←2017-07-20 2017-07-21 2017-07-22→ ↑2017 ↑all
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00:28:45 <Jafet> fizzie: so the completely automated public turing test to tell computers and humans apart is meant to be passed only by computers?
00:29:07 <Jafet> I guess that makes sense
00:30:21 <tswett> `? thanks
00:30:22 <HackEgo> thanks? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
00:31:33 <tswett> `cat bin/learn
00:31:33 <HackEgo> ​#!/bin/bash \ topic=$(echo "$1" | lowercase | sed 's/^\(an\?\|the\) //;s/s\?[:;,.!?]\? .*//') \ [ -e "wisdom/$topic" ] && verb="Relearned" || verb="Learned" \ echo "$1" >"$(echo-p "wisdom/$topic")" \ echo "$verb '$topic': $1"
00:43:16 <tswett> `le/rn thanks//"Thanks" is short for "that helped assorted Norwegians know solitude".
00:43:17 <HackEgo> Learned 'thanks': "Thanks" is short for "that helped assorted Norwegians know solitude".
00:46:32 <quintopia> boily: you never gave me a TIME OF THE CLOCK.
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00:55:17 <shachaf> I saw a learned, learned man
00:56:28 <Jafet> hmm
00:57:09 <shachaf> Jafet: That sounds more like a coturing test.
00:57:23 <Jafet> `learn Thanks is the left absorbing element for the porthanking operation on people named Hanks. Or Anks. It is also the left identity for actor Tom Hanks.
00:57:25 <HackEgo> Learned 'thank': Thanks is the left absorbing element for the porthanking operation on people named Hanks. Or Anks. It is also the left identity for actor Tom Hanks.
00:57:58 <Jafet> `revert
00:57:58 <HackEgo> Done.
00:58:10 <Jafet> `le/rn thanks//Thanks is the left absorbing element for the porthanking operation on people named Hanks. Or Anks. It is also the left identity for actor Tom Hanks.
00:58:12 <HackEgo> Relearned 'thanks': Thanks is the left absorbing element for the porthanking operation on people named Hanks. Or Anks. It is also the left identity for actor Tom Hanks.
00:58:46 <Jafet> a couturing test?
00:58:46 <shachaf> Isn't Tom Hanks a person named Hanks, though?
00:59:10 <shachaf> I guess that's not incompatible with what you said.
01:00:46 <shachaf> `thanks chief
01:00:46 <HackEgo> Thanks, chief. Thief.
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01:01:31 <boily> quintopia: 8pm is a time of the clock.
01:01:52 <shachaf> `thanks hugs
01:01:53 <HackEgo> Thanks, hugs. Thugs.
01:02:04 <shachaf> `thanks bird
01:02:05 <HackEgo> Thanks, bird. Third.
01:03:49 <shachaf> `thanks cat
01:03:49 <HackEgo> Thanks, cat. That.
01:03:56 <\oren\> sell sell sell hahahahahahaha!
01:03:58 <\oren\> https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/07/13/bitcoins_might_just_vanish_into_the_ether/
01:04:12 <boily> he\\oren\. you sound insane. everything's right?
01:04:29 <boily> `thanks boot
01:04:29 <\oren\> boily: bitcoins are DOOOMED
01:04:29 <HackEgo> Thanks, boot. Thoot.
01:05:05 * boily douses \oren\ with Holy Maple Syrup. «calme-toé le pompon!»
01:05:23 <boily> thoot thoot ♪
01:06:35 <shachaf> \oren\: What if I have no bitcoins?
01:06:41 <shachaf> Do I sell short?
01:06:45 <shachaf> Will you lend me some?
01:07:38 <\oren\> shachaf: that would be a good plan, but everyone knows when it will happen so according to that stupid economics theory you can't make any money
01:07:53 <\oren\> I don't have any bitcoins either
01:08:23 <shachaf> If you believe in that stupid economics theory, why are you telling me to sell?
01:09:00 <\oren\> well because if you own any, they are at risk of either vanishing or losing alot of value
01:09:21 <shachaf> But the current price already takes that into account, you're saying.
01:09:49 <\oren\> depends how cautious bitcoiners are
01:10:14 <\oren\> some of them might even swithc to the newer bitcoinage
01:10:21 <shachaf> copumpkin: Remember that one time when you offered to give me 1 BTC (?) to get me interested? That offer is still on, right?
01:10:25 <\oren\> etherium?
01:10:42 <\oren\> ethereum
01:10:48 <Jafet> `coins
01:10:54 <HackEgo> voiccoin vocacoin tagcoin teempadcoin aphagoncoin loadelogenocoin revelacoin doccoin inccoin swirtccoin geom+coin baggreedynaurinatoxoga-intercoin flogcoin coderlcoin uncitcoin velycoin willcoin rumbogucoin volmcoin elicacicoin
01:11:08 <shachaf> I would switch to baggreedynaurinatoxoga-intercoin
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01:11:30 <shachaf> Is INTERCOIN an esocoin?
