00:10:00 [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Yeetb01 * New user account 00:14:57 [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90595&oldid=90545 * Yeetb01 * (+201) be yeet, stay yeet, forever yeet 00:15:56 [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90596&oldid=90595 * Yeetb01 * (+74) fix 00:17:30 [[User:Anthonykozar/A language inspired by Adar]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90597&oldid=90588 * Anthonykozar * (+616) Formatting changes and minor wording changes 00:17:57 is ICMP turing-complete? 00:30:31 [[User:Viba]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90598 * Viba * (+58) Created page with "i am viba and i made these * [[UCanCode]] * [[FakeScript]]" 00:31:32 -!- oerjan has joined. 00:43:43 b_jonas: i find the idea that anyone would care enough about the copyright status of your works 70 years from now enough to kill you utterly bizarre and would suggest you get some more realistic concerns hth 00:45:25 . o O ( like getting hit by meteorites ) 00:46:12 (putting that in . o O ( ) because i'm not going to actually estimate the relative probability) 00:47:23 especially since the people who would normally care most would be the one who _own_ the copyright and would be incentivized to keep you alive longer 00:47:42 *ones 00:49:36 scratch that "especially", even their care should be absurdly low, it's 70 years into the future 00:51:09 @golf 00:51:10 unexpected end of input: expecting number, "d" or "(" 00:51:23 @golf 3d6 00:51:24 oerjan: 5+2+6 => 13 00:51:47 1d8 00:51:47 oerjan: 5 00:53:16 Why is that "@golf"? 00:55:37 @roll 2d6 00:55:37 fizzie: 1+2 => 3 00:55:46 Oh. 01:02:06 oh dear today's girl genius 01:03:23 i suspect madwa is responsible, but if not she's sure to notice them now 01:39:22 i don't know. the tragic death of an artist can significantly boost the sales. 01:42:44 maybe you've seen josie and the pussycats. a nice parody on the evil practices of music industry:) 01:45:28 [[User:Yeetb01]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90599 * Yeetb01 * (+72) e 01:52:50 no i haven't. hm... 01:53:05 i may have misunderstood b_jonas's intent 01:55:51 hm no, still don't understand how his license achieves anything that really matters 01:56:51 earendel: i don't think b_jonas suggested license helps with that sales boosting problem 01:57:13 * b_jonas's 02:00:30 [[Brainfuck+3]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90600&oldid=90103 * Squidmanescape * (+533) /* Implementations */ 02:00:32 which is to say, although some people might conceivable care enough about the sales _now_ to kill him, they won't care whether the copyright then expires slightly earlier 02:00:41 *ly 02:05:40 i'm afraid i missed his part entirely. didn't care to look for it in the logs. i recall that after some decades after the death of the author, you don't need to pay license fees nor ask for permission to use their work. but apparently you as well won't be able to make a new patent, or claim ownership otherwise. was it 70years? should be less, imo. i guess that was your point too? 02:08:22 Hm. The law already covers murdering for profit, doesn't it? 02:10:26 Corbin: you'd think 02:12:14 yes. max sentence. planful and "lower motives", like greed. 02:14:14 not sure what would make a noble motive. confusion maybe :p 02:15:00 tyrannicide. which can go any way as far as sentence goes :P 02:15:14 (dependent on whether the regime survives) 02:15:55 yes.:) 02:17:03 also, not every country has the same law, although you'd expect similar rankings. 02:17:19 ( b_jonas is hungarian, for one thing. ) 02:20:13 we just actively attempt to dismantle copyright in its entirety 02:21:20 life-sentence is 15 years in germany. but there's exception to that. like for people expected to repeat their crime. mostly some psychotic people not in control of themselves. they can be locked indefinitely long. (or until the doctors say you somehow changed for good) 02:22:12 in germany there's a difference between authorship and copyright. authorship for instance is not disposable at all. 02:22:32 [[( )fuck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90601&oldid=90584 * Squidmanescape * (+2003) 02:23:42 [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90602&oldid=90171 * Squidmanescape * (+0) /* Languages I Want to Implement */ 02:26:18 what can they do to prevent you from disposing of it? 02:26:37 [[!lyriclydemoteestablishcommunism!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90603&oldid=81230 * Squidmanescape * (+28) I feel like this is a joke language about censorship. 02:26:40 and of course that is not the point. you should be able to make profits from immaterial goods. but your grand-grand-children should eventually be forced to let off their grip of evil menace. 02:27:10 [[!lyriclydemoteestablishcommunism!]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90604&oldid=90603 * Squidmanescape * (+0) 02:28:20 soni: you can give away licenses like do what you want with it license. but the authorship is yours. and remains yours. nobody can take it away from you. 02:30:42 earendel: sure but what can they do to stop you from using something like [shameless self-promotion] https://ganarchy.github.io/ 02:31:26 i never use morals in argumentation 02:31:37 you should know by now. 02:31:57 this isn't about morals, this is about practicality 02:32:17 [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90605&oldid=90602 * Squidmanescape * (-16) 02:33:50 besides. i don't see what would be wrong about seeking beauty. all the flowers in bloom. all the sweet fruits do attract me. there is nothing to compromise with. 02:34:32 [[User talk:Squidmanescape]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90606 * Squidmanescape * (+40) Created page with "I have decided to create this talk page." 02:35:00 we guess you don't actually have to deny authorship to be able to use our software, and even we don't, but eh 02:41:05 are you saying there is nothing comparable in your country? 02:47:00 i guess you can maximaly give away all copyrights and whatever to somebody. not sure how it is when you're paid for creating immaterial goods on behalf of some company. probably the authorship then belongs to that company as well. but i'm not sure. 02:56:46 most open-source licences require you to give some credit, or require your product to be puslished under certain licences as well. but to fuel your excitement: i think humanity never got closer to the idea of comunism as with the upcoming of computers, the www or open-source. 02:57:30 however non-profit does not mean all is working for free. 03:00:32 sure there is definitely merit to the idea of free market. if somebody doesn't like the product, your agenda or the color of your socks, he mustn't buy it, right? what could be more democratic. 03:06:22 [[Hello world program in esoteric languages (nonalphabetic and A-M)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90607&oldid=90287 * Squidmanescape * (+500) Added (top, height) 03:07:34 you for instance are doomed. 03:08:10 you think the world needs me more than i do. 03:10:48 earendel: we mean, we have git commits with our name on them 03:11:13 that's basically authorship yeah? 03:18:51 if you correct a typo in a text, that's not authorship. also i don't know if authorship is the correct term. in germany it is 'urheber-recht' without the hyphen. i don't remember the exact text, but slightly changing a composition without significant merit wouldn't count. similarily to how patents apply or not. in last instance some court would need to decide. and there are a lot of edge cases, .. ad absurdum. 03:24:45 soni: if you create a new repo you are asked for the license type. i guess such a license may also cover eventual contribution regulation. however i think if you're selling your workforce to a company, of course the company has some privileges or even ownership over that stuff. however i dont remember a company ever having won the nobel price. 03:26:17 our favorite license is still "This software shall only be used in violation of this license." :p 03:29:45 -!- delta23 has quit (Quit: Leaving). 03:29:55 Soni: What is that license called? 03:31:46 the license paradox 03:31:51 OK 03:33:28 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90608&oldid=90583 * PixelatedStarfish * (-465) /* Tests */ 03:34:36 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: Nite). 03:34:38 I don't want to require anyone to give credit, or to do anything else; I only want to prohibit someone else to add further restriction. What is that license called? 03:35:34 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90609&oldid=90608 * PixelatedStarfish * (+142) 03:45:47 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90610&oldid=90609 * PixelatedStarfish * (+513) /* Interpreter */ 03:46:01 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90611&oldid=90610 * PixelatedStarfish * (+1) /* Nondescript Interpreter */ 03:48:01 I still want to find licensing situations that basically require folks to join the community. https://opensource.stackexchange.com/q/11840/18097 was my last inquiry. 04:04:44 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90612&oldid=90611 * PixelatedStarfish * (+266) /* Interpreter */ 04:04:54 Isn't that basically a DRM scheme? 04:08:49 zzo38: get rid of copyright? 04:11:54 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90613&oldid=90612 * PixelatedStarfish * (+2023) /* Test Cases */ 04:12:22 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90614&oldid=90613 * PixelatedStarfish * (+17) /* Test Cases */ 04:12:24 i think if you don't declare the license it may not be binding. but i think all you need is to declare it. (even if it may not be legit. like: all men using this software are pigs! would not necessarily be a legit clause) 04:12:57 because of the all pigs are equal act. 04:13:04 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90615&oldid=90614 * PixelatedStarfish * (+8) /* Test Cases */ 04:13:58 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90616&oldid=90615 * PixelatedStarfish * (+1) /* Test Cases */ 04:14:35 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90617&oldid=90616 * PixelatedStarfish * (-13) /* Test Cases */ 04:16:49 yes. go to bed. i will keep these skandinavian rascals in check. 04:16:53 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90618&oldid=90617 * PixelatedStarfish * (-221) /* Test Cases */ 04:16:54 :p 04:18:11 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90619&oldid=90618 * PixelatedStarfish * (+31) /* Test Cases */ 04:20:06 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90620&oldid=90619 * PixelatedStarfish * (+175) /* Test Cases */ 04:20:36 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90621&oldid=90620 * PixelatedStarfish * (+4) /* Test Cases */ 04:21:09 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90622&oldid=90621 * PixelatedStarfish * (+40) /* Test Cases */ 04:21:22 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90623&oldid=90622 * PixelatedStarfish * (-11) /* Test Cases */ 04:21:46 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90624&oldid=90623 * PixelatedStarfish * (+23) /* Test Cases */ 04:23:59 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90625&oldid=90624 * PixelatedStarfish * (+18) /* Test Cases */ 04:24:49 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90626&oldid=90625 * PixelatedStarfish * (-2111) /* Test Cases */ 04:26:50 Soni: It is similar yes, but want to do as a license so that it can be used in jurisdictions with copyright as well as those without. Actually, there are a few other terms I want to add as well, such as also the patents (if any) can be freely used, support for license compatibility with projects using (A)GPL/CC-BY-SA, and non-endorsement in situation where that becomes important. 