< 1732321310 994609 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 JOIN #esolangs Lord_of_Life :Lord < 1732321325 209224 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1732321390 31756 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1732325432 352802 :amby!~ambylastn@ward-15-b2-v4wan-167229-cust809.vm18.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection > 1732325481 641993 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:ColorfulGalaxy's CA discoveries/One per generation14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146173&oldid=146057 5* 03ColorfulGalaxy's CA discoveries 5* (+462) 10I'm posting this one since they didn't ban my hacked account) (---- > 1732325762 491916 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:ZCX islptng14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146174&oldid=146072 5* 03ColorfulGalaxy's CA discoveries 5* (+214) 10 < 1732326661 281735 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :the funny thing, it had me thinking "why don't functions just return the exception and propagate it, it would be so much simpler" and then Rust ended up doing exactly that < 1732328206 248530 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ais523: A steelman of your position about syntax just popped into my mind. A context-free grammar definitionally can't add any nuance to something like a hardcoded operator, so the assigned semantics must encapsulate the entire concept associated with that operator. (And naturally there should be a category for each assignment, slicing the category of models for the whole syntax.) < 1732328255 122256 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :if the grammar is ambiguous it might cause there to be some contexts where the operator can't be used, because there's no unambiguous way to express it < 1732328257 883017 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :So when e.g. Python says `% 2`, that's one hard-coded concept and also a number. In e.g. Jelly, by contrast, `B` is also one hard-coded concept, but it's a more specific one because it doesn't range over a syntactic number. < 1732328311 484983 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :but yes – golfing languages tend to have a lot of simple combinations like that hardcoded < 1732328319 189099 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :. o O ( it's almost as if there is a separation between syntax and semantics ) < 1732328329 746058 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Oh, of course, I'm assuming that all valid parses are meaningful. The highlight was that `B` refines `%` and the categories of models will reflect that. < 1732328343 601659 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :(that was a totally context-free comment) < 1732328350 974378 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :although, of course, Jelly B and % are both more powerful than the Python equivalents %2 and % < 1732328371 94633 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :because they're overloaded to work on arrays as well as scalars < 1732328428 332466 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :then you get into weirdnesses like × which, if used in a certain way, generates values of a type that doesn't exist in the language as a consequence of an interpreter bug (the interpreter is written in Python, which is sufficiently dynamically typed that this doesn't break anything) < 1732328455 367636 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :There is a model of Python syntax which operates on arrays rather than scalars, I think. We wouldn't ever use it due to the hilarious memory requirements. < 1732328638 429795 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I suppose I'm thinking too much about native type theory here. There isn't really an on-wiki sense of this facet of languages. < 1732328658 761173 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :so I was designing a golfing language that, if it parsed subexpressions that couldn't possibly be useful (were no-ops or were duplicated by some other command), did something entirely unrelated < 1732328678 981749 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :e.g. multiplying a number by 1 checked whether or not it was prime < 1732328693 286410 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :that seems somewhat related to what we're discussing > 1732330151 558804 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:ZCX islptng14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146175&oldid=146174 5* 03Translated ORK 5* (+3007) 10 > 1732330168 919622 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:ZCX islptng14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146176&oldid=146175 5* 03Translated ORK 5* (+1) 10/* Life viewer bug */ > 1732330294 605704 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:ZCX islptng14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146177&oldid=146176 5* 03Translated ORK 5* (+175) 10/* Pronunciation */ > 1732330389 518588 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated ORK/Mihai Again2014]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146178&oldid=145988 5* 03Translated ORK 5* (+130) 10 > 1732330408 486918 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated ORK/PSTF Again-Duoviginte14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146179&oldid=146059 5* 03Translated ORK 5* (+130) 10 > 1732330888 275533 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Ais52314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146180&oldid=146074 5* 03Translated ORK 5* (+155) 10/* I got hacked again */ < 1732331047 894529 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ais523: Yeah, for sure. Native type theory only allows models which validate the various rewriting rules, which prevents that sort of trickery. You could add it back in with a context-sensitive parser. > 1732331283 904044 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Ais52314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146181&oldid=146180 5* 03Ais523 5* (+182) 10/* I got hacked again */ are you two accounts the same user? < 1732331352 442036 :mtm!~textual@47.202.75.129 JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User < 1732331358 181554 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :it has left me wondering whether it's a syntactic or semantic rule (and trying to implement it I went back and forth on where to implement it) < 1732331383 661340 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :it seems to be independent of the syntax in the sense that you could give the language an entirely different syntax and the replacements would still make sense < 1732331681 582828 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Yeah. I think we need a fancier defnition of "language" in order to clarify the situation. < 1732331732 445897 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Like, a language L has programs p1, p2, etc. in L. Great! But we also need refinement: maybe p1 can be refined to p2, and in that case, we should expect maps out of L to preserve refinement. < 1732331738 75833 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :but yes, it's also independent of the semantics in the sense that it can do things like change the type an expression would apparently have < 1732331754 511460 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :it feels like it might be an extra layer in between? < 1732331762 63826 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :like, some sort of macro < 1732331815 951311 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :actually, C macros are a good comparison – they run after the parse in some senses and before in others (and this is implemented by using two parsers, one for macros, one for the result post-macro-expansion) < 1732331828 767187 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :err, I should say "specified" not "implemented" > 1732333014 103116 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Trump -bot- 5* 10New user account > 1732333040 939641 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146182&oldid=145986 5* 03Trump -bot- 5* (+120) 10 < 1732333046 264398 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :what an auspicious user name :-/ < 1732333094 349215 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 JOIN #esolangs * :[https://web.libera.chat] wWwwW < 1732333127 497565 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :that matches the username pattern of a banned user < 1732333185 872790 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :not sure whether to just immediately ban as they seem to have been here before and are probably the same person, or wait for them to be disruptive first < 1732333216 321621 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :it's been long enough that maybe they have grown up? although I'm not hopeful > 1732333360 565686 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Wenyan14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146183&oldid=141216 5* 03Trump -bot- 5* (+50) 10 > 1732333389 968821 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Wenyan14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146184&oldid=146183 5* 03Ais523 5* (-50) 10Reverted edit by [[Special:Contributions/Trump -bot-|Trump -bot-]] ([[User talk:Trump -bot-|talk]]) to last revision by [[User:None1|None1]] > 1732333429 34344 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Special:Log/block14]]4 block10 02 5* 03Ais523 5* 10blocked [[02User:Trump -bot-10]] with an expiration time of 1 week (account creation disabled): apparent return of a previous banned user, continuing to be disruptive < 1732333444 184813 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :well that didn't take long < 1732333452 479200 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :yep < 1732333471 629957 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :(i was very confused cuz IRC has a filter aswell) < 1732333474 614645 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :(lol) < 1732333647 875680 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :last time was in 2021? wow < 1732333661 114608 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I thought it was further back than that < 1732333661 878180 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :damn > 1732333662 646174 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07I/D machine14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146185&oldid=118932 5* 03Fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff 5* (+28) 10 < 1732333681 534667 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :with the "grown up" based off the username its a bot but idk > 1732333687 53351 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:Sandbox14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146186&oldid=144555 5* 03Xyzzy 5* (+149) 10 < 1732333748 690008 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :it's a person with "bot" in most of their usernames < 1732333761 757369 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :why? < 1732333764 278637 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :just why < 1732333796 423197 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I think it's meant to be performance art, but it's both disruptive and somewhat offensive, and doesn't actually help towards the wiki's main purpose at all < 1732333812 714280 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :sometimes esolangs are art, but there's a difference between being a wiki *about* art and a wiki *that is* art < 1732333843 686570 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :the latter doesn't work very well because people differ so much in their opinions about what is good and what is bad to include > 1732333994 127187 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:Sandbox14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146187&oldid=146186 5* 03Xyzzy 5* (+73) 10 < 1732334111 751277 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :yea < 1732334122 656157 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :oh god i got such a bad idea < 1732334543 968777 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ais523: Macros are definitely an instance of what I'm getting at, yes. I wish that this were already an accepted concept with standard terminology; I don't want to ask people to climb up Mt. Category every time. < 1732334796 900161 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :But, like, fundamentally I'm talking about a natural transformation, and those are best thought of as sitting *outside* the parser. It's a transformation on input programs s.t. the resulting parses and evaluations will not be changed. < 1732335071 402178 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :korvo: ah no, I was trying to classify the thing I was talking about < 1732335089 100278 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :there are various nice properties that programming languages can have, and then various ways in which languages can choose not to have them < 1732335198 139146 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ais523: Oh, that's desirable? It seems like the sort of thing that can be fixed by adding quotation marks so that parameters can be uniformly quoted at the syntactic level. Otherwise you end up with dead spots in the grammar. < 1732335235 192128 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :fizzie: this might be relevant to esolangs the bot: https://libera.chat/news/llm-etiquette < 1732335269 322532 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :korvo: well, in a golfing language you want as far as possible to avoid equivalent programs existing, or at least reduce the number of duplicates that exist < 1732335314 832217 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :and there are various tricks to do that – of course you can't go all the way in terms of preventing duplicates whilst staying computable, but the further you can go in that direction the better the language will be, and it isn't uncomputable to go some of the way < 1732335435 562747 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ais523: Ah, I see. I'd immediately weaken that to something more tractable: all the equivalents are *long*. < 1732335475 891595 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :In particular, if we have a way to lengthen a program without changing its behavior, then that can be run in reverse to give us a refinement rule which shortens programs; we can turn algebra into optimizations. < 1732335553 985310 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :well, you can have two programs that are equal length but equivalent, say, arithmetically < 1732335563 715476 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :+ and Ḥ do the same thing as single-byte programs in Jelly < 1732335569 962017 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :the former adds a number to itself, the latter multiplies it by 2 < 1732335659 106142 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Sometimes multiple monoids have the same unit. I don't think that there's an easy way to work around that without adding syntax to explicitly designate units, which would double the size of those programs. < 1732335754 840411 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I think the problem is that you are trying to see programming languages as mathematically elegant objects that can be modeled with denotational semantics, whereas in practice there are often special cases which are hard to handle except as special cases < 1732335824 599024 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :and sometimes that's desirable for, e.g., efficiency reasons – some Perl builtins act differently based on whether their result is interpreted as a number or a string, and this was generalised to allow any scalar value in the entire language to look different as a number or a string, which is one of the reasons why Perl uses so much more memory than you might expect < 1732335826 454371 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Well, as a language designer, yes; languages should have lots of symmetry because every irregularity requires explicit memorization. I don't want to inflict complexity on folks. < 1732335829 468407 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Yeah, there was a wallopsy message about it. < 1732335837 696028 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :As an initial impression leaning towards "no urgent action needed", since there's no training going on (it's entirely self-hosted); it would be nice to make it more clear that there's an LLM in it, but OTOH it's not really useful for anything, so it feels a little too spammy to "advertise" the bot too much either. < 1732335864 193733 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I guess you could just add [LLM reply] or the like at the start of the replies < 1732335882 864333 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :A golfing language asks its users to be compressors. I'm not saying that that's forbidden, but it's not something I'd do. < 1732335943 320631 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I only want to see a language as having an identity transformation on programs, along with a partial order of refinement on programs, because that automatically gives us the bare-minimum machinery for talking about preserving structure. Without it, interpreters and compilers don't make sense as concepts. < 1732335977 182846 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I think a golfing language is more of a toolset that users can compress with, and most good golfing languages do that by providing short ways to express commonly useful concepts – programs in golfing languages don't have to be golfed < 1732335980 560444 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :esolangs: what's this? < 1732335981 669425 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Yes, that's probably a reasonable interpretation of "made aware -- as soon as possible", even if it still allows an unknowing person's first message to the bot to be inadvertently seen by an LLM. > 1732335988 403480 PRIVMSG #esolangs :int-e: Please provide the question! I need to see the question to answer it about esoteric programming languages. 😊 Once you give me the question, I'll do my best to provide a concise and informative answer. < 1732336004 628874 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :esolangs: Are you a bot? Also are you an LLM? > 1732336012 563841 PRIVMSG #esolangs :korvo: I am not a bot in the traditional sense. I am a large language model, trained on a massive dataset of text and code. This allows me to understand and generate human-like text, including responses about esoteric programming languages. < 1732336023 865874 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :I guess that worked out okay. < 1732336025 476811 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :esolangs: Are you aware? < 1732336047 232187 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :recently I've taken to using Jelly to write interpreters for my esolangs, if they're simple enough, because it generally allows interpreters for simple languages to be constructed very quickly < 1732336051 216224 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :Anyway. It mostly has novelty value. < 1732336073 928517 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :Ah did I hit a rate limit? < 1732336081 352011 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :but they aren't explicitly golfed < 1732336087 572732 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :No, judging from the delay that particular question just somehow produced a nonzero amount of wiki page hits. < 1732336104 759573 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :It takes like 2-3 minutes to generate a response when there's a wiki page to feed into it. < 1732336137 959667 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ais523: That's totally fair. I hope I'm not coming across as snooty. I'm just thinking that e.g. finding uses for spare bit patterns is something an arithmetic coder should be doing, and a human shouldn't have to do it outside of learning or fun. < 1732336152 961116 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Since it puts in (IIRC) some 8k tokens worth of wikistuff, plus it may do that a couple of times to ask it to summarize the page first. < 1732336195 302080 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :I'm also expecting a very bad answer, since that's what usually happens when it's given an article to read. > 1732336199 680902 PRIVMSG #esolangs :int-e: Yes, I am aware of Tonoco. It's an esoteric programming language designed by David.werecat, known for its network-based structure and simple operations. It uses boxes connected in a one-way fashion, with 32-bit signed integers as data and a limited set of instructions for control flow. I have access to its documentation and examples, including... > 1732336199 681213 PRIVMSG #esolangs :programs like "Cat" and "Greeter." > 1732336206 790783 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Xyzzy14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146188&oldid=144965 5* 03Xyzzy 5* (+45) 10 < 1732336209 953693 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Ah, there we go. < 1732336249 353090 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :korvo: so the issue here is one of context – an arithmetic coder needs to see a lot of data to be able to usefully compress something without prior knowledge, whereas golfing language programs are often just a few bytes long < 1732336260 201647 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :so we can say, e.g., multiplying a number by 1 isn't useful < 1732336262 219223 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :"The next method of control flow is turning on/off execution with depth ***aware***ness." < 1732336270 759770 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :funny < 1732336271 609428 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :RAG is hit-or-miss because culture is complex. A related question might be "Are you experienced?" which seems like nonsense but is a reference to an old USA meme and should get a reply mentioning Jimi Hendrix. < 1732336305 641735 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :but we need to explicitly teach our compressor all those exceptions, so that it knows it doesn't have to compress programs that use them < 1732336323 681875 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :there is a big advantage to doing the compression manually, though – it makes programs much easier to write by hand < 1732336338 308205 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :. o O ( How much fish would a deadfish fish if a deadfish could fish fish? ) < 1732336425 267248 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ais523: Maybe we should consider a syntax based on opetopes, which are shapes that describe operations; they still have discrete cardinality, but can have high-dimensional inputs and outputs. This would allow us to remove the ability to apply certain operations in degenerate applicative forms. < 1732336452 240823 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Yeah. I've got a logfile of what exactly went on; looks like the first prompt (gives the question and asks for a single search keyword) produced the search term "awareness", and the Tonoco page is the only hit if you search the wiki for that. It then fed the entire page into the summarizer, which produced https://0x0.st/X5A7.txt and finally the the third loop around produced that response. < 1732336466 260865 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :That's not exactly matching the rustic by-hand ideal that you've got, though. More like constant fighting with a complex visual editor. < 1732336555 321384 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I find the easiest way to write golfing language programs is in a sort of pipelined style as a composition of smaller functions, which effectively ends up like a concatenative languages except that it tends to (tacitly) name things based on properties that don't survive concatenation < 1732336598 207020 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :but when the functions you're composing have multiple arguments, there are two ways to compose them, by either hardcoding the left or the right argument, and it has been proven in golfing languages to have concise ways to write both probabilities < 1732336609 334592 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :err, both possibilities < 1732336638 477097 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :*but*, this flexibility is useless when your function is commutative, so it seems like it is sensible to have a syntactic difference between commutative and non-commutative functions < 1732336683 410847 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Yeah, I've run into this when structuring formal proofs. The problem is that the underlying proof is technically 3D (or higher!) and this always generates a choice of embedding into 2D syntax. < 1732336748 69027 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Sorry for only bringing up geometric obstacles. I don't know if geometry of syntax is actually relevant or an alluring dead end. < 1732336779 134643 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I think it's group theory rather than geometry, which is similar < 1732336805 804862 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :what you're trying to do is discover symmetries, so that you can encode only half the symmetry < 1732336820 159771 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :x+y versus y+x is obvious; x+x versus x×2 is less obvious, but still a sort of symmetry < 1732336920 700859 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Yep. And Cayley's theorem seems like a serious general obstacle, then. Like, pick one of these underlying groups, and then Cayley's theorem immediately gives us a physical object with those same symmetries. < 1732337012 939378 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :...Meatballs. My train of thought crashed. Something about how the object could be sliced so that it only expresses the generator for the group, but then that creates a problem when embedding the slice? < 1732337065 862028 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I think these might not compose nicely enough to make group theory usable – group-theoretic symmetries normally apply to the all elements of the group, whereas these don't really > 1732337075 368216 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Ais52314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146189&oldid=146181 5* 03ColorfulGalaxy's CA discoveries 5* (+252) 10/* I got hacked again */ < 1732337088 359526 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :you'd have to say that they leave cases where the symmetry doesn't apply unchanged, but I'm not sure that's always unambiguous < 1732337101 482146 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :especially taking into account expressions like x × 2 × x < 1732337125 902531 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Wouldn't it be the case for commutativity, at least? < 1732337167 180755 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :commutativity seems not to fit neatly because we're applying it to subexpression, not the program as a whole < 1732337186 971386 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :(a + b) ÷ (c + d) can swap the a and b, or the c and d, how many symmetries is that? < 1732337233 772511 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :programs can be arbitrarily large, so we can have a program that exhibits arbitrarily many symmetries, but it's unclear what that says about the set of programs as a whole < 1732337470 707047 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I think that the reasoning still applies. There's four symmetries coming from the two swaps. We'd need a way to break the symmetry somehow. < 1732337509 248828 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :What it says about the set of programs should be structured; a subexpression's symmetries should be a subgroup of whatever it's embedded in. < 1732337578 232423 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :what's bothering me is that group-theoretic symmetries apply to the whole group – whereas here, different programs have different numbers of symmetries < 1732337660 505100 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :so we would need to use a generalisation of a group, which I suspect might just be a category but I am not good at doing category theory at 5am (or, really, even when I'm fully awake) < 1732337686 383017 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Oh yeah, other side of the pond, quite understandable. < 1732337732 394986 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I'd imagine the programs as points in a space (top. space, category, locale, whatever) and the groups as stalks of a *sheaf of groups* on that space. < 1732337833 935620 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :So like for programs p1 and p2 and sheaf S, if p1 textually includes p2 then S(p2) is a subgroup of S(p1). And a choice of symmetry is an assignment for that sheaf. < 1732337870 691549 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Any cases where this rule doesn't work would be obstacles to a global assignment for the sheaf. Not a problem, but something sheaf theory is designed to detect. > 1732337883 435370 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Ais52314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146190&oldid=146189 5* 03Ais523 5* (+791) 10/* I got hacked again */ doing a short ban on a hacked account makes no sense if the account is hacked it generally should be blocked indefinitely, especially as often people claiming to be hacked are trying to cover up mistakes in attempts to abuse multiple accounts < 1732337921 901897 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :oh wow, although I don't have proof, I think it's pretty likely that those two users are a) the same person as each other and b) the same person as trump bot < 1732338008 552267 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :trump bot randomly turning up at that moment, when they hadn't edited for a few years now, and being suspected as the culprit is just too much of a coincidence < 1732338018 526979 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :So "I've been hacked" translates as "I've mixed up my sock puppets"? That would make sense. < 1732338032 359915 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :right < 1732338103 420230 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :and they're trying to hide the evidence – the typical reaction to be hacked is not generally to ask for the usernames on the hacker's edits to be hidden < 1732338116 378694 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I've seen a couple of cases of actual account hacks (normally by correctly guessing the password) at Wikipedia, it looks very different < 1732338144 402615 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :or, well, by "guessing" I mean with help from password leaks at other sites < 1732338165 977752 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :Wikipedia at least has some impact... Who'd hack an esowiki account anyway. < 1732338197 277287 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :My thought reading that section on your talk page earlier was "wtf is this role play?" < 1732338227 838154 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :(that included the allusion to Trump) < 1732338231 239816 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I feel like esowiki's userbase is probably more likely to want to hack each other's accounts than wikipedia's? although the people who would want to do that generally wouldn't have the skill to < 1732338334 872331 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I remember an incident over a decade ago, where a group of channel regulars had a common interest in nomic, and had set up a nomic, and someone was vandalising the gamestate tracker < 1732338367 672015 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :and got caught via someone creating a fake link that resembled a UI element, that went to a server they controlled, and finding the IP address from the server logs < 1732338438 692444 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :so it's totally the sort of thing esolang enthusiasts would do, even for no good reason (arguably, doing things for no good reason is a major part of esolanging) > 1732338471 455001 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Ais52314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146191&oldid=146190 5* 03Translated ORK 5* (+238) 10/* I got hacked again */ > 1732338499 820622 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Ais52314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146192&oldid=146191 5* 03Translated ORK 5* (+0) 10/* I got hacked again */ < 1732338567 182215 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :Semirelated t that story, I discovered recently that XSS-as-a-service is a thing. (Got an email with a weird embedded link.) > 1732338607 311976 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:ColorfulGalaxy's CA discoveries14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146193&oldid=145985 5* 03Translated ORK 5* (+99) 10/* Are you Trump's robot? */ new section < 1732338707 291082 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :How many people are in this group? https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?title=Cellular_automaton&diff=145682&oldid=133470 > 1732338723 286062 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:ZCX islptng14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146194&oldid=146177 5* 03Translated ORK 5* (+232) 10/* Pronunciation */ < 1732338767 404526 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I suspect iddi01 isn't part of the group and just got confused by it > 1732338799 553751 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Cellular automaton14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146195&oldid=145682 5* 03Ais523 5* (-131) 10Undo revision [[Special:Diff/145682|145682]] by [[Special:Contributions/Iddi01|Iddi01]] ([[User talk:Iddi01|talk]]) cross-namespace link, and user talk pages can't be "official" in that sense < 1732338843 555201 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :korvo: good catch < 1732338939 215072 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :Iddi01 has contributed to https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:ColorfulGalaxy%27s_CA_discoveries&action=history but I don't know what to make of that. < 1732339019 203340 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I think some number of people probably got banned from LifeWiki and moved over here? < 1732339063 242351 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Translated ORK is clearly an alt of someone, and one possibility is much more likely than the others > 1732339540 827792 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Cellular automaton14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146196&oldid=146195 5* 03Corbin 5* (+61) 10/* History */ Completely rework history paragraph. Poor Alvy Ray keeps getting cut out of history! > 1732340500 265897 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Cellular automaton14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146197&oldid=146196 5* 03Corbin 5* (-407) 10Big cleanup: Format examples, red- and bluelink, explicitly mention ZISC, remove duplicated bit from prehistory page. Look more like other computational-model pages. > 1732343191 246553 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Special:Log/upload14]]4 overwrite10 02 5* 03RainbowDash 5* 10uploaded a new version of "[[02File:Windmill logo.png10]]" < 1732343204 521548 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :korvo: I don't think you can allow arbitrary quiescent patterns at the background, you could encode an oracle in them to, e.g., make Life uncomputable < 1732343210 201336 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :* as the background < 1732343230 481690 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :in fact, I'm starting to think that even periodic patterns may be cheating to some extent (it's the difference between cyclic tag and sequential tag) < 1732343253 36114 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :anyway, bedtime < 1732343255 562053 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 QUIT :Quit: quit < 1732343322 151345 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I'll have to sleep on that. I would like a better intro for that page, for sure. > 1732343966 409591 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated 14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=146199 5* 03PrySigneToFry 5* (+1719) 10Created page with "Translated is designed by PSTF. It is [[]] but horribly translated. == Steps == 1. First, take the example program. 
        ..."
> 1732343999 609530 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Joke language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146200&oldid=145990 5* 03PrySigneToFry 5* (+81) 10/* Horribly translated variants */
< 1732344712 433701 :X-Scale!~X-Scale@89.214.117.205 JOIN #esolangs X-Scale :[https://web.libera.chat] X-Scale
> 1732346004 165104 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:ColorfulGalaxy's CA discoveries14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146201&oldid=146193 5* 03ColorfulGalaxy's CA discoveries 5* (+223) 10/* Are you Trump's robot? */ No.) (----
> 1732346082 713296 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03ColorfulGalaxy's CA Discoveries 5*  10New user account
> 1732346177 153603 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146202&oldid=146182 5* 03ColorfulGalaxy's CA Discoveries 5* (+352) 10
> 1732346767 884327 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07File talk:Windmill logo.png14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=146203 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+186) 10Created page with "the logo goin hard!~~~"
> 1732346882 81547 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07VERPNL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146204&oldid=144548 5* 03Ractangle 5* (-15) 10/* Credits */
> 1732346983 157734 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Snakel14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146205&oldid=145895 5* 03Ractangle 5* (-25) 10
> 1732347777 411832 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Br greater than14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146206&oldid=146168 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+11) 10/* Commands */
> 1732347837 240918 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Br greater than14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146207&oldid=146206 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+4) 10/* Commands */
> 1732347930 469871 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Br greater than14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146208&oldid=146207 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+54) 10/* Truth Machine */
> 1732347942 643154 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Br greater than14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146209&oldid=146208 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+4) 10/* Commands */
> 1732347979 114681 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Br greater than14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146210&oldid=146209 5* 03Ractangle 5* (-2) 10/* Commands */
> 1732348056 315467 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Br greater than14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146211&oldid=146210 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+13) 10/* by User:Ractangle */
> 1732348120 794890 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Br greater than14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146212&oldid=146211 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+2) 10/* Commands */
> 1732348245 11702 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Br greater than14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146213&oldid=146212 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+23) 10/* Commands */
> 1732348265 747758 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Br greater than14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146214&oldid=146213 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+4) 10/* by User:Ractangle */
> 1732348300 170187 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Br greater than14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146215&oldid=146214 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+2) 10/* by User:Ractangle */
> 1732348488 747239 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Ractangle/Sandbox14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146216&oldid=146165 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+21) 10/* Stuff to continue */
< 1732348757 322826 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User
> 1732348897 548162 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:ColorfulGalaxy's CA discoveries14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146217&oldid=146201 5* 03ZCX islptng 5* (+52) 10/* WARNING! */ new section
> 1732348953 900221 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:ColorfulGalaxy's CA discoveries14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146218&oldid=146217 5* 03ZCX islptng 5* (+329) 10/* Are you Trump's robot? */
> 1732349274 587208 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Translated ORK14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146219&oldid=146056 5* 03ZCX islptng 5* (+419) 10
> 1732350468 800161 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07LJAPL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146220&oldid=144048 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+133) 10Removed redirect to [[Array?]]
> 1732350659 941476 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated /islptng14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=146221 5* 03ZCX islptng 5* (+1266) 10Created page with " Baidu: Chinese-Arabic-Polish-Romanian  Apple: Romanian(Treat as Spanish)-Chinese-Ukrainian-Thai-Chinese  What's the result? 
                 spus-o          Unde e prul                      mult    Destul      ..."
> 1732350755 938215 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated 14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146222&oldid=146199 5* 03ZCX islptng 5* (-12) 10
< 1732350891 358402 :X-Scale!~X-Scale@89.214.117.205 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
> 1732350930 144207 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated /islptng14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146223&oldid=146221 5* 03ZCX islptng 5* (+653) 10
> 1732351143 713869 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[078 bits, 256 bytes14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=146224 5* 03ChuckEsoteric08 5* (+2341) 10Created page with "'''8 bits, 256 bytes''' is an esolang by [[User:ChuckEsoteric08]] inspired by Chip-8 ==Description== It has 8-bit Program Counter, allowing programs to have 256 bytes at most, it has 16 8-bit internal registers, R0-RF, last one used only as a flag for 
> 1732351172 102229 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:ChuckEsoteric0814]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146225&oldid=145768 5* 03ChuckEsoteric08 5* (+23) 10/* 2024 */
< 1732355025 979615 :slavfox!~slavfox@193.28.84.183 QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds
< 1732355136 431092 :slavfox!~slavfox@193.28.84.183 JOIN #esolangs slavfox :slavfox
> 1732355185 961065 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Wenyan14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146226&oldid=146184 5* 03Ractangle 5* (-12) 10/* Brainfuck interpreter */
> 1732356685 335164 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:ZCX islptng14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146227&oldid=146054 5* 03ZCX islptng 5* (+121) 10
< 1732356736 434971 :X-Scale!~X-Scale@89.214.123.211 JOIN #esolangs X-Scale :[https://web.libera.chat] X-Scale
> 1732357747 45266 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Translated ORK14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146228&oldid=146219 5* 03None1 5* (+608) 10
> 1732357880 145615 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Translated ORK14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146229&oldid=146228 5* 03None1 5* (+9) 10/* What is 'Basinite' ? */
> 1732357967 740636 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146230&oldid=145993 5* 03None1 5* (+23) 10/* E */
> 1732358028 538654 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:None114]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146231&oldid=145505 5* 03None1 5* (+53) 10/* My Esolangs */
> 1732358045 322608 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:None114]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146232&oldid=146231 5* 03None1 5* (+0) 10/* My Esolangs */
> 1732358086 934793 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07EchoLang (None1)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146233&oldid=145896 5* 03None1 5* (+35) 10
< 1732358932 941610 :X-Scale!~X-Scale@89.214.123.211 QUIT :Quit: Client closed
< 1732362005 128103 :FreeFull!~freefull@46.205.205.240.nat.ftth.dynamic.t-mobile.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds
< 1732362083 162338 :FreeFull!~freefull@46.205.204.130.nat.ftth.dynamic.t-mobile.pl JOIN #esolangs FreeFull :FreeFull
< 1732363101 217298 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@user/sgeo QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
> 1732363273 971039 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated ORK/PSTF Again-Duoviginte14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146234&oldid=146179 5* 03MihaiEso 5* (+13) 10
< 1732363368 502054 :mtm!~textual@47.202.75.129 QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds
> 1732363505 2882 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated ORK/Mihai Again2114]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=146235 5* 03MihaiEso 5* (+1340) 10Created page with "ORK: Translated ORK/PSTF Again-Duoviginte|k|Y.wx=>:?Q7Bs*4Y[78?KN:#L F????T)oZ@5D??4fyk?&rlw4|?wCOE????%??R?!??/f{fq??3H?b@JC? ..."
< 1732363545 991368 :mtm!~textual@47.202.75.129 JOIN #esolangs mtm :Textual User
> 1732363620 521052 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Joke language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146236&oldid=146200 5* 03MihaiEso 5* (+115) 10/* Horribly translated variants */
> 1732363863 750165 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated /islptng14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146237&oldid=146223 5* 03PrySigneToFry 5* (+28) 10
> 1732363967 309158 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Eror14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146238&oldid=146163 5* 035anz 5* (+221) 10/* Mathematics */
> 1732364158 784504 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07EchoLang (None1)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146239&oldid=146233 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+29) 10
> 1732365293 571123 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated /islptng14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146240&oldid=146237 5* 03MihaiEso 5* (+30) 10
> 1732365552 357923 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated /Mihai14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=146241 5* 03MihaiEso 5* (+2518) 10Created page with "1.Take that [[Translated /islptng|shit!!]] 
                 spus-o          Unde e prul                      mult    Destul            Jolla ireum jolla ireum eun ireum imnida..."
> 1732365574 991309 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Eror14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146242&oldid=146238 5* 035anz 5* (+1051) 10/* Example Programs */
> 1732366279 557010 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Talk:Qwertyuiopasdfghjklzxcvbnm14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=146243 5* 035anz 5* (+130) 10Created page with "Funny how you wrote one command and stopped there. -~~~~5anz"
> 1732366316 11176 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Qwertyuiopasdfghjklzxcvbnm14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146244&oldid=124201 5* 035anz 5* (-8) 10
> 1732366366 699653 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Talk:Qwertyuiopasdfghjklzxcvbnm14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146245&oldid=146243 5* 035anz 5* (+62) 10
> 1732366766 894480 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Tommyaweosme/hjhjhj14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146246&oldid=135513 5* 035anz 5* (+59) 10
> 1732366798 830294 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Tommyaweosme/hjhjhj14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146247&oldid=146246 5* 035anz 5* (+80) 10/* Time Traveling */
> 1732366977 207605 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Special:Log/upload14]]4 overwrite10 02 5* 03Ractangle 5*  10uploaded a new version of "[[02File:My github profile read me.png10]]"
< 1732367121 149650 :amby!~ambylastn@ward-15-b2-v4wan-167229-cust809.vm18.cable.virginm.net JOIN #esolangs amby :realname
> 1732367169 437205 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07LJAPL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146249&oldid=146220 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+13) 10
< 1732367642 282007 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esolangs :Hi
< 1732367658 389990 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :hi apic
< 1732367680 546093 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esolangs :😌
< 1732367696 148748 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :lol
> 1732368861 588682 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated /islptng14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146250&oldid=146240 5* 03ZCX islptng 5* (-45) 10
> 1732369411 667818 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Ractangle14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146251&oldid=146086 5* 03Ractangle 5* (-7) 10
> 1732369424 946675 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Ractangle14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146252&oldid=146251 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+0) 10
> 1732369441 846265 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Ractangle14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146253&oldid=146252 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+0) 10
> 1732369448 729395 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Ractangle14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146254&oldid=146253 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+0) 10
> 1732369469 399975 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Ractangle14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146255&oldid=146254 5* 03Ractangle 5* (-1) 10
> 1732370020 125484 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Eror14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146256&oldid=146242 5* 035anz 5* (+99) 10/* Functions */
> 1732370130 421873 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Ractangle/Sandbox14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146257&oldid=146216 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+137) 10
> 1732370378 94146 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated /PSTF Again14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=146258 5* 03PrySigneToFry 5* (+2866) 10Created page with "[[Translated /islptng]] is still not enough, so let's be crazier!  1. Take this s**t(unnecessary linewrap deleted): 
       spus-o    Unde e prul          mult  Destul     Jolla ir..."
< 1732370395 674312 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 QUIT :Quit: Client closed
> 1732370570 620144 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated /PSTF Again14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146259&oldid=146258 5* 03PrySigneToFry 5* (-715) 10
> 1732370582 26343 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated /PSTF Again14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146260&oldid=146259 5* 03PrySigneToFry 5* (+1) 10
> 1732370612 114091 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated /Mihai14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146261&oldid=146241 5* 03PrySigneToFry 5* (-38) 10
> 1732370749 385532 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated ORK/islptng14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=146262 5* 03ZCX islptng 5* (+560) 10Created page with "(ORK in the hell: Wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwttttttttttttttttffffffffffffffff) 114514114514  Baidu: English-Bulgarian(Treat as Russian)-English   Apple: English-Korean-Thai  Baidu: Thai-Korean-Chinese  Myself: Chinese-English(It won't be a
> 1732370798 813163 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated ORK/Mihai Again2114]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146263&oldid=146235 5* 03ZCX islptng 5* (+6) 10
> 1732370998 437969 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated ORK/islptng14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146264&oldid=146262 5* 03ZCX islptng 5* (+317) 10
> 1732371054 735824 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated ORK/islptng14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146265&oldid=146264 5* 03ZCX islptng 5* (+33) 10
< 1732371870 865075 :Everything!~Everythin@46.211.85.22 JOIN #esolangs Everything :Everything
< 1732371950 999120 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl QUIT :Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…
< 1732372264 134385 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User
> 1732372379 329295 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Eror14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146266&oldid=146256 5* 035anz 5* (+788) 10/* 99 bottles of beer */
> 1732372471 205766 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Eror14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146267&oldid=146266 5* 035anz 5* (+105) 10/* External Resources */
< 1732373225 452687 :craigo!~craigo@user/craigo JOIN #esolangs craigo :realname
< 1732373349 13541 :Everything!~Everythin@46.211.85.22 QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1732373491 230163 :Everything!~Everythin@46-133-33-209.mobile.vf-ua.net JOIN #esolangs Everything :Everything
> 1732374564 121566 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Eror14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146268&oldid=146267 5* 035anz 5* (+38) 10/* Mathematics */
> 1732377055 508656 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07My Unreliable Past14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146269&oldid=54804 5* 03Fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff 5* (+96) 10/* See also */
> 1732377167 442054 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Huh?14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146270&oldid=125363 5* 03Fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff 5* (+25) 10/* Programs */
< 1732377302 385543 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl QUIT :Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…
< 1732378043 119540 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User
< 1732378549 78972 :Everything!~Everythin@46-133-33-209.mobile.vf-ua.net QUIT :Quit: leaving
> 1732380360 423043 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Finite-state mach... wait, WHAT!?14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146271&oldid=82088 5* 03Fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff 5* (-10) 10
< 1732380523 933199 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 JOIN #esolangs ais523 :(this is obviously not my real name)
> 1732380794 189036 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Whenever14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146272&oldid=144364 5* 03Fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff 5* (+32) 10/* External resources */
< 1732381273 306941 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ais523: I want to change the featured language. I don't really care what it is. Got any articles that would be nice to feature but need a little cleanup or polish?
> 1732381725 80824 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07ErrorFull14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146273&oldid=133739 5* 03Fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff 5* (+528) 10
> 1732381763 658947 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Most ever Brainfuckiest Fuck you Brain fucker Fuck14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146274&oldid=86607 5* 03Corbin 5* (+5) 10Fix category.
> 1732381946 44676 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07ErrorFullC++14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146275&oldid=130708 5* 03Fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff 5* (+164) 10
> 1732381979 489291 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07ErrorFullC++14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146276&oldid=146275 5* 03Fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff 5* (-164) 10/* Hello, World! */
> 1732381986 236272 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:ChuckEsoteric0814]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146277&oldid=85976 5* 03Win7HE 5* (+38) 10
> 1732382091 62047 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07ErrorFull14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146278&oldid=146273 5* 03Fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff 5* (+17) 10/* Hello, World! */
> 1732382122 62024 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07ErrorFull14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146279&oldid=146278 5* 03Fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff 5* (+40) 10/* FizzBuzz */
< 1732382158 884260 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Oh, also, I slept on the wrong thing, and remembered that this paper exists: https://arxiv.org/abs/1011.0014 "Galois Theory of Algorithms"
< 1732382213 965055 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :It doesn't have any answers to your work on golflangs but it does directly address the notion that there's groups of symmetries in a program which are irrelevant to the expressed algorithm.
> 1732382540 868362 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated /islptng Again14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=146280 5* 03ZCX islptng 5* (+1295) 10Created page with "1. Take that shit: 
         kgm             ..."
> 1732382799 730366 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[078 bits, 256 bytes14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146281&oldid=146224 5* 03Win7HE 5* (+37) 10
> 1732382821 528659 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[078 bits, 256 bytes14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146282&oldid=146281 5* 03Win7HE 5* (+4) 10
> 1732382956 609967 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Translated /PSTF Again14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146283&oldid=146260 5* 03ZCX islptng 5* (+649) 10
> 1732383072 805045 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Deadfish/Implementations (M-Z)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146284&oldid=144199 5* 03Win7HE 5* (+239) 10/* TailDot */
> 1732383082 395667 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Deadfish/Implementations (M-Z)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146285&oldid=146284 5* 03Win7HE 5* (+1) 10/* TailDot */
> 1732383093 729487 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Deadfish/Implementations (M-Z)14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146286&oldid=146285 5* 03Win7HE 5* (+1) 10/* TailDot */
< 1732383412 350809 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 JOIN #esolangs * :[https://web.libera.chat] wWwwW
> 1732383425 917695 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Special:Log/upload14]]4 upload10 02 5* 03Win7HE 5*  10uploaded "[[02File:Hyperinotoidion.webp10]]": funny evil orange cube that wants to ruin the world  no kia?
> 1732383568 298835 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07COBOL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146288&oldid=75761 5* 03Win7HE 5* (+59) 10
< 1732383803 335972 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Could somebody warn Win7HE?
> 1732384069 261204 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07COBOL14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146289&oldid=146288 5* 03Corbin 5* (-59) 10Undo revision [[Special:Diff/146288|146288]] by [[Special:Contributions/Win7HE|Win7HE]] ([[User talk:Win7HE|talk]])
> 1732384111 579706 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[078 bits, 256 bytes14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146290&oldid=146282 5* 03Corbin 5* (-39) 10Manually revert vandalism by User:Win7HE.
< 1732384174 589557 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I guess that the winter holiday season has started.
< 1732385595 220441 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :I should probably just go ahead and feature Underload, it's got a (on first glance) reasonable writeup, it's on the candidate list, and I'm not personally involved (which I think is the reason why it's not been featured yet).
< 1732385651 526790 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :I'd also _like_ to have Befunge as a featured language, but (from what I recall, didn't check) the article could do with a bit of general polishing, plus it's not actually been officially proposed by anyone.
< 1732386673 238226 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :fizzie: Rad, I'll take a look later, thanks.
> 1732386831 451528 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[078 bits, 256 bytes14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146291&oldid=146290 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+76) 10Categories
< 1732387011 816905 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl QUIT :Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…
< 1732387340 847215 :b_jonas!~x@88.87.242.184 PRIVMSG #esolangs :fizzie: yes, the Befunge article isn't very good, it doesn't describe enough of the semantics or all the versions
> 1732387343 893650 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Ractangle/Sandbox14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146292&oldid=146257 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+4) 10/* Stuff to continue */
< 1732387368 794988 :b_jonas!~x@88.87.242.184 PRIVMSG #esolangs :fizzie: I had proposed Befunge but retracted that proposal
< 1732388680 797142 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User
> 1732391411 852254 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Ractangle/Sandbox14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146293&oldid=146292 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+11) 10/* Stuff to continue */
< 1732391993 921821 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@user/sgeo JOIN #esolangs Sgeo :realname
< 1732392216 625638 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@user/sgeo QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1732392424 917809 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@user/sgeo JOIN #esolangs Sgeo :realname
< 1732392640 980803 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@user/sgeo QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1732392780 975955 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 QUIT :Quit: Client closed
< 1732392815 943454 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@user/sgeo JOIN #esolangs Sgeo :realname
< 1732394826 358499 :Everything!~Everythin@46.211.115.170 JOIN #esolangs Everything :Everything
< 1732396953 949162 :Everything!~Everythin@46.211.115.170 QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1732397165 76158 :Everything!~Everythin@46.211.115.170 JOIN #esolangs Everything :Everything
> 1732399521 655072 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Windmill14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146294&oldid=146038 5* 03RainbowDash 5* (+1036) 10Strings are officially added.
< 1732400365 201451 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl QUIT :Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…
> 1732401544 71405 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Windmill14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146295&oldid=146294 5* 03RainbowDash 5* (-6) 10/* JS implementation */
> 1732401815 672473 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Eror14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146296&oldid=146268 5* 035anz 5* (+206) 10/* Erors */
> 1732402438 35966 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Windmill14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146297&oldid=146295 5* 03RainbowDash 5* (+606) 10/* Example programs */
> 1732402524 980373 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Windmill14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146298&oldid=146297 5* 03RainbowDash 5* (+14) 10/* JS implementation */
< 1732404602 974060 :craigo!~craigo@user/craigo QUIT :Quit: Leaving
> 1732405412 706306 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Windmill14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146299&oldid=146298 5* 03RainbowDash 5* (+1942) 10Added string Concatenation
> 1732405440 393145 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Windmill14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146300&oldid=146299 5* 03RainbowDash 5* (+6) 10Broken pre
> 1732405496 458534 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Windmill14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146301&oldid=146300 5* 03RainbowDash 5* (+86) 10/* Strings */
> 1732405884 498166 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Windmill14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146302&oldid=146301 5* 03RainbowDash 5* (+225) 10Bug involving number[n]
> 1732405918 313624 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Windmill14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=146303&oldid=146302 5* 03RainbowDash 5* (+73) 10/* Defined operators */