< 1545177602 184108 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't find it < 1545177627 999338 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, it might be here < 1545177759 101832 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, here it is < 1545177821 414629 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1545177834 975769 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :no wait < 1545177863 248605 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it looks like for comparisons, I copy the value of the comparison indictor into the next statement < 1545177873 643779 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but why? there's a double indirection < 1545177908 151409 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't the double indirection enough to just conditional jump in one instruction? < 1545177971 452090 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, if $a[1] is 2 when the source is read, then $a[$a[1]] is the comparison indicator, and $a[$a[$a[1]]] is the instruction pointer for a false comparison, and a scratch cell for a true comparison < 1545178028 531708 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, obviously then you want 1 in the comparison indicator because -1 is not a safe scratch cell < 1545178036 678420 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the terminator 0 for the input is in 1 < 1545178045 459496 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I could have used 1 in the comparison indicator easily < 1545178146 520887 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :strange < 1545178159 184493 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well, it's a very old and bad code < 1545178164 2751 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :would probably do it better now < 1545178169 570109 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, let me check this subskin quickly < 1545178173 717181 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's getting late < 1545178178 577364 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :simpler subskin < 1545178263 933200 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah, this Simpler subskin is harder to program, because the control flow is conditionally skipping the next instruction and a single big loop around the program < 1545178289 842951 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: also the code and data are separate, so you can't write self-modifying code, and there's no indirection < 1545178310 683048 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: so if I understand correctly, this one can only access a limited amount of cells, so you need bignum magic to store data < 1545178310 729710 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: right, it's very much a tarpit-of-OISCs < 1545178314 548009 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1545178328 906417 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the trick is, it should run at full speed /despite/ the bignum magic < 1545178330 762308 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, that is very different from the kind of OISC that I was thinking of < 1545178347 638200 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure what the best control flow is, but I definitely wanted something that can do indirect memory access < 1545178347 787077 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as you can simulate all three main stack operations (push 0, push 1, pop) in constant time each < 1545178361 91178 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :which can be done either by code and data in the same space or a built-in indirection < 1545178370 672366 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah < 1545178412 377956 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but only as much speed as you get with a compile time bounded number of stacks or tapes < 1545178415 400207 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :not more < 1545178426 450182 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want indirection to have random access to memory < 1545178445 436805 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that I need that for the example program, it's just that that's the kind of OISC I was thinking of < 1545178458 623049 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously there are a lot of those already < 1545178468 479198 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's even a three-instruction version I think < 1545178483 939154 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :one that can subtract, do some bitwise operation, and conditional jump < 1545178492 513310 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe it's one instruction with four arguments < 1545178523 319435 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :RAM0, perhaps? although that can't do subtraction without a loop < 1545178554 390754 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah, this Simpler Subskin with the counters and subtraction is worth documenting, at least if it's really TC with that control structure < 1545178568 207037 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what it reminds me of is that IOCCC language < 1545178592 206552 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the one that only has a big loop, no control structure, but add, subtract, multiply and divide on variables < 1545178602 824721 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Babbage analytical engine language IOCCC 1992 buzzard1 http://www.de.ioccc.org/years-spoiler.html#1992_buzzard.1 < 1545178635 337631 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's on my TODO on https://esolangs.org/wiki/User:B_jonas because it deserves at least a stub on Esoteric < 1545178636 549262 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: heh, I invented that one independently for a Stack Exchange competition, and called it Blindfolded Arithmetic < 1545178699 58256 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :to program in that one, you use those four operations to implement comparison with 0 and 1 result, then conditional assign using that and multiply, and that's the only control structure you get, but note that you can also multiple multiple comparison results together, so you can have nested conditionals < 1545178738 44049 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is helpful because two levels of conditional and a big loop gets you a state machine to simulate goot < 1545178741 66159 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :goto < 1545178749 460265 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: wow < 1545178762 867083 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: now I'm curios, which Stack Exchange competition? < 1545178798 445744 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, I'll search "blindfolded" < 1545178818 74964 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm trying to search the page atm, and have been for the last minute or so < 1545178820 551803 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but my Internet sucks < 1545178828 358659 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :um... no, the search doesn't work for me either < 1545178832 991937 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's something on SE's side < 1545178834 736344 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :here: https://codegolf.stackexchange.com/a/162531 < 1545178844 888218 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://codegolf.stackexchange.com/questions/162290/escape-from-the-tarpit-cops/162531#162531 < 1545178888 793007 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that seems to be the one, I'll have to read it later < 1545178927 656164 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, seems to be very similar. I must comment then < 1545178991 417410 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :commented, but TODO self: read that < 1545179029 79597 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the exit condition is different, but that's minor < 1545179050 346238 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1545179132 765365 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, you don't have a plain assignment, but that's easy to simulate: instead of A=B; you write A-=A; A+=B; < 1545179151 182439 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1545179188 459139 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the "A -= A;" operation actually turns out to be an interesting special case in many of these small counter machines, as it's often the only way to break reversibility < 1545179244 565349 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and for comparison, if you know that A is nonnegative, then you can safely do B=A; B+=1; B/=B; B-=1; and then B is either 0 or 1 < 1545179258 934492 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, you restricted the number of variables, and don't even allow literals < 1545179262 45656 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's devious < 1545179280 898215 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :now whoever solves that has to prove that that number of memory cells is enough < 1545179291 276622 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and knowing you, you probably used the lowest number of memory cells that works < 1545179306 613694 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :you probably have to reserve one of them just to keep a constant 1 < 1545179319 23298 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is tricky < 1545179330 390471 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not even sure if I can prove five is enoguh < 1545179342 430373 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1545179353 257483 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :no wait, six < 1545179356 5785 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can reuse the input < 1545179365 517195 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe < 1545179377 829253 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a big loop, so reusing the input isn't trivial < 1545179424 987446 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me think, I need one cell for constant 1, two scratch cells for two comparisons like above, and then you can do two-counter Minsky with the other two I think < 1545179437 441066 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1545179440 327411 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving... < 1545179456 91548 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1545179464 25915 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :how does the binary stack pop work? < 1545179493 717946 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: in which language? simpler subskin, or blindfolded arithmetic? < 1545179506 274536 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :blindfolded arithmetic. I'll work it out: < 1545179591 478635 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :S is the stack, I is the constant 1; then B=S; I+=I; S/=I; S+=S; B-=S; S/=I; I/=I; then B is the bottom bit and S the popped stack < 1545179619 121011 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and push 0 is just; S+=S; and push 1 is S+=S; S+=I; < 1545179647 625780 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then I still need one more variable < 1545179691 413799 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I need two stacks for TC, two comparison indicators and a state indicator to implement the state machine < 1545179719 968107 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless I can bootstrap copy from the input to a stack with one less variables somehow < 1545179723 589381 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that seems hard < 1545179732 413957 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: darn, this is tricky < 1545179739 63005 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: don't tell the solution yet, I'll want to think about this < 1545179743 565915 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice puzzle < 1545179788 255258 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.143.174.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1545180008 930935 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe two stacks isn't even the right approach, maybe only one variable stores the data but is accessed in a trickier way < 1545180122 288400 :nchambers!~nchambers@learnprogramming/staff/nchambers JOIN :#esoteric < 1545180212 402157 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could store 2 and 3 in ternary, and rotate cyclically < 1545180218 188792 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1545180219 558353 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1545180224 337761 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that might not work either < 1545180248 966867 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :TODO self: think about this and figure out how six variables, one storing input, are enough < 1545180256 484725 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm waity < 1545180263 446494 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me read the spec, can the input be encoded? < 1545180322 537369 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope, it can't be encoded < 1545180328 744611 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :must accept any positive integer as input < 1545180881 898704 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you don't have to handle input encoding you can do it in five :-) < 1545181089 125383 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, now I'm trying to optimise this myself, you've inspired me to see if I can use fewer variables via using a different approach < 1545181382 628529 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I have an idea < 1545181442 953003 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-76.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can probably do unconditional comparisons to add 2*(S%2) + 4*(S%4) + 8*(I 1545185916 161003 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hexlr714]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=58755 5* 03Cortex 5* (+3036) 10Created page with "'''Hexlr7''' is a language by [[User:Cortex]] on 12/18/2018, designed to be easy (but not too easy) to implement. Implementing it might be a good thing to do when bored and wi..." > 1545185966 824197 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hexlr714]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=58756&oldid=58755 5* 03Cortex 5* (+19) 10 < 1545186074 774446 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-dhvgizbcnawtrybw QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity < 1545187728 299254 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1545187908 257776 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric > 1545188033 988220 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Cortex14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=58757&oldid=58601 5* 03Cortex 5* (+40) 10 < 1545190157 526328 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1545190320 705119 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1545191073 510762 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: quit < 1545192759 130131 :salpynx!794954f8@gateway/web/freenode/ip.121.73.84.248 JOIN :#esoteric < 1545193949 622858 :salpynx!794954f8@gateway/web/freenode/ip.121.73.84.248 QUIT :Quit: Page closed < 1545193995 722396 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite < 1545194859 810640 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT : < 1545199406 437094 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1545200278 884604 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1545200710 819192 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.3 < 1545201282 594072 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-acewmbnvjvcemdiv JOIN :#esoteric < 1545201462 758206 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe QUIT :Quit: Hugs~ <3 < 1545201557 909713 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe JOIN :#esoteric < 1545201642 885939 :heroux!sandroco@gateway/shell/insomnia247/x-jmisisukfhidowuj QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1545201667 399504 :heroux!~heroux@gateway/shell/insomnia247/x-xzvazwhcawbnrvfm JOIN :#esoteric < 1545203338 346692 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: Going offline, see ya! (www.adiirc.com) < 1545203598 56767 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@haskell/developer/copumpkin QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1545203917 555745 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@haskell/developer/copumpkin JOIN :#esoteric < 1545204944 535626 :GeekDude!~G33kDude@unaffiliated/g33kdude QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1545205044 784997 :GeekDude!~G33kDude@unaffiliated/g33kdude JOIN :#esoteric < 1545208371 960480 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.143.174.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1545209924 855286 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds < 1545210236 335139 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1545212054 138250 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zcjpltykrbgmmx.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1545212654 710776 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-acewmbnvjvcemdiv QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity < 1545213108 454842 :doesthiswork!~Adium@131.191.115.81 QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1545215508 389164 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric < 1545215515 33529 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://esolangs.org/logs/ is still down :-( < 1545215555 263140 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me check codu < 1545215564 530185 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope, tunes < 1545215571 864369 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, tunes works > 1545215721 517355 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:The Waterfall Model14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=58758&oldid=58754 5* 03Salpynx 5* (+1242) 10Truth-machine candidate < 1545219306 664920 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hrm. < 1545219447 296157 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: I think you had bad timing. According to my monitoring, it was down (for me, anyway) from 11pm to 1am (UTC) over last night, and then from 10am to 11am this morning, but it should be up now. < 1545219451 803323 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Works for me, anyway. < 1545219477 653363 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :No idea what was wrong, though. I don't think the Prometheus blackbox probe saves any logs of failed attempts anywhere. :/ < 1545219497 740543 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1545219511 57874 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, it is up now < 1545219554 684587 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both times it's been down for almost exactly one hour (it was very briefly back up at midnight). So maybe there's some specific logs page that crashes the server, and it takes an hour to recover. < 1545219565 532977 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it's just /logs, I guess nginx error logs might have something. < 1545219573 520864 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: also, I think it didn't lose IRC connectivity, only the web interface was inaccessible. good. < 1545219602 330131 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, those are entirely separate binaries, one writes logfiles and the other serves them. < 1545219621 952662 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: sure, but I thought it was an error with accessing the network < 1545219647 6440 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if the web process crashed, then we should try to send all kinds of bytes and other strange text in the irc lines to try to reproduce it < 1545219665 207636 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that happens quite naturally on this channel. < 1545219666 876004 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :2018/12/18 23:09:49 [error] 28385#28385: *3568829 upstream timed out (110: Connection timed out) while reading response header from upstream, client: 66.160.140.184, server: esolangs.org, request: "GET /logs/2018-12-10-raw.txt HTTP/1.1", upstream: "http://127.0.0 < 1545219673 957659 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: right, but we want to localize the bug < 1545219675 794709 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :...I was going to redact that client IP. < 1545219684 757387 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :But my paste added a newline. < 1545219690 256386 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :In any case, not too informative. < 1545219704 531321 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know I had a bug in cbstream with characters that aren't valid cp1252 after perlmonks has officially and retroactively changed the encoding from iso-8859-1 to cp1252, because the XML decoding failed < 1545219727 723396 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :we fixed that on the perlmonks side, so that the emitted XML is valid XML 1.1, because it affected most XML parsers < 1545219752 178309 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :technically the output just wasn't valid XML, and it could happen with almost all the XML API of perlmonks, it all used the same quoting functino < 1545219765 523982 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it wasn't a problem with iso-8859-1 because all bytes are valid in that < 1545219794 793398 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so now perlmonks escapes those bytes to different existing high characters when emitting xml < 1545219811 78312 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :No logs output from the actual logs server, and the process doesn't seem to have died either. < 1545219834 697791 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Will have to look into this later, busy now. < 1545219838 592785 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so as long as your XML parser interprets cp1252 as the new cp1252 (MS changed it once or twice without renaming to add the four romanian disunified letters and the euro sign and maybe a few others) < 1545219865 629542 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I won't test this now, but will try to inject some strange characters here later < 1545219879 555315 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I think there are some people here who don't like that, because it "breaks their irc client" or something < 1545219904 142519 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the bot logs only this channel, right? no test channel I can experiment with < 1545219925 454857 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just this channel. < 1545219937 806130 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well, then it will break those people's IRC clients < 1545219967 486327 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The server's written around a single-threaded event loop, so it's possible some blocking operation has found its way in, that would probably result in no special logs but "connection timed out" errors from nginx. < 1545219991 14495 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ah, that's possible < 1545220034 41134 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't just hang it by throttling the read side of the HTTP TCP connection though, right? < 1545220041 851509 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I should test that < 1545220068 928422 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :though that needs some tricky network configuration, lowering my fragment size or something < 1545220513 391108 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: should I add a stub for https://codegolf.stackexchange.com/a/162531/6691 blindfolded arithmetic on esolangs wiki? or should I instead create a stub for the IOCCC language and mention your post there? < 1545220553 605403 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'll do the latter < 1545220629 871677 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, I wonder how it should call it. I don't want to call it just "Babbage analytical engine" because then someone might find assume that that's exactly what Babbage was planning, and that's not certain < 1545220652 387806 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :do we have some sort of systematic naming for IOCCC or ICFP contest esolangs? < 1545220678 840712 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, I dunno, IOCCC/1992_buzzard/0 or something > 1545220714 749102 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:B jonas14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=58759&oldid=58497 5* 03B jonas 5* (+60) 10 < 1545221352 964537 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( 8b12acb3e05c4a04c73bb9638af1d2277f94c195 ) < 1545221372 740027 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: hmm, a random name? sure, that's possible too < 1545221379 748467 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: it's not random. < 1545221398 132098 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although if I choose one, I'll use uppercase hexadecimals, or base64 encode or something, not lowercase hexadecimals < 1545221399 849590 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the output of sha1sum 1992/buzzard.1.c < 1545221438 281019 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: but why would I want that? "IOCCC/1992_buzzard/0" or variants of them are short enough < 1545221467 918087 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh darn < 1545221470 255900 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's content-addressable :P < 1545221476 756975 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would have to be "IOCCC/1992_buzzard.1/0" < 1545221505 760826 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :two buzzard entries that day, so "buzzard.1" is the name < 1545221516 93280 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/day/year/ < 1545221547 962310 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what's the last component? < 1545221584 90930 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: a disambiguator in case there's more than one language associated with the same IOCCC entry. that happens sometimes, though it's more common with ICFP contests. < 1545221603 544132 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: hmm, put differently, where do you put the hints? < 1545221621 669694 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and possibly other auxiliary files? < 1545221650 45820 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :tbh I think you should follow the file structure in the downloadable archives < 1545221682 119994 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :IOCCC/1992_buzzard.2 has two esolangs associated, and 2018_mills has two esolangs associated too < 1545221682 685532 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :then all you need is a prefix and IOCCC seems fine for that. < 1545221694 822850 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: yes, associating with the hint could work too < 1545221709 708649 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :match the higher level language with the hint file that implements it < 1545221750 946978 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: ok, we should do that, but IOCCC should be mentioned somewhere < 1545221781 565364 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I'm following the anchor name in http://www.ioccc.org/years.html#1992_buzzard.2 < 1545221791 152016 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: but downloadable archive may be better < 1545221948 332629 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :So IOCCC-1992-buzzard-1? hmmm. We have categories for years, and we might have one for IOCCC. I don't know. < 1545221975 99167 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: haven't I created that? or was that for ICFP contests? < 1545221990 935827 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, the latter. https://esolangs.org/wiki/Category:ICFP_contest < 1545225248 662556 :LKoen!~LKoen@78.245.243.132 JOIN :#esoteric < 1545226461 72942 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: Now that you mention it, it actually uses a third-party HTTP server (CivetWeb), which uses the thread-per-request (from a pool) model; it's just the rest that's of it that's event-loop-oriented. In any case, the issue might be either on CivetWeb's side (I'm not terribly impressed by it) or on my side. < 1545226470 581230 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although rendering "normal" log pages (like the index or a day/month) don't really involve the event loop side, it's only the stalker page which does. So if I've managed to get the event loop thread stuck, that shouldn't prevent the rest of it from working. < 1545226537 508605 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also turns out my local respository has like a billion uncommitted changes, I was in the middle of migrating the zem.fi bfjoust site to be a part of the esolangs.org infrastructure (integrating into the existing bot), and just got sidetracked and never finished that. < 1545226639 822182 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ok < 1545226659 66535 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the meantime, thank you for maintaining this < 1545226667 317871 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know how tricky that can be < 1545226702 649601 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will have to try to start to fix cbstream during the Christmas break, i.e. rewrite the whole darned thing and prepare to reinstall the hosting server < 1545226721 755601 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly even get a new hosting server for myself in the longer term or something < 1545226723 149604 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I maintain it in fits and starts, once every few months. :) < 1545226776 431964 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still haven't managed to figure out what "Dec 19 11:58:34 techne.zem.fi esobot[19709]: [140B blob data]" means in systemctl status. There's a few messages like that per day. < 1545226776 840274 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, it's just that cbstream and the hosting server are so old and dusty and bitrotten, that I'll have to purge them with fire or something < 1545226785 582167 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps get a flamethrower < 1545226821 302271 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think these correspond to the wiki updates, actually. So maybe that code path outputs something. < 1545226830 82937 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :140 bytes? hehe. cbstream has a binary log that stores 8 bytes per request, and there's normally one request per 30 seconds < 1545226852 948498 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, maybe it duplicates the wiki update to stdout for debugging, and systemd is offended by the command characters for the colors. < 1545226857 419469 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll probably change the format if I rewrite cbstream though < 1545226872 484018 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and make the new version of the decoder program handle both formats < 1545226890 662903 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOG(INFO) << "wiki message: " << msg; < 1545226894 282287 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that's one mystery solved. < 1545226899 811637 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1545226907 172576 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that goes to systemctl? < 1545226909 991786 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1545226927 751862 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's run under systemd as a service, so it captures the stdout and writes it to wherever. < 1545226934 20601 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(systemd is such a black box.) < 1545226943 314081 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1545227027 488474 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it's nice that you don't have to worry about timestamping, logfiles, log rotation or any of that stuff, you just write to stdout. < 1545227069 459204 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the data is stored in some binary journal somewhere, and I can't for the life of me remember the journalctl command syntax. Fortunately "systemctl status" prints a snippet, and that's usually enough. < 1545227232 439756 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : /topic < 1545227234 941931 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhm < 1545227256 359195 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, I should process the binary log file to be able to provide a more precise estimate on request, since part of the point of fixing cbstream is to be able to say "over 10 years, over 20 users" in my CV < 1545227282 498368 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I added the logfile later, so the first few years are probably missing < 1545227305 574064 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but still < 1545228024 261647 :doesthiswork!~Adium@131.191.115.81 JOIN :#esoteric < 1545228448 916375 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client < 1545228977 396193 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric < 1545229397 574563 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`echo qqlEwBAcGc1ZO6Lo96VwWTpTjzGss5mINX1TnM1BGYrSr5RgVslI63092oo0Tc1o < 1545229398 271037 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :qqlEwBAcGc1ZO6Lo96VwWTpTjzGss5mINX1TnM1BGYrSr5RgVslI63092oo0Tc1o < 1545229910 728954 :Luciole!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :and what does it base64 -d as? < 1545230249 519165 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` base64 -d << 1545235385 469378 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Zcstr 5* 10New user account > 1545236252 124635 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=58760&oldid=58696 5* 03Zcstr 5* (+188) 10 < 1545238747 898017 :LKoen!~LKoen@78.245.243.132 QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.” < 1545239166 755412 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1545240649 863000 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1545241447 287876 :GeekDude!~G33kDude@unaffiliated/g33kdude QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1545241447 555339 :doesthiswork!~Adium@131.191.115.81 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1545241447 669948 :doesthiswork1!~Adium@131.191.115.81 JOIN :#esoteric < 1545241528 549982 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.3 < 1545242106 110237 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1545243422 664698 :Essadon!~Essadon@81-225-32-185-no249.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1545243753 790023 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1545243994 693782 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1545245146 244563 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-13-163.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric < 1545245220 791603 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-13-163.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: thank you for linking to the blindfolded arithmetic thing, it's interesting. I'll have to write down the details to check, but I think you're right in that it can simulate a two-stack machine as you define it. < 1545245245 482371 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-13-163.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact I'm starting to think that we can even spare one register, or simulate a three-stack machine, but I'm not certain yet < 1545245301 587321 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-13-163.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's possible to reuse (i-1) as another stack, because at the start of the program, we can copy its data, converting from base 2 to say base 4, to the stack d, all the while keeping i positive, and we don't need an extra stack during that, < 1545245326 276282 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-13-163.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and after that we can start to use (i-1) as a second stack, distinguishing between the states using the value of c, < 1545245359 121989 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-13-163.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'll have to check if this is really possible, where it could go wrong is that we might need an extra scratch register in some stack < 1545245364 29622 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-13-163.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/some stack/some step/ < 1545245778 99814 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-13-163.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the tricky part is actually the equality check for the state register, I'll have to write down later how exactly that is done < 1545246118 309506 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-13-163.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, that should be possible too. just keep all state numbers divisible by 4, temporarily add (1-S) to c, then a=1/c tests if the original c was equal to S, then restore c. < 1545246194 870545 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-13-163.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :then a is 1 if the state is equal to S, 0 otherwise, and you use that to do the push or pop in that state only < 1545246197 257135 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1545246201 106464 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-13-163.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :should work < 1545246733 80634 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :something I'm starting to wonder... is there a tree version of RDF rather than a graph version? < 1545246818 871409 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-13-163.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact I'll have to think it can probably be done with just four variables. < 1545248691 752686 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1545248746 538462 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-13-163.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1545248922 798020 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds < 1545250559 698369 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric < 1545251327 484323 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1545251618 269139 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.3 < 1545252578 66808 :Essadon!~Essadon@81-225-32-185-no249.tbcn.telia.com QUIT :Read error: No route to host < 1545252917 713964 :Essadon!~Essadon@81-225-32-185-no249.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1545252935 429812 :Essadon!~Essadon@81-225-32-185-no249.tbcn.telia.com QUIT :Max SendQ exceeded < 1545252992 126432 :salpynx!794954f8@gateway/web/freenode/ip.121.73.84.248 JOIN :#esoteric < 1545253428 58063 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ztaknddrwepdkgsk JOIN :#esoteric < 1545255212 146709 :moony_!4b6c6ba6@hellomouse/dev/moony JOIN :#esoteric < 1545256396 677210 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds > 1545256949 769243 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Joke language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=58761&oldid=58567 5* 03Cortex 5* (+13) 10/* Example-based languages */ < 1545258823 131619 :moony_!4b6c6ba6@hellomouse/dev/moony QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1545259380 957011 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1545260498 183198 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zcjpltykrbgmmx.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds < 1545262396 839101 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ztaknddrwepdkgsk QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity < 1545262898 977249 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.143.174.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1545263020 23568 :sleepnap!~thomas@2603:3015:260e:1900::13ed PART :#esoteric < 1545263642 977226 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric