> 1700720146 177432 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Marble14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=119799&oldid=119798 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+84) 10Categories
< 1700723507 501593 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User
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< 1700730230 879878 :cpressey!~cpressey@host-89-240-119-39.as13285.net JOIN #esolangs cpressey :[https://web.libera.chat] cpressey
< 1700731611 796984 :Koen!~Koen@2a01:e34:ec7c:30:2184:eac0:93c5:787 JOIN #esolangs * :Koen
> 1700732673 248748 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Talk:Cutw14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=119800&oldid=119761 5* 03None1 5* (+22) 10
> 1700732733 382135 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Joulier429 5*  10New user account
> 1700732838 254543 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Template talk:Py14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=119801&oldid=119795 5* 03None1 5* (+133) 10/* ...this is already a thing though? */
< 1700733043 873630 :cpressey!~cpressey@host-89-240-119-39.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esolangs :So I've been thinking.  The adequacy of the LCF approach really depends on your "threat model".  If you just want to protect against mistakes, it's enough (possibly even more than you need), but if you want to defend against someone *falsifying* a proof, though, it needs to be supplemented (by checking a produced certificate).
< 1700733130 686662 :cpressey!~cpressey@host-89-240-119-39.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esolangs :Because of ROTT, right?  Even if your proof language makes 100% guarantees about integrity of your data structures, who knows what the compiler that compiled the implementation of your proof language might've snuck in there.
< 1700733191 86480 :cpressey!~cpressey@host-89-240-119-39.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esolangs :Anyway, it's the beauty of the idea "Abstract Data Type = Algebra = Proof System" that appeals to me, not really these practical matters.
< 1700733334 478419 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User
< 1700733991 595910 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1700734033 469803 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 JOIN #esolangs Lord_of_Life :Lord
< 1700734388 309848 :cpressey!~cpressey@host-89-240-119-39.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esolangs :"possibly even more than you need" -> Programmers get by with a lot less on a daily basis.  "Voluntary encapsulation" in popular languages.  Otoh, a lot of software in production has data integrity holes in it.  Sometimes massive ones.  So that's probably not a good basis for comparison.
> 1700737370 576368 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[074RL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=119802&oldid=96987 5* 03Kaveh Yousefi 5* (+183) 10Added a hyperlink to my implementation of the 4RL programming language on GitHub and added the category tag Implemented.
> 1700737664 779825 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[074RL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=119803&oldid=119802 5* 03Kaveh Yousefi 5* (+517) 10Supplemented three further example programs, namely (1) a repeating cat program, (2) a truth-machine, and (3) a program termination demonstrator.
< 1700737686 579357 :b_jonas!~x@89.134.28.161 PRIVMSG #esolangs :sure, but automatically producing a certificate and checking it elsewhere is the easy part. the hard part is making the language convenient enough to express long proofs easily, and also making sure that humans can check all your aximos and the statement of theorems easily (because a proof isn't worth much if you aren't sure what it proves)
< 1700738335 760745 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@37.128.204.107 JOIN #esolangs arseniiv :the chaotic arseniiv
< 1700738606 794407 :cpressey!~cpressey@host-89-240-119-39.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esolangs :A language that makes something convenient?? Perish the thought, in this channel!
< 1700739585 783954 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@user/sgeo QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1700741716 479991 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esolangs :😉
< 1700741765 162915 :__monty__!~toonn@user/toonn JOIN #esolangs toonn :Unknown
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< 1700747067 892595 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@37.128.204.107 PRIVMSG #esolangs :a language with the sole (or almost sole) numeric operation which is arithmetic-geometric mean
< 1700747083 429616 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@37.128.204.107 PRIVMSG #esolangs :probably unusable
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< 1700750197 855963 :b_jonas!~x@89.134.28.161 PRIVMSG #esolangs :arseniiv: we have languages with a restricted set of arithmetic operations: Nellephant which uses attract and repel, which I find very annoying and unnecessary because it doesn't seem to really help what that language is trying to do over using more sane arithmetic operations; and more interestingly Analogia
< 1700750243 58851 :b_jonas!~x@89.134.28.161 PRIVMSG #esolangs :also possibly Conedy, depending on how you interpret "numeric operations"
< 1700750522 530978 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@37.128.204.107 PRIVMSG #esolangs :b_jonas: oh I read only today that “analogia” is Ancient Greek for hm I forgot what in arithmetic but something basic
< 1700751232 515507 :b_jonas!~x@89.134.28.161 PRIVMSG #esolangs :man, we should've just left the babylonians and arabs develop mathematics and science and astronomy. the ancient greeks like Euclid and especially Aristoteles just made everything worse. their only upside was Archimedes.
< 1700751311 904671 :b_jonas!~x@89.134.28.161 PRIVMSG #esolangs :plus the Mayans could help if we can contact them earlier I guess
< 1700752039 410491 :Koen!~Koen@2a01:e34:ec7c:30:c542:51a4:b163:1ab9 JOIN #esolangs * :Koen
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> 1700754454 937548 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Funky14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=119804&oldid=119597 5* 03DaMutasimos 5* (+17) 10
> 1700754559 262387 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Funky14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=119805&oldid=119804 5* 03DaMutasimos 5* (+0) 10/* Creating custom functions */
> 1700754655 308420 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Funky14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=119806&oldid=119805 5* 03DaMutasimos 5* (+11) 10/* Creating custom functions */
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> 1700754937 243777 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Talk:A Language Programmed While Listening to Godspeed You! Black Emperor14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=119807 5* 03DaMutasimos 5* (+34) 10Created page with "otherwise known as ALPWLTGYBE?!?!?"
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> 1700760664 521442 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Fdai 5*  10New user account
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< 1700769377 729712 :zzo38_!~zzo38@host-24-207-52-143.public.eastlink.ca NICK :zzo38
< 1700770697 789603 :cpressey!~cpressey@host-89-240-119-39.as13285.net JOIN #esolangs cpressey :[https://web.libera.chat] cpressey
> 1700772606 538149 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Wiwa14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=119808 5* 030ptr 5* (+7334) 10Created page with "'''Wiwa''' is a stack-based, array-oriented esolang inspired by [Uiua https://uiua.org] and [BQN https://mlochbaum.github.io/BQN].  '''Wiwa''' operates on a stack of arrays. Each array can only contain other arrays, meaning there are no values in Wiwa.  You can find the inter
> 1700772618 730396 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Wiwa14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=119809&oldid=119808 5* 030ptr 5* (+0) 10fix the link
> 1700772641 441440 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Wiwa14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=119810&oldid=119809 5* 030ptr 5* (+0) 10fix links
> 1700772927 472769 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Wiwa14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=119811&oldid=119810 5* 030ptr 5* (-8) 10
< 1700773556 372897 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@37.128.204.107 PRIVMSG #esolangs :<b_jonas> their only upside was Archimedes. => he was
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> 1700775930 673652 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Turing Tumble14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=119812&oldid=52228 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+9) 10Stub
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> 1700777760 104722 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Alphuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=119813&oldid=119760 5* 03Kaveh Yousefi 5* (+121) 10Added a repeating cat program and subsumed the twissel of extant examples into a common section.
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> 1700778019 760259 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Alphuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=119814&oldid=119813 5* 03Kaveh Yousefi 5* (+3803) 10Added an interpreter implementation in Common Lisp.
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> 1700778217 878893 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Alphuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=119815&oldid=119814 5* 03Kaveh Yousefi 5* (+233) 10Improved the command table's formatting and supplemented the page category tag Implemented.
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