00:19:16 <Sgeo> comex... isn't here
00:19:31 <\oren\> what the heck is "Jan Mayen"
00:20:56 <quintopia> (hurray for daytime that extents until 9pm)
00:22:11 <HackEgo> off by two//An off by two error is what happens when you expect an off by one error but compensate in the wrong direction.
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00:24:47 <quintopia> hmm. it is suddenly very important that i create an esolang such that "being locked in a matrix of solidity" is meaningful in terms of describing program state
00:25:14 <shachaf> `le/rn infinity/In finity we trust.
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00:26:06 <quintopia> `le/rn finity/Enjoy being locked in your matrix of finity.
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00:31:52 <quintopia> seems like he's having lots of them connection issues
00:34:55 <Koen_> connection tissues are important
00:41:25 <tswett> `le/rn shakespeare/And besicue and a saint and son the may bean the butcious and one them bear and may me for here the mance of my lord, and leave and thou arl of the prince and will not and and hour blood and the be buralont;
00:42:14 <Koen_> tswett: is your keyboard drunk?
00:48:45 <quintopia> it turned from day to evening in the time it took you to reply
00:50:22 <tswett> No no, that's from one of Shakespeare's plays.
00:51:25 <shachaf> No, it's from your matrix multiplier.
00:51:30 <tswett> A relatively obscure one: "The Man the Confent and the Confent and the Man the Man and the Man".
00:51:41 <tswett> Okay, I confess, it's from my matrix multiplier.
00:51:41 <shachaf> I don't think your thing is refined enough to go in wisdom/ yet.
00:52:00 <coppro> `addquote <shachaf> I don't think your thing is refined enough to go in wisdom/ yet.
00:52:03 <HackEgo> 1281) <shachaf> I don't think your thing is refined enough to go in wisdom/ yet.
00:52:07 <quintopia> is it just a shakespearean markov chain?
00:52:22 <shachaf> coppro: Did you see the discussion in #haskell about copprofunctors?
00:55:07 <tswett> quintopia: no, it's a neural net.
00:55:22 <shachaf> No, it's an artificial neural network.
00:55:41 <Phantom_Hoover> has anyone else in this channel looked at http://skullcode.com/ before?
00:57:05 <shachaf> Is that viewer thing looking at its own memory?
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00:59:40 <Koen_> Phantom_Hoover: is that some kind of mastermind-like riddle?
01:00:17 <Phantom_Hoover> something like that, it's a 32-bit VM with a hex editor loaded into it
01:01:10 <Phantom_Hoover> but if you scroll down to the address 00006666 there's a graphic with an exclamation mark in it, and if you overwrite that exclamation mark with a space or NUL then stuff starts happening
01:02:24 <fizzie> http://skullcode.com/bootstrap/hexboot.txt if you want to play the more dangerous game than just mess around in the browser.
01:03:02 <Phantom_Hoover> that thing's for x86, though, and a lot smaller than skullcode; it's a spiritual predecessor
01:05:28 <Phantom_Hoover> there's a block of encrypted data from 61b0 to 65b0; it's pretty easy to play along with it and get a password that'll decrypt the first 32 bytes, but i have no clue how to get at the rest
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01:26:09 <oerjan> @tell int-e <int-e> I think GND is still not considered to be SafeHaskell anyway. <-- oh right.
01:26:46 <oerjan> @tell int-e anyway, turns out there's probably no exploit there.
01:27:48 <boily> oerjan: GND is the opposite end from Vcc hth
01:28:35 <boily> fungot: do you do electronics?
01:28:35 <fungot> boily: this is not the other way around... fnord/ home
01:28:45 <boily> fungot: apparently not.
01:28:45 <fungot> boily: i'm editing this down. user:guernseykidguernseykid 03:54, 26 june 2006 ( utc). small—preceding wikipedia:signaturesunsigned comment added by special:contributions/ fnord)
01:29:47 <boily> oerjan: when designing circuits, you have Vcc on one end, and GND at the other end. stuff go between them.
01:30:09 * oerjan doesn't really do electronics, obviously.
01:32:24 <boily> electronics aren't very much more complicated than that. Vcc is the plus end on your battery. I give you two tries to match what GND is :P
01:32:51 <quintopia> boily: you heard about super mario bros being pspace-complete?
01:32:56 <boily> nowadays, it's like: read the spreadsheet, supply the correct voltage, ?????, profit.
01:33:22 <boily> s/spread/spec/. damned time spent doing excel.
01:33:36 <oerjan> boily: i had already guessed what GND is.
01:33:42 <quintopia> boily: turns out you can make arbitrary circuits by opening or closing pathways by jumping to bump spinies on one or another side of a brick barrier
01:34:47 <quintopia> but the paper isn't presented until next week, and it isn't available anywhere
01:34:59 <boily> not even on arxiv?
01:36:12 <oerjan> <hppavilion[1]> The horror <-- i get the impression hppavilion[1] is a bit sensitive.
01:37:00 * boily horrifies hppavilion[1] with a pluridimensional mapole
01:46:39 <HackEgo> usual suspect//There are 3.99 usual suspects in #esoteric, but they're usually rounded up.
01:46:46 -!- quintopia has changed nick to Quintopia.
01:50:52 <oerjan> `culprits wisdom/usual
01:51:06 <oerjan> `culprits wisdom/usual suspect
01:52:12 <oerjan> on the one hand, that deserves a swat, on the other i didn't get the pun until now.
01:52:36 * oerjan gives shachaf an IOU for a swat.
01:53:06 <shachaf> oerjan: Wait, you didn't get the pun until now?
01:53:13 <shachaf> That explains why I wasn't swatted.
01:53:22 <shachaf> I thought for sure that one would earn me a swat.
01:54:31 <Phantom_Hoover> i take it nobody else is very interested in skullcode then
01:54:34 <Quintopia> oerjan: do you have a mobile internettified swatter?
01:55:42 <oerjan> that's too many buzzwords tdnh
01:57:31 <Koen_> also too many acronyms
01:57:51 <Quintopia> you should try the new iSwatter. comes in a tall glass!
01:59:30 <oerjan> Koen_: in the wisdom hth
02:00:26 <Koen_> is that because round up might mean two things?
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02:09:20 <Quintopia> yes. i can't install/upgrade vmail because of a problem with its gem dependencies. i don't know enough about ruby and gems to fix it.
02:21:44 <HackEgo> wisdom/bezout \ wisdom/bézout \ wisdom/bezout's \ wisdom/bézout's \ wisdom/bezout's theorem \ wisdom/bézout's theorem
02:22:02 <oerjan> `culprits wisdom/bezout
02:22:08 <oerjan> `culprits wisdom/bézout
02:22:16 <oerjan> `culprits wisdom/bezout's
02:22:16 <Quintopia> also it appears that i can't install vim with clientserver flag enabled (or compile it from source) without installing most of gnome?
02:22:24 <oerjan> `culprits wisdom/bézout's
02:22:34 <oerjan> `culprits wisdom/bézout's theorem
02:22:38 <oerjan> `culprits wisdom/bezout's theorem
02:23:30 <oerjan> `` rm -v wisdom/b{e,é}zout{,\'s}
02:23:35 <HackEgo> removed `wisdom/bezout' \ removed `wisdom/bezout\'s' \ removed `wisdom/bézout' \ removed `wisdom/bézout\'s'
02:24:04 <oerjan> @tell b_jonas seriously, don't make 6 copies of the same wisdom entry.
02:26:49 <HackEgo> Bézout's theorem says that if a system of polynomial equations over the complexes has as many variables as equations, then in the general case the number of solutions it has is equal to the product of one less than the degrees of the polynomials.
02:27:08 <oerjan> Quintopia: sadly, symbolic links sometimes get broken.
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02:29:21 <oerjan> (not that i care in this case, it's a crappy entry.)
02:29:30 <tswett> Ī keep forgetting about mȳ macron propōsal.
02:29:58 <tswett> Whȳ dōn't Ī tȳpe līke this all the tīme?
02:34:19 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: goat sex hth
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03:36:13 <tswett> Kinda interesting looking at video memory in a hex editor.
03:37:25 <tswett> The thing is, of course, you're looking at a display of the display. Like pointing a TV camera at the TV that's showing the signal.
03:43:13 * oerjan soundly swats shachaf -----###
03:44:39 <oerjan> the speed of sound isn't that great
03:45:09 <shachaf> i,i faster than the speed of sound in a vacuum
03:51:15 <oerjan> @tell gamemanj spräk does not mean language hth
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04:01:11 <shachaf> I never know what it actually stands for.
04:11:34 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Z]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=47098&oldid=47066 * 71.202.114.203 * (+129)
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04:42:13 <\oren\> what is the inverse of factorial called?
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04:54:57 <hppavilion[1]> Atoms literally pass through each other when going fast enough
04:55:05 <hppavilion[1]> That's it, I'm convinced. The universe is a simulation.
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05:04:46 <HackEgo> 1281) <shachaf> I don't think your thing is refined enough to go in wisdom/ yet.
05:05:11 <HackEgo> *poof* <shachaf> I don't think your thing is refined enough to go in wisdom/ yet.
05:05:16 <shachaf> see, now you don't even need to worry about the double space
05:10:34 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: You're only allowed to delete quotes after reading at least 5 quotes hth
05:11:18 <hppavilion[1]> (As in, for every 5 quotes you read in a 1-hour timespan, you may delete one of the quotes that you read)
05:13:11 <shachaf> oerjan: have you considered that some people don't want to have movie spoilers right in HackEgo hth
05:16:07 <shachaf> For example a decade ago I didn't even know about that spoiler.
05:16:23 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: i don't think that rule applies to very recent quotes hth
05:16:55 <shachaf> `quote do they work.*zzo38
05:16:56 <HackEgo> 1056) <shachaf> Hmm, is an Electronic Signature in a PDF file a thing? <shachaf> How do they work? <zzo38> [1] Yes. [2] It doesn't.
05:19:22 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: it lets you apply a sed script to a file hth
05:19:58 <hppavilion[1]> "This is generation 0. Every time you see this line in a signature, if your signature does not already contain such a line, add this line to your signature with the count multiplied by i and incremented by 1"
05:20:49 <HackEgo> mv: missing destination file operand after `canary tmp' \ Try `mv --help' for more information.
05:21:18 <HackEgo> cp: missing destination file operand after `canary tmp' \ Try `cp --help' for more information.
05:23:13 <hppavilion[1]> The first 100 possibilities are 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i 1+0i 1+1i 1i 0i
05:23:48 <HackEgo> 1244) <ais523> hppavilion1: there's not much point in `addquoting an `addquote unless the person who added it was somehow significant, or there's interesting context <ais523> because you can tell it was added from the fact that it's there \ 1255) <shachaf> What is an esolang? <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: It's an archaic term for an Esolang \ 1256) <h
05:24:25 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: looks a bit repetive
05:24:26 <HackEgo> 598) <shachaf> VMS Mosaic? <shachaf> I hope that's not Mosaic ported to VMS. <shachaf> Hmm. It's Mosaic ported to VMS. \ 608) * Sgeo|web wants to see elliott be wrong about something <elliott> Sgeo|web: That literally never happens. <shachaf> Sgeo|web: There you go. A great example. \ 612) <shachaf> You should get kmc in this channel. kmc has g
05:24:42 <HackEgo> 612) <shachaf> You should get kmc in this channel. kmc has good quotes. <shachaf> `quote kmc <HackEgo> 686) <kmc> COCKS [...] <kmc> truly cocks <shachaf> Well, in theory.
05:25:08 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: I should probably think about complex numbers before using them.
05:25:24 <shachaf> First figure out the mplex numbers.
05:25:44 <shachaf> Or you can figure out the simplex numbers.
05:25:51 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: Those are the split-complexes, aren't they?
05:26:03 <shachaf> Maybe a simplicial complex is made out of a simplex number and a complex number.
05:26:38 <shachaf> ørjan is an expert in simplicial complexes and homology and all sorts of things
05:26:42 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: I do like smashing together different types of complex
05:26:45 <shachaf> I bet he's taught oerjan a thing or two.
05:26:50 <shachaf> @google simplicial complex
05:26:51 <lambdabot> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simplicial_complex
05:27:34 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: aren't you confusing complexes and hadrons
05:27:58 <\oren\> Agh everything is exploding
05:27:59 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: What's a hadron? As in, the large kind that we like colliding?
05:28:18 <coppro> they aren't that large
05:28:35 <oerjan> they're larger than electrons, though
05:28:45 <coppro> it's all relative; good thing we have theories to handle that
05:28:59 <hppavilion[1]> coppro: Um, then why do we have a machine to collide large hadrons?
05:29:11 <coppro> hppavilion[1]: because who doesn't like exotic explosions?
05:29:35 <\oren\> I don't like it when my fuel tanks explode
05:29:51 <hppavilion[1]> coppro: No one, but if hadrons weren't large, then a collider for large hadrons wouldn't be able to make exotic explosions.
05:30:29 <coppro> it's all got to do with the theory of relativity
05:30:38 <coppro> at relativistic speeds, hadrons are relatively large
05:30:40 <hppavilion[1]> Being able to use dvorak at a wpm so high you need scientific notation to express it is useless when you're at a qwerty keyboard
05:30:50 <coppro> that's why the collider needs to get them going so fast
05:31:22 <hppavilion[1]> I prefer the obscene hardon collider myself, though
05:31:38 <oerjan> we were trying not to make that joke, hppavilion[1]
05:32:05 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: I at least found a mildly funny context for it
05:32:08 <coppro> fun fact: the LHC beam has about 362 MJ in it during the course of normal operation
05:32:32 <coppro> that's about $18 of electricity
05:32:53 <oerjan> those are some expensive dollars
05:35:19 * oerjan realizes he has a dirtier mind than hppavilion[1], then implodes.
05:35:24 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: What? Do you have something against hellajoules, or did you think it was another pointless joke?
05:35:34 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: Yep, you thought it was dirty, when it wasn't
05:35:55 <\oren\> I know what oerjan was thinking
05:36:13 <hppavilion[1]> I'm still trying to figure it out. My best guess is H=hand
05:36:36 <hppavilion[1]> Of course, I prefer the Large Boson Collider to the Large Hadron Collider any day
05:37:37 <hppavilion[1]> (OK, I have to ask: Is there a physics reason why Boson collisions aren't interesting? Or are they just impossible to deal with in the same way the LHC deals with Hadrons, so we had to make a choice and chose to make a Large Hadron Collider instead of a Large Boson Collider?)
05:38:37 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: Of course, if it makes you feel better, my mind is almost certainly dirtier than yours; I just happen to have developed a filter that prevents me from saying 999.9999999999952‰ of things that come to mind
05:38:54 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: you can collide composite nuclei that are bosons, i think.