04:29:41 [[Apollo Guidance Computer]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90627&oldid=90594 * B jonas * (+60) 04:34:26 oerjan: I firstly, they wouldn't outright kill me, because that would come with a criminal liability that's not worth the value they could get, they just might make my life slightly harder, but multiple different people (including corporations) all may have an incentive to do that independently, which adds up. 04:35:23 secondly sure, maybe my creative works aren't worth enough, but by that logic you can also say that I'm not rich enough for anyone to steal from my house so I don't need a door lock. 04:36:10 and yes, the 70 year delay is mostly the saving grace that makes this not already have had a too bad effect on artists who actually have valuable creative works. 04:37:26 and no, this is not about the sales boosting effect of my death 04:38:05 earendel: the timeout is usually 70 years, it depends slightly on what country you first publish your creative work in 04:39:58 if it adds up, could the corporations make my penis harder as well? 04:40:13 it would certainly pay off soon. 04:40:27 not even slightly? 04:42:59 seriously. what market incentives would make corporations want to make somebodies life harder. 04:44:09 earendel: again, the incentive is that if I die earlier, then my published creative works lose most of their copyright protection earlier, and so they would acquire a right to use those creative works earlier 04:44:43 I mean that's the copyright side; there are lots of much better reasons why a company would want to make your life harder 04:44:50 but those aren't relevent here 04:45:46 what you have to realize is that while this probably helps very little, the cost is also very little to me. I give away a little bit of the potential profits from the creative work in exchange for a little bit of potential longer life. I think it's a win. 04:46:36 ah ok. i get it making life harder could have a negative impact on health. i get it. they may also want to reward me so it is a win win situation. right? 04:47:17 without a doubt. 04:47:24 earendel: yes, if they want to buy a copyright license for your work then they may want you to live longer actually 04:48:57 well making one life's harder really only make sense if you're out to wait 70 years, and then you would need to compete with anybody else gaining the right use my work. 04:49:33 but only if they buy a perpetual copyright license, which is not that common outside of software really 04:50:10 u will have a hard time to convince your shareholders of the 70 years plus strategy. 04:57:08 earendel: you have to understand the emotional side of my argument. most of the authors whose works are out of copyright died in or around world war II, and often either *from* the war or from the Nazi holocaust. the people who decide about war or peace do probably care 70 years in advance. 04:57:37 admittedly they are also governments who may have extra incentives to keep my works under copyright protection, to increase their tax income. 04:59:36 if you're a big film studio, it's absolutely worth for you to start a war in order to get film rights for all the books out there 70 years later 05:01:18 wikipedia says: 'The original holder of the copyright may be the employer of the author rather than the author himself if the work is a "work for hire".' here we go. 05:03:01 'the most recent major overhaul of copyright in the US, the 1976 Copyright Act, extended federal copyright to works as soon as they are created and "fixed", without requiring publication or registration.' 05:03:02 yes, the law says that, that applies to eg. software that I write during my job. in that case, in theory the company that pays me could have an incentive for me to live longer, but this probably only applies to film studios, software will be worth nothing in 70 years. 05:04:31 earendel: that's technically how it already works here, as in the nominal copyright holder is fixed, but that matters only for very few practical reasons, because you can give licenses that transfer *almost* all the rights from copyright to someone else after the fact, as in the rights to distribute copies and copies of derivatives, 05:04:55 and the remaining few rights are the ones that mostly never expire and have little money associated with them 05:08:25 yes. but there is obviously a distinction between holder and "creator". which would be synonymous with how i used "author". as just for the case of that 70 years, the holder is not relevant. 05:09:20 correct, except in old US works 05:09:41 only the authors matter to determine the expiry time for works created now 05:09:43 i guess the picant details are in fact the weak exception on "work for hire". i bet marx could elaborate 05:11:14 this makes sense because nobody wants to determine when the corporation that you work for dies, so times are tied to your death or publication time 05:11:24 b_jonas: i think this is not correct. authors can give their work out for free instantly. 05:11:45 they remain the creator even after that expiration date as well. 05:12:00 earendel: what is not correct? 05:12:28 "only the authors matter to determine the expiry time for works created now." 05:12:31 yes, you can use a copyright license to give your work away for free 05:12:56 they dont. "creator-ship" doesn't expire. 05:13:08 yes, only most of the rights expire 05:13:19 the remaining few rights like being the author don't expire 05:13:35 only the copy right protection, which they may give away at any time expires. 05:13:36 only most of the copyright protection, as in people by default not being allowed to copy your work 05:20:53 the other reason, as mentioned before is to prevent others of claiming a patent or copyright on works which copyright expired. 05:21:33 however that making your life difficult .. is utter bullshit. 05:23:40 there are laws that further restrict possible exploitation of copyright. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_use 05:26:44 earendel: and they vary from one country to another and have some *seriously* weird clauses, the low point being the one specifically about using works as scenery or backdrops in broadcast television only 05:28:15 [..] for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching (including multiple copies for classroom use), scholarship, or research, is not an infringement of copyright. ' 05:28:56 the high point is seriously lifting restrictions if you copy printed works for use by blind people, either in print form or braille or audiobooks, which is why we have an entire partly government-sponsored library that has audiobook copies of lots of works for which they don't have a copyright license, on audio casettes, but they aren't allowed to loan them to anyone but people who are blind or close to 05:28:58 i guess that's where you in doubt better get some consultance of some lawyer. 05:29:02 it 05:30:37 the other high point is where some exceptions about when you can copy a work for personal non-profit use are such that you're allowed to photocopy or digitize parts (chapters) of a book, but not the whole book together, however, you're allowed to make a handwritten copy of the whole book 05:30:38 creating and patenting a vaccine for a deadly virus and not giving out any licenses for it, but prefer to be burried with it and your money could as well be regarded as not beneficial for the commonwealth. 05:31:13 just for instance. 05:31:21 that law is a worthy read, you can chuckle a lot on its many anachronisms 05:33:20 you seemed to step down from it a bit by now. 05:33:30 well i chuckled a lot reading your wet corporate making life harder thesis. 05:34:37 earendel: again, it's cheap for me. if you think a corporation doesn't care about profits that they can realize 70 years from now or later, then don't you also think that I don't care about profits from my own works that I can only realize 70 years from now, and so it's cheap for me to give away that profit? 05:34:47 this is a low impact intervention, but is also cheap 05:35:19 -!- sprout has quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds). 05:35:53 i think if you can't break even in max five years, you need the state to support your back. otherwise you will have fucking hard time. 05:37:19 you suck at economics. 05:37:21 ;) 05:41:46 yw. instead of investing their limitless capital in renewables to gain control of the new market they prefer to stalk greta thunberg in some chatrooms. :) 05:42:03 but .. could be an explanation. 05:42:33 we'll see if that'll be crowned by success. 05:43:13 -!- sprout has joined. 05:44:18 ps.: no, i'm glad it's tesla and not edison ;) 05:44:28 all good. 05:59:22 -!- sprout has quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds). 06:00:14 -!- sprout has joined. 06:05:34 -!- sprout has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 06:17:24 -!- sprout has joined. 06:22:10 -!- sprout has quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds). 06:33:22 -!- sprout has joined. 06:37:41 -!- sprout has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds). 06:38:17 I think the problem is working-for-hire and letting corporations hold the rights to art. 07:06:37 -!- sprout has joined. 07:07:34 [[CYOA]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90628 * TheJonyMyster * (+1368) Created page with "== Overview == CYOA is a stack based semi-2d esolang. Operates on two stacks of bits, the first initialized with input (or empty if no input is given), the second starting em..." 07:11:45 -!- sprout has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 07:21:51 [[User:Zzo38/Programming languages with unusual features]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90629&oldid=90072 * Zzo38 * (+1452) 07:24:51 -!- sprout has joined. 07:29:19 -!- sprout has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 07:38:31 -!- tromp has joined. 07:56:47 -!- sprout has joined. 08:01:39 -!- sprout has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds). 08:13:38 -!- sprout has joined. 08:18:44 -!- sprout has quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds). 08:30:13 -!- sprout has joined. 08:34:31 -!- sprout has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 08:47:58 [[Brainfuck+3]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90630&oldid=90600 * Squidmanescape * (+314) 08:48:26 [[Brainfuck+3]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90631&oldid=90630 * Squidmanescape * (+6) /* Examples */ 08:55:14 -!- tromp has quit (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…). 09:03:03 [[Generic 2D Brainfuck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90632&oldid=74271 * Squidmanescape * (+4025) 09:04:49 [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90633&oldid=90605 * Squidmanescape * (+20) 09:36:43 -!- sprout has joined. 