1294872056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fisch,
< 1294872057 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1294872069 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294872072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...or double fisch?
< 1294872089 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a game where you try to design RNA molecules
< 1294872121 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wouldn't this cooperative action game be great where you have a bunch of people that are a cellular automaton, and everyone must behave according to the local rule, or CHAOS ENSUES
< 1294872143 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or single-player adventure mode
< 1294872147 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where you are *one* cell
< 1294872181 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lagerholm estimate is in single digit number of days...
< 1294872198 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :our cellular automata course started
< 1294872233 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sofar we've done some basic cantor topology stuff, proved a few things about neighborhoods, and looked at golly simulations for hours
< 1294872244 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3M allocations from China marked as new (less than 5 days ago).
< 1294872255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: :D
< 1294872313 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you know cellular automata look really pretty when you run them? this was news to me, i just knew their theory was pretty
< 1294872340 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :APNIC: 2.39 /8s in RIR Pool
< 1294872356 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes i knew this
< 1294872362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: mr. wolfram
< 1294872374 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i read wolfram's book once but he didn't mention they look pretty when run
< 1294872383 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cantor topology??
< 1294872386 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he just said they look really IMPORTANT and FUNDAMENTAL
< 1294872398 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is still ~20 day spread between the Lagerhom and Houston estimates (due to differing thresholds)...
< 1294872400 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: one of the names of the product topology of Z
< 1294872403 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1294872405 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :S^Z
< 1294872405 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what
< 1294872414 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does it have to do with CA?
< 1294872416 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's topologically equivalent to cantor sets
< 1294872417 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1294872422 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CA is all about topology
< 1294872425 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really?
< 1294872429 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm yes
< 1294872438 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well
< 1294872443 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :please tell me what the connection is
< 1294872465 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the galois connection!
< 1294872469 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can try, but i'll need to come up with a concrete example
< 1294872474 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmhmm
< 1294872492 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Basically, it is all up to APNIC on when IANA pool is going to deplete...
< 1294872498 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so say all finite patterns have a preimage, then "by compactness", all configurations have a preimage
< 1294872503 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an application of topology right there
< 1294872517 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh
< 1294872522 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's S^Z is a compact space, and finite patterns can be made converge into your configuration
< 1294872574 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so preimages of them have a converging subsequence (by compactness) that converges to an X such that X has to have that limit configuration as its image
< 1294872574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wish my trackpad wouldn't freeze up if i move it for too long
< 1294872580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :until i move away for a second and restart moving
< 1294872588 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you follow that? i can do it more clearly
< 1294872602 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i think)
< 1294872735 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll try to improvise: let G be a CA function with a quiescent state q such that G(q, ..., q) = q, such that for all "finite configurations" c there is a c' such that G(c') = c, where finite configuration = finitely many non-quiescents
< 1294872794 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now, consider an arbitrary configuration, also called c for some reason, take a sequence of finite configurations c_i converging to it (why can i do this?), and for each of them a preimage c'_i
< 1294872820 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then, take a converging subsequence of c'_i
< 1294872858 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call that say (d_i), we still know G(d_i) converges to c
< 1294872869 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because G(d_i) is a subsequence of c_i
< 1294872890 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now, because d_i converges, also G(d_i) converges, because G is continuous
< 1294872930 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but we know limits commute with continuous functions, so c = lim G(d_i) = G(lim d_i)
< 1294872945 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :therefore, the limit of the d_i is a preimage of c
< 1294873010 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like the way the channel can segue into advanced mathematics in a matter of seconds.
< 1294873015 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Last time APNIC allocated at something like 2.1 or 2.2 /8s, which is about 0.2 to 0.3 /8s left...
< 1294873018 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :got it? this illustrates the techniques, but in this case you could just open up the meanings of the topological terms, since there's so little of them used
< 1294873019 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol always seems to be involved.
< 1294873025 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION → sleep
< 1294873028 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1294873031 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that wasn't very advanced :D
< 1294873032 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In number of addresses, that's about 4 million.
< 1294873054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it had limits and ' in it
< 1294873056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ADVANCED
< 1294873067 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: did you know CA are exactly the shift-commuting continuous functions from S^Z to S^Z?
< 1294873096 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shift turns configuration x into its left-shifted image, as you might have guessed
< 1294873113 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: The Tao that can be spoken of is not the Tao.
< 1294873119 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and shift commuting is of course that it doesn't matter whether you apply the function before or after the shift
< 1294873120 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4 million... And we are down 3 million in last 5 days...
< 1294873134 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: that makes sense
< 1294873159 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who is using all these IPs?
< 1294873187 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that's actually a sort of trivial thing, in this symposiom I TALKED IN, there was this presentation where they basically just extracted that from some basic category theory for a much larger class of things than just CA, without really doing much
< 1294873197 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's a lot of fun, and that's the reason topology is useful
< 1294873219 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance, if a CA is reversible, then its inverse is also a CA function
< 1294873229 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how does that follow from topology and that characterization?
< 1294873237 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: China.
< 1294873252 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, is asking questions annoying btw, it seems i've started doing that :D
< 1294873265 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really
< 1294873283 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's basically a nicer form of "obviously"
< 1294873285 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess
< 1294873297 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: Jeeze.
< 1294873372 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If APNIC uses 2.2 as alloc threshold this time, that would likely mean exhaustion next week.
< 1294873420 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The reserves holding this month seem rather unlikely...
< 1294873439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DAMMIT CHINA
< 1294873452 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As it was last month, it's *all* a matter of when APNIC feels like allocating.
< 1294873466 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Could easily happen right now.
< 1294873500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wanna take over apnic
< 1294873501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MWAHAHAHA
< 1294873506 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: answer, since you didn't answer my first question either: S^Z is a compact space, so the inverse of a continuous bijection is continuous (basic topological result), and shift commuting should be obvious
< 1294873512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: question, do APNIC _know_ what doing that will result in? :D
< 1294873554 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :S^Z being compact is a fun exercise if you haven't played with this stuff
< 1294873564 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is S?
< 1294873571 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh just the state set
< 1294873575 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :arbitrary finite set
< 1294873581 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1294873585 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry about that, i forget to mention things
< 1294873594 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: They are all *very* well aware that IPv4 depletion happens insanely soon.
< 1294873609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: so is it possible that APNIC will hold back just to shut up doomsday prophets? :D
< 1294873627 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: If they "hold back", we *might* get another month out of IPv4.
< 1294873642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: yeah, but would _you_ give the order "MAKE THE ALLOCATION!"?
< 1294873650 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vodka looks interesting
< 1294873651 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes.
< 1294873673 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How long can APNIC hold out for?
< 1294873689 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vodka looks dead
< 1294873702 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Not long!
< 1294873715 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And not worth discussing.
< 1294873751 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We've likely got a bit over a year untiil *every* RIR is out...
< 1294873763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what Sgeo is trying to say is, he INGESTED the vodka
< 1294873794 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is more like they already have been holding back for at least a month...
< 1294873876 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And if the scary allocation rates shown on December continue after new year's, the extra address pool is going to deplete in no time (forcing allocation).
< 1294873895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is gonna be great
< 1294873914 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Waiting a month, their RIR pool would run SERIOUSLY low.
< 1294873914 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a site to host a PDF, like imgur?
< 1294873914 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: did you lost interest, i was hoping i could lecture about this all night :D
< 1294873917 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*lose
< 1294873932 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I am interested in it but I would like to start at the beginning
< 1294873948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: filebin.ca throws anything you throw at it ... when it's up
< 1294873963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: foobin can of course do pdfs... but you need a server, and also me to have written it
< 1294873964 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :already
< 1294874046 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: we are very close to the beginning, if you're fluent in topology; but i suppose that's not necessarily the case
< 1294874137 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically: 1. S^Z is compact (special case of tychonoff) 2. CA are the continuous and shift-commuting functions 3. examples of using these ideas in proofs; i started at 3
< 1294874184 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I know the definitions of topology but not the theorems like tychonoff. I can learn it another time though.
< 1294874246 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i was joking about lecturing all night, don't worry
< 1294874267 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh :(
< 1294874294 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, would you like a lecture?
< 1294874299 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of corse
< 1294874303 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294874313 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no one EVER wants a lecture!
< 1294874353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: so have you given up on ur again
< 1294874357 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't prove tychonoff. that's crazy shit. i can prove S^Z compact directly though. i think
< 1294874430 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's easy if we already know that CA characterization, but hmmhmm
< 1294874440 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe my numbering was wrong!
< 1294874452 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't actually had to implement this theory
< 1294874459 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've just read other people's code
< 1294874470 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm... About 1 billion endpoint devices and about 625 trillion IPv6 subnetworks allocated...
< 1294874493 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay so first of all we should probably start with S^Z being metrizable
< 1294874515 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is, you can implement the topology with a metric
< 1294874579 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: which metric?
< 1294874584 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one such metric d is defined as follows: if x and y are in S^Z, d(x, y)= 2^{-n} for the smallest n such that x_n != y_n or x_{-n} != y_{-n}
< 1294874606 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you know what the product topology on S^Z is?
< 1294874652 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not exactly what I would call efficient use of address space...
< 1294874718 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has S^\{i : i < j\} x {s} x S^\{i : i > j}} as a subbase, that is a subbase is given by sets where one cell has to be s, and others can be anything
< 1294874732 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*that is, a subbase
< 1294874751 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where s and j range over S and Z, respectively
< 1294874776 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is just the definition of product topology, which we'll make more sense of later, for instance that metrizability should already clarify it a bit
< 1294874832 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1294874875 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the product topology of topological spaces (T_i) in general has as a subbase, for each i, and each open U \in T_i, U x \product_{j != i} T_j
< 1294874890 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just used the fact {s}'s are open sets forming a base for the finite set S
< 1294874909 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(on which we of course use the discrete topology)
< 1294874928 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I want to see documentation that isn't in bed with the /Web part
< 1294874948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ah, so you still don't realise that it's a proof-of-concept
< 1294874952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :essentially
< 1294874952 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so okay now we have the topology of S^Z down, let me try to explain why that d implements it
< 1294874968 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: the point of the /web part is to show why the extended type system is helpful.
< 1294874984 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well first of all, given that d is a metric (i think that's obvious, but should check), it must give us *some* topology on S^Z
< 1294875028 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so all we have to prove is: 1) if B is an open ball in the topology given by d, then there's an open set in the product topology of S^Z that contains it 2) vice versa
< 1294875052 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I am following
< 1294875054 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :__copumpkin__
< 1294875056 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alright
< 1294875071 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now consider such a ball B, it is given by a radius r = 2^{-k}
< 1294875095 0 :__copumpkin__!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :copumpkin
< 1294875103 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's say it's aroung configuration x, now this ball, by the definition of d, contains all y such that x and y agree in the size k neighborhood of the origin
< 1294875114 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or some off-by-one error there, depending on how exactly i defined d
< 1294875130 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't actually matter, but i guess can try to be more precise if you like?
< 1294875174 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(oh and that neighborhood of the origin isn't a topological neighborhood, just an intuitive idea)
< 1294875194 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that the cells of y that are at most k steps from cell 0 must agree with those cells of x
< 1294875245 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is Learn You A Haskell considered decent? I pointed someone to it
< 1294875248 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Someone from class]
< 1294875250 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because otherwise d would be larger, since if x and y disagree in some |j| < |k|, then d(x, y) >= 2^{-j} by definition of d, and that's bigger than 2^{-k}
< 1294875250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes.
< 1294875255 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1294875266 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok
< 1294875268 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where i forgot some ||'s around k and j
< 1294875304 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*d(x, y) >= 2^{-|j|} *that's bigger than 2^{-|k|}
< 1294875352 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i'm waiting for some sort of confirmation, since you gave one such without asking)
< 1294875357 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I think I should write a note on this one
< 1294875361 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a note
< 1294875363 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: for the equivalence proof
< 1294875366 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just mean on a bit of paper
< 1294875370 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :equivalence of what?
< 1294875374 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :d and product
< 1294875404 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean write down the definitions or?
< 1294875618 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant write the whole proof out
< 1294875623 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alright, go for it
< 1294875624 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I don't get stuck
< 1294875686 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean without any input from me? there is really no trick here, so you can certainly do this yourself if you are organized enough not to drown in the details
< 1294875737 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death
< 1294875772 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and remember basic things like intersections of open sets being open...
< 1294875791 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even elliott knows that
< 1294875794 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though
< 1294875799 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that hurts man
< 1294875805 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was just about to say this line:
< 1294875808 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you know that?
< 1294875817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : hey oklopol teach me some maths   okay, so if 2+2=4, then 2+3=5
< 1294875828 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : you following?   eys
< 1294875829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*yes
< 1294875832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : you sure?
< 1294875835 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294875843 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey i once taught you algebra
< 1294875850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : should i prove it to you
< 1294875852 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then you were all like NO MORE, PLEASE GO AWAY
< 1294875861 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i was like :(
< 1294875885 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol how did the proof go
< 1294875907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : well, you see, 2=1+1 (i'll explain why later), so it's 1+1+1+1=4
< 1294875925 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : we can reduce this partially to peano arithmetic, namely, SSSS0 = 4
< 1294875927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : wait
< 1294875930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : what's peano arithmetic
< 1294875936 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ummmm S is like 1+ and 0 is like 0
< 1294875941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : why not just write that
< 1294875945 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ...fuck you
< 1294875948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* oklopol has left IRC
< 1294875953 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294875954 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, fuck you
< 1294875961 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and don't smile at us)
< 1294875978 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION punches oklopol with the power of a thousand punches!
< 1294876005 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still laughing at myself
< 1294876016 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2+2=4 => 2+3=5 only if 3=S2 and 5=S4.  let's define more interesting numbers.
< 1294876054 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: i don't get it, how did you prove that implication
< 1294876076 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to somehow remove the 2
< 1294876080 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from the left sides
< 1294876093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294876098 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like how hilarious this joke at my expense is.
< 1294876105 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* oklopol has joined
< 1294876110 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's a false implication.  i started with P^~P and went from there
< 1294876111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : okay so let's try something simpler
< 1294876115 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD
< 1294876120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : in fact, let's not
< 1294876128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -1*-1 = -1
< 1294876131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : and i can prove it
< 1294876158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -1*-1 = -(1*-1), which is -(-1*1), which is (--1)*1, now --1 = 1, so -1*-1 = 1*1 = 1
< 1294876162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : following me?
< 1294876180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : yes, but i don't see what this has to do with the hairy ball theorem
< 1294876182 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: i see. in a recent exam on ergodic theory, i did a similar thing, and proved everything is an extremal point os any set.
< 1294876182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's
< 1294876183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a punchline
< 1294876185 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something
< 1294876212 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: do you like my cubically valid proof
< 1294876254 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know how the hairy ball theorem is proved
< 1294876262 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i couldn't help you with that
< 1294876268 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehehehehe hair yablabsf
< 1294876271 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ybalbslls
< 1294876273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ballsjfk\
< 1294876319 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah the funny thing about that theorem is is sounds like a guy's low-hangers with hair on them
< 1294876322 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*it
< 1294876334 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and not just the name, the proof is pretty fucking perverted as well
< 1294876386 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the hairy ball theorem? you mean the one that says a vector field on a sphere has at least 2 points of discontinuity?
< 1294876395 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1294876398 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least 1 you mean
< 1294876401 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?
< 1294876410 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is it 2? because it sure looks like 1 is possible
< 1294876416 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1294876420 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait i'm a fucking retard
< 1294876431 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my counterexample had 2
< 1294876459 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so anyway oklopol
< 1294876459 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: but yes, that one
< 1294876463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how can i make a topological database
< 1294876467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a database
< 1294876469 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :based on topology
< 1294876469 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that easy to see?
< 1294876482 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good question
< 1294876505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because uh
< 1294876508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :botte needs that
< 1294876513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :currently my design is just like, based on datalog
< 1294876515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and where's the fun in that
< 1294876520 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you could have the discrete topology, i hear that's the BIGGEST topology of al
< 1294876521 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :l
< 1294876533 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so clearly you'd get *more* stuff out of it
< 1294876565 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: can i have databases be like
< 1294876566 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :balls
< 1294876568 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that i make hair
< 1294876569 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y
< 1294876572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and turn into tori
< 1294876581 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tori?
< 1294876586 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plural of torus
< 1294876587 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :moron
< 1294876589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294876592 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there need not be discontinuities on tori
< 1294876595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait
< 1294876596 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, i know that
< 1294876598 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's actually the plural
< 1294876601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought it was toruses
< 1294876603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD
< 1294876606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was trolling
< 1294876610 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh
< 1294876619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tori is just such a silly word you know
< 1294876663 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know some basic stuff about tori because addition of a constant vector on a torus is one of the basic examples you do in dynamical systems
< 1294876691 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i recently came up with fundamental groups of graphs, although naturally i then found this obvious definition in a paper, stated in a nicer way
< 1294876697 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and
< 1294876707 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tori are the first things you do with fundamental groups
< 1294876710 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because of the groups they give
< 1294876713 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*one of the
< 1294876778 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i could just go to uni, i feel like this is not a very productive use of my important time
< 1294876785 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless j returns
< 1294876803 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it might be productive use of his time at least, since CA are so very very sexy
< 1294876836 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CACACACACACACACACACA
< 1294876842 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's my catchphrase
< 1294876850 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when i roam the street
< 1294876851 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s
< 1294876856 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes i just go all CACACACACACACACACACA
< 1294876916 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: actually i probably couldn't lecture all night, since the first nontrivial thing you usually do about CA is a theorem i actually don't know how to prove :D
< 1294876919 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1294876922 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :injectivity => surjectivity
< 1294876936 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some sort of pigeonhole argument, but i haven't filled in the details, ever
< 1294876941 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION everts elliott's spheres without pinching or poking holes
< 1294876970 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's everting
< 1294877038 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, something you do in a fun, cute, happy game
< 1294877070 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, actually that injectivity => surjectivity thing is really obvious
< 1294877074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you know when you stick your hand up your ass and pull the rest of you outside?
< 1294877077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's eversion
< 1294877077 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't use any topology
< 1294877082 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you do that often
< 1294877105 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, well apart from the fact that if there's a configuration without a preimage, then there's a finite pattern without a preimage, in the obvious sense
< 1294877138 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah it cleanses my body in ways western science just can't
< 1294877146 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1294877148 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :medicine
< 1294877174 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm actually going to go now, before i start proving that theorem
< 1294877185 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that okay?
< 1294877198 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay oklopol I will aks you about this in future thogu
< 1294877232 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go for it
< 1294877247 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Daemon escaped from pentagram
< 1294877273 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or you can just follow our course! http://users.utu.fi/jkari/ca/
< 1294877274 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P
< 1294877301 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294877310 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the lecture notes are pretty good, although topology is used less explicitly, at least in the beginning
< 1294877317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should come visit oklopol and embarrass him at his uni
< 1294877326 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how would you embarrass me?
< 1294877354 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so this one time he was on irc ...
< 1294877357 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294877367 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :repeat 500 times
< 1294877372 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :many people know my irc nick
< 1294877379 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes but they don't know where the logs are
< 1294877381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nor have the patience to read them all
< 1294877383 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose
< 1294877388 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PENIS PENIS PENIS
< 1294877391 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PENIS PENIS PENIS
< 1294877393 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PENIS PENIS PENIS
< 1294877395 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PENIS PENIS PENIS
< 1294877407 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I FEEL SO FREE RIGHT NOW
< 1294877410 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FREE LIKE A FUCKING BIRD
< 1294877415 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :freeee bird
< 1294877418 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now I have to listen to it
< 1294877422 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's that?
< 1294877425 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FREE BIRD
< 1294877425 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but free bird is a terrible song
< 1294877430 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I like it
< 1294877456 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION will be in helsinki on jun 10.  anyone wanna hang out?
< 1294877486 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i could come see you and fizzie at the same time
< 1294877490 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK
< 1294877491 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GUYS
< 1294877495 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :KERNEL HACKING TIME
< 1294877502 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my sync() calls are hanging up
< 1294877510 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is stalling my whole ubuntu
< 1294877531 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION watches another Eversion LP
< 1294877536 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this happened only today only this once when i unplugged a usb drive and plugged in another one
< 1294877545 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe Deewiant as well, but i feel Deewiant is a superior person to me, so i'm not sure that'd be as much fun.
< 1294877546 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: tell me what to do
< 1294877558 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do strace sync and it hangs on this:
< 1294877560 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : " Sgeo, with oerjan and who else?" <<< good morning <-- when, and context?
< 1294877561 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i always think oh Deewiant won't know anything about this thing
< 1294877564 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sync(
< 1294877564 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then Deewiant just like
< 1294877565 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :butts in
< 1294877567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with his superior knowledge
< 1294877568 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so rude
< 1294877570 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is like the last line
< 1294877575 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that thing
< 1294877577 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: tell me how to hax this
< 1294877585 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, screwed up sleep cycles.
< 1294877590 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, ah
< 1294877591 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1294877603 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tests Vorpal for alzheimer's
< 1294877608 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION cannot spell
< 1294877627 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, I slept for a few hours
< 1294877631 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just woke up again
< 1294877641 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is 01:14 here now
< 1294877644 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i tend to assume people remember the context of every line
< 1294877648 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's alzheimer's
< 1294877662 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :irl, i tend to spontaneously continue conversations i've had weeks ago
< 1294877668 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, associated with old people, loss of memory, fatal, Pratchett has it.
< 1294877673 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i dunno, i forgot
< 1294877674 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably spelled incorrectly.
< 1294877679 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: huh?
< 1294877682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: what are you talking about?
< 1294877702 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I hate you.
< 1294877704 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, my grandmother (on my father's side) has it too.
< 1294877709 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Note: Not really]
< 1294877710 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: what? what did i say
< 1294877711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't said anything
< 1294877716 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my grandparents are free from alzheimer's
< 1294877724 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the punchline is they're dead
< 1294877726 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, same here [grandmother on father's side]
< 1294877762 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the last discworld novel had better be fucking awesome
< 1294877772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like if it's shit because of, you know, alzheimer's
< 1294877774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO SYMPATHY
< 1294877788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go out on a bang, asshole.
< 1294877789 0 :Wamanuz5!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1294877797 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, didn't you read it?
< 1294877802 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the last
< 1294877802 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was pretty good
< 1294877803 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, before he dies
< 1294877805 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which will be soon
< 1294877806 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott doesn't read anything
< 1294877811 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm
< 1294877815 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah
< 1294877825 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, now that is not very nice of you
< 1294877836 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what isn't?
< 1294877837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :his condition is deteriorating and he's already said he's going to commit suicide before it becomes too bad, so i'm just being practical here
< 1294877848 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i think he meant the no sympathy thing
< 1294877850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not fair to, like, leave us without tying up all the loose ends and shit with the best novel ever
< 1294877851 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but checked anyway
< 1294877856 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are there any swedes?  i'll be in stockholm that same week
< 1294877860 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1294877864 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal
< 1294877866 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and olsner
< 1294877866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: avoid Vorpal at all costs
< 1294877868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go visit olsner
< 1294877871 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :both would very much like to meet you
< 1294877871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and uh firefly
< 1294877874 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'kay
< 1294877879 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and why do you travel so much?
< 1294877883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal probably treats his house like Mount Vorpal
< 1294877892 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, I'm not even near Stockholm. :P
< 1294877904 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah Vorpal didn't even give me his address
< 1294877905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see, that's good
< 1294877906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go where olsner is
< 1294877918 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aweshum
< 1294877925 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no clue where he lives
< 1294877934 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i travel as much as i can cuz i love travel
< 1294877939 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't matter, just far away from Vorpal most likely
< 1294877940 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, well to be fair I don't have your either (and don't really want it)
< 1294877944 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is what's important
< 1294877955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol's address is- GAK!
< 1294877973 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: should be as easy to avoid vorpal as it is to avoid you
< 1294877976 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i'm not saying you should give it, i'm just saying you're crazily protective of your house
< 1294877993 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: why avoid me i'm amazing
< 1294877997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: sorta like mount vorpal
< 1294878003 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1294878005 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, no.. not really
< 1294878022 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what possible reason could you have for not giving me your address?
< 1294878031 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just gave you my address today, you even asked for it
< 1294878041 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: lay odds on us getting along?
< 1294878043 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, hah not in MC :P
< 1294878051 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: 0, but it's irrelevant, everyone should meet me
< 1294878062 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I DON'T SEE DIFFERENCE
< 1294878066 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: even vorpal?
< 1294878067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: omg where are you in mc
< 1294878069 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you didn't answer, what reason could you have?
< 1294878071 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: yes, so i can kill him
< 1294878087 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, even more reason for me to avoid you :P
< 1294878091 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, uh? me?
< 1294878096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: just Vorpal
< 1294878098 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :won't kill anyone else
< 1294878104 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no I wouldn't
< 1294878108 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i just told Vorpal, since he seemed like a likely person not to do anything annoying, while still keeping the place unseen from the majority so i can be in peace
< 1294878115 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out
< 1294878119 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I get along great with everyone but you and PH.
< 1294878151 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i get along with people who like good beer
< 1294878158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i don't do anything annoying intentionally unless it's to Vorpal :)
< 1294878160 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now it's time for me to go catch a movie
< 1294878166 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes, you!
< 1294878171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: like this one time, i set deewiant's house on fire
< 1294878182 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, oh nice. *bows*
< 1294878184 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294878185 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1294878189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and when i was cleaning it up with lava it made a gigantic cobble monolith
< 1294878192 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: with lava and water inside
< 1294878194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: fun times
< 1294878208 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: that happened when i tried to burn the leaves of a tree away
< 1294878209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with lava
< 1294878213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the leaves kinda drooped over the house a bit
< 1294878215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294878216 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no i mean the question was for you :D
< 1294878216 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would you not me the address!
< 1294878228 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, which question now again?
< 1294878234 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh THAT one
< 1294878235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but uh if you don't let me cut down trees near yours it'll be totally safe
< 1294878236 0 :cheater00!~cheater@g224200114.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294878257 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, well I think you accidentally a verb there
< 1294878284 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, don't trust elliott. He can easily mess up without that
< 1294878291 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yawn
< 1294878296 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there's no magic if i just let everyone come see it every now and then
< 1294878314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i can just use mcmap + a walking bot to find it :)
< 1294878321 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go for it
< 1294878326 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, nice idea
< 1294878336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but why don't we optimise it, together
< 1294878338 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by telling me the result
< 1294878367 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the point is to play the game, not to obtain goals as fast as possible
< 1294878396 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://hpaste.org/42994/dmesg
< 1294878397 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WAT DO
< 1294878424 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1294878434 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, check what 192.168.178.1 does
< 1294878442 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-\
< 1294878452 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm talking about the hanging sync()
< 1294878458 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, why the sysrq stuff in there
< 1294878472 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1294878475 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, kernel version?
< 1294878486 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um
< 1294878519 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copypasting is slow in linux
< 1294878522 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, anything between 2.6.30 and 2.6.35 (inclusive) and I suggest you upgrade. I had sync hanging sometimes during that period.
< 1294878525 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, no it isn't
< 1294878532 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just middle mouse button
< 1294878541 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2.6.32-27-generic #49-Ubuntu SMP Wed Dec 1 23:52:12 UTC 2010 i686 GNU/Linux
< 1294878548 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i'll probably try to upgrade
< 1294878555 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, upgrade to 2.6.36 kernel
< 1294878558 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do i unlock my sync() now?
< 1294878569 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, you reboot
< 1294878583 0 :elliott_!~elliott@91.104.236.154 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294878583 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right, i was gonna leave ->
< 1294878585 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and hope the fs is journaling
< 1294878586 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do i unlock my sync() now without rebooting?
< 1294878591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1294878595 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, you don't. It is a bug in some kernels
< 1294878669 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, just unmount any other file systems
< 1294878670 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: must be some way
< 1294878680 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1294878681 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and remount the ones that couldn't as read only
< 1294878682 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: is there a bug description for this?
< 1294878687 0 :Ilari_antrcomp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1294878697 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, yes, but I don't have a link to it on this machine
< 1294878707 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm sure you're able to find it
< 1294878716 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, no it is on my mail in another computer
< 1294878720 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, also why should I
< 1294878724 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you are that rude
< 1294878732 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why rude?
< 1294878739 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm expressing my belief in your abilities
< 1294878745 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :har har
< 1294878758 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, i'm sure zzo or j-invariant wouldn't be able to
< 1294878769 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as if
< 1294878769 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or oklopol
< 1294878788 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try google yourself
< 1294878791 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can do better than oklopol!
< 1294878801 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i know nothing about the linux kernel
< 1294878827 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i wouldn't recognize the right sites in google
< 1294878839 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, https://bugzilla.kernel.org/
< 1294878841 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have fun
< 1294879010 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, actually it might not be the same bug. Your backtrace looks a bit shorter than I remember mine
< 1294879016 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in which case I can't help much
< 1294879395 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
< 1294879630 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dfsjglfdgjfsglsfgdfg
< 1294879635 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :emacs modes are hard
< 1294879686 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stupid generic-mode only supports three-char comment chars
< 1294879999 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all i want is
< 1294880013 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :colour ~, {, }, :, ., ; specially
< 1294880024 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have a bunch of alternate comment delims up to 6 chars
< 1294880028 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and have an auto-indenter algo
< 1294880030 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THAT SO HARD?
< 1294880189 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1294880396 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :elliott
< 1294880400 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host
< 1294880400 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294880403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION designs a text edito
< 1294880403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :r
< 1294880443 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f/(\w+) (\w+)\(/r{$1'\n'$2'('}
< 1294880485 0 :Ilari_antrcomp!~user@2002:5870:38d7:1:20e:a6ff:fe6f:2288 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294880519 0 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:38d7::1 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294880624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_Ex `find -name \*.[ch]`/{_Op f/(\w+) (\w+)\(/r{$1'\n'$2'('}_Wr _Cl}
< 1294880680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION waits for Sgeo to call him crazy
< 1294880858 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's _Ex?
< 1294880864 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Execute.
< 1294880876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :` is an arbitrary char; you could use % there too.
< 1294880877 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ex %ls%
< 1294880888 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am _NOT_ doing all that next time I omit a letter from a line
< 1294880893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What?
< 1294880902 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That has nothing to do with omitting a letter from a line.
< 1294880903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That changes
< 1294880905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :int foo(blah)
< 1294880907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C prototypes into
< 1294880908 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :int
< 1294880909 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo(blah)
< 1294880914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from all C files in the current dir
< 1294880915 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and children
< 1294880921 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why?
< 1294880927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it's an example.
< 1294880991 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I see it stemming from the grand J tradition of being unreadable
< 1294880997 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION gets shot by elliott
< 1294881018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not even vaguely related to J.
< 1294881021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's more similar to ed and teco
< 1294881029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, unreadable for you maybe
< 1294881038 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i find c# unreadable
< 1294881072 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output.
< 1294881118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: you could easily write that line more readable and clearer. but, err, it's an editor
< 1294881120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who indents editor commands
< 1294881141 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will be offline for much of Friday
< 1294881165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_Ex `find -name \*.[ch]` / {
< 1294881165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  _Op
< 1294881165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  f/(\w+) (\w+)\(/
< 1294881165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  r{ $1 '\n' $2 '(' }
< 1294881165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  _Wr
< 1294881165 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm sure that makes you happy
< 1294881166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  _Cl
< 1294881167 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :}
< 1294881205 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't.. understand it, but if I read about it, it would be comprehendible
< 1294881220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: _Ex is just execute shell command obviously
< 1294881227 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/ is infix operator for "each in list"
< 1294881231 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_Op = open; _Wr = write; _Cl = close
< 1294881234 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm... Wonder what is failure rate of 6to4 return paths...
< 1294881243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f/regexp/ is "find (and, implicitly, select) all matching strings"
< 1294881249 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :r{ ... } is "replace with result of this block"
< 1294881250 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(of course, any failure there is stupid...)
< 1294881255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$1, $2 are your standard regexp () group values
< 1294881257 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's all there is to it
< 1294881262 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah
< 1294881289 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are f and r always together like that?
< 1294881294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No.
< 1294881300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also useful is f/foo/ d.
< 1294881303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To delete all instances of foo.
< 1294881315 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But r is meaningless without a preceding f?
< 1294881318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f/foo/ a... would add stuff after all instances of foo.
< 1294881328 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It operates on the current selection. So you could select, e.g., an arbitrary range in the file instead.
< 1294881340 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Note: You can have N selections at a time; all these operations act on /every/ selection.)
< 1294881344 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah
< 1294881344 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is modelled after sam.
< 1294881352 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ed's graphical successor)
< 1294881618 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Anyway modelling dream editors on TECO is good enough for Mark Chu-Caroll so it's good enough for me.
< 1294881621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :His is actually implemented though.
< 1294881623 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Carroll
< 1294881673 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION colds on chat
< 1294881678 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: What.
< 1294881683 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm cold
< 1294881715 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm in a bit of a happy mood ight now. Deespite being cold
< 1294881718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :P.S. my f/foo/r/bar/ is MCC's g/foo/,{r'bar'}.
< 1294881743 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, where MCC's g comes from is obvious, but why the {}?
< 1294881761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For grouping, presumably.
< 1294881763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :His is more like a foreach.
< 1294881774 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah
< 1294881786 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mine isn't a loop, it just holds multiple selections. Like Schrödinger's editor.
< 1294881798 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed:
< 1294881800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :global: g/pattern/,block
< 1294881800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A simple loop construct. For each match of the pattern within the current cursor, execute the block. So, for example, to do a global search and replace of foo with bar, * g/foo/,{r'bar'}.
< 1294881803 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Less powerful than my notion.
< 1294881868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MCC's has factorial:
< 1294881869 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  fun ($x) @fact {($x,0)@= ? {1} : { ($x, ($x,1)@-@fact)@* }
< 1294881874 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which would be, uh, slightly uglier in mine.
< 1294881934 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :S's cat's editor?
< 1294881938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What?
< 1294881946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh.
< 1294881967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_Set [_Fact] {_Eq $1 0 ?'1' :{I don't even want to write this bit}}
< 1294881979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That just sets _Fact to a string naturally.
< 1294882245 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder what i should impl botte in
< 1294882398 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Courtesy of Notch's incompetence, enjoy minecraft.jar for free: http://s3.amazonaws.com/MinecraftDownload/minecraft.jar
< 1294882412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am fairly sure that anyone can download that URL without supplying the S3 auth token.
< 1294882424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You also require:
< 1294882430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://s3.amazonaws.com/MinecraftDownload/lwjgl.jar
< 1294882430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://s3.amazonaws.com/MinecraftDownload/jinput.jar
< 1294882430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://s3.amazonaws.com/MinecraftDownload/lwjgl_util.jar
< 1294882433 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://s3.amazonaws.com/MinecraftDownload/linux_natives.jar.lzma
< 1294882580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: hi
< 1294883130 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, o.O
< 1294883136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ?
< 1294883180 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's useless without some trick to avoid having to log in, I think
< 1294883394 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :SamuelBeckett
< 1294883403 0 :SamuelBeckett!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :augur
< 1294883503 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: umm, easy
< 1294883507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: just log in with invalid uname/pass
< 1294883516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: or non-purchased one
< 1294883524 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: plus, no, that's launcher.jar
< 1294883529 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless something changed since the al.. ah
< 1294883529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :running minecraft.jar will do everything
< 1294883532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :online servers won't let you in of course
< 1294883538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since they check with minecraft.net
< 1294883540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless they're modded not to
< 1294883548 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a windows_natives?
< 1294883635 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: presumably.
< 1294883645 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those are all free-to-download sorta thing
< 1294883649 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not protected with auth token in download logs
< 1294883662 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: in fact if you run classic in-browser i think you will see it being downloaded
< 1294883689 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : http://s3.amazonaws.com/MinecraftDownload/linux_natives.jar.lzma <--- what, is it that open?
< 1294883703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: linux_natives.jar.lzma is downloaded even by the classic client.
< 1294883713 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay what about minecraft.jar then
< 1294883715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The thing is that minecraft.jar is downloaded like ?user=ehird&auth=...
< 1294883720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I curl -I'd it without those
< 1294883726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it had the same file length and 200 OK response :P
< 1294883744 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how did you find this out?
< 1294883746 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep, downloading it now.
< 1294883758 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It prints out the URLs it downloads when it updates.
< 1294883766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just decided to cut off the params and see what happened.
< 1294883768 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh there is an update out?
< 1294883779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. And since this is a new OS installation I was running it from cmd line.
< 1294883787 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah. What is new this time
< 1294883794 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ubuntu.
< 1294883798 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1294883803 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so no actual update out?
< 1294883811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ wget http://s3.amazonaws.com/MinecraftDownload/minecraft.jar
< 1294883812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott@elliott-MacBookAir:~$ diff minecraft.jar .minecraft/bin/minecraft.jar
< 1294883812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott@elliott-MacBookAir:~$
< 1294883814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Notch quality engineering.
< 1294883816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Indeed.
< 1294883889 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, as notch pointed out, this *is* in fact awesome: http://kotaku.com/5729340/you-can-now-bring-the-real-world-to-minecraft/gallery/
< 1294883927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would so tweet that URL but fanbois would yell at me for being an evil pirate scumbag fuckwit, Notch would fix it quickly (probably badly) and likely FROWN UPON me or something, and nobody would win.
< 1294883941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Instead, I will just link the files to anyone I recommend Minecraft to, to save them the effort of pirating an old version.
< 1294883955 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah
< 1294883959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Also, I linked that in here yesterday.
< 1294883966 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I didn't see it
< 1294883967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, the original source, not Kotaku blogspam.
< 1294883975 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, where is the original source?
< 1294883995 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good question, Kotaku are very good at hiding that... Gawker scumbags...
< 1294884001 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.orderofevents.com/MineCraft/KinectInfo.htm
< 1294884004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :From the bottom of their sidebar text.
< 1294884014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, the other side is apparently concave.
< 1294884020 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is DISTURBING
< 1294884032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I'd take a photo of something very, very red
< 1294884033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*red.
< 1294884038 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except it'd come out as Netherstone...
< 1294884039 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294884041 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*NetherRACK
< 1294884052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*NetherACK
< 1294884079 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it really netherack?
< 1294884099 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dunno :P
< 1294884254 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is a windows_natives
< 1294884274 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm ... hyper with excitement
< 1294884284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make sure to rm bin/version :P
< 1294884289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also... no comment.
< 1294884296 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Note: I don't mean sexually]
< 1294884308 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sexadfawefuhawr
< 1294884311 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-shutup- Shut up about sex!
< 1294884335 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Factoracto
< 1294884340 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As I said, it's broken :P
< 1294884358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That bug was weird. But I'm not restarting it until I decide that it won't hurt me.
< 1294884364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And that service system hurts me.
< 1294884403 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, we all know that shutup's source is updog
< 1294884403 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog?
< 1294884414 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, by the power of rampant speculation.
< 1294884460 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the bug where updog doesn't distinguish between msgs to the channel and to it hurts you even more
< 1294884460 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog?
< 1294884496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hurt, with pain.
< 1294884509 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : That bug was weird. But I'm not restarting it until I decide that it won't hurt me. <-- what bug
< 1294884524 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, something to do with sex, apparently
< 1294884524 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It triggered on "sex" when it was not, in fact, intended to.
< 1294884535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The shutup code is ... kinda tailored for perversity.
< 1294884543 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you accidentally trigger on sex?
< 1294884545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I refuse to code bots in any sane kind of manner.
< 1294884563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: By fitting a words-to-include formula to the data of past things you've said.
< 1294884564 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I think the bug where updog doesn't distinguish between msgs to the channel and to it hurts you even more <-- hah
< 1294884564 0 :updog!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's updog?
< 1294884584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e., decide what words to filter on, make an algo that goes through all your past said words and uses the frequency to decide which ones to keep,
< 1294884589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and fit the latter so that it produces the former.
< 1294884595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I blame you for skewing the results.
< 1294884630 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it will be a while before it triggers on Alluded-To?
< 1294884641 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, Alluded-To?
< 1294884655 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Katie Alluded-To Female.
< 1294884660 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Katie A.T. F. for short.
< 1294884663 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh the "she"?
< 1294884665 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes.
< 1294884674 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, nothing wrong with having a girlfriend
< 1294884685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is she not alluded-to?
< 1294884694 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and what is wrong with that
< 1294884695 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, that was invented far before the term girlfriend could be even vaguely applicable.
< 1294884704 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: somehow i cannot quite recall Sgeo talking that much about sex in the past
< 1294884710 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you should make the bot tell yourself to shut up about @ btw
< 1294884721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i rarely talk about @
< 1294884722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is awesome though
< 1294884723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: did you not read? it's not based on direct frequency
< 1294884741 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well obviously or it would trigger on "the" :D
< 1294884742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i rigged the input to the algo so that it came back with almost the word list i wanted
< 1294884754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because sanity is frankly boring
< 1294884767 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah
< 1294884773 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has to be fairly deliberate for fantasies
< 1294884776 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: maybe you have just algorithmically proved that Sgeo _is_ obsessed with sex, then.
< 1294884781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did add some special-casing.
< 1294884781 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fantasy
< 1294884785 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah
< 1294884793 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I am a brilliant visionary and a scientist.
< 1294884804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I graciously accept this Nobel Prize.
< 1294884848 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but the Nobel Prize is Swedish. How can you not look down on it.
< 1294884849 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION IRC-bookmarks http://code.google.com/p/gnuemacscolorthemetest/
< 1294884855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: so is olsner and he's p. coo
< 1294884864 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just 90% of you suck
< 1294884869 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, "p. coo"?
< 1294884873 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty coo'
< 1294884875 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what about Firefly?
< 1294884882 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well sure but he rarely talks or anything
< 1294884885 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also 90% of *everything* sucks
< 1294884889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :beholdmyglory is also swedish i think
< 1294884895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, yes, but 90% of the remaining 10% of sweden sucks
< 1294884905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sweden applies sturgeon's RECURSIVE law
< 1294884910 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah
< 1294884911 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically only epsilon% of sweden doesn't suck
< 1294884917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :easily provable
< 1294884935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sucks = 90% + 90% of 10% + 90% of 10% of 10% + 90% of 10% of 10% of 10% + ...
< 1294884953 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, we got the joke
< 1294884954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow the emacs themes are ugly
< 1294884959 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, wai
< 1294884964 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's the same thing as 100%
< 1294884965 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :emacs has themes?
< 1294884969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: thus epsilon%
< 1294884972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: color-theme-select
< 1294884975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're all fairly hideous
< 1294884978 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, 99.9999999..... = 100
< 1294884982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was this nice one i used once...
< 1294884988 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: swat Sgeo plxkthz
< 1294884994 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is that M-x?
< 1294885000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes
< 1294885001 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, because I have no color-theme-select
< 1294885007 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what emacs version?
< 1294885012 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. 90% of everything that sucks sucks.
< 1294885015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 23, you may have to require 'color-theme
< 1294885015 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: i think elliott is using non-standard analysis
< 1294885020 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe it has a u
< 1294885026 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah
< 1294885031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: non-standard analysis doesn't exactly give 99.99999... != 100 :D
< 1294885051 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: details!
< 1294885067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: proof that they are all pretty bad: http://gnuemacscolorthemetest.googlecode.com/svn/html/index-c.html
< 1294885075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also http://gnuemacscolorthemetest.googlecode.com/svn/html/index-tex.html http://gnuemacscolorthemetest.googlecode.com/svn/html/index-el.html
< 1294885077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for different languages
< 1294885089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :el one is probably best
< 1294885091 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since the code is the prettiest
< 1294885098 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arjen looks decent
< 1294885108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it doesn't
< 1294885113 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, standard emacs  are quite okay
< 1294885123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most of these look like some colourblind kid slapped random colours together without thinking
< 1294885135 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bharadwaj Slate must die
< 1294885141 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The rest look decent
< 1294885142 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mostly
< 1294885163 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Bharadwaj Slate must die <-- yeargh yesx
< 1294885164 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes*
< 1294885178 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pages.cs.wisc.edu/~psilord/blog/28.html this is the ideal of syntax highlighting
< 1294885180 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also blue sea, blue mood
< 1294885182 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so on
< 1294885182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't like the specific colours he used
< 1294885185 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bharadwaj sounds indian and everyone knows indians are colorblind
< 1294885193 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i generally prefer dark-on-beigey-esque-stuff
< 1294885193 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but
< 1294885195 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Late Night.
< 1294885201 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :his use of colour theory is very relevant
< 1294885202 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seriously. Dear God Why. Late Night.
< 1294885203 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everyone should read that post
< 1294885212 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the end result is really great, ignoring the absolute colours
< 1294885220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you look from a slight distance you can really see the balance it creates
< 1294885233 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if only every language had fans so dedicated to write such colourers for them :)
< 1294885286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: late night is one of the better ones.
< 1294885289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a bit too low contrast
< 1294885295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, at least, it isn't a mess of colours
< 1294885303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shading > colours usualy
< 1294885305 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*usually
< 1294885343 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : http://pages.cs.wisc.edu/~psilord/blog/28.html this is the ideal of syntax highlighting <-- extremely interesting
< 1294885389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i might do that for haskell sometime
< 1294885393 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh, white on black
< 1294885397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: as i said
< 1294885400 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not the actual colours that matter
< 1294885405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the design of the whole thing
< 1294885407 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, I mean
< 1294885410 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to read that
< 1294885416 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :disable css :p
< 1294885420 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i agree it sucks
< 1294885432 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just don't get why people insist on doing that shit
< 1294885442 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people haven't quite realised that with an lcd, backlight-on on backlight-off = lightbulb
< 1294885450 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with crts it wasn't quite the same
< 1294885452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and light-on-dark was ok
< 1294885459 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but on lcds it's godawful
< 1294885531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: can you write a lazy parallel specialiser for me?
< 1294885535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in x86-64 assembly?
< 1294885535 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope
< 1294885535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks
< 1294885540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would be great
< 1294885543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on my desk by monday
< 1294885554 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder if anyone's ever done work on parallel specialisation
< 1294885559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION adds it to the phd thesis topic ideas list
< 1294885562 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Light-on-dark is bad? Huh?
< 1294885567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yes.
< 1294885570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: On LCDs, yes.
< 1294885574 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How so?
< 1294885582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: The background, and the gaps in the letters, get (almost) no backlight. So they're like looking at, you know, a wall.
< 1294885587 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Whereas the letters are lit brightly.
< 1294885594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: The result is that they shine like a lightbulb.
< 1294885612 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Your backlight level is almost certainly set too high.
< 1294885617 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: The best is off-black on, e.g., a medium beige: not black-on-lightbulb, but not lightbulb-on-black.
< 1294885624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Sure. But even with a lower backlight you get similar things.
< 1294885634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The fact is that it's little-tiny-lines-of-light-on-no-light and that just ain't nice.
< 1294885659 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ugh, white on black <-- yeah should use light grey on black
< 1294885663 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ALSO considering probably most of the web is dark-on-light, it's horrible because when you move away from light-on-dark, your eyes explode.
< 1294885663 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like the terminal
< 1294885668 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: lol
< 1294885674 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :off-white on white
< 1294885680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grey1 on grey2
< 1294885689 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pink on purple
< 1294885690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :braille on random sea of braille
< 1294885691 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's best
< 1294885694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^^ NO THIS IS BEST
< 1294885702 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha i'm gonna go around trolling blind people
< 1294885705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Hey, what does this say?"
< 1294885717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg
< 1294885723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone render "has anyone ever been so far as ..." in braille
< 1294885729 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm going to put it on a random door in the high street
< 1294885735 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, your monitor has insufficiently backlight bleeding :P
< 1294885735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294885737 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should sleep now
< 1294885738 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Black on PLUGE black on a TV.
< 1294885740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :before i get any better ideas
< 1294885743 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1294885819 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night again
< 1294886194 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out
< 1294886198 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haha... NASA produces heavy launcher design and notes "However, to be clear, neither Reference Vehicle Design currently fits the projected budget profiles nor schedule goals outlined in the Authorization Act”. Translation: It will take horridly long and be horridly expensive.
< 1294886275 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thanks to those pork-barrel politicans, US manned spaceflight program is effectively dead...
< 1294886292 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294886352 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah; as soon as the shuttle's done, that's it.
< 1294886362 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No more US manned spaceflight, barring a miracle.
< 1294886371 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But remember: we're number one!
< 1294886557 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Basically, only Russia and China are capable of manned launches...
< 1294886566 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(to orbit)
< 1294886671 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought there was something about private companies?
< 1294886718 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And manned moon landing... Hasn't been possible for any space agency for 30 years...
< 1294886726 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(actually more)
< 1294886773 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: There are private companies that would *like* to have a manned launch capacity.
< 1294886784 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm.
< 1294886912 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. SpaceX is actually *working on* a manned orbital launch vehicle.
< 1294887057 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Their rocket has successfully launched a module into orbit.
< 1294887072 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Saturn V-23(L)... Now that would have been crazy device. 5 uprated F-1s (F-1A)... PLUS 4x2 F-1As in form of 4 extra boosters...
< 1294887245 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. It was, in fact, a fully functional cargo vehicle they launched. As soon as NASA is satisfied, it will be launching to the ISS.
< 1294887507 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And too bad none of the "Nova" rockets was ever built...
< 1294887622 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nor any nuclear-powered rockets...
< 1294887666 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And I mean more like NERVA than ORION)
< 1294887737 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :c0pumpkin
< 1294887864 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Idonno, something about contracting to private companies to go to space seems enormously appropriate, we just need to somehow convince them that it's worth it ...
< 1294889509 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My dad accidentally threw out the melatonin
< 1294889520 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was planning on sleeping tonight
< 1294890190 0 :c0pumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :copumpkin
< 1294890237 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_accidentally_
< 1294890240 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?
< 1294890533 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He was cleaning out the medicine closet, and didn't realize the melatonin was mine, I guess
< 1294890809 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My dad just gave me a Benadryl
< 1294891023 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should work
< 1294891044 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um that's not for sleeping is it
< 1294891050 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(says wikipedia)
< 1294891068 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not.  but it has a pretty pronounced drowsiness side effect
< 1294892972 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is a cooler place, kobnhavn or amsterdam?
< 1294893040 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :amsterdam because it actually exists
< 1294893500 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294893647 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copenhagen or denmark man, be straight with me
< 1294893651 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*amsterdam
< 1294893652 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry
< 1294893658 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :two conversations at once
< 1294893715 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the other conversation got a *copenhagen?
< 1294893750 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure
< 1294896544 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It appears that Copenhagen is, but only by 1-2 degrees centigrade.
< 1294896550 0 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-19-45.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294896563 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1294896619 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: ...
< 1294896665 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1294896707 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Well, just going by Wikipedia's relatively limited climate information.
< 1294896831 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O KAY
< 1294896947 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@61.251.165.38 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294897129 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah *good*.
< 1294897182 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :George Hotz's lawyer has, in SCEA v. George Hotz; Hector Martin; Cantero; Sven Peter; and Does 1 through 100, argued against the claim of jurisdiction and the claim that the defendants are somehow acting in concert.
< 1294897289 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In short: unless SCEA can demonstrate that a court in California has jurisdiction over people in: California, New Jersey, Sweden, and various unknown countries in Europe, *and* that the defendants are, in fact, a single group, acting in concert, this case ought to be thrown out soon.
< 1294897347 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As the only reason for the California court to have jurisdiction would be if *all* defendants had agreed to the PSN terms of service, and as George Hotz is in no way acting together with fail0verflow, I expect SCEA to need to file a new case.
< 1294897412 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :His attorney apparently specialises in defending against the RIAA's P2P lawsuits.
< 1294897571 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wonderful
< 1294897727 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, good. Groklaw's following this case.
< 1294897749 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... SCO IS STILL GOING‽‽‽
< 1294898202 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, SCEA?
< 1294898361 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sony Computer Entertainment of America.
< 1294898369 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which, incidentally, is in Delaware.
< 1294898415 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1294898419 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, yeah, they're suing in a state that neither they *nor* their defendants are in, soley because the PSN terms say "you agree to be under the jurisdiction of (some court in California)".
< 1294898448 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not entirely sure that clause even *works* outside of the US.
< 1294898488 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well. It certainly doesn't *effectively* work outside of the US; after all, a non-American can just tell US courts to fuck off and die in a fire.
< 1294898489 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294898513 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're not getting fucking extradited for a civil matter.
< 1294898642 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, if they are not in that jurisdiction that clause shouldn't work
< 1294898764 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Most of the defendants are not in the jurisdiction of *any US court*.
< 1294898908 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1294899245 0 :acetoline!~acetoline@125-237-12-196.jetstream.xtra.co.nz JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294899381 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :has anyone figured out whether they're suing specifically the named people as constituting fail0verflow, or those plus anyone else who happens to be affiliated with f0f?
< 1294899394 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or not suing
< 1294899397 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you know what I mean
< 1294899435 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they mention does 1 through 100
< 1294899476 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: They are suing *specifically* fail0verflow.
< 1294899494 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of which they happen to know four members as named?
< 1294899497 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but potentially more?
< 1294899501 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes.
< 1294899503 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see
< 1294899516 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, *three* members as named.
< 1294899527 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh?
< 1294899529 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :George Hotz is not a member of fail0verflow.
< 1294899536 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are four others
< 1294899538 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And, in fact, has *no* connection to them at all.
< 1294899542 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know :P
< 1294899545 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hector Martin; Cantero; Sven Peter.
< 1294899546 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's 3.
< 1294899549 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :segher
< 1294899554 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's an alias.
< 1294899556 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hector martin cantero is one person
< 1294899567 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bushing is another
< 1294899578 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bushing is an alias.
< 1294899581 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, I know
< 1294899589 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They only named real names.
< 1294899609 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then listed the aliases for people that will be included in "Does 1 through 100".
< 1294899621 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the documents included plenty of mentions of bushing and segher
< 1294899627 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fair enough
< 1294899636 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what other aliases are in there?
< 1294899661 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think there were others; they are merely presuming that there are an unknown number of other members.
< 1294899666 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see
< 1294899682 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With "1 through 100" as shorthand for "however many of them there are".
< 1294899698 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :makes sense
< 1294899773 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it'll be interesting to see how this goes
< 1294899879 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I imagine that Geohotz and Bushing will have trouble from this.
< 1294899907 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everyone else can just mock our insane legal system.
< 1294900000 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://s-hphotos-ash1.fbcdn.net/hs796.ash1/168654_482257016845_714011845_6503407_4647200_n.jpg :-}
< 1294900860 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: are you an actual variable, or one of those stupid fp/math that can't actually change their value?
< 1294900869 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ones that
< 1294901279 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, I'm truly variable
< 1294901621 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least some of the time
< 1294901704 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, yes - when I'm about to be shot, mutilated, or otherwise modified I become const
< 1294901818 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294901854 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know if DVItype has been published in a book? Do you know what would be the proper bibliography citation for it?
< 1294901934 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, what format?
< 1294901946 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MLA ? Chicago ?
< 1294901989 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: I am using Vancouver format.
< 1294902002 0 :Zuu_!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294902009 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION doesn't know that one
< 1294902015 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1294902023 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know MLA6, MLA7, and, APA
< 1294902031 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Chicago
< 1294902035 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know of APA
< 1294902073 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know the citation for it, in any format?
< 1294902094 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, its a website - right?
< 1294902105 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: No.
< 1294902122 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, what is it and I'll try to tell you
< 1294902130 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both the book I am citing and the book I am aking are both computer programs.
< 1294902171 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Online or bought (boxed) ?
< 1294902200 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is a file on my computer, I do not know if it has ever been published in a book.
< 1294902212 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm - its source code?
< 1294902236 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have both the source file and the DVI file.
< 1294902250 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, Last, First. Software Name. Vers. A.b.c. Company Name, 1887. Computer software.
< 1294902253 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in MLA
< 1294902277 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1887 is the year of creation
< 1294902341 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, remove "Vers. A.b.c" if you don't know   remove the "Company name" AND date published if it wasn't previously published
< 1294902365 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not know if it was published.
< 1294902390 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, then just use Last, First. Software Name.
< 1294902401 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note the trailing .
< 1294902404 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The program TeX and METAFONT are published (I have the books), but this program DVItype I do not know (it is related to TeX, though)
< 1294902406 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(again - this is MLA style)
< 1294902472 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, years ago I wrote a program to automatically generate this for me :-}
< 1294902487 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do have "(Version 3.6, December 1995)" and "The preparation of this report was supported in part by the National Science Foundation under grants IST-820 1926 and ..."
< 1294902487 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may rewrite it in Haskell or something - and then publish it
< 1294902499 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.pa.msu.edu/~aaronson/alitest/aintro.html what are your alignments guys?
< 1294902528 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, D&D alignment test - heh
< 1294902549 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i came up True Neutral
< 1294902554 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION looks
< 1294902602 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :These things are written on the table of contents page of DVItype
< 1294902618 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, I'm not very familiar with govt. works
< 1294902625 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd venture to guess that it is
< 1294902656 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, Last, First. Software Name. Vers. 3.6. Computer software.
< 1294902940 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, i only did the first 15 questions: Alignment: True Neutral
< 1294902960 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool
< 1294903260 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Latest figures: APNIC pool is at 39 886 592 IPs. 3.0M-8.0M remain to estimated allocation thresholds...
< 1294903266 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have done a few D&D alignment tests, with some different answers on each one, I have gotten NG, CG, and CN.
< 1294903296 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: I think it is not government work. Donald Knuth wrote DVItype.
< 1294903332 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, you play D&D - curious
< 1294903397 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also invented some spells and feats and stuff for D&D game.
< 1294903426 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, as in official or homebre?
< 1294903429 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*homebrew
< 1294903448 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Just my own spells/feats. But I use the official ones, too.
< 1294903449 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes ot look how large is APNIC IPv6 pool... :-)
< 1294903457 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, heh - same here :-}
< 1294903535 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My character is ettercap. My brother's character is human ninja. There are also some NPCs in the party, one of which is otyugh and the others humans.
< 1294903588 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And almost every one of my actions in the game is strange.
< 1294903663 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :82 339 124 917 091 486 660 901 601 422 606 336  addresses (99.1% of a block).
< 1294903752 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, wrt mcmap: it could be some off by one error. Even when you edit further down you sometimes get errors. Not corruption like near max alt, but sometimes if you edit just below the top block that edit show up as top on mcmap surface view when it shouldn't
< 1294903822 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The first page of DVItype is numbered 402, so it seems it might have been a part of some book.
< 1294903836 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, for example I placed a lightstone below an ironblock at altitude 73 and it showed up as a lightstone on mcmap. However it is not reliably reproducible, even in that one spot. Things like that happen every now and then. But far from always.
< 1294903934 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have read that it is not allowed to place something in the public domain. But does it apply in Canada? Is it allowed in Canada to make something public domain?
< 1294903972 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And why is it disallowed?
< 1294904259 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The reason why public domain might be disallowed is possibility of coercion...
< 1294904337 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I think)
< 1294904355 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: Do you have example?
< 1294904930 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got algorithm to make plurals working, but can you check to see if there are omissions or anything else wrong with my file?
< 1294905259 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, depends on the country
< 1294905272 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most countries follow the Berne convention
< 1294905313 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which basically states: "author gets all the rights except if he gives them away (and a bit of fair use like things)
< 1294905362 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the closest one could get to placing something in the public domain is by providing an irrevocable, transferable, license to everyone
< 1294905387 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the "public domain" is made up by some countries which states that certain types of things don't have a copyright owner
< 1294905406 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IE the federal government in the US, and works over X years from the author's death
< 1294905599 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended
< 1294905600 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294905716 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can I make something in the public domain by dictating the US government to write it down exactly as I said?
< 1294905757 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Of course this is completely impractical, I am asking if it is possible/legal)
< 1294905787 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that depends whether you use legal means for "incentivizing" them to write what you say.
< 1294905837 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe you can sneak things into public domain by getting them recorded as part of some court proceedings.
< 1294905856 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it legal for someone to sue themself?
< 1294905881 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not sure, but you could have an accomplice there.
< 1294905904 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can I get something into the public domain by suing myself over the document I wish to make public domain?
< 1294906032 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have read somewhere that the DMCA allows Sony to sue themself, I do not know whether or not this is true.
< 1294906371 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"While the copyright of the play Peter Pan, or the Boy Who Wouldn't Grow Up by J. M. Barrie has expired in the United Kingdom, it was granted a special exception under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988 (Schedule 6)[33] that requires royalties to be paid for performances within the UK, so long as Great Ormond Street Hospital (to whom Barrie gave the rights) continues to exist."
< 1294906374 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't that a bit strange?
< 1294906429 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yes it is a bit strange, I think.
< 1294906578 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, erm
< 1294906592 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Disney has a perpetual copyright on mickey mouse IIRC
< 1294906598 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, suing oneself is not possible
< 1294906605 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in the US)
< 1294906625 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Do you know if in Canada, it is permitted to put something into public domain?
< 1294906655 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, I would highly doubt it - but I know little of Canadian law
< 1294906655 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think Disney's copyright is just a "de-facto" seems-to-be-extended-all-the-time thing, not something that's actually perpetual.
< 1294906668 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am also not a lawyer and I do not give legal advice
< 1294906705 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But are you a doctor and can the above be construed as medical advice?
< 1294906709 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, strictly speaking its some insanely long term that congress keeps on extending (there was a supreme court case about the constitutionality of this) but its close to perpetual
< 1294906712 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, no.
< 1294906726 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(its sad that I feel I must answer the question seriously)
< 1294906737 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: I am not expecting proper legal advice.
< 1294906747 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nor am I expecting proper medical advice.
< 1294906774 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, public domain is basically things that fall outside of copyright law
< 1294906792 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in most countries its not really possible to put something in PD
< 1294906875 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could just die and then wait a century or so.
< 1294906929 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess if you actually wait a full century, you don't even need to die.
< 1294906945 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, no - its 100 yrs after author death
< 1294906952 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"95 years from publication or 120 years from creation whichever is shorter (anonymous works, pseudonymous works, or works made for hire, published since 1978)"
< 1294906963 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Life + 70 years (works published since 1978 or unpublished works)"
< 1294906968 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what I meany
< 1294906969 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Says Wikipedia's US table.
< 1294906970 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :70 yrs
< 1294906971 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not 100
< 1294906978 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but if you publish it anonymously.
< 1294906990 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, actually - after doing some research (read: google) there is some common law about suing yourself
< 1294907048 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What if I add the following text to the beginning of the document: "This license is secret and its author is not permitted to read/use it, unless it is part of a court case in which case it is public domain. The license conditions end here; what follows is an appendix." and then somehow sue myself over it........
< 1294907070 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, one of my get rich slow schemes is to publish different works under 10 different names forecasting different financial outcomes in a few yrs. Then when one comes true reveal myself as the author of that work and write a new one that I sell for lots of money
< 1294907093 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, you could try to go to congress and get it read there
< 1294907109 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and even if it were criminal you couldn't get prosecuted over it)
< 1294907115 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :France in the table: "Life + 70 years [...] + 30 years for all works if the author died on active service".
< 1294907191 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Why couldn't get prosecuted over it?
< 1294907239 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does the DMCA actually permit Sony to sue themself or is that something that someone else made up?
< 1294907281 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Sony" is composed of so many parts that I'm sure they could find some separate corporations to interfight.
< 1294907447 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, one can't be prosecuted for something said/done in the course of a Congressional hearing IIRC
< 1294907454 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm looking for the exact provision now
< 1294907504 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, "They shall in all Cases, except Treason, Felony and Breach of the Peace, be privileged from Arrest during their Attendance at the Session of their respective Houses, and in going to and returning from the same; and for any Speech or Debate in either House, they shall not be questioned in any other Place."
< 1294907518 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Article I Section 6
< 1294907528 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that only applies to members
< 1294907662 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, the idea was to prevent the president from having legislative members arrested before voting
< 1294907676 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION misremembered the clause
< 1294907776 0 :myndzi\!myndzi@c-24-19-39-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294907825 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is AWAY
< 1294907909 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :    \o/   \m/ \m/   \o/
< 1294907910 0 :myndzi\!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :    |     `\o/´     |
< 1294907910 0 :myndzi\!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :    >\      |       |\
< 1294907910 0 :myndzi\!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :           /´\
< 1294907910 0 :myndzi\!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         (_| |_)
< 1294907967 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1294907984 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Project Gutenberg says you can release your own work into public domain by writing a note; this contradicts the description about the WTFPL. And anyways this is for United States. I live in Canada.
< 1294908762 0 :myndzi!myndzi@c-24-19-39-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294908989 0 :myndzi\!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1294909181 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ilua
< 1294909362 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have idea, I have thought to make a program that converts a ESC/P file for Epson dot-matrix printers into DVI format.
< 1294909695 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1294909830 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://dilbert.com/strips/comic/2011-01-13/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:+DilbertDailyStrip+(Dilbert+Daily+Strip)&Page=2
< 1294909839 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a human spammer?
< 1294909840 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o.O
< 1294911195 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1294911500 0 :Warmage!~user@78.100.187.110 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294911515 0 :Warmage!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :?
< 1294918261 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I have idea, I have thought to make a program that converts a ESC/P file for Epson dot-matrix printers into DVI format. <-- I wonder why this would ever be useful
< 1294918463 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps he has a large amount of documentation or something in the form of ESC/P files.
< 1294918594 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure what my dot-matrix printer used; it might have been partially compatible, but not very. I do have some conversion programs from raster graphics to that, for image-printing.
< 1294918608 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh
< 1294918616 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, for DOS?
< 1294918661 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, just something you can run a .png through and then 'lp' it out a raw printcap entry or something. I think this was pre-CUPS.
< 1294918674 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1294918714 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Speaking of which, I looked at the C1x static asserts; the format is _Static_assert(constant-expression, string-literal), and the semantics are that if constant-expression equals zero, "the implementation shall produce a diagnostic message that includes the text of the string literal". And  defines static_assert to _Static_assert.
< 1294918718 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rather straight-forward.
< 1294918739 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm
< 1294918768 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but rather more limited than D's static asserts then?
< 1294918780 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what those are like.
< 1294918827 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I seem to remember they looked rather interesting when reading ccbi2 source
< 1294918832 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't remember how
< 1294918840 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, btw where did you find the c1x draft?
< 1294918909 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it's at http://www.open-std.org/Jtc1/sc22/wg14/www/docs/n1547.pdf -- don't quite remember where I got the link, it's not directly on the WG14 front page, but maybe it's in there deeper somewhere.
< 1294918927 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ISO working group web pages tend to be a bit unstructured and confusing.
< 1294918954 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh indeed
< 1294918974 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, anyway, open-std? Isn't that POSIX related?
< 1294918991 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They have quite a lot of stuff there.
< 1294918998 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah indeed
< 1294918998 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Including the posix workin group page.
< 1294919015 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"WG11 - Binding Techniques" I wonder what on earth that is
< 1294919045 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also the phrase "Programming languages and, operating systems" looks terribly strange to me. The comma specifically.
< 1294919048 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"how to make specifications independent of programming languages, and then apply these specifications to the programming languages" -- sounds a bit SWIGgy.
< 1294919080 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it's not, really.
< 1294919106 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? that comma was much less out of place to me
< 1294919119 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(if that was what you were trying to imply)
< 1294919132 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I just meant the binding stuff is not very SWIGgy after all.
< 1294919135 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1294919145 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The C standard includes some sort of a "binding" to their "language-independent math" thing.
< 1294919170 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh
< 1294919263 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and C1x thread functions have a naming scheme that's a bit on the ugly side; all thread functions/macros/whatever are thrd_foo, mutexes mtx_foo, and condition-variable stuff cnd_foo.
< 1294919286 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Purely as a guess I think they didn't want to have too many namespace conflicts for people who already were using the full words.
< 1294919300 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, uh do they still have the 8 letter identifier thingy?
< 1294919306 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, if so I guess that is why
< 1294919328 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The names themselves are definitely longer than that, and wasn't it already 31 letters also for external names?
< 1294919337 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh perhaps
< 1294919343 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it used to be 8 somewhere
< 1294919384 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"31 significant initial characters in an external identifier"
< 1294919391 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was in C90, at least, IIRC.
< 1294919398 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1294919448 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though re those 31, "each universal character name specifying a short identifier of 0000FFFF or less is considered 6 characters, each universal character name specifying a short identifier of 00010000 or more is considered 10 characters, and each extended source character is considered the same number of characters as the corresponding universal character name, if any"
< 1294919486 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh...
< 1294919499 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why those specific boundaries
< 1294919501 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So if you use only Unicode characters outside the BMP (say you're programming in old turkic), you're only guaranteed three significant characters.
< 1294919510 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah
< 1294919526 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sounds like they just thought "okay, no-one can be weird enough to use multibyte encodings longer than *this*, can they?"
< 1294919558 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, it isn't like any mainstream implementation actually cuts off at that 31 char limit anyway
< 1294919606 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, no. (Also you're guaranteed 63 characters in internal identifiers, and there even Unicode chars count as just one.)
< 1294919638 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :again I doubt any compiler actually cuts off there
< 1294919725 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C1x also adds u8"foo" UTF-8 string literals, and u"foo" / U"foo" Unicode wide-character (of type char16_t / char32_t, corresponding to UTF-16 / UTF-32, respectively) string literals, and a  header for conflaburating in-between things.
< 1294919791 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've seen people assume that wchar_t numbers correspond to Unicode code points before; it's I guess nice to have something that in actual fact always does.
< 1294919872 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, or at least "always does if __STDC_UTF_16__ / __STDC_UTF_32__ are defined", which you can compile-time test easily.
< 1294919941 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, they don't. iirc they are usually 16 bits
< 1294919958 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(wchar_t that is)
< 1294919969 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no clue what wchar_t actually corresponds to though
< 1294919992 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure how comfortable-to-use the C1x Unicode support is, since they haven't added anything into the stdio formatted-output functions for that.
< 1294920030 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hopefully they will add that
< 1294920063 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's going to be somewhat messy if they keep the existing "w-stuff" and then add even more "u-stuff" on top.
< 1294920166 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt they would drop the w stuff
< 1294920175 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :will*
< 1294920200 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, no. But they might not go through all that complexity to add in the u-stuff.
< 1294920220 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm the bounds checking stuff looks interesting
< 1294920246 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, these GCC-4.4  parts that pertain to wchar_t are a bit amusing: http://p.zem.fi/wchar
< 1294920301 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's like someone's trying to figure out how many ways you can put "wchar" and "t" together for a header-inclusion guard macro name.
< 1294920307 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh
< 1294920357 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, is this from somewhere in bits/ ?
< 1294920366 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait, GCC?
< 1294920383 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/usr/lib/gcc/x86_64-linux-gnu/4.4/include/stddef.h in my machine.
< 1294920392 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought GCC just provided limits.h and stdarg.h
< 1294920406 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/* Why is this file so hard to maintain properly?  In contrast to
< 1294920406 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :   the comment above regarding BSD/386 1.1, on FreeBSD for as long
< 1294920406 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :   as the symbol has existed, _BSD_RUNE_T_ must not stay defined or
< 1294920406 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :   redundant typedefs will occur when stdlib.h is included after this file. */
< 1294920411 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The writer seems somehow depressed.
< 1294920424 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah
< 1294920432 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The "comment above" was a bit longish to paste.)
< 1294920496 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/* In case nobody has defined these types, but we aren't running under
< 1294920496 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :   GCC 2.00, make sure that __PTRDIFF_TYPE__, __SIZE_TYPE__, and
< 1294920496 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :   __WCHAR_TYPE__ have reasonable values.  This can happen if the
< 1294920496 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :   parts of GCC is compiled by an older compiler, that actually
< 1294920496 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :   include gstddef.h, such as collect2.  */
< 1294920508 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any time I take a peek inside, I'm surprised that these things actually for the most part do work.
< 1294920561 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah
< 1294920570 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why GCC 2.00?
< 1294920573 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/* snaroff@next.com says the NeXT needs this.  */   /* Irix 5.1 needs this.  */   /* This avoids lossage on SunOS but only if stdtypes.h comes first.  There's no way to win with the other order!  Sun lossage.  */
< 1294920693 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh
< 1294920728 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what sort of lossage?
< 1294920738 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know, and the writer doesn't specify.
< 1294920790 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, also "stdtypes.h" sounds suspect. I thought the C standard reserved that prefix
< 1294920865 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On the topic of "perverse systems": apparently there are some Crays on which size_t is a 32-bit type, as are most pointers, with the exception of "void *"s and "char *"s, which are 64-bit types. (This was in the context of how likely stuffing a pointer into a size_t is to break, as opposed to using uintptr_t which is guaranteed to work but of course only if you actually have uintptr_t and proper .)
< 1294920876 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, the bounds checking stuff seems confusing in c1x
< 1294920904 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what about a signed intptr_t?
< 1294920931 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that too should work, I just wanted to be consistent and use an unsigned type since size_t is one.
< 1294920951 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1294920959 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ssize_t
< 1294920980 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I always found that one highly suspect
< 1294920993 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is a bit iffy, yes.
< 1294921010 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, anyway isn't intptr_t/uintptr_t XSI or something? My man page for stdint.h indicates that
< 1294921043 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They are at least C99 types, though optional.
< 1294921048 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm
< 1294921053 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since the machine in question simply might not have integers large enough.
< 1294921064 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294921077 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But those Cray boxes do have a 64-bit integer too, it's just that size_t isn't one of them for some interesting reason.)
< 1294921109 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, it constantly amazes me that C didn't end up supporting ternary systems
< 1294921208 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C1x seems to keep the C99 restriction of "it must be either sign-magnitude, one's-complement or two's-complement, not some sort of freaky weird integer encoding".
< 1294921419 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, it is interesting how C99 caused POSIX to restrict CHAR_BIT to exactly 8. IIRC with the restrictions C99 introduced and the old restrictions POSIX had on it, the only possible choice was exactly 8
< 1294921686 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mhm, right; that seems to follow from the fact that C99 mandates CHAR_BIT >= 8, and since intN_t must be exactly N bits with no padding or fluff, sizeof(int8_t) must always be 1, and POSIX mandates int{8,16,32}_t.
< 1294921734 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something like that yes
< 1294921815 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm those bounds checking functions seem rather weak
< 1294921841 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where does it say that intN_t has to take up N bits of space?
< 1294921857 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: "The typedef name intN_t designates a signed integer type with width N , no padding bits, and a two’s complement representation."
< 1294921864 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alright
< 1294921869 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, is that C or POSIX?
< 1294921884 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it was the C1x draft, but I do think it's the same in C99.
< 1294921886 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assumed C
< 1294921888 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1294921895 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I had that handily open.)
< 1294921923 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, isn't stdio functions with the _s suffix some sort of silliness that MSVC invented?
< 1294921942 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The "_s for safe"? Yes, I at least thought those were Microsoft things.
< 1294921952 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, they seem to be in the C1x draft
< 1294921953 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294921958 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :snprintf_s in particular seems utterly silly
< 1294922014 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"snprintf_s is equivalent to snprintf, adding run-time constraints that restrict format from being null, n being less than zero and less than RSIZE_MAX."
< 1294922054 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RSIZE_MAX... why on earth
< 1294922087 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm happy with gcc's __attribute__ to warn me about mismatching format strings and null pointers. It works and seems far more useful than that
< 1294922092 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"ISO/IEC TR 24731-1 recommends that RSIZE_MAX be defined as the smaller of the size of the largest object supported or (SIZE_MAX >> 1), even if this limit is smaller than the size of some legitimate, but very large, objects."
< 1294922160 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god, there is gets_s
< 1294922187 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they recommend fgets rather than it
< 1294922206 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294922207 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems a bit funny.
< 1294922230 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it is tragic
< 1294922243 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gets_s reads lines, fgets reads strings.
< 1294922246 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does the bounds-checking, but "maintains a one-to-one relationship between input lines and successful calls to gets_s. Programs that use gets expect such a relationship."
< 1294922268 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :memcpy_s looks utterly pointless as well
< 1294922273 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why would any program use gets? Isn't that the dangerous function/
< 1294922283 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Many programs do dangerous things.
< 1294922310 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really they should have added strlcpy and strlcat, that would have been way more useful
< 1294922361 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, strcpy_s's buffer-size parameter is at least the sensible one.
< 1294922390 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is indeed an improvement
< 1294922422 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also they seem to be reasonably consistently so that there's always the destination buffer and it's size.
< 1294922453 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for memcpy it seems utterly pointless however
< 1294922495 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's there so that you don't forget to do the check yourself, I guess.
< 1294922503 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or to catch it if you do it wrong.
< 1294922539 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems a lot more annoying to use than gcc's and glibc's stuff.
< 1294922550 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it doesn't even do as much
< 1294922565 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no format check for format strings as far as I can see
< 1294922586 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :memset_s seems utterly stupid
< 1294922634 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the "gcc's and glibc's stuff" that's equivalent to these
< 1294922708 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, well -D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=2 does a good job, plus various __attribute__s like nonnull, format, whatever-the-name-was-for-the-one-that-warns-if-you-throw-away-return-value and so on
< 1294922744 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the fortify source one is closest to this, and is transparent. I believe Ubuntu has it on at level 1 by default
< 1294922823 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Evidently at 2
< 1294922831 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CompilerFlags#-D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=2
< 1294922838 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, also for gcc, it can sometimes turn it into a compile time check when optimising
< 1294922842 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than a runtime check
< 1294922870 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is done with various weird __builtin_foo() functions
< 1294922885 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That can be done with the _s functions as well, depending on their implementation.
< 1294922926 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, true, but they aren't done transparently. Requires more work
< 1294922951 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, they require less work of compiler writers. :-P
< 1294922981 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, and they still won't give you a warning if doing something like printf("Error: %s (%d)\n", 42, "Generic error");
< 1294922984 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :memcpy_s() { if (I don't like your parameters) { abort() or whatever; } else return memcpy(); }
< 1294923006 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd prefer proper "here we actually know the buffer length" checks over "let's put some stuff behind the buffer and see if it gets overwritten" checks.
< 1294923012 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, but that's again difficult.
< 1294923018 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, but a lot more useful
< 1294923045 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's also a QOI issue and not something that (well, arguably) should be in a language standard. :p
< 1294923048 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure I agree: if printf fails it's at least almost always obvious
< 1294923062 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If memcpy fails it might just corrupt some unrelated data
< 1294923067 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, the latter is still useful. But that isn't what _FORTIFY_SOURCE does afaik. -fstack-protector does that
< 1294923105 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it doesn't do that, I don't see how it could even theoretically check for buffer overflows for a dynamically allocated buffer.
< 1294923139 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, but what about memset_s then. Most probably the most common use for it is to zero fill a buffer. You pass it a pointer, a buffer length, a value to fill with, and how much to fill
< 1294923158 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most of the time people probably use memset to fill an entire buffer
< 1294923172 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least an entire buffer after an offset (in case of realloc or such)
< 1294923196 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in which case the two lengths will equal each other. Are you going to write two different code paths for them?
< 1294923215 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you feel yourself writing memset_s(buf, max, 0, max), maybe you could then just consider writing memset(buf, 0, max) in that particular row?
< 1294923238 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though I guess then you won't get the null-pointer runtime constraint checks.
< 1294923265 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, sure. I'm just trying to point out that in general these _s variants seem fairly laughably stupid. Possibly with the exception of strcpy_s.
< 1294923279 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or strcat_s?
< 1294923286 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So far only memset_s seems a bit silly
< 1294923288 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haven't looked at that one *does so*
< 1294923295 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, gets_s too
< 1294923302 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gets_s is fine.
< 1294923310 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, and snprintf_s
< 1294923313 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gets_s is fine if you really don't feel like bothering to actually handle long lines.
< 1294923317 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's what gets should've been in the first place.
< 1294923395 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, okay strcat_s seems reasonable
< 1294923414 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :snprintf_s is another one that just does sensible checks that snprintf should've done, but can't now because of backwards compatibility
< 1294923431 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, the null pointer thing?
< 1294923474 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No null target or format string, no %n, no null arguments to %s
< 1294923498 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :%n shouldn't have been there in the first place
< 1294923502 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not sure what an "encoding error" is for sprintf, that may be sensible as well
< 1294923554 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :From what I can tell, the aim here would be that instead of doing something like  assert(buf != NULL); assert(arg != NULL); snprintf(buf, n, "foo: %s", arg);  you get a runtime-fail-at-least-sort-of-nicely behaviour with just  assert(snprintf_s(buf, n, "foo: %s", arg) >= 0);  or some-such. (A bit contrived example, but anyway.)
< 1294923576 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, wait, does the checking depend on NDEBUG?
< 1294923576 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-6-17.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294923580 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if so that is awful
< 1294923582 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the "you can't pass buffer sizes that span more than half the address space" seems fairly reasonable too, at least by default
< 1294923583 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, no.
< 1294923600 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was meaning an always-on assert here. :p
< 1294923618 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, that depends. Though I doubt anyone will be insane enough to use this on an embedded system anyway
< 1294923626 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least not the tiny ones
< 1294923630 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like said, by default
< 1294923654 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems like a good default, but it should be overrideable
< 1294923695 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be better to add saner strings instead
< 1294923713 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pascal style: 
< 1294923714 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or such
< 1294923772 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Atomo reminds me a little of Factor
< 1294923926 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl
< 1294925102 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The stack-smashing protection seems to still have this old data leak problem too: http://p.zem.fi/memcpy.c
< 1294926046 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, err. What happened there
< 1294926098 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, also uh, doesn't look like a major issue that it reports the new value. Aids in debugging certainly
< 1294926109 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Those values are my own printfs.
< 1294926127 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then what is the data leak?
< 1294926156 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the fact that the "you smashed the stack" error message will blindly follow the new overwritten argv[0] value, and print it out.
< 1294926170 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If this were a suid-something program, you could use that to read out anything in its address space.
< 1294926172 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1294926177 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm indeed
< 1294926222 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here I've just read out the "SECRET DATA" string which I could pick from the executable, or just read from /proc I guess, but it's more problematical for suid executables that, say, read out /etc/shadow in memory, then after that have a (exploitable) buffer overflow somewhere.
< 1294926255 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm indeed
< 1294926310 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, it's an old thing, there's at least one mail about it in Apr 2010 on the full-disclosure mailing list; and I guess it's possible it's already fixed, I'm not exactly using the latest tools here at work.
< 1294926741 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1294926781 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294927593 0 :cheater99!~cheater@g229031211.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294927648 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MY COMPUTER HUNG UP AND I DIDN'T REBOOT IT IMMEDIATELY
< 1294927655 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MY LIFE IS BEGINNING TO SHATTER
< 1294928587 0 :Wamanuz5!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294928679 0 :acetoline!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1294931075 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :sebbu
< 1294931314 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"mkdir: cannot create directory `misc': No space left on device" -- that's always a nice thing to get from the "project work" filesystem.
< 1294932263 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001f5b00390f-CM001e6b2335dc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294932314 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1294932331 0 :cheater00!~cheater@e181136121.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294932366 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, quotas?
< 1294932381 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : MY COMPUTER HUNG UP AND I DIDN'T REBOOT IT IMMEDIATELY <-- do you have a hardware watchdog?
< 1294932386 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, just a 3.7 terabyte NFS share that is full.
< 1294932390 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hah
< 1294932398 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They keep talking about implementing quotas, though.
< 1294932404 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think home directories already have some.
< 1294932422 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I'd like a "hilbert's SSD".
< 1294932429 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :     Filesystem  blocks   quota   limit   grace   files   quota   limit   grace
< 1294932430 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :                  2277M   4096M   4096M           21218   4295m   4295m
< 1294932438 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, there is a home directory quota.
< 1294932442 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4G, I guess.
< 1294932445 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh
< 1294932477 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should probably clean ~ some day, since there should be mostly code, documents and stuff like that in there.
< 1294932547 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: what would you do with it?  it's unlikely you'll ever have an infinite amount of data arriving at once.
< 1294932583 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, yes but even if you have a finite amount you will always have space for it
< 1294932630 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also you don't ever need to erase data, so the SSD write-cycle-durability thing shouldn't be an issue.
< 1294932659 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, and in the unlikely event that someone gives you a full HilbertFlashCard you can always copy it all to the SSD
< 1294932673 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(note: you need a good data bus for this)
< 1294932685 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, that too
< 1294932696 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, except hm you do need to move data, don't you?
< 1294932706 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait I guess it remaps that
< 1294932729 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you restrict yourself to getting only finite amounts of data, you can always just append.
< 1294932758 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, that seems like a rather arbitrary limitation
< 1294932789 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, those realistic assumptions always seem so arbitrary
< 1294932798 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294932939 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suspect seek times would get ridiculous if you need to retrieve data at infinity though
< 1294932948 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, on an SSD?
< 1294932958 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, they don't have seek times
< 1294932974 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they do if they're infinite
< 1294932994 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the time for the address to get mapped to the correct location and the data to return
< 1294932995 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, besides there is no point infinity. Hilbert's hotel iirc deals with potential infinities
< 1294933020 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is an infinite amount of wiring needed there and the signal has to travel at the slow slow speed of light
< 1294933037 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, hm true
< 1294933044 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My Pandora shipped.
< 1294933048 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TO THE WRONG ADDRESS.
< 1294933052 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mail forwarding, don't fail me now.
< 1294933059 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes i know, but imagine retrieiving data from the following sequence of addresses: 2,4,8,16 etc.
< 1294933059 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, unless we just keep halving the size forever
< 1294933066 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, then it can fit into a finite space
< 1294933081 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after a while each successive bit will take enormously long time to arrive
< 1294933097 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, in fact you can do that in two minute. Half it after 1 minute. Half it after another half minute, then 15 seconds, and so on
< 1294933109 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then after 2 minutes you fitted it all into an infinitely small disk
< 1294933139 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :infinitely small?  you mean infinitely fine-grained resolution?
< 1294933158 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose that works, but requires some creative manipulation of physics locally
< 1294933172 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, well duh :P
< 1294933229 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I feel tempted to shout "Don't open that box!"
< 1294933241 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yeah, it's a poor name :P
< 1294933265 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is a pandora again?
< 1294933281 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linux-based game system.
< 1294933292 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how many games does it have?
< 1294933298 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so far I mean
< 1294933305 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zero, or thousands if you include emulators X-P
< 1294933309 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah
< 1294933330 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, can it run bsnes? I bet pikhq will ask you about this anyway
< 1294933337 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I'm saving time by asking you now
< 1294933344 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably, it can emulate a PSX ...
< 1294933355 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But if you really want to run bsnes, you're a durp :P
< 1294933363 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, "durp"?
< 1294933364 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.
< 1294933372 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, hm that sounds rather impressive. What are the specs? And what about battery life
< 1294933375 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Asking what a durp is is such a durp question to ask.
< 1294933380 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh is it like those super-awesome handheld gaming things they have on thinkgeek for hundreds of dollars?
< 1294933397 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://openpandora.org/
< 1294933400 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :using google's "define:" I get "No definitions were found for durp."
< 1294933473 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, looks nice. Was it made with reprap? ;)
< 1294933561 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :holy shit
< 1294933565 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's got everything
< 1294933568 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P
< 1294933578 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, except a keyboard large enough to use
< 1294933583 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: That's 'cuz it's expensive :P
< 1294933598 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, is it li-ion?
< 1294933608 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it's a fucking handheld gaming platform.  wtf do you want a keyboard for?
< 1294933608 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Donno :P
< 1294933609 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Specwise the hardware is really close to my phone. (Which is also 600 MHz Cortex-A8 ARM + TI 64x DSP + PowerVR SGX530 GPU with a 800x480 touchscreen. Of course the phone's keyboard is really not-for-gaming.)
< 1294933632 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, hm. chatting in minecraft or something ;)
< 1294933684 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: work on your texting speed.  you can type surprisingly fast with your thumbs with practice
< 1294933724 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, depends. Not like I text very often.
< 1294933741 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4-5 SMS / week? Something like that
< 1294933763 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, also I fail to see how it would help with that gaming console
< 1294933765 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i irc on my phone. i'm not as fast as keyboard yet, but working on it
< 1294933774 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a keypad is very different from a qwerty layout
< 1294933781 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, you have to practice on the gaming console obviously
< 1294933799 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohhhhhhhhhhh you don't have a qwerty keyboard on your phone
< 1294933801 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i see
< 1294933816 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, I use phones until they break :P
< 1294933870 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, besides if I can't use it with gloves on it isn't worth the money. And resistive touchscreens seem to be getting rare.
< 1294933917 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, you live in a place where you can't get by with thin gloves, don't you
< 1294933938 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, indeed. I use very thick ones when it is -20 C outside and blowing hard. And snowing.
< 1294933947 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in any case, my qwerty keyboard has actual buttons
< 1294933951 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :buttons are nice
< 1294933952 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That happened a few weeks ago. Had to use phone to check bus schedule
< 1294933962 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The physical keyboards don't tend to be large enough for gloveing either.
< 1294933975 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tend to just poke at the on-screen keyboard if it's too cold out there.
< 1294933977 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: agreed.  best to have fingerless mittens in that case
< 1294933980 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, indeed. You can manage keypad if you are careful
< 1294933990 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, that is not really an option around here
< 1294934015 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it is an option anywhere!  fingerless mittens are the greatest thing ever!
< 1294934016 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Don't get an iPhone, they blow up at <0 degrees C and Apple's warranty only covers use in 0-35 degrees C. (There was a case in Norway.)
< 1294934030 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hah
< 1294934034 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perfect finger coverage when you need it, no hassles when you don't!
< 1294934037 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I wouldn't get one anyway
< 1294934070 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because droid >>>>>>>>>> iphone
< 1294934089 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, yeah and maemo >>>>>>>>>>>>>> droid
< 1294934098 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maemo's pretty much dead now. :p
< 1294934108 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well meego then?
< 1294934110 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Will see how it goes with MeeGo, right.
< 1294934206 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're setting up some sort of a "community firmware update" repository thing for Maemo, since you can't (easily) update packages that are classified as "system" packages from the normal community repositories, and there are quite a few bugfix-patches existing for the system packages too.
< 1294934207 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is meego better than droid?  what carriers does it work with?
< 1294934234 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The whole "what carriers does it work with?" thing is something I just never get. Around here the iPhone is the only thing that is ever carrier-locked.
< 1294934234 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, how would the carrier depend on the phone OS?
< 1294934242 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, that makes no sense
< 1294934278 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Welcome to the US.
< 1294934279 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you buy a phone. Then you buy a SIM card. Then you combine the two.
< 1294934281 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, stop calling it "droid"
< 1294934287 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i judge a phone by the hardware first, the carrier second, and the OS third
< 1294934303 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, well we have no clue since things are not generally carrier locked around here
< 1294934312 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Vorpal refuses to understand how phones work in the US. It's not that he can't, he chooses not to.
< 1294934316 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: i'm referring to the motorola droid and droid 2.  that's their official name.
< 1294934333 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Oh, since Vorpal was comparing it to maemo I thought we were talking about Android :P
< 1294934334 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, ah I thought you meant "android"
< 1294934380 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, anyway if you want a specific phone look at n900 (maemo). Don't think meego is in any phone yet, but it is the successor to maemo
< 1294934445 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, Android rules :P
< 1294934448 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MeeGo is sort of a hybrid of Maemo and Intel's Moblin. (And I'm a bit doubtful as to how well it'll go.)
< 1294934552 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah the n900 looks roughly equivalent to the droid in terms of hardware
< 1294934556 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, too much java
< 1294934564 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maemo is more gtk (yay)
< 1294934568 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not REAL Java X-P
< 1294934570 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ew gtk
< 1294934578 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, iirc meego is qt
< 1294934579 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure
< 1294934668 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ANYWAY, Pandora.
< 1294934668 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hopin' I actually get mine.
< 1294934683 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wanted to write ZEE for it, but have no story/photo person >_>
< 1294934702 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, isn't zee js?
< 1294934706 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it should work on there
< 1294934730 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, I mean it was the possibility of the Pandora being a nice platform for it that led me to want a Pandora :P
< 1294934739 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(In part)
< 1294934762 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah
< 1294934777 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My Eternally Stalled Project *sigh*
< 1294934824 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Android schmandroid: isn't it so that even on those supposedly "open" phones you have some sort of "jailbreaks"?
< 1294934847 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, that's a function of the manufacturers, not Android itself
< 1294934864 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also MeeGo is now Qt instead of GTK.
< 1294934865 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: On the actually "open" phones you don't, the ones that you have to "jailbreak" don't claim to be open.
< 1294934879 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: However, unlike iPhone, you don't have to jailbreak to run custom software.
< 1294934885 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, how many are open then
< 1294934894 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Only the "developer" ones.
< 1294934911 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i.e. ones bought directly via Google.
< 1294934924 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, so in practise they are all closed?
< 1294934944 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes. But a closed Android phone is nowhere NEAR as restricted as a closed iPhone. It's not even a valid comparison.
< 1294934962 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, but it is closed compared to an n900!
< 1294934973 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fair enough *shrugs*
< 1294934993 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know how hard it is to root an android phone
< 1294935000 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, depends on the phone
< 1294935002 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the N900 is closed compared to openmoko.
< 1294935005 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, what about compiling a custom kernel?
< 1294935007 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but developer phones are already rooted
< 1294935021 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, developers effectively get root
< 1294935029 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with non-developers, it varies
< 1294935034 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The point is not "how hard", it shouldn't be necessary at all.
< 1294935044 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, indeed
< 1294935069 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294935070 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you buy hardware it should be yours. And it should be up to you what you do with it
< 1294935080 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is true, but the apps that depend on rooting target a very small portion of the market, so they are unlikely to change that.
< 1294935110 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: For the iPhone, it's basically Apple douchebaggery. For Android, it's mainly around preventing arbitrary /apps/ from getting root, and not giving random-idiot-user the idea that there is such a thing.
< 1294935120 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, oh right, they don't even come with a proper native userland.
< 1294935157 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :N900 comes with an xterm in the app menu.
< 1294935167 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here's the problem: Propose a solution that would allow developers to root without putting total morons in possible jeopardy (keep in mind that morons will click "yes" and put in their password for any reason)
< 1294935168 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :awesome
< 1294935196 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, n900 seems to have managed without major issues
< 1294935203 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: n900 has no users.
< 1294935207 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it does have a unixy filesystem with all of the unixy programs you'd expect though.  you can throw a shell on it right off and start doing unixy things.
< 1294935213 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, fizzie uses it
< 1294935221 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Like I said.
< 1294935238 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm a nobody?!
< 1294935250 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compared to average joe user, yes
< 1294935259 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, seems like that nasty evil Gregor thinks so
< 1294935261 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are not a significant demographic
< 1294935280 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You're not a USER, people who actually know how the OS works are 0.000000001% of the target market.
< 1294935354 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if computers were cars, almost no one would pass the driving test.
< 1294935397 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Most people who use computers without full knowledge don't end up hitting someone with their computer and killing them.
< 1294935421 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, quite, they end up sending a lot of spam
< 1294935461 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Also, the vast majority of drivers in the US couldn't tell you what a transmission is.
< 1294935465 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294935483 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :driving a car doesn't require you to know how to do an oil change, as sad as that sounds.  there are people you can pay to do it for you
< 1294935492 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Maemo forums are full of real users. (Complaining about Nokia selling them this confusing... thing.)
< 1294935493 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, do you mean not tell how it works, or do you mean how to use it?
< 1294935528 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I mean if you said "Does your car have a transmission?", they would say "Durrr, what's that?"
< 1294935543 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure if vast majority would say that
< 1294935554 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably a good number of folks with automatics would
< 1294935564 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but people with sticks probably have some idea
< 1294935564 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Which is ... everyone in the US :P
< 1294935568 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, but uh, do they not know how to change gear?
< 1294935600 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: see previously line about automatic transmission
< 1294935600 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Manual gearshifts are a slim minority of power-users and mocked sports-car-morons in the US.
< 1294935606 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least here the driving exam is on manual transmission
< 1294935618 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heck you hardly ever see automatic transmission around
< 1294935623 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, now it seems like everything's going to CVTs...wonder how long it will be
< 1294935626 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Why is that "at least"? I don't know how to drive a manual, that doesn't make me a bad driver.
< 1294935654 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, at least as in "at least in this part of Europe, but I don't know about other parts of it"
< 1294935700 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, I fail to see where I implied automatic is bad (except it is less fuel efficient iirc)
< 1294935728 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, CVT?
< 1294935736 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"at least" -> "to suggest that you have to be at least a little bit competent," :P
< 1294935755 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vorpal: you know.  those things without discrete "gears".
< 1294935759 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;P
< 1294935768 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, at least = anyway
< 1294935778 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, says google. It can have many meanings.
< 1294935790 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X-P
< 1294935796 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tbf, i did read it gregor's way at first
< 1294935816 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is a very ambiguous phrase
< 1294935821 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, hm that CVT interesting. How does that work internally I wonder.
