00:02:12 -!- tromp has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 00:02:45 -!- tromp has joined. 00:03:27 -!- yorick has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 00:06:50 -!- tromp has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 00:25:59 -!- tromp has joined. 00:41:24 boily: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anzu_(dinosaur) hth 00:41:38 hm he looks idle 00:41:50 @tell boily https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anzu_(dinosaur) hth 00:41:50 Consider it noted. 00:49:59 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 00:54:01 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Client Quit). 00:55:55 I happen to think the second card I listed that I made up is really pretty good. You can use it with GENGAR [Lv.38] and possibly pick up the card before the end of your turn. You can also use RATTATA [Lv.12] and then pick up the card next turn! You can also use it if you want to recycle a special energy card, get rid of a card in your hand, or other purposes. 00:56:31 There are some opponent's cards that might cause damage based on how many side cards you have already picked up, so perhaps you can defend against such thing. 01:02:12 oerjan: hellørjan! 01:02:17 @massages-loud 01:02:17 oerjan said 20m 27s ago: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anzu_(dinosaur) hth 01:02:54 oerjan: uhm. why are you dinosauring me? twh 01:03:27 boily: i hear you're interested in chickens hth 01:04:57 -!- ket1v has joined. 01:06:34 oerjan: it may be the case tdh 01:09:32 -!- ket1v has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 01:17:28 http://gaming.stackexchange.com/questions/161098/when-is-it-numberwang 01:20:21 that question is more sensible than I was hoping :-( 01:20:31 I take it that 2048 variant doesn't actually have a win condition? 01:20:37 (actually, "reach 2048" would almost make sense) 01:20:54 also, 2048 disappoints me, in that I feel that it's reasonable for there to be a 100% reliable strategy, yet apparently there isn't 01:22:57 i think if there was a no-op move it would maybe be much easier 01:23:03 also it has the permadeath difficulty curve trap 01:23:41 shachaf: the official version doesn't work on my computer, so I've been playing the js1k version (in 2048 bytes) that never adds 4s, and adds a 2 when you perform a move that moves nothing 01:23:49 in addition to when you perform a move that moves something 01:23:56 ais523: what's the permadeath difficulty curve trap 01:24:00 even though that's much easier 01:24:17 oerjan: when you make the game get harder as it goes along, with the start trivial 01:24:20 in a game with permadeath 01:24:28 hm 01:24:34 it means every time you screw up you have to play through like half an hour of nothing much happening 01:24:45 the correct curve is downwards 01:24:46 ais523: tetris also does that fwiw 01:25:07 btw this is a weird thing for you to say given that this is one of crawl's most obvious differences from nethack 01:25:11 in Tetris it's less bad because a) you can start at a higher difficulty, b) the goal is to last as long as possible, rather than reach a set location 01:25:19 elliott: Crawl and NetHack both curve downwards, though 01:25:26 hm right 01:25:37 what did you think the difference was? 01:25:46 back when i played, i usually started at the second last difficulty level 01:26:22 ais523: well, OK 01:26:23 also, many versions of Tetris have a set-length mode, and those modes normally don't get more difficult over time 01:26:27 since the last one was impossible to keep up for any length of time, while starting as high as you could gave the most points 01:26:30 (in fact, they get easier as you clear garbage blocks) 01:26:53 also I used to play Tetris on the secret difficulty 19 for a while, before going back to 9 for actual play 01:27:17 there's a secret 19? 01:27:20 I'm no good at 19, but it got me in the right mindframe for playing something much easier by comparison 01:27:28 there's an extra set of difficulties above 9 on the Game Boy version 01:27:35 hold, umm, I think it was Down at the title screen 01:27:52 it just displays the last digit (and a heart sign), but they're all much faster 01:27:56 than the originals 01:28:39 ais523: something interesting about 2048 is that if you play well the difficulty fluctuates by dropping down when you round a new block size 01:28:46 -!- DaedricBunny has quit (Quit: quit :: (User u) => u -> Action ()). 01:28:59 oerjan: yes, although having a very full board also reduces the difficulty 01:29:03 in that everything becomes predictable 01:29:12 as long as you're using a version that doesn't drop 4s, anyway 01:32:00 huh 01:32:25 i suspect if you had only 2's then there _might_ be a more obvious perfect play 01:32:28 one simple way to look at it is that 2048 on a 16x1 board, the only time things go wrong is when you're forced to press the forbidden direction (there are only two) 01:32:36 probably even with 4s dropping 01:33:09 unless 2s and 4s decide to drop alternating, but you can't do much about that 01:33:16 oh hm right when they are placed next to where you want them. 01:33:42 er 01:33:50 something vaguely similar to what i said 01:34:11 yeah, I think I know what you mean even though it's nothing like what you said 01:34:50 good, good 01:37:30 ais523: at which number would you stop expecting there to always be a reliable strategy? 01:37:51 anyway, this js1k version is indeed much easier, except for the flickering 01:38:17 that's a good question, possibly 1024 01:38:54 Also, why doesn't it work on your computer? 01:39:02 or maybe 8192 01:39:07 and no idea, the controls just don't work 01:39:10 On my old computer with an old browser, it fails because something has a "continue" attribute. 01:39:16 Oh, but it does draw the numbers? 01:39:19 yes 01:39:29 at least, I think so 01:39:35 I only tried twice, a while back 01:39:54 incidentally, someone used a bot that uses alpha-beta search to try to minimize the impact of bad luck 01:40:06 playing an uncapped version, it got a 2048 and 4096 on the same board 01:51:50 -!- ket1v has joined. 01:53:55 -!- ket1v_ has joined. 01:54:54 -!- ket1v has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 02:01:00 What are the proper archive types for the -t option in 7-Zip? 02:01:28 I know what archive types it supports but I don't know what name to use with the -t option to specify them 02:02:30 Specifically if I have a self-extracting archive I want to be able to tell it whether I want to load it as a ZIP or as a EXE 02:04:48 -texe doesn't seem to work. 02:09:49 (7-Zip does support a lot more file types than it documents: It can extract sections from Windows .EXE files, as well as DOCFILE chunks (which are used mainly in Microsoft Office), and a number of other things.) 02:11:07 -!- boily has quit (Quit: GLOORX VLOQ). 02:11:11 -!- metasepia has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 02:20:03 self extracting archives? 02:20:06 seriously? 02:20:12 do we still live in the 90s? 02:20:15 -!- mysanthrop has changed nick to myname. 02:20:26 zzo38 does 02:20:33 ah 02:20:40 i forgot, the guy that writes dos games 02:21:12 does zzo38 live in portland 02:21:37 ++ 02:21:40 he or she is at Canada 02:22:00 and has an interesting and unique view on the world 02:22:10 i mean, seriously, even windows xp which is over 10 years old can handle zip files 02:22:19 oh! 02:22:27 * myname tackles zzo38 02:22:31 zzo38: where are my donuts? 02:22:31 -!- conehead has quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.). 02:22:34 zzo38 can be pretty interesting to talk to 02:22:41 and has useful views on things 02:22:42 Antonym of "destination"? 02:22:47 you have to deal with the lack of context, though 02:22:53 :D 02:22:55 Taneb: "source", in programming 02:23:09 for journeys, I'm less certain 02:23:15 "starting point"? "origin"? 02:24:15 so... antonym is a synonym of opposite? 02:25:00 myname: yes 02:25:05 it's also an opposite of "synonym" 02:25:17 myname, in one sense, yes 02:25:52 zzo38: what is your origin story? how did you get your powers? 02:26:14 ais523: the opposite of synonym is the synonym of opposite 02:26:17 pretty interesting 02:26:19 also, please don't pick on him 02:26:36 the rest of the Internet does enough of that 02:26:56 lexande: you now zzo is pretty zzoic? 02:27:15 myname: ? 02:27:21 know 02:27:23 damnit 02:27:41 yes but what do you mean by "zzoic"? 02:28:05 I think we should stop talking about zzo38 until he's had time to tell his origin story 02:28:10 what's that bot's trigger for zzo? 02:29:02 it feels unfair picking on someone who isn't here (in fact, it's unfair to pick on someone even if they are here) 02:29:27 well, i do think he's a great guy 02:30:24 * Sgeo vaguely wonders what people say behind his back 02:30:35 shachaf: who are you? 02:30:46 hi 02:31:37 Sgeo: the channel's logged, you can look it up if you like 02:34:42 i guess wisdom has origin stories for most people here 02:35:06 i don't know my origin story 02:35:52 what defines an origin story in this context? 02:35:52 Are there groups of people who don't think their preferred activity is the best thing to teach kids? As in, chess players encourage people to play chess, programmers think programming classes are a great idea, some violinists has this on her page: "On October 1, 2013, Stirling teamed with the non-profit Atlanta Music Project to help spread appreciation of music to children who might not otherwise have the chance. The Atlanta Music Project's 02:35:52 mission was "to inspire social change by providing Atlanta's under-served youth the opportunity to learn and perform music in orchestras and choirs."" 02:35:54 etc etc 02:36:07 porn stars 02:36:31 Sgeo: i don't think programming classes are a great idea 02:36:59 kmc: :D 02:38:22 kmc: porn stars probably tend to support better sex ed? 02:38:36 "sex ed" 02:38:43 with educational videos and stuff 02:38:48 which is in that direction at least 02:40:05 politicians don't generally try to teach schoolchildren politics, do they? 02:40:13 especially given that they actually have the ability to do so 02:40:29 at least in the UK, where they have some input into the required curriculum that must be taught to all children 02:40:48 the nearest we come to that is Citizenship, which doesn't actually work as a subject 02:40:54 given that most teachers don't take it seriously 02:41:06 and even that's a pretty recent innovation 02:41:24 admittedly, I'd have found that a really useful subject if it were actually taught well 02:41:50 i do think most politicians with that influence have an easier life with people not knowing stuff about politics 02:42:24 lexande: What powers? What origin story? 02:44:11 I think that's the question for you 02:45:33 While Windows XP has support for ZIP archives, it isn't very good, since for one thing it isn't supported on command-line access (although for GUI, the built-in ZIP support is good enough) 02:57:48 'They're called "alpha males" because they're broken, primitive, buggy versions of real humans.' 02:58:56 meh let's not get all eye for an eye on dehumanization 02:59:00 that seems like it will end badly 03:01:47 i got stuck playing the fibonacci version of 2048 for hours friday night, and here you're talking about it again, teasing me with it. 03:02:31 doge-mille-quarante-huit 03:02:32 is the fibonacci version mathematically equivalent, or actually different? 03:02:52 quintopia: link 03:02:58 also, I'm not quite sure how games get this popular so quickly 03:03:05 ais523: it's the same game, but it takes one less tile to get each number 03:03:23 someone will have to explain flappy bird to me someday, I know that it was some sort of widely popular game thing thas was easy to implement 03:03:25 but not what it was 03:03:44 http://mike199515.free3v.com/1597/2.htm 03:03:51 ais523: it is like that crappy helicopter games years ago 03:03:53 but worse 03:04:07 i don't get it either 03:04:08 ais523: press a button to make the thing jump up a bit, then it falls down 03:04:17 try to avoid obstacles 03:04:31 does the bird move left and right? or do the obstacles? 03:04:37 side scrolling obstacles 03:04:40 right 03:04:48 that game has been around for ages 03:04:51 there's a better flash version 03:05:11 ais523: yes but kids weren't killing each other over high scores until recently 03:05:11 each version of the game is equally crappy 03:05:14 I seem to remember one of the microgames in one of the Warioware game worked like that, except with blowing into the controller 03:05:18 it only differs in how hard it is 03:05:39 but then, the entire way Warioware works is to have a huge number of games that are individually crappy, but each one only lasts three seconds so who cares 03:05:45 or was it five? 03:05:55 also, in that time period, you have to deduce the rules of the game, in addition to completing it 03:06:14 it gets less interesting once you have them all memorized 03:06:32 this is the decent one: http://techcrunch.com/2014/02/12/canabalt-super-hexagon-flappy-bird/ 03:07:11 even impossible game is waaaaaaay better than flappy bird 03:07:29 super flappy angry doge 2048 03:07:37 64 03:07:40 dot js 03:07:43 so I guess the next problem is "how do you make an easy-to-program game that randomly becomes wildly popular overnight?" 03:07:52 kmc: you won 03:07:58 it's webscale 03:08:05 ais523: LUCK 03:08:07 with svg 03:08:08 (and marketing) 03:08:31 but then better games tend to become wildly popular more often, so that's the better route 03:08:32 I don't think Flappy Bird had marketing 03:08:44 like frex QuizUp...do you know anyone who doesn't have that game? 03:08:48 -!- Bike has joined. 03:08:50 * kmc <- 03:08:51 I have a game I made in C# that I should convert to flash 03:08:52 And fix 03:08:53 quintopia: I've never heard of it 03:08:58 no flash 03:09:11 quizduell became pretty popular here 03:09:13 flash is a dead end technology 03:09:17 plus it sucks 03:09:20 I think there's at least two Flash to HTML5 compilers going around atm 03:09:26 Convert the game into different format, such as iNES format 03:09:28 does that include shumway? 03:09:28 no idea how well they work 03:09:34 not sure whether that counts as a "compiler" or not 03:09:44 what the hell is iNES 03:09:52 so why aren't you all playing 2584 03:10:02 myname: A format for storing ROM images of NES/Famicom cartridges. 03:10:17 Robozzle was briefly popular here for a while 03:10:21 quintopia: i actually like it more than 2048, but 2048 already bored the shit out of me 03:10:36 Sgeo: wow 03:10:37 But it's Silverlight :/ 03:10:41 (These days, even whoever make the iNES format files sometimes never end up making a cartridge.) 03:10:47 Sgeo: there is a js version 03:10:52 Sgeo: also an android app 03:10:54 JS version sucks 03:10:58 why? 03:10:59 Sgeo: There is HTML+JavaScript version too, and now I made DOS version too. 03:11:02 works perfectl well 03:11:57 -!- prooftechnique has joined. 03:12:03 i hardly became 2 or 3 people playing robozzle 03:12:38 and robozzle is awesome 03:12:50 Sgeo: I don't know, what's wrong with JS version either 03:13:05 (Although, I think DOS version is more better) 03:13:06 -!- prooftechnique has quit (Client Quit). 03:13:14 more better 03:13:47 -!- Sprocklem has joined. 03:16:24 Let's see if I still suck at Fitznik 03:17:06 what is fitznik 03:18:58 http://www.screamingduck.com/Fitznik.php 03:20:16 is this something like chroma? 03:21:20 okay, nevermind, i just don't get the pictures 03:21:40 Chroma? 03:23:19 -!- shikhin has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 03:24:21 http://www.level7.org.uk/chroma/ 03:24:49 also: there is a second ui with ncurses 03:24:56 i like that in a game 03:25:07 Ooh 03:25:20 I thought you meant this although it makes no sense http://store.steampowered.com/app/241850/ 03:25:45 gah, curses 03:25:52 I wrote a blog post on what's wrong with curses and variants thereof 03:25:59 Fitznik apparently freezes when minimized too long :( 03:26:09 (the Windows version of pdcurses is less bad in this respect, incidentally, due to not pretending to be portable) 03:27:46 ais523: i jumped over to termbox 03:28:02 but i do think there aren't many people knowing that 03:28:06 I haven't heard of termbox; my own solution was to write libuncursed 03:28:19 which has various not-found-elsewhere-and-unlikely-to-be features I needed 03:29:01 https://github.com/nsf/termbox pretty minimal 03:29:24 you may have to write own helper functions, but i am actually okay with it 03:29:43 also, making bindings for other language is piece of cake 03:30:04 unlike bcurses with its 100s of functions in up to 4 different ways 03:30:08 *n 03:30:16 -!- prooftechnique has joined. 03:30:30 ah, one of my requirements was that it had to be easy to port existing curses code to 03:30:37 because I had existing curses code I needed to port to it 03:32:28 btw, what are this channel's opinion on Facebook's new language which is basically statically typed PHP? 03:32:37 oh my god, there is an android port of enigma (that oxyd like thingie) 03:32:40 have to install 03:33:11 that's apparently pretty old, unless it was developed in the last few days 03:33:16 there was discussion about it recently 03:33:30 also, I have level design credits for Enigma now, I feel somewhat proud of that somehow 03:34:04 "Our solution was to architect the type checker as a local server that watches the filesystem. The server keeps all information about the source code in memory and automatically updates itself when a file changes on disk." 03:34:04 well. i do like the idea of replacing php with something 03:34:13 it's like flymake, but backwards 03:34:19 but 1) i just really don't like facebook 03:34:30 2) don't replace a language with a fork of itself 03:34:52 curses is such a poor library. Especially the bit where it pretends there are non-VT100 terminals on Unix. 03:34:58 also they wrote the compiler in ocaml, which is great ammo to use against first-year students 03:35:03 pikhq: *non-xterm 03:35:18 ais523: Yeah, but all the xterm-alikes are essentially extended VT100s. 03:35:22 the entire principle on which curses is based fails, because everything claims to be xterm 03:35:26 despite not all acting identically 03:35:55 So you might as well just emit codes that should work on pretty much anything vaguely VT100-alike. 03:35:59 gah, facebook's blog rewrites outgoing links so it can check how many people click on them? 03:36:36 Which doesn't get you Windows support, but nothing will without actually calling Windows' console functions. 03:36:47 also they have sugar for Maybe, which is unusual 03:37:03 pikhq: indeed, also you need to know which ones to call 03:37:34 who cares about windows 03:37:44 Unfortunately, a lot of people use it. 03:38:26 I have a faketerm backend that should be reasonably portable 03:38:32 once I fix the way it does select() on Windows 03:38:46 well, i don't have any mercy for people that like terminal tools but have no unixoid system 03:38:50 fun fact: Windows has an API call select that does the same thing as the POSIX version, and all the arguments have identical names 03:38:53 but some of them do something different 03:39:01 and I didn't notice the first time 03:39:18 I though Windows select only worked on sockets though? 03:39:26 pikhq: indeed 03:39:45 another fun fact: Windows has a generic WaitForMultipleObjects function that works like POSIX select, waiting for arbitrary things 03:39:51 /except/ you can't include sockets 03:40:00 there's a separate function, which I forget the name of offhand 03:40:05 if you want to be able to use both sockets and other things 03:40:05 Ouch. That just hurts. 03:40:13 It's like as though they want porting to be hard. 03:40:43 it's like the socket-implementing people at Microsoft couldn't persuade the WaitForMultipleObjects team to add socket support 03:40:45 so had to fork it 03:42:40 starting to think the important part of "everything is a file" is "everything can be handled by one event loop" 03:43:12 Pretty much. Everything is a file descriptor. 03:43:25 Sadly, signals aren't, though you can force it. 03:43:30 Good ol' self-pipe. 03:44:02 yeah, all the parts of UNIX that aren't file descriptors are a pain 03:44:07 obviously have a second input fd that's all the signals, in text format 03:44:20 well, linux has signalfd() 03:44:24 signals especially, but also processes 03:44:37 and timerfd and eventfd and various other fds 03:44:43 Yeah, job control is *amazingly* fiddly. 03:44:44 shachaf: wow that's literally what i was thinking, nice 03:44:49 ugh posix job control 03:45:02 various things are still not available as fds, though 03:46:34 an fd is an unforgeable reference to a kernel resource, and will always refer to the same resource (unlike, say, a filename or a pid) 03:47:40 what would it look like to design an OS explicitly for event-based programming 03:51:18 -!- Sellyme has quit (Excess Flood). 03:53:25 -!- Sellyme has joined. 03:59:51 I don't know how it would look like 04:02:57 foo_dumb sounds like shit :( 04:05:11 kmc: message passing? 04:05:29 Or do you want fancy shit like the kernel calling your event handlers 04:06:21 On the other hand, Pentagonal Dreams + Gapless repeat = good 04:07:34 the "x-kernel" is kind of event based 04:07:51 also arent most message passing microkernels kind of event-based? 04:08:49 No, microkernel threads usually wait on one channel at a time 04:11:09 ahh, you want kernel->user activations that do rely on having a pool of threads waiting to receive something, i guess? 04:12:38 Well, you could be crazy and make kernel upcalls spawn new threads 04:13:13 That's not "event based programming" though 04:17:37 -!- nooodl has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 04:23:16 If you only write code at parties, does that make you an event based programmer 04:24:04 if you only write code at parties and also never go to parties, then you are presumably not a programmer, event-based or otherwise 04:24:05 I bought a shirt http://www.zazzle.com/its_handy_t_shirt-235558875629678746 04:26:22 I have actually read of some system where every subroutine call spawns a new thread. 04:27:09 is the lower left one Ada? 04:27:32 or Algol, something like that but not Pascal 04:28:20 I think it's some BASIC 04:28:24 First thought was VB 04:28:45 Assigning to the name of the function 04:28:45 oh maybe 04:29:05 Yes I think it is BASIC 04:29:18 -!- tromp has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 04:29:28 It looks like it to me. 04:32:00 There is room they could easily put more programming languages too, such as Haskell, SQL, shell scripts, and others. 04:32:58 Haskell is on there 04:33:18 That's how I found the shirt in the first place, searching for Haskell 04:33:21 O, yes it is 04:33:25 After having given up on finding a polyglot shirt 04:33:26 I didn't notice that at first 04:33:37 It is written small 04:33:57 And perhaps they could add Pascal too, even. 04:34:18 And, Forth. 04:36:21 Especially Forth. 04:37:05 trouble is, you're going to need magnifiers to read the t-shirt :P 04:37:41 Picture looks like there is room to add some stuff, if the text is move up a bit. 04:38:38 You can actually change the shirt 04:38:42 Anyways the code won't be very long in many cases 04:41:37 I feel like that Prolog one could be improved 04:42:08 prooftechnique: OK, show me how then 04:42:11 : FACTORIAL ?DUP IF DUP 1- RECURSE * ELSE 1 THEN ; 04:42:29 Well, the N > 0 is unnecessary 04:42:41 WITH X(X,Y) AS (SELECT 1,1 UNION ALL SELECT X+1,Y*(X+1) FROM X LIMIT ?1) SELECT Y FROM X ORDER BY X DESC LIMIT 1; 04:42:51 I guess that's really the only improvement 04:43:02 :D 04:43:25 prooftechnique: I don't know much about Prolog. 04:44:14 Though I guess that's fine, since these aren't all semantically equivalent, so the extra comparison isn't that iffy 04:44:39 Shouldn't the C one be much longer 04:45:09 Jafet: The one given looks OK though 04:46:02 -!- tromp has joined. 04:46:07 This one in SQL is slightly wrong because it fails to give any result at all if you input zero. 04:46:52 i.e., C => factorial(-1) = 1, Prolog => fak(-1, R) = error, Haskell => fac (-1) = -inf 04:48:08 Factorial of negative integers is not defined mathematically anyways. 04:48:34 Well, sure, I'd just like some consistency :D 04:49:02 why bother with consistency there 04:49:05 Or just go all out and write Gamma 04:50:55 Factorial of negative number is possible, as long as they aren't integers. 04:57:14 zzo38, although not in the way factorials are generally calculated 04:58:39 You could define (-n)! as (-1)^n/n!. Who needs analytic continuations anyway. 05:09:03 :\ 05:11:36 Jafet: but don't you want 0! = 0*(-1)! ? 05:13:04 no that's silly 05:13:09 0!=1 as it should be 05:13:17 yes of course 05:13:28 obviously to get (-1)! you divide 0! by 0 05:13:34 We can just skip zero and pretend it never happened 05:13:57 well it worked for the julian calendar 05:13:59 \mathbb{R}* 05:14:13 pi! 05:14:17 uh, i think you mean \mathbb{Z}* 05:14:30 since you disavowed analysis 05:14:48 Ok, but we need Q for the negative continuation 05:14:53 0!=all real numbers 05:15:05 (we disavow functionness) 05:16:32 hmm, http://www.eternal-september.org/ doesn't look too healthy 05:16:33 okay people what game do i play next 05:16:36 what's a little ill-definedness between friends 05:17:11 what game have you been playing so far? 05:17:12 quintopia: does it have to be a game that exists? 05:17:28 if not, I recommend Little Arrow Theory, which will be at least mildly interesting if I ever get around to writing it 05:17:45 Is it a feathered arrow 05:17:51 it has to be one of the following: braid, bastion, amnesia, limbo, lone survivor, super meat boy 05:18:10 braid was pretty good 05:18:14 oh, hmm… braid and bastion are both pretty good 05:18:28 braid is p. good 05:18:29 I've 100%ed both, even though 100%ing braid is stupid 05:18:35 I liked Braid. Haven't played Bastion 05:18:39 it does have a bunch of pretentiousness but it's mostly ignorable 05:18:42 I enjoyed Bastion 05:18:46 i could never convince myself to get more than maybe half an hour into bastion 05:18:53 Bastion is also moderately pretentious, I guess 05:18:55 why is 100%ing braid stupid? i like 100% things 05:19:00 Couldn't get in the hang of Braid 05:19:02 it seems to become boring quickly 05:19:05 quintopia: time 05:19:11 afterward playing braid i dreamt that i was at the airport and missed my flight, and pressed shift to go back and catch it. and the TSA helpfully marked my boarding pass with sparkly green ink so i wouldn't have to have it checked again. 05:19:11 quintopia: there's one part where you have to do noting for two hours, also alt-tabbing doesn't work 05:19:14 quintopia: there's a thing where you need to wait two hours to get it 05:19:36 ais523: can you walk away from the game and set an alarm for yourself? 05:19:37 and also parts of it are so well-hidden that i don't think you have much of a hope of finding them without looking them up 05:19:41 lexande: my favourite bit of Braid: there's a speedrun mode, with a timer 05:19:44 quintopia: sure, that works 05:19:51 shachaf: eh i don't mind cheating to 100% things :) 05:19:59 lexande: and I thought that, because it times everything you do, shouldn't it be in green? 05:20:09 and I looked at it really carefully, and it does indeed have faint green sparkles on it 05:20:23 makes sense 05:20:40 Play Thousand Dollar Soul 05:20:47 it took me around 30 hours to 100% psychonauts 05:21:02 around maybe thrice that to 100% super mario sunshine 05:21:09 100%ing braid seems dubious yeah 05:21:34 i do like some of the bonus star puzzles 05:21:41 though i just 4096'd 2048, which is probably more dubious 05:21:47 100%ing Braid is not meant to be possible without spoilers; in fact, you're not even meant to discover that higher percentages exist without spoilers 05:21:51 but there's no indication that they exist and even knowing that they exist it takes a long time to time everything just right to get them 05:21:52 lexande: damn 05:22:12 probably the minimum level of spoiling that makes it possible is "100% is a thing that can be done" 05:22:33 the minimum level of spoiling that makes it reasonable (but still very difficult) is a list of the levels on which you have to perform different actions to get percentage 05:22:46 oh, and you have to perform a particular action early on 05:22:53 The links to the music is broken :( 05:23:02 ais523: i want the maximum level of spoilage :P 05:23:04 or, at least, there's an action you need to take to finish the game that makes it impossible to 100% the game 05:23:15 quintopia: I rarely spoil people in public, because other people might be caught in the blast 05:23:28 ais523: i figure googling it would work :P 05:23:33 also I can hardly remember at this point, go look up GameFAQs :-) 05:23:40 if you want maximum spoilers you can look it up easily enough 05:23:56 talking to people is good for situation-aware spoilers 05:23:59 the level of spoiling I recommend for 100%, btw, is "here are the locations you have to reach, figure out how", apart from a couple of them, screw those 05:24:16 like the rabbit one? 05:24:39 ais523: that seems about right 05:24:42 maybe that's too much spoilers 05:24:52 ais523's level of spoilers would have been nice, though. 05:25:07 nah, the rabbit one is actually clever 05:25:16 ais523: does #nethack count as in public for NetHack? 05:25:24 Sgeo: it's a spoiled channel 05:25:27 so I spoil in public there 05:25:53 for psychonauts, i wished there was a "list of things you can do to trigger reactions/cutscenes, when and where you need to be" 05:25:55 Where do people go if they don't want spoilers but the game isn't working for them? 05:26:00 Technical but not gameplay assistance? 05:26:11 PM, normally 05:26:29 or just asking the query quickly and leaving 05:26:38 NetHack spoilers often aren't so useful out of context anyway 05:26:46 * shachaf tries to remember the rest of the secret braid locations 05:27:11 hmm, can I create hints generic enough that they don't give away anything unless you already know where they are? 05:27:22 because as difficult as 100%ing psychonauts is, it's trivial compared to "trigger all reactions/cut scenes that can be triggered without a cheat code" 05:27:41 shachaf: we've mentioned three so far, and you almost certainly know where number 8 is 05:28:12 meaning the last one? 05:28:34 yes 05:28:48 zero knowledge hints 05:29:54 nice, emscripten has source maps http://people.mozilla.org/~lwagner/gdc-pres/gdc-2014.html#/27 05:30:09 so you can view and debug C or C++ code in the browser console 05:30:31 OK, I guess that had several mostly unguessable bits. 05:31:05 there is nothing unguessable about number 8, it is by far the clearest one about what you have to do 05:31:15 now, the fun part is: reach the star location /without/ unlocking it 05:31:24 speedrunners do that all the time because it's faster than the regular way 05:32:29 Hmm. 05:37:04 Tell me if there are any commands you think I have missed in the Digi-RGB-Plus specification? 05:37:22 zzo38: would it benefit from a COME FROM command? 05:37:27 actually, probably it wouldn't 05:37:28 -!- tromp has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 05:37:42 -!- tromp has joined. 05:37:45 ais523: It isn't a programming language, so a COME FROM command wouldn't do anything. 05:37:56 right 05:38:10 zzo38: can you get the current time 05:39:41 quintopia: You probably could *set* the current time using the "LOAD CONFIGURATION" command, and could display the time using the OSD command, although there is no way to get the current time otherwise, and that isn't what it is designed to do anyways, so it isn't necessary. 05:40:01 Anyway, factorial in C: int*f(int n, int*d){ int s = n*log(n+1)+1, *a = calloc(s,sizeof*a), i,c; if(a){ *a=*d=1; for(;n>1;--n){ c=0; for(i=0;i<*d;++i) c+=a[i]*n, a[i]=c%10, c/=10; while(c) a[(*d)++]=c%10, c/=10; }} return a; } 05:42:43 Jafet: OK 05:46:35 Could actually be shorter: for(i=0;i<*d||(c&&++*d);++i) c+=a[i]*n, a[i]=c%10, c/=10; 05:49:30 Digi-RGB-Plus control signal is a 1200,8,N,1 serial signal in the opposite direction from all of the other signals (video and audio). The codes go in four groups: Text control codes, Printable characters (in EIA-608 encoding), Remote control buttons, System control codes. 05:52:59 (It isn't actually EIA-608; it is a subset which uses only single-byte encoding.) 05:57:26 I have sixteen codes in "Remote control buttons" which are not currently assigned; maybe you know what to assign there, and/or if any ones that are already assigned are redundant? 05:58:23 (Four of them are assigned as "EXTRA FUNCTION A" to "EXTRA FUNCTION D".) 06:00:08 -!- tromp has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 06:00:26 -!- Sorella has quit (Quit: It is tiem!). 06:00:42 -!- tromp has joined. 06:03:17 now i've watched a braid speedrun 06:03:21 thais523 06:03:31 yw 06:04:14 URL please 06:04:41 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OzvFAZ6_G3w 06:04:53 -!- tromp has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 06:07:23 Braid 100% speedrun? 06:07:25 >:D 06:07:39 Sgeo: there have been people seriously talking about 75% 06:08:04 Being everything except the 2-hour star and the last star? 06:08:33 yes 06:09:15 actually, there are only two really bad stars 06:09:26 the 2-hour star, and the one you can permanently lock yourself out of 06:09:36 not just for the permanent lock, but because the thing you have to actually do is stupid 06:09:43 That one doesn't seem that bad time-wise. 06:09:52 Oh, you mean for discoverability? Sure. 06:09:53 it isn't 06:09:58 not just discoverability 06:10:03 even if you know what to do, it still sucks 06:10:14 and you normally need multiple tries despite the task not being interesting once you know what it is 06:11:53 That's true for many of the puzzles. 06:17:55 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: leaving). 06:32:42 -!- prooftechnique has quit (Quit: leaving). 06:59:11 Fun fact: The Internet Archive seems to have archived a bunch of Dexterity Software demo installers 06:59:38 And yes, this fact is, in fact, fun. 07:00:14 Fun fact: I haven't slept 07:00:21 And it is 7 AM 07:00:39 Actually, no, I slept from 10 to 1:30 07:02:22 -!- Sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 07:08:16 http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://dexterity.fileburst.com/* 07:12:51 -!- password2 has joined. 07:53:12 -!- Bike has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 07:53:49 -!- Bike has joined. 08:14:44 -!- conehead has joined. 08:31:39 Why does ternary raster operations in Windows use both multiplex and RPN codes? (Windows only uses the multiplex codes; I have confirmed this; WineHQ says the same thing, and I have decided to test this.) 08:33:20 Microsoft calls the multiplex codes the "boolean operation index" and the RPN codes the "operation code" (they are really a kind of RPN codes though, described on WineHQ). 08:43:53 -!- ais523 has quit. 09:03:22 -!- tromp has joined. 09:07:37 -!- tromp has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 09:17:53 -!- nisstyre_ has quit (Quit: bai). 09:20:57 -!- Sellyme has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 09:37:04 -!- Zom-B has joined. 09:54:05 -!- Sellyme has joined. 09:57:42 WineHQ says "If you are implementing the raster operations, then decoding the low 16 bit value may be better than having a huge switch statement that picks a set of operations based on one of the 256 valid high word values." I expect that the switch statement would be faster though, if placed outside of the loop. If you have hardware multiplex support then you don't need that either (although I don't think x86 has it?) 10:07:45 A 256-ary switch sounds great for jump predict/microop cache 10:07:45 What is a hardware multiplex? 10:08:48 x86 has an indirect jump, which compilers should use when compiling switch statements over longer consecutive ranges. 10:09:14 -!- quintopia has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 10:09:22 -!- quintopia has joined. 10:09:29 -!- quintopia has quit (Changing host). 10:09:29 -!- quintopia has joined. 10:09:36 Jafet: Esolang wiki as "Muxcomp" which the hardware multiplex is the only instruction in its instruction sets, so, it is something like that. 10:11:57 oh. you really want a binary table lookup. hmm. 10:14:21 -!- nisstyre has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 10:18:59 -!- conehead has quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.). 10:26:57 -!- MindlessDrone has joined. 10:29:03 -!- nooodl has joined. 10:50:02 -!- sebbu has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 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has joined. 11:46:05 -!- lifthrasiir has joined. 11:46:05 -!- vravn has joined. 11:46:05 -!- fizzie has joined. 11:46:05 -!- tromp__ has joined. 11:46:05 -!- trn has joined. 11:46:05 -!- aloril has joined. 11:50:44 -!- boily has joined. 12:12:11 -!- yorick has joined. 12:14:44 -!- atriq has joined. 12:15:12 -!- atriq has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 12:15:43 Morning 12:17:03 Morning too. 12:17:10 @localtime Taneb 12:17:11 Local time for Taneb is Sun Mar 23 12:17:11 12:17:18 yup. definitely morning. 12:18:40 Morning is whenever you want it to be. 12:19:10 also, "moin moin" can be said like any time you want 12:19:24 boily, I went to bed at 7 12:22:02 Jafellot. mynamello. 12:22:30 Taneb: 7, as in 7am? 12:22:48 i did 5 am 12:22:56 Yes 12:23:23 I started working on a game yesterday evening 12:25:18 what game? 12:25:26 I am making a game 12:25:35 You control a zombie horde 12:25:42 anyone called me? 12:25:55 Taneb: i like it so far 12:26:43 Taneb: will there be a terminal version? 12:26:45 My code is on Github if you want to see, https://github.com/Taneb/zombie-game 12:26:53 myname, probably not for a while I am afraid 12:27:07 how am i supposed to play it, then 12:27:08 But it is not outside the realms of possibility 12:27:13 hi 12:27:29 By borrowing a not-terminal-only computer from your parents? 12:27:45 Taneb: could you outline the idea of the game? 12:28:09 You control a horde of zombies who follow the cursor. Use them to defeat the humans! 12:28:17 They are pretty stupid though 12:28:26 have you ever dreamt of irc channels that don't exist in reality? 12:29:04 ? 12:29:12 Taneb: it sounds a bit like a reverse robot escape game 12:30:06 myname, I have not played a robot escape game 12:30:10 b_jonas, no, I have not 12:30:22 Have you? 12:30:53 'control a horde'' hmm... Anyone ever heard of Liquid Wars? 12:31:08 Taneb: you are the player and have to escape robots that pop up, robots always take the shortest path towards you, but if 2 run into each other, they get destroyed 12:31:19 Taneb: I think I have, but maybe I only dreamt that I dreamt of it, or something 12:31:23 I'm not sure 12:31:36 oh theres not a compiled version 12:32:17 debian ships with robots 12:34:05 I once had a dream that I had overslept and woke up at 4 PM instead of 8 AM 12:34:32 You're dreaming of my life 12:36:30 -!- MoALTz has joined. 12:36:41 i should finish my game 12:39:15 starting by addding more creeps! 12:39:33 i should start my game 12:39:56 :P 12:44:32 mmm , Qt needs a clone class button 12:48:41 -!- sebbu has joined. 12:49:28 -!- sebbu has quit (Changing host). 12:49:28 -!- sebbu has joined. 12:53:18 -!- password2 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 12:55:25 -!- shikhout has joined. 12:58:43 -!- shikhin has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 12:58:43 -!- shikhout has changed nick to shikhin. 13:13:08 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:13:12 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:13:13 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:13:54 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:13:58 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:13:59 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:15:01 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:15:05 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:15:05 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:15:37 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:15:41 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:15:41 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:16:13 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:16:17 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:16:17 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:16:49 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:16:53 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:16:53 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:17:40 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:17:44 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:17:45 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:18:13 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:18:17 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:18:17 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:18:56 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:19:00 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:19:01 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:19:52 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:19:56 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:19:57 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:20:31 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:20:35 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:20:35 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:21:19 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:21:23 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:21:23 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:22:04 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:22:08 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:22:09 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:23:10 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:23:11 -!- glogbot has joined. 13:23:14 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:23:15 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:26:26 -!- anubiann00b has joined. 13:27:19 !bfjoust anubiann00b [>[-]-] 13:27:27 ​Score for anubiann00b_anubiann00b: 5.4 13:29:02 !bfjoust noob >>>>>>>>>[>[-]-] 13:29:02 anubiann00b: how dare you score higher than me? 13:29:05 ​Score for anubiann00b_noob: 5.7 13:29:17 boily pro plays right here 13:29:47 !bfjoust anubiann00b [>+[-]-] 13:31:04 -!- mtve has joined. 13:31:08 (mildly interesting wikipédia fact: the [French press](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_press) article doesn't have a French version.) 13:31:24 mmkay then 13:31:38 It's not even french... 13:31:49 !bfjoust noob [>+[-]-] 13:31:52 ​Score for anubiann00b_noob: 5.3 13:32:13 in fact, the name “French press” is a Bodum patent. 13:32:37 !bfjoust noob >>>>>>>>[>+[-]-] 13:32:40 ​Score for anubiann00b_noob: 6.4 13:32:49 really a patent? or e.g. trademark? 13:32:52 So how bad is 6.4 13:33:37 !bfjoust noob >+>->+>->+>->+[>+[-]-] 13:33:40 ​Score for anubiann00b_noob: 5.7 13:34:11 apparently the french name for it is often "Bodum" 13:35:20 !bfjoust oops < 13:35:23 ​Score for int-e_oops: 0.0 13:35:30 !bfjoust test >++++++++++++++++++++ >-------------------- >-------------------- >++++++++++++++++++++ >++++++++++++++++++++ >-------------------- >-------------------- >++++++++++++++++++++ >++++ >---- >---- >++++ >++++ >---- >---- >++++ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >------[+]>------[+]>------[+]>------[+] >------[+]>------[+]>----- 13:35:32 ​Score for anubiann00b_test: 0.0 13:35:35 nice job int e 13:35:52 wait no this code will just run off the right side 13:36:26 olsner: trademark. 13:36:31 what are teh * and % 13:36:44 !bfjoust test something >+>->+>->+>->+(>-++-(.)*132[+]++>-++-(.)*132[-]--)*15 13:36:46 ​Score for anubiann00b_test: 9.3 13:37:52 !bfjoust flagdance [+] 13:37:54 ​Score for anubiann00b_flagdance: 9.8 13:38:26 yeah 9.8 lets go 13:40:39 !bfjoust flagdance [[+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-]] 13:40:43 ​Score for anubiann00b_flagdance: 12.5 13:41:15 !bfjoust [+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-] 13:41:15 ​Use: !bfjoust . Scoreboard, programs, and a description of score calculation are at http://codu.org/eso/bfjoust/ 13:41:52 !bfjoust flagdance [+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-][+-] 13:41:55 ​Score for anubiann00b_flagdance: 10.1 13:42:14 !bfjoust flagdance [[+-]] 13:42:17 ​Score for anubiann00b_flagdance: 12.7 13:42:39 !bfjoust !bfjoust [+-] ([+-])*10000 13:42:43 ​Score for int-e__bfjoust: 9.8 13:42:49 what does the * do 13:42:51 !bfjoust [+-] ([+-])*10000 13:42:55 ​Score for int-e___-_: 9.8 13:42:57 that's not part of the bf language 13:43:09 http://esolangs.org/wiki/BF_Joust describes the extended syntax 13:43:22 (under "Abbreviations") 13:43:29 oh thanks 13:45:10 !bfjoust flagdanceTripwire (>+>-)*5(<)*10[[+-]] 13:45:15 ​Score for anubiann00b_flagdanceTripwire: 4.0 13:45:40 !bfjoust flagdanceTripwire >+>-<<[[+-]] 13:45:45 ​Score for anubiann00b_flagdanceTripwire: 4.7 13:46:12 -!- prooftechnique has joined. 13:46:16 +bfjoust? 13:47:45 !bfjoust - >*10([-.]>)*5<*15(+-)*10000 13:47:49 ​Score for int-e_-: 3.3 13:47:56 fun. 13:48:05 nice 13:48:29 How exactly does a program that sets a tripwire then trolls the flag do worse than a program that just trolls the flag? 13:48:31 !bfjoust +[] 13:48:31 ​Use: !bfjoust . Scoreboard, programs, and a description of score calculation are at http://codu.org/eso/bfjoust/ 13:48:58 @password2 you need to inclue the program name 13:48:59 Unknown command, try @list 13:49:05 like this 13:49:14 !bfjoust foo [-] 13:49:15 @list 13:49:16 What module? Try @listmodules for some ideas. 13:49:17 !bfjoust yolo [-] 13:49:17 ​Score for nortti_foo: 9.4 13:49:19 ​Score for anubiann00b_yolo: 9.4 13:49:22 wat 13:49:35 nortti lol 13:49:51 !bfjoust diit +[] 13:49:54 ​Score for password2_diit: 6.1 13:50:12 !bfjoust dito +[>] 13:50:15 ​Score for password2_dito: 6.1 13:50:58 !bfjoust imdone < 13:51:00 ​Score for anubiann00b_imdone: 0.0 13:51:02 what does the score mean? 13:51:17 !bfjoust yolo [-] 13:51:21 ​Score for anubiann00b_yolo: 9.4 13:52:52 !bfjoust dito +[[[>]]] 13:53:21 -!- anubiann00b has quit (Quit: Page closed). 13:55:24 !bfjoust - (>>+*12>>-*12)*2>([+[.-]]>)*19 13:55:27 ​Score for int-e_-: 14.6 13:55:38 !bfjoust - (>>+*12>>-*12)*2>([+[.-]]>)*20 13:55:41 ​Score for int-e_-: 16.0 13:58:08 !bfjoust - (>>+*12>>-*12)*2>([+[.-]]>)*20[+[.-]]<*29(+-)*10000 13:58:10 ​Score for int-e_-: 17.6 13:59:58 holy fungot, that coffee is powerful. 13:59:58 boily: no, it's not. it's more complex than that. read the code.) good stuff like " thisfunction2 thislineofcode")) but have to seek. hee. i wan to faster finish the game could 14:00:16 fungot: more complex than coffee grounds and hot water? 14:00:16 boily: that is just a value of type " airbus is a big fan of avril....but this song " there was much greenish-brown pulpy matter 14:00:37 fungot: uhm. greenish-brown pulpy matter... 14:00:37 boily: agora alice c64 ct darwin discworld europarl ff7 fisher ic irc* jargon lovecraft nethack pa speeches ss wp youtube with this jaybad... he is like the punching him? does it involve? doing it the way you would calibrate a normal. pm showed the bq a parking citation. if confronted, you will say you are only here to deliver a message and then i'll put his shit.... w.t.f lol 14:01:18 ^style lovecraft 14:01:18 Selected style: lovecraft (H. P. Lovecraft's writings) 14:01:22 fungot: quiens. 14:03:43 -!- ket1v_ has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 14:09:32 -!- Sorella has joined. 14:24:24 is fungot sleeping? 14:24:25 b_jonas: but isolated parts of bodies, or fragments and synthetic mockeries of bodies, or fragments and synthetic mockeries of bodies, or fragments and synthetic mockeries of bodies, as might remain from the morbid and unaccountable foetor, i seized the paper and look affrightedly out of the rest, silhouetted against the rising moon. 14:36:00 All about the bodies. 14:37:08 -!- contrapumpkin has quit (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…). 14:39:41 !bfjoust 0 http://esolangs.org/wiki/BF_Joust 14:39:45 ​Score for int-e_0: 0.0 14:39:46 ;-) 14:40:41 fungot should say that again 14:40:41 Jafet: gilman's room was torn out, the fnord who lodged just under gilman talking to mazurewicz one evening. they were 14:41:02 -!- copumpkin has joined. 14:41:43 Poor fungot, it's still suffering from (dronf)^-1 poisoning. 14:41:43 int-e: some disturbance or malady of genuine gravity, which no doubt formed the basis of the prevailing odd fnord and after six months believed that he could trust his instincts to take him back to fnord 14:43:10 I think fungot can hear you. 14:43:10 Jafet: it does credit to the alertness of ammi's mind that he puzzled even at that tense moment over a point which would probably be missing. joe knew about such things. those scaly fnord seem to have been our associate. moreover, it might form a good present link with the scene of unholy worship, so inspector legrasse and his men, it is true that the window he faced was unbroken, but nature has shown herself capable of many fr 14:54:34 -!- copumpkin has quit (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…). 14:57:38 -!- ket1v has joined. 15:02:19 -!- ket1v has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 15:03:23 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 15:15:03 -!- MoALTz has quit (Quit: Leaving). 15:19:19 I won that stupid 2048 game. 15:22:45 Now do the 3D version! http://joppi.github.io/2048-3D/ Or the 65536 version! http://www.csie.ntu.edu.tw/~b01902112/65536/ Or the Numberwang version! http://louhuang.com/2048-numberwang/ 15:23:30 I tried the numberwang one yesterday. my brain was unhappy. 15:23:57 lol 15:25:55 what the fuck numberwang, the numbers keep changing 15:26:40 Zom-B, focus on the colours :) 15:26:54 i noticed 15:27:05 so its just 2048 with numbers obfuscated? 15:27:21 Well... that's numberwang 15:28:51 Deewiant: intuitively, 65536 should be easy, but it'll take 30k moves. OUCH! 15:29:23 int-e: http://www.csie.ntu.edu.tw/~b01902112/9007199254740992/ 15:30:56 why stop there? doubles can express numbers up to 2^1022 (or so) exactly. 15:31:37 I don't know of a bigger one 15:31:42 the 3d version looks interesting. 15:31:56 Well, except the infinite ones 15:32:03 Deewiant: actually I can prove that 9007199254740992 can't be won. 15:32:17 uhm 15:32:20 I can't 15:32:29 I can't count to 8 :) 15:32:35 http://phenomist.wordpress.com/2048-variants/ 15:36:24 int-e: why stop there? there are bignum libraries for JS. 15:47:29 -!- john_metcalf has joined. 15:50:15 3D is actually a lot easier than 2D 15:53:30 so its just 2048 with numbers obfuscated? 15:53:33 no, actually 15:53:54 2048 in hyperbolic space 15:54:35 Phantom_Hoover, really? 15:55:05 i thought it was more random than that but playing it again it's not 15:55:30 2048 on Riemannian manifolds 15:59:17 2048 on the Stone-Čech compactification of a point topology 16:00:57 2048 on a plane 16:02:14 Stop being a radical Bike 16:02:21 .... apparently I got The Scarlet Letter confused with some book about a fever 16:02:33 Today's SMBC really didn't make sense 16:03:22 speaking of things that don't make sense, http://www.beneath-ceaseless-skies.com/stories/sekhmet-hunts-the-dying-gnosis-a-computation/ 16:04:29 won 3D in 1 go 16:04:56 score 26096 16:06:58 -!- HackEgo has joined. 16:12:45 Deewiant: I hate you. I'm up to 8192. 16:15:42 boily: You might want to digest int-e's comment: "intuitively, 65536 should be easy, but it'll take 30k moves." 16:16:50 -!- MoALTz has joined. 16:20:49 8402 is nice. 16:21:13 is it possible to prevent a 512 tile? 16:22:27 http://int-e.eu/~bf3/tmp/8402.png ... wait, it says "puppies eaten"?! 16:22:33 haha 16:22:58 -!- password2 has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds). 16:25:57 Ah, the autorun mode at https://sztupy.github.io/2048-Hard/ may answer this question. it managed 128+64+32+32+16+16+16+8+8+4+4+4+2+2+2+2 ... impressive. 16:38:38 -!- password2 has joined. 16:40:05 whats the esolang with the least amount of instructions? 16:42:25 password2: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_instruction_set_computer 16:42:34 Also iota 16:42:57 lemme geuss , its an djmpz ? 16:45:27 Subtract and jump if negative is a common one 16:47:21 surpringly not as minamilistic as i thought it would be 16:48:46 CI – Continues Integration https://www.gitlab.com/products/ 16:49:08 I made a machine with subtract as the only instruction, but it's cheating because it has some memory-mapped magical registers for extra instructions. 16:49:19 -!- Slereah_ has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 16:49:57 ah 16:58:36 -!- ket1v has joined. 17:00:39 http://www.wallpapersshop.net/wallpaper/moscow-city-night-winter/ (It seems i live in Moscow now.) 17:01:21 ion: do people attempt to lick you in moscow too? 17:02:01 There has been a worrying lack of attempts to lick me recently. 17:02:49 -!- ket1v has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 17:03:37 ion: you should bring a sign with something to the effect of "Пожалуйста, пожалуйста, лизать Ion." (disclaimer, caveat emptor and all that sort of thing: that went through Google. I am not responsible for damage incurred.) 17:04:56 mmm , lets see if i can do Fibonacci in bf^ 17:05:09 boily: That sounds like a good idea. 17:18:19 -!- Sorella has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 17:20:56 -!- prooftechnique has quit (Quit: leaving). 17:28:35 -!- Sorella has joined. 17:44:01 -!- password2 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 17:45:26 http://www.theonion.com/articles/thanks-for-being-so-cool-about-everything,35584/?utm_source=butt&utm_medium=butt&utm_campaign=butt 17:48:22 b_jonas: an increment register instruction coupled with a subtract and jump if zero instruction is turing complete 17:48:56 i mean decrement, not subtract 17:50:18 -!- boily has quit (Quit: CREMENTING CHICKEN). 17:53:06 ion: honestly I find Kerry's statement ("You just don't in the 21st century behave in 19th century fashion by invading another country on completely trumped up pre-text,") much funnier than that whole article. 17:53:24 hehe 17:54:32 tromp__: sure, that kind of thing is fine, I just chose a particularly ugly and bad way to realize this into a machine, and then wrote a single buggy program for it. I should try a cleaner design later. 17:54:50 I do mean subtract though, not decrement 18:01:07 So you can add, too. 18:02:35 yes 18:02:47 and copy too, which is useful 18:20:24 -!- password2 has joined. 18:33:24 Hi 18:33:29 -!- passwordBOT has joined. 18:34:12 +bfop: 18:35:47 mmm 18:35:48 +bfop: 18:35:49 brainfuck^ opperators are []()<>+-{},. () is like [] except it uses the value the current cell points to , {} is like +- except it dec/inc the value the cell points to 18:35:56 there we go 18:36:29 i made modifications :P 18:36:30 i don't get () 18:36:35 is it relative addressing? 18:36:42 yes 18:37:05 and how can be { like +-? that's like a nop 18:37:08 ie 18:37:14 +bfreset:+bf:++>+++>+++++++++++>+++++++++<<< 18:37:15 Done and it took 31 cycles 18:37:29 +bfdump: 18:37:29 |2| 3 11 9 18:37:42 now to add 11 to 9 18:37:47 +bf:({>}<) 18:37:49 Done and it took 56 cycles 18:37:51 +bfdump: 18:37:51 |2| 3 0 20 18:38:09 ah, that - is meant to be an emdash 18:38:25 emdash? 18:38:29 wait, no 18:38:43 what does { do? 18:39:35 how does it know when i want to increment and when i want to decrement? 18:39:37 it subtracts one from the cell is pointing the current cell is pointing to 18:40:05 i thought it's adding? 18:40:10 {} is increment and ecrement , but it increments that value the current cell points to 18:40:29 nope 18:40:52 i used a loop todo adding 18:40:55 ah, so { is -<+>? 18:41:06 nope 18:41:09 like "move one"? 18:41:34 then i don't get when it increments and when it doesn't 18:41:41 { looks at the current cell and edits the cell this one points to 18:41:48 lemm show and example 18:41:53 ah 18:41:55 +bfreset:++++ 18:41:57 +bfdump 18:42:10 i thought "points to" meant the directio of the symbol 18:42:10 +bfdump: 18:42:17 |0| 18:42:41 +bfdump: 18:42:44 |0| 18:42:53 +bf:++++ 18:42:53 Done and it took 4 cycles 18:43:03 +bfdump: 18:43:06 |4| 18:43:08 in that case, i'd swith {} 18:43:24 +bf:}}}} 18:43:26 +bfdump: 18:43:27 } looks more "adding" to me 18:43:32 Done and it took 4 cycles 18:43:33 |4| 0 0 0 4 18:44:14 -!- Sprocklem has joined. 18:44:47 +bf:{{ 18:44:51 Done and it took 2 cycles 18:45:11 +bfdump: 18:45:14 |4| 0 0 0 2 18:45:24 understand now? 18:46:11 in this case the } looks at cell0 , which contain4 and then increments cell4 18:46:29 yeah 18:47:28 ok 18:48:17 i still find it confusing that it states "{} is like +-" and later "dec/inc" 18:48:24 it should be -+, no? 18:51:13 oh the order , ye 18:51:14 s 18:51:41 will update that 18:52:17 mmm 18:52:57 how do people manage to write complex programs in bf 18:53:20 password2: Sometimes by hand, and sometimes using other compilers. 18:53:28 ah 18:53:49 i tried Fibonacci , but gave up soon 18:54:53 isn't fibonacci straight forward? 18:55:06 you just have to make (a,b) into (b,a+b) 18:55:12 if your hardcode it , yes 18:55:19 doing n times 18:55:29 plus one to memorize a value 18:55:32 -!- shikhout has joined. 18:55:45 4 cells should be enough to get the nth fibonacci number 18:56:25 1. add 1 to cell 3 18:56:30 so you have n 0 1 0 18:56:36 and if you want to have the seqeunce in ram 18:56:41 2. move b to cell 4 18:56:47 ie 1 1 2 3 5 8 13 ... n 18:56:51 you hava n 0 0 b 18:57:01 add b to cell 2 and 3 18:57:19 oh wait 18:57:29 move a to cell 3 first 18:57:39 then add b to cell 2 and 3 18:57:43 then decrement cell 1 18:57:47 you are done 18:57:53 ah 18:58:03 -_- 18:58:31 have you written fibb in bf? 18:58:43 -!- shikhin has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 18:58:43 -!- shikhout has changed nick to shikhin. 18:58:49 just getting the nth fibb should be pretty easy 18:59:29 how does your bot handly input, now? 18:59:30 -!- ket1v has joined. 19:00:05 not at all 19:00:14 it does have output though 19:00:28 input is unimplemented 19:00:46 +bf:++++>>+<<[>>[->+<]<[->+<]>>[-<+<+>>]] 19:00:50 Done and it took 32 cycles 19:00:56 +bfdump: 19:00:59 8 1 1 |0| 2 19:01:07 what? 19:01:18 you didn't reset 19:01:23 +bfreset: 19:01:29 +bfreset:+bf:++++>>+<<[>>[->+<]<[->+<]>>[-<+<+>>]] 19:01:30 Done and it took 32 cycles 19:01:35 +bfdump: 19:01:39 4 1 1 |0| 19:01:46 still not what i wanted 19:02:08 what did you want? 19:02:09 ah 19:02:21 +bfreset:+bf:++++>>+<<[>>[->+<]<[->+<]>>[-<+<+>>]<<<] 19:02:38 Done and it took 524288 cycles 19:02:41 +bfdump: 19:02:46 doesn't sound right 19:02:47 4 59 |93| 124 19:03:02 it stopped at the cycle limit 19:03:34 you might have had an inf loop 19:03:42 +bfreset:+bf:++++>>+<<>>[->+<]<[->+<]>>[-<+<+>>]<<< 19:03:50 Done and it took 33 cycles 19:03:54 +bfdump: 19:03:55 |4| 1 1 19:03:58 -!- ket1v has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 19:04:13 +bfreset:+bf:++++>>+<<[>>[->+<]<[->+<]>>[-<+<+>>]<<<-] 19:04:13 Done and it took 183 cycles 19:04:18 +bfdump: 19:04:18 |0| 3 5 19:04:23 ha 19:04:34 +bfreset:+bf:++++++>>+<<[>>[->+<]<[->+<]>>[-<+<+>>]<<<-] 19:04:35 Done and it took 450 cycles 19:04:37 +bfdump: 19:04:38 |0| 8 13 19:04:41 there you are 19:05:14 wow 19:06:02 just put n in the first cell and you will get the nth fibbonacci number at the third cell 19:06:17 you may move it to the first after the loop 19:07:05 not really what i was trying to do 19:07:17 but geus that works 19:07:36 i will try your thing 19:08:27 i do think the main problem with your approach is to stop 19:09:37 i think with the addons it might be a little easier 19:13:26 +bfreset:+bf:+>+>+++[[->>>+<<<]<<[->>+>+<<<]>>>[-<<<+>>>]<<[->+>+<<]>>[-<<+>>]>[-<+>]<-] 19:13:41 Done and it took 11826 cycles 19:13:49 +bfdump: 19:13:52 1 1 2 3 5 8 13 21 |0| 0 253 19:13:59 there you go 19:14:00 bitch! 19:14:33 i cheated a bit starting with 1 1 (n-2), but well 19:18:02 need an explanation? 19:18:55 nah 19:19:27 you just have to start thinking in steps that are possible in bf 19:19:46 especially stuff like saving a value you are about to consume 19:20:13 -!- Slereah_ has joined. 19:20:30 Man I'm trying to reverse engineer the old Monkey Island sound files 19:20:36 It is not easy 19:22:32 mmm 19:23:05 For some reason, they go take a value in some part of the memory 19:23:18 And then divide it by a value from another part of the memory 19:23:34 Before sending it to the PC speaker 19:24:52 +bfreset:+bf:++++++>+++>+>+<<<->({++}+}---)(++{--)+(++{--}) 19:24:53 Done and it took 33 cycles 19:25:08 +bfdump: 19:25:09 5 |4| 1 0 0 1 1 19:25:41 -!- passwordBOT has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 19:26:28 passwordBOT: i am pretty sure you can save a lot of instructions with your modifications if you deal with your n right, but then again: you have to have a n-1 and n-2 to fully make use of it 19:26:54 damn 19:26:59 password2: i meant you 19:27:01 ok 19:27:55 urg , my lagg is horrendus 19:27:57 15s 19:51:43 -!- MindlessDrone has quit (Quit: MindlessDrone). 20:02:49 -!- nisstyre has joined. 20:03:26 finally i fured out fibb 20:04:06 :D 20:04:07 took me long enough 20:04:15 indeed 20:04:51 -!- passwordBOT has joined. 20:05:03 +bfreset:+bf:+++++++++++>+++>+>+<<<[->({+++}+}----)+++({---}+++)+({---}+++)-----({+++}+}----) +++({---}+++)+({--}++)--<] 20:05:17 +bfdump: 20:05:21 |0| 14 1 1 2 3 5 8 13 21 34 55 89 144 233 20:05:57 what do the {} and () do? 20:06:19 +bfop: 20:06:19 that looks strange 20:06:20 brainfuck^ opperators are []()<>+-{},. () is like [] except it uses the value the current cell points to , {} is like -+ except it dec/inc the value the cell points to 20:06:21 || is the current pointer? nice. 20:06:22 () is [] with relative addresses 20:06:36 {} are -+ with relative addresses 20:06:58 interesting 20:07:29 kind of reminds me about the zero page (or what was it called) 20:08:01 um 20:08:09 its kinda fun playing around with the relative adressing 20:08:15 where's the wiki page for that language? 20:08:43 (+) , will find the first empty cell 20:09:07 that's kinda nice 20:10:30 well, as long as that cell is within the first 256 20:10:49 jip 20:11:35 don't see any point in limiting the value of bf cells 20:12:21 well, the original bf was just a description what the implementation did 20:12:54 and because many programs rely on the wraparound, it is usually implemented so 20:13:32 but nothing stops anyone from making a bigint brainfuck. actually, I think the original turing completeness proof used a variation with bigint cells 20:13:37 +bfreset:+bf:+[+]:+bfdump 20:13:37 Done and it took 767 cycles 20:13:43 +bfdump 20:13:55 +bfdump: 20:13:56 |1| 20:14:03 fascinating. 20:14:11 i do think the +bfdump was it 20:14:24 +bfreset:+bf:+[+]:+bfdump: 20:14:31 Done and it took 767 cycles 20:14:31 |1| 20:14:38 hooray 20:14:47 +bfreset:+bf:+[+] 20:14:50 Done and it took 766 cycles 20:14:53 +bfdump 20:14:55 +bfdump: 20:14:57 |0| 20:14:58 see 20:15:06 the parsing is a bit broken 20:15:11 jip 20:16:01 +bfreset:+bf: is the only combo i made sure to work 20:16:02 Done and it took 0 cycles 20:16:11 :P 20:16:25 mmm , i have an idea 20:18:43 yes? 20:19:27 gonna add flags for auton dumping and auto resetting of tape 20:20:29 i'd make them default 20:20:48 most of the time, you are more interested starting in a new tape rather than working on an existing one 20:21:00 ah,ok 20:21:09 default with option to turn off 20:23:33 -!- passwordBOT has quit (Quit: Good). 20:23:52 -!- passwordBOT has joined. 20:24:08 +bf:(-) 20:24:09 |0| 20:24:15 +bf:+ 20:24:18 Done and it took 1 cycles 20:24:18 |1| 20:24:29 intense 20:24:35 yes 20:24:36 wow 20:24:37 much bf 20:25:14 +bf:+(+) 20:25:16 Done and it took 2 cycles 20:25:16 |1| 20:25:27 +bf:+(+}) 20:25:31 Done and it took 2 cycles 20:25:31 |1| 20:25:54 shouldn't +(+) result in 1 |0|? 20:25:57 mmm 20:26:11 +bf:++ 20:26:12 Done and it took 2 cycles 20:26:13 |2| 20:26:26 +bf:>>>>+ 20:26:32 Done and it took 5 cycles 20:26:32 0 0 0 0 |1| 20:26:49 should be |2| imo 20:26:50 +bf:>>>>+<<<<+(+) 20:26:53 Done and it took 11 cycles 20:26:53 |1| 0 0 0 1 20:27:02 +bf:(+) 20:27:03 Done and it took 1 cycles 20:27:04 |0| 20:27:05 ah 20:27:10 +bf:>>>>+<<<+<+(+) 20:27:13 Done and it took 14 cycles 20:27:13 |2| 1 0 0 1 20:27:21 +bf:<+ 20:27:21 what 20:27:22 Done and it took 2 cycles 20:27:22 |0| 20:27:26 ah 20:27:59 +bf:+[<]. 20:28:03 Done and it took 8 cycles 20:28:03 Output is: 20:28:03 1 20:29:10 mm , i should make 'Done' anouncement optional too 20:30:54 +bf:<+[[-]<+] 20:30:55 Done and it took 3 cycles 20:30:56 |0| 20:31:29 +bf:+[>+] 20:31:34 +bfdump: 20:31:35 Done and it took 260105 cycles 20:31:35 1 |0| 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 20:31:35 1 |0| 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 20:31:57 a tape that wraps around? 20:32:03 yes 20:32:05 looks like it 20:32:18 the tape is actually much much longer though 20:32:26 ok , its 255 20:32:55 möbius tape, please 20:33:06 how would that work? 20:33:13 don't know yet 20:33:19 go round twice? 20:33:20 but there is something inside tat 20:33:27 and how would it be different from a circular? 20:33:35 or invert numbers upon wrapping? 20:33:40 password2: yeah 20:33:47 hmm, or reverses the bits 20:33:57 the second half of the tape would be aliased to the first half but with cells transformed in some way 20:33:59 nortti: maybe if you could have actions on both sides 20:35:49 +bf:<+ 20:35:55 +bfdump: 20:35:57 Done and it took 2 cycles 20:35:58 |0| 20:35:58 |0| 20:36:06 sorry , i lag a bit 20:36:36 +bf:++<<-- 20:36:37 Done and it took 6 cycles 20:36:37 2 20:37:13 pointer does wrap , but the display does not update right it seems 20:37:36 it would be due that i only so 64ish first cells 20:37:46 +bf:+[->}+] 20:38:22 brb 20:38:24 -!- passwordBOT has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 20:38:45 -!- passwordBOT has joined. 20:39:12 +bf:+[->}+] 20:39:48 +bfdump: 20:40:33 +bfdump: 20:40:34 255 20:40:50 ah , my network is to blame 20:40:50 that took pretty long 20:41:04 +bf:] 20:41:07 +bf:->>+[}->+] 20:41:09 bfmemory[ 0 ] 255 bfmemory[ 171 ] 1 20:41:16 +bfdump: 20:41:16 that was the actual memory 20:41:17 yeah a mobius tape would be a tape where the polarity swaps every time you wrap 20:41:18 255 165 0 0 0 0 0 |1| 20:41:34 because you're incrementing "from the other side"...aka decrementing 20:41:38 so 254 become 1 and viceversa? 20:41:59 numbers don't change 20:42:05 just the meanings of + and - 20:42:19 mmm , if i revamp code some more , then i'll be able to do it easily 20:43:44 -!- ket1v has joined. 20:43:54 quintopia: that makes sense 20:45:57 -!- passwordBOT has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds). 20:47:19 -!- password2 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 20:49:34 -!- passwordBOT has joined. 20:49:35 -!- password2 has joined. 20:49:47 sorry , had to reboot internet 20:49:59 +bf:++ 20:50:14 -!- ket1v has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 20:50:20 +bf:++ 20:50:21 |2| 20:50:22 22:49 < password2> sorry , had to reboot internet <-- that wording suggests something else 20:50:34 +bf:<+ 20:50:37 +bfdump 20:50:37 |0| 20:50:54 +bfdump: is no longer required 20:50:55 |0| 20:51:01 oh, Ic séo 20:51:33 +bfset:annon 20:51:37 +bf:+++>> 20:51:37 Done and it took 5 cycles 20:51:37 3 0 |0| 20:51:41 +bfset:annon 20:51:43 +bfset:annoff 20:51:46 +bf:+++>> 20:51:50 Done and it took 5 cycles 20:51:50 3 0 |0| 20:52:50 anyone wanna see a mobius version? 20:53:07 I do 20:53:28 kay , i'll code it up 20:54:21 hopefully it wont take too long 20:55:34 damn , my bf class is at 420 lines already 20:56:04 um 20:56:12 what language 20:56:20 c++ 20:56:21 password2, blaze it 20:56:35 yeah i agree with taneb 20:57:45 ok , have cloned the class 20:57:53 no to do the inversions 20:58:23 should it be that +- == -+ ; {} == }{ ? 20:59:47 or how? 21:00:26 + and - swapped is enough 21:00:31 ok 21:01:54 actually, i wonder what bf joust would be like on a mobius tape (w/ wrapping instead of suiciding). making the flags equally spaced in BOTH directions of course 21:03:03 quintopia: let's test 21:03:26 http://virtuallyfun.superglobalmegacorp.com/?p=3910 21:03:28 -!- Bike_ has joined. 21:03:33 -!- passwordBOT has quit (Quit: Good). 21:03:39 -!- Bike_ has changed nick to Bicyclidine. 21:03:44 myname: okay i'll let you write it. be sure to make it blindingly fast. 21:03:44 should be done now 21:03:52 -!- passwordBOT has joined. 21:04:08 instes of starting cmd with +bf , use +bfmob 21:04:39 +bfmob:+[+>] 21:04:40 -!- ket1v has joined. 21:04:53 mmm 21:05:03 +bfmob:+[>+] 21:05:04 lol 21:05:06 hang on 21:05:28 +bfmob:-[>+]+[>-] 21:05:46 fogot to make an object of the class 21:05:52 oh wait that wouldn't work anyway 21:06:44 quintopia: like, written in assembly? 21:07:21 -!- passwordBOT has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 21:07:41 lets try again 21:07:44 -!- passwordBOT has joined. 21:07:48 +bfmob:+[+>] 21:07:48 myname: the current fastest bfjoust interpreter is in C. if you can beat gearlance, it's fast enough :D 21:07:57 +bfmoddump: 21:08:09 oh , signals , sigh 21:08:24 +bfmob:+[>+]-[>-] 21:08:33 it runs , here 21:08:38 dumping 21:08:38 "255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 " 21:08:47 but it cannot yet respond 21:08:56 -!- nisstyre_ has joined. 21:09:09 -!- passwordBOT has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 21:09:19 everything should now work 21:09:25 -!- passwordBOT has joined. 21:09:31 famous last words 21:09:37 +bfmob:+[>+]-[>-] 21:10:03 +bfmoddump: 21:10:17 +bfmobdump: 21:10:18 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 21:10:28 there we go 21:10:48 -!- elliott has set topic: a variety of colorful fish, but the darkness of no HackEgo | PSA: fizzie is running the wiki now, contact him for any problems | https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2023808/wisdom.pdf http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/ http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/. 21:10:53 +bfmobset:annon 21:11:18 +bfmob:+[>+]-[>-] 21:11:28 Done and it took 524289 cycles 21:11:28 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 21:11:37 that's not the result i expect 21:11:44 in inf loops it seems 21:11:54 seems wrong 21:12:06 fix it 21:12:14 elliott: the end of an era. 21:12:44 it was only two years 21:12:54 not every era is geologic! 21:13:11 quintopia, if you can say what the exact error is , sure 21:13:40 password2: the output should be 0 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 ... 21:15:55 quintopia: huh? 21:16:08 ah 21:16:19 maybe your right 21:16:26 +[>+] should be 0 255 255 255 ...? 21:16:45 -!- passwordBOT has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 21:17:01 i started in the swapped state 21:17:09 -!- passwordBOT has joined. 21:17:11 lol 21:17:11 * int-e wonders which bf dialect that is ... 21:17:25 int-e, a mobius one 21:17:29 int-e: bf on a möbius stripe, obviously 21:17:48 +bfmob:+[>+]-[>-] 21:17:57 I didn't pay attention, and "mob" is a word on its own. 21:18:30 o , almost different result 21:18:31 (which makes it sound like a multithreaded variant) 21:18:36 +bfmobdump: 21:18:37 1 255 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 254 21:18:49 if i make a flash clone that works on a mäbios stripe, will it be flash mob? 21:18:57 No. 21:19:12 myname: no you'll just be insane 21:19:25 quintopia: the problem being what? 21:19:36 writing a flash clone 21:19:48 well, yeah 21:19:55 but being insane shouldn't 21:20:49 password2: looks wrong 21:21:08 but i cant see any errors this side 21:21:13 +[>+] makes 257 + operations, the last being swapped 21:21:23 which results in |0| 1 1 1 ... 21:21:33 +bfmob:+[>+] 21:21:35 1 |0| 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 21:21:43 he's starting with + and - swapped 21:21:49 and swapping polarity too late 21:21:54 +bfmob:-[>-] 21:22:00 i already fixed that 21:22:07 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 21:22:28 +bfmob:+[>+] 21:22:34 1 |0| 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 21:22:44 i think I'll shrink the mem size a bit first 21:22:55 until i can figure out what is wrong 21:23:16 but you agree that +[>+] should result in |0| 1 1 1 ...? 21:23:40 i dont know what it should do 21:23:56 do you swap the polarity of +/- operations or do you actually negate the values? 21:23:59 well, it should just + until the end of the tape 21:24:08 wrap around 21:24:14 make a +, that is now a - 21:24:21 making the first cell to 0 21:24:25 leaving the rest at 1 21:24:35 i swap em 21:24:41 if you negate values on wraparound, |0| 255 255 255 ... would make sense. 21:24:42 -!- passwordBOT has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 21:25:44 ok mem size is now 32 cells 21:25:46 -!- passwordBOT has joined. 21:26:05 +bfmob:-<-<-<-< 21:26:09 +bfmobdump: 21:26:10 255 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 |0| 1 1 1 21:26:23 seems correct to me 21:26:30 +bdmod:+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 21:26:34 +bfmod:+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 21:26:44 -!- ket1v has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 21:26:49 +bfmob:+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ 21:26:50 |223| 21:26:57 what 21:27:02 cool. 21:27:12 that is not the right thing 21:27:23 mmm ,the polarity does not reset 21:27:30 hang on ... 21:27:35 lol :D 21:28:03 -!- passwordBOT has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 21:28:14 -!- conehead has joined. 21:28:19 +bfmob: +[>+] 21:28:22 -!- passwordBOT has joined. 21:28:22 hopefully everything will work now 21:28:26 +bfmob: +[>+] 21:28:32 +bfmobdump: 21:28:33 |0| 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 21:28:39 now that looks right 21:28:49 +bfmob: +[>+]-[>-] 21:28:50 |0| 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 21:29:07 yay 21:29:14 +bfmob:+[>+]>[>+] 21:29:18 0 1 |0| 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 21:29:33 +bfmob:[+[>+]>[>+]] 21:29:35 |0| 21:29:45 +bfmob:+[>+][>[>+]] 21:29:46 |0| 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 21:30:16 okay 21:30:46 +bfmob:+[>+]>[[->+<]>] 21:30:54 0 0 |108| 179 21:30:56 oh dear 21:31:07 that may have been inf loop 21:31:07 oops. 21:31:10 it was. 21:31:24 +bfmodsett:annon 21:31:32 +bfmobsett:annon 21:31:36 two t's? 21:31:39 +bfmob:+[>+]<[>[-<+>]<<] 21:31:40 |0| 31 21:31:48 yay 21:31:50 32, tape length? 21:31:53 yes 21:31:53 +bfmobset:annon 21:32:00 lol , not two 21:32:21 < password2> ok mem size is now 32 cells 21:35:02 do you want me to make it 255 again? 21:37:22 if I do something like mov [boner], ax 21:37:28 With a boner offset 21:37:32 What's the segment used? 21:37:35 Is it DS? 21:37:49 Like by default 21:38:21 yes 21:38:48 Thanks 21:38:51 ds is the default segment for most loads/stores 21:38:56 -!- passwordBOT has quit (Quit: Good). 21:39:15 -!- passwordBOT has joined. 21:39:32 What about C3? 21:39:42 +bfmoblist: 21:40:03 +bfmoblist: 21:40:05 Commands are +bfmoblist: +bfmob: +bfmobreset: +bfmobdump: +bfmobdumpascii:. bf mobius invert -+ upon tape looping. because you're incrementing "from the other side"...aka decrementing 21:40:07 boner offset sounda durty 21:40:20 -!- ket1v has joined. 21:41:07 Slereah_: I think something like mov [esp], ax will use ss instead of ds by default, but I'm not certain 21:41:22 I didn't know that DOS Navigator is open-source now, until I checked. I used that program some time ago! 21:42:11 -!- potato111 has joined. 21:42:14 Also for references involving bp/ebp, which might conceivably confuse someone using it as a general register. 21:42:17 Slereah_: oh, bp / ebp also... efb 21:43:05 and string instructions have their own rules, e.g. movsb moves from ds:si to es:di 21:43:08 http://stackoverflow.com/questions/3948961/what-segment-is-used-by-default-in-x86-indirect-addressing 21:44:44 I made up one other chess variant, but it is currently hidden pending review. 21:52:01 -!- Koen_ has joined. 21:53:20 -!- oerjan has joined. 21:59:56 -!- passwordBOT has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 22:01:19 -!- MoALTz has quit (Quit: Leaving). 22:06:42 Hey web programmers, an interesting thing is happening to me. 22:06:55 I tried to get on Something Awful and a notice popped up from Greyhound that the site is blocked. 22:07:13 maybe they think there's something awful there 22:07:15 The interesting part is, I'm sitting in a library and the nearest Greyhound stop is miles away. 22:07:46 fancy 22:08:18 i was riding the bus yesterday... did they like, censor my computer somehow 22:08:36 force reloading fixes it... god, what the fuck, though? 22:08:51 Browser caching, maybe? 22:09:11 I didn't try accessing something awful from the bus, though. 22:09:23 -!- augur has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 22:09:51 -!- augur has joined. 22:10:20 One of the websites I use has a truncated javascript file permanently stuck in the browser cache, somehow 22:10:38 Solved by using only that website with a different profile 22:10:53 Gregor: are you Scott Adams?/ 22:11:10 Sgeo, I don't know but I am Charles Adams 22:14:11 -!- boily has joined. 22:14:23 -!- augur has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 22:23:45 Taneb: morning. 22:24:28 boily, morning 22:24:39 How are you? 22:24:55 boily!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 22:24:58 ! 22:26:19 boilyn matanebin 22:27:40 it's evening here 22:29:55 -!- aloril has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 22:30:11 <-- how well it is doing compared to the programs on the size 50 hill. i don't think any of those have managed to get onto the hill yet. 22:30:14 oops 22:30:19 what does the score mean? <-- how well it is doing compared to the programs on the size 50 hill. i don't think any of those have managed to get onto the hill yet. 22:30:55 ok 22:31:00 that kinda make sense 22:31:24 quintopia: of course it's evening here, but it's morning. 22:31:26 i forgot to paste the quote (which i'm always doing last because it sometimes ends up containing a newline) 22:31:49 Taneb: doing well. I was with girlfriend. 22:31:56 quintopia: ???????????????????????????????????????? 22:32:04 (¿ also, to balance the ?) 22:32:06 boily, ooh that is good 22:32:18 boily: wanna go canoe the milk river with me 22:32:20 password2: the top score is usually around 50 or so iirc 22:32:25 !help bfjoust 22:32:26 ​Sorry, I have no help for bfjoust! 22:32:29 !help 22:32:30 ​help: General commands: !help, !info, !bf_txtgen. See also !help languages, !help userinterps. You can get help on some commands by typing !help . 22:32:36 !help languages 22:32:37 ​languages: Esoteric: 1l 2l adjust asm axo bch befunge befunge98 bf bf8 bf16 bf32 boolfuck cintercal clcintercal dimensifuck glass glypho haskell kipple lambda lazyk linguine malbolge pbrain perl qbf rail rhotor sadol sceql trigger udage01 underload unlambda whirl. Competitive: bfjoust fyb. Other: asm c cxx forth sh. 22:32:41 `relcome HackEgo 22:32:44 hm it doesn't say there 22:32:46 No output. 22:32:50 NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! 22:33:00 boily: well at least it's _there_ 22:33:05 quintopia: is it cold outside where the milk river is? 22:33:15 I'm adding input to my bf interpreter 22:33:26 oerjan: hm. let me rephrase the noooo. “MAYBEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!” 22:35:04 boily: not in the summer! 22:35:08 password2: http://codu.org/eso/bfjoust/report.txt is the current, top is just above 50 22:35:51 -!- metasepia has joined. 22:35:57 hm i guess the bottom three are from today's experimenting 22:35:57 how does a program get "up the hill" ? 22:36:19 they don't climb 22:36:23 well 22:36:23 password2: when you submit one, it fights against all the ones already there 22:36:29 they could but they usually don't 22:36:37 `run ls 22:36:38 No output. 22:36:39 :/ 22:36:43 `run echo hi 22:36:43 No output. 22:36:56 `help 22:36:56 Runs arbitrary code in GNU/Linux. Type "`", or "`run " for full shell commands. "`fetch " downloads files. Files saved to $PWD are persistent, and $PWD/bin is in $PATH. $PWD is a mercurial repository, "`revert " can be used to revert to a revision. See http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/ 22:36:57 and then the scores are recalculated 22:37:20 (using the points already stored, for fights between those already there) 22:37:34 ok 22:37:41 I wonder is we could manage to get fungot to submit a valid non-zero-scoring bfjoust program. 22:37:41 boily: when old age shall this generation waste, but did not become terrified. it is amusing to reflect that the silent pursuing gugs would not be the first to be approached by the several outsiders who took advantage of the fnord 22:37:51 the points are calculated by the big table on bottom 22:40:39 !bfjoust >>>>>>>>>[[-][-.]>] 22:40:39 ​Use: !bfjoust . Scoreboard, programs, and a description of score calculation are at http://codu.org/eso/bfjoust/ 22:40:54 !bfjoust dunno >>>>>>>>>[[-][-.]>] 22:40:57 ​Score for Taneb_dunno: 6.5 22:40:57 -!- passwordBOT has joined. 22:41:03 Well, that wasn't awful 22:41:19 +bf:,>.!fF0F 22:41:20 0 |0| 22:41:55 +bf:+,,>.!FF0F 22:41:56 what do . and , do in joust again? 22:41:56 Output is: 22:41:56 0 |0| 22:42:21 dammit , it just worked 22:42:26 Bicyclidine: “.” is wait. 22:42:28 +bf:,.>,.!3132 22:42:29 Output is: 12 22:42:29 49 |50| 22:43:27 +bf:+,,!FF 22:43:28 |0| 22:43:32 +bf:+,!FF 22:43:32 |0| 22:43:50 +bf:,[.,]!Hm... 22:43:54 |0| 22:44:07 NOPE 22:44:13 Bicyclidine: . is NOP, , is comment 22:44:16 it seems i am stil making an error somewhere in my code 22:44:20 +bfreset:,[.,]!Hm... 22:45:36 +bf:,>,>,>,.<.<.!Testing 22:45:37 Output is: 22:45:37 0 |0| 22:46:00 lots of them 22:46:06 +bf:,.!Testing 22:46:08 Output is: 22:46:08 |0| 22:46:26 +bf:++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++. 22:46:30 Output is: < 22:46:30 |60| 22:46:41 ^bf ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++. 22:46:41 < 22:46:46 well that one worked 22:47:04 output is sorted , its input that i m messing up 22:47:43 ^bf ,.,.,.!1234567890 22:47:43 123 22:47:55 oops 22:47:56 -!- passwordBOT has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 22:48:04 wrong bot 22:48:08 heh 22:48:24 -!- passwordBOT has joined. 22:48:33 +bf:,.,.,.!1234567890 22:48:36 |86| 22:49:02 +bf:,>.,>.,>.!1234567890 22:49:03 Output is: 22:49:03 18 52 86 |0| 22:49:12 fizzie: esolangs.org points to the right place for me now 22:49:19 it takes in hex , btw 22:49:28 +bf:,>.,>.,>.!ffffff 22:49:29 Output is: 22:49:29 0 0 0 |0| 22:49:36 +bf:,>,>,>,!1234567890 22:49:37 18 52 86 |0| 22:49:46 fizzie: also you might want to add something about hosting the wiki somewhere so people can bug you :p 22:49:50 -!- passwordBOT has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 22:49:53 password2: oh hex, how useless 22:50:04 shhh 22:50:04 ascii>hex 22:50:16 ascii only goes to 127 22:50:16 -!- passwordBOT has joined. 22:50:37 +bf:,!1F 22:50:42 +bf:,!1F 22:50:43 |0| 22:50:49 elliott: I've still got 42575 seconds left of the old IP address on my nearest DNS server. 22:50:50 imo extend to utf-8. 22:51:08 password2: extended ASCII 22:51:23 is the old address down, because the wiki loaded fine here 22:51:27 -!- passwordBOT has quit (Client Quit). 22:51:37 almost there 22:51:46 -!- passwordBOT has joined. 22:51:59 +bf:,!1F 22:52:01 +bf:,!1F 22:52:02 |0| 22:52:09 oerjan: Last I heard, it was read-only but not down. 22:52:28 -!- passwordBOT has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 22:52:39 sigh 22:52:46 -!- passwordBOT has joined. 22:52:48 fizzie: yeah, I'm surprised I got it so fast 22:52:59 oerjan: you can tell by going to http://esolangs.org/wiki/Special:RecentChanges and seeing if the latest change is by me. 22:53:08 +bf:,!1F 22:53:09 +bf:,!1F 22:53:09 |31| 22:53:14 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 22:53:24 elliott: well it is 22:53:30 there we go 22:53:52 does that mean it's the old or new one though 22:54:10 +bf:,<,<,<,<,<,!01020304050607 22:54:11 1 22:54:39 oops 22:54:39 oerjan: old one 22:55:17 +bf:>,>,>,>,>,>,>!01020304050607 22:55:18 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 |0| 22:56:00 +bf:>,>,>,>,>,>,>!0f0Ff0F0ffFF 22:56:00 0 15 15 240 240 255 255 |0| 22:56:06 ok 22:56:08 I'm happy 22:56:10 and tired 22:56:45 1 o clock is a good time to pass out 22:57:24 +bf:,[.,]!486578207375636b73 22:57:25 Output is: Hex sucks 22:57:25 |0| 22:57:47 well done it 22:57:50 rolf 22:58:28 i might add a input type flag later 22:58:47 mmm , or use a @ for ascii input 22:59:06 you realize ! is the standard so it should work normally hth 22:59:53 you 23:00:07 but input is not that major to me 23:00:20 but i ma switch it around 23:00:32 just not now 23:00:55 -!- nooodl has quit (Quit: Ik ga weg). 23:01:38 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 23:04:34 +bf:+>+>+>+>+>+>+>+>+>+>+><<<<<<<<<<<(+) 23:04:34 |11| 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 23:04:45 heh , i love (+) 23:05:18 (+)? 23:05:21 i should use that in my Fibonacci 23:05:35 () is relative version of [ ] 23:05:47 so that (+) finds the first zero 23:06:02 that sounds too complicated for bf 23:06:07 :p 23:06:09 i added it 23:06:19 +bflist: 23:06:20 Commands are +bflist: +bf: +bfreset: +bfdump: +bfdumpascii:. This bf interpreter has pointer too!Type +bfop: for a qiuck list 23:06:29 oops 23:06:34 +bfop: 23:06:35 brainfuck^ opperators are []()<>+-{},. () is like [] except it uses the value the current cell points to , {} is like -+ except it dec/inc the value the cell points to 23:08:09 +bf:+>+<(+}) 23:08:15 |2| 1 0 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 255 23:08:48 hehe 23:08:52 ok I'm out 23:08:55 for real now 23:08:58 * password2 ***** 23:09:02 -!- passwordBOT has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 23:09:27 -!- password2 has quit (Quit: Leaving). 23:11:32 coppro: indirection seems like a nice feature that isn't overly complicated. it'd kinda be cool if bfjoust had it. it'd make golfed warriors a lot more powerful 23:12:34 now i kinda want to make a bf^joust twitterbot 23:12:53 130 character warriors only! 23:14:18 indirection would be interesting in bfjoust, definitely 23:14:25 but it's not a fundamental bf feature 23:14:35 -!- nisstyre_ has quit (Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3). 23:14:35 -!- nisstyre has quit (Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3). 23:17:34 ...by definition\ 23:28:11 -!- kcahsbor2 has joined. 23:29:07 wikileaks.org 23:29:15 -!- tromp has joined. 23:29:28 kcahsbor2: what 23:29:46 kcashbor: What about Wikileaks? 23:30:04 elliott, there was someone similar in the Haskell channel a few minutes ago 23:30:05 i don't see any releases since january. 23:30:12 -!- ChanServ has set channel mode: +o elliott. 23:30:15 -!- elliott has kicked kcahsbor2 kcahsbor2. 23:30:17 -!- elliott has set channel mode: -o elliott. 23:30:31 wow way to prop up the ruling hegemony. 23:31:30 -!- nisstyre has joined. 23:33:22 -!- nisstyre has quit (Client Quit). 23:35:20 -!- nisstyre has joined. 23:38:44 it's what i'd've done 23:39:43 wikipedia.org 23:40:16 jerkcity.com 23:40:56 /kick Taneb 23:42:49 http://31.media.tumblr.com/f970070fceb0518bb01ca9e2bb84f10f/tumblr_n2octpAQfj1snfhwio1_1280.jpg it's like, why continue with the artform after its peak 23:51:37 -!- ket1v has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds).