< 1574726400 391734 :hppavilion[2]!~omegasome@172.98.86.92 JOIN :#esoteric < 1574726464 615292 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT : < 1574726619 268415 :hppavilion[1]!~omegasome@172.98.86.92 QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1574726699 605476 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.182.89.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1574732156 772192 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1574732997 869988 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1574733535 616449 :hppavilion[2]!~omegasome@172.98.86.92 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection > 1574734142 526718 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07HackEso14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67458&oldid=67391 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-7) 10/* The wisdom and quote databases */ Wrong directory > 1574735263 578962 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hello world program in esoteric languages14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67459&oldid=67446 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-1) 10Remind myself that you've inexplicably failed to mess up the order since my last check. Also fix language name. < 1574735297 866865 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which was back in January) < 1574735372 388912 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :first time i've checked out Recent Changes in ages < 1574737245 747566 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no TOPIC #esoteric :IOCCC source code escaped | Welcome to the international center for esoteric programming library design, development, and deployment! | https://esolangs.org | logs: https://esolangs.org/logs/ http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/ http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D https://github.com/KrzysztofSzewczyk/esologs/ > 1574737509 523901 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07HackEso14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67460&oldid=67458 5* 03Fizzie 5* (+0) 10/* The wisdom and quote databases */ I think this was probably intended as formatting. < 1574737618 498114 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'll add an "Implementation details" section just for the curious, though not now. < 1574737797 978382 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:1f:cd59:402a:af21 JOIN :#esoteric < 1574738059 978061 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:1f:cd59:402a:af21 QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1574739003 527927 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric > 1574740894 430296 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07H14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67461&oldid=67454 5* 03A 5* (-2) 10/* Implementations */ Add the new instruction > 1574741030 300054 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:H14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67462&oldid=67455 5* 03A 5* (+316) 10/* HWorld is a powerful language */ > 1574741125 688910 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Bin-814]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67463&oldid=67438 5* 03A 5* (+41) 10XD means eXtremely Destructible. > 1574741192 147362 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:H14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67464&oldid=67462 5* 03A 5* (-226) 10/* Q & A */ Not on-topic for this talk page < 1574744460 733517 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1574744481 20956 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1574744542 450994 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1574747424 714139 :moony!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony NICK :noomy < 1574750628 322179 :hakatashi1!~hakatashi@104.131.49.125 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1574750820 332329 :hppavilion[1]!~omegasome@172.98.86.92 JOIN :#esoteric < 1574751434 139887 :hakatashi!~hakatashi@104.131.49.125 JOIN :#esoteric < 1574751489 295884 :hakatashi!~hakatashi@104.131.49.125 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1574752400 543465 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1574752756 667023 :hakatashi!~hakatashi@104.131.49.125 JOIN :#esoteric < 1574752757 755858 :hakatashi!~hakatashi@104.131.49.125 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1574754359 973629 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:1154:e0fa:ddc3:145e JOIN :#esoteric < 1574754481 528452 :hakatashi!~hakatashi@104.131.49.125 JOIN :#esoteric < 1574757268 18344 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite < 1574757968 339222 :hppavilion[1]!~omegasome@172.98.86.92 QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1574758677 525641 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-13-127.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Quit: Lost terminal < 1574764895 998606 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric < 1574765067 522297 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :question about string literals. you know how there are languages like postscript where the open and close delimiter for a string literal is different, and you can put those delimiters inside the string unescaped if they are balanced. perl also allows this. < 1574765194 839745 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And you know how there are languages like Pascal and SQL where if you double the string delimiter inside a string, it escapes to a single delimiter. < 1574765310 922624 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I'd like to know is if there's a language where the open and close delimiters for string literals are different, but they don't nest, instead the open delimiter is not special inside the string, and you can start a string literal with the close delimiter instead of the open delimiter, in which case that starting close delimiter is part of the < 1574765311 513814 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :string contents, which effectively means that you can escape a close delimiter inside a literal by doubling it. < 1574765350 223686 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm planning to make string literals work this way in Consumer Society, but this part of the tokenization is basically independent of the rest of the language. < 1574765411 520016 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The drawback of this syntax that I propose is that you can't really parse source files read backwards. > 1574766754 525086 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07HackEso14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67465&oldid=67460 5* 03Fizzie 5* (+266) 10/* Command */ Split the difference: equal time for `` and ```. < 1574766979 797349 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah, I put ** instead of ''' for bold. I should just use ... and ..., those work alike on MediaWiki and SE. < 1574767085 31508 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, nuls are replaced by a '.' instead of truncating the message. But I'm going to fix the \r bug before updating that bit. (Sometime later, should get to work now.) < 1574767121 667438 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` echo -e 'foo\0bar\x01baz' < 1574767122 446262 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo.bar.baz < 1574767373 755014 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` echo $'foo\x00bar\rqux' < 1574767374 542245 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo < 1574767388 387422 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that's just weird. < 1574767416 988811 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` echo -e 'foo\0bar\x01baz' | od -tx1 < 1574767417 822819 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :0000000 66 6f 6f 00 62 61 72 01 62 61 7a 0a \ 0000014 < 1574767424 692374 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :um < 1574767433 579808 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` echo $'foo\x00bar' < 1574767434 326229 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo < 1574767439 689331 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` echo $'foo\x00bar' < 1574767440 508806 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo < 1574767449 884469 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` echo $'foo\x00bar\x01qux' < 1574767452 225916 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo < 1574767455 186443 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :What. < 1574767464 397046 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` echo -e 'foo\0bar\x01baz' < 1574767465 288640 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo.bar.baz < 1574767480 560780 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` echo -e 'foo\0bar\x01baz' | od -tx1 < 1574767481 298643 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :0000000 66 6f 6f 00 62 61 72 01 62 61 7a 0a \ 0000014 < 1574767483 237980 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right, obviously echo won't work with a raw \0 in the argument. < 1574767485 561058 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` echo $'foo\x00bar\x01baz' | od -tx1 < 1574767486 430989 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :0000000 66 6f 6f 0a \ 0000004 < 1574767489 900269 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1574767490 865467 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :duh < 1574767492 834402 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're right < 1574767508 582095 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`python3 -cprint("foo\x00bar\rqux") < 1574767509 562482 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo.bar < 1574767519 282374 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`python3 -cprint("foo\x00bar\x02qux") < 1574767520 96865 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo.barqux < 1574767527 154355 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that makes more sense. I was getting a little confused. < 1574767529 319801 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`python3 -cprint("foo\x00bar\x07qux") < 1574767530 196749 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo.barqux < 1574767561 450439 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :\0, \1 and \n are (or at least should be right now) the only specially treated characters. < 1574767577 651261 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is \x01 treated specially? oh right, CTCP < 1574767592 925385 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but \r is treated specially by the IRC server, so you should probably treat it specially too < 1574767596 201793 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1574767608 390699 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`python3 -cprint("foo\rPRIVMSG #esoteric :hello") < 1574767609 154361 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo < 1574767618 266430 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, it's not _that_ stupid < 1574767649 193339 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`python3 -cprint("\rPRIVMSG #esoteric :hello") < 1574767650 38414 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​ < 1574767674 741963 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, although I think it's only by luck, I'm still not 100% sure why it's not that stupid in general. < 1574767715 514191 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not sure yet whether I'll replace '\r' with '.' too (under the assumption that you'll want to know when you have them), treat any one of "\n", "\r", "\r\n" and possibly "\n\r" as a single newline, or collapse any sequence of '\n' and '\r' to a single " \ " (which would make the output more compact, but you couldn't see empty lines). < 1574767750 201830 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'm not sure how the server actually interprets \r and \n . maybe it truncates the line between \r and \n like I think some versions of TeX do < 1574767781 568314 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` echo -e 'foo\0bar\x01baz\rzuul' < 1574767782 367421 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo.bar.baz.zuul < 1574767791 816504 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hot-patched it into . for now. < 1574767800 811139 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the irc standard says that the line delimiter is \r\n and you can't have \r or \n elsewhere, and the server keeps this when sending lines to you, but when you send, it's easier to use \n as the line delimiter because all servers accept it. < 1574767869 770066 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` openssl rand -base64 16 < 1574767876 327461 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :That one's still broken. < 1574767877 510071 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(just checking) < 1574767905 580294 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1574767925 72502 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :There were some leftovers in the repo of some DCC magic, I think from EgoBot times when you could still do \x01 and had network connectivity. < 1574767993 959215 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wonder how much DCC is used in these days of CGNAT and whatnot. < 1574768108 270306 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linux's nf_conntrack_irc module has code to help DCC through, but I assume that's not very commonplace. < 1574769085 531672 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.182.89.