01:13:48 <boily> fungotcoin.
01:13:48 <fungot> boily: ( ( i know)) you really should turn on your t._v. but i mean for me
01:14:09 <boily> fungot: nah, TVs rot the brain.
01:14:09 <fungot> boily: they're beautiful i don't know
01:14:12 <shachaf> `coins
01:14:14 <HackEgo> enchcoin celiecoin patincocoin rephreasurcoin preticack!coin halfcoin glash-01coin chrocoin ziecoin ndermacoin ranotcoin gammacoin chacoin betacoin lukcoin adderincoin ortanacoin highetacoin suchcoin nandcoin
01:14:32 <boily> gammacoin or betacoin?
01:14:44 <shachaf> I'd betacoin or two on the latter.
01:15:40 * boily happily thwacks shachaf. 0.65 FP.
01:16:41 <Jafet> `? fp
01:16:42 <HackEgo> fp? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
01:16:58 <Jafet> `? funpun
01:16:59 <HackEgo> funpuns fceø fbz fryyrev naq pbfcynlf Arcrgn Yrvwba ba jrrxraqf. Ur ungrf oryy crccref jvgu n cnffvba. Gur havg bs sha chaarel vf anzrq nsgre uvz.
01:17:23 <shachaf> `` r13<wisdom/funpun
01:17:23 <HackEgo> ​/hackenv/bin/`: line 5: r13: command not found
01:17:28 <shachaf> `` rot13<wisdom/funpun
01:17:29 <HackEgo> shachaf sprø som selleri and cosplays Nepeta Leijon on weekends. He hates bell peppers with a passion. The unit of fun punnery is named after him.
01:17:45 <quintopia> boily: alright, i have you scheduled in for sunday at 8pm. please provide at least 24 hours notice if you cannot make your appointment or you will be charged a rescheduling fee of 2 more beerses.
01:18:55 <quintopia> or 17 INTERCOINS
01:19:10 <boily> [x] I fully agree and consent to the aforementioned terms and conditions
01:19:39 <boily> Sous-signé, Alexandre Boily
01:20:05 <quintopia> now i want to see what your insignia looks like
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01:25:43 * boily gesticulates. “it kind of has that stroke like that, then that one, then a loop then a dot.”
01:26:58 <copumpkin> shachaf: hah :)
01:27:00 <copumpkin> not quite
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01:27:42 <shachaf> It's a catch-22
01:27:51 <shachaf> The offer is on unless I'm interested enough to accept it.
01:27:57 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Ly]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52478&oldid=52475 * LyricLy * (+137)
01:30:52 <copumpkin> shachaf: :)
01:30:57 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Fish]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52479&oldid=52420 * Manushand * (+197) /* Examples */
01:31:17 <shachaf> copumpkin: did you ever get around to reading that book
01:31:43 <shachaf> copumpkin: Remind me whether you have a pooch in VA?
01:31:55 <copumpkin> nope, haven't read any books in over a year. My first in ages is Anathem which I'm slowly getting through
01:31:59 <copumpkin> I have two pooches
01:32:31 <copumpkin> I do have a physical copy of the book though which is supposed to be next after Anathem :)
01:33:50 <shachaf> copumpkin: do you have any photographic evidence of said pooches
01:33:56 <shachaf> twh
01:33:58 <copumpkin> I do!
01:34:05 <copumpkin> let me see
01:34:36 <copumpkin> I tweeted a few photos of them
01:34:38 <copumpkin> https://twitter.com/copumpkin/status/871115633701916674
01:35:03 <copumpkin> https://twitter.com/copumpkin/status/869193012949200896 https://twitter.com/copumpkin/status/862120526743048192
01:35:15 <shachaf> Also did you see my twit about http://slbkbs.org/serp-pass.html ?
01:35:39 <shachaf> copumpkin: oh man
01:35:44 <shachaf> good pooches
01:36:06 <shachaf> it is with a heavy heart that i must announce that the pooches are at it again
01:36:35 <copumpkin> shachaf: didn't see it :) but amusing
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01:37:24 <Jafet> `slwd funpun//s/ø/ƀ/
01:37:26 <HackEgo> funpun//funpuns fceƀ fbz fryyrev naq pbfcynlf Arcrgn Yrvwba ba jrrxraqf. Ur ungrf oryy crccref jvgu n cnffvba. Gur havg bs sha chaarel vf anzrq nsgre uvz.
01:37:42 <shachaf> Jafet: Please fix bin/rot13 twh
01:38:04 <Jafet> `cat bin/rot13
01:38:05 <HackEgo> print_args_or_input "$@" | tr a-zA-Z n-za-mN-ZA-M
01:43:09 <quintopia> why might my laptop eject and reload usb devices when it's in power-saving mode (but just once)?
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01:50:35 <boily> quintopia: to make the devices do some power-saving by themselves?
01:52:45 <quintopia> i'm at denny's
01:53:05 <quintopia> there's a rick astley song playing
01:53:12 <quintopia> i can tell.
01:53:16 <quintopia> but i don't know the song.
01:53:28 <shachaf> Is it "Never Gonna Give You Up"?
01:53:31 <shachaf> That song is pretty popular.
01:54:45 <quintopia> if it were that one, i would have recognized it.
01:56:05 <boily> the one with the lamps? can't remember the name. something about the night.
01:57:11 <quintopia> yeah that could be it
01:58:34 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Stasoid * New user account
02:01:14 <quintopia> what is the best wes anderson film
02:03:03 <boily> haven't seen any :/
02:03:45 <quintopia> followup question: why the hell not? :P
02:04:08 <boily> eeeeeh...
02:08:35 <quintopia> now its playing eye of the tiger
02:13:33 <doesthiswork> how fast were you driving on your way there/
02:13:50 <doesthiswork> if it was 88mph then you're in trouble
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03:58:35 <\oren\> DERP http://imgur.com/4NCmKgs
03:58:48 <shachaf> Is that going to be KSP, if I click it?
04:05:39 <doesthiswork> nope no kerbles at all
04:06:31 <oerjan> i'd have preferred kerbles
04:09:32 <\oren\> shachaf: nyup
04:11:12 <\oren\> oerjan: you don't leik "やはり俺の青春ラブコメは間違っている"?
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04:24:14 <shachaf> `? pikhq
04:24:15 <HackEgo> pikhq? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
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04:24:26 <pikhq> I had a power outage, computer was fucking up, have only *now* had time to fix it.
04:24:34 <pikhq> Grumble.
04:26:50 <shachaf> `5 w
04:26:55 <HackEgo> 1/2:wise//Uninstalling software installed by the Wise Installation Wizard is unwise. It's neither clockwise nor counterclockwise nor otherwise. \ resolution//As of 2015, highest resolution commercial computer monitors are 5120x2880 Apple and 3840x2160 other. \ wlcom//Hi! This is a chat about unusual programming tools. For additional info, visit our
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04:27:11 <shachaf> `n
04:27:12 <HackEgo> 2/2: wiki: <http://bit.ly/C4TUY>. (For unusual things of a contrasting sort, try http://bit.ly/19k9nf8.)effilry//Effilry is eemnoos how ahs got it all deorst otu. \ sense//Sense is the ability to understand things. A person with much sense is called a sensei.
04:27:55 <shachaf> `cwlprits wlcom
04:28:01 <HackEgo> km̈c
04:28:04 <shachaf> oerjan: should wisdom/wlcom have a newline at the end or is that part of the joke twh
04:28:12 <oerjan> i was just wondering myself
04:28:26 <oerjan> `dowg wlcom
04:28:32 <HackEgo> 4002:2013-11-13 <km̈c> printf \'Hi! This is a chat about unusual programming tools. For additional info, visit our wiki: <http://bit.ly/C4TUY>. (For unusual things of a contrasting sort, try http://bit.ly/19k9nf8.)\' > wisdom/wlcom
04:28:56 <oerjan> `` cat >>wisdom/wlcom
04:29:02 <oerjan> oops
04:29:15 <quintopia> doesthiswork: i walked there
04:29:25 <oerjan> `` echo >>wisdom/wlcom
04:29:27 <doesthiswork> ok you're safe
04:29:57 <oerjan> hm i guess the first would lock the file
04:29:57 <HackEgo> No output.
04:29:58 <HackEgo> No output.
04:30:19 <oerjan> `4 \? wlcom
04:30:21 <HackEgo> 1/3:Hi! This is a chat about unusual programming tools. For additional info, visit our wiki: <http://bit.ly/C4TUY>. (For unusual things of a contrasting sort, try http://bit.ly/19k9nf8.) \ Hi! This is a chat about unusual programming tools. For additional info, visit our wiki: <http://bit.ly/C4TUY>. (For unusual things of a contrasting sort, try ht
04:30:31 <oerjan> seems it worked.
04:30:36 <shachaf> `doag
04:30:37 <HackEgo> 11106:2017-07-21 <oerjän> ` echo >>wisdom/wlcom \ 11105:2017-07-21 <Jafët> slwd funpun//s/\xc3\xb8/\xc6\x80/ \ 11104:2017-07-20 <Jafët> le/rn thanks//Thanks is the left absorbing element for the porthanking operation on people named Hanks. Or Anks. It is also the left identity for actor Tom Hanks. \ 11103:2017-07-20 <Jafët> revert \ 11102:2
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04:41:28 <oerjan> <shachaf> oerjan: do you understand goodwillie functor calculus twh <-- my understanding is perfect, as for all things i have never heard of
04:42:03 <oerjan> (zero is a perfect number, right?)
04:43:50 <shachaf> Hmm, "It is not known whether there are any odd perfect numbers, nor whether infinitely many perfect numbers exist."
04:43:53 <shachaf> I probably knew that.
04:50:15 <Jafet> @let perfect n = 2*n == sum [i | i <- [1..n], mod n i == 0]
04:50:17 <lambdabot> Defined.
04:50:20 <Jafet> > perfect 0
04:50:22 <lambdabot> True
04:50:29 <Jafet> makes sense
05:31:57 <\oren\> Bah, as expected, the official translation is even more stilted
05:32:02 <\oren\> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_Youth_Romantic_Comedy_Is_Wrong,_As_I_Expected
05:32:41 <\oren\> I would have put it "Of course my young love comedy is messed up."
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06:24:33 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[User:Qwertyu63]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52480&oldid=52346 * Qwertyu63 * (+4786) WIP Esolang
06:25:30 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[User:Qwertyu63]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52481&oldid=52480 * Qwertyu63 * (+18)
06:28:02 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[User:Qwertyu63]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52482&oldid=52481 * Qwertyu63 * (+399)
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06:30:09 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[User:Qwertyu63]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52483&oldid=52482 * Qwertyu63 * (+86)
06:32:08 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[User:Qwertyu63]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52484&oldid=52483 * Qwertyu63 * (+76)
06:33:05 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[User:Qwertyu63]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52485&oldid=52484 * Qwertyu63 * (+12)
06:43:07 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[User:Qwertyu63]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52486&oldid=52485 * Qwertyu63 * (+202)
06:43:41 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[User:Qwertyu63]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52487&oldid=52486 * Qwertyu63 * (+17)
06:45:37 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[User:Qwertyu63]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52488&oldid=52487 * Qwertyu63 * (+41)
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07:43:15 <rdococ> bored.
07:43:21 <rdococ> I'M SORRY
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10:17:11 <shachaf> Taneb: whoa whoa whoa
10:17:21 <shachaf> Catspotting?!
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11:44:49 <boily> `5
11:44:51 <HackEgo> 1/2:1244) <Jafet> I guess the problem is, the cache size bounds the evilness of the memory bus \ 1008) <fizzie> ... <fizzie> I was thinking maybe octave's fact() function is the factorial. <fizzie> octave:1> fact(20) <fizzie> Richad Stallman's pinky finger is really a USB memory stick. <fizzie> I don't think that's 20!. \ 1049) <Sgeo> People ar
11:45:03 <boily> `5 w
11:45:07 <HackEgo> 1/2:alpha//Alpha is the numeric measurement of opaqueness, a dog with unusually high voice in the Disney-Pixar Up film, and a NATO phonetic alphabet letteral. \ tvtrope//We'll write about TVTropes here, we just have to finish these tabs first. \ transformer//A transformer is one who used to trans, but no longer does. \ procrastination//The Procrast
11:45:10 <boily> `n
11:45:10 <HackEgo> 2/2:ination is destined to rule the world... right after watching this last funny cat clip on youtube. \ `!//`! is a command that runs interpreters. Supposedly. Nobody actually uses it, or knows how it works. It has some historical significance, where it originally replaced some previous bot of #esoteric that was not as customizable as HackEgo.
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12:00:44 <Jafet> do we have an architecture where mov actually moves data
12:00:48 <Jafet> instead of copying it
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12:37:01 <int-e> anything quantum?
12:38:20 <int-e> (reversible computing is trickier than that; you can copy a value to a place with a known value with a controlled not gate)
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13:35:17 <Jafet> `fetch http://sprunge.us/MXOA
13:35:21 <HackEgo> 2017-07-21 12:34:54 URL:http://sprunge.us/MXOA [727/727] -> "MXOA" [1]
13:36:06 <Jafet> `` \? shachaf | python MXOA
13:36:07 <HackEgo> Dhrra Funpuns bs gur Qnja fceƀ fbz fryyrev naq pbfcynlf Arcrgn Yrvwba ba jrrxraqf. Ur ungrf oryy crccref jvgu n cnffvba. Ur qbrfa'g xabj jura gb fgbc nfxvat dhrfgvbaf.
13:36:35 <Jafet> `` mv MXOA bin/rot13 && chmod +x bin/rot13
13:36:37 <HackEgo> No output.
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13:38:53 <Jafet> `` mv bin/rot13{,_stdin} && echo 'print_args_or_input "$@" | rot13_stdin' >bin/rot13 && chmod +x bin/rot13
13:38:55 <HackEgo> No output.
13:39:45 <Jafet> `rot13 aAäāȦ
13:39:46 <HackEgo> ​/usr/bin/env: python
13:40:48 <Jafet> `/usr/bin/env python
13:41:19 <HackEgo> Python 2.7.9 (default, Jun 29 2016, 13:08:31) \ [GCC 4.9.2] on linux2 \ Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information. \ >>>
13:47:35 <Jafet> `hd bin/rot13_stdin
13:47:36 <HackEgo> 000000 23 21 2f 75 73 72 2f 62 69 6e 2f 65 6e 76 20 70 >#!/usr/bin/env p< \ 000010 79 74 68 6f 6e 0d 0a 0d 0a 69 6d 70 6f 72 74 20 >ython....import < \ 000020 72 65 2c 20 73 79 73 2c 20 75 6e 69 63 6f 64 65 >re, sys, unicode< \ 000030 64 61 74 61 20 61 73 20 55 0d 0a 64 65 66 20 74 >data as U..def t< \ 000040 72 28 63 29 3a 0d 0a 20 20 20 20 6d
13:49:20 <Jafet> `` sed -i 's/\r//' bin/rot13_stdin
13:49:22 <HackEgo> bin/rot13_stdin//#!/usr/bin/env python \ \ import re, sys, unicodedata as U \ def tr(c): \ m = re.match(r'(.*\bLATIN\b.*\bLETTER )([A-Z])\b(.*)', U.name(c, '')) \ if m: \ p, q, r = m.groups() \ n = ord(q) - ord('A') \ try: \ return U.lookup(p + chr(ord('A') + (n + 13) % 26) + r) \ except KeyError
13:50:01 <Jafet> `rot13 aAäāȦ
13:50:01 <HackEgo> nNn̈n̄Ṅ
13:51:01 <Jafet> shachaf: hth
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13:57:30 <Vorpal> Jafet: I don't believe rot13 is well defined without reference to an alphabet (as opposed to a character set)
13:59:21 <Vorpal> Jafet: consider you example, I would dispute it in the context of Swedish: abc...xyzåäö is the Swedish alphabet. This means that rotating half the alphabet would be impossible (since there are an odd number of characters) but even so, in that definition rot13(ä) is not n with two dots
14:02:46 <Jafet> this one is defined with reference to the english alphabet, clearly
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14:06:44 <Vorpal> `rot13 ä
14:06:45 <HackEgo>
14:06:48 <Vorpal> hm
14:06:52 <Vorpal> `rot13 4
14:06:52 <HackEgo> 4
14:07:13 <Vorpal> Jafet: but there is no letter ä in the English alphabet
14:07:54 <Vorpal> I assume it decomposes the letter to "dots-combiner" (or whatever it is called" and an a
14:08:25 <Vorpal> though I thought the ä from my keyboard ended up being a separate codepoint
14:09:12 <Jafet> the code actually purports to change the LATIN codepoints, but the romans didn't even have j or w!
14:09:23 <Jafet> the unicode consortium, whitewashing history.
14:09:37 <Vorpal> hah
14:09:58 <Vorpal> Jafet: Swedish didn't have w in the alphabet until maybe 20 years ago or so
14:10:50 <Vorpal> And you never see w or q in anything except loan-words and some proper names.
14:13:15 <Vorpal> I should write a rotN-program in which you can register alphabets hm
14:15:32 <Jafet> also, wiktionary lists doppelgänger as an english word
14:17:48 <Vorpal> hm, interesting
14:18:03 <Vorpal> `rot13 åäö
14:18:04 <HackEgo> n̊n̈b̈
14:18:16 <Vorpal> how does ö become b?
14:18:33 <Vorpal> should be b with dots at least?
14:18:40 <Jafet> `unicode öb̈
14:18:43 <HackEgo> U+00F6 LATIN SMALL LETTER O WITH DIAERESIS \ UTF-8: c3 b6 UTF-16BE: 00f6 Decimal: &#246; \ ö (Ö) \ Uppercase: U+00D6 \ Category: Ll (Letter, Lowercase) \ Bidi: L (Left-to-Right) \ Decomposition: 006F 0308 \ \ U+0062 LATIN SMALL LETTER B \ UTF-8: 62 UTF-16BE: 0062 Decimal: &#98; \ b (B) \ Uppercase: U+0042 \ Category: Ll (Letter, Lowercase) \
14:18:51 <Jafet> `unidecode öb̈
14:18:52 <Vorpal> `unicode ö
14:18:53 <HackEgo> U+00F6 LATIN SMALL LETTER O WITH DIAERESIS \ UTF-8: c3 b6 UTF-16BE: 00f6 Decimal: &#246; \ ö (Ö) \ Uppercase: U+00D6 \ Category: Ll (Letter, Lowercase) \ Bidi: L (Left-to-Right) \ Decomposition: 006F 0308
14:19:28 <Vorpal> ah
14:19:35 <Vorpal> interesting
14:19:52 <Vorpal> Jafet: I guess my font just doesn't display b with dots properly
14:20:17 <Vorpal> (Dejavu Sans Mono I believe)
14:23:10 <Jafet> dejavu fonts cover all latin scripts, but your font renderer might not
14:23:36 <Jafet> b̈ renders correctly here
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14:26:02 <Vorpal> Jafet: well, it is whatever hexchat uses, so whatever GTK uses probably. Which means pango I think
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14:36:43 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Juergen * New user account
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14:41:31 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52489&oldid=52476 * Juergen * (+146) /* Introductions */
14:41:37 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Malbolge]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52490&oldid=51690 * Juergen * (+12) abbreviations explained
14:54:35 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Malbolge programming]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52491&oldid=51694 * Juergen * (+3) Typo
15:02:33 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52492&oldid=52489 * Juergen * (-1) Typo
15:29:01 <tswett> `unicode U+00F6
15:29:01 <HackEgo> ​ö
15:29:25 <tswett> Aren't `unicode and `unidecode sort of backwards...
