00:01:14 -!- bb010g has joined. 00:20:42 http://esolangs.org/wiki/XEec claims to be TC, but the proof is pretty dubious 00:22:36 hppavilion[1]! 00:22:38 hi 00:22:44 Hi adu! 00:22:57 how goes Dr. Hedwig Notta? 00:23:13 sorry, MetaDr. Hedwig Notta 00:37:48 <\oren\> it should be TC given that you can use 'r' toi rotate one way 'tp' to rotate other way 00:38:43 <\oren\> these can simulkate a tape 00:42:54 adu: Well he died 15+6i years from now, so... 01:01:29 I thought it was 2025+Sqrt(-2) 01:02:08 but either way, that's impossible to map to our linear timeline 01:03:25 I would like to know the solution to the halting problem for hypercomputers 01:03:56 Bascially, is there an abstract super-turing machine that can solve a TM's halting problem AND its own? 01:05:03 I think it is impossible, but, I don't know? 01:06:27 Ooooh... 01:06:36 NDFSMs sound interesting 01:06:48 [wiki] [[ShadyAsFuck]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44664&oldid=44663 * VTCAKAVSMoACE * (+133) 01:12:26 hppavilion[1]: the proof of the halting theorem only assumes that you can compose programs in certain ways, and absolutely nothing about the computational power of those programs otherwise. so the only possible loophole for a machine that can solve its own halting problem is that it does not have sufficiently composable programs. 01:12:47 *halting problem theorem 01:26:39 -!- mauris_ has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 01:27:19 I think it to be remarkable that Infocom designed the Z-machine in such a way that many strange kinds of optimizations are possible that they never used. 01:31:39 [wiki] [[Surreal Numbers]] N http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=44665 * Hppavilion1 * (+391) Initialized Page 01:33:19 [wiki] [[List of ideas]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44666&oldid=44023 * Hppavilion1 * (+129) /* Mathematics */ SURCOMPLEXES 01:35:42 One trick I use in TeX is that if \xyzzy macro is a loop then you can exit the loop by typing {\let\xyzzy} but how common is this? 01:37:41 hppavilion[1]: i'd like to point out that all your case are belong to me and will be corrected as i crawl out of the wiki backlog hth 01:38:03 this may, admittedly, take a while. 01:39:00 (upper case in words other than the first is for proper nouns hth) 01:39:37 If one were to define the Surcomplex numbers, of the form {L0|R0}+{L1|R1}i, would they be defined as the sum of a surreal number and a surreal number times the imaginary unit, or as the sum of a surcomplex number and a surcomplex number times the imaginary unit 01:39:42 ? 01:40:15 the former probably makes the most sense 01:40:34 It does, but the latter sounds like it's probably true. Because that's how math works. 01:40:43 Look at the definition of Surcomplex number see if it is found in Wikipedia? 01:40:58 (If not on Wikipedia, try something else) 01:40:59 hppavilion[1]: well the latter would be true but not a unique representation. 01:41:26 zzo38: I made up the word "Surcomplex" because I needed something to call it 01:41:53 Oh look 01:41:58 That's actually what it's called 01:42:04 It's burried in the wiki article on it 01:42:23 Yup, a and b are surreals, not surcomplexes 01:42:40 I don't expect it would be called something else; "surcomplex" seem how I would call it too 01:43:04 i assume the surreals are a https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Real_closed_field except for not being a set 01:43:30 and so their algebraic closure would be formed in the same way as for normal reals 01:45:21 oerjan: It appears that way 01:45:32 Conway's Game of Life is a 0-player game. We can do better than that. 01:45:44 We must create either a Fractional Player Game or a -1 player game. 01:46:59 Or a -1/2 player game. 01:47:13 If you can figure out how, then yes. 01:48:41 Well an n+0.5 player game could potentially be created by allowing someone to interact who is not strictly participating in the game 01:49:06 I suppose that could make D&D an n+0.5 player game, where n is the number of players other than the dungeon master 01:49:14 * hppavilion[1] has now exhausted his knowledge of D&D 01:49:51 I would not expect it though; the dungeon master is also one of the players of the game, although it is not a formal game so it doesn't matter anyways. 01:53:13 I want to make a euler diagram of number systems. For some reason, that sounds like it'd be more fun than it should be. 01:54:15 What's the value of a number with a fractional exponent where the numerator of such exponent is not 1? 01:56:08 -!- bb010g has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity). 01:56:38 a^(p/q) is the qth root of a^p hth 01:58:05 p/q should be in lowest terms. 01:58:18 a^(p/q) is (the qth root of a)^p hth 01:58:25 there'll still be multiple complex solutions 01:58:36 shachaf: um... 01:58:56 i guess parentheses weren't implied one way or the other in what you said 01:59:21 well they were. is your version more defined... 01:59:26 no 01:59:30 never mind 01:59:35 this did not work out at all 01:59:54 it should work fine for complex numbers 02:00:08 the attempt at some sort of humor 02:00:13 but your version may not need p/q in lowest terms 02:00:33 if it is, then they're probably equivalent? 02:00:42 why does your version need lowest terms? 02:00:52 ah 02:00:52 2/2 02:01:20 1^(2/2) could be -1 otherwise 02:01:33 well, the square root function isn't even defined on negative numbers 02:01:54 hmm 02:01:59 i'm not taking square root of anything negative 02:01:59 that's not what i meant to say 02:02:04 square root isn't even a function 02:02:18 i told you there would be multiple complex solutions 02:02:38 just ignore everything i've said here for the past hour 02:02:49 look 02:02:49 i suppose e^(p/q*ln a) is also good 02:03:01 and probably equivalent 02:03:02 -!- shachaf has left. 02:03:59 s/e^/exp/ 02:04:11 -!- shachaf has joined. 02:04:14 ok this doesn't work either 02:04:16 i'm trapped 02:04:24 mwahahaha 02:04:57 look the point is i want sqrt(a)sqrt(b) = sqrt(ab) 02:06:20 -!- adu has quit (Quit: adu). 02:08:16 <\oren\> font updated! only 6 characters but I did a lot of work to unglitch the width 夢羅針饂飩檎 02:08:49 What is the mindset that leads to questions like http://stackoverflow.com/q/33049458 ? 02:10:37 <\oren\> looks like typical devout onelinerism 02:11:06 <\oren\> he wants to express the twoliner as a oneliner 02:11:28 What'd be a good modern substitute for TeX? 02:11:34 <\oren\> LaTeX 02:11:41 I mean the mixup of forall and exists 02:11:44 And of => and *> 02:11:58 This person wants to write [exists a. Show a *> a] 02:12:03 I read a post where a Mathematician said that it'd be nice if we had a modern text 02:12:20 shachaf: Wut. 02:12:30 [exists a. Show a *> a] 02:12:35 <\oren\> then it's nrtm 02:12:43 <\oren\> he dnrtfm 02:12:57 it's not really the moment for that 02:12:59 I don't know what *> means, but I know that using exists there is awful 02:13:11 Wait, what's ntrm and dnrtfm? 02:13:22 <\oren\> did not read the fucking manual 02:13:27 *> isn't real Haskell (or GHC) syntax, but it would be the dual of => in the way that exists is the dual of forall 02:13:55 Non Tabacco Related Material? 02:13:58 \oren\: Ah 02:14:56 <\oren\> wait, i thought it was spelled "tobacco" 02:15:06 It is 02:15:09 I spelled it wrong 02:15:12 xD 02:15:15 Maybe 02:16:32 <\oren\> hmm. in C, a+>b should be the same as (**a).b 02:16:47 I happen to like TeX; it is good as it is and the modern stuff isn't quite as good 02:16:50 <\oren\> that would have been very helpful today 02:17:26 <\oren\> I wrote my resume in LaTeX 02:17:56 TeX is already very good. There are a lot of modern programs which you can use (including LaTeX) but I don't like them as much (nevertheless, you can use it if it is available, if you want to do so). 02:18:26 <\oren\> I mainly use LaTeX so I can use the $$ equation $$ syntax 02:19:13 The $$ syntax (called display math) is supported in Plain TeX too; it is a primitive feature of TeX 02:26:12 Do you even know how to use TeX? If you do not know, then you must learn. 02:27:42 What is the mindset that leads to questions like http://stackoverflow.com/q/33049458 ? <-- an inability to understand quantifiers beyond the syllogism stage. it might well be a majority human condition hth 02:28:04 oerjan: But people seem to make this particular confusion a lot. 02:31:54 well it adds double negation to the mix 02:31:55 zzo38: Of course TeX is good, but it's old. Here's the idea: If we manage to make a new and better TeX replacement, Awesome! Mathematical writing is now easier! If we make one that's worse, oh well, no one uses it, but it was fun to write 02:33:10 hppavilion[1]: Well, you are free to try to make up new computer program; I have nothing against that. Nevertheless some people might prefer TeX even if you like the new one, but even if a few people can use it, or at least to see the codes, then it is not so useless, isn't it? 02:33:11 What kind of format could we use for typesetting mathematics that hasn't been done before (TeX did a sort of infix function notation, MathML did XML) 02:33:34 RDF maybe? 02:33:36 zzo38: Of course, of course. That's what I'm going for 02:33:40 RDF is an idea... 02:33:40 sexps of course 02:33:55 Or alternatively JSON, or S-expressions as oerjan has said 02:33:59 sexps? perhaps... 02:34:28 I'm going to go to Wiki and see what it has to say on formats 02:35:16 YAML maybe 02:35:43 That is another possibility too 02:36:51 I could do something entirely new 02:37:10 Maybe even SQL 02:37:13 {tag arg var=arg arg: data} 02:37:14 Ooooh 02:37:21 That'd be cool 02:38:05 I suppose that which I just posted is HTMLtaggy JSON with positional arguments 02:38:48 s/HTML/XML / 02:41:34 Meh. I'll just do something normal for now. I'd like to figure out how to render stuff /before/ I start doing it weirdly 02:41:50 But all of these things being specified could also be represented with RDF (or even with each other, although they could be represented best with RDF probably if a common format is used for everything) 02:42:06 True, true 02:42:45 Whatever you do make, see if it is as powerful as TeX 02:42:50 I'll just do something LaTeXy to learn how to render, then something new when I know what I'm doing 02:42:59 zzo38: TC you mean? ;) 02:43:40 I'll call it... FormulaML for now 02:43:43 That isn't quite what I mean 02:44:11 I know xD 02:45:04 TeX isn't only for mathematics, anyways. I use it for many kind of typesetting stuff 02:45:29 I know 02:45:38 But I'm most interested in the mathy stuff xD 02:46:39 So do you have any syntax ideas? It's starting out like normal TeX, with \functionname{stuff}{stuff}, but it'll evolve from there 02:47:19 I find normal TeX syntax fine, and pretty flexible 02:47:55 OK. This'll probably just end up being my own take on TeX xD 02:49:07 I have no clue how typesetting works, so this'll really just be me bumbling my way around. Like, to the degree that I will make up my own font format most likely 02:49:11 Or maybe not 02:49:39 Just use the .TFM format for fonts 02:49:50 OK 02:50:17 Or maybe just fonts existent on the system. This'll probably be interpreted, with it just painting to a canvas 02:50:23 There are a few things with TeX that could be improved, such as using stdin/stdout so that the DVI is written to stdout instead of to a file and so on, as well as allowing error handlers to be defined, although TeX also works very well as it is and can do without such thing. 02:52:53 I'll keep thinking about this. 02:54:13 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: leaving). 02:54:58 When I mention "as powerful as TeX", Turing-completeness isn't sufficient because Turing-complete only has to do with what calculations it can perform rather than how it can be used in the program and with I/O. 02:56:41 For example, can you parse PGN with your system? (I have written a PGN and FEN parser in TeX. I have written a PBM parser too.) 02:57:48 -!- bb010g has joined. 03:01:49 I still want to see a programming language that accepts images as it's source, but Vector instead of Raster 03:02:28 I just found an amazing idea on the Ideas page. An esolang that is a derivative of itself (ideally in a way that makes it possible to deduce most of its semantics via induction, despite the lack of a base case). 03:02:34 SCIENTISTS! INVESTIGATE! 03:07:56 <\oren\> where's boily?! 夢羅針饂飩檎麻鼻麺麦鳴高駅 03:08:07 Same place as elliott? 03:08:25 <\oren\> @tell boily 羅針饂飩檎 03:08:25 Consider it noted. 03:08:37 <\oren\> he requested those five 03:22:30 The next thing I wanted to figure out is how to make ephemeris calculations using TeX (with an external data file if necessary) 03:24:29 Even if it is ephemerides for only the sun and moon, it would be sufficient to print a calendar; if you had all ephemerides (and the necessary fonts) you could print a horoscope too. 03:25:44 I think I'll add the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Π-calculus to LIME 03:26:24 OK 03:29:09 -!- \oren\ has quit (Quit: leaving). 03:34:29 -!- oren has joined. 03:35:03 changed to connect thru my server instead of locally 03:35:52 - hexedit the width at 0x122 to be 0240 and correct the checksum for the OS/2 ta 03:35:55 ble- hexedit the width at 0x122 to be 0240 and correct the checksum for the OS/2 ta 03:37:11 holy shit this new windows terminal has transparency@?!? 03:37:19 PieTTY 03:40:46 bah, too hard to read 03:42:36 i need to know how you decide whether to be called \oren\ or oren 03:43:02 In this case, it just took my username on my server 03:43:32 and made that my nick by default 03:43:45 but I like backslashes 03:47:44 -!- oren has changed nick to \oren\. 03:48:19 -!- \oren\ has changed nick to \oren{. 03:48:55 <\oren{> now my nick is like a forklift 03:49:07 -!- \oren{ has changed nick to \oren{_. 03:49:20 <\oren{_> forklift 04:20:04 -!- Wright has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 04:41:46 -!- adu has joined. 04:56:07 -!- bb010g has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity). 05:30:35 <\oren{_> Today's recommendation: 干物妹！うまるちゃん 05:59:13 Mostly I don't like transparent windows but I have used it once. 05:59:40 -!- JesseH has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 05:59:49 (In order to draw a copy of a picture into MegaZeux) 06:30:17 olsner: whoalsner 06:34:20 <\oren{_> I have no idea how I came across this terminal, but I like it a lot: http://ntu.csie.org/~piaip/pietty/ 06:38:17 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 06:40:45 <\oren{_> Phellontellom Helloovellor 06:41:13 Someone should make a https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Π-calculus haskell equivalent 06:42:27 <\oren{_> I think you mean https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/π-calculus 06:42:42 \oren{_: That's the article. 06:43:47 <\oren{_> wait wtf? the url autocorrects lowercase pi to uppercase, but the article title is lowercase? 06:45:51 <\oren{_> Hmm... so the first letter of wiki urls can be upper or lowercase and it goes to the uppercase version 06:46:09 <\oren{_> but the rest of the url is case-sensitive. assholes 06:47:11 <\oren{_> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cat https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/cat work, but https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CAt is a different article 06:48:09 -!- \oren{_ has changed nick to \oren[_. 06:49:31 That is how MediaWiki software works (although that feature can be disabled) 07:03:39 -!- bender has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 07:05:27 -!- adu has quit (Quit: adu). 07:57:18 it's not even the most annoying think about mediawiki titles 07:57:30 there are a bunch of special characters that you can't use 07:57:55 *thing 08:05:12 why does the balaclava that's used by robbers have a hole for the mouth? 08:08:50 so they can speak clearly? 08:09:23 do they need it? 08:09:49 \oren[_: I think the historical justification for it was so that article titles at the beginning of a sentence wouldn't be different from ones in the middle of a sentence. 08:10:00 \oren[_: Why do you keep adding all these characters to your nick? 08:10:08 I wish people would just stick to one nick. 08:10:38 seconded 08:11:16 izabera, well ideally you want to be able to say 'give me all the money' vs. 'mmf mm mm m mmhmm' 08:13:06 -!- ineiros has quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds). 08:14:22 -!- ineiros has joined. 08:15:41 there's a guy with a gun and you're a bank director, he points the gun to your head 08:15:55 do you need to know exactly what he's looking for? 08:16:13 "sorry i don't understand, can you take off your mask please?" 08:17:36 "i shaid mmmfh mmh money mmhhfm mothafucka!" 08:18:30 maybe he just wants to open an account to deposit the money he robbed from another bank 08:18:40 that kind of confusion is what gets people shot 08:19:28 also why not have a mouth hole? unless you have a very characteristic mouth you're not going to get identified by it 08:20:18 well i dunno, i just thought that it's exposing more than necessary 08:24:08 Or bring typewritten notes, but then it won't help for use of unexpected questions 08:24:45 -!- \oren[_ has changed nick to oren. 08:25:48 You could also just use a medical mask, those poof outwards from your mouth allowing you to speak fairly clearly 08:26:11 件企任伴伝伯伸冗刑判到制奴妹姉始嫌 08:44:28 -!- nchambers has left. 08:44:32 -!- nchambers has joined. 08:53:49 -!- bender| has joined. 08:54:58 shachaf: whoa? 08:55:42 you twitted me or something 08:56:14 ah, I may have followed you 08:56:34 also apparently you have a name that isn't olsner 08:56:51 yes, olsner was already taken 08:57:31 i mean a given name, not a username 08:57:40 anyway 08:57:44 ah, yes, my real name is completely unrelated 09:02:58 my real name is oren 09:05:30 my real name is not myname 09:06:01 i think shachafs real name is shachaf, and I'm almost certain oerjan's real name is some orthographic variant of oerjan 09:10:40 [wiki] [[ShadyAsFuck]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44667&oldid=44664 * 90.201.129.135 * (+140) 09:10:48 Hmm, I need to contact the correct authorities to help me steal my own bike 09:11:40 my trick is not to use a lock 09:12:44 [wiki] [[ShadyAsFuck]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44668&oldid=44667 * VTCAKAVSMoACE * (-4) 09:12:51 I think in my case that would be problematic as it's been on campus for 2 or 3 months now 09:13:10 One of my friends tried to unlock it overnight and broke the key 09:13:18 :D 09:14:52 Acquire bolt cutters? 09:15:24 Well, the issue is I don't want campus security thinking I'm a bike thief 09:16:01 Any proof that it's your bike? 09:16:08 (Well, if you log into the bike to prove its yours...) 09:16:44 I have half the key (the other half is still in the lock) and it has my surname written on it 09:17:01 The bike or the key? 09:17:12 -!- hppavilion[1] has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 09:17:26 The bike 09:17:46 Perhaps campus security has bolt cutters, and maybe your surname written on the bike is enough to verify that it's yours... 09:18:24 Or if it's a TSA lock, you can 3d print the necessary master key. 09:18:43 Issue is the lock was already broken when the key broke 09:19:09 In what was is that an issue? 09:19:12 s/was/way/ 09:20:10 What sort of lock is it? 09:21:09 It was one of those D locks, and I think the part of the cylinder that actually blocks it from being opened has snapped off 09:22:26 You could freeze the lock and hit it with a hammer. 09:22:43 Doesn't solve the issue of not wanting to look like a bike theif 09:22:55 I believe the porters have access to tools to remove bikes, anyway 09:23:38 I don't think there's any way not to look like a bike thief without asking somebody such as security to help you with it. You could try to do it discreetly. 09:24:07 You could dress up as a clown. 09:24:09 Or I could ask security 09:24:54 You could dress up as a bike, then hide out with the other bike for a bit, and then when nobody's looking, pounce away and make the miraculous scene of a bike riding another bike. 09:26:05 Even just holding a sign saying "I AM NOT A BIKE THIEF" might be enough to make you not look like a bike thief, I don't think they generally want to attract attention. 09:26:05 Well, that's all the advice I seem to have available, and thus I shall comatose for a few hours, perhaps hallucinate vividly too, and then suffer amnesia about the whole thing. 09:26:15 Hahah. 09:26:27 Goodnight, zgrep 09:26:52 (Although it might make you look like a bike thief with a clever plan.) 09:27:10 Or I could sit here and learn LaTeX 09:27:53 \documentclass{zZzZ} 09:29:20 The GG website seems to be undergoing some maintenance? Sigh. 09:53:43 [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * M654z * New user account 09:56:04 [wiki] [[Language list]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44669&oldid=44525 * M654z * (+9) 09:57:56 that edit seems a bit premature... 10:05:29 [wiki] [[G*]] N http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=44670 * M654z * (+763) Created page with "G* is an esoteric programming language made by [[User:M654z]] in 2015. G* was originally designed for code golfing. ===Commands=== p - Prints text q - Creates a quine l - Loo..." 10:06:02 [wiki] [[G*]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44671&oldid=44670 * M654z * (+9) 10:06:27 [wiki] [[G*]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44672&oldid=44671 * M654z * (+8) 10:06:49 [wiki] [[G*]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44673&oldid=44672 * M654z * (+10) 10:24:49 -!- zadock has joined. 10:37:39 -!- mauris_ has joined. 10:38:44 -!- zadock has quit (Quit: Leaving). 10:38:47 -!- AnotherTest has joined. 11:21:06 -!- JesseH has joined. 12:20:49 -!- VictorCL has joined. 12:21:35 -!- Patashu has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 12:22:16 -!- Patashu has joined. 12:31:09 -!- VictorCL has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 12:44:08 -!- VictorCL has joined. 12:47:13 -!- Patashu has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 12:47:36 -!- Patashu has joined. 12:52:02 -!- Patashu has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 13:08:30 [wiki] [[ShadyAsFuck]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44674&oldid=44668 * Flawr * (+114) 13:10:07 -!- gamemanj has joined. 13:19:41 G* looks like it mimics the HQ9 family of languages (a case of parallel evolution, maybe). 13:24:20 looks pretty useless 13:54:31 -!- boily has joined. 13:56:31 -!- AnotherTest has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 13:57:51 . o O ( As I said... ) 13:58:16 i like how the l command is practically useless 14:11:06 -!- Wright has joined. 14:29:52 -!- Wright has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 14:30:13 -!- AnotherTest has joined. 14:30:15 -!- Wright has joined. 14:36:09 `wisdom 14:36:10 drone sex/Drone sex has never been observed in the wild; in fact it's rare to see drones in their natural habitat because they are extremely shy. Controlled experiments with drones in captivity have only resulted in broken drones, and a rotor stuck in the ceiling. We are still looking for a biological explanation for the ever increasing drone popul 14:36:15 @massages-loud 14:36:15 \oren\ said 11h 27m 49s ago: 羅針饂飩檎 14:36:59 @tell \oren\ ありがとうございます！ 14:37:00 Consider it noted. 14:51:49 "a biological explaination for the ever increasing drone population"? Such a thing exists? 14:54:07 wisdom is always factually accurate 14:56:03 `` culprits wisdom/drone\ sex # disclosure 14:56:05 int-e mroman 15:02:33 `` sed -i 's=Controlled e=E=' wisdom/drone\ sex 15:02:35 No output. 15:23:49 But how on earth would drone birth work? 15:24:06 Do they carry little 3d-printer filaments? 15:26:32 gamemanj: sounds plausible 15:29:07 Motherships... 15:30:52 So... do they 3d-print little parts, and then they attach them all together? What about the microchips? 15:31:29 Oh... of course. That's another reason it wouldn't work in captivity, either... they wouldn't have anywhere to steal them from. 15:33:10 -!- bender| has quit (Quit: [brb in a few seconds]). 15:50:03 -!- J_Arcane has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 15:50:05 `tail -c 100 wisdom/drone\ sex 15:50:05 tail: 100 wisdom/drone\ sex: invalid number of bytes 15:50:08 `run tail -c 100 wisdom/drone\ sex 15:50:09 eiling. We are still looking for a biological explanation for the ever increasing drone population. 16:15:24 -!- evalj has joined. 16:15:56 ] 4*(_1+3*3)*2*2 16:15:57 b_jonas: 128 16:19:30 -!- llue has joined. 16:20:11 -!- lleu has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 16:20:56 -!- llue has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 16:21:13 -!- llue has joined. 16:26:27 -!- J_Arcane has joined. 16:53:30 -!- VictorCL has quit (Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…). 17:07:35 -!- boily has quit (Quit: TOWER CHICKEN). 17:26:46 -!- oren has changed nick to \oren\. 17:26:55 <\oren\> @messages-loud 17:26:55 boily said 2h 49m 56s ago: ありがとうございます！ 17:30:19 -!- Sprocklem has joined. 17:31:00 -!- copumpkin has joined. 17:33:02 -!- contrapumpkin has joined. 17:35:02 Sometimes, due to my social awkwardness, I forget that I'm actually quite extroverted 17:35:17 I mean, compared to introverts, at least 17:35:30 -!- copumpkin has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 17:35:31 that may depend on the definition imo 17:36:11 I guess 17:36:13 i.e. there seem to be something like "extroverts are good at talking to people" as opposed to "introverts feel most comfortable alone" 17:36:32 I don't think those two are mutually exclusive 17:36:43 exactly that's my point 17:36:55 i don't feel lile belonging to any of these 17:39:43 -!- gr8 has joined. 17:40:17 -!- gr8 has left. 17:40:40 -!- ^v has joined. 17:45:44 Taneb: there's that joke that an introverted mathematician is one who looks at their own shoes when he's talking to someone, and an extroverted one is one who looks at the addressed person's shoes. 17:46:03 :D 17:49:08 i know that one with computer scientists 17:49:13 it may be more true there 17:51:45 Well, yesterday I facilitated a bar crawl for CS students 17:52:56 myname: probably both, yes 17:54:11 Some people seemed to be both computer scientists AND social! 17:54:45 What is it call the mathematician who look at both people's shoes in order to compare? 17:55:11 Taneb: well, people do believe i am.social 17:55:21 zzo38: ambivert 17:55:27 i ave no idea why they do think so, tbh 18:04:09 -!- J_Arcane has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 18:14:35 -!- J_Arcane has joined. 18:23:42 -!- adu has joined. 18:25:59 -!- aretecode has quit (Quit: Toodaloo). 18:30:42 -!- boily has joined. 18:35:50 `wisdom 18:35:52 delve/Delve is a static ability that functions while the spell with delve is on the stack. “Delve” means “For each generic mana in this spell’s total cost, you may exile a card from your graveyard rather than pay that mana.” The delve ability isn’t an additional or alternative cost and applies only after the total cost of the spell with 18:36:07 `` culprits wisdom/delve 18:36:08 tswett 18:36:29 tswett: tswellott. I think the text cuts off prematurely. 18:39:08 `wisdom 18:39:09 urbandictionary/Urban Dictionary is an alternative, inferior wisdom database. 18:40:15 -!- J_Arcane_ has joined. 18:40:37 -!- J_Arcane has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 18:40:41 -!- J_Arcane_ has changed nick to J_Arcane. 18:41:13 -!- heddwch has left ("Leaving"). 18:45:51 except when you are looking at space docking 18:47:43 [wiki] [[ShadyAsFuck]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44675&oldid=44674 * VTCAKAVSMoACE * (+243) 18:48:35 mynamello. space docking? 18:48:59 containerizing the universe... brilliant idea, myname! 18:49:29 -!- ais523 has joined. 18:51:04 b_jonas: i dare you to urbandictionary it 18:51:13 boily: i meant you 18:51:17 wtf irssi 18:51:51 I have the same problem. oerjan and olsner are the same person, as are mauris and mroman. 18:52:08 boily: what? isn't oerjan the same person as oren? 18:52:16 or is that no longer since he uses the nick \oren\ ? 18:52:22 I ain't be urbandictionnarying no word. my expertise lays with recording the Wisdom. 18:53:40 \oren\ has backslashes, so they seceded from the oerljansner fusion. 18:58:33 <\oren\> yeah it is an advantage of having backslashed 18:59:28 an escaped oren! 18:59:57 i disagree 19:05:23 <\oren\> `? csv 19:05:24 CSV猫stands猫for猫Cat猫Separated猫Values 19:05:46 hmm... needs more emoji 19:08:43 -!- J_Arcane_ has joined. 19:08:52 <\oren\> hijarcane 19:09:00 -!- J_Arcane has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 19:09:11 -!- J_Arcane_ has changed nick to J_Arcane. 19:09:34 <\oren\> hĳ_arcane 19:25:06 -!- Sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 19:35:38 -!- rdococ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 19:50:23 -!- FreeFull has quit (Quit: BBS). 19:51:19 -!- FreeFull has joined. 19:51:27 -!- FreeFull has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 19:51:59 -!- FreeFull has joined. 19:52:22 -!- FreeFull has changed nick to Guest91729. 19:52:33 -!- Guest91729 has quit (Client Quit). 19:52:37 -!- burraelicanaima7 has joined. 19:53:06 :-D 19:53:32 -!- burraelicanaima7 has left. 19:54:04 -!- adu has quit (Quit: adu). 19:54:38 -!- FreeFull_ has joined. 19:54:55 -!- FreeFull_ has quit (Changing host). 19:54:56 -!- FreeFull_ has joined. 19:55:10 -!- FreeFull_ has quit (Client Quit). 19:56:40 -!- adu has joined. 20:00:25 -!- adu has quit (Client Quit). 20:01:08 -!- ais523 has quit (Quit: in search of food). 20:01:38 -!- Sprocklem has joined. 20:04:00 -!- FreeFull has joined. 20:05:11 -!- boily has quit (Quit: QUININE CHICKEN). 20:08:55 -!- hppavilion[1] has joined. 20:09:31 Y'know, Magic seems to have a lot of things that are similar to alternative cost. 20:09:42 like? 20:10:20 Well, there's "as an alternative cost, you may do X"; "you may pay this cost by doing X"; and "you may do X instead of paying this cost". 20:10:33 http://amzn.to/13VVqS2 wat 20:10:39 IIUC, Phyrexian mana symbols use the second option, and Delve uses the third. 20:11:08 Actually, let me double-check Delve. 20:12:07 Looks like I'm wrong. http://mtgsalvation.gamepedia.com/Delve says: "Exiling a card this way is simply another way to pay that cost." 20:12:36 I think delve doesn't change the cost (so you can still activate mana abilities even if it can be paid without mana), but Phyrexian mana requires you to choose at the beginning (as you are choosing the modes) whether the cost will be life or mana. 20:15:01 Is that so? 20:15:22 no, that changed 20:17:10 Changed into what? 20:17:47 Hellu 20:18:01 tswett: note that some of the remainder text, such as the new reminder text for the Con-thingy mechanic of Selesnya, may be abbreviated to use templating the rules text wouldn't normally do. 20:19:50 -!- Sprocklem has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 20:27:07 <\oren\> Bad kerning as a sound change: e.g. /cl/ → /d/, /vv/ → /w/, or, more spectacularly, /rri/ → /m/ (the origin of the infamous “hurrianist–humanist” merger). 20:29:03 So I have bluetooth, powerful data manipulation libraries, touchscreen control, amazing hardware-accellerated GUI, server software, the Skype API, etc. All in python. 20:29:15 Now I need to think of something to do with my evil technology 20:29:38 (oh, also, text-to-speech, hotkeys, and sending keypresses to the OS) 20:30:06 Perhaps I could find something for speech recognition and roll my own Programmer's Siri? 20:30:34 zzo38: you can pay for phyrexian mana with either life or mana 20:30:51 Or perhaps I could work on Junction 20:31:24 \oren\: +1 20:32:03 <\oren\> note I didn't invent that, I saw it as a search result for bad kerning rri m 20:32:24 coppro: Yes, but it is rule 601.2b says how to figure out Phyrexian mana, but delve is figured out during 601.2h, that is what the rules says, isn't it? 20:33:55 Maybe Yawgatog has not been updated; the last rule updates are from 2015 July 17 20:34:46 \oren\: I've seen that blog. 20:34:53 I've contributed a few ideas to it. 20:35:56 Let's see, which ideas of mine do I still like? 20:36:07 "Consonants are written on one side of the paper, vowels on the other." 20:36:13 "The writing system only indicates prosody, not consonants or vowels." 20:36:26 "A conversation consists of a game of Go. Anyone who can’t communicate clearly while still playing at at least a 10 kyu level is considered uneducated." 20:36:37 "Every phoneme is a chord. The language can only be spoken by at least three people in tandem (or one person with an appropriate musical instrument). Everyone always carries around a tuning fork to use as a pitch reference, for correct understanding." 20:37:24 i like the last one 20:42:22 -!- ski_ has joined. 20:43:08 "Consonants are written on one side of the paper, vowels on the other." -- that one can basically happen with some languages if you rotate the paper and write only one line, I think. 20:43:49 -!- SirCmpwn_ has joined. 20:43:50 "A conversation consists of a game of Go. Anyone who can’t communicate clearly while still playing at at least a 10 kyu level is considered uneducated." -- hehe, nice 20:44:49 -!- perrier has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 20:44:58 -!- perrier_ has joined. 20:45:07 I don't know about go, but "A conversation consists of . Anyone who can't communicate clearly while is considered uneducated." is a great template, you can have a lot of languages and programming languages on that theme. 20:45:51 Such as, chef and Shakespear which are esolangs where the programs pretend to be something else but also contain steganographed instructions for the program. 20:46:14 Or speaking natural languages constrained to some particular poetic form. 20:47:40 -!- Gregor` has joined. 20:49:07 -!- SirCmpwn has quit (Killed (wolfe.freenode.net (Nickname regained by services))). 20:49:08 -!- SirCmpwn_ has changed nick to SirCmpwn. 20:51:16 -!- aretecode has joined. 20:53:34 -!- ski has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 20:54:45 -!- vifino has quit (*.net *.split). 20:54:45 -!- Gregor has quit (*.net *.split). 21:00:12 -!- vifino has joined. 21:00:39 -!- TieSoul has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 21:03:55 Another idea of Magic: the Gathering cards, this one being a land card: Can be played from your sideboard. ;; {T}, Sacrifice ~: Add {1} to your mana pool. 21:05:29 Can be played from your sideboard. ;; ~ comes into play tapped. ;; {T}, Sacrifice ~: Add {1} to your mana pool. 21:05:54 -!- ais523 has joined. 21:11:23 do not play more than one ~ from the sideboard per round? 21:11:43 hmm, I guess "turn" is the term 21:12:15 It is a land, so you cannot play more than one land per turn at all 21:12:23 duh. right 21:12:46 zzo38: what is this card? note that even if it comes into play tapped and produces {1}, it is probably still brokenly powerful 21:14:31 Yes, probably, but if it is restricted or banned then how powerful is it? 21:14:55 if it's banned then it doesn't matter how powerful it is (see: Contract from Below) 21:15:07 if it's restricted, I imagine nearly all decks would play one copy 21:15:35 Even if restricted or banned doesn't prevent you from using it if it is drafted though. 21:15:44 (note: I'm currently assuming: "Land. You may play ~ from outside the game. ~ enters the battlefield tapped. {T}: Add {1} to your mana pool.") 21:15:58 no, banned works on drafted cards too I think 21:16:11 but different formats have different banlists 21:16:16 and most banlists are aimed at constructed formats 21:16:33 I don't think so; banned cards are allowed in limited formats. 21:16:52 (I think they once prebanned a card, probably for this reason.) 21:17:00 zzo38: I don't think Contract from Below would be allowed in Alpha draft 21:17:14 also they once prebanned Memory Jar, but not because they wanted it for Draft only 21:17:22 it's because they only realised how brokenly powerful it was after it had already been printed 21:17:34 I'm not even sure Draft was an officially supported format at the time 21:18:24 As I understand it, even if it were "legal" in Alpha draft, you'd remove it from your library before you began playing. 21:18:26 If you are playing an Alpha draft without ante then of course Contract from Below is disallowed. 21:18:32 Because ante. 21:18:36 pikhq: right 21:18:44 wouldn't that still let you run less than 40 cards though? 21:18:58 I... don't know. 21:19:09 ais523: Depend how it is checked; I would expect that it does not allow 21:19:16 (admittedly this is a somewhat moot point, because it seems unlikely that anyone will be able to collect enough Alpha boosters into one place at once to be able to draft it) 21:19:50 Unless you use proxies, but in that case it is unofficial and you can define other tournment rules too 21:20:21 Every now and then an unopened *box* of Alpha shows up. 21:20:55 A variant rule can be you can play it, but the ante zone starts empty; if you play Contract from Below and then lose, your opponent has that card for the remainder of the current match only and then after that your score is decreased by the anted card's value. 21:21:25 <\oren\> mAbE I Sud start wRkiG on a gramR riform tU gO wiT mI speliG riform 21:21:39 Does m:tg have cards that can be played from outside the game (without playing a wish-like card in game first)? 21:21:55 Another strangely idea is a card that can be played from the ante zone. 21:22:09 Not to my knowledge, unless you count Un-. 21:22:39 (Or that has a static ability that works from the ante zone) 21:22:47 pikhq: I don't think Un- does either 21:23:04 (Or triggered) 21:23:07