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00:27:09 <hppavilion[1]> I've got a λ-calculus parser up and running, but I'm not sure how to evaluate, or what evaluation would even look like
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00:35:34 <tswett> Find a place where you've got a lambda-function applied to something.
00:35:45 <tswett> Perform alpha-conversion if necessary, then perform beta-reduction.
00:35:59 <tswett> If you can't find such a place, you're done evaluating.
00:36:07 <tswett> 'Course, there are several different evaluation orders you can use...
00:36:58 <fizzie> You should use normal order, because all the others are abnormal.
00:44:00 <hppavilion[1]> A language designed to be archaeologically analyzed
00:45:28 <hppavilion[1]> It would be designed to have a vast, complex syntax and subtle semantics
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00:55:57 <hppavilion[1]> lifthrasiir: The /point/ is that it's just released onto the web one day
00:57:38 <hppavilion[1]> lifthrasiir: And the people of the world are expected to decrypt the meaning of the language
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00:58:45 <FireFly> You could find a lot of unintentional examples of that if you s/language/bytecode/
00:59:27 <FireFly> That is, you could find examples of undocumented bytecode formats being reverse-engineered. I'm thinking of scripting engines in games mainly
01:01:14 <FireFly> (which, by the way, is pretty fun...)
01:01:14 <hppavilion[1]> FireFly: What do you think of the idea though? A diggable language?
01:01:37 <FireFly> I dunno, it sounds a bit weird to intentionally design it for that, but I guess it could work
01:01:40 <hppavilion[1]> Only problem with me doing this is I'm not good at languages I can compile xD
01:02:01 <hppavilion[1]> And it kind of defeats the purpose if you can look at the source
01:02:46 <hppavilion[1]> (though it would make things go faster, as you can check for evilness if it's PD)
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01:20:51 <hppavilion[1]> FreeFull: The people on ##programming like the idea :)
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02:59:58 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * YoshikuniJujo * New user account
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03:10:57 <hppavilion[1]> We're having a sudden growth in new user join rate
03:14:10 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Zot]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=46289&oldid=31882 * YoshikuniJujo * (+71)
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03:44:48 <lifthrasiir> well, imagine a hoard of users that search "trump" from /list
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05:25:38 <Sgeo_> hppavilion[1], similar to Smalltalk?
05:26:25 <hppavilion[1]> Sgeo_: Until somebody solves some complex problem (perhaps producing full, accurate docs?)
05:26:46 <hppavilion[1]> Then they are granted the source, with which they can do as they wish
05:27:17 <hppavilion[1]> Sgeo_: It's not a non-FOSS thing, it's a preventing cheating thing
05:27:27 <Sgeo_> Oh, censorship, not inherent
05:28:04 <Sgeo_> I need to not have a fever
05:29:23 <hppavilion[1]> It wouldn't be fun if you could see the source- oh, night
05:29:53 <Sgeo_> Was thinking source doesn'
05:29:59 <Sgeo_> doesn't even exist
05:30:35 <hppavilion[1]> Sgeo_: No, the source just isn't provided because otherwise you could look at it and it wouldn't be fun
05:31:55 <hppavilion[1]> I'd like to provide the source, but there's no game if I do
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06:09:54 <adu> hppavilion[1]!
06:10:19 <adu> that's almost my nick
06:12:40 <adu> so if an algorithm is defined in terms of bits, but it's implemented in terms of int64's, is it a bit algorithm, or a word algorithm?
06:12:43 <lifthrasiir> between ] and ! there are a series of tag characters for "IMPLIED GREETING TAG"
06:13:31 <adu> ! not in "that"
06:13:38 <hppavilion[1]> adu: It's a qucomplex (like complex, but qubits instead of bits) algorithm
06:15:05 <adu> here's what I don't get, qubits are 3-states, up, down, and 90 degrees from the pole, but the there are an infinite number of possible states, but only 3 are recognized...
06:16:08 <adu> I think we should start with 7 states 3 above, 3 below, and 1 for the 90 degree state, and then gradually improve with technology
06:16:32 <adu> then we could have 127-qubit processors, then 1024-qubit processors, etc...
06:17:13 <hppavilion[1]> adu: It's 1, 0, or some probabilistic superposition of both
06:17:41 <adu> oh, right, and it's the superposition that can be prime oracle
06:18:17 <adu> There was one guy who spent 10 years building a quantum computer that can factor "15"
06:19:23 <adu> yeah, pretty impressive, but still not hack-the-world level
06:20:15 <hppavilion[1]> adu: I think I just found what is probably the only Wikipedia article with this combination of categories:
06:20:58 <hppavilion[1]> adu: Oh, and the probabilities are apparently complex numbers
06:21:21 <adu> complex numbers are very simple, actually
06:21:30 <adu> it's quaternions that are complex
06:22:45 <adu> do you know my favorite complex number?
06:23:40 <adu> the absolute value is 5
06:24:32 <adu> also, because it's more real than imaginary :)
06:24:32 <myname> well, it's just a pythagorean triple
06:25:57 <adu> my favorite real number would have to be 1.6353244967152763993453446183...
06:26:07 <adu> and my favorite integer is 65536
06:26:19 <myname> https://youtu.be/GO6TsdwxcwM
06:27:06 <myname> also https://youtu.be/ZoT82NDpcvQ
06:28:48 <myname> as you can see in both videos: there are at least 4 interesting states
06:28:49 <adu> 1.635... is the supremum of the interval of convergence of y = x^^y
06:29:17 <adu> so qubits are 5-state?
06:29:40 <myname> well, infinitely many, but how do you come to 5?
06:29:56 <adu> myname: I'm just trying to understand quantum mechanics
06:30:05 <adu> currently, I don't
06:30:12 <myname> take a look at the two videos
06:30:55 <myname> also, there was a neat talk at 32c3
06:30:58 * adu is currently running several computations while watching Continuum, when the episode is over, I'll look at the videos
06:31:46 <myname> the talk from 32c3 is german, though
06:37:54 <adu> hppavilion[1]: the movie?
06:38:27 <adu> http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0477051/
06:39:18 <hppavilion[1]> adu: But what's the correspondence between bits and qubits? Do you know?
06:53:12 <myname> qubits collapse to bits
06:53:39 <\oren\> my favorite real number is only hypothetical
06:54:06 <\oren\> it's the unthinkable number closest to 1
06:56:18 <\oren\> unthinkable numbers are those for which no formula could be written, even in theory
06:56:42 <myname> well, it exists in hyperreals
06:58:22 <\oren\> not because the number is infinite or anything, but because the sequence of digits is truly random, and therefore to identify the number requires an infinite amount of information
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06:58:57 <myname> no, you just gave all the information: the smallest positive number
06:59:44 <\oren\> the smallest number such that it is unthinkable
07:00:24 <\oren\> among numbers for which no formula can be written, the one closest to 1
07:01:40 <myname> you don't have to write a formula for a number to exist
07:03:15 <myname> but on the other hand, "the smallest number without a formula" can most likely be expressed as a formula
07:05:47 <myname> my math teacher used to teach us that math is a language
07:06:25 <\oren\> so with for example godel numbering, you can enumerate all formulae for real numbers.
07:06:59 <myname> well, yeah, that's what gödel did, isn't it?
07:07:22 <\oren\> then you find that, although the real numbers are uncountable, the real numbers that can actually be thought of or used are countable!
07:08:34 <adu> \oren\: so it's a real number that is in a neighborhood of 1
07:08:55 <myname> "A The complement of A"
07:09:05 <myname> this book is going to be fun
07:09:39 <\oren\> is there supposed to be a accent on that A?
07:10:00 <myname> i can't see any. may be due to bad scanning
07:11:33 <adu> I see "A The ..."
07:11:54 <adu> and I have unicode fonts
07:12:12 <adu> so if there was something to see, I would see it
07:12:41 <adu> "gödel" comes thru
07:13:00 <myname> what's wrong with gödel
07:13:52 <\oren\> adu: he's saying the book doesn't have the accents, because of some sort of error
07:13:56 <myname> that computational linguistics thingie that was "recommended" here yesterday
07:17:12 <myname> statistical natural language processing
07:24:14 <adu> ᵃᵇ?ᵈᵉ?ᵍʰⁱʲᵏˡᵐⁿᵒᵖ?ʳˢᵗᵘᵛʷˣʸᶻ
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08:40:27 <hppavilion[1]> Does untyped Quantum λ-calculus make any sense? Something with the nice λs so I feel safe reading it? xD
08:41:16 <myname> if all you have is a hammer :p
08:41:51 <mroman> but you may not use this hammer for commercial purposes
08:42:07 <mroman> also you may only use it to hammer in nails produced by $company
08:42:10 <mroman> everything else is illegal
08:42:17 <lambdabot> oerjan said 17h 11m 36s ago: blub. blib blub blub!
08:42:40 <mroman> that would be the case if the hammer were software
08:43:02 <mroman> such licenses should be illegal.
08:43:17 <mroman> If I get a product I should be allowed to use it like I want to
08:43:32 <mroman> (unless I'm using it against other laws such as not killing people)
08:43:43 <mroman> but otherwise I should be allowed to do whatever the fuck I want with it.
08:44:23 <mroman> if a hammer were software people could demand that they get a revenue share of everything you build with that hammer.
08:44:47 <mroman> "Ow see, you built this house with our hammer and that means we now own part of that house because you used our tool to construct it."
08:48:28 <mroman> Nintendo is doing something like that with YouTube revenue :)
08:49:02 <mroman> you gotta share your revenues with Nintendo as soon as you have at least one video in your channel featuring nintendo content.
08:49:23 <mroman> they are going to collect money from people now that advertise your product for free on the internet
08:49:34 <mroman> that's like ... the most capitalist thing ever ...
08:50:52 <mroman> "See, you bought our hammer and teach courses on how to hammer with it to people for money. Since it's our hammer we're entitled that you share your total income with us."
08:51:38 <mroman> where can I lobby against these kind of companies :(
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09:31:16 <fizzie> mroman: You asked whether the microphone in a smartphone works underwater.
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10:14:22 <mroman> sound travels underwater
10:14:35 <mroman> not very good but it travels
10:45:43 <HackEgo> 147) <ais523> syntax is the least important part of a programming language <ais523> other than Python
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11:12:54 <j-bot> Taneb: |value error: help
11:14:03 <Taneb> What's the character for j-bot?
11:14:31 <Taneb> fungot: what's the character for j-bot?
11:14:32 <fungot> Taneb: the latter, usually only way for it to compile!
11:14:49 <Taneb> Thanks, fungot, but that's not quite what I meant
11:14:49 <fungot> Taneb: a good first choice, but i don't use any linux at all. it is _much_ harder than trying to find
11:16:08 <Taneb> ( 4 * log 5 / log 2
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11:55:08 <boily> hellørjan. floating brackets.
11:56:25 <oerjan> helloily. li(ke thi)s?
11:57:09 <boily> . o O ( somebody set us up the bomb! )
11:57:39 <izabera> https://github.com/ryna4c2e/sed-brainfuck https://github.com/svbatalov/bf.sed
11:57:46 <oerjan> @tell mroman mroman said 3h 14m 31s ago: what? <-- blub. you no speak fish?
11:58:18 <boily> izabellora. are you svbatalov?
11:58:24 <oerjan> @tell mroman i've forgotten why i spoke fish, except that there was a good reason. try the logs.
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12:03:51 <izabera> and now there's a sed process that's eating 100% of my cpu trying to sing 100 bottles of beer on the wall
12:05:12 <boily> 100% of cpus on the wall ♪
12:10:42 <izabera> it actually worked, took 7m12.5s but it worked
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12:13:45 -!- oerjan has set topic: Go tromp et al.! | The international hub for magic gathering and deployment. | Effi's finest fluffy waffles | https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2023808/wisdom.pdf http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/ http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | https://esolangs.org/ | 100% of cpus on the wall ♪.
12:14:47 <HackEgo> boily is monetizing a broterhood scheme with the Guardian of Lachine, apparently involving cookie dealing. He's also a NaniDispenser, a Trigotillectomic Man Eating Chicken and a METARologist. He is seriously lacking in the f-word department.
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12:20:48 <oerjan> my left arrow key is lagging too :(
12:22:02 <oerjan> or seemingly missing occasional presses
12:23:46 <fizzie> oerjan: The reason was a discussion on whether smartphone microphones work underwater hth
12:23:56 <fizzie> For fish, not for lagging keys.
12:24:21 <fizzie> (I told this to mroman as well.)
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12:40:00 <lambdabot> [1.0,1.63,2.21751106303051,2.95480183600564,4.23615968785223,7.9224695022536...
12:45:04 <oerjan> this doesn't work and i have no idea what adu meant
12:49:23 <oerjan> @tell adu the weirdness of qubits is such that the answer to how many states they have is either (a) 2, like ordinary bits; or (b) that's meaningless, you cannot think of the global quantum state as separated into the individual qubits.
