00:00:34 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 00:07:54 -!- atrapado has quit (Quit: quitan). 00:10:45 -!- ^v has joined. 00:11:12 -!- arjanb has quit (Quit: zzz). 00:12:43 -!- Tritonio has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 00:13:17 -!- mihow has quit (Quit: mihow). 00:24:53 -!- GeoDude has changed nick to GeekDude. 00:33:41 -!- adu has quit (Quit: adu). 00:46:46 -!- kcm1700 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 00:46:56 -!- kcm1700 has joined. 00:47:33 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: leaving). 00:51:23 -!- kcm1700 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 00:51:58 -!- kcm1700 has joined. 01:01:59 -!- drdanmaku has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity). 01:06:45 [wiki] [[Talk:Folders]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41600&oldid=41590 * Rottytooth * (+470) /* Clarifications? */ response to Keymaker 01:21:46 -!- adu has joined. 01:45:31 -!- rottytooth has joined. 02:08:12 -!- Sprocklem has joined. 02:31:57 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 02:46:46 -!- skj3gg has joined. 03:28:32 -!- Tritonio has joined. 03:29:11 -!- Tritonio has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 03:29:56 -!- Tritonio has joined. 03:49:58 What happens if somehow an aura loses its Enchant ability? What happens if something that isn't an aura (such as an Equipment) gains enchant ability? 03:50:38 -!- adu has quit (Quit: adu). 03:51:37 zzo38: Perhaps you can ask in #mtgrules on EFNet. 03:54:50 I wrote this code two days ago. I do not remember why I have two arguments with confusingly similar names. 03:54:56 OK I will try 03:55:15 What is the host name and port number for EFNet? 03:55:28 -!- FreeFull has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 03:55:51 I think irc.efnet.org:6667 should work. 03:55:53 -!- Pnight has joined. 03:57:23 -!- FreeFull has joined. 03:58:41 hello everybody! 03:58:47 hi 03:58:52 OK it looks like working. 03:58:57 -!- Pnight has changed nick to Eiel. 03:59:18 yes, my first time !!! 03:59:27 looks to me like it's still an enchantment that is now allowed to enchant any object or player. 03:59:42 `relcome Eiel 03:59:43 Eiel: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: . (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on irc.dal.net.) 04:00:14 zzo38: but can you actually make that happen? 04:00:14 thank you elliott! greetings! 04:01:36 int-e: I thought it might be but an unsure, and it doesn't answer the second question. I do not know if anything can actually make that happen. 04:03:30 -!- skj3gg has quit (Quit: ZZZzzz…). 04:04:06 -!- Eiel has quit (Quit: Luego regreso). 04:04:41 zzo38: "The enchant ability restricts what an Aura spell can target and what an Aura can enchant. " <-- if it isn't an aura that doesn't seem to do anything. 04:05:39 but I agree that it's not perfectly clear. 04:06:45 I think if an aura lost "Enchant" it would make sense for it to be able to be able to enchant anything, because "Enchant X. Enchant Y." means it can only attach something which is both an X and a Y. 04:07:03 So for instance it would be able to enchant permanents, players, cards in graveyards, etc. 04:08:37 -!- skj3gg has joined. 04:11:50 * int-e boggles at the thought of enchanting an ability on the stack... 04:14:03 Yes, if it can enchant anything then clearly it could do that; I knew that part already. 04:14:33 Woohoo, only one small mistake in major code change, other than that, worked on first try! 04:15:33 whoa, want to play prismata? 04:16:02 If you enchanted something on the stack, I would believe that as soon as it resolves or is countered, the enchantment is removed as a state based action, isn't it? 04:16:26 That's what I'd expect. 04:16:38 But you could make e.g. counterspells be enchantments with that mechanism. 04:17:24 shachaf: right now, want to refactor a bit to get rid of the poorly named "place", which is easily confused with "dest" 04:17:58 Or maybe some other shuffling around, putting the warning+copyright below the important stuff or something 04:21:11 [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Scoppini * New user account 04:25:25 -!- Tritonio has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 04:25:43 -!- Tritonio has joined. 04:26:01 -!- Tritonio has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 04:26:28 -!- Tritonio has joined. 04:32:09 shachaf: ok, I'll play 04:32:44 After you're done with Master Bot 04:34:10 whoa, does it let you see my game? 04:35:20 yes 04:36:48 -!- skj3gg has quit (Quit: ZZZzzz…). 04:42:47 -!- nys has quit (Quit: sleep). 04:48:23 Sgeo: What are all those engineers for? 04:48:37 Why block 4 with Wall+Steelsplitter instead of 2 engineers+Wall? 04:50:51 -!- GeekDude has quit (Quit: {{{}}{{{}}{{}}}{{}}} (www.adiirc.com)). 04:52:50 -!- MoALTz_ has joined. 04:54:37 -!- rottytooth has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 04:55:16 gg 04:55:48 The engineers were for a vague hope that maybe I could burst build drones, so that your deadeyes can't take out all of them in a single turn, so I could get more ossifieds 04:56:01 -!- MoALTz has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 04:56:14 Why did you build two walls after I built a steelsplitter? 04:56:32 That seems way overdefensive. A wall just by itself can absorb 2 damage. 04:56:48 I may have thought it made sense to prepare defensively. Probably not. 04:57:06 Please do not assume that I am good at Prismata 04:58:02 zzo38: Oh, they don't deal in theoretical questions, apparently. 04:59:52 If there are unspecified situations that can occur, does that mean that Magic is allowed to eat your laundry? 05:00:01 -!- skj3gg has joined. 05:03:11 -!- adu has joined. 05:05:35 -!- oren has joined. 05:10:25 But I am interested even in theoretical questions. 05:16:09 so you can enchant a creature's tap ability, without enchanting the creature? 05:17:49 most of this stuff doesn't fit with the way I played Magic in grade 7 05:21:17 see we used a physical STACK of cards 05:22:04 -!- skj3gg has quit (Quit: ZZZzzz…). 05:31:22 No I think you would enchant it when activated, the enchantment goes away when it resolves 05:41:13 -!- Sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 05:45:04 Since they don't want theoretical questions I may ask some more on here: What happens if an aura has living weapon ability? 05:46:21 I think the answer to many of your questions is that it never happens, so the rules don't specify the behavior. 05:46:43 In this case, though: 702.91a. Living weapon is a triggered ability. "Living weapon" means "When this Equipment enters the battlefield, put a 0/0 black Germ creature token onto the battlefield, then attach this Equipment to it." 05:47:22 I read that already. 05:47:49 I guess "this Equipment" is meaningless, actually. Or means the same as "this permanent". 05:48:26 I would think the latter, but it still leaves a few things unclear to me. 05:48:54 It's the latter, I think that's specified somewhere. 05:50:05 I think so too, but it still doesn't fully answer my question. 05:50:29 Yes. I don't have an answer to your question. 05:51:02 Other than that the rules make it reasonably clear that they don't intend to print it on non-Equipment cards. And I don't know of a way you could get it onto cards otherwise. 06:10:13 -!- adu has quit (Quit: adu). 06:28:18 I looked at the rules; it looks like to me that it first is attached to whatever it targeted, and then it tries to become attached to the Germ token if possible. Is that correct? 06:29:19 zzo38: Maybe #mtg on EFNet would be more accepting of theoretical questions. 06:29:21 I don't know. 06:31:51 -!- MoALTz__ has joined. 06:34:29 -!- MoALTz_ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 06:34:31 i was looking through the list of banned cards, and "Falling Star" seems out of place. 06:40:17 -!- adu has joined. 06:43:48 "< int-e> looks to me like it's still an enchantment that is now allowed to enchant any object or player." - I thought it was like that since Time Spiral, when they added an aura that enchants a card in the gy. 06:44:36 zzo38: "What happens if something that isn't an aura (such as an Equipment) gains enchant ability?" - hmm, there was some way to get an aura equipment in some recent set I think 06:46:40 zzo38: but as for an Aura losing its "enchant" ability, I suspect that's actually impossible in vanilla M:tG, it's only possible in your variant where creature auras don't get removed, but I could be wrong 06:47:00 could you animate and then humiliate an aura without getting state-based actions resolve in between? 06:48:08 hmm, actually, you'd need to animate it, humiliate it, then unanimate it, which is probably impossible 06:54:03 Are there any Magic: the Gathering puzzles involving games of more than two players? If so, are there any that require conceding in order to solve the puzzle? 06:55:02 zzo38: I don't know 06:55:33 it's not hard to set up a situation where conceding will make your team win, but I don't know if there's a good puzzle made from this 06:55:58 I actually have a few ideas relating to such things. 06:58:03 "What happens if an aura has living weapon ability?" -- dunno, but check the set faq and rulings and stuff for the sets in the Theros block, iirc think that was the block where it was first possible to get equipment auras 06:59:03 all I remember is that it could somehow happen to get aura equipment and that they're attached to only one object that both equipment-related and aura-related abilities refer to 06:59:47 I don't quite remember how it could happen though 07:04:51 hmm, can't find that reference to aura equipment 07:12:52 hmm damn 07:13:14 zzo38: that situation I described with conceding in multiplayer to have your team win the game might not work: 07:13:24 "810.8b If a player concedes, his or her team leaves the game immediately. That team loses the game." 07:17:28 however, you could still try to concede to influence which of your opponents win 07:19:20 but that's trivial and doesn't need any rules shenenigans 07:21:17 I was thinking a game following rule 808, not 810. 07:21:57 Therefore, that rule won't apply. 07:37:07 Is 810 the most common team game? Well, I prefer 808. 07:48:19 zzo38: hmm, now I'm no longer sure getting a non-creature aura without enchant is impossible in vanilla 07:48:33 I'll have to investigate whether it's possible 07:49:34 also, as for rules questions, I'd recommend against efnet #mtgrules for these kinds of crazy theoretical rules questions. they're a fine channel for ordinary rules questions, about situations that can reasonably come up in games, but not really for these kinds of esoteric rules situations. 07:53:44 Is it possible to set up a combo with Time Machine that lets you win all future games with the same opponent unless he pulls off a turn zero win? 07:57:52 Hmm no, it isn't. The opponent could concede very early next game to break the loop. 08:06:20 -!- shikhin has joined. 08:07:21 -!- adu has quit (Quit: adu). 08:07:44 -!- Tritonio has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 08:11:43 -!- Frooxius has quit (Quit: *bubbles away*). 08:53:12 -!- shikhin_ has joined. 08:56:04 -!- shikhin has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 08:59:39 STM. Totally a stimulant drink drunk by neurons. http://lawcomic.net/guide/?p=3105 09:08:21 -!- shikhin_ has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds). 09:20:43 -!- shikhin has joined. 09:22:31 my short term memory is literally a stimulant drink, especially at exam time 09:33:56 @tell Vorpal http://www.rutschle.net/tech/sslh.shtml 09:33:56 Consider it noted. 09:35:36 -!- oerjan has joined. 09:48:44 In windows 7, if I am moving a windows by dragging its title bar, and a new window is mapped to the desktop, that sometimes aborts the window move, but not always. What decides whether it aborts that? 09:48:51 . 09:49:16 Grabbing focus, perhaps 09:49:26 -!- SopaXorzTaker has joined. 09:49:28 -!- SopaXorzTaker has quit (Changing host). 09:49:28 -!- SopaXorzTaker has joined. 09:49:59 Jafet: ah yes, that's possible 09:59:17 -!- King2218 has joined. 09:59:25 -!- King2218 has left. 10:12:40 girl genius, WHY AREN'T YOU UPDATING 10:33:20 oerjan: they're out of ideas for paper dolls? 10:34:17 fiendish 10:34:40 that seems unlikely since these dolls are based on an already existing side story 10:35:30 Yes, I did take that into account. I was trying to come up with a worst case scenario. 10:37:00 they still need to get through gil, tarvek and possibly the jägers 10:37:40 ...no, _certainly_ the jägers. 10:37:49 maybe they needed to remind their kids of who their parents are 10:38:04 ah yes. i remember that. 10:38:08 (there was this "who are you people" gag a while back..) 10:38:39 i know. 10:39:05 'course you do. you tend to remember most of GG better than I :P 10:39:11 heh 10:40:28 I kind of want to do a Girl Genius cosplay 10:40:35 The issue is, how to make it recognizable? 10:40:43 i just reread most of the cinderella story, although that was because it was accidentally linked from an old forum comment in the yafgc forum (it turned out the story had a shoutout to them) that got bumped up. 10:40:57 [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Gamemanj * New user account 10:41:02 I don't really have the figure to cosplay Agatha. The only thing I can think of is Gil in his Schmott Guy hat 10:41:39 Taneb: i recall seeing some cosplay of maxim on their blog (also that via an ancient link) 10:41:48 or wait 10:41:55 it was the cosplayer's blog, i think 10:42:47 also the cosplayer was a girl 10:43:11 maxim _is_ canonically a bishounen jäger 10:43:15 -!- MoALTz__ has changed nick to MoALTz. 10:44:14 * oerjan tries to remember what Taneb looks like again 10:45:05 -!- zzo38 has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 10:45:16 apparently there's a guy called Raif Taneb 10:45:21 oerjan, I am just under six foot, skinny, brown hair, not short but by no means long, very noticeable eyebrows 10:45:49 Taneb: i don't really have the ability to connect looks and written desciptions 10:47:20 _something_ tells me this guy isn't you https://www.youtube.com/user/nathanvdoorn :P 10:47:49 (trying to find your esoprogramming video, your name/nick doesn't seem like the best search word) 10:49:10 why does "esolang" give all these russian hits 10:49:11 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bekftEG3j4 10:49:30 Heh, I forgot about that 10:49:37 ah there 10:50:40 [wiki] [[Talk:BytePusher]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41601&oldid=40700 * Gamemanj * (+251) /* Announcements */ 10:51:43 hm i found that too but with a different id 10:52:35 oerjan, yeah, it was uploaded twice 10:52:55 First to the person who filmed it's account, then copied to HackSoc's 10:55:40 oerjan: Zeetha, too... 10:56:56 int-e: hm she wasn't in the part of the story i read 10:57:25 oh wait she was the godmother wasn't she 10:57:45 yes. 10:58:14 though maybe they'll skip her; she had only that one outfit, I'm afraid 10:58:15 i started at the point where the yafgc shoutout was, which was after that 10:59:57 Taneb: i was thinking about moloch von zinzer but then you need more beard 11:00:05 oerjan, I can do more beard 11:10:13 oerjan: interesting, I had missed the fact that the science fair was another concentration of shoutouts. (I was aware of the one when Agatha enters Mechanicsburg) 11:11:12 don't worry, i probably miss most shoutouts in general :P 11:12:09 occasionally i notice some, or notice something which just has to be a shoutout but i don't know to what 11:12:23 sure. it just means that I didn't read the texts carefully that time (it was just a side story after all...) 11:13:36 did you know (of course not) that when i first saw the 3 jägers, i thought they were shoutouts to elfquest characters? 11:14:47 oerjan: did you find http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/ShoutOut/GirlGenius ? 11:14:50 i thought maxim looked vaguely like rayek, ognian vaguely like cutter and dimo vaguely like a troll 11:14:59 no 11:21:55 -!- Lymia has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 11:24:24 -!- Frooxius has joined. 11:25:35 oh wow, the companion cube is hard to recognize... 11:26:03 ( http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20141024 ) 11:26:03 (input):1:5: error: expected: "!!", 11:26:04 "$", "$>", "&&", "&&&", "*", 11:26:04 "***", "+", "++", "+++", "-", 11:26:04 "->", ".", "/", "/=", ":+", 11:26:04 ":-", "::", ":::", ":=", "<",↵… 11:26:21 idris-bot: I forgive you 11:28:05 sometimes i regret suggesting the ( prefix 11:28:29 but bots _shouldn't_ give multiline responses to unknown commands, anyway. 11:28:51 > let f x = x x in x x x x x 11:28:52 Couldn't match expected type ‘Debug.SimpleReflect.Expr.Expr 11:28:52 -> Debug.SimpleReflect.Expr.Expr 11:28:52 -> Debug.SimpleReflect.Expr.Expr 11:28:54 it should be ) 11:29:02 that's not an unknown command 11:29:04 > (\u -> u u) 11:29:05 Occurs check: cannot construct the infinite type: t1 ~ t1 -> t 11:29:05 Relevant bindings include u :: t1 -> t (bound at :1:3) 11:29:24 vanila: there's already a ) 11:29:27 ) 11:29:30 (idris-bot doesn't trigger so easily) 11:29:32 ) as 11:29:58 (but I tend to put spaces around URLs to help copy&pasting.) 11:30:06 vanila: well the bot isn't actually _here_ any more. 11:30:11 OK! 11:30:25 % help 11:30:27 vanila: the _reason_ i suggested ( was to balance out that ) in fungot's prefix list 11:30:27 oerjan: this is just what makes sense 11:30:33 -!- Frooxius has quit (Quit: *bubbles away*). 11:30:37 lol 11:30:38 oerjan: I think it's fine. 11:30:51 > fnord 11:30:53 Not in scope: ‘fnord’ 11:31:00 > fob wfø wohiqw 11:31:01 Not in scope: ‘fob’ 11:31:01 Perhaps you meant ‘T.for’ (imported from Data.Traversable)Not in scope: ‘wfø... 11:31:03 -!- Frooxius has joined. 11:31:04 * int-e swats oerjan. 11:31:17 ok i guess lambdabot isn't entirely innocent. 11:31:31 -!- Jafet has left. 11:31:35 > ''ø 11:31:35 -!- Jafet has joined. 11:31:36 Syntax error on ''ø 11:31:36 Perhaps you intended to use TemplateHaskell 11:32:36 > text $ replicate 10 '\n' 11:32:37 Terminated 11:33:15 > text $ concat $ replicate 10 "Terminated\n" 11:33:16 Terminated 11:33:16 Terminated 11:33:16 Terminated 11:33:31 > text $ replicate 10 '\n' 11:33:32 Terminated 11:33:39 > text "\n" 11:33:40 Terminated 11:33:44 aha 11:34:15 it strips final newlines, and only then decides whether there's no output 11:34:30 > text "\n " 11:34:35 smart! ;-) 11:34:45 now what. 11:34:58 > text $ replicate 1024 '\n' ++ "a" 11:34:59 Terminated 11:35:04 > text $ replicate 1023 '\n' ++ "a" 11:35:06 a 11:35:17 > text " " 11:35:30 int-e: i sense a bug 11:36:03 no 11:36:12 -!- zzo38 has joined. 11:36:15 I think I need to learn more Haskell. 11:36:19 well, not the 1024 thing anyway. 11:36:22 > text " " 11:36:23 � 11:36:39 so, step 1: strip newlines 2: decide whether it's empty so print Terminated. 3: strip whitespace 4: decide whether it's empty so print nothing 11:36:43 `unidecode 11:36:43 [U+00A0 NO-BREAK SPACE] 11:36:52 VERY LOGICAL 11:36:56 `unidecode Â 11:36:56 [U+00C2 LATIN CAPITAL LETTER A WITH CIRCUMFLEX] 11:36:59 fucking unicode 11:37:06 > tect " \n" 11:37:07 Not in scope: ‘tect’ 11:37:07 Perhaps you meant ‘text’ (imported from Text.PrettyPrint.HughesPJ) 11:37:11 > text " \n" 11:37:24 > text " \n \n " 11:37:51 > text " \n a \n " 11:37:52 a 11:37:52 11:37:56 I bet it's a feature ;-) 11:38:00 OKAY 11:38:11 funny though 11:47:11 -!- ais523 has joined. 12:14:39 according to my analysis, the best type of pokemon is fairy/steel 12:14:51 klefki, mega mawile 12:14:55 the worst is ice/rock 12:14:59 both of which are in fact widly used in various metagame 12:15:01 *metagames 12:15:11 and yes, ice/rock is absolutely terrible except as a glass cannon setup 12:15:18 it's not too bad wrt coverage, but it's somewhat redundant 12:15:33 rock bottom 12:15:45 * J_Arcane battles an existential crisis 12:15:54 J_Arcane: you exist 12:15:56 did that help? 12:15:58 I think I saw somewhere what is the worst single type in Pokemon Red they calculated by computer, the result is rocks. 12:16:14 basically i wrote a program to evaluate the type combos according to how many types are good against them 12:16:15 ais523: yes, but what purpose in existing if you fail to provide function? 12:16:20 if that didn't help we'll just have to kill you instea 12:16:23 *+d 12:16:44 J_Arcane: well if you don't know what your purpose is, you can make it your purpose to find out 12:17:18 oren: it strikes me as odd that someone would a) be the type of person to do that, and yet b) include fairy (even dark and steel are a bit weird) 12:17:49 ???? 12:18:10 I use ghost type in pokemon emerand 12:18:11 well everyone knows in the old games only psychic and dragon were worth fielding 12:18:19 I love ghosts. 12:18:23 vanila: your ???? is lacking context, it would describe pretty much everything that happens in this channel 12:18:27 HAHaha 12:18:33 I tried to beat platinum with an all ghost team. 12:18:35 oren: not true 12:18:42 the perfect team for Pokémon Red/Blue was solved quite a while ago 12:18:46 platinum was wicked fucking hard. 12:18:52 unfortunately I can't remember all of it offhand 12:19:08 Tauros, Chansey, Exeggcutor, um… 12:19:18 either Rhydon or Golem, they're so close it makes no real difference 12:19:30 (because you absolutely have to have a zapdos counter or you just lose) 12:19:36 everyone i knew had 3 Alakazam, Mewtwo, Dragonite, Articuno 12:19:44 or womething like that 12:19:54 oh, this is normally assuming that mewtwo is banned and you can't use duplicates 12:20:06 otherwise, the best team is probably either 6 mewtwo or 6 tauros, they're cloes 12:20:46 why not duplicates? 12:21:00 duplicates of non-legendray are easy toget 12:21:04 it's just a commonly enforced rule, partly because so many people assume it's a rule 12:21:12 and even 1 tauros is pretty hard to get, really, in RB 12:22:20 so the assumption is "if you can get anything you want…" 12:22:21 -!- ais523 has quit. 12:22:26 -!- callforjudgement has joined. 12:23:12 -!- callforjudgement has changed nick to ais523. 12:23:47 When dark came, Alakazam was no longer a evil killing machine, i was sad... 12:24:09 I think Alakazam might also be on the perfect team 12:24:28 apparently, mostly as the Pokémon that the opponent puts to sleep 12:24:37 (another commonly enforced rule is that you can't put more than one opposing Pokémon to sleep) 12:26:09 but Alakazam has plenty of counters even in RB 12:26:21 e.g. it can't do anything to Chansey, who will paralyse it 12:26:27 and then it'll die to everything 12:26:33 Hmm... that is pretty far from the way i played it in primary school... Alakazam was countered by Dargonite usually 12:27:01 well we've had well over 10 years to solve the game 12:28:11 that's true. the days of mewtwo -> dragonite -> articuno -> charizard are over 12:28:21 articuno is actually pretty bad 12:28:29 but kills dragonite 12:28:43 or, hmm, no, it's not that bad 12:28:46 misread the guide I'm using 12:29:01 and there aren't that many ice pokemon in RBY anyway 12:29:32 did you see AGDQ? 12:29:39 the reprogrammed pokemon 12:29:47 vanila: did you see the credits for that run? 12:30:04 im not sure, i was talking about the one yesterday 12:30:08 so am I 12:30:13 I guess i missed it 12:30:17 I'm partly responsible for it, is the point I was getting at 12:30:21 oh! 12:30:24 well done :D 12:30:28 that was really stunning 12:30:31 so while everyone else was really happy watching it 12:30:41 I was really nervous, hoping everything would work 12:30:54 not everything did work, but enough did that we were able to pull off something spectacular anyway 12:31:19 ais523: is this the tasbot? 12:31:21 yeah i can imagine! 12:31:28 that would be very nerve-wracking 12:31:45 -!- ais523 has quit. 12:31:52 [wiki] [[Musical notes]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41602&oldid=41447 * TomPN * (-98) /* Syntax */ 12:31:56 -!- ais523 has joined. 12:31:57 oren: so looking this up, articuno loses to starmie, which is the most common reason it isn't used much 12:32:08 I should redo my program to take into acount typical stats of a type combo 12:32:48 ais523, how do you get involved in something like that? 12:33:03 articuno also loses to Mewtwo though... some people used lapras instead 12:33:39 vanila: well dwangoAC organizes the TAS representation at AGDQ, and I've been working with him on another project for over a year now 12:34:10 ais523: on a different note, after what zzo38 said, I'm now wondering about something in M:tG: 12:34:51 Namely whether it's possible to get a situation where you have a non-creature aura without an "enchant" ability in play at a point when the game tries to determine what it can be legally enchanted to. 12:35:31 The rules don't seem quite clear what would happen if that occurred, but I don't know if it's possible in first place. 12:35:35 [wiki] [[Dimensions]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41603&oldid=41448 * TomPN * (-98) /* Loops */ 12:36:56 I think all the existing "lose all abilities" effects only apply to creatures, but you might be able to find one with an until-end-of-turn duration 12:36:58 oh right, Turn 12:37:11 so I think it's doable 12:38:29 [wiki] [[Quantum Dimensions]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41604&oldid=41449 * TomPN * (-1) /* Quantum entanglement */ 12:38:51 Wow. FPComplete is actually really cool. 12:41:05 ais523: oh, Turn! nice, I didn't think of that 12:41:36 [wiki] [[RingCode]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41605&oldid=41428 * TomPN * (-56) 12:43:34 b_jonas: oh "copy enchantment" is an interesting card, it's an enchantment without target (but a triggered ability.) In fact that card tickles the rules about targets in interesting ways - see the first ruling at http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=83807 12:43:37 ok, so how does that work? I animate the aura, cast Turn at it, then unanimate it, and its abilities remain lost until end of turn. 12:43:40 that works 12:44:40 and that strange state lasts long enough that I can even cast spells or try to reattach it with Simic Guildmage's ability 12:46:49 b_jonas: Uhm, "An Aura that's also a creature can't enchant anything. If this occurs somehow, the Aura becomes unattached, then is put into its owner's graveyard." (as a state-based effect) 12:47:22 int-e: sure, but the question is what objects an aura without "enchant" can legally enchant, 12:47:37 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 12:48:10 int-e: the rules basically say that the "enchant" ability determines what an aura can legally attach to, with the exception that if the aura is a creature it can't be attached to anything, and that an aura can never be attached to itself legally 12:48:11 The rules say that enchantments work on objects and players. 12:48:23 and Enchant restricts that set. 12:48:24 yes, object and player sorry 12:48:26 you'd have to make it into a nonenchantment creature first 12:48:28 then Turn it 12:48:32 then undo the type changing 12:48:39 err, nonaura creature 12:48:42 being an enchantment would be fine 12:48:53 so maybe it isn't possible 12:49:24 ais523: hmm... you have to make it non-aura temporarily? that might be easiest by rewriting it with a copy 12:49:33 ais523: hmm actually 12:49:39 there might be an easier way: 12:49:55 we don't have a "target permanent becomes a copy of another target permanent until end of combat", though (or some duration that's shorter than a turn) 12:50:02 or "enchanted permanent is a copy of target permanent" 12:50:05 just manifest an aura, then Turn it, then use the special action from manifest to turn it up so it becomes an auura 12:50:21 b_jonas: doesn't work, manifest special action only works on creatures 12:50:26 hmm... 12:50:31 cards that are creatures on the front, that is 12:50:39 I think, at least 12:50:45 oh, don't use the special ability 12:50:48 use Break Open 12:51:03 that works on everything that's a creature on the back (i.e. everything), and not an instant or sorcery on the front 12:51:08 can you overwrite a non-creature artifact enchantment with a copy somehow? 12:51:26 break open, good idea 12:51:50 well, I hope it's a special action like morph's 12:51:50 holy crap, mewtwo still has monstrous stats 12:51:56 we won't know for sure until the setfaq comes out 12:52:19 oh, that reminds me 12:52:45 it is a special action, it says so in the mechanics preview article 12:52:51 oren: have you seen mewtwoite x / mewtwoite y? 12:53:32 -!- vanila has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 12:53:54 not only does the new mtg homepage no longer has an obvious link to a list of all set faqs; but also even though the pages of earlier sets link to their set FAQs, http://magic.wizards.com/en/game-info/products/card-set-archive/khans-of-tarkir doesn't link to a set faq. 12:54:15 where's the Khans of Tarkir set FAQ, I hope they haven't discontinued set FAQs 12:54:17 ? 12:54:30 oh, it does link to the faq, just on a differnet place 12:54:31 whew 12:55:11 I'll have to download that 12:55:29 (doesn't load, damn it) 12:58:26 Also, why the hell isn't there a game in Orange Islands? 13:00:21 ais523: there's another way, without face down permanents. animate a Mizzium Transreqliquat, activate its ability to copy an artifact aura, and as a reaction, cast Turn to the Transreliquat. 13:00:59 but manifest, Turn, Break open is easier 13:01:04 zzo38: did you get this? 13:01:06 oh, the copy effect causes it to stop being a creature 13:01:27 ais523: nah, you can just make it no longer be a creature at instant speed 13:01:35 by destroying Animate Artifact 13:01:46 you can animate and unanimate artifacts any time you like 13:01:54 ah right 13:02:00 ok, not quite, but any time you can cast spells 13:02:33 I can't load the Khans of Tarkir set faq 13:02:47 guess I'll have to try again in the evening, the wizards website sucks 13:04:38 sorry if I interrupted the pokemon conversation 13:04:50 nah this is more interesting 13:05:17 how dare you interrupt their off-topic conversation with another one 13:05:48 oerjan: actually the mtg one is somewhat on-topic because it's about obfu-uses of M:tG, not normal uses 13:05:54 ew can have multiple conversations at once 13:05:57 OKAY 13:06:06 I don't know if it counts as more on-topic than the pokemon one though 13:06:06 oerjan: I'd claim http://esolangs.org/wiki/StackFlow is ontopic 13:06:22 even though writing that page required me to know about various obscure M:tG cards 13:07:41 someone should invent a tabletop game so complex it is possible to make the referees have to solve the halting problem 13:07:57 oren: M:tG is already like that 13:08:05 oren: because of its rules about infinite loops 13:08:14 those rules, sadly, are also underspecified 13:08:40 oh shit i forgot about those... so they have to know whther the loop is infinite or not 13:08:46 but you can imagine specifying them completely in an ideal world, but they still have to require to solve the halting problem 13:09:09 oren: yes, and as the rest of M:tG is turing complete, those rules make the judges require to solve the halting problem in theory 13:09:32 in practice, you might not be able to set up an interesting enoguh situation without running out of time or some other implementation limit first 13:09:46 -!- callforjudgement has joined. 13:09:54 b_jonas: StackFlow /literally/ solves the halting problem 13:09:56 in any case you may need a co-operating opponent 13:10:03 -!- ais523 has quit (Disconnected by services). 13:10:05 -!- callforjudgement has changed nick to ais523. 13:10:11 the only remaining thing to do is to somehow set it up in a tournament 13:10:38 and then grin and say "Problem, ref?" 13:10:42