< 1322524948 337394 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-200-237.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not really. < 1322524954 930868 :elliott_!elliott@95.149.243.54 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::'( < 1322525128 874650 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, benchmark it? < 1322525134 734114 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(okay that is a LOT of work I know) < 1322525169 702196 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, anyway I'm pretty sure hypervisor is more expensive than syscall. Or at least as expensive. < 1322525188 139658 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :anything else would greatly surprise me < 1322525456 39843 :elliott_!elliott@95.149.243.54 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1322526170 129909 :kmc!~keegan@c-98-216-51-47.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1322526756 95960 :kmc!~keegan@c-98-216-51-47.hsd1.ma.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1322527765 897663 :elliott_!elliott@95.149.243.54 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1322528449 575983 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1322528449 755176 :elliott_!elliott@95.149.243.54 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1322528876 9072 :SimonRC!~sc@fof.durge.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1322528967 467201 :SimonRC!~sc@fof.durge.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1322530062 382656 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The operating system was "inspired by the literary heritage of Dante Alighieri (particularly the Divine Comedy)"? What kind of sense does that make? I challenge anybody to tell me what it was about Dante's philosophy, politics, writing style or anything else that inspired this operating system." < 1322530704 697967 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi. < 1322530953 347605 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1322531363 986580 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :x86 rings are not unlike the circles of hell < 1322531985 326856 :kmc!~keegan@c-98-216-51-47.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1322532258 668166 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hlep < 1322532268 108496 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: :D < 1322532271 556765 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: one cannot be hlepped < 1322532278 422017 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :sad day < 1322532404 751505 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: but go on < 1322532469 441251 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :sam is crouched behind a desk with two guns pointed at him. he has a tiny revolver with four bullets. he has two guns pointed at him. his girlfriend is tied up with an enemy pointing another gun at her head. save him without a deus ex machina. she can die. < 1322532485 787973 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :but she can't die by brains blowing cuz she has to say stuff before she dies < 1322532584 546495 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uhhh < 1322532592 510007 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can we see sam's character sheet first? < 1322532632 775338 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: shoot the girlfriend, use element of surprise to escape < 1322532657 82909 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :not brains blowing, shoot the heart instead or w/e < 1322532661 907368 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :he wouldn't shoot his girlfriend... < 1322532665 774077 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :or would he... < 1322532667 354266 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm < 1322532667 904262 :kmc!~keegan@c-98-216-51-47.hsd1.ma.comcast.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1322532679 523814 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: that wasn't one of the requirements < 1322532687 180572 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's his girlfriend!!!!! < 1322532690 121378 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :She asks him to shoot her, he shoots her, and escapes < 1322532696 326039 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :There, all criteria met < 1322532705 204991 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: won't be his girlfriend if he dies, will she? < 1322532705 383813 :kmc!~keegan@c-98-216-51-47.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1322532706 992452 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :she's pregnant. why would she ask him to shoot her? < 1322532710 953354 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so he's basically fucked on the girlfriend front, either way < 1322532728 452087 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but he i don't want him to do anything out of character < 1322532745 718705 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: shoot a precisely-aimed bullet at the girlfriend so that her womb bursts open; grab baby and escape < 1322532746 41354 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sam hypnotizes the enemies < 1322532747 531744 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :100% realistic < 1322532755 891032 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :happens all the time < 1322532773 332544 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you're Tarantino, shoot her in the side of the head. < 1322532773 686505 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :happened to me the other week, someone shot me and my baby escaped < 1322532774 517599 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :she's only like 2 mos preggo < 1322532778 222914 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :no baby yet just fetus < 1322532788 771207 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: sam believes that life begins at conception. < 1322532790 106855 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :walking fetus! < 1322532828 721246 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: so what is the uh < 1322532829 699740 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :context here < 1322532839 504143 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :a novel i'm writing? < 1322532862 183813 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :It starts in media res < 1322532890 950147 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: i suggest not getting sam in that situation < 1322532903 447022 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Novels with guns are shitty anyways < 1322532928 226596 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: yeah they should be using uh < 1322532931 727568 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :bows 'n arrows instead < 1322532936 472565 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1322532942 776154 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :archery II: this time it's personal < 1322532946 87284 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's more exciting to have him in that situation < 1322532955 831910 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i have an idea < 1322532962 603552 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION thinks text adventure < 1322532964 742054 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :>look < 1322532969 695203 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cloaks 'n daggers < 1322532972 180673 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: have him start just like < 1322532973 144073 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :dancing < 1322532981 39137 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :he just starts dancing < 1322532983 698422 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the people with guns < 1322532991 418230 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and he does a jig over to his girlfriend < 1322532993 393498 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and kicks her out the window < 1322532995 324935 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then jumps after her < 1322532998 955 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there's a trampoline underneath < 1322532998 489179 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :YES < 1322532999 474361 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so he bounces back up < 1322533001 788739 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and shoots the bad guys < 1322533003 228813 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :lul < 1322533005 960335 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :best < 1322533027 549903 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i forgot about that patio outside! < 1322533058 20742 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :he pulls the deskk drawer out < 1322533071 910960 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :throws its contents at the guy with the girlfriend < 1322533095 291862 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the other dudes will just shoot him... < 1322533117 647264 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Desks are bulletproof, man. < 1322533135 711511 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1322533173 444831 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is a *big* desk < 1322533213 593481 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-206-85.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1322533223 44754 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-200-237.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1322533239 905701 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :so then he jumps over the desk and runs at him with the other dudes shooting at him. but he shields himself with the desk drawer. < 1322533246 792230 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep. it could happen. < 1322533269 480580 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hollywood in writing < 1322533304 696961 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know...its all so cliche :P < 1322533320 189933 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually that sounds more like a John Woo thing < 1322533339 843904 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :so then he gets shot some when they figure out to shoot low... < 1322533366 691833 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then... < 1322533370 216284 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :rocks fall, everyone dies < 1322533377 409480 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sam looks behind him and sees a fire extinguisher. He grabs it and uses it to lay down a smoke screen < 1322533385 635108 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh shit good idea < 1322533452 768414 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not knowing where he is, they start shooting at random and hit each other < 1322533455 543868 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :The end < 1322533513 982588 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, you have two days to finish the novel? < 1322533697 727393 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :this novel is terrible < 1322533905 881904 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't matter if it is terrible < 1322533907 346631 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is fun < 1322536274 970454 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1322536299 153407 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they really need to do an fps crossed with secondlife < 1322536323 392480 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not specifically secondlife but something like that < 1322537196 32415 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1322537225 618715 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1322537231 893242 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Have you used Emscripten? < 1322537926 534104 :kmc!~keegan@c-98-216-51-47.hsd1.ma.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1322538000 443954 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1322538377 329311 :Nisstyre!~yours@infocalypse-net.info QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1322538960 366304 :kmc!~keegan@c-98-216-51-47.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1322539294 161402 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey < 1322539453 323379 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1322539553 296832 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :11 PM is an interesting time to wake up. < 1322539600 611678 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1322539984 788068 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell Vorpal so in one of the earlier missions of Magicka there's this dude that freaks out about goblins and says a bunch of hilarious gibberish; is any of that Swedish? < 1322539985 3210 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1322540484 241866 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Goblins? < 1322540507 903798 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't seem to recall any goblins < 1322540543 741251 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :.. < 1322540548 905294 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you lie. < 1322540584 512566 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :..? < 1322540602 242521 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't say no goblins were ever mentioned, just that I don't remember goblins being mentioned < 1322540615 713332 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :We are talking about Puella Magi Madoka Magica, right? < 1322540617 77830 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does it mean "Note: this does not yield a monad unless the argument monad is commutative. " < 1322540680 183749 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: in the context of what? < 1322540691 92488 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yes of course. < 1322540692 237025 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that thing < 1322540694 374378 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that I don't know of. < 1322540724 486710 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: ListT < 1322540755 989349 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi #esoteric < 1322540765 404830 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :good job sgeo < 1322540768 324685 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, that's just the standard implementation that has that issue, I think? < 1322540776 17195 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I don't understand it either. < 1322540780 622756 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy, hm? < 1322540799 649903 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty sure magicka is a game kallisti plays < 1322540803 551450 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1322540820 162354 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy smart < 1322540941 320896 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: does ListT mean anything other than the "standard implementation"? < 1322540959 324275 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy, "ListT done right"? < 1322541124 796175 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :how should I know < 1322541208 745012 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PART #esoteric :"Leaving" < 1322541211 764763 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1322541220 35971 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is no need to keep referencing/commenting on the past to validate the present and future as a sort of musical emollient for the masses. All artists plunder from everywhere, so did Simon and Garfunkel but to put Fleetfoxes into a neat box of "our generations Simon and Garfunkel" is really missing the point in a major way and quite insulting to FFs. I'm listening carefully to music 30 years, and I've never heard anyt < 1322541227 10569 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :youtube comments are great. < 1322541251 171183 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1322541618 111525 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1322541637 317433 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Ping < 1322541709 665499 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there another kind of ListT? < 1322541756 437293 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Amb :-) < 1322541794 194243 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: pong < 1322541811 777962 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :help I'm too dead to read this code. < 1322541814 201224 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: I thought I had a question, but then I realised that clang almost certainly does -m32, so I lost my question < 1322541852 229556 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I can read cut < 1322541858 161591 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it clears the state list. < 1322541858 379164 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1322541861 108890 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION smart. < 1322542112 523338 :pumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod NICK :copumpkin < 1322542324 896166 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fleet Foxes are so authentic, they use reverb effect on every track < 1322542365 661724 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: true authenticity comes from having reverb right in your SOUL < 1322542450 324636 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin, are you a dual? < 1322542700 30507 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: elliott: lolwhat < 1322543269 637124 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, kallisti: UPDATE < 1322543305 741114 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool < 1322543567 710871 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-31-252.dhcp.embarqhsd.net NICK :MSleep < 1322544033 754337 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322544872 290354 :TheJimmyJames1!~TheJimmyJ@124.240.124.158 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322545634 624389 :kmc!~keegan@c-98-216-51-47.hsd1.ma.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1322545970 25408 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :What should a function be called: BarrierT f b m t -> BarrierT (f, b -> BarrierT f b m t) (BarrierT f b m t) m t and Barrier f b t -> Barrier (f, b -> Barrier f b t) (Barrier f b t) t < 1322546130 515465 :kmc!~keegan@c-98-216-51-47.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1322546546 961697 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1322546759 317926 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1322546973 565941 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell Gregor pachelbel < 1322546973 915847 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1322547119 886231 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1322547277 397875 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know what such functions and there inverse would be called? I don't know. < 1322547344 11702 :TheJimmyJames1!~TheJimmyJ@124.240.124.158 QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1322547780 810082 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf my dns is broken < 1322547781 518388 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You have 1 new message. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read it. < 1322547830 827847 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :The DNS breaks sometimes in my computer, and then later it is fixed. < 1322547857 647977 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: I don't remember which part you refer to. But in general the voiced over dialogue is mostly made up language with some English and Swedish words thrown in. < 1322547870 809327 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb going to restart my bouncer < 1322547878 664216 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's dns is broken for most other networks < 1322547881 827524 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(wtf...) < 1322547886 195805 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster QUIT :Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net < 1322547924 446966 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1322547957 947183 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually it is routing to half the internet that is broken < 1322548030 996577 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf ping works but connecting does not? < 1322548036 287920 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and nor does traceroute < 1322548066 57146 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster QUIT :Client Quit < 1322548102 614212 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1322548135 637715 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually not that either. Everything works fine from my laptop... < 1322548155 91206 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know?????? < 1322548203 57253 :kmc!~keegan@c-98-216-51-47.hsd1.ma.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1322548266 754200 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you have any suggestions of the names of the functions I have described? < 1322548503 506465 :kmc!~keegan@c-98-216-51-47.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1322548542 877345 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster QUIT :Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net < 1322548577 457827 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1322548696 300531 :TheJimmyJames!~TheJimmyJ@124.240.125.119 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322549084 413783 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322549198 164969 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi oerjan < 1322549270 388228 :TheJimmyJames!~TheJimmyJ@124.240.125.119 QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1322549367 850961 :TheJimmyJames!~TheJimmyJ@124.240.124.158 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322549373 533214 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :dammit why must the godel's letter comment feed be limited to 10 comments < 1322549399 463700 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :goedel's letter. not goedel's last letter. not goedel's first letter < 1322549399 937293 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :just < 1322549401 397018 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :goedel's letter < 1322549414 367129 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*+lost < 1322549438 585287 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :every time the two MrX and Pelotom trolls and counter-trolls post i lose messages and end up hunting around recent posts < 1322549823 817940 :augur_!~augur@208.58.5.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322549874 955225 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1322549898 967623 :TheJimmyJames!~TheJimmyJ@124.240.124.158 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1322549901 927562 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1322549946 469580 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone tried to answer my questions but seems as they did not understand this question. Did you even understand that? < 1322550180 442544 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do any NSF music files use the track numbers to specify different variations (such as repeat vs non-repeat, equal temperament vs just intonation, etc) instead of another song? < 1322550358 965176 :Jafet!~Jafet@149.171.110.44 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322550362 313608 :Jafet!~Jafet@149.171.110.44 QUIT :Changing host < 1322550362 492505 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet JOIN :#esoteric < 1322550779 284533 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION braces for embarrasment by commenting on the issue on the blog again. < 1322550821 936205 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(as in "why don't you just do this" embarassment) < 1322551107 431907 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*+s < 1322551334 83429 :kmc!~keegan@c-98-216-51-47.hsd1.ma.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1322551747 892571 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1322552150 88568 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm < 1322552153 594898 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need a new username for things. < 1322552165 565117 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :bad_apple < 1322552175 442285 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: one must never be afraid of embarassment < 1322552182 276766 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :O KAY < 1322552187 622717 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :WE ARE ALL FOOLS < 1322552194 375761 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is foolish to pretend you are not. < 1322552195 975689 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :one should also learn to fly by flapping one's arms. < 1322552206 94438 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, no... < 1322552228 404245 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: why not? it's approximately as easy. < 1322552241 545031 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_F9RJSPnf8A < 1322552243 761090 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because this is better. < 1322552505 630803 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster QUIT :Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net < 1322552510 9855 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not flying, that's falling with style. < 1322552541 524202 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1322552543 319469 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1322552606 822386 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I want to do this, but I know I'd just crash into some rocks < 1322552670 448083 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :. The United States Parachute Association (USPA) requires in the Skydivers Information Manual that any jumper flying a wingsuit for the first time have a minimum of 200 freefall skydives, made within the past 18 months, and receive one-on-one instruction from an experienced wing suit jumper, or 500 jumps experience to go without an instructor.[16] Requirements in other nations are similar. Wingsuit manufacturers offer train < 1322552757 269279 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@cl-394.sto-01.se.sixxs.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1322552761 745776 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@cl-394.sto-01.se.sixxs.net QUIT :Changing host < 1322552761 924928 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1322552803 378205 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ 0.585378] pci_root PNP0A08:00: address space collision: host bridge window [mem 0x000c8000-0x000dffff] conflicts with Video ROM [mem 0x000c0000-0x000cffff] < 1322552804 512484 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :gnh < 1322553124 804955 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I want to jump off a skyscraper in one of those wingsuits < 1322553136 751369 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then follow.... a carefully planned route so I doubt crash into anything. < 1322553177 451078 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd be worried about turbulence. < 1322553198 700100 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, if there were any chance of getting beyond my immense fear of heights, that is. < 1322553216 360613 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I'd be worried about a stray gust of wind. < 1322553221 849748 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably they only fly when there's no wind? < 1322553253 78167 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought that was more or less the same thing. < 1322553273 797620 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :turbulence is a more abrupt change < 1322553275 628591 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :in most contexts < 1322553283 339003 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :These techniques include the orientation relative to the aircraft and the airflow while exiting, and the way in which the flier will spread his legs and arms at the proper time so as not to hit the aircraft or become unstable in the relative wind. < 1322553291 957546 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yeah, they could just decrease surface area if they need to < 1322553348 567240 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.pbfcomics.com/28/ < 1322553454 623503 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :With body shape manipulation and by choosing the design characteristics of the wingsuit, a flier can alter both his forward speed and fall rate. The pilot manipulates these flight characteristics by changing the shape of his torso, arching or bending at the shoulders, hips, and knees, and by changing the angle of attack in which the wingsuit flies in the relative wind, and by the amount of tension applied to the fabric wing < 1322553460 753052 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how they like < 1322553463 180616 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :make themselves rotate. < 1322553516 398851 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :While still very experimental, powered wingsuits, often using small jet engines strapped to the feet[13] or a wingpack set-up, allow for even greater horizontal travel and even ascent. < 1322553520 281211 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1322553520 894119 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster QUIT :Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net < 1322553560 833163 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :The proper term is "holy wtf batman". < 1322553566 546193 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1322553732 58822 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1322553929 990918 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :to the batwingsuit < 1322554072 854226 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h4arnATc04U < 1322554074 489353 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is so good < 1322554172 402735 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: I bet being in the jet is more comfortable :P < 1322554211 473152 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :also those jets are flying rather slowly (for jets that is) < 1322554233 890407 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, yeah... < 1322554362 457510 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :still his power to weight ratio is going to be pretty high because... well it's just a carbon-fiber wingspan and a person. < 1322554383 440471 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :he just lacks much fuel I'd imagine. < 1322554451 236086 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: and the human body can only take so much... < 1322554486 384330 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :wrt air speed and so on < 1322554823 537089 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION watches a man fly over the English Channel in a JETPACK < 1322554876 187842 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :personally it is not how I would chose to commute < 1322554933 373760 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's because you're boring. < 1322555128 883345 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: got a link to the video though? < 1322555174 663958 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1322555201 222327 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not as interesting as the grand canyon vid < 1322555262 189467 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WgdIE2t8QkM < 1322555422 826628 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :he does some neat stunts in that one. < 1322555924 637293 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: obviously you don't do stunts when commuting :P < 1322556052 882315 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION zzzzzzs < 1322556075 285260 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: creeper with dyslexia? < 1322556087 821364 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat? < 1322556091 104129 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: that sound < 1322556105 894486 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat? < 1322556117 266132 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like a thing < 1322556119 691550 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that indicates sleeping < 1322556121 786451 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: you never played minecraft? < 1322556133 804038 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :.. < 1322556138 802943 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh < 1322556139 111178 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1322556141 642693 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: oh < 1322556141 822425 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have better things to do < 1322556143 810607 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1322556146 650436 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :come on it is fun < 1322556157 495759 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I disagree. < 1322556163 492070 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: have you tried it? < 1322556171 374967 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I don't mean the free classic version < 1322556171 561168 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've seen people play it. < 1322556177 925267 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I actually have a pretty good imagination < 1322556178 912600 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so like < 1322556181 882818 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can imagine playing it < 1322556183 766007 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :without even having to < 1322556185 830069 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the neatest thing. < 1322556190 617915 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: well at least it isn't like starcraft. I watched people play that. Seems utterly boring. < 1322556199 386836 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...that is where you are wrong. < 1322556209 476230 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :starcraft is like real-time chess on crack. < 1322556218 463156 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: which is utterly boring < 1322556260 616410 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: I tried many RTS, but so far I only found one fun to play: darwinia. < 1322556281 2162 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbwG63KVQz4 < 1322556284 527083 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :this game is good. < 1322556301 200222 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: is there any jargon in it? < 1322556312 431655 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe. < 1322556319 78318 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but Husky is pretty good at explaining what is happening < 1322556320 533598 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you like < 1322556324 350741 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :know starcraft basics < 1322556334 598473 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really < 1322556347 805217 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :he says "macro" < 1322556351 603455 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which isn't really very jargony < 1322556359 203358 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: meaning like autohotkey? < 1322556362 883162 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no. < 1322556364 913944 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :macromanagement < 1322556367 229469 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see < 1322556373 502433 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it refers to how you produce and spend money. < 1322556374 802520 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :your economy. < 1322556376 952805 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :unit production < 1322556377 770665 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc < 1322556395 513768 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: he has an annoying voice IMO < 1322556407 444111 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :when you expand to new bases, when you research new tech, and what units you produce... are basically the three important points of macro. < 1322556411 738294 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway I need to leave for university soon, won't be able to watch the whole thing now < 1322556413 505124 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you get used to it :P < 1322556442 175765 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's also "micro" which is micromanagement... which is movement of individual units / multitasking < 1322556463 298272 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know about micromanagement. I played dwarf fortress. Which is not exactly RTS. Still fun though. < 1322556468 453959 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: ever played dwarf fortress? < 1322556475 114310 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1322556477 688585 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's fun. < 1322556479 575784 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1322556485 332505 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: micro has a more specific meaning than it's usual meaning. < 1322556486 894647 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :in sc2 < 1322556489 955906 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see < 1322556574 633567 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: anyway, I prefer sandbox games. Like minecraft and dwarf fortress. < 1322556577 597543 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :or RPGs < 1322556586 987072 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :open world RPGs are especially fun < 1322556597 25821 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :me too, I just don't like minecraft because it's not a fun game. :P < 1322556613 93234 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I also like strategy/competitive real-time games < 1322556617 206973 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: it sure is. Sure the combat is meh. I prefer creative. < 1322556631 786287 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :some FPSes, super smash bros, magicka, starcraft, < 1322556646 94325 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I kind of suck at aiming at moving objects :P < 1322556654 609349 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm okay with stealth based FPS < 1322556659 828886 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :like deus ex < 1322556666 107068 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :my favorite FPS game is zombies mod in CoD actually. don't really like the multiplayer but the zombies mode is very fun. < 1322556675 73082 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :*mode < 1322556675 909091 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1322556718 903168 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :my max round is 32 on the kino der toten map < 1322556722 339304 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :solo < 1322556728 671347 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: The only FPSes I found fun to play are ones that are RPG-FPS mixes really. Like Deus Ex Human Revolution. Or Fallout New Vegas (haven't played Fallout 3) < 1322556744 134490 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :opposite for me on the fallout stuffs < 1322556748 145776 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I played fallout 3 < 1322556756 632212 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, the mechanics are pretty similar < 1322556761 952483 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :just different setting and story < 1322556766 609627 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've seen it. < 1322556776 445929 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the mechanics are a little different also. they changed some skills around. < 1322556783 702354 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1322556787 710594 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the crafting stuff < 1322556789 935433 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :the VATS system is interesting < 1322556798 154958 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the vats system is boring. :( < 1322556807 647985 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1322556810 489819 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I disagree < 1322556812 610369 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :but whatever < 1322556815 819229 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially with all the vats-related perks. < 1322556820 878920 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1322556832 123639 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you basically just vats everything and..... continue vatsing everything < 1322556832 654147 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway I need to leave. Cya < 1322556836 205387 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :mmk < 1322556837 380902 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: actually no < 1322556855 276222 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: VATS isn't realistic for sniper rifle over long distance at a large unmoving target < 1322556864 11531 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :VATS underestimate the chance to hit then < 1322556865 253863 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl < 1322556877 478688 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh... kAY? :p BYE < 1322556917 166147 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :The chance to hit depends on your screen resolution, too < 1322557015 565205 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :UNFAIR! < 1322557018 317633 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :.. < 1322557063 898988 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the bullets are instantaneous rays anyway, so it doesn't matter if they're moving < 1322557085 68725 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I don't think vats is based on your screen res. < 1322557102 669819 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, but manual aiming can be < 1322557117 511011 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you max out your character so that there's no sway < 1322557138 591856 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :HD TVS ARE OVERPOWERED. QQ < 1322557150 95771 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh, they have only HD resolution. < 1322557162 653682 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nothing on my 2560x1440 < 1322557204 339314 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm, did Bethesda really use the same game engine for four games? < 1322557218 59924 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :That just feels like they pulled something on the world < 1322557266 893027 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey QUIT :Quit: The Other Game < 1322557383 470395 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: sort of. < 1322557395 153822 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: they used a new AI for the NPCs in skyrim < 1322557403 91682 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm sure there have been improvements. < 1322557411 366670 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shiny rocks < 1322557424 682757 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :graphics, yes. shiny interfaces. < 1322557474 682799 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and, uh, giant fucking worlds filled with towns, caves, dungeons, random encounters, every NPC having voice-overs, multiple options for quests, etc. < 1322557495 334509 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :The new AI isn't any more believable than the Oblivion ones, though < 1322557497 679588 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not like they're getting away with anything. < 1322557502 847642 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the NPC animations doing the most of the work < 1322557504 654266 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: well yeah, but it's new nonetheless < 1322557530 23770 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing was pulled, I think. I believe they've put plenty of work into each game. < 1322557532 798958 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :The NPCs tilting their heads actually goes a long way to create realism < 1322557544 997600 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's better than before, certainly < 1322557594 971395 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, when you set out to create a game on the scale that Bethesda does, you normally wouldn't want to release it in a rough, bug-ridden state like Bethesda does. < 1322557731 713513 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1322558011 834629 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1322558013 963512 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :skyrim < 1322558017 416385 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah < 1322558054 834007 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :that reminded me of my second pc which runs the game constantly for 3 days < 1322558886 727059 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell elliott amb is interesting. It does something similar to what I have in mind for my graph language, except that in the graph language it will be implicit to every change of state. < 1322558886 909406 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1322558940 756830 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdabot - the Siri of IRC < 1322559039 702486 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell kallisti to stop using @tell < 1322559039 902172 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can tell yourself! < 1322559045 123141 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdabot: thanks < 1322559550 838940 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1322559561 984679 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION checks out Oz to see how it efficiently does constraint programming. < 1322559731 133736 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not really sure if any of this is relevant though < 1322560255 682250 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but basically the syntax would look something like.... < 1322560281 49249 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :constraint { node -> replacement; node -> replacement; ... } < 1322560291 149598 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the symbols can be changed later if desired. < 1322560381 24355 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if the same node is replaced by two rules then this essentially creates two nodes with past edges that point back to the original node. < 1322560396 996972 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :a sort of non-deterministic split. < 1322560461 6700 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, the somewhat annoying problem of determining the order of execution of graph rewriting rules < 1322560464 602069 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :is.. no longer a problem. < 1322560636 675524 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I guess I should start working on a) what constraints look like b) how to define predicates to use in constraints c) how to define functions in general d) some built-in operations e) how to refer to nodes < 1322560649 788065 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess the constraint would have variables... so like < 1322560674 706832 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :X > 2 { X -> X+1 } < 1322560709 984680 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :X here refers to any node. if a node satisfied the constraint, then it's replaced by the node that's produced from adding one to the node's value. < 1322560821 88221 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :X > Y { X -> null } < 1322560827 292780 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :this would delete every node but the smallest. < 1322560881 79949 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(delete is kind of the incorrect word, as you can still backtrack) < 1322561167 694212 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net QUIT :Quit: hello < 1322561175 112121 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: hello < 1322561204 988921 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I also want things like.... < 1322561220 171769 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :X > Y { X -> past(X) } < 1322561230 691956 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-4d0b7a53.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1322561262 841674 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which would replace X with a past node of itself. since there could possibly be more than one past node this is non-deterministic. < 1322561287 334264 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm okay I could just have sets. < 1322561298 751687 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :X > Y { X -> [X, X+1] } < 1322561323 623749 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :replace all non-minimum nodes with both itself and itself plus 1 < 1322561342 980718 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then have a | which applys constraints to sets. < 1322561420 626904 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :something like... < 1322561467 201574 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :X > Y { X -> e in past(X) | e = e^2 } < 1322561541 936717 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or.... < 1322561607 118900 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :X > Y { X -> a,b in past(X) | distance(X,a) > distance(X, b) } < 1322561617 840059 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :to revert to the most recent past node. < 1322561695 817859 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :minimum(X) := a,b in X | distance(X, a) > distance(X, b) < 1322561722 862592 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :X > Y { X -> minimum(past(X)) } < 1322561734 240328 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :er... < 1322561734 743700 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1322561735 878420 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1322561746 211698 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't work :P < 1322561766 731077 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need something like... < 1322561797 570153 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :minimum(X) := b where a,b in X | distance(X, a) > distance(X, b) < 1322561816 648853 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(will improve the syntax of these things at some point) < 1322562055 137856 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let x = [1..5] in [b | a <- x, b <- x, a > b] < 1322562055 660435 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [1,1,2,1,2,3,1,2,3,4] < 1322562059 342004 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1322562098 319803 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoa < 1322562261 133117 :azaq23!str1442@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322562277 111514 :azaq23!str1442@unaffiliated/azaq23 QUIT :Max SendQ exceeded < 1322562430 37574 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1322562570 62884 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322562638 200977 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1322563257 221980 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let x = [1..5] in [b | let s = join(liftA2(,))x, (a,b) <- s, a > b] < 1322563258 63511 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [1,1,2,1,2,3,1,2,3,4] < 1322563260 777508 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1322563273 196300 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :same thing. < 1322563321 819560 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :> concat . init . inits $ [1..5] < 1322563323 850484 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [1,1,2,1,2,3,1,2,3,4] < 1322563374 681341 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, weren't you going to sleep?... < 1322563452 2224 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t init < 1322563452 971797 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: You have 4 new messages. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read them. < 1322563453 159235 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. [a] -> [a] < 1322563457 595271 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, hello < 1322563459 874196 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1322563463 295844 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no < 1322563469 775302 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> init [1,2,3,4,5] < 1322563470 798724 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [1,2,3,4] < 1322563472 895312 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :backwards tail? < 1322563477 792566 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, pretty sure you said like "zzzzzs" or something < 1322563477 979973 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was actually zzzzzing because you were putting me to sleep. :P < 1322563482 5481 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, oh < 1322563490 257977 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ha ha ha < 1322563524 334880 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm that is some interesting xmas decoration in the window to the robotics lab here at university < 1322563535 49518 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway how do you implement minimum on a set without doing something like a fold < 1322563552 455456 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: well, you could do an associative fold < 1322563557 464492 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which isn't the same as foldl or foldr < 1322563563 675075 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you might still consider it as being like a fold < 1322563582 114544 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically LEDs mounted on a fan, rotating. The LEDs are synced to the rotation so they spell out a word < 1322563587 176634 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :gnh, did that get through? Just lost wlan for a bit < 1322563589 166076 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :("God Jul", Swedish for "Merry Christmas") < 1322563608 684839 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck microwave ovens. < 1322563611 996383 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or I guess actually what I'm asking < 1322563614 721066 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :they mess up wlan badly < 1322563628 901743 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :is how do you use universal quantification to get the minimum of a set. < 1322563639 150283 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh... < 1322563640 123529 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :duh < 1322563663 198413 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :exists a. forall b. a < b < 1322563666 731283 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm and the time too < 1322563668 417739 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the fan < 1322563700 647864 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm my mother seems to be under the impression that second-hand hookah vapor is somehow going to be bad for her because she has asthma. < 1322563707 607231 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which I think is probably not true. < 1322563975 277856 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I'm on the other side of the house < 1322566895 479547 :ais523_!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322566919 900502 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Disconnected by services < 1322566921 37714 :ais523_!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 NICK :ais523 < 1322566925 560694 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :X just exited for no obvious reason… < 1322567056 380356 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I love when that happens. < 1322567232 984427 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, there's garbage on tty2 < 1322567305 160904 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: data has feelings too. just because no one's using it doesn't mean it's not data. < 1322567319 429522 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :garbage is insulting to those poor bits. :( < 1322567332 743346 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*desert login: 1*41*41*41*41*4Password: HHHHHHHHHHHPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPHHHHQQQQQPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPUbuntu 10.04.3 LTS desert tty2 < 1322567334 233023 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric : desert login: < 1322567343 341076 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(note: that isn't actually my password) < 1322567349 945307 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :good password < 1322567475 485083 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(nor my username) < 1322569342 225696 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1322570227 948783 :augur_!~augur@208.58.5.87 NICK :augur[afk] < 1322570664 42394 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1322570790 958742 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-46-232.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1322570791 155884 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-46-232.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Changing host < 1322570791 156071 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1322570847 831929 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322570851 998060 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322570889 851488 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1322570972 895469 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :can anyone explain why you would said "pairwise distinct" instead of "all elements are unique" < 1322571062 743575 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Excess Flood < 1322571160 545432 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322571663 419322 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the hell < 1322571667 115352 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :about a week ago < 1322571685 707520 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was commenting on how warm it is in November < 1322571687 7702 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and today < 1322571688 153669 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's snowing. < 1322571721 371752 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't even think it's below freezing. no, it's not. < 1322572239 791363 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :eräässä kapakassa ja vakioasiakas ehdotti hänelle < 1322572559 879232 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1322572734 456327 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: don't pretend you're not American. < 1322572759 810902 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://s3.amazonaws.com/data.tumblr.com/tumblr_l99k91VcPO1qdpbleo1_1280.jpg?AWSAccessKeyId=AKIAJ6IHWSU3BX3X7X3Q&Expires=1322659120&Signature=ZADFaT4zuI5XQjZSiuliUVob0VQ%3D < 1322572804 483131 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, this must be what Sweet Bro and Hella Jeff is parodying. < 1322572816 132859 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322573076 395512 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/askscience/comments/mt83n/dear_sociologists_why_do_black_people_not_enjoy/ < 1322573077 186352 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You have 9 new messages. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read them. < 1322573078 563275 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :This, wow. < 1322573196 239673 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1322573245 708463 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au QUIT :Quit: MSN: Patashu@hotmail.com , Gmail: Patashu0@gmail.com , AIM: Patashu0 , YIM: patashu2 , Skype: patashu0 . < 1322573252 84378 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell elliott why why why this was a good day < 1322573252 662288 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1322573297 611807 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: you're so popular. < 1322573495 61546 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting, so pistachio seeds actually split open like that because of artificial selection. < 1322573952 95728 :nooga!~nooga@c35-253.icpnet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1322575879 829390 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pics.kuvaton.com/kuvei/there_is_no_censorship_in_us.jpg < 1322576528 912324 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, that's a significantly more complex thing than straight "censorship". < 1322576819 378096 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes I agree. < 1322576852 271593 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems to strange to me that for some reason the US needs different information/stuff from the rest of the world. < 1322576893 562664 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'll mainly be a combination of culture, world prominence and the size of the market. < 1322577049 454654 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se QUIT :*.net *.split < 1322577407 312600 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1322578138 555092 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322578787 936368 :Zuu!~zuu@unaffiliated/zuu QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1322578911 155159 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1322579033 232984 :Zuu!~zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1322579857 904874 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.dalnefre.com/wp/2011/11/fexpr-the-ultimate-lambda/ < 1322579867 202158 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :This looks exceptionally stupid from a cursory glance. < 1322579884 734793 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Application of a Lambda causes evaluation of its operands, producing arguments which are combined as specified by a body expression." < 1322579896 888234 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, yes it is. < 1322579982 322313 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't make sense to me. < 1322579984 933736 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :producing arguments? < 1322579999 860950 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1322580012 80182 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...that's... stupid. < 1322580048 842951 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It appears he's reinvented lazily-evaluated lambdas. < 1322580227 766115 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"application of a lambda causes evaluation of its operands" sounds pretty unlazy to me. < 1322580741 585561 :mrgaddy!~user@217.118.90.134 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322580796 656381 :mrgaddy!~user@217.118.90.134 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello to all esoterics! < 1322580834 462217 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? welcome < 1322580842 73729 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page < 1322580952 367073 :mrgaddy!~user@217.118.90.134 QUIT :Client Quit < 1322581000 285501 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Another neopagan sent packing. < 1322581140 291929 :MSleep!~fyrc@or-67-238-31-252.dhcp.embarqhsd.net NICK :MDude < 1322581223 782932 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1322581248 282086 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1322581439 355853 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: sometimes I wish we were a joint channel between neopagans and amateur language designers. < 1322581458 294904 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, oklopol's a professional language designer. < 1322581507 363269 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess Gregor kind of is too? < 1322581508 669142 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, no < 1322581519 319855 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless he wrote a paper about Plof? < 1322582568 221765 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-206-85.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1322582577 747558 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-147-58.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1322582717 565549 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1322583874 345216 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1322584010 953335 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :!perl print "\n" =~ /\s/ < 1322584013 420783 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 < 1322584017 41084 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :whew. sanity. < 1322584173 80697 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott TOPIC #esoteric :The IOCCC is back on! http://www.ioccc.org | http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/ < 1322584181 739580 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION now proceeds to find out why oerjan did that. < 1322584181 927498 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You have 2 new messages. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read them. < 1322584406 952353 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :!perl my $x = "hi hi ho hi"; while ($x =~ /hi/g) {print $&} < 1322584407 484065 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :hihihi < 1322584413 403601 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :whew. sanity. < 1322584418 61118 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes I have to check when I'm writing perl. < 1322584464 139046 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't loss of sanity the standard perl coding state < 1322584482 993803 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1322584497 27873 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually it's the loss of sanity that makes me check all of these dumb things. < 1322584515 800070 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION cannot remember like 3 million special cases of stuff all the time. < 1322584630 715855 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu NICK :sebbu < 1322585090 271874 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn58-57.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wasn't accepted in stacs :( < 1322585109 892797 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh noklopol? < 1322585151 304291 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn58-57.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you look at accepted papers in http://stacs2012.lip6.fr/, you'll see why < 1322585153 248133 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn58-57.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are idiots. < 1322585188 396090 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol is dum lol < 1322585641 903024 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322586232 490296 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1322586356 214486 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: here? if you're reading this live and not logreading, here's a hilariously breakage of a phpBB webforum: http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=14360&start=50 < 1322586360 716063 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :everyone's panicking, obviously < 1322586373 545625 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(creating new posts works, incidentally, it's just that all existing information seems to be badly messed up) < 1322586374 859602 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1322586381 986037 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha < 1322586389 351067 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my favourite bit is the "Jump to" box at the bottom < 1322586395 542311 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake JOIN :#esoteric < 1322586403 161043 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and half the pages fail with an internal error, the others are like that < 1322586424 845899 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION was vaguely considering playing on MS once < 1322586430 655623 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not sure I have the patience though < 1322586439 258493 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're not sure, you don't < 1322586467 694194 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: as a bonus, none of the site admins are online, but one of the art people is, and tried to fix the problem by changing the default style to be one that they were working on as a joke < 1322586478 571025 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or at least, that had amsuing placeholder graphics in) < 1322586482 445306 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1322586490 275293 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so everyone assumed that it was some sort of hack attempt < 1322586496 602327 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(they changed it back after it was clear that it did nothing useful) < 1322586509 223952 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but now everyone is blaming the tigers < 1322586521 781583 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, where can you see what anyone is actually saying? < 1322586533 529208 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, is there an IRC channel? < 1322586548 487340 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: any thread which was created after this happened < 1322586549 828594 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=19711 < 1322586563 443390 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1322586587 559052 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I /might/ actually end up using the state variable declaration in PErl < 1322586587 756516 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :for my IRC bot < 1322586733 600430 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: any idea of what could cause that sort of breakage? < 1322586740 853572 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems to be some sort of systematic corruption < 1322586850 92582 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1322586865 527099 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1322586870 94810 :kallisti!~eris@h129.0.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1322586870 521793 :kallisti!~eris@h129.0.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net QUIT :Changing host < 1322586870 714473 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake JOIN :#esoteric < 1322586936 558908 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hmm, reordering of table columns? < 1322586941 844686 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or inserting a new one in the wrong place < 1322586953 616058 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :@help < 1322586954 222541 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :help . Ask for help for . Try 'list' for all commands < 1322586956 426601 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :@help help < 1322586957 74924 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :help . Ask for help for . Try 'list' for all commands < 1322586964 694946 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps, but it pretty clearly involves more than one table with any sensible architecture < 1322586969 597467 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. everyone's showing as having joined on the epoch < 1322586977 333429 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :weird < 1322586990 355343 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'm not assuming that phpBB's arch is sensible, but I don't think it'd be /that/ crazy) < 1322586996 260244 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Who the Eff are you and how did you join in 1969" < 1322587010 37900 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, unless join dates are calculated from the posts table < 1322587019 768453 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: they're not < 1322587027 379391 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know a /very slight/ amoutn about phpBB < 1322587033 101368 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :good to know < 1322587040 238743 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's definitely an index on (user, thread, date) < 1322587043 612307 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the posts table < 1322587059 136089 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it wouldn't be impossible to assume there's one on (user, date) too; it'd just be wrong < 1322587175 373890 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, join date can't be calculated from date of first post < 1322587187 176408 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that's what I meant by "wrong" < 1322587196 234297 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, everyone's avatar vanished too < 1322587209 470588 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but changing avatars worked and put them back to normal, or alternatively tiger-themed) < 1322587214 806246 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that can't be related to the posts table, surely < 1322587237 556644 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, IIRC avatar info is stored in a table, just not the files themselves < 1322587265 265814 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, but it wouldn't be the same table as posts unless the database was normalized in a really crazy way < 1322587277 152931 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :typically, changing avatar changes it on all posts, you don't want to go back over all the posts and update it by hand < 1322587289 617877 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus, it's stored in a separate table, almost certainly < 1322587290 403572 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1322587295 950728 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it's stored in the user table < 1322587311 101980 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1322587325 355161 :kallisti!~eris@h211.44.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1322587325 652474 :kallisti!~eris@h211.44.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net QUIT :Changing host < 1322587325 846497 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake JOIN :#esoteric < 1322587335 387449 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :help I'm in wlan limbo < 1322587364 928017 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The tigers are unrelated to the problem at hand." < 1322587407 336264 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: this xalxe person sure does post a lot < 1322587413 324479 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I wonder how long "pretentious hipster" has been cool. < 1322587424 24642 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: he's not a top poster site-wide, he's just interested in the whole tigers incident < 1322587424 345624 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least since like the 50s right? < 1322587435 274228 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tiger Incident(tm) < 1322587472 262111 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it has to be called something < 1322587483 872419 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the blognomic dynasty is still going? < 1322587498 584102 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's the one after the one that started during the Agoran invasion < 1322587503 316100 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, I know < 1322587510 309333 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the last one was very short < 1322587514 998271 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this one seems a more usual length < 1322587515 722307 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's been on this one the last like ten times i've checked :P < 1322587519 631360 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although it's in need of a win condition < 1322587540 666192 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know what would be awesome < 1322587542 405164 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: btw, I realised that Braid's time travel model is a superset of Feather's; e.g. the first puzzle in world 3 is pretty much exactly a <<= operation, giving the key to the player < 1322587549 591099 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1322587558 264185 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and world 2 should serve as a big demonstration of why timeloops are so easy to make by mistake in Feather < 1322587566 17621 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :little balls of soft pretzel, filled with mozzarella. one day I shall make that. < 1322587570 159974 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's actually a good visualisation tool < 1322587580 926216 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :has it solved any feather problems yet? < 1322587586 962375 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, I don't think so < 1322587600 565374 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in Braid, things can just have a glowy green outline and be outside the usual flow of time < 1322587606 419909 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's like the Feather version of unsafePerformIO < 1322587608 895345 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheating! < 1322587613 579475 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :did someone say feather < 1322587618 994646 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you play the game without that? < 1322587640 305072 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't cause things to do that; some puzzles (all in world 3, and many elsewhere) have them naturally on the map, thouhg < 1322587641 621531 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*though < 1322587676 552578 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :each world has its own gimmick (apart from 2, whose gimmick is not having a gimmick) < 1322587686 279775 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, the worlds are numbered starting from 2; it's an effect of the pretentiousness < 1322587687 783763 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :2 is first < 1322587706 16956 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the end is 1, right? < 1322587723 966064 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1322587741 878710 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, or beginning depending on how you look at it, the game's plot is time-reversed (probably inevitably) < 1322587775 9480 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's the level you play last < 1322587785 146452 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: a video title on YouTube you might find amusing: "55 Bugs in 3 Minutes (Minecraft 1.0.0)" < 1322587796 813287 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1322587805 321820 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it single-segment, or IL? < 1322587814 986231 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1322587837 141449 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :are there discontinuities in the action, like saving and then loading elsewhere, or cutting with things done during the cut? < 1322587866 640159 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(if it repeatedly saves and loads in the same place, it's segmented, but that seems really unlikely for that sort of video) < 1322587883 658346 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, there's a cut after every bug < 1322587891 647178 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :demonstrating them all with one large contraption would be... impressive < 1322587930 757482 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :single-segments are much more impressive than ILs for that reason < 1322587934 173993 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Project for Pyralspite? < 1322587936 326141 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"in single player, arrows don't affect a pressure plate until a particle effect intersects the pressure plate" < 1322587952 978736 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although ILs are generally much faster, to make up for it < 1322587957 676533 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :still can't get over how unlikely that bug is < 1322587958 519626 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That bug still amazes me. < 1322587986 259544 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: (What is that terminology from? TASes?) < 1322587987 796361 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Boosters, I can get. Water ladders, I can get. Boatvators, I can get. But that? < 1322587994 615117 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: unassisted speedruns < 1322588002 590630 :TheJimmyJames!~TheJimmyJ@124.240.124.158 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322588003 633881 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :TASes are really heavily segmented by definition < 1322588018 290821 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although there's been one attempt I know of at an IL TAS, TASvideos wouldn't accept it < 1322588045 739479 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as they verify that the whole run is continuous using emulators, and ILs aren't continuous by definition < 1322588049 179666 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, TASes are indistinguishable from someone playing ridiculously well without save-scumming, no? < 1322588057 361478 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, the end result < 1322588063 710914 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: right, indeed < 1322588067 74742 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I had the terminology the wrong way aroudn < 1322588069 97193 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so they look like single-segments when played back < 1322588073 120586 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: all creative sandboxy games need perpetual motion machines. < 1322588076 873895 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does IL stand for? < 1322588079 249342 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or occasionally, single-segment with resets < 1322588081 539096 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :individual level < 1322588083 907112 :TheJimmyJames!~TheJimmyJ@124.240.124.158 QUIT :Client Quit < 1322588091 135954 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you have to play the whole game a level at a time in any order < 1322588107 630520 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1322588117 746902 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's typically used for things like racing games < 1322588128 246976 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :where the levels are all independent, and any ordering of the levels is entirely arbitrary < 1322588148 528914 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and continuity is thus not required; SDA even allows the levels of an IL to be done by different people, and just adds together the best time achieved for each level) < 1322588160 360759 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"A half-block with ice underneath it is slippery." < 1322588163 485631 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: we are using this < 1322588173 780442 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1322588177 385640 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes we are. < 1322588267 672445 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I think I would play minecraft if it were more CAy < 1322588291 437214 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Conway's Game of Life: the Game! < 1322588325 218633 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess redstone is kind of like wireworld???? kind of??????? < 1322588332 156076 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Elliottcraft (the game I'm not really working on but am designing, and that's named after elliott to cause confusion) is basically a bully automaton < 1322588335 409561 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :with only a few individual components < 1322588340 678102 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :being 3D rather than 2D means only a few are needed < 1322588347 921198 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I think it's TC, although haven't proven it < 1322588363 686458 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: import state: ground < 1322588366 488794 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :*important < 1322588376 438608 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming you walk around in it < 1322588391 115650 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: there is a possible content for a cell that is solid and does nothing < 1322588403 637510 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :good. < 1322588406 589560 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :two, in fact, one that falls and can be pushed around, and one that's immobile and just hangs there in midair < 1322588414 217715 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :excellent. < 1322588426 724910 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: So, sand and stone? :-) < 1322588434 192746 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :stupid minecraft and its IMPOSSIBLY FLOATING STRUCTURES which are SOMETIMES NOT WANTED. < 1322588438 908807 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but OTHERTIMES KIND OF COOL. < 1322588441 594962 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: (in Minecraft, sand and gravel alone are affected by gravity) < 1322588444 503941 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't think they have names yet, other than really descriptive names < 1322588457 943407 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the moveable one acts rather more solid than sand < 1322588465 940037 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: sand is solid in MC < 1322588470 546100 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, right < 1322588482 769322 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I read MC as mind control. < 1322588484 268924 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, the game isn't going to make much sense real-worldly, but it should make at least more sense than /that/ < 1322588504 786100 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've even vaguely envisaged it working as an MMO < 1322588522 21675 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: glider guns are a must. < 1322588523 591897 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I'm trying to work out how easily you could attack people by building walls around them or sending lots of factory blocks at them < 1322588531 586086 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: oh, don't worry about that < 1322588541 894381 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a block whose purpose is to be a glider with side effects, and it's quite easy to create < 1322588566 622335 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :reflecty mirror things that move gliders around? < 1322588574 13281 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also: portals < 1322588578 734651 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :every game benefits from portals. < 1322588595 126890 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example see: portal < 1322588599 297959 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I've always liked the idea of games that are basically single-player MMOs < 1322588605 34082 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's see… we have air, ground-like blocks (mobile/levitating), conveyor blocks (mobile/levitating), factory blocks < 1322588615 783186 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :conveyor blocks and factory blocks both have six possible orientations < 1322588618 589661 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that sounds horrible kind of. almost as horrible as regular MMOs < 1322588635 386900 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :none of the blocks can self-propel; but factory blocks can repeatedly create conveyor blocks beneath themselves < 1322588645 589089 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which effectively gives you a side-effecting glider < 1322588653 367550 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you could eliminate the diffusion of mobile and levitating by just putting block on a single kind of levitating block. < 1322588657 363509 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e., the only mode is online server play < 1322588658 337862 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :/but/ < 1322588663 441026 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :everyone spawns like miles and miles away from each other < 1322588674 481075 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you never know unless you like accidentally cross the path of someone exploring far out < 1322588675 297154 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: that'd make severe differences from the way computation worked < 1322588679 956577 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or make plans to meet up with someone < 1322588680 145690 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: but then, how would you play it offline? < 1322588688 40136 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, someone would probably make some sort of space-filling machine before long < 1322588694 85108 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and everyone would come across it eventually < 1322588698 59454 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you don't (bonus points if it doesn't tell you it's connecting to the network before you realise it yourself) < 1322588715 206191 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: then it's effectively malware < 1322588719 977216 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: AWESOME malware < 1322588723 294747 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: peano curves: the game? < 1322588724 873268 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, yes, but still malware < 1322588731 929134 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: more to the point, my network connection is often very unreliable < 1322588741 28235 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I'd notice the game repeatedly crashing < 1322588743 356535 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, it helps to dilute the world of malware with fun malware < 1322588747 452042 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :a world with fun malware > a world with unfun malware < 1322588802 584038 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :a world with fun malware + a world with unfun malware = a world with unfun malware < 1322588806 706975 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :therefore, a world with fun malware = 0 < 1322588840 877770 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1322588856 627248 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION good math < 1322588857 419636 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :therefore, a world with unfun malware < 0 < 1322588868 698161 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and <0 < <3) < 1322588905 607297 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (<0) < (<3) < 1322588906 674698 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : *Exception: (==): No overloading for function < 1322588946 293991 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I wonder why that's erroring on (==) < 1322588955 527780 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :a large part of me wishes that functions were orderable and equatable. < 1322588973 444518 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :then define ordering and equality on functions < 1322588975 986614 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I wonder why that's a runtime error..... < 1322588980 286022 :nooga!~nooga@c35-253.icpnet.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1322588988 159358 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because < 1322588998 152692 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (sin + cos) pi < 1322588999 134339 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : -0.9999999999999999 < 1322589010 781062 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: some library, presumably? < 1322589018 706382 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, what? < 1322589020 129614 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :library for what < 1322589022 47470 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> cos pi < 1322589022 591119 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : -1.0 < 1322589026 128532 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> sin pi < 1322589026 617608 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1.2246467991473532e-16 < 1322589030 233663 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I see < 1322589032 128964 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: num instance for functions < 1322589041 824821 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: defining + on functions < 1322589044 907114 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :sin pi..... < 1322589050 875783 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's just a Num instance < 1322589055 637895 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but Num requires Eq and Show < 1322589056 659842 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because bad < 1322589060 934104 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, aha < 1322589074 749077 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: does Eq requite Ord? < 1322589080 575975 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1322589082 459704 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but Num requires Ord and Show < 1322589083 819399 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ord requires Eq < 1322589084 256832 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or does it < 1322589085 238663 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :@src Num < 1322589085 557419 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :class (Eq a, Show a) => Num a where < 1322589085 747370 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : (+), (-), (*) :: a -> a -> a < 1322589085 747573 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : negate, abs, signum :: a -> a < 1322589085 747674 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : fromInteger :: Integer -> a < 1322589086 797565 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh... < 1322589087 686107 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay. < 1322589089 184551 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no Ord isn't required < 1322589091 499417 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder why they defined it < 1322589102 419136 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :me too. < 1322589124 263847 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I wonder why they defined it in terms of == < 1322589133 2744 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@src (a->b) < < 1322589133 190343 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Source not found. BOB says: You seem to have forgotten your passwd, enter another! < 1322589142 676491 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> ((+3) > (+4)) 5 < 1322589143 767439 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `t1 -> t' < 1322589143 955189 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : against inferred type `GHC.B... < 1322589156 102003 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :.. < 1322589158 78030 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1322589158 960155 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd be great if the rest of the error was printed < 1322589165 256983 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t ((+3) > (+4)) < 1322589165 936422 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bool < 1322589168 888371 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pretty clearly GHC.BOol or siome.. < 1322589170 628573 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, there we go < 1322589179 186675 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in retrospect, that was inevitable < 1322589183 623492 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :..heh, indeed. < 1322589243 504465 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: does caleskell do any other stuff with function instances that would require Ord? < 1322589251 255231 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't think so < 1322589288 456403 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@info (->) < 1322589288 969383 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Parse error at "->)" (column 2) < 1322589297 370021 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@help info < 1322589298 103254 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :help . Ask for help for . Try 'list' for all commands < 1322589305 39270 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@help @info < 1322589305 607131 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :help . Ask for help for . Try 'list' for all commands < 1322589310 491841 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION facepalms < 1322589402 322176 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I imagine one of the tests of the compare function or <= (whichever they defined for (->)) involves equality somewhere. < 1322589416 823684 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then < etc are defined from that. < 1322589446 868565 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Um, why would they define Ord Num with compare or <= being anything other than error? < 1322589449 362815 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that doesn't really explain why there is a completely useless Ord instance of (->) < 1322589455 679914 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, I mean, Ord (->) < 1322589493 224823 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe they were lazy and just used the same error message they use with (==) to make their shitty useless instance. < 1322589630 38089 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps it's actually a bug and no one realized that the Ord instance isn't actually needed. < 1322589647 701724 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :,, < 1322589660 965984 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1322589799 243841 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION gets the discussion going in #haskell < 1322590109 726440 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: it's Ord (a->b), right? (->) is quite different from (a->b) < 1322590116 819285 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1322590141 324036 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: probably. < 1322590156 480417 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> () > () < 1322590157 577054 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : False < 1322590159 861970 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: people often abbreviate instances for (->) in that way, it's kinda gross though < 1322590161 143021 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...bah < 1322590169 493987 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: does the language accept it? < 1322590173 452429 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no. < 1322590176 291552 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, but we're not talking in haskell < 1322590180 198563 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, OK < 1322590189 497434 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's like abbreviating int* to int in C < 1322590200 487815 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really < 1322590206 104163 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :even if you're not talking in C, it's still going to be really confusing < 1322590220 843359 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's definitely obvious that you're saying (make functions do stuff) in much the same way as saying something like "an instance for monads" < 1322590264 533395 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1322590272 990924 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is a sensible definition of Ord for a->b < 1322590277 80691 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, actually < 1322590282 799068 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't know about sensible, but < 1322590290 770148 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no there isn't < 1322590294 439537 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t max < 1322590295 623709 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (Ord a) => a -> a -> a < 1322590324 468828 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: not really, since Ord (->) is totally invalid, and there's only one possible "expansion" to validity < 1322590328 285413 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :as opposed to Ord Int vs. Ord (Ptr Int) < 1322590334 341234 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> max (+2) (+3) $ 5 < 1322590335 595705 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 8 < 1322590344 463392 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, not "sensible" < 1322590345 62836 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ...and? < 1322590347 697186 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t compare < 1322590348 503943 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (Ord a) => a -> a -> Ordering < 1322590350 480243 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :@src Ord < 1322590350 677820 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :class (Eq a) => Ord a where < 1322590350 873674 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : compare :: a -> a -> Ordering < 1322590350 873867 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : (<), (<=), (>), (>=) :: a -> a -> Bool < 1322590350 873968 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : max, min :: a -> a -> a < 1322590353 77394 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Ord (a->a)? < 1322590356 511245 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you implement compare < 1322590357 973591 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But max and min are defined < 1322590366 363735 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So? The others aren't < 1322590370 412204 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: with guards. < 1322590373 444957 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and stuff < 1322590373 642401 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But ah, I guess that's why < 1322590378 438675 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote a consistent compare for functions < 1322590379 960046 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something. < 1322590382 867255 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: (a -> b), Ord (a -> a) isn't valid and wouldn't work if it did < 1322590384 27056 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was kind of slow though < 1322590393 163169 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/did$/was/ < 1322590396 345495 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: for example: "an Ord instance for monads" when you actually mean an Ord instance for (Monad m, Ord a) => m a or something. < 1322590404 487646 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh < 1322590405 963482 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha, you can define <= in terms min as (<=) a b = min a b == a < 1322590412 205541 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: not sure how you'd define that < 1322590412 693980 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: that instance would be terrible and not work < 1322590412 890575 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's where the call to == is coming from, probably < 1322590414 670383 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and < 1322590416 937734 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :nobody says that < 1322590420 534644 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*in terms of min < 1322590421 202325 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and nobody would know what you meant if you said that :P < 1322590429 894547 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: right < 1322590436 660068 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's actually a plausible definition of <= for functions, it's just uncomputable < 1322590450 118737 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and non-transitive) < 1322590456 518774 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had a valid definition of it for functions < 1322590483 704365 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: What did it do < 1322590493 355973 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Try the entire argument space? < 1322590503 376771 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, but it's not that simple < 1322590516 655707 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That sounds fairly non-terminating :P < 1322590546 173573 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: does "valid" here imply "computable"? < 1322590565 827332 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to work out if sorting functions lexicographically by what they map the entire argument space to makes any sort of sense < 1322590585 933242 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it does with restrictions on the functions; differentiability is probably enough, but too strong < 1322590596 169259 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTF < 1322590598 952300 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :>deriv abs 0 < 1322590602 533743 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv abs 0 < 1322590603 768949 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 0 < 1322590606 476294 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that is, it's meaningful, but impossible to compute without more information) < 1322590607 590545 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv abs (-1) < 1322590608 602650 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : -1 < 1322590619 927839 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv abs 20 < 1322590620 565899 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 < 1322590623 158482 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1322590630 4584 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I bet it's just taking the average of left-derivative and right-derivative < 1322590634 630314 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv abs x < 1322590635 832736 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : signum x * 1 < 1322590637 555129 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm pretty sure I've heard the phrase "instance for monads" used before. also: I wasn't anticipating my example would be reviewed for its plausibility of implementation. :P < 1322590645 207899 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah no, doing it symbolically < 1322590648 160820 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@src deriv < 1322590648 788950 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Source not found. Where did you learn to type? < 1322590648 984523 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :>deriv sin < 1322590652 721828 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv sin < 1322590653 253596 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Overlapping instances for GHC.Show.Show (a -> a) < 1322590653 454025 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : arising from a use of `... < 1322590664 640382 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv sin x < 1322590665 273129 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 * cos x < 1322590671 438999 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, symbolically all right < 1322590690 558358 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle (Monad m) => m a -> a < 1322590691 350544 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude (>>) :: Monad m => m a -> m b -> m b < 1322590691 550801 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Monad (>>) :: Monad m => m a -> m b -> m b < 1322590691 550878 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Monad.Instances (>>) :: Monad m => m a -> m b -> m b < 1322590691 752779 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t deriv < 1322590692 437798 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b. (Num a, Num b) => (Dif a -> Dif b) -> a -> b < 1322590701 111454 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ais523: it only worked on finitely enumerable domains, and it would create a list of all functions < 1322590703 642286 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: not symbolically, I don't think < 1322590703 839366 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh come on, Haskell, no breakMonads function? < 1322590705 191879 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :although it might be < 1322590707 958813 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then find who appeared first in that list < 1322590712 723088 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's AD < 1322590714 66002 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was awesome < 1322590716 819329 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the symbolicness comes from the Expr stuff < 1322590719 580638 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which comes in because of x < 1322590721 859268 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv sin 99.4 < 1322590722 661588 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 0.4257869286693041 < 1322590725 270377 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t deriv sin 99.4 < 1322590726 264366 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (Floating a) => a < 1322590727 561179 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1322590730 668464 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how does it differentiate sin to cos without doing it symbolically? < 1322590734 909292 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and actually say the result is cos < 1322590742 279727 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it just guessing that the result acts like cos? < 1322590743 89115 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that's part of the definition of sin < 1322590743 740260 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t sin < 1322590744 720944 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (Floating a) => a -> a < 1322590750 121792 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's part of the Floating instance for Dif < 1322590760 158040 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1322590763 606733 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv (\a -> sin a * sin a) x < 1322590764 278855 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 * cos x * sin x + sin x * (1 * cos x) < 1322590764 944699 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :tl;dr typeclass hacks. < 1322590772 429829 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not a typeclass hack < 1322590792 541464 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it has to know that the input is sin, surely? < 1322590796 819427 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what < 1322590802 233641 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise it's comparing functions and we already know that's impossible < 1322590810 75492 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it's not < 1322590813 938748 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :@messages < 1322590814 496253 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :You don't have any new messages. < 1322590820 295447 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t deriv < 1322590821 99855 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b. (Num a, Num b) => (Dif a -> Dif b) -> a -> b < 1322590830 295432 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :instance Blah (Dif a) where sin = ... < 1322590845 665989 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: right, symbolic < 1322590848 444660 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1322590849 419406 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :not symbolic < 1322590863 569236 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the definition of sin will be something that says "this is sin" < 1322590873 179520 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus, it's symbolic < 1322590877 4669 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1322590877 994831 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :not symbolic < 1322590879 572080 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you're using a really weird definition of the term < 1322590884 483183 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the reason it says cos < 1322590886 353476 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :is because you used "x" < 1322590887 758557 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t x < 1322590888 585904 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Expr < 1322590890 35111 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> sin x < 1322590890 856335 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : sin x < 1322590891 671509 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> cos x < 1322590892 510509 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're just saying lots of stuff that proves it's symbolic < 1322590892 705266 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : cos x < 1322590899 428935 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are still doing stuff that says it's symbolic < 1322590905 29727 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you're just saying lots of stuff that proves you don't know wtf it's doing < 1322590907 438088 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE EXPR STUFF IS SYMBOLIC < 1322590910 610743 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the deriv stuff isn't < 1322590926 805039 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's printing the result symbolically because I used x, indeed < 1322590938 287438 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it was symbolic all along, because you can't go backwards from numerical to symbolic, in general < 1322590938 616512 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PART #esoteric :"ragequit" < 1322590976 817829 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott rageparts easily. < 1322590981 655564 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: presumably it has to do some maths < 1322590984 528799 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not used to elliott rageparting < 1322590987 348950 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: on top of being symbolicish < 1322591007 858886 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :symbolic differentiation basically means that it's using some sort of AST or similar representation of the functions, and operating on that < 1322591013 685832 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than evaluating the functions and operating on the resulting values < 1322591020 947474 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1322591024 720715 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then somehow making them back into functions < 1322591035 166427 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I suggest you look up automatic differentiation < 1322591039 255072 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than arguing from incredulity < 1322591099 471903 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I've just looked it up; Wikipedia says that it isn't symbolic differentiation, then goes on to define it, with a definition that shows that it clearly is symbolic after all < 1322591111 692216 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless "symbolic differentation" refers to something other than differentiation which is symbolic < 1322591113 64279 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are incorrect < 1322591121 420640 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Then, go there and fix it if it is wrong? < 1322591125 877153 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://blog.sigfpe.com/2005/07/automatic-differentiation.html < 1322591136 326542 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the fact that the operations are defined with variables < 1322591138 348110 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :does not make them symbolic < 1322591140 270925 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, put a note on the Talk page to notify them in case someone has reasons to keep it how it is? < 1322591146 780396 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because there are no symbols at runtime < 1322591149 877992 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no symbol manipulation at runtime < 1322591155 592140 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only thing involving symbols or symbol manipulation is Expr < 1322591160 996445 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is completely distinct from the automatic differentiation code < 1322591167 381123 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and unrelated to it < 1322591246 643628 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to find sigfpe's longer post. < 1322591304 580360 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: OK, so automatic differentiation there is an optimization of an optimization of symbolic differentiation where you're superstrict < 1322591310 139455 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1322591313 608032 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's basically a specialiser < 1322591316 524650 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1322591330 773312 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: if you give in x as the argument, then you don't get any specialisation hapening < 1322591332 555440 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*happening < 1322591333 815732 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION will just keep saying "no" every time you make an incorrect statement, since you don't actually listen to the corrections. < 1322591338 448124 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you can't give x in as an argument. x is not a number. < 1322591344 700414 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv (sin :: Double -> Double) pi < 1322591347 499169 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: nor is d < 1322591352 240109 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you cannot pass x to that sin < 1322591355 206433 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it only takes Doublse < 1322591356 766275 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doubles < 1322591359 359385 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait, type error < 1322591362 468804 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1322591364 973539 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sigh < 1322591365 797024 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1322591368 177131 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :automatic differentiation works because it redefines * on d < 1322591370 585227 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :such that d*d = 0 < 1322591372 839858 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1322591393 486887 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `Data.Number.Dif.Dif a' < 1322591393 685295 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : against inferr... < 1322591395 969879 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the type error there is /mandatory/ < 1322591400 876937 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because, d is not a Double < 1322591410 823308 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, it is, it was a trivial mistake and irrelevant because you don't actually understand how AD works < 1322591417 278180 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv (sin :: Dif Double -> Dif Double) pi < 1322591418 457627 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322591418 655662 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : -1.0 < 1322591431 385189 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I presume a Dif Double accepts d < 1322591433 722248 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also, are not interested in understanding, as opposed to just telling me I'm wrong and apparently Wikipedia and everyone else on the planet too based on misunderstandings < 1322591435 512783 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I'm done < 1322591446 231107 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I've read the page, and I understand AD pretty well, by now < 1322591453 926947 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's orthogonal to symbolic versus not symbolic < 1322591471 834069 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, it requires redefining terms in the original expression < 1322591480 770917 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and thus, you need a symbolic version of the input < 1322591506 778965 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no you don't, you just need a polymorphic function < 1322591545 876296 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there an instance (Num a) => Num (Dif a)? < 1322591555 992756 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would hope so. < 1322591566 783201 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let f :: forall a. (Floating a) => a -> a; f x = sin x + cos x {- haskell has no facility for "inspecting" this function symbolically -} in (f (pi :: Double), deriv f (pi :: Double)) < 1322591567 765853 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : (-0.9999999999999999,-1.0000000000000002) < 1322591612 917894 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: actually, Haskell /can/ inspect that function symbolically < 1322591618 36843 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :incorrect < 1322591625 850569 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :create a new type, of typeclass Floating, that builds an AST < 1322591628 961761 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and defines sin, +, cos < 1322591634 830218 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which it does, as it's of typeclass Floating) < 1322591640 785881 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is not "inspecting the function symbolically" < 1322591646 858750 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, types aren't "of typeclasses". < 1322591647 58870 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is it not? < 1322591655 862203 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, with an instance of that typeclass < 1322591660 142891 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: by that argument, map is "symbolic" < 1322591664 379524 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't mean to imply that a type could only belong to one typeclass < 1322591670 351100 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> map (\x -> "f " ++ show x) [1,2,3,4] < 1322591671 942557 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : ["f 1","f 2","f 3","f 4"] < 1322591675 264997 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: but, umm, it is? < 1322591675 464752 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OMG SYMBOLIC! < 1322591694 884514 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> cycle ["yes no "] --tl;dr < 1322591696 25269 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : ["yes no ","yes no ","yes no ","yes no ","yes no ","yes no ","yes no ","yes... < 1322591699 474361 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1322591702 223780 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> foldr (\a b -> a ++ " `f` (" ++ b ++ ")") "z" ["a","b","c","d"] < 1322591703 855106 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : "a `f` (b `f` (c `f` (d `f` (z))))" < 1322591704 864967 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> cycle "yes no " --tl;dr < 1322591705 532043 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OMG FOLDR IS SYMBOLIC < 1322591705 984457 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : "yes no yes no yes no yes no yes no yes no yes no yes no yes no yes no yes ... < 1322591712 650270 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: again, why would you expect it to not be? < 1322591716 36973 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :EVERYTHING IS SYMBOLIC DESPITE THERE BEING NO SYMBOLIC SEMANTICS IN HASKELL OR CODE IN GHC < 1322591716 237027 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't need to evaluate anything < 1322591726 156332 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's true that if you define every function as symbolic, then AD is symbolic, yes. < 1322591739 553280 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe there are even two people on the planet stupid enough to take such a view < 1322591741 220503 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, actually, no < 1322591754 772454 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1322591787 937439 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: btw, I think you'll find that most implementations of AD look like data Dif a = Dif a a, which has a conspicuous lack of symbolic d. < 1322591801 586939 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(d = Dif 0 1, _not_ symbolic at all, _not_ handled specially by the Num instance at all) < 1322591803 72330 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: right, that's a specialization < 1322591815 14114 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, that's the definition < 1322591820 849288 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv (const 4) pi < 1322591822 102269 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 0 < 1322591825 198474 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_number < 1322591833 697041 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, I know why map isn't symbolic, despite everything; it's because it doesn't try to provide definitions for any of the subexpressions of the original < 1322591916 93001 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :AD is that differentiation thing— yep. < 1322591975 179716 :quintopia!~quintopia@74.117.159.204 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322591975 712270 :quintopia!~quintopia@74.117.159.204 QUIT :Changing host < 1322591975 911403 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia JOIN :#esoteric < 1322591993 231689 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv (\x -> x^x) x < 1322591994 343358 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : No instance for (GHC.Real.Integral < 1322591994 542505 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : (Data.Number.Dif.Dif... < 1322591994 911570 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you discussing whether it counts as symbolic derivation or not. < 1322591998 17675 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv (\x -> x**x) x < 1322591998 312189 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, forgot Conal has a serise of posts about it: http://conal.net/blog/posts/what-is-automatic-differentiation-and-why-does-it-work < 1322591999 293374 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : (1 * recip x * x + log x * 1) * exp (log x * x) < 1322592000 461477 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :What should I name the function to put the barrier monad into the other form? < 1322592001 74711 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hmm, I think you'll agree with the following statement: "Any function that doesn't mention Dif and is valid input to dif is also valid input to \f -> f x" < 1322592006 986488 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: no, ais is blindly claiming it is without justification < 1322592018 89367 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you? < 1322592043 790353 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(where x is Expr's x, there) < 1322592044 480674 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no, (Dif a) could easily have instances that Expr doesn't < 1322592055 247723 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Replace every number X with the number x + x'ε, where x' is a real number, but ε is nothing but a symbol with the property ε^2 = 0. Using only this, we get for the regular arithmetic < 1322592058 795014 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: does it? < 1322592059 160784 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: IT'S JUST A SYMBOL DUDE < 1322592062 572580 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: SYMBOLIC < 1322592062 768353 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and would it make sense for it to? < 1322592062 967533 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's... kind of symbolic, in that it only works for functions that only use + and *, but that's not really symbolic in the conventional sense. < 1322592069 207024 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and couldn't the same instances be added to Expr too? < 1322592076 70812 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: moron < 1322592085 611710 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Uhh, it works for functions that use plenty other than + and *. < 1322592092 634910 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hmm, like? < 1322592097 848139 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: AD is widely used to differentiate entire procedural algorithms written in C. < 1322592104 64820 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Like anything? < 1322592107 656160 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any operator. < 1322592115 402389 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: (note: sarcasm) < 1322592117 73891 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I don't know whether it does < 1322592121 25229 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: but they need either the source code or the resulting binary to work, presumably < 1322592125 64630 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, I meant to clarify, that doesn't use any numerical operations other than + and *. < 1322592141 919074 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: if you made your question precise -- "any f :: (Num a) => a -> b can have be applied to (x :: Expr) where instance Num Expr"... no shit? < 1322592148 820493 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ...no? < 1322592161 800167 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, I think by "symbolic", I mean "there is enough polymorphism present that you can just give a lot of AST-building definitions of the operators and end up with a parse tree of the function" < 1322592166 105109 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1322592167 823714 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv sin (x :: Expr) < 1322592168 143404 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is clearly different from your definition, thus the argument < 1322592169 123152 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 * cos x < 1322592177 594248 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how would you use it on, say, ln x. < 1322592184 644865 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I notice a distinct lack of + and * < 1322592188 385475 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: your definition is ridiculous: every polymorphic function becomes symbolic < 1322592197 450475 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Without using the series expansion; that's just expressing it in terms of + and *. < 1322592203 105348 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv log (x :: Expr) < 1322592204 353949 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 * recip x < 1322592209 720559 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv log (pi :: Double) < 1322592210 488092 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 0.3183098861837907 < 1322592215 198370 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hmm, I suppose they are < 1322592216 423537 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Using Expr just confuses things. < 1322592219 282555 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's probably a good thing < 1322592223 405128 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I think it clarifies. < 1322592228 261349 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't < 1322592231 536109 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because Expr only works for a small subset < 1322592245 338121 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc it fucks up on abs or something, I forget exactly what I ran into when I tried to use AD with Expr < 1322592245 830146 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, because it's missing instances, but right < 1322592253 53159 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1322592254 894163 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> abs x < 1322592255 990423 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the types don't work out < 1322592256 220824 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : abs x < 1322592262 634342 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv abs (x :: Expr) < 1322592263 859305 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : signum x * 1 < 1322592272 279161 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv signum (x :: Expr) < 1322592272 960297 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 0 < 1322592275 385599 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : iirc it fucks up on abs or something, I forget exactly what I ran into when I tried to use AD with Expr < 1322592282 267539 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I forget exactly what I ran into" < 1322592290 774380 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1322592300 472695 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I'm currently trying to work out what leads to the sin -> cos case < 1322592321 816642 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Floating instance for dual numbers. < 1322592323 826158 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think? < 1322592329 407632 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the definition of sin for Diff references cos, obviously < 1322592335 617393 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: as the definition of sin for dual numbers /involves/ cos < 1322592340 514227 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because of the infinitesimal part < 1322592349 554265 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but the sin and cos referenced are those of the underlying numeric type < 1322592354 614605 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha, of course < 1322592359 885935 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and for Expr, that consists of prepending "cos " (roughly) < 1322592400 15968 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but, um, seriously, the proof of AD uses a polynomial; how do you use it on things that aren't polynomials? < 1322592413 506803 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :magic. < 1322592423 95711 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: well, all the things that it's being tried on are polynomials < 1322592434 767083 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the case of sin/cos, they're infinite-degree, but still polynomials < 1322592446 242795 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in general, working on all polynomials means it works on anything that has a Taylor expansion < 1322592455 204653 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and things that don't are unlikely to be meaningfully differentiable anyway :) < 1322592475 633484 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note that the standard ad libraries don't actually define things via Taylor expansions. < 1322592484 151838 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes, so how do they do it? < 1322592487 841883 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, because it would be stupid to do so < 1322592497 685859 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're only relevant in proving that the technique works < 1322592503 168113 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: they use basic calculus. < 1322592510 717481 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Um, no? < 1322592518 534057 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: sin = liftAD sin cos < 1322592536 791538 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance < 1322592541 901925 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the ad library has < 1322592547 451670 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : lift1 :: Num a => (a -> a) -> (D t a -> D t a) -> t a -> t a < 1322592548 227141 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does liftAD do? < 1322592559 93266 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :where sin = lift1 sin cos < 1322592565 277743 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Depends on which type you use < 1322592569 78252 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the simple < 1322592569 536794 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :data Forward a = Forward !a a deriving (Show, Data, Typeable) < 1322592570 853638 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's < 1322592573 851966 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : lift1 f df (Forward b db) = Forward (f b) (dadb * db) < 1322592574 49689 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : where < 1322592574 49870 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : Id dadb = df (Id b) < 1322592582 15116 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(where < 1322592582 213152 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : type D Forward = Id < 1322592582 658514 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :) < 1322592658 293673 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322592681 568245 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: why did you put the tunes logs in the topic? I logread but didn't see anything about it :P < 1322592703 341650 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it was while glogbot was crashed < 1322592712 125329 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's a lot of glue code.. < 1322592712 936047 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1322592718 460415 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: because it's generic < 1322592721 563484 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: it has all kinds of AD types < 1322592732 480697 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :including like < 1322592733 139741 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :-- | A @Tape@ records the information needed back propagate from the output to each input during 'Reverse' 'Mode' AD. < 1322592733 327299 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :data Tape a t < 1322592733 327496 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : = Lift !a < 1322592733 327597 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : | Var !a {-# UNPACK #-} !Int < 1322592734 111957 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : | Binary !a a a t t < 1322592736 68389 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : | Unary !a a t < 1322592737 340458 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: right. I think probably a simple example would be easier to follow though? < 1322592738 182566 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : deriving (Show, Data, Typeable) < 1322592740 176925 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :-- | @Reverse@ is a 'Mode' using reverse-mode automatic differentiation that provides fast 'diffFU', 'diff2FU', 'grad', 'grad2' and a fast 'jacobian' when you have a significantly smaller number of outputs than inputs. < 1322592743 84357 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :newtype Reverse a = Reverse (Tape a (Reverse a)) deriving (Show, Typeable) < 1322592745 203643 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that uses StableNames and observable sharing and shit < 1322592746 696340 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: I was giving an actual example < 1322592750 687724 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes I know. < 1322592752 653603 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :to show something that actually works < 1322592781 152335 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :big :: Nat -> Bool < 1322592781 478997 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :big (S (S (S (S (S (S (S (S (S (S _)))))))))) = True < 1322592781 667277 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :big _ = False < 1322592782 957864 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what a swell function < 1322592816 972065 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you could also just say sin (Dif x dx) = Dif (sin x) (dx * cos x) < 1322592819 797084 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :to demonstrate the basic idea. < 1322592828 491594 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1322592831 521199 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hangonhangonhangon, is liftAD just /defining/ the derivative? < 1322592847 663339 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: sin on the dual numbers inherently involves cos. < 1322592853 571000 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not "defining" the derivative. < 1322592866 290510 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Computing sin on the dual numbers involves computing sin on the underlying number type, and cos on the same dual number type. < 1322592879 973151 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could also define "sin x = x+1", it just wouldn't be sin. < 1322592890 339094 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Similarly, the only sin for the dual numbers is lift1 sin cos. < 1322592902 499598 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, OK. < 1322593030 107840 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the formal definition of dual numbers is oddly similar to complex numbers. < 1322593042 272728 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: it's not really odd < 1322593042 968275 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well nawww. < 1322593046 515562 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: complex numbers is adding i^2 = -1 < 1322593049 782709 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: dual numbers is adding d^2 = 0 < 1322593059 96759 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're both gonna end up looking pretty similar :P < 1322593064 171295 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :right that is the similarity I was talking about. :P < 1322593090 154641 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's basically just a different complex number algebra. < 1322593124 108645 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :A different complex number algebra? < 1322593125 703109 :derrik!~xix@gprs-inet-65-40.elisa.ee JOIN :#esoteric < 1322593152 331610 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you can do second derivatives like this also you just need a second level < 1322593153 967085 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or more generally < 1322593159 702969 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :data Diff a = Diff a (Diff a) < 1322593164 626722 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The complex numbers are just ((R,R), +, *); change + or * and you don't have the complex numbers any more. < 1322593167 870352 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but some things stop terminating if you do it like /that/ :P < 1322593201 881058 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: you can't take square roots, sins, and cosines of complex numbers? < 1322593217 173518 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, scratch square roots actually < 1322593227 888410 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, those are all derived from the stuff I stated. < 1322593273 152059 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right division. < 1322593275 286380 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wishes there was Automatic Integration. :p < 1322593280 375154 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Codual numbers! < 1322593291 781550 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: make them < 1322593302 879453 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :publish paper < 1322593303 967996 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :get rich < 1322593411 861670 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, we can already do integration on polynomials really easily. < 1322593447 975452 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not with codual numbers! < 1322593465 556246 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: --Phantom "Help runge kutta" Hoverboard < 1322593489 985176 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hey, I found highly contradictory information on what it could be applied to! < 1322593513 848977 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: (Wait what if we just rewrote Newtonian physics with polynomials?) < 1322593519 424630 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: (THINK ABOUT IT) < 1322593528 770855 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: are you sure you don't need like triangles or something to define sine? < 1322593530 524374 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, they tried that, turns out it's impossible. < 1322593542 515185 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Maybe they didn't try hard enough? < 1322593548 751792 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Maybe they used the wrong foundation. < 1322593552 151036 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, sin x = x - x^3/3! + x^5/5! - ... < 1322593553 649723 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's try it with THE POWER OF TYPE THEORY AND UNSAFECOERCE. < 1322593558 106293 :azaq23!~derivecto@HSI-KBW-046-005-248-025.hsi8.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1322593562 178391 :azaq23!~derivecto@HSI-KBW-046-005-248-025.hsi8.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de QUIT :Changing host < 1322593562 357532 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322593592 551842 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, this definition is demonstrably equivalent to the triangle one, although it's pretty circuitous to actually show it. < 1322593605 661042 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: oh okay. but then you forgot the infinite paper. < 1322593612 291434 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: aren't those two opposite powers? < 1322593612 470757 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: 3/3! = 1! = 1 idiot dummy < 1322593624 5718 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sin x = x - x^1 + x^1 - ... < 1322593625 422170 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :=== < 1322593628 557942 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sin x = x - x + x - ... < 1322593630 103215 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :.Q.E.D < 1322593630 546417 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, yes, they fight crime. < 1322593644 729166 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott "bad at teaching" hird < 1322593648 776692 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :You've proven that sin x doesn't converge for all x? < 1322593655 513335 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, all nonzero x. < 1322593661 443218 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: no we just need to use < 1322593662 194490 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh, TYPE CRIME, it's like thoughtcrime < 1322593664 910199 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ZETA FUNCTION REGULARISATION < 1322593669 856042 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it solves all summing problems < 1322593677 140963 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I think fax may have been a bad influence on you. < 1322593680 136535 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has never had a problem summing. < 1322593703 77837 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: OK I have determined that sin(x) = 1/4e^pi + (x*0.0000000000014) for all x apart from 3. < 1322593710 669286 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sin(3) = god. < 1322593733 767453 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that what zeta function regularisation actually says. < 1322593745 211597 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. It has helped us find god. < 1322593752 573564 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thanks, zeta function regularisation. Theta function regularisation. < 1322593792 797327 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I really want to believe in string theory because one kind of string theory involves using zeta function regularisation to work out a sum for actual physical things??? < 1322593802 940316 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to believe that God is awesome enough to put that into physics. < 1322593811 276274 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, check out the WP article? < 1322593820 983315 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: too bad that's bad because string theory ew < 1322593831 239339 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ? < 1322593845 401203 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The first example is bog-standard QFT. < 1322593860 326693 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Is it? YESSSSSSSSSSSSS < 1322593864 899005 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :THANKS GOD < 1322593872 978178 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Aw c'mon, everyone likes string theory, it's so elegant! < 1322593894 253720 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Before Phantom_Hoover rips into me: it's a joke.) < 1322593935 660761 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, wait, how much do you actually know about zeta function regularisation beyond "you can use it to prove mad things about infinite sums". < 1322593949 443553 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: sometimes I feel like have a superpower to recognize jokes. < 1322593953 435022 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless they're just incredibly deadpan. < 1322593961 632646 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I am like the world's foremost expert of zeta function regularisation? < 1322593975 25764 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what's the zeta function. < 1322593985 724114 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: RIEMANNIAN < 1322594002 180302 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: of all the people I know you seem to know the most about it, so that's a yes < 1322594009 227161 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Riemann, mon. < 1322594016 226464 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, you knew fax, no? < 1322594062 28774 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zeta-Function Regularization is Uniquely Defined and Well < 1322594064 26653 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :E. Elizalde < 1322594066 117013 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Submitted on 6 Aug 1993) < 1322594068 105119 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hawking's zeta function regularization procedure is shown to be rigorously and uniquely defined, thus putting and end to the spreading lore about different difficulties associated with it. Basic misconceptions, misunderstandings and errors which keep appearing in important scientific journals when dealing with this beautiful regularization method ---and other analytical procedures--- are clarified and corrected. < 1322594073 76302 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Q.E.D. bitchen < 1322594086 683089 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: nope, I've never used fax < 1322594111 355338 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is E. Elizalde you in a previous life. < 1322594117 475759 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes. < 1322594127 21591 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I revived two years later. < 1322594156 141055 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should probably learn some analysis sometime, it seems cool. < 1322594212 169670 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes then you will know 1 thing, ha ha ha < 1322594225 781091 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : :'( < 1322594235 646662 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric : oh come on, Haskell, no breakMonads function? <-- it makes very little sense to do that for an arbitrary monad < 1322594266 164621 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because different monads need different kind of setup to get started < 1322594272 573921 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, update < 1322594275 772802 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: some can't get started at all < 1322594281 733117 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: dupdog < 1322594282 657163 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does breakMonads do. < 1322594297 553724 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: @hoogle (Monad m) => m a -> a < 1322594308 82604 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :would be its type < 1322594336 197399 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, yes, the classic "help i want out" response to a monad. < 1322594373 405807 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't most useful monads have a function like that, except with more arguments? < 1322594377 627483 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, _even_ if you admit unsafePerformIO it still doesn't make sense for every monad. < 1322594394 340840 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: unsafePerformIO is in the report :) < 1322594399 286653 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yeah. except sometimes the output too has more arguments. < 1322594405 2685 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: not necessarily < 1322594409 330629 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. lists < 1322594415 867911 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, the function monad doesn't, except it does if you consider the input "more arguments" < 1322594418 743698 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, and there's the crux of the matter: m a isn't associated with any particular value of a. < 1322594430 203454 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :14:17 < elliott> kallisti: dupdog < 1322594433 305469 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what about it? < 1322594433 572631 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why shouldn't I? < 1322594445 332570 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-46-232.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1322594445 514275 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-46-232.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Changing host < 1322594445 514429 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1322594449 423103 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well you could always add it as a method to Monad, with the default definition of undefined < 1322594458 431330 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: well you are basically just defining "useful monad" as "something which can be turned into a function from something else to something with an a in it" < 1322594461 794791 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that it still breaks arbitrary monads. :> < 1322594474 858178 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: yeah fail needs company in its brokenness < 1322594475 42400 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yes, like Phantom_Hoover said. < 1322594478 789280 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think (a -> Bool) is a monad. < 1322594482 759717 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(pure sets) < 1322594490 988534 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, for Eq a < 1322594506 374597 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1322594518 212071 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :er hm < 1322594519 57387 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Cont r may be a better example < 1322594522 51056 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what's wrong with that as a definition of a useful monad? < 1322594522 293019 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you do join < 1322594528 174342 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: (a -> Bool) -> a < 1322594531 740633 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you write that? < 1322594532 810214 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just cannot get an a result out of that < 1322594558 261446 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, least value of a such that the function results in true, for some arbitrary well-ordering. < 1322594562 229218 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming r and a are not allowed to depend on each other < 1322594564 690469 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, even with applying id? < 1322594566 983930 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: you only have (Eq a) < 1322594569 107132 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: um < 1322594571 923862 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ZFC'd. < 1322594572 222245 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :newtype PS a = PS (a -> Bool) < 1322594574 86209 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, using id < 1322594578 602127 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :run :: (Eq a) => PS a -> a < 1322594588 648430 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: id doesn't give you Cont r a -> a < 1322594592 227997 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1322594593 696836 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :for Cont, ok < 1322594601 321180 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1322594601 674478 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t runCont < 1322594602 946088 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall r a. Cont r a -> (a -> r) -> r < 1322594620 753593 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: oh PS isn't a monad < 1322594621 734971 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :unfortunately < 1322594621 915923 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You... get an r? < 1322594625 111461 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously that shows id works if a = r < 1322594628 279283 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's not a functor, it's a contrafunctor < 1322594647 250582 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :er, hmm < 1322594649 537284 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that seems wrong < 1322594654 962031 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because Set /is/ a monad, modulo Ord constraint < 1322594656 384877 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what's up? < 1322594664 354482 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: note that breakMonad was supposed to have the type forall m a. Monad m => m a -> a < 1322594677 375094 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fmap :: (a -> b) -> (a -> Bool) -> (b -> Bool) < 1322594677 615630 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*breakMonads < 1322594681 132109 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1322594686 71584 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: how is Set a monad again? that makes no sense < 1322594701 333918 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's not < 1322594707 546494 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: MODULO ORD CONSTRAINT < 1322594742 187602 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh < 1322594747 412363 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's because Set can access its inner "list of values" < 1322594782 342183 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: apply f to that list, then nub . sort, i presume < 1322594800 903710 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yes, but it's really gross because it means Set is nothing like a set :( < 1322594804 525886 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and set union somewhere < 1322594811 262077 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes the set monad is basically the same as the list monad, modulo ord constraint < 1322594823 108505 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: even worse: you can't define contramap for Set < 1322594829 20800 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you /can/ for (-> Bool) < 1322594834 732987 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sets are like the opposite of sets :P < 1322594933 508678 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :contramap? < 1322594939 476331 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu NICK :sebbu < 1322594989 36729 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: see contravariant package < 1322595086 461428 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :contramap scares me < 1322595092 652579 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :-> Bool is a contravariant functor, yes. also it's its own adjoint functor, and when you compose those you get Cont Bool as the monad. < 1322595128 229141 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yes, i'm just annoyed that (Set a) and (a -> Bool) are almost opposites < 1322595134 924559 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Set has fmap, (-> Bool) has contramap < 1322595161 217031 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would think of the former as the latter except (a) faster and (b) you can get a magic ordered list of values out of it, but that doesn't affect what you can actually "do" to it :P < 1322595196 656697 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it may be somewhat analogous to how a finite dimensional vector space is its own dual, but the isomorphism is not natural (you need to pick an arbitrary basis) < 1322595204 663089 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1322595235 983681 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I'm trying to think of monads that you can't "run" apart from data Trivial a = Trivial (or was it data Trivial a) and Cont... < 1322595244 75749 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :having a hard time of it :P < 1322595265 397245 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hmmm.. what is "run" for lists? < 1322595280 160043 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: head :P < 1322595286 305492 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1322595287 230584 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but more relevantly, < 1322595290 496925 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :[a] -> Maybe a < 1322595297 359526 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo probably considers that close enough to "running" < 1322595302 692948 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :since (Maybe a) sometimes has an a in it < 1322595320 653504 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: at least you know when it doesn't run. < 1322595355 170030 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so wait is Sgeo arguing in favor of breakMonads or something? I haven't been paying attention < 1322595404 263547 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :come to think of it, inner products are what you add to _make_ that self-dualism natural for vector spaces, maybe there's an analogue for Set a and a -> Bool < 1322595551 611784 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :safeIndex would probably be better < 1322595570 227778 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fsvo "better" < 1322595587 457048 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :FSVO IS MINE < 1322595588 659743 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :MIIIIIIIINE < 1322595670 612173 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: friendship fsvo < 1322595682 236772 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ... fsvo fsvo < 1322595690 3681 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :iouhfjkhflsd < 1322595696 472790 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hi friendship fsvo help < 1322595706 290764 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: HELP < 1322595710 644209 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: hlep < 1322595711 443878 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fsvo friendship < 1322595778 304563 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t Expr < 1322595779 439396 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not in scope: data constructor `Expr' < 1322595782 851166 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle Expr < 1322595783 615676 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Text.Parsec.Expr module Text.Parsec.Expr < 1322595783 800553 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Text.ParserCombinators.Parsec.Expr module Text.ParserCombinators.Parsec.Expr < 1322595783 800727 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Text.ParserCombinators.Parsec.Expr buildExpressionParser :: OperatorTable tok st a -> GenParser tok st a -> GenParser tok st a < 1322595799 262428 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm is there a SimpleReflect type that has a parameter? < 1322595850 512015 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://hackage.haskell.org/packages/archive/show/0.4.1.1/doc/html/SimpleReflect.html < 1322595947 375363 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so no < 1322595967 796319 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :would a... simple-reflect monad be possible? < 1322595975 545040 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1322596004 587206 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, kallisti: hi < 1322596011 711791 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: stop kallisti < 1322596017 475146 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-46-232.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1322596017 820162 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-46-232.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Changing host < 1322596017 999040 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1322596021 85392 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: no. return :: a -> Reflect a < 1322596022 226557 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :qhat did kallisti do < 1322596023 531308 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what string do you use? < 1322596029 312415 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : fsvo "better" < 1322596029 491513 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : FSVO IS MINE < 1322596029 491698 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : MIIIIIIIINE < 1322596029 491800 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott: friendship fsvo < 1322596029 491901 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott: ... fsvo fsvo < 1322596030 258156 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : iouhfjkhflsd < 1322596032 215627 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott: hi friendship fsvo help < 1322596034 342266 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : monqy: HELP < 1322596036 330774 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : monqy: hlep < 1322596046 667116 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: :( < 1322596192 24944 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1322596198 439088 :Klisz!~Klisz@c-67-176-12-54.hsd1.co.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1322596266 389731 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1322596377 235357 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://github.com/ghc/testsuite/commit/dfdb979305d5ebb7b28fcabce06d9095d81d34da < 1322596381 371279 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: oerjan: Phantom_Hoover: terrifying < 1322596416 71426 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :??? < 1322596427 153031 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :terrifying < 1322596467 11397 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that’s not all! Humble Introversion Bundle customers now have access to the source code for Darwinia, Multiwinia, DEFCON, and Uplink! Once you've purchased the bundle, check your download page for a source snapshot and gain access to Introversion's developer forums, wiki, and SVN repository. < 1322596468 839746 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :!!!!!!!1183748975438957 < 1322596484 925490 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean the call stack thing which he promised a while ago? < 1322596499 270244 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yes but I DIDN'T KNOW IT WAS BEING EXPOSED TO USER CODE... < 1322596512 221760 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://plus.google.com/107890464054636586545/posts/YJzAAxw28N7 < 1322596522 944242 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1322596607 923303 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is this thinge.. < 1322596632 339264 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :call stack inspection for ghc haskells? < 1322596639 377478 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :terrifying indeed < 1322596651 387054 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about call stack /manipulation/? < 1322596807 246224 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I think this is old news that I saw in here but didn't process properly, but Introversion source now available for Humble Bundle purchasers < 1322596816 170815 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : But that’s not all! Humble Introversion Bundle customers now have access to the source code for Darwinia, Multiwinia, DEFCON, and Uplink! Once you've purchased the bundle, check your download page for a source snapshot and gain access to Introversion's developer forums, wiki, and SVN repository. < 1322596816 350632 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : !!!!!!!1183748975438957 < 1322596816 350796 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : you mean the call stack thing which he promised a while ago? < 1322596816 350896 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : oerjan: yes but I DIDN'T KNOW IT WAS BEING EXPOSED TO USER CODE... < 1322596817 167577 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : https://plus.google.com/107890464054636586545/posts/YJzAAxw28N7 < 1322596819 131662 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : heh < 1322596821 126816 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : what is this thinge.. < 1322596823 215848 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : call stack inspection for ghc haskells? < 1322596825 176971 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : terrifying indeed < 1322596827 138217 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : what about call stack /manipulation/? < 1322596829 201946 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott, I think this is old news that I saw in here but didn't process properly, but Introversion source now available for Humble Bundle purchasers < 1322596835 515296 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sgeo's memory lasts less than 6 minutes < 1322596846 169234 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I could swear I saw it earlier than 6 minutes ago < 1322596851 471070 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like hours ago or something < 1322596950 602220 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: maybe his memory only keeps the first reference < 1322597020 818819 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like: "Major online game" -> "Active Worlds" < 1322597035 345221 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION coughs < 1322597055 152909 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1322597080 301231 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1322597133 114415 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, he remembers things from hours ago, Sgeo is quite the memory artist < 1322597170 46985 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :he should join a circus < 1322597172 433969 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's nothing, i remember things from _months_ ago. like, er, um... < 1322597176 592541 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1322597177 405491 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :you too < 1322597179 202425 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1322597179 381520 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Introversion forums, why are you down? < 1322597302 27057 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu NICK :sebbu < 1322597319 189257 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION still remembers most of his schedule throughout high school. < 1322597351 550315 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and college schedules, even! < 1322597371 238130 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i vaguely remember that i once remembered my schedule < 1322597440 848290 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I took some typing class and geometry at the same time. < 1322597442 86423 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so bad. < 1322597454 634186 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :typing < 1322597455 448778 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :class < 1322597459 862957 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :?????? < 1322597460 605969 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1322597467 329429 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was like "how to use microsoft office: the class" < 1322597473 459949 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow great < 1322597474 260527 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it included a lot of typing of documents < 1322597476 108154 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and spreadsheets. < 1322597488 777646 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was actually awesome because I would always finish first and then basically do nothing the rest of the class. < 1322597495 888249 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :normally doing nothing is boring < 1322597500 676265 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but doing nothing with a computer is AWESOME. < 1322597506 354184 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :most of my high school schedule was unscheduled time, not exactly hard to remember that schedule < 1322597511 682436 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION downloads the Uplink source. < 1322597545 210511 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: I also took this class called construction < 1322597547 428096 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was hilarious < 1322597550 702008 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and awful. < 1322597557 108476 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm imagining a class about playing with blocks < 1322597559 815411 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I USED SAWS. YEAAAAAH < 1322597570 9524 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm bad at saws. < 1322597576 606752 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :We call that DT over here. < 1322597581 533454 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well except jigsaws. jigsaws are fun. < 1322597602 237192 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I made a stick man out of metal and also a plastic self-portrait. < 1322597695 339615 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: So, a stick man out of metal and a stick man out of plastic? < 1322597707 628403 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it was a Phantom_Hoover. < 1322597759 405388 :Slereah!~butt@ANantes-259-1-173-239.w90-49.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1322597797 200262 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Frida_Kahlo_(self_portrait).jpg "Its inclusion in the article adds significantly to the article because it shows the subject of the article" < 1322597802 549419 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Frida Kahlo is the history of art. < 1322597862 235292 :Slereah_!~butt@ANantes-259-1-227-218.w83-195.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1322598364 354097 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"As you’ve discovered, the grandaddy machine-learning algorithm of them all, back-propagation, is nothing but steepest descent with reverse mode automatic differentiation. This means that if you wrote a neural network that simply evaluated, but didn’t know how to learn, and passed it into a routine for optimisation using steepest descent by reverse mode AD, then it would use back-propagation without anyone having to even know that such a thing < 1322598364 647808 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : as back-propagation existed. Internally it would actually perform exactly the same operations as back propagation." < 1322598370 645266 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: thanks for being wrong, it's made me google up things and remember how cool AD is < 1322598656 26347 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: neat < 1322598822 457269 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv log 0 < 1322598823 563153 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Infinity < 1322598827 90955 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha ha ha ha < 1322598837 697034 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv abs 0 < 1322598838 756183 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 0 < 1322598853 628683 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :shocking < 1322598860 634871 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :>deriv (\x -> if x > 5 then 0 else x) 4 < 1322598865 818845 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv (\x -> if x > 5 then 0 else x) 4 < 1322598867 42762 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 < 1322598869 853087 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv (\x -> if x > 5 then 0 else x) 6 < 1322598870 993233 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 0 < 1322598898 622226 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I put in 5 it's going to be 1, isn't it, even though that's not the right answer < 1322598901 118786 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv (\x -> if x > 5 then 0 else x) 5 < 1322598902 162558 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 < 1322598917 783619 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is it not right? < 1322598928 670073 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, nevermind.. < 1322598947 753248 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"limits? what are those?" < 1322598949 409289 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Were you expecting itto work perfectly? < 1322598953 839320 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*it to < 1322598961 349045 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no, but I can dream, can't I? < 1322598970 524095 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1322598995 634673 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, maybe there should be an if' function that ... does something < 1322599009 354231 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1322599013 496608 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how does it determine that constants have a derivative of zero but variables have a derivative of one. actually nevermind I see how it works for variables but not for constants. < 1322599038 242315 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just passes in the argument with the 1 < 1322599045 193965 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose you could have (==*) :: (Eq a) => Diff a -> Diff a -> Diff Bool; ifE :: Diff Bool -> Diff a -> Diff a, but I have no clue what you'd do with Diff Bools. < 1322599050 465756 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if' :: (Num a) -> a -> (a,a) -> (a -> a) -> (a -> a) -> a < 1322599060 470960 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t deriv < 1322599061 707446 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b. (Num a, Num b) => (Dif a -> Dif b) -> a -> b < 1322599068 35687 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh... nevermind < 1322599069 255162 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: const 1 :: Diff Double -> Diff Double < 1322599072 523466 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: === const (D 1 0) < 1322599073 39634 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: fromInteger in the Num instance? < 1322599080 745409 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i havent read the thing < 1322599081 119676 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :const (D 1 0) (D 0 1) == (D 1 0) < 1322599081 407567 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :;_; < 1322599083 68319 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :blah blah blah < 1322599088 60259 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :a while ago i read stuff about AD then i forgot it all < 1322599088 903500 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1322599105 33192 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott "bad at teaching still" hird < 1322599119 271370 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I got it < 1322599120 989611 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so nevermind. < 1322599229 6121 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: I keep forgetting fromInteger is a method of Num and not just some magical thing somewhere else. < 1322599312 957300 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv (\x -> 2*x) 3 < 1322599314 217101 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 2 < 1322599352 15254 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> deriv (sin + cos) x < 1322599352 995690 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 * cos x + 1 * negate (sin x) < 1322599357 811921 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> reduce $ deriv (sin + cos) x < 1322599358 563408 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 * cos x + 1 * negate (sin x) < 1322599361 184725 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-( < 1322599380 623125 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t reduce < 1322599381 669494 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Expr -> Expr < 1322599397 105066 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t reduce $ x - x < 1322599398 246759 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Expr < 1322599407 761040 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> reduce $ x - x < 1322599409 56329 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : x - x < 1322599418 564472 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@src reduce < 1322599419 133302 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :reduce _ 0 = undefined < 1322599419 312533 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :reduce x y = (x `quot` d) :% (y `quot` d) < 1322599419 312704 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : where d = gcd x y < 1322599419 857239 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle (a -> a) -> a -> Int -> a < 1322599420 609670 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Sequence iterateN :: Int -> (a -> a) -> a -> Seq a < 1322599420 789120 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Sequence adjust :: (a -> a) -> Int -> Seq a -> Seq a < 1322599421 200682 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.IntMap adjust :: (a -> a) -> Key -> IntMap a -> IntMap a < 1322599430 896803 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: wrong reduce < 1322599444 162117 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh. < 1322599460 726118 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd've thought that function would be one of the basic ones. < 1322599484 604037 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: To do what? Iterate a function? < 1322599487 698943 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The arguments are all the wrong way around. < 1322599493 434727 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Int -> (a -> a) -> a -> a would be the right way. < 1322599496 885822 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :iterate and !!, tada! < 1322599517 733394 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I thought Hoogle was order-blind. < 1322599530 626662 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: It doesn't exist in the stdlib. < 1322599533 146199 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just saying if it did... < 1322599633 63094 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :@pl i n f a = iterate f a !! n < 1322599633 626435 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i = flip (flip . ((!!) .) . iterate) < 1322599647 177158 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (n f a = iterate f a !! n < 1322599648 254667 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :parse error on input `=' < 1322599648 659359 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :er < 1322599655 340402 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (\n f a -> iterate f a !! n) < 1322599656 760894 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. Int -> (a -> a) -> a -> a < 1322599674 856073 :pikhq_!~pikhq@174-22-152-26.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1322599675 788053 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-147-58.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1322599840 624681 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1322599947 467915 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> foldr (\x acc -> x:acc) [] [x,y,z] < 1322599948 683658 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [x,y,z] < 1322599965 744971 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :> foldr (:) [] [x,y,z] -- before someone yells at me about the lambda < 1322599966 985173 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [x,y,z] < 1322600003 919024 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@help quickcheck < 1322600004 476751 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :help . Ask for help for . Try 'list' for all commands < 1322600008 795492 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@quickcheck < 1322600009 357367 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unknown command, try @list < 1322600010 255563 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: too late. you can't fix it. < 1322600022 42744 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :shouldn't use lambdas for simple things. < 1322600067 99711 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so. I'm kind of bad at quantum mechanics. enlighten me: is there anything in quantum mechanics that disproves determinism? < 1322600072 376808 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think there is. < 1322600089 240249 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, disproves it assuming you hold to no causal influences exceeding c < 1322600094 590083 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, no < 1322600109 183674 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hidden variables are disproved assuming no non-local influences < 1322600131 55250 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think multiple-worlds is considered deterministic without being a local variable theory < 1322600324 44601 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I < 1322600362 799438 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :'m just wondering if my deterministic viewpoint is perhaps unwarranted due to things I don't understand about the universe. < 1322601062 323872 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, kallisti update < 1322601424 975136 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1322601556 566386 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello! < 1322601616 749527 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found a 29-step wiki surf loop < 1322601978 674197 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :first link or last link? < 1322601993 726036 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It loops < 1322601995 108535 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Um < 1322602018 906099 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure which link you mean < 1322602125 198496 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you follow the first or last link on each page? < 1322602130 904190 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Last in the intro < 1322602192 827932 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I put the path in an article on our wiki < 1322602199 860921 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, that sounds off-topic < 1322602207 664438 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :In my userspace < 1322602209 589708 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1322602217 155044 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :User:Taneb/Wiki surf < 1322602222 171795 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"made because I am bored and lonely and have no access to IRC" < 1322602225 947836 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd: http://webchat.freenode.net/ < 1322602230 843185 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Blocked in school < 1322602236 871533 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :lame < 1322602650 921481 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd: i recalled some of the members of your loop from before but not the loop itself, so i followed it and the link Policy studies -> Public administration has already been broken by an edit < 1322602660 783632 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :!!! < 1322602721 972998 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is possible I made a mistake < 1322602744 75618 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd: no, there was definitely a recent edit prior to which that was correct < 1322602750 728232 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow < 1322602766 897815 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, these long loops may not be very stable :P < 1322602900 664838 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in suspect the entire Public administration -> Policy studies part was included in what we did previously - all of them sound familiar. < 1322602927 766367 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :tempting to write a bot to try and find these loops < 1322602937 185118 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*i suspect < 1322602947 550361 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :longest path from A to A has to be something CS has optimised to hell by now, right? :) < 1322602956 42335 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1322602968 118685 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :only need to do it some 2 million times to get the longest one < 1322602999 192949 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: (/is/ there a fast algorithm for that? :P) < 1322603025 426281 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yeah you just need to iterate all pages and for each page follow its path until you hit one you already visited, so it's O(n) in total < 1322603064 20304 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and obviously that's as fast as you can hope for < 1322603071 15189 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, OK :P < 1322603085 157600 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: already visited globally, or from the last iteration? < 1322603086 972857 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :of the pagespace < 1322603091 349571 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :globally < 1322603104 447976 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i guess it's not too bad < 1322603107 869505 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you want to duplicate work < 1322603127 719377 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should _still_ be O(n*max path length) if you don't, though < 1322603135 669134 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you only have to track the set of seen pages < 1322603138 605433 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :not all the paths < 1322603142 620669 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can flush out paths to disk < 1322603146 124028 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it won't take much ram either < 1322603174 35866 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :seen pages and the path lengths of them < 1322603205 270871 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hm right < 1322603256 313276 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it will be slightly different if you hit a seen page from a previous iteration or a seen page from this one (the latter means a _new_ loop, naturally) < 1322603307 110013 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: um you can't have a new loop with an immutable set can you < 1322603311 939392 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because each page has exactly one successor < 1322603350 60894 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :by definition there is only zero or one cycles involving any given page < 1322603402 186533 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: by "new" i mean "not previously discovered" < 1322603411 890418 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1322603639 89893 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: dammit now I want to write this :P < 1322603689 679731 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :getting the intuitive "last link" detection quite right might be tricky. < 1322603698 647070 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially with your section rule. < 1322603700 745089 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1322603726 383086 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well things like references and the "citation needed" links don't look like [[...]] in wikicode < 1322603743 747610 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well ok < 1322603744 96790 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so once you have a section, just scan back for a [[...]] < 1322603756 800190 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :to isolate the section, just take up to the next line starting with = < 1322603764 688162 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or command < 1322604113 740436 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: given a page p, start with a node of just that, and connect it to all the n-chains of p. the 0-chain of p is following the first link, the 1-chain of p is following the second (at each step, ofc), the (-1)-chain of p is following the last, the (-2)-chain is second-last, etc. < 1322604122 574065 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm that wouldn't work unless all pages had the same number of links :( < 1322604131 741694 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I JUST WANT A PRETTY GRAPH < 1322604147 476654 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1322604149 886166 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet JOIN :#esoteric < 1322604352 114526 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ofc i could just draw a graph of all links but that kind of thing has been done and it isn't related to this game :P < 1322604371 472977 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I wonder how well graphviz deals with such massive graphs...) < 1322604939 877010 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 QUIT :*.net *.split < 1322604960 786071 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :smallest netsplit < 1322604963 396806 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :netsplit kitten < 1322604968 135086 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so adorable < 1322605066 839909 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm pretty sure that that's just oerjan's quit message < 1322605083 85946 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :...no, it's not. < 1322605091 21780 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322605091 866302 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :he usually goes for "Good night". < 1322605114 819981 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then he must be unusually susceptible to netsplits? < 1322605125 732564 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :false < 1322605127 844307 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1322605132 238038 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan is up all the time < 1322605136 509172 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or I sort of roll about half the people in this channel to one in my head? < 1322605176 792515 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder in which half am I then < 1322605180 404185 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: oh. by the way < 1322605186 443600 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I found an example of an applicative functor that isn't a monad, IIRC < 1322605188 410928 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :way the by. < 1322605196 993409 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: on the epigram blog. < 1322605198 778339 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :weigh the bi < 1322605215 310525 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT DOESN'T COUNT IF IT NEEDS DEPENDENT TYPING < 1322605230 276359 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: um no, in haskell. < 1322605232 430814 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: http://www.e-pig.org/epilogue/?p=186 < 1322605240 614054 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322605241 555186 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Structure cops will note that De is another example of an applicative functor which is not a monad — join would bring things from the far future to the near future, and that had better not be possible. However, where applicative functors in general only pull through traversable functors (containers with finitely many elements), De pulls through all containers. So it’s a bit special. I wonder what it is." < 1322605260 975721 :derrik!~xix@gprs-inet-65-40.elisa.ee QUIT :Quit: quitter < 1322605348 99240 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a simple way to tell if a list is finite in Haskell? < 1322605372 685089 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"‘NuDe’ is a fixpoint giving co-trees with delayed children." < 1322605382 862138 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I SEE < 1322605396 836626 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd: not that halts if it isn't < 1322605438 847621 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it's mcbride, you are surely used to the puns by now :P < 1322605445 487078 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd: mathematically impossible < 1322605450 665444 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm i may not have read that many of his < 1322605467 620297 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: really? < 1322605471 655195 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but he's so cool :( < 1322605633 665261 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are you... ah.. haskell & theory < 1322605653 896194 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's all we ever do < 1322605702 297660 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I actually understand folds now < 1322605711 737833 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you < 1322605712 221435 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1322605717 20208 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just sort of think of accum as the rest of the fold < 1322605717 920721 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :how have you failed to understand folds for this long < 1322605718 573617 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm that argument that De isn't a Monad looks rather like "it isn't a monad because we have disallowed the obvious way of making it one for semantic reasons." < 1322605724 478531 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> foldr f z [a,b,c,d] < 1322605725 365319 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : f a (f b (f c (f d z))) < 1322605733 546036 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think we should make a #esoteric-haskell; there's been far more Haskell chat than Minecraft chat. < 1322605734 964070 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@src foldr < 1322605735 465687 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :foldr f z [] = z < 1322605735 645181 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :foldr f z (x:xs) = f x (foldr f z xs) < 1322605742 5075 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: um no < 1322605746 579497 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: because the implementation isn't the specification < 1322605752 144473 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: (the specification doesn't talk about unsafeCoerce!) < 1322605752 440826 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: +1 < 1322605758 967568 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Haskell is the best esoteric language! < 1322605761 717752 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd, quiet, you. < 1322605765 479396 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: like < 1322605772 397689 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I actually understand that definition better than the expanded form, I think < 1322605772 829956 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: the implementation could _also_ implement a function that exposed the unsafeCoerceness < 1322605790 368085 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: being able to implement an interface for an implementation doesn't mean that the semantic model can do it, because exposing that interface might /break/ the model < 1322605791 827290 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I though that Minecraft has been forgotten < 1322605815 623481 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: s/:/`f`/, s/[]/z/ < 1322605818 618917 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :a : b : c : d : [] < 1322605819 86320 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :-> < 1322605824 933820 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :a `f` b `f` c `f` d `f` z < 1322605827 934773 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(except right-associative) < 1322605828 114033 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only because of the Bukkit team's lack of appropriate psychostimulants. < 1322605845 293731 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :infixr 9 `f` < 1322605886 603192 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, i'm not convinced that it gives an example of an Applicative in _haskell_ which cannot be made into a Monad. < 1322605900 199942 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: because you need unsafeCoerce to implement it? < 1322605919 230948 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :In dependent typing, is it possible to make a thingy such that it's impossible to implement a Monad thingy that violates the monad laws? < 1322605925 485374 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in, the compiler checks the monad laws? < 1322605953 829747 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 PRIVMSG #esoteric :um the unsafeCoerce isn't even used in the Applicative instance. which is obviously isomorphic to Identity, btw. < 1322605959 218408 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: it "checks" them because you have to prove them < 1322605968 854539 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well ok < 1322605970 367578 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, cool < 1322605972 325386 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you do? < 1322605977 831905 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, dependent typing. < 1322605981 935676 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: "cool", heh < 1322605994 162789 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Spoken like someone who's never tried to prove anything substantial in Coq or Agda before < 1322606079 96127 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The, um < 1322606090 376522 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The top result for "hardback" on DDG is Memory Beta. < 1322606099 60934 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in, the definition box at the top. < 1322606105 567664 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: do those things have unsafeProveAnything? < 1322606119 941528 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: well yes < 1322606133 622135 :oerjan!oerjan@129.241.210.46 QUIT :Quit: unsafeGoodNight < 1322606149 465805 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :They have Axiom unsafeProveAnything : forall x, x. < 1322606158 132168 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Remember when we created ABCDEF...G? < 1322606204 462099 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK so I have discovered a cupboard in the school lab which contains, among other things, toluene, nitric acid and sulphuric acid. < 1322606205 771922 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :FINALLY < 1322606237 152259 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1322606366 186837 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net/wiki/User:Taneb/ABCDEF...G < 1322606378 158941 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone make sense out of that < 1322606435 803765 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1322606442 143289 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :We didn't even implement ABCDEF < 1322606566 357329 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell oerjan Sgeo needs a swat for abbreviating Adjudicated Blind Collaborative Design Esolang Factory < 1322606566 594089 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1322606626 785776 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1322606727 547041 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been swatted for less < 1322606922 474368 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-4d0b7a53.pool.mediaWays.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1322607028 489692 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :AbstractBeanClassDelegationExceptionFactoryGenerator < 1322607269 393327 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle zipWith5 < 1322607269 715946 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.List zipWith5 :: (a -> b -> c -> d -> e -> f) -> [a] -> [b] -> [c] -> [d] -> [e] -> [f] < 1322607271 347878 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yesss < 1322607380 558766 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, what's a fast way of doing (last . takeWhile p) < 1322607484 182171 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@121-74-65-236.telstraclear.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1322607484 399347 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@121-74-65-236.telstraclear.net QUIT :Changing host < 1322607484 399488 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1322607641 168459 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :last . takeWhile p < 1322607772 135675 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :foldr1 (\a b -> if p b then b else a), maybe < 1322607903 824128 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: Fast :P < 1322607907 212689 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Fair enough < 1322607911 799412 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm fine if it has a Maybe result < 1322607967 289306 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :How is that slow? < 1322608011 164966 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: Hmm, I was thinking it'd involve two traversals, but it won't will it < 1322608012 189373 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alright then < 1322608030 506296 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :It might, but that's still fast < 1322608045 737807 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cons, uncons, cons, uncons < 1322608057 15018 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's what I meant, they're in lock-step < 1322608060 133779 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :In a strict language it'd be slow < 1322608069 773798 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'd still be fast! < 1322608075 681509 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :...unless allocation is slow. < 1322608139 547509 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: I have a fear of traversing lists multiple times < 1322608143 134947 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just don't do it, ever < 1322608397 389006 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-169-137.as13285.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1322608441 90904 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :{-# RULE "warm blanket" last . takeWhile p = my'Faster'LastTakeWhile #-} < 1322608558 26089 :elliott!elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1322609062 354378 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1322609266 875244 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1322609450 483688 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1322610999 129561 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1322611099 399961 :augur[afk]!~augur@208.58.5.87 NICK :augur