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00:22:56 <zzo38> How to program in GNU make so that depending which target is selected it will use different options for compiling the C codes?
00:24:51 <b_jonas> zzo38: you add makerules, with a target, dependencies, and a body, where most of the body can be a few make variables
00:27:49 <fizzie> You can do variable assignment with "target ... : VAR = value", as in https://www.gnu.org/software/make/manual/make.html#Target_002dspecific
00:28:15 <fizzie> (It also gets propagated to prequisites.)
00:28:39 <zzo38> OK, thank you that will help
00:28:52 <b_jonas> fizzie: oh nice, I have never used that
00:29:11 <b_jonas> that's better because then you don't need to write the body
00:29:29 <b_jonas> the body can come from a single wildcard target, you only write the target and deps and the variable
00:29:48 <b_jonas> but of course writing a body isn't complicated either
00:31:12 <fizzie> Well, the body won't set make variables.
00:31:20 <fizzie> "A variable definition in a “rule context” which is indented by a tab as the first character on the line, will be considered part of a recipe, not a make variable definition, and passed to the shell."
00:31:41 <b_jonas> the body will contain the full command, except most of it is abbreviated with make variables
00:31:53 <b_jonas> note that make variable definitions can contain other make variables
00:32:02 <b_jonas> references to them, even references to $@ and $+
00:33:00 <b_jonas> but you don't even need that, you can just write a body like $(CC) $(CFLAGS) -lcustom-for-this-rule -Dcustom-for-this-rule -o $@ $+
00:33:45 <fizzie> Right, but you can't make that compile foo.o from foo.c differently depending on whether you're building "make zing" or "make zong".
00:33:48 <b_jonas> you could use a specific variable instead of $(CC) $(CFLAGS), or even multiple ones, one for each different type of rule
00:34:00 <b_jonas> you mean depending on the top level target?
00:34:15 <fizzie> Well, that's how I interpreted "depending which target is selected".
00:34:22 <fizzie> Maybe it didn't mean that.
00:34:31 <b_jonas> that's one I don't really want to do, because it would mess with the whole point of Make where it doesn't rebuild targets that are already present depending on mtimes
00:34:48 <b_jonas> I'd give different names to the targets then, possibly in different directories
00:35:26 <fizzie> That's kind of a problem with target-specific variables as well, except even more so, because if you have two targets (with different target-specific variable assignments) both depending on foo, it's not clear which variable values get used.
00:36:05 <fizzie> So, yeah, maybe it's better in that case to arrange things so that you build "foo-zing.o" and "foo-zong.o" differently.
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02:24:50 <esowiki> [[Symbolic Python]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=61330&oldid=60520 * Cortex * (+145)
02:26:16 <esowiki> [[Symbolic Python]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=61331&oldid=61330 * Cortex * (-6) /* Random hex digit */
02:53:34 <zzo38> I think I figured out how to do it, I will have to see if it work (I don't use make for my own programs, but was modifying one that does)
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04:05:52 <esowiki> [[Armok]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=61332&oldid=46470 * Prof Apex * (+30) /* True Hello World! */ Add code blocks
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07:23:20 <esowiki> [[User:Total Vacuum]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=61333&oldid=61200 * Total Vacuum * (+123) /* ideas for names */
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09:21:18 <oerjan> hichaf. it's about 40 minutes too early to respond in kind.
10:05:04 <myname> we are in the same timezone, i guess
10:06:08 <oerjan> <b_jonas> so there's a third repeating holiday called "mother's day"? <-- norway's is on the second sunday of february hth
10:07:33 <int-e> I read https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mother's_Day the other week... such a mess.
10:07:59 <oerjan> i am assuming we don't do it in may because it's usually packed with other celebrations.
10:08:04 <int-e> (Okay, "read" is an overstatement.)
10:09:59 <oerjan> of course nowadays people also tend to celebrate valentine's day so the timing no longer seems as good.
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10:11:55 <myname> there are people celebrating valentine's day?
10:12:42 <int-e> Well, all you need for a celebration is an occasion.
10:13:14 <int-e> Cynical me (aka me) wants to suggest 9/11.
10:13:48 <myname> what do you want to celebrate?
10:14:01 <lambdabot> ENVA 230950Z 27005KT CAVOK 13/05 Q1019 NOSIG RMK WIND 670FT 10006KT
10:14:33 <int-e> myname: You're missing my point. It's the celebration that matters. Who cares what it's about? :P
10:14:34 <oerjan> myname: well at least the shops are.
10:15:13 <Taneb> myname: he's the patron saint of the plague!
10:15:21 <myname> oerjan: yeah, but valentine's day is like the worst day to go out with somebody
10:15:24 <int-e> myname: Of course personally I find Valentine's day highly offensive.
10:15:39 <oerjan> myname: because it's too crowded, i assume
10:16:20 <oerjan> of course if it _also_ coincides with mother's day, that gets magnified.
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11:52:40 <esowiki> [[User:A]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=61334&oldid=61296 * A * (+800) Weird idea of programming GNU nano
12:48:21 <esowiki> [[Esolang:Featured languages/Candidates]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=61335&oldid=61316 * Helen * (-3) Fixing a minor detail about the computational class and some small spcaing+grammar changes
13:06:11 <esowiki> [[Talk:Bitch]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=61336&oldid=61326 * Helen * (+47) /* Incrementing */ Took out the big unhelpful message and replaced it with a disclaimer
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14:31:08 <Taneb> Has the CSS on nlab changed recently? Looks more... papery
14:49:29 <rdococ> I have a slight suspicion that Swapfuck might not be an LBA.
14:56:18 <esowiki> [[Swapfuck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=61337&oldid=54944 * Rdococ * (+751)
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15:01:05 <orin> testing testing ◌͜◌͝◌͞◌͟◌ͣ
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15:08:40 <orin> oh, now it works
15:54:49 <lambdabot> CYYZ 231541Z 13010KT 15SM -SHRA SCT075 BKN090 12/08 A2979 RMK AC4AC3 ACC ASOCTD PRESFR SLP090 DENSITY ALT 600FT
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19:08:34 <shachaf> Taneb: Yes. nlab is a paper now.
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22:43:13 <zemhill_______> web.le-basic-rush: points -10.90, score 11.28, rank 47/47
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23:19:13 <orin> https://www.ctvnews.ca/world/philippines-duterte-threatens-war-if-canada-doesn-t-take-trash-back-1.4390852
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23:36:19 <sombrero> is there somo inter definition language like Apache Thrift or Babel but for Esoteric programming languages ???
23:36:54 <sombrero> https://computation.llnl.gov/projects/babel-high-performance-language-interoperability/#page=home
23:37:43 <int-e> orin: strong language, but a valid demand.
23:39:05 <sombrero> or like Melange http://melange.inria.fr/ ...
23:40:46 <int-e> Hmm, given how fundamentally different esolangs tend to be, I'm not sure how realistic that is.
23:41:54 <int-e> I wonder what kind of Haskell code Thrift generates...
23:42:27 <HackEso> int-e: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: <https://esolangs.org/>. (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on EFnet or DALnet.)
23:42:37 <sombrero> Just wondering about the existence of such a monster :P, but for more than two would be fine
23:43:27 <int-e> shachaf: Do you realize that that's the least offensive of all *elcomes for me? :P
23:43:43 <shachaf> Why would I want to offend you?
23:43:45 <int-e> https://thrift.apache.org/tutorial/hs <-- ah here's a taste.
23:44:03 <Hooloovoo> what is the most offensive elcome?
23:45:02 <int-e> `wElCoMe is pretty bad
23:45:05 <HackEso> iS: pReTtY: bAd: WeLcOmE To tHe iNtErNaTiOnAl hUb fOr eSoTeRiC PrOgRaMmInG LaNgUaGe dEsIgN AnD DePlOyMeNt! FoR MoRe iNfOrMaTiOn, ChEcK OuT OuR WiKi: <hTtPs://eSoLaNgS.OrG/>. (FoR ThE OtHeR KiNd oF EsOtErIcA, tRy #EsOtErIc oN EfNeT Or dAlNeT.)
23:45:30 <shachaf> Hmm, that one has a different behavior for people with even and odd nick lengths.
23:45:36 <int-e> shachaf: it would offend my eyes.
23:45:41 <HackEso> iS: pReTtY: bA: wElCoMe tO ThE InTeRnAtIoNaL HuB FoR EsOtErIc pRoGrAmMiNg lAnGuAgE DeSiGn aNd dEpLoYmEnT! fOr mOrE InFoRmAtIoN, cHeCk oUt oUr wIkI: <HtTpS://EsOlAnGs.oRg/>. (fOr tHe oThEr kInD Of eSoTeRiCa, TrY #eSoTeRiC On eFnEt oR DaLnEt.)