12:53:24 <fizzie> fungot: You're running on a Linux system, I don't think you can say you don't use any Linux at all.
12:53:24 <fungot> fizzie: yes tell me how to not care. i just wish someone could translate the ca 10 haskell lines to scheme for you. i spent too much time
12:53:35 <fizzie> fungot: Don't you get uppity with me.
12:53:35 <fungot> fizzie: a fnord c-like language for making bot ai's for a game
12:54:07 <fizzie> fungot: You *are* a bot AI for the game called IRC.
12:54:07 <fungot> fizzie: didn't work too insanely well as you can get some food
12:56:10 <oerjan> @tell adu or put differently, there are only two _well_-defined states for a qubit to be in, all other states only make sense as states of the whole system of qubits.
13:02:42 <oerjan> @tell \oren\ <\oren\> it's the unthinkable number closest to 1 <-- there is no such number. the impossible part isn't the "unthinkable", but the "closest to 1" hth
13:03:56 * oerjan thinks the logs are disturbingly full of shoddy math today
13:05:30 <izabera> would you waste time to optimize +++, to , ?
13:05:53 <oerjan> @tell \oren\ proof: clearly 1 is not unthinkable. if x is unthinkable, then (1+x)/2 is also unthinkable, but closer to 1. thus no closest exists QED.
13:06:54 <izabera> pro: obviously better con: only improves stupid programs
13:07:41 <oerjan> izabera: note that "stupid" includes "auto-generated"
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13:09:54 <izabera1> wtf my amazon server is offline
13:10:27 * oerjan has a feeling the universe doesn't want him to spread his wisdom today.
13:11:00 <lambdabot> oerjan said 1h 13m 13s ago: mroman said 3h 14m 31s ago: what? <-- blub. you no speak fish?
13:11:00 <lambdabot> oerjan said 1h 12m 36s ago: i've forgotten why i spoke fish, except that there was a good reason. try the logs.
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13:11:46 <mroman> > group $ iterate (1.63**) 1
13:11:48 <lambdabot> [[1.0],[1.63],[2.21751106303051],[2.95480183600564],[4.23615968785223],[7.92...
13:12:13 <mroman> > filter (\c -> (length c) >= 2) $ group $ iterate (1.63**) 1
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13:12:33 <oerjan> mroman: i seriously doubt that converges, which is why i wondered wtf adu meant
13:12:43 <mroman> yeah but double has finite precision
13:12:49 <mroman> so I thought at some point it wouldn't change anymore
13:13:01 <mroman> (because of precision limitation)
13:13:04 <oerjan> well it would reach +INF
13:13:19 <mroman> > filter (\c -> (length c) < 2) $ group $ iterate (0.63**) 1
13:13:22 <lambdabot> [[1.0],[0.63],[0.7474541304505948],[0.7079722983415685],[0.7210056493825268]...
13:13:30 <mroman> > filter (\c -> (length c) >= 2) $ group $ iterate (0.63**) 1
13:13:37 <oerjan> > drop 10 $ iterate (1.63**) 1
13:13:39 <lambdabot> [Infinity,Infinity,Infinity,Infinity,Infinity,Infinity,Infinity,Infinity,Inf...
13:13:54 <mroman> > group $ drop 10 $ iterate (1.63**) 1
13:13:56 <lambdabot> [[Infinity,Infinity,Infinity,Infinity,Infinity,Infinity,Infinity,Infinity,In...
13:13:59 <oerjan> the point is, it's not actually _converging_, it's growing faster
13:14:22 <mroman> it can't calc the length of that group of infinities
13:14:29 <mroman> how large is a group of infinities?
13:14:49 <mroman> it contains infinity infinitely many times
13:14:54 <mroman> so it's SUPER INFINITE
13:15:01 <oerjan> > group $ replicate 3 (1/0)
13:15:16 <oerjan> oh you already checked that
13:16:50 <oerjan> also it's lazy enough to give the infinities, but it would hang if you ever try to find the next group.
13:17:23 <mroman> but grouping that contains a list of infinite infinity
13:17:56 <oerjan> mroman: you know that m*m = m when m infinite cardinality is a theorem equivalent to the axiom of choice, right?
13:18:37 <oerjan> well it means you cannot super infinite that way
13:18:40 <mroman> if the list is [1,2,3,Infinity,Infinity,Infinity,Infinity....]
13:18:48 <oerjan> (power sets work, of course)
13:18:54 <mroman> you have 3 elements of length 1
13:18:57 <mroman> and one element of length infinity
13:19:04 <mroman> so map (length) on that grouped list would hang
13:19:15 <oerjan> yep. as would length itself
13:19:25 <mroman> that's why the length >= 2 doesn't work
13:19:33 <mroman> it should work with atLeastTwo
13:20:11 <oerjan> well then you get the problem that it hangs if you try to get the "next" group
13:20:20 <mroman> > let atLeastTwo (x:y:_) = True; atLeastTwo _ = False in filter atLeastTwo $ group $ iterate (0.63**) 1
13:20:32 <mroman> at least in my head this would've worked
13:20:44 <mroman> > let atLeastTwo (x:y:_) = True; atLeastTwo _ = False in head $ filter atLeastTwo $ group $ iterate (0.63**) 1
13:21:01 <oerjan> it doesn't work because it doesn't know that there is no more groups after the infinite one
13:21:17 <oerjan> _that_ should have worked.
13:21:30 <mroman> > let atLeastTwo (x:y:_) = True; atLeastTwo _ = False in head . head $ filter atLeastTwo $ group $ iterate (0.63**) 1
13:21:33 <mroman> this' should give Infinity
13:21:46 <mroman> @type let atLeastTwo (x:y:_) = True; atLeastTwo _ = False in head . head $ filter atLeastTwo $ group $ iterate (0.63**) 1
13:22:04 <mroman> y u not working like u should man
13:22:16 <mroman> atLeastTwo shouldn't hang
13:22:39 <oerjan> and it should never look at more than the first
13:23:14 <oerjan> you're using 0.63 instead of 1.63
13:23:41 <oerjan> > drop 10 $ group $ iterate (0.63**) 1
13:23:44 <lambdabot> [[0.7177586391896805],[0.7177528833823562],[0.7177547921676407],[0.717754159...
13:23:53 <oerjan> > drop 50 $ group $ iterate (0.63**) 1
13:23:56 <lambdabot> [[0.7177543168046071],[0.717754316804607],[0.7177543168046071],[0.7177543168...
13:24:23 <oerjan> thought so. that theoretically converges, but in double it gives a periodic loop.
13:25:40 <oerjan> wait, did adu just write 1 instead of 0
13:26:17 <oerjan> > drop 50 $ group $ iterate (0.64**) 1
13:26:21 <lambdabot> [[0.7239190318772367],[0.7239190318772366],[0.7239190318772367],[0.723919031...
13:26:41 <oerjan> still looks pretty converging
13:27:44 <oerjan> mroman: ok your problem was that with 0.63 it converges, but _not_ in Double.
13:34:28 <fizzie> Floating points strike again.
13:42:01 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Sbneelu * New user account
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14:09:16 <FreeFull> I suspect in the real numbers it would converge too, although I have no proof
14:09:33 <FreeFull> There probably is some way to prove it
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14:10:40 <izabera> there probably is some way to prove that there's some way to prove it
14:11:52 <coppro> very few things will converge in Double
14:11:59 <coppro> (besides constant sequences, of course)
14:12:17 <fizzie> > let f (x:y:_) | x == y = x; f (_:y) = f y in f $ iterate (0.66**) 1
14:12:26 <coppro> the nature of denormals means that you can't get most numbers closer than denormals are to 0
14:13:59 <myname> what magic is happening with that guard
14:16:42 <coppro> yeah, took me a moment too
14:18:54 <mroman> @type let atLeastTwo (x:y:_) = True; atLeastTwo _ = False in head . head $ filter atLeastTwo $ group $ iterate (1.63**) 1
14:18:57 <mroman> > let atLeastTwo (x:y:_) = True; atLeastTwo _ = False in head . head $ filter atLeastTwo $ group $ iterate (1.63**) 1
14:19:20 <oerjan> mroman: iterate (0.63**) ends up fluctuating between two close Doubles.
14:19:20 <fizzie> > let f (x:y:_) | x == y = repeat "conv"; f (x:y:z:_) | x == z = repeat "p2"; f (_:y) = f y in ((!! 100) . f . (\x -> iterate (x**) 1)) <$> [0.60, 0.61, 0.62, 0.63, 0.64, 0.65, 0.66, 0.67, 0.68, 0.69, 0.70]
14:19:23 <lambdabot> ["conv","p2","conv","p2","p2","conv","conv","conv","p2","conv","conv"]
14:20:02 <FreeFull> Wolfram Alpha says that for z = k^z the solution is z = Wn(-log(k))/log(k)
14:20:46 <FreeFull> Where Wn is some weird function
14:21:16 <oerjan> > log 0.63 * 0.63**0.717754316804607
14:22:10 <oerjan> FreeFull: see how the derivative is smaller than 1 in absolute value. that means it will shrink the interval around the fixpoint (now just prove there is a fixpoint)
14:22:57 <FreeFull> oerjan: Can you show it diverges for k > 1?
14:23:07 <oerjan> (actually, prove there's some interval mapped into itself, where the derivative is || < 1)
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14:48:51 <coppro> are independence theorems necessarily provable
14:49:07 <coppro> if S is a sentence, I is "S is independent", and I' is "I is independent"
14:49:20 <oerjan> coppro: if they're theorems, they are provable hth
14:49:24 <coppro> then if I' is true, S cannot be provably true, and cannot be provably false, so I is true, contradiction
14:53:11 <oerjan> coppro: "I is true" does not imply "I is not independent" hth
14:57:19 <oerjan> if S is not provably true, not provably false, then I is true, but not necessarily provable, so I' can still be true.
14:59:31 <ais523> what does "independent" mean here? that neither assuming it nor assuming its negation leads to a contradiction?
15:01:41 <ais523> coppro: there are various different formalizations of provability, in some of them but not all you have a result of the form "if 'X is provable' is provable, then X is provable", and in some of them but not all you have the converse
15:03:01 <ais523> also, in some of them you can prove those statements inside the logic, and in others they're true but you can't prove them inside the logic
15:21:45 <coppro> it would take a *proof* of I' to lead to a contradiction
15:21:46 -!- oerjan has set topic: R.I.P. Marvin Minsky | The international hub for magic gathering and deployment. | Effi's finest fluffy waffles | https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2023808/wisdom.pdf http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/ http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | https://esolangs.org/ | 100% of cpus on the wall ♪.
15:40:29 <ais523> coppro: this was my reasoning about P=NP
15:40:36 <ais523> was wondering if it might actually be undecidable
15:40:42 <ais523> I concluded that if it were undecidable, there would be no way to prove that
15:44:44 <oerjan> i think there are subtleties there
15:53:08 <MDream> Undecidably undecidable?
15:53:27 -!- MDream has changed nick to MDude.
15:53:48 <Taneb> MDream: it could well be decidably decidable
15:53:56 <MDude> I see how it couldn't be provably undecidable.
15:54:24 <MDude> Since if it proven undecidable, you'd know you'd never get prove that would make it decidable.
15:54:46 <MDude> And any algorithm that allows P to equal NP would be decisive.
15:55:12 <Taneb> It could even be undecidably decidable
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16:25:16 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Drgftj * New user account
16:26:35 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[1-844-655-0455 Norotn 360 antivirus phone number USA]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=46290 * Drgftj * (+24666) Created page with "Norton@Help 1-844-655-0455 Norton antivirus technical support number USA norton tech support phone number USA norton 360 support phone number norton 844 phone number USA Norto..."
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16:52:11 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Ais523 * deleted "[[1-844-655-0455 Norotn 360 antivirus phone number USA]]": spambot targeting multiple wikis
16:52:40 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/block]] block * Ais523 * blocked [[User:Drgftj]] with an expiry time of 2 decades, 4 years, 4 hours, 19 minutes and 12 seconds (account creation disabled): spambot targeting multiple wikis
17:16:03 <Taneb> That's a very specific expiry timke
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17:29:35 <ais523> Taneb: I just entered "24 years", I think the date parser got a bit confused
17:29:47 <ais523> either that or mediawiki is using floating-point dates to get around the Y2038 issue
17:30:08 <ais523> (2038 - 24 = 2014; the Y2038 issue was genuinely starting to cause problems a couple of years ago)
17:31:47 <ais523> b_jonas: heh, there's apparently an infinite loop where nobody gets priority
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18:22:03 <fizzie> I was thinking maybe the date was rounded to a day boundary, since it's 24 years + some hours, but the exact time doesn't really seem to match.
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18:27:10 <fizzie> 18:26 <fizzie> ,cc float f = 2208988800.0f; float g = nextafterf(f, HUGE_VALF); printf("%.0f seconds", g - f);
18:27:13 <fizzie> 18:26 <candide> fizzie: 256 seconds
18:27:56 <fizzie> OTOH, the gap between successive (even single-precision) floats for unixtime around 2040 doesn't seem like 4 hours either.
18:53:28 <FreeFull> I wonder what sort of company Norotn is
18:53:44 <FreeFull> Is a Norotn 360 like an Xbox 360?
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19:18:27 <FreeFull> He had his body cryopreserved though
19:57:18 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Quick420 * New user account
20:01:18 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[1-888-753-3415Quicken tech Support Number1-888-753-3415 Quicken tech Support Phone Number]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=46291 * Quick420 * (+2062) Created page with "1-888-753-3415Quicken tech Support Number1-888-753-3415 Quicken tech Support Phone Number 1-888-753-3415Quicken tech Support Phone Number1-888-753-3415 Quicken tech Support N..."
20:05:32 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[1-888-753-3415Quicken tech Support Phone Number1-888-753-3415 Quicken tech Support Number]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=46292 * Quick420 * (+2062) Created page with "1-888-753-3415Quicken tech Support Number1-888-753-3415 Quicken tech Support Phone Number 1-888-753-3415Quicken tech Support Phone Number1-888-753-3415 Quicken tech Support N..."
20:07:35 <FreeFull> ais banned one earlier, but it seems this one is getting through now
20:07:39 <hppavilion[1]> I was hoping it was just an extremely long-named esolang
20:08:06 <FreeFull> The username is Quick420.. Do they smoke weed?
20:10:11 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[1-888-753-3415Quicken technical Support Number1-888-753-3415 Quicken technical Support Phone Number]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=46293 * Quick420 * (+2062) Created page with "1-888-753-3415Quicken tech Support Number1-888-753-3415 Quicken tech Support Phone Number 1-888-753-3415Quicken tech Support Phone Number1-888-753-3415 Quicken tech Support N...
20:13:51 <MDude> So, code that gets read directly from a wiki?
20:14:32 <MDude> There's a language that uses wiki code itself as a programming language.
20:15:48 <MDude> http://esolangs.org/wiki/Wiki_Cyclic_Tag
20:17:02 <hppavilion[1]> Taneb: Uniquode. That looks like the languages I make xD
20:18:44 <MDude> The output could be made to include a link to the next step in the code.
20:19:08 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Zc 1-888-753-3415Quicken tech Support Number1-888-753-3415 Quicken tech Support Phone Number]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=46294 * Quick420 * (+2062) Created page with "1-888-753-3415Quicken tech Support Number1-888-753-3415 Quicken tech Support Phone Number 1-888-753-3415Quicken tech Support Phone Number1-888-753-3415 Quicken tech Support N..."
20:19:37 <MDude> And then a wikibot could be made that creates the page for that step and used the previous step's output as its contents.
20:22:45 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[ZX 1-888-753-3415Quicken tech Support Phone Number1-888-753-3415 Quicken tech Support Number]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=46295 * Quick420 * (+2062) Created page with "1-888-753-3415Quicken tech Support Number1-888-753-3415 Quicken tech Support Phone Number 1-888-753-3415Quicken tech Support Phone Number1-888-753-3415 Quicken tech Support N..."
20:25:08 <hppavilion[1]> Even if it's an innocent bystander's computer that got hijacked
20:25:27 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[User:Quick420]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=46296 * 151.226.165.25 * (+7) Created page with "Spambot"
20:27:36 <FreeFull> I probably shouldn't have done that but eh
20:28:00 <FreeFull> hppavilion[1]: I don't know who here has admin priviledges on the wiki
20:28:46 <FreeFull> I should have filled that userpage with swearwords
20:29:46 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Quick191 * New user account
20:33:46 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[(1.888.451.1608) Quickbooks pro Technical Support numberQuickbooks Help Desk Phone number!!]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=46297 * Quick420 * (+9520) Created page with " (1.888.451.1608) Quickbooks pro Technical Support numberQuickbooks Help Desk Phone number!! Call....1 888 451 1608 Quickbooks tech support phone number, Quickbooks customer s..."
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20:37:45 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Quickbooks pro tech support number (1-888-451-1608) Quickbooks technical support phone number usa Call]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=46298 * Quick420 * (+9525) Created page with "Quickbooks pro tech support number (1-888-451-1608) Quickbooks technical support phone number usa Call....1 888 451 1608 Quickbooks tech support phone number, Quickbooks custo
20:38:12 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[HTC+++)(1-888-451-1608) + Quickbooks tech support Phone Number..+ Quickbooks tech support phone number]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=46299 * Quick420 * (+49994) Created page with "HTC+++)(1-888-451-1608) + Quickbooks tech support Phone Number..+ Quickbooks tech support phone number USA + Quickbooks 1 888 451 1608 + Quickbooks customer support phone n
20:40:02 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[DC 1-888-451-1608Quicken tech Support Number1-888-451-1608 Quicken tech Support Phone Number]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=46300 * Quick420 * (+30035) Created page with "QuickBooks Toll Free, Intuit@(1-888-451-1068)@ QuickBooks Tech Support Phone Number provides online solution for all USA/CANADA clients. For any help of query call 1 888-451-1..."
20:40:05 <fizzie> Time to update the captcha.
20:40:18 <fizzie> I'll see if I can manage the blocking thing.
20:41:18 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[(1-888-451-1608) Quickbooks technical support phone number usa,,...Quickbooks help Desk Phone Number]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=46301 * Quick420 * (+8645) Created page with "(1-888-451-1608) Quickbooks technical support phone number usa,,...Quickbooks help Desk Phone Number QuickBooks Toll Free, Intuit@(1-888-451-1608)@ QuickBooks Tech Support Pho..
20:41:27 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Kumarsujit899 * New user account
20:41:27 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/block]] block * Fizzie * blocked [[User:Quick420]] with an expiry time of 2 decades, 4 years, 4 hours, 19 minutes and 12 seconds (account creation disabled, email disabled, cannot edit own talk page): Spamming links to external sites
20:42:53 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[((1 888 451 1608))CAS@Quickbooks tech Support Number]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=46302 * Kumarsujit899 * (+1060) Created page with "Quickbooks tech Support Number1 888 451 1608 Quickbooks technical Support Phone Number1 888 451 1608 Quickbooks technical Support Number1 888 451 1608 Quickbooks tech..."
20:43:16 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/block]] block * Fizzie * blocked [[User:Kumarsujit899]] with an expiry time of 2 decades, 4 years, 4 hours, 19 minutes and 12 seconds (account creation disabled, email disabled, cannot edit own talk page): Spamming links to external sites
20:43:28 <fizzie> Trying to set a new CAPTCHA at the moment, let's see if that works.
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20:44:27 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * USA Helpline ((1.800.860.9230 )) QuickBooks helpline phone number (((QuickBooks Pro support number * New user account
20:44:47 <fizzie> Apparently not. Unless my change didn't take effect soon enough.
20:45:17 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Brotherp * New user account
20:45:42 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Sanramon92222 * New user account
20:45:43 <fizzie> Okay, I put in an impossible CAPTCHA for a moment, just to see if they're somehow bypassing it completely.
20:45:46 <fizzie> Which seems to be the case.
20:46:00 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Helpline ((1.800.860.9230 )) QuickBooks helpline phone number (((QuickBooks Pro support number]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=46303 * USA Helpline ((1.800.860.9230 )) QuickBooks helpline phone number (((QuickBooks Pro support number * (+43605) Created page with "Quickbooks tech Support Number 1 800 860 9230 Quickbooks technical Support Phone Number
20:46:45 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Solutions++++---1-800-728-7356++Quickbooks pro technical support number Quickbooks customer care number]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=46304 * Brotherp * (+11295) Created page with "Solutions++++---1-800-728-7356++Quickbooks technical support number Quickbooks customer care number Quickbooks customer service phone number Calling Helpline USA 1 800 728 7
20:47:14 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/block]] block * Fizzie * blocked [[User:USA Helpline ((1.800.860.9230 )) QuickBooks helpline phone number (((QuickBooks Pro support number]] with an expiry time of 2 decades, 4 years, 4 hours, 19 minutes and 12 seconds (account creation disabled, email disabled, cannot edit own talk page): Spamming links to external sites
20:47:33 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/block]] block * Fizzie * blocked [[User:Brotherp]] with an expiry time of 2 decades, 4 years, 4 hours, 19 minutes and 12 seconds (account creation disabled, email disabled, cannot edit own talk page): Spamming links to external sites
20:47:47 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/move]] move * Sanramon92222 * moved [[HTC+++)(1-888-451-1608) + Quickbooks tech support Phone Number..+ Quickbooks tech support phone number]] to [[Talk:HTC+++)(1-888-451-1608) + Quickbooks tech support Phone Number..+ Quickbooks tech support phone number]]
20:48:35 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Talk:HTC+++)(1-888-451-1608) + Quickbooks tech support Phone Number..+ Quickbooks tech support phone number]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=46307&oldid=46305 * Sanramon92222 * (+22654)
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20:48:57 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/move]] move * Sanramon92222 * moved [[Talk:HTC+++)(1-888-451-1608) + Quickbooks tech support Phone Number..+ Quickbooks tech support phone number]] to [[Talk:HTC+++..)(1-800-919-0992) + Quickbooks tech support Phone Number..+ Quickbooks tech support phone number]]
20:49:16 <FreeFull> https://esolangs.org/wiki/The_Amnesiac_From_Minsk Rip Minski
20:50:35 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/block]] block * Fizzie * blocked [[User:Sanramon92222]] with an expiry time of 2 decades, 4 years, 4 hours, 19 minutes and 12 seconds (account creation disabled, email disabled, cannot edit own talk page): Some page moves I don't understand at all
20:57:02 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Fizzie * deleted "[[1-888-753-3415Quicken tech Support Number1-888-753-3415 Quicken tech Support Phone Number]]": Spam
20:57:19 <fizzie> There will be a bunch of spam-page deletions now. I hope this is the right way to do them.
20:57:39 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Fizzie * deleted "[[1-888-753-3415Quicken tech Support Phone Number1-888-753-3415 Quicken tech Support Number]]": Spam
20:57:52 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Fizzie * deleted "[[1-888-753-3415Quicken technical Support Number1-888-753-3415 Quicken technical Support Phone Number]]": Spam
20:58:07 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Fizzie * deleted "[[Zc 1-888-753-3415Quicken tech Support Number1-888-753-3415 Quicken tech Support Phone Number]]": Spam
20:58:24 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Fizzie * deleted "[[ZX 1-888-753-3415Quicken tech Support Phone Number1-888-753-3415 Quicken tech Support Number]]": Spam
20:58:53 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Fizzie * deleted "[[(1.888.451.1608) Quickbooks pro Technical Support numberQuickbooks Help Desk Phone number!!]]": Spam
20:59:05 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Fizzie * deleted "[[Quickbooks pro tech support number (1-888-451-1608) Quickbooks technical support phone number usa Call]]": Spam
20:59:19 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Fizzie * deleted "[[HTC+++)(1-888-451-1608) + Quickbooks tech support Phone Number..+ Quickbooks tech support phone number]]": Spam
20:59:29 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Fizzie * deleted "[[DC 1-888-451-1608Quicken tech Support Number1-888-451-1608 Quicken tech Support Phone Number]]": Spam
20:59:40 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Fizzie * deleted "[[(1-888-451-1608) Quickbooks technical support phone number usa,,...Quickbooks help Desk Phone Number]]": Spam
20:59:51 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Fizzie * deleted "[[((1 888 451 1608))CAS@Quickbooks tech Support Number]]": Spam
21:00:03 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Fizzie * deleted "[[Helpline ((1.800.860.9230 )) QuickBooks helpline phone number (((QuickBooks Pro support number]]": Spam
21:00:17 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Fizzie * deleted "[[Solutions++++---1-800-728-7356++Quickbooks pro technical support number Quickbooks customer care number]]": Spam
21:00:33 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Fizzie * deleted "[[Talk:HTC+++)(1-888-451-1608) + Quickbooks tech support Phone Number..+ Quickbooks tech support phone number]]": Spam
21:02:12 <fizzie> There's also one account ("Quick191") that got created but not blocked, because it didn't spam any. Wonder what's up with that.
21:03:18 <fizzie> Anyway, seems that the account creation stopped, so maybe the CAPTCHA is actually working, and it just takes a moment to update -- not sure how it works in practice.
21:08:12 <fizzie> Based on the access.log of the web server (which has grown to 200 megs), they're still knocking.
21:09:19 <fizzie> Lots of hits to Special:UserLogin&type=signup etc.
21:10:06 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Talk:HTC+++..)(1-800-919-0992) + Quickbooks tech support Phone Number..+ Quickbooks tech support phone number]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=46310&oldid=46308 * Quick191 * (-62530)
21:10:06 <fizzie> All of this is from a single IP address in India.
21:10:17 <fizzie> Hey, there's the Quick191 I noticed.
21:10:35 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/block]] block * Fizzie * blocked [[User:Quick191]] with an expiry time of 2 decades, 4 years, 4 hours, 19 minutes and 12 seconds (account creation disabled, email disabled, cannot edit own talk page): Spamming links to external sites
21:11:18 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Fizzie * deleted "[[Talk:HTC+++..)(1-800-919-0992) + Quickbooks tech support Phone Number..+ Quickbooks tech support phone number]]": Spam
21:11:24 <FireFly> I think technically it was spamming phone numbers, not links :p
21:11:35 <fizzie> Yeah, but that wasn't on the dropdown of common block reasons. :p
21:12:26 <fizzie> They're following the link in the CAPTCHA question.
21:12:41 <fizzie> I wonder if it's a program that tries all words on that page as the CAPTCHA answer.
21:12:56 <fizzie> (I picked one where you need to turn a plural English word into a singular one for the current question.)
21:14:05 <FireFly> That doesn't really sound all that great.. wouldn't it be pretty easy to do a dictionary attack for that?
21:14:26 <fizzie> Sure, but I don't think they're doing dictionary attacks.
21:14:50 <fizzie> It used to be a year number directly on the linked-to page.
21:17:09 <fizzie> Also blocked some individual IPs completely, firewall-wise. The drop rules keep steadily getting more packets, so they're still trying to connect.
21:17:44 <fizzie> There's a number of addresses, though. Presumably infected zombies.
21:19:41 <fizzie> Wonder if there's a log on the invalid CAPTCHA answers somewhere. It's not in the server access log, because it's a POST request.
21:19:42 <int-e> Wee, 15 days uptime and only a CPU stall, no read errors so far... could it be possible that CoC actually maintains their hardware?
21:20:22 <int-e> (I doubt it, but it's an interesting line of speculation nonetheless)
21:27:00 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Lindaseeds * New user account
21:27:49 <int-e> plausible user name... where's the spam...
21:29:55 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[C-Wing(1-855-935-7526) Quickbooks technical support phone number]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=46311 * Lindaseeds * (+22769) C-Wing(1-855-935-7526) Quickbooks technical support phone number
21:31:01 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/block]] block * Fizzie * blocked [[User:Lindaseeds]] with an expiry time of 2 decades, 4 years, 4 hours, 19 minutes and 12 seconds (account creation disabled, email disabled, cannot edit own talk page): Spam spam spam
21:31:22 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Fizzie * deleted "[[C-Wing(1-855-935-7526) Quickbooks technical support phone number]]": Spam
21:31:35 <fizzie> I impossibilated the CAPTCHA again for now; trying to have dinner here.
21:31:43 <fizzie> Will have to think about this.
21:43:04 <FreeFull> I'll try it out by making an account
21:43:22 <fizzie> You shouldn't be able to solve it.
21:43:33 <fizzie> I mean, currently the answer is a random string.
21:45:29 <fizzie> But that's not very helpful for actual new users, so it's not really a long-term solution.
21:46:11 <fizzie> Sadly, there seems to be no logging in QuestyCaptcha. I could've looked and tried to guesstimate whether they're doing it programmatically or humanistically. It's perfectly plausible they're just having humans solve these.
21:46:49 <int-e> you should perhaps change the question(s?, but I've seen only one) so that it indicates the impossibility to solve...
21:47:57 <FreeFull> You could have probably disabled registration the normal way
21:48:33 <fizzie> Yes, but this was easiest. Google suggested $wgGroupPermissions['*']['createaccount'] = false; but I'm not sure what sort of error messages that would give.
21:48:43 <fizzie> Anyway, put a note in the question.
21:52:30 <fizzie> I thought about having a dynamically generated piece of brainfuck the user would have to run (with a link to one of the JS brainfuck things), which would at least mean you couldn't just solve it once and put the answers in a program, but that doesn't really help if they're having humans solve them on the fly.
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21:54:43 <fizzie> The fact that they keep trying to submit the new user creation form all the time might indicate it's at least not completely manual.
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22:07:24 <FireFly> It helps a bit in that if the users have no idea what they're doing they might not understand to run a piece of brainfuck in a JS interpreter
22:07:39 <FireFly> or might help a bit, rather
22:08:49 <izabera> new small optimizations: http://mazonka.com/brainf/hi123 input https://arin.ga/fPoLYu/raw output
22:10:01 -!- AlexR42 has quit (Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…).
22:10:48 <fizzie> Failed to get D-Bus connection: Unknown error -1
22:10:52 <fizzie> That's not nice either.
22:14:06 <fizzie> Actually, hmm. Maybe the current init is not systemd. That thing got kind of accidentally dist-upgraded recently.
22:16:09 <FreeFull> fizzie: You can check if any systemd processes are running
22:16:32 <fizzie> Maybe that's reasonable then.
22:16:38 -!- peak has joined.
22:16:38 -!- peak has quit (Client Quit).
22:16:58 <int-e> no, that's still an unforgivably awful error message
22:20:23 <fizzie> In other news, they're still sporadically trying to create new users, if I'm reading the log right.
22:21:05 -!- hppavilion[1] has joined.
22:38:13 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[User:Fizzie]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=46312&oldid=46093 * 82.68.182.45 * (+46) CAPTCHA test.
22:38:26 <fizzie> There's a very simple brainfuck-driven CAPTCHA now.
22:38:41 <fizzie> I didn't yet link to a canonical web-based interpreter, but at least it's not impossible to solve.
22:39:30 <fizzie> Oh, it didn't escape the <>s, my browser was just kind enough. I'll need to fix that.
22:41:16 <FireFly> It'll be a bit interesting to see how long it takes for them to figure it out
22:41:41 <fizzie> There's just 25.359 or so bits of randomness in it, but I think that should prevent random guessing.
22:42:50 <fizzie> It computes 10*10 ('d'), and then does 16 times a . instruction, randomly prefixed by either '+', '-' or nothing. Slightly limited so that it's always from 'a' to 'z'.
22:43:55 <fizzie> Line-wrapping on the account creation page is pretty nasty, but...
22:44:42 <int-e> darn, now how does one check whether there is a dictionary word of that kind... with standard unix tools
22:45:10 <fizzie> Heh. I'd go with a perl oneliner.
22:45:29 <fizzie> I don't think there is, though. I mean, not one that's exactly 16 characters.
22:46:09 <fizzie> There's shorter words for sure. "deed" comes to mind.
22:46:46 <fizzie> Maybe something very farfetched.
22:47:33 <fizzie> E.g. "defeeded", when you remove a RSS feed from your feed browser.
22:49:25 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Mackhill1988 * New user account
22:50:02 <fizzie> I'm very disappointed when that turns out to be spam.
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22:50:26 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Contact US......1 800 797 6023 QuickBooks technical support Phone Number and QuickBooks pro customer support Phone Number]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=46313 * Mackhill1988 * (+37075) Contact US......1 800 797 6023 QuickBooks technical support Phone Number and QuickBooks pro customer support Phone Number
22:50:42 <fizzie> I'm very disappointed now.
22:51:35 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/block]] block * Fizzie * blocked [[User:Mackhill1988]] with an expiry time of 2 decades, 4 years, 4 hours, 19 minutes and 12 seconds (account creation disabled, email disabled, cannot edit own talk page): Spam spam spam
22:51:51 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/delete]] delete * Fizzie * deleted "[[Contact US......1 800 797 6023 QuickBooks technical support Phone Number and QuickBooks pro customer support Phone Number]]": Spam
22:52:59 <FireFly> They're not incompetent apparently
22:53:11 <fizzie> I might even go as far as to say they're either having actual humans do this, or there's some sort of circumvention thing (but then why would the keyboard-mashing question block them).
22:53:40 <FireFly> I'm going with humans at this rate
22:53:48 <FireFly> What can you do about that..
22:54:04 <int-e> hmm... a bit silly: grep '^[A-Za-z]*$' /usr/share/dict/words | tr A-Z a-z | grep -Ev 'a[c-z]|b[d-z]|c[ae-z]|d[abf-z]|e[a-cg-z]|f[a-dh-z]|g[a-ei-z]|h[a-fj-z]|i[a-gk-z]|j[a-hl-z]|k[a-im-z]|l[a-jn-z]|m[a-ko-z]|n[a-lp-z]|o[a-mq-z]|p[a-nr-z]|q[a-os-z]|r[a-pt-z]|s[a-qu-z]|t[a-rv-z]|u[a-sw-z]|v[a-tx-z]|w[a-uyz]|x[a-vz]|y[a-w]|z[a-x]'
22:55:02 <int-e> "deeded" is the longest result here... not much of a word.
22:55:59 <int-e> ah damn, that didn't take very long
22:57:32 <int-e> well, if they're using humans to solve them, captchas aren't be of much help...
22:59:05 <hppavilion[1]> int-e: Perhaps we should track down the IP and send a Cease and Desist
22:59:15 <int-e> (The more interesting question is how they get people to do this... some sort of puzzle page that relays captchas, perhaps? With highscores and everything :P)
22:59:50 <hppavilion[1]> fizzie: We could block registration for a few days be using a captcha that requires knowledge of programming
23:02:26 <FreeFull> How about, to register, you have to craft an esoteric language first?
23:03:45 * int-e is registered despite not having created any esolangs...
23:04:01 -!- p34k has quit.
23:04:10 <FreeFull> int-e: Well, it'd be good motivation
23:04:25 <FreeFull> How about a programming language where the interpreter takes a brownian walk through the code?
23:05:49 -!- hppavilion[1] has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds).
23:06:18 <int-e> we'd probably just add to the pile of brainfuck derivatives...
23:07:00 <FreeFull> It doesn't necessarily have to be brainfuck-like at all though
23:07:23 <FreeFull> It doesn't have to be turing-complete either
23:07:47 <int-e> right, even finite automata can be interesting...
23:09:03 <FreeFull> Take an infinite automaton bone, put it in a pot, add some infinitely-sized integers, and you've got yourself a minsky stew going
23:09:31 <int-e> (I'm thinking of Malbolge, which is a finite automaton with something like 59049^59050 states)
23:10:38 <FreeFull> I'm tempted to implement this language now
23:14:47 <fizzie> Maybe I should just ask potential new users to email me (er, well, some role account at esolangs.org). It's kind of sucky to require an email like that, but on the other hand so's having a bunch of spambots.
23:17:22 <FreeFull> What if the spambot owners email you too?
23:18:33 <izabera> who benefits from spamming on esolangs.org?
23:18:57 <fizzie> Well, it's free advertisement.
23:20:44 <izabera> what's special about 2 decades, 4 years, 4 hours, 19 minutes and 12 seconds?
23:20:46 <fizzie> If I Google for that most recent number (6023), #1 hit is esolangs.org, then wiki.jenkins-ci.org (the continuous integration infra system), then wiki.wesnoth.org, then wiki.dreamhost.com, then community.kde.org and so on and so forth.
23:21:12 <fizzie> izabera: It's what comes out when you type "24 years" in the box, which is something ais523 initially did, and I just followed their lead.
23:21:30 <fizzie> We're unsure why it's parsed like that.
23:21:31 <izabera> pretty sure google doesn't show esolangs.org to normal people
23:21:42 <FreeFull> fizzie: What happens if you type in 1 century ?
23:21:59 <fizzie> FreeFull: I'm not sure there's a good way to try.
23:22:55 <fizzie> Well, if I Google for "quickbooks support number", I get the spammy wiki.jenkins-ci.org page as a WebAnswers box.
23:23:00 <fizzie> Time for some feedback, I think.
23:23:08 <FreeFull> fizzie: I was thinking, email is optional right now during registration
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23:23:17 <FreeFull> Would making it mandatory be enough?
23:23:50 <int-e> so they create the page and immediately ask google to crawl it? sigh...
23:24:07 <fizzie> FreeFull: Oh, you mean making it mandatory to do the confirm-by-email thing? I don't know. If they're actually having humans do these, perhaps they're prepared for that as well.
23:28:54 <FreeFull> fizzie: Could even make it something like "ask fizzie on IRC if you want an account"
23:29:19 <FreeFull> There aren't exactly that many people registering for an account anyway
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23:33:01 <int-e> how hard is it to find the operator of a toll-free number?
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23:34:11 <fizzie> I don't know. But they do have several numbers.
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23:44:18 <fizzie> I went to some of the other spammed wikis to try find out how they're coping -- https://wiki.wesnoth.org/ is not looking too good.
23:45:46 <fizzie> The Jenkins CI wiki uses real reCAPTCHA, and they still have spam pages up.
23:46:50 <izabera> http://mywiki.wooledge.org/EnglishFrontPage?action=info check any of these
23:47:33 <fizzie> wiki.dreamhost.com seems to have just disabled account creation.
23:48:31 <FreeFull> Well, recaptcha doesn't help against humans