←2017-08-24 2017-08-25 2017-08-26→ ↑2017 ↑all
00:00:15 <rdococ> Maybe I should just leave. I always seem to be worthless where-ever I go, and every time I try to change that, it fails. Why am I still alive, again?
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00:01:05 <shachaf> Huh.
00:02:08 <shachaf> I don't think rdococ is worthless, but I don't enjoy interacting with them.
00:03:59 <shachaf> What should I do?
00:20:07 <wob_jonas> `? sausage
00:20:08 <HackEgo> sausage? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
00:23:26 <wob_jonas> `learn Sausage is the ground remains of a pig after the valuable parts (meat, liver) and the part that will form sausage skin are removed.
00:23:29 <HackEgo> Learned 'sausage': Sausage is the ground remains of a pig after the valuable parts (meat, liver) and the part that will form sausage skin are removed.
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01:30:11 <oerjan> <shachaf> oerjan: Did you play the Magnet game? <-- i'm on Pearl now (slowly cycling alphabetically)
01:34:04 <wob_jonas> what game is that?
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02:00:09 <boily> `5 w
02:00:13 <boily> @massages-loud
02:00:13 <lambdabot> shachaf asked 22h 21m 5s ago: to /quit CHICKEN OF THE WOODS
02:00:15 <HackEgo> 1/2:vwwwl//Vwwwls wrw w swgn wf wnswffwcwwnt wwsdwm. \ precession//Precession is the opposite of succession. It is the joy of children and the curse of first year physics students. \ blsqbot//blsqbot is the owner of the bot 'mroman'. \ wegian//A wegian is an equivalence class of #esoteric regulars. There are two main wegians, the Nor (from Finland)
02:00:28 <boily> `n
02:00:29 <HackEgo> 2/2: and the Glas (from Hexham). There's also the hypothetical Gal, which hasn't been observed yet so we're not sure where it's from. \ or//Or is an Intercal unary operator.
02:05:05 <imode> in all my days I have never had the chance to mess with ruby. looks like I get to now.
02:05:32 <wob_jonas> imode: uh why?
02:05:40 <imode> wob_jonas: work.
02:06:23 <boily> imellode! what's your opinion on ruby so far?
02:06:40 <imode> have never touched it before. looks nice. going to be pairing it with Sinatra.
02:06:45 <boily> helløœirjan, wobonsoir_jonas.
02:07:00 <boily> Sinatra is that ultra-lightweight Web framework?
02:07:06 <imode> yup!
02:08:20 <boily> nice!
02:08:51 <oerjan> wob_jonas: from tatham's puzzle collection
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02:09:04 <imode> we were previously working with Python and Flask, but we figured we'd have a go at a similar framework in a similar language to compare the two.
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02:10:32 <oerjan> heboilloy
02:11:15 <boily> imode: then you should try Java and Spark!
02:11:34 <imode> why in the hell did that take 100% of my CPU.
02:11:46 <imode> that was just... documentation. o_o
02:11:48 <oerjan> or well, the magnets i play. no idea if that's what shachaf was referring to.
02:12:05 <boily> imode: everything is normal and sane.
02:12:08 <oerjan> docpumentation.
02:12:17 <oerjan> easy to confuse.
02:12:31 * boily *THWACKS* oerjan. 0.59 FP.
02:12:34 <imode> boily: java and sane.. two words I haven't seen together in a long time. :P
02:12:52 <oerjan> i expecte that.
02:12:54 <oerjan> *+d
02:13:13 <boily> you can write sane Java any time. it even comes with lambdas*!
02:13:22 <imode> so does python and ruby. :P
02:13:47 <imode> don't worry. I teach so I'll be doing plenty of java on the 18th.
02:17:22 <wob_jonas> hahahah that's even worse
02:17:36 <wob_jonas> what will you be teaching with java?
02:18:20 <imode> a transfer course to a state university.
02:18:23 <boily> design patterns, SOLID principles, unit tests...
02:18:31 <imode> introductory java.
02:18:46 <wob_jonas> oh. that's EVEN worse.
02:18:51 <wob_jonas> ok
02:19:00 <imode> nah. they walk away with some intuition.
02:19:23 <wob_jonas> you mean you sneakily teach good stuff, not only the curriculum?
02:19:24 <wob_jonas> good
02:19:40 <imode> yeah. that's kind of my thing. :P
02:19:57 <shachaf> oerjan: when are you going to play The Witness hth
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02:22:35 <oerjan> probably never.
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02:27:43 <shachaf> just think of it as a tatham puzzle game hth
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02:39:49 <HackEgo> [wiki] [[User:JWinslow23]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52935&oldid=37537 * JWinslow23 * (-283) Replaced content with "Heya."
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03:08:09 <oerjan> @tell rdococ <rdococ> Even then, with unbounded cells... <-- see https://esolangs.org/wiki/Collatz_function#Reduction_to_3-cell_brainfuck
03:08:09 <lambdabot> Consider it noted.
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03:11:37 <oerjan> @tell rdococ That balances the loops, for the top I guess you need an extra << at the end.
03:11:37 <lambdabot> Consider it noted.
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03:29:07 <myname> it may take a while for him to read that
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05:24:06 <imode> wow. I uh. I see why people like ruby. o_o
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06:42:05 <myname> ruby is like 150% syntax sugar
06:46:32 <imode> then I'll happily rot my fingers off with it.
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08:39:01 <kurolox> Good morning
08:39:13 <kurolox> fizzie, are you here?
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08:54:03 <kurolox> Sorry, I had to change the computer
08:54:15 <kurolox> Are you here, fizzie?
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13:33:49 <wob_jonas> ok, so this might not be the right channel, but have you ever noticed how fucking rare it is for anyone to copyright license anything in such a way that it's free to distribute only in the future, not right now?
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13:34:25 <wob_jonas> many people complain about how copyright terms are too long and how people almost always get the most income from copyright on anything in the first few years
13:35:22 <wob_jonas> yet everybody either simply releases something under a free license right now, or (rarely) releases something they did in the past under a free license as an afterthought, or never releases the work under a free license.
13:36:16 <wob_jonas> I've only ever seen ONE case when someone declared that a work will be public domain in the future but isn't now, and in that case it was already released under a no-derivatives free license and the future time was their death, not just a few years later
13:36:22 <wob_jonas> it's so strange
13:36:29 <wob_jonas> is there some legal difficulty in a timed release?
13:36:50 <wob_jonas> or a psychological difficulty?
13:39:06 <FireFly> I think in cases of "we want to retain copyright for now but will release it freely later", it's usually accomplished by just keeping it proprietary until the point where it'll be released freely
13:39:20 <FireFly> and then licensing it under a free-immediately license at that point
13:39:43 <FireFly> which is more flexible in that the copyright holder doesn't have to commit to a specific date or time ahead-of-time
13:40:37 <FireFly> I guess licensing it under a "these terms apply after $date" condition doesn't really come to mind to people, and also since it hasn't really been done much I guess there's little in way of legal precedent too?
13:41:08 <FireFly> compared to just releasing it under MIT or GPL or whatever at that future date instead
13:43:02 <wob_jonas> FireFly: it might be more flexible for a copyright holder but less convenient for everyone else
13:43:27 <wob_jonas> if I know something will be released from copyright later, I can already start working on derivative versions that I'll release at that time
13:43:58 <wob_jonas> sometimes (say for software that has an immediate use) I might even buy that thing now more (unlike in the case of a fiction book, when I might just wait)
13:44:06 <FireFly> True, but since it's up to the copyright holder to license it, I guess the flexibility for the copyright holder trumps that of others :p
13:44:28 <wob_jonas> this already happens for expiring copyrights (for books of course, there's no software with an expired copyright in most places of the world yet)
13:44:33 <wob_jonas> yeah
13:45:28 <FireFly> It reminds me a bit of how frictional games said they'd release the source code to Penumbra if the Humble Indie Bundle (the first one) exceeded some value in payment
13:45:35 <FireFly> (and did so once it did)
13:45:43 <FireFly> I mean, the topic of timed releases in general
13:45:53 <wob_jonas> oh, I hadn't heard of that
13:46:14 <wob_jonas> so basically they sell a public license in a mass way
13:50:22 <FireFly> Pretty much
13:50:33 <FireFly> of course, you got the binary form of the game either way
13:50:45 <FireFly> and assets weren't included in the source release
13:54:59 <wob_jonas> what do you mean by assets?
13:58:05 <FireFly> They released the source code under a permissive license (I think MIT or something) after they met that criteria in purchases, but that doesn't cover art, music, models, maps, etc
13:58:12 <FireFly> but rather just the code/engine itself
13:58:38 <wob_jonas> ok
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18:15:26 <wob_jonas> what was that programming language where program source code was in the form of everyday physical objects stacked into various towers, and so an interpreter is be very hard to write because it would need lots of recognition capabilities?
18:16:55 <ATMunn> i'm not sure, but that sounds really cool
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22:02:21 <wob_jonas> Hahahahaha! This is one of those cases when I can laugh at the more developed countries for thinking they are so cool when here in Hungary we've invented the same thing ages ago.
22:03:03 <wob_jonas> The last time I felt this was in 2012, when London announced that you can now use mobile phones in their tube network, while we've had mobile coverage in the metro lines for years by that time.
22:03:42 <wob_jonas> This time the Americans think they are cool for traveling to view a total solar eclipse, when we've already organized a total solar eclipse in 1999 with similar great tourist hype. I've seen it myself.
22:05:46 <\oren\> watch what fucking happens if you copypaste a string from hipchat
22:05:52 <\oren\> *       soft  memlock   unlimited
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22:07:55 <wob_jonas> is that double-utf-8?
22:09:27 <\oren\> they're U+2002 EN SPACE
22:09:57 <wob_jonas> \oren\: right, but shown as double-utf-8
22:10:18 <\oren\> I don't... think so?
22:10:43 <wob_jonas> I see a with hat in the line you pasted here
22:11:06 <wob_jonas> that's what you get when you take an en-space encoded as utf-8 and show it as cp1252 or similar instead
22:12:12 <\oren\> so it's not even well-formed utf-8? FUCK
22:12:40 <\oren\> *       soft  memlock   unlimited
22:13:19 <\oren\> HIPCHAT IS FUCKING SHIT
22:17:33 <wob_jonas> huh what? it's probably well-formed utf-8 when they send it to you, they just don't tell you it's utf-8. that, or they already double-utf-8 encode it in their servers, but that's unlikely.
22:17:43 <wob_jonas> or it got messed up when you pasted it here or something
22:18:20 <wob_jonas> I dunno really
22:46:27 <imode> weechat or die.
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22:56:37 <myname> irssi!
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←2017-08-24 2017-08-25 2017-08-26→ ↑2017 ↑all