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03:02:48 <esowiki> [[Underload]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=57499&oldid=55737 * Ais523 * (-17) /* Underload minimization */ golf the definition of ~ in terms of ()a!:*^
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03:04:06 <Sgeo> https://github.com/gergoerdi/brainfuck64
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04:42:45 <oerjan> ^ul (x)(y)aaa(!)(aa(!))(*a*:*^!*^):*^SSS
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12:17:46 <ais523> @message oerjan the trick with the shorter Underload swap is to realise that ~ is really not the most fundamental primitive; the actual primitive here is ~a*^ (which I think of as _), and you can implement ~ as a_
12:17:46 <lambdabot> Maybe you meant: messages messages-loud messages?
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12:18:05 <ais523> @tell oerjan the trick with the shorter Underload swap is to realise that ~ is really not the most fundamental primitive; the actual primitive here is ~a*^ (which I think of as _), and you can implement ~ as a_
12:20:15 <ais523> @tell oerjan for any constant K, (K)_ can be written as aa(!)(K)*a*:*^!*^, so to implement _ on an element taken from the stack, we can use (aa(!))_ to push the aa(!) before the element in question, everything else is easy from there
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17:13:34 <zzo38> I added another file format decoder into Farbfeld Utilities, this time for MegaPaint format.
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18:57:36 <esowiki> [[Vrty]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=57500 * FAKE1007 * (+1219) Created page with "'''Vrty''' is an esoteric programming language by ~~~. It is an attempt on a good programming language that you can write easy programs on. Made in 2018. By the way, the devel..."
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20:03:11 <arseniiv> they don’t even hint what’s eso in that lang
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20:09:27 <Sgeo> The author of TempleOS might be dead (not sure if confirmed yet)
20:11:44 <int-e> HolyC is a terrible pun
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21:10:30 <wob_jonas> hi guys. I got my second wisdom tooth extraction yesterday. it went much better than the first one seven years ago. I still have to be careful for a while with the wound in my mouth, but it was much better.
21:11:28 <wob_jonas> The tooth came out quickly and unbroken, I only got one stitch, I didn't need to take any painkillers after, and my cheek doesn't look like I'm holding a tennis ball in my mouth at all.
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21:14:38 <wob_jonas> I will need a third wisdom tooth extracted, but that will likely be two months from now, to leave time for this to heal completely.
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21:23:19 <zzo38> Do you like sqlext_graph?
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21:35:25 <wob_jonas> zzo38: where are your sql extensions again? anyway, I don't see why I'd like to combine sqlite with drawing graphs. there are already standalone programs for drawing graphs, like gnuplot, and I can feed them a text file and give commands with a text file. I've written advanced programs controlling gnuplot.
21:35:49 <wob_jonas> I think I could read from a database and write the data to a text file (or text pipe) and use gnuplot that way too.
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21:39:04 <zzo38> http://zzo38computer.org/sql/sqlite.txt
21:40:56 <wob_jonas> zzo38: have you tried Scryfall's API yet? you know, the M:tG database
21:43:16 <zzo38> I have not, although I have looked at it, and sqlext_curl can be used to perform downloads from internet. I am not sure how to present the data by SQL tables, or what constraints to implement (some features of Scryfall would be difficult to implement in the SQLite virtual table mechanism).
21:44:30 <wob_jonas> zzo38: I don't want a virtual table mechanism, I just want a way to scrape most of the text data about cards (not the images) and store it locally, in a way that I can easily repeat four times a year.
21:45:08 <zzo38> You could just download the JSON then, I suppose, but then is not as good for querying the data.
21:45:55 <zzo38> What I want is support for incremental updates, but it look Scryfall doesn't have that.
21:46:00 <wob_jonas> zzo38: sure, I'll then parse the JSON (I have used a JSON parser before) and massage to some better format, possibly a database
21:46:26 <wob_jonas> zzo38: downloading all the text data without the images every three months isn't too bad, so the incremental updates isn't important
21:46:52 <wob_jonas> you'd need more frequently than that only if you wanted more up to date price data, but I don't think you need that
21:47:47 <zzo38> I don't need price data, at least
21:52:45 <zzo38> Do you like window functions?
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21:53:48 <wob_jonas> zzo38: I still don't really understand how they work. I haven't dug through their docs yet.
22:09:33 <zzo38> I think I know how they work, but I have not tried it. (I will try it once the next version of SQLite is released.)
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22:24:09 <wob_jonas> I sent a feature request to sqlite3.
22:24:55 <wob_jonas> We'll find out later how they react.
22:25:13 <wob_jonas> I'm requesting a new builtin function.
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22:29:05 <zzo38> What new builtin function?
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22:30:29 <wob_jonas> zzo38: https://www.mail-archive.com/sqlite-users@mailinglists.sqlite.org/msg111795.html
22:32:40 <zzo38> Yes, it is easier to make synonyms of the existing functions in the core rather than extensions.
22:33:51 <zzo38> However, I looked at the Microsoft documentation linked; the WITHIN GROUP clause is something I would want for ordinary aggregate functions (currently only window functions can have their own ORDER BY clause; I wanted a ORDER BY clause for ordinary aggregate functions before, too, but did not know what syntax it should be).
22:36:09 <zzo38> Still, I do not think it necessary to add another alias of an existing function there, but it might be worth while I don't know.
22:40:28 <zzo38> PostgreSQL allows the ORDER BY clause inside of the argument list, which I think is probably better and what I thought of at first.
22:44:30 <wob_jonas> zzo38: I think it might be better to have something that's like an ORDER BY clause for the SELECT query but that sorts the contents of each aggregate groups for all aggregate group (or all rows found if there's no GROUP BY) for aggregate functions iterating over the rows in that query.
22:45:38 <wob_jonas> zzo38: so in a SELECT statement, HAVING filters whole aggregate groups, ORDER BY sorts whole aggregate groups, WHEN filters individual rows before they're aggregated, and there could be one to sort rows before they're aggregated.
22:46:29 <wob_jonas> And then you could also add aggregate functions that take the value from the first row, the last row, or the nth row from the aggregate.
22:49:45 <zzo38> There are already window functions for the first row, last row, etc, but these functions cannot be used as ordinary aggregate functions.
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22:52:04 <wob_jonas> zzo38: you could also define custom aggregate functions for selecting a value from the first row sorted on any number of an extra set of values, eg. first_by(x,y,z) would select the value of x from the row where (y,z) is the lexicographically smallest, and that would still be useful and you could use different orderings in the same query,
22:52:28 <wob_jonas> except you can't make that use the string collation function of the y and z columns implicitly, but most of the time you don't care about that.
22:52:56 <wob_jonas> You wouldn't need window functions for that.
22:53:20 <wob_jonas> It gets ugly because you might want to sort DESC on some of the values, and it's harder to find a good syntax for that
22:53:46 <wob_jonas> you'd probably need a version that takes an extra argument to tell which columns you want to sort DESC by
22:54:44 <zzo38> Yes, that is why I think you should just use a ORDER BY clause in the argument list, with the words ORDER BY; even with GROUP_CONCAT function you might want ORDER BY
22:56:42 <zzo38> The window function is "first_value" and if made a aggregate function to write for example: first_value(x ORDER BY y,z)
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23:03:29 <esowiki> [[Vrty]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=57501&oldid=57500 * FAKE1007 * (+2)
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23:25:46 <wob_jonas> zzo38: I see. Although on second thought, to get the first from a group like (SELECT t.u, first_value(t.x ORDER BY t.y, t.z) AS xf FROM mytable AS t GROUP BY t.u),
23:25:48 <wob_jonas> you could currently use a subquery like (SELECT t.u, (SELECT i.x FROM mytable AS i WHERE i.u = t.u ORDER BY i.y, i.z) AS xf FROM t GROUP BY t.u)
23:29:23 <wob_jonas> I think SQLite can optimize that pretty well if you add the right index, like CREATE INDEX ... ON t(u, y, z, x);
23:29:50 <wob_jonas> no, that should be CREATE INDEX ... ON mytable(u, y, z, x);
23:30:19 <wob_jonas> and the query with the subquery should be (SELECT t.u, (SELECT i.x FROM mytable AS i WHERE i.u = t.u ORDER BY i.y, i.z) AS xf FROM mytable AS t GROUP BY t.u)
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23:31:23 <wob_jonas> and of course you can extend that with additional result columns, ORDER BY and HAVING and WHERE clauses etc, you just may have to repeat the HAVING for both the inner and outer query
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