00:20:35 <b_jonas> fungot, what's the difference between a bucket and a pail?
00:20:36 <fungot> b_jonas: this is a man to treasure. the thief in the throes of an unraveling alibi. " the massacre of syrs gnelph was not as written a message you got, my brother, and we just keep the safe or tub handy or a cunning prankster than a common sort.
00:23:02 -!- eli_oat has joined.
00:29:30 <esolangs> [[Cmpilr]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=92751 * Grom * (+2136) Created page with "{{infobox proglang |name=Cmpilr |paradigms=not specified |author=[[User:Grom]] |year=[[:Category:2022|2022]] |class=:Category:Optionally Turing_complete|Optionally Turing co..."
00:31:44 -!- cd has joined.
00:48:10 -!- eli_oat has quit (Quit: eli_oat).
02:18:05 <esolangs> [[ASCIIORb]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=92752 * Threesodas * (+4372) Created page with "[[Category:2022]][[Category:Unimplemented]][[Category:Languages]][[Category:Stack-based]] '''ASCIIORb''' is a [[stack]]-based language that follows the "syntax" of the '''@ORb..."
02:18:36 <esolangs> [[User:Threesodas]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92753&oldid=92611 * Threesodas * (-42)
02:19:40 <esolangs> [[Language list]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92754&oldid=92745 * Threesodas * (+15) Add ASCIIORb
03:00:21 -!- Sgeo has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds).
03:00:45 -!- Sgeo has joined.
03:03:09 -!- que11en has joined.
03:04:21 <que11en> m0ther: i have deactivated the self-destruction protocol
03:56:18 -!- sprout has joined.
04:38:52 -!- oerjan has joined.
04:41:10 -!- Sgeo_ has joined.
04:42:00 -!- Sgeo has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds).
04:52:09 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92755&oldid=92729 * PixelatedStarfish * (+0) /* Interpreter Status */
04:52:59 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92756&oldid=92755 * PixelatedStarfish * (-1329) /* Considerations for Future Changes */
04:53:09 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92757&oldid=92756 * PixelatedStarfish * (+1) /* Considerations for Future Changes */
04:53:29 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92758&oldid=92757 * PixelatedStarfish * (+0) /* External Links */
04:56:48 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92759&oldid=92758 * PixelatedStarfish * (+0) /* External Links */
04:58:24 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92760&oldid=92759 * PixelatedStarfish * (-157) /* Interpreter Status */
05:01:29 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92761&oldid=92760 * PixelatedStarfish * (+367) /* Instruction Set */
05:03:15 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92762&oldid=92761 * PixelatedStarfish * (+17) /* Instruction Set */
05:04:36 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92763&oldid=92762 * PixelatedStarfish * (+1) /* Grammar in EBNF */
05:06:59 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92764&oldid=92763 * PixelatedStarfish * (+74) /* Error Codes */
05:07:51 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92765&oldid=92764 * PixelatedStarfish * (-13) /* Error Codes */
05:08:33 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92766&oldid=92765 * PixelatedStarfish * (+13) /* Error Codes */
05:09:33 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92767&oldid=92766 * PixelatedStarfish * (+19) /* False Machine */
05:09:50 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92768&oldid=92767 * PixelatedStarfish * (+10) /* False Machine */
05:10:47 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92769&oldid=92768 * PixelatedStarfish * (+46) /* Grammar in EBNF */
05:11:00 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92770&oldid=92769 * PixelatedStarfish * (+2) /* Grammar in EBNF */
05:11:45 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92771&oldid=92770 * PixelatedStarfish * (+177) /* Grammar in EBNF */
05:12:15 <esolangs> [[User:PixelatedStarfish]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92772&oldid=92582 * PixelatedStarfish * (+0) /* MacroBeep */
05:13:15 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92773&oldid=92771 * PixelatedStarfish * (+0)
05:14:34 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92774&oldid=92773 * PixelatedStarfish * (-100) /* Considerations for Future Changes */
05:19:45 -!- que11en has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds).
05:24:12 <oerjan> <riv> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_formatting_and_storage_bugs#Year_2022 <-- a bit depressing, that page
05:25:23 <int-e> *sigh* today: no hot water
05:26:08 <int-e> Oh well. I hope they just forgot to turn off the central boiler and didn't actually break anything.
05:30:52 -!- que11en has joined.
05:32:36 -!- chiselfuse has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds).
05:33:43 -!- chiselfuse has joined.
05:38:12 -!- Sgeo_ has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:12 -!- cd has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:12 -!- silkworks has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:12 -!- APic has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:12 -!- Hooloovoo has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:12 -!- Melvar has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:12 -!- tromp has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:12 -!- sknebel has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:12 -!- fowl has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:12 -!- imode has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:12 -!- b_jonas has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:13 -!- oerjan has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:13 -!- maximum_yellow has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:14 -!- laerling has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:14 -!- scjosh has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:14 -!- iovoid has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:14 -!- joast has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:14 -!- MrAureliusR has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:14 -!- int-e has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:14 -!- aarchi has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:14 -!- zzo38 has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:14 -!- lagash has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:14 -!- ProofTechnique has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:14 -!- riv has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:15 -!- dbohdan has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:15 -!- ^[ has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:15 -!- HackEso has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:15 -!- simcop2387 has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:15 -!- Cale has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:15 -!- benji has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:15 -!- monoxane has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:16 -!- rodgort has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:16 -!- Noisytoot has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:16 -!- slavfox has quit (*.net *.split).
05:38:16 -!- MizMahem has quit (*.net *.split).
05:48:05 -!- slavfox has joined.
05:51:15 -!- HackEso has joined.
05:51:15 -!- simcop2387 has joined.
05:51:15 -!- Cale has joined.
05:51:15 -!- benji has joined.
05:51:15 -!- monoxane has joined.
05:51:15 -!- rodgort has joined.
05:51:15 -!- Noisytoot has joined.
05:52:44 -!- oerjan has joined.
05:52:44 -!- maximum_yellow has joined.
05:52:44 -!- laerling has joined.
05:52:44 -!- scjosh has joined.
05:52:44 -!- iovoid has joined.
05:52:44 -!- joast has joined.
05:52:44 -!- MrAureliusR has joined.
05:52:44 -!- int-e has joined.
05:52:44 -!- aarchi has joined.
05:52:44 -!- zzo38 has joined.
05:52:44 -!- lagash has joined.
05:52:44 -!- ProofTechnique has joined.
05:52:44 -!- riv has joined.
05:52:44 -!- dbohdan has joined.
05:52:44 -!- ^[ has joined.
05:53:34 -!- Sgeo_ has joined.
05:53:34 -!- cd has joined.
05:53:34 -!- silkworks has joined.
05:53:34 -!- APic has joined.
05:53:34 -!- Hooloovoo has joined.
05:53:34 -!- Melvar has joined.
05:53:34 -!- tromp has joined.
05:53:34 -!- sknebel has joined.
05:53:34 -!- fowl has joined.
05:53:34 -!- imode has joined.
05:53:34 -!- b_jonas has joined.
05:54:07 -!- ickk has joined.
05:54:51 -!- MizMahem has joined.
05:57:43 -!- slavfox has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds).
05:59:35 -!- slavfox has joined.
06:00:38 -!- Sgeo has joined.
06:01:54 -!- Sgeo_ has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds).
06:12:37 -!- Sgeo_ has joined.
06:15:17 -!- Sgeo has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds).
06:43:47 <oerjan> now to check if zeetha reacts as i expect
06:48:27 <oerjan> i am slightly annoyed at an inconsistency i noticed.
06:48:49 <oerjan> the brekkah stone is supposedly _older_ than luheia - lost before she was born.
06:49:14 <oerjan> but also, luheia supposedly _led_ them through the mirror to skifander.
06:49:37 <oerjan> which means the stone _shouldn't_ be from there.
06:52:08 <oerjan> also, they totally should get the stone packed away before lady before the enemy shows up.
06:56:15 <oerjan> also, keep it away from dupree, but they don't know that.
06:59:56 <int-e> oerjan: hmm *reading* the Brek'kah stone is one of a pair; what if that pair is linked regardless of where they are? :P
07:01:20 <oerjan> ah yes that might be it
07:02:27 <int-e> It's enough for a writer to wiggle out of it, I think. :)
07:06:49 <int-e> oh, warm water... yay for minor miracles
07:24:30 <tromp> any guesses on simplest addition to {K,W} to make a basis for CL?
07:42:16 <tromp> that works, but is not the simplest
07:42:48 <tromp> in terms of size of the basis combinators
07:43:53 <riv> binary lambda calculus
07:43:58 <tromp> Sizes in binary lambda calculus are defined by size(lambda M)=2+size(M), size(M N)=2+size(M)+size(N), and size(V)=1+i for a variable V bound by the i-th enclosing lambda.
07:44:25 <tromp> ( from https://oeis.org/A333479 )
07:49:13 -!- Sgeo_ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer).
07:57:56 <Palaiologos[m]> i don't have the resources to check my ideas at the moment
08:01:25 -!- revolvereld has joined.
08:03:22 <tromp> {K,W,S} works too, but is not a minimal size addition either
08:04:03 -!- revolvereld has quit (Remote host closed the connection).
08:05:17 -!- revolvereld has joined.
08:05:57 -!- revolvereld has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer).
08:07:59 -!- revolvereld has joined.
08:08:16 <Palaiologos[m]> i've heard about Wolfram willing to pay someone for proving that just the S combinator is TC
08:14:50 <tromp> no, i don't think so.
08:18:56 <oerjan> int-e: oh hm https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20140509
08:19:19 <oerjan> it doesn't say explicitly it was luheia who did it
08:19:53 <oerjan> (took me a while to binge to the right place :) )
08:22:23 <oerjan> Palaiologos[m]: it's probably "universal" rather than TC, which means the definition is vague and up for discussion
08:23:44 <oerjan> (specifically, it's been proved that normalizability of S-expressions is decidable, so you would need to consider non-halting computations at the very least)
08:24:10 <oerjan> (someone linked a nice table in this channel back when it was discussed)
08:24:52 <int-e> Wolfram knows this though, and explicitly asks about some TC structure in the nonterminating computations
08:25:10 <int-e> But that makes things very murky.
08:25:23 <riv> S-expressions being (SS)S(SS)(SS(S)S) type things
08:25:29 <int-e> In particular it's so ill-defined that you can't hope to *disprove* that this is TC.
08:25:49 <riv> as opposed to s-expressions which are like ((S S) S (S S) (S S (S) S))
08:25:58 <int-e> Because there'll always be ways to shift the goalpost further away.
08:26:56 <int-e> (the table was actually from one of Wolfram's posts about this)
08:27:31 <oerjan> riv: i couldn't resist punning, as usual
09:12:26 -!- ickk has quit (Quit: Leaving).
09:21:51 -!- revolvereld has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer).
09:26:28 -!- fowl has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds).
09:32:32 -!- revolvereld has joined.
09:39:56 <salpynx> tromp: is it one of the Q bird combinators? A guess, picking something that is Bish and Cish.
09:46:41 <salpynx> was going to say S, but you covered that above. My guess: λabc.a(cb) (Q1 / apparently 'Quixotic'), maybe Q, λabc.b(ac), ('Queer')?
09:51:09 <esolangs> [[SRlang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92775&oldid=88355 * Soyuzguy123! * (+1488) dont chuck this off as a broken page, its still under construction dw
09:52:03 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/upload]] upload * Soyuzguy123! * uploaded "[[File:SRlang logo-removebg-preview.png]]": Logo for a language
09:54:07 -!- salpynx has quit (Quit: Client closed).
09:54:37 <esolangs> [[SRlang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92777&oldid=92775 * Soyuzguy123! * (+35)
09:56:04 <esolangs> [[SRlang]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92778&oldid=92777 * Soyuzguy123! * (+2)
10:04:56 <esolangs> [[Grammar]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=92779 * Citrons * (+6030) apioform
10:16:26 <tromp> {K,W,Q} is a basis
10:53:10 -!- Lord_of_Life_ has joined.
10:54:05 -!- Lord_of_Life has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds).
10:54:28 -!- Lord_of_Life_ has changed nick to Lord_of_Life.
11:18:46 -!- m5zs7k has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds).
11:19:44 -!- m5zs7k has joined.
11:22:03 -!- tech_exorcist has joined.
11:22:23 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: Later).
11:24:45 -!- revolvereld has quit (Remote host closed the connection).
11:25:01 <esolangs> [[Grammar]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92780&oldid=92779 * Citrons * (+1) typo
11:34:58 <esolangs> [[Grammar]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92781&oldid=92780 * Citrons * (+58) add categories
11:50:44 -!- abraham1 has quit (Quit: The Lounge - https://thelounge.chat).
11:51:01 -!- abraham1 has joined.