23:45:51 <shachaf> That must be what you find offensive.
23:46:00 <kmc> `WeLcOmE is pretty bad
23:46:03 <HackEso> Is: PrEtTy: BaD: wElCoMe tO ThE InTeRnAtIoNaL HuB FoR EsOtErIc pRoGrAmMiNg lAnGuAgE DeSiGn aNd dEpLoYmEnT! fOr mOrE InFoRmAtIoN, cHeCk oUt oUr wIkI: <HtTpS://EsOlAnGs.oRg/>. (fOr tHe oThEr kInD Of eSoTeRiCa, TrY #eSoTeRiC On eFnEt oR DaLnEt.)
23:46:29 <int-e> But since I filter colors, `relcome is just `welcome to me.
23:47:06 <shachaf> The other day someone was saying that WebAssembly is a reasonable IR for distributing portable programs that have nothing to do with the web.
23:48:25 <Hooloovoo> I'd think that something like LLVM IR would be better
23:48:31 <Cale> Things are headed in that direction... WebAssembly is the next Java
23:48:46 <Cale> I can't say that it's "reasonable"
23:48:50 <shachaf> That's not a recommendation.
23:49:07 <shachaf> Well, at least WebAssembly doesn't do garbage collection.
23:49:12 <Hooloovoo> my recommendation is to fire anyone who recommends webassembly
23:50:07 <Hooloovoo> maybe it's okay, but I've never heard anything good about it
23:50:08 <int-e> sombrero: I guess the closest thing esolang people do is write interpreters for one esolang in another.
23:50:24 <shachaf> It's surely better than asm.js
23:50:37 <shachaf> But now people are using it for things that have nothing to do with web browsers?
23:50:59 <shachaf> It seems unreasonable on the face of it.
23:51:01 <Cale> At some point, we're going to switch to using WebAssembly via GHC at Obsidian.
23:51:07 <int-e> node.js, electron... it was just a matter of time?
23:51:19 <shachaf> Electron is obviously just absurd.
23:51:25 <kmc> i can't stand those people
23:51:29 <kmc> for both technical and non-technical reasons
23:51:32 <kmc> but you already know that
23:51:35 <Cale> GHCJS is still more mature, but the WebAssembly backend has a much better shot at actually being upstreamed into GHC proper.
23:52:13 <shachaf> Well, Haskell is scow for programming anyway.
23:52:38 <kmc> i'm also caring less and less as time goes on, which is good
23:52:42 <int-e> shachaf: The main Isabelle developer is tinkering with VisualCode. :/
23:52:47 <HackEso> Scow (S-cow) is canned meat made from cows with a lisp.
23:52:49 <int-e> ... Visual Studio Code.
23:53:06 <shachaf> Whatever code GHC produces will be slow no matter what the backend is.
23:53:38 <int-e> But there's often a huge margin between slow and not fast enough. :P
23:53:55 <shachaf> also mutable state is the best
23:54:08 <int-e> unless you have a bug
23:54:24 <kmc> i wish the rust people weren't shit heads
23:54:29 <kmc> i wish they hadn't ruined open source for me
23:54:33 <kmc> but there's no going back
23:54:34 <int-e> shachaf: plus unsynchronised threads?
23:55:22 <shachaf> int-e: What are synchronized threads?
23:55:47 <int-e> shachaf: the one big lock kind of threads :P
23:56:06 <int-e> (but I had shared memory with uncoordinated access in mind)
23:56:23 <shachaf> shared memory with uncoordinated access seems fine
23:56:26 <int-e> (obviously each thread working on their own little part of memory is perfectly sane)
23:56:33 <shachaf> you can use a library to coordinate the access
23:56:51 <int-e> but certainly that wouldn't be "best" by your definition.
23:57:25 <int-e> The one that includes "memory unsafety".
23:57:37 <shachaf> I think memory unsafety is a pretty reasonable feature.
23:57:40 <shachaf> It's like Turing completeness.
23:57:52 <shachaf> Not ideal, but maybe better than the alternative?
23:59:22 <Cale> Memory unsafety is fine so long as you're not forced into using things which are unsafe just to do basic stuff all the time.
23:59:58 <int-e> I want to keep my sanity intact. Which means, sure, I may occasionally break abstractions (including managed heaps) to gain some performance, but I don't want to deal with it 99% of the time.