00:03:24 <esowiki> [[Meander]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73035&oldid=40142 * DmilkaSTD * (+17) User:
00:04:36 <esowiki> [[Crazy]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73036&oldid=66392 * DmilkaSTD * (+11) - User:
00:08:21 <esowiki> [[User talk:TehZ]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73037&oldid=34795 * DmilkaSTD * (+139) 
00:10:45 <esowiki> [[Minebit]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73038&oldid=49761 * DmilkaSTD * (+5) - User: + M
00:11:52 <esowiki> [[Minebit]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73039&oldid=73038 * DmilkaSTD * (-5) t
00:12:27 <esowiki> [[Minebit]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73040&oldid=73039 * DmilkaSTD * (+5) -t
00:21:32 <esowiki> [[Brainmaker]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73041&oldid=73027 * DmilkaSTD * (-48) I was ignorant
00:22:25 <esowiki> [[Brainmaker]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73042&oldid=73041 * DmilkaSTD * (+48) mess
00:23:14 <esowiki> [[Brainmaker]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73043&oldid=73042 * DmilkaSTD * (-64) Sorry ;-;
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05:23:08 <esowiki> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create  * SummerGlau *  New user account
05:42:06 <esowiki> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73044&oldid=72891 * SummerGlau * (+240) Introducing Summer Glau
05:43:06 <esowiki> [[Rockstar]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73045&oldid=60530 * SummerGlau * (+95) Add the excellent NDC conference video link (timing to Rockstar sequence but all the conference is great to see!)
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08:34:47 <cpressey> On the subject of semigroups. You can take the quotient of a semigroup by an equivalence relation to get another semigroup. The notation is: S/~ is the quotient semigroup of S.
08:35:34 <Taneb> Yes
08:35:34 <cpressey> But what if S/~ has more structure that just a semigroup?  Can you say, "S/~ is the quotient group of the semigroup S"?
08:35:45 <Taneb> Hmm
08:35:59 <cpressey> I mean, I'm sure you *can*, but to what extent do you have to explain the situation
08:36:10 <Taneb> I'd say "C/~ is a quotient semigroup of the semigroup S that happens to have a group structure"
08:36:32 <cpressey> That makes sense.
08:36:52 <Taneb> I once had a semigroup theory lecture interrupted by a fire
08:40:59 <cpressey> Oh dear.  I do hope those two events were mostly coincidental.
08:41:17 <cpressey> Would hate to think of a group of arsonists with something against abstract algebra.
08:46:18 <Taneb> Nah, it was a kitchen fire in a cafeteria nearby
08:47:11 <Taneb> Still, was rather exciting at the time
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08:49:51 <rain1> hey cpressey I finished reading "A tantalising introduction to semigroups" today
08:50:54 <rain1> yes in group theory we do G/N quotient by a normal subgroups
08:51:30 <rain1> in semigroup theory we quotient by compatable relations the kernel relation is defined for any homomorphism between semigroups
08:57:00 <cpressey> The reason I'm interested is because I want to write a better explanation of Burro.  If B is the set of Burro program texts and ~ is the equivalence relation "represents the same Burro program", then B/~ is the set of Burro programs.  B is a monoid but B/~ is a group.
09:03:53 <cpressey> Because B/~ is a group, for every program a in B/~ there exists a unique program b in B/~ s.t. a*b=e, where * is composition and e is the null program.
09:06:29 <cpressey> This induces: For every program text a in B there exists a program text b in B such that a/~ * b/~ = e/~ -- so to speak.
09:11:08 <cpressey> run(a)*run(b)=run("") might be a clearer way to express that.  Or indeed [[a]]*[[b]]=[[]].
09:11:49 <cpressey> It's the evaluation function that induces the equivalence relation, after all.
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09:34:45 <cpressey> Weird. Half the internet just died for me. GitHub, DuckDuckGo, BBC -- none of them work. But my site still does, and other smaller sites.
09:34:49 <cpressey> And IRC still does!
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09:39:16 <cpressey> Google and Slack are down, too. But, like, my bank's site is still up.
09:39:20 <cpressey> Is anyone else seeing this?
09:40:12 <rain1> yen
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10:12:54 <cpressey> esolangs.org is still up, that's good
10:13:52 <Taneb> That's the only important website
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10:33:55 <cpressey> It all appears to back up now
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12:33:36 <ais523> <cpressey> Weird. Half the internet just died for me. ← perhaps your DNS server died? then you'd only be able to visit sites for which your browser had the IP address cached
12:34:29 <ais523> (or where the IP address had been cached by some other part of your network stack)
12:35:32 <int-e> hmm. Does Not Serve
12:39:34 <shachaf> My naive sudoku DPLL solver was much faster than my somewhat less naive DPLL SAT solver at solving sudoku puzzles.
12:39:44 <shachaf> At first I was frustrated by it, but then I realized my encoding was bad:
12:40:22 <shachaf> I gave it constraints like "at least one of each digit in each row", where I should have given it "at most one" instead, since that was truer to what the direct solver was doing.
12:41:03 <ais523> would giving /both/ constraints make it faster or slower?
12:41:29 <ais523> my intuition says that the more constraints you can give a SAT solver, the better; but I don't know whether that's true for algorithms used by SAT solvers in practice
12:42:59 <esowiki> [[Brainmaker]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73046&oldid=73043 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (-5) eso styles
12:43:40 <esowiki> [[Meta Turing-complete]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73047&oldid=30899 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+23) 
12:43:43 <shachaf> I suspect it's mostly true, unless the clauses are pretty useless.
12:44:01 <shachaf> I don't know that these "at least" clauses are very useful.
12:46:23 <shachaf> Also, my naive sudoku solver was fast on the few instances I tried it on, but when I tried it on a bunch more it took as much as 70 seconds.
12:47:58 <shachaf> (I wrote it in Python in about 20 minutes a few months ago, it's not meant to be fast or anything.)
12:48:27 <shachaf> I wonder whether random variable ordering + Luby restarts would speed it up a lot. Probably?
12:50:12 <ais523> this reminds me of the time when there was a spontaneous unofficial competition to write Polarium solvers
12:50:16 <ais523> the winner turned out to be a SAT solver
12:50:25 <ais523> configured to understand Polarium
12:50:46 <shachaf> That's pretty promising.
12:52:06 <ais523> (the rules of Polarium: you have an m by n grid, the cells at the border are all gray, the others are each either black or white; you need to come up with a continuous non-self-intersecting path of squares connected at their edges, starting and ending anywhere, that for each horizontal row on the grid, either goes through every black square on the row but no white squares, or through every white square on the grid but no black squares)
12:53:23 <shachaf> Every white square on the grid?
12:53:43 <ais523> err, on the row
12:53:45 <ais523> not the grdi
12:53:47 <ais523> sorry
12:54:35 <ais523> it strikes me that there's no particular reason why puzzles should confine themselves to gray squares at the border but nowhere else, but that seems to be the convention
12:56:56 <shachaf> Is it http://bach.istc.kobe-u.ac.jp/copris/puzzles/polarium/index.html ?
12:57:37 <shachaf> I should make my SAT solver good.
12:57:48 <shachaf> I bet it's not that much more work to make it acceptable.
12:59:55 <ais523> that appears to be a solver for the same puzzle, although it appears to have been created independently of our competition
13:00:13 <ais523> yes, it was created before the competition started
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13:35:15 <esowiki> [[Eul]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73050&oldid=73049 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (-1) /* Example programs */
13:38:09 <esowiki> [[Hash function]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73051&oldid=61050 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+7) 
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16:02:37 <arseniiv_> linear algebra isn’t free of foundational issues even in interesting parts: “for U a subspace of V there exists a subspace U′ ⊂ V st U ⊕ U′ = V” requires axiom of choice
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16:04:11 <arseniiv> “Hom(U, V) is nonempty for any subspace U of V” too
16:07:31 <arseniiv> I stumbled upon these when proving that the only linear operators commuting with any other are scalar ones: if the space has no structures on it and is not finite-dimensional, we’ll need either U′ or a map from above to complete two operators making counterexamples to the two exhaustive cases when an operator fails to be a scalar one
16:08:23 <arseniiv> the proof modulo invocation of those “foundational-issue-y” facts is almost trivial and neat
16:08:41 <b_jonas> arseniiv: I heard that you need the axiom of choice to prove that vector spaces have a vector space basis, but not that you already need it for that first statement
16:08:59 <b_jonas> but I guess it makes sense in hindsight
16:09:11 <b_jonas> hmm wait
16:09:44 <b_jonas> dunno
16:11:23 <arseniiv> b_jonas: I was said AC is needed for the ⊕ thing at least
16:11:44 <arseniiv> and hopefully they are interchangeable…
16:12:15 <Taneb> I find it interesting that in ZF¬C, there's a vector space without a basis
16:13:52 <arseniiv> Taneb: ah! You reminded I wanted to see what that scalar operator theorem turns into in this case. It seems there should exist an “all-commuting” operator which isn’t scalar?
16:24:11 <arseniiv> hm this way it feels too strong. I think it should be just “may exist”? even in ZF¬C, not just in ZF
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17:06:07 <b_jonas> `learn_append california//. WARNING: The area of California is made of chemicals known to the State of California to cause cancer and birth defects or other reproductive harm.
17:06:08 <HackEso> Usage: le/rn_append keyword//Text you'd like to append.
17:06:18 <b_jonas> `le/rn_append california//. WARNING: The area of California is made of chemicals known to the State of California to cause cancer and birth defects or other reproductive harm.
17:06:20 <HackEso> Learned 'california': California is pronounced "Caliphate-ornery-I-A" . WARNING: The area of California is made of chemicals known to the State of California to cause cancer and birth defects or other reproductive harm.
17:06:27 <b_jonas> no, drop that space
17:06:51 <b_jonas> ``` sed -i 's/" ./"./' /hackenv/wisdom/california
17:06:53 <HackEso> ​/hackenv/wisdom/california//California is pronounced "Caliphate-ornery-I-A". WARNING: The area of California is made of chemicals known to the State of California to cause cancer and birth defects or other reproductive harm.
17:07:00 <b_jonas> `? california
17:07:02 <HackEso> California is pronounced "Caliphate-ornery-I-A". WARNING: The area of California is made of chemicals known to the State of California to cause cancer and birth defects or other reproductive harm.
17:19:23 <esowiki> [[Minebit]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73056&oldid=73040 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (-5) style guide says user should have visible prefix
17:20:12 <esowiki> [[Screwtape]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73057&oldid=47306 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+23) 
17:22:26 <b_jonas> `tty
17:22:26 <HackEso> not a tty
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18:13:24 <esowiki> [[User talk:PythonshellDebugwindow]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73059&oldid=73058 * DmilkaSTD * (+4) 
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18:15:48 <zzo38> In LLVM, what are the differences between "freeze i1 undef" and the @llvm.experimental.widenable.condition intrinsic?
18:22:22 <esowiki> [[Css script]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73060&oldid=70746 * DmilkaSTD * (+46) 
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18:26:47 <esowiki> [[Daoyu]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73061&oldid=67990 * Kaynato * (+12) Daoyu is homoiconic.
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19:03:43 <esowiki> [[Fscratch]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73066&oldid=73065 * DmilkaSTD * (-2) 
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20:00:26 <esowiki> [[Fscratch]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73069&oldid=73068 * DmilkaSTD * (+1056) 
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21:06:42 <esowiki> [[Forbin]]  https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73070&oldid=73055 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (+981) 
21:28:56 <esowiki> [[SpaghettiScript]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=73071&oldid=73018 * UltimateProGrammer * (+115) Add implementation to page
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