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01:20:15 <oerjan> @tell b_jonas the :()^!~ construction that i wrote up before removing ~ is pretty much exactly such a two-stack machine as you mention.
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01:48:41 <esowiki> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Brianush1 * New user account
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02:51:45 <zzo38> What exactly are you supposed to pass as the index for the XLookupKeysym and XKeycodeToKeysym functions? It says "Specifies the index into the KeySyms list for the event's KeyCode", but I don't know what index it is supposed to be.
03:03:55 <fizzie> I think I've called at least one of those functions. I believe it's the index to the list of the various keysyms attached to that specific keycode for the different combinations of modifier keys.
03:04:10 <fizzie> So with an index of 0, you'll get the entirely unshifted keysym.
03:04:44 <fizzie> In other words, the column of the "xmodmap -pk" list.
03:05:51 <fizzie> Or if not directly the column in that table, at least something related.
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03:29:11 <zzo38> How to figure out the index needed for a given set of modifier keys?
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04:11:10 <int-e> bad pun time: Building gadgets for Valiant's theorem is a permanent struggle.
04:11:58 <int-e> (This one: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sharp-P-completeness_of_01-permanent )
04:13:08 * oerjan valiantly swats int-e -----###
04:14:22 <shachaf> first swat in almost a month
04:14:29 <int-e> I did improve Valiant's "junction" gadget though.
04:16:01 <HackEso> Your omnidryad saddle principal ideal golfing toe-obsessed "Darth Ook" oerjan the shifty evil grinch is a punctual expert in minor compaction. Also a Groadep who minces Roald Dahl. He could never remember the word "amortized" so he put it here for convenience. His ark-nemesis is Noah. He twice punned without noticing it.
04:16:25 <shachaf> I was going to add "fungal overlord" but there's already a mushroom in there.
04:17:11 <esowiki> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Norskie7 * New user account
04:17:20 <oerjan> there isn't room for mush there
04:19:01 <esowiki> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=58918&oldid=58876 * Norskie7 * (+183)
04:19:11 <int-e> ... But I'd like to come up with a clause gadget from scratch and I may not be able to. Hence the struggle.
04:19:47 <shachaf> int-e: Wait, computing a permanent is NP-hard?
04:19:54 <oerjan> lisp worst syntax known to man? someone's innocent...
04:20:24 <esowiki> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=58919&oldid=58918 * Norskie7 * (+85)
04:21:49 <int-e> shachaf: Yes. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toda%27s_theorem is even more mind-boggling (a #P oracle gives you all the power of the polynomial hierarchy)
04:22:37 <oerjan> . o O ( shachaf will be permanently boggled )
04:22:40 <int-e> As I learned last week.
04:22:53 <shachaf> I vaguely knew #P gave you a lot but I kind of expected computing permanent to be similar to computing determinant.
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04:24:40 <int-e> also: beware the sharp swatter -----♯♯♯
04:25:51 <HackEso> [U+266F MUSIC SHARP SIGN] [U+0050 LATIN CAPITAL LETTER P]
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04:26:37 <oerjan> hm the article you linked uses # but not the ♯P article itself
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04:30:25 <oerjan> seems a change from last year
04:31:29 <shachaf> define a computational class S
04:31:41 <shachaf> and then you can talk about things that are ß-hard
04:33:12 <oerjan> i tried to check the link to complexity zoo and that had an error from the # to ♯ substitution globally applied :P
04:33:21 <oerjan> although the zoo itself uses #
04:36:41 <int-e> https://esolangs.org/logs/
04:36:59 <HackEso> [U+1F756 ALCHEMICAL SYMBOL FOR HORSE DUNG]
04:37:02 <oerjan> good link, recommended
04:37:45 <int-e> 'twas a mere mispaste
04:38:03 <HackEso> [U+2639 WHITE FROWNING FACE]
04:39:20 <oerjan> that symbol is begging to become a sarcasm tag
04:40:19 <int-e> Well I'm content with the discovery that there is a Unicode symbol for horse shit.
04:40:57 <int-e> But yes, that works.
04:41:29 <int-e> Too bad it isn't properly displayed in my terminal.
04:41:50 <oerjan> it's in mine, unlike the frowning fac
04:43:08 <int-e> That's funny, the face is displayed (though barely recognizable)
04:43:33 <zzo38> What font do you use? I use the "fixed" font
04:43:59 <oerjan> i'm using courier new, i think
04:44:19 <zzo38> (The face is displayed if the terminal is set to UTF-8 (I do so for IRC) but the alchemical symbol for horse dung doesn't work, because it is beyond 16-bits)
04:47:13 <oerjan> i'll just claim to be making a statement that emojis are worse than horse dung twh
04:48:36 <esowiki> [[Nope.]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=58920 * Areallycoolusername * (+876) Created page with "Nope is an [[esoteric programming language]] made by [[User: Areallycoolusername]]. You can code anything you would like, but the interpreter will refuse to give output. This..."
04:49:35 <int-e> The general colored glyph idea annoys me quite a bit.
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04:51:32 <zzo38> Yes, I don't like that either (or the antialiased fuzzy text, either). My proposed EnableLigatures flag would allow (among other things) astral Unicode characters (if the font is Unicode and supports any astral characters), and EnableAntialiasing would allow (among other things) colourful glyphs (and antialiasing). Both flag is off by default, so, you can avoid this
04:52:08 <esowiki> [[Joke language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=58921&oldid=58844 * Areallycoolusername * (+57) /* General languages */
04:53:58 <esowiki> [[Cedar--]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=58922 * Norskie7 * (+3106) Created page with "Cedar-- is an exercise in making a usable language that has the worst syntax imaginable. It was designed in December of 2018, and was implemented in the two weeks following fi..."
05:22:16 <ais523> bignum BF proven TC with only three [ and three ] instructions: https://cs.stackexchange.com/questions/102363/how-many-pairs-of-brackets-in-bf-be-sufficient-enough-to-make-it-turing-complete/102369#102369
05:22:41 <zzo38> O, that is good I didn't know that. I wanted to know that too
05:23:06 <ais523> I'm not 100% certain two is impossible
05:23:36 <ais523> you can do it with a /nesting level/ of only two (that's been on the wiki for a while) but that needs a lot more individual [ and ] instructions in the known proof
05:26:53 <ais523> note: assumes Artin's conjecture if you want to compile arbitrarily large programs directly, but you should be able to use the bundle-an-interpreter method to prove TCness even if Artin's conjecture turns out to be false
05:33:18 <oerjan> ais523: interrupted sentence: "the program is written in such a way that this"
05:36:08 <oerjan> has a primitive root 2
05:36:29 <oerjan> wtf did that include newlines
05:40:00 <oerjan> anyway, that doesn't make sense
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05:46:46 <oerjan> bah can't read this now
05:48:40 <ais523> why doesn't it make sense?
05:48:49 <ais523> we can always add on extra counters to the program
05:49:01 <ais523> so that assumption is wlog as long as there are infinitely many numbers which have 2 as a primitive root
05:50:26 <ais523> btw, there are almost certainly simpler constructions, I just hadn't thought of them at the time I wrote that answer
05:51:27 <ais523> probably using 2*(p*2**(n+k)+n) for some suitable constant k would work
05:52:23 <oerjan> anyway my brain refuses to be in math mode
05:53:40 <ais523> given what time it is, that makes sense
05:54:13 <ais523> the trick is finding a way to cycle over all the counters using only two of your three loops, whilst also ensuring all the difference between pairs of counter locations are distinct
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07:23:12 <esowiki> [[Talk:Nope.]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=58923 * Salpynx * (+603) Prigoginic leap in computational complexity
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11:08:15 <wob_jonas> Quick question. Some photographers upload really high quality photos to commons, and add a note that I shouldn't reupload the file in place, if I want to improve it, I should either choose a new name or ask the uploader.
11:08:56 <wob_jonas> Is there some template or stock text to mark the opposite for some of my photos? I have some photos that could certainly be improved by some color adjustments, eg. https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Orsa-rovdjurspark-tiger-0.jpg or https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Orsa-rovdjurspark-tiger-2.jpg
11:09:17 <wob_jonas> For those cases I want to mark in some way that you should feel free to improve the photo with light editing in place.
11:09:55 <wob_jonas> Mind you, for those two photos in particular, I might just edit them now, but I may want to add this text to some photos I'll upload in the future.
11:23:05 <wob_jonas> um sorry, wrong channel. I meant #wikimedia-commons
14:24:59 <wob_jonas> ais523: wow! three pairs of braces total in brainfuck?
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20:14:23 <b_jonas> oerjan: that's believable, I'll have to check that later on the wiki (re underload)
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21:01:24 <HackEso> 2019-01-04 21:01:23.709402290 +0000 UTC January 4 Friday 2019-W01-5
21:01:42 <b_jonas> my hon. and learned friend fungot, I hope you have a pleasant vacation away from this channel
21:10:28 <fizzie> "We will be seating you in the Afternoon Tea."
21:10:40 <fizzie> I hope that's not literal.
21:14:24 <lambdabot> *** "tea" wn "WordNet (r) 3.0 (2006)"
21:14:27 <lambdabot> n 1: a beverage made by steeping tea leaves in water; "iced tea
21:14:31 <lambdabot> 2: a light midafternoon meal of tea and sandwiches or cakes; "an
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21:18:12 <fizzie> fungot: All back to normal, are you?
21:18:25 <fizzie> Hmm, that's not promising.
21:18:36 <fizzie> fungot: I don't know, you'll have to figure that out.
21:18:36 <fungot> fizzie: i know. it's not impossible to require modules using prefixes etc. which is ok, before implementing it
21:18:45 <b_jonas> my hon. and learned friend fungot is back
21:18:46 <fungot> b_jonas: that i'll fight. it doesn't suck if you have dynamically scoped debugger hooks it's the integration into chicken, if you can
21:19:19 <fizzie> (It resets to the irc style at restart.)
21:22:28 <HackEso> #!/bin/sh \ exec date "+%Y-%m-%d %H:%M:%S.%N %z %Z %B %-e %A %G-W%V-%u"
21:22:31 <HackEso> #!/bin/sh \ exec date -u "+%Y-%m-%d %H:%M:%S.%N %z %Z %B %-e %A %G-W%V-%u"
21:28:06 <b_jonas> `perl -we for $e ("i","u"){ $f="bin/date$e"; open my$i,"<",$e; local$/; $s=<$i> or die; $s=~s/"\+%Y/\${d:+-d "\$d"} $&/ or die; open $o,">",$f or die "error open $f w: $!"; print $o $s or die; close $o or die; print "OK $f\n" }
21:28:07 <HackEso> Value of <HANDLE> construct can be "0"; test with defined() at -e line 1. \ readline() on closed filehandle $i at -e line 1. \ Died at -e line 1.
21:28:37 <b_jonas> `perl -e for $e ("i","u"){ $f="bin/date$e"; open my$i,"<",$e or die "error open $f r"; local$/; $s=<$i> or die; $s=~s/"\+%Y/\${d:+-d "\$d"} $&/ or die; open $o,">",$f or die "error open $f w: $!"; print $o $s or die; close $o or die; print "OK $f\n" }
21:28:38 <HackEso> error open bin/datei r at -e line 1.
21:28:45 <HackEso> #!/bin/sh \ exec date "+%Y-%m-%d %H:%M:%S.%N %z %Z %B %-e %A %G-W%V-%u"
21:29:07 <b_jonas> `perl -e for $e ("i","u"){ $f="bin/date$e"; open my$i,"<",$f or die "error open $f r"; local$/; $s=<$i> or die; $s=~s/"\+%Y/\${d:+-d "\$d"} $&/ or die; open $o,">",$f or die "error open $f w: $!"; print $o $s or die; close $o or die; print "OK $f\n" }
21:29:09 <HackEso> OK bin/datei \ OK bin/dateu
21:29:12 <HackEso> 2019-01-04 21:29:12.098799133 +0000 UTC January 4 Friday 2019-W01-5
21:29:15 <HackEso> 2019-01-04 21:29:15.160479399 +0000 UTC January 4 Friday 2019-W01-5
21:29:23 <HackEso> 2019-01-04 21:29:23.562776983 +0000 UTC January 4 Friday 2019-W01-5
21:29:34 <HackEso> #!/bin/sh \ exec date ${d:+-d "$d"} "+%Y-%m-%d %H:%M:%S.%N %z %Z %B %-e %A %G-W%V-%u"
21:29:35 <HackEso> 2019-01-04 21:29:35.420087204 +0000 UTC January 4 Friday 2019-W01-5
21:29:47 <HackEso> #!/bin/sh \ exec date "+%Y-%m-%d %H:%M:%S.%N %z %Z %B %-e %A %G-W%V-%u"
21:29:49 <HackEso> #!/bin/sh \ exec date -u "+%Y-%m-%d %H:%M:%S.%N %z %Z %B %-e %A %G-W%V-%u"
21:30:08 <b_jonas> `perl -e for $e ("i","u"){ $f="bin/date$e"; open my$i,"<",$f or die "error open $f r"; local$/; $s=<$i> or die; $s=~s/"\+%Y/\${1:+-d "\$1"} $&/ or die; open $o,">",$f or die "error open $f w: $!"; print $o $s or die; close $o or die; print "OK $f\n" }
21:30:13 <HackEso> OK bin/datei \ OK bin/dateu
21:30:16 <HackEso> 2019-01-04 21:30:16.440430275 +0000 UTC January 4 Friday 2019-W01-5
21:30:23 <HackEso> 2019-07-20 00:00:00.000000000 +0000 UTC July 20 Saturday 2019-W29-6
21:30:29 <HackEso> 2019-07-20 10:30:00.000000000 +0000 UTC July 20 Saturday 2019-W29-6
21:30:37 <HackEso> date: invalid date ‘--07-20 10:30’
21:30:47 <HackEso> date: invalid date ‘-19-07-20 10:30’
21:30:55 <HackEso> 2019-07-20 00:00:00.000000000 +0000 UTC July 20 Saturday 2019-W29-6
21:31:14 <HackEso> 2019-01-04 00:00:00.000000000 +0000 UTC January 4 Friday 2019-W01-5
21:31:21 <HackEso> 2019-01-10 00:00:00.000000000 +0000 UTC January 10 Thursday 2019-W02-4
21:31:30 <HackEso> 2019-01-03 21:31:30.305389414 +0000 UTC January 3 Thursday 2019-W01-4
21:31:34 <HackEso> 2019-01-04 21:31:34.359002045 +0000 UTC January 4 Friday 2019-W01-5
21:31:42 <HackEso> 2019-01-04 00:00:00.000000000 +0000 UTC January 4 Friday 2019-W01-5
21:31:45 <HackEso> 2019-01-04 21:31:45.302110784 +0000 UTC January 4 Friday 2019-W01-5
21:31:55 <HackEso> 2019-01-05 00:00:00.000000000 +0000 UTC January 5 Saturday 2019-W01-6
21:31:59 <HackEso> 2019-01-05 00:00:00.000000000 +0000 UTC January 5 Saturday 2019-W01-6
21:32:21 <HackEso> 2019-01-04 21:32:21.060698040 +0000 UTC January 4 Friday 2019-W01-5
21:32:23 <HackEso> 2019-01-04 21:32:22.729636367 +0000 UTC January 4 Friday 2019-W01-5
21:32:25 <HackEso> 2019-01-04 21:32:24.929500528 +0000 UTC January 4 Friday 2019-W01-5
21:33:00 <b_jonas> anyway, datei and dateu now takes a datetime in argument, in the formats that date accepts
21:33:08 <HackEso> date: invalid date ‘march’
21:33:11 <HackEso> 2019-03-01 00:00:00.000000000 +0000 UTC March 1 Friday 2019-W09-5
21:33:46 <HackEso> 2001-09-09 01:46:40.000000000 +0000 UTC September 9 Sunday 2001-W36-7
21:33:59 <HackEso> 2033-05-18 03:33:20.000000000 +0000 UTC May 18 Wednesday 2033-W20-3
21:34:13 <HackEso> 2017-07-14 02:40:00.000000000 +0000 UTC July 14 Friday 2017-W28-5
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22:07:14 <esowiki> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=58924&oldid=58863 * Cortex * (-56)
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23:04:25 <esowiki> [[User:Cortex/draft]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=58925 * Cortex * (+730) Created page with "'''MPD''' is a programming language created by [[User:Cortex|Cortex]] which contains multiple languages inside of it. It is named after multiple personality disorder. User:C..."
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23:37:13 <rain1> just start small and don't get stuck on one particular language/methodology
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