< 1340496697 752940 :derdon!~derdon@p5DE8A2E7.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1340496723 424717 :derdon!~derdon@p5DE8A2E7.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1340496981 862587 :derdon!~derdon@p5DE8A2E7.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1340497364 345955 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a command in MinGW to cut off all lines of stderr after a specified line number? < 1340497833 433183 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is anyone going to make MMIX hardware? < 1340497984 420123 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only thing I want to omit is the rN register; perhaps its meaning can be changed to something else (I think there was a suggestion once about this) < 1340498056 874720 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :GCC can already compile into MMIX, they should also make LLVM to compile into MMIX, and also LLVM compile into Glulx as well < 1340498345 118027 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If LLVM compiles to Glulx, we could make up a LLVM file which implements glk.h with inline assembly language and inlining and so on < 1340498427 253435 :nortti-!nortti@ie.freebnc.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you want to omit rN register? < 1340498568 813202 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The rN register does nothing useful. < 1340498607 735679 :nortti-!nortti@ie.freebnc.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh. it confused it with rM < 1340498781 678566 :nortti-!nortti@ie.freebnc.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :goimg to sleep --> < 1340498796 511487 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :rM should be included. However, rN should be omitted or modified to mean something else. < 1340498944 505275 :nortti-!nortti@ie.freebnc.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :PRNG? < 1340498999 668644 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1340499357 864219 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/compsci/comments/u1ptn/modern_computers_are_supposed_to_be_von_neumann/ < 1340499389 582240 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure this person knows quite what 'equivalent' means. < 1340499421 685998 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a DVI format of Fascicle 1 MMIX? The PDF renders badly. < 1340499434 546725 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm astonished you have a PDF renderer. < 1340499790 851130 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I cannot find any of DVI files for those things, or any TeX source files either < 1340499866 142920 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The PDFs also print badly unless you have the same printer as whoever made the PDF and there are no rounding errors.) < 1340501136 480626 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Synthesizer for ITMCK works < 1340501563 624779 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1340503178 172466 :DHeadshot!~DH____@unaffiliated/dh----/x-6288474 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1340504252 554332 :tswett!~tswett@thay.Stanford.EDU JOIN :#esoteric < 1340506396 465019 :DHeadshot!~DH____@unaffiliated/dh----/x-6288474 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340507307 218456 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1340507703 286107 :DHeadshot!~DH____@unaffiliated/dh----/x-6288474 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1340507714 453822 :DHeadshot!~DH____@unaffiliated/dh----/x-6288474 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340507838 644691 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Io seems like it might be a good language for a codenomic < 1340507905 462093 :coppro!~scshunt@ascorbic-acid.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: get into #nomic < 1340508409 437330 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1340508445 657717 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin JOIN :#esoteric < 1340509295 417217 :DHeadshot!~DH____@unaffiliated/dh----/x-6288474 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1340509314 402476 :DHeadshot!~DH____@unaffiliated/dh----/x-6288474 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340509530 921997 :DHeadshot!~DH____@unaffiliated/dh----/x-6288474 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1340509536 440738 :DH____!~DH____@unaffiliated/dh----/x-6288474 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340511225 671052 :coppro!~scshunt@ascorbic-acid.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :am I a bad person? < 1340511241 377687 :coppro!~scshunt@ascorbic-acid.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyOf fs c = any ($ c) fs < 1340511350 432444 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well using anyOf in a higher order context is nicer than using (any . flip ($)) or whatever < 1340511374 158118 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if you're applying the arguments on-site, i think any ($ c) fs is better < 1340511405 860336 :coppro!~scshunt@ascorbic-acid.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: yeah, I am < 1340511409 441316 :coppro!~scshunt@ascorbic-acid.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I was just generalizing there < 1340511470 385737 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1340511687 286875 :MDoze!~fyrc@67.232.231.162 NICK :MSleep < 1340511688 32731 :coppro!~scshunt@ascorbic-acid.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :isFoo c = any ($ c) [isA, isB, isC] < 1340511797 833903 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t or . sequence < 1340511799 81533 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `Bool' against inferred type `[a]' < 1340511799 281350 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Expected type: [[a]] -> [Bool] < 1340511799 480185 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Inferred type: [[a]] -> [[a]] < 1340511807 312926 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, that seems reasonable < 1340511809 65628 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (or .) . sequence < 1340511810 527389 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall (f :: * -> *). (Functor f, Monad f) => [f Bool] -> f Bool < 1340511835 144450 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (Prelude.or Prelude..) Prelude.. Prelude.sequence < 1340511836 647519 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. [a -> Bool] -> a -> Bool < 1340511880 833679 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t or .: sequence < 1340511882 206451 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall (g :: * -> *). (Monad g, Functor g) => [g Bool] -> g Bool < 1340511887 914465 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :dammit, he even generalized .: < 1340512050 700756 :carbone14!~carbone14@LPuteaux-151-41-21-10.w217-128.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1340512070 349598 :MSleep!~fyrc@67.232.231.162 NICK :MDream < 1340512166 920252 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: I'd be more surprised if he hadn't, since (.:) = (.) . (.) < 1340512478 700745 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :My .: is (.:) :: (Category cat, Functor f) => cat b c -> f (cat a b) -> f (cat a c); < 1340512614 833770 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :class Nyan cat where (=^..^=) :: cat b c -> cat a b -> cat a c < 1340512685 583192 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::3 < 1340512688 514926 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :class Nyan cat where (=^..^=) :: cat cat cat -> cat cat cat -> cat cat cat < 1340512780 88636 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes i'm sure GHC 7.6 will support equirecursive infinite kinds < 1340512795 68687 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: What? < 1340512852 810191 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, what's the kind of 'cat' in that typeclass? < 1340512898 898167 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, you didn't mean that GHC 7.6 will actually support. < 1340512915 703266 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/.$/ it./ < 1340512927 948599 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was using sarcasm < 1340512950 651604 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it does seem to be the direction they're going in < 1340512976 44832 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :equirecursive infinite typekind class family polymorphism < 1340513285 432858 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1340513330 442289 :carbone14!~carbone14@LPuteaux-151-41-21-10.w217-128.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Quit: Quitte < 1340513458 298736 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does "equirecursive infinite typekind class family polymorphism" means? < 1340513494 659635 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yesterday I was looking at Wikipedia about comma category now I can understand comma category better < 1340513497 131244 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it means that cat cat cat can be a valid type < 1340513500 577058 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it means nothing zzo38 < 1340513504 980305 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is a joke < 1340513514 102918 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :add this to your training set on jokes < 1340513515 817819 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1340513526 416151 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: equirecursive infinite kinds would do that < 1340513559 497640 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :cat :: μk. k -> k -> * < 1340513586 187240 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :equirecursive means that you don't need explicit wrapping/unwrapping (as opposed to isorecursive) < 1340513666 312236 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :so isorecursive would be using a newtype to make infinite types? < 1340513671 384572 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: have you come across slice categories already? < 1340513678 270962 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: yeah, at type level < 1340513682 52067 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure what it would be at kind level < 1340513690 385687 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :newkinds? < 1340513775 833712 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: They are mentioned in the same article < 1340513785 554927 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, slice category is a specific instance of comma < 1340513790 793855 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1340513793 70396 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :being more concrete, it might be more obvious though < 1340513979 809554 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :With Ibtlfmm, we would have "kind" and "data kind" declarations (the first for kind synonyms, the second for enumerating the types belonging to it and how many parameters they are required to take; all the parameters are kinds, and there is only one "kind of kinds") < 1340514148 913928 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you can write: kind Constraint = &; kind Nat = +; kind Type = *; kind Module = @; and so on, including synonyms for more complicated kinds, as well as data kinds < 1340514223 375470 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have thought about some other categories, such as sum of categories and product of categories. I think, the sum or product of thin categories is thin, the sum or product of discrete categories is discrete, etc. Some categories may be the sum and/or product of other categories. < 1340514293 86385 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then it would seem you can even combine monads and comonads from the categories you can making a sum or product of < 1340514892 387724 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is then the category of no objects being the identity for the sum, and the discrete category of a single object for the identity for product. < 1340514990 566142 :augur!~augur@206.196.185.120 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340515021 305734 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: Do you know anything of these kind of sum and product of categories? < 1340515048 870390 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's definitely product categories < 1340515057 477283 :augur!~augur@206.196.185.120 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1340515061 655332 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I think you can do a coproduct of categories too, but it's a bit more involved < 1340515076 94424 :augur!~augur@206.196.185.120 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340515088 525489 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the category of small categories definitely has all products < 1340515168 449572 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :and probably all coproducts :) < 1340515229 587899 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I mean by these sum and product of categories is: Sum means, the objects are (C, X) where C is one of its term categories and X is an object of C, and the morphisms are (C, f) where f is a morphism of C, so if f:X->Y then (C,f):(C,X)->(C,Y). Product means, objects are (C, D, ...) where C, D, ... are its factor categories and the morphisms are the morphism one from each factor category. < 1340515354 704648 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is this OK? < 1340515405 607973 :augur!~augur@206.196.185.120 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1340515421 656218 :augur!~augur@206.196.185.120 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340515455 493788 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, that's probably right < 1340515467 793980 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :just look at products and coproducts in the category of small categories < 1340515470 544371 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :they work out < 1340515484 508213 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :coproducts are pretty easy, actually, as far as I can tell < 1340515516 914649 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Coproducts? < 1340515521 191564 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :sums < 1340515529 151177 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :coproduct is the more conventional term < 1340515542 722815 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, well I did think and write about both sum and product of categories < 1340515559 630882 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, you know about products and coproducts within categories? < 1340515582 324216 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1340515593 104420 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think so < 1340515595 267299 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :then work out if your constructions fit the descriptions :) < 1340515599 195858 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I think they do < 1340515612 431305 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :to have a proper sum category < 1340515637 190261 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :it contains all the objects and all the morphisms from the two "addends" < 1340515646 89812 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then you have injection functors from the two addends < 1340515648 648608 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that is how I mean < 1340515651 99735 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a few diagrams commute < 1340515664 631446 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :And yes then you also have a functor from the addend to the sum < 1340515674 110290 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1340515683 361833 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then a universal functor < 1340515687 623014 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it should work < 1340515781 915567 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think they even form a semiring? < 1340515865 163024 :asiekierka!~asiekierk@178235038077.elblag.vectranet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1340516000 103087 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :For multiplication you can make up a discrete category from any natural number so that the sum of a category with itself is like the product of that category with the discrete category with two objects. < 1340516070 300236 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't it? < 1340516435 786436 :DH____!~DH____@unaffiliated/dh----/x-6288474 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1340517336 875400 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can exponent category now be made? I can think of something, but maybe won't work since the exponent may not always be discrete. < 1340517526 385279 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :since Cat is a CCC, it should exist < 1340517533 55460 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't thought about what it would mean though < 1340517576 650623 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :you might want to ask in ##categorytheory < 1340517627 688192 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to go to sleep :) < 1340517689 681473 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have thought a little bit about it < 1340517714 827834 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I think I know what it means at least if the exponent is discrete < 1340517753 590766 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I try to think of it more too; maybe I will manage to think of it < 1340518360 402680 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1340518836 404752 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340520123 38465 :john_metcalf!~digital_w@87.115.178.251 QUIT :Quit: http://retroprogramming.com < 1340521593 534541 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1340521630 51733 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no TOPIC #esoteric :Food is just pals you eat. Here's a spork for ya. | http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/ | This is what the bfjoust hill will look like under the new scoring system: http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=XEWnVMg8 < 1340522025 175912 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :How many people in here know some things about category theory? How many people do not know? < 1340522036 399856 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know some things < 1340522095 676908 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Before you joined to this channel, I have discussed sum and product of categories, and also thinking about power/exponent of categories. < 1340522295 776475 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any monads and comonads in the categories the sum/product is made from, can also be combined to make monads/comonads in the sum/product as well, I think < 1340522301 284427 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :those things are usually defined _in_ categories afaik, which means that if you want to do them _of_ categories you want to look at Cat, the category of categories < 1340522398 328765 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes I do mean of categories. And I have written above about how to do; you may review the logs if you want to < 1340522512 297333 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :what i mean is that your definitions are likely to be equivalent to the usual definitions as applied to Cat < 1340522523 517105 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1340522618 281770 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION mutters about being vaguely near a wildfire < 1340522620 863934 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know absolutely nothing < 1340522650 125756 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Using these sum and product I would also think, the numbers are being like the discrete categories with that many objects < 1340522651 583261 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know if the fire has anything to do with it, but respiration is irritated! < 1340522691 643531 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example, if you have a functor F from A to C and a functor G from B to C, then there should be a unique functor H from A+B to C such that F and G are the compositions of H with the embeddings < 1340522750 298709 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and dually for products < 1340522765 306897 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that the universal property? < 1340522766 376813 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I believe you, it makes sense < 1340522769 857784 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes < 1340522796 653465 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :category theory is so awesome < 1340522818 799787 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Yes < 1340522826 984136 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes < 1340522831 261222 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1340522885 688564 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :while the power/exponent should be defined if Cat is a cartesian closed category, by another universal property < 1340522923 190374 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you get the property I have described if the exponent is discrete? < 1340522940 62920 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :um i didn't read what you said before < 1340522955 444518 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was gonna check what the UP for power is but ended up reading about sheaves and taking a break now. those things are crazy. < 1340522957 160027 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cartesian_closed_category says it is < 1340523013 395704 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I have described is that, if C is to the power of a discrete category having two objects, it will be like a product of C with C, and so on < 1340523015 509380 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ Y is defined as the right adjoint functor of x Y < 1340523040 524642 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: sounds reasonable < 1340523118 460071 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hom(X x 2, Z) ~= Hom(X, Z^2) < 1340523150 506428 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :X x 2 ought to be ~ X + X < 1340523191 937395 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have described above that the sum of C with C, is like the product of C with a discrete category having 2 objects. < 1340523199 897855 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :so then you get Hom(X + X, Z) ~= Hom(X, Z x Z), which looks like it might follow from the universal properties < 1340523217 450552 :calamari!~calamari@ip72-211-147-156.tc.ph.cox.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1340523356 802265 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: i think http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cartesian_closed_category#Equational_theory may be relevant < 1340523377 619219 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1340523520 259806 :augur!~augur@206.196.185.120 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1340523892 578871 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe that does show the property I described to be the case. < 1340523983 421529 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What of monads and comonads on the exponent category then? < 1340524007 433365 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is a category called if all isomorphisms are endomorphisms? < 1340524286 60850 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1340524351 407151 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does it have a name? < 1340524576 526782 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1340524660 153107 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: skeletal category http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skeleton_(category_theory) < 1340524892 760365 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1340525711 160392 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340525724 420380 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1340525730 384970 :augur_!~augur@208.58.5.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340526314 97754 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What values of Cwt should I use for ITMCK? < 1340526345 653259 :derdon!~derdon@217.225.199.206 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340526417 812640 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps 0x7000 is OK since OpenMPT Wiki does not list any other trackers as using that, and the actual version number can be determined by the name of the first instrument < 1340526496 495092 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can, however, use the -w command-line switch or the #TRACKER-VERSION command in the input file to override the Cwt value to be whatever you want. < 1340526603 124846 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But if you have other suggestions you can tell me < 1340526825 187619 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have added the information to the wiki http://wiki.openmpt.org/Development:_Formats/IT as instructed. < 1340527183 182276 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1340527991 36183 :nooga!~nooga@ip-46-250-173-30.ip.maverick.com.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1340528486 400133 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1340528489 87961 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello! < 1340528656 377795 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some guy on the TV is saying "Where in the bible does it say we have to pay tax?" < 1340528669 499730 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to punch him in the face and say Matthew 22:21 < 1340528746 860168 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that the one that's Render Caesar's unto Caesar's? < 1340528751 638870 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1340528758 593228 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because that's easy to twist into meaning absolutely nothing whatsoever. < 1340528764 761258 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :True < 1340528810 266286 :Gregor!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Very much like the rest of the Bible. < 1340528837 953269 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Caesar was a god, so of course you had to pay tax to him. < 1340528850 338264 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obama is Satan, so you shouldn't pay taxes to *him*. < 1340528883 82995 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about David Cameron? < 1340528939 383193 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Leviticus 19:27 < 1340528943 164820 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do not cut the hair at the sides of your head or clip off the edges of your beard. < 1340528952 151328 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yup, he is a servant of Satan. < 1340528960 839358 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait you're saying there are right wing religious extremists outside the USA? < 1340528968 452442 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is highly at odds with what I have read on the Internet < 1340528973 971619 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nah, just people who want to avoid taxes < 1340528983 898268 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1340529002 707399 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: There *are*, they just seem to have somewhat less influence. < 1340529006 778408 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Crazy is a human universal. < 1340529019 539943 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are many places where they have more influence < 1340529022 739499 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :True. < 1340529034 119423 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are many places where the crazies actually run the place. < 1340529074 84754 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the thing about right-wing religious extremists in the USA is, you know which party they're going to vote for < 1340529079 347623 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that party doesn't actually have to give them anything < 1340529088 129779 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe the occasional bone. < 1340529100 353530 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :they bluster about social issues to get out the vote < 1340529117 538817 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and some proportion of the party is composed of said extremists, and some of those people get elected < 1340529121 201302 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not that many really < 1340529206 146998 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not that the people they vote for are any *better*... < 1340529220 190140 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The badness is just of a completely different sort. < 1340529224 769546 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1340529256 2112 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i don't know < 1340529290 534552 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a slight preference for a corrupt corporatist state over a theocracy < 1340529298 474093 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :neither is good < 1340529302 597697 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yes. < 1340529312 605681 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :this preference reflects my various forms of privilege < 1340529324 321000 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both are very, very low on my preference ranking, but corrupt corporatist state > theocracy. < 1340529333 937120 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Back < 1340529387 208685 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But, then, in a theocracy I'm liable to be dead. < 1340529390 755782 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The UK is technically sort-of a theocracy < 1340529399 302582 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But nobody actually cares < 1340529403 151812 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :how so? < 1340529413 925050 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The head of state is directly appointed by good < 1340529416 487603 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :*God < 1340529422 346293 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And is the head of the Church of England < 1340529447 222580 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: Rule by divine right, the monarch is the head of the church, members of the church are *entitled* to positions in the legislature... < 1340529466 850950 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that last bit is dodgy as hell < 1340529498 266816 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The house of lords doesn't have any real power < 1340529536 560804 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :*any more < 1340529542 836693 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1340529555 675593 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Up until quite recently, they were your supreme court as well. < 1340529567 917302 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Really? Didn't know that < 1340529581 359658 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, the House of Lords was the court of last resort up until, what, 2008? < 1340529617 114862 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, 2009. < 1340529750 