< 1570320716 568929 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you know that 'pink' is also named after a flower? < 1570320720 351740 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dianthus_plumarius < 1570320751 105687 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least accoring to some < 1570320756 40899 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :as well as https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pinking_shears < 1570322094 785172 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT : < 1570322304 592354 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:a5aa:a826:2910:c434 JOIN :#esoteric < 1570322585 544340 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:a5aa:a826:2910:c434 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1570323018 963651 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1570323393 843777 :LKoen!~LKoen@lstlambert-657-1-122-23.w92-154.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1570323677 77403 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1570324118 515478 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-yjdyspozzjhhhzax QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity > 1570326570 837081 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66478&oldid=66468 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+4217) 10/* Examples */ > 1570327053 824608 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66479&oldid=66478 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-50) 10 > 1570327217 868368 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66480&oldid=66479 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+17) 10/* Constants */ < 1570327550 823600 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@24.185.137.149 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1570327576 937591 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98995.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1570328422 813971 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`hurl bin/8ball < 1570328424 424202 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://hack.esolangs.org/repo/log/tip/bin/8ball < 1570328459 212202 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hum that's the wrong one < 1570328632 832710 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION waves < 1570328651 11794 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello pikhq < 1570328658 868579 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :What a day, what a day < 1570328684 234683 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not uplogged yet < 1570328699 14863 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :oic < 1570328786 977171 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:a5aa:a826:2910:c434 JOIN :#esoteric < 1570329041 982395 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:a5aa:a826:2910:c434 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1570330811 386894 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :now i am < 1570331211 485311 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :ic < 1570331421 514487 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1570331641 511525 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i note that personal pronouns were involved both here and in the current stackexchange clusterfuck < 1570331755 995428 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? them < 1570331757 456386 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :them? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1570331769 955254 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`wisdom them < 1570331771 88489 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​the them//Information on the THEM has been removed for national security reasons. < 1570331823 95820 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION carefully sidles away from his own brain < 1570331957 865557 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION notes that personal pronouns tend to be, well, important to people < 1570331975 197050 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION agrees with qwwem < 1570332079 20546 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who? < 1570332088 528401 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :with you < 1570332093 776393 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :-_- < 1570332147 138634 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION may not have sidled far enough < 1570332178 467439 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's just say that was rather rude of you and leave it at that < 1570332223 719926 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :my brain has trouble thinking of pronouns seriously now < 1570332405 48301 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i've been half thinking that the sane long-term solution for english is for everyone to standardize on they/them/their, which make your protest against it sort of a mind whiplash. although i can understand how it can still be rude if someone uses it _only_ for non-cis gendered people < 1570332416 917707 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*makes < 1570332486 834525 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1570332502 669012 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is the main case where 'they' would bother me < 1570332510 253905 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ < 1570332519 138576 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I sometimes use "they" for anyone, regardless of who they are, anyways < 1570332533 79196 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i'd be okay with someone who used 'they' for everyone < 1570332543 308975 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :although the last time this actually came up, I was not okay with it < 1570332544 213197 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Really a matter of context making me go "uuuuh" < 1570332559 23750 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's for complicated reasons arising from personal trauma and i wasn't really being fair to that person anyway < 1570332672 948765 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it took me a long time to accept that it's okay to think in principle that gender is stupid and should go away, and yet to be assertive about my own gender identity < 1570332680 600964 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's one of those ideal world vs real world things < 1570332748 144541 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the whole thing has been really humbling as far as learning what i can and can't change about myself < 1570332785 211321 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :transitioning is a huge change but it's something we do because we *can't* change who we really are < 1570332820 974067 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :At a certain point you just get done pretending to be someone else. < 1570332825 917857 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1570332857 16092 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think most trans people would much prefer to take a magic pill that makes you happy with your birth gender, but it doesn't exist < 1570332878 992695 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I would take that pill, personally < 1570332893 588526 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which ironically? makes me "fake trans" to a lot of people, because they can only see this experience through the lens of misery) < 1570332904 747349 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :It sounds easier. But at the same time, that's a radical change in who you are as a person. < 1570332905 201629 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean for one I think that pill would have to change my personality a whole lot < 1570332915 75020 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also well, being trans /is/ very interesting < 1570332933 874088 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and like I'm in a pretty good position to transition compared to most < 1570332951 974639 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I'm some sort of extreme neophile < 1570332953 732533 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i've always been a transhumanist < 1570332970 76662 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is honestly a big ol' scaredy cat :P < 1570332978 762198 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1570332979 845855 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm both < 1570332989 802718 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, it was really hard for me to start making permanent changes to my body < 1570332994 81504 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is v. ironic < 1570333004 361184 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometimes it isn't clear if you mean singular or plural, so then you shouldn't use "they" (or sometimes also "you", which is also grammatically plural but can also be used singular). < 1570333015 502876 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Y'know what's hard? _Shopping_. < 1570333039 699161 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: In such a case it's probably simplest to just rephrase to avoid the use of a pronoun. < 1570333044 973956 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Fortunately, Wizards of the Coast considered that ambiguity when making that change in Magic: the Gathering, so that the ambiguity is avoided.) < 1570333051 929984 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Said cases aren't very common, but that's basic writing, ain't it? < 1570333067 27425 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yes, that is correct, and is what is done in Magic: the Gathering in those few cases. > 1570333071 116646 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Brachylog14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=66481 5* 03A 5* (+1149) 10Created page with "== Brachylog is not a declarative language == Since Brachylog and Prolog are based on similar paradigms, this proof demonstrates that Prolog is technically not a declarative l..." > 1570333091 100762 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Brachylog14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66482&oldid=66481 5* 03A 5* (+31) 10/* Brachylog is not a declarative language */ < 1570333096 888516 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Although there are different ways of doing so. The rules for Magic: the Gathering say "that player" is used if "they" is ambiguous.) < 1570333115 88289 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Reasonable within that context. < 1570333123 888415 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, in that context, it is reasonable. < 1570333129 31970 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In other contexts, there is other ways. < 1570333145 909474 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. if it's ambiguous in other cases you can just use someone's name. < 1570333167 263810 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like you would if there's multiple "he"s or "she"s and you need to be clear who you're talking about. < 1570333175 3875 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, in the cases where their name is known (and not itself ambiguous, which in rare cases it can be). < 1570333186 60243 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Language! < 1570333196 809748 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Always so fuzzy around the edges < 1570333284 940145 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no problem with singular "they", but I don't like singular "themselves". (The singular should be "themself", like for "you", it will be "yourself" as singular rather than "yourselves", I think.) < 1570333330 712605 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the jury's out on which one is the grammatical one there. < 1570333357 935075 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yes, those language always so fuzzy around the edges, is also one of the reason why I don't like Inform7 so much, and also a reason for why I have thought to have a AST-based format for the effect of Magic: the Gathering cards. < 1570333398 669366 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yes, people use both, although I personally don't like to write "themselves" if it is singular. < 1570333416 758529 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION shrugs < 1570333460 975188 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Themselves" still sounds cleaner to my internal sense of things, but that's probably nothing more than pattern matching doing weird things. < 1570333499 306650 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, probably, I think < 1570333536 790556 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(That is probably why many people use that, I think) < 1570333538 686466 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Honestly, I still have a soft spot in my heart for Spivak pronouns. < 1570333884 202329 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1570333886 270093 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, we'll see < 1570333898 367354 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :right now it's hard enough to get people to accept singular 'they' < 1570333911 140851 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :even though it goes back to shakespeare if not earlier < 1570333985 2493 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: you don't like shopping? < 1570334015 618418 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though there is one (honestly minor) difference between historical and modern use. Historical singular "they" was for an indefinite referent; modern singular "they" extends to definite ones. < 1570334040 680954 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: meaning that the use to refer to a specific person is new? < 1570334043 427756 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: I like shopping, and since I'm still boy-mode much of the time, am terrified of being caught in public doing so < 1570334044 361966 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1570335336 757712 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a few question about conlang. One is if you have made fonts for constructed languages (with METAFONT or otherwise; for printer fonts I would probably use METAFONT if I were doing so)? Do some involve sounds not in IPA or X-SAMPA? Are there some with multiple mouth? Are there some with unusual writing directions (e.g. circular or 3D)? < 1570335395 276117 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is also Z-SAMPA, but might any involve stuff not in Z-SAMPA? What effects might physiology have on phonology? < 1570335434 276427 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: ah, I see < 1570335451 443754 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I noticed that Z-SAMPA uses some Italian words that are used in musical notation. < 1570335475 868054 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I've never done so, but this is an interesting thing to think about. < 1570335493 850645 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :A conlang for non-human physiology seems like a space ripe for some interesting experiments. < 1570335525 909579 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: a nice thing happened to me today < 1570335535 116187 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I helped a guy use the parking meter in my neighborhood and he said "wow, you're tall!" several times and at the end thanked me for being a "nice girl" < 1570335543 281972 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aww. :) < 1570335574 306928 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I didn't even put in particular effort today to look female < 1570335582 324290 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was wearing jeans and a men's cut T-shirt < 1570335655 48935 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so apparently the other stuff (hair, glasses, jewelry, tits?) is enough to overcome the fact that I'm a really really tall woman, at least for some < 1570335674 311238 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(6'3", specifically) < 1570335693 214561 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, if being tall were a problem my entire family would have issues. < 1570335700 923304 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :My mom's 5'10". She's the short one. < 1570335715 71237 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't help, but it's not a dealbreaker < 1570335920 879517 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I looked at information about Z-SAMPA, and they mention alternative non-ASCII characters for 8-bit character sets, although there are different 8-bit character sets so you may wish to do differently, such as PC character set. < 1570335965 653703 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Another possibility might be a variant with colours.) < 1570336066 532236 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :About non-human physiology, one thing I thought is that colour words might be untranslatable (although that is a separate issue from phonology, but it is still a part of the language). < 1570336121 842269 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION nods < 1570336134 185049 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :In some cases, only translatable by analogy I suppose. < 1570336175 793206 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1570336266 753103 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though in truth -- color words are sometimes hard to translate even from human languages. < 1570336320 503866 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, although in the case I am describing it is even more difficult, I think. < 1570336381 10827 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :I imagine you're thinking of a species that either has a wider vision range, or (even more difficult) has a vision range that doesn't overlap with ours. < 1570336406 66036 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found a article on Wikipedia about untranslatability. < 1570336414 98225 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though even just having different sensitivity peaks within our vision range probably does odd things to color perception. < 1570336429 308828 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yes, the former; I didn't think of the latter although of course there is that too. < 1570336851 560062 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I didn't think of that either, but that is also a good point. < 1570342943 529737 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1570343430 763795 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-58-74.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1570343570 603417 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric > 1570346714 131493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:A14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66483&oldid=66171 5* 03A 5* (+1303) 10/* Sandbox */ < 1570347976 537919 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1570348290 535608 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1570349087 905039 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite < 1570349886 978008 :tromp_!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:f19e:44c7:5fcf:3593 JOIN :#esoteric < 1570349887 677832 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-58-74.