15:30:39 <tswett> U+00F6 is a code for ö, so turning U+00F6 into ö is decoding.
15:31:02 <tswett> I mean, to be fair, it's really translating from one encoding to another.
15:32:16 <tswett> From codepoints-written-out-in-ASCII to UTF-8.
15:32:33 <tswett> I'd say that CWOIA is "more coded", though, don't you think?
15:32:55 <tswett> Anyway, I'm outta here. Adiös.
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20:26:54 <zzo38> I have found out why the Greek alphabets in MIX are different; it is because the Theta/Phi/Pi is from before they used computerized typesetting for the books.
20:27:56 <shachaf> Phi/Pi/Pho/Pum
20:28:16 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[MIX (Knuth)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52493&oldid=52435 * Zzo38 * (+192) Old and new versions of character codes
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20:31:10 <zzo38> I have also partially written a implementation of MIX in BASIC, which is called MIXPC. (It isn't completed yet.)
20:31:52 <wob_jonas> zzo38: so you were looking at the first edition of vol 2
20:32:06 <wob_jonas> of vol 3 or what
20:32:09 <wob_jonas> wait
20:32:22 <wob_jonas> does vol 3 even have an edition from before TeX? I thought only vol 1 and vol 2 had such editions
20:33:01 <wob_jonas> anyway, I don't see why rewriting his book in TeX would cause Knuth to change the MIX printer character set
20:33:24 <zzo38> Apparently vol 3 does. Now I returned it (the book was due) and now I have the first edition of vol 1 and the second edition of vol 2. And I don't know why that would cause Knuth to change the character set either, but somehow, it does.
20:34:12 <wob_jonas> zzo38: wait, in BASIC? does it use 32-bit integers, which only newer dialects of BASIC use? or does it simulate big integers by using double-precison floating point, which old BASICs often have, though not the IEEE kind of double precision?
20:34:23 <wob_jonas> or do you just compute everything with 16-bit integers?
20:34:58 <zzo38> wob_jonas: Everything is computed with 16-bit integers, doing carrying one byte to the next when doing addition of MIX words.
20:35:39 <wob_jonas> anyway, in that case the Delta/Sigma/Pi is the canonical version, and the Theta/Phi/Pi is obsolete
20:35:45 <wob_jonas> thanks for clearing that up
20:36:00 <wob_jonas> zzo38: can I see that implementation of MIX?
20:36:03 <zzo38> (It does use 32-bit integers for record numbers for the disk and tapes actually)
20:36:34 <zzo38> wob_jonas: It isn't complete yet, but anyways here it is: http://sprunge.us/JIfd
20:37:18 <zzo38> Some non-ASCII characters seem to have gotten lost in this transfer to sprunge, unfortunately.
20:37:26 <wob_jonas> oh, that must be in some modern basic. it has block-if.
20:38:05 <shachaf> 'tis your one byte, sir, catching fire / from one word to the next!
20:38:31 <zzo38> (Also there is no implementation of paper tape and I do not intend to add an implementation of paper tape; this may change in future though if it is found to be important.)
20:39:52 <zzo38> The like that says KEY 1, "": KEY 2, "": KEY 3, "" is supposed to have Greek alphabets between the quotation marks, and the string a$ in SUB InitConversion is supposed to have Greek alphabets inserted in the proper places.
20:40:21 <wob_jonas> zzo38: as far as I understand, paper tape is irrelevant, it's just another user-facing head of the teletype besides the keyboard and printer. from the perspective of the MIX machine, you just get character input and output,
20:40:40 <wob_jonas> you probably can't even distinguish whether input comes from the tape or keyboard (or mixed at character granularity), or whether output goes only to the printer or both to the printer and paper tape
20:41:16 <zzo38> You can however rewind the paper tape in MIX; MIXPC doesn't implement paper tape, so you can't rewind it.