09:59:36 [[Apollo Guidance Computer]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90634&oldid=90627 * B jonas * (+502) instruction mnemonics 10:08:48 [[User:Salpynx/Galveston]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90635&oldid=83729 * Salpynx * (+35) formatting 10:11:54 -!- Lord_of_Life_ has joined. 10:12:41 -!- Lord_of_Life has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 10:14:43 -!- Lord_of_Life_ has changed nick to Lord_of_Life. 10:14:44 [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90636&oldid=90633 * Squidmanescape * (-25) /* Languages I Want to Implement */ 10:16:17 -!- tromp has joined. 10:17:43 [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90637&oldid=90636 * Squidmanescape * (+16) /* Languages I Want to Implement */ 10:25:05 [[Finites at Fredy's]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90638&oldid=84541 * Salpynx * (+3453) /* Examples */ simple output example 10:30:28 [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Zedikon * New user account 10:32:57 [[Finites at Fredy's]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90639&oldid=90638 * Salpynx * (+165) /* Description */ add ! convention 10:33:55 [[Finites at Fredy's]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90640&oldid=90639 * Salpynx * (+2) /* Full-adder (1-bit, with carry) */ update adder example with output notation 10:35:24 [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90641&oldid=90637 * Squidmanescape * (+173) /* Languages I Want to Implement */ 10:35:48 [[Apollo Guidance Computer]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90642&oldid=90634 * B jonas * (+47) /* Instruction set */ 10:38:41 [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90643&oldid=90641 * Squidmanescape * (+42) /* Implementation Planned */ 10:40:55 [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90644&oldid=90643 * Squidmanescape * (-48) /* Languages I Explicitly Won't Ever Implement */ 10:49:10 [[Apollo Guidance Computer]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90645&oldid=90642 * B jonas * (+153) /* Hardware */ 10:57:06 -!- Koen has joined. 11:01:00 -!- Sgeo has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 11:06:20 [[User:Hakerh400]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90646&oldid=89029 * Hakerh400 * (+112) /* Proofs */ 11:07:27 [[User:Hakerh400/Proof 002]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90647 * Hakerh400 * (+2327) Created page with "This is the proof of the correctness of the algorithm described in [[User:Hakerh400/Bijection_between_reals_and_the_powerset_of_naturals]]. === Definitions === A bit is eith..." 11:08:24 [[User:Hakerh400/Proof 002]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90648&oldid=90647 * Hakerh400 * (-5) 11:08:46 [[User:Hakerh400/Proof 002]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90649&oldid=90648 * Hakerh400 * (+5) 11:17:27 [[User:Hakerh400/Proof 002]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90650&oldid=90649 * Hakerh400 * (-28) 11:28:57 -!- Guest76 has joined. 11:30:54 -!- Guest76 has left. 11:33:06 [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90651&oldid=90554 * TJC games * (+34) /* Usage */ 11:34:16 [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90652&oldid=90651 * TJC games * (+134) /* Operations */ 11:36:55 [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90653&oldid=90652 * TJC games * (+112) 11:38:49 [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90654&oldid=90653 * TJC games * (+78) /* Usage */ 11:44:15 [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90655&oldid=90654 * TJC games * (+102) /* Operations */ 11:44:52 -!- tech_exorcist has joined. 11:49:37 [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90656&oldid=90655 * TJC games * (+39) 12:00:24 [[User:Zzo38/Programming languages with unusual features]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90657&oldid=90629 * B jonas * (+4) /* Apollo Guidance Computer */ link page since I have now created it 12:05:40 [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90658&oldid=90656 * TJC games * (+116) /* Operations */ 12:13:02 [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90659&oldid=90658 * TJC games * (+996) /* Hello world */ 12:13:28 [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90660&oldid=90659 * TJC games * (+9) 12:14:09 [[Geolang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90661&oldid=90660 * TJC games * (+11) /* Hello world */ 12:28:56 [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Bombie * New user account 12:49:24 [[Seas]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90662 * AmNow * (+1988) Created page with "Seas is a 2D esoteric programming language made by [[User:AmNow]] and was made for TeamSeas. == Commands == The memory field is an infinite sea with the instruction pointer a..." 12:49:52 [[User:AmNow]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90663&oldid=89490 * AmNow * (+13) 12:50:42 [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90664&oldid=90504 * AmNow * (+11) /* S */ 12:51:57 zzo38: ah you want it to be everything-free 12:55:37 zzo38: https://mobile.twitter.com/SoniEx2/status/1469511388355833858 12:57:34 [[Seas]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90665&oldid=90662 * ColorfulGalaxy * (+469) Category 13:00:35 -!- DutchIngraham has quit (Quit: WeeChat 3.3). 13:52:03 unrelated https://twitter.com/NanoRaptor/status/1469432382247763968 14:18:47 -!- blu256 has joined. 14:25:04 -!- tech_exorcist has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 14:51:42 Blerg, pretty bad Burlesque solutions today. Ended up with: %f9={J-.0>.j+.9<.r@}ps)XX{9rzJcp{j+]{Jx/Jx/d!+.J10==#Rj{JPp}ifjD!}r[p\CLp\PP{p^f9jf9cp}\m}{L[}w!vv{{J9<=.*}m[}m[J\[0CNj}100E!vvCL++ 14:53:49 -!- Koen_ has joined. 14:56:31 -!- Koen has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 15:06:58 -!- tech_exorcist has joined. 15:11:20 -!- earendel has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity). 15:47:27 [[APOL]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90666&oldid=90572 * GingerIndustries * (+544) /* Instruction table */ 15:49:19 Hmm, it's a bit shorter (and slower) if I switch the method of generating the Moore neighbourhood by filtering all grid cells by distance rather than attempting to clamp the X/Y coordinates independently: ps)XX{9rzJcpS0{j+]{Jx/Jx/d!J9==#Rj{JPp}ifj+.D!}r[p\CLp\PP{{?-)ab>]1<=}j+]g0jf[}\m}{L[}w!vv{{J9<=.*}m[}m[J\[0CNj}100E!vvCL++ 15:53:17 more blsq? 15:55:46 Yep. After the last round of trimming, day 11 is shorter than day 9 part 2, which I might just call good enough: https://zem.fi/tmp/aocblsq.txt 16:03:11 -!- blu256 has quit (Quit: Gone). 17:10:31 -!- Koen_ has quit (Quit: Leaving...). 17:16:15 -!- tech_exorcist has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 17:18:20 -!- tech_exorcist has joined. 17:21:35 -!- earendel has joined. 17:38:26 -!- tech_exorcist has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 17:38:54 -!- tech_exorcist has joined. 17:41:14 -!- Corbin has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 17:44:07 -!- tech_exorcist has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 17:46:22 -!- tech_exorcist has joined. 17:56:56 [[P]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90667&oldid=75430 * OrichalcumCosmonaut * (+18) use the LaTeX equivalent of [[File:P.png]] instead of a static image, 18:14:36 -!- tromp has quit (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…). 18:24:06 [[Can]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90668&oldid=90502 * Nxe * (+24) /* Hello World! */ 18:31:00 -!- tromp has joined. 18:41:32 Ooh, . 18:42:01 -!- tromp has quit (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…). 18:48:16 -!- tech_exorcist has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 18:56:25 -!- tech_exorcist has joined. 19:00:56 [[User:Hakerh400/Proof 002]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90669&oldid=90650 * Hakerh400 * (+1) 19:13:05 -!- tromp has joined. 19:29:52 -!- APic has quit (Quit: [TLS] Client upgrade). 19:30:17 -!- APic has joined. 19:35:26 -!- tromp has quit (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…). 19:39:11 -!- tech_exorcist has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 19:40:49 -!- tromp has joined. 19:44:13 [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90670&oldid=90644 * Squidmanescape * (+0) 19:46:12 [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90671&oldid=90670 * Squidmanescape * (+93) /* My Languages */ 19:46:50 [[Hacrzyk]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90672 * Squidmanescape * (+134) Created page with "Hacrzyk is a language heavily based on [[Crazy]], but it is smaller and therefore easier to implement. [[Category:Works-in-Progress]]" 19:47:35 [[Tobi]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90673 * NickDev-1666 * (+730) Xml syntactical c. Made for Tobi 19:47:59 [[Tobi]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90674&oldid=90673 * NickDev-1666 * (+2) /* TobiLang */ 19:48:12 [[Special:Log/move]] move * Squidmanescape * moved [[Hacrzyk]] to [[Haczyk]] 19:50:20 Oh I could've just set a flashing octopodes to -9 and clamp at 0 once things stabilized... 19:52:40 [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90677&oldid=90675 * Squidmanescape * (+401) 19:53:14 [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90678&oldid=90677 * Squidmanescape * (+34) 19:53:45 The Burlesque version increments the flashing ones again because it's easier to generate the 3x3 square than the 8-cell neighbourhood, but that doesn't matter because of the `J9<=.*` that clamps everything >9 to 0 at the end of the step. 19:53:47 [[User:Squidmanescape]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90679&oldid=90671 * Squidmanescape * (-1) /* My Languages */ 19:54:24 Well, actually, now that the neighborhood is generated based on the distance, it'd be just as easy to make the right one, and even marginally more efficient. 19:54:37 (Just a matter of `1==` instead of `1<=`.) 19:54:55 -!- tromp has quit (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…). 20:00:52 [[Tobi]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90680&oldid=90674 * NickDev-1666 * (+65) 20:03:22 [[Tobi]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90681&oldid=90680 * NickDev-1666 * (-18) 20:03:46 fizzie: I did that too, but then I have to keep track of octopodes that have already flashed 20:04:26 [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90682&oldid=90678 * Squidmanescape * (+56) 20:04:45 which got me thinking of ways to track that information with just the world grid. 20:05:20 [[Tobi]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90683&oldid=90681 * NickDev-1666 * (+55) 20:05:27 I don't keep track of octopodes that have already flashed in any separate way. 20:05:49 [[Tobi]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90684&oldid=90683 * NickDev-1666 * (-5) 20:05:57 An octopus will flash (once) when it increments from 9 to 10, that's all. 20:06:40 Or alternatively (what I had before I put that in the innermost loop) an octopus will flash when after one sub-round it has changed from a value that's <= 9 to a value that's > 9. 20:06:49 [[Tobi]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90685&oldid=90684 * NickDev-1666 * (+82) 20:07:00 [[Tobi]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90686&oldid=90685 * NickDev-1666 * (+4) 20:07:23 [[Tobi]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90687&oldid=90686 * NickDev-1666 * (+3) 20:07:34 [[Tobi]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90688&oldid=90687 * NickDev-1666 * (-3) 20:08:16 [[Tobi]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90689&oldid=90688 * NickDev-1666 * (+5) 20:08:20 fizzie: Ah, but I process octopodes in bulk, so it might jump from 9 to 11 which is indistinguishable from jumping from 10 to 11 post-hoc. 20:09:00 Well, yes, I guess you could call storing the bitmap of values <= 9 before a single update pass "keeping track" as well. 20:09:18 "bitmap" 20:09:25 :t S.fromList 20:09:26 Ord a => [a] -> S.Set a 20:09:38 (actually it was just a plain list) 20:09:47 -!- Sgeo has joined. 20:09:48 The J{9<=}fIPp...J{9.>}fIPPIN check I had for that approach broke when I switched from a 1D block and plain indices to a 2D block-of-blocks with {y x} indices; generating neighbours was shorter with the latter. 20:10:19 I'm a little sad I lost the "fIPPIN" part, it was funny. 20:10:55 ("Find indices, pop from secondary stack to main stack, do set intersection.") 20:11:59 [[Another Finite State Brainfuck]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90690 * Oshaboy * (+1476) Initial 20:12:14 -!- tech_exorcist has joined. 20:12:55 [[User:Oshaboy]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90691&oldid=90386 * Oshaboy * (+59) /* Original(-ish) Esolangs */ 20:13:35 [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90692&oldid=90682 * Squidmanescape * (+1207) 20:13:37 -!- tromp has joined. 20:16:23 I'd like Burlesque to have a 2dup. As far as stack management words go, it's got less of them than Forth. 20:16:42 There's even a three-element rotate in only one direction. 20:17:37 x/ goes from `a b c` to `b c a` (top of stack on the right), but there's no single builtin to get `c a b`. 20:18:00 could you do x/x/ 20:18:08 You could, but it's twice as long. 20:19:19 And that Jx/Jx/ nonsense in the day 11 solution is just to get from `a b` to `b a a b`, that's where I'd like a dup2 in. 20:23:51 Forth also has nip ( a b -- b ) and tuck ( a b -- b a b ) which I think I've wanted in earlier solutions. The Burlesque equivalents are I think jvv (swap drop, not too bad) and Jx/x/ (dup rot rot, pretty terrible). 20:24:27 Burlesque does have a full-stack rotate both left and right (#r and #R) though. It's just inconvenient if there's something else relevant still on the stack. 20:25:58 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90693&oldid=90626 * PixelatedStarfish * (+2111) Undo revision 90626 by [[Special:Contributions/PixelatedStarfish|PixelatedStarfish]] ([[User talk:PixelatedStarfish|talk]]) 20:27:02 I'm sure if I tried to actually do AoC puzzles in Forth, the better stack words wouldn't really compensate for the lack of higher-order builtins like map, filter and reduce, as well as lazy lists. 20:31:22 fizzie: there's also the opposite end, https://esolangs.org/wiki/GML where the only stack rearrangement operations are binding to a new local variable and pushing a local variable. not even swap or dup or pop builtins. 20:31:36 it's at least consistent. 20:32:22 Does binding a local variable consume it from the stack? 20:32:51 yes 20:33:38 Mm. There are Forth implementations with locals, that work a little like that -- in Gforth, for example, you can write : swap { a b -- b a } b a ; to reimplement swap. 20:33:44 also even though [ and ] seem at first to work like in postscript to make an array from the stack contents, the language defines them in such a way that [ isn't an actual value on the stack and you can't assign it to a local variable 20:34:14 fizzie: I think it's based more of postscript, which has /x to assign to a variable x, and then x to retrieve that variable 20:34:24 or something like that, maybe it's /x def or something 20:34:45 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90694&oldid=90693 * PixelatedStarfish * (-18) /* Test Cases */ 20:34:46 `( in -- out )` is the convention for a stack effect comment, so `{ in -- out }` binds the locals listed on the left side; the right side is still a comment. And then just mentioning them pushes them on the stack. 20:34:48 rm: cannot remove 'canary': No such file or directory \ /hackenv/bin/(: eval: line 4: syntax error near unexpected token `in' \ /hackenv/bin/(: eval: line 4: `in -- out )` is the convention for a stack effect comment, so `{ in -- out }` binds the locals listed on the left side; the right side is still a comment. And then just mentioning them pushes them on the stack.' 20:34:52 yes, it's not local variables, but the contest has *functional* in its name so they had to do that 20:35:24 I should learn not to start with a backtick. 20:35:48 (Where did "cannot remove 'canary': No such file or directory" even come from there?) 20:37:15 `( 20:37:16 rm: cannot remove 'canary': No such file or directory 20:37:38 ``` type \( 20:37:39 ​( is /hackenv/bin/( 20:37:42 `cbt ( 20:37:43 ​#!/bin/bash \ TIMEFORMAT="real: %lR, user: %lU, sys: %lS" \ shopt -s extglob globstar \ rm canary; eval -- "$1" | rnooodl 20:38:00 oh 20:38:10 that should be changed to reference canary in the right directory 20:38:25 Yeah, I guess it's for running something without making a commit? 20:38:35 yeah 20:38:56 and when I put $HACKENV/ everywhere, I looked for wisdom and quotes and ibin and stuff like that, but not for canary 20:39:08 ``` grep -wl canary bin/* 20:39:09 grep: bin/*: No such file or directory 20:39:20 ``` grep -wl canary /hackenv/bin/* # ok, I deserved that one 20:39:22 ​/hackenv/bin/( 20:39:44 `? ( 20:39:46 ​(? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ 20:40:59 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90695&oldid=90694 * PixelatedStarfish * (+44) /* Test Cases */ 20:41:36 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90696&oldid=90695 * PixelatedStarfish * (-39) /* Test Cases */ 20:43:17 -!- dutch has quit (Quit: WeeChat 3.3). 20:47:52 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90697&oldid=90696 * PixelatedStarfish * (+11) /* Test Cases */ 20:47:53 -!- SpikeHeron has joined. 20:48:41 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90698&oldid=90697 * PixelatedStarfish * (-11) /* Test Cases */ 20:54:45 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90699&oldid=90698 * PixelatedStarfish * (+395) /* Test Cases */ 20:56:05 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90700&oldid=90699 * PixelatedStarfish * (-20) /* Test Cases */ 21:03:08 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90701&oldid=90700 * PixelatedStarfish * (+0) /* Test Cases */ 21:04:33 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90702&oldid=90701 * PixelatedStarfish * (+0) 21:04:55 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90703&oldid=90702 * PixelatedStarfish * (+2) /* Test Cases */ 21:05:26 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90704&oldid=90703 * PixelatedStarfish * (+10) /* Test Cases */ 21:09:26 [[Bedtime]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90705&oldid=90704 * PixelatedStarfish * (+0) /* Interpreter */ 21:15:05 [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90706&oldid=90692 * Squidmanescape * (+243) /* Description */ 21:29:39 -!- chiselfuse has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 21:31:38 -!- Trieste_ has joined. 21:31:49 -!- Trieste has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 21:32:04 -!- tech_exorcist has quit (Quit: Goodbye). 21:32:19 -!- tech_exorcist has joined. 21:35:37 -!- Trieste_ has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 21:36:00 -!- tromp has quit (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…). 21:37:51 -!- Trieste has joined. 21:38:52 -!- tromp has joined. 21:41:52 -!- chiselfuse has joined. 21:42:44 -!- Trieste_ has joined. 21:43:43 -!- Trieste has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds). 21:49:41 -!- Trieste_ has changed nick to Trieste. 21:49:43 `cbt ( 21:49:44 ​#!/bin/bash \ TIMEFORMAT="real: %lR, user: %lU, sys: %lS" \ shopt -s extglob globstar \ rm -- "$HACKENV/canary"; eval -- "$1" | rnooodl 21:50:32 `( seq 10 | tee cXsR 21:50:35 1 \ 2 \ 3 \ 4 \ 5 \ 6 \ 7 \ 8 \ 9 \ 10 21:50:41 `cat cXsR 21:50:42 1 \ 2 \ 3 \ 4 \ 5 \ 6 \ 7 \ 8 \ 9 \ 10 21:50:47 hmm, that didn't work 21:50:50 `rm cXsR 21:50:51 No output. 21:50:54 `cat cXsR 21:50:54 cat: cXsR: No such file or directory 21:51:09 fizzie: ^ doesn't seem to work 21:51:21 I'll have to revert it so it at least gives an error message 21:52:31 `cbt ( 21:52:32 ​#!/bin/bash \ TIMEFORMAT="real: %lR, user: %lU, sys: %lS" \ shopt -s extglob globstar \ rm canary; eval -- "$1" | rnooodl 21:52:57 I think the problem's really that no commit is needed any more for files in the current directory (/hackenv/tmp), so the command becomes slightly pointless. 21:53:11 ah 21:53:13 right! 21:53:17 then I shouldn't revert it 21:53:32 `cbt ( 21:53:33 ​#!/bin/bash \ TIMEFORMAT="real: %lR, user: %lU, sys: %lS" \ shopt -s extglob globstar \ rm -- "$HACKENV/canary"; eval -- "$1" | rnooodl 21:53:53 `( echo cr7xRqXRGr1o > /hackenv/X4_D 21:53:56 No output. 21:54:02 `cat /hackenv/X4_D 21:54:04 cat: /hackenv/X4_D: No such file or directory 21:54:08 good, it is working 21:54:22 thanks for the reminder 21:54:33 The chances of someone successfully using it for its intended purpose are pretty slim, but of course it's the principle of the thing. 21:55:17 sure, the fallback if we can't fix it is to make it always give an informative error message and not execute its comman 21:55:28 if nobody wants to use it, that doesn't hurt 21:55:34 but this is even better 21:57:52 ``` cd /hackenv/bin; ln -sv ../../bin/true ./\: 21:57:54 ​'./:' -> '../../bin/true' 21:58:00 `: ignore this please 21:58:01 No output. 21:58:21 apparently that's only a shell builtin, it doesn't exist as a standalone executable 21:58:25 ``` type -a : 21:58:27 ​: is a shell builtin \ : is /hackenv/bin/: 21:58:29 -!- Koen has joined. 21:58:31 ``` type -a true 21:58:32 true is a shell builtin \ true is /bin/true 22:04:37 -!- tech_exorcist has quit (Quit: Goodbye). 22:09:24 [[Haczyk]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90707&oldid=90706 * Squidmanescape * (+25) /* Description */ 22:16:04 [[KonamiCode]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90708&oldid=90280 * Conor O'Brien * (-12) Given proof of TC, edit tag 22:19:51 -!- A_Dragon has changed nick to Festive_Dragon. 22:27:41 -!- tromp has quit (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…). 22:37:49 `relcome 22:37:51 ​Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: . (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on EFnet or DALnet.) 22:42:22 -!- Koen has quit (Quit: Leaving...). 22:55:53 -!- tromp has joined. 23:05:51 -!- tromp has quit (Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…). 23:15:43 -!- tromp has joined. 23:35:40 -!- Guest35 has joined. 23:35:53 -!- Guest35 has quit (Client Quit). 23:45:09 [[P]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=90709 * OrichalcumCosmonaut * (+21) redirect from double-prime character to two separate prime characters 23:54:18 [[P]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=90710&oldid=90667 * OrichalcumCosmonaut * (+37) correct structured program theorem redlink to point to wikipedia article (which was probably intended) 23:54:45 -!- oerjan has joined.