< 1301616118 207652 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@128.198.109.30 JOIN :#esoteric < 1301616187 727623 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well that's the scariest freenode /notice I've ever seen :P < 1301616235 609547 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :eek. well it _is_ on freenode's own blog... < 1301616278 491544 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not to mention one other obvious fact) < 1301616296 430818 :TLUL!~TLUL@wikia/The-last-username-left JOIN :#esoteric < 1301616297 353989 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't even managed to load the damned blog page yet. < 1301616310 870726 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's almost assuredly an April fool's day prank. < 1301616322 92116 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I was talking about the hearts :P < 1301616326 717858 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't want a network to love me that much :P < 1301616332 790753 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well since everyone else got it at the same time... < 1301616371 174862 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it the blog that's slow or my connection? < 1301616381 200406 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it didn't load for me either < 1301616397 942357 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@128.198.109.30 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1301616413 122796 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as i said, everyone on freenode obviously got the notice near simultaneously < 1301616429 205027 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it's currently 0:06 UTC) < 1301616441 492008 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yuh < 1301616531 382832 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION officially declares antialiasing to be evil http://www.darthsanddroids.net/heists/0050.html < 1301616678 7552 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, that is probably one of the most meta comics, ever < 1301616781 973671 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm they've forgotten the favicon this time < 1301616919 162793 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION huggles nyud.net < 1301616939 24340 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh you fiend < 1301617025 402631 :augur!~augur@208-59-167-26.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1301617048 834543 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :why the heck does neither nyud.net nor www.nyud.net work < 1301617089 862798 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Because you don't support the libc.so fund :P < 1301617107 165917 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://blog.freenode.net.nyud.net/2011/04/important-service-announcement-regarding-defocus/ worked for me < 1301617108 72823 :augur!~augur@208-59-167-26.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1301617143 348173 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yes but that's rather useless for someone who wants to visit the nyud.net homepage to find out exactly what their redirection syntax _was_ again < 1301617179 168590 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you bastard nerds and your photographic command syntax memory < 1301617222 239424 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that wasn't precisely fast either... < 1301618712 399858 :TLUL!~TLUL@wikia/The-last-username-left QUIT :Quit: *disappears in a puff of orange smoke* < 1301618753 310750 :augur!~augur@208-59-167-26.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1301618922 673972 :augur!~augur@208-59-167-26.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1301619380 733587 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1301620131 516180 :augur!~augur@208-59-167-26.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1301621565 695764 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :<-- most obnoxious nick ever? < 1301622038 567001 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :libc\x2Eso: nope < 1301622047 34124 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1301622047 409643 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric : "(-------------------------" is < 1301622055 722674 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Invalid nick < 1301622064 343166 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :libc\x2Eso: not this network. I have seen this before < 1301622070 499441 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah :P < 1301622075 550061 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, it could certainly be valid elsewhere. < 1301622101 516258 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :libc\x2Eso: nearly as bad: "TheLongestNamePossibleOnThisServer" < 1301622109 604352 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hyuk < 1301622303 578703 :augur!~augur@208-59-167-26.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection > 1301622845 602664 JOIN :#esoteric < 1301622845 780524 :glogbot!~glogbot@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1301623191 588786 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1301624896 102534 :augur!~augur@208-59-167-26.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1301625271 60132 :augur!~augur@208-59-167-26.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1301627681 656113 :pumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1301628012 733149 :augur!~augur@208-59-167-26.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1301628555 975025 :Zuu!~vdsvsd@77.215.149.86 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1301629000 261724 :Zuu!~vdsvsd@77.215.149.86 JOIN :#esoteric < 1301629455 811155 :radicalpumpkin!~pumpkin@209-6-232-56.c3-0.sbo-ubr1.sbo.ma.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1301630095 3412 :wareya!~wareya@cpe-74-70-142-220.nycap.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1301630705 435673 :sftp!~sftp@79.174.49.11 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1301632873 902068 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1301633926 831786 :radicalpumpkin!~pumpkin@209-6-232-56.c3-0.sbo-ubr1.sbo.ma.cable.rcn.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1301633943 633861 :radicalpumpkin!~pumpkin@209-6-232-56.c3-0.sbo-ubr1.sbo.ma.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1301633951 162148 :radicalpumpkin!~pumpkin@209-6-232-56.c3-0.sbo-ubr1.sbo.ma.cable.rcn.com NICK :copumpkin < 1301633965 818912 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@209-6-232-56.c3-0.sbo-ubr1.sbo.ma.cable.rcn.com QUIT :Changing host < 1301633965 983614 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1301635255 811797 :asiekierka!~asiekierk@093105167222.elblag.vectranet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1301635637 690944 :cal153!~cal@70.36.237.178 QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1301636603 44952 :Zuu!~vdsvsd@77.215.149.86 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1301637028 673224 :Zuu!~vdsvsd@77.215.149.86 JOIN :#esoteric < 1301637070 531238 :cal153!~cal@c-24-4-207-72.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1301637528 849574 :asiekierka!~asiekierk@093105167222.elblag.vectranet.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1301638265 813569 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1301640213 473294 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://mail.google.com/mail/help/motion.html < 1301640347 133159 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, it's that day again. < 1301640365 607011 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :glorious friday! < 1301640424 540904 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i see reddit's r/circlejerk took some inspiration from r/trees < 1301640743 667316 :augur!~augur@208-59-167-26.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1301641664 878252 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :  < 1301642102 812021 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a name for the type of symmetry "the distance from a fixed center point to the boundary of the shape is the same in both direction x and -x for all choices of vector x"? < 1301642211 12177 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :radial < 1301642591 56210 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, radial is stronger < 1301642614 11415 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's 180 degree rotational symmetry, don't recall if it has a shorter name < 1301642620 167316 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*degrees < 1301642670 608992 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is radial stronger? < 1301642705 425452 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :radial is rotation by any angle, or at least a smaller one... < 1301642730 489643 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Symmetry_%28physical_attractiveness%29 < 1301642742 743936 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :right and the angle depends on the type of symmetry < 1301642747 653880 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the number of rays < 1301642750 695555 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :in this case, 2 rays < 1301642800 654277 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :2-fold rotational symmetry, says http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotational_symmetry < 1301642875 91693 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think radial symmetry just isn't a mathematical term < 1301642899 382074 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radial_symmetry lists 5-fold rotational symmetry as a type of radial symmetry. < 1301642907 970095 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah it seemed to be more biological < 1301642959 44653 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did sort of assume that "radial symmetry" would mean "depends only on distance", purely based on the name, but I guess it's not a real thing. < 1301643058 420202 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's certainly a real thing < 1301643071 647247 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's circular or spherical < 1301643552 972576 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1301643690 817728 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://stackoverflow.com/questions/5508110/why-is-this-program-erroneously-rejected-by-three-c-compilers < 1301643829 146280 :cal153!~cal@c-24-4-207-72.hsd1.ca.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1301644341 716390 :augur!~augur@208.58.6.161 JOIN :#esoteric < 1301644393 846151 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1301644478 192615 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :wild guess: because it's wrong? < 1301644550 50395 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a very plausible guess. but incorrect. < 1301644805 978983 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, the poster just failed to encode it in the format expected by the compilers < 1301644848 898039 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :...i think elliott must be right about those swedes. < 1301645000 676695 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :I liked the second answer, though it was slightly botched by trying to talk about "text files" < 1301646189 672785 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ISO/IEC 14882:1998(E), 2.1p1 subclause 1: "Physical source file characters are mapped, in an implementation-defined manner, to the basic source character set --"; if he's read the standard twice in its entirety already, I would expect him to have noticed this part and realize you can't really expect to be able to write a program based on the standard alone, without considering the implementation. < 1301646454 110857 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :boring, haven't seen any likely april fool hoaxes yet < 1301646810 535791 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Our staff@ mailing list got this: "Please find the Springer marketing campaign below. It seems you can get a 30% Springer author discount from registration fees at selected conferences with LNCS proceedings, but more importantly, you may get a conference review waiver coupon, which enables you to bypass the peer review process in some selected conferences and get an article published directly. This is a nice offer especially for students. See details below." < 1301647078 400291 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1301647082 153225 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :no peer review < 1301647083 339247 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1301647084 985571 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :no peer review < 1301647086 336465 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1301647097 569618 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :no peer review < 1301647098 493129 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1301647112 192411 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :no peer review < 1301647112 911194 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1301647455 477544 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.70 QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1301647531 361734 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Context: april fool hoaxes. < 1301647662 667389 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know < 1301648154 999032 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn58-429.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :' oh, "dleep" was a typo for "sleep"' not a typo < 1301648180 308987 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn58-429.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :although i'm not sure that's relevant < 1301648462 767273 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn58-429.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"This is a nice offer especially for students." :D < 1301648486 537986 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn58-429.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :thank god i didn't go to work today, i had no idea it's april already < 1301649211 414057 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :the math society at UW just adopted a new set of bylaws yesterday. I sent an email out to the mailing list at about 1:30 saying that the version I'd published earlier was wrong and due to some procedural technicalities, we had to adopt this alternate version. it's a work of comedy < 1301650454 785819 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:3714::1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :DNSSEC going nowhere again: .com is now DNSSEC-signed. :-) < 1301650547 582188 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs186230.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anybody got the freenode prize yet? < 1301650619 247439 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1301650912 156542 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn58-429.yok.fi QUIT : < 1301651022 139969 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1301651044 376208 :Zwaarddijk!miekko@infa.abo.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1301651111 661273 :Zwaarddijk!miekko@infa.abo.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1301653899 213078 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: Do you happen to know how much breaks if you turn DNSSEC validation on? (I mean in the usual way where "insecure" zones are allowed, but if a zone has a DS in the parent then it will need to be properly working all the way down.) < 1301654072 370969 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:3714::1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I don't hit that a wide variety of sites, but it seems that very little breaks. < 1301654123 822014 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mhm. Well, I guess that might be either because everyone's doing DNSSEC right, or because no-one's doing DNSSEC at all. < 1301654196 508638 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:3714::1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, not many are doing DNSSEC, but virtually all that are are doing it right. < 1301654658 862190 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:3714::1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :65 TLDs have TAs in the root zone (zone serial appears to be 2011040100). < 1301655711 514892 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :.fi root has been DNSSEC-signed since late 2010, but if I understood correctly it should now be possible to do DS "delegations" to actual zones too. (At least this newspost says after "31.3.") < 1301656502 228791 :cheater00!~cheater@e181136177.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1301656554 314059 :cheater-!~cheater@g228060000.adsl.alicedsl.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1301657321 40214 :wareya!~wareya@cpe-74-70-142-220.nycap.res.rr.com QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1301657539 103554 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1301657674 797437 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1301657680 927153 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The MOTD: so gay. < 1301657978 348680 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I'm not entirely convinced it's even possible to do an April Fool's joke on Esolang < 1301657983 283017 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it wouldn't look any different from the rest of the site < 1301658020 421168 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :07:54:38: wild guess: because it's wrong? < 1301658020 585791 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :07:55:50: a very plausible guess. but incorrect. < 1301658020 750534 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :08:00:05: right, the poster just failed to encode it in the format expected by the compilers < 1301658020 750704 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :08:00:48: ...i think elliott must be right about those swedes. < 1301658025 116767 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i concur in this case! < 1301658040 908671 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is elliott's idea about swedes? < 1301658050 765063 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that they're all weird and crazy and should be avoided < 1301658055 783556 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in a bad way) < 1301658064 924195 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: turn esolang into a site about tongues in which magick spelles are cast'e < 1301658069 421166 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :esoteric languages! < 1301658079 700738 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's all i can think of :) < 1301658089 997723 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i take it you are also r/trees inspired? < 1301658090 163439 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(diff) (hist) . . N Talk:Velato/‎; 05:01 . . (+169) . . 195.211.160.6 (Talk) (Unusually not mephitic forum!!!! Epilogue to bookmarks. To a countless extent wares resource. Greatly much admins) < 1301658102 937730 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i'm logreading :D < 1301658133 319517 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott TOPIC #esoteric :ESOTERIC LANGUAGES | An unusually not mephitic forum. | Enjoy being locked in your matrix of solidity. | Logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D, http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/ < 1301658139 104445 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well i was referring to your AF suggestion for here < 1301658148 798049 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :or the wiki, i guess < 1301658152 999675 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yes, that's where i saw you mentioning the /r/circlejerk//r/trees thing < 1301658160 107372 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(yes, that's a slash separating two /r/ paths, problem?) < 1301658190 556468 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO PROBLEM < 1301658232 523441 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/QlGpd.gif <-- this wins forever < 1301658239 79141 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(on the stackoverflow question) < 1301658241 717917 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*from < 1301658326 103855 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you might like ^ < 1301658341 56306 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :as an expert in abusing ms paint for computational purposes >:D < 1301658390 351848 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is that making? a piet program or something? < 1301658395 951909 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: keep watching < 1301658403 428706 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: (or refresh if it gets cut off) < 1301658416 204498 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's so damn slow on my computer < 1301658420 790951 :cheater-!~cheater@e181130235.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1301658426 3106 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: download it then watch < 1301658435 311988 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(file -> save as :P) < 1301658495 356235 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I take it that wasn't you doing that, given that you'd be unlikely to be using Windows Vista or 7 < 1301658501 436356 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(although that's not completely implausible0 < 1301658501 601615 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :happy mailman mailing list reminder's day yesterday! < 1301658505 340692 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/0/)/ < 1301658511 304902 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: indeed, it's from the stack overflow question that you may or may not have seen < 1301658526 168221 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://stackoverflow.com/questions/5508110/why-is-this-program-erroneously-rejected-by-three-c-compilers < 1301658529 195736 :cheater00!~cheater@e181136177.adsl.alicedsl.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1301658563 965473 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to think of a sufficiently funny question to join #r.trees and say < 1301658565 85965 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: did it have a BOM? < 1301658568 532484 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm guessing from the URL < 1301658579 375443 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, it's an image of a program < 1301658588 514898 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a hand-crafted drawing! < 1301658608 133782 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the typography isn't as good as in the standard document, but C++ compilers can hardly expect such anal calligraphy! < 1301658617 134571 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(This marks the first time the phrase "anal calligraphy" has ever been uttered.) < 1301658684 487787 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: so did esr insist on making the new C-INTERCAL release himself? :P < 1301658750 278239 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1301658756 832786 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll do it myself, a little later < 1301658766 556273 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Last time I chose to program in Python, because I love the language. But I used some Windows-specific libraries and some people were frustrated they could not see the program run on their machine. So this time I'm going to use Java. It's arguably less expressive than Python, but I know that the GUI and window interface is quite portable" < 1301658774 741193 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sadly, not april fools < 1301658790 225684 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(admittedly java.awt.Robot probably doesn't have a portable Python analogue) < 1301658940 834577 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : (This marks the first time the phrase "anal calligraphy" has ever been uttered.) <-- about 103 hits, says google < 1301658958 854577 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, googling "anal calligraphy" since 2011 < 1301658965 765752 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OR EVEN EARLIER ??? < 1301658981 329313 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Buy a handmade custom "Anal" calligraphy wall scroll here!" < 1301658999 371256 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't _think_ i've done it before. < 1301659020 782223 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :that phrase has at least two possible meanings, i note < 1301659037 123765 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :O RALLY < 1301659060 640855 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't have a reddit spore, i feel so inferior < 1301659067 138143 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :er. < 1301659068 102715 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :mold. < 1301659088 747052 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't get to type annoyingly :( < 1301659093 114994 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :poor elliott, all jealous of I_RAPE_CATS < 1301659124 390112 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION waits for someone who has never been on reddit to read this log < 1301659158 323043 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :this surely was not the best time for him to have to defend his actions... < 1301659179 149438 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you seen his userpage? < 1301659182 204258 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/user/I_RAPE_CATS < 1301659186 92926 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :~9873493. A£|F"$F < 1301659227 340981 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :not in a few hours < 1301659241 563703 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i see he got online < 1301659263 99461 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh, meaningless cloaks < 1301659272 481904 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"THERE IS A PRIZE. IT’S WORTH IT. HINT: MOTD." < 1301659279 391774 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :where do we send answers? < 1301659282 731961 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1301659287 473157 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1301659295 959202 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"VmlldyBwYWdlIHNvdXJjZSwgeW91bmcgZ3Jhc3Nob3BwZXIu" < 1301659298 771 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh < 1301659299 298816 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :base36? < 1301659300 121957 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the april fool that there actually _is_ a prize? < 1301659316 88132 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs186230.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: base64 < 1301659322 195384 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm right < 1301659334 244238 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs186230.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I couldn't tell what the next stage was about though, so I left it at that < 1301659363 5747 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :view page source < 1301659384 470431 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :why am i helping you fuckers, i want @unicorn/ or whatever < 1301659408 75617 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the blog post won't load now :) < 1301659417 15656 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs186230.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can paste it for you < 1301659423 982596 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :how does I_RAPE_CATS manage to get _less_ mold? he had 53 before and someone claimed to have seen 54 < 1301659434 221519 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Sure (assuming it's the new one), thanks < 1301659444 45254 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: they wear off? < 1301659450 994834 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: or maybe you can spend KARMA to get rid of them :-D < 1301659454 770485 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1301659455 866919 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs186230.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://sprunge.us/HMGb < 1301659462 988322 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs186230.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The relevant bit) < 1301659473 95167 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was assuming they last for today... < 1301659478 535743 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looks like a trivial cipher < 1301659483 778578 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Un = An, probably < 1301659491 876579 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OTOH this is close to my laziness limit < 1301659497 33185 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs186230.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :It crossed mine < 1301659508 796954 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it started past mine < 1301659509 884988 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll ask what the prize cloak is in #freenode :-D < 1301659680 214677 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : they are throttling blog on purpose < 1301659680 416532 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : to get attention < 1301659689 911511 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wish this guy would shut up so my important question would get answered < 1301659869 963270 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : and all of us say something < 1301659870 128147 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : for aprill fools joke < 1301659870 128300 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : but we act serious < 1301659870 128405 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : but something bad hmm < 1301659870 128509 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : yeh good to see this is a great help channel < 1301659870 571952 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : i will say something and you ay yes i have heard < 1301659872 550902 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : and act serious < 1301659874 580974 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : haha :D < 1301659876 634835 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : what im doing here with kids omg < 1301660288 983405 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1301660484 118420 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Fanny scratching in 18th-century London's Cock Lane was so notorious that interested bystanders often blocked the street. It became the focus of a religious controversy between Methodists and orthodox Anglicans, and was reported on by celebrities of the period such as Samuel Johnson." < 1301660487 866574 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(--wp fa) < 1301660495 619453 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1301660562 426714 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hate notpr0n... < 1301660609 890988 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:52:00: I'm continuing to bother #esoteric because ZERO people from this channel have helped me out here :P < 1301660625 469710 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, it's plausible APT Guy actually would have paid for an address. < 1301660693 179302 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :WOULD have? < 1301660705 782160 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought the auction was over. < 1301660736 401017 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :FSVO over < 1301660751 568632 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:56:27 Well that's the scariest freenode /notice I've ever seen :P < 1301660753 66157 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :What was it? < 1301660758 446593 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :See raw log. < 1301660780 396896 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So the BritClique so thoroughly dominates WP now that all the April Fool's humor on the front page are nothing but references to UK culture? I'm guessing the argument is "Well this is the english language wikipedia, I'm sure the german language WP has German references, etc. etc..." Sorry to inform you, but other people speak english too. As if it wasn't obvious. Jersey John (talk) 06:31, 1 April 2011 (UTC) < 1301660784 94309 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ITS A PONSCIRAPICY < 1301660805 521787 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"On another note, I'm quickly growing tired of the undue snarkiness and senseless arrogance of the Brit Clique, as I call them, here on Wiki... It's no wonder a bunch morons a few years back went and made Conservapedia. Not that I like that place either. Plus I'm banned from it... lol..." --[[User:Jros83]] < 1301660830 786123 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I can't find that notice in the raw log for today or yesterday... < 1301660838 238687 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Try hardesr. < 1301660839 920622 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*harder. < 1301660864 696081 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nope. < 1301660869 858585 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: what kind of horrific person gave wil wheaton 19 molds. WAS IT YOU? < 1301660881 830782 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's better than the toilet paper thing < 1301660890 439879 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i don't have a reddit account < 1301660901 680771 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ? < 1301660907 777419 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well that's what you _would_ say isn't it. < 1301660920 672056 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: remember when the page about toilet paper orientation was discussed in #esoteric < 1301660926 306113 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I said it might make a good april fool's FA < 1301660931 823670 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yes < 1301660951 121660 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: wait, i've figured out a good esolang AF < 1301660953 342957 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(diff) (hist) . . N Talk:Velato/‎; 05:01 . . (+169) . . 195.211.160.6 (Talk) (Unusually not mephitic forum!!!! Epilogue to bookmarks. To a countless extent wares resource. Greatly much admins) < 1301660954 824250 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :leave this here! < 1301660958 735448 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :spam never gets left! < 1301660965 370850 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not a good AF at all < 1301660972 150506 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT'S HILARIOUS < 1301661009 503930 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, did I_RAPE_CATS actually manipulate that stupid video thing? < 1301661021 595989 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION moves [[Fugue Compiler]]. As an April FOol's or something < 1301661043 2815 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: well at a minimum it appears he didn't choose it randomly as he was supposed to < 1301661043 840867 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU < 1301661049 996390 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :libc\x2Eso: YOU LOST HA H < 1301661050 377181 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :A < 1301661054 624633 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :SHOULDA BID HIGHER < 1301661058 717763 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not over, but it's lookin' that way. < 1301661071 187057 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aww. < 1301661076 951740 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :libc\x2Eso: Put more money into it < 1301661085 49980 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I will, 24 hours before the end. < 1301661098 423607 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :libc\x2Eso: BUT THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE _EXPECTING_ YOU TO DO < 1301661102 127862 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :How long does this damn auction *last*? < 1301661113 59287 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's only been on for a couple of days :P < 1301661134 113272 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's it at now? < 1301661144 185874 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, I insist on parsing your nick as libc \x2 Eso < 1301661174 338603 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :$575 :( < 1301661186 266860 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's ridiculous < 1301661189 950834 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=helvetica < 1301661210 439027 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOT FUNNY GOOGLE < 1301661212 842733 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOT FUNNY IN THE SLIGHTEST < 1301661325 543429 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's going on if you google "Helvetica"? < 1301661354 990096 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It goes to Comic Sans. < 1301661355 750124 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: open in your unrestricted browser < 1301661361 674111 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: YOU: SUCK < 1301661387 384065 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, I nearly made an accidental April fool today. < 1301661399 834800 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT YOU SPOILED IT < 1301661405 908136 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1301661451 477729 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION installs autojump < 1301661457 71603 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric : that's ridiculous // OK, seriously, are you the poorest man alive? X-D < 1301661474 532820 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah comic sans gives the same < 1301661483 745525 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :libc\x2Eso: 500 is a very big number < 1301661485 693190 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not arial < 1301661486 401420 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's hard to even visualise < 1301661499 429288 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :500 is trivial to visualise :P < 1301661514 996204 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :£500 would be overpriced for a new computer nowadays < 1301661520 53091 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although with dollars it's more reasonable < 1301661523 412620 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And libc\x2Eso is a privileged douchebag for thinking balking at spending half a thousand dollars on a domain name makes you the poorest man alive :P < 1301661551 715262 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's 2/3rds of a plane ticket, somewhat less than one month's rent, considerably less than the sum of one month's bills. < 1301661563 708838 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :...for you. < 1301661581 988103 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I consider plane travel so expensive that people who require it are insnae < 1301661583 494020 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*insane < 1301661590 812030 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and people who reimburse plane travel costs more so < 1301661674 582503 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1301661690 596045 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1301661712 440213 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh god Gregor's being an idiot about money again isn't he. < 1301661739 693170 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, come to think of it, what *did* you do with that money you got from the bit of Wolfram's ego you heroically chipped off. < 1301661752 272428 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: bought a laptop, and put the rest in the bank < 1301661752 833561 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to find a source download of the bitcoin client < 1301661760 370067 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: http://p.zem.fi/d98k < 1301661778 711927 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and lived off it for a few years < 1301661797 279393 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, a laptop would barely *dent* the prize money you got. < 1301661823 123062 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: What. < 1301661827 44376 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :400 out of 12000 is about 1/30 < 1301661829 970666 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's more than just a dent < 1301661900 340537 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. No it isn't. < 1301661914 923436 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :"My lovely horse, you're a pony no more" // Pony: Not a name for horse babies :P < 1301661959 41491 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :libc\x2Eso, you've presumably never seen Father Ted, being an American and all. < 1301661973 14303 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :libc\x2Eso: i cry foal! < 1301661996 901643 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: 30 dents don't normally completely destroy something < 1301662030 169951 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :libc\x2Eso, also, what is your *job*? < 1301662049 767476 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I'm a grad student. In the summers I usually intern here and there. < 1301662050 56147 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're a grad student, I thought they had, like, negative money. < 1301662074 605019 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm a grad student with fiscal responsibility, I have plenty of money. And yes, occasionally buying something nice for myself still factors into fiscal responsibility. < 1301662105 991595 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since I don't own a Wii, a PS3 and an Xbox 360 (or any of them for that matter), the price some grad students pay to own all three easily covers libc.so right there :P < 1301662110 519043 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. Fiscal responsibility makes you rich. Nothing else. < 1301662122 350878 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION recalls that Tom Scott is a student of some description and quite a bit younger than Gregor, and he had £500 to blow on something even stupider. < 1301662147 549511 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1301662156 707344 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm not rich, but fiscal responsibility keeps you well in the black when feasible. < 1301662165 559729 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't say you were rich. < 1301662178 11547 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But purely being fiscally responsible is not nearly enough to be able to throw $500 for a novelty domain. < 1301662195 255777 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. Yes it is. < 1301662204 478488 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it is not. < 1301662205 642348 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1301662231 918372 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, in fairness, you are not really the one who I would trust to have the clearest grip on finance. < 1301662250 703544 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fine, then I just fall into money. It rains from the sky because the Money Gods love me. < 1301662301 89179 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/Money Gods/parents/ and you have a plausible hypothesis... < 1301662304 609607 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :HA < 1301662306 991682 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's all I'll say on the matter. < 1301662308 714399 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :My parents have no freaking money. < 1301662311 316547 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I loan money to my parents. < 1301662358 825805 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :And if it was there money, I sure as hell wouldn't be using it for libc.so :P < 1301662362 476369 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :... *their < 1301662367 734024 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.tomscott.com/stabbed/ < 1301662374 929238 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got 4/5. < 1301662439 571067 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :This game is impossible. < 1301662478 211619 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm assuming you've been stabbed 5 times. < 1301662481 844764 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: And regarding the previous, also http://p.zem.fi/xcxp < 1301662516 90567 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, I've gone at least two years without hearing yet another tedious Weebl & Bob reference. < 1301662522 753636 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thank you, fizzie, you broke my streka. < 1301662525 159412 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also my streak. < 1301662929 341979 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : libc\x2Eso: i cry foal! <-- sadly I was away when you said this, however had I been there, a pun about the current day would have been in order (hamming distance of 1 after all...) < 1301662977 131588 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :libc\x2Eso, so did you get the domain? Or is it still up for auction? < 1301663006 411131 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :... wtf < 1301663025 389186 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: How do you manage to consistently be weeks out of date :P < 1301663067 474345 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's been up for auction for weeks, the auction started on Sunday. Now it's at $575 and a chat room full of people who've never actually had a job or lived away from home are telling me it's not worth it. < 1301663156 854982 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :libc\x2Eso: because it isn't worth it < 1301663199 730353 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never said it wasn't worth it, what i said was something else entirely < 1301663202 173964 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :libc\x2Eso, yes, ais has never lived away from home or had a job. < 1301663212 303280 :libc\x2Eso!~Gregor@codu.org NICK :Gregor < 1301663228 218665 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I have a job at the moment < 1301663231 922556 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, ah < 1301663266 541520 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, yes, that was sarcasm to show how stupid Gregor's statement was. < 1301663333 894958 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=%28-1%29^%281%2F3%29 < 1301663337 57637 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL MATHEMATICA < 1301663397 529187 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to figure out where bitcoin fits in the gnome hierarchy < 1301663406 927102 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess wherever other financial programs go, but I don't know where that is < 1301663449 169490 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are financial programs? < 1301663512 440569 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :gnucash? < 1301663629 831320 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to generate coins < 1301664031 467973 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1301665407 173060 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: do you want a nice mold? < 1301665422 363676 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, what awesomeness can I do with libdl.so? :( < 1301665425 841068 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ? < 1301665430 780526 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: reddit < 1301665575 210110 :sftp!~sftp@79.174.49.11 JOIN :#esoteric < 1301666458 145281 :elliott_!~elliott@91.104.240.103 JOIN :#esoteric < 1301666458 983183 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1301666577 118099 :augur!~augur@208.58.6.161 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1301666608 659343 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, so you lost the auction, or you're going to lose it? < 1301666651 345068 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :The auction hasn't ended and I'm not up to my max, but I project an extremely low chance of winning. < 1301666664 448604 :asiekierka!~asiekierk@093105167222.elblag.vectranet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1301667263 729308 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1301667403 934876 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-15-162.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1301667489 789485 :pumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1301667587 467806 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1301667980 575037 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :esr is definitely male, right? < 1301667991 490070 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, my Facebook account seems to be haemorrhaging its backlog of unaccepted friend requests. < 1301667997 975383 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems I'm /that/ crazy about pronouns < 1301668023 419069 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/crazy/obnoxious/ < 1301668095 643339 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/obnoxious/pastiche/ < 1301668116 9092 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not an adjective, is it? < 1301668135 168701 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Yeesh, Phantom_Hoover is SO pastiche. < 1301668144 782080 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably because he's locked in his matrix of solidity. < 1301668160 267393 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wiktionary agrees. < 1301668237 366595 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sigh* < 1301668238 994688 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :So pastiche. < 1301668260 987120 :pumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1301668565 545195 :pumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1301668666 485664 :augur!~augur@pool-74-96-16-252.washdc.east.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1301669571 129154 :elliott_!~elliott@91.104.240.103 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no, esr is female < 1301669592 331467 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: too late, I already referred to her with a male pronoun! < 1301669620 290255 :elliott_!~elliott@91.104.240.103 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net/wiki/Main_Page < 1301669621 904480 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eric, short for Erica. < 1301669627 736825 :elliott_!~elliott@91.104.240.103 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, nobody can look at the recent changes any more < 1301669633 276908 :elliott_!~elliott@91.104.240.103 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, comments on a postcard^W/msg only < 1301669933 724911 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1301670227 426223 :elliott_!~elliott@91.104.240.103 NICK :elliott < 1301670231 30125 :elliott!~elliott@91.104.240.103 QUIT :Changing host < 1301670231 195657 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1301670241 209350 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1301670937 457525 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a way to sandbox Chrome tabs? < 1301671289 924580 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm I wonder if the urban dictionary redesign to look similar to wikipedia is special for today... < 1301671304 501841 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea if it been this for long < 1301671453 886958 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :the xkcd 3D trick with javascript looks quite cool < 1301671471 39790 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:3714::1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looks like APNIC is nicely down today. Waiting for the graph to update... :-) < 1301671572 615355 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:3714::1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway: 128k+64k to Japan, 4M(!!!) to China, 8k+4k to South Korea. < 1301671618 989224 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compare last two answers. < 1301671697 128593 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:3714::1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Preliminary calculation gives down 0.27. < 1301671842 152095 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:3714::1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh. 25% of the address space gone in a single day. < 1301671941 666201 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@unaffiliated/poiuy-qwert/x-0506151 JOIN :#esoteric < 1301671952 773317 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I just converted a video to a sequence of PNG files representing individual frames, tar/gzipped it (deduplicating repeated frames), uuencoded, and posted it on sprunge < 1301671955 734759 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there something wrong with me? < 1301671992 859608 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:3714::1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The preliminary figures would mean down 0.83(!) in a single week. < 1301672001 570740 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch < 1301672005 257384 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's /hope/ it's April Fool's < 1301672039 882345 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:3714::1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, this extended delegated file is dated 2nd April... < 1301672047 350564 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1301672051 775775 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose it is April 2 somewhere < 1301672197 822938 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1301672340 147180 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5984 is quite awesome (rfc from today) < 1301672764 281756 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:3714::1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lol, APNIC page has pie graph updated (0.78 left indeed) but bar graph hasn't. < 1301673130 360780 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:3714::1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now the bar graph also updated. Indeed, down 0.27. < 1301673299 821180 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:3714::1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Logaritmic space available: /8.353 < 1301673357 715610 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:3714::1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.apnic.net/community/ipv4-exhaustion/graphical-information ... That shows 1.78, but that doesn't take the final 1.00 into account. < 1301673395 13527 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari, so what is the prediction date now? < 1301673398 529356 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :a few days? weeks? < 1301673480 632001 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1301673529 413679 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:3714::1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I predict Tuesday 12th April. < 1301673592 654877 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1301673705 178519 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:3714::1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, this model would estimate about 768 addresses left on Monday 11th. Of course, this process is discrete to the max. < 1301673950 267306 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[There's also a couple of other reasons a perfect AI doesn't exist, not least the NP-completeness of the problem.]] < 1301673950 432876 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :— TV Tropes < 1301673950 433055 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not well-versed in complexity theory, but that sounds stupidly wrong. < 1301673978 26343 :augur!~augur@pool-74-96-16-252.washdc.east.verizon.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1301673994 265196 :pumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :can we verify that "perfect AI" is correct in polynomial time? < 1301674027 399564 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, the context is Minesweeper. < 1301674051 902970 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :NP-completeness might imply that a perfect AI would take impractically long to run < 1301674065 466137 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That has no bearing on perfectness. < 1301674082 334043 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I imply that "exist" here doesn't refer to theoretical existence, but actual existence. < 1301674096 106487 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :really? the whole point of the NP-completeness proof in Minesweeper is that it's NP-complete for finding if a solution exists < 1301674110 982065 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which implies that you can't find a solution, in general, in polynomial time, as that would imply that a solution did exist < 1301674137 472288 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, but you still /can/, it'll just take forever, making it not worth the effort. < 1301674160 717075 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: oh, I read the line as meaning that nobody had written a perfect AI < 1301674292 259837 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, noöne *has*, but that's nothing to do with NP-completeness, and more to do with Minesweeper being random. < 1301674311 170944 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I disagree with the nothing there < 1301674328 496992 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's unlikely that a NetHack program will become a restricted-tape Turing machine by chance < 1301674334 256090 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm, Minesweeper game < 1301674340 982752 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's possible, and if it fails on that, it isn't perfect < 1301674358 216533 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :...perfect means polynomial now? < 1301674392 561720 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: no, but exponential means unlikely to run in a reasonable time < 1301674395 518672 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so there'd be no way to test it < 1301674407 796564 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still allows the existence of a perfect AI. < 1301674445 16476 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: even if it allows the /existence/, if it makes it impractical, it explains why it hasn't been written < 1301674468 54087 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, the article said it was *impossible* because of that. < 1301674511 128127 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: it says "doesn't exist", that's different from "cannot exist" < 1301674529 657662 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, right enough. < 1301674530 943264 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :X is impractical explaining that X doesn't exist is an entirely valid argument < 1301675361 976086 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1301675395 460625 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-25-93.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1301675395 893886 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-25-93.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Changing host < 1301675396 59047 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1301675549 537521 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 JOIN :#esoteric < 1301676630 706621 :cheater00!~cheater@g229031073.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1301676714 709138 :cheater-!~cheater@e181130235.adsl.alicedsl.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1301677211 471687 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@unaffiliated/poiuy-qwert/x-0506151 QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1301677378 275261 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1301677509 603620 :pumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1301677575 608669 :pumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1301677652 417238 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1301677856 897553 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.johnmwillis.com/other/top-10-worst-captchas/ < 1301677860 989885 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Observe comment 12. < 1301678375 602968 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@17.101.89.204 JOIN :#esoteric < 1301678376 8195 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@17.101.89.204 QUIT :Changing host < 1301678376 174051 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1301678452 615452 :pumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1301678587 691053 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why is the calculus question using partial derivatives? Does that make any difference in the answer/ < 1301678668 576886 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Um... did I just reveal that I understand math a little better than some commentor? < 1301678703 640081 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I guess what e's saying makes sense if you haven't seen the notation before < 1301678711 877258 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: with one variable, it doesn't matter whether you use partial or normal derivatives < 1301678722 622879 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in some fields, like engineering, they typically use partials for whatever reason in that case < 1301678746 355233 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's 'coz engineers r dum. < 1301678761 771051 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, has anyone here tried to run GNU Hurd yet? < 1301678769 241326 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure if I believe the release announcement < 1301678866 598125 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, with 2 variables, does .. it just become incorrect to use normal derivative notation? < 1301678878 835754 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC it means something else < 1301678881 780836 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I can't remember the details < 1301678946 839843 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, WP has the answers as usual, although I've forgotten them since I looked them up. < 1301678955 756994 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :PDEs are boring anyway. < 1301678981 99069 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, the multivariable calculus I'm doing with the OCW thing will be more than Partial Derivatives, right? < 1301678991 176371 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No idea. < 1301678991 897000 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i certainly never took higher level diffeq and i'm fine! < 1301679008 794277 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've never bothered to look into multivariable calculus. < 1301679716 425549 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1301679802 505210 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is March 32 today, isn't it? < 1301679807 776120 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1301679822 868293 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or sep 6422, if you prefer to count that way < 1301679976 119310 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :They say it is April 1 today, but actually it is March 32. April 1 has been cancelled. < 1301680224 207706 :cheater99!~cheater@e181129094.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1301680226 392881 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :fortunately, we have the thinkgeek3d sweepstakes (completely real!) to make up for it < 1301680260 46270 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :MOTD now has ASCII art. It also has the message "VmlldyBwYWdlIHNvdXJjZSwgeW91bmcgZ3Jhc3Nob3BwZXIu" < 1301680270 810065 :cheater00!~cheater@g229031073.adsl.alicedsl.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1301680280 407909 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :decode it < 1301680282 282112 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :get the prize < 1301680283 249657 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :gogogo < 1301680337 909312 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did decode it < 1301680392 769763 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh okay < 1301680395 363249 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was the prize < 1301680455 159940 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what to do with it, once it is decoded < 1301680514 878524 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: join #defocus and say !join, and there's a CAPTCHAbot that gives some sort of quiz < 1301680557 711692 :asiekierka!~asiekierk@093105167222.elblag.vectranet.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1301680558 78953 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I thought it was just a mafia game < 1301680576 959774 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, perhaps < 1301680707 352748 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1301680840 977569 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : JIIbH01UGxIvZ1cAGGOjp1xjLmExI0y6H1uJJx0lBGWnFTf1IyMjI2SVIzuJZQIiJGVkHzEJo3yvERR9 < 1301681338 454542 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :The MOTD message is referring to the blog page's source code. < 1301681360 248198 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :The one at http://blog.freenode.net/2011/04/important-service-announcement-regarding-defocus/ < 1301681387 110155 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I pasted the decoded versions of two of the three things that are in that page's source. < 1301681453 694940 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://p.zem.fi/xcxp and http://p.zem.fi/d98k -- feel free to go on and solve the Cat Enigma. < 1301681486 434459 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would sort-of guess that they'd have gotten the ten solutions already. (Though come to think of it I haven't seen any more global notices.) < 1301681586 667037 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1301681661 70720 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1301681661 813326 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com QUIT :Changing host < 1301681661 978844 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1301681789 273239 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:3714::1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :APNIC burned through 2.678 during last 30 days??? < 1301682252 482733 :Ilari!~user@2002:5870:3714::1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :To paraphrase popular phrase: Allocate baby allocate. :-) < 1301682635 646964 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to add feature to TeXnicard so that it can work without external programs (but keeping the way using external program, too), by adding some commands for image manipulation and for typesetting using some algorithms of TeX. However I do not want to include any external libraries other than the one I can include with source-codes and compiling together with TeXnicard, and without floating point. < 1301682684 735498 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a way to tell git that a file has been renamed? < 1301682775 168113 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: git mv a < 1301682776 509718 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: git mv a b < 1301682855 444212 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, apparently I need a newer yasm < 1301682897 596392 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1301683266 427282 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: What does it mean if a GPU computation program has an option to "use vectors"? < 1301683417 73519 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: my guess is it means vectorised operations, like the SIMD instructions in recent x86-compatible processors < 1301683426 742015 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that would be CPU not GPU < 1301683430 975583 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's OpenCL < 1301683435 83789 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1301683442 529290 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think OpenCL can do both, but this is explicitly a GPU program < 1301683443 792663 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in that case it's a weird name for something else I've never heard of < 1301683465 868845 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently it's ideal on some AMD cards at least < 1301683469 595407 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no word about nvidia < 1301683483 892356 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1301683501 556341 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose it could be a reference to memory coalescing < 1301683520 482580 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :#ifdef VECTORS < 1301683520 645729 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :typedef uint2 u; < 1301683520 811837 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :#else < 1301683520 812007 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :typedef uint u; < 1301683520 812114 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :#endif < 1301683525 320591 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the way that you can request a block of memory and it's as fast as requesting a single byte, because it's typelineable < 1301683529 908977 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :#ifdef VECTORS < 1301683530 152308 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : nonce = base + get_global_id(0) + (uint2)(0, 0x80000000U); < 1301683530 315794 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :#else < 1301683530 315969 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : nonce = base + get_global_id(0); < 1301683530 316079 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :#endif < 1301683534 585997 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha, it is < 1301683545 11498 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's forcing the two units next to each other in memory < 1301683553 371222 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so is that almost universally a good thing, or does it depend on the card? < 1301683556 169095 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that they can be coalesced < 1301683586 454959 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're going to be using two ints anyway, together, it makes sense to vectorise them < 1301683590 719860 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if they're used separately a lot, it doesn't < 1301683615 796394 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and all cards react much the same way on that < 1301683636 78329 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the code is too insane for me to naalyze like that < 1301683641 679507 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : B = B + (rotr(G, 6) ^ rotr(G, 11) ^ rotr(G, 25)) + (A ^ (G & (H ^ A))) + K[54] + W6; F = F + B; B = B + (rotr(C, 2) ^ rotr(C, 13) ^ rotr(C, 22)) + ((C & D) | (E & (C | D))); < 1301683641 845453 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : W7 = W7 + (rotr(W8, 7) ^ rotr(W8, 18) ^ (W8 >> 3U)) + W0 + (rotr(W5, 17) ^ rotr(W5, 19) ^ (W5 >> 10U)); < 1301683642 390274 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : A = A + (rotr(F, 6) ^ rotr(F, 11) ^ rotr(F, 25)) + (H ^ (F & (G ^ H))) + K[55] + W7; E = E + A; A = A + (rotr(B, 2) ^ rotr(B, 13) ^ rotr(B, 22)) + ((B & C) | (D & (B | C))); < 1301683642 390479 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : W8 = W8 + (rotr(W9, 7) ^ rotr(W9, 18) ^ (W9 >> 3U)) + W1 + (rotr(W6, 17) ^ rotr(W6, 19) ^ (W6 >> 10U)); < 1301683644 181210 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : H = H + (rotr(E, 6) ^ rotr(E, 11) ^ rotr(E, 25)) + (G ^ (E & (F ^ G))) + K[56] + W8; D = D + H; H = H + (rotr(A, 2) ^ rotr(A, 13) ^ rotr(A, 22)) + ((A & B) | (C & (A | B))); < 1301683647 176714 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*analyze < 1301683649 468308 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*analyse :-P < 1301683678 740946 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow @ the resulting assembly file < 1301683859 434854 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: You sound terrified :-P < 1301683872 88970 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't realise I sounded anything < 1301683878 383843 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, that sort of thing looks almost normal < 1301683882 643032 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I take it those are thread-local variables? < 1301683897 151881 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :function local, the function is __kernel < 1301683904 590281 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :__kernel void search( const uint state0, const uint state1, const uint state2, const uint state3, < 1301683904 754663 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : const uint state4, const uint state5, const uint state6, const uint state7, < 1301683904 754851 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : const uint B1, const uint C1, const uint D1, < 1301683904 754958 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : const uint F1, const uint G1, const uint H1, < 1301683904 755066 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : const uint targetG, const uint targetH, < 1301683905 178238 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, thread-local < 1301683905 558584 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : const uint base, < 1301683907 555532 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : const uint fW0, const uint fW1, const uint fW2, const uint fW3, const uint fW15, const uint fW01r, const uint fcty_e, const uint fcty_e2, < 1301683910 704832 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : __global uint * output) < 1301683912 604250 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :an impressive signature < 1301683921 279787 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they'd have some sort of indicator if they weren't < 1301683946 740024 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's about a hundred lines like the above in a row, though :) < 1301683949 856987 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i feel like macros could help. < 1301683978 902717 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :unrolled loop < 1301683998 991849 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: again, i feel like macros could help :-P < 1301684009 696186 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think CUDA actually has C++-style templates, despite being mostly based on C, precisely to shorten that sort of thing < 1301684021 142562 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :all this advanced technology and it's being defeated by an http timeout... < 1301684146 494900 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :how odd < 1301684191 169706 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :def if_else(condition, trueVal, falseVal): < 1301684191 436299 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : if condition: < 1301684191 601429 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : return trueVal < 1301684191 601617 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : else: < 1301684191 601726 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : return falseVal < 1301684202 224698 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel good about this code already. < 1301684222 144524 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1301684636 689696 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: wow, GPUs are pretty good < 1301684649 331592 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :approximately 10x as good as CPUs, even :-P < 1301684651 267768 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're much better than CPUs, just hard to write for < 1301684665 280042 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah. and they slow down your desktop when you use them! sheesh < 1301684670 422970 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :for things that are maximally optimal for GPUs compared to CPUs, it's more like 100x < 1301684685 939221 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is what essentially amounts to hash-cracking on the small, I think < 1301684687 368577 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :like Hashcash < 1301684701 228107 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually it's not quite 10x as good as my cpu, more like 5x, because i have two cores < 1301684727 895080 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :grr, maybe compiz will get less lag than metacity < 1301684897 675209 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-25-93.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1301684897 675357 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-25-93.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Changing host < 1301684897 675437 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1301684897 878380 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1301684948 665795 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1301684954 552818 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiz doesn't like being turned on when the GPU is being thrashed < 1301684971 24935 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's very easy to crash a GPU by mistake < 1301684981 736822 :augur!~augur@pool-74-96-16-252.washdc.east.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1301684982 704380 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as they don't have all the OSy stuff that CPUs have nowadays < 1301684991 944781 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that will ruin their throughput? :-D < 1301684993 280466 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a crashed GPU mostly forces you to reboot the computer if you want the screen to work < 1301685002 196346 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, it worked, just, i could only see my mouse < 1301685003 850788 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: nah, I just don't think people have got round to doing it yet < 1301685006 840441 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it changed cursor when moving over texty parts) < 1301685009 825326 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but just that and the background, no windows < 1301685012 754525 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, then it was just being overloaded < 1301685052 969060 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :grr, my gpu is a bit of a weakling < 1301685067 569439 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :despite being basically the best *integrated* laptop gpu out there :) < 1301685076 319854 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a choice of this performing well, or a smooth desktop < 1301685163 225131 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, seems to be getting marginally better < 1301685173 272538 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :except that one of my query windows just went blank < 1301685184 372452 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: do gpus have any sort of "hey, i have no memory left" protection? :D < 1301685190 269683 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, they just crash < 1301685200 714169 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, wait, it didn't actually clear < 1301685204 373624 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're lucky, the supervisor process on the CPU will notice and be able to put things back in order < 1301685208 678251 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I must have hit Ctrl+L by mistake < 1301685264 161902 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least, the supervisor process normally notices if it's running at the time, although it may not be able to put things back to normal depending on how badly crashed the GPU is < 1301685420 66540 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries 1/90 single kernel execution seconds < 1301685435 147801 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay my desktop is basically usable now < 1301685439 665561 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yet more reason to use ratpoison! < 1301685456 452147 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO < 1301685458 717154 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :$825 :'( < 1301685499 307410 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's worth it, put all your money into it < 1301685503 300447 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it isn't, don't < 1301685505 844228 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :buy it for ten thousand dollars < 1301685510 642848 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's still below my max, but not by much. < 1301685511 764996 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :give up hookers for a year if you must < 1301685516 266092 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have all but to concede defeat :( < 1301685539 639738 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"that's still below my max" ;; surely at this point you can admit that it's an insane amount of money to be spending < 1301685555 110962 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's /80 years/ of normal average domain < 1301685558 246087 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*a normal domain < 1301685558 423600 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's mostly not my money, people who aren't douchebags have been donating :P < 1301685591 884456 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf, it's estimating that switching to the gpu was a lose < 1301685607 879848 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :despite it being 5x as fast < 1301685651 972143 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should turn on that vectors thing... and change the worksize :) < 1301685697 586686 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Can I have a GPU farm? < 1301685699 692516 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :THX < 1301685707 489227 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, "that vectors thing" is a massive pessimisation < 1301685713 283193 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :admittedly, I do have access to a GPU farm, but I'd be in trouble if I used it for /that/ < 1301685722 114802 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it looks like it's changing the algo < 1301685731 754826 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :to one that's slower but sped up more by coalescing < 1301685752 928435 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it was $825 of my own money, then yes, that would be a lot. < 1301685759 126679 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I have friends that are actually friends. < 1301685762 150554 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unlike you bastards :P < 1301685784 833166 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: /that/?! YOU MEAN HELPING YOUR FRIEND? ;______________________________________________________________________________________________________; < 1301685791 258054 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I am morbidly obese.) < 1301685813 699794 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: so it's $825 of your friends' money? < 1301685815 524351 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's worse < 1301685835 796688 :wareya_!~wareya@cpe-74-70-142-220.nycap.res.rr.com NICK :wawawareya < 1301685853 49205 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: WTF is wrong with you, seriously. You have so little money sense it's almost offensive. < 1301685858 26964 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor has 15 friends who would give him $20 for a novelty email address? < 1301685872 450849 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :15 * 20 is just $300 < 1301685875 365713 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :money sense, n. spending $825 of your friends' money on a novelty domain name < 1301685896 658318 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: They gave small donations and I'm giving them a vanity email address in return, it's friendly and they're trying to help me out. < 1301686013 762058 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :ALSO you don't read, it's not $825 of my friend's money, I said that's /mostly/ my friend's money. That only means it's at least $413 of theirs. < 1301686064 50202 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It happens to be more, but you people are so frustratingly unhelpful and assholish that I'm not going to give a value) < 1301686099 233647 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: is it us who's being assholish, for trying to give you good advice rather than waste money chasing domain names? < 1301686117 717126 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Things #esoteric has said to Gregor: < 1301686120 122503 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(1) It's too much money. < 1301686124 805469 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(2) It's a waste of money. < 1301686135 966117 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(3) No, fiscal responsibility alone does not give you sufficient money to throw away like that. < 1301686143 816802 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ASSHOLES < 1301686192 151779 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that is unfriendly behavior towards someone who DOES have the money, and DOES NOT have the money through magic or pulling it out of his god damn ass, to want to buy something to make him happy. < 1301686239 502760 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :And "never spend substantial amounts of money on anything that does not have intrinsic value" is a very poor piece of advice if you'd like to actually enjoy life at all. < 1301686266 987721 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I tend not to spend substantial amounts of money even on things that do have intrinsic value < 1301686277 265472 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You've also been bugging us for donations, not just saying you're buying it < 1301686365 474442 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION spends a moment breathing :P < 1301686396 703024 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's up to $825 now? < 1301686425 978745 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, and Gregor is now in a bitter argument with elliott and ais523. < 1301686449 382792 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think donating all the money I made in SL may not be a good idea < 1301686463 970584 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you made money in SL? < 1301686468 841173 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Sealand) < 1301686487 89760 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Second Life) < 1301686495 92540 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION chooses to believe Sealand. < 1301686496 544064 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, not much, especially considering the amount of time involved) < 1301686497 441687 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, he has, like, £160. < 1301686507 122121 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :01/04/2011 20:34:48, fc342b63, accepted < 1301686508 350074 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'M RICH < 1301686518 237268 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, BitCoins? < 1301686529 996753 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg and another... actually I think it just found work this second :P < 1301686538 74468 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Yes X-D < 1301686546 764515 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :My poor GPU is squealing. < 1301686554 952447 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Makes me want to go down to the coal mines. < 1301686559 126390 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually I could just play Minecraft. < 1301686566 938908 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually gold mines but I don't think we have gold mines in England. < 1301686592 586677 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how much is that one coin worth? < 1301686592 835245 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CPU score: 0.01534 < 1301686595 360329 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :GPU score: 2157.0000 < 1301686595 752802 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any transaction fees? (Yeah, I know that currently transaction fees are minimal compared to .. what's it called? The 50) < 1301686597 937930 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I don't have a coin yet X-D < 1301686604 219371 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: This is pooled mining. < 1301686610 344793 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: (In non-pooled mining, you get 50 coins at a time. Very slowly.) < 1301686626 173523 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, you're constructing a batch of coins together and splitting them? < 1301686637 746090 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh, thought you were doing it yourself < 1301686638 810267 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: No, a bunch of people contribute to the mining of one block < 1301686641 632676 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :by a distributed cluster < 1301686649 867719 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the rewards are distributed according to how much work they did, etc. < 1301686653 575569 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, I see < 1301686666 149645 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the combined result is essentially a supercomputer, it gets far more blocks than any one person (who would be unlikely to ever get one with only one computer) < 1301686676 289338 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :How often does that cluster find coins? < 1301686698 155063 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: re: worth; as far as exchange goes, 1 USD = 1.26 BTC; 1 EUR = 1.64 BTC; 1 BTC = L$220 (going to L$; too lazy to work out the reverse) < 1301686715 13629 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(YES, SECOND LIFE'S CURRENCY IS TOTALLY ON THE SAME LEVEL AS DOLLARS X-D) < 1301686728 680648 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also 1 gram of gold is 48.54 BTC X-D < 1301686742 884978 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you have to mine a block at a time the way it works? or can you find just the one coin then stop? < 1301686773 748565 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you have to mine a block at a time, but I believe it's an incremental process, and possibly even distributed < 1301686777 633264 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but all the spoils go to one winner < 1301686789 463255 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the spoils decrease and the difficulty increases as time goes on, before all bitcoins have been distributed into the market) < 1301686836 221168 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but with pool mining, the problems your node has to solve are much smaller < 1301686842 802468 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's a lot faster < 1301686849 238870 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it still seems to be a waste of time to use a CPU, though < 1301686853 458800 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, so it isn't just hashcash-style < 1301686860 314201 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh, I don't know the actual protocol yet < 1301686867 266447 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but it's something like finding a hash with no zeroes, that's involved < 1301686877 663196 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in some base, presumably) < 1301686899 58108 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: btw, the analogue to the sg finding-a-tip problem is that you have to go from the first block ever created to the last < 1301686904 19151 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I think there's like one block per transaction < 1301686914 929265 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :what game is this for? i can't read up < 1301686920 204445 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: it's not a game < 1301686926 490861 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is it? < 1301686928 340233 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :they have no clever solution to it though (I'm not even sure a clever solution is desirable), they just walk from the first block to the latest < 1301686929 679480 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: bitcoin < 1301686940 592512 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf is it < 1301686954 859737 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: cryptographic, decentralised currency < 1301686974 244297 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :in actual use -- you can donate to the EFF with it, buy gold with it, convert it to USD/EUR, etc. < 1301687009 33112 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :oic, so why does it involve mining? < 1301687018 91372 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*facepalm* < 1301687018 680600 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, that's how it's produced < 1301687022 483633 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: mining = solving a bunch of cryptographic problems :P < 1301687025 764506 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's no central bank < 1301687027 754829 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :leading you to a valid bitcoin < 1301687032 10585 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:37:56: How often does that cluster find coins? < 1301687032 192264 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :a < 1301687034 306613 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*all the time, I think < 1301687040 211858 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://mining.bitcoin.cz/stats/ < 1301687058 929978 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia is unable to comprehend any token of exchange that doesn't involve siderophilic elements. < 1301687072 629722 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: the system takes 2% to give to the owner for upkeep < 1301687078 74415 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, i'm reading up on it < 1301687080 467086 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. 1 BTC < 1301687106 359896 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are other pools, but this one seems decent < 1301687107 823588 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently they make you solve those problems to slow the rate at which the currency enters circulation < 1301687108 782437 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The reason people get paid to mine is because they're supporting the network. Each mined block contains previous transactions < 1301687119 76365 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently there are others that give a quicker payout in the short-run, but meh < 1301687132 524060 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: it's not that they make you, it's that it's literally built in to the protocol < 1301687142 841426 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: and there has to be _some_ problem involved, or the first person could just award themselves every bitcoin :-D < 1301687144 831104 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes sure < 1301687203 518612 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically you're making real money by doing nothing, the same way you would by investing real money in a hedge fund or commodities < 1301687218 71197 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, not doing nothing. Providing resources to the network < 1301687224 529768 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: It's not doing nothing, it's doing nothing of intrinsic value < 1301687229 188383 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although the actual computation is wasted < 1301687230 258282 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: but does that really matter? you can get it in other ways far quicker < 1301687242 912573 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :by trading existing currency, offering services (apparently some people will actually pay you in bitcoins already), ... < 1301687257 154325 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's only relevant for the first few years, after which there won't be any to distribute anyway < 1301687272 977765 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, there will still be transaction fees < 1301687275 258178 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: providing resources to the network requires no effort, therefore it is doing nothing < 1301687280 386036 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: anyway, by the same token most office jobs are doing ntohing :-P < 1301687281 388794 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*nothing < 1301687286 507093 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you work as a farmer? < 1301687294 802122 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric : quintopia: It's not doing nothing, it's doing nothing of intrinsic value < 1301687300 393637 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Define "intrinsic value". < 1301687306 544488 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I think the way it's working is that everyone checks the block, looking for perfect or imperfect bitcoins (ones with a few or several bits wrong) < 1301687311 363486 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, i do nothing, and i don't get paid for it < 1301687311 526807 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It's difficult :P But I don't think many people are interested in various cryptographic results. < 1301687328 256542 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :when someone finds a perfect one, it's split between everyone in the ratio of the imperfect ones they found, which are valueless < 1301687336 116554 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but they can easily benefit from them. < 1301687343 119546 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ah; that's not how the protocol itself works, though < 1301687349 346670 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know for a fact that only one person wins a block. < 1301687359 459081 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: indeed < 1301687360 275522 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, one token thnig < 1301687361 909215 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*thin < 1301687363 77437 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*thing < 1301687365 134611 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, "address" < 1301687457 889252 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, it's utterly hilarious that the bitcoin homepage has a flattr link < 1301687470 472816 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, which block did your group find? < 1301687478 490999 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: they're replacing that, I think, with a development-oriented page < 1301687481 991244 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: http://www.weusecoins.com/ is the new "marketing" site < 1301687487 176984 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :with obligatory cute videos < 1301687508 882186 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's worrying that more or less the currency's entire value depends on how good it is at marketing < 1301687520 326198 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: only in the short-term < 1301687526 554871 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: anyway, that's true with _all_ currencies! < 1301687526 719866 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott? < 1301687540 240287 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :all the ones that don't have an actual backing < 1301687547 851791 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, i.e. all of them? < 1301687548 15258 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that makes no sense! < 1301687549 781632 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but very few (no?) currencies are backed by something that's really valuable < 1301687552 643671 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: say pounds were backed by gold < 1301687557 561332 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, dur, it's on the pool's site < 1301687557 974271 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what use is gold? not much < 1301687558 139307 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :gold is also a bubble < 1301687563 837239 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :people value it higher than its uses (which do exist) < 1301687566 458924 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: nothing has intrinsic value < 1301687569 937968 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://blockexplorer.com/block/000000000000261ec3e461516103db3e359519e3cc6149ff5d3af63855465c66 < 1301687570 973870 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: things only have value because we find them useful < 1301687574 539823 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1301687574 782616 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :guess what? fiat currencies have value < 1301687576 455475 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because they're useful < 1301687582 777919 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, if nothing has intrinsic value then what is the point of the concept? < 1301687588 230686 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: there is no point of the concept :) < 1301687596 302710 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I was using it with a meaning that I don't even know earlier) < 1301687604 256287 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only useful concept is human value < 1301687608 521087 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and fiat currencies definitely have that < 1301687611 606977 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, you'd consider things like food to be intrinsically valuable < 1301687616 21888 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1301687621 932863 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the basis that people require it to live < 1301687622 410896 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're useful because we find eating them to be a rather good thing < 1301687627 47210 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because we find staying alive to be a good thing < 1301687630 422885 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :still nothing objective there < 1301687650 390303 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :currency is just abstraction of work; if you can work for a currency, and use the currency to buy the product of work, then that currency is valuable < 1301687655 719191 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fiat currencies no less < 1301687671 43030 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, would you consider the barter system to make sense? < 1301687678 925413 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: anyway, bitcoin is better than a "normal" fiat currency system < 1301687682 646305 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because nobody can control its value < 1301687685 461271 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(directly) < 1301687700 480815 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the barter system is better than no kind of currency system at all, but definitely suboptimal < 1301687706 535064 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, I suspect its value would be much more liable to being manipulated than otherwise < 1301687707 668144 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1301687709 163582 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :define barter system < 1301687714 208551 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and what, bitcoins? howso? < 1301687720 804003 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could drive the value very high the same way you can drive the value of shares high, by buying a lot of bitcoins quickly < 1301687727 717867 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :for more than everyone else thinks they're worth < 1301687734 963672 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if people then trust those trades, you could sell them on at a profit < 1301687739 19954 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and cause a collapse later < 1301687744 784476 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :very risky, but it's been successfully done with other things < 1301687761 264495 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Transaction_fees < 1301687767 643142 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I don't know that they have yet < 1301687787 22199 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think this one is still in progress < 1301687793 953908 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, the statement that they'll keep getting more valuable with time is very worrying; the fact that it's going up rather than down as more are created means that public perception of the value is changing rapidly < 1301687825 251057 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: they get valuable after the distribution stops < 1301687828 978272 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, generation < 1301687851 358771 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't that supposed to be many many years from now? < 1301687912 511028 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and they get harder to get as distribution goes on < 1301687917 308243 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the rewards are less and the problems more difficult < 1301687922 909689 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's all < 1301687928 391417 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: not many, AFAIK < 1301687937 312440 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least, I don't think < 1301687950 498682 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, singularity institute also accept bitcoin donations :) < 1301687987 52598 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, transaction fees are optional < 1301688026 275050 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not that that does much good unless someone runs a miner that doesn't require fees < 1301688057 159896 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: um, as in, you can send bitcoins without transactions < 1301688063 610476 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :("Because nodes have no obligation to include transactions in the blocks they generate, Bitcoin senders may voluntarily pay a transaction fee. Doing so will speed up the transaction and provide incentive for users to run nodes, especially as the difficulty of generating bitcoins increases or the reward per block amount decreases over time. Nodes collect the transaction fees associated with all transactions included in their candidate block.") < 1301688128 720609 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But nodes are free to reject transactions without a fee if they wish < 1301688137 239184 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a free market like thingy < 1301688308 282174 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the way bitcoin works is that everyone has a history of everything that's happened, and it's cryptographically hard to update < 1301688315 517348 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1301688323 981763 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if you manage to update it, you get some free bitcoins as a reward for doing the work in question < 1301688344 67762 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Well, you fooled *us*! Have some bitcoins!" < 1301688354 971941 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, it's basically an attempt to construct a monad in cryptographic security < 1301688364 60587 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU THINK EVERYTHING'S A MONAD < 1301688370 151189 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, just things that are < 1301688382 15749 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :transaction histories /aren't/, bitcoin's an attempt to make them act like one < 1301688397 453867 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's more turning transactions into a linked list < 1301688405 530493 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the point is to prevent the list forking < 1301688418 525166 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically, people put computational power into forcing their own version of events < 1301688420 419052 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, it's a linked list addressed by cryptographic hashes < 1301688438 39631 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you could only fork if you regenerated every event after too, I think < 1301688438 394953 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not a doubly linked list, as that wouldn't make sense < 1301688452 416288 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: blocks have the hash of the last block in them < 1301688453 582880 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, you can just fork at any point by generating a block < 1301688457 683828 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1301688473 85367 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :/but/, if your block chain is easier to generate than the one that most people think is the chain, nobody will pay attention to it < 1301688483 86115 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :whichever chain is the most difficult to generate is the official version of events < 1301688517 979658 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and everyone extends that one as it's the only one other people accept, which means it keeps getting longer and longer, and harder and harder to catch < 1301688534 451742 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Every block contains a hash of the previous block. This has the effect of creating a chain of blocks from the genesis block to the current block. Each block is guaranteed to come after the previous block chronologically because the previous block's hash would otherwise not be known. Each block is also nearly impossible to modify once it has been in the chain for a while because every block after it would also have to be regenerated. These < 1301688534 637420 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : properties are what make double-spending of bitcoins very difficult. The block chain is the main innovation of Bitcoin. < 1301688536 183316 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Bitcoin relies on the fact that no single entity can control most of the CPU power on the network for any significant length of time, since, if they could, they would be able to extend any branch of the tree they chose, and faster than any other branch can be extended, making it the longest branch, and then permanently controlling which transactions appear in it." < 1301688554 142783 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, you can pick any block you like as the "previous block" when generating them < 1301688667 740141 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Anyway, it seems cryptographically sound. < 1301688681 5892 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, I think it makes sense cryptographically < 1301688689 60426 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming no hash collisions, which we can hope is the case < 1301688706 814797 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's SHA-256, so that's a pretty good assumption < 1301688722 272715 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(IIRC) < 1301688801 655981 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :does this bitcoin discussion have to do with the freenode prize? < 1301688811 479266 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing at all < 1301688839 855591 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1301688864 355461 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I currently have 0.05 BTC due to free money being given out :-P < 1301688864 652898 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :kk < 1301688900 644951 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :where can i find the latest BTC exchange rates? < 1301688912 86947 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://bitcoinwatch.com/ < 1301688924 711074 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is also http://bitcoincharts.com/ < 1301688929 32774 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which has fancy market stats < 1301688933 821811 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can pretend to be a REAL trader < 1301688973 181566 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh oh, buying lots of ridiculously overpowerful hardware and then sitting at a computer screen into the night just became profitable < 1301688992 382766 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect the world population growth rate to plummet < 1301688997 868277 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/suspect/something/ < 1301689054 14074 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it though? < 1301689060 961768 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1301689069 781485 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Is it what? Profitable? < 1301689086 83354 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes; people who are doing it are pretty serious :-P < 1301689102 765965 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: why would you have to attend it? < 1301689103 319897 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i expect that you wouldn't be able to mine enough BTC in the short time that new blocks have so much value to recoup the cost of the hardware and electricity < 1301689106 501995 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :but maybe i'm wrong < 1301689138 352005 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, after a while, new blocks won't generate coins < 1301689144 257757 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: traders spend all day looking at screens with white on black and red and blue :-P < 1301689147 807557 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead, people will be paid to generate them by people doing transactions < 1301689148 201494 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And you can do that with bitcoins! < 1301689159 688761 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: you can < 1301689168 814141 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. if you do a transaction, you need to bribe the people making blocks to include it < 1301689169 649660 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: if you buy a handful of high-end GPUs < 1301689179 902368 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise the person at the other end has no way to know if it's confirmed or not < 1301689187 678561 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and thus, whether you're double-spending or not < 1301689219 93817 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, now person #2 has assumed I'm talking about a game when I mentioned bitcoins < 1301689226 488777 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE NAME PERHAPS REQUIRES IMPROVEMENT < 1301689229 516002 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1301689231 982239 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, most purely digital currenices are game-related < 1301689232 299739 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :also < 1301689234 99437 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like TotallySeriousBitCurrencyYo. < 1301689235 627021 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :"mining" < 1301689237 879573 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I didn't mention that :P < 1301689239 763801 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: No, that's awesome. < 1301689253 250813 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :but we have a wealth of mining /games/ < 1301689270 129856 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: In fact I want my screensaver to be a picture of a cute little android mining at a big ol' block of bitcoins. < 1301689278 126208 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :With little coins falling out of it. < 1301689282 364631 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not really a good metaphor < 1301689284 963919 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Based on the actual data. < 1301689286 79152 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :minting would be closer < 1301689287 735125 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd be much better if you could get a bunch of clients cooperating to mine games, rather than coins < 1301689287 899107 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT WOULD BE AWESOME < 1301689294 431861 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd probably be cheaper than making games by hand < 1301689295 237800 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: wat < 1301689297 265814 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :X-D < 1301689309 86129 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :see, it'd produce something actually useful then, people like playing games < 1301689318 356741 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i support this idea < 1301689336 309752 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: wouldn't that involve a very expensive algorithm that generates a new game? < 1301689339 902774 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I approve < 1301689343 9752 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would take a very long time to mine a single game though < 1301689351 177897 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine the games being written in SHAfuck < 1301689357 779480 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: of course, you think generating a good game is easy? < 1301689374 220328 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can determine how good the game is by how many person-hours are spent playing it < 1301689382 359566 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: somehow I'm relieved that nobody from #esoteric invented bitcoins now < 1301689385 206215 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1301689386 858795 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :TO OUR KNOWLEDGE < 1301689389 639250 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, wouldn't it be better to have a rating system? < 1301689390 133381 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then do the rest of the setup the same way as bitcoin < 1301689397 155016 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : you can determine how good the game is by how many person-hours are spent playing it < 1301689400 458474 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then QWOP would rank as a good game! < 1301689401 58927 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: you'd want somethign that couldn't be easily gamed < 1301689406 437660 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: QWOP? < 1301689410 533885 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: YOU DON'T WANT TO KNOW < 1301689414 551524 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it requires flash so you can't know < 1301689424 428130 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :One of those highly-addictive but not particularly enjoyable games. < 1301689424 895610 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, Dot Action 2 would count as a good game, though that's only debatable, not objectively wrong < 1301689429 798939 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: IT'S NOT ENJOYABLE AT ALL < 1301689432 115151 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT'S LIVING HELL < 1301689437 190091 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so why do people play it? < 1301689445 339193 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, since i can't seem to find it in these lay intros, exactly what is the problem being solved in the creation of a new block, and how is its difficulty ramped up? < 1301689451 26278 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: IT CONSUMES YOUR SOUL < 1301689457 139981 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: look at the non-lay intros :P < 1301689464 710093 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: the problem's to find a hash of the previous transaction history that, treated as an integer, is really low < 1301689469 6793 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you mean the original paper? < 1301689469 818287 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Main_Page < 1301689539 544130 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and how is the difficulty parameterized? < 1301689552 301427 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Myths wow, this is big < 1301689574 472102 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: I'm not sure about the translation to a number, but it's basically finding a hash that's, say, only 0.0001% of the maximum value it could have, rather than more like 50% like you'd expect < 1301689583 124501 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bitcoins are worthless because they aren't backed by anything < 1301689583 386173 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gold isn't backed by anything either. See myth https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Myths#Bitcoin_is_backed_by_CPU_cycles < 1301689593 305454 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol, i should have just told ais523 to read this :P < 1301689613 461671 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I agree that bitcoin isn't backed by anything < 1301689635 276547 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could only be backed by CPU cycles if they were intrinsically capable of being exchanged for CPU cycles, and they aren't < 1301689656 134894 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose the reason I think bitcoin's a bubble is because I think gold's a bubble too < 1301689666 696880 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and, well, most or all Real Life currency < 1301689677 190798 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's hard to find a way to live without currency altogether, so I may as well use what most people use < 1301689683 54263 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: all currency is a bubble by your definition < 1301689688 175585 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1301689691 514415 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :inherently < 1301689691 699801 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :can I not believe that? < 1301689698 247134 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe that's true, but it's more making the concept of "bubble" useless, rather than saying something deep about currency < 1301689713 238777 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, yes < 1301689725 85968 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and by "finding a hash" that means "choosing a way of hashing" such that the choices are numerous and the particular choice of hashes is specifiable as a small number? < 1301689727 982027 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :if something is useful indefinitely, I find calling it a bubble silly; and there's no reason bitcoin wouldn't be usable indefinitely, if people keep using it, which there seems to be no reason for them to stop doing < 1301689762 757622 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's doesn't seem to be much reason for them to continue doing either < 1301689791 606347 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: you can append an arbitrary nonce to the data then hash it via a specific hash algo, the difficulty's in finding a nonce for which doing that works < 1301689798 653266 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: as much reason as any currency < 1301689814 378222 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :the reason is because it would take a lot of people deciding not to in order to make it no longer worthwhile for anyone to < 1301689825 270785 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e., it's more useful than having to milk a goat by hand to give milk to the person who you want to buy a coat off < 1301689829 259280 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: except it can happen gradually < 1301689829 631546 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :so continuing to do so is a dynamic equilibrium of the system < 1301689842 662160 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if a few people decide they don't want to continue to use bitcoin any more, it makes its value go down < 1301689851 437677 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: not really < 1301689857 494574 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that'll make more people decide they don't want to use it, and drive its value down further < 1301689858 759931 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: not as long as the exchanges are still used < 1301689858 975056 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc < 1301689861 84348 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an unstable equilibrium < 1301689863 343957 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, anyway < 1301689864 884431 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: sure < 1301689866 179896 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but if everyone is using it, what reason do those people have to choose not to use it? < 1301689868 434336 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :real currency has the same issue < 1301689868 607667 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but you have to show why that would happen < 1301689876 124501 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ALL CURRENCY INHERENTLY HAS THAT ISSUE < 1301689878 345833 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only reason it's tolerated is that people have to use /something/ < 1301689879 803263 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I KNOW < 1301689883 868053 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from currencies whose value is somehow determined by one person < 1301689889 237803 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which can only be done by that one person selling just about every good < 1301689893 814974 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically, how does a rational player determine that it is rational to stop using bitcoin? < 1301689896 123646 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least forcing people to sell it at a certain price < 1301689901 418468 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and, um, people don't like that < 1301689909 567483 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :your argument isn't working, because you're trying to convince me that bitcoin is no worse than any real currency, and I'm saying I don't care because real currencies are bad enough < 1301689911 20828 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what I object to is your use of the word "bitcoin" < 1301689915 391314 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should say "currency" < 1301689919 406240 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, OK < 1301689949 669090 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I'm going to have to bring out the "if you're so clever then what would you use instead" at this juncture. < 1301689956 763659 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: how does a rational player determine that it is rational to stop using a particular widespread currency? < 1301689967 218812 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: people aren't rational < 1301689971 699000 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :come on, you made that far too easy < 1301689972 978712 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: FWIW, I don't like currency in the general case anyway < 1301689983 38546 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: my preferred solution is to eliminate scarcity < 1301689986 685008 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it's just superfluous < 1301689988 986818 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but until then... < 1301689989 693037 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i'm asking a game theory question here, your objection is overruled < 1301689996 4896 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: it's worth not using a currency, if what it takes you to obtain that currency is an unfairly large amount of however-you-value-things-in-general compared to what you can buy using it < 1301690004 251762 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, hello, this is reality speaking. Humans are not rational. Bye. < 1301690007 456249 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: I don't think game theory applies to people deciding to stop using a currency like bitcoin < 1301690007 620758 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may as well give you a stock game theory answer in that case < 1301690011 849738 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are far too many irrational reasons to do it < 1301690040 572395 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i agree that it does not apply in the real world. could you stop bringing up irrelevancies wrt my game theory question? < 1301690079 907226 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: no, I like pinging you, it's fun < 1301690082 827324 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ping ping ping < 1301690086 675925 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the main rational reason to buy a currency that's been freshly created and that doesn't have much momentum yet, is because you think that other people will try to do the same thing as you but later < 1301690095 256575 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember pulling that sort of trick in nomic occasionally < 1301690106 550959 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, PBA vs. RBoA is probably worth analysing by all economists < 1301690107 123001 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I'm a bit of a slowpoke, I probably should have jumped in earlier < 1301690113 182173 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: gah, I was just thinking about the PBA < 1301690116 12645 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: trying to mentally revise it < 1301690121 686138 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: if you're a slowpoke, you'll go and dominate the leaderboard < 1301690124 628860 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :then I wondered about having a bank backed by bitcoins, which sounded like fun < 1301690129 830100 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :until you get trapped by consistency < 1301690133 303625 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OTOH, people would be unlikely to use it < 1301690139 112939 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1301690140 90369 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, at least, more likely than "real" currency < 1301690144 965532 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :despite that not being rational < 1301690151 75067 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: are you saying that for a widespread currency, currency acquisition becomes more expensive than the value of the currency? that seems to contradict the definition of "value"? < 1301690161 805485 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: anyway, the PBA is still inherently better than the RBoA, IMO < 1301690169 645243 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it just needs tweaking < 1301690193 122445 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you're speaking as if it still exists < 1301690199 697758 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i'm speaking about it in the abstract < 1301690202 956471 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: indeed, that's why currencies tend not to collapse < 1301690207 509097 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and the PBA did very well for a long time, it was killed by (1) my coding negligence, (2) BobTHJ's everything negligence and (3) the resulting bank run of one by Wooble < 1301690210 390660 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the value is based on a circular argument, but it's a persistent one < 1301690210 952197 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1301690214 769245 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*(3) the collapse of the game, and the < 1301690215 237507 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric : ais523: what I object to is your use of the word "bitcoin" < 1301690215 401844 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, wait, what. < 1301690222 435323 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also I think my connection is gone again. < 1301690225 547031 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it hasn't < 1301690227 664279 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the collapse of the economy in general helped too, I think < 1301690238 618554 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that's what i said, unless you mean the real world economy < 1301690241 671716 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Phantom_Hoover: because he was objecting to bitcoins in various ways, but they actually applied to every currency < 1301690247 200795 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/^Phantom_Hoover: // < 1301690256 781551 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I meant the Agoran economy < 1301690261 221537 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the game didn't collapse, just the AAA < 1301690262 560861 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which was enough < 1301690267 116928 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I think the start of the PBA was really interesting, because it was amazing how out of whack the RBoA rates are < 1301690270 893872 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1301690294 110994 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and, incidentally, both banks were backed by the AAA, which was backed by the scoring system < 1301690302 74292 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the banks worked fine just as long as win by points did < 1301690307 62157 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it was also backed by notes < 1301690311 481108 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :only the AAA dwarfed notes < 1301690332 575641 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: IMO, a bank should have some built-in-to-the-contract way of selling off work < 1301690339 723521 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: so that e.g. it would still work even if only offices were left < 1301690346 544204 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you could get out of office duties by paying someone else to do them < 1301690353 747022 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i think that is naive to say. there are many reasons why currencies collapse, but i don't think it ever happens because people all at once decide that currency is not as valuable as it once was. from what i've seen it happens when actual real world conditions change to modify the perceived value of the coin < 1301690369 542204 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: see my attempt to create a new economy at Agora < 1301690373 451137 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which I need to get back to < 1301690375 122161 :cpressey!~cpressey@173-9-215-173-Illinois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1301690375 654723 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although tomorrow < 1301690379 946828 :cpressey!~cpressey@173-9-215-173-Illinois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover! < 1301690385 634118 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I probably oppose it, because now I'm all set on reviving the PBA but better < 1301690388 935453 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: we have contracts now, right? < 1301690389 390096 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance, when someone changes the rules about what can be done with currency < 1301690391 456828 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no < 1301690396 724266 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, can we get contracts back? < 1301690401 477504 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the PBA needs something to refer to < 1301690406 683321 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and my new economy works a bit like contracts < 1301690417 62157 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could still create banks, but in nomic they need something to back the < 1301690418 524319 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*them < 1301690422 994149 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly because otherwise they have nothing to trade < 1301690428 752476 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so my plan would create the banking < 1301690431 898311 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*backing < 1301690435 971443 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you could go nuts on top of that < 1301690437 884449 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: like I said, work is the backing < 1301690442 477395 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :as well as other currencies < 1301690448 997715 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, the other trades would be based on "work = {transfer me X}" < 1301690470 440575 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: and that work is what I was planning to make into a currency < 1301690474 123062 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or more precisely, actions < 1301690487 825485 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hmm, perhaps then; I think contract law was a good way of doing that, though < 1301690490 862238 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :more or less like the Vote Market, except not so hideously stupid < 1301690496 822956 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: although contract law would be better if it was based on individual pledges < 1301690500 83021 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can emulate contracts with those, I think < 1301690502 122940 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's really an attempt to bring back something contract-like < 1301690505 313117 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and even emulate equity enforcement with them < 1301690508 442831 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically, it's tradeable pledges < 1301690516 403186 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you write a message, you can give it to other people < 1301690522 864087 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and they can spend it to make you send it < 1301690539 520695 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: can we finally define infinitesimal time to allow message ordering to be formally defined at the same time? < 1301690543 441550 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that'd be useful, to define "message" < 1301690553 380195 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: (otherwise it might be judged that you have to include headers too! :D) < 1301690563 181076 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's an argument about that atm (my contested registration) < 1301690582 439323 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried to get it as close to the player/not-a-player borderline as possible, I think I judged it quite well < 1301690625 631691 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I wonder why I haven't made any bitcoins yet < 1301690632 797000 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly they haven't passed my set 0.01 pool threshold < 1301690674 390315 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Bitcoin is a form of domestic terrorism because it only harms the economic stability of the USA and its currency" ;; I hope nobody's actually said this... < 1301690694 400520 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Bitcoins are stored in wallet files, just copy the wallet file to get more coins!" ;; lol :D < 1301690702 402865 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :this faq is great, bunch of stupid questions :) < 1301690772 807892 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the thing that prevents the coin copying is that if you spend both copies, only one can be baked into a block by whoever's mining (or it isn't a valid block), and they get to choose which of the transactions is valid < 1301690777 864736 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, actual criticism I have: All transactions are public. Even though the identities are conceiled, it may be worked out what's going on to some degree < 1301690790 686521 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, I have returned to calmness (also home :P ) < 1301690803 212398 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if someone apparently sends you bitcoins, you're supposed to wait for a chain past that point to build up to be sure you actually have them and they wern't lying < 1301690804 898599 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*weren't < 1301690810 89633 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: practically, it's that you have to rewrite the rest of history to get anything to trust you, IIRC < 1301690814 64771 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is rather difficult < 1301690831 863545 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but yeah, when the faucet gave me 0.05 coins it started off unconfirmed < 1301690834 683336 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :now it's up to 42 confirmations < 1301690839 559457 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and even then, it only lets you double-spend your own coins < 1301690843 122850 :cpressey!~cpressey@173-9-215-173-Illinois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1301690858 488326 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Nick Clegg tops April Fools poll after pretending to keep a pre-election promise" < 1301690866 914085 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I HOPE YOU ENJOYED THAT PING < 1301690983 10985 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[Bitcoin community are anarchist/conspiracy theorist/gold standard weenies < 1301690983 205299 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CONFIRMED]] < 1301690985 793981 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Best FAQ entry ever. < 1301691007 98750 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, [[Myths]] entry < 1301691013 460789 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not actually the FAQ < 1301691143 522430 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you have a Windows binary of ImageMagick for Fourier transforming? < 1301691152 332859 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1301691243 118270 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: interesting approach < 1301691269 246900 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what? < 1301691355 360161 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott, actual criticism I have: All transactions are public. Even though the identities are conceiled, it may be worked out what's going on to some degree < 1301691360 202842 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: You can create a new address for every transaction. < 1301691373 531240 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: question: if I have coins in my wallet, that were sent to my keypair A, can I transfer them to keypair B without leaving a trace connecting keypair A and B? < 1301691381 850928 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: but you can figure out how each coin was traded < 1301691388 561234 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you'd need to do some sort of crazy money laundering < 1301691394 884476 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: only if you refuse to pay the transaction fee < 1301691396 360936 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :say by converting them to real-word currency and back < 1301691408 916013 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: which is Bad Behaviour < 1301691412 124862 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but perfectly possible < 1301691434 598251 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, the previous history of owners of every bitcoin is recorded; it has to be , or it wouldn't work < 1301691441 732769 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: re: tracking things, I suspect it would get lost in the noise < 1301691445 953124 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite probably < 1301691512 933602 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: but wouldn't you, in that case, be paying a transaction fee to yourself? < 1301691532 99333 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: err, no, you just wouldn't pay one at all < 1301691538 495666 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1301691541 974472 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you did pay it < 1301691545 884690 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :who would you pay it to < 1301691562 560741 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: the network < 1301691566 313067 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :and how would it record that you changed the key you are using for the coin < 1301691575 297407 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to figure out whether "Building nuclear reactor at home - from scratch" is an AF or not < 1301691646 973375 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :What happens with FFT, if you switch the magnitude and phase? What happen if you mirror the phase image and leave the magnitude as is? What if you did the other way around? < 1301691653 935077 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's certainly been done. < 1301691669 979818 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: oh, comments prove that it's certainly plausible (although not actually a nuclear reactor), but I'm still not sure < 1301691681 969266 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Things. Various things. < 1301691686 886588 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Changes in the result according to the changes you make. < 1301691689 746732 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Link, BTW? < 1301691692 36871 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://notalwaysright.com/lindsay-lohan-is-bad-for-your-health/10933 Bahaha < 1301691727 4200 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/ggg43/guys_ive_just_built_tiny_nuclear_reactor_at_home/ < 1301691729 755000 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"ggg" OMG IT'S A BITCOIN < 1301691748 506983 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you got one from the distributed block-finding thing? < 1301691749 64634 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zuh? < 1301691756 440560 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no, see the url above < 1301691759 301655 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: bitcoins start with a lot of 0s < 1301691764 564354 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so my mental pattern matcher has now short-circuited < 1301691775 778543 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1301691791 308715 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you saw three gs at the start of the URL, thought "that's unlikely", and assumed it was valuable? < 1301691795 401354 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Tiny" and "nuclear reactor" don't go so well together ... < 1301691796 95677 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes! :D < 1301691801 245680 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: it's not a real nuclear reactor < 1301691806 144540 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm thinking that's legit. < 1301691808 260321 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: apparently I'll get an email once I reach the stunning total of 0.01 bitcoins < 1301691816 709146 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: yes; the title seems AF-geared, though < 1301691830 459004 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: because i turned on email on payout :) < 1301691835 811527 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've actually thought of a potential problem that isn't addressed there < 1301691854 382215 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :er, in what? bitcoins? reactors? < 1301691855 824066 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Gamma-decay" < 1301691857 541344 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :bitcoins < 1301691857 836680 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFf < 1301691889 838295 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the way mining works, if you want consistent payouts rather than gambling - and probably most people will - it's in your interests to join the largest mining group < 1301691893 714158 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :THERE IS NO SUCH THING YOU IDIOTS < 1301691897 604166 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which would over time lead to the smaller ones collapsing < 1301691908 869614 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that's not quite true < 1301691909 109993 :augur!~augur@pool-74-96-16-252.washdc.east.verizon.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1301691915 256239 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which would give the people in charge of the group a lot of control < 1301691925 786966 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's been shown that over infinite time, ignoring difficulty changes, the payout of a group ~= the payout of doing it manually < 1301691929 392893 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or even ==, I'm not sure) < 1301691930 100806 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, cobalt-60 doesn't even emit gamma radiation without decaying, it just emits gamma radiation when it beta decays. < 1301691932 488215 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: OK, so from skimming that, I agree; it's not a nuclear reactor, it's a nuclear flashlight :P < 1301691941 750773 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Once again my chemistry textbook is full of crap. < 1301691945 560072 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: if you have limited hardware, a group is infinitely better because of difficulty increases and time < 1301691946 397388 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's the same on average, but it's more consistent in a group < 1301691954 208034 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not as bad as it saying that GFMs are unitless, I suppose. < 1301691955 860691 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and more consistency = good for most people < 1301691964 335713 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but if you have a bunch of good GPUs, a pretty sustained rate of 50 bitcoins is far nicer looking < 1301691970 961803 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: than a steadier rate of a lot less < 1301691987 461704 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and, let's face it, "most people" aren't going to mine < 1301691997 78873 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :they'll get bitcoins in far more reasonable ways (assuming "most people" adopt it, that is) < 1301692009 367736 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they probably are if bitcoin catches on, otherwise transaction fees will go up very high < 1301692034 986180 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, they'll set their idle resources to it, I suppose, but mining without a GPU is already hideously impractical < 1301692036 783399 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :even in a pool < 1301692124 725734 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I say hideously < 1301692132 398885 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what I mean is, I got bored enough to check out a GPU miner before I mined anything with a CPU < 1301692154 607896 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :GPU is just much better for that sort of thing < 1301692214 574076 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to figure out the words to justify a GPU cluster as a financial investment < 1301692217 86075 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :;D < 1301692348 440221 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if the EFF will appreciate a ~5 cent donation < 1301692534 96873 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh, my wm has fucked up again < 1301692543 91540 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I bet they will < 1301692549 847044 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not very much, but slightly < 1301692553 672079 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1301692565 601694 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'll hoard my bitcoins until I have more than that :-P < 1301692572 670047 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :seriously though, argh, why does my wm do this < 1301692642 501390 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott QUIT :Disconnected by services < 1301692645 687040 :elliott!~elliott@91.104.240.103 JOIN :#esoteric < 1301692653 821004 :elliott!~elliott@91.104.240.103 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should run the miner on the console instead... or just ditch X entirely < 1301692656 599363 :elliott!~elliott@91.104.240.103 QUIT :Changing host < 1301692656 763953 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1301692898 984333 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 JOIN :#esoteric < 1301693112 649772 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, my total reward so far is ~0.00065 bitcoins < 1301693115 488283 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOICE < 1301693145 274952 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ugh, you re-re-did the c-intercal build system? < 1301693149 816577 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god, don't tell me it was esr < 1301693160 946243 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, he tried to < 1301693165 945431 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I redid it myself in order to stop him < 1301693174 138147 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that was months ago < 1301693175 620844 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: why did he want to redo it? < 1301693182 943870 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :generated files in the repo, of all things < 1301693186 667929 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which should be irrelevant < 1301693188 521986 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: he _wanted_ that? < 1301693195 248373 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, he wanted there to be none at all < 1301693208 44636 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically it was a case of writing a bootstrap shellscript that could generate all the files from scratc < 1301693209 593063 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*scratch < 1301693212 547577 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The floating-point library is now automatically included if < 1301693212 785368 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1301693212 949019 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : a program NEXTs to labels in the range 5000-5999." < 1301693212 949208 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :previously they generated each other < 1301693215 367924 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ew? < 1301693217 201283 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was one of his < 1301693220 179247 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1301693223 696148 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going through them to ew at them < 1301693224 624314 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and only if it doesn't contain any label in that range < 1301693227 216961 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which he forgot to specify < 1301693231 422461 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is that a good thing? < 1301693231 803180 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's saner that way < 1301693252 930185 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's the way INTERCAL library inclusion has Always Worked, just NEXT to a line that doesn't exist and it tries to find an appropriate library < 1301693259 508615 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1301693274 327037 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Bugs reported by Elliott Hird" yaey im fameous < 1301693290 541894 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have you pointed out many bugs? < 1301693299 986485 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :a whole four! < 1301693302 420930 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, five < 1301693306 133487 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but Vorpal got the credit for one < 1301693312 989654 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is the grossest injustice < 1301693329 343087 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: OMG YOU'RE FAMOUS TOO < 1301693335 298899 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :...I am? < 1301693340 288733 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you forgot to call him Adhahamhamhmahmahhmanhnmhanhahn McSomething < 1301693343 787793 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least I think he's said he's McSomething < 1301693344 363815 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.catb.org/~esr/intercal/NEWS.html < 1301693367 202262 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :How bad was the typo? < 1301693383 714845 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :139 < 1301693383 947346 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :29. The function clock_gettime is now supported by the yuk profiler as an < 1301693384 110867 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :140 < 1301693384 111047 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : alternative method of getting a high-resolution clock for profiling (it < 1301693384 111154 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :141 < 1301693384 310473 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : is available on at least Linux). < 1301693384 476250 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did it have the capacity to end all life on Earth? That would be a very nasty typo < 1301693407 841591 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you switched from tar to pax because POSIX deprecated the former in favour of the latter (OBVIOUSLY THAT'S WHY), you should do the same for gettimeofday -> clock_gettime < 1301693414 526384 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :gettimeofday was removed in POSIX 2008, replaced by clock_gettime < 1301693416 757295 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[citation needed] < 1301693419 178879 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: clock_gettime is used if it exists, IIRC < 1301693425 32760 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: for what, what I said? < 1301693429 728502 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :read the posix standard yourself < 1301693461 963642 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not only that, but the libraries and compiled programs now agree on which profiling function to use! < 1301693464 370954 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that bug was hilarious) < 1301693491 514954 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: how many optimisations are there? I'm wondering if I can wile away a few hours by creating more obvious ones and giving them to you < 1301693509 502425 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, citation needed for why I'm famous. < 1301693514 155019 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: you're in the readme < 1301693515 997769 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1301693517 834112 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the HISTORY file < 1301693523 341149 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which should be called Changelog < 1301693524 209005 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: quite a lot; aiming for flow rather than expression optimisation would probably help < 1301693533 901606 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: btw, have you informed esr that there are, in fact, modern INTERCAL implementations not derived from his? < 1301693543 525306 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's aware of CLC-INTERCAL, but ignores it < 1301693547 57503 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :he was under the impression that there weren't in his awful blog post < 1301693547 415679 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is a weird combination < 1301693553 237495 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: heh, what do you mean? < 1301693559 175067 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :he knows it exists, but refuses to act as if it does < 1301693559 727379 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you point out CLC and he said "Yeah yeah whatever"? < 1301693563 822775 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's an attempt to save sanity < 1301693576 222546 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but what did he actually say when you pointed it out; or haven't you < 1301693581 986656 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, there's J-INTERCAL; not *that* modern, but still < 1301693594 588395 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :J- is just like a worse version of old-fashioned C- < 1301693599 216341 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, where's the C-INTERCAL page? < 1301693604 58230 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CLC-INTERCAL has been intrinsically different forever < 1301693610 579570 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and http://c.intercal.org.uk < 1301693618 892948 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, but J- is both (1) pretty modern and (2) an INTERCAL implementation < 1301693649 797709 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, it seems that with 0.29, the tarball has /just/ creeped over a million bytes < 1301693671 882321 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :bloat! < 1301693683 415146 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: YOU SHOULD WRITE AN INTERCAL REPL < 1301693685 829168 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :;D < 1301693692 861318 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that automatically increments statement numbers (and uses them as the prompt) < 1301693700 299045 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, statement numbers? < 1301693702 540007 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(so you can copy-paste lines into an intercal program directly, and also keep track of control flow... kinda) < 1301693711 794487 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: line numbers, whatever < 1301693712 707719 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CLC-INTERCAL has a REPL (INTERCALC), which I've actually used before now to do some quick INTERCAL calculations < 1301693719 623834 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it treats each statement independently < 1301693765 94946 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: boring! < 1301693771 354409 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :how are statement numbers done again? (number)? < 1301693797 491482 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1301693806 162412 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ sickly < 1301693817 948420 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(1) PLEASE DO COME FROM (2) < 1301693826 966354 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's an error already < 1301693827 157905 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(2) PLEASE DO COME FROM (1) < 1301693829 950375 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as (2) doesn't exist < 1301693834 377069 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean (1) PLEASE DO COME FROM #2 < 1301693836 618824 :cpressey!~cpressey@173-9-215-173-Illinois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1301693837 914830 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, right < 1301693839 73224 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ sickly < 1301693841 868167 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is a no-op rather than an error if the line doesn't exist < 1301693842 602414 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :=== Changes reported by Phantom Hoover === < 1301693843 161274 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :24. Fixed a nasty documentation typo. < 1301693845 223282 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the second line can stay the same < 1301693847 276604 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: err, no < 1301693850 220310 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the second line WILL exist < 1301693850 986072 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which typo was that? < 1301693855 224734 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you pretend every line exists already < 1301693856 169257 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I can't remember < 1301693861 898866 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but don't execute statements until the lines they depend on exist < 1301693862 453595 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it was pretty bad, I said the opposite of what I meant < 1301693935 899979 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: or _does_ the latter come into effect once (2) starts existing? < 1301693944 295491 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, wait, even better < 1301693946 517092 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ sickly < 1301693951 331768 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(1) PLEASE DO READ OUT #1234 < 1301693953 184839 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :[...] < 1301693964 672966 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(2) DO READ OUT #4567 < 1301693966 706744 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :[...] < 1301693974 75034 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(3) DO COME FROM (1) < 1301693974 240978 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CLC-INTERCAL's WHILE would be useful for this, except it only applies to expressions < 1301693980 720443 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the second line's output has to get removed < 1301693988 414555 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :DO statement WHILE expression executes the expression as soon as it makes sense and doesn't error < 1301693992 303604 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :clearly it should print < 1301693995 285013 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :[output] NEVER HAPPENED < 1301694000 799820 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and continues with the statement and the rest of the program < 1301694051 107172 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: clearly you need Feather < 1301694057 181593 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god < 1301694072 167295 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, is CLC-INTERCAL non-Free software too? < 1301694078 726155 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's BSD-licensed, IIRC < 1301694082 604121 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something very similar < 1301694086 379526 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : * 2. Any changes you make must be clearly identified by comments < 1301694086 559898 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : * (example: "this function rewritten by YOUR NAME to change the < 1301694086 723751 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : * way bogons are emitted") < 1301694086 723935 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :--rename.c < 1301694121 435323 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://groups.google.com/group/alt.lang.intercal/browse_thread/thread/669d38f639b60093 ;; uh oh, someone who actually believes that only github has git repositories < 1301694126 107361 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's three-clause BSD with some of the language changed for amusement value < 1301694135 878221 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :thankfully, I read their other thread and it looks like they're insane in the mundane, real-world sense < 1301694149 611226 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A25FRpkbDxU < 1301694160 366335 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :This reminds me of Look Around You for some reason. < 1301694174 494060 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or trolling, except that what's the point in trolling a.l.i? < 1301694181 689995 :cpressey!~cpressey@173-9-215-173-Illinois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net TOPIC #esoteric :ESOTERIC LANGUAGES | An unusually not mephitic forum. | Enjoy being locked in your matrix of solidity. | yoob: http://catseye.tc/lab/yoob/applet.html (+Qdeql +Sceql +SMETANA) | Logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D, http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/ < 1301694185 761704 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: is it meant to be watched with 1911 mode on? < 1301694187 802737 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because this is hilarious < 1301694194 877414 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, always the marketer! < 1301694209 103007 :cpressey!~cpressey@173-9-215-173-Illinois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks like elliott's back < 1301694211 573476 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no, it should be watched so you can understand the SCIENCE? < 1301694211 737649 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: wait, it's April 1, why are you believing him? < 1301694225 281641 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :he might have been sneaky and put Thue and Unlambda in there instead! < 1301694231 371317 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Hmm. Indeed, this forum is indeed not very mephitic. And I *do* feel like escaping my matrix of solidity... aha! The solution to my woes!" < 1301694242 935934 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: surely you've clicked the 1911 in the corner < 1301694253 904084 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have. < 1301694378 162788 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :are things like 1911 mode kept forever? < 1301694389 672033 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, accessible after April 1 via an URL param or whatever? < 1301694413 744168 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, TEXTp wasn't < 1301694415 414824 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think < 1301694418 365328 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :1911 should be, though < 1301694421 139201 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it makes every video better < 1301694434 776087 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it makes it hard to hear the sound, and the picture's a bit flaky < 1301694451 614605 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it makes it impossible to hear the sound, it's muted < 1301694456 432890 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you're joking < 1301694484 790760 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it wasn't so much a joke, as an understatement to make the sentence flow a bit better < 1301694507 34306 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :WOOO I'M ABOUT HALF WAY TO 0.01 BITCOINS < 1301694519 477360 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :this computer is not a very fast compuer. < 1301694521 97204 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*comptuer. < 1301694522 959243 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*computer. < 1301694524 972643 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*HALF-WAY < 1301694527 381141 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't type < 1301694570 146154 :cpressey!~cpressey@173-9-215-173-Illinois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net QUIT :Quit: off to implement another one I suppose < 1301694689 885184 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found LodePNG. It can use C or C++ (just rename the file and the compiler will use C mode or C++ mode). Probably I could remove the parts I don't need. Maybe I could convert the rest to CWEB? Would it work? < 1301694755 426194 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh, /me kills the miner for now, want to do some programming and it's too laggy < 1301694771 720828 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll save it until I have a desktop with a decent GPU < 1301694895 12770 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: is gcc's [index] = foo array thing C99 or GNU C89+? I know you've used it, in DNA Maze < 1301695024 196979 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1301695160 626658 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: C99 < 1301695183 676894 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :register Cell tos asm("al"); < 1301695184 39563 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :register Cell sos asm("ah"); < 1301695185 706020 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wonder if that will work < 1301695214 344304 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, Befunge-93 programs have a hard limit to the number of stack they can use, right? < 1301695218 90473 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*amount of < 1301695223 133159 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because they have a maximum number of cycles < 1301695225 262348 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait, that's not true < 1301695228 40853 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION → sleep < 1301695228 205791 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"1" uses infinite stack < 1301695359 681281 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1301695369 161814 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait, the befunge-93 stack is of 32-bit words < 1301695371 322717 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, ints < 1301695388 834503 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :gah, the x86 is so register starved < 1301695410 995755 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: quick! what's a non-eax general purpose register < 1301695416 539398 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(as in _really_ general purpose :-P) < 1301695588 480688 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1301695636 487877 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, lame, fizzie's ff3 does exactly what mine is going to < 1301695663 430977 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :although it does break the standard < 1301695729 682098 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1301695739 469775 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do I do? < 1301695824 138366 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :save yourself! < 1301695993 802608 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Client Quit < 1301696131 651491 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: threaded code < 1301696137 522043 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, how random is rand()%4? < 1301696139 947176 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott: clock_gettime is used if it exists, IIRC <-- hm if you do that, where do you look for it? On Linux it is in librt.so iirc. On FreeBSD it is in libc.so I think. < 1301696153 192394 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I look for it in autoconf < 1301696161 853551 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think by trying to link it to libc and librt and seeing what happens < 1301696165 352475 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1301696183 809734 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, libc first I presume? Since iirc FreeBSD has librt as well... With different stuff < 1301696193 383720 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1301696198 166175 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I try to link them both at once < 1301696199 805439 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Oh, that; well, yes, sure. Though I think it's even more characterized by the "different instruction implementations for all cardinal deltas" thing. (Though mooz's "bef" did that too.) < 1301696202 350833 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does rand()&3 work? Does it work better, or worse, if there is a difference? < 1301696211 299373 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'm doing that too, after seeing yours :P < 1301696221 325370 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: it should obviously be identical, by the laws of & < 1301696224 79045 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the laws of % < 1301696231 691729 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: it works worse than rand()/(RAND_MAX/4) on old implementations of rand(), and the same as rand()%4, obviously < 1301696237 801811 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You can't have non-cardinal deltas in -93, though. < 1301696238 541559 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :on modern implementations, all should be much the same < 1301696252 815796 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm, in df it seems that the z level counter can go to negative values... range on current map seems to be -17 - 120 < 1301696262 613324 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I "plan" to turn it into a proper ripoff of jitfunge98, though. < 1301696282 591028 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially as modern compilers optimise %4 into &3 always < 1301696290 188435 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : hmm, how random is rand()%4? <-- I would presume it depends on your libc. < 1301696291 320888 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as bitwise AND is faster than integer MODULO < 1301696313 266837 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: typical LCRNGs, the high-order bits are more random than the low-order bits < 1301696314 560521 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :grr @ http://catseye.tc/projects/befunge93/doc/befunge93.html < 1301696326 60119 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah, it's just befunge though, ? should be random enough with rand() :-D < 1301696335 468219 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Yes, such optimizations are helpful when macros are being used. < 1301696338 410951 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Right. I also had a version that macrologized in implementations on all (well, most) possible {stack cell type, playfield element type, another parameter, yet another parameter} option -- so you could select those options on runtime instead of compile-time -- but it grew too large for GCC to handle, I think. < 1301696375 746128 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what I mean is that rand()/(RAND_MAX/4)) is a better implementation than rand()%4 on some systems, and equal on most others < 1301696375 911623 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why do you want to do befunge93? Besides how many fingerprints did you do in your last befunge98 implementation? And did you publish the source anywhere? < 1301696378 512565 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Well, I'd quite like to optimise lines properly, too. But OTOH, proper threaded code JITting should be, you know, as fast as Forth, which is good enough for me. < 1301696382 468765 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and thus generally a better implementation < 1301696386 938208 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Other than that, there is not much advantage over entering those optimizations manually) < 1301696390 786245 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ah < 1301696398 591717 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but, that doesn't have the bitwise-and SPEEEEEEEEED < 1301696399 675605 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1301696404 327121 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially as one is a shift and the other is a bitwise-and, and they're both as fast as each other < 1301696407 299258 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless RAND_MAX is a convenient power of two, and a macro < 1301696411 576367 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or a constant, which I suppose is a given < 1301696415 723392 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, it's a constant < 1301696426 959485 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :still one more instruction < 1301696430 853091 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, you probably want (RAND_MAX+1)/4 < 1301696435 353516 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and allow for integer overflow < 1301696436 848520 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope, macro < 1301696438 92931 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :just checked < 1301696440 362844 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't use the rand() command, I made the program, it has its own random number generator, the Xorshift algorithm. It will do modulo, but if the number is too high it will try again (this rarely happens). < 1301696446 981995 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: >> 28 compared to & 3? < 1301696451 241178 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :same instruction count either way < 1301696465 314841 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1301696473 278422 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1301696490 741415 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :that assumes that RAND_MAX is not a lot smaller than INT_MAX < 1301696553 357117 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: my main innovation, BTW, is to put the TOS into a register, and hopefully the SOS too if I can find another free register < 1301696557 801152 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure whether that will be an optimisation or not < 1301696630 623951 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is this code OK? if(rng_w<=max_uint-(max_uint%limit)) return rng_w%limit; else < 1301696662 681703 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://stackoverflow.com/questions/5508110/why-is-this-program-erroneously-rejected-by-three-c-compilers < 1301696669 293427 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: old < 1301696700 42992 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: How much does stringmode screw with your performance? < 1301696701 257336 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I did that -- well, I mean, I put TOS into a separate variable, which is sort-of analogous -- but didn't manage to make it any better than the simpler stack. < 1301696705 413097 :mtve!~mtve@65.98.99.53 QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1301696718 413234 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sort of analogous except it won't go into a register at all :P < 1301696741 892002 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not think the C standard requires that a compiler supports handwriting recognition. < 1301696748 303512 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: whoosh < 1301696754 628376 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well, that's up to the compiler; certainly it could. < 1301696763 986080 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: But it won't. :p < 1301696785 794132 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I might have tried declaring it as a file-scope register variable too, in which case it definitely will. < 1301696797 994127 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Definitely? I thought gcc likes to ignore register. < 1301696806 159438 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a Befunge-93 benchmark? :-P < 1301696810 309783 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not if you name the register. < 1301696839 955250 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Global register variables reserve registers throughout the program. This may be useful in programs such as programming language interpreters which have a couple of global variables that are accessed very often." < 1301696849 796272 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: REboot < 1301696864 574018 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ghc does it! < 1301696873 315267 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: wat < 1301696883 597430 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :uses global register variables < 1301696888 190102 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yes; you didn't specify you named the register, though. < 1301696890 42351 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: When? :P < 1301696907 925381 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: throughout the last 2-3 years I believe < 1301696918 818274 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: I mean, in which case. < 1301696921 969871 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*cases. < 1301696922 883877 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :always? < 1301696943 408083 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :every time you declare a global? < 1301696951 115533 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, just generally stores some data in dedicated registers that are reserved throughout the runtime of the program < 1301696968 34183 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well, I don't really recall what all I tried, to be honest. Anyhoo, re stringmode, that's not very clever; as a matter of fact, at " it just calls a push_string() function, which isn't even constant-delta parametrized. < 1301697015 330931 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :And re benchmarks, the only thing I've used is the "run life.bef for N seconds, measure the amount of generated output", which is... pretty bad, as far as benchmarks go. < 1301697049 351762 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, does Output Integer output a space after like funge-98? < 1301697051 289998 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also here's what ff2 tried to do: http://p.zem.fi/mf5a.c ... it didn't quite turn out well. < 1301697062 382687 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, there's a space. < 1301697118 148137 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1301697134 167187 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1301697136 862834 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I'll just only support 64-bit processors. < 1301697142 242991 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :For the registers :P < 1301697164 636735 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this for your miniforth? < 1301697179 912597 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :No X-D < 1301697182 152627 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ff3 puts three zeroes underneath the the stack so that it can just do the operation without worrying about the stack, and then fix it up later. (I think it was an optimization in at least some cases.) < 1301697190 75428 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat :'( < 1301697205 140768 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: Feel free to code a compiler for that and maybe I'll start working on it again :P < 1301697205 346109 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :does that mean you've dropped the forth thing or that it's done? < 1301697213 409772 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I shamelessly stole the wrapping thing from mooz, too.) < 1301697221 60692 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Heck, I'm not even bothering to check at all. < 1301697222 856544 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: See above. < 1301697231 630048 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: A compiler would probably be pretty easy, but I'm lazy. < 1301697247 185882 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ff1 used to wrap by having a 256x256 playfield and byte-sized ops, but that's pretty slow since it has a huge playfield to walk around in regular-sized programs.) < 1301697257 54878 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah, "above" is not nearly specific enough for me to look it up < 1301697270 773032 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: olsner: Feel free to code a compiler for that and maybe I'll start working on it again :P < 1301697276 928586 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right after your "wat". < 1301697281 559257 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, for the forth thing < 1301697310 281521 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ugh < 1301697310 465687 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :I might! I don't really know how to do forth though < 1301697326 701965 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: All a compiler has to do is allocate a dictionary entry, and then look words up, and append them with either CALL or RET to the dictionary entry. < 1301697339 449062 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: Well, technically some words have compile-time semantics. But I think colorForth gets around this. < 1301697342 784401 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Oh, it seems that ff3 has a -DUNSAFE_STACK=1 compile-time option for a no-underflow-checking stack too. (Since I generally don't pop from the empty stack myself.) < 1301697347 49912 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So no worries, branches can be handled later :P < 1301697356 549128 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you make it sound like it's trivial - that would imply that you're stupid < 1301697359 511625 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You still break the spec for /. < 1301697363 278174 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: No - it would imply that I'm lazy. < 1301697384 975324 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Now to figure out how to do # without breaking my code structure :P < 1301697391 109999 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I could temporarily overwrite the next command with a nop. < 1301697404 587081 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except figuring out the next command is non-trivial, because my delta functions also interpret. < 1301697405 87711 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that too! < 1301697481 447099 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You mean the "won't ask the user for /0" thing? It's not exactly stated in the http://catseye.tc/projects/befunge93/doc/befunge93.html spec, I don't think. Though I admit it would be the more proper thing to do. < 1301697493 362180 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: It would be SO PROPER < 1301697524 789179 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :gah, the & spec is so vague < 1301697531 810841 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Funge-98 spec says Befunge-93 is supposed to ask the user, but I don't think that quite counts as a specified thing. < 1301697549 378220 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's like C++ spec saying things about what C does. :p < 1301697554 20938 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also also, is there a way to tell gcc to fill the rest of an array initialised with [x] = y constructs with a certain value? < 1301697578 827803 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :For a certain value of 0 that's easy. :p < 1301697596 948066 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, well, it's not 0 :P < 1301697604 894961 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And does ~ reflect on EOF? < 1301697607 115687 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't think there's anything else, unfortunately. < 1301697629 350828 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's not much reflecting going on in the '93 land. < 1301697646 58727 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's ~ do then, push -1? < 1301697652 371441 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I probably do that. < 1301697672 626123 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could test against the reference implementation, of course. < 1301697675 628230 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :LESS BRANCHES, after all. < 1301697681 405896 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although EOF is not guaranteed to be -1. < 1301697813 284856 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: According to some talk page nobody, values on the stack should be a "signed long int". < 1301697817 990465 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :According to the Befunge-93 documentation. < 1301697820 6945 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is, by proxy. < 1301697902 146680 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :LodePNG is written by one guy who also did some things with esolangs too. < 1301698020 772738 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Hunh, what's this with you supporting diagonal deltas? < 1301698049 982742 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ohh, I see what you mean with a fluhfluh for every fluhfluh. < 1301698053 852117 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm doing it the boring way. < 1301698302 549679 :iconmaster!~iconmaste@209.150.235.10 JOIN :#esoteric < 1301698682 150599 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually I do have this benchmark.bef I got from somewhere, but as far as benchmarks go it's alsp pretty poor. Full contents: < 1301698685 261620 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :91+:*-:0`#@ #._ < 1301698730 332568 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(At least it gets nice performance boost from the boundary-tracking wrapping.) < 1301698746 880227 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Sleeptime now.) < 1301699195 936313 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-15-162.tn.glocalnet.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1301699679 10148 :wawawareya!~wareya@cpe-74-70-142-220.nycap.res.rr.com QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1301699699 722934 :wawawareya!~wareya@cpe-74-70-142-220.nycap.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1301700961 472250 :cheater00!~cheater@g228061168.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1301701137 977739 :cheater99!~cheater@e181129094.adsl.alicedsl.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1301701341 593439 :iconmaster!~iconmaste@209.150.235.10 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is enjoying being locked in his matrix of solidity. < 1301701357 105921 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is hating it with a passion < 1301701369 256803 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1301701377 387110 :iconmaster!~iconmaste@209.150.235.10 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It just so.... Solid! < 1301701881 117170 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :iconmaster: Enjoy! < 1301701889 160066 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: What, you wanna be LIQUID? Get outta my house. < 1301701899 953778 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :GASEOUS maybe? NO WAIT: oerjan, FREED in his matrix of PLASMOLOGY. < 1301701901 435525 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :YEAH, RIGHT. < 1301701906 501413 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :...so Emacs Lisp is lexically scoped now. < 1301702107 544389 :iconmaster!~iconmaste@209.150.235.10 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whenever I see (defun ...) in Lisp, I think STOP TAKING THE FUN OUT OF MY SUBROUTINES. < 1301702357 472131 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :iconmaster: Can those kind of things be changed with macros or something like that, so that you can use your own words?