< 1669420876 810269 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl QUIT :Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz… > 1669423718 908236 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Eigenratio14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=104923&oldid=89006 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+23) 10Category < 1669424748 844613 :razetime!~quassel@117.193.7.225 JOIN #esolangs * :razetime > 1669425617 758949 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Brainfuck+1014]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=104924&oldid=104903 5* 03Watermelyn 5* (+27) 10 < 1669428628 758160 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1669431238 767411 :Thedarkb-Desktop!~Thedarkb@92.40.196.34.threembb.co.uk QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1669432251 394070 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca JOIN #esolangs zzo38 :zzo38 < 1669434159 85423 :sprout!~quassel@dhcp-077-249-168-103.chello.nl QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1669434174 961956 :sprout!~quassel@dhcp-077-249-168-103.chello.nl JOIN #esolangs * :sprout < 1669435535 829029 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1669435552 211217 :shachaf!~shachaf@user/shachaf PRIVMSG #esolangs :Hmm, the simplex algorithm sure seems very similar to Gaussian elimination. < 1669435696 621103 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :sure, especially when you do it on an extended tableaux < 1669435747 741295 :shachaf!~shachaf@user/shachaf PRIVMSG #esolangs :Uh oh, I don't know what that is. < 1669435941 228942 :shachaf!~shachaf@user/shachaf PRIVMSG #esolangs :Ugh, so many things to learn. < 1669435964 902365 :shachaf!~shachaf@user/shachaf PRIVMSG #esolangs :Apparently this is what Gröbner bases are about too? < 1669436057 906144 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :Or is that called a full tableau? The one that has an identity matrix rather than labeling rows with basic variables < 1669436156 436808 :shachaf!~shachaf@user/shachaf PRIVMSG #esolangs :Is that similar to an augmented matrix thing? < 1669436187 610844 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :Gröbner bases have more of a gcd flavor to me. There's a connection (Bezout's identity can be turned into a linear combination of rows comprised of the coefficients of the polynomials, shifted... cf. resultants) < 1669436189 12200 :shachaf!~shachaf@user/shachaf PRIVMSG #esolangs :I thought with basic variables you still ended up having an identity matrix, though I didn't work through examples very much so maybe that's not maintained. < 1669436282 910007 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :the identity matrix can be completely implicit, but then the variable exchange step (swapping a basic variable and a non-basic one) loses some of its Gaussian elimination flavor. < 1669436325 376148 :shachaf!~shachaf@user/shachaf PRIVMSG #esolangs :Hmm, I see, I think. < 1669436716 64728 :shachaf!~shachaf@user/shachaf PRIVMSG #esolangs :Hmm, can phase 2 of the simplex method start with any feasible point, or does it need to be on a boundary of some sort? < 1669436751 260807 :razetime!~quassel@117.193.7.225 QUIT :Quit: https://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere. < 1669437021 454240 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :I think you'll have a boundary point by force (simply by the presence of that identity matrix in the full tableau) < 1669437098 69052 :shachaf!~shachaf@user/shachaf PRIVMSG #esolangs :Oh, you mean a boundary point in the full problem when you add the slack variables, not in the original problem? < 1669437122 725534 :shachaf!~shachaf@user/shachaf PRIVMSG #esolangs :Hmm, does that sentence even make sense? < 1669437241 858153 :shachaf!~shachaf@user/shachaf PRIVMSG #esolangs :I should implement this so I know what's going on. < 1669437506 780645 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :The slack variables don't really change the set of feasible solutions... they embed it in a higher-dimensional space. < 1669437565 511036 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :For example, rather than x,y >= 0, x+y <= 1, you have x,y,z >= 0 and x+y+z = 1. Both sets are two-dimensional triangles. < 1669437591 550547 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :But one of them is embedded in R^3 < 1669437668 470954 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :And the point of this is... the boundary is not affected by whether you take slack variables into account or not. < 1669437747 60405 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :Or... more abstractly... You can project the slack variables away (projecting from R^(n+m) to R^n), and that's a bijection because you can recompute the slack variables from the constraints. < 1669437797 66402 :shachaf!~shachaf@user/shachaf PRIVMSG #esolangs :Right, fair enough. < 1669437837 817958 :shachaf!~shachaf@user/shachaf PRIVMSG #esolangs :So why do you end up with a boundary point by force? < 1669437927 631836 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :because you've set the maximum number of variables to 0... meaning that the solution touches the corresponding hyperplanes < 1669438011 141656 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :I mean, when you start with a *basic* feasible solution. Which you do if you reconstruct the solution from the tableau (setting the non-basic variables to 0) < 1669439766 770074 :shachaf!~shachaf@user/shachaf PRIVMSG #esolangs :Should I think of the variables in the dual linear program as corresponding the slack variables in the primal program, or is that going down the wrong path? < 1669439927 551290 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :dunno < 1669439990 130863 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :I have not internalized the Farkas lemma. < 1669440982 772681 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1669440995 950336 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 JOIN #esolangs Lord_of_Life :Lord < 1669441069 77502 :shachaf!~shachaf@user/shachaf PRIVMSG #esolangs :What about when you start solving an LP problem directly in phase 2, when all constraints are nonnegative and you can pick the 0 vector as a starting point? < 1669441070 829304 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1669441074 108706 :shachaf!~shachaf@user/shachaf PRIVMSG #esolangs :Presumably that's not on the boundary. < 1669441096 464438 :shachaf!~shachaf@user/shachaf PRIVMSG #esolangs :Or, hmm, maybe it is. Right. < 1669448307 782879 :sprout!~quassel@dhcp-077-249-168-103.chello.nl QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1669448351 823719 :sprout!~quassel@dhcp-077-249-168-103.chello.nl JOIN #esolangs sprout :sprout < 1669448657 810908 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User < 1669454561 879501 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl QUIT :Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz… < 1669459213 830922 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User < 1669459292 253415 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@user/sgeo QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1669466982 656707 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl QUIT :Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz… < 1669467775 759994 :razetime!~quassel@117.193.7.225 JOIN #esolangs * :razetime < 1669468648 821952 :razetime!~quassel@117.193.7.225 QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1669469130 724317 :razetime!~quassel@117.193.7.178 JOIN #esolangs * :razetime < 1669469605 490747 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User < 1669471733 443434 :impomatic!~impomatic@2a00:23c7:5fac:e001:8d91:4d30:2c2a:e5d5 JOIN #esolangs impomatic :John Metcalf < 1669471905 984432 :impomatic!~impomatic@2a00:23c7:5fac:e001:8d91:4d30:2c2a:e5d5 QUIT :Client Quit < 1669471925 404528 :impomatic!~impomatic@2a00:23c7:5fac:e001:8d91:4d30:2c2a:e5d5 JOIN #esolangs impomatic :John Metcalf < 1669473871 564824 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl QUIT :Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz… < 1669474076 907219 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User < 1669474544 258109 :Thedarkb-Desktop!~Thedarkb@92.40.196.34.threembb.co.uk JOIN #esolangs Thedarkb :Ben > 1669475088 597089 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Brainfuckconsole7414]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=104925&oldid=104217 5* 03Andor ch 5* (+269) 10 > 1669475258 540926 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Brainfuckconsole7414]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=104926&oldid=104925 5* 03Andor ch 5* (+260) 10 > 1669475342 528147 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Special:Log/upload14]]4 upload10 02 5* 03Andor ch 5* 10uploaded "[[02File:BrainfuckConsole running as a compilation on processing.png10]]" > 1669475350 929654 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Brainfuckconsole7414]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=104928&oldid=104926 5* 03Andor ch 5* (+74) 10 > 1669475402 992306 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Brainfuckconsole7414]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=104929&oldid=104928 5* 03Andor ch 5* (+91) 10 > 1669475521 784761 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Special:Log/upload14]]4 upload10 02 5* 03Andor ch 5* 10uploaded "[[02File:Swiss Alpine Racing.png10]]" > 1669475527 216305 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Brainfuckconsole7414]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=104931&oldid=104929 5* 03Andor ch 5* (+39) 10 < 1669476681 731966 :razetime!~quassel@117.193.7.178 QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds < 1669477228 841834 :razetime!~quassel@117.193.3.220 JOIN #esolangs * :razetime < 1669478014 771771 :razetime_!~quassel@117.254.34.27 JOIN #esolangs * :razetime < 1669478015 848365 :razetime!~quassel@117.193.3.220 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds > 1669480442 455649 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Truth-machine14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=104932&oldid=104871 5* 03Watermelyn 5* (+31) 10 > 1669480500 571738 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Brainfuck+1014]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=104933&oldid=104924 5* 03Watermelyn 5* (+52) 10 < 1669480664 842571 :impomatic!~impomatic@2a00:23c7:5fac:e001:8d91:4d30:2c2a:e5d5 QUIT :Quit: impomatic < 1669482937 459533 :razetime_!~quassel@117.254.34.27 QUIT :Quit: https://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere. < 1669483268 863315 :FreeFull!~freefull@user-5-173-224-149.play-internet.pl JOIN #esolangs FreeFull :FreeFull < 1669485603 315210 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl QUIT :Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz… < 1669487240 337456 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User < 1669488821 809548 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca JOIN #esolangs zzo38 :zzo38 < 1669492579 949849 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@user/sgeo JOIN #esolangs Sgeo :realname < 1669493885 453747 :simcop2387!~simcop238@perlbot/patrician/simcop2387 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1669493895 382065 :simcop2387_!~simcop238@perlbot/patrician/simcop2387 JOIN #esolangs simcop2387 :ZNC - https://znc.in < 1669493973 266087 :simcop2387_!~simcop238@perlbot/patrician/simcop2387 NICK :simcop2387 < 1669496233 364876 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl QUIT :Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz… < 1669497771 726757 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User < 1669499742 580038 :impomatic!~impomatic@2a00:23c7:5fac:e001:8d91:4d30:2c2a:e5d5 JOIN #esolangs impomatic :John Metcalf < 1669499950 164819 :impomatic!~impomatic@2a00:23c7:5fac:e001:8d91:4d30:2c2a:e5d5 QUIT :Client Quit < 1669499972 631942 :impomatic!~impomatic@2a00:23c7:5fac:e001:8d91:4d30:2c2a:e5d5 JOIN #esolangs impomatic :John Metcalf < 1669500263 832014 :impomatic!~impomatic@2a00:23c7:5fac:e001:8d91:4d30:2c2a:e5d5 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1669500693 685859 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl QUIT :Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz… < 1669500874 587529 :FreeFull!~freefull@user-5-173-224-149.play-internet.pl QUIT :Quit: Night > 1669502344 911553 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Antgrid14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=104934&oldid=92203 5* 03Nakilon 5* (+27) 10added category Unimplemented > 1669502365 388458 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Antgrid14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=104935&oldid=104934 5* 03Nakilon 5* (+0) 10 < 1669505240 241286 :b_jonas!~x@adsl-89-134-12-161.monradsl.monornet.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :https://twitter.com/gro_tsen/status/1595411477065830400 (David Madore on the statement "a monad is a monoid in the category of endufunctors") < 1669505358 22725 :shachaf!~shachaf@user/shachaf PRIVMSG #esolangs :Yes, there are many monoidal structures you can put on that category, and people always leave that bit implicit.