00:20:40 <zzo38> What random number generator should I change it to, to use 256-bits?
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03:40:32 <esolangs> [[User:Pifrited/PasteBin]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163423&oldid=163279 * Pifrited * (+184)
03:49:37 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Plasmatoroid * New user account
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04:17:04 <esolangs> [[User:Pifrited/PasteBin]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163424&oldid=163423 * Pifrited * (+1985)
05:06:05 <esolangs> [[Monoid]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163425&oldid=163410 * Corbin * (+325) /* NP-completeness */ Special case.
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05:43:30 <esolangs> [[Talk:Picofuck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163426&oldid=148158 * Corbin * (+1792) /* Group formulation */ The group/monoid approach won't work, at least not over this simple relation.
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06:22:42 <esolangs> [[User:Pifrited/How Alternating Checkerboard rule emulate work]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=163427 * Pifrited * (+64) .
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07:39:25 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Useless * New user account
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08:50:39 <esolangs> [[Chicken chicken chicken: chicken chicken]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=163428 * None1 * (+1315) Created page with "{{WIP}} {{lang|a=User:None1|i=[[Chicken]]}} It's also known as ccc:cc. Everyone knows that Chicken is inspired by [http://isotropic.org/papers/chicken.pdf the article with only Chicken and punctuations]. This language is more similar to
08:58:47 <strerror> The fourth wiki entry starting with chicken (fewer than I was expecting)
09:05:27 <strerror> zzo38: I think newer games have moved to cryptographic random generators (e.g. SHA256) if truly unpredictable numbers are needed, like in PvP. They need more cpu cycles though.
09:09:18 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Radson * New user account
09:11:06 <strerror> (if complete unpredictability isn't needed, I doubt that 256 bits is necessary)
09:28:26 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Psuranas * New user account
09:37:47 <esolangs> [[Chicken chicken chicken: chicken chicken]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163429&oldid=163428 * None1 * (+179)
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10:11:01 <esolangs> [[Chicken chicken chicken: chicken chicken]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163430&oldid=163429 * None1 * (+11808)
10:11:30 <esolangs> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163431&oldid=163390 * None1 * (+47) /* C */
10:11:55 <esolangs> [[User:None1]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163432&oldid=161166 * None1 * (+48)
10:12:22 <esolangs> [[Chicken chicken chicken: chicken chicken]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163433&oldid=163430 * None1 * (-3)
10:12:32 <esolangs> [[Chicken chicken chicken: chicken chicken]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163434&oldid=163433 * None1 * (+2) /* =Empty sentences */
10:12:55 <esolangs> [[Chicken]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163435&oldid=137156 * None1 * (+14)
10:13:44 <esolangs> [[Chicken chicken chicken: chicken chicken]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163436&oldid=163434 * None1 * (+113)
10:15:43 <esolangs> [[Ccc:cc]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=163437 * None1 * (+54) Redirected page to [[Chicken chicken chicken: chicken chicken]]
11:02:55 <esolangs> [[Dumbascii]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163438&oldid=163406 * None1 * (+29)
11:06:12 <esolangs> [[Talk:Sharp flat]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163439&oldid=163228 * None1 * (+347)
11:10:57 <esolangs> [[Dt]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163440&oldid=163389 * C++DSUCKER * (+577)
11:12:15 <esolangs> [[^]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163441&oldid=153855 * None1 * (+29) /* Interpreter */ be more specific
11:12:33 <esolangs> [[Dt]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163442&oldid=163440 * C++DSUCKER * (+26)
11:12:42 <esolangs> [[Dt]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163443&oldid=163442 * C++DSUCKER * (+2)
11:12:54 <esolangs> [[Dt]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163444&oldid=163443 * C++DSUCKER * (-1)
11:15:11 <esolangs> [[Dt]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163445&oldid=163444 * C++DSUCKER * (-7)
11:15:24 <esolangs> [[Dt]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163446&oldid=163445 * C++DSUCKER * (-9)
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12:18:54 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Hello3782 * New user account
12:20:10 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163447&oldid=163397 * Hello3782 * (+236)
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12:26:41 <esolangs> [[C]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=163448 * Hello3782 * (+177) yes
12:27:17 <esolangs> [[User:Hello3782]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=163449 * Hello3782 * (+22) Created page with "Hi this is me [[C]]"
12:27:39 <esolangs> [[C flat]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=163450 * Hello3782 * (+18) Redirected page to [[C]]
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12:44:53 <esolangs> [[User:Hajunsheng]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163451&oldid=162183 * Hajunsheng * (-149)
12:45:14 <esolangs> [[Mint]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163452&oldid=161446 * Hajunsheng * (-20)
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12:56:38 <esolangs> [[BF Joust champions]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163453&oldid=150009 * Ais523 * (+152) /* 2025 */ mention that later versions of backstop changed the strategy slightly
12:57:34 <esolangs> [[BF Joust champions]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163454&oldid=163453 * Ais523 * (+2) /* 2025 */ fix thinko in my previous edit
13:26:43 <esolangs> [[Moed/Examples]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163455&oldid=155227 * Dhzb * (+23)
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18:25:57 <esolangs> [[C]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163456&oldid=163448 * Aadenboy * (+9) stub
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18:57:30 <zzo38> For my use, I will want to use faster random numbers and is not multi-players
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19:24:36 <zemhill> web.medium: points -9.93, score 13.47, rank 46/47
19:29:25 <zemhill> web.medium: points -5.88, score 17.53, rank 25/47 (+21)
19:37:16 <APic> Nighty-Night *
19:38:36 <zemhill> web.medium: points -2.48, score 20.12, rank 18/47 (+7)
19:45:27 <zemhill> web.medium: points -0.93, score 21.52, rank 16/47 (+2)
19:47:06 <ais523> zzo38: so one possibility is to hash consecutive integers, then split each resulting hash into small segments and treat each of those segments as a random result
19:47:29 <ais523> that way, one hashing operation gives you several random results, so it helps to reduce the performance hit of using the hashing algorithm
19:53:18 <zemhill> web.medium: points -0.21, score 22.15, rank 15/47 (+1)
20:19:47 <zemhill> web.medium: points -0.10, score 22.20, rank 15/47 (--)
20:21:33 <zemhill> web.medium: points 1.81, score 23.93, rank 12/47 (+3)
20:34:17 <zemhill> web.medium: points 1.83, score 23.95, rank 12/47 (--)
20:35:00 <zemhill> web.medium: points 1.93, score 24.04, rank 12/47 (--)
20:42:35 <zemhill> web.medium: points 2.14, score 24.22, rank 12/47 (--)
20:46:09 <zemhill> web.medium: points -46.00, score 0.00, rank 47/47 (-35)
20:46:45 <ais523> !zjoust medium http://nethack4.org/pastebin/medium.bfjoust
20:46:46 <zemhill> ais523.medium: points 2.14, score 24.22, rank 12/47
20:47:08 <ais523> (I was initially just messing around but this does much better than I expected)
20:47:32 <ais523> that said, I think the general strategy is too unstable for it to become a champion
20:52:17 <ais523> !zjoust medium http://nethack4.org/pastebin/medium.bfjoust
20:52:17 <zemhill> ais523.medium: points 2.62, score 25.27, rank 10/47 (+2)
20:56:46 <ais523> !zjoust medium http://nethack4.org/pastebin/medium.bfjoust
20:56:47 <zemhill> ais523.medium: points 2.81, score 25.56, rank 9/47 (+1)
20:57:32 <ais523> it now beats 8 out of the top 10 programs, losing to two_thirds and tying with itself
20:58:15 <ais523> it turns out that the standard strategy that most of the winners use is predictable enough to take advantage of it
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21:14:14 <esolangs> [[BF Joust strategies]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163457&oldid=149567 * Ais523 * (+787) /* Accelerated clear */ new section
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21:29:27 <ais523> !zjoust medium http://nethack4.org/pastebin/medium.bfjoust
21:29:27 <zemhill> ais523.medium: points 3.52, score 26.24, rank 9/47 (--)
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21:38:39 <ais523> !zjoust medium http://nethack4.org/pastebin/medium.bfjoust
21:38:40 <zemhill> ais523.medium: points 4.43, score 26.89, rank 8/47 (+1)
21:48:11 <ais523> !zjoust medium http://nethack4.org/pastebin/medium.bfjoust
21:48:11 <zemhill> ais523.medium: points 4.86, score 27.30, rank 7/47 (+1)
21:55:22 <ais523> !zjoust medium http://nethack4.org/pastebin/medium.bfjoust
21:55:23 <zemhill> ais523.medium: points 6.95, score 29.78, rank 6/47 (+1)
22:00:08 <ais523> !zjoust medium http://nethack4.org/pastebin/medium.bfjoust
22:00:08 <zemhill> ais523.medium: points 7.05, score 29.81, rank 6/47 (--)
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22:44:36 <esolangs> [[Arch is the best! without a quine]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=163458 * WarzokERNST135 * (+403) Created page with "[[Arch is the best! without a quine]] is an esolang made by ~~~~ which is like Arch is the best!, but if you type this: Arch is the best! it outputs: Yes, Arch is the best! Anything else outputs: Arch is the best! [[Category:Languages]
22:45:11 <ais523> do we really need a quineless version of every language that just prints a fixed string?
22:47:20 <int-e> . o O ( We have the answers to your rhetorical questions. )
23:09:59 <korvo> If you can tell me what [[category:nope. derivatives]] should be renamed to -- something like [[category:constant languages]] or [[category:constants]] -- then I'll do the needful.
23:10:33 <korvo> Also, I'd be willing to fill out [[category:quine-avoiding languages]]; maybe that could go through the talk-page process.
23:38:54 <ais523> korvo: might be worth discussing the name on the categorisation page
23:39:16 <ais523> the name "constant string printers" came to mind, but I think we normally use that for esolangs which allow you to choose which constant string gets printed
23:39:50 <ais523> in general it is a bad idea to make big changes to categories without discussion, it is hard for individual people get it right on their own (I know I struggle with it)
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23:52:45 <esolangs> [[BF Joust strategies]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163459&oldid=163457 * Ais523 * (+4) /* Clear */ fix capitalisation of [[brainfuck]]
23:57:11 <esolangs> [[BF Joust strategies]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=163460&oldid=163459 * Ais523 * (+0) /* Careless clear */ the example didn't match the commentary change the commentary to match