< 1330906061 478643 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric : http://esolangs.org/wiki/Talk:Basic_Input/Output_Commander WHY WOULD YOU ARCHIVE THE PAGE LITERALLY DAYS AFTER IT WAS CREATED // why would you archive the page ... at all. < 1330906187 748363 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: Well, archiving talk pages when they grow long is reasonable. Archiving them days after they were created, and are one section long, is not. < 1330906195 34393 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(+ not using the template designed for the purpose) < 1330906364 467565 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll add a comment "Please don't archive when the talk page isn't long", then a day later it'll vanish, replaced with Archive 2 < 1330906421 759471 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: Naw. < 1330906423 903254 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll undo it soon. < 1330906454 291021 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: Actually, go ahead, then it won't look like I'm picking on the guy when I delete the archiev :P < 1330906455 365714 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*archive < 1330906527 813601 :CHeReP!~cherep@217.172.23.118 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1330906711 695183 :derdon!~derdon@pD9E1D382.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1330906739 777217 :cswords!~cswords@c-98-223-234-80.hsd1.in.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330906948 763101 :cswords_!~cswords@c-98-223-234-80.hsd1.in.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1330906951 506513 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what display manager are you using? < 1330907104 954196 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :startx < 1330907127 871226 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Occasionally I've used xdm, which can be whipped up into looking reasonable rather than like ass in a few minutes. < 1330907336 280254 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think slim looks pretty nice once properly configured. < 1330907382 547159 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :slim is unmaintained. < 1330907404 508314 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...didn't we already have this conversation and determine that it's maintained? < 1330907454 720047 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not to my knowledge. < 1330907478 698337 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless the website is out of date as well, it still has a maintainer. < 1330907494 887925 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plenty of packages "have maintainers" but are unmaintained. < 1330907503 949624 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, yeah < 1330907512 140219 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, last release was 2012-02. However the release before that was 2010-07 and is what Arch has (and I bet Debian too). < 1330907519 557949 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps it's been revived. < 1330907528 721593 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that still means it likely has a couple of years bitrot in it. < 1330907536 102843 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, I configured my prntscr key to automatically place the image in my dropbox public folder, and then copy the public URL to primary selection. < 1330907545 143945 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's basically really obnoxious to anyone else but me. < 1330907557 602352 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I could, if I wanted, just spam second-by-second screenshots. < 1330907565 600493 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dropbox isn't that fast. < 1330907572 270122 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes but the public url is instant < 1330907575 578177 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1330907577 671898 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you do have to wait for it to upload. < 1330907580 937523 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :however < 1330907584 291331 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise the link is just 404 < 1330907689 110696 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also my xmobar is completely riced out. < 1330907705 723293 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm more ricer than those youtubers with compiz. < 1330907736 193080 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(okay, maybe not that extreme... that's pretty ricery) < 1330907737 895150 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :xmobar? dzen2, man. < 1330907739 700812 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just ask shachaf. < 1330907746 457661 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I considered trying dzen < 1330907759 893806 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then... xmobar was already working and laziness happened. < 1330907770 133490 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :dzen2 is actually not that good, but I'm bound by pact of honour to shachaf to not use xmobar, and by pact of fizzie to use what he uses, i.e. dzen2. < 1330907780 263579 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1330907786 916514 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, what actual features does it have. < 1330907792 784662 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that make it worthy. < 1330907815 280702 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably nothing over dzen. xmonad has integration for both. < 1330907823 994997 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm. < 1330907825 960295 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*over xmobar < 1330907861 446291 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :gaze at my obnoxiously dark theme http://dl.dropbox.com/u/16495819/2012-03-04_19-36-26_1366x768.png < 1330907896 556298 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your text rendering settings are all wrong, :( < 1330907906 474481 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, untouched? yes < 1330907925 395455 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have medium/full hinting when you want slight. < 1330907939 844001 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1330907940 30740 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1330907940 30996 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1330907940 31105 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1330907940 31205 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1330907940 309232 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : hintslight < 1330907942 297743 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1330907944 301143 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1330907946 337217 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1330907948 327607 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Put that in /etc/fonts/local.conf. < 1330907958 597128 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Except IIRC sometimes Chrome has trouble listening to those. Pah.) < 1330907961 274244 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/those/that/ < 1330907976 848913 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also why the fuck do you use a line cursor rather than a block in your terminal? < 1330908018 523315 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, that's not Chrome. < 1330908021 20049 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why aren't you using Chrome? < 1330908024 533074 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because firefox < 1330908030 395210 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also because google privacy policy < 1330908053 63436 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Wait, you are? < 1330908056 352543 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess so... < 1330908056 554194 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I like line cursor because that's what I'm used to. < 1330908068 255607 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION didn't realize that pact existed. < 1330908078 427190 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Use xmobar if you like. I don't care. < 1330908091 399132 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: "Google privacy policy" is rather irrelevant to Chrome. < 1330908105 704918 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, Mozilla aren't all sunshine and flowers, either. < 1330908106 723040 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, does this page display properly for you in Chrome? It doesn't for me but does in Firefox. < 1330908106 910003 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1330908107 96684 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.flyingmachinestudios.com/programming/chunky-bacon-lisp/ < 1330908119 919665 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: Looks fine to me. < 1330908127 573365 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: also I was having issues with html5 video in youtube for some reason. < 1330908132 135897 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :firefox doesn't have that problem. < 1330908157 811130 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm not using Chrome. < 1330908168 960488 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hope there's no pact about that that I wasn't aware of. < 1330908186 331219 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: why do I want slight hinting < 1330908189 88247 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know much about hinting < 1330908196 423946 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: Yes, Chromium 17.0.963.56 displays that page the same as Firefox 10.0.2 here. < 1330908213 851023 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Stronger hinting ruins the line shapes of the fonts and makes them look thin. < 1330908228 244818 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no words jumbled together and going off margins? < 1330908240 832280 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Slight hinting is "blurrier", but only for the short amount of time it takes you to get used to it, and is easier to read after that (on the majority of displays). It's the default for Ubuntu. < 1330908243 300199 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: Nope. < 1330908249 573447 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: I'm on the Chrome developer build, though. < 1330908250 156409 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm < 1330908252 305573 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, Chromium. < 1330908259 619753 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I seem to be using the same exact build < 1330908262 349994 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well < 1330908266 427205 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't have a local.conf. should I create it? < 1330908274 283829 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Developer Build 121963 < 1330908278 233090 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :On Ubuntu 11.10 < 1330908287 642421 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, Ubuntu 11.10? Wat? < 1330908295 612690 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wat wat? < 1330908295 858391 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought I was on 11.04, hmm < 1330908308 256492 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Yeah. You'll need to restart your session for it to take effect, too. < 1330908314 669099 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: (You might also want to enable subpixel rendering, while you're at it.) < 1330908333 76495 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Could it possibly be LXDE's fault? < 1330908335 847978 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you want to do so: < 1330908344 576671 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ cd /etc/fonts/conf.d && sudo ln -s ../conf.avail/10-sub-pixel-rgb.conf . < 1330908358 648139 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should figure out how to screenshots on here < 1330908359 743835 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :take < 1330908393 504625 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: what are you running? < 1330908399 154836 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, Lubuntu 11.10 < 1330908404 612585 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION installs scrot < 1330908425 96689 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what I'm using. < 1330908443 240745 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@messages < 1330908443 429327 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott said 8h 25m 10s ago: gosc is the compiler ais523 talks about a lot from idealised ALGOL (with lambdas) to VHDL < 1330908452 487452 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Lubuntu? Why? < 1330908483 753470 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://imgur.com/Qz89S < 1330908490 851117 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why does that page look like that? < 1330908524 128284 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Try decreasing + re-increasing font size. < 1330908539 80991 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: er, no. scrot. < 1330908542 208557 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm running Debian. < 1330908547 98016 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :That works. < 1330908567 987143 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :scrot was already installed. And apparently running the last few times I tried to take screenshots and thought I failed < 1330908577 259102 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Oh, right. < 1330908580 227842 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use scrot too. < 1330908599 55140 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you had any trouble with ACPI? < 1330908605 364771 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :my laptop doesn't suspend when I close the lid. < 1330908644 939226 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :This laptop doesn't ever do that, I don't think. < 1330908653 590998 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never use suspend on here though. < 1330908657 89444 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :What GTK theme is that? < 1330908666 347882 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine? none. < 1330908669 372913 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a firefox theme < 1330908675 183406 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :GTK apps look like shit still. < 1330908687 309336 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, maybe I can actually re-read Boatmurdered now < 1330908724 960690 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the past tense of creep (verb)? < 1330908731 831048 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :crept < 1330908732 362185 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1330908733 776332 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :crept < 1330908741 115413 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh yeah. < 1330908741 460042 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :crept? or creeped? < 1330908749 639386 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :crept < 1330908750 805978 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Was wondering why "creeped" had red squigglies. < 1330908754 235862 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stupid irregular verbs. < 1330908760 82035 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :welcome to English. < 1330908762 279921 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :please, have a seat. < 1330908771 634887 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think creeped has a different meaning, as in creeped out < 1330908782 654644 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :"crept out" X-D < 1330908791 558278 :iambored!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 NICK :PiRSquared < 1330908804 147215 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :iambored at the jamboree < 1330908806 657822 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :He creeped out of the photo shoot, utterly crept out. < 1330908806 951583 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: as long as I'm running firefox and terminal apps everything looks dandy. < 1330908815 291709 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if I open up windowed emacs.. < 1330908816 638035 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION shivers. < 1330908820 517912 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: emacs has colour schemes too. < 1330908823 51940 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :GTK won't help much there. < 1330908830 404444 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Install the elisp goodies package. < 1330908835 130241 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've just been using emacs -nw ... < 1330908843 900085 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yuck. < 1330908847 712183 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: I TAKE IT YOU'RE NOT GOING TO MAKE THAT COMMENT < 1330908853 71967 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Nope. < 1330908872 99988 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: this has been a good venture. I've learned a few things about linux. < 1330908877 787595 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, I've learned that screen is awesome. < 1330908902 273977 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish there was also a "screen" for X apps. < 1330908911 542868 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's probably a way to do it. < 1330908916 980422 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't like screen. < 1330908920 659116 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: ;_; < 1330908934 113437 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like it solely for the reason that it preserves console programs as I repeatedly restart my X session. < 1330908935 642143 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: If you just use screen for the detaching (as implied by your X apps comment), you might consider dtach. < 1330908942 66360 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1330908944 571541 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it doesn't do anything more than that. < 1330908948 346113 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also I'm not sure it's in Debian. < 1330908958 211686 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's really all I want < 1330908965 942768 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the ctrl+a thing actually gets in the way < 1330908974 160183 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes dtatch is in the repos < 1330908976 597235 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it has to have some key to detach :) < 1330908981 544615 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :screen's and dtach's are both configurable, I think. < 1330908987 205171 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, yes there's detaching for X apps, but it's kind of ugly I think < 1330908997 796178 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know screens is. < 1330909003 366365 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :X gives you one nicety that nobody wants (network transparency) and withholds all the others. < 1330909003 939657 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(configurable) < 1330909028 475522 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just... haven't. I think I have configure fatigue. < 1330909030 31045 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :if that's a thing. < 1330909102 656566 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I can re-read Boatmurdered now. < 1330909108 663162 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: NOPE. < 1330909110 326472 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOT ALLOWED < 1330909111 227353 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, would an epub of Boatmurdered be a bad idea? < 1330909114 926713 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : Hey, maybe I can actually re-read Boatmurdered now < 1330909115 143653 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : Maybe I can re-read Boatmurdered now. < 1330909122 283379 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe Sgeo_ can re-read Boatmurdered now. < 1330909123 810380 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf was I even doing I forgot... < 1330909130 482276 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Reading conduit documentation. < 1330909131 788181 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe sgeo- can re_read boatmurdered now < 1330909138 36998 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'm losing my memory. < 1330909145 256338 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe Sgeo_ can be boatmurdered now < 1330909148 927112 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, I think I'm having some memory issues. < 1330909155 537093 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, I think I'm forgetting stuff. < 1330909157 504104 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a headache. :( < 1330909159 897385 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe Sgeo_ can transmute into a boat now. < 1330909164 640084 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe sgeo_ < 1330909166 537680 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no that was a long time ago. < 1330909176 61655 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was... likely about to configure something. < 1330909184 115553 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :as that's what I've been doing for the past 4-5 days or so. < 1330909196 997244 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's see. emacs theme? < 1330909209 434858 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure. < 1330909213 303723 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :emacs theme? < 1330909235 459853 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, right. I was going to restart slim. < 1330909241 517214 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Restart slim? < 1330909246 489346 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, just quit yr session to get the hinting. < 1330909253 803160 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then, do that. < 1330909254 396403 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, I guess that might technically restart slim. < 1330909274 419861 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So how long did it take you to get sick of Xfce? < 1330909275 674474 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't tell if it's different. < 1330909281 747409 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Screenshot? < 1330909282 56991 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :who me? I never used it. < 1330909285 683448 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://dl.dropbox.com/u/16495819/2012-03-04_20-00-50_1366x768.png < 1330909298 219158 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it looks a bit better I think. < 1330909304 283386 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...oh I need to change my irssi font. < 1330909308 335475 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or... is that terminators font? < 1330909310 223028 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't even know. < 1330909312 715103 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :How much is color needed to read Boatmurdered? < 1330909315 910236 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want an epub version < 1330909319 593699 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: It's identical. < 1330909326 211536 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: What does it look like in Firefox? < 1330909330 407329 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, you did use Xfce. < 1330909335 839435 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so irssi uses whatever the terminal uses right? < 1330909344 643711 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I did? < 1330909349 31092 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you sure? < 1330909352 646759 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1330909361 303261 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shut up with stupid terminal questions and screenshot Firefox. < 1330909361 703924 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because... I'm pretty sure I went straight from Ubuntu with GNOME 2 to Debian with xmonad. < 1330909382 251345 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, you installed Xfce against my advice. < 1330909389 840078 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"They literally put the work into the public domain by putting it on a public forum for everyones use." < 1330909390 181185 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1330909393 529379 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=100035.0 < 1330909394 696367 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no you're thinking of someone else. < 1330909400 251923 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone please hand me a face to palm. < 1330909416 403215 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: This isn't amusing. < 1330909421 649599 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://dl.dropbox.com/u/16495819/2012-03-04_20-03-02_1366x768.png < 1330909429 102437 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I have not once touched Xfce < 1330909432 112783 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think we had like < 1330909437 158801 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I guess the others assumed they would be greatful that other people are spending their free time to help spread the influence and accessability of their work, and not asking for a wage or any payment whatsoever for doing so. < 1330909437 345579 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :They should be greatful. < 1330909437 345775 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Asking permission is like saying "Please oh please can I spend my time putting your work into a format so even more people can read it". < 1330909437 345884 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck that, hes doing them a favor, though I'm sure he will ask out of pure courtesy. < 1330909437 544306 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :" < 1330909438 433877 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :a brief conversation about it, as I was considering new DEs < 1330909453 473777 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Firefox's toolbar uses the new settings. (You can compare with your previous screenshot.) < 1330909459 382488 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whether the text does is another matter. < 1330909462 113424 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(In Firefox.) < 1330909470 119161 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your terminal continues to use the older sessions; I think I know why. < 1330909478 995845 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :screen < 1330909480 965156 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1330909486 52824 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1330909494 192642 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right that wouldn't make sense. < 1330909494 382178 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Put this in ~/.Xresources: < 1330909495 188627 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[ < 1330909496 935267 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Xft.rgba: 1 < 1330909497 122150 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Xft.lcdfilter: lcddefault < 1330909497 122343 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Xft.hintstyle: hintslight < 1330909497 308704 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :]] < 1330909508 248687 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And put < 1330909509 700810 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :xrdb -merge ~/.Xresources < 1330909512 488623 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah my .Xresources is empty. < 1330909514 690198 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :in your .xinitrc/.xsession/whatever. < 1330909518 657038 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then restart your session again. < 1330909528 566868 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, scratch that lcdfilter line. < 1330909534 914301 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, don't. < 1330909551 834249 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gah this person is a moron < 1330909552 611381 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh, I'm guessing those random [[ ]] things are part of the config? < 1330909565 628482 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: No, that's how I quote long sessions of text. < 1330909565 965062 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: wat < 1330909567 376125 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sections < 1330909569 312149 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah okay. < 1330909572 806247 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seemed out of place. < 1330909577 853709 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I know you don't believe that copyright is a good thing, but do you at least recognize that currently, the law is what it is? < 1330909586 277492 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume you do because you're sane. < 1330909594 428099 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what is lcdfilter < 1330909605 125782 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it make hinting better on LCDs? < 1330909607 763247 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: What do you mean "what it is"? < 1330909625 928727 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: The LCD filter is complicated font rendering stuff you wouldn't understand(tm). lcddefault is actually... the default. < 1330909632 828334 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you can remove that line. < 1330909634 447010 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :shocking < 1330909636 40862 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Yes, I changed my mind again.) < 1330909636 955552 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :That it exists. That it can be illegal to redistribute stuff, even if it's not immoral. < 1330909650 560675 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I'm actually delusional. < 1330909654 50414 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm assuming it's a filter thigny that makes the stuff better on the liquid crystals? < 1330909656 872983 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everything is legal apart from killing pigs. < 1330909686 13741 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: The rgba setting is what turns on subpixel (= LCD) rendering. The lcdfilter is just a parameter. < 1330909703 858721 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :See http://www.freetype.org/freetype2/docs/reference/ft2-lcd_filtering.html if you must know the details. < 1330909706 894628 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just remove that line. < 1330909717 58541 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love details < 1330909732 612143 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, read the thread I linked? < 1330909753 981699 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: recommendations on console font? I'm about to switch to Inconsolata (which is the font in my xmobar) < 1330909759 490653 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: I read about three posts. Is the rest relevant or interesting? < 1330909774 288609 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: I use the default. Inconsolata isn't very good with Freetype IMO. < 1330909782 470684 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Default = dejavu) < 1330909792 469153 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Get hinting + subpixel working before changing. < 1330909798 833266 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it starts getting dumb about 5 posts in. < 1330909800 610068 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'll look different enough that you might change your mind. < 1330909873 429932 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yes < 1330909879 507450 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it looks much different. < 1330909905 278426 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Screenshot? (For important science reasons. Also if you included Firefox with web page text that would be helpful.) < 1330909910 87614 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I am the Font Expert.) < 1330909923 751215 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: "I seriously doubt the legality of your statements." What an idiot, hasn't he heard of the FIRST AMENDMENT? < 1330909983 83423 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :That I assume is just poor phrasing on his part. < 1330909997 149602 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume he meant to say legal correctness < 1330910010 113372 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://dl.dropbox.com/u/16495819/2012-03-04_20-12-50_1366x768.png < 1330910046 376118 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you didn't really specify what kind of website < 1330910049 13612 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I went with the best one. < 1330910061 504844 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that looks correct. Including the objective matter of which website to choose. < 1330910076 773989 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :good good < 1330910085 171121 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, some colour fringing on one or two pieces of text on the site, but I assume it's due to the size and background; looks correct to me. < 1330910085 667369 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm noticing that inconsolata actually looks kind of weird now. < 1330910095 678969 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Actually xmobar has looked like that the entire time. < 1330910099 968358 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems to be ignoring your settings in general. < 1330910104 287563 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh good. < 1330910112 456327 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compare < 1330910112 693413 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://dl.dropbox.com/u/16495819/2012-03-04_19-36-26_1366x768.png < 1330910113 811679 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://dl.dropbox.com/u/16495819/2012-03-04_20-12-50_1366x768.png < 1330910129 118416 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...this convenient screen shot may be a bad idea < 1330910130 890527 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does have quite awful colour fringing. I think that's due to the size it's at. < 1330910134 243679 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :as elliott is going to compile a record of my screens < 1330910136 566935 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and do something nefarious < 1330910138 972706 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://dl.dropbox.com/u/16495819/2012-03-04_20-12-50_1366x768.png < 1330910142 960877 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :er.... < 1330910146 945323 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I have this habit of middle clicking links < 1330910148 946579 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :THANKS HADN'T SEEN THAT ONE. < 1330910163 58265 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: You can set rxvt up to open those in a browser. < 1330910166 478463 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(What terminal are you using?) < 1330910168 837796 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :terminator < 1330910169 234363 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(If it's not urxvt, it's wrong.) < 1330910177 513308 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :terminator has fancy link stuff < 1330910179 729432 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just middle clicked < 1330910230 250260 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-151-191.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1330910234 579676 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I have to add something to xmobar config? < 1330910235 329705 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-200-101.