< 1778630404 247840 :salpynx!~salpynx@121.98.104.53 PRIVMSG #esolangs :re. ssll, I think some creators of 'good' languages felt slighted that their jokes were not being acknowledged? I think some of the most interesting language are doign something 'funny', but legitimately interesting too
< 1778630488 91913 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :It's a spectrum. Even on the most serious end, proglangs usually have silly punny names; the popular languages are e.g. Python, C, Java, C♯, which have interesting stories behind them. I generally hold off on documenting/implementing a language until I have a good name.
< 1778630554 771799 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Okay, it's speedrunning time. Have a good night, y'all.
< 1778630561 83110 :salpynx!~salpynx@121.98.104.53 PRIVMSG #esolangs :g'night
< 1778630592 354704 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :salpynx: there's a genuine field of study of esolangs as art – this isn't the way I primarily view them but some people do
< 1778630603 657547 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :(but it's different from studying esolang *specifications* as art)
< 1778630639 373558 :msv!~msv@user/msv QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1778630962 809024 :Guest12!~Guest12@2001:4450:494c:3700:a562:6cff:27e1:748d PART :#esolangs
< 1778631047 875352 :salpynx!~salpynx@121.98.104.53 PRIVMSG #esolangs :having a clear ontology of concepts would help, I feel like I've only just understood that some users are really only interested in creating specifications, whereas I'd been linking the specs and language because I'm not sure how to unlink them. Computation model and language also gets tricky, TWM and Minsky machines come to mind as difficult to pigeon hole
< 1778631158 647325 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :IMO there's a clear distinction between a specification (which exists as a method of communication, to convey your notion of how a language works to other people), and something that is designed to resemble a specification but isn't linked to a language (which exists basically because language specifications can be an art form but the language actually existing isn't necessarily an essential part of the art)
< 1778631435 660741 :salpynx!~salpynx@121.98.104.53 PRIVMSG #esolangs :right, so it's something taking the _form_ of a language specification, without necessary functioning as one, or that being the primary purpose
< 1778631730 26948 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :yes
< 1778631739 97540 :b_jonas!~x@catv-80-98-84-202.catv.fixed.one.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs ::(
< 1778631797 44178 :salpynx!~salpynx@121.98.104.53 PRIVMSG #esolangs ::( ?
> 1778631811 601928 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:2026 topicality proposal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182005&oldid=182004 5* 03Hotcrystal0 5* (+398) 10
< 1778632325 455264 :salpynx!~salpynx@121.98.104.53 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I don't quite get that last comment on the page then, creating languages from scratch _is_ allowed. Seems likre there's some confusion about what we are talking about. Creating the page before the language exists at any level is the problem
> 1778632409 738369 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Tommyaweosme14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182006&oldid=181873 5* 03Tommyaweosme 5* (+0) 10
< 1778632413 220806 :salpynx!~salpynx@121.98.104.53 PRIVMSG #esolangs :maybe there is a legitimate confustion about what a language is? Maybe there's a view that all you need is a name, then a 'spec'. The name is enough to create a page, then the spec is jsut what gets written on the page?
< 1778632468 842695 :salpynx!~salpynx@121.98.104.53 PRIVMSG #esolangs :too many typos sorry, I need to go get food to focus!
< 1778632546 622779 :salpynx!~salpynx@121.98.104.53 PRIVMSG #esolangs :esolangs should be educational too, if there's a way to communicate some of this better, we'd all likely benefit
< 1778632759 27144 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :one reason I don't like the user-edited languages is that they typically don't have any sort of plan to create a command set that could be used for programming with
< 1778632808 575377 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :when I create a language based on a set of commands, I am typically looking for a set that's sufficient to accomplish the goal I had for the language but without anything that's unnecessary towards that goal
< 1778633430 865199 :b_jonas!~x@catv-80-98-84-202.catv.fixed.one.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :ok, devil's advocate. the page for efghij specifically claims that users can define additions. would you want to delete that page?