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric > 1574773391 473077 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67466&oldid=67390 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+10) 10/* E */ > 1574773454 355028 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67467&oldid=67466 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+26) 10/* T */ < 1574773563 327709 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:1154:e0fa:ddc3:145e QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1574774383 987336 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:1154:e0fa:ddc3:145e JOIN :#esoteric > 1574775632 769418 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07The Temporary Stack14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67468&oldid=67457 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+6) 10/* Examples */ < 1574776613 500582 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :In some of these languages that try to have english-like syntax, it sometimes bothers me when they put terms in inconsistent orders because of that. I know three examples: (1) in python, the `for` stmt has the variable that you assign in front of the expression, but the `with` and `except` stmt has them after the expression. < 1574776650 838869 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(2) also in python, when you get or delete a key from a dictionary, the dictionary expression comes first and the key expression after, but if you test for existence of a key, then the key expression comes first. < 1574776806 630933 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean by the variable that you assign in front of the expression? like [x for y in z]? < 1574776879 925591 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would call y the assigned variable here which in fact is after for and not before < 1574776882 164749 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: I'm talking about statements or statement clauses. `for variable in expression:`, `except expression as variable:`, `with expression as variable:` < 1574776913 959797 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1574776919 779658 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but in a display too, it's `[... for variable in expression]` just like in a for stmt < 1574776931 296091 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(3) SQL, and this one is the worst because the delimiter is always ` AS `: in a `SELECT` stmt where you list expressions to extract as result columns, the expression comes first and the name of the new column next, similarly in the `FROM` clause the table expression come first and the name of that table next, BUT < 1574776983 832306 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT? < 1574777060 460554 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a common table expression introduced by `WITH`, the new table name comes first and the table definition expression after it, and in a `CREATE TABLE` statement for generated columns, the column name comes first and the expression generating it after. < 1574777103 260288 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least python uses `in` when the assigned variable comes first and `as` when the assigned variable goes after; in SQL all four of these use the `AS` separator < 1574777151 708455 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Luckily I'm writing python now, not SQL, so I'm only partly confused. < 1574777165 147808 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i agree to a degree on python. it doesn't bother me because the english-like syntax makes it easy to write it wothout thinking about it. I couldn't come up with a keyword that would make "for expression $keyword variable" work < 1574777201 406810 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`for` is the one you should keep, because assignment expressions have the newly assigned name on the left too < 1574777202 155503 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :for`? < 1574777221 71271 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :even in Python, you write `variable = expression` to assign to a variable < 1574777224 92823 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so `for` is fine < 1574777225 228755 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you propose for with and except then? < 1574777263 511679 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess they could use `with variable in expression` or `with variable = expression` too < 1574777338 965806 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, I know it's not a plain assignment, because the variable can get whatever the __enter__ method returns < 1574777367 71597 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it would be confusing in except < 1574777370 420436 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so make it `with variable in expression:` then < 1574777390 556529 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :because in that case you would have mathematical equality instead of definition < 1574777419 501382 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would find "with variable in expression" confusing < 1574777455 586544 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it would be ambiguous < 1574777460 143260 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it's probably best to leave it alone now < 1574777462 75478 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh... < 1574777468 167755 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, beacuse there's an `in` operator < 1574777475 699399 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're right. not that syntax then < 1574777587 561542 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps `with variable is expression:` and `except variable is expression:` if it were a new language, < 1574777606 261188 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's probably not worth to modify python syntax for this now that everyone knows the existing syntax < 1574777655 624988 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, `is` is not a keyword right now, it would be a keyword instead of `as` in this hypothetical alternate universe < 1574777692 272959 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1574777774 41961 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't like Haskell syntax, but Haskell do notation uses `<-` for this, which would be a bad idea in python < 1574777817 544315 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :"expect variable is expression" sounds more like assert(variable == expression) to me < 1574777863 481831 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: it's `except`, not `expect`. < 1574777881 342546 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :my fault < 1574777885 359427 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: I'm confusing myself with those too words too, but https://docs.python.org/3/reference/compound_stmts.html#the-try-statement says it's `except`, as in the start of `exception` < 1574777900 692997 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but `expect` would make sense for that keyword too, beacuse you use it when you expect an exception < 1574777923 213407 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you use it when the exception is not exceptional, but an expected normal condition from the side where you're viewing the code < 1574777965 444485 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`throw` and `catch` is less confusing :-) < 1574777966 130494 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :throw`? < 1574777984 318467 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, HackEso, I see fizzie modified your "command not found" message < 1574778010 668922 :kingoffrance!~x__@c-67-161-241-22.hsd1.ut.comcast.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1574778014 640569 :x_!~x__@c-67-161-241-22.hsd1.ut.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1574778034 711322 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: could you change the error message to two IRC lines, "'$command' is not recognized as an internal or external command," then "operable program or batch file." :-) < 1574778072 254697 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`=echo hello < 1574778073 11811 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​=echo? < 1574778079 281338 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1574778104 137485 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`str 1s++++++++[->++++++++<]>+.+.+. < 1574778104 857970 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :str? < 1574778108 679461 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :=str 1s++++++++[->++++++++<]>+.+.+. < 1574778108 810623 :bfbot!~bfbot@206.ip-51-91-102.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1574778117 422439 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :=def 1msg1 < 1574778117 557562 :bfbot!~bfbot@206.ip-51-91-102.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, defined 'msg1' < 1574778119 691499 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :=msg1 < 1574778119 788236 :bfbot!~bfbot@206.ip-51-91-102.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ABC < 1574778123 555099 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :=def 1msg? < 1574778123 677179 :bfbot!~bfbot@206.ip-51-91-102.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Error: Name can contain only lowercase letters and digits. < 1574778161 724427 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`=msg1 1 < 1574778162 390197 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​=msg1 1? < 1574778177 240808 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`@messages < 1574778177 984855 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​@messages? < 1574778208 580640 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@messages? < 1574778208 728891 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, no messages today. < 1574778218 817833 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :had to check < 1574778241 93979 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :=msg1 1 < 1574778241 223629 :bfbot!~bfbot@206.ip-51-91-102.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :No such command. Try =help. > 1574778253 398015 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[0712314]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67469&oldid=32365 5* 033snoW 5* (+1514) 10/* Examples */ < 1574778320 825606 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`j-bot,echo:'hello' < 1574778321 687268 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-bot,echo:'hello'? < 1574778321 980132 :j-bot!eldis4@firefly.nu PRIVMSG #esoteric :HackEso, pong: 'hello'? < 1574778338 817381 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, but you can do that without this change too I think < 1574778341 929095 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`echo j-bot,echo:'hello' < 1574778342 692551 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-bot,echo:'hello' < 1574778342 944413 :j-bot!eldis4@firefly.nu PRIVMSG #esoteric :HackEso, pong: 'hello' < 1574778400 7914 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because HackEso doesn't put a space before the message if it starts with a letter -- I find that weird, a starting letter is how you address people without a shortcut < 1574778405 451316 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`@cwnocnida < 1574778406 150796 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​@cwnocnida? < 1574778412 233852 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@phcvoqisda? < 1574778412 350700 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unknown command, try @list < 1574778422 772392 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdabot seems to ignore it < 1574778440 855024 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`^ocviqwnzuigh < 1574778441 537862 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​^ocviqwnzuigh? < 1574778741 940624 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, the rule that output matching ^[A-Za-z0-9_] doesn't get the space is a little arbitrary, especially with bots that accept "botname: " or "botname, " style commands around. < 1574778955 30975 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so fungоt and lambdabot seem to ignore HackEso completely, and it looks like I can't trigger bfbot for anything but an "Unknown command" error message because it seems to want a space after the command name < 1574778982 688637 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I probably can't use this new error message to make botloops, but that's partly by accident < 1574778985 394248 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`prefixes < 1574778986 834587 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bot prefixes: fungot ^, HackEso `, EgoBot !, lambdabot @ or ?, thutubot +, metasepia ~, idris-bot ( , jconn ) , j-bot [ , bfbot =. < 1574778996 102560 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't it just put a zero-width space at the beginning of its output? < 1574779003 551051 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, EgoBot and metasepia and thutubot aren't here < 1574779032 903011 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`echo =it puts a zero-width space before the input for cases like this < 1574779033 771123 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​=it puts a zero-width space before the input for cases like this < 1574779052 874314 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`=but_not_for_the_new_error_message < 1574779053 850831 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​=but_not_for_the_new_error_message? < 1574779062 103945 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe it does? < 1574779171 209361 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, I was wrong < 1574779184 320409 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :HackEso puts something before the error message too > 1574779308 980214 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:OsmineYT14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67470&oldid=67436 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+30) 10 > 1574779426 296045 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07USERA14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=67471 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+129) 10Created page with "{{wrongtitle|title=User:A}} USERA, or User-A is simple language maded by [[User:OsmineYT|OsmineYT]] and dedicated to [[User:A]]." > 1574779442 539422 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07USERA14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67472&oldid=67471 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+0) 10 > 1574779501 427520 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07USERA14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67473&oldid=67472 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+69) 10 > 1574779525 801730 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07USERA14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67474&oldid=67473 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+0) 10 < 1574780211 358348 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1574780256 33539 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it should be any output whatsoever. < 1574780325 469207 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 JOIN :#esoteric < 1574780386 322442 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1574780413 193242 :Frater_EST!adrianbibl@172.242.0.73 JOIN :#esoteric > 1574780591 359524 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07USERA14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67475&oldid=67474 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+243) 10 < 1574780622 197073 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 JOIN :#esoteric < 1574781052 400333 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric > 1574781148 219258 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:USERA14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=67476 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+10) 10Created page with "Discussion" > 1574781251 625780 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Bin-814]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=67477 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+44) 10Created page with "Only not maded discussion for [[Timed]] yet." > 1574781400 566788 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:H14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67478&oldid=67464 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+155) 10 < 1574781594 707074 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how did one format colors on irc < 1574781598 56217 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\u poop < 1574781633 431184 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kspalaiologos: search the internet for "mirc color codes" < 1574781638 668171 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :test < 1574781646 637355 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :alt codes don't seem to work < 1574781649 361854 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :tried to enter 1F < 1574781657 714993 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is, 29 < 1574781658 211255 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` echo $'thing \x0204,06colored' < 1574781659 30045 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :thing 04,06colored < 1574781663 910013 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm no < 1574781666 277875 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` echo $'thing \x0304,06colored' < 1574781667 109986 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :thing 04,06colored < 1574781675 845875 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :test < 1574781677 918145 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :still < 1574781679 595896 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ that, a control-C followed by foregroun and background color < 1574781681 473802 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my client is broken < 1574781705 153125 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :some clients deliberately ignore colors, mind you, because they're mostly used by spammers < 1574781708 249224 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and by relcome < 1574781709 722160 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`relcome < 1574781711 156921 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​02Welcome 06to 13the 04international 07hub 08for 09esoteric 02programming 06language 13design 04and 07deployment! 08For 09more 02information, 06check 13out 04our 07wiki: 08. 09(For 02the 06other 13kind 04of 07esoterica, 08try 09#esoteric 02on 06EFnet 13or 04DALnet.) < 1574781721 65692 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :`rainwords 10 < 1574781724 628103 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​0710 < 1574781734 509738 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1574781738 533168 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've seen your color < 1574781740 349814 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, it wasn't actually the combination of `rainbow and `words. < 1574781748 471978 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`rainbow stuff < 1574781749 268398 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​4s8t9u11f12f13 < 1574781759 120878 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't know it was a control-c < 1574781762 217681 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :good to know < 1574781764 833791 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`rainbow even more stuff to see how will the program behave when the text is longer than a single rainbow < 1574781765 634391 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​4e8v9e11n12 13m4o8r9e11 12s13t4u8f9f11 12t13o4 8s9e11e12 13h4o8w9 11w12i13l4l8 9t11h12e13 4p8r9o11g12r13a4m8 9b11e12h13a4v8e9 11w12h13e4n8 9t11h12e13 4t8e9x11t12 13i4s8 9l11o12n13g4e8r9 11t12h13a4n8 9a11 12s13i4n8g9l11e12 13r4a8i9n11b12o13w4 < 1574781769 744051 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it wraps over < 1574781772 73516 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :meeh < 1574781784 908343 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's only that many colors available. < 1574781786 120084 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` words 16 | rainwords # then < 1574781788 40696 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​13conaritt 04bca 07posite 08cutocyste 09occavel 02tograt 06scani 13gräbe 04dation 07majococh 08screta 09watry 02furp 06man 13oblike 04chiocken < 1574781794 167128 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, I wrote a graphics library for brainfuck yesterday < 1574781805 461885 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've sent a video somewhere here yesterday probably < 1574781808 784314 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's 100% pure brainfuck < 1574781814 138188 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1574781815 486770 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's using ASCII box drawing < 1574781818 686585 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it takes at most two digits, optionally followed by a comma and then at most two digits again, and you may need all the digits and commas depending on the following text, though you can cheat by adding a double control-B as a separator < 1574781819 169984 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :to plot single pixels < 1574781835 191251 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :post the video. < 1574781836 359896 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the actual keyboard shortcut is ^k in mIRC, actually? But it's the byte 0x03 it uses to introduce a color code. < 1574781840 122651 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has a 80x40 framebuffer < 1574781844 286775 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: yes < 1574781855 747494 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :^k for kolor, obviously. < 1574781886 169258 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`perl -eprintf"\x03%02d%02d ",$_,$_ for 0..99; print "." < 1574781886 969278 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​0000 0101 0202 0303 0404 0505 0606 0707 0808 0909 1010 1111 1212 1313 1414 1515 1616 1717 1818 1919 2020 2121 2222 2323 2424 2525 2626 2727 2828 2929 3030 3131 3232 3333 3434 3535 3636 3737 3838 3939 4040 4141 4242 4343 4444 4545 4646 4747 4848 4949 5050 5151 5252 5353 5454 5555 5656 5757 5858 5959 6060 6161 6262 6363 6464 6565 6666 6767 6868 6969 7070 7171 7272 7373 < 1574781904 469389 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`perl -eprintf"\x03,%02d%02d ",$_,$_ for 0..99; print "." < 1574781905 408363 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​,0000 ,0101 ,0202 ,0303 ,0404 ,0505 ,0606 ,0707 ,0808 ,0909 ,1010 ,1111 ,1212 ,1313 ,1414 ,1515 ,1616 ,1717 ,1818 ,1919 ,2020 ,2121 ,2222 ,2323 ,2424 ,2525 ,2626 ,2727 ,2828 ,2929 ,3030 ,3131 ,3232 ,3333 ,3434 ,3535 ,3636 ,3737 ,3838 ,3939 ,4040 ,4141 ,4242 ,4343 ,4444 ,4545 ,4646 ,4747 ,4848 ,4949 ,5050 ,5151 ,5252 ,5353 ,5454 ,5555 ,5656 ,5757 ,5858 ,5959 ,6060 ,6161 ,6262 ,6 < 1574781912 73805 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kspalaiologos.baselinux.net/videos/v000.mp4 < 1574781912 768768 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc < 1574781924 902571 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`perl -eprintf"\x030,%02d%02d ",$_,$_ for 0..99; print "." < 1574781925 665702 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​0,0000 0,0101 0,0202 0,0303 0,0404 0,0505 0,0606 0,0707 0,0808 0,0909 0,1010 0,1111 0,1212 0,1313 0,1414 0,1515 0,1616 0,1717 0,1818 0,1919 0,2020 0,2121 0,2222 0,2323 0,2424 0,2525 0,2626 0,2727 0,2828 0,2929 0,3030 0,3131 0,3232 0,3333 0,3434 0,3535 0,3636 0,3737 0,3838 0,3939 0,4040 0,4141 0,4242 0,4343 0,4444 0,4545 0,4646 0,4747 0,4848 0,4949 0,5050 0,5151 0,5252 0,5353 0,5454 0,5 < 1574781931 4322 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i used the video to demonstrate something was bricked with the WSL output < 1574781935 387609 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it worked fine on cmd < 1574781936 874895 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.182.89.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :my client shows all the formatting and colors but I’m lazy to investigate how does one input them in it < 1574781952 731517 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the program I made was just printing out "1986" (can you guess what date is it?) < 1574781965 992565 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :kspalaiologos: couldn't I just do that with a bf -> text generator? < 1574781973 232340 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :^possibly < 1574781977 777380 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'm working on a 3d cube < 1574781983 328304 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I got really near to finishing it < 1574781994 753992 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :to make a 3d spinning cube it would take you obscene amount of time and code < 1574781998 905993 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :using a generator < 1574782006 285486 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not dump it directly to the output. < 1574782010 810196 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :every frame. < 1574782032 542754 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a couple megabytes brainfuck file < 1574782034 497371 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :are there color codes for "default"? < 1574782046 125869 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :framebuffer is beneficial < 1574782047 651925 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: I think 0 and 1 are the default < 1574782074 946668 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :weird, 00,01text is slightly brighter than my default < 1574782103 871324 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i usually have a grey font color on black ground, 00,01 will print white on black ground here < 1574782152 747178 :FraterEST!adrianbibl@172.242.0.73 JOIN :#esoteric < 1574782167 182780 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I < 1574782170 499929 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :'ll work on font rendering < 1574782175 483931 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it may be a cool task < 1574782178 581954 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :99 is "default" in some clients, 0/1 I think are white and black. < 1574782188 305679 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although it's really up to how your client decides to interpret it. < 1574782206 542920 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :good old standards < 1574782212 454764 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1574782225 159582 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my client shows all of these above < 1574782230 755524 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dont think colors are irritating though < 1574782231 235433 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Colors 0 through 15 are the "old standard" ones, so they're what ^rainbow and friends use. Colors 16 .. 99 are "new standard" ones, with a little less support. < 1574782242 788019 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything looking uniformly is hard to comprehend < 1574782254 79586 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://modern.ircdocs.horse/formatting.html lists more format codes than I've ever heard of < 1574782258 47215 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :from what i can tell about mirc, i wouldn't be surprised if they never had the idea to make something like a default code because everybody has to use the software like they do < 1574782271 805090 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently someone invented codes for "Monospace" and "Strikethrough" < 1574782294 892398 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also that page says "99 - Default Foreground/Background - Not universally supported." < 1574782298 534501 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :my client doesn't show all of that. < 1574782304 204924 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :only 00 through 15. < 1574782316 999822 :Frater_EST!adrianbibl@172.242.0.73 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1574782363 272594 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :irssi does all 99, but (at least in this terminal) only actually uses the standard 16 terminal colors, so e.g. 27, 28 and 29 are all the same dark red. < 1574782397 229893 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :And of course there's no real orange, so 7 is brown. < 1574782564 198888 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` echo $'normal \x02bold\x02 normal \x1Ditalic\x1D normal \x1Funderlined\x1F normal \x1Estrikethrough\x1E normal \x11monospace\x11 normal \x16reverse\x16 normal' < 1574782567 459314 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :normal bold normal italic normal underlined normal strikethrough normal monospace normal reverse normal < 1574782589 330288 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1574783755 712410 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can see bold, underlined and reversed here. < 1574783790 817354 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :And esolangs.org/logs supports bold, italic, underlined and strikethrough. < 1574783829 433988 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, maybe you an always-monospace client "supports" monospace by default, kind of. < 1574783951 555692 :GeekDude!~G33kDude@unaffiliated/g33kdude QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1574784150 654857 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :somehow one of those control codes managed to mess up weechat's UI's colour a bit; impressive < 1574784161 30418 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :and somewhat worrisome < 1574784435 711907 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is mr. Cristofani still lurking the channel? < 1574784462 364209 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? dbc < 1574784463 548428 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :dbc? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1574784505 337768 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some clients also support regular ANSI codes and colors. < 1574784797 385237 :GeekDude!~G33kDude@unaffiliated/g33kdude JOIN :#esoteric < 1574786007 983078 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they dont support ansi escapes < 1574786011 445332 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they just don't filter it < 1574786083 564542 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, there are graphical clients that specifically do support them, IIRC. < 1574786107 303338 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :And from what I recall, irssi supports them pretty explicitly as well, parsing them to some internal format and then reconstructing for display. < 1574786122 7906 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :They definitely don't just leave \e unfiltered. < 1574787259 647618 :imode!~ryantoth@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1574787650 746412 :imode!~ryantoth@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds < 1574787782 387627 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1574787835 701911 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds < 1574787864 938575 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life > 1574789324 459512 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07HackEso14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67479&oldid=67465 5* 03Fizzie 5* (+3104) 10Document implementation details. < 1574790285 869092 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: Connection closed < 1574790845 608800 :laerlingsap!~laerling@193.16.224.13 JOIN :#esoteric < 1574791814 266161 :FraterEST!adrianbibl@172.242.0.73 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1574793037 309306 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric < 1574794044 871291 :laerlingsap!~laerling@193.16.224.13 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1574794274 976078 :laerling_!~laerling@193.16.224.13 JOIN :#esoteric < 1574795321 776299 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-102.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric < 1574795485 595422 :LKoen!~LKoen@lstlambert-657-1-123-43.w92-154.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1574795537 659704 :x_!~x__@c-67-161-241-22.hsd1.ut.comcast.net NICK :kingoffrance < 1574796771 648045 :laerling_!~laerling@193.16.224.13 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1574798451 501749 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`olist 1188 < 1574798452 348253 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :olist 1188: shachaf oerjan Sgeo FireFly boily nortti b_jonas < 1574800731 619137 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What an anticlimax. < 1574800760 737014 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-102.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: the kicker is in the next strip, which is the last one in the book < 1574800764 669368 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-102.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and may take more than one page < 1574800834 663778 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that true? < 1574800842 285085 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-102.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know for sure, < 1574800859 272335 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-102.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there's been a kicker at the last strip of all five main OotS books so far < 1574800871 827505 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-102.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the Giant says that the next strip is the last strip of this book < 1574800939 366732 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant that part. < 1574800991 980488 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-102.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=24280225 < 1574801083 812194 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe you but I guess I'll click the link anyway. < 1574801101 958082 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoa, 1189 will be posted on Monday. < 1574801129 487769 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-102.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it also says "the final strip will be posted Monday", which I thought at first was against the forum rules, but apparently it's not, the rule is worded that "Inappropriate topics. Missed/Late Comics: Threads speculating on when a comic will be posted or why it may be late will be locked; this does not apply to official threads started by site staff providing notification of a late comic." < 1574801167 948592 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Monday" is not all that specific anyway ;-) < 1574801197 499094 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-102.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah. no week or timezone specified. < 1574801203 266428 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :An official announcement isn't very speculative, anyway. < 1574801230 109703 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might be (sorry, weak pun) < 1574801230 675174 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-102.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, I thought the rule just said that you aren't allowed to discuss the schedule of online comic strips on that forum < 1574801308 947789 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :rules are made to be broken < 1574801341 7843 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the trick is not to get punished ;) < 1574801417 774541 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ethics dictate that you only break rules when it doesn't hurt other people < 1574801709 486329 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1574802366 586688 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is the "only" thing that SMT does over SAT is additional propagation rules? < 1574802373 566713 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/is // < 1574802652 744007 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't propagation optional? I mean, the minimum functionality is just detecting conflicts... < 1574802695 605171 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :...typically, when you have a conflict you also produce an unsatisfiable core for it because that's a propositional clause that can be learned. < 1574802841 173228 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, I guess thoe aren't the same. < 1574802865 527167 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think of "propagation" as deducing the consequences of the current assignment, in SAT, which might lead to an empty clause. But maybe the SMT situation is more nuanced. < 1574802944 243316 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, in the picture I have, the propagation is unit propagation from DPLL, handling the propositional part of a formula. < 1574802951 589967 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so SMT doesn't add anything there. < 1574802984 864851 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Well, not necessarily. I'm sure that it /could/ add things there.) < 1574803050 866789 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The thing I was thinking based on some vague verbal descriptions was that SMT effectively gives you implications between statements in your theory. < 1574803068 190532 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it can tell you that x > 5 implies x > 7, and I guess also falsifies x < 5. < 1574803096 8275 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I really know fairly little. Basically I've read the DPLL(T) paper, and learned some basics (linear algebra, equality reasoning, some ideas of theory combination) < 1574803113 351022 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whereas with unit propagation P only truthifies P and falsifies ¬P and nothing else? < 1574803129 144867 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should probably read that paper rather than blabbering on IRC. < 1574803230 997251 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :AFAIUI, if the solver ever asserts x > 5 and !x > 7 at the same time, that will be detected, and you'll get x > 5 /\ !x > 7 as an unsatisfiable core, so you can then learn the negation, which is that x > 5 implies x > 7. < 1574803272 929758 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :But! That paper is just the start of SMT research. I'm sure there's a lot more happening in modern solvers. < 1574803277 936847 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, maybe that's how it works. < 1574803298 81083 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Should I read all these papers or make a reasonable CDCL solver first? < 1574803308 234869 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably there's no actual point in writing a SAT solver. < 1574803325 181737 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :i,i because qbf solvers are where it's at < 1574803362 82679 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :AFAIK, QBF solvers also have a CDCL core though. < 1574803566 399943 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quantifier boolean formula? I just met 'er! < 1574803574 666532 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it's "quantified". < 1574805861 502185 :sftp!~sftp@unaffiliated/sftp QUIT :Excess Flood < 1574805877 362647 :sftp!~sftp@unaffiliated/sftp JOIN :#esoteric < 1574809580 983058 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-102.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1574809992 360715 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-102.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric < 1574810705 604775 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.182.89.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1574811656 325425 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:1585:3200:1154:e0fa:ddc3:145e QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1574812380 83158 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-102.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1574812415 43741 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-14-102.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric