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02:22:27 <oerjan> <shachaf> "RAII" is also a bad name. <-- Ra II would be a pretty badass name for an egyptian-style villain, though
02:23:54 <oerjan> hm Ra II is also the name of one of heyerdahl's boats iirc
02:25:30 <oerjan> `icode II II
02:25:31 <HackEso> ​[U+0049 LATIN CAPITAL LETTER I] [U+0049 LATIN CAPITAL LETTER I] [U+0020 SPACE] [U+0049 LATIN CAPITAL LETTER I] [U+0049 LATIN CAPITAL LETTER I]
02:25:49 <oerjan> huh identical
02:26:39 <int-e> Ra II = Ra ⅠⅠ = Ra Ⅱ <-- better?
02:27:13 <oerjan> oh wait it's the guillemets which norwegian wikipedia uses for some reason https://no.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Ra_II&redirect=no
02:27:30 <oerjan> `icode ⅠⅠ Ⅱ 
02:27:31 <HackEso> ​[U+2160 ROMAN NUMERAL ONE] [U+2160 ROMAN NUMERAL ONE] [U+0020 SPACE] [U+2161 ROMAN NUMERAL TWO] [U+0020 SPACE]
02:27:42 <oerjan> int-e: PERFECT
02:29:43 <oerjan> unlike the english wikipedia, the norwegian one seems to include things like plurals more often
02:30:10 <oerjan> e.g. https://no.wikipedia.org/wiki/Svaler is plural, corresponding to en:swallow
02:30:57 <oerjan> https://no.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stortinget corresponding to en:Storting, except with the definite article suffix
02:31:39 <int-e> Oh the bird, not the verb.
02:32:58 <oerjan> yeah
02:33:22 <oerjan> the article also considers the entire family of birds, so it makes some sense
02:33:25 <int-e> the de. version tops this and makes the plural version the main page, while the singular is a disambiguation page.
02:33:47 <int-e> (cf. https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schwalbe)
02:34:50 <oerjan> ah. the norwegian singular (Svale) is just a redirect to the plural.
02:35:34 <oerjan> ufu is definitely setting things up for an ironic disaster
02:36:17 <oerjan> in some sense, has done so ever since he was introduced
02:44:02 <shachaf> let this = perf_event_open in
02:44:06 <shachaf> Do you like this?
02:45:20 <shachaf> I was previously worried it would be a scow API but it seems pretty reasonable.
02:47:12 <shachaf> Also, did you know the syscall() wrapper in libc returns errors via errno rather than actually just wrapping the syscall?
02:47:32 <shachaf> I previously knew this but I keep forgetting it because when I write a syscall wrapper it's reasonable.
02:47:59 <oerjan> . o O ( just say no to errno )
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02:50:17 <int-e> oerjan: err... no?!
02:50:41 <shachaf> `! c syscall(1, 1, "hi\n", 3);
02:50:43 <HackEso> hi
02:50:44 <int-e> That is a terrible pun. I salute you.
02:51:07 <shachaf> Aha. It seems int-e likes that, but not this.
02:51:36 <int-e> I'm not sure "like" is the correct term.
02:52:16 <int-e> fungot: Nobody's like this.
02:52:16 <fungot> int-e: ' a'.
02:52:53 <shachaf> `! c syscall(1, 1, "1", 1);
02:52:55 <HackEso> 1
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02:59:49 <int-e> shachaf: How do you ensure that you got that WRITE?
03:02:17 <kingoffrance> . o O ( i dont know what scow means, but i imagine from context it refers to the cowtalk cow writing an API )
03:02:48 <kingoffrance> . o O ( via these things of course )
03:04:11 <int-e> `` \? scow # really helpful as always
03:04:13 <HackEso> Scow (S-cow) is canned meat made from cows with a lisp.
03:04:34 <kingoffrance> yes, that totally makes sense
03:04:47 <kingoffrance> i didnt know he had a lisp though
03:04:54 <kingoffrance> the more you know
03:06:08 <oerjan> i think cows are generally female, Cows with Guns notwithstanding.
03:06:59 <int-e> I can't wait for the Chickens with Choppers.
03:07:52 <oerjan> wind to the end then hth
03:08:12 <kingoffrance> s/cowtalk/cowsay/
03:08:15 <int-e> Though more on topic, the high steaks pun was terrific.
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03:09:52 <oerjan> `slwd scow//s,.$, and an extra half-spin./
03:09:53 <HackEso> ​/bin/sed: -e expression #1, char 30: unterminated `s' command
03:10:00 <oerjan> `slwd scow//s,.$, and an extra half-spin.,
03:10:11 <shachaf> `slwd scow//s,meat,join,
03:10:12 <HackEso> scow//Scow (S-cow) is canned meat made from cows with a lisp and an extra half-spin.
03:10:15 <kingoffrance> "terrific" is strange at first glance, but terror bringing joy is perfectly natural, so i see how the modern definition still has it
03:10:19 <HackEso> scow//Scow (S-cow) is canned join made from cows with a lisp and an extra half-spin.
03:11:01 <oerjan> hm race condition
03:11:06 <oerjan> shachaf: ETOOMANYPUNS
03:11:41 <oerjan> now with math _and_ physics.
03:11:58 <shachaf> It's not a good pun but it doesn't make me sad like the other one.
03:12:48 <int-e> Wait, who brought the lettuce to the S-cow?
03:13:28 <int-e> Now for the physics angle, hmm.
03:13:50 <int-e> Is it connected to quarks and interlingual?
03:15:18 <oerjan> quarks yes, interlingual not sure
03:15:21 <int-e> If so that's bad enough to make milk curdle.
03:16:07 <oerjan> yay!
03:16:08 <int-e> I don't think english really has "quark" in that sense. Cf. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curd
03:16:41 <int-e> Hence "interlingual".
03:16:52 <oerjan> oh i didn't think of that at all
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03:17:30 <int-e> Though, hmm. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quark_(dairy_product)
03:17:32 <oerjan> it's just about the s-, not the -cow, so to speak
03:17:36 <int-e> Maybe I'm just wrong.
03:17:40 <kingoffrance> i imagine degrees from kevin of bacin is like layers of interlingual
03:17:45 <int-e> Oh.
03:18:04 <kingoffrance> s/bacin/bacon/
03:18:08 <int-e> oerjan: Oh well, maybe I've taken it to a full spin now.
03:18:52 <int-e> Kevin Bacon is an excellent name for a pig.
03:23:13 <oerjan> oh s is for "scalar"
03:24:02 <oerjan> maybe it should be spinned down instead of up
03:24:03 <zzo38> Freeze Artifact {1UU} Snow Instant ;; Target artifact loses all abilities and has base power 0 until end of turn. Counter all triggered abilities of that artifact, and tap that artifact. ;; Flashback {4UU} ;; Affinity for snow lands
03:27:01 <oerjan> `? scream
03:27:02 <HackEso> scream? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
03:28:32 <int-e> `? sport
03:28:33 <HackEso> sport <n> divides its input into irc-sized pieces and displays the nth (default first). The pipe version of `1. See also spore.
03:28:59 <int-e> (Port is not a dairy product, fortunately.)
03:30:19 <oerjan> int-e: logically sport is a swine product though.
03:30:54 <int-e> right.
03:32:49 <int-e> oerjan: I guess "steak" is also interesting in this context.
03:33:21 <oerjan> `slwd scow//s,an .*,spun down by half to remove the scream.,
03:33:24 <HackEso> scow//Scow (S-cow) is canned join made from cows with a lisp and spun down by half to remove the scream.
03:35:15 <oerjan> i am afraid that edit may have done the opposite, alas.
03:35:30 <oerjan> @wn teak
03:35:31 <lambdabot> *** "teak" wn "WordNet (r) 3.0 (2006)"
03:35:32 <lambdabot> teak
03:35:32 <lambdabot>     n 1: hard strong durable yellowish-brown wood of teak trees;
03:35:32 <lambdabot>          resistant to insects and to warping; used for furniture and
03:35:32 <lambdabot>          in shipbuilding [syn: {teak}, {teakwood}]
03:35:33 <lambdabot> [3 @more lines]
03:36:23 <oerjan> the tense change was obvious when i saw it hth
03:36:47 <oerjan> or well, noun -> verb change
03:41:33 <kingoffrance> this channel is answering all my questions in life today
03:41:34 <oerjan> . o O ( ETHEYJUSTKEEPPILINGON )
03:41:34 <oerjan> int-e: i think a steak pun in this context might be hard to chew and we should table it for later.
03:41:34 <int-e> are you sure you don't want to stable it instead
03:41:34 <oerjan> i was on the edge
03:41:34 <oerjan> you're right
03:41:46 <oerjan> excellent
03:41:51 <kingoffrance> it is common phenomenon restaurants e.g. have a pig with a fork, to advertise bacon;  so yes, kevin bacon is his name
03:42:37 <kingoffrance> its supposed to be "umm, im so tasty i could eat myself, dont you want some?"
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03:43:21 <int-e> oerjan: the steak may fall to slumber
03:44:47 <oerjan> saw.
03:45:15 <int-e> I'm still looking for a use of "scrying".
03:45:43 <int-e> (By this point I'm cheating, and employing stool support.)
03:46:17 <int-e> `` comm -12 /usr/share/dict/words <(grep ^s /usr/share/dict/words | sed 's=.==' | sort) | wc -c
03:46:18 <HackEso> comm: file 1 is not in sorted order \ 0
03:46:33 <int-e> `` comm -12 <(sort /usr/share/dict/words) <(grep ^s /usr/share/dict/words | sed 's=.==' | sort) | wc -c
03:46:34 <HackEso> 7829
03:47:11 <int-e> `` echo $(comm -12 <(sort /usr/share/dict/words) <(grep ^s /usr/share/dict/words | sed 's=.==' | sort) | shuf)
03:47:12 <HackEso> patters lightness's miles hatters hot cores hare ow trident lab wine lop age nagged purred cowl have pins tout's ell's park's allies ledge's cams late lump's tall kidding cram lob's loped lick horn tumble's molders ail wished crawling hoot tumbler's tow potty tuck melt's weeping he'll handy crews evens wears mocking ampler wagging pawned pout's hod crew parring tared paces wig hale lap table top's mocked trapped lump unless cone's molder's ton
03:47:13 <oerjan> just keep swiping the data
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03:48:33 <int-e> actually for a random selection that contains an amazing number of candidates we've already covered.
03:51:36 <oerjan> now find a sentence that makes sense both with and without prepending s to every word :P
03:52:50 <oerjan> i suppose there might not be enough connective words starting in s to make it work for long
03:54:51 <shachaf> Hmm, say I have struct { T *p; int len, cap; } arr; defined locally.
03:55:01 <shachaf> I pass &arr.p to some other function.
03:55:07 <shachaf> Can it get at len and cap without UB?
03:58:33 <oerjan> `8ball can he?
03:58:33 <HackEso> Very doubtful.
03:59:01 <kingoffrance> its difficult to answer that since i may hold things hostage, but when i do it its not called piracy
03:59:36 <kingoffrance> 'arr' is out of my field
04:03:07 <kingoffrance> you basically might have padding
04:03:17 <kingoffrance> so you can get to something, perhaps padding
04:03:26 <kingoffrance> theres an offsetof macro or something
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04:20:41 <oerjan> `! c return *(int *)0;
04:20:43 <HackEso> ​/hackenv/interps/gcccomp/gcccomp: line 53:    68 Segmentation fault      /tmp/compiled.$$
04:21:01 <oerjan> `brl !
04:21:02 <HackEso> https://hack.esolangs.org/repo/file/tip/bin/%21
04:23:59 <oerjan> `../hackenv/ibin/c return *(int *)0;
04:24:00 <HackEso> ​../hackenv/ibin/c? No such file or directory
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04:24:10 <oerjan> `/hackenv/ibin/c return *(int *)0;
04:24:14 <HackEso> ​/hackenv/interps/gcccomp/gcccomp: line 53:    62 Segmentation fault      /tmp/compiled.$$
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04:25:55 <oerjan> `` echo $$
04:25:55 <HackEso> 50
04:26:09 <oerjan> `echo $$
04:26:10 <HackEso> ​$$
04:26:40 <oerjan> `` sh -c 'echo $$'
04:26:41 <HackEso> 53
04:28:10 <oerjan> `slwd lib/interp//6iecho $ARGFILE
04:28:12 <HackEso> Roswbud!
04:28:19 <oerjan> `t sled lib/interp//6iecho $ARGFILE
04:28:21 <HackEso> lib/interp//#!/bin/sh \  \ export I_CMD="$0" \ export I_ARG="$1" \ export ARG_FILE="/tmp/input.$$" \ echo $ARGFILE \  \ get_arg() { \     #if expr "$I_ARG" : "http://" > /dev/null \     #then \     #    wget $WGET_OPTIONS "$I_ARG" -O "$ARG_FILE" \     #else \         printf '%s' "$I_ARG" > "$ARG_FILE" \     #fi \ } \  \ clean_arg() { \     rm -f "$ARG_FILE" \ } \  \ interp_stdin() { \     get_arg \     $1 < "$ARG_FILE" 2>&1 \     clean_arg \ }
04:28:36 <oerjan> `/hackenv/ibin/c return *(int *)0;
04:28:38 <HackEso> ​ \ /hackenv/interps/gcccomp/gcccomp: line 53:    62 Segmentation fault      /tmp/compiled.$$
04:29:27 <oerjan> `` /hackenv/ibin/c 'return *(int *)0;' 2>/dev/null
04:29:29 <HackEso> ​ \ /hackenv/interps/gcccomp/gcccomp: line 53:    66 Segmentation fault      /tmp/compiled.$$
04:29:36 <oerjan> hum
04:32:50 <oerjan> `revert
04:32:51 <HackEso> Done.
04:32:55 <oerjan> `before
04:32:57 <HackEso> ​/hackenv/lib/interp//#!/bin/sh \  \ export I_CMD="$0" \ export I_ARG="$1" \ export ARG_FILE="/tmp/input.$$" \ echo $ARGFILE \  \ get_arg() { \     #if expr "$I_ARG" : "http://" > /dev/null \     #then \     #    wget $WGET_OPTIONS "$I_ARG" -O "$ARG_FILE" \     #else \         printf '%s' "$I_ARG" > "$ARG_FILE" \     #fi \ } \  \ clean_arg() { \     rm -f "$ARG_FILE" \ } \  \ interp_stdin() { \     get_arg \     $1 < "$ARG_FILE" 2>&1 \     c
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05:02:16 <esowiki> [[IBC]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67616&oldid=67607 * Quadril-Is * (+0) /* Cat program */
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06:13:05 <oerjan> <FireFly> wib_jonas: ah <-- scowrevs is generally stupid revisions that affected a lot of files and then got reverted, so it doesn't really tell you anything useful but clutters up what you're really looking for
06:13:35 <oerjan> nearly all of the time
06:15:06 <oerjan> if there are any ranges in there that _didn't_ end up changing nothing, that may be considered an error
06:15:49 <oerjan> `? scowrevs
06:15:50 <HackEso> scowrevs? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
06:18:29 <oerjan> `le/rn scowrevs///hackenv/share/scowrevs is a list of repository revision ranges that affected a lot of files but in the end changed nothing (usually because of a revert at the end). Most of our custom repository lookup commands ignore these to reduce noise.
06:18:32 <HackEso> Learned 'scowrevs': /hackenv/share/scowrevs is a list of repository revision ranges that affected a lot of files but in the end changed nothing (usually because of a revert at the end). Most of our custom repository lookup commands ignore these to reduce noise.
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08:35:51 <timofonic> zzo38: Hello. Where's Aimfiz and Fweep source code? I cant f8nd it on GitLab, GitHub or similar. Do you know about dreammaster's ScummGlk in the ScummVM project? There's #scummvm IRC channel. Disclaimer: I'm not part of the ScummVM project, just a mere user and fan of IF and Point & Click Adventure Games.
08:38:06 <timofonic> I tried to use a Gopher proxy to look at your site, no success at all. You made lots of nntp links on it
08:54:49 <oerjan> <myname> I suppose, if you pronounce gif as jif, you should pronounce fungot as funjot <-- i don't think that's orthographically plausible, g before "o" is never soft.
08:54:50 <fungot> oerjan: could you juse for fun _only_ switch the backend to accomodate the fnord of a
08:55:18 <oerjan> it would have to be spelled fungeot for that.
08:59:46 <oerjan> also, g before "a" shouldn't be, but someone had to invent "gaol".
09:00:29 * oerjan waits for the avalanche of counterexamples
09:01:10 <oerjan> well, unless o or a are part of diphthong, that could mess things up.
09:01:48 <oerjan> *is
09:02:36 <oerjan> `? fungi
09:02:37 <HackEso> fungi? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
09:03:52 <b_jonas> oerjan: for "ga", Alan's pronunciation dictionary says "mortgagor" but I've no idea what that means
09:04:18 <b_jonas> no, that's for "go"
09:04:41 <b_jonas> and for "ga", it says "algae, baggage, 
09:05:31 <b_jonas> gaol, gaolbird, gaolbreak, gaoler, margarine"
09:06:45 <b_jonas> nowait, the baggage is one of the many false positives too, where the other g is pronounced soft
09:07:19 <b_jonas> in that case, the counterexamples are "mortgagor" for "go" and "algae, gaol, gaolbird, gaolbreak, gaoler, margarine" for "ga"
09:08:58 <b_jonas> https://esolangs.org/logs/2019-10.html#lnEc for meta-info on Alan's pronunciation dictionary
09:11:41 <oerjan> algae has a dipthong, but margarine seems right
09:12:09 <b_jonas> it doesn't seem right to me, English is just pronouncing it wrong
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09:13:14 <oerjan> i know, but it seems like a counterexample
09:14:47 <oerjan> mortgagor is illogical, although Agoran
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09:35:14 <esowiki> [[///]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67617&oldid=67034 * Quadril-Is * (+241) /* Hello, world! */
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10:26:03 <esowiki> [[Beatnik]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67618&oldid=53676 * Quadril-Is * (+53) /* Cat program */
10:31:25 <esowiki> [[Beatnik]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67619&oldid=67618 * Quadril-Is * (-53) nope doesn
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11:58:55 <timofonic> zzo38: If you are interested, dreammaster is usually there (depending on each timezone, of course). I also read the IRC logs of both channels, ScummVM developers also usually read the #scummvm channel IRC logs too. What do you think? :)
12:02:05 <timofonic> Why do you people care about pronunciation? Do you find geeks in person to be able to talk about this stuff in person and not only text?
12:03:07 <kingoffrance> although i am not in that group discussing, pronunciation is everything for certain things
12:03:12 <kingoffrance> and spelling is zilch
12:03:30 <kingoffrance> pronunciation is a spelling of sorts
12:04:07 <kingoffrance> you have to say magic words correctly or they do strange things
12:04:28 <kingoffrance> and you have to purposely say them strangely if you want correct things
12:04:36 <kingoffrance> which requires knowing "correctness"
12:06:06 <timofonic> Most personally important stuff for me is in written form, anyway
12:06:48 <kingoffrance> there are phonic writings
12:17:52 <shachaf> `t t 5 t t ` w
12:17:54 <HackEso> ​/hackenv/bin/`: eval: line 5: unexpected EOF while looking for matching ``' \ /hackenv/bin/`: eval: line 6: syntax error: unexpected end of file \ /hackenv/bin/`: eval: line 5: unexpected EOF while looking for matching ``' \ /hackenv/bin/`: eval: line 6: syntax error: unexpected end of file \ /hackenv/bin/`: eval: line 5: unexpected EOF while looking for matching ``' \ /hackenv/bin/`: eval: line 6: syntax error: unexpected end of file \ /ha
12:18:09 <shachaf> uh oh
12:18:12 <shachaf> `t t 5 t t w
12:18:17 <HackEso> ​/hackenv/bin/nur: line 2: : command not found \ /hackenv/bin/nur: line 2: : command not found \ /hackenv/bin/nur: line 2: : command not found \ /hackenv/bin/nur: line 2: : command not found \ /hackenv/bin/nur: line 2: : command not found \ 1/0:
12:18:28 <shachaf> `t t 5 w
12:18:30 <HackEso> 1/1:gamemanj//gamemanj is also the mad scientist I. N. Here. He will overthink everything, except whether overthinking is wrong. \ apt-get//apt-get installs whatever you wanted, plus whatever Mark Shuttleworth wanted. \ tswett//tswett is livin' it up with the penguins. He's a title under the cruxite in the lathe. \ baba//BABA IS ¯\(°​_o)/¯ \ hug//hug? ¯\_/¯\(°​_o)/¯\_/¯
12:18:41 <shachaf> Right. 5 is a run, not a nur.
12:20:17 <kingoffrance> re: pronunciation, also, to correctly satirize something you have to know it well enough
12:20:55 <kingoffrance> so the people so concerned may be in agreement on the worthlessness of pronunciation
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14:07:31 <arseniiv> `cwlprits baba
14:07:33 <HackEso> oerjän
14:07:39 <arseniiv> hahaha :D
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15:36:27 <esowiki> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create  * Hex96 *  New user account
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15:42:39 <esowiki> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67620&oldid=67602 * Hex96 * (+148) /* Introductions */
15:42:50 <esowiki> [[Talk:Burn]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67621&oldid=60871 * Hex96 * (+272) /* I think I got the main parts down */ new section
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16:16:06 <esowiki> [[Talk:Burn]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67622&oldid=67621 * Hex96 * (+65) /* I think I got the main parts down */
16:22:39 <esowiki> [[Code is eso]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67623&oldid=67610 * DmilkaSTD * (+320) 
16:22:58 <esowiki> [[Code is eso]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67624&oldid=67623 * DmilkaSTD * (+1) 
16:25:15 <esowiki> [[Code is eso]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67625&oldid=67624 * DmilkaSTD * (+15) 
16:29:26 <esowiki> [[Code is eso]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67626&oldid=67625 * DmilkaSTD * (+2) 
16:35:47 <esowiki> [[Talk:Burn]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67627&oldid=67622 * Hex96 * (+477) /* Attempted programs */ new section
16:36:09 <esowiki> [[Talk:Burn]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67628&oldid=67627 * Hex96 * (+5) /* Attempted programs */
16:37:32 <esowiki> [[Talk:Burn]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67629&oldid=67628 * Hex96 * (+25) /* Attempted programs */
16:56:08 <cpressey> arseniiv: From what I understood from reading about HOAS, the powerful thing about full-blown HOAS is that it treats two terms as equivalent if one can be α-, β-, or η- converted to the other.  Unification modulo αβη-conversion, in other words.
16:57:10 <cpressey> And that's what makes it need higher-order unification to work.
16:58:24 <cpressey> But I think that's probably far more powerfully expressive than I'd ever need or want!
17:01:08 <arseniiv> cpressey: hmm wait, how is equivalence defined there?
17:01:17 <arseniiv> anyway interesting
17:02:27 <cpressey> I think you could say, if, by the rules of lambda calculus, you could reduce some term X to some other term Y, then HOAS treats them as effectively the same term.
17:03:25 <cpressey> I mean, that was my understanding of it, anyway.
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17:13:25 <arseniiv> cpressey: do you mean, computationally? then it should be a broader equivalence, I think…
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17:18:52 <cpressey> arseniiv: It may be that I fail to see all the implications, but I can't see how it could be anything other than computational, in this sense: there's nothing else in the lambda calculus besides α-, β-, and η- conversion, so if you permit all of those to happen when considering if two terms are equivalent, then... well, you allow arbitrary computations.
17:21:42 <arseniiv> cpressey: I think I have seen two non-αβη-convertible combinators with the same behavior. Hm maybe two divergent ones, let’s say Ω and maybe YI?
17:22:51 <zzo38> timofonic: What is the context of that? What is it about?
17:23:31 <zzo38> O, I found your previous message too now
17:23:39 <zzo38> OK I understand
17:23:42 <cpressey> arseniiv: That seems likely.  (It seems like it should be the implication of some famouse theorem maybe)  But even when they are αβη-convertible, the problem of actually converting one into the other is undecidable in general.
17:23:48 <cpressey> *famous
17:23:58 <zzo38> The answer is I have lost the source code for Fweep and Aimfiz
17:24:54 <zzo38> Does the gopher proxy break when there are NNTP links? If not, then the stuff other than the NNTP link should still work isn't it?
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17:28:26 <zzo38> The NNTP links are listed under the "ZZ Zero" menu; are you interested in ZZ Zero?
17:28:55 <zzo38> (I should perhaps add some additional information there too; that menu does not describe much of what ZZ Zero is.)
17:30:46 <esowiki> [[User:Hex96]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=67630 * Hex96 * (+106) Created page with "I have a challenge for you, I call it the r challenge, get input and print it backwards. Thats it"
17:35:55 <esowiki> [[Talk:Burn]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67631&oldid=67629 * Dart * (+42) 
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17:49:50 <zzo38> (ZZ Zero is a ZZT-like game creation system. If you have used ZZT or MegaZeux or ZIG or other ZZT-likes then maybe you can understand what I mean by this)
17:51:32 <esowiki> [[User:Hex96]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67632&oldid=67630 * Palaiologos * (+150) 
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17:52:30 <kspalaiologos> I felt like I have to complete this challenge
17:52:35 <kspalaiologos> just a random thought
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18:07:53 <kritixilithos> what is HOAS?
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18:23:03 <int-e> "higher order abstract syntax"
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18:32:31 <arseniiv> I thought that was an acronym of HOAS Often Are Serious
18:33:01 <arseniiv> or maybe sentimental or serialized
18:35:14 <esowiki> [[User:Hex96]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67633&oldid=67632 * Hex96 * (+26) 
18:36:02 <kritixilithos> thanks int-e
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18:41:07 <esowiki> [[User:Hex96]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67634&oldid=67633 * Hex96 * (+104) 
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18:43:23 <esowiki> [[User talk:Hex96]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=67635 * Hex96 * (+77) Created page with "Hiya, I make "burn" theories. I also have a challenge. It is in my user page."
18:48:34 <esowiki> [[Burn]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67636&oldid=31184 * Hex96 * (+53) 
18:52:03 <esowiki> [[Talk:Burn]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67637&oldid=67631 * Hex96 * (+137) /* Attempted programs */
18:52:30 <esowiki> [[Talk:Burn]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67638&oldid=67637 * Hex96 * (+5) 
18:52:53 <esowiki> [[Talk:Burn]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67639&oldid=67638 * Hex96 * (+0) 
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18:58:38 <esowiki> [[Talk:Burn]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67640&oldid=67639 * Hex96 * (-6) /* Attempted programs */
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19:46:44 <esowiki> [[User:Hex96]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67641&oldid=67634 * Hex96 * (+39) 
19:48:18 <esowiki> [[User:Hex96]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67642&oldid=67641 * Hex96 * (+481) 
19:49:11 <esowiki> [[User:Hex96]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67643&oldid=67642 * Hex96 * (+13) 
19:49:44 <esowiki> [[User:Hex96]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67644&oldid=67643 * Hex96 * (+0) 
19:51:07 <esowiki> [[User:Hex96]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67645&oldid=67644 * Palaiologos * (+138) 
19:51:19 <esowiki> [[User:Hex96]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67646&oldid=67645 * Palaiologos * (+104) Forgot to sign :p
19:57:42 <esowiki> [[User:Hex96]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67647&oldid=67646 * Hex96 * (+65) 
19:59:01 <esowiki> [[User:Hex96]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67648&oldid=67647 * Hex96 * (+24) 
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20:23:17 <b_jonas> kspalaiologos: how was the incineration? I hope you payed attention to safety.
20:24:15 <kspalaiologos> I'm still working on it among other things
20:24:39 <kspalaiologos> I've made a few decisions regarding the bot already so I might be able to rewrite it pretty quickly as I get to doing it lol
20:25:12 <b_jonas> ok
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20:32:52 <esowiki> [[User:Hex96]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=67649&oldid=67648 * JonoCode9374 * (+219) 
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23:12:22 <fizzie> HackEso
23:12:38 <fizzie> ...whoop, keyboards are hard.
23:12:50 <shachaf> `5 botsnack
23:12:52 <HackEso> 1/1:>:-D \ >:-D \ >:-D \ >:-D \ >:-D
23:13:06 <shachaf> `? 1
23:13:08 <HackEso> The 1 is just for disambiguation.
23:13:11 <shachaf> `? `1
23:13:12 <HackEso> ​`1 <cmd> is equivalent to `` <cmd>, except that it splits the output into irc-sized pieces. The next pieces can be viewed with `spam. See also `2. Confusingly the obvious generalization of `4.
23:13:19 <shachaf> `? `2
23:13:20 <HackEso> ​`2 <cmd> is equivalent to `1 <cmd>, except that it starts displaying the _second_ output piece. Useful when you've already run a command forgetting to use `1.
23:13:22 <shachaf> `? `4
23:13:24 <HackEso> ​`4 <cmd> is equivalent to `5 <cmd>, except that it only repeats 4 times. Useful when you've already run a command forgetting to use `5.
23:13:29 <shachaf> `? `5
23:13:30 <HackEso> ​`5 <cmd> is equivalent to repeating `` <cmd> 5 times, then splitting the output into irc-sized pieces. <cmd> defaults to "quote". See `1, `4 and `spam. Confusingly _not_ the obvious generalization of `2.
23:13:41 <fizzie> `? `3
23:13:42 <HackEso> ​`3 is the obvious generalization of `2 or `4, trying too hard to confuse everyone.
23:14:47 <fizzie> Anyway, what I was going to do was comment on that thing from -blah.
23:14:48 <fizzie> `
23:14:49 <HackEso> ​? Permission denied
23:14:59 <fizzie> Which is an odd error.
23:15:00 <shachaf> `
23:15:02 <HackEso> ​? Permission denied
23:15:07 <fizzie> Presumably it's trying to execute the empty string.
23:15:08 <shachaf> Is it trying to execute a directory?
23:15:18 <shachaf> `/hackenv/bin
23:15:19 <HackEso> ​/hackenv/bin? Permission denied
23:15:21 <fizzie> Yes, I think that would follow.
23:15:54 <shachaf> `! c execve("", (char *[]){}, 0);
23:15:56 <HackEso> No output.
23:16:06 <fizzie> Please don't make /hackenv/bin a file just to test that.
23:16:19 <shachaf> `! c execve("", (char *[]){}, 0); printf("error: %s\n", strerror(errno));
23:16:20 <HackEso> Does not compile.
23:16:30 <shachaf> `! c execve("", (char *[]){}, 0); printf("error: %d\n", errno);
23:16:31 <HackEso> Does not compile.
23:16:42 <fizzie> `! c printf("test\n");
23:16:44 <HackEso> test
23:17:00 <shachaf> `! c (int)errno;
23:17:02 <fizzie> I remember at least one of these turned the \n into a newline even when inside a string literal.
23:17:04 <HackEso> Does not compile.
23:17:06 <shachaf> What an omission.
23:17:15 <fizzie> `! c perror("uh");
23:17:16 <HackEso> uh: Success
23:17:19 <fizzie> There's that.
23:17:40 <shachaf> `cat /hackenv/ibin/c
23:17:41 <HackEso> ​#!/bin/sh \ . ${HACKENV-/hackenv}/lib/interp \ interp_file "${HACKENV-/hackenv}/interps/gcccomp/gcccomp c"
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23:17:54 <fizzie> `! c execve("", (char *[]){}, 0); perror("execve");
23:17:56 <HackEso> execve: No such file or directory
23:18:04 <shachaf> `cat /hackenv/interps/gcccomp/gcccomp
23:18:07 <HackEso> ​#!/bin/bash \ LANG="$1" \ echo >>"$2" \  \ case "$LANG" in \     c) \         HEAD='#include <stdio.h>\n#include <stdlib.h>\n#include <string.h>\n#include <sys/types.h>\n#include <unistd.h>\nint main(int argc, char **argv) {' \         TAIL='; return 0; }' \         EXT='c' \         GCC='gcc' \         FLAGS='-lm -std=gnu99' \     ;; \  \     c++) \         HEAD='#include <iostream>\n#include <cstdio>\n#include <cstdlib>\n#include <cstring
23:18:20 <fizzie> Anyway, thanks to the path search ` is not a straightforward execve.
23:18:52 <shachaf> `! c execlo("", 0); perror("exec");
23:18:53 <HackEso> Does not compile.
23:18:54 <shachaf> uh
23:18:56 <shachaf> `! c execlp("", 0); perror("exec");
23:18:57 <HackEso> exec: No such file or directory
23:19:01 <fizzie> Since "" does not contain a '/', it would try to execute "/hackenv/bin/", "/bin/" and "/usr/bin/" in order.
23:19:08 <fizzie> I guess that's technically a bug.
23:19:10 <shachaf> `! c execlp("/hackenv", 0); perror("exec");
23:19:12 <HackEso> exec: Permission denied
23:19:23 <shachaf> It must be doing a different path search from execlp, if that's what's going's on's.
23:19:36 <fizzie> Yes, it does a manual path search.
23:20:02 <fizzie> Because exec*p is hardcoded to use /bin/sh for files that are executable but not #!something.
23:20:17 <fizzie> And longstanding tradition has those must be executed with /bin/bash.
23:20:25 <shachaf> A manual path search? Does that mean it's searching in /usr/share/man/?
23:21:17 <fizzie> Heh, heh.
23:21:52 <shachaf> `! c execve("/hackenv/bin/run", (char *[]){0}, 0); perror("that does not compute");
23:21:54 <HackEso> that does not compute: Exec format error
23:22:36 <fizzie> "p - execlp(), execvp(), execvpe() -- In addition, certain errors are treated specially. If the header of a file isn't recognized (the attempted execve(2) failed with the error ENOEXEC), these functions will execute the shell (/bin/sh) with the path of the file as its first argument."
23:24:00 <fizzie> It's all in https://github.com/fis/umlbox/blob/master/init.c#L248
23:24:51 <shachaf> Golly. So many malloc calls.
23:25:23 <shachaf> It's kind of funny to use malloc to allocate arguments to exec.
23:25:46 <fizzie> I did in fact consider using a VLA there.
23:26:09 <shachaf> Well, that could cause a stack overflow or something.
23:26:36 <fizzie> In a general case. For HackEso specifically, there's the limit from the length of an IRC message.
23:26:50 <shachaf> Sure.
23:26:59 <shachaf> But of course you could use a stack other than the %rsp one.
23:27:46 <fizzie> There is in fact a VLA in there, `char target[sizeof "/host/" + strlen(mnt->target)];`
23:28:27 <shachaf> I wish the idiom of allocating your own arena was more common.
23:28:40 <shachaf> I guess glibc has obstack.
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