< 1778633484 784576 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :b_jonas: no because it's already a usable language
< 1778633514 21410 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :the reason to delete user-edited pages is because they don't tend to lead to usable languages, if something already is a usable language that reason doesn't apply
< 1778633662 776169 :b_jonas!~x@catv-80-98-84-202.catv.fixed.one.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :good
< 1778635827 32387 :amby!~ambylastn@79-77-115-17.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com QUIT :Quit: so long suckers! i rev up my motorcylce and create a huge cloud of smoke. when the cloud dissipates im lying completely dead on the pavement
> 1778635940 319352 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:2026 topicality proposal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182007&oldid=182005 5* 03Tommyaweosme 5* (+215) 10/* How would "esolanging" work after this? */
> 1778636952 209241 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Infinite commands???14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182008&oldid=173585 5* 03Tommyaweosme 5* (+12) 10/* Interpreter */
> 1778637666 953263 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Windy14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182009&oldid=180650 5* 03Sisobus 5* (+35) 10change github repo path
< 1778638249 60928 :salpynx!~salpynx@121.98.104.53 PRIVMSG #esolangs :focusing back on behaviour rather than content: would restricting new user accounts to 5 edits a day (use them wisely!), then unlimited after some period of time solve all the practical problems at a system level?
< 1778638262 405332 :salpynx!~salpynx@121.98.104.53 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I'd hate to resonisbile for some rigid rule that deleted efghij because I can't communicate clearly. The community has a bunch of unwritten rules that we've all broken with a wink and a nod. To clarify them has me worrying about ontologies and definitions, and zen-like "the page is a finger pointing at the moon, not the moon" koans, when ppl who likely need this level of specific guidance don't care.
< 1778638425 163070 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I'm not sure an edits/day restriction would have the intended effect, except to make reviewing pages easier
< 1778638560 931468 :salpynx!~salpynx@121.98.104.53 PRIVMSG #esolangs :it'd reduce the sustained adrenaline rush or whatever fuels the excitement of an endless blank canvas of a permissive fully open wiki, and enforce more thoughtful edits since they are a limited resource
< 1778638823 477450 :salpynx!~salpynx@121.98.104.53 PRIVMSG #esolangs :break the payoff and engagement loop, by altering the game design and reward more thoughtful play styles
< 1778638950 403935 :salpynx!~salpynx@121.98.104.53 PRIVMSG #esolangs :"make reviewing pages easier" is a pretty decent goal, and there were 'broken windows' complaints brought up on IRC and the recent talk page where Randomm page and recent edits can look like 100% low quality. A slowdown would allow other content to shine through
< 1778638965 948914 :salpynx!~salpynx@121.98.104.53 PRIVMSG #esolangs :... just a though, slightly outside the box
< 1778638969 627070 :salpynx!~salpynx@121.98.104.53 PRIVMSG #esolangs :thought
< 1778639076 605622 :Guest12!~Guest12@2001:4450:494c:3700:a562:6cff:27e1:748d JOIN #esolangs * :[https://web.libera.chat] Guest12
< 1778639293 567727 :Guest12!~Guest12@2001:4450:494c:3700:a562:6cff:27e1:748d QUIT :Client Quit
< 1778640708 471110 :b_jonas!~x@catv-80-98-84-202.catv.fixed.one.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :I don't think limiting edits per day would help much, unless it's extreme, like no edits at all other than the Intro page until your account is two months old
< 1778642312 853090 :pool!~nathan@user/PoolloverNathan QUIT :Quit: The Lounge - https://thelounge.chat
> 1778642392 94071 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:2026 topicality proposal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182010&oldid=182007 5* 03Salpynx 5* (+1612) 10/* Collaborative languages */ simple requirement: main subject space pages be 'articles' about the named topic
< 1778643110 623740 :salpynx!~salpynx@121.98.104.53 QUIT :Quit: Leaving
> 1778645037 768334 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Monte14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182011&oldid=174165 5* 03Corbin 5* (+402) 10Explain the name pun.
> 1778645105 99689 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Monte14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182012&oldid=182011 5* 03Corbin 5* (+32) 10Add section for references.
< 1778648089 956759 :msv!~msv@user/msv JOIN #esolangs msv :msv
> 1778652215 218604 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:2026 topicality proposal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182013&oldid=182010 5* 03Olus2000 5* (+526) 10/* Pages that are themselves art */ deleting is fine, rewriting is effort
> 1778652693 215149 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03CTFFuck2 Developer 5* 10New user account
> 1778652882 366988 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182014&oldid=181957 5* 03CTFFuck2 Developer 5* (+138) 10/* Introductions */
> 1778652974 369875 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182015&oldid=182014 5* 03CTFFuck2 Developer 5* (+113) 10/* Introductions */
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< 1778655905 766371 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@user/sgeo QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
> 1778655911 440600 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182016&oldid=182015 5* 03CTFFuck2 Developer 5* (+0) 10/* Introductions */
> 1778656324 898542 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07CTFFuck214]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=182017 5* 03CTFFuck2 Developer 5* (+770) 10Created page with "CTFFuck2 is a circular-buffer and linear-memory-based language. ==Syntax== CTFFuck2 interpreter will automatically skip any non-decimal characters, which means you can simply write as many comments as you want(Though we suggest that you should format it firs
< 1778656512 606560 :DOS_User_webchat!~DOS_User_@user/DOS-User:11249 QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
> 1778658849 286484 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07CTFFuck214]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182018&oldid=182017 5* 03CTFFuck2 Developer 5* (+171) 10/* Syntax */
> 1778659512 236822 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07CTFFuck214]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182019&oldid=182018 5* 03CTFFuck2 Developer 5* (+1198) 10/* Syntax */
> 1778661385 447884 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07DODO14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182020&oldid=182001 5* 03QuantumV 5* (+0) 10/* Var Ops */
> 1778661422 882668 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Doeimos 5* 10New user account
> 1778661730 437658 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182021&oldid=182016 5* 03Doeimos 5* (+163) 10
> 1778661857 429758 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07DODO14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182022&oldid=182020 5* 03Doeimos 5* (+3) 10quantum you forgot to fix this one lalala
> 1778664424 2535 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07DODO14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182023&oldid=182022 5* 03QuantumV 5* (+24) 10
> 1778665588 297028 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Vikyhugo 5* 10New user account
> 1778667261 747132 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182024&oldid=182021 5* 03Vikyhugo 5* (+173) 10Introduction
> 1778667321 199727 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07BitBitJump14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182025&oldid=176237 5* 03Vikyhugo 5* (+9) 10Changed Oleg Mazonka's page deadlink to wayback link
< 1778668953 967143 :APic!apic@chiptune.apic.name PRIVMSG #esolangs :Hi
> 1778669637 117947 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:2026 topicality proposal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182026&oldid=182013 5* 03Hotcrystal0 5* (+535) 10/* The big problem */ new section
> 1778669647 646485 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:2026 topicality proposal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182027&oldid=182026 5* 03Hotcrystal0 5* (+0) 10
> 1778671126 446070 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Ako's Simple Coding Language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182028&oldid=178523 5* 03Bandori 5* (-320) 10
> 1778672231 720560 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Miui14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182029&oldid=181871 5* 03Miui 5* (-372) 10/* "esolangs" */
> 1778672382 701076 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Talk:Important lesbian virtual machine14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182030&oldid=181949 5* 03Miui 5* (+92) 10/* import as from lang */
> 1778672399 625234 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Talk:Important lesbian virtual machine14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182031&oldid=182030 5* 03Miui 5* (+78) 10/* import as from lang */
> 1778672643 819606 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Oragami14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182032&oldid=181514 5* 03Miui 5* (+37) 10/* Computational Class */
> 1778672662 392243 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03FrostCube 5* 10New user account
> 1778673073 73095 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182033&oldid=182024 5* 03FrostCube 5* (+176) 10
> 1778673759 324929 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Miui14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182034&oldid=182029 5* 03Miui 5* (-64) 10
< 1778676603 857853 :amby!~ambylastn@79-77-115-17.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com JOIN #esolangs * :realname
> 1778679414 280978 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Xyzzy14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182035&oldid=146188 5* 03Xyzzy 5* (-100) 10
> 1778680171 522611 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07DODO14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182036&oldid=182023 5* 03QuantumV 5* (+52) 10forgot len
< 1778682577 308267 :msv!~msv@user/msv QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1778682584 811719 :msv!~msv@user/msv JOIN #esolangs msv :msv