20:41:30 <wob_jonas> ah
20:42:18 <wob_jonas> maybe it's that rigid harmonica kind of paper tape than that's made of thick paper like punch cards, not the cheap flexible type
20:43:16 <wob_jonas> you're passing entire structures to functions... what sort of magical modern BASIC is that even
20:44:25 <zzo38> The structures are passed by reference. Everything passed to functions is by reference unless it says BYVAL (which is only allowed for numeric types).
20:46:41 <wob_jonas> ok
20:46:47 <wob_jonas> I'm just not used to that sort of basic programming
20:51:21 <zzo38> You can tell me if you have other comment, question, complaint, about this program please.
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20:51:42 <zzo38> (It is also possible there are some mistakes in it, because it is not thoroughly tested.)
20:52:07 <shachaf> zzo38: OK, I'll tell you if I have other comment. What's your fax number please?
20:52:10 <wob_jonas> I'm looking at it
20:52:18 <wob_jonas> so the CMPA instruction isn't implemented?
20:52:55 <zzo38> Not yet anyways; it will be, once the program is completed.
20:53:06 <zzo38> So far a lot isn't implemented.
20:54:53 <wob_jonas> in the AddSubtract function, the FOR i = 2 TO 6 loop seems a bit suspicious. why is there a whole loop there, as opposed to just one comparison with i=2 ?
20:55:29 <zzo38> You are right.
20:55:34 <zzo38> I made a mistake.
20:57:51 <wob_jonas> what's COMMAND$ and where is it initialized?
20:58:23 <zzo38> COMMAND$ is the command-line arguments given to the program, converted to uppercase.
20:59:23 <zzo38> (This program uses the command-line argument to specify how many values are valid in a MIX byte, from 64 to 100, with a default of 100, and if a slash is afterward, starts with the device config menu.)
21:00:51 <shachaf> From 64 base 10 to 100 base 8.
21:03:25 <wob_jonas> zzo38: where do you initialize the registers and memory to valid values (eg. six-byte strings with valid bytes), or else why do you not need to initialize them?
21:03:43 <zzo38> Everything is automatically initialized to zero.
21:06:36 <wob_jonas> zzo38: I don't understand where in the program you do the indexing, that is, compute M from the A and I fields of an instruction
21:07:07 <zzo38> I made a mistake there too thank you for notifying me.
21:07:27 <zzo38> The index register number is supposed to be loaded into "idx" but now I see that I forgot that part.
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21:13:12 <wob_jonas> hi ais523
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21:15:44 <wob_jonas> zzo38: also, MUL, DIV and the shifts aren't implemented yet either, right?
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21:16:31 <zzo38> Yes they aren't implemented yet, but I will implement them. (Currently this program isn't so useful as it currently is, as it doesn't do much)
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21:17:16 <zzo38> Also the article on esolang wiki says printer is device 20, but the book I have says 18 is the printer.
21:18:08 <wob_jonas> let me check that
21:19:09 <wob_jonas> you're right, the printer is device 18
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21:21:59 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[MIX (Knuth)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52494&oldid=52493 * B jonas * (+0) /* IO */
21:26:25 <zzo38> Another thing in my program is there is a command that allows the operator to rewind the tape (in the device config menu); perhaps that command should also allow the operator to rewind the card reader if "R" is entered at the "Rewind which tape?" prompt.
21:28:11 <zzo38> It might be useful if you want to load the same card deck again without having to retype the filename of the card deck.
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21:47:28 <wob_jonas> zzo38: in ReadField, you should probably add some check to give an error if the field specification is invalid, unless you're sure those always result in an error
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21:59:17 <zzo38> wob_jonas: Yes I could add that, thank you for suggestion
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22:09:18 <shachaf> `5 w
22:09:23 <HackEgo> 1/2:anagram//Interestingly, "Robert Galbraith" is *not* an anagram of "J. K. Rowling". \ intercal//INTERCAL has excellent features for modular program for the enterprise market. \ ioccclist//ioccclist is update notification for when a new year of the International Obfuscated C Code Contest is announced, or the winners for a year is announced, or th
22:09:25 <shachaf> `n
22:09:26 <HackEgo> 2/2:e source codes of winners are released. http://www.ioccc.org/#news \ marriage//Marriage was made legal in the United States on 2015-06-26. \ source//Sources for HackEgo can be found at https://bitbucket.org/GregorR/hackbot + https://bitbucket.org/GregorR/multibot + https://bitbucket.org/GregorR/umlbox
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22:14:02 <wob_jonas> Oh right, the IOCCC site still says "The IOCCC is on hiatus until mid 2017" as latest new, what's the deal with that?
22:14:44 <ais523> wob_jonas: I think it became such a big deal to judge that the judges don't want to run IOCCCs too often
22:15:13 <shachaf> Any other good contests going on?
22:15:20 <shachaf> Wasn't there an underhanded contest that ended recently?
22:15:57 <shachaf> https://underhandedcrypto.com/
22:16:04 <shachaf> This month apparently.
22:17:25 <wob_jonas> ICFP contest will start in two weeks
22:18:45 <wob_jonas> starts on 2017-08-04
22:19:01 <wob_jonas> http://icfpcontest.org/
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22:36:40 <quintopia> what is that competition usually like
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22:38:58 <wob_jonas> quintopia: interesting. look at some of the prev years at http://icfpcontest.github.io/ . (some years have fallen off the internet(
22:39:58 <ais523> quintopia: it varies in quality but is often very good
22:40:03 <ais523> it also generates an average of more than one esolang per year
22:40:33 <wob_jonas> hehe.. I'm not sure, I think it's slightly below 1 per year
22:41:07 <ais523> typically because there's a strong tradition to make the contest language-agnostic, so it's common to create an asm-alike and ask people to compile into it
22:41:25 <ais523> although some years they just use, say, x86 asm and give people a VM image to test their programs on
22:41:29 <wob_jonas> no way
22:41:52 <ais523> and some years they use network sockets and have people run their programs locally
22:41:59 <shachaf> ais523: Are you participating this year?
22:42:06 <ais523> shachaf: I only participated once
22:42:15 <ais523> it's possible I'll participate if a) I remember, and b) I find the task interesting
22:42:38 <ais523> interestingly, one of the prizes is to have the organizers of the event publicly pay a complement to the programming language you used
22:42:56 <wob_jonas> they never asked people to compile to a general asm-like.
22:43:19 <ais523> wob_jonas: general, no
22:43:24 <ais523> special purpose asm-likes happen all the time though
22:43:28 <ais523> e.g. with the ant contest
22:43:31 <wob_jonas> at least one contest had large programs written by the organizers distributed in some general-purpose low-level language, which the teams had to run;
22:43:43 <ais523> yes
22:43:48 <ais523> the whole UMIX contest was the best thing ever
22:43:50 <wob_jonas> and yes, in at least two contest teams had to write programs in some very restricted esolang
22:43:58 <ais523> and the great thing about it is that it's also entirely self-contained
22:44:15 <ais523> you can take part in the contest for fun even long after it finished and the judging servers were taken down
22:44:22 <wob_jonas> but in that case the point isn't really to be language-agnostic, but more like to restrict what you can submit, similarly to bfjoust
22:44:38 <ais523> because you eventually discover that there's a judging server deeply encoded in the specification itself
22:44:46 <ais523> wob_jonas: it's both, I'd say
22:46:02 <wob_jonas> ais523: yes, the 2006 contest with the sand machine did that; but also the 2007 contest distributed a large program in Endo DNA/RNA, which is a rather esoteric general purpose language
22:47:30 <ais523> shachaf: if you're interested in what ICFP contests are like, I strongly recommend trying this one out for yourself: http://boundvariable.org/task.shtml
22:48:00 <ais523> it was the best contest ever IMO (I missed it live but have had a lot of fun experimenting with it later), and it doesn't require anything other than the downloads at the bottom of that page to participate in
22:52:21 <ais523> oh and the encryption key on the page itself; its purpose was to ensure that people didn't start "early" (it was kept secret until the official start of the contest, but you could download the files in advance in case you had a slow connection)
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22:56:56 <ais523> huh, does Rust's Result type seriously not have an >>= equivalent? or am I missing it?
22:57:08 <ais523> it's clearly a monad and has a ton of utility methods, but not the main one for chaining them
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22:58:53 <ais523> oh, it might be `and_then`
22:58:57 <ais523> this documentation is surprisingly unclear
22:59:13 <wob_jonas> ais523: yes, I think it's the and_then function
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23:00:21 <ais523> ah right, "T" in the documentation of and_then refers to the first generic type parameter of the Result, which is consistently used on the page
23:00:26 <ais523> but it's easy to miss because it isn't documented anywhere nearby
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23:01:19 <ais523> I don't think Rust's metaprogramming power is currently enough to grasp the concept of "being a monad" because it doesn't have higher-kinded types
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23:02:40 <wob_jonas> ais523: correct
23:02:59 <ais523> luckily, once it does, you could add impls to make all these standard types into "official" monads retroactively
23:03:21 <ais523> that's one thing that Rust does way better than, say, Java
23:04:05 <wob_jonas> you probably know this, but there's some active and friendly rust channels over on the mozilla irc server
23:05:00 <ais523> at the moment I'm just dabbling
23:05:19 <ais523> I like systems languages and I like safe languages, so Rust naturally caught my attentino
23:05:38 <wob_jonas> yep
23:06:05 <wob_jonas> my opinion is that rust will be a pretty good language in some years, when they improve it, especially the libraries, a bit more
23:06:24 <wob_jonas> the community developing rust (the compiler and standard libraries) is doing it very well
23:06:49 <wob_jonas> so it's worth to look at rust
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23:50:34 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[Emmental]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52495&oldid=50030 * CatIsFluffy * (-6)
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