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1570350661 587111 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Quit: leaving > 1570351267 703729 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Brainloller14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=66484 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+610) 10Created page with "Braincoaster --~~~~" < 1570351297 733185 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: fuchsia and lavender are named of flowers too > 1570351331 252802 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfrick14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=66485 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+23) 10Redirected page to [[Brainfuck]] > 1570351357 66347 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66486&oldid=66314 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+12) 10 < 1570353426 891789 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric > 1570354049 277715 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:AnimaLibera14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66487&oldid=66477 5* 03AnimaLibera 5* (+51) 10 > 1570354884 546752 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Featured languages/Candidates14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66488&oldid=63077 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+1464) 10/* List of candidates */ < 1570355707 152729 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :do we disqualify that featured language candidate because TwilightSparkle didn't read the instructions at the top of that page? < 1570355971 803476 :Lykaina!~lyka@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi b_jonas < 1570356154 327275 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, let's give her a little more time, in case she realizes her mistake and edits < 1570356158 280639 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or reads the channel < 1570356291 883828 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should suggest nopfunge as a featured language < 1570356330 957387 :Lykaina!~lyka@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :i said i would make twitter-sized cryptoquotes, i just have to figure out how < 1570356353 475449 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean by "cryptoquote"? < 1570356366 781990 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :a quote where it's hard to tell where the quote comes from? < 1570356371 995979 :Lykaina!~lyka@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes called cryptics < 1570356379 981668 :Lykaina!~lyka@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the newspaper < 1570356391 359154 :Lykaina!~lyka@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are quotes < 1570356418 509394 :Lykaina!~lyka@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :that are encrypted with a simple substitution cipher < 1570356438 921869 :Lykaina!~lyka@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :turns out, easier to break than make < 1570356501 765649 :Lykaina!~lyka@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :26! possible ciphers < 1570356539 511533 :Lykaina!~lyka@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :26! = 403291461126605635584000000 < 1570356560 486005 :Lykaina!~lyka@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there are so many quotes < 1570356648 239217 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` \' | perl -e'$/="";$_=<>;for$c(0..rand(25)){y/A-Za-z/B-ZAb-za/};print' < 1570356648 853101 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :930) Gur bgure qnl (jryy, gur bgure jrrx) zl jvsr jnf naablrq jvgu zr orpnhfr fur unq n qernz jurer V unq tbggra hf cynar gvpxrgf vagb n #rfbgrevp zrrg fbzrjurer va gur zvqqyr bs Terraynaq va gur jvagre, jvgubhg nfxvat ure svefg. Cyhf fur jnfa'g ernyyl vagrerfgrq va n #rfbgrevp zrrg ng nyy, yrg nybar bar va Terraynaq, yrg nybar bar va Terraynaq va jvagregvzr. (V guvax vg'f xvaq bs pbyq gurer?) < 1570356654 785157 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, arbitrary substitution one < 1570356658 796880 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's better < 1570356732 451520 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` \' | perl -e'$/="";$_=<>;use List::Util"shuffle";$c=join("",shuffle("a".."z"));eval"y/a-zA-Z/$c\U$c/";print' < 1570356733 238996 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :848) Scj B lq vlabnc Cvgdbjf jhclxck, iua ba bj Elvlmblv Cvgdbjf, vza Ikbabjf Cvgdbjf. < 1570356735 454639 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` \' | perl -e'$/="";$_=<>;use List::Util"shuffle";$c=join("",shuffle("a".."z"));eval"y/a-zA-Z/$c\U$c/";print' < 1570356736 55468 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :262) JDS ejb HS'PP JS MNAS WQ UBBKESIWUPPD FSIWKQI DQNA IKBZ QGWSI < 1570356752 819110 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the "38" is sort of a giveaway < 1570356810 108147 :Lykaina!~lyka@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :famous quotes, not chat room quotes... < 1570356840 173933 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or just use the substitution that turns the quote to alphabetically the first, for canonicity < 1570356860 851905 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you take the first letter to "a", the second unique letter to "b" etc < 1570356908 785398 :Lykaina!~lyka@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :just as easy to break < 1570357665 25400 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1570358466 520304 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.206.178 JOIN :#esoteric < 1570359702 230841 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the last o strip was 12 days ago. time to upload the next one. > 1570361580 506232 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66489&oldid=66480 5* 03A 5* (+59) 10/* Constants */ > 1570361917 935672 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66490&oldid=66489 5* 03A 5* (+19) 10/* Constants */ > 1570361988 132860 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66491&oldid=66490 5* 03A 5* (+8) 10/* Constants */ < 1570362722 895395 :GeekDude!~G33kDude@unaffiliated/g33kdude QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1570362857 978748 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-xdznqteffladiyny QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer > 1570362870 969536 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66492&oldid=66491 5* 03A 5* (+1520) 10/* Constants */ < 1570362877 296368 :Camto[m]!camtomatri@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-kqezcpqvqrvnvnoo QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1570362880 456161 :ivzem[m]!ivzemmatri@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-pfcbxdhmszaevdrx QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1570362883 607100 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-oprrrwpesznuihmf QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1570362883 965711 :wmww!wmwwmatrix@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-ldgcrbamjzopshmi QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1570362913 292617 :GeekDude!~G33kDude@unaffiliated/g33kdude JOIN :#esoteric > 1570363072 688401 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66493&oldid=66492 5* 03A 5* (+292) 10/* Constants */ > 1570363313 982422 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66494&oldid=66493 5* 03A 5* (+253) 10/* Constants */ < 1570363347 333785 :Camto[m]!camtomatri@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-llfdcyjykpwbtxif JOIN :#esoteric > 1570363652 238788 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66495&oldid=66494 5* 03A 5* (+1019) 10/* Constants */ > 1570364144 187646 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07No-code esolang14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66496&oldid=46931 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+20) 10It's a stub, and this wiki is extremely inactive. < 1570364705 975644 :wmww!wmwwmatrix@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-kgafnkfihzpndcpz JOIN :#esoteric < 1570364706 64891 :xylochoron[m]!xylochoron@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-neitrrauynguvntc JOIN :#esoteric < 1570364706 141315 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-qfcdrrqepoigqhsf JOIN :#esoteric < 1570364713 594351 :ivzem[m]!ivzemmatri@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-jevpriyjrvnxmbml JOIN :#esoteric > 1570365236 173094 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66497&oldid=66495 5* 03A 5* (+3276) 10/* Constants */ Thanks! < 1570365722 952784 :ineiros!ineiros@kapsi.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1570365897 112472 :ineiros!ineiros@kapsi.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1570367097 90056 :ineiros!ineiros@kapsi.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1570367148 541908 :ineiros!ineiros@kapsi.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1570368607 112497 :LKoen!~LKoen@lstlambert-657-1-122-23.w92-154.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1570369448 596913 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xrkkupsjcxzlowik JOIN :#esoteric > 1570369532 418114 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Featured languages/Candidates14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66498&oldid=66488 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+52) 10 > 1570369941 432608 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66499&oldid=66497 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+0) 10/* Constants */ < 1570370091 319583 :LKoen!~LKoen@lstlambert-657-1-122-23.w92-154.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.” < 1570370151 929761 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds > 1570370623 991620 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66500&oldid=66499 5* 03A 5* (+119) 10 < 1570371108 769323 :MDude!~MDude@c-174-55-101-236.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds > 1570371819 958406 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66501&oldid=66500 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+2) 10/* Turing-Completeness */ Very 11+1< < 1570372370 203775 :IrYki3ll3!~IrYki3ll3@39.170.83.79.rev.sfr.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1570372428 325730 :IrYki3ll3!~IrYki3ll3@39.170.83.79.rev.sfr.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1570375714 652103 :tromp_!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:f19e:44c7:5fcf:3593 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1570375750 535739 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:f19e:44c7:5fcf:3593 JOIN :#esoteric < 1570376054 575866 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:f19e:44c7:5fcf:3593 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1570376230 29508 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1570376240 388275 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1570376324 598951 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1570376531 964652 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:5de3:32a2:7b16:f0d4 JOIN :#esoteric < 1570376876 958094 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1570377607 463571 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Quit: Laa shay'a waqi'un moutlaq bale kouloun moumkine < 1570377679 84190 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1570377761 414573 :LKoen!~LKoen@lstlambert-657-1-122-23.w92-154.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1570377763 977417 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Client Quit < 1570377789 726042 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric > 1570378312 933466 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07PL/MIX14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66502&oldid=57562 5* 03B jonas 5* (-306) 10 < 1570378346 629085 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: wiki notification bot missed my edit < 1570378663 426693 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah no < 1570378668 514802 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just late < 1570379149 491685 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ 0.0254*12#.6 7 NB. how long is 6 foot and 7 inches? < 1570379150 223580 :j-bot!eldis4@firefly.nu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: 2.0066 < 1570379591 340967 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xrkkupsjcxzlowik QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity > 1570381353 211698 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:MiroslavRD14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66503&oldid=66230 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+33) 10 < 1570381403 764883 :hakatashi!~hakatashi@104.131.49.125 JOIN :#esoteric < 1570381453 464409 :hakatashi1!~hakatashi@104.131.49.125 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1570383384 254544 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`8ball Does fungot give better life advice than a Magic 8-ball? < 1570383384 507231 :fungot!~fungot@2a01:4b00:82bb:1341::2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: forcer says: would " to give somebody something" or " gregor arr"... sort of tripping point is that satisfaction of predicate should be the default. < 1570383384 679797 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is certain. > 1570383446 663492 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:MiroslavRD14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66504&oldid=66503 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+883) 10 < 1570383502 673070 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot, please move the mouse cursor away so it doesn't cover your answer < 1570383502 749662 :fungot!~fungot@2a01:4b00:82bb:1341::2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: they're expensive. < 1570383513 149717 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? mouses? no they aren't < 1570383608 426431 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :must be the cursors then, not the mice. < 1570383692 776656 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or answers. < 1570383763 294089 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION sells prime mouse cursors; only $50 per pixel < 1570383764 715132 :kmc!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the tripping point > 1570383835 954331 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Blyat14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=66505 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+201) 10Created page with "'''Blyat''' is a modded Cyrillic++ just to use CS:GO meme terms instead of normal code. [[Category:Stubs]] [[Category:Languages]] [[Category:Weirdlangs]] Category:Turing-co..." < 1570383843 940509 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: didn't that happen? > 1570383861 103041 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Blyat14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66506&oldid=66505 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+29) 10 < 1570383899 815315 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: close enough, I think: http://www.milliondollarhomepage.com/ < 1570383955 922651 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(wow that looks so terrible) < 1570383956 429414 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1570383983 500731 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pretty awesome bit though. < 1570384102 727645 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :That was 2005. Time's passing so quickly. < 1570384198 617984 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Million_Dollar_Homepage#Survival ... there are "studies" about this page! < 1570384215 224451 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Time is an illusion that helps things make sense... :) > 1570384549 147919 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Human's mind have sex with someone14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=66507 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+5479) 10Created page with "'''Human's mind have sex with someone''' is a stupid Brainfuck, where it uses unabbreviated commands instead of abbreviated symbols. == Commands == * Move the pointer to the..." < 1570384580 650058 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh-huh... < 1570384686 367931 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: ^^ this is your time to shine with another rant. < 1570384707 362605 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :BF derivatives aren't clever? :) > 1570384708 280234 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Human's mind have sex with someone14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66508&oldid=66507 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+133) 10 < 1570384803 128089 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's wait for the inevitable quine, I mean program that prints its own source code. < 1570384865 69429 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: huh? why? just because it's a brainfuck-derivative? < 1570384932 976983 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: yes < 1570385075 75792 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: ok. my usual rant is that while those supposed esoteric languages are stupid, the wiki is serving its originally intended purpose that it's attracting people away from places that we want those people to spam less, like wikipedias. < 1570385122 838617 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :a language with the semantics of Ook! and the syntax of Real fast Nora's is not particularly innovative, but it makes more sense than some of the "languages" that people write pages about < 1570385150 80736 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least it's well-defined enough that you could write programs in it, if the aliens with the big guns demanded that from you < 1570385738 363558 :MDude!~MDude@c-174-55-101-236.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1570386257 818763 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1570386288 706678 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oddly, the BF derivative shovelware ended up serving a "useful" purpose, in that CGCC started writing polyglots with all the syntax-substituted brainfucks < 1570386330 36002 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not a useful purpose, and it's not like they were going to run out of languages usable for programming < 1570386360 563784 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the megapolyglot often seems to be on the verge of running out of languages that can be made to fit < 1570386379 541379 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, you mean that one]\ < 1570386385 52739 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :not just smaller polyglots < 1570386386 469559 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1570386442 308347 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, the esolangs.org community is thinking "surely we have enough BF derivatives already?", and CGCC has fit in 277 languages into a polyglot and thus is often on the verge of running out < 1570386458 872735 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :BF substitutions tend to be easy to fit in due to having simple semantics and ignoring most of the program < 1570386515 13033 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that 277 includes a lot of very closely related languages, such as slightly different Haskell command lines < 1570386653 479452 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, some people on code golf count python1 as a separate programming language from python2 < 1570386924 249467 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :random observations from my vacation to NRW. in Dortmund, there's an U-Bahn (tube, metro) station where there's a platform on both sides of the train, the train doors open on both sides at the same time, people get on on one side and off on the other side. this is an interesting solution for a high traffic stop that I hadn't seen anywhere else. I like it. < 1570386930 604644 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :everyone should according to their rules < 1570386956 495730 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :their definition of a "language" is very precise, things like the Windows version of Perl 5.26 and the Linux version of Perl 5.26 are different languages… < 1570386975 176918 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although the rules end up breaking down when you take them to the logical extremes, most people other than me avoid those < 1570387031 23429 :LKoen!~LKoen@lstlambert-657-1-122-23.w92-154.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1570387051 486830 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :well sure. I've worked with perl on windows, including trying to port my own script from windows-native perl to msys perl. perl is so incompatible with itself that you can consider any version a different version from itself. < 1570387173 383943 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, there used to be a windows-specific bug in perl when you called glob with multiple arguments < 1570387213 602138 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's not just about the parts that are different because they access some functionality where the underlying system calls work differently < 1570387235 150153 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't old versions of Perl implement glob using the shell? < 1570387268 582715 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, old ones did < 1570387275 606213 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :using tcsh I think < 1570387340 89205 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Netscape Navigator 9 with JavaScript disabled" < 1570387350 196637 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(actual language inside the polyglot) < 1570387675 4152 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :what makes it strange is how new contributors test the code in all those weird languages < 1570387723 984138 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I pretty much gave up once it got past the scope of what TIO could handle < 1570387966 762238 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :have they added a pair of languages that are two very similar versions of a 90s game console, and the difference between them is detected from the timing of the sound chip or the diskette drive, so you can only test it on real hardware with an eprom cart, because the emulator doesn't emulate the speed of different diskette drives realistically? < 1570387973 525873 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/emulator/emulators/ < 1570388085 749591 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1570388095 791900 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually there's a surprising lack of machine codes < 1570388104 511030 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(there's at least one, but you'd expect more) < 1570388114 878160 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think there's a desire not to add any languages with a hard size limit < 1570388123 563095 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: sorry for my connection < 1570388144 355865 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1570388152 336642 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :even when the hard size limit is larger than the 32 kilobyte or 64 kilobyte post size limit of SE? < 1570388261 442814 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :we could always start compressing it in the post < 1570388272 757574 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1570388287 928343 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :SE allows "Stack Snippets" which are basically a TC post syntax (based on JavaScript), and they're already being used to collapse the polyglots to save space on the page < 1570388315 169754 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so as long as you can compress it and the post to less than the post size - decompressor size, it should be OK < 1570388330 848729 :RainbowRabbit!~RainbowRa@S0106f0f24964f0e3.su.shawcable.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1570388421 226205 :RainbowRabbit!~RainbowRa@S0106f0f24964f0e3.su.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :sup < 1570388442 436982 :RainbowRabbit!~RainbowRa@S0106f0f24964f0e3.su.shawcable.net PART :#esoteric < 1570388608 891822 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, RainbowRabbit left quickly < 1570388620 483338 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :normally on IRC you have to wait a bit if you want to see whether anyone's around < 1570388702 716140 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :in Köln, in the city center, lampposts were coated with what feels like some sort of silicone substance, probably against grafitti < 1570388825 871535 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, in Dortmund, everything is closed on Sunday, which is pretty annoying to me < 1570388913 827344 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sunday rules in the UK are weird < 1570388926 262496 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :major/large shops are not allowed to open more than 8 hours on a Sunday < 1570388931 837963 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :we had about a year when we had government rules for Sunday too < 1570388934 185268 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they got reverted < 1570388934 865102 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but small shops can open for as long as they like < 1570388936 756358 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :luckily < 1570388944 756495 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :major supermarkets often have small spinoffs to get around this rule < 1570388966 429712 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, I think we had exceptions for small shops too < 1570389077 248875 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that was the rule because it matched their stated purpose with the rule, which was to protect workers who may not want to work on Sunday but were too powerless against their employees -- though people believed there was a less obvious selfish political purpose in the backgroun < 1570389099 25935 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/purpose/agenda/ < 1570389111 421394 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably historically there was a religious justification to it. < 1570389153 256 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, that was certainly part of what they played for < 1570389159 239959 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think in the UK it was originally a religious thing that got repurposed (without necessarily undermining the original reason) < 1570389189 459017 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I don't think religion has much to do with the general idea that people should have a rest on some days of the week < 1570389249 491953 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the sort of thing that both religious and anti-religious governments promised because people like it < 1570389267 372105 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some religions do promote it, but it has been fairly common in a wide variety of societies, yeah < 1570389312 396543 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :right. it's like not murdering people. religions promote it as a rule too, but so do anti-religious people < 1570389444 803564 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah right, we just had an smbc on that < 1570389608 163979 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the rule should be, avoid making too much noise outside on Sunday. But otherwise you can do stuff if you want to do, just as well as other days of the week. < 1570389659 167247 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(With one exception, perhaps: The bells that tell the time on the clock will still be allowed.) < 1570389728 683327 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the northern part of Dortmund has an itneresting park/forest hybrid thing. it's more well-tended than the kind of forest I'm used to, but bigger and more closed than a park in the sense that I could easily walk for a while in the middle without seeing anything but trees. < 1570389738 946759 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's quite close to the city center too < 1570389767 144543 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :was nice but also a little scary in the dark < 1570389788 705451 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :not like one of those big castle gardens either, too irregular for that > 1570390513 704 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:MiroslavRD14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66509&oldid=66504 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+2) 10 > 1570390586 657367 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:MiroslavRD14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66510&oldid=66509 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+5) 10 < 1570390977 163853 :LKoen!~LKoen@lstlambert-657-1-123-43.w92-154.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1570391111 274040 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric > 1570391485 728933 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Here's to the crazy ones14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=66511 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+3428) 10Possibly a normal esolang > 1570391510 232286 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[0799 Bottles of Beer14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=66512 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+32) 10Redirected page to [[99 bottles of beer]] > 1570391524 531636 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66513&oldid=66359 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+84) 10 < 1570391539 556597 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :are there music players suitable for children under 3 years of age, in the sense that they're impossible even for an infant to disassemble, too large to try to swallow, and spit-proof? or is that practically impossible because you can't make the contact towards the charger infant-proof? < 1570391569 833807 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably it would need to have built-in memory rather than a micro-SD card slot < 1570391577 739256 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no display < 1570391590 110196 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Macro SD card? < 1570391602 983677 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not an SD card, more like a PCMCIA-sized SD card :)) < 1570391615 452078 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: no no. an infant would bite on that and break it < 1570391634 292335 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :infant-proofing is harder than vandal-proofing > 1570391658 730091 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MiroslavRD14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=66514 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+29) 10Redirected page to [[User:MiroslavRD]] > 1570391679 596103 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:MiroslavRD14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=66515 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+34) 10Redirected page to [[User talk:MiroslavRD]] < 1570391694 536627 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric : Here's to the crazy ones is a inspiration of Shakespeare Programming Language adjusted to reference Apple's TextEdit icon before Yosemite, saying "Dear Kate, Here's to the crazy ones." ← that sentence has got a close-to-perfectly-balanced ambiguity between Kate as a person's name and Kate as a text editor's name < 1570391707 456962 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: Fiiine < 1570391708 969903 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :given that it's Apple, the former is probably more likely, but that depends on context < 1570391724 326661 :LKoen!~LKoen@lstlambert-657-1-123-43.w92-154.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.” > 1570391750 76625 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete10 02 5* 03Ais523 5* 10deleted "[[02MiroslavRD10]]": links to userspace should be clearly marked (see [[Esolang:Policy]]), a redirect from mainspace goes against that > 1570391769 304962 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete10 02 5* 03Ais523 5* 10deleted "[[02Talk:MiroslavRD10]]": links to userspace should be clearly marked (see [[Esolang:Policy]]), a redirect from mainspace goes against that [talkpage edition] > 1570391936 268724 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Featured languages/Candidates14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66516&oldid=66498 5* 03B jonas 5* (+0) 10Instrns at top of page clearly say you should use the same order as on Language List, so 1+ comes first. > 1570392311 20 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Brachylog14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66517&oldid=66482 5* 03Ais523 5* (+1348) 10Prolog isn't imperative; it has imperative constructs, but many of its constructs can't easily be converted to imperative equivalents < 1570392678 331027 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm considering to change my featured language suggestion from Befunge to Nopfunge < 1570392701 861563 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :despite that I usually don't like counter machines < 1570392772 995570 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nopfunge and Tip are interesting because all the information is stored in the instruction pointer via repeating the program < 1570392783 305076 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1570392796 867238 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Conedy might be like that too, but we don't know if it's powerful enough < 1570392896 743531 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have you seen my new and currently unnamed esolangs? I would want to know what is other people's comment of it. < 1570392920 463793 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could say that they're cheating by storing extra information that doesn't actually determine the instruction in the higher order parts for Nopfunge or the lower order parts for Conedy or Blindfolded Arithmetic < 1570392923 953061 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, this reminds me of an esolang idea I was working on a while back but never made public because I couldn't get it to work < 1570392957 546138 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the language definitions are natural enough that it doesn't feel like cheating < 1570392959 927382 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which one is that? < 1570392966 699326 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it consists of a procedurally generated 3D space with lots of objects in it (like spheres, cubes, rendered 3D ASCII letters, that sort of thing) < 1570392980 972472 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a program is simply a point and a direction < 1570392995 91200 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :interpreted as a ray that bounces off things < 1570393020 216580 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :raytracing: the esolang. < 1570393030 359065 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and all the numbers have infinite precision (somehow, not sure whether rationals or computable reals work better) < 1570393040 707848 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hmm, do we in first place have a language where the contents of the instruction space is a pre-determined infinite one and the program consists of only a bignum instruction pointer for where to start? < 1570393042 866942 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I couldn't get it to be TC in a natural way, though < 1570393053 690400 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: have you seen "geometric" turing machines? < 1570393064 555372 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: I don't think so, I might be wrong though < 1570393066 204530 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: no < 1570393079 917877 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: wait, why 3D rather than 2D? < 1570393082 35767 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :lemme see if I can dig that up. < 1570393094 606899 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't it be turing-complete even if it's 2D? < 1570393107 939106 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: actually I think even 3 dimensions may be too little < 1570393118 431415 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess to get such a language, you can just fix a nopfunge program that is a universal machine < 1570393128 925043 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the basic problems are related to a) how you store information, b) how you store the program < 1570393179 16766 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you have curved surfaces to bounce off you can effectively define a program via using very minor shifts in the starting position of the ray, that get amplified when bouncing, so that you can take whatever path you like < 1570393196 471720 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but a 3D object has a 2D surface, that means you're using up an entire dimension just to store the program < 1570393199 250421 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, so you can have a full oracle in a single finely patterned object < 1570393217 388039 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that just reflect the ray to the right direction in a bounded number of steps < 1570393225 401126 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly even in one step if it needn't be smooth < 1570393230 732171 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the remaining 1 dimension doesn't seem to be usable for anything more data-powerful than a single stack without some really contrived objects < 1570393278 109513 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh, this dude's stuff is scattered everywhere. < 1570393283 657263 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://lara.inist.fr/bitstream/handle/2332/1001/LIP-RR2004-09.pdf?sequence=1 < 1570393287 712522 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, I got stuck (primarily on this problem) and never ended up creating a usable language, but that's about as far as I've gotten < 1570393309 240579 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :he demonstrates a 2 counter automaton. < 1570393313 814303 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a "signal machine". < 1570393324 671163 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: could you make something discrete, like a reversible nopfunge in ten dimensions? < 1570393344 510096 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://arxiv.org/pdf/0906.3225.pdf < 1570393347 809932 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's easy enough to do it if you allow for contrived object fields < 1570393353 812778 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :more stuff. < 1570393397 474042 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like having a universal machine just lying there, or using some sort of space-filling pattern that will contain any particular finite set of objects in any possible arrangement somewhere (assuminig the number of possible object arrangements is countable) < 1570393398 378780 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :dude essentially forms computations by geometric construction. < 1570393413 503231 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :all 2D too. < 1570393432 437892 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: a universal machine for something much more powerful than turing though < 1570393457 425851 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you could absolutely make it TC, just by having different collision rules for