> 1778683526 698387 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07DODO14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182037&oldid=182036 5* 03QuantumV 5* (+145) 10/* Instructions */
> 1778683542 148270 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07DODO14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182038&oldid=182037 5* 03QuantumV 5* (+13) 10/* Instructions */
> 1778683553 126312 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07DODO14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182039&oldid=182038 5* 03QuantumV 5* (-1) 10/* Instructions */
> 1778683741 231908 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07DODO14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182040&oldid=182039 5* 03QuantumV 5* (+542) 10/* Examples */
< 1778684080 603934 :impomatic!~impomatic@lock-04-b2-v4wan-171175-cust377.vm10.cable.virginm.net JOIN #esolangs * :[https://web.libera.chat] impomatic
> 1778684131 83145 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Talk:Important lesbian virtual machine14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182041&oldid=182031 5* 03Ais523 5* (-8) 10do not forge other users' signatures
< 1778684153 603177 :Guest19!~Guest19@185.90.60.222 JOIN #esolangs * :[https://web.libera.chat] Guest19
> 1778684175 214945 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Miui14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182042&oldid=181631 5* 03Ais523 5* (+211) 10/* Warnings */ do not forge other users' signatures
< 1778684204 697535 :Guest19!~Guest19@185.90.60.222 PRIVMSG #esolangs :oh i was gonna report that but i guess ais523 is faster
< 1778684273 759344 :Guest19!~Guest19@185.90.60.222 QUIT :Client Quit
> 1778685478 989311 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Aadenboy/issue14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182043&oldid=170369 5* 03Aadenboy 5* (+485) 10add category page creation
> 1778685838 308999 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Mhm!/Turing-completeness proof14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182044&oldid=180701 5* 03Aadenboy 5* (+1735) 10add visualization of the tree
> 1778686421 203024 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Aadenboy14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182045&oldid=180706 5* 03Aadenboy 5* (-23) 10
> 1778688026 557611 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:2026 topicality proposal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182046&oldid=182027 5* 03Corbin 5* (+753) 10/* The big problem */
> 1778688291 406208 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Miui14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182047&oldid=182042 5* 03Miui 5* (+330) 10/* My Opinion */ new section
> 1778688380 165790 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Miui14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182048&oldid=182047 5* 03Miui 5* (+1) 10/* My Opinion */
> 1778688626 733572 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:2026 topicality proposal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182049&oldid=182046 5* 03Miui 5* (+114) 10/* Regarding any potential mass deletions */
> 1778688646 258283 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:2026 topicality proposal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182050&oldid=182049 5* 03Miui 5* (+70) 10/* Regarding any potential mass deletions */
> 1778688829 149141 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:2026 topicality proposal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182051&oldid=182050 5* 03Corbin 5* (+1706) 10/* How would "esolanging" work after this? */
> 1778689032 371352 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:2026 topicality proposal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182052&oldid=182051 5* 03Corbin 5* (+484) 10/* Regarding any potential mass deletions */
> 1778689433 331555 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:2026 topicality proposal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182053&oldid=182052 5* 03Miui 5* (+434) 10/* Regarding any potential mass deletions */
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< 1778690657 614824 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds
< 1778690755 222844 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 JOIN #esolangs Lord_of_Life :Lord
> 1778692598 270401 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Mecksbui 5* 10New user account
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> 1778694976 328054 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Fading Shout14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=182054 5* 03Ais523 5* (+12800) 10new language
> 1778695018 835064 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182055&oldid=181808 5* 03Ais523 5* (+19) 10/* F */ +[[Fading Shout]]
> 1778695052 754728 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Ais52314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182056&oldid=164992 5* 03Ais523 5* (+18) 10+[[Fading Shout]]
> 1778695092 517393 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Feed the Chaos14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182057&oldid=157803 5* 03Ais523 5* (+19) 10/* See also */ link to [[Fading Shout]] which was inspired by this language
< 1778695180 384957 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 QUIT :Quit: Laa shay'a waqi'un moutlaq bale kouloun moumkine
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> 1778695671 956666 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Miui14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182058&oldid=182048 5* 03Miui 5* (+146) 10/* My Opinion */
> 1778696056 833969 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Miui14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182059&oldid=182058 5* 03Miui 5* (+297) 10/* Archimedean Memory Systems=(Archival Registrars) */
> 1778696255 171439 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Miui14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182060&oldid=182059 5* 03Miui 5* (+222) 10/* My Opinion */
> 1778696258 986356 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Fading Shout14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182061&oldid=182054 5* 03Ais523 5* (+714) 10/* Relationship to Collatz functions */ give a brief summary of GF(2)[X] so that people don't have to try to figure it out from a somewhat technical pair of Wikipedia articles
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> 1778696408 303944 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Miui14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182062&oldid=182060 5* 03Miui 5* (+115) 10/* 1 Joke per diem on sliding scale of user priviledge after assessment of moderation/administration tax */ new section
< 1778696491 124941 :kata!~kata@user/kata JOIN #esolangs kata :kata
< 1778696730 367827 :guest_meow!~guest_meo@93-44-17-206.ip95.fastwebnet.it JOIN #esolangs * :[https://web.libera.chat] guest_meow
< 1778696739 688205 :guest_meow!~guest_meo@93-44-17-206.ip95.fastwebnet.it QUIT :Client Quit
> 1778697139 29137 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Miui14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182063&oldid=182062 5* 03Miui 5* (+167) 10/* My Opinion */
> 1778697409 920541 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Miui14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182064&oldid=182063 5* 03Miui 5* (+221) 10/* Seealso */
< 1778697494 861756 :impomatic!~impomatic@lock-04-b2-v4wan-171175-cust377.vm10.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Quit: Client closed
< 1778697602 613902 :impomatic!~impomatic@lock-04-b2-v4wan-171175-cust377.vm10.cable.virginm.net JOIN #esolangs * :[https://web.libera.chat] impomatic
> 1778697761 180875 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:2026 topicality proposal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182065&oldid=182053 5* 03Blashyrkh 5* (-1140) 10/* Program examples (Category:Examples) */ I had no intent to advertise. I got the idea, Corbin
< 1778698119 141078 :kata!~kata@user/kata QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 4.9.0
< 1778698150 88099 :kata!~kata@user/kata JOIN #esolangs kata :kata
> 1778698153 499322 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Miui14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182066&oldid=182064 5* 03Miui 5* (+138) 10/* 1 Joke per diem on sliding scale of user priviledge after assessment of moderation/administration tax */
> 1778698652 506273 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Miui14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182067&oldid=182066 5* 03Miui 5* (+139) 10/* Todays's joke */
< 1778699496 349219 :kata!~kata@user/kata QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 4.9.0
< 1778699511 908000 :kata!~kata@user/kata JOIN #esolangs kata :kata
> 1778700382 884300 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[0714]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182068&oldid=180900 5* 03CodePentuplets48 5* (+578) 10
> 1778700466 729943 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Unary/Cat program14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182069&oldid=181104 5* 03CodePentuplets48 5* (+16) 10
> 1778700526 512190 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Unary14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182070&oldid=170808 5* 03CodePentuplets48 5* (+48) 10
< 1778700738 392054 :kata!~kata@user/kata QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 4.9.0
< 1778700756 798577 :kata!~kata@user/kata JOIN #esolangs kata :kata
> 1778700852 950859 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Ais52314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182071&oldid=181997 5* 03CodePentuplets48 5* (+90) 10
< 1778701651 26951 :kata!~kata@user/kata QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 4.9.0
> 1778702232 146598 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Miui14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182072&oldid=182034 5* 03Miui 5* (+181) 10
< 1778702679 106472 :sprout!~sprout@2a02-a448-3a80-0-c61c-b515-5509-58e7.fixed6.kpn.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1778702845 257639 :sprout!~sprout@84-80-106-227.fixed.kpn.net JOIN #esolangs sprout :sprout
> 1778705286 128672 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Cyclical14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182073&oldid=181690 5* 03Broxol 5* (+644) 10
> 1778705308 966652 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Cyclical14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182074&oldid=182073 5* 03Broxol 5* (+0) 10/* EXCEPTIONS */
< 1778706766 811659 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 JOIN #esolangs ais523 :(this is obviously not my real name)
> 1778708227 795438 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07XXLogic14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=182075 5* 03CodePentuplets48 5* (+1019) 10Created page with "'''XXLogic''' is a logic-based esolang I did because why not? {| class="wikitable" |+ Commands |- ! Instruction !! Meaning |- | A, N, X, R, O || AND, NOT, XOR, NOR, and OR gates (in that order) |- | S || Swaps the 2 wires coming into it. |- | I || Input |- | O
> 1778708243 14448 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07XXLogic14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182076&oldid=182075 5* 03CodePentuplets48 5* (+18) 10
> 1778708258 812862 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Salpynx14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182077&oldid=181488 5* 03Salpynx 5* (+1964) 10thoughts on From; an LLM ate 70% of the verbiage of my micro-essay. (Original available on request)
< 1778708631 617855 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :fungot: how far is 16 from infinity?
< 1778708631 894645 :fungot!~fungot@2a01:4b00:82bb:1341::a PRIVMSG #esolangs :int-e: but well, it sure hasn't been garbage collected yet.
> 1778708873 461648 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:2026 topicality proposal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182078&oldid=182065 5* 03Blashyrkh 5* (+293) 10/* The big problem */
< 1778709268 545645 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :(I'm toying with what's effectively a sandbox mode in shapez 2 and there's an item that "produces an infinite amount of fluid" which I've now measured to produce 16 units [throughput of a fluid launcher, which is the most basic fluid interface after pipes; pipes don't have a throughput limit])
> 1778709911 76705 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:CodePentuplets48/Sandbox14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=182079 5* 03CodePentuplets48 5* (+749) 10Created page with "DO NOT CRITICIZE OR REMOVE ANY CONTENT FOUND HERE.
''x''
'''x'''
'''''x'''''
==x== ===x=== ====x==== =====x===== [[x]]
x
.
HELP THE X'S HAVE TAKEN OVER
existence.you failed to compile.
NO
> 1778710357 120788 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Talk:A bliss-pit14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182080&oldid=180961 5* 03Miui 5* (+379) 10/* Seeking a worthwhile Hamiltonian StegFuck pixel-art motif to use as a progging portal */ new section
< 1778710541 602533 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@user/sgeo JOIN #esolangs Sgeo :realname
> 1778710604 743492 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:CodePentuplets48/Sandbox14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182081&oldid=182079 5* 03CodePentuplets48 5* (+27) 10
> 1778711102 120201 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03True 5* 10New user account
> 1778712078 95257 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:2026 topicality proposal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182082&oldid=182078 5* 03Ais523 5* (+1416) 10/* How would "esolanging" work after this? */ some thoughts
> 1778712200 737195 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:2026 topicality proposal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182083&oldid=182082 5* 03Ais523 5* (+621) 10/* How would "esolanging" work after this? */ r to Corbin
< 1778712714 668139 :salpynx!~salpynx@121.98.104.53 JOIN #esolangs salpynx :realname
< 1778713280 187194 :aadenboy!~aadenboy@172.56.109.172 JOIN #esolangs * :11,8aadenboy — it's pronounced [ˈejËŒdÉ›nbÉ
< 1778713285 205856 :aadenboy!~aadenboy@172.56.109.172 PRIVMSG #esolangs :afternoon
> 1778713761 802435 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Miui14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182084&oldid=182072 5* 03Miui 5* (+811) 10/* favorite esoquotes */
< 1778713832 176132 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :hi aadenboy
< 1778713840 29641 :aadenboy!~aadenboy@172.56.109.172 PRIVMSG #esolangs :hello!
< 1778713951 866450 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :topicality thing is leading to some interesting discussion, hopefully we can get a consensus eventually although I think maybe there are some viewpoints that will need to compromise with each other
< 1778713970 995209 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I posted a couple of esolangs recently – spent most of today proving https://esolangs.org/wiki/Fading_Shout TC
< 1778713978 486031 :aadenboy!~aadenboy@172.56.109.172 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I've been checking every edit
< 1778714002 164769 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I might need to give it a textual syntax at some point, it doesn't conceputally need one but it would be hard to write an interpreter otherwise
< 1778714029 98651 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I'm never quite sure what to do about syntaxes when it comes to entirely mathematical languages
< 1778714054 298362 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :(i.e. that exist to be a mathematical object that is studied)
< 1778714080 347468 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :they sort-of need a syntax so that you can write programs in them, write compilers into them, and write interpreters (all of which are useful for such languages) but in a sense the syntax doesn't really matter
< 1778714131 98314 :Acid190!~none@184.17.89.58 JOIN #esolangs * :realname
< 1778714215 380828 :aadenboy!~aadenboy@172.56.109.172 PRIVMSG #esolangs :reading through the article atm
< 1778714230 607435 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :esolangs are a weird topic because different parts of it become important depending on what you're doing, for some languages a good syntax is critical, for others pretty much anything would work
< 1778714294 606437 :aadenboy!~aadenboy@172.56.109.172 PRIVMSG #esolangs :hah only being able to move to the right reminds me of [[Countable]]
< 1778714329 851617 :aadenboy!~aadenboy@172.56.109.172 PRIVMSG #esolangs :only one pointer though... can't move back
< 1778714344 927898 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :the data structure is one that I don't think has a name yet, expressing it in terms of a tape was the easiest way to explain it
< 1778714397 327663 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :data structures that work kind-of like that is what I've been studying because it's the hard part in trying to do anything with consistent Collatz / Feed the Chaos, the only data storage works like that but is more complicated, so I wanted to practice on a simple version
< 1778714438 545597 :Acid190!~none@184.17.89.58 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Feed the Chaos?
< 1778714458 121162 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :https://esolangs.org/wiki/Feed_the_Chaos
< 1778714466 110418 :salpynx!~salpynx@121.98.104.53 PRIVMSG #esolangs :that's a language, not a proposed wiki guideline ;)
< 1778714471 727037 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :yes
< 1778714505 136734 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :for some context, a few people have been iterating over all mathematical problems, in order from simplest by some measure to most complex, to find the simplest one they can't solve
< 1778714527 256995 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :and doing this with a few different measures tends to always come up with the same sort of problem, which is determining what happens to a Collatz function where all the multipliers are the same
< 1778714604 756257 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :we know Collatz functions are TC if the multipliers can vary (even if the additive terms are the same), but having all the multipliers the same and varying the additive term isn't obviously TC, and that question seems important enough to encourage me to want to solve it (but difficult enough that I'm not sure I can)
< 1778714709 840713 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :and the TCness proof for Fading Shout is bizarre, I don't think I've done one that looks like it before (in that it lets a lot of semi-uncontrolled tape changes happen and just focuses on identifying the few tape changes that contain important information, which it does primarily by looking at the tape location mod 63 and whether various numbers have an odd or even length when written in binary)
< 1778714927 819310 :Acid190!~none@184.17.89.58 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Tape? Like...tape spindles that fill the room 70 years ago?
< 1778714938 386152 :aadenboy!~aadenboy@172.56.109.172 PRIVMSG #esolangs :thought came up: would [[Arbitrary memory emulation]] be in-scope with the current draft?
< 1778714969 345723 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Acid190: when we talk about tape in esolangs we're normally talking about Turing-machine-style tapes, which are like an idealised version of magnetic tape storage
< 1778714970 254445 :impomatic!~impomatic@lock-04-b2-v4wan-171175-cust377.vm10.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Quit: Client closed
< 1778714981 387671 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :they do much the same thing but are infinitely long
< 1778715007 153008 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :aadenboy: it's a programming technique
< 1778715012 419789 :Acid190!~none@184.17.89.58 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Infinitely long tape, got it.
> 1778715033 210916 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:2026 topicality proposal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182085&oldid=182083 5* 03Hotcrystal0 5* (+313) 10
< 1778715043 106162 :aadenboy!~aadenboy@172.56.109.172 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I wonder if there's a more proper name for it
< 1778715046 5978 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :"Articles can be written here that contain information that is useful for understanding esoteric programming, or designing/analysing/programming in esoteric programming languages." – it's included generically but not called out as something that's specifically allowed
< 1778715081 26788 :aadenboy!~aadenboy@172.56.109.172 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ais523: gotcha
> 1778715114 473044 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Arbitrary memory emulation14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182086&oldid=179596 5* 03Ais523 5* (+14) 10/* Notes */ change category to the more appropriate [[Category:Programming techniques]]
< 1778715138 925203 :Acid190!~none@184.17.89.58 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Unfortunately we have had to restrict certain expensive pages (diffs, old article versions) to logged-in users only, due to excessive amounts of automated traffic. Please ensure you have logged in and then try again.
< 1778715152 893442 :Acid190!~none@184.17.89.58 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Expensive amounts of automated traffic?
< 1778715180 643117 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :yes – basically every website on the Internet is getting hammered with tens of requests per second as scraper bots try to load every page they can find a URL for
< 1778715201 595133 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :this only started a couple of years ago, most people suspect it's related to AI
< 1778715215 125471 :Acid190!~none@184.17.89.58 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I'll admit, it was my first thought.
< 1778715275 628717 :Acid190!~none@184.17.89.58 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Not that they can't handle the throughput, but that they don't like scrapers. Which, no problem.
< 1778715280 797817 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :so all the pages that can appear in lots of different variations (e.g. you can diff any two versions of a page against each other, so the number of possibilities is quadratic in the size of the page), especially if they're expensive for the server to calculate, are login-only now to stop the scrapers bringing the server down
< 1778715303 419343 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :even with all the locks the wiki *still* struggles to stay up at times of high scraper activity
< 1778715336 427880 :aadenboy!~aadenboy@172.56.109.172 PRIVMSG #esolangs :it's been performing better recently
< 1778715380 125424 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :the server admin says that it's OK most of the day but goes down once per day because more scrapers target it then for some reason
< 1778715412 107241 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :(i.e. the person who runs the hardware, rather than me who just moderates)
< 1778715412 271860 :Acid190!~none@184.17.89.58 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Well, they're adaptive, doesn't make it right. Unsung heroes filling the virtual "genius".
< 1778715424 325964 :aadenboy!~aadenboy@172.56.109.172 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I mean generally across the recent week
< 1778715439 231611 :aadenboy!~aadenboy@172.56.109.172 PRIVMSG #esolangs :something about an additional filter, lemme see if I can find it
> 1778715502 494267 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:2026 topicality proposal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182087&oldid=182085 5* 03Salpynx 5* (+25) 10/* Collaborative languages */ minor wording fix in my post
< 1778715519 205268 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :I beleive page history (but not diffs) used to be visible until very recently.
< 1778715540 146899 :aadenboy!~aadenboy@172.56.109.172 PRIVMSG #esolangs :https://logs.esolangs.org/libera-esolangs/2026-05.html#liq
< 1778715587 305274 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :it crosses my mind that hiding history pages from scraperbots may make it much harder for them to find URLs to scrape, as most of them are only linked from history and contributinos
> 1778715737 467055 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Broxol14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=182088&oldid=181682 5* 03Broxol 5* (+18) 10
< 1778716229 969393 :fizzie!~irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :"Expensive" was perhaps not the best word to use in that message. It just meant expensive in the sense of relative CPU cost compared to other types of requests, not expensive in the sense of costing money to serve.
< 1778716291 362004 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :and/or IO?
< 1778716309 525896 :aadenboy!~aadenboy@172.56.109.172 PRIVMSG #esolangs :fizzie: hah my mind turned to expensive mediawiki parser functions instead of either of those two (specifically this message)
< 1778716336 663166 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :Hmm, I'm realizing I know next to nothing about the storage story of Mediawiki. (I probably don't want to know either. :P)
< 1778716380 186538 :aadenboy!~aadenboy@172.56.109.172 PRIVMSG #esolangs :int-e: that's the one thing I would rather stay a black box
< 1778716410 540843 :fizzie!~irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Or that, yes. Basically, I just picked the ones which had a high $request_time in nginx logs.
< 1778716484 192672 :fizzie!~irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Also I've just experimentally re-enabled the history listing (but not the individual old revisions or diffs).
< 1778716499 840507 :fizzie!~irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :The spike of traffic still happens like clockwork at 5pm local time, which is pretty bizarre.
< 1778716586 729915 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :fizzie: thanks, I'm often using that to check who edited those pages. (of course I can log in as well, but it's extra effort)