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330910251 884757 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric : http://sprunge.us/EYXN?haskell < 1330910270 520300 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really know anything about xmobar configuration. < 1330910279 563350 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it uses some obscene pseudo-Haskell record syntax < 1330910279 750167 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd just change the font to Mono. :p < 1330910283 503392 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not pseudo-. < 1330910285 101269 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's Haskell. < 1330910297 35965 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not though < 1330910301 567921 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in, I believe it does the same trick as xmonad. < 1330910302 258621 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean it's not an actual Haskell program obviously. < 1330910307 839132 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I really think it is. < 1330910312 21342 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc it's pseudo < 1330910312 300057 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...there's no main. < 1330910317 705296 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a Haskell expression. < 1330910320 248839 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :just < 1330910321 837666 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it gives shitty parsec-like errors < 1330910323 927288 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :made to look like haskell < 1330910327 267650 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, okay. < 1330910329 331491 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That sucks. < 1330910331 507448 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1330910335 697725 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :dzen2's configuration is... okay, not any better, but less tacky. < 1330910344 366883 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Why not just use xmonad's xmobar module? < 1330910353 921008 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what now? < 1330910363 876439 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, it doesn't have one. < 1330910366 279353 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It only has one for Dzen. < 1330910366 996815 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is this i am bad at computer < 1330910370 581944 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Take that, xmobar!!! < 1330910387 667726 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll ask #xmonad about the font stuffs. < 1330910406 598556 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :What? < 1330910410 821870 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :xmonad is unrelated to xmobar. < 1330910415 283886 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't spam some random other channel. < 1330910425 337860 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :#xmonad helps people with all sorts of things < 1330910429 984356 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :including things completely unrelated to xmonad < 1330910435 221764 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :like how to get a display manager working. < 1330910435 586277 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, it looks like it's actually using the same settings as your real settings now. < 1330910435 773044 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :how kind < 1330910445 25652 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just colour fringing badly because of the font and size. < 1330910455 778255 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see. < 1330910463 401685 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Courier perhaps? I like courier.... < 1330910474 556342 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is font expert. < 1330910484 334041 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Just put "Mono" there and it'll use the same as your terminal. < 1330910490 975602 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't use Courier. You probably don't even have Courier. < 1330910497 140649 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I do actually. < 1330910498 717990 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe not. < 1330910505 261902 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(That is, xft:Mono-9.5.) < 1330910505 448741 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I installed something that looked like it would have courier. < 1330910509 510977 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Except it should be xft:Mono:size=9.5.) < 1330910517 978144 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, wait, is one in pt and the other px. < 1330910522 474141 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gah, it's too late for this crap. < 1330910525 638456 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1330910528 80442 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Courier New, probably. < 1330910529 160773 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not Courier. < 1330910538 746572 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :er, yes. < 1330910541 791488 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Courier New. < 1330910557 186010 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :how about Goudy Old Style? < 1330910562 419148 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zapfino. < 1330910567 449208 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :.... < 1330910568 873605 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :too fancy < 1330910572 924532 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The naming of ridiculous fonts can now end, as I've taken it to the fixed point. < 1330910581 871848 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :dude goudy old style isn't ridiculous. < 1330910588 605489 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :old style fonts are the best. < 1330910630 478398 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooooh wait < 1330910631 695483 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Chiller < 1330910633 933262 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeaaaaah < 1330910635 369861 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Didot. < 1330910648 144027 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that will complement my dark theme (and soul) < 1330910654 164268 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Computer Modern. < 1330910654 351030 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :red chiller < 1330910685 939675 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'll write my next paper in Zapfino < 1330910754 741463 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: I like the resolution, where the guy admits he's wrong on an argument that hinges on SA's irrelevant paywall. < 1330910769 638799 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Fixedsys < 1330910773 364394 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :A good twist ending to a fine comedy. < 1330910783 853933 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Impact. < 1330910789 128091 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeaaaaah < 1330910796 728912 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :22 point Impact < 1330910798 212710 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :for my xmobar < 1330910799 603806 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm feeling it. < 1330910817 137159 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*72 point < 1330910822 748947 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :72 point Impact is the typeface of a generation. < 1330910838 953571 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*font < 1330910840 180574 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1330910847 895490 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you write neatly? < 1330910851 734081 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1330910905 296556 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1330910906 891514 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(no) < 1330910931 150210 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: is there a way to configure xscreensaver to make it look less shitty? < 1330910941 407092 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :How's it look shitty? < 1330910945 894370 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But just don't use a screensaver. < 1330910955 991165 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the about window that pops up on startup gives me flashbacks of Windows 95 < 1330910980 236428 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's jwz, man. The flashback you're looking for is Netscape 3. < 1330911001 668815 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or I guess I should say: is there a better screensaver / lock thing < 1330911019 197750 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think anyone uses anything other than xscreensaver for screen saving. For locking, sure. < 1330911028 84747 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've never seen xscreensaver pop up a window on startup < 1330911030 892318 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's xlock, or slock (http://tools.suckless.org/slock). < 1330911047 567704 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :(if you've seen it, you must be doing it wrong) < 1330911081 133058 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see no options to "remove obnoxious about screen" < 1330911200 172303 :cheater_!~cheater@dslb-084-057-039-207.pools.arcor-ip.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1330911240 780416 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: So how goes musl C++? < 1330911473 927151 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-200-101.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: 0.9.0 should support C++, current git basically works. < 1330911508 309293 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-200-101.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Current work is convincing LLVM devs to not try to use std{in,out,err} as lvalues. < 1330911551 96167 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: let's say in the future I want to completely move this setup to a new Debian install... < 1330911561 818475 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :would it be insane to copy root into the new install? < 1330911574 290122 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: "Copy root"? < 1330911578 89046 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...yeah < 1330911581 467783 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you copied /, you'd be copying... the entire installation. < 1330911582 529287 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I'm guessing "yes" < 1330911585 895373 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thus making it not a "new Debian install" at all. < 1330911589 207790 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1330911594 675718 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the idea. < 1330911596 109496 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why would you want a new Debian install? < 1330911598 766174 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, say I have a new computer. < 1330911604 834261 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I want all of this stuff exactly the same < 1330911605 568289 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-200-101.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(C spec requires that those be macros that evaluate to a value of type FILE*, musl defines them as FILE* const variables and #define stdin (stdin)) < 1330911614 5863 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Oh. That would be unwise. < 1330911639 480136 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so... copy every config file over by hand on the new system? sounds fun. < 1330911645 271682 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: You can copy over non-dotfiles in ~, and important dotfiles (xmonad.hs, whatever xmobar's is called, .Xresources, .xsession, emacs config, etc.) individually. < 1330911651 758266 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric : Current work is convincing LLVM devs to not try to use std{in,out,err} as lvalues. // wut < 1330911658 187991 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Don't copy everything, just important stuff. < 1330911672 225671 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: You can keep dotfiles you care about in a $VCS repository and put it on GitHub or whatever. < 1330911675 624573 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-200-101.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: Yes, they're morons and think that they can use them as lvalues. < 1330911680 533038 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then it's easier to use multiple machines. < 1330911689 430118 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-200-101.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which kinda-sorta works on glibc. < 1330911711 128416 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hm, okay. < 1330911716 139470 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just likely to forget what all I've configured. < 1330911725 720868 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :particularly in /etc < 1330911728 276863 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not so much in home < 1330911740 991564 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-200-101.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Testing hasn't been *extensive* of musl's C++ support as yet, but it sure seems to work. < 1330911745 771509 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: You can put parts of /etc in a repo too. < 1330911747 80923 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-200-101.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :cmake has been built, for instance. < 1330911755 841571 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: But most of them you'd want to maintain as essentially diffs. < 1330911778 548150 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Things like local.conf could be copied wholesale, but modifying existing configs = you don't want to overwrite newer versions with that. < 1330911785 832339 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: KDE? :p < 1330911791 688368 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Chromium? < 1330911794 556851 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: also I discovered mpd. < 1330911803 731679 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know if you've ever used it. < 1330911804 350203 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :mpd is "okay". < 1330911815 365150 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I preferred xmms2 architecture-wise, but I forget why. < 1330911816 262137 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-200-101.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Not been tested just because those require a lot of library building, and nobody's bothered hardcore distroing quite yet. < 1330911820 501267 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the nice thing is the network support, which I may utilize later once I have a functioning server. < 1330911822 787912 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I think I gave up on it for having less language support. < 1330911825 786813 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(library bindings) < 1330911829 203959 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: HAHAHAHA < 1330911834 697934 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have fun with that. < 1330911851 378600 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I will. < 1330911865 956649 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: I doubt your connection can stream your files. < 1330911872 30624 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless they're 128 kbps MP3s or something. < 1330911874 235168 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-200-101.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps a more fruitful test would be Firefox. < 1330911879 508129 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: So you'll need to double-encode. < 1330911885 124807 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I meant with like a VPS or a dedicated server or whatever. < 1330911887 197082 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-200-101.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which is mostly C++, but has no non-C++ dependencies, as far as I'm aware) < 1330911891 486603 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: in the distant future. < 1330911896 292134 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Yes, I know exactly what you meant. < 1330911903 525319 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You would have to connect to that and stream audio to your home computer. < 1330911907 483790 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :some are 128 kbps < 1330911913 94173 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :some are upwards 320 < 1330911915 70646 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :This would be unviable unless you have either a very good connection, or are willing to double-encode them. < 1330911919 129345 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*non-viable < 1330911924 979242 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's designed for LAN use. < 1330911934 806654 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1330911944 900223 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also mpd has no native support for streaming the audio itself to the network.) < 1330911948 291922 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah LAN works too. < 1330911950 596919 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You'd have to run icecast separately.) < 1330911957 221589 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It supports network _control_, that's all. < 1330912007 53085 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, I thought you could configure clients to network stream. < 1330912047 715854 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could point the server at an icecast backend, I think it supports that. < 1330912049 789425 :cheater_!~cheater@dslb-084-057-016-168.pools.arcor-ip.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330912053 7610 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you'd have to set up icecast yourself. < 1330912069 256034 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I think transcoding would be required unless absolutely everything you have is an MP3. < 1330912074 933430 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...almost. < 1330912088 917985 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I converted everything to MP3 a long time ago to conserve disk space on my laptop. < 1330912099 150485 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :in hindsight probably should have gone with ogg. < 1330912158 106501 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You transcoded everything to MP3? < 1330912160 49501 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, I remember that. < 1330912165 848279 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I explicitly told you you were a fucking moron beforehand. < 1330912171 458782 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :with lossless codecs my music collection is basically too big for my 300GB HDD. < 1330912184 179178 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You transcoded non-lossless things too, I believe. < 1330912192 719105 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm... no < 1330912201 885873 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that I'm aware of. < 1330912205 340101 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, I was under the impression that you owned a 1 terabyte external disk. < 1330912208 223406 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still have a few .m4as < 1330912209 802051 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do, now. < 1330912217 380088 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so it's less of a problem. < 1330912234 620518 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :DRASTIC TIMES CALL FOR DRASTIC MEASURES, ELLIOTT < 1330912264 955196 :Tiktalik!znc@ec2-46-137-240-165.ap-southeast-1.compute.amazonaws.com NICK :Sicktalik < 1330912268 261361 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise my music library would have creeped to a standstill. < 1330912270 492874 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you imagine? < 1330912297 520675 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine the creeping. okay. < 1330912337 771906 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually I have a lot of poor quality audio files that I need to replace. < 1330912343 17336 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-227-139.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330912349 840423 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-200-101.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1330912350 760310 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(by poor I mean less than 300 kbps of course.) < 1330912398 272547 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(actually that's a bit extreme. less than 200) < 1330912425 308702 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: A constant bitrate 200 kbps MP3 has a very good chance of being worse than an MP3 that averages 160. < 1330912440 18196 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it indicates it's either old, or the encoder has no idea how to use LAME effectively. < 1330912440 712207 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm? < 1330912446 623390 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I see. < 1330912447 577353 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The VBR presets are a reason. < 1330912460 188853 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes I mean like < 1330912460 732533 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The encoding community is full of a bunch of superstition (e.g. hating joint stereo because they don't understand it). < 1330912464 480743 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*are there for a < 1330912469 66417 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have some files that are like.... 96 kbps < 1330912473 793947 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yes. < 1330912501 370969 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the <300 thing was a joke, the <200 thing was slightly less of a joke < 1330912528 859764 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but is it objectively worse to have a constant bitrate higher than 160? < 1330912532 454562 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :like... that doesn't make sense to me. < 1330912566 189134 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming that the VBR presets were done correctly. < 1330912578 763399 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, not inherently, it is merely an indicator. < 1330912584 874679 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, I see. < 1330912594 553208 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, consider when you have a constant bitrate of 161, but a VBR preset averaging 160 would have gone to 220 for a certain amount of time. < 1330912613 607304 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I didn't factor in that it was VBR. < 1330912637 331497 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which actually means something like "better than this number" but to what degree I don't really know. < 1330912647 221681 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Variable Bitrate < 1330912652 74075 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...yes < 1330912656 866875 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes that is what VBR means. < 1330912658 267643 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :>_> < 1330912663 787002 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what you mean by "better than this number". < 1330912713 159267 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I was basing this decision to replace some of my audio files on the little "bitrate" number that rhythmbox shows. < 1330912719 583125 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which I assume is average. < 1330912741 329119 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It probably just divides the length of the song by the size of the audio data or such. < 1330912747 125583 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh... < 1330912756 78587 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that would kind of be the average right? < 1330912756 264925 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :...also known as the average, are you thick? < 1330912764 699611 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :a little. < 1330912778 678651 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whatever you say. < 1330912789 263155 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1330912824 401946 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure how to articulate what I meant < 1330912834 639818 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically I don't know how to reason about the quality of a VBR based on its average bitrate. < 1330912864 644131 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, you can't, really. < 1330912872 357150 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, you could think of a VBR with some average bitrate x, as being "slightly better" than something with a constant bitrate of x.... right? < 1330912884 98295 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...or not? < 1330912886 664537 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But anything with a sufficiently low average that isn't minimalist music or acapella something will likely be crap. < 1330912888 880413 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :since they both have the same average. < 1330912902 117649 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd just trash crap as and when I play it and hear that it is crap. < 1330912909 495874 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow amazing. < 1330912928 316009 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...actually I don't have a good stereo system so I'm likely not going to hear much of a difference. < 1330912933 321508 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll let you know when I get my epic sound system < 1330912943 500831 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'll hear 96 kbps. < 1330912958 772373 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :128 kbps on LAME since years ago is transparent to most people. < 1330912970 657715 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :160 kbps should be transparent to just about everyone. < 1330912980 71723 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Distinguishing 192 kbps from the real thing requires incredibly pathological samples. < 1330912997 747395 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :If something's 128 kbps it's probably done with really old LAME though, so there's that. < 1330913282 232821 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :~1 bps is transparent for me. < 1330913293 716375 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-227-139.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And if you think the *audio* encoding community is bad, wait till you see the video encoding community! < 1330913338 386358 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-227-139.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've seen people use --crf 13 to encode and then use the resulting average bitrate from *that* as the target bitrate for a 2-pass encode. < 1330913424 264484 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's --crf 13 < 1330913429 265796 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I absolutely need a constant bitrate ... but I don't care what. < 1330913439 264883 :nys!~nys@blk-215-85-41.eastlink.ca QUIT :Quit: quit < 1330913447 504724 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: wat < 1330913485 515830 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-227-139.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: x264 has 3 types of encodes, 1 pass, 2 pass, and CRF. The CRF type is a "constant quality" type of thing, similar to LAME's presets. < 1330913513 750624 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So they use a preset and then throw away all the additional intelligence from the preset??? < 1330913517 453507 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-227-139.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1330913519 146624 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1330913528 31508 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :To smooth out the imperfections, right?!?! < 1330913544 128385 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-227-139.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :--crf 23 is pretty good, --crf 19 will look transparent for most everything, and --crf 13 gets you 1GiB 720p encodes of 20 minute episodes. < 1330913571 52108 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :--crf 1 is actually larger than a directory full of uncompressed .tiffs. < 1330913584 362376 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( Why does Friendship know about video encoding? ) < 1330913596 527605 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I take it CRF uses two passes? < 1330913598 55258 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-227-139.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: Actually, no, that hits x264's lossless encoding mode. < 1330913599 641908 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :You realize I'm spouting bullshit, right? < 1330913600 609077 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-227-139.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ion: No. < 1330913607 12303 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: Oh :P < 1330913608 905103 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1330913615 590615 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: I thought you had actually measured it. < 1330913638 913518 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :My knowledge of video encoding is exactly up to what's necessary to occasionally upload something to YouTube. < 1330913648 931017 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-227-139.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It gets worse. In x264, CRF and 2 pass mode are almost identical. CRF just plugs in a constant where 2 pass mode computes a value from the 1st pass. < 1330913663 577222 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION likes monotonic bit rates. < 1330913701 503867 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-227-139.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, sorry, I should also specify. 1GiB 720p encodes of 20 minute *anime* episodes. < 1330913714 241929 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: How can the video encoding community be worse than the audio encoding community? < 1330913718 26765 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it was porn, it'd be 3GiB < 1330913728 249274 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-227-139.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(anime encodes stupidly well with x264) < 1330913728 560420 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anime has shallower plots than American media, so it compresses better. < 1330913737 22474 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The More You Know < 1330913740 202394 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea what audio is. Video makes sense, at least. < 1330913749 753045 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-227-139.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Animation in general compresses well, due to the reduced movement. < 1330913756 81677 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it's definitely the plot. < 1330913779 147681 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Surely it's the simplicity of the image detail compared to RL, too?) < 1330913796 227813 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1330913797 875996 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-227-139.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: Actually, if it was porn, it'd be encoded to standards appropriate to 2000. < 1330913836 770266 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-227-139.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Actually, if anything that's a bit harder. < 1330913847 60357 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :YouPorn uses H.264 :) < 1330913861 492560 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-227-139.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: Not scene releases! < 1330913872 664901 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-227-139.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: They use Xvid! < 1330913884 604364 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: Can you tell by the pixels? < 1330913891 171239 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: lawl welcome to the future < 1330913902 481424 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330913903 87563 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: And having seen a lot of porn in my day. < 1330913923 336852 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-227-139.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Put in RARs, split at 100MiB. < 1330913972 461368 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-227-139.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :With a target *filesize* of 350MiB per episode. < 1330913982 799760 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, it's "in my time" < 1330913985 711404 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Foo, I was close. < 1330914011 245656 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-227-139.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(so you can back up your downloads on CDR) < 1330914013 118643 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :POSER < 1330915239 974881 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyone know what language it is? The moron in #lisp who posted it thinks its Smalltalk, but that makes no sense. < 1330915240 341155 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://paste.lisp.org/display/128148 < 1330915362 417112 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Might be Ruby < 1330915418 610100 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll answer if you paste an irc log :P < 1330915526 718053 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastie.org/private/8nasfxrmidggvcyts3yna < 1330915539 583862 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I don't need the answer, my confidence that it is Ruby is high < 1330915548 735573 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :18<vortixo> it is smalltalk! < 1330915550 491794 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just now < 1330915552 337944 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is, uh < 1330915569 368497 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's almost-valid Ruby (needs a "proc" or "lambda" before the {); I think there's also a embedded scripting language that nicks the lambda syntax from Ruby in which it might be fully valid < 1330915595 675266 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : probably asked on #haskell and they trolled him to come here < 1330915595 862032 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :A likely story. < 1330915633 464103 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: Anyway, {} is array literal in many Smalltalks, I think. < 1330915639 342184 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And || declares local variables, not arguments. < 1330915644 390515 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt his code is even syntactically valid. < 1330915661 400013 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, Fare is there! < 1330915663 271400 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi Fare. < 1330915671 7637 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if it's the same Fare. < 1330915698 107459 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, I think it is. < 1330915786 928105 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :sintaxis < 1330915793 903860 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Ok, I shouldn't make fun of that) < 1330915848 612620 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :What? < 1330915867 302671 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, he is calling syntax "sintaxis" < 1330915875 560051 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The conversation is ongoing) < 1330915896 819602 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I demand pastes. < 1330916016 943220 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's all greek to me < 1330916046 315460 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi oerjan < 1330916057 258667 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: did you notice that guy archiving a talk page after only one section and a few days... < 1330916057 963467 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :top of the morning to you < 1330916074 477173 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. and he didn't even use your superb archiving system. < 1330916088 471408 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :or wait did he < 1330916112 504524 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1330916123 466003 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1330916129 628110 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which makes it harder for me to revert it < 1330916135 840070 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and impossible for non-admins :P < 1330916143 793693 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :fiendish < 1330916158 545398 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :he also edited my comment before reverting that. < 1330916169 556134 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have half a mind to block him for reminding me of dagoth ur < 1330916423 133590 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well his language is better designed than _that_. just not very innovative or usable. < 1330916467 114095 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, it's the non-language behaviour :P < 1330916471 679379 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*that reminds me < 1330916474 591289 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*of dagoth ur < 1330916475 144436 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*hi < 1330916537 173579 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose he did add conditionals and looping after you asked < 1330916571 383547 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. and helpfully striked out parts of my comment as he added them. < 1330916721 677244 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :* elliott is now known as nerevarine < 1330916905 940579 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1330916911 793153 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh. < 1330916914 158114 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean the esowiki user. < 1330916943 689700 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know < 1330917572 485862 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, new paste from the person: http://paste.lisp.org/display/128149 < 1330917643 721479 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric : it is a programming language called supercollider < 1330917643 945042 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric : it is based on smalltalk < 1330917646 656102 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :...finally < 1330917692 233881 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: i demand a complete log :'( < 1330917756 581652 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastie.org/private/h1uxbqpnrur7yarkxbupa < 1330917837 156665 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1330917862 823138 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330918255 407389 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, yes, it's the same Fare. < 1330918266 46558 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :xscreensaver has pretty cool screensavers < 1330918271 966414 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish it had an electricsheep plugin or something. < 1330918281 282384 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :electricsheep + lock out < 1330918283 574849 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :would be ideal. < 1330918308 730658 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe you can run arbitrary programs as hacks, though I'm not sure. < 1330918319 46434 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a "webcollage hack" < 1330918324 475600 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no clue how it works < 1330918329 133304 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :man page wasn't very helpful. < 1330918343 160470 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1330918349 733466 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean use the electricsheep executable as a hack. < 1330918358 815923 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"as a hack" ? < 1330918363 649639 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does that entail. < 1330918366 704908 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :xscreensaver screensavers are called hacks < 1330918371 62339 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1330918374 842478 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sudo apt-get install electricsheep gets you a program < 1330918378 641196 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1330918383 134696 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It should configure itself to be your screensaver, but you can also run it from the command line just by typing "electricsheep". You can also use "electricsheep-preferences" to configure it." < 1330918389 987755 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it might even work with xscreensaver, going based on "configure itself" < 1330918406 178289 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds a bit too magical. < 1330918421 24735 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :considering I already have electricsheep < 1330918429 582390 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it's in xscreensaver-demo and I missed it or something < 1330918449 566392 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :noep < 1330918488 845019 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could just combine electricsheep and a lock program. < 1330918505 631412 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...well, I like xscreensaver screen savers too < 1330918508 386182 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :pacman? pong? come on. < 1330918568 795779 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think there are programs that rotate a series of other programs to be screensavers and lock; you could rotate a non-locking xscreensaver and electricsheep. < 1330918576 888701 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although electricsheep would run a lot more often than each individual hack, obviously. < 1330918594 931101 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's fine. < 1330918615 972559 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also that would fix the problem that I don't like xscreensavers lock window. :> < 1330918623 517625 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is a picky screen saver user. < 1330918627 553426 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(apparently) < 1330918678 696328 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.jwz.org/xscreensaver/toolkits.html < 1330918686 753891 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can customise it. < 1330918706 374825 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspected xscreensavers man page might be lacking in details. < 1330918723 239712 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.jwz.org/xscreensaver/faq.html < 1330918856 730053 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Where does the text for those silly quotes come from" heh < 1330918904 775181 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :electricsheep doesn’t work with xscreensaver despite coming with /usr/share/xscreensaver/config/electricsheep.xml? < 1330918965 549895 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just can't find the option to turn it on. < 1330919022 108738 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I’ve only used it with gnome-screensaver, it’s been like 10 years since i used xscreensaver directly. I’m afraid i’m of no help. < 1330919044 896449 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I probably just need to configure electricsheep or something. < 1330919092 596943 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a "video driver" option that's currently blank. < 1330919096 786397 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no clue what it wants there. < 1330919159 699846 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :It’s an optional parameter to mplayer, it can be left blank. < 1330919199 732596 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Are you sure it's not listed in xscreensaver-demo? < 1330919206 967770 :TeruFSX!~quassel@71-210-149-100.mpls.qwest.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1330919217 748108 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :xscreensaver-demo < 1330919220 28103 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...wrong window < 1330919230 570526 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(still getting used to "focus follows mouse") < 1330919272 299873 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here’s a hack that downloads all the sheep (gigabytes of stuff) from archive.org somewhat quickly. It was a one-shot program, so it has my home directory hardcoded. https://gist.github.com/1369649 < 1330919274 640155 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming it's named something sensible like "Electric Sheep". yes. let me scroll through the whole list. < 1330919294 669033 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: You can use focus-follows-click with xmonad. < 1330919301 677766 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: not sure if I want to. < 1330919312 955671 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just accidentally type things in other windows due to not being accustomed to it. < 1330919315 270171 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ion: yikes, arrows < 1330919315 974196 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I think I prefer it. < 1330919330 162156 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: HXT made me do it. :-( < 1330919336 686974 :TeruFSX!~quassel@71-210-149-100.mpls.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330919346 239909 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah definitely not there. < 1330919369 355919 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, dunno whether it has suffered from bitrot during the past few months. < 1330919431 194227 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: [[ < 1330919432 104934 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, for xscreensaver all i had to do was to add this line to my ~/.xscreensaver, right below "programs:" < 1330919432 291509 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :electricsheep --root 1\n\ < 1330919432 291706 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :to make it appear in xscreensaver-demo < 1330919432 557496 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :]] < 1330919447 20285 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that < 1330919448 11508 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : electricsheep doesn’t work with xscreensaver despite coming with /usr/share/xscreensaver/config/electricsheep.xml? < 1330919452 221453 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :these xml configs might be a gnome thing or something. < 1330919458 685432 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since it has its own configumarator. < 1330919460 624648 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, did before gnome 3 < 1330919463 389587 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh, interesting < 1330919466 948058 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno though < 1330919471 29219 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't see jwz using xml :) < 1330919478 611932 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1330919481 928029 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :in preference to mork perhaps :P < 1330919514 713064 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn’t put it past them to shove their stuff in /usr/share/xscreensaver. :-P < 1330919519 362215 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the heck kind of line seperator is \n\ < 1330919545 206308 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1330919549 392427 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1330919550 253751 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shut up < 1330919552 884175 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :all the program entries have it. < 1330919563 263941 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1330919567 929635 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"foo\ < 1330919571 524816 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric : \bar" == "foobar" < 1330919587 307985 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, not Haskell? < 1330919663 339065 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I faintly remember the xscreensaver config file having a weird syntax. < 1330919691 144024 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes all the program entries end with \n\ < 1330919998 251752 :cswords_!~cswords@c-98-223-234-80.hsd1.in.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330920038 672887 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: well that is a natural way of doing it in some languages < 1330920067 47176 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :\n for the newline and \ for line continuation < 1330920097 877992 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION cannot really believe kallisti doesn't know that. < 1330920208 813106 :cswords!~cswords@c-98-223-234-80.hsd1.in.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1330920348 636393 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, I know about those two things. but they don't make any sense put together in this context. < 1330920440 479047 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well if all settings are one line... < 1330920442 949547 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :then foo: a\n\ < 1330920444 628327 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :b\n\ < 1330920444 818808 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :c < 1330920448 308745 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :would be how you do a three-line setting < 1330920451 85801 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise it'd be < 1330920451 879373 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo: a < 1330920453 94977 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :b # invalid < 1330920454 971655 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :c # invalid < 1330920490 480637 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :man electric sheep is so cool. < 1330920493 667062 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could stare at it for hours. < 1330921234 202675 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :headache :'( < 1330921333 513781 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch < 1330921357 384437 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://paste.lisp.org/display/128150 I feel like this is ugly somehow < 1330921577 14451 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably because of all the lisp. < 1330921607 726543 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there are different ways to look for beauty in code. < 1330921625 313314 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :a lot of Lisp code is beautiful for its structure. < 1330921644 74259 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and not quite so much because of the arrangement of syntax. < 1330921663 199992 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...though the huge expansion on the arithmetic stuff looks kind of weird. you probably don't need that much indentation there. < 1330921724 412116 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :like the (- (* b b) (* 4 a c)) could be on one line < 1330921742 219546 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, no exponentiation operator? < 1330921813 131848 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know it offhand and was lazy < 1330921849 75190 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming this is common lisp I think it's expt < 1330921870 826047 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHee < 1330921874 436784 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep < 1330921929 781476 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah anyone in the habit of reading lisp isn't going to need that much indentation on the arithmetic < 1330922071 199837 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so my hard drive < 1330922078 268722 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :makes these occasional audible clicks < 1330922093 418221 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems louder than it should be < 1330922096 512562 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :since usually it's pretty silent < 1330922101 680366 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :any idea what that's all about? < 1330922104 315587 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: hey mine too. i think. < 1330922111 917025 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :done so for years. < 1330922138 824915 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :good good < 1330922148 567423 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :two clicks just since i said that. < 1330922150 595296 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION creates backups religiously < 1330922170 507735 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i probably should make another backup soon, it's been a few years. < 1330922187 882447 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I make a backup like every few weeks.... < 1330922209 726941 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or you know, every day. < 1330922212 665598 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'll make that a thing. < 1330922223 863946 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(anything interesting ends up in my web directory on nvg servers anyway.) < 1330922233 833817 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I only have this laptop atm. < 1330922246 542468 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :has all of my work source code. < 1330922255 694260 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I could use GitHub or something. < 1330922261 309430 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: yes, that's worrying < 1330922293 116919 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOOOO IT'S HARMLESS < 1330922304 658689 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah HDDs never fail. < 1330922311 225043 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not a thing. < 1330922350 418416 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and, being the perfect human being I am, there's no way I could misconfigure my Debian installation and horribly destroy everything on the file system. < 1330922355 160568 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably impossible. < 1330922621 304184 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: someone was trying to tell me that I could take root from my virtual box installation of Debian, and replace everything on my Ubuntu partition with it. < 1330922633 519405 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :....and I was pretty sure that wouldn't work. < 1330922647 940141 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(re: the thing about "copying root" earlier) < 1330922672 750833 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, it could work, but there's so many ways it could go wrong. < 1330922716 72946 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-220-49.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330922862 40487 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: yeah it's just not a good idea < 1330922873 897412 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :esp. driver-wise < 1330922880 947699 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-227-139.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1330922976 18355 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-8-248-14.as43234.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1330923003 448396 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-8-158-202.as43234.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330923004 120329 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, does virtualbox use special drivers? < 1330923007 908576 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or does it emulate other drivers? < 1330923127 27497 :PiRSquared!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 NICK :USERHOST < 1330923161 36945 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION would like to use XenClient on his computer. < 1330923240 830819 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: learn perl instead. < 1330923250 29612 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it had been more years than i thought... < 1330923254 866362 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, hm? < 1330923258 675670 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION now has new backup < 1330923261 408905 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Instead of Common Lisp? < 1330923270 640339 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1330923272 57156 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :just learn both < 1330923302 672869 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I took a Perl class once. < 1330923308 32578 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I want to touch it again. < 1330923311 627940 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they have classes for perl? < 1330923314 333133 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :weird. < 1330923329 19126 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't even know how you would go about teaching someone perl. < 1330923352 810165 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Badly? < 1330923357 366582 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :most likely < 1330923362 154319 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they probably skip to OO quickly or something < 1330923371 204232 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: how many years was it TELL ME < 1330923400 889170 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: but no perl's good man. I promise. < 1330923412 10664 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :official kallisti approval stamp. < 1330923453 316383 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: 2007 < 1330923666 150629 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you last backed up in 5 CE? wow. < 1330923674 705528 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i expected that one. < 1330923685 473388 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hate to disappoint. < 1330923706 973690 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you said 5, I would have said the exact same thing < 1330923717 324197 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. < 1330927030 430366 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :, < 1330927233 333268 :MDude!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net NICK :MSleep < 1330927981 612115 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :: < 1330928146 636708 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :· < 1330928199 809511 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :- < 1330929614 266007 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :¿ < 1330930662 671332 :ineiros!~itniemin@li271-145.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :‽ < 1330931705 834643 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :! < 1330931763 621164 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the hell < 1330931772 798271 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :electricsheep is dumping .avis into my home directory < 1330931777 739523 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's some in .electricsheep as well. < 1330931783 768234 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait... < 1330931786 973114 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no I know what happened. < 1330931806 847262 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :by default firefox's download setting for zip files is to unzip them automatically < 1330931814 683453 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think < 1330931841 343651 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1330931950 415136 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: uh, what is the topic from. < 1330932049 478289 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1330932055 742279 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :stack overflow < 1330932124 939520 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is a good topic < 1330932310 265300 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just some questions; what things you disliked and/or would be designed differently by you, in Haskell? < 1330932324 132947 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And other programming languages too) < 1330932375 868154 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :haskell not being perfect really frustrates me < 1330932389 885693 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i designed haskell differently, it would be less not perfect. < 1330932391 706273 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is running forever really undefined behavior? Is running out of memory? You could make a language that does a defined-by-the-language thing upon hitting a memory limit. Also note that given a memory limit, something with more memory could determine whether it infinite loops or not. < 1330932404 873939 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :sgeo...... < 1330932423 795915 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: Well, what, in your opinion, would be closer to perfect? < 1330932732 718150 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-220-49.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: In what context are you referring to "undefined behavior"? < 1330932749 892650 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-220-49.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: And please tell me that's a quote from someone else, or else I will hit you < 1330932759 414553 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-220-49.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hard. < 1330932767 735979 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_, response to topic? < 1330932770 762131 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :>.> < 1330932782 752134 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do I need to run? < 1330932792 699973 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :run like the wind < 1330932839 973294 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, as in my response < 1330932881 863334 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-220-49.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider yourself hit. < 1330932891 373765 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::/ < 1330932924 807810 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_ der Prügelknabe < 1330933178 750342 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1330933180 937699 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :everybody die < 1330933195 288463 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION croaks < 1330933202 157550 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, but not right now. < 1330933328 575013 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Deletion log); 07:41 . . Ehird (Talk | contribs | block)‎ deleted "Talk:Basic Input/Output Commander/Archive 1" < 1330933328 761942 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(diff | hist) . . Talk:Basic Input/Output Commander‎; 07:41 . . (+843) . . Ehird (Talk | contribs | block)‎ [rollback] < 1330933329 699377 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is done. < 1330933514 5811 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i have this awful feeling i'm going to be considering the stux incident completely reasonable within months. < 1330933530 324756 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was the stux incident again < 1330933576 369063 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/User_talk:Stux#Incident < 1330933582 185228 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :drove the guy away :P < 1330933591 313747 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the "junk pages" were the year categories, now reinstated.) < 1330933695 820519 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you agree with me that blackjack is a single player game? (Although can also be played with multi players) < 1330934175 753346 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: why doesn't GHC do polymorphic unpacking :( < 1330934202 189154 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :because polymorphic functions don't get passed actual types < 1330934240 55898 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i _suppose_ it might be put in the GC data... < 1330934257 995821 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the necessary size information) < 1330934265 616655 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well all it has to do is duplicate a type with unpacked polymorphic fields whenever it's used monomorphically < 1330934290 919642 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: or heck, just turn it into a type family, and add an instance (with the same fields and all, just different constructor namse) whenever you give it a parameter it hasn't seen before < 1330934332 985439 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm the point is you need there to be an actual polymorphic implementation in some cases... < 1330934348 241255 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yes < 1330934360 12030 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but this would work most of the time < 1330934364 321005 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think < 1330934501 422348 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :you might want to ask an actual ghc implementor. < 1330934600 773412 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :-> < 1330934647 246186 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well, augustss has said that it's known how to do it, they just didn't bother. < 1330934685 893626 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1330934816 5786 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i wouldn't be surprised if you could do it in all cases in haskell 98 < 1330934849 692088 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I feel special. Today I taught an #xmonad regular that join (fmap f m) = f >>= m < 1330934862 662521 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :m >>= f < 1330934863 857345 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually :P < 1330934915 500649 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you _can_ do newtype Fix t a = Fix (t (Fix t a)) in H98. i think that would be a problem... < 1330934980 102823 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm that a looks unused. anyway. < 1330935027 709684 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(if t unpacks its type argument.) < 1330935084 452860 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: point. well, you can go simpler than that < 1330935089 837121 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :newtype Void = Void Void < 1330935100 833923 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :otoh the simpler could recognise that Void is 0 bytes and solve the equation ;) < 1330935104 326068 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*compiler < 1330935116 802227 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm wait. < 1330935126 183792 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :newtypes are _already_ unpacked. < 1330935127 668488 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yes, my point is you could make a generic Fix and pass it a t which is independently defined to be unpacked. < 1330935131 126380 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ignore me < 1330935132 168470 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: right. < 1330935270 91418 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: CU < 1330935283 995596 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so there's some work going on to make the xmobar config into a compiled Haskell program rather than a parsed format. < 1330935295 411410 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and to in general improve the features. < 1330935299 4025 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who gives a shit? < 1330935301 632311 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a status bar. < 1330935304 109591 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't need features. < 1330935308 955326 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...yes it does. < 1330935323 897459 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :for one it would be nice to work with dbus for things like a system tray and notifications. < 1330935331 4702 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of using trayer seperately. < 1330935344 588300 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :system tray is useless < 1330935354 906368 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am disagre < 1330935358 229082 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it is < 1330935362 476747 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the fuck is in your tray and why do you use it < 1330935389 449003 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, nothing, at the moment < 1330935397 563843 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I don't use one. < 1330935411 532912 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly < 1330935416 200572 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :just don't add one for fuck's sake < 1330935456 385452 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :dropbox would be good. nm-applet is nice. < 1330935476 794056 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...uh, I'm sure there are others? < 1330935516 982028 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1330935526 122576 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why do you need a dropbox icon? And nm-applet is eternal pain and living hell. < 1330935535 562003 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, NetworkManager in general is. < 1330935554 716671 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Get a desk job if you enjoy using trays < 1330935559 320893 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :.. < 1330935565 51230 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :strong opinions on system trays here, I see. < 1330935583 157675 :derdon!~derdon@pD9E1D65C.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330935611 442584 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use the Windows tray every few minutes < 1330935624 907928 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because there are many Windows programs that make the tray useful < 1330935633 481954 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also indicators in general are a useful UI feature. < 1330935642 647298 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gnome, on the other hand... < 1330935654 788710 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example, why should I have a volume bar constantly on when I can have an indicator appear only when I'm changing the volume? < 1330935675 478735 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course I can go without either (and currently am), but the visual feedback is nice. < 1330935725 210941 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :as long as we're talking about necessary here... < 1330935726 688650 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: You have the fucking current temperature on your bar! < 1330935732 870708 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Replace that with the volume. < 1330935735 374730 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no I don't... < 1330935739 914082 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, you did. < 1330935742 757077 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :noep < 1330935752 651774 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :as long as we're talking about necessary here... < 1330935757 575415 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing on xmobar is necessary < 1330935762 817241 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :all of the information can be derived from elsewhere < 1330935779 779357 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, no, just memory, CPU, network, and a really awful battery indicator. < 1330935791 146005 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I need to fix it. < 1330935803 272941 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, the notification daemons all suck. < 1330935840 320394 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: I find Gnome 2's tray much more useful than Windows'. < 1330935847 345064 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably because Gnome 2 puts almost nothing in it. < 1330935874 641540 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ideally the battery indicator would only show AC when there's AC power < 1330935892 589044 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the current xmobar doesn't have that in its default battery monitor. so I need to write the script to do it myself. < 1330935903 220884 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :er < 1330935904 427301 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean < 1330935908 447273 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I messed that up < 1330935911 137288 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you're going to go to those lengths, just switch to dzen2 and use fizzie's thing: https://github.com/fis/dot-xmonad < 1330935914 721317 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should only show time left when there's no AC power. < 1330935954 560890 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Time left estimations are almost wrong < 1330935958 328043 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just display a percentage. < 1330935968 284207 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :percentage is broken. < 1330935975 192738 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think because my battery is broken < 1330935977 615457 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I don't know why for sure. < 1330935984 452763 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :always shows 0 < 1330936286 874564 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the fact that you could remove it entirely also helped < 1330936788 610729 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I've been told that dzen is bad at right-aligning? < 1330937052 7241 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is Fermat's Last Theorem provable in TNT? < 1330937150 119648 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-220-49.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't think I would blame Windows for the tray being so cluttered. < 1330937162 861543 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-220-49.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Out of the box, it's got hardly anything in it. < 1330937182 619230 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-220-49.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unfortunately, every single damned Windows dev seems to think their program is *special*. < 1330937216 929214 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :for some meaning of special that's probably true < 1330937234 201104 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-220-49.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Aaand Windows comes out-of-the-box relatively sparse, so you install a lot of programs in the course of making it usable. < 1330937239 39709 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :On my computer the only icon in Windows system tray is the volume icon < 1330937251 646412 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-220-49.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I am not even slightly surprised. < 1330937337 700845 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott: I've been told that dzen is bad at right-aligning? < 1330937345 13953 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie figured out how! But the standard thing is just to run two of 'em. < 1330937374 151689 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least as of $YEARS ago. < 1330938352 430024 :derdon!~derdon@pD9E1D65C.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1330938449 495513 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The right-aligning also doesn't exist in the released versions, just in the SVN. < 1330938485 26048 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or at least that was the case. < 1330938622 242644 :Frooxius!~chatzilla@cust-101.ktknet.cz QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1330938812 419558 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net QUIT :Quit: hello < 1330939303 691298 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :What comonads can you make on the IO monad Kleisli category? < 1330939453 419557 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1330939887 923971 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I have a bunch of texlive fonts < 1330939889 515435 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a way < 1330939892 344348 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :to get them in fontconfig? < 1330940039 123208 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...nevermind I think I found out how to do it < 1330940046 256137 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the tedious part will be finding all of the font directories. < 1330940098 525143 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :... I installed texlive-fonts-extra < 1330940100 912509 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so there's a lot. < 1330940142 175538 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow... textlive-full is a 1.1 GB download < 1330940518 794159 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: They're unlikely to be in the right formats. < 1330940527 967322 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Computer Modern, f.e., is Metafont. < 1330940560 945198 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never metafont I didn't like. < 1330940585 347299 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/TeX_Live#Fonts < 1330940608 313571 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's truetype and opentype < 1330940612 311340 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and type1 < 1330940616 593066 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and... a lot of stuff. < 1330940621 306842 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're mostly crap. Why do you want them in fontconfig? < 1330940636 575698 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I have a shortage of fonts. < 1330940669 871861 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want all the fonts. < 1330940687 655503 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is. my destiny. < 1330941044 29263 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :b < 1330941049 873982 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, this isn't emacs. weird. < 1330941077 626758 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so by putting .conf files in /usr/share/fonts < 1330941087 54560 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :fontconfig can automatically slurp all of those up? < 1330941091 487522 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or do I need to tell it I've added a new file. < 1330941103 573799 :oklopol!~oklopol@40.Red-83-33-112.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you really even define "emacs" < 1330941119 347404 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1330941127 38210 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ which emacs < 1330941127 703667 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :/usr/bin/emacs < 1330941129 566146 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the one. < 1330941220 467070 :oklopol!~oklopol@40.Red-83-33-112.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1330941222 720297 :oklopol!~oklopol@40.Red-83-33-112.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :deep. < 1330941252 325849 :oklopol!~oklopol@40.Red-83-33-112.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should probably start doing this in #philosophy < 1330941263 671539 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :define what is deep? < 1330941281 16634 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so fc-cache doesn't seem to like my fancy new config file. < 1330941288 679962 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or isn't caring about it or something. < 1330941295 329223 :oklopol!~oklopol@40.Red-83-33-112.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :deep is when someone says something that's very deep < 1330941326 92742 :oklopol!~oklopol@40.Red-83-33-112.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i learned how to define at urbandictionary.com < 1330941337 307741 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: I would guesstimate that config files go to /etc/fonts/conf.d/ or something, unless of course your system is different. (This is an Ubuntu workstation.) < 1330941363 193652 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Please, that directory actually does something. < 1330941369 756441 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ah yes. < 1330941375 26697 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :If he keeps putting them in there, he'll be kept from fucking things up. < 1330941384 857988 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially since there's no chance he'll get the load order right in conf.d. < 1330941385 709689 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is what I get for getting help from the Arch wiki on a Debian machine. < 1330941392 103980 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or put them in conf.avail before symlinking to conf.d. < 1330941397 298497 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arch has /etc/fonts/conf.d too. < 1330941424 859984 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Who am I to forbid people from e.g. getting the "chemarrow" font in fontconfig, for some hot "chemical-reaction arrow on LibreOffice" action. < 1330941451 987231 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they say to make /etc/fonts/texlive.conf < 1330941461 588936 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whatever they say, it's a supremely dumb idea. < 1330941482 931859 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :For example, the Type1-or-was-it-TTF version of Computer Modern is something like 30 fonts, I believe. < 1330941495 899877 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :They are not designed to be used as main system fonts. < 1330941499 899790 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Install some ttf- packages instead. < 1330941587 69367 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=108670 "Personally, I quickly regretted the decision to make all the TeX fonts available to fontconfig, --" < 1330941594 604794 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :A sad story. < 1330941642 826764 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's volume control in xmonad? < 1330941652 913620 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti doesn't listen to advice, he just does the stupid thing and acts indignant when it goes wrong and you point out you told him so. < 1330941665 604211 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: HLEP WHY IS MY LAPTOP OVERHEATING < 1330941692 208580 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: entropy, bro. < 1330941694 223186 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::> < 1330941714 321837 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Heh, so it completely breaks XeLaTeX. < 1330941722 474063 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"merely because the huge number of them (at least for a full TeXlive install) made using any font selection dialogue overwhelming." < 1330941727 193980 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :these are the words of lesser men. < 1330941735 254703 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :who don't have all the fonts. < 1330941763 525450 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And who need to be able to use LaTeX. < 1330941789 845847 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, we've entered stage #3 of your terrible ideas, "sarcastically dismissing all objections"; roll on stage #4. < 1330941848 154222 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :dude, texlive-fonts-extra only took like 50 minutes to install. What's the problem? < 1330941854 614637 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's hardly enough fonts. < 1330941976 547645 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1330941985 624063 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :image having a different typeface for every character.... < 1330942059 971698 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a rather horrible font selection dialogs too, because of $ dpkg-query -l 'ttf-*' | grep ^i | wc -l < 1330942063 268905 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :85 < 1330942068 50492 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just kept pressing + there. < 1330942094 932132 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there doesn't seem to be that many ttf-* packages on Debian... < 1330942098 807852 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :according to apt-cache < 1330942117 877375 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now there's a dozen fonts that only differ in what sort of "funky" symbol they put in the middle of all 'o's; peace signs, four-leaf colvers, and so on. < 1330942139 936373 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just want some more old style fonts. is that too much to ask? < 1330942183 709096 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Biohazard signs. < 1330942185 682460 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://p.zem.fi/sk2s < 1330942190 550967 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :That was like the best idea. < 1330942194 166066 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are the pedals in cars mirrored in countries where you drive on the left side compared to countries where you drive on the right side? < 1330942221 892355 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Little-known fact: left-side driving countries have more left-handed people < 1330942229 564603 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, kind of doubt that. < 1330942239 426103 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I guess it is possible.. < 1330942259 889017 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: As far as I know the arrangement tends to be the same, just the seat with the controls changes. < 1330942260 201501 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're not, silly < 1330942269 358170 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: where are you getting all of these font packages? < 1330942283 29955 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: It's an Ubuntu system, you see. < 1330942291 167627 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1330942303 744708 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :why did I install Debian again? < 1330942307 414748 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :They need to have all the "used by people in flyers of their 'band'" fonts available in order to be competitive. < 1330942331 859780 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want... reasonable normal fonts. my font selection is scarce. < 1330942336 812810 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ fc-list | wc -l < 1330942336 999571 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :1795 < 1330942349 214257 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric : fc-list | wc -l < 1330942349 404418 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :220 < 1330942352 601495 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, the reason I was thinking about this, is that if you for some reason can't drive the car but need to move it forward (and the ground is fairly flat) you can (if the clutch pedal is outermost) just put one foot in the car to press the clutch and move it by hand. Doesn't need a separate person doing the pushing, and is safer than putting the car in neutral if the ground isn't flat enough. < 1330942358 958791 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ fc-list | wc -l < 1330942359 145523 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :90 < 1330942361 51751 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :90-plus percent of the 1795 are the crap. < 1330942372 552969 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's a clutch pedal < 1330942376 538147 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: ... < 1330942376 803649 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :And by "crap" I mean real crap. < 1330942377 174855 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, ... < 1330942392 836270 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you see, there's this thing in manual transmissions called the clutch < 1330942395 176018 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it a pedal on cars that often have to be pushed < 1330942401 174146 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :my point is, it would be hard to do this if you didn't have the clutch pedal nearest to the door < 1330942402 584388 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that connects the transmission with the engine < 1330942415 818519 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or a pedal in countries without bricks < 1330942441 297352 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :More like crotch pedal. < 1330942444 243219 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the clutch pedal, disconnects this connection briefly, so that you can remove the coupling between engine RPMs and transmission RPMs as you abruptly change the transmission RPMs < 1330942451 656378 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Can see your worst font? < 1330942454 303607 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*I see < 1330942462 436151 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to bask in it. < 1330942469 769825 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, I presume you don't have a driving license? :P < 1330942496 525049 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, e just carries a brick around at all times in order to depress the clutch. < 1330942514 45570 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah. < 1330942543 656854 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I use cars that stop working all the time < 1330942548 209245 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite < 1330942555 66114 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Sowwy, but I'm at work, so I don't have them here. Anyway, the one that was called "Hots" that was made of revealingly dressed girls making different shapes that did not even correspond to the letters was probably quite bad. < 1330942562 837498 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :The brick is also essential for hurling at other cars < 1330942578 641680 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ... why did you have that font? < 1330942605 513129 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I installed most things that started "ttf-" as a lark. < 1330942614 830042 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie has downloaded a large font collection < 1330942616 961718 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, which distro had this font? < 1330942627 129025 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, like myself, understands that it's important to have all the fonts. < 1330942639 743430 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you may need them < 1330942654 990174 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Ub untu. < 1330942656 100396 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ dpkg-query -S `locate hots.ttf` < 1330942656 287063 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :ttf-larabie-uncommon: /usr/share/fonts/truetype/ttf-larabie-uncommon/hots.ttf < 1330942658 676985 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: That's the bestest font. < 1330942661 955255 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ... wow < 1330942669 709932 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Less common freeware TrueType fonts from Ray Larabie. This package contains fonts which are beautiful for special decorations and headlines." < 1330942677 520942 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You should set your IRC client to use hots.ttf. < 1330942679 450717 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Special decorations" indeed. < 1330942686 137100 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :three ttf fonts are enough: one sans serif, one serif, and one monospace. Then you need one bitmap font as well. < 1330942693 107541 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Total shoulder-glancing protection. < 1330942694 88588 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :then the fallbacks and such will work < 1330942701 866763 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You don't need bitmap font. < 1330942705 215658 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*fonts < 1330942706 643806 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*a, font < 1330942712 185324 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: nope < 1330942714 76764 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You can see it in action at http://www.fonts4free.net/hots-font.html < 1330942725 875993 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, sure you do, for your terminal. ttf fonts don't work in the vt < 1330942728 488536 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no all serif fonts are created equally. < 1330942730 604577 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :*not < 1330942744 306076 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, if you took me seriously you missed the whole point < 1330942768 752859 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, apparently. < 1330942775 393359 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: http://www.fonts4free.net/custom.php?owntext=%3Celliott%3E%20*fonts&ttf=hots.ttf < 1330942778 719136 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :It could be used for diagramming cheerleading moves < 1330942779 667838 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite readable, I think. < 1330942815 299726 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Oh, they have the letters in their shirts. < 1330942817 337749 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders what classes as "revealing" in Finland. < 1330942820 58314 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, they do? < 1330942821 683741 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even better. < 1330942827 313372 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was wondering what that was. < 1330942828 79395 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I couldn't see that in the font selection dialog, it's pretty small. < 1330942876 264488 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh no, I actually do have Courier as well as Courier New < 1330942910 435293 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, http://www.larabiefonts.com/ recommends the Ultimate Font Download, it has 10000 fonts. < 1330942919 601704 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"All the free Larabie Fonts are included and a lot more. It’s the only big font download pack I recommend." < 1330942960 966950 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shocking. < 1330942978 626042 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if all creators of big font download packs say the same. < 1330942991 575869 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"This one is good -- but, you know, the other ones are too." < 1330943007 818482 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ dpkg-query -S `locate $(fc-match 'Hippy Participants' | cut -d: -f1)` < 1330943008 5457 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :ttf-larabie-uncommon: /usr/share/fonts/truetype/ttf-larabie-uncommon/hippp___.ttf < 1330943017 171050 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the same guy's fault. < 1330943023 879749 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm guessing I don't want "ttf-opensymbol" < 1330943028 925893 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect that's where most of the stupidity is. < 1330943048 234144 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, there's all kinds of "binary" fonts, and one composed of just sequences of cigarettes called "Holy Smokes" or something, and so on... < 1330943058 71494 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Holy Smokes! < 1330943069 219230 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Have you considered: Removing them? < 1330943084 199558 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unsurprisingly, Holy Smokes comes from ttf-larabie-uncommon. < 1330943097 463551 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nooo.... < 1330943099 8928 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :removing them? that's counterintuitive < 1330943104 482385 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would involve having less fonts. < 1330943126 961611 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :/usr/share/fonts/truetype/ttf-larabie-uncommon/skeletor.ttf < 1330943132 648137 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm sure that's one of the best things. < 1330943140 511405 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or the "stupefac.ttf". < 1330943148 228640 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or the "worthles.ttf". < 1330943200 721109 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait I think I found a good old style font. < 1330943202 733066 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gentium. < 1330943232 697351 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, are all those 10000 fonts novelty ones? Or are there "proper" ones as well? :P < 1330943249 172697 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I don't know, but it's the Ultimate Font Download. < 1330943254 289020 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1330943265 939837 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :ii ttf-larabie-deco 1:20011216-1.1 Decorative fonts from www.larabiefonts.com < 1330943269 428754 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :ii ttf-larabie-straight 1:20011216-1.1 Straight fonts from www.larabiefonts.com < 1330943272 960241 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :ii ttf-larabie-uncommon 1:20011216-1.1 Special decorative fonts from www.larabiefonts.com < 1330943275 960120 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose the "straight" fonts are "proper". < 1330943317 688782 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :161 fonts (well, .ttf files) in straight, 161 in deco, 149 in uncommon. < 1330943325 15720 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not sure what they mean by straight there... < 1330943329 103050 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Normal". < 1330943332 917538 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1330943335 916608 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Square. < 1330943342 525521 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ttf-larabie-gay < 1330943345 911696 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite < 1330943385 187430 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.ultimatefontdownload.com/index.htm?hop=typodermic < 1330943388 266254 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :holy crap these are amazing < 1330943404 801067 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you search in installed packages on ubuntu? As in just getting the package names matching something and that are installed < 1330943415 342003 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Black Boys on Mopeds" < 1330943420 12818 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know that one's good. < 1330943448 133805 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Anyway, you can see probably most of the Larabie fonts at http://www.myfonts.com/foundry/Larabie/ -- < 1330943468 93239 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: dpkg --list | grep ttf- < 1330943473 74407 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: And "dpkg-query -l '*foo*' | grep ^i" is what I've done, though I'm sure there's a better way. < 1330943507 333825 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"dpkg --list" seems to equal "dpkg-query -l" < 1330943533 396595 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :dpkg-query -l 'ttf-*' | grep ^i | awk '{print $2}' < 1330943536 305197 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :that works < 1330943545 345289 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1330943549 64920 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm that is a lot of packages. < 1330943555 607862 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :36 of them < 1330943569 222707 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Debian has 14.. < 1330943572 221219 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1330943573 613538 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1645615/what-is-the-use-of-brainfck < 1330943585 308023 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, heh < 1330943594 165177 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Perhaps more if you enabled the other repos. < 1330943599 213488 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do I have fonts for languages I can't read installed < 1330943601 542839 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :contrib and non-free. < 1330943604 484861 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :might as well save some disk space < 1330943608 247281 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ...um, I did? < 1330943614 159975 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: So Wikipedia pages aren't littered with boxes? < 1330943615 702851 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's how I have wireless and such < 1330943645 946853 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, uh? en.wikipedia.org and sv.wikipedia.org are the only relevant ones anyway? < 1330943667 361153 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :aptitude search '~i ttf-' would have been an alternative. < 1330943671 295871 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what IRC would look like in CM btw... < 1330943678 158923 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: also the use of brainfuck is to increment and decrement bytes in an unbounded tape. < 1330943701 169616 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh fancy < 1330943704 117643 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in case you didn't know) < 1330943705 168011 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: To suggest that foreign scripts never appear on Wikipedias is pretty highly ignorant. < 1330943724 286344 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well of course it does, but to what degree depends on which articles < 1330943736 885573 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not to mention the various recontextualised uses of them -- e.g. see that Kannada letter in the look of disapproval, and so on. < 1330943754 571935 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm fair enough < 1330943761 422379 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are easier ways to save disk space than to decrease the literacy of your system. < 1330943761 657268 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway doesn't dejavu have most of them < 1330943782 895664 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't need fonts dedicated to those letters if I have them in dejavu. < 1330943819 626350 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Oh yes, http://www.myfonts.com/fonts/larabie/ennobled-pet/ was pretty bad too. But maybe not quite "Hots" bad. And, uh, http://www.myfonts.com/fonts/larabie/oil-crisis/ < 1330943844 618460 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh... < 1330943860 499828 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Oil Crisis: best IRC font? < 1330943882 64350 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are the points of those fonts? Wouldn't just using a vector graphics clipart be better? The effect would be pretty much the same < 1330943900 830328 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I think you should /kick Vorpal for blasphemy. < 1330943914 286408 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's just too far. < 1330943924 250228 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's stylistic scripts for people who can't create custom graphics. < 1330943931 683161 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're all quite specific in their uses. < 1330943944 722977 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, clipart is for people who can't create custom graphics too! < 1330943959 951418 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then Sappy Mugs (just people and fish with silly faces), Riot Act (made out of monsters, I *think*), Lucky Ape (slot machine slots), ... < 1330943983 523599 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: KIIIICK < 1330943994 465553 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION hovers his delete-finger over [[Grasp]] -- uh, [[User:Fizzie]]. < 1330943997 45069 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :should I install Mathematica fonts? < 1330944038 492782 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the answer is obviously YES < 1330944041 921570 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I seem to recall them being utterly utterly useless without, you know, Mathematica. < 1330944044 923626 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :So YES. < 1330944051 523384 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, I have them, because I have mathematica < 1330944061 733565 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :people use mathematica. huh. < 1330944065 475303 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page?uselang=qqx -- this is the hardcore. < 1330944068 712952 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I've been living in a cave. < 1330944076 114530 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, I said I have it, not that I use it (very much) < 1330944112 237672 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm I wonder how much of the stuff in the mathematica fonts lacks a standarlised code point in unicode. < 1330944122 445145 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are quite a lot of math symbols there. < 1330944154 312858 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think they have the corresponding Unicode code point information even in the cases where it would exist. < 1330944160 818743 :kallisti_!~eris@h130.9.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330944164 393968 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, indeed < 1330944181 76163 :kallisti_!~eris@h130.9.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh hi < 1330944185 615537 :kallisti_!~eris@h130.9.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: hm < 1330944236 471609 :kallisti_!~eris@h130.9.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net QUIT :Client Quit < 1330944241 573441 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :unicode even have code points for stuff like 𝕀 < 1330944256 587043 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the letter "I" in blackboard bold) < 1330944260 26293 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was strange < 1330944269 473105 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I lost my irssi window, but it was still attached according to screen... < 1330944306 675759 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it's ttf-mathematica so it should be usable elsewhere < 1330944312 237802 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it looks like a shitty font. < 1330944355 451643 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Usable, but not useful. < 1330944361 368623 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe it just assigns symbols to random codepoints. < 1330944362 635283 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I could use it for lik < 1330944363 835916 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1330944371 422525 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :formal invitations < 1330944378 649616 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a nice semi-calligraphic kind of script. < 1330944390 176063 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...you know because I totally write formal invitations. < 1330944424 869509 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, if you want an OS with a lot of nice serifs, you're just going to have to use OS X. < 1330944439 764124 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1330944610 523785 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :how about < 1330944618 707113 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find someone else with OS X < 1330944621 478002 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and steal all of their fonts. < 1330944710 22802 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are free versions of Garamond out there, but I doubt they're as high quality. < 1330944740 402120 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-4db4fce8.pool.mediaWays.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1330944773 539274 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: You'll have to convert the dfont files, and since OS X fonts have no hinting (since OS X doesn't hint), they'll look like crap. < 1330944777 19495 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially since freetype sucks. < 1330944784 755920 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The free Garamonds are okay. < 1330944803 596318 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Install all the free Garamonds and take their average to get an even better approximation of the real thing. < 1330944805 924426 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :A new free Garamond came out recently, I think. < 1330944823 908936 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Clicked my Avería link, eh? < 1330944833 407233 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I did. < 1330944836 691611 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://iotic.com/averia/ < 1330944846 322864 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1330944849 893063 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :How coincidental. < 1330944880 490981 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: wait what? why doesn't it hint? < 1330944995 520205 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hinting distorts font shapes in return for crispness. OS X's font renderer is good enough, and their displays high-DPI enough, that they don't need it. < 1330945177 647899 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1330945330 810733 :kmc!~keegan@c-24-130-174-20.hsd1.ca.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1330945664 934227 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how does .dfont differ from .ttf? < 1330945671 917116 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, why would apple not use ttf < 1330945683 430982 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(they co-developed ttf after all, iirc) < 1330945703 627409 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Datafork TrueType is a font wrapper used on Apple Macintosh computers running Mac OS X. It is a TrueType suitcase with the resource map in the data fork, rather than the resource fork as had been the case in Mac OS 9. It uses the file extension .dfont." < 1330945705 932569 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, but: "In Mac OS X 10.6, released August 28, 2009, the dfont format is being (gradually) replaced with the TTC format (TrueType) [1]." < 1330945709 195912 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's also .otfs. < 1330945712 933009 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know if freetype can do .otf. < 1330945733 583941 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truetype#Suitcase < 1330945736 734511 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the diff between dfont and ttf < 1330945737 248894 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought they abandoned resource fork mostly < 1330945737 989302 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1330945755 585295 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it seems it is still supported on os x < 1330945758 54425 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :though not used < 1330945771 119933 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :why though, intel macs can't even run classic < 1330945772 802789 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :.sfont has the font curves in the salad fork. < 1330945804 240849 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: "Datafork TrueType is a font wrapper used on Apple Macintosh computers running Mac OS X. It is a TrueType suitcase with the resource map in the data fork, rather than the resource fork as had been the case in Mac OS 9. It uses the file extension .dfont." < 1330945808 878476 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e., it uses the data fork on OS X. < 1330945821 255976 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes indeed, but read what I said < 1330945821 510969 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, OS X is still embarrassed by its filesystem. < 1330945827 101073 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah right < 1330945832 815064 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :They wanted to go for ZFS. < 1330945833 475166 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :so still HFS+? < 1330945836 744161 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But then Oracle happened and they gave that up. < 1330945840 214930 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, still HFS+. < 1330945851 707952 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't they support UFS2? < 1330945857 27640 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think so. < 1330945866 998551 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe UFS then < 1330945884 104635 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect they'll assign some engineers to make a new "next-gen" (like btrfs, ZFS, etc.) filesystem sometime. < 1330945888 267936 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :They certainly have the expertise and the need. < 1330945914 601789 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1330945932 918764 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-234-56.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330945935 835326 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-220-49.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1330945954 893550 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, does OS X just do unix permissions or is there any support for more advanced ACL? < 1330945965 601664 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :They do ACLs. < 1330945969 208474 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1330945976 869498 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think they're OS X-specific. < 1330945980 764226 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :layered on top of HFS+... < 1330945992 712271 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :There was some sort of UFS thing, I remember reading about it when installing yaboot. But it might be abandoned nowadays. < 1330946009 244656 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: They still develop HFS+. < 1330946012 736875 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :operating systems are ugly. < 1330946018 912333 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Not @. < 1330946027 131866 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, vacuously. < 1330946041 543876 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :is oracle going for zfs or btrfs in the future? Or both? < 1330946047 927042 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Can you register a wiki account so I can ban you for that? < 1330946051 431879 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maintaining both doesn't seem sensible < 1330946061 783011 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you can think of it as vaciously banned < 1330946062 131515 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ZBTRFS < 1330946072 621408 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pronounced "ze buffer FS". < 1330946074 282228 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*butter < 1330946076 917157 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1330946079 468526 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :*vacuously < 1330946089 950755 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway how old is zfs by now? < 1330946098 354787 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think you could call it "next-gen" any more < 1330946124 779856 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's next-gen when everyone is using ext4/whatever the BSDs are on these days. < 1330946141 926197 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, "current gen" might be roughly XFS. < 1330946182 56639 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think FreeBSD is still on UFS2 with that crazy soft-update stuff instead of journaling? < 1330946196 46637 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :zfcfs -- Zermelo-Fraenkel set file system. < 1330946213 141785 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Poor Choice. < 1330946219 320595 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :.. < 1330946227 368185 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The page you have tried to view [...] is currently available to LWN subscribers only." < 1330946231 653864 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I bet fizzie is a LWN subscriber. < 1330946270 556304 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm about to open GIMP without any of the default xmonad config stuff that makes it sane to use < 1330946273 562182 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wish me luck. < 1330946308 122325 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe GIMP sets floating hints on its windows. < 1330946384 154212 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right I'm using the thing with the acronym < 1330946401 78382 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :What? < 1330946403 145 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :EHWM < 1330946434 31839 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :er < 1330946441 195266 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :EWMH < 1330946447 100988 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You don't "use" EWMH. < 1330946448 62021 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It just is. < 1330946463 393732 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had to configure it in xmonad... < 1330946468 47242 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :EWMH? < 1330946472 185182 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://hackage.haskell.org/packages/archive/xmonad-contrib/0.9.1/doc/html/XMonad-Hooks-EwmhDesktops.html < 1330946526 268970 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so .xpm is a bitmap format right? any way I can set a background that isn't a bitmap? < 1330946543 55811 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: jfgi < 1330946550 897616 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: just use xsetroot in xsession < 1330946575 590085 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, you want a full-colour image thing. < 1330946582 626678 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Install an image viewer and run it in the root window in your xsession. < 1330946586 987673 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :feh can do that. < 1330946700 1089 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :@ping < 1330946700 190373 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :pong < 1330946870 25708 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: cool < 1330946906 482702 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so now instead of Debian's default spaceship stuff I have BEAUTIFUL PLANTS PREGNANT WITH RAINDROPS. < 1330947018 822413 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how easy it is to randomly change backgrounds occasionally. < 1330947025 591956 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, what, that doesn't make sense. You surely mean pregnant with seeds or such? < 1330947034 112844 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1330947050 564355 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I... okay it may not make sense. < 1330947053 491391 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they have raindrops on them < 1330947055 952604 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :beautiful raindrops < 1330947060 553903 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fair enough < 1330947063 730252 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :And 'pregnant' is a very widely-applicable word. < 1330947064 941896 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :3. fraught, pregnant -- (filled with or attended with; "words fraught with meaning"; "an incident fraught with danger"; "a silence pregnant with suspense") < 1330947194 238054 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so.. < 1330947199 341201 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :should I consider using a file browser? < 1330947203 165721 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :what, windows 7 is freaking me out. There are two folders with the exact same name in my "Documents library" < 1330947209 955700 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :how does that even work < 1330947233 266402 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-4d0b6721.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330947247 194585 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh it is a merged view of "shared" documents and "my documents" < 1330947250 63228 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1330947255 298404 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a "library". < 1330947259 857301 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :but why not merge those directories too < 1330947279 444428 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if I can get just plain old my documents in the start menu then < 1330947285 434137 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not what a library does. I mean, they don't merge the pages of books with similar titles. < 1330947288 434370 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Logic(TM).) < 1330947310 624006 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I see... < 1330947316 810718 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, on the other hand, when I create a new directory in that "library", how does it decide where it should go < 1330947318 590323 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually this makes it very easy to randomly shuffle background images. < 1330947348 608994 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I don't know about that, but there's a "Locations" list that you can edit. < 1330947348 795951 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : should I consider using a file browser? < 1330947356 64405 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :A terminal works just fine. If you must, use ROX Filer. < 1330947380 329173 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the main reason I would want to use one is things like images < 1330947388 289621 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I could just learn how to use an image viewer effectively < 1330947390 971373 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :geeqie is good at showing a bunch of images. < 1330947394 579570 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :gqview is kind of bad though.... < 1330947395 881345 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant recommended it to me. < 1330947400 368539 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :geeqie is a fork of gqview, I think. < 1330947423 144468 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :when I open qwview the title say "geeqie" < 1330947424 149803 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: One of them is supposedly the default. < 1330947430 807503 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: "Change the default save location. The default save location determines where an item is stored when it's copied, moved, or saved to the library. For more information, see Customize a library." < 1330947446 275524 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone know an image viewer/searcher that can search/filter on EXIF data? < 1330947447 220430 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's in the Locations list. < 1330947452 398244 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Weird. < 1330947457 940699 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I may just use feh. it seems pretty good. < 1330947460 861741 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm < 1330947479 34066 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: feh doesn't really do directories much, afaik. < 1330947484 860146 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can < 1330947485 422789 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, it needs to support raw images. < 1330947494 776889 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would really like a tool like that < 1330947512 335616 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: if you pass it a directory < 1330947516 319509 :oklofok!~oklopol@40.Red-83-33-112.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330947517 354884 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also you can choose sorting options < 1330947532 622692 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, does it support sorting on EXIF tags? < 1330947533 114540 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and... probably a bunch of other stuff. < 1330947552 724887 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and filtering possibly) < 1330947570 463664 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no idea. < 1330947573 806808 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well < 1330947592 967134 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've learned much languages, but now I want to choose one, but the language that I most liked was Haskell, it is like a interpreted language, but is a compiled. Then I want to know the pros and cons of this powerfull language(just to make the correct choice). < 1330947594 639388 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, if you happen to come across a competent image library organizer software, do tell me. < 1330947610 731788 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Allowed sort types are: name, filename, width, height, pixels, size, format. < 1330947614 224766 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ouch the (lack of) grammar < 1330947624 992450 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, nah, not enough for me < 1330947651 263564 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :my version is apparently compiled without EXIF support < 1330947664 383053 :oklopol!~oklopol@40.Red-83-33-112.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1330947682 480599 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, I want to be able to filter and sort on shutter settings and such. (This is very much useful when trying to check through HDR photography) < 1330947692 338760 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :perl < 1330947694 951715 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :>_> < 1330947697 49611 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh < 1330947722 212367 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, it doesn't really allow be to browse though < 1330947725 480782 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :visually I mean < 1330947733 83237 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh just dump everything to feh or something. < 1330947736 98930 :kmc!~keegan@c-24-130-174-20.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330947758 332201 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, dump everything of what? < 1330947760 235450 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Shotwell is Gnome's new standard image organizer, I suppose you've given it a whirl? < 1330947761 645827 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :all the images? < 1330947762 956999 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or < 1330947770 476222 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, is it from gnome 3? then no < 1330947778 333036 :oklofok!~oklopol@40.Red-83-33-112.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1330947794 187265 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, I would like to see thumbnails kind of thing, I believe eog can do that though. Oh well. < 1330947798 363862 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's what they replaced F-Spot with, don't know about Gnome version numbers. < 1330947801 310445 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah feh can take multiple files, directories, or URLs, apparently. < 1330947802 174318 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it doesn't show me the EXIF data on the side iirc < 1330947809 279954 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can specify a zoom size.... < 1330947837 941696 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well, f-spot was a joke for my purposes < 1330947854 51756 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :--draw-exif (only if compiled with exif=1) display some EXIF information in the bottom left corner, similar to using --info with exiv2 / exifgrep . < 1330947867 534021 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Given that it's a Gnome tool, and the default Gnome tool at that, it's probably more or less oversimplified. < 1330947875 678265 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think feh is your program of choice. < 1330947879 620812 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :feh + perl. have fun. < 1330947880 799779 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::> < 1330947881 615336 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, exiv2 bugs out on my files, exiftool works fine though < 1330947886 821479 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least last I checked it bugged out < 1330947893 114334 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: that was docs from feh < 1330947898 664169 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't properly parse the vendor specific extension < 1330947908 373752 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, extension block < 1330947919 279158 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it byteswapped them < 1330947929 615385 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, indeed < 1330947969 577962 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://yorba.org/shotwell/ < 1330947980 131410 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not GNOME-originated. < 1330947987 888122 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in, official-GNOME-HQ. < 1330948000 559901 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And it's <3.) < 1330948002 385696 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er. < 1330948004 776955 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :less-than-GNOME-3. < 1330948005 874043 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not hearty. < 1330948045 864025 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: It has replaced F-Spot as the standard image tool for several GNOME-based Linux distributions, including Fedora in version 13[1] and Ubuntu in its 10.10 Maverick Meerkat release.[2] < 1330948047 340032 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: YOU LIE. < 1330948064 551447 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if there is any sort of browsing support in rawtherapee... I should check < 1330948068 905038 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I guess it could be just that distribution-makers replaced F-Spot with it. < 1330948070 639982 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is quite a nice tool < 1330948077 611340 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh nice feh has mouse support < 1330948085 243535 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :MOUSE SUPPORT < 1330948097 907152 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I think I'll just use feh, since I'm basically migrating entirely to console apps... < 1330948136 483297 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: yeah dude, it's the future. < 1330948148 917743 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://redmine.yorba.org/projects/shotwell/wiki/ShotwellFeatureComparison <- bestly formatted comparison table. < 1330948156 462563 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :feh: a console app. < 1330948173 104672 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suggest you migrate to aaview. < 1330948182 98459 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm it does. I need to install it on this laptop, or check later on if it is suitable on my desktop (when I rebooted to linux) < 1330948183 195726 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or cacaview if you want to be "fancy". < 1330948287 349411 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1330948333 25232 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, err is it just me, or is that page just broken? With some random chars on it "–" for example < 1330948387 590006 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's a program you use from a command-line with an entirely keyboard-based interface. my bad. < 1330948415 565 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I can't read that "table" at all < 1330948420 649864 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it isn't a table < 1330948424 749213 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine that it's not a table. < 1330948425 322974 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1330948429 156732 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that will help you. < 1330948454 494675 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: You don't "use it from a command-line". < 1330948457 519030 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Some of the earlier versions do show the first table, but not the rest. < 1330948460 350864 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It can be started from a command-line; so can Firefox. < 1330948486 184451 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: with feh I'm pretty sure it's a requirement < 1330948496 112476 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it needs options and parameters < 1330948504 421147 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it needs an argument. < 1330948511 729622 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do you think happens when you double-click on an HTML file in a file manager? < 1330948512 4530 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :at minimum < 1330948535 308598 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, okay, other programs can launch feh. < 1330948543 179359 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not really seeing your point. < 1330948589 602682 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I'm looking at rawtherapee's file browser atm. Well trying to. The Ubuntu 10.04 download doesn't run on Ubuntu 10.04 due to missing library (wut) < 1330948597 661913 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used the program for other stuff previously < 1330948604 33692 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(mostly as a more advanced ufraw) < 1330948621 81458 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Minibiatch i like the part where this page has no content and the page it links to purporting to contain the content states "I have personally removed this because Oerjan fucked with it." < 1330948634 450618 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like the part where does anybody object to me obliterating that thing < 1330948663 778297 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I object to the part where elliott likes the parts < 1330948733 151962 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, anyway; Shotwell is the only specifically-an-image-organizer app I know of (except silly F-Spot and KDE's digiKam); it does have (some of) the sensible features, like an attempt at raw support and the whole non-destructive edits thing, but presumably the image editing functions are pretty streamlined. (Still, it should be able to do metadata-driven searching right.) < 1330948751 512088 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :More like E-Spot am I right??? < 1330948751 913900 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1330948783 823381 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :am i right < 1330948795 913858 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :am < 1330948796 463638 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i < 1330948797 333938 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1330948814 540810 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :9am < 1330948815 677923 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :9i < 1330948816 763120 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :9right < 1330948825 780831 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You are more like a DEE-spot. You know. A despot. < 1330948843 136197 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :WELL it was nice knowing [[User:Fizzie]] too bad he's BANNED FOREVER. < 1330948845 676185 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, so how hard is it to do a search like "exposure time > 1/60 && exposure time < 1/80" < 1330948868 664325 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I mixed up those < > but apart from that < 1330948934 106019 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ALSO [[USER:VORPAL]] < 1330948955 932327 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow this is infinitely better than GNOME 2... < 1330948973 787874 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I HAVE COMPLETE CONTROL (within the limits of available software, time, and effort) < 1330949001 131483 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also [[User:wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake]]. < 1330949006 606560 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1330949006 793265 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I blocked a fucking cloak hostname, fuck you. < 1330949010 226411 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I doubt shotwell supports anything but 8 bits per channel though? Thumbnails of images with 16-bits per channel would be nice. < 1330949014 276617 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: wait what < 1330949017 738074 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU < 1330949037 283297 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :am I banned from internet now? < 1330949057 291755 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1330949163 603896 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: How should I know, I don't even have it installed? Anyway, it's got a search editor where you can list conditions; I don't know what sort of conditions it supports. And a higher-depth workflow with GEGL seems to be on the roadmap, but probably not in yet. < 1330949211 492020 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1330949215 591817 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You mentioned something; you must be an expert in it. Vorpal rules. < 1330949222 981274 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm sorry you can't realize your true potential. :( < 1330949259 349720 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no, that isn't the reason. The reason is that fizzie is an expert on everything, and if he isn't, it is able to become one within minutes. This is not a general rule. It just applies to fizzie. < 1330949294 950596 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/it is/he is/ < 1330949297 521483 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(weird typo) < 1330949302 791940 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Counterpoint: Deewiant is an expert on everything without having to learn it. < 1330949314 706245 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :me too < 1330949322 563677 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm, possibly, haven't noticed that though < 1330949347 253269 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's because you're Swedish and stupid. < 1330949382 28831 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah < 1330949398 424873 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1330949407 3856 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: perl is probably your program of choice for making the thing you want happen. < 1330949414 186177 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's highly configurable. < 1330949449 188255 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it uses an advanced configuration language that allows you to configure the exact results you want it to give you. < 1330949451 54591 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, well yes, but it is perl. Anyway it looks like rawtherapee supports most of the features I want. Just not all. < 1330949457 374935 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :close enough for now < 1330949463 252183 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :raw the rape e < 1330949468 436174 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus as a bonus it provides /really/ good editing < 1330949507 778104 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well, for pre-processing) < 1330949548 136130 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a raper, and the rapee. < 1330949577 514064 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake NICK :theraper < 1330949603 173229 :theraper!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :theraper. n. someone who gives therapy < 1330949611 348265 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1330949656 961207 :theraper!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake NICK :kallisti < 1330949688 809867 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so now that elliott is gone I can act sensible again. < 1330949695 45793 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1330949717 743167 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'll start by going to sleep. < 1330949724 895009 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :since it's... 7:14 AM < 1330949738 275875 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :2:15 PM, you mean. < 1330949743 767816 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, exactly. < 1330949761 851378 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Time zones are a Zionist conspiracy. < 1330949782 481210 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes they were perpetuated by the white man to enslave the children of the earth. < 1330949814 390434 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, Muslims are taking over Europe. < 1330949820 402995 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because of time zones. < 1330949861 32976 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish I could dream electricsheep < 1330949865 959034 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, they have made the time zones so that they are in the future and can control the past. < 1330949867 861962 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe if I were an android. < 1330949874 844660 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(FUCK YEAH REFERENCES....) < 1330949907 488485 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :good nighzzle. < 1330952818 958598 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1330953038 952882 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1330953268 882220 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :whta < 1330956081 980138 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330956087 895443 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :tnaneb < 1330956093 517072 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello! < 1330956101 408001 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's almost my username! < 1330956141 477784 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does the halting problem apply to Push-down automata? < 1330956752 328310 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :tnanananananeb < 1330956759 823593 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :tnan...eb < 1330956766 96264 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :tnan eb and flo < 1330956766 895509 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :w < 1330956780 696509 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :tunab < 1330956791 416254 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :teenak < 1330956802 560904 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :tunb < 1330956825 896706 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :tanb < 1330956854 556695 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net NICK :Ngevd < 1330956858 810715 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOW WHAT WILL YOU DO? < 1330956874 497946 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ngvd < 1330956877 377845 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :negev < 1330956882 44706 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :nee...guvd < 1330956894 67444 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :nguvd tanb < 1330956901 661280 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net NICK :ettioll < 1330956940 435750 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :e...toil < 1330956943 483472 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ettowel < 1330956945 188060 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :towel < 1330956946 517364 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :tanb < 1330956947 630821 :ettioll!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net NICK :Taneb < 1330956948 563923 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :tanb towl < 1330956954 461681 :Frooxius!~chatzilla@cust-101.ktknet.cz JOIN :#esoteric < 1330956957 891956 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::') < 1330957052 728412 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: can you change your name to tanb towl < 1330957056 423017 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngetanevdb: I'm not sure what "apply" means; I mean, certainly you can wonder about whether PDAs halt, but the question is decidable, so maybe it's not so much of a problem? (Proof outline at http://www.cse.ohio-state.edu/~gurari/theory-bk/theory-bk-threese6.html -- can't find our theory course's notes.) < 1330957095 738077 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You call something a problem if it can inspire wonder. That's how it works. < 1330957125 284694 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes, but I'm not going to < 1330957130 10296 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: ok but please do < 1330957156 195361 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I was wondering about its decidability < 1330957197 770761 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: please < 1330957205 763698 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: can you op me please, thank you < 1330957299 966376 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i had a dream where i smashed a glass window to get out < 1330957363 8962 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: hi, realise you're busy, but, it's been a few seconds since my request, what is the progress report on me getting opped? < 1330957419 580548 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've "tabled" it. I hear that's a kinda thing that happens. I don't know what it means. < 1330957459 305705 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay. can you table it into happening? < 1330957463 412740 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie is probably trying to figure out what the right command is. I think the relevant mode is b. < 1330957472 335959 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hope that helps. < 1330957480 26675 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, i think it's o instead < 1330957482 906862 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you using a dvorak keyboard? < 1330957486 227591 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think b and o might be close on that. < 1330957496 708268 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not on qwerty. interesting to meet someone who uses strange keyboard layouts! < 1330957504 338362 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :we will be friends in the future. fizzie am i an op yet? < 1330957520 570732 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, you're right. I meant to type q. < 1330957552 732769 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i think you may not be so good at typing the letters, friend!!!! < 1330957557 308674 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is o. o. ooOOOoooOoo. < 1330957561 614704 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not with all those letters like that, just o. < 1330957567 980025 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: i think: /mode +o elliott should do it. thanks! < 1330957624 134482 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could also /mode +o Jafet. i think he is a good person. < 1330957660 501305 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not so sure that command is correct. I tried it and it didn't work. < 1330957709 167451 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh!!!!! oh no. oh no. oh no. < 1330957713 71673 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ask fizzie for help, i think. he is a good man < 1330957718 347330 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :he will get to you as i am sure he will get to me < 1330957722 224091 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :he gets to us all, one day. < 1330957724 960682 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :satan, i mean. < 1330957858 197957 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay my graphics card doesn't want me to play Amnesia: the Dark Descent < 1330957892 982009 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might be satan. ask fizzie for help. < 1330959443 395490 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330959742 505356 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523 < 1330959757 986483 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi elliott < 1330959767 242445 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how's (insert project here) getting on? < 1330959777 890663 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :terribly to excellently < 1330959797 790838 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and have you been working on anything recently? < 1330959812 699499 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, what's recently < 1330959819 70672 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, fun fact about Linux: UNIX sockets don't respect chroots, despite looking like filenames < 1330959823 82852 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and, hmm, last week or so? < 1330959838 186057 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean they don't respect chroots? < 1330959874 212415 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you have a socket /tmp/.X11-unix/X0, then you can't have another socket called /tmp/.X11-unix/X0 open at the same time < 1330959882 748109 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :even if they happen to be different tmps due to the processes having different root directories < 1330959903 905336 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was trying to figure out htf a process inside weboflies could detect X outside it, apparently that was how < 1330959928 191230 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: start the X as 99? < 1330959947 167559 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: nah, better, there's a kernel flag, implemented quite recently, to separate network namespaces < 1330959951 783035 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or rewrite filenames in your -- right < 1330959954 613190 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, I think it makes socketcall work by itself < 1330959974 634603 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you try to make a TCP connection and get all sorts of beautiful errors because there's no networking-related initialisation at all < 1330959999 355117 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :do weboflies nc localhost 9999, and you get an error message back that it couldn't determine the IP address that localhost referred to < 1330960006 688974 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, lately-as-in-past-week-or-so: not really much :( < 1330960010 153542 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because there isn't an /etc/hosts inside weboflies, and it has no other sort of DNS < 1330960054 643015 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you see the editor who archived a talk page with only one, unfinished conversation, only a few days old? < 1330960087 204766 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ pty output: telnet: could not resolve google.com/telnet: Servname not supported for ai_socktype\x0d\x0a < 1330960097 610771 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, not yet, haven't looked at Esolang since I came online < 1330960102 924544 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's somewhat amusing < 1330960104 915012 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: aw, I spoiled the surprise < 1330960122 699966 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the Basic Input/Output Commander‎ guy < 1330960126 996660 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, you revesed the archiving < 1330960129 267802 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was thinking about mentioning the rather unsightly thing about Unix sockets and the filesystem. < 1330960131 700394 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :they also edited my comment a few times before /reverting/ themselves before archiving it... < 1330960138 250190 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linux has that "abstract" Unix socket namespace, too. < 1330960140 12436 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :strong dagoth ur vibes < 1330960149 293093 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :only slightly more competent at making languages < 1330960169 844350 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :we need a Category:Almost as Shameful < 1330960210 527164 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I think we should ban low-level stuff that works along the same lines as CPUs worked decades ago < 1330960241 295688 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's perpetuating the myth that computers actually work like that, and leading to worldwide inefficiency as a result < 1330960242 141922 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ban crap? are you nuts? nobody would visit any more < 1330960244 27157 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :WORLDWIDE! < 1330960249 461974 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I meant everywhere, not Esolang < 1330960254 373619 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1330960274 848656 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this would also imply banning x86, but I don't see the problem :) < 1330960279 615641 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I do my part by fuming inside whenever anyone hails assembly as "right on the bare metal" < 1330960291 15816 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(when they say C is that, I just laugh instead) < 1330960297 535117 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(when they say C++ is that, I close the tab) < 1330960309 917229 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Lisp is like that < 1330960335 495174 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :totes < 1330960344 313655 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, hey, the lisp machine OSes used lisp even for mega low level stuff < 1330960352 41373 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :they got as much claim as C < 1330960380 590617 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, I didn't know that < 1330960383 160067 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh, did you hear about the Linode hack? < 1330960386 624668 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yep < 1330960407 670577 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you have opinions on it? < 1330960432 191405 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the breach itself, in terms of what was done (just stealing credentials), is uneventful; the security policies it revealed are really bad < 1330960446 388958 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but (a) Esolang has no really confidental data and (b) I have no reason to believe anywhere else is better < 1330960454 118138 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I suggested bitcoin micropayments (0.50 BTC/edit) for the esowiki, in order to make it a target for such activities; currently all the cool guys just ignore it, going after bitcoins. < 1330960470 598219 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, they also stole thousands of bitcoins, a bunch of Slashdot people think it was an inside job < 1330960480 780325 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the breach itself, I meant as in "the attack" < 1330960483 943903 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: 0.50 BTC is actually quite a lot < 1330960486 856122 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: OK < 1330960503 801306 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's between $2 and $3, right? < 1330960507 997728 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: "inside job" conspiracies sound right up Slashdot's alley < 1330960518 930401 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems a bit much for an edit < 1330960523 267044 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: subset-of-Slashdot? indeed < 1330960536 773576 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :$3 for an edit? it'd solve the BF derivatives < 1330960544 914759 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also everything else < 1330960553 493891 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't help maintain the wiki if I had to pay $3 per edit < 1330960554 94720 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :a price we must pay < 1330960558 925650 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in bitcoins) < 1330960569 646399 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh, admins actually /get/ 0.50 BTC per edit < 1330960602 718542 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :from where? < 1330960612 775098 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: other edits, obviously < 1330960626 954071 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then do you get locked out from editing when the wallet is empty? < 1330960634 363856 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you're an admin, I mean. < 1330960638 448351 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it just doesn't pay you until someone else edits. < 1330960650 241263 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :This will lead to a boom in popularity as we desperately advertise it. < 1330960772 597330 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: anyway, the real story is that people would store such large amounts of money on budget-ish VPS providers < 1330960827 887671 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least it wasn't anyone's full savings (AFAIK), just their day-to-day operations money. < 1330960829 821011 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: actually, they seem to have been acting quite sensibly, all the money stolen was a small proportion of the money that the person actually owned < 1330960851 664554 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :stuff that was being actively traded rather than in storage < 1330960872 662912 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, I hear figures around a month's worth of money and the like < 1330960876 126157 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I'm misremembering < 1330960876 984421 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which leads me to wonder, how did Bitcoin exchanges get so big that around $200000 is only a tiny proportion of the total amount of money they're handling? < 1330960885 415058 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, it was mostly organisations, not people, as I understand it < 1330960890 32157 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the biggest mining pool, the faucet, etc. < 1330960895 671387 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: drugs, mostly < 1330960907 799066 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least ISTR Silk Road is the most popular BTC thing < 1330960921 879307 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I may be completely wrong :) < 1330960927 693016 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, wrt organisations < 1330960969 645163 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :ISTR that Bitcoinica was the one from whom the lottest money was stolen, and their post about it mentioned that due to X and Y their "hot wallet" was larger than other operators'. < 1330961010 738163 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The problem with Bitcoin is that it's totally the most boringest of the cryptocurrencies. < 1330961070 203347 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, according to bitcoincharts Mt. Gox's 30-day volume for the bitcoin/USD exchange market is something like $14 million USD, so there's certainly some money happening there. < 1330961111 772763 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I think I heard there was some money laundering going through BTC, but I may be totally wrong again < 1330961147 740645 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really get how Bitcoin works < 1330961166 408387 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://bitcoincharts.com/charts/mtgoxUSD#tgSzm1g10zm2g25 -- the stablest currency ever. < 1330961174 627725 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mind you, I don't really get how most things work < 1330961183 967723 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: It doesn't, really. < 1330961193 653026 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Is that dip the MtGox hack? < 1330961226 528360 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does have labels on the time axis; I can't recall when it happened. < 1330961253 464798 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, elliott, does mcmap work with MC 1.2.x? < 1330961312 512231 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Very no. < 1330961329 225614 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay < 1330961336 298541 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt it will in the forseeable future, though fizzie would be the one to change that prediction. < 1330961408 534093 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hmm, I'm suddenly reminded of the way that some commonly used programming language (I can't remember whether it was Perl or Python) treats invalid characters in its input, when re-encoding, by encoding them to invalid characters in its output < 1330961413 648385 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would probably make that happen if I could motivate myself to MC somewhere. < 1330961423 908604 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. converting invalid UTF-8 to invalid UTF-16 in a reversible way < 1330961482 315758 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1330961485 804260 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1330961499 349229 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You realise the entire map format has changed, right? < 1330961502 869275 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, the world is twice as high now. < 1330961604 610964 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I saved that straight from the cache and the [code] tags should stop any formatting. I'll upload it when I have a chance, but I'm pretty sure it's identical." < 1330961607 865769 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :binary files do not work like that! < 1330961632 655082 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :That doesn't sound like a terribly major change. Anyway, no, I don't "realise" anything; haven't looked at all. < 1330961644 873669 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, really crazy idea: is it possible to get a hashlife-like algorithm to work on a random initial state by lazifying the randomness? < 1330961691 559126 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :other anyway: I'm annoyed that X seems to segfault inside weboflies but not outside (both Xorg and Xvfb, which appear to be doing the same thing when they segfault) < 1330961703 372915 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you request debug symbols for a package in Ubuntu? < 1330961713 565475 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then all I'll have to do is get core dumps working inside weboflies… < 1330961717 401311 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1330962140 524620 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Having the randomness "lazy" sounds problematical in the sense that you never know what sort of things would be coming out of those regions, without evaluating them, and their effects can I guess spread at c or something. < 1330962822 705075 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is really crazy because hashlife would utterly suck at it < 1330962837 788660 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least until it stops being random < 1330962862 501629 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :back < 1330962865 322431 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : "I saved that straight from the cache and the [code] tags should stop any formatting. I'll upload it when I have a chance, but I'm pretty sure it's identical." < 1330962869 335016 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: we quoted that yesterday, too < 1330962875 648453 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : That doesn't sound like a terribly major change. Anyway, no, I don't "realise" anything; haven't looked at all. < 1330962882 6520 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: They changed the save format. < 1330962895 903579 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And, as I understand it, every chunk packet, completely. < 1330962896 766300 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only a little < 1330962912 976338 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : how do you request debug symbols for a package in Ubuntu? < 1330962914 254242 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :-dbg? < 1330962950 23721 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, there's an xserver-xorg-core-dbg < 1330962983 390507 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330963120 206365 :MSleep!~fyrc@c-174-55-44-190.hsd1.pa.comcast.net NICK :MDude < 1330963171 150164 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi Phantom_Hoover < 1330963189 276818 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net QUIT :Quit: Oh no! < 1330963193 886794 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, how long has it been since I *really* programmed? < 1330963259 618608 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://plus.google.com/109925364564856140495/posts/g4LbUEFBXTw < 1330963265 644266 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I know the feeling < 1330963268 382641 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 operating systems class < 1330963312 92425 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, so it's 16x16x16 chunks now in a 256-high column? Well, still. < 1330963322 593201 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :People are tweeting on Google+ now? < 1330963326 438938 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Aways.) < 1330963355 169554 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: wat < 1330963401 592202 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Helliott. < 1330963500 133798 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: some people < 1330963511 604842 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :that one is a dedicated page so meh < 1330963878 931195 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION idly ponders the presence of some brocolli on his desk. < 1330963942 603370 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :💩 < 1330963974 835120 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/1f360/index.htm < 1330963996 131038 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Finally, a character to express roasted sweet potato without wasting all that space! < 1330964043 770401 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :🐐 < 1330964522 990493 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :im a monument to goat < 1330964545 676577 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't even figure out why weboflies would make a program segfault < 1330964568 723656 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my guess is that it's assuming the existence of a file that doesn't exist and not checking an error condition, but it doesn't happen right after a file-related syscall < 1330964645 923764 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: How do you deal with shared-memory blocks? < 1330964675 502394 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mmap-based shared memory? I simply ensure that the scheduler's deterministic < 1330964682 603791 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the basis that processes can't access the shared memory while they aren't running < 1330964699 902146 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this will break if someone spinlocks on shared memory, but who does that? < 1330964707 342349 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also, it'll break by going into an infinite loop, rather than segfaulting) < 1330964721 586232 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :weboflies? < 1330964778 133141 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, weboflies < 1330964804 937276 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is, err, nontrivial to explain < 1330964813 304154 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(formerly known as the Secret Project, but it's less secret than it used to be) < 1330964814 446402 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: you know weboflies < 1330964821 431209 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : I can't even figure out why weboflies would make a program segfault < 1330964822 733223 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :try gdb! < 1330964826 867265 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, the Secret Project. < 1330964836 680278 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ooh, you should post your weboflies problems on SO, the reactions would be priceless < 1330964840 315226 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you /do/ know what happens if you put gdb and weboflies together, right? < 1330964842 513894 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :What was it that it did? Something to do with spoofing something, no? < 1330964845 767066 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Have you tried using gdb?" "Well... I can't." < 1330964861 276935 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, or giving you an environment to do things which are normally Bad? < 1330964873 360469 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :5 minutes later: closed as too localised 30 seconds ago by [...] < 1330964885 624363 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: it's for speedruns < 1330964890 406627 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :stackoverflow is meant to be a collaborative FAQ building site, right? < 1330964895 332509 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: it's a program regulariser < 1330964903 735755 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ohhhh, right. < 1330964904 426687 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it makes Linux programs run in a repeatable way < 1330964905 474213 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I mean shared memory objects, you know, the sysv IPC style. Those have their own namespace (the 'keys'), and so on. < 1330964912 458730 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ah, OK < 1330964917 335735 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I've caught anything using them yet < 1330964924 802884 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : stackoverflow is meant to be a collaborative FAQ building site, right? < 1330964927 721225 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Keyword "frequently!" < 1330964929 631509 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*"! < 1330964931 368128 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I don't see any reason why they couldn't be regularised the same as everything else? < 1330964932 119152 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But no, not exactly.) < 1330964985 208066 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It's just that X has that widespread MIT-SHM extension, I was wondering. < 1330965029 153015 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also a failed attach of a shm segment might easily cause things to segfault.) < 1330965034 793415 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :besides, there's only one process when it goes wrong < 1330965065 18780 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I don't think IPC is responsible < 1330965079 631594 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if weboflies doesn't have a syscall implemented, it forwards it to the actual kernel < 1330965172 151102 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey ais523, can you buy me more RAM? < 1330965189 928485 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what for? < 1330965193 756024 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the answer is probably going to be no anyway < 1330965199 348442 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that doesn't stop me being curious < 1330965205 720545 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, you see... I want it < 1330965240 368791 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, oerjan is alive < 1330965258 905695 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :editing a terrible article for some reason < 1330965261 632411 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that seems statistically likely, I wouldn't expect him to have died unexpectedly < 1330965333 115656 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :always expect the unexpected < 1330965442 865341 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Anyway, can you get core dumps out of weboflies'd processes? It sounds not impossible for those to be gdb'able, depending on how things go. < 1330965457 714427 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: that's what I'm wondering at the moment < 1330965476 952081 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :part of the problem is that even if it is dumping, I have no way to tell < 1330965482 777008 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as it's being dumped on a filesystem that doesnt' exist < 1330965497 497281 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I can't do something like sh -c'program; ls' due to a ptrace misfeature < 1330965502 780665 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that strace has an insane workaround for < 1330965525 987769 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that I'll probably have to implement some day < 1330965543 694688 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that reminds me, why /didn't/ I download strace's source, rather than relying on strace strace to determine everything about how it works? < 1330965643 281735 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1330965649 185821 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :license? < 1330965659 413176 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :3-clause BSD, by the look of it < 1330965671 989866 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I could even use code from it if necessary < 1330965681 482379 :Frooxius_!~chatzilla@cust-101.ktknet.cz JOIN :#esoteric < 1330965799 101482 :Frooxius!~chatzilla@cust-101.ktknet.cz QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1330965800 561132 :Frooxius_!~chatzilla@cust-101.ktknet.cz NICK :Frooxius < 1330965834 467849 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: What was the basic weboflies mechanism, anyway? ptrace with PTRACE_SYSCALL? < 1330965840 186598 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1330965845 92856 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly the same as strace < 1330965879 523444 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, weboflies works inside strace (but not strace -f, nor does strace work inside weboflies) < 1330965886 434837 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if /ltrace/ works inside weboflies? < 1330965887 584857 :tzxn3!~tzxn3@cpc5-mapp3-0-0-cust464.12-4.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1330965959 464898 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope, there's a bunch of "program uses forbidden syscall 26" followed by ltrace complaining about ENOSYS errors < 1330966078 962273 :USERHOST!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 NICK :WHOWAS < 1330966083 535356 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, good ol' web o' flies. < 1330966095 337567 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :In that case, I suppose you get the sigsegv in your tracer, and could just PTRACE_GETREGS the eip out of it? (And/or PTRACE_GETSIGINFO + si_addr as well.) Those numbers + /proc/maps + the debugging symbols might well give some sort of an indication to the cause of the fault, even without a proper core dump. < 1330966374 790112 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, I can figure out the IP pretty easily < 1330966405 283131 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The IP address on the Web o' Flies. < 1330966648 527375 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330966874 795722 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330966879 233472 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh yes! < 1330966895 438004 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :totally.. < 1330966899 261110 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello < 1330966926 741277 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is a day to celebrate Taneb < 1330966948 82788 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not sure why though. < 1330967407 832630 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I declare 5 March as International Taneb Day < 1330967459 867694 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330967461 506946 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or international celebrate things based on grammatical ambiguities way day < 1330967477 722590 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1330967498 634073 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net NICK :Taneb < 1330967511 761912 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does " < 1330967511 948639 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Disconnected (An established connection was aborted by the software in your host machine)." mean? < 1330967795 184357 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the connection was reset, basically < 1330967799 373387 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1330968127 420107 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I reckon this arc in Gunnerkrigg Court is going to be weird < 1330968208 518084 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1330968441 210530 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1330968450 385548 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :did < 1330968458 926623 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :did elliott just go to sleep in the afternoon again < 1330969068 218835 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite possibly. < 1330969080 659887 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you ever start a replacement to Rosyarrow? < 1330969100 166869 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Was I meant to? < 1330969110 563235 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not as such... < 1330969122 787681 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shall I? < 1330969125 347343 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I kind of wanted elliott to, since both of us have had a shot at dictating the basic layout of a fort. < 1330969143 537184 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott's slightly asleep < 1330969144 857647 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. a beautifully efficient powerhouse vs. a confusing, sprawling mess. < 1330969160 269249 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, my fortress design is improving < 1330969818 452481 :cswords_!~cswords@c-98-223-234-80.hsd1.in.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1330969832 568442 :cswords!~cswords@c-98-223-234-80.hsd1.in.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330969980 962957 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :computer simulation of reality is so absurd... < 1330969981 252228 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1330969997 923204 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's this about call/cc possibly being removed from Scheme? < 1330970009 990949 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.33 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330970011 83928 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or at least Oleg wants to remove it < 1330970011 807838 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://lists.scheme-reports.org/pipermail/scheme-reports/2012-February/001824.html < 1330970032 252810 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :even the best simulators are all rigid optimizations of a physics problem < 1330970084 575241 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :such simulations burning up exponentially large levels of electricity compared to the actual thing being simulated < 1330970167 330480 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the other hand.. the large hadron collider i can respect... < 1330970236 675272 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as far as broadcasting sporting events.. if people just had local stadiums they wouldnt need hdtv < 1330970291 232736 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sneer! jibe! < 1330970318 119513 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What if they were fans of American Football, but lived in Helsinki? < 1330970412 778701 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be better than being an australian in irc at 5am ranting about the limitations of technology < 1330970429 944936 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What part of Australia? < 1330970438 900189 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :melbourne < 1330970450 410329 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've got family there < 1330970479 636518 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(humbly) its certainly one of the best places on earth to live < 1330970497 815651 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The radio said "No, Taneb. You are the itidus" < 1330970502 914993 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then Taneb was an idiot. < 1330970532 107381 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :On which note, I'm thinking of learning C++ < 1330970546 841669 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: it's too low-level an abstraction < 1330970635 819948 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net QUIT :Quit: dinner < 1330970652 562094 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is an appropriate abstraction for, say, using a callback-taking library in a linear way? Threading? < 1330970682 93107 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably just using functions, why would you need continuations for that? < 1330970736 890955 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because I don't want to keep putting the rest of my code in lambdas, etc., and then how could I, say, loop over such a thing < 1330970744 531565 :Sgeo_!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, I'm not making myself clear at all :/ < 1330970819 637577 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, uh, so how will you do the stuff you could do with call/cc instead? < 1330970829 65751 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :using higher-level abstractions, obviously < 1330970904 876719 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I seen backtracking implemented with call/cc in a very elegant way, not sure what other abstraction in scheme would be suitable. Sure you could add new ones but will you need multiple ones or will whatever replaces call/cc be as flexible? < 1330970937 137550 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1330970938 249012 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1330970939 357682 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my god < 1330970940 257533 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think you want to add in backtracking as such into the language standard for example. < 1330970947 122327 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :full life consequences has synopses < 1330971978 619934 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Non-determinism is explicitly mentioned by the document. Generators are mentioned as a reasonable abstraction; not much details, though. (Also, have seen.) < 1330972028 485645 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm interesting < 1330972060 197602 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :And uh, generators wouldn't replace several of the use cases of call/cc that I can think of. Unless I missed something huge. < 1330972159 535019 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, coroutines and the nondeterminism thing. < 1330972217 419795 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Using call/cc to implement backtracking is probably my favourite usage of call/cc, and I can't see how to do that with generators. < 1330972231 122582 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless they mean something else with generators than I think they do < 1330972304 597318 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am presuming the nondeterminism bit means something that does (amb 1 2 3) and backtracking would instead turn into a set of (recursive) generators that would yield the total list of valid solutions when you keep prodding at it. Or something like that, anyway. < 1330972349 853950 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1330972378 974538 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well, that sounds fancy. I think I see what you are getting at though < 1330972471 873198 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Another Oleg document at http://okmij.org/ftp/continuations/generators.html might be relevant. < 1330972574 847811 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it would all be obvious if one knew any Icon. < 1330972745 519495 :oklopol!~oklopol@40.Red-83-33-112.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330973957 758792 :oklopol!~oklopol@40.Red-83-33-112.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net QUIT : < 1330974112 858142 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder which province the next TES game will be set in. Which ones haven't they done already (well, apart from in Arena that is)? < 1330974148 742889 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would love to see Elsweyr. < 1330974175 845526 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe Valenwood < 1330974190 417536 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :They've already done the whole continent, technically. < 1330974195 876148 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Akavir? < 1330974200 535752 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, I said that above (Arena) < 1330974252 865186 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or Black Marsh, but lizard people doesn't sell. < 1330974287 830741 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm so, Elsweyr, Valenwood, Black marsh and Summerset Isle haven't been done since Arena. Except possibly in spinnoff games. Most of Morrowind hasn't either but I doubt they will just make a game with everything apart from Vvardenfall (sp?) < 1330974332 660466 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have to see that Valenwood or Summerset Isle sounds most interesting to me. < 1330974358 255880 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're just some sort of a specieist. < 1330974381 993127 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"No furries or lizards" and all that. < 1330974395 88086 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I would like to see some jungles, and looking at http://www.uesp.net/wiki/File:TamrielMap.jpg Valenwood looks good for that < 1330974421 539254 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.33 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1330974434 683065 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would also like better water content, perhaps with working boats. Which would be great with Summerset Isles perhaps < 1330974443 677323 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about a Tamriel/Akavir real-time strategy wargame thing?-) < 1330974449 450235 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god < 1330974456 557358 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I'm not an RTS fan < 1330974463 166825 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :but sure, Akavir would be interesting < 1330974476 192433 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Real time twitching < 1330974487 99119 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, anyway where did the nords come from in the lore, didn't they come from yet another place? < 1330974506 219910 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes, Atmora < 1330974526 690671 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The last purported emigrant from Atmora recorded in history is Tiber Septim, who presumably traveled directly to Skyrim, where he spent his youth.[5]" < 1330974549 838843 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, it looks like no one knows what has been going on there for several hundred of years at least? < 1330974585 298274 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I doubt they would do another place similar to Skryrim next < 1330974596 220031 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :could see Atmora as an expansion pack to Skyrim though < 1330974599 643883 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yokuda, where the game starts, then you drown, and that's it. Cheap to make, at least. < 1330974617 701803 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1330974734 72398 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oblivion is another candidate, but bethesda is never in their life going to top Planescape: Torment < 1330974743 559138 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1330974755 233188 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :also you need to come up with a name for that game < 1330974759 732721 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't call it Oblivion < 1330974770 149671 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Player: Torment < 1330974780 673726 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :because they called what should have been "Cyrodiil" "Oblivion" < 1330974797 185920 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Summerset Isles do sound very sellable, though. You can do lots of fancy architecture, and they've got the Psijics, and so on. < 1330974801 60380 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :You die whenever the game encounters a bug < 1330974818 761335 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, aren't the Thalmor (sp?) from Summerset Isles too? < 1330974840 423499 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh btw, are there any references to the Psijics before Skyrim? I certainly can't remember hearing of them. < 1330974853 204786 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Galerion the Mystic < 1330974865 555862 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why do I know this. < 1330974876 630701 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1330974888 635959 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, congrats you are a TES lore expert! < 1330974893 218971 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or you just checked uesp) < 1330974899 344594 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a feeling there were books. < 1330974904 744529 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably because I actually read every book I find < 1330974920 857095 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've just read all the UESP copies. :p < 1330974927 756493 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, I read like half of them < 1330974987 752591 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, I can't think of any other video game franchise with a quite as detailed, deep and intricate lore as TES < 1330975012 878793 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(FF would probably have done it by now except they aren't even remotely consistent between the games anyway.) < 1330975048 149786 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Intricate? Heh < 1330975062 789947 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :They very obviously make shit up as they go along, unlike some other franchises < 1330975084 897516 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eg. there was never any mention of a dragon enslavement of mankind before Skyrim < 1330975089 814475 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1330975093 456098 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :And even now it is impossible to date < 1330975102 530926 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, Dragon Break, maaaan. < 1330975150 110516 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric : Summerset Isles do sound very sellable, though. You can do lots of fancy architecture, and they've got the Psijics, and so on. < 1330975167 42146 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, well sure, but the games seldom outright contradict each other. And when they do it is usually some small detail, like a sword ending up two-handed in one game when it was one-handed before. < 1330975182 109499 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, they don't quite have the Psijics any more < 1330975186 862784 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could do some pretty impressive stuff with the setting, too, like if it was in the middle of an Imperial counterattack against the Thalmor. < 1330975205 280965 :myndzi\!~myndzi@c-67-168-184-168.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330975209 339734 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That'd also deal with the problem of almost everyone being an Altmer and thus terrible. < 1330975224 900202 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, nice, as long as they improve the engine so it handles large scale battles < 1330975231 364715 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1330975264 820398 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, or they could just do it as a set of special operation missions. Don't need a lot of people then :P < 1330975275 792385 :myndzi!myndzi@c-67-168-184-168.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1330975281 396961 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bethesda is a huge company with loads of clout, they can do just about anything with Tamriel now and it will fly. They just need to actually put two more years of work into each game < 1330975301 273114 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, adding more bugs? < 1330975304 159587 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds stupid < 1330975335 452738 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, oh yes there is one HUGE piece of retcon. Between Arena and Oblivion. < 1330975346 980891 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that is the only really huge one I can think of < 1330975368 279165 :Frooxius_!~chatzilla@cust-101.ktknet.cz JOIN :#esoteric < 1330975378 513724 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: they have bugs because they schedule out those two years of work < 1330975383 590134 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'm talking about the shape and size of Cyrodiil) < 1330975406 336095 :Frooxius!~chatzilla@cust-101.ktknet.cz QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1330975409 603376 :Frooxius_!~chatzilla@cust-101.ktknet.cz NICK :Frooxius < 1330975415 483543 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just waiting for the unofficial skyrim patch < 1330975448 943160 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://images.uesp.net/b/b1/Arena-Map.jpg < 1330975454 650582 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looks good to me. < 1330975457 803612 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just waiting for Skyrim to become at least 50% off. :p < 1330975458 153396 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :And that work doesn't just go to fixing bugs, it goes to actually completing all the quests < 1330975463 43629 :WHOWAS!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 QUIT :Quit: bye < 1330975475 478083 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :So many storylines and plot arcs are left incomplete in the games < 1330975480 76866 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, uh? You know that Imperial Province? Cyrodiil... < 1330975491 153219 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, that grew a LOT in Oblivion < 1330975507 720852 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, if you take it to be *only* the area around the Imperial City. < 1330975511 569439 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe people become smaller when they enter Cyrodiil < 1330975514 485393 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, on the map it is < 1330975539 780474 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://uesp.net/wiki/File:AR-map-small.jpg < 1330975542 135797 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better still. < 1330975549 770669 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, also all the towns (apart from Imperial city), like Bravil, Anvil and so on are missing < 1330975573 544535 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hardly a huge retcon. < 1330975597 926877 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric : And that work doesn't just go to fixing bugs, it goes to actually completing all the quests < 1330975608 808500 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you mean the factions would have actually *mattered*? < 1330975616 616242 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :If they added things to Cyrodiil, it's not so much a retcon as a forecon < 1330975646 755876 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : So many storylines and plot arcs are left incomplete in the games <-- I feel like the Winterhold College questline is way too short compared to the Mage guild one in Oblivion < 1330975667 477644 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yes < 1330975686 670387 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :If the factions mattered at all, a player couldn't rise to the tops of all of them with the same character < 1330975689 974607 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, you should have to /work/ to become Argemage < 1330975694 520693 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Archmage* < 1330975699 245358 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(wth at that typo) < 1330975701 799727 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sadly, this design has become entrenched since Oblivion < 1330975712 260397 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, they shouldn't just let any new random person become it < 1330975748 35481 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, that the end of the College questline is particularly dumb is not a point of contention. < 1330975763 924005 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, indeed, I'm just venting some steam here. < 1330975794 122491 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Skyrim is generally bad because of the release date < 1330975798 341058 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :the Theives Guild quests are better. Far more work involved. Quite repetitive though, which is not a good thing. < 1330975813 268741 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, it was released too early yeah < 1330975854 581475 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, they won't be able to nail the next game at 12/12/12, and after that, it is going to take ages before the next such chance < 1330975856 201414 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that's what happens when the executives make the games. < 1330975873 876872 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :at worst they can do an expansion pack at 12/12/12 < 1330975884 226079 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :The most colourful game was Morrowind < 1330975885 684429 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :or a fallout game (meh) < 1330975906 507528 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, didn't ever finish Morrowind, it is very crashy on my computer for some reason < 1330975908 962085 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fallout Twelve. < 1330975919 273596 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, would be Fallout 4 < 1330975925 299854 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think < 1330975959 341020 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://spikedmath.com/480.html Intelligent commentary from the mathematics community. < 1330975964 389083 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why am I even reading this. < 1330975970 785243 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, I really liked Shivering Isles < 1330976048 573278 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'd be cool but no fun if they brought Solsteim back again. < 1330976101 27027 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, uh, you mean Solstheim? < 1330976120 93581 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got tired of checking the UESP before saying anything. So sue me. < 1330976140 323485 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I was trying to search for it, as I never got that far into Morrowind :P < 1330976242 254456 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I pirated it only to discover the copy I have's in Russian. < 1330976248 655135 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1330976341 859824 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also I just died a bit inside. I found out they are adding a pre-rendered cutscene to the next update of Witcher 2 (due out on the 17th April). < 1330976342 939699 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1330976371 543230 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is absolutely no need to, that game engine is amazing... And upscaling will of course be a problem < 1330976383 23088 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.gog.com/en/news/the_witcher_2_assassins_of_kings_enhanced_edition_announced < 1330976384 346785 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'd almost think it's not the worst thing. < 1330976405 470382 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :3.5 minutes of it even < 1330976482 764904 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, have you played that game btw? < 1330976492 259427 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even a microsecond would be a blasphemy. < 1330976498 70046 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, indeed < 1330976508 557884 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, let's just hope nobody tells Vorpal about pictures. < 1330976509 415124 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1330976526 727307 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, no, on account of having heard it's kind of crap. < 1330976546 20735 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, huh? < 1330976565 357523 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, who said that? And what was the reason for it? < 1330976585 23696 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I... heard it. From people. < 1330976609 201591 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Overcomplicated interface, repetitive boring gameplay, bad plot... < 1330976651 719599 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :The combat is quite hard even on normal difficulty (some people like that, I like it). There is some LOD popin sometimes though. That is about the only bad things I can think of. < 1330976683 112369 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, and no the interface isn't overcomplicated. It works unlike that of Skyrim (which has a bloody awful interface on PC) < 1330976713 365250 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :But a simple one. < 1330976718 292947 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is the normal, inventory/map/level-up/journal-and-quests split for the menus, they are quite straight forward too. < 1330976795 274438 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay so there are a few minor menus, like the alchemy/crafting one. But that one is simple: Select recipe, click craft, select how many from the dialog that pops up. < 1330976816 216979 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders how the hell the term 'RPG' can cover both Skyrim and The Witcher 2. < 1330976824 594464 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh good question < 1330976831 678128 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, anyway, no the GUI isn't complicated. As for gameplay being boring. I would argue that Skyrim has fairly boring gameplay. < 1330976838 433903 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :compared to that of witcher 2 < 1330976853 687958 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :the combat in Witcher 2 is really good. It could be boring if you play on easy. < 1330976859 909231 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, does role-playing mean following a set character on a largely predetermined path, or projecting yourself into the gameworld? < 1330976881 566245 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and unlike Skyrim, the combat animations in witcher 2 are in the right place dammit < 1330976882 107160 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're both exact opposites and yet they're both treated as the same genre. < 1330976915 997081 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Different roles! < 1330976917 996832 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well, in witcher 2 it follows a set character, but you can make major choices affecting the rest of the game in several places. < 1330976927 999635 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are two completely different chapter 2 for example < 1330976929 998091 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not to be confused with roll playing < 1330976973 343043 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Picking between 2 plots is hardly creating your own story. < 1330976996 459035 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, true, but how much story do you really create in Skyrim. < 1330977005 758981 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Depends on how much you want to. < 1330977034 769235 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :There isn't much story, just running from one NPC to the next < 1330977050 859833 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes; that's the sense in which you make it. < 1330977072 996651 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, You don't really change the game world that much. NPCs aren't going to treat you differently for beating the main quest apart from a few greetings here and there (unless they are related to the main quest, like the Blades or such) < 1330977086 440742 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :From a purely in-game perspective the Dragonborn is just some weirdo running around doing odd jobs. < 1330977095 883586 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, exactly < 1330977101 249415 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's up to you to tie that together into a coherent system of motivations and aims. < 1330977127 830181 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not really. The game developers just weren't doing their job. < 1330977143 641545 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :In other games, I don't need self-conscious effort to role-play. < 1330977152 361843 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :None of the NPCs really care about what you have done. You might be the hero of the realm and they will still great you like "hey, jerk who isn't a nord" < 1330977166 196702 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, just like real Swedes, duh. < 1330977172 585493 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1330977196 73039 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :More to the point, the developers take great pain to have quests affect as little of the game world as possible < 1330977214 271391 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because they don't want the casual teenage idiot to whine < 1330977227 180454 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh dear, you're going there. < 1330977228 294171 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, and I would say the plot is fairly good in Witcher 2. It is a plot of political intrigues really. < 1330977235 25884 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and really good as such < 1330977239 45075 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cue bitching about console gamers. < 1330977258 132310 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, unless they are playing COD I'm not going to complain :P < 1330977278 800851 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact I'm not going to complain if they play COD either, because that means they are not playing a game I'm playing :P < 1330977279 52979 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt the casual teenage idiot would whine anyway, it's just executive rationality < 1330977324 363298 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, I think the real reasons quests don't affect the game world much except for the NPCs tied directly to the quest (and sometimes barely even then) is to avoid bugs with quests interacting. < 1330977335 283639 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Such bugs still happen yes. But imagine how much worse it could be. < 1330977359 349487 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric : More to the point, the developers take great pain to have quests affect as little of the game world as possible < 1330977359 710425 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric : Because they don't want the casual teenage idiot to whine < 1330977362 68977 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :How does that even < 1330977368 640211 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, it doesn't make sense < 1330977385 794412 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"OH MY GOD THAT THING CHANGED SLIGHTLY I HATE THIS GAME!!111!!111!!1"? < 1330977392 495085 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, the real reason is most probably to avoid quest interaction bugs. < 1330977401 104151 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, they actually worry that people complain about that. < 1330977402 169522 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, most probably. < 1330977408 148330 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, {{fact}}. < 1330977442 226150 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal already gave the reason < 1330977458 246781 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :OMGZ I CAN'T FINISH THIS QUEST BECAUSE I CHOSE TO RAZE ITS CITY < 1330977470 986353 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, also it would involve a lot of work to handle all possible questline interactions. Like arch mage and leader of companions and just joined thieves guild < 1330977482 837051 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, Vorpal's talking about actual *bugs*. < 1330977502 459767 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like when I couldn't progress in the main quest because Winterhold was blocking it. < 1330977516 516945 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :haven't heard of that specific one, but yeah exactly < 1330977524 866359 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :from what I heard the civil war quest line manages break loads of other quests. < 1330977526 324257 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It didn't make in-game sense; the dialogue trees just hadn't been built to cover that particular case. < 1330977569 513624 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :How much work would it take to get all the questlines to interact properly? < 1330977585 567433 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I'm unable to start becoming a thane of Falkreath (sp?) in my current game. And I have no idea why < 1330977591 497011 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, I don't know, but it's a good bet that it'd be harder than you think. < 1330977595 430846 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :the relevant options just never show up when UESP say they should < 1330977602 931115 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :no known bug that applies listed < 1330977648 640327 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's only hard in that it takes actual developer time < 1330977671 7136 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, and expensive to hire voice actors for additional lines. < 1330977671 864933 :MoALTz_!~no@host-92-2-147-175.as43234.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330977690 791131 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, speaking of which, while the voice acting in skyrim isn't as bad as in oblivion, it is still pretty terrible < 1330977703 381517 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from for a few select NPCs. < 1330977706 249590 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, in what sense? < 1330977723 930347 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not so much terrible in itself as it is used badly < 1330977745 748984 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :What with the continuing mudcrabitis < 1330977761 624031 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, a lot of the non-star-actor voicing lacks emotion for example. And several voices are reused too much. I'm pretty sure Clavicus (sp?) Vile was Mercer Frey for example. < 1330977773 822475 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :. < 1330977774 910839 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :. < 1330977775 488856 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :. < 1330977786 372960 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-8-158-202.as43234.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1330977798 870230 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mercer's the same guy as Belethor, Enzir and many others, IIRC. < 1330977812 509961 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, and he has a very distinctive accent. < 1330977858 753046 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : I'm not saying voice actors shouldn't be reused. They must be for budget reasons, but at least make the separate instances sound different enough. Some voice actors can pull that off. Some just sound too unique. < 1330977922 110761 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, also I wonder how many people voice acted the guards. I'm guessing like two persons of each gender or some such. < 1330977931 33000 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, the GitHub hack is hilarious < 1330977943 640380 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure I realise you can't make every guard sound unique, but a bit more variation would have been nice. < 1330977953 476036 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems that Rails has a feature that's suspiciously like register_globals < 1330977968 73454 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and GitHub were using it without proper security checks < 1330977973 123994 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no I'm not talking about arrow in knee (though actually it is far less annoying than the "mudcrabs" discussions of oblivion) < 1330977994 115985 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Speech synthesis + randomized voice parameters == unique voices to all. < 1330978004 889915 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, will they should as good though? < 1330978016 544286 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, but that's the price you pay. < 1330978021 817865 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1330978045 209111 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, there witcher 2 stands out. Really awesome voice acting. < 1330978059 169575 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Set of recorded voices + slight tweaking can move the "amount of variation" / "natural-sounding speech" boundary around. < 1330978067 437486 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1330978075 813882 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, so sampling basically? < 1330978100 390849 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm couldn't that work, sampling on the word or phrase level? < 1330978131 706545 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not unless you want people to sound quite multiple-personality-disordery. < 1330978132 326522 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :It works when you produce a synthesizer that works < 1330978136 479803 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not before < 1330978144 55329 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course it's nontrivial to do the right sort of tweaking without having a human present. < 1330978151 426280 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1330978186 468414 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :GlaDOS' voice is a good example of "start with a human, tweak for style" voice, even if the goal there is not to make another (but different) human voice. < 1330978216 238417 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway I would strongly recommend Witcher 2 as one of the best modern RPGs out there, if you are grown up. I wouldn't recommend it to anyone under age. Because it is rated Mature for a reason. < 1330978241 548407 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any voice, facial, hair or cloth synthesis in a video game is going to suck for the next few decades < 1330978261 774970 :invex!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330978263 205119 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's cool to push the boundaries, but that's the truth < 1330978267 940863 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, not sure about cloth actually. Hair yes. < 1330978288 369617 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, you can do transformations to voices. If they're slight enough, they might not sound too bad. Of course it's then arguable whether it adds enough variation to be worth it, since you might still be able to recognize that there's just very few actual speakers. < 1330978297 907967 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is maybe the weakest point of Witcher 2, the hair, but even then the hair in that game looks better than in most other games. < 1330978354 761748 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :The real test is when you compare a game to the games five years *after* it < 1330978364 195036 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :If nothing's changed, then your synthesis is real < 1330978371 729565 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1330978376 837972 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1330978389 289951 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eg. vehicles now enjoy this status < 1330978400 513947 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least visually < 1330978433 982456 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, the "game" mechanics of flight sims are also good enough to not change much any more. < 1330978491 153076 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, as for face, I guess LA Noir doesn't count, since it isn't actually synthesis? < 1330978500 465475 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'll see in five years. < 1330978508 693474 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, it uses face scanning < 1330978509 776149 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :so uh < 1330978515 282285 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know. < 1330978523 879867 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :haven't played it myself < 1330978537 16106 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm still sure it's going to look bad in five years. < 1330978540 83496 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, clothing in Witcher 2 looks awesome. Mostly it is armour though, but quite a lot of leather or other light armour, and dresses and such does seem to behave naturally. < 1330978550 277540 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :if that is what you meant with cloth synthesis < 1330978636 214872 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was shorter than typing "voice synthesis and cloth animation" < 1330978653 424213 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet, cloth animation would be involved in dresses though < 1330978739 167037 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cloth animation is a classic hard problem. Most games simplify it by having really coarse physics modelling or connecting canned animations < 1330978750 716209 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1330978765 983019 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometimes it looks smooth enough that you don't notice it's fake, and I think that's the best you can achieve these days < 1330978773 657878 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1330978781 124495 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330978961 752215 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330979030 610306 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330979039 750752 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is ℒ meta-turing complete? < 1330979157 228919 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1330979941 331151 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Was this "ntnu.no" oerjan's sorta-place, or how was it? < 1330980077 381145 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lastlog suggests it was. < 1330980106 663792 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, some kind of norwegian university-ish thing, presumably < 1330980298 333605 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: ℒ is ℒ-complete. < 1330980321 293762 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: Whether it is TC or not is a philosophical question, but adding "meta" doesn't make it suddenly make sense. < 1330980333 660845 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Meta_Turing-complete < 1330980403 523981 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, random googling hit a ntnu.no url of a (very short and detail-less) paper on "Voice transformation and speech synthesis for video games" from GDC 2008. It speaks of the sort of thing where you have a single recorded voice and it is transformed to generate multiple people. < 1330980438 244515 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :What the bleh < 1330980519 996657 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott innit here < 1330980529 275516 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, "innit" means "isn't it" X_X < 1330980550 152090 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's probably asleep < 1330980578 236929 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: So yeah, those two pages seem to be describing the same phenomenon. < 1330980603 958520 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not quite, but Meta Turing-Complete is a superset of Fancy L? < 1330980620 84864 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :meta turing complete looks like nonsense to me < 1330980634 994572 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider that ALPACA can describe many CA's, but a theoretical Fancy L could only describe one < 1330980668 677886 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: That's just what ℒ means, ℒ-hard seems to be equivalent to metaTC. < 1330980880 385718 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330981333 625925 :MoALTz_!~no@host-92-2-147-175.as43234.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1330982002 347917 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric : Taneb: Whether it is TC or not is a philosophical question, but adding "meta" doesn't make it suddenly make sense. < 1330982010 10812 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not philosophical, it's definitionall < 1330982013 611866 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*definitional. < 1330982067 20892 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :We need to ASK THE GHOST OF ALAN TURING < 1330982083 501626 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric : anyway I would strongly recommend Witcher 2 as one of the best modern RPGs out there, if you are grown up. I wouldn't recommend it to anyone under age. Because it is rated Mature for a reason. < 1330982092 301140 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: you mean the META-GHOST of ALAN META-TURING? < 1330982109 72954 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never meta ghost < 1330982110 996565 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :You mean the really immature sex stuff made by and for 13-year-olds? < 1330982127 67058 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Past company excepted. < 1330982239 431744 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh, Skyrim /has/ a disposition system, it just never /uses/ it. < 1330982347 718458 :invex!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 NICK :PiRSquared < 1330982361 17652 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : Huh, Skyrim /has/ a disposition system, it just never /uses/ it. <-- wow < 1330982377 767187 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it does use it... for marriage. < 1330982384 259005 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Come one, Vorpal. He just said that. < 1330982385 554128 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : You mean the really immature sex stuff made by and for 13-year-olds? <-- hm, yes there is a bit of that. But there are actually some real mature stuff as well. < 1330982391 619670 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like one line up < 1330982399 34310 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb, yes? < 1330982421 58353 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The disposition system for marriage is such that there's a woman in Whiterun who'll marry you immediately after you beat her in a fistfight. < 1330982439 326933 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1330982884 159884 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also I find the entire marriage system in Skyrim to be the funniest thing in the game; it's so ridiculous.) < 1330983022 644688 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-2-130-19.as43234.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330983060 692018 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mawwiage! Twue wuw! < 1330983208 175242 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://images.uesp.net/f/fd/SR-npc-Maramal.jpg < 1330983226 50376 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh my god he looks like he's talking that way < 1330983406 402371 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 0.3.7 < 1330983432 476321 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :He looks like an axe murderer to me. < 1330983435 203652 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, heeeeeey, you misquoted that. < 1330983440 413519 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: RACIST < 1330983443 725354 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's "Twue wuv!" < 1330983468 464154 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well he's blatantly a scamster. < 1330983483 309167 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I thought it may, but wasn't sure enough to s///. < 1330983531 152369 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :His hand appears to have slightly melted into the clothing, too. < 1330983551 458585 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The dialogue with him is along the lines of "So, you want to get married? Well, everyone in Skyrim is too busy getting eaten by the fauna to talk to their prospective spouse, so you'll need a Marriage Thing. By the way, I happen to have a very nice Marriage Thing with me!" < 1330983582 435419 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :He then charges you 200 moneys for a Marriage Thing. < 1330983835 115950 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION reads [[Caster Semenya]], notes the gem "The federation also explained that the motivation for the test was not suspected cheating but a desire to determine whether she had a "rare medical condition" giving her an unfair competitive advantage." < 1330983850 370731 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :WELL WE CAN'T HAVE ANYONE'S INHERENT ABILITY GIVING THEM AN UNFAIR ADVANTAGE NOW < 1330983959 113318 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you have a .plan file on any accounts anywhere? < 1330984271 358289 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : He then charges you 200 moneys for a Marriage Thing. <-- septims < 1330984326 13396 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you're missing the point of the placeholder < 1330984341 990473 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not necessarily "I don't know what it's called", but "other people won't know what it's called" < 1330984346 558391 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, uh, I was correcting "moneys" < 1330984353 824252 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it's a placholder < 1330984356 58633 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*placeholder < 1330984359 499037 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :to make the sentence more legible < 1330984367 172625 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, so "currency units (septims)" < 1330984400 620714 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and "Marriage Thing" is "Amulet of Mara" I /think/ < 1330984456 654088 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had a .plan file in some earlier home Linux box. < 1330984487 842311 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :And maybe I have a .plan at the university's general-purpose shell home directory? Though I have a feeling they wiped those out at some point. < 1330984519 450560 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I still have a .plan file there. < 1330984522 222582 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :vipunen ~ 53 % cat .plan < 1330984522 409002 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :>#v1&#:<-1<-1\0\_.@ use email < 1330984522 409199 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :>2-!#v_:2\^fibre^-< to connect. < 1330984522 409308 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :^:_ >$1>\#+:#$!_1^ < 1330984532 401922 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's even channel-appropriate. < 1330984547 701669 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sadly, I don't think anyone has ever asked me about the meaning of the .plan. < 1330984586 886851 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have an account on the Free Geek computers, so I have a .plan file there. It contains information about which days I am in. < 1330984612 123071 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The finger server even returns the plan, I was wondering if they had given up on that. < 1330984623 64558 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think we have a publicly approachable finger server, though. < 1330984653 333027 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is a .plan? < 1330984666 701057 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a file in your home directory that a finger server includes in the finger output. < 1330984672 459421 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone has said that "Which constellation on the ecliptic is an astrological sign not named after?" should be a question in Trivial Pursuit, after we have discussed a few things. Do you think so? < 1330984678 959064 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Typically a multi-line one; while a .project is a single-line variant. < 1330984692 116047 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're supposed to set them so that people fingering you can know roughly what you're working on. < 1330984704 276239 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-78-146-166-86.as13285.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1330984710 974588 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Free Geek Vancouver also has no public accessible anything in the user accounts, as far as I know. < 1330984766 697999 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric : slaves to armok programmer's .plan is ~1000 lines long < 1330984822 636764 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: /all/ the constellations in the ecliptic, there's an astrological sign not named after that constellation < 1330984826 687390 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I think that is far longer than a .plan file ought to be; it should never be more than twenty lines in my opinion (although probably less) < 1330984827 795983 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least 11 of them, in fact < 1330984853 38194 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also "what is a .plan file" was apparently taught at our "computer as a tool" (the mandatory introduction-to-the-university's-system) course. < 1330984854 836809 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Maybe I should rephrase the question, it isn't very good < 1330984865 537867 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'm grepping old logs to find out if anyone has asked me about the .plan above. < 1330984900 617278 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently it was even one exercise on that course, to make a .plan file for yourself. < 1330984926 697809 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Do you know a better way to rephrase the question? < 1330984960 181167 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see someone else's plan has been "Doing my best to become the fastest wank^H^H^H^Htyper." < 1330984966 328243 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"which constellation on the ecliptic does not have an astrological sign named after it?" < 1330985002 389912 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Yes, that is better. < 1330985011 842804 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(xlock also (at least with some versions/settings/etc.) shows the locked user's .plan under the user name.) < 1330985018 940493 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric : ais523, so "currency units (septims)" < 1330985019 282280 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric : and "Marriage Thing" is "Amulet of Mara" I /think/ < 1330985026 306489 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :[1] Do you think it would be a good question for Trivial Pursuit? [2] Do you know the answer? < 1330985026 494250 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And people say Vorpal has a sense of humour. < 1330985061 506507 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[1] probably not, there are probably minor constellations on the ecliptic that don't have names; [2] no < 1330985112 831801 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I think all constellations have names because the IAU defined all areas of the celestial sphere as belonging to one of 88 Latin constellations. < 1330985133 324151 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(They are useful for naming stars and for identifying stars) < 1330985181 221567 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :See if anyone else in here knows the answer < 1330985423 386209 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are other people who have accounts at Free Geek Vancouver, but as far as I know none of them have a .plan file. < 1330985475 501933 :tzxn3!~tzxn3@cpc5-mapp3-0-0-cust464.12-4.cable.virginmedia.com QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1330985563 547248 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did not know the answer, but now I do; still, it's slightly obscure for Trivial Pursuit, maybe? Then again, I'm no trivia game designer, and certainly it's got questions of various difficulties. < 1330985618 307634 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want a more obscure trivia game anyways < 1330985732 846409 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Another thing: Two astrological signs are named after constellations which have slightly different names than the astrological signs named after them (I don't know if it was always the case). Do you know which two? (Hint: One of them is an astrological sign which one of the tropics is named after and corresponds to.) < 1330985748 794566 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, wouldn't sell to the "masses" < 1330985882 584327 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I suppose you are correct; but you could still make minor selling things, there are such service to sell such games with actual cards. You could also make them as data files in computer; actually I think they should include both so that you can write computer program with it and print out the cards yourself too < 1330985896 404282 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, cards? < 1330985897 540382 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1330985922 376246 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you mean a physical game < 1330985933 984830 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was thinking game show < 1330985945 729891 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :still I don't think it is mainstream enough < 1330985950 65280 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, I found something, you can sell with cards, dice, custom board, whatever. For computer file you can just type into the computer. For television, of course you need far more < 1330985953 236646 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :computer game, maybe < 1330986056 8003 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was going to say "Trivial Pursuit, which was mentioned, isn't a game show", but of course it has game show adaptations. Anyway, it's got all these different nonsense editions, though admittedly a bit more "mainstream" than astronomy/astrology. (Like, uh, the Star Wars Episode I edition.) < 1330986059 27699 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, but sure, include questions like "what does the following 4x4 transformation matrix do" < 1330986067 277271 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(okay that is even more niche) < 1330986090 167891 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes you can include stuff like that too if you want to < 1330986095 599060 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1330986098 686353 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't want to < 1330986179 750036 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a collective name for the vectors (1 0 0 1) (0 1 0 1) (0 0 1 1)? That is the unit vectors of 3D with a homogeneous coordinate added? < 1330986283 651145 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps they're called "the unit vectors of 3D with a homogenous coordinate added". < 1330986300 156763 :PiRSquared!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 QUIT :Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88 [Firefox 10.0/20111221135037] < 1330986356 943502 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, that is rather long and unwieldy though < 1330986506 853429 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're just x̂, ŷ, ẑ in an xyzh coordinate system, aren't they? < 1330986518 685130 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, my IRC client renders those combined characters pretty badly < 1330986527 613688 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, uh is that how you write unit vectors? x with a ^ on top? < 1330986538 910173 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never seen that way to write unit vectors before < 1330986545 322661 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's what's taught in school in the UK < 1330986548 964256 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh okay < 1330986559 699951 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :vorpal: How do you write unit vectors? < 1330986561 887622 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ on top = unit vector, regardless of whether it's in an axis direction or not < 1330986598 275358 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ion, e_1, e_2, ...., e_n (where _ is as in TeX) for (1 0 ...) (0 1 0 ...) ... < 1330986611 677763 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :\hat{x} is I think vaguely common for the normalized x. < 1330986616 691110 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is what I have been taught < 1330986627 210265 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\hat{v} = v/||v||, no? < 1330986638 128585 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I've seen the x-, y- and z-aligned unit vectors called \hat{i}, \hat{j} and \hat{k}. < 1330986640 738038 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ion, had a German teacher though, so who knows (I live in Sweden) < 1330986663 686153 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your German teacher taught you maths? < 1330986670 240513 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: oh, you're right < 1330986672 418603 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That explains a lot. < 1330986678 577553 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, no, the math teacher was from Germany < 1330986683 893706 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :he didn't teach German < 1330986684 148242 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is î, ĵ, k̂ < 1330986687 534869 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not x/y/z < 1330986690 198428 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The notations , , , or , with or without hat/circumflex, are also used, particularly in contexts where i, j, k might lead to confusion with another quantity." < 1330986709 908432 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, he spoke pretty good Swedish though < 1330986723 378875 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh... that's hatted (x, y, z), (x_1, x_2, x_3), (e_x, e_y, e_z) and (e_1, e_2, e_3). < 1330986724 725168 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I currently have a math teacher at university who is from China. And that guy doesn't speak very good Swedish. < 1330986729 285772 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unit_vector < 1330986735 369459 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :So that's a total of five notations for them. < 1330986748 685767 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1330986768 93063 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then the versions without hats for those where it makes sense. < 1330986803 710154 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yeah I never seen the hat one < 1330986810 985682 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :In these parts we write vectors with squiggly lines underneath. < 1330986838 623602 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I seen vectors done as straight underline, bold font and line just above the letter < 1330986842 661159 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :by different teachers < 1330986842 951284 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The hat is a common notation for normalization, though; it's just that when speaking of the unit vectors, it's a bit superfluous. < 1330986852 891498 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometimes there's a small arrow above. < 1330986859 220747 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yes that one too < 1330986866 131354 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, seen arrow below too < 1330986966 109316 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why are there so many ways to write the same thing in math? < 1330986973 380644 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :It just hinders communication < 1330986986 86719 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then there is the case of the same symbol being used for different things < 1330987000 92678 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :which at least make slightly more sense < 1330987000 999157 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the two are probably connected, if you think about it < 1330987030 879335 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, hm? the two questions I raised? Or the two usages of the same symbol? < 1330987033 236570 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, surely it's obvious even to you why there are so many notations for vectors. < 1330987044 984736 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the idea of "homogeneous coordinates" is also a similar idea occurs in my system of "matrix accounting"? < 1330987061 114670 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, presumably different people preferred different notations and thus we got the confusing mess we are in now < 1330987063 840066 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: writing the same thing different ways, and same symbol used for different things < 1330987064 940664 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is not a very good reason < 1330987072 37183 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to invent new notations on the fly to avoid clashes < 1330987086 595240 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes of course < 1330987121 15305 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But, I suppose, many things in mathematics can be found to have multiple applications possible < 1330987136 546571 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, so you are saying 5 different persons needed to come up with a notation for vectors? That is a lot of independent research around the same time finding the same concept then < 1330987185 61092 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's bad enough, in my field, that for the same notion, some people are using ⩽ for the same thing that other people are using ⩾ for < 1330987205 630343 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: and I'm saying that notation that avoids clashes for one person, will have clashes for someone else < 1330987214 767402 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :people who use vectors almost exclusively aren't going to want to write in arrows all the time < 1330987229 909958 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but people who use both vectors and other things may need them to avoid clashes < 1330987252 47505 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : it's bad enough, in my field, that for the same notion, some people are using ⩽ for the same thing that other people are using ⩾ for <-- wow < 1330987264 555219 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: and I'm saying that notation that avoids clashes for one person, will have clashes for someone else <-- ah, right < 1330987275 174020 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, specifically, vectors are a very widespread and very old (by mathematical notational standards) concept. < 1330987282 570066 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yes < 1330987288 211798 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :They have been independently invented and studied countless times. < 1330987317 910187 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Each of those times resulted in a new notation which persisted in the work which inherited most directly from it, and over time they intermingled. < 1330987319 390985 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, but over time you would think some ways of writing them would die out and you would in the end be left with a single one < 1330987348 980779 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, might have been ≤ and ≥, I can't remember < 1330987352 529867 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, because for all that intermingling the people using one notation don't interact that much with those using the other, and most are content to make do. < 1330987388 52989 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, isn't ≤ just a different way to write ⩽? Different stylizing I mean < 1330987395 493230 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not always, but yes sometimes < 1330987398 754041 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1330987409 160128 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you think they have different Unicode codepoints? < 1330987417 679764 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, fair enough < 1330987430 719833 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, good point < 1330987458 201155 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the fourth one for (i, j, k)? Is it just l? Or do people just go with (e_1, e_2, e_3, e_4) when they need four? (For (x, y, z) I'd assume w.) < 1330987501 359052 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's got to be either l or h, I think < 1330987555 920385 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, btw you said xyzh for homogenus coordinate above, it is just that I seem to remember it being xyzw in some contexts (such as opengl)? < 1330987581 663346 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :opengl has sets of four arbitrary letters that it uses for coordinates without knowing what they mean < 1330987586 922862 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, CUDA does < 1330987600 408200 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, probably it's /actually/ GLSL < 1330987605 6286 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know too many GPU-related frameworks < 1330987613 844151 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can address a vector as xyzw or as rgba, for instance < 1330987631 305808 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are a few other schemes, they had to use weird letters sometimes to avoid clashes < 1330987645 724928 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, um, opengl accpets xyzw, rgba, 0123, A < 1330987649 905567 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/A$// < 1330987658 584919 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, glsl does < 1330987679 524766 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least those are the four variants I know of < 1330987693 365352 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and presumably the texcoord one is uv?? < 1330987709 155754 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :OpenGL texture coordinate function parameters are s, t, r, q. < 1330987721 546407 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1330987724 11439 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though normally people don't go beyond s, t. < 1330987728 544674 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :so why is it called uv-mapping? < 1330987741 136231 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1330987742 186784 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because the coordinates are quite often also (u, v). < 1330987746 234871 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1330987769 138803 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know how they'd continue from (u, v) onwards though. < 1330987777 516539 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :sadly mixing them doesn't work. You can't do foo.xyb < 1330987800 186255 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :For some reason I would have guessed (u, v, s, t), but I'm not sure if that happens anywhere. < 1330987811 699219 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well, why should they be in order, strq isn't < 1330987819 601401 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :rgba isn't either of course < 1330987832 926307 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yeah uvst would work < 1330987864 656213 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :'strq' isn't even in the '3412' order. < 1330987884 26386 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe someone added 'r' first, and then had to add 'q' later. < 1330987885 629558 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is 3421 < 1330987894 357244 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I guess so < 1330987906 900969 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, they could go stuv < 1330987954 349618 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, then you could claim "uv-mapping" originated in someone reading it in middle endian < 1330987970 894762 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :which would be an awesome way to confuse new students < 1330988001 140157 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see "uvw mapping" is also a term that is used, in 3D modeling contexts. < 1330988007 388078 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1330988011 961322 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :for 3D textures? < 1330988094 803034 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, minecraft with 3D textures and a way to cut blocks in any way you like, that sounds awesome < 1330988127 783493 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure how you would handle grass though < 1330988188 568342 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems to be about just plain regular textures; not sure how it differs from UV mapping. < 1330988214 416514 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :A Blender tutorial about it seems to be using UVW and UV quite interchangeably. < 1330988214 754734 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1330988274 349155 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh < 1330988289 334788 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1330988310 786756 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(A "Blender tutorial" above meant "someone's unofficial tutorial that uses Blender", not "a tutorial that's part of the official Blender documentation".) < 1330988317 301490 :kallisti!~eris@h130.9.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330988317 746589 :kallisti!~eris@h130.9.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net QUIT :Changing host < 1330988317 933218 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake JOIN :#esoteric < 1330988357 627917 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm 3D textures mostly seem to be used for clouds and similar < 1330988390 298872 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hlep < 1330988399 358165 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, hi < 1330988401 412608 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm trying to get my second monitor working. < 1330988417 57117 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :at first it was freezing up my computer with kernel messges about an invalid EDID checksum or something < 1330988420 46959 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1330988424 185589 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I switched to usermode mode setting < 1330988430 219029 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which allows me to connect the monitor < 1330988431 67164 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :however < 1330988437 912299 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :now the display resolution on my normal monitor is shit. < 1330988442 558382 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, nvidia, amd or intel? < 1330988448 524968 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :intel. integrated. < 1330988462 798307 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, always worked for me in the gnome 2 monitor control panel < 1330988468 424180 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :HA HA HA HA HA GNOME < 1330988469 924228 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :never used anything else for it < 1330988470 209842 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's that? < 1330988473 791507 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, gnome 2 < 1330988482 504104 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :not gnome 3 < 1330988498 618539 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, pretty sure there is a tool in xfce too < 1330988501 709799 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol noob. real linux users have horrible problems for very basic things that they have to spend hours fixing by hand. < 1330988504 26575 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :xrandr's command-line tool is reasonably reasonable, and should be able to do everything. < 1330988527 729266 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :And there's... I forget the name. It was gxrandr or some-such. < 1330988547 431528 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah okay. < 1330988563 46928 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :å lol noob. real linux users have horrible problems for very basic things that they have to spend hours fixing by hand. <-- quite, I remember dealing with some old slackware on a 2.4 kernel < 1330988563 541144 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"xrandr -q" is a good first step to check that it sees the outputs correctly. < 1330988567 301299 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/^å// < 1330988578 790543 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :xrandr: Failed to get size of gamma for output default < 1330988580 417006 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks promising < 1330988590 411416 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :size of gamma? < 1330988591 500311 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1330988604 379054 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :value for gamma I would understand < 1330988607 137444 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :but size? < 1330988608 620089 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Possibly as in "float, int, or whatever". < 1330988624 369954 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ xrandr -q |& sprunge http://sprunge.us/ecVe < 1330988639 360814 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sprunge.us/WXgi <-- my xrandr -q, as a reference < 1330988645 136833 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that's not good. < 1330988654 644015 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so... < 1330988654 830631 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's seeing only a single output. < 1330988657 48773 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw this only have LDVS, VGA and DP1 afaik < 1330988659 852086 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this monitor just broken < 1330988660 57590 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1330988661 960176 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :the HDMI and DP2 are made up < 1330988666 120097 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it worked fine about a week ago in Ubuntu. < 1330988680 42121 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, reboot to ubuntu and check < 1330988683 243920 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :..no < 1330988684 772845 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, what distro are you on now < 1330988687 817689 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Debian < 1330988692 630956 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1330988699 547150 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I could try liveCD or something < 1330988703 96417 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but man that's going to take forever. < 1330988707 723528 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was under the assumption that Intel drivers should do XRandR pretty well. < 1330988717 2367 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I'm missing some drivers? < 1330988719 162111 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, hm 1024x768... I guess that one is a 4:3 laptop? < 1330988722 97883 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it mirrored now? < 1330988727 938073 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1330988729 978494 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :black screen < 1330988752 688318 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : but man that's going to take forever. <-- how will a livecd take forever? < 1330988757 586653 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :more like 5 minutes < 1330988778 355997 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you must have amazing internet. < 1330988778 853207 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that is assuming a slow computer < 1330988790 634996 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, oh I thought you had a copy locally < 1330988791 715826 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1330988799 230937 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :then an hour or so to download it < 1330988800 466182 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't suppose there's any official "fn-f7"-style display-mangling key? (Alternatively, X startup logs about the video bits can also help.) < 1330988811 108371 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is... but it doesn't work now. < 1330988812 944146 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :5 minutes to copy to USB stick < 1330988814 784134 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's not hardware < 1330988821 965166 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's some kind of software key. < 1330988825 375450 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that did stuff in GNOME < 1330988827 375316 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but now doesn't in xmonad. < 1330988857 341158 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, the hw (computer or monitor) could have died, or you are now using a buggy version of the kernel < 1330988879 417522 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://askubuntu.com/questions/14299/my-monitor-is-plugged-into-vga-0-why-it-is-giving-me-errors-about-vga-1 < 1330988882 446055 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been going off of this. < 1330988889 239844 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which says switch from kernel mode setting to user < 1330988890 335279 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which I did. < 1330988911 576088 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll play around some more < 1330988934 502666 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, that is for radeon, which is just crazy usually < 1330988972 220741 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :um not specifically no. < 1330988976 375257 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :works for Intel as well. < 1330988984 557946 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fair enough < 1330988993 306795 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm beginning to think that user mode setting is not the solution here though < 1330989004 567237 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, anyway radeon /is/ crazy, I should know, though I use the catalyst driver < 1330989006 807389 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Hour? Downloaded ubuntu-11.10-desktop-amd64.iso the other day to test the internets; 6.7 MiB/s at home, a bit less than two minutes for the CD. < 1330989026 850206 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm, how large is that image? < 1330989033 547624 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :730 megs or so. < 1330989037 497742 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it was a full-sized CD... < 1330989039 157162 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1330989050 735348 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was the name of that graphical utility? < 1330989055 888618 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :for xrandr? < 1330989058 539081 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm must have been using bt to download it last time < 1330989059 14220 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: that's like ... A HUNDRED SECONDS < 1330989061 511739 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :sloooow < 1330989062 957764 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, and that took about an hour < 1330989067 874232 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least I know it wasn't corrupt < 1330989072 589084 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :730/6.7 is around 108. < 1330989081 628273 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1330989087 684633 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine's estimated at around 50 minutes currently < 1330989095 201322 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, oh you have 6.7 MiByte/s? < 1330989097 758401 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :lucky you < 1330989109 603920 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have 8 MBit/s < 1330989117 399780 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(down that is) < 1330989119 808391 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :youtube has this fancy thing that compares your internet speed to everyone elses < 1330989122 826192 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and mine is shit. < 1330989149 12806 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: Thankfully it was 78.7 MiB/s at work; so if I'm in a hurry and can't wait that two minutes, I can go there to download it. Shouldn't take more than a hour to get to work and back. < 1330989165 401599 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: 50 minutes, for one cd? so you have about 1-1.5MBit then? < 1330989213 720321 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: nice < 1330989220 41431 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, how long would it take with a 300 baud modem (include protocol overhead, because it is going to be quite significant in absolute terms in this case I bet) < 1330989220 912473 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330989233 360973 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: something like that. < 1330989240 818117 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I don't think my office has gigabit internet, probably at most 100Mbit < 1330989263 666417 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :currently ~330 Kb/s < 1330989288 567808 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no ethernet access at home currently < 1330989291 659873 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :always wireless. < 1330989296 132224 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch < 1330989300 269744 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't survive that < 1330989304 647455 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :my desktop lacks wlan < 1330989307 368497 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :just gbit ethernet < 1330989311 553525 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use that for my laptop too < 1330989315 174701 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: 300 baud? depends on how many symbols you're using for the encoding < 1330989327 120733 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it is more stable, and faster when transferring between the desktop and laptop < 1330989338 102610 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :or *modulation, maybe < 1330989348 380405 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, hm good point, what were the standard coding at the time those were modern? < 1330989358 294479 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I liked the 6.7 MiB/s home-speed especially since the contract is for 50 Mbps == 5.9 MiB/s. < 1330989366 603938 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1330989401 403447 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, is it possible that I need some driver to get this monitor to work correctly? < 1330989410 274683 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330989428 712777 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, since it is intel graphics: no < 1330989436 126641 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The VDSL box reports it negotiates the link at around 76000kbps. I'm hoping nobody at the ISP is going to notice and downgrade it. < 1330989455 480625 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1330989472 725772 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :where is the bootup log? < 1330989479 153363 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I saw something about i283 in it. < 1330989491 327057 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, presumably the standard place? < 1330989496 912166 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...which is? < 1330989499 688398 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt debian vs. ubuntu would change it < 1330989507 356369 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :/var/log/dmesg < 1330989516 535976 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no I mean < 1330989524 179918 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the messages that appear when Debian is starting up < 1330989534 185976 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: looks like some of the early modems were 300bit/s < 1330989535 47315 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think it's dmesg < 1330989536 996355 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, not sure what you mean, not the kernel messages? < 1330989541 174399 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, hm < 1330989549 392611 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :(though I wonder why I'm looking this up on wikipedia for you) < 1330989569 206244 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, I'm conditioning you to become like fizzie < 1330989570 436696 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's all dmesg up until the init.d scripts start. < 1330989574 329289 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :snap, I let it slip < 1330989591 644378 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't know where (or if) the initscript outputs go. < 1330989596 875758 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1330989597 426977 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes init.d stuff < 1330989602 397831 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :no clue < 1330989612 767613 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're not usually so interesting. < 1330989633 368314 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: google for 730MB / 300 bit/s now < 1330989634 3396 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :this one went something like "failed to find i283 symbols. graphics turbo disabled" or something. < 1330989635 319117 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would see them just above my login prompt < 1330989637 628357 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'VE LOST TURBO GUYS < 1330989640 561515 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, even when they e.g. load modules, the interesting bits are the kernel messages from the modules. < 1330989653 172378 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, stop trying to condition me into using google! < 1330989679 208578 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: google for 730MB / 300 bit/s now < 1330989686 750352 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1330989690 742781 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(730 MB) / (300 (bit / s)) = 236.253235 days <-- nice though < 1330989695 988435 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :success < 1330989700 702422 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :dammit < 1330989713 470038 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, Now 50 minutes doesn't seem that long does it? < 1330989713 980762 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ 17.356635] intel ips 0000:00:1f.6: failed to get i915 symbols, graphics turbo disabled < 1330989716 979194 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ 22.553315] intel ips 0000:00:1f.6: i915 driver attached, reenabling gpu turbo < 1330989722 90411 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there we go. < 1330989725 480198 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti, stop whining you modern kids... < 1330989726 939557 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so... not a problem? < 1330989736 847669 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doesn't look too problematic. < 1330989759 12962 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about the Xorg.0.log's "intel" lines? < 1330989794 210268 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And/or xrandr -q if you changeded something, I suppose.) < 1330989884 294401 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing bad... < 1330989913 339475 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ sudo find /var/log/ -exec grep i915 {} \; | sprunge http://sprunge.us/JZcU < 1330989918 541254 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :.. < 1330989939 214351 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :night < 1330990045 224145 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Was this still without KMS? < 1330990205 935557 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1330990211 627356 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The ignored EDID blocks don't sound too scary. It's only every odd one, after all. But the X logs should list all (i.e. >1) detected outputs. < 1330990226 793838 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: was what? < 1330990235 839164 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the second monitor? no. < 1330990239 236095 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything else? yes. < 1330990249 131459 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1330990258 707094 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...misread. uh, some of it is without KMS and some of it is < 1330990268 812645 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I only switched to no-KMS like 30 minutes ago maybe. < 1330990287 796347 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but with KMS it would spam invalid EDID messages and everything froze < 1330990293 380188 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :until I disconnected the monitor. < 1330990374 418122 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330990391 520885 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the monitor is definitely sending incorrect information. < 1330990393 395759 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think. < 1330990396 929938 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the same block everytime < 1330990448 838506 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1330990501 91948 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not entirely sure why I switched to Debian < 1330990504 194020 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It shouldn't really be actively sending anything, just when the card polls it. But I suppose it's possible for the KMS bits to get confused by EDID issues and keep asking. < 1330990532 34655 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could have easily set up xmonad in Ubuntu, and kept all the fancy autoconfigure stuff. < 1330990620 826068 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless the fancy autoconfig stuff is mostly GNOME < 1330990719 873665 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's some amount of Ubuntu involved too, when it comes to drivers and settings and such. Anyhoo. Without KMS, tried plugging to monitor in and then restarting X and seeing if it even notices there's two outputs. (I suppose there's no xorg.conf to confuse matters?) < 1330990744 727128 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't touched xorg.conf so, probably not. < 1330990761 847389 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...restarting X would involve restarting firefox < 1330990764 568513 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and my Ubuntu download. :P < 1330990765 940774 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1330990784 512071 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps I should have set up screen with wget. :P < 1330990882 52559 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-52-77.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1330990882 303929 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-52-77.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Changing host < 1330990882 490308 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1330990911 289884 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, I could switch to bittorrent. :> < 1330991012 907248 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's possible X might notice something new at startup time. Though I think "xrandr -q" itself should make it "rescan monitors". < 1330991077 536084 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"arandr" was the lightweight XRandR GUI, but it doesn't do anything magical. < 1330991122 730993 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :awww yeah < 1330991134 58361 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :screen session with rtorrent resuming where the direct download left off. < 1330991185 775126 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The "ignoring invalid edid block" of every odd number just sounds like the monitor had all modes in two different formats, the correct one and (maybe for compatibility?) some funky one.) < 1330991207 392134 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an old HP monitor < 1330991215 790445 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not too old. it's an LCD. < 1330991233 431335 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :with builtin speakers < 1330991246 545173 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :HP pavilion vf52 < 1330991318 957524 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no search seems to bring up any linux related issues specifically with the monitor. < 1330991332 184752 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :could it be the VGA cable? < 1330991365 277020 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Regarding your TURBO, "Note: If you have a first generation Core i{3,5,7} series processor with an integrated GPU, failure to add i915 to the MODULES array in /etc/mkinitcpio.conf will likely cause the error kernel: intel ips [...]: failed to get i915 symbols, graphics turbo disabled." < 1330991382 71077 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The instruction was for Arch.) < 1330991404 696299 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh look I have a core i3 < 1330991413 493492 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, but it's probably that it doesn't have the i915 module available at that early time. < 1330991428 932587 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also I've been having issues with ACPI < 1330991438 822202 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :my laptop won't suspend when I close the lid. < 1330991441 612696 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :specifically. < 1330991442 356104 :myndzi\!~myndzi@c-67-168-184-168.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1330991474 414657 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still, it doesn't sound like it should be a *fatal* error, and esp. not one that'd cause things to hang. < 1330991504 345213 :blackwhit!~BirtchFam@EV-ESR1-72-49-249-239.fuse.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330991538 782393 :blackwhit!~BirtchFam@EV-ESR1-72-49-249-239.fuse.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello? < 1330991546 113114 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1330991586 163254 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ 17.749133] ACPI: resource 0000:00:1f.3 [io 0x1840-0x185f] conflicts with ACPI region SMBI [io 0x1840-0x184f] < 1330991588 521692 :blackwhit!~BirtchFam@EV-ESR1-72-49-249-239.fuse.net PART :#esoteric < 1330991589 643251 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wonder what that's about < 1330991600 989974 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ 17.749139] ACPI: If an ACPI driver is available for this device, you should use it instead of the native driver < 1330991609 881572 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1330991635 876229 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think there is one though... I wouldn't know what to look for. < 1330991681 272986 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could lspci |grep 1f.3 to maybe at least see which device it's about. < 1330991738 472462 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I seem to recall encountering some dangerous-sounding ACPI resource conflict problems too, though I think that was just for hardware monitoring sensors. < 1330991890 336359 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1330991989 593940 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would guesstimate it's about the same issue as https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=12376