11:52:01 -!- abraham1 has changed nick to abraham.
12:05:18 -!- peter29 has joined.
12:24:46 -!- __monty__ has joined.
12:32:05 -!- peter29 has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds).
12:35:00 <esolangs> [[Plurple]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92782&oldid=92746 * Laclale * (+170) /* Commands */
12:36:23 -!- wib_jonas has joined.
12:42:28 <wib_jonas> int-e: I'm still sticking to my opinion that it's not a problem that we're looking only among non-terminating behavior, because old personal computers all have a power supply and RAM that can't be stopped programmatically, so all the programs on it never halt, but nobody would think that that's an obstacle to them doing universal computations. that
12:42:28 <wib_jonas> their RAM and backing storage is small can be an obstacle, but that won't be a problem with a combinator basis.
12:43:41 -!- oerjan has joined.
12:43:46 <Palaiologos[m]> wib_jonas: don't old computers have a BIOS call for restarting the machine from scratch including the POST, etc..., meaning that they do theoretically halt for a short while?
12:47:05 <wib_jonas> Palaiologos[m]: there's a reboot routine which eg. resets the video card settigns, stops the sound from the sound chip, etc. it's useful in practice because (1) it reinitializes hardware from most of the broken states that an incorrect program could put them into, and (2) it works even after thrashing memory, because it only relies on the data in
12:47:05 <wib_jonas> the ROM. but none of that behavior is special to the BIOS, a normal program (perhaps customized for the specific hardaware) could do just the same. and in particular, it won't affect the power supply or RAM or CPU in any special way.
12:48:00 <oerjan> `learn The password of the month is decided with a non-terminating computation.
12:48:02 <wib_jonas> You can say that the display on the monitor or the sound from the speaker is a nice observable output, more so than whatever is written to the memory or extension port, so it's a good alternative to halting.
12:48:05 <HackEso> Relearned 'password': The password of the month is decided with a non-terminating computation.
12:48:42 <wib_jonas> That shows why you can use the monitor, sound, or many other optional external hardware like disks to get a result from a program, without caring about whether the program halts.
12:49:20 <wib_jonas> You can say that the combinator calculus with just S doesn't have such nice external signs, so you need a much less clear definition of what you want to observe (rather than halting).
12:49:30 <Palaiologos[m]> isn't halting just an arbitrary state though? we could define the program in the state after executing `cli / hlt` as halted without the power going out.
12:50:12 <wib_jonas> You can't just say that you can observe whatever is apparent to an untrained user, i.e. without probing the bus with a signal generator, because combinator calculus doesn't have that distinction.
12:52:41 <wib_jonas> Palaiologos: the halt thing applies to a modern CPU like 8086, and I'm not even sure you can really observe it externally until even later CPUs add power saving features. You could try to see when the CPU does it, but it's a worse method of output than looking at the monitor or speaker or floppy drive.
13:13:25 -!- tech_exorcist has quit (Remote host closed the connection).
13:13:47 -!- tech_exorcist has joined.
13:29:51 -!- eli_oat has joined.
13:33:00 -!- wib_jonas has quit (Quit: Client closed).
13:48:07 -!- eli_oat has quit (Quit: eli_oat).
14:00:41 -!- eli_oat has joined.
14:08:31 -!- fowl has joined.
14:11:56 -!- tech_exorcist has quit (Quit: see you later).
14:39:21 <esolangs> [[SRlang]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92783&oldid=92778 * PythonshellDebugwindow * (-55) Remove nonexistent category and incorrect category (language isn't total)
14:42:27 -!- wib_jonas has joined.
14:47:14 -!- tech_exorcist has joined.
15:07:39 <Corbin> Palaiologos[m]: One challenge in Wolfram's framing is that it's already proven that K and I aren't derivable from S. I don't think B, C, or any other linear combinator is derivable, although I'm open to evidence. Wolfram's really askiing for a homomorphism from trees of S combinators to any TC language s.t. reductions of S terms in the original tree correspond to reductions in the TC language.
15:07:44 -!- Sgeo has joined.
15:09:20 <wib_jonas> Corbin: from a subset of the trees at least, yes.
15:09:30 <riv> can you make an infinite loop with S alone?
15:10:13 <wib_jonas> nah, never mind, I'm not sure that homomorphism thing is a good description. it doesn't bring you closer to what Turing-complete means
15:11:22 <Corbin> Sure; we don't usually talk about TC languages in terms of homomorphisms. I think we should, though, if for no other reason than that these homomorphisms are typically compilers.
15:14:00 <wib_jonas> Corbin: in that case I don't understand what kind of homomorphism you want
15:15:18 <Corbin> wib_jonas: It should preserve the reduction structure; if it's legal to reduce one tree of S to another tree, then similar reasoning should allow us to reduce one TC program to another. (Or else trees of S clearly aren't TC, because not all TC reductions show up inside it!)
15:18:17 <riv> Sxyz = (xz)(yz) so SSyS = SSyS I guess this is an infinite loop
15:18:50 <riv> can you make one that grows each time?
15:24:52 <tromp> no, SSyS = SS(yS) which is quite different
15:31:36 -!- ProofTechnique has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds).
15:36:10 -!- ProofTechnique has joined.
15:40:21 -!- que11en has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds).
16:01:30 <oerjan> riv: istr that the decidable normalization article said reductions always halt at the top level, which would mean it's only the deeply nested subterms that can continue growing.
16:02:50 <oerjan> mind you i only browsed a bit of it
16:07:49 -!- SoniEx2 has changed nick to Soni.
16:08:38 <esolangs> [[Plurple]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92784&oldid=92782 * Laclale * (+43) /* Commands */
16:14:53 -!- wib_jonas has quit (Quit: Client closed).
16:21:09 <esolangs> [[Plurple]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92785&oldid=92784 * Laclale * (+230) /* Sigil and Space */
16:27:26 -!- vyv has joined.
16:28:11 -!- eli_oat has quit (Quit: eli_oat).
16:51:31 -!- eli_oat has joined.
17:10:45 <int-e> oerjan: you remember correctly; Waldmann calls it top-stabilization
17:12:03 <int-e> b_jonas: it's okay to look at non-termination. but the less natural your criterion, the more you're opening up yourself to questions how much of the TC-ness you've derived can be attributed to S and how much to the criterion you're using
17:13:14 <int-e> I have the same issue with the rule 110 thing. Rule 110 + infinite repeating background is TC, but how much "control flow" or maybe "adjoined finite automaton" is encoded in that pattern?
17:14:54 <int-e> (AIUI the halting criterion is relatively sane in that case since it's emulating some cyclic tag thing.)
17:17:48 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: Nite).
17:25:29 -!- eli_oat has quit (Quit: eli_oat).
17:30:35 -!- eli_oat has joined.
17:30:37 -!- eli_oat has quit (Client Quit).
17:31:00 -!- eli_oat has joined.
17:39:27 <esolangs> [[Plurple]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92786&oldid=92785 * Laclale * (+275)
17:41:52 <esolangs> [[Plurple]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92787&oldid=92786 * Laclale * (-5)
17:43:24 <esolangs> [[Plurple]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92788&oldid=92787 * Laclale * (-23)
17:45:15 <esolangs> [[User:PixelatedStarfish]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92789&oldid=92772 * PixelatedStarfish * (+114) /* MacroBeep */
17:48:56 <esolangs> [[User:PixelatedStarfish]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92790&oldid=92789 * PixelatedStarfish * (+119) /* MacroBeep */
17:49:13 <esolangs> [[User:PixelatedStarfish]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92791&oldid=92790 * PixelatedStarfish * (+2) /* MacroBeep */
17:55:53 <esolangs> [[Category:Markup Languages]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92792&oldid=43275 * Laclale * (+23)
18:01:37 -!- Noisytoot has quit (Remote host closed the connection).
18:02:00 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92793&oldid=92774 * PixelatedStarfish * (+272) /* External Links */
18:02:10 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92794&oldid=92793 * PixelatedStarfish * (+1) /* =Repls for Online Use */
18:02:37 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92795&oldid=92794 * PixelatedStarfish * (+4) /* Repls for Online Use */
18:03:00 <esolangs> [[MacroBeep]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92796&oldid=92795 * PixelatedStarfish * (-1) /* External Links */
18:04:04 -!- Noisytoot has joined.
18:04:10 <esolangs> [[User:PixelatedStarfish]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92797&oldid=92791 * PixelatedStarfish * (+4) /* MacroBeep */
18:04:39 <esolangs> [[User:PixelatedStarfish]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92798&oldid=92797 * PixelatedStarfish * (+0) /* MacroBeep */
18:23:09 -!- SGautam has joined.
18:44:32 -!- eli_oat has quit (Quit: eli_oat).
19:14:45 -!- fowl has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer).
19:15:23 -!- fowl has joined.
19:29:23 -!- tech_exorcist has quit (Remote host closed the connection).
19:29:47 -!- tech_exorcist has joined.
19:45:51 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * WaifuShork * New user account
19:48:40 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92799&oldid=92716 * WaifuShork * (+261) /* Introductions */
19:50:10 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92800&oldid=92799 * WaifuShork * (+6) /* Introductions */
19:56:01 -!- Bertrahm has joined.
19:57:06 <Bertrahm> I've been playing with this concept of a joke (?) or theoretical lang that could create a turing completeness proof for any language but I dont know if thats already around
19:57:54 <Corbin> Interesting. How would you specify the object languages?
19:58:44 <Bertrahm> i think the meaning of object languages got lost in translation for me. do you mean the language to generate for?
20:00:40 <Bertrahm> I've been thinking about it, if it should be more "realistic" and get fed a set of rules of the language and its keywords or if I should make it purely theoretical where it can generate a turing proof by just the name of the language
20:01:19 <Corbin> Yeah. Like, I understand how you would represent the typical programming language. But what about something like a Wang tileset?
20:02:39 <Bertrahm> what do you mean by Wang tileset? All I can think of is the wang tile thing by hao wang
20:05:20 <Corbin> Yeah, that's what I'm thinking of.
20:06:58 <Bertrahm> how do you calculate with the wang tiles? Or am I just lacking in knowledge again '=D
20:07:26 <Palaiologos[m]> <Bertrahm> "I've been playing with this..." <- so something like what cyclic tag systems, brainfuck, minsky machines, etc...?
20:07:38 <Palaiologos[m]> these all are being used for turing completeness proofs on the way of translation or simulation.
20:07:53 <Corbin> https://grahamshawcross.com/2012/10/12/wang-tiles-and-turing-machines/ seems like a decent introduction to writing programs with Wang tiling.
20:08:10 <Palaiologos[m]> i don't think it gets any simpler than minsky machines or cyclic tag.
20:08:32 <Corbin> Palaiologos[m]: I think Bertrahm is thinking about the metatheory for performing Turing-completeness proofs; something like a formal-methods framework or a theorem-prover.
20:09:49 <Bertrahm> Some of this is going over my head since english isnt my native language. What I mean is that it would, given a languages name (or a set of rules and instructions for the language) generate a turing-completeness proof program for that language
20:11:35 <Corbin> Aha. That makes some sense. (Your English is very good, by the way!)
20:11:48 -!- salpynx has joined.
20:14:37 <Bertrahm> I think I'll write a wiki page for it laying out what Ideas I have and then share it. Im just struggling to think of a name xD
20:29:12 <salpynx> riv: Re. Loops in S: Section 3, Lemma 3.3, with proof: There are no reduction cycles in Σ [Σ = CL(S)] https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0304397579900045
20:31:52 <riv> woah!! that's cool!
20:32:06 <riv> so any loop must explode
20:32:16 <riv> why isn't this stuff more widely known!
20:39:50 <esolangs> [[Turing Completer]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=92801 * Bertrahm * (+1306) Created page with "{{WIP}} '''Turing Completer''' is a theoretical language capable of generating a [[Turing Completeness]] Proof for any language. There are 2 variations for this language, one..."
20:41:17 <Bertrahm> wrote everything out that I had in mind. I think that there could be more to it but I can't think of anything...
20:45:01 <esolangs> [[Turing Completer]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92802&oldid=92801 * Bertrahm * (+322)
21:11:54 -!- MizMahem has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:54 -!- SGautam has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:54 -!- Noisytoot has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:55 -!- Sgeo has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:55 -!- abraham has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:55 -!- cd has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:55 -!- silkworks has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:55 -!- APic has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:55 -!- Hooloovoo has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:56 -!- Melvar has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:56 -!- tromp has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:56 -!- sknebel has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:56 -!- imode has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:56 -!- b_jonas has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:57 -!- maximum_yellow has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:57 -!- laerling has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:58 -!- scjosh has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:58 -!- iovoid has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:58 -!- joast has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:58 -!- MrAureliusR has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:58 -!- int-e has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:58 -!- aarchi has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:58 -!- zzo38 has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:58 -!- lagash has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:58 -!- riv has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:59 -!- dbohdan has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:59 -!- ^[ has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:59 -!- HackEso has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:59 -!- simcop2387 has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:59 -!- Cale has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:59 -!- benji has quit (*.net *.split).
21:11:59 -!- monoxane has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:00 -!- rodgort has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:00 -!- chiselfuse has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:00 -!- j-bot has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:02 -!- shikhin has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:02 -!- fizzie has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:02 -!- yuu_ has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:02 -!- mich181189 has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:02 -!- tech_exorcist has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:02 -!- ProofTechnique has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:02 -!- __monty__ has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:02 -!- m5zs7k has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:03 -!- Lord_of_Life has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:03 -!- slavfox has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:03 -!- immibis has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:03 -!- user3456 has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:03 -!- ski has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:03 -!- sprock has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:04 -!- vyv has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:04 -!- msmith12[m] has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:05 -!- oren has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:05 -!- fungot has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:05 -!- relrod has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:06 -!- citrons has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:06 -!- lambdabot has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:06 -!- haavard has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:06 -!- A_Dragon has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:06 -!- kronk has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:07 -!- feoh has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:07 -!- jix has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:08 -!- sebbu has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:08 -!- ccx has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:09 -!- Palaiologos[m] has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:09 -!- ecs has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:09 -!- Argorok has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:09 -!- Corbin has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:09 -!- V has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:10 -!- mcfrdy has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:10 -!- sprout has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:11 -!- Riviera has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:11 -!- pikhq has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:11 -!- myname has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:11 -!- shachaf has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:11 -!- salpynx has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:11 -!- Bertrahm has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:12 -!- integral has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:12 -!- sunarch has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:12 -!- Bowserinator has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:13 -!- FireFly has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:13 -!- Taneb has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:13 -!- zegalch has quit (*.net *.split).
21:12:13 -!- leah2 has quit (*.net *.split).
21:13:21 -!- relrod has joined.
21:13:21 -!- fungot has joined.
21:13:21 -!- oren has joined.
21:13:21 -!- msmith12[m] has joined.
21:13:21 -!- vyv has joined.
21:13:21 -!- rodgort has joined.
21:13:21 -!- monoxane has joined.
21:13:21 -!- benji has joined.
21:13:21 -!- simcop2387 has joined.
21:13:21 -!- HackEso has joined.
21:13:21 -!- shachaf has joined.
21:13:21 -!- myname has joined.
21:13:21 -!- pikhq has joined.
21:13:21 -!- Riviera has joined.
21:13:21 -!- sprout has joined.
21:13:21 -!- kronk has joined.
21:13:21 -!- A_Dragon has joined.
21:13:21 -!- haavard has joined.
21:13:21 -!- citrons has joined.
21:13:21 -!- lambdabot has joined.
21:13:21 -!- Cale has joined.
21:13:21 -!- sprock has joined.
21:13:21 -!- ski has joined.
21:13:21 -!- user3456 has joined.
21:13:21 -!- immibis has joined.
21:13:21 -!- slavfox has joined.
21:13:21 -!- Lord_of_Life has joined.
21:13:21 -!- m5zs7k has joined.
21:13:21 -!- __monty__ has joined.
21:13:21 -!- ProofTechnique has joined.
21:13:21 -!- tech_exorcist has joined.
21:13:21 -!- Bertrahm has joined.
21:13:21 -!- salpynx has joined.
21:13:26 -!- sunarch has joined.
21:13:26 -!- integral has joined.
21:13:26 -!- Bowserinator has joined.
21:13:26 -!- FireFly has joined.
21:13:26 -!- Taneb has joined.
21:13:26 -!- zegalch has joined.
21:13:26 -!- leah2 has joined.
21:13:50 -!- SGautam has joined.
21:13:50 -!- Sgeo has joined.
21:13:50 -!- abraham has joined.
21:13:50 -!- cd has joined.
21:13:50 -!- silkworks has joined.
21:13:50 -!- APic has joined.
21:13:50 -!- Hooloovoo has joined.
21:13:50 -!- Melvar has joined.
21:13:50 -!- tromp has joined.
21:13:50 -!- sknebel has joined.
21:13:50 -!- imode has joined.
21:13:50 -!- b_jonas has joined.
21:14:07 -!- feoh has joined.
21:14:07 -!- jix has joined.
21:14:07 -!- sebbu has joined.
21:14:27 -!- maximum_yellow has joined.
21:14:27 -!- laerling has joined.
21:14:27 -!- scjosh has joined.
21:14:27 -!- iovoid has joined.
21:14:27 -!- joast has joined.
21:14:28 -!- MrAureliusR has joined.
21:14:28 -!- int-e has joined.
21:14:28 -!- aarchi has joined.
21:14:28 -!- zzo38 has joined.
21:14:28 -!- lagash has joined.
21:14:28 -!- riv has joined.
21:14:28 -!- dbohdan has joined.
21:14:28 -!- ^[ has joined.
21:14:50 -!- j-bot has joined.
21:14:50 -!- shikhin has joined.
21:14:50 -!- fizzie has joined.
21:14:50 -!- yuu_ has joined.
21:14:50 -!- mich181189 has joined.
21:15:02 -!- ccx has joined.
21:15:02 -!- MizMahem has joined.
21:15:08 -!- msmith12[m] has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds).
21:15:11 -!- sebbu has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer).
21:15:18 -!- Palaiologos[m] has joined.
21:15:18 -!- ecs has joined.
21:15:18 -!- Argorok has joined.
21:15:18 -!- Corbin has joined.
21:15:18 -!- V has joined.
21:15:18 -!- mcfrdy has joined.
21:15:19 -!- Palaiologos[m] has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds).
21:16:30 -!- sebbu has joined.
21:20:08 -!- tech_exorcist has quit (Remote host closed the connection).
21:24:06 -!- Cale has quit (Quit: Leaving).
21:24:22 -!- Cale has joined.
21:25:33 -!- Cale has quit (Client Quit).
21:25:47 -!- Cale has joined.
21:25:58 -!- Cale has quit (Remote host closed the connection).
21:26:11 -!- Cale has joined.
21:27:39 <esolangs> [[MathSeq]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=92803 * Threesodas * (+4348) Created page with "{{lowercase}} [[Category:Unimplemented]] [[Category:Languages]] '''mathSeq''' ('''math Seq'''uences) is an esoteric programming language created by User:Threesodas|Threesoda..."
21:27:56 <esolangs> [[MathSeq]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92804&oldid=92803 * Threesodas * (+3) oosp typo
21:30:44 <esolangs> [[MathSeq]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92805&oldid=92804 * Bertrahm * (+6) /* Syntax */
21:32:13 -!- Cale has quit (Quit: Leaving).
21:32:27 -!- chiselfuse has joined.
21:32:30 -!- Cale has joined.
21:32:42 -!- Bertrahm has quit (Quit: Client closed).
21:33:14 -!- Noisytoot has joined.
21:50:50 -!- vyv has quit (Quit: Konversation terminated!).
21:53:03 -!- Palaiologos[m] has joined.
21:56:37 -!- simcop2387 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds).
21:56:42 -!- perlbot has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds).
22:00:57 -!- msmith12[m] has joined.
22:28:50 <esolangs> [[ScrubCode]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92806&oldid=47256 * MeowflashDaProgrammer * (+70)
22:29:19 <esolangs> [[User:MeowflashDaProgrammer]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92807&oldid=47247 * MeowflashDaProgrammer * (-1349) Replaced content with "Please delete this user. I don't want to use the Esolangs wiki anymore."
22:37:12 <esolangs> [[User:Threesodas]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92808&oldid=92753 * Threesodas * (+16)
22:50:13 <esolangs> [[MathSeq]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92809&oldid=92805 * Threesodas * (+70)
22:56:57 <esolangs> [[Plurple]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92810&oldid=92788 * Laclale * (+55) /* Commands */
23:00:13 -!- APic has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds).
23:01:50 -!- APic has joined.
23:06:25 -!- __monty__ has quit (Quit: leaving).
23:08:52 -!- zegalch has quit (Remote host closed the connection).
23:09:08 <esolangs> [[January 25, 4092]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=92811 * Threesodas * (+243) Created page with "[[Category:Joke_languages]] '''January 25, 5092''' is a joke esoteric language that can only be compiled on the specific date ''January 25, 4092''.<br> This is the only valid..."
23:09:17 -!- zegalch has joined.
23:09:31 <esolangs> [[January 25, 4092]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=92812&oldid=92811 * Threesodas * (+0) Change 5 to 4
23:11:29 -!- SGautam has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity).