< 1676423564 731742 :Lymia!lymia@2600:3c01::f03c:92ff:feec:5051 QUIT :Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds. < 1676423637 332160 :^[!~user@user//x-8473491 QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1676423638 36532 :Lymia!lymia@ayame.servers.aura.moe JOIN #esolangs Lymia :Lymia Aluysia < 1676424292 977637 :^[!~user@user//x-8473491 JOIN #esolangs ^[ :user < 1676430512 31959 :razetime!~Thunderbi@117.193.1.74 JOIN #esolangs razetime :razetime < 1676433233 304575 :razetime!~Thunderbi@117.193.1.74 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1676434196 287641 :sam!~sam@37.247.55.216 JOIN #esolangs * :sam < 1676435891 776668 :razetime!~Thunderbi@117.193.1.74 JOIN #esolangs razetime :razetime > 1676435919 26405 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Talk:Footsteps14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=106838&oldid=105580 5* 03Ais523 5* (+615) 10/* Start 0 */ reply to [[User:Salpynx]] < 1676436627 977752 :craigo!~craigo@user/craigo JOIN #esolangs craigo :realname < 1676438471 56114 :slavfox!~slavfox@93.158.232.111 QUIT :Quit: ZNC 1.8.2 - https://znc.in < 1676438807 777180 :slavfox!~slavfox@93.158.232.111 JOIN #esolangs slavfox :slavfox < 1676441656 25876 :bgs!~bgs@212-85-160-171.dynamic.telemach.net JOIN #esolangs bgs :bgs < 1676445119 577088 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@user/sgeo QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1676445484 776932 :craigo_!~craigo@180-150-37-12.b49625.bne.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN #esolangs * :realname < 1676445656 963047 :craigo!~craigo@user/craigo QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1676447052 376146 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User < 1676448282 756895 :razetime!~Thunderbi@117.193.1.74 QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1676448993 778119 :razetime!~Thunderbi@117.193.1.74 JOIN #esolangs razetime :razetime > 1676449086 824900 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Orisphera/Completeness14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=106839&oldid=106822 5* 03Orisphera 5* (+39) 10/* What is a programming language? */ < 1676450973 326767 :razetime!~Thunderbi@117.193.1.74 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1676459530 801435 :bgs!~bgs@212-85-160-171.dynamic.telemach.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1676462110 688834 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 JOIN #esolangs Lord_of_Life :Lord < 1676465051 531261 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl QUIT :Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz… < 1676469771 768379 :__monty__!~toonn@user/toonn JOIN #esolangs toonn :Unknown < 1676470455 854735 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User < 1676471243 559017 :Cale!~cale@cpe80d04ade0a03-cm80d04ade0a01.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1676471329 766812 :Cale!~cale@cpe80d04ade0a03-cm80d04ade0a01.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN #esolangs Cale :realname < 1676473392 764856 :Cale!~cale@cpe80d04ade0a03-cm80d04ade0a01.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1676474128 818047 :razetime!~Thunderbi@117.193.1.74 JOIN #esolangs razetime :razetime < 1676474173 945062 :Cale!~cale@2605:8d80:6a2:d49b:a139:9a62:b1d5:76a4 JOIN #esolangs Cale :realname < 1676475640 789730 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :TIL that unproductive endless loops like `for (;;) {}` are UB in C++ :-/ < 1676475815 279280 :FireFly!~firefly@glowbum/gluehwuermchen/firefly PRIVMSG #esolangs :in general? I know that having main diverge is UB in C++ but I thought it might be specific to main somehow < 1676475892 998704 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@user/sgeo JOIN #esolangs Sgeo :realname < 1676475960 90219 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :FireFly: https://en.cppreference.com/w/cpp/language/memory_model includes a "progress guarantee" and LLVM has started to take advantage of it, leading to https://karlsruhe-social.de/system/cache/media_attachments/files/109/856/328/357/566/082/original/abdcd25332d18d5a.png (confirmed with versions 13.x and 14.x) < 1676476064 200520 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :(seen on ##rust-offtopic) < 1676476449 859594 :FireFly!~firefly@glowbum/gluehwuermchen/firefly PRIVMSG #esolangs :*nod* < 1676476782 15990 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :There's a similar C thing (since C11) but it's restricted to loops that have a non-constant controlling expression. < 1676476892 594575 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :C11 6.8.5p6: "An iteration statement whose controlling expression is not a constant expression, that performs no input/output operations, does not access volatile objects, and performs no synchronization or atomic operations in its body, controlling expression, or (in the case of a `for` statement) its /expression-3/, may be assumed by the implementation to terminate." < 1676476914 849376 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Inherited from one of those C <-> C++ harmonization efforts, I believe. < 1676476952 680003 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :https://www.open-std.org/jtc1/sc22/wg14/www/docs/n1349.htm "Non-terminating loops" < 1676477031 615400 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :AIUI the "-- controlling expression is not a constant expression --" part was added in committee deliberations because of the body of existing C code that used `for (;;);` as a "should not be reached, and execution should not continue if reached" construct. > 1676477255 737704 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Vodracseck 5* 10New user account > 1676477525 289963 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=106840&oldid=106825 5* 03Vodracseck 5* (+74) 10/* Introductions */ < 1676477968 321045 :b_jonas!~x@adsl-89-134-28-167.monradsl.monornet.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :int-e: ok, that does look weird. I'd not be surprised if the while(1); loop could end in finite time, since that's a look with no side effects so it can be optimized away to nothing. but I don't see how you'd enter the other function. it can't be UB caused by the missing return statement in main because this is C++ code, not C, and C++ has an implicit return 0 at the end of main. < 1676478245 288751 :b_jonas!~x@adsl-89-134-28-167.monradsl.monornet.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :are you saying that the while(1); loop can be optimized to unreachable somehow instead of just optimized to a nop? < 1676478422 552038 :FireFly!~firefly@glowbum/gluehwuermchen/firefly PRIVMSG #esolangs :how would the loop ned in finite time? < 1676478424 594051 :FireFly!~firefly@glowbum/gluehwuermchen/firefly PRIVMSG #esolangs :end* < 1676478513 28 :b_jonas!~x@adsl-89-134-28-167.monradsl.monornet.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :FireFly: it can't really, but since it never causes side effects and never changes any value that can be observed from the outside, I assume the compiler can optimize it as if it ended in finite time and did nothign < 1676478520 47226 :b_jonas!~x@adsl-89-134-28-167.monradsl.monornet.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :I don't think it can optimize it to UB < 1676478671 110179 :b_jonas!~x@adsl-89-134-28-167.monradsl.monornet.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :but no, I can't cite the standard for this < 1676478678 296994 :b_jonas!~x@adsl-89-134-28-167.monradsl.monornet.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :it's just how I think it might work < 1676478710 796729 :b_jonas!~x@adsl-89-134-28-167.monradsl.monornet.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :but maybe that's not right < 1676478720 110263 :Hooloovoo!~Hooloovoo@hax0rbana.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1676478724 313872 :b_jonas!~x@adsl-89-134-28-167.monradsl.monornet.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :yeah, it shouldn't be optimized to a nop < 1676478763 566014 :Hooloovoo!~Hooloovoo@hax0rbana.org JOIN #esolangs hooloovoo :ZNC - https://znc.in < 1676478783 756940 :FireFly!~firefly@glowbum/gluehwuermchen/firefly PRIVMSG #esolangs :I've heard the thing about divergence being explicitly UB, and I think a compiler replacing an infinite loop without side-effect with a nop def woludn't be fine (well uh, I guess it would be as a consequence when it's UB, but like, just indirectly in that it could do anything) < 1676478793 39160 :FireFly!~firefly@glowbum/gluehwuermchen/firefly PRIVMSG #esolangs :but I don't really speak C++ much < 1676478806 179698 :b_jonas!~x@adsl-89-134-28-167.monradsl.monornet.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :imagine a loop that searches for a counterexample to the Goldbach conjecture (or a contradiction in ZF or whatever), and then the statement after the loop just prints "found" without printing any more specific info about the loop. presumably you don't want that loop to be optimized away to nop, so this infinite loop shouldn't be either < 1676478869 751467 :b_jonas!