00:00:30 I was hoping that the wtf was the W3Schools site 00:00:32 We discussed that the other month. 00:01:00 they did forget the "FILE_NOT_FOUND" result though. 00:01:01 At least those strings are truthy and "" is falsey 00:01:29 Actually, that could be worse... it might act like a boolean for a little while 00:01:35 You really have to work at it to get more than a "maybe" out of Chrome, since so many formats support all kinds of unlikely codecs. 00:01:50 AFK 00:02:58 Sometimes if you specify the codec it will say "probably", e.g. for 'audio/webm;codecs="vorbis"'. 00:04:02 -!- Bicyclidine has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 00:04:45 hmm "this combination does not make sense but we'll take our chances anyway?" 00:05:44 nah, that's not it. 00:05:46 * int-e shrugs 00:06:14 audio/webm is officially only Vorbis, anyway, so the codec specification is slightly superfluous. 00:07:00 I'm stupidly mixing up "maybe 00:07:04 " and "probably" 00:07:43 "Generally, a user agent should never return "probably" for a type that allows the codecs parameter if that parameter is not present." 00:08:11 makes sense, actually 00:10:01 But nevertheless, I find those return values ridiculous. If they wanted to express levels of certainty, why didn't they specify to return a float between 0 and 1? 00:10:53 What are your feelings on "0 but true"? 00:11:02 Then at least I could probe all the types I have and pick the one that the browser considers best. 00:12:28 -!- bb010g has joined. 00:12:51 0.0 is true? 00:13:13 No, I meant the Perl handling of the string "0 but true". 00:13:16 I love Java, especially how Java EE follows all best practices. "Returns an array containing all of the Cookie objects the client sent with this request. This method returns null if no cookies were sent." 00:13:21 ffff 00:13:29 Even if you wanted efficiency 00:13:41 You can't spare a constant zero-length array so you don't make your users cry? 00:13:54 I bet the thought process was "oh, we should special case the zero case, our one-or-more code doesn't work" 00:14:04 Then someone's brain broke and put "return null" there instead of the sensible thing. 00:14:23 fizzie: it's a reasonable hack that takes something that could be done anyway, and tweaks the warnings system to match common practice 00:15:02 Lymia: didn't you see the sarcastic smiley! (I knew I forgot something.) 00:15:57 * Lymia tilt head 00:18:04 fizzie: I'm not too happy with perl's idea that the string "0" is false. 00:18:08 -!- brandons1 has joined. 00:18:54 but "00" isn't. Heh. 00:22:06 -!- brandonson has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds). 00:22:27 I don't like that either (and PHP is bad at those kind of things too) 00:28:10 My opinion is best is "" is false and "0" is true 00:49:51 "" and "0" as booleans should be mu 00:50:12 Also, if I hate cold weather, how bad of an idea is a trip to Svalbard 00:50:30 Do they have hot showers in Svalbard? 00:52:06 Aren't there Norway people in here? 01:00:02 Is Oerjan people? 01:07:31 -!- HackEgo has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 01:08:25 -!- skarn has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 01:22:59 -!- hjulle_ has joined. 01:24:37 http://vindinium.org/ would a client for humans be legal? 01:26:29 -!- shikhout has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 01:27:59 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds). 01:34:42 -!- skarn has joined. 01:36:38 If the worst news I had today was just that my originally desired trip to the eclipse was fully booked, I would be happy 02:00:53 -!- MoALTz_ has joined. 02:03:23 -!- MoALTz has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 02:24:42 -!- nys has quit (Quit: sleep). 02:32:35 -!- impomatic_ has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 02:36:50 Anyways... which is colder? Svalbard or Alaska? 02:37:40 is this why you wanted to know whether iceland had subways :p 02:38:47 That was when I was under the impression that the Iceland trip wasn't fully booked 02:39:12 Eclipse from plane + aurora borealis sounds ideal 02:39:24 s/Iceland/Faroe Islands/ 02:46:56 So, choices are try for eclipse+aurora in Svalbard, or just settle for aurora in Alaska 02:47:13 Don't want to try for eclipse on the land of the Faroe Islands, heard there's bad weather 02:50:26 "Armed guards will be on hand in case a polar bear should wander near and we provide warm drinks to keep the cold from your bones. " 02:54:36 -!- MDude has quit (Read error: No route to host). 02:55:34 Oh, the Svalbard trip I was looking at is sold out too 02:56:47 Or... actually, might only be the option with flight from Oslo 02:57:00 Not sure 03:00:22 -!- MDude has joined. 03:01:29 travelling to svalbard but avoiding other places due to bad weather... 03:04:03 clouds are worse than being cold, when it comes to viewing a solar eclipse 03:04:17 what about bears? 03:04:38 I can only hope the armed guards know what they're doing 03:06:09 "armed guards" might be referring to the panserbjørne... 03:07:03 armoured bears? 03:11:47 His Dark Materials reference. sorry. 03:13:07 Ah. I thought you were referring to something real, like some sort of governmental anti-bear patrol, which happened to have the same name as some His Dark Materials thing 03:13:11 >.> 03:24:11 [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Rodolvertice * New user account 03:42:52 -!- ^v has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 03:44:39 wow, I just got spam saying (NOT A SPAM) in the subject line 03:45:38 -!- ^v has joined. 04:15:28 -!- idris-bot has quit (Quit: Terminated). 05:04:44 -!- idris-bot has joined. 05:10:23 -!- brandons1 has quit (Quit: WeeChat 0.4.3-dev). 05:30:23 -!- FreeFull has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 05:33:07 -!- MDude has changed nick to MDream. 05:39:26 I have a book titled "Pope-Pourri". It inclueds a list of some saints and their specialties, which include: communists; protection from fools, clowns, and idiots; protection from freethinkers; stuttering; vampires; children who are late in learning to walk; sick chickens; servants who break things; those who are insane... 06:04:55 -!- ais523 has quit. 06:05:11 -!- ais523 has joined. 06:09:42 -!- centrinia has joined. 06:09:59 I can convert Brainfuck to Whitespace: https://gist.github.com/Centrinia/2836820aaf12e048e320 06:10:40 I was hoping it was written in befunge :( 06:22:30 [wiki] [[FakeASM]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=40711&oldid=40710 * CosmoConsole * (+33) 06:23:25 -!- hjulle has joined. 06:23:49 -!- hjulle_ has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!). 06:27:46 [wiki] [[Language list]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=40712&oldid=40664 * CosmoConsole * (+14) adding [[FakeASM]] 06:30:19 [wiki] [[Hello world program in esoteric languages]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=40713&oldid=40656 * CosmoConsole * (+46) [[FakeASM]] 06:31:35 [wiki] [[FakeASM]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=40714&oldid=40711 * CosmoConsole * (+1) /* FakeASM2 */ I hate editing w/ mobile 06:37:11 [wiki] [[FakeASM]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=40715&oldid=40714 * CosmoConsole * (+1) /* Debug mode */ typos. my only weakness 06:40:02 these change messages are quite entertaining 06:40:37 at least i know what to do once i become a villan 06:41:07 [wiki] [[FakeASM]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=40716&oldid=40715 * CosmoConsole * (+2) /* Instruction list */ WSD fix 06:48:45 http://thejh.net/misc/website-terminal-copy-paste 07:06:39 -!- oerjan has joined. 07:13:43 -!- impomatic_ has joined. 07:28:01 int-e: I've sent a solution so now you won't be the first <-- ah, i'd been wondering if "jonas" was you... 07:32:18 oops, the hungarians are breeding 07:32:40 (hi nyuszika7h) 07:33:35 I think the hungarians have been breeding for a very long time 07:34:20 but ON THE CHANNEL? 07:35:36 they're breeding in here? ew. 07:37:40 i see you have also discovered the danger of hinting to int-e that things are possible 07:38:21 http://codepad.org/M6k4nhGu 07:39:59 centrinia: is that a whitespace program 07:40:02 oerjan: have you been bitten by that too? 07:40:10 oerjan: Yes. 07:40:26 I converted a Brainfuck program to that. :p 07:40:37 https://gist.github.com/Centrinia/2836820aaf12e048e320 :p 07:41:21 elliott: only slightly, i tried to obliquely hint that there was a more efficient way of making local definitions in golfing, and he quickly guessed i was referring to pattern guards 07:44:03 somehow, though, i've yet to actually make an optimal golf solution that uses them 07:44:12 iirc 07:45:09 hm yet another person who prefers explicit braces in haskell. i think you're more common than people claim. 07:45:47 Haskell benefits from not having to be whitespace-sensitive 07:45:53 who? 07:46:02 elliott: see centrinia's gist 07:46:20 elliott: do /I/ get to complain at /you/ for not following links? 07:46:29 that would seem very out of character for both of us 07:46:58 hmm, that's not doing the polynomial optimization, is it? 07:47:19 also, github has a big signup advert at the bottom of gists too 07:47:28 I didn't realise it was in response to the link 07:47:30 it annoys and depresses me that they are this desperate for users 07:47:38 oerjan: I might be inconsistent about what nick I use on anagolf among "jonas" and "b_jonas" 07:47:41 I should try to stick to one 07:47:48 ais523: it's not really an ad so much as the submit a comment form 07:48:08 the homepage is definitely an ad, though 07:48:17 yeah, I'm definitely inconsistent, damn 07:48:40 but I think if you wait a few more days, some of the regulars on anagolf will submit a shorter perl 07:48:46 well, okay, it is an ad too, but it serves a purpose 07:50:01 oerjan: I prefer explicit braces in haskell too 07:51:07 hm 07:52:52 mind you, with all the pattern matching in function heads and the pointfree style, some haskell code contains very few braces, explicit or implicit 07:55:52 -!- MoALTz_ has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 07:57:53 right 08:00:26 Article about BANCStar says "Not known if strings index from 0 or from 1". I believe it is from 1. 08:01:10 There are things known about BANCStar? 08:02:22 Sgeo: there's been huge archaelogical investigation into BANCstar 08:02:29 I'm not sure what people are using as sources 08:02:31 Awesome 08:02:50 I once completely failed to get the presumed current owners to give any documentation 08:04:04 This means that "10829,2446,22245,22012" in C16LNAPP.SCN would set the "Financial Summary?" variable to "N", which seems sensible given the context. 08:04:58 experimentation? 08:05:06 Someone has a BANCstar interpreter? 08:05:22 As far as anyone knows, nobody has an implementation. 08:05:28 Because, it got lost. 08:07:56 What if the top secret proprietary information in the sample ends up getting revealed? 08:08:25 Sgeo: I already figured out some of it actually 08:09:54 centrinia: looking briefly over it, i think your optimize will not handle >++ 08:10:23 because the Advance gets stuck between the Increments 08:11:57 I am guessing that command 3100 will result in an error (requiring you to retype the input) if the condition isn't true. 08:12:08 oerjan: It outputs p[1] += 2; p+=1; 08:12:23 centrinia: huh 08:12:36 So it does optimize. 08:12:44 There is a fixedPoint function. 08:12:48 oh hm 08:13:09 But the optimize function does need some work. 08:13:21 oh ic 08:14:25 The Whitespace output is not very optimal. :"> 08:15:42 ais523 pointed out you weren't doing "polynomial" optimization 08:15:49 but that's fancy stuff imo 08:16:31 I guess it does linear optimization. 08:17:49 It converts while(*p) { *p--; p[i1] += inc1; } to p[i1] += inc1 * *p; *p = 0; 08:17:54 And the like. 08:17:54 oerjan: it's needed to be competitive with the better BF optimizers 08:18:11 meanwhile, RLE optimization is pretty basic, even fungot does that 08:18:11 ais523: I am working on it. 08:18:11 ais523: but cyrus! are you leaving! nothing here using the dna from animals, only the 3 entities you saw will help you leave, crono?!! you brought back my cat! thank you, crono! 08:18:32 oh your "isStationary" is basically the same as "checking all loops are balanced", but it needs to be applied after the optimizations that move Advance? 08:19:15 I think some kind of de-tapeification optimisation would be interesting. 08:19:24 something that tries and extracts underlying variables and maybe even data structures. 08:19:48 The wiki says that 2999 introduces a new page. I think rather, a prompt with the response field's position being given as a negative number ends a page. 08:19:57 elliott: Wouldn't that involve dry runs of the program? 08:19:58 (This makes it even less clear what "stop code" really means.) 08:20:23 centrinia: I don't see why 08:20:36 oerjan: isStationary is used in very experimental parts of the code. :p 08:20:58 Does polynomial optimization work on something like this? http://codepad.org/BWiQokT1 08:21:44 elliott: that's just called decompilation 08:22:02 Jafet: sure. 08:22:10 Sgeo: jloughry may have one @BANCStar 08:22:21 centrinia: i think it can handle all balanced loops in principle? 08:22:36 But the last thing I've heard from him was him trying to rescue something from a floppy disk 08:22:37 I thought as much. 08:22:49 which he told me was somewhat corrupt. 08:22:56 Since then I haven't heard from him again. 08:23:49 I've also tracked the company down that now acquired (through various steps) the company behind BANCStar 08:23:56 but they haven't answered to my e-mails 08:26:27 Apparentely there also was a developer manual that they have written for themselves 08:26:46 (They reverse engineered bancstar and documented what they have found out) 08:27:14 However, he couldn't find a copy of that. 08:28:00 So I don't know how to get more information about it anymore ;) 08:28:28 the only idea I have left is ask jloughry about other people that worked with BANCStar 08:28:40 (i.e. work colleagues of him) 08:28:52 and then contact them and ask if they somehow have something laying around :D 08:29:32 I think there might be some shorthand to set stdout to binary/latin-1? <-- we compared those, setBinaryMode ... True is actually longer than using setEncoding ... utf8 08:30:00 and utf8 is shorter than char8 08:30:03 > (length "setBinaryMode ...$1==1", length "setEncoding ... utf8") 08:30:04 mroman: Well, a lot of things I figured out are contrary to what is on the wiki and I am making a list of them on the talk page right now. 08:30:05 (22,20) 08:30:09 hmm 08:30:11 what's the shortest True? 08:30:16 1>0 08:30:24 okay so it can't compete I guess 08:30:55 -!- impomatic_ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 08:31:07 oh forgot the h prexix, it's hSetBinaryMode and hSetEncoding 08:38:28 Which Brainfuck compilers do full-blown polynomial optimization? 08:38:38 esotope for one 08:38:53 polynomial optimization? 08:38:54 https://code.google.com/p/esotope-bfc/ 08:39:07 now I'm wondering "what's the shortest true in Prolog" 08:39:09 I know some trivial optimizations 08:39:25 basically because you might be able to use ! but it has horrendous side effects 08:39:43 esotope generated this: http://codepad.org/gXW1K2ma 08:39:53 Eliminating -+ and the [ after ]... and <> etc 08:39:56 I suspect that the loop can be completely removed. 08:40:21 ais523: isn't in some sense the empty predicate true 08:40:50 but i guess that cannot be used everywhere 08:40:54 oerjan: no, the empty predicate is fail; the simplest possible nonempty predicate is true 08:40:59 or, well, I see what you mean 08:40:59 Oh, BF->C, not BF->BF 08:41:09 I guess you could just do "t." and then use t instead of true 08:41:11 centrinia: note that there are two esotopes :/ 08:41:14 you want the one I linked 08:41:16 that's three characters even if you only use it once 08:41:49 elliott: That was the one you linked. :( 08:41:52 ais523: well i also mean, that many times when you would want to use t, you can just leave it out 08:42:11 ah, okay 08:42:12 oerjan: yes, but the same is true of booleans in lots of other cases 08:44:14 centrinia: hm indeed, so then it doesn't do full polynomials in that case 08:46:54 mind you, while i _think_ you can optimize all balanced loops into direct formulas, you are going to need modulus arithmetic and stuff in general 08:47:05 especially if cells are bounded wrapping 08:47:31 or wait hm 08:48:17 that is not true. you can do exponentiation in a balanced way, i should know since that was the only way i saw to convert input properly for 3-cell bf. 08:48:34 so there are probably limits 08:49:06 (i have _still_ not found a way to do proper output, mind you.) 08:49:19 What do you mean? 08:51:11 centrinia: [->[->++<]>[-<+>]<<] will multiply the second cell by 2 to the power of the first, essentially 08:51:21 (with 3rd cell starting as zero) 08:51:37 so it's not describably by just a polynomial 08:51:40 *e 08:52:11 um 08:52:37 yes 08:53:39 centrinia: also, i once proved that brainfuck is turing-complete with just 3 unbounded cells, you can find the details at http://esolangs.org/Collatz_function 08:54:04 oerjan: http://codepad.org/10Gxjwwm 08:56:16 centrinia: yes, and that still contains a loop. also it's not very optimal even inside the loop, especially lines 4 and 5 should be easily combined? 08:56:44 Well, yeah. :p 08:58:03 This is equivalent: http://codepad.org/B8gxa2Hc 09:00:19 oerjan: does three-cell collatz in BF use unbounded loops? 09:00:22 err, unbalanced 09:00:35 nope 09:00:45 so that's even stronger proof you cannot make a formula 09:02:34 http://codepad.org/f8sZl9wf 09:02:44 centrinia: that's a lot of duplication of code just to avoid having p[2] = 0 in the inner loop 09:02:51 (the previous one) 09:02:58 Well, it is one unroll. 09:03:13 But it allows for assignments. :) 09:03:41 http://codepad.org/8zsFbPyS 09:05:00 oh well 09:05:19 although i was really intending for p[2] == 0 to start with 09:05:29 Oh, that is true. 09:05:37 But my optimizer doesn't know that. :( 09:05:47 It doesn't know that p[2] has not been touched. 09:06:34 i recall back when pikhq did similar stuff, he optimized the whole program with the assumption things started as 0. 09:07:11 -!- mihow has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 09:08:56 -!- mihow has joined. 09:09:30 [wiki] [[Talk:BANCStar]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=40717&oldid=40092 * Zzo38 * (+1725) 09:09:35 i think he had a dictionary of cells with known values 09:09:45 or something like that 09:10:01 I still cannot quite figure out "combination goto" 09:15:05 fizzie: what is "chocobi-C" 09:15:09 [wiki] [[Talk:BANCStar]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=40718&oldid=40717 * Zzo38 * (+96) 09:16:29 oh never mind 09:20:22 -!- shikhin has joined. 09:22:17 -!- ais523 has quit. 09:24:27 similarly you can strip out the final newline if you are submitting the program by upload, though I don't know whether that's still counted or not <-- it's even easier on the form, of course 09:39:33 oerjan: lol, hi 09:40:09 * oerjan waves 09:40:51 -!- drdanmaku has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity). 09:55:19 [wiki] [[Talk:FakeASM]] N http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=40719 * Rdebath * (+287) /* Um Esoteric Language ? */ new section 09:58:53 http://www.windytan.com/2014/10/visualizing-hex-bytes-with-unicode-emoji.html 10:16:25 isn't http://esolangs.org/wiki/Lenguage sort of like http://esolangs.org/wiki/Unary except compressed more efficiently? 10:16:51 and wasn't there a third brainfuck variant simliar to these, but with exclamation marks? 10:17:24 oerjan: Where I copied it from, though I guess you already guessed that. 10:18:03 [wiki] [[Unary]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=40720&oldid=38803 * B jonas * (+15) /* See also */ 10:18:15 ah right, http://esolangs.org/wiki/Unary#See_also actually links to a few others 10:25:00 -!- boily has joined. 10:38:24 like unary, except compressed more efficiently, sounds like a plan. 10:38:44 -!- FreeFull has joined. 10:41:00 oerjan: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Golunar is very much that, too. 10:43:06 fizzie: yes, that, and http://esolangs.org/wiki/Unary links to http://esolangs.org/wiki/MGIFOS and http://esolangs.org/wiki/Ellipsis as well, which are all variants of the same thing 10:43:17 wait 10:43:25 Yes, though Golunar adds another layer of pointlessness. 10:43:32 Intel doesn't publish all bugs in its processors 10:43:44 The provided converter doesn't even construct the corresponding unary string. :/ 10:43:47 some information can only be obtained under an NDA agreement for OEMs 10:43:50 this is why creating new brainfuck variants should be banned 10:44:54 mroman: just more evidence for my theory that we're toast the moment the first real cyber war starts 10:48:02 That's pretty much clear, yes. 10:48:11 -!- centrinia has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 10:48:56 I guess it shouldn't be really hard for a country to ruin another countries economy just by doing some cyber attacks on some companies and infrastructure in that country 10:49:06 *country's 10:50:03 Cyber war oughta be much cheaper than conventional war? 10:50:21 Military equipment (bombs, ships, tanks) are really expensive. 10:51:04 that being said: You can have the cleverest hacker and try to hack some other bigger country 10:51:16 chances are they won't respond with a cyber war but with a few drone strikes 10:51:32 I'm not sure who's better off then. 10:52:23 (by cyber war I mean "war" not the "spy" thing that's going on already anyway) 10:57:45 fungot: How do you think about cyber war? 10:57:45 mroman: by thy leave, crono?!! you brought back my cat! thank you, crono! crono...! there was nothing i could do! we must get help from guardia kingdom, and my ultimate creation, the mighty lavos! haahahahaha! fools! i only ride with him, you are gentle, isn't he? 10:57:53 ^style qwantz 10:57:53 Selected style: qwantz (Dinosaur Comics transcriptions 2003-2011) 10:57:55 fungot: How do you think about cyber war? 10:57:56 mroman: the second was mental. engaged to be married to an older and handsome t-rex to confront their greatest fear: becoming separated from each other and then make a mental note, i'm going back to bed, falling asleep, and this world to get worked! 10:58:29 fungot: there was a first and second cyber war? 10:58:29 mroman: t-rex, that sounds like a crazy friday as weekend, why not monday too? 10:58:41 ^style 10:58:41 Available: agora alice c64 ct darwin discworld enron europarl ff7 fisher fungot homestuck ic irc iwcs jargon lovecraft nethack oots pa qwantz* sms speeches ss wp youtube 10:58:54 ^style discworld 10:58:54 Selected style: discworld (a subset of Terry Pratchett's Discworld books) 10:58:58 I don't really know what I'm doing in this vision/graphics practical 10:58:59 fungot: hi 10:58:59 mroman: oats sat and listened. that's not what i wanted out of life. sooner or later, i've got to hand it to petulia. she spotted a gap in the things they said. 10:59:12 It seems to be saying I can use MATLAB to turn an image into some pretty graphs 10:59:19 Without explaining why the graphs are useful 11:02:06 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: Later). 11:03:50 Taneb: they are pretty. that's where their usefulness lies. 11:04:52 (seriousness of proposition depends on which kind of class and/or department this is.) 11:07:28 fungot: bon matin. enjoying some gapspotting? 11:07:28 boily: " i was only a sweeper's shrine!' and use the corpse as a swing. 11:08:21 corpse swingin', gap spottin', shrine sweepin' fungot. 11:08:22 boily: he was vaguely aware that there was this about agnes's shape. it was of a huge wooden horse. more correctly, argument. 11:13:02 -!- centrinia has joined. 11:13:48 `relcome centrinia 11:14:10 oh, no HackEgo. 11:14:12 Hmm. 11:14:25 didn't we have a backup `relcome somewhere? 11:14:44 Hi, centrinia, this is the channel for Esoteric Programming Languages! Check out our wiki at http://www.esolangs.org 11:14:55 -!- HackEgo has joined. 11:14:57 If you wanted the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on irc.dal.net 11:14:59 That's better. 11:15:04 (how did I do) 11:15:11 Taneb: Too monochromatic. 11:15:21 Also there is a backup welcome in fungot, but no backup relcome. 11:15:21 fizzie: " ass," said 11:15:28 fungot: Don't you be giving me any lip. 11:15:29 fizzie: the show must go on"! what's so special about lord hong, watching the world go by. when they were in some dark alley, his stomach was full of this big, solid men, the kind of commander who comes up with all the treasure we want,' whispered bilious. 11:16:19 I think I tried fitting a relcome in, but the low ul/bf output length limits combined with the color codes made it inpractical. 11:16:36 ^show 11:16:36 echo reverb rev rot13 rev2 fib wc ul cho choo pow2 source help hw srmlebac uenlsbcmra scramble unscramble asc ord prefixes tmp test celebrate wiki chr ha rainbow rainbow2 welcome me tell eval elikoski list ping def a thanks tmp2 8ball 11:16:44 ^welcome just_testing 11:16:44 just_testing: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page. (For the other kind of es ... 11:17:04 See, even without colors it's incomplete. 11:17:30 Taneb: you should go the myndzi way, and embrace your inner cyborg. 11:22:00 -!- boily has quit (Quit: VIRIDIAN CHICKEN). 11:23:55 -!- heroux has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 11:24:30 -!- heroux_ has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 11:25:56 -!- FreeFull_ has joined. 11:55:55 -!- shikhin has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 11:56:39 -!- shikhin has joined. 12:41:10 -!- centrinia has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds). 12:54:22 -!- HackEgo has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 12:55:37 -!- ais523 has joined. 12:56:56 -!- yorick has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 12:56:59 -!- lambdabot has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 12:56:59 -!- kline has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 12:58:15 -!- kline has joined. 12:58:30 -!- yorick has joined. 13:02:31 -!- lambdabot has joined. 13:08:03 -!- ais523 has quit. 13:09:14 -!- HackEgo has joined. 13:23:27 -!- HackEgo has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 13:34:48 -!- contrapumpkin has joined. 13:36:21 -!- copumpkin has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 13:37:06 -!- Sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 13:38:03 -!- HackEgo has joined. 13:41:02 -!- `^_^v has joined. 13:42:21 -!- HackEgo has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 13:50:39 -!- contrapumpkin has changed nick to copumpkin. 14:03:02 -!- HackEgo has joined. 14:16:37 why does "git add *.java" add recursively 14:16:42 but "git add *.sh" does not? 14:18:35 You might be using a shell that does expansions weirdly. It may expand *.java to "*.java" when no files happened to match (instead of an error) but *.sh to "foo.sh" "bar.sh" "baz.sh" when files happened to match. 14:19:40 “setopt bad_pattern” to make zsh behave nicer. 14:19:58 Wait, no, setopt nomatch. 14:42:19 git does its own globbing? >_O 14:42:33 Is there no depth of stupidity to which this tool will not sink? O_< 14:46:32 -!- Sprocklem has joined. 14:49:16 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 15:04:15 -!- Sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 15:11:01 -!- drdanmaku has joined. 15:15:48 -!- Sprocklem has joined. 15:28:55 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 15:49:35 -!- nisstyre has quit (Quit: WeeChat 1.0.1). 15:51:57 -!- nisstyre has joined. 15:55:23 -!- Akhu has joined. 15:55:57 -!- Akhu has quit (Client Quit). 15:57:24 -!- heroux has joined. 15:58:50 https://gitorious.org/eternity-prj/eternityvision/source/524686c237f2f85c19b2e33a5ee5ca7a7a06a74d:Documentation/scheduler/sched-BFS.txt 16:01:17 ion: that seems to be the thing, yes 16:06:00 Gregor: why shouldn't git do globbing? 16:06:16 Because of exactly the problem you just found. 16:06:31 for example 16:06:34 rm *.log will fail 16:06:40 if you have like 10K log files in a directory 16:06:40 If two tools solve the same problem in slightly different ways and present a result that makes it nonobvious which tool solved the problem, you will blame the wrong tool for the bug. 16:06:57 because your shell will expand that to a too long command line 16:07:31 which means I'd prefer if rm would just use *.log as a filter 16:07:45 The fact that globbing in the shell can cause too-long command lines is no reason to go to the DOS dark ages of globbing @_@ 16:08:22 It's more important that its behavior be consistent than robust, especially when the expense is making robustness a problem for every conceivable tool rather than one. 16:09:24 for all I care the OS should provide an API for that 16:10:13 with iterator style stuff 16:10:15 The OS does provide an API for that, it's called glob(). But git wants its own globbing behavior, so it doesn't use glob(). Thus, it gets inconsistent behavior. If everyone used glob(), then the behavior would be the same, except that bugs are now spread across thousands of programs instead of one. 16:10:40 so you don't run out of memory if you happen to have so many files that a char** of filenames wouldn't fit into memory 16:10:42 (Also there would be no way to explicitly name a file with stars in it) 16:10:53 -!- nisstyre has quit (Changing host). 16:10:53 -!- nisstyre has joined. 16:11:14 well 16:11:22 some OSes don't allow * in file names anyway 16:11:23 ;D 16:12:16 Did you mean "if everyone used glob() (from the OS)" 16:12:22 or "if everyone used his own glob"? 16:12:58 also the OS might allow to escape * 16:15:19 like BefungeOS 16:15:43 fungot: are you running on a BefungeOS server? 16:15:43 mroman: cohen shrugged, and shook his head, and strode away. now the best efforts of the official history?' said 16:18:30 unary 16:18:46 Ooknary is the same as unary but replaces 0 with Ook 16:30:19 -!- MDream has changed nick to MDude. 16:38:56 promptfile->type = atoi(secondtoken); /* and convert them into */ 16:39:11 prompt_type[prompt[i].type]); 16:39:32 if the prompt-type can be 2304 16:39:36 wouldn't this segfault? 16:39:51 prompt_type is a char[9] 16:40:44 (first one is from L_RDPROM.C line 88) 16:41:02 second is from L_REPORT.c:498 16:42:36 -!- dianne has quit (Quit: ~). 16:42:58 Gregor: I believe git does globbing itself because the shell can't glob inside trees and such. 16:43:04 zzo38: prompt types are colors 16:43:29 Gregor: not that that matters for git add. 16:43:49 but it makes some sense if you think of git(1) as providing an interface to a filesystem that the OS/shell doesn't know about. 16:44:32 "If everyone used glob(), then the behavior would be the same, except that bugs are now spread across thousands of programs instead of one. 16:44:35 " 16:44:37 tbf this isn't really very compelling 16:44:41 because this is already the case with, like, getopt 16:44:47 [wiki] [[Talk:BANCStar]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=40721&oldid=40718 * 160.85.232.177 * (+200) + prompt type 16:44:53 (you could say that's an argument for centralising option parsing instead, though) 16:45:04 -!- dianne has joined. 16:45:27 -!- edwardk has left ("Leaving..."). 17:21:50 -!- shikhin has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 17:44:36 http://i.4cdn.org/x/1414647728741.png 17:48:15 Oh, wrong channel. 17:54:54 -!- MDude has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 18:12:12 -!- FreeFull_ has quit. 18:13:01 elliott, Gregor: Similarly, I can give globs to yum in paths to whatprovides, and in package names, neither of which are accessible to the shell. You *always* need to know which program is interpreting the glob. This is why one should set failglob if using bash. 18:13:56 I have some sympathy for Windows' model where programs get to interpret everything. 18:14:10 I have more sympathy for a model that moves more to the shell and lets programs hook into it better, though. 18:14:33 (I mean, {bash,zsh}-completions is already a thing.) 18:21:31 -!- MoALTz has joined. 18:29:28 [wiki] [[Language list]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=40722&oldid=40712 * 83.101.88.18 * (+13) /* S */ 18:31:44 [wiki] [[Strato]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=40723&oldid=40695 * 83.101.88.18 * (+42) 18:36:17 -!- Sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 18:52:42 -!- Sprocklem has joined. 19:02:18 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 19:17:50 I believe the BANCNova documentation contains errors too. Since, I tried to figure out from looking at the printout to see what it looks like those commands would do in the given contexts. 19:18:07 (I did not look at the LINK source.) 19:26:24 good evening, zzo38 19:26:45 -!- perrier has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 19:26:58 hmm, I gotta enjoy it while it lasts: I'm still leading http://golf.shinh.org/p.rb?Make+24 19:27:19 some golfer will probably easily do much shorter though 19:27:24 b_jonas: I wrote most of a dc solution before realizing the numbers aren't always in the same order as the input. :) 19:27:57 -!- perrier has joined. 19:28:39 -!- Sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds). 19:28:41 in fact, I think a gzipped solution will probably be shorter than mine 19:29:47 hmm, let me see 19:35:22 -!- Sprocklem has joined. 19:42:12 [wiki] [[Talk:BANCStar]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=40724&oldid=40721 * Zzo38 * (+303) 19:42:14 -!- MoALTz has quit (Quit: Leaving). 19:46:51 -!- Sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 19:47:44 -!- Sprocklem has joined. 19:48:02 I'm repeatedly submitting another ()[rand 3] solution 19:49:12 waiting for the 1/27 chance 19:52:37 -!- Sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds). 19:53:51 not $$%3? 19:54:27 The dc solution I had picked the thing by summing all the numbers and doing vv1-v. 19:54:40 That's essentially sqrt(sqrt(sqrt(sum))-1). 19:55:00 (With a sqrt that truncates down.) 19:55:02 int-e: right... I just realized that that's two chars shorter 19:55:04 or three 19:55:50 fizzie: huh... which problem is that? euclidean norm? 19:55:58 summing what numbers? 19:56:07 The one you're talking about, I assume. 19:56:13 Make 24, and the input numbers, of course. 19:56:25