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00:20:26 <korvo> ais523: I figured out how to incant `unshare` and now I have working ejectors in Vixen. It turned out that less is more; the man page for `unshare` tried to convince me that I need to set up all the different namespaces like users and cgroups and mounts, but I just needed processes.
00:24:29 <esolangs> [[Human-81]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170525&oldid=170524 * A() * (+534)
00:26:08 <esolangs> [[Human-81]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170526&oldid=170525 * A() * (+0)
00:30:21 <int-e> korvo: Hmm. But a new file system namespace is nice to have so that you can mount your own /proc.
00:30:44 <int-e> And you need new-almost-everything if you want to set up a new namespace as an ordinary user.
00:32:32 <korvo> int-e: Seductive, isn't it? But what I actually need is to remount /sys/fs/cgroup with a fresh cgroup namespace so that I can access /sys/fs/cgroup/cgroup.kill. And the man page suggests that a user namespace is required for doing this as an ordinary user. So that's four namespaces (PID, mount, cgroup, user) already! And each of them has to be correctly configured.
00:34:12 <korvo> It ended up being simpler to just save the PID, risk the TOCTTOU which appears to be inherent to using `unshare` since it doesn't allow actions between fork() and unshare(), and $(kill $PID) when appropriate.
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00:50:28 <esolangs> [[Esolang talk:Categorization]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170527&oldid=169814 * RainbowDash * (+781) /* Category:Branchless paradigm */ new section
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00:57:32 <ais523> korvo: setting up a new user namespace sometimes lets you do the other sorts of unshare without root permissions, but yes, apart from that, process namespace is all you likely nee
01:01:04 <esolangs> [[Esolang talk:Categorization]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170528&oldid=170527 * Ais523 * (+683) /* Category:Branchless paradigm */ agree with the category, would like more input on the name (this would be a big break from tradition but may nonetheless be correct)
01:01:46 <ais523> OK, this is the best category proposal I've seen in ages
01:15:02 <int-e> Is this somehow distinct from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straight-line_program ?
01:15:42 <ais523> int-e: that's a sort of program rather than a sort of language
01:16:09 <ais523> so it'd be "language in which all programs are straight-line, except possibly for an implicit loop around the program"
01:16:32 <int-e> Right; I was more interested in the straight-line part
01:16:50 <ais523> notably, straight-line programs can't be TC unless one of the individual instructions is TC, but branchless languages like cyclic tag can be
01:18:09 <int-e> okay, you pointed out a difference :)
01:26:49 <esolangs> [[Mutt Machine]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=170529 * RainbowDash * (+1822) Created page with "'''Mutt machine''' is a computational model invented by [[User:RainbowDash]] in [[:Category:2025|2025]]. == Overview == Mutt machine works on a tape of symbols. Symbols are viewed on the right of tape and appended to the left. Any amount of symbols can be rea
01:30:40 <esolangs> [[Esolang talk:Categorization]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170530&oldid=170528 * RainbowDash * (+367) /* Category:Branchless paradigm */
01:31:32 <esolangs> [[User:RainbowDash]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170531&oldid=169637 * RainbowDash * (+59) Mutt machine
01:50:01 <esolangs> [[Esolang talk:Categorization]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170532&oldid=170530 * Ais523 * (+272) /* Category:Branchless paradigm */ an alternative potential name
01:56:55 <esolangs> [[Mutt Machine]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170533&oldid=170529 * RainbowDash * (+2370)
01:58:18 <esolangs> [[Esolang talk:Categorization]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170534&oldid=170532 * RainbowDash * (+290) /* Category:Branchless paradigm */
02:11:13 <esolangs> [[Mutt Machine]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170535&oldid=170533 * RainbowDash * (+55)
02:14:06 <esolangs> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Cmontella * New user account
02:22:05 <esolangs> [[Esolang talk:Categorization]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170536&oldid=170534 * RainbowDash * (+207) Not responding to ais just saying.
02:22:52 <esolangs> [[Esolang talk:Categorization]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170537&oldid=170536 * Aadenboy * (+471) /* Category:Branchless paradigm */ proposal; it was mentioned above as well
02:31:47 <esolangs> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170538&oldid=170416 * Cmontella * (+151)
02:44:34 <esolangs> [[Esolang talk:Categorization]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170539&oldid=170537 * RainbowDash * (+150) /* Category:Branchless paradigm */
02:58:57 <esolangs> [[Esolang talk:Categorization]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170540&oldid=170539 * Corbin * (+330) /* Category:Branchless paradigm */ SWAR's a paradigm, right? Branchless is very similar.
03:09:59 <esolangs> [[User talk:PrySigneToFry]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170541&oldid=169706 * PrySigneToFry * (+280)
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04:42:26 <esolangs> [[Purrtran]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=170542 * Cmontella * (+4215) Joke esoteric programming language featuring an AI cat coding assistant.
04:45:13 <esolangs> [[Joke language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170543&oldid=165995 * Cmontella * (+83)
04:48:40 <esolangs> [[Purrtran]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170544&oldid=170542 * Cmontella * (+1) /* PURRTRAN */
04:52:39 <esolangs> [[Purrtran]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170545&oldid=170544 * Aadenboy * (-14) remove h1 header
04:53:32 <esolangs> [[Purrtran]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170546&oldid=170545 * Cmontella * (-4180) Redirected page to [[PURRTRAN]]
04:53:39 <esolangs> [[PURRTRAN]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=170547 * Cmontella * (+4216) Created page with "= PURRTRAN = '''PURRTRAN''' is a joke esoteric programming language themed around programming with an AI cat assistant. Although nominally described as a modernized FORTRAN dialect, PURRTRAN has no formal syntax or semantics; instead, its defining feature is an "Art
04:54:17 <esolangs> [[User:Yayimhere]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170548&oldid=170312 * Yayimhere2(school) * (+11) /* esolangs */
04:54:45 <esolangs> [[PURRTRAN]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170549&oldid=170547 * Aadenboy * (-14) remove h1 header (again)
04:56:36 <b_jonas> I feel like this branchless thing could be hard to determine for some languages. A tight loop that's running on a GPU heavily parallelized is clearly branchless, whereas something like ABC that has long forwards only jumps clearly isn't branchless, but what if the language has a way to skip any instruction or short sequence of instructions based on flags and since it's an esolang where we don't care
04:56:42 <b_jonas> about performance you can't tell if it runs in constant time regardless the conditions like a GPU does or not taken branches actually save time like in ABC?
04:57:44 <ais523> right, the gray area is predicated instructions
04:58:00 <ais523> which can be interpreted either as branching or as non-branching
04:58:24 <b_jonas> yes, it could even differ between implementations
04:58:34 <ais523> cyclic tag is predicated in a sense
04:59:07 <ais523> because the productions get pushed conditionally
05:00:30 <esolangs> [[CCCC]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170550&oldid=169871 * Yayimhere2(school) * (-3) /* Semantics */
05:00:45 <ais523> I guess the extreme is languages like "BPF wrapped in a loop", which is very branchy but seems to have a number of properties of branchless languages
05:01:34 <ais523> all this discussion is making me think that branchlessness purely is a paradigm (as opposed to something like reversibility) because it's more a matter of style than of capabilities
05:02:09 <ais523> you can imagine the "case/switch/match statement in a loop" style of programming and that's both equivalent to a state machine, and somewhat reminiscent of branchless programming
05:02:16 <ais523> b_jonas: Berkeley Packet Filter
05:02:27 <ais523> widely used intentionally sub-TC language
05:02:44 <ais523> originally used for firewalls but ended up being used for other things too
05:03:03 <b_jonas> yeah, for running untrusted code in kernel space
05:03:08 <ais523> it's a lot like a typical asm except that jumps can only go forwards
05:03:28 <ais523> (which is what makes it sub-TC)
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05:08:21 <ais523> b_jonas: thinking about it a bit more, at least in esolangs, the thing that makes esoprogramming feel like it's branchless is that you have to somehow encode the data you're operating on in such a way that predication works
05:09:08 <ais523> if your language has a "skip the next instruction if X" then it feels more like a match-in-a-loop style of programming
05:09:36 <ais523> if your language is based around unconditional data operations but you can arrange the data to make them work as no-ops, that's what seems to define the esobranchless style
05:10:09 <ais523> (this is assuming that you have reasonable power to determine X)
05:11:12 <ais523> OK, here's another edge case – is The Waterfall Model branchless?
05:11:45 <ais523> it doesn't have an instruction pointer in the traditional sense
05:13:13 <ais523> (this is even more interesting if you compare to Delta Relay, which is almost identical except that "which counter is 0" acts like an instruction pointer, and that instruction pointer moves around in a branchy sort of way)
05:14:51 <b_jonas> ais523: but wouldn't that criterium say that GPU inner loops are not branchless?
05:16:55 <ais523> b_jonas: I think there are multiple boundaries
05:17:03 <ais523> and the esolang boundary is in a different place from the practical programming boundary
05:35:41 <sorear> half-remember someone doing that with the C preprocessor, maybe more relevant to esoteric programming
05:38:58 <b_jonas> sorear: do you mean IOCCC 1992/buzzard.1 ?
06:04:47 <esolangs> [[Hexad]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170551&oldid=169570 * Yayimhere2(school) * (+1) /* Commands */
06:31:32 <esolangs> [[Semi-serious language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170552&oldid=170497 * PkmnQ * (+549) Add a bunch of esolangs (I may be a bit lenient, feel free to remove what doesn't belong)
06:44:30 <esolangs> [[Talk:]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=170553 * I am islptng * (+218) Created page with ":Today is Dec 13 again, looking back, this is a s**t esolang() ~~~~"
06:45:55 <esolangs> [[Talk:CCCC]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=170554 * I am islptng * (+125) Created page with "I have a CA rule called CCCC. ~~~~"
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07:36:48 <esolangs> [[Undefined behavior (language)]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170555&oldid=139799 * JHSHernandez-ZBH * (-134) the specification is supposed to be incomplete.
07:40:16 <esolangs> [[Undefined behavior (language)]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170556&oldid=170555 * JHSHernandez-ZBH * (-43)
07:42:42 <esolangs> [[Undefined behavior (language)]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170557&oldid=170556 * JHSHernandez-ZBH * (+195)
07:42:56 <esolangs> [[Undefined behavior (language)]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170558&oldid=170557 * JHSHernandez-ZBH * (-2)
07:44:30 <esolangs> [[Undefined behavior (language)]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170559&oldid=170558 * JHSHernandez-ZBH * (+147)
07:52:26 <esolangs> [[2 Bits, 1 Byte]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170560&oldid=168651 * JHSHernandez-ZBH * (+0)
08:14:35 <esolangs> [[Abcout]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170561&oldid=169120 * ChuckEsoteric08 * (+127) Undo revision [[Special:Diff/169120|169120]] by [[Special:Contributions/Sporeball|Sporeball]] ([[User talk:Sporeball|talk]])
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09:45:01 <esolangs> [[User talk:Hammy/signature]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170562&oldid=170504 * Esolangist alt * (+422) Esolangist alt
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10:45:55 <esolangs> [[Abcout]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170563&oldid=170561 * PkmnQ * (-127) Technically not limited to a finite amount of memory as currently specified
10:48:48 <esolangs> [[Abcout]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170564&oldid=170563 * PkmnQ * (+253) /* Computational class */ This might be clearer
12:49:44 <esolangs> [[User:RikoMamaBala]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170565&oldid=170351 * RikoMamaBala * (-155)
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13:39:16 <esolangs> [[A0A0]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170566&oldid=79201 * Somefan * (+0) fix implementation links
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13:44:07 <esolangs> [[FlogScript]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170567&oldid=139917 * Somefan * (+95) external fix
13:45:32 <esolangs> [[Techno]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170568&oldid=75529 * Somefan * (+30) snapshot for external link
13:49:51 <esolangs> [[Autopsy]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170569&oldid=118827 * Somefan * (+30) snapshot for external link
13:54:19 <esolangs> [[Autopsy]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170570&oldid=170569 * Somefan * (-30) nevermind, http
13:55:03 <esolangs> [[Techno]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170571&oldid=170568 * Somefan * (-30) nevermind, http
13:59:28 <esolangs> [[Matcha]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170572&oldid=170402 * Hibye1217 * (+4117) Rewrote the document to fit the tea theme. Also definitely did not hid any hidden message.
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14:05:07 <esolangs> [[Matcha]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170573&oldid=170572 * Hibye1217 * (+29) Fixed minor formatting mistakes
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14:54:10 <esolangs> [[2 Bits, 1 Byte]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170574&oldid=170560 * None1 * (+0) Undo revision [[Special:Diff/170560|170560]] by [[Special:Contributions/JHSHernandez-ZBH|JHSHernandez-ZBH]] ([[User talk:JHSHernandez-ZBH|talk]]) Some commands use 4 bits
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15:49:45 <esolangs> [[Brainfuck basic edition]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=170575 * GolferHome * (+1808) Created page with "= Brainfuck basic edition = '''Brainfuck basic edition''' (also known as '''BBE''') is an [[Category:Brainfuck_derivatives|brainfuck derivative]] which removes some instructions while still being [[Turing-completeness|Turing-complete.]] It removes <c
16:07:41 <esolangs> [[Gemini/Example Programs]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=170576 * PrySigneToFry * (+711) Created page with "{{Back|Gemini}} This contains a series of Gemini example programs. = Hello, World! = <pre> func main(argC: Int64, argV: list) do var a: Doc = "Hello, World!"; println a; end </pre> = Deadfish = <pre> func main(argC: Int64, argV: list) do
16:08:32 <esolangs> [[Matcha]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170577&oldid=170573 * Hibye1217 * (+361) Compiler and Truth Machine
16:09:28 <esolangs> [[Gemini]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170578&oldid=170137 * PrySigneToFry * (+37)
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16:59:11 <esolangs> [[A0A0]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170579&oldid=170566 * Yayimhere2(school) * (+6) /* Language overview */ clear up A a lil'
17:32:56 <esolangs> [[A Combinator Language]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170580&oldid=170129 * Yayimhere2(school) * (+19) /* Combinators/lambda expressions */
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17:52:31 <esolangs> [[Lacc]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=170581 * Yayimhere2(school) * (+1542) Created page with "'''Lacc''', originally inspired by a chat with [[User:Waffelz]], is a stack based language, and as such imperative language, with only one way of doing control flow: a version of the call/cc operator, normally only used in functional programming languages. == C
18:02:17 <esolangs> [[Lacc]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170582&oldid=170581 * Yayimhere2(school) * (+36)
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19:35:06 <esolangs> [[User talk:Hammy]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170583&oldid=168984 * Hammy * (+390)
19:45:22 <esolangs> [[User talk:Hammy/signature]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170584&oldid=170562 * Aadenboy * (+712)
19:52:23 <esolangs> [[User:Niko Strauch]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170585&oldid=120751 * Niko Strauch * (-4)
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20:01:33 <esolangs> [[Translated Batch/Hammy]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=170586 * Hammy * (+4504) Created page with "[[Translated Batch/Mihai Popa|Less crazy]] Step 1: Take this piece of sh*t code. <pre> @echo off cls Amasampula e-REM Creative 8-bit ADPCM Let me tell you about Jim Leonard. It does not stop the flow of water from flowing into the air. i want to be a membe
20:02:47 <esolangs> [[Translated Batch/Mihai Popa]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170587&oldid=127933 * Hammy * (+55) /* See also */
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20:27:15 <esolangs> [[Useredited]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=170588 * Hammy * (+24) Redirected page to [[UserEdited]]
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21:05:36 <esolangs> [[UserEdited]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170589&oldid=167594 * Hammy * (+498)
21:30:55 <esolangs> [[Brain-accumulator]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170590&oldid=170209 * Kaveh Yousefi * (+2) Ameliorated a lapsus in the elision of the Common Lisp programming language as the interpreter's foundation.
21:49:40 <zzo38> I had symlinked /dev/urandom into a directory accessible to DOS programs in order that I can make better quality random numbers in programs that are written in BASIC; I don't know how many other people would do stuff like that (I expect most people would want to use more modern programs instead, but I think DOS works well).
22:09:15 <zzo38> (This works; I have tried it because I was not sure if it would work, and it does work.)
22:53:28 <APic> Good Night. Happy 03 Advent to You all!
23:19:55 <esolangs> [[Language list]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170591&oldid=170505 * Buckets * (+26)
23:20:29 <esolangs> [[User:Buckets]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170592&oldid=170506 * Buckets * (+12)
23:21:07 <esolangs> [[MIRROR]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=170593&oldid=147415 * Buckets * (+33)
23:21:14 <esolangs> [[Mirror]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=170594 * Buckets * (+3607) Created page with "{{Distinguish/Confusion|MIRROR}} Mirror Is an Esoteric Programming language Created By [[User:Buckets]] In 2021. {| class="wikitable" |- ! Commands !! Instructions |- | q || Creates an IP with 11. |- | || Set the to 0. |- | 0 || Set The To 0. |- | F || Skip next comm
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