05:39:16 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: Wait, I forget, are Hadrons and Bosons mutually exclusive?
05:39:28 <oerjan> i think they are colliding lead, but i'm not sure whether they're bosonic or fermionic.
05:40:26 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: no, mesons are hadrons and bosons iirc. but you cannot keep them long enough to use them.
05:41:17 <hppavilion[1]> (A reference, of course, to Black Mesa from various Valve games I've never played)
05:41:45 <oerjan> basically protons, electrons, and their antiversions are the only charged subatomic particles that live long enough to be used, i think.
05:42:16 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: i don't think there's one, they're usually named after greek letters.
05:43:16 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: ...question #492 on my Grand List of Questions: How the hell can there be such thing as an "Anti-neutron"? If an antiparticle has the opposite charge, and a neutron has no charge, how can there be such a thing as the opposite of 0?
05:45:34 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: btw i think some people are trying to collide photons, which are bosons.
05:46:24 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: ...collide photons? You have something moving at literally the speed of light, and which from its point of view the entire universe is in the same place, and you're trying to make them hit each other?
05:47:32 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: the anti-neutron consists of 3 anti-quarks, each of which is the antiparticle of a corresponding quark in the neutron.
05:48:17 <hppavilion[1]> I wonder what we're going to call it when we find something smaller than a quark... (don't argue, you know it's going to happen)
05:48:25 <oerjan> (for a certain value of "consists". there are all manner of virtual gluons and quarks inside.)
05:50:31 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: i didn't say getting photons to collide is easy. (and i'm not sure whether it was supposed to be within currently realistic technology or not.)
05:50:51 <oerjan> although you just to aim enough in the same spot, you'd think.
05:51:27 <hppavilion[1]> oerjan: Furthermore, you'd think that a couple photons would have collided at some point near a scientific instrument in the last decade or so
05:52:03 <hppavilion[1]> It doesn't seem like they could /not/ collide if it was possible
05:54:07 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: fwiw your question about anti-neutrons applies much better to anti-_neutrinos_. (in which case something called "chirality" related to spin becomes reversed)
05:55:25 <oerjan> but neutrinos are so weird some theorize they are their own antiparticles ("Majorana neutrinos")
06:00:53 <hppavilion[1]> Santorum: "If people thought about gay sex as much as I do, they'd understand how disgusting it is"
06:03:35 <shachaf> And vector spaces, I guess.
06:05:43 <oerjan> sounds a bit of a thin connection
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06:06:58 <shachaf> Well, it's not all that thin, because I was thinking of Chu spaces just now.
06:09:58 <oerjan> practically monofilamentary
06:13:17 <hppavilion[1]> "Would you rather be able to fly, but only at 0.000001c, or be able to breath underwater, but only for a millicentury"
06:13:42 <hppavilion[1]> ^^^good "would you rather" to differentiate those who do understand math/physics/SI/etc from those who do not
06:14:31 <shachaf> please reconsider the perspective that leads you to write a sentence like that twh
06:15:13 * hppavilion[1] desperately scrambles for a joke to make out of this
06:17:20 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: I don't see which perspective I need to reconsider
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06:36:02 <oerjan> hppavilion[1]: always decant cider
06:41:17 <hppavilion[1]> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/As_Slow_as_Possible: A 640-year song
06:56:55 <hppavilion[1]> I can't help but read https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rastafari in a stereotypical Jamaican accent
06:58:23 <oerjan> obviously you should sing it to a reggae beat hth
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07:50:20 <b_jonas> oerjan: um, if symlinks don't work, then could we have some other mechanism for aliasing wisdoms then?
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08:05:16 <shachaf> I've wanted to set something like that up.
08:05:38 <shachaf> Wisdom redirects or something. Wisdom wildcards. Who even, like, knows, man.
08:24:26 <b_jonas> shachaf: so add a wisdom/location directory, and if wisdom/$foo is not found, wisdom/location/$foo is read and it gives the canonical name to redirect to
08:24:46 <shachaf> How is that an improvement over links?
08:24:55 <b_jonas> shachaf: not broken by revert
08:25:08 <shachaf> Oh, is that what it was about?
08:26:39 <oerjan> mind you, with any kind of links you have the problem that the two versions either may get accidentally out of sync, or accidentally edited together when the edit only fits one of them.
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09:51:32 <S1_p> Oh, the wisdomme is back. Yay.
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10:46:59 <b_jonas> Ok, so I think I want to set up an alias that can do a git checkout to an existing branch, but will absolutely refuse to do the file restore operation that the git checkout command also does.
10:47:30 <b_jonas> Also, I'd like it to print the previous branch or commit that was checked out, so it's easy to follow what happens.
10:49:58 <b_jonas> git checkout is just too dangerous as is
10:52:51 <b_jonas> I wonder how to convince git checkout to do this.
10:53:17 <fizzie> You'd want it to update what HEAD points at and maybe the index, but not do anything to the working tree?
10:53:38 <b_jonas> fizzie: no, I do want to do a full checkout, as in update the working tree and the index too
10:53:52 <fizzie> Oh, just disallow the variant of checkout that takes paths?
10:54:28 <b_jonas> git's syntax for objects and paths are horribly ugly, and there are magical syntaxes that apply to both but have a completely different meaning
10:54:47 <b_jonas> like, :/foo is both a path and an object, but the :/ means something completely different
10:54:58 <b_jonas> the syntax is just horrible
10:55:43 <b_jonas> svn does this much better, there the syntax of urls (pointing to a file in a repository, or a version of a file in a repository) have a syntax that's not only disjoint from that of paths, but also visually different
10:55:49 <b_jonas> so you can't accidentally confuse them
10:56:12 <b_jonas> and the git checkout interface is horrible because it combines a safer operation with a very unsafe irreversible operation
11:00:56 <fizzie> You might just allow -- in a script -- unambiguously-an-existing-branch-and-nothing-else options, and then fall back to being careful and using the raw command if you need to do something strange.
11:01:03 <fizzie> Hopefully that'd cover most branch-switches.
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11:51:03 <b_jonas> fizzie: I don't know, it's probably possible to solve in some way like that, but I'll have to do some careful testing on it
11:52:04 <b_jonas> I certainly don't want to checkout only existing branches. I often checkout -b to create a new branch (from HEAD or another commit), but the script can probably test for that.
11:52:36 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[~-~!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=47099&oldid=40050 * 80.7.4.196 * (+5) Fixed a bug - & has a higher precedence than -, so the - following it had to be wrapped in <>
11:53:04 <b_jonas> hey, maybe I could make a script that does like (git checkout -B foo foo) to checkout branch foo
11:53:38 <b_jonas> but... why can't git just have at least an unambiguous long switch or command to force this, to make my life easier?
11:54:10 <b_jonas> and when I solve this, I'll still have to solve the interface of git reset and git branch, although for those the ambiguity is less dangerous and for git branch I think I already know the solution
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12:15:01 <boily> `relcome IvanSiber
12:15:32 <HackEgo> IvanSiber: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: <http://esolangs.org/>. (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on EFnet or DALnet.)
12:18:17 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[~-~!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=47100&oldid=47099 * 80.7.4.196 * (+1) Added a : to the end of write comment
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12:35:58 <b_jonas> Ok, I set up an alias such that (git switch foo) will do the same as (git checkout foo --). This works even with multiple arguments, and shouldn't checkout paths, unless I explicitly pass "--" as an argument.
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12:39:07 <gamemanj> ok, so my previous messing around during this week has finally come to a conclusion:
12:39:10 <gamemanj> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/21184720/kyouma/index.html
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12:44:08 <rntz> tswett: "i,i" means roughly "I have nothing to contribute, I just like saying", i.e. it's a prefix for off-topic one-liners
12:44:30 <rntz> comes from CMU zephyr (an old messaging protocol), I think
12:45:54 <HackEgo> Oona's Blackguard \ 1B \ Creature -- Faerie Rogue \ 1/1 \ Flying \ Each other Rogue creature you control enters the battlefield with an additional +1/+1 counter on it. \ Whenever a creature you control with a +1/+1 counter on it deals combat damage to a player, that player discards a card. \ MOR-U \ \ Oona's Gatewarden \ (u/b) \ Creature -- Faerie
12:46:00 <HackEgo> Oona, Queen of the Fae \ 3(u/b)(u/b)(u/b) \ Legendary Creature -- Faerie Wizard \ 5/5 \ Flying \ {X}{(u/b)}: Choose a color. Target opponent exiles the top X cards of his or her library. For each card of the chosen color exiled this way, put a 1/1 blue and black Faerie Rogue creature token with flying onto the battlefield. \ SHM-R, MMA-R, V11-M
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13:18:52 <fizzie> Oona is the 175th most common female name in Finland, with ~7500 people.
13:19:36 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[~-~!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=47101&oldid=47100 * 80.7.4.196 * (+105) Grammar and clarification
13:21:23 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[~-~!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=47102&oldid=47101 * 80.7.4.196 * (-1) Changed associativity of &
13:22:59 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[~-~!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=47103&oldid=47102 * 80.7.4.196 * (-2) Bugfix - removed trailing :
13:29:36 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[~-~!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=47104&oldid=47103 * 80.7.4.196 * (+173) Clarification about :
13:30:33 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[~-~!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=47105&oldid=47104 * 80.7.4.196 * (+1) Bugfix - removed trailing :
13:31:40 <gamemanj> I'm getting the feeling asm.js should be classed as esoteric simply because of the crazy type checking
13:35:19 <gamemanj> If I'm trying to be nice, I'd say asm.js is a version of LLVM for the web, but now the type annotations are weirder.
13:36:21 <gamemanj> Eh, LLVM's relatively nice, it's like asm.js but you write in actual human-understandable string names for the type names instead of having to understand the exact details of how + modifies it's parameters.
13:36:50 <gamemanj> Then again again, people just stackalloc everything anyway.
13:36:57 <Phantom_Hoover> asm.js can basically only work with 32-bit ints, that's one big difference
13:37:38 <gamemanj> Wonder how they're going to weasel their way out of that one when it inevitably reaches the point where applications are limited
13:38:17 <gamemanj> Ah, you mean browser vendors will just detect this sort of thing?
13:39:05 <Phantom_Hoover> no it'll just only be used to write fast code operating on 32-bit ints
13:40:10 <gamemanj> Now then, time to go use 32MiB instead of 16 because asm.js wants me to jump up to the next power of two to avoid a bounds check. Seriously.
13:40:36 <gamemanj> (The ironic thing is that I added the 8 extra bytes because this is how to avoid bounds checks on BytePusher)
13:41:32 <gamemanj> ...either that or I technically violate specification...
13:41:46 <gamemanj> ...eh, violating specification it is.
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13:44:29 <gamemanj> ...and now the browser gives me a second annoyance... "unable to cache asm.js in synchronous scripts"???
13:45:23 <gamemanj> I sincerely hope that the lack of caching refers to if I happen to compile the same function twice, and not if I happen to reuse the same function instance...
13:45:26 <Phantom_Hoover> the skullcode vm is in asm.js, i actually find it a lot more readable than the minified JS that defines all the interface code
13:45:44 <gamemanj> Well, there is readable asm.js out there
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13:48:50 <gamemanj> Post-ASM.JS version of JIT, performance seems to be...worse than with the Pre-ASM.JS version of the JIT, judging by the now-stuttering audio...
13:49:21 <gamemanj> Though it does keep having little bits where it runs normally...
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13:50:21 <gamemanj> Like, audio was always this "clicky", but it didn't outright stop as much. Good thing I have a backup of the pre-ASM.JS'd JIT.
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13:51:38 <gamemanj> It seems it's actually not compiling more segments - it's literally just the overhead from running the asm.js.
13:52:30 <gamemanj> I knew there'd be some entry/exit overhead due to the nature of the JIT, which would offset the benefit somewhat, but this bad?
13:52:32 <Phantom_Hoover> you are running this on a JS interpreter which can compile the asm.js into machine code, right?
13:52:42 <gamemanj> Firefox. Hence I was getting asm.js warnings.
13:53:02 <gamemanj> but it doesn't seem to have helped that much...
13:53:14 <gamemanj> It's saying "successfully compiled asm.js code".
13:55:37 <gamemanj> I should probably explain what's going on
13:56:01 <gamemanj> That JIT compiles segments of BytePusher code into JavaScript
13:56:13 <gamemanj> I then changed it to write it into asm.js
13:56:19 <gamemanj> Pre-ASM.JS: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/21184720/kyouma/index.html
13:56:23 <gamemanj> Post-ASM.JS: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/21184720/kyouma-asm/index.html
13:57:10 <gamemanj> What I at least notice is that although pre-asm.js, it's stuttery, once the VM loads up segments most of the problems are just due to my bad audio code.
13:57:26 <gamemanj> Post-asm.js, it just doesn't stop stuttering.
13:59:11 <gamemanj> A possibility is that perhaps the asm.js entry overhead causes the "which segment should be used for execution" code to be a lot slower, causing issues.
13:59:38 <gamemanj> This means that the issue should be resolved by making a non-ASM.JS copy of that code.
14:00:33 <gamemanj> (note: Multiple versions of one segment may be compiled for different circumstances. I assumed the "which segment to use" routine would benefit from asm.js, but I may well be wrong.)
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14:08:02 <Akaibu> yo gamemanj do you know about jsMESS?
14:08:12 <Akaibu> that might help with what ever your doing
14:08:24 <gamemanj> Akaibu: Nope, but I can guess. And anyway, I'm messing with BytePusher, so...
14:08:54 <Akaibu> https://github.com/jsmess/jsmess www.archiveteam.org/index.php?title=Javascript_Mess
14:12:03 <gamemanj> Well, I'm not using emscripten ^.^;
14:13:31 <Akaibu> good to take tips though gamemanj
14:13:57 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[~-~!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=47106&oldid=47105 * 80.7.4.196 * (+3079) Finally fleshed out library semantics
14:15:25 <gamemanj> True, but this is a JIT, not a standard interpreter (I already tried that with hand-written asm.js and got pretty good performance from it - I'm JITing things to try and improve on that.). If someone had a guide to asm.js efficiency in there, then that would be useful.
14:17:27 <gamemanj> Basically, of the 3, performance seems to be so far: [asm.js interpreter] > [Javascript-compiling JIT] > [asm.js-compiling JIT]
14:18:42 <Phantom_Hoover> wait so you're regularly JITing blocks of bytepusher into asm.js? yeah i expect it's the startup overhead then
14:19:01 <gamemanj> Well, at first there's obviously segment compilation overhead
14:19:10 <gamemanj> But then there are times when it's slow and it's not compiling any segments
14:21:47 <gamemanj> For example, during the initial startup phase, when it's generating tables (the program's 32k) it goes through the "base set" initialization, and that's relatively fast with not much segment compilation, followed by the first page of the "banks" initialization, which does tons of segment compilation, followed by the rest which does almost none.
14:22:20 <gamemanj> Then, for the first few letters it displays on screen it's still compiling bits of the font renderer...
14:22:36 <gamemanj> But after that, it shouldn't be as slow as it ends up being.
14:22:50 <gamemanj> Compiled segments value drops.
14:28:16 <gamemanj> Ok, uploaded new version, this time it has "CS" and "F" stats (CS is how many segments it's compiled so far this frame, F is which frame the VM is on.)
14:29:44 <gamemanj> It's a bit telling that the asm.js version is laggy during the first 4 seconds while the non-asm.js version isn't as laggy, even though CS:0 for all but a few frames...
14:30:16 <gamemanj> I must be making a very serious mistake in how I write my asm.js...
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17:27:50 <HackEgo> super effective? ¯\(°_o)/¯
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17:34:39 <int-e> hmm a supercritical hit
17:35:55 <\oren\> is that the same as a its super effective critical hit?
17:36:15 <gamemanj> Since installing Unifont, my ability to see the symbols you post has increased by orders of magnitude. My ability to understand them has not.
17:51:13 <int-e> \oren\: I was looking for a connection to supercritical fluids
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19:21:31 <hppavilion[1]> From the Wikipedia article on "Computus", the family of algorithms one uses to calculate the date of Easter because one's church is a massive pain in the ass and doesn't just choose a fixed, symbolic date:
19:21:33 <hppavilion[1]> "The last limit arises from the fact that the crucifixion was considered to have happened on the fourteenth (the eve of the Passover) and the resurrection therefore on the sixteenth."
19:21:54 <hppavilion[1]> Um... Christianity? Are you sure you can really math?
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19:39:02 <hppavilion[1]> Instead of "The more you know", we (the population of the internet) should use "the less you look like a dumbass"
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20:00:19 <Koen_> that would make a whole sentence!
20:03:51 <int-e> in two different ways
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21:35:21 -!- shachaf has set topic: The intradisciplinary hub of solidity matrices, esoteric programming language design, and font forging | http://esolangs.org/ | logs: http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/ http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2023808/wisdom.pdf.
21:36:25 <HackEgo> shachaf: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: <http://esolangs.org/>. (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on EFnet or DALnet.)
21:36:25 <HackEgo> /home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: bye: not found
21:38:45 <gamemanj> At some point someone ought to port a text adventure to HackEgo...
21:39:11 <gamemanj> That is, make it save on input, and reload when given a line of input
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21:45:47 <\oren\> i once was a font forager now am a font forger
21:48:11 <HackEgo> #esoteric bitmap fonts include: \oren\'s font http://www.orenwatson.be/fontdemo.htm , lifthrasiir's font https://github.com/lifthrasiir/unison/ https://lifthrasiir.github.io/unison/sample.png , b_jonas's font http://www.math.bme.hu/~ambrus/pu/fecupboard20-c.pcf.gz
21:48:22 <b_jonas> wasn't there a fourth one?
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21:49:29 <Moon_> gamemanj, hw about me?
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21:50:05 <Moon_> [16:38] <gamemanj> At some point someone ought to port a text adventure to HackEgo... [16:39] <gamemanj> That is, make it save on input, and reload when given a line of input
21:50:13 <gamemanj> Well, it would be fun, if you want to ^.^ (though it might end up playing like Twitch Plays <insert game here>)
21:50:17 <b_jonas> \oren\: by the way, I just checked http://www.orenwatson.be/fontdemo.htm , and strangely the webfont doesn't show up for me. but it's probably a problem on my side again
21:50:37 <gamemanj> b_jonas: I can confirm the font is visible, and I do not have the font installed.
21:50:37 <Moon_> ill allow save selection for ease of use :P
21:50:52 <gamemanj> However, there is one major issue with the font...
21:51:35 <Moon_> is that a be- wait thats infinity, i play dwarf fortress too much
21:53:16 * gamemanj disappeared in a puff of smoke (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
21:53:31 <\oren\> gamemanj: wait did i nitmove those yet? shit i must[have firgotten
21:54:17 <\oren\> uhhh... how did he get it to say that?
21:54:48 <Moon_> shachaf, calm down >_>
21:54:59 <Moon_> no need to spam hackego
21:55:09 <\oren\> it said gamemanj disappeared in a puff of smoke ping timeout
21:55:10 <gamemanj> oren: Aha. Your chat client doesn't colour the difference between quits and /me.
21:55:24 <gamemanj> oren: I can tell simply by the fact you were fooled by it!
21:56:27 <HackEgo> nœd//Nœd is Norwegian for distress.
21:56:27 <HackEgo> brick//Brick goes in brain. The statutory punishment for perpetrators of brainfuck derivatives.
21:56:31 * Moon_ Moon_ [4c01498a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.76.1.73.138] has quit [Bia]
21:56:37 <\oren\> my crap ssh app doesnt support the advqnced colors
21:56:54 <Moon_> i ruined my chance
21:57:10 <\oren\> im on my phone right now
21:57:37 <Moon_> actually: what os/
21:57:39 <\oren\> android samsung galaxy lte
21:58:01 <Moon_> ok: termux -> weechat -> #esoteric
21:58:15 <Moon_> thats the esoteric way :P
21:59:40 <\oren\> i wish i had a physical keybiatd on this phone
21:59:58 <Moon_> termux is a terminal emulator
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22:00:09 <\oren\> then i could type with less mistakes
22:02:43 <\oren\> ifeally it would have a full 104 key keyboard and flip open
22:06:13 <int-e> and a d key that's exactly where you need it?
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22:07:58 <\oren\> aaaaaaaaaasqaqqaaaaaaaaaasassaaaaaassaaaaaqaq
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23:14:51 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: Well yeah, but we don't talk about edge cases
23:16:05 <shachaf> I have a very fast edge detection algorithm.
23:16:20 <hppavilion[1]> If the first time derivative of a changing position is its velocity and the second is acceleration, what's the third time derivative?
23:16:21 <shachaf> It's very accurate, except in edge cases.
23:16:41 <HackEgo> Jerk is the integral of snap.
23:17:55 <hppavilion[1]> Oh, it was explained in literally the very next sentence
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23:18:24 <shachaf> (that's what the kids say these days, right?)
23:19:00 <hppavilion[1]> shachaf: Bearing says that occasionally, but nobody else
23:19:28 <hppavilion[1]> But what's the negative first derivative of a changing position?
23:19:39 <hppavilion[1]> Oh wait, negative derivatives are probably integrals
23:19:56 <shachaf> oh man, you read the spoilers
23:19:58 <boily> hppavellon[1]. have you discovered the wonderful world of fractional derivatives?
23:20:03 <shachaf> you'd have more fun if you didn't read the spoilers
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23:21:39 <boily> hppavilion[1]: imagine, Morgan Freeman doing an ASMR video about derivatives.
23:22:04 * hppavilion[1] later wakes up to find that his brain is completely depleted of endorphines
23:23:03 <quintopia> then absity, abseleration, abserk, ...
23:27:01 <hppavilion[1]> boily: There are imaginary derivatives, but they're useless in physics (as far as we know mwahahahahaha)
23:28:25 <boily> everything's useful in physics. physics is engineering, and engineering is the Essence of Life hth
23:29:41 <hppavilion[1]> I should probably read about fractional derivatives first though
23:30:45 <quintopia> i can't imagine what a 2D space with diff/int on some axis would even be about
23:31:48 <hppavilion[1]> quintopia: Of course, 2-time is interesting too. 2,2-spacetime, perhaps?
23:32:00 <quintopia> http://jlms.oxfordjournals.org/content/s2-3/2/241.extract "Mellin transforms" I'm already lost
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23:51:10 <shachaf> oerjan: There should be join messages in IRC.
23:51:19 <shachaf> So I could figure out what the dual of "Nite" is.
23:52:28 <boily> I don't think join messages are good. I'd have to find the dual of a chicken.
23:52:46 <shachaf> Did you logread my CHICKEN message the other day?
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23:53:15 <quintopia> boily: do you manually the chickens? or script?
23:53:46 <boily> quintopia: manually.
23:53:51 <boily> it's a craft! an art!
23:54:26 <oerjan> chickencraft, the game where you build things from chickens.
23:55:26 <oerjan> such as the great pyramids of chicken itza.
23:55:58 * boily doublethwacks \oren\ and oerjan. 0.75 and 0.99 shachafs.
23:56:08 <quintopia> i could build an academic cs paper from chickens...
23:57:17 <oerjan> boily: hey i made two!
23:57:34 <oerjan> i guess the first might not really count as a pun.
23:58:03 <HackEgo> A mapole is a thwackamacallit built from maple according to Canadian standards. The army version includes a spork, a corkscrew and a moose whistle. A regulatory mapole measures 6' by 12 kg, ±0.5 inHg.
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23:58:25 <boily> oerjan: I didn't count the first.
23:58:28 <shachaf> What precision do you measure with?
23:58:31 <oerjan> it's so hard to get above 1. i think he might consider it like the c of relativity.
23:58:53 <boily> shachaf: about that.
23:58:57 <quintopia> hmm, 6' by 12 kg? that doesn't sound possible to do two doublethwacks in a row without inducing severe exhaustion or broken radii in the thwacker
23:59:02 * boily flails around a gesture of precision
23:59:04 <oerjan> . o O ( so what i need is a _really_ tachy pun )
23:59:18 <shachaf> boily: How many usual suspects would you say there are?
23:59:31 <boily> that was a good one :D
23:59:33 <quintopia> oerjan: that was only a 0.3 on the tachometer