< 1294935829 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: MAGIC.
< 1294935833 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: see howstuffworks article
< 1294935842 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it explains 3 or 4 different types of CVT
< 1294935847 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, I was actually checking wikipedia
< 1294935890 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :National Hat Day (USA) is January 15th
< 1294935892 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Discuss.
< 1294935929 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suspect that everything that doesn't need immense amounts of torque and speed simultaneously will eventually be on CVTs in the next half-century or so.  They seem much more fuel-efficient than "modern" transmissions
< 1294935944 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294935953 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: oh goody.  i have just the hat.
< 1294935996 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DISCUSSION INSUFFICIENT :P
< 1294936055 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :regarding the number which nobody noticed between three and four: I have managed to take a solved rubicks cube and twist it into an unsolvable state
< 1294936055 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, hm indeed. I suppose you can manually override them for when the road conditions need different gear? Or I guess computers can detect such nowdays
< 1294936132 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, ... what
< 1294936132 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep.  automatic traction control
< 1294936143 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, I presume most cars have that?
< 1294936150 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure
< 1294936151 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since it is likely to be needed quite often
< 1294936164 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, then certainly people will know what transmission is
< 1294936170 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :less often than you'd think around here.  this weather is the exception, not the rule
< 1294936183 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, I'm sure there are parts of US where that is not the case
< 1294936205 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even here in Indiana where it snows all winter, the roads are plowed well enough that you never need to even use chains.
< 1294936206 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alaska comes to mind. But even in northen mainland US...
< 1294936243 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, plowing doesn't help when you get rain which freezes as it hits the ground.
< 1294936248 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Last winter I drove an automatic Toyota Echo from Oregon to Indiana and never had to set the gear manually X-P
< 1294936254 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Salting does.
< 1294936305 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, only when it doesn't get cold very quickly after. This happened last week or so here. Dropped from -1 C with rain to -20 C in a few hours (rain stopped when it went below -3 C or so)
< 1294936315 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, no time to pour salt on every small street
< 1294936328 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sand helps to some degree
< 1294936341 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and salt doesn't work when it is really cold
< 1294936376 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you've just reduced the affected population of the US to near-zero.
< 1294936388 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, I can't say that sort of weather is common here
< 1294936406 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but this winter and the one before have been extreme
< 1294936422 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The six people in Minnesota who have experienced such weather were simply snowed in :P
< 1294936442 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, what about Alaska?
< 1294936452 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They fly or walk, driving is much less common there.
< 1294936480 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The southern part of Alaska is more temperate, and the rest isn't accessible by road.
< 1294936532 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm
< 1294936608 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, I guess they could use snowmobiles or similar. They are popular in the extreme northern parts of Sweden
< 1294936610 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although yes, I'm sure that those who drive know damn well how to drive a manual :P
< 1294936657 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't know how to drive an automatic. Manual I know.
< 1294936676 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think it's possible to not know how to drive an automatic. You could learn in thirty seconds.
< 1294936690 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vorpal: a lot of people in AK don't drive all winter i hear.  that's what their bushplanes are for :P
< 1294936725 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, well getting a pilot cert is a lot more complex than a driving license :P
< 1294936747 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: If you live in Alaska, you have one. (OK, that's a bit of an exaggeration, but not as much of one as you think)
< 1294936752 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :being an AK resident is a lot more complex than a driver's license too
< 1294936786 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, how many pedals do you have in an automatic? The usual three?
< 1294936794 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote  vorpal: a lot of people in AK fly    quintopia, well getting a pilot cert is a lot more complex than a driving license :P    being an AK resident is a lot more complex than a driver's license too
< 1294936796 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, everyone in AK are close friends with each other anyway.  hell, they can see russia from their front porch :P
< 1294936798 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No clutch.
< 1294936825 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :266)  vorpal: a lot of people in AK fly    quintopia, well getting a pilot cert is a lot more complex than a driving license :P    being an AK resident is a lot more complex than a driver's license too
< 1294936828 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, how do you prevent rolling backwards if you are starting uphill then?
< 1294936870 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That's what your fancy automatic transmission is for.
< 1294936877 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, it just doesn't happen
< 1294936900 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :idling speed gives you a little bit of forward momentum all the time
< 1294936904 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's always engaged
< 1294936931 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, so what if you want to stand still, say, waiting for traffic to pass before crossing a major road? Brake down?
< 1294936936 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep
< 1294936944 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :keep the brake down or put it in neutral
< 1294936945 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or put it in park if you're there for very long.
< 1294936961 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, sounds like it would take more time to start driving from that
< 1294936974 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why?
< 1294936987 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't have to shift first
< 1294936994 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just move your foot to the other pedal...
< 1294936999 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, nor would you with a manual transmission
< 1294937025 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: All you have to do is LIFT your foot from the brake to start moving forward.
< 1294937026 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you would just release the clutch more than the equilibrium point. Since you would be in the first gear
< 1294937035 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes well
< 1294937043 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, hm true. About the same then
< 1294937045 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you also have to do a lot of work to get up to speed after that
< 1294937055 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, with manual? Not really.
< 1294937062 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, it comes naturally after all
< 1294937068 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :once you learnt it
< 1294937081 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so does the automatic...naturally as in...you don't do anything :P
< 1294937094 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still.  CVTs.  way of the future.
< 1294937105 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, yes they sound interesting indeed.
< 1294937424 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, question: would you rather have to start a process by pressing 5 buttons in quick succession and then walking away, or by pressing two buttons with a wait of approximately one second in between them.  total time is about the same, but in the first case you have to do more work and in the second you have to stand there and do nothing for a whole second.
< 1294937457 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, I would prefer the one that worked on road conditions around here :P
< 1294937480 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :specifically, this is the coice i have for setting my microwave to 1:30
< 1294937486 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it runs on no roads around there)
< 1294937512 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, well then, that depends on that operation. I guess I would prefer the one I could run netbsd on
< 1294937631 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're creating differences between the two operations that aren't there.  this is just two different ways to do the same operation on the same microwave.  the only difference is the one i gave and there are no other differences.
< 1294937676 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, I would probably choose randomly between them each time. And also wonder what the point of two ways on the same product was
< 1294937704 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then I would realise it was Perl, not Python
< 1294937814 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  lol
< 1294937828 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this somehow moved me this morning: http://everything2.com/user/Wolfeh42/writeups/January+13%252C+2011
< 1294938087 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294938218 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Star Trek Table of Elementa is very mixed up.
< 1294938286 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, hm how can you engine brake with automatic? Sure a bit would work but you couldn't control it very well.
< 1294938371 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Automatic has gears other than "drive", they're not commonly used though. Basically if you put it in first gear, then the engine will clutch and change gears for you when possible.
< 1294938386 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: "Engine breaking" is a technique not commonly known in the US though, I suspect.
< 1294938412 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, here you won't pass driving test if you can't do it nowdays. Because it saves fuel to use it.
< 1294938460 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It saves fuel on a manual, on an automatic you'll automatically shift down if you brake and slow down anyway.
< 1294938496 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It also saves on brake pads though :P
< 1294938523 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, if you brake you will surely still engange the brake pads. Which means less fuel saving since more energy gets lost as heat. Simple physics.
< 1294938540 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, MC now has two kinds of wood.
< 1294938545 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's actually quite cool.
< 1294938548 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, update out?
< 1294938550 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm
< 1294938551 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1294938578 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it was a bug, but then I tried cutting it down.
< 1294938599 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm not arguing that the fuel savings are the SAME, I'm arguing that it's more of a deal for manual than for automatic.
< 1294938607 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well ok
< 1294938619 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, screenshot? I'm using the alternative launcher thingy so I don't need to update to login.
< 1294938645 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i engine break when i need to, on steep winding rodes
< 1294938651 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly the way gregor describes
< 1294938659 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh
< 1294938662 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure I'm going to upgrade until ineiros update. And that probably means waiting for bukkit (horrible name), since hmod will be dropped
< 1294938662 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*engine brake
< 1294938663 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, http://imgur.com/TgHcQ
< 1294938665 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's got me doing it now
< 1294938677 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to look for reeds.
< 1294938686 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, oh, looks like birch?
< 1294938686 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Basically, to drive an automatic: Forget everything you ever learned about shifting. If you want to go forward, put it in "D". If you want to go backwards, put it in "R". If you want to park, put it in "P". If you don't want to move or want to slow down, use the brake. That is literally everything there is that is necessary to drive an automatic.
< 1294938693 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, or whatever the English word is
< 1294938693 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, yeah.
< 1294938697 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :björk in Swedish
< 1294938714 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I guess painterly is broken now?
< 1294938724 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, haven't tried it.
< 1294938726 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably.
< 1294938734 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gregor: don't forget overdrive
< 1294938739 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, and if you want to drive in bad winter conditions?
< 1294938745 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Why? Most people do.
< 1294938746 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FWIW, I can see a very tall tree with all of the leaves bunched up at the top in a snowy biome.
< 1294938754 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have to put overdrive on above 45mph to keep the engine from winding up way too high
< 1294938755 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Then you put on chains and suffer.
< 1294938766 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: ... you turn overdrive /off/?
< 1294938775 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, chains? You mean winter wheels with steel studs
< 1294938781 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dubbdäck in Swedish
< 1294938784 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: below 45mph to keep the engine from running too slow
< 1294938788 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, I mean chains.
< 1294938802 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: You're a poor excuse for an automatic driver X-P
< 1294938813 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note that OD on my van is a separate gear and not a button on the shifter
< 1294938814 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, you don't use studded wheels?
< 1294938842 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :studded wheels?
< 1294938845 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are those?
< 1294938845 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Not typically. I have a set of chains for the rare occasion that I need more winter traction (read: never), it would be a huge waste to have winter wheels.
< 1294938849 0 :Zuu_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Zuu
< 1294938849 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are surely a myth
< 1294938865 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, not around here
< 1294938870 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most people have them
< 1294938880 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In most locales in the US they're wildly illegal.
< 1294938908 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, NOT IN ALASKA I BET ;P
< 1294938928 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DURPADURP!
< 1294938940 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, http://imgur.com/Jmvfm
< 1294938946 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Last I checked, the vast majority of the US is MORE TEMPERATE than Swedeland! SHOCKA
< 1294938957 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably meant to be a conifer.
< 1294938958 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, they are only legal during winter here. And during winter you have to use them (or non-studded snow tires) to be legal
< 1294938964 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HUMANZZZZZZzzzzz
< 1294938977 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION shoots death rays out of his empty eyesockets
< 1294938980 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, nice
< 1294938983 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Can't use chains at all, or they're just not even something done there?
< 1294939014 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, rarely used. Legal if conditions warrants it iirc
< 1294939021 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very rare
< 1294939055 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, but iirc you have to stop and take them off if you get onto a road that don't need them. Which make them inconvenient for most drivers.
< 1294939086 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as opposed to taking them off at full speed? i can see how that saves time
< 1294939092 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Both chains and studded tires beat the hell out of dry roads.
< 1294939093 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, :P
< 1294939102 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P
< 1294939112 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, well yes. But you will have a hard time finding dry roads here this time of the year.
< 1294939126 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, anyway they save lives compared to non-studded winter tires.
< 1294939137 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: So do chains :P
< 1294939154 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, true. Still they are not very common.
< 1294939218 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, also limits speed more iirc
< 1294939325 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, FWIW, the normal and birch wood don't actually stack on each other.
< 1294939330 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Again, Sweden vs. USA. We don't swap our actual /tires/ because the need for added traction is only warranted some tiny amount of the time, and in some tiny amount of roads. The vast majority of roads are either plowed and drivable with any ol' all-weather tire, or completely snowed over and not drivable no matter how good your tire augmentation is (i.e. snowmobilable), with the latter being a very small set.
< 1294939342 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well seems reasonable
< 1294939376 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They also both refine to normal planks.
< 1294939377 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, plowing doesn't perfectly clean a road however.
< 1294939384 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, okay that makes less sense
< 1294939402 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what about other crafting from them?
< 1294939408 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(is there some?)
< 1294939420 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :None that I know of, although I didn't really bother experimenting.
< 1294939441 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"* Reeds magically turned into sugar canes. They still make paper."
< 1294939442 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what
< 1294939447 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's sad
< 1294939454 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's to make cake
< 1294939462 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, Birch makes better root beer (birch beer) than conventional Sarsparilla/Sassafras (or artificial imitations thereof), but noooo, birch beer is hard to find.
< 1294939464 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, he could add a separate ones
< 1294939465 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one*
< 1294939478 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In a studded tire, there may only be up to 50 studs per metre (of circumference), and the maximum extent out of the tire surface is 1.2 mm. (Was trying to find out the state of winter tireage in Finland.)
< 1294939481 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm assuming that they're weird Minecraft canes.
< 1294939490 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, heh
< 1294939510 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"* One secret useful block" <-- mhm
< 1294939511 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: birch beer is deliciouuuuuuuuuuuuusssssssssssssss
< 1294939526 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"* Paintings work in multiplayer" <--- yay finally
< 1294939527 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: I KNOW RIGHT
< 1294939537 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's that company that makes all those fruit sodas?
< 1294939550 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :December, January and Feburary are the obligatory winter-tire months here.
< 1294939551 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they made a birch one once and i've NEVER SEEN IT AGAIN SINCE.
< 1294939552 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"* Fixed colors going weird on PowerPC" <-- how did that happen
< 1294939566 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Notch quality engineering, that's how!
< 1294939585 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My bet: endianness.
< 1294939587 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"* Fixed most lighting bugs in newly generated SMP maps" <--- newly generated. Right. Well I guess it is better than making the server load everything on next start.
< 1294939589 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When elliott comes in I am just going to tell him the changes were "there's cake and also two new types of tree."
< 1294939595 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could fix it on the fly maybe
< 1294939610 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, the cake is a lie surely?
< 1294939615 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oho, reeds!
< 1294939623 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, screenshot?
< 1294939641 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They look exactly the same.
< 1294939645 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They craft into sugar.
< 1294939648 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...
< 1294939762 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Re hMod, he just said that it will be dropped when bukkit is ready; my guess is it might still get a Beta 1.2 update. (Unless you've seen something further on it.)
< 1294939773 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(There are, after all, >1 contributor to the hMod repo.)
< 1294939789 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps I should have kept a reed handy to start a farm to try to craft cake.
< 1294939845 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty sure I saw that it wouldn't be upgraded
< 1294939848 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You make cake ... out of reeds?
< 1294939850 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yummy.
< 1294939863 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, not official however
< 1294939902 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only thing I saw was the hMod thread, which still states "Bukkit will be superseding hMod. Once Bukkit is ready, hMod will no longer be updated. I no longer have an interest in Minecraft, so this change is for the best." .. and I think Bukkit is quite far from being ready.
< 1294939924 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have to say that I think this update is the best since Halloween.
< 1294939929 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It actually adds things.
< 1294939948 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A water mob! Dyes! Cake!
< 1294939985 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Black sheep!
< 1294940030 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death
< 1294940037 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I have ever milked a cow in MC; I didn't even know they were milkable.
< 1294940037 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently flowers craft to dye now.
< 1294940074 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: What else is milkable?
< 1294940088 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Logically, all mammals should be, but I'm betting that's not the case!
< 1294940095 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably nothing else.
< 1294940105 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION sips from his tall glass of pig's milk.
< 1294940109 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sheep are shearable, cows are milkable, pigs are ridable.
< 1294940118 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The right tool.. er, animal, for the right job.
< 1294940141 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And chickens are... a nuisance?
< 1294940149 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you not kick them?
< 1294940159 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IF YOU KICK THEM, DO THEY NOT BLEED?
< 1294940169 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but that's not a chicken-specific act, you can kick the other animals too.
< 1294940177 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294940182 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems like chickens should fly farther though
< 1294940183 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, they're a source of feathers.
< 1294940185 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And eggs.
< 1294940222 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes, but you can't do a thing to them.
< 1294940238 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, eggs are now used in cake.
< 1294940266 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you bake them?
< 1294940276 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fry them?
< 1294940278 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deep-fry them?
< 1294940315 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deep-deep-deep-deep-deep-deep-fry them.
< 1294940358 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No, I mean, you can't do a chicken-specific act that would result a chicken dropping an egg; there's nothing you can do by right-clicking them.
< 1294940384 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shallow-fried chicken, for those who want the insides to be raw.
< 1294940426 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well can you at LEAST bugger 'em?
< 1294940468 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They
< 1294940474 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'re not hedgehogs, so I'd *guess*.
< 1294940518 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In-game I mean
< 1294940520 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are also octopodes now.
< 1294940531 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: OCTOPODES, NO!
< 1294940542 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They drop ink sacs when they die, so I assume they're another source of dye.
< 1294940544 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: And the Minepedia already has pages "Octopus", "Octopi" and "Squid" for it.
< 1294940565 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyhow, where else do you get dye from?
< 1294940568 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the plural is "octopodes"!
< 1294940584 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://spamusers.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=13217&start=100#p251044
< 1294940587 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Crafting flowers or killing octopodes.
< 1294940651 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Inflections:  Plural octopuses, octopi, (rare) octopodes"
< 1294940655 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're a rare fellow.
< 1294940752 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does that say about platypus?
< 1294940787 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Inflections:  Plural platypuses, platypi, (rare) platypusses, (rare) platypodes."
< 1294940791 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where that == OED.
< 1294940806 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I do like the fact that the pretentious-but-not-actually-correct version is the accepted plural.
< 1294940838 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, the relevant part is being pretentious, not being correct
< 1294940840 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh, i'll keep my platypoda anyway
< 1294940843 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: They don't list "octopussies" as a valid plural, however.
< 1294940862 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll keep my PLÖTSPLÄTS anyway.
< 1294940880 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: octopussies is the only accepted plural of octopussy
< 1294940906 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PLATYPODES, NO!
< 1294940959 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Speaking of which, beta 1.2 unsuprisingly breaks mcmap.
< 1294940964 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Platypode, I choose you!
< 1294941079 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I added a player list to the client as a gui hack. But then I realized it just listed players in range, not everyone." "So that's a revert. Next update!"
< 1294941093 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if in next update it's going to send other-player coordinates too, or just their names.
< 1294941131 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294941189 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the alternative launcher works perfectly
< 1294941198 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what alternative launcher
< 1294941203 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:31:49  My dad accidentally threw out the melatonin
< 1294941204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:32:00  I was planning on sleeping tonight
< 1294941205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. accidentally.
< 1294941207 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the one that asks about updating
< 1294941212 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah.
< 1294941224 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, since there was an update a few hours ago
< 1294941235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION creates .minecraft/launcher
< 1294941296 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1294941318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm planning on making my Minecraft the most ridiculously CPU and GPU-intensive program ever.
< 1294941322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minecrysis.
< 1294941356 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah
< 1294941423 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Specifically, I am going to use an HD texture pack (probably Aza's), run on far/fancy, have Better Light installed, and use that arbitrary-GLSL-shader module, with the modified Depth of Field shader (and possibly the Even Better Light one the author showed, if it's released and I can get them to merge; it basically did full lighting, including redstone torch lighing being red, with shaders; beautiful screenshot).
< 1294941433 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well new blocks so if you update you need to use the standard texture pack for now
< 1294941437 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or things will look weird
< 1294941449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure. But it's the principle.
< 1294941466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'll look ridiculously good.
< 1294941474 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* One secret useful block
< 1294941474 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* One secret pretty block
< 1294941480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Go away, Notch. We can see your textures.
< 1294941504 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Maybe you could use some sort of a custom vertex/geometry shader/mod that'd also smooth the block edges so that the terrain wouldn't be so blocky!
< 1294941509 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: all that just to make it like a pre-1995 game?
< 1294941521 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: It... does not really look pre-1995 like that.
< 1294941536 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in what way does it look pre 1995 then?
< 1294941543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not ever?
< 1294941556 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"ever" is not a way
< 1294941560 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a time specifier :p
< 1294941567 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Not in any way"
< 1294941573 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^
< 1294941584 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor wins the spelling bee prize!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
< 1294941594 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so going to use the alternative launcher and play on the server?
< 1294941612 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt it, the server will probably go vanilla soon.
< 1294941619 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well until then
< 1294941626 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: OH BOY IM GONNA USE IT TOO BYE ALOT OF CANDY
< 1294941629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depth of field example: http://img337.imageshack.us/i/screenshot20110107at111.jpg/
< 1294941631 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with aza's texture pack
< 1294941634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: pre-1995 eh?
< 1294941649 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i bet it could run on this: http://benheck.com/04-05-2009/commodore-64-original-hardware-laptop
< 1294941656 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>_<
< 1294941657 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh go away
< 1294941672 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p
< 1294941675 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: here's the really cool (and afaik unreleased) one, shader light: http://img443.imageshack.us/f/screenshot20110108at101.png/
< 1294941679 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks amazing
< 1294941691 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : depth of field example: http://img337.imageshack.us/i/screenshot20110107at111.jpg/ <-- this reminds me of those clay-animation games somehow.
< 1294941706 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the polycount is the giveaway
< 1294941707 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it looks like it is made out of cardboard boxes and so on.
< 1294941711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ha
< 1294941714 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: there were DOF mods for unreal 1 engine
< 1294941718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: who cares
< 1294941721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it looks pretty
< 1294941721 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which was pre-1995!
< 1294941725 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just saying :p
< 1294941729 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :games in 1995 did not look like that, in general.
< 1294941741 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unreal's lighting was very good
< 1294941747 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, new MC things!
< 1294941752 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MORE TYPES OF TREE!
< 1294941754 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it had dynamic lighting
< 1294941755 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I mean it really looks like someone made a miniature set and took photos in it. The other one is nice
< 1294941757 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The first Unreal game was released in 1998.
< 1294941769 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah the depth of field is a bit extreme, i'd tweak it a bit
< 1294941769 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but the first tech demo was leaked in 94
< 1294941771 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: btw, mipmapping, to stop the ugly warping when playing on far: http://img443.imageshack.us/f/screenshot20110108at101.png/
< 1294941785 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: e.g. look at the stairs on far, look around, notice it warbling
< 1294941788 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: have you seen those photos of real life that are minified? :D
< 1294941790 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, isn't there anisotropic filtering or whatever to do that?
< 1294941795 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=128995
< 1294941801 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they use like a really long exposure and a moving lens :D
< 1294941808 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: btw, mipmapping, to stop the ugly warping when playing on far: http://img443.imageshack.us/f/screenshot20110108at101.png/ <-- that is the light pic
< 1294941812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: that'll give you the same problems as anti-aliasing
< 1294941813 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops
< 1294941816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=128995
< 1294941818 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even Descent 1 doesn't quite qualify "pre-1995", since it came out in 1995. (But it had some coloured lights, IIRC.)
< 1294941818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see the screenshot there :P
< 1294941838 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tilt-shift
< 1294941871 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well sure. I doubt my CPU could handle it
< 1294941874 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my GPU maybe
< 1294941880 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: err. it's likely to cause less load
< 1294941887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: all it does is use less pixels the further away the texture is
< 1294941888 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well mipmapping yes
< 1294941892 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I meant the other ones
< 1294941894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah.
< 1294941925 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: causes it to use multitexturing though
< 1294941927 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and blending
< 1294941933 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which makes it again slower
< 1294941943 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :using less pixels just lowers the necessary bandwidth
< 1294941970 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have AGP 8x :P
< 1294941977 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have EISA
< 1294941979 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also, there are now octopodes.
< 1294941982 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well I doubt that will matter)
< 1294941986 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ...
< 1294941997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: So, um, what are the new tree types.
< 1294942007 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, birch tree is one iirc
< 1294942013 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Knee-jerk "I don't like it" at this point.
< 1294942020 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The other is the Tree of Knowledge.
< 1294942021 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why is that
< 1294942027 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Birch and a single sighting of a conifer-shaped one in a snowy biome.
< 1294942027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dunno.
< 1294942030 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Phantom_Hoover said best update since halloween
< 1294942031 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, dyes.
< 1294942036 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"A bunch of new crafting recipes" Oh joy.
< 1294942046 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, because it did something *other* than breaking everything.
< 1294942060 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, who knows. Might have broken stuff.
< 1294942069 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Bonemeal what
< 1294942097 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://img689.imageshack.us/i/minecraftmip.png/
< 1294942100 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this actually looks cool
< 1294942107 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now if they added per pixel lighting to the whole thing
< 1294942125 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and volumetric shadows
< 1294942126 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: Better Light does ambient occlusion.
< 1294942149 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Some Minepedia file-uploader seems to think the trees are aspens. (Which sounds rather unlikely.)
< 1294942166 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: cool
< 1294942166 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, nah, go for FPGA-based real-time raytracing!
< 1294942177 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: speaking of fpgas, i am slowly learning
< 1294942186 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, this is all actually interesting.
< 1294942186 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: soon, i'll be simulating neurons in fpga!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.
< 1294942194 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00, oh and?
< 1294942205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol. i doubt.
< 1294942208 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then, i'll upload myself!
< 1294942211 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, so I need three buckets of milk and some wheat.
< 1294942228 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what is the cake good for?
< 1294942234 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For eating?
< 1294942237 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, does it stack at least?
< 1294942253 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cake is absolutely useless AFAIK, but I'm going to make some anyway.
< 1294942253 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Edible items don't tend to stack.
< 1294942307 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It does heal 1.5 hears "every use, and you can use it 6 times".
< 1294942311 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, seems like paintings were fixed in SMP. So some good news.
< 1294942313 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :According to Minepedia, anyway.
< 1294942318 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/hears/hearts/
< 1294942328 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah
< 1294942360 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if I should try and put optimine into that big hodge-podge of mods I'm installing.
< 1294942365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It might, you know, make this actually feasible.
< 1294942385 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :optimine?
< 1294942414 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exactly what it says on the tin.
< 1294942420 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SPAWNIN' NEXT TO CLAY OH YEAH
< 1294942467 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think "octopodes" is correct and "octopi" is incorrect.
< 1294942521 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah
< 1294942525 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: octopusses
< 1294942542 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I don't think so.
< 1294942550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait what.
< 1294942557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Monster spawners work in daylight, right?
< 1294942558 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's from greek
< 1294942564 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Octononions.
< 1294942569 0 :Oklopol!~oklopol@87-93-140-25.bb.dnainternet.fi JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294942571 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :two of them are an octopair, three are an octet, five are an quintopus, seven are a septopode
< 1294942575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes?
< 1294942580 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :octopodes if you're pretentious, octopi if you're pretentious and clueless, and octopusses if you can't be bothered
< 1294942581 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: But octonions is different.
< 1294942584 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopuses.
< 1294942599 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a mishmash of greek and latin
< 1294942616 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and old english
< 1294942618 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Octopuses" is the most common plural, they say.
< 1294942620 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol
< 1294942624 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL
< 1294942624 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :oklopol
< 1294942627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do monster spawners require a certain area around them?
< 1294942656 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopods.
< 1294942682 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could quote the OED entry in whole, since I still have the tab open: "The plural form octopodes reflects the Greek plural; compare octopod n. The more frequent plural form octopi arises from apprehension of the final -us of the word as the grammatical ending of Latin second declension nouns; this apprehension is also reflected in compounds in octop-: see e.g. octopean adj., octopic adj., octopine adj., etc."
< 1294942756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GUYS. MONSTER SPAWNERS
< 1294942763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they work in daylight don't they
< 1294942783 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :octopi = 25.132741...
< 1294942788 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahaha!
< 1294942796 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For the pluralization tables of Plain TeXnicard, it will make "octopuses" which the reference which I took the data from, says is correct, but it also says "octopodes" is correct. I selected the Anglicise plurals to make the rule lists simpler.
< 1294942808 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not sure.
< 1294942821 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They don't work above a certain light level, do they?
< 1294942829 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they dont
< 1294942832 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*'
< 1294942851 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though placing torches around the spawner or otherwise lighting the area will prevent monsters from spawning, the only sure way to prevent a Monster Spawner block from spawning monsters is to destroy it.
< 1294942856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In rare cases where the dungeon is located near the surface, the player can remove the ceiling of the dungeon and expose the Monster Spawner and surrounding area to direct sunlight, preventing monster spawns during the day [1].
< 1294942857 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :great
< 1294942860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ticking timebomb
< 1294942863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i will destroy it
< 1294942867 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just skeletons
< 1294942871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :skeletons aren't very useful are the
< 1294942872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y
< 1294942880 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good source of bone.
< 1294942885 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And BONE MEALS.
< 1294942889 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The latest McMeal.
< 1294942891 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you put stuff around it, probably it can't do much?
< 1294942891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck that
< 1294942895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: scared dammit scared
< 1294942897 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is the first night
< 1294942919 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Meh meh meh I'm afraid of the walking dead oh woe is me durp durp
< 1294942926 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well just a few layers of dirt, takes just a couple seconds and you'll have your own monster spawner for later
< 1294942937 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294942939 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A-YUP
< 1294942946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But hey, I have:
< 1294942948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clay
< 1294942950 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :skeletons drop arrows
< 1294942950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :6 iron ingots (thanks chest)
< 1294942952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :String
< 1294942954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Food of various sorts
< 1294942954 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course
< 1294942955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Saddles
< 1294942959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And sulphur
< 1294942966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So... woo, now fuck, it's gonna be nigth soon and I have no house
< 1294942983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: That birch tree is hideous.
< 1294943003 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: by 6 iron ingots DO YOU MEAN 6 STACKS OR 6 BIG BOXES
< 1294943009 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I MEAN 6
< 1294943025 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol i have like 10 boxes in my base.....................
< 1294943028 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you suck
< 1294943041 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also
< 1294943044 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by having played one night
< 1294943053 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you mean having played one stack of nights or a big box of nights
< 1294943067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294943069 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Or bix box of night-blocks crafted out of 9 nights?
< 1294943073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean this is the first day
< 1294943078 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1294943083 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: hey what should i build my house out of, SAND? lololololol
< 1294943109 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Build it out of Lapis Lazuli, the "misterious Ore/Block added in Minecraft Beta 1.2 .The only known use is for make the Blue Dye"
< 1294943116 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you could craft some emos out of night blocks
< 1294943117 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Punctuation as in the source.)
< 1294943118 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how would you be inside it?
< 1294943119 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cool houses are built of pure obsidian.
< 1294943125 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and make them guard you
< 1294943128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just read "lapis lazuli" yesterday... Baader-Meinhof.
< 1294943135 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: The ICE HOUSE is the coolest house.
< 1294943136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Do you play MC, or do you just know things X-P
< 1294943142 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: MAGIC
< 1294943150 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm talkin' REAL LIFE, bitch!
< 1294943153 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you can get under-beach caverns, touching one bit of the roof destroys it all :D
< 1294943157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well, makes it all fall
< 1294943171 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :w'w
< 1294943182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat
< 1294943202 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? that was like the only reason to have finite height world
< 1294943205 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey
< 1294943207 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am wondering
< 1294943215 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did anyone ever do a computer in minecraft?
< 1294943218 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sand can be realistic without the coder having a brain
< 1294943221 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since it seems to have logical gates
< 1294943231 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: yes, even i know that
< 1294943239 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what should i do with my 6 iron ingots
< 1294943243 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Got a link?
< 1294943249 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott : Bukkits
< 1294943252 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: wait till you have more, iron blocks are sexy
< 1294943265 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: google minecraft cpu
< 1294943271 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: not like, armour? :P
< 1294943275 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe the iron block house.
< 1294943277 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: nope!
< 1294943378 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thx
< 1294943397 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: So that DOF shader, does it "focus" on the distance the crosshair is on?
< 1294943397 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Armors wore off, elliott
< 1294943403 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But bukkits are forever
< 1294943407 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or until you die in lava
< 1294943417 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: Or until you use the bukkit as furnace fuel.
< 1294943418 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-196-183.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294943419 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yes.
< 1294943424 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why would you do thaty
< 1294943428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: The screenshot is from a modified version later in the thread.
< 1294943430 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When you have infinite wood
< 1294943437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's getting dark, and my house isn't even vaguely done :(
< 1294943440 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just the first layer
< 1294943441 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's in the sea, but
< 1294943443 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am going to die
< 1294943448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and lose all my amazing first-day possessions
< 1294943479 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it's just first day, it doesn't matter much
< 1294943506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: I have a ton of clay, 6 iron ingots, a decent bit of wheat, bread, two saddles, 8 string, and wood.
< 1294943519 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is a good first day
< 1294943524 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hello.
< 1294943526 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dungeon'
< 1294943528 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is a good first day that makes me NOT WANT TO DIE
< 1294943529 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm lucky if I find coal
< 1294943535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes, but I got the clay and wood from spawn
< 1294943544 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1294943545 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wait, why are you building in the sea?
< 1294943556 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He is Spongebob Squarepants
< 1294943559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wanted to
< 1294943561 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck it
< 1294943563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my first house will be a tower
< 1294943625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :time to craft all night
< 1294943628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seriously though
< 1294943633 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should i make a pick, sword, armour, or what with my ingots
< 1294943634 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also
< 1294943636 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine
< 1294943643 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: on top of a tower?
< 1294943648 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No
< 1294943651 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Inside!
< 1294943654 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I made a tower
< 1294943656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i built the tower.
< 1294943658 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :out of clay.
< 1294943659 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is 1x1.
< 1294943660 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is actually
< 1294943664 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i cannot actually mine :P
< 1294943670 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tell me what to do with my ingots
< 1294943670 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is not really a tower
< 1294943671 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal
< 1294943680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: keeps me away  from creepers
< 1294943681 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i told you already
< 1294943681 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well
< 1294943685 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do nothing
< 1294943688 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ?
< 1294943690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hope they don't blow up my fucking clay :D
< 1294943694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: first night, i have 6 iron ingots
< 1294943699 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: what should i do with them
< 1294943705 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Picks go away pretty quickly
< 1294943708 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :44 wood
< 1294943709 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, switch to peaceful
< 1294943712 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So usually stone is better for that
< 1294943712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah pick isn't worth it
< 1294943713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no.
< 1294943721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: i have no stone tonight :D
< 1294943723 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, whatever you feel is best then
< 1294943726 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Armor might help, but I ouldn't do it on the first day
< 1294943733 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Craft: iron HOE + iron SHOVEL.
< 1294943736 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott : Wood pick, mine some stone, make stone pick
< 1294943738 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The most important tools evar.
< 1294943740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: USEFUL
< 1294943745 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, probably sword then armor?
< 1294943746 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: CAN'T MINE STONE ON THE FIRST NIGHT
< 1294943748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'M ON TOP OF A TOWER
< 1294943759 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: shovel is much more useful than axe imo
< 1294943764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sword is top priority, but is an iron sword worth it?
< 1294943764 0 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-19-45.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294943769 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and axe uses much more
< 1294943785 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: can't really do armour AND anything else
< 1294943790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :boots would leave me with only 2 iron!
< 1294943791 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Wait, no, no, wait: six, you say? You can make a minecart! (And then one shovel.)
< 1294943795 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes, the enemies will be too afraid to come close
< 1294943799 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: OH MAN.
< 1294943803 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott : Wait for morning
< 1294943811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: there will be lots of monsters below
< 1294943816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to be equipped to fight them
< 1294943821 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a stone sword doesn't sound "equipped" to me
< 1294943823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1294943824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not even stone
< 1294943824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wood
< 1294943828 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I guess sword then
< 1294943830 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or armor
< 1294943836 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or FLEE
< 1294943841 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as i said, i could only make one piece of armour
< 1294943847 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: What's the recipe for an iron flee?
< 1294943847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, hard to flee when i'm dismantling my house
< 1294943861 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't dismantle it
< 1294943869 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it's one block tall, just walk
< 1294943884 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: It is not ...
< 1294943886 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could also make 16 minecart tracks and make a rectangular loop, then repeatedly run it.
< 1294943891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: It is about 40 blocks of clay tall.
< 1294943898 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a lot of clay
< 1294943905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PRECISELY
< 1294943907 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you far from your spawn point?
< 1294943922 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because, you could
< 1294943926 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jump from it
< 1294943928 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1294943930 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Locate it because it is tall
< 1294943935 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And get your stuff back
< 1294943940 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would jump into nice, relaxing, non-dying sea.
< 1294943946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I suppose I could.
< 1294943966 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not really a game for fighting monster, really
< 1294943969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nonetheless: what do I do with my 6 iron that will help me best on the first night? I'm leaning t'words sword at this point.
< 1294943971 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially on the first night D:
< 1294943974 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Iron sword should kill off enemies pretty quickly.
< 1294943981 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :True, but
< 1294943982 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Creepers
< 1294943987 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Creepers will fuck you up
< 1294943991 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just whack 'em with the sword. Duh.
< 1294943998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: Eh, if you have full armour and a good sword you can stay outside all night.
< 1294944018 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294944054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"void main() is not legal in C++ but is legal in C." Whoa.
< 1294944065 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which prolly won't happen at night
< 1294944069 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean
< 1294944071 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :First night
< 1294944088 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm lucky if I can find coal on the first night
< 1294944143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Vorpal: fizzie: Behold, the PERMA-LITE: http://i.imgur.com/Jghek.png
< 1294944156 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's happening??
< 1294944163 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Bugs!
< 1294944219 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, MC has added lapis lazuli.
< 1294944230 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1294944247 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does essentially nothing, other than dying things blue.
< 1294944271 0 :Oklopol!~oklopol@xdsl-83-150-123-242.nebulazone.fi JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294944296 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah
< 1294944299 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you can
< 1294944306 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make a colorful fortress of doom
< 1294944312 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Delightful wallpaper
< 1294944322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I also have cactus.
< 1294944328 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: so now you can have your bluestone?  *ducks*
< 1294944331 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cactus are useless, though
< 1294944352 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They can actually be useful in mob traps.
< 1294944356 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Phantom_Hoover: Vorpal: fizzie: Behold, the PERMA-LITE: http://i.imgur.com/Jghek.png <-- what
< 1294944363 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just accidentally made an iron pickaxe :P
< 1294944385 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it will be useful if you encounter some redstone or diamond
< 1294944388 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which you WON'T
< 1294944396 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Notch can't code.
< 1294944415 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that why everything is made of
< 1294944417 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one polygon
< 1294944440 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, sandstone has been added!
< 1294944454 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can make a house in the style of Edinburgh's New Town!
< 1294944494 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pickaxe, sword, and axe. Guess I'm set for day.
< 1294944498 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Is it craftable from sand and stone?
< 1294944512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, just four sand.
< 1294944521 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no he will add lanterns further on
< 1294944524 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what sandstone do
< 1294944544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Creeper circling my precious clay house.
< 1294944546 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Ha ha ha.
< 1294944556 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well I'm sure we can get a kit :P
< 1294944569 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeaaaaah, that doesn't help SSP.
< 1294944580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Lanterns are planned crafted objects which were originally planned to be introduced in the Halloween Update. This feature was delayed because of the lack of time and will be implemented in a future update."
< 1294944581 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, true but I have large stocks there
< 1294944586 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's easier than fucking music blocks, Notch.
< 1294944602 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, less nice than those though
< 1294944613 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so what is the new useful block?
< 1294944618 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Music blocks? Do you bounce off of them?
< 1294944622 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, what is special about a lantern?
< 1294944625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: You PLAY them!
< 1294944627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol: torches will go out
< 1294944629 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :couldn't he just copy paste the code from torches?
< 1294944631 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and need flintn'steel to relight
< 1294944632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1294944632 0 :Oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :oklopol
< 1294944633 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1294944634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1294944635 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he could
< 1294944636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but he's a mron
< 1294944638 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean a moorn
< 1294944641 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean a mrornr
< 1294944643 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously there is no reuse of any line of code
< 1294944647 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Mario is shaking his head in shame.
< 1294944658 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: he writes the 3d rendering code for each block individually!
< 1294944658 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it should still be trivial to add lanterns...
< 1294944681 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, then makes texture files by taking screenshots so that it looks like he's not a retard
< 1294944714 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Yes, but y'see, maybe he was worried about there not being enough time to playtest it for balance problems.
< 1294944781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294944782 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It *is* a pretty big change to the game dynamics.
< 1294944783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'cuz he does that
< 1294944784 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all the time
< 1294944793 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, mining becomes quite a bit harder.
< 1294944831 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and more funnnnn
< 1294944832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais is not here :(
< 1294944874 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Didn't he roll back the "non-monster-spawn light level depends on depth" thing real fast because of difficulty issues.
< 1294944880 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes.
< 1294944888 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And torches going out is that times ten.
< 1294944898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a really stupid idea.
< 1294944905 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a great idea
< 1294944913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It only makes sense as part of the Bluestone proposal, where you could power a torch indefinitely with a generator anyway.
< 1294944921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Assuming you get enough bulk fuel, which shouldn't be too difficult.
< 1294944928 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It makes secure mines impossible until you can make a nether portal, which requires vast amounts of mining in the first place.
< 1294944930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can just throw coal in to keep everything you use going.
< 1294944936 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well obviously the game needs either bots or a huge amount of players
< 1294944941 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can use them as bots
< 1294944963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: make smp bots, the protocol isn't that hard :)
< 1294944990 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wanna make my bots in-game
< 1294945023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: please tell those guys at Umeå universitet to stop using their internet connection, i'm downloading ubuntu packages
< 1294945031 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ..?
< 1294945037 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: they host my ubuntu mirror
< 1294945042 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes and?
< 1294945043 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go tell them off for hogging the pipe
< 1294945045 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's slower than usual
< 1294945052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're in sweden, shouldn't be hard to get there
< 1294945075 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you realise the distance to there from here is longer than from the south tip of England to the north tip of Scotland?
< 1294945105 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UK is tiny
< 1294945107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you want me to go tell Phantom_Hoover off? i can do that, sure
< 1294945108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in return
< 1294945113 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no
< 1294945118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well
< 1294945119 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The distance from the south tip of England to the north tip of Scotland is pathetic :P
< 1294945124 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, indeed!
< 1294945125 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: why not
< 1294945130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: your face is pathetic
< 1294945136 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what do you think would happen
< 1294945158 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : The distance from the south tip of England to the north tip of Scotland is pathetic :P ← and elliott is talking about north England to south Scotland.
< 1294945166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shut up.
< 1294945178 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, :)
< 1294945234 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is it, like 700 miles? Less?
< 1294945234 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`calc 700 miles in km
< 1294945235 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I forget if that still works)
< 1294945261 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In my country, blah blah blah it's bigger is the point.
< 1294945262 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Google Maps Labs has added a distance measurement tool now.
< 1294945282 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Schweet
< 1294945301 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It can even measure the length of a polyline if you like.
< 1294945304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I realise you're compensating for your lack of size in other areas. It's okay.
< 1294945325 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And report results in Ångströms or light-years.)
< 1294945360 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In my country, you can drive 1,000 miles and see no appreciable change in dialect, accent, religion or ethnicity!
< 1294945360 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, you can drive 2,000 miles to the same effect :P
< 1294945362 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what about parsec?
< 1294945376 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That, too. And TeX points.
< 1294945379 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, not on the east coast I bet
< 1294945384 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Any lack of size there could only have been inherited from the UK, but at least we have our teeth :P
< 1294945406 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, how amusing
< 1294945417 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Less so on the east coast, but the east coast is still WAY more homogenous than anywhere in Europe.
< 1294945429 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: In my country, you can drive a million miles with no change. (Admittedly you need to be driving in a small circle.)
< 1294945438 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, :D
< 1294945489 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh yeah, well in my country you can drive a parsec with no change (in a rather large circle)
< 1294945564 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Dispenser <-- oh they can fire arrows, nice
< 1294945577 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well in my country you can drive infinity plus 999 miles!
< 1294945609 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in my country you can drive an uncountable infinity distance
< 1294945638 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not only in a circle. But also in a square with rounded corners!
< 1294945648 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is that for.
< 1294945662 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, OK, that is officially the best thing to happen to MC since sliced bread.
< 1294945680 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MC has sliced bread?
< 1294945688 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, yeah mods have been able to do this for ages
< 1294945708 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, yes, but still.
< 1294945726 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, did they do it in a non-hacky way?
< 1294945741 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well for server mods that would be hard
< 1294945756 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, craftbook had an IC to do it
< 1294945760 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, also an arrow barge one
< 1294945763 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is cooler
< 1294945768 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(5 at once)
< 1294945788 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output.
< 1294945797 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...
< 1294945799 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what
< 1294945807 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh that above
< 1294945808 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : `calc 700 miles in km
< 1294945819 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HackEgo, not impressed.
< 1294945902 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'm looking into Atomo again
< 1294945951 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`echo It's not slowness, it's unimplementedness :P
< 1294945953 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not slowness, it's unimplementedness :P
< 1294945963 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, working on making mcmap work with this new one?
< 1294945986 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`url bin/calc
< 1294945987 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/bin/calc
< 1294946001 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, what was that RNA thing you mentioned?
< 1294946006 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Not at the moment; do you have some local server you'd like to run it against?
< 1294946046 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hold on, let me check
< 1294946066 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EteRNA\
< 1294946071 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, my local server runs hmod and movecraft, so not very
< 1294946115 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://eterna.cmu.edu
< 1294946122 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right. The protocol docs seemed updated already, but I'll probably patch mcmap when there are some uses for it.
< 1294946124 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, collecting flowers on ineiros's server atm
< 1294946167 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'll be a backwards-incompatible change anyway; I don't really feel like supporting multiple protocol versions, since Notch doesn't bother anyway.
< 1294946180 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are flowers a renewable resource? I guess not.
< 1294946278 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, not afaik
< 1294946320 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, ^
< 1294946343 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Going to update the WooW flora room "reed" sign, now that they're sugar instead?
< 1294946360 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Might as well be quaint
< 1294946399 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, do they still grow next to water
< 1294946404 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if so it sounds like reed
< 1294946419 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think the semantics have been changed.
< 1294946548 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Like the real plant, sugar cane must be planted on a grass/dirt block immediately adjacent to water, --"
< 1294946576 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X-D
< 1294947121 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :god damn it
< 1294947126 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still haven't found my sugar cane
< 1294947140 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I came across some so I trimmed it and replanted then lost it :|
< 1294947146 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was that poetry
< 1294947160 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"god damn it
< 1294947163 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still haven't found my sugar cane
< 1294947170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I came across some so I trimmed it and replanted then lost it"
< 1294947179 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep
< 1294947181 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"god damn it / I still haven't found my sugar cane", by J. Invariant.
< 1294947187 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294947198 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i found it pretty deep
< 1294947205 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, hey, wait till you try to find some eggs.
< 1294947206 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine it being read in a serious voice by a 60-year-old poet
< 1294947212 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you forgot the face at the end
< 1294947219 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is part of the poem
< 1294947219 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: too low-brow
< 1294947232 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, indeed, wheat.
< 1294947712 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: needs a blues melody i think
< 1294947819 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :god damn it i still haven't found nananeenernanun
< 1294947837 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my sugar can cane i came across some nananeenernanun
< 1294947869 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i trimmed it and replanted nananeenernanun
< 1294947884 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then lost it colon pipe nananeenernanun
< 1294947914 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes i feel, lord
< 1294947917 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like i been
< 1294947925 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tiiiiiiiied to the whippin post
< 1294947932 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shantih shantih shantih
< 1294947964 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION bows
< 1294948185 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...
< 1294948220 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was expecting some snapping...
< 1294948233 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"colon pipe"
< 1294948241 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it surely _looked_ as if quintopia had snapped *ducks*
< 1294948244 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294948273 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a pipe in my colon
< 1294948275 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gregor: ce n'est pas une colon pipe
< 1294948283 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ceci
< 1294948292 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that
< 1294948296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ceci nest p'as none colon pipe une
< 1294948300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*p'as nest
< 1294948301 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION doesn't francais
< 1294948304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*cesi
< 1294948324 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cesium is no colon pipe
< 1294948375 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seize my colon pipe
< 1294948389 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...i think that may be illegal
< 1294948400 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294948417 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go go gadget chaotic neutral
< 1294948426 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Go go gadget colon pipe?
< 1294948453 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :The sucked up fleep channel | I'll suck up ALL your fleep, baby! Right through the colon pipe. | http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page | logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D or (hg) http://codu.org/projects/esotericlogs/hg/
< 1294948466 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no not the gadget skates! whooooaoaoaOOOOOAAAA
< 1294948503 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: do we _really_ want to scare away the newbies before getting them addicted?
< 1294948513 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yus
< 1294948513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1294948522 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IF YOU SAY SO
< 1294948525 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: HEY, don't make me reintroduce your colon pipe.
< 1294948531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm currently optimising my procedure, i think i can filter out the worthy ones even quicker than i did with the xkcd guys
< 1294948539 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically i start by killing their family
< 1294948541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and eating their children
< 1294948544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then i yell in their ear for 24 hours
< 1294948554 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: My piping is 2" PVC now.
< 1294948555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those that then create seventy languages of oklopol-level pure beauty then go onto the next stage
< 1294948557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is secret
< 1294948558 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO! NOT YELLING IN THE EAR!
< 1294948566 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's just plain _cruel_
< 1294948567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: YELLING INSULTS NO LESS
< 1294948575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah they usually beg me to just like
< 1294948578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kill their grandparents too
< 1294948611 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not grandchildren
< 1294948625 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least not until they release another album
< 1294948657 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oerjan: My piping is 2" PVC now. <-- play music on it
< 1294948672 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... THAT IS SICK.
< 1294948691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION plays music on his colon pipe
< 1294948691 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's Vorpal what do you expect
< 1294948704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone seize it before it explodes with music
< 1294948707 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, wait, I thought you would expect that from Gregor
< 1294948719 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1294948751 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i'm pretty sure we've discussed PVC instruments on this channel before
< 1294948761 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, indeed
< 1294948779 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, done with the colon pipe discussion then :P
< 1294948780 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, they are quite interesting
< 1294948782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/pvcinstruments/
< 1294948795 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, any colon pipe there?
< 1294948797 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do want to make a PVC xylovibraglockenphone.
< 1294948809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :geez you are all obsessed with my colon pipe
< 1294948822 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, :P
< 1294948838 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, what exactly is a xylovibraglockenphone
< 1294948843 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, any photo of one?
< 1294948858 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's obvious
< 1294948871 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm referring of course to the family of instruments including the xylophone, vibraphone, marimba and glockenspiel.
< 1294948873 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, http://codu.org/pvcinstruments/ <-- link dead, goes to geocities
< 1294948880 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, you might want to update that link
< 1294948881 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294948903 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hahahfail.
< 1294948904 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, also images on http://codu.org/pvcinstruments/baritonetrombute.php broken
< 1294948904 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a cross between and vibraphone a glockenspiel and a xylophone and a drumbone for good measure
< 1294948912 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, and that is your local stuff
< 1294948920 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : http://codu.org/pics/displayimage.php?album=33&pos=3 <-- 404
< 1294948922 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That I'm aware of and haven't bothered to fix :P
< 1294948935 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, aww :/
< 1294948939 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, how does it look then?
< 1294948946 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION looks forward to the next blue man gregor concert
< 1294948966 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I didn't even put instructions on my PVC trombone there :P
< 1294948984 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION finds a reference to "ass pipe" on http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Music_of_the_Virgin_Islands
< 1294948998 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, pvc pan flute
< 1294949007 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Too easy.
< 1294949012 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, hm true
< 1294949053 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PVC saxophone? (I haven't been following the context.)
< 1294949056 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so how is the new minecraft version?
< 1294949065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I haven't really played, but it seems stable enough.
< 1294949071 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'm not sure how to make a single reed, and valves are borderline impossible.
< 1294949079 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Trombaxophone, maybe.
< 1294949095 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, downside is of course that you can't play on current server atm unless you use alternative launcher
< 1294949137 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl
< 1294949539 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"trombaxophone" has only one result on Google D-8
< 1294949541 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UNACCEPTABLE
< 1294949762 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Ahahahah*.
< 1294949776 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Among other things, Sony submitted *the actual keys* in court documents.
< 1294949792 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :....
< 1294949793 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf?
< 1294949795 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :srsly?
< 1294949795 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meaning that the "circumvention device" they seek to prevent the distribution of is a matter of public record.
< 1294949802 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seriously.
< 1294949868 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sort of like those scenes in movies where somebody knows they're being watched by the good guys and says "Boy I sure hope they don't find the key under the mat that goes to the back window, since there are no sentries posted to the left of that window!"
< 1294949920 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is the best thing ever.
< 1294949998 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Surely they didn't do something that barefacedly stupid.
< 1294950010 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: in that series of screenshots?
< 1294950012 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or where?
< 1294950021 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: In that gigantic pile of screenshots.
< 1294950042 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Page... 247 of court document 4.
< 1294950046 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1294950086 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Remember that the keys were already released because Sony doesn't know the meaning of "random".
< 1294950122 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out
< 1294950126 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: It was random, it just had a very small range.
< 1294950134 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: no
< 1294950137 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Namely, a single value.
< 1294950147 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: HALLO MR I-DUNT-GET-JOKES
< 1294950150 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1294950163 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though even if it were random *with a known bias*, the keys would still be vulnerable.
< 1294950164 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, indeed, but there's failing to be cryptographically secure due to skimming the textbook and there's publishing them on a document you *know* is going to be public.
< 1294950174 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where's the pile of screenshots?
< 1294950175 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(this was the issue with the whole Debian OpenSSL thing)
< 1294950232 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.thesangreal.net/gaf/sony.zip Well, this zip has all the stuff submitted by SCEA so far.
< 1294950243 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The pile of screenshots is in 04.pdf
< 1294950260 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's absurdly huge.
< 1294950273 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :282 screenshots.
< 1294950299 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I mean the zip.
< 1294950303 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes.
< 1294950334 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Christ on a pogo stick, wheat takes ages to grow in MC.
< 1294950350 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, it always done?
< 1294950371 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: As opposed to real life, where you pretty much drop it in the ground, go get coffee, then make bread.
< 1294950374 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, yes, but I never needed it soon.
< 1294950385 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, it takes ages to grow in real life too. The issue is that trees grow unrealistically fast in mc.
< 1294950389 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so does wheat
< 1294950391 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, and where you can break solid stone with your bare hands.
< 1294950394 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need months in real life
< 1294950402 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, that is some nice karate!
< 1294950422 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You can if you're not some kind of PUSSY.
< 1294950444 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: (And also it's sandstone)
< 1294950452 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, naw, they added that/
< 1294950457 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, what is sandstone?
< 1294950459 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's different from normal stone.
< 1294950471 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, ...a soft kind of stone?
< 1294950475 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294950485 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I meant, chemically
< 1294950492 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's a rock made of lightly-cemented sand.
< 1294950492 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I know what sandstone looks like
< 1294950499 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Chemically, it's a load of sand smushed together.
< 1294950499 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, cemented how?
< 1294950504 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, smushing.
< 1294950517 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I'm not familiar with that jargon *googles it*
< 1294950519 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, even sandstone isn't that weak.
< 1294950540 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Trust me, I live in a city where the primary building material is sandstone.
< 1294950560 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Then if you can't smash through your buildings, then I guess you're just some kind of PUSSY.
< 1294950581 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you could punch apart houses in less than a day, there wouldn't be a house standing.
< 1294950600 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wrecking balls in the next update?
< 1294950609 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rabid house-punching squads are destroying New York! D-8
< 1294950662 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like all the ads in the documents
< 1294950686 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1294950695 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294950704 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what can't you smash even sandstone!?
< 1294950708 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'd have thought they'd have gone over the keys with a marker pen or something.
< 1294950743 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, can you‽
< 1294950761 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, never tried. I'd assume so
< 1294950772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X-D
< 1294950785 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hope Vorpal goes and smashes Edinburgh now.
< 1294950808 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, a bit too far to travel
< 1294950832 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Insane Swedish man found punching houses, trees."
< 1294950846 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, :D
< 1294950852 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Subtitle if it's published in the Evening News: "Believed to be tram contractor."
< 1294950861 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what?
< 1294950867 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't get that
< 1294950900 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, the Evening News is the local rag, which views the council and the tram system which is being built in a similar light to that in which paedophiles are viewed by lesser tabloids.
< 1294950921 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, haha
< 1294950928 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, why do they hate the tram?
< 1294950948 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because the council did it and it's not exactly been done with the greatest of competence.
< 1294950954 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Roadworks etc.
< 1294950966 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, why do they hate the council?
< 1294950973 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea.
< 1294950978 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They just *do*.
< 1294951010 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://edinburghnews.scotsman.com/news/Tram-talks-off-till-March.6689138.jp
< 1294951016 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Read comments for amusement/despair.
< 1294951018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would love to live in a city where trams are treated like paedophiles.
< 1294951018 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because the council is the government.
< 1294951020 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Therefore evil.
< 1294951024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It just sounds ... amazing.
< 1294951030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Trams: Is YOUR child next?"
< 1294951047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle (a -> IO b) -> IO a -> IO b
< 1294951048 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Exception bracket :: IO a -> (a -> IO b) -> (a -> IO c) -> IO c
< 1294951048 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.OldException bracket :: IO a -> (a -> IO b) -> (a -> IO c) -> IO c
< 1294951048 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Exception bracketOnError :: IO a -> (a -> IO b) -> (a -> IO c) -> IO c
< 1294951049 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*picture of young child riding a tram, onlookers stare in horror*
< 1294951065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*picture of young child riding a paedohpile, onlookers stare in horror*
< 1294951067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*paedophile
< 1294951084 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PEDOPILE
< 1294951086 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't that type signature just flip (>>=)??
< 1294951092 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/??/?/
< 1294951114 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, if you spell paedophile without an 'a' you are obviously a paedo.
< 1294951139 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yeah, but at least I'm an AMERICAN (not some filthy Amrican)
< 1294951197 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Re optimine, intriguingly "The FasterRender mod by @Scaevolus is included in beta 1.2, please let us know if it helps! And send him your regards".
< 1294951212 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Right. Isn't that the SSP-only one, though?
< 1294951220 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ppperhaps.
< 1294951220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes, it's =<<.
< 1294951221 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: (=<<) ?
< 1294951223 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But =<< is SO UGLY.
< 1294951227 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I already forgot what the different bits did.
< 1294951273 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://voices.washingtonpost.com/blog-post/2011/01/new_zodiac_sign_dates_dont_swi.html
< 1294951303 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love the way that article is written as if the Earth's axis has suddenly swivelled 30° overnight and astronomers have just noticed.
< 1294951342 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then the way that the astrologers try to justify it and they take it completely seriously.
< 1294951349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://people.cs.uu.nl/andres/lhs2tex/Guide2-1.16.pdf Oh wow, this is complicated.
< 1294951387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey j-invariant, have you used lhs2tex
< 1294951392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :say yes :P
< 1294951482 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find it slightly revolting when the advice for students writing lab reports is to use Word.
< 1294951562 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gleh.
< 1294951589 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :87.5% of our students use LaTeX for their reports. (Sample size: N=8.)
< 1294951589 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SCEA has *also* filed a description of how to go *about* deriving the private keys.
< 1294951608 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hey they added charcoal!
< 1294951612 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Charcoal
< 1294951613 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In essence, they themselves have made the entire thing a matter of public record.
< 1294951617 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bravo!
< 1294951620 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I just noticed that.
< 1294951621 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: the astrological signs start their division at the spring equinox (the actual modern one).  the fact that the divisions are named after >= 2000 year old constellation placements is just tradition.  this particular detail isn't really one of the arguments against astrology.
< 1294951626 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you might find this useful
< 1294951633 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, yes, I know.
< 1294951651 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well. It's a fairly short description, but one that any knowledgable cryptographer would be able to work with.
< 1294951671 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"They didn't use random numbers in their ECDSA implementation." ← Sufficient!
< 1294951699 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, elliott, from version history: "Spiders can climb up walls."
< 1294951701 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :be scared
< 1294951703 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :be VERY scared
< 1294951720 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought they'd always been able to do that.
< 1294951730 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can they climb up 1x1 pillars?
< 1294951734 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, no they could jump high however
< 1294951736 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, no clue
< 1294951751 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yes, that is a botherance.
< 1294951770 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh, wood and stone tools got a boost.
< 1294951783 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, they did?
< 1294951791 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clearly this is just a lull before Notch brings out the big difficulty hikes.
< 1294952051 0 :cheater-!~cheater@g231050135.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294952056 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1294952356 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Charcoal also obviously means light sources (well, until lantern-time) for your sustainability project. (Though I'm not sure how you get a furnace, since even though cobble is sort-of renewable, I'm not sure how you'd do a cobble factory without a bucket to move lava.)
< 1294952395 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lava is non-renewable now.
< 1294952418 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That, too.
< 1294952431 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I already have one from when lava was renewable from spawn
< 1294952442 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and now it is an artifact which can be used
< 1294952450 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something
< 1294952455 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, but if you'd like to start from scratch somewhere elsewhere, then it's a problemo.
< 1294952463 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, indeed it is
< 1294952534 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe you could manage to build a cobble factory around an existing lava fall (unless you'd count that despoiling nature, too), but still a bucket seems essential for moving water around.
< 1294952553 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I seen natural cobble factories
< 1294952557 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hard to use though
< 1294952560 0 :acetoline!~acetoline@125-237-12-196.jetstream.xtra.co.nz JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294952652 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SPIDERS UP WALLS WHAT WHY
< 1294952653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHYW
< 1294952654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WYHWYH
< 1294952654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HWHY
< 1294952655 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHY
< 1294952660 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHYWYHOIERYDRLTKJFGH,IOJKLD;SA'SC.F,GNMHLG;KJFD;SPOACLV,XCMVNBL,FGKTRPOEI45039ROKIO908I94586U859RTUYIR9TUJWHY
< 1294952670 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, did they climb up 1x1 pillars?
< 1294952726 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can they climb over fences
< 1294952732 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, what a shame: the wiki "Crafting" page recipe images are actual screenshots (cropped any which way and sometimes stretched strangely and whatnot); I was somehow assuming they'd be some clever table-driven things, like Wikipedia's chessboards.
< 1294953036 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ...that is how it works.
< 1294953073 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, some of them.
< 1294953126 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, I was sure that's how it worked.
< 1294953136 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The new "dye recipes" seem to be all more or less ugly screenshots.
< 1294953189 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go fix them?
< 1294953219 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night →
< 1294953316 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: DO YOU WANT TO READ MY PROGRAM
< 1294953323 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is it
< 1294953330 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: the worst program
< 1294953332 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay
< 1294953370 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :useful examples of mutually recursive functions?
< 1294953395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: is there a shortage of those?
< 1294953398 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When you run it your cat dies.
< 1294953425 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t scanl
< 1294953426 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b. (a -> b -> a) -> a -> [b] -> [a]
< 1294953524 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I cna't think of any
< 1294953526 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: can you
< 1294953531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: even and odd, for instance!
< 1294953533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: :D
< 1294953555 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only thing that cmoes to mind for me is EVAL/APPLY and some proofs, well they don't really count though
< 1294953556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: if you only have induction-recursion on naturals, and you can memoise them, it's even the fastest way!
< 1294953564 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eval/apply is pretty relevant
< 1294953570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all interpreter-esque things are structured that way
< 1294953571 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Hofstadter functions?
< 1294953575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more or less
< 1294953578 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sequences
< 1294953600 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The female and male ones, specifically.
< 1294953757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: here's my ugly program: http://sites.google.com/site/ehirdfiles/files/guessing-game.pdf
< 1294953780 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: state machines work nicely as mutually recursive functions
< 1294953781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh
< 1294953782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can simplify i
< 1294953783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :t
< 1294953829 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: at least you use lhs2tex
< 1294953842 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that's the sole reason this program exists :P
< 1294953849 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294953860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: complaints so far: <=, =>, && look ugly, they're too big... also, it italicises EVERY DAMN NAME, which is just really freakin' annoying
< 1294953867 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should, like, only use it for local variables
< 1294953887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: re: is there something like pastebin for pdfs, as i've just found out, "yes" pretty much
< 1294953895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: go to google sites, create a site, create a page, make it a file cabinet
< 1294953895 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: google?
< 1294953901 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :voila, instant file host
< 1294953914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: new version: http://sites.google.com/site/ehirdfiles/files/guessing-game.pdf
< 1294953917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :getGuess is less ugly now :P
< 1294953922 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: oh, extra complaint about lhstotex: you can't do
< 1294953924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do foo
< 1294953925 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :   bar
< 1294953927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it renders it as
< 1294953929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do foo
< 1294953929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  bar
< 1294953932 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g.
< 1294953940 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo = do blah
< 1294953943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         blah2
< 1294953947 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comes out as
< 1294953949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo = do blah
< 1294953950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  blah2
< 1294953959 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's stupid
< 1294953963 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's a bug
< 1294953971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probabl
< 1294953972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y
< 1294953984 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :extra complaint: it doesn't put enough whitespace between two successive functions in a \begin{code} block
< 1294954018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i wish there was a variant of literate programming that utilised hypertext better
< 1294954027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: like, i don't really care so much about having a coherent linear order
< 1294954036 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but i want to interleave code and documentation fully, and also have links
< 1294954045 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, i could link to the whole chapter comprising, say, the parser of a language
< 1294954055 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and individual functions would link to the place where they are discussed inside that chapter
< 1294954056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc.
< 1294954072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could even do a whole OS as a single literate program, because there wouldn't be a strict linear order, it'd be hyperlinked
< 1294954098 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah that would be a big improvement
< 1294954130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: and then I could make @ one gigantic literate program with both x86-64 asm and @lang code :D
< 1294954137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(@ is my platonic ideal dream OS)
< 1294954144 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(@lang is the language it's based on)
< 1294954266 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Aaaaagh*.
< 1294954281 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq does not approve of @/
< 1294954281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i love ams euler, it goes so well with linux libertine
< 1294954288 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s|/||
< 1294954289 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most of the BS-X games will only run for a certain number of boots before locking themselves out forever and ever.
< 1294954303 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Making it *even more impossible* to actually emulate the damned thing.
< 1294954312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294954315 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, including the poorly-batched square brackets?
< 1294954326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Is there something wrong with Euler's []s?
< 1294954340 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Short a bunch of former Nintendo developers "misplacing" a bunch of ROMs on the Internet.
< 1294954341 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's something wrong with Libertine's.
< 1294954354 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: There is?
< 1294954358 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which *has* happened for some of them.)
< 1294954377 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The closing one is noticeably narrower and longer than the opening one.
< 1294954382 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: If you just mean "they're not flippings of each other", well, it's olde-style.
< 1294954406 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294954414 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but the way it's done is sloppy-looking.
< 1294954425 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who uses square brackets anyway.
< 1294954523 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To mark elisions?
< 1294954531 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To make nested brackets less confusing?
< 1294954545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Loser.
< 1294954557 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't do it!
< 1294954562 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But some people do!
< 1294954593 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And whenever we have code snippets in the channel and they contain square brackets it also looks bad!
< 1294954595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: PLAY MY AMAZING GUESSING GAME :d
< 1294954597 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*:D
< 1294954605 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[]
< 1294954607 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[][][][]
< 1294954609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[[]]]
< 1294954650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: here's the .hs file :P http://sprunge.us/hRLa
< 1294954817 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@2001:4428:251:1:21f:16ff:fe68:a55 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294954817 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host
< 1294954817 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294954853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :while () { /* valid K&R C */ }
< 1294954955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: do you have any opinions on serialisation of arbitrary GADT values
< 1294954956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if not, get some
< 1294954970 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im not that interested in serliazation
< 1294954988 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but @ is based on serialisation!
< 1294954997 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in what way?
< 1294954998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: every value in the system is regularly and completely transparently serialised to disk
< 1294955006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: "RAM" is now a fancy word for "big disk cache"
< 1294955013 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric := orthogonal persistence
< 1294955016 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(This is so awesome that words cannot express it.)
< 1294955025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: yes, you just keep saying how @ is awesome while i explain ti
< 1294955026 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EVERYTHING becomes vastly nicer.
< 1294955028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i appreciate
< 1294955030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the effort
< 1294955030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*it
< 1294955032 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oi!
< 1294955056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what
< 1294955075 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, LaTeX in @: cool as ?
< 1294955087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Psht, I'm writing my _own_ format.
< 1294955097 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :More semantic!
< 1294955110 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LaTeX is based on the CRIPPLED MOUND OF PRINT LAYOUT.
< 1294955144 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought LaTeX was one of the few things you liked a lot!
< 1294955149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do!
< 1294955151 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it is not IDEAL.
< 1294955182 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about: implement a nice, clean typesetting system, and implement LaTeX on top of it?
< 1294955237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Impossible; my system will be a semantic documentation system, not a typesetting system.
< 1294955260 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The "LaTeX" part will be a program that takes some documentation and an optional object describing the nitty-gritty of formatting it, and producing an abstract typeset result.
< 1294955266 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By program I mean function.
< 1294955449 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Good night
< 1294955455 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What about when you want to write some mathematics?
< 1294955490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: That'll be part of the semantic format. The syntax will resemble LaTeX
< 1294955492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*LaTeX.
< 1294955507 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why not just have it BE LaTeX?
< 1294955531 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or have a LaTeX to @type converter?
< 1294955547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: see /msg.
< 1294955598 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Secret typesetting conspirationism!
< 1294955610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Actually, Minecraft SMP.
< 1294955634 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, well, that's far less intrigueish.
< 1294955648 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: And far more creepery.
< 1294955809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Got a spare server lying around?!
< 1294955905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It can't BE LaTeX because LaTeX is implemented on top of TeX, a low-level, print-based, layout and formatting-centric, non-semantic, imperative language.
< 1294955924 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was offered an old server by a family member, but I'm not up for paying money to my parents for the titanic electrical cost.
< 1294955977 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It's unlikely your connection is fast enough anyway.
< 1294955991 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep.
< 1294956007 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ergo
< 1294956016 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: WIPE ZEM AND USE IT TO HOST MINECRAFT
< 1294956290 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1294957135 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Woo
< 1294957141 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I managed to stay awake all day
< 1294957146 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Reading stuff
< 1294957152 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure it's quite performancey enough.
< 1294957442 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: RAM is the main thing.
< 1294957525 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ALL YOUR OBJECTIONS WILL BE MET
< 1294957601 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's something like a 1.5GHz Pentium M with maybe a gigabyte or two of memory. And a messy linux-vserver pseudo-virtualization thing.
< 1294957656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: But, but we are blowing up TNT.
< 1294957759 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1294958049 0 :Mesingw!~AEther@c-98-221-232-28.hsd1.nj.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294958064 0 :Mesingw!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :?
< 1294958279 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1294958297 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tomorrow, tomorrow, I love you, tomorrow, you're only a day away
< 1294958340 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, does the fact that you are singing love songs indicate events pertaining to Katie the AT?
< 1294958344 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes.
< 1294958352 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: *Katie A.T. Female
< 1294958364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like how it's pronounced "Katie-atie".
< 1294958447 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like an AT-AT from Star Wars.
< 1294958480 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't be surprised if there is actually something called a KT-AT somewhere in the Star Wars EU.
< 1294958491 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294958516 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, so basically, your girlfriend is part of the Imperial war machine.
< 1294958531 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm pretty sure that "I love you" referrs to "tomorrow" in that song, not to a person
< 1294958532 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any questions?
< 1294958541 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, she's not my girlfriend
< 1294958548 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*object of lust?
< 1294958581 0 :Tritonio!~TrT@athedsl-86851.home.otenet.gr JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294958746 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doesn't matter, she's still part of the Imperial war machine.
< 1294958750 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Logic says so.
< 1294958820 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://s3.amazonaws.com/data.tumblr.com/tumblr_lere161DYc1qay7sto1_1280.jpg?AWSAccessKeyId=0RYTHV9YYQ4W5Q3HQMG2&Expires=1295045258&Signature=cwhPuXXRZ/x2oU29OTpRyz2s044%3D
< 1294958837 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Awwwwwwww.
< 1294958853 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: LNOL
< 1294958854 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1294958862 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the smile at the end is hilarous
< 1294958869 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :happy at last
< 1294958904 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, logically you can make 8 coal from 1 coal now.
< 1294958915 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"logically"?
< 1294958918 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Given a supply of wood, which is far easier to secure than a supply of coal.
< 1294958924 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, abuse of notation.
< 1294958926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: BANK RUN
< 1294958936 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bank run?
< 1294958945 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: There's an inefficiency in the market, EXPLOIT IT
< 1294958952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Vastly inflate your coal supplies!
< 1294958958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It's basically a wonky exchange rate.
< 1294958966 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Given a supply of wood" you can make an indefinite amount of coal from 0 coal, can't you?
< 1294958984 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh
< 1294958990 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :logically??
< 1294958995 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, wood now smelts into coal.
< 1294959002 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Logically here is a picture of mars http://photojournal.jpl.nasa.gov/catalog/PIA13755
< 1294959025 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's charcoal, not real coal, isn't it? (With identical behaviour, but still.)
< 1294959040 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: do I have to update minecraft? I have never done that
< 1294959055 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, it updates on start if you've bought it.
< 1294959072 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I did say that "logically" was an abuse of notation.
< 1294959078 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll try to stamp it out.
< 1294959085 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does it mean!!
< 1294959086 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It updates even when you don't want it to, until you take pains to prevent it.
< 1294959090 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, I was ignoring you for suspected Englishness.
< 1294959165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it means MEANINGNESS
< 1294959173 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ecologically-sound torches/
< 1294959181 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently, bone meal makes crops grow instantly.
< 1294959186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Wait a second.
< 1294959194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: 1 coal = infinite coal, modulo trees.
< 1294959200 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Coal is now a renewable resource.
< 1294959200 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes.
< 1294959202 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes.
< 1294959204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Step 1: Mine 1 coal.
< 1294959207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Step 2: Set up free farm.
< 1294959209 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, modulo cobble.
< 1294959214 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Step 3: Turn trees and coal into more trees and more coal.
< 1294959223 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Step 4: Forever
< 1294959241 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : hurf durf i don't see why i should think when adding features
< 1294959268 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: COMEDY: Notch claims the uselessness of gold is his OMG POLITICAL statement about gold's real-world usefulness. Coal is now renewable. Theory: Notch denies climate change.
< 1294959280 0 :Tritonio!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1294959281 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do you need the 1 coal for?
< 1294959288 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You don't.
< 1294959358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, indeed.
< 1294959369 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFyY2mK8pxk
< 1294959403 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"If you use 'octopodes' you had better be able to give this spiel at a moment's notice, and in a British accent."
< 1294959406 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Done and done.
< 1294959430 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :octopine
< 1294959499 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Conclusion: people who say "octopi" are fair game for being punched in the face when they act like smug grammar Nazis.
< 1294959517 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :octopi? who says that
< 1294959555 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :smug nazis
< 1294959560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the same people who say virii
< 1294959570 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it also virodes?
< 1294959587 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Virii is fair game.
< 1294959591 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's Latin-derived.
< 1294959606 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cacti
< 1294959608 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Glargh, apparently not.
< 1294959619 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Goddamn declensions.
< 1294959624 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or is it conjugations?
< 1294959627 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Instead of VIRII?
< 1294959630 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :virodes :D
< 1294959685 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death
< 1294959693 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal is busy turning his entire chests of coal into more coal.
< 1294959694 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, from now on every word ending in -us has -odes as the plural
< 1294959705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i agree
< 1294959712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh... are there many?
< 1294959713 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hate Latin dictionaries which just assume you can work out the declensions off-the-cuff from the set of endings they give you.
< 1294959715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meatodes
< 1294959736 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The issue with "VIRII" as a plural for "VIRUS" is that in Latin, "VIRUS" is an uncountable noun.
< 1294959744 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wikipedia says "The word is from the Latin virus referring to poison and other noxious substances, first used in English in 1392. The plural is viruses."
< 1294959752 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.archives.nd.edu/cgi-bin/lookup.pl?stem=virus&ending=
< 1294959754 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HELPFUL
< 1294959770 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not according to that dictionary, pikhq.
< 1294959781 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So if you were to be *accurate* with your plurals, the plural of "virus" would be "virus".
< 1294959791 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least with comparison to their entry for arma, which I *know* is an uncountable noun.
< 1294959805 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(source: Wiktionary. May be wrong.)
< 1294959892 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Ah. According to Wikipedia, *some* dictionaries treat it as a generic second-declension noun. However, this is a neologism.
< 1294959895 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1294959940 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello
< 1294959959 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you do so, the plural is "VĪRA".
< 1294959960 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, why all the talk of octopodes recently?
< 1294960038 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, they were added to MC.
< 1294960044 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what!!
< 1294960060 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, they drop black dye.
< 1294960072 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're more sqoctopodes.
< 1294960073 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And yes, I'm damned well using all-caps for Latin.
< 1294960086 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And those little lines on the vowels!
< 1294960100 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consistent orthography is too puny for pikhq.
< 1294960107 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha, so it went something like "* implemented octopi" in the change log and then an explosion of ZOMG WRONG PLURAL FORM?
< 1294960121 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should have used it for "VĪRĪĪ" and "VĪRUS", as well.
< 1294960138 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sqoctopodes <3
< 1294960142 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or just omitted it in general.
< 1294960158 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, do the little lines, or do it in caps.
< 1294960162 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't do both.
< 1294960174 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And if you're going to do it in caps, use the Roman letters.
< 1294960192 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"VIRVS" or "vīrus".
< 1294960196 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One or the other.
< 1294960199 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The first is wrong.
< 1294960205 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm.
< 1294960206 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No.
< 1294960222 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :U for V in the middle of words is a Medievalism.
< 1294960236 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it a bad sign that I think of Latin words with the Roman pronunciations?
< 1294960289 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's technically right to do so with caps, as that practice *does* predate the presence of case in common usage...
< 1294960298 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*However*, it's not exactly classical.
< 1294960298 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: you probably think of english words with english pronunciations...
< 1294960325 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: BTW, I was thinking of it as "U because it's in the middle of a word", not "U because it's the vowel".
< 1294960351 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but does it make me unbearably pretentious to say "waynee weedee weekee" rather than "veiny veedy veechy"?
< 1294960382 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Depends on context.
< 1294960417 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: It's just "* a new water dwelling mob" in the change log, the plural discussion started because the unofficial MC wiki had pages "Octopus", "Squid" and "Octopi" already created.
< 1294960453 0 :Tritonio!~TrT@150.140.227.31 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294960468 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyways. KONSISTENT ORÞOGRAΦY EYE DISPIES!
< 1294960469 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ViciViciVeb
< 1294960695 0 :Tritonio!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit
< 1294960707 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: UuikiUuikiUueb.
< 1294960723 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pv3Tt0fFJkU&feature=related
< 1294960735 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GET OUT OF MY HEAD YOU GODDAMN TUNE
< 1294960742 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
< 1294960864 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what should I be working on in the next four days
< 1294960880 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: knowledge!
< 1294960892 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: scapegoat!
< 1294960897 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The ONLY blame-based version control system!
< 1294960909 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha
< 1294960909 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :features such as: probably slower than even darcs 1
< 1294960913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's not a joke :D
< 1294960920 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, the death of all people with second toes longer than their big ones!
< 1294960925 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION → sleep
< 1294960938 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep
< 1294960952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'll also probably use quite a bit of disk...
< 1294961086 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Every record of each revision contains the entire repository history up to that point.
< 1294961106 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course, every revision needs to know what it started with
< 1294961109 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unary-encoded for convenience.
< 1294961124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: that lacks FEATURES
< 1294961124 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and unary is just the easiest way to encode anything :P
< 1294961177 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm reading Bertrand Russel "Introduction to the Problems of Philosophy"
< 1294961178 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, cutting your hair makes everywhere colder - the effect can be significant if there was a lot of it
< 1294961184 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Russell
< 1294961196 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the whole thing is.. stupid
< 1294961196 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1294961207 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the hell is he talking about?
< 1294961227 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problems of philosophy?
< 1294961238 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: stuff like "tables don't exist even though I can touch them"
< 1294961255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't believe in tables
< 1294961272 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I really have not got the slightest clue what he's trying to get at
< 1294961313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is my gpu meant to be 73 C while idling?
< 1294961328 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does anyoen actually care about philosophy
< 1294961328 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why
< 1294961334 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: No.
< 1294961340 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: well ... it is :D
< 1294961340 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: But I suggest attaching a griddle to it.
< 1294961346 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: it's in a lapotp
< 1294961348 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*laptop
< 1294961348 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fry you some bacon!
< 1294961353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note that the laptop feels cool
< 1294961359 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ofc the thermal reading might just be bS
< 1294961360 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*BS
< 1294961386 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At 73°C, that shouldn't be cool to the touch.
< 1294961391 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::(
< 1294961393 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That should be melting your leg-flesh.
< 1294961404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: i think the reading is taken from _inside_ the core
< 1294961452 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I should write a tutorial about something that nobody cares about
< 1294961466 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Melting your leg-flesh!
< 1294961477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: make a tutorial about how to add one to an integer
< 1294961492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: apparently it's now 84 C
< 1294961528 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: this is trivial
< 1294961528 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, feynman is cool
< 1294961538 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like feynman
< 1294961544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not if you make it hard
< 1294961558 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bertrand Russell said "The goal of scienci is to find uniformities of the universe"
< 1294961584 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but Feynman said "I don't care if I get a simple equation for everything, I just want to understand nature. If there is no equation okay, that's what we find instead"
< 1294961602 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't get much out of Bertrand
< 1294961615 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everything he says is not even wrong
< 1294961685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: can i explain scapegoat to you, it's not fair just me and ais understanding it
< 1294961687 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: or you
< 1294961688 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: or you
< 1294961689 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: or you
< 1294961691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OR ANYONE
< 1294961694 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: YOUR LEG-FLESH IS IN PAIN, I'M SURE.
< 1294961698 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you already did, it's hilarious
< 1294961706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i explained it with one line??
< 1294961708 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: not now, I'm going to bed an hour ago
< 1294961710 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or have i mentioned it before
< 1294961733 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :足肉が痛んでるよ!
< 1294961766 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, there's a movie about feynman and throat singing
< 1294961804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ARE YOU NOT INTERESTED IN SCAPEGOAT
< 1294961927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: did i actually explain tit to you??
< 1294961936 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1294961940 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: when
< 1294961944 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just now
< 1294961963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that was not an explanation :)
< 1294961988 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: so you don't want to know? :
< 1294961989 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::(
< 1294961993 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*it
< 1294962070 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pah
< 1294962074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll bother copumpkin more then
< 1294962077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SUSPICIOUS LACK OF REPLY
< 1294962093 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when did copumpkin end up in here anyway?
< 1294962108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when PH got lambdabot back
< 1294962113 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all the DAMNED HASKELLERS invaded
< 1294962116 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and copumpkin kinda stuck
< 1294962132 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, we have a lambdabot now
< 1294962134 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@quote Plugin
< 1294962135 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plugin `quote' failed with: getRandItem: empty list
< 1294962143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://twitter.com/pigworker/status/25356492341252096 GET THERE NOW
< 1294962180 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Desperately Seeking Conor
< 1294962191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's in edinburgh dammit
< 1294962194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he can get there
< 1294962205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO EXCUSE NOT TO
< 1294962229 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it just says he's teaching.. it's not an invitation :P
< 1294962239 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but it COULD be!
< 1294962249 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;yeah .. if you misinterpret it
< 1294962250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if all else fails, stand at the window with your face pressed to the glass, listening intently
< 1294962253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps with a glass
< 1294962305 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you can talk to him on IRC
< 1294962350 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm sure he loves all the stupid questions we throw at him in #epigram
< 1294962373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: you fool! if you talk to him on IRC, you'll interrupt his Epigram coding!
< 1294962378 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you think 2 is taking so damn long??
< 1294962384 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1294962422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: On the OTHER hand, asking me questions about scapegoat slows nothing down and everyone should do it.
< 1294962436 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm
< 1294962438 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :new version of uAgda
< 1294962458 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION steals all of vorpal's entropy
< 1294962465 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there any neat way to diff two directories?
< 1294962476 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a programm called diff :P
< 1294962480 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*program
< 1294962489 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can do taht?!
< 1294962495 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, diff -r
< 1294962498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD
< 1294962501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH MY GOD IT CAN DIFF DIRECTORIES
< 1294962507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THIS IS THE BEST DAY OF MY LIFE
< 1294962507 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grat!!
< 1294962515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :absolutely grat
< 1294962530 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm
< 1294962537 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm diffing aginst my hacked copy
< 1294962547 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can also get kdiff or another graphical diffing tool, but most of them suck way more than diff and less combined
< 1294962560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: so since you're not sleeping i must tell you about scapegoat
< 1294962569 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and colordiff will make that suck even less)
< 1294962593 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, you'll just drive me away so I'm forced to sleep
< 1294962609 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>:(
< 1294962615 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: SCAPEGOAT
< 1294962615 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this update doesn't fix the bug I mentioned
< 1294962622 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: uAGDA
< 1294962624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: are you sure they actually saw the post about it
< 1294962629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you should have stored your uagda changes in scapegoa
< 1294962629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :t
< 1294962635 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what do you think of Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality?
< 1294962638 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it sounds interesting, which is what makes it so dangerous
< 1294962644 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then I would be blamed for breaking it?
< 1294962660 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: it's amusing, i haven't read it for ages
< 1294962665 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :two new uAgda example codes
< 1294962666 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(hmm, shaving... I can't imagine some people actually do that every single day)
< 1294962672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that isn't how scapegoat works dammit
< 1294962678 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION loves it so far
< 1294962694 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I have this beautiful vision of scapegoat in ym head, don't ruin it!
< 1294962709 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how does it work?
< 1294962712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: the reality is even better, because it's FRACTAL!! (not really but)
< 1294962717 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: the problem is that it never updates!
< 1294962719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well!
< 1294962739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: basically, everything is a Change, capital C
< 1294962739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and uh
< 1294962740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait
< 1294962744 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i can get olsner to listen if i try hard enough
< 1294962749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and copumpkin, i don't really wanna do this three times
< 1294962751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is, of course,
< 1294962753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :inevitable
< 1294962764 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-- let's use parametricity in a useful way: prove that any
< 1294962764 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-- function of type (X : *) -> X -> X is the identity.
< 1294962784 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :save the log, then paste it one line at a time at the right interval to make it seem like you're doing it in person all over
< 1294962795 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: f _ _ _ = undefined
< 1294962800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: is not a function.
< 1294962801 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: uAgda
< 1294962803 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@free a -> a
< 1294962803 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Extra stuff at end of line
< 1294962807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@them a -> a
< 1294962808 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are welcome
< 1294962812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh what's the theroems for free command
< 1294962813 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*theorem
< 1294962814 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@themk
< 1294962815 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  : parse error (possibly incorrect indentation)
< 1294962815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*theorems
< 1294962816 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@them
< 1294962816 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are welcome
< 1294962817 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION hates termination checkers
< 1294962817 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@them
< 1294962817 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are welcome
< 1294962821 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@help
< 1294962822 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :help . Ask for help for . Try 'list' for all commands
< 1294962823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: lol.
< 1294962828 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: it's not a "termination checker"
< 1294962833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just a sub-TC language
< 1294962838 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not a TC language + some checker
< 1294962841 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a stupid way to think about it
< 1294962851 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"sub-TC" is silly
< 1294962853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, good luck doing proofs with _|_
< 1294962859 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not strongly normalizing /because/ it's sub-TC
< 1294962869 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's sub-TC because it's SN!
< 1294962874 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, non-TC
< 1294962878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know whaddimean
< 1294962888 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tell me about scapegoat!
< 1294962890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@list
< 1294962891 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://code.haskell.org/lambdabot/COMMANDS
< 1294962899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: convince olsner to stay up long enough to listen and i WILL
< 1294962909 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@free a -> a
< 1294962909 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Extra stuff at end of line
< 1294962914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@free f :: a -> a
< 1294962914 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :g . f = f . g
< 1294962916 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: help me program in uAgda
< 1294962921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :worst theorem for free
< 1294962925 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i can only do one of those two things :D
< 1294962937 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hmm, maybe, how long will this take? :)
< 1294962948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: like 15 minutes max?
< 1294962957 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastebin.com/JmXRenaa
< 1294962959 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CHeck this out
< 1294962968 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool, that's about as long as is left of this half-played episode I just found
< 1294962985 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: do I have to duke it out to the death with that episode?
< 1294962990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, "max"
< 1294962993 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: neat
< 1294962997 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes!
< 1294963009 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I find paused mplayer windows all over, then I have to watch them to the end after unpausing)
< 1294963022 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: why is that a bad free theorem?
< 1294963038 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, I expect you to coexist peacefully
< 1294963049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: i refuse to talk to anyone without FULL ATTENTION! scapegoat is IMPORTANT1
< 1294963051 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*IMPORTANT!
< 1294963054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: it could give "f = id" :P
< 1294963084 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not how it works :P
< 1294963087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: you want to hear about scapegoat, I'm sure
< 1294963092 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm at work
< 1294963101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: ALL THE MORE REASON
< 1294963107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, where are you?
< 1294963116 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have this conception that ou're in the uk
< 1294963118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*you're
< 1294963132 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he could be canadian
< 1294963143 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: see my paste
< 1294963150 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i did
< 1294963157 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: be more excited!!
< 1294963161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i was!
< 1294963168 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: nah, US
< 1294963169 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the ! thing is like "gimme parametricity"
< 1294963187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: oh ... so you're lame
< 1294963194 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why?
< 1294963198 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because, uh
< 1294963199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because
< 1294963202 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why?
< 1294963205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BECAUSE I SAID SO
< 1294963216 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, I'm from england originally :P
< 1294963223 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, sure
< 1294963225 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure what  f! A< (Eq A< x<) x< (\_ p -> p)  does
< 1294963228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :giving them the secrets of our bad teeth
< 1294963229 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bastard
< 1294963231 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :born in london!
< 1294963235 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :looking at the type of f! doesn't really help
< 1294963339 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: have you seen the light yet
< 1294963356 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's silent because he's regretful
< 1294963357 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it's still winter here
< 1294963368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: have you seen the scapeglight
< 1294963388 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not a word I know, so it's hard for me to determine that
< 1294963389 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you're a bad englishman by american standards, anyway
< 1294963395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: o rly?
< 1294963399 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: the light of scapegoat
< 1294963411 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: I bet he eats crumpets and drinks tea, isn't that enough?
< 1294963425 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you're not supposed to be enthusiastic and noisy. You're supposed to be posh and nonchalant
< 1294963430 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I eat crumpets and drink tea
< 1294963437 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also like marmite and potato waffles
< 1294963440 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: i totally am, when i don't talk about scapegoat
< 1294963445 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is, incidentally, the best thing?
< 1294963453 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf is scapegoat
< 1294963456 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm aiming to be as annoying as possible until everyone agrees that talking about scapegoat would be preferable
< 1294963458 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that's a rhetorical quesiton, I don't want to know)
< 1294963461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: THE BEST VERSION CONTROL SYSTEM EVER
< 1294963467 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOOOOOOOO
< 1294963470 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I already did
< 1294963483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yeah but i'm trying to get as many people involved as possible first so we can have a big scapegoat party
< 1294963489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: HEY YOU
< 1294963490 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah you are losing me though
< 1294963493 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: ask me about scapegoat
< 1294963494 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: also you
< 1294963503 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i'm on the verge of giving up and just telling you
< 1294963568 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ok fine i will
< 1294963571 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey elliott
< 1294963572 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sup
< 1294963575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: do you know how git and darcs work
< 1294963575 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats scapegoat
< 1294963580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: THE BEST VERSION CONTROL SYSTEM EVER
< 1294963584 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now if you'd just been talking about scapegoat instead of talking about talking about scapegoat...
< 1294963590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :invented by ais, refined (BRILLIANTLY) by me!!!!124823954365706432-2==
< 1294963596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what i'm saying is i'm a genius? anyway ask me about it
< 1294963607 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't want to monologue like oklopol
< 1294963622 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how does scapegoat store its data?
< 1294963623 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds boring
< 1294963624 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bye
< 1294963661 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur:  [a]
< 1294964705 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Ix range :: Ix a => (a, a) -> [a]
< 1294964705 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :System.Random randomRs :: (Random a, RandomGen g) => (a, a) -> g -> [a]
< 1294964705 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude snd :: (a, b) -> b
< 1294964714 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION laughs
< 1294964722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t concatMap (\(a,b) -> [a,b])
< 1294964724 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall t. [(t, t)] -> [t]
< 1294964730 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@pl (\(a,b)->[a,b])
< 1294964731 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uncurry ((. return) . (:))
< 1294964731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ?
< 1294964737 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SCEA's lawyers have apparently shown up in #ps3dev on EFnet.
< 1294964738 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My dad's yelling at me to buy shoes
< 1294964741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t zip
< 1294964742 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b. [a] -> [b] -> [(a, b)]
< 1294964746 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The day before I go to the mall with someone
< 1294964749 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION mindboggles
< 1294964753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@pl (\xs ys -> concatMap (\(a,b) -> [a,b]) (zip xs ys))
< 1294964754 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :((uncurry ((. return) . (:)) =<<) .) . zip
< 1294964756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1294964761 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not saying anything. Just a guy with the right host mask.
< 1294964764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle [a] -> [a] -> [a]
< 1294964765 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude (++) :: [a] -> [a] -> [a]
< 1294964765 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.List (++) :: [a] -> [a] -> [a]
< 1294964765 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.List deleteFirstsBy :: (a -> a -> Bool) -> [a] -> [a] -> [a]
< 1294964766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: :D
< 1294964766 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: tell him not to yell or just ignore him
< 1294964778 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, oh, oops. He's not literally yelling.
< 1294964789 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://pastie.org/1458314 Here's logs.
< 1294964814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> [-1,-2..]
< 1294964815 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  [-1,-2,-3,-4,-5,-6,-7,-8,-9,-10,-11,-12,-13,-14,-15,-16,-17,-18,-19,-20,-21...
< 1294964822 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> [-1..]
< 1294964823 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  [-1,0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14,15,16,17,18,19,20,21,22,23,24,25,26,...
< 1294964857 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : kdutine: hi!
< 1294964859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH MAN IT'S RMS
< 1294964868 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Almost certainly not *the* RMS.
< 1294964891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OF COURSE IT IS
< 1294964904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: quick, gimme some haskell to enumerate all strings
< 1294964906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait
< 1294964908 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can just enumerate chars
< 1294964910 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I already did
< 1294964910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then [a]
< 1294964912 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you did?
< 1294965077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instance (Elems a) => Elems [a] where
< 1294965077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  elems = concatMap ofLength [0..]
< 1294965077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :    where ofLength 0 = []
< 1294965077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :          ofLength n =
< 1294965077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :            concatMap (\xs -> concatMap (\x -> xs++[x]) elems) (ofLength (n-1))
< 1294965080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: was it less ugly than that?
< 1294965093 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes :P
< 1294965097 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: show :P
< 1294965103 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I told you yesterday
< 1294965110 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HINT: concatMap is (>>=)
< 1294965112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you did? o_O
< 1294965117 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right
< 1294965123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to find t :D
< 1294965124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*it
< 1294965130 0 :Tritonio!~TrT@150.140.227.31 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294965137 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it might not have been yesterday
< 1294965142 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it was in the past
< 1294965144 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm grepping >>= on the logs actually gives nothing, how strange
< 1294965161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :definitely not before the 8th unless i'm missing something, wasn't it in haskell?
< 1294965175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*#haskell
< 1294965197 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :flip replicateM "fobar" =<< [1..]
< 1294965200 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> flip replicateM "fobar" =<< [1..]
< 1294965202 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  ["f","o","b","a","r","ff","fo","fb","fa","fr","of","oo","ob","oa","or","bf"...
< 1294965257 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah thanks :)
< 1294965298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :class Elems a where elems :: [a]
< 1294965298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instance Elems Bool where elems = [False, True]
< 1294965298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instance Elems Integer where elems = interleave [0..] [-1,-2..]
< 1294965298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instance (Bounded a) => Elems a where elems = [minBound..maxBound]
< 1294965298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instance (Elems a) => Elems [a] where elems = flip replicateM elems =<< [0..]
< 1294965323 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe this is like exaustive quickcheck
< 1294965327 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha
< 1294965334 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: guess how this helps me implement toList
< 1294965343 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::S
< 1294965349 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're actually going to /USE/ this stuff
< 1294965349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t maybe
< 1294965351 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall b a. b -> (a -> b) -> Maybe a -> b
< 1294965356 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: no, this is in a toy :D
< 1294965363 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even in a toy...
< 1294965390 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :toList :: (Elems k) => PM k v -> [(k,v)]
< 1294965391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :toList m = concatMap (\k -> maybe [] (k,) (m k)) elems
< 1294965392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: BEHOLD
< 1294965403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes indeed
< 1294965405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :type PM k v = k -> Maybe v
< 1294965412 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: have you got multitouch to work?
< 1294965415 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1294965418 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hao?
< 1294965422 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_o
< 1294965422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :installing things
< 1294965423 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want too
< 1294965428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: best ever?
< 1294965429 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which thingsssss
< 1294965431 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that gives an open list?
< 1294965432 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :URL
< 1294965437 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like [1,2,3,4,
< 1294965447 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION [explosion] elliott 
< 1294965448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater-: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/MacBookAir3-2/Meerkat
< 1294965449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yep
< 1294965454 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but it's GOOD ENOUGH :D
< 1294965456 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :useful X)
< 1294965456 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1294965463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well hey, got a better idea?
< 1294965468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I could just keep the [(k,v)] along with it
< 1294965472 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then the function would just be an optimistaion
< 1294965474 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*optimisation
< 1294965476 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I HATE optimisations!
< 1294965493 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's hnot possible unless you do something ugly like carry around an upper bound
< 1294965499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ew
< 1294965512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: inserting would be hilariously slow :D
< 1294965512 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's how polynomials are doen :(
< 1294965514 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hate it
< 1294965518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless i had a fast goedelNumber thing
< 1294965524 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: huh
< 1294965546 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :undecidable instances FUCK YEAHHHHHHH
< 1294965571 0 :cheater00!~cheater@g228062216.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294965620 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but hey
< 1294965631 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Main> toList Main.empty :: [(Bool,Integer)]
< 1294965631 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[]
< 1294965633 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just use finite keys :D
< 1294965644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION does "toList Main.empty :: [(Int,Integer)]"
< 1294965646 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should terminate eventually
< 1294965682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf
< 1294965689 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Main> toList (insert 3 42 Main.empty) :: [(Int,Integer)]
< 1294965689 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  C-c C-cInterrupted.
< 1294965695 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: is concatMap not lazy or something?
< 1294965702 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1294965703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1294965711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: "elems :: [Int]" --> all negatives first
< 1294965756 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: teach me haskell :D
< 1294965759 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294965759 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no
< 1294965762 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pls
< 1294965764 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1294965780 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll have to have ais teach me all of haskell then..
< 1294965800 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he'll be preoccupied and won't be able to write any more papers that you can illegally download..
< 1294965821 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION terrorizes elliott a little bit
< 1294965832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: i don't think ais will.
< 1294965842 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm sure he's friendly enough
< 1294965855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: can i see how you did the upper bound thing?
< 1294965890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: hey i just realised, you can look up any element certain types of infinite maps in finite time with my impl :D
< 1294965891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g.
< 1294965894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(\k -> Just k)
< 1294965897 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the mapping i -> i
< 1294965950 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I never actually wrote it but it would be  type PM k v = (k,k -> Maybe v) -- with the condition that for k' > k, f k' = Nothing
< 1294965971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: hmm does String have Ord? wait of course
< 1294965982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you still have to enumerate every string below that one though :-P
< 1294965983 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: everything has Ord!
< 1294965996 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a < b if a is enumerated first
< 1294965999 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: the idea is that with a perfect lazy specialiser, this should be a very fast implementation
< 1294966010 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this will never be efficient :P
< 1294966015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: because (f key) for common key will automatically get specialised
< 1294966022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which will involve the impl inserting key into a hash table for f
< 1294966031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mapping it to a constant value
< 1294966035 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. it turns into a hash table lookup
< 1294966120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but enumerating is a problem :/
< 1294966158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://polymathematics.typepad.com/polymath/2006/06/no_im_sorry_it_.html?cid=18295323#comment-6a00d8341bfda053ef00d83492d19d53ef troll :D
< 1294966171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf that link doesn't work
< 1294966177 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :weird
< 1294966223 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't understand why people discuss that 0.999.. thing so much
< 1294966229 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do people care at all? It's so lame
< 1294966234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Through proofs, yes, you have "proven" that .9 repeating equals 1 and also through certain definitions.
< 1294966235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But in the realm of logic and another definition you are wrong. .9 repeating is not an integer by the definition of an integer, and 1 most certainly is an integer. Mathematically, algebraicly...whatever, they have the same value, but that doesn't mean they are the same number.
< 1294966235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm getting more out of "hard" mathematics and more into the paradoxical realm. Have you ever heard of Zeno's paradoxes? I think that's the most relevant counter-argument to this topic. Your "infinity" argument works against you in this respect. While you can never come up with a value that you can represent mathematically on paper to add to .999... to equal one or to come up with an average of the two
< 1294966236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :, that doesn't mean that it doesn't conceptually exist. "Infinity" is just as intangible as whatever that missing value is.
< 1294966238 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but every time it comes up people discuss it for hours
< 1294966258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :discuss
< 1294966265 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more like idiots are idiots and other people yell at them
< 1294966404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what, jsmath is lagging my browser
< 1294966614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: so how goes the dependent cas :P
< 1294966624 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not making one
< 1294966682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but i thought that's what you were doing :(
< 1294966763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: or did you give up?
< 1294966850 0 :myndzi!~myndzi@c-24-19-39-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294966893 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1294966915 0 :myndzi!~myndzi@c-24-19-39-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294967087 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.
< 1294967152 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit
< 1294967220 0 :myndzi!myndzi@c-24-19-39-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294967786 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/41047777
< 1294967788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...
< 1294967790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD
< 1294967794 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was a random link from reddit
< 1294967795 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stupid clipboard
< 1294967798 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: http://xkcdinosaur.blogspot.com/
< 1294967802 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: You have been one-upped.
< 1294967899 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh
< 1294967943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh?
< 1294968170 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: :D
< 1294968246 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dear EVERY FUCKING FLASH VIDEO PLAYER EVER: stop requiring buffers of INCREASINGLY LARGE SIZE.
< 1294968364 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact: every buffering scheme for video from the Internet ever: YOU SUCK.
< 1294968401 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Buffer enough that, if the current average download speed continues, you will get to the end of the video without ever once stopping.
< 1294968482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus a bit
< 1294968519 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometimes, YouTube will claim an amount is buffered, and playback is before that point, yet it still stops
< 1294968707 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@209-6-232-56.c3-0.sbo-ubr1.sbo.ma.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294968710 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host
< 1294968710 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294968817 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, every fucking flash video player ever: HAND ME A URL TO THE ACTUAL VIDEO FILE. FLASH SUCKS.
< 1294968885 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1294968939 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :->
< 1294968941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1294969165 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Handing you a URL to the video file would be an extremely poor way to prevent you from learning the URL to the video file.
< 1294969301 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Why yes, yes it would.
< 1294969330 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Of course, as preventing me from learning the URL to the video file is, I do believe, a "dick move", that is irrelevant.
< 1294969899 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1294971189 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1294971417 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1294971443 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294971498 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1294971627 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294971907 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: even if it's a flv?
< 1294971937 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294971967 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: ... So?
< 1294971975 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: .flv is just a video container format.
< 1294971986 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mplayer demuxes it just fine.
< 1294971991 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1294973013 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh... Reminds me of once figuring out URL for datastream for flash video and then just downloading it...
< 1294973108 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It was a video about IPv4 depletion).
< 1294973384 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep
< 1294974818 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1294976591 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" why do people care at all? It's so lame" <<< maybe it's something where people think they are allowed to have an opinion in mathematics, and people love having opinions
< 1294976633 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people never seem to debate whether 0.3 recurring is 1/3
< 1294976685 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that's equivalent, people always prove an equivalence proof with 0.999... vs 1 first, as a lemma
< 1294976809 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's funny because what i see as the difference between S^Z and R is really that 0.9999.... is *defined* to be 1, by taking a certain equivalence relation between elements of S^Z
< 1294976838 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course, R has operations and shit, but that's just because after this quotienting, those start making sense
< 1294976927 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, of course you can always define R that way, i guess i can't exactly put into words what exactly is funny here
< 1294977331 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm somewhat confused about the functional nature of Haskell when it comes to IO. I have an entire program written in Haskell. But the moment I want to stop inputting the numbers directly in the program - and use command line arguments I need put everything in a do section and use IOStrings - right?
< 1294977377 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you typically keep your "business logic" out of IO
< 1294977388 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haskell kind of stops being functional when it comes to IO... :P
< 1294977393 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but only a little bit!)
< 1294977394 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really
< 1294977462 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin, yes - but lets say I had some business logic "add these two numbers to together and return the result"  I can't pass that function any numbers I got from input
< 1294977473 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure you can
< 1294977480 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how?
< 1294977482 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Oh wow*.
< 1294977498 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :say you have add :: Int -> Int -> Int
< 1294977513 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kk
< 1294977517 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So. That person-from-the-SCEA-lawfirm who signed onto the #ps3dev room?
< 1294977518 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do x <- readLn; y <- readLn; print (add x y)
< 1294977529 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*He used his real name*.
< 1294977534 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: smart of him
< 1294977537 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was it?
< 1294977544 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I quit #ps3dev
< 1294977550 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was depressing
< 1294977559 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"kdutine" was his nick; "Kip Dutine" is his name.
< 1294977606 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, you sure it wasn't a parody ?
< 1294977608 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: Shame that it's like 4 or 5 intelligent people and hundreds of complete morons going "LAWL PIRACY".
< 1294977617 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: The host mask was from the actual lawfirm.
< 1294977639 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I call Poe! <----- joke
< 1294977665 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT THE HELL python library for wikipedia
< 1294977672 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all "edit times" are 0 :-
< 1294977693 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But seriously... Those people who want a backup manager working on 3.55? Get off your ass and write it yourself if you care that much. If you can't be bothered, well, shaddup about it!
< 1294977727 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: damn right
< 1294977781 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though I *would* like to see a region-free PS1 and PS2 loader one of these days... I'm not exactly pestering the people who are trying to figure out how shit works about it!
< 1294977958 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i read that as religion-free PS1 and PS2 loader
< 1294977969 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i didn't get it
< 1294978025 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, ha
< 1294978150 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: you should join the fun!
< 1294978176 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all the cool kids are getting sued, so should you!
< 1294979066 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294979919 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294980177 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :moerning oerjan
< 1294981921 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1294982110 0 :comex!comex@c-67-188-10-190.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294984748 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1294984767 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294988690 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1294988774 0 :Tritonio!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1294988847 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1294989880 0 :shaswot!~pustakala@202.63.242.250 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294990530 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294991453 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, ice's expansion pressure is huge
< 1294991504 0 :rodgort!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shaswot: the channel knows, I do not
< 1294991568 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is it the channel knows? (Why does that sound like a silly riddle?)
< 1294991743 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the channel knows all, sees all
< 1294991762 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-254-37.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294991999 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended
< 1294992000 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294992271 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: water has ridiculous expansion pressure when it freezes
< 1294992298 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you know how much pressure is required to melt water at 251 K?
< 1294992319 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2040 atm
< 1294992326 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we should harness this somehow
< 1294992348 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is 2040 atm a lot?
< 1294992397 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 atm is atmospheric pressure
< 1294992401 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20000 meters of water if i recall correctly?
< 1294992404 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(hence atmosphere)
< 1294992412 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know that
< 1294992415 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't tell me anything
< 1294992426 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that water thing tells me something
< 1294992430 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it's true
< 1294992472 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhm
< 1294992506 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more
< 1294992521 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, i recalled 10 meters of water is one atmosphere
< 1294992557 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, it may be less
< 1294992565 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :due to the increasing force of gravity at depths
< 1294992570 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :simple linear calculations won't account for that
< 1294992580 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also the slight compressibility of water)
< 1294992592 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm 20km matters for that?
< 1294992597 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gravity
< 1294992599 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20km is roughly correct though
< 1294992654 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well anyway i don't know any physics, was just wondering if 2040 was actually a lot in some sense
< 1294992686 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that sure sounds like a lot
< 1294992712 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, actually based on the movies i've seen about space stuff, the atmosphere basically keeps us together
< 1294992718 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i guess it's not that little
< 1294992725 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20km affects acceleration due to gravity by somewhere in the vicinity of 1%
< 1294992745 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which isn't much, but if you're doing the calculus, it matters
< 1294992748 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in which direction?
< 1294992752 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :down
< 1294992760 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'm approximating anyways
< 1294992761 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alright, makes sense
< 1294992765 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah sure
< 1294992765 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(this is assumed from sea level)
< 1294992792 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, err, actually average radius
< 1294992799 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: "Normal high pressure gas cylinders or bottles will hold from 200 to 400 atmosphere (unit)s." (According to the omniscipedia.)
< 1294992827 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :APNIC pool: 39 212 032
< 1294992833 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::(
< 1294992838 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a depressing number
< 1294992863 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1294992873 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, when you're thirsty and it's -22 degrees Celsius out there, you should try something else than squeezing a block of ice to get some water to drink?
< 1294992962 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How low was it supposed to go, anyway?
< 1294993104 0 :shaswot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1294993111 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The esimated number at next allocation (triggering X-day): 32M-37M.
< 1294993142 0 :shaswot!~pustakala@202.63.242.250 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294993316 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seemingly someone in the US allocated a /10...
< 1294993342 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-237-203.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294993428 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now that kind of allocation from APNIC could be pretty much instant X-day...
< 1294993708 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So about 2M-7M left...
< 1294994246 0 :Tritonio!~TrT@dias.ceid.upatras.gr JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294994397 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ilua
< 1294994474 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death
< 1294994479 0 :shaswot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1294994514 0 :shaswot!~pustakala@202.63.242.250 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1294994591 0 :shaswot!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :?
< 1294999941 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* quintopia steals all of vorpal's entropy <-- nasty
< 1294999950 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION steals it back
< 1294999968 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU CANNOT DO THAT WITHOUT APPLYING WORK
< 1295000105 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, a friend gave me some for the purpose of this.
< 1295000112 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O KAY
< 1295000190 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :time to fetch clog logs again. Should add a daily cron entry calling the downloading script
< 1295000213 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :currently it happens rather erratically
< 1295000523 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the japanese class is sneaky, i just realized all the frequent messages from the teacher are now in japanese, and i have no idea when that happened
< 1295000553 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah
< 1295000589 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, then I guess that means you are getting the hang of the language
< 1295000605 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(except for a couple of translations in some messages, and complete translations in certain cases, maybe this was the first one without those)
< 1295001656 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl
< 1295001913 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295001959 0 :cheater00!~cheater@e181130110.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295002490 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pon
< 1295002552 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'pon my honour
< 1295003504 0 :acetoline!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1295004564 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1295005882 0 :Tritonio!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1295008199 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295008446 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295008770 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does the minecraft world wrap around?
< 1295008777 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ilke a donus
< 1295009008 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure that that's known
< 1295009014 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's certainly never been seen
< 1295009037 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Should be determinable based on the source
< 1295009504 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295009631 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I don't know if I went all the way around or just in a circle
< 1295009646 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: so nobody knows where it tends?
< 1295009654 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How many RL years were you travelling for?
< 1295009663 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also what do you mean by "source"
< 1295009710 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right, MC's closed-sourceish
< 1295009902 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish you could change your spawn point
< 1295009984 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295009994 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On some servers you can use the /spawn command to do that; in single-player, I'm not so sure.
< 1295010087 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could in creative.
< 1295010099 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You definitely can by editing the save file, but that's kludgy.
< 1295010122 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not /spawn, /setspawn or something.
< 1295010279 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :According to Wikipedia, "the largest possible world size to date reaching the equivalent of nearly eight times the surface area of the Earth before running into technical limitations", but the citation attached refers to a pretty old blog post.
< 1295010391 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Protocol-wise sometimes it sends absolute position numbers given as signed 32-bit ints that indicate 1/32ths of a block; that would allow for a 2^27 x 2^27 block square.
< 1295010480 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow thats insane
< 1295010488 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it would juts be quite a small world
< 1295010498 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That would be quite a lot more than "eight times the surface area of the Earth", so perhaps there are other limitations.
< 1295010539 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wikipedia says Earth has a surface area of 510,072,000 km^2; a 2^27 metre square has about 35 times that.
< 1295010630 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On our server the furthest place anyone's traveled has been about 140 kilometres away from the spawn, and that was enough to basically crash it, so I'm not sure how feasible an Earth-sized world is with the current architecture.
< 1295010639 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It will at least take a lot of disk space.
< 1295010640 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey
< 1295010646 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should totally break that record manually
< 1295010654 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the further you walk the more world it generates?
< 1295010668 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, but doesn't it drop the stuff you didn't change?
< 1295010676 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :answer to j, question to f
< 1295010709 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it just unloads those blocks on disk.
< 1295010713 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As far as I know.
< 1295010725 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think it ever shrinks the world.
< 1295010758 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not entirely certain about that, though.
< 1295010800 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros' file listings would probably answer that; if there's an unbroken path of chunks to the furthest point, then it probably doesn't.
< 1295010824 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you hack your way in and check?
< 1295010834 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or break into his house
< 1295010877 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could maybe just ask.
< 1295010891 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right
< 1295010896 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the third option
< 1295010907 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :honestly didn't occur to me
< 1295010999 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :next on the list was marrying him an infinite amount of times, and always getting half those files in the divorce
< 1295011005 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1295011020 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What.
< 1295011034 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what?
< 1295011052 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Constantly walking into one direction for 8 hours should (if I calculated right) give you the coveted "been furthest away" award (well, assuming you wouldn't have to go around mountains or anything). As well as create about ten thousand files (around a hundred megabytes, maybe) on his disk.
< 1295011068 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::O
< 1295011078 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could it handle that?
< 1295011084 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :8 hours isn't exactly a long walk
< 1295011097 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Based on someone's forum-post saying walking speed is "about 5 blocks/second".
< 1295011125 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, 80 hours isn't a long walk, as a project
< 1295011135 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc1-sgyl29-2-0-cust788.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295011135 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host
< 1295011135 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295011153 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!perl print 8*60*60*5
< 1295011154 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :144000
< 1295011162 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that'd be about 144 kilometres.
< 1295011168 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well. maybe it's slightly over medium, since it's not *that* much fun without far
< 1295011179 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure the "5 blocks/s" is in fact accurate.
< 1295011184 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's weird, since you can't walk that much in 8 hours
< 1295011195 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's 18 km/h, it sounds a bit fast for a walk.
< 1295011209 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right 5 blocks a second is not 5km/h
< 1295011224 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i forgot hours are stupid
< 1295011231 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't use them much
< 1295011263 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minecart max speed is 8 blocks/s, according to Minepedia, but I'm not sure how to compare. It does feel a lot faster than walking.
< 1295011268 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I saw a travel speed table somewhere.
< 1295011300 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_lmMmYAyow
< 1295011302 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD
< 1295011307 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4.27 m/s, http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Transportation
< 1295011312 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well note that i would probably not do it by running straight ahead, but strolling away, looking at the world
< 1295011324 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite possibly the funniest thing Fox News has ever done.
< 1295011333 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'sup?
< 1295011353 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, assuming 2 blocks/sec of actual progress, that'd be 20 hours.
< 1295011365 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the helll LOL
< 1295011398 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm still laughing.
< 1295011475 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"and that simple contact could be all that pedophile needs to fulfill his fantasies for the day"
< 1295011514 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, what MC things are you doing?
< 1295011535 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, currently i'm just making a base, but i feel kinda nomadish after that short talk
< 1295011539 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: He wanted to be the guy who's been furthest away from spawn, so I was computerizing how much walking would it take to get to (100k,100k).
< 1295011551 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lots.
< 1295011553 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a creeper blew up my pyramid :(
< 1295011555 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really
< 1295011560 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :according to fizzie
< 1295011578 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It's not that much: 8 hours if you could proceed with maximum walking speed to one direction; 20 hours might be realistic, even.
< 1295011604 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: though you might die half way
< 1295011608 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope
< 1295011612 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: You can't die on that server.
< 1295011615 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then I will just //goto one metre further.
< 1295011616 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1295011631 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes, but you'd be a FILTHY CHEATER.
< 1295011637 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: that wouldn't really change anything
< 1295011662 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :going farthest is the inspiration, not an actual goal
< 1295011683 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: You could try walking 100 km to bring visibility for some charity, I hear that's very popular.
< 1295011691 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295011703 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :walking 100km irl isn't much of a project either
< 1295011718 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we did this rather spontaneous 80km walk one weekend
< 1295011723 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but on-server there'd be a large audience.
< 1295011729 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :surely
< 1295011738 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Walk 4Mm.
< 1295011762 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can then say to everyone you walked the distance through the world!
< 1295011818 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not quite the whole world.
< 1295011841 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, 4000Mm is the radius, isn't it?
< 1295011850 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not that either, I don't think.
< 1295011860 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4000 megameters?
< 1295011868 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you corrected
< 1295011869 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yourself
< 1295011876 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because some protocol messages use absolute-integer coordinates that denote 1/32ths of a block; that'd be 2^27 metres.
< 1295011891 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also i might not have that much time for mc now since i just realized courses + other stuff actually take quite a lot of time, so dunno
< 1295011899 0 :totem!~brasero@unaffiliated/totem JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295011902 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I did mean IRL.
< 1295011912 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Ohhh, right.
< 1295011925 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is no "distance through the world" in mc
< 1295011943 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be nicer than the current fixed height tho
< 1295011963 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: IRL the Earth's circumference is 40 Mm; 40k kilometres.
< 1295011999 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mean radius is ~6.5Mm.
< 1295012010 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*6.3
< 1295012019 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean radius
< 1295012020 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*6.4
< 1295012027 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dammit, rounding.
< 1295012041 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, the radius? Of the planet?
< 1295012048 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: It's the distance from the center to the surface, approximately.
< 1295012052 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no that was a pun that made no sense
< 1295012082 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway earth's is a mean radius
< 1295012092 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahh.
< 1295012098 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I completely failed to catch that.
< 1295012140 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it doesn't have two parsings
< 1295012150 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i couldn't think of one that does
< 1295012152 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote  no that was a pun that made no sense
< 1295012168 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Earth's is a mean radius" works.
< 1295012191 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure
< 1295012212 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but with that mean-ing of mean, everything technically works
< 1295012220 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, everything with mean radius that is
< 1295012244 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Remote Authentication Dial In User Service (RADIUS).
< 1295012245 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :267)  no that was a pun that made no sense
< 1295012297 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, hey, can we have an unmodified SMP server while we wait for hMod to update?
< 1295012313 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And a pony!
< 1295012329 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is in a weird mood today
< 1295012346 0 :totem!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2rGTXHvPCQ
< 1295012365 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then again, hMod shouldn't take too long: the github repo has a "NON WORKING beta 1.2 release, DEVELOPERS ONLY" already.
< 1295012374 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, whoops, I misread that as "NOW WORKING".
< 1295012401 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh well, it's just one more line.
< 1295012413 0 :MigoMipo!~John@62.119.155.253 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295012540 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295013268 0 :Tritonio!~TrT@150.140.227.31 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295013363 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295013364 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host
< 1295013364 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295013475 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1295013855 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295013944 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION puts oklopol in a simulation of conway's game of DEATH!!#$!$#
< 1295014567 0 :__xrott__!~rottensix@110.139.109.163 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295014653 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh so I have an egg
< 1295014663 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :need to find that sugar cane
< 1295014717 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and flour I guess
< 1295014726 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it really worth it to make cake?
< 1295014734 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :idk
< 1295014850 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a principle thing, I think: it's cake, after all.
< 1295014852 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And a new recipe.
< 1295014856 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why does it say peter griffin :|
< 1295014859 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All new recipes should be crafted at least once.
< 1295014883 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, yes, actually.
< 1295014897 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It regenerates a total of 9 hearts and you can stagger it.
< 1295014902 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Minecraft Beta 1.2_01 (less bugs, more framerates)"
< 1295014906 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that didn't take long.
< 1295014909 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So have a single cake in your shelter, and use it when you get hurt.
< 1295014948 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"* Added a temporary fix to get rid of chunk visibility errors
< 1295014948 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The last one is interesting.. The problem with chunk visibility errors was that for some reason the “dirty” flag on chunks and the list of “dirty chunks” got out of synch. There wasn’t time to try to do a proper fix today, so I just made the client check a couple of dirty chunks per frame to make sure they’re in the list.
< 1295014948 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So until we fix it proper, you might get invisible chunks, but they will fix themselves after a second or two, usually way before you even get close to them."
< 1295014958 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How very shotgun-codingy.
< 1295014992 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, you can't put cake in the hand to use it?
< 1295015035 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, no.
< 1295015054 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because you can use it 6 times, which doesn't work with MC's eating system.
< 1295015063 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is also why food items don't stack.
< 1295015077 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still have the smegging Serenity theme stuck in my head...
< 1295015084 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't even seen the film!
< 1295015100 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't even watched Firefly! It's just latched onto my brain and it won't let go!
< 1295015103 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How is block resistence n/a?
< 1295015112 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a block, isn't it?
< 1295015196 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The cake?
< 1295015211 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It can't be picked up, so...
< 1295015215 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, it could be an entity.
< 1295015248 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now that charcoal exists, is there a point to regular coal?
< 1295015262 0 :__xrott__!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...............
< 1295015265 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, you know that block resistance measures the damage from TNT?
< 1295015272 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, vaguely
< 1295015277 0 :Tritonio_GR!~TrT@150.140.227.31 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295015286 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, yes, i.e. that it's a lot less resource-intensive to mine coal than to smelt lots of wood.
< 1295015312 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'll bump into coal when mining normally anyway.
< 1295015345 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, turns out that you can make bonemeal into any other dye.
< 1295015438 0 :Tritonio_GR!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit
< 1295015509 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Bone meal is used to make white wool by crafting one Wool block with bone meal above it."
< 1295015510 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uhhh
< 1295015609 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Sheep can also have their wool dyed by directly using dye (right clicking) on them. When a dyed Sheep is attacked it will drop coloured wool in the same way normal sheep drop their wool. This can be useful because you can obtain multiple coloured wool blocks from a single Sheep, instead of getting just one block from the crafting process."
< 1295015614 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now *that*'s amusing.
< 1295015636 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm feel like painting all on-server sheep pink.
< 1295015772 0 :__xrott__!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1295015843 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, is the server updated?
< 1295015865 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :great, it isn't :(
< 1295015866 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err
< 1295015867 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::)
< 1295015868 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant
< 1295015870 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, no.
< 1295015871 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION plays
< 1295015875 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just for future reference.
< 1295016020 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait do you need a pick to mine coal??
< 1295016030 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like if you break the block without you just get nothing?
< 1295016104 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes.
< 1295016128 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But a wooden pick is good enough.
< 1295016153 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qXorGZcsnHo
< 1295016162 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mt. Hoover *needs* one of these.
< 1295016185 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I ust wasted two blocks of coal ;_;
< 1295016223 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I tried making a farm but if you run too far away the animals disappear
< 1295016229 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: like even if they are completely trapped
< 1295016246 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, they must despawn if you venture too far.
< 1295016295 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Nice sound.
< 1295016338 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow tta's like an arrow cannon why does that work?
< 1295016410 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dispenser + clock circuit, isn't that quite simple.
< 1295016493 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3RAjfNdZ0hw&feature=player_embedded
< 1295016496 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My god.
< 1295016506 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't understand it
< 1295016509 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, yes?
< 1295016510 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this thing built into the game
< 1295016514 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, the trick is getting a very high-speed oscillator.
< 1295016518 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is that some kind of unintended consequence
< 1295016520 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, just got added.
< 1295016522 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yesterday.
< 1295016542 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dispensers eject their contents when they receive a redstone charge.
< 1295016564 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't say I understand redstone oscillators either, but they're well-known things, you can find designs in the web.
< 1295016613 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The moment when that video actually scrolls up was very impressive.
< 1295016624 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Extremely.
< 1295016713 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would assume some sort of a trick has been used to fill all those guns with eggs, though.
< 1295016929 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, natureally.
< 1295016932 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*naturally
< 1295017008 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295017196 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out
< 1295017300 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295017458 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is leaving soon
< 1295017473 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To wait 5 hours to see someone for 1.5 hours :/
< 1295017540 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why not just go in 4 hours?
< 1295017570 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By waiting, I mean most of the time will be commutting
< 1295017572 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I can't think of a suitable Katie A.T. comment here. Submissions are welcomed.)
< 1295017677 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.
< 1295017732 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, so how many bugs did the new version add?
< 1295017734 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Something about commuting and the AT-AT walker, maybe.
< 1295017754 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, will you be travelling on a KT-AT, then?
< 1295017758 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, none I noticed.
< 1295017761 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BA-DUM CHING
< 1295017769 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OTOH, I didn't do any particularly intensive playing.
< 1295017797 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well there is a _01 version
< 1295017820 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, but I didn't see any bugs.
< 1295017826 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haven't been on SMP as well, though.
< 1295017847 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and they added the bug fixes from optimine it seems
< 1295017848 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahah
< 1295017869 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The top speed of AT-AT is 60 km/h, maybe you could work that in too somehow.
< 1295017873 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295017911 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and gold tools got a boost, but not when it comes to durability
< 1295017955 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I have decided that as soon as the server updates Mt. Hoover must get a repeating double-barrel arrow machine gun.
< 1295017962 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qXorGZcsnHo
< 1295017971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I agree, but only if we also get creepers.
< 1295017980 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yesyesyes.
< 1295017989 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hope we don't get creepers
< 1295018002 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps we could do that SMP airbase thing while we wait for hMod to update.
< 1295018008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:12:51  "While the copyright of the play Peter Pan, or the Boy Who Wouldn't Grow Up by J. M. Barrie has expired in the United Kingdom, it was granted a special exception under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988 (Schedule 6)[33] that requires royalties to be paid for performances within the UK, so long as Great Ormond Street Hospital (to whom Barrie gave the rights) continues to exist."
< 1295018016 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is ridiculous.
< 1295018019 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If Vorpal agrees not to whine about dying.
< 1295018027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You have diamond armour and probably more than one diamond sword.
< 1295018038 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I do not have diamond armour
< 1295018040 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As well as an almost-inaccessible-for-mobs, completely-protected castle.
< 1295018042 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have literally nothing to fear.
< 1295018046 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, you can trivially get it.
< 1295018054 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true
< 1295018056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Assuming you nabbed diamond from spawn when you could which I find likely.
< 1295018057 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Surely that's not recognized in any other country?
< 1295018062 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Errr
< 1295018064 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: That
< 1295018069 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but we'll obviously set creepers off everywhere on top of Mt. Vorpal.
< 1295018073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Presumably.
< 1295018092 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Well, it's only royalties for performances in the UK, not "proper" copyright-as-in-actually-control-the-rights thing. But still.
< 1295018095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Still, ugh -- can you imagine trying to overturn that? "But what about the children!" (Great Ormond Street is a children's hospital.)
< 1295018104 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I read that as that they are turned off
< 1295018122 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: WON'T ANYONE THINK OF THE CHILDREN?!?!
< 1295018141 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think children should be banned just so people can't pull that crap.
< 1295018149 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: So what if a different children's hospital wants to put on a performance of it :P
< 1295018166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: THEY HAVE TO TURN OFF LIFE SUPPORT SYSTEMS TO RAISE MONEY TO GIVE TO THE EVIL, CORPORATE CHILDREN'S HOSPITAL.
< 1295018175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WON'T ANYONE THINK OF THE CHILDREN?!?!?!?!?!
< 1295018198 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eh, they'll live so long as their medicinal colon pipes are in place.
< 1295018230 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Assuming you nabbed diamond from spawn when you could which I find likely. <-- I wish I had...
< 1295018237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not if some paedophile seizes them, Gregor.
< 1295018244 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Just ask server for diamond, the chest not working is a mere bug.
< 1295018250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm sure you'd get it.
< 1295018264 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bye elliott and all
< 1295018278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bye?
< 1295018278 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Well, I might be here a few more minutes. Don't rely on it though]
< 1295018281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, Alluded-To.
< 1295018281 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, still you don't even have somewhere to hide at night.
< 1295018292 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Sgeo is off on a 5-hour KT-AT trip.)
< 1295018300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :5-hour? Dear god.
< 1295018309 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: When the KT-AT's rocking, you'd better not come a'knocking.
< 1295018309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, but I have enough diamond blocks from spawn to make diamond armour and a sword.
< 1295018310 0 :totem!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :?
< 1295018319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: And with that you don't _need_ a house.
< 1295018327 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Based on the movie, those things seemed pretty wobbly.)
< 1295018333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Do you have that locally or have you tried it on a test server?
< 1295018336 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I creeper exploded my pyramid :(
< 1295018337 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, he said that it was 5 hours for a sum total of half an hour of whatever the hell it is he plans to do.
< 1295018340 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I have; you kill skeletons in two hits.
< 1295018348 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott, still you don't even have somewhere to hide at night.
< 1295018350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Eh?
< 1295018351 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: :(
< 1295018368 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: Do you have that locally or have you tried it on a test server? <-- tried what?
< 1295018373 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: 5 hours of travel for 1.5 hours of "action".
< 1295018375 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He has a share in HHI, and as such can use corporate shelters.
< 1295018398 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Diamond armour + sword.
< 1295018410 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Couldn't they just use a hotel?
< 1295018416 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well I made some just now on ineiros' server
< 1295018419 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think they need to go to the Australian outback for some privacy.
< 1295018449 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, with a dad like that, who knows
< 1295018459 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-D
< 1295018467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They turn around and he's been following them ALL THIS TIME
< 1295018473 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All the way to Australia
< 1295018478 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm
< 1295018485 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the hell is going on here
< 1295018489 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295018492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Sgeo is in Australia
< 1295018492 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/gVH9s.png
< 1295018495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1295018506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what do you mean?
< 1295018512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also lol @ _01, i wonder what notch broke
< 1295018514 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :water comeing from nowhere O_o
< 1295018521 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, he's headed for Australia.
< 1295018522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: All water comes from nowhere.
< 1295018527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: It's a water block.
< 1295018529 0 :cheater00!~cheater@e181137183.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295018533 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :minecraft does not have conservation of mass
< 1295018533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just like at the edges of pools, say.
< 1295018536 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it flows down from there.
< 1295018544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: All  waterfalls are like that.
< 1295018550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: (only 3 torches?)
< 1295018556 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>.> we're not doing anything
< 1295018563 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bye
< 1295018572 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, it's OK, your dad can't spy on you here.
< 1295018578 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or wait, maybe he can.
< 1295018583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: "The last one is interesting.. The problem with chunk visibility errors was that for some reason the “dirty” flag on chunks and the list of “dirty chunks” got out of synch. There wasn’t time to try to do a proper fix today, so I just made the client check a couple of dirty chunks per frame to make sure they’re in the list."
< 1295018590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: [I am watching you. --your dad, proxying]
< 1295018594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: [xoxo]
< 1295018603 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, we can always kidnap him for a couple of hours.
< 1295018613 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: So what's the secret useful block?
< 1295018614 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We'll be more than happy to, in fact.
< 1295018624 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dispenser
< 1295018626 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*.
< 1295018627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. And then kill him.
< 1295018636 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sshhhh!
< 1295018645 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We're TRYING to trick Sgeo!
< 1295018648 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: UPDATE THE SERVER
< 1295018655 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there something interesting in nether?
< 1295018687 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, lightstone. Slow sand. Netherstone. Ghasts.
< 1295018697 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, wait with updating server until hmod is updated (or bukkit is out)
< 1295018699 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, :)
< 1295018706 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's also usable as hyperspace.
< 1295018706 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, just use the alternative laucher to play
< 1295018709 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: hMod will never be updated.
< 1295018718 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well wait for bukkit then
< 1295018726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Bukkit is not going to be stable for a _while_.
< 1295018730 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They haven't even released a pre-alpha build yet.
< 1295018739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is nothing wrong with the vanilla server, just don't make any big jumps.
< 1295018743 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not like you do anyway, thanks to armour.
< 1295018747 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well iirc hmod was going to be upgraded until hmod was out
< 1295018755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Allow me to quote.
< 1295018756 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, if I do that I take armour off.
< 1295018761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although people have already been under the impression that we pledged to keep hMod up to date, this isn't the case. Prior to this announcement, we had not stated anywhere that we would be maintaining hMod and anyone believing otherwise was mistaken. However, we do recognise the predicament we've put server admins in as hey0 has announced that hMod is essentially no more, and Bukkit is not ready for public consumption yet.
< 1295018762 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[We will try and update hMod (at least this time)]] — Bukkit devs.
< 1295018770 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently the Bukkit team are "trying" to update hMod.
< 1295018773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I wouldn't rely on it.
< 1295018775 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The beta update is _big_.
< 1295018781 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yeah.
< 1295018788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It will take longer then the original beta update, I would bet.
< 1295018794 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably
< 1295018795 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I would just use the vanilla server for now.
< 1295018806 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, just use the alternative launcher
< 1295018809 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it works perfectly
< 1295018816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've already updated, and I want lapis lazuli.
< 1295018822 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slow sand?
< 1295018825 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295018833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: *SOUUUUUL sand
< 1295018834 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you don't have a backup? Well I could send you my files then
< 1295018838 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, relevant: bonemeal can be turned into lapis lazuli.
< 1295018847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I think you're missing something here: I _want_ to be updated.
< 1295018852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: What exactly is wrong with the vanilla server?
< 1295018858 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros used it before and there were no problems.
< 1295018861 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no /home or /spawn
< 1295018863 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Problem: we don't have bonemeal unless monsters are on.
< 1295018868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: So?
< 1295018870 0 :cheater00!~cheater@e181137255.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295018873 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also, health is a bugger.
< 1295018875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not like you can't find Mount Vorpal.
< 1295018882 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Less of a bugger than not having the newest version
< 1295018895 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not really no. The current version works fine.
< 1295018902 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but sure, as long as monsters are off.
< 1295018933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Current version isn't fine for anyone who's using the latest version in their single-player game
< 1295018951 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, easy to switch. just an mv
< 1295018956 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or two rather
< 1295018964 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and you always made backup of old version before
< 1295018969 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I would assume you have that now too
< 1295018975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I didn't, because I realise it'll only be useful for a few days.
< 1295019010 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well then I can send you my files if you want.
< 1295019024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd rather ineiros updates :-P
< 1295019026 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He did last time, so.
< 1295019035 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway no glass kit, no other kit either if you play without a mod
< 1295019053 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295019067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not like glass is being used much.
< 1295019076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it's not like our tools are going to wear out in the next, uh, 100 years or so.
< 1295019089 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is a "non-working" 1.2 hMod in th github, so someone's doing something, at least.
< 1295019093 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, actually, shovels can wear out surprisingly quickly.
< 1295019104 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH NO GRASS WILL TAKE HALF A SECOND TO DIG!!!!!!!!!!
< 1295019111 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott, relevant: bonemeal can be turned into lapis lazuli. <-- how?
< 1295019119 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not telling.
< 1295019123 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SECRET
< 1295019126 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, there is no mention on the wiki of that
< 1295019127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Advantage of latest beta: Coal is completely renewable.
< 1295019135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: With a tree farm, you can turn 0 coal into 1,000,000 coal.
< 1295019143 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes, that is a minor advantage.
< 1295019144 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Why? Wood can be smelted into 8 coal.
< 1295019146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Minor"?
< 1295019151 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Coal is the most useful fucking ore in the game.
< 1295019155 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have like 70 furnaces.
< 1295019156 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, disadvantage: no hmod or bukkit yet
< 1295019160 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is way larger
< 1295019162 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FFS.
< 1295019183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ... seriously, how often do you use hMod commands? /home, /spawn, maybe.
< 1295019188 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Health? You never do anything dangerous anyway.
< 1295019189 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We have enough iron stocks to offset health considerably anyway.
< 1295019197 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, /kit too
< 1295019209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: seriously?
< 1295019212 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How often do you use that?
< 1295019215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's (1) glass and (2) tools.
< 1295019221 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, twice the last few hours. Been mining.
< 1295019222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You already have tools. Probably backups knowing you.
< 1295019235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mining? Don't you have EVERY ORE EVER?
< 1295019256 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295019259 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, mining is also fun. Since I combined it with spelunking
< 1295019273 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and without spelunking, what is the point of minecraft?
< 1295019277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Riiiiiiight.
< 1295019342 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and health off is important.
< 1295019382 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. It isn't.
< 1295019389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You always do things the safest way. You rarely jump far.
< 1295019390 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why not
< 1295019397 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a language with a continuous address space?
< 1295019398 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How on EARTH is health a problem for you?
< 1295019404 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, never wondered why I had no armour the last few weeks?
< 1295019407 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, because it broke
< 1295019407 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. floating-point pointers
< 1295019413 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: By doing what?
< 1295019421 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, spelunking
< 1295019435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: How did you lose health?
< 1295019450 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, fall damage mostly
< 1295019456 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, given the health regenerates and armour doesn't, it's not too big a deal.
< 1295019462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Are you too stupid to see what's right ahead of you??
< 1295019469 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just don't jump down 20-metre drops and you'll be fine.
< 1295019469 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: But yeah, as Phantom_Hoover said, health regenerate.
< 1295019471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*regenerates.
< 1295019472 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quickly.
< 1295019477 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1295019478 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt you could die without being incredibly wilfully stupid.
< 1295019480 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, only if monsters are off though
< 1295019487 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Uhh, you think ineiros is going to turn monsters on?
< 1295019489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you on crack?
< 1295019505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Oh, I was going to wait for hMod, BUT INSTEAD I TURNED MONSTERS AND PVP ON AND THEN DESTROYED YOUR HOUSE, ENJOY."
< 1295019505 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, who knows. Has he been near alcohol?
< 1295019519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, right, I forgot, alcohol turns people into abject morons in Vorpal-land.
< 1295019528 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No exceptions.
< 1295019532 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well remember hell world?
< 1295019548 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note how that had no lasting effects and did not take place in the actual world.
< 1295019553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note how it happened only because of lots of invalid moving going on.
< 1295019558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note how you're making no sense whatsoever.
< 1295019559 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, true
< 1295019566 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am making sense
< 1295019569 0 :hiato!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295019616 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: Someone on comp.lang.c seriously suggested extending C so that floats can be used as array indices to access individual bits of the bytes.
< 1295019647 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: i was more thinking about arbitrary-precision definitions of data
< 1295019650 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :?
< 1295019651 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: :-D
< 1295019654 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295019655 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fractals or continuous functions
< 1295019662 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, makes sense.
< 1295019663 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i can see how floats would be fun there :D
< 1295019664 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: the Infinity Machine has infinite-sequence-of-bits addressed memory.
< 1295019666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is equivalent.
< 1295019673 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~sgtatham/infinity.html
< 1295019683 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: welllllll
< 1295019692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An infinite sequence of bits is the same as a real.
< 1295019697 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the practical side of things will probably be very different.
< 1295019699 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't disagree with that, because you'll be wrong.
< 1295019705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: This is not practical in any way, shape, or form.
< 1295019784 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-10-158.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295019916 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good
< 1295019919 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the way i like it.
< 1295019959 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm installing half of windows on my ubuntu right now. meh
< 1295019974 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why does everyone use windows?
< 1295019979 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know
< 1295019979 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I always thought it was rubbish so I never bothered
< 1295019981 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea
< 1295019988 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i want to run fallout 2
< 1295019993 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and this means i need to run winetricks
< 1295019994 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, join the club!
< 1295020001 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The answer is market dominance.
< 1295020007 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AKA capitalism doesn't actually work.
< 1295020010 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used to use Mac OS but I don't like apple any more
< 1295020011 0 :Tritonio!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1295020040 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think apple used to be a good company but they have rotted and now they push DRM etc etc
< 1295020044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i hate apple, just bought an apple machine, and don't use mac os on it
< 1295020049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION CRAAAAAZY
< 1295020062 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I couldn't install any GNU/Linux system of my mac
< 1295020085 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: YOU ARE OUT OF YOUR ELEMENT
< 1295020087 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I could but it didn't work perfectly
< 1295020105 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*GNU/Linux/X.org/util-linux-ng/cron/...
< 1295020117 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats X.org lol
< 1295020126 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's Linux
< 1295020128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The providers of the X11 server. The term GNU/Linux is frankly offensive.
< 1295020140 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that a kernel for the GNU operating system?
< 1295020145 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linux is a made up operating system from the hit TV series "The IT Crowd"
< 1295020145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, GNU did _not_ provide all the software required to run this Linux machine.
< 1295020157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They don't get the right to the name just because they wrote the coreutils.
< 1295020162 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: oh.
< 1295020184 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: got any citation on this?
< 1295020191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Citation for what exactly?
< 1295020201 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that GNU/Linux is offensive
< 1295020203 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: for the fact that GNU did not make ALL of Linux
< 1295020207 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, actually look up who wrote the software?
< 1295020210 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: That's a personal, subjective opinion.
< 1295020216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: How am I supposed to provide a citation for it?
< 1295020226 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: [E. Hird]
< 1295020234 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you use non-GNU software integrally to your OS, "GNU/Linux" is inaccurate.
< 1295020257 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: what about GNU+Linux?
< 1295020259 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Linux" is more acceptable since it is almost universally used as a generic term for a Linux-based operating system; "the Linux kernel" is more commonly used to refer to the kernel itself.
< 1295020277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"GNU/Linux" manages, by omission, to disregard all the other important parties who wrote software to make a modern Linux OS work fully.
< 1295020284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rms enjoys overstating GNU's efforts.
< 1295020285 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since Linux :|: GNU != {}
< 1295020286 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think Linux omits them too
< 1295020301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: As I said: Linux is used as a generic name to refer to a Linux-based operating system.
< 1295020312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: "GNU/Linux" is explicitly defined, and exclusively used, as referring to Linux as a kernel.
< 1295020316 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, you still haven't demonstrated that you aren't English and as such should not be ignored, BtW.
< 1295020322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Therefore, "GNU/Linux" disregards more efforts than "Linux".
< 1295020331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And also puts GNU in an unwarranted position of importance.
< 1295020347 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what other kernels does GNU have?
< 1295020352 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HUUUUURD
< 1295020358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And, uh, kFreeBSD if you use Debian :-P
< 1295020368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except that uses BSD libc I think. Or does it? I don't know. Maybe not.
< 1295020374 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think not actually.
< 1295020381 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Elliott HUUUUURD
< 1295020401 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kElliottBSD
< 1295020410 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and Liott
< 1295020422 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the three kernels of the ELLIOTT operating system.
< 1295020430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@'s kernel is @.
< 1295020430 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe you meant: . ? @ ask bf do ft id msg pl rc v wn
< 1295020437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck off, lambdabot.
< 1295020455 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are there any kernels being developed for lambda machines?
< 1295020459 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^bf-txtgen floople
< 1295020468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"lambda machines"?
< 1295020472 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: fail
< 1295020472 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^help
< 1295020472 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ ; ^def   ; ^show [command]; lang=bf/ul, code=text/str:N; ^str 0-9 get/set/add [text]; ^style [style]; ^bool
< 1295020477 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lisp machines!
< 1295020478 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is.
< 1295020484 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen rambunctiability
< 1295020495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: Uh, Genera is still sold but not maintained.
< 1295020503 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it was fungot for some reason...
< 1295020503 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: when, in such a fun thing! just foaming at the
< 1295020518 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't the GNU operating system (emacs) work on lisp machines?
< 1295020570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: Symbolics machines came with Zmacs.
< 1295020581 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :136 ++++++++++++++[>+>++++++++>+++++++>+++++++<<<<-]>>++.>>-.<<-----.>.<++++++++.-------.>+.<++++++.>++++++.>.+.+++++++.+++.<.<.+++++.<----. [700]
< 1295020583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: Well, and all other Lisp Machines.
< 1295020588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Zmacs was written for the MIT Lisp machine and runs on its descendants (Symbolics Genera, LMI Lambda, TI Explorer). Zmacs is written in Lisp Machine Lisp (called ZetaLisp on Symbolics Lisp Machines)."
< 1295020635 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@bf ++++++++++++++[>+>++++++++>+++++++>+++++++<<<<-]>>++.>>-.<<-----.>.<++++++++.-------.>+.<++++++.>++++++.>.+.+++++++.+++.<.<.+++++.<----.
< 1295020635 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  rambunctiability
< 1295020667 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can hear a lot of teen girls outside my door
< 1295020672 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm gonna go check it out
< 1295020684 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen On Thinkable Forms, with notes towards a Logical Imaging Technique
< 1295020688 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :653 ++++++++++++[>+++++++>+++++++++>++++++>+++<<<<-]>-----.>++.>>----.<<<+++++.++++++++++++++++++++.+.>.---.<--------.+.>+.<+++.>>>.<--.<<++++++++++.+++.>>+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++.++++++.>++++++++++++.------------.<++++.<---.>---.<-.>>.<<<----.+.>>.<---.>-.>.<+.-----.++++++++.<----.<+++.>+++.>----.>.<<---.>>.<<---------------------.>----.<<-----------.++.------.--.>>---.>.+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++.++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
< 1295020693 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :phail
< 1295020805 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait
< 1295020816 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should generate a new world after update
< 1295020827 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to mine new blocks, right?
< 1295020841 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or just move around to generate new chunks?
< 1295020878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: just move around
< 1295020893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: you may want to use a mapping tool to find where the nearest unloaded part is
< 1295020941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: "Oh look, flight in Beta." http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=131336&sid=9ad025becbbe3a02f18bb7fa340b6670
< 1295020944 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Bat -- out of the cag.
< 1295021005 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ^
< 1295021202 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00 is not back
< 1295021220 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he is now
< 1295021231 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i thought the girls
< 1295021232 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :teen girls in pantyhose = win
< 1295021232 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nvm
< 1295021247 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what were they doing there?
< 1295021254 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're there every day all day
< 1295021265 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i live in a big house that has two ballrooms
< 1295021274 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since monday they're being used for a ballet school
< 1295021283 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1295021295 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the teacher is all like "hey wanna join the classez"
< 1295021323 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i'm mostly like "i'll have to see which group i like most"
< 1295021323 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::x
< 1295021440 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You know what really really irritates me
< 1295021452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: No, no I don't
< 1295021462 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when people say "yes, yes it is" or whatever
< 1295021471 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why does it repeat the word?
< 1295021472 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But. I say that
< 1295021473 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, yes it's irritating
< 1295021487 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's for emphasis, welcome to language :P
< 1295021528 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean "I'm not _not_ sad" doesn't mean exactly that you're sad??
< 1295021535 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn
< 1295021811 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :    What we say is that you ought to give the system's principal developer a share of the credit. The principal developer is the GNU Project, and the system is basically GNU.
< 1295021814 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :    If you feel even more strongly about giving credit where it is due, you might feel that some secondary contributors also deserve credit in the system's name. If so, far be it from us to argue against it. If you feel that X11 deserves credit in the system's name, and you want to call the system GNU/X11/Linux, please do. If you feel that Perl simply cries out for mention, and you want to write GNU/Linux/Perl, go ahead.
< 1295021820 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :    Since a long name such as GNU/X11/Apache/Linux/TeX/Perl/Python/FreeCiv becomes absurd, at some point you will have to set a threshold and omit the names of the many other secondary contributions. There is no one obvious right place to set the threshold, so wherever you set it, we won't argue against it.
< 1295021825 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :    Different threshold levels would lead to different choices of name for the system. But one name that cannot result from concerns of fairness and giving credit, not for any possible threshold level, is “Linux”. It can't be fair to give all the credit to one secondary contribution (Linux) while omitting the principal contribution (GNU).
< 1295021890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: GNU is not the principal contributor to Linux.
< 1295021893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is mere propaganda.
< 1295021900 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really?
< 1295021911 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Additionally "Linux" as a name does NOT refer to the kernel, it refers to the kernel PLUS all the additional software. That is how the terminology has evolved.
< 1295021921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Claiming otherwise is dishonest.
< 1295021942 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is that propaganda
< 1295021983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Because it distorts the facts in a way that makes GNU look more important than they are, to serve something GNU wants (for people to call it GNU/Linux).
< 1295022062 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what facts
< 1295022076 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, "GNU/X11/Apache/Linux/TeX/Perl/Python/FreeCiv" <-- interesting product
< 1295022091 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to figure out what combining perl, tex and python would do
< 1295022093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: For instance "GNU is the principal contributor to a full Linux-based system" is incorrect.
< 1295022110 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linus is?
< 1295022114 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: No?
< 1295022118 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the
< 1295022120 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(yeah yeah, not meant like that)
< 1295022120 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what then
< 1295022126 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is no one principal contributor.
< 1295022135 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In 2008, we found that GNU packages made up 15% of the “main” repository of the gNewSense GNU/Linux distribution. Linux made up 1.5%. So the same argument would apply even more strongly to calling it “Linux”.
< 1295022146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Package count is irrelevant.
< 1295022165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: gNewSense is a biased source; it is a GNU project that refuses to package software the FSF doesn't consider a suitable part of a Free system, this includes Firefox.
< 1295022173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They instead package a GNU fork of Firefox, artificially inflating the GNU count here. etc.
< 1295022181 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, Linux deserves a mention. It is the kernel after all. Same goes for any other kernel.
< 1295022197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If Ubuntu replaced the GNU coreutils with a fully-featured BusyBox tomorrow, yes, the system would be different, but the essential use of the system for 90% of its users would be very, very similar.
< 1295022201 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least more than the userland does
< 1295022209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Debian and Ubuntu already use a non-GNU C library -- eglibc, a fork of the GNU libc.
< 1295022210 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's a good point
< 1295022223 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even then, they could use a fully-featured uClibc and the system would still be very similar.
< 1295022228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not the same, but similar.
< 1295022235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Heck, for most users of Ubuntu, the main contributor is GNOME.
< 1295022238 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you know bout eglibc etc :D
< 1295022241 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is a GNU project, yes.
< 1295022241 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never heard of these
< 1295022242 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, actually I would react, mostly because much of my .bashrc would be broken :P
< 1295022243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But consider KDE users.
< 1295022249 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I have a dormant distribution project.
< 1295022256 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's that?
< 1295022258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I said similar for most users.
< 1295022261 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: What's... KDE?
< 1295022269 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that the question you are actually asking...?
< 1295022281 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"dormat distribution project
< 1295022286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh.
< 1295022288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*dormant :P
< 1295022292 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yeah I could survive. Might patch busybox grep to add --colour=auto or such. And a few small things like that
< 1295022293 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's called Kitten.
< 1295022297 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahh
< 1295022299 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool
< 1295022312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Notably it gives me good grounds to claim that GNU is not an essential part of Linux systems; I (was going to) use uClibc and BusyBox.
< 1295022327 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe
< 1295022336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Leaving the main GNU software being, uh, the core compilation tools (binutils and gcc), and Emacs.
< 1295022352 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you're a vi fan and use clang, that's reduced to just binutils.
< 1295022369 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, btw do you know any better way than temporarily changing the /bin/sh symlink to bash from dash when a build system refuses to work with dash as /bin/sh. In this case it was some sub-configure of older binutils that I needed to a cross tolchain (no support for that target in recent binutils)
< 1295022383 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Gregor has the solution to that.
< 1295022385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SPS!
< 1295022386 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or was it a sub-configure of old gcc? hm. One of them
< 1295022405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's see, what would the syntax be...
< 1295022411 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, something that works with minimal work. Something that is easier than sudo -s and changing the symlink around
< 1295022420 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, like setting an env variable or something
< 1295022421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: $ sps with 'sh == bash' -- ./configure
< 1295022432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Assuming == is the syntax for setting the selected metapackage or whatever.
< 1295022443 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, takes more work since I would need to install that and so on.
< 1295022454 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: "How can I solve this problem without changing anything?" You can't.
< 1295022480 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well I had a vague memory that make had some MAKE_SHELL_TO_BE_USED env var.
< 1295022484 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(with some other name)
< 1295022490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: How about $ find . | xargs sed -i 's,/bin/sh,bash,g'
< 1295022503 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, confgure isn't make.
< 1295022516 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yep, but I was hoping it had something similar
< 1295022529 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you know, it has CC, LD, and what not
< 1295022532 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so why not I thought
< 1295022536 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You mean like:
< 1295022543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#!/bin/sh
< 1295022560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if ! [ "x$SH" = "x" ]; then
< 1295022567 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well the issue here was that it was in a subconfigure. And also I think inside a statement using sh -c or similar
< 1295022574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  if ! [ "$SH" = "/bin/sh" ]; then
< 1295022580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :    $SH "$0"
< 1295022583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :    exit
< 1295022583 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hah :P
< 1295022584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  fi
< 1295022584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fi
< 1295022585 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P
< 1295022597 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Verbosity added due to configure working on ANY SYSTEM YOU WANT, so long as it's GNU.)
< 1295022616 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well just doing bash ./configure would work EXCEPT that it was one of the damn recursive configures that was invoked after you run make
< 1295022625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Throw it out and write your own program.
< 1295022637 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Oh wow, with that SH thing, you could do
< 1295022641 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SH=cat ./configure
< 1295022646 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GENIUS
< 1295022647 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, for older gcc you did a cross toolchain by cd gcc-source && ln -s ../binutils-source/foo
< 1295022650 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that kind of stuff
< 1295022653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^^^ GENIUS
< 1295022683 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and then you built gcc and binutils together at once
< 1295022759 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I had to patch gcc configure since it grepped configure.ac of binutils for the version of it, and depended on a specific whitespace length for indentation. Which was no longer the case.
< 1295022768 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, gnu buildsystem eh?
< 1295022772 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :build system*
< 1295022786 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But don't you know, it's _portable_.
< 1295022793 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, except not between versions
< 1295022799 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or anything.
< 1295022982 0 :Zuu!zuu@0x55529f1b.adsl.cybercity.dk JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295022986 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host
< 1295022986 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295023141 0 :doraemon___!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Page closed
< 1295023143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Get that APT developer over here to tell me how to write cabal2deb.
< 1295023243 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, over here, why not go to where that guy is
< 1295023266 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's in Edinburgh.
< 1295023274 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also ostensibly minorly incompetent.
< 1295023338 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, he hates functional programming.
< 1295023349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Strike ostensibly, minorly, insert incredibly.
< 1295023777 0 :Tritonio!~TrT@150.140.227.31 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295023780 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He decided to learn C and C++ over Haskell and Lisp.
< 1295023828 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And probably failed Higher maths, which is an exercise in stupidity.)
< 1295023888 0 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@32.140.30.134 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295023944 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, still on your KT-AT trip?
< 1295023991 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It wont take as long as I thought to get there, or to wait once I'm there. I miscounted
< 1295024009 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exactly what is this journey you're making?
< 1295024044 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds
< 1295024078 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A detour around a train station my dad said was unsafe
< 1295024083 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :L O L
< 1295024093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no words left.
< 1295024098 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, me preferring tl be an hour early than a little late
< 1295024120 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeoN1, that offer of kidnapping is still valid.
< 1295024132 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact, you will have to pay me not to go through with it.
< 1295024171 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would have only saved 20 min or so to use that route, and due to my wish to be early I would have left the house at the same time
< 1295024218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's this film noir mafia train station in my head and I love it.
< 1295024340 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There better be a place to sit
< 1295024376 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Going to save battery. Bye.
< 1295024378 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Bye
< 1295024403 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Don't go through that station, Seth. THERE MIGHT NOT BE A PLACE TO SIT"
< 1295024416 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If this conversation did not take place someone will die.
< 1295024458 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh, best part of Incompetent APT Guy: despite having evidently no aptitude for mathematics whatsoever, he wants to do CS at university
< 1295024478 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :???
< 1295024498 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :today, CS is for people who "can't do math"
< 1295024501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seth... that station be grue territory. Don't go/
< 1295024502 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*go.
< 1295024506 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it shouldn't be though)
< 1295024555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: there are good CS curricula out there ... but ...
< 1295024566 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's rare
< 1295024603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suspect scotland of holding them hostage from the rest of the world
< 1295024615 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah
< 1295024626 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-218-140.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295024675 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oxford apparently uses Haskell and Oberon for first-years, which is an... interesting combination
< 1295024748 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : i suspect scotland of holding them hostage from the rest of the world ← hm?
< 1295024759 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Think Epigram.
< 1295024768 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, yes.
< 1295024777 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're so inferior to me.
< 1295024791 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. Perhaps I shall step in front of a train.
< 1295024810 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What, someone actually uses csh.
< 1295024823 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Astonishing.
< 1295024871 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, it's not just that he can't do maths, he's doing Higher /again/.
< 1295024883 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :repeating because he was not good at it?
< 1295024885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meanwhile: "Gnus is an awesome mail and news reader, but it can be a bit of a performance bear, especially when using IMAP. Since Emacs is single-threaded, IMAP operations that take too long can disconnect you from IRC, Jabber, or any number of other network services you also use from Emacs."
< 1295024889 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This implies he either failed or got an abysmal mark when he first did it.
< 1295024891 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait I don't even know who you are talking about
< 1295024968 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, just so you know, Higher maths goes no further than basic calculus.
< 1295024984 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who is it
< 1295024987 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295024994 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523
< 1295024999 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was just thinking about scapegoat actually
< 1295025012 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ... Emacs is single-threaded? Wow. It's even more of a hack than I thought.
< 1295025019 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, a guy at my school who is an APT developer or somesuch.
< 1295025019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You didn't know that?
< 1295025031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I'm fairly sure he hasn't actually submitted any code for apt.
< 1295025032 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh apt
< 1295025043 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes, probably.
< 1295025046 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if he hacks on some serious software he probably has some ability
< 1295025064 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would put not being skilled at mathematics down to the low quality of mathematics education in general
< 1295025071 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know of any decent code he's done.
< 1295025072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: As I said, he doesn't actually code apt.
< 1295025077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He just creates deb packages.
< 1295025084 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seemingly limited to applying other people's debdiffs.
< 1295025087 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :teach him to program
< 1295025088 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least that's what I could find.
< 1295025101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: seriously?
< 1295025111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That would likely be living hell and Phantom_Hoover has other things he has to do.
< 1295025144 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He is also doing Advanced Higher computing, which, given my understanding of the SQA computing curricula, is probably just going to make him even worse at coding.
< 1295025160 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION despairs at the world.
< 1295025197 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well. I suppose they do actually run on DOS still.
< 1295025207 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was deleting the "higher mathematics" to leave "curriculum" in Google, then started typing "advanced" at the start... and it came up with "advanced kindergarten curriculum".
< 1295025214 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Advanced. Kindergarten.
< 1295025215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295025225 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: can I ask you a scapegoat question?
< 1295025236 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Fingerpainting and quantum physics!
< 1295025248 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ANYWAY, need to see the AH computing curriculum to see if it's contempt-worthy.
< 1295025264 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION forgets why he uses Firefox, switches to Chrome.
< 1295025317 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :17:14  * Phantom_Hoover despairs at the world.
< 1295025319 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :teach him to program
< 1295025323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: why
< 1295025336 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fix things
< 1295025367 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, what can I do? I never exactly learned to program in any well-defined way myself.
< 1295025382 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what
< 1295025410 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: you could learn some things from books
< 1295025460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: why?
< 1295025470 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why what
< 1295025477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: why should he teach him how to program
< 1295025480 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, SCEA v. George Hotz et al. is currently having a hearing regarding SCEA's motion for a temporary restraining order...
< 1295025484 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to help both of them
< 1295025486 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wonder how that's going down.
< 1295025492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you believe he wants to be taught, he believes he can program already i gather
< 1295025494 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, not too interested.
< 1295025496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: how would it help Phantom_Hoover
< 1295025503 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he probably doesn't want to
< 1295025506 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could always just chuck SICP at him and hope it sticks.
< 1295025507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: how would it help Phantom_Hoover?
< 1295025508 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it might be
< 1295025522 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it is useful tot each things
< 1295025536 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I think Phantom_Hoover is competent enough already
< 1295025580 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001f5b00390f-CM001e6b2335dc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295025613 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Formal education in programming is, frankly, not helpful until you've got a general idea how it all works *anyways*...
< 1295025615 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's daft, you can always learn more
< 1295025629 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: go for it
< 1295025634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: not by teaching someone who already thinks he can program and has Strong Opinions that are wrong
< 1295025644 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: okay
< 1295025646 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how to program is a silly subject.  algorithms and proofs thereof is where it's at, man
< 1295025647 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And heck, even formal "intro to programming" classes understand that. They pretty much go as far as "I want you to program this."
< 1295025668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: when you append a file to a directory, you also put the objects (StartOfFile ) and (EndOfFile ) in the database, right?
< 1295025672 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :near-guaranteed way to spot spam #n+1: the body of the email asks you to contact an email address, claiming it's the author's, but which doesn't match the from or reply-to fields
< 1295025680 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Well, yes, that's something that goes a bit beyond just "Here's the *bare basics*, now write some shit."
< 1295025682 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes
< 1295025690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: right
< 1295025691 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you have something to reference when you add to the file
< 1295025692 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that could happen if someone changed their email address though
< 1295025710 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: hmm, I should add "without any indication of why that should be"
< 1295025720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I'm trying to implement all the basic change algorithms in Haskell now, as pure as possible, but I'm having trouble doing ordered vs. unordered change structures elegantly
< 1295025726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: most of the algorithms on them are the same, but they share basically no members
< 1295025744 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's interesting, but maybe not so surprising
< 1295025752 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: i think of "programming" as translating proven ideas into established languages.  and therefore, yes, it is the easy part :P
< 1295025768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: right now I'm considering just having SOF/EOF, the model being that there's only one file in this pure implementation :-)
< 1295025779 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Programming is a craft.
< 1295025781 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that might be a good start
< 1295025802 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like other crafts, the way to learn it is to just do it a lot.
< 1295025806 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: yeah i can see that
< 1295025822 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't agree pikhq
< 1295025836 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only reason it is a craft is because we don't properly understand it yet
< 1295025851 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I do agree, it is a craft
< 1295025854 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I would like to change that
< 1295025863 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what would you change it to
< 1295025874 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hmm, how would you grep a file for two things?
< 1295025886 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i.e., i want to filter the results of a grep by only showing the files that /also/ match another grep on that file
< 1295025904 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: something based on a foundation. e.g. bridge building today is quite sensible, we know which ones stay up and which fall down
< 1295025923 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: but in the past we could not build such a variety of interesting bridges because only a very small number were known to stay up
< 1295025944 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: I think programming will be similar: We should learn structural properties of large csale programming that "stay up"
< 1295025974 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: We know *precisely* how to do large scale programming "right".
< 1295025984 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's being done to i think.  that is called software engineering i ween, and some places teach it better than others.
< 1295025986 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We do?
< 1295025998 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course, it's nowhere near the level of bridge-building yet
< 1295025999 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: huh? :)
< 1295026004 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well, "right" to the extent that we can create bug-free programs.
< 1295026008 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, then why does noöne *do* it right?
< 1295026012 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because bridge-building fundamentals are more standardized
< 1295026014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: software engineering is code for "code monkey training"
< 1295026017 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I want to make a bug free program :(
< 1295026017 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: We can?
< 1295026018 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's obnoxiously expensive!
< 1295026027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You mean the NASA model?
< 1295026029 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: sadly, yes, in most places it is
< 1295026029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, that is not it.
< 1295026040 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is _not_ a fundamentally hard task, I don't think.
< 1295026041 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Take bridges.
< 1295026042 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well. Yes, I mean the NASA model.
< 1295026052 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wait, I thought Sgeo was doing SE-but-stupider?
< 1295026055 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Poor bastard...
< 1295026058 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is creating each bridge an immensely difficult effort that goes under intense, INTENSE scrutiny, where the architect has little freedom because IT MUST WORK?
< 1295026065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not *really*.
< 1295026073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bridges are made all the time with not much fuss at all.
< 1295026078 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the NASA model is very interesting but I don't suppose it's necessary to work that way
< 1295026080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And they stay up.
< 1295026091 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Currently it may well be the best, but in future there could be a "cheaper" way
< 1295026100 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: galloping gertie aside, of course
< 1295026103 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how would you grep a file for two things? <-- grep -l | xargs grep
< 1295026110 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: is that a multiline grep?
< 1295026119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: well, sort of.
< 1295026122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: thanks
< 1295026131 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what elliott asked for was grepping only files that matched another grep
< 1295026139 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyways, a large part of the problem we see with common programs is that they are written in languages that make it *trivial* to introduce bugs.
< 1295026141 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's what xargs is for, pretty much
< 1295026146 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel at this point that I should point out that bridges are vastly easier to reason about than your average program.
< 1295026151 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And even very dangerous bugs.
< 1295026156 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: yeah. That's insane, it's mad that people still use e.g. PHP
< 1295026161 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously I've left a bunch of stuff out of the command line, but elliott's easily intelligent enough to infer it emself
< 1295026162 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I just cannot understand that one bit
< 1295026164 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Off-by-one error in C? Bam, you're fucked.
< 1295026187 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: not many languages make it easy to avoid bugs
< 1295026190 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, I think he's thinking more of C and other languages which are stupidly low-level but are ubiquitous because programmers are, by and large, idiots.
< 1295026204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: wtf, i seem to be unable to find my pastie of my scapegoat algo :D
< 1295026208 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i never pasted it
< 1295026210 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Yes, but some languages make it easy to hit horrifyingly dangerous bugs.
< 1295026211 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :arguably, Java was designed like that, but it doesn't actually help because throwing an exception and doing nothing about it is not much better than simply crashing
< 1295026227 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: where "horrifingly dangerous" = security bug? data loss bug
< 1295026228 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>
< 1295026240 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/\n>/?/
< 1295026244 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Think "buffer overflows".
< 1295026244 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, buffer overflow bug?
< 1295026248 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, yeah, security bug.
< 1295026258 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :buffer overflows are just one sort of security bug
< 1295026273 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :arghghghgh
< 1295026275 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it's just an example of one that low-level languages make really easy to hit.
< 1295026276 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where is ftp_proxy being set
< 1295026278 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, and they're by far the easiest to introduce.
< 1295026287 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is linux so conniving
< 1295026288 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not even sure they're the most common, exploitable dangling/NULL pointers seem around as common
< 1295026290 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um...what sort of people don't do something useful with caught exceptions?  (tbh, i don't like the way java does exceptions, but i don't like people who ignore errors even more)
< 1295026293 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alhtough they're a bit harder to exploit
< 1295026305 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this env variable isn't in any scripts that i know of!
< 1295026317 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: people who just squash the error message, or log it, or whatever, or throw it right out of the program
< 1295026321 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A buffer overflow can also just cause very unpredictable behavior.
< 1295026324 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, I hardly ever see exceptions handled sensibly
< 1295026336 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, i meant, what is those people's IQ level?
< 1295026338 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least a crash in a Java program does just that: it stops working.
< 1295026355 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott@elliott-MacBookAir:~/esotericlogs$ grep 'elliott>.*http://sprunge' 10* | sed 's/.*http/http/g;s,us/\(\w*\).*,us/\1,g' | while read url; do echo "$url: $(curl -s $url | head -n 1)"; done
< 1295026356 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: probably quite high, programmers tend to be more intelligent than average, I imagine
< 1295026357 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: am i insane?
< 1295026361 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not a case of stupidity, it's a case of not caring
< 1295026370 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't think so
< 1295026390 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whereas in C, you could hypothetically have the program start formatting the hard drive while whistling, because the programmer forgot to check the size of a buffer.
< 1295026392 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :incidentally, I'm wondering how easy that operation would be in Windows, I doubt it would be a one-liner...
< 1295026435 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: there was a thread on comp.lang.c where they asked people what the worst undefined behaviour behaviour was that they'd ever seen in practice
< 1295026447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sprunge.us/gZDO
< 1295026448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :found it
< 1295026449 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone had a buffer overflow jump to the "are you sure?" of the format routine, which happened to be in RAM at the time
< 1295026463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1295026467 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and said they thought themselves lucky that it didn't jump to just after the check
< 1295026468 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow!
< 1295026477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ?
< 1295026477 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it may well have tried to format a nonexistent drive, though)
< 1295026492 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Yeah, that's positively frightening.
< 1295026502 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No MMU in that computer?
< 1295026513 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: Probably DOS.
< 1295026517 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i just want to make sure you realise that applying changes in scapegoat involves a potentially expensive topographic sort
< 1295026522 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: they didn't say it was DOS, but that was implied
< 1295026530 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yep, that seems plausible
< 1295026542 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm one for semantics first, efficiency second, in most cases
< 1295026543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: because, you have to figure out the order to apply it in to avoid fake conflicts
< 1295026546 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because most things can be optimised
< 1295026555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh, in my opinion this is a great achievement
< 1295026560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you know why?
< 1295026564 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why?
< 1295026571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: previously, it was thought that a version control system being slower than darcs 1 was a logical impossibility
< 1295026575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but we will prove them wrong
< 1295026578 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha
< 1295026615 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, darcs 1? what is the current version of it?
< 1295026621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 2
< 1295026622 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it optimises pretty well, actually; you can cache tsorts
< 1295026627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they solved a major inefficiency
< 1295026630 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah
< 1295026645 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: to be precise, 1 and 2 have a similar average case (although I think it's faster), but 1 had a completely insane worst case
< 1295026652 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which was hit in practice fairly often
< 1295026706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: here is what inspired me to resume implementing scapegoat, by the way: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOGmwA5yBn0
< 1295026718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I figured I should get to the point where I can make a video with an EVEN BETTER commit tree.
< 1295026757 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is so much resistance to the improvement of programming
< 1295026782 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ?
< 1295026792 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: don't you also observe that?
< 1295026804 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :juts look at blog posts or reddit or anything like that
< 1295026832 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, you may be correct, but your statement's too vague for me to be sure of what it means
< 1295026921 0 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295026985 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this channel's definition of "improvement of programming" may be quite different from many others'...
< 1295027080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that video, incidentally, makes me dislike git
< 1295027082 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh *cackle*
< 1295027090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't quite realise the implications of its rather basic model
< 1295027156 0 :cheater99!~cheater@e181137126.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295027173 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295027180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I improved on your lambdas in C, but completing the implementation requires some cpp hackery that I'm not good enough to do.
< 1295027182 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wait, you started disliking git heh
< 1295027183 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm actually interested in how Scapegoat works now.
< 1295027187 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to watch that video
< 1295027199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well it's still what I'd use in practice if not darcs, but scapegoat is better.
< 1295027225 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: hmm, I'm happy to explain it but ask ais523 first; if he wants me to I will, but he gets the first opportunity
< 1295027236 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, do you want to explain?
< 1295027239 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd better, I'm currently angry (at something unrelated to this channel)
< 1295027256 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: do you still think it's hard to combine haskell's IO with the functional parts?  (my impression is: it depends on how interactive your IO is)
< 1295027258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: More NetBeans students?
< 1295027266 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, darcs is quite decent is isn't it? A bit weird and long names for the commands, but the same applies to git ("git st"? nope, "git status", sure sure tab complete, but even so there are more than one thing that tab complete on git st)
< 1295027285 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: surprisingly, no
< 1295027288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That latter is such a minor complaint that I can't even comprehend it.
< 1295027291 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: (About git)
< 1295027294 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: oen thing that sucks is taking a pure code and moving it into a monad... Then again the oenly reason it's such a pain to do is because it /could/ be automated
< 1295027308 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well no it isn't a major issue. Just convenience of short commands
< 1295027314 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :darcs tab-completes just fine on Debian/Ubuntu
< 1295027318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Darcs is alright, yes.
< 1295027356 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm using a mixture of darcs and git for things nowadays; git when I have to collaborate with someone else a lot, darcs for personal things
< 1295027362 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well turning pure code into monadic requires making a decision about order of actions, which might not be relevant for the pure version
< 1295027375 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and git for collaboration with others only because it's more popular so it's easier to persuade them to use it)
< 1295027387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: OK, so, do you know the basics of how git and darcs work?
< 1295027399 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Revisions and stuff?
< 1295027408 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(as i see it that's the same problem as with the interactivity)
< 1295027414 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: that's an incredibly bad description
< 1295027418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: err, i can't really explain it then if you don't know the basic model of those two
< 1295027420 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and how they differ
< 1295027420 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry
< 1295027420 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as it applies only vaguely to git, and not really to darcs at all
< 1295027447 0 :Tritonio!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1295027451 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(although it is possible to find something corresponding to a revision in darcs, say to port a darcs repo to a different VCS; it's a snapshot of the code as it was at a given time)
< 1295027527 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I've never needed a VCS!
< 1295027538 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never bothered learning what the hell they did!
< 1295027545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Then I cannot explain scapegoat to you, and nor can anyone else really.
< 1295027550 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Well, other than control revisions.)
< 1295027576 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295027633 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hmm, I think I really "get" git now, it's a bit like C in a way, you do everything by hand
< 1295027651 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what horrifies me is git-rebase
< 1295027659 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, any recommended reading, then?
< 1295027662 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and the fact that people actually use it -- regularly
< 1295027662 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it horrifies me too, although probably not for the same reason
< 1295027668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: not really, I don't know what's good to read
< 1295027676 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, I use it regularly when I use git
< 1295027676 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: my reason is that THAT SHOULD NEVER BE ALLOWED EVER
< 1295027685 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it doesn't really work otherwise
< 1295027688 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: use it regularly and *recommend it as a Good Thing*
< 1295027693 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, inherently
< 1295027700 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"gee keep your revision log clean!"
< 1295027705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just no. No no no.
< 1295027706 0 :Wamanuz5!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
< 1295027708 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: put it this way, a simple git pull has an implicit rebase if it fast-forwards
< 1295027714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You fail at version control.
< 1295027719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: which is just a flaw in git
< 1295027723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really though, it's rewriting history
< 1295027728 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't imagine how anyone thinks that's a good idea
< 1295027741 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because git shows your history as you wish it were, rather than as how it actually was
< 1295027786 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if your repo starts out the same as someone else's, they make some changes, you pull them, your repos now have different histories, as one pulled the changes in a chunk, the other made them one at a time
< 1295027797 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, git actually inherently goes exponential without any sort of rebase
< 1295027810 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you have to keep on merging the fact that you're aware of the fact that the other person merged
< 1295027816 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now, I'm not saying this is a good thing at all
< 1295027845 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(git disregarding the same change made by two people in parallel I thought was just a detail, it's actually completely essential to the way that git works)
< 1295027845 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :awful
< 1295027856 0 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@32.140.30.134 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295027863 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...
< 1295027872 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1295027877 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeoN1, has KT-AT stood you up?
< 1295027891 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A few minutes after I got here, she called to say she missed her bus
< 1295027911 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yup.
< 1295027946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: coding haskell makes me crazy
< 1295027958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have to distill every algorithm down to the point where it's just a few combinators put together
< 1295027960 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anything else and I've failed
< 1295028006 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (git disregarding the same change made by two people in parallel I thought was just a detail, it's actually completely essential to the way that git works) <-- who gets credited with it then?
< 1295028009 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or what do you mean
< 1295028011 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We're going to try again tomorrow
< 1295028035 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm not entirely sure, it might actually be different in the two repos
< 1295028049 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because from git's view of the world, it doesn't matter
< 1295028102 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@undo do { x <- apply c xs; return $ (c1',s1) : (c2',s2) : x }
< 1295028102 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apply c xs >>= \ x -> return $ (c1', s1) : (c2', s2) : x
< 1295028108 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, so the revision id checksum thingy is on the delta, and doesn't include commit message or author?
< 1295028110 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@pl apply c xs >>= \ x -> return $ (c1', s1) : (c2', s2) : x
< 1295028111 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :([(c1', s1), (c2', s2)] ++) `fmap` apply c xs
< 1295028168 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: "replace SOF with X" is an invalid change, right?
< 1295028171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same with s/SOF/EOF/
< 1295028186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: (I'm assuming there's a replace, since having it as a delete+insert causes fake conflicts)
< 1295028199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(if not, "delete SOF/EOF" is an invalid change, right?)
< 1295028269 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> ((1 :) . (2 :)) [1,2,3]
< 1295028271 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  [1,2,1,2,3]
< 1295028440 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think ais523 just removed SOF.
< 1295028702 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm trying the airbase idea now, FWIW.
< 1295028711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: On SSP?
< 1295028715 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YEs.
< 1295028719 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Yes.
< 1295028719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Towards Dawn did it with tiny platforms.
< 1295028736 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm not going to be doing that, obviously.
< 1295028741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHY NO
< 1295028741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :T
< 1295028756 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have enough wood now that I can smelt some coal overnight and get some torches.
< 1295028773 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Charcoal is the best thing EVER.)
< 1295028839 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Waitwhat.
< 1295028839 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295028843 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wood doesn't burn any more.
< 1295028860 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, logs do.
< 1295028865 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOOD THING I KEPT SOME
< 1295028888 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It doesn't?
< 1295028891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Weird.
< 1295028896 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds
< 1295028899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How many logs did you start with?
< 1295028902 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, wait, planks still burn.
< 1295028902 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :According to the wiki, at least.
< 1295028908 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Possibly a balance thing, but I'll need to check
< 1295028968 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The furnace isn't working at all.
< 1295028969 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:04  elliott> @pl apply c xs >>= \ x -> return $ (c1', s1) : (c2', s2) : x
< 1295028970 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:04  lambdabot> ([(c1', s1), (c2', s2)] ++) `fmap` apply c xs
< 1295028972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I have 26+5 right now, how much more should I get?
< 1295028977 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh, @pl is that clever now?
< 1295028977 0 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@32.140.30.134 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295028987 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't know; I think I'll ask someone.
< 1295028992 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: became: apply c xs >>= \ x -> return $ (c1', s1) : (c2', s2) : x
< 1295028994 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1295029000 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: became   | otherwise = (((c1',s1) :) . ((c2',s2) :)) <$> apply c xs
< 1295029044 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you didn't use the [...] ++  ?
< 1295029055 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: no, because I have ((foo,bar) :) <$> in other cases of the function
< 1295029057 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so this is more consistent
< 1295029065 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAa
< 1295029078 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's *wood* which smelts to coal, not *planks*!
< 1295029084 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i think you have a redundant set of parentheses there
< 1295029098 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (0$0<$>)
< 1295029099 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  The operator `Data.Functor.<$>' [infixl 4] of a section
< 1295029099 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :     must have lowe...
< 1295029143 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the precedence of . is lower
< 1295029150 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er, higher
< 1295029152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: LAWL
< 1295029157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Start a tree farm, btw.
< 1295029164 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ah
< 1295029170 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will, I have the dirt and saplings.
< 1295029173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: 10 cobble enough for the first night?
< 1295029200 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: basically . has the highest possible precedence, and $ has the lowest
< 1295029216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: um there is no $ here
< 1295029252 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, it's just a general rule i go by
< 1295029280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: FWIW, how much wood did you start off with?
< 1295029293 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact it annoyed me that Parsec gave another operator ( iirc) the same precedence as $, in a way that ruined the ability to combine them
< 1295029309 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, a pretty large amount.
< 1295029324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: how come everyone else's days seem to last 2398234982349 longer than mine
< 1295029328 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There were quite a few large trees when I found them
< 1295029337 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Actually, the night snuck up on me.
< 1295029343 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(if  had reversed its order of arguments and used the same fixity as $, they would have worked seamlessly together without parentheses)
< 1295029352 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's weird. I found smoe new kind of wood but it's still called wood
< 1295029357 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it was morning when it was evening
< 1295029384 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But by that point I had plenty of wood, cobble and dirt, so I just set up the base as night fell.
< 1295029389 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, that's a FEATURE!
< 1295029397 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(There are now 3 kinds of tree.)
< 1295029397 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the Prelude has no operators sharing precedence with either . or $ afair
< 1295029401 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TODO: get a few more cobbles and then go up.
< 1295029409 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: What's the third?
< 1295029431 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, pine.
< 1295029433 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well s/Prelude/\& and Haskell 98 library/
< 1295029434 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :)
< 1295029447 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The cobbles aren't that necessary, I just wanted them for peace of mind.)
< 1295029497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The cobbles are required for furnace and also for initial tools.
< 1295029506 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: nice, I really like this new kind
< 1295029506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: For instance a wood sword won't get you very fa.
< 1295029507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*far.
< 1295029515 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am trying to grow it
< 1295029535 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, OK, but you won't need tools once you get up onto your platform for the night.
< 1295029543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: But the next day...
< 1295029549 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :9 for a furnace is all you really need.
< 1295029549 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1295029551 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*PH:
< 1295029555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: How high did you make your shelter?
< 1295029561 0 :impomatic!~chatzilla@86.241.112.87.dyn.plus.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295029565 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi :-)
< 1295029566 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: make my function prettier! http://sprunge.us/ECZO :P
< 1295029567 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I now have a 5x5 tree plantation with 9 saplings!
< 1295029574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I only have 8 saplings.
< 1295029576 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, 30m off ground.
< 1295029577 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ho
< 1295029583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Off sea level?
< 1295029593 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Near enough.
< 1295029617 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic: hm i have a vague idea there was something i wanted to tell you
< 1295029649 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oerjan: was it about corewar, programming games or recursion?
< 1295029662 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm _possibly_ recursion
< 1295029690 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oerjan: or maybe you wanted to join the mob of people angry at me for some dodgy Forth code!
< 1295029694 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That creeper is just sitting there.
< 1295029694 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i already did tell you, i'm not sure
< 1295029696 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mocking me.
< 1295029704 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Preventing me from returning to the ground.
< 1295029705 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic: i'm pretty sure it wasn't forth-related
< 1295029714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: did you use the dirt to be one piece of the floor?
< 1295029719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i assume you made the house itself out of planks
< 1295029732 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes.
< 1295029741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Did you make walls?
< 1295029744 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic: hm was it something wiki-related...
< 1295029748 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no.
< 1295029751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: A ceiling?
< 1295029755 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rather superfluous, no?
< 1295029756 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION checks
< 1295029760 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: A ceiling?
< 1295029764 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No.
< 1295029783 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's only 5x5 with an adjoining 5x5 tree farm.
< 1295029807 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oerjan: it might have been, I was asking about BF Joust, FYB, pastebin.ca and broken voxel links a few days ago :-P
< 1295029829 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic: oh BF Joust it was
< 1295029840 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic: i wanted to suggest you ask in agora
< 1295029854 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And a gigantic swath of APNIC allocations leaves them below 2.1 /8s.
< 1295029855 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since that's where it was invented
< 1295029865 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Did you build a one-high wall to stop you falling out, or are you more hardcore than me?
< 1295029872 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, MORE HARDCORE
< 1295029881 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is their usual allocation threshold...
< 1295029892 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I might build a fence, but it might be too much bother if I expand.
< 1295029899 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Food →
< 1295029921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I'm above water, so I can just jump off if I want. MWAHAHAHAHA
< 1295029958 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IANA depletion estimate: any minute now.
< 1295029998 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oerjan: I found what I needed to know thanks... I was adding a brief history to the page on the programming games wiki http://programminggames.org/BF-Joust.ashx
< 1295030021 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my first crash :(
< 1295030043 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Back.
< 1295030060 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic: oh you're Imp... you _do_ have a User:Impomatic too
< 1295030060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: One log only produces one coal.
< 1295030069 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes...?
< 1295030095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well it's INEFFICIENT!
< 1295030108 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No it isn't.
< 1295030121 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oerjan: I know, but I forgot the password and I didn't set an email address to recover it :-(
< 1295030127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well, it's 5/4 logs to 1 coal.
< 1295030132 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: APNIC's pool is at 2.01 /8s. Thought you'd like to know.
< 1295030147 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ...no it isn't.
< 1295030156 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Oh, of course, you can use the coal as fuel.
< 1295030241 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sod it. I am just going to set the difficulty to peaceful for a second and despawn the creepers.
< 1295030258 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Source?
< 1295030274 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.apnic.net/community/ipv4-exhaustion/graphical-information
< 1295030293 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Why?
< 1295030296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to go on to hard.
< 1295030309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Question. Can trees grow on the corner of a platform?
< 1295030317 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION checks that he has his email set
< 1295030355 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Would anyone be interested in an ARobots tournament? http://programminggames.org/ARobots.ashx - basically CROBOTS in 8086 assembly
< 1295030385 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I should think so.
< 1295030401 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"When APNIC only has a total of one /8 left, the final /8 policy will be triggered." -- That's presumably some APNIC-internal policy...
< 1295030408 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I'm just trying to get rid of daytime creepers, which are ridiculously broken gameplay-wise.
< 1295030439 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: Yeah, that's an allocation policy for dealing with being near RIR depletion.
< 1295030479 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For rationing out the very last /8.
< 1295030483 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: of course it doesn't actually _matter_ when they allocate, given that no one else is likely to do so.  apart from the news/propaganda value.
< 1295030536 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, slightly more awesome version of the lavalight: http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/File:Ladder-lava-force-field.png
< 1295030538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Facepalm. I just placed torches in my tree farm.
< 1295030544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: My tree farm that gets sunlight.
< 1295030545 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IPv4 depletion is near and I still don't have IPv6 service from my ISP.
< 1295030555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, seen.
< 1295030576 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same here...
< 1295030578 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-/
< 1295030591 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::(
< 1295030626 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :
< 1295030669 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: What should I do with my SEXY BLACK WOOL
< 1295030764 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, pretend it's obsidian?
< 1295030767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Since my abandonment of RCS in favor of hg has caused comex to start
< 1295030767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tracking the ruleset again, I resign as Rulekeepor."
< 1295030814 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1295030889 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :According to APNIC extended delegated file, they have 33 608 704 IPs available (2.003 blocks)
< 1295030907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THESE TREES IN'T GROWING
< 1295031010 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lagerholm estimated that the request will be sent on monday and takes few days to process, officially depleting the pool on wednesday or thursday...
< 1295031012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Make the trees grow.
< 1295031013 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, agora? (wrt that quote)
< 1295031017 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes.
< 1295031037 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, get some bonemeal?
< 1295031037 0 :cal153!~cal@c-24-4-207-72.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295031043 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari, depleeting what pool?
< 1295031044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: How does that help?
< 1295031047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: *depleting
< 1295031048 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IANA IPv4.
< 1295031056 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari, the global one!?
< 1295031061 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes ...
< 1295031061 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so soon?
< 1295031063 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes.
< 1295031080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it'll be a few months before we see the effects.
< 1295031088 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then allocation really spiked the last week or two
< 1295031092 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, indeed I know that
< 1295031110 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, bonemeal makes trees and crops grow instantly.
< 1295031110 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: How does bonemeal help?
< 1295031113 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yeah, APNIC had some massive allocation requests recently.
< 1295031113 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does??
< 1295031115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do I get it again?
< 1295031128 0 :Wamanuz2!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295031138 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, ah
< 1295031167 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott, bonemeal makes trees and crops grow instantly. <-- really? How do you apply it then
< 1295031182 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :before or after I mean
< 1295031191 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(planting)
< 1295031191 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, right-click, I assume.
< 1295031198 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, find bone. Craft bone.
< 1295031204 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, and you claimed it makes that blue stuff. How?
< 1295031205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: How find bone.
< 1295031205 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bones are dropped by skeletons.
< 1295031210 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Secret.
< 1295031218 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is it a bug or not?
< 1295031220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, it's called lapis lazuli.
< 1295031233 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, find skeleton. Kill skeleton.
< 1295031245 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alternately: find skeleton. Wait 'till skeleton goes on fire.
< 1295031246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I have no armour. That sounds scary.
< 1295031250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That sounds easier.
< 1295031289 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds
< 1295031293 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, just asking about that bonemeal -> lapis lazuli: is it done by making use of a bug or is it intended?
< 1295031312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is HHI secret.
< 1295031321 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Food →
< 1295031325 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you can answer if it is a bug or not without problems however.
< 1295031333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course. But we won't.
< 1295031336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DAMMIT TREES, GROW
< 1295031340 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :STOP BEING HAPPY, COWS
< 1295031342 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MY TREES AREN'T GROWING
< 1295031352 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I can't see how it helps me if I knew if it was due to a bug or not
< 1295031356 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :besides, why is it a secret
< 1295031393 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah found it on youtube
< 1295031401 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The terrain generator's improvements are wonderful.
< 1295031414 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, will it result in an edge towards current terrain?
< 1295031423 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unlikely, I don't think it's new.
< 1295031425 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just tweaked.
< 1295031443 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Take a look at this: http://i.imgur.com/IVrIw.png
< 1295031448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea how far it goes.
< 1295031475 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well I seen similar things before
< 1295031485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Biomes are still too tiny though.
< 1295031591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the cobble texture has been changed.
< 1295031594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well.
< 1295031601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The top of furnaces are now not the same as stone. :/
< 1295031641 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it has been fixed (the bonemeal thingy) in the update today it seems. At least according to reddit.
< 1295031650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lies.
< 1295031671 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm okay.
< 1295031715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :INCIDENTALLY
< 1295031719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jeb made this: http://i.imgur.com/a7uht.png
< 1295031733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note how this update, which is cool and seems to have added almost no bugs, was made almost entirely by Jeb.
< 1295031753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And also increases performance by including the code improvements of a (supposedly frowned-upon) modder.
< 1295031761 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah
< 1295031763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We should all pray that Notch decides to retire immediately.
< 1295031767 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Curiosity cam http://www.ustream.tv/nasajpl#&utm_source=498663
< 1295031771 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And leaves Minecraft to Jeb.
< 1295031789 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, notch had decent ideas though.
< 1295031797 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just poor at implementing them
< 1295031799 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But he should never be allowed near code. Ever.
< 1295031807 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that I can agree on
< 1295031815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also I think Notch ran out of ideas.
< 1295031822 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Before this Jeb update, the game had been much the same for ages.
< 1295031839 0 :Wamanuz2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1295031876 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: underflow
< 1295031954 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out
< 1295032010 0 :hiato!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295032031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Phantom_Hoover: "Possbly due to an error, when Beta 1.2 came out trees that had already been created were re-created often with the same shape but more than one type of leaves, often all three."
< 1295032040 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295032068 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is it this bug: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3K7BGI2Jq8E
< 1295032077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HHI is silent.
< 1295032087 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, if it is then it is already out in the open
< 1295032088 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P
< 1295032102 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, where did you *think* we got it from?
< 1295032106 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: wow!
< 1295032117 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Not there at least.
< 1295032121 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, it was a bug which has been fixed.
< 1295032124 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I've seen a tree with two leaves
< 1295032128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. But HHI still has the power.
< 1295032131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: :D
< 1295032133 0 :acetoline!~acetoline@125-237-12-196.jetstream.xtra.co.nz JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295032133 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, I got it from /r/minecraft, but anyway...
< 1295032135 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well you could have found it yourself?
< 1295032140 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Right, but we have the btter way.
< 1295032149 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, that way.
< 1295032151 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, we do.
< 1295032162 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, found another way yourself? heh nice
< 1295032165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bone meal is white dye. Why.
< 1295032171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wool is already white!
< 1295032202 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, you can combine it with coloured dyes to make light colour
< 1295032210 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, they combine? Neat.
< 1295032236 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you make dye in the first place?
< 1295032243 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've never seen anything like lapis lazuli in the wild
< 1295032244 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OMG YOU CAN PAINT SHEEP
< 1295032246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: various ways
< 1295032248 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, various sources.
< 1295032251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: lapis lazuli is ore, near redstone
< 1295032251 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, j-invariant: http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Wool_Dyes
< 1295032257 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or that
< 1295032258 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : OMG YOU CAN PAINT SHEEP <-- old
< 1295032263 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I heard that yesterday
< 1295032263 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't care
< 1295032265 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :youcan paint sheep
< 1295032269 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, OLD
< 1295032276 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, this has been known since yesterday
< 1295032276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can paint sheep
< 1295032278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't care
< 1295032279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can paint sheep
< 1295032283 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, Haskell is too elegant to easily read
< 1295032296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: wat
< 1295032299 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like the accusations people make against Perl, except actually warranted
< 1295032305 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, correct. But if you think that is the most important thing to repeat... sure go ahead
< 1295032306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: not...really
< 1295032308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find Haskell easy to read
< 1295032310 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, wrong way 'round.
< 1295032312 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just says too much in too little a piece of code
< 1295032324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It's _slower_ to read, but you have _less_ to read.
< 1295032327 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not more difficult.
< 1295032328 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perl is needlessly hard to read, while Haskell is actually terse for a reason.
< 1295032332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It's just more compact.
< 1295032345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle tsort
< 1295032346 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No results found
< 1295032349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle topological
< 1295032350 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No results found
< 1295032462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: How resource-intensive is blowing up a 128x128x127 cube of TNT?
< 1295032481 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_Extremely._
< 1295032491 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I find that Haskell is easy to read except when people are being *too* clever.
< 1295032494 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Servers have broken on me with *8* TNT.
< 1295032507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: WELL I WANT TO DO IT
< 1295032513 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: The problem is, of course, is that some people are far too clever.
< 1295032518 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Go ahead, but your computer will die.
< 1295032523 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: World editing plugin to clear 128x128x128 plus a bit, and then fill 128x128x127 with TNT, and detonate it.
< 1295032528 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Come back a few hours later with tea, observe destruction.
< 1295032531 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TNT is a lot to use one a server
< 1295032535 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*on
< 1295032536 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Perl, on the other hand, is hard to read except when people are being careful.
< 1295032549 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, servers do actually crash with less TNT than that.
< 1295032560 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, it may just be that I find a monad-pipeline pretty clear.
< 1295032566 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love parsec
< 1295032572 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's beauty
< 1295032574 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I have had entire worlds corrupted.
< 1295032585 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, by the way
< 1295032586 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :siunitx
< 1295032590 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is like the greatest package ever
< 1295032604 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hmm, it just occurred to me that there's probably a way to turn any container into an equivalent change structure
< 1295032611 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: as in, lists -> file changes; sets -> directory changes
< 1295032611 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Oh?
< 1295032630 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: TeX package that does unit formatting for you
< 1295032646 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Delish.
< 1295032663 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :G = \SI{6.67e-11}{\meter\cubed\per\kilogram\per\second\squared}
< 1295032668 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a bit verbose, but very legible
< 1295032679 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the verbosity is optional iirc
< 1295032683 0 :Wamanuz2!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295032683 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: How resource-intensive is blowing up a 128x128x127 cube of TNT? <-- in what?
< 1295032685 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, I remember what put me off Chrome.
< 1295032689 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No adblock.
< 1295032689 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Um, Minecraft?
< 1295032690 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, CPU? Memory?
< 1295032693 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everything.
< 1295032697 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Um, it has extensions.
< 1295032701 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: And AdBlock.
< 1295032701 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, or do you mean in number of TNT required
< 1295032704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Former.
< 1295032712 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yaaaaaay!
< 1295032716 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hmm, what's the rough algorithm for turning a set of scapegoat changes into a graph so that it can be topologically sorted?
< 1295032767 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I have no idea. But even something like a few hundred TNT could crash the server. Though iirc with 1.2 TNT was optimised a bit. Still I expect enough TNT will cause issues. No idea where the limit is.
< 1295032839 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an awesome package
< 1295032946 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so here's a tip; If you use shift to walk near the edge of a thing... even if you've stopped moving, letting go can make you fall
< 1295032962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: obviously :P
< 1295032967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can walk off the edge of a lock with sneaking
< 1295032973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*block
< 1295032977 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no you can't
< 1295032979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, you can
< 1295032985 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you see it on multiplayer
< 1295032989 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people off the edge of blocks while sneaking
< 1295032991 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :leave go, fall down
< 1295033021 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how do you lock sneaking on, BtW?
< 1295033026 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: you don't.
< 1295033137 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a very good source of health?
< 1295033146 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, pigs, wheat, fish.
< 1295033153 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :killing all the pigs is hard, oh I will try fishing!
< 1295033163 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'll need string.
< 1295033180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Set up a farm.
< 1295033187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For wheat.
< 1295033192 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay
< 1295033395 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hm interesting: "This same principal applies to combining string to form a wool block and grabbing it with a dyed wool block!"
< 1295033398 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You need a hoe first.
< 1295033400 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I guess that is it :)
< 1295033413 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, or have you found a third way?
< 1295033413 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, that bug is also fixed.
< 1295033461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :graphFromEdges :: Ord key => [(node, key, [key])] -> (Graph, Vertex -> (node, key, [key]), key -> Maybe Vertex)
< 1295033462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mrf, how stupid.
< 1295033468 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They are actually both the same bug.
< 1295033475 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hm
< 1295033480 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, did you make up the Graph monad.
< 1295033488 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?
< 1295033506 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, so you have a third bug then?
< 1295033527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We could not possibly comment.
< 1295033553 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, dude this reveals nothing :P
< 1295033562 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aw the fishing line can't stretch infinitely far
< 1295033576 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and I was asking Phantom_Hoover not you
< 1295033605 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, did you plan something that needed that?
< 1295033685 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no
< 1295033703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/46k5O.png Redstone over Radio
< 1295033724 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: is that true :D
< 1295033734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: It's just an idea, of which there are billions.
< 1295033736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT IT'S A GOOD ONE
< 1295033741 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is a decent one yes
< 1295033746 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but why a hide?
< 1295033755 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I think minecraft should have a system for adding new things like this to it, since everyone has their own ideas
< 1295033765 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you want oklopol's game
< 1295033766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: vibrations
< 1295033768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ear
< 1295033773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it's like drum material
< 1295033775 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eardrum type stuff
< 1295033779 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is it?
< 1295033782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: where every block has its own program in it
< 1295033786 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, arguably that would be better for the music blocks instead
< 1295033796 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: and you play by programming blocks to be bots that mine for you and shit
< 1295033809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: do you know what the eardrum is ...
< 1295033811 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this a real game?
< 1295033815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sound -> hide part vibrates -> stuff
< 1295033817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well he's working on it
< 1295033819 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well yes, but do you know what a speaker is?
< 1295033824 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool
< 1295033827 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes.
< 1295033844 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh speaker could use paper there I guess
< 1295033854 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most speaker membranes are paper afaik
< 1295033860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really? xD
< 1295033876 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, never took apart a loudspeaker?
< 1295033883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no.
< 1295033886 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to get around to trying out that computer level
< 1295033893 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't tried anyone elese minecraft worlds yeet
< 1295033904 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, paper is very common as the membrane. I can't promise that every speaker use it but all the ones I took apart have
< 1295033915 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : really? xD ← ...yes?
< 1295033928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i see a market for audiophiles
< 1295033933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PURE GOLD PAPER MEMBRANE
< 1295033956 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:3.5_Inch_Speaker.jpg  the black is rather thick paper
< 1295033988 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I thought you meant paper-paper.
< 1295033997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, actual writing-style paper paper.
< 1295034017 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no.
< 1295034018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover:
< 1295034019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can hook a dispenser up to redstone, have the dispenser shoot an arrow at a wall of paintings with pressure plates underneath. The arrow knocks off the painting which hits a pressure plate and causes a continuation of the circuit.
< 1295034019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WIRELESS REDSTONE!
< 1295034020 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The diaphragm is usually manufactured with a cone- or dome-shaped profile. A variety of different materials may be used, but the most common are paper, plastic, and metal."
< 1295034024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HHI Research must do this.
< 1295034037 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, this has been done in the craftbook mod
< 1295034042 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't care.
< 1295034056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HHI Research will use it to blow up TNT, which will be an innovation.
< 1295034063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The test will take place underneath Mount Vorpal, a very secure location.
< 1295034076 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, did you find that thing about the painting yourself?
< 1295034082 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295034084 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, as if...
< 1295034096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I Ctrl+V'd, which is obvious.
< 1295034107 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no quotes around it
< 1295034113 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I was wondering
< 1295034113 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh noes
< 1295034122 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why would it be that bad?
< 1295034128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: OH GOD SPIDERS CLIMBING WALLS WAS A PLAYER SUGGESTION WHY
< 1295034132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ?
< 1295034138 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : HHI Research will use it to blow up TNT, which will be an innovation. ← I feel that we need some other innovations.
< 1295034144 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TNT-related innovations?
< 1295034145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I agree
< 1295034147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*agree.
< 1295034149 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, "oh noes" <-- why would forgetting quotes be that bad
< 1295034155 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ITT sarcasm
< 1295034174 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hooked a creeper and pulled him towards me X)
< 1295034209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: stupidest thing to do ever :D
< 1295034213 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway I don't see the invention in using this thing someone else did. Not saying using it is a bad idea at mt hoover or at the cube. But calling it innovation seems a bit wrong :P
< 1295034221 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: *mt vorpal
< 1295034225 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no
< 1295034241 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :herlo
< 1295034250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://foone.org/minecraft/death/
< 1295034258 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have no money
< 1295034260 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want to minecraft
< 1295034269 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone buy minecraft!
< 1295034294 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater99, ask elliott for that link that notch left wide open due to incompetence (if it still works?)
< 1295034306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't service cheater99.
< 1295034306 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: PLZ~
< 1295034315 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :cheater98
< 1295034319 0 :cheater98!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: PLZ~
< 1295034333 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, right. I guess it is a HHI secret?
< 1295034341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, cheater98 is just a twat.
< 1295034348 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyone else want Minecraft?
< 1295034350 0 :cheater98!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::'(
< 1295034369 0 :cheater98!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :chelliott
< 1295034373 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :me!
< 1295034401 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Link? Wide open?
< 1295034418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, anyone can download minecraft.jar.
< 1295034427 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, right.
< 1295034430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He has S3 authentication tokens and whatnot set up but doesn't actually, you know, require them; you can just download the file.
< 1295034435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No, I mean, as in, bin/minecraft.jar.
< 1295034445 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in, Notch's incompetence lets anyone pirate the game direct from Mojang.
< 1295034454 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if you download it can you play on public servers?
< 1295034469 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Consider myself curious.
< 1295034471 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes, I know.
< 1295034488 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott: no.
< 1295034493 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also, I knew those chickens were up to something.
< 1295034497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That will always require purchase due to Mojang's DRM system.
< 1295034512 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DRM?
< 1295034529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: /msg
< 1295034531 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mojang?
< 1295034539 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: The servers check with minecraft.net to see if you're authenticated and purchased.
< 1295034546 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's no actual way around that other than the server being modded.
< 1295034562 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what server do you guys play on?
< 1295034563 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :public?
< 1295034570 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or private/modded?
< 1295034572 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott, not for you.
< 1295034577 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O M G
< 1295034648 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :( * chelliott pretends to care so that Phantom_Hoover and elliott actually think he's interested in playing minecraft with them, in order to do some "bonding", but doesn't really care deep down)
< 1295034691 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott: they are very secetritve
< 1295034711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Everyone knows our server, it's just that ineiros is technically the only person allowed to tell anyone and he's been away :P
< 1295034713 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295034719 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't know it
< 1295034727 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: because you haven't bugged ineiros while he's been online.
< 1295034745 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott, you could find it in logs
< 1295034754 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: right
< 1295034760 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: but then, i don't get server :(
< 1295034762 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I might ask him because I want to see "The Cube"
< 1295034763 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott, grep them for http://.*minecraft.*
< 1295034769 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott, tough shit
< 1295034789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: It's, er, very under-construction.
< 1295034791 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott, iirc s3.amazon.com or whatever they call their service
< 1295034797 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Don't fucking tell him.
< 1295034811 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well you could start acting decently towards me
< 1295034814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I guess as long as he doesn't find the server it's okay.
< 1295034819 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, then I might care more for what you say
< 1295034819 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i am going to cry my eyes out and then curl up in an embrional position, bobbing back and forth, until the exhaustion makes me fall asleep.
< 1295034840 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i always wanted to see what it would be like to climb Mt. Vorpal :(
< 1295034844 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is never to be..
< 1295034848 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh fuck off.
< 1295034857 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep
< 1295034862 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott, you can do single player. For multiplayer you obviously need to buy the game
< 1295034881 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: don't you guys have a hacked multiplayer server?
< 1295034885 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott, anyway you can find the urls in the logs if you care for single player
< 1295034889 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott, no. not hacked
< 1295034890 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: sounds like a fairly simple thing to do in fact
< 1295034902 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just intercept the requests, no?
< 1295034905 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the cube?  the movie?
< 1295034913 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or a mc thing
< 1295034947 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway, when do you plan to start acting decently towards me? Do you expect something for nothing?
< 1295034955 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: he does
< 1295034959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::indignant:
< 1295034959 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i bet they're not even encrypted?
< 1295034961 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott?  the female portal-shooting equivalent of ehird?
< 1295034971 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott, what?
< 1295034980 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: cheater being a moron.
< 1295034982 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: those call-homes
< 1295034984 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott: ineiros doesn't want non-purchasers on the server.
< 1295034989 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott: So that will never, ever happen.
< 1295034999 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: not talking to u
< 1295035007 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott, what elliott said is true here
< 1295035011 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ahh ok
< 1295035025 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, you are right I guess.
< 1295035026 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: but if someone were to set up a server, they could intercept it like that, right?
< 1295035036 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott, I don't see why you need to do that
< 1295035036 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They could just use a mod that disables it ...
< 1295035038 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*shrug*
< 1295035048 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: so that people without a bought mc can also play
< 1295035057 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott, ... read again please :P
< 1295035068 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott, and then read what elliott just said
< 1295035072 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i'm sorry, i'm a bit lost
< 1295035083 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, sorry, i mostly don't read what elliott says
< 1295035084 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott, no need to intercept. Just mod.
< 1295035090 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gotcha
< 1295035103 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oh, sorry, i mostly don't read what elliott says <-- sounds like a good idea in fact.
< 1295035110 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: BTW, the S3 downloads don't work; you need to log in once before you can play.
< 1295035123 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh? didn't they work before?
< 1295035127 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: we should set up a mega secret server then!
< 1295035128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What?
< 1295035155 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1295035162 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you said they worked before? Anyway I believe faking a login is rather trivial.
< 1295035172 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I looked at the decompiled launcher
< 1295035173 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, the enemy of your enemy is not your friend here.
< 1295035186 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could just mod it.
< 1295035188 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hm?
< 1295035190 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Getting rid of cheater is in everyone's interest.
< 1295035194 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, when did I claim it was.
< 1295035208 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, do not engage with him. At all.
< 1295035221 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well then, why not ask a channel op about him?
< 1295035282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he manages to avoid outright trolling enough of the time that he goes under the radar.
< 1295035289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, ops never do anything apart from kick shutup
< 1295035307 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, they kickbanned spambots I know :P
< 1295035328 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait, that is what you said
< 1295035329 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry
< 1295035334 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hm. The something for nothing thing applies to you too
< 1295035351 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What?
< 1295035373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Someone I don't like is saying these things, therefore the fact that they can reasonably demonstrate that the actions they recommend are in the channel's best interest are things I should NOT do, because I must prove that I am at least as childish as the people I call that!"
< 1295035381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're well on your way, keep up the good work.
< 1295035385 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, see scrollback around last like coppro spoke
< 1295035434 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"therefore the fact that they can reasonably demonstrate that the actions they recommend are in the channel's best interest" <-- so demonstrate it
< 1295035484 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what I'm saying here is closer to "I don't trust your judgement.
< 1295035486 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"
< 1295035499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater has repeatedly demonstrated that not only does he have no interest or knowledge of esolangs,
< 1295035518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but he has repeatedly acted superior and idiotic to many people in this channel on many, many occasions, while having contributed not one iota of positive discussion to it.
< 1295035538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That he is an idiot can be trivially verified by reading the logs; that he annoys people who are not can be verified the same.
< 1295035551 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All he does is waste people's time.
< 1295035573 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fair enough on those points.
< 1295035578 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott: you should change your name back then
< 1295035602 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As such, you should ignore him and starve him of the attention he so desperately craves.
< 1295035622 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295035639 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Brawndo! It's got what plants crave!
< 1295035684 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i have demonstrated i have no interest in knowing esolangs?
< 1295035693 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: have you been drinking cillit bang again?
< 1295035711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You haven't really talked about esolangs once (you talked about Clue once, but then you started spinning some bullshit about it being a good business idea to oklopol or something).
< 1295035721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You also have no wiki presence
< 1295035721 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you're the kid here talking about computer games and ubuntu and mac laptops all the time
< 1295035726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*presence.
< 1295035727 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah yeah
< 1295035737 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay so no one is on topic very much
< 1295035737 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott: I have repeatedly demonstrated that I have an interest in and knowledge of esolangs in the past.
< 1295035738 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we've got another one of elliott's attacks, everyone take cover
< 1295035739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have not.
< 1295035746 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can we please have the restraining jacket
< 1295035748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, fuck off.
< 1295035755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You are an utter twat.
< 1295035761 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you forgot to run out and slam the door.
< 1295035772 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FFS, I am putting him on ignore. elliott, I will put you on ignore as well if you keep on engaging with him.
< 1295035774 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and scream "no one understands me"
< 1295035783 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and you are socially incompetent
< 1295035786 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"He's on to me, I'd better try and change the topic by being an idiot!"
< 1295035794 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: why don't you change you rname back?
< 1295035798 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chelliott: I mean
< 1295035800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: OK, where the fuck did you get that from?
< 1295035806 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: oh right, well, i forgot about it
< 1295035818 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, from observing your general behaviour towards me and coppro for example.
< 1295035820 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: then i read your comment, and then i read elliott's mental diarrhea, and had to reply to that first
< 1295035821 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who's chelliott?
< 1295035827 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay
< 1295035828 0 :chelliott!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :cheater777
< 1295035832 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeoN1, cheater. Do not talk to him.
< 1295035839 0 :cheater777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there you go j-invariant
< 1295035839 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now I hope you can stop fighting because I think it's upsetting elliot
< 1295035848 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not upset.
< 1295035849 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, coppro is reasonably intelligent and he is interested in esolangs afaik
< 1295035853 0 :cheater777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you've mixed up cause and effect
< 1295035856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can I not yell at someone without it being construed as upset?
< 1295035862 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: coppro is the one who has me on ignore.
< 1295035866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not have him on ignore.
< 1295035873 0 :cheater777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: coppro != cheater777
< 1295035874 0 :cheater777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-)
< 1295035877 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have been rude to him lately because he keeps being a jerk mentioning how I'm on ignore all the time.
< 1295035881 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater777, indeed, did I claim so?
< 1295035881 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do I get RSS feeds on Chrome?
< 1295035898 0 :cheater777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: just saying, it's a common typo.
< 1295035914 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no. And now you are being annoying.
< 1295035922 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My toes hurt
< 1295035938 0 :cheater777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: i think if you go to a page which has an rss feed you get an icon on the address bar... but i hadn't used chrome in ages now
< 1295035939 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well how comes he ignored you?
< 1295035953 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Ask him.
< 1295035955 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
< 1295035957 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I seem to remember there was indeed a very good reason
< 1295035959 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^^distracting everyone from the war so they can talk about my liveblkgging nonsense
< 1295035966 0 :cheater777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i'm not being annoying, i just thought you were talking about me and made a typo, just like j-invariant a couple minutes earlier. what's so annoying about that?
< 1295035975 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I was there, it was a rhetorical question.
< 1295035986 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Enjoy your regular whine-about-elliott rant alone.
< 1295035998 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeoN1, as a sign of how desperate I am, please start liveblogging to your full capacity.
< 1295036010 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh? I don't really enjoy this discussion. And it is no rant.
< 1295036028 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeoN1, LIVEBLOG
< 1295036031 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm on my second to.last bus
< 1295036057 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm upset that I didn't see her today, butthrilldd for tomorrow
< 1295036065 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, still if you can't be decent towards me, then don't expect me to listen to your pleas
< 1295036074 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My hands are to cold to.type properly in this phone
< 1295036092 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeoN1, can't you type with gloves on?
< 1295036102 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeoN1 is actually dying of cold somewhere in the frigid wastes of New York.
< 1295036116 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, the. Us is warm, but my hands are still stiff
< 1295036139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The US is warm indeed.
< 1295036144 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. The Us
< 1295036147 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeoN1, yes I'm sure parts of US is warm. Like Hawaii. But I suspect Alaska is rather cold.
< 1295036155 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what the average temperature is
< 1295036198 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe tomorrow I'll see her for more than the 1.5 hours I thought I'd see her today
< 1295036199 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okokokokokokokokokoko
< 1295036200 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okokokokokokoko
< 1295036203 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okokokokokokokokokokokokokokokokokoko
< 1295036204 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okokokokoko
< 1295036206 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okokokokokokokokokoko
< 1295036209 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is my 2 cents
< 1295036209 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oko!
< 1295036222 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hope i didn't interrupt anything important
< 1295036233 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, indeed you didn't
< 1295036235 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be embarrassing
< 1295036241 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay good
< 1295036305 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My toes ads still in pain
< 1295036334 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every period, when courses start, i have this really hard time doing homework because i'm afraid i just can't do it anymore
< 1295036342 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if i've gotten old, and can't math anymore
< 1295036350 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, things got so bad I had to get Sgeo to liveblog.
< 1295036368 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: they give you homework that actualyl requires thinking? wow
< 1295036370 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, I doubt that. How old are you?
< 1295036404 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm err
< 1295036407 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck do i know
< 1295036408 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295036411 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1295036411 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20
< 1295036415 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or 21
< 1295036421 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck...
< 1295036422 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, it is very unlikely to happen until you are at least 40 I bet. And even then unlikely for many years
< 1295036423 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me calculate
< 1295036436 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-173-37.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295036436 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2011 - 1989, so that means i turn 22 this year
< 1295036439 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, anyway if you are around 20-25 then you are not getting too old yet
< 1295036441 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i'm 21
< 1295036458 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, hey we are equally old (excluding month and day I guess)
< 1295036461 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, but what if i've just gotten totally rusty at math
< 1295036472 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm same age
< 1295036474 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, did you just finish a course with math?
< 1295036475 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when do you turn 22?
< 1295036479 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, get some WD-40 on those brain cells.
< 1295036482 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :May
< 1295036483 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, December
< 1295036484 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes, i had an exam on monday
< 1295036494 0 :cheater777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: sweet 22!
< 1295036496 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, then you are unlikely to be rusty already
< 1295036500 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SgeoN1, yes, but you have allowed your development to be retarded to the extent that you are effectively 14.
< 1295036506 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, a year without math, then maybe
< 1295036523 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, be fair. 15
< 1295036529 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, have a little croft in some hinterlands.
< 1295036532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does anyone know how to make xchat ignore mentions of a name?
< 1295036550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: As an ex-14-year-old, I take offence.
< 1295036551 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you could use the python or perl scripting plugin
< 1295036553 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION discovers that "hinterland" does not actually mean what he thought it meant.
< 1295036569 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what did you think it meant?
< 1295036573 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that's clearly because you are an immature and stupid 15-year-old.
< 1295036575 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hunter2land
< 1295036579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: INDEED
< 1295036583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I smell funny too.
< 1295036602 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have no understanding of the deeper meaning of things, unlike those of us who are fortunate enough to have the wisdom of age.
< 1295036605 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott is also homo and a nigger
< 1295036610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1295036614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a fag no less
< 1295036615 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a homo fag
< 1295036619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :additionally a kike
< 1295036620 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, OK, a croft in the highlands.
< 1295036649 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, so what did you think "hinterland" meant?
< 1295036667 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :backland
< 1295036668 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Middle of nowhere".
< 1295036699 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hm I thought that too. In a somewhat negative sense.
< 1295036712 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: what do you mean?
< 1295036717 0 :cheater777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i heard elliott programs in php
< 1295036720 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean have one
< 1295036730 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, huh: "The hinterland is the land or district behind the borders of a coast or river. Specifically, by the doctrine of the hinterland, the word is applied to the inland region lying behind a port, claimed by the state that owns the coast. ..."
< 1295036733 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, get one.
< 1295036735 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb ->
< 1295036738 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i will
< 1295036738 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Grow stuff. Eat it.
< 1295036746 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mmm, food
< 1295036779 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Finland is, admittedly, not the standard location for crofting, but I am assuming that it's sufficiently similar to the Highlands to be used for the purpose.
< 1295036821 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : You have no understanding of the deeper meaning of things, unlike those of us who are fortunate enough to have the wisdom of age. <-- wait, aren't you younger than elliott even?
< 1295036832 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, where did you get that idea from?
< 1295036837 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, from elliott iirc.
< 1295036841 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am far older and more mature than elliott.
< 1295036850 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, more mature, I don't dispute that
< 1295036855 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clearly that lie is just his vast immaturity showing through.
< 1295036858 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover must be at least 20
< 1295036865 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :might even be 23
< 1295036865 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm
< 1295036876 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HOW OLD ARE YOU PH
< 1295036883 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, recommended reading: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crofting
< 1295036884 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, no I don't think so. Could be older than elliott yes.
< 1295036928 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yeah maybe closer to 20
< 1295036938 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, more like 16-20
< 1295036942 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmhmm
< 1295036947 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ph: age?
< 1295036954 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, but yeah I thought elliott said you were 12 or 13?
< 1295036955 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :15^W16.
< 1295036970 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the reason for my guess was the similarity to pikhq
< 1295036976 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know where i get that from
< 1295036987 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ph is actually 7
< 1295036993 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise i might've guessed he's overcompensating for his age
< 1295036994 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, there was a complicated accident with a relativistic spaceship and I aged 3 years.
< 1295037009 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by being careful about what he says
< 1295037010 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like me
< 1295037034 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i actually think a penis hours about what i'm gonna say before hand
< 1295037054 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was pretty obvious that I was less than 18, what with me mentioning school all the time
< 1295037071 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i don't actually listen to the *content*
< 1295037079 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, ah
< 1295037080 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just read the tone of voice of all you
< 1295037083 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ppl
< 1295037095 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, tone of voice over IRC? :D
< 1295037110 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah you know, punctuation
< 1295037117 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1295037127 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Reminds me of that Pratchett character who pronounced brackets.
< 1295037141 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's all i see, dots and uppercase vs lowercase
< 1295037160 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, http://www.crofting.org/
< 1295037166 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hm yes. What was his name? And which book was it?
< 1295037168 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :theory: complaints about immaturity are _always_ hypocritical.  no exceptions.
< 1295037169 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clearly you must start the Finnish crofting foundation.
< 1295037186 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, Kirsty from the Johnny Maxwell series.
< 1295037186 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maturity is a silly concept
< 1295037195 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, not in cheese!
< 1295037200 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even when said as joke.
< 1295037201 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, oh I thought it happened in Discworld too?
< 1295037205 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*a joke.
< 1295037230 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, some lawyer or something? Probably wee free men or such?
< 1295037231 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note: above comment is hypocritical.
< 1295037257 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I got topographic sorting of changes working, at least
< 1295037280 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: topographic sorting is trivial, please try to grow up.
< 1295037288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: xD
< 1295037297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't actually impl the topographic sorting, just got it working on this structure :p
< 1295037297 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or use a fucking php function script kiddo
< 1295037306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol@ implication that php has tsort
< 1295037309 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295037313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :too complicated to implement!
< 1295037316 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed
< 1295037319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: http://sprunge.us/cGcj pretty this please
< 1295037337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wish haskell let me do "f x x" for "f x x' | x == x'" :(
< 1295037342 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't checked this, but i imagine from the millions of php functions, you can actually never find any algorithms you need for your basic stuff
< 1295037344 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah same
< 1295037371 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you're doing something stupid like web stuff
< 1295037390 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oklotalk lets you do that
< 1295037414 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D
< 1295037419 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: impl http://sprunge.us/cGcj in oklotalk please
< 1295037443 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I want to know how Scapegoat works. Please give me basic direction on where to look for Git help.
< 1295037456 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: i dunno, ask ais523
< 1295037459 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's good at answers
< 1295037493 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, where do I look for Git help?
< 1295037495 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so when where the three differen types of tree introduced?
< 1295037498 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that very recent?
< 1295037502 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, yesterday.
< 1295037506 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah!!
< 1295037518 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then the minecraft world is not all generated when you start a new game
< 1295037529 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course not.
< 1295037535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Considering it's practically infinite, of course not :P
< 1295037536 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you seriously think it was?
< 1295037541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's LAZILY EVALUATED.
< 1295037550 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it wasn't: This proves it
< 1295037555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except that sometimes the function changes half-way through evaluation and you get biome discontinuities!
< 1295037560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: It has been proved much earlier.
< 1295037566 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ALSO, all trees regenerated with the update.
< 1295037566 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by someone else
< 1295037573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Normally you wouldn't see the new type.
< 1295037577 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Until venturing out into new terrain.
< 1295037583 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did go to new terrain
< 1295037622 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is "Combinatorial Algorithms" any good? (Donald Knuth)
< 1295037646 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's knuth so probably?
< 1295037649 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh
< 1295037714 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# 7.9. Herculean tasks (aka NP-hard problems)
< 1295037716 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds good
< 1295037798 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3RAjfNdZ0hw NOTHIN' TO REPORT TODAY JUUUUUUUD
< 1295037864 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTF lol
< 1295037887 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I already linked to that.
< 1295037904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, your mother.
< 1295037919 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/eS9fx.jpg BEST EVER
< 1295037920 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001f5b00390f-CM001e6b2335dc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295037940 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: BTW, I will never forgive Jeb for taking up bluestone for lapis POOPLI.
< 1295037972 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Lapis lazuli" is objectively the coolest name for anything ever.
< 1295037983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I want there to be some secret conspiracy where you can make a portal out of Lapis Lazuli blocks and get into heaven."
< 1295037993 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Heaven portals. Fuckin' DISCUSS.
< 1295038015 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, when you go there, there's a Jesus mob.
< 1295038025 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it's all made of cloudstone.
< 1295038025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD
< 1295038031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cloudstone YES
< 1295038040 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Sand falls, but cloudstone RISES.
< 1295038050 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have to put stuff above it to stop it going above level 127 and evaporating.
< 1295038054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Canon: It becomes cloud.)
< 1295038070 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Putting cloudstone below sand makes an explosion, naturally.
< 1295038074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: (Or just swaps them.)
< 1295038102 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um
< 1295038109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://www.reddit.com/r/Minecraft/comments/f20n0/efficiency_of_making_coal_instead_of_mining_coal/
< 1295038109 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :help :(
< 1295038110 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott:
< 1295038112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ?
< 1295038159 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the CPU level for minecraft is a whole load of .dat files, but in ~/.minecraft/saves it's all categorized into folders
< 1295038166 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it's a version mismatch
< 1295038182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you have to put it in a world directory
< 1295038183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously
< 1295038185 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :World[12345]
< 1295038189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use an unused one
< 1295038190 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously
< 1295038207 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eah but World1 has folders like 0,1,1c etc
< 1295038209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: or do you mean the 0/ 1/ 1c/ etc. folders?
< 1295038212 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah
< 1295038215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: put the dat files in anyway, i think it'll auto-convert
< 1295038216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when you load it
< 1295038223 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay ill try it
< 1295038348 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I have individual change application and changeset application, what do you suggest I add next? I already have merging, right? since it's based into change application
< 1295038362 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you might want some more @'s in apply to share the tuples from the original line.  also .Set.map needs a space after the .
< 1295038393 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: no, it doesn't, actually
< 1295038397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but good catch, it should have one
< 1295038407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yeah, OK, I'll add more @s
< 1295038409 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still, it's quite ugly :(
< 1295038413 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"needs" in the pretty sense here
< 1295038471 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u350uod6Xzo
< 1295038475 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well alas i don't know how to solve your ugly =='s problem
< 1295038481 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arrow trap, but on FIRE.
< 1295038516 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so umm, server hasn't been updated or anything?
< 1295038516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: http://sprunge.us/HIHO it's better now, thanks, but apply is still pretty ugly
< 1295038526 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: indeed
< 1295038536 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: the ==s aren't even the ugliest part, probably
< 1295038537 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, just heard something about some new stuff
< 1295038551 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it's just that every case is very very similar
< 1295038558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: and it irritates me that i can't fix the duplication
< 1295038576 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Dear god. Do they ... hurt more like that?
< 1295038581 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No.
< 1295038590 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's no functional difference.
< 1295038594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I'm still scared. Especially because of the door opening.
< 1295038604 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's like, HI I NOTICED YOU, SO TAKE A LOOK AT HELL.
< 1295038611 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1295038632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle foldrM
< 1295038633 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Foldable foldrM :: (Foldable t, Monad m) => (a -> b -> m b) -> b -> t a -> m b
< 1295038638 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow it exists, yay
< 1295038654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle (a->b-> m b) -> b -> [a] -> m b
< 1295038655 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Foldable foldrM :: (Foldable t, Monad m) => (a -> b -> m b) -> b -> t a -> m b
< 1295038655 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Monad zipWithM_ :: Monad m => (a -> b -> m c) -> [a] -> [b] -> m ()
< 1295038655 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Monad foldM :: Monad m => (a -> b -> m a) -> a -> [b] -> m a
< 1295038721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: is my ordering function inefficient? I use the changes themselves as the keys
< 1295038723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which seems wonky
< 1295038730 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah this is crap
< 1295038735 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can#t load the CPU level
< 1295038770 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least I managed not to destroy my own saved game
< 1295038813 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> zip [0..] [1,2,3,4]
< 1295038815 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  [(0,1),(1,2),(2,3),(3,4)]
< 1295038821 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll use that for the keys i guess
< 1295039027 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders if anyone plays in WorldForge
< 1295039053 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ugh, I can't use integers as the keys, because deps returns [Change]
< 1295039060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and changes don't know about their list indices obviously
< 1295039094 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://worldforge.org/dev/metaserver
< 1295039102 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's 21 clients on one of the servers
< 1295039218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb
< 1295039220 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i'm not one to ask about efficiency optimization
< 1295039256 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mushrooms cannot be grown?
< 1295039263 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sucks I was going to grow some
< 1295039299 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure they can
< 1295039312 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: interesting i think most of your apply guards are equivalent to deps c `isPrefixOf` map fst line
< 1295039399 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*lines
< 1295039560 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: i don't think so, i just happened to read a reddit mc thread in which allowing mushroom farming was suggested
< 1295039579 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(browsing r/all)
< 1295039609 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1295039688 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was pointed out that allowing this would make some other foods essentially useless
< 1295040158 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish there was a way to sleep
< 1295040174 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minecraft: More than 500 sold <-- WTF???
< 1295040186 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it would be in the trillions by now
< 1295040257 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295040266 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://omnium-gatherum.appspot.com/pages/tile.html
< 1295040270 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you think this is trivial?
< 1295040293 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or easy
< 1295040315 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :62% packet loss to ineiros :/
< 1295040330 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that seems to be what cause the lag in general
< 1295040351 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, lemme guess, it's an open problem.
< 1295040422 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295040433 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it's periodic, although i already closed my solution
< 1295040500 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually took me quite a while because i figured it's aperiodic
< 1295040508 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because of "convince yourself"
< 1295040567 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also what's the smallest period you can get
< 1295040573 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i have the smallest possible
< 1295040589 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295040946 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I think I did it
< 1295041057 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott: interesting i think most of your apply guards are equivalent to deps c `isPrefixOf` map fst line
< 1295041060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: oh that's intriguing
< 1295041075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Minecraft: More than 500 sold <-- WTF???
< 1295041078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's 1 million
< 1295041079 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as of lately
< 1295041115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: do you think abusing that would be evil? :)
< 1295041129 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: the thing is that i'd have to pattern-match anyway, so it would just be weird... but i could do it as a subfunction
< 1295041168 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295041178 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit
< 1295041196 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DIE SGEO_ DIE
< 1295041227 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: btw trying to replace or delete SOF/EOF should also be disallowed, but
< 1295041449 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: periodic? what period?
< 1295041487 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: omg, it's insanely nice
< 1295041496 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295041503 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and how many of each block do you use
< 1295041512 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a repeating pattern
< 1295041521 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: http://sprunge.us/NKJI
< 1295041531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Now you tell me why that's incorrect :P
< 1295041553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm that erroneously accepts SOF/EOF as a change but whatever
< 1295041575 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually given the symmetry of the blocs, neither of those tells me much
< 1295041594 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except maybe that great minds think alike
< 1295041599 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and me as well
< 1295041643 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*blocks
< 1295041741 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION vaguely remembers reading somewhere that Red Dwarf survived in the BBC because the director general thought it was mocking SF, but can't remember where he heard it.
< 1295041789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah well it's broken so far
< 1295041867 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so hey, what structures are Changes and [Line]s :D
< 1295041869 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are they FUNCTORS
< 1295041917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i rely on oerjan to do all my thinking for me
< 1295041925 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295041950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The BBC is so strange.
< 1295041977 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the times fit too, since it was airing while Doctor Who was being cancelled.
< 1295042121 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Functors in String, probably
< 1295042133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: boring!
< 1295042144 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: are they APPLICATIVE functors?!!?!!!!!
< 1295042153 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey the toaster changed shape by series 4!
< 1295042164 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SUCH A VIOLATION OF CONTINUITY CANNOT BE TOLERATED
< 1295042183 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it has period 3 horizontally and period 4 vertically (with a shift of 1 block horizontally)
< 1295042215 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if there is a tiling with rotational symmetry
< 1295042216 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: sounds awkward
< 1295042234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i just want to be a pseudomathematician and reek, like all haskellers are known to do
< 1295042243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: sorry i forgot: also i want to be part of a cargo cult
< 1295042246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so please give me structures that it is
< 1295042250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even if i have to break the laws of those structures
< 1295042261 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: someone said "cargomorphism" in #haskell and got banned
< 1295042274 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: are you sure they were banned for _just_ that :p
< 1295042281 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well not just that
< 1295042286 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it was the last straw on the camels back
< 1295042293 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: was it that guy talking about a basic program
< 1295042295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with line numbers!
< 1295042298 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no
< 1295042299 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and clearly i can't do it simply in haskell
< 1295042300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1295042313 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you probably want the Changeset case to be before the general one.  could also put an SOF test there i think
< 1295042317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#haskell used to be such a nice channel, but haskell's recent surge in popularity hasn't done it good :(
< 1295042320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yeah i did :P
< 1295042355 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t isInfixOf
< 1295042356 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (Eq a) => [a] -> [a] -> Bool
< 1295042363 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t elem
< 1295042364 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (Eq a) => a -> [a] -> Bool
< 1295042374 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@pl (\c -> elem SOF (deps c) || elem EOF (deps c))
< 1295042374 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ap ((||) . elem SOF . deps) (elem EOF . deps)
< 1295042377 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh
< 1295042387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@pl (\c -> elem SOF (deps c) || elem EOF (deps c)) c
< 1295042388 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elem SOF (deps c) || elem EOF (deps c)
< 1295042392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD
< 1295042398 0 :Ahoalton!IceChat09@dialup-4.249.228.55.Dial1.Washington2.Level3.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295042468 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: strictly speaking SOF and EOF shouldn't be allowed in the deps of a Change, should they?
< 1295042479 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh someone on MO posted "question which, I suppose, is as easy as abc for an expert"
< 1295042481 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: (Insert "hello" SOF EOF)
< 1295042488 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: that inserts the line "hello" into the empty file
< 1295042490 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1295042500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: remember that it's blame-based: you insert things in-between _changes_
< 1295042504 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so Insert is an exception...
< 1295042504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a line is identified by the change that created it
< 1295042514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: oh... indeed...
< 1295042526 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I have a feeling this SOF/EOF thing is crufty and could be improved, but ais at least hasn't thought of anything better
< 1295042545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: link?
< 1295042548 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i have period (4, 1)
< 1295042555 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohh
< 1295042566 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah okay you explained both periods
< 1295042587 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just gave the bigger one, i think we have the same one then
< 1295042599 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it may be the smallest tiling then
< 1295042611 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://mathoverflow.net/questions/52116/quadratic-forms-without-common-zeroes
< 1295042655 0 :Ahoalton!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhh, what is this chan
< 1295042660 0 :Ahoalton!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and how did I wind up here?
< 1295042662 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a quadratic form :P
< 1295042673 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somehow i feel like i should remember the def
< 1295042684 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: linear combination of squares
< 1295042685 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahoalton: esoteric programming languages.  except we're almost never on topic
< 1295042696 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should invent an esoteric programming language
< 1295042701 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahoalton: spiritualism, mysticism, and magick! note: lies
< 1295042711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we're actually a figment of your imagination
< 1295042726 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahoalton: otherwise, anything weird from programming or sometimes math
< 1295042761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we're basically one big family that's constantly fighting and wishing certain members would die
< 1295042766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :having a constant christmas reunion
< 1295042767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forever
< 1295042773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and pretending to like each other
< 1295042774 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha
< 1295042784 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hey we're not _that_ bad
< 1295042784 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295042795 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well we wouldn't be, if only Vorpal choked on his own vomit!
< 1295042797 0 :Ahoalton!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are esoteric programming languages?
< 1295042805 0 :Ahoalton!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll check teh wiki
< 1295042811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahoalton: ones that you wouldn't want to actually, you know, use
< 1295042842 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: quadratic form on F^5 means you have a quadratic form in 5 variables?
< 1295042847 0 :Ahoalton!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like wolfram mathematica
< 1295042855 0 :Ahoalton!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone used the software?
< 1295042876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahoalton: mathematica is the buggiest, slowest piece of rubbish ever
< 1295042889 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i used to use it when i had integration in my courses
< 1295042916 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1295042921 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i don't need that shit anymore so i don't really use mathematica either
< 1295042929 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i don't think that would be abc for an expert
< 1295042934 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahoalton: I write my own
< 1295042948 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i may be wrong ofc, but that seems like a nontrivial prob
< 1295042963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahoalton: we have a guy in here that wolfram gave $25,000 to and even he hates mathematica :D
< 1295042968 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's a (consequence of a) really neat theorem
< 1295042975 0 :Ahoalton!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which version elliott it got better
< 1295042982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahoalton: no it didn't, this was with 7
< 1295042984 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: The Chevally-Warning thing, the proof is pretty easy
< 1295042990 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh whoops lol
< 1295042990 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: (I mean to read... not to come up with)
< 1295042997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahoalton: i'm referring to the winner of http://www.wolframscience.com/prizes/tm23/solved.html who is ais523 in here
< 1295043009 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i thought that was a *warning* for when he starts proving the thing :D
< 1295043010 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD
< 1295043013 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1295043017 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahoalton: warning, elliott is the resident channel cynic
< 1295043019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahoalton: the wolfram guys gave him some mathematica code that reimplemented his submitted Perl, and it made mathematica crash, as in a segfault
< 1295043031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hey now, the fact that mathematica sucks is well-known :)
< 1295043033 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although some others seem to be converting
< 1295043046 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i'm speaking generally here
< 1295043059 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i guess i just don't know anything about multivariate stuff
< 1295043062 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ørjan
< 1295043063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahoalton: warning, oerjan is the resident channel superstitious guy
< 1295043064 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lemme check proof
< 1295043068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: speaking generally!
< 1295043077 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: http://math.uga.edu/~pete/4400ChevalleyWarning.pdf
< 1295043077 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: O KAY
< 1295043083 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: >:D
< 1295043094 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and the EGZ theorem is super cool
< 1295043124 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295043125 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-variant what is?
< 1295043133 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is ?
< 1295043140 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EGZ thm
< 1295043141 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used to write down maths homework half the time in LaTeX, the other half in a Mathematica notebook. It wasn't that bad for that, and at least you had it open for checking things.
< 1295043144 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what IS
< 1295043148 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it in that paper?
< 1295043151 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: :D
< 1295043157 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: yes
< 1295043157 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: answer his question!
< 1295043160 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1295043162 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what *is*
< 1295043163 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"what is?" "yes"
< 1295043169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it all makes sense now
< 1295043177 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION achieves nirvana
< 1295043191 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps dropping my pronouns around you people is a bad idea
< 1295043199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahoalton: you're on DIALUP?
< 1295043203 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you a spane or something
< 1295043205 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry for being lazy but i am@typing on my phone so...
< 1295043207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahoalton: my condolences
< 1295043217 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also i found out i can do it with gloves on
< 1295043225 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean rub your penis
< 1295043247 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no
< 1295043251 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the phone thing?
< 1295043263 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Maybe Level3 just already ran out of IP addresses and started reusing dialup-named ones.
< 1295043267 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i need both hands wide open to rub my penis
< 1295043278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: :D
< 1295043279 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: If you have a collection of n different numbers, there is a subset of size <= 2n which sums to 0 (mod n)
< 1295043289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: I need my arms
< 1295043295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really inconvenient
< 1295043306 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually <
< 1295043311 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: isn't that a bit too much on the safe side?
< 1295043312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so hey oerjan change the model so that insert isn't a special case :
< 1295043316 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: hm?
< 1295043324 0 :Ahoalton!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you know my connection elliott
< 1295043327 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It's in their old 4.0.0.0/8 net, so you can't really tell much from the address.)
< 1295043328 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't you just need n
< 1295043330 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: mdaning multiset?
< 1295043332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahoalton: it's in your /whoi
< 1295043333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s
< 1295043333 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :numbers
< 1295043338 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* [Ahoalton] (IceChat09@dialup-4.249.228.55.Dial1.Washington2.Level3.net): The Chat Cool People Use
< 1295043339 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oops! I meant n/2
< 1295043341 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not 2n
< 1295043348 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1295043352 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :makes more sense
< 1295043357 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: yeah sorry multiset
< 1295043365 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh n/3
< 1295043369 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*n/2
< 1295043372 0 :Ahoalton!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right, well it works well
< 1295043373 0 :Ahoalton!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :enough
< 1295043380 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so umm how about 1 n/2 times
< 1295043382 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it really doesn't
< 1295043383 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001f5b00390f-CM001e6b2335dc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295043384 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it's a multiset
< 1295043387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you like, use gopher
< 1295043390 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh the subset is
< 1295043391 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a multiset
< 1295043392 0 :Ahoalton!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for what I do it does
< 1295043399 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahoalton: use gopher?
< 1295043399 0 :Ahoalton!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can do everything but watch videos
< 1295043404 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you need n different numbers in the multiset
< 1295043405 0 :Ahoalton!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the hell is gopher
< 1295043406 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :read man
< 1295043418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahoalton: like the web except usable on dialup and also useless
< 1295043437 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but umm
< 1295043441 0 :Ahoalton!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhh, no I use firefox and the normal internet with noscript and adblock
< 1295043445 0 :Ahoalton!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :makes things faster
< 1295043446 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so just take any number n times?
< 1295043454 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can someone state the problem without errors?
< 1295043455 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahoalton: right, so loading google.com prolly only takes you about 4 minutes?
< 1295043467 0 :Ahoalton!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I can even torrent, if not slowly a
< 1295043473 0 :Ahoalton!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and google isn't slow
< 1295043499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :torrent??? like what
< 1295043501 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Google's rather bandwith-optimized, for obvious reasons.
< 1295043503 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't imagine torrenting anything on dialup
< 1295043503 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i assume it is in the linked paper
< 1295043505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe like
< 1295043506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 jpegs
< 1295043512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that could be torrentable
< 1295043534 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hey i can do a HACK
< 1295043538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: | dps == [SOF} || dps == [EOF]
< 1295043542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: since non-Insert deps lists are only one long
< 1295043543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*]
< 1295043544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDDDD
< 1295043549 0 :Ahoalton!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ya'll are annoying,
< 1295043550 0 :Ahoalton!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bye
< 1295043550 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: they don't call them torrents.
< 1295043552 0 :Ahoalton!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :?
< 1295043558 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ever heard of "bittrickle"?
< 1295043562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay, another newbie scared away
< 1295043569 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least that one didn't know what esolangs are
< 1295043577 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: bitdrip
< 1295043623 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was he even asking for?
< 1295043637 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: nothing
< 1295043641 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay so
< 1295043641 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he just came in and then asked how the hell he got here
< 1295043644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then defended mathematica
< 1295043646 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, dialup's not *that* slow, I think I used to get something like 30-40 kbps from the theoretically-56k connection.
< 1295043646 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was no n/2 i suppose
< 1295043647 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and asked what esolangs are
< 1295043651 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and USED DIALUP
< 1295043661 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: And then you ANNOYED him away.
< 1295043672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: he said YA'LL, not ELLIOTT
< 1295043678 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i blame quintopia personally
< 1295043687 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm... Hash function that blows up if you feed 65536YiB to it in one message... Meh.
< 1295043691 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was the non-royal ya'll, meaning "you", in this particular case "just you".
< 1295043695 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it was definitely my fault
< 1295043696 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: Oh no, how horrible :P
< 1295043700 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't it always
< 1295043709 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION scurries away
< 1295043711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: The non-royal ya'll... the most USELESS WORD EVER
< 1295043723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only purpose of y'all existing is to be a plural you :P
< 1295043759 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if all y'all think that, elliott
< 1295043761 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ya'll is short for "ya will" i.e. "you will"
< 1295043769 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295043778 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: True, I will indeed are annoying at some point.
< 1295043824 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :22:24 < oerjan> if all y'all think that, elliott
< 1295043826 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops
< 1295043827 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y'all yell a lot
< 1295043831 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: That compares favorably to SHA-1/SHA-2, which both have a maximum message length of 2^64-1 bits, i.e. 2 EiB (minus one bit).
< 1295043837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: STOP COPYING OUR MESSAGES
< 1295043862 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Well, SHA-256 variant of SHA-2; SHA-512 has 2^128-1 bits.)
< 1295043863 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT'S INFRINGEDEMENT
< 1295043864 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(although it is certainly obvious floor(n/2) works)
< 1295043914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hey why isn't there a name for foldr . reverse (modulo making that correct)
< 1295043932 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: foldl
< 1295043938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i.e. if i have a list of changes [a,b,c,d] and a must come before b, b must come before c, etc., then the right thing is "foldrM apply xs (reverse listOfChanges)"
< 1295043941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: er not really?
< 1295043960 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it?
< 1295043960 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm
< 1295043967 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who knows
< 1295043986 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> foldl (flip f) end [a,b,c,d]
< 1295043988 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  Not in scope: `end'
< 1295043991 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> foldl (flip f) x [a,b,c,d]
< 1295043994 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  f d (f c (f b (f a x)))
< 1295043999 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDD
< 1295044004 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: is n/2 optimal?
< 1295044017 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for distinct numbers
< 1295044019 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well the theorem says you have 2n-1 things, and there is a subsequence of size at most n
< 1295044033 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: if it's optimal it will be optimal on oen of the prime numbers
< 1295044039 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't checked myself
< 1295044078 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: looks like one of the rare possible uses for foldl rather than foldl'
< 1295044085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t foldl
< 1295044086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t foldl'
< 1295044086 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b. (a -> b -> a) -> a -> [b] -> a
< 1295044087 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b. (a -> b -> a) -> a -> [b] -> a
< 1295044091 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hm why
< 1295044100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i guess it might be marginally more efficient
< 1295044102 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: non-strictness
< 1295044105 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: if a change overwrites another change?
< 1295044111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ?
< 1295044126 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh well then maybe you want foldl' anyhow
< 1295044133 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or not...
< 1295044135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well i just wonder why you think foldl would help
< 1295044138 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vs foldl'
< 1295044156 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well i mean for that foldr ... . reverse thing in general
< 1295044166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1295044170 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not to mention that hashing even a 1PiB in single message would take a fast computer with a fast hash algorithm about 24 days...
< 1295044174 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: foldl' just makes me feel bad in general
< 1295044178 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: actually so does foldl
< 1295044183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just seems wrong
< 1295044192 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: note that in this case it's _actually_ foldM
< 1295044195 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: because applies can fail
< 1295044207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so I think it's already the equivalent of foldl'
< 1295044209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@src foldM
< 1295044209 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foldM _ a []     = return a
< 1295044210 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foldM f a (x:xs) = f a x >>= \fax -> foldM f fax xs
< 1295044218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol @ fax as arg nam
< 1295044218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e
< 1295044220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*name
< 1295044236 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, in your opinion, does making a language easier to implement make it worth crippling the language?
< 1295044247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: No. Never.
< 1295044250 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, by easier, I think he means nicer
< 1295044257 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, ...why on earth would that be worthwhile.
< 1295044262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Well, unless it's to make a theoretical model.
< 1295044266 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Who, what language, and what crippling?
< 1295044269 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You want a language to use, not to stare at the interpreter.
< 1295044276 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, so esolangs exempt.
< 1295044282 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://raynes.me/logs/irc.freenode.net/atomo/today.txt
< 1295044290 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295044298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Another exception: Toy languages like Atomo.
< 1295044301 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But most implemented esolangs *are* an interpreter.
< 1295044317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: i.e., if you're just exploring the design space, you can do whatever.
< 1295044323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And generally implementation ease wins out there.
< 1295044332 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, the word "isoblorphism"
< 1295044346 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*turned up in my head, and I want to know what it's supposed to mean.
< 1295044354 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Am I misinterpreting what he's saying?
< 1295044355 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hm yeah it's foldl' except in the rare case where you can deduce a Nothing as the result from only the outer part of it
< 1295044368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I don't know, I don't know Atomo.
< 1295044372 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Summarise.
< 1295044399 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: can you make ais appear here
< 1295044403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i need to ask him qs about scapegoat!
< 1295044403 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He removed the ability to change an object's delegate so that the implementation becomes much nicer
< 1295044413 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: How did you arrive to that number? Because I went by Skein, which reportedly does 500 GiB/s on a 3.1 GHz x64 Core 2 Duo, and that gives 1*1024*1024/0.5/60/60/24 ~ 24.27, which is suspiciously similar.
< 1295044416 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: or wait, the definition of foldM makes that foldl' for Maybes
< 1295044429 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: If changing delegates is a Bad Thing to do anyway, then it's a good decision.
< 1295044434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I suspect it is a bad decision.
< 1295044437 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/GiB/MiB/
< 1295044449 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(500 gigabytes/sec would be pretty impressive.)
< 1295044474 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://files.slatelanguage.org/doc/pmd/talk.pdf argues that the ability to change delegates is a very, very good thing
< 1295044488 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mutation is always bad.
< 1295044491 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So no, no it isn't
< 1295044491 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Store a piece of state as "which ancestor" instead of as a slot on the object
< 1295044493 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*isn't.
< 1295044517 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: no, he wrote another toy language, "Atomy", with a much simpler model for objects, then backported the changes
< 1295044530 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Goddamn it, why are there no Linux browsers with built-in PDF readers.
< 1295044536 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Chrome.
< 1295044542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Its built-in reader renders text really badly though.
< 1295044554 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314, uh?
< 1295044560 0 :Wamanuz3!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295044575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: i see no evidence for that
< 1295044597 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ask him yourself.
< 1295044624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: considering that his github has no atomy repo, and you haven't provided any sort of evidence at all, I don't see why I should
< 1295044628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did he tell you that, or osmething?
< 1295044629 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it doesn't seem to...
< 1295044630 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*something?
< 1295044630 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: https://bitbucket.org/alex/atomy/
< 1295044639 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When I click on links to PDFs, it downloads as normal.
< 1295044642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh, bitbucket
< 1295044653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: by chrome, do you mean Debian's chromium package?
< 1295044657 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I bet it doesn't come with the pdf reader
< 1295044663 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone here like beer?
< 1295044665 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: it's a bad reader though, I don't recommend it, text is really ugly
< 1295044666 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. Is it terribly outdated or crippled?
< 1295044675 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Uh, it's fairly outdated I think.
< 1295044683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since Chrome gets updated roughly every millisecond.
< 1295044692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Silently, and automatically, like Minecraft!)
< 1295044693 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :beer? anyone?
< 1295044697 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(OK, not really.)
< 1295044700 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: nope!
< 1295044707 0 :Wamanuz2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295044712 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know you don't
< 1295044718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just providin' a data point
< 1295044736 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :datum is shorter
< 1295044749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your face is shorter.
< 1295044752 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :than a datum.
< 1295044756 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my face has a beer
< 1295044763 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders how to most effectively compress music to fit in MC music circuits.
< 1295044765 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your beer is a datum.
< 1295044769 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: mp3!
< 1295044771 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PRACTICAL
< 1295044772 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and a beard  but that is irrelevant)
< 1295044778 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Oh my god, let's wire one up to the CPU.
< 1295044783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: IT MUST BE DONE
< 1295044783 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, we're talking note-level.
< 1295044790 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION likes the occasional beer but hasn't had one for months
< 1295044813 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, have you *seen* the time that thing takes per iteration?
< 1295044815 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd buy you a beer
< 1295044824 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you would promise not to swat me
< 1295044824 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: IT'D BE A VERY SLOW SONG
< 1295044835 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Do the rendition of the Lincolnshire Poacher heard on the numbers station of the same name.
< 1295044842 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It creeps me out. Like a creeper.
< 1295044843 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: i don't like beer _that_ much
< 1295044849 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTFAD
< 1295044850 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha
< 1295044854 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION whistles innocently
< 1295044856 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Well, we're talking note-level. <-- some MIDI?
< 1295044859 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I used bit higher clock rate (i7 can have one) and 6 clocks per byte.
< 1295044868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: In fact, make it activated by a pressure plate, and surround your house with them, so that when a creeper steps on them, it plays it.
< 1295044870 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Has people smelling clean sheets, then narrator says they were washed 7 days ago
< 1295044876 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How is that interesting?/
< 1295044877 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, dunno, just as in sheet music.
< 1295044879 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, though a different scheme is probably better
< 1295044879 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Poacher.ogg
< 1295044884 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, maybe after 7 days of regular use, etc.
< 1295044929 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sgeo: it's a commentary on people who like the smell of sweat
< 1295044958 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Bye
< 1295045120 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: Well, Skein is also described a 6.1 clocks/byte; does something else do 6?
< 1295045181 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some other implementation reportedly did 5.99.
< 1295045219 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on what operation?
< 1295045234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :skein.
< 1295045239 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: i like beer
< 1295045262 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i almost never drink it
< 1295045281 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does skein even mean?
< 1295045290 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: It's one of the SHA-3 contest hash functions.
< 1295045301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite likely to win.
< 1295045303 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, a measure of wool?
< 1295045305 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1295045309 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :got it
< 1295045333 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel tempted to say "Schneier's one", but it *does* have other authors, and I don't want to slight them.
< 1295045352 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :speaking of contests, I haven't checked up on the netflix prize in almost a year....
< 1295045376 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Didn't they already award it to someone?
< 1295045388 0 :Wamanuz4!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295045405 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dunno.  like i said...haven't checked
< 1295045444 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"On September 18, 2009, Netflix announced team "BellKor's Pragmatic Chaos" as the prize winner, and the prize was awarded to the team in a ceremony on September 21, 2009.[22] "The Ensemble" team had in fact succeeded to match BellKor's result, but since BellKor submitted their results 20 minutes earlier, the rules award the prize to them."
< 1295045446 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: ping.
< 1295045451 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What a dramatic moment.
< 1295045472 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha
< 1295045478 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a close call
< 1295045489 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have they started a new one?
< 1295045551 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No.
< 1295045573 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Legal troubles.
< 1295045575 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i assume they have implemented that algorithm on their servers now
< 1295045577 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"In the past few months, the Federal Trade Commission (FTC) asked us how a Netflix Prize sequel might affect Netflix members' privacy, and a lawsuit was filed by KamberLaw LLC pertaining to the sequel."
< 1295045578 0 :Wamanuz3!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1295045584 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"In light of all this, we have decided to not pursue the Netflix Prize sequel that we announced on August 6, 2009."
< 1295045603 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I remember reading about the lawsuit, but not that they decided to cancel the new competition.
< 1295045624 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as i recall, all their test data were anonymouse
< 1295045634 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, anonymized to some degree.
< 1295045641 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's always arguable how much of that can be done.
< 1295045642 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would the sequel dompromise privacy'
< 1295045665 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They were worried about the first contest already.
< 1295045677 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some people identified particular users by cross-correlating against IMDB ratings.
< 1295045688 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anonymized inasmuch as they removed all references to actual people and randomize some of the data
< 1295045698 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1295045700 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :weird
< 1295045734 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The ratings of less-popular films, coupled with the dates they're rated, form a kind of movie-preference fingerprint that can be used to make matches, the researchers concluded."
< 1295045763 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They can't add too much random noise before their data set goes too far from the real data for sensible algorithm evaluation and such.
< 1295045769 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh shit.  ghey can find out what movies people like!
< 1295045780 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an invasion of privacy
< 1295045788 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they might like /porn/!
< 1295045810 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out
< 1295045816 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yes, indeed.
< 1295045816 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay phone is dying
< 1295045818 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bye
< 1295045824 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So. Minecraft is really, really, really addictive.
< 1295045841 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Told you.
< 1295045842 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't find it tat bad
< 1295045842 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think also Netflix people may have said in their Terms that they won't tell other people what they're renting.
< 1295045845 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a lot of fun though
< 1295045847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You've had it for, what, 3 hours? :P
< 1295045860 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Guess how long I've been playing it!
< 1295045868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: SEVEN HOURS?
< 1295045878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :04:39:30  does the minecraft world wrap around?
< 1295045878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :04:39:37  ilke a donus
< 1295045882 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this reminds me, I should be playing minecraft
< 1295045885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: dunno, why not walk to the edge and find out :D
< 1295045896 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You are an evil man.
< 1295045897 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I thought I hade looped but turns out I just went in a circle
< 1295045899 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's clearly an Orbital.
< 1295045902 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: LOL
< 1295045908 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it has 4x the surface area of the earth
< 1295045914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you will nevereverever find the edgee
< 1295045915 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*edge
< 1295045916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EVER
< 1295045924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you walked for real-world years constantly ... still no
< 1295045939 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not without our top-secret SMP teleporter.
< 1295045947 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: yeah then it'd just lag forever
< 1295045948 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Don't they always say 8x?
< 1295045949 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one thing which sucks is I can't leave minecraft running the background while I am here on IRC
< 1295045953 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: er maybe
< 1295045955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yes you can?
< 1295045987 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: btw re: source code, minecraft is "open" in that decompiling java produces something almost identical to the original code minus variable names, and there's a bunch of batch files (apparently with a shell script version) that deobfuscate most of the class, variable and method names
< 1295045990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can use this for modding
< 1295045998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :05:21:47  4.27 m/s, http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Transportation
< 1295046002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Scale that to the Minecraft day.
< 1295046005 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: geez he should just release the code :P
< 1295046007 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: i.e., 20 minutes vs. 24 hours
< 1295046020 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*17 minutes
< 1295046024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Yeah, well, Asteroids II will come with full Amber source code.
< 1295046066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: um?
< 1295046069 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: the days are 20 minutes
< 1295046089 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nights are 7. Days are 10.
< 1295046095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Sunrise/set are 1.5 each.
< 1295046097 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And dusk/dawn are the other 3.
< 1295046097 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Day/night_cycle.
< 1295046099 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right.
< 1295046103 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric := 20.
< 1295046108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : one thing which sucks is I can't leave minecraft running the background while I am here on IRC
< 1295046109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: why not?
< 1295046121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Phantom_Hoover: Gem from that page: "Actual time of Sunset will not change if the texture for the sun is changed. The day/night cycle will be the same length with the same effects even if the sun is visibly larger or smaller."
< 1295046122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O RLY
< 1295046218 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish you could put a collar around animals so they don't disappear
< 1295046228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ubuntu is getting really great lately
< 1295046232 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10.10 is very polished
< 1295046233 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well that doesn't seem too insane really. Maybe texture packs should be able to provide a parameter for it
< 1295046257 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: OMG
< 1295046258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hellworld
< 1295046258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This option has shown up in the 0.2.2_01 release.
< 1295046258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Valid values:
< 1295046258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true - the server will behave like The Nether; red sky, zombie pigmen and ghasts spawning. The map will stay the same, however, so don't set this flag if you don't want pigmen stomping all over your flower garden.
< 1295046268 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You can get red sky, zombie pigmen, and ghasts on a normal map.
< 1295046271 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That would be ... so amazing
< 1295046281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh look:
< 1295046281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :online-mode
< 1295046281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Server checks connecting players against minecraft's account database. Only set this to false if your server is not connected to the Internet. Hackers with fake accounts can connect if this is set to false!
< 1295046282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Valid values:
< 1295046282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true - Enabled. The server will assume it has an Internet connection and check every player.
< 1295046283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :false - Disabled. The server will not attempt to check connecting players.
< 1295046285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You don't even need a mod.
< 1295046302 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course not. But to provide any level of security you do
< 1295046303 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is this *official*?
< 1295046312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It's in server.properties, at least.
< 1295046318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Server.properties
< 1295046327 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jeb is the best thing to happen to MC since forever.
< 1295046335 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :05:25:39  Phantom_Hoover: He wanted to be the guy who's been furthest away from spawn, so I was computerizing how much walking would it take to get to (100k,100k).
< 1295046338 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, online-mode would allow me to log in as you and dump your inventory in one of my chests for example. And that thing has been around for ages.
< 1295046339 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: me and Phantom_Hoover have been there.
< 1295046353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I don't think that's new.
< 1295046354 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Psssht.
< 1295046376 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SHUTUPFACTSCAN'TDISSUADEMYJEBFANBOYISM
< 1295046418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Jeb still WORKS FOR NOTCH and ostensibly agrees with his main opinions.
< 1295046424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: And didn't veto the switch from git to svn.
< 1295046425 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well, 4.27 blocks/IRL-second → 4.27/72 game-metres/game-second → 213.5 metres/hour. Okay, that's not a very fast walk.
< 1295046427 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do not like him too much.
< 1295046444 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: 0.1 mph :D
< 1295046461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You have verified my theory that everything in the Minecraft world is really, really slow and we just view it from a zoom lens.
< 1295046478 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295046503 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but you hate git now...?
< 1295046505 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well, minecarts can travel up to 0.25 mph.
< 1295046508 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a mathematical proof that a programming language cannot be both turing-complete and reversible?
< 1295046535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ZOMG
< 1295046537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: No, because it can be.
< 1295046552 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, and in km/h?
< 1295046567 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I forgot the conversion factor for that)
< 1295046588 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It is what I thought, yes it can be both.
< 1295046663 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 0.4 km/h.
< 1295046706 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(28.8 km/h if you count metres in game-blocks but time in IRL terms.)
< 1295046717 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone mentioned a proof:  http://esolangs.org/wiki/Talk:2D-Reverse
< 1295046771 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: The Art of Computer Programming, Volume 4A: Combinatorial Algorithms, Part I, has been released.
< 1295046807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Part 1
< 1295046815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: hey is that the book you were referring to?
< 1295046826 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: of course you should by TAoCP! all of it! NOWWWW
< 1295046845 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Should I get TAoCP?
< 1295046867 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not have it but I would like to buy it too.
< 1295046889 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Amazon sells a reasonably priced reasonably pretty box of TAoCP 1-3.
< 1295046894 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: there are turing equivalent reverseible prorgamming languages
< 1295046919 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: there is also a notation of "reversibly turing complete" which means it does not store its whole execution trace (while still being reversible)
< 1295046937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: YES. (Note: It costs like £100 for the box set.)
< 1295046943 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm
< 1295046960 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For Volume 4, I think I'll wait until they sell a box with at least 4A, 4B and 4C.
< 1295046962 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Random things that immensely annoy me about Doctor Who part n: how many times is humanity going to make first contact?
< 1295046964 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295046986 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I expect 2D-Reverse is reversible and turing-complete.
< 1295047002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: :D
< 1295047006 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it?
< 1295047019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I like how everyone acts completely normally even though aliens have been shown to definitely exist, rather dramatically.
< 1295047025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Nobody ever talks about them. Ever.
< 1295047028 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, Amazon already has a Volume 1-4A box (for pre-order).
< 1295047038 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, except when it's a plot point, naturally.
< 1295047059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: "ridiculous. ant/nant is already the ultimate build system." --actual person expressing actual, non-sarcastic opinion
< 1295047075 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It got particularly ridiculous when noöne bothered to tell Donna that she had missed about 3 alien invasions.
< 1295047126 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.amazon.com/Art-Computer-Programming-Volumes-Boxed/dp/0201485419/ -- this is the version I have, and it's sort-of reasonably priced; but of course if you don't have volumes 1-3, the new box -- http://www.amazon.com/Computer-Programming-Volumes-1-4A-Boxed/dp/0321751043/ -- probably has updates in 1-3 too. (Since it's called "third edition" and all.)
< 1295047173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish ais was here so I could ask if all changesets should just be stored topographically sorted to avoid recomputing, or if there's some reason why that can't work.
< 1295047173 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Anything happen while I was away?" "Well, some aliens invaded and killed a bunch of people, but that's old news."
< 1295047212 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You're forgetting the part where the Earth got TRANSPORTED TO ANOTHER SOLAR SYSTEM, which apparently made the sky transparent for some reason.
< 1295047218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or was Donna there for that?
< 1295047221 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Point is, nobody's mentioned it since.
< 1295047227 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, erm, the sky kind of is transparent.
< 1295047235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well, yes.
< 1295047239 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If there was another planet nearby in the sky, we'd see it clearly.
< 1295047242 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: But I mean, it became black with planets dotted in it.
< 1295047250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: *Yes*, but there was a suspicious lack of *blue*.
< 1295047270 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, there wasn't exactly a star nearby.
< 1295047277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Err, wasn't there?
< 1295047290 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not IIRC.
< 1295047294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh.
< 1295047299 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The rest of my line still stands.
< 1295047359 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The bit about everyone forgetting and going about their lives?
< 1295047360 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I now know what causes the lag to ineiros. Packet loss.
< 1295047380 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal had finally solved the greatest problem of his existence.
< 1295047406 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION ponders redownloading ... those links elliott mentioned
< 1295047426 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, did I claim that...?
< 1295047436 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, where did you get that idea from
< 1295047440 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, nowhere.
< 1295047448 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BACK TO THE AMNESIA OF DOCTOR WHO CHARACTERS
< 1295047458 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To be fair, they do poke fun at it.
< 1295047480 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the timeline and continuity is irrevocably screwed up, probably because RTD is a grade-A idiot.
< 1295047484 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4A has a pretty limited topic (7.1 zeros and ones, incl. 7.1.3 bitwise tricks and techniques, plus 7.2.1 combinatorial generators), leaving many juicy bits (7.3 shortest paths, 7.4 graph algos, 7.5 network algos, etc.) for volumes 4B, 4C, ...; even given that it manages to be 912 pages. So my guess is it's rather knuthian in depth.
< 1295047532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: They should devote two whole series to reconstructing the timeline.
< 1295047533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like DC Comics.
< 1295047539 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, even then.
< 1295047552 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider that it can't possibly be in sync with the real-world time.
< 1295047595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Have it start with the "wibbly wobbly timey wimey" speech from Blink!
< 1295047599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That solves everything
< 1295047615 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doctor Who quite clearly has 2D time.
< 1295047644 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, your links don't work
< 1295047653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Yes they do.
< 1295047658 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm
< 1295047669 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in, trying to use the downloaded files doens't work
< 1295047701 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: They do if you have a friend who's willing to let you access their MC account once.
< 1295047703 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, from Knuth's page: "Volume 5, Syntactic Algorithms, in preparation: 9. Lexical scanning (includes also string search and data compression); 10. Parsing techniques. Estimated to be ready by 2020." Well, he certainly is optimistic.
< 1295047706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ask KTAT
< 1295047708 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Failed to load Main-Class manifest attribute from .."
< 1295047726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: He has discovered the Fountain of Youth.
< 1295047727 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"After Volume 5 has been completed, I will revise Volumes 1--3 again to bring them up to date. In particular, the new material for those volumes that has been issued in beta-test fascicles will be incorporated at that time.
< 1295047728 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then I will publish a ``reader's digest'' edition of Volumes 1--5, condensing the most important material into a single book.
< 1295047728 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And after Volumes 1--5 are done, God willing, I plan to publish Volume 6 (the theory of context-free languages) and Volume 7 (Compiler techniques), but only if the things I want to say about those topics are still relevant and still haven't been said." That's probably around 2100 or so, then.
< 1295047742 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C:\Users\Sgeo\Downloads\MinecraftNew\minecraft.jar"
< 1295047761 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, *KT-AT
< 1295047780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Ktat.
< 1295047783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Fail.
< 1295047790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It goes in %APPDATA%\.minecraft\bin.
< 1295047803 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And you need Minecraft.jar (uppercase M) from the minecraft.net site (placed anywhere) to launch it.
< 1295047843 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why is there a Minecraft.jar and a minecraft.jar?
< 1295047850 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Notch-quality naming scheme
< 1295047852 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?
< 1295047878 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does the Minecraft.jar have to be up to date?
< 1295047889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh, it's a free download.
< 1295047947 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what will happen to my alpha save?
< 1295047952 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Should I just delete it?
< 1295047961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It will work fine.
< 1295047975 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :More grievances with Doctor Who: what was with everyone acting like everything was fine after they rewound time in the series 3 finale?
< 1295047980 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is happy that he won't need to go coal hunting
< 1295047988 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Um, you'll need to mine.
< 1295047990 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The people still *died*, you stupid twats.
< 1295047991 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And mining of any sort = tons of coal.
< 1295048020 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't strictly speaking need to mine, if I'm fine being bored on the surface the whole time
< 1295048023 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>.>
< 1295048028 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just because you've pulled yourselves out of the situation doesn't magically fix everything.
< 1295048029 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it means I won't need to rush to get coal
< 1295048046 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: If you're not on Peaceful, you need to mine to get the stuff you need to not die.
< 1295048128 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or you can just avoid things that kill you.
< 1295048143 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or you can cower in a hole in a cliffside like I do.
< 1295048145 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, shelter, lighting, what else?
< 1295048170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I'm way ahead of you: I *won* Minecraft.
< 1295048178 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: How to win Minecraft:
< 1295048181 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Find a hill made out of dirt.
< 1295048193 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Take two blocks, one above the other, starting at ground level, from the hill.
< 1295048195 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Walk inside.
< 1295048201 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Place them just in front of you, looking outwards.
< 1295048215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Congratulations, you have mined two blocks, placed two blocks, and are in an invincible shelter.
< 1295048219 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Monsters can never harm you.
< 1295048220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You Win!
< 1295048227 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Yes, I did this.)
< 1295048237 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless you want to enjoy yourself.
< 1295048252 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, you can also use the patented HHI Airbase.
< 1295048256 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yeah, but it's the winning that's important.
< 1295048259 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: DON'T REVEAL THE PLANS.
< 1295048262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They are state secrets.
< 1295048277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: BTW, if the airbase gets big enough, we'll need a ceiling (glass, probably); otherwise monsters will spawn like 40 blocks away.
< 1295048279 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Or you can just put it on peaceful and mine the fuck out of everything.
< 1295048294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Peaceful single-player is rather boring most of the time.
< 1295048298 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, erm, lighting?
< 1295048307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well, sure.
< 1295048314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Or... MAKE THE AIRBASE OUT OF STEPS
< 1295048317 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My mouse will STILL not stay in the window
< 1295048320 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AKA a trivial requirement?
< 1295048328 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION gives up for now
< 1295048342 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Your computer is broken.
< 1295048345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ?
< 1295048352 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, lighting.
< 1295048353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: What OS?
< 1295048354 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Right.
< 1295048360 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Windows
< 1295048371 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Not helpful.
< 1295048372 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: What OS?
< 1295048377 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Windows 7
< 1295048389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: What JVM?
< 1295048395 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Um
< 1295048408 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hold on
< 1295048451 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295048506 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C:\Users\Sgeo>java -version
< 1295048506 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :java version "1.6.0_22"
< 1295048506 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Java(TM) SE Runtime Environment (build 1.6.0_22-b04)
< 1295048506 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Java HotSpot(TM) 64-Bit Server VM (build 17.1-b03, mixed mode)
< 1295048550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Screenshot of Minecraft running?
< 1295048559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With your mouse inside the window.
< 1295048562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And clicking.
< 1295048584 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295048587 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, the .minecraft is an amalgamation of those files and nooga's source's files
< 1295048590 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's probably it
< 1295048602 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I don't know how to fix it
< 1295048625 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, buy the game
< 1295048627 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that fixes it
< 1295048634 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I intend to soon
< 1295048637 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the amalgation of files)
< 1295048648 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :amalgamation*
< 1295048656 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am very happy to have bought it, it was well worth it
< 1295048680 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, and I'm sure ineiros will let you on then. Even if elliott will hate that.
< 1295048703 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, the only issue is the addiction. But I guess Sgeo has that already
< 1295048705 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott wants me on so I can do drudge work
< 1295048730 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, refuse to once you get on and instead go build some awesome thing some distance away :)
< 1295048773 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a boring idea
< 1295048782 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, oh?
< 1295048785 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Binary
< 1295048791 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, binary what?
< 1295048834 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One block, then to the left block above air, then to the left, block block, then to the left, block air air, etc
< 1295048835 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, better idea: build a houseboat as your base. Won't be able to move yet (perhaps if we get movecraft!). But awesome
< 1295048889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...so?
< 1295048901 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I did say my idea was boring
< 1295048902 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you build cars of some sort in movecraft
< 1295048915 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: if they hover in the air, i guess
< 1295048921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it empties chests though
< 1295048934 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that will likely be fixed soon
< 1295048936 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When will it not empty chests?
< 1295048939 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I spoke to the authors
< 1295048942 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :author*
< 1295048953 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :movecraft is cool, and getting cooler every day
< 1295048957 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it possible to use water to get down from any height safely?/
< 1295048965 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, yes
< 1295048968 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295048973 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, 2 deep pool at the bottom
< 1295048977 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, 1 deep won't work
< 1295048983 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Um
< 1295048986 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, you need 2 deep or deeper
< 1295048990 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you don't have access to the bottom?
< 1295048998 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And are spilling the water from a height?
< 1295049000 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death
< 1295049005 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, I guess you could carefully go down a waterfall
< 1295049008 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it theoretically impossible to get down safely from a single block up in the air?
< 1295049010 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do normal people get down from a scaffold?
< 1295049010 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think so
< 1295049024 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, not if you have a bucket of water with you
< 1295049027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: hmm
< 1295049028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no
< 1295049029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: of course not
< 1295049032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: sand
< 1295049040 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295049043 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, you walk down it if you built it that way
< 1295049046 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sneak to the edge of the block, place one sand, run back onto the block so you don't fall
< 1295049050 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :repeat until there's a full tower
< 1295049051 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :using just dirt, that was kinda important
< 1295049052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :step on
< 1295049053 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, or if it is a 1x1 pillar then you dig down
< 1295049054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :destroy sand below you
< 1295049063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: are we to assume that there is no terrain nearby?
< 1295049071 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1295049083 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all terrain in the world is 10 lower than you
< 1295049091 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously you can move arbitrarily far at your height
< 1295049096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yes, you can use water to get down. you can even remove the water and dirt first
< 1295049105 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming you have an infinite amount of dirt at least
< 1295049107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :place water, step on water, carefully remove dirt, bucket water, follow stream down
< 1295049116 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: trivially impossible then afaics
< 1295049147 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What dirt?
< 1295049149 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, if all terrain is 10 below you
< 1295049158 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, then built out until you are above 2 deep water
< 1295049162 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, then jump down
< 1295049174 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, I think elliott has me on ignore so tell him I solved it
< 1295049174 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1295049175 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously all that terrain is dirt
< 1295049180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: if you're on one block of dirt
< 1295049187 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, not obviously. You didn't say that :P
< 1295049201 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: maybe if you remove the dirt block below you, wait until you're in placing-range of the terrain below, then rapid-fire :D
< 1295049209 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that's the natural question
< 1295049211 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you follow a stream down, and it ends up not being 2 deep at the bottom
< 1295049213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd only fall 4 blocks, if you can place blocks instantly
< 1295049218 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: 10 is enough to forbid that
< 1295049219 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't think that will work
< 1295049223 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no it isn't
< 1295049226 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by a couple blocks
< 1295049226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you can place from 6 blocks
< 1295049229 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so fall 4 blocks
< 1295049229 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1295049230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :place madly
< 1295049233 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4 hurts
< 1295049236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :until there's a block below you
< 1295049237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it does?
< 1295049240 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think so
< 1295049240 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1295049243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :test it :p
< 1295049250 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3 does not hurt. 4 does
< 1295049251 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why 10. that's a lie, i just chose it arbitrarily.
< 1295049281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: "Bees, bees, bees, bees!" --slogan
< 1295049288 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what i was thinking was something crazy like jumping down so you can start putting stuff under your original block, but obviously you still can't put a block under yourself...
< 1295049306 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION attempts to examine schedules again
< 1295049311 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And trying not to go mad
< 1295049377 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah: http://i.imgur.com/uWV6r.jpg
< 1295049382 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover logreading: Bad thing about skybase: Respawning often offsets you enough that you fall to your death.
< 1295049467 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: haha
< 1295049489 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if you have sand and dirt, you can actually reach any cell from any cell
< 1295049501 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :starting and ending on top of single block
< 1295049503 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without tower
< 1295049509 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, also this is seriously cool: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEPVYrltke4
< 1295049516 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a bit glitchy in the middle
< 1295049518 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but still
< 1295049527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well er... maybe
< 1295049532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't see how you could get up again to a single block
< 1295049533 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a bit waste of space though to not reuse block for same tone
< 1295049537 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow! that's great
< 1295049553 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: using dirt, just make a staircase and break it as you go up for instance
< 1295049569 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: how can you break the block before your current one
< 1295049570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in
< 1295049571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :below
< 1295049572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i.e.
< 1295049574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : #
< 1295049575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :##
< 1295049577 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1295049578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.#
< 1295049579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :##
< 1295049581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you break bottom-right
< 1295049582 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, by shifting out on the edge
< 1295049586 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...
< 1295049588 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can even just break the block two down from you, then jump up and place under you'
< 1295049589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure it's possible... maybe starting on the
< 1295049589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.
< 1295049590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#
< 1295049590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :part
< 1295049593 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*-
< 1295049604 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : i'm not sure it's possible... maybe starting on the <-- yes it is
< 1295049606 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I told you how
< 1295049607 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :duh
< 1295049628 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, you can tell him what I said. He is obviously /ignore-ing me. I don't know why
< 1295049662 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what exactly should i tell him?
< 1295049671 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://image.bayimg.com/padlgaade.jpg
< 1295049674 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, that I told him how it is possible to do that :P
< 1295049679 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, are you ignoring Vorpal?
< 1295049703 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
< 1295049704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Until XChat can be configured to ignore mentions of names I will have to do it mentally.
< 1295049704 0 :pumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295049711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll write a script to do it at some point.
< 1295049719 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL
< 1295049722 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how strange. Well if that is his style
< 1295049731 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Vorpal suggested sneaking over the edge
< 1295049750 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he will refuse to acknowledge this
< 1295049753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I recommend not trying to evade ignores.
< 1295049756 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which will be utterly stupid
< 1295049757 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see
< 1295049760 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is what I told you
< 1295049769 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how immature
< 1295049773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal might note that that method is exactly what I said, however.
< 1295049776 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Vorpal suggested what Sgeo said, but you don't even need to have that, all we need is that you can remove the topmost dirt from piles close to you, if you have good visibility
< 1295049783 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal might note that that method is exactly what I said, however. <-- no
< 1295049784 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1295049785 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it wasn't
< 1295049791 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh of course you then can't remove the last one
< 1295049796 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you said " i'm not sure it's possible... maybe starting on the" after
< 1295049856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The Blue Creeper is a new variety of creeper that spawns in the dark just like normal creepers, but they have a much different behaviour pattern. Instead of puffing up, these creepers launch themselves into the air like a rocket! After that, they explode on impact with the ground, so get out of there!!!"
< 1295049857 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, lovely.
< 1295049859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just what I need.
< 1295049879 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw
< 1295049884 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's actually still possible with a slightly less powerful visibility (which i don't specify): you have AB and C on top of C, now add D next to A on another axis, remove B, then remove D, jump on C and remove A
< 1295049889 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was able to hook a creeper on the fishing line to actually get him off my treehouse :P
< 1295049896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: :D
< 1295049903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: start minecraft theory
< 1295049935 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bloody piece of shit website
< 1295049942 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :STOP BEING DOWN
< 1295049980 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's back up?
< 1295049982 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o.O
< 1295050007 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://twitter.com/pigworker/status/25835213661675520
< 1295050010 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep
< 1295050022 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it's back down
< 1295050027 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION stabs elliott angrily
< 1295050032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What.
< 1295050054 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just taking out my anger at this website on you
< 1295050070 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott is an awesome punching bag
< 1295050084 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed, but for the gormet punching experience may i recommend oklopol
< 1295050089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*gourmet
< 1295050090 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mmmm
< 1295050092 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gourmet
< 1295050114 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should probably eat some meat. and possibly some noodles.
< 1295050123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how gourmet
< 1295050151 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, i have a binary scale from uninteresting to gourmet
< 1295050241 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's actually a bit crazy that even if you have an infinite plane, there is actually no way to even get one block down from it
< 1295050247 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless there already are blocks down
< 1295050267 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there with some tool or something?
< 1295050275 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION oohs at http://isup.me
< 1295050276 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sand doesn't help in this case
< 1295050335 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: If your spawn-point is on the plane, jump down, place blocks as you fall, die, respawn, go down.
< 1295050349 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess that doesn't quite count.
< 1295050349 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well sure, by using one life, you can lower the plane as much as you like
< 1295050393 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: "oohs"?
< 1295050398 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you seriously haven't seen it before?
< 1295050400 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the whole plane, since if you have even one block under the plane, you can easily destroy the whole plane, and build another plane from that single block (ignoring the fact it's an infinite plane, but anyhow i think you can do it lazily)
< 1295050409 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I haven't seen the shortened domain before.
< 1295050416 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::/
< 1295050421 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the hell is impressive about that
< 1295050424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ...you're oohing at a domain being slightly shorter.
< 1295050429 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your... brain is... broken.
< 1295050433 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Maybe if you ride a boat down you could (theoretically) place blocks as you fall in such a way that you'd be able to jump from the boat on to one of them. (I'm not sure how well you can jump from a falling boat, however.)
< 1295050437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your brain is completely and utterly not working correctly in any way whatsoever.
< 1295050440 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh my god Sgeo, what the hell did you just do! please apologize
< 1295050443 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for once I actually agree with elliott
< 1295050449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that hurts man, that hurts :D
< 1295050450 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: And then there was the water thing.
< 1295050451 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :me too
< 1295050468 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, um?
< 1295050472 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Sgeo: ...you're oohing at a domain being slightly shorter. <-- "slightly"?
< 1295050481 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the one I remember is rather long
< 1295050482 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohh right, make a waterfall, go down by boat, put some blocks, come up?
< 1295050490 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can just swim down/up.
< 1295050493 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tru
< 1295050519 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so again, that's kind of trivial
< 1295050522 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I don't suppose you could hang at the "bottom" of a ladder and place a continuation block below where the ladder ends? (Probably not.)
< 1295050534 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seriously? Not having to type as much is not ooh worthy?
< 1295050541 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Bookmarks are useless for me]
< 1295050543 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want a problem that doesn't have an *effective* solution, like you'd need a bot and it'd take ages to do
< 1295050552 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: i don't know, was wondering
< 1295050555 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oklopol: Maybe if you ride a boat down you could (theoretically) place blocks as you fall in such a way that you'd be able to jump from the boat on to one of them. (I'm not sure how well you can jump from a falling boat, however.) <-- you can exit a falling boat. I don't think you can jump from one though. Never tried in single player since falling on a falling boat hurts (it falls slower than
< 1295050555 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you do except when you hit it and your vertical speed is reset to zero)
< 1295050556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yes, it seriously is not
< 1295050585 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a certain elegance to the new domain name
< 1295050585 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, elliott is wrong
< 1295050597 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, though perhaps you did over-react a bit
< 1295050606 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but he is way too hard. I think he gone nuts recently
< 1295050619 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"recently"
< 1295050619 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?
< 1295050625 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, well more than usually
< 1295050637 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, he has been nuts for a long time
< 1295050641 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not this much
< 1295050656 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm pretty sure his reaction is typical of him
< 1295050667 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, well true. But I meant in general
< 1295050680 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are there minecraft puzzles somewhere?
< 1295050701 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, that sounds interesting
< 1295050703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a certain elegeance
< 1295050705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*elegance
< 1295050706 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you could do some stuff with resource limitations, dunno
< 1295050706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :honestly
< 1295050707 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, do you mean physical ones?
< 1295050709 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: There's a domain (registered) called up.is, that could be made one of those is-it-up sites.
< 1295050719 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, or puzzles to solve in-game?
< 1295050722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also if you're replying to Vorpal which I suspect, he's currently in his regular elliott whine mode
< 1295050733 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no I'm not
< 1295050737 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where he uses every situation as an opportunity to talk about how horrible i am, i doubt j-invariant and oklopol got the same treatment despite them agreeing
< 1295050740 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are in going nuts mode
< 1295050741 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :puzzles to solve in-game would necessarily be pretty trivial wouldn't they
< 1295050744 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then Vorpal never was one for consistency, non-hypocrisy, logic, ...
< 1295050753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: that's what ADVENTURE mode is going to be
< 1295050756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no block placing which is just stupid
< 1295050757 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh come on. You are not one for them either
< 1295050772 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well of course there has to be block placing and removing
< 1295050791 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise obviously you can execute any puzzle as a computer program opening a door if the correct switches are used
< 1295050806 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BRB
< 1295050824 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or alternatively: that wouldn't really be a minecraft puzzle
< 1295050861 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: in-game, sure, but in the sense that you are given extra rules
< 1295050876 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Minecraft without block placement is like a farm without the wife walking on the granary path, you know. (I don't suppose the "talo ilman aitanpolulla astelevaa emäntää" thing is an international idiom.)
< 1295050877 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmhmm
< 1295050887 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could you build a trap that can't be destroyed easily without dying?
< 1295050888 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :next time I'm setting up base somewhere isolated I am saving the coordinates
< 1295050921 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :P.S. how the hell am I supposed to SEE the coordinates over that graph
< 1295050929 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone highlighted me.
< 1295050934 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a problem i have as well
< 1295050943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: get a better cpu
< 1295050946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it'll take up less of the graph :-)
< 1295050959 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. Wow.
< 1295050961 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : olsner: "ridiculous. ant/nant is already the ultimate build system." --actual person expressing actual, non-sarcastic opinion
< 1295050970 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Using a larger and/or a differently shaped window might also help. (I don't know if it scales the font size or not.)
< 1295050972 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OUTRAGE!
< 1295051024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: when someone said "but XML" they replied "well nant fixes that!" (paraphrased)
< 1295051029 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, could you make something like a huge amount of arrow guns that shoot at you no matter which way you approach the thing?
< 1295051044 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: probably
< 1295051053 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from bedrock to clouds
< 1295051060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can go above clouds
< 1295051060 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shooting all the time
< 1295051063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you can place dispensers in any direction
< 1295051066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shooting all the time? heh
< 1295051067 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only remedy would be if nant stands for "not ant", but even in the negative starting with ant is the wrong way
< 1295051072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's just a constant redstone circuit
< 1295051075 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: up as well? oh cool
< 1295051085 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kind of like how SVN wouldn't have been any better if it was "not cvs" instead of "better cvs"
< 1295051088 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: nant = .NET ant
< 1295051090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: er well doubtful
< 1295051093 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is "nant" that Ant-like .net build tool? Because that's XML build files too.
< 1295051102 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it just uses LESS XML!
< 1295051105 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you just meant in any nwes direction
< 1295051105 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but if you build bedrock to top you can't go above anyway
< 1295051106 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well
< 1295051110 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can climb to the top, but
< 1295051116 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's basically unsolvable
< 1295051121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even with arrows, you could climb to the top
< 1295051122 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://nant.sourceforge.net/release/latest/help/fundamentals/buildfiles.html -- yeah, I'm sure that's very nice to anyone who hates XML.
< 1295051123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and just jump over quickly
< 1295051129 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it? what if you build a wall as you go
< 1295051135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd get killed from the fall though
< 1295051136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: eh?
< 1295051140 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we may assume a single arrow kills you
< 1295051169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: are the cows in this model spherical?
< 1295051170 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: like, dunno, somehow shield yourself from the arrows
< 1295051181 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :great: "NAnt's build files are written in XML. Each build file contains one project and a number of targets.  Each target contains a number of tasks."
< 1295051181 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it makes the puzzle interesting, sure
< 1295051182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think it's quite simple
< 1295051192 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's *exactly what ant does*
< 1295051204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: does the inside need to be guarded too?
< 1295051212 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. do you want people inside to be shot
< 1295051218 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no
< 1295051227 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the goal, to get inside
< 1295051228 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe.
< 1295051229 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: That's not surprising, given that it's designed to be "like Ant".
< 1295051234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: build each wall with the arrows facing outwards
< 1295051253 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?
< 1295051258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: this misses diagonals, so if you approach from a diagonal, time it right, and put two dirt in front of you, you can shield
< 1295051261 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(btw i just realized you can just approach diagonally)
< 1295051266 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: according to some supporters nant fixes all the problems with using xml
< 1295051266 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you might need two i think arrows go through one block with dispensers
< 1295051270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and then you just have to like
< 1295051277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :build one platform, place dirt over dispenser quickly
< 1295051280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :repeat until you get to the top
< 1295051282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: alternatively
< 1295051289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: start far enough away that the arrows don't reach you
< 1295051289 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe the trap sends minecarts shooting arrows by using zombies
< 1295051291 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :build tower to level 128
< 1295051293 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1295051295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :build dirt towards tower
< 1295051296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :step over
< 1295051297 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not zombies, skeletons
< 1295051297 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do dispensers have any user other than weaponry?
< 1295051298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fall to death
< 1295051304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yes
< 1295051311 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3RAjfNdZ0hw
< 1295051335 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you can be higher than highest dirt?
< 1295051344 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you can stand on top of it
< 1295051356 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so the dispenser would be level with what you're standing on
< 1295051359 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus making you immune to its arrows
< 1295051400 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: is your game done
< 1295051403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yet
< 1295051412 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in that case you can approach any trap: no trap can destroy your dirts, and no trap can shoot up, so you can just remove one layer of the trap at a time
< 1295051418 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one level i mean
< 1295051433 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :starting from the top
< 1295051439 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :blergh
< 1295051464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: hehe
< 1295051470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: question, you know your game
< 1295051475 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know it
< 1295051482 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not ready yet btw
< 1295051498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's 2d universe right
< 1295051505 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1295051520 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3d is always ugly
< 1295051520 0 :cheater00!~cheater@g224202189.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295051529 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1295051553 0 :Tritonio!~TrT@athedsl-258916.home.otenet.gr JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295051554 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i have an idea you will enjoy
< 1295051560 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm sure i will
< 1295051563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: 3d universe with 2d cross-section interface
< 1295051566 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i.e. the dwarf fortress model
< 1295051576 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all the freedom of 3d, all the beauty of 2d, all the incomprehensibility of the combination
< 1295051579 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that's a retarded idea
< 1295051604 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you hurt me
< 1295051630 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: why's it retarded :p
< 1295051642 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :less ugly than the usual 3d view, sure, but so is rendering a 3d world as a butterfly flying around on your screen.
< 1295051647 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't really make the gameplay all that fun.
< 1295051671 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why are you down, website? Why? Why must you do this to me?
< 1295051677 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You are tearing me apart, website!
< 1295051683 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you would be a complete cripple against an enemy
< 1295051693 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1295051711 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a human that uses the usual 3d rendering or an ai
< 1295051712 0 :cheater777!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295051717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: make it 4d then
< 1295051726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: everyone's a cripple
< 1295051728 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4d is always a viable option
< 1295051729 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295051738 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: now how you render this is
< 1295051748 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :speaking of 4d...is that 4d platformer thing any closer to public playability/
< 1295051754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: pick a 4d->3d projection, preferably the craziest one you can think of that works in discrete space
< 1295051764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: then do the cross-section 3d->2d thing
< 1295051773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: congrats, least understandable world, ever
< 1295051801 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.sct-bus.org/br.html is up, but the main website isn't
< 1295051804 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe a 1d projection would be nice
< 1295051804 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION mindboggles
< 1295051818 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1295051821 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i meant to say 0d
< 1295051829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: use the most mathematically pretty Z^2 -> Z projection you can think of
< 1295051833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and render the plane in 1d like that
< 1295051840 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295051844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: omg, then do a 3d projection like this:
< 1295051845 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey that's actually a great idea
< 1295051853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: first row is everything with z=0, with that pretty projection
< 1295051853 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|4d| = |1d|
< 1295051855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :second row is z=1
< 1295051858 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :third row is z=2
< 1295051858 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc.
< 1295051866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you'll have the most fucked-up 3D projection ever :D
< 1295051868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now
< 1295051873 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that forms a 2D image
< 1295051879 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compress THAT with the same projection
< 1295051881 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah we just need one dimension and a bijection with the 4d space
< 1295051883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you've compressed 3D into 1D
< 1295051888 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then do the same thing with rows again
< 1295051889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tada
< 1295051889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4D
< 1295051893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in 2D
< 1295051900 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and arrows drawn on top to show where the successor in each direction is
< 1295051920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: mine is nicer
< 1295051920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because
< 1295051929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :movement would be completely incomprehensible
< 1295051936 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd probably just jump about the plane seemingly randomly
< 1295051936 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if ( temp == '.' ) { fileName=fileName }
< 1295051937 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the array gets randomly resorted all the time in order to make sure the hamming distances correspond well to distances on screen
< 1295051942 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and things would just sorta flicker all the time
< 1295051943 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bloody hell is wrong with this website?
< 1295051972 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1295051974 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#esoteric is not a "website"
< 1295051982 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's supposed to work like this
< 1295052010 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295052024 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so maybe 4d -> 2d + arrows + resorting
< 1295052028 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or actually
< 1295052032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: dude excuse me
< 1295052034 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it just shows a neighborhood as a graph
< 1295052036 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: mine involved one, pretty projection?
