< 1472170185 0 :moonythedwarf_!~IceChat9@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf JOIN :#esoteric < 1472170312 0 :moonythedwarf!~IceChat9@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1472170746 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm, can I call the number 110,000 "eleven hundred hundred"? < 1472170778 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :1.1 lakh < 1472170867 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :eleven myriad! < 1472171096 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Talk:MiniStringFuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49644&oldid=49638 5* 03Darkrifts 5* (+364) 10 < 1472171336 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : じゅういちまん < 1472171384 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :十一万 HTH < 1472171439 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: can you read hiragana? < 1472171467 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: Nope < 1472171474 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :jyuu ichi man < 1472171507 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is some weird romanization. < 1472171588 0 :Lord_of_Life!Elite12246@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-ildhnuqfyzkjcmcn QUIT :Excess Flood < 1472171589 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Jūichiman" would be a more normal Hepburn, no? < 1472171618 0 :Lord_of_Life!Elite12246@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-kpwrtoucyldiiykb JOIN :#esoteric < 1472171873 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Talk:MiniStringFuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49645&oldid=49644 5* 03Darkrifts 5* (+47) 10 < 1472172382 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I'm sort of using wa-puro romaji < 1472172527 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's pretty scow. < 1472172544 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially when you're inserting literally unnecessary characters in it. < 1472172560 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even with normal-ish wapuro, that'd be "juuichiman". < 1472172573 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or "juu ichi man" I guess. < 1472175629 0 :byteflame!~byteflame@c-71-238-242-230.hsd1.ar.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472177139 0 :byteflame!~byteflame@c-71-238-242-230.hsd1.ar.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1472177163 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :How is circumcision not classified as genital mutilation? < 1472177208 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :To some degree, it's like carving a cross or star of david into your child's flesh < 1472177442 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dang. /// is more than 10 and a half years old now. < 1472177565 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :About circumcision: yup. < 1472177582 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tradition, I suppose. < 1472177602 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's been legal for thousands of years and they haven't changed the law yet. < 1472177633 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: you musta been, like, 4 when I came up with ///. < 1472177735 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now here's a question. < 1472177748 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: Sounds right < 1472177752 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :...wow Mauritania < 1472177753 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good job < 1472177756 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Great job < 1472177758 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :In ///, how can I compress a big long thing that's very regular, but doesn't actually have much in the way of individual substrings that are repeated a lot, like: < 1472177760 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :99E99F98E98E98F97E97E97F96E96E96F95E95E95F94E94E94F93E93E93F92E92E92F91E91E91F90E90E90F89E89E89F88E88E88F87E87E87F86E86E86F85E85E85F84E84E84F83E83E83F82E82E82F81E81E81F80E80E80F79E79E79F78E78E78F77E77E77F76E76E76F75E75E75F74E74E74F73E73E73F72E72E72F71E71E71F70E70E70F69E69E69F68E68E68F67E67E67F66E66E66F65E65E65F64E64E64F63E63E63F62E62E62F61E61E61F60E60E60F59E59E59F58E58E58F57E57E57F56E56E56F55E55E55F54E54E54F53E53E53F52E52E52F51E51E51F50E50E50F49E49E49F48 < 1472177760 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :E48E48F47E47E47F46E46E46F45E45E45F44E44E44F43E43E43F42E42E42F41E41E41F40E40E40F39E39E39F38E38E38F37E37E37F36E36E36F35E35E35F34E34E34F33E33E33F32E32E32F31E31E31F30E30E30F29E29E29F28E28E28F27E27E27F26E26E26F25E25E25F24E24E24F23E23E23F22E22E22F21E21E21F20E20E20F19E19E19F18E18E18F17E17E17F16E16E16F15E15E15F14E14E14F13E13E13F12E12E12F11E11E11F10E10E10F < 1472177777 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm... < 1472177796 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, you mean.... < 1472177799 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see what you mean < 1472177820 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, how could I create a concise /// program outputting that? < 1472177832 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: No, the problem is I don't see the pattern yet < 1472177838 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can see that there is some sort of pattern < 1472177841 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I can't tell how it works < 1472177870 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Essentially, the string consists of "nEnEnF" repeated for each number from about 99 down to about 10. < 1472177871 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Start with a concise program outputting that in a traditional language, for a start < 1472177901 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: Except 99E is only once? < 1472177941 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently. So 98 is the first one where it has the entire nEnEnF. < 1472177959 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ihttp://esolangs.org/wiki//// may be my favorite URL < 1472177974 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know, it's kind of a wonderful URL. < 1472177976 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: Well, you're definitely going to need the string #E#E#F < 1472177990 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And # gets replaced with the number < 1472178039 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, not sure how to print it < 1472178092 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lemme pose a possibly easier question. < 1472178101 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: No, I think I'm figuring it out < 1472178108 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, so the pattern has to be a literal, except \ can escape \ or /? < 1472178112 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, for my own benefit, I mean. < 1472178114 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's correct. < 1472178122 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And, of course, \ and / both must be escaped. < 1472178138 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: ...that's what I said < 1472178188 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, for my own benefit, here's a new question. Come up with a reasonably concise /// program outputting this: < 1472178196 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :00_01_02_03_04_05_06_07_010_11_12_13_14_15_16_17_18_19_20_21_22_23_24_25_26_27_28_29_30_31_32_33_34_35_36_37_38_39_40_41_42_43_44_45_46_47_48_49_50_51_52_53_54_55_56_57_58_59_60_61_62_63_64_65_66_67_68_69_70_71_72_73_74_75_76_77_78_79_80_81_82_83_84_85_86_87_88_89_90_91_92_93_94_95_96_97_98_99_ < 1472178220 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Um... there's a hilarious error in the middle of that. < 1472178235 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :See where it says 07_010_11? That should say 07_08_09_10_11. < 1472178292 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm, I'm not sure if there's a way to do it concisely < 1472178304 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now, here's a trick I learned from the wiki page. < 1472178306 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, there probably is < 1472178309 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Step 1 is to convert that to this... < 1472178325 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :00_01_02_03_04_05_06_07_08_09/_0/_1/_00_01_02_03_04_05_06_07_08_09/_1/_2/_00_01_02_03_04_05_06_07_08_09 < 1472178327 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And so on. < 1472178334 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean... if you can make a replacement self-replicate somehow, it'd probably work < 1472178347 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then you can come up with a shortcut for 00_01_02_03_04_05_06_07_08_09. < 1472178381 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then you'll just be left with something looking a lot like... < 1472178406 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you need to have a normal decrement substitution (like the one in Thue in reverse and decimal rather than binary) < 1472178423 0 :moonythedwarf_!~IceChat9@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1472178426 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :x/_0/_1/x/_1/_2/x/_2/_3/x/_3/_4/x/_4/_5/x/_5/_6/x/_6/_7/x/_7/_8/x/_8/_9/ < 1472178426 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which will definitely have to be at least 10 distinct substitutions < 1472178496 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then a counter I think... < 1472178562 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then a method by which the count can be inserted into all occurrences of # in #E#E#F < 1472178573 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then print it and start over with a decremented count < 1472178597 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does it have to be terminated by a final _? < 1472178663 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: nope. < 1472178675 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :print('_'.join(str(x).zfill(2)for x in range(100))) Is the shortest I can come up with in Python < 1472178686 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I bet there is a shorter version though < 1472178688 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: note you can escape characters other than / and \ as well. that often makes it easier _not_ to substitute things too early. < 1472178740 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Python 2 lets you omit one set of () so it's 2 characters shorter < 1472178842 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the best language for this? < 1472179043 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :bash is pretty good. < 1472179045 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :for i in {00..99}_; do echo -n $i; done < 1472179057 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or... < 1472179077 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :echo {00..99} | sed 's/ /_/g' < 1472179099 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, if you're okay with spaces instead of underscores, it's just... < 1472179103 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :echo {00..99} < 1472179142 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, lemme try perl < 1472179220 0 :FireFly!~firefly@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm < 1472179271 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: tr -d ' ' < 1472179325 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :echo {00..99}_|tr -d ' ' is the shortest I can come up with without spaces < 1472179330 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :In bash < 1472179427 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is seq 00 99 considered correct? < 1472179448 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nevermind, it doesn't pad < 1472179459 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :adding a format will be way too long < 1472179690 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm having trouble figuring out the perl version < 1472179772 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: str(x).zfill(2) == '%02d'%x for given range < 1472179814 0 :FireFly!