~x@adsl-89-134-28-167.monradsl.monornet.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :(of course that loop might be hard to write in a way that the compiler can prove it has no side-effect, since a naive implementation will have malloc call sbrk or mmap, but that's just a technical problem, the compiler can know enough about malloc to know that those aren't real side effects) < 1676478952 788524 :b_jonas!~x@adsl-89-134-28-167.monradsl.monornet.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :(I think both C++ and rust folks are working on that you can eventually heap-allocate from compile-time code) < 1676479001 913323 :b_jonas!~x@adsl-89-134-28-167.monradsl.monornet.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :(and besides, you can just avoid the malloc by searching for a counterexample that fits a gigabyte of pre-allocated memory, presumably the compiler won't be smart enough to be able to prove that that doesn't terminate) < 1676480653 97 :j-bot!~jbot@hagall.firefly.nu JOIN #esolangs * :jevalbot < 1676481904 958070 :razetime!~Thunderbi@117.193.1.74 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1676481955 59536 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1676481981 45727 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 JOIN #esolangs Lord_of_Life :Lord < 1676484173 836923 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl QUIT :Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz… < 1676485479 26360 :bgs!~bgs@212-85-160-171.dynamic.telemach.net JOIN #esolangs bgs :bgs < 1676487007 34714 :FreeFull!~freefull@46.205.213.124.nat.ftth.dynamic.t-mobile.pl JOIN #esolangs FreeFull :FreeFull < 1676487634 364488 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User < 1676489299 993490 :Cale!~cale@2605:8d80:6a2:d49b:a139:9a62:b1d5:76a4 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1676490344 767087 :Cale!~cale@cpe80d04ade0a03-cm80d04ade0a01.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN #esolangs Cale :realname < 1676490742 344729 :sam!~sam@37.247.55.216 QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1676491843 953856 :lagash_!lagash@lagash.shelltalk.net NICK :lagash < 1676492139 420378 :lagash!lagash@lagash.shelltalk.net QUIT :Quit: ZNC - https://znc.in < 1676492418 16402 :lagash_!~lagash@lagash.shelltalk.net JOIN #esolangs * :ZNC - https://znc.in < 1676495038 161510 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer > 1676498547 176814 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Abc!?14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=106841&oldid=100412 5* 031hals 5* (+2371) 10Clarify variables and operation types > 1676498711 586744 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Abc!?14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=106842&oldid=106841 5* 031hals 5* (+85) 10/* Move statement */ < 1676498826 766611 :craigo_!~craigo@180-150-37-12.b49625.bne.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds > 1676498988 920010 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Abc!?14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=106843&oldid=106842 5* 031hals 5* (+316) 10re-organize the operators section > 1676499038 237368 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Abc!?14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=106844&oldid=106843 5* 031hals 5* (-293) 10remove the redundant special features section < 1676500040 520775 :chiselfuse!~chiselfus@user/chiselfuse QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1676500103 528952 :chiselfuse!~chiselfus@user/chiselfuse JOIN #esolangs chiselfuse :chiselfuse > 1676500315 389275 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Abc!?14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=106845&oldid=106844 5* 031hals 5* (+598) 10Add untested Fibonacci example > 1676500460 776578 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Abc!?14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=106846&oldid=106845 5* 031hals 5* (+210) 10 > 1676500709 912460 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Abc!?14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=106847&oldid=106846 5* 031hals 5* (+24) 10/* Variables */ < 1676502243 974288 :__monty__!~toonn@user/toonn QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1676502770 290649 :bgs!~bgs@212-85-160-171.dynamic.telemach.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1676503270 437514 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :b_jonas: the crazy thing is that it discards the code *after* the loop as unreachable, but also discards the loop.