< 1295052057 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's a stupid projection because you have to stay near spawn all the time
< 1295052062 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or you won't see what you're doing
< 1295052077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: um it always scrolls to show you where you are
< 1295052078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and
< 1295052086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you can hold like shift while pressing a direction
< 1295052087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to "look around"
< 1295052098 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. center the view on the block to your [direction]
< 1295052102 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and move around like that, without actually moving
< 1295052104 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it scrolls, yes, what i meant was the jumps get longer
< 1295052107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus letting you GET TO GRIPS with the world
< 1295052110 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but of course
< 1295052112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't that a feature
< 1295052122 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a feature that means you have to stay near spawn
< 1295052126 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish you coud put down flags that would be your (nearest) spawnpoint
< 1295052128 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i prefer just rendering a graph
< 1295052157 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-169-224.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295052190 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ofc it's always the same graph, but i won't tell the randomized graph drawer that
< 1295052201 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tomorrow I shall stop being so afraid of iretq
< 1295052252 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: how far is your os done
< 1295052268 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd say a few operations short of iretq
< 1295052276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: no but srsly
< 1295052310 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well srsly then - I was working on context switching then figured out it was a wee bit trickier than in theory
< 1295052329 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(this was 3 weeks ago)
< 1295052376 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it should be doable without any of the fancy stuff that an iretq *can* do, not so sure anymore
< 1295052434 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, iretq?
< 1295052456 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295052457 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :interrupt return, quad version
< 1295052475 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or iret with a 64-bit operand size
< 1295052491 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, is that the x86 family?
< 1295052505 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did not do any work today, just played minecraft :|
< 1295052512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: :D
< 1295052530 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: so what is your os actually going to be like
< 1295052532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what structure
< 1295052540 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Why are you down, website? Why? Why must you do this to me? <-- hey get with the memes, it's supposed to be "WEBSITE  Y U NO WORK?"
< 1295052553 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: mostly yet to be determined, microkernelish
< 1295052564 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I finally got my hands on the bus's schedule
< 1295052588 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and, you know, there won't actually be an *operating* system, it'll just be a kernel until at least 2020
< 1295052611 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(probably...)
< 1295052632 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!help
< 1295052637 0 :pumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295052641 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :help: General commands: !help, !info, !bf_txtgen. See also !help languages, !help userinterps. You can get help on some commands by typing !help .
< 1295052643 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Speaking of ambition, today I came across http://nhi1.berlios.de/ "The line from the evolution in computer-science up to the computer hardware development speed and the internet global computer network lead to the possibility to create the first Non Human Intelligence until 2040. [...] The NHI1 project will create an open intelligence."
< 1295052651 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen Hello, World!
< 1295052672 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They have already solved natural language understanding: you just do "human language   -->   other language    -->   human language" and then make sure "other language" is "computer understand-able".
< 1295052679 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err
< 1295052692 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's very slow today
< 1295052698 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :126 +++++++++[>++++++++>+++++++++++>+++++>+<<<<-]>.>++.+++++++..+++.>-.------------.<<+++++++++++++++.>.+++.------.--------.>+.>+. [707]
< 1295052703 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh come on
< 1295052705 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!bf_txtgen Hello, World!
< 1295052708 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :128 +++++++++++[>+++++++>+++++++++>++++>+<<<<-]>-----.>++.+++++++..+++.>.------------.<<+++++++++++++++.>.+++.------.--------.>+.>-. [771]
< 1295052715 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :..
< 1295052719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Easy!
< 1295052744 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: hey 2020 is about when I expect @ to start taking shape...
< 1295052760 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after fixing up context switching I think communicating processes will be next - then some kind of support for SMP systems, basically just whatever is needed for the kernel not to fuck itself immediately
< 1295052767 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : They have already solved natural language understanding: you just do "human language   -->   other language    -->   human language" and then make sure "other language" is "computer understand-able". <-- :D
< 1295052781 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what morons.
< 1295052785 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OHEY Notch should add a fourth dimension mode to MC and completely remove the market for Miegakure :P
< 1295052805 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. I'd like it to be pre-emptive as soon as possible, but I think there are tricky bits in making that work right
< 1295052811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie:
< 1295052816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why 'Friend Of Google' ?
< 1295052816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the past days I had time to watch some tubes from Google tech-talk including the latest interviews from Eric Schmidt. I thing Google is the current technology PowerHouse and worth to serve as the first target of NHI1.
< 1295052816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Would that be Google as a verb or a noun? -> more noun as verb
< 1295052831 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: They also have "theBrain", which is a key-value database, because, you know, that's all a brain is. Since "Data is the key point of every technology. Data have to be smart organized to be available with the speed and with the quality needed."
< 1295052842 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Tokyo Cabinet: it's intelligent!
< 1295052861 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :~99% of all the data is located in the private (local) networks. (to check this, google (verb) for an average known (not famous) person from your own social environment and check the results available in the Internet. You will not find any data from the person own hard-drive, you will not find any data from the person employer, you will not find any private data from a Login-Required Internet zone like facebook... -> This all is good because priv
< 1295052861 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ate is private and the opposite from public)
< 1295052865 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, the Moggel thing was a bit curious too.
< 1295052866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Private is private and the opposite from public.
< 1295052885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Project sounds a little bit like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Test-driven_development but it does, in fact, more. The goal is that the programmer does only write test-cases and the TDC is in duty to: write, organize and publish the software. Nobody, including the programmer itself, have to understand the software created.
< 1295052885 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Do note that "theCompiler" has some Clue-like tendencies. (Except it of course doesn't exist.)
< 1295052888 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it irks me this full context switching thing though - there are a *lot* of registers to restore... cooperative multiprocessing would be nicer - not least because since you already have rcx and r11 clobbered for syscall so you can simply sysret back to it
< 1295052890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, they invented Clue! >:)
< 1295052892 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: haha
< 1295052899 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :again, cooperative sucks
< 1295052921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: see if you compile a language like I do, then you can automatically insert yield instructions in the compiled code in places that the compiler deems to be optimal
< 1295052924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: just saying
< 1295052954 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, basically you have to *guarantee* that all user processes call yield in a timely manner
< 1295052955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: this allows the simplicity of a cooperative architecture with the responsiveness and reliability of a preemptive architecture, and with a Sufficiently Smart Compiler, even greater performance
< 1295052963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: yes, and since all things in my OS go through the compiler
< 1295052968 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just has to insert yield instructions itself
< 1295052972 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, that's your OS
< 1295052979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: which your OS should be, since my OS is the best?
< 1295052995 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : it irks me this full context switching thing though - there are a *lot* of registers to restore... cooperative multiprocessing would be nicer - not least because since you already have rcx and r11 clobbered for syscall so you can simply sysret back to it <-- hm doesn't x86 have an instruction to dump it all or restore it all?
< 1295053018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: "responsible engineer to migrate the entire infrastructure of a life insurance company to the state of the art"
< 1295053024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Dear god, this guy is actually given serious tasks to do.
< 1295053028 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for one, I still expect an assembly-level interface, and no trust from the OS on user processes - this means cooperative is pretty much out of the question from the start
< 1295053033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://openfacts2.berlios.de/wikien/index.php/User:Aotto1968#1_mar_2008
< 1295053051 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295053062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: my OS gives no trust at all to "processes" (no such concept in mine), but yeah, no asm-level interface without the user demanding that e be allowed to run some arbitrary code :)
< 1295053082 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, will this be an RTOS?
< 1295053086 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: there is (waspushad
< 1295053105 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, er?
< 1295053109 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*(was) pushad, but it doesn't restore ip and doesn't support 64-bit registers
< 1295053121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: have I mentioned: @ is the greatest?
< 1295053132 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: repeatedly, probably
< 1295053133 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, wasn't there some task dump?
< 1295053140 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: Insufficiently? I am going to mention it?
< 1295053140 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tasks? no such thing
< 1295053143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@ is the greatest?
< 1295053179 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: that is to say, hardware task-switching is generally recognized as suckage and is dropped in amd64
< 1295053207 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Good night
< 1295053210 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well, he does (to some extent) seem less overtly crazy than, say, Mentifex; and there are some reasonable (from a first glance, anyway) low-level twiddlery there, though of course nothing that'd have anything to do with AI.
< 1295053243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: OS task-switching is generally recognised as suckage and is dropped in @
< 1295053269 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott trolling. surprising in oh so many ways.
< 1295053279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: i have a knife and your address
< 1295053290 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, well yes
< 1295053295 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: wtf, who gave you a knife? and my address?
< 1295053302 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, I still thought there was some dump-registers thingy
< 1295053303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: that's what I want to know!
< 1295053317 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://9gag.com/gag/68400/ <-- greatest troll ever
< 1295053331 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: also, do come visit and chop some vegetables with your knife, we could cook and have fun all night
< 1295053342 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295053349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: :D
< 1295053361 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: pervert, I'm going to call the police
< 1295053385 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: "a'ight" as they say "in da hood"
< 1295053403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: I have trouble believing that you have any relation to or know anything about "da hood"
< 1295053445 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295053454 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I have trouble believing in God, yet he's real
< 1295053462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: he is?
< 1295053490 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure, as previously mentioned I have trouble believing
< 1295053507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: are you _trying_ to confuse me? :D
< 1295053537 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :am I? really?
< 1295053542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: yay mentifex http://cyborg.blogspot.com/2010/09/sep09mfpj.html
< 1295053547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: knife, address
< 1295053563 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: vegetables, "fun all night"
< 1295053574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: saved for future blackmail
< 1295053578 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice
< 1295053585 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: CARS  WHAT ARE CARS / GUNS  WHAT ARE GUNS / TOOLS  WHAT ARE TOOLS
< 1295053588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Pure poetry.
< 1295053731 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also obvious sentience.
< 1295053790 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE  GUNS MAKE  THE  CARS
< 1295053814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: It's referring to the military-industrial complex, dude.
< 1295054088 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: give haskell a better type system please
< 1295054156 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: HAHA
< 1295054165 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: haskell is broke, let it die
< 1295054175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i'm not about to start writing programs in coq
< 1295054176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p
< 1295054186 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Coq fails
< 1295054186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"There's a feature called "reification" (which the classically-educated will recognise as the Latin for "thingification"), which provides a reflection mechanism."
< 1295054191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: oh yeah, epigram 2 programs
< 1295054194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hurf durf
< 1295054198 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Epigram 2?
< 1295054227 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well got another suggestion? :P
< 1295054255 0 :Wamanuz5!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295054316 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: There is currently no programming language suitable for actually programming in
< 1295054332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i don't think that's true ... you can mostly sling it if you build your own little library of abstractions
< 1295054362 0 :Wamanuz4!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1295054696 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle TypeQ -> Name
< 1295054697 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unsafe.Coerce unsafeCoerce :: a -> b
< 1295054697 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.OldException throwDyn :: Typeable exception => exception -> b
< 1295054697 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Language.Haskell.TH.Syntax bindQ :: Q a -> (a -> Q b) -> Q b
< 1295054703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: for instance I think Template Haskell is useful :-)
< 1295054957 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't like it
< 1295054964 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :neither do you
< 1295055113 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I should just give on scheme and implement a new language in haskell
< 1295055138 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slate has macros, right?/
< 1295055148 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[I think I'm putting Atomo down, for now]
< 1295055161 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: nobody is going to know what Slate is in 2 years
< 1295055170 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I hope)
< 1295055208 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :java: malloc.c:3684: __libc_malloc: Assertion `!victim || ((((mchunkptr)((char*)(victim) - 2*(sizeof(size_t)))))->size & 0x2) || ar_ptr == (((((mchunkptr)((char*)(victim) - 2*(sizeof(size_t)))))->size & 0x4) ? ((heap_info *)((unsigned long)(((mchunkptr)((char*)(victim) - 2*(sizeof(size_t))))) & ~((2 * (4 * 1024 * 1024 * sizeof(long)))-1)))->ar_ptr : &main_arena)' failed.
< 1295055212 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do prefer Atomo's lambda syntax
< 1295055213 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YAY
< 1295055223 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's the best I've ever seen
< 1295055234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambda syntax, that's what matters in a language
< 1295055237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: :-D
< 1295055239 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: waht jvm?
< 1295055241 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*what
< 1295055253 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, note that, despite that, I'm still leaning back towards Slate
< 1295055265 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, lack of a lambda syntax can be.. ticky
< 1295055267 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what should I call my caluculator thing?
< 1295055273 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Computronium?
< 1295055275 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you mean your dependent CAS?
< 1295055279 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah
< 1295055282 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same with a crappy one (ahem ahem Python)
< 1295055326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Colony?
< 1295055330 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: justification: dependent -> http://wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn?s=dependency
< 1295055336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-> colony for some reason
< 1295055344 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: also you could say it was like a colony of mathematical definitions??? i dunno :D
< 1295055351 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe
< 1295055352 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: HotSpot.
< 1295055353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like short, simple names, they don't have to mean much imo
< 1295055363 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: note that hotspot is -client only, -server is another VM
< 1295055378 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: "In computer science, coupling or dependency ..." maybe some pun on coupling
< 1295055381 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's claiming to be HotSpot server.
< 1295055389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Relate, coupling -- relationship, and it like, finds mathematical relations?
< 1295055398 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: so Colony or Relate :P
< 1295055503 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't program without dependent types
< 1295055526 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOW IT KEEPS CRASHING.
< 1295055531 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT MUST HATE MY MINE
< 1295055534 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: simple example:  data T = Z | Q, obviously you just defiena function  carrier Z = Integer ; carrier Q = Rational  and everything is easy
< 1295055562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that's rather limited since you can't extent T
< 1295055563 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: (N.B. I can't do the usual  data T x where Z :: T Integer ... because of other stuff)
< 1295055568 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no?
< 1295055573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: or wait, is this haskell?
< 1295055576 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait obviously not
< 1295055585 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: so how are you approaching this, are you implementing a dependent lang and doing it in that or?
< 1295055587 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is an explanation of why haskell is stupid
< 1295055636 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(N.B. I am well aware that it's /me/ that's stupid, because I can't find any way to program this very simple)
< 1295055655 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I'll just have  if x /= y then error "IMPOSSIBLE" else ...  everywhere
< 1295055656 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Has anyone yet made an easily reprogrammable music playing system in MC?
< 1295055683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no
< 1295055686 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's only been a day
< 1295055704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: try template haskell :D
< 1295055706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: alternatively
< 1295055718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: one way to do more "complex" types that doesn't give compile-time errors but stops you having conditions everywhere
< 1295055719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is
< 1295055727 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :module Foo (DataType, mkDataType) where
< 1295055735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :data DataType = Constructor ...
< 1295055744 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mkDataType ... | ok = Constructor ...
< 1295055749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| otherwise = error "nooooo"
< 1295055751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance
< 1295055755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :module Nat (Nat, mkNat) where
< 1295055760 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :newtype Nat = Nat Integer
< 1295055764 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mkNat n | n >= 0 = Nat n
< 1295055773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| otherwise = error "Nat.mkNat: negative natural"
< 1295055781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then nothing can access the constructor
< 1295055781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1295055782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you also need
< 1295055788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the relevant deriving instances
< 1295055792 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can to toInteger and the like
< 1295055793 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeha
< 1295055794 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*yeah
< 1295056051 0 :amca!~amca@CPE-121-208-84-154.cqzr1.cha.bigpond.net.au JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295056101 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I think I can actually make a valid claim that "haskells type system is too limiting"
< 1295056123 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(normally when people say that they are wrong)
< 1295056145 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can't embed a more expressive type system into it
< 1295056191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously :P
< 1295056197 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so e.g. if you are implementing a language with a more expressive type system, your typechecking (written in haskell) cannot give you a well typed & total evaluator
< 1295056198 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle a -> ExpQ
< 1295056207 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(In fact haskell can not even express its own type system)
< 1295056211 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: the thing is that more expressive type systems have their own problems
< 1295056225 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't know of any
< 1295056235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: try and type infer Coq programs
< 1295056253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: also you get very close very quickly to "oops, my language must be sub-TC for this to work"
< 1295056260 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also "oops, I need proofs everywhere to take advantage of this"
< 1295056268 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also "oops, everything is really fucking slow to typecheck now"
< 1295056272 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@help
< 1295056273 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :help . Ask for help for . Try 'list' for all commands
< 1295056276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle ExpQ
< 1295056278 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Language.Haskell.TH type ExpQ = Q Exp
< 1295056278 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Language.Haskell.TH.Lib type ExpQ = Q Exp
< 1295056278 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Language.Haskell.TH.Quote dataToExpQ :: Data a => (b -> Maybe (Q Exp)) -> a -> Q Exp
< 1295056301 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295056323 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I am wrong! I hope so
< 1295056328 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: here's a little something i am working on for haskell
< 1295056335 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just had a stupid idea that might work
< 1295056340 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :type level GENSYM
< 1295056349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{-# LANGUAGE TemplateHaskell #-}
< 1295056349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :import Foo
< 1295056349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :validatedType "Nat" "Integer" [| \i -> i >= 0 |]
< 1295056357 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: then
< 1295056364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Main> :browse
< 1295056364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :newtype Nat = MkNat Integer
< 1295056364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mkNat :: Integer -> Nat
< 1295056381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Main> mkNat 3
< 1295056381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MkNat 3
< 1295056381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Main> mkNat (-1)
< 1295056381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MkNat *** Exception: bad!
< 1295056409 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: obviously I really want it to be like maybeMkNat returning Maybe Nat and then have functions on top of that etc
< 1295056418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*etc.
< 1295056485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: obviously this is runtime-only
< 1295056487 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i think it's quite cool
< 1295056553 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you could implement this without TH?
< 1295056560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: how?
< 1295056574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well sure you could write out all the functions yourself ... but that's a huge pain
< 1295056588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the point is that this defines things like mkMaybeNat, isValidNat, etc.
< 1295056741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ?
< 1295056834 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: not trying to be mean but I don't find that very useful
< 1295056845 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I mean just type out the names by hand :P
< 1295056866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ok compare:
< 1295056889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :newtype Nat = MkNat Integer deriving (Eq, Show)
< 1295056896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mkMaybeNat :: Integer -> Maybe Nat
< 1295056900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mkMaybeNat x
< 1295056905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  | x >= 0 = Just (MkNat x)
< 1295056910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  | otherwise = Nothing
< 1295056914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mkNat :: Integer -> Nat
< 1295056922 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mkNat = fromJust . mkMaybeNat
< 1295056924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: with
< 1295056931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :validatedType "Nat" "Integer" [| \i -> i >= 0 |]
< 1295056969 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well maybe that is useful but it's not exactly a pearl
< 1295056985 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i mentioned it because it was relevant to what you were saying
< 1295056990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: wrt continually making checks for validity
< 1295057010 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, how is it?
< 1295057026 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nobody in #haskell wants to help me :(
< 1295057068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you didn't state your problem very clearly in #haskell :)
< 1295057074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: also, the point is that instead of checking values are valid all the time
< 1295057077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can just build this "gate"
< 1295057088 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and since all Nats have to come from mkNat, since you don't export MkNat,
< 1295057096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can be sure that every Nat obeys the condition you ste
< 1295057097 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*set
< 1295057109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is type safety, of a sort: all your internal code can assume and work upon these invariants on the type
< 1295057116 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just that it's actually implemented at runtime
< 1295057122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it should simplify your code a lot
< 1295057233 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: also someone mentioned "Turing complete" which was annoying
< 1295057277 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol don't acll him on it, that will just make things worse
< 1295057290 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he just hadn't seen what I was trying to explain
< 1295057301 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thuogh it was kind of a knee-jerk thing
< 1295057313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like calling people on things
< 1295057318 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X)
< 1295057320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but i'll answer your question
< 1295057333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: stop trying to make everything perfectly type-safe, this isn't how haskell is meant to be done
< 1295057339 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :?
< 1295057342 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: :D
< 1295057344 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :verify that types are essentially write, but handle actual errors as runtime errors, for instance via Maybe
< 1295057361 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haskell isn't meant to let you solve all bugs with the type system, that's a design decision, probably a conscious one
< 1295057366 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So don't try and make it do that for you
< 1295057449 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can actually make this work IF there is no type level computation
< 1295057460 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(on the other hand, I like type level computation..)
< 1295057464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: try and forget dependent types exist entirely
< 1295057468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: write your program
< 1295057475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: and /then/ see what you can do to it
< 1295057476 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I tried that, In scheme
< 1295057502 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: do it in haskell
< 1295057504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't forget types exist
< 1295057508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just dependent types :)
< 1295057509 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Didn't work out, someone mentiond "use objects" and I gave up
< 1295057520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: if you want an abstract syntax tree, make "data MyAST = ..."
< 1295057524 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: if you want an integer, use Integer
< 1295057530 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: avoid type parameters except for generic structures like lists and the like
< 1295057532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and use no GADTs
< 1295057540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I dare you, try and write your polynomial code like that
< 1295057546 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: this may not be the nicest way to use it
< 1295057548 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but in Haskell
< 1295057550 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : have to use GADTs :>
< 1295057553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the only way you're gonna be able to code it
< 1295057555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: nope, not allowed
< 1295057560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: remove some type parameters until you don't have to any more
< 1295057626 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295057648 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.
< 1295058186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi augur
< 1295058201 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_O
< 1295058205 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey elliott
< 1295058210 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sup boy
< 1295058215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why O_O
< 1295058234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?
< 1295058245 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@69.157.44.226 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295058264 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur
< 1295058290 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cause!
< 1295058300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat
< 1295058337 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295058370 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aggry
< 1295058381 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eggry
< 1295058763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i need to figure out what program to write!
< 1295058859 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im writing one as we speak!
< 1295059116 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#math is fucking stupid
< 1295059129 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're all doing pseudo-set theory
< 1295059279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: quotes? :D
< 1295059284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :    Couldn't match expected type `Change t a'
< 1295059285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :           against inferred type `Change t1 a1'
< 1295059289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: if i get this error it means i'm winning right?
< 1295059291 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :02:42 < Polytope> {x | P} means that x is in the set if and only if P is true.
< 1295059291 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :02:43 < j-invariant> no set theory allows definitions like that
< 1295059297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :      NB: `Change' is a type function, and may not be injective
< 1295059306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: more, i want more quotes, pastebin! :P
< 1295059315 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@209-6-232-56.c3-0.sbo-ubr1.sbo.ma.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295059315 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host
< 1295059315 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295059325 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :02:26 < j-invariant> Axmann: { X subset of Y | P(X) } defines a set
< 1295059325 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :02:26 < j-invariant> Axmann: { X | P(X) } does not
< 1295059409 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :    Type declaration in a class must be a kind signature or synonym default
< 1295059411 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :definitely winning
< 1295059432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: wait a sec
< 1295059437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: is this the polytope of http://www.bash.org/?4916
< 1295059453 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno
< 1295059458 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: everyone's being an idoit
< 1295059464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i doubt it, he mentioned first-year, so first-year uni student?
< 1295059466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that quote is 90s vintage
< 1295059478 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so he'd have to have said that when he was like
< 1295059479 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :9
< 1295059485 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: they are doing { x | P(x) } rather than { x in X | P(x) }
< 1295059496 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: apparently it's easier?
< 1295059500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: P(x) = x in X /\ Q(x)
< 1295059503 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Problem? :trollface:
< 1295059527 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :P(x) = x is not in x, problem Frege?
< 1295059541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :P(x) = not P(x), problem Aristotle?
< 1295059553 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't do that!
< 1295059553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why did i say aristotle
< 1295059560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: isn't #math basically a cesspool anyway
< 1295059561 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1295059567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow holy shit look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page
< 1295059569 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah seems that way, it's frustrating
< 1295059569 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugliest fucking logo ever
< 1295059574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol at the mirroring in the box
< 1295059575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jesus christ
< 1295059582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh my god look at the featured section what have they done
< 1295059588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Today's featured picture
< 1295059589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :	
< 1295059589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jimmy Wales is the co-founder of the online encyclopedia Wikipedia, along with Larry Sanger and others. Wikipedia succeeded an earlier attempt at an encyclopedia called Nupedia, but Nupedia grew slowly because of its onerous submission format, which required articles to be peer reviewed. Sanger was then introduced to the concept of a wiki, and thus Wikipedia was born. Wales continues to serve the Board of Trustees of the non-profit Wikimedia Foun
< 1295059589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dation, and he also co-founded Wikia, a for-profit wiki hosting site.
< 1295059591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is that
< 1295059592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is this
< 1295059594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this a joke
< 1295059608 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :todays featured picture http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/23/Jimmy_Wales_Fundraiser_Appeal_edit.jpg
< 1295059612 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh LOL you're on it too
< 1295059621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Cannot join #not-not-math (Channel is invite only).
< 1295059634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should redirect to #math
< 1295059636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to annoy intuitionists
< 1295059647 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1295059691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh come on haskell
< 1295059694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't be a dumbfuck
< 1295059750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :    Couldn't match expected type `Change t2 a2'
< 1295059750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :           against inferred type `FileChange'
< 1295059750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :      NB: `Change' is a type function, and may not be injective
< 1295059755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :steadily heading towards failure
< 1295059776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i'm going to troll them
< 1295059778 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :badly
< 1295059781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for my own amusement
< 1295059784 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :God dammit.
< 1295059794 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minecraft crashed. I lost the crate I put my stuff in.
< 1295059802 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this will not end well
< 1295059803 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: :(
< 1295059807 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: that happened to me once
< 1295059814 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I submitted a report
< 1295059821 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that just submits to apple
< 1295059822 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1295059824 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjsWHtkd7Yk
< 1295059827 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait
< 1295059829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're not on os x
< 1295059830 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: XD
< 1295059835 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I emailed it by hand
< 1295059838 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: internalise this phrase: Notch quality engineering.
< 1295059846 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Notch, you see, is possibly the worst programer of our time.
< 1295059864 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Minecraft crashed. I lost the crate I put my stuff in. <-- since when did you start playing minecraft? :D
< 1295059873 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Today!
< 1295059878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: He got a good idea, somehow managed to develop it to near its current state (recent improvements have been by Jeb, who is competent), and then went into an ETERNAL LOOP OF FAIL.
< 1295059883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: For instance. A quote.
< 1295059897 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: [[Oh, and I’ve finally committed the Music Blocks to the repository.
< 1295059897 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Oh, wait, no, I didn’t.. Doing so broke git, so we’re changing to svn because git is horrible and evil)]]
< 1295059917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: When Beta first came out, in multiplayer, when you died, items would *duplicate*.
< 1295059923 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You would get two of everything you own lying around.
< 1295059931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But only half of them could be picked up.
< 1295059931 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, see that link!
< 1295059934 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what the hell just happened lol
< 1295059941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Additionally, leaf decay meant that single-player games ran at about 5 fps.
< 1295059943 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: oops how did I miss that
< 1295059955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: We are almost entirely certain that Notch does not even try and run the game before pushing updates.
< 1295059974 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: WOW!!! Meta :D
< 1295060021 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah well.
< 1295060032 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All I lost was wood and cobblestone.
< 1295060042 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, indeed. There was harry potter theme on youtube too. Played manually
< 1295060051 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, by walking sideways and hitting timed blocks
< 1295060055 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I
< 1295060058 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: what's your base
< 1295060059 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: this one is great though
< 1295060062 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'ve been hollowing out a mountain.
< 1295060062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in what type
< 1295060065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1295060080 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And mining the hell out of it.
< 1295060092 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm playing on peaceful, though.
< 1295060113 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: laaame
< 1295060116 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf
< 1295060119 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3f1ofoKylN4
< 1295060119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: real men play on hard
< 1295060120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also real women
< 1295060121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and fake men
< 1295060123 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was a skeleton that killed me IN BROAD DAYLIGHT
< 1295060124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not fake women
< 1295060128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: xD
< 1295060132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it just didn't want to burn
< 1295060137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: if trees shelter them
< 1295060140 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they can avoid burning
< 1295060142 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, rather expertly played I have to say considering the limits of minecraft. I played that melody on piano
< 1295060142 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not if they step out
< 1295060181 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: have you seen the CPU?
< 1295060189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, he has.
< 1295060210 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aaaaargh fuckyoufuckyoufuckyoufuckyou FUCK GHC
< 1295060213 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, yes I have even downloaded and played with it locally
< 1295060222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU ARE NOT DOING THINGS I WANT YOU TO DO, DESPITE THE FACT THAT THESE THINGS ARE UNREASONABLE
< 1295060228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I DISLIKE THIS FACET OF YOU
< 1295060270 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: oh really! I tried that.. didn't work for me
< 1295060295 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I thnink the savegame format has been changed recently
< 1295060301 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, no it hasn't
< 1295060302 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :folderized
< 1295060304 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: hm
< 1295060307 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, it likely will though
< 1295060309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it changed a looong time ago
< 1295060310 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Then I am an idiot
< 1295060312 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, did you unpack the zip?
< 1295060316 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the RAR
< 1295060319 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right
< 1295060320 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the rar
< 1295060321 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever
< 1295060337 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm being precise because the mistake is probably a very small detail
< 1295060353 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, oh right. unrar?
< 1295060359 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah
< 1295060365 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, you need to tell it to unpack with folder structure preserved
< 1295060370 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, rather than unpack flat
< 1295060373 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes this is stupid
< 1295060381 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :check docs. iirc it is x instead of e
< 1295060381 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I blame unrar :P
< 1295060383 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not myself
< 1295060384 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something like that
< 1295060388 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, same
< 1295060435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :holy shit, it works
< 1295060463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, sorta...
< 1295060519 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, if you ever played zelda oot you will find this awesome: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uRUSF3IlFqY
< 1295060561 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: one question.. how do you find all these videos so quickly?
< 1295060572 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, by searching youtube!
< 1295060572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :reddit.com/r/minecraft
< 1295060576 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no
< 1295060582 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some I found there
< 1295060585 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not most
< 1295060586 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to make these boxes
< 1295060587 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you will notice it taking up 90% of your reddit time soon
< 1295060601 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, can you tell him not for all cases
< 1295060616 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meanwhile, nine year old girls play Minecraft: http://i.imgur.com/KPI02.jpg
< 1295060631 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like how the idea of a minecart floating in the void was scrapped.
< 1295060644 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott:
< 1295060645 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :03:03 < Axmann> so if {x | x is an integer above zero}, then |8|?
< 1295060645 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :03:03 < Axmann> that 8=infinity
< 1295060650 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Misson accomplished
< 1295060662 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: wait what xD
< 1295060694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 8*2i = oo
< 1295060698 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: {troll}
< 1295060728 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Cool! It's working
< 1295060866 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, happy to be of service
< 1295060880 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# C  [r600_dri.so+0x55d0c]  radeonEmitVec4+0x4c
< 1295060882 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ARGH
< 1295060890 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's hitting a bug in my driver.
< 1295060900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: :-D
< 1295060931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what, they're actually listening to me ...
< 1295060943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: assure me that #math is never worthwhile, because I'm on the road to a ban
< 1295060981 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :02:45 < j-invariant> I thought this was #math, not #interpretive-dance
< 1295061044 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1295061105 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3:14 maybe I should go to bed
< 1295061109 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, ouch
< 1295061127 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, should have gotten yourself nvidia or intel :P
< 1295061163 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, 04:15: I agree
< 1295061166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i'm not going to bed so you shouldn't either, that's like
< 1295061168 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a fundamental law of nature
< 1295061168 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night →
< 1295061179 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Some people have to get up in the morning
< 1295061197 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'm not one of them)
< 1295061199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what a strange concept
< 1295061220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: anyone who has to get up in the morning on saturday probably has a terrible life i figure, so being sleep-deprived shouldn't make things significantly worse
< 1295061222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ergo what i said stands
< 1295061278 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL
< 1295061279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I suggest switching to another driver, Minecraft takes precedence over all
< 1295061280 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so harsh
< 1295061290 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I would redesign @ to be able to support a JVM if it couldn't, just so it could run Minecraft
< 1295061473 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION just won Minecraft.
< 1295061493 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Build a tiny room from wood planks. VICTORY SHALL BE YOURS.
< 1295061521 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::O
< 1295061556 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ...?
< 1295061569 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin! O_O
< 1295061574 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU BASTARD
< 1295061576 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mobs can't get you. Voila, you are immortal.
< 1295061576 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?
< 1295061587 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sup dude
< 1295061594 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yo yo
< 1295061594 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since when do you come here
< 1295061602 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: I'm just stalking you
< 1295061606 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::>
< 1295061609 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3
< 1295061623 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, I intend to murder you
< 1295061628 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but to do so I must first learn your habits
< 1295061632 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :D:
< 1295061638 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: um i just mentioned how to win
< 1295061639 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also months ago
< 1295061639 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well
< 1295061645 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott can explain my habits to you
< 1295061650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: you can do it with only taking two blocks
< 1295061660 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MURTHER!
< 1295061665 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: in fact, you can win in seconds
< 1295061666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: let me tell you how
< 1295061669 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: find a dirt hill
< 1295061674 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: take two blocks vertically from the ground
< 1295061675 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: step inside
< 1295061676 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: turn around
< 1295061682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: place them in front of you facing outside
< 1295061685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :congratulations, you win Minecraft!
< 1295061694 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are the criteria for winning?
< 1295061702 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: being safe forever, obviously
< 1295061709 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: if there's nothing more to fight, obviously you win the game
< 1295061711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's how games work
< 1295061717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after you do the final boss, that's it, no more game, you win
< 1295061725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in this case, the final boss is two dirt blocks
< 1295061805 0 :nooga!nooga@jasminek.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295061864 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: still playing peaceful like a wimp?
< 1295061886 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I won on hard!
< 1295061895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Hard isn't actually very hard vs. normal
< 1295061896 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mmmm weetabix
< 1295061906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Really, if you have a house, you're fine; and you can even go around at night with a sword and armour.
< 1295061919 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, even a wooden sword?
< 1295061920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just makes mining more interesting :P
< 1295061927 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And wooden armor?
< 1295061928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Sure, but why would you make wooden anything?
< 1295061931 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: BUT I MUST REMOVE ALL THE STONE FROM INSIDE THIS MOUNTAIN
< 1295061932 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is no wooden armour.
< 1295061936 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You can do that on hard.
< 1295061948 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, because you haven't started mining yet
< 1295061950 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: to make the hall of the mountain king
< 1295061959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: You make one pickaxe, take three stone, and you have a stone pickaxe.
< 1295061964 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Congratulations, you never need to use wood tools ever again.
< 1295061991 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, unless you're careless and run out of stone pickaxe usage and stones
< 1295061997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: That is impossible.
< 1295061998 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... *Run out of stones*?
< 1295062007 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A stone pickaxe lasts for enough time to mine hundreds and hundreds of cobbles.
< 1295062024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you ever go "oops, out of cobbles, have to make a wood pickaxe", congratulations -- you are the first person to actually *lose* Minecraft.
< 1295062074 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: so are you a minecraft-head too or are you just here for the esoteric languages nobody ever speaks about?
< 1295062110 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyone want to shoot comex with an alarm clock?
< 1295062121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: he's just in here because of ircnomic
< 1295062124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...to some approximation
< 1295062141 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't actually know if comex does esolangs, but he never really talks, so, we just kinda accept him
< 1295062143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's cool
< 1295062147 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, surely you mean Canada
< 1295062163 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eff you!
< 1295062165 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: he used to use an uncommon language, at least
< 1295062166 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's a pretty cool guy though. He doesn't afraid of anything!
< 1295062171 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure I'd call it esoteric :P
< 1295062172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: What, Python?
< 1295062176 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, nimrod
< 1295062185 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ne'r heard of it.
< 1295062192 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, that thing.
< 1295062201 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That terrible-looking thing.
< 1295062224 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: All comex's code that I've seen has been Python at least
< 1295062227 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bayes was Python.
< 1295062255 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's occasionally shown a tiny bit of interest in haskell
< 1295062260 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is pretty esoteric
< 1295062278 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders if talking about comex for long enough will un-afk him
< 1295062306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i think he's written...one haskell program?
< 1295062312 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which one?
< 1295062350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD
< 1295062383 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn Boston public transport
< 1295062391 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to get to the airport tomorrow morning
< 1295062394 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for a flight at 6:50
< 1295062407 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the bus to get to the airport starts up at 5:50
< 1295062407 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: Yeeaaah, good luck with that.
< 1295062409 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :look at that
< 1295062414 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a person who needs to be up on Saturday
< 1295062419 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ha ha, let's laugh at him
< 1295062428 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe
< 1295062430 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hey, I get to go to warm places, at least :)
< 1295062434 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's fucking cold here
< 1295062434 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm planning on waking up early on Saturday
< 1295062443 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Assuming she contacts me tonight
< 1295062446 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sucks how everyone who asks a programming question seems to get an answer, except nobody knows how to solve my thing
< 1295062446 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: i want to live in iceland, i can't really relate
< 1295062455 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: your question is wrong :D
< 1295062461 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: Boston's public transport is positively nice for "sane" hours. If you happen to need to be along the right routes.
< 1295062468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the context of haskell
< 1295062477 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: 6:50 AM on Saturday? Weep!
< 1295062478 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: yeah, except I live and work on the green line
< 1295062482 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's j-invariant's question?
< 1295062486 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: Ouch.
< 1295062492 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: a colleague of mine is from iceland!
< 1295062497 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I'm listening to icelandic music right now
< 1295062499 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zomg
< 1295062501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: wait wait wait let me guess their name
< 1295062504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: either
< 1295062504 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: how do I do such and such
< 1295062506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: X Yson
< 1295062507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: or
< 1295062509 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sofuckingslow.
< 1295062513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: X Ydottir
< 1295062513 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1295062516 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1295062518 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :none of that
< 1295062535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*dóttir
< 1295062539 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no
< 1295062542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: er are you sure, isn't that how icelandic names are formed :P
< 1295062546 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1295062550 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a grammar for them?
< 1295062557 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION builds an enumerator
< 1295062566 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now, I have a tough question
< 1295062569 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you guys can help me
< 1295062584 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mayhaps.
< 1295062586 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just ate 3 (THREE) weetabix. Should I eat more?
< 1295062589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: well er,
< 1295062602 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: it's [Firstname] [Parentfirstname][son|dóttir]
< 1295062608 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's their name, I'd be very surprised if it didn't fit that?
< 1295062614 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :son is indeed the suffix
< 1295062641 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: then "X Yson" is correct, as i said
< 1295062654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Icelandic_name
< 1295062664 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I didn't realize your uppercase was a free variable
< 1295062686 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh
< 1295062689 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi, my name is ecks whyson
< 1295062700 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1295062711 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's like trying to guess if the sun's going to come up tomorrow.
< 1295062722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: wut
< 1295062730 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dagur Bergþóruson Eggertsson
< 1295062739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's some name
< 1295062746 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep
< 1295062746 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Guessing that -son or -dóttir is the suffix for a Icelandic name.
< 1295062753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: congratulations, you know the mayor of reykjavik
< 1295062760 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*reykjavík
< 1295062761 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm good
< 1295062768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm ex-mayor
< 1295062777 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, about the important question
< 1295062783 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does anyone have any thoughts?
< 1295062804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what question
< 1295062819 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE FUCKING WEETABIX
< 1295062822 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1295062825 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eat more weetabix
< 1295062829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with maple syrup
< 1295062831 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really?
< 1295062832 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I ate three
< 1295062835 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(everything should be combined with maple syrup)
< 1295062835 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin will ate 40 weetabix. That's as many as four tens! And that's terrible.
< 1295062839 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also bacon)
< 1295062839 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't had them with maple syrup
< 1295062843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and chocolate
< 1295062845 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :simultaneously
< 1295062860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bacon with melted chocolate dripped in maple syrup is probably close to being liquid happiness-inflictor
< 1295062874 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well apart from not being liquid
< 1295062875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's one failing
< 1295062879 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Surprisingly, bacon and chocolate do in fact go together very well.
< 1295062885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: i have this bacon chocolate here
< 1295062886 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's amazing
< 1295062889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fucking amazing
< 1295062892 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :restored my faith in god
< 1295062893 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know what also goes with bacon?
< 1295062895 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless you're Jewish. In which case you're fucked.
< 1295062897 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more bacon?
< 1295062897 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :balsamic vinegar
< 1295062902 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, you're wrong, the answer is more bacon
< 1295062910 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :strangely enough
< 1295062910 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that too
< 1295062912 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Baconic vinegar?
< 1295062917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: vinegar + maple syrup!!!
< 1295062920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE BEST WORST THING EVER
< 1295062925 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guido thinks it's unbaconic
< 1295062931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh
< 1295062943 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: does the Type 1 font program language count as esoteric?
< 1295062947 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need it for this exploit.
< 1295062952 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ssshhh)
< 1295062955 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: no, sry
< 1295062964 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a pretty good example of a turing tarpit
< 1295062965 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::]
< 1295062967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: I totally won't tell anyone what it is if you say it in this publicly-logged channel.
< 1295062974 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tweets it
< 1295062981 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin won't tweet it either
< 1295062983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so go ahead
< 1295062989 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not? :(
< 1295062993 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want some fame too
< 1295063002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's secret! you can tweet it in a few minutes.
< 1295063011 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION sets a countdown timer
< 1295063017 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes and fetches more weetabix
< 1295063019 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x.x
< 1295063035 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295063039 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not even kidding, though; it feels like writing in an esolang.
< 1295063047 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@209.59.220.33 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295063053 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: EXCUSE ME SORRY TELL US WHAT THE EXPLOIT IS OR GET BANNED
< 1295063062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :famous people are allowed in here only if they give us inside scoops
< 1295063074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or money
< 1295063093 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think Notch would be allowed here even if he gave us both
< 1295063116 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe if he gave us a LOT of money.
< 1295063138 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why wouldn't he?
< 1295063144 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: because he can't fucking code
< 1295063152 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh?
< 1295063153 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and he has the piece of shit autoupdate to more broken versions constantly without warning
< 1295063166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and he said git is horrible and evil and switched to svn because he fucked something up
< 1295063170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and and and he "frowns upon" modders and
< 1295063172 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1295063174 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he is the most hateful person
< 1295063187 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but he's rich
< 1295063191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1295063192 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in my land, that means he's good
< 1295063198 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and he can't even fucking hire developers to code minecraft properly
< 1295063207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he hired devs ... to code on his supersekrit new project
< 1295063215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than, you know, the game people actually fucking play
< 1295063244 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Didn''t a non-Notch person work on the new update?
< 1295063246 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in my land, that just means he's going to try to get richer
< 1295063248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1295063249 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jeb
< 1295063250 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which means he's even gooder
< 1295063255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: your land is strange
< 1295063260 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: the only non-Notch coder working on MC
< 1295063263 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also seemingly competent
< 1295063287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he basically did the whole new update
< 1295063288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which was good
< 1295063292 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Would I be an improvement or a ... opposite
< 1295063292 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :success = good and money = success
< 1295063294 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :From Notch
< 1295063295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more evidence that notch is a oajgoidfjg
< 1295063298 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you are poor, you are a bad person
< 1295063300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: um i don't even want to think about that
< 1295063305 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: good to know!
< 1295063319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: i'm just going to assume you're joking even though this is the internet
< 1295063343 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to assume that you assume that because you're poor
< 1295063349 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cause good people wouldn't assume that
< 1295063358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm actually gandhi
< 1295063366 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not even going to bother making the obvious Star Trek comparision
< 1295063367 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, the worst person in history
< 1295063381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: what.
< 1295063387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no star trek comparison is ever obvious
< 1295063401 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now that I have consumed more weetabix
< 1295063402 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what.
< 1295063409 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and am relatively replete
< 1295063412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: eat more
< 1295063414 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bitch
< 1295063416 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This one is.
< 1295063416 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have another profound question
< 1295063422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay
< 1295063423 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shoot
< 1295063432 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should I sleep a bit and then wake up to go to the airport
< 1295063442 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or just stay up as late as I normally do, and not sleep at all
< 1295063446 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: latter
< 1295063447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :way more fun
< 1295063450 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh
< 1295063452 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION decides that he's the wrong person to answer the question
< 1295063453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you will RULE the plane
< 1295063454 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :look
< 1295063455 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: ALSOALSO
< 1295063458 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minecraft is a Java applet
< 1295063458 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then I'll want to sleep tomorrow
< 1295063461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: you can eat more weetabix
< 1295063463 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't need to say anything else
< 1295063464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the meantime
< 1295063465 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I only have a couple of days out there
< 1295063468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: it's not an applet
< 1295063468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it is
< 1295063471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but nobody uses the applet...
< 1295063474 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't mod it or anything
< 1295063476 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it seems like a waste to fly away and sleep there
< 1295063476 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or even use texture packs
< 1295063480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or adjust the resolution
< 1295063483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would anyone even use the applet
< 1295063493 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: sleep on the plane
< 1295063499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: problem solved
< 1295063499 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's only three hours or so
< 1295063507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: good enough!
< 1295063512 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/ applet//
< 1295063515 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my statement is still valid
< 1295063519 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need 18 hours of beauty sleep
< 1295063520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: Minecraft is A java?!?!?!
< 1295063523 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the beauty is somewhat lacking)
< 1295063525 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You don't have to make random transfers on the plai1
< 1295063526 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::'
< 1295063527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: don't sleep ever
< 1295063543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: more fucking weetabix
< 1295063543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now
< 1295063544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :god damn
< 1295063546 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plail. PLAIL.
< 1295063552 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: WEETABIX
< 1295063556 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION forcefeeds elliott WEETABIX
< 1295063557 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :me finds this hilarious
< 1295063560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no
< 1295063563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forcefeed YOURSELF
< 1295063592 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott `>> [ clone. ]
< 1295063593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: EAT SOME FUCKING WEETABIX FUCKFACE
< 1295063600 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION hides
< 1295063609 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait.
< 1295063616 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why would I ever, ever do that
< 1295063623 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Give elliott even 1 clone-child
< 1295063636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :MOTHERFUCKING WEETABIX | WEETABIX: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | WEETABIX WITH MOTHERFUCKING MERCURY IN IT: http://codu.org/projects/esotericlogs/hg/ | PAGES ABOUT WEETABIX: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page | WEETABIX FUCKING WEETABIX
< 1295063642 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :....that sounded far, far wronger than I meant
< 1295063647 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :MOTHERFUCKING WEETABIX | WEETABIX: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | WEETABIX WITH MOTHERFUCKING MERCURY IN IT: http://codu.org/projects/esotericlogs/hg/ | PAGES ABOUT WEETABIX: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page | WEETABIX, FUCKING WEETABIX
< 1295063654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to preempt sgeo
< 1295063657 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: WEETABIX OR BUST
< 1295063668 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wha?
< 1295063713 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1295063747 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::o
< 1295063767 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :weetafux
< 1295063768 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay you convinced me
< 1295063771 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: WEETABIX OR WEETABIX
< 1295063771 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YAY
< 1295063772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MORE WEETABIX
< 1295063774 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never understood why people ate that
< 1295063776 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll eat more weetabix
< 1295063781 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: they're yummy
< 1295063783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::)))))
< 1295063795 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like a piece of wasa bread
< 1295063797 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in your milk
< 1295063806 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soaked
< 1295063809 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and soggy
< 1295063814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: i have a
< 1295063814 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yumy
< 1295063815 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i could never get it, maybe i'm using them wrong
< 1295063815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :serving suggestion
< 1295063818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for your weetabix
< 1295063820 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :serve it with more weetabix
< 1295063823 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no bacon
< 1295063835 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just put them in the milk and it gets soggy and crappy and boring
< 1295063841 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the weetabix thing that is
< 1295063895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin
< 1295063898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make my function prettier
< 1295063900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/more efficient
< 1295063910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ordering cs =
< 1295063910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  let (g,v2n,n2v) =
< 1295063910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :        Graph.graphFromEdges . Set.toList . Set.map (\c -> (c, c, deps c)) $ cs
< 1295063910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  in reverse . map (\v -> case v2n v of (c,_,_) -> c) . Graph.topSort $ g
< 1295063916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right now it relies on changes themselves being Ord
< 1295063920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since they're used as the key
< 1295063922 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is bleh :(
< 1295063951 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :graphs suck
< 1295063953 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's sad that the only language or platform that has solved the module issue to my satisfaction thus far is JAVA
< 1295063957 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fucking JAVA
< 1295063957 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to make them suck less in haskell someday
< 1295063963 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but for now, I can't, sorry
< 1295063969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if java has solved your module issue
< 1295063971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your issue is wrong
< 1295063985 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295063990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: i don't really mind the api, i just want you to fix the function :(
< 1295064003 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO
< 1295064005 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i'll abstract a way a change-ref (i.e. object id) and use that as the key.
< 1295064011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which i have to do anyway
< 1295064012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but
< 1295064013 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Java has no conflicting packages whose names are the same
< 1295064014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be so ugly
< 1295064021 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or at least, if people weren't idiots, it wouldn't
< 1295064025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yes it does
< 1295064028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo.org.blah
< 1295064029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo.org expires
< 1295064031 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why can I not make a warning about converting a integer to a pointer without a cast, into error, without making other warnings also errors?
< 1295064032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :new owner takes it up
< 1295064033 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh
< 1295064034 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo.org.blah
< 1295064039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH SNAP
< 1295064056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: the only solution to your problem is having the cryptographic hash of the API be the hash's name (tuomov has proposed this solution)
< 1295064118 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: what about python?
< 1295064189 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you just use #line if you want the compiler to emit an error message for compile-time-assertions?
< 1295064201 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Such as arrays that conditionally have negative size)
< 1295064211 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I have tried this, and it works)
< 1295064254 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The command in the new C specification that says you can make compile-time-assertions is unnecessary, I think.
< 1295064301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XcvyaGhc1mg
< 1295064331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pure awesome
< 1295064332 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, there's another solution, that I think Newspeak is heading in
< 1295064345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: being?
< 1295064349 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have names not need to be unique within a system.
< 1295064379 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: that doesn't really solve any problem unless you're more specific.
< 1295064402 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: What are you trying to make?
< 1295064423 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Suppose you have two packages named Foobar. No packakages that use either Foobar have the name Foobar forcefully encoded in
< 1295064427 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just as documentation
< 1295064443 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The user might call one copy of Foobar Foobar_to_do_this and the other Foobar_to_do_that
< 1295064446 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295064456 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hook each up to wherever it needs to go in the IDE
< 1295064457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: The problem is, of course, that every time you use a module at the top level, you have to give it EVERY FUCKING MODULE THERE IS.
< 1295064518 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, just the ones it needs. And if you don't have duplicate names in a system yet, the IDE does it automatically perhaps
< 1295064537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: (1) That's what I meant. Consider something that needs 30 modules.
< 1295064566 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: (2) So basically, duplicate names are REALLY FUCKING ANNOYING to the point where you'd never want them anyway (and you're handwaving language issues by diverting them to some "IDE" that is well beyond the well-defined accepted scope of an IDE)
< 1295064606 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: In what programming language? Java?
< 1295064612 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Newspeak.
< 1295064630 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note: I am not on the Newspeak team. Just imagining where I think it would go
< 1295064651 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK I found it on Wikipedia now.
< 1295064682 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, instead of saying "IDE", is a config file better?
< 1295064689 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: No, not really.
< 1295064694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Name conflicts are still a horrific pain with that system.
< 1295064706 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, at least they can be dealt with
< 1295064713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For instance, a module can't use a module X, and also use another module that wants a different module called X.
< 1295064715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: They shouldn't be.
< 1295064740 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes, it can?
< 1295064744 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I avoid using Google whenever possible, so sometimes I search for things on Wikipedia instead.)
< 1295064748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it can't?
< 1295064793 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hook up other module's X to the X it wants, and main module's X to the X it wants
< 1295064821 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see, so you get a horrible tangle if two commonly-used modules use different modules named X.
< 1295064828 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not to mention that EVEN IF YOU CONFIGURE IT CORRECTLY,
< 1295064837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're going to have a world of confusion as you try and talk about it:
< 1295064844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"So X1 does blah, and ..." "Which one is X1 again?"
< 1295064848 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The one that does X." "They both do X."
< 1295064857 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is why they need to add a command to rename modules.
< 1295064863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Uhh, the one that Poophead wrote." "Oh. Is that the one with the API that looks like turds or the API that looks like turdy turds?"
< 1295064865 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Turdy turds."
< 1295064875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"*looks at the code* No, that's the other one."
< 1295064876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Oops."
< 1295064882 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Like the ALIAS command in Visual Basic, I guess.)
< 1295065080 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so it's not perfect, it can still be better than the rest
< 1295065088 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not really.
< 1295065096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't remember the last time I actually saw a naming conflict.
< 1295065107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have to wonder why you are obsessed with them.
< 1295065142 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because the idea of their existence horrifies me
< 1295065152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Horrifies.
< 1295065155 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you sure you want to use that word.
< 1295065159 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does it not strike you as too strong
< 1295065181 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does the word hyperbole strike you as a bit too..
< 1295065210 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Considering you've talked about some random pseudoscientific book as making you physically ill, I really don't think I can assume hyperbole any more.
< 1295065413 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if the archive of tuomov's blog is complete.
< 1295065432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps I could ask tuomov for the missing posts if not.
< 1295065582 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1295066277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Here is tuomov's post about APIs and modules. http://tuomov.bitcheese.net/b/archives/2007/07/16/T22_41_22
< 1295066475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: You should read it.
< 1295066480 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I a
< 1295066481 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :am
< 1295066537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, the archive is not complete it seems ...
< 1295066622 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is tired
< 1295066628 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And not in the best of moods
< 1295066629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Less tired, more reading!
< 1295066713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh man, scapegoat is gonna rock.
< 1295066962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://bugs.darcs.net/issue64 <-- finally fucking resolved
< 1295066963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Read it?
< 1295066968 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YES
< 1295066974 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Enlightened?
< 1295066974 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I DID
< 1295066978 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Enlightened?
< 1295066985 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't care right now
< 1295067009 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Darcs is anti-tf8?
< 1295067012 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, you said resulved
< 1295067014 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ressolved
< 1295067017 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck it
< 1295067038 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o_O
< 1295067041 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: You seem...disturbed.
< 1295067050 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :She's still not online
< 1295067167 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Missing the bus and calling at the last limit ... (presumably) implying she'd be online and then not being so... Hmmmmmmmm.
< 1295067169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am going to sleep now.
< 1295067184 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1295067195 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :She didn't know that it takes me so long to get to the mall
< 1295067286 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: I need silence right now
< 1295067403 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
< 1295067462 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295067974 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1295068045 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295068479 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-216-47.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295069590 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1295069592 0 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-216-47.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295069642 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need a new graphics card.
< 1295069647 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :pikhq
< 1295069689 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With ATi, I've got a choice of: slightly unstable drivers, or slightly unstable drivers *that fucking glitch like crazy* (those being the "official" drivers).
< 1295069943 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seriously, the official drivers suck balls.
< 1295070019 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i believed you the first time
< 1295070053 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: It needs to be said often.
< 1295070088 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, Flash is a monstrosity and Adobe should be murdered for it.
< 1295070113 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't care if it's impractical to murder an international megacorp, either!
< 1295070251 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, bombing their headquarters doesn't seem so infeasible at least
< 1295070352 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :< sean_> inglip would kick zalgo's ass
< 1295070363 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what shall i tell him?
< 1295070500 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quickly, bring pie
< 1295070604 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hah... Another piece of drivel promoting fantasy "mediterrainian diet".
< 1295070747 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"extra virgin olive oil and canola oil in place of saturated and trans fats" ... Yeah, right... Maybe they use _some_ olive oil (cold-pressed)... But sure no rancid-at-the-shelves canola/rapeseed oil...
< 1295070784 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then there's the French paradox...
< 1295070984 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1295071480 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-215-160.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295071543 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :French Paradox: Why do French have so little heart disease even if their saturated fat consumption is so high?
< 1295071663 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Answer: correlation ≠ causation.
< 1295072256 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm certain my away message is a quote from some Simpsons book, a guide to either Simpsons episodes or to Springfield
< 1295072260 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But Google turns up nothing
< 1295072261 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::(
< 1295072263 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Night all
< 1295072688 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds
< 1295073151 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@209.59.220.33 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295073554 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GAH!
< 1295073622 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Star Wars trilogies are getting yet *another* modified rerelease. Though the prequels probably can't be made much *worse* by Lucas, I wonder how fucking awful he's going to be to the original trilogy this time.
< 1295074719 0 :Zuu_!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295074721 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295075443 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lagerholm estimate is now below 7 days... The estimate for today will come in about 1.5 hours... But I doubt it is going to be more optimistic...
< 1295075454 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Current burnrate in used /8 per month: 1.84
< 1295075792 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HURRR... http://www.potaroo.net/tools/ipv4/fig25.png
< 1295075807 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that some sort of data processing error???
< 1295075896 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And for extra fun, APNIC seems to be handing out about half of the addresses...
< 1295076414 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably more pessimistic, if anything.
< 1295076834 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295076998 0 :Wamanuz5!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295077313 0 :amca!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Farewell
< 1295078399 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended
< 1295078400 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295080647 0 :Wamanuz2!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295080816 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295080924 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now the estimate is today (of course, being Saturday, it is not likely that anything happens before monday...
< 1295080968 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Last 5 days large allocations: 6.5Mi
< 1295081146 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, these predictions are quite messed up...
< 1295081389 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The fastest case is APNIC having requested the blocks on Friday (and IANA has not yet processed the request...)
< 1295082044 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295082978 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295082978 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host
< 1295082978 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295083006 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Been discussing Weetabix, have we?
< 1295083251 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.
< 1295084101 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-10-158.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295084397 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lagerholm estimate is today.
< 1295084401 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow.
< 1295084423 0 :Wamanuz4!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295084452 0 :Wamanuz2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1295085549 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1295085605 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295085936 0 :Wamanuz5!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295086063 0 :Wamanuz4!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295086151 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295086298 0 :Wamanuz5!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1295086516 0 :Zuu_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1295086713 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ilua
< 1295086900 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, they already updated Painterly.
< 1295086910 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is astonishing.
< 1295087347 0 :bc98270!~bc98270@pool-173-64-156-55.sttlwa.fios.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295087837 0 :Wamanuz2!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295087862 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295087954 0 :cheater00!~cheater@g229029187.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295087971 0 :Wamanuz3!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295087994 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1295088000 0 :bc98270!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :suck
< 1295088098 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295088123 0 :Wamanuz2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295088962 0 :Wamanuz4!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295089079 0 :Wamanuz3!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
< 1295089090 0 :Wamanuz5!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295089268 0 :Wamanuz4!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
< 1295089366 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295089510 0 :Wamanuz5!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1295089793 0 :Wamanuz2!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295089963 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295090078 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.
< 1295090192 0 :bc98270!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: question = ( to ) ? be : ! be;   -- Wm. Shakespeare
< 1295090653 0 :Wamanuz2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds
< 1295091532 0 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-19-45.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295091564 0 :Wamanuz2!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295091611 0 :acetoline!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1295097486 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295098023 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o
< 1295098027 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais, how's up
< 1295098430 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295098899 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295100575 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295100635 0 :cheater00!~cheater@e181133021.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295102594 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YouTube comments will never cease to destroy my faith in humanity.
< 1295102640 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Example?
< 1295102668 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEATei2wewY&feature=related
< 1295102679 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :First listen to the soundtrack. Then read the comments.
< 1295102732 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Half of them are right-wing screeching.
< 1295103079 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was wondering where I heard that song
< 1295103588 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh... I just remembered that my earlier estimate of IANA IPv4 depletion estimate was mid-January... Lagerholm estimate is now "any moment now"...
< 1295103672 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do we know when it happens?
< 1295103694 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm pretty sure it'll be all over reddit
< 1295104166 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_IaJ8bec8fg
< 1295104169 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that a bug?
< 1295104210 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, if that's not been fixed, it's insanely useful.
< 1295104224 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has been fixed. Damn.
< 1295104231 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linky?
< 1295104402 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meh
< 1295104419 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, look at the comments.
< 1295104430 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On a different vid: "I don't know why this never occurred to me. What a great method. xD Once buckets are fixed in multiplayer, I'm going to use this on the obsidian tower I'm building."
< 1295104438 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's wrong with buckets in multiplayer?
< 1295104461 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They were a bit unreliable IIRC.
< 1295104700 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exactly how mathematical is the average CS curriculum?
< 1295104944 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295105644 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know about average, but here it's: not very, unless you deliberately choose courses to make it so.
< 1295106650 0 :Wamanuz3!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295106836 0 :Wamanuz2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1295107395 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, have you updated the server yet?
< 1295107409 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is in a good mood
< 1295107532 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295107695 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295107844 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, does it turn out that KT-AT plays AW as well?
< 1295107853 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No
< 1295107866 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I did show her Cybertown a while ago
< 1295107869 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, no. If that were the case, Sgeo would be far too busy being paralysed with joy.
< 1295107870 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just briefly though
< 1295107878 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, oh god.
< 1295107924 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EXTREMELY GOOD ADVICE: do NOT attempt to serenade her. Particularly not with "I see a red robe and I want to paint it black".
< 1295107948 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know if she was bored. I do know she was once bored when I was describing some computer thing. And it's not like we haven't done anything that bored me
< 1295107988 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, you are only allowed to liveblog in the event of impending trollpocalypse.
< 1295108029 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did I ever mention the time that I took a journal to school and wrote about what happened as, or shortly after, it happened?
< 1295108179 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow
< 1295108189 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds like the most boring journal ever
< 1295108218 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Particularly given Sgeo's academic career.
< 1295108232 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not boring
< 1295108234 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think
< 1295108241 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. being sent to a 5th-rate college because his dad is a total smeghead.
< 1295108241 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you'd think I was a pervert perhaps
< 1295108249 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, this was in highschool
< 1295108275 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, o god please tell me you weren't writing down your fantasies.
< 1295108299 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and please say they didn't involve urination
< 1295108440 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot, please tell me he wasn't writing down his urolagnic fantasies.
< 1295108440 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1295108440 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: this program is linked into the market-o-matic, thinking that i claim no special effort to keep solaris his sign of the
< 1295108456 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295108456 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host
< 1295108456 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295108468 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot, please tell me he wasn't writing down his urolagnic fantasies.
< 1295108468 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: claimed that the victim) subject:re: `which foo` error message
< 1295108503 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right.
< 1295108509 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Effing connection.
< 1295108550 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Today, 3/9/07, begins my Era of Documentation. A while ago, my Dad told me not to use LiveJournal as a private journal. I wish I disobeyed him sooner."
< 1295108575 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should have listened to him :/
< 1295108593 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and here in turku it's even less mathematical than in helsinki
< 1295108596 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cs
< 1295108600 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why is this computer unable to competently hold onto a wireless network.
< 1295108606 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :afaiu
< 1295108632 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: why no wired connection
< 1295108641 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, when I'm on Linux and at school, I have the same problem
< 1295108657 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, Weetabix looks extremely gross :P
< 1295108677 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, because I live in a hundred-year-old house and as such it was not designed with easy Ethernet cable access in mind.
< 1295108677 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Here is a dense, solid block of cereal product. Digest it."
< 1295108698 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: oh i know how that goes :/
< 1295108711 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, wait, you actually disobeyed your father over something>
< 1295108720 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: no u look like a solid block
< 1295108725 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since 2007 or so, all the time
< 1295108743 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, before or after you let him pick your college?
< 1295108753 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slightly before
< 1295108759 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Holy crap, it's Industrial Food Product.
< 1295108771 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't say I disobey him on everything
< 1295108773 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well. More so than the rest of an American diet.
< 1295108789 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just things like having my name on Facebook, talking to people about him, etc.
< 1295108800 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, it's called Farmingdale.
< 1295108802 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Farming. Dale.
< 1295108829 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They thought "Farming" did not indicate how rustic they were.
< 1295108839 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So they stuck "dale" on the end.
< 1295108843 0 :Wamanuz4!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295108863 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That alone should indicate that you ignore anyone who says it's a good place to study computers.
< 1295108884 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well computer science is a bit gay anyway
< 1295108886 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... He goes to a college called *Farmingdale*?
< 1295108889 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes.
< 1295108893 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sounds like a knock-off social networking game
< 1295108893 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Farming is not.
< 1295108902 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: it's a man's job!
< 1295108905 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, no, it's located in a place called Farmingdale
< 1295108920 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, the point still stands.
< 1295108929 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure what that was an argument for, exactly
< 1295108943 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: And there's nothing more manly than a man in another man's embrace!
< 1295108948 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295108953 0 :Wamanuz3!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295108962 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: My intelligence informs me that it's SUNY Farmingdale, or formerly, Long Island Agricultural and Technical Institute.
< 1295108968 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's all give up computers, move to PA, stop shaving our beards, and farm!
< 1295108997 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Computer science is gay? Okay, then. Where's a phallus...
< 1295108999 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, awful, isn't it.
< 1295109013 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, well, it's... what I meant is that it's not called that because the college just decided "Hey, Farmingdale is an awesome name for a college", which is what I thought you meant.
< 1295109054 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Dear God man, you'd have a more respectible education at Devry. And those people ride the short bus!
< 1295109065 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out
< 1295109065 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION gets offended at pikhq 
< 1295109097 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your dad offends my sensibilities!
< 1295109100 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he may be offensive...but he may be right...
< 1295109108 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, he offends everyone's sensibilities.
< 1295109116 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :respectable education is a bit gay anyway
< 1295109120 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Except apparently Sgeo's.
< 1295109131 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Relevant: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UF5yBBf-1ps
< 1295109136 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: My dad tells me he regularly has this conversation at work: "My son got into {Devry,University of Phoenix,Other Boxtop University}." "That's nice, my son is a doctoral student at Purdue." "*fume*"
< 1295109142 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, so it's not relevant at all, but it's funny.
< 1295109158 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"This video contains content from Channel 4, who has blocked it in your country on copyright grounds."
< 1295109168 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: ... Who would be *proud* of being a student at one of those boxtop universities?
< 1295109168 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, NO SOUP FOR YOU
< 1295109172 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you're slowly convincing me that I should go gay.  keep it up and I'll soon be asking you to undress...
< 1295109178 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: My community college has stricter requirements.
< 1295109202 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: i'm always naked when i'm on irc
< 1295109208 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Pencils are phallic, and we know what Freud has to say about phallic objects.
< 1295109209 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION laughs at the pathetic Americans.
< 1295109220 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: But ... he's some scrawny little Finnish twink :P
< 1295109220 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: dicks or GTFO
< 1295109242 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And someone tell me what a boxtop university is.
< 1295109245 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: do you have your hat on?
< 1295109255 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Always!
< 1295109263 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not at all scrawny
< 1295109267 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: one you get a scholarship to by mailing weetabix tops
< 1295109277 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, right.
< 1295109302 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: One of a few for-profit colleges which exist *largely* for the purpose of soaking up federal financial aid from students.
< 1295109309 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i was recently told i'm "surprisingly fat" when i told them my weight, i'm not sure how to interpret that
< 1295109326 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is trying to remember which boxtop university it is that's in the /mall/ in Portland.
< 1295109344 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can get into them if you are capable of breathing, just about, and their degrees have similar value to a high school diploma.
< 1295109360 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apollo College, that's right.
< 1295109378 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When you go to college in a mall, then you need to reconsider your life decisions :P
< 1295109385 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, is there a way to confirm that my college isn't one of them?
< 1295109402 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[It doesn't sound like one. I think]
< 1295109411 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, why, exactly, did your dad send you there?
< 1295109412 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: SUNY isn't one of them, it's just a piss-poor choice for you.
< 1295109414 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: you don't have to move to find work after college, the mall and the uni have a deal
< 1295109422 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Because he's a smeghead" excepted.
< 1295109423 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: X-D
< 1295109466 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Easy commute + not as competitive
< 1295109476 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is competitive bad?
< 1295109482 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i do happen to be naked at the moment, and for some reason my bathwater won't get above lukewarm today :/
< 1295109488 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wish we had even the slightest bit of competition here
< 1295109501 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, you're on your computer in the bath?
< 1295109516 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sgeo: my droid
< 1295109520 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, my dad's convinced that I have difficulties getting homework done
< 1295109535 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As much as I wish I could say I thought he was wrong...
< 1295109536 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: It's a bit like getting a CS degree from The Institute of Everything Un-Technical. Even if the institute is the best thing ever, *you're a fucking moron* for getting a CS degree there.
< 1295109540 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :("motorola milestone" in other parts of the world)
< 1295109561 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: however, if you went to a competitive university, you might start doing homework, because it would have a point.
< 1295109565 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oklopol, my dad's convinced that I have difficulties getting homework done ← I have difficulties getting homework done. Getting homework done doesn't matter.
< 1295109569 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the point being the competition
< 1295109607 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i suppose you might drop out if you sucked ass
< 1295109611 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is what you meant
< 1295109657 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sgeo: i recommend you transfer somewhere better at the earliest available opportunity
< 1295109694 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: at uni, it matters for the first few years tho
< 1295109712 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after that, you'll have your own research to do anyway, so homework is just a sidejob
< 1295109715 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, not at Sgeo's.
< 1295109757 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: well no but i mean whereever you'll go
< 1295109767 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're going to
< 1295109777 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming Sgeo's university is as crappy as i hear
< 1295109812 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not the uni that's crappy, it's his program
< 1295109878 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Holy crap they don't even *offer* computer science.
< 1295109889 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They offer "computer programming & information systems".
< 1295109901 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, yes
< 1295109909 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They had a CS program once
< 1295109912 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: that's also the case in turku :\ although partly because our math department has all the good cs
< 1295109950 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Data structures" is an optional class and it's 300 level!
< 1295109959 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : They had a CS program once ← "once"
< 1295109974 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It requires business classes!
< 1295109979 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think Data Structures is optional
< 1295110015 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I'm looking at the degree requirements. Only required in the "programming track".
< 1295110045 0 :charlvn!~charlvn@bot.za.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295110061 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: BTW: data structures in most CS programs is a freshman course.
< 1295110073 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :....what? Seriously?
< 1295110093 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes you seriously need to transfer asap
< 1295110140 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And *holy God* the math requirements are light.
< 1295110141 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can I get a Bachlor's here, and then do stuff at a more interesting place?
< 1295110150 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, there are math requirements?
< 1295110158 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Calc I and "Probability methods".
< 1295110170 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :calc 1 is like some precalc shit or?
< 1295110179 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Most places I've looked, a CS degree gets you a math minor for free.
< 1295110182 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sgeo: just transfer now and get a bachelor's elsewhere
< 1295110186 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"here's the rules you learned in high school PLUS 5 MORE!"
< 1295110193 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: It's the first of three courses on the calculus of integrals and derivatives.
< 1295110208 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: i got a dual major with just like two or so more classes
< 1295110227 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Yeah, I'm getting a math degree for 3 extra credit hours.
< 1295110239 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least around here you can't include the same course (credit-point-wise) in multiple "modules".
< 1295110259 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: here you can :P
< 1295110263 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: But if I literally *didn't try*, I would have a math minor.
< 1295110264 0 :charlvn!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Max SendQ exceeded
< 1295110267 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So getting a second minor is automatical +20 or +30 credits or however much it was.
< 1295110268 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds
< 1295110293 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Here it's entirely accepted practice.
< 1295110294 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they only require that you take X extra hours that aren't for the primary major
< 1295110295 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, it's a bit problematical in fact when you're taking two minors (or a major and minor) that have a lot of overlapping classes, since you then need to invent credit points for the second.
< 1295110306 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :electives are completely double-dippable
< 1295110306 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oklopol: It's the first of three courses on the calculus of integrals and derivatives. ← so you do polynomials and that's it?
< 1295110324 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, there's no way I could just get a Bachelor's here, and ..whatever the next thing is at Stony Brook?
< 1295110326 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295110331 0 :charlvn!~charlvn@bot.za.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295110341 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No, you do 2 dimensional integrals and derivatives. And that's about it.
< 1295110353 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2 dimensional?
< 1295110358 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: You would have serious trouble going into grad school with that.
< 1295110364 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: it's kinda weird there's actually no way to get a major from both math and cs, since there are just not enough courses
< 1295110377 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes, on functions of single arguments?
< 1295110386 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, if you've done the stuff required for the degree, why can't you have it...
< 1295110402 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, what, so you mean you only work with f(x) rather than f(x,y)?
< 1295110409 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yeah.
< 1295110412 0 :charlvn!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Max SendQ exceeded
< 1295110433 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, erm, here in Scotland you never even touch on multivariate functions.
< 1295110447 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Calc III covers calculus on multivariate functions.
< 1295110483 0 :charlvn!~charlvn@bot.za.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295110489 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we have a course called multivariate functions, but it's given by a very old guy, so it's way too hard for everybody
< 1295110489 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aand calc II is a mishmash of various topics that didn't get covered in calc I.
< 1295110516 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAAAGH
< 1295110517 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the old dudes still think like students should actually work for the courses
< 1295110527 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"like"?
< 1295110532 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: You can take "Foundations of Programming I" *or* "Programming in Visual Basic".
< 1295110541 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: is that a joke? :D
< 1295110553 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: No.
< 1295110558 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't stop laughing
< 1295110568 0 :charlvn!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Max SendQ exceeded
< 1295110579 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I can only conclude that it is educating farmers in CS applicable to sheep feeders.
< 1295110589 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Frankly, I'd be worried about your courses *transferring*.
< 1295110596 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It's not even a CS degree!
< 1295110635 0 :charlvn!~charlvn@bot.za.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295110680 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to remember how many universities there are in Edinburgh, fails.
< 1295110704 0 :charlvn!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Max SendQ exceeded
< 1295110713 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looks like it's two.
< 1295110731 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you in edinburg ph
< 1295110743 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Edinburgh. And yes, I am.
< 1295110747 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was there just recently, we could've played the bagpipe together
< 1295110748 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh sorry
< 1295110755 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295110762 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bagpipes: WORST THING EVER
< 1295110767 0 :charlvn!~charlvn@bot.za.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295110774 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well eaten haggis then'
< 1295110777 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :worn kilt
< 1295110784 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've never worn a kilt, either.
< 1295110786 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :drinking beer
< 1295110789 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :having sex with sheep
< 1295110798 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck do i know what you ppl do in your spare time
< 1295110799 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's Wales, you fool.
< 1295110802 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh sry
< 1295110826 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HEY
< 1295110830 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bagpipes are great.
< 1295110834 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Almost as good as accordions.
< 1295110839 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're also required at Sgeo's school to take "Management Theories and Practices"...
< 1295110841 0 :charlvn!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Max SendQ exceeded
< 1295110850 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, not when you can't go anywhere near the city centre without hearing them!
< 1295110855 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... He's required to take more business classes than math classes!
< 1295110884 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Your degree is a joke.
< 1295110976 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, which college does he go to again?
< 1295110987 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha i wonder if they teach Sgeo to mind his own business haha
< 1295111003 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also, why do you Americans not have universities? Why is it all colleges?)
< 1295111004 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: SUNY Farmingdale.
< 1295111026 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: And we do have universities; we just tend to refer to any degree-granting institution as a "college".
< 1295111038 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Including universities.
< 1295111045 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: which do you regret more, going to fd or mentioning it here? :D
< 1295111055 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Going to FD
< 1295111069 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although there were some nice things social-wise
< 1295111078 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AFAIU colleges here are either constituents of universities or places that do some kind of vocational training.
< 1295111094 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Colleges are *also* constituents of universities here...
< 1295111105 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: In addition to being any degree-granting institution.
< 1295111109 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Phantom_Hoover: And we do have universities; we just tend to refer to any degree-granting institution as a "college". // uhh ... no?
< 1295111122 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yeah, I guess so ... implicitly.
< 1295111131 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You say "I go to college" even if you go to a university.
< 1295111146 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You say "college degree" even if it's from a univeristy.
< 1295111160 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You actually *call* it a college even if it's a university...
< 1295111190 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You guys have for-profit universities.
< 1295111196 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What.
< 1295111237 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Arguably, even our public universities are for-profit.
< 1295111241 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :usa has for-profit free food for the poor organizations
< 1295111243 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :here, colleges are not universities
< 1295111245 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at all
< 1295111254 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The USA also has for-proift prisons.
< 1295111277 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: inmates don't get to vote right?
< 1295111288 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: It depends on the state, actually.
< 1295111419 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Two states—Maine and Vermont—allow prison inmates to vote."
< 1295111430 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good for them
< 1295111439 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(inmates got the vote here thanks to the Charter(
< 1295111462 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Disenfranchisement is considered elsewhere to be part of the punishment for crime *shrugs*
< 1295111471 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If people actually cared about voting, then it would be a legit punishment :P
< 1295111490 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem is that by denying inmates the right to vote, you effectively deny any useful commentary on the prison system
< 1295111490 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Two states disenfranchise all felons. Even after their sentence is done.
< 1295111502 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since the only users of a prison get no say
< 1295111504 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow
< 1295111513 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arizona and Texas?
< 1295111518 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kentucky and Virginia.
< 1295111522 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :darn :(
< 1295111534 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds surprisingly liberal for texas
< 1295111560 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Texas isn't completely *nuts*.
< 1295111682 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :push button, receive bacon
< 1295111701 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, is the justification "being tough on crime"?
< 1295111728 0 :BMG!~behold@d83-183-183-70.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295111768 0 :impomatic!~chatzilla@86.241.112.87.dyn.plus.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295111771 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yup!
< 1295111771 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi :-)
< 1295111779 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: Push button, receive weetabix D'AWWWW
< 1295111780 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: most prison inmates never voted a day in their life, and even if they all did, they'd still be in the minority
< 1295111805 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's only old people that vote in the US.
< 1295111834 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, the politics tends to trail decades behind.
< 1295111836 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We vote with student riots in the U.K.
< 1295111837 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hence the AARP being the biggest most powerful PAC
< 1295111853 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1295112070 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AARP and PAC?
< 1295112142 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :=old people's society and =lobbying organization
< 1295112188 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host
< 1295112188 0 :BMG!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295112192 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :BeholdMyGlory
< 1295112234 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, that is quite possibly the most hilarious thing I have heard about US politics.
< 1295112250 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your country. Is ruled. By an old people's organisation.
< 1295112284 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all the major politicians are old people too.  at least the president is young
< 1295112909 0 :charlvn!~charlvn@bot.za.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295113045 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fun "microcode error detected" from wlan card. rmmod and modprobe worked
< 1295113189 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAAAAARRRRGGGGH my architecture has failed!
< 1295113200 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is a spider on top of the shaft to my mines!
< 1295113224 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha sucks to be you
< 1295113457 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295113565 0 :cheater00!~cheater@g230230018.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295114305 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295114328 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh, you came just too late.
< 1295114334 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh god what did I miss.
< 1295114397 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq was telling Sgeo that his college is the worst ever, in detail.
< 1295114411 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did Sgeo listen?
< 1295114418 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Turns out they do more management courses than mathematical ones.)
< 1295114418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :02:21:40  Wow, they already updated Painterly.
< 1295114418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :02:21:50  That is astonishing.
< 1295114421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's only 16x16. :p
< 1295114629 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I've never worn a kilt, either. <-- YOU'RE NO TRUE SCOTSMAN!
< 1295114647 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, nope.
< 1295114718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :08:24:17  Wow, Weetabix looks extremely gross :P
< 1295114718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :08:24:37  "Here is a dense, solid block of cereal product. Digest it."
< 1295114720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TRAITOR OF WEETABIX
< 1295114722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DESTROYER OF SOULS
< 1295114971 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295114985 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :08:37:46  Easy commute + not as competitive ← wait, surely you could, y'know, live away from home.
< 1295114998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UNTHINKABLE HIS DAD WOULD BEAT HIM INTO A BLOODY PULP
< 1295115001 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :08:32:52  oklopol: you're slowly convincing me that I should go gay.  keep it up and I'll soon be asking you to undress...
< 1295115002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, it's just like 2008!
< 1295115052 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was never allowed to go to sleep-away camp as a kid
< 1295115058 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My parents thought I wouldn't eat.
< 1295115062 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, ...
< 1295115076 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They *thought* that.
< 1295115085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need live advice, people: do I laugh, or do I curl into a ball and cry on Sgeo's behalf?
< 1295115088 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295115089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can do both, but I need to know the order.
< 1295115099 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"No, Seth, you can't go to camp, you won't eat." "But I LIKE eating!" "Not at camp, you won't."
< 1295115107 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: simultaneously
< 1295115112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't it well-known that Sgeo doesn't actually like eating at all.
< 1295115119 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What elliott said.
< 1295115121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :08:36:25  pikhq, is there a way to confirm that my college isn't one of them?
< 1295115122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :08:36:42  [It doesn't sound like one. I think]
< 1295115122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let me think... SUNY... STATE UNIVERSITY of New York ... hmm ... state university ... hmmmmmmmmmm
< 1295115135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably an independent, for-profit corporation.
< 1295115142 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, why the hell did they think you wouldn't eat?
< 1295115149 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you have a habit of not eating?
< 1295115152 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes
< 1295115160 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You don't know this ...?
< 1295115171 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh.
< 1295115181 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why exactly would I?
< 1295115188 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Because it comes up all the time?
< 1295115193 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does?
< 1295115198 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought he just didn't sleep.
< 1295115199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, in Sgeoland.
< 1295115212 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My sleep issues are relatively recent!
< 1295115224 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: next, breathing!
< 1295115227 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"But my eating issues you can RELY on!
< 1295115228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*on!"
< 1295115270 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, so you can't live in student accommodation because you won't eat?
< 1295115296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can set up a bot to order you to eat at regular intervals
< 1295115298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if that would help
< 1295115302 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295115309 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My step-mom's convinced that my unwillingness to organize and throw stuff out in this messy house is an indication that I can't live on my own
< 1295115317 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[My step-mom's crazier than my dad]
< 1295115325 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, Christ.
< 1295115336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo's step mother has never seen student accommodation.
< 1295115336 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How the hell can someone be crazier than your dad?
< 1295115341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And believes it to be a place of cleanliness and perfection
< 1295115388 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds
< 1295115394 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"You're not allowed to date non-Jewish girls" "You're ill"
< 1295115398 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, that offer to kidnap your father is now extended to murdering your stepmother.
< 1295115420 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"You're not allowed to date non-Jewish girls" <-- bitch
< 1295115430 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, *murdering your stepmother very painfully
< 1295115439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a fork?
< 1295115442 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gotta have the forks
< 1295115456 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lawl, wtf
< 1295115461 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since when is Sgeo even Jewish?
< 1295115474 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, dunno.
< 1295115476 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :She also says that that my mom wanted me to only date Jewish girls. While I think my mom would prefer it slightly, I don't think she was that strict about it"
< 1295115481 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Besides, the Jewish side of my family says things more like "You're not allowed to date Jewish girls."
< 1295115525 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, why did you not just spit in her face at this point?
< 1295115548 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Spit ACID IN HER FACE
< 1295115554 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bonus points for not melting your tongue and gums firts
< 1295115555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*first
< 1295115660 0 :Slereah!~butt@ANantes-259-1-61-41.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295115664 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: i'm not sure if it's been mentioned enough but you should transfer to another college right now before it's too late and you get a useless degree that gets you nowhere at all ever
< 1295115666 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION now imagines Sgeo always wearing hasidic garb
< 1295115668 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just sayin'
< 1295115672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PROBABLY A GOOD IDEA?
< 1295115691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alternatively drop out because you could just scribble some crayons on a piece of blank paper and get a degree of similar usefulness
< 1295115698 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, say you're going on a date with KT-AT and NEVER COME BACK
< 1295115709 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: TRYING TO OFFER SERIOUS LIFE ADVICE HERE
< 1295115710 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :KTHX
< 1295115769 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm sure Sgeo is aware that he could just leave if he liked
< 1295115784 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But my degree is almost done!
< 1295115784 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'm not sure he's aware that it's the only sane option
< 1295115791 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
< 1295115796 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, the degree will *decrease* your prospects.
< 1295115798 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: And...then what? You're not gonna get into grad school with it ...
< 1295115817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: If you transfer it's not like you're going to have to start at square one...
< 1295115818 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not even at another SUNY school?
< 1295115826 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can I get a degree and then transfer?
< 1295115830 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...no.
< 1295115838 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You see, you get the degree when you *finish* college.
< 1295115842 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You transfer while you are *in* college.
< 1295115857 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pretend he doesn't have a degree?
< 1295115873 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can I do all the required courses for a degree, and just not get the degree?
< 1295115880 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course
< 1295115890 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they don't just automatically give it to you
< 1295115898 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295115899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Choice 1: (1) Finish useless degree. (2) Be unable to get into grad school. Choice 2: (1) Transfer to another college. (2) Finish good degree. (3) Get into grad school. Choice 3: what you said but why would you want to do that
< 1295115925 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because the senior project sounds like something I need to do. Have a real project.
< 1295115941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because there won't be any "real projects" in another college ...
< 1295115947 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[SARCASM ALERT]
< 1295115996 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, wait, how long have you been at university for?
< 1295115997 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sounds like a drastic solution i know, but when all of #esoteric vehemently agrees...well, desperate times call for it
< 1295116010 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, since beginning of 2008
< 1295116021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seriously.
< 1295116025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You need to get out of that shithole.
< 1295116035 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, so... 19?
< 1295116046 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as you said, sunk cost.  best not to sink anymore
< 1295116056 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What'd you do between leaving school and then?
< 1295116060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because if you sink... you DROWN 
< 1295116076 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nothing.
< 1295116085 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It felt like a summer that wouldn't end
< 1295116104 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[I hate summers]
< 1295116111 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, erm, you left school at 19?
< 1295116120 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, um, hm
< 1295116120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was one of those freakish year-long summers.
< 1295116123 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, 18
< 1295116131 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think
< 1295116142 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, just half a year
< 1295116147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: do we need to go and tell sgeo to transfer in person
< 1295116154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll get plane tickets
< 1295116159 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's all do this together!
< 1295116161 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What were you doing that meant you sat around for the end of 2007?
< 1295116175 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: fuck that.  that's more work even than filling out the transfer papers for him and hell if i'm doing that.
< 1295116184 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, my step-mom and dad wanted me to go to Israel for a little while. That didn't happen.
< 1295116190 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, ...
< 1295116192 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why.
< 1295116193 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1295116197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: BECAUSE HE'S A GOOD JEW
< 1295116208 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Yeah, but he'll give us less horrific stories if he gets out of there, and that's worth anything.
< 1295116250 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i suppose i would feel awful good about helping someone so desperately in need
< 1295116260 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and as long as you're buying the tix...
< 1295116270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1295116272 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: what's your address
< 1295116293 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somewhere near farmingdale ny obviously
< 1295116295 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i already asked him
< 1295116299 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wouldn't tell me
< 1295116301 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Farmingrusticruralpigagridaleshire.
< 1295116306 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no shit sherlock
< 1295116308 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just like the rest of you people WHO I THOUGHT WERE MY FRIENDS
< 1295116320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: ok we'll meet him AT the college then
< 1295116332 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, with some chloroform?
< 1295116333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know his name and what he looks like when dressed in a fursuit^Wblood drop costue
< 1295116335 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*costume
< 1295116336 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how my dad would react if he met you
< 1295116349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: We'll never find out, because he'd be unconscious before he realised.
< 1295116356 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your dad would like me
< 1295116360 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm very likable
< 1295116363 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :able babble
< 1295116368 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your dad would very much like me
< 1295116369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :babel abble
< 1295116383 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah he and quinn could have a beer together
< 1295116384 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because he likes people who are smarter than him, right?
< 1295116393 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah totally that's why he treats Sgeo like a king
< 1295116402 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know what his head looks like when he's not in a bloodsuit.
< 1295116409 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: okay, so, if we meet him at farmingdale, we need to throw him into the back of a truck
< 1295116415 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and drive him to a good college
< 1295116421 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295116423 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He wouldn't like me, because I am extremely insufferable.
< 1295116426 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go up to the first official-looking person we see
< 1295116427 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :say
< 1295116438 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"This poor man was in SUNY FARMINGDALE."
< 1295116443 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you rent the truck, i'll drive with my AMURRCAN driver's license
< 1295116444 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"And he didn't even KNOW the implications."
< 1295116450 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They will look horrified, and take him in.
< 1295116462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: how does that plan sound to you
< 1295116471 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's on
< 1295116474 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1295116480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll buy tickets tomorrow
< 1295116483 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, clearly you should chloroform him because you are stunted by malnourishment and as such he will suspect nothing.
< 1295116487 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why don't people kidnap each other just for giggles anymore
< 1295116490 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just to see the look on the poor official looking person's face
< 1295116502 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: SGEO KNOWS WHAT IT'S LIKE TO BE STUNTED BY MALNOURISHMENT
< 1295116505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i miss the good ol' days
< 1295116525 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's true.  sgeo is mentally malnourished in farmingdale
< 1295116537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :09:17:16  We vote with student riots in the U.K.
< 1295116540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be the greatest voting system
< 1295116548 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, naw, elliott is physically malnourished due to the Harrying of the North.
< 1295116549 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"WE DEMAND HIGHER PENSIONS FOR THE ELDERLY"
< 1295116579 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that...is how politics works in the U.S.
< 1295116587 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but are they all students
< 1295116592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and do they actually count as votes
< 1295116602 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, of course not
< 1295116605 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :votes are worth nothing
< 1295116612 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :riots actually accomplish things
< 1295116634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suggest a riot on sgeo's house
< 1295116642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly because i dunno how you'd vote in sgeo's house
< 1295116673 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's easy
< 1295116674 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, votes are made by bludgeoning Sgeo's father and stepmother.
< 1295116678 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we all go in there
< 1295116688 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Sgeo doesn't live with his stepmother.
< 1295116693 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and we say "we're all having a vote on whether sgeo has to transfer"
< 1295116698 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: THINGS I AM RAPIDLY TIRING OF: Remakes of random music in Minecraft.
< 1295116699 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we'll even let his parents vote too
< 1295116714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only his dad gets a vote
< 1295116717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait does Sgeo get to vote
< 1295116718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah
< 1295116719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously
< 1295116722 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not tired of those yet
< 1295116725 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, OK, different sides of Sgeo's father's body.
< 1295116750 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: let's be fair and let everyone in the household vote.  there can't be more than 5 of them and there are at least 20 of us...
< 1295116759 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: isn't it just Sgeo and his father.
< 1295116763 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you what we're going to vote
< 1295116767 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wouldn't know
< 1295116776 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if so, they can both vote, why not?
< 1295116795 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would hate to be accused of being unfair
< 1295116798 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just me and my dad
< 1295116803 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes it easier
< 1295116805 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bye, going to meet up with KT-AT
< 1295116809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh
< 1295116816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: if you moved
< 1295116818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could move
< 1295116820 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CLOSER TO KTAT
< 1295116834 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1295116849 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: So I've been thinking about yellowstone (Notch feckin stole blue for lapis).
< 1295116855 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, PRETEND SHE KIDNAPPED YOU
< 1295116876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The opening of this video is the most amazing thing ever. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ewFrgDPCgGA
< 1295116887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Watch it. You will not regret it.
< 1295116937 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, :D
< 1295117065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=opuQmQy87x4
< 1295117118 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: fog is a wonderful thing
< 1295117394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I have an idea for an RNG in Minecraft.
< 1295117403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in, using only existing blocks.
< 1295117429 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are already some pretty compact ones.
< 1295117485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Um, what?
< 1295117491 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: AFAIK nobody has made an RNG in Minecraft before.
< 1295117493 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I mean --
< 1295117496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: One that seeds itself.
< 1295117507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e., if you run the circuit multiple times, you'll get different results.
< 1295117510 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's that one that was used for the creepy door.
< 1295117513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even if you restore a save.
< 1295117519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: What door? Also, it probably had a predefined seed.
< 1295117563 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A friend elsewhere has just said that Chrome logs your browsing history to Google.
< 1295117573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your friend is wrong.
< 1295117591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See Preferences -> Under the Bonnet for an enumeration of all the communication Chrome does to Google.
< 1295117592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tl;dr:
< 1295117593 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I see, the dispenser is a block
< 1295117602 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tohught it was some funny trick with the smelter
< 1295117602 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When you put stuff in the address bar it tells Google, to get search results there.
< 1295117614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It also uses the phishing/malware protection that, sure, sends domain names.
< 1295117618 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But they aren't logged.
< 1295117625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And... when you get an error page it asks Google for some likely results.
< 1295117628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All of these are disableable.
< 1295117645 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: If he disagrees, tell him to point you to the line in the source code where it communicates with Google.
< 1295117693 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is it?
< 1295117699 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ?
< 1295117748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I am VERY UPSET that you are not asking me about my amazing RNG idea!
< 1295117761 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, OK, go on.
< 1295117765 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :me too, because i was too lazy to ask myself
< 1295117779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dispensers throw items a seemingly random distance.
< 1295117785 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Surround a dispenser with wooden pressure plates.
< 1295117786 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Set it off.
< 1295117793 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Use the resulting pressure plate patterns.
< 1295117804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Issues: (1) Can't reset automatically, AFAIK.
< 1295117807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(2) ?
< 1295117814 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :non-uniform
< 1295117817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, you'd just use the result as a seed.
< 1295117819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: naturally
< 1295117822 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd have to account for that
< 1295117835 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by weighting the value of each plate or whatever
< 1295117849 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzERWnFoW54&feature=related
< 1295117869 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fucking kiershar.
< 1295117883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it's because of minute lag in the redstone system.
< 1295117887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vs. the game clock or something.
< 1295117890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea.
< 1295117896 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Basically, yes.
< 1295117907 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where dou find all this redstone stuff..
< 1295117911 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: But if redstone wasn't buggy like that, then my idea would still work!
< 1295117914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: kiershar knows all.
< 1295117945 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295118052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=1021&t=114491
< 1295118060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: This pack looks awesome.
< 1295118139 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there should be a university that has a program in game physics, that is, the whole program is just about reverse-engineering games in-game. would make much more sense than just physics, because instead of one uninteresting universe, you'd have all kinds of universes.
< 1295118222 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and minecraft cosmology, we did a bit of that here the other day
< 1295118233 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sociology of lemmings
< 1295118243 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :biology of Dogz
< 1295118248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Wow, Optimine is great.
< 1295118250 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(by editing the config files)
< 1295118264 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :far/fancy without my fan going to 100%
< 1295118299 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: those topics make sense within this universe, but i'm not sure biology of games would be very a coherent field
< 1295118305 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by physics, i meant all natural sciences
< 1295118307 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wishes BiomeTerrain worked.
< 1295118345 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, maybe it might.
< 1295118548 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not even kidding about that in-game experimentation thing, i never understood the point of finding out stuff about this particular universe, it doesn't get much less interesting than this
< 1295118581 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"hey you can move around, and if you work for hours you can make an object that's slightly better suited for bashing containers open"
< 1295118582 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The genetics in Creature is pretty complex, from what I've read
< 1295118586 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least as far as games go
< 1295118588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Oh boy. There's a bloom filter fort he GLSL shaders mod :P
< 1295118591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: Don't make Sgeo start
< 1295118596 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...than your hand
< 1295118620 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: and even better, you actually get to try them out
< 1295118625 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unlike on earth
< 1295118648 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, you can do it on earth, too
< 1295118652 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :technically yes
< 1295118653 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It just takes longer than a day
< 1295118657 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can also build a computer in minecraft
< 1295118664 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who the fuck would, after it's been tested once, tho
< 1295118665 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I've read
< 1295118671 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well
< 1295118673 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For instance
< 1295118678 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could make a MUSIC BOX
< 1295118692 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got so lost my saved game as become 20 megabytes
< 1295118709 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh
< 1295118724 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I try not to wander too far if I don't have a tunnel near
< 1295118741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=107720 YESSSSS
< 1295118750 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, only?
< 1295118765 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, my local world1 is about 100 MB iirc
< 1295118781 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :world2 and world3 are about 25-30 MB iirc
< 1295118781 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mine is only 8 so far :c
< 1295118781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Oh, it has hardcoded side-grass. Lame.
< 1295118782 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: O_O
< 1295118789 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(each)
< 1295118790 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But then again, I do spend a time making my lair pretty
< 1295118804 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, my local test server world: 110 MB
< 1295118825 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: what the hell do you *do*? :P
< 1295118844 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, build (mega-scale). Explore. Spelunk
< 1295118848 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool
< 1295118851 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, remember I play on peaceful.
< 1295118871 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You pansy :V
< 1295118871 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, night is just a minor light level inconvenience to me thus
< 1295118885 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah, well sure :P
< 1295118911 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You need to man up, and spend every night cowering in fear in your lair!
< 1295118916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: try mcregion to get smaller files
< 1295118918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well
< 1295118920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also speed things up
< 1295118925 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: optimine + mcregion = awesome fast
< 1295118965 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTF a creeper just jumped off a cliff to get me
< 1295118972 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, ouch
< 1295118997 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He is a suicide bomber, j-invariant
< 1295119000 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does he care!
< 1295119015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=107720
< 1295119015 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, idea: creepers able to build 1x1 towers of dirt to reach you
< 1295119016 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1295119018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=107720
< 1295119019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ermmfsdogmsgflk
< 1295119022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X32nuDEvw-4
< 1295119031 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all enemies should be able to mine and build just like you
< 1295119032 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ofc
< 1295119037 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh
< 1295119056 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :think how neato, you'd never be safe if they get your scent
< 1295119078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :optimine + mcregion + mipmapping + better light = fuck yeah
< 1295119083 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if you walk on the surface during the day, they'll start digging near that area
< 1295119091 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, if you are inside a obsidian structure?
< 1295119094 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, with no door
< 1295119097 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you are safe
< 1295119098 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well you basically have to be
< 1295119100 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you need something special to mine those bricks tht look like coal but white?
< 1295119105 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what
< 1295119107 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHY IS THIS #minecraft
< 1295119107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ???
< 1295119109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coal but white?
< 1295119110 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :screenshot
< 1295119112 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you're safe unless they find diamond
< 1295119123 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, hah
< 1295119131 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they have the whole night to look for it
< 1295119132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Phantom_Hoover just scared me into thinking that accidentally today
< 1295119135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: imo i think just zombies should mine
< 1295119135 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, you can mine away obsidian at lower than that
< 1295119140 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :creepers explode, skeletons fire arrows, zombies mine
< 1295119146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after all they look like us and we can mine, and have no special power now
< 1295119147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'s only logical
< 1295119148 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, just you won't get any obsidian blocks dropped
< 1295119155 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :think about it, every night, a thousand creatures are born that have all the powers of a player, that try to kill you
< 1295119159 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They are zombies, though
< 1295119164 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You would need like
< 1295119166 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Evil dudes
< 1295119168 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not dead people
< 1295119191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: They can move and jump and punch, so they can mine.
< 1295119194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(They punch you)
< 1295119215 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Back.
< 1295119221 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: except somehow i think they would necessarily be a bit less smart than the player
< 1295119232 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Should I enable Better Grass or not.
< 1295119238 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SO HARD TO DECIDE
< 1295119238 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, alternatively
< 1295119243 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I SOMEHOW just got a stack of 65
< 1295119244 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can try it multiplayer
< 1295119244 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how
< 1295119246 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And wage war
< 1295119260 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : i'm not even kidding about that in-game experimentation thing, i never understood the point of finding out stuff about this particular universe, it doesn't get much less interesting than this
< 1295119263 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, what?
< 1295119280 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We don't even know how it works, and what we do know about that is very interesting.
< 1295119305 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For a start, a fair bit of new mathematics has come from physics.
< 1295119309 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the actual dynamics are not at all interesting
< 1295119313 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(In modern times.)
< 1295119325 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, define "interesting".
< 1295119339 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a bit subjective, but i'm sure you all agree
< 1295119349 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why people play minecraft instead of football
< 1295119358 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, erm, what is so boring about quantum physics?
< 1295119381 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quantum physics is not something you can actually do stuff with
< 1295119390 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, you can
< 1295119393 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like
< 1295119395 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EVERYTHING
< 1295119395 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you guys talking about reality?
< 1295119399 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or minecraft?
< 1295119399 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, if you've built a computer in minecraft
< 1295119401 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: HOLY FUCK CREEPER IN THE DAY
< 1295119431 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Day creepers are the worst man
< 1295119434 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, the essential reason that we study the way this universe works rather than artificial ones is because a) this one is the one we actually live in and b) we don't actually know how this one works, unlike any artificial ones we make.
< 1295119434 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or
< 1295119440 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a day creeper just kille dme
< 1295119444 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Natural caves creeprs :c
< 1295119457 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When I die, I'm not getting my stuff bck
< 1295119465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was day on the FIRST DAY
< 1295119467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably from a cave
< 1295119467 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: we certainly do not know how the artificial ones work either
< 1295119476 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not on a macro level
< 1295119477 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, yes, we do.
< 1295119480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: GoL
< 1295119481 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tell me how it works
< 1295119483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on a macro level
< 1295119484 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As a species, at least.
< 1295119494 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so hey
< 1295119496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some mod i have
< 1295119498 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no one really knows anything about gol
< 1295119499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :has evidently fixed side grass
< 1295119499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but
< 1295119499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er
< 1295119502 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And working bottom-up is not what we are doing with reality.
< 1295119503 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/YlDro.png
< 1295119504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :badly
< 1295119507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDD
< 1295119508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder what did it
< 1295119511 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is extremely obvious.
< 1295119633 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but what are interesting are the methods of going top-down, and how simple things turn into macro-things. both can be done separately with artificial models, except you don't have to own a university to be able to do that, and you're not restricted by whatever god chose to include!
< 1295119642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The most recent update was on January 15th, and is henceforth known as the Community Appeasement Grab Bag Edition MK II. This update adds nearly 100 new tiles and skins, for the 1.2 beta patch. "
< 1295119645 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nearly 100????
< 1295119692 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, innumerable variants.
< 1295119707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oak is the normal tree type, right?
< 1295119711 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I looked at the customiser, and it had added a Chinese theme.
< 1295119720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Omg, finally, I can replace the fucking fugly birch tree bark.
< 1295119779 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ARGH MY SAVE DISAPPEARED ENTIRELY
< 1295119779 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: pastebin.ca has been for over a week... Is there any chance you could upload your BF Joust interpreter elsewhere?
< 1295119782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: :-(
< 1295119785 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :BeholdMyGlory
< 1295119787 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Save of what?
< 1295119790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I don't get the problems you do.
< 1295119791 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minecraft.
< 1295119792 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: MC.
< 1295119797 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic: use egojoust, it's fairer
< 1295119798 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm hitting every edge case!
< 1295119808 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, you have jumped on the bandwagon?
< 1295119810 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't get on the server
< 1295119814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes, I helped him pirate it.
< 1295119816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's not updated yet.
< 1295119820 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, what?
< 1295119824 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, snap to it.
< 1295119826 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: People who like dark wood textures have a brain disease: discuss.
< 1295119826 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, I saw you join
< 1295119828 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then part
< 1295119838 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, downgrade minecraft and use a non-updating launcher
< 1295119839 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I use the dark wood textures!
< 1295119840 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's my next purchase when I have expendable income.
< 1295119842 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right so i should've prevented update as well? shit
< 1295119848 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Umm, why do you hate humanity?
< 1295119848 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: naw
< 1295119850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I haven't
< 1295119854 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: just play locally for now
< 1295119859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the update is well worth it.
< 1295119863 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but playing locally is totally gay!
< 1295119864 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay
< 1295119866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: (Actually I'm going to try dark wood.)
< 1295119867 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what, exactly, is wrong with dark wood?
< 1295119878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Do you use the brick-planks or the line-planks?
< 1295119895 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: *Part* of the problem is that Minecraft and an IME do not interact at all.
< 1295119897 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On-the-line.
< 1295119901 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: So disable the IME :P
< 1295119909 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yeah, I closed it.
< 1295119910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I'll try it ... this once...
< 1295119927 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, which sandstone texture should I use?
< 1295119929 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: But, yeah. That's only going to come up for East Asian-language-speakers.
< 1295119933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I haven't got there yet!
< 1295119941 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295119947 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Moar sign options!
< 1295119948 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I group them only because their *technological* requirements are very similar)
< 1295119951 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good thing too, I don't like the bordered-sign.
< 1295119959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*bordered sign.
< 1295119963 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so umm, can i change textures by just changing some sort of pic files
< 1295119965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: DO YOU USE LIGHT OR DARK STONE
< 1295119975 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dark, obviously.
< 1295119977 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you want to make your own pack?
< 1295119980 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Why obviously.
< 1295119982 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1295119984 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do
< 1295119991 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, because light is unspeakably hideous.
< 1295119998 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need some iron
< 1295119999 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You are plunged into an ocean of beige.
< 1295120001 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Texture_Pack
< 1295120007 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: look at that list of modifiable files
< 1295120011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: copy them all out of minecraft.jar
< 1295120013 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: make a zip file
< 1295120015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: put them all in
< 1295120017 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :name it something
< 1295120020 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copy it into a new folder
< 1295120023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :%APPDATA/.minecraft/texturepacks
< 1295120027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and edit terrain.png inside the zip
< 1295120031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also other files, but terrain.png is all the blocks
< 1295120042 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you _can_ change them direct in the jar but this is more maintainable
< 1295120055 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, beige is nice
< 1295120057 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I... need a screenshot of your setup with both stone and wood, because it sounds horrifically dark.
< 1295120059 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, remember that stupid basic texture pack for slow computers.
< 1295120064 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, that sounds like *seconds* of work
< 1295120070 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it's no darker than the default.
< 1295120076 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently you can use a stone pickaxe to get iron
< 1295120077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I NEED SCREENSHOT (also, wood is).
< 1295120089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Dude, I found iron on my third in-game day...
< 1295120094 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You are mining terribly :P
< 1295120117 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1295120184 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, sec.
< 1295120200 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minecraft: http://i.imgur.com/ZODJz.gif
< 1295120246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so is your texture pack done
< 1295120257 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://imgur.com/7kp9M
< 1295120271 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: THINGS THAT ARE NOT IN THAT PICTURE: Stone
< 1295120315 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it's 30m up from the ground. Of course there's no stone.
< 1295120324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: But I asked for stone!
< 1295120332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DISAPPOINTED PLEASE GIVE SCREENSHOT WITH STONE
< 1295120335 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, where IS that?
< 1295120341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, SSP.
< 1295120356 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, http://imgur.com/B7BTZ
< 1295120358 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so can i have alpha color everywhere
< 1295120362 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better than the ocean of beige.
< 1295120371 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: looks like gravel
< 1295120373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: not on every block i don't think
< 1295120383 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: with leaves you can have full alpha, dunno about half
< 1295120387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and ice is half-transparent or whatever
< 1295120392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: btw changing water/lava does not work
< 1295120398 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need to use this fancy mcpatcher thing to do that but whatever
< 1295120410 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: also the blocks at the bottom are the digging animation, you can use any greyscale there
< 1295120418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*mining animation
< 1295120435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: So ocean of grey > ocean of beige? :P
< 1295120440 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes.
< 1295120445 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Beige is the wost colour.
< 1295120448 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*worst
< 1295120456 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I like beige. Wait, do you use dark cobblstone too?
< 1295120459 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*cobblestone
< 1295120481 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless you're a tetrachromat, and since that requires you to be female, there's not much chance of that.
< 1295120482 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes.
< 1295120496 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Phantom_Hoover: I like beige. Wait, do you use dark cobblstone too? <-- I like beige as well
< 1295120500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: We are ... no longer friends.
< 1295120502 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also,
< 1295120503 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :alise
< 1295120505 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TOTALLY FEMALE
< 1295120507 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :elliott
< 1295120513 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, _chromosomally_ female.
< 1295120527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got chromosome reassignment surgery.
< 1295120537 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295120544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And became a tetrachromat in the process!
< 1295120560 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so clearly you regressed to a zygote and regrew?
< 1295120573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I think that's a fetish, but no.
< 1295120576 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They changed them in-place.
< 1295120583 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, your eyes?
< 1295120589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My chromosomes.
< 1295120593 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even then.
< 1295120596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So my eyes changed obviously, because they had new chromosomes now.
< 1295120598 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not how biology works.
< 1295120611 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh really? Then why am I a tetrachromat?
< 1295120640 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your body doesn't go "oh, look, the DNA changed. Must bring phenotype up to date, then."
< 1295120684 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes it does.
< 1295120686 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I want Lapis Lazuli ground into a powder for dyes." Ooh...
< 1295120721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: What redstone wire do you use?
< 1295120725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The ornate one looks cool.
< 1295120738 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I switched to it because I'm a sucker for ornateness.
< 1295120753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Hopefully you can agree that the Painterly chests and doors are hideous, though.
< 1295120761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU CANNOT DO THAT IN 16 PIXELS WITHOUT LOOKING HIDEOUS
< 1295120771 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The ornate ones?
< 1295120782 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. Which is all of them.
< 1295120793 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the light wood ones are good
< 1295120798 0 :Wamanuz5!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295120819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Give me Chinese-style windows." UGLIEST
< 1295120826 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Which sandstone option is most realistic.
< 1295120832 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the chests and doors are nice on the default.
< 1295120842 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I went for bricks since I'm used to seeing it used for that.
< 1295120851 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Original cloth of woven cloth?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!
< 1295120852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*or
< 1295120866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Smooth-topped?
< 1295120879 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Brick topped.
< 1295120883 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm considering changing that.
< 1295120896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Smooth-topped sandstone columns look nice... but I'll stick with the default for now.
< 1295120903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT WHICH CLOTH
< 1295120912 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the woven cloth.
< 1295120931 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stitched-edge.
< 1295120946 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Personally "I would like BARONS DEF CHARGER'S woven cloth texture", even despite the name.
< 1295120956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: That's the one I've been usin' too.
< 1295120957 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I want a metal creeper insignia ornate monster spawner cage."
< 1295120958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YES PLEASE.
< 1295120975 0 :Wamanuz4!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1295120996 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Change my wood door into an unstained light wood door." ;; I would use this one if it were darker.
< 1295121055 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Chocolate cake, I hope.
< 1295121061 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I want my sugar in a bag like civilized people."
< 1295121061 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What? No.
< 1295121071 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Are you even human?
< 1295121075 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Given that cocoa beans are a probable addition.
< 1295121085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: *The Minecraft cake is chocolate*.
< 1295121088 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, the cake in Portal is chocolate.
< 1295121094 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ...it is?
< 1295121101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To which?
< 1295121113 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both.
< 1295121133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well, Notch *said* it was chocolate, and the sponge is dark enough for it.
< 1295121139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And yes, the cake in Portal is chocolate.
< 1295121140 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://theknittingdefective.typepad.com/.a/6a0115714ad401970c011572419026970b-800wi
< 1295121152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better shot: http://honestcake.files.wordpress.com/2010/02/portal_and_there_will_be_cake.jpg
< 1295121171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT PAINTING OPTIONS DO YOU USE
< 1295121179 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That looks like a plastic cake.
< 1295121180 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Monet.
< 1295121187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use pastel bedrock.
< 1295121195 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Urgh, ugly.
< 1295121203 0 :pingveno!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out
< 1295121206 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Give me an ink sac, straight from the squid." Disgusting; I'll take the splatter.
< 1295121246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck you, default choice, my chickens are CHICKENS.
< 1295121279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :People who use glowing-eyed creepers are abortions: discuss.
< 1295121294 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use glowing-eyed creepers!
< 1295121294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact, people who use anything other than "Give me a Creeper that looks more like the original!" are probably Nazis.
< 1295121300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: YOU ARE THE WORST PERSON.
< 1295121320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Blue sea squid <3
< 1295121330 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HAPPY CHEST
< 1295121332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*GHAST
< 1295121353 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do NOT confuse chests and ghasts.
< 1295121370 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: What game cursor do you use.
< 1295121375 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pixel.
< 1295121381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I hate you.
< 1295121385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CROSS DAMMIT CROSS
< 1295121396 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :JESUS DIED ON THE CROSS
< 1295121401 0 :pingveno!~pingveno@c-98-246-133-8.hsd1.or.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295121431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LATEST UPDATE:
< 1295121431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1.1.10_01 - Fixed custom water/lava for beta 1.1_02
< 1295121437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gee, I wonder if it'll work on 1.2_01.
< 1295121439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LET'S FIND OUT
< 1295121484 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The custom water/lava options are disabled.
< 1295121484 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't.
< 1295121485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am sad.
< 1295121492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll use default water for now ...
< 1295121516 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but anyway, that basic texture back thing has been taken down because noöne donated to it.
< 1295121519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hope whatever's causing that fucked-up side grass goes away.
< 1295121521 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: :-D
< 1295121533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh god, the brick background on the title screen is ugly.
< 1295121617 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The "radios" are jukeboxes, right?
< 1295121623 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : People who use glowing-eyed creepers are abortions: discuss.   I use glowing-eyed creepers! <-- i am starting to see a trend here...
< 1295121632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover is the worst person.
< 1295121661 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I left them as jukeboxes because I am lazy.
< 1295121676 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ornate dispenser so ugly oh my god
< 1295121691 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION whistles
< 1295121695 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I want an industrial simple dispenser." is nice.
< 1295121723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You at least use "I want cobblestone with larger individual stones.", surely?
< 1295121725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not the DEFAULT?
< 1295121736 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes.
< 1295121741 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, wait.
< 1295121742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phew.
< 1295121744 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh god.
< 1295121753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: And marble half blocks?
< 1295121755 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I use tiles.
< 1295121760 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And marble half-blocks.
< 1295121767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least you're human in one area.
< 1295121779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Tell me you agree that Phantom_Hoover's texture pack options are insane.
< 1295121782 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover is half-creeper
< 1295121796 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:05 < AliG> I is here with my man and we ares chattin about something well  important, math.
< 1295121799 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:05 < AliG> What is math?
< 1295121801 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott
< 1295121801 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: "I want to use the flat Painterly lapis lazuli block." yes?
< 1295121805 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: xD
< 1295121814 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, slab.
< 1295121823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I think you should die.
< 1295121828 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I picked all the dyes in bowls, before you ask.
< 1295121833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quickly, in fact.
< 1295121842 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: he said die, not dye
< 1295121848 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295121871 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION swats oerjan ----###
< 1295121889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GRR, that stupid grass problem hasn't fixed itself. I need to repatch everything.
< 1295121911 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Holy shit, what coal ore do you use, the default dark stone coal ore is amazingly bad.
< 1295121916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has... yellow edges...
< 1295121943 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coal with extra sulphur, clearly
< 1295121955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mipmapping + painterly = love
< 1295121965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Game looks fucking amazing.
< 1295121994 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I used the default coal ore because it was that or beige or strangely machined coal chunks.
< 1295122048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Dude, it's grey, not beige.
< 1295122066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can I just say now that Painterly dirt tiles terribly.
< 1295122149 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is pastebin.ca down for good?
< 1295122156 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it hasn't worked on any of my recent attempts to access it
< 1295122196 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i doubt it
< 1295122200 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it was up only a few days ago
< 1295122211 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: filebin has been down forever, though
< 1295122258 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello
< 1295122276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: anyway, I implemented tsort for changesets
< 1295122286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: probably wildly inefficient
< 1295122292 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, I have installed Optimine, mipmapping, MCPATCHER, Better Light and Painterly.
< 1295122301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You don't need mcpatcher.
< 1295122303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it's lowercase.
< 1295122309 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why not?
< 1295122311 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Just put it in texturepacks?
< 1295122314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's native texture pack support now.
< 1295122319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mcpatcher is only required for custom water and lava.
< 1295122322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which don't work right now.
< 1295122324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And also HD packs.
< 1295122325 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It still does basic water and lava.
< 1295122326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which Painterly is not.
< 1295122330 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Animations that it.)
< 1295122334 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ...fail.
< 1295122335 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*is
< 1295122342 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it doesn't?
< 1295122342 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Those buttons just make it use the DEFAULT Minecraft water/lava.
< 1295122353 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SO BETRAYED
< 1295122354 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Until custom water/lava are reenabled, mcpatcher does nothing for non-HD packs.
< 1295122370 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does your side-grass get coloured weirdly, too?
< 1295122392 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's just Notch-quality engineering.
< 1295122423 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't use biome compliance unless you like ugliness.
< 1295122460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I *didn't*.
< 1295122470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: And it also happened with the default pack.
< 1295122486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The problem is that it's colouring the dirt parts too for some reason according to the biome.
< 1295122487 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Default is biome-compliant.
< 1295122508 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Otherwise, I have no idea what you're talking about.
< 1295122542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://i.imgur.com/YlDro.png
< 1295122544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: See?
< 1295122554 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's just you.
< 1295122561 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No, that's some mod.
< 1295122573 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, get rid of it!
< 1295122625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I INSTALLED THE SAME MODS AS YOU.
< 1295122628 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :green dirt looks nice imo
< 1295122647 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't know, then!
< 1295122651 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Anyway, you forgot mcregion.
< 1295122654 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Remove bin and try again!
< 1295122703 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :BeholdMyGlory
< 1295122776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck yeah, 64+64+20.
< 1295122777 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*clay.
< 1295122793 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295122863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Respawned - half the clay returned - but still in my inventory - fuck yea
< 1295122889 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clay is really only good as an æsthetic thing...
< 1295122891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Oh wow, it is comical how bad the game looks without mipmapping and Better Light.
< 1295122942 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I think that stint with side-grass-that-looks-like-pure-grass has convinced me that either Better Grass or Painterly's 1/1 grass option are awesome.
< 1295122976 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds
< 1295123038 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Do beaches usually have a ton of brown mushrooms on them?
< 1295123044 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No.
< 1295123053 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But sometimes you get a massive cluster.
< 1295123100 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295123111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Notch hasn't hired Scaevolus yet; discuss.
< 1295123128 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/f2wvt/is_this_a_secret_fallout_puzzle_it_looks_like_a/
< 1295123128 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Scaevolus?
< 1295123128 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1295123130 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont know
< 1295123131 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but
< 1295123137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The author of Optimine and mcregion.
< 1295123143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: A part of Optimine was included in 1.2.
< 1295123144 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah.
< 1295123147 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe its not a message and is just a bunch of keys for lockers..
< 1295123157 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something like that
< 1295123162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: PSHT WHAT SILLINESS
< 1295123200 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, if it IS a code, surely you could figure it out pretty quickly, at least if it were binary, morse, baudot, ...
< 1295123225 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: >expecting intelligence from /r/gaming
< 1295123229 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true
< 1295123241 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : http://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/f2wvt/is_this_a_secret_fallout_puzzle_it_looks_like_a/ <-- nice myst reference in the comments :D
< 1295123247 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1295123263 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good thing its the first comment so i was guaranteed to see it as i read the comments.
< 1295123275 0 :Wamanuz5!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1295123316 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Wait what, MC can still read my McRegion save.
< 1295123333 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok its time to watch some lectures on the russian revolution
< 1295123346 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, more of a discussion
< 1295123379 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh. nevermind. this is boring and short
< 1295123379 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, conversion hasn't happened yet?
< 1295123388 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I started a new mcregion game.
< 1295123413 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm still getting FPS drops.
< 1295123461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Hmm, I'ma skip Better Grass, since Painterly has an equivalent as a texture option.
< 1295123474 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: (OK, so with Better Grass I'd get 2/3 instead of 1/1 when there's dirt below, but I always thought that looked weird.)
< 1295123487 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Putting dirt below a grass block should not cause it to lose grass!
< 1295123509 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: im making a tagging app
< 1295123513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: for what
< 1295123641 0 :ais523_!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295123650 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Disconnected by services
< 1295123650 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Dude, I just did it all from scratch.
< 1295123651 0 :ais523_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ais523
< 1295123665 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Optimine -> McRegion -> Mipmapping -> Better Light, in that order.
< 1295123673 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Side grass dirt is still biome-tinted.
< 1295123675 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523
< 1295123679 0 :Tritonio_GR!~TrT@athedsl-258916.home.otenet.gr JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295123682 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Disconnected by services
< 1295123697 0 :Mathnerd314_!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295123703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: how would you recommend handling the fact that there are different types of change? one type for files (lists of lines), one type for directories (sets of directory entries), etc...
< 1295123707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in scapegoat
< 1295123736 0 :Mathnerd314_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Mathnerd314
< 1295123797 0 :augur_!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295123805 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: *blink* mcpatcher JUST GOT UPDATED.
< 1295123809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*This very second*.
< 1295123814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has custom water/lava now.
< 1295123822 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: So tick custom water/lava, detick animated water/lava, and ENJOY
< 1295123824 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, elliott, if you said anything after my response i didnt see it
< 1295123825 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::(
< 1295123830 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott: im making a tagging app
< 1295123830 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : augur: for what
< 1295123852 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok so you didnt get my answer
< 1295123853 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what tagged: files, urls, text; what os: mac; what purpose: nothing does precisely what i like
< 1295123868 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hate tagging.
< 1295123878 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Disconnected by services
< 1295123885 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :augur
< 1295123888 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :taggint
< 1295123911 0 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-215-160.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295123918 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh?
< 1295123940 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how do you organize your ideas and stuff you find interesting and so forth?
< 1295123965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :irc :P ... in practice i use a file system
< 1295123969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in @ it's basically based on search
< 1295123993 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: FFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUU, it seems that mcpatcher's custom water/lava overrides mipmapping.
< 1295124035 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: So I'll have to copy the custom files into minecraft.jar myself.
< 1295124064 0 :p_q!~poiuy_qwe@69.157.44.226 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295124101 0 :cheater-!~cheater@g230230018.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295124158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, here's what I'll do: Optimine -> McRegion -> Mipmapping -> Better Light -> manual copy of custom water files. (If that does in fact work.)
< 1295124163 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait.
< 1295124167 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That won't solve the side grass issue.
< 1295124184 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: OK, seriously, screenshot some damn side-grass for me, I do not believe that you do not see the issue with these mods.
< 1295124193 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, i use a file system too, but my organizational habits arent well adapted to file systems
< 1295124193 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: What order did you install them in? You realise some of them overwrite the others?
< 1295124208 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no it doesn't.
< 1295124213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: Nobody's are. But nobody likes tagging either, and you'll slip doing it eventually.
< 1295124216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No it doesn't what?
< 1295124224 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: will not! :|
< 1295124230 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i used delicious right up to the end
< 1295124234 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was like four years worth
< 1295124240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :delicious still exists, you know
< 1295124255 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but its supposedly closing
< 1295124269 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split
< 1295124280 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split
< 1295124281 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split
< 1295124282 0 :Tritonio!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split
< 1295124308 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless they changed their plans
< 1295124308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: no it isn'
< 1295124308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :t
< 1295124309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yahoo are selling it
< 1295124309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which has always been the case
< 1295124310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ITT: believing everything you hear on reddit
< 1295124310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then not seeing follow-up posts
< 1295124311 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah ok, well they were supposedly just closing
< 1295124312 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :either way, i want tags for my files and for ideas too, not just links
< 1295124312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :based on one slide from a presentation that never actually said that.
< 1295124313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :files are useless.
< 1295124314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Do not what.
< 1295124315 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, mipmapping still works.
< 1295124333 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: files are useful!
< 1295124334 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have lots of them
< 1295124334 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so do you!
< 1295124335 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: They are not useful.
< 1295124344 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Please tell me what order you installed mods in.
< 1295124344 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not
< 1295124350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Also, be aware that I'm using the new mcpatcher which was updated at 8:25 pm.
< 1295124354 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is not the version you used.
< 1295124395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: http://catseye.tc/ehird/files-suck.html is a very whiny and very incomplete page, but it's more than you'd get out of me right now while I'm busy bugging Phantom_Hoover.
< 1295124396 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I used the mcpatcher which just came out.
< 1295124403 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"very whiny"
< 1295124406 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Are you going to give me the order of mods...?
< 1295124417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: Or so I hear. Apparently italics are whiny, I use a lot of them.
< 1295124435 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Optimine, mcregion, mipmapping, Better Light + Grass, mcpatcher.
< 1295124437 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was just commenting more on you commenting your own shit as whiny
< 1295124453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: I didn't think it was whiny until everyone informed me it was. :p
< 1295124461 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x3
< 1295124470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You mean that with Better Grass, which turns all the side of grass blocks into grass, you don't see tinted dirt? HOLY SHIT YOU'RE KIDDING ME
< 1295124472 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HOW AMAZING
< 1295124479 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe that's because there IS NO DIRT?
< 1295124484 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no, erm, no.
< 1295124489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: What.
< 1295124553 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better Grass leaves some blocks with the default side grass texture.
< 1295124555 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :These are fine.
< 1295124565 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: MATRIX DIRT?!
< 1295124575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Screenshot, please. Also, what checkboxes did you tick in mcpatcher?
< 1295124589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: BTW, I suspect Better Grass is still the culprit, in that it probably overwrites the offending code entirely.
< 1295124596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: Less talking, more reading!
< 1295124660 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295124681 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it sounds like you want an Alto.
< 1295124699 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: Yes, please.
< 1295124703 0 :MigoMipo_!~John@84-217-10-158.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295124703 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::)
< 1295124710 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: (Even Multics, the big behemoth predating Unix, had a form of orthogonal persistence.)
< 1295124710 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, i agree with everything you said.
< 1295124715 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1295124726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: And so you should use @!
< 1295124727 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Has someone told you that TeXnicard is used by writing Underload-like programs? I will tell you now that it is only partially true.
< 1295124730 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats @
< 1295124739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: My pipe-dream OS of amazingness.
< 1295124765 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: It got a remarkably solid design a while ago, which I then completely liquefied by thinking about it some more.
< 1295124771 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: checkboxes!
< 1295124777 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Can you use pipes with it?
< 1295124783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: No.
< 1295124788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Strictly forbidden.
< 1295124803 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: a friend of mine is creating an OS
< 1295124805 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is mulling it over
< 1295124813 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Then why did you call it pipe-dream OS? And how can it be used without pipes?
< 1295124817 0 :charlvn!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1295124817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: It's probably shit. @ has features such as being awesome, which is the opposite of the feature of being shit.
< 1295124828 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ive been pushing for a completely radical rethinking of how it should work
< 1295124829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=define:pipe-dream
< 1295124835 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Custom water, IIRC.
< 1295124844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: @ is what happens when you radically rethink radical rethinking.
< 1295124847 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically where everything is data-oriented instead of application oriented
< 1295124851 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It is important which animated box you ticked.
< 1295124856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: @ had that from version 0.1...
< 1295124856 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :outside the box
< 1295124863 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: good!
< 1295124865 0 :Wamanuz2!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295124869 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@ is INSIDE THE CARDBOARD COMPRISING THE BOX
< 1295124870 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, lava.
< 1295124872 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And fire.
< 1295124879 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: But not water? Hmm.
< 1295124886 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: How are you sure that mipmapping still functions?
< 1295124887 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what language are you writing it in?
< 1295124911 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes, because things in the distance look nice.
< 1295124916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: @lang. (I'm not kidding. Both @ and @lang are, of course, placeholder names; @ has also gone by ElliottOS in the past in here.)
< 1295124919 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You could just be blind.
< 1295124930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: OK, I'll retry in a minute...
< 1295124931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I still suspect Better Grass, though.
< 1295124931 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like to have many commands acting like filters so that you can use pipes for everything.
< 1295124940 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: whats @lang like
< 1295124947 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: You know Haskell?
< 1295124951 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a little!
< 1295124968 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: Imagine if Haskell decided to stop being practical and became completely and utterly hardcore, thus ensuring it could never reasonably interact with existing systems.
< 1295124973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: That's @lang.
< 1295124990 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought haskell WASNT practical :(
< 1295124998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: @ itself is actually written in two languages: x86-64 assembly, and @lang.
< 1295125019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: The assembly includes an efficient, parallel lazy specialiser for @lang (WARNING WARNING OPEN RESEARCH TOPIC WARNING).
< 1295125024 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1295125025 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: This comprises the implementation of @lang.
< 1295125034 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :k
< 1295125038 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: It also has task switching code and the security system.
< 1295125047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: Everything above that, including just about all hardware drivers, are written in @lang.
< 1295125065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed, in @lang, you can write to any memory address you want, so long as you have permission to.
< 1295125082 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Of course, you are unlikely to get such blanket permission; drivers will get permission to write to restricted regions of memory if they require it, but little else.)
< 1295125129 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: How much convincing do you need to redo it all without Better Grass to see if that's the cure?
< 1295125147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: You seem like you have lost interest!
< 1295125153 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have.
< 1295125160 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you would actually have to pay me.
< 1295125163 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: What did I say. :p
< 1295125175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: Was it "OPEN RESEARCH TOPIC"?
< 1295125178 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something other than nothing
< 1295125187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: Gee, thanks?
< 1295125189 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no i kid i kid
< 1295125198 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you answered the question.
< 1295125202 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;__; INSUFFICIENTLY
< 1295125217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: But there are so many INTERESTING DESIGN DECISIONS.
< 1295125274 0 :MigoMipo_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295125286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: I'm giving you ammo to make your friend redesign their OS here!
< 1295125331 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1295125341 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295125342 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host
< 1295125342 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295125353 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really
< 1295125385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: Psht, your tagging program is the worst ever, then. :p
< 1295125454 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1295125494 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1295125505 0 :p_q!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1295125517 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295125518 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit
< 1295125560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: I AM DISAPPOINTED IN YOU
< 1295125561 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@69.157.44.226 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295125575 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok?
< 1295125580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psht!
< 1295125590 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :?
< 1295125616 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott is #esoteric.
< 1295125624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, yes I am.
< 1295125634 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If he were not here, this channel would have no properties in common with the channel as it is.
< 1295125646 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Every predicate true of it now would be false, and vice versa.
< 1295125673 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: So if I left, the channel would not exist?
< 1295125692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :careful, you might say something you Kant
< 1295125701 0 :acetoline!~acetoline@125-237-12-196.jetstream.xtra.co.nz JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295125734 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would not exist, and the set of people in it would be the complement of the set of people currently in it.
< 1295125739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's try it out.
< 1295125741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :?
< 1295125790 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, the tunes.org logs still log this channel as it would be if elliott were still here.
< 1295125804 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295125804 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host
< 1295125804 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295125825 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295125827 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They do? Drat.
< 1295125834 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: you should probably join and then identify, not vice versa.
< 1295125836 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do?
< 1295125844 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett, huh?
< 1295125847 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: DUDE THAT WAS AWESOME
< 1295125851 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I have a theory. That theory is that mipmapping doesn't work, at all.
< 1295125855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: How do you know, you weren't here.
< 1295125859 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everything false was true and vice versa!  Except for some things.
< 1295125867 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes, it does.
< 1295125871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: Oh wait ... it briefly obeyed the property "is a gigantic space monster that eats everyone".
< 1295125872 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but the set of people in this channel was equal to {tswett}.
< 1295125875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It used to! But now it doesn't!
< 1295125877 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: OK, new theory.
< 1295125883 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course it did.
< 1295125883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mipmapping has to come before McRegion.
< 1295125896 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett, also, I should point out that I have no control over what XChat does.
< 1295125902 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes you do.
< 1295125905 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Specify a server password instead.
< 1295125962 0 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295125972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Phantom__Hoover (~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486) has joined #esoteric
< 1295125974 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit
< 1295126041 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295126049 0 :coppro!~scshunt@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295126052 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does mindmapping have something more to it than categorizing in treeform and being restricted to a small amount of data in nodes?
< 1295126061 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I swear. Mipmapping does nothing.
< 1295126061 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no
< 1295126061 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or
< 1295126065 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um why would you want to join before identifying, wouldn't that temporarily reveal the cloak
< 1295126070 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you talking about something other than the general concept :D
< 1295126071 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Oh, well NOW it does.
< 1295126076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: that's what he currently does
< 1295126077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: mipmapping
< 1295126080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not mindmapping
< 1295126083 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait what
< 1295126088 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295126090 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i read that as mindmapping every time
< 1295126093 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295126093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a 3d graphics thing
< 1295126104 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was kinda wondering why you'd be suddenly talking about that
< 1295126105 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you know when you look at far away stuff on minecraft... actually you don't since you use tiny
< 1295126108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if you've ever used far,
< 1295126111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if you move your mouse left to right
< 1295126113 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can see it warp around
< 1295126118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because of it scaling the texture down
< 1295126118 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i wanted to ask the question so didn't feel like googling for what you might actually mean
< 1295126125 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mipmapping just uses less pixels in the texture the further away it is
< 1295126128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meaning far-away stuff looks nice
< 1295126136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :less detailed, but nicer
< 1295126138 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when looking around
< 1295126149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(this warping is especially noticeable on the Stairs near spawn on the server)
< 1295126164 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: was tswett doing that opposite thing when he suggested it, then?
< 1295126173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Phantom_Hoover was suggesting the proper way
< 1295126174 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1295126177 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: tswett was suggesting the proper way
< 1295126178 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to Phantom_Hoover
< 1295126183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who was doin it rong
< 1295126188 0 :Ilari_antrcomp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out
< 1295126188 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out
< 1295126192 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is mipmapping the name of this technique, or some tool?
< 1295126194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari = Vorpal
< 1295126197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: name of the technique
< 1295126206 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because i think i've heard the term, maybe it was in that one book i read once
< 1295126213 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway that's kind of an obvious thing to do
< 1295126215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=128995
< 1295126222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not as simple as just activating mip-mapping.
< 1295126222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Initially it looked really bad because some blocks looked broken.
< 1295126222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Glass, for instance had black halos and was completely black in the distance.
< 1295126222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I fixed this by adjusting the alpha testing, so it discards everything with alpha < 0.5 instead of alpha=0.
< 1295126222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what remains is that glass almost disappears in the distance.
< 1295126226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then, water had a purple shade in the distance.
< 1295126228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The fix for that is somewhat of a compromise: I clamp the mipmapping level so there's always at least one pixel per texture.
< 1295126231 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so technical :P
< 1295126235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh it improves fps too
< 1295126237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very slightly
< 1295126259 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: The name is also derived from latin, so the technique is doubly awesome.
< 1295126275 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you sure :P
< 1295126287 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not really a technique, it's an obvious thing to do
< 1295126297 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It also eats a bit more texture memory, but, well, nowadays cards seem to have gigabytes of it.
< 1295126299 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh indeed it is
< 1295126305 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where does it come from
< 1295126314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: do you still use tronic
< 1295126319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okIn 3D computer graphics texture filtering, MIP maps (also mipmaps) are pre-calculated, optimized collections of images that accompany a main texture, intended to increase rendering speed and reduce aliasing artifacts. They are widely used in 3D computer games, flight simulators and other 3D imaging systems. The technique is known as mipmapping. The letters "MIP" in the name are an acronym of the Latin phrase multum in parvo, meaning "much in a
< 1295126319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :small space". Mipmaps need more space in memory. They also form the basis of wavelet compression.
< 1295126320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: In 3D computer graphics texture filtering, MIP maps (also mipmaps) are pre-calculated, optimized collections of images that accompany a main texture, intended to increase rendering speed and reduce aliasing artifacts. They are widely used in 3D computer games, flight simulators and other 3D imaging systems. The technique is known as mipmapping. The letters "MIP" in the name are an acronym of the Latin phrase multum in parvo, meaning "muc
< 1295126321 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :h in a small space". Mipmaps need more space in memory. They also form the basis of wavelet compression.
< 1295126327 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :worst name ever
< 1295126330 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MUCH IN A SMALL SPACE MAPS
< 1295126335 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was thinking i'd pay a couple thousand for a computer in february, SO I NEVER HAVE TO BUY A NEW ONE AGAIN
< 1295126341 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hope there isn't a flaw in my logic
< 1295126348 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :About gigabytes, or about it using more?
< 1295126354 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott:  Phantom_Hoover: you should probably join and then identify, not vice versa.
< 1295126355 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i can get parts for you, i'm GOOD at that!
< 1295126363 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i didn't do it for Phantom_Hoover because his budget was lame
< 1295126367 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm already paying a friend to do that
< 1295126367 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but a couple thousand euros i could do a lot with
< 1295126370 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DARN
< 1295126370 0 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295126375 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i'll do it for free, and am more awesome?
< 1295126383 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're killing small businesses
< 1295126384 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that work for free
< 1295126385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like me
< 1295126386 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he would do it for free
< 1295126389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is it working for free that's killing us
< 1295126390 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure
< 1295126395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Oh. Weird.
< 1295126435 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I haven't tried MC post the 1.2 update at all; so I'm not sure how to answer. Theoretically speaking "yes, I'm still using Tronic"; but on the other hand the updater will wipe that, so maybe "no" is closer.
< 1295126461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Well, only very few packs are updated for the beta, but yeah that was what I meant (are you using it as of last time you played).
< 1295126470 0 :Ilari_antrcomp!~user@2002:5870:38d7:1:20e:a6ff:fe6f:2288 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295126482 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was, yes.
< 1295126496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Information wants to be free!" -- obnoxious. slogan.
< 1295126502 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-10-158.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295126522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: OK, hypothesis. Mipmapping only works the first time you load a world.
< 1295126531 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: he _was_ talking about predicates reversing truth value at about the same time though
< 1295126541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: This theory holds up so far.
< 1295126579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ADDITIONAL FACT: Side-grass only looks weird in some biomes.
< 1295126579 0 :BMG!~behold@d83-183-183-70.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295126583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Travel to another, I bet you'll see the tinting.
< 1295126586 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A foresty one.
< 1295126600 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why is it that mipmapping makes ladders white?
< 1295126607 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What.
< 1295126617 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, canya travel to another biome for me?
< 1295126636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or even just compare grass block above dirt block.
< 1295126639 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The dirt will *not* be the same colour.
< 1295126703 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host
< 1295126703 0 :BMG!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295126708 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :BeholdMyGlory
< 1295126781 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1295126829 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://imgur.com/gkWnC
< 1295126833 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, IS THAT GOOD ENOUGH
< 1295126856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I blame Better Grass and holy shit whatever that four-block thing is, it is hideous, is that cobble?
< 1295126867 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Get rid of that.
< 1295126883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Your 1/1-side-grass is seemingly not mip mapped.
< 1295126895 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eh?
< 1295126917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Look at the side grass in the distance.
< 1295126922 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compare with the top grass.
< 1295126926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ho ho. Better Grass does indeed fix things.
< 1295126942 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...And?
< 1295126948 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looks mipmapped to me.
< 1295126956 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stuff in the distance is fine.
< 1295126969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The side of grass blocks aren't.
< 1295126975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wait, they are.
< 1295126978 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Verified locally.
< 1295127131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Views like this make me want biome-compliant grass working properly on the side. Badly. http://ompldr.org/vNzA1Nw
< 1295127134 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(WARNING: PRETTY)
< 1295127199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover exploded from the pretty.
< 1295127235 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295127310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You get to appreciate it, then: http://ompldr.org/vNzA1Nw
< 1295127466 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION explodes too.
< 1295127537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: How much is it bothering you that I didn't pick up the pumpkins beforehand?
< 1295127999 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295128025 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Guest93753
< 1295128110 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello, Guest93753.
< 1295128123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Can you please please please get ineiros to the requisite level of drunkenness to update to the stock beta server tonight?
< 1295128136 0 :aloril_!~aloril@dsl-tkubrasgw3-fe7ef900-153.dhcp.inet.fi JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295128146 0 :Guest93753!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host
< 1295128146 0 :Guest93753!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295128181 0 :Guest93753!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Phantom__Hoover
< 1295128185 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :phantom ho kekekekekeke
< 1295128237 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I was supposed to, on Friday, but he went and got some sort of a flu thing and was too feverish for that.
< 1295128243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: I just can't stop taking screenshots... http://ompldr.org/vNzA1Yg This is how Minecraft should come by default.
< 1295128247 0 :aloril!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds
< 1295128250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Fast, CPU-friendly, and absurdly pretty.
< 1295128271 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I still get the FPS drops even with mcregion.
< 1295128275 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now we just need shader-powered colour light, like in that beautiful screenshot of the unreleased shader with red redstone torch light...
< 1295128281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Well, it can't be perfect.
< 1295128289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I definitely couldn't play with all these fancy mods seamlessly before.
< 1295128299 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh?
< 1295128303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ?
< 1295128304 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something to make minecrafpt faster?
< 1295128311 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=132717
< 1295128314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: and also install mcregion:
< 1295128318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=120160
< 1295128327 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want these graphics :D
< 1295128329 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: (updates will make your saves inaccessible but there's a conversion tool so you can use them)
< 1295128338 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: those graphics are what me and Phantom__Hoover just got working basically :P
< 1295128347 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: how good is your gpu/cpu?
< 1295128353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: do you play on Far/Fancy?
< 1295128363 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno
< 1295128363 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no
< 1295128373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: can you do Far/Fancy without your computer lagging?
< 1295128377 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :failing that, Normal/Fancy?
< 1295128388 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Far/Dandy.
< 1295128395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you can't play Normal/Fancy smoothly, it's very unlikely you'll be able to get all these mods working smoothly, even with optimine and mcregion
< 1295128405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although mipmapping helps a bit
< 1295128462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: basically: Install Optimine; install McRegion; install mipmapping; install Better Light and Better Grass; use mcpatcher on a customised Painterly Pack, check Custom Water, Animated Lava and Animated Fire, decheck the rest. If you have problems with any step in this just ask me for help. :p
< 1295128485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have to say, it's well worth it.
< 1295128497 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ty
< 1295128505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also playing fullscreened helps for prettiness. :p
< 1295128520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: the checkboxes in mcpatcher are very unintuitive btw but those are the options you want
< 1295128663 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Might update in the morning.
< 1295128680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: It's very, very early morning!
< 1295128691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: BTW, after this last hMod release, there'll be no more.
< 1295128710 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's all going to the "super-fancy" vapourware pre-pre-pre-alpha Bukkit.
< 1295128718 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's past midnight here, so it qualifies as a morning.
< 1295128723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: See?
< 1295128726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should update RIGHT NOW
< 1295128745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Problem solved. Starting a world in full-screen doesn't do mipmapping. Seriously.
< 1295128747 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wtf. :p
< 1295128795 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ODzO7Lz_pw
< 1295128801 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MC IRL with a toaster.
< 1295128843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TED talks overstep my upsettingly-short attention span.
< 1295128846 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry.
< 1295128960 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: 50-60 fps standing still, 30-40 fps moving. Booyah.
< 1295128981 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TL;DR: it takes the best part of human civilisation as it presently stands to make a toaster.
< 1295129010 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh.
< 1295129017 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Wait. You don't use view bobbing, do you?
< 1295129022 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do.
< 1295129022 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, I watched that video. Awesome.
< 1295129029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: ... how do you live with yourself?
< 1295129049 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It looks so mechanical when you just glide over the ground.
< 1295129200 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295129214 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295129308 0 :charlvn!~charlvn@bot.za.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295129326 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love the way he uses moulds made of a log.
< 1295129358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: 16 PUMPKINS IN ONE FIELD
< 1295129462 0 :Tritonio_GR!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295129488 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295129492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: I'm trying out a new playstyle.
< 1295129496 0 :Tritonio_GR!~TrT@athedsl-258916.home.otenet.gr JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295129510 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hopefully now it will not disconnect due to server problem.
< 1295129512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: Mariner.
< 1295129535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: I spend my time in the ocean, searching out new lands; in the day, I land on them, take useful materials, and sail on.
< 1295129560 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Do you mean, you steal them?
< 1295129565 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What?
< 1295129569 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Steal what?
< 1295129588 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Steal the materials.
< 1295129598 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Nobody has laid claim to them, so how can it be stealing?
< 1295129621 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Are you sure?
< 1295129635 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't be so sure.
< 1295129647 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: There are no houses, or indeed any signs of building, or any change to the landscape at all; no signs; nothing.
< 1295129659 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So if someone has laid claim to them, they haven't exactly made it explicit.
< 1295129661 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And what kind of materials are they?
< 1295129673 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wood from trees. Coal. Iron. Stone.
< 1295129707 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, don't steal too much of them, otherwise it will become empty and the trees and stuff can be important.
< 1295129720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I replant the saplings from the trees so that more grow.
< 1295129748 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: OK. But please do not cut *all* the trees at once, at least!!
< 1295129754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't.
< 1295129759 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good.
< 1295129811 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://davepenguin.imgur.com/the_candle
< 1295129952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seen it. It is cool.
< 1295130006 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3kRGx--e-w
< 1295130008 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
< 1295130030 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Has anyone played A.I. Wars?
< 1295130132 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic: I have not. I do not know what that is.
< 1295130142 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: CAPTAIN'S LOG, night 1: Good lord. Spiders can swim. I only hope that my boat can outrun these abominable creatures. There is wonderful land to the side of me, but I cannot stop now; there will be others like it, I am sure. For now, I approach morning ... as fast as my boat will take me.
< 1295130146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH MAN THIS IS SO CHEESY I LOVE IT
< 1295130149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: ISN'T IT
< 1295130178 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Minecraft LPs: SO YESTERDAY
< 1295130185 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OOLITE LPs ARE WHERE IT'S AT
< 1295130194 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOTE: THERE IS ONLY ONE OOLITE LP AND IT'S CRAP
< 1295130199 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: it's some kind of programming game with robotic insects and 3d graphics, I don't know much about it - http://programminggames.org/AIWars-The-Insect-Mind.ashx
< 1295130234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: CAPTAIN'S LOG, night 1, addendum: A perfectly square hole in the world, down to lands of lava and void. What hath God wrought upon this sea? Have I tread into curséd waters?
< 1295130243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Chunk loading error)
< 1295130247 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, right.
< 1295130249 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SAIL ONTO IT
< 1295130255 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: btw that toaster thing is exactly what i meant by this being an utterly uninteresting world, it takes a fuckload of work to make it interesting!
< 1295130270 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i suppose that work has been done already, so maybe i should complain less
< 1295130282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: No. :p
< 1295130319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: CAPTAIN'S LOG, night 1, addendum 2: There are beasts frozen in a permanent expression of horror, made out of unearthly materials, stalking me silently. I am losing my faith.
< 1295130369 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, squid?
< 1295130385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Creepers.
< 1295130426 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: CAPTAIN'S LOG, night 1, addendum 3: A forest alight. If the unholy creatures did not dwell nearby, I would inspect. Perhaps they did this. There is no land ahead of me that I can see.
< 1295130437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ablaze
< 1295130446 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lava?
< 1295130563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: No.
< 1295130622 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: CAPTAIN'S LOG, night 1, addendum 4: Never so fast have I tried to eliminate dirt as when I saw I was careering towards it. I did not get out; I knew the skeletal archers must have been watching me intently. But now my boat is a pile of wood and I am alone in the night. I am not even sure I have the wood to repair it.
< 1295130656 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, MC really needs better oceans.
< 1295130669 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The crappy little lakes it has now don't cut it.
< 1295130746 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: CAPTAIN'S LOG, night 1, addendum 5: I hastily built a workbench and my boat again; thank God I had the materials. And I even managed to remove my workbench, but as I removed the few remaining blocks of dirt to allow me to pass them with the possibility of return if, as I suspect, it was a dead end, a zombie appeared next to me, after slinking up unnoticed. My boat is in the water but I am not in it, and I fear that the zombie wil
< 1295130746 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :l soon decimate my health. I am at a loss.
< 1295130799 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.universetoday.com/20671/ion-shield-for-interplanetary-spaceships-now-a-reality/
< 1295130807 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Effing science journalists.
< 1295130816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: EXCUSE ME I REQUIRE ADVICE?
< 1295130817 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, no.
< 1295130820 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Effing Redditors.
< 1295130825 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: "The USS Enterprise has many uses for its deflector shields, including repelling the Borg (Paramount Pictures)"
< 1295130830 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :--caption
< 1295130837 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, effing science journalists.
< 1295130852 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why not both?
< 1295130864 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, both!
< 1295130888 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can kill a few when I murder Sgeo's father and stepmother.
< 1295130902 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: CAPTAIN'S LOG, night, addendum 6: Braaaiiiins. Braiiiiiiiiiiiiiiins... everything is so much better now... braaaaiins... the sea restricts movement, it is no place I want to be ... all I desire ... is FLESH...
< 1295130908 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I died.)
< 1295130924 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what
< 1295130934 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: A zombie killed me while I played a mariner.
< 1295130997 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 1 + 1
< 1295130998 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  2
< 1295131014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yes, you can rely on haskell's arithmetic procedures working
< 1295131019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even if they're not proven :D
< 1295131029 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#esoteric: bunch of smart computer wizzards playing with blocks like small boys + some audience
< 1295131049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: you forgot the small boy playing with blocks like a small boy
< 1295131057 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yes, me
< 1295131061 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-D
< 1295131063 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :irrelevant
< 1295131083 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: bought the damn game yet? I need slaves.
< 1295131125 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, i'm busy finding this lapis
< 1295131130 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1295131241 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: just make some TNT and use it for digging
< 1295131252 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: we already have shitloads of TNT
< 1295131255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem is, it's not nearly enough
< 1295131259 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we've used up almost 9 stacks
< 1295131263 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or even more, actually
< 1295131270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: and it's still only a tiny, tiny corner
< 1295131272 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that isn't even all down to bedrock
< 1295131278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, we need help draining, too
< 1295131317 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by nine stacks, sure you mean 9 boxes? i have at least a big box full of 9 boxes of exploded tnt
< 1295131324 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*surely
< 1295131344 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: xD
< 1295131346 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah cuz you can stack boxes
< 1295131348 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as we all know
< 1295131360 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when you say stack boxes, surely you mean box boxes
< 1295131367 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually it would be nice if you could put chests in chests... not chests in inventory obviously
< 1295131372 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but chests in chests, nested only one level
< 1295131373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would be like
< 1295131376 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a one-chest storage solution for life
< 1295131394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ofc stacking chests works
< 1295131395 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should be able to make a backpack
< 1295131396 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a scrollbar
< 1295131398 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you *can* put chests in chests.
< 1295131402 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: _with items_
< 1295131404 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that lets you store more stuff
< 1295131407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so one 64-stack of chests is as good as 64 chests
< 1295131407 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the inventory is smallllllll
< 1295131413 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : you should be able to make a backpack with a scrollbar
< 1295131416 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and one large chest of 64-stacks of chests could store EVERYTHING IN THE UNIVERSE
< 1295131438 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what i would really like to see is the held-item bar being redesigned.
< 1295131449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: there you should just be four rows of inventory, and at the end of each row, scrolling past gives you the next one
< 1295131451 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :surely you mean it could sore a big box full of universes?
< 1295131451 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it wraps around
< 1295131456 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*store
< 1295131458 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you don't have to fucking drag things down and up all the time
< 1295131533 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm trying to respond but i'm not sure what to surely-you-mean
< 1295131549 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D
< 1295131571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: surely you mean you should be able to scroll through the contents of infinite universes in the bottom bar
< 1295131589 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by bottom bar, surely you mean a big box of bottom bars?
< 1295131613 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have at least 3 big boxes of bottom bars in my base
< 1295131614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe the inventory should just be displayed in a sidebar
< 1295131624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a square
< 1295131628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you enter two digits, row then col, to select an item
< 1295131641 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it'd have the 2x2 crafting there
< 1295131648 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and uh
< 1295131649 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your picture
< 1295131653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the armour stuff
< 1295131706 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd like mc more if instead of objects, you'd have big boxes full of objects, like you know use the chest icon as the icon of every object and name object x "a bix bog of x's"
< 1295131717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295131735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: or you could just make stacks go up to 1728
< 1295131737 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is equivalent
< 1295131738 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait
< 1295131740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's for a small chest
< 1295131751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: 3456 (omg that's ASCENDING)
< 1295131754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3, 4, 5, 6 ?!£NRjhkflghvmkjg
< 1295131755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pojmklgtr
< 1295131755 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL, small chest... surely you mean a bix box of small chests
< 1295131767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bix box, is that like weetabix
< 1295131776 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1295131781 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry
< 1295131783 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by bix box
< 1295131792 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i of course meant a big box of bix boxes.
< 1295131816 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh... "New" indications on IETF I-Ds are based on date. That resulted obsolete version of I-D having "new" indiction.
< 1295131842 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ah, so infinite storage?
< 1295131842 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: surely you mean it's based on a big box of dates?
< 1295131852 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should stop this before it stops being funny
< 1295131854 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well
< 1295131862 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you're actually a big box of oklopols, right?
< 1295131867 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really a danger of that anytime soon
< 1295131872 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you know, in a couple of days
< 1295131917 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: by a big box of oklopols, surely you mean a big box of big boxes of oklopols? i have like 5 big boxes of big boxes of oklopols in my base
< 1295131926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: friendly word of advice
< 1295131930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: DEAR GOD NEVER LET THEM ESCAPE
< 1295131934 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295131941 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true
< 1295131951 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should certainly not let them escape
< 1295131955 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but can i ask you something?
< 1295131957 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1295131964 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when you say friendly word of advice
< 1295131974 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :surely you mean a big box of friendly words of advice?
< 1295131975 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean
< 1295131977 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295131980 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :absolutely.
< 1295131986 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have like 7 big boxes of friendly words of advice in my base.
< 1295131988 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whole BOOKS of advice.
< 1295131994 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whole big boxes of books of advice.
< 1295132002 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by whole books of advice, i should probably go to sleep
< 1295132039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what do you call it when you start a new world, walk around for most of the day, take in the sights, explore tons, build something small, die much much later, respawn, and find out that you built that thing at spawn?
< 1295132045 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't walk in straight lines :D
< 1295132082 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://9gag.com/gag/29876/ THEY'VE FOUND OUR SECRET
< 1295132103 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295132130 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you call that the circle of life
< 1295132132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I don't remember anything about ear juice in the Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion.
< 1295132147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw guys
< 1295132148 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page
< 1295132151 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugliest logo ever?
< 1295132158 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugliest box ever? with the logo at both sides, flipped on one
< 1295132159 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: That's because we'd kept it a secret even through then, but now the damned Chinese have found it!
< 1295132161 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes.
< 1295132177 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seriously, every time i go to wp i'm like "wait this isn't wp, what the fuck is that logo"
< 1295132182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"... oh. it's wp."
< 1295132186 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Their special content is a big picture of Jimbo.
< 1295132191 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I KNOW
< 1295132213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: the filename is best though
< 1295132216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :File:Jimmy Wales Fundraiser Appeal edit.jpg
< 1295132221 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, let's feature that
< 1295132230 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, can I clarify a point here?
< 1295132242 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: I doubt it :P
< 1295132253 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is Jew's ear Juice juice squeezed from a Jew's ear or juice that Jews pour into their ears?
< 1295132257 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT'S AMBIGUOUS
< 1295132265 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both.
< 1295132271 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh good. Then they still don't REALLY know the secret.
< 1295132273 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*WHEW*
< 1295132279 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wales must really like his face
< 1295132280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ear juice back and forth, forever.
< 1295132285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's so beautiful
< 1295132313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know what the most useful thing about the NVIDIA X Server Settings is?
< 1295132313 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it is a loveable face, if that guy tried to sell me a vacuum cleaner, i'd buy the hell out of it
< 1295132322 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It lets you enable a cursor shadow!
< 1295132323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck yeah!
< 1295132327 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's the one thing I missed from Windows.
< 1295132359 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : wales must really like his face ← naw, it doesn't look like a sheep's at all.
< 1295132379 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heck... I think IANA IPv4 depletion will be all over the net (and not just reedit).
< 1295132381 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL i get the reference :DDDDDDDDDDDDDd
< 1295132402 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least every blog related to IPv6 or IPv4 depletion.
< 1295132418 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: what's ipv4?
< 1295132424 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it some sort of sports thing
< 1295132440 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295132467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: can you not download mc skins??
< 1295132470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want to back mine up
< 1295132471 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ages ago, i decided i'd add something to all this ipv4 humble and jumble that's been going around on the channel
< 1295132474 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and now i did
< 1295132474 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or wait
< 1295132477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the path to the png file?
< 1295132477 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i feel a proud.
< 1295132478 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone know?
< 1295132522 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi
< 1295132524 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sup?
< 1295132545 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, this lattice is not complete
< 1295132551 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foundit
< 1295132599 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of the two major IPv4 depletion estimates, the more pessimistic one is now in "any moment now" mode. The another gives less than a month left...
< 1295132624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: how long until RIR depletion?
< 1295132625 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Woo, civilisation ends!
< 1295132646 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LET'S HAVE A PARTY
< 1295132650 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\o/
< 1295132650 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :          |
< 1295132650 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :          >\
< 1295132706 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder how long it would take to make an ipv4 protocol from scratch
< 1295132712 0 :MrPhone!~Ident@cpe-98-14-44-145.nyc.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295132744 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i should do a ted talk on that
< 1295132777 0 :MrPhone!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is variable;    curious does have any (good) graphics libraries?
< 1295132781 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's difficult to estimate. Especially due publicity from IANA depletion... I hope that one graph I saw was misleading due to incorrect data processing...
< 1295132781 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone tell me how I subscribe to RSS feeds with Chrome.
< 1295132795 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MrPhone, we have esoteric graphics libraries.
< 1295132798 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, not really.
< 1295132806 0 :MrPhone!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom - extension
< 1295132820 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We have that non-Euclidean raytracer which I have not been working on solidly for about 6 months.
< 1295132842 0 :MrPhone!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant haskell
< 1295132859 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right.
< 1295132861 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MrPhone: Like, what?
< 1295132864 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MrPhone: There's an SDL binding.
< 1295132864 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Non-Euclidean? Elliptic and Hyperbolic geometries? Or just General Relativity?
< 1295132866 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't help you there.
< 1295132876 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari, GR? Hahahahahahahahahano.
< 1295132880 0 :MrPhone!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does haskell have something like tk or gtk?
< 1295132889 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not raytraceable for a start.
< 1295132894 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MrPhone: GTK
< 1295132894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MrPhone: gtk2hs is a binding to gtk.
< 1295132906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MrPhone: There's also Qt, I think... and Cocoa
< 1295132913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MrPhone: Protip
< 1295132916 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I don't even understand what the objects half of GR's equations rely on are so...
< 1295132919 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MrPhone: http://hackage.haskell.org/packages/archive/pkg-list.html
< 1295132924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MrPhone: Look at the categories :)
< 1295132937 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MrPhone: But what you want is a GUI toolkit, not a graphics library.
< 1295132958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MrPhone: http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Gtk2Hs Gtk2Hs is your best bet.
< 1295132967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MrPhone: It's widely-used, well-maintained, and I gather has a decent API.
< 1295132971 0 :MrPhone!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Will look later -on phone now due to busted internet
< 1295132999 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course it's not "perfect" as its use is mostly imperative/object oriented since Gtk is, but hey, it's not like you'd write all of your program in IO anyway.
< 1295132999 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari, FWIW, I was kind of hoping that I'd be able to get it to do hyperbolic and elliptical geometries and maybe if thins turned out really well some arbitrary manifolds.
< 1295133007 0 :MrPhone!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And thanks for the reference
< 1295133013 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are some experimental projects to do purely-functional GUIs, but they're not really mature enough to use in practice.
< 1295133027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: fizzie: I have a new skin and it's even more beautiful than my last one: http://minecraft.net/skin/skin.jsp?user=ehird
< 1295133031 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh yeah, GR includes SR and SR is dynamic.
< 1295133044 0 :MrPhone!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ty elliot
< 1295133073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: did you get those mods installed?
< 1295133075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MrPhone: Two Ts! :-)
< 1295133078 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no
< 1295133079 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I fell at the first stumbling block of not actually understanding how geodesic rays are calculated.
< 1295133087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: aw, did you not bother or was there a problem
< 1295133096 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I' going to do it later
< 1295133101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok :)
< 1295133105 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the java doens't work :(
< 1295133106 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Very rainbowy. (And yes, the URLs the client prints out don't seem to work for any old web browser; I don't know if it's about request headers or something.)
< 1295133108 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :user=ehird
< 1295133114 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just a grey box FURPDKPDR
< 1295133115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Worked for me, I just wgetted it.
< 1295133116 0 :MrPhone!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Elliott - no tab  completion
< 1295133122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you have no java plugin :P
< 1295133126 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MrPhone: hehe ok
< 1295133136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: preview: http://minecraft.net/skin/ehird.png
< 1295133137 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh there we go
< 1295133138 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just imagine that warped
< 1295133139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1295133153 0 :MrPhone!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Phone
< 1295133154 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that't cool
< 1295133170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Did you see how Notch is offering pirated versions of Minecraft due to his own incompetence?
< 1295133245 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know, variable has been converted to the Functional Order rather well.
< 1295133306 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aw
< 1295133406 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could be in a better mood right now
< 1295133412 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, he wasn't in the Functional Order before?
< 1295133417 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, did you elope with KT-AT?
< 1295133419 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Did KT AT not show up *again*?
< 1295133423 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :She showed up
< 1295133429 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And...
< 1295133431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: No, I convinced him to learn Haskell.
< 1295133437 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But my happiness is pretty much entirely eclipsed by a belief she holds
< 1295133443 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Astrology?
< 1295133445 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Christianity?
< 1295133445 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That the Earth is flat?
< 1295133446 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tooth fairy?
< 1295133450 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Homeopathy?
< 1295133452 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That P=NP?
< 1295133455 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That sugar is imaginary?
< 1295133457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: OMG
< 1295133459 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't even joke about that
< 1295133463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's just sick
< 1295133469 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, none of those are potentially lethal [I started typing this before you mentioned homeopathy]
< 1295133474 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That ZFC is inconsistent?
< 1295133476 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Breatharianism?
< 1295133477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Say yes.
< 1295133480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Please to god say yes.
< 1295133494 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A real-life breatharianist would be the awesome.
< 1295133499 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: They do exist, you know.
< 1295133499 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: No, I didn't.
< 1295133505 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That Vitamin C can essentially cure cancer, and chemotherapy is essentially vitamin C.
< 1295133509 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
< 1295133514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You dodged a bullet, my friend.
< 1295133523 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, get access to her perfume.
< 1295133524 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And this is the LAST person I'd expect to hold such a belief
< 1295133527 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fill it with benzene.
< 1295133537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION notes to self: never let Phantom__Hoover near anyone I love.
< 1295133543 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: hey don't dis that, Dick Lipton believes P=NP.  maybe.
< 1295133551 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, I want P=NP!
< 1295133551 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: t'was a joke
< 1295133560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: The client downloads minecraft.jar?auth=...&..., but you can actually just elide the ? and everything after and it lets you download it.
< 1295133571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Notch quality protection.
< 1295133574 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people actually beleive P=NP? not just to be contrary?
< 1295133575 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shortly after I met her, I was _convinced_ that she wouldn't hold such a belief
< 1295133576 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't wait for the Mojang condom.
< 1295133585 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Dick Lipton :-P
< 1295133613 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: There are plenty of females in the universe ... and most of them don't even believe that Vitamin C causes cancer.
< 1295133622 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you read what I said wrong
< 1295133626 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or you mistyped
< 1295133629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I'm saying that it isn't a big deal :P
< 1295133631 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm.
< 1295133631 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*cures
< 1295133639 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: But I am kind of upset, because now I have to start preparing another silly name...
< 1295133657 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The thing is, you wouldn't expect a cancer survivor to hold such a belief
< 1295133682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X-D
< 1295133689 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doged. A. Bullet.
< 1295133692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Literally.
< 1295133696 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :She probably shoots people for fun.
< 1295133701 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bullets cure cancer.
< 1295133704 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, benzene.
< 1295133712 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: the "maybe" is part of his belief, though.
< 1295133733 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : A real-life breatharianist would be the awesome. <-- what do they believe?
< 1295133736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: So, so, wait, what cured her -- did she drink a lot of orange juice and it cleared itself up?
< 1295133747 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or was it, uh, lots of medical expertise and chemotherapy?
< 1295133762 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :She got chemo. She's not against regular medicine
< 1295133768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: *real medicine
< 1295133772 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: hey maybe she's the reincarnation of Linus Pauling.  that would be cool.  sort of.
< 1295133776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: But seriously, SHE BELIEVES CHEMOTHERAPY IS BASICALLY VITAMIN C?
< 1295133781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THAT DOESN'T EVEN MAKE
< 1295133810 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you point out to her that vitamin C doesn't make you bald?
< 1295133816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YES IT DOES
< 1295133819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just nobody's taken enough yet.
< 1295133825 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Chemotherapy results in LOTS of Vitamin C.
< 1295133826 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOTS of it.
< 1295133831 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like a HUNDRED oranges.
< 1295133837 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1295133838 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :She believes that vitamin C is free of side-effects
< 1295133843 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And thus is better than chemo
< 1295133846 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: So it doesn't cure cancer?
< 1295133853 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That you can survive without eating; the justifications vary, sometimes you get things from the air by breathing, other times from the sunlight.
< 1295133853 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, DID SHE NOT NOTICE HER SMEGGING HAIR FALLING OUT
< 1295133857 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Oh god, I was drinking this orange juice and the most horrible thing happened... my cancer got cured!"
< 1295133871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: No, you see, only radiation Vitamin C causes hair falling out.
< 1295133874 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think she was cured of her cancer before she formed this belief
< 1295133876 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, haha
< 1295133876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Regular Vitamin C is better, because it doesn't.
< 1295133883 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, real life ones would be rather short lived
< 1295133892 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: One of 'em took the Randi test, and was found sneaking into McDonald's around 04am, IIRC. But he said he just went there to breath in the nutrients.
< 1295133896 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, chemotherapy isn't even radioactive!
< 1295133907 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or maybe it was just some generic test and Randi reported it in the blog.
< 1295133919 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295133920 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I think he has a standing rule of not testing that sort of silliness.)
< 1295133925 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, BENZENE
< 1295133938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: It's pure Vitamin C-enriched uranium.
< 1295133941 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, Randi?
< 1295133958 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: James Randi, a noted skeptic.
< 1295133966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal doesn't know who Randi is? lol.
< 1295133967 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and illusion maker
< 1295133969 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And a stage magician.)
< 1295133970 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right.
< 1295133977 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not magic! it's an illusion
< 1295133989 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, only kind of magic anyone's going to see.
< 1295133991 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: There was one where they first did it in a city, deteriorated; "yeah well the air isn't pure enough!"; did it in the beautiful countryside, condition deteriorated, testers said fuck it, and cancelled it.
< 1295133993 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why not call it magic?
< 1295134005 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Randi always makes the distinction
< 1295134016 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :?
< 1295134018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: But yeah, another famous breatharianist has been found ordering meals on planes and such.
< 1295134022 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: "James Randi James Randi has an international reputation as a magician and escape artist --", directly from randi.org; I'm pretty sure he's called it magic too.
< 1295134054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A magician is an illusionist; a magician does magic tricks; magic tricks are illusions; a magician does not do magic, but "magic" is a common abbreviation for magic tricks.
< 1295134059 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION logreads
< 1295134061 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So really it's fine to say he does magic, because it's an abbreviation in context.
< 1295134066 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:29:13 * Sgeo decides not to state his sexual wishes in the channel
< 1295134079 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But what are your sexual wishes Sgeo? We need to know!
< 1295134097 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clearly he wants his partner to dress up as a macrophage.
< 1295134116 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that's logical.
< 1295134147 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then have some sort of weird blood-furry-vore.
< 1295134159 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DISGUSTING
< 1295134179 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: impossible. blood is not kosher!
< 1295134184 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-D
< 1295134199 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, ah, but which constituent of blood?
< 1295134269 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, HE isn't doing the eating.
< 1295134294 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clearly this is why his stepmother didn't want him seeing non-Jewish girls.
< 1295134309 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it all makes sense now!
< 1295134379 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The pieces of the puzzle are fitting together!
< 1295134387 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, YOUR SILENCE SPEAKS VOLUMES
< 1295134402 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :microscopic pieces
< 1295134428 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, maybe even... ANTIBODY PIECES
< 1295134437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does anyone have that archive of the frappr, just realised i lost mine
< 1295134453 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out
< 1295134493 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.stewarthomesociety.org/images/gallery/necrocard.jpg lawlwtf
< 1295134546 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295134557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: old
< 1295134573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: that was actually made by some i think performance artist who actually carries it
< 1295134577 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that it holds any legal weight of course :)
< 1295134858 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd rather have sex after my death than be eaten by worms
< 1295134864 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or burned
< 1295134867 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or pretty much anything
< 1295134895 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would rather not be buried when I am dead
< 1295134919 0 :charlvn!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1295134921 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :me neither, it is a waste of space
< 1295134981 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also would rather not funeral for when I am dead
< 1295135009 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi zzo38
< 1295135010 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why?
< 1295135016 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why no funeral
< 1295135033 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're no fun at all
< 1295135063 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would rather not die\
< 1295135132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah eral is latin for not at all
< 1295135240 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dingus Maximus died. Well that's fun eral.
< 1295135259 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey
< 1295135266 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just got what elliott meant by that
< 1295135271 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was a joke!
< 1295135273 0 :Wamanuz3!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295135274 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see
< 1295135275 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :INDEED
< 1295135277 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fun-eral
< 1295135280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very
< 1295135280 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklodurp
< 1295135283 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fun-not-at-all
< 1295135300 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: /nick oklodurp
< 1295135315 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okloplo
< 1295135321 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'M ACTUALLY BBER SMART
< 1295135324 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*VERY
< 1295135328 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I would rather not die\ ← UNTIL YOU BECOME SENESCENT AND ARE PHAGOCYTOSED BY A SEXY MACROPHAGE
< 1295135336 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+quote  I'M ACTUALLY BBER SMART
< 1295135336 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bieber Smart? That doesn't sound very smart at all ...
< 1295135354 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295135362 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're just ignorant
< 1295135377 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but is he bber ignorant?
< 1295135382 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*justin gnorant
< 1295135447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant:     Could not deduce (Peano n) from the context (Peano (S n))
< 1295135448 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's "justin bieber"?
< 1295135458 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't sound right
< 1295135468 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was some other justin
< 1295135476 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess there could be two famous justins
< 1295135485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :timberlake? :P
< 1295135488 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :timberlake
< 1295135489 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah
< 1295135500 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hum
< 1295135501 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's like some famous programmer or what
< 1295135506 0 :Wamanuz2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1295135507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: :D
< 1295135514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i should probably do it as a type family
< 1295135517 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something
< 1295135532 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bieber is a singer i think
< 1295135540 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and has a really high voice?
< 1295135568 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i read this in a youtube comment i think
< 1295135634 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU SAY JUSTIN BIEBER, I SAY METAL BAND #1; YOU SAY SPICE GIRLS, I SAY METAL BAND #2; etc.
< 1295135646 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have to conclude people who listen to metal are retarded
< 1295135691 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how ironic
< 1295135696 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You say? Justin Bieber,I say PARAMORE!!! You say Lady Gaga,I say Evanescence You say Miley Cyrus,I say Slipknot You say? T-Pain,I say Three Days Grace You say Emenem,I say Linkin Park You say Jonas Brother,Isay Green Day
< 1295135698 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, the correct deduction is "people who comment on music videos on YouTube are retarded."
< 1295135716 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :92% of teens have turned to pop and hip-hop.If? you are part of the? 8% that still listens to real music, copy and paste this message to 5 other videos.? DON'T LET THE SPIRIT OF ROCK AND ROLL DIE!!!!!!!
< 1295135736 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :7 exclamation marks.
< 1295135740 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Good night
< 1295135742 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's some grade-A stupid there.
< 1295135755 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love it when people say things are ironic ironically.
< 1295135756 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you sure it wins the actual content in stupidity?
< 1295135758 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How ironic!
< 1295135764 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, they actually DO copy paste that around :D
< 1295135794 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, believe me, I know.
< 1295135799 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P
< 1295135880 0 :sshc!~sshc@unaffiliated/sshc JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295135894 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why has Sgeo not taken on board my dating advice.
< 1295135909 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover, I'm not a murderer, and I still like her
< 1295135922 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just... am fearful for her safety
< 1295135927 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, just give her loads of orange juice!
< 1295135951 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would not stab someone who believes that they are immortal, either
< 1295135952 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom__Hoover: did you suggest he kill her or what?
< 1295135980 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, I suggested he put benzene in her perfume in order to demonstrate that vitamin C does not, in fact, cure cancer.
< 1295136004 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION → sleep
< 1295136005 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also who puts slipknot and evanescence on the same list :D what's their connection?
< 1295136015 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"electric guitar -> metal!"
< 1295136029 0 :Phantom__Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1295136050 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and who puts eminem and justin bieber on the same list
< 1295136053 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's their connection
< 1295136067 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well umm maybe i shouldn't analyze this further
< 1295136071 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're both jokingly made fun of by some group
< 1295136085 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?
< 1295136093 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you elaborate
< 1295136100 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm referring to the thing i pasted
< 1295136246 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :People hate Justin Bieber for no reason, and I'm sure people hate Eminem for no reason
< 1295136251 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU SAY C++, I SAY BRAINFUCK!!!!! YOU SAY JAVA, I SAY UNLAMBDA!! 6% OF PEOPLE HAVE TURNED TO PROGRAMMING, IF YOU ARE IN THE 0.03% SUBSET THAT USES REAL PROGRAMMING LANGUAGES, COPY AND PASTE THIS TO 5 OTHER PROGRAMMING CHANNELS!!!!!!!!!!!!! DON'T LET THE SPIRIT OF ETC
< 1295136251 0 :sshc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295136257 0 :sshc!~sshc@unaffiliated/sshc JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295136269 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would make a great retard
< 1295136273 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really i wouldn't have to change a thing
< 1295136297 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU SAY C++, I SAY BRAINFUCK!!!!! YOU SAY JAVA, I SAY UNLAMBDA!! 6%  OF PEOPLE HAVE TURNED TO PROGRAMMING, IF YOU ARE IN THE 0.03%  SUBSET THAT USES REAL PROGRAMMING LANGUAGES, COPY AND PASTE THIS TO  5 OTHER PROGRAMMING CHANNELS!!!!!!!!!!!!! DON'T LET THE SPIRIT OF  ETC
< 1295136316 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what were the channels?
< 1295136320 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just this one
< 1295136322 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1295136328 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :darn, i wish elliott was here
< 1295136336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not
< 1295136342 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, i know
< 1295136348 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"6%  OF PEOPLE HAVE TURNED TO PROGRAMMING, IF YOU ARE IN THE 0.03%  SUBSET THAT USES REAL PROGRAMMING LANGUAGES"
< 1295136350 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise i would've said
< 1295136353 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay, elliott is here
< 1295136354 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think there's a /prog/ meme like that :}
< 1295136360 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or well, was
< 1295136384 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it's kind of an obvious joke, so obvious that it took me quite a lot of effort to make myself write it.
< 1295136398 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1295136402 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or in what sense?
< 1295136413 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i used to see that youtube comment like daily
< 1295136430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait Sgeo is still going to date ktat?
< 1295136431 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CAN YOU LOOK UP MEM
< 1295136431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL
< 1295136472 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why wouldn't he date ktat?
< 1295136488 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: she believes vitamin c causes cancer, and that chemotherapy is essentially vitamin c
< 1295136494 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, cures
< 1295136497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops
< 1295136502 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: (and is a cancer survivor herself, cured by chemotherapy, not vitamin c)
< 1295136508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait i forgot, they're the same thing
< 1295136511 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because radiation is a vitamin
< 1295136541 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think [hope] she knows radiation isn't a vitamin
< 1295136553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: then how is chemotherapy vitamin c
< 1295136562 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: everyone laughed at einstein when he told the world center of physics that the earth is actually the center of time but look what happened
< 1295136571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: marry me
< 1295136579 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Chemotherapy != radiation
< 1295136588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: i am aware, how's chemotherapy vitamin c
< 1295136604 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :She mentioned some documentary...
< 1295136625 0 :sshc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295136625 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :chemotherapy != radiation? i thought that was the essential part
< 1295136627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but you see the thing is chemotherapy has nothing to do with vitamin c
< 1295136630 0 :sshc!~sshc@unaffiliated/sshc JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295136630 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just saying
< 1295136637 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kinda important fact
< 1295136664 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ALSO WHO CARES WHAT A GIRL THINKS AS LONG AS THERE'S PROSPECT OF SEX
< 1295136692 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that needed to be said i think
< 1295136711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but Sgeo has said he's not sure he'd like sex before! all he wants is opinions on vitamin c
< 1295136714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and boy, these opinions are low-quality
< 1295136735 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i knew this guy who said he didn't like sex, masturbation was better
< 1295136753 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how do you have such a good memory?
< 1295136758 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, Mike?/
< 1295136767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: because i remember things that are really strange, and you're fucking weird.
< 1295136770 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: a guy i went to high school with
< 1295136772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*that are strange
< 1295136807 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: do you remember something i've said?
< 1295136817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dog food
< 1295136824 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh eating that
< 1295136844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was it nice
< 1295136845 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've certainly dabbled in dogging
< 1295136855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eating doggy style
< 1295136878 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am here now. I was away before sorry someone tried to call me
< 1295136912 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno if it's nice or bad, but it's certainly different from human food
< 1295136924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: why don't you want a funeral
< 1295136925 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i've only tried the dry stuff
< 1295136928 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there will be people with a serious fetish for behaving like a pet dog and eating dog food out of a bowl
< 1295136946 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sexylosers.com/053.html [NSFW NSFW NSFW]
< 1295136949 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to funeral for me and no bury me. The funeral and these things is cost money and I do not like it.
< 1295136950 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wouldn't be surprising if it's called dogging too
< 1295136977 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^^relevant to what oklopol said about that guy
< 1295136986 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can make my body to use, such as making wig by the hair, making writing by the blood (perhaps some lie about how I died?), and the rest of the body for eating??
< 1295137001 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: how about sex?
< 1295137005 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if eating is okay
< 1295137029 0 :sshc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295137033 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: No sex. (Of course I am dead and I will therefore not stop you, but surely sex of the dead is doesn't even make sense??)
< 1295137034 0 :sshc!~sshc@unaffiliated/sshc JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295137040 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Necrophilia is real.
< 1295137049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It happens :P
< 1295137072 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :necrophilia with a man would obviously have the dead guy as a bottom
< 1295137087 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least i assume so
< 1295137089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1295137093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"well come on then"
< 1295137095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I'M WAITING"
< 1295137101 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know since i'm a completely straight necrophiliac
< 1295137104 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would assume it goes all ways
< 1295137138 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gay necro is just weeeeird
< 1295137146 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The more time you waste with sex from dead, the body will be rotten and then it will be no good for anything whatsoever (except, perhaps, source of carbon).
< 1295137146 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just... always assume some people are weirder than you thought possible
< 1295137174 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean come on, who wants to see two guys kiss each other and one is dead, two girls (one being dead), sure, everyone likes that but two guys.. (and one is dead) that's just sick
< 1295137195 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never leave us oklopol
< 1295137203 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :necrophilic cannibals finish quick so they can have fresher meat
< 1295137207 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have to eat right away while it is still on the line of live and dead. But you also have to pull your hair, not only so you can see who is strong enough to pull the hair, but also so that you can make wig.
< 1295137212 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: it will have been good for the sex, at least you can have sex multiple times, you can only eat a body once
< 1295137220 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although i guess you'll get a lot of meat from one body
< 1295137232 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: But you cannot make proper sex with the dead!
< 1295137247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can if they're still warm!
< 1295137254 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: why?
< 1295137259 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Of course, it is possible to be bald when dead, and then you will have no hair to pull)
< 1295137273 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meat should be cured for better taste though, I would assume this goes for humans too
< 1295137308 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: No! I disallowed you to sell human meats in the store!
< 1295137338 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, are you drunk?
< 1295137345 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why couldn't you have sex with someone who's dead, zzo38?
< 1295137349 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. Are you drunk?
< 1295137358 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nope.
< 1295137358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why couldn't you have sex with someone who's dead, zzo38?
< 1295137359 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you just mean because it's gross, or like some physical reason
< 1295137367 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Because it is not proper sex.
< 1295137386 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't expect it to work so well or proper.
< 1295137388 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about sex with someone who's unconscious?
< 1295137400 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: how is it not proper?
< 1295137400 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yuck! that's just weird
< 1295137415 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: In that case, they are still live, and they didn't tell you consent, so you should not do that either.
< 1295137423 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But for different reason)
< 1295137425 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1295137444 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can consent to unconscious sex just as you can for post-mortem sex
< 1295137448 0 :sshc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295137454 0 :sshc!~sshc@unaffiliated/sshc JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295137461 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you know they "didn't tell you consent"? and we're not talking about whether you should do it, but whether it'd be proper sex
< 1295137475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: well except that you're going to wake up if you're unconscious... and are also still a sentient being
< 1295137475 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: i think legally you can't consent to post-mortem sex
< 1295137480 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it possible to write a note from blood of the recently deceased, about how they died?
< 1295137484 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but legally, you can consent to unconscious sex, prolly
< 1295137489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: so post-mortem is a bit different
< 1295137495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: "I died getting the blood to write this note"
< 1295137498 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Well, I guess if they told you consent ahead of time for unconscious sex, it is different.
< 1295137504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: so why can sex with a dead person not be proper?
< 1295137533 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: we don't care about the consent part... or is sex somehow different depending on whether it's immoral or not?
< 1295137534 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Because sex must involve two people and their body of sex is not function properly once dead, therefore it is improper.
< 1295137544 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1295137548 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :improper as in "wrong"?
< 1295137549 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: how does it not function properly, like, how does that stop sex being proper?
< 1295137550 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or what
< 1295137559 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure about the legalities, of course, but if someone decides their burial should involve sex shouldn't that be exactly like deciding you want to be cremated?
< 1295137563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: as in -- what parts of the body are (1) required for sex to be proper and (2) not functioning past death?
< 1295137583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: ashes to ashes... dust to dust... genitalia to genitalia...
< 1295137584 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't know, I am not a doctor. Nor do I know about sex. Maybe you should ask a sex doctor.
< 1295137595 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: unless it's just plain illegal to fuck a dead body
< 1295137595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: then i don't see how you can say post-mortem sex is not proper
< 1295137603 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well
< 1295137617 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Of course I can say whatever I want, it doesn't make it necessarily true!
< 1295137617 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose this gets a bit fine-grained, maybe you can still make the contract legally or something
< 1295137624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: well that's a bit silly
< 1295137633 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you can't make a contract saying someone can murder you
< 1295137634 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think burning a dead body is illegal too, except when part of the procedures
< 1295137636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it's probably similar
< 1295137659 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i imagine most necrophiliacs wouldn't actually fuck a dead guy
< 1295137661 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for, you know, safety reasons
< 1295137663 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if you hump the body so fast the friction creates spontaneous combustion
< 1295137670 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does that count as cremation
< 1295137684 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wouldn't that also cause self-immolation?
< 1295137686 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: fucking a fresh body doesn't sound very dangerous tho
< 1295137696 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not if you're wearing an asbestos condom
< 1295137706 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and besides, we're not even debating that aspect really :D
< 1295137707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well it'd be a bit cold still
< 1295137718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :muscles frozen up and stuff
< 1295137729 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dunno it still sounds unsanitary :D
< 1295137740 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really
< 1295137755 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asses are full of shit and still we stick our dicks in them without protection
< 1295137768 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Food Matters
< 1295137774 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's the name of the bullshit that she saw
< 1295137823 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also i think the coldness would just be really hot if your fantasy is to fuck a dead body
< 1295137850 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've tried a cold fleshlight for instance and that works fine
< 1295137867 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You probably will not die by writing a note from your own blood if it is one small part. But if you played mahjong with blood and your opponent won everything and they must remove all of your blood from one small hole in your arm (which is sterilized too), then it is different.
< 1295137870 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not for that purpose tho :D
< 1295137885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: chilled with ice?
< 1295137886 0 :sshc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295137889 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: you say weird things
< 1295137892 0 :sshc!~sshc@unaffiliated/sshc JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295137895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: also, sane people don't stick their dicks in asses without protection :P
< 1295137899 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: a dead body would be room temperature, wouldn't it
< 1295137921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: doesn't even have a wp page
< 1295137922 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with time, a dead body will approach ambient temperature
< 1295137923 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1528734/
< 1295137925 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not in uncharted asses, no
< 1295137930 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but asses in general
< 1295137952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : You probably will not die by writing a note from your own blood if it is one small part. But if you played mahjong with blood and your opponent won everything and they must remove all of your blood from one small hole in your arm (which is sterilized too), then it is different.
< 1295137953 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what :D
< 1295137958 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C1TSND_enUS401US401&aq=f&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=%22Food+Matters%22
< 1295137977 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Can you play mahjong? Can you read Akagi manga book?
< 1295137987 0 :cheater00!~cheater@g230229189.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295137988 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no. it is physically impossible for me to read Akagi
< 1295137990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would combust.
< 1295138007 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the probabilities of catching std's are highly overestimated to scare young ppl into being safer, i've had unprotected sex with non-regular gf at least 4 times and i've caught only one std
< 1295138008 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Why would you?
< 1295138012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :magic
< 1295138013 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295138013 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if he/she dies during the act? that wouldn't be so unsanitary. i mean it's not like 50 milliseconds after death the corpse becomes a juicy tender sack of disease, riddled with bugs. it's not an old apple that's been in tupperware on the back of your car in the sun for too long
< 1295138023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i have no words :D
< 1295138029 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :These books are real books they are not magic.
< 1295138042 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:36 < oklopol> and the probabilities of catching std's are highly overestimated to scare young ppl into being safer, i've had  unprotected sex with non-regular gf at least 4 times and i've caught only one std
< 1295138044 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Holy fuck
< 1295138046 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is not reassuring
< 1295138049 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just saw the trailer
< 1295138054 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have *all* of the Akagi books, including the special edition.
< 1295138057 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: it was a joke
< 1295138062 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you missed that
< 1295138070 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the series is still on-going.
< 1295138070 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow 0.999... = 1 discussion in #haskell
< 1295138071 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lame
< 1295138075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but i already quoted it to everyone...
< 1295138076 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it's true, sure)
< 1295138083 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but it was a joke)
< 1295138097 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: TROLL TIME
< 1295138106 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: IS IT TRUE OR NOT
< 1295138124 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1295138130 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've caught an std
< 1295138157 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think. it was kinda unclear, they told me i MUST HAVE CAUGHT IT, and that they'd call me when it's confirmed, gave me the treatment and sent me away
< 1295138161 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but didn't call me
< 1295138177 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i suppose i didn't have it, or i had such a strong strain that they figured i'll just die anyway
< 1295138261 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or i suppose it's more likely that they were actually never going to call in the first place and i just misunderstood
< 1295138264 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never listen to ppl
< 1295138292 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: here?
< 1295138305 0 :sshc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295138306 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even in D&D game, my character had blue blood so I cut myself to use it to cover a potion to disguise its colors, so someone else doesn't know what color it is.
< 1295138310 0 :sshc!~sshc@unaffiliated/sshc JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295138311 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: here?
< 1295138317 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm here!
< 1295138321 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but are you here?
< 1295138327 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Yes.
< 1295138330 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay
< 1295138332 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: they took a sample of your blood but there were no blood cells in there, only cancer cells infested by HIV
< 1295138339 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Are you not here?
< 1295138347 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: you unignored cheater00 right?
< 1295138350 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I am not in your house.
< 1295138358 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Yes I did.
< 1295138359 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Are you not not here?
< 1295138367 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: :D
< 1295138372 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Not not where, to be specific?
< 1295138379 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Not not there.
< 1295138408 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: i've decided my body is naturally resistant to all forms of cancer
< 1295138425 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I only ignored cheater00 for a short time, and even if I did not remove the ignore it is not persistent across sessions unless I put it in the init file for the IRC client)
< 1295138428 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you're an Oklopol Realdoll
< 1295138429 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because people are all gay about how dangerous it is, i've decided to take the higher road
< 1295138452 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: aka mr. floppy
< 1295138462 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or how-ever-the-hell-you-call-it
< 1295138465 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: now they're using inconsistent theories
< 1295138470 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: MISSION ACCOMPLISHED
< 1295138481 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: the 0.999 vs 1 thing?
< 1295138489 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb, need to say bye to my friends who're off on a trip
< 1295138490 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbs
< 1295138522 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah say bye to your friend's whore
< 1295138576 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can someone copy and paste the interesting bits of the convo somewhee
< 1295138577 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*where
< 1295138581 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: cale doesn't believe in an objective universe
< 1295138590 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is Cale the one who's being stupid?
< 1295138598 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought he's like the smartest guy on ever
< 1295138611 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no he isn't being stupid apart from that
< 1295138627 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well I am not sure what it means, I'm interested
< 1295138641 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which IRC clients do and do not persist ignores (and/or other things) across sessions?
< 1295138653 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xchat persists it
< 1295138688 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Does xchat have a init file?
< 1295138691 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know what a session is
< 1295138696 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds like a pretty useless concept
< 1295138697 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no
< 1295138700 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: indeed
< 1295138727 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: What I mean by a session is when the program is loaded and then closed. Next time you run the program is the next session, memory from the previous session is gone.
< 1295138733 0 :sshc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295138739 0 :sshc!~sshc@unaffiliated/sshc JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295138753 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh alright
< 1295138771 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Call it something else if you want to.
< 1295138795 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no sensible program ever had that concept, when you close a program and reopen it, obviously you start in the same state
< 1295138823 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: No, many program do not start automatically from where you left off.
< 1295138838 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: they are retarded programs and can be ignored for the purposes of this argument
< 1295138853 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :studying the empty set is much easier and purer
< 1295138858 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: in @, it's impossible to write a program that obeys differently when you close it!
< 1295138859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well
< 1295138860 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(TeX will save state if you use \dump otherwise it will not do so)
< 1295138863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could hook into disk save/disk load
< 1295138870 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that doesn't correspond to start/stop using necessarily at all
< 1295138940 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only way a program can tell it has been closed and reopened is that the system clock suddenly jumps
< 1295138962 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would someone associate with this event the emptying of all state
< 1295138987 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I suppose if that is the way, you can make it if you do not want to save state, instead delete it when you close and create a new copy with a nwe session ID and everything when you start back up.
< 1295139008 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The program does not need to be able to tell when it has been closed or not, because you can set state by user setting instead of by program setting.
< 1295139021 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me try to work my way through what you just said
< 1295139024 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would also be useful to have multiple sessions, sometimes, such as working on multiple things.
< 1295139031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol all mobs are invisible for me how amazing is that
< 1295139042 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"delete it when you close"
< 1295139069 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's the way it should be, even scarier than as is
< 1295139107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: :D
< 1295139125 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I mean is delete the copy of the session, and then you can create a new session from the copy of the initial program.
< 1295139161 0 :sshc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295139169 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" It would also be useful to have multiple sessions, sometimes, such as working on multiple things." <<< that is actually very true
< 1295139182 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i'm not sure starting and closing programs is the way to do that
< 1295139202 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is why the session should be separate from the program itself, even if sessions are allowed to persist.
< 1295139212 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: why are they invisible?
< 1295139218 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yeah
< 1295139237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: some bug
< 1295139248 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that actually sounds so scary
< 1295139260 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd just occasionally hear the sound of something
< 1295139271 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then, perhaps, allow you to copy a session.
< 1295139276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i'm muted
< 1295139276 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and oh god, where is it
< 1295139283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so actually, i just started losing damage
< 1295139284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and being pushed
< 1295139288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and tried to run away but couldnt
< 1295139289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*couldn't
< 1295139290 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295139292 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because i didn't know where it was
< 1295139293 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's so cool
< 1295139294 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it killed me
< 1295139300 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha
< 1295139302 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ghosts
< 1295139317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it should play monster sounds completely uncorrelated with actual monsters
< 1295139318 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there should be a game based on that
< 1295139326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hear a spider, nothing's there, but you walk a bit, and there's a zombie, totally silent, start losing health
< 1295139330 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fight it like a spider
< 1295139331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :die horribly
< 1295139348 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have some games with some things invisible.
< 1295139363 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Including I modified the ROM for Super Mario game to make Mario to be invisible, too.
< 1295139364 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what kind of games?
< 1295139376 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mario being invisible would be just annoying
< 1295139383 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And also one pinball game with the ball is invisible.
< 1295139383 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as would mario enemies being invisible
< 1295139383 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything should be invisible
< 1295139386 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from terrain
< 1295139387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :third-person
< 1295139393 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: also that sounds just annoying :D
< 1295139396 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :scrolling pseudorandomly triggered so you can't deduce your position from it
< 1295139403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all items, enemies, yourself, etc. are invisible and inaudible
< 1295139412 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's just a game of luck isn't it
< 1295139415 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that pong
< 1295139416 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And there is invisible tetris (it is a mode in Lockjaw).
< 1295139419 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm pinball
< 1295139428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well in pinball you already whack the flippers madly constantly anyway
< 1295139434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :invisible tetris xD
< 1295139434 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Pinball is not just a game of luck, invisible or not; flippers or not.
< 1295139435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :worst game ever
< 1295139439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yes it is
< 1295139446 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a game of
< 1295139453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(1) pressing flippers when you see the ball (a monkey could do this)
< 1295139453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and
< 1295139454 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I do not whack the flippers madly.
< 1295139458 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(2) hoping it doesn't go straight in the middle
< 1295139462 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which it does, constantly
< 1295139463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's it
< 1295139467 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: No, it isn't. You also bump the table.
< 1295139470 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should make a game that's like totally awesome, with contemporary 3d graphics, but everything is actually rendered as a black screen without sound
< 1295139471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :useless
< 1295139473 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially if it is flipperless game.
< 1295139474 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless it completely stops
< 1295139476 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in which case bump it once
< 1295139481 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: xD
< 1295139482 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I prefer flipperless pinball game.
< 1295139505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so uh
< 1295139507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one control?
< 1295139509 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no game with one control can be good
< 1295139511 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty much
< 1295139512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need two
< 1295139513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly two
< 1295139518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or infinite
< 1295139518 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295139519 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just like when we were making this one game which never came to be, we decided to make this big elaborate secret area that you *actually can't access in any way*
< 1295139531 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well, you have multiple controls. You can bump it in many different directions, and you can control the plunger.
< 1295139539 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: stfu
< 1295139543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: what game
< 1295139547 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION blends oklopol
< 1295139548 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ulimon!
< 1295139553 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295139555 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: also, there was one of those in some nintendo or something game
< 1295139556 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DD
< 1295139559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: contest winner got a special room
< 1295139567 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: except that it was only in the american version
< 1295139568 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pokemon but with ulis... although it didn't have much to do with pokemon
< 1295139572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: and the american localisers removed the door
< 1295139576 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it was impossible to get to
< 1295139582 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1295139590 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh hey elliott
< 1295139596 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you ever read up on hyperreal numberz
< 1295139599 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In a real flipperless pinball game (without computer), you can bump in any direction you want and with different amounts of force.
< 1295139618 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pinball is rubbish
< 1295139624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: so how goes oklocraft
< 1295139630 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: guess!
< 1295139636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: almost developed?
< 1295139642 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Probably because you do not understand the strategy for playing the game.
< 1295139650 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is a strategy?
< 1295139660 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: For pinball game, yes.
< 1295139663 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: no, no, you see, my opinion is that it's rubbish
< 1295139668 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after a few bumps, the movement of the ball is random
< 1295139686 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it usually bumps like 30 times before falling
< 1295139708 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Timing is important. You cannot just bump it at randomly, you will almost certainly lose that way.
< 1295139721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if the flippers extended to the middle
< 1295139724 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone could beat the world record for pinball
< 1295139729 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in some pinballs there's some sort of plot like you have to hit a certain thing and then another thing etc, so you have aim those couple of first bumps right
< 1295139729 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :easily
< 1295139746 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except not because the ball could still fall between flippers in an unlucky situation!
< 1295139752 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You also have to pay attention to all of the lights and everything, and order of targets if it is important, the velocity of the ball, and more.
< 1295139755 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then someone who's extremely unlucky will always keep on doing that
< 1295139766 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: you call aiming the first bump of the ball to be somewhere that gives a high amount of points "strategy"?
< 1295139782 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: What is the elasticity of the flippers?
< 1295139792 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: No, that is only a small part of the game.
< 1295139801 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have to think about the entire game which is a lot more than just that.
< 1295139828 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you do realize when you hit the ball, it hits the first couple things as you like, and then it just jumps around randomly
< 1295139828 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep
< 1295139829 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The elasticity of the various objects in the table is very important.
< 1295139845 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you make very precise hits that come back right away, is that the way pros play it?
< 1295139848 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: speaking of elasticity.. i should play some gish
< 1295139852 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gish!
< 1295139854 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<4
< 1295139860 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahah
< 1295139865 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you been playing it again?
< 1295139869 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Yes it does do that sometimes, which is why you have to make precision and timing, and to think of how to recover from some things.
< 1295139871 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah no pinball is boring and unstrategic
< 1295139875 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not in ages
< 1295139885 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death
< 1295139891 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"yes it does do that sometimes"
< 1295139892 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do what?
< 1295139923 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Moves in the different way than expected.
< 1295139929 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whenever you let the ball jump more then 2 times, you certainly can't predict *at all* what it's going to do
< 1295139949 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is what makes pinball a good game, you can do like that.
< 1295139950 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@69.157.44.226 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295139954 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: you can in (good) real pinballs
< 1295139973 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not like the pinball that came with windows nt 4
< 1295139974 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i find that hard to believe
< 1295139984 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in start > programs > accessories
< 1295139985 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295139991 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but okay maybe like 4
< 1295139991 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Which is why you might attempt to hit certain targets in order to turn on and off lights in order to improve the advantage that you might get with the ball moving different way.
< 1295140039 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: as long as you really play the game in such a way that the ball returns down at least say every 3 bumps, i believe you're actually controlling the game.
< 1295140054 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and not just being good at catching the drops that almost go in the middle
< 1295140073 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i don't *believe* that, but at least it could theoretically be possible
< 1295140095 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I play a pinball game called "JiggleBox". There are bumpers and drop targets and rollover targets with lights and stuff, but near the bottom, the ball can reenter the launch area, and then there is some holes, labeled "50", "100", "0", and "game over".
< 1295140133 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you get the ball in a hole you get that many points and you lose the current ball (you get nine balls per game). If you get the ball in the hole labeled "game over", the game ends immediately, you lose all of your balls to play.
< 1295140205 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So when the ball is up high you try generally to hit targets and lights and points, and try not to make it too fast into the lower area; when it is in the lower area, try to recover so that the ball will touch the launch area, or the "100" hole, at least.
< 1295140226 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when the ball is high, you can control its movement?
< 1295140256 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: By hitting the table so that the ball deflects off of bumpers and pins and walls and drop targets in various ways.
< 1295140278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Apparently you spawn in a random location of the first chunk in SMP. (reddit hearsay.)
< 1295140281 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does hitting do?
< 1295140322 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never used that because in all the pinballs i've played, it's just a small random move that is not really good for anything
< 1295140322 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: When you hit the table it gives force to the table in the direction you hit it, moving everything in one way for a short time.
< 1295140341 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does the ball's trajectory change?
< 1295140366 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or can you just make the ball touch an object if it was already going near it
< 1295140420 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: It can, a little bit, depending on friction and stuff. But usually you just make the ball touch an object that it is near, in a certain way, to increase or reduce the force with which the ball touches that object.
< 1295140423 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if the trajectory doesn't change, that's just silly optimization
< 1295140442 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i think it's to make it bounce harder
< 1295140452 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And of course the force is a vector quantity, which is also important.
< 1295140465 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well in that case the trajectory certainly does change
< 1295140477 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: what?
< 1295140493 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway you're not really convinving me at all
< 1295140494 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yes, to make it bounce harder or in a different direction. (Or, sometimes less hard)
< 1295140507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah these are not good arguments
< 1295140530 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're not really telling me anything i didn't know
< 1295140548 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i suppose it's hard to prove something that's not true
< 1295140551 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD
< 1295140563 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pinball is all based on physics.
< 1295140576 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what
< 1295140582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so is solitaire
< 1295140585 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you put the cards on top of each other
< 1295140588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's physcs
< 1295140589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*physics
< 1295140593 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: No, that doesn't count.
< 1295140599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also chess, how do you think those pieces stay on the board
< 1295140601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FRICTION bitches
< 1295140619 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: it's based on physics, point is there's so little control the movement of the ball is essentially random
< 1295140629 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Of course the games work because of physics, but chess is not a game of physics.
< 1295140677 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: It isn't. I know because I play pinball a lot and the control you have can improve the game a lot, even though there are many random movements of the ball.
< 1295140712 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't seem to find youtube vids of people being good a pinball
< 1295140716 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :might convince me a bit
< 1295140751 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :?
< 1295140777 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See a picture of the pinball game  http://zzo38computer.cjb.net/img_12/jigglebox.png
< 1295140801 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't like pinball, it's bad
< 1295140806 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i agree with oklopol
< 1295140808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :give us youtube videos
< 1295140810 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of good pinballing
< 1295140890 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm
< 1295140915 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think she might not think that chemo is literally vit. C, just that it has the same effect as far as destroying cancer is conc.. wait, no
< 1295140928 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i assume people can become really awesome in these games, but i still think 1) it's mostly about very rough estimates of how to stay safe, and never failing when it's possible to catch the ball 2) a casual player will never reach anything above randomness
< 1295140982 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: You are probably correct
< 1295141027 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey oklopol you're good at x86-64 asm right
< 1295141029 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, it's possible the pro way is indeed to either 1) actually control the ball by hitting 2) make short between-control runs by hitting in places so that the ball just falls back
< 1295141042 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: wait no why
< 1295141043 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i've read a book about it, i don't remember any of the actual operations though
< 1295141045 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*why "wait no"
< 1295141046 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295141050 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: right, so you get to write @'s kernel
< 1295141072 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if either of 1 or 2 is used, i believe the game can become non-random
< 1295141079 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I asked her how there could be different types of chemo, and she said different doses
< 1295141112 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: You can also use a combination of those techniques.
< 1295141113 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't chemo = injecting some shit for fun + radiation
< 1295141190 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: so like, do you actually decide "okay, i'm going to hit that target, and then let the ball go to that other target there, then come back", or do you go "okay ima hit there", and then when it hits those two targets you go like yay i hit exactly what i wanted!
< 1295141202 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do the latter
< 1295141211 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i've played a lot of pinball
< 1295141237 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course, only the windows pinball, so maybe there is essential difference in amount of control, but anyway.
< 1295141262 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in windows pinball, you always choose like a mission by hitting these targets
< 1295141270 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: It is selected based on a few factors, such as the current velocity of the ball and the probability of certain things working.
< 1295141272 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then based on that mission, you have to hit certain kinds of targets
< 1295141301 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that was all very random
< 1295141323 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like "put numbers in this prng and try to get 3452 to appear in the first 30 digits!" random
< 1295141324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: so can you give us a youtube thing
< 1295141337 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I have no YouTube things.
< 1295141352 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well get one, to show us pinball
< 1295141363 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : like "put numbers in this prng and try to get 3452 to appear in the first 30 digits!" random
< 1295141365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would play that
< 1295141367 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if there are no youtube videos of pinballing, then it's pretty obvious no one has ever become good at pinball
< 1295141396 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a video where this guy picks a whole glass of snot from his nose in one minute
< 1295141404 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so pinball shouldn't really be excluded
< 1295141409 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was a lie
< 1295141416 0 :TLUL!~TLUL@wikia/The-last-username-left JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295141419 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks i can taste snot now
< 1295141436 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :once me and a friend tested whether you can drink coke through your nose and i drink a whole glass
< 1295141446 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*drank
< 1295141447 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I have played the Windows pinball. The up arrow is a dumb key for forward bump, so you can change it to spacebar (and set the plunger key to enter). But if you hold down the bump key for more than a small fraction of a second it goes on tilt, so release the keys very quickly after pushing them.
< 1295141465 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah tilt is kinda stupid
< 1295141496 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :either make hitting an essential part of the game mechanics and make like a bar that shows how much you have left to use or something, or just leave it out...
< 1295141516 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tilt penalty is found less often on flipperless games than on flippered games.
< 1295141532 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?
< 1295141538 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well right, because it's copied from irl machines
< 1295141549 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hitting *is* an essential part of the game.
< 1295141566 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the penalty is done completely wrong
< 1295141566 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: did it burn your nose
< 1295141572 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Many flipperless games do not detect tilt.
< 1295141586 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's copied from irl games where the system WAS MADE SO THAT NO ONE COULD HIT THE BOARD EVER
< 1295141593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't get the tilt penalty, yeah
< 1295141593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like
< 1295141595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :STOP THAT
< 1295141598 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in real life does it beep
< 1295141599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and punch you
< 1295141601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you tilt it too hard
< 1295141652 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It won't punch you, but some games will reboot if you tilt it too hard.
< 1295141702 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose the point of tilt penalty is exactly that hitting makes the game less random, and you generally want your games to be random if people are paying to play them
< 1295141711 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because otherwise good players can play longer
< 1295141716 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you want everyone to play for a short time
< 1295141855 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah, why not take hitting - a misfeature provided by reality in the irl pinballs - and then also add tilt penalty - a misfeature provided by the fact games are not actually made to be interesting, but to make money - to your computer game
< 1295141868 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the fuck is wrong with these people
< 1295141891 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't really care
< 1295142238 0 :drakhan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1295142268 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know if you will be able to help to write user-documentation/tutorials for TeXnicard?
< 1295142587 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know *i* can't, if that helps!
< 1295142589 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no
< 1295142597 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was just weird
< 1295142604 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :pikhq
< 1295142613 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i fell on some crap earlier today and now my pants are all smelly
< 1295142617 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no what
< 1295142631 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well you know that question you once asked
< 1295142641 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: You can't? Do you know why you can't?
< 1295142647 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: oh the dog food right
< 1295142653 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no
< 1295142660 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: one of the other ones
< 1295142661 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then what
< 1295142667 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm
< 1295142667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which
< 1295142672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey pikhq
< 1295142673 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me copy it for you
< 1295142681 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since you seem to be a bit short on the brain today.
< 1295142681 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Main> eval (Lam (\x -> Lam (\y -> x)))
< 1295142681 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eval (Lam (\v0 -> (Lam (\v1 -> v0))))
< 1295142705 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" oklopol: did it burn your nose"
< 1295142708 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1295142718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coke burns my nose
< 1295142732 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you try
< 1295142740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, but i've had it come out of my nose
< 1295142741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that burns
< 1295142746 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i wrote the most lovely lambda calculus in haskell just now
< 1295142752 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :realy
< 1295142758 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WAT
< 1295142763 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:54 < elliott> *Main> eval (Lam (\x -> Lam (\y -> x)))
< 1295142763 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:54 < elliott> eval (Lam (\v0 -> (Lam (\v1 -> v0))))
< 1295142766 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fail
< 1295142773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: howso
< 1295142775 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alpha evaluation LOL
< 1295142779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: nope
< 1295142780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not how it works
< 1295142780 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im just being silly
< 1295142782 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out
< 1295142800 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i based it on http://sneezy.cs.nott.ac.uk/fplunch/weblog/?p=95 which you've probably seen
< 1295142803 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems to be down
< 1295142804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cache: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:joFRT78UzLkJ:sneezy.cs.nott.ac.uk/fplunch/weblog/%3Fp%3D95+http://sneezy.cs.nott.ac.uk/fplunch/weblog/%3Fp%3D95&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk
< 1295142813 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but, i used HOAS instead of de bruijn
< 1295142823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: and now the evaluator and the quoter are crazy bidirectional!
< 1295142843 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://sprunge.us/ZEeS
< 1295142856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: obviously if you just want an evaluator, you can ditch Var, SVar, showSyn and the Show instances
< 1295142858 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool
< 1295142859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and even nf
< 1295142870 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which makes it literally just... 7 lines
< 1295142875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i counted)
< 1295142882 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :data Syn = Lam (Syn -> Syn) | App Syn Syn
< 1295142882 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I found what report DVItype is part of (which is why it starts on page 402 instead of page 1), it is TeXware, it is listed in the bibliography for TeX. But there is no ISBN?
< 1295142885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :data Sem = Sem (Sem -> Sem)
< 1295142886 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295142888 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eval :: Syn -> Sem
< 1295142893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eval (Lam f) = Sem (\x -> eval (f (quote x)))
< 1295142895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eval (App f x) = f' (eval x) where Sem f' = eval f
< 1295142899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quote :: Sem -> Syn
< 1295142899 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quote (Sem f) = Lam (\x -> quote (f (eval x)))
< 1295142901 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that's all you need
< 1295142910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey those functions are eval . f . quote
< 1295142912 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and quote . f . eval :DD
< 1295142917 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very nice
< 1295142963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Main> nf (Lam (\x -> Lam (\y -> Lam (\z -> App (App x y) z))))
< 1295142963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Lam (\v0 -> (Lam (\v1 -> (Lam (\v2 -> *** Exception: /home/elliott/Code/lc/second.hs:9:35-49: Irrefutable pattern failed for pattern Main.Sem f'
< 1295142964 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops
< 1295142966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll fix that
< 1295142970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it'll get uglier
< 1295142997 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't understand http://zzo38computer.cjb.net/img_12/jigglebox.png
< 1295143001 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :                 /home/elliott/Code/lc/second.hs:9:35-49: Irrefutable pattern failed
< 1295143001 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where are the flippers floppers
< 1295143004 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :                 for pattern Main.Sem f'
< 1295143007 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yeah
< 1295143008 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DONT USE TYPES HE SAID, IT WILL BE OKAY HE SAID.
< 1295143012 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DD
< 1295143013 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: That is a flipperless game, there are no flippers.
< 1295143023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: basically the problem is, (App (SVar i) ...) doesn't work
< 1295143027 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P
< 1295143028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i'm not sure how to fix that without it being horrible
< 1295143032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any ideas?
< 1295143035 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: oh? just hitting or?
< 1295143052 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or no control at all? :D
< 1295143055 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that'd be cool
< 1295143060 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Yes, just hitting. (Actually there is one more thing you can control -- the launch strength.)
< 1295143088 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The computer allows hitting in five directions.
< 1295143089 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so... that's fortuna, not pinball?
< 1295143102 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is fortuna?
< 1295143103 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even more pointless a game
< 1295143158 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my internet is not flowing so i can't check if the name is international or just the name of a particular type of that game no one knows outside my apartment
< 1295143159 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :JiggleBox is a pinball game, just without flippers. If you are good at it you might be able to hit all of the drop targets twice per game.
< 1295143187 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, pinball games last for like 15 minutes before ball drops out..
< 1295143202 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's mostly a game of stamina...
< 1295143205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: oh i know...
< 1295143214 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: if i just implement an evaluator that works on pure Syn it would work :D
< 1295143215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uglyyy
< 1295143222 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: If you are good at it you can make it last longer.
< 1295143250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: or actually, I could put Add in Sem, but that is ugly!
< 1295143261 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :02:02 < Mahcaut> ⓘⓢ ⓘⓣ ⓣⓡⓤⓔ ⓣⓗⓐⓣ ⓘⓝⓣ ⓢⓘⓝ(ⓧ) ⓘⓝⓕ ❸.1❹
< 1295143265 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :02:02 < Mahcaut> ⓞⓞⓟⓢ
< 1295143270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ...xDDDD
< 1295143274 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :longer than 15 minutes? sure, that was just an indication of what kind of game pinball is, since "you might be able to hit all of the drop targets twice per game" sounded a bit less
< 1295143276 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :than 15 minutes
< 1295143279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that #math
< 1295143317 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Yes it does usually last less than 15 minutes. But sometimes it will go on longer.
< 1295143335 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also, the drop targets are not the entire game; mostly you hit the other things.)
< 1295143343 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if you don't hit at all, it just falls down or?
< 1295143355 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or jumps around just as long
< 1295143358 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just as randomly
< 1295143381 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: The ball might just fall down, but it might also jump around. Usually it will jump around for a while and then fall down before you have many points.
< 1295143395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant:
< 1295143397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Main> (Lam (\x -> Lam (\y -> Lam (\z -> App (App x y) z))))
< 1295143397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Lam (\v0 -> (Lam (\v1 -> (Lam (\v2 -> (App (App v0 v1) v2)))))))
< 1295143397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Main> eval (Lam (\x -> Lam (\y -> Lam (\z -> App (App x y) z))))
< 1295143397 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eval (Lam (\v0 -> (Lam (\v1 -> (Lam (\v2 -> *** Exception: /home/elliott/Code/lc/second.hs:9:35-49: Irrefutable pattern failed for pattern Main.Fun f'
< 1295143401 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yep, my Sem is insufficient
< 1295143407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i.e. quote isn't total)
< 1295143471 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you are not good at the game, you will probably fail to hit all of the drop targets even once.
< 1295143505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Main> eval (Lam (\x -> Lam (\y -> Lam (\z -> App (App x y) z))))
< 1295143505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eval (Lam (\v0 -> (Lam (\v1 -> (Lam (\v2 -> (App (App v0 v1) v2)))))))
< 1295143506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\o/
< 1295143506 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  |
< 1295143506 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : /'\
< 1295143550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Main> eval (App (Lam (\x -> x)) (Lam (\x -> x)))
< 1295143550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eval (Lam (\v0 -> v0))
< 1295143553 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it works, how amazing is that
< 1295143557 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :31 lines
< 1295143570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :7-lines extended with full printing functionality that actually works as Show
< 1295143574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. the result is valid Haskell
< 1295143574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295143579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(with the same result always)
< 1295143602 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :02:08 < gnee> lol 50% IS math
< 1295143602 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :02:09 < joo> It's like undone math cake.
< 1295143602 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :02:09 < gnee> lol
< 1295143602 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :02:09 < Mahcaut> ⓘⓢ ⓘⓣ ⓣⓡⓤⓔ ⓣⓗⓐⓣ ʃ ⓢⓘⓝ(ⓧ/ⓨ) ∝ ξ
< 1295143605 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...
< 1295143759 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what the fuck is this xD
< 1295143787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ok i need a tip
< 1295143787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : how do you get the limits of factorials
< 1295143787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ?
< 1295143811 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>:)
< 1295143832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: is it bad if my Sem type contains things that could be evaluated further?
< 1295143838 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in my defence, my functions never produce such values
< 1295143898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i'm asking for, like, spiritual guidance here
< 1295143935 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is bad
< 1295143961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but i need it to do proper showing! :P
< 1295143977 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: the only other way is to have an extra type with its own evaluator for no real reason...
< 1295143990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: basically, you could say (SApp (Fun ...) ...), even though that should never happen
< 1295143992 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's really for
< 1295143997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(SApp (SVar 42) ...)
< 1295143998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the like
< 1295143999 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: whta is it trying to do?
< 1295144034 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://sprunge.us/dCVK
< 1295144048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Var, SApp, and SVar exist solely to support showing
< 1295144053 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but the only problematic one is SApp
< 1295144067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in that you can construct (SApp (Fun ...) ...), which should be reduced to ((...) ...)
< 1295144078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no function there ever constructs that
< 1295144080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can manually
< 1295144097 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Sem shouldn't be the same as Syn
< 1295144108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well it isn't
< 1295144110 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just grew into that
< 1295144112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for this one special case
< 1295144115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is _not_ a mirror
< 1295144119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SApp is used differently to App
< 1295144125 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you suggest I do this?
< 1295144140 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do what?
< 1295144144 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this
< 1295144145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P
< 1295144153 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I don't know what the goal is
< 1295144167 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant:
< 1295144172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :data Syn = Lam (Syn -> Syn) | App Syn Syn
< 1295144172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :data Sem = Fun (Sem -> Sem)
< 1295144172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eval :: Syn -> Sem
< 1295144172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eval (Lam f) = Fun (eval . f . quote)
< 1295144172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eval (App f x) = f' (eval x) where Fun f' = eval f
< 1295144173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quote :: Sem -> Syn
< 1295144175 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quote (Fun f) = Lam (quote . f . eval)
< 1295144182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :extend Syn and preferably Sem to have a Show instance
< 1295144189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the most elegant, clean and short way possible
< 1295144197 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait how you can quote that Sem
< 1295144202 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tohught you have to have a variable thing in there
< 1295144208 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: HOA
< 1295144209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*HOAS
< 1295144224 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's beautiful :D
< 1295144234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i love how the Lam and Fun cases are mirrors of each other
< 1295144451 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: any ideas on how to extend it?
< 1295144468 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ext,md
< 1295144471 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :extend to what/?
< 1295144489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : extend Syn and preferably Sem to have a Show instance
< 1295144489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : in the most elegant, clean and short way possible
< 1295144504 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you need a syntax without lambda in is
< 1295144505 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in it
< 1295144514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: eh?
< 1295144520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it works fine with those, you just pass a gensym
< 1295144521 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty much
< 1295144530 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like SYN = Lam Name SYN | ...
< 1295144543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yeah but isn't that the same as basically passing a gensym
< 1295144551 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess it's because you can't really evaluate (f x) where f is a free variable
< 1295144556 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ok so do you suggest i make this a third type?
< 1295144562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Syn, Sem, NameSyn?
< 1295144589 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well maybe it is the same as GENSYM, but what I mean is that the lambda in Syn is completely cosmetic. Whereas the lambda in Sem is actually essential
< 1295144604 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://imgur.com/a/dhld6
< 1295144604 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://imgur.com/a/dhld6
< 1295144605 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://imgur.com/a/dhld6
< 1295144637 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1295144648 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Fortytwo
< 1295144680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm what should i call the new type :D
< 1295144683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NamedSyn is so ugly
< 1295144723 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: TrueType
< 1295144855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i can't write Syn -> Named
< 1295144859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because i'd have to pass a gensym
< 1295144878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I don't think there is *any* way of doing this without introducing a dummy Var type into Syn
< 1295144883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which then requires a brother in Sem
< 1295145025 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::S
< 1295145026 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=65201 stole my fucking name
< 1295145041 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yeah i'm lost as to how to do it...
< 1295145045 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is where HOAS fails
< 1295145052 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: HOAS is stupid :/
< 1295145055 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i know...maybe...
< 1295145058 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but really elegant for this
< 1295145061 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: there's no fold on it
< 1295145068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh?
< 1295145070 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(IIRC)
< 1295145120 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: btw, http://i.imgur.com/m4W5N.png
< 1295145252 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: hey wow how did you get it rendering like that
< 1295145253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is sweet
< 1295145259 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: LaTeX
< 1295145270 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: which is just hte problem....
< 1295145277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but, err, it looks like you're mixing up your polynomials and your renderings of polynomials
< 1295145287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I would put the rendering code in another module or whatever to avoid clashing?
< 1295145301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is amazing though
< 1295145309 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's the problem X)_
< 1295145315 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: why can't you do that :)
< 1295145333 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I can do polynomials on their own, and modular arithmetic on it's own.. But how do I do polynomials with modular arithmetic coefficients?
< 1295145354 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically I have to start combining LaTeX cleverly)
< 1295145418 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: every. single. thing... I add to this program ends up being a huge hassle
< 1295145431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ok i need to ask you
< 1295145441 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: why are you representing things with their latex display?!?!??!!
< 1295145448 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wdhat do you mean
< 1295145449 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?
< 1295145453 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maintain polynomials as abstract objects and then handle rendering to latex in another module
< 1295145457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that seems like the only sane thing to do by far ...
< 1295145565 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I cna't be bothered fixing this I just wish it waws done
< 1295145582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: well it seems like your program is structured  very wrongly
< 1295145584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*structured very
< 1295145591 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :realyl? :P
< 1295145596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's like you've defined + on IO Ints instead of Ints
< 1295145603 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha
< 1295145604 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, why would you even do that
< 1295145609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :latex is a separate thing!
< 1295145756 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: fix my program
< 1295145761 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::)
< 1295145766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: gimme the file :P
< 1295145774 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a whole bunch of fiels
< 1295145776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, only if you help program scapegoat
< 1295145779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: tar it up then
< 1295145780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or put it in
< 1295145781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a
< 1295145783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :scapegoat repository
< 1295145792 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lolj
< 1295145807 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :step 1 of putting smoething in a scapegoat repo:  Implement scapegoat?
< 1295145808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Main> showVarred 0 (varify (Lam (\x -> x)))
< 1295145808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"(\\v0 -> ((\\v1 -> ((\\v2 -> ((\\v3 -> ((\\v4 -> ((\\v5 -> ((\\v6 -> ((\\v7 -> ((\\v8 -> ((\\v9 -> ((\\v10 -> ((\\v11 -> ((\\v12 -> ((\\v13 -> ((\\v14 -> ((\\v15 -> ((\\v16 -> ((\\v17 -> ((\\v18 -> ((\\v19 -> ((\\v20 -> ((\\v21 -> ((\\v22 -> ((\\v23 -> ((\\v24 -> ((\\v25 -> ((\\v26 -> ((\\v27 -> ((\\v28 -> ((\\v29 -> ((\\v30 -> ((\\v31 -> ((\\v32 -> ((\\v33 -> ((\\v34 -> ((\\v35 -> ((\\v36 -> ((\\v37 -> ((\\v38 -> ((\\v39 -> ((\\v40 -> ((\\v41 -
< 1295145808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> ((\\v42 -> ((\\v43 -> ((\\v44 -> ((\\v45 -> ((\\v46 -> ((\\v47 -> ((\\v48 -> ((\\v49 -> ((\\v50 -> ((\\v51 -> ((\\v52 -> ((\\v53 -> ((\\v54 -> ((\\v55 -> ((\\v56 -> ((\\v57 -> ((\\v58 -> ((\\v59 -> ((\\v60 -> ((\\v61 -> ((\\v62 -> ((\\v63 -> ((\\v64 -> ((\\v65 -> ((\\v66 -> ((\\v67 -> ((\\v68 -> ((\\v69 -> ((\\v70 -> ((\\v71 -> ((\\v72 -> ((\\v73 -> ((\\v74 -> ((\\v75 -> ((\\v76 -> ((\\v77 -> ((\\v78 -> ((\\v79 -> ((\\v80 -> ((\\v81 -> ((\\v82
< 1295145809 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  : parse error on input `->'
< 1295145811 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-> ((\\v83 -> ((\\v84 -> ((\\v85 -> ((\\v86 -> ((\\v87 -> ((\\v88 -> ((\\v89 -> ((\\v90 -> ((\\v91 -> ((\\v92 -> ((\\v93 -> ((\\v94 -> ((\\v95 -> ((\\v96 -> ((\\v97 -> ((\\v98 -> ((\\v99 -> ((\\v100 -> ((\\v101 -> ((\\v102 -> ((\\v103 -> ((\\v104 -> ((\\v105 -> ((\\v106 -> ((\\v107 -> ((\\v108 -> ((\\v109 -> ((\\v110 -> ((\\v111 -> ((\\v112 -> ((\\v113 -> ((\\v114 -> ((\\v115 -> ((\\v116 -> ((\\v117 -> ((\\v118 -> ((\\v119 -> ((\\v120 -> ((\\v121
< 1295145816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -> ((\\v122 -> ((\\v123 -> ((\\v124 -> ((\\v125 -> ((\\v126 -> ((\\v127 -> ((\\v128 -> ((\\v129 -> ((\\v130 -> ((\\v131 -> ((\\v132 -> ((\\v133 -> ((\\v134 -> ((\\v135 -> ((\\v136 -> ((\\v137 -> ((\\v138 -> ((\\v139 -> ((\\v140 -> ((\\v141 -> ((\\v142 -> ((\\v143 -> ((\\v144 -> ((\\v145 -> ((\\v146 -> ((\\v147 -> ((\\v148 -> ((\\v149 -> ((\\v150 -> ((\\v151 -> ((\\v152 -> ((\\v153 -> ((\\v154 -> ((\\v155 -> ((\\v156 -> ((\\v157 -> ((\\v158 ->
< 1295145821 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i think my code is broken
< 1295145823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes, that's step one
< 1295145824 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why you shouldn't use /exec -o ^
< 1295145830 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that wasn't exec -o
< 1295145833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was copy and paste magic!
< 1295145923 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my idea didn't work :(
< 1295145924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hoas is lame
< 1295145925 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P
< 1295145931 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe
< 1295145935 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some people really love HOAS I think
< 1295145982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's so cool except you CAN'T FUCKING PRINT SHIT OUT
< 1295145996 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: so are you totally coding scapegoat
< 1295146029 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sort of
< 1295146040 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually you never said how it works
< 1295146051 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: quite well!
< 1295146056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>_>
< 1295146087 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My dogs got no nose
< 1295146103 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel like a pair of curtains
< 1295146133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pull yourself terrible
< 1295146542 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: A LaTeX object will render "\\sqrt{2}" for example... what should that stsring be called?
< 1295146558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: where it can be any object being rendered?
< 1295146559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: "latex"
< 1295146588 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(struct latex (string) ...) <-- need a better name for the string :/
< 1295146591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: seriously though... you want to make polynomial an abstract structure, now, and have one function to do latex rendering
< 1295146594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you'd do
< 1295146599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(to-latex poly1)
< 1295146600 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm rewriting it now :P
< 1295146602 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and get that picture out
< 1295146603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay
< 1295146604 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: make it
< 1295146606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: uh
< 1295146609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: call it "code"
< 1295146619 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: wait, what is the rest of struct latex
< 1295146620 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm
< 1295146624 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually this doesn't even work
< 1295146627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: wait, what is the rest of struct latex
< 1295146644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wanna know :)
< 1295146685 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it has a custom print method to render and display itself
< 1295146695 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: so it has only one field?
< 1295146699 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1295146707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I suggest you ditch that model.
< 1295146729 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why?
< 1295146730 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Have to-latex, taking a polynomial, and outputting a LaTeX string. Then have render-latex, taking a LaTeX string, and outputting a Racket picture.
< 1295146738 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Then have render, which is just render-latex . to-latex
< 1295146747 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: This will be much simpler, and you don't have to come up with variable names :-)
< 1295146756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Structures with one element are a bit iffy in Scheme I would say, they feel wrong
< 1295146772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Remember that you can use a single type for many semantic meanings in Scheme and derivatives
< 1295146786 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And if you can do things nicely with an existing type, such as strings and pictures, you should
< 1295146797 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: try that model, I think it'll turn out cleanly
< 1295146844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Why did you remove the gio dependency from mcmap?
< 1295146887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Also: Can I factor out the platform-specific bits (i.e. the ifdef WIN32/else) into a win32.c and a posix.c, so that the rest of the code just calls functions? ifdef-portability really irks me.
< 1295147006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: Oh, look at that; hMod isn't going to be updated.
< 1295147007 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ^
< 1295147015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stock Minecraft server until Bukkit comes out which will take months.
< 1295147053 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1295149507 0 :res0001!~res@96-35-248-155.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295150745 0 :res0001!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Ex-Chat
< 1295152949 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1295154796 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295158953 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had to do it with raw sockets to fix the Windows build (since GIO sockets there are just too broken); since I had that in place already I realized I could just use the same code for both. Also "yes", assuming it doesn't go all messy-looking from that.
< 1295160287 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.
< 1295160430 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, so hMod won't be updated because they couldn't figure out how to do that even after being "all day" at it; everyone knows that either you can do it in a day or else it's just impossible.
< 1295160472 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, just because they won't doesn't mean someone else won't go through the trouble of cobbling together a build.
< 1295160653 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least Bukkit is enterprisey enough to have trouble with "licensing issues" such that they need to "get in contact with Mojang to discuss what we're doing".
< 1295160685 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minecraft server mods seem to be serious business.
< 1295160924 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, someone's public server (the alarmingly named "FurMine") is listed as to having a beta 1.2 hMod build.
< 1295161040 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also a Finnish server ("Kemicraft") says they're running 1.2_01 with their own unofficial hMod build.
< 1295161234 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(They also sell "VIP privileges" == access to a kit for 3/5/10 EUR -- steel/diamond/both kits -- on Kemicraft. That's enterprisey in a whole another way.)
< 1295161856 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295162028 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RIICHI!!!
< 1295162074 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rîti?
< 1295162139 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yes, same thing.
< 1295162152 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Care to explain the significance thereof?
< 1295162174 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Mahjong.
< 1295162181 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, *duh*.
< 1295162277 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know how many different names the normal chess game is called by?
< 1295162323 0 :TLUL!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1295162455 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What can you make out from this chess position?   http://play.chessvariants.org/pbm/play.php?game=123456+Chess&log=maeko-makov333-2009-359-344
< 1295162584 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Probably gets worse when you realise that chess has a freaking *family tree* going on.
< 1295162596 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And that each one has its own name.
< 1295162740 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The normal chess game is called FIDE chess, Orthochess, Orthodox chess, International chess, Western chess, and the "Mad Queen" variant.
< 1295162801 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And that's just in English. >:D
< 1295162926 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that's just in English.
< 1295163143 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know any more that are used in English?
< 1295163191 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Normal chess".
< 1295163250 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, of course. And also "chess"
< 1295163645 0 :TLUL!~TLUL@wikia/The-last-username-left JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295163650 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What can you figure out from this chess position?
< 1295163672 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is the black player's turn. What move?
< 1295163777 0 :unenana!~unenana@ANantes-552-1-149-251.w90-1.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295163848 0 :unenana!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit
< 1295163997 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can see five ways to get out of check. Can you find more?
< 1295164266 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Roll one of those d6's?
< 1295164276 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Not allowed.
< 1295164310 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You may increase one of them by one, though. But doing so would not get you out of check, anyways.)
< 1295164566 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295164799 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended
< 1295164800 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295165409 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@p4FF6817C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295165412 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host
< 1295165412 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295165965 0 :Wamanuz3!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295165967 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The black player is going to lose the queen.
< 1295165996 0 :Wamanuz3!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295166471 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1295167555 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ineiros: Oh, look at that; hMod isn't going to be updated.
< 1295167555 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: ^
< 1295167555 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Stock Minecraft server until Bukkit comes out which will take months.
< 1295167560 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well, nothing to do about it
< 1295167563 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(source?)
< 1295167619 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah found it
< 1295167621 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well
< 1295169951 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295170680 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried to knock a channel because I was not invited, but I do not believe there is anyone there.
< 1295170831 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-14-42.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295172365 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Answer me!
< 1295172368 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Answer me!
< 1295173060 0 :impomatic!~chatzilla@86.241.112.87.dyn.plus.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295173066 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi :-)
< 1295173130 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does anyone have a TRS-80?
< 1295173832 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=65201 <<< this guy is an idiot, you have 3 dimensions in minecraft, which basically lets you do this already, and even his trivial diagrams aren't optimal
< 1295173839 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait umm
< 1295173864 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :scratch that
< 1295173871 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's so stupid i don't need an argument
< 1295173970 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe if you could color more objects than just wool
< 1295173978 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then redstone would be one of those
< 1295174028 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and also i think that's a good idea, just that the guy is an idiot :D
< 1295174067 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"only an idiot would come up with this particular good idea"
< 1295174087 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :                                    o
< 1295174336 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Psssht, bluestone is bettr.
< 1295174339 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*better
< 1295174499 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :surely, that would be a very small-scale thing only useful, but it'd take 3 minutes to implement
< 1295174506 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*-only useful
< 1295174517 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did some heavy refactoring on that sentence
< 1295174560 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what is your bluestone like exactly
< 1295174580 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it just a general idea of what you can do with it or some actual spex
< 1295174638 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It allows more interactions with the environment and requires constant power, basically.
< 1295174736 0 :Wamanuz4!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295174803 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and what are those interactions
< 1295174894 0 :Wamanuz3!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1295174934 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean if i find bluestone ore, what can i do with it, can i make a bluestone block? can i eat it? can i feed it to a creeper to make it walk backwards?
< 1295175044 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, well, you can wire things together with it.
< 1295175092 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, okay?
< 1295175102 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does that make them move?
< 1295175121 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One of the things to do was to have a more elegant wiring system.
< 1295175130 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Redstone's is too clunky.
< 1295175202 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err k
< 1295175212 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought you had moving blocks and shit
< 1295175219 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so how is the wiring system more elegant?
< 1295175241 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :More compact, can be put on roofs and walls etc.
< 1295175257 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :couldn't you just make redstone do thate
< 1295175258 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*that
< 1295175271 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, probably.
< 1295175331 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::\
< 1295175341 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i should've asked elliott
< 1295175358 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he'd've been all like AND THEN LET ME IMPROVISE SOME SEMANTICS FOR HOW BLUESTONE MOVES BLOCKS AROUND
< 1295175658 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : maybe if you could color more objects than just wool <-- iirc someone was working on a mod for stained glass
< 1295175690 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wouldn't work on SMP as it currently stands due to needing to add new stuff client side for it
< 1295175726 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295175836 0 :drakhan!~drakhan@c34-243.icpnet.pl JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295175846 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, he would also be be like "omg lets add lava and TNT to it" or such.
< 1295175867 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(nothing wrong with that, in moderation)
< 1295176210 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when a bluestone signal is sent to lav
< 1295176211 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a
< 1295176216 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a huge lava monster is born
< 1295176231 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also
< 1295176238 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when bluestone signal is applied to tnt
< 1295176245 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a huge tnt monster is born
< 1295176258 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like a creeper but slightly deadlier.
< 1295176560 0 :acetoline!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1295177043 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :?
< 1295177327 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, "slightly"?
< 1295177409 0 :drakhan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi there.
< 1295177443 0 :drakhan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As I think, many people in here are interested in esoteric, spiritual development, occult, yes?
< 1295177502 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :drakhan, no. It is about esoteric programming languages
< 1295177640 0 :drakhan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, my bad :x
< 1295177726 0 :Tritonio_GR!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295177914 0 :drakhan!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :?
< 1295178493 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Been a while since we had a neopagan.
< 1295178958 0 :Wamanuz5!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295179073 0 :Wamanuz4!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295179220 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Chrome doesn't have AdBlock Plus.
< 1295179225 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ugh.
< 1295180171 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295180316 0 :Wamanuz5!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
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< 1295183135 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1295183966 0 :Wamanuz2!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1295186186 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295186489 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295187083 0 :Wamanuz2!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295187236 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295187415 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295188108 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1295189506 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out
< 1295189850 0 :Wamanuz2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295189984 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295190472 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"B has got it into her nut that A is in love with her. Now until recently, B was engaged to ... errr" "Shall we call him C, sir?" "Well alright, Caesar is as good a name as any."
< 1295190536 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1295190783 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295190812 0 :cheater00!~cheater@e181136042.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295190834 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to remember the names one cryptologist used that were real names but pronounced like A and B
< 1295190842 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think Bea was one of them
< 1295190850 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah
< 1295190873 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the other one was something irish-like and thus impossible to guess the spelling of
< 1295190944 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Abhmnghe?
< 1295190948 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and iirc it was male
< 1295190954 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: not _that_ absurd
< 1295190969 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something like aeion or the like, i think
< 1295191268 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah found it
< 1295191270 0 :Tritonio!~TrT@athedsl-259991.home.otenet.gr JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295191272 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aodh and Bea
< 1295191279 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...
< 1295191318 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(wikipedia's Irish name article to the rescue)
< 1295191359 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Card Colm's column is where i saw it first
< 1295191521 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um *-'s
< 1295191548 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jaoSzCfa9OM
< 1295191554 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow.
< 1295191681 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295191847 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable!
< 1295191998 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295192003 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant!
< 1295192020 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey Phantom_Hoover
< 1295192027 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hows it going
< 1295192053 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Left.
< 1295192100 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :07:13:54 * oerjan tries to remember the names one cryptologist used that were real names but pronounced like A and B
< 1295192112 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone deviated form Alice and Bob? TREASON
< 1295192114 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: oh, neat
< 1295192153 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it wasn't actually cryptology btw, it was mathematical card games
< 1295192159 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially like how it's all sunk into the ground to what must be the same depth as the height of those example cells
< 1295192348 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295192368 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295192756 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295192790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi
< 1295192830 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you don't beleive in caetgory theory you will be eater by sabre toothed tigers
< 1295192855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :category theory is like GOD, how can you BELIEVE in it!!!OI
< 1295192858 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Every time you say you don't believe in category theory a fairy dies.
< 1295192874 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://homepages.inf.ed.ac.uk/s0894694/agda-course/
< 1295192877 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wdat's it going to teach?
< 1295192877 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# Uncomment to get a beep at grub start
< 1295192878 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#GRUB_INIT_TUNE="480 440 1"
< 1295192880 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg
< 1295192883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can make it play a tune
< 1295192887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :best day
< 1295192894 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: so you'll be gored by big cats?
< 1295192903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*groan*
< 1295192925 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hey i wouldn't even have noticed if not for the egregious misspellings
< 1295192933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295193042 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hi
< 1295193091 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi
< 1295193142 0 :sftp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1295193295 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant, I could always break in if given suitable payment.
< 1295193326 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, and I can use the opportunity to kidnap Conor McBride.
< 1295193398 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295193545 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: do you have to pay?
< 1295193566 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know.
< 1295193568 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295193578 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://i.imgur.com/J0U4t.png
< 1295193580 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I have other things to waste my time on.
< 1295193587 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Kernel modesetting isn't supported by the native nvidia drivers, right?
< 1295193613 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: great! did you try my idea of ditching the latex type?
< 1295193616 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no
< 1295193621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psht :p
< 1295193630 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's this?
< 1295193636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, did you still not make polynomials abstract objects?
< 1295193643 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://paste.lisp.org/display/118670
< 1295193658 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is my generic function system
< 1295193663 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ouch... i'm not sure you want to do that
< 1295193670 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do what
< 1295193672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that
< 1295193679 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :be specific
< 1295193680 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :programming, ever again
< 1295193683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that whole paste :P
< 1295193697 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION didn't actually open the file
< 1295193764 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Okay you should see my actual code first, because maybe you have imagined it is different than it is
< 1295193773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :possible
< 1295193881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION reboots
< 1295193926 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : programming, ever again <-- what
< 1295193962 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://i.imgur.com/sI2Ot.png & http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=XWS1MuCj
< 1295194033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295194080 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" do what" " programming, ever again"
< 1295194127 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i figured if elliott isn't direct about it, it must be pretty devastating
< 1295194155 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if elliott was a doctor and a guy had cancer he'd go to the guy and say "hey mister X, you have cancer"
< 1295194169 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah.
< 1295194183 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then the guy'd be like "oh my god, is it terminal" and elliott would be all like "yes."
< 1295194222 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1295194234 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU KILLED THEM BOTH
< 1295194243 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION starts getting nervous
< 1295194258 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295194266 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eek, zombie
< 1295194300 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the me who'd be his secretary would go all like isn't terminal cancer one despair-filled can, sir
< 1295194309 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and elliott would go like "lol, classic oklo"
< 1295194329 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then the guy would leave because he thought elliott was an occultist doctor
< 1295194352 0 :sftp!~sftp@79.174.49.208 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295194372 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but he's actually just a completely insane doctor that specializes in curing methods that aren't at all practical, just weird.
< 1295194388 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and everyone would be mining the walls of the hospital all day
< 1295194400 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i'm having a dream
< 1295194404 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minecraft hospital!
< 1295194410 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i need to go steal some yoghurt ->
< 1295194419 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, extcore! I think I could build jonguilexiphonaugh on that (http://hackage.haskell.org/package/extcore)
< 1295194430 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: beware of creepers in the corridors!
< 1295194447 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You pay taxes in the form of wheat and then there's just a dispenser that throws bread at you.
< 1295194451 0 :sftp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295194451 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mm yohgurt
< 1295194458 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was a typo
< 1295194469 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yo, hgurt
< 1295194477 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My yog hurts!
< 1295194493 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: too much yoga!
< 1295194542 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :beware of yog sothoth
< 1295194687 0 :sftp!~sftp@79.174.49.208 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295194860 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION falls into a pit of boredom
< 1295194866 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295194875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ubuntu is working stupidly well
< 1295194904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :08:09:15  if elliott was a doctor and a guy had cancer he'd go to the guy and say "hey mister X, you have cancer"
< 1295194904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :08:09:43  and then the guy'd be like "oh my god, is it terminal" and elliott would be all like "yes."
< 1295194904 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3
< 1295194912 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it's certainly good to hear that ubuntu is so good at working stupidly!
< 1295194919 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would have caused the cancer, naturally.
< 1295194927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i see that code but i still think you should do it my way :)
< 1295194942 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because i'm awesome, you see
< 1295194983 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: but then j-invariant might get an awesomeness overdose!  have you thought of THAT?
< 1295194989 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tru
< 1295195002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what I would do is: (define (render x) (texvc-render (to-latex x)))
< 1295195006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: then, using your generic thing
< 1295195014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(define-generic-procedure (to-latex x) define-latex)
< 1295195019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: and they return strings
< 1295195022 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :render flesh
< 1295195033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: then you can just do (to-latex 3) to get "3" and (render 3) to get $3$
< 1295195050 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: oh and btw i'm sure Racket already has a library for multiple-dispatch style stuff like you are doing with define-generic procedure
< 1295195059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a proper type system too rather than using predicates like that
< 1295195074 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295195153 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :08:13:39  ah, extcore! I think I could build jonguilexiphonaugh on that (http://hackage.haskell.org/package/extcore)
< 1295195153 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :naturally
< 1295195219 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You know, Minecraft is sorta like Eversion Lite.
< 1295195236 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the major obstacle for making progress on that is that I need a frontend for the source language, and I think haskell should be fine as that source language
< 1295195267 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ...*how*?
< 1295195288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Oh, it's like *LEGO*. For kids." "Sheesh, this grass is obnoxiously bright. And I'm this stupid block-guy?" "And I make a little cute house. How wonderful and mature." "Hey, this cave looks interesting." "Bit dark in here, oh well." [hurrrrrrrrng] "WHAT THE FUCK WAS THAT" [slrrrrrrp] "AH OH GOD WHAT ARE YOU I'M DYING OH FUCK" [You died!]
< 1295195293 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otoh, I'll need to check that I can actually use GHC Core directly :)
< 1295195308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I said SORTA
< 1295195318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: what is it, again?
< 1295195327 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the kim jong-ilasjoifjofdgjkhklfjgh
< 1295195337 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: not much more than a name :)
< 1295195448 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: jonguilexiphonaugh, I don't see why you have such problems spelling it :P
< 1295195454 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite
< 1295195467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: so you are totally going to use SCAPEGOAT to manage the jonguilexiphonaugh repository???????
< 1295195470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes????
< 1295195477 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I might if you tell me what the heck that is
< 1295195497 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it have an implementation yet?
< 1295195599 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295196057 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, down?
< 1295196081 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: not _yet_, but i am actually working on it
< 1295196090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : j-invariant: what I would do is: (define (render x) (texvc-render (to-latex x)))
< 1295196090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : j-invariant: then, using your generic thing
< 1295196090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (define-generic-procedure (to-latex x) define-latex)
< 1295196090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : j-invariant: and they return strings
< 1295196090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : j-invariant: then you can just do (to-latex 3) to get "3" and (render 3) to get $3$
< 1295196093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : j-invariant: oh and btw i'm sure Racket already has a library for multiple-dispatch style stuff like you are doing with define-generic procedure
< 1295196096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : and a proper type system too rather than using predicates like that
< 1295196123 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm going to assume Vorpal has said "down?"
< 1295196124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and reply yes
< 1295196185 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295196186 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: did you see my image and source code paste
< 1295196190 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1295196194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and replied with that suggestion :>
< 1295196665 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://ompldr.org/vNzA1Nw
< 1295196680 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION looks
< 1295196682 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1295196712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(That screenshot really makes me wish for biome-compliant grass in Painterly that worked on the side (Notch's bug).)
< 1295196715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Lovely colour of grass.)
< 1295196721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Blends in really well with the scenery.
< 1295196823 0 :TLUL!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :TLUL|afk
< 1295196824 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295196836 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't figure how to remap a key
< 1295196880 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: in what
< 1295196889 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UBUNTU
< 1295196894 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what key to what other key
< 1295196964 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295197033 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: "turn off internet" key to do nothing
< 1295197065 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Run "xev" from terminal and focus the window it pops up, wait a second, press the key, and look (without moving mouse or anything) at the last event in the terminla
< 1295197086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Specifically the "keycode" part of a KeyPress/KeyRelease event pair.
< 1295197087 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I tried that :( then xmodmapping it to NoSymbol
< 1295197096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What went wrong?
< 1295197108 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well there was no error messages at all, but it doesn't do anything
< 1295197114 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the key just continued to do what it  does
< 1295197131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what file did you put it in?
< 1295197148 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what file? no file
< 1295197156 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what command did you run
< 1295197157 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just use   xmodmap -e 'keycode ...
< 1295197202 0 :TLUL|afk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295197207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: right... just _have_ to check, you didn't reboot after right? :-P
< 1295197215 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no I didn't
< 1295197226 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Itried putting the command into .xinitrc and rebotting though
< 1295197230 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that ddidn't do anything either
< 1295197233 0 :TLUL|afk!~TLUL@wikia/The-last-username-left JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295197253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you did "keycode 358934593475345 = NoSymbol"?
< 1295197259 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1295197265 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except its' a 3 digit number
< 1295197270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah yeah
< 1295197276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: probably what happens is that it turns it off in hardware, and then sends the key
< 1295197280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so there's nothing you can do
< 1295197281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry :/
< 1295197285 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will try BIOS
< 1295197289 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe there is a configure option there
< 1295197292 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably the best idea, yeah
< 1295197295 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I don't knoww hot to access that.
< 1295197355 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: erm when you boot your pc up hammer delete and f2
< 1295197358 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those are the most common keys
< 1295197366 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it usually says on the screen somewhere what key will do it
< 1295197373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but try del and f2 first, just hammer them constantly :P
< 1295197383 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"If the OS can't see anything when you press the brightness keys, it could be because they're handled directly by the BIOS. The battle is not completely lost — it is in principle possible to hack the BIOS — but the difficulty level is considerably raised."
< 1295197420 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: just try booting into the bios, sometimes they have options to disable the keys
< 1295197424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not hard to use the bios :-P
< 1295197457 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you do it?
< 1295197464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant:  j-invariant: erm when you boot your pc up hammer delete and f2
< 1295197464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : those are the most common keys
< 1295197464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : it usually says on the screen somewhere what key will do it
< 1295197464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : but try del and f2 first, just hammer them constantly :P
< 1295197476 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay thanks ill try!
< 1295197479 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then it's just an easy menu-driven interface :P
< 1295197483 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1295197708 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295197718 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: great! that fixed it, thanks
< 1295197724 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: :)
< 1295197725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no problem
< 1295197730 0 :cheater00!~cheater@e181142091.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295197738 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FINALLY
< 1295197744 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was annoying me for ages
< 1295197749 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kept pressing "turn off internet" by accident
< 1295197931 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah
< 1295199326 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I g9ess I will dgo on minecraft
< 1295199340 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :h I can intall stuff now
< 1295199360 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes?
< 1295199370 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: "I would like detailed birch bark for my birch trees." or "I would like detailed dark birch bark for my birch trees.", latter is best, see the customiser's previews
< 1295199379 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the former is just too high contrast, *really* ugly
< 1295199394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's brighter in-game than it looks there, btw, for both of them
< 1295199396 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the former I think. well, I'll see how it looks when I find a birch
< 1295199404 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are they biome specific?
< 1295199410 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not relaly
< 1295199411 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*really
< 1295199418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try tree farming
< 1295199424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or just going to ungenerated terrain :D
< 1295199475 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how do I find the most recent versions of e.g. optimine?
< 1295199476 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : or just going to ungenerated terrain :D <--- that would be far and take ages
< 1295199486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: um you get them from the forum
< 1295199491 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=132717
< 1295199504 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah how do you know that's the most recent one?
< 1295199505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I can link you to all the mods I mentioned if you want, they can be hard to google
< 1295199512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: um because it's started by the mod author
< 1295199514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who keeps the thread updated
< 1295199519 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay
< 1295199522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they can edit the fpost
< 1295199523 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*the post
< 1295199530 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :,elliott I just didnt'w atn to install a bunch of weird versions like an idiot :P
< 1295199554 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: with mip mapping, the link in the first post is actuallywrong
< 1295199560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I can link you to the correct one, but remember the order :P
< 1295199577 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*mipmapping, please be more careful about typos
< 1295199580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :optimine -> mcregion -> mipmapping -> better light+grass -> texture pack
< 1295199589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's actually MIP mapping
< 1295199591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shortened to mipmapping
< 1295199597 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so mip mapping is correct if you eschew lowercase
< 1295199601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ergo f u
< 1295199637 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just needed to point out j-invariant's awesomely typo filled message
< 1295199655 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which admittedly just had two centers of typoty
< 1295199661 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :typoty?
< 1295199663 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyhow
< 1295199671 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: when you get to mipmapping let me know and i'll link you to the right version for the new beta
< 1295199685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: do you use painterly already?
< 1295199691 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no I don't use any mods of anything yet
< 1295199698 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm trying optimine now
< 1295199705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1295199709 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so is mipmapping from the latin word MIP
< 1295199711 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait
< 1295199713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes
< 1295199713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295199716 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did i ask this already
< 1295199725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: multium in parvo or something
< 1295199727 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't, but i asked something related
< 1295199731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :multum in parvo
< 1295199732 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :parvo?
< 1295199735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :many in one
< 1295199738 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well
< 1295199741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"much in a small space"
< 1295199747 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how do I check if optimine is working :|
< 1295199751 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you don't, it is
< 1295199757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you did the steps, and it starts, then it's working :)
< 1295199760 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guh
< 1295199766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you forgot to delete META-INF it wouldn't even start
< 1295199768 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you did it right
< 1295199771 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea whether this is any different from the normal one
< 1295199779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is, don't worry
< 1295199780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do mcregion next
< 1295199791 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also elliott, don't you have to reinstall these mods every time there is an update
< 1295199791 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: painterly has rather bad defaults and HUNDREDS of customisation options, so you'll want to go through http://painterlypack.net/customizer.php sometime soon
< 1295199796 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, still no sign of a server?
< 1295199799 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes, but it really doesn't take that long
< 1295199801 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: no, it's updated
< 1295199808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I can apply all these mods in like... 3 minutes
< 1295199812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: besides, you won't have to do it every update
< 1295199815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since they won't be updated themselves yet
< 1295199821 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's really every update plus a few days
< 1295199822 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no, I mean that SSP one.
< 1295199826 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Oh. Indeed.
< 1295199830 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: *SMP
< 1295199838 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: man I dunno if I like this it sounds like a problematic thing
< 1295199845 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: But a322 is back up!
< 1295199847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: like what?
< 1295199847 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :having to convert saves back and forth if an update comes out
< 1295199852 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yaaaaay!
< 1295199859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: You don't have to install it, but it's only one command to convert them.
< 1295199863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it speeds up single-player immensely.
< 1295199866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's your game ofc :P
< 1295199876 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just sounds like somethign that might go wrong
< 1295199896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Scaevolus is a very well-respected modder
< 1295199902 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: in fact part of optimine was included in the latest update
< 1295199906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by Mojang
< 1295199910 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd trust it, but it's up to you :P
< 1295199914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is a big speedup
< 1295199945 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Notch and the Mojangs: http://i.imgur.com/CVAYf.jpg (via reddit)
< 1295199953 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I saw.
< 1295199955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you can skip mcregion, all the other mods will still work fine
< 1295199982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i'll link you to the right mipmapping download
< 1295199994 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://up.dafk.net/files/9de39/minecraftmipmap4dev.zip
< 1295199995 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how do I know if mcregion has installed properly :/
< 1295200001 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it is
< 1295200002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't worry
< 1295200006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's impossible to install it wrongly
< 1295200009 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you copied the files over
< 1295200011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it starts
< 1295200014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you did it right
< 1295200030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you don't have to delete META-INF in future btw, since you already did
< 1295200048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: note that Better Light/Grass are applied differently to most other mods
< 1295200063 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it does feel faster but I don't know if it REALLY is
< 1295200071 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it's not slower, so who cares :P
< 1295200072 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, has mcmap been updated for Beta 1.2?
< 1295200075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No.
< 1295200093 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'M VERY DISAPPOINTED
< 1295200096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://www.multiupload.com/ZJWVAP6EUB this is better light/grass -- unpack the zip into ~/.minecraft, you don't need to touch the jar
< 1295200105 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: then do "java -jar MrMPatcher.jar" inside .minecraft
< 1295200122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: tick Better Light, Better Grass, and SMChat if you want (simplemap doesn't work without tweaking in the latest version), and click patch
< 1295200136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: only do that after mipmapping though
< 1295200149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise mipmapping will overwrite better light & better grass
< 1295200166 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay
< 1295200193 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No, but now that there's a vanilla 1.2_01 up, I think I'll update it.
< 1295200207 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As soon as this render finishes.
< 1295200218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'll factor out portamability stuff into separate files first.
< 1295200228 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll test OS X compilation sometime too.
< 1295200248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: SO CAN I MOVE THE MCMAP REPOSITORY TO GOATPEN, THE ONLY SCAPEGOAT HOST
< 1295200252 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*THAT MATTERS
< 1295200261 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think it'll really overlap.
< 1295200267 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can host your ML rewrite there. :p
< 1295200351 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I installed MrMMods but it doesn't show in mods
< 1295200359 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: it shouldn't
< 1295200361 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is no official mod support yet
< 1295200367 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: did you run the patcher and everything?
< 1295200380 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1295200384 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: just load a world
< 1295200386 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the lighting has improved ;D
< 1295200388 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: and look at the lighting of blocks
< 1295200388 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep
< 1295200391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: and also, look at grass on a hill
< 1295200394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'll see it goes down all the way
< 1295200407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: btw you have to use better grass for now, better light on its own doesn't work properly
< 1295200411 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey I found a way to get infinite wool
< 1295200414 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: did you get mipmapping installed?
< 1295200425 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just take some wool, drown yourself go and pick it up again and the sheep will have its wool back
< 1295200436 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1295200439 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I have no idea, I did "install it" but there is no confirmation that it worked
< 1295200451 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: go to the top of a mountain and look at a mountain further away
< 1295200457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it looks smooth, then mipmapping is working
< 1295200470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also if you stand on some land and look at where it meets the first block on top
< 1295200474 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if that's smoothed, then it's working
< 1295200475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also
< 1295200478 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you look at a big sea
< 1295200483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it just becomes blue the further away it is
< 1295200484 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it's working
< 1295200509 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hah, a squid on land
< 1295200518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Screenshot?
< 1295200522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SILLY SQUID. YOU'RE NOT MEANT TO BE THERE.
< 1295200538 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it is next to the water stream near subrary bridge
< 1295200546 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It'll probably be gone by the time I get there.
< 1295200557 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm standing there atm. Just get on now and walk there?
< 1295200559 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do I do mcpatcher now
< 1295200570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: no
< 1295200571 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or wait, now it went away
< 1295200578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you use that to apply the texture pac
< 1295200579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :k
< 1295200586 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: go through http://painterlypack.net/customizer.php and make your selections
< 1295200593 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well it was moving weirdly, that a screenshot can't capture
< 1295200601 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like how pigs move when on fire
< 1295200613 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: mcpatcher's checkboxes are confusingly named, but basically you want to have them all ticked apart from Custom Water and Animated Water (trust me, even if this makes no sense, this gives you painterly water and keeps the rest working)
< 1295200620 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: but you need to feed it a texture pack
< 1295200620 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bit instead of up/down, it did it horizontally
< 1295200622 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus http://painterlypack.net/customizer.php
< 1295200622 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but*
< 1295200645 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://github.com/downloads/pclewis/mcpatcher/mcpatcher-1.1.11.jar put this wherever, but yeah, you need to customise painterly first
< 1295200648 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah no it is there
< 1295200650 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just timed out
< 1295200651 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I can give you the painterly pack I use
< 1295200655 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which I used to take that screenshot you saw
< 1295200659 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you don't wanna bother customising everything
< 1295200742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: just ping me if you want me to upload it
< 1295200749 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1295200894 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295200900 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, he's added a yet another complicated "stream of variable-sized items" packet field format that needs to be completely decoded in order to be skipped over. GRAA, why can't he just add a length field in the protocol.
< 1295200940 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://i.imgur.com/emifw.png
< 1295200942 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that normal?
< 1295200956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: press F5
< 1295200976 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: did you use the mipmapping link i gave you? the one in the post is wrong
< 1295200981 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't tell from the screeny but i'm not sure you have mipmapping
< 1295200998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: why do you undef main on win32?
< 1295201018 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I mean the grass http://i.imgur.com/gFNHg.png
< 1295201035 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that's Better Grass :)
< 1295201042 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, you do have mipmapping
< 1295201047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but why do you use such a tiny window to play in?!
< 1295201062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: btw better grass looks nicer with painterly
< 1295201063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by far
< 1295201070 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since with painterly, normal grass goes down 2/3rds of the way
< 1295201091 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay im configuring paintlerly :)
< 1295201097 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Because otherwise SDL.h redefines it to SDL_main, but that causes mingw to go all "there is no main() method in the application, I'll use WinMain as the entry point" even if I statically link against libSDLmain.
< 1295201103 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: my configuration is the BESTEST!!!
< 1295201114 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Ah, I'll put it in platform.h then, as ugly as that is.
< 1295201134 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would like a crude creeper large pumpkin.
< 1295201176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: that's what i have :D
< 1295201189 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: btw you probably do not want biome compliant grass
< 1295201194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(biome-compliant leaves are fine)
< 1295201200 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it doesn't work for side-grass, because Notch sucks
< 1295201215 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, Jeeves and Wooster went downright crazy in the last season.
< 1295201250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: btw I'd do "cp ~/.minecraft/bin/{minecraft.jar,minecraft.good.jar}" now
< 1295201256 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just in case you mess up mcpatcher, happens to the best of us :P
< 1295201269 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh for goodness sake this customizer is MASSIVE
< 1295201277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yes it is, want my precustomised pack? :P
< 1295201285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some of us take our painterly customisation err...quite seriously
< 1295201292 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btr
< 1295201300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btr?
< 1295201307 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have  minecraft.jar, minercaft (copy).jar and minecraft.mrm2011-1-16-0
< 1295201312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha
< 1295201319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make minecraft.patched.up.the.wazoo.jar
< 1295201320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something
< 1295201324 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(copy) is my backup, I think mrm is Mr... backup
< 1295201331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah
< 1295201336 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you want a backup with all the patches though
< 1295201338 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :before mcpatcher
< 1295201341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: If I turn -DWIN32 into -DPLATFORM=win32, is that okay?
< 1295201386 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is no -DWIN32 at the moment.
< 1295201390 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's mingw-defined automagically.
< 1295201403 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I can do -DPLATFORM=win32 if you want.
< 1295201419 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Or even BETTER
< 1295201422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#ifdef WIN32
< 1295201426 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#define PLATFORM win32
< 1295201428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#endif
< 1295201430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BEST IDEA??
< 1295201451 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, why nots, assuming it ends up in all the places that test for PLATFORM.
< 1295201530 0 :acetoline!~acetoline@125-237-12-196.jetstream.xtra.co.nz JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295201547 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295201566 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295201573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :platform.h:9: error: pasting "PLATFORM" and "." does not give a valid preprocessing token
< 1295201576 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gah, how are you meant to do that, again?
< 1295201594 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295201602 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or maybe I should just use a conditional, wacky.
< 1295201604 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometimes you need a separate macro, if you want it to expand PLATFORM.
< 1295201615 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#define PLATFORM_HEADER_NAME_(x) x##.h
< 1295201615 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#define PLATFORM_HEADER_NAME PLATFORM_HEADER_NAME_(PLATFORM)
< 1295201615 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295201615 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#define QUOTE_(x) #x
< 1295201615 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#define QUOTE(x) QUOTE_(x)
< 1295201615 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#define PLATFORM_HEADER QUOTE(PLATFORM_HEADER_NAME)
< 1295201615 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#include PLATFORM_HEADER
< 1295201622 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I actually just want that first macro there to work without erroring :-P
< 1295201625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ORRRR I could just do it manually.
< 1295201673 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Or, wait, I'll just pass -iwin32.h to the compiler.
< 1295201675 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's the "sanest" thing.
< 1295201701 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, *-include win32.h
< 1295201756 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see what's so unsane about just a single #if ..  #include "win32.h" #elif .. #include "posix.h" #else #error "your platform is bad" #endif chain somewhere. (As opposed to trying to autodefine the header name like that.
< 1295201763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Mind if I ditch useful.make? It's bugging me.
< 1295201765 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Jeeves and Wooster managed to go three and half seasons with no transvestites, but being British and all just couldn't make it much further.
< 1295201772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Yes, yes, so HYPOCRITICAL.)
< 1295201776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Verily.
< 1295201788 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You added it, of course you can get rid of it too if you like.
< 1295201792 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sweet, I'm gonna delete all the files I added. For anarchy!
< 1295201823 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: cant' decide between:
< 1295201823 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The core of my world is delicious candycane. ◊
< 1295201823 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PreviewPreview
< 1295201824 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to live on the back of a cosmic space turtle.
< 1295201839 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I use boring ol' bedrock, but I'd go for space-turtle.
< 1295201846 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The candycane is rather glaring when you're in a dark mine at bedrock.
< 1295201899 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295201901 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://p.zem.fi/c179 -- *so* pretty. (The new packet field format is: read records until id byte == 127; record size depends on three top bits of ID byte, with 0 → 1 byte, 1 → 2 bytes, 2/3 → 4 bytes, 4 → length-prefixed UTF-8 string, 5 → 5 bytes.)
< 1295201903 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, working on mcmap update?
< 1295201908 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Yet another place where it can get broken.)
< 1295201927 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, the whole protocol changed fundamentally?
< 1295201941 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, he just added yet another field type that doesn't have a fixed length.
< 1295201946 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1295201956 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's used for something mob-related.
< 1295201964 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1295202106 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds
< 1295202340 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: What would be your most approved-of renaming of main? (The platforms will handle main() itself.)
< 1295202379 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what's up with all the non-square moons and suns? Weird
< 1295202388 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I use them :P
< 1295202394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Plain circular moon, circular sun)
< 1295202431 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anything, really; but preferrably something that includes the substring "main". (And no, something incorporating the verb "remain" doesn't quite count.)
< 1295202471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll make it mcmap_main.
< 1295202492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: What's this setlocale(LC_ALL, "") nonsense?
< 1295202496 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Finally made my pack
< 1295202497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are we a locale-friendly app now?
< 1295202497 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :java.io.IOException: Server returned HTTP response code: 504 for URL: http://www.minecraft.net/game/joinserver.jsp?[...] -- is there some sort of a problem, or is that just me?
< 1295202498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p
< 1295202501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: \o/
< 1295202501 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :               |
< 1295202501 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :               >\
< 1295202516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Download mcpatcher, tick all except Custom Water and Animated Water, specify pack location
< 1295202518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Press Patch
< 1295202520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Start Minecraft
< 1295202521 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rejoice
< 1295202523 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It manages to localize the glib help messages (partially) and something else. I don't remember what I thought when adding it.
< 1295202529 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: (Assuming you ticked a water you like in the customiser.)
< 1295202662 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not have custom water?
< 1295202671 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what should tile size be?
< 1295202675 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: er, wait
< 1295202677 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: OK, leave tile size
< 1295202679 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you want to:
< 1295202681 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :untick custom lava
< 1295202685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :untick animated water
< 1295202687 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make sure all others are ticked
< 1295202695 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Animated water actually *disables* Painterly's animated water.)
< 1295202697 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(So you want it UNTICKED.)
< 1295202700 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tile size is 16x16
< 1295202703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep
< 1295202704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's correct
< 1295202708 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :click Patch, close the patcher, start minecraft normally
< 1295202711 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::(((
< 1295202714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ?
< 1295202725 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Replacing kf.class: java.io.FileNotFoundException: newcode/kf.class
< 1295202731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what
< 1295202735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: do the paths look right?
< 1295202778 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the dialogue box
< 1295202779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that you select
< 1295202802 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: So are we going to have a fancy GTK launcher someday? :P
< 1295202842 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1295202856 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really think so. :p
< 1295202869 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got "Success ...probably" this time, with custom water off
< 1295202870 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :laggy
< 1295202894 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems to have worked
< 1295202907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: ah
< 1295202913 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you forgot to enable water in painterly customiser!!
< 1295202914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go fix it
< 1295202924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do not include MCPATCHER animation files for water.
< 1295202925 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Include MCPATCHER animation files for light water.
< 1295202925 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Include MCPATCHER animation files for dark water.
< 1295202927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :choose one of the latter two
< 1295202928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dark is best imo :P
< 1295202935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw hover over the pictures to get previews
< 1295202959 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I chose dark water
< 1295203014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: are you sure? :/
< 1295203022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you are on 1.2_01, right?
< 1295203024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :minecraft
< 1295203052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Should I name portable types and functions like socket() and the socket type with mcmap_ prefix or sth?
< 1295203060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: typedef int mcmap_socket; and the like.
< 1295203063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or platform_socket?
< 1295203067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I'll go for platform_ prefix.
< 1295203093 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ITS SO BEAUTIFUL OMFG
< 1295203128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: If you want to hear your hardware scream, set viewing distance to far and rendering to fancy.
< 1295203186 0 :Wamanuz2!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295203392 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1295203436 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Is it okay if the win32 console still gets threaded, even though it isn't quite required?
< 1295203449 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how does a language like Slate manage to ... exist so long while going practically nowhere, generating little interest?
< 1295203463 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can the thread do anything there? I mean, the currently ifdef'd-out code won't compile on Windows.
< 1295203483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Well, the idea is that there'd be a few console_* functions in platform.h, that both posix.c and win32.c would implement.
< 1295203489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And posix.c would use readline and win32.c just the usual read() stuff.
< 1295203493 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, er, fread, whatever.
< 1295203496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fgets. whatever.
< 1295203505 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: So it'd be threaded in all cases.
< 1295203518 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm'k. Well, why not.
< 1295203521 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: "going practically nowhere" is quite insulting to all the people who have been working on it for years. Besides, there was a dip in activity for years, this is a "revival".
< 1295203523 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One more thread doesn't really matter.
< 1295203548 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A revival that seems to consist of one person, as far as I can tell
< 1295203573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Io is basically a one-man project too.
< 1295203577 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, pushed?
< 1295203582 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, I'll push this protocol-update change; it only changes protocol.h (and there only the packet_id and field_type enums) and protocol.c, it should auto-merge without any problems.
< 1295203586 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm
< 1295203594 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I don't believe he's done.
< 1295203603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, so he is.
< 1295203611 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am; I just testeded it a moment ago.
< 1295203621 0 :TLUL|afk!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :TLUL
< 1295203622 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, right, he said in game he was about to push, then he left the game
< 1295203625 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There it goes.
< 1295203642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Actually, come to think of it, I can just only have the thread in posix.c.
< 1295203662 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 2 files changed, 61 insertions(+), 6 deletions(-)
< 1295203668 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.
< 1295203776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Is console_readline ever false on POSIX?
< 1295203869 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, there? Planning on that joint expedition still?
< 1295203885 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep.
< 1295203889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm?
< 1295203895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What joint expedition?
< 1295203899 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, now seems like a perfect time to do it
< 1295203900 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, for lapis.
< 1295203902 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, :)
< 1295203907 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Updating mcmap...
< 1295203912 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It can be if there is both atexit + regular-quit cleanup.
< 1295203914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Filthy traitor!
< 1295203916 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, what colour is it in mcmap?
< 1295203919 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ^
< 1295203927 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, mcmap doesn't have that block colored yet.
< 1295203930 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it'll be black.
< 1295203935 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah well I'll add it then I guess.
< 1295203953 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can manually add it for now; I'll fix that (and note blocks and whatnot) a bit later.
< 1295203973 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0x15
< 1295203990 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Non-white cloth blocks will also be black at the moment.
< 1295204018 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, any plans to make mcmap highlight specific blocks?
< 1295204028 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, aren't they all the same id, but different durability?
< 1295204036 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes, with a //command.
< 1295204053 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Oh, right, they might be. The classic cloth block had different IDs.
< 1295204059 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do pressure plates provide charge downwards?
< 1295204080 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I'll need to get armour.
< 1295204083 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes.
< 1295204111 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hm.
< 1295204125 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is mcmap working for you, BtW?
< 1295204135 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, about how long do you estimate? I have an early morning tomorrow
< 1295204148 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, however long it takes...
< 1295204155 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1295204182 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what about NE approx?
< 1295204187 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shouldn't be that long; we just need to branch mine at a specific depth/
< 1295204198 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, how about (-4000,-4000)?
< 1295204209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I seem to recall you "not being interested" in lapis?
< 1295204211 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well tell me if there is water to fall in there :P
< 1295204223 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well I'm not HUGELY interested. But some will be fun :P
< 1295204348 0 :BMG!~behold@d83-183-183-70.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295204418 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host
< 1295204418 0 :BMG!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295204421 0 :BMG!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :BeholdMyGlory
< 1295204540 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what happened?
< 1295204549 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1295204550 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Landed on a chunk error.
< 1295204557 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1295204887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sed 's,\($*\)\.o[ :]*,\1.o $@ : ,g' > $@
< 1295204890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: What does that line noise do?
< 1295204946 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It adds the depfile in the list of targets, so that it also depends on the dependencies.
< 1295204952 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck minecraft.net being downish
< 1295204954 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's that GCC-specific option for it.
< 1295204971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Is there?
< 1295204976 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It corresponds to "-MT $@"
< 1295204979 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, new entry for "list of unreasonably difficult tasks for a PhD student": discovering exactly what page of a conference proceedings you don't have your paper starts on
< 1295204986 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or -MT $(objdir)/$*.d in useful.make terms.
< 1295204988 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, just discovering the name of the conference proceedings can be quite hard
< 1295204993 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Heh, I already use -MT $(@:.d=.o) right now.
< 1295205009 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll leave your ugley script in.
< 1295205024 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's picked from the GNU make manual.
< 1295205044 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you could change it to "-MT $(@:.d=.o) -MT $@" if you're using the MT flag in any case.
< 1295205063 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you putting the Windows build in the same Makefile as the "sensible" build?
< 1295205129 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, down?
< 1295205148 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes.
< 1295205242 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: No.
< 1295205253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'm making Makefile.common, Makefile.win32, Makefile.posix.
< 1295205267 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: And then probably making Makefile just include Makefile.posix, unless there's a snazzy detect-win32 thing in make.
< 1295205268 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or mingw.
< 1295205272 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does mingw's uname output?
< 1295205282 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know, I just cross-build it.
< 1295205483 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I wish Slate had up-to-date thorough documentation
< 1295205507 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which, at least, is better than Atomo's ... complete-looking, but secretly lacking, documentation
< 1295205596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: So win32 actually has no input facilities, right?
< 1295205613 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are the console functions.
< 1295205623 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But currently it doesn't have any, if that's what you meant.
< 1295206228 0 :TLUL!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295206261 0 :TLUL!~TLUL@wikia/The-last-username-left JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295206290 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, it seems that LyX's "integrated version control" is in fact RCS
< 1295206296 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure how to react, or how Vorpal will react
< 1295206616 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It only uses RCS by default if it doesn't smell some other version control repository in the directory you've saved the file in.
< 1295206628 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It does CVS and Subversion if it sees files related to those.
< 1295206675 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think it does any other systems yet, though.
< 1295206710 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: chopping down trees form the comfort of my boat: If only I could get a workbench on it!
< 1295206755 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gah, that Minecraft protocol is ad-hoc. The format for packet 0x35 ("place a block") starts as "int, byte, int" (X, Y, Z) coordinates. For packet 0x36 ("play a note block") the first three fields are "int, short, int" (also X, Y, Z). And there are quite many packets that start with "int, int, int" (X, Y, Z).
< 1295207461 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Going to start watching DS9 again
< 1295207715 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Finally I found some iron (and clay!)
< 1295207921 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"we're looking to compile at a rate very close to 100,000 lines of source code per second"
< 1295207933 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seriously. What the hell is going on in "industry"?
< 1295208008 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295208015 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like anarchy golf?
< 1295208035 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it makes me feel stupid. I cna't do any of them
< 1295208100 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: I can give a lot of hints. I know a lot of tricks that can be used. Each programming language usable has its own challenge.
< 1295208221 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Such as, Objective-C is a strict superset of C, so any solution in C should also be acceptable as a Objective-C code.
< 1295208233 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, may I please request a chunk revert?
< 1295208246 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott has caused massive damage to the summit of Mt. Hoover.
< 1295208253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Accidentally!
< 1295208260 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And in an agreement of war, no less.
< 1295208264 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Drrrrrama!
< 1295208304 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you either recreate the entire terrain from scratch or you help me get ineiros to give me a revert.
< 1295208312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He'll revert it anyway.
< 1295208317 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What happened?
< 1295208322 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why, exactly, were you placing that much TNT near the summit?
< 1295208331 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL
< 1295208331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: We _agreed to war_.
< 1295208341 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess elliott blew up Mt. Hoover
< 1295208343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :War, as in, war where people die.
< 1295208347 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, please stop acting like this is a joke.
< 1295208347 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, does more TNT cause a bigger explosion?
< 1295208356 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minecraft: Serious Business
< 1295208360 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I made a comment in jest.
< 1295208363 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: A chunk revert takes two seconds, and I'm not acting like this is a joke, and for once Sgeo is right.
< 1295208375 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :?
< 1295208377 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I consulted you on the matter of war for a reason and you agreed.
< 1295208386 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what? No, you didn't.
< 1295208401 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, you have chat logs on your terminal
< 1295208411 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On IRC.
< 1295208435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Anyway, the portability work is almost done.
< 1295208447 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, yes
< 1295208452 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, want them?
< 1295208458 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need the strongest posible armor
< 1295208462 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, will take a minute or so to sprunge
< 1295208464 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have some iron ore (not much)
< 1295208482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: diamond
< 1295208491 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im not sure where to find dioamonad
< 1295208496 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, dumped in a file.
< 1295208498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: does -O3 break windows?
< 1295208516 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably not.
< 1295208519 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haven't tried, though.
< 1295208532 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I have saved them to a file
< 1295208584 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hm?
< 1295208675 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no ping reply from PH. I guess that is it
< 1295208678 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295208700 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep
< 1295208968 0 :Phantom_Hoover!5ead0b15@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.173.11.21 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295209003 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My parents have confiscated my laptop because I'm "addicted" and I'm doing it in favour of homework I don't have.]
< 1295209019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh: #       renamed:    console.c -> posix.c
< 1295209030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Permanently? :p
< 1295209051 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: apparently it's "for tonight"/
< 1295209068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hate to ask the obvious question but what are you IRCing from :P
< 1295209070 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have to demonstrate that I'm not addicted by doing something else, or something like that.
< 1295209080 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Family Mac, which is in the study.
< 1295209109 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can't be long until they find me on this as well and force me off it.
< 1295209121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Pushed the portability stuff, probably broke Windows builds.
< 1295209126 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably broke POSIX builds come to think of it, but whatever.
< 1295209136 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They are incapable of grasping that addiction is not the same as being annoyed when you are forced off it in the middle of doing something.
< 1295209171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: As a revolutionary, while opposed to you, I am also naturally opposed to all forms of authority, and so death to parents and etc.! But if you will excuse me, I must go and blow shit up.
< 1295209175 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295209180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I, on the other hand, am quite clearly addictd ^)
< 1295209182 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*addicted
< 1295209288 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's an interesting "clean" sequence:
< 1295209290 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ make clean
< 1295209290 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mkdir build
< 1295209290 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rm -f build/mcmap build/posix.o build/cmd.o build/console.o build/main.o build/map.o build/nbt.o build/protocol.o build/world.o build/posix.d build/cmd.d build/console.d build/main.d build/map.d build/nbt.d build/protocol.d build/world.d
< 1295209290 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rmdir build; true
< 1295209297 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where is my intel manual for compiler writers
< 1295209323 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295209338 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yes, it generates all the dependencies.
< 1295209345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: useful.make hardcoded around this, but it was rather dumb.
< 1295209350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: For instance, "make clean all" broke.
< 1295209352 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=40327
< 1295209391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Of course, if you're cleaning without building in the first place, you're silly anyway. (You'll want to rm -rf _build and _debug, probably.)
< 1295209399 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: "The name is quite stupid", like they say. :p
< 1295209430 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: anyway, how about that chunk update?
< 1295209437 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er, *revert.
< 1295209438 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Would you believe it, it actually works
< 1295209444 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, ostensibly.
< 1295209468 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ make -f Makefile.win32
< 1295209468 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In file included from platform.h:5,
< 1295209468 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :                 from common.h:4,
< 1295209468 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :                 from world.c:13:
< 1295209468 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :posix.h:6:19: error: netdb.h: No such file or directory
< 1295209475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: What.
< 1295209476 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Preprocessor == compares values, not strings.
< 1295209489 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Oh, in-deed. I thought that was the case but forgot.
< 1295209492 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both "posix" and "win32" have the value 0 if you don't define them to something.
< 1295209500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I Can Fix That.
< 1295209554 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :down...
< 1295209597 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Come to think of it, I'll just make it -DPLATFORM_POSIX vs. -DPLATFORM_WIN32.
< 1295209623 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or you could use the guaranteed-to-be-defined-on-all-win32-builds WIN32. :p
< 1295209636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that's less generic! What if you port it to Classic Mac OS?
< 1295209647 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then you don't test against it.
< 1295209661 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wouldn't you rather have to?
< 1295209666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I see what you mean.
< 1295209669 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that's a SPECIAL CASE.
< 1295209677 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, okay.
< 1295209688 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pushin' a fix.
< 1295209786 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: http://www.spieleplanet.eu/get/mcmap-gui.png <-- is *your* launcher this ugly?
< 1295209820 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what is this launcher of yours?
< 1295209822 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a lot smaller.
< 1295209831 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Approximately equally ugly, though.
< 1295209834 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It launches nuclear warheads.
< 1295209849 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I added a small launcher dialog in the Win32 build that's shown if you don't include any command-line arguments.
< 1295209854 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah
< 1295209898 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Page closed
< 1295209935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lawl
< 1295209964 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out
< 1295209978 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pushed a three-line patch to fix the Windows builds.
< 1295209980 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 2 files changed, 3 insertions(+), 1 deletions(-)
< 1295209995 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, maybe it could be considered a four-line patch in some sense.
< 1295210067 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The link step needs $(objs) $(LDFLAGS) as opposed to $(LDFLAGS) $(objs), because otherwise it won't pick up the referred-to symbols from the DLL link stub libraries. (It only collects symbols that are used.)
< 1295210195 0 :cheater00!~cheater@g231051083.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295210236 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I like the checkbox for "render the hell dimension"
< 1295210483 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also pushed a Perl script that takes a protocol.txt and writes the ugly parts of packet-format structures from that. Got tired of updating three different places whenever the protocol changes.
< 1295210500 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Didn't add that as a build step though, since conceivably someone might want to build on Windows without Perl.
< 1295210707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: heh
< 1295210731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: But doesn't that -Wl thing need to come before iojdofgjsodigjhfgsihjfkglhjlfkdh?
< 1295210732 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Before...
< 1295210734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, the files?
< 1295210738 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because you had it like that in the Makefile.
< 1295210752 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably not. I don't really know. At least it builds. :p
< 1295210776 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :notch talks on http://www.livestream.com/coesquest
< 1295210782 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to some guyis playing his game
< 1295210791 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: notch is the worst
< 1295210797 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE WORST
< 1295210841 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders if Phantom_Hoover should destroy the remaining stocks of TNT
< 1295210900 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :over 3000 people lol
< 1295210968 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just because he is there
< 1295210998 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::(
< 1295211003 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GODDAMMIT MINECRAFT
< 1295211017 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: PRAISE THE GLORIOUS NOTCH
< 1295211109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: fizzie: "4815162342 lines of code!" That would explain a lot..
< 1295211111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*lot.
< 1295211180 0 :trinithis!~trinithis@c-24-6-5-250.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295211212 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Congratulations on your DSL (the .txt)
< 1295211242 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You should probably add a rule to update protocol-data.{c,h}.
< 1295211245 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To Makefile.commo.
< 1295211248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*common.
< 1295211281 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, probably; I didn't want to make the build actually-depend on Perl, but OTOH it doesn't if those files do exist in the repo.
< 1295211292 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It is possible to interact with the environment while riding a cart, such as shooting a bow at enemies or laying down track in front of the minecart while it is moving."
< 1295211294 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm
< 1295211304 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That sounds like it could be... useful for long journeys
< 1295211305 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^cat coppro: i like how much the minecraft talk bothers you
< 1295211305 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: i like how much the minecraft talk bothers you
< 1295211312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I know fungot's inner desires.)
< 1295211312 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i have gotten a test binary file.
< 1295211332 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott are you now speaking to me through fungot?
< 1295211332 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: i... just another instance of unix is no longer useable as a snarcstation-2. but these days? so what happened, and hardware manufacturers said the name of the
< 1295211342 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"When riding a falling minecart, landing will deal no damage."
< 1295211354 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^cat Stop accusing elliott of things, I'm a real human being who' sa bot.
< 1295211354 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stop accusing elliott of things, I'm a real human being who' sa bot.
< 1295211360 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That sounds like an easy way to get down from high heights
< 1295211361 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^cat *who's a. I even make mistakes!
< 1295211361 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*who's a. I even make mistakes!
< 1295211364 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, yes, yes he is
< 1295211370 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sigh
< 1295211380 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A+ for creativity
< 1295211403 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^cat Of course, this means Sgeo can impersonate elliott within coppro's mind
< 1295211404 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, this means Sgeo can impersonate elliott within coppro's mind
< 1295211421 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except I can see Sgeo issue the command
< 1295211423 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^cat dfjghdfgkjljsdfzl;dfkjgophs94gsozf\dzf
< 1295211423 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dfjghdfgkjljsdfzl;dfkjgophs94gsozf\dzf
< 1295211428 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :..Oh right
< 1295211433 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^cat MY BRAIN IS A WALRUS
< 1295211433 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MY BRAIN IS A WALRUS
< 1295211440 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I think fungot is having a nervous breakdown.
< 1295211440 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the other hand, given the poor are terribly poor and the program.
< 1295211515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently, mipmapping is forcing the volume to 0 or something...
< 1295211546 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Changing volume when music and sound are both off crashes Minecraft"
< 1295211549 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOTCH QUALITY ENGINEERING
< 1295211581 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How to catch chickens: Use a fishing rod to pull them into a cactus
< 1295211595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: X-D
< 1295211805 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh
< 1295211844 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it worth using powered minecarts?
< 1295211872 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :English guys: how does a name "cardernet" (for an internet service) sounds to you?
< 1295211909 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: a bit cheesey
< 1295211927 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah
< 1295211930 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought so
< 1295211933 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: approve
< 1295211957 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd rather name it cardsnet or something like that
< 1295211969 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because AFAIK carder is something weird
< 1295212015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :paulscode.sound.SoundSystemException: The specified class does not implement interface 'ICodec' in method 'setCodec'
< 1295212015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :	at paulscode.sound.SoundSystemConfig.setCodec(SourceFile:584)
< 1295212015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :	at sg.d(SourceFile:47)
< 1295212015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :	at sg.a(SourceFile:31)
< 1295212016 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :	at net.minecraft.client.Minecraft.a(SourceFile:331)
< 1295212018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :	at net.minecraft.client.Minecraft.run(SourceFile:643)
< 1295212020 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :	at java.lang.Thread.run(Thread.java:636)
< 1295212022 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :error linking with the LibraryJavaSound plug-in
< 1295212024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: No.
< 1295212033 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahah the water in minecraft is not confluent
< 1295212046 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: wat
< 1295212127 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the way it flows is dependent on the order in which its path is cleared
< 1295212128 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Might Minecart boosters eventually be nerfed?
< 1295212131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sound is so boooorken for me :(
< 1295212132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yes
< 1295212135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: indeed
< 1295212139 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: The current system seems to have bit of a rebuild problem: http://p.zem.fi/fkwv -- based on make -d at http://p.zem.fi/7nwt it's because you depend on the build directory, and that is always newer because any file-change inside there will update its timestamp.
< 1295212150 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How much stuff will break?
< 1295212160 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Everything.
< 1295212163 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And will powered minecarts then become useful?
< 1295212171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Oh for chrissakes. Change the dependency on $(objdir) to | $(objdir).
< 1295212172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Ask Notch.
< 1295212207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: That will fix it.
< 1295212212 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it seems to.
< 1295212281 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"You can also ride "them" and they'll move nearly forever if there is no dead end. It also moves slower off track and can move through water.
< 1295212281 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"
< 1295212282 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh
< 1295212293 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The word confluent comes from the behavior of water
< 1295212358 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait how dum
< 1295212369 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what a dumb way for water to work
< 1295212420 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Eh?
< 1295212427 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right.
< 1295212430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The really buggy ones
< 1295212432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ones.
< 1295212442 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Have you had any audio issues?
< 1295212519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Shall I add the auto-update of the protocol-data files to the build system? It'll only trigger when the files are out of date, obviously.
< 1295212644 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't played Minecraft with sound more than once or so.
< 1295212647 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I heard the "ouch" but saw nothing that could hurt you
< 1295212650 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can. I was going to, but forgot.
< 1295212656 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Fell down the stairs. :p
< 1295212658 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah
< 1295212695 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Minecart_booster#Double_Booster
< 1295212698 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Pushing.
< 1295212716 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what were you going to screenshot?
< 1295212720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Yeah, that _will_ be fixed. It's a crazy bug.
< 1295212726 0 :trinithis!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1295212736 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, here's what I got when I tried to add "show block light levels in surface map for nice night-time look" in mcmap: http://zem.fi/~fis/mcmap-lights.png
< 1295212739 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not quite it.
< 1295212752 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hah
< 1295212755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I WANT TO MAKE AN ALBUM JUST SO I CAN USE THAT AS THE COVER.
< 1295212763 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295212779 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have made a list of some hints for anarchy golf   gopher://zzo38computer.cjb.net:70/0phlog*c_golf.anagol-tricks
< 1295212780 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think boosters period are a crazy bug
< 1295212786 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: But a useful one.
< 1295212789 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: SRSLY THAT IS AWESOME
< 1295212801 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, found out anything about the corruption bug btw?
< 1295212849 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not yet either. I should really take a look at some point.
< 1295212858 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Item duplication glitches are useful bugs
< 1295212893 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://i.imgur.com/moAMH.png
< 1295212898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't stop staring at http://zem.fi/~fis/mcmap-lights.png
< 1295212900 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's so pretty
< 1295212905 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :free string every time I spend the night in my house
< 1295212915 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: great :)
< 1295212928 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :works well because I can get fish with it
< 1295212928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: add some logs on fire there, hehehe
< 1295212932 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: have you built a portal to the Nether yet?
< 1295212939 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no I don't have any obsidian :(
< 1295212947 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just found clay and iron for the fisrst time today thoug
< 1295212949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you want buckets of lava and water, to build it in-place
< 1295212957 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that way you don't have to mine it either
< 1295212964 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah I do know where there is some lava
< 1295212967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: If it has taken this long for you to find iron you are doing something very wrong :)
< 1295212968 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: string is useless though
< 1295212971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To make a bucket you need iron
< 1295212975 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I can make a fishing rod with it
< 1295212987 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: also, wow, you really need to play at a higher resolution :P
< 1295212996 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you use 5 of it in the whole game
< 1295213021 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295213024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: http://zem.fi/~fis/mcmap-lights.png has PORNOGRAPHIC MATERIAL in it, I am disgusted.
< 1295213028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Found ANOTHER computer?
< 1295213044 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/File:Quarry_1.png
< 1295213051 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, I really, *really* need that revert.
< 1295213052 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wants to make a swimming pool that size
< 1295213088 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The damage is effectively irreparable.
< 1295213119 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you do squares in the gimp? :p
< 1295213131 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cobblestone factory + tree farm = plenty of smooth stone
< 1295213148 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Cobblestone factory = useless.
< 1295213152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is 1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000x faster to mine.
< 1295213160 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, do you have any idea of the rate of production in a cobble factory?
< 1295213161 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Second attempt: http://zem.fi/~fis/mcmap-lights2.png
< 1295213177 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's nice
< 1295213177 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: That's the cover to the accompanying EP.
< 1295213184 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it correct?
< 1295213186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Can you save the version that generated mcmap-lights.png?
< 1295213188 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Literally the only place it would be useful would be in the Nether.
< 1295213188 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I really wanna use it :p
< 1295213190 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*it. :p
< 1295213194 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, can't be lower than mining, right?
< 1295213201 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, it's *far* lower.
< 1295213205 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How?
< 1295213214 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"a block a second" lower.
< 1295213217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Because the cobble don't regenerate instantly.
< 1295213219 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I already messed it up. :/
< 1295213230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If the cobble magically reappeared AS SOON as you finished mining (not even a ms delay) it would be as fast.
< 1295213237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it takes like a second.
< 1295213239 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : fizzie: http://zem.fi/~fis/mcmap-lights.png has PORNOGRAPHIC MATERIAL in it, I am disgusted. // worst - porn -e ver
< 1295213241 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*- ever
< 1295213253 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mining isn't as safe
< 1295213258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I'm trying to highlight the pornographic material now :P
< 1295213270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Yes... it is.
< 1295213277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you do a corridor, it's completely safe and you get iron and coal too.
< 1295213309 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not as ecological
< 1295213310 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>.>
< 1295213311 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, do it chunk-wise then
< 1295213319 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'll run out eventually
< 1295213328 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And have to walk a distance to find more
< 1295213332 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I made some cool stuff such as a note based warning system when someone enters my place
< 1295213352 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, note?
< 1295213354 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, do what chunk-wise?
< 1295213360 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, the revert
< 1295213362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: "Run out"? Not underground.
< 1295213370 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the world is fucking infinite, there is nothing to conserve.
< 1295213373 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, you mean list the chunks necessary?
< 1295213380 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, yeah.
< 1295213383 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This means war!!
< 1295213385 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, how?
< 1295213395 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well the worldedit plugin for bukkit could do it
< 1295213396 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, the world is infinite, but if you run out in a fixed area, you have to leave that area
< 1295213419 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, for a very short time while you get cobble.
< 1295213421 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, wait, dump with mcmap. then figure out the file names
< 1295213423 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HOW DO YOU DRAW A SQUARE WITH THE GIMP
< 1295213431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Wrong.
< 1295213435 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I assume they would be the same for mcmap and for the server
< 1295213435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: The underground extends forever.
< 1295213437 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :relative the world dir
< 1295213452 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'll *already* have more cobble than you need from mining.
< 1295213464 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I doubt it.
< 1295213475 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Usually I just select a rectangle, then select->border, then fill that.
< 1295213475 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mcmap has absolutely no idea what the server calls the chunks.
< 1295213496 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : HOW DO YOU DRAW A SQUARE WITH THE GIMP <-- make a rectangle selection, shift or ctrl or something to ensure all sides equally long
< 1295213503 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The file names are just base36-encoded integers of the chunk position.
< 1295213507 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, isn't it determnistic from the coords?
< 1295213515 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, oh?
< 1295213607 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Gregor: PROOF OF EVIL PORNOGRAPHY: http://i.imgur.com/c37jR.png
< 1295213653 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes. The path for chunk at (X,Z) is "%s/%s/c.%s.%s.dat", base36(X&63), base36(Z&63), base36(X), base36(Z).