889642 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. I suspect that that's where the Senate's role of trying impeachments comes from... < 1340529776 74402 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1340529855 140402 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the US Congress was designed with the *intent* of the House of Representatives being somewhat analogous to the House of Commons, and the Senate somewhat analogous to the House of Lords) < 1340529869 563766 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :How did that end up? < 1340529899 758367 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably the last blow in the setup was the establishment of direct election of Senators. < 1340529986 714968 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the original setup was that each state appointed Senators in a manner they saw fit, with convention being that the governor of the state would appoint them) < 1340530157 718132 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought they were mainly elected by state legislatures < 1340530196 109295 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The Senate of the United States shall be composed of two Senators from each State, chosen by the Legislature thereof" < 1340530204 326414 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, perhaps I misremembered. < 1340530407 70731 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed I did. < 1340530455 292396 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :amusingly enough, the current non-proportional structure of the Senate would be unconstitutional if it weren't explicitly in the Constitution < 1340530472 139252 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the supreme court has ruled that the 14th Amendment forbids states and cities from having similar bodies < 1340530521 843187 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also to change the composition of the Senate, you would arguably need *two* constitutional amendments < 1340530560 27906 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :because Article V (the article on amendments) explicitly forbids that change < 1340530589 405745 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :How very nomic. < 1340530627 20243 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :In practice, I suspect they'd somehow figure out a way to get that deemed "interstate commerce" so it could be a regular bill. < 1340530642 376572 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1340530646 563370 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, i don't think that would fly < 1340530704 227647 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But if a butterfly flapping its wings can cause rain in China, then surely the composition of the Senate effects interstate commerce, so therefore they have the power to regulate it. < 1340530734 204363 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :On a more serious note, yeaaah that clause would have to be a *lot* more abused than it is now for something like that to fly. < 1340530752 810025 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, that clause is all about the division of powers between state and federal legislatures < 1340530801 527440 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what also sucks is that the Senate's rules of procedure have nearly as much influence on how law is made as the Constitution < 1340530820 689692 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps more. < 1340530843 812079 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The infamous 'fillibuster' rules have a rather dramatic effect. < 1340530858 947788 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1340530883 981992 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a recent thing too < 1340530892 200275 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean aiui filibuster was used pretty rarely before like 2006 < 1340530898 574705 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :now it is the default and every bill needs 60 votes to pass < 1340531008 200844 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Cloture_Voting,_United_States_Senate,_1947_to_2008.svg < 1340531109 425827 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And that's just the number of times the Senate actually attempted to stop a filibuster. < 1340531198 121626 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net QUIT :Quit: stuff < 1340531279 286125 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, many of them are preemptive < 1340531312 300055 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :actual filibusters are still rare, the threat is just baked into how the body operates < 1340531344 859087 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is part of the problem — people would be less eager if they had to personally go up and talk for 15 hours! < 1340531503 672143 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i would hope that a filibuster would make the filibustering party look like childish obstructionists < 1340531525 789125 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i think a lot of the blame for problems in Washington gets accounted in a nonpartisan way < 1340531532 372962 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Congress's approval ratings are far lower than either party < 1340531764 902733 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rather amazingly so. < 1340531801 747677 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What was it, like 8% approval? < 1340531883 311211 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :something like that < 1340532089 169501 :derdon!~derdon@217.225.199.206 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1340532116 69898 :derdon!~derdon@pD9E1C7CE.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1340532400 46712 :derdon!~derdon@pD9E1C7CE.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1340532421 392248 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340533018 975744 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, is /r/conspiracy championing the cause of *Syria*? < 1340533061 946730 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what they want you to think < 1340533077 516480 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :/r/conspiracy is actually a KGB conspiracy. < 1340533083 44749 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So... /r/conspiracy is in fact run by the conspiracy? < 1340533084 501296 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. < 1340533100 724000 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me guess, the US and Israel dislike Syria, therefore Syria must be good < 1340533102 199306 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You must admit it's an appropriate name. < 1340533107 268725 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(this mirrors well-documented KGB conspiracies surrounding the JFK shooting) < 1340533123 551319 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(... the KGB spread conspiracy theories about it. I shit you not.) < 1340533129 707657 :Patashu!Patashu@c27-253-127-153.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :" let me guess, the US and Israel dislike Syria, therefore Syria must be good" sounds like solid logic to me < 1340533131 155401 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Makes sense. < 1340533144 142199 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc, looks like it. < 1340533160 279567 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Liveleak is a propaganda hub." < 1340533194 340541 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :goatse is a propaganda hub < 1340533201 655388 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Precisely the reason I dont believe anything. Ever. There may not even be a syria for all I know < 1340533201 853582 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :" < 1340533299 260251 :Patashu!Patashu@c27-253-127-153.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1340533322 222177 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :um < 1340533322 794094 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1340533326 359582 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in another thread < 1340533333 483877 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone has just said they wouldn't eat mule meat < 1340533340 75290 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's genetically modified < 1340533366 632940 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :mule meat contains chemicals! < 1340533424 581373 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"If the alternative media on the Internet continues to grow and expose the secret working of the grand deceivers, i.e. the Wizard of Oz behind the curtain, the masses will find out the King is actually naked and the kings new clothes shtick was all a big con." < 1340533443 365211 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :If we hit that conspiracy bullseye, the rest of the dominoes will fall like a house of cards. Checkmate. < 1340533445 718862 :Patashu!Patashu@c27-253-127-153.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that a quote < 1340533453 608701 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zardoz speaks to you, his chosen ones < 1340533456 509467 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: Ew, chemicals. < 1340533477 680579 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE GUN IS GOOD < 1340533478 570766 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :When I disposed of my television years ago, the last of my chemicals had to go with it. < 1340533483 453016 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE PENIS IS EVIL < 1340533484 653370 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu, the quoted bit is. < 1340533493 869997 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/vimgh/if_the_alternative_media_on_the_internet/ < 1340533512 411476 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION now leads a 100% natural, chemical-free life. < 1340533522 297000 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"New World Order Blueprint Leaked" < 1340533540 868168 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So what, is this part of a conspiracy to give away NWO trade secrets? < 1340533601 595625 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm afraid this is going to devolve into trolling by proxy < 1340533621 327894 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/vhzj0/a_friend_is_going_to_let_me_look_through_his/ < 1340533622 655253 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh my god < 1340533653 583046 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: My friend said trolling by proxy is good because it can inject outside opinions into echo chambers which don't usually get such opinions. < 1340533663 910649 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really agree with him, but do you have any counterarguments to that? < 1340533674 888818 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :-_- < 1340533690 435437 :Patashu!Patashu@c27-253-127-153.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is 'trolling by proxy' < 1340534040 861687 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"hi, my friend says Haskell gives you herpes and aids, i think this is wrong but pls provide a detailed rebuttal" < 1340534063 500535 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :produces similar results to someone coming in and saying haskell gives you herpaids < 1340534077 150339 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :worse, in that you can't make it go away by kickbanning someone < 1340534085 18534 :Patashu!Patashu@c27-253-127-153.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I see < 1340534088 168757 :Patashu!Patashu@c27-253-127-153.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :very clever < 1340534105 901115 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :even when nobody in the channel intends to troll, the result is the same as trolling < 1340534108 474220 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: It's far from the state of the art in trolling techniques. < 1340534111 348798 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ingenius in its subtlety. < 1340534114 68830 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :happens a lot when you're discussing Other People who are Wrong On The Internet < 1340534116 181328 :Patashu!Patashu@c27-253-127-153.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I am not very good at trolling < 1340534117 577471 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: what's the state of the art? < 1340534118 346791 :Patashu!Patashu@c27-253-127-153.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I'm easily impressed < 1340534127 847371 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: I don't think that's public information. < 1340534140 691351 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it u < 1340534145 382527 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. :-( < 1340534148 296852 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: But in this case there's still responsibility: The "friend" said something inflammatory. < 1340534152 988883 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :poorchaf < 1340534165 966851 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The ultimate trolling probably arises on its own, like a sort of meme. < 1340534167 918010 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: well, in less hyperbolic cases, the friend is perhaps just ignorant < 1340534169 467177 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc, but in this case I'm not quoting them as things I want treated seriously and debunked, I'm quoting them because I and presumably everyone else finds them risible. < 1340534177 110226 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Things like "0.999... = 1?!", maybe. < 1340534189 786571 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just think of the discussions that generates, even when everyone means well. < 1340534209 348890 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it's not exactly a "technique". < 1340534224 413562 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So basically politics and religion are the ultimate trolling technique? < 1340534254 379610 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: There are a lot of trolls in politics and religion. < 1340534261 770060 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But some topics, yes. < 1340534296 7570 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: did u accuse me of being cheater :'( < 1340534316 358114 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is cheater the state of the art in trolling < 1340534327 241554 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think so. < 1340534329 45585 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Decidedly not. < 1340534331 525608 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well in that he can troll elliott and Phantom_Hoover without saying anything at all < 1340534332 321858 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :He got banned from multiple channels. < 1340534345 627911 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and cause them to abuse third parties < 1340534369 769618 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still bitter about that? < 1340534384 345123 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, which "that" is that? < 1340534385 669978 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :not bitter, just amused and confused < 1340534406 87480 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Take it up with ais if you think the ban was unjustified. < 1340534412 505579 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not saying he shouldn't be bant < 1340534417 752807 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did he get banned in here? < 1340534421 508390 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1340534424 921331 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just think it's insane how much abuse I got for daring to say "hi" to him < 1340534433 173331 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the sort of thing you see in extremely brainwashed religious societies < 1340534441 149071 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the unclean one must be shunned < 1340534446 142574 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater: hi < 1340534457 345439 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc, I do believe you're trying to troll me. < 1340534474 347831 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, i can understand that he doesn't get along with this channel, but apparently the fact that I can get along with him in any context at all makes me a horrible human being < 1340534490 573958 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yeah < 1340534496 46493 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think anyone who can produce that kind of response < 1340534499 155427 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is a pretty advanced troll < 1340534548 411093 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc gets along with everyone* < 1340534562 714525 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zero or more copies of everyone < 1340534737 580272 :Patashu!Patashu@c27-253-127-153.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :who is cheater < 1340534740 188734 :Patashu!Patashu@c27-253-127-153.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel I am missing out on something < 1340534748 725599 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :join #codez < 1340534766 358407 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the channel he set up to talk to the people from #esoteric, #haskell-blah, and ##electronics who will still put up with him < 1340534784 864059 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Founder: cheater < 1340534804 976111 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Longrunning troll who survived largely because for most of his time on the channel there were 3 ops none of whom actually used their powers. < 1340534958 981395 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I'm in #codez but I still have cheater on /ignore < 1340534996 672965 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what that'll do. < 1340535000 283953 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe he'll ban me. < 1340535295 46820 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't believe in /ignore < 1340535363 219904 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't either, but then he decided to take a particular dislike to me for some reason. < 1340535378 762591 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, odd < 1340535405 248309 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :There were other conversations in the channel so I decided it would be reasonable. < 1340535588 80608 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the other day someone joined and asked about the most pythonic way to solve some problem < 1340535592 870242 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(cause that's a thing that happens apparently) < 1340535605 607754 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and cheater gave just about the most convoluted, un-pythonic solution you could reasonably pass off as serious code < 1340535742 346243 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know if he was trolling, or just felt obliged to give some answer (even a bad one) immediately < 1340535935 282343 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i still don't get what the cheater fuss was all about < 1340535950 646427 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm way more annoying < 1340536144 108878 :MDream!~fyrc@67.232.231.162 NICK :MDude < 1340536147 358125 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're annoying in an amusing way. < 1340536172 251551 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1340536179 46389 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT I TRY SO HARD < 1340536204 709742 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :so this #codez, is it like esoteric but without all that annoying programming stuff < 1340536352 737095 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1340536924 847610 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340538303 157317 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340538403 58001 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT : < 1340538549 841054 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1340538565 423465 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 NICK :itidus21 < 1340540485 976960 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: is that a no < 1340540572 378415 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually it seems to be like esoteric but without all that annoying anything. < 1340545834 22589 :nooga!~nooga@ip-46-250-173-30.ip.maverick.com.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1340546948 161596 :nooga!~nooga@ip-46-250-173-30.ip.maverick.com.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1340546976 96541 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1340546977 375190 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello < 1340547560 115973 :Lumpio-!~matti@62-113-182-248.bb.dnainternet.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1340547561 442927 :Lumpio-!~matti@62-113-182-248.bb.dnainternet.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :huzzah! < 1340547577 738352 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yo. < 1340548837 240646 :Patashu!Patashu@c27-253-127-153.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au NICK :Patashu[Zzz] < 1340551255 864843 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@ping < 1340551256 63575 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :pong < 1340551422 790326 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@iuher < 1340551423 301964 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unknown command, try @list < 1340551429 297533 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@irti < 1340551429 890828 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unknown command, try @list < 1340551433 53162 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@ahuis < 1340551433 486226 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unknown command, try @list < 1340551449 364968 :pikhq!~pikhq@70-56-227-27.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1340551483 162579 :pikhq_!~pikhq@168-103-250-216.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1340551574 715192 :calamari!~calamari@ip72-211-147-156.tc.ph.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1340551683 915071 :Eli_!6da08903@gateway/web/freenode/ip.109.160.137.3 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340551788 610313 :Eli_!6da08903@gateway/web/freenode/ip.109.160.137.3 QUIT :Client Quit < 1340552035 299381 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :possible candidate for worst wikipedia page ever: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bound_property < 1340552066 804939 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1340552142 691165 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :an object lesson in how not to do a wikipedia article < 1340552269 3279 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it's just me.. blood sugar could be low etc. < 1340552469 678188 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: bad, but not bad enough < 1340552493 342526 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :not even interestingly bad, I think < 1340552973 656219 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i found it via the talk page < 1340553887 65549 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1340553903 92627 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello < 1340554507 525059 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1340556622 18758 :nooga!~nooga@ip-46-250-173-30.ip.maverick.com.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1340556780 874359 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1340556813 996711 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay the housemates just moved out < 1340556827 889009 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is hoping for at least some weeks of peace and quiet < 1340558668 600356 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1340558951 377563 :Frooxius|TabletP!~chatzilla@cust-101.ktknet.cz JOIN :#esoteric < 1340559233 614522 :john_metcalf!~digital_w@87.115.178.251 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340559631 718094 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, followed by the person who comes to collect rent < 1340559729 249787 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, that's transferred automatically < 1340559906 156035 :Lumpio-!~matti@62-113-182-248.bb.dnainternet.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf is the example on that wikipedia page about < 1340559925 864605 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which wikipedia page? < 1340559976 375491 :Lumpio-!~matti@62-113-182-248.bb.dnainternet.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bound_property < 1340560315 75943 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1340561060 678917 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :View to a Kill - Zorin's computer http://youtu.be/043WEs_6TAo < 1340561160 715173 :nooga!~nooga@ip-46-250-173-30.ip.maverick.com.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1340561186 334886 :Frooxius|TabletP!~chatzilla@cust-101.ktknet.cz QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1340561285 968911 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1340561373 421456 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340562292 433137 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340562301 407058 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 QUIT :Max SendQ exceeded < 1340562514 486594 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340563503 44225 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340564987 705048 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What things need to be done to make a option of ITMCK to make the output be more compatible with certain players? < 1340566113 477630 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1340566127 283174 :derdon!~derdon@pD9E1C7CE.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1340566315 424188 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340566431 248698 :Frooxius|TabletP!~chatzilla@cust-101.ktknet.cz JOIN :#esoteric < 1340566454 991958 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-87-25.as13285.net QUIT :Quit: GOODNIGHT < 1340566479 977366 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340567178 601088 :Frooxius|TabletP!~chatzilla@cust-101.ktknet.cz QUIT :Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88-rdmsoft [XULRunner 1.9.0.17/2009122204] < 1340567193 452029 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-46-58.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1340567193 773044 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-46-58.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Changing host < 1340567193 971944 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1340567377 482845 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1340567379 989497 :augur_!~augur@208.58.5.87 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1340567983 680873 :nortti!~nortti@www.nowhere-else.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1340568093 803733 :nortti!~nortti@www.nowhere-else.org QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1340568500 31766 :asiekierka!~asiekierk@178235038077.elblag.vectranet.pl QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1340570126 473004 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1340570548 588918 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Goof night < 1340570652 437616 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-46-58.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1340570652 939662 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-46-58.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Changing host < 1340570653 138447 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1340570860 441515 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1340571509 6086 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1340571551 492214 :pikhq!~pikhq@70-56-227-27.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1340573114 439191 :calamari!~calamari@ip72-211-147-156.tc.ph.cox.net PART #esoteric :"Leaving" < 1340573705 668067 :Frooxius|TabletP!~chatzilla@cust-101.ktknet.cz JOIN :#esoteric < 1340574394 963390 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://machinegestalt.posterous.com/if-programming-languages-were-cars < 1340574520 334200 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :then all new languages would suck? < 1340574536 920692 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if programming languages were cars then even more people would be killed by them < 1340574656 697193 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :all new cars suck? < 1340574672 695098 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :cars suck < 1340574679 11378 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't even get me started < 1340574689 301735 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :cars ruined this country basically < 1340574728 591953 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i agree, those things are scary. < 1340574746 939417 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't get how people are afraid of parachute jumping but they routinely drive a car in fucking traffic < 1340574753 203302 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Car companies buying and destroying all public transit way back when, y'mean? < 1340574774 388073 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :but stating that new cars suck seems weird, at least new cars are way less ugly < 1340574818 213062 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, jeeze, turn of the century almost all cities ran on gigantic streetcar systems. < 1340574864 475334 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's one of the many ways cars ruined the country < 1340574895 662358 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"C: Still the best systems programming language 40 years later." < 1340574902 511770 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1340574907 500168 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh systems < 1340574908 344937 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1340574937 773283 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's only "the best" because it's barely good enough and so all attempts to replace it with something better have failed < 1340574954 163983 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yes, but imagine my horror when i didn't notice the word "systems". < 1340574970 501065 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, see, if it weren't for that cars would not be anywhere *near* as relevant. Before the streetcar systems were destroyed, cars were seen as luxuries... < 1340574981 172735 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think you have causality backwards there < 1340574992 575166 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was a conspiracy by car-related industries to destroy streetcars < 1340574993 141750 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Бойня кошек на Лестнице http://youtu.be/8FRBQOrvURA < 1340574996 867177 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it was only accelerating an existing trend < 1340574997 963038 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. Bastards. < 1340575015 940915 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :with or without that, cars became much more affordable and people could have them < 1340575024 299751 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :If bad programming languages killed more people perhaps programming languages wouldn’t suck as much. < 1340575026 679892 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyways. Yes, I agree, cars are a *real friggin' problem*. < 1340575029 532157 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Yes @all new cars suck. < 1340575033 836438 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :which led to the building of massive road infrastructure coupled with the decline of rail infrastructure < 1340575034 864006 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :They look like shit, literally. < 1340575043 362777 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :which produced these horrid, unsustainable modes of living < 1340575062 768506 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :new cars look modern and nice, old cars look ugly and boring. < 1340575065 161468 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.nfscars.net/forum/picture.php?albumid=201&pictureid=4092 <- that is a car. < 1340575080 40726 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :that looks like a banana mated with a robot < 1340575083 543348 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.quaiswaseeq.com/top-5-muscle-cars-of-all-times/muscle_cars/1969-chevrolet-camaro-ss.jpg <- that is a car < 1340575084 807153 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :where you live in a McMansion in suburbia and the closest you have to a "town center" is a malignant tumor of big box stores, strip malls, and office parks < 1340575105 30570 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/73/Overhaulin_442.jpg <- that is a car < 1340575129 217770 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric : new cars look modern and nice, old cars look ugly and boring. < 1340575131 992283 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which kind of new car < 1340575136 408405 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean < 1340575138 503267 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fairly new < 1340575140 773889 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or new new < 1340575154 870149 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because there was that whole thing where angles came into fashion < 1340575165 465614 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.wallpapers-football.net/Other-wallpapers/car/car8.jpg <- looks stupid < 1340575170 502540 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: in all seriousness, yeah those look okay. not as nice as new ones, but okay. < 1340575185 751104 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: Little boxes of ticky-tacky, little boxes all the same... < 1340575187 80495 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pics.ricardostatic.ch/ImgUsers/EuroTax/p0502828.jpg <- looks like crap < 1340575188 453133 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :the last one is obviously the prettiest < 1340575212 677571 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :the last last one looks so sexy i would totally mate with it < 1340575219 767792 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric : http://www.auto-bilder.org/autobilder/volvo-c30-3729.jpg <- ugly < 1340575221 644382 :Frooxius|TabletP!~chatzilla@cust-101.ktknet.cz QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1340575226 803763 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok kmc, pikhq_, cut the circlejerk < 1340575228 142726 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :tbh streetcars aren't that great < 1340575234 838694 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1340575241 375498 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :they have some advantages over buses but it's not a huge difference imo < 1340575241 574326 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay the last last last one is the super bestest. < 1340575244 620757 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc is ok because he tends to have a fairly balanced perspective < 1340575252 678332 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, ew no, not enough angles < 1340575254 212122 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like old cars :) < 1340575260 972244 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not < 1340575263 857657 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :enough < 1340575266 96767 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :angles < 1340575269 520473 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: The advantage is they could've been built into a more robust transit system. If developed instead of destroyed. < 1340575274 702167 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1340575278 164530 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :a subset of old cars :) < 1340575282 845976 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: in all real seriousness, i don't give a shit, i wouldn't buy any of those < 1340575283 601202 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the subset < 1340575285 486294 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :with angles < 1340575287 786411 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1340575295 101188 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever < 1340575300 640173 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: by building new tunnels, you mean? < 1340575302 43122 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1340575307 642129 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :the subset with edges and angles. < 1340575322 751989 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also tbh aesthetics comes a long way after, for instance, crumple zones < 1340575332 30400 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FRBQOrvURA&feature=youtu.be this one i would buy < 1340575336 970925 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :streetcar tunnels are kinda nice but I think proper grade-separated heavy rail rapid transit is much much better < 1340575349 322680 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc, what do you think, of trams < 1340575351 162548 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're going to the expense of new tunnels, maybe you should just build a new rapid transit system < 1340575358 219027 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: There's reason to *move* that way when not everyone has cars. < 1340575369 914276 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, no that's a cat < 1340575374 763811 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there have been a fair number of those constructed in post-WWII america < 1340575381 152772 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know you finns have problems with r/t < 1340575381 537202 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :not as many as there should be, but still < 1340575385 597762 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than new streetcar systems < 1340575395 328187 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc, trams! i need to know < 1340575398 236319 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: sorry i have visual dyslexia and thought that was a video of a car. < 1340575408 52413 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: trams and streetcars are the same thing < 1340575412 819976 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :en_US vs en_UK or something < 1340575417 172435 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that like where you confuse things based on whether theyre spelt similarly < 1340575423 505504 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1340575432 53906 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i need to see a description in writing < 1340575435 963377 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc, oh right, for some reason i was thinking cable car (??) < 1340575444 684627 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1340575447 283106 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :to notice subtle differences in spelling < 1340575448 65392 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Streetcars in modern use have little to no reason to be built further, yes. The *point* is that it's mass transit, and when everyone uses mass transit you have reason to do more mass transit. < 1340575456 627764 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the reason i ask is because we have an infamously terrible tram system in edinburgh < 1340575459 364898 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1340575461 848542 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*will* have < 1340575471 411773 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's following the duke nukem school of development < 1340575481 752579 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's also the "aerial tram" which is kind of like an enclosed ski lift car < 1340575485 779995 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hangs from a cable in the air < 1340575487 589396 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rather than, y'know. "Yeah, we put in a single line cause that's 'green', but really everyone has a car so who cares." < 1340575493 77943 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's one of these in NYC actually < 1340575504 604743 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc, they have those in detroit in DX:HR!!! < 1340575521 12606 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fun fact, detroit in HR does not resemble real detroit in any meaningful way < 1340575533 967525 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :from tv shows, i've learned that americans only ride the bus if they are really poor < 1340575540 814911 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1340575555 879575 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :this never ceases to amaze me. < 1340575559 16716 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :except in new york city, maybe < 1340575566 407811 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :even there, you take the subway if at all possible < 1340575574 517600 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Yes. It's *severely* difficult to use the buses in most cities, and so it is extremely beneficial to get a car if at all possible. < 1340575581 744208 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway this is why there is no political support for public transit < 1340575601 90593 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah, that's the other reason the trams here are awful, we have a perfectly good bus system < 1340575615 135638 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's also part of the calculus on, should you build new transit systems in places with none, or should you improve transit in places with high transit ridership already < 1340575617 537506 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: We're talking "add on an extra hour to your transit, at least". < 1340575645 405916 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_, do the buses, like, drive 5 miles backwards? < 1340575669 163332 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And only then start going where they're meant to? < 1340575681 908483 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or is that just because American cities are ridiculously sprawling. < 1340575688 509448 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't really imagine an enjoyable life where i frequently have to travel distances i can't easily walk. < 1340575696 925605 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :buses are infrequent and they don't go to exactly where you want to go < 1340575703 874006 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you might have to transfer, and wait for the next bus which is also late < 1340575710 82296 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Combination of American cities being ridiculously sprawling and buses being very infrequent and bus routes being sparse. < 1340575723 723776 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :buses are much more usable if you have a smartphone, because many cities have realtime online tracking of buses now < 1340575731 752804 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc, there's a road near my house which I swear has a bus stop every 50 metres. < 1340575732 415977 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :o_O < 1340575762 963586 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :@smartphone tracking < 1340575763 380937 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unknown command, try @list < 1340575763 680100 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's annoying if you're on the bus because you're constantly stopping because one person is at each stop. < 1340575784 697784 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway it's obvious that buses can never be faster than driving < 1340575789 945730 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :We have roughly every km a bus stop. < 1340575800 256879 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is how it should be :) < 1340575804 991828 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why you need proper dedicated right-of-way rapid transit < 1340575838 405918 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :one of the dumb things in America is local zoning laws which prohibit dense development, mandate a certain amount of parking for businesses, etc < 1340575869 896084 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Buses are faster than driving here during rush hour, since the major roads have bus lanes. (Granted, that's not very often.) < 1340575870 490970 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the south San Francisco Bay Area, you have lots of wealth, and lots of people who would love to live in a real, dense city, but it's just illegal for them to make one < 1340575902 884005 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess they're not if you drive in the bus lanes too, but that's illeggul. < 1340575913 86804 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some cities get it stupider still... For instance, the city I'm in (Colorado Springs) has height limits on buildings. < 1340575946 49547 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: do they keep some parts completely undeveloped and foresty, or just empty? < 1340575952 873866 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC, you can't go above 8 stories, period. < 1340575967 538256 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the one reason i love about finland is that there are trees. < 1340575983 187714 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :the rest of europe is just horrible < 1340575988 237381 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric : one of the dumb things in America is local zoning laws which prohibit dense development, mandate a certain amount of parking for businesses, etc < 1340575989 632066 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you what < 1340575999 325538 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Colorado Springs is thus even more sprawly than usual. < 1340576004 79061 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well sweden is just a better finland ofc but i mean the southern countries) < 1340576009 682975 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and people do complain on pretty much all "tall building" projects here, on the grounds that it ruins the (pretty much flat) skyline. < 1340576019 27226 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, um sorry sweden is the: worst < 1340576076 52900 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: there are many undeveloped forest or desert parts of the USA < 1340576076 251406 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That tallest building in Edinburgh is 19th-century. < 1340576081 972952 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yeah, that's pretty typical... < 1340576082 172908 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*the < 1340576095 877090 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i pretty much prefer all countries in the scandinavia family over the rest of europe < 1340576136 424684 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The highest off the ground is IIRC also the oldest building in the city.) < 1340576138 86056 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: US zoning laws typically mandate low-density development. < 1340576144 497187 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_, ...why? < 1340576162 777627 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you built high density housing, dangerous minorities would move in < 1340576184 51276 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :forest parts sound nice, you should keep it that way. < 1340576185 527263 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :rich white people left the cities in the 60's due to high crime < 1340576188 142036 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And if you built shops without giant parking lots, then you couldn't get your land yacht there. < 1340576190 519626 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :please tell my opinion to all americans < 1340576212 13562 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then they passed laws to prevent their new suburban areas from becoming like those cities, without regard to which properties of cities are good or bad < 1340576217 664158 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: It would be very, very hard for us to *not* keep forests. < 1340576223 482829 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, I'm not even sure how many surviving forests there are in the UK... < 1340576241 974210 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Boston in particular has a lot of nice parks within or just outside the city < 1340576267 129900 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pretty sure we have multiple forests larger than the UK. < 1340576268 464531 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think there are bits of the Highlands which have gone mostly untouched, but south of that almost everywhere's cultivated to some extent. < 1340576272 778309 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are more than a dozen large, substantial parks i can bike to easily from my home < 1340576278 980145 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: i saw some in scotland, but only on some sort of island. then again i guess forests are not scotland's thing. < 1340576296 153878 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wolfram|Alpha is unable to tell me how many trees there are in Finland. < 1340576300 806466 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :NYC has a lot of parks too < 1340576331 70375 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: sounds nice < 1340576345 918883 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: are they full of murderers? < 1340576346 117813 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :some (like Central Park) are obsessively designed and sculpted, so they aren't really "nature", but still very very nice < 1340576351 438995 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, well on the couple of trips I've had to the Highlands I've definitely visited forests. < 1340576360 509796 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but even in Manhattan, there's Inwood Hill Park, which feels like being lost in the woods < 1340576382 781631 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've only been to uk once and we didn't exactly try to seek forests < 1340576386 412923 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT : < 1340576397 860823 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :so really i don't have any idea < 1340576406 115052 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PART #esoteric :"Leaving" < 1340576411 26209 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1340576417 246100 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :goddamn window focus < 1340576421 1891 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :but let me tell you about this one time i went to paris and decided i'll just sleep in the forest. < 1340576421 743134 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it's a property of the old cities in the east of the USA in general < 1340576429 258435 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that they have lots of parks < 1340576436 51839 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't sleep in the forest. there are none. < 1340576448 864802 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_woodland < 1340576486 253668 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :in retrospect i was pretty retarded < 1340576511 601533 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :people told me there are no forests but i was like hey i don't mind walking a few kilometers. < 1340576564 574120 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was also fun trying to get to the eiffel tower with a backpack, turns out they won't let you leave it anywhere. not even in the finnish embassy :( < 1340576578 145923 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i left it in a park i found about 4 km from the tower < 1340576618 112534 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the world come to when embassies won't even give their citizens backpack storage. < 1340576624 769024 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah :/ < 1340576630 773199 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was the only place that really considered it < 1340576656 903191 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :they all spoke finnish so they took my plight pretty seriously < 1340576674 793849 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :they even called somewhere to check that there's no way < 1340576677 644283 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there was no way < 1340576684 424790 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-46-58.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1340576684 890176 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-46-58.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Changing host < 1340576685 89355 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1340576694 753162 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are Finns compelled to take anything said in Finnish seriously. < 1340576733 703289 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :you wouldn't understand, your language is a minority. < 1340576753 484869 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"your money.. it has all been lost" said in finnish :D < 1340576753 706353 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1340576755 783632 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :*isn't < 1340576761 169798 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :I for one won't take anything said in Finnish seriously < 1340576774 651764 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :^Finnish < 1340576807 863027 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: go easy on finland i just praised yours :( < 1340576825 679465 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's end the hate < 1340576840 461305 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :what, end it? but hate is so fun! < 1340576845 442198 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1340576846 541829 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed it is < 1340576852 879758 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: Oh, come now, surely you can hate some other group. < 1340576860 286440 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like the poor sods in France! < 1340576864 154523 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck you olsner, if i ever meet you, i will chop off your head and feed it to a rabbit < 1340576864 352970 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, see now you have learnt life's most valuable lesson:] < 1340576870 295283 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :never be nice to sweden < 1340576875 130242 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's the spirit!! < 1340576895 137220 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ive never been outside australia < 1340576901 816480 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1340576907 396094 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've never been outside the complement of australia < 1340576919 728620 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Likewise. < 1340576941 432554 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe this means me and itidus21 are part of the proof that the earth is hausdorff with the country topology < 1340576947 850422 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if one considers the earth as a big rock with water on it.. then this all sounds liess exciting < 1340576960 936605 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :^less < 1340576968 788702 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-34-147-4.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most rocks don't have magma centers. < 1340576985 986444 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :even big ones? < 1340576995 882407 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, wouldn't iti have to have never been outside the interior of Australia for that to work. < 1340577006 543775 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i should probably know whether they do) < 1340577015 579082 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Depends on how big they are. < 1340577035 332827 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_4C_tSMqS810/Swyal4RdGAI/AAAAAAAAE_Y/Ev07Fu2dueo/s1600/simpsons,+vishnu,+hindu,+atheism,+cosmology.jpg < 1340577085 596232 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: sorry for speaking evils about Finland, please don't kill me if we meet < 1340577093 771549 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, don't listen to him < 1340577098 731032 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's manipulating you < 1340577101 768432 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: i'm a very gentle killer < 1340577113 699182 :Lumpio-!~matti@62-113-182-248.bb.dnainternet.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1340577133 460394 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: alternatively we can have a beer and be best buds. < 1340577145 198722 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have been to 2 australian states and 1 australian territory < 1340577190 761066 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and 32 super mario bros. levels < 1340577209 680822 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok maybe not all 32 < 1340577215 223738 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should write a blog about your travels, i'd totally give it a read < 1340577218 993623 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: "gently" chopping someone's head off sounds difficult, you must be skilled < 1340577245 353272 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: well in a single trip we travelled through all 3 < 1340577258 83934 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :when my dad did some work in canberra for a week or 2 < 1340577258 787233 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: this is irc, you can't blog here < 1340577264 56513 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :but okay do tell < 1340577265 806545 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1340577269 473112 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well thats it < 1340577273 111480 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1340577280 54774 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :short and sweet < 1340577291 619217 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: have you visited any of the cantons in austria as well? < 1340577302 376910 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1340577308 37377 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :like an asian strawberry prostitute < 1340577330 115060 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have visited 5 cantons in austria < 1340577348 679419 :Lumpio-!~matti@62-113-182-248.bb.dnainternet.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1340577444 736594 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :sudden craving of strawberries < 1340577493 447616 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm ambivalent about them < 1340577501 485872 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is that < 1340577522 829746 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not enough good strawberries < 1340577536 169321 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are a rare breed < 1340577539 723828 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i appreciate that the poor plants go through hell over it though < 1340577552 945906 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :no strawberries in austria? < 1340577566 631156 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :and very few of them will actually let you have sex with them. < 1340577575 740916 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, "here.. i consumed most of my lifes energy making these, go ahead, take them.... what do i care' < 1340577587 907484 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :although i did mean a craving for eating them < 1340577589 820360 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're only my children < 1340577608 49264 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1340577610 381827 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think most berries are made to be eaten < 1340577615 971671 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i will never eat strawberries again < 1340577619 64641 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahahaha < 1340577623 795193 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's how the plants distribute their seeds, given that they don't walk < 1340577626 556068 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner is right < 1340577631 969227 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :he is? < 1340577637 187928 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course I am! < 1340577637 598372 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :berries are unhappy if they are not eaten < 1340577646 270302 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, just like cows < 1340577649 28100 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :so can i eat them without being evil? < 1340577652 982444 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they will just fall to the ground and rot < 1340577659 353509 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like my quamquots do at times < 1340577662 734424 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :just like cows < 1340577715 570753 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :... infact i think strawberries want to make use of your shit as fertilizer or something < 1340577722 332384 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just a guess < 1340577723 811458 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh kinky < 1340577761 48312 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and < 1340577764 232524 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :with this in mind < 1340577771 36982 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh it's there alright < 1340577781 590894 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :one can see perhaps why animals are so picky about where they do their doodoo < 1340577803 604527 :derdon!~derdon@pD9E1C7CE.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1340577811 478517 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :because they want to fertilize only the sexiest strawberries? < 1340577825 954573 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it's a great responsibility < 1340577830 125760 :derdon!~derdon@pD9E1C7CE.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1340577831 998367 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1340577840 771000 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't just eat seeds and deposit them at random < 1340577878 878115 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think animals get picky if they have somewhat fixed nesting places where they benefit from not rolling in shit, but otherwise aren't picky at all, in general < 1340577888 557557 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah there's child support and shit to think about < 1340577895 290727 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :interdependance is weird < 1340577911 779387 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :strawberries don't ask for child support < 1340577918 515306 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think we haven't told them they can, or something < 1340577930 49143 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :somewhat unfair, but economical < 1340577931 44656 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they don't seem to care < 1340577937 143455 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that's slavery < 1340577954 46089 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm sure they'd have a use for money < 1340577955 926690 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :well paper money < 1340577956 847048 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :would they care if they knew? I think they ought to know, so they can decide whether to care < 1340577963 421824 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :plants are used to being slaves < 1340577977 630316 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok maybe not < 1340577977 828887 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :so were black people and women < 1340577985 754209 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :back then < 1340578002 98420 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb... toast time! < 1340578027 16952 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if plants can deal with it so can black people < 1340578036 433836 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: with dismembered and squashed strawberries on top? < 1340578051 293748 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, dismembered and squashed black people < 1340578052 71851 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :drawn and quartered < 1340578082 158391 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"petermolydeux ‏@PeterMolydeux < 1340578082 357229 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why do keys remain in your inventory until you use them? What if you could actually misplace them? or you unknowingly dropped one?" < 1340578092 279792 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO THAT IS NOT SOMETHING YOU SHOULD BRING UP EVEN AS A JOKE < 1340578093 659393 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :TOO FAR < 1340578108 306706 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is that too far? sounds neatly realistic < 1340578114 49167 :derdon!~derdon@pD9E1C7CE.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1340578118 760108 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god < 1340578128 346579 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :there can be actual holes in pants, for example < 1340578135 117320 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1340578137 18332 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't < 1340578138 544538 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :understand < 1340578143 310156 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :even joking about it < 1340578147 883282 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :make it more likely to come true < 1340578156 234597 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's just what i always wanted, a losing-your-keys simulator < 1340578178 50832 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"How about an escort mission where YOU play as the escort for a horrible agent. Give them a mental breakdown by repeatably getting in the way" < 1340578178 252778 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i love losing my keys, it's these little things that make days magical. < 1340578180 879313 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I assume that you are talking about some game you play and therefore care about not being able to lose your keys in? < 1340578182 793461 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :unfortunately i never do :( < 1340578184 535739 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would play the shit out of that game < 1340578198 756913 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :but luckily i fuck up every other thing < 1340578200 609616 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, yes by which i mean literally any game with keys < 1340578234 439796 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, one of the halo games worked well as a "lost in empty space station" simulator < 1340578258 999277 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's like system shock? < 1340578276 306114 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :"oh, did you think this was a running-around-and-shooting game? nope, it's just a maze!" < 1340578285 197749 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :with no exit < 1340578299 393779 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :haven't played system shock, so I wouldn't know < 1340578309 408335 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, oh man you clearly never played the second-last level of Halo 3 < 1340578333 375702 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have only played one of them and it was 10 years ago < 1340578333 705944 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :is halo an fps? < 1340578360 692185 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"OK so you run around and shoot people, except none of them have ammo, the environment is a bunch of boring meat corridors and once you think you've reached the end you have to turn back around and do it all over again, backwards!" < 1340578425 936589 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, yes. < 1340578432 427023 :augur!~augur@c-69-250-16-8.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1340578464 141192 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :none of them have ammo? oh god you don't have to shoot civilians do you? how twisted, i'm sure most gamers would stop in horror. < 1340578482 616542 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, civilians would at least not put up a fight. < 1340578487 948069 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :system shock 2 is a great game < 1340578557 219662 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc, I haven't played it, I just know there's a space station (OK spaceship, same difference) involved. < 1340578580 57150 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :a few spaceships actually < 1340578583 960162 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :and every time you shoot a civilian, you are shown a clip of their family crying < 1340578591 357533 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :kind of like in that austin powers movie or what was it < 1340578598 125497 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, are you the one behind peter molydeux < 1340578621 554871 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, but i almost took part in it < 1340578632 251384 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was invited < 1340578633 286368 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorta < 1340578681 755889 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Peter Molydeux, the man, the mystery, the inspiration for the recent MolyJam game jam that attracted more than 1,000 people to more than 30 locations worldwide." < 1340578690 194760 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So that's like 30 people per location? < 1340578717 992003 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it would seem < 1340578760 226115 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think there was a location at our university. or something. < 1340578769 367842 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It could so easily have been 31 < 1340578770 718987 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1340578776 578300 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some people say the 7xxx version numbering scheme for .IT files is bad idea http://wiki.openmpt.org/Talk:Development:_Formats/IT < 1340578776 777594 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :30 + 1/30 < 1340578790 18807 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i presume oko would split himself evenly across all venues < 1340578796 709246 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :naturally < 1340578805 377836 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise it would be just unfair. < 1340578845 995139 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :would you doing it according to continuous chess principles < 1340578866 339866 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would totally being do it that ways. < 1340578885 209799 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1340578895 842116 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you say doing because it's the continuous form < 1340578966 683067 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :naturally < 1340578969 106907 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :from now on i shall call you the high priest of continuous chessism. < 1340579007 392632 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :Given a solid oklo in 3‑dimensional space, there exists a decomposition of the oklo into a finite number of non-overlapping pieces (i.e. subsets), which can then be put back together in a different way to yield two identical copies of the original oklo. < 1340579012 715592 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh fuck it's 2 am < 1340579030 873360 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the afterlife you need to divide yourself between heaven and hell such that your centre of mass lies in limbo < 1340579034 672894 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus solving the molydeux unfairness problem < 1340579063 318201 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was to olsner, although probably being in limbo solves all problems < 1340579087 138852 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it creates all problems, but if you reverse time that's probably equivalent < 1340579151 229283 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hear the universe is reversible. < 1340579211 385137 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :unfortunately, reversible 3d CA do not have a computable upperbound for the radius of the inverse CA :( < 1340579229 636454 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why time travel is hard < 1340579242 666503 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :that has to be it < 1340579270 22143 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-194-156.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :that and the lack of working time machines < 1340579297 19681 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm that's why there's a lack < 1340579342 230797 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would like to see a game which implemented that tarski banach thing < 1340579381 874204 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you elaborate on implement < 1340579399 208449 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yup, one moment < 1340579451 584049 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :iti went to write a constructive proof. < 1340579462 853766 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it was nice knowing you. < 1340579615 856911 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok what i had in mind is that it is a game where you can somehow cut objects up, and reconstruct them, where the game simulates nonmeasurable sets somehow < 1340579635 549850 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-49-17.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does afterlife have a center of mass? < 1340579636 339106 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever these nonmeasurable sets are < 1340579701 971467 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :so like you have 5 question marks that you can move around < 1340579776 894695 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it really surprises me that it only works in 3d < 1340579784 799054 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :3d and up < 1340579812 803865 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can do things that are "against geometric intuition" in any dimension though. < 1340579844 794627 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :just not that particular thing i guess < 1340579939 619026 :augur!~augur@c-69-250-16-8.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1340579942 268493 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21, the gist of it is that it's because if you do two rotations in succession in 2D they'll be the same as if they were in the opposite order, but the same is not true in 3D. < 1340579967 974981 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahh < 1340579973 740131 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh ooh free group free group NONAMENABLE GROUP OF ROTATIONS < 1340579983 453675 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :...or so i hear < 1340580013 311073 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes oko the reason i was avoiding mentioning those words is because iti is now going to look them up and confuse himself horribly < 1340580014 862136 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well done < 1340580024 983732 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry :( < 1340580041 449682 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :so are you in a math university yet < 1340580046 778449 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so 2d rotations are .. c-something < 1340580049 926016 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1340580063 629189 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :commutative < 1340580076 159703 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now i'm waiting to see if i messed up the "you want to do maths with us hahaha fuck off" test i had to sit < 1340580077 527628 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not, you already know all the right words :/ < 1340580098 836840 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :dammit why didn't i think of that < 1340580111 550287 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd probably have gained like 10 marks for 'amenable' < 1340580115 590952 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was actually just proctoring that sorta thing < 1340580126 70346 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :and laughing at people's answers < 1340580150 328208 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :iti, yes, commutative means ab = ba < 1340580185 376978 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am getting better at this stuff.. but when? well thats more complicated < 1340580188 482117 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :and 2d rotations form a commutative group with respect to their natural composition, which is "first rotate like this, then rotate like this" < 1340580233 186646 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :certain things get in the way of learning < 1340580239 686918 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :identity being "don't rotate at all" and inversion being, bare with me this gets complicated, "rotate in the other direction". < 1340580245 812671 :Patashu[Zzz]!Patashu@c27-253-127-153.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au NICK :Patashu < 1340580246 583155 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :for some reason or other < 1340580249 902362 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"...by the same amount" < 1340580256 489151 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and when those things go away, learning can proceed < 1340580306 561401 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also there's associativity but it's trivially obvious when you explain it like that < 1340580319 885316 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah because a < 1340580321 471653 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1340580350 12682 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :well let's just leave it like that < 1340580351 170019 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like it < 1340580374 473024 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if you rotated 5 degrees then -2 degrees.. for a total rotation of 3 degrees.. would the inverse be -3 degrees? < 1340580383 783729 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1340580403 901018 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :humm.. < 1340580436 318803 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah so basically 2d rotations are just numbers modulo 2pi, or 360 if you prefer < 1340580470 631956 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meanwhile, in 3D, if you rotate an object 90 degrees around the x axis then 90 degrees around the y axis you get a different overall transformation to rotating by the y axis and then x. < 1340580474 317198 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yup.. 1 circle mapped onto some unit < 1340580475 271877 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :which makes it even more obvious that they are commutative < 1340580479 999849 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :and associative < 1340580516 762425 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: sooo you start next fall? < 1340580528 544757 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but suppose you had a unit which was 1 = 720 degrees. i suppose nothing exciting would come of it < 1340580531 151460 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming you aren't way stupider than you look < 1340580556 771477 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should be safe, I look pretty stupid. < 1340580562 195438 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :good. < 1340580656 537256 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: i'm not touching that one due to having a hunch you could connect it to some of the pictures in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riemann_surface < 1340580657 373433 :Patashu!Patashu@c27-253-127-153.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :has anyone ever actually plaed continuous chess? < 1340580662 974558 :Patashu!Patashu@c27-253-127-153.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :it looks like a buff to bishops and a nerf to knights < 1340580672 672961 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: i think i let ph win me in it once < 1340580698 386790 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, no, I let you amend the rules so you captured the closure of your piece. < 1340580737 420887 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, but we then played again < 1340580749 927217 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was more of a joke < 1340580756 330220 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu, hmm, I thought knights would be overpowered due to them being able to move through other piece. < 1340580780 686617 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :log z looks like a water slide < 1340580786 649342 :Patashu!Patashu@c27-253-127-153.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am a continuous chess armchair theorist < 1340580802 203229 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you can basically bump a fairly small amount of knight into the enemy's queen on the first move, making the queen totally useless for capturing. < 1340580864 577555 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :how sad < 1340580874 348568 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay i have to go, i have important work to do tomorrow < 1340580876 887809 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, not totally, but unable to checkmate of her own accord. < 1340580893 952456 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :see uu < 1340580903 645188 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although considering that determining checkmate is everything-hard that's not a massive disadvantage. < 1340580906 307448 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :humm < 1340580938 428700 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't want to keep oko about, but the rest of you can hear this < 1340580942 286633 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw your last statement reminded me of http://arxiv.org/abs/1201.5597 < 1340580960 392302 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: what you have a problem with me???? < 1340580972 886381 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no you need to go for important work < 1340580984 607046 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right, it is indeed important < 1340580986 554377 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :so important. < 1340581007 382418 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha. < 1340581026 6793 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i have always (not always) thought of chess as a CA < 1340581034 592719 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i guess part of it didn't make sense < 1340581037 138970 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :...a CA you say? < 1340581039 925028 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh bye. < 1340581067 44571 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I’m impressed by how easy it was to create a new LXC container. apt-get install lxc && lxc-create -t ubuntu -n foo && lxc-start -n foo, done. < 1340581073 306856 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but just now it occurs to me that what a board game does different than a typical CA is it makes exactly 1 change per iteration < 1340581092 930529 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And is nondeterministic. < 1340581110 706832 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And has unbounded neighbourhoods. < 1340581128 802378 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And has a handful of instances of hidden state. < 1340581133 864939 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you could make it deterministic, like a "film" < 1340581154 802585 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you could make the neighbourhood the entire board < 1340581175 308579 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nondeterministic CAs are perfectly cromulent, they just aren't used as much. < 1340581214 114374 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a decent amount of research on those < 1340581220 867595 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh < 1340581231 688819 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :vs. what exists for deterministic CAs? < 1340581233 503250 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :^i don't want to keep oko about, but the rest of you can hear this < 1340581234 163800 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you seriously discussing CA just when i'm trying to leave < 1340581242 945916 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: well i suppose not. < 1340581247 606556 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did a half arsed disclaimer < 1340581251 642067 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :the most famous big CA theorem is for nondeterministic CA < 1340581258 702612 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was well aware of this problem oklopol < 1340581265 180131 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the thought would be lost < 1340581267 842603 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise < 1340581286 49634 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well we would not want such a thought lost to the world < 1340581351 411004 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://arxiv.org/pdf/math/0003117v1.pdf this little thing < 1340581368 459239 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway you hinted that tomorrow isn't important < 1340581376 843635 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just another day < 1340581399 852299 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, my colleagues are back from uk so i can tell my coauthor about my results from this week. < 1340581408 166811 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm.. the thing about man discovering fire is that he already knew what fire was < 1340581428 111514 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :although i will prolly publish them myself since i basically finished the article already < 1340581429 142899 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it was like.. hmm my whole life i have seen fires.. how do i make one? < 1340581458 2734 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but for us modern humans.. we are not readily exposed to things we can't reproduce < 1340581462 29422 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :buy a lighter and improve on it < 1340581477 957771 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :we aren't| < 1340581479 435298 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1340581496 506628 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :let my just quickly reproduce this computer of mine. < 1340581503 91224 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :just gimme a shovel < 1340581531 140107 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it must have been awe inspiring to not know any means to create fire < 1340581574 610939 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah kind of like last week it was inspiring that no one basically had any idea what kind of subshifts can be the sets of surjective sequences of nonuniform bounded radius CA < 1340581587 238065 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then some genius proved that at least every SFT is < 1340581595 340813 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly < 1340581621 196608 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wish i could shake his right hand with my right hand, but that'll never happen :( < 1340581626 197924 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1340581633 865821 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh it could happen! < 1340581658 841269 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1340581659 377415 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :how < 1340581662 255000 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as far as what "could" happen... you may end up even as neighbours one day < 1340581669 306350 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it cant < 1340581674 755683 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :well we kind of are neighbors < 1340581680 712121 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :for one thing, it was proven by a woman < 1340581682 172961 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :for another < 1340581685 806784 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :she doesn't have a right hand < 1340581694 243785 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :humm < 1340581716 49774 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :those are non-trivial obstacles < 1340581737 826622 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : so it was like.. hmm my whole life i have seen fires.. how do i make one? <-- uh? How old were you then? < 1340581744 682348 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: are you trying to make me be even less subtle and say "no it was me who proved it"? < 1340581754 953263 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait misread < 1340581757 992921 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1340581758 182837 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :because that'll never happen. < 1340581763 69992 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's called modesty. < 1340581780 551860 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wiki calls it "almost certainly won't happen" < 1340581787 628080 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it might < 1340581803 939070 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, why would I make you say that? < 1340581816 831776 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems strange to try to make someone say something that's not true. < 1340581835 386929 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1340581836 630187 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm < 1340581839 276218 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1340581856 180650 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahh < 1340581867 281664 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :most amusing < 1340581899 159804 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just need to use another form of the verb shake! < 1340581924 108186 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :humm no same verb < 1340581925 225813 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1340581931 305719 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :could you show me this woman, my girlfriend is a lowly statistician :( < 1340581940 408045 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :transitive verb vs intransitive verb < 1340581975 843057 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i can do the standard english construction < 1340581982 681725 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it gets kind of crazy < 1340581990 501848 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"shake" < 1340582006 518988 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, well I mean if you'd go out with a statistician I'm not sure you'd be attracted to a woman who can do real maths. < 1340582008 496054 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the context suggested a transitive verb < 1340582022 5658 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if you meant an intransitive verb then you could shake his right hand < 1340582025 413597 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: err why? < 1340582046 303767 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops what the hell do i mean < 1340582055 513883 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no i give up < 1340582058 545439 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have never dated a mathematician, have always wanted to try but they are hard to find. < 1340582066 293979 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.148.51.163 PRIVMSG #esoteric :im going to nap < 1340582070 237813 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1340582074 65877 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well yeah, but then why a statistician? < 1340582080 903199 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're, like, the opposite of mathematicians. < 1340582109 821661 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i only learn about her condition after we'd signed the going out agreement. < 1340582116 127509 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :*learned < 1340582236 67441 :Phantom_Hoover!~Phantom@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :See that's why you have to be open about that kind of thing. < 1340582246 696558 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :when i told her about CA and gave a specific one, she ran a few iterations of it on paper. god that was sexy. < 1340582364 305377 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay silence, my cue to leave < 1340582372 357171 :oklopol!~nnscript@dyn58-51.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(seriously)