~firefly@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ ,'_',.~(_2{.!.'0'":)"0 i.100 < 1472179814 0 :j-bot!~j-bot@li1285-84.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: 00_01_02_03_04_05_06_07_08_09_10_11_12_13_14_15_16_17_18_19_20_21_22_23_24_25_26_27_28_29_30_31_32_33_34_35_36_37_38_39_40_41_42_43_44_45_46_47_48_49_50_51_52_53_54_55_56_57_58_59_60_61_62_63_64_65_66_67_68_69_70_71_72_73_74_75_76_77_78_79_80_81_82_83_84_85_86_87_88_89_90_91_92_93_94_95_96_97_98_99_ < 1472179831 0 :FireFly!~firefly@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Feels rather mediocre, honestly < 1472179849 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and has a trailing underscore < 1472179852 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: and ('_%02d'*100%tuple(range(100)))[1:] is shorter < 1472179857 0 :FireFly!~firefly@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought that was intended < 1472179868 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: I forgot about the formatting operator < 1472179869 0 :FireFly!~firefly@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett's original line had one too < 1472179881 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: How about a Perl version? < 1472179888 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rught < 1472179894 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not good at perl golfing :p < 1472179906 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :print '00'..'99'; is missing the _ =P < 1472180546 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :print map{s/$/_/r}'00'..'99' < 1472180547 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Got it < 1472180571 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can someone come up with a shorter perl version? < 1472180884 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1472181054 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1472181332 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1472181665 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1472181735 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, little poll. < 1472181752 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm creating a database query tool. I'm thinking of naming it Catabase. < 1472181762 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do you think of this name? < 1472181909 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite < 1472181922 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: next time try 'patabase < 1472182028 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like it < 1472183130 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: is the first a short or long? < 1472183177 0 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Short. < 1472183184 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :catamountbase < 1472183719 0 :espes!~espes@205.185.120.132 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1472183740 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1472183810 0 :espes!~espes@205.185.120.132 JOIN :#esoteric < 1472183821 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf JOIN :#esoteric < 1472184464 0 :FireFly!~firefly@freenode/staff/firefly QUIT :Ping timeout: 612 seconds < 1472184594 0 :FireFly!~firefly@freenode/staff/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1472184858 0 :adu!~ajr@pool-71-178-208-237.washdc.fios.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472185926 0 :adu!~ajr@pool-71-178-208-237.washdc.fios.verizon.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1472186342 0 :adu!~ajr@pool-71-178-208-237.washdc.fios.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472186618 0 :Akaibu!uid118096@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-pudtcimibqlkxcjr JOIN :#esoteric < 1472187731 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: That kind of open protocol and game logic by server is also how I would design some multiplayer online game too such as a card game; in this case hard realtime is not as important. Time limits may be defined but you do not need so much precision < 1472188219 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472189839 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish customary units were better < 1472189925 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :With words for things other than the simple stuff that people cared about in... huh, we don't know how old English Units (the parent of both Imperial and Customary units) are < 1472189938 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :They were around during roman colonization in the 0s < 1472189987 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :...wow, the reason we still use Customary here is "Advocates of the customary system saw the French Revolutionary, or metric, system as atheistic." < 1472190044 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :...oh, huh < 1472190063 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :On my keyboard, I HAVE TO PRESS shift to turn off capslock suddenly < 1472190065 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :...OK < 1472190119 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 furlong, 2 yards < 1472190648 0 :Cale!~cale@CPEc8d3a35c2cdd-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1472190668 0 :Cale!~cale@CPEc8d3a35c2cdd-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1472190783 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why does nobody use the metre-gram-second? < 1472190818 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seconds are a bizarre unit. < 1472190947 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Why? < 1472190950 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :.../dammit/ < 1472190966 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1472191033 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, NFM < 1472191036 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :*NVM < 1472191037 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think < 1472191072 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: How are seconds a bazaar unit? And how exactly do you "sell" a second in Mesopotamia? < 1472191263 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :...wow < 1472191275 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :When people petitioned the white house for a Metric implementation < 1472191299 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The director of the NIST said that, since customary units were defined in the metric system, the nation is "bilingual" in terms of measurement systems. < 1472191311 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just use natural units. < 1472191329 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :How many planck lengths tall are you? < 1472191378 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm about 1.143*10^35 planck lengths tall, personally. < 1472191389 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: The natural unit of length is the smoot. < 1472191423 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: If we do that, we'll at the very least need to define units completely unrelated to planck in name that are always the same multiple of the natural version of what they measure < 1472191441 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I cannot argue that. < 1472191452 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has even walked that bridge before
< 1472191466 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But did you ever walk the planck? < 1472191472 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1472191561 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, for example, a brick (or whatever) is roughly 0.21765099999999998 kilograms < 1472191571 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then the argument is smoot. < 1472191671 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(If I were to propose a system for the US to use, there would be a unit called the toom that is about a smoot and hope nobody noticed) < 1472191696 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :our inability to objetively define mass is irritating < 1472191710 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also symptomatic of our general inability to comprehend gravity) < 1472191738 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should learn about physics. < 1472191745 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: if you do let me know < 1472191748 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should too < 1472191771 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :If we Americans are going to keep our isolationism, we need to stop using those obviously-metric "kilobytes" and "megabytes" and "gigabytes" < 1472191776 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The trouble is that physicists have a bizarre perspective on everything. < 1472191788 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the most Customary-esque measurement of information? < 1472191799 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :we are all americans on this blessed day < 1472191809 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Information can be measured in semitones. < 1472191810 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: yeah, like on what is reasonable mathematics < 1472191814 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or in bels. < 1472191820 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(...august 25?) < 1472191852 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://i.imgur.com/Bxmjwj0.png < 1472191854 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The smallest unit would be 6 bits (called a "letter") < 1472191859 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I probably shouldn't've done that. < 1472191864 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: The BTU per Rankine. < 1472191892 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ASCII (which is the American Standard) is a 7-bit code < 1472191905 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: But not all of ASCII is letters < 1472191924 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least, that unit has the same dimension as thermodynamic entropy. < 1472191979 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know what? A letter is 5.70043 bits, not 6 < 1472192037 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't entropy the negative of information? Or something like that? < 1472192099 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Thermodynamic entropy = (-1) * information theoretic entropy < 1472192103 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :A line is 50 letters, a page is 36 lines (though there's conflict; most government entities are supposed to use a 72 line page (as they assumed both sides), but common usage is 36) < 1472192131 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Yes, I grabbed the nearest book and counted the lines on the page I had open) < 1472192218 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(what's a common unit of information? < 1472192218 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :) < 1472192312 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Common? The bit. < 1472192353 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Common as in colloquial < 1472192367 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: When explaining that there's a lot of data somewhere, what do you use for comparison? < 1472192396 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :The KJV Bible? < 1472192400 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Sure < 1472192426 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Searched "KJV bible length in characters". Received "9" < 1472192524 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :correct < 1472192529 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> length "KJV bible" < 1472192532 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : 9 < 1472192693 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The most recent release of Ubuntu (64-bit desktop) is, if my torrent client is correct, 146503 page < 1472192720 0 :adu!~ajr@pool-71-178-208-237.washdc.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]! < 1472192724 0 :adu!~ajr@pool-71-178-208-237.washdc.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi hppavilion[1]! < 1472192749 0 :adu!~ajr@pool-71-178-208-237.washdc.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: how have you been? < 1472192772 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hadu < 1472192775 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good < 1472192802 0 :adu!~ajr@pool-71-178-208-237.washdc.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had a 30 minute tele-conference with my company's competitor today :D < 1472192828 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1472192829 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why? < 1472192837 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you stealing trade secrets!? :) < 1472193362 0 :adu!~ajr@pool-71-178-208-237.washdc.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1472194665 0 :adu!~ajr@pool-71-178-208-237.washdc.fios.verizon.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1472195110 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'll try and get Congress to pass a law improving the Customary system; if we can't switch to metric, we can at least make it easier < 1472195183 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Define the metric prefixes (plus hella- and hello-) as acceptable modifiers of unit (so kilofoot and millipound are words that government organizations can use) < 1472195200 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And add some new units that Metric already has single units for but Customary doesn't < 1472195438 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(there's no simple word for a Customary Newton or Pascal or any such thing) < 1472195466 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And maybe even some shorthands for concepts (like speed and acceleration) < 1472195502 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the REAL reason I do this is for an evil purpose- it mixes in my system of naming, and establishes it as compulsory for marketing < 1472195508 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(for information) < 1472195837 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think in United States, legal documents are already allowed to use metric. < 1472195843 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Such a law has already been passed. < 1472195927 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You don't have to use metric) < 1472195932 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :The major issue is, in certain contexts you're not allowed to *exclusively* use metric. < 1472195971 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :For instance, packaging for food is generally not allowed to use metric exclusively. < 1472195984 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, so that is how it is. < 1472195986 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but is required to use metric in addition to US customary units) < 1472196005 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1472196018 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is it an issue? < 1472196024 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not really see much of a problem with that though. < 1472196033 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not a huge one, except some manufacturers would like to stop caring. < 1472196057 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fortunately, there's no requirement that your goods be a round number of units in one system or another. < 1472196093 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :So e.g. it's perfectly valid to sell 4L of milk, just so long as it's 4 L (135 fl oz) < 1472196239 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( One hertz-second (Hz⋅s) is a useless unit... I wonder if we make stuff more confusing with it ) < 1472196545 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The best strategy to secure our borders and keep out ISIS trying to get in through Mexico is, in my opinion, to (1) help fix Mexico so it's not a shitty place to live that makes the US much more appealing (2) form a "North American Union" of sorts (NAU- like the EU) and (3) Impose strict regulations on travel into NAU member states, but travel between NAU member states is allowed and easy (but you don't necessarily get government < 1472196545 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :benefits for the country you're in) < 1472196620 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: This is because you're thinking about effective policy, not racism. < 1472196627 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ...Oh right < 1472196668 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Well, if we get enough mixed-race couples then Mexicans and Whites will slowly become indistinguishable < 1472199647 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@193.190.253.145 JOIN :#esoteric < 1472200243 0 :Kaynato!~Aedile@cpe-75-187-129-201.neo.res.rr.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1472200986 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT : < 1472201144 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm... < 1472201155 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it possible to have a measurement along the lines of m^1/2? < 1472201295 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :eu has like 25 members < 1472201298 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :nau would have 2 < 1472201305 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :izabera: 3 < 1472201312 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not north < 1472201315 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i < 1472201322 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :izabera: canada < 1472201330 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :canada and us < 1472201336 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :mexico isn't north < 1472201338 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :izabera: And Mexico < 1472201344 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :izabera: Mexico is in North America < 1472201351 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever < 1472201353 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :25 to 3 < 1472201358 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :North America as opposed to South America < 1472201360 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The continents < 1472201425 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also the EU currently has 28 members < 1472201446 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that before or after brexit? < 1472201453 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Before < 1472201474 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :We're seeing how long we can procrastinate brexit before everyone forgets about it < 1472201787 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was real Brexit-sad at Heathrow again when using the "UK and EU passports" lane. < 1472201804 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`welcome fizzie < 1472201825 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also the automatic ePassport gates refused to like my passport -- Brexit consequences manifesting in advance? < 1472201827 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Brazil is exiting?! < 1472201838 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The ones in Finland liked it just fine.) < 1472201928 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lizzie, < 1472201930 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1472201944 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I had that in Heathrow < 1472201954 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :But not in Venice < 1472201966 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So what is the square root of a unit? What's sqrt(kg) or sqrt(s) or sqrt(m)? < 1472202110 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: Apparently fracture toughness values are typically in units of MPa sqrt(m), as in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fracture_toughness#Example_values < 1472202139 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :m^i < 1472202143 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll show myself out < 1472202193 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm really just looking for a physical interpretation, if such a thing can possibly exist < 1472202812 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1472204642 0 :moonythedwarf!~IceChat9@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf JOIN :#esoteric < 1472205688 0 :moonythedwarf!~IceChat9@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1472206339 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, this is unexpected < 1472208614 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Fourier14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49646&oldid=49164 5* 03Beta-Decay 5* (+336) 10 < 1472209351 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Fourier14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49647&oldid=49646 5* 03Beta-Decay 5* (+0) 10 < 1472215533 0 :augur!~augur@2602:304:cdac:e260:a470:45f6:2c84:df73 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1472218669 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: a Nyuszi gondoskodott a vitaminról < 1472218670 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: too late to change design philosophy. it only teaches the new language < 1472218674 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, he's back! < 1472219767 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: a lepke őt és mindhármukat én. < 1472219767 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: and now he's going to switzerland to a winter solstice ritual in a " symbol", and you can rotate the picture in all 4 compass directions < 1472220297 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both racism and discrimination against the poor are stupid < 1472223321 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1472223634 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> chr$72+29+9 < 1472223637 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : 'n' < 1472223645 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> chr$72+29+7 < 1472223648 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : 'l' < 1472223654 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1472223873 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Special:Log/block14]]4 block10 02 5* 03Oerjan 5* 10blocked [[02User:83.230.38.5810]] with an expiry time of 1 year (anonymous users only, account creation disabled): Spamming links to external sites < 1472223964 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :another legitimate anonymous edit caught in the filter :( < 1472224166 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete10 02 5* 03Oerjan 5* 10deleted "[[02User:Mtve10]]": Spam: Apparently no one noticed back in 2011 when this spam page was (re)created :P < 1472224300 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell ais523 the "polish" spammers stupidly respammed a page they'd managed to split by us - in 2011 :P < 1472224300 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1472224317 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell ais523 *slip, sheesh < 1472224317 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1472224324 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1472224430 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Dimensions14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49648&oldid=45598 5* 03Oerjan 5* (+0) 10/* Hello World! */ Anonymous legitimate edit caught by filter 9 < 1472224492 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell ais523 Somehow, filter 9 seems to cause more work :( < 1472224493 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1472224763 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was also an earlier blocked edit which i don't know if is correct https://esolangs.org/wiki/Special:AbuseLog/6629 < 1472224861 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Special:Log/block14]]4 block10 02 5* 03Oerjan 5* 10blocked [[02User:5.248.239.3210]] with an expiry time of 1 year (anonymous users only, account creation disabled): Spamming links to external sites < 1472225004 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 kiloHertz-seconds is just 10000 < 1472225093 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :shocking < 1472226323 0 :icomefromSPACE73!