00:20:55 -!- Omnious has joined. 00:21:31 -!- Omnious has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 00:27:16 -!- KellerFuchs28 has joined. 00:28:19 -!- KellerFuchs28 has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 00:42:24 -!- bradcomp has joined. 00:55:03 -!- bsanford has joined. 00:55:26 -!- bsanford has quit (Killed (Sigyn (Spam is off topic on freenode.))). 00:56:46 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 01:06:48 I think that the Dawkins scale is fail to consider the difference kind of ideas how is meant by "God" (and what is meant "exists" in this context, too) (including, that you can't know what it means). 01:08:59 -!- bradcomp has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 01:11:40 -!- OPK9 has joined. 01:17:54 -!- OPK9 has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 01:26:26 -!- Kronuz14 has joined. 01:31:30 hm 01:32:14 -!- bradcomp has joined. 01:32:35 -!- Kronuz14 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 01:32:57 I think general public definitely in average doesn’t know what it means by “exists”, and I see only two ways to define this word more or less unambiguously and usefully, both of which define existing relatively: 01:34:51 -!- LKoen has joined. 01:36:31 one is for “A exists in mathematical/physical theory B” (any modern physical theory contains some mathematical theory and “bindings” of it with experimentally checkable) 01:37:14 -!- bradcomp has quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds). 01:39:13 -!- bradcomp has joined. 01:40:11 -!- LKoen has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 01:47:27 or not a physical one — any scientific theory admitting a precise definition (i. e. a mathematical one) somewhere inside in its workings; 01:48:34 -!- bradcomp has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 01:49:17 -!- bradcomp has joined. 01:54:36 another IIRC is for “(A exists in sc. theory B) upto accuracy C”, in this case it’s not atomic (and thus I think I have thought of something else originally) as it boils down to the first and “sc. theory is valid upto accuracy C” 01:57:57 so we can say “electrons exist”, and behind the scenes it means we pick any theory which defines them (classical electrodynamics, quantum electrodynamics etc.) and mean such an accuracy level that that theory holds — in everyday life it’s usually a very low level (and a pure mathematical theory always holds if we’re all think it’s sound) 01:58:30 or we can say “2 exists”, and it admits even more contexts where it’s true 01:59:59 there could be contexts where it’s meaningless or indeterminate or false (e. g. if we define 2 ≡ 1 + 1, and the theory knows about 1 and +, then 2 exists; if we also want 2 > 1, then in some cases 2 doesn’t exist) 02:00:48 these definitions are very useful IMO and they capture that we usually speak inside a vast context 02:02:11 but I’m still unsure abouth the second. When I find my notes, I’ll write if it’s laid out right 02:03:10 but, as about e. g. Dawkins, there are also useful existential _presumptions_ 02:07:55 they could be thought of as a propositions (maybe axioms) of some very general theories which is hard to place exactly in what domain of knowledge they are, but philosophers these days say they have figured this out. This metatheoretical stuff is a dim part and it’s not that essential to workings of science or everyday scientific worldview 02:10:26 it’s not IMO that interesting as an existence. Also several formalizations of logic treat existence differently in details, so that underlying logic must be included in a mentioned theory, if one to be boring enough 02:13:27 also these are cases when “is valid” for a theories is not enough, then there comes “is useful (to a consensus, or to someone like me)” 02:13:32 subtlety 02:15:59 -!- insidious23 has joined. 02:18:15 oops I’ve completely missed. I was defining what is truth, not existence. It’s more general 02:21:49 so we have a mathematical truth (depending on a logic and a theory in it) or an experimental truth (depending on a precision). “Electron exists” will be the first, many experiments on this or that electrodynamics would give us tons of the second ones. Then we could combine truths of both kinds and say electrons exist with this accuracy 02:23:16 of course it’s a first approximation, but it’s about right for everything ontological an average man like me will need 02:25:02 -!- insidious23 has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 02:26:26 an important corollary to this definition of truth is that absolute truth is a non-entity. Any truth is relative, but of course not in a sense it is usually used by politicians or journalists 02:31:56 -!- maxalt10 has joined. 02:32:28 -!- maxalt10 has quit (Killed (Sigyn (Spam is off topic on freenode.))). 02:32:52 zzo38: ^ if you want 02:33:43 I looked at this 02:34:58 -!- XorSwap has quit (Quit: the creeping crawling chaos will return.). 02:35:29 okay 02:37:34 bye, going to sleep finally 02:39:28 -!- stasoid has joined. 02:45:23 -!- arseniiv has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 02:49:05 -!- bradcomp has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 02:50:52 -!- bradcomp has joined. 02:56:06 -!- tromp has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 03:03:00 -!- joepie919 has joined. 03:04:08 -!- joepie919 has quit (Killed (Sigyn (Spam is off topic on freenode.))). 03:05:50 [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=57354&oldid=57343 * Stasoid * (+155) /* Introductions */ 03:06:31 [[Talk:Axo]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=57355&oldid=8279 * Stasoid * (+141) /* Exit command in string mode */ new section 03:09:08 [[Talk:Axo]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=57356&oldid=57355 * Stasoid * (+121) /* Name capitalization */ new section 03:11:59 -!- tromp has joined. 03:14:14 -!- stasoid_ has joined. 03:14:28 -!- drot29 has joined. 03:15:00 -!- stasoid has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds). 03:16:31 -!- stasoid has joined. 03:17:02 -!- tromp has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 03:17:07 -!- drot29 has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 03:18:13 -!- stasoid has quit (Client Quit). 03:33:05 -!- bradcomp has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 03:35:13 -!- LKoen has joined. 03:36:23 -!- LKoen_ has joined. 03:36:23 -!- LKoen has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 03:38:19 -!- bradcomp has joined. 03:40:57 -!- LKoen_ has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 04:06:09 -!- tromp has joined. 04:10:48 -!- tromp has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 04:11:22 -!- zch has joined. 04:11:40 -!- zch has quit (Client Quit). 04:16:11 -!- bradcomp has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 04:57:03 [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * SelfMod * New user account 04:59:32 -!- tromp has joined. 05:02:05 [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=57357&oldid=57354 * SelfMod * (+173) /* Introductions */ hi 05:03:52 -!- tromp has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds). 05:19:52 -!- bradcomp has joined. 05:21:23 -!- Nazca has joined. 05:21:56 -!- Nazca has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 05:28:44 -!- Cronus28 has joined. 05:28:48 -!- johnpark_pj has joined. 05:29:07 -!- Cronus28 has quit (Killed (Sigyn (Spam is off topic on freenode.))). 05:33:19 -!- bradcomp has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds). 05:35:29 -!- johnpark_pj has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 05:38:50 -!- spirit_pact9 has joined. 05:42:32 -!- vespaper has joined. 05:44:18 -!- spirit_pact9 has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 05:45:03 -!- vespaper has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 05:52:25 -!- wraeth16 has joined. 05:53:29 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10:26:59 [[Puzzlang]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=57358&oldid=40488 * Oerjan * (+4) /* Computational Class */ Link TC 10:49:23 -!- zseri has joined. 11:02:57 -!- MDude has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 11:25:10 -!- poxifide27 has joined. 11:28:07 -!- poxifide27 has quit (Killed (Sigyn (Spam is off topic on freenode.))). 11:35:58 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 11:38:06 -!- SopaXorzTaker has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 11:38:21 -!- JStoker21 has joined. 11:41:34 -!- SopaXorzTaker has joined. 11:41:53 -!- JStoker21 has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 12:07:42 -!- Esqapezord has quit (Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. 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Anywhere.). 17:34:34 -!- bradcomp has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 18:03:00 -!- bradcomp has joined. 18:07:05 -!- bradcomp has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 18:27:32 -!- LKoen has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 18:37:55 -!- bradcomp has joined. 18:39:50 -!- TheoM has joined. 18:42:27 -!- bradcomp has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 18:46:57 -!- TheoM has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 19:09:49 -!- bradcomp has joined. 19:12:34 -!- SopaXorzTaker has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 19:23:05 -!- unknown29 has joined. 19:23:44 -!- unknown29 has quit (Killed (Sigyn (Spam is off topic on freenode.))). 19:28:14 -!- oerjan has joined. 19:29:24 Many C programs are designed to return a null pointer in case of error and something else if it is OK, but how common is it to return a null pointer if it is OK and not null if it is an error? Sometimes I have done that in some cases. 19:30:45 Go functions often do that with the second return value. 19:31:18 x, err := f(); if err != nil { ... } 19:31:46 It's not a pointer, but some glibc functions have an annoying idiom with errno that works similarly. 19:32:05 (errno = 0; x = f(); if (errno != 0) { ... }) 19:32:23 -!- Phantom__Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 19:35:40 Some functions in Free Hero Mesh return null if OK or a constant error message if it is an error (although some errors are fatal and will cause the program to terminate instead). 19:37:27 -!- bradcomp has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 19:38:48 jix: you have some questions for you on Talk:Axo 19:39:25 * oerjan cannot recall em talking in years... 19:40:48 I don't know of any program language other than C and LLVM which has setjmp/longjmp, even though sometimes it can be good. Also many APIs of many programs can't be longjmp through since it might do something that it doesn't expect 19:43:42 -!- Phantom__Hoover has joined. 19:44:10 hasn't edited the wiki since 2006, yet is still here in the channel :P 19:44:27 i guess i can answer one of the questions. 19:48:02 -!- bradcomp has joined. 19:49:19 [[Axo]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=57359&oldid=42647 * Oerjan * (+14) Standardize capitalization to the (mostly) original 20:06:30 hm i think the other question was due to an edit error 20:14:15 -!- DenSchub7 has joined. 20:17:22 -!- Lumpi6 has joined. 20:17:51 -!- DenSchub7 has quit (Killed (Sigyn (Spam is off topic on freenode.))). 20:19:11 -!- kashike3 has joined. 20:20:08 -!- kashike3 has quit (Killed (Sigyn (Spam is off topic on freenode.))). 20:20:09 -!- Janusz7 has joined. 20:21:05 [[Axo]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=57360&oldid=57359 * Oerjan * (+35) grm, fix ancient rewriting error 20:22:12 -!- Janusz7 has quit (Killed (Sigyn (Spam is off topic on freenode.))). 20:22:29 Why does SQLite have a sqlite3_result_blob64() function but no corresponding sqlite3_value_bytes64() function (at least according to the documentation)? 20:22:39 jix: never mind, i found the answers 20:22:58 -!- Lumpi6 has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 20:26:03 [[Talk:Axo]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=57361&oldid=57356 * Oerjan * (+554) Fixed errors 20:27:20 Presumably the reason is due to the limit which is limited to 32-bits (having interfaces with 64-bit numbers can be useful in case you do not want to implement that by yourself), but it should probably be mentioned in the documentation of sqlite3_result_blob64() and so on that it is limited otherwise you might think the limit is longer if you do not check elsewhere. 20:27:57 -!- LKoen has joined. 20:29:25 (Since it is already limited to one billion anyways.) 20:29:43 [[List of ideas]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=57362&oldid=57080 * GDavid * (+569) /* Mathematics */ 20:32:35 -!- LKoen has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 20:32:43 (If a sqlite3_limit64() function is ever added, then a sqlite3_value_bytes64() function may be necessary.) 20:41:03 -!- atslash has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 20:41:17 -!- atslash has joined. 20:41:20 -!- bradcomp has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 20:48:03 <3 null pointer dereferences. 20:49:29 Null pointer dereferences? 20:51:03 or near enough: SEGV on unknown address 0x000000000008 20:52:14 What program is that? 20:55:14 Ar maybe address sanitizer is playing tricks on me. It's my own program but the error is thrown in a library. 20:55:46 [[Puzzlang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=57363&oldid=57358 * Oerjan * (+52) /* Overview */ Use horizontal space instead of vertical 20:56:11 * oerjan vaguely wonders if someone changed it the opposite way before 20:56:58 Sometimes that happens if you pass improper arguments to the library. 20:57:43 zzo38: well I found my real mistake and address santizer is still complaining. so I guess that interacts badly with the library (it's an OpenCL thing) 20:58:34 Sometimes the mistake is actually in the library; it is not always your own mistake. 21:01:50 -!- imode has joined. 21:02:23 It's somewhat interesting... the Intel OpenCL runtime reads from the zero page, and the nvidia one doesn't even show up to the party, if I enable the address sanitizer. 21:04:48 http://paste.debian.net/1038537/ 21:09:56 -!- matlock has joined. 21:12:00 cute, intel's vendor id is 0x8086 21:16:27 -!- matlock has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 21:18:47 -!- LKoen has joined. 21:20:46 -!- imode has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 21:22:13 -!- Guest32399 has joined. 21:26:54 -!- bradcomp has joined. 21:27:05 -!- Guest32399 has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 21:30:09 How common is programs that use SQLite databases also allowing the user to use SQL to write extensions for the program? 21:30:49 -!- cats28 has joined. 21:31:38 -!- bradcomp has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 21:36:50 -!- cats28 has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 21:37:15 -!- imode has joined. 21:53:30 shachaf, did you real latest OOTS book? 22:12:18 No. 22:12:38 I'm waiting to order the The Complete Olist of the Stick book 22:12:46 Which is a shame because it'll probably never be released? 22:18:54 . o O ( just put $1 into a bank account so you'll be able to pay for it when it is released ) 22:20:13 -!- AnotherTest has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 22:20:54 -!- LKoen has quit (Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.”). 22:29:00 -!- imode has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 22:29:30 zzo38: if you care, https://github.com/google/sanitizers/issues/629 has some information relevant to why the nvidia platform "disappears" with address sanitizer. 22:30:28 (and indeed it doesn't do that if I use ASAN_OPTIONS=protect_shadow_gap=0) 22:30:30 -!- imode has joined. 22:30:34 -!- bradcomp has joined. 22:33:27 :) 22:35:20 -!- bradcomp has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 22:55:32 -!- bradcomp has joined. 22:59:43 [[TRAVEL 33]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=57364 * GDavid * (+3624) Created page with "TRAVEL 33 is an esolang invented by [[User:GDavid]]. It's capable of sending information in time, even backwards therefore it's uncomputable.
It got it's name from the f..." 23:00:03 -!- danieljabailey has quit (Quit: ZNC 1.6.5+deb2build2 - http://znc.in). 23:00:19 -!- danieljabailey has joined. 23:08:02 Is anyone on here willing to help to write the picture editor program for use with Free Hero Mesh? It should not use any libraries other than those used by Free Hero Mesh itself, ideally, but maybe there is other idea 23:12:01 what is free hero mesb 23:15:08 Here is a wiki and source repository: http://zzo38computer.org/fossil/heromesh.ui/wcontent The file format for the pictures is documented, and you can also look at the source codes. You can also add feature requests, bug reports, add more documentation if you want to, etc. So far I wrote all of it by myself, and expect I will continue to write most of it, but I also accept contributions if there are any. 23:19:42 Free Hero Mesh is a program to make puzzle games. 23:22:27 -!- arseniiv has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 23:26:36 Are all of the documentation of the file formats sense or is something difficult to understand? 23:30:07 Free Hero Mesh is designed for puzzle games played on a rectangular grid (no larger than 64x64), without any randomness or any timing; it is purely turn-based. Hidden information is partially supported for classes with the CF_QUIZ flag set, although it is recommended not to hide information. 23:31:23 -!- bradcomp has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 23:33:49 -!- bradcomp has joined. 23:36:20 -!- tromp has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 23:42:07 -!- Guest88463 has joined. 23:42:32 @google "bio-integrity metadata" 23:42:33 https://patchwork.kernel.org/patch/9497271/ 23:49:35 -!- Guest88463 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 23:52:14 -!- tromp has joined. 23:54:38 -!- bradcomp has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 23:57:02 -!- tromp has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds).