< 1535328047 778343 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@46.191.210.223 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: But, what with instruction set? => didn’t think about it, but it would be nice if it somehow anticipated using algebraic datatypes in a language compiled to it < 1535328134 591154 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@46.191.210.223 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it would should have a minimalistic instruction set < 1535328140 329710 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@46.191.210.223 PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course < 1535328170 544970 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1535328667 120054 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: What's the problem with parentheses and spaces? < 1535328884 919896 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The fields in that file are separated by spaces, and there is parentheses around it, but how can you parse it if the filename contains parentheses and spaces? < 1535328925 123278 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I misread that as /proc/$$/comm somehow. < 1535329483 893704 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I found the answer. < 1535329493 211976 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: First you look for the leftmost (, and then you look for the rightmost ) < 1535329499 218231 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the comm is between them. < 1535329508 835860 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is what ps does, at least. < 1535329528 698428 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://github.com/thlorenz/procps/blob/master/deps/procps/proc/readproc.c#L516 < 1535329551 378323 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I suppose that will work (as long as no other parentheses are possible in that file, which as far as I can tell is the case), although it doesn't seem a very good design. < 1535329557 957592 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I agree. < 1535329575 715413 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's p. scow the amount of ad-hoc parsing unix makes you do to do things < 1535329710 789224 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find myself kinda wishing the "everything is text" thing had motivated fewer data representations, not more. < 1535329765 879699 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think it's that great. < 1535329796 959503 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Structure is good, throwing it away is a scow move < 1535329900 11289 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :On the other hand, the period structured file systems were pretty scow. < 1535329923 151205 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@46.191.210.223 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Structure is good, throwing it away is a scow move => +1 vive LispOS! < 1535329929 450022 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, sure, most things are scow. < 1535329940 916282 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But why do we gotta be stuck with the 1970s scow? < 1535329987 992260 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because people are afraid of change. < 1535330022 399893 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :To the point that you live in a country that's using 16th century scow units. :) < 1535330037 601666 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'll give up on all computer things and just do it all myself. < 1535330107 742894 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :UNIX is still much better than Windows though, even though there are some problem < 1535330177 467079 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it better than Windows? < 1535330302 922194 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Depends on where you're looking really. < 1535330304 514330 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :A lot of the windows system calls seem better to me. < 1535330393 16173 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, a few are in fact better, some are same, many are worse. < 1535330423 159504 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't used other UNIX systems much. < 1535330437 651375 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which parts of the Linux system call API are much better than Windows? < 1535330462 689324 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It exists? :P < 1535330480 30916 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Windows does not have a stable system call API at all) < 1535330492 246878 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean kernel32.dll or whatever the equivalent is. < 1535330499 847906 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that is much of why Windows is worse. < 1535330508 470831 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Windows approach seems p. reasonable? < 1535330518 133932 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's like the VDSO in Linux. < 1535330531 739696 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nah, kernel32.dll is not a thin wrapper. < 1535330559 312177 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, but is that a bad thing? < 1535330560 987731 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kernel32.dll is more analogous to glibc, if glibc was built on top of an unstable system call API. < 1535330581 659910 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better for more of the stable API compatiblity layers to be in userspace rather than in the kernel. < 1535330600 145067 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Then again, they do font rendering in the kernel, so, y'know.) < 1535330767 450693 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :By the way, I didn't really realize until recently why C89 requires all variable declarations to be at the beginning of a block. < 1535330801 99650 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's really laying out a stack frame, just like a struct etc. < 1535330852 668901 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compilers have been ignoring that completely and doing much fancier allocation for a long time so it didn't really occur to me. < 1535330854 139762 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, and period compilers were generally very simple. < 1535331083 343345 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Windows debugging-related system calls seem much nicer than ptrace. < 1535331106 609243 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I hear IOCP is p. good? < 1535331164 265759 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :IOCP is a mixed bag. When it works it's great, but it requires a client-side buffer for each request, and in some cases *can block anyways*. < 1535331180 681970 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's true for a lot of Linux APIs too. :-( < 1535331191 310684 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, and I'm harsh on them for the same exact reasons! < 1535331208 904041 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't understand why they don't just give you an API where everything is asynchronous. < 1535331239 324243 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where you can do socket I/O and file I/O and it's guaranteed not to block the OS thread. < 1535331263 42547 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, it makes some things really painful not having that. < 1535331281 940631 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thread pools for async IO should not be a thing that people actually do. < 1535331286 787183 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Instead it's a mess of different APIs for different things and they have strange restrictions and some things can block anyway. < 1535331301 138549 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you have to use a thread pool, yep. < 1535331330 431177 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it's just so much effort for so much wasted work! To make the thread pool work it has to be doing lots of extra work I don't want! < 1535331345 501851 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can make it work that way, but it really feels like just reimplementing a part of the kernel because the kernel can't be bothered to expose it to you. < 1535331486 592100 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, exactly. < 1535331681 954913 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@46.191.210.223 QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1535333573 3322 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Will GCC optimize out a code to switch the endian if it is already correct, in any cases? < 1535333596 503821 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm confused by that question. < 1535333629 608054 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you mean "if (IS_BIG_ENDIAN) { x = switch_endian(x); }", where IS_BIG_ENDIAN is known to be false at compile-time? < 1535333689 335263 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or do you mean something along the lines of "char *p; uint32_t x = p[0] | p[1] << 8 | p[2] << 16 | p[3] << 24;"? < 1535333710 860465 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean like that second way. < 1535333730 279478 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the first case, it can certainly remove that dead code. In the second case, I'm pretty sure it'll recognize that and turn it into a simple instruction that reads 4 bytes at a time. < 1535333740 217045 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Assuming there are no alignment issues, I guess.) < 1535338061 462329 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if there are any C64-like screen editors for shells for modern OSes < 1535338232 214695 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, you mentioned music compression? http://deepsid.chordian.net/?file=MUSICIANS/0-9/4-Mat/Empty_512_bytes.sid < 1535338289 221835 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no SID player on my computer at this time < 1535338293 349821 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The file it's playing is ... huh my copy is 630 bytes, I feel cheated < 1535338297 986721 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :That website has a built in SID player < 1535338306 961383 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe there is a header? < 1535338336 966925 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The heck? Windows tells me the size on disk is 0 bytes < 1535338655 209869 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh, so they measure the side of the .prg file (executable C64 can run). .sid does have a header, so yeah maybe < 1535338672 7211 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although turning a .sid into a .prg would also involve adding a small amount of code < 1535338740 629911 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :7zip says the .sid is 618 bytes and the .prg is 510 bytes > 1535339072 835303 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Printf14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=57485&oldid=57451 5* 03A 5* (+27) 10Actually, mispelled word > 1535339082 455869 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Printf14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=57486&oldid=57485 5* 03A 5* (-4) 10 < 1535339693 872309 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ebdnqiifalgefpwe QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity < 1535342763 828284 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone fit the Bad Apple animation onto a single disk for the C64 < 1535342773 832520 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://csdb.dk/release/?id=131628 < 1535343924 400964 :bradcomp!~bradcomp@c-67-161-161-17.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1535344303 510697 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net QUIT :Quit: the creeping crawling chaos will return. < 1535344960 467358 :bradcomp!~bradcomp@c-67-161-161-17.hsd1.ca.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1535348043 679786 :copumpkin[m]!copumpkinm@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-ujlzkslnyogehmgx QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1535348596 736938 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :""The (zero) flag is probably misnamed, and should have been called the < 1535348596 940487 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :flag (for "equals")." < 1535348921 332781 :copumpkin[m]!copumpkinm@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-aconrckwdqxrimrg JOIN :#esoteric < 1535349068 38561 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is vaguely annoyed that 6502 asm uses "EOR" instead of "XOR" < 1535349279 754457 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Coding to test the RUN/STOP key is often removed once testing is complete, on the assumption that no one will want to stop perfect program. Incidentally, if you plan to write nothing but 100 percent perfect programs, you will not need to use this subroutine." < 1535357038 688336 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric < 1535357177 902337 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: re "comm" field of /proc/$$/stat, see http://man7.org/linux/man-pages/man5/proc.5.html and the source of http://procps.sourceforge.net/ which has utilities like ps and top for linux and parse data from /proc , note that you may need to read /proc/$pid/status instead < 1535357251 265691 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: also, if you only want the arguments (argv or the argument list in execve), you can try /proc/$pid/cmdline < 1535357302 246560 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the format of /proc/$pid/cmdline is nul-byte-separated and so completely unambiguous < 1535358065 382096 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: You can also read the source code of Linux or of any of the open source BSDs that emulates a linux-like /proc interface. I did that to make sure that that counter somewhere in /proc that counts the number of times a new process was created was 64-bit so it can't overflow. < 1535358247 213490 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The counter is the line with "processes" in /proc/stat < 1535358719 431044 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: gcc optimize endian: in some cases yes, but it's hard to tell which those cases are, so it's easier to just steal the macro definitions from http://software.schmorp.de/pkg/libev.html , which define sane endianness swapping operations calling builtins on many compilers including gcc and msvc, and falling back to portable C on others. < 1535358799 999497 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can also point to like five other libraries that give you endianness interface, including https://www.boost.org/doc/libs/1_68_0/libs/endian/doc/index.html , but I can't vouch for their quality, < 1535358927 816341 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas I have examined libev in detail and have worked with schmorp on some of libev's integer code, and I know its code is excellent. < 1535358950 835303 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, wrong library. < 1535358961 27600 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Instead of libev, I mean http://software.schmorp.de/pkg/libecb.html < 1535358967 121735 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ignore libev for this discussion. < 1535358998 906270 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :You want the functions ecb_bswap16 < 1535359026 298352 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :, ecb_bswap32, ecb_bswap64, ecb_big_endian, ecb_little_endian. < 1535359084 132046 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also wanted to add macro functions for reading/writing unaligned integers, but eventually schmorp convinced me that malloc is the best solution for that, compilers already optimize it really well and it has exactly correct semantics in C and C++, my solutions were more complicated and not better. < 1535359691 739948 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric < 1535359756 409664 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds < 1535359949 521818 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yes, the operation was called EOR and IOR back then, for exclusive and inclusive or. It's not xclusive to 6502. < 1535359959 187728 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :People started "xor" later. < 1535359974 351044 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know when "iff" and "ssi" started. < 1535360026 698447 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@natx-145.kulnet.kuleuven.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1535361032 9433 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :"iff" is nxor; wtf is "ssi"? < 1535361061 555683 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Most of my assembly exposure was intel x86, hence 'xor' rather than 'eor') < 1535361089 262397 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: You were playing that one assembly game. < 1535361091 330324 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What was it called? < 1535361157 482070 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Which one, box-256, tis100, shenzhen I/O? Or the old hugi competitions? < 1535361182 959342 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Box-256, I think that was it. < 1535361191 3490 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: "ssi" is "iff" in french < 1535361210 58084 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I ssi, err see. < 1535361424 863031 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I think "iff" in the bitwise logic version is called "xnor" or "equ" rather than "nxor", but I'm not sure < 1535362137 130019 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: I think you're right... and it's confusing :P < 1535362193 466549 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(exclusive neither-nor?) < 1535363328 695527 :atslash!~atslash@broadband-46-188-0-82.2com.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1535363386 850497 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1535363800 168073 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: "exclusive nor". sounds better than "nexclusive or". < 1535363860 113760 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, let me check what the MMIX bitwise instructions call it... it has all 8 bitwise instructions, not just the 4 ones that are invariant to zeros < 1535363930 897551 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: I've been trained to think logically... :P < 1535363941 966166 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :MMIX calls in NXOR < 1535363985 997507 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the eight are OR ORN NOR XOR AND ANDN NAND NXOR < 1535364003 127393 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in that case there's good precedent to call it "nxor". sorry. < 1535364014 94121 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: sorry < 1535364069 822103 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the text gives the short name "bitwise not-exclusive-or" to that instr < 1535364149 448495 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the text might have changed in the final version, not likely, but if you want I can check at home where I have the up to date book; the instruction mnemonic can't have changed because that would break compat with MMIXAL programs whose syntax were fixed at that time < 1535364695 976319 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, seems unlikely < 1535364718 456403 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that the text changed from the pre-fascicle to the published fascicle) < 1535365417 275008 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in any case, "bitwise not-exclusive-or" is definitely not a so silly name that nobody would ever use it < 1535368426 948577 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1535373942 58871 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Later < 1535375628 411020 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1535375671 191659 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@messages? < 1535375671 278090 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have 1 new message. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read it. < 1535375676 51287 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@messages < 1535375799 322952 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ai523 < 1535376065 189841 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a question < 1535376086 4739 :vertrex!~vertrex@unaffiliated/vertrex QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1535376441 648072 :vertrex!~vertrex@digital-forensic.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1535376442 230285 :vertrex!~vertrex@digital-forensic.org QUIT :Changing host < 1535376442 230352 :vertrex!~vertrex@unaffiliated/vertrex JOIN :#esoteric < 1535376612 741311 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"don't ask to ask, just ask" < 1535376627 479280 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh damn < 1535376638 469463 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's kind-of pointless to attract someone's attention to say you're going to ask a question, and then not ask it, because there's nothing they can actually do with their attention on the channel < 1535376642 451349 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I asked on #nethack4, then noticed you're not joined there. Join there, or should I ask here? < 1535376651 62073 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, you are joined there < 1535376651 576277 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, I am there < 1535376655 504845 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm stupid < 1535376660 99821 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just checked #esoteric first < 1535377232 434758 :sleepnap!~thomas@2603:3015:260e:1900::13ed JOIN :#esoteric < 1535378534 55001 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xprirmeoxafyucqz JOIN :#esoteric < 1535379186 684502 :vertrex!~vertrex@unaffiliated/vertrex QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1535379299 700845 :vertrex!~vertrex@digital-forensic.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1535379300 283128 :vertrex!~vertrex@digital-forensic.org QUIT :Changing host < 1535379300 283169 :vertrex!~vertrex@unaffiliated/vertrex JOIN :#esoteric < 1535382199 646516 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@46.191.210.223 JOIN :#esoteric < 1535382368 461938 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1535382631 86228 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1535382991 527400 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client < 1535384169 483392 :bradcomp!~bradcomp@38.104.142.186 JOIN :#esoteric < 1535384204 553129 :ep100_!~max@105.187.34.208 JOIN :#esoteric < 1535385414 711494 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@natx-145.kulnet.kuleuven.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1535385489 43556 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: quit < 1535385833 380805 :digitalcold!~redacted@unaffiliated/digitalcold JOIN :#esoteric < 1535387023 969259 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zcb1dmnmcpyztw.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1535387038 159102 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am making a graphics extension for SQLite. Currently I have functions GR_BLANK, GR_HCONCAT, GR_HEIGHT, GR_TEXT, GR_VCONCAT, GR_WIDTH, RGB8, RGBA8, RGB16, RGBA16, but I intend eventually will also add functions for making pie charts and other data graphics too (possibly as aggregate functions). < 1535387048 152550 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :@messages-loud < 1535387048 262572 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie said 1d 7h 31m 8s ago: I don't think you can. No matter which value q you choose to correspond to the first non-empty byte string ("\0"?), q/2 is a smaller rational and should've been chosen < 1535387048 262609 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead. < 1535387048 262618 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan said 1d 4h 41m 57s ago: Can you make a correspondence between all byte strings and all rational numbers (or, possibly, all rational numbers whose denominator is a power of two), and < 1535387048 262640 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :have the proper ordering? <-- i think not; there are strings with no elements between them, like "" and "\0" < 1535387092 565594 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like this graphics extension? (Note: The extension to display the graphics on the screen is a separate extension (already released, as "sqlext_xwindows"), since it uses Xlib.) < 1535387901 965856 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :A function to convert a picture into Sixel format may also be helpful, in case you wish to display the picture inline rather than a separate window. < 1535387913 124613 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1535389456 182636 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xprirmeoxafyucqz QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity > 1535390588 167584 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Math++14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=57487&oldid=53054 5* 03SuperJedi224 5* (+141) 10 < 1535392227 855541 :zseri!~zseri@i5E86C49A.versanet.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1535392254 376651 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1535392390 374918 :ep100_!~max@105.187.34.208 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1535392451 852418 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric < 1535392539 375671 :ep100_!~max@105.187.34.208 JOIN :#esoteric < 1535393407 860268 :zseri!~zseri@i5E86C49A.versanet.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :@messages < 1535393407 940518 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :You don't have any messages < 1535393957 722587 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1535394708 666646 :void_!~void@p2003008869014D00E5B5AF19EE700BEE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1535394768 944315 :void_!~void@p2003008869014D00E5B5AF19EE700BEE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de QUIT :Client Quit < 1535396652 792764 :iCantBePepperdin!~DaydreamL@pool-96-239-74-137.nycmny.east.verizon.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1535396741 542483 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1535397211 711187 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1535397624 874394 :Shragazord!~quassel@bzq-109-67-85-18.red.bezeqint.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1535397752 772344 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Quit: brb < 1535397955 688809 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric > 1535398346 317355 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Alphabet Stew14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=57488&oldid=57287 5* 03DMC 5* (+57) 10/* Description */ < 1535399150 660359 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric < 1535399549 326640 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lol I figured out this bug only because of my memorization of the numberic values of ascii chaacters < 1535399597 571557 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just happen to know that !"#$ are the first 4 ascii < 1535399896 493233 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :> [' '..'0'] < 1535399898 544531 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : " !\"#$%&'()*+,-./0" < 1535401044 211368 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-moglmmuatblbqadu JOIN :#esoteric < 1535401081 579366 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1535401151 533060 :xkapastel!~user@142.93.249.241 QUIT :Quit: ERC (IRC client for Emacs 24.5.1) < 1535401165 20249 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-tmspihdjivruouxs JOIN :#esoteric < 1535401926 429925 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1535402285 948127 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1535402334 703885 :sleepnap!~thomas@2603:3015:260e:1900::13ed QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1535402440 552242 :tswett!d047504c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.208.71.80.76 JOIN :#esoteric < 1535402571 40860 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still think C++ syntax for pure virtual fucntions is retarded < 1535402578 40139 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric := 0; < 1535402582 796615 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1535402670 800102 :tswett!d047504c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.208.71.80.76 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've always thought that generally, esolangs should be designed with the best and clearest syntax possible. < 1535402677 370204 :tswett!d047504c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.208.71.80.76 PRIVMSG #esoteric :This means, of course, that C++ fails to meet esolang standards. < 1535403397 69440 :tswett!d047504c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.208.71.80.76 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, competition time. < 1535403402 984857 :tswett!d047504c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.208.71.80.76 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Invent the best esolang based on aviation. < 1535403433 636139 :tswett!d047504c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.208.71.80.76 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The prize is a free ride in a glider, assuming that I have a commercial pilot's license by the time you make it to Richmond Field on a day that I'm flying there. < 1535403439 315771 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: that will never fly < 1535403451 140409 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: let tswett have this flight of fancy < 1535403477 606334 :tswett!d047504c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.208.71.80.76 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you guys need to take the ten thousand foot view. < 1535403480 559374 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: fair enough but I don't want to be here when it comes crashing down < 1535403497 305160 :tswett!d047504c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.208.71.80.76 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think this idea could really take off. < 1535403562 163482 :tswett!d047504c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.208.71.80.76 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's all a matter of having the right attitude. < 1535403646 167910 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@46.191.210.223 PRIVMSG #esoteric :altitude? < 1535403689 64910 :zseri!~zseri@i5E86C49A.versanet.de QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1535403747 719436 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@46.191.210.223 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(personally IDK anything about aviation but that dispatching all that is really hard on people doing it and that they do it well, so there’s less incidents than with cars etc.) < 1535403811 938638 :tswett!d047504c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.208.71.80.76 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I have a completely different idea. < 1535403825 329948 :tswett!d047504c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.208.71.80.76 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to create the fastest video game ever created. < 1535403850 455277 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :GAME OVER < 1535403858 588941 :tswett!d047504c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.208.71.80.76 PRIVMSG #esoteric :You click on "start", and the Big Bang happens, and you guide the entire evolution of the universe until its heat death 20 seconds later. < 1535404054 848221 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@46.191.210.223 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it possible to base an esolang on keyboard cleaning procedures? I’ve cleaned mine and it was as usual full of cat hair and crumbs of something, and I have finally realized how the Enter key is supposed to be fixed correctly (there are staple-like things which allow the key to press more stable) < 1535404104 39628 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@46.191.210.223 PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: too hard, interesting parts would be unnoticeable < 1535404229 53085 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1535404846 730503 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1535405966 398818 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1535406297 335285 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1535407270 977824 :contrapumpkin!~copumpkin@haskell/developer/copumpkin JOIN :#esoteric < 1535407317 723445 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@haskell/developer/copumpkin QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1535407425 513201 :ep100_!~max@105.187.34.208 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1535407486 438854 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds < 1535407788 818071 :Melvar!~melvar@2.203.38.71 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1535407911 312346 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-002-203-038-071.002.203.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1535408109 954429 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zcb1dmnmcpyztw.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1535408931 800602 :LKoen_!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1535408960 878986 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1535409013 110705 :LKoen_!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net QUIT :Client Quit < 1535409020 663241 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1535409251 796295 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1535410071 472086 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1535410319 196998 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1535410431 700575 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1535410560 773330 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1535410589 400470 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1535410680 478175 :bradcomp!~bradcomp@38.104.142.186 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1535410738 160257 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1535411602 331928 :atslash!~atslash@broadband-46-188-0-82.2com.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1535411672 405374 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1535411926 360916 :atslash!~atslash@broadband-46-188-0-82.2com.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds < 1535411978 775308 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1535411985 969064 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@46.191.210.223 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1535412002 720105 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@46.191.210.223 JOIN :#esoteric < 1535412123 715640 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1535412438 66935 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.” < 1535413398 735578 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1535413814 650442 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1535414000 796767 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ QUIT :Quit: CHEAPIE! What did you do to the bouncer?! :P (jk) < 1535414011 717731 :rdococ!rdococ@cheapiesystems.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1535414032 425930 :rdococ!rdococ@cheapiesystems.com QUIT :Changing host < 1535414032 448458 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ JOIN :#esoteric