00:16:01 <kmc> http://i.imgur.com/ZTcgzOq.jpg
00:16:03 <kmc> canada.jpg
00:21:10 <HackEgo> danddreclist 44: shachaf nooodl boily \ http://zzo38computer.org/dnd/recording/level20.tex
00:26:37 <shachaf> zzo38: You should add a PDF file so I can view it from my browser.
00:27:13 <zzo38> shachaf: No, if you want a PDF you do it yourself.
00:27:30 <zzo38> (I don't have the program to print it to PDF)
00:27:33 <shachaf> zzo38: I think you want "starts laughing", not "stars laughing".
00:28:07 <zzo38> Thank you for noticing that mistake; I fixed it now.
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00:30:05 <zzo38> And now I found out that I need to fix dungeonsrecording.tex to support more than five levels of spells; the current implementation will try to put them all in one row, which doesn't fit on the page very well.
00:30:24 <Taneb> zzo38, help I'm starting to play D&D
00:30:55 <zzo38> Taneb: I cannot help you with too general requests like that.
00:31:17 <Taneb> I think I've made one of the hardest characters for a beginner
00:31:30 <Taneb> A freakin' pacifist
00:31:59 <shachaf> https://www.fanfiction.net/s/6466824/1/The-Pacifist
00:32:01 <zzo38> Well, make whatever character you want; that is OK. You can make a character which is difficult for you if that is what you prefer.
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00:59:03 <zzo38> I have been trying to find graphing software with language bindings for SQL, and cannot find some.
01:22:07 <zzo38> Why are there none?
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01:42:15 <zzo38> I could try to write one for PLplot
01:51:56 <quintopia> zzo38: matlab can talk to mysql servers
01:53:03 <zzo38> quintopia: Well I mean calling graphing software from SQL programs, in SQLite
01:53:15 <zzo38> I don't mean accessing SQL servers from other programs
01:54:36 <zzo38> It seems the most sensible way to me
01:56:00 <zzo38> That way you don't need to access it from other programming languages, if you have SQL data you can plot it by writing SQL queries, having aggregate functions that will plot the data they receive, and so on
01:58:32 <quintopia> an rdbms client is not and was never intended to be visualization software
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02:02:32 <ski> shachaf : nope
02:03:04 <zzo38> But SQL can import foreign functions too, like other programming languages can.
02:08:19 <zzo38> I want to be able to plot data that has been filtered and manipulated and stuff too, and grouped, and various other things that are done in an SQL query.
02:19:57 <zzo38> What I want actually is a SQLite extension library which provides aggregate functions to plot graphs of the data they receive.
02:27:09 <ski> <shachaf> ski: did you see the longversation about chu spaces in here yesterday
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03:03:36 <zzo38> O, I thought you don't want to die of chanting.
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04:45:14 <zzo38> How common is it for programs to use true to mean failure and false to mean success? In the Z-machine, the PRINTR instruction prints a string, followed by a line break, and then returns true. Due to this, the program I am writing uses true to indicate failure.
04:49:41 <copumpkin> 0 is a "nothing failed" return value for most processes
04:49:48 <copumpkin> which would also be considered false in most languages
04:49:57 <kmc> but not in shell script :)
04:50:27 <kmc> this is based on the notion that there's one way to succeed but many ways to fail
04:52:26 <Sgeo> I keep forgetting to post to SO
04:52:48 <Sgeo> Incidentally, if commercial support gives you a solution to something, is that supposed to be ... proprietary?
04:52:54 <Sgeo> Especially if others have similar questions?
04:53:30 <zzo38> Well, in the Z-machine, zero is still considered false and one is considered true
04:57:24 <kmc> doesthiswork: yes
04:57:57 <kmc> in Rust you used to be able to create a bool which is neither false nor true
04:58:00 <kmc> that... got fixed
04:58:21 <zzo38> (Although I suppose this isn't much more than a convention, since any actual instructions that test less/greater/equal/flags/etc just branch instead)
04:58:54 <doesthiswork> they refuse to be limited by your 1-dimensional thinking
04:59:13 <zzo38> (Also, routine 0 always returns 0, and the SAVE/RESTORE opcodes return 0 or -1 on failure, and other numbers on success.)
04:59:37 <kmc> doesthiswork: no
05:00:32 <kmc> zzo38: mmap(2) returns -1 rather than 0 for errors, because one could map a page at 0 but one couldn't map a page at -1 unless the page size is 1
05:00:53 <kmc> does POSIX allow a page size of 1? that would make so many things so much nicer
05:00:55 <doesthiswork> (this is the place to drop a "laws of form" reference)
05:01:27 <zzo38> kmc: Ah, OK, but I mean a function that returns a boolean
05:02:09 <zzo38> kmc: I suppose if it would be allowed, then it should be prohibited for the page to start at -1 in order for that to continue to work.
05:02:10 <kmc> also I was wondering the other day if there are programs which map the same pages 2 or 4 or 8 times so that tag bits in pointers can be used without needing to mask them out
05:06:18 <kmc> why wouldn't it?
05:06:54 <zzo38> I don't know how the page mapping works, so I wouldn't know much about it
05:07:11 <Bike> i don't think i understand this mechanism, explain?
05:07:15 <kmc> well, you would still have to mask when taking offsets or comparing pointers for object identity
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05:09:20 <kmc> Bike: you would map the same physical page at (e.g.) 0x10000 and 0x11000 so that a pointer into either region works the same, and then you can use that bit 0x1000 to store some associated information that can be accessed without dereferencing the pointer
05:10:15 <kmc> pointer tagging tricks are common but generally you have only a single mapping and so you need to mask off the tag bits first before dereferencing
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05:10:57 <zzo38> They don't seem to work necessarily so well on all computers necessarily, since they might operate differently.
05:11:08 <Bike> i've heard of having different regions for different types to avoid tagging but not that.
05:11:14 <zzo38> I do not expect to guaranteed to work it correctly.
05:11:29 <kmc> fun fact: 16 of the virtual address bits in a current AMD64 CPU are ignored and could be used for such tags without masking, except that the architecture explicitly forbids it
05:11:38 <kmc> for forwards compatibility reasons
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05:12:53 <kmc> questionable decision imo
05:13:49 <zzo38> Allocating different regions ahead of time and checking if the pointer is in range would seem to work more consistently, although then you need to fix the amount of available memory when the program is starting. (But I don't know if this would work on the "Future Systems" 128-bit processor and other really strange things)
05:14:06 <kmc> how hard would it be to have a "I don't intend to use more than 256 TB of address space" control flag
05:14:46 <kmc> there are a lot of people who need speeeeeeeeed and don't mind writing unportable code or using a nonstandard ABI
05:15:28 <kmc> another fun fact: ARM uses the low bit of the program counter basically as a tag to say whether it's in ARM or Thumb mode
05:15:49 <kmc> (instructions on ARM are at least 2-byte aligned)
05:15:55 <kmc> this is nice because function calls automatically save/restore that mode too
05:16:44 <zzo38> If you want to write non-portable codes, you could at least partially write them in assembly language, and/or use C preprocessor macros to detect what computer it is running on
05:17:28 <kmc> that is typically done
05:18:06 <zzo38> But if I am writing a program in C, I rarely want unportable codes anyways
05:20:21 <zzo38> Protected mode adds too many complications anyways, I think. Some of these things could still be done in simpler ways, and other things
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05:26:09 <shachaf> what's with people who have a television on at night making noise
05:26:22 <kmc> it's snowin
05:26:39 <shachaf> can there just not be such people in the world anymore
05:27:22 <shachaf> kmc: Yes, I've heard of such behavior.
05:27:53 <shachaf> I think maybe the Xbox did something like that?
05:28:10 <kmc> okay before it was snowing but now it's snowing like a motherfucker
05:30:06 <shachaf> i was just trying to sleep and now i hate all people within a 5km radius
05:30:55 <kmc> what did the xbox use it for
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05:33:45 <shachaf> Hmm, maybe I'm thinking of something else.
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05:41:20 <shachaf> kmc: Ah. The Xbox 360 has 64-bit addresses but only 512MB of RAM, so the upper 32 bits are used as flags by the L2 cache.
05:41:36 <shachaf> E.g. whether memory is encrypted.
05:41:43 <kmc> that's physical address bits right?
05:42:07 <kmc> i recall that was used for some hax
05:42:30 <shachaf> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uxjpmc8ZIxM was a nice talk about it.
05:44:13 <kmc> off to japan, ttyl
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05:49:51 <shachaf> kmc: i like how the bug was in the syscall handling code
05:53:38 <quintopia> anyone here feel like translating TAPASM to syntactically correct english?
06:04:18 <ion> A hospital room is the perfect place for the data center. http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=196098420
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07:15:22 <shachaf> ski: Do you know lots of things about Chu spaces?
07:17:11 <ski> ran into them when looking at linear logic papers
07:17:44 <shachaf> Related to de Paiva's thing?
07:18:42 <shachaf> Do you know how I can relate them to (a) topological systems and/or (b) adjunctions?
07:20:11 <shachaf> Also, do you know anything about the category whose objects are categories and whose arrows are adjunctions?
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07:23:36 <ski> (Valéria de Paiva,Peter Wojtáš, whence "PV")
07:23:56 <ski> sorry, no details :/
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08:19:07 <mroman_> Bike: Execute In Register with an Execute in Register Instruction in the Register would be an endless loop
08:20:40 <oerjan> you mean never halt hth
08:21:28 <oerjan> <fizzie> (Now everyone knows your Steam Name.) <-- well all the 3 who visited the page.
08:22:13 <olsner> iirc, on s/390 the execute in register instruction doesn't accept another execute-in-register instruction
08:23:01 <oerjan> olsner: how non-orthogonal
08:23:28 <oerjan> (all instructions should be orthogonal to themselves, obviously!)
08:26:22 <olsner> there should be an ISA where instructions have 90 degree angles to each other... maybe call it a vector processor
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08:28:48 <oerjan> @tell Taneb <Taneb> I DON'T HAVE ANY MILK <- ME NEITHER
08:29:08 <myname> wasn't there a language with stuff like "turn right"?
08:29:19 <oerjan> olsner: lambdabot has been kidnapped!
08:29:39 <oerjan> myname: Logo, also karel the robot
08:29:47 <fizzie> Many (most?) 2D languages have "turn right" too.
08:29:59 <myname> that's not what i meant
08:30:13 <myname> literally "turn right" as a command
08:30:15 <oerjan> fizzie: technically don't they have "turn in this direction i'm pointing"
08:30:32 <oerjan> myname: i _think_ karel the robot may have had that.
08:30:37 <myname> and if your instruction pointer is moving from top to bottom, you have to write one letter at a column
08:30:41 <fizzie> oerjan: A number also do it relatively. Like the Funge-98 ].
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08:31:25 <fizzie> (And I suppose you could argue that ">" is still "turn right" even though it's absolute, it's all about the definition of "right".)
08:31:27 <oerjan> myname: wat "one letter at a column"
08:32:17 <oerjan> hm actually it had turnleft and turnright is the first example procedure in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karel_(programming_language)
08:33:47 <mroman_> http://codepad.org/m5LlaE5D
08:34:00 <mroman_> ^- as of now. all 128 instruction are taken :)
08:34:05 <myname> http://esolangs.org/wiki/Alight
08:36:04 <mroman_> although I could make shl,shr use Reg[src] for how many shifts to be performed
08:36:32 <oerjan> myname: itym "per line"
08:38:32 <mroman_> better replace them with a generic bit manipulation instruction where the src register encodes what's to be done :)
08:41:48 <oerjan> <ion> http://heh.fi/tmp/mpiling_data.jpeg <-- my new laptop is seriously sucky on dark pictures :(
08:42:28 <ion> The relevant part isn’t darkened.
08:43:10 <oerjan> putting full brightness on isn't enough, at the same time i need to put brightness on 50% not to hurt my eyes on ordinary black on white text...
08:43:35 <ion> Try adjusting the gamma.
08:44:17 <oerjan> i have no idea how. and all i could find about constract was claims about "laptops don't usually have it".
08:44:58 <ion> Try xgamma -gamma 1.2
08:45:40 * ion swats oerjan with a fish
08:46:32 <ion> @google windows adjust gamma
08:47:16 <mroman_> olsner: There really is a CPU that can decode an instruction in a register and execute it?
08:47:57 <ion> Perhaps Hitler requested that.
08:51:06 <mroman_> I thought one should only pull the Hitler card in a vigorous discussion one is about to loose because running out of useful arguments
08:51:21 <mroman_> and to possibly troll the opponent discusser.
08:52:31 <ion> That was a completely reasonable guess given that IBM did business with him.
08:54:21 <mroman_> Isn't that uhm... treason?
08:54:36 <mroman_> Seeing as IBM is probably an american or ukanian company
08:55:30 <oerjan> ion: thanks gamma helped
08:55:44 * oerjan tries with 1.5 for now.
08:57:15 <ion> oerjan: http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/gamma_calibration.php
08:58:08 <oerjan> oh 2.2 is the standard?
08:58:35 <ion> Don’t set the value to 2.2, set the value to whatever makes the bars say 2.2
09:00:23 <oerjan> mroman_: they _may_ have stopped in 1942 or so?
09:01:06 <mroman_> Yeah. But the war started 1939?
09:07:23 <elliott> mroman_: "ukanian" is somewhat liable to misreadsings
09:12:03 <mroman_> I can't get that theme out of my head :)
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09:51:33 <mroman_> ah well. I just reserve one instruction as a marker for a secondary instruction set
09:51:42 <mroman_> that'll give me another 128 instructions once I need them
10:01:03 <oerjan> <shachaf> what's with people who have a television on at night making noise <-- devil worshipers hth
10:03:10 <oerjan> elliott: plz take back lambdabot this new guy is obviously not up to the responsibility thx
10:08:12 <oerjan> shachaf: the same goes for people with barking dogs
10:08:41 <oerjan> see: my neighbor in some not entirely determined direction
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10:39:06 <mroman_> I let streams run in background while working
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10:58:41 <fizzie> "IEEE's core purpose is to foster technological innovation and excellence for the benefit of humanity."
10:58:47 <fizzie> Oh, I thought they were in it to make money.
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11:03:53 <HackEgo> darklust: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: <http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page>. (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on irc.dal.net.)
11:05:11 <darklust> I'm here for brainfuck and brainfuck accessories
11:05:36 <oerjan> your nick made me suspicious :P
11:07:46 <int-e> poor, abused little thing.
11:07:56 <lambdabot> http://hackage.haskell.org/trac/ghc/newticket?type=bug
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12:05:45 <Bike> mroman_: so's jump rel 0
12:07:26 <int-e> fizzie: But who's looking at money when humanity is at stake?!
12:09:30 <int-e> Hmm, this quote that I read yesterday seems related somehow: "It is not heartless to say that if every human life is actually priceless, then it follows that there will never be enough money."
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12:40:22 <mroman_> Bike: Yeah. But that's a different loop :)
12:41:01 <mroman_> execute in register would produce a loop inside the execution circuitry
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12:43:50 <mroman_> depends on the implementation of course
12:49:22 <fizzie> I remember there being some debate on the corner cases of the semantics of Funge-98's "k" instruction, which repeats the next instruction N times.
12:53:54 <Deewiant> "some debate" is an understatement
12:57:51 <int-e> ooh! I guess I can ask a similar question for x86: what happens if a rep stosb modifies the rep or stosb opcodes?
13:01:34 <Deewiant> According to http://www.woodmann.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-12442.html "when an interrupt is generated, CPU stops executing overwritten REP STOS/MOVS"
13:05:00 <int-e> Deewiant: nice. can you parse this? "meanwhile, some CPU have a bug. they executes CLD commands _before_ overwritten REP STOS/MOVS will be stopped or finishes. as result, REP STOS/MOVS changes the direction and hits the memory not supposed to be written."
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13:06:28 <Deewiant> int-e: Seems mostly clear except that I don't know where the CLD is coming frmo
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13:09:09 <int-e> ok, I guess it's just too weird to really believe :)
13:11:22 <boily> good unbelievable morning!
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16:47:15 <Slereah> What the hell is the .stack header supposed to be in 8086?
16:47:52 <Slereah> I can't seem to find a tutorial that actually says what it does
16:47:53 <int-e> define the stack size?
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17:28:46 <ruddy> THAT'S WHAT IT SAID ON THE COW
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17:44:35 <ruddy> your IP is showing
17:44:53 <shachaf> who's ruddy and why is it quoting me
17:44:54 <ruddy> day is in his late 20s
17:45:08 <Slereah> If register access is faster than memory access, why are there so few of them?
17:45:25 <Koen_> I thought register were memory
17:45:26 <Slereah> Is it a problem of price, complexity?
17:45:33 <Slereah> The fear that they would go unused?
17:45:45 <Slereah> They are, but not RAM memory or disk memory
17:47:13 <Koen_> @tell boily I moved to paris but there was not much to do there until tuesday 19th, november, so I kept moving back and forth between paris and the suburbs and most of the time I left the computer at the other place
17:47:41 <lambdabot> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memory_hierarchy
17:47:41 <lambdabot> Title: Memory hierarchy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
17:47:50 <fizzie> ruddy: Your computer may be broadcasting an IP address!
17:48:21 <shachaf> fizzie: THAT'S WHAT IT SAID ON THE COW
17:48:36 <Slereah> Is "expensive" in price or in electricity?
17:48:56 <shachaf> fizzie: http://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/13786158/portraits/shachaf.png
17:49:24 <fizzie> shachaf: Those pictures are the best.
17:49:55 <Koen_> Slereah: tell me more
17:50:14 <Slereah> I wonder what's the highest number of registers on a processor
17:50:14 <Koen_> about you being in Paris!
17:50:38 <Slereah> To do some computer school thang
17:50:46 <shachaf> Slereah: http://people.freebsd.org/~lstewart/articles/cpumemory.pdf probably has good answers to your questions.
17:50:56 <Koen_> what's the name of the school?
17:51:11 <shachaf> It's more than just an issue of expensive.
17:51:15 <Koen_> I've got a friend there
17:51:19 <Slereah> LET'S MAKE A GIGABYTE OF REGISTERS
17:56:48 <boily> back from lunch, and I haven't moved to Paris.
17:59:51 <boily> I went to Paris once, ten years ago. can't say I remember much of it.
18:01:03 <metasepia> CYUL 181700Z 22028G38KT 30SM BKN055 10/02 A2941 RMK SC7 SLP959
18:02:27 <Koen_> when foreigner friends come to paris they all tell me it's a beautiful city and I'm lucky to live there... all I see here are the unfriendly people, the cigarettes and other trash scattering the floor, and angry drivers
18:03:50 <mrhmouse> Koen_: I think that's the same for many (if not all) major cities
18:04:20 <Koen_> well, i went to Koln and Bonn in germany during the summer and it was sooooo clean
18:04:43 <Koen_> and London is much much cleaner than Paris
18:04:58 <Koen_> and people there don't drive with their right hand stuck to the horn
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18:13:17 <fizzie> I remember being envious of the river, in Paris.
18:13:26 <fizzie> But that extends to any city with a river, which is quite many of them.
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18:13:59 <Koen_> yeah hmmmmmm I wonder why people keep building cities next to rivers
18:14:12 <Koen_> like they want the water or something
18:14:22 <boily> better than next to a river, on an island in the river!
18:14:23 <fizzie> It's just that we don't have one here, and for some reason it feels lacking.
18:14:42 <fizzie> At least anything you'd count as a proper river. I mean, there's some water.
18:15:18 <Koen_> how about hijacking a neighbouring river?
18:15:26 <fizzie> I'm not sure how we'd carry it.
18:16:11 <fizzie> http://goo.gl/maps/fAFdU like there's that one little thing but it's there on the wrong side of the city and all.
18:16:36 <Koen_> is it me or have you got a whole ocean?
18:17:06 <fizzie> It's not much of an ocean. And anyway, it's clearly not a river.
18:17:33 <fizzie> I'm sure that if I lived in a city with a river, I'd be disappointed with it and want an ocean instead.
18:21:29 <fizzie> Speaking of cities in Europe, Berne (in Switzerland) seemed like a nice place, based on a very short visit. (There's even a river.) Maybe it doesn't quite count as a "major city".
18:22:56 <Koen_> ouh, the movie I wanna see is ten minutes away, both timely and spacely gotta go bye
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18:25:15 <oklopol> fizzie: you're envious of turku?
18:25:39 <shachaf> fizzie: can you cross the same river twice
18:25:51 <boily> fizzie: according to wikipédia's “List of Primate Cities”, Bern counts as a major city in Switzerland.
18:26:27 <fizzie> oklopol: Kinda-sorta. Vaguely. Not because of much else than the river, though.
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18:41:38 <FreeFull> It's large enough to be known by name by random europeans who have never been to Switzerland
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18:49:22 <Taneb> York has like two rivers
18:51:02 <Taneb> fizzie, move to York imo
18:52:01 <Taneb> Phantom_Hoover, York has twice as many rivers as Hexham!
18:52:10 <boily> fizzie: Montréal is better. we have the same river, but twice!
18:52:12 <Taneb> Also I'm just being silly at fizzie
18:52:29 <Taneb> Phantom_Hoover, York even has a wall!
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18:53:19 <Taneb> Except I live on the outside of the wall :(
18:54:32 <boily> we have walls. sort of. https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Fortifications_Montr%C3%A9al_2009.JPG
18:55:17 <Phantom_Hoover> we don't have walls in edinburgh because *rolls dice* walls are for puny englishmen
18:55:46 <Taneb> Phantom_Hoover, does Coventry have walls
19:02:05 <quintopia> Taneb: plot and graph (not in the node-vertex sense but the other one) appear to be interchangeable both as nouns and verbs
19:02:21 <quintopia> Taneb: plotting a graph and graphing a plot are about the same thing
19:04:05 <Taneb> quintopia, but both have different meanings
19:05:13 <quintopia> Taneb: yes i know you were looking for words which have the same meanings and ONLY the same meanings, but words which interchangeable for one of their definitions is useful enough to a learner of english
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19:05:47 <Taneb> quintopia, now you're moving the goalposts :P
19:06:14 <quintopia> Taneb: i already hit a home run. i can do what i want.
19:06:25 <quintopia> boily: does ursula martinez live in montreal
19:06:54 <boily> quintopia: probably. lots of people live in montréal. who is she?
19:07:50 <boily> (wikipédia says that she lives in London.)
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19:09:37 <quintopia> they call her a "cult cabaret diva"
19:10:23 <quintopia> i have a video of an amazing performance of hers in montreal. so i had to ask.
19:11:10 <quintopia> it's the second youtube link on google...but i think the full version is longer than 4:47?
19:11:37 <boily> once again according to the wiki, youtube videos butcher her performance.
19:12:02 <boily> (why do we have so many naked people in montréal? don't they know that it gets fungottely cold in the winter?)
19:12:02 <fungot> boily: i could never put a cat in the barrel because they believed in the dark or otherwise confused.
19:12:02 <mrhmouse> quintopia: possibly because not all of her performance is "acceptable" for YouTube?
19:12:22 <mrhmouse> fungot: please don't barrel any cats
19:12:22 <fungot> mrhmouse: you just enter a number to someone whom sarahbot thinks that your nick resembles. then t has a uniquely determined extension to a bounded linear transformation s from the closure to see the enhancements. i
19:12:27 <quintopia> mrhmouse: you mean youtube can't show full frontal nudity? NONSENSE
19:12:59 <boily> fungot: you do texture mapping with other bots? fascinating.
19:13:07 <boily> fungot: beuh. I am disappoint.
19:13:07 <fungot> boily: remove ( unit foo) ( define b ( begin ( define ( push el list))) shoudl tell you.
19:13:19 <boily> fungot: oh, a secret coded message!
19:13:19 <fungot> boily: very simple to implement, i juts mean a set with a fluid environment, as well as math functions ( the ones from queue) but they use perl because it's what i'm currently using that via ssh rather than my perl programs
19:13:46 <boily> fungot: I'll have the decoder implemented right away. by the way, did you know that R7RS is out?
19:13:46 <fungot> boily: gorgeous soaking cold! var temp)... in essense you're constructing an if/ else that does either one or the other
19:14:06 <shachaf> fungot: you're confusing everyone
19:14:07 <fungot> shachaf: " amis" is finnish for finland finnish :p)
19:14:22 <mrhmouse> today I learned finnish. thanks, fungot.
19:14:22 <fungot> mrhmouse: mmmdonuts: so you didn't write asiebot to another channel sometime and i'll tell you that continuations are an integral part of the article.
19:14:25 <shachaf> fizzie: can you confirm or deny (probably deny)
19:14:28 <boily> s/is finnish/is french/
19:15:05 <shachaf> fungot: do you even know finnish?
19:15:05 <fungot> shachaf: i agree, i still don't get why they think schemers are arrogant.)
19:15:19 <shachaf> fungot: can you help me make a starcraft clone in scheme
19:15:20 <fungot> shachaf: somehow you're getting into the hair splitting business
19:16:29 <shachaf> fungot: i'd love to get into that business
19:16:29 <fungot> shachaf: yes, and misspelling it purposely. very clever. but alltogether i think cotmta is the best
19:16:41 <shachaf> fungot: no, you're the best ♥
19:16:41 <fungot> shachaf: neilv says: no problem writing ' u' and liberally sprinkling sentences with ' lol'
19:17:31 <shachaf> fungot: i got a problem with that
19:17:58 <fungot> Phantom_Hoover: two stacks for the program :)
19:18:14 <quintopia> shachaf: looks like fungot got tired of you
19:18:14 <fungot> quintopia: ( especially regarding the cons) ( define ( fnord status) " an error is signalled", btw). i thought of that
19:18:26 <fungot> shachaf: then i'll get back to when the state of the art. it's a large industry to be sure
19:18:47 <shachaf> fungot: WHAT'S A LARGE INDUSTRY? complete sentences, please!
19:18:47 <fungot> shachaf: oh wait. that was actually very inviting...
19:18:55 <fungot> shachaf: i want a break from it. so it took a while to adjust to it and crossed my fingers.)
19:19:01 <Phantom_Hoover> thanks fungot, being friends is so much better than when you wanted to kill me
19:19:01 <fungot> Phantom_Hoover: tried to copypaste stuff from this compiling machine to the next logical step is to figure out
19:19:17 <shachaf> fungot wanted to kill Phantom_Hoover?
19:19:17 <fungot> shachaf: notice that its name already ended in -y.
19:19:59 <mrhmouse> fungot is teaching ruddy to spout nonsense
19:20:00 <fungot> mrhmouse: it has two defective pixels, no matter who listens to trance :)
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19:24:18 <quintopia> JesseH blanked the Derplang page. Yes, it's JesseH's lang, but... NO TAKEBACKSIES ON PUBLIC DOMAIN DEDICATION. can i get a ROLLBACK??
19:24:58 <fizzie> shachaf: "amis" is colloquial (arguably slightly derogatory, depending on use) for "ammattikoulu" ("ammattiopisto", "ammattioppilaitos"), i.e., "vocational school", a place for the sort of career-oriented upper secondary education from which one typically does not go on for a university degree.
19:25:02 <quintopia> Phantom_Hoover: but seriously, why "Phantom Hoover"?
19:26:19 <shachaf> Higgledy-piggledy, / Phantomy_Hoovery / Once thought that fungot would / Want him to die; // How'd he survive that? By, / Uncomplicatedly, / Changing his nickname by / Dropping a -y.
19:26:19 <fungot> shachaf: but it would cause executing unwanted instructions even if you leave it out.
19:27:40 <shachaf> fungot: Is "amis" Finnish for Finland Finnish?
19:27:40 <fungot> shachaf: the ultimate esolang shootout" ( when i'm already familiar with usual til strategies.
19:28:43 <shachaf> Higgledy-piggledy, / Phantomy_Hoovery / Once thought that fungot would / Want him to die; // How'd he survive it? By / Uncomplicatedly / Changing his nickname, and / Dropping a -y.
19:28:44 <fungot> shachaf: i could be wrong. it refers to whether you do it,
19:28:47 <fizzie> shachaf: No. But maybe it's Finland for Finnish Finland, if that means anything.
19:29:24 <shachaf> fizzie: well maybe YOU'RE finland for finnish finland!!
19:29:50 <quintopia> at least fungot has admitted it might be wrong
19:29:51 <fungot> quintopia: because nobody does this mean?
19:30:07 <fungot> quintopia: are you referring to
19:34:49 <oerjan> fungot: are you dropping
19:34:50 <fungot> oerjan: by saying " you hit me, and the
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19:51:41 <HackEgo> Darklust: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: <http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page>. (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on irc.dal.net.)
19:52:07 <boily> oerjan: I think you accidentally.
19:52:19 <fungot> Phantom_Hoover: the music sucks ( war samples like guns and radio communications) and the second one is a editor for midi ( rosegarden, kde based)
19:52:19 <oerjan> boily: he's already had a `relcome
19:52:42 <oerjan> boily: nothing accidentally about it
19:53:32 <quintopia> you haven't been coding in dogescript have you.
19:53:33 <shachaf> Uh oh, we need to undo boily's damage.
19:53:37 <shachaf> Darklust: You are not relcome here.
19:53:39 <boily> oerjan: and there I was naïvely hoping I could `relcome someone...
19:54:06 <Darklust> I'd rather not, it's built ontop of what, javascript?
19:55:49 <Darklust> Why is there no implementation of NABD?
19:55:59 <Darklust> At least, none that I can find
19:56:02 <quintopia> because you haven't written it yet
19:56:46 <boily> shachaf: that diæresis was valid. you can't counter it.
19:57:12 <shachaf> boily: Over here, "naïve" gets rendered with *three* dots above the ı.
19:57:50 <HackEgo> [U+006E LATIN SMALL LETTER N] [U+0061 LATIN SMALL LETTER A] [U+0069 LATIN SMALL LETTER I] [U+0308 COMBINING DIAERESIS] [U+0076 LATIN SMALL LETTER V] [U+0065 LATIN SMALL LETTER E]
19:57:57 <shachaf> Yes, that's a combining diæresis.
19:58:03 <shachaf> naïve gets rendered with two dots.
19:58:10 <shachaf> naive gets rendered with one dot.
19:58:17 <shachaf> naıve gets rendered with no dots.
19:58:40 <Darklust> Are those mapped to your keyboard
19:58:44 <olsner> naïve gets rendered with three dots. three!
19:58:53 <quintopia> Darklust: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Not_a_brainfuck_derivative is this what you're referring to? it definitely doesn't say "Implemented" there at the bottom. also, there's no spec.
19:59:15 <olsner> I think this font is lacking lots of fancy unicode
19:59:22 <Darklust> I got excited and then I wasn't excited
19:59:40 <HackEgo> [U+006E LATIN SMALL LETTER N] [U+0061 LATIN SMALL LETTER A] [U+00EF LATIN SMALL LETTER I WITH DIAERESIS] [U+0076 LATIN SMALL LETTER V] [U+0065 LATIN SMALL LETTER E]
19:59:42 <olsner> I think gtk and xchat aren't much good at it either
19:59:54 <Slereah> How easy is it to write a BF compiler in assembly?
20:00:10 <Slereah> I am wondering if it's a good idea to try out assembly a bit
20:00:33 <Bike> it's pretty easy to write a bf compiler in anything
20:00:34 <quintopia> Slereah: an assembly program to compile BF to machine code?
20:00:51 <quintopia> but what machine would you target? x86?
20:00:52 <fizzie> Well, that's just weird. In PuTTY (I'm doing some Windows-Steaming), "naïve" gets three dots; if I copy-paste it to Chrome's input line, it gets a single dot; but when I paste it in, say, Google's search field, it gets two.
20:00:58 <fizzie> I guess that averages out to correct.
20:01:17 <Slereah> Seems like it might be a neat little project to learn some more assembly
20:01:21 <boily> your setups are wëird.
20:01:35 <fizzie> (Maybe Chrome's input line has some special handling for safety.)
20:01:36 <quintopia> boily: don't worry. it renders just fine with two dots here.
20:01:53 <boily> quintopia: thanks for reassuring me. I was feeling very strange.
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20:03:07 <olsner> does the w in ẅ look normal to you?
20:03:22 <boily> olsner: it switches fonts, but displays properly.
20:03:50 <olsner> I guess the font switch is what makes it look bad here
20:04:50 <Slereah> I guess the hardest part would be figuring out the IO
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20:05:55 <boily> olsner: my IME lets me put diæresises on: äëḧïöẗüẅẍÿ
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20:08:00 <ion> http://www.c-span.org/Live-Video/C-SPAN3/
20:09:29 <quintopia> boily: the htx look a bit strained, but the others get remapped to the appropriate non-combined characters
20:10:12 <olsner> Slereah: not too hard, just depends entirely on what you target with the assembly... doing a system call on e.g. linux is easy
20:11:07 <olsner> there was a " on that h right until I pressed enter
20:12:00 <quintopia> hmm. even the non-combined form looks blurry
20:12:53 <HackEgo> [U+00E4 LATIN SMALL LETTER A WITH DIAERESIS] [U+00EB LATIN SMALL LETTER E WITH DIAERESIS] [U+1E27 LATIN SMALL LETTER H WITH DIAERESIS] [U+00EF LATIN SMALL LETTER I WITH DIAERESIS] [U+00F6 LATIN SMALL LETTER O WITH DIAERESIS] [U+1E97 LATIN SMALL LETTER T WITH DIAERESIS] [U+00FC LATIN SMALL LETTER U WITH DIAERESIS] [U+1E85 LATIN SMALL LETTER W WIT
20:13:14 <HackEgo> [U+1E85 LATIN SMALL LETTER W WITH DIAERESIS] [U+1E8D LATIN SMALL LETTER X WITH DIAERESIS] [U+00FF LATIN SMALL LETTER Y WITH DIAERESIS]
20:13:25 <oerjan> not a combined character in sight
20:14:17 <HackEgo> [U+0068 LATIN SMALL LETTER H] [U+0308 COMBINING DIAERESIS]
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20:40:25 <boily> reachable accented letters on my layout: http://pastebin.ca/2477097
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20:51:47 <HackEgo> bin/unidecode: a python script text executable
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21:00:42 <FreeFull> I wonder if it'd be good to make a variant of befunge that's more suitable for scripting
21:02:03 <FreeFull> Ability to execute programs and pipe/redirect their results, maybe ability to have substacks that can be pushed onto the stack
21:02:46 <fizzie> Funge-98 already has a stack of stacks. Though not quite like that.
21:04:47 <mrhmouse> by "execute programs", do you mean arbitrary system calls or other Befunge programs?
21:05:00 <fizzie> And a kind of an equivalent to C's system(3) even without going into the fingerprints. No redirection of inputs with built-in commands, though.
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21:08:52 <fizzie> Curiously, I'm not sure if there's a fingerprint for doing something like popen. There's FORK, but that's just a FORK. There's no file-descriptor-level IO (though FILE could perhaps open /dev/fd/N) or exec that I can find, which is kind of crazy, because there *is* SysV message queues, semaphores and shared memory.
21:12:40 <olsner> maybe you could open /proc/self/mem and add some code
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22:20:01 <fizzie> @ask oerjan Hey, do you Norweggers have some sort of logical rules when you use "på" and when "i" when you're explaining where someone/something is? (In Finnish the two suffixes -ssa/ssä and -lla/llä seem to be used pretty much randomly, but OTOH all Swedish examples I could think of were pretty logical; mostly "i", and then "på" for things like islands.)
22:26:45 <`^_^v> @ask lambdabot will you go out with me
22:32:05 <shachaf> fizzie: Things like islands?
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22:35:19 <fizzie> shachaf: På Åland, i Helsingfors. På Sveaborg. I Vanda. "På" is like "on", so it makes sense for islands. "I" is like "in", so it makes sense for generic places.
22:35:46 <fizzie> shachaf: (But those four in Finnish would be "Ahvenanmaalla", "Helsingissä", "Suomenlinnassa" and "Vantaalla".)
22:37:59 <fizzie> Right. I'm sure Swedish has some exceptions that don't really make sense too, but I couldn't think of any. At least for the Swedish names of Finnish places.
22:46:35 <HackEgo> olist (931): shachaf oerjan Sgeo FireFly
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23:44:55 <ion> The overview text http://www.crutchfield.com/S-AtP1DjFffcX/p_703SUB36M/AudioQuest-SUB-3-6-meter-19-7-feet.html
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23:53:22 <shachaf> ion: wow i'm throwing away all my other cables
23:57:30 <ion> shachaf: Remember to only use this for the subwoofer, there are other cables for other speakers.
23:57:53 <ion> Important: “Although this same material can cause high frequencies to sound edgy with full-range analog audio signals, it actually improves bass articulation when used in subwoofer cables.”
23:58:14 <ion> “edgy” and “bass articulation” being the proper scientific terms.