< 1295213660 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ...what.
< 1295213683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you need me to colour it according to how an EVIL PORNOGRAPHIST would, I can do that too, but I figured I'd rely on your OWN EYES.
< 1295213713 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is it Cthulhu's secret porn stash?
< 1295213723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes.
< 1295213735 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You ... must have an extremely dirty mind to see anything in that :P
< 1295213738 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(With a base36 digit set of "0123456789abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz".)
< 1295213810 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Obviously the woman on the right is screaming in horror at what a horrible picture she is in, while wearing a necklace with a Christian cross on it, and apparently with no neck separating her face and breasts. IT'S OBVIOUS!
< 1295213821 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU'RE the pervert!
< 1295213825 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe YOU'RE Cthulhu.
< 1295213855 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And ... a parrot on her shoulder?
< 1295213859 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is smelting with lava ever worth it?
< 1295213898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: That's clearly a tentacle.
< 1295213901 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: No.
< 1295213906 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Oh dear.
< 1295213918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: SEE?
< 1295213948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Here's incentive to play at a higher resolution: http://ompldr.org/vNzBuNg
< 1295214074 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, does 2 TNT next to eachother make more of an explosion than 1?
< 1295214082 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. Obviously.
< 1295214106 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can that be used to explode past obsidian, or is it just size of explosion?
< 1295214124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You would need a LOT of TNT to explode obsidian.
< 1295214140 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's theoretically doable?
< 1295214161 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How much TNT would you need to explode past water?
< 1295214161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'd probably crash the game well before you ever got past TNT.
< 1295214163 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I think that's bigger than my maximum res :S
< 1295214164 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*past obsidian.
< 1295214166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Infinite.
< 1295214171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: just press F11 :P
< 1295214178 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: BTW, turns out my security system isn't completely watertight http://i.imgur.com/dUR5V.png
< 1295214179 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, water is literally unbreakable?
< 1295214181 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :might take pressing it thrice, if it doesn't get rid of your top/bottom panels
< 1295214186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yes.
< 1295214188 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think.
< 1295214203 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yikes
< 1295214209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: did it come down?
< 1295214215 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Explosion#Block_Resistance has smaller numbers for water than obsidian, but I really don't know how those are calculated.
< 1295214216 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :According to http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Explosion#Block_Resistance, water has a lower resistance than obsidian
< 1295214218 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha it can't come down but I can't go up either
< 1295214221 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh
< 1295214226 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :n/m the oh
< 1295214229 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Underwater explosions are a different thing, though.
< 1295214241 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wasnt asking about underwater explosions
< 1295214254 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wanted to know how well a wall of stationary water would hold up
< 1295214270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah.
< 1295214386 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What... was the point of Notch programming in the spring duplication?
< 1295214465 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Do people actually eat weetabix?
< 1295214467 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Spring duplication?
< 1295214473 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Yes. It's nice.
< 1295214476 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, the way water behaves
< 1295214499 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, there's a certain maximum damage a single TNT block can deal.
< 1295214513 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, with more TNT, can more damage be delt?
< 1295214527 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, I don't think so.
< 1295214546 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't it additive if exploding exactly at the same time
< 1295214547 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So elliott's wrong then. Ok
< 1295214552 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The explosion algorithm is insane, and I think it's the reason TNT is woefully resource-heavy.
< 1295214554 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought that was how TNT cannons worked
< 1295214561 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, they have been rewritten in 1.2
< 1295214562 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/da/Weetabix.jpg <-- this looks like something you'd be served as an indentured slave to the military.
< 1295214623 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Optimine stops TNT lagging things.
< 1295214627 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So not really.
< 1295214637 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: That picture is awful.
< 1295214637 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Optimine?
< 1295214642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Also what, you soak them in milk.
< 1295214652 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: They... really don't look like that :P
< 1295214662 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: With some sugar and soaked in milk it's actually really tasty.
< 1295214676 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: It isn't hard or anything, when milk'd.
< 1295214677 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My hatred for milk makes that even worse :P
< 1295214686 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Oh... well you're just weird then.
< 1295214692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Srsly, it's nice :P
< 1295214711 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minepedia explains the block-destroying process reasonably well, but not the interaction of multiple TNT blocks, except by noting that other TNT blocks may ignite from the explosion; it doesn't mention at which point it resets the damage-to-blocks counters.
< 1295214716 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, use  then.
< 1295214725 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Coca-Cola?
< 1295214729 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes.
< 1295214732 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, that article is on block interactions, isn't it?
< 1295214732 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Weetabix in coca-cola.
< 1295214740 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not entities, which is what lit TNT is.
< 1295214754 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The only dangers that a quarry presents are death from falling into the pit, death from hitting a magma flow, or by falling into a cavern due to recklessness and getting killed by a mob underground."
< 1295214762 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LIES! You could also die of boredom
< 1295214830 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraftwiki.net/index.php?title=Template:Blocks&diff=40037&oldid=39916 How annoying.
< 1295214841 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, or from spiders getting into the pit.
< 1295214853 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well yes, though it has an "interactions with entities" paragraph too, but that's just about how creatures and players get damage.
< 1295214857 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: If you dipped it in chocolate, I could see it being food.
< 1295214863 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. the dangers presented by mining plus one more.
< 1295214875 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Sure :-P
< 1295214906 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is a very confusing sentence about high-resistance blocks: "The minimum block resistance required to absorb maximum blast force of TNT explosion (with at least attenuation of 2 steps) is 77.67, 63.5 of creeper explosion, 20.17 of fireball explosion. So water, stationary lava, obsidian, and bedrock are always indestructible, and furnaces and less resistant blocks can be destroyed by fireballs."
< 1295214913 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really know what they mean by that.
< 1295214948 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess "with at least attenuation of 2 steps" means that it takes 2 steps to get out of the TNT block itself.
< 1295215060 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just thinking that bomb shelters made out of water are more economical than those made of obsidian
< 1295215073 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ping
< 1295215106 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Daemon escaped from pentagram
< 1295215127 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, an interesting result of TNT resistance is that the Cube would be extremely resistant to single-floor TNT detonations.
< 1295215192 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295215205 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :..? o.O?
< 1295215239 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, it would destroy the floor and ceiling of the level it was on (near the blast zone, at least).
< 1295215246 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the damage would stop there.
< 1295215321 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the Cube made of? Also I don't know what it is, but I guess vertically it alternates block air block air?
< 1295215375 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has lava between the floors for lighting.
< 1295215403 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can the cube fly
< 1295215449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no
< 1295215452 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, it's glass with lava sandwiched between things like fizzie said.
< 1295215471 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mmmm, lava sandwiches.
< 1295215471 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lighting?
< 1295215479 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But there's no air to move around in?
< 1295215491 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait
< 1295215509 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :glass lava glass air air repeat?
< 1295215513 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes.
< 1295215519 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Awesome
< 1295215559 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd like to see pictures
< 1295215587 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, then buy MC and get to doing drudge work on it.
< 1295215610 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Cube site is going to be a deathtrap now that health is on...
< 1295215612 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can't just show me a screenshot?
< 1295215631 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, it doesn't exist yet?
< 1295215637 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No.
< 1295215664 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume there is easy access to a lava lake near the site?
< 1295215670 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295215698 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, there is not.
< 1295215712 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We used to have renewable lava, but server-side inventory broke it.
< 1295215738 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now we sit and wait for Bukkit to be released and then bug ineiros for a lava kit and a chunk revert on Mt. Hoover.
< 1295215752 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or just abandon the site
< 1295215756 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Find a lava lake
< 1295215769 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or minecart system between current site and lava lake
< 1295215771 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: mcmap is a lot shorter than I thought:
< 1295215775 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Totals grouped by language (dominant language first):
< 1295215776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ansic:         2609 (89.20%)
< 1295215776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sh:             242 (8.27%)
< 1295215776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perl:            74 (2.53%)
< 1295215776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Total Physical Source Lines of Code (SLOC)                = 2,925
< 1295215781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Abandon the site that's had so much work done on it? I think not.
< 1295215784 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Besides, one lava lake is NOT enough.
< 1295215790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: We need 16 thousand lava blocks per floor.
< 1295215805 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minecart system it is
< 1295215837 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, 4000x4000? Why?
< 1295215839 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait
< 1295215850 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :400x400
< 1295215867 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How much does a single lake hold?
< 1295215876 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, it depends on the lake.
< 1295215888 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Not enough" is invariably going to be the answer, though.
< 1295215901 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, can you estimate how many lakes you need per floor?
< 1295215916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: 400x400?
< 1295215921 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's 128x128.
< 1295215952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :126x126 (accounting for the edge) = 15,876.
< 1295215961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Far, far too many. Lakes are incredibly rare.
< 1295215962 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And small.
< 1295215963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well.
< 1295215964 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not so rare.
< 1295215969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But we'd have to basically go down to bedrock EVERYWHERE.
< 1295216007 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait for update in which portals work in SMP?
< 1295216042 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, AKA never.
< 1295216055 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: That's not going to happen.
< 1295216133 0 :sftp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295216399 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How far away can a ditch be before it doesn't influence where water flows?
< 1295216728 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Sgeo: That's not going to happen. <-- oh?
< 1295216748 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, check wiki? Page on fluids iirc
< 1295216752 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Portals are going to go to another server, apparently, but definitely never the Nether.
< 1295216753 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forgot exact count
< 1295216765 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the point was that the other server could hold nether.
< 1295216770 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so one admin would run two servers
< 1295216782 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and let portals work between them
< 1295216788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That requires running two servers.
< 1295216793 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, indeed
< 1295216795 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is impractical.
< 1295216796 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For most people.
< 1295216798 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep
< 1295216812 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, reddit minecraft server could probably manage that
< 1295216820 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doubt they would want to
< 1295216827 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They already run TWO servers :P
< 1295216830 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh?
< 1295216836 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, creative/survival?
< 1295216876 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and what happened to that server after hmod was gone (didn't they use hmod?)
< 1295216945 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I think some of the "big" servers are using their own hMod development builds.
< 1295216953 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, yes, creatie/survival.
< 1295216957 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*creative/
< 1295216964 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm.
< 1295216966 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://nerd.nu/
< 1295216971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or they're just downgraded.
< 1295216975 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And also have an additional beta server.
< 1295216980 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is that texture pack I wonder.
< 1295217010 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, looks HD
< 1295217017 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It looks quite nice, like Painterly HD.
< 1295217051 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, boring: http://redditpublic.com/wiki/Rules#Creative
< 1295217059 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay a few make sense
< 1295217061 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but a lot does not
< 1295217062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Looks like the creative server is running Bukkit.
< 1295217068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some sekrit build, presumably.
< 1295217074 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Redstone ore?????
< 1295217080 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I have no idea
< 1295217080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I can understand water and shit, even if it is stupid.
< 1295217083 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But REDSTONE ORE???
< 1295217089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FISHING ROD?
< 1295217311 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Flowing lava is banned in Survival, stationary lava isn't/
< 1295217654 0 :sftp!~sftp@79.174.49.208 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295217875 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And now, classic poetry ala moron ala Gregor:
< 1295217876 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The bird flew.
< 1295217877 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why cant they stop,
< 1295217877 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the bird flew.
< 1295217877 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If they hav a cewre for canser,
< 1295217878 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they should be able to stop a simple,
< 1295217880 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :flew.
< 1295217900 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295217907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1295217913 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295218610 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Exasperated
< 1295218725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Should .d files go in build/ even for debug builds, since they're common to both?
< 1295218824 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the dependencies will depend on the macros that are defined though, so that's not guaranteed to be safe :)
< 1295218875 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well... it'll be "safe" but not necessarily correct
< 1295218907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: oh, you are right, it'll have $platform.{c,h} deps
< 1295218914 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so we can't really do that without forcing both in or whatever
< 1295218916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh
< 1295218951 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: there needs to be a build system that considers make variables (including cflags) as dependencies :)
< 1295218954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and, uh, oh so much more
< 1295218954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well
< 1295218955 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ghc --make
< 1295218957 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :problem solved
< 1295218968 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right :)
< 1295219104 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: actually such dependency tracking should probably go in the OS ...
< 1295219113 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :strace can work for a lot of things, fabricate uses that, but it's imperfect
< 1295219132 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: again a case of forcing things to go at a higher level of abstraction allowing greater system integration :P
< 1295219309 0 :acetoline!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1295220412 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :MOTHERFUCKING WEETABIX TASTE LIKE CARDBOARD | WEETABIX: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | WEETABIX WITH MOTHERFUCKING MERCURY IN IT: http://codu.org/projects/esotericlogs/hg/ | PAGES ABOUT WEETABIX: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page | WEETABIX, FUCKING WEETABIX | The Weetabix company would like to deny the claim that Weetabix tastes like cardboard. Having sampled a wide var
< 1295220418 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :D'awwwww
< 1295220467 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :WEETABIX TASTE LIKE CARDBOARD | WEETABIX: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | WEETABIX WITH MERCURY IN IT: http://codu.org/projects/esotericlogs/hg/ | PAGES ABOUT WEETABIX: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page | FUCKING WEETABIX | The Weetabix company denies the claim that Weetabix tastes like cardboard. Having sampled a wide variety of cardboard, the vast majority are not any m
< 1295220499 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :WEETABIX TASTE LIKE CARDBOARD | WEETABIX: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | WEETABIX WITH MERCURY IN IT: http://codu.org/projects/esotericlogs/hg/ | PAGES ABOUT WEETABIX: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page | FUCKING WEETABIX | The Weetabix company denies the claim that Weetabix tastes like cardboard. Our fine natural additives completely eliminate cardboard flavor.
< 1295220516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Weetabix tastes like cardboard" is possibly the first thing Americans ever said, so shut your face.
< 1295220527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :MOTHER | FUCKING | WEETABIX |                                                                       http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D
< 1295220553 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :ELLIOTT'S MOTHER IS | FUCKING | WEETABIX |                                                                       http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D
< 1295220612 0 :Weetabix!~RawIRC@wb-dhcp2-38.wmiscable.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295220622 0 :Weetabix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I AM YOUR FATHER
< 1295220640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :Beet a wix | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D
< 1295220643 0 :Wamanuz3!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295220657 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every time i read weetabix i think of Mr. Bix from the redmeat comic book
< 1295220676 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :Beet a wix | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | elliott denies claim of wheat-based parentage. More at 11.
< 1295220679 0 :Wamanuz2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295220706 0 :Weetabix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit
< 1295220713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll beet YOUR wixed parentage.
< 1295220917 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried a weetabix once... I threw it up.
< 1295220981 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe because it was 3 months old
< 1295221151 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :....did I have a dream about using Linux Mint?
< 1295221152 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION WTFs
< 1295221485 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what should I do next?
< 1295221488 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a coulple hours
< 1295221765 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :minecraft
< 1295221835 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t forM
< 1295221836 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a (m :: * -> *) b. (Monad m) => [a] -> (a -> m b) -> m [b]
< 1295221836 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yep!
< 1295221853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t mapM
< 1295221854 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a (m :: * -> *) b. (Monad m) => (a -> m b) -> [a] -> m [b]
< 1295221857 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh
< 1295221882 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, not 3 or 4 lakes per floor, then?
< 1295221890 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that would have been survivable
< 1295221948 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I can't pick up lava in my bucket :/
< 1295221953 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe because it's a waterfall
< 1295221959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: yeah you have to get a source block
< 1295221967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: what?
< 1295221975 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For the cube
< 1295222066 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do I need something special to mine gold/redstone?
< 1295222083 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or because it had so many suspicious chemicals in it?
< 1295222259 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: ...?
< 1295222283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Redstone_(Ore)
< 1295222285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: iron or diamond pickaxe
< 1295222295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: same for gold
< 1295222376 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I wonder if I could make a web framework that's horrific as possible, to ensure that my prediction about Haskell comes true, while still not writing, you know, a *web framework*, because i'd feel awful
< 1295222388 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe if i make it out of category theory!
< 1295222394 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha
< 1295222399 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, best idea ever
< 1295222402 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :objects are pages
< 1295222407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :morphisms are ... redirections!
< 1295222414 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :youcan be the next paul graham
< 1295222419 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1295222437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll use lots of template haskell, so nobody can read it without first studying every macro
< 1295222439 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what's your prediction about Haskell?
< 1295222440 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like paul graham did!
< 1295222445 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo:
< 1295222449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@quote web frameworks
< 1295222449 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No quotes for this person. BOB says:  You seem to have forgotten your passwd, enter another!
< 1295222452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@quote 2009
< 1295222453 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e says: I propose that all of f, g, h and i be made illegal. (referring to http://hackage.haskell.org/trac/haskell-prime/wiki/StricterLabelledFieldSyntax as it existed on 2009-10-05)
< 1295222457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@quote 2009
< 1295222457 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e says: I propose that all of f, g, h and i be made illegal. (referring to http://hackage.haskell.org/trac/haskell-prime/wiki/StricterLabelledFieldSyntax as it existed on 2009-10-05)
< 1295222463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@quote Combinatorial
< 1295222463 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird says: 2009: The Year of the Combinatorial Explosion of Haskell Web Frameworks. Also, the Linux Desktop.
< 1295222465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ^
< 1295222475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok so it's not 2009 any more, but who cares
< 1295222484 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a Haskell web framework in the works, isn't there?
< 1295222490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are thousands :P
< 1295222503 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's only one that I heard of >.>
< 1295222511 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://snapframework.com/
< 1295222511 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://docs.yesodweb.com/
< 1295222515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://happstack.com/index.html
< 1295222546 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: happstack is the maintained fork of the dead-but-famous HAppS
< 1295222551 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://happs.org/
< 1295222558 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :About throwing up that weetabix
< 1295222573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: But Weetabix is delicious!
< 1295222580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Delicious like CEREAL BLOCK
< 1295222622 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: lol, what have I done, I'm actually writing example code for a web framework now :(
< 1295222626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think this makes me a bad person
< 1295222629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but at least i'm optimising for insanity
< 1295222635 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :marketing:
< 1295222639 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The perfect web framework for type theorists!
< 1295222666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ph.D. getting you nowhere? Have to take a job in the web development industry? We feel your pain. And we're going to give you some more!
< 1295222698 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Snap's the only one I heard of
< 1295222712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably because Snap is the one with the obnoxious Ruby-style marketing flash.
< 1295222739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: D.entity [d| data Item = Item { text :: String } |]
< 1295222748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: guess what this does? hint: the answer is not "define text :: Item -> String"
< 1295222755 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death
< 1295222777 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that would be the obvious thing)
< 1295222781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and therefore wrong, in this context)
< 1295222804 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, better than haXe, which seems to be an entire LANGUAGE based on marketting flash
< 1295222849 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott well it must creaet an HTML tag for this data type
< 1295222853 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: LOL
< 1295222859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: no, no, better, this has nothing to do with the web, this particular bit
< 1295222866 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe
< 1295222867 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: what it does is make text a data-accessor
< 1295222880 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. http://hackage.haskell.org/package/data-accessor
< 1295222886 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you have to do item^.text
< 1295222895 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but hey, that's USEFUL! totally useful!
< 1295222903 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and overloading the normal definition syntax?
< 1295222906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :totally the right way to go about it
< 1295222923 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: can you reassure me that I won't accidentally invent something useful here :/
< 1295222958 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: THE NEXT PAUL GRAHAM
< 1295222971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually what i'm doing here as a joke is disturbingly like what Yesod does
< 1295222982 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's web for ya
< 1295222994 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, no, it's clearly proof that I cannot avoid injecting my genius into things
< 1295223004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i continue, i will have the world's first good web framework!
< 1295223010 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um that's another way to look at it :P
< 1295223019 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then, I will make shit smell like flowers and taste like lemonade
< 1295223029 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even if that's somewhat less impressive
< 1295223335 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1295223387 0 :Oklopol!~oklopol@dyn37-95.vpn.utu.fi JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295223432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol is an poklo ol, confirm/deny?
< 1295223500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: LOL, it looks like just about everything I wrote as a joke is a yesod core feature
< 1295223509 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What we're learning here is: Haskell, lol
< 1295223521 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Oh that's it, you are SO sued for slander.
< 1295223532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Sure thing, Mr. Weetabix.
< 1295223538 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rofn
< 1295223572 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I think you mean Mr. Oklopol's-Lawyer. -stein.
< 1295223593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: Rolling On the Floor, Neglecting parts of my life by playing minecraft?
< 1295223614 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahah Yes
< 1295223673 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: do you know what makes me SAD? Two-way parsers aren't powerful enough to parse most things
< 1295223684 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that a theorem?
< 1295223686 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(single combinator definition a la parsec but only Applicative that can both parse and deparse)
< 1295223690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: someone proved it to me on #haskell once :-D
< 1295223692 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: SOUNDS LIKE IT'S TIME FOR A THREE-WAY THEN.
< 1295223702 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Parsing, deparsing, and ... ARSING?!
< 1295223704 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: stop destroying my dreams
< 1295223712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: i know it's horrible, i wanted to write all parsers like that forever
< 1295223717 0 :cheater-!~cheater@g228062004.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295223749 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Heww yeah.
< 1295223770 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: (Foo =:<= digit) <: digit <: digit
< 1295223775 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm so glad your dialect has a convenient rhyme :P
< 1295223781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-> 123 is (Foo '2' '3') and vice versa
< 1295223786 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: wat
< 1295223803 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: "arse"
< 1295223808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: X-D
< 1295223813 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arse arse arse.
< 1295223815 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ARSE
< 1295223910 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295223975 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: great now I have all the Obsidian I need -- just have to get a pick to mine it
< 1295223995 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: FAIL
< 1295224004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: you're meant to use buckets of lava and water to construct the portal in-place
< 1295224006 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :using cobbles to guard it
< 1295224011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that way, you don't have to mine it later
< 1295224013 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually wait a sec
< 1295224013 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is exceedingly tedious
< 1295224015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20-30s per block
< 1295224024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are meant to *create the obsidian in the right place* the first time :)
< 1295224039 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I thought of thhat
< 1295224042 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make sure to see http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Portal for how to make a portal and also how to cut corners if you want to avoid using too much obsidian
< 1295224106 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey
< 1295224110 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: obsidian is renewable
< 1295224112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Even when a portal is built with only 10 blocks of Obsidian (by leaving out the corners), the portal frame spawned on the other side will have the full 14 blocks."
< 1295224134 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295224151 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-invariant: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WUxhO9VLKPY
< 1295224167 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Contrary to public belief[2], portals do not conserve momentum.
< 1295224197 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love that song :D
< 1295224413 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastie.org/1468410 maybe somebody know what this piece does in prolog
< 1295224418 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or how to use it?
< 1295224435 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION *still* finds it somewhat odd that the Super Bowl is actually broadcast outside of the US...
< 1295224453 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are there that many non-Americans that give a crap?
< 1295224490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: Impossible to say without the context, dude. But it looks like some kind of proof-generating system.
< 1295224504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :G'night.
< 1295224509 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1295224515 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They don't even air the same ads!
< 1295224520 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes, unfortunately, there are
< 1295224532 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, well. There is Canada, which actually has *reason* to care.
< 1295224549 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Namely, they also play football.
< 1295224653 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, dunno if anyone else cares
< 1295224713 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it certainly gets *shown* elsewhere.
< 1295224736 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How many Brits are likely to give a damn, though?
< 1295224773 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: that's a prolog interpreter
< 1295224790 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dominion episode1
< 1295224825 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd like to modify that to produce proof trees
< 1295224831 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i don't know prolog
< 1295224900 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm constructive prolog
< 1295225036 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't imagine what a proof tree would look like for prolog
< 1295225046 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically and execution trace
< 1295225051 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1295225060 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what i'd like
< 1295225072 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i don't get it :D
< 1295225184 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what ! does?
< 1295225228 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :! is the hardest part of prolog to understand.
< 1295225255 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://cs.union.edu/~striegnk/learn-prolog-now/html/node96.html
< 1295225255 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Basically they had implemented prolog in a very specific way, and exploited the way it was done to add this new ! thing
< 1295225259 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and what is X here?
< 1295225270 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the consequence is that ! makes no sense
< 1295225338 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They way they implemented prolog was to have it every time a choice can be made they push that set of branches to a stack
< 1295225368 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :! erases all the alternatives of the top most choice point
< 1295225518 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295225538 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION cuts j-invariant 
< 1295225596 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I made up a program to track the dynamic memory usage of other program. Is there better ways?
< 1295225665 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :man 1 ps
< 1295225694 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What will happen if I eat clementines as my only fruit?
< 1295225715 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Currently, I'm not eating fruits on a regular basis]
< 1295225765 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, you'll be at a much lower risk of scurvy.
< 1295225767 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Is it answer to me?
< 1295225773 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Yeah.
< 1295225796 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am on Windows, though. (The program is cross-platform, however.)
< 1295225816 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I do not like Windows that much; UNIX is better, but Windows is what I have, so I use it.)
< 1295225834 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess that depends on "topmost"; I mean, for a(X,Y,Z) :- b(X), b(Y), !, b(Z) where b(X) can produce multiple choices, the ! will make it not backtrack to try out different values for either X or Y; not just cut the latest possible branching point where the value for Y was determined. (It will also not try some hypothetical other a(X,Y,Z) :- whatever rule it otherwise could.)
< 1295225886 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is the program:  http://sprunge.us/IHEa   You can tell me if I did something wrong.
< 1295226035 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why do humans peel certain fruits?
< 1295226084 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the rind is difficult and/or unrewarding to eat
< 1295226095 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Probably from not liking eating some of the outsides.
< 1295226206 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Non-human animals are presumably ok with it
< 1295226238 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^^not a good reason to do what non-human animals do
< 1295226299 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Another reason might be if it is dirty outside.
< 1295226307 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But, some people do like to eat the peeling.
< 1295226311 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Mostly just preference.
< 1295226314 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Sometimes separately from the inside part)
< 1295226428 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Though some fruits are actually inedible without peeling.
< 1295226442 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, how does that make sense?
< 1295226458 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Then don't eat it!
< 1295226473 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do non-human animals do with such fruits?
< 1295226486 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or did these fruits evolve after mankind started peeling fruits?
< 1295226529 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: That's "inedible to humans".
< 1295226536 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah
< 1295226628 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And of course, you must remember that most human-consumed foods are the result of artificial selection.
< 1295226655 0 :azaq23!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1295226729 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(fun fact: the bananas we typically cultivate & consume cannot survive without human intervention!)
< 1295226927 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(okay, this is actually true of an *insane* number of species...)
< 1295226987 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THAT'S BECAUSE THEY WERE CREATED BY GOD FOR US
< 1295227030 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, when you mention bananas, it's worth noting that animals do typically peel bananas
< 1295227034 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: God created the turkey-physically-incapable-of-having-sex?
< 1295227059 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: How in the world do non-primates handle that?
< 1295227086 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295227106 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Either they eat the bananas or don't eat them or do weird things to them?
< 1295227116 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295227133 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: "Peel bananas", specifically.
< 1295227158 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: my suggestion was that they do not
< 1295227160 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah.
< 1295227481 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ghh
< 1295227712 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION belongs to the Church of Google anyways
< 1295227731 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'm being recruited
< 1295227845 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Why did you belong to the Church of Google?
< 1295227900 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, well god has to be omniscient right? and doesn't google fit that criteria ?
< 1295227914 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also google answers my prayers - whatever I want to know - it knows
< 1295227928 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also - google is all good - it can do no evil
< 1295227942 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :google MUST be god
< 1295227977 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: Google does not know everything. Many things I find it hard to find at all no matter what.
< 1295228095 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, then you must not be a True Believer. Have more trust in your query and you shall learn
< 1295228097 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't use Google very often.
< 1295228111 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tsk tsk.
< 1295228116 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Trust The Google.
< 1295228121 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Love The Google.
< 1295228131 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Give all thine data to The Google and The Google shall give all its love to you.
< 1295228159 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I more often use Wikipedia to search for information than I use Google.
< 1295228213 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, wikipedia is a saint in the Church of Google
< 1295228262 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: I don't care who they are a saint of or not.
< 1295228277 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I use a lot of different things.
< 1295228323 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will ask on IRC, and search some things on Veronica. And I have some books, I will look there. Or, looking at the files I have in my computer.
< 1295228334 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I do sometimes search Google, as well.
< 1295228407 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, your taking the fun out of it
< 1295228410 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tis called a joke
< 1295228416 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION does all those things too
< 1295228418 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but meh
< 1295228438 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not use Google as much as most other people, however.
< 1295228590 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, tbh I'm finding that google is getting worse and worse
< 1295228608 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: I also find it getting worse and worse. In more than one way.
< 1295229390 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295230570 0 :acetoline!~acetoline@125-237-12-196.jetstream.xtra.co.nz JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295231200 0 :calamari!~calamari@ip70-162-184-205.ph.ph.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295231538 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Invent a chess variant involving some esolangs.
< 1295231637 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: ever play Crobots?
< 1295231684 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :calamari: No.
< 1295231694 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I have heard of it though.
< 1295231779 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyhow, HQ9+ could be the pawn :P
< 1295231826 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, if the game is designed to work in a way that is like that.
< 1295231875 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wasn't really serious
< 1295231890 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Other ideas are: Make a game based on 2-dimensional esolangs. Make a game with some hidden information. Make a game involving cards with commands to execute on the board.
< 1295231925 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :calamari: Yes, it certainly does not seem sensible that you could make a chess variant where HQ9+ could be the pawn (or where any esolang "could be the pawn").
< 1295231975 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It can be a game with normal chess board/chess pieces, or one with a different size of board and different pieces.
< 1295231976 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyhow, what I liked about crobots was that you could make some complicated program that did all sorts of stuf.. but then it would get killed by a simple program because the complicated one was bloated and slow in comparison
< 1295232738 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make a chess variant involving pieces with the INTERCAL commands on them.
< 1295232811 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it says something about me that I generally have to close dozens of Wikipedia pages every day...
< 1295232830 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not sure what, though.
< 1295232855 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't strike me as a very unique problem :)
< 1295232879 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably a pretty common problem, really.
< 1295232912 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hardly ever have more than two Wikipedia pages open at once.
< 1295233160 0 :j-invariant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1295233212 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry I'd have to agree.. when I get on wikipedia, if I get more than a few tabs opened, I'm doomed, because that means I'll be on there all night as my tabs grow to infinity
< 1295234024 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Please tell me whether or not this is good enough:    http://sprunge.us/NXPL
< 1295234081 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, you seem to have pasted a tex document and not a runnable or compileable program
< 1295234137 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: It is compileable program, but it requires Enhanced CWEB. Also, it won't compile without TeXnicard, because of the line that says #include "texnicard.c"
< 1295234162 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean just to read to see if the memory usage stuff is workable or if there is something wrong with it.
< 1295234354 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep
< 1295235422 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295235545 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 241 seconds
< 1295236673 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RAM. Cloud.
< 1295236675 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why
< 1295237081 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295237133 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Because eCloud Technologies is going to let us enter the Internet Age!
< 1295237183 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am absolutely bursting to tell people about the awesome thing I just did.
< 1295237188 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But alas, I cannot.
< 1295237199 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(For about a month and a half)
< 1295237213 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: NDA?
< 1295237219 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nope
< 1295237262 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Too awesome for our brains to comprehend, and we need to wait for your newfound singularity to improve our brains enough to be able to understand it?
< 1295237271 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Closer to that.
< 1295237290 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Not that much closer, but the competition is "NDA" :P
< 1295237291 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :)
< 1295237304 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P
< 1295237319 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, "NDA" is at least *plausible*.
< 1295237336 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still not close :P
< 1295237342 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor finally made contact with aliens
< 1295237352 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even closer!
< 1295237376 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Still not close at all, but indisputably closer)
< 1295237392 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor finally made contact with ... something
< 1295237401 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Less close :P
< 1295237427 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...the aliens are the close part?
< 1295237449 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor did something with an FFI (hence the closeness of "aliens")
< 1295237470 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mmm ... about equally close. In the "still not close at all" sense.
< 1295237485 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor did something.
< 1295237491 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EXACTLY!
< 1295237513 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn you Sgeo now we cannot get closer!
< 1295237551 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION suddenly remembers ais523's aversion to "damn you"
< 1295237769 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DAMNATION BE UPON ÞEE
< 1295237801 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295238326 0 :TLUL!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :TLUL|afk
< 1295242466 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott did stuff with Factor
< 1295242467 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh
< 1295243401 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, hasn't he done something in nearly every non-crap language you heard of (and possibly a few of the crap ones too)
< 1295243433 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no
< 1295243439 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he hasn't actually done anything about them
< 1295243450 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just yelled at us about how dumb we are for not having done it for him
< 1295243466 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably he ignored the mediocre and tried out the real crappy ones. I seem to remember he tried to code something in "Plain English" just for the laughs.
< 1295243520 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, that might be a bit of an extreme point of view. The truth is probably in between
< 1295243558 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does your leg hurt yet? if not I'll pull it harder
< 1295243574 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, oh right. I just woke up :P
< 1295243603 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, besides if I can't clearly detect humour I default to taking a statement as serious
< 1295243612 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'm going to look at Io again
< 1295243680 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, why are you so language-ambivalent?
< 1295243700 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: the language or the moon?
< 1295243705 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assure you the latter is more interesting
< 1295243709 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o.O
< 1295243718 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, :D
< 1295243725 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why the Io hate?
< 1295243737 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not Io hate
< 1295243750 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just that Io is friggin awesome
< 1295243767 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, not as awesome as Europe or Titan iirc?
< 1295243771 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the most active body in the solar system
< 1295243772 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"That's because he's speaking in French the entire series, and the Universal Translator turns it into vaguely british sounding English." On Jean-Luc Picard.
< 1295243776 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295243779 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, oh okay
< 1295243779 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D:D:D
< 1295243788 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, hah
< 1295243813 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, where is that from?
< 1295243830 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there an "anti-block" in Io?
< 1295243850 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Force this piece of code to be executed before the surrounding function looks at it
< 1295243853 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: TVtropes.
< 1295243867 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Io loses one ton a second of material to the Jovian magnetosphere
< 1295243869 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, oh. I would have gussed memory alpha for something that absurd ;P
< 1295243886 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's not absurd in the context of the series, it really isn't.
< 1295243893 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, wow
< 1295243904 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, when does Io die?
< 1295243908 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, well I watched (part of) the series.
< 1295243922 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, and I still think it is rather absurd :P
< 1295243928 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Did Riker have a beard?
< 1295243941 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, seen both with and without that
< 1295243943 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly with it
< 1295243960 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, good, you didn't soley get the pain of the first season.
< 1295243977 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, some of the first season was okay
< 1295243984 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the first season was painful
< 1295243993 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not the Q stuff though
< 1295244001 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It ranged from mediocre to OH HOLY GOD THAT HURTS.
< 1295244008 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, yeah
< 1295244011 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With the exception of the first appearance of Q.
< 1295244020 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which was put in as *filler*...
< 1295244022 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, indeed that was okay, the second was not
< 1295244047 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To pad the series opening out to two hours.
< 1295244054 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway. Off to university now.
< 1295244064 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it just me, or is Io a bit of an anti-Haskell?
< 1295244072 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TNG was at its best when it was full of philosophy
< 1295244085 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In Haskell, you can (kind of) substitute definitions for .. defined things
< 1295244091 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was at its worst when it was trying to be TOS with a different cast.
< 1295244133 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In most languages, you don't expect a difference between passing in an expression, and a name containing the value of the resulting expression
< 1295244149 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know there's a term for that, mentioned in SICP, but I don;t know what it is
< 1295244154 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Io throws that out the window
< 1295244174 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: As does C. Macros!
< 1295244210 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: referential transparency
< 1295244215 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and uh, you're wrong
< 1295244222 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm?
< 1295244224 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :referential transparency is a rare feature
< 1295244260 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I mean is, in most languages:
< 1295244263 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295244264 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a = foo()
< 1295244267 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :b(a)
< 1295244268 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Really? Most languages at least have it for pass-by-value.
< 1295244271 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the same as
< 1295244277 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :b(foo())
< 1295244284 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, that's not referential transparency
< 1295244289 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :referential transparency is
< 1295244293 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not referential transparency, but there's a name for it in SICP
< 1295244296 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think
< 1295244302 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't actually read it >.>
< 1295244308 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :b(foo()) != b(2) where foo() returns 2
< 1295244323 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: no language with side-effects does
< 1295244334 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi
< 1295244342 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Oh, dur, I should've specified "modulo side effects".
< 1295244356 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can I construe this conversation as a defense for Io?
< 1295244358 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that makes it nearly meaningless as a distinction.
< 1295244363 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: yeah
< 1295244379 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I cannot imagine a language that did not have referential transparency modulo side effects
< 1295244395 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: prease to be explraining preblerm
< 1295244419 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Io does not have referencial transparency modulo side effects.
< 1295244426 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*referential
< 1295244428 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_o
< 1295244437 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :k I'm going to bed now
< 1295244440 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Tcl doesn't always.
< 1295244449 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may be misunderstanding
< 1295244463 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: my god
< 1295244464 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Granted, you have to be doing nasty things to it for that to come up.
< 1295244468 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1295244488 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :About on par with heavy, heavy macroing in Lisp.
< 1295244494 0 :acetoline!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1295244521 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(oh, the joys of a *first-class stack*)
< 1295244540 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the thing with Io is, every call can be to what another language would call a "macro", and it might be easier to write macros in Io
< 1295244545 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Haven't begun experimenting yet)
< 1295244555 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, not first-class.
< 1295244555 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: until your compiler is first-class, you aren't doing it right :P
< 1295244564 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But... Readily accessible call stack.
< 1295244587 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Sadly, the dodekalogue is not modifiable.
< 1295244616 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro, this is an if statement in Io:
< 1295244616 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if(b == 0, c + 1, d)
< 1295244643 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, that's not nearly as revealing as I want
< 1295244658 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :System args foreach(k, v, write("'", v, "'\n"))
< 1295244677 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Looks like side effects to me. :P
< 1295244696 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm... Now the Lagerholm estimate is 19th. Wonder if that 15th was processing error or if he added couple of days for processing delay.
< 1295244743 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably processing delay.
< 1295244765 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people select(age < 30)
< 1295244805 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As APNIC is *definitely* below his declared threshold right now.
< 1295245621 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295245887 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In Io, strings have encodings
< 1295245897 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That... just makes no sense
< 1295245920 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Encodings refer to the physical representation, not to.. an inherit property of Unicode text
< 1295247847 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am suddenly reminded of Haskellian laziness
< 1295247903 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Praise be to the almightly lambda.
< 1295247907 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Almighty, even.
< 1295248306 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thinking that Unicode isn't superset of everything?
< 1295248466 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :n/m my comment on Haskellian laziness
< 1295248891 0 :acetoline!~acetoline@125-237-12-196.jetstream.xtra.co.nz JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295249762 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION likes how Googleable Ioke is
< 1295250009 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION likes the distinction between the place where methods accessible from anywhere go (Ground) and the [kind of] top level Object (Origin)
< 1295250084 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, it might be DefaultBehavior, not Ground, I'm not sure
< 1295250257 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HOLY. FUCKING. CRAP.
< 1295250262 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION starts worshipping Ioke
< 1295250360 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://ioke.org/wiki/index.php/Guide#Let
< 1295250378 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Of course, it's a power that can be abused, but it gives lots of interesting possibilities for expression."
< 1295250392 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, well, it prevents poisoning of the global state
< 1295250419 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION can think of potential bad interactions though
< 1295250791 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death
< 1295251199 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended
< 1295251200 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295251307 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :excitement of the day:  can Sgeo manage to break up with Ioke before elliott wakes up and modifies shutup?
< 1295251394 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: We should have some sort of a betting pool.
< 1295251408 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay
< 1295251441 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, let might not be as useful for what I was imagining
< 1295251875 0 :TLUL|afk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: *disappears in a puff of orange smoke*
< 1295252038 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hurr... APNIC has allocated over 8M addresses just this month...
< 1295252731 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a pretty insane allocation rate.
< 1295253726 0 :Tritonio!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1295254438 0 :choochter!~choochter@nat/ibm/x-oxugrbupozrjhdyq JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295254874 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now the estimate is 20th... Anyway, one would expect the allocation request very soon (or it may already have been sent)...
< 1295255013 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If the threshold is 2, one would expect allocation request to be sent today...
< 1295260477 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1295261148 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295261260 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295262348 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295262455 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295262459 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295262906 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, that was pleasantly unexpected
< 1295263444 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :email conversation goes vaguely like this:  service X seems to do everything we want  but that would violate the terms of service  you seem to be right, I'll look for a different service
< 1295263454 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this does not fit in with the typical stereotype of an employer
< 1295263475 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(although companies tend to be more worried about doing something illegal than individual people, as they can be relatively large targets to sue)
< 1295263523 0 :acetoline!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1295263537 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, wtf?: http://yro.slashdot.org/story/11/01/16/2110254/Facebook-Opens-Up-Home-Addresses-and-Phone-Numbers
< 1295263571 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295263669 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295264771 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295264869 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295265970 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295266067 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295266209 0 :wth!~tianhou@122.82.33.163 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295266330 0 :wth!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295267169 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1295267266 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295267547 0 :wth!~tianhou@122.82.33.163 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295267562 0 :wth!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295267588 0 :wth!~tianhou@122.82.33.163 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295267599 0 :wth!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295267898 0 :wth!~tianhou@122.82.33.163 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295267946 0 :wth!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295268096 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295270565 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out
< 1295270591 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295270614 0 :cheater-!~cheater@g231048214.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295271193 0 :ineiros!~itniemin@james.ics.hut.fi JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295273015 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295273584 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out
< 1295273648 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295274253 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295274269 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295274295 0 :Tritonio!~TrT@dias.ceid.upatras.gr JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295277582 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295277585 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/5rNti.jpg
< 1295277625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:44:17  HOLY. FUCKING. CRAP.
< 1295277625 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:44:22 * Sgeo starts worshipping Ioke
< 1295277626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sigh
< 1295277636 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"dad blamed"?
< 1295277706 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-13-131.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295277741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :% This program is public domain, but if you combine it with GPL program,
< 1295277741 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :% the combination is licensed by GPL.
< 1295277747 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: That is not even close to legally valid.
< 1295277752 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You be in charge of telling him why not.
< 1295277755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well.
< 1295277761 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's either trivially true, or utterly invalid.
< 1295277860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :17:40:07  zzo38, your taking the fun out of it
< 1295277865 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: you're taking the 're out of you're
< 1295277881 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hrm?
< 1295277891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*you're
< 1295277892 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::)
< 1295277904 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, fuck you
< 1295277912 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gee, thanks
< 1295277916 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-)
< 1295277918 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: swat variable for me
< 1295277921 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WE SPELLS OUR GRAMMARS PROPERLY HERE IN #ESOTERIC
< 1295277934 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: dad blamed is apparently a euphemism for god damned
< 1295277940 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha
< 1295278002 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, in Sgeoland, a euphemism for BANNED
< 1295278010 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm elliott that statement is invalid because of the "this program is public domain"
< 1295278015 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: i recall a recent reddit post arguing that people correcting each other's grammar and spelling is the only thing keeping communities from descending into youtube comment quality
< 1295278022 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/post/comment/
< 1295278033 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: preeeecisely...except /arguably/ it is just stating informatively /what/ the GPL demands
< 1295278039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :either way, it's completely useless text :)
< 1295278073 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep
< 1295278076 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm or was it recent, it may have been just linked from a recent reddit comment
< 1295278081 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where did you find that?
< 1295278108 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: the program zzo linked yesterday
< 1295278111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he is a fan of terrible licensing!
< 1295278122 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he can't seem to not invent his own ... like everything else ...
< 1295278127 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, why do I get the feeling that 50% of the comments were a flame about some perfectly normal variation? ie color v colour ?
< 1295278136 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295278145 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: well that happens of course :D
< 1295278161 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think a saw someone complaining about "whilst" yesterday
< 1295278165 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*i
< 1295278166 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: *colour vs. colour
< 1295278170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you illiterate American bastard!
< 1295278206 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: however on reddit that just means we're in for the _next_ commenter giving us a lesson
< 1295278234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD
< 1295278238 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, did I mention that UK shows are so much better than the Americanized versions (Hustle v Leverage)?
< 1295278275 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#esoteric is of course _almost_ indistinguishable from parts of reddit
< 1295278279 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable: you are granted temporary lenience.
< 1295278283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: er are you sure about that :D
< 1295278310 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hey i corrected it to "parts of" before pressing enter!
< 1295278335 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I'd like to see a subreddit as flamewarry as here... or as interesting... or as off-topic
< 1295278397 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :r/politics for the first perhaps?
< 1295278415 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ok but with #esoteric the important thing is that it's intelligent people arguing like morons
< 1295278425 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :U WRONG!
< 1295278426 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/r/politics is just morons arguing like morons
< 1295278543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hi
< 1295278544 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also things go off-topic all the time in the comments
< 1295278575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well sure, but I just don't really see this place as being similar to reddit
< 1295278592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: proggit circa early 2007, perhaps
< 1295278613 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and people keep complaining about r/science not having real science although i saw a post indicating they were intending to moderate more restrictively
< 1295278615 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:13:44  Please tell me whether or not this is good enough:    http://sprunge.us/NXPL
< 1295278615 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:14:41  hmm, you seem to have pasted a tex document and not a runnable or compileable program
< 1295278621 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: ENHAAAAAANCED CWEEEEEEEEEEB
< 1295278641 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*start moderating
< 1295278660 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It gives you PROGRAMMING POWERS
< 1295278670 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can write a BOOK and it's a PROGRAM but a BOOK and a program yet a BOOK!
< 1295278678 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT RENDERS LINE NUMBERS TO .DVI
< 1295278734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:34:26  elliott did stuff with Factor
< 1295278734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:34:27  huh
< 1295278734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I had a half-broken commit made to the repository that got fixed by Slava and made "0 /" give a less horrific exception.
< 1295278745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:50:33  no
< 1295278745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:50:39  he hasn't actually done anything about them
< 1295278745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:50:50  just yelled at us about how dumb we are for not having done it for him
< 1295278753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^cat coppro: factually incorrect
< 1295278753 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: factually incorrect
< 1295278772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if I accidentally killed coppro's dog or something
< 1295278794 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: thinking about it, it's possible that i just tune out the parts i like the least from both places, making them converge :)
< 1295278807 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: FUCK YOU ASSHOLE
< 1295278808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hi
< 1295278827 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat
< 1295278957 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what
< 1295278958 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it takes a few more lines than that to make me _start_ tuning out, naturally :D
< 1295278969 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: pumpkin enclosed with leaves, how odd
< 1295278972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: FUCK YOU ASSHOLE
< 1295278972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: FUCK YOU ASSHOLE
< 1295278973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: FUCK YOU ASSHOLE
< 1295278973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: FUCK YOU ASSHOLE
< 1295278973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: FUCK YOU ASSHOLE
< 1295278973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: FUCK YOU ASSHOLE
< 1295278974 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hi
< 1295278985 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah yeah whatever
< 1295278994 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ok this whole tree seems to exist solely to conceal pumpkins
< 1295279003 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, do ypu dislike Ioke? I assume if you do, it's for the same "It has no rules" reason for hating Io
< 1295279031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's probably better than Io but I don't see any reason to give it any attention.
< 1295279045 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is, IIRC, JVM-hosted, which is a strong negative.
< 1295279058 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION paging shutup in 1, 2...
< 1295279176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Waaay too lazy to add anything to it since it doesn't seem to have done anything.
< 1295279198 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's still broken?
< 1295279229 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh not done anything to Sgeo you mean
< 1295279246 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you do not seriously _expect_ people to respond constructively to harassment, do you?
< 1295279266 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_even_ if you're right about the fundamental issue
< 1295279363 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :triggering people's basic defense instincts is not a way to make them behave rationally.
< 1295279449 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that i imagine Sgeo caring that much about shutup anyhow
< 1295279513 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION always feels hypocritical when talking about how people should behave :(
< 1295279912 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well i _have_ tried talking him out of it, and yelling at him directly
< 1295279920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i can hardly program a bot to talk rationally, so instead it yells
< 1295279932 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :patches welcome :P
< 1295279999 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295280047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I think you might want to remove the "simple little" part from the mcmap README's first line.
< 1295280054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's quite a hefty program now. :p
< 1295280056 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD
< 1295280088 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :simple little behemoth
< 1295280113 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, does mcmap have a built-in colour for TNT?
< 1295280124 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I haven't done a thing.
< 1295280137 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Heh, I'm going to tweak the dependency-generating rule with that option that ignores non-existent headers, assuming they're generated; currently it won't generate dependencies if protocol-data.h doesn't exist.
< 1295280171 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you expect me to take your word on that?
< 1295280179 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Draaaaaaaaama.
< 1295280193 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you know I didn't push a SECRET UPDATE to decolour TNT!!?!??@49837869rumkf
< 1295280326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Srsly, all I did last night was walk around.
< 1295280332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am currently lost somewhere far away from the Cube.
< 1295280456 0 :Tritonio!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1295280500 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://pdos.csail.mit.edu/scigen/
< 1295280510 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now what are the coords of spawn again...
< 1295280524 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Also outdated: "If you leave it out, the window will be resizable, but resize events are not handled, so something bad will probably happen. (Fixing this is on the hypothetical TODO list.)"
< 1295280533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I pushed that build system fix, btw.
< 1295280552 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001f5b00390f-CM001e6b2335dc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295280641 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[15:40]  ais523: hi <-- hi
< 1295280662 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what are good times to bug you about scapegoat relative to your sleep schedule? :-P
< 1295280689 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh, the issue for me now is that I'm looking at #esoteric when people speak there
< 1295280692 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not really taking in any of the words
< 1295280704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: minecraft, eh :P
< 1295280709 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could be
< 1295280726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: surely the tab colour for minecraft is different if you've been pinged?
< 1295280729 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's xchat default, at least
< 1295280740 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, it is
< 1295280767 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but as I said, I just noticed I'd been pinged, looked at the channel, then went back to looking at something else
< 1295280770 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and again, didn't actually read it
< 1295280775 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think my brain is IRCing on autopilot
< 1295280823 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: check the link i pasted
< 1295280827 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: IF I PING YOU LIKE THIS WOULD IT HELP
< 1295280872 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: BEEP BEEP WAKE UP BEEEEEEEP
< 1295280923 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: BEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEP
< 1295280930 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I only noticed the third one
< 1295280938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ok, i'll use that in future
< 1295280947 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and probably only because I was looking at the channel at the time
< 1295280971 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: this is why most people have system-wide indicators if they've been pinged :P
< 1295280972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. sound
< 1295280977 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I /do/
< 1295280983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you're...deaf?
< 1295280998 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or just _really_ good at ignoring things?
< 1295281008 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, I just don't react to the fact I was pinged for whatever reason
< 1295281013 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh
< 1295281014 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, #esoteric was set not to trigger them
< 1295281017 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which probably has something to do with it
< 1295281022 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :must have been a mouse-typo weeks ago
< 1295281032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that might be something worth fixing :p
< 1295281050 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, I looked in the client's config, and there was a specific config entry meaning "#esoteric should not ping me no matter what's said there"
< 1295281051 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fixed now
< 1295281057 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I don't know if you heard the last time I said, but my scapegoat implementation can now order and apply changesets
< 1295281063 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay
< 1295281070 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: which I think means it does automatic merging
< 1295281084 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what happens on a changeset that contains a conflict?
< 1295281085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the changeset {A, B}, when applied, will produce an automatic merge of A and B if one is possible, right?
< 1295281088 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it returns Nothing :-)
< 1295281092 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's my only failure mechanism right now
< 1295281098 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh
< 1295281102 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm trying to get it as platonically elegant as possible before ruining it
< 1295281108 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can upgrade it to a better monad later
< 1295281122 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. Either, for the purpose of returning more details about the problem
< 1295281127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: doubt it needs to be a monad; just (Either ApplyError [Line])
< 1295281131 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, is (Either a) a monad?
< 1295281135 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep
< 1295281135 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it only is under certain conditions
< 1295281150 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just Maybe + error message
< 1295281169 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as long as you use Right as the actual value, and Left as the error condition; its >>= is defined with that assumption
< 1295281173 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1295281207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: anyway, what do you think I should implement next? I was thinking changes-on-sets (i.e. directories), but I'm not sure
< 1295281228 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, it might be better to ask me when I'm capable of concious thought
< 1295281232 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which it seems I'm not at the moment
< 1295281234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and my attempts to refit the code to allow genericisation have resulted in ugliness
< 1295281246 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: heh, try and remember to ping me when you are then :P
< 1295281316 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, my sleep schedule is mostly OK except I was awake all night Saturday -> Sunday, due to looking after a relative
< 1295281326 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and this is the first week of term
< 1295281429 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I have a report deadline
< 1295281495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: just one question if you feel conscious enough to answer it: do you think it's possible to derive the file changes with an F([String]) and the directory changes with F(Set DirEntry) for the same F?
< 1295281506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. are they direct analogues of each other that can be auto-generated?
< 1295281526 0 :Vorpal_!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295281534 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha, probably not, because the way you specify context is different
< 1295281536 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal_: what coords are spawn, do you know?
< 1295281539 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: define context?
< 1295281542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ah
< 1295281546 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: because with a list, you go between two elements
< 1295281549 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Disconnected by services
< 1295281550 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: with a set, you specify the whole set
< 1295281551 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep
< 1295281551 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to insert to
< 1295281555 0 :Vorpal_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Vorpal
< 1295281564 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's a big enough difference to confuse type systems
< 1295281565 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : [17:29:57] Vorpal_: what coords are spawn, do you know? <-- no idea
< 1295281574 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, some smallish positive number?
< 1295281578 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for x and z
< 1295281579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well i know that :)
< 1295281584 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, is this channel still talking about minecraft?
< 1295281585 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: even then, I've been trying to make a "Change" typeclass so that I can define operations generic to change type ... but this might be fruitless
< 1295281607 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: at the same time, I think I still want _some_ sort of genericity, because e.g. both types of change have the same metadata
< 1295281609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is:
< 1295281611 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :author, date, etc.
< 1295281611 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed
< 1295281617 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i'm a bit confused :)
< 1295281621 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just getting levels of abstraction right
< 1295281631 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's coming up in my research atm and confusing me
< 1295281636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I think I'll make a distinction between "changes" and "patches"
< 1295281639 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also my computer crashed. Something with USB is shoddy and can cause a reset.
< 1295281645 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: change = basic operation; patch = change + metadata
< 1295281649 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: changes reference patches
< 1295281653 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, OK
< 1295281660 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e., a change might be "insert 'foo' between patch1 and patch2", and a patch using it might be:
< 1295281662 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure how useful the naming is there, but I doubt any other naming would do better
< 1295281663 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :author: elliott
< 1295281666 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :date: [now]
< 1295281670 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :insert 'foo' between patch1 and patch2
< 1295281673 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the concepts are certainly useful
< 1295281678 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, a patch is the kind of thing you'd show to another person, a change isn't
< 1295281714 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, here's a concept English doesn't have a word for, and comes up a lot in programming: imagine something like a computer game (Minecraft perhaps?) where you want to generate some in-game concept (perhaps monsters)
< 1295281733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: now we're on-topic! ...wait...
< 1295281738 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, err?
< 1295281743 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are two ways you can define "monster": an individual monster in a location on the map, or the concept of that monster that it's generated from
< 1295281756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh
< 1295281771 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I'd call the former a monster and the latter a monster-class
< 1295281773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or monster-type
< 1295281775 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the question is, how do you name the second type of monster, to show it's distinct from the first?
< 1295281778 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but those don't make sense to refer to Changes as
< 1295281786 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, you mean like the idea of an monster (as in Platon (sp in English?))
< 1295281788 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, that wasn't a scapegoat reference at all
< 1295281788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i assume that's what you're trying to say
< 1295281790 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1295281798 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: what
< 1295281800 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes, I've seen "platonic" used to describe the concept before
< 1295281806 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well sort of...
< 1295281809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just a template vs. instance
< 1295281809 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it doesn't seem to fit exactly
< 1295281813 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: use OOP TERMINOLOGY!!192871349
< 1295281814 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, the second could perhaps be an instance of a monster
< 1295281817 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, in fact, this is almost directly OOP
< 1295281819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :class vs. instance
< 1295281821 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: except you need multiple inheritance
< 1295281822 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: er no
< 1295281826 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the second is the class
< 1295281827 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :definitely
< 1295281836 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, err, which one do you mean is the second
< 1295281839 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and which is the first
< 1295281847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the one that came second in his message, perhaps?
< 1295281850 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just thinking out loud here
< 1295281854 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : there are two ways you can define "monster": an individual monster in a location on the map, or the concept of that monster that it's generated from
< 1295281856 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait yeah I mixed up order
< 1295281859 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it was the other way around
< 1295281860 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION clap
< 1295281866 0 :asiekierka!~asiekierk@078088180066.elblag.vectranet.pl JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295281867 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, how do you need MI?
< 1295281870 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello!
< 1295281874 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is what boredom does to people
< 1295281886 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastebin.com/712w0gTm
< 1295281898 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: because sensibly, an individual monster needs to inherit from a monster class (if you're doing OO), and that's the way round nearly all games do it
< 1295281914 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott's claiming it should also inherit from the monster template, which is entirely sensible except it requires MI
< 1295281917 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I think it only is under certain conditions <-- the Left type needs an Error instance, is all
< 1295281924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: erm
< 1295281925 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: not really
< 1295281932 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: class Grue < Monster := ...
< 1295281935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: myGrue := new Grue
< 1295281940 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastebin.com/xyGf2UVF <- added some more info
< 1295281941 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: right
< 1295281949 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, yep. So the monster classes inherits from some base class. And then you have instances of each monster. This is one of the few situations where OOP terminology actually seems pretty sensible
< 1295281950 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: but Monster shouldn't contain things like X and Y coordinates
< 1295281955 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and nor should Grue
< 1295281956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: is this on Windows?
< 1295281958 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but myGrue should
< 1295281960 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and they are quite rare
< 1295281963 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Linux
< 1295281965 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ubuntu 10.10
< 1295281968 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hmm, yes they should
< 1295281971 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2.8GHz Intel Core 2 Qud
< 1295281972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Monster should inherit from GridEntity
< 1295281972 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quad*
< 1295281980 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: needs moar llvm
< 1295281983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm
< 1295281983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clang
< 1295281987 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: also pcc
< 1295281992 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also non-glibc libc
< 1295281992 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s
< 1295281997 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :adding clang
< 1295282001 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ah, I see, that makes complete sense if you have a fixed set of monsters
< 1295282010 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: *monster types?
< 1295282014 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, yes
< 1295282023 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most games are written in such a way that monster types could be added at runtime
< 1295282029 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is weird, as none of them actually do do that
< 1295282039 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott: but Monster shouldn't contain things like X and Y coordinates <-- so you could have another base class that includes other things which has a position in the game world, "entity" seems like the best name? Though this is getting very far into OOP now...
< 1295282045 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: how does that clash with my way of doing it?
< 1295282048 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bench.c:67:1: error: 'main' must return 'int'
< 1295282052 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: welcome to me, five lines ago
< 1295282053 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fixing
< 1295282060 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(yes, that's clang)
< 1295282074 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it requires generation of classes at runtime
< 1295282077 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well you split your statements over more lines. Of course you get more said (though less per line)
< 1295282094 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: So? :)
< 1295282099 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott - looks like we have a current winner
< 1295282100 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: gcc's error is actually similarly useful in this case
< 1295282104 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is surprising
< 1295282108 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: gcc gave nothing!
< 1295282110 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: you're testing this while you're running an irc client?
< 1295282115 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: -Wall fail
< 1295282121 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that and Firefox
< 1295282124 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I think that one's actually under -pedantic
< 1295282128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: hahahaha
< 1295282144 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: benchmarks while running Firefox
< 1295282145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hilarious
< 1295282156 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, if you want to make monsters at runtime you presumably also need to add some sort of game logic to them at runtime. Some sort of AI. Which means you need to add code at runtime anyway.
< 1295282164 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :either by scripting language
< 1295282170 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or by loading native code, or something else
< 1295282177 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's not that ridiculous, you can use the POSIX timer that counts only time spent by the process in question
< 1295282186 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ignores other processes on the same processor
< 1295282189 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(where "native" could be byte code if you do it in java or whatever)
< 1295282196 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that's not a very good measurement
< 1295282205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: since it'll probably be quite a bit less than a machine just running the benchmark
< 1295282207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and counting real time
< 1295282216 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastebin.com/FHwQ12XD
< 1295282217 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, how would you count waiting for IO and no other runnable task?
< 1295282218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i guess it depends on how it treats kernel time, but still
< 1295282223 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott it's not a speed benchmark
< 1295282224 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: seems I was wrong, it's under both -Wall /and/ -pedantic
< 1295282226 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a comparison between compilers
< 1295282227 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, to that process or to nowhere?
< 1295282236 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IO waits go to nowhere on that timer
< 1295282236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: doesn't matter, your results are biased
< 1295282247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :due to Firefox using different resources at different times, most likely
< 1295282268 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, which timer you use depends on what you're trying to measure
< 1295282278 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, then how do you deal with virtualisation. You can't tell really where time went if you are virtualised.
< 1295282288 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I/O time is very relevant for benchmarking some programs, and not for others
< 1295282295 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: did not make a real difference
< 1295282303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: you can't know that...
< 1295282311 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i turned off everything
< 1295282317 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: indeed
< 1295282320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: including X11?
< 1295282320 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the console (used to run benchmarks), IRC client and 1 tab in Firefox
< 1295282326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"everything"
< 1295282334 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we have different definitions of everything
< 1295282335 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i need the irc client and firefox to update
< 1295282337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yours doesn't include X11, apparently
< 1295282348 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a whole bunch of system services too
< 1295282368 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever
< 1295282375 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose you could use emulation, rather than virtualisation, for consistent benchmarks
< 1295282384 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i will zip up the compiled binaries
< 1295282386 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the source code
< 1295282392 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: how would that help you benchmark them?
< 1295282395 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and put it up so you can test it
< 1295282400 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I wouldn't want to
< 1295282401 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway
< 1295282405 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where can i find pcc, elliott?
< 1295282408 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not me who wants the benchmark results
< 1295282409 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: neither would I :P
< 1295282421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pcc.ludd.ltu.se/
< 1295282422 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you want benchmarks just to compare two situations (different softwares, before/after change) or such just turn off most CPU intensive stuff then set cpu frequency governor to performance. Then time the thing a number of times and take the average.
< 1295282424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need the CVS versoin
< 1295282425 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*version
< 1295282426 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most of the time that works well
< 1295282427 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also pcc-libs
< 1295282441 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I would say "ugh CVS", except that I'm using RCS for a serious project
< 1295282443 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :admittedly by mistake
< 1295282444 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: timing a number of times is done by Linpack
< 1295282451 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka, the other bits?
< 1295282452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, they're BSD guys, they're luddites :)
< 1295282474 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's not too awful, except for having to check out immediately after checking in when I'm the only person working on the file
< 1295282482 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal - i do not know where to find the cpu governor and i tured off the cpu intensive stuff already, except what i need
< 1295282485 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the CPU frequency really matters. ondemand is bad for quick benchmarks. Or anything where CPU load isn't high for a long time
< 1295282495 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really it seriously messes up timing
< 1295282505 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a locking VCS isn't really an issue at all when only one person is working on the file anyway
< 1295282519 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: see if you used SCAPEGOAT ... wait, i can't use that on you
< 1295282532 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka, cpufreq-set -g performance -c 0, repeat with -c 1 and so on for each core in your CPU
< 1295282536 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :needs sudo
< 1295282544 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or su or whatever)
< 1295282563 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://reckzb.imgur.com/new_haven_museum#q7EwQ
< 1295282566 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to restore just do cpufreq-set -g ondemand -c whatever for each core
< 1295282571 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Beats Deewiant's, I'm afraid.
< 1295282575 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Loading cpufreq kernel modules...                                     [fail]
< 1295282580 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am sudo'd
< 1295282581 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or su'd
< 1295282589 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : admittedly by mistake <-- uh how did that happen?
< 1295282593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"sudo'd or su'd" -- ah, to be incompetent.
< 1295282598 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I was using LyX
< 1295282602 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Man, that Painterly pack is weird.
< 1295282606 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am root
< 1295282607 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: he accidentally typed "rcs"
< 1295282608 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tat's better
< 1295282610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it all went downhill from there
< 1295282612 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the windows are different.
< 1295282613 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it has version control integration, but doesn't state the VCS when setting it up
< 1295282613 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: root is better than sudo?
< 1295282614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL.
< 1295282620 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe
< 1295282622 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :turns out, the only VCS it actually integrates with is RCS
< 1295282627 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, heh. I just ignore it's built in vcs support. But doesn't it do svn nowdays too?
< 1295282635 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps as a plugin
< 1295282635 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rcs is preferable to svn
< 1295282637 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P
< 1295282641 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1295282643 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I think in the very last version or such
< 1295282645 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but SVN is much worse than RCS for a single-developer project
< 1295282648 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :svn is like cvs, except without historical justification
< 1295282652 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also, very slow
< 1295282655 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or was it git? well some non-rcs anyway
< 1295282655 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, FWIW, that museum must have been done with a map editor.
< 1295282661 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Why? Bedrock?
< 1295282665 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my main annoyance with svn is the lack of local history
< 1295282677 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I've been using git-svn nowadays
< 1295282686 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for use with other people's svn repos
< 1295282690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: SCAPEGOAAAAT
< 1295282693 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or, in the case of UnNetHack, tailor)
< 1295282695 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no, but it has lapis, redstone and coal ore in the one room.
< 1295282700 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Ah.
< 1295282704 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :None of which can be placed.
< 1295282704 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hmm, we must add scapegoat support to tailor when we're done
< 1295282713 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And there's a *lot* of blue wool there.
< 1295282714 0 :asiekierka!~asiekierk@078088180066.elblag.vectranet.pl JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295282716 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: agreed, but IIRC Tailor's architecture is a bit bad? I forget
< 1295282718 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back
< 1295282724 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295282728 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I'm planning to write darcs2sg as soon as sg "works" so it can be tested
< 1295282730 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway... /usr/include//stdio.h:34: error: cannot find 'stddef.h'
< 1295282731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on real repos
< 1295282732 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's probably awful, although I've never looked at the source it has a tendency to fail randomly
< 1295282736 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what pcc gives
< 1295282741 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with pcc-current.tgz
< 1295282741 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, not randomly, deterministically
< 1295282751 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but without it being obvious what the relevant factors are
< 1295282753 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: you didn't install pcc-libs.
< 1295282760 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: also, use cvs, not the .tgzs.
< 1295282763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pcc-libs is only available via cvs too.
< 1295282770 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: sg basically needs to-sg-repo support anyway, for converting old repositories
< 1295282772 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although VCS type seems to be one of them, and directory structure is possibly another
< 1295282776 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: indeed
< 1295282778 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: so darcs can be done quite easily
< 1295282787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from-sg would take actual work, but who would want to do that? :)
< 1295282792 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl
< 1295282813 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it wouldn't be too hard
< 1295282832 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd just need to figure out what to define as a merge from the point of view of the other VCS
< 1295282859 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could either do it completely linear or maximally branching; the second would probably be a more accurate view of things, the first would correspond to a rebase and rebases are evil
< 1295282894 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3
< 1295282912 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(sorry, I typoed 3 in my terminal, realised that was an inappropriate place to typo it, so I moved the typo to #esoteric to get rid of ti)
< 1295282914 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*it
< 1295282916 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pcc-libs is on the FTP too, but i'll try cvs
< 1295282939 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem is
< 1295282941 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how to remove pcc
< 1295282954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: you make installed it?
< 1295282956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :looooooooool
< 1295282964 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop loling
< 1295282967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: into /usr?
< 1295282967 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did it at least install in /usr/local?
< 1295282967 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know you hate me
< 1295282970 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just stop loling
< 1295282979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, i don't hate you, it's just i laugh at stupid decisions
< 1295282979 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes
< 1295282991 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i only installed linux last week, keep it a little bit easier
< 1295282994 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: it's not too hard to uninstall, then; you just need to rm -r all the directory trees it created
< 1295283004 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is easier if you know where they actually are
< 1295283005 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or just rm -rf /usr/local if you haven't installed anything there before.
< 1295283013 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: > llvm
< 1295283021 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also parts of gcc
< 1295283023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: good luck...
< 1295283029 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :look to see if there's a make uninstall in the makefile
< 1295283031 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is sometimes
< 1295283032 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use --prefix=/opt/foo in future, or checkinstall
< 1295283035 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes it even actually works
< 1295283038 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: checked already
< 1295283039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: they're BSD guys. they're luddites
< 1295283039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt it :)
< 1295283051 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also
< 1295283053 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pcc wiped out manually
< 1295283056 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(C-INTERCAL's does, although it doesn't uninstall previous versions)
< 1295283056 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now to get the cvs versions
< 1295283120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you /must/ switch C-INTERCAL to scapegoat as soon as it's stable enough, I want to see esr's reaction
< 1295283131 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why?
< 1295283148 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because everything esr has said so far re: C-INTERCAL has been amusing
< 1295283194 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/usr/local install isn't ridiculously bad; it's comparable to the situation on Windows
< 1295283205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: windows programs all have uninstallers
< 1295283211 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes, but they generally don't work
< 1295283217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: they work better than nothing :)
< 1295283288 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the situation with Norton is ridiculous; it comes with an uninstaller that doesn't work, but you can download an uninstaller that does from the company website
< 1295283304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, "isn't ridiculously bad; comparable to Windows" is a strange thing to say
< 1295283317 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you've used Windows, you know it isn't completely awful
< 1295283326 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :atm I consider it usable but suboptimal and a pain to develop for
< 1295283330 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, no, but its /architecture/ is terrible
< 1295283339 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :terrible and improving
< 1295283343 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: not internally
< 1295283350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Old New Thing can convince anyone of that
< 1295283356 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't read it much
< 1295283361 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I probably should, it's a good blog
< 1295283372 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 3
< 1295283372 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (sorry, I typoed 3 in my terminal, realised that was an inappropriate place to typo it, so I moved the typo to #esoteric to get rid of ti)
< 1295283372 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : *it
< 1295283381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D
< 1295283385 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, you are joking right? It isn't some sort of OCD?
< 1295283392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*of awesome?
< 1295283395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: here's something you won't believe
< 1295283396 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(you never know with people of this channel)
< 1295283406 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I am aware you can get rid of typos more easily than that
< 1295283406 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: as far as I can tell, Raymond Chen wrote Linux 2.0's configuration interface bash script
< 1295283418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Raymond Chen, of Old New Thing. *While working at Microsoft.*
< 1295283427 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was just in a mood to give this one a home
< 1295283428 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, well yes. But would you use the other way?
< 1295283433 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1295283435 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it was credited to a Raymond Chen, it had an @microsoft.com email, and IIRC googling the email vaguely pointed me in his direction.
< 1295283452 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not completely implausible
< 1295283452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It was a *bash shell script*. Used for configuring Linux 2.0.
< 1295283459 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not completely, but awesome!
< 1295283471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: (it's a horrific script -- it reads answers from /dev/tty, so you can't pipe less in)
< 1295283474 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott
< 1295283475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*pipe yes in
< 1295283478 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea why
< 1295283483 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where can i find the way to download pcc-libs via cvs
< 1295283496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pcc.ludd.ltu.se/downloads/
< 1295283498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :check out the pcc-libs module
< 1295283504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :via cvs
< 1295283508 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hey, C-INTERCAL reads from /dev/tty
< 1295283508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same pserver as listed there
< 1295283513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: why?
< 1295283513 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or used to, at least
< 1295283524 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the code logic completely lost track of stdin after a while
< 1295283531 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I got lost trying to figure out where it had got to
< 1295283536 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly still does
< 1295283536 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha
< 1295283545 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just for the debugger, which makes sense reading from the tty anyway
< 1295283556 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, for unknown reason it reassigned stdout and stdin a lot iirc
< 1295283579 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, but what if you want to use the debugger from inside an editor. Like gdb-mode for emacs or similar?
< 1295283596 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: M-x term
< 1295283604 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although that's far from optimal
< 1295283608 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed
< 1295283616 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, doesn't Emacs simulate /dev/tty anyway in shell-mode?
< 1295283617 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: /usr/include//signal.h:349: error: cannot find 'stddef.h'
< 1295283619 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the funny thing is
< 1295283622 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is no stddef.h in there
< 1295283624 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can just use a pty
< 1295283628 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, perhaps. I haven't checked how gdb mode work or such
< 1295283632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: did you make install pcc-libs?
< 1295283635 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, I'm vaguely annoyed at the moment because the burglar alarm's gone off again
< 1295283646 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that happens while compiling pcc-libs
< 1295283650 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, at university?
< 1295283652 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: comint doesn't simulate /dev/tty, i don't _think_
< 1295283652 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it uses pcc to compile them
< 1295283654 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes
< 1295283657 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: it shouldn't
< 1295283657 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1295283659 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: it's meant to use gcc
< 1295283662 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you set CC=pcc or something
< 1295283671 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: failing that, "make clean; CC=gcc ./configure"
< 1295283687 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wait, can't it self-host?
< 1295283691 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott - still uses pcc
< 1295283697 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Not when you don't have a working compiler yet :-P
< 1295283702 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pcc-libs is the other half to pcc on Linux.
< 1295283705 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, fair enough
< 1295283718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: you should have compiled pcc second, I don't know what to do; it should work with CC=gcc
< 1295283722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it doesn't you did something really weird
< 1295283727 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it does not have a check for CC anywhere
< 1295283727 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, though iirc gcc insists on self-hosting itself when compiling with any other compilser
< 1295283729 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compiler*
< 1295283731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: what?
< 1295283737 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :./configure listens to CC.
< 1295283740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*$CC
< 1295283742 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i tried searching the entire ./configure to CC
< 1295283744 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for CC
< 1295283758 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/sigh
< 1295283763 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that autoconf configure?
< 1295283766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes.
< 1295283767 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :got it
< 1295283770 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well then wtf
< 1295283772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it probably does some random shit.
< 1295283775 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than say CC directly.
< 1295283780 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it does that for two reasons: half of it's written in gcc extensions, and as a check (it compares gcc compiled with gcc compiled with gcc to gcc compiled with gcc compiled with $OTHER_COMPILER to verify they're identical)
< 1295283802 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that's far too many recursions
< 1295283804 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah
< 1295283804 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :autoconf respects CC
< 1295283805 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: fixed it
< 1295283812 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: any fewer and you wouldn't expect the binaries to match
< 1295283812 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :removed /usr/local/bin/pcc (will reinstall it)
< 1295283822 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it does check for pcc hardcoded, if it doesnt find it only then it uses gcc
< 1295283823 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: gcc compiled with gcc compiled with X = gcc compiled with gcc compiled with gcc compiled with X
< 1295283838 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that's two less recursions than yours
< 1295283853 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now it works
< 1295283855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that only requires three compilations
< 1295283866 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, but what about stuff like debug info. Wouldn't you expect them to differ (different paths in the debug info)?
< 1295283866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and since gcc only goes up to stage3, I *doubt* it does what you said
< 1295283883 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :runs at roughly the same speed as GCC
< 1295283892 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, that's what I said
< 1295283894 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually a bit slower
< 1295283894 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just the other way round
< 1295283898 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, actually he got the count right
< 1295283901 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll try to recompile pcc-libs with pcc now
< 1295283906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh, you used "with" to separate them both
< 1295283920 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no he used "to"
< 1295283920 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: thus making your sentence completely unparsable
< 1295283929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not looking at that sentence again, it hurts me
< 1295283946 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope, no difference
< 1295283961 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well with PCC-compiled libs it is faster
< 1295283973 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still slower than GCC, though
< 1295283979 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: now do them all again with uClibc/dietlibc (compilers bootstrapped with same)
< 1295283980 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have fun
< 1295283990 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay
< 1295284003 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well here I added markup, look if you want, if not then don't: "it compares (gcc [3] compiled with gcc [2] compiled with gcc [1]) to (gcc [2] compiled with gcc [1] compiled with $OTHER_COMPILER) to verify they're identical"
< 1295284004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need to patch both dietlibc and pcc to get them working together, but i can't give you them, they're on the other box.
< 1295284011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: right.
< 1295284021 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the number are the stage numbers
< 1295284024 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's a lot easier if you have a C interpreter
< 1295284024 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :numbers*
< 1295284035 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, does any exist?
< 1295284037 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: gcc compiled with gcc_interpreted = gcc compiled with gcc compiled with gcc_interpreted
< 1295284040 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: *do, and I thnk so
< 1295284042 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*think
< 1295284047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cint or whatever
< 1295284047 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh nice
< 1295284048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and Ch
< 1295284054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ch supports the 1999 ISO C Standard (C99) and C++ classes. It is superset of C with C++ classes. C99 major features such as complex numbers, variable length arrays (VLAs), IEEE-754 floating-point arithmetic and generic mathematical functions are supported. Wide characters in Addendum 1 for C90 is also supported.
< 1295284056 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the other hand
< 1295284060 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PCC wins in size
< 1295284076 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's not really much easier, you just replaced "compiled with" with "interpreted with", then "interpreted with" with an underscore
< 1295284080 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: pcc/dietlibc can produce statically-linked executables of 4K in size
< 1295284082 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, complex numbers. heh nice
< 1295284094 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that is one of the features I would expect to be unsupported
< 1295284095 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: (statically linking with glibc = 100K+ usually)
< 1295284102 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: not that hard to do, surely
< 1295284120 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: shush :)
< 1295284125 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, pcc supports all of C89 and some of C99?
< 1295284126 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's certainly faster to do, probably
< 1295284127 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yeah but if you look at C99 compilers it is one of the last features to get done it seems.
< 1295284130 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastebin.com/b4P3QzZM
< 1295284130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since gcc takes so long to compile
< 1295284142 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :current rank
< 1295284144 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, (based on clang and gcc development history)
< 1295284158 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, possibly because few people use it?
< 1295284165 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably
< 1295284202 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastebin.com/fJ2CVjjj <- added one more important info
< 1295284227 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most effort put into biased benchmarks evar
< 1295284240 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : since gcc takes so long to compile <-- wouldn't it take ages to interpret as well?
< 1295284254 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well you'd only hit the codepaths that are actually used to compile gcc.
< 1295284256 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so probably not.
< 1295284258 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: bash adds a bit of overhead
< 1295284259 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok it'd be very slow still :)
< 1295284260 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should i disable it too
< 1295284268 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it doesn't
< 1295284270 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well a coverage analysis might be interesting here.
< 1295284273 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also the kernel adds some
< 1295284274 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bash will just be sleeping while it runs
< 1295284277 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should do it without a kernel
< 1295284280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :false comparison
< 1295284282 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, I'm not going to try that on gcc bootstrap
< 1295284331 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/Minecraft/comments/f3llk/dear_mojang_different_colored_wood_and_stairs/c1d2hz4?context=2 I approve
< 1295284334 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(sorry ais523)
< 1295284352 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :here's another question
< 1295284361 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how to switch ubuntu to use dietlibc and not glibc
< 1295284371 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure if it's designed for that sort of customization
< 1295284384 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the purpose of Ubuntu isn't really extreme tinkering
< 1295284400 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(does even gentoo let you do that switch easily?)
< 1295284403 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey even gentoo doesn't support that sort of stuff iirc
< 1295284417 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :according to my biased benchmark, if you care about size you should use PCC (it has the performance of GCC but a far smaller size)
< 1295284427 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you care about speed, use Clang (the files are not the biggest either)
< 1295284442 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: what?
< 1295284446 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: you just install dietlibc in another prefix.
< 1295284450 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then compile with /opt/bin/diet gcc ...
< 1295284460 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: what optimization options are you using?
< 1295284460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, pcc's performance is lower than gcc.
< 1295284465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and clang's runtime performance is often slower than gcc
< 1295284469 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but it is always faster at compiling)
< 1295284472 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: none!
< 1295284480 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka, well duh.
< 1295284480 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i use -o bench-[whatever] -lm bench.c
< 1295284488 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll try to run it with -O3 then
< 1295284489 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess
< 1295284490 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: oh, you're talking about compilation speed, not the speed of the resulting program?
< 1295284495 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523 no
< 1295284498 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :talking about the speed of the app
< 1295284501 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll try -O3 now, i guess
< 1295284503 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, -Os is often better for speed of the resulting program due to cache effects
< 1295284511 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll use -Os then
< 1295284513 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka, you need each -O then. -Os can be faster. And is certainly smaller
< 1295284520 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka, so do them all, well not -O1 I guess
< 1295284527 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but -Os, -O2, -O3
< 1295284537 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and equiv ones for other compilers
< 1295284553 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comparing unoptimized compiler output for speed is unlikely to be too helpful...
< 1295284568 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL, you used no optimisation options?
< 1295284570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :faaaail
< 1295284578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: for a benchmark like this you want -O2
< 1295284581 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott stop going all fail over me, that's really annoying
< 1295284585 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since it's performance-heavy
< 1295284592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: well, in my defence, you are failing. very hard.
< 1295284594 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not -Os -O2 -O3
< 1295284598 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott i am
< 1295284599 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...
< 1295284601 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you should just tell me
< 1295284606 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am
< 1295284607 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and not go LOL FAIL BWAHAHAHAHA WHAT A NOOB
< 1295284608 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : faaaail
< 1295284618 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as that's how i see your actions every 30 seconds
< 1295284642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: do two torches right after each other mean "end of line" in your exploration-marking system?
< 1295284647 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm trying to get back to spawn from (100,100)
< 1295284651 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I've been following your torches
< 1295284657 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TCC seems to have no optimization options
< 1295284657 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there are two right after each other and then none that I can see
< 1295284658 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*facepalm*
< 1295284665 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: it has -O IIRC
< 1295284682 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the filesize does not change at all
< 1295284685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: oh wait found the next one
< 1295284687 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no. It depends on context
< 1295284692 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is it underground?
< 1295284692 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: i believe it is on by default.
< 1295284695 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no, overground
< 1295284702 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what, then I have no idea :P
< 1295284706 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, probably marking something
< 1295284707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ...
< 1295284708 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :look around
< 1295284715 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: there ain't shit there but more torches
< 1295284721 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, maybe there is some cool scenery around?
< 1295284723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's vaguely pretty i guess
< 1295284731 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GCC: -Os -O2 -O3 gives a 4x improvment
< 1295284737 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, which direction do you move
< 1295284744 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wut
< 1295284749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: THOSE OVERRIDE EACH OTHER
< 1295284754 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is this one of the east or west trails?
< 1295284760 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I don't know!
< 1295284763 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott tell that to Vorpal
< 1295284766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I think I might be going the wrong way
< 1295284769 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: it was a list.
< 1295284771 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : but -Os, -O2, -O3
< 1295284773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you fail at english.
< 1295284774 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka, the last one takes effect
< 1295284775 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did i mention fail?
< 1295284776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fail fail fail
< 1295284779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :faaaaail fail fail
< 1295284784 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka, it was trying each one. Separately
< 1295284785 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know a song that will annoy everyoneeeeeee
< 1295284788 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite obvious
< 1295284791 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see the comma there?
< 1295284791 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's called fail, fail, fail, fail, fail, YOU FAAAIL
< 1295284793 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now try to read
< 1295284797 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh ok
< 1295284798 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote  GCC: -Os -O2 -O3 gives a 4x improvment
< 1295284802 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you need to place more torches, cheapskate
< 1295284808 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, uh, *WHERE*
< 1295284808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ais523: talking about real life obviously)
< 1295284810 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: here
< 1295284816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't follow your trails :D
< 1295284816 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I can't get on atm
< 1295284816 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh, I don't mind
< 1295284819 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just surprised
< 1295284825 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm on EDGE
< 1295284833 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I will not minecraft on that
< 1295284839 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the connection is just too  bad
< 1295284842 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oklopol minecrafts on a 3g stick, i bet it's normally on edge
< 1295284844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :be hardcore!
< 1295284845 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/  / /
< 1295284852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's... slightly addictive
< 1295284855 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now i did them separately
< 1295284861 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, dude, normally you get 3G in scandinavia :P
< 1295284868 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Os gives 1400000 KFlops (compared to 400000 pre-optimization)
< 1295284883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#esoteric-minecraft anyone?
< 1295284883 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway. tell me which direction compared to spawn
< 1295284888 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's probably common enough talk to get its own channel
< 1295284895 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, otherwise I suspect it is someone else who placed that
< 1295284929 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :267)  GCC: -Os -O2 -O3 gives a 4x improvment
< 1295284951 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'll add him as an op.
< 1295284958 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and resign yourself?
< 1295284973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Are you afraid I'll ban you and then you'll die or something?
< 1295284996 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: There, given fizzie enough flags that he can remove my privileges if he wants, but I doubt he will.
< 1295285001 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no I'm not "afraid". I'm just suspecting you will abuse the op at some point
< 1295285006 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like whenever we two disagree
< 1295285008 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: To do _what_?
< 1295285021 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If fizzie has ops he can trivially remove any ban I place.
< 1295285041 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, kickban probably. One way to resolve this would be to make me op as well. I wouldn't abuse it (I'm not you)
< 1295285060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tl;dr  YOU'RE EVIL AND IMMATURE, SO OP ME NOW!!!!!!!!!
< 1295285077 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1295285077 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no :P
< 1295285095 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but I do not trust you to be a balanced person.
< 1295285095 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm now re-benchmarking every compiler (except tcc which lacks optimization options)
< 1295285100 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for -Os, -O3 and -O2 separately
< 1295285114 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, not every compiler has -Os, and clang has more than -O3 iirc
< 1295285118 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, read the docs
< 1295285120 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for details
< 1295285127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey ais523, did you know that I'm unbalanced
< 1295285134 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: why are you pinging me with that, I'm not surprised at all
< 1295285139 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: in what sense?
< 1295285141 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, err
< 1295285144 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I dunno, ask Vorpal
< 1295285144 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, mistap
< 1295285146 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tab*
< 1295285147 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, in the winning an insult match sense
< 1295285149 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka, ^
< 1295285161 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks
< 1295285165 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, not really. I'm just describing him
< 1295285169 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the point is i won't do a separate benchmark for 1 compiler
< 1295285192 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i will later organize the average KFlops results into an array
< 1295285195 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and compare yourself to ais523. Who of you is least likely to shout? Or get visibly angry?
< 1295285201 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: do you realise that for a very long time, the vast majority of immaturity in this channel has come from you saying stupid shit and then justifying it based on me being immature?
< 1295285207 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: *Which of you
< 1295285209 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Oh?
< 1295285212 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought that it was me
< 1295285213 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I disagree.
< 1295285215 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, ah indeed
< 1295285229 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :selecting from a list is always which, regardless of what the list contents are
< 1295285230 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: please tell vorpal to shut up, he doesn't listen to me...
< 1295285240 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastebin.com/G6k41v7i
< 1295285242 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my current progress
< 1295285249 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...
< 1295285270 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I listen to you when you say sensible things.
< 1295285277 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: please tell elliott to try to be more balanced
< 1295285279 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Vorpal: this argument's unlikely to be productive in any case
< 1295285285 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, indeed
< 1295285289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: so, question, "revoke your ops right now because you're an unbalanced individual" is sensible?
< 1295285291 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so there's not much point in continuing it
< 1295285307 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you just like arguments for the sake of arguing, I suppose
< 1295285311 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they can be fun to watch sometimes
< 1295285373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I'm just trying to get the off-topic Minecraft stuff in another channel to free up #esoteric some more, and Vorpal is refusing to use it unless I revoke my op privileges, because I'm "unbalanced" and I will kickban him or something, despite the fact that fizzie is also an op. While undoubtedly he's going to come back with his own version of events in reply to you like it's some sort of challenge to get ais to take your side, I really just
< 1295285373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : want him to admit that he's a fuckface for saying that.
< 1295285382 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I think it is sensible to carefully suggest handing over that channel to fizzie. If that is what you meant.
< 1295285422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: do you not quite grasp how insulting what you said was?
< 1295285431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or do you just not care?
< 1295285450 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, perhaps we put different weights on the word "unbalanced"?
< 1295285451 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :STOP.
< 1295285465 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I ask again to compare yourself to ais.
< 1295285468 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you don't stop immediately i will quit this channel and stop giving elliott any reason to bother/troll/anger you
< 1295285476 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Should help
< 1295285479 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :according to what he was saying
< 1295285482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: that's really just incentive for me to keep going, isn't it...
< 1295285490 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, again: Compare yourself to ais523. Which of you is least likely to shout? Or get visibly angry?
< 1295285491 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not trying to win anything, I just want an apology from Vorpal.
< 1295285504 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: that I never get visibly angry is not really evidence of anything
< 1295285506 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least, not on IRC
< 1295285511 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do get angry from time ot time
< 1295285517 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*time to time
< 1295285522 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but mostly in RL
< 1295285532 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, well, indeed, but the question is if you are in control of the anger or if you react like elliott.
< 1295285534 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes I come on here, furious at events in RL, and state that I'm angry because people couldn't tell otherwise
< 1295285547 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(because when RL makes me angry, it isn't #esoteric's fault)
< 1295285553 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well, probably)
< 1295285558 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, even when you are angry, you do seem a rather calm.
< 1295285563 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is my point
< 1295285565 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes, I'm an unstable wreck of an individual who kickbans people based on random whims and then immediately deops everyone else so that nobody can undo my injustice, and I shouldn't be allowed in polite society.
< 1295285568 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same goes for fizzie
< 1295285575 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott - if you say you're so
< 1295285576 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are
< 1295285578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :having just come above surface from a fucking year of people treating me like I'm insane:
< 1295285580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: FUCK YOU.
< 1295285583 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, now that is a strawman.
< 1295285584 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: looking calm and being calm are different things
< 1295285588 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You are on ignore, and are never coming off.
< 1295285590 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YAY
< 1295285597 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ELLIOTT TURNED ON MADNESS MODE
< 1295285598 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and I never said "wreck"
< 1295285602 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: Also you.
< 1295285605 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YAY
< 1295285607 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: that's unlikely to help...
< 1295285613 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ELLIOTT IS GOING MORE MADNESS MODE
< 1295285614 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you've been missing the point for the past 10 minutes
< 1295285621 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, indeed. And I think this actually proved my point.
< 1295285625 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :his reaction to this.
< 1295285666 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, annoyed at my suggestion: of course. But he overreacted wildly.
< 1295285692 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastebin.com/aPTureza
< 1295285695 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm too tired to do any more
< 1295285707 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal - elliott behaves like me 3 years ago
< 1295285709 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :read: when i was 10 or 11
< 1295285714 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :remember me from back then?
< 1295285716 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was an annoyance
< 1295285757 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka, well, to be honest, you still are annoying to some degree. Though quite a bit less than before.
< 1295285765 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yeah
< 1295285769 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see: 3 minutes ago
< 1295285773 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when i went "lol madness mode"
< 1295285782 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1295285784 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also my frequent pasting of things which are useless
< 1295285790 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like the benchmark status
< 1295285830 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, and... not reading those comma :P
< 1295285836 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what else is there
< 1295285846 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, not reading fully before asking
< 1295285849 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also saying stupid things
< 1295285859 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(because of lack of knowledge mostly, but still)
< 1295285871 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did i miss anything?
< 1295286006 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that's all today iirc
< 1295286014 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay
< 1295286301 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, you really need to do something about your connection
< 1295286441 0 :impomatic!~chatzilla@86.241.112.87.dyn.plus.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295286945 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*chirp* *a* *dirp*
< 1295287049 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :Elliott/Vorpal Fallout, Channel Dies | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | elliott denies claim of wheat-based parentage but denies banning accusers. More at 11.
< 1295287069 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :Elliott/Vorpal Fallout, Channel Dies | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | elliott denies claim of wheat-based parentage but also denies banning accusers. More at 11.
< 1295287069 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D
< 1295287079 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HEY
< 1295287094 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes me remember times
< 1295287097 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when i was editing the topic
< 1295287098 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SOMEONE IS _REALLY_ GRUMPY
< 1295287101 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ehird kept changing it back
< 1295287103 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not grumpy?
< 1295287120 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...why did you censor the topic then
< 1295287152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it's only going to make things more off-topic and stupid?
< 1295287159 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1295287161 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone wants a free google adwords promotional coupon code
< 1295287175 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: no thanks
< 1295287207 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : SOMEONE IS _REALLY_ GRUMPY <-- that is an understatement :)
< 1295287233 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well you also removed the denial of your wheat-based parentage, so i'll assume that means you've finally admitted it
< 1295287237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes.
< 1295287241 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am kin of Weetabix.
< 1295287593 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, this is the year of Duke Nukem Forever's announced release.
< 1295287609 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So weird...
< 1295287631 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hah
< 1295287650 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: yes, and last year we made first contact! oh wait...
< 1295287709 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well anyway it's better than back in '84 when we were under that oppressive dictatorship
< 1295287723 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, as in, "the people making it have stated in no uncertain terms that it is going to be released in the second quarter of the year"
< 1295287776 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the signs of the end times are here
< 1295287918 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: and Perl 6 is basically complete too, it's usable right now
< 1295287944 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and duke nukem forever is written in it!
< 1295287952 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it runs on HURD!
< 1295287958 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right, Hurd
< 1295287959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that's why it's taken so long to release, they had to wait for the language to exist first
< 1295287964 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I knew I was missing one, just couldn't remember what it was
< 1295287991 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's all formally verified with Epigram 2!
< 1295288061 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what would formally verifying a computer game even mean?
< 1295288185 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: making sure it's FUN
< 1295288187 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with MATHEMATICS
< 1295288193 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone who disagrees is obviously irrational
< 1295288196 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's been PROVEN!
< 1295288270 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I didn't remove the "bad things might happen if you make it resizable" when I pushed the "handle resize events" change, since I'm not entirely sure it actually works.
< 1295288294 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1295288321 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295288390 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm playing with DrScheme because i like colorful pictures
< 1295288391 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and
< 1295288407 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stepping through s-exps in runtime
< 1295288409 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and arrows
< 1295288412 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whee
< 1295288816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1295288841 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295288842 0 :j-invariant!~aaaa@unaffiliated/j-invariant JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295288953 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit
< 1295288962 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric
< 1295289039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: how did you find that i did stuff with factor, anyway?
< 1295289051 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back
< 1295289134 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how about "looking at your Github account"?
< 1295289181 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, that would indeed work.
< 1295289186 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Black magicke.
< 1295289210 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My commit had a last-minute typo, hehe... quite embarrassing when slava told me it was wrong just from looking at it.
< 1295289271 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: my gitorious login still has that cyclexa thing on it
< 1295289279 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :together with intercal, and nethack-tas-tools
< 1295289286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: haha
< 1295289296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: btw, as far as i can tell, github's TOS was redone
< 1295289300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and now is perfectly benign
< 1295289302 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as TOSes go
< 1295289308 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I'm reasonably active on both gitorious and patch-tag now
< 1295289316 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :patch-tag? haha
< 1295289321 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but patch-tag is basically dead afaik
< 1295289327 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :darcsden less so
< 1295289348 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who cares if it's basically dead, it hosts repos
< 1295289365 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never really understood the repo-host-as-a-social-network thing
< 1295289369 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo either hates or loves darcsden because it's ran by the person who does atomo
< 1295289376 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: github just uses the social language as marketing
< 1295289382 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's really a "collaborative network"
< 1295289393 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :activity on the site as a whole doesn't matter, even if you were the site's only user it wouldn't matter as long as you can push and other people can pull
< 1295289400 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the many-forks-that-get-merged-into-one model is good for a lot of projects
< 1295289402 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can add other people to push
< 1295289408 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and things like pull requests _are_ important for that
< 1295289412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which plain git lacks
< 1295289420 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes, but why can't people just register on the site to add one?
< 1295289430 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: plenty of people just have github repos as a mirror of git
< 1295289434 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, do these sites let you add a pull request from unrelated sites?
< 1295289438 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if not, they should
< 1295289439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: anyway, yes, it could do with more decentralisation, but that isn't much of a viable business model
< 1295289442 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no, because there's no protocol for it
< 1295289451 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :git://? http://?
< 1295289457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you don't know what a pull request is
< 1295289464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it only includes certain commits
< 1295289475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i believe
< 1295289477 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make a branch, then, containing only those commits?
< 1295289483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I'm not saying this is how it should be, just that github is more useful than plain git for a certain model of development
< 1295289504 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I agree that it might be, but I'm saying that the reasons why it is are easily genericisable
< 1295289515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, but they haven't been :)
< 1295289539 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: darcs solves this by using email
< 1295289543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which works quite well
< 1295289543 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, see /msg
< 1295289559 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: do you have opinions on Google removing H.264 support from