< 1527725937 317804 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1527727067 634164 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Xanman12321 5* 10New user account < 1527727078 851912 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying... > 1527727365 290520 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55456&oldid=55453 5* 03Xanman12321 5* (+219) 10 > 1527727386 356097 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Xanman1232114]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55457 5* 03Xanman12321 5* (+13) 10Created page with "Hey, I'm Xan." < 1527728035 573335 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1527728108 275251 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1527728355 665585 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :Y'all know about skullcode, right? http://skullcode.com/ < 1527728386 585390 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's this thing. It's not completely obvious what, exactly, it is. < 1527728387 819260 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you going to try to convince me to click the link? < 1527728410 483591 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, it's a "self-hex-editor" hosted in some sort of VM. < 1527728429 744926 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a hex editor running on a VM, where the thing that it's editing is the memory of that VM. < 1527728464 928540 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1527728469 638961 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't that make it a codenomic, technically? < 1527728471 562238 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523 < 1527728474 860360 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi shachaf < 1527728476 219071 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kind of! < 1527728479 388401 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you logread? < 1527728500 670901 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's not multi-player. < 1527728503 68492 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not normally; sometimes I logread when I have nothing better to do (not the case right now!) but in such cases I'll typically not be on IRC at the time < 1527728503 854931 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: do I? I don't. < 1527728509 940315 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if someone suggests logreading then that'll normally prompt me to read < 1527728516 822741 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, let me segue into my question. < 1527728539 296700 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does anyone know of a browser-hosted VM (similar to skullcode) where you can edit, save, and load snapshots of the VM state? < 1527728547 636621 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :Preferably a VM with a simple architecture, like MIPS? < 1527728570 727581 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote a bit about for-else above but by now I've had a whole bunch of other thoughts. < 1527728579 44040 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: sorry for my connection < 1527728591 582178 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1527728642 925182 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric : In Ruby you can write a regular while function that can be used like while(p) { ... }, right? ← this is a defining feature of call-by-name languages < 1527728664 709392 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :some languages are normally call-by-value but let you explicitly lazify an argument, which makes them effectively call-by-name in that respect < 1527728720 616201 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not exactly what's going on there, I think. < 1527728763 347781 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can't reevaluate an arbitrary argument, just restart the entire function from the top, including argument evaluation. < 1527728785 529357 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also when people say call-by-name I usually think of languages without mutable variables. < 1527728791 930986 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` ocaml < 1527728792 649985 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/hackenv/bin/`: line 5: ocaml: command not found < 1527728795 50560 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :bleh < 1527728797 890507 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :was going to give an example < 1527728808 149685 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, I believe you, it makes sense. < 1527728815 310906 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: that defeats most of the point of call-by-name if you don't have mutable variables < 1527728820 445735 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as that makes the calling convention invisible < 1527728838 411956 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you don't know or care if it's call-by-name or not and in most contexts, call-by-value is more efficient < 1527728917 556835 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless an argument doesn't terminate or something like that. < 1527728925 235095 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1527728931 950193 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's effectively an effect too < 1527728944 407014 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure. < 1527729402 613147 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: here, here's a program I just wrote: http://nethack4.org/pastebin/15.txt < 1527729408 317593 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's Algol 60 < 1527729412 137419 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it shows off call-by-name pretty well < 1527729427 125911 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although not the control flow behaviour (Algol 60 control flow is painful), more the basic idea of CBN < 1527729439 334625 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it shows off re-evaluating arbitrary arguments, at least < 1527729466 604641 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(OK, technically it isn't proper Algol 60 as Algol 60 doesn't have a print statement, but my Algol 60 compiler adds one as an extension) < 1527729726 426945 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Makes sense. < 1527729835 706798 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can probably guess what output gets printed > 1527729882 190570 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Roie14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55458&oldid=55448 5* 03Galaxtone 5* (+112) 10Just incase. < 1527729935 770453 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1527730220 237887 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually that code feels a bit icky to me from a types point of view, functions should be distinguishing between integer lvalues and integer rvalues < 1527730332 395683 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric < 1527731119 748584 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1527731714 312769 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying... < 1527732896 699117 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric < 1527733240 400604 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1527733248 724102 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :this roie language is giving me some real trouble to make it actually work < 1527733258 239238 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Might have to add yet another instruction > 1527734057 242971 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Xanman1232114]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55459&oldid=55457 5* 03Xanman12321 5* (+34) 10 > 1527734425 35119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Xanman12321/Consequences14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55460 5* 03Xanman12321 5* (+573) 10Created page with "'''Consequences''' is an esolang very similar to Brainfuck, however each command does something unwanted. {| class="wikitable" |- ! Command !! Extra action |- | > || Decrement..." < 1527734734 730391 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Noice he finally made that < 1527734832 580819 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's userspace, so it's probably a draft rather than a final version < 1527734929 868332 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was wondering if it was TC until I saw the side effect of + < 1527734936 219883 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now I think it probably is TC, although I'm not sure < 1527734957 955728 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there might be something specific you can't do that you need to but I can't see anything obvious < 1527734976 215849 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you mostly use + to go left, > to go right, - to adjust cells < 1527734995 927900 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and leave enough junk elements on the tape that you can throw away most of the side effects in places you don't care about > 1527735023 936217 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Xanman12321/Consequences14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55461&oldid=55460 5* 03Xanman12321 5* (-573) 10Blanked the page > 1527735061 813487 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Xanman12321/Consequences14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55462&oldid=55461 5* 03Xanman12321 5* (+573) 10 > 1527735107 181926 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03Xanman12321 5* 10moved [[02User:Xanman12321/Consequences10]] to [[Esolang:Xanman12321/Consequences]] < 1527735121 433284 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I think they're trying to move it to mainspace < 1527735126 718199 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd better intervene, screwed-up moves can be hard to fix > 1527735134 943705 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03Xanman12321 5* 10moved [[02Esolang:Xanman12321/Consequences10]] to [[Xanman12321/Consequences]] < 1527735136 56756 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1527735138 216764 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :he;'s got it. < 1527735143 536355 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't worry I'm in his DM > 1527735152 396356 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03Ais523 5* 10moved [[02Esolang:Xanman12321/Consequences10]] to [[Consequences]]: I assume the author's trying to move this to mainspace < 1527735161 837960 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh ais523 > 1527735181 267497 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete10 02 5* 03Ais523 5* 10deleted "[[02User:Xanman12321/Consequences10]]": Broken redirect < 1527735182 331716 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :He already moved it back berfore you did that < 1527735187 66311 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1527735202 986507 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was trying to warn you. > 1527735203 327032 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03Xanman12321 5* 10moved [[02Xanman12321/Consequences10]] to [[Consequential]] < 1527735214 745856 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consequential > 1527735215 228220 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Consequential14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55470&oldid=55468 5* 03Xanman12321 5* (+1) 10 < 1527735218 473228 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice. < 1527735247 764282 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I kind of want to write an implementation of this block language. < 1527735255 810967 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it might be a lot of work. > 1527735256 389500 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete10 02 5* 03Ais523 5* 10deleted "[[02Consequences10]]": Broken redirect < 1527735279 607633 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I'm mostly procrastinating on something important by thinking about it. > 1527735287 362379 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete10 02 5* 03Ais523 5* 10deleted "[[02Xanman12321/Consequences10]]": Broken redirect: redirect left behind after a chain page-move < 1527735289 480767 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry mate, looks like you were trying to help but just ended up messing up in the end. < 1527735310 48288 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, he didn't move it back < 1527735315 141593 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :he moved it to three different titles < 1527735319 32993 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I had to clean up after each of them < 1527735332 788007 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh... well I'm confused. < 1527735339 736652 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :He has been on the discord and just created his account < 1527735341 185928 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :‎<‎ais523‎>‎ I'd better intervene, screwed-up moves can be hard to fix ← looks like I was slightly too slow on the intervening, but luckily it was screwed up in a way that was fairly easy for an admin to fix < 1527735343 515374 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's new. < 1527735354 699653 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll inform him of this redirect "issue". < 1527735357 41345 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the page name /meant/ to be? if it's Consequential, then all is fine < 1527735367 783877 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep he's fine with that < 1527735379 68412 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the basic rule is that you can't move the same page twice without admin help, or things end up getting slightly broken < 1527735399 696316 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but quite a few people try to get round this issue via copy-and-paste which makes things a lot worse < 1527735417 311203 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that didn't happen so the cleanup wasn't so hard < 1527735422 646977 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok I've sent him an image of this so he knows about it. < 1527735431 639101 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that he doesn't accidentally create redirects unkouwningly < 1527735439 425064 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :unknowingly* < 1527735443 240067 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-( < 1527735486 485357 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :incidentally, when you create a new language, it's often worth adding it to categories (see https://esolangs.org/wiki/Esolang:Categorisation) and to the [[e:Language list]] < 1527735491 800138 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, https://esolangs.org/wiki/Language_list < 1527735506 862486 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes it easier for other people to come across it < 1527735523 381891 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which increases the chance that you get comments from other people, implementations, computational class proofs, etc. < 1527735553 229531 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if the only places it shows are in Special:RecentChanges (and it stops being recent after a while…) and Special:Allpages, very few people are likely to ever see it > 1527735588 126633 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Consequential14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55471&oldid=55470 5* 03Xanman12321 5* (+44) 10 > 1527735607 469787 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Consequential14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55472&oldid=55471 5* 03Xanman12321 5* (+1) 10 > 1527735649 41902 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Consequential14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55473&oldid=55472 5* 03Xanman12321 5* (+8) 10 > 1527735667 982776 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Consequential14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55474&oldid=55473 5* 03Xanman12321 5* (+0) 10 > 1527735691 396745 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Consequential14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55475&oldid=55474 5* 03Xanman12321 5* (-3) 10 > 1527735697 272369 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Consequential14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55476&oldid=55475 5* 03Xanman12321 5* (-1) 10 > 1527735711 831400 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Consequential14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55477&oldid=55476 5* 03Ais523 5* (-12) 10site policy: links to userspace must have the "User:" visible < 1527737495 872194 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :really? < 1527737502 269463 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the User: part must be visible? < 1527737527 207703 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait did you just update your privacy policy?!?! < 1527737562 578075 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, that's been a policy for years and years < 1527737576 898787 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1527737579 219170 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Esolang:Policy < 1527737584 803441 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I know plently of esolang pages which don't have User: < 1527737599 143746 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :since 2007: http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?title=Esolang:Policy&oldid=7955 < 1527737603 325168 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`[[User:Galaxtone|Galaxtone]]` well there goes this. < 1527737603 947464 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/srv/hackeso-code/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: [[User:Galaxtone|Galaxtone]]`: not found < 1527737613 469272 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ssh hackeso wasnt talking to you. < 1527737620 781381 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, it's not that enforced because it's easy to miss it < 1527737632 964135 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the point is that we want to separate pages /about/ something or someone from pages /by/ something or somoene < 1527737653 236888 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can write more or less what I like on https://esolangs.org/wiki/User:ais523, but people visiting the page should know that it might be potentially biased or the like < 1527737656 565776 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :time to go through all my contributions < 1527737705 596386 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually it was policy even before 2007 I think < 1527737733 751131 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the Esolang:Policy page started off as observational, i.e. "this is a list of things that people got banned for disobeying even though there were no explicit rules", back when Esolang was pretty much a dictatorship < 1527737738 750370 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nowadays we use it as a guide to what the rules are > 1527737747 4302 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Roie14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55478&oldid=55458 5* 03Galaxtone 5* (-10) 10Just learned it's against esolang "policy" to hide "User:" in user page links. ;-; < 1527737772 737622 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well now to apply that to like 5 other pages > 1527737829 528743 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Seeker14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55479&oldid=55452 5* 03Galaxtone 5* (-15) 10Just learned it's against esolang "policy" to hide "User:" in page links. ;-; > 1527737850 43802 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Schmuu14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55480&oldid=55423 5* 03Galaxtone 5* (-18) 10Just learned it's against esolang "policy" to hide "User:" in page links. ;-; > 1527737869 951772 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07The Insane Esolang14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55481&oldid=55420 5* 03Galaxtone 5* (-10) 10Just learned it's against esolang "policy" to hide "User:" in page links. ;-; < 1527737894 414355 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait... < 1527737901 588254 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Emoji-gramming doesn't show who created the language. < 1527738427 698647 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: /dev/null is full < 1527739101 484214 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Do you like this? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ar9WRwCiSr0 < 1527739451 503180 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also I guess that's somewhat on-topic in here. < 1527739542 762778 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yo can someone link Brianfukc < 1527740274 278801 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh man < 1527740277 908990 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :this video is too good > 1527742108 575732 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Consequential14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55482&oldid=55477 5* 03Galaxtone 5* (+404) 10Redid the layout a bit. < 1527742234 342872 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Galaxtone: hmm, your friend deleted the end of the article by mistake < 1527744484 724887 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@145.255.8.243 JOIN :#esoteric < 1527744582 553928 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying... < 1527748243 480315 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1527752024 673241 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1527752569 362107 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-esrgrtqkiyzrfmyk QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity < 1527753467 806040 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite < 1527753920 34712 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1527754024 380867 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1527754061 774242 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1527754416 712237 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: quit > 1527758495 312501 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Fyr 5* 10New user account < 1527758944 300512 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric > 1527759018 670360 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55483&oldid=55456 5* 03Fyr 5* (+137) 10 < 1527759090 509921 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: no, Rust always had return values from blocks, they were always expressions like do-blocks in perl < 1527759119 825666 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: the new feature is that now you can use a break statement for a bare labeled block, as opposed to just in a while loop with or without a label < 1527759130 973422 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and for such a break statement, you can also return a value, which isn't too new < 1527759178 174936 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, I mean for a forever loop < 1527759222 561586 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't allow return values for while loops and for loops, for the technical reason that the return value wouldn't be defined if the condition is false the first time in a while loop or there are no iterations on the for loop < 1527759239 189652 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but forever loops always have at least one iteration, because they don't start with a condition, so it's no problem there < 1527759315 972831 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I'd also like to note that my esolang geo has plain blocks and forever loops, and for both you have unconditional and conditional breaks that can deliver a return value for the block, but only for the innermost level, no labels or multi-level breaks < 1527759409 674577 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, looks good. < 1527759442 397742 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought saw an RFC for adding these things to Rust but maybe it was quite old. < 1527759452 302471 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and rust has supported multi-level breaks using loop labels for very long, but not through function/lambda boundaries < 1527759545 777337 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ruby and mathematica also have values for blocks, with not much difference between statements and expressions < 1527759627 547907 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in rust there's some slight difference, as in, you need a brace block (as opposed to just parenthesis) for semicolons or local variable declarations or other declarations, and brace blocks make the lexical scope of identifiers declared inside local into them and gets local variables declared in them destroyed at the end of the block (like C++) < 1527759665 895463 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I also want possible input values for blocks. < 1527759702 412102 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but brace blocks themselves are expressions that you can put anywhere in an expression and have a value, and all the control statements (if, while, for, case, loop) are statements you can put anywhere too (although while and for always return unit) < 1527759761 740195 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: you have those too, if you mean like the limited syntax support for local variables declared in the head condition of an if/while/for like in C++ < 1527759774 207845 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure what else you mean by input values < 1527759826 875955 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, well, how would you translate { it := for(a); ... } as described earlier? < 1527759843 628597 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :um... described where? let me check the logs < 1527759896 993577 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I don't understand the question. can you clarify? < 1527759925 99195 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't understand it either, exactly. < 1527759957 34361 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you defined a "for" operator that iterates a thing and yields a value to the rest of the block, what code would it turn into? < 1527760110 611677 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe something like: { L: Iterator it, end; start: it = a.begin(); end = a.end(); upkeep: if (it == end) break L; goto main; main: { ... }; end: ++i; goto upkeep; } < 1527760121 927581 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is half-C++ < 1527760175 938458 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: in rust, the for loop always returns the unit value (), because that's how it's defined and that's what makes sense when it can have zero iterations. if you want a return value, you use a library method such as map, find, max, sum, fold, ... < 1527760194 739927 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, I agree about that. < 1527760211 661897 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or you can use a local variable and access it inside a for loop or in the callback of some of those methods < 1527760228 497470 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(because lambda magic) < 1527760264 939785 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rust has mutable local variables like C++, perl, ruby, scheme, etc, so you can do this easily, unlike in haskell < 1527760287 283238 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can do that but sometimes it doesn't make sense to have an uninitialized variable. < 1527760298 845037 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, then you can initialize it < 1527760310 935973 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or you can use an option < 1527760336 294288 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the fold method, you give an initializer; for the find method, it returns an Option (which is like a Maybe in haskell) < 1527760416 534605 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, but I'm not talking about Rust. < 1527760464 464473 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's no real reason to talk about C++ iterators either, of course, but they're a reasonable starting point. < 1527760595 894979 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I think what rust does here is more or less reasonable < 1527760919 510161 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :For what? < 1527761072 425952 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: for syntax and semantics of loops and statements and expressions, at least in a language that you may want to compile < 1527761088 862076 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(as opposed to some fully dynamically typed language that you'll always interpret) < 1527761127 260543 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(you know, one like ruby or perl where you can override most builtin ops) < 1527761373 427700 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I specifically want this other syntax and semantis. < 1527761401 380752 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's still all compiled, though, hopefully to equally efficient code. < 1527761464 293502 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: um, but what's the other syntax and semantics you're proposing? < 1527761685 297046 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that's what I'm figuring out. < 1527761708 277859 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The syntax looks like { x := for(a); ...; } < 1527761769 912895 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: but what would that do? < 1527761782 915078 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would do "for(x : a) { ... }" < 1527761786 115398 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1527761799 210967 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :For example, I don't know, { i := for(range(n)); j := for(range(m)); if (i < j); print (i,j); } < 1527761811 927679 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Each thing affects the rest of the block that comes after it. < 1527761826 439010 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I talked about this earlier but probably not very clearly. < 1527762140 557987 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :makes sense < 1527762215 374202 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think "blocks that have an input" is similar to SSA < 1527762287 192862 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also I guess conditional goto is standard in SSA. < 1527762301 902293 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :With basic blocks/extended basic blocks and all that? < 1527763069 836054 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com QUIT :Quit: Tis but a scratch < 1527763960 284464 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, what is "SSA"? > 1527766354 769416 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Infbf14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55484 5* 03Fyr 5* (+1346) 10Created page with "'''Infbf''' is an [[esoteric programming language]] by [[User:Fyr]]. It is a derivative of [[brainfuck]] with an infinite-dimensional hypercube tape where each dimension has t..." > 1527766421 988808 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Fyr14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55485 5* 03Fyr 5* (+9) 10Created page with "[[Infbf]]" < 1527766629 266844 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric < 1527768133 915904 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ivljhpoyakdmqqtr JOIN :#esoteric > 1527770404 201101 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Infbf14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55486&oldid=55484 5* 03Fyr 5* (+200) 10 < 1527770706 388580 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric > 1527771313 748879 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Infbf14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55487&oldid=55486 5* 03Fyr 5* (+8) 10 < 1527781147 95433 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`smlist 464 < 1527781147 811743 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :smlist 464: shachaf monqy elliott mnoqy Cale < 1527781362 477017 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client < 1527781659 347348 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cale: Yay > 1527782060 318124 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Seigel 5* 10New user account < 1527782506 635448 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1527782836 715967 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric < 1527784931 679795 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric < 1527786146 517658 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-002-203-000-049.002.203.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Quit: thunderstorm < 1527787169 418426 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1527787507 733947 :joast!~rick@cpe-98-145-132-215.natnow.res.rr.com QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1527787787 479634 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-002-203-000-049.002.203.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1527788157 618126 :joast!~rick@cpe-98-145-132-215.natnow.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric > 1527788357 890507 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Infbf14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55488&oldid=55487 5* 03Fyr 5* (+88) 10Added implementation < 1527788904 364211 :TIKOALA!~stefan@22.243.151.77.rev.sfr.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1527788941 720197 :TIKOALA!~stefan@22.243.151.77.rev.sfr.net PART :#esoteric < 1527789700 207090 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1527789828 343425 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu NICK :sebbu < 1527792444 661502 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1527793096 264075 :user24!~void@p2003008869012300796685AC3938AA46.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1527793545 385555 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1527793647 692215 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@145.255.8.243 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1527795272 721925 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1527795684 568813 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ivljhpoyakdmqqtr QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity < 1527797056 481138 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1527797059 973260 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1527797279 68058 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1527799136 738459 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu NICK :sebbu < 1527799180 543914 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1527801823 615894 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Infbf14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55489&oldid=55488 5* 03Fyr 5* (+25) 10 < 1527801864 704722 :iconmaster!~iconmaste@2604:6000:b188:9800:9d13:8c40:9971:5084 JOIN :#esoteric < 1527804330 269335 :heroux!sandroco@gateway/shell/insomnia247/x-lkpvfakijrzurtpg QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1527804368 737839 :heroux!sandroco@gateway/shell/insomnia247/x-jtxxupqfdsikbnrk JOIN :#esoteric < 1527804710 181000 :iconmaster_!~iconmaste@2604:6000:b188:9800:9ded:4732:55c1:d3d6 JOIN :#esoteric < 1527804956 749589 :iconmaster!~iconmaste@2604:6000:b188:9800:9d13:8c40:9971:5084 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1527805487 537025 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-uyiniflljyfmgcxp JOIN :#esoteric < 1527805725 643335 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1527806220 646528 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1527808077 689703 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1527809030 692639 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1527809152 217652 :user24!~void@p2003008869012300796685AC3938AA46.dip0.t-ipconnect.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1527809918 308346 :user24!~void@p200300886900E100796685AC3938AA46.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1527810959 775045 :iconmaster__!~iconmaste@2604:6000:b188:9800:447b:674d:9782:7b62 JOIN :#esoteric < 1527810961 480433 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1527811081 218059 :friendlyGoat!~Jonah@50.105.198.143 JOIN :#esoteric