00:00:12 James R Munkres 00:02:19 Aha! my Analysis I textbook was Spivak's "Calculus" 00:03:22 So i confused the two a little 00:04:51 Analysis II was very hard but it obviated the need to take othermath courses 00:05:43 it is the end all be all for math prerequisites in CS 00:07:06 -!- Lymia has joined. 00:09:55 I wonderif all universities have prereq lists like " 00:10:27 Take A and B and C, or just take D. 00:32:50 oren, well most universities probably build on things you learned earlier in your course, yes 00:33:06 if anything i wish mine would do so more thoroughly 00:33:28 i've lost track of how many modules have gone through the definition and basic properties of a group 00:34:04 shachaf: i think it may have been massey, i'm too lazy to go down to the parking cellar to find the book and stupid amazon basically has a biography instead of a proper book description 00:35:26 in any case, it had a final chapter on de rham 00:35:36 *de rham cohomology 00:36:20 you're a cohomology expert, right? 00:36:23 or was it homology? 00:37:02 if by "expert" you mean i once proved some spaces to have trivial homology in a published paper 00:37:29 What is a homology? 00:37:54 oh and i guess some others _not_ to have trivial homology, by being very not simply connected 00:38:15 Taneb: it's a functor from topological spaces to a sequence of groups 00:38:36 is that (very not simply) connected or very not (simply connected) 00:38:46 oerjan, a sequence of groups form a category? 00:39:00 or a sequence a functors from spaces to groups 00:39:27 Taneb: well by trivial product, definitely, although in this case there definitely are connections between them 00:40:21 but H_0(S) is basically the free abelian group with card(S) generators 00:40:46 and H_1(S) is the "abelization" of the fundamental group 00:41:19 then the higher groups are more complicated things involving higher dimensional properties of the space 00:41:49 -!- hoosieree_ has joined. 00:41:51 but e.g. the circle has H_0(S) = Z and H_1(S) = Z iirc 00:42:23 while a "contractible space" like a point or ball has both (and all the rest) trivial groups 00:43:18 the n-sphere generally has most of them trivial but 2 neighboring ones are Z, one further out per dimension 00:43:31 iirc which i'm pretty unsure of for the latter 00:43:55 Interesting 00:43:59 I should go to bed now 00:44:00 Goodnight 00:44:04 and the fact that these are functors allow you to prove things like the jordan curve theorem 00:44:24 (and in fact its higher-dimensional generalization) 00:46:01 shachaf: oh and it's both, assuming the former implies the latter 00:46:54 oerjan: presumably the former means that it's connected, but in a v. complicated way 00:46:54 erm s/card(S)/card(components of S)/ above there 00:47:51 shachaf: well they were connected indeed 00:48:03 or wait were they 00:49:09 hm i'm not sure if that was part of it 00:49:54 they had a quotient space that was basically a product of infinitely many circles 00:50:11 iirc 00:50:26 *it had 00:50:52 this was just one space in particular, the simple topological measures on a torus 00:50:59 afair 00:53:33 but i don't remember that the space was necessarily connected 00:54:16 i don't think we had enough control to say that 00:56:07 @ask mroman You just get a log-normal distribution 00:56:07 Consider it noted. 00:57:02 while a "contractible space" like a point or ball has both (and all the rest) trivial groups 00:57:03 uh no 00:57:11 H_0 of a point is Z 00:58:18 n-sphere has H_0 and H_n isomorphic to Z 00:58:51 right, i get confused about the H_0 vs. reduced H_0 thing 00:59:08 reduced homology is such a weird convention 00:59:45 it only changes H_0 yet it's treated like a property of the entire sequence of homology groups 01:06:22 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 01:41:02 -!- shikhin_ has joined. 01:44:20 <^v> aww 01:44:21 -!- shikhin has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 01:44:23 <^v> i missed the soak 01:45:08 what soak 01:47:12 It says that "nc -e" is dangerous; what dangers are there exactly? 01:49:22 Is it safe if the program you are running is safe? 01:49:48 The usual dangers with allowing people to connect to your machine and run programs, probably. 01:50:05 nc here doesn't have -e but its man page has a comment "Be cautious here because opening a port and let anyone connected execute arbitrary command on your site is DANGEROUS." 01:50:44 (in the part suggesting how to get around the lack of -e) 01:51:03 same for curl ... | sh - 01:51:04 But can't you specify what program you want to run? They won't necessarily execute arbitrary commands in this way isn't it? 01:52:28 -!- boily has quit (Quit: EXECUTIVE CHICKEN). 01:53:15 zzo38: people used to run nc -e /bin/bash anyway. 01:53:32 much like rm -rf /... 01:55:06 -!- MoALTz__ has joined. 01:56:27 -!- weissschloss has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 01:58:12 -!- tromp__ has joined. 01:58:17 -!- yukko_ has joined. 01:59:47 -!- heroux_ has joined. 02:00:02 -!- jameseb- has joined. 02:00:38 -!- Sprocklem_ has joined. 02:04:46 -!- aloril_ has joined. 02:06:02 -!- yukko has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 02:06:02 -!- MoALTz_ has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 02:06:02 -!- aloril has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 02:06:02 -!- jameseb has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 02:06:02 -!- heroux has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 02:06:02 -!- hoosieree_ has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 02:06:02 -!- Sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 02:06:03 -!- tromp has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 02:06:08 -!- heroux_ has changed nick to heroux. 02:07:44 -!- weissschloss has joined. 02:18:38 -!- arjanb has quit (Quit: zzz). 02:23:03 zzo38: nc -e inetd-style-httpd would be just fine I imagine. 02:36:54 -!- Lymia has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 02:39:42 -!- zzo38 has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 02:51:27 [wiki] [[Brainfuck algorithms]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41709&oldid=40821 * 71.10.94.116 * (+205) /* Print value of cell x as number */ 02:59:18 surely we have that already? 02:59:34 Probably a tweak if it isn't a bad edit. 03:01:43 [wiki] [[Brainfuck algorithms]] M http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41710&oldid=41709 * Oerjan * (+2) /* Print value of cell x as number for ANY sized cell (ie 8bit, 16bit, etc) */ Wrap line 03:02:46 -!- Tritonio has joined. 03:02:55 -!- antelios has joined. 03:04:38 [wiki] [[Brainfuck algorithms]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41711&oldid=41710 * Oerjan * (+8) /* Print value of cell x as number */ cell size 03:05:50 -!- loathiingsmoker has joined. 03:06:20 -!- loathiingsmoker has left. 03:09:33 -!- skj3gg has joined. 03:10:09 -!- antelios has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 03:10:38 -!- Tritonio has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 03:21:17 -!- Lilax has joined. 03:21:32 [wiki] [[Brainfuck algorithms]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41712&oldid=41711 * 71.10.94.116 * (+254) /* Print value of cell x as number for ANY sized cell (ie 8bit, 16bit, etc) */ 03:21:45 :0 03:23:11 [wiki] [[Brainfuck algorithms]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41713&oldid=41712 * 71.10.94.116 * (+6) /* Print value of cell x as number for ANY sized cell (ie 8bit, 16bit, etc) */ 03:24:28 D:< 03:29:23 -!- aloril_ has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 03:36:09 I wonder if the ::bb:: thing for bolding would work for irc 03:36:45 or was it 03:36:55 ::b:: 03:37:00 I forgot 03:37:44 -!- skj3gg has quit (Quit: ZZZzzz…). 03:38:09 Place to use bots? 03:38:24 not here though 03:38:38 #bots? 03:38:43 thanks 03:39:13 Was jsut guessing since I figured that's how channel names worked. 03:39:25 And then joined right before you. 03:40:37 [wiki] [[Brainfuck algorithms]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41714&oldid=41713 * 71.10.94.116 * (+58) /* Print value of cell x as number for ANY sized cell (ie 8bit, 16bit, etc) */ 03:40:42 -!- Lymia has joined. 03:43:27 [wiki] [[Brainfuck algorithms]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=41715&oldid=41714 * 71.10.94.116 * (+193) /* Print value of cell x as number for ANY sized cell (ie 8bit, 16bit, etc) */ 03:44:21 * Lilax stares around 03:47:12 -!- aloril has joined. 03:48:53 > 10^10^100 03:49:15 nvm where's that calculation bot 03:49:48 Lilax: bold is triggered with a ctrl-B character, you probably need to escape it in your client somehow to insert it 03:50:27 (if you didn't see bold in bold there, your client doesn't support it) 03:50:49 @ping 03:50:49 pong 03:51:06 Lilax: your calculation may be timing out 03:51:22 although, why hasn't it already 03:51:26 > 10^100 03:51:27 1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000... 03:51:31 > 10^10^100 03:51:49 hm... 03:51:51 > 2 03:51:53 2 03:52:10 > let f n = f(n+1) in f 1 03:52:14 mueval-core: Time limit exceeded 03:52:37 hm that timed out, 10^10^100 must be doing something that gets even that to fail 03:53:26 @ask int-e do you know why > 10^10^100 times out without giving any message? 03:53:26 Consider it noted. 03:54:15 oerjan: It happens in GMP, I guess? 03:54:20 -!- skj3gg has joined. 03:54:23 > 10^1000000000000 03:54:24 Something about uninterruptible calls or who knows. 03:54:33 It behaves differently in ghci too. 03:54:38 hm 03:54:57 basically GMP doesn't give any error on overflow? 03:55:04 What overflow? 03:55:18 shouldn't that be larger than memory size? 03:55:28 (^) uses repeated squaring 03:55:42 the _result_ is still larger than memory size, eventually 03:55:52 Sure, but presumably it times out before reaching that. 03:55:58 i don't see why 03:56:04 (^) is implemented in Haskell 03:56:06 well 03:56:08 It's just using GMP multiplication. 03:56:09 oerjan: 03:56:16 10^10^100 03:56:21 is a googolplex 03:56:27 Lilax: i know it is large 03:56:34 And I don't think any bot can handle that 03:56:41 not even... 03:56:43 Googlebot? 03:56:56 Lilax: well it couldn't handle 10^1000000000000 either 03:57:25 -!- skj3gg has quit (Client Quit). 03:57:31 which i was trying to make big enough to outrun memory, but not by too many magnitudes 03:57:50 300^300^3000 03:57:53 > 1e5 :: Integer 03:57:54 No instance for (GHC.Real.Fractional GHC.Integer.Type.Integer) 03:57:54 arising from the literal ‘1e5’ 03:58:06 e5 isn't that big 03:58:06 shachaf: it doesn't have your extension :( 03:58:27 Lilax: i was just checking if it could use e-notation for Integers 03:58:30 oerjan: i was about to complain to int-e 03:58:35 > 1e1 :: Integer 03:58:36 No instance for (GHC.Real.Fractional GHC.Integer.Type.Integer) 03:58:36 arising from the literal ‘1e1’ 03:58:38 shachaf made an extension to ghc for it 03:58:39 nah 03:58:40 > let x :: Integer; x = 00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 in x*x 03:58:41 0 03:58:45 Jesus 03:58:46 checkmate 03:58:55 That's not fair 03:58:56 This website has profiles that let users have an about string. If no about string is entered, it defaults to "I love Internet Explorer." 03:58:57 er, i forgot the 1 at the beginning 03:59:02 shachaf: *cough* 03:59:05 Also shachaf 03:59:22 implementing the e isn't hard 03:59:35 Does it work? 03:59:43 what are you even doing, Lilax 03:59:57 The work of god 03:59:58 shachaf: i sincerely doubt it errors out at anything that small, sine i've calculated factorials of numbers > 100000 before 04:00:15 oerjan: yes, that's not very many bits at all 04:00:40 how many bits can lambdabot handle before a crash 04:00:46 anyway what i thought was happening was a timeout in gmp code 04:00:55 > 10^10^6 04:00:57 1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000... 04:01:04 10^10^6 * 10^10^6 04:01:10 > 10^10^6 * 10^10^6 04:01:12 1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000... 04:01:25 > 10^10^12 04:02:16 oerjan: so what's with tensors twh 04:02:18 > 10^10^9 04:02:47 > (6, 10^10^6) 04:02:48 i feel like listening to physicists is the worst way to learn things 04:02:49 (6,1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000... 04:02:57 > (7, 10^10^7) 04:03:00 (7,1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000... 04:03:07 > (8, 10^10^8) 04:03:11 mueval-core: Time limit exceeded 04:03:19 ah an actual timeout 04:03:32 > (9, 10^10^9) 04:03:57 now that's weird then 04:04:17 > length (show (10^10^7)) 04:04:22 mueval-core: Time limit exceeded 04:04:23 mueval: signalProcess: permission denied (Operation not permitted) 04:04:28 fancy 04:04:31 tensor means a vector, matrix, or any number of dimensions 04:04:50 > length (show (10^10^7)) 04:04:54 10000001 04:04:57 > length (show (10^10^8)) 04:05:03 mueval-core: Time limit exceeded 04:05:03 mueval: signalProcess: permission denied (Operation not permitted) 04:05:05 > length (show (10^10^9)) 04:05:23 No because 04:05:43 oren: i keep being told that's a terrible definition 04:05:44 in the 10^10^8 - 9 areas 04:05:54 except by physicists, and who trusts them 04:05:55 is to near googol 04:06:07 plex* 04:06:21 no 04:06:23 I'm dumb 04:06:32 I apparently can't read 04:06:47 > logBase 2 10 * 10^8 04:06:49 3.321928094887363e8 04:06:56 > logBase 2 10 * 10^9 04:06:58 3.3219280948873625e9 04:07:20 it's around a gigabit 04:07:45 > logBase 256 10 * 10^9 04:07:47 4.152410118609203e8 04:07:51 that second result was enlightening hth 04:08:30 but less than a gigabyte 04:11:59 shachaf: you can take tensor products of vector spaces, that's a start 04:13:21 shachaf: the tensor product of two vector spaces is defined by the universal property wrt. bilinear maps from them 04:13:22 > length (show (2^2^26)) 04:13:23 and those are defined as a left adjoint to the internal hom 04:13:26 mueval-core: Time limit exceeded 04:13:35 > length (show (2^2^27)) 04:13:37 or what you said, which is p. close to the same thing 04:13:43 mueval: signalProcess: permission denied (Operation not permitted) 04:13:43 mueval-core: Time limit exceeded 04:13:52 FireFly: HireFly 04:13:59 > length (show (2^2^28)) 04:14:02 istr something like all universal properties are adjoints 04:14:04 mueval: signalProcess: permission denied (Operation not permitted) 04:14:05 mueval-core: Time limit exceeded 04:14:14 > length (show (2^2^29)) 04:14:24 if you look at them the right way 04:14:28 mueval: signalProcess: permission denied (Operation not permitted) 04:14:28 mueval-core: Time limit exceeded 04:15:18 oerjan: well, we're talking about a slightly different one here, with (A ⊸ (B ⊸ C)) ~ (A ⊗ B ⊸ C) 04:15:28 but it's the same idea at any rate 04:15:48 a linear map from the tensor product is like a bilinear map from the cartesian product. or something 04:16:22 this is nicer than talking about multidimensional arrays but doesn't give me much intuition 04:17:11 i see a number of blank squares, and am not sure if you mean them all to be tensor products because then you're just saying associativity 04:17:23 (A -o (B -o C)) ~ (A (x) B -o C) 04:17:28 where -o is linear map 04:18:00 hm... 04:18:34 i suppose the left is the same as the set of bilinear maps from A and B to C 04:18:39 right 04:18:58 it's funny because usually you define the cartesian product first and then define exponentials in terms of it 04:19:01 (in a category) 04:19:08 but here you start with the internal hom 04:19:38 well it's not a CCC 04:19:50 but it's a MCC? 04:20:02 i think so? 04:20:38 anyway, so i should get some intuition for this operation 04:20:44 the subspaces of hilbert spaces are said to satisfy the orthomodular law 04:20:57 e.g. they say that if V and W are n- and m- dimensional, V(x)W is nm-dimensional 04:21:21 shachaf: you know for that looking at bases might actually be simplest 04:22:12 a basis for V(x)W can simply be pairs of basis elements for V and W 04:22:45 and then you can check that that fulfils the universal property 04:24:27 makes some sense, since it's linear in both of them separately 04:26:10 might wonder if you can show point-freely that the tensor product of the free vector spaces on sets S and T is a free vector space on S x T 04:26:40 perhaps that holds more generally than vector spaces 04:27:17 * oerjan leaves this to you as the CT expert btw 04:28:14 what is the "more general" version of tensor product 04:28:35 left adjoint to the internal hom? 04:28:53 hmm, there's no general definition of internal hom 04:28:59 so that doesn't worka 04:29:02 s/.$// 04:29:31 no, but you could assume that it exists and try to prove it from that? 04:29:44 what properties would it have 04:29:55 presumably you're not taking any ol' monoidal category 04:30:16 * oerjan is actually rather weak on monoidal categories hth hth 04:30:47 is hth associative 04:30:50 like a group action 04:30:52 argh 04:31:09 i keep forgetting that the script doesn't work with actions 04:31:20 why don't you just turn the script off twh 04:32:02 now that's crazy talk 04:32:07 anyway monoidal category just means you have a "product" bifunctor with an identity in the obvious way 04:32:51 anyway for the inner hom you want exponentials no? 04:33:29 well, exponentials are right adjoint to cartesian product 04:33:36 i mean categorical product. whatever it's called 04:33:39 that's not the same as tensor product 04:33:43 hmph 04:33:45 (for this case, at least) 04:34:56 ok maybe it's not easy to generalize 04:35:27 it would be a good generalization if it is 04:37:47 anyway, so this tensor product thing exists, great 04:39:09 and an tensor on V is defined to be V(x)V(x)...(x)V(x)V(x)V*(x)V*(x)...(x)V*(x)V* 04:39:24 an (n,m)-tensor, where the number of Vs is n and the number of V*s is m 04:39:46 My understanding is: basically the tensor has two types of indexes, the covariant ones which are summed over upon application, and the contravariant which are not. 04:40:10 imo one step at a time 04:40:22 what are indexes and application and summing and so on 04:40:42 i think he's referring to einstein notation 04:40:51 indexes are the dimensions of the multidimensional array 04:40:54 which is _very_ coordinate based 04:41:05 i'm not talking about multidimensional arrays right now hth 04:41:07 also does implicit summation 04:41:16 einstein notation always looked like scow to me anyway 04:41:27 but but einstein... 04:41:33 maybe it's a convenient notation when you're doing things but not convenient for figuring out what they mean 04:42:09 so V* = (V -> F), where F is our field, right? 04:42:24 why do we distinguish between covariant and contravariant Vs, given that they're isomorphic? 04:42:28 (but not naturally) 04:43:07 shachaf: because you want V and V* to live in the tangent bundle on a manifold 04:43:37 because the covariant ones are summed over, like the horizontal of a matrix,but the contravariant ones remain in the result, like the vertical of a matrix 04:43:40 basically distinguishing allows to express physics equations so they _are_ natural 04:43:59 oren: what's with the matrices hth 04:44:15 matrix is a (1,1) tensor 04:44:26 oren: please don't provoke shachaf with this low-level intuition twh hth 04:44:56 (it's how i learnt about tensors first myself, but still i don't think it's what he's after) 04:45:03 so a (1,1) tensor -- i.e. an element of V(x)V* -- is a linear map 04:45:10 yup 04:45:14 i guess it's a linear map : V* -o V 04:45:26 er, : V -o V 04:45:29 shachaf: no, V -o V 04:45:37 is a linear map : V -o W a tensor? 04:45:53 yes 04:46:00 what sort of tensor? 04:47:26 V*(x)W obviously 04:47:47 so it's a tensor product, sure, but it's not a tensor, is it? 04:48:02 i am unsure of the nomenclature here 04:48:05 and (1,1). the (n,m) tells you nothing about the size of the dimensions only their number 04:48:16 i'm going by https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tensor_(intrinsic_definition) 04:49:08 you can also say that an (n,m) tensor is a multilinear map : V x ...m... x V x V* x ...n... x V* -> F 04:49:19 where you switch which spaces are dual to keep the same variance 04:50:07 how do we go from (V -o V) to (V (x) (V -o F))? 04:54:10 a linear map from V to F would be a (0,1) tensor 04:54:20 shachaf: use the bilinear map that is simply application of the functional to the vector? 04:54:46 no wait 04:54:57 * oerjan thinking backwards 04:56:15 and a vector is a (1,0) tensor. so V (x) (V -o F) would be a (1,1) tensor (the dimensions add) 04:56:29 -!- shikhin_ has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 04:57:52 -!- skj3gg has joined. 04:58:40 -!- skj3gg has quit (Client Quit). 04:59:21 -!- adu has quit (Quit: adu). 05:00:27 if -o is the notation for a linear map then the notation for a multilinear map must be -ꙮ 05:01:03 shachaf: i think you might need to use V** ~ V in there 05:01:19 because i don't think it is true for infinite dimensional spaces 05:01:35 ok 05:03:20 (V -o V) (V -o ((V -o F) -o F)) ((V (x) (V -o F)) -o F) 05:03:26 ugh my internet connection is a class-E scow right now 05:04:30 anyway going from that last thing to V* (x) V is presumably pretty straightforward 05:04:40 MAYBE 05:04:52 * oerjan may not have the brain for this 05:05:38 you're p. helpful so far tdh hth 05:05:47 yw 05:05:57 But multiplying a (0,1) tensor and a (1,0) will only give you linear maps where all the components of result are linear to each other 05:06:11 what's multiplying tensors 05:06:49 you multiply all components with each other 05:06:53 taking the paired basis elements, basically 05:07:01 what's components 05:07:05 numbers 05:07:10 n F 05:07:27 are we somehow talking about multidimensional arrays again 05:07:53 obviously... the tensor product is defined in terms of numbers 05:08:04 in the field F 05:08:20 over which your vector space is defined 05:08:46 look we defined the tensor product already 05:08:53 with a universal property 05:08:59 and paired basis elements on top of that 05:09:01 no numbers in sight 05:10:19 ok, so i believe that a (1,1) tensor is a linear map : V -o V 05:10:47 i suppose that if you choose bases or coordinates or whatever then each element of the matrix corresponds to one pair of basis elements? 05:10:59 exactly... 05:14:10 -!- nys has quit (Quit: quit). 05:17:29 i suppose you could define the basis of the space of (1,1) tensors, as the set of linear maps which project onto the ith basis and scale the jth basis by the result... 05:18:34 did oerjan leave due to lack of brain :'( 05:19:30 previous statement not intended in the rude way that an observer without context might interpret it hth 05:19:37 symbollically... E_ij(v) = (v . e_i)e_j 05:20:01 what do these symbols mean hth 05:20:02 if i only had a brain 05:21:21 Um... E_ij is the i,jth basis element for the set of (1,1) tensors, e_i is the ith element of the basis of V, v is a arbitrary vector, . is a dot product 05:22:06 wait, don't you write e_i^j or something 05:22:30 That's for components of tensors 05:22:57 oh so what's E 05:23:20 ok you're just talking about matrices here 05:23:25 E is a list of basis elements for the set of (1,1) tensors 05:23:31 oh 05:24:42 I'm basically showing we can create a basis for the (1,1) tensors from a basis for the vectors 05:25:45 although really i dunno whther such construction can be made general 05:28:49 i guess the idea is, use the functions f_i(v) = (v . e_i) as a basis for the (0,1) tensors, given that e_i form a basis for the (1,0) tensors... 05:34:01 -!- glguy has joined. 05:35:34 then the tricky bit is proving that given a basis B for the (n,m) tensors and a basis E for the (k,l) tensors, that the products of each member of B with each member of E form a basis for (k+n,m+l) tensors 05:36:04 -!- GeekDude has quit (Quit: {{{}}{{{}}{{}}}{{}}} (www.adiirc.com)). 05:36:31 in using the matrix notation for tensors we are essentially assuming that the above is true 05:50:42 -!- FreeFull has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 05:58:33 I am confuse 06:05:08 don't worry, I am too 06:11:20 http://is.gd/k2NuAY 06:11:37 I had made 20 pancakes 06:12:04 -had 06:28:33 * oerjan expected picture of pancakes and was disappointed 06:30:18 http://esolangs.org/wiki/Pancake_Stack 06:30:29 lol 06:30:57 STILL NO PANCAKES 06:31:10 oerjan: http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lq4287y4CJ1qmqpiro1_1280.jpg hth 06:33:00 does someone want a pancake / while we've still got 'em? 06:33:12 * shachaf 06:34:08 i think you missed your cue hth 06:34:52 http://nuttygod.tumblr.com/image/108806826655 06:34:54 still missing it twh 06:34:56 Hey, it's an English-like esolang that isn't a BF derivative! 06:34:59 What about that 06:35:02 Anyways 06:35:07 ye so I made pancakes 06:35:18 Didn't eat any of them 06:35:21 shachaf: you forgot to make the proper rhyme hth 06:35:27 Wonder if could make language that looks stack based but is really BF 06:35:43 oerjan: wait is this a reference to something 06:35:52 shachaf: you just linked it 06:35:58 lol 06:36:10 oerjan: oh tdh 06:36:28 my accent must be incompatbile with that 06:36:36 ible 06:37:25 possibly it works in no accent known to man 06:37:31 i wouldn't know 06:37:51 Lilax: i'm missing emperor palpatine somewhere between 2 and 3 06:38:17 There's a flaw in the Swedish language in one small town where yes is pronounced as a sharp intake of breath 06:38:35 ,in one* 06:38:43 Man my english is bad 06:38:57 Grammatical skills for typing 06:38:58 it's more than just one small town and wasn't this discussed earlier? 06:39:16 also you cannot call it a "flaw" that's not how language works 06:39:31 Well 06:39:42 was it discussed earlier? 06:39:53 I thought it was in just one part of Sweden 06:40:09 But.. Why a sharp intake for yes. 06:41:01 Sgeo: In India they bobble their heads side to side for yes 06:41:12 Lilax: In India they bobble their heads side to side for yes 06:41:15 well _someone_ a few days ago asked me if i pronounced yes like that 06:41:37 (i don't. also i'm norwegian if anyone's confused.) 06:41:52 I know 06:41:56 (i'm also norwegian if no one's confused, but i find that unlikely.) 06:41:58 oerjan: did you answer by moving your head twh 06:42:10 shachaf: i don't remember 06:42:22 -!- FreeFull has joined. 06:42:59 i think my response head movements are pretty normal for a western european 06:43:00 Yes is Norwegian is ja 06:43:06 so no probably 06:43:17 Lilax: it's ja in swedish too 06:43:24 I say 'ya' in english too 06:43:43 I pronounce exclamations 06:43:48 I don't know why. 06:44:52 Lilax: btw the sharp intake is supposed to be simultaneous with a "ja" hth 06:44:58 'ya' sounds like no in japanese though 06:45:31 Don't you have to be exactly on point with puncuation in Japanese 06:45:46 wat 06:45:50 ixk 06:45:53 idk* 06:46:00 oren: isn't that word so impolite that they almost never use it 06:46:35 hey, what happened to the unicode haiku 06:47:17 `quote HIRAGANA 06:47:18 No output. 06:47:52 well yeah, generally no in Japanese is u-un or iie, but in a dramatic situation IYA! is the word you shout 06:48:16 you hear it a lot in anime and dramas etc. 06:49:19 shachaf: is it gone? 06:49:33 `? haiku 06:49:34 haiku? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ 06:49:41 oerjan: yes 06:49:52 maybe someone thought it was gibberish 06:50:20 is gibberish with a hard or soft g? 06:50:56 AAAAAAAAAAAAAA 06:51:30 Its 06:51:47 Pronounced in my understand jib-er-ish 06:52:03 if only english had glottal stops 06:52:13 Ye 06:52:18 what are those again 06:52:57 doesn't it have them before vowels 06:53:14 oerjan: i read jib-er-ish as if it had glottal stops 06:54:22 shachaf: there is a glottal stop in the english uh-oh... 06:54:32 there is also one in the english up and over 06:54:35 and 06:54:48 self- word here 06:54:49 shachaf: ok only at the beginning of words hth 06:55:56 imo the system where it's another consonant is better 07:00:17 the system where every letter is accented and is a vowel 07:02:57 shachaf: i cannot find any relevant removal less than 19 months old hth 07:04:06 oerjan: how about greater than or equal to 19 months old twh 07:04:24 fiendish 07:06:08 -!- pikhq has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds). 07:06:15 -!- MDude has changed nick to MDream. 07:13:52 make the 24 months hth 07:13:55 *that 07:14:30 http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/rev/85805e0c2335 07:19:04 wait, that's not evidence that it was a quote 07:19:14 maybe it was never added 07:20:17 * Sgeo would say he has successfully been advertised to... for a product that doesn't currently exist 07:20:44 Sgeo: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limonana hth 07:21:10 As far as I know that thing you linked exists. 07:21:36 did you read the history twh 07:22:01 Twh? 07:22:08 Ah 07:22:20 that would help 07:22:21 That would help? 07:23:05 shachaf: ah that proves i've search far enough back... 07:23:18 `quote swede 07:23:19 357) as always in sweden everything goes to a fixed pattern: thursday is queueing at systembolaget to get beer and schnaps, friday is pickled herring, schnaps and dancing the frog dance around the phallos, saturday is dedicated to being hung over \ 654) (I vehemently oppose the SNP because they want closer ties with Sweden 07:23:25 oops 07:23:29 `quote ꙮ 07:23:30 1138) A Swede who was in #esoteric / Thought his rhymes were a little generic. / "I might use, in my prose, / ꙮs, / But my poetry's alphanumeric." 07:23:36 maybe i was thinking of that one 07:24:45 -ꙮ is my best accomplishment of the day 07:25:04 i'll have to write a linear algbera book to popularize it 07:25:11 i'll also throw in some monad analogies 07:25:58 first you have to make it show up properly in clients hth 07:26:30 -!- Patashu has joined. 07:27:21 it shows up properly in proper clients and improperly in improper clients hth 07:27:48 fiendish 07:28:09 i do, perhaps, include putty in the setup 07:29:38 `unicode [MAHJONG TILE AUTUMN][HIRAGANA LETTER YA][SNOWMAN WITHOUT SNOW] 07:29:39 U+0000 \ UTF-8: 00 UTF-16BE: 0000 Decimal: � \ . \ Category: Cc (Other, Control) \ Bidi: BN (Boundary Neutral) \ \ U+0001 \ UTF-8: 01 UTF-16BE: 0001 Decimal:  \ . \ Category: Cc (Other, Control) \ Bidi: BN (Boundary Neutral) \ \ U+0002 \ UTF-8: 02 UTF-16BE: 0002 Decimal:  \ \ Category: Cc (Other, C 07:29:43 ff 07:29:53 `unicode [MAHJONG TILE AUTUMN] 07:29:55 U+0000 \ UTF-8: 00 UTF-16BE: 0000 Decimal: � \ . \ Category: Cc (Other, Control) \ Bidi: BN (Boundary Neutral) \ \ U+0001 \ UTF-8: 01 UTF-16BE: 0001 Decimal:  \ . \ Category: Cc (Other, Control) \ Bidi: BN (Boundary Neutral) \ \ U+0002 \ UTF-8: 02 UTF-16BE: 0002 Decimal:  \ \ Category: Cc (Other, C 07:30:00 `unicode MAHJONG TILE AUTUMN 07:30:01 ​🀨 07:30:19 `unicode HIRAGANA LETTER YA 07:30:20 ​や 07:30:39 shachaf: monads are ꙮ? probably one of the best monad analogies around 07:30:40 `unicode SNOWMAN WITHOUT SNOW 07:30:40 ​⛄ 07:30:56 whoa, hi olsner 07:31:09 `` ls bin/*slash* 07:31:09 bin/slashes \ bin/slashlearn 07:31:35 olsner: Well, you have an adjunction, so you do get a monad of some sort there. 07:31:50 `slashlearn haiku/🀨や⛄ 07:31:52 Learned «haiku» 07:32:03 `? haiku 07:32:04 ​🀨や⛄ 07:32:17 aren't you missing a character there 07:32:22 oh, maybe my client is improper 07:32:32 i don't see the last one either 07:32:38 ⛄ 07:32:46 what a scow 07:32:51 i thought i'd finally made it work 07:33:12 shachaf: there's an adjunction in ꙮ? what does that even mean 07:33:30 olsner: Well, defining the tensor product. 07:33:54 I guess you weren't around earlier. 07:33:59 I use A -o B to mean a linear map 07:34:08 So I decided to use A -ꙮ B to mean a multilinear map 07:36:26 `icode ⊸ 07:36:27 ​[U+22B8 MULTIMAP] 07:36:35 apparently unicode has a different use in mind for that character 07:37:14 shachaf: that limonana is some effective marketing 07:37:32 oerjan: would you like a glass hth 07:37:59 i'm afraid i'm very fond of lemon 07:38:02 *not 07:38:12 -!- chaosagent has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 07:38:15 i suppose the appropriate acronym to end that question with was "wth" 07:38:16 you can pour some on my fingers, they obviously like it 07:38:31 are you fond of nana 07:38:52 certainly 07:39:41 'TIL THE WHITE ROSE BLOOMS AGAAAAIN... 07:39:47 -!- pikhq has joined. 07:39:55 did you really learn that today hth 07:40:24 hmm, http://www.pagetable.com/?p=774 - apparently basic for 6502 was written in PDP-10 assembly, with macros to trick it into generating 6502 code instead 07:40:26 um no i've known that song for years? 07:41:06 the joke was how i read the first word of your sentence hth 07:41:15 oh. 07:41:24 *TILL 07:42:08 is there a difference in meaning between till and until? 07:42:25 You put money in one? 07:42:26 or 'til 07:42:42 olsner: not that i know of. 07:42:43 `thanks glguy 07:42:44 Thanks, glguy. Thuy. 07:43:43 somehow that doesn't seem appropriate like an appropriate `thanking 07:44:34 if you read glguy as a single syllable, with glg as a consonant cluster or the spelling of a weird consonant, that works I think 07:44:53 `thanks shachaf 07:44:54 Thanks, shachaf. Thachaf. 07:54:31 `thanks olsner 07:54:32 Thanks, olsner. Tholsner. 07:56:05 `thanks cranks 07:56:05 Thanks, cranks. Thanks. 07:56:34 `thanks thanks 07:56:35 Thanks, thanks. Thanks. 08:04:23 -!- shikhin has joined. 08:14:52 -!- Sprocklem_ has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 08:15:20 -!- hjulle has joined. 08:29:19 -!- stuntaneous has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds). 08:39:51 -!- FreeFull has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds). 08:51:17 -!- Lilax has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 08:52:27 -!- bb010g has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 08:52:42 -!- supay has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 08:53:21 -!- ocharles has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 08:54:05 -!- Lilax has joined. 08:58:34 -!- Lilax has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 08:59:06 -!- supay has joined. 09:04:56 -!- ocharles_ has joined. 09:06:47 -!- Lilax has joined. 09:10:00 -!- bb010g has joined. 09:26:13 -!- jameseb- has changed nick to jameseb. 09:31:37 -!- FreeFull has joined. 09:35:21 -!- Lilax has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity). 09:51:33 -!- hjulle has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds). 10:13:13 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: leaving). 11:17:00 -!- boily has joined. 11:57:31 -!- Patashu has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 11:58:56 -!- hjulle has joined. 12:07:07 -!- GeekDude has joined. 12:11:10 -!- yeah_right has joined. 12:11:11 -!- vapse has joined. 12:11:16 hi 12:11:43 need some explanation about solving one shit, who can help me? 12:12:23 http://i.imgur.com/ERVFrrx.png 12:12:28 need to solve his shit 12:17:33 -!- hjulle has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 12:22:39 Where is that from? 12:23:01 yeahello_right. it's a canal. and the sky is gray. 12:23:07 (and the sky is graaaayyy ♪) 12:23:25 -!- boily has quit (Quit: ETERNAL CHICKEN). 12:26:36 its from geocaching task 12:28:19 boily get lost 12:31:47 -!- yeah_right has left. 12:37:53 > -1 `mod` 5 12:37:54 -1 12:37:57 crap 12:38:56 > (-1) `mod` 5 12:38:57 4 12:39:05 haskell sucks 12:39:27 that parses as -(1 `mod` 5) 12:39:30 yours I mean 12:46:28 -!- vapse has quit (Quit: Page closed). 12:49:53 really? 12:49:59 no wai 12:50:04 > (-1) `mod` 5 12:50:06 4 12:50:07 lulz 12:50:13 haskell suckz modz 12:57:26 -!- Tritonio has joined. 13:10:05 -!- Tritonio_ has joined. 13:11:24 -!- Tritonio has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 13:13:32 -!- Tritonio_ has changed nick to Tritonio. 13:36:06 -!- Tritonio has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 13:41:22 -!- shikhin_ has joined. 13:45:12 -!- shikhin has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 13:55:58 -!- GeekDude has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 13:56:03 -!- G33kDude has joined. 13:56:04 -!- G33kDude has changed nick to GeekDude. 14:01:26 -!- TieSleep has changed nick to TieSoul. 14:05:20 -!- nairanvac has joined. 14:08:47 "Exercise: make identifiers as general as possible (but no more so)" 14:10:42 Context? 14:11:28 -!- Tritonio has joined. 14:11:56 > let thing = 42, process x = x+23 in process (process thing) 14:11:57 :1:15: parse error on input ‘,’ 14:12:02 > let thing = 42; process x = x+23 in process (process thing) 14:12:03 88 14:12:31 Not enough beans 14:12:55 -!- nairanvac has left ("(Byrd IRC Client // haxed.net)"). 14:12:58 maybe "thing" is too general and it should be "number" instead. I'm not sure. 14:13:02 -!- SopaXT has joined. 14:13:11 -!- Lilax has joined. 14:13:40 oh man i2p is weird 14:14:30 Melvar, it's from my uni course 14:14:59 Hey Taneb 14:15:04 o/ 14:15:16 Also bye 14:16:02 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 14:16:07 ??? 14:16:12 > all (\b -> ap (==) reverse $ showIntAtBase b ("012"!!) 24014998963383302600955162866787153652444049 "") [2,3] 14:16:13 True 14:16:47 Now I'm out of disk space. 14:20:58 That's a new one... (spam) "I got your email address from the yahoo tourist search [...]" 14:21:22 :r 14:21:31 -!- Frooxius has quit (Quit: *bubbles away*). 14:22:15 ... US$8.500,000.00 ... <-- the two decimal points are a cute touch. 14:22:42 Apparently that's a stock phrase 14:22:48 @google "yahoo tourist search" 14:22:49 http://419.bittenus.com/9/5/musawalter.html 14:22:49 Title: musa walter: I GOT YOUR CONTACT FROM YAHOO TOURIST SEARCH 14:25:14 wow I got a lot of those today, I should add the figures 14:30:21 > (4.2 + 8.5 * 0.4 + 10.5 * 0.4 + 7.3 * 0.3, 25 + 10.6) -- the latter two didn't say anything about how much I get to keep 14:30:23 (13.99,35.6) 14:30:31 that's in Million USD, of course. 14:30:37 good day. 14:30:52 Better check that the offers are not exclusive 14:31:09 they're all exclusive and confidential of course. 14:31:21 -!- oren has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 14:31:22 so damn, I guess I no longer qualify. 14:32:16 (there's an exception; the 4.2 figure is one of those refund-for-scammed-people fund meta-scams) 14:33:00 And I didn't mention the 450k Euro I won from google. 14:33:10 Maybe you should take one of those other scams so that you can qualify for the refund scam 14:34:35 maybe 14:37:17 int-e: it says $8.500,000.00, not $8,500,000.00 14:37:18 quite different 14:37:24 you would receive $8.50 14:38:12 you and I both know that's not what they meant :P 14:38:53 `quote :r 14:38:54 No output. 14:38:59 `quote quote 14:39:00 27) i can get an erection out of a plank, you can quote me on that. \ 65) Note that quote number 124 is not actually true. \ 71) let's put that in the HackEgo quotes files, just to completely mystify anyone who looks back along them in the future \ 124) Never ever use a quote which contains both the words "aloofness" a 14:39:10 ... 14:39:36 There should be quotes about meta-quotes . 14:39:37 `quote 124 14:39:38 124) Never ever use a quote which contains both the words "aloofness" and "gel" (verb). 14:39:59 `quote meta 14:40:00 308) I was more of a pervert in Metaplace than Utherverse I invented Metaplace sex >.> \ 358) i never meta turing. he died before i was born. \ 359) oerjan: can you delete that and the meta turing completeness page thanks elliott: IN UNIVERSO ALTERNATIVO, OERJAN PAGINAS DELET \ 511) o 14:40:28 `quote 511 14:40:29 511) oh no, I think we've managed to mix three metaphors in a way that actually makes sense 14:40:42 that sounds like fun 14:42:56 `quote rummy 14:42:57 431) So it's like... Rummy mixed with... breakout? 14:44:09 https://twitter.com/KeLuKeLuGames/status/557226441838833665/photo/1 15:00:09 -!- oren has joined. 15:09:58 -!- oren has quit (Quit: Lost terminal). 15:13:51 fungot, IN UNIVERSO ALTERNATIVO, OERJAN PAGINAS DELET 15:13:52 b_jonas: what's a typeclass? :) htmlprag?! :(". this isn't; it calls out to rand(3). 15:13:53 "Rapid E-Learning" 15:13:54 I see 15:15:38 fungot,