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00:20:37 <esolangs> [[User:PixelatedStarfish]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=89370&oldid=89369 * PixelatedStarfish * (+15) /* In Chronological Order */
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01:10:58 <oerjan> <b_jonas> Or, for a more mathematical argument, consider Underload without the ! and S primitives, which can't delete anything, but is still Turing-complete. <-- iirc the first proof i made in that section is pretty much the same kind of junk-based thing int-e gave for BCW (which i hadn't heard about)
01:11:18 <oerjan> except the junk is put on the stack
01:12:13 <oerjan> now i somewhat wonder if you could also apply the later "two ways of running a term, one of which self-deletes" method to BCW
01:54:47 <b_jonas> oerjan: Smullyan's bird book talks about BCW, but I don't think it gives a full proof
01:56:26 <b_jonas> it also doesn't tell whether it's Turing-complete – it only says that from the BCW basis you can get any lambda term of a certain form, namely one with applications only on variables inside the lambdas, and with all bound variables used at least once
01:56:59 <b_jonas> all of that IIRC, I haven't checked the book even though it's within arm's reach of me
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06:01:03 <int-e> Corbin: Here's a tested translation to BCWI: https://paste.debian.net/1218287/
06:02:52 <int-e> what I did yesterday was flawed... it's not really possible to extract all the garbage to the top level (some subterms may not even participate in the evaluation to head normal form).
06:04:45 <int-e> But it's also simpler than what I tried yesterday in that application is actually translated as application.
06:06:42 <int-e> (This relies on the <F,X> <G,Y> = F G Y X that I spelled out yesterday.)
06:11:18 <int-e> Anyway, I would be surprised if this kind of direct simulation of combinatory logic works for S. But I can't rule it out; lack of erasure simply isn't enough.
06:25:13 <Corbin> I still like my argument from last time about implementing S with S, but I'm not any closer to making it rigorous.
06:29:08 <int-e> Oh the x z I I (y z g h) from [S] can be demystified using that pair identiy: it's equal to <x,I> <z,I> (<y,h> <z,g>)
06:29:57 <int-e> where I, g, and h are garbage we don't care about.
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06:55:40 <riv> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wJi0xeNI6ho
07:04:55 * int-e eyes that links suspiciously
07:06:02 <int-e> "436,906 Hz redstone clock" hmm might actually be amusing
07:07:44 <int-e> GoL has a similar thing where people searched for the fastest possible glider gun
07:12:05 <int-e> cf. https://www.conwaylife.com/wiki/Period-14_glider_gun
07:12:56 <riv> successive gliders cannot be closer than 14 generations
07:13:36 <riv> funny that you can inject with spaceships somehow
07:13:42 <riv> that there's enough space for that
07:49:54 <esolangs> [[GPTLang]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=89371 * Hakerh400 * (+5240) Created page with "GPTLang is an esoteric programming language invented by the GPT neural netwrok. <!--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------..."
07:50:20 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=89372&oldid=89351 * Hakerh400 * (+14) /* G */
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08:11:50 <int-e> (They automated User:A)
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08:38:58 <esolangs> [[GPTLang]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=89374&oldid=89371 * Hakerh400 * (+0) typo
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09:58:45 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Guy Fawkes Rep * New user account
10:05:20 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=89375&oldid=89310 * Guy Fawkes Rep * (+347) Stop the fire
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14:00:13 <esolangs> [[Timers]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=89377&oldid=89367 * Rphii * (-39) fix logical mistakes
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