~j@172.56.7.120 JOIN :#esoteric < 1472226343 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :10000 what? < 1472226350 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :we need a unit for non-dimensional constants < 1472226354 0 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the consistency < 1472226405 0 :icomefromSPACE73!~j@172.56.7.120 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1472226427 0 :icomefromSPACE73!~ICOMEFROM@172.56.7.120 JOIN :#esoteric < 1472226439 0 :icomefromSPACE73!~ICOMEFROM@172.56.7.120 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi everyone! < 1472226498 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`relcome icomefromSPACE73 < 1472226499 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​04icomefromSPACE73: 07Welcome 08to 09the 02international 06hub 13for 04esoteric 07programming 08language 09design 02and 06deployment! 13For 04more 07information, 08check 09out 02our 06wiki: 13. 04(For 07the 08other 09kind 02of 06esoterica, 13try 04#esoteric 07on 08EFnet 09or 02DALnet.) < 1472226524 0 :icomefromSPACE73!~ICOMEFROM@172.56.7.120 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so are we programming the universe here? < 1472226532 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :rarely < 1472226544 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh that < 1472226545 0 :icomefromSPACE73!~ICOMEFROM@172.56.7.120 PRIVMSG #esoteric :who's fault is it that i'm on planet earth? < 1472226566 0 :icomefromSPACE73!~ICOMEFROM@172.56.7.120 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and how do i get my fusion drives working so i can get off this planet? < 1472226588 0 :icomefromSPACE73!~ICOMEFROM@172.56.7.120 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my mechanic died in plasma conduit malfunction < 1472226593 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ic < 1472226599 0 :icomefromSPACE73!~ICOMEFROM@172.56.7.120 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes yes.. < 1472226618 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? space < 1472226619 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :space? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1472226647 0 :icomefromSPACE73!~ICOMEFROM@172.56.7.120 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's right.. i come from a planet called Superion... it's awesome, i want to get back < 1472226684 0 :icomefromSPACE73!~ICOMEFROM@172.56.7.120 PRIVMSG #esoteric :healp mah < 1472226722 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think the book "The little Prince" has some advice at the end hth < 1472226755 0 :icomefromSPACE73!~ICOMEFROM@172.56.7.120 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm does it show you how to fix a fusion drive? < 1472226779 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope, it's too old to know about those. < 1472226800 0 :icomefromSPACE73!~ICOMEFROM@172.56.7.120 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeeesch.. well i like the burritos here so that's something < 1472226811 0 :icomefromSPACE73!~ICOMEFROM@172.56.7.120 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and cats.. they're cool < 1472226812 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, you could ask those ITER guys. < 1472226818 0 :icomefromSPACE73!~ICOMEFROM@172.56.7.120 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ITER? < 1472226823 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? burrito < 1472226824 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Burritos are like Monads, according to Joe. See https://byorgey.wordpress.com/2009/01/12/abstraction-intuition-and-the-monad-tutorial-fallacy/ < 1472226838 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :icomefromSPACE73: earth's main fusion project hth < 1472226851 0 :icomefromSPACE73!~ICOMEFROM@172.56.7.120 PRIVMSG #esoteric :gotcha < 1472226859 0 :icomefromSPACE73!~ICOMEFROM@172.56.7.120 PRIVMSG #esoteric :does earth not already have fusion drives? < 1472226908 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope. all our attempts to use fusion keep pushing back to 30 years in the future, somehow. < 1472226933 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :we're pretty good with fission, though. < 1472226942 0 :rodgort!~rodgort@68.ip-149-56-14.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1472227185 0 :icomefromSPACE73!~ICOMEFROM@172.56.7.120 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1472227253 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`le/rn space/Humans come from space. In particular, the part of space that has Earth in it. < 1472227254 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learned «space» < 1472227358 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is earth only the word for this planet in english? < 1472227372 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i considered reverting that to make it start with "space", but it didn't feel right. < 1472227401 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: i should think so. < 1472227438 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :except perhaps english-based creoles < 1472227446 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: some science fiction refers to it as "Terra", but general english calls it "the earth" or "earth" < 1472227502 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in german there is "erde" which can be either the name of this planet or that brown stuff you plant plants in < 1472227516 0 :rodgort!~rodgort@68.ip-149-56-14.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472227532 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :in norwegian "Jorda" (or "jord" for the brown stuff) < 1472227598 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(those are all cognates) < 1472227606 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: yeah, and some science fiction calls the sun "Sol" and the humans "terrans", see http://scifi.stackexchange.com/q/116820/4918 < 1472227679 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh man, I'm connected to eight different irc networks. again. < 1472227689 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :crazy stuff < 1472227699 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :on any but freenode, I only want to access very few channels < 1472227700 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :"In its earliest appearances, eorðe was already being used to translate the many senses of Latin terra and Greek γῆ (gē): the ground,[n 9] its soil,[n 10] dry land,[n 11] the human world,[n 12] the surface of the world (including the sea),[n 13] and the globe itself.[n 14]" < 1472227801 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :The earliest citation for "Terra" as a name for the planet Earth is from an 1871 lecture "Science & Revelation" by Robert Payne Smith: < 1472227878 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, relatively new term < 1472227922 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :in english, that is. < 1472227926 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, Terra fits in better with the Latin names we use for the other planets < 1472227942 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course the romans didn't consider it a planet. < 1472228012 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :true,but still, you have these latinate names for the other planets, and then the odd one out is earth with its th sound < 1472228067 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, the odd one out is Moon < 1472228094 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that too. Luna < 1472228172 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and Sun. < 1472228178 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sol < 1472228192 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in the Solar System < 1472228256 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :norwegian has it easy there, our word for sun is sol. < 1472228351 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :A similar problem occurs in japanese where the other planets end in 星 (star) while earth is 地球 (dirt ball) < 1472228387 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, the difference between "sun" and "sol" stem from PIE grammar - the word had different forms in different cases. < 1472228392 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*stems < 1472228416 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :suppletive forms < 1472228421 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: hey, isn't that just japanese humility :P < 1472228477 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the also had to cram in neptune and uranus after the other planets used the five lements < 1472228510 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :天王星 sky king star 海王星 sea king star < 1472228527 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :all the germanic, latin and greek words for "sun" seem to be cognate. < 1472228554 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also russian, i recently learned) < 1472228595 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: oh right, those other five elements, the ones in the Chinese system. I don't know how that system works. < 1472228696 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :while the moon's name seems to be different in all three < 1472228721 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :mercury is water, venus is metal, mars is fire, jupiter is wood, and saturn is earth < 1472228778 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :saturn is earth? those crazy chinese < 1472228792 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :earth star < 1472228805 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, soil star? < 1472228862 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :土星 < 1472228929 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the sun is pretty crazy too: 太陽 (fat yang) < 1472228936 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :...yeah < 1472228960 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I only know the classical alchemical correspondence: Sunday/Dimanche/Sun/gold, Monday/Lundi/Moon/silver, Tuesday/Mardi/Mars/iron, Wednesday/Mercredi/Mercury/mercury, Thursday/Jeudi/Jupiter/tin, Friday/Vendredi/Venus/copper, Saturday/Saturn/lead. Makes much more sense. < 1472228999 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: thes sort of used those for the days of the week in Japanese < 1472229028 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's also an alchemical correspondence to basically any set of seven things you can think of, plus also any set of five or six or eight or nine or ten or eleven or twelve things just shoehorned on somehow. < 1472229058 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :like thursday is wood-week-day < 1472229061 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the modern day, few do alchemy, so it's astrology that has to listen to these corespondences. < 1472229093 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: which disney dwarf corresponds to which planet? < 1472229098 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I say we should just cut out the roman gods and name the names of weeks from the classical metals in first places. < 1472229113 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then sunday is day-week-day and monday is moon-week-day < 1472229115 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: http://www.xkcd.com/1417/ < 1472229125 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: that's what i was referring to < 1472229170 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote ais.*obscure < 1472229170 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :1243) (on another note, I love the way that the standard way to indicate that you get a reference is to make a different obscure reference to the same thing) < 1472229202 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`botsnack Zippy! < 1472229203 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​>:-D < 1472229314 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's also the seven wonders and the hét honfoglaló vezér, of whom there are different contradictory lists of which seven, so very likely everyone is just fudging the lists to make sure it comes out to seven after the fact when they find out more. < 1472229403 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alexander, Caesar, Genghis Khan, Napoleon, Hitler, Stalin < 1472229425 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and Ramses whatever-his-number-was < 1472229502 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :The hét vezér in particular are either ((Álmos|Árpád), Előd, Ond, Kond, Tas, Huba, (Töhötöm|Tétény)) based on the list by Anonymus, or a completely different sounding list with some overlaps and family relationships with the previous one. < 1472229508 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION cannot say he's ever noticed lists of seven conquerors, anyway.
< 1472229522 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. they have to be hungarian. < 1472229550 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are three primary sources giving three different lists, plus extra sources with no list but talking about some of the individual people. < 1472229594 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm maybe Mehmed 2(?) fits better. < 1472229669 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :far too many conquerors in the world as a whole. < 1472230381 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :seven empires: British, French, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, German, and Russian < 1472230401 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(at least, those are the ones from Age Of Empire 2) < 1472230405 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(at least, those are the ones from Age Of Empire 3) < 1472230438 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :stupid fingers, stop typing the button bedide the one I want < 1472230467 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :age of empires also has the ottomans but they suck < 1472230571 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :theres also the "group of seven" canadian painters < 1472231233 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@193.190.253.145 QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1472231387 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, git cloning the zem.fi hill is broken again < 1472231387 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :fyi < 1472232512 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hurbl. I thought I fixed that. < 1472232586 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I just thought about it. < 1472232682 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did fix that thing that was previously wrong (not running git update-server-info in the post-update hook). < 1472232778 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't even find the URL you're supposed to clone any more. < 1472232863 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently https://zem.fi/bfjoust/hill.git/ and cloning it seemed to work now. < 1472232884 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course I made the mistake of manually running update-server-info, so if it was broken before that, I have no way of knowing. < 1472233307 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: pedially running < 1472233541 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :!zjoust meowmeowmeow < < 1472233541 0 :zemhill__!bfjoust@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia.meowmeowmeow: points -46.00, score 0.00, rank 47/47 < 1472233557 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't work < 1472234043 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mhm. Looks like the same problem of not auto-running that thing, but I have no idea why. < 1472234084 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, duh. < 1472234112 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :!zjoust how_about_now <>< < 1472234112 0 :zemhill__!bfjoust@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie.how_about_now: points -46.00, score 0.00, rank 47/47 < 1472234127 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now it's fixed. < 1472234144 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :In other news, though, "it doesn't work" is a horrible bug report. < 1472234154 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Please clearly state expected and actual behaviour. < 1472234301 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1472234708 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :that program looks a bit fishy < 1472234949 0 :Kaynato!~Aedile@cpe-75-187-129-201.neo.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1472235189 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: You're just carping. < 1472235215 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :!zjoust meow :3 <( meow! ) < 1472235216 0 :zemhill__!bfjoust@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia.meow: points -46.00, score 0.00, rank 47/47 < 1472235234 0 :MoALTz!~no@78-11-183-124.static.ip.netia.com.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1472235271 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :The food chain in action. < 1472235569 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric : In other news, though, "it doesn't work" is a horrible bug report. < 1472235570 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric : Please clearly state expected and actual behaviour. < 1472235573 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Expected behavior: It works < 1472235577 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actual behavior: It doesn't work < 1472235969 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1472236036 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51A4BF3B.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1472236235 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Expected behaviour: it behaves as expected. < 1472236251 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@2a00:f41:386b:eb7d:de85:deff:fe55:967a JOIN :#esoteric < 1472236258 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actual behaviour: it behaves in an unexpected manner. < 1472236404 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :In that case, it's working as intended. < 1472236862 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :do british people who move to France have to refit their cars with a steering wheel on the other side? < 1472236863 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a simple way to forge the reply-to message-ID in Heirloom-Mailx? < 1472236920 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\, I don't think so < 1472237079 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :So that I can reply to messages that I have not received. < 1472237235 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@2a00:f41:386b:eb7d:de85:deff:fe55:967a QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1472237668 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1472237829 0 :adu!~ajr@static-108-48-76-162.washdc.fios.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472237969 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1472238451 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is kg^-1... the measurement of percentage? So U-235 has a value 0.0072 kg^-1 in pure uranium? < 1472238628 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, How computationally expensive is markov scoring? < 1472238643 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it unreasonable to try and compute it on ~9000 programs < 1472239015 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :On the floor inside of the boat they should add a compass with aft/fore/port/starboard so that you can know which way to go inside of the ship. Some of the boats can go in either direction, so in that case, to add lights on the wall inside to tell you which way. < 1472239311 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :My english teacher this year is scow < 1472239314 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prescriptivist scum < 1472239364 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :For English as a foreign language, I think that would be preferable < 1472239382 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: Everybody in this class speaks english as a first language < 1472239389 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm < 1472239523 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What, you prefer the American teacher? < 1472240461 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :English class in Canada is a mixture of prescriptivism to high class dialect, literature studies on Canadian authors, and political propaganda. < 1472240624 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and shakespeare, lots of shakespear < 1472240678 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gotta shake that spear < 1472240919 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1472240948 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1472241201 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :He also said that the singular they isn't a thing (on the grounds that languages change... and nobody uses it any more? Not even the solid 80% of English speakers who use it regularly without even thinking about it?) < 1472241231 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :"adjective" is pronounced without the c sound (bullshit; that isn't even an archaic pronunciation, it just isn't a real thing) < 1472241298 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :And "dream" (the kind that happens while you sleep), "think", "ponder", and "imagine" are all synonyms (even if the connotations may be different, he says they're all exactly the same word) < 1472241360 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :And "seventh" in "seventh graders" is an adjective- when I tried to point out that you'd be looked at like you were crazy if you just said "graders", he said that "graders" (as in "people who grade papers") means that isn't true < 1472241367 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even though that's clearly an entirely different meaning < 1472241384 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :("seventh graders" aren't a type of "grader") < 1472241864 0 :byteflame!~byteflame@70-89-65-45-little-rock-ar.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472241918 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: yep, that's the high school experience all right < 1472241933 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can somebody get me the link to the comic 2 before http://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/you-are-loved < 1472241946 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :The one immediately before includes the word "fetish" so my school blocks it because bullshit < 1472241952 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't worry, http://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/adam39s-rib < 1472242224 0 :augur!~augur@2602:304:cdac:e260:40a4:c0af:1121:2f1a JOIN :#esoteric < 1472242306 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote reasonable < 1472242307 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :112) Some people are reasonable, some people who are not reasonable insist on changing things so therefore progress depends on not reasonablepeple \ 529) One reasonable approach for the image->color case could be to take the mean (possibly in the RGB space, it doesn't have the hue discontinuity problem) of the most likely Gaussian < 1472242331 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote 529 < 1472242331 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :529) One reasonable approach for the image->color case could be to take the mean (possibly in the RGB space, it doesn't have the hue discontinuity problem) of the most likely Gaussian distribution to have yielded the image pixels, considering each pixel as an independent sample. Wait, that'd just be the mean. Never mind. < 1472242339 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 JOIN :#esoteric < 1472242450 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote mean < 1472242451 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :6) what, you mean that wasn't your real name? Gosh, I guess it is. I never realized that. \ 58) Warrigal: what do you mean by 21? \ 69) so a.b.c.d.e.f.g.h.i.j.k.com might be self-relative, but a.b.c.d.e.f.g.h.i.j.k.l.com always means a.b.c.d.e.f.g.h.i.j.k.l.com.? \ 121) i think of languages as tools, < 1472242509 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hpp: I also dislike teachers that try to use the student's yet ignorance and trust to tell their style preferences as if they were rules or accepted best practices. I wasn't too much scarred from them, because I'm always a self-learner who prefers to learn from books over presentations, but still, I dislike it by principle. < 1472242537 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` quote mean | sed -e 's/\(^[^)]*\)).*/\1/' < 1472242538 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :6 \ 58 \ 69 \ 121 \ 154 \ 184 \ 193 \ 234 \ 250 \ 286 \ 326 \ 331 \ 351 \ 353 \ 366 \ 451 \ 477 \ 491 \ 500 \ 529 \ 536 \ 567 \ 626 \ 639 \ 644 \ 666 \ 703 \ 733 \ 760 \ 781 \ 819 \ 840 \ 860 \ 866 \ 904 \ 963 \ 975 \ 1046 \ 1056 \ 1058 \ 1091 \ 1106 \ 1139 \ 1189 \ 1261 \ 1279 < 1472242538 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: Yep < 1472242550 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't mind people forming their own preferred style, or even teaching them as a starting point, but they should always make it clear which parts are generally accepted rules and which are just their preferences. < 1472242557 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, it worked first try! yay < 1472242587 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: Like teachers saying the Oxford comma is always right or always wrong, with no mention that it's rather debated at the moment? < 1472242589 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote 121 < 1472242589 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :121) i think of languages as tools, there is no holy grail of languages even if there's no holy grail, that doesn't mean cups of crap is ok < 1472242598 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote 154 < 1472242599 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :154) How much do mainframes cost these days? I mean, they're obsoleteish, right? My notebook's much more powerful? So surely, they're cheap? < 1472242641 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: I prefer no commas in those cases < 1472242650 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: As in, none at all? < 1472242654 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I ate bread eggs and milk for breakfasr < 1472242663 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1472242681 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: I was originally taught to not use the oxford comma, but when I learned that it's actually not just an absolute rule I decided that it should be used < 1472242857 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :As for punctuation, Hungarian has very different and strict and simple rules for where to use comma (or other punctuation, as in colon or semicolon or dash or parenthesis). One of the important differences is that Hungarian always has punctuation between any two subclause. (That isn't the only rule, there are commas in other places too.) < 1472242884 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not *using* those rules for English, but I'm sometimes sort of influenced by them, and I probably use somewhat strange and unusual rules in English. < 1472242952 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1472242981 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric : The one immediately before includes the word "fetish" so my school blocks it because bullshit < 1472242994 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is when you pull out all the web filter bypass techneques. < 1472243044 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :or just use your phone < 1472243048 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hpp: oh by the way, do they also block all urls matching /ad/ for ad-blocking? < 1472243056 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I think I've seen that filter < 1472243169 0 :APNG!soniex2@unaffiliated/soniex2 JOIN :#esoteric < 1472243185 0 :APNG!soniex2@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :some esolangs are based on PNG < 1472243202 0 :APNG!soniex2@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :why are there no supporters of the EPNG format? https://gist.github.com/SoniEx2/60a025d5901f67b2e549dca4a0ba7d46 < 1472243230 0 :APNG!soniex2@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(technically a PNG extension, not a format) < 1472243271 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why, oh why, did not i take the blue Pill? < 1472243316 0 :APNG!soniex2@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :please support EPNG ^^ < 1472243326 0 :APNG!soniex2@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1472243341 0 :APNG!soniex2@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :do minecraft command blocks count as an esoteric programming language? < 1472243362 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :APNG: yes < 1472243370 0 :APNG!soniex2@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1472243378 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just like OTTD signals < 1472243410 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1472243412 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :APNG: you can program them, but it's kind of hard because they weren't really designed for that. < 1472243432 0 :APNG!soniex2@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh ok < 1472243461 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Admittedly, some of the redstone logic stuff was *probably* added with the intent that geeks program it, but not for the complicated projects some people use them. < 1472243464 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it's debatable. < 1472243471 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably not as esoteric as dwarf fortress I guess. < 1472243511 0 :APNG!soniex2@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I basically once programmed a whole (music) tracker using command blocks https://minecraft.curseforge.com/projects/wireless-note-block-song-player < 1472243537 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe it's sort of like TeX, which Knuth designed to be programmable, but not really to be easy to write general programs in, and many of the hacks he and other people wrote in it abuse the language way more than it was intended. < 1472243555 0 :APNG!soniex2@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :TeX... heh < 1472243571 0 :APNG!soniex2@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't someone make an ATeXMel or something? < 1472243645 0 :APNG!soniex2@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this https://gitlab.brokenpipe.de/stettberger/avremu/tree/master#README < 1472243645 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=49649&oldid=49177 5* 03Tripl3dogdare 5* (+15) 10/* S */ < 1472243646 0 :APNG!soniex2@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1472243692 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe that since 1.8 Minecraft sans command blocks is TC < 1472243716 0 :APNG!soniex2@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb, 1.8 added slime blocks right? < 1472243720 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1472243737 0 :APNG!soniex2@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1472243751 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I reckon you can use slime block flying machines as registers for a Minsky machine < 1472243769 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :With players carried to keep the chunks loaded < 1472243774 0 :APNG!soniex2@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I bet you can simulate protein folding with slimeblocks < 1472243795 0 :APNG!soniex2@unaffiliated/soniex2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't feel like trying tho < 1472243918 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Me either < 1472244549 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-80.dynamic.asdk12.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1472244867 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do wish I understood how to design Minecraft flying machines, though < 1472245097 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm there should be a multiplayer dwarf fortress < 1472245270 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia: Google famously computes it for the Internet (as in, it's more or less like PageRank), so doing 9000 programs shouldn't be impossible. Done the iterative way, it's just a matter of repeatedly multiplying a vector by a 9000x9000 matrix (which I assume should be a quadratic operation), stopping when you're converged enough. < 1472245283 0 :dingbat!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-bceuspsatvyuresd QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1472245299 0 :ocharles!sid30093@musicbrainz/user/ocharles QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1472245335 0 :zgrep!sid43445@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-tegxfaacgefisqgp QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1472245388 0 :augur!~augur@2602:304:cdac:e260:40a4:c0af:1121:2f1a QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1472245918 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do TeX programming too < 1472246059 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo: do you count it as an esolang when you do that? < 1472246073 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :A little bit < 1472246355 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, *shrug* < 1472246363 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :As long as it's not O(n^3) or something < 1472246369 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :O(n^2) matchups between programs is nasty enough < 1472246541 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think some of the esoteric features I find strange in TeX and Metafont might not have been unusual back at that time, they only seem unusual now: < 1472246575 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in, those languages have rules such that they really can't be compiled, only interpreted as token strings at runtime, because how the token things are parsed can change at runtime. That doesn't cause a problem in normal programs where you don't abuse that, but it also always makes it possible to write obfuscations. < 1472246612 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now clearly that's not how people make programming languages now, because people want to be able to analyze and optimize and compile programs. But back then, it was normal, at least APL was like that, probably more. < 1472246660 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perl is also one of those < 1472246669 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: no, not really < 1472246690 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: in perl, more or less every subroutine is compiled to a clean op-tree once. < 1472246727 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in APL or Metafont or TeX, everything is left as a token string, and which part of the token string are functions that act on which other parts is decided dynamically and may change at runtime depending on how variables are assigned < 1472246812 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :But most languages aren't like that, they can be compiled to at least optrees, even the old languages like algol, fortran, smalltalk, basic, and some variants of lisp (but not emacs lisp). < 1472246832 0 :byteflame!~byteflame@70-89-65-45-little-rock-ar.hfc.comcastbusiness.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1472246917 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, in perl, you can compile a function at runtime, but once you compile it, the interpreter knows from the optree which words are functions and which are barewords and what are variables and what the precedence and calls are etc. Compiling each function can happen somewhat late, because you routinely run perl code in BEGIN blocks before other < 1472246917 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :code gets compiled (unlike ruby). < 1472246954 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :But even in perl, you don't usually get functions recompiled again and again. There are only a few mechanisms for that, like eval, or abusing do-file, or s///e, or starting a new perl interpreter, etc. < 1472246957 0 :byteflame!~byteflame@70-89-65-45-little-rock-ar.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472246969 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not like you have to keep everything a token string. < 1472247139 0 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1472247407 0 :Reece`!~Ner@cpc4-wiga13-2-0-cust799.18-3.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472247673 0 :Lord_of_Life!Elite12246@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-kpwrtoucyldiiykb QUIT :Excess Flood < 1472247728 0 :Lord_of_Life!Elite12246@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-qfofclfrrkbsqilj JOIN :#esoteric < 1472247796 0 :ocharles!sid30093@musicbrainz/user/ocharles JOIN :#esoteric < 1472247831 0 :Lord_of_Life!Elite12246@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-qfofclfrrkbsqilj QUIT :Excess Flood < 1472248034 0 :zgrep!sid43445@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-pkudtmmkyymglvla JOIN :#esoteric < 1472248088 0 :Lord_of_Life!Elite12246@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-mftejvahxbogwkld JOIN :#esoteric < 1472248327 0 :dingbat!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rbsekkoktsimhjmc JOIN :#esoteric < 1472248384 0 :adu!~ajr@static-108-48-76-162.washdc.fios.verizon.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1472248587 0 :Reece`!~Ner@cpc4-wiga13-2-0-cust799.18-3.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Quit: Alsithyafturttararfunar < 1472248768 0 :byteflame!~byteflame@70-89-65-45-little-rock-ar.hfc.comcastbusiness.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1472248774 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1472248791 0 :Guest61991!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472248870 0 :Zarutian!~zarutian@168-110-22-46.fiber.hringdu.is JOIN :#esoteric < 1472248972 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can tamper with the category codes in TeX to parse some other kinds of files, is also one thing that can be done. < 1472249051 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yeah, some people do strange things in TeX. Sometimes I don't understand why they try to stick to pure TeX instead of delegating some task to non-TeX programs. < 1472249073 0 :Lord_of_Life!Elite12246@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-mftejvahxbogwkld QUIT :Excess Flood < 1472249084 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to use the best tool for each task, and that often means mixing multiple languages. That's no problem. Good languages are meant to interoprate with other languages in various ways. < 1472249084 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is also stuff that can be done with \uppercase and \lowercase and one thing I have done with this is the ability to output binary specials rather than only ASCII text in specials. < 1472249145 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yeah, those are magical, sometimes people use them (and \roman I think) for things where they don't even need to translate characters, they just use it for the strange side effects on the TeX mouth that you can't get otherwise or something. < 1472249151 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really understand how it works. < 1472249155 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I understand metafont even less.) < 1472249172 0 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1472249196 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :One advantage to write purely in TeX is that you do not need another program; TeX is designed to be the same on all computers, so the program will work everywhere (the possible exception is an out of memory error, but that's all). < 1472249214 0 :Guest61991!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1472249265 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can also use \romannumeral-` to get rid of a } that follows < 1472249266 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: sure, but I can also write other programs that are more or less portable, and also, I can distribute the intermediate results (like an index of a book) that you can then TeX on your own computer. < 1472249341 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can do that yes. Although, I have also made the program entirely in TeX to make the index, too. < 1472249342 0 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1472249359 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I have made many considerations to reduce the amount of memory each index entry takes up.) < 1472249466 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :One thing I often use is things like this: \def\ecall#1{\begingroup\edef\next{\endgroup#1}\next} < 1472249554 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The stuff built-in to Plain TeX that defines \next for a temporary purpose can interfere with other uses of \next; my way does not cause this interference. < 1472249577 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I prefer writing things in C that generate HTML < 1472249595 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: um, can't you just use some other token than \next instead then? < 1472249598 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :That can work if you are trying to make HTML < 1472249623 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: But if they are multiple uses of the same command, that won't work; they will interfere with itself. < 1472249744 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I sort of feel that other software is finally catching up to TeX in the typography and math formula typography aspect, so maybe in another decade we'll no longer need to use TeX for anything, and won't need to deal with the language part that comes with it. < 1472249802 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still prefer TeX over much of the new stuff anyways. < 1472249805 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sort of like how I finally no longer need to depend on libraries written in fortran to do numerical computation stuff, because the newer software has caught up with the huge advantage that the numeric libraries written in fortran had < 1472249823 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and the fortran libraries got sort of obsolate because they weren't written with modern cpu and caching in mind). < 1472249844 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: right now, sure. I'm saying I think it will happen in like a decade. The software haven't quite caught up with TeX yet. < 1472249876 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(As in, all the technology is replicated, but they're not put together to good usable tools for all tasks yet.) < 1472249981 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you do not like TeX another alternative is troff, which has its own output format but it can convert to DVI (as well as other formats, such as man page view). < 1472250025 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't he "modern" answer to TeX .pdf and WYSIWYG editors anyway < 1472250048 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't like PDF and WYSIWYG and I think TeX does it better than those anyways. < 1472250067 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :One feature of TeX I really like is custom output routines; I don't know what others will do such thing. < 1472250079 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia: no, I don't think so. I like pdf, but it's not the wysiwig editors that I'm missing, I'm not that sort of gui guy really. < 1472250097 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :My technical writing classmates can't make something look pretty in a WYSIWYG editor. < 1472250106 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt they can get TeX to output anything at all. < 1472250134 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia: oh sure, some people make crap with any tool, and they don't care what anything look like. that's not really my problem. < 1472250140 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not working for them. < 1472250142 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry. < 1472250230 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :On the other hand, I'd like to have access to all the modern infrastructure with fonts and unicode and alternate glyphs and stuff, and it's sort of incompatible with TeX, as in, neither can you use all features of Metafont fonts in modern stuff, nor can you use all features of new text rendering infrastructure in TeX. < 1472250238 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51A4BF3B.access.telenet.be QUIT :Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in < 1472250250 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd probably just use some sort of gui editor if I needed to typeset something. < 1472250253 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I think eventually (in a decade) you just won't need TeX, because the modern stuff will take all the good features. < 1472250260 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better iteration time for messing with layout and such. < 1472250264 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia: sure, and gui editors do exist, and they will get better. < 1472250276 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless I need to autogenerate something from code, I guess. < 1472250285 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a use case for TeX-type stuff still. < 1472250294 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :You need both gui editors and programmability, and they need to interoperate, but we have a lot of that already (for non-TeX stuff) < 1472250367 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and the gui editors (including the MS office, mind you) take the appearance part of LaTeX syntax, like, you enter formula as \frac{\varphi}{2}, simply because many mathematicians do that. They don't really run any sort of TeX, just steal the names and the outward appearance of the syntax, < 1472250385 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :mathml? < 1472250403 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1472250407 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just like how javascript and lots of other languages steal some bits of C syntax, like the spelling of operators and the control statements. < 1472250464 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia: IMO mathml is not a source format. It is a representation format, which you should sort of compare to DVI or PDF, only the viewer can change a lot of things with it (varying page size and fonts and font size etc) which makes sense because readers now use browsers instead of paper journals. < 1472250497 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :But mathml is a good thing, and I wish more browsers would support it well. < 1472250506 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can look at this file http://zzo38computer.org/barps/main.tex to see some of the stuff that is done, to resolve cross-references and create a table of contents and index without needing to run it twice or use an external program for these things. One thing it does not currently do is to output SQL although I intend to later make it to also output SQL to another file. < 1472250510 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least as far as I've seen it. I don't know too much about it. < 1472250524 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: scary < 1472250532 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: you actually have to run it only once? < 1472250538 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not, like run it a constant number of times? < 1472250556 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, even if I want the table of contents on the front? do I have to rearrange the pages of the dvi later? < 1472250576 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I've sliced and catenated dvi pages once. No problem. Just asking how this works.) < 1472250596 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Or maybe it was PDF pages? I dunno.) < 1472250681 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, you only have to run it once to create the output. < 1472250695 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The table of contents is already on the front. < 1472250702 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow. < 1472250712 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes you will get the table of contents on the front even if you only run it once. < 1472250729 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And you'll get the rest of the document too? < 1472250756 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, as well as an auto-generated auto-sorted index, with all cross-references (both backward and forward) resolved. < 1472250799 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't that even theoretically impossible? < 1472250881 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, a page number in a cross-reference can change form 99 to 100 which is wider and that could affect page breaks and page numbers later so you have to find a fixed point for cross-references (which might not even exist in really pathological cases). < 1472251052 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but it is unlikely. There are ways to deal with that if needed though. < 1472251097 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :!ztest meow (>)*9((+)*15[-]>)*4([>{((+)*15[-]>)*-1}])%3 < 1472251098 0 :zemhill__!bfjoust@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia.meow: points -25.31, score 5.03, rank 47/47 (--) < 1472251101 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, you can always just tweak the document a little manually if there's no fixed point, and in practice you usually hit a fixed point the third iteration. < 1472251107 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :!ztest meow ++(>)*9((+)*15[-]>)*4([>{((+)*15[-]>)*-1}])%3 < 1472251108 0 :zemhill__!bfjoust@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia.meow: points -26.00, score 6.05, rank 47/47 (--) < 1472251123 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :!ztest meow ++(>)*9((+)*15[-]>)*-1 < 1472251124 0 :zemhill__!bfjoust@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia.meow: points -23.24, score 11.99, rank 26/47 (+21) < 1472251135 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :kiseki definitely effs up the ladder. :D < 1472251191 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And if you want a nice-looking document, then there are tons of other things that you may have to tweak manually to improve the looks and that you can't predict until after you render and look. < 1472251214 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1472251313 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :But anyway, yes, doing that in one run of TeX is impressive, even if it's sort of an esoteric goal. < 1472251521 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, some of my CGI is still in sh, I should convert it to C < 1472251558 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472251727 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometimes an external file is used to store cross references, but this won't work if the page is not being shipped out and also may cause problems with interpreting the output as input differently (although sometimes, you would want that), so what I did is to add an insertion class, and put into the insertion, marks and penalties interleaved, and then use \vsplit to extract the marks. < 1472251729 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not entirely certain that doing CGI in C is safer, or even faster, but it does put the C back into it. < 1472251764 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-48-196.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(This can also be used to substitute for multiple classes of marks if you need that feature.) < 1472251994 0 :MoALTz!~no@78-11-183-124.static.ip.netia.com.pl QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1472252512 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-92.dynamic.asdk12.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1472252866 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've now reimplemented the allfiles.htm in C < 1472252930 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.orenwatson.be/listall.c.htm < 1472252980 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: I see < 1472253050 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.orenwatson.be/listall.sh.htm is the original in sh < 1472253075 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@74-114-87-92.dynamic.asdk12.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1472253266 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? cgi < 1472253267 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :cgi? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1472253306 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? minpoijjikop < 1472253306 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :minpoijjikop? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1472253315 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client < 1472253366 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1472253394 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472253432 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`le/rn cgi/CGI stands for uh... C, goblin, interface? < 1472253433 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learned «cgi» < 1472253550 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? wob < 1472253551 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1472253556 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? wob_jonas < 1472253556 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1472253602 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`learn wob_jonas is b_jonas in disguise, so that he can do magic tricks. < 1472253604 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learned 'wob_jona': wob_jonas is b_jonas in disguise, so that he can do magic tricks. < 1472253624 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? b_jonas < 1472253625 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas egy nagyon titokzatos személy. Hollétéről egyelőre nem ismertek. < 1472253679 0 :Zarutian!~zarutian@168-110-22-46.fiber.hringdu.is PRIVMSG #esoteric :Common Gateway Interface if you must know < 1472253726 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah what a meaningless acronym < 1472253802 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :It should be "RPFWR" running programs for web responses < 1472254005 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a shame that CGI is designed such that it's often not practical to e.g. pass the file descriptor for the connection to the CGI program. < 1472254050 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric : web.minpoijjikop: points -46.00, score 0.00, rank 47/47 (-44) < 1472254051 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mind, that's the least of CGI's issues. < 1472254066 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :There was a program named minpoijjikop a long time ago. It turned out to be... I think margins3 with random characters removed. < 1472254071 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess someone decided to kill it. < 1472254094 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well, okay. Issues if you're concerned about maximally simple implementation. It's really not an issue if you don't mind a mild complexity bump and don't mind the inefficiency of CGI, anyways.) < 1472254128 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Contente generaté interactifemente, it's French < 1472254149 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :(disclaimer: I do not know French, at all) < 1472254224 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :How should web programs work? < 1472254392 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :The web is scow. Complex apps on the web should be done via a simple bytecode spec with sandboxed implementation. ("simple" as in "you can easily *prove* your sandbox's security guarantees") < 1472254411 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric : How should web programs work? < 1472254417 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :In a way that doesn't involve C. < 1472254443 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, too late for that. < 1472254487 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least for web development purposes, there's stuff like Scala.js or Coffeescript or whatever. < 1472254496 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you don't have to use Javascript. < 1472254717 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :!zjoust  < < 1472254717 0 :zemhill__!bfjoust@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia: Program name () is restricted to characters in [a-zA-Z0-9_-], sorry. < 1472254804 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :!zjoust < < 1472254804 0 :zemhill__!bfjoust@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia: "!zjoust progname code". See http://zem.fi/bfjoust/ for documentation. < 1472254901 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a little confusing. < 1472254963 0 :PinealGlandOptic!~PinealGla@82.144.205.57 JOIN :#esoteric < 1472254990 0 :centrinia!~centrinia@107-208-218-105.lightspeed.tukrga.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472254994 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1472255017 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does a message.split(' ', 3) to split it into (command, name, code) triplet. < 1472255100 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then verifies that the name doesn't contain anything outside that set and is at most 48 characters long (wonder where that number came from). < 1472255306 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@93-231-58-66.gci.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1472255437 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@93-231-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Word of the day: Monopolyamorous < 1472255458 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@93-231-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You get to sleep with lots of people, but they can only ever sleep with you < 1472255472 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@93-231-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also, you're always the giver, they're always the receiver) < 1472255509 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :eew < 1472255521 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@93-231-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( "The Giver" (the Lois Lowry book) just got a lot sleazier ) < 1472255553 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, you mean that wasn't thinly veiled yaoi? < 1472255621 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@93-231-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia: I would say "yes", but now that you mention it I'm not sure < 1472255676 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@93-231-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(If you were to edit the giver to be much more vague about how memories are passed, it would definitely be thinly veiled yaoi, with an appetizer of Paedophilia and a side of May-December) < 1472255737 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Re the ladder, yeah, I'm not sure what to do about the Kiseki Problem. I like that a proof-of-concept thing like that exists and is somehow acknowledged to, but on the other hand it does quite a job on the scores. I could just manually remove it, but that's not particularly elegant either. And I don't think I'm up for doing any sort of particularly elaborate restructuring, like multiple hills ... < 1472255743 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :... or whatnot. < 1472255845 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm working on it < 1472255856 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it actually works on unknown programs somewhat too. :V < 1472255878 0 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do you think I want the zemhill repo for