objects. < 1570393526 327570 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: right, I wanted something like that but more tarpitty < 1570393541 467576 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't get more tarpitty than actual TMs. :P < 1570393549 723993 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes you can < 1570393550 713432 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you probably could now that I think about it.. < 1570393562 123876 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Quit: Laa shay'a waqi'un moutlaq bale kouloun moumkine < 1570393566 24580 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :keep forgetting the lengths people will go to to make their language unusable. < 1570393585 134913 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :tag machines are a good example of something generally considered to be simpler than a Turing machine < 1570393599 77238 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1570393621 537838 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: it's not just deliberately making them unusable, it's natural constructions that happen to be hard to use, or stuff like M:tG that are designed for goals other than general programming < 1570393640 972536 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dunno, Malbolge seems maliciously designed. < 1570393648 420008 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :along with a host of other languages. < 1570393660 696014 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: yeah, think of Nopfunge rather than Malbolge or Intercal < 1570393667 591603 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Malbolge's kind of a special case, it was intentionally designed to be unusable < 1570393671 288379 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and note that Malbolge is old, which is its excuse < 1570393695 579566 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: well, if you subscribe to the rottytooth school that sees esolang creation as art, the user experience is part of that < 1570393701 8694 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't seem rather well thought out considering... ALGOL68. :P < 1570393706 254140 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the theoretical/computational experience is quite different < 1570393711 3260 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but also part of that < 1570393726 491441 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :esolangs designed as esolangs should ideally be interesting in all dimensions < 1570393739 375186 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I put a lot of effort into Incident, for example (which is hard to use but at least has interesting reasons for that) < 1570393792 163324 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :much of my esolang research is more at the computational model end of things, though < 1570393808 127477 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in which case the syntax doesn't even really exist, you're just coming up with something to fit it into a computer < 1570393912 939902 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess my line is "if this language mostly exists to compile into something else, its syntax is not the interesting part" < 1570393931 36028 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas if the language mostly exists for some other reason, things like the user interface are important < 1570393957 208934 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's an esolang (I've forgotten what it's called) in which there's a time limit on entering each line of the program and you can't use backspace… < 1570393978 341694 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, waterfall model and stackflow are examples where the syntax isn't important < 1570393991 891568 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :At the very least, esolangs ought to be interesting along some dimension in ways that would otherwise be impractical for a language intended for serious use by _someone_. < 1570393992 815140 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: is that one flavored as a magic system in some fantasy universe, the programs being spells? < 1570394017 311872 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: no, it's flavoured as a terrible IDE < 1570394033 164637 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes, those do exist > 1570394036 567895 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07014]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=66518 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+13304) 10Created page with "0 is a joke language created by [[User:MiroslavRD|MiroslavRD]]. It is a glitchy [[brainfuck]] derivative. It distorts your code in these ways: * Add unexpected symbols * Re..." > 1570394045 966776 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Joke language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66519&oldid=66295 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+169) 10 > 1570394077 852447 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Aleph 014]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=66520 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+18) 10Redirected page to [[0]] > 1570394077 999798 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07014]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66521&oldid=66518 5* 03Ais523 5* (-11) 10unpipe link to userspace < 1570394164 361867 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :like the door opening keypad at my grandmother's house, which has such a short timeout that it erases my input between when I type the flat number and separator and when I figure out what the four-digit password is < 1570394200 610763 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I always get it only on second try, when I have the password cached into my short term memory rather than just use the mnemonic from my long term memory < 1570394217 359064 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so stupid, no need to have such a short timeout there < 1570394255 792045 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the purpose of a timeout on those things is often to prevent issues where one person leaves information partially entered and then another person uses the keypad, causing all the inputs to be misinterpreted < 1570394271 933241 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, I agree that there should be a timeout < 1570394277 3908 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just too short in that case < 1570394280 244431 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've seen mechanical keypads of that nature which, being mechanical, have no timeout; there are often big signs put above them saying "please remember to press cancel before using this keypad" < 1570394285 500763 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :How short is the timeout? < 1570394303 75131 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I don't remember, probably like five seconds < 1570394373 580503 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: this keypad has a display though, which shows "---" while you're typing the password < 1570394396 509245 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :this sort of keypad is really common, we have a similar one on this house, and one on my parents' house < 1570394472 27289 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the keypad reads digits by shining horizontal and vertical lights a millimeter in front of the keypad, and detecting which row and column of light is interrupted. thus it can only read one key at a time. < 1570394501 921761 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an interesting way to make a keypad that doesn't break easily from outdoor conditions and deliberate vandalism < 1570394548 442805 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :couldn't it read two or more keys at a time if they were in the same row or column? < 1570394565 566917 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps it could < 1570394585 408528 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I think it's better to detect those as invalid reads < 1570394663 626921 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? resetti < 1570394664 542913 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :resetti? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1570394747 576628 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could use them as chords to expand the character set of your passwords < 1570394778 998211 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the one at my parent's house already sometimes becomes unusable at winter. or it did before some of the hardware got replaced. so I say no. < 1570394803 121188 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you want to expand password space, just use passwords longer than four digits. < 1570394858 70764 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think four digit passwords is too short. Even if four digit passwords are allowed, the maximum should be more than that, perhaps eight or ten digits. < 1570394874 591847 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: for a house gate, it doesn't really matter < 1570394888 780153 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but sure, allowing a longer password is fine < 1570394903 602361 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the hardware these days can allow it easily < 1570394925 979007 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :for electronic house door openers I mean, not for eg. combination locks < 1570395709 58853 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? electronic monk < 1570395709 911657 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :electronic monk? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1570395976 714950 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Electrocuted monk? < 1570395991 278801 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: no. electronic monk, from Douglas Adams. < 1570396014 39683 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bah, humbug. < 1570396026 73216 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Go stick your head in a pig. < 1570396677 442654 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.206.178 PRIVMSG #esoteric :do someone knows what’s that CRT mania about? < 1570396687 301068 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.206.178 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how objective is it < 1570396698 99109 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :CRT? < 1570396705 634319 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? crt < 1570396706 468407 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :crt? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1570396707 250946 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.206.178 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CRT display, I mean < 1570396763 90675 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.206.178 PRIVMSG #esoteric :versus modern LCD technologies which there too many are now that I don’t know their betterness relations anymore < 1570396971 145263 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.206.178 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: I know one electronic monk, it’s called Delay Lama and is very old by now < 1570397156 857131 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :does he use mercury delay lines? < 1570397203 590434 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's funny you mention that, I had an idea for a language that functioned similarly to delay lines. < 1570397325 747985 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :instructions are laid out linearly. data is fed through them, one at a time. the instructions essentially define a pipeline. every element of memory is fed through the pipeline and then sent back through the loop until you hit a stopping point. < 1570397368 475737 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :with structured data items and stateful pipeline stages, could prove a concise dataflow language if you figure out how to "flatten" dataflow networks into a pipeline. < 1570397826 931939 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.206.178 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: as if! < 1570398090 795615 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.206.178 PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh, I meant to say “if only” < 1570398238 841596 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, could you combine the two phrases into "as if only" to make a simultaneous expression of disbelief and encouragement? < 1570398391 583589 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot probably could, he combines expressions from a too narrow window all the time < 1570398391 720551 :fungot!~fungot@2a01:4b00:82bb:1341::2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: your patience is commendable. let me check whether it is < 1570398535 421014 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: it's time for the new o strip. please post it. < 1570398535 515888 :fungot!~fungot@2a01:4b00:82bb:1341::2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: then i think you have a third-world browser? or disabling it voluntarly? sure < 1570398564 455920 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did do a shift-refresh. I'm not going to disable the browser cache for you. < 1570398902 898266 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: There's a few different claims for why they're "better", but the Big Ones are: CRTs have less intrinsic delay, CRTs are better at handling interlaced signals, and CRTs tend to be more accepting of odd display timings than modern LCDs are. < 1570398936 948416 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: also their colors look the same from a wider viewing angle < 1570398953 838574 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :For example, some games switch between 240p and 480i display modes with slightly different timing, and modern displays basically stop drawing anything during the switch. < 1570398959 266800 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.206.178 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: is that still an issue with modern types of LCDs? < 1570398959 303002 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :(old CRTs just don't care) < 1570398965 924133 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: I think so < 1570398987 795301 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: what did improve in LCDs is that their colors look nicer, and the contrast stronger < 1570399020 981793 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.206.178 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm I guess first of all I just don’t game too much, moreso in fullscreen < 1570399067 940943 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.206.178 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I even watched films in a window usually :D < 1570399076 3454 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ultimately all of those add up to "old game consoles were built for old displays, and modern displays aren't 100% compatible with them -- especially without a lot of hacks" < 1570399104 293416 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: the viewing angle thing isn't about that < 1570399118 566394 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, that's more a fundamental limitation in the display tech. < 1570399121 324343 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.206.178 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: wait, I thought they talked about modern gaming? oh < 1570399137 552956 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's both < 1570399140 872006 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though modern LCDs have _much_ better viewing angles than old ones did. < 1570399149 561135 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the larger part is that the old games were designed for crts < 1570399166 4509 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, CRTs having better latency still holds for modern gaming. < 1570399192 932441 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though -- if you purchase the right displays, you can get LCD displays with low enough latency it's not a problem. < 1570399195 737952 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's also that crts can do 200 hertz refresh and the visible output can change quickly compared to similarly priced lcds < 1570399206 236994 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I think that's getting somewhat solved by more expensive lcds < 1570399215 516351 :pikhq!uid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-putygvflmnyxxsta PRIVMSG #esoteric :(buuut it's a lot easier to find suitable CRTs) < 1570399240 708250 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I prefer lcds though, they have a lot of advantages < 1570400370 8822 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, at least nice lcds < 1570400378 623947 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :not the cheap ones that come with broken pixels < 1570400446 284501 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-235.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had the misfortune of meeting the latter kind at work < 1570401699 118525 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: quit < 1570402613 576720 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.206.178 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds > 1570402896 635356 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07014]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66522&oldid=66521 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+548) 10Fixed Brainfuck code to Aleph 0 code > 1570403116 679605 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07And then14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66523&oldid=46426 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+19) 10 < 1570403241 574540 :tromp_!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:a55c:6be6:8fc7:5784 JOIN :#esoteric > 1570403409 881242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Here's to the crazy ones14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66524&oldid=66511 5* 03MiroslavRD 5* (+42) 10 < 1570403445 18699 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:5de3:32a2:7b16:f0d4 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds > 1570403521 669904 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Template:CodeBox14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=66525 5* 03Moon 5* (+771) 10Migrate from Wikipedia. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:CodeBox I think it'd be more fitting here. > 1570403592 538757 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Template:CodeBox14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66526&oldid=66525 5* 03Moon 5* (-29) 10Remove tag, as the SyntaxHighlight extension is not installed on esolangs. > 1570403800 534127 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Template:CodeBox14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=66527&oldid=66526 5* 03Moon 5* (+8) 10 < 1570404204 283071 :tromp_!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:a55c:6be6:8fc7:5784 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1570404238 599267 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:a55c:6be6:8fc7:5784 JOIN :#esoteric < 1570404511 595058 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:a55c:6be6:8fc7:5784 QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1570405498 481843 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Quit: Laa shay'a waqi'un moutlaq bale kouloun moumkine < 1570405532 340954 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1570406207 884753 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does some mailing list software include support for NNTP?